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8jnz4f | 50 | Security Megathread Hey guys! I ve seen a lot of posts about Tesla vandalism and thefts lately. In the comment sections of each of these posts there are some really good suggestions like buying dash cams property cameras GPS units separate from the built in Tesla GPS and disabling certain features in the car itself that make it harder to steal. Can you guys post those suggestions and links to products that you use here to form a sort of megathread on safety and security for your Tesla? I d love to hear more about what some of you are doing to keep your property safe. | IT Security guy here I had high hopes when I read the title. | I was looking at front and rear hardwired camera installation for my model 3. But in another thread someone mentioned it may cause battery issues warnings. Are there any alternatives that don t have ugly battery boxes or wires hanging around in plain view? | 33 | 4 | 2,406 |
8k60mx | 62 | Humans are too fucking stupid to use the Tesla autopilot feature There has been another Tesla crash and it is starting to seem like perhaps technology is advancing further than our ability to properly assimilate it into our daily lives. More here: https: knowtechie.com humans-dumb-tesla-autopilot | Humans are too fucking stupid to use cars that don t have autopilot. You ever walk down the street and watch to see how many drivers are looking at phones? It s a terrifying percentage of people. | Disagree it s just that the press covers it. If they covered every car accident and death the same way we would all be walking to work | 157 | 10 | 2,407 |
8k60mx | 62 | Humans are too fucking stupid to use the Tesla autopilot feature There has been another Tesla crash and it is starting to seem like perhaps technology is advancing further than our ability to properly assimilate it into our daily lives. More here: https: knowtechie.com humans-dumb-tesla-autopilot | I posted this before but got down-voted which made me laugh. I was surprised at my delivery how little Tesla said about autopilot. There was no mention of its intended use what it can t do etc. I understand as the end-user I should dive deep into the instruction manual and read that myself but even a 5-minute info-dump from a delivery specials seems appropriate. “It will not read lights stop signs etc. It is really intended for highway use. You need to be vigilant and pay attention at all times.” Yes Tesla fans will know all of this but a massive group of new owners are pouring in a large majority have likely had little or no experience with a Model S or X. I fall into the “tesla fan” group and I d driven an S before with autopilot so I knew what it could and couldn t do. My delivery specialist pretty much said “ya read the manual on autopilot. Ok great let s go over some other details.” I m surprised with the recent deaths and news cycles around autopilot crashes that there isn t a greater emphasis on what it is truly intended to do at delivery. Seems like Tesla s lawyers would want this. Let s see if I get downvoted again. 😊 | Disagree it s just that the press covers it. If they covered every car accident and death the same way we would all be walking to work | 40 | 10 | 2,408 |
8k72bu | 70 | Model 3 Seat Pattern Change https: imgur.com a 6BE9rh7 Looks like Tesla has already changed the pattern for the seats on the Model 3. New pattern looks a little more refined. There appears to be some extra support on the front of the bottom part too. Any thoughts on if this could mean the white interior is coming soon? Hopefully we ll learn more about the white interior when (if) the AWD options specs are released this week. Source: [@tsportline](https: www.instagram.com tsportline) | Did everyone a favor and [put the images side by side](https: imgur.com gallery 5t7pXwL) | The edge supports on the sides of the base look a little taller. Having sat in a 3 (not driven) I would say this is a good change. | 116 | 7 | 2,409 |
8k72bu | 70 | Model 3 Seat Pattern Change https: imgur.com a 6BE9rh7 Looks like Tesla has already changed the pattern for the seats on the Model 3. New pattern looks a little more refined. There appears to be some extra support on the front of the bottom part too. Any thoughts on if this could mean the white interior is coming soon? Hopefully we ll learn more about the white interior when (if) the AWD options specs are released this week. Source: [@tsportline](https: www.instagram.com tsportline) | Did everyone a favor and [put the images side by side](https: imgur.com gallery 5t7pXwL) | Any info on what VINs might have the new seats? I know VINs aren t sequential but I m picking up my Model 3 on Saturday and I m curious what my chances are of getting the new seats. | 116 | 7 | 2,410 |
8k72bu | 70 | Model 3 Seat Pattern Change https: imgur.com a 6BE9rh7 Looks like Tesla has already changed the pattern for the seats on the Model 3. New pattern looks a little more refined. There appears to be some extra support on the front of the bottom part too. Any thoughts on if this could mean the white interior is coming soon? Hopefully we ll learn more about the white interior when (if) the AWD options specs are released this week. Source: [@tsportline](https: www.instagram.com tsportline) | Did everyone a favor and [put the images side by side](https: imgur.com gallery 5t7pXwL) | Does 3 have lumbar support? | 116 | 8 | 2,411 |
8k8b0b | 131 | Tesla is doing it s best to lose my business I am in the process of ordering a model 3 with owner priority in Ontario Canada. I placed my reservation the moment the live stream opened and configured my car only 2 days after the first round invites went out on March 24th. Today I was finally connected with someone from Las Vegas who was supposed to be the final step in my extremely anticipated new car saga only to find out that my car will not make it to Toronto until June 5 at the earliest coincidentally when I am away on a business trip which I can t reschedule. Fine I thought just ask them to move it a day or two earlier and I can make it work. Well an hour later I get the call they are going to give my car away to someone else because I can t pick it up during that week... They would not hold the car 3 extra days until I was back. Better yet he had no timeline on when I might get another car. The truly awful part of all of this is that the car costs 72 thousand before tax and others who configured after me without owner priority etc. are getting their cars delivered **NOW**. I want to support Tesla s vision here but they are doing there absolute best to alienate me. I asked to cancel my order because the level of customer service on a car that costs this much is appalling and the ISA had the nerve to say I would forfeit my deposit and order payment **despite the fact that they are going to give away my car to someone else.** I am at my whits end here who am I supposed to talk to now? He offered no escalation procedure my delivery assistant has been no help throughout this whole process. Is my only recourse to charge back the order payment and cut my losses? **Edit:** Not sure why I m being down voted here this is an honest account of my experience and frustrations with Tesla so far. **Edit 05-18:** Just received a call from the ISA s supervisor and without any issue I am now scheduled for delivery on June 9. I very much appreciate everyone s support in this thread. | I hesitate to suggest this but I would have considered saying Yes I d like to pick the car up on June 5. In all likelihood that date would get pushed back until after you returned. Even if it was to happen on time I would tell them around noon on June 5 An emergency came up at work I can t come in today! I would do that−just like they have done for so many others−until the day I returned. | These problems are easily solved... tesla needs to stop with the shenanigans. | 117 | 6 | 2,412 |
8k8b0b | 131 | Tesla is doing it s best to lose my business I am in the process of ordering a model 3 with owner priority in Ontario Canada. I placed my reservation the moment the live stream opened and configured my car only 2 days after the first round invites went out on March 24th. Today I was finally connected with someone from Las Vegas who was supposed to be the final step in my extremely anticipated new car saga only to find out that my car will not make it to Toronto until June 5 at the earliest coincidentally when I am away on a business trip which I can t reschedule. Fine I thought just ask them to move it a day or two earlier and I can make it work. Well an hour later I get the call they are going to give my car away to someone else because I can t pick it up during that week... They would not hold the car 3 extra days until I was back. Better yet he had no timeline on when I might get another car. The truly awful part of all of this is that the car costs 72 thousand before tax and others who configured after me without owner priority etc. are getting their cars delivered **NOW**. I want to support Tesla s vision here but they are doing there absolute best to alienate me. I asked to cancel my order because the level of customer service on a car that costs this much is appalling and the ISA had the nerve to say I would forfeit my deposit and order payment **despite the fact that they are going to give away my car to someone else.** I am at my whits end here who am I supposed to talk to now? He offered no escalation procedure my delivery assistant has been no help throughout this whole process. Is my only recourse to charge back the order payment and cut my losses? **Edit:** Not sure why I m being down voted here this is an honest account of my experience and frustrations with Tesla so far. **Edit 05-18:** Just received a call from the ISA s supervisor and without any issue I am now scheduled for delivery on June 9. I very much appreciate everyone s support in this thread. | I hesitate to suggest this but I would have considered saying Yes I d like to pick the car up on June 5. In all likelihood that date would get pushed back until after you returned. Even if it was to happen on time I would tell them around noon on June 5 An emergency came up at work I can t come in today! I would do that−just like they have done for so many others−until the day I returned. | M3 is 72k pre tax in Ontario? Holy fuck. Do you meet threshold for rebate though ? Or is that 75k after tax where you get the rebate? Also what specs | 117 | 6 | 2,413 |
8k8b0b | 131 | Tesla is doing it s best to lose my business I am in the process of ordering a model 3 with owner priority in Ontario Canada. I placed my reservation the moment the live stream opened and configured my car only 2 days after the first round invites went out on March 24th. Today I was finally connected with someone from Las Vegas who was supposed to be the final step in my extremely anticipated new car saga only to find out that my car will not make it to Toronto until June 5 at the earliest coincidentally when I am away on a business trip which I can t reschedule. Fine I thought just ask them to move it a day or two earlier and I can make it work. Well an hour later I get the call they are going to give my car away to someone else because I can t pick it up during that week... They would not hold the car 3 extra days until I was back. Better yet he had no timeline on when I might get another car. The truly awful part of all of this is that the car costs 72 thousand before tax and others who configured after me without owner priority etc. are getting their cars delivered **NOW**. I want to support Tesla s vision here but they are doing there absolute best to alienate me. I asked to cancel my order because the level of customer service on a car that costs this much is appalling and the ISA had the nerve to say I would forfeit my deposit and order payment **despite the fact that they are going to give away my car to someone else.** I am at my whits end here who am I supposed to talk to now? He offered no escalation procedure my delivery assistant has been no help throughout this whole process. Is my only recourse to charge back the order payment and cut my losses? **Edit:** Not sure why I m being down voted here this is an honest account of my experience and frustrations with Tesla so far. **Edit 05-18:** Just received a call from the ISA s supervisor and without any issue I am now scheduled for delivery on June 9. I very much appreciate everyone s support in this thread. | I hesitate to suggest this but I would have considered saying Yes I d like to pick the car up on June 5. In all likelihood that date would get pushed back until after you returned. Even if it was to happen on time I would tell them around noon on June 5 An emergency came up at work I can t come in today! I would do that−just like they have done for so many others−until the day I returned. | I have a similar situation where they threatened to give my car to somebody else. I spoke with my delivery specialist at about 11 am this morning she said she would call me back after checking with the local store. I m going out of town for 2 weeks and I called to let them know that over a month ago. Naturally my car is ready for delivery about 3 days after I leave town... | 117 | 10 | 2,414 |
8kaihy | 45 | 1000 Miles in my Model 3 (144XX)- The Good the Bad the Ugly First time Tesla owner here thought I d throw my hat into the review ring. Not a comprehensive review nor anything approaching a real review - more of an overview of my experience thus far. I m coming from a 2008 Nissan Altima with 190k miles for reference and I ve never owned any sort of luxury or sports sedan. Also this is my daily driver and kiddo transport for a 5- and 3-year old. TLDR: https: www.youtube.com watch?v=0wALArd2rvo **The Good:** * Quieter smoother and more powerful than anything else I ve driven for more than a few days. * Autopilot has been largely drama-free. Something like 3 4 of my miles are highway miles on the NYS Thruway and related interstates including picking up my car from Mount Kisco (6+ hrs from Buffalo). First few times I used it I had a hard time figuring out the right amount of pressure to apply to avoid the nag without disengaging but for the most part I think I ve got the feel down now to where I barely get nags but also don t disengage. See below for more. * TACC in stop and go is worth sacrificing a kidney for. * Efficiency is amazing - I m at 249 Wh mi and that s with plenty of demo rides (gotta show off the linear acceleration!) and my newly-heavy foot. I routinely enjoy passes that my previous vehicle made me too timid to attempt. * The seats (I have the updated version apparently) are quite comfortable. Ride is wonderful and coupled with the 18 wheels is smoother than I m used to. * Homelink setup for my home garage door opener was effortless. * Fit and finish are generally good. Zero squeaks or rattles. **The Bad:** * Minor panel gap issues - driver s side A pillar fender line isn t even. Driver s side trunk lid sits higher than the surrounding panels. I m not worried about the A pillar it s quite imperceptible unless you re looking for it and I would have never noticed it on any other car I ve had - I just happened to look over the car with a much more careful eye than I have in the past. The trunk lid has either gotten worse since delivery or I somehow missed it. I ve tried adjusting the stopper on the lid (it screws in out) without success. * Post-delivery support hasn t been stellar. I did have some paint issues (again I don t think I d have noticed on previous cars but I spent a lot of time looking at the car up close and further away on delivery) - minor scratches on the hood a rock chip on the fender panel near the hood and headlight and two factory imperfections on the lower front bumper. A more serious scratch in the trunk lid. My DS has been...slow to respond and needs prodding but thus far has gotten most things to me. Because I live so far from the nearest service center they re trying to work with a local to me body shop I was planning on ceramic coating the car immediately after delivery but that s on hold while I resolve the paint issues. Supposedly they ve gotten a quote from the same detailer I was going to do the coating with it seemed to take a while but has been approved by DS mgt to have it fixed but it s been a couple of days since they were supposed to schedule the repair. I m not putting this in the ugly section...yet. * I ve had 3 phantom braking issues. No real pattern I can discern but it s certainly a concern if you re being tailgated. My foot hovers over the accelerator while I ve got someone close enough behind and today I had to use it. * Auto lane change has been mostly ok but I had one instance where I had to manually abort. First day I drove it on EAP I had a minivan overtaking me. As I d previously been wont to do I hit the signal as it was alongside - had I been driving manually I d have waited for it to pass then moved. EAP started to move pretty much immediately and I had to swing the wheel back. Maybe it would have detected itself and aborted but it wasn t a great feeling. Since then I ve not started indicating until after the vehicle overtaking has passed my front bumper and not had any further issues. I ve had a few instances where I ve indicated EAP hasn t done the lane change for long enough that I turn the blinker off and try again. * One instance where EAP made me look like a drunk driver also on that first day. I was in the left lane when a third lane opened on the left but markings didn t immediately start (maybe a 50-75ft gap before markings started). Car drifted to the center of what I assume it thought was a very wide lane then noticed the lane markings and jerked hard back towards the right. Startled me and I over-corrected a bit so there was a bit of tire squeal. Likely would have been totally fine had I just let it do it s thing (even if a bit abrupt it probably wouldn t have caused any issues with other vehicles as it corrected) but I was on a bit of a hair trigger. * While being an unpaid brand ambassador :) I was demonstrating where the charge port was. I opened the charge port cover from the phone app and something fell out as it opened. I happened to be parked over a storm sewer grate and of course whatever it was dropped in :( I think it s either a magnet or a small piece of ferrous material and it is integral to the push open functionality because ever since it s dropped off I can only open via the screen app button on Tesla chargers. Not a huge deal but definitely not enough glue (you can still see a tiny bit in the recessed area I think it fell out of) on that part. * Black interior - dear God it shows.every.single.spec.of.dust. Really wish there was a gray option. Related first time I got in after parking facing the sun on an 80 degree day I was unpleasantly surprised at how hot the seats were. Have to get used to using the app to cool (and eventually heat) the car remotely - that s on me. * Rear seat weight sensors + car seats installed with LATCH. Ended up buying some silencers on Amazon because the car kept alerting that rear seats were occupied but unbuckled. Seems like that should be a software preference somewhere. **The Ugly:** * Detailing process QA needs work. Many (though not all) of the scratches detailed above seemed to be due to either an incomplete rinse before buffing or dirty wash supplies IMO. * NYS license plates - the safety yellow clashes horribly with the MC Red. Would have liked it if they d have let me order custom plates upon taking delivery (I didn t trade in my vehicle so needed new plates in any case) instead they refused and I need to wait to get my registration from the DMV before I can order them myself (at additional and partially redundant cost). * Lack of all-weather floor mats. See: two kids. * Lack of large cupholders. My road trip drink of choice is a 32oz Gatorade G2. Good luck finding any place for that - or a large water bottle (e.g. my 32oz Nalgene) etc. **Summary:** I love the car. The ability to basically get into or out of any spot with ease and speed is amazing. Autopilot has some quirks but has generally performed well and seems to make long drives much more tolerable. I m sad I won t be able to keep it clean and pristine. Literally 2 minutes after pulling it into my driveway my daughter put a 1 scratch on the bumper (she was trying to get the bugs off with her firefighter squirt backpack and scraped at the bugs with the nozzle - sigh). The bad items enumerated above are *far* outweighed by the positive aspects. Questions? Ask away and I ll try to answer them tomorrow. | IMHO our community did itself a collective disservice with all of the scrutiny of panel gaps (which was never even a consideration of mine before this car) and demanding fixes for tiny paint imperfections. Once you ve owned the car for any length of time you will have these imperfections and more. And unless it impacts how the doors or trunks close most of the panel gaps have no functional meaning. People object to them because they are supposed to be straighter. Feel free to say Tesla won t get better unless people complain but I for one don t appreciate waiting two hours during my Model 3 pickup while people go through checklists or having to wait 10 days for a service appointment while hearing that most Model 3 service appointments are for cosmetic issues. (Yes I ve asked.) Maybe there are a lot of people who feel jerked around by Tesla—it s been a long wait—and feel like demanding something in return. But honestly to pick up this amazing car on delivery day and then start negotiating right away about when one of your panels can be adjusted a tiny fraction of an inch and when three small paint nicks under the bumper can be corrected? That s super sad. There s a small contingent of people who always demand this kind of stuff but in this community lately I feel like it s spread to a wider group that would normally be so satisfied on delivery day but instead are sweating checklists they ve never come close to using during previous car purchases. Just seems like a shame. | I ve had the phantom brakes happen to me 3 times as well in the last 2 weeks. Scared the shit out of me since I had a tailgater the first time. Oddly there is *nothing* in front me when it happens. I reported the bug via the voice command. I do have a new firmware being installed as part of a service appointment I had to fix a sticky door handle and other small stuff. Picking up tomorrow. Wonder if it has a fix for that. | 38 | 9 | 2,415 |
8kcu8e | 76 | Elon Time Guesses for Model 3 AWD While we wait... The end of the week is Sunday internationally Saturday in the US and Friday is the end of the work or business week. Which did Elon mean? | I ve been checking this sub even more obsessively than normal waiting for this announcement. My heart says today my brain says... End of the month maybe? | As someone still waiting for my first production invite i must admit i m hoping 3 months maybe 6 months definitely. | 87 | 7 | 2,416 |
8kdwgu | 63 | I was able to fit in my Model 3... * My full-size 88-key piano keyboard with stand without even having to take it apart * Piano stool * 1 large suitcase * 1 small suitcase * 1 medium box * 1 smaller box * 1 air mattress * Printer scanner * Various doodads (a couple prints iron gym suit folded up hamper etc.) And I still have both rear visibility and an empty passenger seat! Edit 1: OK OK I ll take post pictures! Stay tuned! Edit 2: [Pictures!](https: imgur.com gallery U5PmVxt) | Reading that title I was expecting something really different... | All at the same time? Can you post pictures of it packed? | 41 | 2 | 2,417 |
8kdwgu | 63 | I was able to fit in my Model 3... * My full-size 88-key piano keyboard with stand without even having to take it apart * Piano stool * 1 large suitcase * 1 small suitcase * 1 medium box * 1 smaller box * 1 air mattress * Printer scanner * Various doodads (a couple prints iron gym suit folded up hamper etc.) And I still have both rear visibility and an empty passenger seat! Edit 1: OK OK I ll take post pictures! Stay tuned! Edit 2: [Pictures!](https: imgur.com gallery U5PmVxt) | Reading that title I was expecting something really different... | I m assuming the air mattress was deflated :) | 41 | 7 | 2,418 |
8kh54q | 89 | Talent retention in Tesla I attended a conference recently where one of the main speakers introduced by sharing Reno s economy and how it is attracting top talent. He shared that his own son who is a U Penn engineering graduate a land a top performer is moving to Reno working in Gigafactory (although the father speaker was really questioning his decision to move to a place like Reno). The point he was making is how Tesla like companies are changing economic landscape of Reno. But what struck me is that for every executive that we hear leaving poached away from tesla they attract equal or more top talents. I also know someone personally working at Tesla who was the top electronics engineer (highest GPA and what not) of THE top engineering college of his country. I also did some random profile checks of engineers at Tesla and found loads and loads of graduates of Stanford and CMU and such top notch schools. My point being of all the things Tesla is trying to solve attracting and retaining talent shouldn t be any problem. | Here in Silicon Valley turnover is a constant. We don t hear about it every time one of the engineers or managers leave Apple Google or Facebook for one of the other top 10 SV companies but it s happening every day just as it is with Tesla. It s part of the culture. | You make a great point. Those of us who know Tesla well understand this but non enthusiasts are unaware | 78 | 2 | 2,419 |
8kh54q | 89 | Talent retention in Tesla I attended a conference recently where one of the main speakers introduced by sharing Reno s economy and how it is attracting top talent. He shared that his own son who is a U Penn engineering graduate a land a top performer is moving to Reno working in Gigafactory (although the father speaker was really questioning his decision to move to a place like Reno). The point he was making is how Tesla like companies are changing economic landscape of Reno. But what struck me is that for every executive that we hear leaving poached away from tesla they attract equal or more top talents. I also know someone personally working at Tesla who was the top electronics engineer (highest GPA and what not) of THE top engineering college of his country. I also did some random profile checks of engineers at Tesla and found loads and loads of graduates of Stanford and CMU and such top notch schools. My point being of all the things Tesla is trying to solve attracting and retaining talent shouldn t be any problem. | Here in Silicon Valley turnover is a constant. We don t hear about it every time one of the engineers or managers leave Apple Google or Facebook for one of the other top 10 SV companies but it s happening every day just as it is with Tesla. It s part of the culture. | [Tesla says it received ‘nearly 500 000 applicants last year](https: electrek.co 2018 03 21 tesla-applicants-employee-growth ) | 78 | 4 | 2,420 |
8kh54q | 89 | Talent retention in Tesla I attended a conference recently where one of the main speakers introduced by sharing Reno s economy and how it is attracting top talent. He shared that his own son who is a U Penn engineering graduate a land a top performer is moving to Reno working in Gigafactory (although the father speaker was really questioning his decision to move to a place like Reno). The point he was making is how Tesla like companies are changing economic landscape of Reno. But what struck me is that for every executive that we hear leaving poached away from tesla they attract equal or more top talents. I also know someone personally working at Tesla who was the top electronics engineer (highest GPA and what not) of THE top engineering college of his country. I also did some random profile checks of engineers at Tesla and found loads and loads of graduates of Stanford and CMU and such top notch schools. My point being of all the things Tesla is trying to solve attracting and retaining talent shouldn t be any problem. | Here in Silicon Valley turnover is a constant. We don t hear about it every time one of the engineers or managers leave Apple Google or Facebook for one of the other top 10 SV companies but it s happening every day just as it is with Tesla. It s part of the culture. | 10 years from now we ll be having a conversation with someone and Tesla will come up and they ll say “Oh I totally knew Tesla was going to be huge!” And I ll be thinking “If you knew that why aren t you rich!?” | 78 | 5 | 2,421 |
8khqdh | 198 | Went to Pick up my White Model 3 Back from Tesla (White Bumper Mismatch) For those that don t know I made a post previously about the [bumper mismatch](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 8ey1g2 bad_rear_bumperbody_paintmatching_on_white_model_3 ?utm_content=title& utm_medium=user& utm_source=reddit& utm_name=frontpage) and then [Tesla agreeing to fix it](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 8ikhjz tesla_working_to_fix_the_mismatched_bumper_on_my ?utm_content=title& utm_medium=user& utm_source=reddit& utm_name=frontpage). I dropped it off last week and went to pick it up this week with a bit of disappointment * [The body shop cracked my charge port.](https: imgur.com a aGTaR3T) I guess I will have to enjoy the long wait for parts to get that replaced. * [They somehow managed to make the bumper worse with the left side alignment. The bumper is recessed deeper ](https: imgur.com a Orw2Wdz) * There was a deep scratch on the quarter panel above the wheel well which we noted on delivery. I don t have a picture but their fix was to make it look like a paint chip.... * On the bright side they did fix the overspray in the door jam * And lastly the Bumper color re\\-do. You guys be the judge but I don t feel like it looks any different... * [Before](https: imgur.com a S49YXCg) * [After](https: imgur.com a SMINhkN) The service center people have been really nice and all and I know it s all out of their control for the most part. However Tesla really needs to think about which body shops they send these cars to. I ve heard stories from my local body shop guy about who they contract out to and I wanted him to be wrong but the quality shows otherwise. In the end they said they will try to fix the bumper alignment a bit at the service center but they weren t 100& #37 sure they could get it any better. At this point I have no idea how to proceed. Just give up? Edit: So I should clarify a bit on the cracked charge port. The service adviser told me that they did not know who cracked the charge port. The body shop claims it came cracked. I know for certain it was not cracked when I dropped it off. Personally I think they body shop is lying because I noticed on the app as they had my car that the charging port was constantly open [Also If my car turned out like this I would have been satisfied](https: teslamotorsclub.com tmc threads white-paint-bumper-mismatch.114299 page-2#post-2734283) | That alignment is awful. They need to give you a whole new bumper if that s what it takes. Sorry this happened to you :(. The body shop they sent mine to for a paint chip did a great job but it s definitely dependent on location. | No don t give up. It s your car. You spent your hard earned money on this. There was an error from the factory and Tesla should be required to fix it. That bumper is nowhere near acceptable from a fit and finish standard. If you leave it like that it could possibly rub the paint off both the bumper and the rear quarter panel. This will lead to appearance issues as well as a possible corrosion issue down the line. This needs to be fixed again and the correct way. The paint mismatch is still there but is slightly better. It will depend on lighting. It s your car so you need to decide what is acceptable for you. | 112 | 52 | 2,422 |
8kj6jt | 103 | EAP on Model 3 suddenly slammed on brakes on the freeway even though there was 0 traffic Here s where it happened (about 0.25-0.5 miles before it happened): https: www.google.com maps @34.0595277 -118.1754625 3a 75y 64.54h 86.69t data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sKMHTo9QxD1hqYcgswqFZ_Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 I had AP on with both hands on the wheel the entire time. Was on the right most lane. It was wide open with no traffic ahead of me. I was going 70-75mph. Apparently the freeway tilts slightly down so it s hard for AP to see the lanes. So after a few seconds of driving from that point in the Google Maps link AP SLAMMED on the brakes (even though there was no one ahead of me ). I ve noticed when driving on hills I d randomly get proximity beeps. Maybe it was the combination of not being able to see the lanes ahead and the proximity sensors raising false alarms. Is there a way to report this to Tesla so that they can address this? | In every accident thread people wonder “why doesn t Autopilot just slam on the brakes whenever it s not sure of what it sees?” This would be why.... It s a careful balance between emergency braking enough vs not falsely braking. | Overhead sign prob | 103 | 7 | 2,423 |
8kj6jt | 103 | EAP on Model 3 suddenly slammed on brakes on the freeway even though there was 0 traffic Here s where it happened (about 0.25-0.5 miles before it happened): https: www.google.com maps @34.0595277 -118.1754625 3a 75y 64.54h 86.69t data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sKMHTo9QxD1hqYcgswqFZ_Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 I had AP on with both hands on the wheel the entire time. Was on the right most lane. It was wide open with no traffic ahead of me. I was going 70-75mph. Apparently the freeway tilts slightly down so it s hard for AP to see the lanes. So after a few seconds of driving from that point in the Google Maps link AP SLAMMED on the brakes (even though there was no one ahead of me ). I ve noticed when driving on hills I d randomly get proximity beeps. Maybe it was the combination of not being able to see the lanes ahead and the proximity sensors raising false alarms. Is there a way to report this to Tesla so that they can address this? | Do a bug report in the vehicle right after it happens. I assume the Model 3 has it like the Model S: Use the voice recognition feature and say report bug and then explain what happened. | Overhead sign prob | 81 | 7 | 2,424 |
8kj6jt | 103 | EAP on Model 3 suddenly slammed on brakes on the freeway even though there was 0 traffic Here s where it happened (about 0.25-0.5 miles before it happened): https: www.google.com maps @34.0595277 -118.1754625 3a 75y 64.54h 86.69t data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sKMHTo9QxD1hqYcgswqFZ_Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 I had AP on with both hands on the wheel the entire time. Was on the right most lane. It was wide open with no traffic ahead of me. I was going 70-75mph. Apparently the freeway tilts slightly down so it s hard for AP to see the lanes. So after a few seconds of driving from that point in the Google Maps link AP SLAMMED on the brakes (even though there was no one ahead of me ). I ve noticed when driving on hills I d randomly get proximity beeps. Maybe it was the combination of not being able to see the lanes ahead and the proximity sensors raising false alarms. Is there a way to report this to Tesla so that they can address this? | Do a bug report in the vehicle right after it happens. I assume the Model 3 has it like the Model S: Use the voice recognition feature and say report bug and then explain what happened. | Will throw in that I also had a phantom brake experience on the 163 N in san diego. Felt the car hesitate and brake due to downhill slope and large rectangular shadow from an overpass. Just pay attention! Easy to take control and the software will keep learning. | 81 | 16 | 2,425 |
8ks6wb | 170 | The Bloomberg tracker just updated to a new record: 𝟯 𝟱𝟲𝟲 cars week Tesla Model 3 production rate [The Bloomberg Model 3 tracker just got updated](https: www.bloomberg.com graphics 2018-tesla-tracker ) to: #3 566 cars week ... which is the highest rate of Model 3 production so far - and it s also pretty impressive because it s before the planned end of May tooling upgrade: - At the end of May (starting on the 26th in 6 days) Tesla will be upgrading their Model 3 lines in the Fremont factory for a couple of days - their expectation is that the Fremont factory should be able to hit 5 000 cars week threshold after that. - Elon also mentioned it recently that the Gigafactory peak battery pack manufacturing rate was already *demonstrated* to be at 5 300 packs week. With 3 500 cars week and an initial average sales price of ~$50K it would adds 2.1 billion dollars to Tesla s quarterly revenue. 5 000 cars week would add 3 billion dollars per quarter. (exact revenue depending on the options mix) If the May upgrade goes well Tesla should be able to meet the overall sustained rate of 5 000 cars week benchmark. | I hate this tracker since it s very slow to update and it shows different numbers to different people depending on region and what not. Tracker says 2900 for me. I get that it s very difficult to track these things but people are taking these numbers waaaaay too seriously | The funny thing about Bloomber s tracker is last week it was estimating things would soon be up at 4000 per week but now that it s at 3500 it s predicting things will drop dramatically. | 47 | 5 | 2,426 |
8kwmgy | 36 | [Discussion] Let s get a show of hands of how many day1 line waiters have received their Model 3. Where were you that day and how does it feel now. Curious to see who s furthest from the factory and the store where you stood in line. That day was memorable. | My wife stood in line at the Natick Mall store in MA was < 10th. Picked up the car on the two year anniversary of the wait 3 31 2018. I ve put about 2000 miles on it and it is far and away the best car I ve ever driven and was totally worth the wait. I m still amazed that it is in my garage and driving it continues to put a smile on my face every time. My wife is now angling to buy a used S in a few years. | Have you checked the Model 3 Invited spreadsheet in the sidebar? it s pretty exhaustive in what you re looking for in details and metrics \\(given the audience you are asking\\). | 31 | 4 | 2,427 |
8l0c4m | 22 | [Discussion] Model 3 AWD rides lower than RWD? Noticed this when playing with the Model 3 configurator s compositor parameters. When equipped with the AWD (code DV4W) the car appears to be an inch or so lower than the same configuration but w RWD (code DV2W). To be clear: The wheels stay in the same place but the rest of the car is lower. Compare for yourself: Three\\-quarter view: [RWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV2W& view=STUD_3QTR& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) [AWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV4W& view=STUD_3QTR& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) Wheel view: [RWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV2W& view=STUD_WHEEL& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) [AWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV4W& view=STUD_WHEEL& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) | The AWD version just has a full charge so the batteries weigh more. | Has there been any official mention of air suspension? | 45 | 2 | 2,428 |
8l0c4m | 22 | [Discussion] Model 3 AWD rides lower than RWD? Noticed this when playing with the Model 3 configurator s compositor parameters. When equipped with the AWD (code DV4W) the car appears to be an inch or so lower than the same configuration but w RWD (code DV2W). To be clear: The wheels stay in the same place but the rest of the car is lower. Compare for yourself: Three\\-quarter view: [RWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV2W& view=STUD_3QTR& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) [AWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV4W& view=STUD_3QTR& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) Wheel view: [RWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV2W& view=STUD_WHEEL& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) [AWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV4W& view=STUD_WHEEL& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) | The AWD version just has a full charge so the batteries weigh more. | it is just a render | 45 | 5 | 2,429 |
8l0c4m | 22 | [Discussion] Model 3 AWD rides lower than RWD? Noticed this when playing with the Model 3 configurator s compositor parameters. When equipped with the AWD (code DV4W) the car appears to be an inch or so lower than the same configuration but w RWD (code DV2W). To be clear: The wheels stay in the same place but the rest of the car is lower. Compare for yourself: Three\\-quarter view: [RWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV2W& view=STUD_3QTR& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) [AWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV4W& view=STUD_3QTR& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) Wheel view: [RWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV2W& view=STUD_WHEEL& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) [AWD](https: www.tesla.com configurator compositor?context=design_studio_2& options=$W39B $PMNG $DV4W& view=STUD_WHEEL& model=m3& size=1441& bkba_opt=1& version=0.0.25& version=0.0.25) | The AWD version just has a full charge so the batteries weigh more. | Surely this is just the Photoshop guy goofing up? | 45 | 17 | 2,430 |
8l1l3s | 184 | ...... im a huge tesla fan but ... service :( This is becoming brutal. I have yet to have a service experience that comes back positive. In the last 10 months I ve been in 5 times for various things. Most recently 2 weeks ago I sent car for annual service gave them 4 days to complete it while I was out of town. I live 2h away from nearest service center. It doesn t get finished. Turns out the broke one of my rear deflector lights while there and needed to order new parts so my car was there for a week. When I received my car it was a mess on interior it had not been properly cleaned. The winter tires were bagged with these flimsy thin bags with holes in them and put on top of the white seats. The seats were covered in dirt from tires. (When I gave the car I had placed all tires in not on the seats). One of my key fobs battery had died (I assumed) and when I got the car back it still didn t work. Was it even tested? Was battery replaced? Was anything done? Final straw I had never had any issues with laying down back seats and today the first time after service as I m getting ready to go on a bike trip my passenger side back seat will not fold down. They had apparently changed some pannel on the passenger side (damaged at previous service appointment) and the seat was stuck. 30 mins on phone with tesla mobile service we can t fix it. They need it back in service center 2h away. I don t know what to do it s very frustrating because it is a brutal trend everytime I take the car in for service it comes back with new issues. Now let me be clear I love my model X and love what tesla is trying to do. Yes they gave me a loaner last min yes they delivered my car to my work after the service and yes they even waived my service fee. But that s not the point. I just want good quality service done properly and I am willing to pay for it done properly and to the level expected for a 6 figure car. What is the solution here? Are we just to suck it up? I really look forward to the day where the quality of the service matches the vision of the company and that we can enjoy these vehicles for what they truly are meant to be. | Tesla service is like the rest of the company understaffed and overworked. You get what Elon pays for which is not enough people and not enough time to do the job effectively unfortunately. | Ah the ol they ll downvote me and call me a short unless I start with I m a huge Tesla fan | 115 | 5 | 2,431 |
8l1l3s | 184 | ...... im a huge tesla fan but ... service :( This is becoming brutal. I have yet to have a service experience that comes back positive. In the last 10 months I ve been in 5 times for various things. Most recently 2 weeks ago I sent car for annual service gave them 4 days to complete it while I was out of town. I live 2h away from nearest service center. It doesn t get finished. Turns out the broke one of my rear deflector lights while there and needed to order new parts so my car was there for a week. When I received my car it was a mess on interior it had not been properly cleaned. The winter tires were bagged with these flimsy thin bags with holes in them and put on top of the white seats. The seats were covered in dirt from tires. (When I gave the car I had placed all tires in not on the seats). One of my key fobs battery had died (I assumed) and when I got the car back it still didn t work. Was it even tested? Was battery replaced? Was anything done? Final straw I had never had any issues with laying down back seats and today the first time after service as I m getting ready to go on a bike trip my passenger side back seat will not fold down. They had apparently changed some pannel on the passenger side (damaged at previous service appointment) and the seat was stuck. 30 mins on phone with tesla mobile service we can t fix it. They need it back in service center 2h away. I don t know what to do it s very frustrating because it is a brutal trend everytime I take the car in for service it comes back with new issues. Now let me be clear I love my model X and love what tesla is trying to do. Yes they gave me a loaner last min yes they delivered my car to my work after the service and yes they even waived my service fee. But that s not the point. I just want good quality service done properly and I am willing to pay for it done properly and to the level expected for a 6 figure car. What is the solution here? Are we just to suck it up? I really look forward to the day where the quality of the service matches the vision of the company and that we can enjoy these vehicles for what they truly are meant to be. | No don t just suck it up. Escalate. You need to speak to the manager of your SC. And in addition to that I d get in touch with corporate to file a complaint. And as an aside - and I know it s a hassle when you pick up do a thorough inspection. If it s not up to snuff don t accept the car. I don t give them my loaner key until I m happy with my car. | Ah the ol they ll downvote me and call me a short unless I start with I m a huge Tesla fan | 97 | 5 | 2,432 |
8l1l3s | 184 | ...... im a huge tesla fan but ... service :( This is becoming brutal. I have yet to have a service experience that comes back positive. In the last 10 months I ve been in 5 times for various things. Most recently 2 weeks ago I sent car for annual service gave them 4 days to complete it while I was out of town. I live 2h away from nearest service center. It doesn t get finished. Turns out the broke one of my rear deflector lights while there and needed to order new parts so my car was there for a week. When I received my car it was a mess on interior it had not been properly cleaned. The winter tires were bagged with these flimsy thin bags with holes in them and put on top of the white seats. The seats were covered in dirt from tires. (When I gave the car I had placed all tires in not on the seats). One of my key fobs battery had died (I assumed) and when I got the car back it still didn t work. Was it even tested? Was battery replaced? Was anything done? Final straw I had never had any issues with laying down back seats and today the first time after service as I m getting ready to go on a bike trip my passenger side back seat will not fold down. They had apparently changed some pannel on the passenger side (damaged at previous service appointment) and the seat was stuck. 30 mins on phone with tesla mobile service we can t fix it. They need it back in service center 2h away. I don t know what to do it s very frustrating because it is a brutal trend everytime I take the car in for service it comes back with new issues. Now let me be clear I love my model X and love what tesla is trying to do. Yes they gave me a loaner last min yes they delivered my car to my work after the service and yes they even waived my service fee. But that s not the point. I just want good quality service done properly and I am willing to pay for it done properly and to the level expected for a 6 figure car. What is the solution here? Are we just to suck it up? I really look forward to the day where the quality of the service matches the vision of the company and that we can enjoy these vehicles for what they truly are meant to be. | The issues your are experiencing are a significant part of why dealerships - not owned by the manufacturer - came into being. Having a third party whose business depends both on a quality vehicle provided by a manufacturer (so they have something people want to buy) and providing better service than the other guy who works on this make (so people return to them for service instead of going elsewhere) actually serves the automotive consumer very well. When the manufacturer holds all the cards so to speak the individual consumer has no power whatsoever. | Love my service center have never had a bad experience. I even bring them treats every time I go because they are so nice to work with. | 31 | 2 | 2,433 |
8l25zl | 32 | [Discussion] Model 3P > competition This isn t getting enough attention. The **price and specs released for the Model 3P are superior** than all three of the most legendary sport sedans on the market: BMW M3 Mercedes AMG C63 Audi RS4. [Breakdown here](https: www.teslarati.com tesla-model-3-performance-against-track-legends ) Elon claims it performs well on the track which is new for Tesla. The S and X \\(and in even the original roadster to some extent\\) were known for being fast in a straight line but not great on a track. [Early evidence](https: www.teslarati.com tesla-model-3-laguna-seca-raceway-track-racing-video ) from people taking the 3LR on the track suggests this is changing and Elon s tweet could mean *we finally have a Tesla track king*. People are freaking out about the price but at $78k plus autopilot it s close to half the price of a Model S P100D and very comparable to the ICE competition. Edit: I agree the jury is still out as to how well it will perform on track but even the 0-60 time for a practical four door luxury sedan is competitive for the price. Edit 2: I m a Tesla fan yes but I ve been a car guy for much longer. I grew up fawning over Porsche s and BMWs. I m excited that Tesla might finally become a performance contender and trying to share different perspective than all the FUD about price. | Let s see what happens when they re independently tested instead of taking Elon at his word. | I hope that the Performance car has a different brake setup. It seems the 3LR doesn t have the brakes for track use. While 0\\-60 times are relevant in this kind of driving I feel that the 30\\-50 and 50\\-70 break\\-away sprints are more important. In that area EVs dominate. The BMW M3 scores 2.2 and 2.8 seconds respectively while the Model S 90D gets 1.25 and 1.9 seconds and we know the Model 3 Performance will be better than that. But here s something else to consider: Next year we ll get the Porsche Mission E. People have been comparing it to the Model S for a while. We know the Mission E is smaller than the Model S and should be great on the track. It does 0\\-60 in around 3.5. The Mission E might actually be competing with the Model 3 Performance and not the Model S at all and if so that might be a very interesting comparison. Range price acceleration and track\\-ability might point to the Model 3P more than any flavor of Model S. | 43 | 16 | 2,434 |
8la7re | 36 | Model 3 Autopilot keeps telling me to grab the wheel but my hand is already on the wheel! Sorry Tesla I m not gripping the wheel with a the force of 10 nations but my hand is on the wheel. I now don t necessarily trust when Tesla reads the logs after an accident. | There s a torque sensor not a pressure one. Just give it a slight rotation in the direction it s turning. You ll get really good at it. The logs definitely can t be trusted when it says your hands weren t on the wheel. | give it an ever-so-slight wiggle not enough to disengage Autopilot but enough to let it know you re there. | 70 | 4 | 2,435 |
8la7re | 36 | Model 3 Autopilot keeps telling me to grab the wheel but my hand is already on the wheel! Sorry Tesla I m not gripping the wheel with a the force of 10 nations but my hand is on the wheel. I now don t necessarily trust when Tesla reads the logs after an accident. | There s a torque sensor not a pressure one. Just give it a slight rotation in the direction it s turning. You ll get really good at it. The logs definitely can t be trusted when it says your hands weren t on the wheel. | Give it some force to turn. It doesn t care about squeezing or your hand being on it - it wants to feel turn resistance. | 70 | 13 | 2,436 |
8la7re | 36 | Model 3 Autopilot keeps telling me to grab the wheel but my hand is already on the wheel! Sorry Tesla I m not gripping the wheel with a the force of 10 nations but my hand is on the wheel. I now don t necessarily trust when Tesla reads the logs after an accident. | This is why I take issue with Tesla s statements Driver did not touch steering wheel for X seconds . No you didn t detect the driver s hands on the wheel for X seconds big difference. You can have your hands on the wheel without giving torque input happens to me all the time. | Give it a jiggle not Kung-fu grip | 34 | 2 | 2,437 |
8la8uh | 22 | [Discussion] Trying to convince HOA for personal NEMA 14-50 plug outside garage I am about to get my model3 and my HOA has rejected my proposal to install nema plug right outside my garage (my own private driveway). Unfortunately even though it s town home my home is under HOA. They reason someone might topple on wire. It s NJ state. Tonight I am planning to attend their meeting and come up with logical reasoning. It s single car garage home and even i want i can t empty out garage to park car inside for charging. And most of times I need to charge my car once or twice in a week. (I will share picture in comments). EDIT: Why i don t park inside? Single car garage and family of 4 .. bicycles small work bench and misc stuff. I will be more than happy to park inside (my precious car) but it won t practical. Even small scratch on side will be disappointing. I want to be ready legally too. Is there any NJ or Federal law something like right to charge . (Google didn t help me). ------ Second EDIT: As i will be installing NEMA 14-50 (with nema adapter inside) almost 3 feet above ground. And I will pull in other cable from car only for charging purpose. Hence there won t be any cable on ground at any time except while my car is backed up to garage door and being charged. And plug will on side of garage with no active walkway. No mailman .. and no neighbors or even landscaping guys. ----- Thanks for all responses. As we all understand HOA is being unreasonable And also have rights to say NO. But I still need to get permission. If they still reject it then I will have to talk to some local HOA lawyer and in mean time put plug inside garage. (ironically i will be still parking in front of garage which charging wire is coming from inside. :) ) | I d like to see you get it outside but is there a way you could fudge the rules by getting it installed right inside the garage door and run the cable under the corner of the door to your car. You can even paint the charge cable bright orange or something to satisfy tripping concerns. HOAs suck. | Image showing physical location of proposed plug and how car will get parked. [image](https: imgur.com YIt31jQ) | 34 | 6 | 2,438 |
8lfdtm | 53 | [DISCUSSION] How do you wash your Model 3? The owner s manual says to avoid touch car washes. A few swirl marks on my car serve as evidence that it s good advice. The only alternatives I see are hand washing and touchless gas station washes that barely get the job done. I hope I m not alone in this sentiment but hand washing is a little above and beyond the effort I m willing to put in for my car. I know this is sacrilege to many people on car forums but I suspect I m in the majority of the general population on this one. Are swirl marks or a dirty car the only alternatives to hand washing? Curious if anyone else doesn t hand wash their Tesla and if so what they do instead. | Go for the touchless washes. Those are the ones with just water jets no spinning whip-like apparatuses. But seriously the mechanical washes are hell on your paint. The scratches referred to aren t deep. They re super small micro scratches. And after accumulating enough of them it will dull the shit out of your awesome car. It will turn to shit before your very eyes. Death by a thousand cuts. | I wash mine at the local automatic wash. No scratches.... all is good! Just pick a good wash and you re fine. | 33 | 2 | 2,439 |
8lfdtm | 53 | [DISCUSSION] How do you wash your Model 3? The owner s manual says to avoid touch car washes. A few swirl marks on my car serve as evidence that it s good advice. The only alternatives I see are hand washing and touchless gas station washes that barely get the job done. I hope I m not alone in this sentiment but hand washing is a little above and beyond the effort I m willing to put in for my car. I know this is sacrilege to many people on car forums but I suspect I m in the majority of the general population on this one. Are swirl marks or a dirty car the only alternatives to hand washing? Curious if anyone else doesn t hand wash their Tesla and if so what they do instead. | I use Optimum No Rinse with two buckets then hand dry using Opti-seal as a drying agent. It only uses four gallons of water can be done in a garage with no mess and yields a really really nice shine with zero scratching if you have good drying towels. ONR: https: www.autogeek.net optimum-no-rinse.html Opti-Seal: https: www.autogeek.net optimum-opti-seal.html Drying towels: Buff Detail Premium Automotive Microfiber Towels | Plush and Extra Microfibers 550 GSM | Satin Piped Edges | Lint-Free | 16 x 16 | 6 Pack (Gray)… https: www.amazon.com dp B076Z3H4D4 ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_qHnbBbSE3C7TH Buckets: $4 buckets from Walmart | I wash mine at the local automatic wash. No scratches.... all is good! Just pick a good wash and you re fine. | 28 | 2 | 2,440 |
8lfdtm | 53 | [DISCUSSION] How do you wash your Model 3? The owner s manual says to avoid touch car washes. A few swirl marks on my car serve as evidence that it s good advice. The only alternatives I see are hand washing and touchless gas station washes that barely get the job done. I hope I m not alone in this sentiment but hand washing is a little above and beyond the effort I m willing to put in for my car. I know this is sacrilege to many people on car forums but I suspect I m in the majority of the general population on this one. Are swirl marks or a dirty car the only alternatives to hand washing? Curious if anyone else doesn t hand wash their Tesla and if so what they do instead. | I use Optimum No Rinse with two buckets then hand dry using Opti-seal as a drying agent. It only uses four gallons of water can be done in a garage with no mess and yields a really really nice shine with zero scratching if you have good drying towels. ONR: https: www.autogeek.net optimum-no-rinse.html Opti-Seal: https: www.autogeek.net optimum-opti-seal.html Drying towels: Buff Detail Premium Automotive Microfiber Towels | Plush and Extra Microfibers 550 GSM | Satin Piped Edges | Lint-Free | 16 x 16 | 6 Pack (Gray)… https: www.amazon.com dp B076Z3H4D4 ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_qHnbBbSE3C7TH Buckets: $4 buckets from Walmart | I ve foam cannoned and hand washed twice in the past four days. Having the car ceramic coated (or doing it yourself) will hugely improve the ease of cleaning. | 28 | 2 | 2,441 |
8li9in | 231 | We re pleased to have a new addition to the r TeslaMotors mod team please welcome u dirtyfries! If you re on the forum often you will see u dirtyfries is one of our top daily contributors. He is often first in comments and had offered a lot to the community. Full disclosure: u dirtyfries informed us he has had the opportunity to consult for Tesla in the past but is not an employee anymore as we had to ensure there wouldn t be a conflict. He has worked closely with Tesla vehicles and knows them intimately and he will be a great addition to the mod team. It s not an easy decision making this choice with so many submissions as we don t want to disappoint others who didn t quite make it. But it s still important to note our runners up who were closely considered (in no particular order) who also contribute very often so we want to thank them too: > u MajesticJG > u WhiskeySauer > u kushari > u rcnfive > u scottg96 > u supratachophobia > u exjr_ Please give u dirtyfries a warm welcome :) | This was certainly a surprise to wake up to. Thanks to the entire mod team and community! I was gonna have a first order of business ready but I ve already removed like 8 blurry Model 3 sightings and 3 Tesla crash posts so meh here we are. Happy to help out this great community and all the fans with their questions concerns. PS: Memes will be removed with extreme prejudice. Edit: [This is me now...if you act like a dick.](http: media.comicbook.com 2018 03 screen-shot-2018-03-16-at-82734-pm-1094040.jpeg) | Awesome! I love me some dirtyfries! | 80 | 2 | 2,442 |
8li9in | 231 | We re pleased to have a new addition to the r TeslaMotors mod team please welcome u dirtyfries! If you re on the forum often you will see u dirtyfries is one of our top daily contributors. He is often first in comments and had offered a lot to the community. Full disclosure: u dirtyfries informed us he has had the opportunity to consult for Tesla in the past but is not an employee anymore as we had to ensure there wouldn t be a conflict. He has worked closely with Tesla vehicles and knows them intimately and he will be a great addition to the mod team. It s not an easy decision making this choice with so many submissions as we don t want to disappoint others who didn t quite make it. But it s still important to note our runners up who were closely considered (in no particular order) who also contribute very often so we want to thank them too: > u MajesticJG > u WhiskeySauer > u kushari > u rcnfive > u scottg96 > u supratachophobia > u exjr_ Please give u dirtyfries a warm welcome :) | This was certainly a surprise to wake up to. Thanks to the entire mod team and community! I was gonna have a first order of business ready but I ve already removed like 8 blurry Model 3 sightings and 3 Tesla crash posts so meh here we are. Happy to help out this great community and all the fans with their questions concerns. PS: Memes will be removed with extreme prejudice. Edit: [This is me now...if you act like a dick.](http: media.comicbook.com 2018 03 screen-shot-2018-03-16-at-82734-pm-1094040.jpeg) | congrats! | 80 | 2 | 2,443 |
8li9in | 231 | We re pleased to have a new addition to the r TeslaMotors mod team please welcome u dirtyfries! If you re on the forum often you will see u dirtyfries is one of our top daily contributors. He is often first in comments and had offered a lot to the community. Full disclosure: u dirtyfries informed us he has had the opportunity to consult for Tesla in the past but is not an employee anymore as we had to ensure there wouldn t be a conflict. He has worked closely with Tesla vehicles and knows them intimately and he will be a great addition to the mod team. It s not an easy decision making this choice with so many submissions as we don t want to disappoint others who didn t quite make it. But it s still important to note our runners up who were closely considered (in no particular order) who also contribute very often so we want to thank them too: > u MajesticJG > u WhiskeySauer > u kushari > u rcnfive > u scottg96 > u supratachophobia > u exjr_ Please give u dirtyfries a warm welcome :) | This was certainly a surprise to wake up to. Thanks to the entire mod team and community! I was gonna have a first order of business ready but I ve already removed like 8 blurry Model 3 sightings and 3 Tesla crash posts so meh here we are. Happy to help out this great community and all the fans with their questions concerns. PS: Memes will be removed with extreme prejudice. Edit: [This is me now...if you act like a dick.](http: media.comicbook.com 2018 03 screen-shot-2018-03-16-at-82734-pm-1094040.jpeg) | Congrats u dirtyfries!!! There s a reason I once mistakenly took you for a mod lol. | 80 | 2 | 2,444 |
8liwpi | 223 | A little bit of perspective when you see Tesla in the news Obviously it s a little concerning when auto manufacturers need to mass recall vehicles. No matter who the manufacturer is. Let me give some examples: [Subaru ABS + Driver Assist 72 000 vehicles in total](https: www.usatoday.com story money cars 2015 06 25 subaru-automatic-braking-failure-recall 29279317 ) > If the switch that activates the brake lights fails the automatic pre-collision braking component of the company s driver-assist system will not function causing the affected vehicle not to react to an obstacle in its path the documents said. > Subaru says the problem can be **fixed by dealers with a simple software flash**. “It s really an easy fix for the customer ” [Audi Volkswagen Skoda 766 000 vehicles in total](http: www.thedrive.com news 12186 volkswagen-recalls-766000-cars-globally-for-brake-issue) > Under some conditions such as “when the driver over-steers under-steers or slams on the brakes ” the anti-lock brake system may fail. **The issue can reportedly be fixed with a software update**. [Toyota 400 000 vehicles in total](https: www.computerworld.com article 2520732 enterprise-applications toyota-to-recall-prius-hybrids-over-abs-software.html) > but when the ABS cuts in the cars switch to hydraulic braking only which can result in reduced braking performance and a longer stopping distance. > It will see **new software loaded into the car that should improve braking** while ABS is active at low speeds the company said. [Volkswagen 135 000 vehicles in total](https: www.automotive-fleet.com 138468 volkswagen-recall-addresses-antilock-brakes-in-older-cars) > To fix the problem dealers will **update the ABS control module software and improve the module s self-testing abilities** [Chrysler 150 000 vehicles in total](https: www.cnet.com roadshow news 2017-chrysler-pacifica-recall-software-glitch-stall ) > Chrysler dealers **will install updated engine control software** on affected models free of charge. And most recently... https: www.reuters.com article us-fiat-chrysler-recall fiat-chrysler-recalls-4-8-million-u-s-vehicles-for-cruise-control-defect-idUSKCN1IQ1QY I realize there are some old and new vehicles in the links I provided but if you do research yourself you ll see that this affects nearly everyone. So when you see things in the news about Tesla remember that they often have an advantage because every car can get an over-the-air software update (except for the original Roadster). And most issues can be fixed with software. Just imagine how much money will be saved if a software update can prevent the need to physically bring in a vehicle when Tesla has over a million vehicles on the road and they can ensure everyone gets the update overnight. Sometimes it s important to provide perspective especially when the car company has been doing over the air updates [since 2012](https: www.motorauthority.com news 1077081_tesla-releases-final-2012-model-s-production-video-ahead-of-friday-deliveries) and they are near the heart of Silicon Valley where software talent thrives. | Also in just the past month BMW has recalled over 300 000 vehicles due to the likelihood of stalling when being driven https: www.independent.co.uk news business news bmw-recall-3-series-z4-x1-car-safety-issues-uk-latest-a8342851.html?amp Mere weeks after that they announced another recall due to a fire risk in the 3 Series https: www.autocar.co.uk car-news industry bmw-issues-new-recall-294000-uk-3-series-due-fan-fire-issue Safety recalls are an unfortunate reality in an imperfect world. Edit: So this just came out today https: www.bbc.com news amp technology-44224794 Hackers were able to find a number of vulnerabilities in BMW s software. | Thanks for the perspective T1000! | 61 | 13 | 2,445 |
8lm6et | 62 | Suggested Software Updates Upvote Party... In the spirit of one of Elon s recent tweets let s use this thread to upvote features tweaks improvements we think can should be pushed out via software update... | Better support for media player sources. Especially for use with voice recognition. Spotify Plex Google Music whatever. It has always been my dream to someday have all my music accessible via voice commands but Slacker has so many shortcomings it is just not cutting it. Additional voice recognition commands : Any and all features controlled by the screen should be implemented with hands-free driving. Open glovebox skip track set wipers to auto enable chill mode sync temperature to 70 etc etc BTW what tweet are we talking about? | My suggestion is Model 3 specific (natch): Improving the auto high-beam algorithm (had to turn it off on the drive from D.C. to RVA last night because literally every highway sign made my headlights dim even in the driving rain) | 86 | 6 | 2,446 |
8lm6et | 62 | Suggested Software Updates Upvote Party... In the spirit of one of Elon s recent tweets let s use this thread to upvote features tweaks improvements we think can should be pushed out via software update... | Better support for media player sources. Especially for use with voice recognition. Spotify Plex Google Music whatever. It has always been my dream to someday have all my music accessible via voice commands but Slacker has so many shortcomings it is just not cutting it. Additional voice recognition commands : Any and all features controlled by the screen should be implemented with hands-free driving. Open glovebox skip track set wipers to auto enable chill mode sync temperature to 70 etc etc BTW what tweet are we talking about? | Android auto carplay or some mirroring app. It s long overdue :_) | 86 | 21 | 2,447 |
8lm6et | 62 | Suggested Software Updates Upvote Party... In the spirit of one of Elon s recent tweets let s use this thread to upvote features tweaks improvements we think can should be pushed out via software update... | WiFi connection support \\(Model 3\\) | My suggestion is Model 3 specific (natch): Improving the auto high-beam algorithm (had to turn it off on the drive from D.C. to RVA last night because literally every highway sign made my headlights dim even in the driving rain) | 60 | 6 | 2,448 |
8lqbr9 | 27 | As summoned Media gets wild over Elons media tweets Well what was to be expected? After Elons tweets about distorted reporting by the the media in classic fashion reacts with distorted reports. From the German media: **Rubbish from start to finish** [Die Welt - Elon Musk blames media for Tesla s misery](https: amp-welt-de.cdn.ampproject.org v s amp.welt.de wirtschaft article176626708 Elektorautobauer-Elon-Musk-gibt-Medien-die-Schuld-fuer-Teslas-Misere.html?amp_js_v=a1& amp_gsa=1#amp_tf=Von%20%251%24s& ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.welt.de%2Fwirtschaft%2Farticle176626708%2FElektorautobauer-Elon-Musk-gibt-Medien-die-Schuld-fuer-Teslas-Misere.html) **clickbait headline but article is short and simply reports what happend** [N-tv - Attack on big media Elon Musk looses his nerve](https: www.n-tv.de 20447774) | Honestly I feel like he s a bit ridiculous lately. I m a big fan of what the guy is doing but come on...just roll with the punches and let your actions speak for themselves. | Dammit clicked on that last one to see if they actually had a spelling error in the title. I have failed. | 43 | 11 | 2,449 |
8lqbr9 | 27 | As summoned Media gets wild over Elons media tweets Well what was to be expected? After Elons tweets about distorted reporting by the the media in classic fashion reacts with distorted reports. From the German media: **Rubbish from start to finish** [Die Welt - Elon Musk blames media for Tesla s misery](https: amp-welt-de.cdn.ampproject.org v s amp.welt.de wirtschaft article176626708 Elektorautobauer-Elon-Musk-gibt-Medien-die-Schuld-fuer-Teslas-Misere.html?amp_js_v=a1& amp_gsa=1#amp_tf=Von%20%251%24s& ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.welt.de%2Fwirtschaft%2Farticle176626708%2FElektorautobauer-Elon-Musk-gibt-Medien-die-Schuld-fuer-Teslas-Misere.html) **clickbait headline but article is short and simply reports what happend** [N-tv - Attack on big media Elon Musk looses his nerve](https: www.n-tv.de 20447774) | Honestly I feel like he s a bit ridiculous lately. I m a big fan of what the guy is doing but come on...just roll with the punches and let your actions speak for themselves. | Elon blames media for distorting the facts so they can make click baity headlines. Media replies by distorting the facts in click baity headlines. Didn t click on the articles. Do these journalists have any integrity at all? | 43 | 14 | 2,450 |
8lqbr9 | 27 | As summoned Media gets wild over Elons media tweets Well what was to be expected? After Elons tweets about distorted reporting by the the media in classic fashion reacts with distorted reports. From the German media: **Rubbish from start to finish** [Die Welt - Elon Musk blames media for Tesla s misery](https: amp-welt-de.cdn.ampproject.org v s amp.welt.de wirtschaft article176626708 Elektorautobauer-Elon-Musk-gibt-Medien-die-Schuld-fuer-Teslas-Misere.html?amp_js_v=a1& amp_gsa=1#amp_tf=Von%20%251%24s& ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.welt.de%2Fwirtschaft%2Farticle176626708%2FElektorautobauer-Elon-Musk-gibt-Medien-die-Schuld-fuer-Teslas-Misere.html) **clickbait headline but article is short and simply reports what happend** [N-tv - Attack on big media Elon Musk looses his nerve](https: www.n-tv.de 20447774) | What I hate is that the more serious journalists who don t really do a bad job get offended and the crappy ones don t give a fuck. | Dammit clicked on that last one to see if they actually had a spelling error in the title. I have failed. | 37 | 11 | 2,451 |
8lqcwr | 53 | Tesla seems to have lower executive turnover than average There is a widespread belief that executive turnover at Tesla is unusually high. This belief seems to result from a misleading inductive bias rather than from hard data. In fact the available data indicates just the opposite: executive turnover at Tesla appears to be lower than average. Google Tesla seems to have lower executive turnover than average for article. (link is blocked). | This article has been removed due to an error in analysis of the data. | I am always a little surprised that so many articles are happy to describe the company as troubled because of this issue while not making any attempt to define what level of turnover is normal or acceptable. The way the news media can shape public perception of issues like this is truly terrifying. | 30 | 2 | 2,452 |
8lqcwr | 53 | Tesla seems to have lower executive turnover than average There is a widespread belief that executive turnover at Tesla is unusually high. This belief seems to result from a misleading inductive bias rather than from hard data. In fact the available data indicates just the opposite: executive turnover at Tesla appears to be lower than average. Google Tesla seems to have lower executive turnover than average for article. (link is blocked). | This article has been removed due to an error in analysis of the data. | Welp I m convinced. | 30 | 3 | 2,453 |
8lthr1 | 127 | Update: My Model 3 experience is quickly turning into a Model S one. From my [original post](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 8ji4lk my_model_3_experience_is_quickly_turning_into_a) I had to take my Model 3 into service less than 48 hours after I got the car. I did the initial dropoff on 5 May got my 3 back on the 17th. The morning of the 18th I ve got a fresh pool of blue in my garage. After Tesla had advised me there wasn t a leak before or maybe some wipe fluid spilled I decided to save this fluid in a paper towel and Ziploc. I was camping from the 18-20 so was using my wife s car and had Tesla come pick the car up. I hadn t touch the wiper fluid just to show that it wasn t that leaking and I had the valet look and see where the fluid was leaking. I ve been back in an S for 4 days and Tesla has no idea what s wrong with my car. They can t reproduce the leak in the shop but I ve provided them multiple forms of evidence that car is leaking. I bought my Model 3 three weeks ago today. So far I ve driven the car for 3 days and have had it in my possession for 5 (not counting camping). I ve spent 17 days with the Model S with no timeline on getting my 3 back. P.S. Becuase I was asked before and I ve got to switch back and forth several times here s what I like more about the S: * **The Doors** are so much nicer. No smudgy fingerprints or awkward hoping the mobile key works. * It s definitely faster (Loaner 1 was a 2018 75 Loaner 2 is a 2014 85) * The sunroof goes back which is pretty cool However I much prefer the 3. The sleek interior and the easy controls create a really nice ambiance. The electronics are more responsive and it starts faster. The backseat is great for car seats and the range is incredible. My Model S experience is getting old and I just want my 3 back and for it to stop bleeding blue! Edit: service just reached out. They found a damaged hose connector the fluid was running down and pooling towards the rear. Replacing the hose and connection should have it back tomorrow! | As a side observation it s refreshing to hear about a service appointment that s not for fixing a tiny nick in the paint under the bumper or to make two body parts be exactly flush. Not that it s not Super Important to make sure that all of the nicks on the car were caused solely by the owner and the people he she parks next to but on the whole these things do clog up the works for folks with blue liquid leaking out on their garage floor for instance or who have a fritzy electronic system. I was getting a smashed window on my 3 fixed recently and I told the tech that I was curious about what the typical repairs have been lately for the Model 3. Cosmetic stuff mostly he said. People being a little picky? I asked. Yeah... he said sighing. | Wasn t the whole plan for the “first production” rollout that Tesla service centers would quickly identify problems and report them back to the designers factory in order to minimize large-scale recalls? If so why isn t a swarm of technicians all over this leak? Also how hard can it be to identify the source of a leak? | 31 | 4 | 2,454 |
8lv0id | 67 | [Discussion] My 29 day old Model S was Rear-ended by a limo driver. $29500 repair cost Insurance offering $2000 for diminished value should I take it? It s been 8 months since the accident. The diminished value report was submitted claiming $9300 but the other party s insurance initially offered $1500 and after 3 months they are offering $2000 as the final offer. How much does a new Model S diminish by value because of accident and repairs worth $30k? Should I go with a legal counsel seeking more? There was no structural damage but a lot of things were replaced which took the bodyshop 3 months(thanks to delay with parts). The other party s insurance took care of everything related to repairs including my rental car and gas for 3 months. | The diminished value is more than $2000. | I can t comment on if you should actually take it or not - but that value seems way too low to me. | 74 | 48 | 2,455 |
8lvif7 | 262 | Not discussed enough: The Model 3 sound system is amazing I just picked up my 3 last night and out of all the fancy features the sound system blew me away with the quality. It sounds amazing: One gripe \\- and apologies if this is incorrect and I just haven t figured it out yet: I wish I could play over the usb rather than be dependent on Bluetooth. | You can play over USB plugged into one of the two front ports. It only works with flash drives not a phone. When a proper USB drive is plugged in you get an extra source called USB. | You *can* play mp3 and flac (and probably other formats) via USB - not sure if that s what you meant or not. | 45 | 3 | 2,456 |
8lvif7 | 262 | Not discussed enough: The Model 3 sound system is amazing I just picked up my 3 last night and out of all the fancy features the sound system blew me away with the quality. It sounds amazing: One gripe \\- and apologies if this is incorrect and I just haven t figured it out yet: I wish I could play over the usb rather than be dependent on Bluetooth. | You can play over USB plugged into one of the two front ports. It only works with flash drives not a phone. When a proper USB drive is plugged in you get an extra source called USB. | There was an early post talking about how an audiophile had a friend with lots of expensive testing equipment check out his Model 3 - and said it was one of the best sound systems in a car he had ever seen even above things like Bentley s. Another thread had someone talking about meeting the guys who designed the system for the Model 3 wanting to use his car for something he couldn t disclose who they were but there was a dedicated independent company used to design the premium system specifically around the shape of the interior and all facets of the car. | 45 | 4 | 2,457 |
8lvif7 | 262 | Not discussed enough: The Model 3 sound system is amazing I just picked up my 3 last night and out of all the fancy features the sound system blew me away with the quality. It sounds amazing: One gripe \\- and apologies if this is incorrect and I just haven t figured it out yet: I wish I could play over the usb rather than be dependent on Bluetooth. | You can play over USB plugged into one of the two front ports. It only works with flash drives not a phone. When a proper USB drive is plugged in you get an extra source called USB. | The sound system is the **only** reason I m considering PUP (got to try it when u youyouxue was in Denver). I really don t care much for any of the other PUP features. | 45 | 4 | 2,458 |
8m22pe | 254 | Model 3 has a pedestrian warning speaker that is not yet installed under the front area of the car confirmed When I lent out the car to the audio system designers for the Model 3 for a couple days they showed me the overall package for both premium and standard audio systems. The difference in physical speaker quality was obvious however I expect the regular sound system to be just fine. They also confirmed that Tesla had them design & finalize a pedestrian warning speaker for the anticipated law requiring the use of such a system. The speaker is water & weather-proof and will be located somewhere under the front hood. All Model 3 s currently don t have this speaker installed so [if law requires a retrofit] a mobile service tech or SC will have to install it for you as required by law. When required new Model 3 production units will come with the speaker pre-installed. I did not get a chance to hear what the actual warning sounds like. Edit: Not 100% sure but I m pretty positive they claimed you won t be able to hear the sound from within the cabin and it will definitely only activate at lower speeds. | Will I be able to blast Move b*tch get out the way by Ludacris through this speaker? | If they are being honest about their role in the Model 3 I have to imagine they have a NDA. | 305 | 2 | 2,459 |
8m22pe | 254 | Model 3 has a pedestrian warning speaker that is not yet installed under the front area of the car confirmed When I lent out the car to the audio system designers for the Model 3 for a couple days they showed me the overall package for both premium and standard audio systems. The difference in physical speaker quality was obvious however I expect the regular sound system to be just fine. They also confirmed that Tesla had them design & finalize a pedestrian warning speaker for the anticipated law requiring the use of such a system. The speaker is water & weather-proof and will be located somewhere under the front hood. All Model 3 s currently don t have this speaker installed so [if law requires a retrofit] a mobile service tech or SC will have to install it for you as required by law. When required new Model 3 production units will come with the speaker pre-installed. I did not get a chance to hear what the actual warning sounds like. Edit: Not 100% sure but I m pretty positive they claimed you won t be able to hear the sound from within the cabin and it will definitely only activate at lower speeds. | Will I be able to blast Move b*tch get out the way by Ludacris through this speaker? | I m pretty sure it ll be close to this kind of [alert](https: youtu.be 3qXM0nZq0RA). | 305 | 3 | 2,460 |
8m22pe | 254 | Model 3 has a pedestrian warning speaker that is not yet installed under the front area of the car confirmed When I lent out the car to the audio system designers for the Model 3 for a couple days they showed me the overall package for both premium and standard audio systems. The difference in physical speaker quality was obvious however I expect the regular sound system to be just fine. They also confirmed that Tesla had them design & finalize a pedestrian warning speaker for the anticipated law requiring the use of such a system. The speaker is water & weather-proof and will be located somewhere under the front hood. All Model 3 s currently don t have this speaker installed so [if law requires a retrofit] a mobile service tech or SC will have to install it for you as required by law. When required new Model 3 production units will come with the speaker pre-installed. I did not get a chance to hear what the actual warning sounds like. Edit: Not 100% sure but I m pretty positive they claimed you won t be able to hear the sound from within the cabin and it will definitely only activate at lower speeds. | Will I be able to blast Move b*tch get out the way by Ludacris through this speaker? | This is cool information thank you. I kind of appreciate that they didn t install the speaker on current production cars. It saves them money and \\(donning my speculation helmet\\) if the law doesn t require retrofitting of old cars means they can t be pressured into activating the speaker in software for vehicles that were produced before the law went into effect. | 305 | 20 | 2,461 |
8m3c6t | 64 | Model S took over steering without AP active (to avoid a perceived collision) I was driving the other day in the left-hand lane alongside a Jersey wall barrier directly to my left. Near the end of the barrier I felt the steering wheel pull slightly to the right and got the high-pitched collision warning beeps as well. I immediately looked at the instrument screen and my proximity to the barrier was in the yellow zone (so not super-close but pretty-close). The car definitely tried to pull itself rightward away from the barrier. It wasn t drastic but enough that I could feel it happening. I did not have any AP features active at the time and was just driving normally manually. I didn t realize this was a feature unless AP was enabled. Did I miss something or is this new? | This is Side Collision Assist documented in the manual. It is indeed active regardless of whether or not you re in Autopilot. | Definitely not new. In fact I had phantom occurrences often (near my house) before the 2018.10.4 release which sometimes would included beeping braking and swerving. I haven t had a single phantom since 2018.10.4. | 36 | 6 | 2,462 |
8m877f | 23 | $1.7 billion in Federal Credit to help sell Model 3 Based on my quick calculation. If Tesla reaches 200k US sale by July 2018 this year and Model 3 US production level continues at the same 5000 vehicles per week for all 26 weeks = 130 000 vehicles = almost $1 billion in Federal credit. This means a total of $1.7 billion before Federal credit runs out f they maintain the same output sale to US of 5000 week (total production is probably more when added in other countries) until the end of 2019. Nice free promotion courtesy of our great government. Glad to see my tax dollars finally put to good use. Year Quarters Model 3 Federal Credit Total 2018 July - Dec 130 000 $7 500 $975 000 000 2019 Jan - Jun 130 000 $3 750 $487 500 000 2019 July - Dec 130 000 $1 875 $243 750 000 $1 706 250 000 | Wow that s almost 1 stealth bomber! | Best use ever. I ve seen estimates that every $7500 credit actually buys about $80k in advanced vehicle research. But I don t have a source on that. | 70 | 13 | 2,463 |
8m877f | 23 | $1.7 billion in Federal Credit to help sell Model 3 Based on my quick calculation. If Tesla reaches 200k US sale by July 2018 this year and Model 3 US production level continues at the same 5000 vehicles per week for all 26 weeks = 130 000 vehicles = almost $1 billion in Federal credit. This means a total of $1.7 billion before Federal credit runs out f they maintain the same output sale to US of 5000 week (total production is probably more when added in other countries) until the end of 2019. Nice free promotion courtesy of our great government. Glad to see my tax dollars finally put to good use. Year Quarters Model 3 Federal Credit Total 2018 July - Dec 130 000 $7 500 $975 000 000 2019 Jan - Jun 130 000 $3 750 $487 500 000 2019 July - Dec 130 000 $1 875 $243 750 000 $1 706 250 000 | Good. We spent will have spent trillions in the Middle East on war for oil. We should have reinvested that here in America instead. We didn t need to redistribute billions of tax dollars into the dirt of Afghanistan and Iraq in the form of bombs and American blood. | Best use ever. I ve seen estimates that every $7500 credit actually buys about $80k in advanced vehicle research. But I don t have a source on that. | 68 | 13 | 2,464 |
8m8bn4 | 232 | My statement regarding the collision on Autopilot Statement Re: Model 3 crash on Autopilot Statement regarding collision 26 May 2018 FLORINA GREECE Thank you everyone for your kind wishes and messages of support following the collision late yesterday night. This is an absolutely devastating loss for me and brings a great journey to a sudden end. I was driving southbound on highway E65 near the city of Florina Greece. I was headed towards Kozani Greece where I planned to charge and spend the night. At this time I was not tired after having 8 hours of sleep the previous night. I engaged Autopilot upon entering the highway after crossing the border between Macedonia \\(FYROM\\) and Greece. My Autopilot maximum speed was set at approximately 120 km h the speed limit for this highway. The highway was well\\-marked well\\-maintained and well\\-lit. The conditions were dry and there was no traffic around me. The highway was two lanes in each direction separated by a concrete median. The highway in my direction of travel divided at a fork with the #2 right lane changing into the exit lane and the #1 left lane remaining the lane for thru traffic. I was travelling in the #1 lane. My left hand was grasping the bottom of the steering wheel during the drive my right hand was resting on my lap. The vehicle showed no signs of difficulty following the road up until this fork. As the gore point began approximately 8m before the crash barrier and end of the fork my Model 3 veered suddenly and with great force to the right. I was taking a glance at the navigation on my phone and was not paying full attention to the road. I was startled by the sudden change in direction of the car and I attempted to apply additional grip onto the steering wheel in an attempt to correct the steering. This input was too late and although I was only a few inches from clearing the crash barrier the front left of the vehicle near the wheel well crashed into the right edge of the barrier resulting in severe damage. I was not harmed in the collision and no medical attention has been sought. I was wearing my seatbelt before and during the collision. None of the airbags deployed. My Model 3 is not drivable as the front left wheel is completely shattered and the axle is out of alignment. The damage is severe on the left of the front bumper running to the front lip of the driver s door and is moderately severe from there to the left of the back bumper. The vehicle has been towed to a shop and at 09:00 today I will accompany the vehicle on a tow truck to Thessaloniki. I am towing the car there under recommendation from locals as more resources are available there including resources to repatriate the vehicle back to the United States. I will make a decision soon as to whether or not it makes sense to bring this car back to the United States in an attempt to fix it as the cost to repair the vehicle may substantially exceed its value after repair or salvage value. Tesla states in an on\\-screen warning that both hands should be on the wheel when Autopilot is activated. Furthermore Tesla states that drivers should be paying attention and monitoring the performance of Autopilot at all times. It is likely true that if all drivers obeyed the warnings surrounding this software that most of the collisions we hear about in the press would never happen. Autopilot has limitations that currently can only be overcome through human intervention. For example it cannot detect stationary objects which explains collisions where Model S has rear\\-ended stationary vehicles parked on the side of the road. By looking at my navigation and by not having both hands on the wheel I was not paying full attention to the road while the vehicle was in Autopilot and was not following Tesla s directions in regards to the correct use of the software. I want to make it clear that I take responsibility in regards to my actions. With that being said I do not believe that there are many Tesla owners who when using Autopilot always keep both hands on the wheel and provide their undivided attention to monitoring the road and the software. This collision was directly caused by the Autopilot software seriously malfunctioning and misinterpreting the road. This collision could have happened to anyone who does not expect a car travelling at a fast speed in a straight line to suddenly and without warning veer off course. After tens of thousands of kilometres worth of Autopilot driving without major incidents I have learned to trust the software. Autopilot provides users with a strong sense of security and reliability as it takes you to your destination and navigates traffic on your behalf. Clearly I had become too trusting of the software. Autopilot is marketed as a driver assistance feature that reduces stress and improves safety. However the vigilance required to use the software such as keeping both hands on the wheel and constantly monitoring the system for malfunctions or abnormal behaviour arguably requires significantly more attention than just driving the vehicle normally without use of Autopilot. Furthermore I believe that if Autopilot even has the small potential of misreading a clearly marked gore point and has the potential to drive into a gore point and crash into a barrier it should not be tested in beta on the open road and by normal consumers. My experience is not unique as many drivers have reported similar behaviour from Autopilot and a fatal crash involving Autopilot on a Model X may have been caused by a disturbingly similar malfunction. Many Tesla fans will likely dismiss this as fully my fault but I implore those who believe so to take a full step back and put themselves in my shoes as a driver who had used this amazing software for so long and who could not have anticipated such a sudden and violent jerk of the wheel to one direction while travelling at a fast speed. I hope that my fellow owners will be less dismissive of various incidents regarding Autopilot and understand that the general public views these severe collisions differently from the owner community. Tesla is moving quickly into the mass market and potential customers in that segment aren t going to ask “why were both of his hands not on the wheel while the car was in Autopilot?” rather they are going to ask “why did the car swerve into the gore point without warning?”. The autonomous driving movement as well as the Tesla community can only get stronger when we tackle these questions and resolve the issues behind them. I love my Teslas and I have owned a Tesla since 2014. I am upset with myself for being part of the growing list of individuals who have been involved in collisions while their Tesla was on Autopilot. I strongly believe in the capability of self\\-driving vehicles to not only eliminate all collisions on the road but to revolutionise our society. However malfunctions like this greatly reduce the public s confidence in a technology that should indeed be tested and rolled out to the public as soon as it is safe for use. I do not want to cause Tesla damage to its brand or image as I wholly support its mission and I am a big supporter. I only hope that Tesla will investigate this incident to determine what went wrong with the software and make improvements that will enhance other people s experiences with the car. I am very grateful to be alive after what could have easily been a fatal collision. This incident was not more severe thanks to an excellent crash barrier on the Greek highway. I want to thank everyone again for your messages of support. I am honoured to have had this opportunity to spread the EV movement not only around my country but around the world. In closing I want to address some of my critics who have used this collision to laugh at me or to otherwise make fun of this incident. On this road trip there have indeed been crazy posts where I push the limit of my car and I have only done these things to share my excitement about my Model 3 with others. Please understand that there was nothing out of the ordinary occurring before this collision. I was not sleeping at the wheel I was not tired I was not eating at the wheel \\(which by the way I have not done before\\) no videos were being filmed \\- the vehicle was being operated normally. I am truly sorry and deeply regret that some of my actions have caused a bad taste in people s mouths I ask those people to judge my road trip thus far as a whole and not by my craziest or worst moments. I have met with over 8000 people on the road in three continents and 25 countries and have demonstrated that not only is it possible to drive an EV across the world it is absolutely exhilarating and brings along great adventure along the way. I have also seen the potential and power of the EV owners community which when leveraged can make a great difference in our world. I ask those who disapprove of my actions to reconsider their stance and I want to see what positive things can come of this collision. What happens next on this road trip is uncertain. I will keep everyone posted. Edit: small typo | Are you sure this was caused by autopilot and not by a failure in your steering system? I think I saw a post from you saying that it was making some bad noises when turning. It seems like that could be a symptom of a mechanical problem. When you say you couldn t overpower it it makes it sound like it was something other than autopilot because you should be able to overpower autopilot pretty easily with one hand. | Thanks for the long write up. Glad you are okay. I actually read the whole thing! | 102 | 2 | 2,465 |
8m8bn4 | 232 | My statement regarding the collision on Autopilot Statement Re: Model 3 crash on Autopilot Statement regarding collision 26 May 2018 FLORINA GREECE Thank you everyone for your kind wishes and messages of support following the collision late yesterday night. This is an absolutely devastating loss for me and brings a great journey to a sudden end. I was driving southbound on highway E65 near the city of Florina Greece. I was headed towards Kozani Greece where I planned to charge and spend the night. At this time I was not tired after having 8 hours of sleep the previous night. I engaged Autopilot upon entering the highway after crossing the border between Macedonia \\(FYROM\\) and Greece. My Autopilot maximum speed was set at approximately 120 km h the speed limit for this highway. The highway was well\\-marked well\\-maintained and well\\-lit. The conditions were dry and there was no traffic around me. The highway was two lanes in each direction separated by a concrete median. The highway in my direction of travel divided at a fork with the #2 right lane changing into the exit lane and the #1 left lane remaining the lane for thru traffic. I was travelling in the #1 lane. My left hand was grasping the bottom of the steering wheel during the drive my right hand was resting on my lap. The vehicle showed no signs of difficulty following the road up until this fork. As the gore point began approximately 8m before the crash barrier and end of the fork my Model 3 veered suddenly and with great force to the right. I was taking a glance at the navigation on my phone and was not paying full attention to the road. I was startled by the sudden change in direction of the car and I attempted to apply additional grip onto the steering wheel in an attempt to correct the steering. This input was too late and although I was only a few inches from clearing the crash barrier the front left of the vehicle near the wheel well crashed into the right edge of the barrier resulting in severe damage. I was not harmed in the collision and no medical attention has been sought. I was wearing my seatbelt before and during the collision. None of the airbags deployed. My Model 3 is not drivable as the front left wheel is completely shattered and the axle is out of alignment. The damage is severe on the left of the front bumper running to the front lip of the driver s door and is moderately severe from there to the left of the back bumper. The vehicle has been towed to a shop and at 09:00 today I will accompany the vehicle on a tow truck to Thessaloniki. I am towing the car there under recommendation from locals as more resources are available there including resources to repatriate the vehicle back to the United States. I will make a decision soon as to whether or not it makes sense to bring this car back to the United States in an attempt to fix it as the cost to repair the vehicle may substantially exceed its value after repair or salvage value. Tesla states in an on\\-screen warning that both hands should be on the wheel when Autopilot is activated. Furthermore Tesla states that drivers should be paying attention and monitoring the performance of Autopilot at all times. It is likely true that if all drivers obeyed the warnings surrounding this software that most of the collisions we hear about in the press would never happen. Autopilot has limitations that currently can only be overcome through human intervention. For example it cannot detect stationary objects which explains collisions where Model S has rear\\-ended stationary vehicles parked on the side of the road. By looking at my navigation and by not having both hands on the wheel I was not paying full attention to the road while the vehicle was in Autopilot and was not following Tesla s directions in regards to the correct use of the software. I want to make it clear that I take responsibility in regards to my actions. With that being said I do not believe that there are many Tesla owners who when using Autopilot always keep both hands on the wheel and provide their undivided attention to monitoring the road and the software. This collision was directly caused by the Autopilot software seriously malfunctioning and misinterpreting the road. This collision could have happened to anyone who does not expect a car travelling at a fast speed in a straight line to suddenly and without warning veer off course. After tens of thousands of kilometres worth of Autopilot driving without major incidents I have learned to trust the software. Autopilot provides users with a strong sense of security and reliability as it takes you to your destination and navigates traffic on your behalf. Clearly I had become too trusting of the software. Autopilot is marketed as a driver assistance feature that reduces stress and improves safety. However the vigilance required to use the software such as keeping both hands on the wheel and constantly monitoring the system for malfunctions or abnormal behaviour arguably requires significantly more attention than just driving the vehicle normally without use of Autopilot. Furthermore I believe that if Autopilot even has the small potential of misreading a clearly marked gore point and has the potential to drive into a gore point and crash into a barrier it should not be tested in beta on the open road and by normal consumers. My experience is not unique as many drivers have reported similar behaviour from Autopilot and a fatal crash involving Autopilot on a Model X may have been caused by a disturbingly similar malfunction. Many Tesla fans will likely dismiss this as fully my fault but I implore those who believe so to take a full step back and put themselves in my shoes as a driver who had used this amazing software for so long and who could not have anticipated such a sudden and violent jerk of the wheel to one direction while travelling at a fast speed. I hope that my fellow owners will be less dismissive of various incidents regarding Autopilot and understand that the general public views these severe collisions differently from the owner community. Tesla is moving quickly into the mass market and potential customers in that segment aren t going to ask “why were both of his hands not on the wheel while the car was in Autopilot?” rather they are going to ask “why did the car swerve into the gore point without warning?”. The autonomous driving movement as well as the Tesla community can only get stronger when we tackle these questions and resolve the issues behind them. I love my Teslas and I have owned a Tesla since 2014. I am upset with myself for being part of the growing list of individuals who have been involved in collisions while their Tesla was on Autopilot. I strongly believe in the capability of self\\-driving vehicles to not only eliminate all collisions on the road but to revolutionise our society. However malfunctions like this greatly reduce the public s confidence in a technology that should indeed be tested and rolled out to the public as soon as it is safe for use. I do not want to cause Tesla damage to its brand or image as I wholly support its mission and I am a big supporter. I only hope that Tesla will investigate this incident to determine what went wrong with the software and make improvements that will enhance other people s experiences with the car. I am very grateful to be alive after what could have easily been a fatal collision. This incident was not more severe thanks to an excellent crash barrier on the Greek highway. I want to thank everyone again for your messages of support. I am honoured to have had this opportunity to spread the EV movement not only around my country but around the world. In closing I want to address some of my critics who have used this collision to laugh at me or to otherwise make fun of this incident. On this road trip there have indeed been crazy posts where I push the limit of my car and I have only done these things to share my excitement about my Model 3 with others. Please understand that there was nothing out of the ordinary occurring before this collision. I was not sleeping at the wheel I was not tired I was not eating at the wheel \\(which by the way I have not done before\\) no videos were being filmed \\- the vehicle was being operated normally. I am truly sorry and deeply regret that some of my actions have caused a bad taste in people s mouths I ask those people to judge my road trip thus far as a whole and not by my craziest or worst moments. I have met with over 8000 people on the road in three continents and 25 countries and have demonstrated that not only is it possible to drive an EV across the world it is absolutely exhilarating and brings along great adventure along the way. I have also seen the potential and power of the EV owners community which when leveraged can make a great difference in our world. I ask those who disapprove of my actions to reconsider their stance and I want to see what positive things can come of this collision. What happens next on this road trip is uncertain. I will keep everyone posted. Edit: small typo | Are you sure this was caused by autopilot and not by a failure in your steering system? I think I saw a post from you saying that it was making some bad noises when turning. It seems like that could be a symptom of a mechanical problem. When you say you couldn t overpower it it makes it sound like it was something other than autopilot because you should be able to overpower autopilot pretty easily with one hand. | Any accident at high speed is traumatic I m glad you re ok and hope you ll be ok after this experience. Between the possible faulty wheel issue (which I don t think you addressed) looking at your phone and experiencing a traumatic event I m unsure you can say with certainty the distance you were from the gore before the swerve. I ve no doubt you have no doubt but memory is a tricky thing. Hopefully Tesla can pull your data log from Europe to clarify. The common denominator for all auto pilot crashes are the drivers eyes. Every time. God speed YouYou | 102 | 3 | 2,466 |
8m8bn4 | 232 | My statement regarding the collision on Autopilot Statement Re: Model 3 crash on Autopilot Statement regarding collision 26 May 2018 FLORINA GREECE Thank you everyone for your kind wishes and messages of support following the collision late yesterday night. This is an absolutely devastating loss for me and brings a great journey to a sudden end. I was driving southbound on highway E65 near the city of Florina Greece. I was headed towards Kozani Greece where I planned to charge and spend the night. At this time I was not tired after having 8 hours of sleep the previous night. I engaged Autopilot upon entering the highway after crossing the border between Macedonia \\(FYROM\\) and Greece. My Autopilot maximum speed was set at approximately 120 km h the speed limit for this highway. The highway was well\\-marked well\\-maintained and well\\-lit. The conditions were dry and there was no traffic around me. The highway was two lanes in each direction separated by a concrete median. The highway in my direction of travel divided at a fork with the #2 right lane changing into the exit lane and the #1 left lane remaining the lane for thru traffic. I was travelling in the #1 lane. My left hand was grasping the bottom of the steering wheel during the drive my right hand was resting on my lap. The vehicle showed no signs of difficulty following the road up until this fork. As the gore point began approximately 8m before the crash barrier and end of the fork my Model 3 veered suddenly and with great force to the right. I was taking a glance at the navigation on my phone and was not paying full attention to the road. I was startled by the sudden change in direction of the car and I attempted to apply additional grip onto the steering wheel in an attempt to correct the steering. This input was too late and although I was only a few inches from clearing the crash barrier the front left of the vehicle near the wheel well crashed into the right edge of the barrier resulting in severe damage. I was not harmed in the collision and no medical attention has been sought. I was wearing my seatbelt before and during the collision. None of the airbags deployed. My Model 3 is not drivable as the front left wheel is completely shattered and the axle is out of alignment. The damage is severe on the left of the front bumper running to the front lip of the driver s door and is moderately severe from there to the left of the back bumper. The vehicle has been towed to a shop and at 09:00 today I will accompany the vehicle on a tow truck to Thessaloniki. I am towing the car there under recommendation from locals as more resources are available there including resources to repatriate the vehicle back to the United States. I will make a decision soon as to whether or not it makes sense to bring this car back to the United States in an attempt to fix it as the cost to repair the vehicle may substantially exceed its value after repair or salvage value. Tesla states in an on\\-screen warning that both hands should be on the wheel when Autopilot is activated. Furthermore Tesla states that drivers should be paying attention and monitoring the performance of Autopilot at all times. It is likely true that if all drivers obeyed the warnings surrounding this software that most of the collisions we hear about in the press would never happen. Autopilot has limitations that currently can only be overcome through human intervention. For example it cannot detect stationary objects which explains collisions where Model S has rear\\-ended stationary vehicles parked on the side of the road. By looking at my navigation and by not having both hands on the wheel I was not paying full attention to the road while the vehicle was in Autopilot and was not following Tesla s directions in regards to the correct use of the software. I want to make it clear that I take responsibility in regards to my actions. With that being said I do not believe that there are many Tesla owners who when using Autopilot always keep both hands on the wheel and provide their undivided attention to monitoring the road and the software. This collision was directly caused by the Autopilot software seriously malfunctioning and misinterpreting the road. This collision could have happened to anyone who does not expect a car travelling at a fast speed in a straight line to suddenly and without warning veer off course. After tens of thousands of kilometres worth of Autopilot driving without major incidents I have learned to trust the software. Autopilot provides users with a strong sense of security and reliability as it takes you to your destination and navigates traffic on your behalf. Clearly I had become too trusting of the software. Autopilot is marketed as a driver assistance feature that reduces stress and improves safety. However the vigilance required to use the software such as keeping both hands on the wheel and constantly monitoring the system for malfunctions or abnormal behaviour arguably requires significantly more attention than just driving the vehicle normally without use of Autopilot. Furthermore I believe that if Autopilot even has the small potential of misreading a clearly marked gore point and has the potential to drive into a gore point and crash into a barrier it should not be tested in beta on the open road and by normal consumers. My experience is not unique as many drivers have reported similar behaviour from Autopilot and a fatal crash involving Autopilot on a Model X may have been caused by a disturbingly similar malfunction. Many Tesla fans will likely dismiss this as fully my fault but I implore those who believe so to take a full step back and put themselves in my shoes as a driver who had used this amazing software for so long and who could not have anticipated such a sudden and violent jerk of the wheel to one direction while travelling at a fast speed. I hope that my fellow owners will be less dismissive of various incidents regarding Autopilot and understand that the general public views these severe collisions differently from the owner community. Tesla is moving quickly into the mass market and potential customers in that segment aren t going to ask “why were both of his hands not on the wheel while the car was in Autopilot?” rather they are going to ask “why did the car swerve into the gore point without warning?”. The autonomous driving movement as well as the Tesla community can only get stronger when we tackle these questions and resolve the issues behind them. I love my Teslas and I have owned a Tesla since 2014. I am upset with myself for being part of the growing list of individuals who have been involved in collisions while their Tesla was on Autopilot. I strongly believe in the capability of self\\-driving vehicles to not only eliminate all collisions on the road but to revolutionise our society. However malfunctions like this greatly reduce the public s confidence in a technology that should indeed be tested and rolled out to the public as soon as it is safe for use. I do not want to cause Tesla damage to its brand or image as I wholly support its mission and I am a big supporter. I only hope that Tesla will investigate this incident to determine what went wrong with the software and make improvements that will enhance other people s experiences with the car. I am very grateful to be alive after what could have easily been a fatal collision. This incident was not more severe thanks to an excellent crash barrier on the Greek highway. I want to thank everyone again for your messages of support. I am honoured to have had this opportunity to spread the EV movement not only around my country but around the world. In closing I want to address some of my critics who have used this collision to laugh at me or to otherwise make fun of this incident. On this road trip there have indeed been crazy posts where I push the limit of my car and I have only done these things to share my excitement about my Model 3 with others. Please understand that there was nothing out of the ordinary occurring before this collision. I was not sleeping at the wheel I was not tired I was not eating at the wheel \\(which by the way I have not done before\\) no videos were being filmed \\- the vehicle was being operated normally. I am truly sorry and deeply regret that some of my actions have caused a bad taste in people s mouths I ask those people to judge my road trip thus far as a whole and not by my craziest or worst moments. I have met with over 8000 people on the road in three continents and 25 countries and have demonstrated that not only is it possible to drive an EV across the world it is absolutely exhilarating and brings along great adventure along the way. I have also seen the potential and power of the EV owners community which when leveraged can make a great difference in our world. I ask those who disapprove of my actions to reconsider their stance and I want to see what positive things can come of this collision. What happens next on this road trip is uncertain. I will keep everyone posted. Edit: small typo | Are you sure this was caused by autopilot and not by a failure in your steering system? I think I saw a post from you saying that it was making some bad noises when turning. It seems like that could be a symptom of a mechanical problem. When you say you couldn t overpower it it makes it sound like it was something other than autopilot because you should be able to overpower autopilot pretty easily with one hand. | Just glad you re safe. Thanks for sharing your experience. I m a TM3 UK reservation holder equally excited and nervous about EAP. | 102 | 3 | 2,467 |
8mkwxv | 330 | [DISCUSSION] Tesla should be more transparent in the release notes of their OTA updates when the changes involve the way the car operates. Like the title says Tesla should treat OTA updates the same way we receive app updates in our phones. I am very surprised that owners had to find out about the Model 3 brake update through a tweet from Elon instead of through the car when they first applied the update. I know for the most part they include major changes in the release notes but often times owners receive the several updates that have the same release notes. So it leaves me wondering why the update? What changed? Even if it s a simple “bug fixes and improvements.” Thoughts? | While they do publish release notes they are almost comically incomplete. I agree with OP. | Usually there are a number of minor arcane things that usually get fixed in a software release. For the average person a list of those would sound like the soul-destroying fine print on a user agreement and people would just start ignoring them. Maybe if they offered a release page on their website or by pressing a button called Gory Details. I get why they just draw our attention to things that rise to the level of a feature enhancement. Because improving the consistency of stopping from high speeds in more conditions than before would just be confusing and probably misunderstood. The car was not unsafe before and remember Motor Trend s best stopping result was 119 feet. They were totally pleased with that aspect as were other road testers. (They duplicate feature additions because some people skip versions and only get those features a release or two later. I suppose they could make them previous installed version-sensitive. ) | 119 | 4 | 2,468 |
8mkwxv | 330 | [DISCUSSION] Tesla should be more transparent in the release notes of their OTA updates when the changes involve the way the car operates. Like the title says Tesla should treat OTA updates the same way we receive app updates in our phones. I am very surprised that owners had to find out about the Model 3 brake update through a tweet from Elon instead of through the car when they first applied the update. I know for the most part they include major changes in the release notes but often times owners receive the several updates that have the same release notes. So it leaves me wondering why the update? What changed? Even if it s a simple “bug fixes and improvements.” Thoughts? | While they do publish release notes they are almost comically incomplete. I agree with OP. | I agree on this. Sometimes you hear about some minor bug fixes or etc. i d like to know the details of that! What bug fixes are you fixing. I like knowing details out of curiosity. | 119 | 7 | 2,469 |
8mkwxv | 330 | [DISCUSSION] Tesla should be more transparent in the release notes of their OTA updates when the changes involve the way the car operates. Like the title says Tesla should treat OTA updates the same way we receive app updates in our phones. I am very surprised that owners had to find out about the Model 3 brake update through a tweet from Elon instead of through the car when they first applied the update. I know for the most part they include major changes in the release notes but often times owners receive the several updates that have the same release notes. So it leaves me wondering why the update? What changed? Even if it s a simple “bug fixes and improvements.” Thoughts? | While they do publish release notes they are almost comically incomplete. I agree with OP. | I thought they did with the release notes published on screen in the car? | 119 | 8 | 2,470 |
8mt10q | 76 | My Model 3 is my first new car ever I had a 2009 Prius for 4 months before that. Basically my first car ever. Anybody else in the same club? | Yes. I m 50 years old and never spent a 5 digit amount on a car. Buying new cars always seemed stupid to me because of depreciation but Tesla made me weak. I rented a Model S and a Model X for two days each. Now I am trapped between you only live once and economical habits. | Yup same here. Only have bought 2 cars both used. They were about 2-3 yo when I got them. Last car was 2006 Infiniti M35x. EDIT: it s also my first American car. My first EV. | 74 | 16 | 2,471 |
8muxb4 | 140 | Tesla rolling out Performance Version AWD before regular AWD per Twitter... “Yes AWD P first and then AWD. Production costs are always high when line first gets going so we have to sell higher price versions first or each car will have very negative margins. As production efficiency rises we can make lower cost versions & not lose money.” | The environment Tesla is operating in changed. The model 3 took longer to ramp than expected and the market has turned very negative on Tesla. They are not being given the leeway to lose $$$ until they have fully ramped to 10k week. So they are very smartly adapting. It was not a lie before and its not sleazy move now. Adapt or die. They are going to crush it. | Source? | 114 | 6 | 2,472 |
8muxb4 | 140 | Tesla rolling out Performance Version AWD before regular AWD per Twitter... “Yes AWD P first and then AWD. Production costs are always high when line first gets going so we have to sell higher price versions first or each car will have very negative margins. As production efficiency rises we can make lower cost versions & not lose money.” | The environment Tesla is operating in changed. The model 3 took longer to ramp than expected and the market has turned very negative on Tesla. They are not being given the leeway to lose $$$ until they have fully ramped to 10k week. So they are very smartly adapting. It was not a lie before and its not sleazy move now. Adapt or die. They are going to crush it. | The good news is not many people are going to pay the premium for performance model 3 so don t worry about it. | 114 | 10 | 2,473 |
8muxb4 | 140 | Tesla rolling out Performance Version AWD before regular AWD per Twitter... “Yes AWD P first and then AWD. Production costs are always high when line first gets going so we have to sell higher price versions first or each car will have very negative margins. As production efficiency rises we can make lower cost versions & not lose money.” | The environment Tesla is operating in changed. The model 3 took longer to ramp than expected and the market has turned very negative on Tesla. They are not being given the leeway to lose $$$ until they have fully ramped to 10k week. So they are very smartly adapting. It was not a lie before and its not sleazy move now. Adapt or die. They are going to crush it. | I appreciate that this sucks for a lot of people but it would suck more that Tesla goes broke trying to get profit margins on an already low margin car. | 114 | 20 | 2,474 |
8mzaw2 | 53 | Model 3 fit & finish panel gaps etc initial survey scores are in * [Here](https: i.imgur.com hM7zTup.png) is a screenshot. * [Here](https: docs.google.com spreadsheets d e 2PACX-1vSkckurdmbXt5Bh4dVenUhsjoal1Y6qRIkFBG_tcOhTxGp6xUL5j8DqkMPY0K9TfOCDz83A_7HGcQCl pubhtml?gid=1940616588) is the published web version of the Google sheet. * [Here](https: docs.google.com spreadsheets d 1Epf_BY83M9FcuuOKfinQSSwSQtSfRxb-qVBcWmvXKY8 edit#gid=1432656320) is the Google sheet. Look at the Options & more tab. The idea is to monitor how these will change over time as more people fill in the survey. So far 81 Model 3 buyers who have taken delivery have submitted data. As time goes on I will add charts that show how the rating changes over time. If panel gaps change from 4.3 stars to 4.5 or 4.1 we will be able to see that. If you have taken delivery of a Model 3 and you want to submit your data click [here](https: docs.google.com forms d e 1FAIpQLScW5QUYZatZZRohDYhm1jGC_Ta0kJ6gJrtvg8gWSHi40TfO1g viewform) for the Google form. The links are also available in the sidebar where it says Model 3 Invites Spreadsheet . | Took delivery at 10:30am this morning and the car is flawless ... couldn t be happier. | I wish there were concrete objective measurements instead of it being totally subjective. Examples are a checklist of things that did or didn t happen at delivery actual panel gap measurements and places to measure (auto calculate tolerance). etc. | 36 | 4 | 2,475 |
8mzaw2 | 53 | Model 3 fit & finish panel gaps etc initial survey scores are in * [Here](https: i.imgur.com hM7zTup.png) is a screenshot. * [Here](https: docs.google.com spreadsheets d e 2PACX-1vSkckurdmbXt5Bh4dVenUhsjoal1Y6qRIkFBG_tcOhTxGp6xUL5j8DqkMPY0K9TfOCDz83A_7HGcQCl pubhtml?gid=1940616588) is the published web version of the Google sheet. * [Here](https: docs.google.com spreadsheets d 1Epf_BY83M9FcuuOKfinQSSwSQtSfRxb-qVBcWmvXKY8 edit#gid=1432656320) is the Google sheet. Look at the Options & more tab. The idea is to monitor how these will change over time as more people fill in the survey. So far 81 Model 3 buyers who have taken delivery have submitted data. As time goes on I will add charts that show how the rating changes over time. If panel gaps change from 4.3 stars to 4.5 or 4.1 we will be able to see that. If you have taken delivery of a Model 3 and you want to submit your data click [here](https: docs.google.com forms d e 1FAIpQLScW5QUYZatZZRohDYhm1jGC_Ta0kJ6gJrtvg8gWSHi40TfO1g viewform) for the Google form. The links are also available in the sidebar where it says Model 3 Invites Spreadsheet . | Took delivery at 10:30am this morning and the car is flawless ... couldn t be happier. | Nice work. Does something similar exist for service center visits within the first months after delivery? By reading reddit and other forums you would think that pretty much every Model 3 needs rework done after delivery. I wonder what the real numbers are. | 36 | 5 | 2,476 |
8mzaw2 | 53 | Model 3 fit & finish panel gaps etc initial survey scores are in * [Here](https: i.imgur.com hM7zTup.png) is a screenshot. * [Here](https: docs.google.com spreadsheets d e 2PACX-1vSkckurdmbXt5Bh4dVenUhsjoal1Y6qRIkFBG_tcOhTxGp6xUL5j8DqkMPY0K9TfOCDz83A_7HGcQCl pubhtml?gid=1940616588) is the published web version of the Google sheet. * [Here](https: docs.google.com spreadsheets d 1Epf_BY83M9FcuuOKfinQSSwSQtSfRxb-qVBcWmvXKY8 edit#gid=1432656320) is the Google sheet. Look at the Options & more tab. The idea is to monitor how these will change over time as more people fill in the survey. So far 81 Model 3 buyers who have taken delivery have submitted data. As time goes on I will add charts that show how the rating changes over time. If panel gaps change from 4.3 stars to 4.5 or 4.1 we will be able to see that. If you have taken delivery of a Model 3 and you want to submit your data click [here](https: docs.google.com forms d e 1FAIpQLScW5QUYZatZZRohDYhm1jGC_Ta0kJ6gJrtvg8gWSHi40TfO1g viewform) for the Google form. The links are also available in the sidebar where it says Model 3 Invites Spreadsheet . | Took delivery at 10:30am this morning and the car is flawless ... couldn t be happier. | It d be interesting to see how those results have changed over time. Anecdotally (just based on looking at pictures) it seems to have improved quite a bit over early builds. | 36 | 6 | 2,477 |
8n35zz | 80 | Feature Request: Allow me to disable my Tesla (no key fob will work until I reactivate it) In order to prevent surprise theft or unwanted entry while away it would be nice to completely disable entry to the car until I enter the app and reactivate the car. | This is a good idea until Tesla s API goes down (like it did last night) | Also notifications when somebody turn on the car start the car etc. | 46 | 20 | 2,478 |
8n5iqq | 271 | The organization Reveal and it s top people have gone from falsifying information regrading Tesla s safety record to now pushing a conspiracy theory that Elon Musk is an anti-semitic white supremacist... First...quick context... Reveal is an organization that is supposed to be investigating bad things. They ve made up some blatantly false allegations against Tesla recently. Because of that they ve gone balls to the wall and are trying to get anything to stick to the wall... -Exhibit A: https: www.revealnews.org As you can see there are three wonderful anti-Tesla pieces on their homepage at the same time. Huh...seems a wee-little-bit biased but whatever... Now...as you know...these reports have had little to no impact on anyone s perception of Tesla. Tesla has admitted some shortfalls but nothing close to the extent these articles are trying to persuade readers to believe. If you hate Tesla this hasn t changed your mind...and if you love Tesla this hasn t change your mind.... Enter Al Letson a journalist reporter he is from Reveal. -Exhibit B: https: imgur.com a FBWea8f Here we have someone who is supposed to be a real journalist ignoring the context of multiple conversations the context of an answer to a question and telling his followers & the public that Elon Musk is propagating anti-Jewish sentiment. When someone tells you who they are believe them - a phrase often thrown at racists. He has ALL of the information in front of him to see that isn t the case...and he ignored it willingly...and is trying to convince the public that Elon Musk is a white supremacist. The same guy who is behind the anti-Tesla hit pieces. Later on he deleted the tweet... -Exhibit C: https: twitter.com Al_Letson status 1001118461265772544 Hmmm... He says he deleted the tweet because he was tired of being trolled. AND THEN HE DOUBLES DOWN. Now he accuses Elon Musk of being a secret-closet white supremacist who is being tricky with his racist views. -Exhibit D: https: twitter.com Al_Letson status 1001148960348647424 -Exhibit E: https: twitter.com Al_Letson status 1000988698899447808 He then admits he may be wrong...BUT STILL INSINUATES that Elon Musk is a racist...and says we may not all agree ... MOTHER-F-ER THIS ISN T A DISCUSSION OVER THE LAST PLAY OF THE VIKINGS-SAINTS GAME. THERE IS NO DISCUSSION. HE ISN T A RACIST. The next time ANYONE considers Reveal a legitimate news source please keep in mind the context. Their authors have NO ISSUE with trying to convince the public that Elon Musk is a white-supremacist. If they ll push lies about him being a white supremacist...if they are willing to do that...they will do ANYTHING. Quick Note: I m ignoring Elon s advice to be nice to these people. No. I will not. I won t do it. As someone who is fricken Jewish and has been the victim of real freaking white supremacists it is a disgrace to see people getting away with accusing the CEO of Tesla of racism but still getting to retain their credibility. End Rant. | If Reveal wants credibility they should fire Al Letson. No other way. He has no regret has been given many opportunities to take back his accusations and hasn t take the opportunity. | Wow Reveal hates african americans enough to start lying smear campaigns against them to try and drum up more hatred of african americans. Hope their racist drum beating hatred rally cries don t bite them in the ass! It would be a shame if people noticed what they were doing that shit is never popular. | 54 | 5 | 2,479 |
8n5iqq | 271 | The organization Reveal and it s top people have gone from falsifying information regrading Tesla s safety record to now pushing a conspiracy theory that Elon Musk is an anti-semitic white supremacist... First...quick context... Reveal is an organization that is supposed to be investigating bad things. They ve made up some blatantly false allegations against Tesla recently. Because of that they ve gone balls to the wall and are trying to get anything to stick to the wall... -Exhibit A: https: www.revealnews.org As you can see there are three wonderful anti-Tesla pieces on their homepage at the same time. Huh...seems a wee-little-bit biased but whatever... Now...as you know...these reports have had little to no impact on anyone s perception of Tesla. Tesla has admitted some shortfalls but nothing close to the extent these articles are trying to persuade readers to believe. If you hate Tesla this hasn t changed your mind...and if you love Tesla this hasn t change your mind.... Enter Al Letson a journalist reporter he is from Reveal. -Exhibit B: https: imgur.com a FBWea8f Here we have someone who is supposed to be a real journalist ignoring the context of multiple conversations the context of an answer to a question and telling his followers & the public that Elon Musk is propagating anti-Jewish sentiment. When someone tells you who they are believe them - a phrase often thrown at racists. He has ALL of the information in front of him to see that isn t the case...and he ignored it willingly...and is trying to convince the public that Elon Musk is a white supremacist. The same guy who is behind the anti-Tesla hit pieces. Later on he deleted the tweet... -Exhibit C: https: twitter.com Al_Letson status 1001118461265772544 Hmmm... He says he deleted the tweet because he was tired of being trolled. AND THEN HE DOUBLES DOWN. Now he accuses Elon Musk of being a secret-closet white supremacist who is being tricky with his racist views. -Exhibit D: https: twitter.com Al_Letson status 1001148960348647424 -Exhibit E: https: twitter.com Al_Letson status 1000988698899447808 He then admits he may be wrong...BUT STILL INSINUATES that Elon Musk is a racist...and says we may not all agree ... MOTHER-F-ER THIS ISN T A DISCUSSION OVER THE LAST PLAY OF THE VIKINGS-SAINTS GAME. THERE IS NO DISCUSSION. HE ISN T A RACIST. The next time ANYONE considers Reveal a legitimate news source please keep in mind the context. Their authors have NO ISSUE with trying to convince the public that Elon Musk is a white-supremacist. If they ll push lies about him being a white supremacist...if they are willing to do that...they will do ANYTHING. Quick Note: I m ignoring Elon s advice to be nice to these people. No. I will not. I won t do it. As someone who is fricken Jewish and has been the victim of real freaking white supremacists it is a disgrace to see people getting away with accusing the CEO of Tesla of racism but still getting to retain their credibility. End Rant. | If Reveal wants credibility they should fire Al Letson. No other way. He has no regret has been given many opportunities to take back his accusations and hasn t take the opportunity. | The antisemitism is probably the most absurd and weakly supported of all the crap flung at Elon last week and this guy is lame for trying to vaguely stick to that theme despite the complete lack of evidence or argumentation. However this is not a strong refutation for the arguments in the Reveal piece. | 54 | 12 | 2,480 |
8n5iqq | 271 | The organization Reveal and it s top people have gone from falsifying information regrading Tesla s safety record to now pushing a conspiracy theory that Elon Musk is an anti-semitic white supremacist... First...quick context... Reveal is an organization that is supposed to be investigating bad things. They ve made up some blatantly false allegations against Tesla recently. Because of that they ve gone balls to the wall and are trying to get anything to stick to the wall... -Exhibit A: https: www.revealnews.org As you can see there are three wonderful anti-Tesla pieces on their homepage at the same time. Huh...seems a wee-little-bit biased but whatever... Now...as you know...these reports have had little to no impact on anyone s perception of Tesla. Tesla has admitted some shortfalls but nothing close to the extent these articles are trying to persuade readers to believe. If you hate Tesla this hasn t changed your mind...and if you love Tesla this hasn t change your mind.... Enter Al Letson a journalist reporter he is from Reveal. -Exhibit B: https: imgur.com a FBWea8f Here we have someone who is supposed to be a real journalist ignoring the context of multiple conversations the context of an answer to a question and telling his followers & the public that Elon Musk is propagating anti-Jewish sentiment. When someone tells you who they are believe them - a phrase often thrown at racists. He has ALL of the information in front of him to see that isn t the case...and he ignored it willingly...and is trying to convince the public that Elon Musk is a white supremacist. The same guy who is behind the anti-Tesla hit pieces. Later on he deleted the tweet... -Exhibit C: https: twitter.com Al_Letson status 1001118461265772544 Hmmm... He says he deleted the tweet because he was tired of being trolled. AND THEN HE DOUBLES DOWN. Now he accuses Elon Musk of being a secret-closet white supremacist who is being tricky with his racist views. -Exhibit D: https: twitter.com Al_Letson status 1001148960348647424 -Exhibit E: https: twitter.com Al_Letson status 1000988698899447808 He then admits he may be wrong...BUT STILL INSINUATES that Elon Musk is a racist...and says we may not all agree ... MOTHER-F-ER THIS ISN T A DISCUSSION OVER THE LAST PLAY OF THE VIKINGS-SAINTS GAME. THERE IS NO DISCUSSION. HE ISN T A RACIST. The next time ANYONE considers Reveal a legitimate news source please keep in mind the context. Their authors have NO ISSUE with trying to convince the public that Elon Musk is a white-supremacist. If they ll push lies about him being a white supremacist...if they are willing to do that...they will do ANYTHING. Quick Note: I m ignoring Elon s advice to be nice to these people. No. I will not. I won t do it. As someone who is fricken Jewish and has been the victim of real freaking white supremacists it is a disgrace to see people getting away with accusing the CEO of Tesla of racism but still getting to retain their credibility. End Rant. | If Reveal wants credibility they should fire Al Letson. No other way. He has no regret has been given many opportunities to take back his accusations and hasn t take the opportunity. | It sucks. I really like Reveal. They ve done some really great work about subjects we care about- correlation between earthquakes in the Midwest and hydraulic fracturing the for profit prison system even went 1:1 in an interview with Richard Spencer and many more eye opening topics presented in an engaging manner. These are all amazing pieces of work and I can understand why they were given the Peabody award. These pieces I don t know... I feel like they got some info from bad sources and have really run with it. They ve got a lot of wind under their wings because they re awesome at what they do and view taking on Tesla as their biggest story yet. But the yellow thing? Really? | 54 | 19 | 2,481 |
8nhodw | 501 | Model 3 teardown in Germany finds that Tesla s cost of materials is $18k cost of production $10k (and that s w a $50k+ early production Model 3) Article in German: https: www.wiwo.de technologie mobilitaet elektroauto-zerlegt-tesla-model-3-kann-gewinn-abwerfen 22625806.html Article in English (w google translate): https: translate.google.com translate?hl=en& sl=de& tl=en& u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.wiwo.de%2Ftechnologie%2Fmobilitaet%2Felektroauto-zerlegt-tesla-model-3-kann-gewinn-abwerfen%2F22625806.html In addition findings indicate Tesla was able to significantly reduce the cobalt in its batteries calling it a breakthrough Note: There s also a premium version of this article (w more details) if anyone has access please update... | I got the full article key points: & nbsp + Material and production cost estimates of $18k and $10k are based on a 10 000 cars week run rate. + The German premium manufacturer who ordered this tear down would not be able to produce a similar EV right now even with low cost suppliers from eastern Europe. + Interior is nice to the touch where it matters ceiling (likely the discontinued Alcantara) and doors. Parts near the feet are cheap plastic. + Lower production and storage costs due to only a few upgrade options. Also the iPad helps to reduce complexity. + Interior is completely symmetric good for RHD production efficiency. + The drivetrain exceeds Elons promises regarding maximum speed torque and acceleration. It is thought trough compact well integrated and relatively light weight. Not easy for competitors to build something similar. + Good material mix in the chassis. + There are only 4 kinds of screws in the under body a car from a German competitor would have 40 different ones. Again reduced complexity. Many parts of the aero are designed so robots can grab them easily. + Batterypack is hard to remove. + Corrosion prevention is not on premium level but not far off. + Crash safety is only adequate not on premium level. + Only 2.8% Cobalt in the battery cells even the most up to date cells from competitors have double the amount. & nbsp Their analysis of component costs: 40% Battery 14% Electronics 11% Suspension 11% Interior 10% High voltage motor 8% Exterior 7% Chassis | They also mentioned that the price of a TM3 on the gray markert is about 100k - 130k $ | 237 | 3 | 2,482 |
8nhodw | 501 | Model 3 teardown in Germany finds that Tesla s cost of materials is $18k cost of production $10k (and that s w a $50k+ early production Model 3) Article in German: https: www.wiwo.de technologie mobilitaet elektroauto-zerlegt-tesla-model-3-kann-gewinn-abwerfen 22625806.html Article in English (w google translate): https: translate.google.com translate?hl=en& sl=de& tl=en& u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.wiwo.de%2Ftechnologie%2Fmobilitaet%2Felektroauto-zerlegt-tesla-model-3-kann-gewinn-abwerfen%2F22625806.html In addition findings indicate Tesla was able to significantly reduce the cobalt in its batteries calling it a breakthrough Note: There s also a premium version of this article (w more details) if anyone has access please update... | I got the full article key points: & nbsp + Material and production cost estimates of $18k and $10k are based on a 10 000 cars week run rate. + The German premium manufacturer who ordered this tear down would not be able to produce a similar EV right now even with low cost suppliers from eastern Europe. + Interior is nice to the touch where it matters ceiling (likely the discontinued Alcantara) and doors. Parts near the feet are cheap plastic. + Lower production and storage costs due to only a few upgrade options. Also the iPad helps to reduce complexity. + Interior is completely symmetric good for RHD production efficiency. + The drivetrain exceeds Elons promises regarding maximum speed torque and acceleration. It is thought trough compact well integrated and relatively light weight. Not easy for competitors to build something similar. + Good material mix in the chassis. + There are only 4 kinds of screws in the under body a car from a German competitor would have 40 different ones. Again reduced complexity. Many parts of the aero are designed so robots can grab them easily. + Batterypack is hard to remove. + Corrosion prevention is not on premium level but not far off. + Crash safety is only adequate not on premium level. + Only 2.8% Cobalt in the battery cells even the most up to date cells from competitors have double the amount. & nbsp Their analysis of component costs: 40% Battery 14% Electronics 11% Suspension 11% Interior 10% High voltage motor 8% Exterior 7% Chassis | Aren t these numbers pretty much invalidated by Elon s tweets from last week where he stated that right now Tesla would lose money selling a car at $35 000? | 237 | 6 | 2,483 |
8nhodw | 501 | Model 3 teardown in Germany finds that Tesla s cost of materials is $18k cost of production $10k (and that s w a $50k+ early production Model 3) Article in German: https: www.wiwo.de technologie mobilitaet elektroauto-zerlegt-tesla-model-3-kann-gewinn-abwerfen 22625806.html Article in English (w google translate): https: translate.google.com translate?hl=en& sl=de& tl=en& u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.wiwo.de%2Ftechnologie%2Fmobilitaet%2Felektroauto-zerlegt-tesla-model-3-kann-gewinn-abwerfen%2F22625806.html In addition findings indicate Tesla was able to significantly reduce the cobalt in its batteries calling it a breakthrough Note: There s also a premium version of this article (w more details) if anyone has access please update... | I got the full article key points: & nbsp + Material and production cost estimates of $18k and $10k are based on a 10 000 cars week run rate. + The German premium manufacturer who ordered this tear down would not be able to produce a similar EV right now even with low cost suppliers from eastern Europe. + Interior is nice to the touch where it matters ceiling (likely the discontinued Alcantara) and doors. Parts near the feet are cheap plastic. + Lower production and storage costs due to only a few upgrade options. Also the iPad helps to reduce complexity. + Interior is completely symmetric good for RHD production efficiency. + The drivetrain exceeds Elons promises regarding maximum speed torque and acceleration. It is thought trough compact well integrated and relatively light weight. Not easy for competitors to build something similar. + Good material mix in the chassis. + There are only 4 kinds of screws in the under body a car from a German competitor would have 40 different ones. Again reduced complexity. Many parts of the aero are designed so robots can grab them easily. + Batterypack is hard to remove. + Corrosion prevention is not on premium level but not far off. + Crash safety is only adequate not on premium level. + Only 2.8% Cobalt in the battery cells even the most up to date cells from competitors have double the amount. & nbsp Their analysis of component costs: 40% Battery 14% Electronics 11% Suspension 11% Interior 10% High voltage motor 8% Exterior 7% Chassis | I m curious to see how Sandy s numbers stack up against these. Especially in regards to the dino tech.... | 237 | 8 | 2,484 |
8niia0 | 122 | Electrician is Installing my 14-30 Outlet Today: a cautionary tale for those expecting to just use their 110 outlet.... I felt confident I could get by with just charging my 3 via the 110-V outlet that is closest to my car (my wife parks closer to the outlet that is pre-wired for higher voltage) because I only have a 20-mile commute round trip and that would allow me to maintain a full charge without even trying. Well lo and behold I like driving this damn car so much that I can t get the electrons fast enough. I ve driven to DC twice in the past two weeks (230 mile round trip) and Charlottesville twice last weekend (120 mile round trip each) and while the superchargers are well located for both of these trips I would have been able to do all these trips without supercharging if I had been able to charge faster overnight at home. Furthermore I find myself obsessing about my state of charge and unable to find time to get up to a full charge before these road trips. Just a word of experience from a 1-month owner. You re going to want to drive a lot and trickle charging sucks ass... | I ve lived through all rates of charging between my BMW i3 and Model X and soon to be model3... 120V\\-12A 120V\\-16A 240V\\-16A 240V\\-32A 240V\\-48A Assuming 12 hrs per night of downtime that you can charge model 3 72kwh usable battery and 12& #37 charging efficiency losses Standard Outlet 120V\\-12A makes things difficult \\~5MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 56 Hrs Overnight only nets you \\~65 miles if you are low and you forget to charge you are kinda screwed. If not relying on superchargers for long distance travel meticulous planning may be required. Forgetting to charge when low could mean you don t make it to work the next day while waiting for it to charge. 20 Amp Outlet 120V\\-20A is actually a big 33& #37 faster step up \\~7\\-8MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 42 Hrs. \\(get the 5\\-20 adapter from tesla\\) This will net you \\~87 miles a night. If not relying on superchargers for long distance travel Planning may be required. Forgetting to charge when low could mean you miss half a day of work while waiting for it to charge. 240\\-16A is a Major step up and can be done with the same in wall wiring by replacing the receptacle and the breaker on an existing 20 amp circuit. \\(just be sure you know which outlets are on the circuit and change all the receptacles so nobody can plug in standard plugs into them. This is 166& #37 faster than a standard outlet This will charge \\~14\\-15mph. Charge from 0& #37 in 21 Hours This will net you \\~174 miles a night. If not relying on superchargers long distance travel may require some planning. Forgetting to charge when low could mean you miss 2\\-3 hrs of work while waiting for it to charge up a bit. 240\\-32A usually requires new wiring unless you have existing dryer outlets but is extremely flexible 433& #37 faster than a standard outlet This will charge 29\\-30 MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 11 hours. This will charge completely 310 miles overnight easily \\(only 11 hrs if empty\\) If not relying on superchargers long distance travel requires little if any planning as long as you plug it in the night before you leave on your trip. Forgetting to charge when low might mean you miss an hour or so of work while you get enough range to make it in. 240\\-48A also requires new wiring unless you have existing dryer outlets but will also require purchasing a high power wall connector. best flexibility for model3 \\(LR\\) charging \\(not possible for model 3 SR\\). 700& #37 faster than a standard outlet Will charge at 44MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 7 hours. Will easily charge car overnight. If not relying on superchargers long distance travel almost no extra planning at all. Forgetting to charge when low might mean you plug in while you take a shower and get dressed and might lose 15 minutes in the morning while charging enough range to make your trip. I got really carried away in this post.... hopefully it is useful. | While not everyone enjoys trip planning I do. I look for destination chargers and call places that are not listed to ask about EV charging. I am either pleasantly surprised and can charge or tell them charging is a consideration in my destination. | 50 | 2 | 2,485 |
8niia0 | 122 | Electrician is Installing my 14-30 Outlet Today: a cautionary tale for those expecting to just use their 110 outlet.... I felt confident I could get by with just charging my 3 via the 110-V outlet that is closest to my car (my wife parks closer to the outlet that is pre-wired for higher voltage) because I only have a 20-mile commute round trip and that would allow me to maintain a full charge without even trying. Well lo and behold I like driving this damn car so much that I can t get the electrons fast enough. I ve driven to DC twice in the past two weeks (230 mile round trip) and Charlottesville twice last weekend (120 mile round trip each) and while the superchargers are well located for both of these trips I would have been able to do all these trips without supercharging if I had been able to charge faster overnight at home. Furthermore I find myself obsessing about my state of charge and unable to find time to get up to a full charge before these road trips. Just a word of experience from a 1-month owner. You re going to want to drive a lot and trickle charging sucks ass... | I ve lived through all rates of charging between my BMW i3 and Model X and soon to be model3... 120V\\-12A 120V\\-16A 240V\\-16A 240V\\-32A 240V\\-48A Assuming 12 hrs per night of downtime that you can charge model 3 72kwh usable battery and 12& #37 charging efficiency losses Standard Outlet 120V\\-12A makes things difficult \\~5MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 56 Hrs Overnight only nets you \\~65 miles if you are low and you forget to charge you are kinda screwed. If not relying on superchargers for long distance travel meticulous planning may be required. Forgetting to charge when low could mean you don t make it to work the next day while waiting for it to charge. 20 Amp Outlet 120V\\-20A is actually a big 33& #37 faster step up \\~7\\-8MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 42 Hrs. \\(get the 5\\-20 adapter from tesla\\) This will net you \\~87 miles a night. If not relying on superchargers for long distance travel Planning may be required. Forgetting to charge when low could mean you miss half a day of work while waiting for it to charge. 240\\-16A is a Major step up and can be done with the same in wall wiring by replacing the receptacle and the breaker on an existing 20 amp circuit. \\(just be sure you know which outlets are on the circuit and change all the receptacles so nobody can plug in standard plugs into them. This is 166& #37 faster than a standard outlet This will charge \\~14\\-15mph. Charge from 0& #37 in 21 Hours This will net you \\~174 miles a night. If not relying on superchargers long distance travel may require some planning. Forgetting to charge when low could mean you miss 2\\-3 hrs of work while waiting for it to charge up a bit. 240\\-32A usually requires new wiring unless you have existing dryer outlets but is extremely flexible 433& #37 faster than a standard outlet This will charge 29\\-30 MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 11 hours. This will charge completely 310 miles overnight easily \\(only 11 hrs if empty\\) If not relying on superchargers long distance travel requires little if any planning as long as you plug it in the night before you leave on your trip. Forgetting to charge when low might mean you miss an hour or so of work while you get enough range to make it in. 240\\-48A also requires new wiring unless you have existing dryer outlets but will also require purchasing a high power wall connector. best flexibility for model3 \\(LR\\) charging \\(not possible for model 3 SR\\). 700& #37 faster than a standard outlet Will charge at 44MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 7 hours. Will easily charge car overnight. If not relying on superchargers long distance travel almost no extra planning at all. Forgetting to charge when low might mean you plug in while you take a shower and get dressed and might lose 15 minutes in the morning while charging enough range to make your trip. I got really carried away in this post.... hopefully it is useful. | Yeah the car makes me drive way more I have a 14-30 it works great. | 50 | 3 | 2,486 |
8niia0 | 122 | Electrician is Installing my 14-30 Outlet Today: a cautionary tale for those expecting to just use their 110 outlet.... I felt confident I could get by with just charging my 3 via the 110-V outlet that is closest to my car (my wife parks closer to the outlet that is pre-wired for higher voltage) because I only have a 20-mile commute round trip and that would allow me to maintain a full charge without even trying. Well lo and behold I like driving this damn car so much that I can t get the electrons fast enough. I ve driven to DC twice in the past two weeks (230 mile round trip) and Charlottesville twice last weekend (120 mile round trip each) and while the superchargers are well located for both of these trips I would have been able to do all these trips without supercharging if I had been able to charge faster overnight at home. Furthermore I find myself obsessing about my state of charge and unable to find time to get up to a full charge before these road trips. Just a word of experience from a 1-month owner. You re going to want to drive a lot and trickle charging sucks ass... | I ve lived through all rates of charging between my BMW i3 and Model X and soon to be model3... 120V\\-12A 120V\\-16A 240V\\-16A 240V\\-32A 240V\\-48A Assuming 12 hrs per night of downtime that you can charge model 3 72kwh usable battery and 12& #37 charging efficiency losses Standard Outlet 120V\\-12A makes things difficult \\~5MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 56 Hrs Overnight only nets you \\~65 miles if you are low and you forget to charge you are kinda screwed. If not relying on superchargers for long distance travel meticulous planning may be required. Forgetting to charge when low could mean you don t make it to work the next day while waiting for it to charge. 20 Amp Outlet 120V\\-20A is actually a big 33& #37 faster step up \\~7\\-8MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 42 Hrs. \\(get the 5\\-20 adapter from tesla\\) This will net you \\~87 miles a night. If not relying on superchargers for long distance travel Planning may be required. Forgetting to charge when low could mean you miss half a day of work while waiting for it to charge. 240\\-16A is a Major step up and can be done with the same in wall wiring by replacing the receptacle and the breaker on an existing 20 amp circuit. \\(just be sure you know which outlets are on the circuit and change all the receptacles so nobody can plug in standard plugs into them. This is 166& #37 faster than a standard outlet This will charge \\~14\\-15mph. Charge from 0& #37 in 21 Hours This will net you \\~174 miles a night. If not relying on superchargers long distance travel may require some planning. Forgetting to charge when low could mean you miss 2\\-3 hrs of work while waiting for it to charge up a bit. 240\\-32A usually requires new wiring unless you have existing dryer outlets but is extremely flexible 433& #37 faster than a standard outlet This will charge 29\\-30 MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 11 hours. This will charge completely 310 miles overnight easily \\(only 11 hrs if empty\\) If not relying on superchargers long distance travel requires little if any planning as long as you plug it in the night before you leave on your trip. Forgetting to charge when low might mean you miss an hour or so of work while you get enough range to make it in. 240\\-48A also requires new wiring unless you have existing dryer outlets but will also require purchasing a high power wall connector. best flexibility for model3 \\(LR\\) charging \\(not possible for model 3 SR\\). 700& #37 faster than a standard outlet Will charge at 44MPH Charge from 0& #37 in 7 hours. Will easily charge car overnight. If not relying on superchargers long distance travel almost no extra planning at all. Forgetting to charge when low might mean you plug in while you take a shower and get dressed and might lose 15 minutes in the morning while charging enough range to make your trip. I got really carried away in this post.... hopefully it is useful. | Why not get a 14-50 installed instead? Is the cost that much different? Can your house not handle 32A vs 24A? | 50 | 7 | 2,487 |
8nl0ka | 93 | Tesla said I have to accept the outcome of my Model 3 bumper replacement [A little background](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 8khqdh went_to_pick_up_my_white_model_3_back_from_tesla ?utm_content=title& utm_medium=user& utm_source=reddit& utm_name=frontpage) TLDNR White Bumper Mismatch. Tesla tried to fix but bodyshop made it worse and cracked my charge port. So It s been about 3 weeks since I dropped off my Model 3 \\(Been at service center longer than my house. But at least I have a Model S Loaner\\). The service center person even agreed that my bumper looked more yellow worse than other whites at the location. I got news recently that they were replacing my bumper with a new one \\(yay!\\). Then my wife gets a call today saying they will only do it if I agree to accept whatever outcome occurs from this process. Meaning if they make it worse I have to accept it and move on. What do you guys think? | No that s messed up. I would involve another service center and management escalation | fuck that. you bought a white car... | 169 | 17 | 2,488 |
8nl0ka | 93 | Tesla said I have to accept the outcome of my Model 3 bumper replacement [A little background](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 8khqdh went_to_pick_up_my_white_model_3_back_from_tesla ?utm_content=title& utm_medium=user& utm_source=reddit& utm_name=frontpage) TLDNR White Bumper Mismatch. Tesla tried to fix but bodyshop made it worse and cracked my charge port. So It s been about 3 weeks since I dropped off my Model 3 \\(Been at service center longer than my house. But at least I have a Model S Loaner\\). The service center person even agreed that my bumper looked more yellow worse than other whites at the location. I got news recently that they were replacing my bumper with a new one \\(yay!\\). Then my wife gets a call today saying they will only do it if I agree to accept whatever outcome occurs from this process. Meaning if they make it worse I have to accept it and move on. What do you guys think? | Tell them you ll agree to it as long as it s in writing and have them send you the copy to sign. Then tweet the copy to Elon. | I d tell them you want a different car. I have a white model 3 and the rear bumper color is slightly off however I didn t really notice it until weeks after I took delivery. Had it been worse I would have asked for a repaint or replacement bumper cover. If I knew white was gonna be an issue I would have gone with another color however the chatter of white paint issues popped up well after I placed my order. All in all I m happy but a bit silly for them to strong arm you like this. | 88 | 5 | 2,489 |
8nl0ka | 93 | Tesla said I have to accept the outcome of my Model 3 bumper replacement [A little background](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 8khqdh went_to_pick_up_my_white_model_3_back_from_tesla ?utm_content=title& utm_medium=user& utm_source=reddit& utm_name=frontpage) TLDNR White Bumper Mismatch. Tesla tried to fix but bodyshop made it worse and cracked my charge port. So It s been about 3 weeks since I dropped off my Model 3 \\(Been at service center longer than my house. But at least I have a Model S Loaner\\). The service center person even agreed that my bumper looked more yellow worse than other whites at the location. I got news recently that they were replacing my bumper with a new one \\(yay!\\). Then my wife gets a call today saying they will only do it if I agree to accept whatever outcome occurs from this process. Meaning if they make it worse I have to accept it and move on. What do you guys think? | Tell them you ll agree to it as long as it s in writing and have them send you the copy to sign. Then tweet the copy to Elon. | ugh so scared to get our white car today | 88 | 9 | 2,490 |
8nqh2b | 261 | I got rear ended and i ve been without my S for over 2 months. Tesla seriously needs to address the parts issue It s a lease so kinda miffed I m essentially paying for nothing while we wait. Did I mention insurances usually only cover 30 days of car rentals? [Edit] yea I ve been in contact with both the body shop and Tesla s body shop support. The issue is definitely parts not being available. For example there are no rivets available until 6 8. (of all things rivets...) I also had a terrible Tesla body shop support person but that s another issue (she can t help the supply issue but she could at least call me back when she says she will). I mean I love the brand the car and the mission. I m a fanboy....but this problem will not fly with the general public. I hope they improve on this before the fleet size really takes off. | I can t believe this is still an issue. When I worked for Tesla I went to our “Certified Shop” to see what the issue was and it s a complete shit-show for them to order parts. Tesla is at fault for this everyone wants to blame the body shop but the process is simply stupid to acquire replacement parts. Basically my suggested fix was to give the body shops direct access to the same screens the Parts Managers Parts Advisors have so they could actually see what items are actually available and not order a part that may not be in stock. (i.e. Parts Manual calls for a “C” revision part but “D” “E” “F” revisions will work. Body shop orders a “C” revision and never receives the part because Tesla is now stocks D E F and not the C. If the body shop had their own access to see what parts are currently available they could order as such thus reducing down time.) | Where are you located? | 192 | 2 | 2,491 |
8nqh2b | 261 | I got rear ended and i ve been without my S for over 2 months. Tesla seriously needs to address the parts issue It s a lease so kinda miffed I m essentially paying for nothing while we wait. Did I mention insurances usually only cover 30 days of car rentals? [Edit] yea I ve been in contact with both the body shop and Tesla s body shop support. The issue is definitely parts not being available. For example there are no rivets available until 6 8. (of all things rivets...) I also had a terrible Tesla body shop support person but that s another issue (she can t help the supply issue but she could at least call me back when she says she will). I mean I love the brand the car and the mission. I m a fanboy....but this problem will not fly with the general public. I hope they improve on this before the fleet size really takes off. | I can t believe this is still an issue. When I worked for Tesla I went to our “Certified Shop” to see what the issue was and it s a complete shit-show for them to order parts. Tesla is at fault for this everyone wants to blame the body shop but the process is simply stupid to acquire replacement parts. Basically my suggested fix was to give the body shops direct access to the same screens the Parts Managers Parts Advisors have so they could actually see what items are actually available and not order a part that may not be in stock. (i.e. Parts Manual calls for a “C” revision part but “D” “E” “F” revisions will work. Body shop orders a “C” revision and never receives the part because Tesla is now stocks D E F and not the C. If the body shop had their own access to see what parts are currently available they could order as such thus reducing down time.) | Seems to be that way for the S and X but the 3 parts supply chain appears to be better. I needed a new seat for my S and it was on order for months even in an escalated state directly through Tesla. We ended up having to work out an alternative solution so no idea if I would still be waiting. My 3 has had numerous parts replaced including a seat. The seat arrived in about 1 week. Entire dash arrived in days. The A pillar covers took the longest at about two weeks. Not sure about body panel parts. | 192 | 5 | 2,492 |
8nqh2b | 261 | I got rear ended and i ve been without my S for over 2 months. Tesla seriously needs to address the parts issue It s a lease so kinda miffed I m essentially paying for nothing while we wait. Did I mention insurances usually only cover 30 days of car rentals? [Edit] yea I ve been in contact with both the body shop and Tesla s body shop support. The issue is definitely parts not being available. For example there are no rivets available until 6 8. (of all things rivets...) I also had a terrible Tesla body shop support person but that s another issue (she can t help the supply issue but she could at least call me back when she says she will). I mean I love the brand the car and the mission. I m a fanboy....but this problem will not fly with the general public. I hope they improve on this before the fleet size really takes off. | I can t believe this is still an issue. When I worked for Tesla I went to our “Certified Shop” to see what the issue was and it s a complete shit-show for them to order parts. Tesla is at fault for this everyone wants to blame the body shop but the process is simply stupid to acquire replacement parts. Basically my suggested fix was to give the body shops direct access to the same screens the Parts Managers Parts Advisors have so they could actually see what items are actually available and not order a part that may not be in stock. (i.e. Parts Manual calls for a “C” revision part but “D” “E” “F” revisions will work. Body shop orders a “C” revision and never receives the part because Tesla is now stocks D E F and not the C. If the body shop had their own access to see what parts are currently available they could order as such thus reducing down time.) | Insurance here in Norway gave a new car to a customer due to parts shortage. He had unlimited rental included in his insurance... In the end the insurance company decided it was cheaper to get him a new car... I need to check my insurrance to ensure that I have unlimeted rental car... | 192 | 25 | 2,493 |
8nr1gn | 33 | June 2018 - Experience Megathread **Photos and Posts that should be intended for this thread:** - Common Searchable Personal Experiences - Vehicle Sightings (S 3 X) - Order Confirmations - Delivery Day Photos - Delivery Transport Photos - Vehicle Customizations - Blogs Vlogs + Racing Videos - Vanity Plates - Toy items Baked goods \\> > **[Upload your image(s) here and share the links below](https: imgur.com upload).** < < [Jan](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 7ndeak january_2018_experiences_megathread ) | [Feb](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 7uirbc february_2018_experiences_megathread ) | [Mar](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 812zqv march_2018_experience_megathread ) | [April](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 88o8v0 april_2018_experience_megathread ) | [May](https: reddit.com r teslamotors comments 8g7p7o may_2018_experience_megathread ) | The first time I farted in my new Model 3 I felt a little sad as it was no longer a zero emissions vehicle 😢 edit: [you sit on a throne of lies](https: i.imgur.com AaaoGN8.jpg) | I picked up my Model X 75D earlier this week. I enjoyed the experience up until delivery day. It felt quite rushed and the person helping me didn t seem to be an expert about the car. For example clicking through the menu trying to figure out how to disable the auto wipers I could have done that myself if that was the case. Everyone I had spoken to or dealt with up until delivery day was super enthusiastic and informative it was so refreshing from the usual dealership experience. The person I got at delivery was boring and seemed pretty new. I also found the clapping when driving out of the delivery center to be a bit cringey but it was fun. Overall though I m happy. I don t regret it and I am enjoying the car so far. I ve gotten the windows tinted and the wheels painted satin matte black. Haven t taken photos cause it s quite dirty from some rain. Will post photos soon! | 42 | 3 | 2,494 |
8nr1gn | 33 | June 2018 - Experience Megathread **Photos and Posts that should be intended for this thread:** - Common Searchable Personal Experiences - Vehicle Sightings (S 3 X) - Order Confirmations - Delivery Day Photos - Delivery Transport Photos - Vehicle Customizations - Blogs Vlogs + Racing Videos - Vanity Plates - Toy items Baked goods \\> > **[Upload your image(s) here and share the links below](https: imgur.com upload).** < < [Jan](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 7ndeak january_2018_experiences_megathread ) | [Feb](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 7uirbc february_2018_experiences_megathread ) | [Mar](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 812zqv march_2018_experience_megathread ) | [April](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 88o8v0 april_2018_experience_megathread ) | [May](https: reddit.com r teslamotors comments 8g7p7o may_2018_experience_megathread ) | The first time I farted in my new Model 3 I felt a little sad as it was no longer a zero emissions vehicle 😢 edit: [you sit on a throne of lies](https: i.imgur.com AaaoGN8.jpg) | Picked up my red model 3 (aero) today in Cleveland Ohio. If you re in the northeast Ohio area and haven t experienced the car yet give me a shout! | 42 | 3 | 2,495 |
8nr1gn | 33 | June 2018 - Experience Megathread **Photos and Posts that should be intended for this thread:** - Common Searchable Personal Experiences - Vehicle Sightings (S 3 X) - Order Confirmations - Delivery Day Photos - Delivery Transport Photos - Vehicle Customizations - Blogs Vlogs + Racing Videos - Vanity Plates - Toy items Baked goods \\> > **[Upload your image(s) here and share the links below](https: imgur.com upload).** < < [Jan](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 7ndeak january_2018_experiences_megathread ) | [Feb](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 7uirbc february_2018_experiences_megathread ) | [Mar](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 812zqv march_2018_experience_megathread ) | [April](https: www.reddit.com r teslamotors comments 88o8v0 april_2018_experience_megathread ) | [May](https: reddit.com r teslamotors comments 8g7p7o may_2018_experience_megathread ) | The first time I farted in my new Model 3 I felt a little sad as it was no longer a zero emissions vehicle 😢 edit: [you sit on a throne of lies](https: i.imgur.com AaaoGN8.jpg) | Ok so my delivery is scheduled for 10am tomorrow and I got a call from John at my delivery center. There was a very small nick found in the bumper after delivery \\(he described it as a thumbnail thickness x 1 8in long\\) and gave me the option of delaying the appointment a few days \\(worst case a week\\) for them to make it right or to come in to check it out and decide then \\(with the options of not taking it to fix taking it and bringing it back later for them to fix or just taking it as is\\). Personally I m opting to keep the appointment and checking it out. If that is literally the only problem \\(and it really is as small as he describes\\) I may take it as is and say screw it :P If it s worse or there are additional issues then I may change my mind of course. Thoughts? | 42 | 3 | 2,496 |
8o19w9 | 46 | Notices thoughts after 10 days of ownership. 1. Phone doesn t connect with the car after connecting to home Wifi. I have to do the airplane mode reset pretty much each morning if I connect to Wifi at home the night before. However it works when I leave work since I m on 4G LTE the entire day. Anyone else have this issue? 2. A couple of days ago the radio didn t work when I started the car to drive to work. Streaming was just fine I had to reset the screen and it came back. 3. The same day after work I got in the car the screen turned on I put the car in reverse and the screen went completely blank but the car was still backing up. This scared me a bit. I was still able to put it into drive and park it to restart the screen. It worked fine after that. 4. When the air is on full blast there s a small rattling sound coming from the passenger side vent. This only happens when it s on max. 5. There is a loud thump! noise when the car locks and unlocks. Is this normal? Sounds like it s coming from the bottom of the car. 6. AP is rather aggressive. When follow distance is set to 2 it means 2 and makes sure it s 2 as quickly as possible. haha...I guess I ll just have to get used to it. 7. In parking lots people totally check out your car as they pass by. They stand and stare point and discuss. I m an introvert. I guess it s just something that goes along with owning the car until it s commonplace. 8. Even though the garage door now opens by itself upon reaching home I still somehow attempt to hit the garage door opener when I get home which used to be on my visor. This has happened about 20 times in the last ten days. 9. Always take your phone. My husband dropped me off at the post office while he circled around for a parking spot. I left my phone and purse in the car thinking he was going to just wait for me. He found a spot parked and left without realizing my phone was still in the car. That could ve been bad. 10. I have now forgotten my house keys when going to work this entire week. What do you guys do to help you remember?? 11. This car is absolutely amazing. If you re on the fence about buying it and you can afford it comfortably you should totally go for it. It s an expensive car but well worth the price. Plus what other car can give you updates through the air? I look forward to Tesla OTA updates like I do with patches notes on games. What you see isn t what you get. In this case it s more and there s more to come. | 5 is normal. I don t really use my house keys because I changed my door to a digital lock. I m completely keyless! Best thing is that I ll never forget my cellphone now. | Which model? I m assuming a Model 3 based on the forgetting the car keys. | 29 | 3 | 2,497 |
8o1xko | 270 | I decompiled the Tesla Android app and poked around a bit to try to figure out how the Model 3 phone key works Warning crypto jargon ahead. Unfortunately the code is heavily obfuscated but based on what I was able to (and cared to) deobfuscate this is roughly how it works: 1. Before anything happens the app generates and stores locally a key pair 2. The phone connects to the car over BLE 3. Once a BLE connection is established the app sends a request to the car for its public key. In this request packet the app includes its own public key s **ID** but not the public key itself. 4. The car responds with a certificate out of which the app extracts the car s public key. This public key is ephemeral (short-lived) and isn t validated by the app in any way. 5. Once the app has its own key pair generated and the car s public key it derives a symmetric secret using ECDH. 6. The app requests a list from the car of whitelisted public key IDs. If the app s key isn t in the whitelist it stops activity but stays connected. 7. The app requests the car s capabilities (I m unsure what these are) 8. The app requests from the car its permissions (Add To Whitelist Local Unlock Local Drive Remote Unlock Remote Drive Change Permissions Remove From Whitelist Remove Self From Whitelist) 9. The app syncs some kind of crypto counter with the car 10. The app requests the car s status which appears to be whether it s locked or not (4 possible statuses: Unlocked Locked Internal Locked Selective Unlocked) and the closure state of the doors (closed open ajar unknown) Other interesting values: **Authentication Levels** - None - Unlock - Drive **Actions** - Unlock - Lock - Open Trunk - Open Frunk - Open Charge Port - Close Charge Port - Cancel External Authenticate (appears unused) There are also some references to signed messages in here. I m not sure if this means all messages are signed some messages are signed or no messages are signed. That said I m unsure message signatures are necessary at all considering the key exchange mechanism assuming that the symmetric crypto (most likely AES) also has a MAC. I m a crypto hobbyist not an expert but as far as I can tell the fact that the car s public key isn t authenticated isn t a problem. From the code I saw the phone app never actually sends its public key to the car over BLE only its key ID. I assume that the public key is sent to the Tesla server and then to the car securely over LTE and then the car stores the public key. That s how the car authenticates the phone. So when the phone connects the car sends it a short-lived public key and both sides do ECDH to derive a shared key. Someone could theoretically pretend to be the car and get the app to do a handshake with them but without knowing the phone app s public key the malicious actor couldn t derive the same shared secret as the phone. So theoretically messages wouldn t need to be signed at all to be secure since they re going over a securely encrypted channel. But the takeaway here is that Tesla is definitely absolutely doing asymmetric encryption with its phone key system making it more secure than a traditional rolling code key fob. | TL DR: Phone > fob. Interesting stuff! Thanks. | very nice thanks. | 77 | 4 | 2,498 |
8o1xko | 270 | I decompiled the Tesla Android app and poked around a bit to try to figure out how the Model 3 phone key works Warning crypto jargon ahead. Unfortunately the code is heavily obfuscated but based on what I was able to (and cared to) deobfuscate this is roughly how it works: 1. Before anything happens the app generates and stores locally a key pair 2. The phone connects to the car over BLE 3. Once a BLE connection is established the app sends a request to the car for its public key. In this request packet the app includes its own public key s **ID** but not the public key itself. 4. The car responds with a certificate out of which the app extracts the car s public key. This public key is ephemeral (short-lived) and isn t validated by the app in any way. 5. Once the app has its own key pair generated and the car s public key it derives a symmetric secret using ECDH. 6. The app requests a list from the car of whitelisted public key IDs. If the app s key isn t in the whitelist it stops activity but stays connected. 7. The app requests the car s capabilities (I m unsure what these are) 8. The app requests from the car its permissions (Add To Whitelist Local Unlock Local Drive Remote Unlock Remote Drive Change Permissions Remove From Whitelist Remove Self From Whitelist) 9. The app syncs some kind of crypto counter with the car 10. The app requests the car s status which appears to be whether it s locked or not (4 possible statuses: Unlocked Locked Internal Locked Selective Unlocked) and the closure state of the doors (closed open ajar unknown) Other interesting values: **Authentication Levels** - None - Unlock - Drive **Actions** - Unlock - Lock - Open Trunk - Open Frunk - Open Charge Port - Close Charge Port - Cancel External Authenticate (appears unused) There are also some references to signed messages in here. I m not sure if this means all messages are signed some messages are signed or no messages are signed. That said I m unsure message signatures are necessary at all considering the key exchange mechanism assuming that the symmetric crypto (most likely AES) also has a MAC. I m a crypto hobbyist not an expert but as far as I can tell the fact that the car s public key isn t authenticated isn t a problem. From the code I saw the phone app never actually sends its public key to the car over BLE only its key ID. I assume that the public key is sent to the Tesla server and then to the car securely over LTE and then the car stores the public key. That s how the car authenticates the phone. So when the phone connects the car sends it a short-lived public key and both sides do ECDH to derive a shared key. Someone could theoretically pretend to be the car and get the app to do a handshake with them but without knowing the phone app s public key the malicious actor couldn t derive the same shared secret as the phone. So theoretically messages wouldn t need to be signed at all to be secure since they re going over a securely encrypted channel. But the takeaway here is that Tesla is definitely absolutely doing asymmetric encryption with its phone key system making it more secure than a traditional rolling code key fob. | > crypto jargon Glad to see the word “crypto” being used as cryptography. I would guess the counter is a nonce to avoid replay attack. So for example somebody else can t record a previously sent “unlock” message and use that to unlock the car later. | Fun read :) | 62 | 3 | 2,499 |
8o1xko | 270 | I decompiled the Tesla Android app and poked around a bit to try to figure out how the Model 3 phone key works Warning crypto jargon ahead. Unfortunately the code is heavily obfuscated but based on what I was able to (and cared to) deobfuscate this is roughly how it works: 1. Before anything happens the app generates and stores locally a key pair 2. The phone connects to the car over BLE 3. Once a BLE connection is established the app sends a request to the car for its public key. In this request packet the app includes its own public key s **ID** but not the public key itself. 4. The car responds with a certificate out of which the app extracts the car s public key. This public key is ephemeral (short-lived) and isn t validated by the app in any way. 5. Once the app has its own key pair generated and the car s public key it derives a symmetric secret using ECDH. 6. The app requests a list from the car of whitelisted public key IDs. If the app s key isn t in the whitelist it stops activity but stays connected. 7. The app requests the car s capabilities (I m unsure what these are) 8. The app requests from the car its permissions (Add To Whitelist Local Unlock Local Drive Remote Unlock Remote Drive Change Permissions Remove From Whitelist Remove Self From Whitelist) 9. The app syncs some kind of crypto counter with the car 10. The app requests the car s status which appears to be whether it s locked or not (4 possible statuses: Unlocked Locked Internal Locked Selective Unlocked) and the closure state of the doors (closed open ajar unknown) Other interesting values: **Authentication Levels** - None - Unlock - Drive **Actions** - Unlock - Lock - Open Trunk - Open Frunk - Open Charge Port - Close Charge Port - Cancel External Authenticate (appears unused) There are also some references to signed messages in here. I m not sure if this means all messages are signed some messages are signed or no messages are signed. That said I m unsure message signatures are necessary at all considering the key exchange mechanism assuming that the symmetric crypto (most likely AES) also has a MAC. I m a crypto hobbyist not an expert but as far as I can tell the fact that the car s public key isn t authenticated isn t a problem. From the code I saw the phone app never actually sends its public key to the car over BLE only its key ID. I assume that the public key is sent to the Tesla server and then to the car securely over LTE and then the car stores the public key. That s how the car authenticates the phone. So when the phone connects the car sends it a short-lived public key and both sides do ECDH to derive a shared key. Someone could theoretically pretend to be the car and get the app to do a handshake with them but without knowing the phone app s public key the malicious actor couldn t derive the same shared secret as the phone. So theoretically messages wouldn t need to be signed at all to be secure since they re going over a securely encrypted channel. But the takeaway here is that Tesla is definitely absolutely doing asymmetric encryption with its phone key system making it more secure than a traditional rolling code key fob. | > crypto jargon Glad to see the word “crypto” being used as cryptography. I would guess the counter is a nonce to avoid replay attack. So for example somebody else can t record a previously sent “unlock” message and use that to unlock the car later. | very nice thanks. | 62 | 4 | 2,500 |
8o3crj | 85 | [Long Read] Fascinating look at model 3 battery http: evtv.me 2018 05 tesla-model-3-gone-battshit | **TL DR:** I m going to spoiler the conclusion of the article: > **this is the BEST most ADVANCED large scale lithium battery ever produced on [the] planet and is YEARS ahead of anything currently in work.** > > Like a 7-year-old on Christmas morning I am in absolute DELIGHT at what we are learning about this remarkable car. The kid in me is going ape shit by what we are seeing in the charger and particularly in the motor drive unit. Across the board this ain t your daddy s Oldsmobile. **And I can pretty much assert that everything you THOUGHT you knew about the Tesla Model 3 is basically a miss. It s going to be a delight but a bit of a longer more drawn out affair to explore just what IS in this remarkable device.** > > Jack Rickard A long but fascinating article from someone who clearly knows what he is talking about! | Good read thanks! | 39 | 3 | 2,501 |
8o3crj | 85 | [Long Read] Fascinating look at model 3 battery http: evtv.me 2018 05 tesla-model-3-gone-battshit | **TL DR:** I m going to spoiler the conclusion of the article: > **this is the BEST most ADVANCED large scale lithium battery ever produced on [the] planet and is YEARS ahead of anything currently in work.** > > Like a 7-year-old on Christmas morning I am in absolute DELIGHT at what we are learning about this remarkable car. The kid in me is going ape shit by what we are seeing in the charger and particularly in the motor drive unit. Across the board this ain t your daddy s Oldsmobile. **And I can pretty much assert that everything you THOUGHT you knew about the Tesla Model 3 is basically a miss. It s going to be a delight but a bit of a longer more drawn out affair to explore just what IS in this remarkable device.** > > Jack Rickard A long but fascinating article from someone who clearly knows what he is talking about! | Hearing Jack speak is a pleasant experience but due to his very low rate of articulation an over a hour long video is quite tiring. That s the first time I ve read him and it s quite a revelation. | 39 | 13 | 2,502 |
8o7e51 | 126 | < Discussion> Tesla s history of poor level of build quality has resulted in people being hyper sensitive to any issues now. With some of the faults issues down to an exhaustive checklist to me it seems that Tesla is a has made a rod for its own back now with owners scrutinising their cars far far more than they ever would have with other manufacturers. Anecdotally for me having bought two new non Tesla cars in the past the idea of a checklist is ridiculous but I understand why people are doing it. This isn t a post on the people but I think what Tesla has created is that their already problematic support network is going to get more smashed than ever because people are going in expecting a 100% flawless car when that just isn t very likely even with competitor vehicles. If you look close enough in every nook and cranny of even brand new cars you ll fine problems. They are in the end built from materiel that vary in quality and it s extremely hard to get everything exact 100% of the time. So in Tesla s pursuit of fixing it later it might have created a scenario where owners will nitpick even minor minor details and tie up the Service network trying to get it fixed. What s people s thoughts on this? | > Anecdotally for me having bought two new non Tesla cars in the past the idea of a checklist is ridiculous but I understand why people are doing it. Because even a Toyota dealer let alone a luxury brand would have done all of this for you before you get the car versus Tesla who didn t even notice a Model3 had been dropped dragged off the delivery truck. Many of the issues people are bringing up simply don t exist in other cars (or are very rare) I don t see why it s unreasonable to expect a product that was assembled correctly and not damaged in transport. | This is true but it will make the build quality so much better a year from now and people will not only scrutinize Tesla but other brands too. I have never paid attention to panel gaps before but now whenever I walk through a parking lot I thought “wow look at that panel gap.” I am sure a lot of non-Tesla buyers have download the checklist to take with them when they go to the dealership. Tesla progresses fast while others don t. So I think at the end Tesla will come out on top. | 88 | 3 | 2,503 |
8o7e51 | 126 | < Discussion> Tesla s history of poor level of build quality has resulted in people being hyper sensitive to any issues now. With some of the faults issues down to an exhaustive checklist to me it seems that Tesla is a has made a rod for its own back now with owners scrutinising their cars far far more than they ever would have with other manufacturers. Anecdotally for me having bought two new non Tesla cars in the past the idea of a checklist is ridiculous but I understand why people are doing it. This isn t a post on the people but I think what Tesla has created is that their already problematic support network is going to get more smashed than ever because people are going in expecting a 100% flawless car when that just isn t very likely even with competitor vehicles. If you look close enough in every nook and cranny of even brand new cars you ll fine problems. They are in the end built from materiel that vary in quality and it s extremely hard to get everything exact 100% of the time. So in Tesla s pursuit of fixing it later it might have created a scenario where owners will nitpick even minor minor details and tie up the Service network trying to get it fixed. What s people s thoughts on this? | > Anecdotally for me having bought two new non Tesla cars in the past the idea of a checklist is ridiculous but I understand why people are doing it. Because even a Toyota dealer let alone a luxury brand would have done all of this for you before you get the car versus Tesla who didn t even notice a Model3 had been dropped dragged off the delivery truck. Many of the issues people are bringing up simply don t exist in other cars (or are very rare) I don t see why it s unreasonable to expect a product that was assembled correctly and not damaged in transport. | I hate the phrase build quality By the automotive definition AK-47 has poor build quality. The word is fit and finish not build quality. Tesla has never had poor build quality it has had inconsistent fit and finish which is drastically different than build quality as build quality deals with the underlying engineering reliability of the product and safety of operation. Teslas are some of the safest most reliable and most engineered cars on the road and while there have been a few cars that actually required work to function (such as cars litterally not working weeks after delivery) that certainly has been the vast minority of reports considering that the Tesla taxi from LA to LV has reported it s model S fleet to have paid itself off compared to traditional cars in a year and a half due to the lower cost of maintenance and high degree of reliability over any traditional auto. Can we stop calling paint and panel gaps build quality and call it what it is? It s product polish and litterally every manufacturer has this issue when they begin. Some get over it (remember when Kia was a throw away brand) and others never do (lol American cars from 1975-2008). I don t give a damn if my panel alignment is 1mm worse than a Mercedes. I give a damn if my car will drive a million miles without needing major repairs or engine replacement and that I don t have any breakages that make the car completely disfunctional over the next ten years (as in the car is undrivable or not safe to operate not talking about window won t roll down). All the little things can add up too so obvious brownie points if overall the interior of the car holds up to regular use. This is something that Tesla has historically been so-so with at least compared to something like a no frills Toyota. | 88 | 9 | 2,504 |
8o7e51 | 126 | < Discussion> Tesla s history of poor level of build quality has resulted in people being hyper sensitive to any issues now. With some of the faults issues down to an exhaustive checklist to me it seems that Tesla is a has made a rod for its own back now with owners scrutinising their cars far far more than they ever would have with other manufacturers. Anecdotally for me having bought two new non Tesla cars in the past the idea of a checklist is ridiculous but I understand why people are doing it. This isn t a post on the people but I think what Tesla has created is that their already problematic support network is going to get more smashed than ever because people are going in expecting a 100% flawless car when that just isn t very likely even with competitor vehicles. If you look close enough in every nook and cranny of even brand new cars you ll fine problems. They are in the end built from materiel that vary in quality and it s extremely hard to get everything exact 100% of the time. So in Tesla s pursuit of fixing it later it might have created a scenario where owners will nitpick even minor minor details and tie up the Service network trying to get it fixed. What s people s thoughts on this? | > Anecdotally for me having bought two new non Tesla cars in the past the idea of a checklist is ridiculous but I understand why people are doing it. Because even a Toyota dealer let alone a luxury brand would have done all of this for you before you get the car versus Tesla who didn t even notice a Model3 had been dropped dragged off the delivery truck. Many of the issues people are bringing up simply don t exist in other cars (or are very rare) I don t see why it s unreasonable to expect a product that was assembled correctly and not damaged in transport. | I agree. | 88 | 11 | 2,505 |
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