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Oracle sues Google over use of Java in Android - jbarham
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/oracle-sues-google-for-patent-infringement-2010-08-12?reflink=MW_news_stmp
======
cscotta
The biggest issue I see with Oracle's lawsuit is not with Android itself, but
the future of Java as an open platform.
The claims are pretty serious, and Oracle is going straight for the jugular.
It'll be interesting to see how it shakes out, but I've got to hope that
Google will come out of this in good shape for the sake of Java. It's
unfortunate that Oracle is interpreting Google's implementation of Dalvik and
a Java-based system as a direct infringement upon their patents.
Android aside, it raises some fairly serious questions around Java's future
development as a platform vis a vis the uncertainty recently resolved between
Microsoft and the Mono project. While Microsoft extended their "Community
Promise" to Mono implementors and users, Oracle seems to be taking the
opposite approach to companies developing alternate JVMs and Java-based
devices. It'll be interesting to see Oracle's stance toward other alternate
JVMs such as IBM's.
If you're curious, the original complaint is here:
[http://www.scribd.com/doc/35811761/Oracle-s-complaint-
agains...](http://www.scribd.com/doc/35811761/Oracle-s-complaint-against-
Google-for-Java-patent-infringement)
The patents upon which Oracle claims infringement are:
\- Protection domains to provide security in a computer system (6,125,447)
\- Controlling Access to a Resource (6,192,476)
\- Method and apparatus for pre-processing and packaging class files
(5,966,702)
\- System and method for dynamic preloading of classes through memory space
cloning of a master runtime system process (7,426,720)
\- Interpreting functions utilizing a hybrid of virtual and native machine
instructions (6,910,205)
\- Method and system for performing static initialization (6,061,520)
~~~
shasta
Oracle may claim that Google infringes on all those patents, but they'll never
sue. Patents are just a nuclear deterrent.
Edit: Wow, -7 and dropping. I guess I should have included a sarcasm symbol.
Spoiler: My point was that patents do get used, and this argument about them
just being for defense is nonsense.
~~~
Confusion
A nuclear deterrent only works if both sides have nukes. Google is a pretty
young company, with few patents. Oracle is a much older company, that bought
many old companies along the way. Oracle's patent portfolio vastly outstrips
that of Google.
~~~
daveungerer
We currently have enough nukes to destroy the world many times over. If you
take the comparison between patents and nukes to its logical conclusion, the
same probably holds. Google vs. Oracle == mutually assured destruction,
regardless of how much bigger Oracle's portfolio is.
------
tptacek
_"Java is the single most important software we've ever acquired," Oracle
Chief Executive Larry Ellison said during a conference call [...]_
... "and if you don't do everything I say, I'll blow up the moon! Ah-
hahahahah!"
How do you not love this guy? Somebody get him a black cape.
~~~
gahahaha
He is just trying to save /more/ children in Africa.
[http://online.wsj.com/article/NA_WSJ_PUB:SB10001424052748704...](http://online.wsj.com/article/NA_WSJ_PUB:SB10001424052748704017904575409193790337162.html)
Larry Ellison is a saint! ... and an asshole.
~~~
Timothee
The letter he wrote for the Giving Pledge website actually shows a bit of him
being a saint and an asshole:
<http://givingpledge.org/#larry_ellison>
_To whom it may concern,_
_Many years ago, I put virtually all of my assets into a trust with the
intent of giving away at least 95% of my wealth to charitable causes. I have
already given hundreds of millions of dollars to medical research and
education, and I will give billions more over time. Until now, I have done
this giving quietly – because I have long believed that charitable giving is a
personal and private matter. So why am I going public now? Warren Buffett
personally asked me to write this letter because he said I would be “setting
an example” and “influencing others” to give. I hope he’s right._
_Larry Ellison_
On one hand, he _is_ giving a lot, on the other, you can tell he couldn't care
less about the pledge and the letter.
~~~
iambvk
I wonder how much did google give away till now...
~~~
micrypt
"In 2004, when Google founders Larry Page and Sergey Brin wrote to prospective
shareholders about their vision for the company, they outlined a commitment to
contribute significant resources, including 1% of Google's equity and profits
in some form, as well as employee time, to address some of the world's most
urgent problems. That commitment became a range of giving initiatives
including Google.org."
\- <http://www.google.org/about.html>
------
guelo
My dream for wrestling my profession away from the lawyers and CEOs is the
formation of a programmer's union. The union would mainly be concerned with
issues like these patents. A strike would be called on any company that tried
to use software patents. A strike would mean not only that the programmers of
that company would stop working, but also all programmers nationwide would
refuse to work on that company's products and platforms.
If such a union existed it would immediately stop the use of software patents.
The union could also lobby congress for the elimination of software patents
and could work on other programmer related laws, establish standards bodies,
etc. IOW, give programmers some say in the industry that is currently driven
by the suits.
~~~
maweaver
I'd rather see us become licensed professionals, like CPAs, with a large
professional organization (like the AICPA) to lobby for us on issues like
software patents, etc.
~~~
noarchy
I see your point, but I worry about this creating barriers for people wanting
to get into our profession. As it stands, you can still get a job in this
field without any formal education in it, as long as you can show you've got
the goods. I'm quite fond of this fact, and there is some real talent out
there that might get the door shut in their face if there were a wall of
licensing.
------
Eliezer
I like this headline because if we sent it back in time 30 years it wouldn't
make any sense at all.
~~~
pjscott
Looking over the front page, I wonder what the people thirty years ago would
have made of some of the other headlines:
"Making GitHub More Open: Git-backed Wikis"
"Twitter Polling in the Cloud in 30s using PiCloud"
or, my favorite:
"Burning man defeats PayPal"
(I envision something like the Biblical story of Jesus driving money-changers
out of a temple, but this time, Jesus lights himself on fire first. It's very
intimidating.)
~~~
jemfinch
> Looking over the front page, I wonder what the people thirty years ago would
> have made of some of the other headlines
People thirty years ago? Heck, I wonder what my _in-laws_ would make of those
headlines :)
------
jchonphoenix
The most worrisome factor in this lawsuit is how this will impact java as a
language and a platform. If Google loses this lawsuit, java as a language and
platform could easily die. Many companies would refuse to use it, just to be
on the safe side and avoid litigation from Oracle.
Oracle probably doesn't realize the massive damage it has done to the java
platform just by going forward with this suit. Due to the looming threat of
Oracle closing the java platform, startups and companies may begin avoiding
the java platform in the same way they avoid the Microsoft stack. In fact, I
can't see any reason why I WOULDN'T choose the .NET framework over java if
both are so closed. At least C# has lambdas...
~~~
loup-vaillant
If you like lambdas, you'd probably like F# better: lighter syntax, types are
inferred, and it looks like it's quite well supported by Microsoft.
But of course, if you consider F#, you may want to use the more free and open
Ocaml.
~~~
bruceboughton
You can like lambdas without wanting to go fully functional... just like you
can like objects without wanting to go fully object-oriented.
~~~
loup-vaillant
Well, I'm not sure. First, assignments are evil[1], which means you should
avoid setters. Second, inheritance is evil, for similar reasons (thick
interface). Third, every time I saw mixins or class polymorphism, lambdas or
sum types, would have been simpler, respectively.
Once you like lambdas, functional programming becomes more attractive than a
black hole.
[1]: <http://www.loup-vaillant.fr/articles/assignment>
~~~
barrkel
Sum types are not as dynamically extensible at runtime, or by third party
libraries, as class polymorphism.
~~~
loup-vaillant
For the particular cases I saw, runtime extensibility never mattered. (Do you
have one where it does?)
And extending a third party sum type is not very hard:
data LibType = Zero
| One Int
| Two Int Int
data MyType = ZeroOneTwo LibType
| Three Int Int Int
(It of course implies that you use MyType instead of LibType in your code.)
Finally, if you _really_ want to extend a sum type, no work around allowed,
you might want to look at Ocaml's variant types.
~~~
barrkel
The code using LibType is code you don't control; you can't change it to use
MyType instead. Indeed, you don't even have the source code to it. That's also
why the extensibility happens at runtime.
~~~
loup-vaillant
So What? Just do what you would have done in Java without inheritance:
aggregate. For each function that matters, you can write a new one that handle
the extra case:
new_function ZeroOneTwo x = old_function x
new_function Three a b c = -- handling new case
~~~
barrkel
I'm not sure if you're being willfully obtuse or not. The functions that
matter are functions you didn't write. You don't have the source code to them.
You cannot rewrite them with an extra case because you can't rewrite all the
calling sites, because those are baked into executable binaries.
The world of shrink-wrapped closed-source software may be a foreign world to
many functional advocates, but it's the world I live in, and extensibility
here is often done with polymorphism and inheritance. The code in the closed-
source kernel (application, framework, whatever) interacts with values
polymorphically, with modules and third parties relying on inheritance and
overriding to work their behaviour into the system.
You want a market for components, where both buyers and sellers are protected;
sellers do not necessarily want to reveal their source code, and buyers
especially don't. Binary, executable code is the medium of interchange. In
order to fit these things together you need protocols: sets of expected
messages and documented responses. OO polymorphic interfaces, in other words.
Inheritance at the interface level is necessary, and at the implementation
level it decreases the burden somewhat - using aggregation instead can lead to
problems of identity (the sub-parts of an aggregate each have a different one,
since they are mutable).
~~~
loup-vaillant
First, I believe that the world of shrink-wrapped proprietary software should
die.
Second, I fail to see how inheritance solves your problem: " _The code using
LibType is code you don't control; you can't change it to use MyType instead._
"
OK, let's try this with inheritance.
class LibType { Handles 3 cases }
class MyType extends LibType { Handles a fourth case }
Now tell me: how would you make the code of the library use an object of type
`MyType` instead of `LibType`? If you don't control its code, I see only one
way: somewhere, this library expects an object of type `LibType` as a
_parameter_.
Interestingly, idiomatic functional programming do just that: passing
functions as parameters. Or tuples of functions, in that case. You know that
an object is just a tuple, right?. For instance:
// Statically typed, Class based OO language
class Foo {
int bar(int,);
float baz(float, int);
int x;
}
-- Haskell
data Foo = Foo (Int -> Int)
(Float -> Int -> Int)
Int
-- The same, with record syntax. (for easy access)
data Foo = Foo { bar :: Int -> Int
baz :: Float -> Int -> Int
x :: Int
}
Note that the functions in objects of type Foo aren't fixed. So I can override
all I want. Class Polymorphism is cool, but I can do the same with mere
parametric polymorphism if I really need to. Sure, the library must be
designed for extensibility in the first place, but the same is true about OO
libraries: inheriting from a class that isn't designed with inheritance in
mind is dangerous.
~~~
loup-vaillant
Dear down voter: would you care to explain which line I crossed please?
------
patrickaljord
According to this thread on the Android mailing list, Oracle tried to settle
privately with Google but Google refused. This may mean that Google has a
strong case against those patents:
[http://groups.google.com/group/android-
developers/browse_thr...](http://groups.google.com/group/android-
developers/browse_thread/thread/a0d97347e53e94?hl=en)
------
seldo
Excuse the really really obvious question, but how can you sue somebody for
intellectual property infringement on open-source software? Didn't you already
give anybody the license to do what they wanted with it? If they've violated
the license terms in some way, isn't that different from IP infringement?
~~~
wmf
It's important to understand that Android doesn't use Oracle's open-source
OpenJDK. An argument could be made that Oracle licenses the necessary patents
_only_ for OpenJDK and not for alternate implementations such as Dalvik. An
argument could be made that Oracle licenses patents only for JVMs that are
TCK-compliant, which Dalvik isn't. An argument could be made that Oracle
licenses patents for GPLed JVMs but not for ASL-licensed JVMs (because ASL is
"too free" perhaps?)
~~~
icey
Thank you for this explanation. Until reading it this way my understanding of
the whole affair was somewhat wrong.
Given that Oracle doesn't seem shy about going after a giant like Google makes
me wonder what _other_ software Sun owned the rights to that might be even
remotely popular. If I were a company using a lot of old Sun IP in even
moderately unique ways, I'd be a little concerned right now.
~~~
nostrademons
MySQL? BerkeleyDB?
~~~
seldo
Well, Sun own MySQL. But the drop-in replacement MySQL engine makers
(infobright, percona, etc) might be a little worried.
~~~
JoachimSchipper
The comment you're replying to pointed out that Oracle owns MySQL (acquired
with Sun) and BerkeleyDB (acquired with SleepyCat).
~~~
seldo
I had forgotten they also owned BerkeleyDB (obviously I know that Oracle own
Sun, is that why I'm getting downmodded?).
But my point still stands: makers of replacement engines for MySQL could be in
violation of MySQL-related patents, which Oracle could then sue over.
~~~
bravo_sierra
They could, but they haven't, and probably won't. Oracle had a big database-
related portfolio long before they acquired Sun/MySQL, which had relatively
few. They even bought Innobase, makers of the InnoDB engine a few years ago.
Other database vendors (Percona et al., not IBM) don't have assets for Oracle
to take, don't directly threaten their core business, and going after them
would get Oracle in trouble with regulators.
Better to land a tuna than chase sardines around.
------
dminor
Google's an engineering company and I think they should fight back as such.
Get together a team of your best and brightest, take Postgres, and turn it
into a drop-in replacement for Oracle. And be very public about your efforts.
~~~
houseabsolute
Because Oracle doesn't own any patents on the implementation of relational
databases that they couldn't also sue Google over . . .
The most engineer-ish thing to do is a back of the envelope calculation:
1. Estimate how much it'd cost to fight the suit.
2. Estimate the probability of winning.
3. Estimate the damages if you lose.
4. Estimate Oracle's ask for licensing the patents.
If (1 + 2 * 3) < 4, fight, else settle. They probably have pretty good numbers
on one, three, and four considering they likely discussed this with Oracle
before fisticuffs began. The only perilous part is estimating two.
~~~
lsc
ah, but reputation matters here... you don't want to have a reputation for
being easy money for patent trolls. Additionally, as google doesn't seem to be
a patent troll, it's probably also in their interest to set legal precedents
that weaken software patents.
I mean, obviously, this doesn't mean 'always fight' but it's another value you
need to punch in to your equation, one weighing in on the 'fight' side.
In my business, a similar example would be the money I spend on running an
aggressive abuse desk. Running a less-aggressive abuse desk would be cheaper,
both in the work it takes and in customers I've lost, at least in the short
term.
But in the long term, /because/ I have succeeded in making my service a
hostile place for spammers, my abuse complaint rate is much lower than it
would be otherwise. for a while, another VPS company rented a few servers from
me... and in spite of being something like 1/60th of my size, they produced
more abuse desk work than the rest of my customers combined. I believe,
because I have an aggressive abuse desk.
(I mean, there are other costs... I've lost at least one legitimate customer I
know of, because he was compromised and his box was spewing ssh attacks over
the network. I shut him down with an email notice, the email went to the shut
down box, so he never got it. )
my point is that there are real business reasons to fight that sometimes go
beyond the immediate results of that fight.
~~~
houseabsolute
Maybe there is some space for a 3.1 step where you factor in the benefit from
fighting even if you end up losing, but I doubt there is going to be one
nearly as often as your VPS example.
~~~
lsc
in this case, they'd only get the benefit if they won; assuming that if they
lost they'd have to pay the other guy's court expenses /and/ a license, it
would make loosing more costly, but it would also make the win more valuable,
possibly out of proportion to how much more costly it makes losing.
------
jarin
The headline should read "Oracle sues Google over literally the only thing
keeping Java relevant".
~~~
zmmmmm
I don't necessarily agree about relevance, but I do find it quite mind
boggling that Oracle would strike out against what is clearly a massive growth
opportunity for Java. If they want to destroy the Java brand the fastest way
possible then definitely the right thing to do is start suing people who are
using Java. The million dollar question is why would anybody in their right
mind do this?
~~~
tezza
" The million dollar question is why would anybody in their right mind do
this?"
A slice of Android sales revenue... Perhaps as high as US$1 per handset would
be nice.
~~~
chmike
Isn't Android free ? The problem is more for mobile phone companies that may
now have to pay a license for using it. This will hurt a lot.
~~~
zmmmmm
It might not hurt too much if Oracle just asks for money. I don't think it's
the "free-as-in-beer" quality that is crucial to Android - it's the freedom
for carriers to do what they want with it that matters.
They scariest possibility would be if Oracle actually tries to exert some
other kind of influence - force their own software or restrictions or branding
onto Android (ugh!) - that would really scupper the whole thing. I have no
idea if that is possible or not (someone please tell me it is not).
------
stephenjudkins
It seems like defending against software patent claims are a cost of doing
anything interesting now days. Create a novel, popular platform or tool, and
someone somewhere will probably sue you over infringing on their patents.
Google can probably dig into its mountain of cash and come out OK, but the
precedent is chilling to smaller companies.
It's also ironic that it's Dalvik that got hit, given the amount of anti-
Microsoft hysteria that has surrounded the Mono project.
~~~
phaedrus
I'm reminded of a comment a Mono developer made about the hullabaloo over
whether Mono is a Microsoft Trojan Horse:
"I can only imagine the C++ developers are laughing their heads off at us."
------
gojomo
What an excellent occasion to try the homoglyph hoax attack on friends and
enemies! (See <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1571984> .)
<http://www.google.com/search?q=οraclе>
_Your search - οraclе - did not match any documents._
~~~
jacquesm
It seems to be the o and the e at the end. Homoglyphs were a bad idea. Single
letter or word homoglyphs in ohterwise latin text ought to be highlit somehow
to warn against tricks like that.
~~~
cracki
i just set the default encoding of my browser to latin1 and disabled auto-
detection. it doesn't work most of the time because the browser doesn't have
to _detect_ anything because of encoding tags in the page code, but it's handy
if i have suspicions.
now i see gibberish for everything i don't care about, including utf8
homoglyphs.
------
brettnak
I feel a little naive for not expecting something like this. I thought all the
Sun/Oracle nonsense would be around MySQL.
~~~
mkramlich
MySQL: I bet that part is coming.
------
bitsai
What implications, if any, does this have for the future of JVM languages like
Scala, Clojure, etc.?
~~~
cageface
Good question. It's got to cast a bit of a shadow over anything based on the
VM.
This seems like a catastrophically stupid and short-sighted move on Oracle's
part. The reason Java is as big as it is today is that it's been an open
playing field for all comers. Start tossing the odd hand grenade into the
party and the room is going to clear out fast. The timing could hardly be
worse too - Scala and Clojure seem to be building some real momentum lately.
~~~
wmf
I disagree. Java ME is already dead, so there's nothing left to kill. Server-
side Java is all properly licensed, so I don't see a problem there.
~~~
cageface
Patent and licensing issues are so complex and the outcome of litigation so
unpredictable that good faith and precedent are what count. This suit
demonstrates that Oracle is perfectly willing to pursue offensive suits on
Java IP and that's a very damaging precedent.
------
hugh4life
I bet the mono people are laughing their asses off now...
I think Sun suing Microsoft was a mistake too for the Java platform... the
write once, run everywhere ideology made Java the native platform of the
server... write once, run everywhere should be the default, but it should be
easier and encouraged to escape...
~~~
megablast
Microsoft were destroying Java with their own implementation, which was not
compatible with normal Java. They were changing the language, just as they
tried to do with HTML in internet explorer and active-x, so we still see
people having to use ie6.
Sun had to sue Microsoft, before they changed Java so much it was no longer
platform agnostic (or it was way less agnostic).
~~~
MartinCron
I wonder what would have happened, though. Would the market decide that being
platform-agnostic is more important than using MS dev tools? Would developers
just have to work (around) with an incompatible platform, as they do with IE.
I wonder if the MS rift caused more harm to Java than letting Microsoft change
its implementation.
------
rjurney
Oracle CEO Larry Ellison are good friends, best man at your wedding kind of
friends. Ellison was once on Apple's board of directors after Jobs returned to
Apple. Oracle suing Google over Java patent infringements in Android sure
plays well for Apple...
Apple vs (Google vs (Facebook && Oracle))
~~~
jws
… and if you rearrange the letters of "spicy acorn" it even spells
"conspiracy"!.
~~~
pohl
That's the beauty of _quid pro quo_ : it's plausibly deniable and you can poke
fun at those who suspect it.
------
squidsoup
This article is a bit light on detail - can anyone explain how the development
of Android infringes on Oracle's IP?
~~~
tzs
If they were talking about Oracle's patents, it would make sense. It's the
talk of it being copyright infringement that has me confused.
Android is basically, as far as I've read, a Linux kernel, with Google's own
user space on top of that--their own equivalent of libc and their own
windowing system. On top of that, they run their own JVM, which they wrote
themselves and which is NOT even compatible with Oracle's at the byte-code
level. Android apps are written in Java and compiled/JITed for Google's VM.
So, unless the Java compiler itself takes code from Oracle's compiler, it is
hard to see what in their would contain copies of Oracle code.
~~~
pohl
One thing missing from your list: the standard java libs like java.lang.* etc.
Are those google's implementations?
~~~
jancona
They're from the Apache Harmony project, not from Sun's Java.
------
macemoneta
As background, from WikiPedia:
"On November 13, 2006, Sun released much of Java as open source software under
the terms of the GNU General Public License (GPL). On May 8, 2007, Sun
finished the process, making all of Java's core code available under free
software/open-source distribution terms, aside from a small portion of code to
which Sun did not hold the copyright."
If Sun willingly made the code GPL licensed, and Google isn't using anything
outside the GPL code, even if some of the technologies were covered by patents
I don't see Oracle having a case. Right now, this sounds very much like the
SCO - Linux suit that dragged on forever and went nowhere.
~~~
avar
Giving out software under the GPL v2 does not mean that you grant others a
patent license, that isn't within the scope of the GPL v2.
~~~
ori_b
That's not true. See section 7 of the GPL. In part:
For example, if a patent license would not permit royalty-free redistribution
of the Program by all those who receive copies directly or indirectly through
you, then the only way you could satisfy both it and this License would be to
refrain entirely from distribution of the Program.
However, it seems Sun can relicence the software under whatever they want, and
the current versions of it wouldn't be under GPL anymore. I am not a lawyer,
so I don't know exactly what this implies.
~~~
jamesgeck0
So you're saying that it grants users of the GPL code an exception from the
patent owned by the original developers?
In that case, wouldn't the exception only be extended to Google if their
implementation of Java was not independent from Sun's implementation? Because
Devrak was derived from Apache Harmony, it might not share _any_ code with
Oracle Java.
------
Encosia
I was reviewing some of Ellison's pre-acquisition talk about Java and found
this: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Dtqe1e0tXg#t=7m10s>
Interesting and relevant.
------
bliss
As a developer, I'm getting scared off the Java platform here. I know it's the
JVM that's at issue, but I hate the kind of lock in that this implies - I
think they'll do serious long term harm here.
------
noonespecial
It just goes to show that whatever company-de-jour promises about enforcing
the patents that they are granted today, all bets are off when they fall on
hard times and are acquired tomorrow.
Serious about openness? Skip the "patent and promise" dance and just release
the damn thing BSD.
~~~
technomancy
The BSD license would be useless here. Preventing this kind of thing is the
whole point of the third revision of the GPL; to my knowledge there are no
other software licenses that do this.
~~~
bad_user
No, GPLv3 is useless here.
Oracle can sue for patents over any GPLv3 technology, and all GPLv3 says is
that the company doing the suing can't distribute code under GPLv3.
But since they own the copyrights of Java, they can always change its license
and leave the rest of the world in dust.
~~~
purple-people
Uhh, no.
They would be violating the GPLv3 license under which they distributed the
source. Changing the license only affects the next person acquiring the
source. The people who acquired it under the GPLv3 license cannot have this
retroactively revoked or relicensed. If Orcale sued those parties, they would
be violating the terms of the license. In the least instance they shouldn't
have been distributing the source unde GPLv3 so their claim for infringement
would be moot.
------
arghnoname
Can someone remind me why Google didn't buy Sun when it was on the market? The
culture seems like it would have been a relatively good fit and their use of
Java related technologies (obviously now) would have made ownership of those
technologies useful.
Had they bought Sun and then sold off the hardware side of the business they
would have bought a lot of solid engineers and IP.
~~~
el_chapitan
In hindsight, it might have been cheaper to buy them outright than to litigate
a battle like this. Then again, they're going to have some undisclosed
settlement, so we'll never really know how it ends up.
I'm guessing they didn't buy them because of the business they were in.
Selling workstations + Solaris was only part of their business. I think the
services part of their work was bringing in more money towards the end. As far
as I'm aware, Google doesn't do much in the services realm, which probably
factored big into their decision not to buy.
------
dstein
Oracle is sending a very clear message every programmer, young and old.
"If you use Java to make something valuable, we're gonna sue the crap out of
you".
This will have long term consequences for Oracle.
~~~
joeyh
"Java: Write once, run anywhere, be sued by Oracle"
~~~
nivertech
"Java: Write once, run anywhere and hide from Oracle"
------
InclinedPlane
Oracle may do what no other company, even MS, has managed to do: kill java.
They are currently making an excellent case that it's time to move on to a new
technology, not just open source but actually free to use.
------
hugh4life
Google just bought Instantiations... and Google is getting to release their
GUI designers for Swing, SWT, and GWT...
<http://www.infoq.com/news/2010/08/eclipse4-released>
""""" "You said..."it is expected that GWT Designer will make an appearance
via the GWT Blog in the coming months"
Actually, we are in the process of Googlizing _all_ of our products; not just
GWT Designer. They will all be made available again fairly soon and the
announcement will be made on the GWT blog. """""
------
noelchurchill
Aren't Larry Ellison and Steven Jobs best friends?
~~~
parenthesis
A source: [http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-
bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/ar...](http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-
bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/01/14/MNGS649LVB1.DTL)
"Ellison's best friend … Steve Jobs … did double duty as the wedding
photographer [at Ellison's wedding]."
Also Ellison was on Apple's board for a few years after the second coming of
Jobs.
------
thebootstrapper
This sucks. Android is one the best thing happened to Java in recent times.
And this actually means the Apache Harmony people wont get the TCK now. Sucks
even more.
------
dkskalwd
I am happy about this. This demonstrate that patents and copyright in the IT
field can kill the innovation. So a hard war in this field can contribute to
abolish copyright.
Small developers are very vulnerable, let's see what happen when the giants
eat each other.
------
elblanco
Amazing, Oracle's strategy seems to be to purchase good technology (MySQL,
JAVA,...) and then strangle off and alienate users of that entire business
line by being douches.
There must be some kind of business school thing I'm missing here.
------
mmorris
I'm sure there would be speed issues, but Google is really supportive of
Python right? Wink wink, nudge nudge.
(I've heard about the Android Scripting Environment, but it sounds like that
is not as fully supported as might be ideal).
~~~
statictype
I believe its already possible package python programs as .apk bundles right?
------
waldrews
What does this mean for the almost-but-not-quite-JVM implementation in GAE?
~~~
pjscott
Do you have a link that explains more? The GAE docs say they use "the Java 6
virtual machine (JVM)."
<http://code.google.com/appengine/docs/java/overview.html>
------
tzs
Google should switch to C# and Mono. Besides giving them a better language and
VM, it would cause the most amusing set of rants from the anti-Mono crowd.
Win/win.
~~~
squidsoup
By better language, do you mean better than Java? The JVM supports many other
great languages like Ruby, Clojure and Scala.
I'd love to see Google provide GWT support for Scala, but that's another issue
:)
~~~
binaryfinery
The JVM bytecode is shitty. It cannot support dynamic languages at the VM
level (yet: <http://jcp.org/en/jsr/detail?id=292>), the support for the C#
equivalent of structs has been pushed back, and that makes any kind of
hardware acceleration painful. Then theres type erasure - a total hack to get
generics.
I think Oracle is being beyond stupid here. If anyone has the power to come up
with a language and toolchain to make Java utterly irrelevant, its Google.
~~~
rayvega
History will repeat itself. Sun sued Microsoft over their implementation of
Java. In response, MS drops Java and creates its own language (C#), framework
(.NET), and VM (CLR) which now solidly competes with Java in the enterprise
software space.
If MS was able to accomplish all of that, then imagine what Google could
create if they decided to drop Java altogether ('Go' language might be the
preview.) That would be a huge win for the software industry while a big (long
term) loss for Oracle as Java further wans in popularity.
(Hmm....if Oracle can sue Google over the non-Java VM they created for Android
couldn't they sue MS for their "JVM-like" CLR? This is another reason why
their patent lawsuit is so ridiculous.)
No matter how you slice it, Google has the advantage in the long run while
patent trolls like Oracle have the most to lose in the long term.
------
timinman
"A Google spokesman said the company hasn't yet been served with the lawsuit,
and is therefore unable to comment.
An Oracle spokeswoman declined to comment."
With Oracle knowing obviously knowing this could damage their largest asset,
it makes me wonder if they're still in talks. Someone who knows more law than
I do could probably tell us. How hard is it do withdraw a suit once filed. How
expensive is it to file a lawsuit your not certain you'll follow through on?
------
donaq
I'm sorry, but I just don't understand this decision. Is Oracle in need of
cash or something? Why did they become patent trolls? I mean, they're not even
in the smart phone business, and it's not like Google is going to put a DBMS
into Android. How are they being threatened in any way by Google?
~~~
wmf
Oh, but they _are_ in the phone business; every phone that includes Java pays
license fees to Oracle... except Android phones aren't paying.
~~~
zmmmmm
This may be true but it would be amazingly bone headed of them. Android is the
best thing to happen to Java in the last 5 years, and the perception (at
least) that people using Java have less to worry about as far as patents go is
one of the few things really giving it a strong advantage over .NET. This is a
remarkably effective way of destroying several of Java's strengths all in one
go....
~~~
Calamitous
You're assuming they a) care about Java, and b) care about what's good for the
smartphone market. If you flip those assumptions, it's not boneheaded at all.
Just very, very slimy...
------
rquirk
Oracle must be pretty sure of victory, or a positive outcome at least,
otherwise why would they go after Google right away? They could have gone
after HTC, as Apple did. That would have been a more likely victory, which
Oracle could have used as leverage against Google.
~~~
caf
On the other hand, why didn't they go after HTC and the other device
manufacturers at the same time?
------
drv
This bit at the end was interesting:
_[...] any software found to be in violation of Oracle's copyrights "be
impounded and destroyed."_
How does one go about rounding up all the copies of something as ephemeral and
easily duplicated as software? Is this common wording in software litigation?
------
serichsen
Is Oracle faring so bad? Last I looked, a company actively suing for patent
infringement meant that they have no real product, so it's their only hope of
"generating" "income". It is a sure sign of imminent corporate decline.
------
Confusion
What I don't understand and can't find anywhere: what is in it for Oracle? Do
they want licensing fees? Do they want to destroy Android? Do they want Google
to grant them licenses to certain patents Google owns?
------
anigbrowl
Interesting.
Please note, I'm not an attorney or expert on Java.
The complaint is quite vague overall, perhaps deliberately. It lists the
various patents, says what they are, and alleges that Google infringed upon
each one. It also suggests that Sun/Oracle owns heaps of Java source code
which has been used by Google, thereby breaching copyright. Oh, and since I
own an Android phone I too am infringing on their patents, but fortunately
they lay the blame for this at Google's feet. Whew!
Nowhere in the complaint is there any explanation of what licensing
obligations were applicable or which govern the distribution of Java. Nor is
it clear when Oracle alleges this infringement began in relation to each
patent, or why or how they consider it to be infringed upon by Android. The
complaint mentions the Dalvik VM specifically.
Looking through the licensing information on the phone itself, there's a bunch
of stuff from Sun under a 1993-4 license which is very short and confers the
right to use, modify and distribute the software without reservation. Most of
the rest is under the Apache Harmony license, and a sprinkling of others.
Well, I suppose if google were deliberately infringing, they would hardly
mention the fact in their licensing statements.
So where is the problem?
_14\. On information and belief, Google has been aware of Sun’s patent
portfolio, including the patents at issue, since the middle of this decade,
when Google hired certain former Sun Java engineers._
A good ZDnet article suggests the engineers in question may be 'Lars Bak,
Robert Griesemer, and Frank Yellin, all former Sun employees who now work for
Google on Java and Web browser technologies, and all of whom appear as
inventors on one or more of the patents in question.'
[http://www.zdnet.com/blog/burnette/oracle-uses-james-
gosling...](http://www.zdnet.com/blog/burnette/oracle-uses-james-gosling-
patent-to-attack-google-and-android-developers/2035)
Also (possibly, IMHO) <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshua_Bloch>
I don't know what Oracles chances are. On the surface it looks like rather
weak sauce, with some of the patents being questionable because of prior
art...but like I said, that's an amateur perspective. Oracle appears to be
saying the bare minimum necessary at this time. Google will likely move for a
summary judgment of dismissal, denying that there is any substance to Oracle's
claims, and at that point Oracle may have to make some more specific
allegations.
~~~
wccrawford
Whenever someone says 'You infringe on my patents! Pay me! ... No, I won't
tell you how you infringe,' I immediately think they're just spreading FUD.
------
epochwolf
Oh joy. I would like some details before I wave goodbye to java and the jvm.
------
bborud
[http://blog.borud.no/2010/08/pull-yourself-together-larry-
el...](http://blog.borud.no/2010/08/pull-yourself-together-larry-ellison.html)
my 2 cents
------
c1sc0
Steve Jobs must be laughing from his evil genius lair about this. You know,
two dogs fighter over a bone and stuff ...
------
loewenskind
Does this have anything to do with the GPL? I mean, is Oracle trying to
enforce Java's GPL license on Google?
~~~
wmf
No, because Java isn't GPLed. OpenJDK is GPLed, but this suit has nothing to
do with OpenJDK.
------
BenoitEssiambre
I thought we were supposed to use java instead of c# to avoid getting into the
this exact situation :-S
------
billmcneale
The biggest issue for Oracle is that Sun's previous CEO publicly congratulated
Google about Android:
[http://beust.com/weblog/2010/08/12/oracle-is-suing-google-
ov...](http://beust.com/weblog/2010/08/12/oracle-is-suing-google-over-java-
theres-just-one-tiny-problem/)
Good luck defending your trademark after the CEO declares it's not really
interested in doing so.
~~~
btilly
Intellectual property divides into 3 fields with 3 different sets of rules.
Anything you learn about how copyrights, trademarks and patents work is more
likely than not to be wrong about the other two.
You're thinking trademark law. This lawsuit is under patent law. It doesn't
matter what Jonathan Schwartz publicly said.
~~~
_delirium
It's not as strong as with trademark law, but patent law does have some notion
of estoppel--- if you know someone is using a patent of yours, and publicly
congratulate them for it, and then years later turn around and sue them, your
job in pulling off the U-turn is at least a bit harder. Among other things,
they can argue detrimental reliance on your public acquiescence to their
usage.
------
bdwalter
I expect this to be the first of many lawsuits from "the larry" surrounding
Sun IP.
------
js4all
As a side note, there is something cooking. In the last weeks, Oracle has been
replacing Sun's copyright messages with their own all over in Java. This even
effected Eclipses startup code.
~~~
rue
This is probably because Sun no longer exists.
------
obluda
goodbye java ?
------
c00p3r
That is good for Android community and not so good for Java community.
First of all, we should praise Google for making so good decisions, to re-use
wast community of Java developers and Eclipse (without which they cannot
program ^_^) and avoid bloated and corporative-centered JVM or Java ME, that
it resulted in such ridiculous lawsuit about .jar files. ^_^
They also got a lot of buzz and the reputation of not doing evil and even
being a victim of a corporate monster and patent trolls.
btw, it looks a lot like an Apples decision about dropping Flash (yet another
outdated artificial tumor) just because it simply does not work. Google'd
rewrote VM, while Apple invested in LLVM.
So, it is a good news.
------
binaryfinery
And needless to say, at least patent 6,125,447 has prior art.
------
korch
Google choosing Java:
<nelson> Ha-Ha! </nelson>
------
dangrossman
Sun released the majority of Java under the GPL. How can you claim that
someone you licensed the code to is infringing both its copyright and its
patent? I'm looking forward to some more detail when Google publishes a
response.
~~~
patrickaljord
But Google's android does not use Sun's GPLed Java, it uses their own Java
called "Dalvik" <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalvik_(software)>
~~~
jbarham
Note that Dalvik is essentially just an alternate stack-based virtual machine
for bytecode that's been converted from the standard stack-based JVM bytecode.
You still need a standard Java SDK to develop Android applications in order to
compile the Java source code to JVM bytecode.
So far Google has been able to get the best of both worlds by leveraging the
vast Java tools ecosystem but then in the final step they convert the standard
JVM bytecode to run on their own Dalvik VM which means they don't have to pay
license fees for the standard Java runtime. IMO this is what is really
annoying Oracle. (To be fair there are also good technical reasons why they
created Dalvik.)
I can understand where Oracle is coming from legally, but business-wise I
think this lawsuit is bound to backfire. Google has the resources to defend
themselves and move away from Java in the long term, but in the meantime
Oracle has created serious uncertainty about the openness of the Java platform
which will scare technically innovative players away from Java that don't have
the financial and legal resources that Google does. So Oracle turns Java into
the new COBOL, a technically moribund backwater that is only kept alive for
legacy purposes.
~~~
artsrc
I don't know why Dalvik exists.
The JVM is GPL'd, you don't have to pay license fees to use.
There are other Apache licensed JVM's (<http://harmony.apache.org/>).
If this lawsuit drives people towards the Newspeak and V8 VM that would be a
good thing.
------
RexRollman
If I didn't detest software patent suits so much, I would say this is karma
for Google's recent actions regarding network neutrality and wireless
broadband.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
GitHub Removes BSD2/3 Clause Licenses - deadgrey19
When creating a new repository on github.com (https://github.com/new), it is no longer possible to automatically generate BSD2/3 clause licenses.
======
darkengine
They also don't have an option for GPLv2, because it would introduce
"cognitive overhead".
[https://github.com/github/choosealicense.com/issues/413](https://github.com/github/choosealicense.com/issues/413)
~~~
yc-kraln
I guess their users aren't really thinking types...
------
rurban
Huge bullshit. They have no idea about MIT vs BSD, and "cognitive overload" is
a non-argument. Removal didn't change anything to them, but a lot for their
users.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: How do you organize and share information within your company? - EpiphanyMachine
We are looking for a place to put all the knowledge we share into one place. The idea would be that when someone asks you a questions you answer in this place and send them a link to your answer. With a culture of always checking this resource first we could save a lot of time on repeat answers.<p>We tried google sites (mostly because it was a simple proof of concept) but want something more robust. We are looking at using a wiki right now.<p>What tools are you currently using and what do you like or dislike about them?
======
nicolasiac
We installed WordPress on a server and then installed a plugin for
knowledgebase. Everyone can add an article under various categories.
~~~
EpiphanyMachine
Have you gotten feedback good or bad from users of this? My concern is people
won't start to use it if there is friction or annoyance with the setup.
Thanks!
~~~
nicolasiac
This is the one we used. [https://en-gb.wordpress.org/plugins/wp-
knowledgebase/](https://en-gb.wordpress.org/plugins/wp-knowledgebase/) As you
can see, you can organize articles in categories and there is even a search
box. Initial feedback is good so far. A knowledgebase system is essential in
all companies regardless of the feedback some users might give (usually those
who are bored to search for answers), since all knowledge should be stored
centrally. If a key person leaves, all his/her knowledge will be there!
------
mohsinr
What about internal wiki. We use doku wiki lot of knowledgebase there for
anyone to read...
~~~
EpiphanyMachine
It is used all the time or a backup for when you don't have someone to ask? I
am specifically trying to find something with a barrier so low it is the first
thing people turn to when they have a question.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Automated Python 2 to 3 code translation - julox
http://pythonconverter.com/
======
mherrmann
I don't mean to be negative, but how is this better than just using the `2to3`
tool that already ships with Python?
~~~
mathnode
But this web-2to3 is monetised with ads. The python community didn't think of
that.
~~~
raverbashing
They (the python community) doesn't require a library for left-padding. I
don't think they will fall for this
~~~
mathnode
Even the Jedi felt that burn.
------
raverbashing
I guess this is a sample project, that looks like a good portfolio piece, but
for real applications it has all the downsides of an online tool and none of
the upsides
I'll keep calling 2to3
------
4c2383f5c88e911
a = "test"
if a < 1:
print(a)
~~~
tyingq
There are some corner cases that run fine in python but trip up 2to3 tools,
including this web based one. This code for example:
print(set(x for x in range(2),))
~~~
eesmith
"asdf".encode("hex")
Is there a tool which knows to translate this to:
import binascii
binascii.b2a_hex(b"asdf")
Even worse, if the string isn't known to be a byte string or ASCII unicode
string, it's something like:
import binascii
binascii.b2a_hex(s.encode("ascii") if isinstance(s, str) else s)
~~~
tyingq
Sure...that's a different thing though. Python 3's choice to introduce new
types and change behavior of existing types means no automated tool can really
decide what to do.
The snippet I posted is a little different in that it runs on both Python 2 as
well as 3, but the 2to3 tools choke on it.
~~~
eesmith
Ahh, yes, you're right.
I'm still irritated by this specific case because my code and documentation
used s.encode("hex") often, and it took a while to fix them all. Especially as
the original code used both str and unicode hex-encoded values, so I couldn't
drop in binascii. I ended up adding a C extension function.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: BidOnMyDay, bid to have me fly to you and do anything - driverdan
Looking for feedback on my newest project, BidOnMyDay: http://bidonmyday.com<p>I came up with this idea a few weeks ago when JetBlue reopened sales of their BluePass. You bid to have my fly to you, using my BluePass, and do whatever work you need done. I'm a web developer but I'm willing to do almost anything. Bids start at $1.<p>To add additional value I'm doing a video and blog post of each job, with do-follow backlinks.<p>http://bidonmyday.com
======
BSeward
This is a great idea and I hope it brings you a month of interesting
adventures.
That said, hope you'll be cleaning my home some time soon. :p
~~~
superted
I concurr, this is a fantastic idea. A book and/or blog series on your
adventures would definitely count me as an avid reader!
------
saintfiends
<http://bidonmyday.com>
------
waitwhat
You might want to put a comment somewhere that bids will only be accepted if
it is actually possible to fly JetBlue to get to the bidder's home/business.
~~~
driverdan
I'll accept any location if the bidder wants to pay for the additional
transportation. Antartica? No problem!
------
marquis
Seems like a great way for a startup to get some inexpensive attention via
your services. Wish I had something to offer right now, good luck!
------
hrabago
Good luck! I was considering bidding, but learned that JetBlue doesn't fly to
where I am.
------
dekz
Any plans to turn this into something similar to Kickstarter where bidders can
post their task for you and others can attempt to pay additional money to see
it happen? Or is this meant to me more of a surprise for you on arrival?
------
WadeWilliams
Pending Success, consider opening this up to anyone with the Blue Pass. I'm
sure there's plenty of people who would be interested in this work model,
should be easy enough for you to take a small percentage of each accepted bid.
------
jrubinovitz
I'm viewing your site with Chrome on Ubuntu and your linked text is
overlapping onto your other text. Sounds like a fun idea, though. I hope that
you'll keep records for us to see. EDIT: So is your bolded text.
~~~
driverdan
I'm looking into it. It's probably a font issue since Linux fonts are a bit
different than OS X and Windows.
------
kgen
Interesting idea, though I can't help but think that you should have left a
little more time for this to spread (it's labour day weekend after all)?
~~~
driverdan
Had I thought of it a month or two ago I would have given it a lot more time
for promotion.
I've been working on it for a few weeks and needed to launch. The BluePass is
only good Aug 22 to Nov 22. There are still parts I'm working on completing,
like outgoing email and automatic confirmation.
------
philiphodgen
I have Dan this Saturday. A day of brainstorming the re-architecture of my
website. No coding. Just thinking.
------
Shenglong
... is this right - someone bid $20,000?
------
jayliew
I like the idea, a pretty radical one too! :) All the best!! Do share the
results with the community
------
TomGullen
No bids yet? Come on people, looks good! Would bid but we are in London :(
------
capdiz
Wow good idea man.
------
BigGirlsAreBest
Doesn't mention whether this includes the option of "adult" services.
~~~
nazgulnarsil
tangential: it amazes me more attractive women don't pull a natalie dylan.
~~~
qw
My guess is that most women who decide to try prostitution has had sex before.
~~~
nazgulnarsil
I dunno, once you hit 6 figures calling it prostitution seems...like it
violates the connotations built into that word. Much less seven figures,
enough to retire on.
------
brockf
Any plans for carbon offset? Please?
~~~
driverdan
If I can find a legitimate way of doing it that's backed by science and not
some feel-good greenwashing I'd consider it. Recommendations?
~~~
brockf
<http://store.terrapass.com/store/c/18-Carbon-offsets.html>
I know South Park-style anti-liberalism can be fun, but we don't have to let
the word "green" be sucked up by big business.
Offset your carbon for this little adventure of yours, please. Sometimes,
flight travel is unavoidable, and, sometimes, people can barely afford the
flight yet alone offsets. However, this whole experiment is obviously not
about affordability or unavoidable flights, right?
Thank you!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Let's be real about dependencies - steveklabnik
https://wiki.alopex.li/LetsBeRealAboutDependencies
======
marcus_holmes
Really interesting article, but it does treat Go and Rust dependency cultures
as equivalent. Whereas there is a _strong_ preference in Go culture to use as
few dependencies as possible, and preferably only use the standard library. A
Go project using "2-300 dependencies" (cited in TFA as normal for a Rust
project) is incredibly unusual, and would be a cause for concern.
There are regular posts in r/golang from new Go devs asking what frameworks to
use, where to find the list of packages needed to do anything, etc. The
answers are always "just use the standard library".
This is often portrayed as a result of Go's historically relatively poor
package management. But I'd argue it's the other way around. Go's culture of
avoiding dependencies meant that package management wasn't as big a
requirement as it is in other languages.
It'll be interesting to see if the average number of dependencies in a Go
project increases now that the package management system is more standardised
and powerful.
~~~
pornel
The article uses C tools as an example, and which are even more conservative
with dependencies than Go.
Note that it's the _transitive_ dependencies add up. Each project, even Rust,
or even npm, has only a few direct dependencies on average.
Actual stats for Rust crates:
0 deps: 23.77% crates
1 dep: 13.81% crates
2 deps: 11.70% crates
3 deps: 10.33% crates
4 deps: 8.12% crates
5 deps: 5.75% crates
6 deps: 4.48% crates
7 deps: 3.84% crates
8 deps: 3.85% crates
9 deps: 2.61% crates
10 deps: 1.90% crates
~~~
marcus_holmes
interesting. I've no experience with Rust, so took his "2-300" at face value.
It'd be interesting to run the same analysis on Go projects and compare.
~~~
steveklabnik
It's not about "face value", it's that you may only have three dependencies,
but if one of those three has ten, and two of those ten have five, and so on
and so on. The article is talking about the end total, the parent commentor is
talking about direct dependencies.
~~~
marcus_holmes
Yeah, sorry, I meant that I misinterpreted his "2-300 dependencies per
project" to mean the developer themselves had included 2-300 dependencies per
project, rather than that was the final result of the entire dependency tree.
Maybe I've seen too many nightmare JS projects where this is literally true ;)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
"Potentially rogue binary" in Sprint Evo - jchonphoenix
http://www.unrevoked.com/rootwiki/doku.php/public/unrevoked1_disclosure
======
mmastrac
I'm part of the team that found this backdoor. A few points:
1\. "Never Trust Sprint Again" is editorializing on the part of the submitter,
not our stance. It's a very, very crappy thing to put on a phone, but there's
no evidence it was placed there maliciously.
2\. It was released in the wild on the HTC Hero for some time. We believe it
would have been in the wild on the EVO if we hadn't reported it.
3\. Sprint was very responsive when we reported this to them. They turned
around a patch within a few days that sealed this particular hole.
4\. We have no idea where this came from or who was ultimately responsible.
That information never made it back to us.
~~~
Turing_Machine
Clarification request: I don't have one of these phones, but have friends who
do. Are the OTA updates installed automatically, or do they need to take some
action (e.g. run a software update app or the like)?
~~~
mmastrac
If you're running stock (or close to stock firmware), you'll get a popup
notification saying there's an update available. If you haven't received one
for a few days, you're more than likely up-to-date.
~~~
Turing_Machine
Thanks! I'll let my friends know.
------
mahmud
Look, if your backdoor binary sits in /usr/bin or similar in a file system,
you really have no business writing backdoors.
Sprint could have the same functionality built into the kernel and no one
would have noticed it. It's actually a good thing it's not running by default.
I would snoop around further and see how it's launched; the command list only
has the shutdown commands, not the launcher. Without the trigger you really
don't have the whole answer.
~~~
noonespecial
Also if you name it "SkyAgent" (or anything vaguely Terminator-y), you wear
the hat of shame. To parties.
------
nonane
"We do not believe that skyagent could ever be invoked remotely."
Whats the risk here? Possibly a debugging helper app left inadvertently?
~~~
masklinn
Or an OTA update adding it to the init process (though apparently skyagent has
not been removed)
~~~
mmastrac
It was removed in the OTA update on the EVO and Hero (not just chmodded, but
unlinked).
~~~
masklinn
Erm yes, I apparently mistyped, I meant to write that it had been removed
(saying that it hasn't been removed makes low if any sense)
------
jbyers
4 Jun 2010: Sprint OTA update removing skyagent binary.
I didn't trust any of the carriers to begin with. At least Sprint removed it.
------
st3fan
skyagent == air marshal?
------
jchonphoenix
What's unstated here but recognized by unrevoked is that Sprint had skyagent
purposefully on their phones so that they could easily gain root access and
keep their phones under their command.
~~~
po
If is recognized by unrevoked that that is true, then why does it state, "At
this time, we believe that skyagent was a debugging binary left over from
manufacture. We have been consistently impressed with the actions taken by
Google, Sprint, and HTC to expeditiously resolve this issue."
~~~
joubert
But a few paragraphs later they write:
However, the security vulnerabilities present in skyagent are of less cause
for concern than the purpose of the program. It appears that the binary was
designed as a backdoor into the phone, allowing remote control of the device
without the user's knowledge or permission. When the program is invoked, it
listens for connections over TCP (by default, port 12345, on all interfaces,
including the 3G network!) that accepts a fixed set of commands. These
commands appear to be authenticated only by a fixed “magic number”; the
commands are neither encrypted on the way to the device or on the way back.
The commands that we have knowledge of at this time include:
sending and monitor user tap and drag input (“PentapHook”), sending key events
(“InputCapture”), dumping the framebuffer (“captureScreen”), listing processes
(“GetProc”), rebooting the device immediately, and executing arbitrary shell
commands as root (“LaunchChild”)
~~~
ramchip
Isn't your comment fully supporting the previous poster?
It sounds a lot more like a debugging tool than a malevolent program: a
backdoor sitting in an obvious folder, with an easy default port and no
encryption, that allows to see system status, events, or run commands. Also,
"We do not believe that skyagent could ever be invoked remotely".
~~~
joubert
Curious name for a "debugging tool", but maybe that's just me.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Step inside your photos with Cardboard Camera - modeless
https://googleblog.blogspot.com/2015/12/step-inside-your-photos-with-cardboard.html
======
mortenjorck
According to a friend's analysis, this appears to be using a rather ingenious
dual slit-scan technique where it's gathering the leftmost and rightmost
columns of pixels from the CMOS as the phone is turned, and then using the
offsets between these columns against the two scans to re-create parallax.
Fascinating stuff.
------
corysama
This looks like a great inside-out 3D scanner.
Meanwhile, MS is working on a mobile-phone outside-in scanner :)
[http://www.theverge.com/2015/8/24/9199469/microsoft-turns-
ip...](http://www.theverge.com/2015/8/24/9199469/microsoft-turns-iphone-
into-3d-scanner)
------
joefkelley
I've taken "non-3d" panoramas and viewed them in Cardboard, and that was cool
enough. It is certainly the best way that currently exists to share the
experience of being somewhere with someone else. I can't wait to try this out;
I expect the addition of depth will make it that much more amazing.
------
mark_l_watson
I played with the new app yesterday. It works fairly well, generating 3D from
camera motion (you slowly pan the camera).
The resolution did not seem very good, but the effect is nice. Someone had a
good idea.
------
davesque
I'm a little confused. Do you need some kind of smart phone holder that has a
slot for your phone and lenses in front of each eye? If so, where do you get
that?
~~~
VikingCoder
"Google Cardboard."
Verizon is handing them out free right now, as a promo with Star Wars.
The New York Times sent them free to every Sunday subscriber, a few weeks ago.
Amazon has them, too. Also, here:
[https://www.google.com/get/cardboard/get-
cardboard/](https://www.google.com/get/cardboard/get-cardboard/)
~~~
davesque
Thanks!
------
CarVac
It works surprisingly well, but it has a very limited vertical extent (based
on how wide your phone camera is) and that limits the scenes it is suited for.
------
mthoms
Is there an iOS equivalent to this yet?
~~~
fredkelly
Check out [http://optonaut.co](http://optonaut.co)
------
soylentcola
Gonna have to check this out later and see how the viewing part works on the
Rift. I'm guessing it'll come down to viewing the images with the proper
alignment on the desktop/browser-based photo viewing app. If you can pull them
up fullscreen with a side-by-side layout it ought to work fine.
~~~
VikingCoder
They don't make it easy to do what you're asking.
Mostly because it's a panorama. Also because it's a single jpg, but it only
shows the left eye. The right eye data is embedded as a BASE64 encoded JPEG
that is stored in the XMP data of the image. Yup.
~~~
soylentcola
Yeah, I figured that out the un-fun way. Hopefully someone makes a wrapper or
something the way they have for other panoramic images or street view. You can
fullscreen a side-by-side 3d image and view on the Rift but you'd need
something to translate it to that format and map positional tracking.
------
Freeboots
Gah, not available in your country. Lame, why do they do that...
------
breakingcups
Cool, but why does it need permission to access my microphone?
~~~
modeless
Because it optionally records ambient audio to play while looking at your
panorama.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why Micro-Location iBeacons May Be Apple's Biggest New Feature For iOS 7 - jimiasty
http://www.forbes.com/sites/anthonykosner/2013/08/29/why-micro-location-ibeacons-may-be-apples-biggest-new-feature-for-ios-7/
======
jimiasty
This is Jakub, co-founder of Estimote (YC S13).
I will add to this article that few weeks ago we have released iOS app called
"Estimote Virtual Beacon" people can use to experience the micro-location and
proximity iBeacon-style by turning one iOS device into a virtual beacon and
use the other to test it.
Enjoy! [https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/estimote-virtual-
beacon/id68...](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/estimote-virtual-
beacon/id686915066)
I will be more than happy to answer any questions. Will be here for some time.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Of emoji, Hanzi and alchemy (2015) - mountainplus
https://jealousmarkup.xyz/texts/of-emoji-hanzi-and-alchemy/
======
telotortium
I wonder how the visual density of Hanzi vs. Pinyin (or English) compares. On
the one hand, each hanzi is approximately equivalent to about 4 letters of
Pinyin, and Hanzi text uses no spacing (which would otherwise be needed
approximately every 2 Hanzi). On the other hand, apparently Hanzi text should
be approximately 1.3 times the vertical height of Roman text, according to the
article, and Hanzi are square, so significantly wider than a Roman character.
From my observations, it seems that Chinese text ends up slightly denser than
the equivalent English text, but not overwhelmingly so, but surely there
should be an actual comparison somewhere...
~~~
azurezyq
Though varies by different kinds of content, but in reality Chinese is often
noticeably denser, mainly because most Chinese "word"s are less than 2
characters, while much longer in English. Here is a good example:
[http://www.xinhuanet.com//english/2017-06/29/c_136403556.htm](http://www.xinhuanet.com//english/2017-06/29/c_136403556.htm)
It's high quality translation of Chinese Premier's speech.
~~~
Dylan16807
So about twice as dense at the same line size, but it's using much finer
details and shapes. If I want to make sure all the lines are clear, I need to
zoom in to about 150% for the Chinese, while the English has clear lines at
70-80%.
~~~
aikinai
Maybe you're just speaking theoretically, but if you're talking about
practical reading, you certainly don't need all the details. Just like English
(where you can basically read with no more than a rough outline of words), you
can read hanzi with full fluency even with many strokes abbreviated,
illegible, etc.
~~~
Dylan16807
I'm not speaking theoretically at all.
Obviously you can shrink both. But my guess is you need to keep the Chinese
bigger.
I don't know if it's 1:1. I can't read Chinese so I can't give exact
legibility numbers. But when I shrink the text closer to the limits of legible
English, with letters still basically intact, many of the Chinese characters
are completely destroyed (while some are perfectly fine, but with more
information per character losing any of them is much worse).
~~~
aikinai
Sorry, replying very late, but I do read Japanese and you can go very small
and still read it. There’s enough context and humans are incredibly good at
seeing patterns and filling in details.
Early computer fonts, for example, couldn’t fit nearly all the strokes and
could be read just fine.
------
faitswulff
This is literally the only time I've heard anyone say anything good about
Skype since they were bought by Microsoft.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why Rust for Low-Level Linux Programming? - pieceofpeace
http://groveronline.com/2016/06/why-rust-for-low-level-linux-programming/
======
ktamura
As a long-time developer marketing person, I must say Rust is kicking ass, not
just as a language but as a community. They are deeply strategic.
1\. Clear audience target: They aren't going after C++ gurus or C magicians
but people who are new to systems programming. From Klabnik to Katz to
literally everyone in the community, they are consistent with this messaging.
2\. As part of 1, they have invested a lot in teaching systems programming 101
(heap v. stack, etc.), i.e., stuff that you learn in the first course in
systems programming in college, but many self-taught, higher-level programmers
might not know. This is a great example of authentic content marketing based
on a clear strategy working out.
3\. Their community is very inclusive. My experience (as a marketing guy who
barely remembers how to code) is that people are very helpful when you ask
questions, submit a patch, etc. This has been the case for me not just with
Rust itself but a couple of Rust projects that I've interacted with.
~~~
Bromskloss
> developer marketing person
What is that?
> They aren't going after C++ gurus or C magicians
Don't they have anything to gain from using Rust?
~~~
pjmlp
A developer evangelist. Think someone doing a talk about new Java 9 features
at a Java conference.
C++ gurus and C magicians already have invested too deep into their languages
to throw everything away and start from zero.
For example I love Rust and play occasionally with it, but for the time being
C++ is my native language on the job when I need to use a native language
outside .NET or JVM.
I know it since the C++ARM "standard" and we depend on standard OS tooling
that Rust is still catching up with.
The day will come when our customers will be able to do mixed debugging
between JVM/.NET and Rust. Or produce COM as easy as C++ compilers do.
But these are things that beginners in systems programming aren't usually
doing.
~~~
jdeeny
As a C magician, rust provides too many clear improvements over C to ignore
it. I certainly don't feel like I am 'throwing everything away and starting
from zero,' as much of my C (and other language) knowledge transfers over to
rust.
I'm not a C++ guru, but I think modern C++ is powerful enough that it doesn't
feel lacking in features compared to rust, like C does. There is less of a
draw for seasoned C++ programmers.
Rust seems to be gaining a lot of momentum and I am becoming more and more
confident that it will be regarded as a major language for embedded and
general systems programming and possibly even a successor to C.
~~~
pjmlp
For me C was already lacking when I got to learn it in 1992 , because by then
I was quite comfortable with Turbo Pascal 6.0.
Just check the feature list and type safety differences. The only advantage
from C was being less fragmented than Pascal dialects.
So I became a C++ hipster (if that would be a thing in the 90's).
We used to have the same heat from C guys that C# and other language users
nowadays have from systems languages.
Hence why I am always supportive of new programming languages that target the
same use cases.
------
jernfrost
I love C, but I think we really have to stop building all kinds of shared
libraries in C. Important code which needs to be secure and solid can't be
built on C anymore, it puts everybody at risk. Just look at the disaster
OpenSSL has been.
I think Rust would be create for building common crypto infrastructure and
things such as crypto currency. It seems risky to me to build something like
Bitcoin with C++ where millions can easily be at stake if the system doesn't
work.
I am an application programmer so I might not be the primary target, but I
started programming with Swift and although it isn't the same as Rust it has
some similarities. A lot stricter language than C++, C, Lua, Python and
Objective-C which have have used most in the past. So many bugs are caught at
compile time. I used to be skeptical towards static typing, primarily because
languages like C++ and Java made types so awful to work with. But with the
newer OOP languages with more functional inspiration, it is getting easier to
deal with strict typing.
You don't have to chose between productivity and safety so much anymore.
~~~
pcwalton
> You don't have to chose between productivity and safety so much anymore.
Exactly. If I had to sum up Rust's philosophy in one sentence, this would
basically be it. (Add "and performance" after "safety" too.) :)
~~~
infogulch
Safe. Productive. Fast.
Choose any three.
(Taking a hint from SQLite.)
------
Animats
Rather than writing for Linux in Rust, we need a new kernel written in Rust.
I'd like to see a replacement for the QNX microkernel written in Rust. It's
about 60K bytes of code, yet you can run POSIX programs on it. (You need file
system and networking, which are user processes.) The QNX kernel is stable -
it changes very little from year to year. There's hope of catching all the
bugs. This offers a way out of "patch and release" OS development.
Yes, you take a 20% or so performance hit for using a microkernel. Big deal.
At one time, you could download the QNX kernel sources and look at them.[1]
This would be helpful in getting the microkernel architecture right. It's very
hard to get that right. See Mach or Hurd.
[1]
[http://community.qnx.com/sf/sfmain/do/downloadAttachment/pro...](http://community.qnx.com/sf/sfmain/do/downloadAttachment/projects.core_os/wiki/BuildKernelWithIDE?id=atch1253)
~~~
naasking
L4.sec is already formally verified. So the microkernel is already done. You
need the user land services to provide POSIX compatibility, and that you can
possibly do in Rust.
~~~
steveklabnik
[https://robigalia.org/](https://robigalia.org/)
~~~
naasking
Looks cool, thanks. They should take the opportunity to fix a few Unix/ACL
security problems though, instead of just reproducing the same old POSIX
quagmire. Make chroot isolation complete with plan9-like private namespaces,
don't implement the traditional broken user/group security model and instead
learn from the Polaris virus safe computing prototype (they're already partway
there by using the capability secure seL4 kernel).
I would personally also want to eliminate a lot of the duplication in the
POSIX API, but that probably won't fly. Can have your cake and eat it too.
------
TheMagicHorsey
Is there any reason why embedded software for autonomous vehicles is still
being written in C/C++? This last week I was talking to a friend at a company
that makes a small autonomous vehicle. During testing their prototype suddenly
went off in a straight line. They had to pull a safety to halt the vehicle or
it would have gone straight forever into the Pacific Ocean. Turns out there
was an unsafe access to a variable in memory, which had not been caught with
their software and hardware test platform, even with thousands of virtual
sorties.
If their code was written in Rust, that sort of bug could not have occurred.
~~~
steveklabnik
There's two reasons Rust might not be ready here yet. First, while LLVM
supports a wide number of platforms, some embedded devices literally only
support the exact version of the C compiler they ship to you, sometimes, it's
even got its own custom patches. Second, we sort of assume 32 bits at the
lowest, though we have a patch in the queue that starts some work on 8/16 bit
support. This means some tiny micros are out of reach at the moment.
~~~
shepmaster
> we have a patch in the queue
If you mean this one[1], it's merged. Still lots of work to do, and even more
corners where things will shake out[2], but there's definitely progress.
[1]: [https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/pull/33460](https://github.com/rust-
lang/rust/pull/33460) [2]: [https://github.com/rust-
lang/rust/pull/34174](https://github.com/rust-lang/rust/pull/34174)
~~~
steveklabnik
Ah nice! I was unsure if the first had gotten through bors yet or not, and I
was pretty sure the second one hadn't.
------
fdr
I'd like to be able to use something like rust, and maybe I will for smaller
projects or for novelty sake, but I chafe over how slow compilation time is
relative to C (not C++!) projects last I checked.
On the hardware of yesteryear, a parallel compile could build Postgres in
about 45 seconds (750-1305KLOC, depending on measurement) , and user mode
Linux (which doesn't compile so many drivers) in about a minute.
~~~
steveklabnik
We've made steady improvements here, so depending on when you checked, it
might be much better.
The real improvements will come when incremental compilation lands. The
precursor requirements are just landing now; so it won't be immediately here,
but it will be soonish.
------
xvilka
Well, Rust is awesome, but there is a place for C too. I just don't understand
lack of the life and no improvements in C for ages. Better typing system (for
example _Generic doesn't know uint8_t, etc types - they are just typedefs),
'pure' keyword for functions without side effects, tuples support, deprecate a
lot of the things and so on.
~~~
stirner
> I just don't understand lack of the life and no improvements in C for ages.
Well, MSVC still hasn't even fully implemented C99. One of the big draws of C,
as I see it, is its wide support on many operating systems and architectures.
If you're going to abandon that by using new C features, you might as well use
a language with less cruft.
~~~
valarauca1
>Well, MSVC still hasn't even fully implemented C99
Neither does GCC. Both don't fully implement C11 either.
Most these features are either things C-Compilers don't need to support
themselves. Namely: special integer types can be placed in libraries instead
of compilers.
Also bounds checking interfaces are a performance loss and not included in C
compilers despite them being part of the C11 standard. (Well they're optional)
------
bjourne
Performance. Rust is still twice as slow as C
([http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/performance.php...](http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/performance.php?test=spectralnorm))
which is still a fair bit slower than if a skilled assembly programmer had
taken on the task.
Rust aficionados will say that their compiler is getting better, but so is C.
clang has gotten faster than gcc on some benchmarks and on some others gcc has
catched up and is now faster than clang again.
But what if you don't need optimal performance? Then you can use Rust. But
then you can also use Go, Python, SBCL, Haskell, Java, C#...
~~~
valarauca1
This difference on this test is caused by Rust not having stabilized SIMD
support. Also Rust support hand rolled assembly (on nightly) that C has.
On non-SIMD tasks Rust/C are neck and neck
[https://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/rust.html](https://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/rust.html)
You're just cherry picking benchmarks. In the cases you _care_ about raw
number crunching power you'll likely be using a GPU not SIMD instructions as
CPU's are roughly 3-4 orders of magnitude slower then GPU's at pure number
crunching tasks.
Not that SIMD isn't important as it's instructions also cover things like AES,
SHA1/2, Random numbers, Cache pre-loading/evacuation, memory fences, and fast
loading paths. But so few programmers worry about these things you are really
hitting a niche market.
~~~
bjourne
> This difference on this test is caused by Rust not having stabilized SIMD
> support. Also Rust support hand rolled assembly (on nightly) that C has.
Cool. Let's call that language with SIMD and inline assembly support
FutureRust(tm) to differentiate it from the currently released and available
Rust. We can have a discussion about how fast FutureRust will be vs C, but
this discussion is about Rust vs C. Or rather clang 3.6.2/gcc 5.2.1 vs Rust
1.9.0 since language performance is very implementation dependent.
> On non-SIMD tasks Rust/C are neck and neck
> [https://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/rust.html](https://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/rust.html)
In 5 of 10 benchmarks, C is twice as fast as Rust. In one of the benchmarks
where it is neck and neck, like pidigits
([https://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/performance.ph...](https://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/performance.php?test=pidigits))
it appears to be so because both the C and the Rust variant are wrapping
libgmp. GMP is written in C.
~~~
valarauca1
>In 5 of 10 benchmarks, C is twice as fast as Rust
fannkuch-redux why? SIMD
fasta-redux why? SIMD
spectral-norm why? SIMD
reverse-complement why? SIMD
N-Body why? Oh you guessed it SIMD
Seriously read the source code. Remember on HN where a lot of people
constantly say the benchmark game is really crappy. This is why. All 5 of
these tests boil down to raw FLOPS. Which C/C++ having access to SIMD
instructions wins at.
The fact that Rust/C performance difference works out to just the ability to
emit vector instructions says a lot about everything else in Rust. The fact
that Rust can dereference, pass variables on the stack, call functions, and
make decisions as fast as C renders your core point completely moot.
You are just being incredibly pedantic for no reason. And your argument holds
no water. Everything Rust does is identical to C except one barely used corner
case. They use the exact same model for computation, they both live in the
Cee-LangVM. Post compilation they are functionally identical (except Rust
makes stack manipulation easier).
Does any of that make sense to you?
:.:.:
Also Rust/C both calling the GMP without a time difference is a good thing.
The Rust->C FFI is literally non-existent in practice. Dipping into C code
from Rust (and vice versa) has no penalty. The same can't be said for HUNDREDS
of languages.
~~~
bjourne
Rust is also slower in binarytrees, regexdna and fasta. SSE is not one "barely
used corner case" because huge amounts of performance critical code takes
advantage of it.
Edit: To explain why I don't believe you when you say that "Post compilation
they are functionally identical [in performance]" is because if it were so,
you would just transliterate the C solutions to the Rust equivalents and it
would run as fast as C. Since that hasn't been done and is trivial to do, my
conclusion is that it doesn't lead to the same performance.
~~~
burntsushi
Did you know Rust was quite a bit faster than C in regexdna merely a few
months ago? It didn't get slower because of Rust. The algorithms employed are
radically different. My hope is that the regex library has already regained
performance, but until the benchmark game is updated (which is on us, not the
benchmark game maintainer), I suppose we'll have to suffer the pedants!
Or perhaps, you might look at single threaded performance and wonder, maybe
there is something more interesting going on than a naive surface analysis of
C vs. Rust! :-)
[https://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64/rust.php](https://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64/rust.php)
And by the way, transliterating a regex library isn't trivial. I invite you to
transliterate Tcl's regex library. Let me know how that goes. ;-) So I think
your reasoning is specious at best.
~~~
igouy
> It didn't get slower because of Rust.
Do you mean the program became relatively slower because of changes you've
made to the regex crate?
Wasn't the program relatively faster because you wrote the regex crate to use
Aho-Corasick for the matches required by the regex-dna task?
~~~
burntsushi
> Do you mean the program became relatively slower because of changes you've
> made to the regex crate?
Yes. The underlying reasoning is complex. When the regex crate got a lazy DFA
(similar to the one used by RE2), the vast majority of regexes got
significantly faster. Some got slower. This one in particular from regex-dna:
>[^\n]*\n|\n
Before the lazy DFA, compile time analysis would notice that all matches
either start with `>` or `\n` and do a fast prefix scan for them. Each match
of `>` or `\n` represents a candidate for a match. Candidates were then
verified using something similar to the Thompson NFA, which is generally
pretty slow, but the prefix scanning reduced the amount of work required
considerably.
Once the lazy DFA was added, the prefix scanning was still used, but the lazy
DFA was used to verify candidates. It's faster in general by a lot, but, the
lazy DFA requires two scans of the candidate: one to find the end position and
another to find the start position. That extra scan made processing this regex
(on the regex-dna input) slightly slower.
I've since fixed some of this by reducing a lot of the match overhead of the
lazy DFA, so my hope is that it's back to par, but I haven't done any rigorous
benchmarking to verify that.
> Wasn't the program relatively faster because you wrote the regex crate to
> use Aho-Corasick for the matches required by the regex-dna task?
Aho-Corasick is principally useful for the second phase of regex-dna, e.g.,
the regexes that look like `ag[act]gtaaa|tttac[agt]ct`. (In the last phase,
all the regexes are just single byte literals, so neither Aho-Corasick nor the
regex engine should ever be used.) Performance here should stay the same.
On that note, I have a new nightly-only algorithm called Teddy that uses
SIMD[1] (which replaces the use of Aho-Corasick for those regexes) and is a
bit faster. I got the algorithm from the Hyperscan[2] project, which also does
extensive literal analysis to speed up regexes.
To clarify, this optimization is generally useful because a lot of regexes in
the wild have prefix literals. Even something like `(?i:foo)\s+bar` can
benefit from it, since `(?i:foo)` expands to FOO, FOo, FoO, Foo, fOO, fOo,
foO, foo, which can of course be used with Aho-Corasick (and also my new SIMD
algorithm).
One also must wonder how well a C program using PCRE2's JIT would fair on the
benchmarks game. From my experience, it would probably be near the top. It's
quite fast!
[1] - [https://github.com/rust-lang-
nursery/regex/blob/master/src/s...](https://github.com/rust-lang-
nursery/regex/blob/master/src/simd_accel/teddy128.rs)
[2] - [https://github.com/01org/hyperscan](https://github.com/01org/hyperscan)
~~~
igouy
> One also must wonder how well a C program using PCRE2's JIT would fair on
> the benchmarks game.
Let's hope some C and C++ programmers take up the challenge ;-)
------
Scarbutt
_Rust reduces the amount of state I need to keep track of in my brain._
I doubt it, the mental overhead of doing "safe memory programming" in Rust is
very high.
Edit: all good replies, want to clarify and forgot to mention that I was
comparing to languages with a GC, since I'm seeing Rust being used for lots of
stuff, in a general purpose programming language sense (like creating web
frameworks for example). Also, for non-very-low-level stuff I guess this
cognitive load will be less if/when they introduce an optional GC.
~~~
gue5t
Designing memory-safe programs in C requires a programmer to reason about the
same domains as doing so in Rust, but C doesn't double-check you to make sure
you get everything right. With no guard rails, C is a lot more stressful.
Re: reducing mental state for a programmer, algebraic datatypes in general
decrease the size of the state space of your program by making many illegal
states unrepresentable. Without advanced forms of dependent types (maybe
quotients), you can't make _all_ illegal states unrepresentable, but you
shrink the size of the state space hugely compared to writing everything as
product types (as you would in C). A programmer has to reason about all the
possible values their variables can take on, so it pays to minimize the
cardinality of that set.
~~~
mfukar
Why are we throwing away all the work done on static & dynamic analysis tools
for C programs in this kind of discussions? Programmers are crippled just for
picking C? Come on..
~~~
Manishearth
Because ultimatelty they're imperfect.
Sure, C+static analysis is good enough for many situations. But it can't
compare with the guaranteed safety offered by Rust.
~~~
mfukar
> Because ultimatelty they're imperfect.
Everything is imperfect, it's not a good reason to discount anything.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Study says standardized testing is overwhelming nation’s public schools - antigizmo
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/study-says-standardized-testing-is-overwhelming-nations-public-schools/2015/10/24/8a22092c-79ae-11e5-a958-d889faf561dc_story.html
======
douche
No shit. Public school is all about teaching to the tests. There's no time to
actually _learn anything useful_ , because everything is focused on bringing
up the state test scores, which influence funding. Not only are you spending
all this time teaching what is going to be on the standardized test, and how
to structure essays and do your work according to what the test graders
expect, but there's the two weeks taken out of instructional time just to take
the damned tests.
So you see everything that doesn't support that goal get stripped back. Home
economics? Shop? History? Real literature? Gym?
Programming/technology/spelling/philosophy? Nope, we're going to spend 80% of
your time honing your five-paragraph essay skills and pushing everybody
kicking and screaming through pre-calc.
~~~
SilasX
Whether that's good or bad depends entirely on the content of the tests. You
have to ask, "is this stuff that a graduate of the system should be able to
do?" If no, then it's fair to criticize them for having to spend time teaching
this, and instead achieve a lower proficiency but teach a broader skill set.
But if yes, then any criticism of "teaching for the test" falls flat: this is
stuff students need to be able to do, and to the extent that you're finding it
hard to do, then you were failing all along, and removing the tests would just
hide that. [1] (Plus, it's not like a student that can't meet this minimum is
going to somehow do just fine in "real literature".)
However, to conclude a "no" answer to _that_ question, you would need to cite
specific questions from the tests, and go on record saying "nope, no reason a
graduate of our system needs to know that, so why are we making sure they can
answer it?"
So I'm confused as to why such testing critics _never discuss_ this crucial
piece of evidence, instead relying entirely on innuendo about suppose dangers
of "teaching to the test".
[1] Which, of course, doesn't means the teachers specifically were the cause;
in the extreme case, if students are literally starving, then you need to fix
that. But regardless, any root-cause analysis must start from the detection of
a failure, irrespective of where it ends.
~~~
ZeroGravitas
"Teaching to the test" generally doesn't mean covering the material that the
test is intended to cover in theory, it means drilling the exact format of
questions, studying previous years, knowing exactly what you can sacrifice
coverage of, how to guess multiple choice questions when you don't know the
answer etc. Basically over-optimizing to fit an imperfect model.
Now, I'm a good test taker generally, and it has always helped me in life, and
I will ensure my children know the rules of the game. But from the perspective
of the country or planet, that's not time and effort well spent, it's a zero-
sum arms-race that could have been better spent.
There's more to this, e.g. the fact that the tests are really testing the
teachers (again very imperfectly), that some people want to privatize
education and so on, but "teaching to the test" is a well known anti-pattern
for good reasons, even though the individual incentives push us in that
direction.
~~~
waterlesscloud
>"Teaching to the test" generally doesn't mean covering the material that the
test is intended to cover in theory, it means drilling the exact format of
questions...
Sure, if you're an incompetent teacher. But then maybe, just maybe, you
shouldn't be teaching at all.
~~~
acdha
You're making a number of bad assumptions:
1\. The test actually covers what's important
2\. The teacher has the time, resources and support needed to fully convey the
material to every student
3\. The teacher and the school are receiving students who are realistically
capable of reaching the expected level
4\. The test results will be interpreted in good faith and used only to help
students and teachers perform better
In the U.S. public education system, years of simplistic fixes have largely
ensured that none of those are true. Instead there are vicious feedback loops:
unprepared students will do worse on tests, which is held against the teachers
and school no matter how hard they were trying, which leads the most motivated
parents to take their kids elsewhere and the best teachers to leave teaching
or find another school or district where their efforts are appreciated. After
a few iterations, the district may close the “failing” school and make life
even harder for kids who now have the same problems plus a more of their day
commuting to a school where they'll probably bear the stigma of having come
from a bad school/neighborhood.
------
epalmer
I'm a parent of a recent college grad and high school senior. Both of my girls
went to a “good” public school in an semi-affluent neighborhood. They take
standardized tests for two weeks each year. Or at least the calendar is
blocked from real work those two weeks. And once done the rest of the school
year is time wasting. So lots of wasted time just for the administration and
post test taking. Teachers routinely complain (in private) about teaching to
the tests.
And yet there are glimmers of hope:
Project based learning in school and after school can make a difference. While
not exactly the same thing, challenge based learning, is making a difference
in a few school districts across the county as well
[https://www.challengebasedlearning.org/pages/welcome](https://www.challengebasedlearning.org/pages/welcome).
My girls participated in FIRST Robotics
[http://www.usfirst.org/](http://www.usfirst.org/) starting with First Lego
League (FLL) and advancing through First Tech Challenge (FTC) and then to
First Robotics Competition (FRC). The best part of these programs is that it
is so much more than STEM. They learn how to solve real world like problems,
do marketing, run the business of the team, work in teams, learn about robot
design, programming and more. As a volunteer in FIRST for now ten (10) plus
years, I have witnessed it transform the lives of more than a hundred kids.
There are other similar programs like VEX, which I know little about, but
support in concept. [http://www.vexrobotics.com/](http://www.vexrobotics.com/)
The biggest challenge with these programs is funding and penetrating the
underserved schools. Of course in the underserved school if kids are hungry
then not much else matters. The same could be said for kids that can’t get to
after school programs for the many reasons that exist like both parents
working, the need to take care of siblings and more.
In my state (Virginia), state legislators and the head of the department of
education are starting to take notice of the impact of FIRST robotics on
outcomes and are talking about funding underserved school programs. Many
robotics team has been lobbying at the state and federal level for just this
cause including my daughter’s team. So maybe next year some funding will be
allocated. In my hometown, Richmond, VA. there seems to be enough passion
among adults that volunteers can be found to staff more programs for project
based learning.
We are also starting to see interest and some action for building and staffing
makerspaces in schools and libraries. This is very exciting since small
projects are also valuable for learning and more affordable. We need
makerspaces across k12 and into colleges and universities.
While none of the above fixes the teach to the test problem, or the
socioeconomic gradient issues, they at least help in some little ways.
------
yummyfajitas
23 hours a year is "overwhelming"? That's 40 minutes/week, assuming a 36 week
school year.
In other news, I'm overwhelmed by brushing my teeth.
Incidentally, since I'm sure a bunch of people will spout the "teaching to the
test" slogan, I'd love it if someone could look at these _real tests_ and
explain how to teach to them without improving student learning. Somehow I
suspect not, because real tests are actually reasonably well designed and
"teaching to the test" is actually just "teaching".
[http://www.cde.ca.gov/ta/tg/sr/documents/cstrtqmath7.pdf](http://www.cde.ca.gov/ta/tg/sr/documents/cstrtqmath7.pdf)
[http://www.nysedregents.org/Grade8/Mathematics/20100505book1...](http://www.nysedregents.org/Grade8/Mathematics/20100505book1.pdf)
[http://www.nysedregents.org/Grade8/EnglishLanguageArts/04261...](http://www.nysedregents.org/Grade8/EnglishLanguageArts/042610book1w.pdf)
~~~
hga
And most of this anti-testing stuff ignores the reason the whole regieme was
established in the first place: too many schools weren't even pretending to
teach their students the most basic of things, including the 3Rs (heck,
phonics vs. "Dick and Jane and Their Running dog Spot" is _still_ being fought
60 years after _Why Johnny Can 't Read_ was published).
I'm certain it's being taken too far without caring about the consequences
(which we could point out as another example of how dysfunctional our public
schools have become, see above, in the latter half of the 20th Century they
simply didn't care if their graduates could read), but graduating from high
school in 1979 I was at the edge of the beginning of this in Missouri. And the
test was simple (well, after the SATs and College Board achievement tests :-)
and covered entirely relevant stuff, things you really should be able to do to
earn a high school diploma.
This in fact has a lot to do with out current insane college finance regime;
the high school diploma became an _entirely_ worthless signal, so when
combined with _Griggs v. Duke Power_ , the non-free for the student college
degree has become the new signal of minimum competence.
------
rdtsc
Another negative side effect is it discourages good teachers. A neighbor told
me how he wanted to be a science teacher in highschool. He shadowed one of the
older science teachers and was basically discouraged by what he found out from
them -- the advice was "you don't get to actaully teach much fun or
interesting stuff, just teach to the test"
Or put it another way, think about the people who would choose to teach
knowing that they'll just be drilling tests all day every day. Think about
personalities that process will select for. And those will be people teaching
your kids.
~~~
matwood
I think it is important to remember why testing came about. Bad schools were
doing so bad that kids were graduating HS without the ability to read or do
basic math. In order to fix a problem this bad, first measurements have to be
taken.
My biggest problem with testing is that it can hold back gifted students.
~~~
rdtsc
But why are most schools spending almost all their time teaching to the test
so to speak. Were all of them miserable failures before?
Why couldn't they just focus on underperforming school and investigagte what
is happening there (probably poverty, crime, bad home environments if I had to
guess...).
I also don't understand the idea of relating budgets to test scores. It is
like they want schools to fail on purpose -- "Looks like you are struggling
here with teaching these kids, ok, well we'll cut your budget, that should
help..."
~~~
matwood
> But why are most schools spending almost all their time teaching to the test
> so to speak.
Is this really problem if when taught the test someone can do general math and
reading comprehension? At that point, teaching the test is teaching the basic
skills we expect a member of society to have. The only problem I have with
teaching the test is it gives a disincentive to push gifted students beyond
the test material.
> "Looks like you are struggling here with teaching these kids, ok, well we'll
> cut your budget, that should help..."
Welcome to the perverse federal government. States handle education so they
could simply tell the feds no, but the feds use tax dollars to twist the
states arms. This is also how highway speeds get set. The federal government
takes a bunch of tax money from the states and then holds it hostage unless
the states implement what the federal government wants. This is one of the big
reasons for people wanting smaller/less federal government.
------
lm______
I worked for a year as a tutor in an elementary school. Even the first graders
are doing six or seven standardized tests every year, plus random additional
tests (including those given by me and my fellow reading tutors, testing every
student in the school three times yearly to see if they qualified to be
tutored).
The kids would even get their scores back too, so would be distraught when
they didn't match up to other classmates who would brag about doing better. I
tutored kids who were behind a bit in reading, so of course my students were
consistently stressed out before the tests and afterwards, they would tell me
how this bullshit test meant that they're "stupid". I had many kids use that
exact word.
The teachers universally hated it too, since they constantly had
administrators breathing down their necks and it severely restricted their
freedom to teach creative, engaging material.
~~~
waterlesscloud
" Even the first graders are doing six or seven standardized tests every year,
plus random additional tests"
Name them. They're standardized, so this shouldn't be a problem for you.
~~~
lm______
DIBELS, MAPS, Common Core, etc. Some of these happen multiple times a year.
I honestly can't remember all of the names, but I can assure you there were
more. I was a _tutor_ \-- I never administered any of these tests -- and it
was three years ago. Just Google "first grade standardized tests" and you'll
find some more, though I can't remember which of those in particular the kids
at my school took. Each state has its own standardized tests too...
To be honest, I enjoyed taking standardized tests when I was a student, but it
became clear to me that for most kids (most of whom didn't have the stress-
free, charmed existence that I had growing up) it's just demoralizing and
useless.
~~~
waterlesscloud
Googled "first grade standardized tests" and not seeing anywhere near 6 or 7
plus more.
Sure you can't remember them all?
~~~
lm______
Yes, I'm sure. Why are you so hellbent on doubting me?
------
tboyd47
I tutor my little brother-in-law sometimes (he's 9), and I like to deprogram
him from public school testing culture as much as possible. I tell him that
when he's with me and he doesn't know the answer, don't guess. Just say, "I
don't know." And I test him, too. I ask him questions he can't possibly know
the answer to, or questions that have no right answer, just to hear him say,
"I don't know." And then I congratulate him for being honest. I do this
because I know that public school encourages him to do the exact opposite. At
least when I was in school, they never want you to leave a question blank.
They always tell you to guess. If you guess, and get the answer wrong, you get
partial credit (IIRC, 25%), but if you leave it blank, you get no credit. Why
they do this, I have no idea. Maybe they feel like if the child guesses, they
have a 25% chance of getting the right answer, so that means the school has a
25% chance of getting the federal money, so therefore the child should get 25%
credit for at least filling in the bubble. Makes sense in kind of a bizarre
way. But in the real world, there is no 25% credit for guessing.
~~~
336f5
Test motivation differs from person to person, so if you don't encourage
everyone to at least try every question and guess, you'll get differences in
scores which don't reflect the child's difference in knowledge (which is what
the test is trying to measure) so much as willingness to try or guess. This
willingness can differ systematically so you might get drastically lower
scores for poorer children than they should. (This is one of the reasons
schools like psychologists to do IQ tests, because they can spot when a child
isn't trying or is deliberately underperforming.) So that's one reason.
Another reason is that it's rare to have _no_ idea whatsoever; even if you
feel entirely uncertain, you can still often guess at above chance rates,
showing that you did know more than nothing. Forced-choice methodologies
expose that knowledge and again make the tests more accurate, because more
items means more effective at distinguishing between students.
(Imagine a test of 10 questions, each substantially harder; one student
manages to answer correctly up to question 5 before starting to feel uncertain
and refusing to answer any more, and a second gets up to question 6. How sure
are you that #1 knows less than #2? Now imagine that they instead 'guessed' on
the remaining 5 questions, and #1 got 3/5 right and #2 got 1/4\. Now how sure
are you? Haven't you learned something from this apparently 'useless'
guessing?)
> But in the real world, there is no 25% credit for guessing.
You can no more refuse to guess in the real world than you can refuse to make
choices, take actions, or let time pass.
~~~
tboyd47
I'm not saying there aren't any valid reasons for doing it. I'm just saying
the there's a "meta-lesson" there that has to be corrected. I want all my kids
to grow up knowing that there's no shame in saying "I don't know," if you
honestly don't know. Life is not a sounding smart contest.
~~~
336f5
>> Why they do this, I have no idea.
> I'm not saying there aren't any valid reasons for doing it.
> I'm just saying the there's a "meta-lesson" there that has to be corrected.
And I'm saying that your meta-lesson is not a good idea as it will tend to
teach underconfidence. The real world does not always let you off with a "I
don't know"; you may not know to some high degree of certainty whether a
cancer treatment is a good idea, but nevertheless you must decide whether or
not to do it.
------
xacaxulu
In the broader context, when it comes to math, reading and science, teens in
the U.S. rank 36th in the world. Students in Shanghai are rated the best. What
are they doing right that we could be doing better here in the US?
[http://cnycentral.com/news/local/new-survey-ranks-us-
student...](http://cnycentral.com/news/local/new-survey-ranks-us-
students-36th-in-the-world---how-do-we-improve?id=978874)
~~~
acdha
Those comparisons are misleading because they don't control for the
demographics of students coming in. The United States does a decent job for
affluent students but we have a relatively percentage of lower class students
taking the same tests, which means that the effect is significantly smaller
once you compare demographically matched students from different countries.
The elephant in the room is poverty: that's well known to have massive
educational drawbacks and most of the countries which outperform the United
States have much higher social safety nets. It's hard to study when you have
untreated medical problems, are hungry or perhaps not sleeping in the same
place every night or even having a safe place to sleep at all. That's a
familiar litany to many U.S. public school teachers and it's something which,
unlike standardized testing, has been the subject of ongoing cuts for decades.
I think that this is something we should address for many reasons but I do
want to note that poverty doesn't directly explain the entire gap, although I
suspect that the problem is exacerbated by the social instability caused by
multi-generational poverty which is harder to directly account for:
[http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/assessing_the_assessments/201...](http://blogs.edweek.org/edweek/assessing_the_assessments/2014/03/poverty_PISA_scores.html)
“Even the OECD authors of the PISA test acknowledge that PISA results are due to a combination of variables, including but not limited to schooling, life experiences/home environment, poverty, access to early childhood programs, and health. In 2013, the OECD wrote in one of their reports that poverty explains up to 46% of the PISA mathematics score in OECD countries. At no time did OECD claim, as Duncan stated, schools' performance on the test can be blamed on low expectations and complacency.”
[http://www.epi.org/publication/us-student-performance-
testin...](http://www.epi.org/publication/us-student-performance-testing/)
“If U.S. adolescents had a social class distribution that was similar to the distribution in countries to which the United States is frequently compared, average reading scores in the United States would be higher than average reading scores in the similar post-industrial countries we examined (France, Germany, and the United Kingdom), and average math scores in the United States would be about the same as average math scores in similar post-industrial countries.”
------
darkmighty
They should take a hint from engineering:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nondestructive_testing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nondestructive_testing)
~~~
JorgeGT
I don't see how dousing the kids in vast amounts of gamma radiation will do
any good...
------
mamon
In Poland we have three levels of schools: 6 years elementary, 3 years middle
and 3 years high school. There are three standard tests done at the end of
each level, which are the basis for the admission to the next level school. I
don't see the point of making more standard tests than that - it's just an
unnecessary distraction.
And yes, with Polish system you also waste some time (usually last semester)
for teachers to do test-specific teaching, but that still seems better than
having 6-7 standard tests per year
~~~
zo1
You have this in English-based schools as well. 7 + 4 + 2 years. Primary,
lower and upper sections of the last 6 years of high-school, respectively.
Even though the tests are only towards the ends of the level, most of the time
prior to it is spent teaching for it as well. Except for primary, I think you
get to pass that no matter what, unless there is something seriously deficient
in your knowledge.
------
epalmer
In addition to the in-school teach to the test problem the focus on SAT and
ACT tests for college admissions is also a really big problem. For the kids
lucky enough to consider college, the fact remains that parents can throw
money at SAT test preparation and get test score improvements in the 100 point
range and more. I know because I have done this.
When I took the SAT in 1970 no one got assistance via test preparation. Now it
is, or so it seems mandatory to top the charts with test scores.
Colleges look to raise their selectiveness rating by admitting higher and
higher SAT (and ACT) test scores. The net affect is that for those that don't
know or can't afford test preparation classes, they have lower scores than
they might otherwise and the assumption is they have less choice in college
admission.
I work at a University that plays the selective SAT game but also is starting
to talk about if there are other ways of serving those that can succeed in
college but might not get the scores that we strive for in our admits.
I think after 9 years of working in higher education and being a parent of a
college grad and high school senior I think it is fair to say that both K12
public schools and institutions of higher education need some radical
reinvention. I just hope I live long enough to see it come to happen.
~~~
rch
Based on your experience working in higher education, would you say that the
SAT in its current form is as effective a test as the version you took in the
1970's?
My perception is that scores have become more correlated with money spent on
test preparation, and less correlated with actual aptitude.
~~~
epalmer
So I don't work directly with the admissions process (I run the public web)
but as a parent I see the correlation with money spent. Also I've had
conversations with the SAT preparation consultant that we used for both girls
and the degree to which preparation classes or one-on-one consultation helps
is dramatic at least at her firm. I know this to be true because of the
feedback from other parents that we recommended.
The funny thing is that one of the highest correlations with college
retention, as compared to just getting admitted, is how the student feels when
the visit the campus. If they feel like they will fit it they have a much
higher retention rate.
Because of this colleges track visits to their campus for campus tours and
some factor that in at least when courting the prospects.
------
mtreis86
I have never understood why we keep most kids grouped by age throughout their
education.
In my opinion, standardized testing is most useful in a situation where a very
limited number of tests are given as 'mile markers' in an educational path. A
re-calibration of the scale.
No two students learn at the same pace, why force it?
------
mschuster91
The fallacy with using tests of the kids as a marker for the quality of the
teachers is that you just can't do that and get reliable results.
A bunch of black kids from the ghettos, who have their parents in jail/dead,
worrying about siblings etc. and no cash to spend on basic school equipment,
much less a decent meal every day, will have vastly lower scores than a bunch
of white kids with helicopter parents.
If schools were adequately financed e.g. to provide free, healthy meals,
proper study rooms and free school supplies, that could at least reduce the
gap.
Unfortunately, kids can't vote and a large number of poor black kids end up in
jail or dead anyway so they can't vote even when they're old. And so, schools
remain the first place to go when politicians need to cut expenses.
~~~
336f5
> The fallacy with using tests of the kids as a marker for the quality of the
> teachers is that you just can't do that and get reliable results.
Which is not what is being proposed by people arguing for teacher evaluations
drawing on standardized testing ([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Value-
added_modeling](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Value-added_modeling)), as the
very name 'value-added' implies.
~~~
acdha
VAM is a good idea but it's really hard to get right and the trend has been
make it very high stakes for teachers. You didn't really address the examples
which mschuster91 provided and that's important to understanding the problem:
1\. Limited parental support (note: this does not imply bad parents – working
3 jobs to pay the bills leaves little time to help with homework)
2\. Unstable living environment
3\. Strong financial restrictions
4\. Need to care for siblings[1]
5\. Food insecurity
How do you construct a VAM model which recognizes that a teacher who got a
class full of students suffering from one or more of those problems and
managed to improve them by one grade level had a LOT more work, and more
complicated work, than the teacher in a wealthy suburb who got a bunch of
students with affluent, involved parents who are both pushing their kids hard
to excel and providing tons of extra support outside of school?
This isn't just a philosophical debate, either, since school districts are
tying large parts of compensation to test scores. Starting with a hard job
which doesn't pay particularly well, how many years are you going to spend not
getting bonuses for your hard work or even being arbitrarily punished before
you give up and find an easier job?
One estimate has ~12% of NYC public school teachers being punished by the
flawed VAM in use there:
[http://mathbabe.org/2015/04/03/how-many-nyc-are-
arbitrarily-...](http://mathbabe.org/2015/04/03/how-many-nyc-are-arbitrarily-
punished-by-the-vam-about-578-per-year/)
That's a high number to begin with and downright shameful when you consider
that those schools are already facing a hard time getting qualified teachers.
If hiring is hard, you really need to make an effort to retain the people you
do manage to find.
1\. My wife has had students who felt pressure to skip after-school extra-
curricular activities or even go to an inferior college so they could care for
younger siblings while their parents worked. That's not wrong in the sense of
everyone involved having a sympathetic motive but it's a huge burden which
more affluent kids never even have to think about, which is why simple-
sounding ideas like making college admission or scholarships merit-based ends
up reinforcing the existing socioeconomic status quo rather than changing it.
~~~
336f5
> You didn't really address the examples which mschuster91 provided and that's
> important to understanding the problem:
On the contrary, I addressed it entirely. mschuster91 seems to be under the
impression that the teacher evaluation schemes boil down to nothing but the
simplest possible before-after comparison of grades of students, ignoring all
issues of demographics, differing student quality, differing school
circumstances, etc. Such a scheme is indeed absurd, as his counterexample
proves, but it is not what has been proposed by pretty much everyone! The
_actual_ proposals are well aware of what he thinks is the fatal problem, and
go to often elaborate lengths to model and adjust for these sorts of
heterogeneities in order to quantify the value- _added_ of a particular
teacher. The problem is recognized, included, and mostly dealt with. Whether
the solution works entirely or is worthwhile is unclear, but he's arguing
against a strawman.
> One estimate has ~12% of NYC public school teachers being punished by the
> flawed VAM in use there:
So I've looked at [http://mathbabe.org/2015/04/02/the-arbitrary-punishment-
of-n...](http://mathbabe.org/2015/04/02/the-arbitrary-punishment-of-new-york-
teacher-evaluations/) and I have zero idea what she is trying to show. She
assumes independence and treats it as a coin flip. Ummm.... what? With that
sort of logic, you could show no one could expect to score a 1600 on the SAT.
When criticized she links to a real analysis†, which shows considerable _non_
-independence which means her numbers are wrong and will overstate how many
will be denied tenure based on the VAMs. By the way, why are you phrasing it
as 'punished'? That sounds like you're assuming your conclusion. If VAM
doesn't affect hiring decisions, there's no point to bothering with it in the
first place is there, but if it does affect hiring decisions, that means
teachers are being 'punished'...?
† not that I think too much of it either, since it relies mostly on an
argument from incredulity and pointing angrily at some scatterplots, and tries
to ignore the r=.35 correlation of ratings from two subjects; to put an r=.35
in perspective, the correlation between years of education and intelligence is
only ~r=.55! Even the best IQ tests won't correlate with Gf more than r=.7 or
so. r=.35 is pretty good for a single pair. I don't know why he thinks a .24
is 'minuscule' when that means you're predicting half of variance... (I wonder
if this is a graphing problem? He doesn't seem to jitter the datapoints, which
for a large amount of discrete data will hide a lot of the density; a plot of
r=.35 of n=6k should look much more striking, like this:
[http://imgur.com/KcwmJJH](http://imgur.com/KcwmJJH) ) For implications, look
at the first graph and think about classification rates. Look at the
datapoints at 100 along one axis, then look across to see how many correspond
to <10 on the other; hardly any do, and the 100s are almost all mapped onto
80+ on the other axis. Or look at the 0s. In terms of identifying the bottom
decile, it's doing a good job.
------
littletimmy
The rich send their kids to private schools.
Therefore, this problem does not apply to the rich.
Therefore, this problem will not be solved.
~~~
forrestthewoods
This made me pause and think for a moment. What do rich kid schools do? I have
no idea. I went to a dumb kid rural high school. But for some reason through
the endless education discussion I've never heard brought up what rich kid
schools do differently. Even if the answer is "but we can't do that because
we're poor".
Man. Now you've got me all curious...
~~~
japhyr
One thing "rich kid schools" do is filter out many students who are difficult
to teach. Teaching and running a school is a lot easier if your goal does not
involve teaching everyone who walks through your doors.
~~~
logicchains
If that's the case, it seems like it would be a pretty easy problem to fix:
allow schools to suspend/expel students who are repeatedly disruptive or
violent in class. From a utilitarian perspective this would probably be a net
win, in that whatever the disruptive students lost from being expelled would
be more than made up for by what the students who actually wanted to learn
gained from not having the disruptive students interrupting the learning
process.
~~~
douche
It's not just the disruptive students - you've got the special-ed students,
and all the students that are what my mother (an elementary special-ed
teacher) refers to as "dull-normals" \- those who don't really have learning
disabilities that would get them labeled, but are just not very smart (80-100
IQ). Then there are the ESL students, and all the other categories I can't
think of at 3AM...
Public schools have to service all of these students, until they graduate,
drop out, or age out.
~~~
logicchains
Why don't private schools have to deal with these "dull-normals" too? Having
rich parents doesn't disqualify one from having below-average IQ.
~~~
timpattinson
Private schools can choose who they want to admit
~~~
logicchains
Well there must be private schools somewhere that admit children of below-
average intelligence, due to the profit to be had from rich parents with said
children, so perhaps it would be instructive to look at how those schools
handle it.
~~~
jwdunne
In the UK, I've seen richer parents simply send their children who didn't not
meet private school's admissions and performance requirements to state school
(the one I attended!) whilst their siblings passed the requirements and
remained at the private school.
I remember two kids from primary school seemed to have disappeared and then
reappeared a few months down the line from school year start. They didn't make
the cut like their siblings. I think one of those kids, thinking back, was the
son of the managing director of the company that is now TalkTalk pre-
acquisition.
~~~
logicchains
That's somewhat disheartening: it suggests that it isn't a problem that can be
solved by throwing more money at it.
~~~
jwdunne
It's not. Private schools I've heard of and experienced have strong academic
selection criteria on top of being incredibly expensive.
My son had funding for a time for nursery and was moved into the prep school.
It was like seeing a foreign school. Class sizes were naturally smaller and I
noted things such as their morning 'prayer', which went along the lines of "I
vow to work hard today in everything I do", where as my morning prayer in an
RC school was the Our Father.
I also saw kids in my sons class who, at 3 years old, were able to compute
divisions in their head and articulate in a way that I've never seen a child
that age speak.
These places are optimised for kids who have a lot of money backing them up
and the brain power to boot. In some respects, their parents ability to simply
hire help to ensure their kids do well academically must be noted too.
------
xname2
One test per major course per school year, how the hell could this be
"overwhelming"?
------
wnevets
That was the point of the of no child left behind. If a select few aren't
getting rich off of a public service then it must be broken and privatized.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Understanding Event Driven Architecture - kiyanwang
https://hackernoon.com/understanding-event-driven-architecture-ub1k3umo
======
chadcmulligan
Images don't appear in safari on the Mac - the webp ones are displayed as
broken images, works fine on chrome (naturally enough)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Drug Decriminalization in Portugal: Lessons for Successful Drug Policies - agbell
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=10080
======
stretchwithme
its completely impractical to try to control what people do with their own
bodies. impractical and immoral.
cato is great on drugs (so to speak). I first used their research in college
to give a speech on this same issue.
~~~
ilkhd2
Tell it to pharma-corps and medical establishment that refuses to sell
medicines without prescription. Trust me Cato, being right wing institution
would come up with reasons why it is not good.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Amazon Should Acquire Netflix - Here's Why - dell9000
http://ryanspoon.com/blog/2009/01/02/why-amazon-should-acquire-netflix/
======
catone
The argument I've always heard against Amazon acquiring Netflix is that
Netflix has distribution centers in something like 45 states, whereas Amazon
only has them in a handful. So that'd be 45 states in which Amazon would then
have to charge sales tax.
If Netflix were a solely streaming operation, it'd make sense for Amazon, or
if tax on ecommerce was already charged in most states regardless of physical
presence it would make sense. Not sure it does otherwise, though.
~~~
antiismist
Amazon seems to charge sales tax based on where the goods are shipped to, not
where they are shipped from:
"Items sold by Amazon.com LLC, or its subsidiaries, and shipped to
destinations in the states of Kansas, Kentucky, New York, North Dakota, or
Washington are subject to tax."
[http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=4...](http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=468512)
~~~
catone
I think those are the states in which they have a physical presence. I know
their headquarters are in Washington, for example, and that they have a big
distribution center in Kentucky. New York, though, may just have laws taxing
ecommerce (I'm not certain).
~~~
antiismist
Nope, Amazon has distribution centers in 8 states, but they don't all get
sales taxed:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon.com#Fulfillment_and_ware...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon.com#Fulfillment_and_warehousing)
~~~
catone
I guess it would depend on the sales tax laws in each state.
Some states require sales tax on ecommerce if there is a physical presence,
some do not. Some require tax regardless.
The argument I have always heard in relation to Netflix is that if Amazon were
to acquire Netflix it would mean charging sale tax to a much greater number of
customers.
Netflix has many more established physical presences across the US:
[http://www.listology.com/netflix_tracker_reports.cfm?report=...](http://www.listology.com/netflix_tracker_reports.cfm?report=centers)
------
jonknee
Netflix and Amazon know the days of physical discs are numbered. I don't think
Amazon needs to acquire a business to dominate a dying vertical. They already
have digital distribution and a huge brand, just bank on that.
~~~
inklesspen
The days of physical discs will last for quite a while. First Amazon would
have to provide a TV-centric solution that matches Bluray's power, and then
they will have to provide a drm-free solution so buyers aren't tied to Windows
Media.
~~~
jonknee
Why would it have to be DRM free? DVD and Blu-Ray are riddled with DRM and
they are still popular. This is to do "rental", not purchasing. Only makes
sense to have some DRM on there or else the purchase business will end.
~~~
inklesspen
Depends on the form of DRM, really. DVD's DRM doesn't bother most people,
because it doesn't really pose an obstacle to what they want to do with it.
But Windows Media DRM won't work nicely with set-top boxes, with Macs, perhaps
even with Microsoft's own products (remember Zune not working with
PlaysForSure?). And there have been well-known cases of Windows Media DRM
servers going dark. The DRM the movie cartels insist on for digital downloads
is just too intrusive.
~~~
jonknee
Amazon does video on demand to Macs, PCs, XBOX, Tivo, etc. Who cares if DRM
servers go dark, this is a streaming service. You watch it and then Microsoft
could be fire bombed and it doesn't affect you.
I agree DRM is shitty for purchased movies, but this is basically a pay-per-
view service. For most movies that's all people want. Why wait for the mail
man or go to a store/kiosk when you can watch instantly from your couch?
------
hs
i guess the reason amazon doesn't have many distribution centers is because
they are expensive
she outsourced the problem by having amazon marketplace
now every kindle is distribution center (cheap)
looking at this trend, she might be better off creating a kindle for movies
her strength is not in rental (why safari bookshelf is unchallenged ?)
if she _really_ want to be in movie rental, maybe safari dvd-rack model
(download high-res per dvd chapter or streaming lower res for full, 3
titles/rack/mo) is a long shot
the success of youtube indicates that not everyone cares about dvd-quality
clips, they simply want to watch it now
~~~
asnyder
Could it be that the larger iPod Touch will be the new kindle for movies? If
and when our bandwidth catches up to our foreign counterparts, renting movies
via the embedded iTunes app will seem natural enough.
However, unlike books, movies are best experienced in an environment dedicated
to it. So even if the iPod Touch is the next kindle for movies, something like
Apple TV, or the numerous netflix set top boxes will most likely be the next
step in movie rentals and purchasing.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
TripIt insecurely broadcasts sensitive travel details in calendar feeds - jyujin
http://httpshaming.tumblr.com/post/94950343491/tripit-insecurely-broadcasts-sensitive-travel-details
======
donkeyd
The case of using the info at a hotel to get your room key is pretty
reasonable. On the home break-in story however there's a lot of evidence that
this hardly ever happens if it happens at all. There are plenty analog ways in
which criminals scout for homes where the occupants are on vacation. These
ways are often much more efficient than their digital counterparts.
I'm not saying this article should be disregarded, however if you're on
holiday and you used TripIt's feed on public WiFi, the chance that you're
house was broken into because of this is negligible.
~~~
onion2k
_On the home break-in story however there 's a lot of evidence that this
hardly ever happens if it happens at all._
What evidence would/could there be? Someone sophisticated enough to be wifi
sniffing HTTP calls on open networks for details of when people are travelling
is unlikely to then just do a straightforward smash and grab burglary. Even
just the fact they're bothering with information gathering in the first place
points to a criminal who's bit cleverer than your typical housebreaker.
I'm not saying you're wrong, just questioning whether there'd be enough data
points to suggest one way or the other. It could be a 'common' method of
scouting places to burgle among criminals who manage to not get caught.
~~~
riquito
An evil organization may build a CAAS (crime as a service, TM since now :-p)
and the little burglars may buy a 1.99$ app to know if there is a free house
nearby.
Mmm, this may work...
~~~
onion2k
Crime As A Service is essentially what Moriarty does in the Sherlock Holmes
novels. Make you wonder if it's ever been done for real...
~~~
brohee
The once stealing CC informations are not the one using it usually, the whole
"carding" scene is based on CaaS.
------
drglitch
As OP and many others have said, airline confirmation numbers are a pretty big
personal security risk - an international itinerary always carries passport #,
address, emergency info, et.
A very bad practice I've seen over and over are people doing boarding-pass-
selfies in airports, inadvertently exposing their confirmation numbers to
entirety of their twitter/instagram/facebook feed.
At best, you can move your buddy's girlfriend to be next to you on a flight
instead, at worst, you can cancel their flight or move them to an
earlier/later one. At very worst, you can use the plethora of PI data for ID
theft.
------
mjs
The "http" calendar URLs (now?) actually redirect to "https" URLs, but this
doesn't help retrospectively, since the only thing that needs to be kept
secret is the URL, and that's redirected in plain text…
TripIt's web UI actually present the "private" calendar URL with a "webcal"
scheme--is that typically secure? (You can replace "webcal" with "https" and
things work just fine, though.)
~~~
toddn
FWIW, both Google Calendar and the subscribed calendar on iOS attempt to
access webcal:// URIs over SSL on port 443. I'm not sure at what point they
would fall back to http; if they do, I haven't seen it.
------
toyg
The good side of it is that this hole doesn't seem to be actively exploited on
a significant scale. Feed urls cannot be harvested without sniffing traffic
for each and every user, and profit is very indirect.
The bad side of it is that TripIt/Concur don't seem very responsive on the
issue. It often feels like TripIt is on life support, really, which is a shame
-- I use it extensively because of its wonderful "just forward to
[email protected]" feature.
~~~
bergie
I'm still a TripIt user, but it seems Google Now is replacing that feature
more and more (if you allow it to scan your email).
The flight cards I got to my smartwatch when flying back from Finland last
week were pretty handy with the gate info and everything...
~~~
christop
Unfortunately, you need to have a Gmail account to get all the various
automated hotel/car/flight reservation and parcel tracking notification stuff.
It would be nice if there was an API into Google Now (or even a Tripit-style
email to selectively forward to) to insert such events, for those who can't
use or choose not to use Gmail.
------
ismaelc
Hi guys, Chris here, Developer Evangelist at Concur. I just got word from the
TripIt team that they are aware of the issue and working to get it fixed. Feel
free to email me at [email protected] if you have questions. Thanks!
------
plg
What's the big impediment to just making all websites https, all the time?
Technical? Financial? Honest question.
~~~
monort
For small sites it's mostly certificate and dedicated IP price. Wildcard
certificates price is especially egregious.
For big sites - probably their load balancers can't handle the https load.
~~~
sbarre
A wildcard SSL certificate is $250 per _year_. You can't tell me that this is
a prohibitive cost for someone operating a serious business.
~~~
onion2k
For an established business that you know is going to make thousands of
dollars in the next year it's trivial, but for a new business with an unknown
future it's a pretty big addition. If setting up a new venture had a _minimum_
cost of $250 (rather than being close to $0 as it is now) we'd see fewer side
projects and part-time entrepreneurs.
------
rdl
The concept behind httpshaming is great, although it would be nice if there
were a softer/more positive initial request to the sites to add https.
However, it's not like https is new; even post-Snowden is over a year now.
I love TripIt, but they really need to fix this for me to keep using it.
------
colinbartlett
I wonder if we can ever look forward to a day when unencrypted http just
doesn't exist. When the only option is https?
~~~
userbinator
I'm in favour of encryption for protecting sensitive data (TripIt is violating
this principle), but don't think it should be needed for publicly accessible
information. The centralised CA model is probably one of my biggest gripes
about using HTTPS.
~~~
fabulist
CAs are unfortunate, but the reality is that all data is sensitive to some
degree. TripIt's data is more sensitive than, say, which Wikipedia article I'm
reading, but that still gives away a huge amount of information about what my
current thought process is and where its going.
The only way to avoid the dragnet surveillance we're currently experiencing is
to take away the opportunity.
~~~
MichaelGG
And an attack can also modify data. Even "public" data, like Wikipedia info,
could be valuable to modify. You can attack a user that way by providing
misleading information. Or carry out XSS-like attacks. Or just insert spammy
links or redirections all over the page.
------
martingordon
Hmm, I guess it's a good thing I proxy through Google Calendar then, huh?
The Google/TripIt connection may be unencrypted, but I'm assuming (and hoping)
that Google Calendar feeds are sent over HTTPS.
------
JoeAltmaier
Strawman? Has anybody ever been robbed due to a high-tech criminal
intercepting their calendar data? Keep in mind that most breakins are by local
teenagers looking for a thrill. And they are much more likely to know you're
going on vacation because they're your neighbors.
~~~
joshdance
He's not talking about getting robbed, he is talking about someone changing or
canceling your airline reservation.
~~~
JoeAltmaier
Wha? The article changed after my comment? Strange.
~~~
NDizzle
That's HN for you. Seeing what they want us to see.
~~~
JoeAltmaier
HN has nothing to do with the original article?
------
cV6WB
Wow – this is terrible.
FWIW you can choose to disable "Include detailed items in your calendar feed"
from Settings > Publishing Your Data.
------
michaelrshannon
Wow - I've been a huge advocate for TripIt in the past - definitely need to
pause using it though until they get this sorted :/
~~~
mseebach
Just don't use the "export" feature, or use it securely, eg. by exporting to
Google Calendar.
------
nodata
The other pages on this site are pretty good: Little Snitch, Scribd, PGP..
~~~
fabulist
Its important to note that they're pointing the finger at the MIT PGP
keyserver, which has long been notorious for being poor in the security
department. This is not even the worst of their crimes; for a long time
(perhaps still?) they were ignoring key revocations. Meaning, if your key was
stolen and you sent out a message declaring it void, people using pgp.mit.edu
would never get the message. >.<
tl;dr don't use pgp.mit.edu .
~~~
tonywebster
Author here. If you let me know some sources for the above, I'd love to add
them. Contact info in profile. Thanks!
~~~
fabulist
I believe I originally heard that here:
[https://we.riseup.net/riseuplabs+paow/openpgp-best-
practices](https://we.riseup.net/riseuplabs+paow/openpgp-best-practices)
------
jqueryin
This is a nicely detailed post of uncovering the flaw (Thanks Wireshark!) and
explaining the implications.
My biggest concern with this post and the entirety of the blog is that I'm not
sure as to whether you're performing full disclosures before the shaming. It'd
be irresponsible not to give the team time to respond and remedy. It'd be a
quick addition to the footer to blanket that you do full disclosures and give
an adequate amount of time before posting.
_Edit: not sure if this post in particular had the disclosure statement added
after my comment, but most of the other blog posts are devoid of disclosures._
~~~
sandy12
Did you even read the entire post?
> Only my own information was accessed in these screenshots, and I manually
> changed the name from mine to John Doe. I contacted TripIt / Concur
> Technologies about this issue via e-mail and Twitter NINE MONTHS AGO and
> never heard back. A similar TripIt calendar feed security issue was brought
> up on the TripIt-maintained Get Satisfaction website OVER SIX YEARS AGO,
> with no resolution.
~~~
jqueryin
If you browse through other posts on the blog, you'll notice a recurring
pattern of no mention of disclosure.
~~~
mikeash
So, what, it's OK to be wrong about this one because it applies to other
cases?
~~~
jqueryin
I was wrong but that's not the core point of the comment. What I'm driving
home is nondisclosure is irresponsible and I would hope that's not the route
taken.
~~~
tonywebster
HTTP Shamer here. I absolutely practice 'responsible disclosure' when it is
appropriate.
In the case of TripIt, they've known about this issue for a VERY LONG TIME and
chose not to address it. I'm incredibly sad about this because I absolutely
love TripIt.
There's several sites and apps I've either found out about myself or have been
submitted to the Tumblr that I do think warrant responsible disclosure, and
I've either done that or am working on that. Sadly, only one of those vendors
even has a security e-mail address with a responsible disclosure policy.
In the case of Scribd, if you're using HTTP for all of your account activity,
it's not going to be encrypted, period. I'm not going to responsibly disclose
that passwords are sent cleartext over HTTP because that's obviously what
happens with HTTP. If the vendor made any attempt to use SSL that appears
broken, I would stop and responsibly disclose.
In the case of apps going out and checking for updates insecurely, I think
that behavior is prevalent enough to see, and obscure enough to exploit, that
responsible disclosure doesn't really apply. It's just that HTTPS is something
I'd like to see on developer roadmaps. There's been good discussions about
this on Twitter, including the VLC team closing a ticket about it.
If I saw personally-identifiable information being sent from an app, I would
stop and responsibly disclose.
~~~
mikeash
Personally, I don't see how responsible disclosure can really apply to cases
like this.
This is not some obscure vulnerability. It's a deliberate design decision with
obvious tradeoffs. It's analogous to a bank keeping deposits sitting on tables
in front of the building. It's obvious to anyone who looks, and it should have
been obvious to the person who came up with the scheme.
The point of responsible disclosure is to give companies a chance to fix a
vulnerability before it becomes widely known. That doesn't work when the
problem is obvious to anyone who glances at it, because you've lost your
chance at "before".
For something like "you can hijack session cookies sent over an unencrypted
connection", I can see how that would warrant responsible disclosure. But for
"this entire feed is dedicated to sensitive information, and it's sent in
clear text by the very nature of the protocol you've chosen to deliver it", it
doesn't seem like it works.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
BitMessage - Bitcoin Inspired Peer to Peer Encrypted Messaging - ericb
https://bitmessage.org/wiki/FAQ
======
Sami_Lehtinen
I have found several issues with current implementation. Address spoofing and
Inventory injection attacks, crashing listener thread with stateless
connection flood etc. There are several ways to seriously disturb
functionality of this network. When I have time, I'm going to look for
ultimate attack, which would be network propagated persistent attack. It would
crash all clients after injecting just a single message to any node of the
network. Message would also be persisted in datastore so it would recrash the
client on restart. Requiring manual fix or software update to get past this
issue. By design system doesn't seem to scale well. I would like to see 10
million nodes on this network. Dont run current client without virtual
machine, unless you're ready to encounter interesting problems with resource
consumption. (cpu, memory, network, disk)
~~~
jamoes
So, even though it's inspired by bitcoin, it doesn't quite have the same rock-
solid original implementation. Bitcoin would have collapsed if there were any
major cryptographic bugs, but it turns out that "Entire classes of bugs [were]
missing." (-Dan Kaminsky, Security Researcher).
I hope that you can help out by reporting your findings back to them. I think
Bitmessage is a really cool idea. It has the potential to allow communication
to occur no matter what hostile power wants to censor it. It also finally make
end-to-end message encryption a default rather than an after-thought.
~~~
nwh
Don't assume that Bitcoin hasn't had it's share of implementation problems.
There's been a couple of remote DOS bugs, remote command execution
vulnerabilities, and an integer overflow that lead to the creation of 32
million additional bitcoins.
[https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Common_Vulnerabilities_and_Exposu...](https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Common_Vulnerabilities_and_Exposures)
~~~
jamoes
Good point. Fortunately, there haven't ever been any vulnerabilities so severe
that the entire network was shut down until a software update could be
released (as the grandparent said he was looking for with bitmessage).
~~~
ctz
There was certainly a bug recently where the whole blockchain split and one
half of the split ended up losing all the bitcoins they had mined on that
limb. As far as cryptocurrencies go, I'd say that was a serious vulnerability.
~~~
nwh
Oddly enough, the Bitcoin foundation paid all the miners on the chain fork for
the lost blocks.
~~~
narcissus
I hadn't heard that before. Is there a link or something that we can read
about this?
~~~
nwh
[https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=156641.msg1660732#ms...](https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=156641.msg1660732#msg1660732)
~~~
narcissus
Thanks for that link... it seems as though there were a lot of people that
were thankful and a lot that were against it. Assuming the "guess" of the
change address getting 200BTC, that was 800BTC that they paid out. Not knowing
enough about it all, why was one of the commenters there saying that it was
from the EFF do you know?
~~~
celticninja
It was paid out of bitcoin faucet funds, the bulk of which were donated by the
EFF when they stopped accepting bitcoin. A position on which they have
recently changed their stance.
------
chrisballinger
I am very interested in developing an iOS client for this. We are developing a
pluggable framework for Tor integration on iOS called OnionKit [1] based off
of Onion Browser for the ChatSecure project [2], the only open source OTR
compatible chat client for that platform. It's in pretty rough shape right now
because we got stuck trying to figure out how to make Apple's Networking APIs
honor the proxy settings on TCP connections, so please contact us if you can
help solve this problem.
Since it doesn't involve the transfer of money or copyrighted material, it
shouldn't yet be rejected by Apple's reviewers as the BitTorrent and BitCoin
protocol have been. Skype is still allowed, and that technically is (or used
to be?) a peer to peer communications system.
Unfortunately, you aren't presently allowed by Apple to run a background
socket on iOS for longer than 10 minutes unless it is a full VoIP application,
so you would never be able to use it for push-style communication, without
compromising a user's anonymity via a web backend that stores your APNS token
(device specific messaging token for iOS devices).
[1] <https://github.com/ChatSecure/OnionKit> [2] <https://chatsecure.org>
~~~
jamoes
Jeesh, why are people still putting up with Apple's domineering control over
what they're allowed to do with their own devices?
I know none of what you said is new news, but seeing it all come together like
that really highlights the problem with Apple's policies.
IMO, a much more useful app to build would be an HTML5 Bitmessage app that
users can just run in their browser (similar to the blockchain.info/wallet app
for bitcoin). This would make the technology accessible to a much larger group
of people.
~~~
chrisballinger
I think the ultimate human cost of not providing free native, easy-to-use
cryptographically secure communications apps on iOS is worse than the
ideological battle against Apple's idiotic walled garden.
It's not just a threat against activists under oppressive regimes, it's a
matter of "national security". Centralized chat services like WeChat [1]
(developed by by Tencent in China) or WhatsApp [2] get more popular, the
governments of the world will be able to intercept all private communication
on a large scale. Although to be fair, privacy has been effectively dead
pretty much worldwide for a while now.
[1] [http://www.scmp.com/comment/blogs/article/1083025/hu-jia-
exp...](http://www.scmp.com/comment/blogs/article/1083025/hu-jia-explains-why-
mobile-apps-make-activism-spooky) [2]
[http://security.stackexchange.com/questions/27897/can-an-
emp...](http://security.stackexchange.com/questions/27897/can-an-employer-
access-whatsapp-messages-if-you-are-using-their-servers)
~~~
droopyEyelids
Beautifully put. I too, see the ideological cost of patronizing Apple's closed
system.
But there is another fee levied when the most popular set of devices in our
country allows unlimited snooping of the people's data.
------
mrmaddog
I really like how readable the overview paper is [1]—I'd recommend reading it
if you want to understand what is being proposed here. I especially thought
the section on a passive operating mode was interesting. The idea that you can
hide an ACK in another message, which is then broadcast to ACK _both_ of the
original messages is pretty clever. However, since Bradley's message to
Charlie is also broadcast to everyone, wouldn't Eve get the same amount of
information as if Bradley had just ack'd the message in the first place?
Anyhow, assuming I misunderstood something, passive listening doesn't seem to
work well with their description of stream scalability, since Alice would now
think she knows Bradley's stream, when it was actually Charlie's stream. For
this to work, I suppose Alice would have to know that Bradley would be a
secret listener to begin with.
In any case, it is definitely an interesting read. Seems like the type of
thing Julian Assange would love to have. [2]
[1] <https://bitmessage.org/bitmessage.pdf>
[2] <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5574589>
~~~
cantos
I had a brief look at the paper. I got stuck on the section about scalability.
I can't see how that could be implemented so that authentication can be done
given that the nodes are untrusted (by which I mean implemented with a much
smaller amount of computation and storage than was required in the non-
optimized approach).
~~~
Sami_Lehtinen
True, you're going to need gigabytes of memory. My test client used over 6
gigabytes o memry after small inventory injection play. I have a few great
ideas how to create efficient propagating attacks, but I haven't yet tried
those.
~~~
muyuu
Just publish the ones you've tried.
------
neilparikh
Oh hey, I had an idea to make this exact protocol a few weeks ago, just for
fun. I didn't think of adding a POW in though.
Anyway, this is a pretty cool implementation. Just one question though, how
does a node know if a certain message is for it, rather than another node? The
whitepaper didn't specify anything about attaching a recipient to the message.
~~~
dpacmittal
Node tries to decrypt all the message it receives to see if it was for them.
It's there in the whitepaper:
>Just like Bitcoin transactions and blocks, all users would receive all
messages. They would be responsible for attempting to decode each message with
each of their private keys to see whether the message is bound forthem.
~~~
neilparikh
Oh whoops, must have missed that. Thanks.
------
vessenes
This is interesting. Four minutes for proof of work is tough, though. That's a
long time to wait to send a message.
Bitcoin itself could often use sideband communication protocols for, e.g.
transaction details, but this doesn't seem to tick all the boxes: incentives
alignment needs to be worked on, and I would suggest that the spamming
prevention is somewhat naive; there should be a market.
Consider -- all bitmessage messages are considered "high quality" by default,
and therefore sent directly to one's phone.
Botnet operators determine that while one botnet client could send 100 e-mails
per minute, the open rate on one bitmessage message is nearly 100%, making it
economically feasible to botnet spam bitmessage.
I would like to see more self leveling, and a pricing market baked in to
something like this, as well as a way to send messages instantly.
~~~
chadillac83
From 4 minutes to instantly? I would say anything under a few seconds is
feasible so long as it's easy to use.
------
ww520
The proof of work concept is really interesting. It's a good way to deter
spamming. I wonder whether email can utilize the same concept to force a cost
for sending email. May be a two-tier system, emails with POW signature would
be sent faster, while plain old email has lower priority.
~~~
josephagoss
The person who created hashcash, better known now as Bitcoins proof of work
actually invented it for email use.
Apparently it did not catch on that well and a decade later Satoshi used it
among other things to create Bitcoin.
~~~
vy8vWJlco
Interestingly, Adam Back has a cache of a Satoshi Nakamoto bio, and related
stuff on his home page, advertising a conspicuous interest.
<http://www.cypherspace.org/adam/>
As long as we're speculating wildly, I have a theory... (Bear with me now) It
is possible, if not probable, that Ted Nelson is himself Satoshi and was only
trying to throw everyone off the trail (or it's Adam Back, I can't be sure,
but it's definitely one of the two, if not both...).
~~~
josephagoss
I do wonder...
I love the Satoshi speculations a lot, I think Bitcoin is awesome enough as it
is, but to add that the creator is unknown just makes the story even more
compelling.
If Bitcoin does take off or a derivative based on Bitcoin, it will be weird
having this anonymous guy as the creator. Most computer science history has no
large mystery like Bitcoin will have. (If Bitcoin is still around in a decade
or more)
Very exciting.
~~~
mortenjorck
It's funny, of all the William Gibson imaginings that have found their way
into real life, Bitcoin is probably the most purely Gibsonian, in its plotline
of the anonymous, genius creator of some earth-shaking thing whose identity is
the stuff of legendary speculation.
Makes me wonder if there's a Bigend out there with a crack team of Satoshi
researchers on a globetrotting adventure...
~~~
waterlesscloud
With millions of dollars piling into bitcoin, both via startups and via direct
purchase of coins on the markets, it does seem likely that someone somewhere
has put a "due dilligence" team on the case.
I wonder what, if anything, they've found...
------
YAYERKA
I find it troublesome that some of the code in BitMessage seems to be taken
directly from Stackoverflow.com responses (it actually reminds me a lot of
what I see happening at school). With that being said -- I do appreciate that
this is new and can be improved upon quickly by a community of people with
interest in such a system.
[0]
[https://github.com/Bitmessage/PyBitmessage/blob/master/src/a...](https://github.com/Bitmessage/PyBitmessage/blob/master/src/addresses.py#L18)
[1]
[http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1119722/base-62-conversio...](http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1119722/base-62-conversion-
in-python)
~~~
dpacmittal
I don't see anything wrong with taking a working and bug-free code/function
and using it in your own software given the snippet is in public domain. Why
re-invent the wheel?
------
so898
I used to have an idea which is similar to this project. With BT network, we
can exchange the database or part of the database between nodes. So the IP
address will not be the personal ID anymore, everyone could register an ID for
the service.
------
vy8vWJlco
I'm not sure I see myself using BitMessage (yet) but if nothing else this FAQ
has introduced me to TorChat, which looks promising for simple private text
messaging - and whatdoyaknow, the latest version is in Debian Sid (and a
slightly older one is in Wheezy).
------
hucker
I don't really see what BitMessage provides over TorChat for example, other
than being able to deliver messgages when the sender is offline. It's a much
easier protocol, and much less that can go wrong.
~~~
sprash
> other than being able to deliver messgages when the sender is offline.
This is exactly the point. Most people can not afford to run a mailserver
24/7. With Bitmessage you only have to be online very shortly every other day.
------
joshontheweb
I'm a noob. from what I've read webRTC is encrypted. Is that all I need to
have secure communications (video, audio chat). Or do I need something more
like this. Is it only text chat?
------
johnchristopher
The client UI is very nice and straightforward. But it's borderline unusable
on old laptop (on my trusty 1000he atom n270) because of the raw power needed
to compute and send messages.
------
smitec
I think it will be interesting to see if this goes down a similar path to the
old newsgroups wherein someone develops a protocol to send binary data through
bitmessage efficiently.
~~~
nwh
It has been done, there's at least one base64 channel on bitmessage. I imagine
its horrible slow to send though, the POW difficulty scales with the size of
the message.
------
kruhft
The subscriptions feature looks interesting; I'm assuming that it's a mailing
list type feature. Is there a list of subscribable addresses somewhere?
~~~
kruhft
I did a bit of playing with the client. Once you generate an address under the
'Your Identities' tab, right click and select 'Special Address behaviour' and
have it 'Behave as a pseudo-mailing-list address'.
Here's a test one if you feel like trying it out:
BM-2DCGcvGwvGUr7yYSzWWa6rBrVok8mM7HtK
I don't think the name matters but I called it 'kruhft-list'.
------
socrates1024
There's no incentive for participation. In this sense it does not resemble
Bitcoin very much at all.
~~~
FellowTraveler
There's always this: <https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=212490.0>
------
ancarda
Has anybody had success getting this to run on OS X?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
How to create your own SMTP server in 20 minutes - sameercharles
https://sameercharles.com/how-to-create-your-own-smtp-sever/
======
panpanna
Thought I would see some really cool and simple smtp implementation. All I
found was
npm install $stuff
$stuff run
~~~
sameercharles
Yeah, but thats a point of this blog. Finding things anyone can build.
But thanks for the comment, I will try to keep that in mind.
Cheers!
~~~
panpanna
I don't have any problems with that.
But I don't think "create" is the right word to use here. Maybe set up?
Configure?
~~~
sameercharles
Agree.
------
emptybottle
> Start Haraka (as root)
Yikes. If I did need to use Haraka for some reason (why is it better btw?),
I'd run it on a high port using an MTA with a long security stability track
record (like postfix) as a frontend queueing MX.
------
sameercharles
I wish this place was a little bit more constructive. As engineers we should
try to solve a problem or invent something useful. It's a good feeling to find
good in things, anything.
~~~
thisBrian
Just a friendly tip: consider posting it to dev.to[0] (no affiliation); the
content seems more geared towards helping people starting out on their dev
journey.
Without generalising, HN tends to be more frank in dissecting the novel
aspects of a post.
0: [https://dev.to/](https://dev.to/)
------
arpa
What are the advantages of haraka over mature MTA solutions? They also work
out of the box when installed and yum install / apk add / apt install takes
even less time...
~~~
sameercharles
Not a comparison really.
------
mruts
This is a pretty worthless article. I can set up OpenSMTP in 10 minutes, and I
bet it is more performant, stable, and well designed despite suffering from
the lack of “coolness” that Node.js undoubtably excels at /s
Maybe there is some compelling reason to use Haraka, but I wouldn’t know,
because the author doesn’t seem willing to bother actually writing a post that
contains any non-trivial information.
Moreover, the title is misleading. I was hoping it would be about implementing
a simple SMTP server (though 20 minutes is a little tight for that I suppose),
which actually would have been interesting, unlike this article.
The last section is really precious: “What would you create with Haraka?”
Oh I dunno, a mail server? I wasn’t aware that email was such a novel and
innovative technology that I needed a prompt in order to even consider the
infinite possibilities.
Looking at this guys other post, it almost seems like some blog spam MTurk
job.. His articles are very short and very bad. One is a summary about
graphene, with all the facts lifted off wikipedia, another is about how to use
a geolocating service (lemme guess, you make a GET request to their api?), and
one is basically about how to create a Digital Ocean droplet..
~~~
dang
Could you please not be a jerk on HN? It's against both the letter and the
spirit of the rules
([https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)).
Maybe you know a lot, that's great—but being an asshole more than cancels it
out.
If you know more, try sharing some of what you know, so we can all learn. If
you don't want to do that or don't have time, it's fine to not post anything.
If you think an article is bad, move on to something that you like better.
Tearing other people and their work to shreds just poisons the commons.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Project Logos - natmaster
http://www.dellsocialinnovationcompetition.com/apex/ideaView?id=087800000005GwJAAU
I want to fix news. Please give me feedback.
(Note: a lot of details have been omitted in the public entry to protect the execution of my idea - if you need more information, feel free to ask and I might reveal more)
======
timmorgan
Am I the only one who thought this was a link to something about logo designs
for open source projects?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
"The only man who has ever visited Dune" has passed away - davi
http://www.bpib.com/illustra3/Schoenherr/Draft.html
======
davi
A little more: [http://ianschoenherr.blogspot.com/2010/04/john-
schoenherr-19...](http://ianschoenherr.blogspot.com/2010/04/john-
schoenherr-1935-2010.html),
[http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/04/08/in-
memory-...](http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2010/04/08/in-memory-of-
the-great-bear-of-locktown/)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: Israel has been rocket-free for ... - BrandonMarc
http://israelhasbeenrocketfreefor.com/
======
embro
Nice try...
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Air Force Shoots Down [Unresponsive] Drone Over Afghanistan - chaostheory
http://www.popsci.com/military-aviation-amp-space/article/2009-09/when-drones-go-wild-air-force-shoots-them-down?page=
======
TrevorJ
"If communications cannot be restored and the failsafe measures fail (as they
appear to have here), current drones lack remote-kill or self-destruct
mechanisms"
Yikes. Jamming seems to be a pretty big vulnerability for unmanned vehicles in
general. I wonder how they account this.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Hardware RNG via cheap USB SDR - ac29
https://pthree.org/2015/06/16/hardware-rng-through-an-rtl-sdr-dongle/
======
ac29
This appears to be useable as an additional source of entropy in linux via
rtl-entropy[0] and rng-tools[1].
[0] [https://github.com/pwarren/rtl-entropy](https://github.com/pwarren/rtl-
entropy)
[1] [https://www.gnu.org/software/hurd/user/tlecarrour/rng-
tools....](https://www.gnu.org/software/hurd/user/tlecarrour/rng-tools.html)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Order of Operations - ph0rque
http://adam.blog.heroku.com/past/2009/3/18/order_of_operations/
======
jerf
I disagree strongly with making "security" step 4. By the time you finally get
around to making the app functional you may have fallen into several
fundamental traps that require massive work to get out of the hole.
The vast, vast bulk of security holes are due to simple things that are easier
to get right even in the prototype stage than to retrofit later. Concatenating
strings into an SQL statement is _harder_ than using a proper library for
escaping. Properly escaping HTML isn't that hard if you know what you are
doing _and_ plan for it in advance, but is hell to go back and fix later.
Buffer overflows are easy to avoid today by using secure libraries or
languages in the first place but can be very difficult to fix in an audit
phase. Even things like implementing a basic role/capability system are a lot,
lot easier to implement from the beginning than to try to retrofit, and they
are not hard. If you have some experience and know what you are doing
frequently the right way has been made easier than the wrong way anyhow.
If you are still at an experience level where you still have to think about
how to properly encode an SQL query value... well, charge forward I suppose,
but I promise you, you will pay. There's no way around that.
Concerns with a similar pattern: Handling string encoding. You will come out
ahead if you start out aware of how encoding works and how to handle it,
rather than trying to retrofit it later. Internationalization: If you know
what you are doing, it is not significantly harder to do at least basic
internationalization first (a string table instead of typing a raw string,
with a bit of work you can make it an emacs macro so it costs one whole extra
keystroke per string), and retrofitting it is extremely hard. If you encounter
one particularly hard string, label it in a comment and bail if you're in a
hurry, but you're still ahead for having thought about it and having
everything else set up properly.
If you feel you should object to my point by saying "But those things are too
hard!", you're missing my point. For someone with decent experience, they
_shouldn't_ be. I don't have to think too hard about any of these things even
in my prototypes. (Except encoding, which is hard to think about because it's
a hard problem, even for a prototype, unless you are blessed to be working in
an environment that has a sane encoding story.)
~~~
lsb
I agree that security shouldn't be a last-minute thought, but those are
terrible examples!
If you're prototyping, think at a higher level, and prototype with native
language objects, or if you need to use a DB, use an ORM. Writing raw SQL is
only fast the first time, and then you're no better than assembly-coding your
database.
For string encoding, just take out non-alphanumeric characters, unless you're
dealing specifically with non-English, and then expand your target audience
once you can do it safely. Most blogs, for example, don't deal with i18n in
urls; they just convert any non-alphanumerics (include spaces) to hyphens,
which is safe and easy. Again, that's a simple regexp: in Ruby,
.gsub(/[^0-9a-z]/,'-') . If non-Anglophones sign up in droves, you have a
massive user base, which is motivational inertia enough.
~~~
jerf
"If you're prototyping, think at a higher level, and prototype with native
language objects, or if you need to use a DB, use an ORM. Writing raw SQL is
only fast the first time, and then you're no better than assembly-coding your
database."
Yes, good job, part of my point.
"For string encoding, just take out non-alphanumeric characters, unless you're
dealing specifically with non-English, and then expand your target audience
once you can do it safely."
No, the real solution is to learn what encoding actually entails and learn how
to do it right without a lot of fuss. That approach is actually harder than
doing it right, because it's "only one regexp" in a quick HN comment; in
practice it'll blow up in your face. That's just a panic response brought on
by not knowing what you're doing with encoding.
------
bk
Rather than thinking of these steps as a strict sequence, one should think of
them as parallel processes with shifting resource allocations.
Ultimately, the development process comes down to the experience and habits of
the developer. If you have a lot of experience, your marginal cost of "getting
it right" from the beginning is lower, because you already have the necessary
domain expertise.
For example, if you're inexperienced, you might build a login system that
simply stores plain text with a note to "hash passwords" later. You might then
move through unsalted via manually salted hashing to finally arrive at
something like bcrypt.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Google's geographer-in-chief - pastalex
http://www.fastcompany.com/3060811/most-creative-people/google-map-quest
======
adrianN
I find it weird that people contribute to Google maps. I use OSM most of the
time and contribute whenever I find a path that is missing, but I would never
contribute to a closed data silo like Google Maps (at least not without being
paid).
The very idea that someone _owns_ mapping data seems weird to me. It's the
real world, people can just go and see what's there, how can someone claim to
own location info?
~~~
buro9
I contribute to both, and use both.
It's possible to find value from both for different reasons, realise they
excel in different ways, and my contributions to each reflect my use of each.
Into Google I add/update business opening hours, locations, photos of the
inside of a shop or space, reviews of the produce or service on sale (with
more positive reviews than negative). These are the things I find of most
value when I travel to another area or country.
Into OSM I add/update paths, geographic features, detail on the ground. Things
that aid navigation, location, a more factual rather than subjective view of
the world around. These are the things I find most of value when I am
travelling or researching history and wanting more factual information at a
fine level of detail about a collection of places (an area).
I find no contradiction between contributing and using both, because my reason
for using OSM and Google services does not boil down to ownership of data.
That said, there is an area in which I actively promote OSM... cycle
navigation.
The Garmin maps are exorbitantly priced and always out of date. I promote (on
over 300 cycling forums that I run) the use of Open Cycle Map, the ability to
load these for free onto a Garmin, and the quality of them across most of the
world.
But then... you didn't mention Garmin ;)
~~~
adrianN
I use a Garmin device with OSM maps. I bought it specifically because it can
read them. Buying that thing was one of the best investments I made in recent
years.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Dear Apple, I’m leaving you - superchink
http://www.businessinsider.com/dear-apple-im-leaving-you-2012-11
======
Karunamon
Headline is pretty much my stance. This recent bit of flat-out patent trolling
(the whole slide to unlock thing, more recently their downright childish
conduct wrt. a court order) evaporated what was once a great deal of respect
for a visionary company.
Apple is now on my do not buy list. I've dumped my iOS devices because there's
no way to extend their functionality without sending cash Apple's way. I'll
continue to use the desktop OSes until such time as that becomes true there
(hoping it doesn't, but you'd have to be blind not to see the direction the
industry is taking), and then I'll migrate to some form of Linux distro, or
even Windows.
This really hurts. I really used to like Apple, I used to really like their
products, damn it, I really used to like the way the kool-aid tasted. But I
can't support them in good faith any longer.
~~~
snogglethorpe
It does hurt ... Apple's hardware is some of the sweetest out there. Even
though there's some pretty functional stuff amongst the competition, no other
manufacturer seems to be willing to go to the lengths Apple does to get that
extra little bit of pure beauty/sex-appeal.
I want an iphone5 running Android!
------
beatpanda
There's still no better consumer video editing program than iMovie and I still
can't use CS6 on Linux without a bunch of awful, messy hacks. These are the
_only_ things keeping me on OS X.
Are you a founder looking for a good idea (perhaps for your YCombinator
application?) Let me be clear — _I will pay for these things._ Free me and
everyone else from the growing tyranny of the Apple ecosystem and you'll be
stacking paper to the ceiling.
------
shortformblog
Dear WordPress folder, I can see you.
[https://www.dropbox.com/s/btxyhpeivqyvemr/Screen%20Shot%2020...](https://www.dropbox.com/s/btxyhpeivqyvemr/Screen%20Shot%202012-11-02%20at%2012.41.43%20AM.png)
(I caught the article before the site stopped working … and it just sort of
feels like a rant I've read a million times. I can understand why one might
feel that way, but it's kind of been said before.)
------
da_n
I have recently made the same decision after more than a decade using Apple,
going to move to Linux and sell my iOS devices to get Nexus ones instead. It
has not been an easy decision but I now feel I have no choice, and I will save
a ton of money. Every OS X update since Snow Leopard has been a step backwards
for me, iOS is starting to feel like Windows XP, no innovation, code quality
seems to be awful, and its very ugly in parts (just look at Game Center which
is perhaps the most revolting app on iOS). I also really dislike the feature
hold back strategy they have for older devices which are obviously capable. I
have an iPhone 4 and had to get the slap in the face which was no Sir in iOS
6. I now have an iPad 3 and now the new comes out just months after I bought
it. Fine, I don't particularly mind that, except I just know they will hold
back new snazzy features in iOS 7 saying some shit about the iPad 3 being too
old, I've been burnt before. Yeah I know these are 'first world problems' but
why should I put with it? I'm done with Apple.
------
MrLemon
Wow. This guy is such a dumb, annoying ranter. He picks out a couple truly
small things that he doesn't like for whatever reason and whines about how
it's not perfect. I can't believe anyone would want to listen to him. I'm not
a huge apple fan myself, but this even pissed me off. Like he complained that
the new MacBooks added an SD card. Seriously?? What the hell is wrong with
ADDING a feature on their laptops? And it sounds to me like he's just being
pissy about apple changing their dock connector to lighting because he had
accessories for the old one. It's been 9 years since they came out with that,
are they never allowed to upgrade? I'm an android and windows user and even I
think everything about this article is completely unreasonable.
------
dmix
I believe the growing consensus is that the playing field has been levelled
between iOS and Android. Both are fair options... and one not heavily dictated
by price (as with the osx vs windows debates).
This of course won't be the usual conclusion of the tech commenters as iOS vs
Android has turned into political camps
<http://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Politics_is_the_Mind-Killer>
That being said, the app marketplaces are still heavily in favor of iOS.
~~~
general_failure
> That being said, the app marketplaces are still heavily in favor of iOS.
No it's not. What apps are you missing?
~~~
dmix
It's not about missing apps, it's about the quality of the apps.
In addition, most startups invest more time in developing iOS apps first and
release android apps as an afterthought.
~~~
general_failure
> In addition, most startups invest more time in developing iOS apps first and
> release android apps as an afterthought.
Can you list some startup apps available only on iOS and worth it?
~~~
dmix
Prismatic is my favourite iOS/web app, I miss it since I bought a Galaxy S3.
I also wanted to try out <http://getmaid.com/>
Also a taxi service app in Toronto is iOS only.
Whats your point? Are you saying companies don't almost always release iOS
apps before Android?
------
brudgers
Article elsewhere on the internet:
[http://www.businessinsider.com/dear-apple-im-leaving-
you-201...](http://www.businessinsider.com/dear-apple-im-leaving-you-2012-11)
------
37prime
Dear BusinessInsider, I'm tired of your whining.
------
MatthewPhillips
> I’ll hang onto my iPad for the time being. I’ll certainly keep the Macbook
> Air – I’m not quite ready to return to Windows yet.
The paradox of monocultures; where you write bold, flowery proclamations that
only 2/3rds of your computer devices will be made by Apple.
------
ae7
Planned obselence is unavoidable. Android device manufacturers are notorious,
especially that awful Verizon Droid branding.
------
tuananh
site owner did it on purpose?
index.php_disable
~~~
bradleyland
It's probably an automated script on the server, and a dumb one at that. I
imagine it's something like this: a rudimentary process monitoring tool on the
server looks for scripts that are generating high load. It kills the script
and appends '_disable' to the name.
What's dumb about it is exactly what we've seen here. With indexes enabled in
Apache, we can see the vhost's underwear. Not good.
------
ummjackson
Nice dead link.
------
azio
Nah, nothing changed about Apple. You just got bored and want to play with
different thing.
------
drequivalent
Why return to Windows? You could use Linux.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: What is the best advice I can give my wife on finding freelance work? - krmmalik
My wife was a practising Solicitor in the UK until recently. She's now lost her job and using this change in circumstance as an opportunity to re-assess her life. She has previous experience in Copywriting, and is very artistic (but no DTP experience).<p>What is some good advice I could give her to help her find freelance work?<p>She's submitted plenty of bids on places like Elance and FreelanceGuru in the past few weeks, but isnt having much luck. Most of the work also seems to be targeted to SEOs
======
Akram
Elance, FreelanceGuru really suck for newcomers. It's almost impossible to get
a project if you don't have a good credit score. I would recommend trying
places like constant-content or FreelanceSwitch.
A friend wrote this post on WF, hope this would be of help.
[http://www.warriorforum.com/main-internet-marketing-
discussi...](http://www.warriorforum.com/main-internet-marketing-discussion-
forum/482668-epic-list-90-awesome-ways-help-you-make-money-online-even-if-
youre-dead-broke.html)
You can scroll to the "Like Writing" section.
~~~
krmmalik
Thank you so much - I'll ask her to look into it.
------
paulhauggis
You could try craigslist or the equivalent in your area. Also, if you do get a
project, ask for a % of the money up-front. All of the non-serious people will
go away.
~~~
krmmalik
Great advice. thank you.
------
oneiroscopist
MediaPiston <https://www.mediapiston.com/writers/signup>
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why Sapience built an all-seeing eye for employee productivity - gameface
http://www.techrepublic.com/article/why-sapience-built-an-all-seeing-eye-for-employee-productivity/
======
gameface
This has just been installed on all the developer PCs where I work. You can't
turn it off.
I guess it's another aspect of the surveillance society we're now in, but I
wonder to what use these "productivity" "metrics" will eventually be put.
~~~
flukus
I hope this is mentioned on glassdoor reviews.
I suppose next they'll be crying about how they can't find enough developers.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Employers Choose Bonuses Over Raises - JumpCrisscross
https://www.wsj.com/articles/benefit-gains-exceed-wage-growth-new-labor-data-shows-1537289455
======
newscracker
I wonder if there's a need to read the entire article, because anyone who
thinks a little bit about continuous costs and one off costs will arrive at
the same conclusion as mentioned in the first paragraph:
> a move that gives them more flexibility to dial back that compensation if
> the economy turns sour.
To add further, though salary cuts can be done by companies (this may vary
across geographies), it's usually a little more cumbersome and also sends a
different message to employees. It's a lot easier to put in vacation caps
(thus chopping off the ability to use the provided compensation completely) or
not pay a bonus. While bad for morale, at least some employees may not
consider these moves as a loss from the status quo. That's why different kinds
of variable pay schemes is very attractive for employers so that they have
several knobs to control.
As far as I'm concerned, employees should consider their base salary, benefits
and some expected bonus as their fixed compensation so that they can better
understand if the company is just skimming money and not rewarding their work
because top executives want the bonuses for themselves (even when the
situation looks like it wouldn't hurt to give some additional compensation).
This behavior is quite common in many companies, and is probably one of the
reasons why the CEO to average employee compensation has become increasingly
skewed over time and is getting worse.
On the other hand, given a choice, most employees would choose a salary
increase (continuous increase) over an unpredictable and one off bonus or any
other benefit that can be easily cut.
~~~
dunpeal
> To add further, though salary cuts can be done by companies (this may vary
> across geographies), it's usually a little more cumbersome and also sends a
> different message to employees.
It's a lot more cumbersome, and will create a lot more friction and problems.
The key reason there's even a distinction between salary and bonus is that a
salary is guaranteed as long as you work there, while the bonus is not.
~~~
rootusrootus
OTOH, when the bonus has been paid out reliably for years, then the
distinction gets pretty blurry. My company just cut bonuses this year for the
first time in memory, by almost 40%. In the last two weeks we have had a half
dozen new resignations _per day_. The company is profitable, they just set a
target for year-over-year revenue gain that has not ever been met in the
company's history, so that they'd have an excuse to pay less. And now
everyone's pissed and the best folks are walking.
I am pretty sure it was deliberate, a way of cutting way back without having
to give severance or make the news.
~~~
fma
I'm in the same boat. We have measurements and the bar gets moved every year.
Now we are at 150% profitability compared 2 years...and the bonus were nice.
Now to get our regular size bonus we need to keep it up. In other words, the
company makes more money than before, and pays less bonus.
~~~
maxxxxx
Your CEO has a nice boat on order. The money has to come from somewhere :-)
------
arnvald
Besides flexibility for the employer, there's one more reason why they prefer
bonuses over salary raise: if you leave the company in the middle of the year,
you don't get half of the bonus, you get nothing.
I understand employer's perspective here: they don't know how well the company
will perform, you can't predict everything. So bonuses are a good way to say
"if we achieve our goal, you will get part of it as a reward".
However, very often recruiters include the bonus as part of annual salary when
presenting the offer. This is unfair to the candidate - since bonus is not
guaranteed, it shouldn't be included in the annual compensation, it should
always remain separate with a clear information about conditions under which
the bonus will or won't be granted.
~~~
jknz
This may be a short-sighted policy for the employer.
Once-in-a-year bonuses give very little incentive to produce efficient work
day-to-day. Because bonuses are given far in the future, employees have little
to no rapid feedback on their work; and being far in the future some employees
simply forget about them (or believe they might change jobs before bonuses are
given so why work hard anyway).
Giving weekly or monthly bonus would give a rapid a powerful feedback to
employees; and bonuses would be much connected to actual work than the
corporate politics that happen just before the yearly bonus.
Another thing that employers risk with this policy is employees leaving en-
masse as soon as the bonus is given. Some consulting/audit companies give
bonus after the summer, just before their busy season starts; and employers
learn the hard way that giving the bonus as late as possible is not as smart
as it first sounded.
~~~
JackFr
It's not short sighted.
In finance it used to be the norm and is largely moving back that way.
Using it as a lever for employee performance is a secondary effect (that can
be done just as effectively with salary). Primarily it allows the firm to
manage comp costs to be in line with the firm's performance. During a downturn
it allows you to cut comp by like 25% without reducing headcount. The
possibility of employees leaving en masse is certainly considered but it's not
very common.
~~~
jknz
I should have added that it only applies to some companies.
Finance is a special case because if a lot of traders leave at the same time,
the ones who stay will have more capital to play with.
Consulting/contracting/auditing firms are very different: they are committed
to specific projects for specific clients and have already negotiated the
fees. So it's real trouble if employees leave all at once--you cannot simply
move their projects/clients to the employees who stay (because it creates even
more overworked employees who will leave asap after the next bonus).
Also these projects may be much shorter than a year, some audit works are done
within one-two weeks. If the firm negotiated a 2 weeks project for $XX fees
and the employees on that project manage to finish the project for far less
resources, the firm knows that they made a huge profit on that project. The
firm may give these employees an instant bonus so that the employees are
incentivised to reiterate the performance for the next project.
------
ChuckMcM
I have a mixed opinion on bonuses.
On the one hand as engineers get more senior it becomes more possible for them
to 'move the needle' in the parlance and do something really impactful for the
company. Its also possible that they might do something really great one year
and nothing notable for the next four years. So bonuses allow you to reward
for work done "above an beyond" without a long term salary expense hit that
might not be as justified in later years. So in that regard I think making
more of the pay variable as you get more senior makes a lot of sense.
But then bonuses can also be used as tools by managers to foster unhealthy
behavior. When they are a 'beauty contest' (basically people who the manager
likes get good bonuses unrelated to their contribution) then they are
demoralizing to the group and promote sycophantic behavior over outstanding
technical contribution.
When I was at Google they tried to have their cake and eat it too, on the one
hand they said your bonus was all algorithmic (personal multiplier, company
multiplier, salary) but they refused to tell you what your personal multiplier
was. So your manager could give you a really happy sounding review and a
personal multiplier of .1 or something and you had no way of knowing if what
you did was really useful or if they were just blowing smoke. It was pretty
clear that management reverted to what managers do, which is lean the rewards
toward people that supported their agenda and away from people who didn't,
regardless of "impact" (positive or negative!) to the company.
Bonus plans that work are ones where you establish clear measurable goals for
the year which can be objectively adjudicated. If you make all the goals you
get the full promised bonus, you make a fraction of them, you get the prorated
bonus. Weak managers will push back on those because they don't have the tools
to evaluate the difficulty of the goals. Something I suggested at Google could
be peer reviewed (they still didn't like it).
I don't have any magic bullets here, having experienced no less than six
differently structured bonus programs they all seemed to leave some folks
feeling they were treated unfairly.
------
olliej
Presumably a raise brings a long term cost as it’s much harder to lower
someone’s wage than to not give them a bonus.
Similarly I suspect people take a bonus of X amount more happily than a raise
that would work out to the same amount (like credit purchases talking about
monthly costs making a purchase seem cheaper, even when you end up paying
more). Of course it’s possible a lump sum all at once has more intrinsic
“value” to the recipient (eg getting a bonus right now vs more money spread
over the next year)
~~~
maxxxxx
"Similarly I suspect people take a bonus of X amount more happily than a raise
that would work out to the same amount ”
I think most people know that a bonus is a much worse deal for most people who
aren't VP and above level. A salary increase locks you in for the next year
but the bonus can be taken away.
~~~
olliej
Yeah, I’m not so sure - basically imagine you’re an low/minimum wage worker.
You (and millions who are earning more than the anemic us minimum wage) are
fundamentally trapped in a paycheck to paycheck existence. A few hundred
dollars right now could actually be worth more than an equivalent pay rise,
because you don’t have to wait an entire year to have recovered it. That money
you could use to immediately pay down debt, and you’re low income so you
credit interest will be higher than the rich.
Don’t get me wrong: I know that in general a bonus is probably cheaper than an
actual wage increase for the company, but there’s a fairly large group where
it can legitimately be worth more to someone.
(Please no one respond with “poor people waste the bonus” it’s not helpful and
also largely not true)
~~~
maxxxxx
That sounds a little like the logic behind payday lending. Get some money now
but pay a huge price later. I am sure plenty of people are in that position
but it's certainly not a good thing.
~~~
olliej
Payday lenders can charge excessive interest rates, or “fees” (worded however
necessary to make it “legal”) because they know the people getting them have
no choice.
If you need your car to get to your job, then if it needs immediate repairs
you have no choice but to get the money for a mechanic immediately.
If you’re on a low or minimum wage there is not any kind of safety buffer for
you, and banks won’t lend to you (collectively low income people are higher
risk of default so it’s easiest for banks to just say no than do it case by
case).
The problem is that once you have needed a payday loan once, you’re trapped:
if you’re living paycheck to paycheck, then once they take their cut you don’t
have enough money to pay the rent, so you need a loan ...
And so from a single loan they now have a permanent source of income, and it’s
a higher interest rate than any other (10-20% per week is “reasonable”)
In principle I don’t have a problem with the concept of a payday loan (it’s
essentially a secured credit), but something about that industry drives them
to fee gouge and ruin people’s lives.
------
no-such-address
Is this actually a surprise to anyone? Year 1: here's an extra x% of your
salary! Aren't you happy! Year 2: here's the same x%! Aren't you just as
happy.
Compare this with getting a raise.
------
throwaway9292
It can be extremely hard to predict revenue. We've made exactly this choice so
that we can dial back compensation if revenue goes down, hopefully without
sending the wrong message.
~~~
anigbrowl
I guess the wrong message here would be 'our business plan isn't very robust.'
~~~
thedufer
Smoothing volatility is expensive in some businesses. Plenty of rational
people would prefer $90 this year and $120 next year over a consistent $100
each year.
------
SomewhatLikely
A raise has added value also in that base salary seems to go further when
negotiating your next jump. Of course, this also motivates the employer to
give bonuses vs raises.
~~~
analog31
I've thought about this, and wondered if I should just show my W-2 if asked
about my current salary in a negotiation. It doesn't differentiate between
salary and bonus. I would have no problem stating outright that I don't care
how they pay me, so long as it's a hard offer and adds up to the right amount.
------
k__
When I read about such behavior, I'm happy not being employed anymore...
------
circadiam
paywall bypass: [https://outline.com/JzU3Zu](https://outline.com/JzU3Zu)
~~~
gok
That’s a different article
------
tejasmanohar
Sometimes, I wonder what percent of the people who upvote these links actually
read them. I hit my free limit on WSJ opening HN links and can't read this.
~~~
freddie_mercury
You must be new to the internet :)
But, yes, it would a better world if people read links before
upvoting/downvoting/commenting.
------
exabrial
Given how badly the Democrats oppose anything Trump signs off on, this is a
smart bet. It's sad we can't look past party lines on good things like this
~~~
maxxxxx
Can you be a little more specific?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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On St. Augustine's Confessions - tintinnabula
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2017/10/26/sarah-ruden-augustine-dialogue-god/
======
ezekg
I'm surprised and happy to see something like this posted and upvoted on HN.
The first time I read through Confessions and City of God, I thought they were
both _very_ tough reads (thou, thee, etc.), much like John Calvin's Institutes
of the Christian Religion (which I haven't actually finished yet), but very
good reads nonetheless, full of arguments/debates on many hard topics that are
applicable even today.
Like this article mentions, you get to see Augustine's view of God change
throughout Confessions, from master (rules, rules, rules--no fun) to lover
through a deeper understanding of grace, a lot like my own journey. Augustine
has been a huge instrument for me in developing a correct view of God through
his great arguments/debates and by introducing me to reformed doctrine (which
you will come in contact with if you search Augustine's writings enough).
I love the quote from his conversion after reading Romans 13:
> No further would I read, […] nor had I any need; instantly at the end of
> this sentence, a clear light flooded my heart and all the darkness of doubt
> vanished away.
Anyways, like I said, I'm really happy to see this posted here. I'm interested
in seeing where the discussion goes.
~~~
riot504
Over the summer I built a set Catholic theological writings by scouring used
book stores that I plan diligently going through over the next couple of
years. I say years because I also have St. Aquinas' Summa Theologica
(complete) in there as well. I am really interested in seeing the path I take
going through these as adult.
~~~
0x4f3759df
If you don't mind reading on kindle... The Complete Ante-Nicene & Nicene and
Post-Nicene Church Fathers Collection: 3 Series, 37 Volumes, 65 Authors, 1,000
Books, 18,000 Chapters, 16 Million Words
for $3
[https://www.amazon.com/Complete-Ante-Nicene-Post-Nicene-
Fath...](https://www.amazon.com/Complete-Ante-Nicene-Post-Nicene-Fathers-
Collection-ebook/dp/B00KYBSUUM)
~~~
riot504
Thank you for that. I do have one of the Father's of the Church volumes and
one of the book stores has a few other volumes.
I'm most interested right now in The City of God due to the context/thesis
being relevant today. As a teenager I switched to Buddhism (20 or so years
ago) but have gained new interest in my Catholic upbringing as I was finding
it hard to relate to Buddhism and its history. Culturally it was different
from my own and I always had a feeling of being an outsider/imposter.
Most of HN and others who are in educated professions appear to dismiss
religion though I've come to find it as a guiding principal and cultural
history - Western Civilization is built on Christianity, Catholcism for a
larger portion.
Currently in the US we are losing our sense cultural understanding, in my
opinion, and wish for the government to set laws and regulations on
everything. The freedoms set forth in the first amendment give us the freedom
to guide our lives as we see fit, religion filling the moral and spiritual
need in our lives. The libertarian in me agrees with the freedom but to ensure
others are given the same freedom as long we do no harm to others - nor should
we judge or force our beliefs onto others.
Now I understand that certain groups haven't experienced the same freedoms as
others but is that religions fault? I would say no, and offer the perspective
of culture. Simple cultural norms bring us together. I live in the PNW and
have a beard, I know if I were to back to New Orleans where I'm from a beard
would be viewed differently causing issues with employment. This is a simple
and harmless is example that isn't a non-issue compared to others.
Overall I'm excited to begin the journey with the open mind of an adult.
Sorry for tangent and possible incoherent ramble - on my tablet.
~~~
geerlingguy
> Most of HN and others who are in educated professions appear to dismiss
> religion
I think a lot of us just keep our mouths shut due to the large amount of
vitriol that results from any rational discussion of metaphysics or the
supernatural :)
~~~
humanrebar
To attempt to dispel some hesitance, I have a lot of conversations about this
sort of thing. Only a minority involve any vitriol, and they're easy enough to
walk away from. The more principled extroverts might comment on the tone of
conversation as they leave.
And to attempt to make a positive case for engagement, we really need a lot
more of it. We need to be careful because people of various religious (and
agnostic and atheist) persuasions see this fear of engagement as a dislike or
even hate of their kind of people (not just the theology or lack thereof). I
don't want anyone to feel like they have to live secret or closeted lives. And
it's pretty obvious that the stratification of Western culture is causing a
lot of real problems.
~~~
riot504
I am unsure exactly your meaning regarding the stratification of Western
culture, though I assume its in reference to inequality. If this is the case
then I agree. However, I don't believe it stems from Western culture but from
a culture of consumerism. Capitalism often receives the blame though I believe
it is our lack of discipline as a society. Out consistent drive of want -
material items, money and power. Religion, be it Catholicism, Protestant,
Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism etc..., teaches to lead a far simpler life; Buddhism
strives to be content; minimalist.
Does capitalism thrive if everyone in society reduces their wants, focusing
more on their needs and being content with their current belongings? I would
think so, though it would look much different with current economic
measurements needing drastic revisions.
Is religious belief required to move society in this direction? Not
necessarily. Though deep, open philosophical and theological discussion is
required. Agnostics, atheists and religious individuals need to be able to
discuss matters, find similarities in their beliefs - how they guide their
lives.
Since the millennium we have all become aware of our differences, but not our
similarities. Division consistently drives our lives which will increase the
stratification of Western culture. A main area being reduced is Western
Civilization history and thought. It would be hard to argue the United States
was founded on ideas outside Western civilization which goes back to Greek and
Roman thought, but this is now seen as a negative.
In the end we need to have open discussions, be aware of our history, both the
positive and negative aspects and understand the negatives that happened in
the US have happened all around the world and still occurring. In the end I
believe spiritual discussion and reformation is required to reset society will
maintaining freedom of religion being of the utmost importance.
------
indescions_2017
Also glad to see Peter Brown is still writing. One of the original, old school
Oxford "Greats" from a bygone era when Greek and Latin mastery was still a
prerequisite to considering oneself an educated individual.
His latest would make an interesting basis for an "alternative history" of
Monasticism ;)
Treasure in Heaven: The Holy Poor in Early Christianity
[http://www.upress.virginia.edu/title/4867](http://www.upress.virginia.edu/title/4867)
From the description:
"Seen against the backdrop of Asia, Christianity might have opted for a
Buddhist model by which holy monks lived by begging alone. Instead, the monks
of Egypt upheld an alternative model that linked the monk to humanity and the
monastery to society through acceptance of the common, human bond of work."
------
dblarons
I finished Confessions a few weeks ago, and this review does it justice. The
first few chapters, which are autobiographical, completely changed how I view
antiquity. From "ah, these people are tough to relate to and certainly must
have led much different lives than me," to "Augustine could come spend a day
with me, or I a day with him, and neither of us would feel much out of place."
He is today's "young professional" \-- working, traveling, and being
entertained in ways that are strikingly similar to today's tech worker.
The latter half of the book is a bit trickier. Like the other commenter, his
treatment of time was food for thought - not just for me but for philosophers
and scientists for centuries to come. After finishing that chapter I got lost
in Wikipedia learning more about it, eventually finishing with articles on
general relativity (Augustine to Einstein... not what I expected from a 16
century old book).
Anyways, read Confessions. It's really worth it.
~~~
ziotom78
I fully agree. The Confessions is an incredibly modern book, when I read it
the first time I couldn't believe it was written at the time of the Roman
Empire. Also, the text is full of wit, like when he describes time (“What then
is time? If no one asks me, I know what it is. If I wish to explain it to him
who asks, I do not know.”).
------
walterbell
Well worth watching is Roberto Rossellini's _Augustine of Hippo_ ,
[http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0072617/reviews?ref_=tt_ov_rt](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0072617/reviews?ref_=tt_ov_rt)
_" Roberto Rossellini directed a string of biographies in the 1960s and early
70s, all of which revolved around famous historical figures (Christ, Pascal,
Descartes, Socrates, St Francis, St Augustine, King Louis XIV, Giuseppe
Garbaldi, and one unrealized project about Marx), and all of which utilized a
sparse, stripped down aesthetic which revoked the pomp and pageantry typically
ascribed to such characters."_
------
spinchange
Henry James and St. Augustine on the front page at the same time? Digging the
literary flavor, HN.
------
pavlov
A fun (if longish) read about how Augustine's strange relationship with his
mother led to his philosophy of sin:
[https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/06/19/how-st-
augusti...](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/06/19/how-st-augustine-
invented-sex)
------
forapurpose
If you want some context, I highly recommend this clear, engaging, in-depth
run-through of Scholasticism, the leading Medieval philosophy which was
Augustine's legacy.
[https://www.britannica.com/topic/Scholasticism](https://www.britannica.com/topic/Scholasticism)
(If you get a paywall, pull up the link in a search engine and open it from
there.)
You might be thinking: Scholasticism, Augustine, Britannica ... cannot
possibly be engaging. I recommend the Enlightenment approach: Try it for
yourself.
------
steelbird
Nice. The version I first read had "Thou"s, "art"s, and "wherefore"s all over
the place. It made the denser chapters less accessible. I'll probably look at
this one in a year or two, once the price has gone down a bit ;)
~~~
cmccart
I think we read the same version. "Verisimilitude" was a new word for me. I'm
still trying to find a way to use it in conversation.
~~~
hodgesrm
We use it constantly in bars in Berkeley. Example: "The pronouncements of
[insert least favorite politician here] do not exhibit the faintest degree of
verisimilitude." You can add rhetorical flourish by taking a thoughtful sip of
beer immediately thereafter.
~~~
ironic_ali
Along the same lines is 'verily' \- and as you mention, beer (and chin
stroking while looking ponderous) is always involved.
------
slyrus
I dreamed I saw St. Augustine, alive as you or me, tearing through these
quarters in the utmost misery, with a blanket underneath his arm and a coat of
solid gold, searching for the very souls whom already have been sold.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
"SMS of Death" Could Crash Many Mobile Phones - raphar
http://www.technologyreview.com/communications/27021/
======
dkersten
Nothing new here. I used to work on an anti-fraud and anti-spam platform for
SMS and we performed various checks on messages passing through the mobile
network to prevent these kinds of messages from being delivered.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Cephaloponderings - lelf
https://putanumonit.com/2019/07/26/cephaloponderings/
======
cgio
If you find this interesting “other minds” by Peter Godfrey Smith is an
excellent book.
------
pvaldes
> the males that detach their mating arms to keep from being eaten, and
> generally they really can’t mate again after that (why they bother trying to
> avoid being cannibalized if they don’t mate again afterwards)
Nothing prevents them to mate again. Male octopuses are able to regenerate
lost arms and the Hectocotylus easily. The best known species live fast and
have short lives in any case.
------
namanyayg
Even if only a small % of males manage to reproduce after mating arm removal;
over time, would that not lead to the gene for surving reproduction to be
selected and become more common?
Great article, and indeed confusing questions. Wish we can learn more about
octopuses, specially the social octopuses.
Also interesting were recent mdma experiments on octopuses.
------
safeguard77
Thanks for the read. Its utterly bizarre to hear the math of it
All this points to orphaned octopus babies having an advantage over those with living parents,
which is easy enough to fathom. Without mom and dad around, the kids are left with more food and territory for themselves.
However I’m still confused. Wouldn’t a given gene be more likely to replicate itself residing
in an individual that reproduced multiple times in addition to being in half the octopus babies it helped produce?
How does a gene that a parent only passes down (typically) once that inhibits
survival after mating outlive a mutation that doesn't?
------
antoniorosado
My God, what a lovely post.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
AWS CodeBuild – Build and test code with continuous scaling - Trisell
https://aws.amazon.com/codebuild/
======
St-Clock
I'm trying to find if they offer or plan to offer these features:
1\. Caching. CircleCI and Travis cache intermediate build artifacts (e.g.,
virtualenv in python) to reduce build time.
2\. Github pull request integration (red cross on pull requests if the build
fails).
3\. Chat integration. Sending a message to slack or hipchat when the build
fails.
4\. SSH into build container. Very handy for rare but difficult to locally
reproduce build bugs.
Interesting offer though. We found that we would pay less than 5$ a month for
our build needs and they would run concurrently.
~~~
donatj
The Github PR integration is the most important part for me. It's a necessity
for us to be able to use it. We use our own install of Drone on a fairly
sizable EC2 instance and not having to manage that anymore would be wonderful.
~~~
awinder
Github does expose an API for this:
[https://developer.github.com/v3/repos/statuses/](https://developer.github.com/v3/repos/statuses/)
I mean integration is one less thing to build & manage, but you can sling
together support in a pinch
------
debaserab2
How many different CI workflow tools are on AWS these days? How do I know
which one to pick? I really wish Amazon would spend some time building
comparison guides for their services. Each one feels very silo'd off from each
other and the crossover in functionality seems very high.
~~~
vacri
Cloudformation is for when you have a team of ops or a workflow where you have
a lot of repeated resource recreation; Beanstalk is for when you have no ops,
and you're happy for someone else to handle the environment; CodeDeploy is
just yuck; and don't know about this one yet.
Cloudformation: infrastructure-as-code (but has sharp edges) (doesn't touch your app/code directly)
Opsworks: wizard-style 'drop your app here' kind of thing (less flexibility and control)
Beanstalk: a simpler version of OpsWorks? (never tried it)
CodeDeploy: install an agent, it pulls code/artifacts (janky workflow)
CodeBuild: no idea, just been released
Just Using The Web Console: convenient, but manual process (labour-intensive, prone to manual errors)
On the CI thing - from my experience at one of the places I work, there are a
thousand CI systems out there, but very few CD systems. Pretty much anything
can schedule and track builds, but few things schedule and track deploys
(which gets suprisingly tricky suprisingly quickly). CD is the 'last mile'...
EDIT: missed some that I've never looked at. It is getting crazy...
CodeCommit: looks like it might be a 'github'?
CodePipeline: No idea. Perhaps a spruced-up version of CodeDeploy?
~~~
debaserab2
I appreciate the breakdown. It would be awesome if there was someone with the
know-how to go more in depth on each of these.
I recently inherited an app that uses OpsWorks. The deploy process is actually
really nice, but I notice that it doesn't receive a lot of updates from AWS.
Since OpsWorks came out when Chef was hot, and now Chef seems to be less
popular than Ansible and/or docker. I wonder what the future holds for me if
Chef continues to decline in popularity.
------
luhn
I'm excited about what this means for Lambda. Building Lambda packages has
always been a pain because much of the time it needs to be built on Amazon
Linux to work, meaning most (all?) CI SaaS solutions are out the window. I
assume CodeBuild will run Amazon Linux and CodePipeline integrates with
Lambda, so this should make setting up continuous deployment with Lambda much
easier.
~~~
timoth
AWS now provides a container image for Amazon Linux which might also be an
option, depending on the CI SaaS: [https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/new-
amazon-linux-container-...](https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/new-amazon-linux-
container-image-for-cloud-and-on-premises-workloads/)
------
saurik
When I saw this I got super excited because I thought it was going to be "per-
minute low-latency distcc hosts" which was probably set up by having a ton of
common toolchains ready to go at all times, and my big questions were "did
they bother to support MinGW (easy)" and "do they have a reasonable story for
iOS (though I can't imagine they have armv6 working right)", but while they
got my hopes up when they said one could even upload custom toolchains I
realized that didn't make much sense and a few paragraphs later I got the
disappointing news that this is just some extremely thin wrapper over ECS that
is limited to doing builds on single computers which max out at 8 vCPU
(why?!). I mean, I guess this makes CI slightly more accessible to some
people, but it isn't anything terribly exciting and is mostly going to help
people with extremely small projects: this isn't going to scale up to the
kinds of builds where you'd expect a service billing itself on scalability to
be most valuable.
...Except for this part: _CloudBuild has per-minute billing_!! This is one of
the major complaints people have about EC2 (and all the services Amazon builds
over it), and is one of the major downsides of using it over Google's Compute
Engine. If you have any kind of task that can possibly be thought of as a
"build"\--one which can be expressed as a container of software configured to
access some external asset as input and which generates a concrete output
"artifact" (and maybe even not, right? to support some silly things people do
in their builds like "check out code from npm", you likely get network access,
and your build output could always be an empty file)--this now seems like a
depressingly hilarious way to trick Amazon's infrastructure into giving you
per-minute billing for random tasks which take less than 20 minutes to run
(important limit, as they are charging a 3x overhead vs the on demand price
for an equivalent instance: for 8 vCPU / 15 GB instance, a c4.2xlarge costs
$0.419 per hour and a build.general1.large costs $.02 per minute, which would
be $1.20 per hour).
In other words: I will argue that this service really can and maybe should
just be looked at as a different pricing model for ECS, to support any "small"
task (not just building code): if it takes less than 20 minutes and doesn't
require a massive computer, CodeBuild is not only cheaper but probably easier
to use (as it already models the problem in terms of a task queue, so you
don't have to do that part either).
------
nzoschke
This is really exciting. The lack of a build service has been apparent for a
while: [https://convox.com/blog/aws-missing-build-
service/](https://convox.com/blog/aws-missing-build-service/)
I wrote up how we plan to use this in the Convox platform here:
[https://convox.com/blog/codebuild/](https://convox.com/blog/codebuild/)
Practically speaking, we're working through PCI compliance. Getting builds off
of production services and root-enabled docker daemons is a huge win.
------
AtticusTheGreat
As someone who has had to shop around and try out a bunch of continuous
integration services (Travis, CircleCI, Snap, Solano, to name a few), this
looks pretty interesting! We've stayed away from managing our own CI
infrastructure but this could be a good (and cheaper) solution. It doesn't
seem to actually be available yet, but it'll be worth a look.
------
redgc
As it sounds like it's running inside Docker itself, I'd like to know if this
supports "Docker in Docker". My requirement is not strictly DinD however I run
multiple containers during CI (Postgres, node, test containers, etc). Possible
via different approaches in CircleCI, Shippable and SemaphoreCI. I don't
actually build any containers to save.
~~~
ethangj
This is actually how Codeship's Docker infrastructure works by default, builds
up containers and executes all commands in them natively. DinD still possibly
but somewhat yet useful with that approach.
------
msie
What's frustrating is if you go to the aws reinvent page they tell you a lot
except the dates of the conference!!!
[https://reinvent.awsevents.com/](https://reinvent.awsevents.com/) I was
wondering why all these aws announcements were here.
~~~
brazzledazzle
They used to have the date but maybe they pulled it when the conference sold
out.
------
brazzledazzle
At any time someone can show up to eat your lunch but if you're developing
software for operations or developers it seems like a scary space to be in.
AWS has a huge advantage by being able to simply add a service to their
existing catalog.
~~~
TheRealWatson
I feel like none of the AWS developer offerings (the Code* services) are
compelling enough.
Kind of like a lot of Microsoft tools, they are all lacking but, hey, the have
deep integration with each other, so easier gluing.
------
bloomark
[https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/aws-codebuild-fully-
managed...](https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/aws-codebuild-fully-managed-
build-service/)
~~~
AtticusTheGreat
Hmm this blog post says it is available but there seems to be no way to get to
it and it is not showing up in the console.
~~~
_superposition_
the url works
[https://console.aws.amazon.com/codebuild](https://console.aws.amazon.com/codebuild)
------
Malkav
Gave it a try, seems to be kinda slow building docker images. An image that
take 2 minutes in my machine is taking around 10 minutes in CodeBuild. The
build seems to freeze a little between docker build steps :
\--- Example 1 ---
[Container] 2016/12/01 22:39:59 Step 9 : EXPOSE 3000
[Container] 2016/12/01 22:40:31 ---> Running in 1c6e3a4dbec8
[Container] 2016/12/01 22:40:45 ---> 602aa4bc97ac
\-----------------
\--- Example 2 ---
[Container] 2016/12/01 22:36:00 Step 4 : WORKDIR /src
[Container] 2016/12/01 22:36:32 ---> Running in 98800352e6c2
[Container] 2016/12/01 22:36:45 ---> b437afe2a1c5
\-----------------
Not sure if this caused by the fact its a docker inside docker implementation.
------
davecap1
This sounds a bit like BuildKite which has worked out pretty well for us! They
provide an elastic AWS CI environment that you run in your own AWS account,
and scales up/down as builds are queued up.
------
ianceicys
I really wish AWS CodeBuild supported .net\C# as a preconfigured environment.
Hopefully .net is not too far down on their priority list...right now we are
using Jenkins.
~~~
gtsteve
I'm pretty certain someone will make a Docker image for Core CLR apps soon.
There's one for Bitbucket Pipelines already.
------
STRML
Seems pretty nice. A few things I'd like to see:
1\. We should be able to configure this for a few/all branches (including PRs)
and have conditional build tasks based on branch.
2\. We need be able to access resources inside a VPC.
3\. Turnkey chat integrations would be nice, but it's not a big deal to just
curl.
4\. We need a way to execute actions on failure.
~~~
gsharma
> 4\. We need a way to execute actions on failure.
I am curious to know what kind of actions would they be other than notifying
via chat/email?
~~~
TomFrost
For one, hitting the Github API to put failed build markers against commits
and PRs. CodeBuild doesn't appear to have the same Github integration that
most other CIs do out of the box.
------
mesozoic
FAQ says this. Is there any examples on setting it up? It isn't obvious from
inside CodePipeline.
Yes. The CodePipeline Plugin for Jenkins can be used to integrate CodeBuild
into Jenkins jobs. The build jobs are sent to CodeBuild, eliminating the need
for provisioning and managing the Jenkins worker nodes.
------
btashton
Still no way to build iOS applications.
~~~
kt9
Hi you can build iOS applications using Distelli and your own build servers -
[https://www.distelli.com/docs/kb/using-your-own-build-
server](https://www.distelli.com/docs/kb/using-your-own-build-server)
disclaimer: I'm the founder at distelli
------
crb002
This is AWS FatLambda. You provide a full container image instead of just a
zip file.
------
callumjones
Does it support parallel builds?
~~~
bkendzior
You can set up parallelism manually, yes.
------
sidcool
How does this compare with Amazon CodeDeploy?
~~~
Timmy_C
It works side-by-side with CodeDeploy.
Using CodePipelines and CodeCommit you can create a workflow where a git
commit to a CodeCommit repo can get picked up by pipelines and sent to the
build service (i.e. CodeBuild or Jenkins). Then CodeBuild will push the
resulting artifact to S3. CodeDeploy (and Elastic Beanstalk, CloudFormation
and OpsWorks) can be configured to deploy the built artifacts to your
application fleet.
It's the last piece in AWS's solution for continuous deployment.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
A Change to Google Code Download Service - gigiduru
http://google-opensource.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/a-change-to-google-code-download-service.html
======
claudius
You know that something is wrong with a website if it is worth loading a
spinning gears icon to show as an animation while the rest of the page loads.
Why do four paragraphs and a headline need so long to load/display? Size-wise,
ISDN would have happily delivered that content within less than a second more
than ten years ago.
------
stock_toaster
previously: <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5753775>
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: PrefaceCSS – A CSS Boilerplate for Minimalists - giancarlostoro
https://github.com/cluzier/PrefaceCSS
======
ahpearce
I've been looking for something like this. I really dig the aesthetic. Great
job!
~~~
giancarlostoro
Hey thanks, I'm not the author, but I did contribute a bit by fixing up some
of the README based on my experience, I'm friends with the author and have
relayed your message. I'll see if he can join HN and comment.
If anyone has any questions feel free to ask, I will get you answers.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
“AI bookkeeper” startup that raised $100M and failed used humans instead of AI - ilarum
https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidjeans/2020/07/20/scalefactor-raised-100-million-in-a-year-then-blamed-covid-19-for-its-demise-employees-say-it-had-much-bigger-problems
======
teruakohatu
There has been faked AI ever since the invention of the original Mechanical
Turk in 1770.
~~~
tabtab
No wonder my Turk stock took such a hit.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Economics of Uber Eats - ycombonator
Do you think Uber Eats is profitable ? Does the driver just gets paid a buck or two ? Recent order https://imgur.com/a/GGiPqzN
======
NotPaidToPost
Uber Eats, Deliveroo, etc. are like Uber, Lyft, etc. : Throwing massive mounts
of money to 'grow' at huge losses.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Flask 0.5.1 Released - Python WSGI microframework - enduser
http://pypi.python.org/pypi/Flask/0.5.1
======
enduser
From the mailing list:
"And two hours later: the 0.5.1 point release. Why that? Because when you had
a module named A without templates in A but the application's template folder
in the subfolder A, Flask would have chopped of the leading "A/". Fixed that
now and expanded the testsuite."
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Airbnb hosts are building their own direct booking websites in revolt - dionmanu
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/06/airbnb-hosts-are-building-their-own-direct-booking-websites-in-revolt.html
======
rogerkirkness
Similar to sellers leaking from Amazon > Shopify. Reintermediation is the
first step to digital enablement. Not necessarily the last step...
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Tell HN: Flesh out your profiles please - jacquesm
There's an old internet joke, that on the internet, nobody knows you're a dog.<p>The way to let people know that you're not a dog, is to establish an identity, maybe a short blurb about yourself and a way to contact you out-of-band.<p>Lots of HN profiles are blank, and the nicknames used are anonymous. Of course, the theory is that since we are all judging your writings by their merits it is just as good to get that information you just wrote from an anonymous source as it would be to get it from a source that has an identity.<p>To me that would matter, for one when someone is attaching their name - and by extension their reputation - to their words they automatically have something to lose by saying it.<p>Second, it helps to verify that they are real people with relevant experience, instead of posers.<p>Anonymity on the net has its uses, for instance for whistleblowers and to ask embarrassing questions.<p>But for the most part it is used as a shield for cowardly attacks, sockpuppets and to create a persona with a reputation that is larger than the one the person is really entitled to and so on.<p>Being yourself is more than enough. So, to all those that are for whatever reason anonymous here, step out of the shadows and tie your HN identity in with your real-life persona.<p>Anonymous cowards belong to that other site :)
======
madair
I think it's worth mentioning the other block of people you left out: those
who risk corporate jobs or contracts simply by having opinions that an
employer doesn't agree with.
Some (many?) of us have kids or other responsibilities and don't have a nest
egg, relatives or soft landings.
Until our peonage is less feudal I think it's going to be this way.
~~~
jacquesm
That's one I hadn't thought of, indeed. I've been 'unemployed' (that's a
different word for self employed) long enough that it never even crossed my
mind, sorry.
On the other hand, it's a shame that it should come to the point that people
are hiding who they are for fear of retribution from their employers.
~~~
madair
:)
Yes it is a shame. For me it's a few more years to get some teenagers through
HS (it's not like that's without rewards) and then I can get back to wanton
risk-taking.
I spent my risk allowance for 10 years: founding a couple of lousy startups
(not Silicon Valley, and it was my own damn fault that they were crapiola),
and then an employer that suffered death by VC (that one wasn't my fault), so
yeah, it's not like corporate is the only way in my case, it's just the
recessionary cookie crumble.
------
mbenjaminsmith
Jacquesm, what exactly would constitute a poseur around here? Are members
expected to be a level n programmer or startup founder? What behavior have you
witnessed that would be thwarted by calling someone a poseur after the fact?
Doesn't that lead to more personal attacks?
Personally I don't know who you are and I really don't care. I care if what
you write is insightful and helpful to me (and hopefully I do the same for
some other people).
I'm sure I've been attacked a few times by people that might be run out of
town under the no cowards policy, but I'd rather deal with ankle biters than
have this place turn into a cult of personality for a handful of celebrity
posters.
Btw if anyone downvotes this without a bio I'm calling you out. That's ironic
humor if you're wondering. Am I qualified? Yes, I'm a startup founder with a
degree in literature.
~~~
jacquesm
Armchair founders and lawyers would be one group, cowardly attacks are a
problem but less so, I've so far had exactly two directed at me, one through
mail and one here on the site. I've seen a few others and for the most part
the attackers find themselves at -4 or banned pretty swiftly.
The only real 'celebrity posters' I can think of are PG, patio11, cperciva,
tptacek and jgrahamc and their reputations are well established and deserved
in the fields they write most about, for the most part their votes seem to
reflect the quality of what they write on a case-by-case basis.
For example, it's rare to see PG downvoted because most of the time what he
writes makes very good sense (and I've been on the receiving end of a couple
of 'you disagreed with PG downvotes' but it does happen, and that, as far as
I'm concerned proves that the problem if it exists is not that large.
So inspite of the research referenced above and personal experience, even if
it does happen we don't have a cult of celebrity worship here as far as I can
see, but at the same time we're talking about a bunch of counters in a disk
file somewhere, so assuming that we do it _still_ isn't a problem. Maybe ask
the posters I mentioned above if they feel 'worshipped' in any way?
> Btw if anyone downvotes this without a bio I'm calling you out.
Hehe, that was funny :)
And I'm just a startup founder with a typing diploma and a driving license.
~~~
mbenjaminsmith
You've got me coming around a bit on that. But I haven't yet seen a comment
where I felt I was getting bad legal advice or an insincere 'fail early,
often' or anything similar. I could see it useful in say a discussion of
operating a site at massive scale when the poster's sys admin skills were
limited to a WP blog.
But usually in those cases people qualify what they're saying with, 'I worked
on x and we did y'. I think you have to qualify what you're saying in that
way. It's presumptuous to assume people know who you are. My background is
marketing and PR (as an entrepreneur) so I usually qualify PR-related advice
with a note of my experience. If people don't I usually assume they're
regurgitating what someone else told them.
Anyway it's moot for me because I never check people's bios.
I don't know who any of those people are other than pg. I'm ok with that
because again I'm really only interested in what they have to say. If Mr Z is
on his 11th startup and is worth 23 gazillion dollars I would expect that will
come through in his perspective on the industry. I hope it would at least.
Don't worry, if I could do it over again I would skip college. I wish I would
have raised 1/5 of the money I had to for college and started a business. I
would have learned more, faster and would probably be retired already.
~~~
jacquesm
> But I haven't yet seen a comment where I felt I was getting bad legal advice
> or an insincere 'fail early, often' or anything similar.
I've seen more than a few, but truth be told they were usually identified as
such.
> Don't worry, if I could do it over again I would skip college. I wish I
> would have raised 1/5 of the money I had to for college and started a
> business. I would have learned more, faster and would probably be retired
> already.
I still have contact with a few of the people from 'the old days', and I
wouldn't trade with them for any amount of money, but every now and then I
wished I'd gotten the benefits of at least high school calculus.
I tend to spend too much time approaching mathematical problems in a way that
I can fudge my basic knowledge, in stead of for instance a direct approach
using an analytical method I might code up a brute force search or a hill
climbing algorithm (and pray I'm not stuck on a local maximum :) ).
The network would have come in handy as well in the beginning, but I've long
ago made up for lack of that.
~~~
mbenjaminsmith
I think I take that back - I would do college again to get a CS degree. I
really enjoy programming, but it's only a fraction of my time even now that
I'm doing tech. I wish I would have done CS so I would have had more time on
the intellectual side of programming - both so I could program better (I fudge
my way through it as well) and for the enjoyment of it.
------
ryandvm
Meh. There's enough celebrity worship around here as it is. Now you're
suggesting we fill out our profiles so our posts can be voted up based on who
they're authored by instead of what they contain? No thanks.
~~~
jacquesm
> Now you're suggesting we fill out our profiles so our posts can be voted up
> based on who they're authored by instead of what they contain?
Where did you read that ? The word vote isn't even in there, and that was not
a suggestion I had in mind.
~~~
sraybell
It's kind of implied, however.
~~~
jacquesm
Why? Because you'd vote differently if you knew that I was me? But you already
know, and I take it that it makes no difference in how you vote. So why would
that be different for you?
~~~
corruption
There are many papers in psychology dealing with the influence of prestige on
statement credibility. It does have a large effect and is replicated across
many studies.
Whether or not you want your prestige to influence your statement credibility
is entirely personal. I'd rather have it not effect it to keep myself honest.
~~~
Zev
If this was that big of a deal for an online site in which you say whether you
like something or not, I'd have thought that sites would hide the username
from everyone until you voted on a comment/story/etc. However, in practice,
its not that big of a deal. pg hasn't even experimented with it on HN afaik -
and on some level, I generally think of HN as his personal experiment sandbox
(either for how people behave, UI/UX or for Arc).
~~~
corruption
I propose an experiment rather than making an assumption that it's not
important.
Randomly change the username on new posts from users that have a low average
points per post (ppp)to a top 20 user in terms of ppp.
If there is no effect of username on ppp, then the difference between the
users true average ppp and the randomly assigned one will be large, if there
is an effect it will be approximately zero. We could test this statistically
easily enough.
What say you pg?
~~~
jacquesm
That's a really clever idea.
------
codexon
I don't think this will help.
As you may have noticed, the Facebook privacy stories are rated very highly
here.
For those of us in startups, we are either too busy to comment, too afraid to
alienate potential customers with our opinions, or currently in stealth mode.
I'd venture to guess that most of the people here are not concerned with
winning arguments on the internet by prestige, as you've described as the main
reason to lose anonymity.
~~~
ggchappell
> As you may have noticed, the Facebook privacy stories are rated very highly
> here.
I think there may be a misunderstanding here. Facebook's problem is not that
they make information about their users available, but that they do so after
having been specifically directed not to. One can have no problem with the
former, while being very much against the latter.
As this article (posted last week on HN)
http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/05/14/facebook-and-radical-transparency-a-rant.html
said:
> The battle that is underway is not a battle over the future of privacy and
> publicity. It’s a battle over choice and informed consent.
------
sraybell
Or not. See, that's the beauty of this, I have no interest in sharing anything
on any particular site. That said, simply doing searches on my username will
yield results both by myself and my father.
I have no interest in taking it further. This isn't Facebook.
------
grandalf
It's not that, it's just that some of us prefer to be anonymous just from
things like google searches, etc.
------
prodigal_erik
> when someone is attaching their name - and by extension their reputation -
> to their words they automatically have something to lose by saying it.
Why is why I never say anything even slightly controversial for the record
under my True Name. I don't know about you but I rely on getting food and
shelter by negotiating with other members of a nosy, judgmental, sometimes
irrational species.
<http://www.paulgraham.com/say.html>
~~~
jacquesm
So do I, but I'm not at all worried about saying controversial stuff.
Essentially you are saying that you are self-censoring.
~~~
Vivtek
Yes, that is exactly what he's saying, and moreover he seems to think he has
reason to do so.
~~~
prodigal_erik
Just for example, if a potential employer running a PHP/MySQL shop could
easily look up my opinion of their chosen tools, most would only hire me as a
last resort if at all. Those tools are still popular enough that I would never
bet my career on being able to avoid them indefinitely. (I'm more candid with
my current manager now that we trust each other, in fact his views are
stronger than mine.)
And that's without even getting into political views like IP law, or whatever
the hell future landlords or neighbors might object to....
------
brm
Judge a user not by the depth of their profile but by the quality of their
previous comments and contributions.
------
marcusbooster
Since we're appointing ourselves sheriff of hn now, how about we knock it off
with the meta-posts.
------
RevRal
I spent about half an hour working on mine.
I have trust issues with random people on the internet.
~~~
jacquesm
That's gorgeous.
------
ryanelkins
I think people are capable of building a reputation based on the quality of
their contributions. For many of us that don't have any kind of reputation
that would be meaningful from our real identities we rely on building it on
here.
That said, I would like it if people added things like a way to contact them.
There have been times when I would like to contact people and there isn't
really a good way to do it. I've been contacted from having my email address
in my profile and made some good contacts through it as well.
------
wwortiz
The only time I really look at profiles is if I see people over and over again
commenting on a large portion of the same things I comment on or like and it
is just to see if they have a website or something like that.
So you really don't need to expose your full fledged identity but if you have
a blog and like a bit of extra relevant traffic put it up on your profile page
and it might get more visits.
One thing I would like to see more of is people responding when they downvote
something because I always like to see the other side of the argument (other
than those comments that have no merit whatsoever and should probably be
flagged rather than, or perhaps in addition to, being downvoted.
Other than that my profile is blank because I don't really have anything to
put there.
------
unavailable
>> step out of the shadows and tie your HN identity in with your real-life
persona.
Has HN been acquired by the government for an undisclosed sum lately?
~~~
jacquesm
Yes, but your profile was blank so we couldn't mail you the memo...
------
Unseelie
Wow. We have profiles?
~~~
jacquesm
Click your username.
~~~
kordless
Then click on my username!
------
corruption
I would rather have bias against my ideas because I am anonymous compared to
bias for my ideas because of my accomplishments.
It depends if you want to let other accomplishments add weight to your
argument, or let your argument stand on it's own. I prefer the latter.
------
epochwolf
> There's an old internet joke, that on the internet, nobody knows you're a
> dog.
woof!
> So, to all those that are for whatever reason anonymous here, step out of
> the shadows and tie your HN identity in with your real-life persona.
No thanks, I'm happy being another dog on the internet.
~~~
jacquesm
I think I can see why ;) :
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1364225>
~~~
epochwolf
Nah, it's for stuff like this:
<http://twitter.com/epochwolf/status/14430334843>
~~~
jacquesm
It would be a great loss to the world if you would no longer post stuff like
that because you have your name out front.
~~~
epochwolf
I know you're being sarcastic but the problem is if I can't say stuff like
that, what can I safely share under my real name? The internet is a safe place
for me to share what I'm thinking. I don't have that freedom in real life.
~~~
jacquesm
That's pretty split to me. There isn't a thing that I'm thinking that I would
speak out loud that I would not dare to commit in writing, and there isn't
anybody of authority that I would look up to them with automatic respect so as
to be deferential.
That got me in to a lot of trouble in my school days by the way, especially
with religious teachers ;)
------
Zev
Kind of agreed, but for other reasons. It isn't important to me who you (the
commenter) are in particular. However, a way to message you (the commenter)
would be nice, short of having to post "Hey, mind emailing me? I'd like to
talk to you about something."
How the method works is an irrelevant implementation detail (as long as its
not an anonymous PO box, that is..). Really, an anonymous gmail thats checked
once every few weeks would be fine most of the time.
Of course, I can just as easily understand why someone _wouldn't_ want to be
contacted. So, shrug.
------
mgcross
As much as I completely understand remaining somewhat anonymous for privacy
issues (my facespace acct is so overpopulated that I feel awfully muzzled), I
often click through to a poster's profile not so much to check out their name
or reputation, but because I'm interested in reading more of their thoughts or
checking out their projects.
I filled my profile out a little more, but I'm honestly pretty boring to
everyone I know with the exception of my dog!
------
pook
I just added a bit more to mine.
I've been spouting my beliefs on the interwebs long enough that am unelectable
to any political office.
------
kimfuh
I haven't achieved anything of relevance yet. But I don't think that makes my
opinion irrelevant.
------
starkfist
The majority of the users on the leaderboard do have identifying information
in their profiles.
~~~
jacquesm
That's an interesting observation.
------
avk
Thanks for the encouragement. I just updated mine. Feedback appreciated :)
------
nfnaaron
My profile is blank.
So is my life.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Review My App: Mides IDE - heat_miser
Hey HN, I've been grinding away on this app for a couple of years, trying to build the best mobile IDE that I could on the iPhone / iPod Touch. I have recently ported it to iPad and wanted to get some feedback.<p>Thanks!
- Irvin
======
heat_miser
<http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/mides-ide/id284965983?mt=8>
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
If you’re not terrified about Facebook, you haven’t been paying attention - annadane
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/jul/26/with-facebook-we-are-already-through-the-looking-glass
======
jjgreen
... and next to the article, a "share on Facebook" button
~~~
nix23
Activate the anti-social filter-list in uBlock ;)
------
PhaedrusV
Have people decided that they need Facebook for some reason? Just delete your
account. If you need photos, or groups, or contact, there's other services.
A good ol' boycott will fix everything wrong about Facebook. No 'terror'
required.
~~~
AndrewDucker
Facebook is where my brother posts photos of his kids. It's where my old
friends (scattered around the world) let me know they're getting married,
having kids, getting cancer, etc.
I'd love it if they used their own blogs, like in the good old days. But until
then that's where I have to go if I want to keep up with the people I care
about.
~~~
wayneftw
Do they care about you? If so, they might leave if you do.
There has to be something better to go to of course...and I just don’t see
that right now.
~~~
theklr
That’s a pipe dream. Been off for 2 years now. Shared my details with those
who claimed they cared... unless I’m actively reaching out to them, I’m
“forgettable.” Humans are lazy, not in a spiteful way it’s just convince >
privacy.. and Facebook has dressed convenience over privacy ridiculously well.
------
encom
I hate Facebook as much as the next guy, but Jesus Christ. It wouldn't be a
Guardian article if they didn't blame everyone else for their own problems.
------
pmlnr
> In 2016, we didn’t know. We were innocent. We still believed social media
> connected us and that connections were good.
I'll just leave this here, from 2014:
[https://salimvirani.com/facebook/](https://salimvirani.com/facebook/)
~~~
cassianoleal
> from 2014
The first line of the article reads:
"I originally wrote this for my friends and family in 2015 (...)"
------
heldrida
Why is this article flagged? I'm curious.
~~~
WalterSear
Hacker news attracts people of all kinds.
------
strogonoff
The article is not about privacy violations per se, and a single individual
quitting Facebook would not help the issue.
The article is attempting to raise awareness of how Facebook’s mode of
operation (or its vulnerability to certain kinds of exploitation) can render
fair elections impossible.
Notably, it’s written by the same journalist who exposed the scandal around
Facebook and Cambridge Analytica, featured heavily in both Trump election
campaign and (more importantly, given this is UK media) Brexit campaign.
Her TED talk (yes I know, but still) from 2019 may also be worth watching.
------
BickNowstrom
> Zuckerberg says Black Lives Matter and yet we know Donald Trump used
> Facebook’s tools to deliberately suppress [1] and deny black and Latino
> people the vote. With no consequences.
[1] [https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-10-27/inside-
th...](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-10-27/inside-the-trump-
bunker-with-12-days-to-go)
> The Trump team’s effort to discourage young women by rolling out Clinton
> accusers and drive down black turnout in Miami’s Little Haiti neighborhood
> with targeted messages about the Clinton Foundation’s controversial
> operations in Haiti is an odd gambit. Campaigns spend millions on data
> science to understand their own potential supporters—to whom they’re likely
> already credible messengers—but here Trump is speaking to his opponent’s.
> Furthermore, there’s no scientific basis for thinking this ploy will
> convince these voters to stay home. It could just as easily end up
> motivating them.
Nowhere in that article is anything about denying black people a vote. Even if
Trump did that, that does not negate that Zuckerberg thinks Black Lives
Matter.
I am sick and tired of politics and sourness masquerading as bad journalism.
Step up the game now, or forever deserve the awful Fake News moniker. The
United States needs an impartial factual news media now more than ever. Forget
the clicks for a month or three.
------
theklr
For those claiming “the guardian” wrote this, you know how opinion columns
work right?
------
stransky
Facebook is bad for human brains.
~~~
itg
I would extend this to all social media.
------
joe_momma
Trump won because Democrats did Bernie wrong not because Facebook displayed
ads to people who were more likely to vote the way they did anyway. Democrats
are always whining about the wrong things instead of addressing problems from
the standpoint their supporters see every day. Trump will win again because of
this, not because of social media advertising.
~~~
Kaze404
I think it's fair to say there can be more than one reason to why things
happen.
~~~
joe_momma
Yah very true, but the Bernie thing shows how disconnected the top of the
democratic food chain is from the next generation of liberal voters. Education
and the environment are two sticking points Bernie nailed. He deserved better
and now the democratic base knows the best candidate on their own ticket can't
be nominated. Shenanigans I say.
~~~
theklr
I think it’s still an oversimplification that it’s just Bernie. On the ground
his ideas work, but he doesn’t. That’s a big problem that Bernie stans still
won’t acknowledge.
~~~
joe_momma
But to be fair I first never thought it was entirely Bernie but rather
Hillary's lack of attention in the Rust Belt and Coal States. She also did not
appeal to women as some may think she should. There are a lot of reasons, but
coming back to the Bernie thing, that really split the Democratic party in
two, which you can see now with defund police movements.
------
thiscatis
It's been a while since The Guardian wrote a deep-state Facebook article.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Is Using Twitter Paying Off For You? Check Out Buffer - jameshicks
http://www.thetechscoop.net/2011/03/23/is-using-twitter-paying-off-for-you-check-out-buffer/#axzz1HM8SDcPN
======
jameshicks
extremely useful means of scheduling your twitter stream
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why Do We Only Care About Programmers? - balac
http://modelviewculture.com/pieces/why-do-we-only-care-about-programmers
======
lugg
Ahh survivors guilt. Dont worry, it'll pass.
On a little more serious note I believe it has a lot to do with supply and
demand. Good programmers just think differently. Whether that way of thinking
is something you can teach is something incredibly hard to argue. I think it
can be, but I dont really know how and dont think the worlds education systems
are even close to figuring it out. Its sort of a sum of life's learning's and
experiences. You either pick it up and do well or you dont.
Well that's what I believe anyway. You might not agree but that and the 5
years of education and the 5 years of debt which followed is what I think
separates me and the people selling what I create.
Please dont get me wrong I dont think I'm better than anyone else, I just
think that my higher than average wage is due to a lack of supply and wanted
to lay it all out.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Supreme Court seek Obama administration views on Google-Oracle dispute - drallison
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/12/us-usa-court-copyright-idUSKBN0KL1IB20150112
======
drallison
This dispute centers upon whether APIs can be copyrighted. This case has broad
implications for everyone who builds and uses software. See
[https://www.eff.org/cases/oracle-v-google](https://www.eff.org/cases/oracle-
v-google) for a bit more background.
------
tzs
I'm confused about how precedent works in this kind of case.
Generally, the precedent that a particular court must follow in a case is the
rulings of courts that its ruling in the case can be appealed to. So, a
California district court has to follow 9th Circuit precedent in a copyright
case, because it will be the 9th Circuit appeals court that gets the case on
appeal. The California district court does not have to follow, say, 2nd
Circuit precedent, because the case will not ever reach the 2nd Circuit
appeals court.
For a patent case, the path is a little different. All patent appeals go to
the Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit (CAFC) rather then to the Circuit
appeals courts. Thus, a California district court hearing a patent case
follows CAFC precedent, because that's where the case will go on appeal.
The Oracle-Google case is _both_ copyright _and_ patent. Because of the patent
aspect, the appeal from the district court went to the CAFC. Although a
copyright appeal would not go to CAFC on its own, CAFC is allowed to handle it
when it is part of a patent case. Thus, we end up with the CAFC issuing a
copyright ruling.
What I do not understand is which courts have to take the CAFC copyright
ruling as precedent.
Suppose I sue someone over copyright in California, and suppose there are no
patent issues anywhere near the case...it's just a pure copyright case. The
appeal then will go to the 9th Circuit appeals court, not to CAFC, so does the
district court in this case have to follow CAFC's Oracle ruling? Or do they
look strictly to what the 9th Circuit has said?
Given the theoretical basis for precedent, I'd expect that the district court
follows the 9th Circuit.
If that's the case, suppose that the defendant would really prefer to operate
under CAFC copyright precedent rather than 9th Circuit copyright precedent.
Could he try to add a patent counterclaim, so that the appeal would go to
CAFC, and so the district court would have to follow CAFC precedent? Would I
have a reasonable chance under FRCP Rule 42 to ask for separate trials on the
copyright and patent issues?
------
Oletros
The Supreme Court also seek DoJ views on Google vs Vederi, the Google Street
View case that the Appeals court reversed
------
angdis
I fail to see what Oracle gets out of all this aggression other than an
interminable legal fight and associated expenses, the scorn of developers
everywhere, and a _very_ iffy future pay-off. What is the motivation here?
~~~
debacle
Money. What else would the motivation be? This is Oracle we're talking about.
~~~
angdis
OK, but they're already making money. And anyway it is far from certain if
they will "win" and moreover how much they'll even get out of it. It is less
likely to be successful than a "slip-and-fall" scam. Surely, there is more to
it?
------
th0br0
Does anybody else find it disturbing that the Supreme Court, which, as the
head of the legislative, should be a fully independent entity, defers its
decision of whether it should become active to the head of the
executive/judicative? So much about the separation of powers...
~~~
jaredhansen
1) They aren't deferring the decision of whether to become active; they're
asking the administration to provide its thoughts. They aren't bound to do
what the administration says, but it's not unprecedented or even that odd.
2) Not to be pedantic but for the benefit of others who may not be aware: the
Supreme Court is the highest judicial body, not the head of the legislative
body. Congress is legislative, the courts are judicial, and the Obama
administration is the current incarnation of the executive branch.
~~~
th0br0
Whoops, mixed the two words up there... sorry about that. I just read the
article as the decision being a bit more conditionally then.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Indenting Cond Forms in Clojure - nathell
http://blog.danieljanus.pl/2020/02/10/cond-indentation/
======
kimi
Worth checking out - it would be nice to see what cljfmt thinks of this.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
What Critics Don't Understand About Gun Culture - tntn
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2018/02/gun-culture/554351/?single_page=true
======
rabboRubble
I grew up in a family with a lot of guns around. As an adult, I've never felt
the need to waste my money on them. For me it's just another thing I have no
real need or want for, that would require occasional maintenance, and
occasional training to stay proficient. I have enough stuff to clean and
enough stuff to learn that interests me a lot more.
My issue with many members of my family is that they are sloppy. They do not
treat the weapons as the instruments of war that they are. Having a shotgun,
loaded and propped in a corner is not good stewardship, especially when
entertaining visitors. Having an unlocked gun cabinet is not good stewardship.
Tossing loaded rifles in the back of a pickup with the barrels pointing
backward towards the tailgate and towards people who _do not know_ the rifles
are loaded when they unloaded the truck, not good stewardship. Blasé attitudes
abound and as far as I can tell, blasé attitudes towards gun ownership
increases the more the owner reveres the second amendment or protecting the
constitution or whatever.
Worship at the gun alter if it suits your interests or if you have a
legitimate need as the author seems to. Be a good steward of the
responsibility that gun ownership entails.
~~~
RickJWagner
Have any of your relatives had a mishap?
~~~
rabboRubble
Nope, thank god. I’ve shamed them a bit when I found out these particulars.
------
iamnotlarry
This is written by one person who is one small part of gun culture. There are
lots of angles in "gun culture." I live in a place that goes pretty strongly
pro-gun. I think that most of "gun culture" around here is not much connected
to the gun culture described by this author.
A lot of the gun supporters live in rural America and only experience the
types of threats related here when watching Hollywood productions. Everybody
these days is feeling the threat of all the mass shootings, but very few in
rural America have been personally touched by them. They also haven't really
experienced gang violence, home invasion, mugging, etc. We all know those
things happen, and some feel some distant anxiety about them. But most in
rural America have not experiences them except through news reports.
Yet, gun support is strongest in rural America. Some point to hunting. Some
will talk about self-defense. Many are just enthusiasts who like to target-
shoot for enjoyment. Some feel some nationalistic pull to defend against
Germany^H^HRussia^H^HChina^H^HNorth Korea^H^H or whoever is the latest poster
child threat to the American Way. And some think that from the very beginning
of America, there has been one constant threat--the one threat the founders
new first-hand and the reason for the right to bear arms.
It seems like terrorism to actually say it, but for some the main reason to
bear arms is to be able to rebel against tyranny--foreign and especially
domestic. In other words, it's important for people to be able to occupy a
wildlife refuge and "take it back" from the government. Taken to the extreme,
this right is for the express purpose to allow civilians to kill policemen and
military personnel in a pitched battle. It's not really about hunting or
defense against home invasion. It's about an armed citizenry to keep the
government in check.
That's a part of "gun culture" with which the author may not be able to
relate. That's very scary to a lot of people. And to some that thinking is no
longer needed to keep people safe in the modern world. But to some, it's
absolutely vital to the preservation of the Constitution.
You may not agree with it. The author of this article may not agree with it
either. But it just goes to show that there is not one true gun culture. There
are different reasons to oppose guns and different reasons to support them.
~~~
zimpenfish
> It's about an armed citizenry to keep the government in check.
Which made sense 200 years ago. Today, against a government armed with reaper
drones et al, a populace armed with AR-15s would last about an hour if the
government really wanted to put them down.
~~~
tntn
I see similar statements to this quite frequently around this topic, and every
time they strike me as quite simplistic.
If such a conflict were to ever happen (and let us pray that it doesn't), I
feel that it would be quite a bit more complicated than "government brings out
the big guns, game over," for several reasons:
1\. This ignores the historical track record of the US military in asymmetric
warfare, fighting determined foes with inferior equipment and weaponry. I'm
thinking of Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Not perfect comparisons, but
worth some thought.
2\. It is likely that the US military would see significant desertion and
insubordination in such a situation. Military personnel are people too, and
many may be reluctant to go to war against their own country.
3\. Every state has an Army National Guard and an Air National Guard, and many
states has state defense forces. While the National Guard units are legally
obligated to obey orders from the federal government, there is no guarantee of
what would happen were there to actually be a domestic insurgency.
A populace armed with AR-15s may well be enough of a problem that the opposing
force weakens its opposition and starts to fracture.
Again, let us all hope that nothing like this ever happens, but that shouldn't
stop us from analyzing in more detail what might happen.
~~~
zimpenfish
> every time they strike me as quite simplistic.
Sure but the whole "we need guns as protection against the government"
argument is equally simplistic.
> many may be reluctant to go to war against their own country
Perhaps but the enthusiasm with which e.g. ICE officers have turned against
their own country does not give optimism here.
------
scarface74
I'm not morally opposed to gun control. For me, it's more practical.
Let's say that we did "ban guns" like we "ban drugs" and now we have a "War on
guns". How affective has the "War on drugs" been? How evenly has it been
applied? Why would anyone think that the same biased criminal justice system
that applies punishment and enforcement of drugs unequally would all of the
sudden start applying stricter gun laws equally?
Why do we think that we could anymore keep guns out of the hands of criminals
than we could keep drugs out of the hands of people?
~~~
krapp
>Why do we think that we could anymore keep guns out of the hands of criminals
than we could keep drugs out of the hands of people
Your equivocation seems to imply that gun regulation would either have either
no or negative effect on gun ownership and usage. Yet other countries with
stricter gun laws than the US have fewer incidents of gun violence, which
would appear to suggest that it is, in fact, possible for gun laws to be
effective at limiting gun violence.
The question, then, is not whether gun laws _can_ keep guns out of the hands
of criminals, but whether one believes they _should_.
~~~
scarface74
I didn't say it wouldn't have any effect. I'm saying that that the trade off
of giving the government more power to lock people up isn't worth it. The
criminal justice system has harmed far more lives by locking up non violent
offenders than gun violence.
------
rdtsc
> It starts with the consciousness of a threat. Perhaps not the kind of threat
> my family has experienced. Some people experience more.
Why can't it just be a hobby, or hunting, or sport. I remember having fun
shooting at a range. Around 8th grade I joined a local small bore club and
shooting range and we shot .22 rifles. It was tons of fun. It wasn't in US,
not sure if those things exist here for kids at that age. But anyway I can
definitely see people doing it for that reason.
~~~
adamrezich
I graduated high school (US) in 2009. My mom did the same, at the same school,
30 years earlier. When she was in high school, guys would leave shotguns and
rifles in gun racks in the backs of their pickup trucks, in the school parking
lot, and there was never an issue.
In 1991 (year I was born), a kid brought a sawed-off shotgun to my high school
and held up a class, discharging something like 10 shots into the wall. Nobody
was injured and everyone made it out alright. This did not get weeks of
nonstop national news coverage like contemporary school shooting incidents do.
The kid brought a sawed-off shotgun, and handgun legislation was the thing of
the time (which has now mysteriously switched to rifle legislation for no
perceivably valid reason). Also, nobody died, so there weren't any dead kids
to use as the emotional bedrock for any sort of political activism.
When I was in high school, a kid at either my high school or maybe it was the
school across town, got a felony for leaving a paintball gun (from the weekend
or whatever) in his car and parking it in the school parking lot.
What's changed in the past 30 years?
~~~
jchb
Deinstitutionalisation - reduction of involuntary mental care and closure of
large psychiatric hospitals - took full effect? Combine that with (local)
economic downturn, veterans returning from Iraq and Afghanistan wars..
------
RickJWagner
The problem is mostly about culture, not guns.
The crazy gunman shooting at a school pictures himself as George Clooney in a
Tarantino movie.
------
Simulacra
My husband and I have guns, and we rarely shoot them. Mainly because of cost,
time, and the effort it takes to go to a shooting range in an area where few
exist. They're good for protection, but we both really enjoy the mechanical
engineering behind them. Science behind delivering a projectile do a paper
target 100 yards away. They are absolutely should be more restrictions, but I
think it's also a slippery slope.
~~~
senectus1
>They're good for protection
I'd really like to see the stats on this. because I have a feeling that this
is quite possibly provably incorrect.
~~~
AstralStorm
Easy. Please be less lazy in finding them (one Google search is all that takes
to get Eurostat data) and consider that all kinds of statistics are
incomplete.
Preferably skip US stats as they are loaded with noise, mishandling and
organized crime confusion.
------
solipsism
The author, like most people who oppose common sense regulations like the
banning of assault rifles, sees the world in simplistic black and white. There
are _bad guys_ who want to harm people, and who scoff at laws. And there are
_good guys_ , who follow laws, are patriots, and just want to protect their
family and community.
Of course the world is a lot more complicated than that. Yesterday's _good
guy_ is tomorrow's school shooter. Domestic violence, alcohol, mental health
disorders, theft, and accidents are all cracks in this simplistic worldview.
No matter how you cut it, a world where all the good guys have assault rifles
with high capacity magazines is a world where the effects of the inevitable --
the breakdown of social order -- are magnified. A shooting spree instead of a
bar fight. A family murder-suicide instead of a black eye and a CPS visit. 20
school children dead instead of 10.
This is what NRA supporters don't seem to understand about the world. They're
stuck in a comic book good-vs-evil story and they're the hero.
~~~
Turing_Machine
> Yesterday's good guy is tomorrow's school shooter.
Sorry, but that's patent nonsense.
Somewhere north of 3 million AR-15 rifles have been sold. The number of mass
murders (not all of which use AR-15s, by any means) committed at schools
averages about one per year.
[http://news.northeastern.edu/2018/02/schools-are-still-
one-o...](http://news.northeastern.edu/2018/02/schools-are-still-one-of-the-
safest-places-for-children-researcher-says/)
You should be embarrassed to even make that claim.
~~~
yongjik
> The number of mass murders (not all of which use AR-15s, by any means)
> committed at schools averages about one per year.
Only in America you will find someone saying, with a straight face, that _one
mass murder at school per year_ does not constitute social crisis...
~~~
Turing_Machine
Way more children drown in swimming pools.
Something like 15 teenagers (comparable to the number killed in Florida) die
_every day_ from texting and driving.
Why aren't those things "social crises"?
~~~
IntronExon
More people died from the Spanish Flu epidemic than all of WWI. Was WWI not a
crisis? Half of all people who have ever lived, died as a result of mosquito-
borne illnesses, do all other causes of death not matter? Shall we stop
bothering to develop autonomous vehicles because deaths from automotive
accidents pale next to that?
Note that I’m not even attacking your premise that accidental deaths during an
activity voluntarily engaged, in some way relates to mass murder.
------
jacknews
"At the end of this process, your life has changed for the better."
Not really. Life would change for the better if the bad guys found it very
difficult to obtain and keep possession of weapons, so the rest didn't have to
play the arms race. Of course, since we don't know who's bad and who's good,
that means everyone should find it extremely hard to buy and possess. Angry
ex-boyfriends would then probably not be (fire-)armed unless they were, or
willing to become, serious criminals.
The whole "responsible ownership", and "guns don't kill people, people do",
argument also appears broken. It is not legal to own a cruise missile for
example, so clearly the weapons themselves are the problem, and there is a
level of destructive power beyond which individuals should not be trusted.
IMHO that level should be drawn lower; everyone gets crazy or depressed
sometimes, we should reduce the potential for severe consequences.
And even an AR-15 isn't going to be much help against an oppressive
government, as the tanks roll down the street, so the whole 2nd amendment
argument seems very weak too.
~~~
chrismcb
Why do you think the "guns don't kill people" argument is broken? A gun is
merely a tool that a murder uses to kill. After the gun control act in
Australia the number of people killed didn't change much, just the method of
killing them. The problem with most gun control arguments is it ignores the
fact that someone choose to kill someone. The fact they choose to use a gun
isn't really relevant.
~~~
chrisaycock
From Australia's own crime statistics: "Homicide in Australia has declined
over the last 25 years. The current homicide incidence rate is the lowest on
record in the past 25 years."
[http://crimestats.aic.gov.au/NHMP/1_trends/](http://crimestats.aic.gov.au/NHMP/1_trends/)
~~~
CompanionCuuube
"The US is safer than ever — and Americans don’t have any idea"
America also had a decline over the last 25 years.
[https://www.vox.com/2015/5/4/8546497/crime-rate-
america](https://www.vox.com/2015/5/4/8546497/crime-rate-america)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Google Research: From Words to Concepts and Back - ot
http://googleresearch.blogspot.co.uk/2012/05/from-words-to-concepts-and-back.html
======
mark_l_watson
I am grabbing the data accompanying the blog post (<http://www-
nlp.stanford.edu/pubs/crosswikis-data.tar.bz2/>) right now. Looks to be a
great resource for text mining applications for training data, labeling text
by concept, etc.
------
lookforr
It will be even better if Google can provide search queries associated with
the Wikipedia entities.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
$50k competition to spot icebergs off the coast of Newfoundland - kirillzubovsky
http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/ship-iceberg-competition-kaggle-1.4405021
======
toomuchtodo
All ships over a certain gross tonnage or in commercial service must use AIS
to announce themselves. Seems straightforward to subtract the satellite image
objects that correlate to ships announcing themselves, leaving only icebergs
(making it cheap to submit follow up satellite image tasking requests at high
resolution to confirm).
Cool crowdsourced challenge!
Edit: Removed US Coast Guard reference, see peeters link below.
[https://www.marinetraffic.com/](https://www.marinetraffic.com/)
~~~
peeters
Not sure why US requirements are relevant to Newfoundland. Here are the
Canadian requirements:
[http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2005-134/...](http://laws-
lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-2005-134/page-5.html#h-41)
Automatic Identification Systems (AISs) 65
(2) Every ship, _other than a fishing vessel_ , of 300 tons or more that is
engaged on an international voyage shall be fitted with an AIS.
(3) Every ship, _other than a fishing vessel_ , of 500 tons or more that is
not engaged on an international voyage shall be fitted with an AIS, but if it
was constructed before July 1, 2002 it need not be so fitted until July 1,
2008.
I've emphasized the part about fishing vessels because that is particularly
relevant here. The waters around Newfoundland are huge fishing grounds.
~~~
toomuchtodo
Indeed, I should’ve grabbed the Canadian requirements. Mea culpa, I sail out
of the US.
AIS has been slowly rolling out for almost 13 years now, and is pervasive
enough that you can be fairly confident most, of not all, large ships are
announcing themselves with it. I know several blue water cruisers even with
sailboats in the 30-50ft range that have it installed to prevent “death by
cargo ship” in the middle of the night.
------
BucketSort
While the Kaggle competitions are cool for students, 50K would be a measly
amount paid to an R&D company or contractor to do such a job. I don't like the
bounty approach to data science the same way I don't like it for software
engineering.
~~~
autokad
as far as i know, most kagglers are not students, but honestly i havent seen
any data on that.
I'll speak for myself, I do it because I love trying to solve interesting
problems and I love data science.
thus far every competition I joined I learned something new and expanded my ds
code base. I also really love the fact people post kernels and discussions I
can learn from as well.
~~~
joshvm
It's very difficult to win a Kaggle comp these days, not because of technical
difficulties, but because you're up against teams of people with the resources
to try a lot more hyperparameters than you. To a certain extent you can win
with money - if you can afford to spend money on a bunch of AWS instances,
that gives you more iteration time than one person with a 1080 in their
bedroom. (So no, they're mostly not students.)
On the other hand the problem sets are 'real' and it's excellent machine
learning experience - importanly because you have the competition element, you
get an idea about how good your solution actually is.
~~~
autokad
in the zillow one, I was 41/3800, but I got over-obsessed with lb results and
the first round of home sales my rank droped to 118.
however, this was my first real kaggle competition, and I only spent a few
weeks on it, (I'd say about 3 total). it was also one of the more competitive
competitions, with a million dollars on the line.
Its exponentially difficult to move up the ranks, but I do think its realistic
to win one (though hard - as it should be). a lot of time, effort, and skills
required but not impossibly difficult.
I think kaggle would do everyone a favor if they gave out awards to more
people, instead of the winner take all mentality. at the very least, everyone
in the top 10 should win money, not just the top 3, with 1 getting the lions
share.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
U.S. Economy Sees Sharp Downturn Amid Covid-19 Crisis - OrganizedChaos
https://www.cybercoastal.com/u-s-economy-sees-sharp-downturn-amid-covid-19-crisis/
======
masonic
Plagiarized from Felix Richter's article:
[https://www.statista.com/chart/18839/quarterly-real-gdp-
grow...](https://www.statista.com/chart/18839/quarterly-real-gdp-growth-in-
the-united-states/)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
This experiment proved that anyone could design a nuclear weapon - DanielRibeiro
http://io9.com/this-experiment-proved-that-anyone-could-design-a-nucle-510618426
======
Mvandenbergh
>In the 1960s World War II was well over, and the United States and the Soviet
Union were both settling into a nice, long, cold war. Both countries were
nervous, knowing that each had designed and built nuclear weapons. At least,
though, they were the only two countries that could manage it. Nice article
but it gets the time-scales slightly wrong.
The Soviet Union tested their first device in 1949.
The United Kingdom in 1952 (and their first thermonuclear bomb in 1957).
France in 1960.
China in 1964.
So by the time this programme began, all the countries in the NPT nuclear club
already had fission bombs and at least the UK had a hydrogen bomb. The idea
was not to figure out which country would be third but just how many nuclear
powers there would be. 1967 is only one year before the first countries signed
the NPT so proliferation was clearly on everyone's mind at that time.
------
venus
Good quote from one of the comments:
>> “With modern weapons-grade uranium, the background neutron rate is so low
that terrorists, if they have such material, would have a good chance of
setting off a high-yield explosion simply by dropping one half of the material
onto the other half. Most people seem unaware that if separated HEU [Highly
Enriched Uranium] is at hand it’s a trivial job to set off a nuclear explosion
… even a high school kid could make a bomb in short order.” - Luis Alvarez,
Nobel Laureate in Physics, 1988
~~~
jlgreco
I'm not so sure that it would be quite _that_ simple. You could make the
material go supercritical like that but that doesn't necessarily get you a
high-yield explosion if the mass blows itself apart too soon.
The so called "Demon Core" went supercritical when Louis Slotin accidentally
dropped a neutron reflector onto it (this was the second time out of three
that it went critical) and although it killed him, there was no explosion per-
se.
From wikipedia: _"He quickly knocked the two halves apart, stopping the chain
reaction and likely saving the lives of the other men in the laboratory,
though it is now known that the heating of the core and shells stopped the
criticality within milliseconds of its initiation."_
~~~
sp332
It might go critical, but not supercritial. It's possible to cause a large
explosion, although not the same scale as an actual bomb, by making a reactor
using control rods and then removing the rods.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SL-1#Accident_and_response>
~~~
jlgreco
Supercriticality refers to exponential growth in the rate of fission (each
fission event in turn causing more than one additional fission event), but
unless other conditions are met then going supercritical does not mean you
actually get a nuclear bomb style explosion.
There is also the concept of prompt and delayed neutrons. Prompt neutrons are
products of the fission of the fuel, while delayed neutrons are products of
other fission products and are released shortly after the fission of fuel.
Normally nuclear reactors run prompt-subcritical, delayed critical (meaning
that each fission event causes on average less than one other fission event
with prompt neutrons, but when you account for delayed neutrons then the
average becomes one for one. The lag incurred by relying on delayed neutrons
to push you up to critical allows the system to be controlled).
During both the SL-1 accident and the second Demon Core accident, for a very
brief moment fission events were causing more than one additional fission
events with prompt neutron products. In other words they both went prompt-
critical, which _is_ a type of supercritical. Thankfully SL-1 disassembled
itself, the Demon Core rapidly heated and expanded, and neither were brought
into a supercritical configuration quickly enough. This is the fundamental
difference between what happened when the demon core went supercritical when
Louis Slotin fucked up and when it went supercritical when the they detonated
the bomb made with it over the Pacific.
_"one of the design problems to overcome in constructing a bomb is to
contract the fissile materials and achieve prompt criticality before the chain
reaction has a chance to force the core to expand. A good bomb design must
therefore win the race to a dense, prompt critical core before a less-powerful
chain reaction (known as a fizzle) disassembles the core without allowing a
significant amount of fuel to fission. "_
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prompt_critical#Nuclear_weapons>
The second demon core accident was a fizzle. It went supercritical but without
involving a significant amount of the fuel.
~~~
mpyne
Indeed, I have spent a _lot_ of time no farther than about 100 feet from an
operating nuclear reactor that was technically supercritical.
------
znowi
There's a catch. While it's trivial to design a gun-type bomb (Little Boy),
it's very difficult to produce weapon grade uranium for it. As for implosion-
type bomb (Fat Man), it's relatively easy to get a hold of plutonium, but the
design is extremely complex.
~~~
yk
> As for implosion-type bomb (Fat Man), it's relatively easy to get a hold of
> plutonium, but the design is extremely complex.
Relatively easy as in, you need a chemistry lab and a working breeder reactor.
To elaborate a bit, for Uranium the main task is isotope separation, this is
quite complicated since different Uranium isotopes are chemically identical
and have a mass difference of just 1%. On the other hand, more or less all
plutonium isotopes are fissile, and the task is to chemically separate them
from other elements. ( And that one needs to work with spend nuclear fuel.) On
the other hand, Plutonium does not occur naturally, so one needs a breeder
reactor to produce it first.
~~~
DennisP
But Pu240 undergoes a lot of spontaneous fission, and if you have too much of
it your bomb will fizzle. Pu238 generates a lot of decay heat, which makes it
great for NASA missions but not so great for bombs. For a while it was used in
pacemakers.
Bombs are generally made from fairly pure Pu239, which can be made by
bombarding U238 with neutrons. But if you leave the plutonium in the reactor,
you get a mix of isotopes that's pretty much useless for bombs. Separating the
isotopes is harder then enriching uranium.
For these reasons, nuclear waste from reactors, even with reprocessing, isn't
actually much of a proliferation concern.
~~~
yk
These problems are discussed in considerable detail in [1], specifically:
While reactor grade plutonium would probably be of no
interest to a nation with access to better grade
material, it could be effectively used by a nation
capable of good weapon design, but without access to
better fissile material. Even a low technology nation
could fashion powerful weapons from it, after all even
a 1 kt device greatly exceeds the destruction of any
conventional weapon.
So yes, recognized nuclear states are using very pure Pu239, but this is done
for engineering convenience and not an absolute necessity. And the calculation
probably changes for a state with a clandestine nuclear program, since it is
much easier to hide the additional computing capacity to make a working
reactor grade plutonium design, than it is to hide a breeder reactor.
[1] <http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Nwfaq/Nfaq6.html> (In section _6.2.2.10
Reactor Grade Plutonium_ )
~~~
DennisP
From that section of your link: "Using this material in a bomb would be a
challenge. Continual active cooling would be needed to prevent deterioration
and damage to the core, explosives, and other components. The high rate of
neutron emission means that predetonation is inevitable, even with a very
efficient implosion system. However, even the relatively primitive Fat Man
design would have produced a 0.5 kt or so yield with this material. With
optimal implosion design yields in the range of at least several kilotons are
possible. If fusion boosting is used, then the adverse effects properties of
reactor grade plutonium can be completely overcome"
Yield restricted to a couple kilotons is generally considered a fizzle. It's
big compared to chemical explosives but only about a tenth as big as
Hiroshima. And the experiment in OP's article only talked about making a
working bomb, not an optimal one.
The point on fusion is interesting, though. It might be worth repeating the
experiment for thermonuclear bomb designs.
------
randallsquared
There's a book from the 70s, _The Curve of Binding Energy_, by John McPhee,
which is about how easy it was at that time to acquire weapons-grade materials
and design and build a device. I found it pretty interesting.
Of course, I read it in the 1980s, and here we are in the 2010s, and there's
never been a private nuclear explosion of any kind, nor apparently any nuclear
blackmail. That says something about either difficulty, or about how effective
(covert?) non-proliferation efforts have been, or about how rare is the desire
to use a nuclear weapon. Not sure which.
------
chr15p
I think the article is pretty misleading given that the British carried out
their first nuclear bomb test in 1952 and the French in 1960, it was pretty
obvious already that other countries could build a bomb.
Reading the original report they assumed a reactor capable of producing
plutonium was available so I'd say the real reasons for the experiment is to
answer questions like, "if we sell countries reactors how big a step would it
be for them to build a bomb". Given smart (but not Einstein smart) trained
physicists with access to the publicly available literature, the answer they
come to is 3 man years. Thats for an implosion device, a gun design would have
been "finished much sooner".
Reading between the lines I guess there was also an element of trying to
figure out how much of other countries nuclear programmes was based on
espionage (the British were partners in the Manhattan Project, and the Soviets
had had several spies there). They conclude that "its not surprising China has
progressed so rapidly".
Finally its also worth noting that the reviewers were less confident in the
design then the scientists were, they dont say it wouldn't work, just that it
would need testing to work out the kinks (which the designers also say they
just seem to expect less bugs :)
------
6d0debc071
There's a more in-depth article on this here:
<http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/jun/24/usa.science>
I suppose the reassuring thing is that it took two fairly smart people a
significant amount of time, and that was without management giving them too
much agro, and with the ability to run experiments more or less as they
pleased via asking their supervisors to run the tests and getting the results
back.
'They were to explain at length, on paper, what part of their developing
design they wanted to test, and they would pass it, through an assigned lab
worker, into Livermore's restricted world. Days later, the results would come
back - though whether as the result of real tests or hypothetical
calculations, they would never know.'
(Quote taken from the Guardian article.)
------
floatingatoll
The appendix from the scientists documenting where they learned various things
is a thrilling read.
And, TIL that you should not use classified material as a paperweight.
"Marv Williamson (whose office was just down the hall from us) kept an
interesting paperweight on his desk.
[REDACTED: several hundred words, presumably describing it.]
We still have no idea what it really is because we don't want to ask! It was
probably because we found it here in the Laboratory that we were led to
speculate about it in the first place."
~~~
VLM
Its an interesting trivia question. One of Feynman's many autobiographical
books described how they had spheres and hemispheres of all manner of crazy
stuff to test neutron flux and explosive lens issues. He specifically
mentioned gold and silver, because normally it would be pretty insane to have
giant lumps of that stuff laying around, but given the level of perceived
security, using a hemisphere of solid 24kt gold as a desk paperweight isn't so
crazy after all. Its probably more secure on his desk than in a normal bank
vault or merely ft knox or whatever.
------
msandford
As is the case in many fields, designing != building.
For example I ride bikes. A friend of mine designed a bike for me. But since
neither of us could (at the time) weld, I had to pay someone else to assemble
it.
Just because you can design a bomb that would work doesn't mean you'd have the
ability to actually build it. Even if you were given refined uranium (and
that's 80% of the job) there's still quite a lot of work to tolerance
everything correctly, machine it all without killing yourself, assemble it,
procure the primary explosives, put together a precise enough detonation
system to allow the chain reaction to happen and then build a system to
trigger the detonation. All of that is no joke.
~~~
alan_cx
All I know is what I read in Tom Clancy's Sum of All Fears, which has a hell
of a lot of detail about building a nuclear bomb. The thing that struck me was
all the very high precision machining required, and how hard that was to
achieve.
As you suggest, design principle, easy, actually engineering it is the tricky
bit.
~~~
wtracy
Plutonium is harder to machine that other metals, as it's density tends to be
non-uniform: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plutonium#Allotropes>
You go along milling a hard spot, then hit a soft spot and--oops! You took off
too much.
------
jd007
The hardest part of making a nuclear weapon is acquiring weapons grade (highly
enriched) uranium and/or plutonium. The actual designing/making of the bomb
itself is relatively trivial compared to the materials enrichment process (you
can easily find detailed diagrams of good bomb designs online).
~~~
caf
Even at the time of the Manhattan Project, the vast majority of the cost,
facilities and workers on the project were involved in creating the
fissionable materials rather than the better-known design work at Los Alamos.
Remember that even then, they were confident enough in the gun-type Little Boy
design that they didn't even need to test it.
------
CapitalistCartr
Building a nuke requires purified uranium or plutonium. Making that is a
massive industrial operation. Then comes casting, machining, etc. Only a
determined nation-state has a chance of success, in spite of movies. Given
that, design hasn't been a obstacle for decades.
~~~
cpleppert
Design is still a major obstacle for advanced multi-stage hydrogen bombs. How
they work exactly is still a major secret that isn't public knowledge AFAIK.
~~~
venus
Yeah, but you don't need that to get people's attention. Any nuclear bomb at
all is a Big Deal.
~~~
gizmo686
If your going for attention you don't even need to go critical. A dirty bomb
should be enough for that.
------
dbbolton
Seriously misleading title. It seems to me that this particular experiment did
_not_ prove that "anyone could make a nuclear bomb". Rather, it demonstrated
that a group of highly-educated physicists, when provided with the necessary
resources and enough time, could develop one.
I sincerely doubt that reading this study would lead one to conclude that a
member of a hunter-gatherer tribe could do the same. Perhaps "anyone" should
have been substituted with "any industrialized country" in the title.
------
rosser
Fortunately, designing one doesn't mean you'll successfully build one, and
building one doesn't mean you'll have something that actually works.
~~~
phaemon
I'm guessing the fact that it was a design for a "working atomic bomb" (from
the article) is the bit that means you'd "have something that actually works."
~~~
pyre
The generic design might be something that works, but if you don't account for
materials, tolerances, etc that are associated with the building of the
device, it could be broken.
------
dmead
covered by the guardian 6 years ago
<http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/jun/24/usa.science>
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nth_Country_Experiment>
thanks bloggers!
~~~
ChrisClark
Yes, you're right. Because it has been talked about before we should never
talk about it again. Makes sense to me. ;)
~~~
lostlogin
These seems to be a growing trend whereby general interest stories and
articles have someone calling them out as not hacking, not allowed (they are),
or dismissing them as discussed some time ago. If people up vote and its
within the guidelines isn't that all that matters?
------
ommunist
That was 60-ies. I wonder about results of this would-be nuke design these
days. I have a clue that current physics grads are unable to produce anything
like their granddads did when it comes to nukes.
------
brokenparser
'Course, there's an Emacs command to do that.
------
agnaseginoseg
Probably are a few out there in private hands.
:-/
~~~
derleth
There are few things in the world as useless as a nuclear weapon nobody else
knows you have. All of the game theory, and _that_ is where the advantage
comes from, derives from the fact people will go to extremes to keep
themselves from getting nuked even once. Keeping a Doomsday Device a secret
defeats the whole point.
~~~
Nrsolis
And yet Israel has a policy of not confirming or denying they have a working
weapon, although everyone _knows_ they do.
------
tete
I think a lot of these things are whether you _want_ to. It's just like people
do the impossible with strong will and when there is a complete lack of will
they simply never will. And building weapons and military infrastructure was
something the US always wanted - something they learned, because they learned
war, weapons and military brings money, power and a form of social
infrastructure, while still being able to call it non-socialist. Those are all
benefits. Hope that doesn't sound negative, but as a matter of fact the US has
really much power, especially with their agencies and real problems with
preventing enemy nations from building atomic bombs.
On the other hands smaller countries, like Lichtenstein, Luxembourg, Monaco,
Austria, ... probably have the resources, monetary and scientifically (else
they could buy them), but have a complete lack of interest, just like the
ordinary physics student has a complete lack of interest. In fact I even know
someone with a startup who is really scared of their technology being used for
weapons and he does everything to prevent this (they make amazing drones and
Hollywood and stuff are already really interested, cause it has a camera that
allows to make pictures/films that could not be done before). He also lost
friends because they got into military stuff - like they were killed.
Anyway, this article states that these were people who studied physics and
were not into weapons and did only use public information, but that's really
far from reality of someone who would target and have the real will to create
a nuclear weapon. Many circumstances would most likely be way better for
someone who really wants to.
Now one can do some research on this topic, but the US, kinda as part of their
military system also has a huge army when it comes to agencies and invests
like an unlimited amount of money into them, so it can pretty much flood
Iranian science institutions with agents. I mean, they often had agents that
got into way higher political positions than they intended and stuff like
that. And military spending is just extreme in the US (look it up on Wikipedia
if you haven't seen the figures yet).
So basically nuclear weapons are a lot about will, but also fear. I mean
looking at the world and how the official US tends to act a lot of states that
could have interests in such weapons doesn't want to, cause it would result
into a nearly automatic invasion, be it by agents or military from the US.
Okay, I don't know how hard it really is. I mean according to the US the Iran
was really close (weeks/months away) from the atomic bomb since the eighties
or so. I don't know what stopped them, whether it really just were agents or
whether there were other reasons, but given these facts and how much the Iran
(according to the US! (not saying you can trust the other side more though))
wants this weapons there has to be more than a bit of cyber war, which really
was more like public "look how cool we are" thing. I mean they put in agents
there to place that worm and I am pretty sure he could have done many things
and they just did it for the public.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Escher – Build beautiful interactive Web UIs in Julia - Lofkin
https://shashi.github.io/Escher.jl/
======
benhamner
Beautiful! Appears inspired by RStudio's Shiny
[http://shiny.rstudio.com/](http://shiny.rstudio.com/)
~~~
FractalNerve
I'm currently working a lot with Matlab and seeing a beauty like Escher for
Julia is all I could wish for. Great work!!
It reminds me a little about Elm, I'm not sure what's missing in Escher over
Elm's features, but that's another story.
~~~
g0wda
Hello! I wrote Escher. Thanks!
Reactive.jl which Escher depends on for interaction was entirely inspired by
Elm! I think the main difference between Elm is that Elm is currently a
client-only compile-to-JS language. Escher, otoh runs on the server and
compiles to Virtual DOM instead of JS. The Virtual DOM can include custom HTML
elements, I use Polymer extensively, and have a few elements of my own for
doing things like event capture, websocket communication, sampling events etc.
see [https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/julia-
users/UEaYPlBu...](https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/julia-
users/UEaYPlBuIkc) for a _brief_ description of how it works.
------
dang
Although
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9650438](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9650438)
had significant attention recently, this post seems different enough that I
think we can not count it as a dupe.
~~~
ibdknox
They don't appear to be related. The previous discussion was about replicating
an Escher style drawing in Julia. This is about a web framework for Julia that
just happens to be named Escher :)
~~~
dang
The username in the url is the same, so presumably they're by the same person?
~~~
g0wda
Yup. :)
------
curiouslearn
This looks really amazing. Thank you Shashi.
Does this need Julia 0.4?
A very minor comment - In the markdown example, you need to add "Interpolate
\KaTeX" in the input (it is there in the output but not in the input).
------
gjm11
The plotting examples on that page work for me in Chrome but not in Firefox
(version 38.0.5 on Windows 8.1, if it matters).
------
tempodox
Almost makes me drool. If only Julia could produce stand-alone executables!
~~~
tadlan
That is on the roadmap
~~~
tempodox
So it was said a year ago.
~~~
Lofkin
It is already possible to some degree:
[https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/issues/9973](https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/issues/9973)
More robust support starts with package precompilation which is slated to go
into 0.4
[https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/pull/11426](https://github.com/JuliaLang/julia/pull/11426)
------
jtth
Huh. I actually saw the stylesheet load over the page layout.
------
spacko
Escher? Why not Gödel ... or Wittgenstein ... or Kant?
Then again Bauer, Müller or Becker would be just as appropriate, wouldn't it?
~~~
mkempe
Indeed, a note explaining why it's named Escher would be appropriate.
~~~
spacko
Well, Escher's pictures are sophisticated and "beautiful" \- I guess that's
why
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Programmer's Bill of Rights - roachsocal
http://victorgarcia.me/programmers-bill-of-rights/
======
eplanit
I really want to _not_ criticize this post. It's from a new programmer who is
early in his career. He has a lot to learn -- so did all of us at that stage.
I'm not trying to be condescending.
I must, however, shout a 'whoa' at one point: "Programmers shall have the
right to...be treated as professionals"
That is never a right. One has a right to be treated respectfully.
Professionalism is something you must build into yourself, it's something to
earn. When you conduct yourself professionally, you will be treated as a
professional. It's not granted by title or circumstance.
Here's to a great career for you.
~~~
vgarcia1586
The right is earned, I completely agree. However, the point that I wanted to
make is that a lot of programmers earn their right to be treated
professionally by doing all of the right things, but aren't.
~~~
hga
Without the guild like systems that e.g. doctors, lawyers and civil engineers
have, I don't think we'll see it. And even then, doctors and lawyers come in
for a lot of abuse, don't they?
I very much don't want the barriers to entry that come with guilds. Maybe for
some life and death critical domains like flight software and a lot of medical
areas, but it would be insane for the sort of consumer web sites this forum is
particularly focused on (well, beside leaking customer financial data...).
E.g. we _really_ need to get serious about radiation treatment machines,
seeing as how we're now into the second round of disasters, you would have
thought the Therac-25 would have taught people their lessons....
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ubuntu made in CSS = Mind-Blown - gdi2290
http://www.ubuntu.com/tour/en/#
======
tejask
This is awesome!
~~~
gdi2290
my thoughts exactly
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Qualcomm Said to Seek U.S. Import Ban for iPhones - niftich
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-05-03/qualcomm-said-to-seek-u-s-import-ban-for-iphones
======
PhantomGremlin
Dumb move by Qualcomm. They just put a bullet thru the head of any remaining
modem business they had with Apple.
But maybe it had already reached that point? Qualcomm might already have lost
all further modem design wins with Apple? So now they have nothing to lose by
shifting to the ITC to battle exclusively on the patent front?
~~~
quickben
Arguably a dumber move was by Apple's CEO when he decided he just isn't going
to pay anything (disregarding the fact they already signed a contract).
[https://finance.yahoo.com/news/apple-ceo-tim-cook-
withholdin...](https://finance.yahoo.com/news/apple-ceo-tim-cook-withholding-
royalties-owed-qualcomm-230913988.html)
Guess twice which way is ITC going to lean now.
It will be fairly interesting to see how this develops.
~~~
tiredwired
I think the company with $260 billion will win.
~~~
tooltalk
based on Appple's past lawsuits with Nokia, Ericsson, etc, Apple for the most
part ended up paying up after a brief licensing renegotiation dance.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why Apple’s Frightened of Female Sexuality - lkrubner
http://www.twinfinite.net/2014/06/08/apples-orgasms-female-sexuality-frightens-apple/
======
mwfunk
I came very close to missing the fact that there was a page 2 here, but to
anyone that wants to read the whole thing: there's a page 2.
I strongly agree with much of what the author is saying here, but she may be
reading too much into the fate of this particular pair of apps ("never
attribute to malice...", etc.). I mean this as a nit and not the dreaded
"middlebrow dismissal". :) The saving grace of the piece is that her thesis is
more about attitudes towards sexuality in general; this particular incident
only provides a convenient example.
------
Infinitesimus
Article doesn't properly address the headline. Apple's rejection could be the
same for a game about male masturbation.
------
a2tech
Are there app's available teaching men to masturbate? If there are, then she
has a complaint. If there aren't, she doesn't have much ground to stand on.
~~~
x0x0
As mentioned in the article, rack stare [1] is in the app store. So
masturbation bad, sexual harassment good?
[1] [https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/rack-
stare/id385786751?mt=8](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/rack-
stare/id385786751?mt=8)
~~~
phillmv
Let's get on a more basic level, even.
Which of the two apps is more pornographic? The cutesy anthropomorphized
vagina giving anatomical lessons, or the game that rewards you for staring at
cleavage?
~~~
bjz_
Please read the entirety of the article, including page two (which is
unfortunately easy to miss). There she writes:
> I’ll acknowledge that, although disgusting and possibly dangerous, Rack
> Stare caters to a certain market. The real problem is there aren’t many
> alternatives to this construction of sexuality
------
neves
Hey Apple, approve the App!!! If I had a teen daughter, I would buy it for
her. Everybody else: read till the second page.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: What are your favorite board games? - martian
Hackers tend to have great taste in board games, especially ones involving complex strategy. So, what games do you like to play?
======
andy_wrote
I can't believe that I'm the first to mention One Night Ultimate Werewolf,
which has been the consensus favorite amongst my friends for a while now.
It has relatively simple rules but very solid strategy (rewards logic and
duplicity). The games are short, so you never feel "stuck" on a long game and
when you're a beginner, you can rapidly absorb new lessons and strategies and
apply them to the next round. The replay value is tremendous.
I have observed/heard about the game not "clicking" for some players the first
few times. You _can_ reason out substantial amounts of information by sharing
claims and thinking hard about what you personally know, and you _can_
tactically disrupt other people. I think if you have a crowd of new people, it
helps to have an experienced player sit out one round and emcee, encouraging
certain lines of thought and discouraging others. One of my friends said he
only really "got" it after the third round, when he saw me spin a story from
start to finish so that I could pin a wolf on someone when I in fact was a
wolf.
I also love Dominion, which others have mentioned. (That's my personal
favorite; Werewolf is my friend group-favorite.) It is in a very different
genre, but it also has fast-cycling games, deep strategy vs. simple rules, and
huge replay value, which are three aspects of board games that I really value.
~~~
k__
Is it better than regular werewolf?
We play this all the time, but it's a bit ugly for people who get out on the
first night.
I talk trash most of the time so some people just kill me on the first round
because they want their peace :D
~~~
andy_wrote
I've never played regular Werewolf, unless you are referring to what I know of
as the informal party game Mafia (several nights, one killer, several
townspeople, maybe one or two additional roles who get special abilities).
In that case, yes much better:
\- Everyone is involved start to finish, and a free phone app serves as the
emcee.
\- People receive cards with (usually) unique roles that furnish them some
special information in their own way. I think some Mafia variants have minor
special roles, but the makers of ONUW really did a good job thinking of
creative ones.
\- Many roles involve moving cards around at night, so when you wake up you
usually don't know for sure whether you're still the role you thought you
were, or whether a card you saw at night is still where it was when you saw
it.
------
litghost
Hard to go wrong with Baduk/Go. Doesn't really scale to groups though.
Terra Mystica[0] and Tzolk'in[1] are both low randomness worker placement game
that require long term planning and fun mechanics.
If war-games are more your speed, Diplomacy[2] and Twilight Imperium 3rd Ed[3]
are some of the best in class. Both take all day (or more if you play
Diplomacy by mail). I personally like Exocus: Proxima Centauri[4] a lot in
this genre.
[0] [https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/120677/terra-
mystica](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/120677/terra-mystica)
[1] [https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/126163/tzolk-mayan-
calen...](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/126163/tzolk-mayan-calendar)
[2]
[https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/483/diplomacy](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/483/diplomacy)
[3] [https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/12493/twilight-
imperium-...](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/12493/twilight-imperium-
third-edition)
[4] [https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/122842/exodus-proxima-
ce...](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/122842/exodus-proxima-centauri)
~~~
valarauca1
Baduk/Go doesn't scale well in groups but it also can impart a lot of
important life lessons as you learn it.
The enemy's key point is yours
Beware of going back to patch up
Don't chase what you can't kill
Check escape routes first
Big dragons never die
Give your opponent what they want
Don't follow proverbs blindly
[http://senseis.xmp.net/?GoProverbs](http://senseis.xmp.net/?GoProverbs)
------
Dobbs
\- Codenames is a great party game. Easy to teach and works really well in
larger groups. It is a word association game. One person gives a hint and the
their team tries to guess all the right words on the board without hitting any
of the other teams word, or the bomb that causes your team to instantly lose.
\- Splendor another easy to teach game. 2-4 players its quick to play, around
20 minutes a game.
\- Roll for the Galaxy. A much more complicated game although probably medium
in complexity as far as the board game spectrum goes. You get to roll lots of
dice.
\- Dead of Winter. A story based secret information game. Everyone has a
secret goal, and someone _might_ be a traitor trying to sabotage the colony.
Despite this you have to work as a team to try and survive the zombie
apocalypse.
------
JoshTriplett
Hanabi: multi-player co-op, and you can see everyone's cards but your own. All
about reasoning and inference.
Betrayal at House on the Hill: cooperative until it isn't, with a traitor
arising halfway through the game. Many novel "haunt" scenarios for replay
value.
Coup: Bluffing game, where you have a couple of hidden "role" cards, each role
card has some abilities, but you can use the abilities of any role as a bluff,
if another player doesn't call you on it.
Netrunner (note, _not_ the new remake, the old out-of-print version): CCG with
asymmetric sides, the "runner" trying to break in and the "corporation" trying
to defend and advance their agenda.
Ascension: deckbuilding game with a large variety of cards. There are only 1-3
of any given card in the deck; every game tends to turn out differently, and
any strategy has to adapt to the available cards.
Dixit: Interesting exercise in description, because you have to hint at the
image on your card without being spot-on, so that _some_ but not _all_ players
get it. Helps to know the other players.
And if you don't already watch Tabletop, I recommend it:
[https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4F80C7D2DC8D9B6C](https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4F80C7D2DC8D9B6C)
. (Note: that playlist is sorted in reverse order, for some reason; start at
the bottom.)
That's in addition to various tabletop RPGs, which I find even more fun when
we can get a group together for them.
~~~
andy_wrote
I'll second Hanabi. In addition to being inherently very fun, collaborative
games are a great way to bring in people who aren't as into board games and
are worried about getting stomped on by experienced players.
An interesting and much more challenging variation for experienced Hanabi
players is to disallow people from saying a number or color. You point to a
set of cards in another player's hand and that's it. Those cards share some
attribute, and all the other cards in the hand don't have that attribute,
whatever it is.
~~~
JoshTriplett
> An interesting and much more challenging variation for experienced Hanabi
> players is to disallow people from saying a number or color. You point to a
> set of cards in another player's hand and that's it. Those cards share some
> attribute, and all the other cards in the hand don't have that attribute,
> whatever it is.
Interesting! That breaks so many common reasoning rules, especially if you're
playing multicolor. I can see how that would add a huge amount of challenge.
I'd be interested to see some of the reasoning based on that variant.
------
thearn4
Simpler than many I expect to see listed here, but I'm a pretty big fan of
Dominion. If the cards are always picked randomly, each play of the game is
very different.
~~~
JoshTriplett
I used to enjoy Dominion, but it can become very mechanical. For any given set
of 10 cards, you usually want to ignore all but a few of them.
~~~
ng12
For a while each successive expansion was getting more and more powerful
action cards to address this issue. Not sure if they followed that trend past
Prosperity though.
~~~
JoshTriplett
That doesn't solve the problem. For any given set of 10 cards, there's an
optimal strategy, and it typically involves relatively few of the cards. And
some cards are effectively _never_ worth touching in any game.
------
piercebot
I really enjoy Agricola[0], because there are no elements of chance in the
game, only strategy. It's also a little more approachable to people averse to
conflict-focused games, because the only victory condition is "everybody has
taken all their turns"
[0]
[https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/31260/agricola](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/31260/agricola)
~~~
Pelerin
If you like Agricola, I recommend Caverna. Sort of a spiritual sequel to the
game, and done better in my opinion, which is saying a lot because Agricola
was one of my favorites.
~~~
egru
I find Caverna lacks in replayability. My group played it a couple times and
everyone started doing the same thing. Eventually we just migrated back to
Agricola. Haven't touched Caverna in over a year.
------
Pelerin
My family plays a lot of board games. Most recently we've been playing:
\- Concordia
[https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/124361/concordia](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/124361/concordia)
\- Istanbul
[https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/148949/istanbul](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/148949/istanbul)
\- Lanterns [https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/160851/lanterns-
harvest-...](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/160851/lanterns-harvest-
festival)
\- Codenames
[https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/178900/codenames](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/178900/codenames)
(this last one is more of a lighthearted party game, but still great fun)
------
caylorme
\- Settlers of Catan: Cities and Knights \- Caracassonne \- Blokus \- Chess \-
Risk (Luxor, complex maps) \- Aquire
~~~
martian
Curious why you specify the Cities and Knights expansion?
~~~
pimlottc
For me, it adds a good source of tension (barbarians) and competition
(knights, defending or not), without being direct PvP combat. It also adds a
variety of different special actions through progress cards (which replace
development cards). Perhaps it adds a bit more randomness but it's fun to be
able to drop a "power move" with a well-timed play of cards.
------
BooneJS
My wife and I have 2 elementary school aged children, and we like playing
Pandemic[0].
[0]:
[https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/30549/pandemic](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/30549/pandemic)
------
mdturnerphys
After hearing about Rithmomachy/Rithmomachia on HN six months ago [1,2], I
recently laser-cut a board and set to try it out with. It sounds rather
tedious from the description, but actually was pretty enjoyable. A nice
feature is that the difficulty is very scalable--once you find a set of rules
([3] is one source), you can decide how many of them to actually follow before
starting the game.
[1]
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11003320](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11003320)
[2]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rithmomachy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rithmomachy)
[3]
[http://www.gamecabinet.com/rules/Rithmomachia.html](http://www.gamecabinet.com/rules/Rithmomachia.html)
~~~
egru
Agricola
Twilight Imperium
Through the Ages
Terra Mystica
Suburbia
7 Wonders
Lords of Waterdeep
------
DanBC
I prefer simple games at the moment, so Carcassone, Bohnanza, and Lost Cities
are currently my favourite.
But I've also enjoyed playing Puerto Rico, Dominion, Race to the Galaxy, among
others.
Ticket to Ride is great with my family, because of the player interaction.
------
wilwade
El Grande is an older, but great game.
The re-release of Elfenland just came out "Elfenroads" is a great buy.
[http://riograndegames.com/Game/1295-Elfenroads](http://riograndegames.com/Game/1295-Elfenroads)
There are others, but I'll let others pick their favorites. P.S Not a strategy
game, but Concept has hit the table a lot for us with lots of different types
if people.
------
roryisok
My all time favourite is heroquest. I played that game (and it's counterpart,
space crusade) to death in my youth, and then some more. Recently I've started
making my own games for kicks, roughly based off the ruleset but with
different themes. I made a zombie survival game and a space pirate adventure
thing. Making board games is now my New favourite game
------
IdahoEv
By category:
1) Heavy Strategy: Eclipse and Terra Mystica (tie)
2) Strategy Cardgame: Race for the Galaxy & expansions
3) Abstract: Arimaa. Runner up: tie between Go and Hive.
4) Real-Time Co-op: Damage Report. Runner up: Space Alert
5) Co-Op: Mysterium
6) Wargame: War of the Ring. Runner up: Twilight Struggle
7) CCG or LCG: Lord of the Rings LCG
8) Party Game: Time's Up Title Recall Runner up: Concept
9) Reaction time: Jungle Speed.
10) Most _disliked_ game: Catan or any spinoff thereof
~~~
IdahoEv
Forgot one:
11) Social Deduction: Two Rooms and a Boom
------
anotherevan
Backgammon.
It's a good metaphor for life. You have to weigh up probabilities and likely
outcomes, know when to take a risk and when to play safe. Sometimes the other
player plays better than you, sometimes worse, and sometimes the dice just
come along and kick your arse.
------
Symbiote
Strategy games which are simple to explain, but allow skilled players to
compete without getting bored.
Go, Scrabble, chess... What modern games are like this?
Or, silly games where losing doesn't matter, it's fun anyway. My current
favourites are Space Alert and Galaxy Trucker.
~~~
vinchuco
I commented it below too, but then I read your comment. I've found Hive is
very enjoyable for a chess player (myself) since the strategy is different as
the board is the pieces. If you want more level of skill, Terra Mystica was
also very strategic balancing territory and resource control.
------
bostik
At the top my list, even if it might not technically be a board game: Mah-
Jong. The most complex part of the game tends to be the scoring, and agreeing
on a set of rule variants your entire gaming group don't object to.
After that, Scrabble and Puerto Rico.
------
guiseroom
Quelf is always a good time. [https://www.amazon.com/Spin-Master-
Games-20053371-Quelf/dp/B...](https://www.amazon.com/Spin-Master-
Games-20053371-Quelf/dp/B008N6KJMC)
~~~
roryisok
+1 for Quelf, lots of fun with a group of people
------
GavinMcG
Escape from the Aliens in Outer Space [0] – you can get a print-and-play
edition for a buck fifty!
[0]
[http://www.escapefromthealiensinouterspace.com/](http://www.escapefromthealiensinouterspace.com/)
------
apjana
Chess
~~~
vinchuco
And hive
------
lackbeard
My favorites: Power Grid, Terra Mystica, Dominion, Race for the Galaxy.
------
lefstathiou
1\. Settlers of Catan (with expansions) 2\. Axis & Allies (standard edition)
3\. Chess 4\. Cranium 5\. Scrabble 6\. Monopoly (with modified rules that
makes the game last about an hour)
~~~
eitland
A lot of people around here would do well just to _read_ the official rules
carefully and _follow_ them.
------
w00dy73
All time favorite: Risk (especially Risk Legacy)
Others: Settlers of Catan, Ticket to ride, Dominion, Kingdom Builder,
Civilization
------
IgorPartola
I really enjoy Resistance, but you have to have the right group of people for
it.
------
nappy-doo
Top games:
1) Cosmic Encounter. Plays 3-8 (best with 4-6), about 90 minutes. It's a
negotiation game where each person has an asymmetric way they alone can break
the rules. Cosmic is a strange game where the entire game takes place off the
table, but you use the table to keep track of what's happening in the game.
The first one or two times you play, you probably won't understand how deep
and subtle the game is, but stick with it.
([https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/39463/cosmic-
encounter](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/39463/cosmic-encounter))
2) Memoir '44\. 2 Player, as written plays in about 30 minutes, but typically
we switch sides between rounds, so 60 minutes. Light WWII war game. Lots of
expansions (Russians, Japanese, British armies), and lots of ways to play
(expansions allow up to 8 players). This game is just so much fun if you dig
the WWII theme.
([https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/10630/memoir-44](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/10630/memoir-44))
3) Kemet. 3-5 players, about 90-120 minutes (depending on player count).
"Dudes on a map" war game with excellent fighting mechanics. Very well
balanced, with every player being able to attack all other players. Fun little
monsters you can buy in the game.
([https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/127023/kemet](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/127023/kemet))
4) Railways of the World. 2-6 players (depending on the map), 60-120 minutes
(depending on the map). Nice railway game. Simple rules (about 10 minutes to
explain), but just a great game.
([https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/17133/railways-
world](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/17133/railways-world))
5) Star Wars Rebellion. 2 players, 90 minutes to 270. Thematic Star Wars game.
Imperial player tries to find the rebel base, while the rebels just need to
last long enough to have their cause take hold in the galaxy. Incredibly well
balanced, despite the asymmetry between the players.
([https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/187645/star-wars-
rebelli...](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/187645/star-wars-rebellion))
6) Party games: Love Letter, Codenames, Wits & Wagers, Can't Stop. All are
great games. One game, For Sale, deserves special mention because it explains
so fast, but has such depth.
7) Eclipse. 2-9 players (best with 3-5), takes about 45-60 min/player. 4X game
where you explore the galaxy and try to accumulate the most points through
science, research, economy, battles, negotiations, and exploration. You should
buy the Rise of the Ancients expansion to fix a subtly broken part of the game
dealing with missiles.
That's just off the top of my head. Last night I played Patchwork and
Quadropolis. Patchwork might be a great game -- too early to tell, and
Quadropolis is fun, and likely worth the money, but I don't think has the
staying power of some others.
------
chvid
Backgammon
------
jtacon
Splendor
------
9214
Zertz and Tzaar from GIPF project.
------
kamilszybalski
absolutely settlers of catan
------
Al-Khwarizmi
In my group of friends we have more than 50 games, most of them involving
complex strategy (as we do like that). Here is a list of my personal top 10:
1) Shogun. Archetypical Risk-like game of moving soldiers and conquering
provinces, but with a unique twist that makes it outstanding in my view:
instead of dice, it uses a cube tower to generate randomness. The outcome of
fights is based in the number of cubes from each player that come out of the
tower. If you get bad luck in a battle (because your cubes stay inside) then
the tower will be loaded in your favor for the next battles (those hidden
cubes can come out at any moment). I love this because, although I think some
randomness is good in strategic battle games to spice things up and so that
the game doesn't turn a chess-like prediction game, I don't like the winner
being dependent on luck. The tower introduces randomness, but guarantees that
no one will be too lucky or unlucky, which is great. Combine with a setting in
feudal Japan, complete with rice farming and starving populace revolving
against you, and you get an amazing game.
2) Imperial 2030. Another typical Risk-like game of moving soldiers and taking
countries... except that it's not. You don't control the empires themselves,
instead you are a banker that buys each empire's bonds. At a given point in
the game, the banker that holds more bonds for a particular empire is the one
controlling its politics. So maybe right now I control China, but I know that
you have a lot of cash and are looking at Chinese bonds with greedy eyes, so I
send the Chinese army on an unnecessarily painful military campaign to wither
down its power in case you are going to control it in the next turn. This
makes for awesome mechanics in a really strategic game. By the way, it doesn't
have any random elements at all, so it's a good game if you are against that.
3) Galaxy Trucker. This game is great due to its sheer concept... first you
use pieces from a scrapyard (competing for the pieces with the other players)
to build a spaceship with its cannons, shields, cargo holds, etc. and then all
of you have to fly them in a journey littered with space pirates, meteorites
than can tear off pieces of your ship, merchant planets, smugglers and more.
The feeling when one of your rival ships is tore in two by a meteorite is
unbeatable.
4) Star Wars: Imperial Assault. When a friend of mine got this game, I thought
"they have the Star Wars franchise so it will probably be a crappy game - they
will sell anyway". But no. It's actually a very good tactics game with lots of
choices, characters with very different styles, special abilities, and a set
of rules that (albeit unspecified at times) go very well together.
5) Robo Rally. A classic from Richard Garfield, the guy that brought you MtG.
OK, maybe this doesn't fit that much into "complex strategy", but it's also a
game that hackers should like because it's about programming after all! You
have to program your robot with randomly-dealt cards to try and survive pits,
traps and the other robots' lasers. A huge strong point of this game is that
the maps and missions are hugely customizable, supporting different sets of
rules like races, capture the flag, deathmatch, and others that you can come
up with. It supports up to 8 players, you can build different maps putting
together map boards, and there are editors online to print your own map
boards, so it's the ultimate customizable game. I think it's out of print but
a new edition has been announced, although it only supports 6 players sadly.
6) Carcassone. One of the best known modern board games, together with Catan.
But while Catan is IMHO too shallow and too random, featuring few meaningful
decisions, in Carcassone every tile you place is a meaningful decision. The
experience is very different in 2-player games (much more offensive) than in
games with more players. Some expansions (the builder, the granary and pig,
the mayor, the resources, etc.) really enhance the game although others are
prescindible.
7) Discworld Ankh Morpork. A deception game: you have to work towards your
goal and the other characters don't know what it is. You don't have to know
Discworld to like it (one of my friends hasn't read any of the books and loves
it). Drawback: unbalanced, it's easier to win with some characters than
others. If you care much about that, it's probably not your game.
8) Goblins Inc. Similar mechanic to Galaxy Trucker (probably inspired on it),
but with goblins that build robots of doom instead of spaceships, and with
direct combat. Contrary to Galaxy Trucker, it's team-based (2v2) but it also
gives you the possibility of being a traitor to your partner. Less flexible
than Galaxy Trucker (this one only really works with 4 players) but loads of
fun!
9) Power Grid. A classic game where you have to build a power network. Lots of
strategy and decisions, although the beginning depends too much on player
location and the endgame turns a bit too much into an arithmetic-fest counting
to the last nickel IMO.
10) Escape from the Aliens in Outer Space. A quite original board game in that
it doesn't have a board, the board is in each players' head. Some players are
humans and others are aliens, but they can't see where each other is, except
with certain clues (people making noise) and items. The humans must escape the
aliens. It's a lot of fun and it involves both abstract thought and
psychology/bluffing/etc. The drawback is that some maps and situations can be
unbalanced, especially if you play with the stock rules (a door to exit the
ship can randomly work or not) a player can lose very unfairly. It should be
pretty easy to customize the rules though.
Also go is awesome, but I don't think it's the kind of game you were looking
for advice about (and it's difficult to compare to the others as it's on an
entirely different category).
------
olafleur
Pandemy is awesome.
~~~
nappy-doo
I think you mean Pandemic
([https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/30549/pandemic](https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/30549/pandemic)).
------
egru
Agricola
Twilight Imperium
Through the Ages
Terra Mystica
Suburbia
7 Wonders
Lords of Waterdeep
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: moving my Django app away from GAE, where do I go? - fchollet
Hi HN,<p>So I have this Django app (http://www.wysp.ws) that has gathered 1500 signups in 3 months of un-publicized beta, and is growing at an accelerating pace. It's hosted on Google App Engine (and user-submitted pictures are sent to S3).<p>I want to move away from GAE, because of several huge technical drawbacks:<p>- The 20 seconds limit for request processing make it impossible for my users to submit anything bigger than small pictures (upload time + processing time (resizing, etc) + time to send the file to S3 > 20 secs). Especially given that outbound traffic from GAE in seriously slow.<p>- I'm using the DB middleware Django-appengine to keep using Django's native models with the GAE Datastore, and I have come to realize how bad of an idea that is. Can't fetch (or count) more than 1000 objects, HUGE performance issues, etc.<p>- I can't believe how bad Google treats their paying customers. For instance: one day Google decided it didn't like my credit card info, which caused my application to go down for several hours... because each time I tried to reenter my CC info, after rejecting it Google would prevent me from trying again for 30 minutes (while the app was down). It happened several times in a row. No possibility to get support whatsoever. And that's just an example.<p>So where do I go? EC2? Rackspace? Gondor? Heroku? What would be the best and cheapest for a Django app with image uploading requirements?
======
gumbah
Linode has always worked very well for me. You do have to have some basic
Linux sysadmin skills, but they have good documentation that should get you on
your way, awesome support and it's way cheaper than Heroku or Gondor. So my
advice would be: Linode combined with EC2 for storage
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Spielberg to Propose Oscars Rule Change That Would Disqualify Netflix Films - smacktoward
https://www.complex.com/pop-culture/2019/03/steven-spielberg-may-propose-oscars-rule-change-to-disqualify-netflix-films
======
arikr
Netflix should create their own awards show.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: How Much Are Bloggers At Mashable, TechCrunch Paid? - momzpie
These blogs <i>- - TechCrunch, Mashable, Gizmodo, Engadget etc - -</i> are really popular, as you all know. I would like to know how much the bloggers at these websites are actually paid.<p>-------------------------------------<p>PS: This is my first day at HN. I just love the community. :)
======
marshallk
I can't speak for those _other blogs_ but at ReadWriteWeb (the most fabulous
blog on the internet, if you ask me) we did some polling and ran this post on
pay rates 3 years ago
[http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/how_much_do_top_tier_bl...](http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/how_much_do_top_tier_bloggers_make.php)
To be honest, given the economy, I doubt things have changed that much since
then.
~~~
momzpie
Marshall, the post says $45K to $90K for full-time bloggers, that's annual
pay, right? (I might look sheepish here)
If you can tell us, how much does RWW pay? And yes, it's one of the most
fabulous blogs on the Internet.
PS: thank you.
~~~
marshallk
I cannot disclose RWW's rate of pay but as I said in that post, the higher you
go in that continuum, the more likely you are to be a consultant vs a
journalist. And we are journalists ;)
~~~
momzpie
No problem. But thanks for the info.
------
anderzole
I once heard bloggers at TUAW get $15/post. But this was back in 2007, I'm
sure it's changed since then. I suppose it also matters if someone is a
contributing blogger or a full on staff member like MG Siegler and Sarah Lacy
at TC
~~~
ftblogger
$15 would be pretty low for a major blog, I think. When I was writing for one
of the larger tech blogs, I was making about $2000/month for 3 stories per
day.
~~~
davidcann
Then your rate must have been about $22/post, which seems in the same
ballpark.
~~~
ftblogger
Not quite. You're assuming I worked 30 days a month - but I only worked on
weekdays. So the pay per post was actually just above $30.
------
tudorizer
Welcome to HN ;)
~~~
momzpie
ThankQ!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Make_windows10_great_again.bat - Kristine1975
https://gist.github.com/IntergalacticApps/675339c2b805b4c9c6e9a442e0121b1d
======
Jaruzel
Whereas I commend the effort that has gone into this script, the end result
for most users will be an unusable Windows 10 installation. The script is VERY
aggressive, and does not explain what it is turning off and/or removing and
nor does it give the user the ability to control what's being done.
It's nice to see a transparent script with all this in (as opposed to all
those sealed EXEs that are floating about), but it's definitely a) not for
machines that end users will use, and b) only useful for techies who want to
cherry pick out the bits they care about.
------
Bino
Protip, huge warning! never run these scripts on any computer!
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Lawmakers Issued License Plates 'Invisible' To Traffic Cams - kilroy123
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20130805/08323124067/lawmakers-issued-license-plates-that-make-them-invisible-to-traffic-cams-parking-tickets.shtml
======
vxNsr
Well this comes as a surprise to no one.
Though I am slightly taken aback that a police officer would even give a
ticket to an FBI car, I guess this is for unmarked cars... which lends the
question, why does the FBI have so many unmarked cars in DC (as compared to
any other large metro area)?
------
lifeisstillgood
Why would you travel in a car that essentially had a big "something dodgy"
flag on it? What is the advantage of a number plate that is not in the DMV
database (apart from avoiding tickets?)
Or is the implication that traffic cams routinely track and report the
location of every number plate - and access is so widespread that its bound to
be leaked to the criminals?
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"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Snoopers' Charter: Government Wins Vote on Investigatory Powers Bill - dubwubz
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/12194441/Snoopers-Charter-Parliamentary-vote-on-the-investigatory-powers-bill-live-updates.html
======
beedogs
Coming soon to a Western "democracy" near you. We've already got it down in
Australia.
------
flashm
So what happens now? Can myself and my LTD company claim asylum elsewhere?
------
junto
Are VPN's and circumvention going to be banned as well?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Game of Life, Implemented in Game of Life - joss82
http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/2em5t7/game_of_life_implemented_in_game_of_life/
======
ColinWright
Discussion:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4644679](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4644679)
Videos:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3650610](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3650610)
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3768363](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3768363)
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4297644](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4297644)
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5522865](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5522865)
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7012844](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7012844)
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8228642](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8228642)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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John Conway: Discovering free will (2011) - monort
https://plus.maths.org/content/john-conway-discovering-free-will-part-i
======
dekhn
If you're an armchair quantum theorist, I have a suggestion. Rather than
sitting around positing how the world works, build an actual quantum
experiment, and spend some time just thinking about what's going on with your
intuitive brain and comparing it to what you observe.
It's a bit pricey, but
[https://www.thorlabs.com/newgrouppage9.cfm?objectgroup_id=69...](https://www.thorlabs.com/newgrouppage9.cfm?objectgroup_id=6957)
is a full quantum erase experiment with a straightforward, visible path for
the photons.
I personally found that arguing with people with pop-sci level of
understanding of quantum to be pretty exhausting. If you can setup an
experiment like this and understand it, it goes a long way to reconfiguring
your brain to accept the counterintuitive implications of QM.
That said I still hold out an irrational hope for superdeterminism.
~~~
theoh
This is a teaching problem, because (like most things that are taught) there's
no way for most students to verify it.
People who seek out areas of ambiguity or contested models in later life,
after formal or professional education: good luck to them. They would surely
benefit from your suggestion. But the rest of us are going to have to just
believe what we are told, having applied certain personal heuristic filters to
the info we are getting...
------
montenegrohugo
So it seems that quantum particles do not "choose" their state until observed.
I've heard this multiple times now, including in this article (demonstrated by
the 33 sticks analogy).
I'm curious, has any research been done on HOW they "choose" their state when
observed? I imagine it is pretty difficult (if not impossible) to analyze
this, but is there any insight of the factors that make a quantum particle
choose its state? Or is the prevalent theory that it is completely random?
PD: I find this topic fascinating.
~~~
n4r9
This is basically where interpretations of quantum mechanics come into play.
The maths/experiments alone don't tell you much. There are only a few things
we can be sure of, e.g. the particle is not choosing a locally determined,
pre-existing value as in classical mechanics. What you believe after that
comes down to which "comforting illusion" you are most willing to ditch.
~~~
posterboy
> the particle is not choosing a locally determined, pre-existing value as in
> classical mechanics
Translation: The value of to entangled measurements does not allow inference
of a value back in time.
> What you believe after that comes down to which "comforting illusion" you
> are most willing to ditch.
You should drop the illusion that even 1% reading here understand enough
relativity theory to even understand the problem. I don't. I took a few crash
courses on physics and they tried to teach the double slit experiment to us in
the second semester. Of course they had to cut it short and call it "magic".
Of course even scientists parrot popular science when explaining only the
difficulties they face, not the exact physics, I guess.
All this _local hidden variable_ stuff seems like a version of Laplace's
demon. Well of course you don't have enough data. There could always be
another hidden variable. But instead QC takes a statistical approach like
thermodynamics, ignoring single states and looking at, ironically speaking,
the bigger picture.
> What you believe after that comes down to which "comforting illusion" you
> are most willing to ditch.
There's no illusion to ditch. You start with a null hypothesis, so the problem
is which null hypothesis to fall back on. To ditch a hypothesis you need to
understand the experiments in question and the math. The philosphy is an after
thought to rationalize the results, but it doesn't matter much to e.g. the
material scientists doing the field work, and vice versa, the level of
precision of these measurements is so far removed from our every day
understanding that it really has no bearing on Multiverse Theories and all
that popular nonsense.
By the way, non-local hidden variables have not been ruled out. Where's the
difference, distance (ie. locality) might just be a matter of more than 4
dimensions?! Maybe I misunderstand. Different question. Why is time always the
independent variable?
I think the problem is that people like things linear, first order, because I
have a huge problem imagining differential equations, recursion and what not,
even OEDs, not to mention PDEs.
~~~
n4r9
You don't need to understand even _special_ relativity to learn about Bell's
theorem. It's just about measurement settings and local influence.
You're correct that non-local hidden variable theories are still plausible.
Bohmian mechanics is the prominent example. In this case "locality" is the
comfortable illusion that you drop. In Copenhagen it is a kind of realism. In
Many Worlds it is the notion that an observation leads to a single result.
There's no clear way to determine which of these is more like a "null
hypothesis" than the others, so what tends to happen is that people gravitate
towards one or another based on which of the illusions they're more okay with
dropping.
It would be nice to be able to discriminate between interpretations based on
experiment, and a little work has been done on this, but we're not really
anywhere near there yet.
~~~
posterboy
I wrote under the impression that locality would rely on a notion of space-
time. wiki/Local_realism says as much. That then is one notion to knock down.
The null hypothesis here would be non-locality.
Unifying that with GR is the big problem, I hear, especially regarding
gravity.
~~~
n4r9
Without some notion of space-time you could not have a meaningful notion of
locality, therefore Bell's Theorem is a non-issue. But you don't need a
relativistic space-time for Bell's Theorem, any space-time in which physical
influences travel at a bounded speed will suffice.
Bell's Theorem does, however, create an uneasy tension between quantum theory
and special relativity. Tim Maudlin writes quite a good book about this called
"Quantum Non-Locality and Relativity".
------
dingo_bat
> "You mustn’t misread it, we’re not asserting these particles make decisions,
> we’re not saying they have any consciousness. What happens is they act, they
> indubitably act, and which action the particle does is free in this sense,
> it is not a predetermined function of the past. And that’s not the same as
> randomness, oh dear me no!"
Why not? Couldn't seem to find a reason for this assertion. If the behavior of
a particle is not predetermined, how is it not random?
~~~
popnroll
I don't know if this adds anything to your comment; The input of a program is
neither predetermined nor random.
If there is an input "out of our reality", then our reality would not be
predetermined nor would it be random. (Which makes sense for the simulation
hypothesis, which I enjoy having that conversation with my colleagues)
~~~
joe_the_user
It's easy to say X part of a system is "neither predetermined nor random"
within a system defined as open (like a computer program or even a machine
with a dial that can be set by an operator).
When a system is closed, things become harder.
Chaitin's number represents (very roughly) the structure of any complete
mathematical system and it can be shown to be random in the sense of
Kolmogorov.
------
finmin
Conway proves the existence of free will not by nebulous philosophical
arguments but by a combination of quantum mechanics and relativity.
Note the definition of 'free will' here is specific: fundamental particles
future states cannot be purely a function of the information in their past
light cones and so only 'they' can fully determine their future state, and
this is not the same thing as them having random number generators; they truly
are free
~~~
Rounin
As far a I can tell from the article, Conway doesn't prove the existence of
free will at all, not even attempt to do so. Instead he explores what the
implications of free will would be if it exists.
And despite the claim to the contrary, his definition of "free will" isn't
appreciably different from randomness, only he uses the word "randomness" to
mean pseudorandomness, so he sticks the term "free will" on true randomness.
An interesting contribution to quantum physics, presumably, but not a proof of
free will.
~~~
zornthewise
Can you define precisely what you mean by random in this context?
~~~
Rounin
How about "proceeding, made, or occurring without definite aim, reason, or
pattern". From
[https://www.dictionary.com/browse/random](https://www.dictionary.com/browse/random)
.
------
atemerev
For me, this is a bad name for the theorem. Free will is not just
indeterminism, it also includes agency.
If I understood the argument correctly, there is still one possibility of
global determinism: imagine a "God function", a random oracle that gives all
results to all measurements, unpredictable but fully deterministic. Even if it
can't be predicted from previous states of the world, it can still maintain
some sort of "determinism". It can even be tractable: imagine a pseudo-random
generator with some seed and "external" state as this God function. It should
all work.
~~~
n4r9
It "works", although it's an absurdity at the level of Descartes' evil demon.
See superdeterminism:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superdeterminism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superdeterminism)
------
nabla9
The free will as it defined in this context means the ability of an entity to
do truly __random__ choices not dependent on the surrounding environment or
their causal history.
It does not mean that they can intelligently freely choose between the
options. Any cognitive mechanism that does reasoned decisions is not free. It
can just have a random or arbitrary[1] element in it.
I like how Einstein never mixed free will with true randomness. Used the
better metaphor: throwing the dice.
\---
[1]: What I mean with arbitrary is something that derives choices that are not
relevant to the decision decision. For example pseudorandomness.
------
dziungles
I find the topic of the free will to be the most fascinating.
The abscence of the free will ('free will' as it is defined by the pop
culture) is a revolutionary idea because the current world structures and
narratives are based on the notion that free will exists.
It is a much more revolutionary idea than Copernicus' round Earth discovery,
because the illusion of the free will influences our lives more and in
multiple ways.
I'm also a strong believer that the society without the idea of the free will
would be a much more compassionate, healthier and happy.
~~~
coldtea
There's an endless loop in this argument.
Per definition, if free will doesn't exist, then you can't say that "the
illusion of the free will influences our lives more and in multiple ways."
If free will doesn't exist, then our lives, thoughts and choices are
predetermined, and thus they can't be "influenced" by our belief in free will
(or lack thereof).
In fact if we are in such a world, the we can't even opt to believe in free
will or not -- since in such a world, our beliefs are also predetermined
themselves.
The society wont be any more "compassionate, healthier and happy" in such a
world based on any of its beliefs. It would only be compassionated, healthier
and happy if its predetermined to be so.
The only option for your argument to work, would be for free will to exist
while the society doesn't believe it does. Such a society, indeed, could be
more compassionated, healthier and happy (it remains to be proven, but it's a
possibility that non-belief in free will could change things positively, as
long as free will exists for this non-belief to make a difference).
~~~
nailuj
The experience of free will can be real, without free will being real. An
individual believing it has free will, will certainly act different to an
individual that believes all actions are predetermined. I think what your
parent commenter meant was that society might be better off if the notion of
free will was not taken for granted by its individuals, hoping this would
inspire compassion and tolerance. Of course, if free will isn't real, this
isn't something anyone would be able to influence. It would still be possible
to come to that conclusion deterministically.
Looking at this from the angle of social organisation, I think without the
notion of personal responsibility, we lose more good things than we would gain
by assuming life is deterministic, and I don't see how we can keep personal
responsibility when giving up on free will. There is a consideration of
trusting other people to be cooperative if they stand nothing to lose by being
selfish to the detriment of others hidden somewhere in there too.
~~~
tjoff
I don't see how personal responsibility wouldn't be possible without free
will.
Society decides the consequences for wrongdoing (and positive reinforcement).
Free will or not an entity is affected by the consequences of ones action (if
it is able to realize those consequences).
The desire to live in a society where people don't solely act in their own
interests is by itself a driving force (not necessarily fueled by free will).
There are other species that more or less do only act in their own interest
but humans would not have survived if we did, our strength comes from
collaboration.
Even our own, well behaved, developed software "understand" the concept of
consequences and personal responsibility - because we program in that
behavior. Just as evolution has programmed us not to be destructive (with
varying success).
~~~
coldtea
> _I don 't see how personal responsibility wouldn't be possible without free
> will._
Responsibility is not about punishment or lack thereof. That is just a
mechanism to encourage responsibility, not its manifestation.
Responsibility is about being able to do X or Y and choosing right.
A rock is not considered responsible because we don't think it has free will.
If a rock falls on one's head and kills them, that's it. We don't jail it.
In most jurisdictions we don't even hold people that are mad as responsible
for something they committed for the same reason (the US is kind of Old
Testament backwater legally so this might be different there). They don't go
to jail etc.
> _Society decides the consequences for wrongdoing (and positive
> reinforcement). Free will or not an entity is affected by the consequences
> of ones action (if it is able to realize those consequences)._
Without free will there is no "decides".
Everything is pre-decided.
It doesn't even matter if one is guilty or not -- the decision to jail them or
not is already made before they committed anything and is independent of their
actions.
~~~
tjoff
> _In most jurisdictions we don 't even hold people that are mad as
> responsible for something they committed for the same reason (the US is kind
> of Old Testament backwater legally so this might be different there). They
> don't go to jail etc._
It depends on your viewpoint, but the reason for why they don't go to jail
etc. is because it doesn't match the intent with jail. Jail is meant as a
deterrence as well as shielding the society. If it doesn't work as a
deterrence and we have better ways to shield the society from it happening
again (which is "easy" to argue in regards to a mad person) then it doesn't
make sense to force it upon people where it will do more harm than good (we
still do it do a large extent, but society also benefits from its inhabitants
believing that the system is fair and that is a difficult balance).
> _Without free will there is no "decides"._
This also depends on your viewpoint. A computer takes tons of decisions but
they are all based on a given set of inputs, as will society (regardless of
whether free will exist or not).
~~~
coldtea
A computer doesn't take any "free will" decision of its own -- everything is
determined at the time the program is written/loaded.
"Doing X if Y" is not a free will decision if it's already encoded. In a sense
it's not a decision at all. When X, the computer will do Y, period.
(And this also applies if we add some stohastic elements in the mix).
~~~
ajuc
> everything is determined at the time the program is written/loaded
Computer can measure random event and do something basing on that.
> is not a free will decision if it's already encoded
Most probably so is our "free will".
------
flabbergast
Free will does exist, only we don't have it. We live in our own little world
of illusions, thinking and dreaming. In reality every random influence can
change our path.
Reality only exists in the present moment; just try to "be" there for a few
minutes (without thinking) and you realize you don't have "free will". These
are qualities that come with a huge price that almost none of us can or want
to pay for, mainly because we love to dream we already have it.
Examples of people with free will are: Jesus Christ, Buddha, etc..
~~~
montenegrohugo
I'm curious as to what your theological beliefs are? How come you list Jesus
(which I would understand if you are christian) but also, in the same breath,
Buddha?
~~~
ardillaroja
As I understand it there's pretty firm evidence that both Jesus and Buddha
existed and arguably they both had some pretty cool ideas...
~~~
delinka
That doesn’t mean that their ideas weren’t generated by a deterministic
machine inside their skulls. GGP doesn’t explain why he thinks these
individuals had free will and the rest of us don’t. Seems to me even in
“random” yet deterministic systems, you’ll still get “anomalous” behavior that
others within the system catagorize as “somehow different” - still doesn’t
mean their will is freer than others’.
~~~
ardillaroja
Yeah absolutely. I don't agree with his 'examples', but I'll defend to the
death his right to use them in the same breath. It seems absurd to claim a
handful of humans to have free will and others not, not really sure what that
would even mean.
~~~
manfred_macx42
In Buddhism there is a notion that the human conscious experience is a largely
automatic state of "waking sleep" where the individual navigates life
reactively, subject to the karmic law of "cause and effect". (Determinism)
The metaphor of "waking up" is about practicing a present state of mind, such
that one recognizes how they are living life with about the same amount of
awareness as a dream, with the aim to cultivate the same agency of a lucid
dream in waking life. (Free Will)
A Gnostic reading of the New Testament reveals a similar allegorical
prescription to awakening in Jesus' teachings, whereby adherents strive to
attain "Christ Consciousness" and achieve liberation.
Many contemplative traditions hold that human suffering is caused by our
baseline instinctual unconscious tendencies (a feedback loop from hell), and
that it takes sustained practice to become present enough to "take the car off
autopilot" permanently.
A cursory survey of the brutishness of human history is a testament to how
rare this mental state is, and explains the high regard by those who attempt
to emulate the characters (historical or fictional) claimed to have mastered
it.
------
thefranke
The whole free will debate always falls flat on its face because the
distinction between free will and free choice is never made. You may not have
free will, but you have natural tendencies that you gravitate towards.
However, these can only be expressed if you have the choice to do so.
There is a joke that I think captures this philosophy of Compatibalism quite
well: A reporter asks a citizen in Pyongyang to comment about life in North
Korea. The citizen answers "Well, I can't complain".
------
posterboy
Ensembles can disentangle, right? Then, if measuring only one side, how do you
know the other side is entangled? How did experiments establish entanglement
anyway? If you measure hundred runs and all correlate, sure you can say the
next one will too, but that's literally a predetermined outcome.
------
tomhoward
Archive version:
[http://archive.is/NlB7R](http://archive.is/NlB7R)
~~~
akavel
Part 2:
[http://web.archive.org/web/20180726093121/https://plus.maths...](http://web.archive.org/web/20180726093121/https://plus.maths.org/content/john-
conway-discovering-free-will-part-ii)
------
stultifying
Okay, but it still doesn't mean the particle passes through both slits.
------
darekkay
If you find this topic interesting, I highly recommend watching this talk by
Sam Harris [0].
[0]
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCofmZlC72g](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCofmZlC72g)
------
bloak
"Conway thinks the free decisions of the particles inside us might account for
our own free will."
Another mathematician, Roger Penrose, made a similar claim, but with
"consciousness" instead of "free will".
I find this very implausible. So does Douglas Hofstadter, probably, though
I've not yet read his main book on the subject.
Thought experiment: You make a mathematical model of how neurons work, you cut
up a human's brain, and you build a machine that simulates it. Wherever the
model required randomness, you use pseudorandom numbers, generated
cryptographically, so the entire system is deterministic. You connect it up to
some kind of humanoid robot. Does the resulting system behave roughly like a
human, and, if so, does it have free will, and is it conscious?
People who believe that consciousness or free will depends on fundamental
physics have to believe:
* Either that the simulated human won't work like a human: it will mysteriously fail to function, but how exactly?
* Or that the simulated human will seem to work like a real human, but nevertheless it won't be conscious; it will be a mere "zombie".
The first option seems intuitively implausible to me, and the second option
sounds like silly sophistry.
~~~
foldr
In the case of free will I don't see any intuitive implausibility. It's
intuitively plausible that someone/something could exhibit human-like behavior
without actually having free will. After all, some people think that regular
humans fall into this category!
~~~
bloak
The difficultly in deciding whether humans have "free will" suggests that the
concept of "free will" might be silly sophistry.
~~~
foldr
Similarly, the difficulty in deciding whether or not Goldbach's conjecture
holds shows that the concept of "prime number" might be silly sophistry.
~~~
bloak
Hardly worth replying, but I don't see the similarity. A 6-year-old
understands perfectly well what a prime number is, and you can write a program
to test for primality in half a line of Haskell (though the performance will
not be good). Now what's a "free will"?
~~~
foldr
I was responding to your original claim, which appeared to rest on the
assumption that problems which are difficult to solve are likely to be
psuedoproblems. I deliberately chose a difficult problem based on a concept
that has a clear definition (prime number) in order to show how silly this
line of argument is.
If you are just saying that it's difficult to come up with a generally agreed
upon definition of "free will", then that's of course true. But that doesn't
mean that there aren't any genuine philosophical problems relating to free
will. By way of analogy, it's also difficult to define terms like "property",
"freedom" and "constitution", but that doesn't mean that all of political
philosophy is sophistry.
------
popnroll
Oh boy, I know this is arrogant; It's pretty easy to show evidence of
determinism. 1) Read my brain, check if in ten seconds I will say yes or
nothing. 2) Don't tell me. 3) Wait ten seconds. 4) Compare results. I'm aware
of the experiments of reading brain decisions faster than our consiousness
(machines telling which button we will play "before we realized"). No, no
psychomotor tricks. Just read my brain, don't tell me until I made my choice.
If you get 100% I believe you, meanwhile, no evidence.
~~~
ppod
>no evidence
Why do you assume that the null hypothesis is free will?
~~~
popnroll
I'm not assuming free will exists. To be honest, I'm personally a
compatibilist. I'm determinism and free will agnostic. No evidence for free
will doesn't mean determinsm is true. No evidence for determinism doesn't mean
free will is true. Is an unpopular opinion. But I see no gap in the logic.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Possible to get Rust job without C++ background? - jetti
I have been learning Rust in my free time for the past 6 months. I would love to be able to find a job that works with Rust full time as I'm bored with the .NET stack that I have been doing for the past 8 years. My worry is that, from my understanding, many companies are using Rust to replace their C++ code base however, I have very limited C++ experience. Is it worth pursuing Rust in the hopes of landing a job with it? My other thought was to learn Go, as I know there are some Go jobs in my area and they seem don't seem to require C++ knowledge.
======
steveklabnik
I haven’t seen many jobs that are for explicitly replacing C++ code, for what
it’s worth.
~~~
jetti
Thanks Steve. I think I'm influenced by what a single company was doing and
assumed that many others were doing that same thing. There's a company in
Chicago that is trying out Rust by replacing some of their C++ code base with
Rust but I don't think they are actively hiring Rust developers.
------
phonebanshee
You're overlooking something important: they can't hire C++ people. They just
aren't around. Sure, if you're directly competing against someone who has a
lot of relevant experience, they're likely going to try hiring the other
person first. You're not likely to run up against that in the real world.
~~~
dev_north_east
> They just aren't around.
How do you mean?
~~~
phonebanshee
I mean that if you're trying to hire people with C++ experience, you're having
a very hard time. It's a very small pool to draw from.
------
vkaku
Of Course. But you want to be good at systems/basics.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The GitHub Arctic Code Vault - gingernaut
https://github.blog/2020-07-16-github-archive-program-the-journey-of-the-worlds-open-source-code-to-the-arctic/
======
tw4l
As David Rosenthal (formerly of Sun, NVIDIA, and Stanford) explains, the
actual Arctic Code Vault is a PR stunt, and has almost no chance of helping
anyone in any kind of realistic disaster scenario:
[https://blog.dshr.org/2019/11/seeds-or-
code.html](https://blog.dshr.org/2019/11/seeds-or-code.html)
That said, the _rest_ of the project, which focuses on preserving several
independent copies of repositories hosted on GitHub with a handful of partner
organizations, is quite useful. From the same post: "They are using a range of
technologies, making feeds available over the Internet, and partnering with
the Internet Archive, the Software Heritage Foundation and the Bodleian
Library. These are mostly things which will get used in the foreseeable
future, and should be applauded for that reason."
~~~
rezendi
Archive Program director here - it's really not a PR stunt, we genuinely
believe it will be of significant historical value and quite a good chance it
will be of practical value.
Much of that is "if we forget technology which we realize somewhere down the
road we actually might want to use again." History provides plenty of examples
of this, and it's particularly important with a technology which mostly lives
on ephemeral media that only lasts a few decades.
Even if you do expand your speculation to post-disaster scenarios, though,
while it's true the archive wouldn't be an instant reset button, it would help
greatly accelerate the recovery of technology. It's worth noting that it will
come with a slew of (human-readable, not encoded) technical works regarding
subjects ranging from modern software engineering to microprocessor design to
photolithography to power systems, which we call the Tech Tree, along with a
guide and index to all the stored repos. Wherever its inheritors / discoverers
may be in terms of technological advancement, and especially if they have
modern-ish hardware (which can last much, much longer than most storage
media), recovering the archive's contents will be a lot faster than
rediscovering them from scratch.
(Also worth noting we'll be storing "greatest hits" copies of the ~15,000
most-starred / most-relied-on repos, along with a sampling of several thousand
repos with few/no stars, in a selection of places like Oxford's Bodleian
Library; our hypothetical future tech seekers won't have to go all the way to
Svalbard for those.)
I don't want to stress the doomsday scenarios too much, though, despite our
ongoing pandemic. I think the most likely outcome by far is that progress will
continue; the archive may be useful to recover a couple of otherwise forgotten
technologies that suddenly become important / interesting; and it will
ultimately be chiefly of interest to historians. That historical value is a
key reason why it casts such a broad net. I too have a couple of fairly
unsophisticated pet projects in there that the future won't be interested in
individually - but collectively is another matter. One of the most interesting
things our advisory committee told us is that history is replete with lists
composed by wealthy people of the books they thought most important, carefully
preserved for posterity, whereas what modern historians _really_ want is
ordinary people's shopping lists, of which almost none survived. That's one
reason there are millions of repos in the Arctic now, instead of eg just the
most-starred 100K: some of those may be the modern technological equivalent of
Renaissance shopping lists, for the historians who may take a particular
interest in this (possibly) especially wacky and volatile era.
I know it's an inherently cinematic and dramatic project and so it's tempting
to call it a PR stunt ... but I assure you, it's not, and, speaking
personally, I would never have gotten involved with it if I thought it was.
~~~
rkagerer
Did people with repositories know this was going to happen and did you give
them a choice to opt out?
~~~
throwaway368765
Rather more eloquently asked than by the other person I saw querying this[0]!
I suspect it's covered under Github's TOS - specifically[1], only public
repositories were included and these are all effectively just backups.
Especially in the case of the vault in Svalbard. But you can opt out of the
'warm storage'[0].
[0] [https://github.com/github/archive-
program/issues/36](https://github.com/github/archive-program/issues/36) [1]
[https://docs.github.com/en/github/site-policy/github-
terms-o...](https://docs.github.com/en/github/site-policy/github-terms-of-
service#4-license-grant-to-us)
~~~
rkagerer
I recognize they wouldn't have done it unless they felt confident of having
the legal right, but it's just bad manners not to ask first.
If that's the case, this not-a-PR stunt degraded my impression of them.
I'm quite certain this isn't what their customers contemplated when reading
"backup" in their ToS.
EDIT: Interestingly it says " _This license does not grant GitHub the right to
sell Your Content or otherwise distribute or use it outside of our provision
of the Service._
It also says " _You still have control over your content_ ".
Is a subarctic vauly really within the ordinary course of providing the
service? Did content owners have an opportunity to exert any control?
Most probably think it's neat, but GitHub would be naive to imagine everyone
would consent.
Also what happens if it turns out one of those repos had personal information
in it and the subject makes a GDPR right-to-forget demand? Are they going to
drag it out and purge that bit of tape?
~~~
throwaway368765
>Also what happens if it turns out one of those repos had personal information
in it and the subject makes a GDPR right-to-forget demand? Are they going to
drag it out and purge that bit of tape?
I believe GDPR has exemptions for archives ([0] section 28) so that's less of
a concern for them I imagine. I recognise what you're saying, but I think
anyone _very_ opposed would have a difficult time in court arguing GitHub
should remove their work/name/etc. My (very loose) understanding of the law is
that they would have to demonstrate some kind of loss. That being said, GitHub
could just have sent a notification email with very little effort. Maybe 'no
harm, no foul' applies here?
[0]
[https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2018/12/schedule/2/part...](https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2018/12/schedule/2/part/6/enacted)
------
ca_parody
Honestly, for however much this project either (a) is a genuine archeological
move for the preservation of information or (b) to get good press, all I
genuinely thought when this happened is "aw shucks - wish i fixed those bugs
before they zapped it onto film and flew it to santa clause".
~~~
jcahill
I am a web archivist with an archival project on Svalbard that predates this
GitHub initiative.
Additionally, large-scale github-specific projects like
[https://gharchive.org](https://gharchive.org) (formerly GitHub Archive) have
existed for some time.
In my experience, code is more likely than not to be preserved in a stale
revision, if at all.
The most common forms of preservation are (a) simple tarballing and (b) git
bundles.
------
Gollapalli
Beautiful.
Honestly, nothing scares me more than losing all the code and all the
technology we've developed in the past 70 or so years. There's been so much
advancement, but it's also transferred in such a way (institutional knowledge,
propietary software, proprietary hardware, etc.) that it's super easy to lose.
If we preserve open hardware and software, then we could rebuild in the case
of civilizational decline and the accompanying knowledge loss, something which
we would neither be the first nor the last to experience.
~~~
Wowfunhappy
> If we preserve open hardware and software, then we could rebuild in the case
> of civilizational decline and the accompanying knowledge loss
...can we?
I'm sometimes a little concerned about how complicated chip fabs are. They
feel like something that could take generations to rebuild, even if we had all
the knowledge on what to do.
~~~
helldritch
Home photo-lithography and chemical etching setups aren't common, but have
been done by several people. We wouldn't be able to jump straight to 14NM, but
we would probably be able to get to the 500-300nm size relatively quickly (a
year or two, maybe, if starting from scratch) and shrink down from there.
Devices would be much bigger and less efficient, but we would be able to run
code and pump out 8086 processors within 6 months.
~~~
quicklime
That's just one layer of the stack though. Future archaeologists will also
need to create mock npm registries and maven repositories, and set up docker
and k8s so they can deploy a complex set of microservices to look up our
birthdays.
~~~
Wowfunhappy
...all the code to which should be right in the Github Vault, right?
Idk, the hardware part seems much more difficult to me.
------
toomuchtodo
> The Internet Archive is a well-known, widely beloved non-profit digital
> library which provides free public access to collections of digitized
> materials. In partnership with the GitHub Archive Program, the Internet
> Archive (IA) commenced its ongoing archive of GitHub public repositories on
> April 13 of this year. At present, IA is using a two-pronged approach.
> First, their well-known Wayback Machine is accessing and archiving raw
> GitHub data as WARCs, or Web ARChive files. As of this writing they have
> archived some 55TB of data. Second, they have the goal of making entire
> archived GitHub repositories available via “git clone,” while also keeping
> repo comments, issues, and other metadata easily accessible on the web. This
> second initiative is well underway and initial archiving is expected to
> commence this month.
Tremendous news.
------
atonse
This is so awesome, but the most surprising to me is that all the public
source code on GitHub only totals 21 TB.
I forget that they do fundamentally host text, and not video etc.
I somehow thought it would be petabytes. The private repos might be more than
that but those are historically paid.
~~~
no_wizard
On the topic of size, I wonder how small it would be if you were able to
deduplicate all repositories against each other. I sometimes suspect there is
a tremendous amount of copy/paste code out there masquerading as someone
else’s.
Even a naive deduplication might yield some very interesting results
Reminds me of a time I caught someone using someone else’s code in an
interview and passing it off as their own. (Using was fine, it was the claim
that it was theirs that bugged me)
~~~
progval
I work at Software Heritage, where we archive all source code we can find,
including all GitHub repositories, and deduplicate them internally.
The size of all file contents (including older versions of files) is a few
hundreds TBs, and everything else (directory structures, revision history,
etc.) is under 10TB.
So for GitHub alone it would be a little under that
------
gdsdfe
Am I the only one thinking this is a waste of money and time?! How any of this
makes sense, maybe as a weird PR stunt but ... Just strange
~~~
dakiol
I agree. I can't believe they are spending so much money and effort to
preserve code I don't give a damn now and once I pushed to GitHub. And like
me, 99% of the devs I know personally.
~~~
cmrx64
it's probably less effort to just archive the whole damn thing and let the
future figure it out than to decide important things to archive and leaving
everything else to disappear someday
~~~
rezendi
Archive Program director here. One of the most interesting things our advisory
committee told us is that it's really hard to determine what's important in
advance: history is replete with lists composed by wealthy people of the books
they thought most important, carefully preserved for posterity, whereas what
modern historians _really_ want is ordinary people's shopping lists, of which
almost none survived. That's one reason we cast a wide net and archived
millions of repos instead of eg just the most-starred 100K..Even seemingly
trivial repos might collectively be the modern technological equivalent of
Renaissance shopping lists, for the historians who may take a particular
interest in this (possibly) especially wacky and volatile era.
~~~
cmrx64
thank you so much for doing this work btw, archival is one of my loves :)
------
rwky
This means that after the apocalypse people will be able to reclaim the Linux
source code but not Windows. I find it poetic that open source may one day be
the norm.
~~~
jedieaston
I’m thinking that someone at Microsoft may have snuck the code for Windows
into the archive after it was pulled from Github. Between Windows and OS X, a
ton (most?) of the end user software would be unusable to a future generation
in its original form since they didn’t have the desktop OS it was used on.
Ironically, 500 years from now, they may think that the year of the Linux
desktop was 2008 :-D
~~~
zaptrem
[https://github.com/reactos/reactos](https://github.com/reactos/reactos) would
probably make this less of an issue as well.
------
1337shadow
Where can we find the list of the 6000 repos ? On my profile it just shows 3
"and more", would like to get the full list. TYIA ;)
~~~
axegon_
Same. Or how they were picked. I kept scratching my head all evening cause I
haven't made any updates or contributions to mine in quite a while.
~~~
zenhack
My best guess is it's some function of the popularity. The three that my
profile shows are
\- capnproto/capnproto
\- sandstorm-io/sandstorm
\- erlang/otp
(I don't remember the order).
I actively contribute heavily to sandstorm. I've sent patches here and there
to capnproto, and it's vaguely a sister project to sandstorm. Those are
probably some of the most popular projects I have multiple contributions to,
though there are others.
otp feels a bit odd though, if there's and "and more" \-- I sent them a one
line patch to fix a build error when building against musl. I haven't really
been involved since, nor was I before. But it's a high profile project.
------
grogenaut
What I really want from github is to allow people who own open source projects
who don't want to own them anymore to just hand them off for escrow so that at
a later date a reputable group like apache can maintain them if needed.
~~~
sudhirj
Couldn’t Apache just make a fork and announce it? Or is this just about the
convenience and marketing?
~~~
grogenaut
If it's done this way then all of the web links stay live, and a new owner
doesn't need to be found immediately. Think of it as a special permission
holding pool. There are many cases of "done" libraries that need changes
later. This would help with them. However when they're not done this way you
can spend a few weeks / months trying to get ahold of the author and for them
to decide "oh yeah I don't really care about x anymore"
------
brendanmc6
I'm curious, do they perform some sort of test reads on the reels to make sure
that the data was actually copied over correctly?
------
sixhobbits
What stops this stored data degrading? Do they have to periodically check /
renewal the reels?
------
makerofspoons
I was hoping for more of a description on how they plan to keep this vault
safer than the Global Seed Vault, which was once flooded due to soaring arctic
temperatures:
[https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/may/19/arctic-s...](https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/may/19/arctic-
stronghold-of-worlds-seeds-flooded-after-permafrost-melts)
~~~
erikbye
That was sensationalism, per usual. Bit of water in the access tunnel, no seed
damage.
~~~
price
The story says right up front in the subhed that the flooding didn't reach the
seeds. But the quotes make it pretty clear that what did happen was out of
spec.
For something that's meant to survive any catastrophe that might happen over
centuries to come, it's not a good sign to see that happen so early. It's
extra bad to see it driven by a trend, namely global warming, that we're
continuing to push farther and farther and have shown few signs of stopping.
------
etaioinshrdlu
It looks like the code is actually stored in plain text, and that this is
basically microfilm?
~~~
rob-olmos
I don't think so. Project Silica talks about storing the data in droplet-
looking voxels rather than etching language symbols. Cool video of the
process:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CzHsibqpIs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CzHsibqpIs)
~~~
etaioinshrdlu
But, from the article, it doesn't look like they used Project Silica here,
they used piqlFilm.
~~~
rejschaap
Yeah, Project Silica is another project within the GitHub Archive Program. You
can see the microfilm in this video
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzI9FNjXQ0o&feature=youtu.be...](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzI9FNjXQ0o&feature=youtu.be&t=72)
------
nomoreservices
Strong A Fire Upon the Deep vibes thinking of future archeologists studying
that.
------
Zamicol
They __are not__ using QR code for storage as has been misreported by a few
media outlets.
See
[https://earth.esa.int/documents/1656065/3222865/170922-Piql-...](https://earth.esa.int/documents/1656065/3222865/170922-Piql-
ESA_Slides-Final) for piql's storage method.
------
un_montagnard
> The next morning, it traveled to the decommissioned coal mine set in the
> mountain, and then to a chamber deep inside hundreds of meters of
> permafrost, where the code now resides fulfilling their mission of
> preserving the world’s open source code for over 1,000 years.
What is the probability that we still have the required tech to read that code
in 1,000 years?
~~~
davedx
Depends on whether the Great Filter is before or behind us.
------
benatkin
Ice. Not to be confused with ICE.
~~~
rvz
GitHub is working with both? Very chilling.
------
therealmarv
Only disappointed that the new badge does not show the 2 open source projects
I contributed to in the last 10 years of my work for open source :( They are
not super big, but also not super small.
Seems organisation work is ignored and only individual username fork/PRs
respected (is this a bug?). Software is teamwork ;)
I mean awesome-react, tldr-pages or homebrew-cask are probably not unimportant
but that's not where I contributed most to.
~~~
Phillips126
I am not a huge GitHub user and have only contributed some code to a single
repo that was merged. I was surprised to see I had the badge in my profile.
------
fnord77
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5D_optical_data_storage](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5D_optical_data_storage)
------
symplee
1000 years from now, I can only imagine the hidden Y3K bugs...
------
malechimp
If things come to that I doubt the practicality of it all. But it makes easy
headlines. It also makes open source an immortality project for a lot of
people.
------
TheSpiciestDev
Ha, that README grammar fix years ago finally pays off!
------
girst
In a 1000 years people will surely benefit from the millions of copy-pasted
dotfiles :^)
------
Google234
This is a waste of money.
------
chickenpotpie
So, if I'm in the EU can I GDPR my repo out of their vault?
~~~
adrianpike
I'm guessing you're being facetious, but it has come up and it's covered in
the FAQ:
[https://archiveprogram.github.com/faq/](https://archiveprogram.github.com/faq/)
------
juanbyrge
This is pointless - a complete waste of time, effort, and energy. Isn’t there
something more beneficial they could have done instead? Why pollute the Arctic
with plastic and film canisters?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why is violent crime so rare in Iceland? - bsg75
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-22288564
======
visarga
My insight: it's the degree of integration of society. No disenfranchised
sections.
Besides Iceland, two other countries stand up: Japan an Switzerland. In the
former, not even police or yakuza bear fire arms, things are solved mainly on
reputation. In the latter, every citizen has to know how to operate a firearm,
on account of not having an army.
So it's not the availability or lack of thereof of guns. It's the "social
tension" (what exists between people) that binds people together. A society of
strangers and cvasi-anonymous people leads to higher violence. When people are
separated, they don't prevent each other from falling into a life of crime.
A society where whole swaths of people are in poverty believing they have no
chance to succeed leads to the worst cases of violence. Even the slight idea
that there is a path from poverty to success, even if it is an illusion, keeps
the violence down.
But when people are convinced that the system is stacked against them no
matter what they do, then they dissociate from the large society, form a new
attitude - that they don't need to play by the rules, they don't need to have
compassion, because the rich have all the power and resources anyway and they
actively block the poor from raising up. That's basically whet the shit hits
the fan.
Remember the French arab revolt from a few years back, in Paris? Same thing.
Arabs emigrated in France after WWII for work. They remained in France and had
children. Now french people don't need them any more, but the kids are born in
France, they have no idea of the countries their parents came from. They don't
want to leave, but they are not welcome in France either. They are without a
place of their own. Thus, feeling of racial discrimination and violent
protest.
~~~
snogglethorpe
Regular Japanese police do carry firearms.
~~~
visarga
Even the guys who stay at the local booth in the corner of the street?
~~~
snogglethorpe
Yes.
------
ellyagg
Last year, New Hampshire's murder rate was 1.3. Since 1996, like Iceland, its
murder rate has never gone above 1.8. New Hampshire is four times as big as
Iceland. Why is violent crime so rare in New Hampshire?
[[http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/murder-rates-nationally-
and-...](http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/murder-rates-nationally-and-state)]
Not that New Hampshire is unique. There are other states larger than Iceland
that have similarly low murder rates.
~~~
dm2
Could the weather have anything to do with it?
Could also be partly the lack of tourists or type of tourists, compared to
warmer areas.
~~~
kyllo
Boston is less than 2 hours' drive from New Hampshire and has plenty of
violence.
I think New Hampshire's cities are small and just don't really have ghettos
the way most large American cities do. The violence happens in bigger cities
that are pretty nearby, but happen to be outside NH's borders. Southern NH is
kind of like an extended suburb of Boston.
~~~
zequel
Mass has very little gun violence, in fact, ~ 3.1 per 100k. "Plenty of
violence" isn't a helpful statement.
~~~
kyllo
OK, so now we get to play "compared to what?"
OP is about murder rate, not gun violence rate.
(2011): National rate: 4.7 Northeast rate: 3.9 MA rate: 2.8 NH rate: 1.3
MA's rate is lower than the national average and lower than the Northeast
regional average, but more than double than NH's average.
My argument is that NH has a particularly low murder rate because it doesn't
really have any big cities--the populated areas are mostly suburban. High
murder rates correlate with high population density (and poverty). If the
nearby metropolis of Boston were inside NH's borders, then I think NH would
have the higher murder rate. Do you disagree with that assessment?
------
schoper
Biology. Icelanders in the U.S. don't murder people very often either. Nordics
make good neighbors.
Then again, if you've read the Icelandic Sagas, you'll find that they used to
be bloodthirsty enough in pre-modernity. Culture matters too. Just not as much
(in the range of societies that exist in the first world today).
~~~
tinco
I do not believe that there exists any evidence that there is a biologic
difference between Icelandic or Nordic people in general and other groups of
humans that correlates strong enough to explain the crime rate statistics of
Iceland.
Also, the fact that you mention 'nordics make good neighbors' in the same
comment as acknowledging that nordics raped and pillaged my people for
hundreds of years.. (edit: sorry I'm a bit tired I had some insulting line
here I hope no one read)
culture matters too..
------
tzs
I recall several news stories around a month ago about the Icelandic
government creating a smartphone app that lets Icelanders check to see if the
person they are dating is a relative. Apparently the small population and low
immigration rate means that a given random pair of Icelanders are likely to be
more closely related than a given random pair of people from most other
countries.
I wonder if the increased risk that your victim might be a relative might have
some deterrent effect?
------
wtbob
My suspicion is that it's due to a number of factors. Economic equality (real
or perceived) is probably one thing; cultural homogeneity is probably another;
if I infer correctly from the article that Icelanders see dealing with crime
as a matter for all citizens, not just agents of the state, then that probably
is as well.
------
anuraj
The homicide rate is not too low. For example, my state Kerala which has the
highest recorded crime rate (read mostly petty) in India, has a homicide rate
of 1.09 - Much less than Iceland even with 100x population.
~~~
jsnk
Iceland's homicide rate is one of the world's lowest, and it has lower
homicide rate than India by 35 times.
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentiona...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate#By_country)
~~~
anuraj
I told you about the Homicide rate of Kerala, an Indian state which has 100x
population of Iceland. 365 (470 including culpable homicides not amounting to
murder) homicides in 2011 with 33.4 million population.So Iceland is nothing
exceptional here. <http://www.keralapolice.org/newsite/crimein_kerala.html>
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerala>
~~~
mercurial
You seem to be claiming Kerala as the norm rather than an outlier. You're
certainly welcome to compare crime rates between the two and/or suggest
explanations/compare living conditions, but saying that very low crime rate is
the norm is simply false [1]
1: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_rate>
~~~
anuraj
No - I said Kerala has a high crime rate - but a relatively low homicide rate.
Kerala is definitely an outlier in many respects in India. What I am trying to
hint is it is not exceptional to have low homicide rates - there are several
parts of the world where it is the norm. It may be better to consider high
homicide rates in some developed, high HDI regions as an anomaly and analyze
the reasons.
------
mwctahoe
I feel the fact that they named the armed cops the Viking Squad is being
overlooked here. Viking Squad aint nuthing ta fuck wit.
------
Muzza
This is not the answer HN is looking for, but Iceland is safe because it's
full of Icelanders. England was safe when it was full of Englishmen. Not
anymore. Sweden was safe when it was full of Swedes. Not anymore. Etc.
~~~
saraid216
This is actually my intuition, too: most of the Scandinavian countries'
successes are better attributed to racial homogeneity than to actually being
institutionally sounder.
I can't prove that, though; there have been discussions before about
immigration similarities, but nothing that I found convincing enough to
remember.
~~~
onemorepassword
Seriously, I fucking hate this uninformed American crap, like Europe is some
mythical white people planet?
"Racial homogeneity" my ass, Scandinavia or the rest of Europa isn't living in
the middle ages anymore. It's insulting and borderline racist nonsense.
~~~
mercurial
Immigration is pretty low in Scandinavia. Coming from Paris, it's quite
bizarre to visit Copenhagen or Árhus and wonder what happened to the non-white
people.
~~~
rdl
There are actually a lot of refugees/immigrants in the
Norway/Sweden/Denmark/Netherlands from Islamic countries, now. And, those
communities tend to commit a disproportionate number of crimes, although this
could be for a variety of reasons -- poverty before moving, poverty after
moving, culture, age, ... (Biology seems like the least likely, especially
given how bloodthirsty the vikings were only 50 generations ago)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
We Need More Alternatives to Facebook - submeta
https://www.technologyreview.com/s/604082/we-need-more-alternatives-to-facebook/?set=607909
======
kem
This touches on so many issues at once I don't even know where to start
(private versus public, social medial popularity cycles, distributed versus
centralized services...)
I think it's not just an alternative to Facebook we need, it's a distributed
paradigm, with a distributed network, with distributed services.
The tension/problem as I see it is this: we need distributed networks, where
people run their own services, and are servers as well as clients, but at the
same time a large proportion of people do not or cannot run their own
services. Solving that problem seems key to me--have people act as servers
without realizing it (maybe something like with torrents).
The success of things like Facebook and Twitter has never seemed like that
much of a mystery to me: they basically allow people to have a web page
without needing to make one. There was MySpace that did that, and then people
wanted to add on privacy and discussions, etc. to their webpage, so Facebook
supplied that; Twitter was basically providing a way for people to post
rss/Atom feeds, etc. But then you cede control to these large providers.
I don't think that model completely applies anymore, with messaging, photo
sharing, and what not becoming so integrated, but I think the fundamental
issues are the same, in that that the internet was developed with a greater
ratio of providers:users in mind than is the case now. I think there was a
much more federated model in mind when the internet was developed than is the
case today.
~~~
Sir_Substance
>The tension/problem as I see it is this: we need distributed networks, where
people run their own services, and are servers as well as clients, but at the
same time a large proportion of people do not or cannot run their own
services. Solving that problem seems key to me--have people act as servers
without realizing it (maybe something like with torrents).
We already have a model for this: email.
You and I can use whoever we want as email providers, including hosting our
own, and if you don't think I'm a trustworthy provider, you can drop my
messages.
The system isn't without it's corner cases, but it's certainly proven to be a
robust model over the last ~30 years.
The only thing it requires is standards. We already have one for facebook
messenger: XMPP. Facebook and Google used to support it, but they both shut it
down because they wanted to lock their users in harder. We have CalDav for
events, but again, none of the big players want to know about it.
We could have a "social status" standard, allowing you to send a robustly
versioned life update to other servers from whatever social service manager
you'd prefer, but you and I know that no amount of user outcry could persuade
any of the major players to adopt it. Network effects, peer pressure and
social expectation (e.g. please submit a snapchat along with your job
interview) power their meteoric growth.
What we need is a "Regulating the Gauge of Railways Act 1846" for the digital
age. We need international bodies to review software that has become mandatory
to the modern world, distill it down to a set of living specifications, and
then ram it down the throats of software vendors.
~~~
skybrian
Email is insecure and was overwhelmed by spam, driving people to use systems
(such as Gmail) that are good at filtering spam.
Any distributed system will need to figure out how to deal with spam and
abuse. That's hard to do without there being a dedicated team to deal with
flagged messages.
~~~
wmeredith
Eh, if you set up your social email client like Twitter, you only get messages
from those people you follow. Done.
~~~
anigbrowl
Then you miss out on the social discovery aspect which is a key part of social
networking. You're just avoiding the problem of where to go by cutting off
your own legs.
~~~
marmaduke
Seems contextual whether that's good or bad: one theory of sleep is that we
lose consciousness so that we don't go out and get ourselves killed in low
visibility conditions.
~~~
anigbrowl
Social discovery is obviously something people want or they wouldn't use
social media services in the first place. Pointing to the existence of other
contexts where that doesn't matter is neither relevant nor insightful.
It's like saying 'why worry about these problems, just don't don't use the the
internet at all.' I still like paper books and other things and usually spend
a day a week off the internet but that doesn't help anyone who's trying to
solve an internet problem, does it?
------
ohthehugemanate
Every time I see a sentence that starts with "we need..." I automatically
think "shut up and build it, or you're just complaining."
If it's a real need, then building it is a good idea, and will probably make
you money. But 99.9% of the time, it's just a turn of phrase way to bitch
about the way the world and human kind actually works. Yeah, if we had another
Facebook the world would be better. And if I had wheels I'd be a cart. What's
your point?
We don't have another Facebook, and we aren't likely to get one, because we
don't actually "need" that enough to pay tens or hundreds of people to build
it. You just want to wish it into existence.
TL;DR: shut up and build it, or stop complaining.
~~~
ben_jones
I've actually spent quite a bit of time working on a design document for an
open source version of the Facebook platform. I got a fair bit of the
architecture and requirements down for what I believed would make the project
successful. Then I came to the slow realization that the world had
categorically no use for a Facebook alternative.
The features of Facebook are largely meaningless. What matters is the absolute
stranglehold Facebook has and will maintain via acquisitions of users. It's
not a question of simply getting the user to register for another site. Many
Facebook users will have as many as five or more Facebook products on their
mobile. They'll also be logged into a half dozen other properties on the
internet with Facebook's OAuth scheme.
Icing on the cake? Tinder. Every college aged person I've spoken to has little
interest in Facebook. But they've all reinstalled it in order to use Tinder.
You cannot get a mass migration to occur unless their is an absolute PR
Apocalypse at Facebook or if you can offer absolute parity to the slow
dopamine drip provided by constant notifications and social validations coming
from all their products. At once.
~~~
Bahamut
I think there is space for an alternative - keep in mind that that doesn't
mean that they have to be hugely popular.
For example, some online communities I am a part of subsist mainly in chat
rooms, or forums. Those communities are so tightly knit in many ways. While a
lot of us are also friends on FB, our ties in these communities are still very
strong.
~~~
anigbrowl
I'm in some such communities too, but efforts to get anything going on other
sites outside fb come to nothing because you just end up with more social
media to keep track of for no real benefit - you can't _do_ anything
sufficiently interesting that you can't already do on FB, and you've lost all
the network effects for content discovery, rapid dissemination of news or
sufficiently entertaining content etc.
OK you gain privacy but that's really a negative freedom. I assume everything
I do online is visible to spies and corporations anyway unless I go to the
bother of running Tor (and probably even then), so moving some of my social
activity off FB isn't much more effective than virtually waving a fist in Mark
Zuckerberg's direction.
Let's be realistic here, small specialist forums are simply not going to
overcome large-scale network effects absent massive functional advantages.
~~~
type0
> I assume everything I do online is visible to spies and corporations anyway
> unless I go to the bother of running Tor
Not quite sure what's your point here but most subject specific forums on the
web have a huge bunch of users with nicknames and not their real names. With
the same reasoning you could also say: no need to close the door to WC when
you go there to do your needs since people outside know what you're doing
there anyway! If you use VPN and a lot less of your personal information will
be sold to advertisers.
------
65827
The alternative increasingly is to simple delete facebook and live a more
offline life. Starting to see it become more and more trendy nowadays,
especially among teenagers. It's considered retro and hip to just schedule
social time and disconnect completely
~~~
blatherard
Here's one bit of anecdata in response. I've tried to disconnect from social
media and get out in the real world. I took an improv class in NYC with about
15 other people, a range of ages & backgrounds. On the last day of the class,
a number of the students were asking around for Facebook profiles to keep in
touch. When asked, I replied that I didn't have a Facebook account anymore and
it was...awkward, to say the least. Like, giving someone an email or a phone
number seems much more formal and/or like more of a commitment, I think.
Anyway, I came out of it feeling a little disillusioned about the viability of
an offline social life. Though this was a group of mid-20 to 40-something
people, without the teens you mention.
~~~
codingdave
I have had similar experiences, more than once, but it wasn't awkward. Most of
the time, people just say OK, and go on with their life. A couple times, we
talked about it, and they commented that they wouldn't be able to get in touch
with me again. We talked about whether being connected on Facebook vs. never
talking again really would amount to much of a difference in the long run, and
agreed that it really would not.
At the end of the day, a Facebook connection from someone that you otherwise
don't communicate with, or run into in the real world isn't important. So
those conversations are only awkward if you make them so.
~~~
nogbit
Well said, similar experiences myself. If someone is worth being a friend then
I get their email or phone number. If it's at a professional level then
LinkedIn is more than enough.
I think Facebook is sad, very sad, and the majority of people waste their
lives away on it.
------
evdev
From my perspective, problems with facebook:
1) Anti-privacy, megalomaniacal nature of network.
2) Social cost of having removed the normal ways we moderate each other's
behavior. E.g. when someone is a narcissistic bore, you talk to them less and
less at the barbecues and eventually events start happening they're not
invited to. Facebook takes the people most willing to ignore social boundaries
and customs and puts them center stage.
3) Opportunity costs of not having mechanisms to form more naturally-moderated
social groups, but with a wider pool of potential people than are in your
physical social graph. This has always been the dream of the social internet.
4) "Fake news", specifically the moral hazard of providing an environment that
plays to the "worst" tendencies of media consumption. This is obviously
dependent on our values, and how patronizing we're willing to be. But the
hazard is a real issue especially when your network attracts people under one
pretense--hang out with your friends/kids/grandkids--and then has this non-
advertised effect of sticking you in a media echo chamber. This unlike when
people choose to go out and fight their echo chamber in a way that's fairly
important.
5) Like 3) but now for "good" media consumption, or a Healthy Democratic Civil
Discourse, or whatever. I'm glib because this is on the razor's edge of
smuggling in whatever values we daydream about imposing on the world.
A lot of us can come up with the David-and-Goliath dream of a distributed
network, but I think it's interesting that this is probably neutral-at-best
for 4), which is the issue du jour. One could easily see things getting worse
and articles being published with the thesis that people need to be de-
balkanized for the sake of civic discourse.
Also, the REAL contrarian take here is that things are close to optimal.
People are succeeding at 3) and by extension 2), just in niche special
interest groups that aren't salient to us in the steady state. The "problem"
is that many of us lack the conviction or self-direction to quit media
behaviors we don't like. Meanwhile 4) and 5) are really about the bankruptcy
of modern ideologies, etc. etc.
~~~
anigbrowl
I don't get your 2) because I have no problem ignoring people I don't like.
But I agree that bad behavior is rewarded and that this is a problem on social
networking in general (jackassery on YT, Twitter trolls, things like Infowars)
I'd add to your list the imposition of censorship with no feedback mechanism -
Facebook's 'community standards' are wholly arbitrary, and I find it extremely
disturbing that you can share almost any kind of violent content there with no
problem, but anything too sexual risks a date with the banhammer. It's
perpetuating standards of social control and sexism that actively hurt people.
------
donpdonp
[http://scuttlebot.io/](http://scuttlebot.io/) is a distributed log file meant
to be an application platform. It has some nice design choices and is worth
looking at in the context of making a new social network.
~~~
tomcam
Didn't know about that. Thank you – it looks like a well-put together project
------
godelski
It seems to me that a social network is one of those natural monopolies. It
works so well because so many people use it. Remember the big reason many
social network alternatives failed, no one else was on them.
There are some things (very few in fact) that just work better as monopolies.
But that just means you need to regulate it differently. And there's an
interesting discussion, how best to regulate natural monopolies.
~~~
adventured
The big reason many other networks failed, is because no one else was on them?
Prove that as the cause, as opposed to them sucking as the reason. MySpace &
Friendster were already very substantial when Facebook came along and
destroyed them, because they were horrible services.
The better question is, why would you need or want to regulate it as a natural
monopoly? Specifically: to accomplish what?
Let me give you some examples.
1) To force FB to open up, allowing other social networks to openly ride on
its network / social data (the broadband one pipe lots of delivery companies
premise). Ok, now you're begging for a radical increase in abuse of personal
data. And you're going to need some new (or expanded existing) bureaucracy
agency to manage it all, which will open up new government abuses without a
doubt (happens every time; and said agency will radically slow down
innovation, which also happens every single time). Some obnoxious SNEA -
Social Network Enforcement Agency - will get created, and that'll be the end
of any innovation in social media; if you give the Feds an inch of new power,
they'll take a thousand miles.
Besides, you can already replicate your social network onto other platforms by
allowing FB apps to access your list of friends. Most people don't care
because there simply are not that many highly compelling social concepts to
explore that are worth the effort to maintain/use. There will never be large
numbers of compelling social offerings; there inherently can't be as people
have finite time, the hurdle to acquire it is very high. It's work/effort to
maintain these networks for the end user, they do not want to have to upkeep
it all.
2) To enforce higher standards on privacy. Well, we can already pass
legislation to do that comprehensively across all media platforms, if it makes
sense. It'd be ridiculous to regulate one platform for that purpose.
3) To limit various corporate abuses by FB (Instagram/Snapchat, ala Internet
Explorer/Netscape). Well, we already have anti-trust laws for that and
thousands of other laws & regulations and numerous giant three letter
enforcement agencies.
Meanwhile, while the argument is being made for regulating Facebook as a
natural monopoly, the next technology paradigm is being born somewhere to make
them far less relevant. That process has been repeating itself for 60 years or
so now, requiring very little actual regulation by the government.
~~~
crdoconnor
>Meanwhile, while the argument is being made for regulating Facebook as a
natural monopoly, the next technology paradigm is being born somewhere to make
them far less relevant. That process has been repeating itself for 60 years or
so now, requiring very little actual regulation by the government.
^^ Just world fallacy
In reality, the DoJ deal with Microsoft is probably partly what led to the
second internet startup renaissance. MS were still bullies and they still
inhibited innovation by squashing smaller competitors but it would have been a
_whole_ lot worse if Microsoft were not defanged by that deal.
Unfortunately anti-trust enforcement seems to have gone out of vogue these
days (starting with Bush, but Obama was worse than useless in that respect as
well).
------
dgudkov
Many people miss the fact that Facebook as a product is not about the website
and related services. It's _your social connections_ that are the product for
you (and for Facebook itself). The technology is just a wrapper and is
secondary in this case. In order to create a viable alternative to Facebook
one should find a way to create a new kind of social good attractive to many
(which is much harder when Facebook already exists). So it's more about social
good engineering rather than coding.
------
Eerie
No, we don't need More Alternatives to Facebook. We need Less Alternatives to
Facebook. That is, Zero Alternatives to Facebook AND Zero Facebook.
Stop wasting your time!
~~~
danellis
Why is keeping in touch with friends in one place online wasting time?
~~~
type0
More like waisting your freedom, integrity, privacy etc...
~~~
danellis
Can you give me an example of how my freedom, integrity or privacy have been
wasted? They're not taking anything I haven't willingly given them.
~~~
type0
How do you know, if the latest reports is to go by they are buying personal
information from third parties in order to construct better dossiers.
------
thr0waway1239
I wonder what traits will define the Facebook transcender like the Windows
transcender [1] mentioned in PG's essay.
You can argue that since that essay (2005) the iPhone/iPad and Android and
then eventually "all meaningful apps becoming web enabled" has mostly made
Windows the last choice amongst the candidates rather than the first when it
comes to selecting personal computing devices. Right now, people who use
Windows see it in the same way people see crusty old government bureaucracies
- it is just one of those things you deal with because you have to, and move
away from ASAP.
[1] [http://paulgraham.com/ideas.html](http://paulgraham.com/ideas.html)
------
erikb
We actually have alternatives. G+, Twitter, Gnu Social, Slack, Wechat. The
question is what's your flavour and how do you convince your friends to switch
with you.
------
WCityMike
My perfect Facebook would be crosspollinating Facebook and the structure of a
RSS reader. I want to be able to skim through EVERY update on EVERY page and
person I follow, star/flag the ones I'm interested in, and then read the ones
I'm interested in. Because of its popularity, Facebook has all the content I'm
interested in within its walled garden -- but its browsing experience sucks.
IMO.
------
davnicwil
Shameless plug, but very relevant since it is literally built to be an
alternative to the current mainstream social networks: I'm hacking on
[https://postbelt.com](https://postbelt.com) \- a privacy-first, ad-free,
text-only, discussion-focused social network.
Check it out if it sounds interesting :-)
------
tracker1
What we need are (as much as possible) unbiased sources of news, or news
feeds. Right now, there's so much bias in the media, and in news outlets to
the point where it's hard to distinguish fact from fiction, or see news that
might otherwise make things "difficult" for those organizations.
The profit above all else direction the large media news outlets have taken
may serve their profit motives, but do little to actually further human
knowledge of current or pressing events.
~~~
cJ0th
There obviously are bad news that no one should consume (i.e. "fake news") but
I'd argue there is no such thing as good news in the sense that every one
should read them to become informed.
To enable the public to make informed decisions every individual should come
to face with a random selection of sources on a daily basis so that echo
chambers get reduced and a problem-solving mentality can come into being.
The problem - as you've stated - is indeed that all news websites want to
maximize views/profits. This, for one thing, leads to market segmentation
(echo chambers). For another thing, Hotelling's law is at work within each
segment so that the news from your preferred sources are very similar. If CNN
writes about Trump's tweet instead of mass starvation then chances are very
high that it's the same with CBS.
~~~
djsumdog
I liked the old term for "fake news." Before 2016 we just called it "news."
What seems like a free press in the US and the world is heavily controlled by
less than a dozen conglomerates. They often game the system, mixing propaganda
with news to create a narrative. Just look at all the pro-Monsanto comments on
Hackernews and the recent court revelations that Monsanto had a big marketing
program to post pro-company commends on tons of major/minor social networks.
~~~
tracker1
There's a big difference between not being anti-gmo, and being pro-
monstanto... I'm pretty biased against larger corporations and want a serious
reversion of IP legislation and practice (though feel some of it has a place,
we've just gone too far).
It really depends on the specifics. There's plenty of things in nature than
can kill you. Most people are allergic to something. That said, it really
depends, and most of what's done to GMO products aren't _that_ different than
the selective breeding that has gone on for millennia, and the stuff that
actually occurs in nature.
Just because there's always been some manipulation of news/media, doesn't mean
we should or have to accept that moving forward. I wish I had the time and
could cover the expense of coming up with something better, at least a place
to start.
------
mattbgates
Google tried and failed. There are alternatives in other countries.. V
Kontakte and odnoklassniki for Russia, WeChat and Qzone for China, though
other countries other than those two are using what Americans use. There are a
few other things like Snapchat and Kik that teenagers are using.
Basically, if you think about the time you were a teenager: your parents are
old. If they are using Facebook, than Facebook must not be cool. If your
parents aren't using it, than it must be cool. In Facebook's defense: adults
are more valuable as users than teenagers are, as they are clicking on ads and
buying things. So there wouldn't be any reason for Facebook to even try to be
that "cool" place where teenagers go.
So for someone to capture that niche the way Facebook had done would be very
hard to do. I'm around Zuckerberg's age and at first, Facebook never appealed
to me, until they removed the .edu cap. So that was an important step of
getting Facebook to the entire world. It made everything so easy to connect
with people and "keep in touch" via messages, wall posts, and photos. The
"Like" button seemed to be something the world had never really seen as well
and made it even easier to "show" you acknowledged it, rather than having to
respond.
I'm sure if Google Plus attempted to be a compliment, rather than be a
replacement, it would've had more success. And the next big social media
network that is an alternative to Facebook will need to focus on that. People
don't really like "change". However, they are willing to learn and switch to
things that are more useful and helpful. For the older generation, which on
Facebook -- 25+ is probably the most prominent users -- they really don't care
to switch because their friends and families aren't using anything else. This
is where Facebook has great strength.
Where Facebook and Google tend to fail is: they want to be everyone's
everything. They seem to want to dominate all aspects of our lives. And while
it sounds great and it has worked in China (with WeChat), it is not appealing
to everyone that uses their products. However, when you have so many products
within your already-huge enterprise: those products get lost or belittled. How
many features does Google and Facebook have that many people don't even know
exists? Facebook is social media and Google is search. Both have a little bit
of extra pull with the open source and developer community, BUT.. they need to
stay focused on what they are best at doing.
As a web app developer, I keep an eye on those failed or lesser known products
from Facebook and Google, and make my own and charge for them. It is likely
that they are free on Facebook and Google, but people might not know they
actually exist because again: Google is for search, Facebook is for social
communication. Anything more than that... is lost.
~~~
hdhzy
> As a web app developer, I keep an eye on those failed or lesser known
> products from Facebook and Google
Could you provide an example or two? I wonder if you mean something like Buzz
and Reader or something completely different.
~~~
mattbgates
Another thing that I think is becoming more apparent is the fact that despite
the "privacy policies" of Facebook and Google, they will hand over information
because they record it. With security and privacy a concern, more companies
that advocate their stance and clearly state that they either do not keep the
information or they do not share it is important and a big selling point, and
will be in the future.
Look at ProtonMail. Secure email service. It is booming in business because
people are seeking alternative to Gmail, Yahoo (notorious for data breaches),
and Live mail.
So there is likely a huge market for this as more and more people become aware
of just how much data about them is being sold to third-parties.
------
andreasgonewild
Agreed; distributed, free and secure group communications is a much needed,
missing piece of the puzzle. If only I could figure out how to make it pay the
rent. A couple of extra brains/hands wouldn't hurt either...
[https://github.com/andreas-gone-wild/snackis](https://github.com/andreas-
gone-wild/snackis)
------
ams6110
To me, the alternative to Facebook has been around for a long time: email.
The people I keep in touch with online all have email accounts. Sending email
to one, a few, or all of them is easy.
~~~
gvurrdon
Email mostly works for me, particularly for friends and family. The problem is
that many people prioritise Facebook over email and frequently forget to
reply, or don't send email in the first place as they assume that everyone has
seen their Facebook post. So, outside friends and family, not having a
Facebook account tends to mean not getting information.
------
ouid
There's lots of alternatives to Facebook. Facebook is for people who don't
care about alternatives.
~~~
anigbrowl
No it isn't. I've had accounts on numerous alternative social networks and
none of them are much good as general platforms because there aren't enough
other people using them, or using them often enough.
Stop pretending network effects don't exist or that your social media usage
habits must be true for everyone else.
~~~
ouid
replacement != alternative. Not using Facebook is a proper alternative to
Facebook. What Facebook provides isn't necessary, and what's bad about
Facebook is probably intrinsic to the entire social media model.
------
nemoniac
How on earth has Facebook become the arbiter of our collective morality?
------
dyeje
There are plenty of alternatives already, you just need to use them.
------
5_minutes
We just need a modern version of Geocities.
------
skrowl
... and Reddit!
------
fergazen
I've developed a sort of 'core technology' that can be used to build out what
can hopefully become another option in the social media arena. It's open
source. It's supports a fully threaded 'tree' of content, rather than just a
linear stream like Facebook and Twitter. You create SubNodes, rather than
'tweets' for example. Technology stack is Java, TypeScript, Google Polymer,
Jackrabbit JCR, MongoDb, SpringBoot.
Demonstration site is: [http://sbnode.com](http://sbnode.com)
------
wcummings
Email and something like Google Groups does 80% of what Facebook does.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
New Facebook Android App - reviews scare me - vividmind
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.facebook.katana
======
macleanjr
It's possible that these reviews are for the update that was pushed out on
12/6, and not the native app that is supposed to be released today.
~~~
Pr0
They are. The new native app isn't out yet.
~~~
vividmind
I was really astounded to see so many negative reviews. And after Google
switched reviews to G+ people are more careful to leave reviews too... Anyway,
looking forward to see the new app.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
How Long Before VPNs Become Illegal? - nthitz
http://torrentfreak.com/how-long-before-vpns-become-illegal-120615/
======
ChuckMcM
Never of course. To make them illegal would force the question of a
constitutional right to privacy. So in the US at least it won't happen.
That being said, I expect various people to continue to obfuscate and make it
confusing. At some point I expect a 'VaaS' type service to be announced with
pretty compelling economics, and it will be impossible to tell that the
service provides access to certain third parties.
Phil Zimmerman is doing his part with Silent Circle. That too is looking to
force the question.
~~~
aqme28
Privacy as a Service sounds like a very plausible business model for the
future (or even today).
edit: I forgot about this[1], so apparently it already exists!
[1]: [http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-57412225-281/this-
internet...](http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-57412225-281/this-internet-
provider-pledges-to-put-your-privacy-first-always/)
~~~
AncientPC
Tor has its own issues (difficult set up, high latency), as well as VPNs
(single point failure / tracking, US-based companies must obey warrants).
Perhaps there's an opportunity for a company based in Switzerland to run a
private TOR network for obfuscation with guaranteed bandwidth. Private TOR
network has its own problems though. You need a large number of users to
anonymize each other's data, and the block of assigned IPs can be treated as a
single entity and blocked / rerouted as a result.
~~~
lambada
I'd argue Tor has removed the difficult set-up recently. Now it's as simple as
downloading the recommended Browser Bundle, run it and you get a standalone
(branded?) Firefox completely set up and ready for Tor surfing.
Admittedly, it is still complicated to set-up your existing web-browser to use
it, and latency is still a huge issue - not helped by the limited number of
exit nodes.
------
fleitz
They'll never become illegal, it will just become like guns in crime, use a
VPN, get an extra 5 years for whatever your thoughtcrime might be. Paid with
bitcoins? Here's 10.
------
jfoutz
The day after there are no legal requirements for handling health care data or
financial data on the internet.
------
grecy
Maybe they won't be outright illegal, but I could see laws being passed so
VPNs must keep extremely detailed logs of users and their activity, thus
making them useless as a way to mask online activity.
~~~
AncientPC
What happens when you use an off-shore VPN that doesn't keep logs?
TorrentFreak listed a bunch of them with their respective privacy policies:
[https://torrentfreak.com/which-vpn-providers-really-take-
ano...](https://torrentfreak.com/which-vpn-providers-really-take-anonymity-
seriously-111007/)
~~~
grecy
Sure, that's a good way around it right now.
But I can also see America forcing their will on other countries and forcing
them to keep detailed logs too (let's face it, the UK is right there with
America)
Countries like the one that hosts TPB may hold out as long as possible, but
eventually the rest of the "internet world" could just ban those IPs or
whatever. (just like they are banning the TPB IP now).
What I'm saying is, I can see the day where it's illegal or extremely
difficult to use a VPN anonymously, from any country.
------
jkap
It seems unlikely that VPNs will ever become completely illegal, at least not
in the US. Too many very large companies use them for Congress to consider it.
They may make them illegal for non-corporate uses, but that would be difficult
to enforce and overall useless.
~~~
noarchy
I can easily see governments forcing ISPs to blacklist the IP addresses of
known VPN servers. I'm only slightly surprised that this hasn't happened yet
in the UK and other such places. The first step is to try to ban direct access
to websites. Then they'll likely try to ban the workarounds. Yes, power users
will always find a way around these things, but it will work to stop many, I
suspect.
And as for corporate/government VPN users, maybe this will be an excuse to
introduce a VPN "license" for those who will be allowed to use them.
~~~
wtracy
The big tech companies I've worked for use VPN heavily for remote workers, so
my first reaction was, "This could never happen."
But now that you mention it, I could see a situation where domestic VPN
providers are forced to log user data (or be on the hook for copyright
violations when the VPN is used by employees) and ISPs are strong-armed into
blacklisting overseas VPN providers. That's actually kind of scary.
------
res0nat0r
Perfect time for another episode of:
Betteridge's Law of Headlines: "Any headline which ends in a question mark can
be answered by the word 'no'".
~~~
Karunamon
Q: How Long Before VPNs Become Illegal?
A: No.
Doesn't flow too well here ;)
~~~
chc
Eh, it very well might be the best answer. It's a "Have you stopped beating
your grandmother?" kind of question. Perhaps the famous Zen non-answer "Mu"
would be better, but "No" is about as close an English equivalent as you'll
get.
Q: How long until they ban VPNs?
A: No. Just no.
------
jcr
Never. The article is mostly fear mongering on a slow news day. The reason why
it would be impossible to make a "VPN" illegal is simple; Internet commerce
transactions are done over an encrypted tunnel (httpS via SSL/TLS), and there
is really no simple technical differences between one kind of secure tunnel
and another.
For those that don't know, SSL/TLS based VPN's do exist, and the most common
implementation is OpenVPN. It's based on the same OpenSSL (library) code that
your web browser is (most likely) using.
<http://openvpn.net/>
The SSL/TLS based VPN's use " _only_ " 128 to 160 bit encryption, and if your
tin foil hat is on tight enough to cut off your circulation, then this fact
makes you nervous. You can run OpenVPN via UDP over a "tun" interface (OSI
Layer 3) or even a "tap" interface (OSI Layer 2), and compared to many VPN-ish
alternatives, it's pretty fast in my tests.
The other common light-weight approach to VPN's is using PPTP (Point to Point
Tunneling Protocol). I have _NOT_ (recently) studied the crypto employed in
PPTP implementations, but I'd guess it's nearly on par with SSL/TLS. It's been
eons since I've messed with PPTP, so I'm going to keep my (outdated) opinions
mostly to myself. The most fair thing to say is there is (can be) some crypto
involved, and it can be pretty fast.
Though I'm currently working on some OpenVPN stuff for firends, I personally
prefer the more (ahem) sophisticated (read: difficult and complicated) VPN
solutions based on SSH, or better, IPSec. They are a lot more work, but they
tend to be more robust and more resistant (when done properly --and any VPN
done wrong is just a false sense of security). The down-side with SSH based
tunnels is there is a greater performance overhead with TCP based connections,
and hence, you get reduced throughput. IPSec is better, but it's even more
difficult to get right.
For a lot of testing I use Tunnelr.com. They offer both OpenVPN and SSH
(SOCKS) based VPN's for a cheap price.
<https://tunnelr.com/>
It's kind of sad that privacy is being equated with piracy, but the "lump it
altogether" folks are idiots. There are actually _lots_ of extremely good (and
legal) reasons to use both VPN's and other types of secure connections...
--Every time you buy something from Amazon or similar, you're most likely
using a secure connection.
The original article has a link to:
[https://torrentfreak.com/which-vpn-providers-really-take-
ano...](https://torrentfreak.com/which-vpn-providers-really-take-anonymity-
seriously-111007/)
Sadly, the above listing of data retention policies of various VPN providers
is already out of date. For example, iPredator (from the folks at
ThePirateBay) are now logging IP address in accordance with the EU data
retention laws going into effect in Sweden.
[https://blog.ipredator.se/2012/03/the-question-of-data-
reten...](https://blog.ipredator.se/2012/03/the-question-of-data-
retention.html)
The iPredator/TPB blog post is intentionally distracting and painfully vague
on details about the logging they've implemented to comply with the law.
(NOTE: I stumbled on the poorly named iPredator service of TPB because they
offer PPTP based VPN's.)
The same may or may not be true of other EU based services listed in the
TorrentFreak link above. See the following for reasonably updated info:
<https://wiki.vorratsdatenspeicherung.de/Transposition>
If you do any work on Computer Vision (CV) or other types of image/video
analysis (Machine Learning) based on data downloaded from the Internet, you
need to be extremely careful. When you have scripts/programs/spiders
downloading (image/video) data for you, your never know what "kind" of data is
on the other end of any link, and that data may very well be illegal! --It
sucks, but this is the reality everyone lives with. If you take a step back,
you'll realize how normal browsing of the Internet is really no different than
running your own spider to collect data. Every link you click is a potential
violation of some law.
~~~
kfreds
OpenVPN supports all ciphers supported by the OpenSSL library, so you can for
instance get 256 bit AES-CBC if you want. I´ve seen benchmarks with one tunnel
running >400 Mbit, so you can certainly get some nice performance.
PPTP* is broken, and should only be used for anonymisation, never to ensure
confidentiality or integrity of the data in the tunnel. PPTPs encryption
scheme is MPPE which is based on RC4, and tunnel traffic can be decrypted in a
matter of minutes unless the key is sufficiently strong. This is almost never
the case since the password is the only thing used for key material. IMHO this
is pretty much irrelevant anyway since you can do a MITM attack to hijack the
connection or downgrade the session to not use encryption. So basically the
encryption doesn´t matter.
* I´m told the exception would be to use PPTP with EAP-TLS which is certificate-based. However I don´t have any experience setting that up, so I´m staying quiet on that one.
As for data retention, I don´t see how VPN providers have any obligation to
log. And even if they did perhaps a little bit of collective civil
disobedience might be in order?
Full disclosure: I run a VPN service.
~~~
jwr
I don't know which VPN service you run, but I looked at tunnelr and the
showstopper for me is that it _only_ supports OpenVPN.
In order to use VPNs on my Mac and on my mobile devices, I have to pay for two
separate VPN services, which is a deal breaker.
I would much rather use a service that supports both OpenVPN and PPTP, with a
bunch of disclaimers. I understand the tradeoff and I am willing to make it.
~~~
jcr
You might want to take a closer look at tunnelr.com. They _do_ support both
OpenVPN and OpenSSH based tunnels, and both of these work fine on MacOS. I
don't own a "normal" Mac, but I did see MacOS tutorials on their site, in
fact, there are two tutorials, with each using a different method.
You were a bit vague when simply stating "mobile device" but if memory serves
me, Both OpenVPN and OpenSSH will work on some "mobile" platforms (Android,
iOS, etc.). I've never tried it personally, and I don't know what kind of
"mobile device" you use, so for your specific case, I could very well be
wrong.
Using OpenSSH via SOCKS support in applications or by using a SOCKS-Wrapper
like "DSOCKS" by Dug Song or similar ("Sockify for windiws, etc), take more
effort than running OpenVPN. It might take more effort, but if you don't mind
the hassle, it's most likely more secure than the common alternatives
(OpenVPN, PPTP, etc.). The only thing better than OpenSSH (in my opinion)
would be using a correctly configured IPSec implementation. But getting IPSec
right makes OpenSSH look very easy.
You might want to note how in this discussion both Fredrik Strömberg (kfreds
-runs the Mullvad VPN service) and myself have intentionally tried to avoid
disparaging PPTP. Whether good or bad, a lot of people like PPTP for various
reasons, and a lot of VPN services offer it as an option. Other than for the
sake of curiosity, learning, and experimentation, I would never use PPTP. When
it comes to both security and privacy, PPTP has many known problems and some
VPN service providers refuse to support it due to these issues.
Trying to be fair to those who like PPTP is being a bit too generous since the
security and privacy of people is at stake. None the less, development work is
still being done on PPTP, and it has supposedly made some improvements over
the years.
EDIT: I misspelt Fredrik Strömberg's name. Sorry. (sigh).
~~~
jwr
iOS devices do not support OpenVPN nor OpenSSH. You can use L2TP, PPTP or
IPSec for VPNs.
So, I can either pay for tunnelr.com and have zero VPN support on my iOS
devices, pay for two separate services, or switch to a provider that supports
both. I suggested that while it's fine to tell people not to use PPTP, some of
us will _still_ want to use it, because it is better than nothing at all
(please don't make me argue that it really is better than no VPN at all).
Here's a statement of fact: at present, the only reason tunnelr.com does not
get my money is because it does not support PPTP alongside OpenVPN.
~~~
jcr
> please don't make me argue that it really is better than no VPN at all
No argument at all from me. ;)
What you've said seems blatantly pragmatic to me. --It's sad how so much of HN
these days is pointless arguments. Sure, it's good that we're accurate in what
we say, and fair about it, but every word we utter should not lead to an
argument. Oh well...
Anyhow, I did find one SSH app for iOS (iPad) when I last looked, but I still
agree; Whether or not it's possible to get other apps to play well with SOCKS
would be a real headache.
I'm not a real iOS user, but I have helped my parents with their iPad a bit.
I'm curious how much of a pain it is on iOS to get IPSec set up properly?
IPSec can be really tricky to set up properly, but once you've got it right,
it's the very best VPN solution. A lot of companies have tried to make IPSec
more "usable" and "user-friendly" on desktops, but it's still an unwanted pain
for users. For admins, testing it for leaks is often a convoluted nightmare.
The thought of attempting both the setup and testing on a mobile device
(iOS/Android) makes me shudder.
------
eli
_...it’s by no means unthinkable. In Iran, where a quarter of all Internet
subscribers use VPNs, the government has already announced a crackdown on
privacy-enhancing tools that bypass local law._
Err, yeah. That's not a very convincing argument.
~~~
ajross
You took that quote out of context. It was speaking to feasibility, not
policy.
~~~
eli
I don't think that's out of context at all, so I guess I'm reading it
differently than you are. Seems clear to me that they are saying it happened
there so therefore it could happen here.
------
7952
I find it hard to believe that governments can ever do anything to stop file
sharing in the long term. The more things are forced underground the harder
they are to stop. The DMCA was intended to stop piracy but ultimately gave
legal cover to numerous sites that would otherwise have been sued out of
existence.
------
guard-of-terra
You should notice this is orchestrated by countries with consistently high
scores on various internet freedom ratings. They turn blind eye on any
violation if it's reasoned with IP protection, and they crack down on other
countries for rumors or vague plans on blocking some sites or just "because".
------
pasbesoin
IIRC, prohibition of VPN-type "circumvention" was already part of one or more
draft legislation initiatives in the U.S. -- serious initiatives. I'm not
sure, but was it part of the early SOPA/PIPA drafts -- a portion that was
moderated or removed as part of the "appeasement" efforts of the legislation's
proponents?
In summary, it's my recollection that this is already being pushed for, in and
by the U.S. government and/or its lobbyist "masters". And they don't have to
outlaw all VPN connections -- just establish either legal justification or
extra-judicial powers to harass and/or arrest you if you can't qualify and
justify your use of a VPN to their satisfaction.
Keep in mind: They don't have to apply such powers universally. Just enough to
provide the desired effect.
------
altrego99
Kind of a side point, as many people join and use the tor network, will the
speed of tor increase - or atleast move towards the average Internet speed in
the world?
Edit: Only reason why I don't use tor yet is that everytime I tried, speed was
slow. Thanks for the opinions on the question.
~~~
hack_edu
It should definitely get better over time, but the latency issue is pretty
tough to get around. Bouncing between a half dozen nodes, surely back and
forth across an ocean once or twice between each request and piecing
everything back together, is a pretty tough problem to solve. Especially when
a disproportionate number of nodes seem to be located in Central Europe.
Its also an issue that most exit nodes restrict their outbound speed and ports
they route outward. Without restricting the speed in my tor configuration my
exit node holds a constant 10/MBs all day even with only common ports open.
Once you stop restricting ports you'll be getting multiple cease-and-desist
notices within a matter of days since all your traffic will be absorbed by
torrents.
Someone will likely come up with an equally/more secure option before Tor gets
all that close to your average user's connection speed.
~~~
coolnow
People torrenting over Tor make my blood boil.
------
Malic
Assuming Google's SPDY protocol catches on wide-scale (which is likely, I
believe), then SSL will be pervasive; SSL is a requirement of SPDY. At that
point, most web traffic will be encrypted.
------
rsanchez1
They'll become illegal when Obama wills it. SOPA/PIPA/CISPA don't matter now
that Congress is irrelevant.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why do many people feel the Chinese can't possibly be OK with their government? - w1ntermute
https://www.quora.com/Why-do-many-people-feel-that-Chinese-cant-possibly-be-basically-ok-with-their-government-or-society?share=1
======
throwaway90446
Because the brainwashing of Western education is that the values of the
Enlightenment are the only acceptable values.
------
altcognito
Principals of democracy and capitalism underlie each other. If you believe
capitalism is by and large the best system going, you probably also believe
that free markets require a reasonable amount of transparency and freedom.
(Freedom of capital to move, businesses to operate without interference)
These principals apply to science, business, and in governance. Ideas should
be held up to the light of day and tested. That's the enlightenment.
You can always accept less...
------
sam_lowry_
Same question for Russians, please ;-)
------
jack9
US citizens aren't ok with their government, but that's not the issue. It's a
risk management issue. Be reasonably comfortable and survive, versus die
fighting while others watch on.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Understanding Image Virality [pdf] - sytelus
https://www.cv-foundation.org/openaccess/content_cvpr_2015/papers/Deza_Understanding_Image_Virality_2015_CVPR_paper.pdf
======
M_Bakhtiari
I'd be impressed if they could find an algorithm to determine the dankness of
a meme.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Daggerfall: Now available for free - tom9729
http://www.bethblog.com/index.php/2009/07/09/daggerfall-now-available-for-free/
======
troygoode
If by "now" you mean July of 2009 - check the URL.
~~~
tom9729
Oops, didn't realize how old this was. I saw a link posted in the Amazon
forums for Skyrim and thought I'd share it here.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: Listen to Interview with Derrick Mar of Pathrise (YC W18) - jacobpedd
https://anchor.fm/hs/episodes/26-Pathrise-w-Derrick-Mar-e2j55p
======
mtmail
Blog posts aren't part of Show HN
([https://news.ycombinator.com/showhn.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/showhn.html))
so I'd argue interviews shouldn't either.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
CLisp needs maintainers - ghostDancer
http://article.gmane.org/gmane.lisp.clisp.general/14256
======
616c
You will see that a few people ask: why care in the face of such impressive
native code compilers: Steel Bank, Clozure, and Embedded (although maybe ECL
is short for something else; ironically they also needed a new maintainer as
the previous guy became busy): porting and bootstrapping.
[https://www.common-lisp.net/~bmastenbrook/new-
sbcl/porting.h...](https://www.common-lisp.net/~bmastenbrook/new-
sbcl/porting.html)
With CLISP that worked on ARM, I am not sure how much slower it would have
been to port SBCL to ARM architectures, which is less <1 year of usable, even
though CCL had it for years (and why I started compiling CCL using the AUR
mechanism on Arch Linux prior to using SBCL in the official repos, for later
playing with RPi stuff).
So, thanks for the awesome Lisp, and thanks to you guys specifically because
it is niche and thankless with so many jokes about the Lisp/CL community. Even
on HN, you can hear the mumbling when people post Lisp articles.
(hail (clisp))
~~~
jordigh
Thanks, I was looking for an excuse to try to help CLisp. This might be it.
~~~
616c
Cool. And that is coming from me, someone who knows like %1 of anything
CL/Lisp related.
Unrelated side bar for initiated: is the actual capitalization of this thing
(beyond the terminal of course) CLisp or CLISP?
[http://clisp.org/](http://clisp.org/)
So I noticed that the original title of this link (at least when I started
reading) was CLisp, and it had not even occurred to me it was C( language)
Lisp maybe, but still I though the caps must br wrong. On their site it is
full CAPS, even though that peeves a lot of Lispers who will tell you that is
like original Lisp Lisps (or LISP Lisp family languages, to be funny).
So can someone chime in and tell us?
------
jordigh
Well, I just started reading Land of Lisp a few weeks ago. It recommends
CLisp. I'm quite new to all of lisp, so, let's take a look:
$ hg clone http://hg.code.sf.net/p/clisp/clisp
Wow, that took a long time to clone. How big is the thing?
$ du -hs clisp
147M clisp
$ cd clisp
$ hg branches
default 15611:5c63938ef493
Hm, a moderate-sized repo, only 15611 commits and no branching to speak of.
Let's look at the latest commits,
$ hg heads
changeset: 15611:5c63938ef493
tag: tip
user: Sam Steingold <[email protected]>
date: Wed Oct 22 12:04:12 2014 -0400
summary: Fix bug#668 posix:file-state always return NIL for :rdev
What! Last commit was from October last year? Clearly development has slowed
to a standstill. Who is generally in charge around here nowadays?
$ hg churn -r "date('2010 to today')"
sds 313529 **************************************
[email protected] 194383 ********************
vtz 2723 *
ampy 801
haible 758
[email protected] 627
[email protected] 279
[email protected] 239
cvs2hg 46
So for the past 5 years, it's been almost all the work of sds, Sam Steingold.
Huh. I was expecting Bruno Haible to still be involved, but he seems to be
doing almost nothing nowadays. Well, it's not unusual for a free project to be
the labour of only a single person, but it's typical to have a lot of small
drive-by contributions. Almost nobody except sds has done anything for CLISP
for the last five years, which could explain why there have been no releases.
But there's been a lot of work being done! Look at all those lines of code
that have been modified! Maybe all they really need is a release manager.
Well, does the thing build right now?
$ ./configure
...
./configure: libsigsegv was not detected, thus some features, such as
generational garbage collection and
stack overflow detection in interpreted Lisp code
cannot be provided.
Please install libsigsegv like this:
...
Okay, fine, I'll install it. Let me try again,
$ ./configure
...
./configure: libsigsegv was not detected, thus some features, such as
generational garbage collection and
stack overflow detection in interpreted Lisp code
cannot be provided.
Please install libsigsegv like this:
...
What? Didn't I just do that?
$ apt-cache policy libsigsegv-dev
libsigsegv-dev:
Installed: 2.9-4
Candidate: 2.9-4
Version table:
2.10-4+b1 0
-1 http://ftp.ca.debian.org/debian/ unstable/main amd64 Packages
*** 2.9-4 0
500 http://ftp.ca.debian.org/debian/ wheezy/main amd64 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
Okay, maybe my version of libsigsegv is too old. But a version newer than
Debian's oldstable is mighty demanding of a package whose development has
slowed down to nothing. So at this point I'm considering if I want to debug
their build system or not. I might. Or perhaps someone else will. My
conclusion is that CLisp development is almost dead, yet there certainly is
something worthwhile releasing here since the last release in 2010.
~~~
rjsw
And that is why people shouldn't use configure [1].
[1] [https://www.varnish-
cache.org/docs/2.1/phk/autocrap.html](https://www.varnish-
cache.org/docs/2.1/phk/autocrap.html)
~~~
taylanub
>Some day when I have the time, I will rip out all the autocrap stuff and
replace it with a 5 line shellscript that calls uname -s.
And packagers will everywhere will hate you for it.
I've recently written many GNU Guix package recipes, and packages using
Autotools are the ones I tend to have the least headaches with. CMake and Waf
are so-so I think, perhaps lacking in maturity, but I didn't have that much
experience with them. Custom/hand-written Makefiles and ./configure scripts
are the worst.
Just learn Autotools, get over the fact that they contain backwards-
compatibility crud (that you can just ignore, or how does it hurt you?), and
stop the FUD. Even if only targeting GNU and BSD systems, there is already
enough diversity and library detection boilerplate to make it worth using a
proper build system, and Autotools is the most mature one out of the bunch.
It's even more important for unconventional systems like Nix/Guix where
software is to be built in very special ways, where hard-coded assumptions in
build systems hurt, especially if a custom one; if it's a known one then even
if hard-coded it will probably conform to some typical pattern of use of that
build system so one can use tooling to automatically fix packages using that
build system, and in the case of Autotools that isn't necessary in first place
because everything is parameterized and flexible to hell and back.
Also please do use pkg-config. Like Autotools, it's not perfect either, but I
could write another two paragraphs on how helpful it is in bringing
consistency, toolability, etc. into build/packaging systems...
~~~
haberman
My entire build can run in less time than a ./configure script.
It doesn't require developers to run ./autogen.sh, or to have autotools
installed (in their correct versions).
It doesn't contain obscene amounts of indirection, where the actual libraries
live in a hidden directory called .libs (looking at you, libtool).
It doesn't make you write m4, or Makefile.am files with all these magic
incantations. It doesn't make you delve into the guts of these crufty systems
when things don't work the way you expect.
If you want build systems to satisfy your use cases, publish some doc of best
practices and capabilities that all build system interfaces should provide. If
I'm convinced I'll be happy to conform to the _interface_ you need. But there
is no way you're going to convince me that everyone needs to just keep using
autotools (a specific _implementation_ ) forever. I hate them.
I mean, by that logic, why are you doing something new like GNU Guix when
everybody already knows/uses APT, RPM, BSD ports, etc? "Just learn [them], get
over the fact that they contain backwards-compatibility crud (that you can
just ignore, or how does it hurt you?), and stop the FUD."
Or maybe it is worth breaking with the past sometimes, when you think you can
do better.
~~~
taylanub
Late reply but:
All of the things you list are annoyances with crud that exists to satisfy
this or that use-case which I suppose you personally don't need, which doesn't
mean they don't have purposes. I would also say they are all minor annoyances.
Your builds run faster than a ./configure script? Not building particularly
large projects I suppose. Installing autotools? Big deal! I don't know when
one needs to write m4, but the Makefile.am format looks rather clean and
minimal to me; I don't see how you could have something much cleaner without
losing a lot of generality. And having to delve into the guts of some obscure
system is _exactly_ what I had to do a few times because some piece of
software refuses to keep with the convention and just use Autotools.
The documentation you ask for is idealistic and unrealistic. GNU Autotools are
free software, and with decades-old proven maturity; I see no reason not to
use them. The only pseudo-reasons I see are NIH, FUD, etc.; the usual.
GNU Guix (and before that, Nix) is fundamentally different from all other
package managers, so that analogy makes no sense here unless you have some
radically different innovative build system.
------
edem
I'm a bit confused. What is the relationship between CLisp and ANSI Common
Lisp?
~~~
jordigh
CLisp is a GNU implementation of common lisp. Other popular free
implementations include SBCL and CMUCL, both of which have made recent
releases. GCL is the other GNU common lisp, which also made a release more
recently than CLisp.
~~~
zachbeane
This is true in the same sense that the GIMP is the "GNU Image Manipulation
Program". It's just a label, and a license choice, without much real meaning
behind it. GCL is also called "GNU Common Lisp".
CMUCL is not popular any more.
SBCL is popular, and so is Clozure CL.
~~~
jordigh
Hm, indeed, I was expecting to see CLisp follow the GNU coding standards, but
it doesn't seem to. I know GIMP does, though, and it consistently uses GNU
terminology (free software, not open source, etc). Being GNU does mean
something for most GNU packages. In Octave we also follow most of the GNU
coding standards, for example, and we benefit from FSF and GNU infrastructure.
~~~
kazinator
CLISP, historically (which takes us back to 1987), did not start out as GPL-ed
software, and certainly wasn't part of the GNU Project.
First it became GPLed, over a heated dispute with Stallman w.r.t. its use of
the GNU Readline library.
Evidently, it is now part of the GNU Project. (So there is justification in
referring to it as "GNU CLISP".)
Programs aren't going to switch their coding style just because they join the
GNU Project.
~~~
aidenn0
Yes, that was the thread where RMS argued straight-faced that having optional
readline support made CLISP a derivative work of readline.
------
kazinator
I sent a bug report to the clisp-list mailing list just days ago, but it
didn't come through.
Date: Mon, 04 May 2015 07:20:34 -0700
To: Clisp list <[email protected]>
Subject: Invalid backquote reduction: ,',@x
Hi all,
I've discovered that (admittedly, an old version) of CLISP is
reducing a certain backquote syntax according to a hare-brained
user expectation instead of diagnosing en error.
Pardon me if this has been fixed more recently.
In a double backquote, if you quote a splice, and then unquote
the quote, the unquote and quote cancel out naively.
(Is that, by chance, my doing???)
CLISP:
[1]> (let ((a '(1 2 3))) ``(a b c ,',@a))
'(A B C 1 2 3)
Of course the above quote form then eval-s to (A B C 1 2 3).
Clozure CL:
? (let ((a '(1 2 3))) ``(a b c ,',@a))
(LIST* 'A (LIST* 'B (LIST* 'C (LIST (QUOTE 1 2 3)))))
? (eval *)
> Error: Too many arguments in form (QUOTE 1 2 3) .
The Clozure output (IMO correct) illustrates precisely what
wrong, so I almost don't have to say anything more.
The construct ',@a is (QUOTE ,@A) which stuffs zero or more
things into the QUOTE syntax where there should be exactly
one, potentially resulting in an incorrect quote syntax.
So given (UNQUOTE (QUOTE (SPLICE A))), then only if A
generates exactly one item, are we justified in
"canceling" the QUOTE and UNQUOTE! In other cases,
it is invalid and should be diagnosed as an abuse of
QUOTE.
* * *
Is there a possibility that this could be documented
as an extension? I think it's too much of a special case
in its present form, because it only works when the
QUOTE form is an immediate argument of the UNQUOTE,
as seen from this CLISP output:
[2]> (let ((a '(1 2 3))) ``(a b c ,(list ',@a)))
(LIST 'A 'B 'C (LIST (QUOTE 1 2 3)))
We might imagine that a possibly meaningful
extension (which swiftly reveals itself to be otherwise)
along these lines:
"If a splice is the child, direct or indirect,
of an unquote, then the unquote *and all
intervening syntax* distributes over the splice,
as if by replication over the elements. That
is to say ,(syntax ,@form) is treated as if
it were ,(syntax ,(first form)) ,(syntax ,(second form))
and so on, where form is evaluated only once,
and the number of unquotes depends on the size of
the output of form.
According to the above rule, we would then expect:
[2]> (let ((a '(1 2 3))) ``(a b c ,(list ',@a)))
;; FANTASY:
(LIST 'A 'B 'C (LIST (QUOTE 1)) (LIST (QUOTE 2)) (LIST (QUOTE 3)))
The problem is that this interferes with existing semantics;
the structure ,(syntax ,@form) already has firm meaning,
which is that form is evaluated to create arguments which
are substituted into SYNTAX, and then this is unquoted, leading
to the evaluation a single instance of SYNTAX as an operator.
When SYNTAX is QUOTE, no special exception can be made;
,(quote ,@form) must also mean "zero or more arguments
into quote which is then evaled in the next round, possibly
leading to a quoting error".
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Patent US6368227 - Method of swinging on a swing - gojko
http://www.google.co.uk/patents/US6368227
======
jchung
To be fair, the patent was filed by a five year old whose patent-attorney
father was trying to educate on how the patent process works.
[http://www.nytimes.com/2002/05/13/business/patents-patent-
of...](http://www.nytimes.com/2002/05/13/business/patents-patent-office-faces-
huge-backlogs-extremely-technical-inventions-absurd.html) Perhaps he taught
his son even more than he expected.
~~~
antiterra
It's also expired due to nonpayment of fees.
~~~
ctdonath
Confirmed; the US Patent Office says "Patent Expired Due to NonPayment of
Maintenance Fees Under 37 CFR 1.362".
------
DigitalSea
This is disgusting. It's disgusting that just the other day I saw kids
probably no older than 6 violating this very patent in a public playground of
all places. Six year olds violating patents, what has society become? They
were smiling and giggling with their friends swinging on the swingsets,
hopefully the criminals responsible for violating this patent are dealt with
to the full extent of the law.
In all seriousness though, it's patents like this that are the reason the
patent system is as broken and messed up as it is. You can patent anything if
you use enough convuluted words in a couple of paragraphs it would seem.
~~~
calvinlough
This patent is for side-to-side swinging. IANAL, but if they were doing the
traditional forward-backward swinging they should be okay.
~~~
noonespecial
It will however require the services of a competent patent attorney at a cost
of around $1mm and approximately 3 years in a court in Eastern Texas to prove
that they are in fact "okay".
~~~
marshray
Don't worry, we can start out by getting a judge to enjoin the probable
infringement. We'll make sure no kids are allowed to attend elementary school
during those 3 years.
------
curveship
It's a tongue-in-cheek troll, and a beautiful one at that. Someone filed this
on behalf of his/her son. Check out the last lines of the application, with
emphasis added:
\-- snip --
Lastly, it should be noted that because pulling alternately on one chain and
then the other resembles in some measure the movements one would use to swing
from vines in a dense jungle forest, the swinging method of the present
invention may be referred to by the present inventor _and his sister_ as
_"Tarzan" swinging_. The user may even choose to produce a Tarzan-type yell
while swinging in the manner described, which more accurately replicates
swinging on vines in a dense jungle forest. _Actual jungle forestry is not
required._
_Licenses are available from the inventor upon request._
\-- end snip --
edit: formatting
------
scott_meade
There is nothing patented in this patent. Note that "Claims 1, 2, 3 and 4 are
cancelled". That's all of the claims.
~~~
monochromatic
Wait, where does it say that?
~~~
jryan49
Last page.
~~~
monochromatic
Ah, I didn't realize it'd gone into reexam. That seems like a silly waste of
money.
------
alphaBetaGamma
I rather like this one. Though to be fair, it was probably correct to award
it: it's definitely inventive, and I doubt there is prior art.
<http://www.google.com/patents/US3216423>
~~~
Zimahl
I don't know a better word to describe that except to say it is _disturbing_.
------
abcd_f
It's a mock patent.
I worked for a company whose on-staff lawyer was friends with the person who
authored this patent. He too was (is?) a lawyer and he filed this application
to demonstrate how ridiculous the patent legislation was. It was never meant
to be a serious patent.
------
ChuckMcM
I cannot help but think this patent and others like it would be good test
cases for a summary reversal mechanism. I would use them as follows:
1) Create a policy whereby a patent can be identified as being 'issued in
error' (to be clear the case is made that at the time of filing the patent
basis was already unpatentable)
2) Provide a framework for describing the unpatentability and the evidence
standards for elements in the framework (so you have to show it was obvious
for example and have other indpendent inventions at a similar time, or prior
art, etc)
3) Establish what rights the patent holder has in defending against this
allocation (what rules of evidence are needed, what standard does that
evidence need to meet)
4) Establish an appeal process, if any, and its rules.
5) Establish a way of introducing these disallowed patents as evidence of
unpatentability in current office actions.
Then start with patents like this one and run them through that process.
Part of the problem here is that the challenge process is really broken and it
needs to be fixed in order to balance out the inevitable human failings on the
approval process.
------
blktiger
What I want to know is why does is this patent referenced by a Microsoft
patent that is completely unrelated?
<http://www.google.co.uk/patents/US8181265>
Does Microsoft think the patent system is a joke?
~~~
bhavin
I went through both Samsung and MSFT patents that 'refer' to this patents.
This patent, in both cases, is cited by the examiner. So, my idea behind that
is the examiner either didn't like his job or had a good sense of humor about
whole patent process!
~~~
DigitalJack
Or it was a form of protest. Those patents are now tied to absurdist humor
forever.
------
dctoedt
When you think about it, patent examiners make industrial policy that affects
the entire United States for up to 20 years. To be fair, the USPTO takes that
responsibility pretty seriously. Still, examiners are human --- and a lot of
them aren't experienced enough to have signature authority: their actions must
be signed by their supervisors, who have to oversee multiple junior examiners.
In many fields, the examining corps is pretty buried by the workload and
doesn't have the time or other resources they'd like to have. [EDIT: In
response to 'dkhenry, I agree, there's no excuse for the patent being
discussed here.]
This examiner burden is exacerbated by three things:
First, patent examiners' performance is graded in part on the basis of a
"count system," which provides at least some incentive for examiners to allow
at least some claims [1].
Second, the statute mandates that a patent be issued unless the examiner can
demonstrate that the application is _not_ patentable.
Third, there's no requirement that a patent applicant conduct any kind of
patentability search. An applicant and his patent attorney must disclose any
"material" prior art _of which they're aware,_ but the applicant need not do
any kind of literature search. [EDIT: When you apply for a patent, you pay
filing fees in part to help cover some of the cost of having a patent examiner
do a search.]
Just imagine if a PhD candidate wasn't required to do a literature survey as
part of her dissertation work, but instead her advisor and thesis committee
were required to approve her degree unless _they_ and their TAs could
affirmatively demonstrate that her research was insufficiently novel. That's
not unlike the way it works in the patent system. And now think of how much
more national impact can result from the issuance of a patent compared to the
issuance of a PhD degree.
Inventors and patent attorneys tend to fiercely oppose any proposal that
patent applicants be required to conduct prior-art searches, on grounds that
it would increase the cost of a patent application. But if an inventor wants a
national industrial policy to be made in his favor that will last for as much
as 20 years, it doesn't seem _per se_ unreasonable for society to require him
to do some due diligence first.
(Of course, as long as the law is what it is, patent applicants, including my
own clients, will quite properly abide by the law as it is and not as some
might think it ought to be.)
Richard Stallman once asserted, in testimony at the USPTO [2], that:
\--snip--
_Some years ago a professor I know patented Kirchoff's current law, which
says that the electric currents flowing into a junction equal the currents
flowing out. He did this to confirm, privately, his suspicion that the PTO
could not handle the field of electronics. He never tried to enforce the
patent which has since expired. I will disclose his name if you give
assurances that he and his lawyer will not get in trouble for this._
_Kirchoff's laws were formulated in 1845. If the PTO couldn't understand
electricity after a century, how can we expect it to understand software in
another decade or two._
_(applause)_
\--snip--
[1] [http://www.ipwatchdog.com/2010/02/26/usptos-new-examiner-
cou...](http://www.ipwatchdog.com/2010/02/26/usptos-new-examiner-count-system-
go-into-effect/id=9310/)
[2]
[http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/com/hearings/software/sanjo...](http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/com/hearings/software/sanjose/sj_stallman.html)
~~~
dkhenry
If you were commenting on a patent on a complex technical subject then fine,
this is on swinging. There is nothing other then gross negligence that can
explain why this was approved.
~~~
nh
Claim 1 states:
"A method of swinging on a swing, the method comprising the steps of: a)
suspending a seat for supporting a user between only two chains that are hung
from a tree branch; b) positioning a user on the seat so that the user is
facing a direction perpendicular to the tree branch; c) having the user pull
alternately on one chain to induce movement of the user and the swing toward
one side, and then on the other chain to induce movement of the user and the
swing toward the other side; and d) repeating step c) to create side-to-side
swinging motion, relative to the user, that is parallel to the tree branch."
Now go find prior art for this where it shows steps a, b, c, d. Not easy
anymore is it?
Obviously, common sense should have played a huge part. But common sense by it
self is not patent law. You still need evidence to support your common sense.
dctoedt is right. Humans make mistake.
~~~
lurker14
> Now go find prior art for this where it shows steps a, b, c, d. Not easy
> anymore is it?
Go out side. Turn left. Walk to the park. Look at the 11-year-old boys on the
swingset.
~~~
masterzora
Even ignoring the tree branch I'd be surprised if you found a single one of
those 11-year-old boys employing the method described within.
~~~
talmand
Can I be considered prior art? Because I did that very thing as a kid over
twenty years ago. In fact, I would say the method in question was common
knowledge on the playground. Parents didn't like it because if the kid next to
you did it then you stood the chance of bumping into each other unless you
could get a matching rhythm going.
I also "discovered" that if you use your feet to twist the ropes around each
other as you sit in the swing you eventually can cause a spinning motion in
the opposite direction by lifting your feet from ground. Is there a patent for
that? Did I miss my chance?
EDIT: oh wait, it seems the patent was either not granted or lapsed due to
non-payment. I guess I don't have precedent for my twisting swing patent idea
after all. Feel free to try it with my blessing.
~~~
pwg
> Can I be considered prior art?
Short answer: yes.
Longer answer: yes, but only if the one single examiner handling this patent
at the time had known of you, known how to contact you, and been able to
obtain any information from you (and mind you, he/she likely could not have
told you why he/she wanted the information).
The other problem is that while you did this over twenty years ago along with
the others on the playground, where did any one of you publish anything
describing your alternate swing method? Because to make a rejection stick, the
patent examiner has to find some publication by you or one of your playground
mates from twenty years ago disclosing to the public your new swinging method.
This is because the position of the courts is that an applicant deserves a
patent __unless__ the us patent office can prove otherwise (and "prove" pretty
much means "prove to the level of a civil trial in court").
If the system were reversed, i.e. that applicant did not deserve a patent
unless they (the applicant) could prove it was sufficiently new to deserve a
patent, there would be far less of these "swinging on a swing" type patents.
------
jorgeleo
The patent it self is so simple and basic, that mind as well be someone
teaching exercise into the patents world.
What it is making me "uncomfortable" is that patents from Microsoft (Secure
machine counting) and Samsung (transistor substrate) refer to them...
~~~
bhavin
No they don't. In both cases, this patent is cited by the examiner, who
probably had good sense of humor.
~~~
dctoedt
If a patent examiner cited the swinging patent in an application involving
actual technology, I would guess the examiner might have intended the citation
as a red flag, a signal to future judges and juries that the examiner regarded
the application as bogus but couldn't prove it.
------
ciphersson42
I find it hilarious there is even a debate in these threads about this. I
think it's pretty well established the patent system is entirely screwed. Alas
very rich people have a good reason to keep it screwed. To stay rich.
The only thing that suffers is inovation. There is also a trending story
floating around lately were some one posted a bogas story created by SciGen to
a spammy security magazine. Look at the person who filed these patents...
TL;DR just skim them...
[http://www.google.co.uk/search?tbo=p&tbm=pts&hl=en&#...</a><p>One would
almost think he used the equivalent type script but for patents. HA!
------
jryan49
Look at the last page. The claims are "cancelled". I'm guessing that makes the
patent invalid.
------
bbeaudoin
Apparently the burrito (or is it a canoli?) was invented 12 years ago:
[http://www.google.com/patents?id=YlkIAAAAEBAJ&printsec=a...](http://www.google.com/patents?id=YlkIAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&source=gbs_overview_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false)
~~~
tsahyt
Don't worry. The EU recently standardized Pizza Napoletana[1]. Among some of
the regulations are:
* The flour used has to have a deformation energy between 220W and 380W
* The dough has a pH-value of 5.87 and a density of 0.79g/cm³
* The salt has to be applied with a spiral motion on top of the tomatoes
* The olive oil has to be applied with a spiral motion as well, totalling at 4-5g of oil with an allowed error of 20%
* The baking time is 60-90 seconds. The dough has to reach 60-65°C
That's not just a patent. This is a legal ordinance. This is law. This is
taxpayers money at work!
EDIT: edit for formatting and source
[1] [http://eur-
lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=0J:L:2...](http://eur-
lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=0J:L:2010:034:0007:0016:DE:PDF)
(German)
~~~
DanBC
I'm not sure what your point is. TSGs exist and are useful, as are PDOs etc.
([http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geographical_indications_and_tr...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geographical_indications_and_traditional_specialities_\(EU\)))
([http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2...](http://eur-
lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2010:034:0007:0016:EN:PDF))
(English).
------
Zenst
Are we allowed to discuss this without violating Patent number: 6715762
<http://www.google.co.uk/patents/US6715762>
Maybe this is a way to avoid parking tickets, who knows, anything is viable
with the right lawyer these days.
------
bockris
IIRC this was a joke patent that they put forward just to see what they could
get away with.
~~~
smoyer
Or maybe not so much a joke as an absurdity used to prove a point? I actually
wish there were more patents like this as it would lead to tighter
examination.
I also don't think it's an accident that the inventor and filing attorney have
the same last name. It's hard to justify the cost of doing this unless you can
get the lawyer for free. It's not the filing fees that are expensive so much
as the rest of the process.
------
manaskarekar
Have you seen this patent on 'refreshing a bread product by heating ...':
<http://www.google.com/patents/US6080436?hl=en>
~~~
yk
To be fair, that patent claims:
b) setting the temperature of the heating elements
between 2500 F. and 4500 F
So it is using light bulbs to heat the bread. Which is somewhat imaginative
compared to using an oven.
------
dkersten
I spent a lot of the day yesterday doing patent and publication searches and
I've come to the conclusion that patents are written both by and for retarded
monkeys.
------
damoncali
Even better: <http://www.google.com/patents/US4022227>
------
ThomPete
So let me ask this totally noob question. Is this where one could claim "prior
art" or does that no apply in this case?
------
astangl
I looked at costs of filing a patent awhile back. Seems relatively cheap to
file, if you do as much work yourself as possible, however the maintenance
fees they require you to pay at 3.5 yrs, 7.5 yrs, and 11.5 yrs, to keep the
patent in effect, get progressively steeper.
I wonder if this guy has paid any of the maintenance fees?
------
philh
I actually never realised that a swing could be used like this. I always just
went forwards and backwards.
------
gojko
and here's another one. Wheel patented (in Australia) as a "circular
transportation facilitation device"
[http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn965-wheel-patented-
in-...](http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn965-wheel-patented-in-
australia.html)
~~~
jprobitaille
The Australian Innovation Patent isn't really a patent. When an application is
filed a formalities check is completed, but no prior art search is conducted.
Also, the inventor and assignee of an AIP can't litigate. If one wanted to,
the Australian Patent Office would need to examine and issue an allowance as a
standard patent.
From the perspective of the US patent system, the AIP is more like a
provisional patent application than anything else.
[http://www.ipaustralia.gov.au/get-the-right-
ip/patents/types...](http://www.ipaustralia.gov.au/get-the-right-
ip/patents/types-of-patents/innovation-patent/)
------
bromley
If anyone fancies suing the Whitehouse to make a point, here's a picture of
what appears to be a relevant violation:
[https://www.acclaimimages.com/_gallery/_image_pages/0519-090...](https://www.acclaimimages.com/_gallery/_image_pages/0519-0907-3019-0022.html)
~~~
andreasvc
No. This patent was for sideways swinging.
------
protomyth
I think the original swing patent is pretty interesting. It is different from
just a piece of wood held by two ropes / chains. Heck, there seems to be a lot
of different types of swings that got patent protection. Must of been a
competitive field.
------
dkhenry
The real question is why do Primary Examiner: Kien T. Nguyen and Attorney:
Peter Lowell Olson
Still have jobs at the patent office ( if they do ). We should be able to
demand the termination of public servants who do not do their jobs.
~~~
sliverstorm
_Inventor: Steven Olson
Attorney: Peter Lowell Olson_
------
mey
Of note is the Microsoft patent (US8181265) that cites it for "Secure machine
counting"
<http://www.google.com/patents/US8181265>
I assume as joke or hidden egg.
------
plam
in one of the water cooler rooms in the canadian patent office, we have a wall
of shame for patents like this. I remember one patent for a stick, and another
for patenting the patent process.
------
jimworm
I'm waiting for the self-referential patent "A method to defend against patent
lawsuits" that patents patenting the act of filing patent lawsuits in order to
defend against patent lawsuits.
------
LVB
More patents should reference Underdog:
_"Young children often need help to climb onto a swing and may need a push
(sometimes even an "underdog" push) to begin swinging."_
------
RileyJames
Startup idea: crowd sourced prior art search?
I remember performing this swinging procedure as a child. Surely there is some
video evidence of someone doing it somewhere.
------
webosdude
I'm going to patent See-Saw balancing on a tree stem. That's just the
beginning, I'm headed to Children's Park to get more ideas now...
------
sthu11182
A great collection of patents - <http://patently-useless.tumblr.com/>
------
drharris
Has nobody noticed there is no issue date? You can file any patent you want,
but if it's actually issued, that's another problem.
~~~
DigitalSea
Better prepare yourself, on the left hand side there is in-fact an issue date,
"Issue date: 9 Apr 2002" which is beneath the filing date "Filing date: 17 Nov
2000"
------
utf8guy
Upon re-examination, all the claims for this patent were cancelled (see the
last page.)
------
TwilioJosh
This gives me hope that my patent for "Going to the Bathroom" is going to be
approved!
------
OllieJones
It's been a while since Albert Einstein worked in the patent office, eh?
------
forgivegod
I wish I was a troll with a law degree.
------
QuarkSpark
This just made my day!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Have a free tool for devs and digital designers? Submit here. Is free - Mike_Andreuzza
https://www.colorsandfonts.com/submit
======
nh2_amine
Colors and Fonts Extractor
A firefox extension that does just that and exports them as CSS variables
[https://addons.mozilla.org/fr/firefox/addon/colors-and-
fonts...](https://addons.mozilla.org/fr/firefox/addon/colors-and-fonts-
extractor/)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The State of Desktop Applications in Node.js - callum85
https://nodesource.com/blog/node-desktop-applications
======
doublerebel
There are a number of ways to make desktop apps with JS. TideKit/TideSDK uses
V8 IIRC. On Linux, Gnome has the GJS API. Tint and Quaxe are two more
promising newcomers. All of these use a JS engine to create native platform UI
controls. So for anyone who thinks JS is limited to webviews, you missed the
boat. Thousands and thousands of native apps are already created and shipped
on a JS core.
The async nature of UI and I/O makes JS a perfect fit, so I expect this trend
to only continue and the tools to improve. It's so much faster and more
efficient to create using JS than "native" languages, it's a no-brainer for
any business who has a dev with this experience.
------
mid-kid
The web wasn't made to be used as a desktop app replacement, and it will never
be. Quit trying to make it that way, and start using a widget toolkit like you
should. Hell, if you love html/js so much, there's a big chance you won't
dislike QML. The web is for sharing content, not for games, text editors, and
all that stuff. I see google trying to blur the lines between that, but why is
it necessary? Just because people are too lazy to adapt themselves to the
platform they're writing for, and allow them to create slow, shitty "web
apps"?
~~~
Iftheshoefits
The hype around HTML/JS as a substitute or replacement for native development
has little to do with developer laziness and more to do with commoditizing
software development labor.
Native is _hard_ relative to (the nearly thoughtless) slapping together of JS
and CSS frameworks to "build" an "app." It requires paying people more and
taking more time to develop.
~~~
smacktoward
You make it sound like there's no benefit to programmers to consolidating
around a single platform. But there are several:
\- It removes the risk of spending time and money learning what turns out to
be the "wrong" (i.e. an unsuccessful) platform
\- It avoids splitting the effort of tooling vendors, library authors, etc.
across many different platforms, reducing the amount of redundant effort spent
reimplementing things in platform Y that already exist in platform X and
freeing them up to work on unique ideas instead
\- It brings the largest possible number of people underneath one umbrella,
which makes that community more economically attractive and therefore
increases the number and quality of tools and services they have access to
Not that it's all sunshine and roses, of course, but it's not without
advantages.
~~~
Iftheshoefits
All of your points apply to webdev. They just take a different form, and
frequently are masked by mistaking the ease with which trivial apps can be
developed by mixing a few canned frameworks together for reduced complexity.
------
snide
We ended up building Mac and Windows apps for
[http://www.webhook.com](http://www.webhook.com) built on a Node / Chromium
shells. Essentially we're a Wordpress competitor, but Node powered, and wanted
to provide a simple one-click install for people that didn't know how to work
their command line or how to install Node properly. This solution ended up
working great. It basically allowed us to build a non-destructive sandbox dev
environment for them that had a UI experience similar to the CMS itself.
Better yet, the app points to hosted JS and CSS files so really there's never
a need to "update" the app. When we have feature or bug changes, we just push
out new files and everything just works.
This kind of stuff isn't for all apps, but for our use case it was almost too
good to be true. We built everything out in about two to three weeks. I don't
know how long it would have taken for us to do something similar with true
Desktop tooling.
Here's a video of the end result in case anyone in interested...
[https://vimeo.com/108922566](https://vimeo.com/108922566)
~~~
callum85
This is great. Did you use node-webkit?
------
one-more-minute
The post mentions Light Table as a node-webkit user, so I'll mention that
we're actually in the process of moving to atom-shell [1]. After having some
issues with NW we found that atom-shell gave us a more suitable architecture
and some nice desktop integration features for only a few days work.
The multi-process model is definitely more complex and probably not for
everyone, but it's working really well for us so far.
[1]
[https://github.com/LightTable/LightTable/pull/1756](https://github.com/LightTable/LightTable/pull/1756)
------
pjmlp
2014, still catching up with the desktop.
If one really really wants to use JavaScript, at least make use of QML or
Nashorn/JavaFX.
~~~
woah
Just for the delicious pain of Java development?
~~~
pjmlp
Java development is pure pleasure when compared with web development.
~~~
mateuszf
Usually said by Java developer not understanding JavaScript.
~~~
penprog
You see, I barely need to "understand" Java to use it and get decent and
performant code but I need to be a javascript expert to be able to do anything
not horrible.
Please stop trying to act like the state of web and javascript is good because
it's shit. Web development is basically a bunch of people suffering from
stockholm syndrome.
~~~
jekrb
Really? I feel js gives way more freedom and is much more forgiving to writing
in your own particular style. I've had the exact opposite experience with
Java. I write JavaScript all the time for work and hobby and it's always
rewarding.
Also, I'm in college for computer science and the school will only teach Java
courses. It's dreadful and maddening. Classical inheritance is complete shit.
Compiler error messages suck. The language itself is just too bloated for me
to want use. Whatever I can write in Java I can do in a fraction of the time
with js with much more modular and maintainable code.
I think java interfaces are a clear sign of stockholm syndrome, as every time
I asked the professor why they are necessary I never got an answer other than
"to hide part of your code from the outside world", "to use as a blueprint for
your classes", or my personal favorite "Because in Java you write interfaces."
I tried shifting my question to "Why _don 't_ I have to write an interface in
js?" That one never got answered. Maybe someone here who is crafty with Java
could explain and justify for me the reason for writing what feels like more
code for no obvious benefit.
Also, sorry if Java is your thing and I sound like I'm bashing it. It's just
been really frustrating for me compared to literally every other language I've
used, especially since my degree depends solely on the language.
~~~
penprog
java interfaces are one of the main reasons people like java (and as other
people have said, it's reimplementation in other more modern languages shows
how popular and useful they are). They promote code reuse and allow protected
variation. Your professors bad explanations aren't a reason to dislike
interfaces.
Also how have you not, in a java class, written code that uses polymorphism?
That would be the easiest way to understand how useful interfaces are.
~~~
jekrb
But I reuse code all the time with js, following DOT and DRY principles, just
fine without an interface. Especially with tools like browserify, where I can
basically manage my code as partials independent from each other. Also, I have
had to write java code that uses polymorphism. I still find polymorphism
_easier_ in javascript. That being said, I think classes and polymorphism is
kinda of all just nonsense.
My preferred method of "inheritance" really is just extending an object. Which
js is great at. And there's multiple ways to do this, with multiple kinds of
prototypes. For something quick an easy I can make a prototype and just pass
that through object.create() and now I have a new object that has all the
properties of what I would loosely consider to be a "parent". It's more
cloning than it is inheritance, and I can completely override properties
however I want, while the original properties stay unchanged.
IMO polymorphism and interfaces in Java seem more like hurdles and added
complexity compared to object extension and cloning in JavaScript. _.extend
paired with browserify also makes for extremely modular code that I haven't
seen any Java code compare too.
~~~
woah
I agree. An interface in JS is a unit test.
I think that a lot of "classical" programmers simply don't understand how
important modules are to JS development.
This is why you get these posts about "how can you manage 1,000,000 LOC in
JS!!?", when they don't understand that you never have 1,000,000 in JS, you
have a bunch of small, unit tested modules.
~~~
pjmlp
Because in the real boys club (aka enterprise) no one writes unit tests unless
they are imposed on them.
------
rrdharan
This article doesn't accurately convey the state of Chrome Applications.
There's actually a much richer way to build apps that have a more native look
and feel, including their own branded top-level window with fewer of the
limitations the author cites.
[https://developer.chrome.com/apps/about_apps](https://developer.chrome.com/apps/about_apps)
~~~
evv
The article's title is "The State of Desktop Applications in Node.js", and
chrome applications do not let you run node.js on the local machine. If you
can't run your own userland code on the machine and talk to hardware, then you
can hardly call it a desktop app.
Google wants to keep you locked in their sandbox.
~~~
juliangregorian
I don't know, they seem to tout interfacing with network and hardware pretty
heavily.
------
Rauchg
Check out thrust as well:
[https://github.com/breach/thrust](https://github.com/breach/thrust)
multi-platform and easily bindable to any language
~~~
rdtsc
That looks promising. It is used for Breach but are there any other users?
------
callum85
Last time I tried building a 'blank' node-webkit app for OS X (using
[https://github.com/Dica-Developer/generator-node-
webkit](https://github.com/Dica-Developer/generator-node-webkit)), the
resulting .app came to ~100MB.
Does anyone know the base size for an atom-shell app?
~~~
FooBarWidget
Seriously, does anybody nowadays care about a 100 MB desktop app? I developed
my first app in 1997 with Delphi and it was only 200 KB, so from that
perspective I always cringe when I see that an app I've developed is multiple
MB. But in all seriousness, do users actually care? Every time I download an
OS X app, it's _at least_ 50 MB, but I find that even I don't care anymore
because downloading 50 MB nowadays only takes 10 seconds, and my machine has
more than enough RAM to load all the bundled libraries. We are in an age where
people deploy VM images and Docker containers that are many hundred megabytes,
and it seems people are happy that way.
The alternative is _not_ making apps self-contained, but instead to make them
rely on shared libraries. This is much more efficient, but apart from a few
neckbeards who cry "bloat" it seems that most people care more about avoiding
dependency hell and ease of use, even if that means large packages due to
library duplication.
~~~
callum85
I would agree with you if you were talking about 20MB. I think that would be
my threshold for not caring about how big an app is, i.e. even if it's
something really basic like a countdown timer app I would be OK with it being
up to 20MB, because as you say, connections are fast and space is cheap. But
100MB? I don't know.
~~~
jiggy2011
You could install more than 1000 apps on a moderate SSD at 100MB each. How
many apps does the average person have installed?
~~~
callum85
It's nothing to do with how much space it will take up. The problem is that,
as a user, I would be very suspicious of a 100MB countdown timer app. I would
think that either it's got some kind of adware in it, or just that it's
incompetently designed.
~~~
Carrok
>as a user, I would be very suspicious of a 100MB countdown timer app
You mean as a developer. Your average 'user' does not know or care how big an
app 'should' be.
~~~
callum85
I disagree. App file sizes are displayed in app stores because many users care
about them.
A significant number of users would notice an app being dramatically larger
than it ought to be. I've seen a _lot_ of reviews like "why the hell this app
over 100mb??!!1". There is a huge spectrum of technical competence between "I
don't have any sense of what a megabyte is" and "Developer".
------
zzzcpan
Related question: what are the other ways to build a desktop application on
Linux that works on Linux, Windows and OSX on slow machines, like intel atom,
and doesn't require anything from the user?
~~~
pavlov
Qt is great for this. It's used by lots of desktop applications, from small
open source tools to large commercial content creation apps like Maya.
[http://qt-project.org/](http://qt-project.org/)
It does have a substantial learning curve. The traditional desktop stuff is
all C++. The new mobile stuff is easier to develop, with a nice declarative UI
system and JavaScript, but it's not applicable if you want native-feeling
desktop widgets.
------
mnkypete
There is also a quick way to start a new application with Atom:
[https://github.com/atom/atom-shell-starter](https://github.com/atom/atom-
shell-starter)
------
echoless
I've played around with both node-webkit and atom-shell, and I prefer atom-
shell over node-webkit, due to some minor inconveniences with node-webkit.
* When an error occurs in node-webkit, it loads an error page instead of simply logging it to the console like normal web pages. Even after fixing the error and hitting reload or navigating back, the page doesn't go away. You need to manually enter the url(copy/paste doesn't work).
* I don't know if this is something that was my fault or the app's, but when I made a call to a sqlite3 database using the node-pure-sqlite3 gem, it would take around 3 seconds to execute. With atom-shell it would take less than a second.
* The developer console is a separate window from the application in node-webkit. I prefer having a single window hold both the app and dev console during development(which atom shell-allows).
~~~
ep103
completely clueless programmer checking in. How is atom's performance? The one
app I tried that used it was always slow and cludgy...
~~~
echoless
For DOM performance, they are pretty much identical. Both use Chrome(each uses
a different version though, usually atom-shell uses more recent versions).
For performance of node.js calls, I haven't run any benchmarks, so I cannot
help you there. However subjectively, both felt about the same to me(except in
the node-sqlite-purejs case).
------
teleclimber
If you are targeting Mac only and don't depend on Node an alternative would be
MacGap:
[http://macgapproject.github.io/](http://macgapproject.github.io/)
The packaged app is tiny compared to a chromium+Node shell app.
------
benjismith
I've been using node-webkit for the past 18 months or so, and it's been
absolutely delightful.
One thing this article gets slightly wrong is this sentence: "This means that
Node.js modules must exclusively use functions and classes provided by Node.js
or modules from npm, as the DOM is off limits."
This might be technically true, but there's an easy enough workaround:
1) Use a script tag to include jQuery in the index.html page
2) Pass the jQuery object ($) as a dependency into a node module.
3) Profit.
I regularly modify the DOM from node context using this pattern.
------
tyrion
Is there some way to have a "Firefox shell" instead of a Chrome/Chromium
shell?
~~~
jamii
[https://developer.mozilla.org/en-
US/docs/Mozilla/Projects/XU...](https://developer.mozilla.org/en-
US/docs/Mozilla/Projects/XULRunner)
I'm not sure if it's still actively developed though.
------
abimaelmartell
~100 MB for a hello world...
------
edem
Try out the new StarUML beta. I was surprised to see that it uses node.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Supermensch: What does the superhero craze say about our own times? - Hooke
https://aeon.co/essays/why-superheroes-are-the-shape-of-tech-things-to-come
======
opportune
Way too complicated an explanation. I don’t think it has to do with technology
at all.
I think the reason superheroes are all the rage is that they present usually
simple, uncontroversial content that appeals to the broadest collection of
cultures, ages, and educational/socioeconomic backgrounds - so they maximize
their audience and thus the money they make. It’s simplistic and you don’t
have to think too deeply about it. It doesn’t challenge your notions of
society or speak truth to power. It’s just about good guys fighting bad guys
~~~
klmadfejno
I don't think this is true. Moral ambiguity, anti-government, anti-wealthy
people themes have been pretty prevalent in the movies of late. They're not
especially deep or insightful, but the term comic-book evil seems unsuited to
modern superhero movie villains. They're undoubtedly "better" than what I grew
up with at least.
Large portions of fiction have generally always focused on people who were
superior to others, at least in terms of cleverness, but often physical
ability as well. Odysseus comes to mind. Extraordinary people are simply more
interesting than ordinary ones, especially if your primary goal is to
entertain.
I think the reason comic book superheroes in particular are popular is simply
that they're easy to make and market than something that is less well known
and less established; and from a business perspective, there's synergy in
making lots of movies from the same universe because people like it when
movies come from the same universe.
~~~
scarejunba
Two of the most popular superheroes of today are Iron Man and Batman. They are
literally just rich dudes in rich dude toys. They are the heroes of the story.
Professor Xavier is wealthy af. And he doesn't go around helping just anyone.
His altruism is hecka parochial.
About the only common element is that the government generally sucks at doing
anything. The only thing the government doesn't suck at is having at least one
plucky SEAL/Ranger/Marine team out there that's fighting against the odds.
~~~
klmadfejno
Iron Man and Batman are some of the most intelligent humans in their
universes. Iron Man per the latest marvel films, invented self-regenerating
nanobot armor and time travel. Batman kinda varies in how superhuman his
intelligence is depicted and I haven't bothered to see the last few so can't
comment.
Writing this now I see your point was not that they aren't extraordinary, but
rather the opposite of anti-wealth. I don't disagree, but I'm not claiming
that every movie covers the same ideas either. However, the villains of
Spiderman 2, for instance, are a bunch of Iron Man's lower level former
employees who specifically call out how they got the short end of the
capitalist stick, and how unfair it is that he got the spoils of everything,
and how easy it was for him to dispose of them. The villains of Spiderman 1
are just some construction guys who got shafted by the collateral damage of
the heroes and are trying to make a living wage. Yes; I do recognize the irony
in that both of these working class groups are villains, but they're not meant
to be portrayed as "Evil" for the most part. Again, not especially deep, but
not "I'M GOING TO DESTROY THE SUN BECAUSE THATS WHAT VILLAINS DO!".
The captain america movies, seem particularly keen on the idea that the
american government / law does not define the american ethos.
~~~
scarejunba
Maybe they're just returning to the roots of the word villain from Old French
for a villager/peasant.
------
travisjungroth
Superhero stories were always compelling, then CGI got good enough to make
them into movies. I don’t think it’s chance that they got popular shortly
after you got really good visuals of someone getting punched through an office
building. I find that explanation a lot more simple and convincing than the
one in the article.
~~~
bhaak
Superhero stories were put on the screen long before CGI.
The Batman series from 60s come to mind or the Superman movies from the 70s
(and there Superman III is IMHO the most enjoyable with a Richard Pryor that
pulls of a really cool hack).
~~~
travisjungroth
I should have said CGI got good enough to make them into really popular
movies. Or more specifically, that they were able to recreate the same images
that you have in comic books in live action movies. The superhero movies of
the 60s and 70s didn't pull that off.
------
Mountain_Skies
Another possibility is that superhero movies are expensive and complicated to
make. Tools for making video entertainment have empowered a much larger number
of people with the ability to create content. While many fan films and amateur
productions are still poor in quality, others now match or exceed what
Hollywood put out just decades ago for a fraction of the cost. Instead of
trying to compete with these low cost productions, moving into mega
blockbusters where the small guys can't follow keeps Hollywood's product
unique.
------
michelpp
Joseph Campbell's work The Hero with a Thousand Faces dives deep into the
mythology of heros across many groups:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hero_with_a_Thousand_Faces](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hero_with_a_Thousand_Faces)
We've been doing this for thousands of years. Movie fiction is just one facet
of how humans are compelled to hero worship at all scales of communities
whether political, fictional, sports, or careers.
~~~
aSplash0fDerp
I was going to mention the hypocrisy of media and how conflicting narratives
on hero worship are compounding mental health problems for younger
generations, but you summed it up pretty well.
With the glut of false/fabricated idols, the entertainment industry seems to
be playing catch-up on niche hero's to suit every demographic.
------
adrianN
Superheros weren't invented in the 20th century. We just used to call them
differently. They used to be gods or their offspring.
~~~
neves
Do you pray for Wonder Woman?
~~~
adrianN
Did the Greek pray to Herakles?
~~~
bhaak
Yes. Some did.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heracles#Cult](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heracles#Cult)
Although if instead of the verb "pray" you use the verb "worship", the
distinction between ancient heroes/half gods and modern day super heros
becomes much smaller.
~~~
krapp
>Although if instead of the verb "pray" you use the verb "worship", the
distinction between ancient heroes/half gods and modern day super heros
becomes much smaller.
It doesn't. No one is actually _worshipping_ modern superheroes. No one
believes superheroes actually exist, or ever existed, and can intercede on
their behalf they way they might angels or other deities.
~~~
bhaak
> It doesn't. No one is actually worshipping modern superheroes. No one
> believes superheroes actually exist, or ever existed, and can intercede on
> their behalf they way they might angels or other deities.
I'm not sure the latter was something that the ancient people thought
possible. If somebody you worship actually exists or existed, is of little
importance to the impact they have on the lives of humans.
Fans build shrines for their favorite characters, take them as rolemodels,
draw strength from their stories, discuss them as if they were real persons.
Fictional characters often influence people much more than real people.
------
Apocryphon
There's probably a less lofty, more mundane pop cultural answer for this: the
generation that grew up on Saturday Morning superhero cartoons are now
tastemakers, and the mainstreaming of nerd culture and fandom has incentivized
studios towards making big budget live action versions of what used to be
consigned only to cartoons on TV.
Also, while superhero movies are as old as Christopher Reeve's Superman films,
or perhaps Republic serials, the mainstreaming of nerd culture and fandom has
also created a public that's more open to elaborate world-building and lore in
their summer blockbusters. So while superhero movies used to be more self-
contained, now we have these sprawling multi-film sagas giving the studios an
excuse to churn out multiple pictures a year.
------
Isamu
>Looking at it this way, the popularity of superhero culture among aficionados
of new technological entrepreneurship seems obvious. It’s a culture that
celebrates individual agency at the expense of the collective.
Ah there you have it, superheroes are popular because they are anti-
collective.
>But the superheroes also demonstrate what a peculiar kind of divinity this is
– shorn of the spirituality that is supposed to define our relationship to the
divine. The divine power that the technological future offers devotees is
purely material. And the doors of that technological heaven will be opened
only for the elect who have the material means to enter.
And we learn that superheroes are anti-spiritual, materialistic and only work
for the elite 1%.
------
jacquesm
Superheros are just angels or demi-gods with a more exciting story behind
them. Miracle workers, they look like us to some extent but have superpowers.
It's the same old story in a new dress.
------
ajkjk
I feel like the popularity of superhero narratives isn't because people
particularly love those stories; it's because they're easy to make them
decent. The public just wants good, enjoyable stories. The creators figured
out that superhero stories are pretty reproducibly effective, so they keep
making them.
------
jeffadotio
> Übermenschen – machine-men, aerialists and space-bound conquistadors –
> tantalised philosophers and beguiled fascists
Articles like this seem to take advantage of the misunderstanding of Nietzsche
without directly endorsing it. The actual concept of "ubermensch" would have
no place in this article.
The term was coined by Nietzsche and referred to a futuristic human who was
raised without the influence of religion or superstition and without having
interacted with anyone who has such influences. In his view these people would
be liberated from what he saw as the oppression of Christianity (and other
Abrahamic religions), which he felt encouraged people to accept meekness,
suffering and poverty in exchange for a pleasant afterlife. He called
Christians "preachers of death" and encouraged people to abandon complacency
for a "will to power". It is an appeal to a superior type of person but it is
intended to encourage rational cultural development. The term itself has
nothing to do with technology or ethnicity.
By now everyone knows that his work was bastardized by the Nazis but many seem
to prefer the controversy of the Nazis' version over what he actually wrote.
He spoke out in defense of the Jewish people and even stopped doing business
with and publicly rebuked a publisher who was an anti-Semite. We have gotten
really good at remembering the hateful and forgetting the rational.
~~~
AnimalMuppet
I don't think Nietzsche quite fits this context. "Will to power" without
meekness, suffering, or poverty seems to fit a super _villain_ more than a
superhero.
------
uk_programmer
It wouldn't be it was/is a fad? In the 2000s there was literally a zombie
movie coming out every week it seemed. In the UK there was load of movies
about the UK "underworld" e.g. Football Hooligans, Drug Dealers, Gangstars and
Illegal fights (Layer Cake, Snatch, Rock and Rolla, Green Street, Football
factory, The Business and my favourite Sexy Beast).
There is generally a new film genre that does really well and people copy it
chasing the money as people tend to want more initially until it is played
out.
~~~
pessimizer
The title refers to it as a "craze." I don't think using the synonym "fad"
adds anything. The question is "why this fad, now, rather than a different
fad, now?"
~~~
uk_programmer
What did zombie movies say about the 2000s? Nothing really.
Christopher Nolan’s dark night trilogy proved that these films can make money
and be critically acclaimed.
Also is it really a craze? Christopher Reeves Superman was pretty popular so
was Spider-Man and the Hulk when I was a kid. There were loads of movies and
tv shows in the 80s and 90s with super heroes. I actually can't remember a
time when they weren't popular.
The only difference now is Marvel is raking in at the box office. Is anyone
else actually making money? DC aren't.
------
AtlasBarfed
Individually we are small, powerless people (one in billions) being faced with
insurmountable existential challenges (global warming, etc).
~~~
AnimalMuppet
Not just large challenges. We are faced with a society so big that we feel
that nothing we do can make any difference. We feel powerless. Hence the
appeal of individuals powerful enough that they can, individually, make a
difference.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Huawei in early talks with U.S. firms to license 5G platform - thg
https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-usa-huawei-tech-licensing-exclusive/exclusive-huawei-in-early-talks-with-u-s-firms-to-license-5g-platform-huawei-executive-idUKKBN1WY010
======
dang
"Early talks" probably isn't substantive enough to count as significant new
information. Did I miss something?
[https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu...](https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&query="significant%20new%20information"&sort=byDate&type=comment)
------
perspective1
Here, I'll paste the quote that substantiates this entire story-- Vincent Pang
(Huawei): “There are some companies talking to us, but it would take a long
journey to really finalize everything... they have shown interest."
------
Gpetrium
The exec response can be coming from a variety of angles:
1) Reuters reached out and he simply provided a snippet of what is happening;
2) US firms are interested in the product;
3) US firms are interested in using this conversation to leverage negotiations
with another party;
4) Whether they are getting little to no traction or some, Huawei may be
trying to say "look, we are not nuclear, others are talking to us, you should
too' to prop up interest and willingness via journalism.
------
Consultant32452
At this point we might as well go full patent war and each side can just
openly declare the other's patents are void.
~~~
downrightmike
China already steals what they want.
~~~
DiogenesKynikos
Chinese companies pay a very large amount of licensing fees to American
companies. Huawei itself has paid $6 billion in licensing fees since 2001,
with 80% of the fees going to US companies.
1\. [https://www.zdnet.com/article/over-6b-in-ip-royalties-
paid-b...](https://www.zdnet.com/article/over-6b-in-ip-royalties-paid-by-
huawei-nearly-80-to-us-firms/)
------
m0zg
Meh. We should go straight to 6G at this point. It's not like 5G is a pressing
need. Current 4G LTE is more than fast enough for just about everybody.
~~~
snagglegaggle
Well, people are already thinking about 6G, so we may have to hold off for 7G.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Silicon Valley's Saudi Arabia Problem - petethomas
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/12/opinion/silicon-valley-saudi-arabia.html
======
joe_the_user
The problem is that the Saudi Regime has reached a point of not just murder
but instability and poor judgement. IE, they brutally murdered someone of
substance, in a lawless fashion, outside Saudi Arabia proper, for very little
cause - after they brutally, physically extracted wealth from their own
financier class (princes and such probably had taken a good portion of this
corruptly but there's a reason for rule-of-law in these situations, other the
state doesn't know when to quit).
It's one, sadly normal, thing these days to get blood money from one or
another sources. It's another thing to get money from a powerful entity that
kills anyone at all that displeases them - after all, at that point they might
actually kill you, personally if you lose money or complain. I don't think
even the Mafia is foolish enough to do this regularly.
And the evils of the Saudi Regime have been considered tolerable for years, in
the interest of stability and, well, making money. Now you have something like
a coal-mine that's broken out into the open. What to do, what to do?
~~~
konschubert
> The problem is that the Saudi Regime has reached a point of not just murder
> but instability and poor judgement.
Maybe you did not mean it that way,but this sounds extremely cyncical.
~~~
joe_the_user
I personally would love for the US to have a foreign policy that's even
remotely humanitarian - I'll vote and advocate here for that.
The reality however is that US' policy has for years been murderously cynical
with respect to the Saudis and numerous other dictatorships.
I don't have the ability even now to change much. Well meaning folks don't
really have that ability. So really all one can do is throw the brutality and
cynicism of those having power back in their faces. Maybe spotlighting this
level of actual murderous narcissism will get the attention of who argued the
need for the realpolitik approach of supporting the Saudis.
------
rdlecler1
I saw Marc Andreessen and Sam Altman listed on the new Saudi Arabian advisory
board. I’d bet the Saudi’s are either LPs in their funds or they are courting
them for their next fund.
------
dang
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18201620](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18201620)
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18197431](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18197431)
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18196934](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18196934)
------
gfodor
It's striking how in the span of a week the media is in a full court press
against Saudi Arabia, based upon (as far as I know) unconfirmed alligations
around the disappearance of a journalist. There is truth to the narrative that
SA is an ethically compromised country, it has been for decades, but the
sudden coordinated messaging and deluge of articles that all seem directed
towards affecting the relationship between Saudi Arabia and the US is too
overt not to notice.
~~~
buboard
not long ago there was coordinated reporting about the "saudi arab spring"
that the new ruler would bring. Thats the media i guess, herdish.
[https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/23/opinion/saudi-prince-
mbs-...](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/23/opinion/saudi-prince-mbs-arab-
spring.html)
[https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/18/world/middleeast/mohammed...](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/18/world/middleeast/mohammed-
bin-salman-saudi-arabia-60-minutes.html)
~~~
gfodor
The cynic in me thinks that, like most things the media reports on these days
it seems, there is an attraction to stories that undermine Trump. Call me a
conspiracy theorist, but I'm going to assume that this sudden meme about Saudi
Arabia emerging is evidence in favor of there being some currently undisclosed
diplomatic headway in the peace talks underway between the US, SA, Israel, and
others that have been ongoing since Trump's trip to Riyadh the first month of
his presidency.
~~~
fmajid
No, it's much simpler than that. A journalist was murdered, and that hits
close to home for... journalists. Unlike genocide in Yemen.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Awesome JS - xethorn
https://github.com/xethorn/awesome-js
======
unoti
Hi! The title in the github repos maybe should say JavaScript, not Python. "A
curated list of awesome Python frameworks, libraries and software. Inspired by
awesome-php."
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Moving from bash to zsh - DanielRibeiro
http://askubuntu.com/questions/1577/moving-from-bash-to-zsh
======
crazydiamond
Recommend reading zsh-lovers (<http://grml.org/zsh/zsh-lovers.html>).
Also check the zsh reference card on the sourceforge website. Learn the
various techniques of globbing on the command line.
For zsh-lovers to make sense, you have to also refer to the zsh reference card
(zsh sourceforge.net site) as well as the User Manual by Peter Stephenson
(pws).
<http://zsh.sourceforge.net/Guide/zshguide.html>
<http://zsh.sourceforge.net/Doc/Release/zsh_toc.html>
I have found the zsh-users mailing list to be a great place to get the best
and quickest answers. The folks who maintain zsh such as pws and others who
have been there for over 12 years (such as Bart Schaffer), answer questions.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Could ayahuasca have health benefits? - jeffwass
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-41333172
======
dnc
While I was on a retreat this year in a Peruvian village, I was told by
several natives (Shipibo people) that, by their tradition (some estimations
are that Shipibo tribes have been using Ayahuasca for millenias), Ayahuasca is
orally taken in healing ceremonies by their shamans only. Traditionally, in
the normal course of a healing ceremony, it is not a patient who takes 'the
medicine' or 'the plant teacher' (Ayahuasca), but the shaman in order to learn
from the plant what his patient illness is and how to go about healing it.
Also traditionaly, Ayahuasca is taken during shamanic training (which takes
years, if not a whole life) as a part of a special and very strict diet that
can last between several weeks to a year or more, depending on a plant that
one is dieting. During the diet shaman apprentice is supposed to take
Ayahuasca, but only at the beginning and at the end of the diet, if it is a
short one, or every once in couple of months if the diet is longer. The diet
is a way to become familiar with the plant and learn what it has to teach you
and Ayahuasca, the teacher plant, is used as a sort of a learning facilitator.
From my understanding, a practice of organizing Ayahuasca ceremonies and
giving the brew to foreigners in exchange for money has been relatively
recently established with rising popularization of Ayahuasca and demand for it
from abroad.
~~~
Radim
the shaman in order to learn from the plant what his patient illness is and how to go about healing it.
And how was that working out for them, from what you could see? Did patients
there prefer the "traditional" or the "western" medicine?
~~~
dang
Please don't take HN threads on generic tangents. That argument leads nowhere
new and therefore nowhere interesting.
[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)
Edit: whoops I misread that one and broke the site rules in the process. Sorry
and carry on!
~~~
borski
dang, apologies, but the parent didn't seem to be taking this on a generic
tangent. The OP has a very interesting anecdotal story to tell, related
directly to a group of people that take ayahuasca for healing, and I, too, am
curious about how it worked for them, specifically.
~~~
dang
Uh oh, on a proper reading I see that you're right. Thanks for pointing it
out.
I overhastily ascribed the comment to the "western medicine, you mean real
medicine?" meme that doesn't belong here. Perils of pattern-matching.
Retracted!
------
nowherecat
Having had frequent ceremonies over the course of several months I stopped
drinking the tea, because I find it is not helping being pulled from one
extreme into another. Our western way of life makes it very difficult to
integrate the profound experiences that one can get through this medicine and
it requires major commitments to change..and it requires good helpers and
facilitators. We, as westerners, are often times not equipped to integrate
this lost wisdom into our lives. I know it is said it is not addictive but I
know enough people that at least appear dependent on it and swear by it being
the solution.
I personally believe that meditation and journeying inward without drugs
brings about insights of a similar magnitude in a pace that we can cope with
and integrate what we learn without jojo’ing between bliss and depression.
Ayahuasca has its place. It definitely helped us experience that there is much
more to life than the material. But in my opinion I t’s a sledge Hammer that
helps crack hard nuts or sets a direction. The work has to be done by oneself
and the risk with ayahuasca is that one just keeps drinking the tea, thinking
that that is enough.
Apart from that it is quite dangerous nowadays to do ceremonies with traveling
“shamans”, because a lot of them don’t even brew the tea themselves and
oftentimes facilitate in a way that it is bound to go wrong at some point.
~~~
kobeya
Or psychoactive drugs don’t teach you anything new but rather modify brain
functionality such that you feel different. Gaining new belief or believing
you have new beliefs are typically indistinguishable from the inside.
~~~
nowherecat
Well, could’t You say the same thing about experiences of any nature? For
example: our thoughts always affect our body/mind .. if I take a drug or in
the case of ayahuasca an entheogen, it creates a non ordinary state of
consciousness, which -if strong enough- can permanently change the way I feel
and act. The same you could achieve by meditating on a regular basis or going
on a long trip, having a traumatic experience etc .. our brains are being
modified constantly by our experiences, not just by drugs. And yeah, a belief
is a belief - if it’s a conscious belief you could say ‘I believe in having
this belief’ and if it’s unconscious it’s just a belief I am not consciously
aware of. But both have the same Effect on my body and mind
~~~
kobeya
It permanently changes you by causing conditions by which your brain rewires
itself. For psychiatric patients that is often a good thing because where they
are at is not a good place. But why would you throw a spanner in the works if
you're already a well adjusted individual?
If you want to be content and enjoy life, why not get a lobotomy. It's a more
consistent result. Oh you don't want to do that to your brain? Well acid may
have different mechanisms but can trigger similarly drastic effects, it's just
now you've introduced a roll of the die, and I'm not a fan of gambling without
a winning strategy.
~~~
KennyCason
Given your very clear and strong stance that this is something you won't ever
try, of which I don't have any issue with, I won't spend a lot of time
debating this statement. But, your analogy with getting a lobotomy to enjoy
life being even remotely equivalent to doing psychedelics is simply wrong. The
effects are not similar. You are also drastically overestimating the gambling
nature of psychedelics. You're probably way more likely to wreck your life
while drinking alcohol than you are with psychedelics.
------
Fnoord
Ayahuasca is a South American brew consisting of two plants one consisting of
a MAOI and another of DMT (the exact plant genus differs). DMT without a MAOI
gets broken down by the blood brain barrier, so its not efficient without the
MAOI.
The MAOI however puts dietary restrictions before the drug is being
administered, and also makes the drug last vastly longer. Without the MAOI,
the DMT wouldn't last long (IIRC even less long than Salvia). That _might_ be
an interesting use case.
Apart from that, there's all the time research on tryptamines [1] (MDMA, LSD,
psilocybin, etc) used to treat mental diseases and personality disorders. The
advantage synthetic drugs have is they're easier to standardise. I'm not sure
why you'd want to research MAOI + DMT instead of the ones already mentioned?
What advantages could it have over those?
[1] [http://psychedelic-information-theory.com/Psychedelic-
Pharma...](http://psychedelic-information-theory.com/Psychedelic-Pharmacology)
~~~
pstuart
My only DMT experience lasted about 15 minutes, and that was plenty.
~~~
Fnoord
I assume Ayahuasca refers to MAOI + DMT instead of merely DMT, but I could be
wrong. Although which plants would be used as source? Maybe we should try to
avoid the term Ayahuasca altogether; it is vague.
~~~
LaikaF
Ayahuasca referrers to the uses of plants. Normally done by Shamans.
pharmahuasca is DMT + MAOI inhibitor
The experience is very different. Ayahuasca has a lot of bad side effects such
as vomiting, sea legs, and diarrhea
~~~
Fnoord
Cheers, had not heard of pharmahuasca before.
> Ayahuasca has a lot of bad side effects such as vomiting, sea legs, and
> diarrhea
Those are side effects which _can_ occur; not side effects which _will_ occur.
Ie. possible side effects.
Its anecdotal and merely one experience as well, but I had no problem with
diarrhea or vomiting. Sea legs, yes, which I knew beforehand. Hence I made
sure I was able to lie down (which I did).
------
astura
My brother went on an Ayahuasca retreat but ended up deeply disappointed that
it didn't change his life and his problems got much worse as a result.
Of course, that can happen with any treatments as well. However, professional
support could maybe mitigate that a bit. Plus actual data may give a better
idea of likely outcomes.
He then came home and took LSD that caused an episode of psychosis that lasted
a couple weeks and landed him on the hospital plus in trouble with the law.
I don't disagree that these drugs can be beneficial for many people and should
be studied but there is dangers as well and the dangers are often downplayed
as "just anti drug FUD."
~~~
anythingnonidin
Did any of the following apply?
> No current or past history of schizophrenia or other psychotic disorders, no
> Bipolar I or II disorder, and no first or second-degree (“A second-degree
> relative is defined as a blood relative which includes the individual’s
> grandparents, grandchildren, aunts, uncles, nephews, nieces or half-
> siblings.”) relatives with these disorders.3
[https://tripsafe.org/how-to-take-lsd/#1-avoid-with-
certain-h...](https://tripsafe.org/how-to-take-lsd/#1-avoid-with-certain-
health-conditions)
Also this means that it is advisable for you to steer clear of psychedelics.
For what it’s worth:
> “Since the early 1990s, approximately 2000 doses of psilocybin (ranging from
> low to high doses) have been safely administered to humans in the United
> States and Europe, in carefully controlled scientific settings, with no
> reports of any medical or psychiatric serious AEs, including no reported
> cases of prolonged psychosis or HPPD (Studerus et al., 2011).”1
[https://tripsafe.org/shrooms/#2-the-safety-profile-of-
shroom...](https://tripsafe.org/shrooms/#2-the-safety-profile-of-shrooms-
might-surprise-you)
~~~
tgb
I really dislike this argument. About 1% of US adults have had schizophrenia
in the past year. And 2.6% of the adult population has bipolar. Yet at some
point in their life they didn't know they were going to have schizophrenia or
bipolar! You're arguing that this only affects people with the condition
already but if you _can 't know_ if you are predisposed for that, then you
have to accept that there's risk. I support studying the risk and benefits,
but your argument suggests that the risk only applies to other people. It
doesn't and it's destructive to suggest otherwise.
Let me put this another way. Their recommendations include first and second
degree relatives. Wikipedia says that the risk of having schizophrenia when
you have a first degree relative with it is 6.5% [1] This is the single
biggest risk factor for it but it's still pretty small. If it's too dangerous
to take based off a 6.5% risk then it's also probably too dangerous to take
off the 1%-ish risk that the entire general population faces. At the very
least, it's important to _acknowledge that there exists these risks_ instead
of replying to every anecdote that hurts your cause with this misleading
information while allowing the anecdotes that help.
[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia#Genetic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia#Genetic)
~~~
MAGZine
So you're 500% more likely to have schizophrenia when first-degree relatives
are more involved.
Another book cited by the wiki page claimed that 13% of people with one
parent, and 50% of people with both parents, are likely to have schizophrenia.
These aren't hard and fast rules. People can experiment, but they should know
that if they do psychedelics when first-degree relatives have the condition,
then they're more likely to have it themselves.
Just like many other health conditions.
------
virtualwhys
> Could psychedelic drug ayahuasca have health benefits?
Certainly, anecdotally I kicked a very strong 20 year coffee and sugar habit
after doing a 3-day retreat in Latin America this past winter. Just happened
naturally, oh, I don't need this daily coffee and sugar fix anymore.
On the flip side, as the article mentions, the psychedlic tourism industry as
a whole doesn't have formal safe guards in place for when the shit hits the
fan with one (or more) of the attendees. My friend, who sat all eleven days,
said that two women just completely lost it on day 3, screaming hysterically,
out of their minds battling unknown demons.
The retreat "helpers", do the best they can to settle you down, but when
you're deep in the experience it's very hard to distinguish between
real/unreal. For example, in some kind of existential moment I shouted out in
my mind's eye, "you are the most high!". In reality I shocked the 30 other
attendants out of their seats, and a helper rushed up to see if I was Ok.
It's an extremely powerful substance. At the end of the retreat, when everyone
headed off to sleep, I was still tripping so hard that sleep was impossible.
When I finally lay down the sheer flow of non-stop Dali/Escher-like
hallucinations running through my mind were sufficient to make me question
whether I was ever going to return to reality -- Pandora's box indeed.
tl;dr; proceed with caution, can have beneficial side-effects.
~~~
hal9000xp
> I don't need this daily coffee and sugar fix anymore.
In the same way, some people just stop being "addicted" to life in general
after strong trip. Some of them decide to commit suicide.
Just yesterday, I've been in party and one guy told story of his friend who
committed suicide _after_ such trip.
The big problem with psychedelics is that you _can 't predict_ in which way a
trip could change you.
~~~
hutzlibu
"Just yesterday, I've been in party and one guy told story of his friend who
committed suicide after such trip."
unpleasant theory: maybe in some cases it is even better, that a person just
kills himself after a drug-triggered insight - instead of years of drowning
everybody around them into their black hole - and still suicide in the end.
(or worse, go amok)
But sure, I am not saying at all, that this was the case in your story. What I
know is, that Psychedelics are no miracles. The "insights" you get, might be
also totally wrong and misleading.
I see Drugs as "tools" for the mind. You can use them right, or wrong.
~~~
hhhxyxyy
The main insight is more likely that people like you exist, with your immature
attitude/ridiculous theory on suicide. I find your kind to be subtly
destructive and all too common.
Take care and aloha.
~~~
hutzlibu
Those are very good arguments you provide ...
It is probably pointless, but to try more arguments, I think the same about
you " I find your kind to be subtly destructive and all too common"
The illusionary theory, that every human must be saved at all costs. Only that
in reality "by all costs" means very often, that not only one goes down, but
also many people around them.
I have seen it too often. And in the end, those persons might indeed still
breathe, but more like zombies and not really alive .
Letting go can be less cruel in the bigger picture.
~~~
hhhxyxyy
Do you actually have experience with counterculture? Primal instincts based
around the idea of dominance prevail as often do in any social hierarchy, and
the musings about some type of altruistism surrounding suicide by the
commenter to whom I replied reflect this reality.
In short, the counterculture movement is plenty infiltrated with immature and
often sociopathic mentalities that heartlessly harass sensitive folks who are
at their most vulnerable under the influence of psychedelics. This is rarely
discussed but is so prevalent, particularly since the age of exposure aligns
with immature phases, adolesence in particular.
In laymen’s terms, it’s a sport to “fuck with” someone who has a “reaction”.
Perhaps it’s the suicide victim realizing that, instead of this idea that they
are a defective burden saving society from their own black hole via premature
self termination, that they are escaping unwanted membership of a vastly
primitive species. I assure you, the mentality of the suicidal is quite the
opposite of “conventional wisdom” about being a burden, at least in some
cases.
~~~
hutzlibu
Dude.
You told me I am imature, because I proposed the theory, that in some(!)
cases, it might be better for a suicidal person to just kill himself, instead
of everyone around them as well. (I know cases, where persons literally think
about the latter, those I referenced)
So what has that to do with psychopaths who take advantage of sensitive
persons and possible drive them to death?!?
Not at all related for the sake of the original argument.
But by now I know your type of person well, self-declared enlighted ... high
above the " primitive species" below. But unhappy, because the primitive
people have the power and therefore drive the enlightened down out of
jealously. Yeah, yeah, I know.
Well in that case, what do you think about a very low specimen who is so down,
that he hinks about either killing himself, or other's? Save him under all
costs and risk him later still killing "enlightened" people? Or accept him
choosing to go on his own, now? Why do you care anyway, he's just from a "low
species"...
~~~
hhhxyxyy
You come across as suggesting to someone they should self-terminate because
it's better that way.
~~~
hutzlibu
In "some" cases I do believe, it is the better way.
Not at all in all cases, nor in your case.
------
nicodjimenez
Psychedelics provide a incredible jolt to the system (at least that's what
they tell me) but if they do provide health benefits I believe they are short
term, similar to traveling to another country or doing something unusual with
your life. On the other hand, people that take psychedelics too often tend to
have long term negative consequences such as anxiety or become dysfunctional
in other ways. It's very hard to have nuanced opinions these days, but I think
society in general needs to come to terms with psychedelics, the dangers they
present, the novel experiences they enable, and some mental health benefits
they may enable.
~~~
ianai
Considering the US still throws people away for going near drugs I’d say the
pendulum doesn’t need to swing further the same direction.
~~~
freeloop2
Most countries do this. I don't know why people always pick on the US in this
regard.
~~~
ianai
Highest per capital inceration rate.
~~~
freeloop2
But not the most stringent drug laws.
------
jack_pp
I don't have any evidence of this but I stronly suspect that doing regular
meditation will reduce the chance of bad trips or atleast let you deal with
them much better. I'm saying this in case someone decides to experiment with
DMT or other halucinogens, you should seriously consider trying meditation as
a prerequisite.
~~~
R_haterade
Anything specific practices you recommend? I'm not interested in ayahuasca,
but meditation has been on my list for a while now.
~~~
te_chris
Install an app and start - Headspace is popular and easy to get going with.
There are lots of different practices, sure, but it's a lot like jogging: you
don't need to learn a lot of technique, just need to get up and do it.
~~~
fish_fan
I can’t tell if you’re joking with the app or not.
If you’re good enough to meditate around the app, you don’t need any help from
the app to start!
------
afro88
A negative anecdote: a friend of a friend of a friend went on a retreat and
did actually lose his mind. He needs help and probably will for the rest of
his life.
Just putting it out there for some balance. I’ve heard my fair share of
positive anecdotes too.
~~~
laser
So some guy on the internet says that a friend of a friend of a friend of his
lost his mind on Ayahuasca? Based on schizophrenia rates, I suspect pretty
much everyone even has a friend of a friend that might catalyze their latent
schizophrenia through psychedelics. But, the idea that psychedelics cause
mental illness in those that otherwise would have been fine is not supported
by scientific evidence[1][2], only anecdotes.
[1] [https://www.nature.com/news/no-link-found-between-
psychedeli...](https://www.nature.com/news/no-link-found-between-psychedelics-
and-psychosis-1.16968)
[2] [http://mentalhealthdaily.com/2014/03/28/lsd-and-
schizophreni...](http://mentalhealthdaily.com/2014/03/28/lsd-and-
schizophrenia-does-acid-cause-mental-illness/)
[3]
~~~
darpa_escapee
The functional difference between 'causes schizophrenia' and 'triggers latent
schizophrenia' to someone who is diagnosed with schizophrenia after ingesting
ayahuasca is practically non-existent.
Sure, you can generalize that those with family members who have schizophrenia
are at an increased risk of having it rear its head. However, not everyone
with schizophrenia gets diagnosed nor do many people have detailed psychiatric
evaluations of their relatives to make decisions off of.
~~~
adrusi
Presumably the person with latent schizophrenia would see it emerge at later
date even if they didn't take psychedelics. If the drug is only making
symptoms emerge earlier, the cost of the trip is only however many years of
sanity you had left (say, 5) rather than a lifetime of sanity (~65 years).
~~~
darpa_escapee
My understanding is that 'latent schizophrenia' is a term referring to the
predisposition towards developing schizophrenia if certain environmental,
social or other stressors trigger it.
It may never truly manifest itself as schizophrenia because of the lack of
non-genetic factors involved in the illness.
The nature of schizophrenia isn't that genetics will absolutely determine
whether or not someone will develop the disease. One can be diagnosed with
prodromal schizophrenia and, with proper intervention, will never be diagnosed
as schizophrenic or experience those symptoms again.
To say that the drugs will make symptoms emerge earlier instead of later in
life isn't entirely accurate. Those symptoms may _never_ emerge at all, given
the right circumstances.
It seems that the 'right circumstances' for those with a predisposition
towards developing schizophrenia include never ingesting certain types of
drugs.
------
indescions_2017
One theory is that psychedelics increase the Shannon entropy of the brain’s
functional connectivity:
Shannon entropy of brain functional complex networks under the influence of
the psychedelic Ayahuasca
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5547073/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5547073/)
------
mooneater
I permanently quit a 15 year cigarette habit after a weekend with Aya. And I
have never wanted to go near a cigarette since (7 years ago).
------
leggomylibro
It might be easier to find out, if rigorous research into psychedelics weren't
so arbitrarily difficult compared to other medicines.
~~~
schedule1
Nothing will happen until psychedelics are rescheduled. It's a travesty that
even the "natural" tryptamines (psilocybin/psilocin and DMT) can't be
researched more easily.
~~~
anythingnonidin
Not true - psilocybin is being actively researched by Heffter/Usona. They are
much more limited by funding than they are by scheduling (at least, in the
US).
The main benefit of rescheduling will likely be through easier access to
government funding and funding from large foundations.
If you’re very wealthy, you can fund psychedelic research that interests you
today - again, the scheduling is not close to being the main limiting factor.
Source: I’ve talked with multiple researchers who are studying psychedelics.
------
beepboopbeep
We won't know unless we research it!
~~~
Rafert
Exactly. Medicinal marihuana or more recently MDMA for PTSD treatment
([https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15120656](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15120656))
all took a while too.
------
swayvil
I have used psychedelics. I consider it to be one of the most beautiful,
educational and healthful things that I have ever done.
These days I meditate.
------
icarito
As a practitioner of traditional amazonian spiritual tradition, I and my
family drink Ayahuasca on a regular basis and find it to be invaluable, our
first line of defense for disease both physical and spiritual.
~~~
colordrops
Did you pick up this tradition through family or did seek out this practice
and learn it?
~~~
icarito
It was in my own pursuit.
------
tudorw
It's modulating the expression of some important genes;
"It is also a selective inhibitor of the human cytochrome P450 isozyme 2D6
(CYP 2D6)"
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16149329](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16149329)
"the inhibitions on human liver CYP3A4 and CYP2D6 enzymes by those β-carboline
alkaloids were studied kinetically. Harmine, harmol and harmane exhibited
noncompetitive inhibition on the activity of CYP3A4 with K(i) values of 16.76,
5.13 and 1.66 μM, respectively. These β-carboline alkaloids were also found to
be both substrates and inhibitors for CYP2D6. Harmaline, harmine and harmol
showed typical competitive inhibition on the activity of CYP2D6
Inhibition of Human Cytochrome P450 Enzymes 3A4 and 2D6 by β-Carboline
Alkaloids, Harmine Derivatives (PDF Download Available). Available from:
[https://www.researchgate.net/publication/50834428_Inhibition...](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/50834428_Inhibition_of_Human_Cytochrome_P450_Enzymes_3A4_and_2D6_by_b-
Carboline_Alkaloids_Harmine_Derivatives) [accessed Oct 1, 2017]."
[https://www.researchgate.net/publication/50834428_Inhibition...](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/50834428_Inhibition_of_Human_Cytochrome_P450_Enzymes_3A4_and_2D6_by_b-
Carboline_Alkaloids_Harmine_Derivatives)
~~~
nnfy
Do you have evidence that ayuhuasca is mutagenic? Inhibition of enzymes is
temporary and generally harmless if you are careful not to consume certain
drugs while inhibited.
~~~
tudorw
Not I, though Dr. Shulgin says; "The second question relates to yet another
beta-carboline alkaloid, Harman. This is a structural analogue of Harmine that
has been stripped of its methoxyl group. It is widely found in plants and
foods, and has been shown in experimental animals to be a vasodilator and a
hypotensive agent. It also interacts directly with DNA and is thus a possible
mutagenic agent."
Courtesy of the wayback machine you can read the article,
[https://web.archive.org/web/20020325022732/http://www.alchem...](https://web.archive.org/web/20020325022732/http://www.alchemind.org/shulgin/adsarchive/ayahuasca_maoi.htm)
------
fapjacks
You can buy the ingredients for ayahuasca (B. Caapi vines and P. Viridis
leaves) online for cheap.
------
thescribe
Given the article this basically comes down to "We don't know".
------
ssijak
Yes :
[https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/12/161207124115.h...](https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/12/161207124115.htm)
[http://beckleyfoundation.org/ayahuasca-stimulates-the-
birth-...](http://beckleyfoundation.org/ayahuasca-stimulates-the-birth-of-new-
brain-cells/)
[http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal....](http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0042421)
[http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v12n2/12225mab.html](http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v12n2/12225mab.html)
[http://beckleyfoundation.org/resource/exploring-the-
therapeu...](http://beckleyfoundation.org/resource/exploring-the-therapeutic-
potential-of-ayahuasca-acute-intake-increases-mindfulness-related-capacities/)
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4773875/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4773875/)
[http://www.maps.org/research/ayahuasca/ayahuasca-
canada](http://www.maps.org/research/ayahuasca/ayahuasca-canada)
[http://beckleyfoundation.org/resource/long-term-use-of-
psych...](http://beckleyfoundation.org/resource/long-term-use-of-psychedelic-
drugs-is-associated-with-differences-in-brain-structure-and-personality-in-
humans/)
[http://www.greenmedinfo.com/article/ayahuasca-may-act-
agains...](http://www.greenmedinfo.com/article/ayahuasca-may-act-against-
chronic-low-grade-inflammation-and-oxidative-stress)
[http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v08n3/08312rib.html](http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v08n3/08312rib.html)
[http://www.trnres.com/ebook/uploads/rafael/T_12998350813%20R...](http://www.trnres.com/ebook/uploads/rafael/T_12998350813%20Rafael.pdf)
[http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v06n3/06324aya.html](http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v06n3/06324aya.html)
[http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v06n3/06327tak.html](http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v06n3/06327tak.html)
[http://www.trnres.com/ebook/uploads/rafael/T_12998352185%20R...](http://www.trnres.com/ebook/uploads/rafael/T_12998352185%20Rafael.pdf)
[http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v11n1/11125hof.html](http://www.maps.org/news-
letters/v11n1/11125hof.html)
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=evidence%20of%20hea...](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=evidence%20of%20health%20and%20safety%20in%20american%20members%20of%20a%20religion%20who%20use%20a%20hallucinogenic%20sacrament#)
[http://www.maps.org/research-
archive/html_bak/kristensen.htm...](http://www.maps.org/research-
archive/html_bak/kristensen.html)
[https://qz.com/963683/the-ayahuasca-ceremony-is-going-
under-...](https://qz.com/963683/the-ayahuasca-ceremony-is-going-under-the-
scientific-method-microscope/)
[http://www.iceers.org/docs/science/ayahuasca/ICEERS2012_Ayah...](http://www.iceers.org/docs/science/ayahuasca/ICEERS2012_Ayahuasca_literature_compilation.pdf)
more here : [https://www.globalayahuascaproject.org/ayahuasca-
research/ay...](https://www.globalayahuascaproject.org/ayahuasca-
research/ayahuasca-research-papers/)
many new research presented here also :
[https://www.youtube.com/user/mapsmdma/videos](https://www.youtube.com/user/mapsmdma/videos)
etc, etc..
And aslo from anegdotal evidence answer is - YES.
------
stefek99
WOW. I really enjoy whenever psychedelics hit the mainstream.
I'm sitting on the fence regarding psychedelic coming out:
blog.mostlydoing.com/2016/04/7-reasons-why-you-dont-psychedelic.html
Those who know know, default legal system is still unadvantageous towards drug
users.
~~~
flycaliguy
I was hoping to gain some insight from the link, but it's just immature and
condescending...
I have really grown to resent that tone and it's become very popular in a lot
of opinion writing on the web. Seeing it from a psychedelic advocate is not
doing his cause any favours.
EDIT: Noticed that you wrote that, so to clarify what I'm saying: Your tone
implies that it's absurd for somebody to have an opinion contrary to your own.
It's not a healthy contribution to anything.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Where to report bugs in HN? - JoshCole
I just noticed that one of the news items is appearing twice on the ask list (http://imgur.com/yVzSP.png). I'm guessing that this a bug, but couldn't find a Hacker News issue tracker.
======
kazuya
I get to mind less about consistency of those web apps.
You don't get consistency until it eventually gets consistent. That's how I
look at Web 2.0.
------
JoshCole
<http://imgur.com/yVzSP.png>
------
bkrausz
What's really weird is that they have a point difference...
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Another Book on Data Science – Learn R and Python in Parallel - zelda_1
https://www.anotherbookondatascience.com/
======
clarityPhone
I skimmed through the book, and think it does a very poor job at showcasing
how R and Python are juxtaposed in industry.
To be fair, the book advertises showing R and Python code side-by-side. And
that’s what it does. But it does it unlike how the languages are most often
used in industry.
As a quick example, I saw no tidyverse code, which is essentially the only
thing keeping R in the game. Learning R from this book won’t prepare you for
writing R in most R shops.
I don’t see the utility in knowing how to do the same thing in both python and
R if you’re a beginner. This is even more true if you’re not taking advantage
of the strengths/weaknesses of either language.
Instead, just learn one of the languages well, and then learn the other well.
Shallow dives in both will make you weak in both.
Unfortunately, 90% of data science content seems to be geared at beginners.
~~~
wjn0
I agree for the most part, but R does have a few things beyond the tidyverse:
built-in dataframe support, lots of domain-specific packages, more consistent
interfaces for basic statistics and machine learning models, etc. Python is
definitely better for matrices (because of NumPy) and anything involving
custom gradient descent methods (because of TensorFlow).
I think 90% of data science content is for beginners because anything more
advanced isn't best described as data science. As soon as you get beyond the
initial stages of data analysis (cleaning and processing data), you're doing
something best described as some other word (statistics, machine learning,
etc.) - although, granted, there isn't much content in these areas if you
don't know _exactly_ what you're looking for.
~~~
randomvectors
> built-in dataframe support
Not an advantage if you ask me - exactly because data.frame is built in,
people have been building their own versions (tibble, data.table) instead of
improving it. That's how R ended up with 3 different structures that are
similar but have inconsistent apis and behaviour.
> lots of domain-specific packages
That's true.
> more consistent interfaces for basic statistics and machine learning models
Can't disagree more - there is no one go-to library for ML in R (like sklearn
in Python) and each package has it's own strange interface and implementation.
~~~
RosanaAnaDana
You mean like keras? or tensorflow? Or base random forest. You know, like the
original Breiman implementation.
Python has utility. But R is ___far_ __superior in its the quality of the
packages, their documentation, their ability to behave predictably on a given
data type.
I run a machine learning shop. Right now all of the training, application, and
data management is handled via R. R is simply superior in too many ways for us
to be bothered with python for the scale of work we are doing.
Since we're moving some big applications to keras/ TF we do use python and
will be using more in the future. However, for almost all data management,
munging, movement visualization, reporting, its an R world.
~~~
randomvectors
> You mean like keras? or tensorflow? Or base random forest. You know, like
> the original Breiman implementation.
> ...
> Since we're moving some big applications to keras/ TF we do use python and
> will be using more in the future.
Not sure if I misunderstood, or you're contradicting yourself there.
> R is far superior in its the quality of the packages, their documentation,
> their ability to behave predictably on a given data type.
I not only disagree but I think that the exact opposite is true for each one
of these points. But if things are working well in our shop, I'm not going to
try to convince you otherwise.
~~~
RosanaAnaDana
My point behind the keras/ TF comment is that the libraries have front ends in
both python and R, so its mix mox/ dealers choice on what you like to work in
(since the backends of both are identical).
The primary reason to moving these to python is due to convenience/ the
community. Most new work is published in python. If we find a new/ interesting
model we want to implement, its probably written in python. Rather than reskin
the thing in its entirety, its easier here to work in python.
A couple disclaimers: my group works primarily in geospatial data, and
principally in LiDAR and multispectral imagery.
The coarse division I see between R/ Python, is that if you come from a
research/ academic background (non-engineering), you probably learned to
program in R. If you were an engineer, you probably learned matlab. If you are
self taught/ coursera/ youtube, you probably learned in python.
R libraries are generally more geared towards academic research, and
specifically, working within existing frameworks (handling geospatial data as
geospatial data rather then turning them into a numpy arrays). Working in
python, there is far more re-invention of the wheel, and its always a pain the
ass to get things back into the structures they came in as.
Python has huge utility and is an important tool for certain work. But its
really really not faster than R (it def used to be, this isnt the case any
more).
R has better support for more scientific programming than python.
~~~
euler_angles
> My point behind the keras/ TF comment is that the libraries have front ends
> in both python and R, so its mix mox/ dealers choice on what you like to
> work in (since the backends of both are identical).
Not as a point of argument, just additional information: R's support for keras
and TF is a wrapper around the Python interface to those libraries.
------
randomvectors
This just doesn't seem to have a place.
1\. It's aimed at beginners.
2\. If you're a beginner, you're best off picking one language and sticking
with it for a while.
3\. There are so many other beginner resources that are much better.
~~~
thewhitetulip
Can you please list a few?
I'm currently following ISLR book & course
~~~
randomvectors
Depends on what you're interested in, your goals and your starting point. You
have two main learning lanes:
1\. Theory.
Math, calculus, linear algebra, probability, statistics, ML algorithms. ISLR
is a very good beginner-ish resource that helps you understand the algorithms
but doesn't go too deep into the math. As you go deeper, you may realise that
you have gaps in your math knowledge and you need to cover a lot more
probability, calculus and linear algebra.
2\. Programming.
2.1. Good software engineering practices - writing maintainable code, design
patters, version control, unit testing etc.
2.2. Tooling - knowing the language-specific ecosystem of libraries (the OP is
an attempt to teach you this in two languages at the same time). This is what
most beginner resources focus on; your knowledge here has the least
transferability and tends to go out of date quickly. Still, using the right
tools and knowing them well goes a long way.
~~~
thewhitetulip
I'm sorry in advance if I'm taking too much of your time.
#2: coding is my hobby and have been writing well designed apps for a long
time, so thats not an issue
#3: ISLR is teaching how to do ML algo in R, so there goes that point
#1 is what I'd like more information. Good important is the maths to work as a
data scientist? I'm planning ISLR and then maybe ESL or some advance course
A few of my friends work on Data science and they said that maths isn't that
important as in, one needs to know the formulas and why things work the way
they do as in not rote learning the math.
It'd be great if you can list down intermediate courses, the learning market
has drowned good tutorials and books with not so good guides!
~~~
randomvectors
> then maybe ESL or some advance course
> A few of my friends work on Data science and they said that maths isn't that
> important
Without the math you won't understand anything in ESL.
Which might be okay if the job doesn't require you to go into that much depth
- some data science jobs are more focused on research (very math-heavy), some
on ETL and/or engineering, others on business understanding and communication;
it's a really broad title.
~~~
thewhitetulip
Thank you. That's what I was thinking. The jobs I'll apply won't be math
oriented.
------
anonu
What does the HN community think about Python for statistical computing?
Core Python is fine. But pandas is an atrocious mess of object orientedness
and other weird stuff.
------
omnimkar69
I also skimmed through the book and it does very poor work in case of python I
think they have to change this concept
------
thatcat
I'd be interested in a version that included SAS. Is SAS ever used outside of
academia?
~~~
randomvectors
SAS is still used by companies who don't want to use open source tools and
would rather pay a lot of money for an established product name and have a
support line that they can call if anything goes wrong. Understandably, it's
slowly dying out.
~~~
tomrod
Support, and also indemnification.
SAS lives on borrowed time.
------
Dkastro92
I think it's a good first impression of either languague
------
dlphn___xyz
i only read the chapter on optimization/linear programming - its far too brief
and misses key concepts for it to be useful. there are no real applications of
the concepts covered in the section.
~~~
zelda_1
Yes, it is very brief. I tried to give some useful reference
books/papers/links for each subject appeared in the book. Hope that is useful
if the readers are willing to dive deeper. But the concept of linear
programming itself is not complex, the users are generally not required to
understand simplex/interior point algorithm. If they are able to translate the
actual problem into the code then it is basically done. It is not like
constrained optimization for which customized treatment based on mathematical
theories is more important than writing the code.
------
euler_angles
What are the good intermediate level data science books?
------
adamnemecek
Julia is hands down much better than either of these languages. Don't waste
your time.
~~~
mruts
I whole heartedly agree. Python is garbage for data science. If an industrial
grade NN library was written for it, plus some quant libraries, I think most
people would switch.
I work in finance doing data science-y things and have yet to meet anyone who
doesn’t think that Python is a pile of garbage.
People used to make the easy to learn argument, but Julia is even easier. And
more elegant, extensible, and faster.
~~~
huac
You, uh, don't like PyTorch and TensorFlow? I can't tell if this is sarcastic.
~~~
pjmlp
They are written in C++.
~~~
randomvectors
Not sure how that's relevant. Everything is written in something else.
Python itself is written in C. The Julia github repo shows Julia 68.2%, C
16.3%, C++ 10.4%, Scheme 3.2%. R is a mix of C, C++, R and some Fortran I
think...
~~~
pjmlp
It is relevant from the point of view of what a developer is able to achieve
without being forced to drop down to a 2nd programming language, aka "2
language syndrome".
And how many Python libraries are just plain wrappers, not really written in
Python.
I use TensorFlow from .NET ML and C++ API.
------
omnimkar69
I also skimmed through the book and it does very poor work in the case of
python I think that they should change R bcoz 90% are the beginners
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Climate change, impacts and vulnerability in Europe 2012 - brutuscat
http://www.eea.europa.eu/publications/climate-impacts-and-vulnerability-2012/
======
brutuscat
Some very interesting maps I found in the pdf report which are forcing me to
read this.
Potential environmental and economic impact of climate change
<http://imgur.com/31j2I>
Key observed and projected climate change and impacts for the main regions in
Europe <http://imgur.com/r4Qj0>
Projections of extreme high temperatures <http://imgur.com/d8FVh>
Projected changes in the tourism climatic index for all seasons
<http://imgur.com/sv1Nu>
I guess Spain will suffer a lot...
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Don't tell Google, Facebook or Twitter, Instant Search Hacked In 2+ Hrs - MII9
http://www.YTLatest.com
======
Pewpewarrows
What exactly does this prove? Oh man, you used AJAX to call an API and pull up
a result from it.
Let me know when it scales to millions of people hitting your page every hour,
with it still returning the results in a fraction of a second, and with it
hitting your own site's and server's API every time. That's what was
technically impressive about Google's Instant Search, not the simple
javascript behind it.
------
zbanks
Doesn't work for me. Chrome on Ubuntu.
Yes. Very easy.
~~~
VMG
Same for chromium 7.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
DHH (Rails) and Matt Mullenweg (Wordpress) talk about open source [notes] - kirillzubovsky
https://smashnotes.com/p/rework/e/open-source-and-power-with-matt-mullenweg
======
AlchemistCamp
The entirety of the visible page is a signup form, a subscribe button and a
login button.
~~~
kirillzubovsky
Hi AlchemistCamp, Kirill here, I made Smash Notes. That's strange. Can you
tell me what device/browser you're using? Are you able to click-out of the
signup form? Usually hitting the X should close it, and prevent it from
popping up again, but obviously I should look into this. Would love feedback,
thank you!
~~~
AlchemistCamp
Firefox... not sure. I bounced from the page as soon as I saw it.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
What’s Something That Was Said to You That’s Forever Changed the Way You Think? - jimsojim
https://upvoted.com/2015/12/12/whats-something-that-was-told-to-you-thats-forever-changed-the-way-you-think/?utm_content=bufferb40e2&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer
======
ourcat
This question.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
New Emoji include 'tiny p****' and 'period blood', according to the Internet - Varcht
https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2019/02/06/tiny-penis-and-period-emoji-headed-your-keyboard/2792533002/
======
towaway1138
Does anyone really want to receive tiny dick pics?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Reset your life - msvan
http://levels.io/reset-your-life/
======
pearjuice
First and foremost: this was posted on Monday the 22nd of April, 2013.
Secondly, the guy writing this is extremely privileged yet implying he somehow
had a hard time and had to "escape" the system. If anything, his life was
getting monotonous and he did indeed reset it, but not completely. He still
had his massive bank account when he left for Thailand, so in the end it was
just moving without having to transport all the belongings (as he got rid of
everything).
~~~
jere
It's _Eat, Pray, Love_ for the tech crowd.
I've seen a lot of these articles. It reminds me very much of 4HWW. They're
all written like the author is overcoming some major hurdle and achieving some
sort of enlightment, but in fact they're basically just going on vacation
after becoming hugely successful.
~~~
sliverstorm
You've got to cope with the burden of success _somehow_ , right? :)
------
ev9
It sounds like (or at least the title suggests that) the author would advocate
this extreme approach to others? Perhaps I can advocate another approach:
If you're feeling signs of depression or panic attacks, seek out the help of a
mental health professional.
There are real neurological and physical implications to the symptoms the
author describes. Picking up and moving won't be an option to all, and may not
work even for those who do have the option.
~~~
vinceguidry
I know a very good mental health professional, a trained psychologist with a
Ph.D. She says (and I'm paraphrasing) that 99% of people's problems can be
treated by getting away from sources of stress, and exercising. These things
work much better than most forms of therapy, and most of her sessions involve
convincing clients to do these simple, effective things.
So if you're having problems, going to Thailand is excellent medicine, if you
can afford it.
~~~
ev9
Sounds like a safer conclusion for a mental health professional to come to
than a layman, given proper data. That is, I trust your friend's opinion on
this topic more than yours or mine, but in more advanced cases I'm sure she'd
prefer to see the patient than they skip her counsel.
The technical community has a higher than normal prevalence of mental illness.
We need to learn to put more stock in real, educated, professional advice on
these topics than blog and forum-based accounts of self-prescribed solutions.
~~~
DanBC
> The technical community has a higher than normal prevalence of mental
> illness.
What makes you say this?
> We need to learn to put more stock in real, educated, professional advice on
> these topics than blog and forum-based accounts of self-prescribed
> solutions.
Yes. See also any thread about food.
~~~
ev9
>> The technical community has a higher than normal prevalence of mental
illness.
> What makes you say this?
[http://www.tablexi.com/blog/2013/04/developers-and-
depressio...](http://www.tablexi.com/blog/2013/04/developers-and-depression-
end-the-shame/txi-life/)
>> We need to learn to put more stock in real, educated, professional advice
on these topics than blog and forum-based accounts of self-prescribed
solutions.
> Yes. See also any thread about food.
Food? Food sources? Cooking? Farming? What are you talking about?
~~~
DanBC
> _I know of no formal study, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the rates of
> bipolar and depression amongst software developers are double that of the
> general population._
So, you're just guessing about rates of mental illness among the technical
community?
> Food?
Yes, food. The threads are full of weird anecdote and semi-mystical bollocks.
------
gdubs
Shaking things up can be cathartic and sometimes the exactly right thing to
do. More frequently, I've found, changing one's life in smaller degrees can
have a profound effect on mood and well being: exercising more, eating
healthier, getting more sleep, meditating, consuming less media, keeping a
clean living space. It's worth checking the low-hanging fruit -- small things
can make a big difference.
~~~
inovica
I've been thinking about 'big changes' in my life and in that of my families.
I too am privileged to a degree. Reading your comment though has made me think
and I'd like to thank you for that. Its easier to think of doing one big step,
but really you're right - I need to stop thinking that I'm too busy to
meditate or do yoga and I just need to do it. I've already stopped consuming
too much media but every single of your points are valid in terms of what I
need to do. Thank you.
------
fromdoon
I had a panic attack recently. Let me tell you, it is worst feeling in the
world. The urge to reset your life after such a event is almost natural. It's
like, If I don't change right now, I would not be able to live any longer.
I started changing little things. I started sleeping more.
I made it a point to do a 6 Km walk everyday.
I cut down on alcohol.
I stopped seeing people whom I had wanted to avoid for a long time but was not
doing so out of social pressures.
I started seeing my parents more often.
I also signed up for an online meditation course.
I started working less ( Looking back, this maybe was the most effective
thing)
It takes days to overcome a full fledged panic attack. For days you would
dread that you might get another panic attack when you're least expecting it.
Like when you're in office or when you are driving or when you're shopping.
I have changed my lifestyle and I can tell you I am quite happy after I did
so.
I hope OP also experienced something similar.
------
Touche
Not to play armchair psychologist but the whole minimalist thing strikes me as
a way to put unnecessary extra stress on yourself. Having nothing means having
no excuse not to constantly work, and you shouldn't constantly work. You
should fucking relax every now and then, drink a few beers and watch something
mindless on your obscenely large flatscreen.
Having shit is a way to make your life be about more than just what your
early-20s self told you was necessary to consider yourself a success. If you
think life is only worth living if you follow [insert well known person]'s
biography to a T then your bound to have incidents that make you want to do
crazy things like "reset" your privileged life.
* the preceding is not a judgment on the author's decisions, which are his own, but rather a commentary on the "minimalist" movement.
~~~
breischl
OK, but you don't need things in order to relax. In fact, many of the best
ways to relax don't need things (or at least, very many things). I think
that's the point.
Rather than owning an obscenely large flatscreen (and stand to put it on, and
couch to sit on while watching it, and apartment to put it in, and
cable/Roku/DVD/(insert content device)) you could...
Go for a walk
Go for a walk in nature, now it's a hike!
Go to a museum
Play frisbee (borrow if necessary)
Ride a bike (rent if necessary)
Find some music to listen to
~~~
Touche
You can do all of those things while also owning stuff. Owning stuff just
makes it easier to relax. Instead of planning to relax... you just walk into a
room with distractions available.
Having distractions readily available is benefitial to your mental health.
Sometimes you have to not over-analyze your every action. Have an office which
is empty, that's what I have, for when you need complete concentration. Stop
making early-20s dreams your entire existence.
~~~
nileshtrivedi
Right. But what about distractions that you never use but still end up having
to maintain (which involves over-analyzing and mental costs)?
Minimalism is about making that same decision. It's about eliminating those
things from your life that don't bring more fun to you than their maintenance
costs. Stuff that is making it _harder_ , not easier, for you to relax. What
qualifies as minimalist living is an inherently personal decision. For some,
everything can fit in a backpack. For others, even a mansion may be minimal.
Owning "only 100 things" isn't the _definition_ of minimalism. Only an
example. Like "delicious", "minimalism" is a subjective concept.
------
hsitz
Uprooting your life and doing a "reset" as described will make you feel good
for a while.
Unfortunately, "wherever you go there you are." You can't outrun yourself, and
thinking a reset like this is anything more than a temporary band-aid is
misguided.
------
badman_ting
Shaking things up and changing your life drastically is fun and
exciting......... for a while. Then you have to learn to build a life that you
find sustainable, whatever it is, or else you will always be running. This is
sometimes called the "distance cure".
Again, doing this feels great. For a while. I did it myself. But you should
learn to distrust that good feeling, to examine it and find out why it's
happening. A note of warning though, you probably won't like what you find.
It's really easy to fool yourself into thinking that you are effecting change
when really you are doing anything but. We are being lied to, by ourselves.
~~~
im3w1l
As someone considering changing my life drastically, I would appreciate if you
could elaborate on this post.
~~~
joshguthrie
Week one: "Great, my life is changing! It's a fresh new start!"
Week two: "It's nice making new friends every place I go!"
Week six: "I kinda miss hacking, having my place, a stable life and my usual
clique of friends. But not too much. Moving is cool but where am I really
going? And for what?"
Week ten: "Actually, I'm just doing what I was doing before but in another
part of the world. And I realize I'm not even building something that's gonna
last because I know I'm just gonna move out whenever I feel like it."
------
chill1
"Life is like the best video game ever, it has amazing graphics, infinite
amounts of levels, a huge map and this ridiculous great freedom. I just needed
to pick up the controller."
~~~
grumpycord
not sure this would go down as well for someone without a well established
developer's expertise/experience. i can imagine landing at a foreign
destination, after my life-reset and then asking '...now what?'
~~~
chill1
True.. If someone who wasn't already an established freelancer / contractor in
the IT field tried to do what he did, they'd certainly have a hard go of it.
And, if they wanted to mirror the author's "reset", they would certainly have
to think longer term than most people seem to be capable of; 2+ years minimum
of pushing yourself to learn, gain experience in the field, and build a
network of contacts.
~~~
devgutt
Probably hardship is the exact thing that he wants to experience.
------
nickthemagicman
They say that if you make over 35,000 a year you're in the top 1% of the
WORLD.
How we look at the the ultra rich with their 4 mansions and Lamborghini's is
how the average world citizen looks at people like this guy.
------
euphemize
Alright to this guy had an anxiety attack, and decided to reset his life :
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6580196](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6580196)
He went to Thailand and explained the process :
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6540030](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6540030)
Then made a post of about how explaining his process has affected his blogs'
stats :
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6577524](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6577524)
Hopefully another epiphany in Thailand, another reset, another relocation,
another blog post, another HN hit...?
break;
------
jotm
Why Thailand, though? I mean, Europe itself is more diverse than the US, for
example, you could've moved anywhere within the continent and still have a
massive change. Prague, Madrid, London, Berlin, Warsaw, Zagreb (new EU member,
Croatia) all very different - why Bangkok? Could've moved to Australia even
:-D
~~~
yodsanklai
Thailand is cheap and safe. They have good infrastructures (internet,
hospitals, transportation...). It's hot all year long. There are many expats
and tourists so it's easy to find similarly minded people.
Also there are tons of affordable sex workers. Prostitution is not frown upon
there as it is in the West. I don't know if it was a motivation for this guy,
but it certainly something that attracts many men.
~~~
jotm
That could be said for some of the major cities in Europe, as well (including
the prostitution, which is not illegal in Europe, just brothels are)...
~~~
yodsanklai
Of course, Europe has good infrastructures. But Thailand is much cheaper than
Europe (almost an order of magnitude cheaper for food and lodging).
An other thing that makes Thailand appealing is that there are many expats or
long term tourists slacking/working there, so you wouldn't feel out of place
living there with no well-defined purpose. I don't think you could get the
same kind of vibe in Europe.
As far as prostitution goes, Thailand is VERY different from Europe and the
US.
------
Alexx
Last time I saw 'this post' was 643 days ago, and my observations then[1]
still seem to be holding true now :)
[1][https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3470328](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3470328)
Not that it's a bad thing! I'd just love to see a follow up from one of these.
~~~
breischl
So your observation was "Unknown or expired link" ??
:)
~~~
Alexx
Whoops, link fixed to the permalink.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
BedBudd - The answer to bed-based arguments - ryanSP
http://bedbudd.com
======
ryanSP
Is this thing for real? Not sure, looks nice though!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
How I Reimplemented My Shopping Cart To Sell More Software, w/ Code - patio11
http://www.bingocardcreator.com/articles/developing-shopping-cart.htm
======
patio11
Hiya guys. I recently redid the shopping cart for my business. Then I spent a
few hours writing it up for folks, with the hope somebody can use something.
Article includes:
\+ Results of my A/B tests with previous ways of presenting software for sales
to my customers.
\+ How I use lightboxes to make a good deal of money
\+ An AJAX cart I have used to good effect
\+ How I went about designing and reimplementing a cart, in JS, to give the
feel of the AJAXy one but improve its speed and UI
\+ Code for everything, which I put in the public domain. Go nuts.
~~~
apsurd
>So your shopping cart needs to be willing to continue the conversation with
your customers.
Great advice, I like your insight into how users interact with shopping carts.
I'll be taking this with me on my project!
FYI: the link to e-junkie at the end of the page is broken. It points to:
<http://www.e-junkie/>
------
lonestar
Maybe I've missed something, but it seems like you could completely eliminate
the security flaw of letting your user's decide how much to pay for your
software very easily. Just have the server send the price with an HMAC, check
the HMAC on return, and voila.
~~~
dmolnar
This is a neat idea, but there is at least one subtlety: you need to make sure
that it is not possible to cut-and-paste HMAC'd prices from one web page into
another. Otherwise the user could ask for a page for an item with a price of
$1, receive an HMAC on "$1", and paste that into a page for a different item.
Two possible ways to do this:
1) Use a different HMAC key for each page you generate. 2) HMAC the pair
(price,nonce) where nonce never repeats from one page to another. The server
has to keep the nonce, as well, i.e. is not obtained from the web page.
~~~
rcoder
A simple one-way hash will provide sufficient security for most cases.
Assuming you're representing items for sale in a Javascript array, you might
send data like this to the browser:
var forSale = {
"book": {"price": 19.95, "description": "a book", "checksum": "c6da835c1fd2ee98d68eee3912dd199e41c82a32"}
}
The value for 'checksum' is just a SHA1 hex digest of the ('book', '19.95',
'secret'), joined by tab characters. It can be included as a hidden form field
or invisible element within your page; it doesn't matter so long as you can
capture it and POST is along with the item + price.
In your order-processing logic, just check that the hash verifies with your
secret key ('secret' in the above), and you know with a reasonable degree of
certainty that the original page was one generated by your server.
~~~
patio11
That would work, but I don't do order fulfillment. e-junkie does. They get to
keep the IPN and Google payment notification interfaces, an email server to
send out registration keys, bunches o' reporting code, and integration to the
company that stamps CDs for me.
The cart posts directly to them, so hypothetically assuming I generated a
secret and passed it over, they'd process the order anyhow and then tell me
"By the way, your website passed this secret with the order -- do whatever
with it", after which point a) the customer would have a registration key and
b) if they ordered a CD, it would be scheduled to ship already.
Which is a long way of saying "There are ways to make this setup more secure
but they'd involve me having to rewrite large portions of my business
processes." Like I mentioned: it would cost me a lot of time at a very minor
increase in security.
Probably illusory, actually. No amount of securing my cart will protect me
from this attack: buy the software, write me an email saying "You offer an
unconditional guarantee. I'd like a refund." And there is absolutely nothing
that anyone could say or do which would make me stop offering that
unconditional guarantee, because it is practically a license to print money.
(To anyone who produces a low-marginal-cost product or service: if you do not
have a guarantee, start A/B testing one. Its the closest thing in life to free
money.)
~~~
Tangurena
I remember reading one of the "hacking exposed" books (the exact one I can't
remember now), where there was an incident where an online store used values
in the webpage itself to handle the prices of goods. In the example in the
book, the hackers had replaced $45 list price with $1 giving huge discounts to
the purchasers. And to make things even worse, some of the hackers would order
dozens of shirts (at $1 each) and then return them for full price.
It might have been an earlier edition of this one, but I do remember the
bright red cover: [http://www.amazon.com/Hacking-Exposed-Web-
Applications-2nd/d...](http://www.amazon.com/Hacking-Exposed-Web-
Applications-2nd/dp/0072262990/)
------
MattMitchell
Um, I'm not sure I'm reading this right but you hard-code your prices in JS to
cut down on an AJAX call.
Why not just print your JS from server-side - i.e. you can still have your
prices in your JS but have the server generate these?
~~~
patio11
Easy, fast, and clean all in one little packet of geek joy. I like this
suggestion a lot. Thanks. (The whole code-generates-code thing is still taking
me some time to get used to... even though I spent several hours yesterday
writing code-generates-code-generates-essay.)
------
swombat
_Accordingly, the fact that the same URL rewriting trick that lets me change
the price to give users discounts could be used to reprice my software to a
penny... really doesn't worry me that much._
Is this an invitation to get a 1 penny trial version of your software?
------
staunch
> _"Originally posted by monkeyfish at Hacker News: "_
Should be mechanical_fish I think.
~~~
patio11
I'll fix that once I get back home. Good eye.
------
weaksauce
Does your cart fail gracefully if javascript is turned off, or is that not a
concern for you?
~~~
patio11
Did you try it?
It should fall-through to e-junkie's traditional non-Javascript cart hosted
offsite. I personally think the experience is decidedly suboptimal next to
either of the JS carts but, honestly, I think the Internet is moving away from
assuming that Javascript is optional.
(I would have a different opinion if I had to support a range of mobile
browsers but, well, I sell downloadable software to elementary schoolteachers.
Most of them don't think "Ooh great I loved this downloadable free trial! Let
me write down the URL, get out my iPhone, type in the URL, then order a
copy!")
------
apollo
Good work, I admire your approach.
------
jwesley
How I SEOed my website to make more sales!
~~~
patio11
The main reason it is on the website, as opposed to my blog, is because I am
making _extensive_ use of Rails as the world's most over-engineered templating
system to write that. It wouldn't be interesting at all without the cart to
play with, now would it? I'm all about avoiding sucky user experiences and "I
am going to extensively discuss a feature of another website. Please open that
website in a tab and follow along" is a sucky user experience.
But yeah, to the extent that people find this article as valuable and link to
it, Google will see my site as more trustworthy and send me more frazzled
teachers trying to get ready for fourth period.
I really don't have a problem with that: they get their prep work done, I get
money, the rest of the world gets a few hours of engineer time writing what I
hope was a useful article as a result of the cross-subsidy. The notion is
quite similar to OSS. Its a win for everybody.
~~~
jwesley
Don't get all defensive bro. It's cool to get paid.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Avoid CloudAtCost - st3fan
I found the following email in my inbox today:<p>http://pastebin.com/gKfpWiWN<p>Note the following:<p>I never received the original initial email about this emergency maintainance. I doubt they actually sent that. I have a couple of accounts and none of them received the initial email.<p>Promising 'we will never have an outage again moving forward' is a dangerous thing to say for a company that deletes daily cronjobs from their clients servers because the disk IO that the daily jobs generate result in kernel panics or read-only remount of your VPS fileystems. (Is this a fix for that issue? Who knows .. communication is not their best skill)<p>So even though these folks run VMWare, which is perfectly capable of migrating VMs or simply suspending and resuming VMs, they decide to POWER OFF your VMs and tell you via email that you can MANUALLY turn then back on.<p>I know I can't complain because I paid $35 for a lifetime server and you get what you pay for. But seriously, this is all so incredibly amateur hour.
======
ddorian43
Other than that, is the server good ?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
North American vs. Japanese zoning - oftenwrong
http://devonzuegel.com/post/north-american-vs-japanese-zoning
======
avar
Somewhat tangential: One of the things I was most disappointed in when
visiting Japan was discovering (at least in Tokyo, Kyoto etc.) that they don't
really seem to have the concept of a public green space as it exists in
Europe.
Instead most of these parks have fences around the grass, and you're not
allowed to lie down there and hang out. Some are also "temples" and have
guards that'll yell at you if you even sit down out of the way on some stairs
for a second.
I live in Amsterdam, and in general I'd much prefer living in a smaller house
with no yard of my own if there's a big park nearby, but in Japan I'm not so
sure. If I can't use the park for anything worthwhile (lie in the sun, have a
BBQ etc.) I'd rather just live in an American-style suburb with my own small
yard.
~~~
zumu
There are plenty of parks in Japan where people hang out, lay in the grass,
play instruments, practice their lines, drink socially, enjoy their lunch,
walk their dogs, go for runs, etc.
I suspect what is a park and what isn't might not be easy to tell as a
tourist. If you are trying to lounge in something that isn't technically a
park, there's a good chance it won't be received well.
That being said, in Tokyo, most of the central public parks are packed during
the weekends. Tokyo could definitely use a lot more, imho.
------
morley
I find these types of articles invigorating and demoralizing at the same time.
I think the reason why, and something I've thought about a lot lately, is:
what would it actually take to do something like this? It'd probably involve a
series of steps like this to do _exactly_ this:
* Decide to run for office
* Raise an enormous amount of money, somehow without indebting yourself to private interests
* Convince a large amount of people to vote you into office
* Bring to bear an enormous amount of political capital to convince other people to enact these changes
That involves no small amount of luck and personal charisma. I probably have
none of these things, so that leaves me out.
There are other methods that are potentially easier (the one that comes to
mind is effectively paying off an incumbent politician), but I'd roughly guess
that there's only a 40-60% chance to get the outcome you want. Even easier
actions, like calling your representatives, I'd peg at 2-5% expected value.
Voting is <0.1%.
Are these really our only options? Am I thinking about this problem wrong? Is
this just the great struggle of human governance we've been trying to solve
for millenia?
~~~
jjaredsimpson
A real problem is that public service is underpaid. I live in a state with a
part time legislature that is paid $27k/year. I'm never going to run for
office and derail my life by earning next to nothing and being co-mingled into
a system I find full of corrupt and detestable people.
America has a perverse relationship with politics, politicians, and
governance. Politicians do some of the most important work possible in our
society, but by underpaying you only attract certain types of people. Either
those just hungry for power, using office as a stepping stone to wealth. Or
those already wealthy looking to maintain existing structures and protect
their wealth.
I don't mean to sound flippant. Our system of government is an evolved process
settled on over millennia. It's really close to some local maximum.
My gripes are mostly centered around complaining that we "all know" there are
obvious problems with the system but there isn't some obvious "continuous"
path of from here to a better system.
If I were benevolent dictator I'd like to see something like futarchy. And
even while saying that I'm not sure if it just appeals to my hyper rationalism
or if it's genuinely better. I assume current legislator suffer from this same
bias on all kinds of issues.
~~~
raldi
It's true; here in San Francisco, the annual city budget is $11B, and each of
the 11 members of the Board of Supervisors makes $110,000 a year (which sounds
like a lot until you find out that thanks to our housing shortage, HUD defines
the local "low-income" threshold as $117,400).
The 11 supervisors are the equivalent of senior executives. How much do you
think a senior executive of a company with $11B revenue gets paid?
As a result, we get supervisors like Aaron Peskin (who's a landlord on the
side and pushes civic policy that obstructs the creation of new apartments) or
Chris Daly (basically a clown).
~~~
pound
it's $117,400 for the family of 4
~~~
emmett
You don't think a city supervisor should be able to support a family of 4
without being classified as low income?
------
21
For the land of the free, some US rules are a shock to me.
Like how in many places you are not allowed to have a brown lawn, or one with
taller weeds instead of grass.
> Grass or weeds taller than 8 inches is in violation of Minneapolis
> ordinance. If grass or weeds are taller than 8", an inspector may issue an
> order to the property owner giving them at least 3 days to cut it. If the
> violation is not corrected, inspectors may authorize a contractor to cut the
> grass and assess the costs and administrative fees to the owner.
~~~
Spivak
The rules are a bit crazy but they're not born out of malice -- they basically
exist to control negative externalities and protect the property values of the
neighborhood.
It's a very real fear that one of your neighbors will drive people away from
your neighborhood, tank property values, and suddenly you have 20 families
underwater on their mortgage. These rules are kinda dumb and often go way far
because HoA members get a little drunk with power but they're essential for
mobility in suburbia.
~~~
humanrebar
Family homes should have stopped being investment vehicles a long time ago.
If we want affordable housing, housing costs must necessarily fall behind
inflation, which is the thing brown lawn regulations are trying to prevent.
I'm not saying brown lawns are _the_ way to lower housing prices, but the
whole point rests on the value judgement that expensive housing is better.
~~~
davidw
At least it's brown _lawns_ people don't want in their neighborhoods these
days.
~~~
monocasa
It's still both.
~~~
stronglikedan
It's still both _everywhere_ , but not as much _anywhere_ as some would like
to believe. It's better now than it ever was, and as long as it keeps moving
in that direction that's a good thing.
~~~
monocasa
I mean, schools are more segregated now then they were 40 years ago. So no,
it's not better than it ever was, it's just more quiet.
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-
sheet/wp/2013/08/...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-
sheet/wp/2013/08/29/report-public-schools-more-segregated-now-than-40-years-
ago/)
~~~
stronglikedan
That's just one data point in one area, and doesn't necessarily reflect
racism. My general statement is still accurate - racism has been and still is
on the decline.
------
slivym
As a Brit something that always struck me as strange was that Americans all
seemed to own large, detatched houses. It just seemed odd to me, and whilst
it's true that a lot of the US is less dense than the UK I find it fascinating
that the zoning laws seem to massively encourage and protect single family
homes.
~~~
tudelo
Do you not want a large, detached house? :) I think part of it has to do with
the fact that that is what people want... When you have such a place you don't
have to worry as much about how much noise you're making or if you're
disturbing your neighbors.
~~~
Zach_the_Lizard
> Do you not want a large, detached house? :) I think part of it has to do
> with the fact that that is what people want
If people truly wanted this, we wouldn't need a large zoning law apparatus to
legally enforce it, now would we?
Historically these laws came about due to White Flight and wanting to keep the
"other" people out.
My hypothesis is these laws persist due to effectively creating legally
enforced housing cartel, pushing up house prices. Throw in some rent control
to turn some poor folks against new housing, and you've got a recipe for ever
increasing house prices, falling fertility rates, and the squeezing of the
middle class.
~~~
Spivak
People absolutely want large detached houses, but housing developers want to
build densely packed multi-family housing because they're more profitable.
Here's the problem:
\- Start with a nice, quiet, picturesque suburban neighborhood.
\- Naturally people want to move into this neighborhood because it's so nice
and want it to be affordable so, absent zoning, developers build apartments
and condos to fill the need.
\- Then all the people move in and the neighborhood slowly learns that the
reason it was actually nice and picturesque was the low density and high buy-
in.
\- Property values start going down, along with tax revenue, the schools
decline, $/student plummets, and all the people with the means move somewhere
else.
Without at least some laws it's incredibly difficult to break this cycle.
~~~
AnthonyMouse
> People absolutely want large detached houses, but housing developers want to
> build densely packed multi-family housing because they're more profitable.
They also cost less per unit, which is a thing people (i.e. new homeowners)
like even more.
> \- Property values start going down, along with tax revenue, the schools
> decline, $/student plummets, and all the people with the means move
> somewhere else.
This can be solved by adjusting the mil rate to generate the original amount
of property tax revenue per unit against the lower housing prices.
I also don't see how the cycle is not self-defeating. If there are a hundred
low density units and someone builds a hundred high density units near them so
the original inhabitants leave and build a hundred new low density units
somewhere else, now there are three hundred housing units available. The
higher supply reduces the profit in building new condos anywhere in the
region. If the cycle repeats then even more housing is constructed. At some
point the profit in building new condos falls below the construction cost,
because people don't want to live in a condo in the otherwise low density area
more than they want to have a much smaller mortgage payment.
~~~
emodendroket
In this scenario a lot of people probably still have to commute to the city or
nearby so moving to further and further rings out has real disadvantages
~~~
AnthonyMouse
> In this scenario a lot of people probably still have to commute to the city
> or nearby so moving to further and further rings out has real disadvantages
This is obviously an argument _in favor_ of high density zoning. Even if you
want to live in a detached single family home, you want as many other people
as possible to be able to live in high density housing to minimize the amount
of land you have to drive through between your home and the city.
~~~
emodendroket
Perhaps, but you can see how this is not necessarily a situation where what's
good for the goose is good for the gander.
~~~
AnthonyMouse
"Screw all of you, I've got mine" seems like it shouldn't be a winning policy
argument.
------
pluma
As a European I guess this explains why Sim City's zoning never made much
sense to me.
------
kindatrue
Not mentioned: In America, owning a home is considered the most important
investment you can make.
Who would've thought that mindset would lead to unaffordable housing!
Or parents telling their children that they won't be able to live near their
parents because... well... investment! Like this guy:
[https://twitter.com/nextdoorsv/status/999364778907914245](https://twitter.com/nextdoorsv/status/999364778907914245)
~~~
gascan
I would think owning your place of residence would be a pretty good long term
investment most anyplace. It's practically a fundamental rule of the market;
more expensive to rent than own long term.
~~~
closeparen
This is mainly a psychological trick: people are more disciplined about paying
a mortgage under threat of foreclosure than they are about actually investing
the savings from renting. But if you do actually invest the savings, they come
out pretty close. There are a lot of costs to owning a home beyond the
principal payment.
~~~
gascan
Even after the mortgage is paid off?
~~~
closeparen
You have a pretty good chunk of capital (and capital gains) after investing in
index funds for 30 years. That is, after all, how retirement works.
------
crawshaw
Comparisons between the governments of homogeneous states like Japan and
sprawling unions like the USA are not particularly helpful. The nature of the
problems the governments face is too different.
Instead, compare California to Japan. From this article, run the thought
experiment of a California-wide zoning board.
------
vorpalhex
So the linked article doesn't directly cite any work but does provide
highlighted notes for an article, which I followed... which also doesn't
actually cite anything. So I went down a rabbit hole of researching early
zoning laws to evaluate a very specific claim: that the origin of zoning laws
is racist.
In 1917 Buchanan v Warley mades directly racist zoning illegal... which
affected a single city in Kentucky and otherwise had very little effect. In
addition, the very first zoning laws didn't get passed until 1910 in the US
and zoning didn't exist much until the 1920s [1] so that seems to undermine
that claim as an emotional, not a factual one.
Everyone seems to suggest that the fix for high housing prices is to simply
build more densely (more supply, same demand, therefore prices should go down
right?). Yet that appears to not be the case either - as buildings get taller
and more dense, costs seem to increase outside the direct supply/demand system
[3] and those units which are built are typically more expensive then low
density options.
[1] -
[https://www.dartmouth.edu/~wfischel/Papers/02-03.pdf](https://www.dartmouth.edu/~wfischel/Papers/02-03.pdf)
[3] - [https://www.forbes.com/sites/joelkotkin/2017/08/31/high-
rise...](https://www.forbes.com/sites/joelkotkin/2017/08/31/high-rise-glut-
affordable-housing/#6f2ce63753e0)
\--
[2] - [http://marketurbanism.com/2017/11/01/does-density-raise-
hous...](http://marketurbanism.com/2017/11/01/does-density-raise-housing-
prices/)
~~~
pitaj
Zoning laws _were_ created by progressives for racist reasons
[http://www.latimes.com/opinion/livable-city/la-oe-
vallianato...](http://www.latimes.com/opinion/livable-city/la-oe-vallianatos-
sb-827-housing-zoning-20180402-story.html)
[https://reason.com/archives/2014/04/02/zonings-racist-
roots-...](https://reason.com/archives/2014/04/02/zonings-racist-roots-still-
bear-fruit)
Federal policies were also motivated by racism
[https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2014/05/the-
rac...](https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2014/05/the-racist-
housing-policy-that-made-your-neighborhood/371439/)
and the federal housing project program created ghettos under the guise of
providing adorable housing for the poor. They just wanted to concentrate the
poor (read "black people") in certain areas.
~~~
monocasa
It's not really fair to blame this kind of stuff on progressives.
For instance, that Reason article calls "Barry Mahool" (actually J. Barry
Mahool), a progressive and doesn't really elaborate beyond that, letting the
reader assume that his progressivness extending to racial thought at the time.
Looking into it, he seems to be thought of a progressive because of his out
spoken support for women's suffrage, but as for black people he created the
zoning laws as "Blacks should be quarantined in isolated slums in order to
reduce the incidents of civil disturbance, to prevent the spread of
communicable disease into the nearby White neighborhoods, and to protect
property values among the White majority".
That's like calling Dick Cheney a progressive because of his out spoken
support for gay marriage.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Barry_Mahool](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Barry_Mahool)
[https://www.asu.edu/courses/aph294/total-
readings/silver%20-...](https://www.asu.edu/courses/aph294/total-
readings/silver%20--%20racialoriginsofzoning.pdf)
~~~
pitaj
The first progressives came out of the eugenics movement. They were all huge
racists. Woodrow Wilson, one of the first progressive presidents, was
responsible for segregating the military.
~~~
monocasa
Words change meaning over time. The progressive era of 1890 to 1920 is a
completely different movement than that of today.
~~~
pitaj
Ok? I never said it was the progressives of today.
~~~
monocasa
Without context that you're using a word with a century old archaic
definition, yes, the assumption is that the progressive movement of today has
racist roots.
~~~
pitaj
The progressive movement can't just isolate itself from the evil, bigoted
legacy it has.
Modern progressives support most of the same policies, but for supposedly
different reasons. They still see older progressives as heroes for
implementing those policies, despite their bigoted intentions at the time.
~~~
monocasa
They're two different progressive movements. One that died out around 1920,
and the current one today. Just because they use the same word, doesn't mean
it's the same movement.
------
gallerdude
Imagine we immediately changed to Japan’s system - do you think us Americans
would do a good job utilizing it?
I think the Japanese system is better, I just fear that part of the benefit
they have is cultural (harder to implement than laws).
~~~
TulliusCicero
Changing to it immediately would be impractical, but a steady transition would
be pretty easily feasible, outside of the political concerns.
It's not like dense, mixed-use areas don't exist in the US -- NYC being the
most obvious example. They're just uncommon because regulations force them to
be uncommon. Where they do exist they work fine.
~~~
emodendroket
I suggest you pick up a small-town paper talking about any proposed
development at all to get a sense of issues that exist beyond just whatever
old zoning laws are on the books. People have lots of reasons for not wanting
that to happen -- some, granted, are silly, but not all of them are.
~~~
rayiner
They’re all silly (often racist). In Annapolis, there is opposition to
redeveloping City Dock, which is old and gross, for “historical preservation.”
~~~
emodendroket
I don't know anything about Annapolis and won't weigh in on that one. But I do
understand why people don't want compressor stations or nuclear waste near
their homes, for instance.
~~~
TulliusCicero
Getting pretty sick of this strawman. Nobody's ever suggesting getting rid of
zoning rules that keep polluting factories and similar buildings away from
residential areas.
Like, this is very explicit in the article for this thread even, and somehow
it still comes up.
~~~
emodendroket
The compressor station thing is on the top of my mind because they want to
build one in my town. Anyway there is a wide gradient; a bar isn't quite as
undesirable as some of the industrial facilities, but it can still be
disruptive to someone who lives nearby.
~~~
TulliusCicero
A bar is a fair example, nuclear waste really isn't (we can't even
collectively agree to put it under actual fucking mountains in apocalypse-
proof vaults).
Anyway if you look in the article it talks about how you still exclude things
from residential areas based on level of nuisance. Presumably a compressor
station could qualify.
~~~
emodendroket
It kind of gets to the anxiety about handing over control though. Towns do not
get to decide whether they'll have a compressor station so a number have been
built over community objections. I'm not really a local-government fetishist
but I would be worried about how responsive a more centralized system would be
to resident complaints.
------
dghughes
As interesting as the article is why is it titled North America vs Japan? Not
USA vs Japan or North America vs Asia? There are 23 countries and almost two
dozen dependencies in North America.
------
knuththetruth
It would be great to have improved zoning, but switching to Japanese-style
zoning in the US doesn’t solve the problem of US housing being an investment
vehicle for Global Capital.
In Japan, land itself keeps its (high) value, but still mostly grows/tracks
with inflation. Houses themselves are seen as disposable with an approximately
30 year shelf-life.
~~~
Tiktaalik
Yeah exactly. People love to compare zoning systems, but that's just a tiny
slice of the picture. Among many, many other factors there is also the
cultural attitude toward housing which is different from NA.
------
api
This is something concrete we could push for to fix California's housing
crisis. Something like this at the state level would go a long way toward
making it easier to build efficiently so that supply can increase to match
demand.
------
jdhn
The biggest change I see from the NA model is that localities don't really
have the ability to make their own rules. Seems like this would require a very
strong movement at the state level to ever implement something like this.
~~~
slivym
There's literally no chance of that happening in the US for fundamentally
philosophical reasons. Politically the US has a very strong preference for
pushing decisions down to the lowest level they can, whereas European
countries and Japan take a much more pragmatic approach.
~~~
Spooky23
That's an inaccurate characterization.
The Federal government has a minimal direct impact on civil administration in
populated areas and always has. Land use, code enforcement, permitting, police
and similar functions are all state responsibilities that are delegated to
varying degrees to county or municipal government.
US States are also nominally sovereign. It's less philosophy and more legal.
------
claydavisss
This would be a disaster in the US. This surely victimizes some in Japan also
but because of cultural differences you just get more silent suffering.
Even if implemented, the new Federal Zoning Board would be obligated to honor
pre-existing zoning rules. If not, the party holding power in Washington at
the time would get demolished. What politician will risk telling an entire
state of voters that their assumptions about their property are going to be
unilaterally changed? No one, it would be political suicide.
Accurate or not, any politician proposing this would be accused of trying to
socialize housing.
~~~
emn13
I'd say it's the opposite: the US system is quite rigid and micromanages how
society builds. Limiting the power of government to regulate only broader,
more overlapping categories is quite the opposite of socialism in the US
sense; it's more like liberalism.
But mostly, comparing either to a political philosophy sounds far-fetched. But
hey, it's politics, so you may be right somebody will be accused of socialism,
however nonsensical that is.
~~~
dsfyu404ed
> US system is quite rigid and micromanages how society builds.
This varies a ton from city to city. My general perception is that the
cities/towns that tend to be more likely to praise European ways of doing
zoning/development are more rigid ones when it comes to zoning so it's much
harder to actually do mixed development in those places because of all the
boxes checked and signatures required to do it and comply with local
regulation. I find this contradiction somewhat comical.
~~~
scarejunba
There are no such American cities.
~~~
dsfyu404ed
I said "praise", not "successfully implement"
------
closeparen
We’re headed towards a new caste system in America: those who inherit houses /
tax concessions / rent control in productive places, and those who don’t. In
many ways this will be a rebalancing, as the middle-class from places on the
way down gets locked out of the labor force and the poor from places on the
way up find themselves with exclusive access to booming jobs markets. But I’d
anticipate some _serious_ civil unrest before the border controls around
wealth centers like the Bay Area are truly solidified.
~~~
TFortunato
br3aer1t
------
csomar
When I was a child and living my parents we had two properties: One small
apartment in the city, and a big house with a sizable garden (like 50-60
trees) far in the suburb. We live 5 day of the week in the apartment and spend
the weekend on the suburb.
I think it was the best setup. You get both of best world. During the week you
are close to work, school, services and need absolutely no transportation. In
the weekend you can barbecue.
Americans can have that luxury. I guess they just need to work harder to be
able to afford two properties?
------
paulgrimes1
“Category II Residential Zone: The permitted buildings include shops, offices,
and hotel buildings as well as buildings with karaoke box”
------
tawm
Are there any other examples of countries using a Japanese zoning system?
~~~
hrktb
I think France has a similar system of threshold. You have residential areas,
commercial areas, industrial areas and so on, with increasing permission to do
whatever you want.
That often means tall residential buildings will be near commercial areas,
huge residential complexes (often for social residence) near industrial area.
------
g8oz
The discourse within the planning profession has to change before this type of
innovative thinking can make any headway in N. America.
------
beebmam
Japanese real estate has been in a rut for decades. I don't think Japan is the
right country to compare the US to as a model to admire.
------
sgt
"greatly limits density" "strangles redevelopment" "keeps neighborhoods in
formaldehyde"
This article sounds somewhat socialist and left leaning and assumes that such
a "Japanese system" is what most families actually want.
If you have a house in a typical middle class neighborhood, practically
speaking you don't want neighborhood to densify too much. With higher density
comes a lot more people living in the same street as you, and with that comes
noise, more traffic and less personal space which can have negative
psychological impacts on some people.
It also comes back to the arguments for an against planning and development of
cities; just because there is an open area available, should we really develop
everything? I realize that we live in a world with a booming population, but
it doesn't mean that we should aim to fill every square meter on this planet
with people.
__Edited open space- >personal space. Sorry guys.
~~~
adrianN
Density doesn't mean that there are no open spaces left. On the contrary. If
you build denser you have more room to spare. I'd much rather have a couple of
large parks and urban forests like for example here in Berlin instead of a few
hundred square meters of yards and garages around each house that nobody but
the owners can use.
~~~
sgt
You are basically saying that people should be couped up in tiny little
shoeboxes, so that parks can be larger. I don't mind bigger parks, but it's
very nice to have a big yard and a garage too. With a city like approach in
the suburbs, you will have less personal space. I am not talking extreme here
- regular American properties in most middle class areas work just fine in my
opinion, and they are usually not overly large.
~~~
TulliusCicero
Nobody's talking about outlawing SFH's. You can still have a big yard if you
want it. But allowing smaller forms is good for a number of reasons:
supporting multi-modal transportation, environmental impact, and reducing
economic segregation among them.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Discovery of unpredicted stellar black hole in milky way galaxy - QueensGambit
https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2019-11/caos-cao112519.php
======
QueensGambit
Until now, scientists had estimated the mass of an individual stellar black
hole in our Galaxy at no more than 20 times that of the Sun. But, this stellar
black hole has a mass 70 times greater than the Sun. The monster black hole is
located 15 thousand light-years from Earth and has been named LB-1 by the
researchers.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
A discussion of scientific python and the business of open source - mikeckennedy
http://talkpython.fm/episodes/show/34/continuum-scientific-python-and-the-business-of-open-source
======
brudgers
The interviewee, Travis Oliphant, is primary developer of NumPy and a founding
contributor to SciPy.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Real-time metric counter using Soviet-era Nixie tubes - misterkgb
http://tellaparteng.tumblr.com/post/51805124205/in-the-nix-of-time
======
jacquesm
When I read these and see the general response I wonder how the average code-
jockey today would respond to the articles that were quite common in Elektor
and other 80's era electronics builders magazines.
This stuff is childs play in comparison to the kind of gear hobby electronics
types would churn out in those days and if the response is as strong as I
think it is this may mean that a new wave of home-brewers is about to launch.
~~~
zdw
I think the geek zeitgeist changes from decade to decade depending on what
cool new thing is out there. 50 years ago it was building Heathkit and being a
HAM radio enthusiast. 25 years ago, it was the PC/microcomputer. 15 years ago,
the web.
Now, we have a weird amalgamation of all the above, at price/performance
levels that would blow away anyone operating in those previous eras, and
enabled things like cheap 3D printing and software defined radio.
It's a heck of a nice time to make interesting hardware.
~~~
platz
to throw out a few watery ideas based on your comments - it seems to fit with
the 'retro' aesthetic; or at least the re-hashing of old ideas at a high
frequency. This reminds me very much of the idea of post-modernism. Perhaps
the downside is we loose some authenticity but make up for it in the wealth of
the combinations.
------
msarnoff
Damn, that looks costly. Each one of those tubes goes for at least $40-$60 on
eBay, and the socket/driver boards are another $5 each. I like the acrylic
base and standoffs--well done!
------
umsm
This story made me want a nixie watch:
<http://www.cathodecorner.com/nixiewatch/watchmovie.html>
------
terhechte
Boy, I want one of those. I just found Nixie clock building kits. I'm really
tempted to buy one as the primary clock for my office. That'd look fabulous.
------
teeja
_All told, there are over 500 solder points or connector crimps..._
Meh. The H-8 backplane alone took 500 solders.
------
kevingadd
Makes me want to build one as a divergence meter:
<http://steins-gate.wikia.com/wiki/Divergence_Meter>
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
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