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space clippers launched space clippers launched successfully when i first saw this i thought for a second that it was a headline from the star about the pliers found in the srb recently y know sometimes they have wire cutters built in tommy mac tom mcwilliams wk as the radius of vision increases tm ibm cl msu edu hm the circumference of mystery grows
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magellan update forwarded from doug griffith magellan project manager magellan status report april the magellan mission at venus continues normally gathering gravity data which provides measurement of density variations in the upper mantle which can be correlated to surface topography spacecraft performance is nominal magellan has completed orbits of venus and is now days from the end of cycle and the start of the transition experiment no significant activities are expected next week as preparations for aerobraking continue on schedule on monday morning april the moon will occult venus and interrupt the tracking of magellan for about minutes ron baalke baalke kelvin jpl nasa gov jet propulsion lab m s telos the aweto from new zealand pasadena ca is part caterpillar and part vegetable
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space class for teachers near chicago i am posting this for a friend without internet access please inquire to the phone number and address listed space teaching s newest frontier sponsored by the planetary studies foundation the planetary studies foundation is sponsoring a one week class for teachers called space teaching s newest frontier the class will be held at the sheraton suites in elk grove illinois from june through june participants who complete the program can earn two semester hours of graduate credit from aurora college please note that while the class is intended for teachers it is not restricted to teachers the class which is being cosponsored by the united states space foundation will teach how to use space exploration as a teaching tool to get students excited about learning and interested in science classroom topics to be covered by the class include living in space the space shuttle the space station nasa spinoffs that benefit society principles of astrodynamics aeronautics the solar system there will also be simulated zero g training in an underwater space station simulation model rocket launches observing sessions at the harper college observatory and field trips to the adler planetarium and the museum of science and industry featured speakers include jerry brown of the colorado based united states space foundation and debbie brown of the nasa lewis research center in cleveland ohio additional instructors will be provided by the planetary studies foundation the social highlight of the class will be a dinner banquet featuring space shuttle payload specialist byron lichtenberg currently president of payload systems inc lichtenberg was a member of the crew of sts which flew in november the banquet is scheduled for thursday june the registration fee includes transportation for field trips materials continental breakfasts lunches and the special dinner banquet guest tickets for the dinner banquet are also available there is an additional charge to receive the two hours of graduate credit for any additional information about the class contact the science learning center at or write to planetary studies foundation w algonquin rd palatine il dennis newkirk dennisn ecs comm mot com motorola land mobile products sector schaumburg il
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re soviet space book i have received my copies of cosmonautics and cosmonautics as well as soviet space and space station mir handbook from aerospace ambassadors with no problem i m getting ready to fax them some material in huntsville and i ll include a printout of your inquiry george hastings ghasting vdoe vak ed edu space science teacher compuserve com if it s not mathematics science center stareach bbs fun it s hartman street office probably not richmond va fax science
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re space on other nets we run spacenews views on our stareach bbs a local operation running wwiv software with the capability to link to over other bbs s in the u s a and canada through wwivnet having just started this a couple of months ago our sub us currently subscribed by only about ten other boards but more are being added we get our news articles re on internet via ftp from nasa sites and from a variety of aerospace related periodicals we get a fair amount of questions on space topics from students who access the system george hastings ghasting vdoe vak ed edu space science teacher compuserve com if it s not mathematics science center stareach bbs fun it s hartman street office probably not richmond va fax science
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in article zv b w w theporch raider net gene theporch raider net gene wright writes with the continuin talk about the end of the space age and complaints by government over the large cost why not try something i read about that might just work announce that a reward of billion would go to the first corporation who successfully keeps at least person alive on the moon for a year then you d see some of the inexpensive but not popular technologies begin to be developed there d be a different kind of space race then gene theporch raider net gene wright theporch raider net the macinteresteds of nashville if that were true i d go for it i have a few friends who we could pool our resources and do it maybe make it a prize kind of liek the solar car race in australia anybody game for a contest michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in article apr aio jsc nasa gov kjenks gothamcity jsc nasa gov writes gene wright gene theporch raider net wrote announce that a reward of billion would go to the first corporation who successfully keeps at least person alive on the moon for a year then you d see some of the inexpensive but not popular technologies begin to be developed there d be a different kind of space race then i m an advocate of this idea for funding space station work and i throw around the billion figure for that reward i suggest that you increase the lunar reward to about billion this would encourage private industry to invest in space which should be one of nasa s primary goals ken jenks nasa jsc gm space shuttle program office kjenks gothamcity jsc nasa gov better faster cheaper daniel s goldin nasa administrator also would maybe get the russians involved after all they do have the resources to do it in part but they need the capital and the goal i wonder if renting the russians resources would be a disqualification michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked
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re space debris there is this buy at nasa langley yes give me his name i would greatly appreciate it rich the earth is a cradle of the mind but we cannot live forever in a cradle k e tsiolkovski father of russian astronautics
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re conference on manned lunar exploration may crystal city prb access digex com pat writes aw st had a brief blurb on a manned lunar exploration confernce may th at crystal city virginia under the auspices of aiaa does anyone know more about this how much to attend anyone want to go pat i got something in the mail from aiaa about it cost is speakers include john pike hohn young and ian pryke
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re conference on manned lunar exploration may crystal city in article quule re access digex net prb access digex com pat writes aw st had a brief blurb on a manned lunar exploration confernce may th at crystal city virginia under the auspices of aiaa does anyone know more about this how much to attend anyone want to go pat here are some selected excerpts of the invitation registration form they sent me retyped without permission all typo s are mine low cost lunar access a one day conference to explore the means and benefits of a rejuvenated human lunar program friday may hyatt regency crystal city hotel arlington va about the conference the low cost lunar access conference will be a forum for the exchange of ideas on how to initiate and structure an affordable human lunar program inherent in such low cost programs is the principle that they be implemented rapidly and meet their objectives within a short time frame more deleted conference program preliminary in the washington room a m opening remarks dr alan m lovelace a m keynote address mr brian dailey a m u s policy outlook john pike american federation of scientists a discussion of the prospects for the introduction of a new low cost lunar initiative in view of the uncertain direction the space program is taking noon morning plenary sessions presentations on architectures systems and operational concepts emphasis will be on mission approaches that produce significant advancements beyond apollo yet are judged to be affordable in the present era of severely constrained budgets in the potomac room p m lunch guest speaker mr john w young nasa special assistant and former astronaut in the washington room p m international policy outlook ian pryke invited esa washington office the prevailing situation with respect to international space commitments with insights into preconditions for european entry into new agreements as would be required for a cooperative lunar program p m afternoon plenary sessions presentations on scientific objectives benefits and applications emphasis will be placed on the scientific and technological value of a lunar program and its timeliness there is a registration form and the fee is us the mail address is american institute of aeronautics and astronautics dept no washington dc and the fax no is or it says you can register on site during the aiaa annual meeting and on friday morning may from sounds interesting too bad i can t go steven davis daviss sweetpea jsc nasa gov o o db mcdonnell douglas i don t represent vv space systems company anybody but myself houston division
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space station radio commercial a brief political cultural item radio station wgms in washington is a classical music station with a large audience among high officials elected and otherwise imagine a radio station that advertises mercedes benzes diamond jewelry expensive resorts and truthfully trident submarines this morning i heard a commercial for the space station project didn t catch the advertiser guess they re pulling out all the stops chuck divine
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science news article on federal r d just a pointer to the article in the current science news article on federal r d funding very briefly all r d is being shifted to gaining current competitive advantage from things like military and other work that does not have as much commercial utility chuck divine
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in article apr aurora alaska edu nsmca aurora alaska edu writes in article zv b w w theporch raider net gene theporch raider net gene wright writes with the continuin talk about the end of the space age and complaints by government over the large cost why not try something i read about that might just work announce that a reward of billion would go to the first corporation who successfully keeps at least person alive on the moon for a year then you d see some of the inexpensive but not popular technologies begin to be developed there d be a different kind of space race then gene theporch raider net gene wright theporch raider net the macinteresteds of nashville if that were true i d go for it i have a few friends who we could pool our resources and do it maybe make it a prize kind of liek the solar car race in australia anybody game for a contest michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked oh gee a billion dollars that d be just about enough to cover the cost of the feasability study happy happy joy joy peter f schaefer
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last call s w wizard position at tandem cupertino ca well we got some responses and are doing some interviews with interesting responders however just in case the other posting was overlooked by an incredibly talented person mea culpa for posting this here for mike but we re looking for someone special tandem computers is currently looking for a software wizard to help us architect implement a fault tolerant generalized instrumentation subsystem as part of our proprietary operating system kernel tns kernel the tns kernel is a proprietary loosely coupled parallel message based operating system the tns kernel has wide connectivity to open standards in this key individual contributor role you will work with other developers working on various components of the transaction management facility your background needs to encompass some of the following categories of would be excellent category math working knowledge of statistics real analysis as used in experimental physics or chemistry or in engineering category working knowledge of telemetry issues i e time series autocorrelation and statistical correlation of data streams category integration test instrumentation of systems under test i e payloads flight modules etc category software engineering programming skills algorithms and systems software techniques please send your resume to mike fleice tandem computers ridgeview ct loc cupertino ca fax or e mail fleice mike tandem com
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re conference on manned lunar exploration may crystal city in article apr aio jsc nasa gov daviss sweetpea jsc nasa gov s f davis writes in article quule re access digex net prb access digex com pat writes aw st had a brief blurb on a manned lunar exploration confernce may th at crystal city virginia under the auspices of aiaa does anyone know more about this how much to attend here are some selected excerpts of the invitation registration form they sent me retyped without permission all typo s are mine thanks for typing that in steven sounds like a fall back and regroup strategy session i wanted to add that my copy of the brochure arrived with a flattering cover letter invitations are being extended to those who have demonstrated a strong committment to space program development and have been influential in its advancement we sincerely hope you will be able to attend wow i wonder which of my contributions to the conquest of space convinced them to send me this letter i hope you decide to go pat the net can use some eyes and ears there bill higgins if we can put a man on the moon why can t fermilab we put a man on the moon bill engfer higgins fnal fnal gov if we can put a man on the moon why can t higgins fnal bitnet we put a woman on the moon bill higgins
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re science news article on federal r d in article c r dk skates gsfc nasa gov xrcjd resolve gsfc nasa gov charles j divine writes just a pointer to the article in the current science news article on federal r d funding very briefly all r d is being shifted to gaining current competitive advantage from things like military and other work that does not have as much commercial utility chuck divine gulp disclaimer this opinion is mine and does not represent the views of fermilab universities research association the department of energy or the th ward regular science fiction organization o zap bill higgins fermi national accelerator laboratory bitnet higgins fnal bitnet internet higgins fnal fnal gov span hepnet higgins
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re space debris keesler loftus potter stansbery kubriek i gues it is keesler the others do not ring the bell but they might be involved as well sometime ago keesler was here at langley teaching a course on space debris and if my memory does not fai l i think there was even a reference to a book on the subject c o egalon larc nasa gov claudio oliveira egalon
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re cold gas tanks for sounding rockets in article eagle ukc ac uk rdl ukc ac uk r d lorenz writes does anyone know how to size cold gas roll control thruster tanks for sounding rockets well first you work out how much cold gas you need then make the tanks big enough our sounding rocket payload with telemetry guidance etc etc and a telescope cluster weighs around pounds it uses freon jets for steering and a pulse width modulated controller for alignment ie during our eight minutes in space the jets are pretty much continuously firing on a duty cycle or so the jets also need to kill residual angular momentum from the spin stabilization and flip the payload around to look at the sun we have two freon tanks each holding liters of freon i m speaking only from memory of the last flight the ground crew at wsmr choose how much freon to use based on some black magic algorithm they have extra tank modules that just bolt into the payload stack this should give you an idea of the order of magnitude for cold gas quantity if you really need to know send me email and i ll try to get you in touch with our ground crew people cheers craig don t drink soap dilute dilute ok
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stereo pix of planets can anyone tell me where i might find stereo images of planetary and planetary satellite surfaces gifs preferred but any will do i m especially interested in stereos of the surfaces of phobos deimos mars and the moon in that order thanks
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in article zv b w w theporch raider net gene theporch raider net gene wright writes announce that a reward of billion would go to the first corporation who successfully keeps at least person alive on the moon for a year and with b on offer the problem of keeping them alive is highly likely to involve more than just the lunar environment oh dear my freighter just landed on the roof of acme s base and they all died how sad gosh that leaves us as the oldest residents quick boss the slime from yoyodyne are back and this time they ve got a tank man the guns one could imagine all sorts of technologies being developed in that sort of environment greg i m kidding btw although the problem of winner takes all prizes is that it encourages all sorts of undesirable behaviour witness military procurement programs and b is probably far too small a reward to encourage what would be a very expensive and high risk proposition gregory bond gnb bby com au burdett buckeridge young ltd melbourne australia knox s is slick fox in sox on knox s box knox s box is very quick plays lots of lsl he s sick apologies to john iron bar mackin
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re conference on manned lunar exploration may crystal city prb access digex com pat writes aw st had a brief blurb on a manned lunar exploration confernce may th at crystal city virginia under the auspices of aiaa does anyone know more about this how much to attend a good summary has been posted thanks but i wanted to add another comment i remeber reading the comment that general dynamics was tied into this in connection with their proposal for an early manned landing sorry i don t rember where i heard this but i m fairly sure it was somewhere reputable anyone else know anything on this angle hrumph they didn t send me anything josh hopkins jbh uxa cso uiuc edu find a way or make one attributed to hannibal
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re biosphere ii in article almaden ibm com nicho vnet ibm com writes in q ku av access digex net pat writes the work is privately funded the data belongs to sbv i don t see either george or fred scoriating ibm research division for not releasing data we publish plenty kiddo you just have to look never said you didn t publish merely that there is data you don t publish and that no one scoriates you for those cases ibm research publishes plenty it s why you ended up with nobel prizes in the last years but that some projects are deemed company confidential att bell labs keeps lots of stuff private like karamankars algorithm private moeny is entitled to do what it pleases within the bounds of law and for all the keepers of the temple of science should please shove their pointy little heads up their conically shaped posterior orifices pat who just read the sa article on karl fehrabend sp
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help i need some addresses hi all i m trying to get mailing addresses for the following companies specifically i need addresses for their personnel offices or like bureau the companies are amroc orbital sciences corp sp spacehab inc i know this one is somewhere in seattle wa or at least part of it is space industries inc somewhere in houston space enterprises inc if anybody could point me in the right direction on this i would be most appreciative i prefer an email response but i will post a summary if sufficient interest exists thanks mitch jmcocker eos ncsu edu
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in article apr bby com au gnb leo bby com au gregory n bond writes in article zv b w w theporch raider net gene theporch raider net gene wright writes announce that a reward of billion would go to the first corporation who successfully keeps at least person alive on the moon for a year and with b on offer the problem of keeping them alive is highly likely to involve more than just the lunar environment oh dear my freighter just landed on the roof of acme s base and they all died how sad gosh that leaves us as the oldest residents quick boss the slime from yoyodyne are back and this time they ve got a tank man the guns one could imagine all sorts of technologies being developed in that sort of environment greg i m kidding btw although the problem of winner takes all prizes is that it encourages all sorts of undesirable behaviour witness military procurement programs and b is probably far too small a reward to encourage what would be a very expensive and high risk proposition gregory bond gnb bby com au burdett buckeridge young ltd melbourne australia hey my dad has an old hangar and judy has some old rockets in her attic let s put on a lunar program sounds good but let s play a game what would be a reasonable reward what companies would have a reasonable shot at pulling off such a feat just where in the budget would the reward come from should there be a time limit would a straight cash money award be enough or should we throw in say exclusive mining rights for the first fifty years you get the idea i d like to play but i don t have a clue to the answers tom freebairn he who refuses to understand math will probably never get his checkbook figured out
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double sonic booms every time you read about a shuttle landing they mention the double sonic booms having taken various relevant classes i have several ideas of where they come from but none of them are very convincing exactly what causes them are they a one time pheneomenon or a constant one like the supersonic shockwave that is constantly produced by a plane but you hear only when it goes over you carlos g niederstrasser only two things are infinite princeton planetary society the universe and human stupidity and i m not sure about the former einstein carlosn phoenix princeton edu space phoenix princeton edu ad astra per ardua nostra
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re magellan update in apr kelvin jpl nasa gov baalke kelvin jpl nasa gov ron baalke writes forwarded from doug griffith magellan project manager magellan status report april magellan has completed orbits of venus and is now days from the end of cycle and the start of the transition experiment sorry i think i missed a bit of info on this transition experiment what is it on monday morning april the moon will occult venus and interrupt the tracking of magellan for about minutes will this mean a loss of data or will the magellan transmit data later on btw when will nasa cut off the connection with magellan not that i am looking forward to that day but i am just curious i believe it had something to do with the funding from the goverment or rather no funding ok that s it for now see you guys around jurriaan jhwitten cs ruu nl jurriaan wittenberg department of computerscience utrecht the netherlands
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looking for a little research help hi i m writing a science fiction script and i m looking for some answers to questions regarding the moon and earth my starting point is an impossible situation i checked with a professor at berkeley and his response was a very helpful can t happen if you enjoy playing with unusual ideas and are willing answer some questions please contact me via e mail jennise dgi com i get extremely annoyed when screen and tele plays ignore basic facts about computers that i m determined to be as scientifically accurate as i can sorry for being vague but i d like to protect my idea as much as i can until i m ready to sell it hopefully jennise
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looking for a little research help addendum sorry but i forgot this ps right now my sight is getting news about two weeks behind so it s kind of necessary to me that any responses be sent to me directly thanks a lot jennise jennise dgi com
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ariane v mission data arianespace flight flight v was originally intended to carry the hughes hs series galaxy iv satellite but the payload was withdrawn just prior to flight the th ariane launch is now scheduled to place the astra c and arsene satellites into an improved geostationary transfer orbit gto with inclination reduced to degrees and apogee altitude increased by km this will be the th launch of an ariane and the first in the l configuration with liquid strap on boosters pal it will be launched from the newly refurbished ariane launch complex ela in kourou french guiana the launch vehicle performance requirement for this mission is kg of which kg represents the satellite mass the total vehicle mass at liftoff is kg required orbit characteristics perigee altitude km apogee altitude km at injection inclination degrees the ariane l lift off for flight is scheduled on thursday april as soon as possible within the following launch window kourou time gmt washington dc launch vehicle ariane l this is a three stage liquid fueled launcher with two liquid fueled strap on boosters the first stage l is built by aerospatiale and is powered by liquid fueled viking v engines the second stage l is built by mbb erno and is powered by a single viking iv engine both the viking iv and v engines are manufactured by sep the first and second stages use a biliquid uh n o fuel the third stage h is built by aerospatiale and is powered by a cryogenic h o fueled hm b engine built by sep the two strap on boosters pal are each powered by a viking vi engine also built by sep which use the same biliquid fuel as the first and second stages the fully assembled launch vehicle stands meters high on the pad it uses the type ariane short payload fairing flight profile liquid strap on booster jettison first stage separation second stage ignition fairing jettison second stage separation third stage ignition third stage shutdown orbit injection astra c separation cyclade adapter separation arsene separation end of ariane mission payloads astra c is the third spacecraft in the fleet of societe europeenne des satellites to broadcast direct tv to homes all over europe built by hughes it will be the second hs launched by ariane total mass at lift off kg mass at geo insertion kg dry mass kg on board power w end of life nominal lifetime years span of solar panels m on orbit position degrees east over africa transmission capacity channels in ku band via transponders in flight operations solar array deployment about days after lift off first of apogee motor firings about hours after lift off at th apogee arsene is the first spacecraft built by the european space industry for the benefit of the world amateur radio community total mass at lift off kg mass at geo insertion kg dry mass kg on board power w end of life nominal lifetime years spacecraft dimensions m x m orbital parameters km inclination period transmission capacity s band transponder at ghz vhf uhf mhz launch coverage all ariane missions are broadcast live via satellite from kourou coverage begins at minutes before launch and continues until all payloads have been deployed this mission will likely be carried in the us on galaxy however it could be galaxy or another satellite what is the european satellite normally used for ariane coverage dean adams
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re stereo pix of planets y in article apr csus edu arthurc sfsuvax sfsu edu arthur chandler writes can anyone tell me where i might find stereo images of planetary and planetary satellite surfaces gifs preferred but any will do i m especially interested in stereos of the surfaces of phobos deimos mars and the moon in that order thanks ames arc nasa gov not sure what subdirectory thou michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked ps i know it has a gif area as well as space and other info
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in apr indyvax iupui edu tffreeba indyvax iupui edu writes let s play a game what would be a reasonable reward what companies would have a reasonable shot at pulling off such a feat just where in the budget would the reward come from should there be a time limit would a straight cash money award be enough or should we throw in say exclusive mining rights for the first fifty years you get the idea a cash award is ok a time limit would be nice you can t give away mining rights assuming there s anything to mine because you don t own them sig files are like strings every yo yo s got one greg nicholls nicho vnet ibm com business or nicho olympus demon co uk private
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in article qve kinnpas sal sun usc edu schaefer sal sun usc edu peter schaefer writes announce that a reward of billion would go to the first corporation who successfully keeps at least person alive on the moon for a year oh gee a billion dollars that d be just about enough to cover the cost of the feasability study happy happy joy joy depends if you assume the existance of a working ssto like dc on billion would be enough to put about a quarter million pounds of stuff on the moon if some of that mass went to send equipment to make lox for the transfer vehicle you could send a lot more either way its a lot more than needed this prize isn t big enough to warrent developing a ssto but it is enough to do it if the vehicle exists allen lady astor sir if you were my husband i would poison your coffee w churchill madam if you were my wife i would drink it days to first flight of dcx
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moon colony prize race billion total i think if there is to be a prize and such there should be classes such as the following large corp small corp company based on reported earnings large government gnp and such small governemtn or political clout or gnp large organization planetary society and such small organization alot of small orgs the organization things would probably have to be non profit or liek of course this means the prize might go up larger get more or basically make the prize total purse billion divided amngst the class winners more fair there would have to be a seperate organization set up to monitor the events umpire and such and watch for safety violations or maybe not if peopel want to risk thier own lives let them do it any other ideas michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked
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re how to read sci space without netnews in article c ljg n cs cmu edu mwm cs cmu edu mark maimone writes in article f permanet org mark prado p f n z permanet org mark prado writes if anyone knows anyone else who would like to get sci space but doesn t have an internet feed or has a cryptic internet feed i would be willing to feed it to them kudos to mark for his generous offer but there already exists a large email based forwarding system for sci space posts space digest it mirrors sci space exactly and provides simple two way communication i think mark was talking about making it available to people who didn t have email in the first place if anybody in the boston area wants a sci space feed by honest to gosh uucp no weird offline malreaders let me know i ll also hand out logins to anyone who wants one especially the boston chapter of nss which i keep forgetting to re attend questions comments to space request isu isunet edu mark maimone phone carnegie mellon computer science email mwm cmu edu richard nickle rick trystro uucp v v bis think trystro rick somerville massachusetts
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re what if the ussr had reached the moon first in article apr ke zv uucp gary ke zv uucp gary coffman says in article saundrsg qucdn queensu ca graydon saundrsg qucdn queensu ca writes this is turning into what s a moonbase good for and i ought not to post when i ve a hundred some odd posts to go but i would think that the real reason to have a moon base is economic since someone with space industry will presumeably have a much larger gnp than they would without space industry eventually they will simply be able to afford more stuff if i read you right you re saying in essence that with a larger economy nations will have more discretionary funds to waste on a lunar facility that was certainly partially the case with apollo but real lunar colonies will probably require a continuing military scientific or commercial reason for being rather than just a we have the money why not approach i was assuming that there won t be a moon base unless it makes a profit actually if it does well that gives a larger gnp which leads to being able to spend more money on your military including gosh wow space stuff assuming it s profitable rather than paying for itself it s conceivable that luna will have a military purpose it s possible that luna will have a commercial purpose but it s most likely that luna will only have a scientific purpose for the next several hundred years at least therefore lunar bases should be predicated on funding levels little different from those found for antarctic bases can you put a person base on the moon for million a year even if you use grad students you might be able to run one for that put it there hardly why do you think at least a couple centuries before there will be significant commerical activity on the moon graydon
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re dc x update in article schumach convex convex com schumach convex com richard a schumacher writes would the sub orbital version be suitable as is or as will be for use as a reuseable sounding rocket dc x as is today isn t suitable for this however the followon sdio funds will a reusable sounding rocket was always sdio s goal thank ghod i had thought that spacelifter would definitely be the bastard son of nls so did i there is a lot going on now and some reports are due soon which should be very favorable the insiders have been very bush briefing the right people and it is now paying off however public support is still critical in politics you need to keep constant pressure on elected officials allen lady astor sir if you were my husband i would poison your coffee w churchill madam if you were my wife i would drink it days to first flight of dcx
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re dc x update in article ugo b w w angus mi org dragon angus mi org writes exactly when will the hover test be done early to mid june and will any of the tv networks carry it i really want to see that if they think the public wants to see it they will carry it why not write them and ask you can reach them at f national news media abc world news tonight face the nation west th street cbs news new york ny m street nw washington dc associated press good morning america rockefeller plaza abc news new york ny broadway national desk new york ny foreign desk washington bureau larry king live tv cbs evening news cnn w th street massachusetts avenue nw new york ny washington dc cbs this morning larry king show radio w th street mutual broadcasting new york ny so jefferson davis highway arlington va christian science monitor csm publishing society los angeles times one norway street times mirror square boston ma los angeles ca cnn macneil lehrer newshour one cnn center p o box box washington dc atlanta ga macneil lehrer newshour cnn wnet tv washington bureau w th street massachusetts avenue nw new york ny washington dc crossfire nbc news cnn nebraska avenue nw massachusetts avenue nw washington dc washington dc fax morning edition all things considered national public radio m street nw washington dc united press international eye street nw washington dc new york times u s news world report w rd street n street nw new york ny washington dc new york times usa today washington bureau wilson boulevard eye street nw th floor arlington va washington dc newsweek wall street journal madison avenue liberty street new york ny new york ny nightline washington post abc news th street nw w th street washington dc new york ny nightline washington week in review ted koppel weta tv abc news p o box desales nw washington dc washington dc this week with david brinkley abc news desales nw washington dc time magazine time warner inc time life building rockefeller center new york ny lady astor sir if you were my husband i would poison your coffee w churchill madam if you were my wife i would drink it days to first flight of dcx
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jemison on star trek i saw in the newspaper last night that dr mae jemison the first black woman in space she s a physician and chemical engineer who flew on endeavour last year will appear as a transporter operator on the star trek the next generation episode that airs the week of may it s hardly space science i know but it s interesting doug loss
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re russian email contacts it is usually possible to reach people at iki institute for space research in moscow by writing to ikimail esoc bitnet this is a machine at esa in darmstadt germany iki has a dedicated phone line to this machine and someone there logs in regularly to retrieve mail in addition there are several user accounts belonging to russian scientific institutions on user sovam com which is a commercial enterprise based in san francisco that provides email services to the former ussr for example fian sovam com is the physics institute of the academy of sciences initials transliterated from russian of course these connections cost the russians real dollars even for received messages so please don t send anything voluminous or frivilous larry r d addario national radio astronomy observatory addresses internet ldaddari nrao edu fax charlottesville green bank mail ivy road charlottesville va usa phone office home cho off lab apt gb
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message from space digest joint press release esa un no paris april un esa joint training course on satellite applications to be held in italy april the united nations and the european space agency esa are jointly organising a training course on the applications of satellite data gathered by the european remote sensing satellite ers to be held in frascati italy from to april the training course will discuss the applications of satellite data concerning natural resources renewable energy and the environment the training course organised for the benefit of francophone african experts will be hosted by esrin the european space agency s establishment in frascati which is responsible for coordination with the users of data from esa s remote sensing satellite twenty four experts in the field of remote sensing selected from francophone countries from northern western and central africa and three regional african centres will attend the two week session the course will focus on remote sensing techniques and data applications particularly ers data the ers satellite developed by esa and launched in with the european ariane launcher carries an advanced radar instrument and is the first in a series of radar remote sensing missions that will ensure availability of data beyond the year the aim of the training course is to increase the potential of experts using the practical applications of radar remote sensing systems to natural resources renewable energy and the environment with particular emphasis on applications to geology and mineral prospecting oceanography and near coastal areas agriculture forestry and meteorology the education and practical training programme was developed jointly by the united nations and esa the facilities and the technical support as well as lecturers and information documents for the training course will be provided by the agency lecturers at the training course will include high level experts from other european and african organisations active in remote sensing applications funds for the training course are being provided by the united nations trust fund for new and renewable sources of energy the primary contributor to that fund is the government of italy a similar training course is being planned for latin american experts
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re magellan update in article apr cs ruu nl jhwitten cs ruu nl jurriaan wittenberg writes in apr kelvin jpl nasa gov baalke kelvin jpl nasa gov ron baalke writes on monday morning april the moon will occult venus and interrupt the tracking of magellan for about minutes will this mean a loss of data or will the magellan transmit data later on the gravity data is collected in real time and it not recorded to the tape recorder however you only need to collect the gravity every rd or th orbit so there is no real data loss if the moon blocks transmission for a short while btw when will nasa cut off the connection with magellan not that i am looking forward to that day but i am just curious i believe it had something to do with the funding from the goverment or rather no funding the aerobraking starts may and is expected last about days if the funding is provided million dollars to extend the mission for the high resolution gravity data then the mission will last through october otherwise the mission will end this coming july ron baalke baalke kelvin jpl nasa gov jet propulsion lab m s telos the aweto from new zealand pasadena ca is part caterpillar and part vegetable
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re conference on manned lunar exploration may crystal city in article c rhoc fty news cso uiuc edu jbh uxa cso uiuc edu josh hopkins writes i remeber reading the comment that general dynamics was tied into this in connection with their proposal for an early manned landing sorry i don t rember where i heard this but i m fairly sure it was somewhere reputable anyone else know anything on this angle the general chairman is paul bialla who is some official of general dynamics the emphasis seems to be on a scaled down fast plan to put people on the moon in an impoverished spaceflight funding climate you d think it would be a golden opportunity to do lots of precusor work for modest money using an agressive series of robot spacecraft but there s not a hint of this in the brochure hrumph they didn t send me anything you re not hanging out with the right people apparently bill higgins beam jockey i m gonna keep on writing songs fermilab until i write the song bitnet higgins fnal bitnet that makes the guys in detroit internet higgins fnal fnal gov who draw the cars span hepnet higgins put tailfins on em again john prine
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re how many read sci space in article qkmkiinnep mojo eng umd edu sysmgr king eng umd edu doug mohney writes in article apr mksol dseg ti com pyron skndiv dseg ti com dillon pyron writes there are actually only two of us i do henry fred tommy and mary oh yeah this isn t my real name i m a bald headed space baby damn so it was you who was drinking beer with robert mcelwane in the parking lot of the k mart software engineering that s like military intelligence isn t it sysmgr cadlab eng umd edu they just tore down the kmart near my house putting in a new suptermarket i heard that there is a beer drinking ghost who still haunts the place tom i liked this one i read a while ago data sheet hsn nuclear event detector the ned senses the gamma radiation pulse from a nuclear weapon as if we wouldn t notice
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re solar sail data in article apr news duc auburn edu snydefj eng auburn edu writes i am looking for any information concerning projects involving solar sails i was at an interesting seminar at work uk s r a l space science dept on this subject specifically on a small scale solar sail proposed as a student space project the guy giving the talk was keen to generate interest in the project i ll typein the handout he gave out at the meeting here goes the microlight solar sail introduction the solar sail is a well established concept harnessing the pressure of sunlight a spacecraft would have unlimited range in principle such a vehicle could explore the whole solar system with zero fuel consumption however it is more difficult to design a practical solar sail than most people realize the pressure of sunlight is only about one kilogram per square kilometer deploying and controlling the large area of aluminized fabric which would be necessary to transport a conventional type spacecraft is a daunting task this is why despite the potential of hte idea no such craft has actually been launched to date design recent advances in microelectronics make possible a different concept a tiny sail just a few metres in diameter which could be controlled purely be electronics with no mechanical parts several attitude control methods are feasible for example the pressure sunlight exerts on a panel of solar cells varies according to whether power is being drawn the key components of the craft will be a minute ccd camera developed at edinburgh university which can act as both attitude sensor and data gathering device solar cells providing watt power for control and communication and a directional radio antenna etched onto the surface of the sail itself launched as a piggyback payload the total cost of the mission can be limited to a few tens of thousands of dollars missions the craft would be capable of some ambitious missions for example a it could rendezvous with a nearby asteroid from the apollo or amor groups closeup pictures could be transmitted back to earth at a low bit rate b it could be steered into a lunar polar orbit previously unobserved areas around the lunar poles could be viewed by angling the sail to reflect sunlight downwards polar craters whose bases never receive sunlight could be imaged bright reflections would confirm that volatiles such as water ice have become trapped in these locations immensely valuable information for setting up a manned lunar base btw c it could be sent to rendezvous with a small asteroid or comet nucleus impacting at low speed a thin wire probe attached to the craft causes it to rebound while capturing a tiny sample is a sharp edged tube like performing a biopsy returning to earth the sail acts as an ideal re entry parachute load per unit area gm m ensures that heat is reradiated so efectively that the sail temperature cannot exceed deg c the material sample is recovered enclosed in a small insulating container contact colin jack tel oxford mathematical designs high street oxford ox dh england this guy would love to hear from anyone interested in this project or seeking details or anything and would be most happy to send you more information andy andy jonathan j broderick i have come that they might have rutherford lab uk life and have it to the full mail ajjb adam bnsc rl ac uk jesus christ
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in article apr iti org aws iti org allen w sherzer writes this prize isn t big enough to warrent developing a ssto but it is enough to do it if the vehicle exists actually there are people who will tell you that it would be enough to do ssto development if done privately as a cut rate operation of course they may be over optimistic you can also assume that a working ssto would have other applications that would help pay for its development costs i d be inclined to make the prize somewhat larger but g might be enough all work is one man s work henry spencer u of toronto zoology kipling henry zoo toronto edu utzoo henry
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space activities in tucson az i would like to find out about space engineering employment and educational opportunities in the tucson arizona area e mail responses appreciated my mail feed is intermittent so please try one or all of these addresses ben muniz w munizb rwtms decnet beach rockwell com or bmuniz a tms remnet ab com munizb rwtms decnet consrt rockwell com
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re what if the ussr had reached the moon first in article saundrsg qucdn queensu ca graydon saundrsg qucdn queensu ca writes in article apr ke zv uucp gary ke zv uucp gary coffman says it s conceivable that luna will have a military purpose it s possible that luna will have a commercial purpose but it s most likely that luna will only have a scientific purpose for the next several hundred years at least therefore lunar bases should be predicated on funding levels little different from those found for antarctic bases can you put a person base on the moon for million a year even if you use grad students you might be able to run one for that put it there hardly why do you think at least a couple centuries before there will be significant commerical activity on the moon wishful thinking mostly it s more likely that the moon will never be the site of major commercial activity as far as we know it has no materials we can t get cheaper right here on earth or from asteroids and comets aside from the semi mythic he that might be useful in low grade fusion reactors exploring it would satisfy a curiosity itch and it s position in the gravity well of earth coupled with it s heat sink capacity could offer some military utility for high ground military weapons systems but it holds very minute commercial value if space travel becomes cheap enough it might become a tourist attraction as mt everest and the antarctic have become but that s a very minor activity in the global scope of things luna has an inconvienent gravity field it s likely too low to prevent calcium loss muscle atrophy and long term genetic drift yet it s too high to do micro g manufacturing space based colonies and factories that can be spun to any convienent value of g look much better luna has a modest vacuum and raw solar exposure two weeks a month but orbital sites can have better vacuums and continous solar exposure luna offers a source of light element rocks that can serve as raw materials heatsink and shielding the asteroids and comets offer sources of both light and heavy elements and volatile compounds and many are in less steep gravity wells so that less delta v is required to reach them we don t use rds of the earth now the seafloors and we virtually ignore antarctica a whole continent that s because we don t have to deal with those conditions in order to make a buck luna is a much more expensive place to visit or to live and work i think we ll use the easier places first that pushes lunar development back at least a few centuries if not much longer luna s main short term value would be as a place for a farside radio astronomy observatory shielded from the noisy earth or as the site of a laser particle beam or linear accelerator weapons system for defending earth or bombarding it as the case may be the first is unlikely because of the high cost for such a basic science instrument the second is just as unlikely because conventional nukes are good enough and the military would really rather see the earth safe for conventional warfare again there s little glory in watching from a bunker as machines fight each other over continental ranges little ultimate profit either gary gary coffman ke zv you make it gatech wa mei ke zv gary destructive testing systems we break it uunet rsiatl ke zv gary shannon way guaranteed emory kd nc ke zv gary lawrenceville ga
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re what if the ussr had reached the moon first in article c qiv h o cs cmu edu nickh cs cmu edu nick haines writes in article apr ke zv uucp gary ke zv uucp gary coffman writes if i read you right you re saying in essence that with a larger economy nations will have more discretionary funds to waste on a lunar facility that was certainly partially the case with apollo but real lunar colonies will probably require a continuing military scientific or commercial reason for being rather than just a we have the money why not approach ah but the whole point is that money spent on a lunar base is not wasted on the moon it s not like they d be using r bills to fuel their moon dozers the money to fund a lunar base would be spent in the country to which the base belonged it s a way of funding high tech research just like darpa was a good excuse to fund various fields of research under the pretense that it was crucial to the defense of the country or like esprit is a good excuse for the ec to fund research under the pretense that it s good for pan european cooperation now maybe you think that government funded research is a waste of money in fact i m pretty sure you do but it does count as investment spending which does boost the economy and just look at the size of that multiplier actually i favor government funded research it is a pump prime for a lot of basic technologies i also understand the short term value of high tech welfare programs but they can t substitute for long range wealth generation via commercial enterprise that s what s needed to maintain a healthy economy anywhere on earth or luna i don t see that long term potential on luna due to a bunch of factors i outline in another post gary gary coffman ke zv you make it gatech wa mei ke zv gary destructive testing systems we break it uunet rsiatl ke zv gary shannon way guaranteed emory kd nc ke zv gary lawrenceville ga
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first spacewalk at one time there was speculation that the first spacewalk alexei leonov was a staged fake has any evidence to support or contradict this claim emerged was this claim perhaps another fevered cold war hallucination fred baube tm in times of intellectual ferment baube optiplan fi advantage to him with the intellect include disclaimer h most fermented how is frank zappa doing may paris it s retrospective time
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moonbase race from gene wright gene theporch raider net with the continuin talk about the end of the space age and complaints by government over the large cost why not try something i read about that might just work announce that a reward of billion would go to the first corporation who successfully keeps at least person alive on the moon for a year then you d see some of the inexpensive but not popular technologies begin to be developed there d be a different kind of space race then i ll say imagine that there were a couple groups up there maybe landing a few weeks apart the year mark starts coming on for the first group isn t a billion pretty good incentive to take a shot at a potential winner yeah that s a shame that team a s life support gave out so close to the deadline thanks for the billion on the other hand if apollo cost billion for a few days or weeks in space in dollars then won t the reward have to be a lot more than only billion to get any takers tommy mac tom mcwilliams wk as the radius of vision increases tm ibm cl msu edu hm the circumference of mystery grows
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level nick haines sez given that i ve heard the shuttle software rated as level in maturity i strongly doubt that this having lots of bugs is the case level out of how many what are the different levels i ve never heard of this rating system anyone care to clue me in tommy mac tom mcwilliams wk as the radius of vision increases tm ibm cl msu edu hm the circumference of mystery grows
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re orion drive in vacuum how in article c qvjc b b zoo toronto edu henry zoo toronto edu henry spencer writes the national air space museum has both the prototype and the film however quite possibly it s no longer on display nasm like most museums has much more stuff than it can display at once and does rotate the displays occasionally the nasm photo archives are open to the public all or almost all still pictures in the collection are available for viewing but i don t know about films at least it might be worth a try i m not sure if appointments are necessary but i think not good luck and let us know what you find steve willner phone bitnet willner cfa cambridge ma usa internet willner cfa harvard edu member league for programming freedom contact lpf uunet uu net
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re moon colony prize race billion total in article apr aurora alaska edu nsmca aurora alaska edu writes i think if there is to be a prize and such there should be classes such as the following large corp small corp company based on reported earnings large government gnp and such small governemtn or political clout or gnp large organization planetary society and such small organization alot of small orgs whatabout schools universities rich individuals around people in the uk have more than million dollars each i reecieved mail from people who claimed they might get a person into space for per pound send a skinny person into space and split the rest of the money among the ground crew the organization things would probably have to be non profit or liek of course this means the prize might go up larger get more or basically make the prize total purse billion divided amngst the class winners more fair there would have to be a seperate organization set up to monitor the events umpire and such and watch for safety violations or maybe not if peopel want to risk thier own lives let them do it agreed i volunteer for any uk attempts but one clause no launch methods which are clearly dangerous to the environment ours or someone else s no usage of materials from areas of planetary importance any other ideas yes we should do this rather than talk about it lobby people the major problem with the space programmes is all talk paperwork and no action michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked marvin batty djf uk ac cov cck and they shall not find those things with a sort of rafia like base that their fathers put there just the night before at about o clock
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re conference on manned lunar exploration may crystal city higgins fnalf fnal gov bill higgins beam jockey writes josh hopkins writes i remeber reading the comment that general dynamics was tied into this in connection with their proposal for an early manned landing the general chairman is paul bialla who is some official of general dynamics the emphasis seems to be on a scaled down fast plan to put people on the moon in an impoverished spaceflight funding climate you d think it would be a golden opportunity to do lots of precusor work for modest money using an agressive series of robot spacecraft but there s not a hint of this in the brochure it may be that they just didn t mention it or that they actually haven t thought about it i got the vague impression from their mission proposal that they weren t taking a very holistic aproach to the whole thing they seemed to want to land people on the moon by the end of the decade without explaining why or what they would do once they got there the only application i remember from the av week article was placing a telescope on the moon that s great but they don t explain why it can t be done robotically hrumph they didn t send me anything you re not hanging out with the right people apparently but i m a member besides bill i hang out with you josh hopkins jbh uxa cso uiuc edu find a way or make one attributed to hannibal
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re solar sail data ajjb adam bnsc rl ac uk andrew broderick writes in article apr news duc auburn edu snydefj eng auburn edu writes i am looking for any information concerning projects involving solar sails i was at an interesting seminar at work uk s r a l space science dept on this subject specifically on a small scale solar sail proposed as a student space project the guy giving the talk was keen to generate interest in the project i ll typein the handout he gave out at the meeting here goes stuff deleted however it is more difficult to design a practical solar sail than most people realize the pressure of sunlight is only about one kilogram per square kilometer i m glad to see that someone is working on this however it would be nice if he got his units right josh hopkins jbh uxa cso uiuc edu find a way or make one attributed to hannibal
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re solar sail data in article apr news duc auburn edu snydefj eng auburn edu frank j snyder writes i am looking for any information concerning projects involving solar sails are there any groups out there currently involved in such a project sure contact the world space foundation they re listed in the sci space frequently asked questions file which i ll excerpt world space foundation has been designing and building a solar sail spacecraft for longer than any similar group many jpl employees lend their talents to this project wsf also provides partial funding for the palomar sky survey an extremely successful search for near earth asteroids publishes foundation news and foundation astronautics notebook each a quarterly page newsletter contributing associate minimum of year but more money always welcome to support projects world space foundation post office box y south pasadena california wsf put together a little paperback anthology of fiction and nonfiction about solar sails project solar sail i think robert staehle david brin or arthur clarke may be listed as editor also there is a nontechnical book on solar sailing by louis friedman a technical one by a guy whose name escapes me help me out josh and i would expect that greg matloff and eugene mallove have something to say about the subject in the starflight handbook as well as quite a few references check the following articles in journal of the british interplanetary society v p v p v p v p v p v p can you guess that matloff visited fermilab and gave me a bunch of reprints i just found the file and k eric drexler s paper high performance solar sails and related reflecting devices aiaa paper probably in a book called space manufacturing maybe the proceedings of the second conference on space manufacturing the one at any rate submarines flying boats robots talking bill higgins pictures radio television bouncing radar fermilab vibrations off the moon rocket ships and higgins fnal bitnet atom splitting all in our time but nobody higgins fnal fnal gov has yet been able to figure out a music span higgins holder for a marching piccolo player meredith willson
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keeping spacecraft on after funding cuts why do spacecraft have to be shut off after funding cuts for example why couldn t magellan just be told to go into a safe mode and stay bobbing about venus in a low power use mode and if maybe in a few years if funding gets restored after the economy gets better hopefully it could be turned on again for that matter why exactly were the apollo lunar experiments turned off rather than just safed was it political i e as along as they could be used someone would keep bugging congress for funds turning them off keeps them pesky scientists out of the bureaucrat s hair i ve heard the argument that an active but uncontrolled spacecraft causes radio noise i find that hard to believe that this could be a problem in a properly designed safe mode this safe mode could be a program routine which causes the spacecraft to go to least fuel using orientation and once a week month year whatever attempts a signal lock on earth at that time if funding has been restored the mission can continue if no signal is recieved the spacecraft goes back to the safe mode for another time period as we would know when the spacecraft is going to try to contact earth we could be prepared if necessary as another a spacecraft could do at the attempted contact is beam stored data towards earth if someone can receive it great if not so it s lost and no big deal by making the time and signal location generally known perhaps someone in the world might be able and willing to intercept the data even if they re not willing to contact the spacecraft i see this as being particularly useful for spacecraft which could have an otherwise long life and are in or are going to places which are otherwise unaccessible jupiter saturn orbit exiting the solar system etc perhaps those designing future spacecraft cassini pluto flyby etc should consider designing in a pause mode in case their spacecraft gets the ax sometime in the future after completion of the primary mission perhaps mars observer and galilleo could have some kind of routine written in for the post mission drift phase so any holes in all this james t green jgreen oboe calpoly edu i believe that this nation should commit itself to achieving the goal before this decade is out of landing a man on the moon and returning him safely to the earth john f kennedy may
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commercial mining activities on the moon in article apr ke zv uucp gary ke zv uucp gary coffman writes be the site of major commercial activity as far as we know it has no materials we can t get cheaper right here on earth or from asteroids and comets aside from the semi mythic he that might be useful in low grade fusion reactors i don t know what a low grade fusion reactor is but the major problem with he aside from the difficulty in making any fusion reactor work is that its concentration in lunar regolith is just so small on the order of ppb or so on average more in some fractions but still very small massive amounts of regolith would have to be processed this thread reminds me of wingo s claims some time ago about the moon as a source of titanium for use on earth as i recall wingo wasn t content with being assured that titanium at in the earth s crust average would not run out and touted lunar mines even though the market price of ilmenite concentrate these days is around pound this prompted me to look up large potential terrestrial sources on the moon titanium occurs in basalts high ti basalts apollo and have titanium dioxide by weight this is nice but terrestrial continental flood basalts are also typically enriched in titanium they very often have tio frequently have and sometimes even tio again by weight these flood basalts are enormous millions of cubic kilometers scattered all over the world siberia brazil the nw united states ethiopia etc if even of the basalts are tio this is trillions of tons of tio at concentrations only a factor of less than in lunar high ti basalts it is difficult to see how the disadvantages of the moon could be overcome by such a small increase the concentration of the ore never mind the richer but less common terrestrial ores being mined today paul f dietz dietz cs rochester edu
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re keeping spacecraft on after funding cuts in article apr zeus calpoly edu jgreen trumpet calpoly edu james thomas green writes why do spacecraft have to be shut off after funding cuts for example why couldn t magellan just be told to go into a safe mode and stay bobbing about venus in a low power use mode and if maybe in a few years if funding gets restored after the economy gets better hopefully it could be turned on again it can be but the problem is a political one not a technical one ron baalke baalke kelvin jpl nasa gov jet propulsion lab m s telos the aweto from new zealand pasadena ca is part caterpillar and part vegetable
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re orion drive in vacuum how in article apr head cfa harvard edu willner head cfa harvard edu steve willner writes the nasm photo archives are open to the public all or almost all still pictures in the collection are available for viewing but i don t know about films at least it might be worth a try i m not sure if appointments are necessary but i think not is posible to make copies of these photographs or any other aerospace photographs at nasm if you pay a copyright fee andres c gaeris living example of the application of newton s junior laser fusioneer zeroth law agae lle rochester edu every body in rest wants to remain in bed
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re comet in temporary orbit around jupiter jgarland kean ucs mun ca writes also perihelions of gehrels were april jupiter radii august jupiter radii where jupiter radius km mi au so the figure seems unlikely to actually be anything but a perijove is that the case for the figure as well sorry perijoves i m not used to talking this language hmmmm the prefix peri is greek not latin so it s usually used with the greek form of the name of the body being orbited that s why it s perihelion rather than perisol perigee rather than periterr and pericynthion rather than perilune so for jupiter i d expect it to be something like perizeon bob bob com robert k coe churchill st sudbury massachusetts
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proton centaur has anyone looked into the possiblity of a proton centaur combo what would be the benefits and problems with such a combo other than the obvious instability in the xssr now james t green jgreen oboe calpoly edu i know you believe you understand what it is that you think i said but i am not sure that you realize that what i said is not what i meant
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re commercial mining activities on the moon in article apr cs rochester edu dietz cs rochester edu paul dietz writes in article apr ke zv uucp gary ke zv uucp gary coffman writes be the site of major commercial activity as far as we know it has no materials we can t get cheaper right here on earth or from asteroids and comets aside from the semi mythic he that might be useful in low grade fusion reactors problem with he aside from the difficulty in making any fusion reactor work is that its concentration in lunar regolith is just so small on the order of ppb or so on average more in some this thread reminds me of wingo s claims some time ago about the moon as a source of titanium for use on earth as i recall wingo wasn t even of the basalts are tio this is trillions of tons of tio at concentrations only a factor of less than in lunar high ti basalts it is difficult to see how the disadvantages of the moon could be overcome by such a small increase the concentration of the ore never mind the richer but less common terrestrial ores being mined today why paul it s obvious once chlorine chemistry has been banned on earth as is being advocated by some groups ti prices will sharply increase we are of course not allowed to assume any developments in ti processing lunar ti will then be eminently competitive for the trendy jewelry market and certain applications of national importance oops this is sci space wrong rules of debate seriously i d say there is a flaw in gary s analysis in that he assumes an export oriented economy maybe the lunatics will just want some native ti for local use as to why lunar natives are cost effective analysis has shown they will be critical in providing a sheltered manufacturing base technological innovation critical materials and manpower in the war between the allies and central powers in about two hundred years steinn sigurdsson i saw two shooting stars last night lick observatory i wished on them but they were only satellites steinly lick ucsc edu is it wrong to wish on space hardware standard disclaimer i wish i wish i wish you d care b b
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re commercial mining activities on the moon in article steinly apr topaz ucsc edu steinly topaz ucsc edu steinn sigurdsson writes why paul it s obvious once chlorine chemistry has been banned on earth as is being advocated by some groups ti prices will sharply increase we are of course not allowed to assume any developments in ti processing lunar ti will then be eminently competitive for the trendy jewelry market and certain applications of national importance well there already is a sulfate process for tio purification the chlorine process is cleaner however and for that reason is achieving dominance in the marketplace most ti is used in pigment btw as the oxide where it replaced white lead pigment some decades ago very little is reduced to the metal seriously i d say there is a flaw in gary s analysis in that he assumes an export oriented economy maybe the lunatics will just want some native ti for local use which merely evades the issue of why those lunatics are there at all and why their children would want to stay paul f dietz dietz cs rochester edu
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re did any dc x gifs show up fils iastate edu douglas r fils writes in article qgiah h g news cerf net diaspar nic cerf net diaspar virtual reality network writes the rollout was great and i got lots of great shots i attended the press briefing and got shots of the dc y model too all in d david h mitchell david are you still planing on scanning these and posting them somewhere hope hope hope if you could that would be great thanks for report of the rollout as well take care doug they did the rollout already i am going to have to pay more attention to the news are any of the gifs headed for wuarchive patrick patrick grady how do they manage it these humans beginning pwg uxa cso uiuc edu each time so innocently yet always ending up pwg sumter cso uiuc edu with the most blood on their hands fathertree to bugger o s card s xenocide
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re commercial mining activities on the moon in article apr cs rochester edu dietz cs rochester edu paul dietz writes in article steinly apr topaz ucsc edu steinly topaz ucsc edu steinn sigurdsson writes why paul it s obvious once chlorine chemistry has been banned on earth as is being advocated by some groups ti prices will well there already is a sulfate process for tio purification the chlorine process is cleaner however and for that reason is achieving dominance in the marketplace darn caught by the white hot heat of technological progress again most ti is used in pigment btw as the oxide where it replaced white lead pigment some decades ago very little is reduced to the metal spoilsport hence the need for increasing fashion emphasis on anodise ti jewelry seriously i d say there is a flaw in gary s analysis in that he assumes an export oriented economy maybe the lunatics will just want some native ti for local use which merely evades the issue of why those lunatics are there at all and why their children would want to stay i did not evade the issue at all i clearly stated that this would be from diabolical foresight in establishing a sheltered industrial base for the upcoming great war very cost effective if you use the right accounting method steinn sigurdsson lick observatory steinly lick ucsc edu standard disclaimer but oh love is strange and you have to learn to take the crunchy with the smooth i suppose b b
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re why not give billion to first year lo in article f zoo toronto edu henry zoo toronto edu henry spencer writes in article apr iti org aws iti org allen w sherzer writes this prize isn t big enough to warrent developing a ssto but it is enough to do it if the vehicle exists actually there are people who will tell you that it would be enough to do ssto development if done privately as a cut rate operation of course they may be over optimistic you can also assume that a working ssto would have other applications that would help pay for its development costs i d be inclined to make the prize somewhat larger but g might be enough this all sounds like that indecent proposal movie wouldn t there be a lot of people that would try this with little hope of working just to get the dough if you have a chance and it costs you mil then you might pay some stooge a few grand to be your lucky hero just send up a few dozen and is bound to survive enough to make you rich dong
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vandalizing the sky from the article what s new apr in sci physics research what s new in my opinion friday april washington dc space billboards is this one the spinoffs we were promised in science fiction writer robert heinlein published the man who sold the moon which involved a dispute over the sale of rights to the moon for use as billboard nasa has taken the firsteps toward this hideous vision of the future observers were startled this spring when a nasa launch vehicle arrived at the pad with schwarzenegger painted in huge block letters on the side of the booster rockets space marketing inc had arranged for the ad to promote arnold s latest movie now space marketing is working with university of colorado and livermore engineers on a plan to place a mile long inflatable billboard in low earth orbit nasa would provide contractual launch services however since nasa bases its charge on seriously flawed cost estimates wn mar the taxpayers would bear most of the expense this may look like environmental vandalism but mike lawson ceo of space marketing told us yesterday that the real purpose of the project is to help the environment the platform will carry ozone monitors he explained advertising is just to help defray costs what do you think of this revolting and hideous attempt to vandalize the night sky it is not even april anymore what about light pollution in observations i read somewhere else that it might even be visible during the day leave alone at night is nasa really supporting this junk are protesting groups being organized in the states really really depressed enzo vincenzo liguori enzo research canon oz au canon information systems research australia phone po box north ryde nsw fax
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re astronomy program in article galaxy ucr edu datadec ucrengr ucr edu kevin marcus writes are there any public domain or shareware astronomy programs which will map out the sky at any given time and allow you to locate planets nebulae and so forth if so is there any ftp site where i can get one i posted my public domain msdos program sunlight zip to sci astro yesterday it easily locates the sun moon and planets and can also be used to locate other objects if you input their right ascesion and declination use uudecode to extract robert sheaffer scepticus maximus sheaffer netcom com past chairman the bay area skeptics for whom i speak only when authorized marxism and feminism are one and that one is marxism heidi hartmann and amy bridges quoted by catharine mackinnon above the first chapter of her toward a feminist theory of the state
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re solar sail data higgins fnalf fnal gov bill higgins beam jockey writes snydefj eng auburn edu frank j snyder writes i am looking for any information concerning projects involving solar sails are there any groups out there currently involved in such a project bill says also there is a nontechnical book on solar sailing by louis friedman a technical one by a guy whose name escapes me help me out josh i presume the one you refer to is space sailing by jerome l wright he worked on solar sails while at jpl and as ceo of general astronautics i ll furnish ordering info upon request the friedman book is called starsailing solar sails and interstellar travel it was available from the planetary society a few years ago i don t know if it still is josh hopkins jbh uxa cso uiuc edu find a way or make one attributed to hannibal
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re proton centaur in article apr zeus calpoly edu jgreen trumpet calpoly edu james thomas green writes has anyone looked into the possiblity of a proton centaur combo i don t know a whole lot on proton but given that it is a multi stage rocket up to stages it may not really need the centaur plus it may end up seriously beating on said centaur also the centaur is not small unless the proton has an oversize shroud you may not be able to get the centaur in under it dennis you know much about this pat
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boom whoosh and one of my profs is the chief engineer for the project dr ron humble univ colorado at colorado springs i love the idea of an inflatable mile long sign it will be a really neat thing to see it explode when a bolt or even better a westford needle comes crashing into it at clicks a sec boom whooooooooshhhhhh sputter sputter okay pretend it would make a sound i hear insert favorite rumor here that it will supposedly coincide with the atlanta olympics fuzzy lt david fuzzy wells i want peace on earth o o hq afspacecom cna goodwill toward men we do debris we re the government we don t do that u ack wdwells esprit uccs edu that sort of thing sneakers
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in article apr iti org aws iti org allen w sherzer writes in article qve kinnpas sal sun usc edu schaefer sal sun usc edu peter schaefer writes announce that a reward of billion would go to the first corporation who successfully keeps at least person alive on the moon for a year oh gee a billion dollars that d be just about enough to cover the cost of the feasability study happy happy joy joy depends if you assume the existance of a working ssto like dc on billion would be enough to put about a quarter million pounds of stuff on the moon if some of that mass went to send equipment to make lox for the transfer vehicle you could send a lot more either way its a lot more than needed this prize isn t big enough to warrent developing a ssto but it is enough to do it if the vehicle exists allen lady astor sir if you were my husband i would poison your coffee w churchill madam if you were my wife i would drink it days to first flight of dcx or have different classes of competetors and made the total purse billion or billion depending on how many different classes there are as in auto racing motocycle racing and such we shall see how things go michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked
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re keeping spacecraft on after funding cuts some birds require constant management for survival pointing a sensor at the sun even when powered down may burn it out pointing a parabolic antenna at sol from venus orbit may trash the foci elements even if you let teh bird drift it may get hosed by some cosmic phenomena pat
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re jemison on star trek in article c sb p ib fs ece cmu edu loss fs ece cmu edu doug loss writes i saw in the newspaper last night that dr mae jemison the first black woman in space she s a physician and chemical engineer who flew on endeavour last year will appear as a transporter operator on the star trek the next generation episode that airs the week of may it s hardly space science i know but it s interesting doug loss interesting is rigth i wonder if they will make a mention of her being an astronaut in the credits i think it might help people connect the future of space with the present and give them an idea that we must go into space michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked
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re why not give billion to first year lo in article c szvl i oakhill sps mot com dong oakhill sps mot com writes i d be inclined to make the prize somewhat larger but g might be enough this all sounds like that indecent proposal movie wouldn t there be a lot of people that would try this with little hope of working just to get the dough if you have a chance and it costs you mil then you might pay some stooge a few grand to be your lucky hero just send up a few dozen and is bound to survive enough to make you rich any prize like this is going to need to be worded carefully enough that you cannot get it without demonstrating sustained and reliable capability rather than a lucky one shot it can be done all work is one man s work henry spencer u of toronto zoology kipling henry zoo toronto edu utzoo henry
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re moonbase race in article c sx y z cs cmu edu tm msu edu tom writes on the other hand if apollo cost billion for a few days or weeks in space in dollars then won t the reward have to be a lot more than only billion to get any takers apollo was done the hard way in a big hurry from a very limited technology base and on government contracts just doing it privately rather than as a government project cuts costs by a factor of several all work is one man s work henry spencer u of toronto zoology kipling henry zoo toronto edu utzoo henry
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sunrise sunset times hello i am looking for a program or algorithm that can be used to compute sunrise and sunset times i would appreciate any advice joe wetstein jpw coe drexel edu
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re vandalizing the sky in article c t k db research canon oz au enzo research canon oz au enzo liguori writes from the article what s new apr in sci physics research what s new in my opinion friday april washington dc space billboards is this one the spinoffs we were promised what about light pollution in observations i read somewhere else that it might even be visible during the day leave alone at night is nasa really supporting this junk are protesting groups being organized in the states really really depressed enzo i wouldn t worry about it there s enough space debris up there that a mile long inflatable would probably deflate in some very short period of time less than a year while cleaning up leo somewhat sort of a giant fly paper in orbit hmm that could actually be useful as for advertising sure why not a nasa friend and i spent one drunken night figuring out just exactly how much gold mylar we d need to put the golden arches of a certain american fast food organization on the face of the moon fortunately we sobered up in the morning todd
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lunar colony race by or okay here is what i have so far have a group any size preferibly small but send a human being to the moon set up a habitate and have the human s spend one earth year on the moon does that mean no resupply or need to find atleast billion for prize money contest open to different classes of participants new mexico state has semi challenged university of alaska any branch to put a team together and to do it any other university college institute of higher learning wish to make a counter challenge or challenge another school say it here i like the idea of having atleast a russian team some prefer using new technology others old or the basic idea of the new moon race is like the solar car race acrossed australia atleast in that basic vein of endevour any other suggestions michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked
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re looking for a little research help found it thanks i got several offers for help i appreciate it and will be contacting those people via e mail thanks again jennise
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old spacecraft as navigation beacons other idea for old space crafts is as navigation beacons and such why not if you can put them on safe pause mode why not have them be activated by a signal from a space craft manned to act as a naviagtion beacon to take a directional plot on wierd or what michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents the apollo program cost something like billion at a time when the value of a dollar was worth more than it is now no one would take the offer bruce watson wats scicom alphacdc com bulletin item extract
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re moonbase race hmm billion lesse i can probably launch tons to leo at million in five years which gives about tons to the lunar surface one way say five tons of that is a return vehicle and its fuel a bigger mercury or something might get that as low as two tons leaving fifteen tons for a one man habitat and a year s supplies gee with that sort of mass margins i can build the systems off the shelf for about another hundred million tops that leaves about million profit i like this idea let s see if you guys can push someone to make it happen slightly seriously george william herbert retro aerospace
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re vandalizing the sky in article c t k db research canon oz au enzo research canon oz au enzo liguori writes hideous vision of the future observers were startled this spring when a nasa launch vehicle arrived at the pad with schwarzenegger painted in huge block letters on the this is ok in my opinion as long as the stuff returns to earth what do you think of this revolting and hideous attempt to vandalize the night sky it is not even april anymore if this turns out to be true it s time to get seriously active in terrorism this is unbelievable who do those people think they are selling every bit that promises to make money i guess we really deserve being wiped out by uv radiation folks stupidity wins i guess that s true and if only by pure numbers another depressed planetary citizen hoover uwe hoover schuerkamp hoover mathematik uni bielefeld de clear skies fight light pollution
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re space station radio commercial in article c r i skates gsfc nasa gov xrcjd resolve gsfc nasa gov charles j divine writes a brief political cultural item radio station wgms in washington is a classical music station with a large audience among high officials elected and otherwise imagine a radio station that advertises mercedes benzes diamond jewelry expensive resorts and truthfully trident submarines this morning i heard a commercial for the space station project didn t catch the advertiser guess they re pulling out all the stops in the air force world at least the crisis escalates when scale models of the plane in question i e about to be sacrificed begin to arrive in key senators and congresspersons offices of course it is assumed that coffee mugs and other decorative junk has been tried earlier spiros spiros triantafyllopoulos c st kocrsv delcoelect com software technology delco electronics gm hughes electronics kokomo in i post therefore i armm
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re commercial mining activities on the moon dietz cs rochester edu paul dietz writes which merely evades the issue of why those lunatics are there at all and why their children would want to stay paul for the same reason that many other colonies are founded why not charlie prael dante shakala com shakala bbs clanzen radio network sunnyvale ca
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re boom whoosh matthew phantom gatech edu matthew deluca writes in article apr mnemosyne cs du edu wdwells nyx cs du edu david fuzzy wells writes i hear insert favorite rumor here that it will supposedly coincide with the atlanta olympics even worse the city of atlanta has a proposal before it to rent space on this orbiting billboard considering the caliber of people running this city there s no telling what we re going to have leering down at us from orbit i would just like to point out that it is much easier to place an object at orbital altitude than it is to place it with orbital velocity for a target km above the surface of earth you need a delta v of km s assuming that rockets with specific impulses of seconds are easy to produce a rocket with a dry weight of kg would require only about kg of fuel oxidizer a small dispersal charge embedded in about kg of sand or birdshot depending on the nature of the structure would be the payload i am sure the whole project is well within the capability of the amateur rocketry community it sounds like a good science fair project reduction of light pollution through applied ballistics or it could be part of the challenge prize being discussed here billion for the first person to spend year on the moon million for the first erradication of an orbital eyesore ccd burner i wouldpledge for the first person to bring it down and i am sure there are at least other astronomers nature lovers or just plain people of good taste who would do likewise of course a gerald bull solution might be simpler either the solution gerald bull would apply the use of a large caliber gun or the solution which was applied to gerald bull the use of a small caliber gun david m palmer palmer alumni caltech edu palmer tgrs gsfc nasa gov
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which gehrels was re comet in temporary orbit around jupiter in article apr sq sq com msb sq sq com mark brader writes also peri jove s of gehrels were thanks again one final question the name gehrels wasn t known to me before this thread came up but the may issue of scientific american has an article about the inconstant cosmos with a photo of neil gehrels project scientist for nasa s compton gamma ray observatory same person i would guess not dr neil gehrels of cgro is the son of dr tom gehrels of the university of arizona since he s long had research interests in asteroids and other solar system astronomy tom is the one more likely to have discovered a comet and thus had his name attached to it tom gehrels is a leader in the spacewatch project which has recently increased mankind s discovery rate on near earth asteroids they re finding a couple every month for much more on this interesting guy read his autobiography on a glassy sea do you know the asteroids mr kemp bill higgins hundreds of thousands of them all wandering around the sun in strange fermilab orbits some never named never charted the orphans of the solar higgins fnal fnal gov system mr kemp higgins fnal bitnet and you want to become a father moon zero two span hepnet higgins
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re old spacecraft as navigation beacons nsmca aurora alaska edu writes other idea for old space crafts is as navigation beacons and such why not if you can put them on safe pause mode why not have them be activated by a signal from a space craft manned to act as a naviagtion beacon to take a directional plot on wierd or what michael adams nsmca acad alaska edu i m not high just jacked there is a whole constellation of custom built navigation beacon satellites in the process of being phased out right now the transit oscar satellites are being replaced by gps or were you thinking of deep space navigation which is best done with doppler vlbi stellar measurements i do not think additional radio beacons would help much dave stephenson geological survey of canada ottawa ontario canada internet stephens geod emr ca
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re commercial mining activities on the moon in article steinly apr topaz ucsc edu steinly topaz ucsc edu steinn sigurdsson writes very cost effective if you use the right accounting method sherzer methodology software engineering that s like military intelligence isn t it sysmgr cadlab eng umd edu
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re moonbase race in article c teik z zoo toronto edu henry zoo toronto edu henry spencer writes apollo was done the hard way in a big hurry from a very limited technology base and on government contracts just doing it privately rather than as a government project cuts costs by a factor of several so how much would it cost as a private venture assuming you could talk the u s government into leasing you a couple of pads in florida software engineering that s like military intelligence isn t it sysmgr cadlab eng umd edu
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life on mars what is the deal with life on mars i save the face and heard associated theories which sound thin to me are we going back to mars to look at this face agian does anyone buy all the life theories don schiewer internet schiewer pa a inland com onward great inland steel uucp uucp pa a inland schiewer stream
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re moonbase race in article r o inn j mojo eng umd edu sysmgr king eng umd edu writes so how much would it cost as a private venture assuming you could talk the u s government into leasing you a couple of pads in florida why would you want to do that the goal is to do it cheaper remember this isn t government instead of leasing an expensive launch pad just use a ssto and launch from a much cheaper facility allen lady astor sir if you were my husband i would poison your coffee w churchill madam if you were my wife i would drink it days to first flight of dcx
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re level in article c sy s x cs cmu edu tm msu edu tom writes nick haines sez given that i ve heard the shuttle software rated as level in maturity i strongly doubt that this having lots of bugs is the case level out of how many what are the different levels i ve never heard of this rating system anyone care to clue me in this is a rating system used by arpa and other organisations to measure the maturity of a software process i e the entire process by which software gets designed written tested delivered supported etc see managing the software process by watts s humphrey addison wesley an excellent software engineering text the levels of software process maturity are initial repeatable defined managed optimizing the levels are approximately characterized as follows no statistically software process control have no statistical basis for estimating how large software will be how long it will take to produce how expensive it will be or how reliable it will be most software production is at this level stable process with statistical controls rigorous project management having done something once can do it again projects are planned in detail and there is software configuration management and quality assurance the process is defined and understood implementation is consistent this includes things like software inspection a rigorous software testing framework more configuration management and typically a software engineering process group within the project statistical information on the software is systematically gathered and analysed and the process is controlled on the basis of this information software quality is measured and has goals defects are prevented the process is automated software contracts are effective and certified nick haines nickh cmu edu
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re lunar colony race by or in article apr aurora alaska edu nsmca aurora alaska edu writes okay here is what i have so far have a group any size preferibly small but send a human being to the moon set up a habitate and have the human s spend one earth year on the moon does that mean no resupply or need to find atleast billion for prize money my first thought is ross perot after further consideration i think he d be more likely to try to win it but come in a disappointing third try bill gates try sam walton s kids matt matthew feulner qmlink draper com
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re level in c sy s x cs cmu edu tm msu edu tom writes nick haines sez given that i ve heard the shuttle software rated as level in maturity i strongly doubt that this having lots of bugs is the case level out of how many what are the different levels i ve never heard of this rating system anyone care to clue me in sei level the highest level the sei stands for software engineering institute i m not sure but i believe that this rating only applies to the flight software also keep in mind that it was not achieved through the use of sophisticated tools but rather through a brute force and ignorance attack on the problem during the challenger standdown they simply threw hundreds of people at it and did the whole process by hand i would not consider receiving a warning status on systems which are not yet in use would detract much if anything from such a rating i ll have to get the latest copy of the guidelines to make sure they just issued new ones i think also keep in mind that the sei levels are concerned primarily with control of the software process the assumption is that a well controlled process will produce good software also keep in mind that sei level is damned hard most software in this country is produced by engineering practicies that only rate an sei level if that insisting on perfect safety is for people who don t have the balls to live in the real world mary shafer nasa ames dryden fred mccall dseg ti com i don t speak for others and they don t speak for me
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re conference on manned lunar exploration may crystal city in article c rhoc fty news cso uiuc edu jbh uxa cso uiuc edu josh hopkins writes i remeber reading the comment that general dynamics was tied into this in connection with their proposal for an early manned landing sorry i don t rember where i heard this but i m fairly sure it was somewhere reputable anyone else know anything on this angle if by that you mean anything on the gd approach there was an article on it in a recent avation week i don t remember the exact date but it was recent allen lady astor sir if you were my husband i would poison your coffee w churchill madam if you were my wife i would drink it days to first flight of dcx
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re why not give billion to first year long moon residents in article c sjdp f zoo toronto edu henry zoo toronto edu henry spencer writes this prize isn t big enough to warrent developing a ssto but it is enough to do it if the vehicle exists actually there are people who will tell you that it would be enough to do ssto development if done privately as a cut rate operation of course they may be over optimistic in spite of my great respect for the people you speak of i think their cost estimates are a bit over optimistic if nothing else a working ssto is at least as complex as a large airliner and has a smaller experience base it therefore seems that ssto development should cost at least as much as a typical airliner development that puts it in the g to g range you can also assume that a working ssto would have other applications that would help pay for its development costs true it and the contest would result in a much larger market but i don t think it would be enough to attract the investors given the risks involved if you could gurantee the ssto costs and gurantee that it captures of the available launch market then i think you could do it allen lady astor sir if you were my husband i would poison your coffee w churchill madam if you were my wife i would drink it days to first flight of dcx
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lindbergh and the moon was why not give g all of this talk about a commercial space race i e g to the first year moon base is intriguing similar prizes have influenced aerospace development before the k orteig prize helped lindbergh sell his spirit of saint louis venture to his financial backers if memory serves the k prize would not have been enough to totally reimburse some of the more expensive transatlantic projects such as fokker s nungesser and other multi engine projects however lindbergh ultimately kept his total costs below that amount but i strongly suspect that his saint louis backers had the foresight to realize that much more was at stake than could it work with the moon who are the far sighted financial backers of today layne cook cook apt mdc com mcdonnell douglas space systems co
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