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Show HN: MapMe.io, AR platform for IoT, primarily for transportation awareness - craigm26
http://MapMe.io, a AR platform for the IoT, primarily for transportation awareness. Original motivation was to create an all-software solution for the bicyclist to be more aware of something coming up from behind - as I am mostly deaf. After a few startup weekends and intel edison incubators, I'm getting close to testing with small group of alpha users in a larger city like SF (where real-time data is available for public buses). The idea for the MapMe.io is to be the software platform where real-time notifications enhance transportation safety overall. Spotter view/tab will access the phone camera for "background" of app/"foreground" for user and the alerts will give relevant alerts based on user location.<p>Built on Firebase with Ionic. Any suggestions on functionality or initial impressions would be great!.
======
dang
Posts without URLs get penalized, so you'd be better off submitting this with
a link to your site, then adding the above text as a first comment in the
thread. Good luck!
~~~
craigm26
thanks!
------
craigm26
company website at beaconsafety.co
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Fippet allows you to pass on snippets of info via a 4 character code - fippet
http://fippet.com
We have just launched - would love your feedback!
======
fippet
Hi Krap,
Thanks for the feedback, you recon logging in to post a snippet should be
optional? It's just once you post a snippet we like to add it to your profile,
so you can find it again.
4 characters is easy to remember :)
------
krapp
Why the limitation of 4 characters?
And also why do I need an account to post a snippet?
Also the wood background makes the text really hard to read.
------
fippet
If you have any questions let me know :)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Minecraft will get Oculus Rift support in next few weeks - jonbaer
http://www.theverge.com/2016/7/28/12308268/minecraft-vr-oculus-rift-windows-10-launch
======
benmcnelly
Wonder if locomotion via controller will be an option along with teleporting
around.
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"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Why More Features Doesn’t Mean More Success - jeremylevy
http://blog.kissmetrics.com/features-doesnt-mean-success/
======
darkxanthos
What's really hard here isn't so much the advice but the how which the article
thankfully addresses (though only briefly). More needs to be written on this.
Routinely I find businesses afraid to interact with their customers which
means then that they can't gather the infomation they need to be successful.
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Google shaking up earthquake searches - peter123
http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2009/03/shaking-up-earthquake-searches.html
======
indiejade
Neat. The Pacific Rim of Fire is such a hotbed of activity:
[http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en&gl=us&ie=UTF8&#...</a><p>Just wish I
could have figured out how to get the little markers to be different colors
for earthquakes and volcanoes.
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Google: Web Application Exploits and Defenses - emilepetrone
http://google-gruyere.appspot.com/
======
roadnottaken
This is very interesting. I'm a little conflicted about whether the benefit of
distributing this info outweighs the risks of teaching anyone how to hack a
website. There are certainly LOTS of vulnerable websites still out there...
~~~
patio11
The bad guys already know this stuff, or are capable of searching teh G00gelz
for l33t hackorz skriptz which will automate e.g. trying SQL injections or
pulling cookies out of your wifi. The good guys, on the other hand, need all
the help they can get (including, for example, being reminded that one can
easily pull cookies out of your wifi).
In a related vein, there is WebGoat, a Java application which is designed to
be compromised.
~~~
tptacek
I'm not a fan of WebGoat. If you're seriously going to spend some time beating
up an application to learn appsec --- and I highly recommend you do --- drop
me an email and I'll give you a better target.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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What exactly makes Entrepreneurship so hard - paraschopra
http://www.pluggd.in/what-exactly-makes-entrepreneurship-so-hard-297/
======
idlewords
Maybe a better question is, what makes entrepreneurship so self-involved?
Hats off to the lurkers here who are just building shit.
~~~
nazgulnarsil
narcissism seems naturally correlated to self starters IMO.
------
nkabbara
I completely disagree with the “Period.” I think it’s a very small part of why
it’s hard. Actually, if I were to ask the question differently and say: What
exactly makes Entrepreneurship so attractive? Many would say it’s the lack of
a boss.
Entrepreneurship is very personal and if you don’t have the discipline muscle
already trained and ready, the first year or two will be very hard. But after
that, you simply pick up a sheet of paper in the morning, look over at your
yearly plan, and write down the couple of things that you must do that day to
get a little closer.
At the end of the day, cross all the items off the list. If you’re lucky, that
is.
Of course, it’s much harder than that. Specially when your plan is evolving as
you go.
From my experience, I believe what makes entrepreneurship so hard is having to
fly multiple plans in the sky simultaneously.
It’s telling which planes are carrying the cargo and which are carrying the
people. The ones that can absolutely not crash no matter what from the ones
that can not crash.
------
andrewljohnson
Well, that's not what makes entrepreneurship hard for me. Each day, I can get
up and decide various things to do, and I'm plenty motivated. In fact, I would
guess most entrepreneurs are the workaholic, get-it-done type.
What makes entrepreneurship hard for me is figuring out what to do, not
following through on it. So, in some sense, it would be easier if I had a boss
with a todo list, if the ideas were better than my own.
At a chugging corporation, it's easy to figure out stuff worth doing, and hard
to motivate people. At a start-up, it's just the opposite... it's easy to
motivate people and hard to figure out stuff worth doing.
------
JacobAldridge
If you need a boss to make all of the prioritisation and deadline decisions,
you won't make it as an entrepreneur. But you can take responsibility without
having to make all of those decisions on your own.
This is where having the support of people who have walked the path before
(like the YC team or even others here at HN) is invaluable, as well as getting
the right advice _and_ being held accountable by a specific mentor or coach.
------
coffeemug
I disagree. Everyone has some kind of a boss, even though it may not be a guy
working in the office next to you. For entrepreneurs it might be the
customers, it might be your investors, it might be your cofounders, but there
is still "a boss".
What makes it hard for me is the fact that there is a fog of war. There is a
high degree of uncertainty about almost everything. I'm dedicating a
tremendous amount of my time and effort to something that might tip over at
any moment, either because of a wrong decision, or because of a situation
outside of my control, or because I'm not good enough, or because it was a
terrible idea in the first place. Entrepreneurship requires faith, basically,
and I'm not used to structuring my life that way.
------
DaniFong
The full responsibility for the fate of your company, and all of the people
depending on it, though it depends to a great extent on investors, partners,
customers, the markets, technical and social and financial risks that you can
only vaguely see and barely control, ultimately rests on you.
This is so completely unlike the typical modern day human experience that
people often just get culture shock and flicker out. Even more often, they
give up and fade out, blaming some little thing or external cause for their
failure.
The creation of valuable new technologies, while challenging, seems like a
cakewalk compared to the moral weight you're required to bear when running a
company. I think this can be partially seen in how many entrepreneurs do end
up giving up the reins of their company; either during an acquisition or to
'professional managers' (who often themselves simply shirk the moral weight
since the company isn't theirs to the same extent.) Those who can take their
company to the next level are, at each step, both rare and exceedingly
valuable.
------
Aegean
its a very small detail for why it is hard. there is about 100 - 150 more
other things you need to worry about just as much.
------
lsd5you
The economic equilibrium.
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"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Andrew Ng – What Artificial Intelligence Can and Can’t Do Right Now - geedzmo
https://hbr.org/2016/11/what-artificial-intelligence-can-and-cant-do-right-now
======
Isamu
Andrew Ng: "Here’s one rule of thumb that speaks to its disruptiveness:
"If a typical person can do a mental task with less than one second of
thought, we can probably automate it using AI either now or in the near
future."
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Hotel Tonight but for Haircuts? - pabenjam23
Would you use a service that lets you schedule an appointment online with a service provider like a barber or tax accountant when you need them?
======
kremdela
I have never felt like I had a dire need to do either of those things but
couldn't.
For me, things that would fit better in that category are when my wife bugs me
that we should do an exercise class tonight, and I don't want to be bothered
to search through the 5 yoga studios or spin classes near my house to find an
open class.
My $0.02
| {
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An alternative, better approach for writing technical documentation - cubicy
http://cubicspot.blogspot.com/2017/07/an-alternative-approach-for-writing.html
======
rman666
So, use (GitHub) Markdown and store in a GitHub directory?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Build your business around an idea - kneath
http://warpspire.com/posts/idea-businesses/
======
6ren
When you focus on needs that don't change, you can change what products you
create to meet it, and you will always be in demand.
When you focus on a need that can never be perfectly met, you will always be
able to improve, and you will always be in demand.
------
dstein
I think a better way to think about this is to separate your company from the
products you build. Ask yourself what does your company do, and how your
products accomplish that goal. In a lot of startups these days the product is
the company which leaves you with absolutely no wiggle room.
------
politician
"Spend a few weeks hanging out in bars and cafes asking what people do and
you’ll hear some of the most idiotic business ideas in the world. A lot of
journalists use this argument to call San Francisco an echo chamber whose sole
purpose is burning money. And you know, they’re right. This city does burn
through money on terrible ideas. But that’s a tradeoff for fostering a city of
people who believe they can do anything."
There's something to be said for inadvertently confirming that tech is in a
bubble. "Here, just buy this house on an adjustable rate mortgage, then flip
it for bucks!"
Nevertheless, I thought the author made a good point about building the
future.
------
pedalpete
The ideas in this post are inline with Simon Sinek's 'start with why' book and
ted talk.
[http://www.ted.com/talks/simon_sinek_how_great_leaders_inspi...](http://www.ted.com/talks/simon_sinek_how_great_leaders_inspire_action.html)
| {
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Ask HN: How would you explain time management to a middle school kid? - Fiveplus
======
PaulHoule
Work backwards from what needs to be done to develop a realistic plan.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Blender 2.80 - harperlee
https://www.blender.org/download/releases/2-80/
======
dingus
The interface overhaul is a huge accomplishment.
I suspect adoption will grow considerably. The previous interface conventions
were unusual and clumsy, and were the primary barrier for those curious about
switching packages.
I switched to Blender after using the beta for several months. I have put
thousands of dollars into licenses for Modo and Maya over the years. I would
much rather put that into Blender donations, now that I can actually use it.
The things a good user interface team can do.
~~~
bogwog
> The previous interface conventions were unusual and clumsy
Unusual, sure. Clumsy? not at all. It was extremely efficient and hyper-
organized. The real problem was that it was different, and people just don't
like change.
This new interface is great because it's easy to use for Maya/Max people, and
it's still similar-enough to the 2.7 era so as not to alienate long-time
users.
~~~
echelon
> Unusual, sure. Clumsy? not at all.
It was clunky, kind of like Gimp's UI, and felt like a remnant of the 90's.
Usable, sure. Aesthetically pleasant? Absolutely not. Our tools should feel
nice.
Major kudos to Blender on this.
~~~
bogwog
You must have not learned how to use it then. That, or we have different
definitions of the word "clumsy". It has absolutely nothing in common with
Gimp, so that makes me wonder if you used it at all.
> Aesthetically pleasant? Absolutely not
That's subjective, but it did support themes and DPI scaling.
~~~
lone_haxx0r
You could justify any ugly design under the "subjective" premise, even pink
buttons on a #FF0000 background. But to anyone with good taste, it looks
better now.
------
deltron3030
Their integrated renderers don't work on newer macOS versions with AMD cards
unfortunately, no metal support. macOS id really a bad place right now if
you're into 3D and want GPU rendering, not only because of Blender, but others
like Cinema 4D aren't there yet either.
It's a big fail of the Apple management to not support the metal development
for apps like Blender, they gonna lose a generation of creatives.
~~~
chewyland
Doesn't anyone think that MacOS is pretty much abandonware at this point? I
don't want to stir anything up but I don't believe Apple is putting too much
effort into the OS at this time. When I boot my MacBook into MacOS (once a
year, if that) I feel like I'm 10 years back in time (yes, I have the absolute
latest version).
I think they're focusing most of their resources on ARM.
Or, I'm probably just crazy.
~~~
skrowl
Anyone who listens to their quarter earnings calls knows that macOS is pretty
far down the priority list.
#1 is billed services (iCloud, Apple Music, etc)
#2 is iOS devices (mostly iPhone)
a very distant #3 is laptops and desktops
macOS is nowhere on the list because it doesn't make them any money.
~~~
mwfunk
It makes them tons of money, their problem is that other things make even more
money. Sadly their organizational structure is such that walking and gum-
chewing is almost impossible for them, so even colossally profitable and
beloved products can wither away from neglect.
~~~
nitrogen
This is why large companies need to be split at some point -- a $x billion
market is enough to sustain a great company, but a $100x billion company will
try hard to ignore it.
------
cabaalis
"The Blender Game Engine was removed." It's been a very, very long time since
I played with Blender, but I think this is good news? The game engine thing
never quite made sense to me.
Edit: This quote is from a different link,
[https://www.blender.org/download/releases/2-80/](https://www.blender.org/download/releases/2-80/)
~~~
reilly3000
Godot has done a great job in this space. The Blender team is wise to not try
to be great at everything, especially when they are great at so much.
~~~
lasagnaphil
Note that Godot is still not great at high-end 3D games because of various
performance issues and missing features. (The reddit link explains how the
Godot third-person demo is showing its weaknesses)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/godot/comments/9n53ij/wha](https://www.reddit.com/r/godot/comments/9n53ij/wha)
t_do_people_here_make_of_this_detailed_and/
Fortunately, the next expected release of Godot (4.0) might be able to solve a
lot of those problems. It's going to be ported to Vulkan, the renderer is
going to be multi-threaded and optimized, and a lot of the lighting related
functionality from major game engines is going to be implemented.
[https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Godot-4....](https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Godot-4.0-Rendering-
Plans)
~~~
indolering
Sounds like they focused on making a small product for a specific niche and
(now that it's taking off like wildfire) they are fixing things.
------
lukebitts
I've been a Blender user since 2.48 and it's so nice to see open source
software getting so much better. Eevee is the biggest game changer for me, my
workflow is much faster now that I can actually preview what my assets will
look like in a PBR renderer, but even "small" stuff like workspaces made my
workflow better. All in all a great release! Congratulations to everyone
involved!
------
edgarvaldes
One thing I always loved about Blender is the installer size. It blows my mind
that a 3D modeling software is under 100 MB.
~~~
gregschlom
I think the same thing every time I download it. I hope the Blender foundation
is able to keep it that way, as things do tend to get more and more bloated
over time.
~~~
vanderZwan
Ton Roosendaal started out as a programmer on the Amiga. I'm probably somewhat
biased here, but I expect that he has strong feelings about avoiding bloatware
~~~
anchpop
I think it would be a good use of space to include some default assets
(models, textures, etc.) for beginners to play with, even if it doubled the
size of the download
~~~
amatecha
There are already tons of demo files you can mess around with and learn from:
[https://www.blender.org/download/demo-
files/](https://www.blender.org/download/demo-files/) :)
------
tombert
Has anyone here used the Blender video editor? How well does it work?
I've been looking to get back into video-production in my free time, but on
Linux the number decent video-editing solutions is limited. I'm looking into
Lightworks, but I'd prefer something FOSS if at all possible.
~~~
burk96
Not FOSS, but I can highly recommend Davinci Resolve. I actually have come to
prefer it over Premiere and Vegas which have been my favorites for over a
decade now. Compared to those two, it just feels like a much more modern, well
polished product. The stability is what has really sold me after having to
save Premiere and Vegas projects after nearly every edit because I never knew
when they would randomly crash. Its free license gives you just about
everything you will need and the multiplatform support is great. I really
recommend you give it a try and see how it suits you.
~~~
spsphulse
A newbie here who plans to learn basic video-editing. I am in a dilemma
whether to go for Davinci Resolve or Adobe Premiere. While the first is free,
I noticed there are very very few assets(LUTs, Lower-thirds, Transitions etc)
that are freely available for DR. Perhaps because it is still in its nascent
stage. Do you happen to know any resources to find such assets for Davinci
Resolve?
------
dman
In case someone from the Blender team is reading this could you share some
pointers on how the ui toolkit for blender 2.80 is implemented? Any files to
start reading / any design docs? Blender is one of the nicer opengl based guis
I have seen and am curious to learn more on how its implemented (fonts for
instance).
~~~
Jasper_
Looks like a custom glyph atlas cache based on top of FreeType [0].
These days I would use HarfBuzz/stb_truetype [1] for a lightweight thing. Use
FreeType if you need something even fancier.
[0]
[https://git.blender.org/gitweb/gitweb.cgi/blender.git/blob/H...](https://git.blender.org/gitweb/gitweb.cgi/blender.git/blob/HEAD:/source/blender/blenfont/intern/blf_glyph.c)
[1] like
[https://gist.github.com/rygorous/6f2779a451d2040371e3acb79e1...](https://gist.github.com/rygorous/6f2779a451d2040371e3acb79e16eaff)
------
pcurve
I used to do a lot of 3d in the 90s so I'm extremely familiar with 3d modeling
concepts. One day I decided to give blender a go after many years of hiatus
and oh boy was it difficult to use even after looking up documentation.
Nothing like maxon cinema 4d. Is blender built on preexisting 3d app UI
convention? Or is it its own animal?
~~~
bananaoomarang
This release is a pretty significant UI overhaul, as was 2.6 from memory but
that was a good few years back. Probably worth giving it another shot with
2.8!
~~~
Causality1
That in particular was my issue when I gave up learning to use Blender. There
are tons and tons of tutorials, but Blender hits a big "randomize" button for
its UI every time it updates. Nothing is ever where the tutorials tell you to
find it. It likely isn't even grouped under the same menu heading anymore.
~~~
wlesieutre
Stick to tutorials from the same 2.x line and there aren't many UI changes.
They've had betas and release candidates for 2.8 for a while now, so there's
already a pretty good body of tutorials available.
Outdated tutorials aren't totally useless, since they'll still give you an
idea of how to approach a modeling problem. But the UI won't match what you're
working in, so I certainly wouldn't recommend them for trying to learn the
software.
~~~
TylerE
There should be a lot of great tutorial content coming out now/soon. I know a
lot of the big training vendors (e.g. cgcookie) have basically been building
for 2.8...lots of new courses and old stuff getting redone and updated.
------
dgellow
Quite excited by the 2D rendering features!
[https://www.blender.org/features/grease-
pencil/](https://www.blender.org/features/grease-pencil/)
------
severine
And they're hiring:
[https://www.blender.org/jobs/](https://www.blender.org/jobs/)
------
xtracerx
Used Maya and cinema 4d for years.. just started switching to Blender because
I heard the buzz around it.. and it is legitimately the biggest win for
consumer open source software by a huge margin. Absolutely great product, I
think I can get workflows as good or better than Maya out of this.. and Maya
costs thousands of dollars a year.
------
danellis
I love Blender. I'm not an artist, even though I've made a few little things
in it, but I still think it's an incredible piece of software and a shining
example of what open source software can be.
------
micah_chatt
One of the things about blender that was frustrating for me when I last tried
it ~3 years ago was the inability to use a different python REPL (ex: iPython)
or easily import the blender python libraries in a non-blender python process.
Can anyone say if this has gotten better?
~~~
UncleEntity
Almost all of bpy is a simple generated wrapper around builtin C functions but
you can (or could, dunno how well its been maintained?) build blender as a
python module to import into CPython. Some experimental CMake setting IIRC.
------
hutzlibu
Does anyone know, what is still missing, to wide professional adoption of
blender in the industry?
Is it at this point mostly momentum of Maya etc. or are there still many small
things, that a professional designer miss in blender?
Or is it bigger? Some time ago, I heard the renderer of blender did not hold
up to the rest, but that has changed?
Some time ago, the blender ren
~~~
atoav
Depends entirely on how you use it. But for many many things it is already
used professionally.
I used Maya as a 3D freelancer for some while and switched to Blender when
Cycles got introduced. I never really regreted that decision. Odly enough the
one point that I liked the most about Blender was its user interface – yeah it
was _weird_ , but it was _consistent_. If "g" moves things in the 3D window it
moves things also in a timeline and in a compositor.
What does Blender need? I think 2.80 has done a lot of what the industry
needs, especially in terms of 2D animation and performance improvements. My
major caveat is, that Compositing with video sources is just slow.
------
darkwater
When I see new releases of art/design/drawing creation products I always envy
the artists that are capable of using them and create beautiful things. I've
always been incapable of anything related to drawing.
I wonder if it is something you can learn by working on it or you just have to
be gifted...
~~~
hapsam
Art is a profession which can be learned, you dont need to be gifted or have
any talent to start. But like with many professions, art takes time and people
underestimate the amount of time which is required to get to a decent level
(multiple years of practise and exercise).
------
Mobius01
I’m really happy to see this. There are so many segments that could benefit
from Blender’s non-existing cost of entry that were running into too much
friction with the user interface and general oddities of it’s interaction
models, and this may help bridge that gap.
------
billfruit
They have done amazing work in building their own UI framework. Perhaps one
day they can make it available as a standalone library, for use as a
crossplatform UI toolkit.
------
ohazi
Congratulations to the Blender developers! This massive release has been years
in the making. I remember watching an interview with Ton Roosendaal just
before the 2.7 release (so 5 years ago? Back then they still thought the next
version was going to be 3.0), and they were talking excitedly about this UI
refresh as if it were just around the corner.
------
smcnally
> Templates > When starting a new file, there is now a choice between multiple
> application templates: ... > Video Editing: for using Blender as a video
> editor.
Video’s a reason I’ve spent time with multiple previous Blender versions. Be
great if this UI refresh + templated defaults create more traction for me and
other video editors.
------
zowanet
I don't suppose there's a torrent/magnet link?
My http download is glacially slow right now...
~~~
nybble41
You can install and run Blender through Steam. There's even a beta channel for
the release candidates. That might get around the slow download issue.
~~~
mottosso
Indeed it did! Barely pressed the download button before it finished, and it's
2.80 as well, as opposed to the previous RC. Already updated on Steam too,
that's quick!
------
ilaksh
Really hopeful for the UI changes.
Crazy question. Is anyone working on a VR interface for Blender?
~~~
makx
[https://www.marui-plugin.com/blender-xr/](https://www.marui-
plugin.com/blender-xr/)
[https://github.com/MARUI-PlugIn/BlenderXR](https://github.com/MARUI-
PlugIn/BlenderXR)
------
vkaku
Whoa :o they made it, Amazing work by the devs.
It looks more like Max now. And I know they did some rework in the whole asset
organization thing.
And they removed the parts that weren't as core, so great job overall. :)
------
v-yadli
As a long time Vim user, the comments here actually encourage me to give it
another try. I once tried it on a tablet, but obviously I missed that it’s
about keystrokes.
------
dekhn
a while ago, before the North American Solar Eclipse, I needed to do some
simulation work on my code that processed eclipse images so I made a toy solar
system from spheres and used it to render views of the eclipse from locations
on earth. Lots of fun. Huge learning curve, but still lots of fun. The only
issue I had was I had to scale everything down 1/10th due to float precision
issues.
------
wy35
It looks so much better! When I tried using Blender it felt really awkward and
the learning curve was really steep. Glad to see this update.
------
TheRealPomax
Really wish I could run it on my my laptop with a Radeon HD 6750M, though.
Instead it's just a blank screen with a spinner for a cursor, which isn't the
greatest experience.
Sure, the minimum requirements are "GCN 1st gen and up", which came out after
the 6750M, but other apps with GPU acceleration work fine with it, and Blender
2.79 also worked fine, so it's kind of shitty to miss out on all the amazing
new stuff that got added to 2.80 =(
------
agumonkey
I think I need an opengl 1.3 laptop now
------
helb
2.8 release page with news & screenshots:
[https://www.blender.org/download/releases/2-80/](https://www.blender.org/download/releases/2-80/)
~~~
harperlee
Thanks! Unfortunately I can edit the title but not the url. Perhaps dang or
other admin can update to this one?
~~~
sctb
We've updated the link from the homepage. Thanks!
------
yodon
previous discussion
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20563491](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20563491)
~~~
orev
That “previous discussion” is mostly people confused about what is going on
because that poster tried to steal their thunder by making the post before the
actual release was announced. That’s not a useful discussion thread.
~~~
Nullabillity
Nobody has a right to compel other people to follow their release schedule.
~~~
liability
No such supposed right was implied...
~~~
Nullabillity
> because that poster tried to steal their thunder by making the post before
> the actual release was announced.
~~~
liability
Saying that one _shouldn 't_ behave in some way is not the same as claiming
they have no right to behave in that way.
------
bla3
Encouraged by the "new, more intuitive UI" points I gave it another try.
Background: I did lots of 3d coding and have used several 3d modeling
packages, all a while ago. I've tried to learn Blender years ago and after
lots of RTFM I could do some things in it back then, but I forgot all about
that.
I still find the 2.80 UI unintuitive. Clicking now selects, which is great,
but it's weird to me that clicking on the background and then dragging doesn't
move the viewport but does a selection box. Neither ctrl-drag nor any other
modifier and drag moved the viewport either. After some more trial and error,
apparently swiping on the trackpad rotates the viewport and shift-drag moves
it, but I couldn't figure out how to dolly after some more trial and error.
IIRC Blender is the only program where I couldn't figure out basic actions
without RTFM. It's a bit better now, but that's still the case.
Don't get me wrong, it's really impressive that they're able to do such a big
UI overhaul! But at least for me, it feels there's still a ways to go.
~~~
avhon1
Middle-click and drag to rotate the viewport
Shift+middle-click to translate the viewport
If you're using a Mac, or a laptop without a three-button trackpad or mouse,
there is an option called "emulate three-button mouse" that lets you use
alt+left-click as an alternative to middle-click. A little clumsy, but
adequate for viewing files on-the-go.
In the new 2.80 UI, there is a set of colored axes in the top-right corner.
Clicking and dragging on those rotates the viewport, and clicking on the ends
of one of the axes aligns the viewport to that axis.
To the left of those axes is a hand-shaped icon. Clicking and dragging on this
icon translates the viewport.
(I'm curious which programs you've used before. This is definitely the same
way you navigate in all of Autodesk's products, and in SolidWorks.)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Meta Rules - DTrejo
http://epistemocrat.blogspot.com/2010/07/david-trejos-m1n1-meta-rules.html
======
dmoney
The rules listed sound like good rules, but I don't think they're meta-rules.
They don't really relate to the creation of other rules.
------
lemoinem
I also fail to catch the "meta" dimension of it... Sounds like a buzzword...
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
July 2012: Objective-C Ranked Higher in Popularity than C++ - cillosis
http://www.tiobe.com/content/paperinfo/tpci/images/tpci_trends.png
======
jballanc
> C++ is used heavily in large high-performance systems whereas Objective-C is
> mainly used in the mobile apps industry.
Try, "Objective-C is mainly used on iOS". If you look at the before-and-after
picture of Obj-C, it is painfully clear that the _only_ reason for its
popularity is iOS. One must wonder what would be possible on the iOS platform
if other languages were given a fair shot at that pie...
~~~
J3L2404
You can write apps in C or C++ on iOS if you like, but the framework (Cocoa)
is everything.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: GitMark – Your GitHub Report Card - jicooo
http://www.gitmark.me/
======
jud_white
Please remove the access to Private Repositories, or make it optional.
~~~
mixonic
[https://api.monosnap.com/rpc/file/download?id=kelMhl0A6kbbaN...](https://api.monosnap.com/rpc/file/download?id=kelMhl0A6kbbaNs8vTWO9Z9oe15g0c)
Haha, yes this is a pretty high bar of entry.
~~~
jicooo
What, you don't trust me with ALL YOUR REPOS? Haha. I know, I mentioned this
permissions thing in the blog post. Building it for myself, that scope is the
only way I could read contributor stats for my company's private repos.
Definitely don't need 90% of the other things, write access especially.
Optional private repository access seems like a good solution.
------
33a
Why does this need write access to my public repos?
~~~
jicooo
It doesn't really need write access, but in order for it to fetch the
contributor stats, I had to add the "repo" scope to the permissions.
Unfortunately, I couldn't see any other way around that. See:
[https://developer.github.com/v3/oauth/#scopes](https://developer.github.com/v3/oauth/#scopes)
------
jicooo
Here's a blog post I wrote about this project:
[https://medium.com/@jico/building-
gitmark-d6a4e193e19](https://medium.com/@jico/building-gitmark-d6a4e193e19)
(it talks about the permissions overkill).
If you want to take a peek at the dashboard without having to grant GitHub
access, here's a screenshot of mine:
[http://i.imgur.com/ufqifkp.jpg](http://i.imgur.com/ufqifkp.jpg)
------
mikeomoto
This kind of functionality would be cool if github adopted it in-house. Having
the read/write access to all public/private repos is a bar that's a bit too
high.
------
burkesquires
Not working for me...says I am not part of any organization but I am a member
of two.
------
iKlsR
Random, how do you draw those charts?
~~~
jicooo
Whoops, I meant to mention that in the blog post. I used Chart.js
[http://www.chartjs.org/](http://www.chartjs.org/).
------
whatnotests
Ummm deploy keys?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Being a Noob - golanggeek
http://www.paulgraham.com/noob.html
======
chalst
Cf. last month's discussion at
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22180374](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22180374)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Navy names aircraft carrier for Dorie Miller, black sailor and Pearl Harbor hero - rmason
https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politics/2020/01/18/navy-names-aircraft-carrier-for-dorie-miller-black-sailor-from-waco-and-unlikely-pearl-harbor-hero/
======
rmason
If you ever visit Pearl Harbor as I have you learn the story of Dorie Miller.
When his ship was attacked he was sent to rescue the captain and then climbed
up the tower and without any training opened up on the Japanese Zero's with a
50 caliber machine gun.
There weren't a lot of heroes that day. My opinion is if he was white he'd
have been on bond drives for the rest of the war. Instead he went back down to
the kitchen on another ship that ended up getting sunk two years later.
It took sixty years for a TV movie to be made about him and another twenty
before he received the honor he was due. A pretty long time for the Navy to
finally get it right.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Carmen Ortiz’s Sordid Rap Sheet - pccampbell
http://whowhatwhy.com/2013/01/17/carmen-ortizs-sordid-rap-sheet/
======
malandrew
"According to the sworn testimony of a DEA agent operating
out of Boston, it was his job to comb through news stories
for properties that might be subject to forfeiture. When he
finds a likely candidate, he goes to the Registry of Deeds,
determines the value of the property in question, and refers
it to the U.S. attorney for seizure."
Seriously? We, as taxpayers, indirectly support a job like that? That's
disgusting. I'm shocked we have someone actively combing to discover assets
the government might be able to seize in court. I'm further shocked that the
accused is under the obligation to prove innocence instead of the other way
around. That's not due process.
~~~
InclinedPlane
Yup. And it's been that way since the '80s. Welcome to the drug war.
Today's quiz in remedial civics: what happens when law enforcement gains the
power to control their own funding depending on the way they enforce the law.
P.S. If you'd like a bit of disheartening theater, read this:
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_v._$124,700>
~~~
saraid216
> Today's quiz in remedial civics: what happens when law enforcement gains the
> power to control their own funding depending on the way they enforce the
> law.
Market-driven police state?
~~~
nirvana
Police operate using violence. Markets operate with free exchange. Thus you
posit a contradiction.
~~~
saraid216
> Thus you posit a contradiction.
What is the sound of one hand clapping?
------
pygy_
The petition asking for Heymann firing still lacks 15.000 votes. From what I
read he was more instrumental than Ortiz in the aggressiveness the
prosecution.
[https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/fire-assistant-
us-...](https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/fire-assistant-us-..).
Sorry for insisting, but I think it's important. I'm not a US citizen, and I
can't vote, the only thing I can do is trumpet it.
Not that the witch hunt is very useful in itself, but it keeps people involved
and the more shit we stir, the most likely things will move.
~~~
pygy_
[https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/fire-assistant-
us-...](https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/fire-assistant-us-attorney-
steve-heymann/RJKSY2nb)
Here's the correct link (too late to edit).
Also, you don't have to be a US citizen to sign (I just read the TOS)!
Thanks to mavhc for pointing out these.
~~~
pccampbell
This is a huge, folks. Please, sign.
------
RyanMcGreal
The way US prosecutors operate - piling on large numbers of felony charges
with decades in maximum sentencing and offering a shorter sentence in exchange
for a guilty plea - is a clear violation of the 8th Amendment.
It's functionally equivalent to using the threat of torture to extract a
confession.
<http://quandyfactory.com/blog/103>
~~~
monochromatic
_a clear violation of the 8th Amendment_
Is that your legal opinion? You know, there are centuries of jurisprudence
exploring the meaning of various constitutional provisions...
~~~
efsavage
You don't need to be a lawyer to have a valid "legal" opinion.
And yes, there are centuries of jurisprudence, but it is always changing,
evolving, and sometimes even reversing to meet the needs of the present.
~~~
monochromatic
_You don't need to be a lawyer to have a valid "legal" opinion._
That's true in the same way that _a broken clock is right twice a day_ is
true.
------
i4i
"Between 1989 and 2010, an estimated $12.6 billion was seized by US Attorneys
in asset forfeiture cases. The growth rate during that time averaged +19.4%
annually. For just 2010 alone, the value of assets seized grew by +52.8% over
2009 and was six times greater than the total for 1989."
<http://www.drugwarfacts.org/cms/forfeiture>
------
wereHamster
"and—under civil law—the burden of proof is on the defense to demonstrate
their property is innocent."
Really? I thought the burden of proof was on the prosecution side to
demonstrate guilt.
~~~
Spooky23
With asset forfeiture, in effect your property is arrested, and property does
not have civil rights.
One well known case in the early 90's was an old black gentlemen who owned a
plant nursery, and was detained at an airport for the crime of being black and
in possession of $30,000. I think the story was featured on 60 Minutes and the
NY Times.
The guy was the son of a sharecropper, was illiterate, did not use checks or
credit cards. He had flown from his home to Texas every year with a bag of
money to buy plants to ship north to sell after becoming too old to drive. He
wasn't committing a crime, so he wasn't arrested -- but his money was kept as
it was considered suspicious by the Federal authorities. It was a catch-22
situation, as litigating against the Feds will cost alot more than $30k.
~~~
jacquesm
'Flying while black'... disgusting.
~~~
pstuart
Just like 'driving while black', or 'walking down the sidewalk while black' --
equally disgusting.
But hey, it doesn't affect me directly so why should I care? /s
------
chris_wot
When I first heard about Carmen Ortiz, I realised there was very, very little
I could do about it, given I am not a U.S. citizen.
A few days later, more out of frustration, I created the following meme:
[http://memecrunch.com/meme/DV7N/carmen-ortiz-for-great-
justi...](http://memecrunch.com/meme/DV7N/carmen-ortiz-for-great-justice)
Image is here:
[http://memecrunch.com/meme/DV7N/carmen-ortiz-for-great-
justi...](http://memecrunch.com/meme/DV7N/carmen-ortiz-for-great-
justice/image.png)
Hopefully someone here finds it darkly amusing.
~~~
DoubleMalt
I share your concern about Carmen Ortiz' fitness for being at a position where
she holds any power whatsoever over people. But your meme distracts from the
real sinister elements of the system that are outlined in the article. It is a
strawman argument that is easily dismissed, which is detrimental to the
discussions.
The system incentivizes abuse of power and coercion of suspects. No one in the
system is honestly interested in absurdly high sentences. hey are only
interested in "winning", which is the main problem.
Competitiveness has its place in sport, in the economy and at hackathons.
But a trial should NEVER be a competition. I am aware that the legal system in
many countries devolved to this. BUt we should not rest to attack this aspect.
------
DanBC
This thread has some comment about the motel case.
(<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5084791>)
------
ScottBurson
Don't overlook the last paragraph.
~~~
bambax
Yes!
> _Thanks to tough-on-crime laws and mandatory-minimum sentencing, prosecutors
> are able to extort—if they so choose—a quick end to the proceedings and a
> headline-worthy admission of guilt._
"Tough-on-crime" is the real culprit -- and it's what a strong majority of
Americans support.
~~~
nirvana
They want toughness on violent crime, not government agents perpetrating
crimes for their own benefit.
These agents _profit_ from destroying people's lives, and they _Break the law_
when they do so.
The problem is, who is going to prosecute the prosecutors? Whose going to
collect evidence? The police who enjoy protection by prosecutors? The judges
who work for the same employer?
~~~
mercurial
But it's all a balancing act. If you vote for a system where disproportionate
penalties are possible, and the incentive to use it as leverage to secure
convictions is built into the system, don't be surprised of the consequences:
it's perfectly predictable. Remove disproportionate sentences and mandatory
minimums, and prosecutes won't be able to exert the same pressure.
------
c3d
No mention of Kim Dotcom or Julian Assange in the story. But that seems like
higher-profile cases with the same kind of bullying tactics.
~~~
fleitz
Her behaviour is by no means uncommon which is why the press is having no
problem digging up other cases in which she leveraged the resources of the
state against those who were defenceless.
Don't think she's particularly evil, she's your everyday average prosecutor.
~~~
javajosh
I don't understand why people keep saying this as if it's an excuse. Just
because everyone does it doesn't make it not evil. When slave-owning was legal
in this country, it was still evil.
~~~
Daniel_Newby
If it was just her, she would have already been assassinated; the cops would
have shook their heads and turned a blind eye because hey, she did need
killin'.
By getting mad at her personally, you are in effect becoming Timothy McVeigh.
He took out an entire building full of feds and _nothing happened_. I'm not
even sure that carpet nuking Washington, D.C. would put a dent in federal
overreach. It's a mass social movement, not a breakdown of part of the system.
~~~
chris_wot
Good Lord, am I ever glad you are being downvoted to oblivion. _Nobody_ so far
has suggested assasination or terrorism to solve these problems. You are the
first (and hopefully the last) to suggest this as a solution.
~~~
Daniel_Newby
D you even read my comment? No, you did not. You read the word "assassinated",
then turned off your logic to indulge in an unregulated emotional response.
At no point did I suggest that anybody be harmed.
So go read my comment.
...
Now, what you read was a conditional statement. The article claims that
prosecutor Ortiz is a bad seed, a "lone gunman theory" of a rogue lawyer who
conducts legal lynchings on her own accord.
What I replied is that _IF_ that hypothesis were true, she would have been
taken out long ago. A lone psychopath simply cannot go around destroying
people's lives in broad daylight. If nothing else, the widow of one of her
victims will do her in. Since she still breathes, the rogue prosecutor theory
is conclusively disproven.
Read the next paragraph of my comment.
Now, Timothy McVeigh had a rogue government theory, just like the article we
are discussing. He thought that if you could just prune back the feds a bit,
do a little gardening, that they would get the message. He obviously failed.
If anything, he made them stronger and more determined. So the theory that
government overreach has anything to do with individual government employees
is very conclusively disproven.
Logically, then, if you believe that naming and shaming prosecutor Ortiz will
help, you are making the same mistake as Timothy McVeigh, and for the same
reasons. The correlation of Ortiz's actions with Aaron's outcome does not
imply causation.
You are glad I am being downvoted into oblivion. Of course you are. You are
part of the system, and the system defends itself against strong statements
about how things actually work. You and your downvoting friends are antibodies
trying to maintain the status quo. You are part of the vast social movement
that has given us asset forfeiture and national bunny rabbit police.
~~~
chris_wot
Faulty logic. If she was an out of control lawyer, then it does not
necessarily follow she would have been "taken out".
------
pccampbell
I'm in MA, and what really drives me crazy is that local TV news sources have
basically made it sound like she's going to still try running for MA Governor.
Essentially, she's using her public statement to sugar coat and bury the story
amongst folks that aren't familiar with Aaron.
------
rusodepaso
The arrogance and basic lack of human decency, on the part of Carmen Ortiz and
her lackeys, are really stunning. Aaron Swartz is not the only case her office
mishandled: see Carmen Ortiz’s Sordid Rap Sheet,
[http://whowhatwhy.com/2013/01/17/carmen-ortizs-sordid-rap-
sh...](http://whowhatwhy.com/2013/01/17/carmen-ortizs-sordid-rap-sheet/)
Petition the Obama administration to: Remove United States District Attorney
Carmen Ortiz from office for overreach in the case of Aaron Swartz
[https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/remove-united-
stat...](https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/remove-united-states-
district-attorney-carmen-ortiz-office-overreach-case-aaron-swartz/RQNrG1Ck)
------
barking
It doesn't sound quite so paranoid anymore to arm oneself to the teeth and
retreat to a wilderness redoubt in Montana.
------
venomsnake
The ceasing of the property - doesn't that make Mrs Ortiz guilty of RICO
herself?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
CA Supreme Court to review Brian Reid's age-discrimination case against Google - dctoedt
http://www.mercurynews.com/traffic/ci_15147417?nclick_check=1
======
mccutchen
Link doesn't work for me with the querystring parameter. Try this instead:
<http://www.mercurynews.com/traffic/ci_15147417>
------
xenophanes
Meh, making people hire (or not fire) those they don't like is evil. If I
don't want to spend my money on this guy, I shouldn't have to. If the reason I
don't want to is that I'm ageist -- well, so what? Yeah that sucks for both of
us, but making ageists spend tons of money to hire old people they don't want
to be around, or making racists spend tons of money to hire black people, or
whatever, is no solution.
~~~
reader5000
Because society is better off if your irrationality is overridden.
~~~
xenophanes
Is it? This policy:
1) hurts ageists, racists, etc (that's quite a lot of people, counting mild
cases)
2) discourages ageists from starting businesses
3) discourages ageists from hiring anyone
4) makes old people feel entitled to work at ageist businesses, when perhaps
it'd be better if they didn't expect to be able to work anywhere and put more
effort into finding a better fit
5) harms productivity and therefore the economy (via making some people
uncomfortable at their own business)
6) makes it hard to fire old, black, gay, female, etc, persons for vague but
legitimate reasons, or reasons one doesn't want to tell them
On the other hand, if an ageist doesn't hire an old guy who was best for the
job then the harm done is roughly:
1) the old guy gets the second best job available to him
2) the company gets the second best employee available to them
That's only a small inefficiency.
~~~
nir
_1) hurts ageists, racists, etc (that's quite a lot of people, counting mild
cases)
2) discourages ageists from starting businesses
3) discourages ageists from hiring anyone _
Well, they can not apply their ageist, racist views in the workplace. It's not
a basic civil right to be an ageist or racist.
_4) makes old people feel entitled to work at ageist businesses, when perhaps
it'd be better if they didn't expect to be able to work anywhere and put more
effort into finding a better fit_
Why? The case in question will be decided (I assume) on whether the employee
was fired due to his age or productivity.
_5) harms productivity and therefore the economy (via making some people
uncomfortable at their own business)_
Productivity is harmed when people like the guy in this story can't get a job,
too. Seems to me if you don't exclude people from certain jobs based on
irrelevant parameters, economy usually benefits.
_6) makes it hard to fire old, black, gay, female, etc, persons for vague but
legitimate reasons, or reasons one doesn't want to tell them_
I doubt old, black, gay, female employees are particularly hard to fire, at
least in the US.
_1) the old guy gets the second best job available to him_
These issues usually rise when it's not the rare case but the common case. So,
the old guy will not get the second best job but perhaps the twentieth best
job, or none at all. Take a look around you (assuming you work in software)
and count how many people over 50 you see.
~~~
Dove
There is not a simple answer to the conundrum, but I agree with xenophanes in
my preference: I would rather working relationships remained totally
voluntary, however stupid people's reasoning may be.
You are right that when unfair discrimination (or any stupid opinion in
general) is widespread, the result is unjust--and can even cross the line from
annoyance to injury. Small affronts can add up to oppression; death by a
thousand cuts. I wish there were a form of redress beyond making papercuts
illegal (something I'd rather not do).
The main consolation I see is that making the action illegal may not help much
except in marginal cases. If the law says one thing and society widely
believes another, the latter is going to rule what actually happens--either
through legislative change or jury selection or selective reporting or
something. I believe the only real secure refuge from widespread
discrimination is victory in the court of public opinion. One must rely on the
natural justice of the cause and prove naysayers wrong.
It is not complete protection, but I think it more just than the alternative:
making a particular _motivation_ for hiring or firing illegal. It is important
to me that economic transactions be totally voluntary for both parties. And it
is very important to me that private people be able to hold and act upon
stupid beliefs. The invasion becomes particularly evident if I turn the
situation around: Would I want to defend my actions before a court? Would I
want a lawyer examining my motivation behind hiring this plumber, quitting
that job, or buying a third car, to ensure they are not tainted by some
vestige of racism? Heaven forbid!
I don't have a great answer for it. But I think, weighing the two harms, I
would rather suffer under misguided, widespread discrimination than permit the
courts to question the beliefs and motivations that go into a private
transaction. The former is an evil that I think I am willing to consciously
accept as the price of the latter freedom.
------
_delirium
some discussion from yesterday: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1373802>
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Amazon rainforest was home to millions of people before European arrival - soneca
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn27945-myth-of-pristine-amazon-rainforest-busted-as-old-cities-reappear/
======
davidw
I recall reading about this some in the book 1491, which is quite interesting,
and talks about how the Americas were prior to Columbus.
[http://amzn.to/1HQYgSY](http://amzn.to/1HQYgSY)
~~~
benbreen
Seconding this recommendation - I'm planning on assigning this book in a
college course on the Columbian Exchange next year. It's got the readability
of a longform New Yorker article and the scholarly credibility of an academic
book. Totally fascinating material that will up end much of what you learned
in high school textbooks.
~~~
moultano
Thirded. It took me years to become interested in history, and books like this
are what finally broke through.
~~~
marai2
I don't mean to hijack this thread, but I too wasn't interested in history at
all until I read this book: The Prize: The Epic Quest for Oil, Money & Power (
[http://www.amazon.com/Prize-Epic-Quest-Money-
Power/dp/143911...](http://www.amazon.com/Prize-Epic-Quest-Money-
Power/dp/1439110123)) Which was a fascinating history from the rise of oil in
modern times uptil the first Gulf War. I would love recommendations on other
history books that got people turned onto history?
~~~
benbreen
I actually got into history through visual sources and maps, like Colin
McEvedy's "Penguin Atlas of Medieval History." But the history books that I
remember really changing my life include Simon Schama's "The Embarrassment of
Riches" (a fantastic history of the rise and fall of the Dutch empire), Alfred
Crosby's "Ecological Imperialism" (similar to 1491, but more wide-ranging),
and Fernand Braudel's Civilization and Capitalism series (the best history
books of the 20th century, in my view).
I also remember loving John Brewer's "The Pleasures of the Imagination:
English Culture in the 18th Century" and Mario Biagioli's "Galileo Courtier."
Also "Mad Blood Stirring" by Edward Muir, which tackles the question of why
16th century Italian street life was so incredibly violent.
Edit: seems apropos to mention that a couple friends of mine are about to
launch a site for historians to curate lists of their favorite books on key
topics, called Backlist: [http://backlist.cc](http://backlist.cc)
~~~
thaumasiotes
> I actually got into history through visual sources and maps
I've noticed that fantasy novels often include maps of the fictional geography
of the world, and fantasy authors sometimes write introductions basically on
the theme "I've always loved maps and thought they were special". Personally,
I've never really looked at those omnipresent maps, because they never matter
in the story.
On the other hand, maps are incredibly useful when reading history. Or they
would be... but history books almost never include them!
------
clock_tower
Following _1491_: home to millions of people, the jungle mostly consisting of
fruit-bearing trees (the modern Amazonian tribes are living in overgrown
orchards), and in possession of miraculous sanitation/fertilizer technology.
Everyone should know about terra preta. It turns out it wasn't a soil-
enrichment technique, it was sanitation with a side effect of soil enrichment
-- and could be very applicable in the developing world (and the developed
world!) today. An experiment in Germany -- look up the paper "Terra Preta
Sanitation" \-- showed that a slightly modified method of terra-preta
production can sanitize human waste to well within First World standards.
~~~
alisson
Terra preta is formed naturally by falling fruits, leaves and branches that
get composted on the soil. There's a agriculture method called agroforestry
that make use of this concept, it's very promising for organic farms:
[https://vimeo.com/146953911](https://vimeo.com/146953911)
I know a couple of people here who have "dry bathrooms" (or banheiro seco)
that is just a bucket to collect the poo, when you poo you cover it with dry
leaves or grinded wood (they are the source of carbon, and stop the bad
smell), when the bucket fills up they take it to an area outside far from the
house where it will compost, naturally kill the pathogens (because of the heat
it produces) and became terra-preta, much better solution than to send it down
stream, easier to decentralize and the end result is the best product you
could have.
~~~
cylinder714
_The Humanure Handbook_
([http://humanurehandbook.com/](http://humanurehandbook.com/)) goes into the
specifics of how to build sawdust toilets and manage waste and compost safely.
For those even remotely interested, the e-book is only USD$10, and earlier
editions are free for the downloading.
If you know someone who lives in the country and is interested in off-the-grid
living, or is merely serious about gardening, a copy would make for an unusual
gift.
~~~
green7ea
I've read this book and strongly recommend it. The subject matter is not the
easiest to write about but the author really does a great job, approaching it
in an educative and interesting way. He also clearly demonstrates that this is
something important to our civilization as a whole and that ignoring it
because it is uncomfortable is a mistake.
------
jccooper
There is also good evidence that there were extensive agricultural urban
civilizations around and along the Mississippi. But they were so thoroughly
destroyed (by the Little Ice Age, drought, and disease) that by the time
European settlers got to those territories, even the descendant peoples had no
memory of them. Only a handful of early explorers recorded them, and the
principal archaeological traces are earth mounds (some rather large) built in
their cities. For quite some time the "Mound Builders" were thought to be a
different people entirely from the present native peoples.
------
tosseraccount
Original paper here :
[http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/282/1812/2015...](http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/282/1812/20150813)
"Here, we review the evidence of an anthropogenic Amazonia"
------
tosseraccount
side note on Amazon Indians: [http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-
nature/dna-search-firs...](http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/dna-
search-first-americans-links-amazon-indigenous-australians-180955976/?no-ist)
DNA Search for the First Americans Links Amazon Groups to Indigenous
Australians. a researcher in Reich’s lab, noticed that the Suruí and Karitiana
people of the Amazon had stronger ties to indigenous groups in
Australasia—Australians, New Guineans and Andaman Islanders—than to
Eurasians."
I wonder how much was lost by the Amazon peoples by the invasions of the
Clovis peoples from Siberia.
------
duaneb
While it's probably in the millions, all projected numbers are extremely rough
and work by calculating the percentage likely to have die died in the disease
that swept the continent. DO NOT VIEW THEM AS PRECISE OR ACCURATE.
However, the evidence seems pretty convincing that the vast majority of the
indigenous people died in the centuries following spanish contact.
------
dghughes
Supposedly when Europeans (the later arrivals not Vikings) showed up and
disease spread killing many First Nations/Native Americans it caused a
dramatic environmental shift.
As forests took over the former areas where the first peoples of the Americas
lived trees sucked up a lot of CO2 causing the mini ice age in Europe.
Interesting if true, yet of course very sad as well but if true that pretty
incredible to think of such a connection.
~~~
facepalm
That must be a joke?
~~~
datenwolf
No it's not. The little ice-age is a well documented period of time of below
average temperatures at the end/after the medival ages
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Ice_Age](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Ice_Age)
There's still a lot of speculation going on, what caused it, because the
explanation for the "Big" ice ages (the periodic tilting of the Earth's axis
reaching a position that gives to a colder climate) doesn't fit. So there are
a lot of possible explanations.
From archeological evidence we know that in the timeframe before the little
ice-age begain large parts of the North American population fell victim to
disease and/or famine, so one proposed model is, that the regrowth of forrests
on (fertile) ground left unmanaged by the decreasing population sucked out a
lot of CO2 from the atmosphere.
------
jMyles
When I think about the Amazon rainforest and those who have called it home in
the past 500 years - especially as we learn that they were more advanced than
we had supposed - I think back to Terence McKenna's dying hope to save the
plant medicines that are being forgotten and eradicated with deforestation.
We have no idea what manner of spiritually relevant plants are falling into
obscurity cum annihilation, and given the resurgent interest in (and power of)
ayahuasca, it's worth taking action to document and remember them.
------
redwood
Similar levels of density were reported around the Mississippi river delta
------
gp7
With a little digging you can trace back the development of the consenus
surrounding this issue over the past 25 years or so, which would probably be
worth an article on its own.
------
dang
Url changed from [http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/amazon-
rain...](http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/amazon-rainforest-
was-home-to-millions-of-people-before-european-arrival-says-
study-10412030.html).
------
patrickfl
When I first saw this post I thought (Amazon.com) came out with a new product
called "rainforest."
Anyway, so did the natives breed with the Europeans when they "wiped them out"
or did the native people migrate to another part of the continent?
~~~
Symmetry
Basically malaria was unknown in the Americas before western explorers brought
it over. From there it became very prevalent in some places such as the Amazon
and essentially made mass agriculture impossible there. Then pretty much
everyone starved. There were also things like smallpox that devastated people
everywhere in the Americas but those were more a one time thing, people were
able to rebuild after they passed.
~~~
cubano
Isn't a devastating, long-term drought a recent and popular theory as well,
decimating many Central and South American tribes such as the Mayans and the
Aztec?
[1][http://science.time.com/2012/11/09/mayans/](http://science.time.com/2012/11/09/mayans/)
~~~
duaneb
I believe the drought predated contact by ~7-800 years. Definitely explains
the decline of the Mayans, but not really relevant to discussing the effects
of Columbian contact.
------
cowardlydragon
Why is it this article has the vague overtone of "so we can go ahead and chop
it all down, right?" on it?
I think it's the "pristine myth" language. Just reeks of let-us-clear-cut-it
mentality.
~~~
CPLX
I don't get that at all. I got the "how presumptuous of Europeans to think
that they brought civilization to the area, it was already there and if
anything they may have set back the pace of progress."
------
adamkochanowicz
Wow, Amazon has so many products.
------
rogerbinns
I do wish the historians/reporters for this article were more accurate in
their use of "decimation".
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decimation_(Roman_army)#Curren...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decimation_\(Roman_army\)#Current_usage_of_the_word)
The 1491 book put the death rates at around 1 in 20 surviving - ie 19 out of
every 20 people dying from disease etc.
~~~
graeme
The definition "destroy a large number of" has been around for centuries.
You're contradicting long established usage, while pretending to appeal to it.
~~~
rogerbinns
I am not contradicting it. From their context it was not possible to tell if
they meant the deaths of 1 in 10, a number similar to that, about half of all
people, 9 in 10, 99 in 100 etc. I gave the proportions as remembered from the
book as that gives a far clearer picture.
~~~
graeme
Here's the dictionary definition of decimate. The primary definition is
"destroy a large number of". This isn't recent - I looked it up in the full
OED and it's been around for centuries.
[http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/decimat...](http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/decimate)
------
meira
Great content!
------
EGreg
I wonder if any of this can be used to answer the objections to Biblical
stories like Noah's flood: "how did the rainforest come about in a mere 4000
years?" And here we read that the forests were domesticated in the last 3000.
~~~
crpatino
Many ancient cultures have myths about a great flood or series of floods. It
was probably not a single global event, but plausibly to have been based in
some shift in climate patterns during protohistoric times.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
CDC director: Keeping schools closed greater health threat to children reopening - mrfusion
https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/506640-cdc-director-keeping-schools-closed-poses-greater-health-threat-to-children
======
fabian2k
Keeping the schools closed has a high cost, and it is likely to exacerbate
many problems for weaker students, or students that don't have an ideal
situation at home with strong support from their parents and easy access to
all the stuff you need for remote learning.
But there isn't really a choice in many parts in the US unless you're willing
to let the pandemic run its course and kill as many people as it takes to get
to herd immunity. The only way to safely reopen schools is to suppress the
virus enough that you can contain it with contact tracing. If you can't do
that, there's no way to safely reopen schools in full. You can try
alternatives like e.g. teaching outside, using masks, but they're not entirely
safe, difficult to do and can't really work at 100% capacity.
~~~
nradov
Safety is not a binary condition. The risk will be higher than it was last
year no matter what we do. Keeping schools closed indefinitely is obviously
untenable. Since they have to reopen eventually, there's nothing to be gained
by waiting.
~~~
xref
I don’t think anyone is advocating keeping schools closed until the heat death
of the universe, and there is a lot to be gained by waiting when you’re
somewhere in the middle of a pandemic.
Hence the ongoing conversation about striking the right balance which is very
much going to be regional and fluid.
~~~
nradov
How will we know when we're in the middle, and how long will that take?
~~~
xref
Welcome to the ongoing conversation!
------
thih9
> "I think really people underestimate the public health consequences of
> having the schools closed on the kids," Redfield said
Did he name these consequences?
I couldn’t spot that in the article. Did someone find that or does anyone have
a quote from elsewhere?
Preferably no speculation; a direct quote or a summary of his statement would
be ideal.
~~~
verdverm
One example I know of is school meals for low income students.
My brother, a teacher, was telling me about socialization and brain
development in adolescents. There is a definite impact that we have very
little understanding of.
~~~
piotrkaminski
Why does it seem like everyone assumes you can only socialize in school? I
don't think homeschooled kids are particularly deficient in this regard
either.
~~~
dx87
That's highly dependent on the parents. A lot of homeschooled kids end up
normal, but the stereotype of homeshooled kids not knowing how to behave in a
social setting exists for a reason. It'll be even worse in the current
situation where you have parents that are working full time and don't have
time to also organize social activities like the parents who intentionally did
homeschooling.
------
jshaqaw
Keeping schools closed is horrific for my children. That said all of these
brave warriors demanding schools reopen from behind the keyboards of their
socially distanced houses should have to spend a day to two a week working in
the schools and expose themselves as adults to that environment. Our teachers
and other educational workers are not disposable. Moreover our school is
facing a 20 percent budget cut while being tasked with converting to hospital
grade PPE/distancing. Utterly unrealistic.
~~~
mercer
That's a good point. Over here (NL) things have been slowly opening up, to the
point where to many of us it feels like things are 'back to normal'.
Nonetheless, when it comes to schools reopening, as I understand it, one of
the big problems is that many teachers aren't quite as comfortable going 'back
to normal'.
~~~
jshaqaw
I'm writing from NYC. My wife is the Principal of a school here. Schools are
being given almost no support or guidance at any level from local to federal.
Educational administrators are being told to open schools ensuring student and
staff safety without a shred of fiscal support or health science guidance. The
physical infrastructure of the schools can't possibly handle the distancing
requirements being imposed. My wife is being presented with a Kobayashi Maru
here but with the real lives of children, staff, and extended families on the
line. I am 110% sympathetic to the importance of getting kids back in school.
My kids are suffering from social and educational withdrawal. When schools
even partially reopen I'll be solo with the kids on their home days as my wife
is back running her school. Not exactly an environment conducive to productive
work or my kids' mental health. But the idea that we can just ram through re-
openings prematurely is insane. It is double insane that at this time the
Federal government is bailing out every private sector millionaire in creation
via PPP while schools are being forced to cut budgets by catastrophic amounts.
------
xyst
We have already seen what happened when the bars and restaurants re-opened
(increase in infections and deaths). I imagine we won't see anything different
when the schools re-open. So this seems incredibly shortsighted to me.
It's sad that the administration is willing to sacrifice the teachers, misc
school staff, parents and children for short term gains.
Not only are we endangering human lives, but we are risking prolonging this
disease which will continue to ravage the economy. If you think it's bad now,
imagine what it will be like in 2021 if we continue at this rate.
Why can't we continue with e-learning for the first half of school and
reassess the situation as we approach 2021?
~~~
ryandrake
The sad and frustrating thing is we know how to beat this disease: STAY HOME,
wear a mask when you absolutely have to go out, contact tracing. But Americans
just won’t do these simple things. They’ve got to go get their nails done, and
eat at their restaurants, and walk around flexing their freedom, and by
whatever means possible _own the libs_. Then they wonder why we have so many
cases and deaths and can’t open schools without the apocalypse happening. I’m
pretty much out of empathy at this point. We are missing out on an entire year
because people won’t put a piece of cloth over their face.
------
sjg007
I don’t get it, kids have 3 months off in summer. Do we just ignore them
during those times. They still have meal requirements and issues at home.
Delay school start at a minimum until we can get our positivity rates down.
The Feds could feed kids who need it.. it seems like a false narrative to
focus on kids here. Am I wrong? Congress could do a lot more and save the day.
~~~
ceejayoz
> Do we just ignore them during those times.
Working parents tend to send them to summer camp... which have also been
closed.
~~~
tzs
Even accounting for children sent to camp, there are a lot of children left to
deal with.
In the US, about ~20% of children attend summer camp in a given year (that
includes both day camps and overnight camps). For children from poor families
it's down around 7%. 38% for children from affluent families.
Also, of those who do go to camp many of them go to camps that do not last the
entire summer.
------
Blackthorn
What about the threat to all the adults?
Lots of teachers. Janitors. Chefs. Administrators. Support staff.
~~~
vvanders
Yeah, the push to re-open schools just seems like a bad idea on multiple
fronts, this part included.
A few teachers I follow are being asked to name someone who can "replace" them
if they contract covid. I can't wrap my head around putting people in harm's
way like that willingly when we don't have any control over the outbreak.
~~~
claudeganon
School districts are already preparing form letters for when kids and teachers
die. It’s the height of nihilism when compared to what countries in SE Asia
have accomplished in stopping the disease.
~~~
Blackthorn
Amazing that they pay them like crap and then expect them to put their lives
on the line. I have no idea why anyone would ever bother becoming a teacher in
2020.
~~~
baldfat
This goes back 25 years. It is even more so if you are the first in your
family to go to college. There will be a huge shortage of teachers and there
already is a HUGE diversity problem with most minority groups do not go to
school for teaching as a profession.
------
ceejayoz
> The American Academy of Pediatrics has also called for students to return to
> classrooms, citing the educational and social harms to children of being
> away from school for a prolonged period of time.
They walked this back on Friday.
[https://www.wbur.org/npr/889848834/nations-pediatricians-
wal...](https://www.wbur.org/npr/889848834/nations-pediatricians-walk-back-
support-for-in-person-school)
~~~
dx87
It doesn't sound like they walked it back, but clarified their statement. They
still think the goal should be to get kids physically in schools, they just
emphasized that it shouldn't be done based only on political reasons.
------
claudeganon
> "I don't think we should go overboard in trying to develop a system that
> doesn't recognize the reality that this virus really is relatively benign to
> those of us that are under the age of 20”
Great. How about their teachers and school staff, parents and extended family?
What are the consequences of watching you’re teachers get seriously ill or
die, losing a grandparent, or your mom or dad? Also, novel disease so we don’t
actually know the long term consequences for children or anyone else.
3 teachers in Arizona tried to be extra precautious and do in person
instruction over the summer. Now, one of them is dead from COVID:
[https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-
education...](https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/arizona-
education/2020/07/09/after-arizona-teacher-kim-byrd-dies-covid-questions-
raised-over-school-reopening/5405651002/)
------
codefreakxff
Why is this being posed as either closing the schools and kids get no
education or making kids go to school with expensive mitigations, and masks,
etc. Why hasn't there been a serious effort at converting to online learning
just like the transitions that happening around working remotely?
~~~
nradov
Online learning isn't effective for most small children.
~~~
treeman79
I have 2 ADD children. I’m ADD myself. Yea at home learn is a nightmare.
Someone had to sit with kid entire time. Even when video camera is on with
teacher
------
baldfat
Why are teachers never even entered into the equation? You have no teachers
you don't have school. Teachers getting sick is going to put a serious hurt on
the educational system.
Teachers have been demonized for decades now so hardly anyone is going into
the field.
~~~
avancemos
“Teachers have been demonized for decades” Lol
~~~
baldfat
Teachers have been the enemy for decades.
[https://www.huffpost.com/entry/why-america-demonizes-its-
tea...](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/why-america-demonizes-its-
teachers_b_7463084)
------
cs702
There is ZERO mention of any data or research in this article providing any
evidence that this decision is a good one.
It _may_ be a good decision, BUT it hasn't been justified, as far as I can
tell.
Moreover, the article quotes school administrators, teachers, and their
representatives stating in no uncertain terms that schools in the US do _not_
yet have the resources necessary for reopening safely.
What the heck?
~~~
lostlogin
There is no mention of the risk to teachers health either. It likely varies a
lot country to country and region to region, but there are a significant
number of of old teachers. However a brief look at the average age of the US
teaching workforce shows a slightly younger teaching workforce than I'd have
expected which presumably helps a little. One upside of the distinct gender
bias in the teaching workforce is that females seem to fare better when they
get corona virus, so there is that.
[https://nces.ed.gov/surveys/sass/tables/state_2004_19.asp](https://nces.ed.gov/surveys/sass/tables/state_2004_19.asp)
[https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpubh.2020.0015...](https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpubh.2020.00152/full)
------
foogazi
Why not partial reopening?
Kids that don’t have caretakers during the day go to reduced attendance
classes
Kids that have someone to look after them can do online or go a couple of days
a week
Fortunately decisions like this are up to the local school districts and
parents - adjustments have to be made
------
pornel
This is a political opinion, not a scientific one. He's Trump's appointee, and
his credentials are in line with the rest of them:
> _Robert Redfield is a sloppy scientist with a long history of scientific
> misconduct and an extreme religious agenda._
[https://cspinet.org/news/cspi-urges-administration-not-
appoi...](https://cspinet.org/news/cspi-urges-administration-not-appoint-dr-
robert-redfield-history-scientific-misconduct-cdc)
------
moreorless
All I am hearing from this is, "We must reopen the economy."
------
mindslight
CDC director, _after_ being pushed by the grim reaper in chief. The federal
agency's initial advice can be taken as useful, but once there has been time
for the marching orders to come down, it's better seen as outright harmful.
Unfortunately that won't stop a lot of people in red states from dying, as
their corrupt leaders point to the harmful misinformation when implementing
their own backwards agendas.
~~~
mindslight
I wrote a reply to a comment that was deleted before I hit submit. It linked
[https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-
updates/2020/0...](https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-
updates/2020/06/29/884638999/u-s-pediatricians-call-for-in-person-school-this-
fall) . Given the downvotes my comment is receiving, I'll post it to clarify:
I'm not saying that the pediatricians are wrong, or even that the headline of
"Keeping schools closed greater health threat to children reopening" is false
_in a vacuum_. The problem is the narrow emphasis, ultimately to support a
counterproductive political agenda. The pediatricians' quote includes the
caveat "wherever and whenever they can do so safely", which will surely be
ignored, especially in underfunded school systems.
The fact is that the US is basically still at the _beginning_ of our dealing
with COVID-19, due a lack of societal and political will to confront the
challenge. I too hope that it does magically go away due to a vaccine,
silently-growing herd immunity, etc. But it's foolish to adopt hope as a plan
of action, as opposed to acknowledging the problem and doing the hard work to
address it.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: Single-file components for React - MunGell
https://github.com/digitalie/one-loader
======
MunGell
I am using Vue and React on a couple of projects and found it convenient to
have Vue components contained in a single file.
As an experiment, I've created a Webpack loader to allow combining styling and
React code in a single file.
This is not production-ready and could be redundant for inline-styled
components (in its current state anyways).
Feedback is welcome.
------
tlb
I really need syntax highlighting and tab-completion within CSS, because CSS
and I don't have a mutual understanding. Atom does this natively within .css
files -- is it easy to make it work for JSX-embedded stylesheets?
~~~
btown
See syntax highlighting section here: [https://github.com/zeit/styled-
jsx/blob/master/readme.md](https://github.com/zeit/styled-
jsx/blob/master/readme.md)
------
peternicky
Upvoted because I like experimentation however I still cannot think of a
reason to structure react components in this style. Is this more of an
exercise to port an idea you like from Vue into React?
~~~
MunGell
I liked the idea of how Vue components combine business logic and styling code
in one file using HTML-like wrappers.
As I mentioned in a comment below I realise there is already a number of ways
to approach the problem. I personally didn't find any of the ones that I am
aware of being as convenient, so I've created and published this experimental
loader to see if it 1. would actually work for React and 2. if someone else
finds this concept interesting/convenient.
------
spankalee
Another example of why we need HTML Modules:
[https://github.com/w3c/webcomponents/issues/645](https://github.com/w3c/webcomponents/issues/645)
------
devdad
Not to be rude, but I fail to see what the use case is for this. You can
already use CSS in React and a component is often CSS, JS and JSX. What's the
win here?
~~~
MunGell
Hi @devdad,
Thanks for your feedback!
I guess you mean CSS-in-JS approaches where CSS is either put inside JS code
as a template literals/string (styled-components, csjs etc) or as inline
styles with JS objects (Radium etc.). Both approaches have their own
advantages and disadvantages.
It could be only me, but I personally don't like the idea of having inline
styles, although I realise it could be the only way to make styles cross-
platform.
The string approach works well and has additional advantage of dynamic
property values (in case of template literals). However, (and this is IMHO
again), I can't say this is the most readable way to structure code,
especially if you rely on IDE/text editor identifying this code as CSS.
There is a third approach, which is basically putting <style> tag right in JSX
component, but this then gets repeated with every component you put on the
page. Thus, I wouldn't consider this as an approach at all.
Let me know if I missed anything above.
My initial intention was to create a way to get styling and JS/JSX code
together in one file in a way that would keep code readable and reusable.
This experiment does not tick all the boxes for the cross-platform, easy to
write and read reusable way of combining styles and JS code in one file.
However, the concept could be convenient in some cases where cross-platform-
ness is not a requirement and styles are already written in CSS.
As I mentioned, one-loader was inspired by vue-loader, which I found
convenient for the purpose of storing css and js code in one file.
Hope that makes sense
~~~
akawry
What about just importing the css file from your component file?
For example, in MyComponent.js, you have:
import './MyComponent.css';
const MyComponent = () => (
<div className="my-class">I'm a component!</div>
);
and in MyComponent.css,
.my-class {
color: red;
}
To handle proper scoping, you could use something like css-modules or wrap
each component in a top-level <div> with a component-specific class name. For
example:
const MyComponent = () => (
<div className="MyComponent">
<div className="content">
I'm a component
</div>
</div>
);
and then
.MyComponent.content {
color: red;
}
If you use a preprocessor like sass, you can just nest your entire component-
specific styles like this:
.MyComponent
.content
color: red
.footer
color: blue
~~~
MunGell
I use this approach in most cases combining it with BEM class naming. However,
the point of having single-file components it to have all the required code in
one file, including CSS/styling.
------
spraak
For a similar but more comprehensive approach, try zeit/next
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Russian nuclear submarine: Norway finds big radiation leak - herendin2
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-48949113
======
herendin2
In case of misunderstanding, the sub is K-278, the big nuclear-armed and
nuclear-powered Komsomolets, which was lost at 1680 meters in 1989. It isn't
the smaller sub that recently had an accident, also in the Barents Sea, but
did not sink.
~~~
Areading314
I believe the smaller one was called the Kursk
~~~
jlgaddis
> _The Komsomolets sank in the Norwegian Sea in 1989 after a fire on board
> killed 42 sailors._
~~~
Areading314
No, the smaller, more recent one that was mentioned
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kursk_submarine_disaster](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kursk_submarine_disaster)
~~~
ceejayoz
The Kursk sank.
This is the one, I think:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_submarine_Losharik](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_submarine_Losharik)
------
whenchamenia
Title 'Big radiation leak'
Body 'nothing alarming'
Thanks BBC.
~~~
superhuzza
The radiation level is '800,000 times higher than normal'. Objectively
speaking, that's a big leak. It's just not anywhere that important.
~~~
manfredo
Not if normal is close to zero.
"Homicide rates tripled in the last year!" could easily mean 3 people got
killed when last year was one. Never trust a proportional statement when the
baseline is not provided.
In this case, a pipe was measured to be leaking 800 becquerels per lite. One
Curie is 37 trillion becquerels. It's 46 millionths of a Curie. A fatal dose
is usually measured in the thousandths of a Curie. This is incredibly benign,
and probably drops to difficult-to-detect levels 100 meters from the
submarine.
Really, this article strikes me as low effort at best, fear mongering at
worst.
~~~
superhuzza
After reading your comment and some other articles, you're right.
I guess I was just shocked by the relative difference even if it was fairly
meaningless in reality.
------
demarq
Aren't those nuclear missles technology that should be recovered or guarded?
~~~
ceejayoz
At a mile below the surface, it's probably safer (from human malicious actors)
there than pretty much anywhere in Russia.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Can behaviors really be contagious? - brahmwg
https://www.sciencenews.org/blog/scicurious/running-contagious-among-those-competitive-bug
======
dozzie
Yes. An example from 250 years ago is spelling "behaviour" as "behavior" that
infected whole US.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
An incredibly simple solution to plastic packaging waste - mreome
https://www.treehugger.com/plastic/incredibly-simple-solution-plastic-packaging-waste.html
======
erkose
Most of these products are vanity items that we should not even bother
producing. For my part, I still purchase Gatorade in powder form. 8 gallons
for $10 save both money and plastic.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
A Quantum Leap for the Web - Manishearth
https://medium.com/mozilla-tech/a-quantum-leap-for-the-web-a3b7174b3c12
======
dherman
[disclaimer: I co-founded Mozilla Research, which sponsors Servo]
It's awesome to see the Gecko team continue to tackle big, ambitious projects
now that electrolysis is rolling out. And I'm so excited that they're betting
big on Servo and Rust. Servo has really been taking advantage of one of Rust's
promises: that you can reach for more aggressive parallelism and actually
maintain it. I believe recent numbers showed that effectively all of Firefox's
users have at least two cores, and about half have at least 4. The more we
fully utilize those cores, the smoother we should be able to make the whole
web.
Over the last year, all three communities have been laying groundwork to be
able to land Rust components in Firefox and share components between Gecko and
Servo, and now it looks like that's teed the Gecko team up to commit to making
use of some big pieces of Servo in the coming year. Some of the initial builds
of Firefox with Stylo that Bobby Holley has showed me look really amazing, and
WebRender could be a game-changer.
And the Servo project is just getting warmed up. ;) If you're interested in
what they're up to next, check out Jack Moffitt's recent presentation from a
browser developer workshop last month:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PL4sEzdAGvRgCYXot-o5cVKOo...](https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PL4sEzdAGvRgCYXot-o5cVKOobIXZI5iLF&v=UGl9VVIOo3E)
~~~
the8472
> The more we fully utilize those cores, the smoother we should be able to
> make the whole web.
I wonder why the GC/CC are not multithreaded though. It seems like those are
fairly isolated components, considering the entire application gets suspended
so they can do their job, i.e. prime candidates for parallelism.
When forcing a collection on a large firefox instance it can easily spend 20+
seconds collecting on a single thread while a java VM can munch churn through
something like 1 gigabyte per second per core.
In other words, from the outside it looks like a low-hanging fruit that has
not been plucked.
~~~
mccr8
Writing a parallel GC surely is not "low-hanging fruit" by any reasonable
measure. Java already has to deal with concurrency in their objects, and
throughput is more of a concern for server-like workloads, so they are dealing
with a different situation. In Firefox, most of our effort has focused on
improving responsiveness and eliminating work (through things like
compartmental GC). (Some GC sweeping is already done in parallel in Firefox.)
That said, I believe IE does some concurrent marking, so there is certainly
room for improvement.
~~~
the8472
> and throughput is more of a concern for server-like workloads
Many java applications also have to worry about latency, not just throughput.
Parallel collections cut down on pause times, too. Simply because they can get
about the same work (in terms of CPU cycles) done in less wall time. I.e.
parallelizing non-concurrent GC phases also improves responsiveness.
------
mtgx
> A first version of our new engine will ship on Android, Windows, Mac, and
> Linux. Someday we hope to offer this new engine for iOS, too.
More people need to put pressure on Apple to allow third-party browser engines
on iOS. Fortunately, they're already getting sued over this, but just in case
that doesn't succeed, there should also be bigger public pressure on Apple to
allow them.
[http://www.recode.net/2016/10/7/13201832/apple-sued-ios-
brow...](http://www.recode.net/2016/10/7/13201832/apple-sued-ios-browser-
limits)
~~~
tedmielczarek
I've had a Gecko port stood up and running on iPhone hardware several times in
the past 6 years but we've never sorted out a real path to shipping. The most
recent incarnation felt a lot nicer than Safari with our async pan/zoom
architecture. Maybe I should just get Servo running and we can ship it as a
tech demo. :-P
~~~
larsberg
I'll do the CI work to keep it building :-)
------
bobajeff
This sounds to me like Mozilla is getting impatient with Servo. Servo was more
than just a parallel browser engine it was the only new web engine not based
off of decade old codebase.
It was a statement that it's feasible to hold off on monoculture because
compatibility isn't impossible to achieve on new engines.
~~~
bzbarsky
Compatibility in new engines is ... hard. Servo is basically going to need to
spoof the WebKit UA and duplicate a bunch of WebKit bugs (the Edge approach)
or spoof the Gecko UA and duplicate a bunch of Gecko bugs. Some specs now have
an explicit "does your UA say you are Gecko, or does it say you are WebKit"
switch with behavior specified for both branches. :(
~~~
Aldo_MX
Considering that Servo is an embeddable engine, why not keep the scope of
Servo focused in building a standards-compliant engine?
Replicating other engine's bugs sounds like too much effort towards the wrong
direction :/
Although, after the -webkit-disaster I don't really expect anyone to like the
idea of a standards-compliant engine :(
~~~
pcwalton
> Considering that Servo is an embeddable engine, why not keep the scope of
> Servo focused in building a standards-compliant engine?
That's what we've done so far. We haven't exposed any Gecko- or WebKit-
specific stuff that I'm aware of. We have our hands full with the standard :)
(That said, we have implemented things that are unspecified but are _de facto_
standards implemented by _both_ Gecko and WebKit. That includes basic things
like <button> and tables…)
~~~
kibwen
Any efforts underway to turn those de facto standards into actual standards as
Servo encounters them?
~~~
pcwalton
Yes, when we have time. For example, notriddle has been going great work
trying to spec hypothetical boxes:
[https://github.com/notriddle/ServoHypothetical](https://github.com/notriddle/ServoHypothetical)
------
aantix
They should use Yahoo's front page as their performance baseline.
Whenever I load it, the favicon starts to flicker, multiple movies (ads) start
playing, and I can't tell whether scrolling has been badly hijacked by some
rogue js plugin or if the performance of their video playback is just _that
bad_.
~~~
mgalka
Yahoo's home page explains so much about the company -- unable to maintain
even the simplest and most basic features of their site. I'm still on Yahoo
mail, and there were a few months this year where the basic search
functionality didn't work.
Yahoo would probably make a great case study in corporate culture gone wrong.
~~~
AceJohnny2
> _Yahoo would probably make a great case study in corporate culture gone
> wrong._
"would probably"? :)
------
mnemonik
Quantum wiki page with info on how to get involved:
[https://wiki.mozilla.org/Quantum](https://wiki.mozilla.org/Quantum)
------
mthoms
I hope that low power usage remains a key priority. Surprisingly, I don't see
any mention of it in this article.
~~~
mnemonik
There is some discussion about power usage in this video by Jack Moffit:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PL4sEzdAGvRgCYXot-o5cVKOo...](https://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PL4sEzdAGvRgCYXot-o5cVKOobIXZI5iLF&v=UGl9VVIOo3E)
------
yalooze
Does anyone know how this compares to the current implementations of competing
browsers? ie. is Firefox still playing catch up in some respects or is this
leaps ahead of the competition too?
~~~
metajack
I think performance of the style systems in Blink and Firefox are similar.
Since Servo's style system is linearly scalable, we expect most users to get a
~4x speed improvement on styling.
Users's don't care specifically about style performance, though, but about
things like interactivity. We think Servo's style system will improve those
things, but don't have numbers for that on hand.
To give a concrete example, it takes Firefox ~1.2 seconds to restyle the
single page HTML5 spec with it's current non-parallel style system. Firefox
with Stylo can do this in ~300ms. That is close to a full second off of
initial page load.
~~~
gsnedders
How does WebKit's JITing style system compare? (As far as I'm aware, nobody
else has anything like it, though it is still single-threaded as far as I'm
aware.)
~~~
pcwalton
I would eventually like to look into a CSS JIT. But I would not like to just
copy WebKit—I would like to look into treating CSS as a global DFA and
compiling accordingly instead of looking at local optimizations only.
As always, the problem with JITs, especially on the Web, that it's hard to
beat the interpreter when you take compilation time into account, and most
selectors you see in the wild only apply to a small number of nodes.
~~~
notriddle
For context, [here's an IRC discussion about implementing style matching as a
single global DFA, and what it's tradeoffs would
be]([http://logs.glob.uno/?c=mozilla%23servo#c550146](http://logs.glob.uno/?c=mozilla%23servo#c550146)).
------
c-smile
"But nowadays we browse the web on ... that have much more sophisticated
processors, often with two, four or even more cores."
Having batched GPU rendering / rasterization makes real sense, yes. When it
shown, the browser is the largest screen space consumer.
4K displays (300ppi) increased number of pixels that need to be painted by 9
times. Thus CPU rendering / rasterization is not the option anymore, yes.
But browser is not the only process competing for those cores.
2 or even 4 cores ... You have more front running applications than that these
days. Some of them are invisible but still CPU intense.
In order to get significant benefits from parallelism in browsers the number
of cores shall be measured in tens at least I think. If not even more than
that. To run things in parallel like bunch of Cassowary solvers for each BFC
container.
I suspect that the main bottleneck at the moment is in existence of methods
[1] that force synchronous layout / reflow of the content. These are things
that kill parallel execution. DOM API shall change towards batch updates or
other more parallel friendly means.
[1]
[https://gist.github.com/paulirish/5d52fb081b3570c81e3a](https://gist.github.com/paulirish/5d52fb081b3570c81e3a)
~~~
pcwalton
> 2 or even 4 cores ... You have more front running applications than that
> these days. Some of them are invisible but still CPU intense.
Occasionally that's true, but users typically interact with just one app at a
time. Even if background tasks are running and taking up CPU time (which is
_not_ the common case—if it were then games wouldn't work!) the foreground app
should get priority in using the CPUs. So background apps aren't relevant
here, any more than background apps are relevant in a single-core scenario.
> In order to get significant benefits from parallelism in browsers the number
> of cores shall be measured in tens at least I think. If not even more that
> that. To run things in parallel like bunch of Cassowary solvers for each BFC
> container.
First of all, that's not true, based on our measurements. We've seen large
improvements with as few as two cores. Second, CSS parallelizes just as well
if not better than Cassowary: unless text actually has to wrap around floats
we can lay out _every block_ in parallel. Even when there's a lot of text
wrapping around floats, we can lay out all the floats in parallel.
> These are things that kill parallel execution.
Even if we had batch updating APIs, existing browser engines would be in no
position to offload layout and restyling to a separate thread. The DOM and
render tree are too intertwined in typical engines.
~~~
c-smile
"we can lay out every block in parallel"
I wouldn't be so optimistic, especially with flexboxes and grids.
display:grid;
grid-columns: 1fr max-content 1fr minmax(min-content, 1fr);
The above requires intrinsic min/max width calculations (full layouts de
facto) before you can even start doing layout of cells in parallel.
The same is about our old good friend <table> by the way where each cell is
BFC.
~~~
pcwalton
Intrinsic inline-sizes have been handled just fine in Servo from day one with
a parallel bottom-up traversal. This is well-known; the technique goes back to
the Meyerovich paper.
------
TeeWEE
You can make a super fast web browser, but that doesnt solve the fundamental
issue: The web is not designed for performant applications. Resources loading,
javascript, rendering... Solve that first before you build a fast engine...
Off course a fast engine is good. But dont forget the root problems with the
web.
~~~
amelius
Yes. The article speaks of "zero latency", but that is simply not achievable
with a network connection that has latency. My guess is that in current
browsers, on average 90% of the latency is in the network (as opposed to
rendering). So even if the render step was perfect, you would only get a
measly 10% performance gain.
------
TekMol
we’ll be rolling out the first stage of Electrolysis to
100% of Firefox desktop users over the next few months.
From my experiments with it, this _still_ does not fix the problem that the
javascript in all windows shares one core. A script running in one browser
window still slows down the other windows.
A problem that Chrome has solved years ago. So I think this is not really a
leap for the web. Just FireFox catching up a bit.
FireFox is my main browser. The way I deal with it is that I start multiple
instances as different users. So they run inside their own process. This way I
can have a resource hungry page open in one window (For example a dashboard
with realtime data visualization) and still work smoothly in another.
~~~
bholley
> So I think this is not really a leap for the web. Just FireFox catching up a
> bit.
To be clear, Project Quantum is the next phase of architecture, post-
Electrolysis. We're also simultaneously working on multiple content processes
(which is how Chrome often avoids inter-window jank), but not under the
Quantum umbrella.
We think we can do better though, which is where Quantum comes in. The Quantum
DOM project is designed to solve exactly the problem you're describing, while
using fewer resources and scaling to more tabs. Stay tuned!
~~~
Eridrus
This sounds like it directly conflicts with sandboxing tabs, either for
security or stability. Am I missing something?
------
runeks
I don't understand what the difference is between Quantum and Servo. To me it
sounds like a new name for the same thing. I recall Servo being promoted this
way three years ago.
~~~
Manishearth
Quantum is about new architectural advances within Gecko. These advances can
be achieved by taking code from Servo (Quantum Style), ideas from Servo
(Quantum DOM), or in general new ideas (not sure if any of the quantum
projects are of this form).
Servo is still its own thing. The timelines are radically different, Quantum
is something you should be able to directly benefit from a year from now;
Servo is something you should be able to directly benefit (as a product) from
in the far future. You of course may indirectly benefit from Servo when its
advances are applied to other browser engines (which is what quantum is).
------
bandrami
Pet peeve of mine: a "quantum leap" is literally the _smallest change of state
that is physically possible_ , but it's come to mean the opposite in popular
use.
~~~
TheRealPomax
Time to shelve that pet peeve, because any physicist should be able to tell
you that this claim is one of those hilarious "people keep pretending this is
true" when it has nothing to do with what a quantum leap actually is.
In physics, a "quantum leap" is a synonym for atomic electron state changes.
These don't take place as a continuous gradient change, they jump from one
state to the next, releasing or absorbing photons as they do so: the changes
are quantized, and any change from one state to another termed a quantum leap.
And it really is "any change": they're all quantum leaps.
There is also no stipulation on direction, state changes go both up and down.
So while there certainly is a lower bound to the value that we will find in
the set of all possible quantum leaps in atomic physics (because you can't go
"half distances", the whole point of quanta is that it's all or nothing). the
idea that a quantum leap is "one value" is patent nonsense; different state
transitions have different values, and can be anywhere between tiny and huge
jumps, and can release massively energetic photons in the process.
And if the term has been given a new meaning in everyday common language, then
cool. That's how language works. It doesn't need to be correct with respect to
its origin, people just need to all agree on what the terms used mean. In
every day language, understanding that "a quantum leap" means "a fundamental
change in how we do things" (which is implied always a big deal, even if the
change itself is small) demonstrates a basic understanding of conversational
English. So that's cool too.
~~~
bandrami
_In physics, a "quantum leap" is a synonym for atomic electron state changes.
_
Right. The smallest such change physically possible, which is exactly what I
said.
~~~
TheRealPomax
Again with the pretending there is only one possible change here: a state
change in high orbit excitation levels is nowhere near "the smallest such
changes", yet we still call them quantum leaps because that's what they are.
The distances and energies involved are HUGE at the atomic scale, which is the
scale we must necessarily stay grounded in when discussing what a quantum leap
"really" means. (where "really" is a misnomer because there is nothing that
requires a scientifically precise term to be reflected in common everyday
language. The only important part is that you don't use the meaning of the
latter in the context of the first)
------
k26dr
Doesn't Chrome/Chromium already run as multiple processes?
~~~
Roboprog
I believe it is "only" one process per tab on Chrome. This sounds like having
multiple processes per tab (or at least, active tab), splitting up different
kinds of work to "specialist" processes.
Clarification / refinement, anybody?
~~~
the8472
There is this concept called "threads" which can be found in most operating
systems.
~~~
Roboprog
Process, thread, task, whatever.
(I so remember the first time I was reading about threads in OS/2 and Novell
back in 1989 or 90 - no risk not worth taking to squeeze a little bit more out
of 10 MHz CPUs with OS's with crummy process management, I guess)
------
andrewstuart
I wish I could see how much processing power/memory was being taken by each
tab.
------
joshmarinacci
It's about damn time!
------
mxuribe
Looking forward to this!
------
ifhs
Sorry but posting this on medium is a quantum leap backwards. That too from
Mozilla.
------
criddell
Heh. It's interesting to me that in the vernacular a _quantum leap_ is a large
change while in physics it's a very quick, extremely tiny event.
~~~
krastanov
No! This meme is just wrong (and it does grind my gears to an unreasonable
amount as a physicist). In physics quantum means discrete, it does not mean
small. Hence the idiom "quantum leap" used as "a discontinuous abrupt jump in
quality" is perfectly in sync with the way physicists use the phrase.
~~~
criddell
I'm not saying it _means_ small, just that quantum leaps are nanoscale. And
also, the state after the leap isn't better or worse than the state before,
just different.
~~~
krastanov
I still disagree. Quantum does not imply nanoscale - we are building bigger
and bigger systems that exhibit inherently quantum behavior (for instance
superconducting cavities used in quantum computing research are centimeter
scale). Moreover, the jump is not necessarily in a spatial variable - it can
be a very big jump in energy levels for instance, which is the case with laser
emissions.
Sure, a (big or small) discrete jump does not necessarily imply a jump to
something better, but that has little to do with my complaint about the meme
that "quantum implies small".
~~~
criddell
I stand corrected. Thank you.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Requiring secure contexts for all new features - jwarren
https://blog.mozilla.org/security/2018/01/15/secure-contexts-everywhere/
======
nickpsecurity
They probably should've linked to a better intro to Secure Contexts than a
standards document. Here's a simple explanation for them from Mozilla:
[https://developer.mozilla.org/en-
US/docs/Web/Security/Secure...](https://developer.mozilla.org/en-
US/docs/Web/Security/Secure_Contexts)
Features Restricted to Secure Contexts:
[https://developer.mozilla.org/en-
US/docs/Web/Security/Secure...](https://developer.mozilla.org/en-
US/docs/Web/Security/Secure_Contexts/features_restricted_to_secure_contexts)
Chrome's Secure Origins seem to be the same thing:
[https://www.chromium.org/Home/chromium-security/prefer-
secur...](https://www.chromium.org/Home/chromium-security/prefer-secure-
origins-for-powerful-new-features)
~~~
annevk
I adjusted the post to take your feedback into account. Thanks!
------
niftich
This seems reasonable.
Declarative code, such as HTML or CSS, which describe particular behaviors of
rendering from a broad, but limited palette, are a different severity from
imperative code that can interact with various features of your host platform.
As a user, for the web execution trust model to work, you need to know that
the code you're about to execute was vetted by originating site and not
altered in transit. TLS provides this. It won't help you with easing the
cognitive load of making that decision, or extending your trust model to
third-party origins referred to by the site you visit, but it does provide
baseline assurance that the content wasn't tampered with by an agent that
wasn't a party known to you or your origin ahead of time.
As a side-effect, this move serves to further segregate the document-based
'legacy' web and the new web that's an application delivery platform. In my
opinion, any move that sets these two use-cases further apart, without
necessarily impacting the nameplate usability expectation of either, is a
welcome step.
~~~
pavon
The post states that any new features including something as simple as a CSS
property will now require a secure context, regardless of whether the new
feature exposes more security risk or not. This is a marked departure from the
declarative markup vs imperative scripts distinction that you make, or any
other risk analysis which has guided which features require a secure context
in the past. It doesn't distinguish between simple web pages and web
applications. Instead it is a blanket policy that if you don't encrypt, you
will not be able to use any modern web standards, period.
~~~
ilikethiscmnt
Correct me here if I'm wrong but the linked article actually uses the example
of a new CSS property as an instance of something that would _not_ require a
security context.
~~~
Ajedi32
No. It says a new CSS color keyword would not require a secure context, but
that a new CSS property likely would.
------
nicolaslem
My eye got caught by the author's signature on the side: "Standards hacker.
Mozillian. Loves talking about turning the web into an OS."
I'm personally going the opposite direction, I started using browsing with JS
disabled a while ago and found my browsing experience improved.
With the recent security issues, is that really the way we want to go?
~~~
albertgoeswoof
Probably, you’re putting an extra layer of protection (the browser sandbox)
between the attack vector and your system.
~~~
earenndil
But by doing that you're feeling ok with running untrusted code which could
easily exploit the JIT. Whereas with native code you have to trust it so
you'll only run good trusted code.
~~~
Ajedi32
> with native code you have to trust it
I consider that a drawback of native code. Not an advantage.
> so you'll only run good trusted code
In practice this isn't a very safe assumption to make.
~~~
fabrice_d
There is some truth in the fact that until we have support for signed code on
the web - and a way to check that whoever signed can be trusted, we only have
"level 1" security.
In FxOS we used code signing to grant access to more powerful apis. I think
that something like what the Dat project is doing could be interesting in this
regard, or web packages as described in
[https://github.com/WICG/webpackage/blob/master/explainer.md](https://github.com/WICG/webpackage/blob/master/explainer.md)
------
Scaevolus
New CSS properties are only going to work in secure contexts?
How is local development supposed to occur?
E: there's going to be some flag to enable it for development
~~~
kam
[http://localhost](http://localhost) and file:// are considered secure
contexts according to [https://developer.mozilla.org/en-
US/docs/Web/Security/Secure...](https://developer.mozilla.org/en-
US/docs/Web/Security/Secure_Contexts#When_is_a_context_considered_secure)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
California Man Pleads Guilty in Deadly Wichita Swatting Case - lnguyen
https://www.justice.gov/usao-ks/pr/california-man-pleads-guilty-deadly-wichita-swatting-case
======
bootsz
> A man who came outside to face police, however, had done nothing wrong and
> did not know about the swatting call. As he stepped onto the porch, police
> told him to put up his hands. When he unexpectedly dropped his hands, he was
> shot and killed.
The number of times I've read an account of this kind of scenario playing out
in the past few years is absolutely mind-boggling and depressing. The fact
that in the US you can so easily be shot to bits by police just by
accidentally making a small incorrect movement is just insane to me. I
understand that police face real threats and need to take precautions to
protect their own lives, but _surely_ there must a better system to accomplish
this other than requiring someone to immediately perform a sequence of body
movements without making a single mistake or else you kill them.
~~~
cypherg
Non-deadly force has been completely ignored. Why not just incapacitate the
suspect?
~~~
Analemma_
With the way incentives are set up right now, there’s no reason to. For all
practical purposes, police are completely immune to any consequences of
unjustified killings– DA’s never ever prosecute cops and internal affairs
departments are do-nothing bodies designed only to make it look like there’s
some accountability– so there’s no reason to not always use the maximum amount
of force “just in case”.
~~~
erichurkman
Or, if you do get fired, you just move to the police department in the town
next door, or from city to county, or county to state. It's the standard
practice for communities with no incentive to prosecute (like the Vatican
shuffling around rapist priests and bishops instead of bringing them to
judgment).
------
danielvf
The man who pled guilty was calling in a swatting or a bomb threat every two
to three days for the three months before he was caught. It took someone dying
to actually get a serious investigation.
\- Initial charges (including twitter logs, 911 call transcript)
[https://regmedia.co.uk/2018/05/24/barrissindictment.pdf](https://regmedia.co.uk/2018/05/24/barrissindictment.pdf)
\- 46 additional charges for bomb threats and other swattings.
[https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/5019352/Barriss-I...](https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/5019352/Barriss-
Information-10-24-18.pdf)
------
sorokod
What happened to the policeman who did the actual killing?
~~~
zimpenfish
Looks like "nothing" \- the DA declined to charge him and whilst there was an
internal investigation, that doesn't seem to have gone anywhere either.
~~~
sorokod
The contrast between the fate of the swatter and the killer is quite...
striking. Makes it look as if police has no agency not to kill.
~~~
goldenkey
"When crime is acceptable, make no mistake.. the criminals will be the ones
wearing the uniforms and badges of honor."
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynwood_Vikings](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynwood_Vikings)
------
opwieurposiu
What about this: A device that uses a camera and laser galvo to temporarily
blind people by scanning a laser in their face. If someone is blind then they
can't aim a gun. This could be useful for both police wanting protection from
citizens and visa versa.
------
msla
One of these days, there's going to be a swatting case that's deadly for the
police.
~~~
kickopotomus
Not swatting, but no-knock raids have gone badly for the police before[0].
[0] [https://newsmaven.io/pinacnews/courtroom-files/texas-man-
fou...](https://newsmaven.io/pinacnews/courtroom-files/texas-man-found-not-
guilty-for-shooting-three-cops-during-noknock-raid-ehraX84ZEUi9Q0___1p4XA/)
~~~
PhasmaFelis
And there, as here, the police refused to accept any responsibility for their
actions.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The Economics of Building Knowledge Bases - miket
http://blog.diffbot.com/the-economics-of-building-knowledge-bases/
======
mjpuser
This is a compelling article, but then when you try to see what the product
is, you have to submit your email / request a demo. In my experience, hiding
your product behind a demo is a bad sign that the product has flaws. It also
puts you in contact with a salesman or account manager which is typically
geared towards a high pressure sale event of the product. I'd be interested to
hear other people's experiences with this model, though.
~~~
m_ke
Sometimes with products like this one the value that it provides to the
customer varies significantly depending on a use case and it's hard to put up
pricing without either cutting out a long tail of smaller users or losing
money on the big deals.
I have an API that market research and medical customers are willing to pay
100x more for than consumer social, at the same time the consumer companies
have 100x the volume.
~~~
sokoloff
Find a way to segment that into two markets based on features or volume. Don't
try to do it by making your customers take a phone call before telling them
anything about the product. That's a move that even Oracle sales would think
twice about...
------
zozbot234
Freebase was not just "shut down" out of nowhere. A data dump is still
available, and some of it was merged into Wikidata but overall the resource
was found to be of poor reliability. It may have had very accurate data _on
average_ , but this was not enough for many Wikidata use cases.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Nvidia Launches Year-Long Research Residency Program - bcaulfield
https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2018/11/02/residence-in-nvidia-launches-year-long-research-residency-program/
======
MenloMaggie
Great opportunity to gain AI expertise and create fun tech!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Google Wave is the new X-Windows - enki
http://lolstartups.com/post/159309953/wave-is-the-new-x-windows
======
jimbokun
"It essentially defines the data structures of a collaborative document
editor"
Thank you!
I have not been able to make sense of the press coverage trying to describe
what Google Wave is. This is immensely clarifying. Google Wave is chiefly
technology for building collaborative editing applications. Casting it in
terms of competing against email, IM, or Facebook, is simply a category error.
I suppose the technology demo labeled "Google Wave" built on the underlying
tech may be partially at fault for the confusion.
~~~
extension
You can look at it is a collaborative document editor, but the fact that the
developers intend for it to be used for day to day communication is important.
It means that they will make sure it does all the little things a
communication tool needs to do.
Most importantly, the waves (documents) are structured as threaded
discussions. Users have global, unique, human readable addresses. Access to
waves and parts of waves can be controlled per-person. There is an an inbox
that lists waves by time. It keeps track of which ones have unseen content and
notifies you when a change is made, and so on.
I don't think any mere mortal can get a good sense of what Wave is without
seeing it in action. I didn't really wrap my head around it until I had spent
a couple of hours using it.
------
rjurney
No, Google Wave is the new RIPscript:
[http://www.bbsdocumentary.com/library/PROGRAMS/GRAPHICS/RIPS...](http://www.bbsdocumentary.com/library/PROGRAMS/GRAPHICS/RIPSCRIPT/)
"In 1993 Telegrafix created RIPscript or RIPscrip, which stood for "Remote
Imaging Protocol". It was intended to be a vector-like graphics protocol that
used ASCII files to describe lines and shapes to a client. This sort of
approach (send descriptions of graphics, render them at the client side) had
been done before, but a major push came with RIPscript and it followed onto
the internet as a plug-in. Ultimately, the protocol did not catch on and was
soon forgotten."
~~~
gfodor
Now _there's_ something I haven't thought about in like 15 years!
RIP script was cool, I remember the editor they had for it was pretty slick.
~~~
rjurney
Doesn't it kinda remind you then? You know - the folly of specifying the
future before it happens. RIPscrip made tons of sense until... something
unpredictable like interwebs happened :) The pipes turned out to be different
in practice than the BBS perspective told us. Wave has that same kind of
feeling to me. Not saying there's not some neat there, but the style of the
announcement and marketing... feels like RIPscript to me - doomed, arrogant,
silly.
------
sung
"In the blog posts I’ve read, Wave’s merits are analyzed solely based on the
current developer UI preview. ... and not an infrastructure protocol under
heavy development."
Great insight! I also feel the same way; that is a very important point that
people often overlook. Wave has a huge grand vision that could be shown far
beyond the power of current UI client.
Great to hear that you are a fellow gtug campout member. It was one of the
best experience. Thanks to Google for providing it.
~~~
jonmc12
Yea, it was a great event!
The winning team built a prototype of a Justin.tv type of app in 2 days.
I do think it will be sometime before the platform sees any applications that
have mainstream adoption. Video may be the first thing that gets wave rolling
from consumer perspective.
------
cpr
One critical question is whether Google will successfully define the Wave
client/server (GWT-based) protocol in an open fashion, or at least open enough
that people can implement their own.
Otherwise, the whole thing will be dependent on the quality of their
client/server, and people will still be locked into a single implementation.
And, the other issue is just how extensible their data model can be, for other
clients to do more than just their simplistic pidgin-HTML document rendering
model. I.e., can another client/server pair use a more sophisticated document
model but still have the document maintained by other implementations? (Not
talking about robots or gadgets here, but a more fundamental question of
document extensibility.
On these questions (and others) hang the whole general utility of the
collaborative document editing facility.
~~~
nailer
They already have - the first public wave server was PyGoWave, which was made
from the open spec by third party developers.
~~~
omouse
Where's the client?
------
ssriram
Great Job!! I've replied to your group post at
[http://groups.google.com/group/wave-
protocol/browse_thread/t...](http://groups.google.com/group/wave-
protocol/browse_thread/thread/2634a27c4839bdab?hl=en)
------
swombat
Seems like a pretty sensible view, and probably fairly close to what Google is
aiming for.
I know a number of non-technical people who have watched the whole GW
presentation and they can all immediately see the potential of Google Wave to
be used within their work and adapted to their workflows. It's very smart of
Google to support developers first, because GW's success will probably be
highly dependent on specific applications/customisations built on top of their
platform.
~~~
nazgulnarsil
I'm wondering whether google wave can solve the problem of having to use
overly complicated interfaces like email or social sites just to share a link
with friends.
I feel like I should be able to drag and drop an image or link into something
and have it show up on my friend's computer.
~~~
sophacles
My friends and I call that jabber :-P
~~~
nazgulnarsil
i dont mean IM where things disappear and involve synchronous chat though.
------
liz_hitchcock
This is potentially very useful to schools who wish to collaborate with other
schools. But students need to be 'contained' within one Google Wave with a
defined 'team' working on for example a citizenship project on fair trade etc,
rather than be free to start new Waves on the subject of say Zak Effron or
start messaging their friends... can you have an owner defined Wave ie by the
teacher and partipants ie students permissioned to access only that one Wave.
------
tdoggette
I think that Google Wave will be interesting for the social place it falls
into. Will it be the new Usenet, or IRC, or web forums? Will it be large and
unified ("I'm on Wave, hit me up"), or fragmented ("Yeah, I switched over to
the wave Matt's running. You should try it out")?
These are the interesting parts, I think.
~~~
jimbokun
If there is any validity to the X-Windows comparison, none of those questions
make any sense. Substitute and you get "I'm on X-Windows, hit me up" or "Yeah,
I switched over to the X-Windows Matt's running," which no one would ever say.
I agree that the coverage so far have said exactly the kinds of things you are
saying. I never understood what they were really getting at, but this article
makes a lot more sense to me. It is mainly a protocol, and what the press are
calling "Wave" is just a demo app that Google put together.
~~~
tdoggette
In this case, though, I think the press are right. What really matters is what
people do with the software, not what happens underneath. It's our job as
nerds to get it from a communications protocol to a community.
------
hvs
Did that analogy give anyone else shivers down their spines? That isn't to say
that separating mechanism from policy is a bad idea.
I just hope that we get the words "client" and "server" defined correctly this
time around.
~~~
pohl
I always thought that XWindows uses the term 'client' and 'server' correctly,
while the average joe simply uses the words too loosely: they want to say that
the client is "my machine right here", and the server is "that machine over
there".
But, in reality, it is the display server process that offers display services
to client programs that use them.
~~~
dejb
It always felt wrong to me because the remote computer acted in response to
your actions. You click on something and it responds. I'm sure there were
valid technical reasons for it but commercially it must have been disaster.
~~~
sp332
You're thinking of it in terms of the application, not the display. The app
was running on the app server, which connects to the X server as an X client.
~~~
dejb
I'm thinking more in terms of the person sitting in front of the computer
rather than than the app. They are the ultimate 'client' who is served by the
computer in front of them. That computer (thin client) is the client of the
application server and so on down the line to the database and whatever other
services (servers) are called.
I can't really see a solid line of differentiation between an 'X server' and a
browser. Would you call the browser an HTML/Javascript server?
~~~
pohl
You're using loose terminology that a system administrator might use, where
"clients" and "servers" are machines.
X Windows is using computer science jargon instead, where "client" and
"server" are words that describe roles that two programs might play in a
specific kind of relationship with each other.
~~~
dejb
> You're using loose terminology that a system administrator might use,
How dare you insinuate that I might be a system administrator. Or that system
administrators really don't know much beyond their domain. I won't stand for
it!
I'm sure 'X windows' is technically a server in some the strictest sense.
Technically I guess the client app issues a request for user input which is
served by the X server. To extend that model the X server issues a sub-request
to the user who fulfils that request. To me this seems to twist the
terminology to the point where the user is just another service available to
the program. It reflects a view of reality that does not appeal to ordinary
end users and I believe this limited the success of X windows and unix/linux
on the desktop.
------
omail
The title mislead me. I thought he was going to argue that Google Wave is like
X-Windows. He seems to be saying Google Wave can be used as the transport
layer for a display service. There does not appear to be any reason why it
can't be X11 on top of Google Wave other than the insane latency requirement.
EDIT: He seems to be more keen on replacing X11. I think a protocol which
works with X would be better.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Some Favorite Non-Technical Books (2018) - mpiedrav
http://www.stroustrup.com/literature.html
======
urs2102
One of my favorite classes with Bjarne from college was Bjarne telling us the
story of a ten year-old who wrote him asking if it was too late to start
programming and what he should learn so he can work as a programmer (to get
started so he could be one of the best in the world at something in the
field).
Bjarne says he responded by telling the kid to stop worrying about work or
what he wanted to work as, and to spend time playing (both on the computer and
just outside) because it was just as good as good for the mind as sitting in
front of the computer and that ten year-olds could often be the best in the
world at playing.
Similar to his penchant for fiction here, this is something I’ve always loved
about Bjarne... despite being so good at one thing: finding the beauty in
balance.
~~~
newsbinator
I'd bet that the nervous 10-year-old promptly ignored Bjarne's advice and went
on to ask others what to cram.
~~~
watwut
And maybe 10-years old would be right. Not because of becoming best in the
world, but because there would be zero harm to his development, really.
~~~
Aperocky
Unless he burns out.
Usually 10 years old (speaking from experience) don’t worry about job or
employment prospect, they just want to do the cool thing. And if it’s the
former that’s pushing I suspect a strong possibility of burning out.
Heck, even as an adult I can barely tolerate working on things I’m not
interested in but pressured so.
------
mpiedrav
«I (Bjarne Stroustrup) have also been asked where I find the time to read non-
technical books. Actually, it is not a question of finding the time. Reading
non-technical stuff is essential. Without it, I'd go nuts and lose my sense of
proportion. As a practical matter, I read for about an hour almost every
evening before going to bed -- trying to go straight from technical work to
sleep is usually not a good idea.»
~~~
ImaCake
> trying to go straight from technical work to sleep is usually not a good
> idea
I did this with an assignment last night and ended up dreaming about linear
algebra. I did not sleep well!
~~~
raincom
There is a Fields medal winner, who does math in his sleep. John von Neumann
loved to work in noisy environments, did not like quiet places.
~~~
mpiedrav
It's rather common to dream about math or computing when you are solving some
hard problem or digesting some topics with a time limit (next exam, project
deadline, etc.)
As for Fields medalists, they are extremely creative folks who can find new
and effective ways to tackle seriously deep problems, even when doing things
unrelated to math (swimming, hiking, etc.)
------
euske
Can I just list my favorite non-technical books here?
Richard Feynman, What Do You Care What Other People Think? - Probably no
additional description needed. It's a kind of sequel of Surely You're Joking,
Mr. Feynman! but has a more personal touch.
Antoine de Saint-Exupéry - Night Flight. A somewhat romanticized tale about
the early era of air mail delivery. The story about the personal sacrifice for
public good.
Tove Jansson - Moominvalley in November. It's disguised as a kid's story, but
from what I read the book is about loss and absence of loved ones. Funny,
soothing and surprisingly profound.
------
nihonde
Hands down, the most useful non-technical book I’ve read is The True Believer
by Eric Hoffer. Written in 1951, but utterly timeless, it unlocks a new way to
view your fellow man by revealing the impulses that lead someone toward
fanatical mass movements. In a funny way, it frees you from participating in
the pointless debates about ideologies and allows you to be more empathetic to
those who have fallen into the trap of mass movements. Beautifully written,
too, without even a hint of academic pretensions.
~~~
d_burfoot
Thanks for the recommendation. I liked the author's biography:
> Eric Hoffer (1902 -- 1983) was self-educated. He worked in restaurants, as a
> migrant fieldworker, and as a gold prospector. After Pearl Harbor, he worked
> as a longshoreman in San Francisco for twenty-five years. The author of more
> than ten books, including The Passionate State of Mind, The Ordeal of
> Change, and The Temper of Our Time, Eric Hoffer was awarded the Presidential
> Medal of Freedom in 1983.
------
AdieuToLogic
For me, my favourite non-technical book I can remember reading is:
The Tao of Physics[0]
In retrospect, this may explain my comfort with C++ over the years. ;-)
0 -
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tao_of_Physics](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tao_of_Physics)
------
kmlx
wow, what a walk down memory lane.
this is a very, very good list. read most of these books in high school.
Destoievski is still one of my favourite authors, and i still have dreams of
Eco's 1300s abbey.
i would also mention Kafka, and any of the SciFi greats (Asimov, Clarke, P.K.
Dick etc). Re-read a lot of these this past year.
and i would also mention Marcus Aurelius "Meditations", a book written 2000
years ago by one of the greatest thinkers of his time.
there are so many good book written throughout history it's absolutely crazy.
the only problem i see is the monumental amount of crappy books that have been
launching recently and becoming instant hits. combined with a "does this take
longer than a 10 minute youtube video" attitude.
otherwise, if you have a modicum amount of patience, any of those books will
prove to be an unforgettable experience.
~~~
Joeri
Wrt. the sci-fi greats, I once worked my way through the list of joint winners
of nebula and hugo awards, and it was awesome. Those books are all excellent.
------
lonesword
>This "use" of literature and history is reflected in my choice of reading:
There is very little "heavy" reading listed here.
And then he lists Dostoevsky and Homer. Those doesn't count as heavy reading?
What counts as heavy reading? Ulysses/Paradise lost?
My "oh hell yeah!" moment was when i saw Lord of the Rings in the list :p
~~~
watwut
> And then he lists Dostoevsky and Homer. Those doesn't count as heavy
> reading? What counts as heavy reading? Ulysses/Paradise lost?
Dostoevsky is not difficult to read. If you like depressive psychological
drama, it is quite enjoyable. Homer difficulty depends heavily on translation.
It can be stiff and boring or basically just fun (but again, you gotta like
the relationships non-actiony aspect of it).
Yeah, Ulysses is definitely hard to read.
~~~
rbavocadotree
If Dostoevsky is not difficult to read, then there exist only a handful of
authors who are. Maybe it isn't difficult to find enjoyment in his works, but
there is a hell of a lot more going on than just depressive psychological
drama.
~~~
watwut
I really dont think it is so difficult to read. I was no regular reader of
classic and was definitely not seeking anything difficult when I found it
first time and I enjoyed it.
I used to abandon books quickly when they were hard to read or boring or
anything like that.
------
Keltullis
Who else is adding this to an already huge list of "To Read" items in their
"To Do" list?
~~~
simonebrunozzi
Damn. Me too. Although, I am cherrypicking, instead of adding it all.
------
sjustns
I have a long list of non-technical (and non-fiction) books, available here:
[https://public.3.basecamp.com/p/8ogy66cGzqVxape4Th648eLV](https://public.3.basecamp.com/p/8ogy66cGzqVxape4Th648eLV)
If you're interested in reading and talking about these types of books with
people who have a similar bookish intuitions, shameless plug:
[https://strangers-club.com](https://strangers-club.com)
------
signa11
there is only one kierkegaard book there, i was hoping for more :) (given a
bunch of epigraphs (from kierkegaard) in various books that he has authored)
------
WilTimSon
He has some excellent books in there with classics and cult favorites but I
have to specifically give the highest recommendation to John Steinbeck's
dilogy of Cannery Row/Sweet Thursday.
It's a very humanistic book that covers stories of poor characters in a
humorous way without mocking them or acting as if they're beneath others
somehow. The atmosphere of the books is inviting and warm and they're both
good stories to read in the cold of the upcoming winter. They're often
overlooked in favor of Steinbeck's popular titles like Grapes of Wrath and
East of Eden but I'd say these two are essentials as well.
------
richardjdare
I read "Seven Gothic Tales" by Isak Dinesen (Karen Blixen's pen name) after
seeing it quoted in Stroustrup's "The C++ Programming Language". Lovely
dreamlike prose. Stroustrup's book is one of my all-time favourite technical
works, I hope we get a new edition for the latest versions of the language.
------
Merrill
No Nordic Noir? e.g. Henning Mankell.
Lots of history, but only Barbara Tuchman on WW 1. I recommend G. J. Meyer "A
World Undone: The Story of the Great War, 1914-1918" and "The World Remade:
America in World War I".
------
scabarott
These are just his favorites not everything he's read, and kudos to him for
putting this out there. But I'm a little disappointed as the list is kind of
heavily Euro-centric. Probably even just a couple decades ago this would be
the norm but I think in 2019 a person of his calibre and intelligence could
benefit a lot by broadening his reading tastes, and there are increasingly
many excellent (non-european) authors to choose from to broaden one's
perspectives. Not a criticism, just my observation.
------
RachelF
I love the good ol' fashioned web page look.
~~~
ycosynot
We lost something. At the beginning of internet, I remember, there were this
kind of lists, with many links to interesting webpages, or quirky stuff.
Surely you know what I mean, it was usual to see along smart blogs, this kind
of list of gorgeous references, and it was amazing.
Maybe I'm missing something, but nowadays the internet seems "diluted", there
is more noise than information, and it's full of common sense, low-value
content (like Wikihow, I'm sorry to say). Google Search is a bit responsible,
they rank at the top superficial stuff, and we lost trace of this kind of
juicy content.
If someone has more links like this one, I'd be happy to read about it.
------
frequentnapper
are dirk gently books even better than the show?
~~~
JackDrury
Most definitely
------
C1sc0cat
I Would take Thucydides over Herodotus any day
~~~
billfruit
I would rather take Plutarch than either of them, the very tricks and
manipulations described in his Lives are still what politicians still use day
to day to get what they want done.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
EU's Most Widely Use Language, English, Endangered by Brexit - cpeterso
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2016/06/28/world/europe/ap-eu-britain-eu-what-about-english.html
======
gpvos
Will not happen. Many EU parlamentarians speak English more often than their
own language on the floor. English is essential for the EU to function; German
or French could not fill that role.
It could be easily solved by having one of the "spare" countries that only
have languages that are also an official language in another country choose
English. Candidates would be Belgium, Luxembourg, Austria, and several others.
~~~
dalke
The proposed solution mentioned is easier - let a country select two
languages.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
RSC Study: Three Myths about Copyright Law and Where to Start to Fix It [pdf] - rkudeshi
http://rsc.jordan.house.gov/uploadedfiles/rsc_policy_brief_--_three_myths_about_copyright_law_and_where_to_start_to_fix_it_--_november_16_2012.pdf
======
rkudeshi
A summary by Redditor davidjoho:
"The 3 myths are:
\- The purpose of copyright is to compensate the creator of the content
\- Copyright is free market capitalism at work
\- The current copyright legal regime leads to the greatest innovation and
productivity
And the four "potential policy solutions" are:
\- Statutory damages reform
\- Expand Fair Use
\- Punish false copyright claims
\- Heavily limit the terms for copyright, and create disincentives for
renewal"
Saw this originally posted on Reddit:
[http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/13cq6s/republican_...](http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/13cq6s/republican_committee_nails_3_myths_about/)
Which pointed to a a discussion on Slashdot:
[http://politics.slashdot.org/story/12/11/16/2354259/gop-
brie...](http://politics.slashdot.org/story/12/11/16/2354259/gop-brief-
attacks-current-copyright-law)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Australian gamers finally get R18+ classification - westicle
http://www.theage.com.au/digital-life/games/gamers-get-adultsonly-r18-classification-20120618-20kiw.html
======
westicle
Something Australian gamers have been waiting a long time for.
Interestingly, for years the government spin was "We can't allow people to
sell R-rated games... think of the children!"
Now all of a sudden the political winds have changed, and we have "R-rated
games will protect children from inappropriate content!"
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: CakeResume v3 – Making your resume a piece of cake - trantor
https://www.cakeresume.com/v3
======
trevvr
I now want my CV to be available as a nice, double layer, chocolate vanilla
sponge.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: Hacker News for Windows Phone 8 - miguelrochefort
Hacker News for Windows Phone 8 just passed the certification and is now available in the Marketplace.<p>You can see it there: http://www.windowsphone.com/en-us/store/app/hacker-news/89024c43-fa94-463a-a560-ee5c8825225c<p>Let me know what you guys think.
======
vyrotek
Nice work! I was really hoping to get a WP8 this Christmas but unfortunately
Sprint dropped the ball on that one and decided not to release any phones
until "next year". I'm still using my 3 year old HTC Hero because I refuse to
get another android. One day I'll get a WP8 and I'm sure this will be one of
the first apps I install. :)
------
kevinwmerritt
Hey I really like this app. Thanks for keeping a very simple style with the
comments. I would like the ability to vote and write comments. Looking forward
to the live tile updates. Also it would be cool to integrate the native
sharing options to quickly share a link.
------
cheeaun
What's the difference between this and your Combinator app?
[http://www.windowsphone.com/en-
us/store/app/combinator/a5275...](http://www.windowsphone.com/en-
us/store/app/combinator/a5275a3f-6611-48f6-bd62-7382eda4c028)
~~~
miguelrochefort
It's been remade for Windows Phone 8. It currently matches Combinator's
features, but I plan on adding additional features to it in the near future
(such as live tiles and dynamic lock screen).
It supports multiple tile sizes.
It uses the device's theme/accent instead of the custom Hacker News theme. I
may add an option to set the HN theme if people request it.
The comment view is a bit different. I think it's cleaner.
The name is different, which make it look like an "official" app. I believe
people prefer to use an app named "Hacker News" than "Combinator". I'll
probably drop the Combinator app in the near future.
------
miguelrochefort
Clickable link: [http://www.windowsphone.com/en-us/store/app/hacker-
news/8902...](http://www.windowsphone.com/en-us/store/app/hacker-
news/89024c43-fa94-463a-a560-ee5c8825225c)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Attention Is All You Need - espeed
https://papers.nips.cc/paper/7181-attention-is-all-you-need
======
eggie5
This paper has a lot of prerequisites to understand. A good paper to read is
precursor to this paper released a year ago:
[https://arxiv.org/abs/1606.01933](https://arxiv.org/abs/1606.01933)
------
bthornbury
I expect we'll be seeing many shakeups on what has (perhaps prematurely)
become the established norms for NN architectures (CNN and RNN) throughout the
next few years.
Its a great time to be alive!
------
pilooch
See the Google blog post from last summer,
[https://research.googleblog.com/2017/08/transformer-novel-
ne...](https://research.googleblog.com/2017/08/transformer-novel-neural-
network.html) A novel simplified architecture for sequences and translation.
------
ferros
Can somebody assist in breaking this down?
~~~
RangerScience
I'm seconding this. I could not find a good resource to understand what
"attention" actually _is_.
(The next step for me would be to follow the citation trail to the original
paper, but that might not be the best place to come to an understanding of the
thing.)
~~~
visarga
Attention is just a weighted sum over a set of vectors, where the weights sum
to one. Attention weights are usually created by neural nets. The word
"attention" might seem more grandiose than what it actually does.
~~~
speedplane
That may be true on a mathematical level, but that's also the answer to just
about any neural net question... it's all just a a weighted sum. My
understanding of "attention" on a higher level is the ability to concentrate
more neurons on "important" areas of an image than less important ones.
An imperfect analogy is how the human visual system has better resolution at
your eye-line's center than at it's edges. In this analogy, your brain should
not waste effort processing image details in your peripheral vision.
~~~
visarga
The key element is that we use neural nets to compute the attention weights,
so attention itself is learnable.
------
IncRnd
Reading the headline I thought the article would be about mindfulness, which
would have been nice. Reading the article I was pleasantly surprised to find a
different subject that I also enjoy. :)
------
chriswarbo
Would this have implications for using ANNs on recursive structures (trees and
graphs)? Their "position encoding" seems a little contrived, but may be
amenable to a more complex positioning scheme (e.g. paths from a root node).
Whilst there are "standard" approaches in computer vision ("CNNs applied to
<foo>") and sequence processing ("LSTM RNNs applied to <foo>"), there doesn't
seem to be any "standard" for variable-size, recursively-structured data. Sure
there's recursive ANNs, backpropagation-through-structure, etc. but they all
seem like one-off inventions, rather than accepted problem-solving tools.
~~~
sdenton4
Seq2Seq is kind of a standard, but also strikes me as pretty hacky. The
network has an encoder and a decoder mode, reads until it finds an end of
input signal, then switches to decode mode. This is how absolutely nothing
works in nature.
------
phkahler
Is this really significant? I'm not an NN kind of guy but I find it an
interesting thing to follow from a distance. From the abstract, this sounds
like an important paper. Is it?
------
jorgemf
This paper was uploaded to arxiv 6 months ago (June). With the fast pace in
translation in the last years it might be outdated already
------
m3kw9
I wonder how Capsule nets can evolve using Attention model like this
~~~
eref
Capsules basically do a kind of self-attention. But there the parent features
compete for a coupling, not the child features.
------
imurray
I suggest changing the link from the .pdf to the web page:
[https://papers.nips.cc/paper/7181-attention-is-all-you-
need](https://papers.nips.cc/paper/7181-attention-is-all-you-need)
It's one click to get the pdf from there. But you also get a plain webpage
with abstract, citation details, and so on, which you can't get back to from
the PDF.
In general it's good to knock the ".pdf" off the end of all papers.nips.cc
links. Similarly turn /pdf/ links on arXiv into /abs/ links, and replace
"pdf?" in openreview.net links with "forum?".
~~~
popcorncolonel
Agreed. Plus, its really annoying to open it on mobile and my phone starts
downloading the pdf file immediately, which I don't want to have to manually
delete in the future.
------
hjjiehebebe
Abstract:
The dominant sequence transduction models are based on complex recurrent or
convolutional neural networks that include an encoder and a decoder. The best
performing models also connect the encoder and decoder through an attention
mechanism. We propose a new simple network architecture, the Transformer,
based solely on attention mechanisms, dispensing with recurrence and
convolutions entirely. Experiments on two machine translation tasks show these
models to be superior in quality while being more parallelizable and requiring
significantly less time to train. Our model achieves 28.4 BLEU on the WMT 2014
English- to-German translation task, improving over the existing best results,
including ensembles, by over 2 BLEU. On the WMT 2014 English-to-French
translation task, our model establishes a new single-model state-of-the-art
BLEU score of 41.0 after training for 3.5 days on eight GPUs, a small fraction
of the training costs of the best models from the literature.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Amazon Takes a Page from Toys ‘R’ Us with a Holiday Catalog - prostoalex
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-07-04/amazon-said-to-take-page-from-toys-r-us-with-holiday-catalog
======
thecrumb
That would be the Sears Holiday Catalog. How quickly we forget.
------
QuinnyPig
I really, really hope there's a direct mail opt-out.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
SICP (Python Version) - ekm2
http://www-inst.eecs.berkeley.edu/~cs61a/sp12/book/index.html
======
rlander
It's a shame that Berkeley dropped Scheme in favour of Python. In the words of
the former CS61a teacher, Brian Harvey, who's retiring [1]:
"In an ironic development, while the Berkeley CS faculty pretty clearly regard
the Python-based course as the future of 61A for Berkeley CS students, both
the UC Online people and the team at Stanford developing technology for
massive online courses are excited about adapting 61AS to their formats. So,
down the road, it may be that everyone except Berkeley students can study
SICP."
An also[2]:
"You can learn to program in any language. But it’s not just an accident that
the authors of SICP chose Scheme as their teaching language. The big ideas in
the book — the ones that alumni in the real world tell us they’re using in
their work — express themselves best in Scheme. Indeed, saying it that way
puts the matter backward. Gerry Sussman (with Guy Steele) invented Scheme
before he turned (with Hal Abelson) to expressing the ideas behind Scheme in a
course. SICP is Scheme, in tutorial form."
BTW, if you have some free time and want to learn Lisp, do yourself a favour
and go watch the old Scheme-based lectures on Berkeley's webcast; they're
awesome.
PS. I do most of my professional work in Python.
[1] <http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~bh/retire.html>
[2] <http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~bh/proglang.html>
~~~
mapleoin
I definitely agree with all that you've said. On the other hand, as someone
who doesn't live in the US and could never afford that kind of education, I
don't really care.
I am actually grateful that I now have access to what looks like a great
Python book _in addition_ to the existing SICP book and videos.
I can't wait to read the _Distributed and Parallel Computing_ chapter.
~~~
groovy2shoes
If you want to learn Python and you already know a programming language,
you'll probably be best served by Python's official documentation:
<http://docs.python.org/>
------
amatsukawa
As someone who took the Scheme version and is now teaching the Python version,
there are without a doubt aspects of the course I miss. The old Scheme course
just had a kind of elegance to it.
We are still striving to teach the same material, just in a different
language. This class is not at all a class about Python, just as the old
course was not a class about Scheme. The course content is almost the same:
functional programming, data abstraction and data structures, OOP,
interpreters, parallel and distributed computing, declarative programming.
We have unfortunately had to sacrifice some _great_ aspects of the original
class, eg. the metacircular evaluator. The hope is that in exchange we have a
more natural OOP system, better support for parallel and network computing
packages, and much more modern implementations of distributed computing.
[disclaimer: these are my own opinions, I do not speak for the department]
------
groovy2shoes
It seems to me that this version has much less to offer than the original.
After reading only the table of contents and the first chapter, I feel as
though it lacks many of the qualities that make the original such a classic in
my mind.
Most of these qualities have nothing to do with Lisp. SICP had a tendency to
take things slow. The presentation of the material reflected how programs are
actually structured -- the text incrementally built on itself much in the same
way that abstractions are built on other abstractions.
While reading through the first chapter of the Python version, I felt as
though I was being bombarded with tidbit after tidbit without the richness of
explanation featured in the original.
One thing that's missing is metalinguistic abstraction. This is something
that's comparatively easy to do in Lisp, so it's understandable that it's been
left out of the Python version. Unfortunately, that chapter of SICP is often
an eye-opener for even experienced programmers.
Parallel and distributed processing are certainly welcome topics, and will
probably become necessary (if they haven't already) as we continue moving into
the Information Age.
Overall, however, I didn't get the feeling that this work keeps the same
spirit as SICP. I think an almost one-to-one code translation of the first
three chapters would have been better.
~~~
baddox
I don't understand what justification there is for calling this "SICP for
Python." I'm sure it's a fine Python textbook, but the table of contents bares
little resemblance to SICP.
~~~
groovy2shoes
Nor does much of the content.
------
gonewest
I took 6.001 at MIT in the 80's. Clearly, Abelson and Sussman did not choose
Scheme because of it's popularity in industry, not even then. Nor did Barbara
Liskov expect us to use CLU professionally, but that was the language for
6.170 back then (I think they teach it in Java now).
So this movement to "port" SICP to Python or whatever other modern language
seems to misunderstand the purpose of the book.
Come back in another 25 years and let's talk about which version of the book
is still considered classic.
~~~
brlewis
I also took 6.001 in the '80s and loved it, although the hardware was totally
inadequate for Scheme. Code ran painfully slow. I adopted C and programmed in
it for 12 years before coming back around to Scheme.
I just pushed some new Scheme code to my photoblog service, OurDoings, before
I came here and saw this post.
------
aroberge
This is even better read using Crunchy (<http://code.google.com/p/crunchy>)
running under Python 3. Crunchy styles the code, making it more pleasant to
read, while inserting a Python interpreter whenever it detects some code,
allowing to reproduce (or modify) the examples, instead of simply passively
reading them.
------
jballanc
I still haven't heard a good reason why universities are switching away from
Scheme...
I'm not one to claim "we must follow the old ways" just for the hell of it. I
can understand the desire to look out at the world of programming languages
(which is much larger today than it was when Scheme was invented), but there
was a reason to pick Scheme for the original: it's simple.
Python, with its "batteries included" philosophy is a poor choice because it
misses the original intent. With Scheme, you have to invent everything. With
Python, you just have to look up the documentation.
Honestly, I can't for the life of me understand why they didn't replace Scheme
with Lua.
~~~
irahul
> Python, with its "batteries included" philosophy is a poor choice because it
> misses the original intent. With Scheme, you have to invent everything. With
> Python, you just have to look up the documentation.
Your point doesn't hold.
With Racket, which is the recommended scheme, you don't have to invent
everything - you just have to look up the documentation. And if you think you
won't use Racket, or use #lang htdp or something in Racket; these are
artificial restrictions and students can very well be asked(like you are
asking not to use batteries with Racket)to respect them while coding in
Python.
There are other reasons to prefer Scheme over Python, but this isn't one.
------
lispm
Looks just like another programming introduction using Python. I fail to see
the connection to SICP.
~~~
adient
Except for the first statement on the page that it is derived from SICP, of
course.
------
kmfrk
I would pay money to have this as a well-designed iBook.
Maybe I'll settle by downloading it for Instapaper.
------
ekm2
UC Berkeley is also using the original SICP in its CS 9D class,Scheme for
Programmers.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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People are getting robocalls about their “derogatory” Trump posts - odammit
https://gizmodo.com/people-are-getting-robocalls-about-their-derogatory-t-1820819203
======
tonyquart
I got multiple calls from 4 numbers since maybe 3 months ago, and when I
Googled the number, I found a nice information at
[https://www.lemberglaw.com/lemberg-law-uncovers-dirty-
dozen-...](https://www.lemberglaw.com/lemberg-law-uncovers-dirty-dozen-
robocallers/) that those numbers have been investigated by some law firms. I
think we should always report those numbers to the authority, and let the
authority do the rest.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why I'm frustrated that I wasn't accepted into Y Combinator. - cirroc
http://www.scribd.com/doc/30644/Why-Im-frustrated-that-I-wasnt-accepted-into-Ycombinator
======
mattjaynes
From my notes of PG's talk on Wednesday:
12\. There are 2 kinds of judgments: Admissions and Grades If you get a bad
grade in a class, but think you did a great job, then you feel entitled to go
and talk to the teacher and challenge the decision. On the other hand, that
entitlement feeling isn't present if you apply to a college and get denied.
This is because in admissions there are a limited number of seats available
and a cutoff point at which no more people can be accepted. Like in the
olympic tryouts - the top X% of swimmers for a country may get to go to the
games, but those below that threshold don't get to go. It's not much different
in getting funding - you can just slide off the edge and just not make the
'admission'. When I was rejected by Harvard I thought I sucked. Now I see it
as laughable. Have you ever been to the admissions office? A rejection in an
admissions scenario is not necessarily a reflection on you. At YCombinator we
go through and rank all of the applications, then we take the top 30 for
interviews. Recently we looked at some of our early teams and compared how
they are doing now with how we rated them in the application process. It was
scary! One of our most successful teams was at number 30! Just one more down
and they would have missed the cutoff.
~~~
ced
So all this talk about accepting "any team good enough" applies only for
funding, and not the interviews?
That would mean, incidentally, that anyone who was rejected this round might
have been accepted in the last, or might be accepted in the next one.
~~~
mattjaynes
I've been following YC fairly closely since their start and have never come
across anything that gave the impression that they would accept "any team good
enough". Think about it - they have very limited resources - particularly of
time, and there is just no way they could take on every team "good enough"
unless they grew their staff and created a large investment organization,
which is not what they're trying to do. Even big VC's and angels don't accept
"any team good enough" - they just don't have the time and it wouldn't make
sense for them to spread themselves so thin.
You said: "That would mean, incidentally, that anyone who was rejected this
round might have been accepted in the last, or might be accepted in the next
one."
Yes, that is exactly right according to what Paul said.
------
jkush
The best advice I can give is this: give yourself until the end of the week to
mourn. Be depressed about it. In fact, be REALLY depressed about it. Don't
sugarcoat it, let it sink all the way in. Get all that negativity and
depression out of your system.
On Monday, pick yourself up and work with what you've got. You've got lots of
opportunities. Find out what they are and use them to their fullest. Don't let
being "rejected" beat you. Give yourself time to grieve then move one.
It's what you're going to do anyway. Just shorten the cycle.
~~~
dfranke
Screw that. I have better uses for my time than stages of grief. Five hours
after I got rejected I took a job with another Cambridge startup, with enough
equity for a chance at getting rich.
~~~
jkush
I'm with ya dfranke. I picked it back up pretty fast too. My point is that we
all pick it back up eventually. Some (like you) don't even waste time feeling
bad, you get right back to it. Others don't. My point is that if you do feel
bad, fine. Feel bad and move on. You're going to move on eventually, so just
do it quicker.
------
yaacovtp
Sad, go back and read the second half of the first paragraph of the email you
received. Do you realize the odds of getting into Harvard are better then
getting an interview with YC and even then only about a third are accepted.
Not having an extra 15K in the bank never stopped anyone from launching a
startup.
I bet that more startups are started because of groups applying to YC. It's a
good thing you applied, but move on already. My partner and I don't need the
money. We applied more for the mentoring and camaraderie one gets spending
time in a group setting. Instead of YC we're tapping the locals here in NYC,
online and anyone else we can think of to bounce ideas off of, test our
application and help get the word out once we've launched.
Go, work, launch. Let me know when you do.
~~~
mattculbreth
This is a good point, and there are some of us in Atlanta meeting next week.
We've met purely as a result of being in this group.
------
abstractbill
I can sympathise. I think my fiancee put it best though, when she asked me "Do
you want to turn out like Uncle Rico, always moaning about how life could have
been if only coach had put you in the game?"
------
gyro_robo
Y Combinator picked Pollground.
And one of their best-performing picks currently was their thirtieth and last
pick of the 30 "most promising" they invited for interviews that round -- if
they had assigned it #31, it would have gotten axed. One can infer from this
that some who missed the cut would likely do better than some who made it.
The low-hanging web 2.0 fruit may be harvested soon, in which case they would
have to expand into other types of ventures.
Also, there are some technologies that are vital but don't make good start-
ups. Work done on the Linux kernel (including virtualization); Compiz/Beryl;
PostGreSQL; and so forth. The complexity may be an order of magnitude greater
than doing a website, but you can't sell ads in Xen source code.
YC's modus operandi also rules out start-ups that need more time and/or
capital. In short, they are pursuing a specific niche.
Don't be discouraged -- their validation is orthogonal to whether your work is
technically novel or highly profitable.
------
zaidf
Man, if this has been your greatest challenge and biggest disappointment to
date, get ready for the journey ahead!
One lesson I have learned over the years from disappointments is never to get
too attached or confident when applying for something. I felt we had a very
strong application but I always know there is decent chance we won't get
accepted and it would have little to do with the quality of our idea or
product--communication and bad luck, may be.
------
BitGeek
Ok, you're working on this in your spare time. Good, that's a good plan.
You're working day jobs, and then in the evenings you're working on your
startup.
That's all well and good, but where's your cocaine habit? How are you blowing
all your money if you're spending all your time at work or on the startup?
IF you're not blowing all your moeny, and you've spent a year looking for
funding (like it sounds like) then why dont' you have a year's worth of living
expenses saved up?
The problem here is hte pervasive idea that the first step to starting a
company is getting someone else to fund it. Screw that-- nobody can ever know
your business as well as you can. You can use advice, sure, but wasting months
working on proposals-- getting seeking emotional validation from investment,
this is all the wrong way to go about it.
Build your product, save your cash. When you have enough money saved up, and
if you really believe in your predictions (That you'll be cash flow positive
in 6 months) then you quit your jobs when you have $12,000 saved up, or less.
If you can't save $12,000 between now and the next YC funding round, and
you're working full time, then you are spending your money on something--
cocaine, maybe?
IF your idea and team really are good, you shouldn't be desperate for money...
and hinging your emotional well being, or self confidence, on validation from
investors is a recipe for failure (and unhappiness.)
------
jsjenkins168
No one has gotten accepted into YC this round yet. For those that got the
interview, they are facing the hardest part now. You feel cheated for getting
an email, imagine how 2/3 of those who fly in for the interview will feel when
they get a call Sunday night telling them they are rejected. I will personally
be crushed if we're in that 2/3. But at the same time I know we have
potentially a great idea that we can run with regardless of what YC's opinion
is about us.
If you think you have a great idea that users will actually want, get up on
your feed and go run with it.
------
aston
I can tell you've got a ton of emotion behind this post. Hopefully writing it
all down helped put it all into perspective.
Not getting YC funding is definitely not the end of the world. There are a ton
of reasons why you might not have gotten funding, and many of them aren't
really related to how great a hacker/startupper you might be.
There are plenty of folks around here who are going to press on despite the
setback [2]. No matter what you do, you're going to run into roadblocks, and
part of being successful is getting past them without losing heart. Don't give
up now, and good luck in the future.
[1] <http://onstartups.com/home/tabid/3339/bid/1350/Why-Not-All-Great-
Hackepreneurs-Get-Picked-By-Y-Combinator.aspx>
[2] <http://news.ycombinator.com/comments?id=11551>
------
Tichy
Cry me a river... I don't get it, why do you need these external motivators?
If you are so good, why can't you get your project off the ground by yourself?
The trick is to not beg for approval, you want to have the investors begging
you to take their investment. Or so I think... but seriously, it sounds like
you have been rejected three times, that is nothing. Think about dating -
would self-pity and begging win you the favours of any girl? If everybody gave
up after three rejections, humans would be extinct by now.
If you are so creative, why can't you find other ways to raise money? Besides,
I think if you apply for YC you don't really need money (because surely you
could get 15000$ somehow), it is all about the experience, right? If you build
your startup anyway, it will be exciting and interesting, too. Who knows, next
year YC might invite you as a speaker.
~~~
randallsquared
"because surely you could get 15000$ somehow"
I think you live in a different world than some of the rest of us. Not only is
15K a lot of money (more than half of what my wife and I made last year, and
we're not doing badly here in east Alabama), but it's often the case that the
only people who could possibly get that kind of money are friends and family
who've already paid for most or all of a house. So, the question becomes,
would you rather work on this part time, or try to convince your parents or
friends to bet their home on your startup?
~~~
snowmaker
No offense intended, but if you want to start a startup, the first thing you
should do is get the hell out of Alabama. In Silicon Valley, you can raise 15K
by just asking for it.
~~~
theoutlander
LOL ... so I am based in Seattle ... does it make sense for me to move to the
bay area ?
~~~
BitGeek
Seattle is the third best startup hub, behind SF Bay and Boston and ahead of
New York.
Zero reason to move to the bay area if you're in seattle... and a lot of
reasons not to.
~~~
theoutlander
Oh, this should really email me when someone replies to my post ... so I have
been thinking about it a lot ... and it seems like SF Bay is the preferred
location ... I guess I should get out of Redmond and into Seattle ....
------
menloparkbum
"We developed a strategy for reinvigorating Adventure Games- Making them sell
when they never had before."
~~~
yaacovtp
Yeah, I was going to go there too (update: Making them sell when they never
had before."), but didn't want to say the obvious.
~~~
mynameishere
"go where?" I don't get it.
At any rate, failure is a part of business. Think of a store owner: He sits
and watches people enter and exit all day long without buying anything.
Failure, failure, failure. If you can't stomach it, then _that_ is your real
problem, not what PG thinks--remember that PG has his prejudices when it comes
to technology, and I don't think he likes games very much.
------
mukund
Getting frustrated for small things? First thing is one must understand that
they may be better plans and ideas by better people. The assumptions that my
idea is the best is the cause of these problems. When one is passionate about
one's stuff, a slight rejection of that angers one. If one things that his/her
own stuff is the best then why not be confident enough to keep working on that
and may be who knows that D-day will come when you will be recognized.
------
mattculbreth
Keep your head up man, it's all good. YC said in the email that it's an error-
prone process. I know of at least one blunder they made. :)
~~~
theoutlander
So do I :)
------
theoutlander
What VC's or YC say is not the ultimate ...if you have a great idea, it will
succeed if you execute it right! If you are that into YC, you should apply
again... Obviously, these guys cannot accept everyone, so they had to find
some reason here and there to eliminate people ...
------
marketer
Up to this point most college-aged kids have followed a clearly defined path:
do well in school, go to college, etc.. Paul has structured YC so it's an easy
and well structured method of doing a startup, but it's definitely not the
only way to go.
------
gibsonf1
Maybe the issue is that YC is not funding stand-alone games but focusing on
web technologies which would mean it has nothing to do with the merits of your
plan. (Is the game web-based?)
------
whacked_new
I'm actually most impressed by the line in the essay, pg's "why not to start a
startup" pushed your cofounder over the edge.
------
timg
summary:
Tease investors suck the life out of startups.
~~~
mattjaynes
Actually, the summary should be:
"Tease investors (cough, in this definition _all_ investors) suck the life out
of WEAK startups."
Startups that really have any potential will not be phased by a trivial
'setback' like this.
From my notes on pg's talk the other day:
Some founders approach investors as if they are asking for permission to start
a company. That is very much the wrong approach. You need to make it clear
that the train is leaving and if they want to be on it, they better get on.
That being said, you have to mean it 100%, because if you don't, they'll be
able to tell. A good way to mean it 100% is to have a solid backup plan. What
also helps is to start cheap and avoid doing the expensive things till later
so you don't _need_ the investment, but can get real momentum going for your
company.
You're startup needs to be like a cockroach - hard to kill, even after a
nuclear war. Don't be a delicate beautiful flower, be a cockroach.
------
vlad
I'm half asleep right now..
The word on the street is that adventure games are the next big thing in
casual games. Not sudoku, or bejeweled. Casual gamers expect more these days.
Adventure games are also much harder and take much more time to clone.
Finally, you could sell level packs to your customers once your actual product
is done, something that you can't do for games with random levels. I think
between your web site and the main portals (RealArcade, BigFishGames, Oberon)
and your own web site you can start your own niche. Just make sure you can
partner with somebody who can create great art, quickly. However, the kind of
companies PG wants for YC are ones that can have a reasonable demo after just
three months of work, and also those that he knows enough about that he can
actually contribute to. In other words, there are millions of things in the
digital world one could make money off, but PG (like everybody else) is
interested in a subset of them, and no investor who wants to be involved with
a project will choose one where you'll be in the corner working on your own
thing and he will only play a small role in the fun. (I wouldn't be surprised
if helping startups from scratch IS like an adventure game to PG.)
And, actually, Yahoo! could actually buy you considering they are one of the
top places for selling casual games. BigFishGames bought a developer in Europe
after he came out with 2 or 3 hit games within 1 year, and called it
BigFishGames Europe. In other words, the portals are buying developers who can
actually create a quality game on a low budget, quickly and repeatedly. When
they own the developer, they can put it on the front page and make a lot more
profit, such as BigFishGames is doing with their Mystery series of games. But,
some people have made a decent living (not millionaires, but livable).
If you want to create adventure games that use the mouse that are easy to get
into and want to make about $8-$10 per sale on the portals and about $18 on
your web site, go for it. Those are the kinds of games that people want which
are also hard to clone, and hard to find a free flash game online to replace.
You also have the advantage of creating some IP (character, names, trademarks)
to use later, which is hard to do if you're just creating Bejeweled (and for
which games will easily find flash games if they don't want to pay for the
real versions.)
So, go for it, as long as you are focusing on creating an actual game as soon
as possible, and not spending the next 10 months developing a framework for
your future game, because that is pointless. Aveyond is not an adventure game
but more like an RPG, but it was a good seller (supposedly) and made in Game
Maker (which also supports old-school one-screen-at-a-time adventure games.)
Just create some kind of an adventure game where you own the IP using Game
Maker, then after you are a big success you can port it to XBOX 360 or the
Mac. The key is to create a game, not a game framework.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
iPad Haskell Editor - LukeHoersten
http://slidetocode.com/raskell/
======
dannyobrien
This looks great, and something I've been looking for for a while. One thing:
I tried checking the type of a function with Hugs' ':type' command, and it
crashed. Peering a types is pretty much all I do when hacking Haskell -- would
it be possible to have support for it?
I love the vi command keyboard!
~~~
steeleduncan
That crash slipped in at the last moment, have fixed it now. Yes, I am missing
those commands as well, I will look into adding them.
~~~
jlturner
I experienced this too, but overall this is a great app. Hope you continue
development. If only Apple ToS would allow package management...
~~~
jlturner
Also seems to crash randomly when importing standard libraries (like Data.Map)
in a file I'm currently editing, making it somewhat unusable for the time
being.
------
morganwilde
I applaud the effort, especially the virtual keyboard with the actual meaning
of vi commands, instead of HJKL.
------
dserban
The demo doesn't have a voiceover, but this project looks intriguing. I would
love to read a side-by-side comparative review of Raskell and iHaskell (which
I've used on someone else's iPad, and liked).
------
klrr
Does it compile code on the iPad or does it use some online API like the other
Haskell programs on the Apple App Store?
~~~
steeleduncan
It compiles to a virtual machine, then interprets on the iPad. No internet
connection is required.
~~~
tluyben2
This is allowed by Apple because no code is loaded from the net right?
~~~
steeleduncan
Yes, interpreters are ok, but they must not execute downloadable code
(including email imports and iTunes sync)
~~~
tluyben2
I read somewhere that it's ook if it is javascript executed with jscore; know
if that is true? That would give slightly more leeway.
~~~
steeleduncan
I think so. It is hard to disallow that without crippling the OS.
------
pikachu_is_cool
What advantages does this have (other than the changing keyboard button icons)
over running haskell in MobileTerminal with an actual vim/emacs/nano/whatever
I want to use? Why should I pay $3 for this if I can do it for free already?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why no looting in Japan? - sunjain
http://caffertyfile.blogs.cnn.com/2011/03/15/why-is-there-no-looting-in-japan/?hpt=T1
This does not actually answer this question...but should be an interesting analysis.
======
tc
From _Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman!_ ; Feynman and a colleague are
staying at a traditional Japanese hotel in Kyoto:
The next morning the young woman taking care of our room fixes the bath, which
was right in our room. Sometime later she returns with a tray to deliver
breakfast. I'm partly dressed. She turns to me and says, politely, "Ohayo,
gozai masu," which means, "Good morning."
Pais is just coming out of the bath, sopping wet and completely nude. She
turns to him and with equal composure says, "Ohayo, gozai masu ," and puts the
tray down for us.
Pais looks at me and says, "God, are we uncivilized!"
We realized that in America if the maid was delivering breakfast and the guy's
standing there, stark naked, there would be little screams and a big fuss. But
in Japan they were completely used to it, and we felt that they were much more
advanced and civilized about those things than we were.
~~~
StavrosK
I came here to quote Feynman too, but a different part:
_This question of trying to figure out whether a book is good or bad by
looking at it carefully or by taking the reports of a lot of people who looked
at it carelessly is like this famous old problem: Nobody was permitted to see
the Emperor of China, and the question was, What is the length of the Emperor
of China’s nose? To find out, you go all over the country asking people what
they think the length of the Emperor of China’s nose is, and you average it.
And that would be very “accurate” because you averaged so many people. But
it’s no way to find anything out; when you have a very wide range of people
who contribute without looking carefully at it, you don’t improve your
knowledge of the situation by averaging._
It seems to me that they asked a bunch of people in the US why they _think_
there is no looting in Japan...
~~~
jerf
It strikes me as a theory with very poor explanatory power. We've seen many
crises in the US as well, and Katrina was an _exception_. There have been a
couple of others within my lifetime, but it's not politically correct to point
out what similarities they may have. (I suppose I should point out this isn't
a veiled reference to _race_ , it's actually 100% _cultural_ , but it's still
not politically correct to discuss.) It is true in the US we always have to be
at least a bit worried about looting, we can't quite _completely_ write it
off, but in general it doesn't happen, and we do have a very loose society by
comparison to Japan's. Whatever the determining factor is, that is not it, at
least not directly.
~~~
bilbo0s
Sorry, not trying to anger anyone or anything, I am genuinely interested.
Where in the US was there a natural disaster of significant scale where there
was no looting?
I'm actually from Wisconsin, but was living in Cedar Rapids during the floods,
and there was looting there. My neighbor was the cop chasing these guys down.
I am just curious how other communities were able to avoid looting.
BTW, Cedar Rapids is in Iowa.
~~~
coconutrandom
Not a disaster quite, but in Houston everyone evacuated from the hurricane and
no one I knew reported any looting happening.
~~~
dctoedt
And people turned out to help, first to clean up their own blocks, then to
help with citywide food banks.
------
tsuyoshi
There was a major power outage in much of the northeastern North America,
affecting tens of millions of people, and almost no looting (aside from
isolated incidents in Ottawa and Brooklyn) there either. There was a major
terrorist attack in New York in 2001 and no looting. There was a major
earthquake in San Francisco in 1989 and no looting. This statement that
"looting is something we see after almost every tragedy" is simply not true.
~~~
asdkl234890
Exactly! This _Why are the Japanese so different!_ is just romanticising them
for not being us. It may not quite rise to racism, but it certainly is silly.
------
orijing
I am surprised nobody mentioned this yet: Japan has a much MUCH lower level of
income (and wealth) inequality than the US, Haiti, etc. [1]
There are just a lot fewer poor people in Japan. So if your house got leveled
by the tsunami, you can go to your friends, relatives, family, etc for a
little help because they aren't half impoverished already.
I don't mean to demean the theory regarding social differences. I'm sure it's
very true that society's standards and everyone's individual respect for
shared property play crucial roles in the lack of looting. But I'm willing to
bet that economic factors made a difference too.
[1] [https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-
factbook/...](https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-
factbook/rankorder/2172rank.html)
~~~
pessimizer
The UN Gini numbers:
Japan: .249
US: .408
Haiti: .592
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equ...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_income_equality)
Aside from media exaggeration of looting, which is almost instant after a
disaster where there are significant numbers of black people. Pretty much, the
mirror image of this post. Google "looting in Japan" if you want to take a
sample of the most racist invective on the internet. I mean, if the Japanese
have honor in their blood...
------
po
Japan takes a lot of criticism for being a closed off culture. After living
here for a while I have started to believe that it is necessary to support
these values. Multiculturalism means lowest common denominator. There are
efficiencies you can gain by having a monoculture. Nobody has to lock their
bikes, subways can have nice cloth seats and you can walk around in any
neighborhood and be safe.
When I came to Tokyo, a lot of foreigners I met who had been living here
complained about the uptight nature of Japan. Too rigid, too exclusive, too
slow to change.
Before Tokyo, I lived in a very nice part of Brooklyn. I remember I was
walking down the street and I saw a man with his child come out of a store.
The kid unwrapped his new toy and promptly threw the package onto the curb. I
had a flash of anger and was thinking "what's wrong with that guy not
correcting his kid?" As I was thinking this, the guy threw his cigarette pack
cellophane on the sidewalk. He had different values than me, and I had a dirty
street because of it.
In a place like Brooklyn you learn tolerance and how to live with other
people's values on a day to day basis. In a place like Tokyo, the system shuns
you until you adopt their values. I don't think either is necessarily better
but you should be aware of it when you live in Japan and feel left out.
~~~
mapgrep
"There are efficiencies you can gain by having a monoculture. Nobody has to
lock their bikes, subways can have nice cloth seats and you can walk around in
any neighborhood and be safe."
Bangladesh is 98% ethnic Bengali; you can read about their crime here
[http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1011.html#c...](http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1011.html#crime)
("U.S. citizens should avoid walking alone after dark, carrying large sums of
money, or wearing expensive jewelry").
Lesotho is 99.7 percent Basotho, with an intentional homicide rate seven times
higher than the U.S.
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentiona...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate)
Meanwhile, Singapore, split between large numbers of Chinese, Malays and
Indians is one of the safest places in the world
(<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Singapore>). Also safe is Switzerland,
which is so ethnically diverse there are three official languages, each widely
spoken within the country.
([http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1034.html#c...](http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1034.html#crime))
.
~~~
po
Please note that I'm _not_ saying all monocultures are safe. I am certainly
also not saying multi-cultures are unsuccessful. This has nothing to do with
safety or success, more efficiency gains and tolerance costs. I'm trying to
raise a nuanced point and I went out of my way to say neither is better than
the other.
I think the efficiency gained depends on the culture gaining it. Japan has
decided that they value safety. In Bangladesh there are probably different
assumptions you can make. I don't know what they are and I don't want to
speculate because I don't have any experience living there.
_edit:_ also wanted to add... even though Switzerland is ethnically diverse
and speaks many different languages, I would still call it a mono-culture. The
swiss are also sometimes criticized for being unique in their ways and
resistant to change. Culture is not the same as race or language.
~~~
mapgrep
"Please note that I'm not saying all monocultures are safe."
Sure, but you attributed safety and other "efficiencies" in Japan to
"monoculture." You also wrote, "Multiculturalism means lowest common
denominator."
Now you seem to be attributing safety in Japan not to monoculture but to
/Japanese/ culture. Fair enough.
In that case, what would happen if 10 million Japanese moved to Bangladesh,
making it more multicultural? Would it be a less "efficient" culture? Would it
be anchored by the "lowest common denominator," or would the nation improve
through the infusion of new cultural values? It seems doubtful that, after
conducting this thought experiment, most people could honestly conclude that,
"Multiculturalism means lowest common denominator." It likewise seems hard to
imagine Singapore in its present state -- including efficiency-wise -- if all
those ethnic Chinese has never migrated there.
The big context here is that you were defending Japan against criticism that
it is a "closed off culture" and "too exclusive, too slow to change." That
criticism is very well earned; for all its many virtues, there is a disturbing
level of racism in Japan, against Koreans and Americans of black heritage
(usually in military service there but not always, see
[http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1101880815-...](http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1101880815-149882,00.html)).
There is also the matter of Japan's depressingly extended economic stagnation,
going on 20 years old now, which is widely and credibly explained as being
closely tied to an unwillingness to embrace new, often foreign values around
business, corporate culture, risk taking, credit and competition.
The one time I visited Japan, for two weeks, I conjured many positive words to
describe the country. "Efficient" was not one of them. The grueling, sit-at-
your desk 14 hour workdays that are de rigueur in Japan are not particularly
efficient. The make-work jobs everywhere also seemed inefficient, like the guy
in a uniform bowing in apology non-stop to people driving by a construction
detour in the road, or the full time ticket taker/thanker in the back of the
bus who collected my payment stub. The many ritual greetings and apologies
also did not seem efficient.
I have a hard time seeing how multiculturalism would not ENHANCE Japan's
efficiency -- and economy.
Update:
"The swiss are also sometimes criticized for being unique in their ways and
resistant to change. Culture is not the same as race or language."
In that case, Brooklyn is a monoculture of New Yorkers, or Americans, and your
original distinction between it and Japan is rather meaningless.
~~~
po
_Now you seem to be attributing safety in Japan not to monoculture but to
/Japanese/ culture. Fair enough._
Yes I wasn't careful enough in my writing. I mean to say that monoculture
allows you to optimize around your values. Lowest common denominator sounds
too judgmental but I mean it in the set-theory kind of way. I probably should
just have said "common values".
_what would happen if 10 million Japanese moved to Bangladesh, making it more
multicultural? Would it be a less "efficient" culture?_
Yes, I think there would be certain generalizations that you could no longer
depend on being true. I don't know what they would be. Maybe it would be
better, maybe worse. Maybe it would be you would have to order a wider variety
of food at your wedding to make everyone happy. I don't know. I would say
that's a reduction in efficiency.
I am aware of racism here and I don't think it's good. I don't think Japanese
companies are economically efficient but they pretty good at reflecting
Japanese values. I eat a restricted diet and it's an inconvenience that people
assume that I just eat the standard issue Japanese cuisine. A lot of people
complain about that but I understand why it is that way.
I don't see what is so controversial about what I'm trying to say. I'm saying
that having to always be tolerant for the way other people do things trades
something off compared to living where everyone already does things mostly the
way you would.
~~~
mapgrep
I think I grok your meaning of "efficiency" now; I'm definitely not suggesting
you are an intolerant person.
I would politely challenge, however, the idea that there's roughly equal
virtue between Brooklyn-style embraced diversity vs Japan-style conformity.
Not only does multiculturalism have a genuine moral attractiveness, which
should not be dismissed, it makes for a stronger, more resilient country over
the long term. Fresh ideas, fresh values, fresh labor, fresh taxpayers, fresh
consumers, fresh inventors and indeed fresh culture are stengths that have
been indispensable in allowing the U.S. to overcome its many deep (and often
chronic) flaws and attain the level of economic and cultural success that it
has. Similarly, a tendency toward xenophobia has hampered Japan's many
intrinsic strengths, which have nevertheless been strong enough to set the
country as an (oft misinterpreted) example of How To Win.
TLDR: Monoculture is a harmful, false optimization at the national level
(though quite useful within, say, an apartment, church or startup incubator).
~~~
koudelka
This reminded me of a quote from Shirow Masamune's Ghost In The Shell:
"No matter how powerful we may be fighting-wise, a system where all the parts
react the same way is a system with a fatal flaw. Like individual, like
organization. Overspecialization leads to death."
------
chrismealy
This was already debunked:
'Professor Pflugfelder evidently needs to study Japanese history a little
better because after the Great Kanto Earthquake of 1923 there was widespread
looting and rioting, and during the firebombings of WWII looting was a common
practice. If these are deep cultural roots, they only go back about two
generations'
[http://partialobjects.com/2011/03/is-looting-our-default-
rea...](http://partialobjects.com/2011/03/is-looting-our-default-reaction-to-
trouble/)
~~~
kentosi
I just read the article, and the one main point s/he makes that struck me is
that in Japan, as opposed to Katrina, the citizens KNOW that they'll be looked
after.
Comparing the situation to here in Australia where we had floods and
hurricanes, it's the same: we know that the government will look after us.
So I agree with him/her. It's got nothing to do with culture/etc. Because if
you take away all the efforts the government and international community are
making, then I bet the situation in Japan would be totally different.
------
micheljansen
This is something that really surprised me about Japanese culture. I went
there in 2008 for a study tour and one of the things that really impressed me
is how different their attitude towards shared property and public space is.
On numerous occasions I saw things where I thought: wow, in my country (The
Netherlands) this would totally get abused, vandalized or stolen. Not that my
country is not safe or dirty, just that it is individualized to the extent
that people place more value on the well-being of themselves and their stuff
than that which they share with others or the public space.
Some examples:
Vending machines are so ubiquitous in Japan that they are an icon in itself.
Trash cans, on the other hand, are not. However, you rarely see trash on the
streets. Not because there are exorbitant penalties for this, people simply
don't do it. People simply drag their trash along until they get to a place
with a trash can (maybe their home or office) and dispose of it there.
In crowded areas, there are always plenty of public toilets and they are
generally free to use. Not once have I seen one that was dirty or vandalized.
At one point, I found myself in a packed bus that had one of those old-
fashioned destination "tickers" made out of a roll of paper with the names of
all destinations printed on it. When we still had those buses in my country,
they were encased in industry-grade steel enclosures, lest people break the
thing or change the destination. In Japan, one could just reach out and do
just that, yet nobody did.
In six week of traveling through Japan, visiting dozens of places and most
major cities, I saw one wall that had graffiti on it. This was so special that
I took a picture of it.
I think it is too easy to "blame" this cultural difference on a "shame"
effect, as is often done. I spoke to a lot of Japanese people and my
impression is quite different. I would say the major reason why there is so
little looting in Japan, is that rather than thinking about their own petty
interests first, Japanese consider the quality of the public or shared space
to be just as important to their personal well-being. In other words: when
western people throw their trash on the floor, they think "Good, I got rid of
my trash"; for Japanese people nothing changed, since it is still in "their"
space, so they better dispose of it properly.
Disclaimer: I am by no means an expert on all things Japanese. I was just
there for six weeks and this is my impression, I might very well be totally
wrong :)
~~~
donw
There's plenty of graffiti, just not in plain sight. Look in the alleys.
Regarding the trash, there's two forces at work. One is that there's a rich
naturalist tradition here. Japanese _love_ nature, which is why you see so
many people enjoying the parks here. Littering goes against that tradition,
and the second force at work is that Japanese people really don't buck
tradition.
~~~
mc32
To me, the way they "love" nature, is a bit different form the nature I'm used
to. Nature means a weekend walk in the park -meanwhile many riparian areas
have simply been paved over. So the love for nature is a little different.
It's more "human tamed nature". It's kind of like when humans (yama girls)
outnumber trees that you know it's not really nature.
Agree with the rest though.
------
kstenerud
Same reason nobody vandalizes vending machines, even when they're quite
literally in the middle of nowhere along the side of an unfrequented road in
the countryside.
Same reason it's unthinkable for a Japanese to take fruit or berries hanging
outside of someone's yard, even when it's falling off the branch and rotting
on the ground, and yet they'd hardly think twice in their downtown drunken
stupor to steal a bicycle to get them home after the trains had shut down for
the night.
They have different social norms there.
~~~
kmfrk
Japanese vending machines also have a safety lever (of sorts) that makes all
the beverages free, in the event of a catastrophe.
I don't know how it works specifically, but I'm sure there would be better
ways than to vandalize the machines in order to obtain the contents.
~~~
huhtenberg
I don't know if this is true, but this was making rounds today:
If you need water, Suntory vending machines have emergency
levers beneath a sticker on the upper-right corners. Pull
the sticker off, pull the lever firmly and you’ll get free
drinks.
------
naner
[http://partialobjects.com/2011/03/is-looting-our-default-
rea...](http://partialobjects.com/2011/03/is-looting-our-default-reaction-to-
trouble/)
_when you feel like you’re on your own, when you feel abandoned and the only
one who you can depend on is you, then yes, you’re going to do what you have
to do to survive. This has been seen around the world in many countries and
cultures. The big difference in postwar modern Japan is that people are
confident that help is on the way._
...
_Here’s where you see a glaring cultural difference: virtually nobody in
contemporary Japan has this kind of contempt for their fellow countrymen. Yet
prewar Japan was deeply divided along class lines, and when disaster happened
and the poor starved and burned, neither the government nor the upper classes
could be bothered to give a shit. Currently in Japan there are calls for the
government to scrap proposed tax cuts and use the money for relief efforts.
Can you imagine the same happening in the US?_
~~~
yummyfajitas
_Can you imagine the same happening in the US?_
No, we would have both tax cuts and relief efforts funded by deficit spending.
That's something you can do when your debt to GDP ratio is 60% and when the
world considers your bonds to be risk free.
It's trickier for Japan to do that - their debt to GDP ratio is 200% already
(second only to Zimbabwe).
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_by_pub...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_by_public_debt)
~~~
bcaulf
Wow, I did not know that. Worse than Greece at 144%!
------
patio11
Looting is the exception in most Western nations, not the rule. I love crime
here, don't get me wrong, but how many reports of widespread looting have we
ever heard in the US? Rodney King riots, Katrina (and that was exaggerated)...
that's about it, right? Massive floods strike Iowa, war breaks out, terrorist
attacks, lethal heat waves, Bulls win trophy, none of these calamities cause
looting.
Yeah, one of those things is not like the others _sigh_.
~~~
bilbo0s
Wow,
where did you get the idea that no one in Iowa got robbed during the floods?
As a matter of full disclosure, I think I should tell you that I lived there
at the time of the flood and had to listen to my neighbor go on and on about
what he was dealing with. Neighbor was a cop.
------
joebananas
Man, you guys are just busting out with the exotism in this here thread.
"People there carry honor in their blood"...
~~~
9999
The original article is definitely full of that sentiment, although the
responses here are more measured.
Still, why has no one mentioned the fact that there is nothing left to loot in
the areas most effected?
~~~
w1ntermute
I do believe joebananas is referring to this[0] comment, which is indeed on
HN:
> Honor is something we can't describe but japanese people carry it in their
> blood.
0: <http://hackerne.ws/item?id=2330020>
------
Pahalial
So I read that, and the first thing that jumped out to me from the quotes:
"The so-called civilized world can learn much from the stoic Japanese."
If you don't consider Japan part of the "civilized world" you have probably
not updated your social mores since WW2 and should reconsider that before
commenting further.
~~~
biot
Either I'm misunderstanding you, or you read that the wrong way around. The
point is that those who _do_ consider themselves civilized are, in reality,
not civilized when compared to the Japanese.
------
bluehat
Many other people on this thread have compiled lists of "western" tragedies
that did not come to looting, so I think calling it a cultural thing is out.
I think the difference is that when people believe the world is watching and
that help is coming (ie September 11th, this earthquake) they maintain their
composure. People destroy and loot when they feel that the world has forgotten
them and that help is not coming. During Hurricane Katrina the government was
quite slow to respond. In Haiti it took nearly two days to reach twitter/the
public and trigger international relief. Almost nobody was there to hold them
over until then, and chaos happened. I think this is quite rational: if you
felt the world had ended and that it was not going to be made better, you'd
probably act like an animal and only think of yourself too.
------
panarky
Japan certainly has social mores that discourage petty crime.
There are also practical considerations at play. The damage is so severe that
there's not much left to loot, and there's and nowhere for looters to keep
what they steal.
The article makes comparisons with Haiti and Katrina, but the damage in Japan
is more total than either of these. In many towns there is literally nothing
left.
[http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1366395/Japan-
tsunam...](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1366395/Japan-tsunami-
earthquake-Haunting-images-450-Britons-feared-missing.html)
~~~
donw
Also, if you loot, you're ostracized. You will forever be remembered by your
community and friends as a thief.
It's very, very hard to form a new group of friends, if you have no existing
connections to leverage.
------
mistermann
This is probably a presumptuous or naive statement, but the very first thing
that came to my mind was: if you have ever been to Japan, you wouldn't even
think of asking this question.
~~~
Florin_Andrei
By all means, please do elaborate.
~~~
kragen
I was thinking the same thing. Modern Japanese culture looks very negatively
at people who put their own interests ahead of everybody else's, to an extent
that you probably can't imagine if you haven't been there, and this is backed
up by very low levels of inequality.
I remember a news program I was watching in our Japanese class in, uh,
probably 1992. A couple of policemen were interviewing a distraught
convenience-store clerk who had just been robbed.
"Did he look blue-collar, or white-collar, or what?"
"He just looked like a normal person! But obviously he wasn't, because he
robbed the store!"
Our whole class (this was in the US) burst out laughing. The idea that, in
order to commit armed robbery, a person would have to have some kind of mental
abnormality — it was so alien to us as to be comical. That idea used to exist
in US culture; Lombroso's theories used to be popular, eugenic policies were
often justified on the basis that "morons" were likely to be criminals, and
the word "crook" was a neat little package wrapping up the idea of mental
abnormality causing lawbreaking. Much of Clarence Darrow's career was spent
defending the most abhorrent criminals on the basis that their criminality was
beyond their control, although not merely because of mental defects.
But, at least since the 1970s, an alternative conception of law and
lawbreaking has been popular in the US — perhaps due to the absurd drug war,
perhaps due to the discovery of abuses like the Tuskegee experiment, J. Edgar
Hoover's campaigns of persecution against national heroes like MLK, and
government deceptions about Vietnam and the dangers of fallout from open-air
nuclear testing, perhaps due to the increasing cultural influence of
Hollywood, or perhaps simply due to the failure of prosperity to be widely
shared.
Whatever the cause, though, people from the US almost universally think of
lawbreaking as a common and often harmless activity, not something limited to
the mentally handicapped or partially insane — something that many people
would do if the law weren't restraining them.
Also, in Japan, if you deviate from social norms, everyone will pressure you
to conform. In the US, it's usually just the police.
Therefore the difference in looting behavior is unsurprising. I hypothesize
that if you look back to 1955, you'll find natural disasters in the US with
almost no looting, too.
Here in Argentina, things are even more American than in the US.
~~~
dragons
> Whatever the cause, though, people from the US almost universally think of
> lawbreaking as a common and often harmless activity, not something limited
> to the mentally handicapped or partially insane - something that many people
> would do if the law weren't restraining them.
I don't think you're correct, that's certainly not a "universal" thought,
although I suppose there may be subcultures that believe this. I live in the
US, and I don't know anyone who thinks this way (at least no one I've
discussed it with). We think criminals had a bad upbringing, or that they have
some kind of psychological problem (which may be due to physical brain
problems).
> "He just looked like a normal person! But obviously he wasn't, because he
> robbed the store!"
I like this response; it sounds like the response I'd have given.
~~~
kragen
> I live in the US, and I don't know anyone who thinks this way
You don't know anyone who thinks of _any of_ jaywalking, speeding, streaking,
riding in a car without a seatbelt, smoking marijuana, and snorting cocaine as
common and often harmless activities? _Everyone_ you know thinks of _all of_
them as activities limited to the mentally handicapped or partially insane?
~~~
BrandonM
Maybe the parent poster is from a rural area and hasn't yet reached driving
age.
------
dfischer
The Japanese have a lot of respect. When I visited a common thing said was "If
you leave your wallet on the street and come back a day later, it's likely it
will still be there or in the closest shop."
~~~
staunch
This actually happened. When we were living in Tokyo my wife lost her wallet.
A day later she found that it was sitting in the basket of her bicycle outside
our building. This was a busy street in a business district (Nihonbashi) with
hundreds of people going past it and it was a large new coach wallet with at
least a few hundred in cash.
Not that someone wouldn't have eventually stolen it though.
~~~
kmfrk
>Not that someone wouldn't have eventually stolen it though. Japan is only
nearly Utopian.
Let's be careful with the orientalism. The suicide rate[1][2] is one thing
that personally bothers me.
Japan is fundamentally different from the West, and this has its advantages
and disadvantages.
[1]:
[https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/List_of_count...](https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate)
[2]:
[https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/List_of_OECD_...](https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/List_of_OECD_countries_by_suicide_rate)
~~~
nivertech
Clear trends:
* Southern Europe/Mediterranean/Levantine countries - low suicide rates.
* English-speaking/Northern countries/former Communist block in Eastern Europe/Developed Asian countries - high suicide rates.
Seems to be related to amount of daylight, climate, stress and competition.
~~~
jules
Has anybody else noticed the magical effect of sunlight? A few days ago was
the first sunny day of the year. Everyone was very happy.
~~~
defen
Magic, or a surge of vitamin D3 in their bloodstreams.
------
vacri
This is an outrageously biased article. The previous two globally-advertised
large-scale disasters happened in western anglo countries and had minimal, if
any, looting. I'm talking about the floods that devastated Brisbane and the
Queensland coast, quickly followed by a category 5 cyclone smashing into
Townsville (Australia) and the Christchurch earthquake where the centre of the
city was levelled (New Zealand).
Both of these disasterous events had extremely little looting. Both of these
events saw _strong_ outpourings of community spirit and solidarity, with lots
of volunteering and food drops. It's not something that's mysteriously
Japanese.
This is important because the article paints this as a Japan vs the World
thing by roping in the UK, Chile and Haiti.
The article lists the following as reasons why there is little looting in
Japan: \- buddhism and shinto \- honour and dignity \- conformity and
consensus \- national pride \- high discipline \- they return your lost wallet
\- more highly evolved race (!) Few of these are attributes that random
interviewees would say are characteristics of Australians or New Zealanders
The Japanese are a unique culture and credit needs be given where due, but we
need to stop talking about them as if they're magical and mysterious, beyond
mortal ken just like Tolkein's elves.
------
kierank
I'm surprised nobody's mentioned the explanation that there's no looting
because the Government's emergency response is very good and people are
getting what they need at the shelters.
~~~
mc32
>there's no looting because the Government's emergency response is very
good...
That wasn't particularly the case during the great Hanshin EQ of 1995. I think
they did try to improve gov't response to disasters since then. So, yes, I
believe they have faith in the gov't, but it's not because of a stellar
record.
------
Kilimanjaro
I went there in the 90s and remember leaving my wallet in a store, then
walking down the street a man tapped my shoulder from the back and when I
turned I saw the store owner giving it back to me. Man I was touched by that
gesture. A couple of stores down the road we entered a jewelry and my gf tried
some expensive pearl necklaces just for the fun of it (like Y3M a pop ($30k
back then)) and she forgot to return the last one she tried. A couple of
blocks down we noticed and looked at each other with that weird sensation and
the urge to return it, like if we were guilty of something we really didn't
do.
And we did, they guy thanked us like a million times. We felt the most
honorable people on earth. Honor is something we can't describe but japanese
people carry it in their blood.
~~~
fierarul
>that weird sensation and the urge to return it, like if we were guilty of
something we really didn't do.
Same thing happened to us in a Spanish clothing shop. Wife went out with some
blouse she tried and somehow this didn't trip that alarm at the door. While
groceries shopping nearby we notice the blouse.
>And we did, they guy thanked us like a million times. We felt the most
honorable people on earth.
We go return the blouse, the alarm starts while we enter then we have to
fiddle explaining in half-Spanish what we meant to do.
We end up paying for the damn blouse, with the guard next to us but we don't
get a receipt because that's company policy (I'd guess a form of punishment so
you couldn't return the item).
In the end we both regretted returning it and kinda ruined the whole evening.
Not sure if this is a valid Spanish/European-Japanese comparison but it
certainly is a corporate versus humane shop comparison.
------
jules
A guy in my class parked a shiny bike not locked for a month. After a month
when he came back it was still there. The chances of this happening in
Amsterdam are very slim. Even if you only lock your bike to something with a
big chain somebody with a metal cutter will come and get it if the bike is
shiny. And better lock both of your wheels and the frame through the chain or
else you end up with a bike without wheels. Unfortunately the steering wheel
and saddle are not so easily locked.
~~~
vacri
The saddle is just as easily locked - get a light chain and a padlock, wrap it
around one of the underwires of your saddle.
As for 'steering wheel'... a bike that unusual is asking to be stolen by a
curious enthusiast :)
~~~
jules
My bike doesn't have this, although my racing bike does. Unfortunately racing
bikes as made in such a way that you can detach parts easily in a couple of
seconds...so it's really necessary to bring two locks or one very long one to
lock everything.
------
zspade
NPR had a good piece about how the Chinese looked at the Japanese and wondered
the same thing when hey had so much price gouging and looting themselves
during their last major earthquake.
~~~
est
Ok, just to be clear, since when did Chinese start looting in earthquakes? I
admit there are prices gouging in the 2008 earthquake, but looting?
~~~
zspade
There was some looting during the 2008 earthquake, but not really that much
upon doing more research. They did have significant issues with price gouging
on essential goods like food/water/blanknets etc. The way the NPR worded it,
and the chinese nationals they got sounds bites from made it easy to jump to
the wrong conclusions...
------
teyc
Broken windows at work here. Nobody loots because nobody else loots.
In any instance, it takes a few disgruntled, enterprising people to start a
riot or mass vandalism. Particularly the disaffected.
Racial homogeneity can only go so far to explain things, but Japan is a
country where people generally look out for one another. When I was there,
people were so polite that I thought these people were feigning politeness. I
remembered walking out of a food stall when the head waiter would call out
that a customer is leaving, and all the wait staff would turn around and bow
and ask us to come again. It was simply amazing. I guess by learning to be
polite even when you are tired, stressed, you become very good at being
outwardly calm and it helps to maintain social order.
Incidentally, I remembered the caning incident where a young expat in
Singapore spray painted cars and got several strokes of cane as a punishment.
Wanton destruction is an alien concept to me when I grew up in Asia. A lot of
vandalism with spray painting were simply copy cats importing an unwanted
culture.
------
geoffw8
This was the first thing I thought about when it all kicked off. I watched a
video on one of the news reports and when the earthquake hit, staff in the
stores instead of hiding tried steadying shelves to stop things falling off.
We honestly have a long way to go.
~~~
pyre
Japan also gets more earthquakes than most places that you're probably used
to. Even though this one was larger, it seems that to the Japanese, dealing
with earthquakes is rote.
------
forkandwait
I think it is high level of "human capital" plus an understanding that your
society is a cooperative venture. I am not sure, but I would hazard that most
Japanese are highly literate, brought up to behave well, and that there is
actually a social contract in force. I am willing to bet just a little bit of
money that your average high school grad (i.e. "working class") Japanese
person would rival our state college educated class for both high levels of
good behavior and knowledge. I bet there would be similar behavior in the
Scandinavian countries.
And, interestingly, everyone would expect the students at a state college or
better to behave just like the Japanese.
Really, the fact that there is such widespread poverty, thuggery, and low
educational levels in the US is just plain embarrassing. That you can't trust
the people you live around is the weird thing, not that you can.
------
temphn
The answer to this question is completely obvious to people who spent
formative years in Asia and are free of American/Western taboos (we have other
taboos no doubt but not these).
Here is why there is no looting in Japan. Across the world -- in the US, UK,
Canada, Brazil, South Africa and any country where they live side by side --
people of primarily Northeast Asian descent tend to commit crime at lower
rates than people of primarily European descent, who in turn tend to commit
crime at lower rates than people of primarily sub-Saharan African descent.
You can google the various crime stats if you aren't aware of this. Here are
the California state statistics:
<http://stats.doj.ca.gov/cjsc_stats/prof09/00/22.htm>
Divide that by California population totals to get the rank ordering of
violent crime rates by population.
You can also look at table 43 of the FBI Uniform Crime Reports, which is fine
for establishing the black/Asian violent crime ratio, but which lumps
Hispanics in with whites, inflating the apparent white violent crime rate.
<http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2009/data/table_43.html>
Similar stats can be obtained for other countries with a bit of googling. Now,
the absolute magnitudes do change (1), which one could legitimately ascribe to
the local culture. But the trend is very consistent.
There isn't a country across the world that I'm aware of in which people of
primarily sub-Saharan African descent commit crime at a lower rate (or have
higher educational levels, incomes, and so on) than people of Northeast Asian
descent. Interested in counterexamples, but this appears to be a very
consistent pattern.
Obviously there are other factors as well. But the probability of looting
seems to be proportional to a group's propensity to disorganized violence
(e.g. murder, rape, robbery) and inversely proportional to their ability to
commit organized violence (e.g. military actions).
No doubt this post is extraordinarily blasphemous. But someone had to say what
a good fraction of the rest of the world is thinking.
(1) Cultural variation seems to shift magnitudes but not rank ordering. That
is, it does not appear to be a large enough factor to make Northeast Asian
descent individuals in country X commit more crime than sub-Saharan African
descent individuals in country Y. At least, I couldn't find any examples of
this for any (X, Y) pair in the world, but perhaps you can.
~~~
smackfu
Conflating race and socio-economic status is a pretty classic justification
for racism.
------
winestock
At the same time, we must ask: Why _so much_ looting in Haiti and New Orleans?
------
Emore
This is not a perfect truth. Friend reports that her family have seen
(directly or indirectly, I don't know) both theft and rape. Nonetheless, the
extent is probably much less than any other place of crisis.
------
Chi019
Population genetics, as it affects those parts of the nervous system involved
in social behavior, together with geography and a long common history,
predisposed the Japanese to strong ethnonationalism and social stability in a
well-organized and well-supervised hierarchical order. Under premodern
conditions this did not preclude intracommunal violence under codes widely
understood and enforced; but in the affluent post-WW2 world, with good
standards of health and education, and under imposed consensual government
following certain highly salutary experiences, these old factors directed the
Japanese to an exceptionally high level of nonviolent social cohesion and
intense but benign racial-national consciousness.
[http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/262162/people-want-
know...](http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/262162/people-want-know-contd-
john-derbyshire)
------
bilbo0s
One word : 'Individualism'
The article mentions UK floods, Chile and Haiti earthquakes, and Katrina. The
UK, Chile, Haiti and US are all 'Individual at the Center' societies. By
contrast, Japan is not so 'Individualist' a society.
You may have less looting in a place like Japan after a natural disaster of
this scale. However, if there is ever say ... oh ... a recession, you will
have 100,000,000 people standing around waiting for the authorities to 'fix
it'. You will observe far fewer people launching startups for instance, than
you would in similar recessionary environment in say ... Chile.
Just wanted to make sure everyone realized that 'it cuts both ways' as it
were. All societies have strengths and weaknesses. In fact, as in this case,
the strength of any society usually is its weakness.
~~~
InclinedPlane
More so, modern Japan is not a pure entity, it is the product of Japan's prior
history, the events of WWII, the American occupation, the reconstruction, and
the close ties with America since. Without all of the latter Japan as a nation
would be quite different today.
------
hasenj
I think it's really just because there aren't many poor people (socialism is
good :D)
I'm pretty sure it's not honor. Middle Eastern cultures also put plenty of
emphasis on honor and dignity, but there are many poor pockets of society that
simply ignore these values during times of crises.
------
maxklein
I'd personally think that it's because the japanese have a greater sense of
'us' than in countries where looting occurs. Nobody thinks to loot from their
family, only from other people.
------
krig
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence. Just because there are no news
reports about looting doesn't mean it's not going on. The social difference
may be in how news are reported, not in how people cope with disaster. I'm not
saying that's what is going on, just saying that the statement "there is no
looting in Japan" is taken as fact without any closer examination, which is a
very unscientific approach.
~~~
krig
Also, from the photos of the stricken areas that I've seen; what are you going
to loot? Everything is destroyed, there is no way to get around, there are
rescue teams working around the clock. It's not a situation where houses were
flooded but remain mostly intact. There are no houses anymore.
Photos of empty store shelves are from areas outside the disaster zone where
people are preparing for a possible radiation disaster where they would be
unable to go out of their homes for days. That's not a situation that is
conductive to looting.
------
davidasikin
I've collected heartwarming tweets from the eye-witnesses of 2011 Sendai
earthquake as seen on Twitter timeline.
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2330680>
They tell their experiences following the earthquake. These snippets of what
moved them and touched them during these very trying times are heart-warming.
From the tweets you can see the spirit of "in it together".
------
grammaton
By and large people _don't_ go crazy looting during disasters. The idea that
the moment authority disappears, we instantly devolve in to dog-eat-dog
anarchy is a myth - mostly promulgated by those who feel it's their job to be
the one in charge.
There are notable exceptions, of course, but for the most part people can do a
pretty good job of policing themselves.
------
jjordan
People respecting people, even in great tragedy and chaos. Refreshing.
~~~
jf271
From another board:
"We have friends over there and what info we are getting is that they are
having to deal with heartache and problems of Biblical proportions. If it
weren't for those citizens who are in the older age group who know what to do
in desperate times there would be more problems. The older people are self
reliant and remember Hiroshima, Nagasaki...they know how to share with each
other and help each other in the worst of times. Panic has not gripped them as
it would a lot of other countries...look at Haiti..look at other regions where
something less than this has taken hold and how they react."
------
danenania
Aside from the strong cultural values and homogeneity of that culture, I would
think socioeconomic factors must have a major impact. I don't know how the
statistics stack up in Japan, but looting is generally an activity of the poor
and disenfranchised. Anyone have data pertinent to this?
~~~
kentbuckle
<http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/22/world/asia/22poverty.html> The poverty rate
in Japan isn't that much lower than the US (15.7% vs. 17.1% according to the
article). However, people below that line in Japan are somewhat unwilling to
admit being in poverty.
~~~
rick888
It's not only people that are poor, but people that have a poor culture that
loot. I can bet there were lots of poor people in Japan that didn't loot or
steal from their neighbors.
------
guelo
I can't find the link right now but I'm prety sure I saw a news report
yesterday about some looting happening. In any case, I see absolutely nothing
wrong with looting in an emergency situation where there is no access to food
and water.
~~~
Florin_Andrei
Well, that's surviving, not looting.
------
yannickmahe
There wasn't any looting also in the 2008 Chinese Wenchuan earthquake, where
people are much poorer. I don't think the absence of looting has anything to
do with the Japanese spirit, and is more about the human spirit.
I'd expect the same from anywhere.
------
mgutz
Does not surprise me at all. I remember being in Japan in the service for only
two weeks. Two things I remember:
1) I left a noodle restaurant and left a little too much for the bill. The
owner ran me down on the street and handed me the change. She would not accept
it as a tip even after I begged her to keep it for her honesty.
2) A policeman on foot simply has to waive an orange baton at you if you were
speeding. Offenders just pulled over.
There is much to admire about Japanese culture. Really what it comes down to
is, the USA is a ME-first culture. Japan is an US-first culture. I always say
the way to get back at Japan and most of Asia is to westernize them.
------
starpilot
I've heard anecdotally that the Japanese are horribly repressed. They also
have the second-highest suicide rate among industrialized nations:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_OECD_countries_by_suici...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_OECD_countries_by_suicide_rate)
(South Korea is #1, USA is #20). They may be composed, but their culture is
far from an ideal.
------
Chi019
From a review of Wilson and Herrnstein's Crime and Human Nature:
"Criminals tend to be young males who are muscular rather than thin, and who have lower-than-average IQs and impulsive, "now"-oriented personalities, which make planning or even thinking about the future difficult."
Is there any group other than the Japanese for whom that description would be
less fitting?
------
furyg3
Income equality?
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gini_Coefficient_World_CIA...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gini_Coefficient_World_CIA_Report_2009.png)
If you already have about the same amount of stuff as everyone else, stealing
seems silly.
------
Keile
But there is looting in Japan.
Andrew Sullivan on The Atlantic has articles linking to cases of looting,
fraud, child molestation and hoarding.
The Japanese government itself just isn't very forthright with regards to
collecting and releasing information about victims and events.
------
michaelty
I'm guessing they haven't run out of food yet. Then there's the "no guns"
thing.
------
stcredzero
In part, it's the Yakuza. In the neighborhoods they control, no one commits
crimes they disapprove of. It's much better for it to be peaceful for the
gambling and other revenues.
~~~
splat
That would be really interesting if true. Do you have any sources to back that
up?
~~~
kstenerud
No. The Yakuza generally do not participate in civilian affairs, nor are they
interested in "policing", except where someone becomes a personal nuisance to
a higher-up or someone disrupts their business.
Their primary interest lies in the financial side of mizu-shobai type
establishments, gambling, and money laundering.
They also offer thug-work-for-hire, which is helpful when the police aren't,
but you've got to be careful dealing with them because there tend to be hidden
costs to their "help".
* whoops. replied at the wrong level :P
~~~
kstenerud
What I am saying is that the lack of looting has nothing to do with the
Yakuza.
------
kingkawn
From what I've heard many vendors are also giving away their goods, especially
food, during the crisis, so it sorta precludes looting doesn't it?
------
ChRoss
I'm not a Japanese, but I will say it's because of their Bushido spirit
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bushido>
------
georgieporgie
Japan seems to have very little crime, or at least, very little obvious crime.
This may be rooted in their distant past. Here is a quote from "Sources of
Japanese Tradition - From Earliest Times to 1600" which contains description
of Japan by Chinese from around 297 CE:
There is no theft, and litigation is infrequent. In case of violations of the
law, the light offender loses his wife and children by confiscation; as for
the grave offender, the members of his household and also his kinsmen are
exterminated.
------
funthree
How about because the Japanese have been living on that island for what,
30,000 years? I think they have a sense of longevity in their culture that we
could all really learn from.
~~~
olivercameron
So have the people of England, what's your point?
~~~
michaeldhopkins
No, they have not. Roman Briton was a different society than pre-Roman Briton.
The Anglo-Saxons came about 1500 years ago and nearly completely replaced the
Britons, genetically and culturally. The Norman invasion was about 950 years
ago and greatly changed Anglo-Saxon culture, although not as much as the AS
changed post-Roman Briton. There were several other invaders (Danes, etc.) as
well.
By contrast, the Japanese are perhaps 3,000 years old as a distinct ethnic
group on the island.
~~~
wyclif
_The Anglo-Saxons came about 1500 years ago and nearly completely replaced the
Britons, genetically and culturally_
Replaced in that region, but the Celtic peoples were driven West and North
(Wales, Cornwall, and Northumbria).
~~~
michaeldhopkins
Yes, that is true, and I should have mentioned Northumbria especially because
that was a wonderful culture, but their numbers were still greatly reduced.
Cornish culture is now completely wiped out.
Edit: Cornishness wiped out as far as continuity. I respect the "revival
movement" but the re-rooting process will take awhile even if most of the
people there support it.
------
rajpaul
Does looting commonly follow earth quakes in a large percentage of other
countries?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Who is hiring Marketing/Sales/BizDev (1/1/11 Edition) - mschaecher
Please state the location of the job first.
======
instakill
Me (digital marketing/media). Johannesburg, South Africa.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
China’s Overrated Technocrats - metaphysics
https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/07/04/chinas-overrated-technocrats-stem-engineering-xi-jinping/
======
tomohawk
> ... engineers raised with a strong ideology, whether Islamism or communism,
> can be among the most rigid of thinkers. Engineering is “more attractive to
> individuals seeking cognitive ‘closure’ and clear-cut answers as opposed to
> more open-ended sciences,” Gambetta and Hertog wrote. And that training
> seems to encourage the idea of a toolbox that can be applied to any problem,
> such as the application of Marxist ideas to society, producing the rigid
> cruelties of the Maoist era and the crushing of dissidents under Xi in the
> 2010s.
I doubt I'd ever vote for an engineer president. We've had 2 (Carter, Hoover)
and they've both been stinkers.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Lucasfilm will use video game engines in movie post-production process - Impossible
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2295956/lucasfilm-will-combine-video-games-and-movies-to-axe-post-production-process
======
hayesdaniel
I'm a vfx guy and used to work at ILM (lucasfilm). This title is incredible
misleading. Tech to "previsualize" objects "in camera" has been around a long
time and is in pretty wide use. Avatar used it very heavily, for example.
It's important to realize that what happens in post is a whole lot more than
making a 3d object and placing it in the scene. We do a lot of integration
work in 2D by hand to match things like color, edges, etc. There's massive
amount of simulation work on water, fire, etc. Sometimes people straight-up
paint on film frames in things like photoshop.
The big win with real-time visualization is the creative control for the
direction and director of photography, who are generally far removed from the
final product and this can cause expensive second-guessing all around.
Lastly, it's a bit condescending to artists working on games to suggest that
the painstaking work that goes into making/optimizing/QCing interactive
content is something that can just happen on the fly. Sure, game engines and
hardware are pretty great, but games themselves are more and more realistic
because very specialized people are working very hard to make them that way.
~~~
ajg1977
I'm one of the engineers working on this, I even make a semi-appearance in the
video. I'm not really going to say much about it because it's a little
annoying that it leaked out, and by such a crappy recording too, but -
a) I think the title here is pretty good, better than the hyperbolic one the
Inquirer used.
b) Your middle two paragraphs are spot on
c) Given the video, it's understandable people are focused on the "actor as a
virtual character" previsualization part ('but Avatar did this two years
ago!', 'our game engine does that!', yadda yadda). That's only a small part of
it, and honestly one of the less interesting ones.
I don't see what you think is condescending though. There's not a lot of
difference today in the skill-set of a CG artist and a games artist. Generally
they're just working to different budgets. (I say that as someone who spent 15
years working on console games).
The painstaking days of game artists building models that use less than 100
verts and hand-painting 256x256 textures are gone. Now, both your CG and game-
artist build super-high resolution models, probably starting with something
like ZBrush, then decimate down to whatever they need with the highres asset
used to generate normal or displacement maps.
Optimius Prime in the original Transformers movie used ~20x more polygons than
a PS4/Xbone game would today for a similar character. That's pretty amazing
when you think that the GPUs in those machines are already handily outmatched
by PCs, and the performance gains Nividia/AMD bring with every hardware cycle.
~~~
thenomad
Interesting!
So what would you say - as one of the people involved, rather than a
journalist commenting - are the most interesting/important parts of the
project?
~~~
ajg1977
I would say that when you reach the point of being able to accurately
represent final CG in realtime, a huge number of possibilities open up :)
~~~
thenomad
Including an accurate lighting model? Or do you think that there's a
significant inflection point before that when we're still attempting to
replicate a final render using rasterizers?
(My current bee-in-bonnet, besides integrating HMDs and mocap, is realtime-ish
path tracing - but that's a while away yet, still.)
------
thenomad
Heh, they're a bit late to the party on this one...
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machinima](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machinima)
My production company already uses realtime motion capture and realtime
rendering - we've been doing so since we moved away from pure Machinima
techniques 5 years ago.
And we're currently incorporating GPU-based semi-realtime path tracing and
Oculus Rift powered VR into the mix...
------
Pxtl
Dangit, don't tease me with the words "Lucasfilm" and "game" in the same
headline - it makes me miss LucasArts.
~~~
ctdonath
_Lucasfilm has been able to transfer its techniques to film-making, shifting
video game assets into movie production._
Yes, does seem a strange innovation, having dumped the department responsible
for the assets they're now touting new uses for.
------
btown
While this is very ambitious, I'm sure that they will eventually settle on a
similar pipeline to Avatar: render in lower graphics quality in real-time,
then increase the "graphics settings" and re-render in post-production. People
are used to seeing things like realistic water and hair simulations, and those
things do just take time.
~~~
chaostheory
What they demo'd may not work for movies, but I can see it working well for
television shows for kids.
~~~
vidarh
Check out "Gormiti Nature Unleashed". It's a CGI rendered childrens cartoon,
and the rendering is so low budget that when the scene complexity gets high,
it stutters, as if they're recording from realtime rendering. Don't know if
that's what they're doing, though the entire look of it makes that plausible,
or if it's just that they've got a fixed time budget for rendering each frame
and simply skips frames for the most complex stuff.
------
kreek
I have a better technology for stormtrooper rendering, it's called guy in
stormtrooper suit, hyper-realism since 1977.
------
ctdonath
At what point will the actors use HMDs so they too can see the virtual world
they're supposedly interacting with? ...and will lag & resolution affect that
behavior in a way causing an "uncanny valley", with actors responding to
situations discernible milliseconds later than the audience expects them to?
~~~
sp332
I think a head-mounted display would get in the way of recording their facial
expressions for the characters.
------
mseepgood
Will they use the SCUMM engine?
------
codereflection
It's a damn shame that 1313 will not be made, but exciting to see that the
technology they developed for it will live on.
------
Tloewald
I wonder if there's a big project to fix script writing...
~~~
mprovost
There is (if you call it fixing):
[http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/culturebox/2013/07/hollyw...](http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/culturebox/2013/07/hollywood_and_blake_snyder_s_screenwriting_book_save_the_cat.html)
------
TheZenPsycho
WARNING: The linked page has (edit: sometimes, at random) an autoplaying video
advertisement on it.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
One-electron universe - _pius
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-electron_universe
======
chriswarbo
There's a related idea called the "transactional interpretation" of quantum
mechanics:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transactional_interpretation](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transactional_interpretation)
The idea is that every event (eg. a particle collision) sends waves forwards
and backwards in time, eg. if * is an event and </> are waves moving
backwards/forwards in time:
<- past future ->
<<<<<<<<<*>>>>>>>>>
The waves from multiple events can overlap and interfere, eg.
<<<<<<<<<<<<*>>>>>
<<<*>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The interference depends on the phase of the waves, but let's simplify and say
that similar arrows are destructive (represented as a space) and opposite
arrows are constructive (represented as a dash). In which case, the
interference pattern of the example above would be:
*--------*
It _looks like_ there is something which is created at the first event,
travels through time to the second event, and is then destroyed. That "thing"
is what we'd call a particle. This idea is called "transactional" because it
treats the existence of a particle as not just depending on the event which
_creates_ it, but also on the event which eventually _destroys_ it, and the
interference of these "waves through time" is like a 'negotiation' between the
two events.
~~~
drostie
It'd be interesting to know how they deal with the phase requirements--
normally you have boundary conditions which set up these sorts of standing
waves but it sounds like these "events" would not have that and thus would
have to conspire their phases so that you wouldn't get something more like:
---* *---
Probably it's something like, "each event must exist on at least two different
fields; if you look at the other (~) field too then this event looks like
---*~~~~~~~~*---
so that, for example, this electron clearly collided with a high-energy photon
to become a muon for a time and then relaxed back to being an electron,
emitting the photon back."
------
tempestn
I'm with Feynman. One electron sounds like nonsense. (Where exactly does the
"looping around" happen, where it changes directions? Outside of time?)
However, the idea of positrons as electrons moving backward in time is cool,
and does seem like a convenient sort of an explanation for their creation and
annihilation.
~~~
one-more-minute
The idea is that any time an electron-positron pair is created or destroyed is
a change in direction.
Say a pair is created in space, they move around for five seconds, and
annihilate each other. You could also explain that as a single electron in a
loop – electron moves forwards in time for five seconds, changes direction
(becomes a positron), moves back in time for five seconds, changes direction,
the cycle repeats.
You can extend that to a set of two of electrons/positron pairs. Assuming each
electron is created and destroyed with different positrons, you can again
explain the system in terms of a single electron that changes direction four
times. Add a few more in and you have a whole universe with one electron.
(That assumption may be a big one, which is where things fall down, but it's
not nonsense. Also, bear in mind that the while idea of "moving" back in time
is a helpful analogy, it's not very precise and shouldn't be taken too
literally)
~~~
tempestn
Of course, yes. Thank you. For some reason my mental picture was limited to
creation and annihilation events being the exception, with most particles
existing 'throughout time', but that's what's nonsense.
In fact, if you consider that a lot of particles would have presumably been
created in the big bang, at which point they would conveniently be in the same
location in our other three dimensions as well, it's certainly conceivable
that you could have a single particle pinballing back and forth as you (and I
guess Wheeler) describe.
Of course, still far from a certainty, but a neat idea.
------
skywhopper
I love the direct quote: "I did not take the idea that all the electrons were
the same one from [Wheeler] as seriously as I took the observation that
positrons could simply be represented as electrons going from the future to
the past in a back section of their world lines. That, I stole!"
I can absolutely hear it in Feynman's rapid, wry, dramatic voice.
~~~
drostie
You can read his whole Nobel speech online and it's well worth a read. My
favorite part is:
"There was a gentleman, newly arrived from Europe (Herbert Jehle) who came and
sat next to me. Europeans are much more serious than we are in America because
they think that a good place to discuss intellectual matters is a beer party.
So, he sat by me and asked, "what are you doing?" and I said, "I'm drinking
beer!" Then I realized that he wanted to know what _work_ I was doing..."
link:
[http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/physics/laureates/196...](http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/physics/laureates/1965/feynman-
lecture.html)
------
quarterto
One-electron seems very problematic in light of the observed antimatter
asymmetry. Why/how could the electron travel forwards in time more often than
backwards?
~~~
yk
Well, assume that time loops back onto itself. Then the electron goes forward
most of the time and you see multiple copies. ( This is of course ridiculous,
everybody knows that all electrons are just pointers to one _const particle_
structure. )
~~~
V-2
Obtaining multiple electrons by forcing a single one to bounce back and forth
all the way across the time line a zillion times seems like a major design
smell. That would be the worst hack ever, or at least the worst one before
Facebook devs hacked Dalvik just to get their app to run on Android:
[http://jaxenter.com/facebooks-completely-insane-dalvik-
hack-...](http://jaxenter.com/facebooks-completely-insane-dalvik-
hack-105776.html) ;)
Perhaps our universe is one created by a junior, or an intern, and this
"creative" workaround got mocked on TheDailyWTF somewhere.
~~~
jdrols
It's only a "major design smell" to "bounce back and forth" if it's
computationally expensive. This theory makes it sound like electrons aren't
firmly rooted in space and time to begin with.
Maybe it's computationally cheaper to define something as existing in all
places and all times.
~~~
one-more-minute
You can make it cheaper, but you have to accept a certain amount of
uncertainty in your position and momentum data.
~~~
wlesieutre
Don't forget the maximum speed, it'd be tough to simulate a universe where
things could affect arbitrarily distant objects instantly!
[http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=2535#comic](http://www.smbc-
comics.com/?id=2535#comic)
------
V-2
Let's hope nothing bad happens to that electron, then.
~~~
stesch
Are you blackmailing the universe?
------
nilkn
> Any given moment in time is represented by a slice across spacetime
Is this actually true when we take into account special relativity? I've
always struggled with this.
I was taught that this sort of thing is not nearly so simple. For instance, if
you fix a point in spacetime and have a timelike vector, representing the
motion of an observer, then the set of events which that observer will
perceive as simultaneous to the fixed point all lie in the plane orthogonal to
that timelike vector. Even more bizarrely, because this is a non-Euclidean
notion of orthogonal, this orthogonal complement rotates _towards_ the vector
as it deviates from the centerline of the future line cone at that point.
Given all this, I don't see how one can just say that a slice across spacetime
somehow represents a particular moment in time. I thought the whole point of
relativity is that there are no absolute time slices in spacetime.
~~~
drostie
Yes, it's still true when we take special relativity into account. One good
perspective on special relativity is that it sort of says, "everybody's
right." That is, you abstract _your_ "present" moment to distant positions as
a 3d plane in the 4d space; someone else at the same position with a different
velocity will have _their_ present too, and those will not be 100%
commensurate, but that's OK -- both of you have valid coordinate systems for
any calculations you want to accomplish.
The family of all the "presents" of a point in spacetime is the set of all
points which are spacelike-separated from that point -- i.e. if that point is
at the origin of some coordinate system, the complete "relativistic present"
is all of those points such that
c² t² − x² − y² − z² < 0
Every observer passing through a point agrees upon these points exactly; the
only difference is that my t=0 will not correspond to t' = 0 under a Lorentz
transform, so that my "simultaneous" at space-separated points is not someone
else's "simultaneous" at those points.
(Light bubble picture: imagine that the light which shines upon an event in
spacetime expands outwards with speed c, forming an expanding bubble of light.
Consider two events. They are both "simultaneous" in the sense that there is
an observer who thinks that they are simultaneous, if their light bubbles
start out topologically disconnected and overlap eventually. They are both
"time-ordered" in the other case, if one bubble is inside the other. If two
things are objectively time-ordered then they are not objectively space-
separated, because the points in the larger bubble correspond to valid
inertial trajectories of a spaceship going less than the speed of light --
there are some spaceships which visited both events inertially. Similarly if
two things are objectively space-separated then they are not objectively time-
ordered; consider someone on the intersection of the two light bubbles seeing
both events happen "right now"; there is always a velocity vector such that
they will trace the distances back to the origins of the events as equal --
and hence that observer thinks that both happened simultaneously at their
different locations.)
~~~
saganus
Wow... that made my mind bend or something. This sounds pretty dense (or maybe
the dense one is me...)
------
krylon
Not being a physicist (not even close), I find it amazing how within just ~100
years, "our" model of the universe has changed so drastically.
I once read that sometime in the late 1800s, people assumed that they had
basically understood how the universe works, and that all that was left was to
fill in some of the blanks.
And now look what an increasingly strange (and wonderful!) place we find
ourselves in.
------
pmontra
I remember I already heard that, but is there a way to proof it? Annihilating
electrons with positions obviously isn't enough.
~~~
foobar2020
Well I suppose there is a way to disprove this: create an electron-positron
pair, then annihilate the pair. This way we would get a closed loop, which
would obviously not be a part of a giant knot spanning through the universe.
~~~
raldi
Measure their mass first, too. If they don't match the mass of the ones that
are part of the knot, then you know you've stumbled onto something _big_.
------
theon144
>"the eventual creation and annihilation of pairs that may occur now and then
is no creation or annihilation, but only a change of direction of moving
particles, from past to future, or from future to past."
Forgive my ignorance, but how does the fact that annihilation "produces"
energy out of the two particles fit into this?
~~~
one-more-minute
Since a photon is its own antiparticle, you might imagine that a photon and an
electron "bounce" off of each other in time, and both reverse their
directions. From our point of view it looks like two photons created and two
electrons annihilated, or vice versa.
Interesting idea at any rate.
~~~
sukilot
One electron and one positron, not two electrons.
------
scotty79
It's really neat that electrons and positrons traveling in time just bounce of
photons, that are timeless (because of the speed they have).
I wonder what cool observation might make by similarly rotating they intuition
90 degrees so that time becomes axis something can move on.
------
fibo
I also arrived at the same conclusion during meditation
~~~
icebraining
groovy, man!
------
gesman
Different sources are saying the same:
[http://www.youaretrulyloved.com/bashar-explains-how-
everythi...](http://www.youaretrulyloved.com/bashar-explains-how-everything-
is-the-one-same-thing/)
------
olla
Every time some limit is reached in a physics equation, dilation, contraction
or even moving in time is taken as a measure to rescue. It all sounds like a
convenient method for explaining something we can not explain. It all comes
from the fact that time is defined through speed and speed depends on space,
thus time cannot describe dimensions not dependant of space.
~~~
one-more-minute
In what sense is time defined by speed? Surely it's the other way around?
Currently the second is defined by a number of oscillations of a known
wavelength of radiation, which explicitly avoids any dependence on space /
measurement of spatial speed.
~~~
olla
Isn't wavelength as such dependant on space? It all seems to come together as
A is defined by B and B is defined by A.
~~~
one-more-minute
Yes, but the standard second doesn't depend on wavelength (maybe I should have
said "known energy"). You take a Caesium-133 atom, look at it's emission
spectrum, isolate the ground state radiation and time a number of
oscillations. Of course, the radiation _has_ a specific wavelength/energy, but
the calculation doesn't depend on it.
Once you know about time, you can start talking about distance – a meter is
defined as the distance light travels in a given time. Given that the meter is
defined this way, defining time in terms of speed would be a bit circular.
~~~
olla
Ok, the time dilation makes actually sense now. So like chemical reactions
depend on temperature and pressure, physical reactions (if they can be called
this way) are dependant on gravity and velocity (dependance on the last I can
not quite get still). By physical reactions I mean the transitions between the
ground states that time is defined by.
~~~
one-more-minute
Sure, local velocity at any rate. If someone goes past you in a rocket, you'll
notice that their Caesium radiation is oscillating slower than yours, so their
second will appear to take longer than yours.
------
resyum
I received a telephone call one day at the graduate college at Princeton from
Professor Wheeler, in which he said, "Feynman, I know why all electrons have
the same charge and the same mass" "Why?" "Because, they are all the same
electron!"
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: Parapet – A purely functional library to build distributed systems - dmgcodevil
http://parapet.io
======
vemv
One specific thing I think FP distributed-system frameworks could bring is
instantaneous, deterministic testing.
e.g. I have N microservices, they communicate via IO (which means slow/brittle
tests) but the framework abstracts over that, so I can run the whole system
test suite under a second, because all IO (messaging, DB, concurrency) can be
replaced with an in-memory implementation.
Interestingly, one could also inject faults to those IO mocks, and test how
the system respond to that.
I believe FP is a prerequisite for meeting those goals, because otherwise
having impure IO all over the place is hard (if not impossible) to mock out.
~~~
hderms
I agree, but what about when the persistent shared state ends up actually
being most of what needs to be tested in a distributed system?
~~~
vemv
Can't see the problem in principle - all kinds of storage (DBs, S3, Redis)
seem mockable.
------
linux2647
Looks like a library for Scala and other JVM languages?
~~~
theCodeStig
Yes
------
tunesmith
Is this an alternative to something like Akka Cluster Sharding and
Persistence/Distributed-Data?
~~~
dmgcodevil
In theory, wherever Akka is used Parapet can be used instead. It's just not
that big as Akka. Parapet provides a messaging module for interprocess
communication based on ZMQ.
------
thekhatribharat
How does this compare to Metaparticle
([https://metaparticle.io/about/](https://metaparticle.io/about/))?
~~~
dmgcodevil
as I can see Metaparticle is a tool specifically built for Kubernetes and uses
its API underhood. Parapet can be extended to support Kubernetes ecosystem how
it was done for ZMQ. Parapet can be integrated with Metaparticle, so that you
can run the same distributed algorithms written in Patapet in a Kubernetes
cluster.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
I Know Who You are. What your Browser Can Reveal About Yourself - xpressyoo
http://blog.florianbersier.com/i-know-who-you-are/
======
jpdevereaux
I have the feeling people suppose they're in some sort of armored vehicle when
browsing the web, when in reality it's an open-top Jeep. It's too bad the
general public has no concept of how vulnerable their identity is on the web.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Manifesto for Agile HR Development - fouc
http://www.agilehrmanifesto.org
======
fouc
Collaborative networks over hierarchical structures; Transparency over
secrecy; Adaptability over prescriptiveness; Inspiration and engagement over
management and retention; Intrinsic motivation over extrinsic rewards;
Ambition over obligation
VS
Individuals and interactions over processes and tools; Working software over
comprehensive documentation; Customer collaboration over contract negotiation;
Responding to change over following a plan
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Best ad network to use to monetize site? - rpweber
I'd like to add advertisements to one of the sites I'm working on in order to monetize it. I know of google ad sense, but was wondering if anyone had any recommendations for other ad networks or programs I should be considering instead (or in addition to) Google Ad Sense.
======
Travis
If you sign up for the google DPF (doubleclick for publishers) program, you
get the option to tie in other ad networks. AFAIK, google's interface will
manage your ad inventory for you. It says it even allows you to sell your own
ads, and it will select the highest performing ones to display automatically
(and adjust based on inventory).
In general, I figure that you should start with adsense (because it's the
simplest to add in and get a lot of relevant ads). Then you want to look for
more focused networks, as the general rule is you'll get better performance
the more focused you are.
~~~
rpweber
Thanks Travis. I actually just tried signing up for ad sense, and they
rejected my app due to lack of content. Basically, the app provides a lot of
charts and graphs based on user data, but doesn't have much in the way of
text, and it appears Google Ad Sense won't work effectively in that case. I'll
take a look at google DPF and see if I can use other ad networks as per your
suggestion. Thanks for the tip!
------
manmanic
I've seen the best results with Tribal Fusion and Casale Media. Unless you're
in a high-premium field, don't expect more than $2 EPM for a 300x250 (or
equivalent area) spot.
~~~
primitive
ValueClick Media and Burst Media are a couple of other top tier ad networks to
look into. Google AdSense is obviously another option worth considering.
I did a short write up of using the major players over at
<http://www.adbalance.com/ad-networks/>
Depending on your niche and traffic though you may be better either directly
selling to advertisers (serving/tracking ads through OpenX, Google DFP, or OIO
Publisher is pretty straight forward).
Again depending on your niche you might find a vertical ad network - there are
these for food, health, religion, music, sport and pretty much any other
popular vertical you can think of. They tend to get better ads at better rates
- but obviously have higher entry requirements.
------
calebhicks
You should look at selling your own adspace using tools like OIOPublisher or
OpenX OnRamp.
I'm not sure the amount of traffic that you have, but OpenX has served me
greatly on a similar project.
It's important to note the market your app attracts. If it's highly sought
after and lucrative, you may be able to find a small advertising network
focused on your niche. Something to think about.
~~~
rpweber
Thanks! Hadn't heard of those but will look into it. Appreciate the
suggestions.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Can We Please Move Past Apple’s Silly, Faux-Real UIs? - adamjohn
http://www.fastcodesign.com/1669879/can-we-please-move-past-apples-silly-faux-real-uis
======
michaelpinto
I think you have to take the texture map driven interfaces as part of a larger
package that includes the outside industrial design of Apple products. The
outside package tends to be very futuristic and bare of details, so having the
UI feature texturemaps of organic objects like wood or leather makes for a
nice humanizing contrast. If you copy this on another device it's not quite
the same thing, although if you look at the new Windows OS they did a great
job of making something that looked very different.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The Need for Standardization in Crowdsourcing - Panos
http://www.behind-the-enemy-lines.com/2012/02/need-for-standardization-in.html
======
anandkulkarni
Having been party to this conversation for some time, I largely agree –
MobileWorks (www.mobileworks.com) has been taking steps in this direction for
some time, though I can't speak to what other crowd platforms are up to.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Dear PG: Please post a canonical list of editorial guidelines for HN. - asciilifeform
Is there a clear explanation posted anywhere of why: one is sometimes unable to reply to a comment; the title of a submission is often changed arbitrarily; down- or up-voting is sometimes disabled. And why does a thread sometimes turn up locked, with no explanation? (http://news.ycombinator.org/item?id=716546) Is HN now Wikipedia?
======
pg
Title changes are explained in the guidelines:
<http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html>
Up- and downvoting depends mostly on karma thresholds, though there are also
some protections against karma-bombing and voting rings. You can't post
comments on items that are dead or over 45 days old.
Most of the details can be found in the source:
<http://www.ycombinator.com/arc/arc3.tar>
------
frossie
Well I haven't been around that long so let's see if I can pass the test.
_why one is sometimes unable to reply to a comment_
There is a cooling off period when there is vigorous activity on a subthread
to avoid flame wars. I think this is a recent change.
_"the title of a submission is often changed arbitrarily"_
The guidelines are pretty clear on this one: "You can make up a new title if
you want, but if you put gratuitous editorial spin on it, the editors may
rewrite it."
_"down- or up-voting is sometimes disabled"_
I've never seen that. Downvoting for comments is only available to logged in
accounts with a karma of 500 I think, and not for stories.
_And why does a thread sometimes turn up locked, with no explanation Is HN
now Wikipedia?_
I don't know what the dead-ing mechanism is, but it certainly not Wikipedia -
HN is a private site and I expect the editors to do what they like.
[Edit: Thanks to rms and tokenadult for the corrections below]
~~~
ErrantX
> I think this is a recent change.
It is - I think it's one of the best (the algorithm apparently scales too - so
longer waits the deeper the thread). it's stopped me posting a rash response
once or twice.
~~~
frossie
I find it a bit annoying (sometimes there is a rapid-fire _good_ debate) but I
can sure live with it if it really helps the S/N of the site. I concede there
is a certain logic in "If you can't wait a few minutes to say something maybe
you don't need to say it _that_ badly".
------
RiderOfGiraffes
When I first saw this post I thought "Another clueless Newbie", but I checked,
and it isn't. That gave me pause for thought.
Most of these questions are answered in the FAQ, or turn up sufficiently often
that I would expect a casual reader to know them. Clearly I'm wrong.
So this goes for other sites as well: How can you arrange information such as
this, so that both new and experienced users can find it easily, instead of
being driven to ask questions?
Can we create a really useful question answering system of which questions
like this can be asked, and which mines a database for the answers?
There's a start-up waiting to happen ...
~~~
mahmud
Instead of an "expert system" for posting guidelines, the UI can expose and
explain functionality.
Can't upvote or down vote a story? white-out the arrows and put an alt="can't
(up|down)vote story, you don't have enough foo".
Can't reply to a post? remove the link but leave a white "reply" text in a box
with gray sunken borders. Hovering over it should show the reason why.
Each deactivated post can also log its status and reason for disabling right
in the title, or somewhere in the header area; maybe the top-color can change?
People shouldn't be sent to an Information Desk; instead, the system should be
self-documenting, if not self-evident.
~~~
RiderOfGiraffes
I agree with most of what you say, and I certainly agree that most interfaces
- this one included - can and should be more transparent than they are. It's a
good objective for which we must strive. Expose reasons where they exist, give
explanations as a part of the UI, this is all good.
However, and this is where I wish I were more eloquent, and more of a writer
than doer, because I'm sure I'm not going to say this as well as I want ...
I can't help but feel that there are cases where the ideals of instant
obviousness and total transparency actively prevent the potential for power
use. Insisting that everything is self-documenting is, I feel, inherently
self-limiting.
I feel sure that in some cases it's right to have a learning curve, and some
effort required to be expended. Insisting that everything be instantly obvious
to everyone who stumbles across it is, I think, creating the expectation that
everything should be like that.
It's a gut reaction. To paraphrase an old, hackneyed and much criticised
observation: Everything should be as obvious as possible, but no more.
Perhaps there's a place for the unobvious.
~~~
mahmud
FWIW, I too gave this a little more thought, and from an engineering
prespective, found that my proposed solution would tightly couple UI with
business logic if greater care isn't taken. I am sure it isn't much overhead
in simple news.arc to selectively render UI elements based on the status of a
post, for example, but in larger applications, feature-requests could lead to
a lot of conditionals creeping into display rendering.
What we need is to study and consolidate "Adaptive User-Interfaces" (a well
stablished field of study, btw) with software engineering, and specially the
web (and even more specially, with respect to dynamic programming languages
and in my case Lisp and CLOS.)
Something I have been doing lately was reverse-engineering a few google apps
from their rendered HTML and minified JS. I don't wanna throw speculations
around, but I think Google has some sort of a "learning" engine which adjusts
the shown content to the estimated level of user expertise. They do this with
a "newbie cookie". See the sources for any google apps help pages, for
example, and you will see this:
var global_newbie_cookie = "newbie_11";
Here is one:
<http://www.google.com/support/a/bin/answer.py?answer=77003>
Your global newbie cookie should be different than mine.
Regards.
~~~
ErrantX
mine is newbie_11 too - on all the computers I tried in the office.
~~~
mahmud
I would kill to know what that variable does. Maybe they're ranking the
technical expertise of the user based on what section of the help pages he is?
Say, asking for help on gmail SMTP relaying is different that asking for help
on how to use the calendar.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
New spear phishing tactic: notice to appear in court - mergy
http://mergy.org/2013/12/new-spear-phishing-tactic-notice-to-appear-in-court/
======
a3n
I'm getting phishing related to Target, which probably works. It's like a
terrorist/military bombing where the attackers wait around and then take out
the first responders. Twofer!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Breaking Up the NSA - Libertatea
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2014/02/breaking_up_the.html
======
nmc
You are linking to a page. At the bottom of that page, there is a link called
_" Hacker News thread"_ pointing to
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7277128](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7277128)
Duplicates on HN are annoying, but searching the site every time can be
troublesome, so I totally understand when sometimes someone posts a link that
is already on the front page.
However, since Schneier linked to the original post himself, I am puzzled —
how did you not see that? I am genuinely curious.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Where is the best place to learn Java? - GoofyGewber
======
alphang
I know you're asking about "place", but ...
Kathy Sierra and Bert Bates' "Head First Java" book.
Her SCJP book is also pretty good, but it's more skewed towards the
certification exam.
~~~
GoofyGewber
Thanks, I'll look into it.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Waymo, Uber Driverless Projects Make Scanning Sensors Cheaper - jfoster
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-05/waymo-uber-driverless-projects-make-scanning-sensors-cheaper
======
jfoster
"After 2020, lidars will probably be significantly smaller -- the size of a
credit card or a postage stamp, according to the report."
This seems unusual to me. I presume that it costs something to make LIDARs
smaller. Unlike with consumer electronics, though, there's almost no need to
make them smaller. Assuming autonomous cars are the primary use of LIDAR in
the future, why invest into making them smaller than they already are?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Demo: Running Bash on Ubuntu on Windows - Mojah
https://ma.ttias.be/running-bash-ubuntu-windows-demo/
======
JdeBP
Merged discussions are at
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11388418](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11388418)
and
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11390545](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11390545)
.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The CEO of Panera Bread attempts to live off food stamps for a week - weu
https://www.linkedin.com/today/post/article/20130913215601-25745675-snap-challenge-day-1-prepping-for-the-challenge?trk=tod-home-art-list-large_0
======
thomasz
While there is nothing inherently wrong with experiments like that, there
should be no mistake that "taking the SNAP challenge" does not give you a deep
understanding about the condition of being poor. Living by $4.50 a day for a
week with a seven figure bank account, a nice car and a house in an upscale
neighborhood makes you a tourist.
I just don't understand the rationale behind this. It's not like there is a
big misunderstanding about the poor living an awesome life. What's missing is
the slightest shred of empathy for them.
But she didn't understand,
she just smiled and held my hand.
Rent a flat above a shop,
cut your hair and get a job.
Smoke some fags and play some pool,
pretend you never went to school.
But still you'll never get it right,
cos when you're laid in bed at night,
watching roaches climb the wall,
if you call your Dad he could stop it all.
-- Pulp, Common People
~~~
malkia
There is hidden cost in being poor: You don't have a car, or money for gas -
so you don't have access to cheaper stores. Simple as that. Did he account for
it?
~~~
yummyfajitas
False. 70% of the poor own a car and 25% own two cars.
[http://www.census.gov/prod/2008pubs/h150-07.pdf](http://www.census.gov/prod/2008pubs/h150-07.pdf)
~~~
mkopinsky
Why was this downvoted?
------
peterwwillis
_" On Wednesday night, after a long work day, I got into my car"_
That's his first mistake. Many (most?) people on food stamps can't afford a
car. When you have little money for food, and you just got off the late shift
of your second job, you have an even longer trip to the store, costing you
more money.
Many of these people also may live in food deserts, where the most common type
of store is a liquor store, followed maybe by a payday loan place and a gas
station, or a bar. That's where I live anyway.
The closest grocery store is a very poorly maintained Aldi, and some people I
know take a cab there and back once a week so they don't have to spend an hour
or more traveling by bus.
~~~
Dylan16807
How long is the taxi ride? And does the bus pass by _any_ properly-maintained
grocery stores? I'm really interested in this because the bus near me goes
from suburbs to the middle of downtown in about half an hour, going by quite a
few groceries. I didn't know it was possible to be that far from anywhere to
buy food in a non-rural area.
~~~
001sky
Example: Total Trip: 85 minutes. This is 20 mintes each way, plus wait times.
Bus comes 30 minutes on some routes, every 60 on others. A median wiat time
would be 30-60 minutes for a round trip.
~~~
peterwwillis
Yes, exactly. As funding gets pulled from public transit budgets, routes run
less and less frequently.
In Florida (where I lived before Baltimore) it can take two and a half hours
by bus to travel what takes around 20 minutes by car, but there the grocery
stores are plentiful because of the immense urban sprawl.
In Baltimore and DC, there are literally almost no grocery stores in large
swaths of the city, and not a lot of bus lines, because why would buses run
often to places with no commerce? Some heavily traveled lines are between a
half hour and an hour late, regularly.
\--
This[1] is a map of food deserts in DC, which doesn't include Prince George's
County (where most of the gentrification is pushing lower-to-middle-class
[almost entirely black] families that can't afford living in DC anymore). Note
that children are highly affected. There have been studies showing the lack of
nutrition for children severely affects their development.
This[2] page from Baltimore City Planning lays out the numbers, in which 1/3
of Baltimore neighborhoods lie in a food desert (we're not as well off as DC's
metro-accessible gentrified and developed areas; our metro is a joke). It's
much easier to find Ramen noodles than it is a piece of fruit, or non-fried
foods.
Walmart has been trying to break into DC and Baltimore for years, and is
coming very close, partly on the argument that it would lessen food deserts.
But the reality shows that they are pushing hard for long, large flat parking
lots and super-centers, which 1. increases car traffic to an already congested
urban neighborhoods, 2. removes store space and convenience for small
businesses, which in turn 3. reduces the number of small businesses available
to sell healthy food to locals, because they can just get everything at
Walmart.
This results in no additional relief for the majority of residents in food
deserts, while reducing the number of small businesses that could have
provided better food service, and making traffic worse for public transit
(which is already stressed).
The USDA had a map of food deserts from 2010 but it's not working for me.
Maybe someone can download the data from here[3] and plot it in some
JavaScript library?
\--
[1] [http://dcentric.wamu.org/2011/05/mapping-d-c-s-food-
deserts/...](http://dcentric.wamu.org/2011/05/mapping-d-c-s-food-
deserts/index.html)
[2]
[http://www.baltimorecity.gov/Government/AgenciesDepartments/...](http://www.baltimorecity.gov/Government/AgenciesDepartments/Planning/BaltimoreFoodPolicyInitiative/FoodDeserts.aspx)
[3] [http://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/food-access-
research-a...](http://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/food-access-research-
atlas/download-the-data.aspx)
------
visakanv
Somebody on Quora once wrote beautifully about how it's impossible for the
rich to ever understand what it's like to be truly, horribly poor- because
there is no escape. There is no safety. The writer described how, even when he
was in dire straits, at the back of his mind he knew that he could count on
maybe extended family or something or someone to pull him out of trouble. The
poor have no such privilege. True despair means being truly, completely cut
off.
So there's really very little a rich person can do to walk in the shoes of a
poor person- because even if say, Bill Gates gave away ALL his fortune and got
himself into crippling debt or something- at least some people will recognize
that he's Bill Gates, and treat him differently for it.
No simple solutions to offer here, just saying dis shit is complex.
~~~
jbert
> Somebody on Quora once wrote beautifully about how it's impossible for the
> rich to ever understand what it's like to be truly, horribly poor- because
> there is no escape. There is no safety.
Jarvis Cocker wrote quite a good song in that vein:
[http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/pulp/commonpeople.html](http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/pulp/commonpeople.html)
~~~
shimfish
Incidentally, I really like William Shatner's cover. It brings out the
contempt in the lyrics. And it rocks.
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ainyK6fXku0](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ainyK6fXku0)
------
SteveGerencser
Many many years ago as a new parent recently laid off we went on the 'food
stamp program'. They really were little pieces of paper back then. I ate
better for those 7 weeks than I had all my adult life to that point. And it
was years before I was able to eat that well again.
The system is great for what it tries to do, help people in need. But in my
opinion we have gone far too far in trying to remove the 'stigma' of being on
aid. Instead of heading in to town to collect our stamps you get an EBT card
with money automatically added to your account each month. It's too easy to
take the money. When we were on aid we needed it. But having to use those
colored pieces of paper in line at the grocery store while everyone else
watched was a huge motivator to get out and get a job.
~~~
damncabbage
I ate better for those 7 weeks than I had all my adult
life to that point.
I'd suggest that today's "food stamps" don't cover as much as they used to.
The article does a good job of showing how little nutritious food the handouts
can buy.
Instead of heading in to town to collect our stamps...
Which costs money, particularly if you have to live a fair way outside out of
town. Because you're poor.
But having to use those colored pieces of paper in line
at the grocery store while everyone else watched was a
huge motivator to get out and get a job.
People _are_ trying. Pull your head out and look at the economy. You may be
fine; plenty aren't, and are stuck in a rut where they can't get out.
I know arguing with you is useless, but it's this " _I worked hard, I got
mine, so fuck you_ " attitude that's making everything worse for the poor.
Have some empathy.
~~~
SteveGerencser
Without going in to a very long detailed family history, I do have 2 sisters
that have basically worked less than 20% of their entire adult life. Between
them they have 8 kids and 5 baby daddys. They do very well living on 'aid'.
One of them is in Fort Meyers "on vacation" right now.
For every person trying hard and working to improve their life, there is
usually a matching person not giving a damn and enjoying the freedom that not
having to work gives them. Do they live in a nice house and drive a nice car?
Nope. But they live as well as any college student in any fair sized college
town, and had Playstations and X-Boxes long before I did.
But thanks for projecting 'your' issues on me. I never once said I got mine so
fuck you. Not even close to that.
~~~
cpleppert
>>For every person trying hard and working to improve their life, there is
usually a matching person not giving a damn and enjoying the freedom that not
having to work gives them. Do they live in a nice house and drive a nice car?
Nope. But they live as well as any college student in any fair sized college
town, and had Playstations and X-Boxes long before I did.
I would love to see statistical evidence of this phenomenon. The unemployment
rate for labor force participants (which you need to be to collect welfare) is
17% so I'm not sure how you get from there to 50%. Out of ALL people living in
poverty 59% don't have job which isn't surprising considering a lot are young
or elderly or performing other familial responsibilities.
As for living as well as any college student in any fair sized town I have a
hard time understanding how that could possibly be true.
~~~
SteveGerencser
Because being poor is not something you play at for a week and decide the
system is broken. In my small circle of family and friends and acquainences,
for every person that needs help, there are 2 or 3 that are living the easy
life. Is it a great life? Hell no. Would I want to live that way? Never again.
But they do it all the time because it is easier than actually working.
Do I know enough to have a statistical standard? No, but I know enough to let
me know that the system is completely and totally broken. The solution is NOT
giving even more aid. The solution is to stop requiring people be so dirt poor
to get it that they give up. Rather than saying oh - you have too much money /
asset / whatever to get get help and forcing them to choose selling their only
car or getting help, give them enough help to bring them to a minimum level of
security.
If that level is $500/wk and they can go out and EARN $300/wk trying to get
ahead, give them $200 more to feel secure in the effort they are making. What
we shouldn't be doing is forcing them to zero and telling them at any effort
short of $500/wk ends all aid. That is a system designed to create and
maintain a 'poor' class of people for very obvious reasons.
------
mynameishere
Sigh. Food stamps are properly called SNAP or "Supplemental Nutrition
Assistance Program". The name isn't a joke--they are supposed to be
"supplemental", not an all-you-can-eat buffet. The reality is that they cause
all kinds of abuses, some legal and some illegal. The CEO of Panera Bread is
probably not an idiot, and is probably aware of this, so I think it would be
best that we not take his pandering too seriously.
------
jmtame
For $3 a day you can eat (relatively) healthy food and only shop once or twice
a week: [http://www.miketuritzin.com/writing/eating-healthily-
for-3-a...](http://www.miketuritzin.com/writing/eating-healthily-for-3-a-day)
I've tried this for a few months. It's hard to do just the rice and beans. We
modified it by adding salsa, shredded cheese, and tortilla shells to make
burritos out of everything. It's probably an extra $20-$30 per month to do
that.
~~~
ctdonath
A LOT of people do very well on $1/meal or less. It's basic frugality.
~~~
jmtame
$1 per meal? What are the ingredients? Did I miss this from the article?
~~~
ctdonath
Check my [http://abuckaplate.blogspot.com](http://abuckaplate.blogspot.com)
for starters.
Google "frugal living" etc too.
------
littletables
Yes he should do this for a month, and he should try it as a woman. You can't
buy tampons with food stamps.
I tried to survive with food stamps for a while when I lived on the streets as
a teen. It was impractical for actually supplementing my survival. When you
have nowhere to live, you have nowhere to cook.
------
jared314
Day 2 is already up:
[http://www.linkedin.com/today/post/article/20130914223744-25...](http://www.linkedin.com/today/post/article/20130914223744-25745675-snap-
challenge-day-2)
I would have rather read this at the end of the challenge, so there would be
some sort of perspective on things.
~~~
thejulielogan
But there's something authentic about sharing things as you realize them. Less
chance for editing. It's also going to give him an interesting POV on his own
evolution and realizations.
------
zirok
These kinds of challenges are pointless. It's true that living on a food stamp
budget is hard, but it's not impossible. The real trouble begins when you
encounter unexpected costs. When you are living from hand to mouth you can't
plan ahead for whatever mishap might happen, be it illness, a car crash or
just about anything that might make your already tight budget nonexistent.
~~~
meowface
You're right, though he is showing that in fact it's hard to get a full and
balanced diet using just food stamps as an income. So he's contributing to
your point, even if he's not going through a full "challenge" of forcing
himself to spend no more than X amount in a month on bills/mainteinance/etc.
It's hard to properly emulate what it's truly like to live in poverty.
------
sc68cal
While reading this story, please keep this guide handy, which measures the
political donations that his company makes:
[http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/summary.php?id=D000059478&cy...](http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/summary.php?id=D000059478&cycle=A)
I should note that the latest Farm Bill attempted to decouple SNAP funds from
the agriculture parts of the bill, which historically was the only way to
protect SNAP benefits from being significantly slashed.
[http://www.forbes.com/sites/nadiaarumugam/2013/07/13/republi...](http://www.forbes.com/sites/nadiaarumugam/2013/07/13/republicans-
cut-food-stamps-from-farm-bill-whats-the-big-deal/)
So, while this is a commendable action on his part, there are individuals
inside his company funding candidates and a party that advocates elimination
of the entire program, because of supposed moochers and "young bucks" who go
and buy steaks, abusing the system. Perhaps he can lead by example and help
change some attitudes inside his company.
EDIT: The political donations are from individuals in the company, instead of
from a PAC the company controls. There are however, other organizations that
Panera may be a part of (The Chamber of Commerce comes to mind) that also have
poured a lot of money into Republican coffers.
~~~
jamesaguilar
Ten thousand dollars per year is negligible, especially since almost half of
it has gone to dems. They probably resisted the change you mentioned. If
there's any doubt that your comment is talking about a non-issue, it's also
worth mentioning that all those contributions are from _individuals_ , who he
is legally unable to influence.
This nit doesn't even qualify as microscopic. It'd be better if you just
skipped picking it.
Edit: re: your edit, why would you criticize them over organizations they
_may_ be a part of?
~~~
jlgreco
> _criticize them over organizations they may be a part of_
It is the classic HN desire to be contrarian reaching new lows.
~~~
jamesaguilar
If you can't tell someone why they're wrong, you can't win, right? That seems
to be the rule here, even when someone is doing something eminently sensible
and helpful like trying to see things from a different perspective (in
whatever limited way that might be possible).
------
jeffdavis
Traditionally, when I hear about eating cheaply, I think "rice and beans". So
I'm a little surprised to see those absent. Comments?
~~~
mortenjorck
Funny, I actually just had that for dinner tonight. Trader Joe's instant
jasmine rice, organic black beans, cherry tomatoes from the local farmers'
market. Surprisingly cheap, easy, and delicious.
I don't think a $30/week grocery budget is unreasonable at all, with a bit of
ingenuity (and, critically, proximity to the aforementioned vendors; food
deserts turn this whole thing on its head).
~~~
auctiontheory
The cherry tomatoes were cheap? You must not go the same farmer's markets that
I do.
On a per-calorie basis, almost all fresh fruits and vegetables are insanely
expensive - someone on $30/week could perhaps afford an occasional banana.
Recently my local Trader Joe's was selling onions at $1.09 (or was it $1.19?)
per onion. Per onion!
------
smsm42
This page:
[http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=1269](http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=1269)
outlines SNAP benefits which currently are $200 for single person, or $6.45
per day, or $45 a week. Why does it say $31.50 in the article?
Also, there are other food programs where he lives (assuming it's indeed
Boston):
[http://www.massresources.org/food.html](http://www.massresources.org/food.html)
------
carlob
Slightly off topic. I was once told panera always has to show a full stock of
every type of bread until closing hour. This means a large quantity of bread
gets discarded at the end of the day just because a half empty shelf looks
bad.
I was provided this information by a girl who volunteered at a soup kitchen.
She told me they often harvested this source of still perfectly good bread.
I never checked independently, so if anyone has any idea this is false please
let me know.
~~~
michaelt
If Panera's corporate website is to be believed, they've been donating unsold
goods since they were founded in 1988, most recently with their 'Day-End
Dough-Nation' program.
------
malkia
I've read this some time ago, and although I did not remembered all the
details - something stuck in me - that being poor is not something easily
emulated, or experimented.
Here is the article (don't know much about the guy that wrote it, political
orientation or so, but it's an eye opener) -
[http://blumenauer.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&tas...](http://blumenauer.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1495)
One thing that stuck with me was the "car" situation. I didn't drive a car
because of my choice (not money), i live in LA, but when our son was born I
had to take driving lessons. It kind went well for us, since we can go now to
Costco more often, than Whole Foods across the street. Also cutting down to
paying taxis, or waiting too much for the bus has a benefit (if only LA's
transit, or Santa Monica's one was a bit better).
------
motters
I assume that if things keep going the way that they have been in the last
five years then food stamps will also be coming to the UK. As I see it it's a
method used by politicians to prevent the poor from participating in the wider
economy, by ensuring that they may only have access to politically approved
resources.
~~~
repsilat
I take it you're in favour of "just give them cash" programs? That people
should be able to decide for themselves what to spend their money on? That's a
position I can respect (if not entirely agree with), but I wonder how
consistently you apply it.
What do you think about childcare subsidies? If a government gives poorer
parents a rebate or a discount (functionally identical to a voucher) on care
services or education, is this patronising because the government isn't
trusting them to spend the money wisely? Does this infringe upon their agency,
or cost them essential self-respect?
------
Cookingboy
Really respect him for what he tried to do, but there may be a flaw in the
logic behind competitions like this. He said with the 30 something dollars
budget he was forced to drop items like milk and coffee, but for many items
like that, they will last for more than a week (I certainly don't drink a
gallon of milk a week). So their cost is distributed over more than just one
week.
A more realistic challenge would be given a weekly budget but make the
challenge to last say.. a month or so. But for obvious reasons it won't be as
easy to pull off :)
~~~
gscott
Also when your poor you need to buy milk because cereal is cheap and filling.
I spent $91 this week for groceries for 3 people this week and it will last.
Cereal, 50% off meat, half off soups, and so on.
~~~
jlgreco
Eh, I prefer cereal dry, particularly grapenuts. All cereal with milk tastes
the same to me. A glass of water on the side takes care of dryness.
------
dnccrfctyq
If you really want to eat cheaply, I suspect the trick is to go to "ethnic"
groceries. I remember a reddit post about Paraguyuan meals that cost very
little, I would suspect Indian-style veggie meals would also be reasonably
cheap.
------
tomjen3
Many of the comments here are just to complain that this does not correctly
account for how poor people live and then basically give him shit for it.
Have you tried to live on SNAP when you don't have to? Though so, given the
guy a break.
------
dbg31415
A lot of poor are... blah blah blah.
Look, not saying it's easy to be poor.
Just saying the Panera CEO is doing this to raise awareness about the low
minimum wage. He's incapable of living as a poor person, of course he has
luxuries -- namely the knowledge of how to escape poverty.
Do we need a raise in the minimum wage? Sure, I guess. But more we need to
empower poor people with skills that build the confidence to get themselves
out of being poor.
------
phamilton
How much do people here spend on food each month?
I have a family of 4 and budget $500 for groceries and personal care item plus
$120 for eating out.
Please respond to this thread with your household size and budget.
For reference, max monthly SNAP allotment: Household of 1: $200 Household of
2: $367 Household of 3: $526 Household of 4: $668 Household of 5: $793
Household of 6: $952
------
ethana
I applied for it and got one of those EBT card. There's a food stamps office
right in the financial aid building on my uni campus. So I got it while
applying for financial aid. Fooze money:)
------
boomlinde
What a disgusting way to try to draw attention to your company.
------
rorrr2
Getting a minimum wage job would instantly up your budget from $31.50/week to
$320/week ($282.75 take home after taxes), and even more if you're willing to
work more than 40 hours.
If you are incapable of getting a minimum wage job, you are either lazy or
disabled or mentally ill. Heck, I know disabled people working for much more
than minimum wage.
~~~
thenomad
_" If you are incapable of getting a minimum wage job, you are either lazy or
disabled or mentally ill."_
I hate to say [[citation needed]], but I really think that if you're going to
make an absolute statement which completely dismisses a massive source of
suffering, you need to prove it in some convincing way.
_" I know disabled people working for much more than minimum wage."_
...and therefore all people, disabled or not, can find minimum-wage work?
Logical fallacy.
~~~
rorrr2
Are you saying there are no jobs?
I just looked up op craigslist, and there are tons of postings for unskilled
jobs, such as delivery, servers, greeters, waiters, busboys, hosts, runners,
coat checkers, etc.
If you have any skills, there are even more options.
~~~
thenomad
No, I'm saying
_" if you're going to make an absolute statement which completely dismisses a
massive source of suffering, you need to prove it in some convincing way."_
So far you have said
_" I just looked up op craigslist, and there are tons of postings for
unskilled jobs"_
and
_" I know disabled people working for much more than minimum wage."_
Neither of these anecdotes comes close to being proof, or even significant
evidence, that
_" If you are incapable of getting a minimum wage job, you are either lazy or
disabled or mentally ill."_
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
FriendFeed by Email - Posterous competitor? - joepestro
http://friendfeed.com/share/mail
======
kineticac
Micro blogging by email would compete with posterous for sure, while blogging
by email for the soul purpose of being on a blog would still be intact,
especially if you're already pulling in posterous feeds into friendfeed.
I think it gives people who aren't exactly looking for a blog setup for a
place to send their items. I feel bad sometimes doing a one liner email to
posterous where it dilutes the blog's other content with small posts. Putting
small micro posts to friendfeed would be much better in those situations.
------
khangtoh
Wordpress also launched that recently, so Posterous better be prepared for
more competitions.
------
joepestro
I love the simplicity of posterous and how they handle pictures + video.
They can also autopost to other services. But, so can friendfeed. And
friendfeed has features on top of that like rooms, a realtime feed, and
support for tons of services.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: US Hackers Who Spent 6 Mos Traveling Europe - smcguinness
My wife and I are looking into spending a year traveling Europe. I plan to pick up some freelancing work, however, through some research it looks like I'll need to obtain a visa to be able to stay in Europe that long. Has anyone done this? And if so, which country did you go with to get the visa? Also, what about health insurance?
======
aggronn
From [http://thesavvybackpacker.com/long-term-travel-
europe/](http://thesavvybackpacker.com/long-term-travel-europe/)
> The easiest ways to extend your trip past 90 days is to visit both Schengen
> and non-Schengen countries. Once your 90 days is up, travel to the UK,
> Ireland or many of the Eastern European countries that aren’t part of the
> agreement. Once you’ve spent those 90 days there you are free to return to
> to the Schengen area for another 90 days. You can keep repeating this
> process until you run out of money. - See more at:
> [http://thesavvybackpacker.com/long-term-travel-
> europe/#sthas...](http://thesavvybackpacker.com/long-term-travel-
> europe/#sthash.NV8Ne3nr.dpuf)
You can only be in Schengen zone for 90 days out of 180, so expect to spend
some in eastern europe or UK/Ireland. You may also qualify for the german
freelance visa:
[https://medium.com/@imcatnoone/how-to-get-your-german-
freela...](https://medium.com/@imcatnoone/how-to-get-your-german-freelance-
visa-without-losing-your-sanity-8fa68b39431a)
------
dalke
You are right that you will need to get a visa to stay in a specific country
for 6 months. However, "Europe" has several different regions. You can be in
the Schengen countries for 90 days out of 180. The Common Travel Area (UK,
Ireland, Isle of Man, Jersey and Guernsey) is its own region. You can be in
the UK for up to 6 months without a visa.
So what you can do is split your time between those two regions, plus the
other countries in Europe which aren't part of those regions.
If you get a visa for a year's residence then you will also be paying local
taxes, on top of the US taxes.
------
lumberjack
You need a Schengen visa.
[http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/home-affairs/what-we-
do/policies/bor...](http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/home-affairs/what-we-
do/policies/borders-and-visas/visa-policy/index_en.htm)
You also need to declare your income and your intention to work while here.
Your current insurance provider will surely have some travel insurance package
for this exact purpose. For primary care and dentistry work you can just pay
cash like the locals.
------
S4M
I suspect in most of the countries in EU you can go without visa for 3 months
- your US passport grants you a tourist visa. When you go to another country,
you get a new visa for that country, which means that you could stay in Europe
for a while by going to a new country every three months.
------
mc_hammer
no you just have to try another country after your 14, 30, or 90 day tourist
entry expires.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
U.S. wage growth is higher than we think, researchers say - jaytaylor
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-02-27/u-s-wage-growth-is-higher-than-we-think-fed-researchers-say
======
bediger4000
It seems to me that the explanation of why average individual wage growth is
higher than AHE (the reported number) makes total sense. You have to weight it
based on worker age because as they point out, wages grow faster early in
working life, and slower late in working life. That means that the adjusted
and weighted etc AHE is the correct measure.
Why does the headline slyly contradict the article's conclusions? Seems weird.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
See Python, See Python Go, Go Python Go - cdnsteve
https://blog.heroku.com/archives/2016/6/2/see_python_see_python_go_go_python_go
======
lucianmarin
Can Django run on top of this? How?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
[Nature] Economics needs a scientific revolution - Anon84
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v455/n7217/full/4551181a.html
======
Anon84
Maybe an opportunity for a smart start-up?
~~~
bstadil
I can't read the article. Did you pay?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Researchers Discover Tor Nodes Designed to Spy on Hidden Services - Jerry2
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2016/07/researchers_dis.html
======
brudgers
Vice article: [https://motherboard.vice.com/read/over-100-snooping-tor-
node...](https://motherboard.vice.com/read/over-100-snooping-tor-nodes-have-
been-spying-on-dark-web-sites)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
ABC to look at 'Star Wars' live-action TV series - rosser
http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/11/showbiz/tv/abc-star-wars-tv-series-ew/index.html?hpt=hp_t3
======
rikacomet
The case is against live-action for many reasons:
A. Disney just took things over from LA, so its a very risky decision to fun a
live-action series because A. Star Wars came into prominence as a movie B. The
New Content won't be the same (Yoda-Obi Wan are both ghosts now, Luke might be
a old man now, and lot of the real life actors are either old or have moved on
to other projects). At this point, they would certainly introduce a lot of new
characters, A movie is the safe bet I think honestly.
B. The return on 120 minute content for a movie vs a live-action tv series are
worlds apart. Movies make a lot of money for a lot less content.
C. Movies stars and Movie Production houses have a bigger mass appeal and
reach than TV ones.
~~~
stackcollision
Who said the TV series would have to take the place of the final 3 movies? The
star wars universe is vast in both history and size, they could set a TV show
at any of a hundred interesting times without tying directly into the movies
at all.
~~~
rikacomet
true, but they already announced that the upcoming movies would be set after
the story line of the movies. While they are doing that, on the second hand
funding a live-action somewhere else in the star wars timeline might be to
hush hush!
------
myle
Is it only me that thought of the conjecture/theorem abc?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why note-taking is broken and suggestions towards a solution - juergensw
https://medium.com/@juergenschweizer/why-note-taking-is-broken-9c69e75767d9
======
walterbell
What did you think of Lotus Agenda's data entry & automatic categorizing?
While inventing new ways of taking notes, please invent a way for someone to
indicate on this HN thread that they would like to be notified of your follow-
up HN thread :)
------
szimpl
sounds interesting. Looking forward to the next part and learn more about your
solution.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
HTML5 introduces a new attribute on the script tag called async - shawndumas
http://www.nczonline.net/blog/2010/08/10/what-is-a-non-blocking-script/
======
Xavi
The async and defer attributes are great. Don't forget to added them to your
disqus script as well.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
A Report Card on Toronto's Startup Ecosystem - buckpost
http://www.markevans.ca/2014/10/27/toronto-startup-ecosystem/
======
buckpost
Although it's still a quasi-secret, Toronto's startup ecosystem is thriving.
There is still room for improvement, particularly the need for more capital
and more support from the city.
------
mackinac
Have there been any big startup successes out of Toronto recently? Success
being a large exit or just a startup doing really well by any metric.
~~~
buckpost
Lots of good things happening in Toronto: WattPad, ClearFit, Top Hat Monocle,
CrowdCare, Interaxon. For more insight, check out this infographic:
[http://www.markevans.ca/hot-startups/](http://www.markevans.ca/hot-startups/)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Wikipedia bans Breitbart as a source for facts - aceperry
https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/pa9qvv/wikipedia-banned-breitbart-infowars
======
HissingMachine
Maybe this speaks more about how Wikipedia works than quality of Breitbart as
a source.
First, if you look how credible news organizations work, they need three
confirmations from unrelated sources before calling it a fact. If Wikipedia
has lower standards than that, then it doesn't really matter whom they choose
as a source of information, it still rises the question of validity of the
claim if there is only one corroborating source.
Second, this ban seems to assume a position that Breitbart can't be a valid
source even if they use outside sources corroborating their claim, and that
just goes against journalistic principles in general. But then again,
Wikipedia has to my knowledge never claimed to work on journalistic
principles, they do have guidelines in place that anyone can verify, but
outright banning a source has a negative impact on their validity even if it
is for a good reason.
Refusing to use Breitbart as only source is reasonable and valid in my
opinion, but accepting any other source as valid enough to be used as a single
source raises the same problem, news orgs are wrong from time to time, and
that is a fact. So if they really wanted to make a statement, they would flag
articles that need more sources and get more sources even if one of them is
Breitbart. But positioning yourself as arbitrator of truth and banning
sources, even bad ones really doesn't build confidence, instead it just erodes
it.
I like that Wikipedia's visual style is black and white, but I'd like it's
content principles to be a gradient.
~~~
rubyfan
Well stated. The problem that the blanket ban on one source introduces is that
it becomes a divisive issue. The source and faction that subscribes then
believes Wikipedia has lost its objectivity (even if it is trying to maintain
the truth). The faction then just starts saying Wikipedia is biased and
discounts it as a credible source that speaks the truth universally. To be
clear I am not saying that the non-truth should be considered in Wikipedia - I
am saying that I like what the parent suggests. Wikipedia should look for a
more broad application of standards for sources, as the parent suggests
flagging universally around citations not meeting standard, etc.
~~~
dsfyu404ed
I don't see it that way. This is probably just a pragmatic move to keep
Wikipedia users and contributors from getting their panties in a knot.
It's basically impossible to have a discussion on the internet about the merit
something a strongly right leaning media outlet says (well it's possible, but
the discussion won't be very civil). Anything factual Breitbart reports will
be reported elsewhere because that's how media works, if one outlet covers it
others will too. In light of that there's not much to be lost by banning
Breitbart as a source. What you gain is that it gives the monkeys that edit
pages one less reason to fling poo at each other.
~~~
pattrn
Many conservatives consider CNN as left wing and disreputable as many liberals
consider Breitbart. Your same reasoning would also apply to Wikipedia banning
CNN. Would you consider that a pragmatic move? If not, then for what reasons
would they differ?
~~~
lolc
Does Breitbart even publicly retract or correct stories at all?
~~~
masonic
Here's an example from just today:
"This article has been updated to indicate that the 1,500 people who were
errantly registered _included_ non-citizens, but that did not mean _all_ 1,500
were non-citizens."
[0] [https://www.breitbart.com/big-
government/2018/10/08/californ...](https://www.breitbart.com/big-
government/2018/10/08/california-dmv-registered-1500-non-citizens-to-vote-
in-2018)
~~~
lolc
Thanks. Still looking for a retraction. But those are notoriously hard to
find. Everybody likes to report on the retractions of others, but not on their
own.
------
pavlov
For all their flaws, Wikipedia is one of the few web information sources that
are globally accepted as more or less correct. Everybody has something they
hate about Wikipedia, but the general gist is that they're more or less
credible. Alternative encyclopedic efforts are totally fringe and/or money-
making scams like Everipedia.
With this in mind, perhaps social media companies should piggyback on
Wikipedia's reputation and flag articles from sources like InfoWars and
Breitbart with a banner that reads: "Wikipedia doesn't accept this site as a
valid source."
That would let Facebook and Twitter off the hook from having to make these
calls themselves, and would provide readers with valuable context.
~~~
repolfx
That depends a lot on the topic. I've seen articles on Wikipedia that were
ridiculously wrong and couldn't be corrected for some byzantine reasons. For
the longest time Wikipedia claimed Bitcoin was a pyramid scheme, despite it
failing to meet the criteria on Wikipedia's own page on pyramid schemes.
I certainly wouldn't accept Wikipedia as correct on any topic that gets caught
up in the culture wars. Unfortunately, Wikipedia is by its nature very easy to
manipulate for small very intense groups who believe they're on a holy mission
to cleanse the internet of "bad people".
This change being a case in point. I read all kinds of news sources, from the
Washington Post to CNN to the Daily Mail to Breitbart. I wouldn't say
Breitbart is wildly different in accuracy to any of the rest, not because it's
great, but because so many other outlets (like the NY Times, BBC and CNN)
routinely publish things that are false as well. CNN is practically a byword
at this point for biased misleading nonsense, they publish stories that
collapse all the time. Yet Wikipedia isn't banning CNN, only conservative
outlets like the Daily Mail and Breitbart. Isn't that strange?
~~~
mjrpes
Breitbart is no worse than NY Times or WaPo? I gather you have doubts about
climate change also.
~~~
dang
Please don't make a thread like this even worse by tossing in even more
political flamebait.
"Comments should get more civil and substantive, not less, as a topic gets
more divisive."
[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)
------
writepub
Hope the average HN reader is aware that Breitbart is banned on HN, as a
submission source.
~~~
lolc
I was blissfully unaware. For a fleeting moment your post made me wonder
whether I should consider the ban problematic. Then I figured that credible
sources would report on whatever Breitbart was shouting about, if it was
serious.
And I'll live on as before.
~~~
malvosenior
> _Then I figured that credible sources would report on whatever Breitbart was
> shouting about, if it was serious._
To the best of my knowledge, Breitbart was the only place to release all of
the court documents from the Damore case.
Interesting enough, because of that, those documents are not cited on the
Wikipedia page:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google%27s_Ideological_Echo_Ch...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google%27s_Ideological_Echo_Chamber)
~~~
lolc
As far as I understood Wikipedia's decision the court documents could still be
linked in an article. Breitbart is not the original source of the documents.
I think that Wikipedia trusts Breitbart enough not to falsify court documents.
------
malvosenior
That's funny. Wikipedia allows Gawker and Vox posts to be used as sources on
articles that directly involve Gawker and Vox:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamergate_controversy#cite_ref...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamergate_controversy#cite_ref-
Hathaway_151-0)
That whole entry is compiled of highly questionable sources.
Seems like a massive double standard.
~~~
TarpitCarnivore
Gamergate's entire "mission" is highly questionable.
~~~
malvosenior
Do you think that because of all of the biased media reports about it? That's
literally what it's about (as is the topic of this thread). Social media, new
media and old media being politicized, cliquish and dishonest.
That Vox and Gawker are viewed as more reputable than Breitbart gets to the
very heart of what Gamergate was about (IMO).
~~~
TarpitCarnivore
At its surface I will take Vox reporting over what Breitbart puts out there.
Much of the Breitbart stories I have read operated on FUD by taking the very
smallest bit of information and conflating it into something far worse than
what it is. Gakwer & Vox are not without their flaws, especially Gawker.
Gamergate is the perfect example of how media & reporting can be twisted into
whatever narrative people want to make. The fact that it evolved into what it
did is all the proof you need. If it was ever about "ethics in journalism"
they would have never championed YouTuber's and people with 0 track record of
journalism. Not to mention they continue to prop up people with known
histories of questionable behavior (Cheon, Moriarity). The very fact that much
of their 'theory' was based in journalist talking to each other is laughable.
~~~
malvosenior
I agree that Breitbart is trash, but I disagree that Vox and Gawker are any
better. The issue is that everyone is allowed to say that Breitbart is trash,
Wikipedia can ban it... But while many people know that Vox and Gawker are
also trash, there are many institutions and platforms that will prop them up
as reputable (such as Wikipedia).
That double standard spurred _a lot_ of Gamergate's energy. Putting "ethics in
journalism" in quotes says a lot, the whole thing was nothing but media meta-
commentary (ethics in journalism).
~~~
TarpitCarnivore
Well I did fully acknowledge that Vox & Gawker are not without their problems.
And if we break down Gawker to be ALL of Gawker a big problem of trust their
is their Kinja contribution system, but some writers within the smaller groups
(Kotaku, Gizmodo) have done good reporting. Wikipedia stated the reason they
removed Brietbart was due to its "unreliability". That means they did take the
time to explore BB as a source to validate the claims. If Vox and the entire
Gawker network were "unreliable" I'm sure they would do the same.
I put it in quotes because it was a statement the GG latched on to to claim as
their whole reasoning. However countless doxing & harassement attempts,
specifically towards some women, prove otherwise. Again, one of their big tent
pole arguments was that gaming press (which in reality is relatively young)
had a mailing list they all communicated on. Which is just ludicrous to use as
"collusion" b/c it assumes all press operates in a black box with no
communciation.
There is a double standard in press reporting, but it is not some thing that
is exclusive to gaming. There's a clip of Rooster Teeth slamming another press
outlet for their review of Fallout while all three of them (Rooster Teeth) are
decked out in Fallout gear. I can assure many more YT personalities are
getting free gifts from companies to promote & review, but not disclosing as
such. There is a new practice now of seeding games to these personalities
early to help drum up hype around games. This is precisely the ethics
situation you claim, but that's if you assume YT should be considered press
(it's not). Someone who was contributing to IGN just got ratted out for
plagarizing and IGN, after investigating, removed every piece of their
content. By GG standards of IGN they're some unethical place and would have
never done this. So yeah, GG in itself is a double standard and completely
unreliable in their message.
~~~
CM30
Just going to say that quite a few GamerGate forums covered the IGN story,
praised IGN for getting rid of the guy and basically slammed the hell out of
Filip Miucin for copying other people's work.
[https://old.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/search?q=Filip+Miuci...](https://old.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction/search?q=Filip+Miucin)
The idea that they're quiet on actual ethics issues while making a mountain
out of a molehill on localisation ones is false.
As for collusion, well it's questionable whether it occurred, but at least a
bit suspicious that many sites suddenly turned out their audience mid
controversy. Imagine if someone else did that. Like, an agency dev called
their clients morons online, or a retail worker said their customers were
malicious/trolls/sociopaths to their face. Would they still have a job?
Probably not. But that happened, it shouldn't have happened, and it's being
justified somehow.
It's also worth pointing out that quite a few smaller sites and YouTube
channels with GamerGate... tendencies or neutrality are actually pretty damn
reliable, and that most aren't exactly Breitbart or fake news esque. Stuff
like Techraptor or Niche Gamer or what not isn't exactly unreliable. Stuff
like SidAlpha's YouTube channel isn't unreliable.
The issue is that what Wikipedia considers a reliable source is very much
tilted in the large corporation/academia direction and misses the point in
what reliability actually is. This isn't the 60s/70s/80s/whenever when being
reliable only meant being a full time employee for a major newspaper or
television network or publishing your work in an academic context. Many
smaller blogs and creators (even under pseudonyms or anonymity) have equally
good or better records now, and standards should change to accomodate that.
~~~
TarpitCarnivore
For clarification, I was intending to say GG took down IGN over the story. I
was noting an outlet that was targeted initially in GG was IGN, but IGN showed
they do in fact have "ethics".
------
8bitsrule
Wikipedia, these days is remarkably accurate.
But _much_ more significant than that, it's a compelling demonstration of what
a large, committed community can do, together. With a vision for creating
value, without a need for satisfying shareholders in anything but reason and
adequately-competent, wide-ranging content.
In my view it is becoming one of the wonders of the modern world. Without a
sugar daddy.
------
dmitrygr
Unpopular opinion: Sometimes Breitbart does have useful info. They were the
only ones who had the full leak of the Google all-hands that was definitely
newsworthy, for example. Discard that and you missed some useful info. You
canot just color publications as "good" and "not". This sort of maximalism
(seeing the world in black and white) is rarely good long term. Almost
everything in the world has a use.
~~~
blahblahthrow
> almost everything in the world has a use
Do you routinely read far-left news sources like Current Affairs and Jacobin
to make sure you're getting the full picture?
~~~
dmitrygr
Yes I do. And also foreign news to get a non-usa-centric view.
------
mythrwy
If sources which occasionally play lose with facts or spin are to be banned
from Wikipedia some mainstream news outlets should probably go as well.
Not a fan of Breitbart, but this reeks of political preference. Wiki should be
above this kind of thing but apparently isn't, which speaks to it's own
credibility.
~~~
mythrwy
Really curious about the downvotes (which I don't care about the votes, just
what it means).
Do they mean "Breitbart is much much less credible than all other news outlets
(except maybe Infowars) so they deserve this!"
Or do they mean, "Yes, but leftism is the correct point of view, they told me
so in college, so they deserve this block!"
Or do they mean "We've been trying really hard to resurrect major media as a
legitimate source for believable propaganda and don't like your insinuation
there!"
Or something else I haven't thought of?
Because from where I sit, Breitbart, the grand total of 3 times I visited it
seemed a bit extreme and one sided, but in reporting not any further from what
one might consider "accurate" than many biased mainstream news outlets
(comments section excluded, that was indeed a circus).
Did I miss something?
Not really a person of strong political persuasions but big tech shoving brave
new world down everyone's throats isn't really my thing either. Plus I doubt
it will work. I guess I prefer the dumb pipes model but once people are
involved that goes out the window? Any way to tone that down?
~~~
lolc
In your original post:
> Not a fan of Breitbart, but this reeks of political preference. Wiki should
> be above this kind of thing but apparently isn't, which speaks to it's own
> credibility.
Wikipedia editors concluded that Breitbart News is an unreliable source. If
this reeks to you, fine. Maybe there is something there. Maybe they did have
other motives. Go dig. But don't just draw general conclusions about
Wikipedia's credibility from that reek.
In my opinion, anything touching Breitbart reeks. Wikipedia is doing well to
have settled the matter and gotten rid of that reek. At some point you don't
discuss the finer points of shit anymore. You close the lid. As they did with
a host of other publications.
Just one stinking example:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breitbart_News#False_report_of...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breitbart_News#False_report_of_Muslim_mob_in_Germany)
~~~
mythrwy
"Go dig" and "general conclusions" don't make any sense in this case. The
evidence for the conclusion is there.
The point, as stated in my original post, is that "fake news" type reporting
isn't confined to right leaning publications. One doesn't need to dig much to
determine that. Yet one view source is banned, the other is not. This isn't
"assumption" or accusation, it's how it appears to be.
What I really hear you saying, (and I think reality comes out a bit further
down in your post), is "I don't like Breitbart!".
And, emotionally not liking something is a good reason as any to downvote so
that is fine. Thanks for the explanation.
But just to re-iterate, I don't care for Breitbart either. Nor CNN. I do think
Wikipedia should stay out of politics though.
~~~
lolc
Are you comparing CNN to Breitbart? And by what standards?
> I do think Wikipedia should stay out of politics though.
Impossible. What gave you the idea?
~~~
mythrwy
You are saying you think it's ok for Wikipedia to have a political bias or you
are saying you don't think this indicates they have one?
If it's the first I guess we have to just disagree and that's it and I'm
really sad you feel that way and wish you would reconsider your stance. If
it's the second, there are arguments to be made.
My concern isn't your political views or distaste for the slant of some
publication. I understand that, I don't like grossly biased publications
either. My concern is the danger of a politically motivated group of people
removing a publication from being cited in a very large crowd-sourced
knowledge base because some people don't like the slant.
Whatever happened to principal before preference? Did that all go away and now
we just try to bulldoze our way around everything at any cost because we think
our subjective opinions are "right"? Can't folks see how not only futile but
self defeating this is? Smart folks at that. WTF? is all I can really say.
It's a big world with lots of opposing visions and views. And people have a
right to these, even when we believe differently, and a good knowledge base
will try to remain objective.
~~~
lolc
I disagree with the narrow meaning you give to the term "political". Political
is anything related to how we organize our government. From my understanding
what you mean is "partisan". You're implying that Wikipedia is partisan to
"left-leaning" news sources. And you mention CNN.
Are you saying that if Wikipedia bans Breitbart, they should ban CNN too? And
on what basis? What would be the standard they should use?
I agree that the polarization observed in US politics is a dangerous trend.
But I think that Wikipedia is navigating this well.
~~~
mythrwy
You may be right. I have only visited Breitbart a few times, the actual
"reporting" seemed to be reasonably accurate (although certainly overlaid with
bias). I'm just concerned is all.
------
justtopost
Can Vice be next?
------
YouOkOrNot
Breitbart is actually quite accurate, I'd say it's no more misleading than any
other mainstream publication. I'd wager that most people here don't actually
read the website yet hold strong opinions on its reporting, which in itself is
sad.
I challenge everyone who disagrees to look at Breitbart's front page right now
and find an article you would consider objectively false or more biased than
the average CNN or HuffPo article.
What is the case is that very often Breitbart reports on things more
mainstream sites refuse to report on. It's real diversity of perspective like
this that's actually valuable in a free society.
But Breitbart doesn't tow the ideological line, so it gets banned.
When we ban websites like Breitbart we lose sources that examine sides of
issues that often go unexamined, or issues that get ignored altogether.
~~~
orf
> I challenge everyone who disagrees to look at Breitbart's front page right
> now and find an article you would consider objectively false or more biased
> than the average CNN or HuffPo article.
Sure.
> EU Cracks: Juncker Says Brexit Deal Close
[https://www.breitbart.com/london/2018/10/06/eu-blinks-
juncke...](https://www.breitbart.com/london/2018/10/06/eu-blinks-juncker-
brexit-deal-close/)
It's certainly not the EU who are cracking under Brexit, Theresa May's
government is.
> Danish Minister Rejects EU Migrant Quotas Claiming ‘Too Few Contribute’
[https://www.breitbart.com/london/2018/10/07/danish-
minister-...](https://www.breitbart.com/london/2018/10/07/danish-minister-
rejects-eu-migrant-quotas-claiming-too-few-contribute/)
The actual source ([https://jyllands-posten.dk/politik/ECE10915137/stoejberg-
dan...](https://jyllands-posten.dk/politik/ECE10915137/stoejberg-danmark-
tager-ikke-imod-kvoteflygtninge-i-aar/)) says it is the UN quotas it is
stopping, not the EU ones as suggested in the title. The title is also
misleading, "too few women contribute" is the quote.
They only took in 500 refugees a year before that, something the writing
definitely does not reflect, and will continue "throw open their borders" to
refugees with disabilities.
And hey, lets throw in a nice bit about rape statistics and putting asylum
seekers on deserted islands.
The less said about the comments, the better.
~~~
leereeves
What's your source for the 500 refugees per year? I saw different:
> The country registered 3,500 asylum seekers in 2017, according to the
> ministry, the lowest number since 2008.
[https://www.thelocal.dk/20181004/denmark-refuses-to-take-
in-...](https://www.thelocal.dk/20181004/denmark-refuses-to-take-in-un-quota-
refugees-in-2018)
As for the rest of your nitpicking, I'm sure you're aware we could do the same
with the headlines from any media source. I once saw CNN publish essentially
the same story with two opposing headlines: "NFL ratings are down again this
season. Is it time to panic yet?", then "Trump says NFL ratings are 'way
down.' That's not completely true"
~~~
orf
In the article I linked.
> However, Inger Støjberg has broad support for the decision in the Folketing.
> All parties in the blue block and Social Democracy say no to take 500 quota
> refugees through the UN system, as it did before.
These are the _quota refugees_. The ones the article is lambasting. Asylum
seekers are different, technically a superset of refugees I guess.
I'm glad you saw two contradictory headlines once (to nitpick: way down !=
down), I'm not sure how that refutes any of the many things wrong with the two
articles I described above, found within 5 clicks on their website frontpage.
~~~
leereeves
That was just one example of thousands. Headlines are misleading more often
than not, I find.
The examples you gave from Breitbart don't come anywhere close to proving that
it's worse than other media.
~~~
orf
And the zero examples you gave prove what exactly?
~~~
leereeves
Now you're just being argumentative. I gave one example of a misleading
headline.
Just try being equally critical of, say, CNN headlines and I'm sure you'll see
what I mean.
~~~
orf
I'm merely nitpicking. "i once saw X trust me ok" is not an example, it's an
anecdote.
If you want to put out the point that these shoddy half articles I found on
Breitbart are actually representative of CNNs reporting and the industry as a
whole then I suggest you do exactly what I did: go to their frontpage and find
two completely misleading headlines with borderline xenophobic, utterly
misleading content that are there _right now_.
Of course, this will be super easy right because CNN is the same as Breitbart,
right?
Something in me thinks this will be the last I hear from you. It's been nice
discussing this with you.
~~~
leereeves
The actual headlines of the articles don't count as an example? They're easy
to look up. You'll see that CNN published the same facts with two
contradictory headlines, coincidentally changing their position to disagree
with Trump.
I'd like to see what Breitbart publishes that's worth a ban.
Please feel free to provide ban worthy examples if you like, instead of a
couple of minor mistakes of the kind every news organization makes in their
headlines.
~~~
orf
Again, no examples. Why?
I feel like your conviction that breitbart is as good as any other news source
(or as bad, whatever way you look at it) is not grounded in reality if you
call those minor mistskes.
Not only is the headline misleading but the contents as well, designed to
stoke certain people and confirm their biases.
From reading that article, the contents instead of just the headline, you
would get they are stopping accepting all the thousands and millions EU
immigrants flooding into their borders because they do not contribute.
Not one bit of that is true.
Find me something on CNN as patently false and misleading as that, on their
front page right now please. Thanks!
~~~
leereeves
What's patently false and misleading here is your characterization of the
article.
> From reading that article, the contents instead of just the headline, you
> would get they are stopping accepting all the thousands and millions EU
> immigrants flooding into their borders because they do not contribute.
Nowhere in that article did Breitbart say millions of EU immigrants are
flooding into Denmark.
And if I give a charitable interpretation to your nitpick that Breitbart
altered the quote, removing women from "do not contribute", it could apply to
the headline, but not the article. Breitbart quoted the full statement in the
second paragraph.
------
JohnStrangeII
I'm astonished they accepted Breitbart in the first place. When I first heard
about it, I checked it out and literally the first discussion in their comment
section was about how to most efficiently gas the maximum number of jews in
the US. I'm not kidding.
Breitbart is not the only problem of people who read it, many of them are
mentally ill (schizophrenia) or they were raised in a way that makes it almost
impossible to discern facts from fiction. Before you argue about that, I can
guarantee you that I would - and in fact do - say the same about similar
radical left-wing "news sites".
One problem at Wikipedia is that there is generally not enough vetting of the
citation sources.
To be fair, that's not entirely their fault, because especially in the US
there is a vast network of fake science and news sites powered by lobbyists,
and it takes a substantial amount of effort to discern these from reputable
sources. I've seen some interesting network analysis of the lobby sites of the
US oil industry, and have to say that I wouldn't have been able to easily
recognize their think-tanks and science information sites as fake. They're
well-disguised and you have to look at interconnections, board members, and
funding sources to find out who is really behind them. For example, some of
them looked like legitimate sources about green energy technologies, but were
in reality designed to poison the climate change debate and further the
interests of oil concerns.
Conclusion: Don't focus too much on Breitbart, there are plenty of other
seemingly legitimate associations, news sites, institutes and think tanks
whose primary purpose is to bullshit people, and they are funded from the left
and right.
~~~
tomohawk
You're making an extraordinary claim here. Care to provide a link backing it
up? If not, this is just a slur.
You're implying that people who go to breitbart are mentally ill. Maybe they
need help? Should be committed to an institution for their views? That worked
out so well in the Soviet Union...
~~~
JohnStrangeII
Yes, many of them are mentally ill, which is pretty obvious if you would
actually care to check out their comments on Breitbart, which I have done.
I stand by my word, everything I've said about Breitbart is true, whether you
like it or not. You can downvote me as much as you want, fact is that
Breitbart is a hate speech site that _also_ happens to copy & pastes news from
other sources in order to disguise their real purpose. Anyone who thinks there
could be a "news site" with a more right wing bias than Fox News is seriously
deluded, because the primary goal of news reporting is not to politically
influence the public towards radical anti-democratic world views and create
chaos.
Just to make this clear, I'm not a US citizen and couldn't care less about
Breitbart's fake news if Bannon hadn't recently announced that he wants to
invest money to focus his propaganda efforts on the EU with the goal of
disrupting the European Union and instigate chaos in Europe. There is no need
to write indirect slurs about Breitbart, the truth suffices to discredit this
site.
But if you want a real slur, no problem. Yes, the people who run Breitbart are
absolutely despicable scum.
Would you read an ISIS "news site" to get your "news"? If the answer is no,
then you also shouldn't read utter crap like Beitbart.
~~~
WilliamEdward
Ok, but where is your source that they have schizophrenia?
~~~
13415
Unfortunately many conspiracy theorists suffer from schizophrenia, a tendency
to believe in conspiracies is one of the symptoms of schizophrenia, and the
Breitbart site comments section is full of conspiracy theories - or at least
used to be (see below).
Note that I said "many" not "all" in the original post, and that was based on
checking their comment section in 2016. Since then I haven't checked whether
they have moderation now and whether this has changed, as you may imagine I
have better things to do.
_Note: Same poster as OP, just from a different account._
~~~
ohhellno
Multiple personalities?
------
pfschell
This says far more about the credibility of wikipedia’s editors than it says
about Breitbart.
------
beshrkayali
This is very bad.
------
arthev
A web site banned as a source for facts from schools the world over now bans a
web site as a a source of its banned facts.
~~~
danpalmer
I get the joke, but it is worth clarifying that schools don’t ban it because
it’s unreliable, but because it’s a secondary source. It’s done to teach
sourcing discipline.
~~~
saagarjha
Many teachers accept other secondary sources, though. News article that
summarizes a scientific paper? Ok. Wikipedia article citing that paper? Not
ok. My impression of this has been a mix of misinformation (anyone can edit
it, it must be wrong!), and the fact that it’s just too easy: it really
doesn’t make students “work for” their information, so it completely throws
off their schedule because everyone has quick access to a reasonably high-
quality source.
~~~
solarkraft
It really is mostly FUD. Wikipedia tends to be quite accurate (on somewhat
popular topics, anyway) precisely BECAUSE there are multiple people reviewing
articles.
I'd argue that its strength is exactly being a secondary source, instead of
just alledging facts someone has already taken the time to value multiple
sources. Additionally the talk page often adds extra depth.
Instead of blindly hyping against Wikipedia, it should be taught to use it
well (and not depend on it too much).
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Programming Languages, lambda calculus, calculus of constructions - gtani
http://northhorizon.net/2010/interview-with-kalani-thielen-trends-in-programming-languages/
======
maxdemarzi
"Languages like F#, Scala and Haskell each fall somewhere in between these two
extremes. None of them are precise enough to accept only halting programs
(although Haskell is inching more and more toward a dependently-typed language
every year). Yet all of them are more precise than (say) Scheme, where
fallible human convention alone determines whether or not the “+” function
returns an integer or a chicken."
There's some material for xkcd.com
Reading the rest of the article, one thing I don't get is why the focus on the
idea that "programs and proofs are equivalent". You can do math in isolation,
but your programs have to run on something which runs on something which runs
on something all the way down to the hardware level where at any step along
the way you lose control of the "precision" of the code being run or some
anomaly environmental/hardware factor affects the overall outcome and the
proof is out the window.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Can Kickstarter be used to develop a nanosat launcher? - nkoren
http://unreasonablerocket.blogspot.co.uk/2012/03/ideas-about-business-and-request-for.html
======
nkoren
Paul Breed is no flake - he's the CEO of Netburner and a very serious, well-
respected rocketeer. The question is less whether he has the capability of
building a nanosat launcher -- which I suspect would probably cost around a
million dollars -- but more whether the crowdfunding model could raise that
kind of capital for something other than a video game.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
How to approach VC and get him/her hear what we have to say/offer? - jparicka
Hi there,<p>We're a new London based startup (called Elleo Ltd.) and we have developed a very interesting piece of technology, semantic engine, a prototype that actually works!<p>Please let me also mention that this is no semi-functional semantic engine (as we've all seen around) but a real thing on which our team (we are 3 world champions in programming!) worked for over a year.<p>We believe with our hearts that there's a need for our technology and that we can truly create a new mean, a meaning that will make the world a better place.<p>Sadly, as you probably already all figured, we're all technical guys and we have no idea on how to "business-talk" and lift our startup off the ground, so that we can carry on working on this full-time.<p>We've been reading a lot (and I mean a lot) on startups, VCs, etc.., we've even attended pricy Next Web conference in Amsterdam but we still didn't quite figure out how to approach VCs and get them hear what we have to say.<p>I would very much appreciate if anyone can give us an advice on this.<p>Also, if you'd be interested learning more about our exciting project, please contact me on jparicka(at)gmail.com. Otherwise, wait for a demo which should come out shortly.<p>Thank you,<p>Jan
======
davidu
Find someone with a background in business and finance you trust and make them
a part of your team. Great companies take a lot more than technology.
~~~
rsvaskova
Where would one look for one? No, seriously. Where would one look for one?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
When Big O Fools You - matthewwarren
https://jackmott.github.io/programming/2016/08/20/when-bigo-foolsya.html
======
justusw
This article points out a few right things, but also skips over the wrong
parts.
Namely, the amortised time complexity of dynamic lists.
Amortised analysis treats operations not as single events but looks at the
time complexity over the span of many operations (through something called
"Accounting"). An initial "investment" of array over-allocation will be
amortised by inserting, but only over time. Inserting into an ArrayList will
be in O(1) given enough insert operations.
Essentially, you over-allocate in order to save time. You're trading time
complexity for space complexity.
A really good explanation on amortised analysis can be found here on
Wikipedia, which explicitly treats ArrayList:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amortized_analysis#Dynamic_Arr...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amortized_analysis#Dynamic_Array)
As always, a look into the source code of your language of choice helps. In
Python, a list object over-allocates using a very peculiar, but finely tuned
formula:
[https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/09dc3ec1713c677f71ba7...](https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/09dc3ec1713c677f71ba7c536140ce12801a5036/Objects/listobject.c#L42)
~~~
bfstein
The nuance you're missing here is that the author is always inserting at the
front of the arraylist. So even though the list grows dynamically, it still
needs to move every value one spot over.
e.g. arraylist: [0][1][2][3][ ]
Even though there is space left in the array, we still need to move all the
values one index to the right to be able to insert at the front, which takes
O(n) time. In contrast, inserting at the front of a linked list is simply a
matter of moving pointers and therefore constant time.
~~~
gens
Can't you just imagine it is reversed, where the_array[num_things-1] is the
first ?
~~~
DougBTX
Yes, then it would be a discussion about append performance instead of insert
performance. Might be handy to do if you know that all the changes to an array
will be inserts at the front, then you can just write the array in reverse and
also read in reverse.
But it is helpful to keep the terminology clear, because an insert in the
middle of a linked list is still O(1), but inserting into the middle of an
array will require moving some fraction of the data.
The OP is discussing inserts at the start just because it is the worst-case
scenario for arrays, then a positive result will still be true if some of the
inserts are in the midddle or even near the end.
~~~
thaumasiotes
> But it is helpful to keep the terminology clear, because an insert in the
> middle of a linked list is still O(1), but inserting into the middle of an
> array will require moving some fraction of the data.
This is true if you already have a reference to the middle of the list. If you
don't (say, because you want to insert while preserving the fact that the list
is sorted), then inserting into a linked list is O(n) just like the array is.
~~~
wolf550e
Memory reads and memory writes are not the same. Linked list insert in the
middle needs to do only O(1) writes. But because linked lists preclude memory
prefetch, they should not be used these days.
------
ncw33
In no so many words, the article is pointing out that O(n) + O(1) is not
necessarily quicker than O(n) + O(n): both add to O(n) (since only the
highest-order factor matters), and the constant factor is unsurprisingly
better for array lists.
He's not benchmarking an O(1) operation against an O(n), or anything
surprising, or even pointing out a "hidden" O(n) operation, it's simply a
demonstration that O(n) + O(1) = O(n).
~~~
JohnLeTigre
Of course this was a single example.
The main point is that the big O notation ignores the cache misses.
For example:
\- try writing a quicksort as a template to avoid the comparison function
calls
\- in the sorting loop, switch to an insertion sort when buckets have <= 32
elements
You will see speed improvements of 2 to 3 times faster than a vanilla
implementation of quicksort.
Although this approach is slightly more complex on the abstract level, it's
faster because it reduces lots cache misses.
~~~
tillytal
Surely the _main_ point is that
O(n) + O(n) = O(2n) = O(n) = O(n + 1) = O(n) + O(1)
and the constant factors left out of O() often dominate execution time.
Cache performance is just one example of a constant factor, right?
~~~
JohnLeTigre
Cache performance is not constant, if it was, we wouldn't even consider it
when optimizing.
The point is to use data that was recently fetched into the (faster) cache
memory as much as possible instead of incuring the penalty of a cache miss
Cache performance really depends on memory access patterns.
Anyways :) I'm being pedantic here, I should probably go back to work.
~~~
hcs
Memory access time is a constant multiplier, whether it hits or misses the
cache. There can be a big difference in that constant depending on the access
pattern, but it is still considered a constant factor.
Yes, random access (missing the cache every time) may be 100x slower than
sequential (hitting the cache almost always), but if you're iterating through
an array twice as large, it will still be 100x slower.
~~~
JohnLeTigre
I agree, on the same machine, the slow-downs are constant for each level of
cache and for ram access.
------
readams
A cache miss can be a slowdown of ~200x on modern CPU architectures. Lets say
you have a choice of a O(n) algorithm that always misses the cache and a O(n
lg n) algorithm that never misses the cache.
The crossover point where it makes sense to use the O(n) algorithm will occur
when:
200 * n = n lg n
which occurs for n > 2^200. Most of us are not dealing with problems larger
than can be represented in our universe, so cache efficiency matters, kids.
Note that this changes for other comparisons. Going from n maximally cache
inefficient vs n^2 cache efficient is only worth it for n up to 200, and n lg
n --> n^2 up to n about 2223.
Of course, in practice your algorithm won't be missing the cache on every
access, so reality is somewhere between these values.
------
stcredzero
_Make Sure the Abstraction is Worth It_
Yes! All abstraction has a price. This is what people really mean when "all
abstractions leak." Basically, all code and runtime features have a cost in
terms of developer resources, cpu, memory, etc. The "inner game" of
development isn't being able to muster huge amounts of "cleverness" power. The
"inner game" is being able to put whatever resources you have to the best
possible use.
~~~
johncolanduoni
This isn't true at all. What's the cost in developer resources, cpu, _or_
memory of making a complex number class in C++ a template over floats and
doubles? How about the cost of using Rust's generics to make a parser that can
parse from any linear source of bytes (e.g. both files and in memory byte
arrays)?
There's plenty of abstractions which don't actually cost anything, and there's
room for even more.
~~~
Retra
What's the cost in making a template more generic? Greater compile time. Need
for compiler that can handle generics. Greater number of functions in
binaries, and thus more unique places for bugs to occur. Dynamic library
bloat. Harder to understand code. Quirky edge cases. Harder to learn
languages. Harder to _parse_ languages. And of course, developer time is spent
dealing with all of this.
Abstractions leak because they are _models_ , and thus are necessarily
different from the concrete things that they model. These differences can and
will cause problems. Generic programming is an abstraction that pretends you
aren't working on low-level un-typed system. And you pay for that abstraction
any time you need to deal with low-level demands through that abstraction.
~~~
johncolanduoni
> Greater compile time.
Not really with newer generics implementations (.NET, Rust, etc.). I don't
think anyone thinks C++ templates are ideal, and the others show this at least
a non-essential cost.
> Greater number of functions in binaries, and thus more unique places for
> bugs to occur.
Less human written code, so this reduces the surface area to the compiler;
which is an "issue" no matter how low level your code is.
> Dynamic library bloat.
Your alternatives are A. duplicate the classes yourself B. let the compiler
duplicate them. Where's the bloat? C++ _requires_ you to explicitly
instantiate templates if you want them in a library, and usually they're just
left to the header. The others I listed won't generate anything unless you
actually use a particular instantiation.
> developer time is spent dealing with all of this
It's pretty hard to argue that more developer time is wasted by the compiler
writer than that of the time saved for developers who use the language for
such a broadly used feature.
> Abstractions leak because they are models, and thus are necessarily
> different from the concrete things that they model.
What concrete thing do generics model? Tediously copy-pasted code? These will
only be different if you mess up when you do the copy-pasting.
> Generic programming is an abstraction that pretends you aren't working on
> low-level un-typed system.
What? It's an abstraction over an _already_ typed system that obviates the
need to duplicate code, which after the generics are unwound produces the same
code you would have had anyway. You're just as far or close to the low-level
un-typed system as you were before.
"All abstractions leak" is a nice platitude, but handwaving about "models" and
"concreteness" doesn't prove anything.
~~~
Retra
You seem to be misunderstanding the generality at which I'm speaking. Take
this:
>It's pretty hard to argue that more developer time is wasted
That's NOT what I'm arguing. I'm saying that it takes a _different_ amount of
time. Hence the concept of "trade-offs", AKA "cost."
With that said...
>Your alternatives are A. duplicate the classes yourself B. let the compiler
duplicate them. Where's the bloat?
C. Monomorphise at runtime.
>Less human written code, so this reduces the surface area to the compiler;
which is an "issue" no matter how low level your code is.
Yes, but it's a different issue. Again, there are trade-offs.
>What concrete thing do generics model? Tediously copy-pasted code?
No. They model the behavior of the algorithm as it physically exists in a
machine.
>What? It's an abstraction over an already typed system that obviates the need
to duplicate code, which after the generics are unwound produces the same code
you would have had anyway. You're just as far or close to the low-level un-
typed system as you were before.
Generics are part of your language. They do not abstract over the language.
They abstract over the behavior of your program. It's just a feature of the
language that does so with greater generality that the rest of the language.
And the code you "would have written anyway" is _machine code_. Which you
_are_ abstracting over. Generics allow you to pretend your algorithm doesn't
need a fixed machine representation. The fact that you can produce two
different machine representations for the same template code is an example of
what I'm talking about, not a counter example. The abstraction leaks. You
write one algorithm, and it has to be compiled into two different
representations. That's the cost of the abstraction. You get increased
generality at the cost of memory and time.
~~~
johncolanduoni
> Generics are part of your language. They do not abstract over the language.
Most generics systems allow the code to be unfolded into generic free code;
this is how templates are usually compiled in C++. So in a material sense the
compiler treats templates as syntactic sugar added over C++ without templates
(which is a valid language, which the compiler uses internally).
> C. Monomorphise at runtime.
A lot of generics (like my complex number example) can't be monomorphized at
runtime since floats and doubles don't have dynamic dispatch in these
languages. Not to mention the loss of type safety even if you implemented it
this way. So that is not equivalent.
> And the code you "would have written anyway" is machine code.
That's not analyzing the cost of generics, that's analyzing the cost of the
whole language, and then putting it on generics. If that's fair, why wouldn't
we add the cost of designing and operating computers instead of doing it on
paper? There's nothing special about machine code here.
> The abstraction leaks. You write one algorithm, and it has to be compiled
> into two different representations. That's the cost of the abstraction.
If (as in my example before) you need complex numbers with floating point
numbers, and complex numbers with doubles, the compilation will likely be
_faster_ because the compiler doesn't need to take two parallel
implementations through the whole parsing process, and can instead generate
the necessary ASG itself. If you use on only one, then maybe there is a
detectable differential cost.
Also, how is that even a leak? That's the abstraction working absolutely
perfectly and giving you exactly what you intended.
------
sn41
I agree with the fundamental point in the article, but isn't it well known
that when you consider multiple levels of the memory hierarchy as a whole, big
O notation needs to be modified to take into account the relative cost of
access?
I think the problem is not so much the big-O notation, but that the underlying
assumption that the data access is from an "all main memory" model with no
cache or secondary storage is often forgotten.
For example, in database algorithms, all memory operations are often
considered to be unit cost since they are an order cheaper when compared to
accessing the disk storage?
~~~
geophile
Big O notation is typically counting comparisons, and ignores constant
factors. It isn't that memory hierarchy is ignored so much as the equating of
comparison growth (in n) with performance.
The field of cache oblivious algorithms is focused explicitly on memory
hierarchy, and accounts for cache misses.
~~~
SamReidHughes
It's typically not counting comparisons, there are none when inserting
elements. But sometimes it pretends that comparisons are O(1).
------
CountHackulus
Big O isn't fooling you, it's giving you a one-function explanation of how the
algorithm runs on an idealized system as the size of the problem increases.
There's other systems you can simulate for big O, but the math is much harder
and you wouldn't generally use it unless you're doing something complex like a
cache-oblivious algorithm.
If you're using solely big O to decide on an algorithm, you're fooling
yourself. If performance is an issue, profile, benchmark, study, don't guess.
------
lziest
Big O notation is asymptotic. Using only 5 insertions to understand Big O is
definitely the wrong way. For example, insertion sort works better when the
array is small, but insertion sort is definitely O(n^2), worse than qsort.
Don't let Big O notation fool you, don't misunderstand Big O.
~~~
Guvante
Inserts in that chart is the ratio of inserts to reads.
5 means "write five times then read once per iteration" not "write five
times".
------
caf
_The result is that when you iterate over contiguous memory, you can access it
about as fast as the CPU can operate, because you will be streaming chunks of
data into the L1 cache._
This is not true at all. You'll be able to access it about as fast as the
_memory_ can operate - it'll still be much faster than randomly chasing
pointers all over the place - but the maximum processing speed of the CPU is
an order of magnitude greater than that again.
------
altendo
A lot of the focus in the HN comments is on ArrayLists, but I'm curious why
the author chose to give linked lists an O(1) insert time. In some
implementations (doubly linked list, inserting at the head of the list) I can
see the O(1) time, but when appending to the end it also is O(n) because one
has to traverse the entire list of elements before updating the link at the
end of the list. Might just be nitpicking here but that might also be
affecting the author's results.
~~~
tbirdz
Just keep a pointer to the head and tail of the list. You can then append to
either end of the list in O(1). When you put a new node at the tail end, use
the tail pointer to get to the tail node instead of walking the whole list. Of
course, you need to make sure the head/tail pointers are always updated to
point to the current head/tail of the list.
------
Rhapso
The question I always ask before replacing an n^2 process with an nlg(n) one
is "Am I in that window where n^2 is actually faster?"
------
Const-me
Ported to C++, added two ATL collections, also added 100M elements data point:
[https://github.com/Const-me/CollectionMicrobench](https://github.com/Const-
me/CollectionMicrobench)
Arrays are still generally faster than lists.
The funny thing is Microsoft’s linked lists are faster than C++ standard
vectors.
~~~
ric129
>The funny thing is Microsoft’s linked lists are faster than C++ standard
vectors.
If I had to guess, it's because the std::vector is more conservative in memory
use and it causes more malloc/array copy calls.
~~~
Const-me
I think the main reason is CAtlList class encapsulates its own memory pool. It
allocates RAM in batches. The default batch size for CAtlList is 10
elements/batch, user-adjustable in constructor, but I kept the default value
10.
The elements are created directly adjacent to each other. This makes iteration
faster because RAM locality despite the pointer-based data structure.
------
AStellersSeaCow
There's a simpler and broader point: don't use Big O as the sole means of
analysis of a high level language's data structures. The theoretical
time/space complexity of a data structure may or may not accurately reflect
how it's actually implemented in that language.
------
jontro
I just read this nice piece on linked lists and why they have almost no place
in programming nowadays
[http://cglab.ca/~abeinges/blah/too-many-
lists/book/](http://cglab.ca/~abeinges/blah/too-many-lists/book/)
------
nayuki
Arrays are fast for getting random elements and inserting/deleting at the end
(amortized), but slow for inserting/deleting in the middle.
Linked lists are fast for inserting/deleting/getting at the beginning and end,
but slow for random access for anything in the middle.
So far, that's what the article covered. Now if you want fast random
insertions/deletions and fast random access, this is possible with balanced
trees. A tree-based list can support all single-element operations in O(log n)
time. Sample code: [https://www.nayuki.io/page/avl-tree-
list](https://www.nayuki.io/page/avl-tree-list)
~~~
edejong
That's not what the article is about nayuki. The author of the article makes
and proves a claim that arrays are faster than linked lists regardless of the
insertion point. The metrics presented clearly show this.
The reason for this abnormality is cache locality (there are other reasons,
which I will not go into right here).
Balanced trees can be pretty slow in fact. After some operations, a tree
structure can become quite fragmented in memory, leading to many cache misses.
In my experience, it is often faster to work with arrays instead of trees when
processing in memory. However, using external storage, a b-tree often
introduces quite some performance gain.
------
qwertyuiop924
Here's a question: How often does this _matter_? No, not that big O can fool
you. That always matters.
How often does it matter that non-contigouous memory access is slow? Really.
How much do those few useconds really matter? In most apps, I would guess that
a CPU cache miss isn't noticable by humans.
Yes, non-contiguous structures are significantly slower, but if you don't need
to be as fast as possible, eliminating them for that reason only (assuming
that there is any non-perf reason to stick with them) is a premature
optimization.
But if you ARE optimizing, yeah, you need to think about how often worst-case
occurs. Because big O only tells you about worst-case. NOT the average.
~~~
corysama
_A_ cache miss isn't noticeable by a human. Code that cache misses a lot runs
10-100x slower than code that takes into consideration that it's running on a
physical machine and not an abstraction. That is very noticeable by humans.
Even when your data structures and algos are designed with a nice O(logN),
it's very noticeable when one program bogs down with 1/6 the data compared to
another.
I work in games, so the story I tell new kids is: The PlayStation2 ran at
300Mhz and a cache miss would cost you 50 cycles. The PlayStation3 ran at
3200Mhz and a cache miss would cost you 500 cycles. So, if you are cache
missing a lot, your PS3 game will run as if it were on a PS2.
In other words, not paying attention to cache make your computer run like it's
10 years older than it is. You paid for a modern machine, but you are getting
the results of a Craigslist junker. This is true outside of games. It's the
reason 4x2Ghz cellphones struggle to run seemingly simple apps. It's a big
part of the reason people struggle to orchestrate armies of servers
(distributed computing is easier when it's 90% less distributed).
Is it really harder to work with the cache system instead of ignoring it?
Yeah, it requires a tiny bit of study an a little bit of planning. In
contrast, the theme I see a lot online is to completely dismiss physical
reality in favor or theory. And, the theme I see almost universally in the
students (and many senior engineers) I interview is complete ignorance of the
very existence of cache and it's effects on the code they write. It's very
concerning...
~~~
qwertyuiop924
No, I don't deny it's important to know that cache misses exist, and what they
can do: to the contrary, it's vital.
However, in 90% of applications, it's not going to matter, because those
applications are spending hundreds of cycles waiting anyways: Disk or network
IO, user input, all that stuff is way slower than a cache miss. If you're
writing a video game, or a database, or other software with very high soft-
realtime speed requirements, or heavy data access, by all means, optimize to
avoid cache miss.
But if you're writing a company-internal Rails app, nobody's going to notice,
even if you're getting cache miss after cache miss. Which you probably won't.
Actually, if your language isn't compiled, a cache miss is the least of your
worries, perf-wise.
And now I've got to see if I can optimize my code to avoid cache misses. But
the code's in Scheme, so unless the initial access cost is amortized, I'm
already doomed...
~~~
Koromix
You're looking at this problem backward. For example, you mention user input.
Users may need a second to click or touch a button, but when they do the
software should react _instantly_ , and that does not leave you that many
cycles. My smartphone's lock screen is my go-to example: most times it fails
to follow my finger, and I barely have anything running on it.
Most of the dynamic languages are data and instruction cache-miss machines.
They chase objects and pointers all around the memory.
~~~
qwertyuiop924
>My smartphone's lock screen is my go-to example: most times it fails to
follow my finger, and I barely have anything running on it.
...That doesn't sound like a cache miss. Knowing Android, A cache miss is
probably the least of your worries.
>Users may need a second to click or touch a button, but when they do the
software should react instantly, and that does not leave you that many cycles.
You raise a good point...
>Most of the dynamic languages are data and instruction cache-miss machines.
They chase objects and pointers all around the memory.
...and this is part of my point. If you look at a problem and think, "A high-
level language is fast enough," then you are implicitly saying that the
latency of a cache miss is acceptable. And IME, in most cases that's true. I
mean, heck, I'm using Scheme, so while I may have pointer chases like the
Amazon has trees, but I CAN optimize them into array lookups, and my code is
compiled: not great, but better than most HLLs.
It's the same argument as always: perf vs. development speed. You can be in
the C and FP loop, or the Lisp and JS loop.
~~~
Koromix
> That doesn't sound like a cache miss. Knowing Android, A cache miss is
> probably the least of your worries.
My example was meant to illustrate the user input problem. From what I know
about Android, the absymal performance is very much a case of "death from a
thousand cuts".
> It's the same argument as always: perf vs. development speed. You can be in
> the C and FP loop, or the Lisp and JS loop.
The fast(er) languages we have are old and full of warts, and that makes them
slow to develop in. The heavily used HLLs such as Python and Ruby were made by
people who did not care much (at all?) about performance, and it shows in many
design decisions. But here's the thing: we could have both at the same time. I
don't buy this dichotomy.
~~~
qwertyuiop924
>But here's the thing: we could have both at the same time. I don't buy this
dichotomy.
That's actually not true: OO, dynamism, late binding, and a lot of the other
things that HLLs have to offer require a lot of pointer chasing and non-
consecutive datastructures. I'm mostly a Schemer, and Scheme and Lisp have had
decades of research put into making them compile and run fast. Most dynamic
languages aren't so lucky. But the required pointer chasing and garbage
collection mean they'll never be as fast as C.
Functional programming languages, however, are rarely late-binding, and don't
expose as much about their implementation, so some of the pointer chasing can
be avoided.
Rust doesn't need a GC, and is fairly C-like - or rather, ALGOL-like and
BLISS-like - with added memory safety. So with a programmer who knows what
they're doing, it can be pretty fast. But here's the rub: the faster a
language is, _the closer it has to be to the metal,_ and the less it can do
with high-level features.
So yes, you can make HLLs faster, but you can't take the cache misses out of
an HLL, and you can't make a systems language wearing an HLL's clothing -
although Rust is making an admirable attempt.
~~~
Koromix
> OO, dynamism, late binding
None of these are required for ease of development. At least the first two
often result in precisely the opposite.
HLLs are not required to focus on slow abstractions. For example, homogeneous
arrays of tagged unions can replace inheritance most of the time. And they
avoid breaking your code in 10 files and 20 classes (though for some reason
this metric is seen as a good thing way too often).
~~~
qwertyuiop924
OO, perhaps, but without dynamism and late binding, metaprogramming is
difficult, as is any number of techniques. Like, for instance, class
generation, and extending methods.
And while I don't set much store by inheritance, it set considerably more
store by duck-typing and polymorphism.
>None of these are required for ease of development. At least the first two
often result in precisely the opposite.
So are you talking about Java-style OO? Because I was talking about Smalltalk
OO, which is pretty different.
_Required,_ no, but they're tools, and they come in handy. Certainly make
development a lot more comfortable.
And some of the time, they make delvelopment a lot easier.
~~~
Koromix
> Like, for instance, class generation, and extending methods.
This is precisely the kind of thing that leads to unmaintainable "magic" code,
even though it can still be useful but with _extreme_ moderation. So I don't
see the point of making that a core feature of any language.
If you have any example to the contrary, I'd love a link to a good open-source
project that uses these things extensively.
~~~
qwertyuiop924
RSpec? A lot of ruby uses metaprogramming in some respect.
As for not seeing the point of making it a feature of your language, how about
Lisp? And I'm not just talking macros. Lambdas, late binding, and in Scheme,
the ability to rebind anything lead to a lot of cool tricks and capabilities.
And late binding is extrordinarily important.!
~~~
Koromix
I don't consider the Ruby ecosystem to be a good example of much. Idiomatic
Ruby code is much slower and usually not more maintainable than C++. Actually,
it may even be worse thanks to dynamic typing, which makes refactoring much
more painful than it already is in large code bases.
Well I guess it's good at making CRUD web sites. Hardly rocket science.
~~~
qwertyuiop924
Okay then: Lisp.
Tinyclos is a fairly sophisticated implementation of OO and the MOP, written
in Scheme.
Its descendants, COOPS, GOOPS, and others, are in most schemes today. Many of
them are written in their respective dialect of scheme, with little or no
specific compiler support.
SXML allows for writing XML in native scheme syntax.
The anaphoric macros (aif, acond, etc.) are all, well, macros, and thus use
metaprogramming principles.
tclOO, [incr tcl], and other OO TCL systems are usually implemented in regular
TCL.
Give or take, any large Lisp or Smalltalk codebase takes advantage of dynamic
typing, late binding, and some form of metaprogramming.
However, you've made it clear that you hate Ruby, Dynamic Typing, and other
such things, as given as much of metaprogramming requires this sort of
flexibility, I very much doubt anything I say will convince you that dynamic
languages are in any way useful.
~~~
Koromix
I don't hate them. I've used python more than once, and will continue to do
so. And I think it's great teaching material. It's a good _scripting_
language. But I think its drawbacks far outweigh its advantages for large
projects.
All your examples are programming gimmicks, and I've yet to see stuff that
solves actual hard problems. I'm not interested in programming for
programming's sake. I want to use it to make my computer do _useful_ stuff.
~~~
qwertyuiop924
Gimmicks? Some of them, yes, but CLOS and its descendants are used in Real
applications, as are the TCL OO systems. But if you want Real World, I'll give
you real world.
Maxima is a descendant of the original MACSYMA, developed at MIT. It is still
a usable and viable system, even if it has ageda bit.
Emacs is a popular programmer's text editor written in C and a dialect of
lisp.
Both of the above programs are large, useful, and written in an HLL - one
particularly amenable to pointer chasing, I might add - and they make use of
the variety of abstractions which that HLL provides.
If those aren't modern enough for you, check out some Clojure applications.
------
billconan
I think the overemphasis of big O, especially during job interviews, is a sad
thing.
I think multi-threading is an equally important skill, that gets less
attention.
~~~
SamReidHughes
It's not. The reason is, a lot of stuff isn't multithreaded or is just a bunch
of threads talking to a database. (I've been asked questions about
multithreaded stuff, in interviews at companies that specifically did
multithreaded stuff. Companies that talked to databases would be better off
asking SQL stuff.)
------
jwatte
One thing I didn't see in the article: in addition to cache misses, the list
stores 3 words per word; the array between 1 and 2 (up to 3 only when
reallocating,) so array touches less RAM, even when inserting.
------
yandrypozo
The author is doing less than 10 insertions per benchmark, that's practically
a constant O(1), even if you have to copy the entire array 5 or 10 times don't
affect the Big O analysis
~~~
Moto7451
But he's inserting at the front of an array, which requires the rest of the
elements to be copied into a new array. DotNetPerls has a clearer example:
[http://www.dotnetperls.com/list-insert](http://www.dotnetperls.com/list-
insert)
------
akandiah
Technically speaking, he ought to be using Big Theta (Θ) to describe his
bounds. Throwing Big O around to describe everything is foolish.
------
kazinator
The benefits of the list abstraction are small---because it's a clumsy, blub-
like list abstraction with a container object and iterators.
Look at the code; termination of the loop is even based on an integer count
pulled from the container.
A True Scotsman's linked list has no such thing. It's either an empty
indicator (like NIL in Lisp) or a binary cell consisting of an item and a
pointer to the next one.
The benefit of that abstraction is that you can recurse over it directly
without clumsy additional parameters having to be passed.
Another benefit is substructure sharing. We can insert at the front of a list
not only in O(1) time and that is great. But perhaps more importantly,
existing copies of the list before the insertion _do not change_. And it is
the same way if we delete from the front: we just move the local head pointer
to the previous node, which doesn't affect anyone else who is still holding on
to the pointer to the original front node.
These lists also allow lock-free operation, unlike "heavy weight" containers.
Suppose we have a list that acts purely as a container, but is shared by
multiple threads. We can insert into it by consing a new node onto the head of
the current snapshot of the list, and then doing an atomic-compare-swap to
install that head in place of the old head. If it fails, it means the list
changed behind our back; we cons the node onto the new list (or rewrite the
cons to point to the new one as its "rest" pointer) and try again.
Some of the caching benefits of the array will disappear if the array holds
only references/pointers to items. In this example, the containers are typed.
The List<int> actually can allocate the int objects in an array that packs
them together in memory. Whereas the LinkedList<int> has individual separately
allocated nodes which hold the int. Suppose the List and LinkedList hold
pointers to heaped objects. Then the impact of caching is softened. It's still
the case that multiple pointers in the array can be cached together; but these
have to be traversed to access the items themselves. In the case of the
LinkedList, we have to traverse a pointer to get to the next node and traverse
a pointer to get to the heaped object. But two pointer traversals versus one
is not as bad as one traversal versus zero. If the objects being traversed are
fairly complex, and have pointers to additional objects that have to be
examined during the traversal, it matters even less what kind of list they are
accessed from. If I have a list of File objects, for each of which a stream is
opened and a regex scan performed, why would I care whether it's an array list
or a linked list.
The results shown in this test case tell me that the performances of the two
containers are not that far off! Here they are subject to a test case that is
designed to highlight the difference between them by making the container
content, and its processing, almost as trivial as possible. That 38 seconds
versus 51 difference is almost purely in the container-related operations.
That is as bad as it gets: from there, the more actual real work you do per
container node, the smaller the actual difference. (What is 51 versus 38 in
"orders of magnitude"? Why 0.12 orders. It's 0.42 "binary orders of magnitude"
(where 1 binary order is a doubling; terminology mine). So in terms of classic
Moore's Law (speed doubling every 18 months), that's a 7.6 month advance. "My
arrays are 7.6 months ahead of your linked list container, in Moore's Law, in
a pure benchmark; eat my dust!"
------
happytrails
Oprah fooled me once!
------
ctvo
If the author sees this: please consider changing your color choices. It'd
make reading the content you put so much work into producing easier for
everyone. I couldn't finish the post. The 90s hacker's lair colors were that
offensive.
~~~
T0T0R0
The process of weeding out. Sometimes it's better to select against sensitive
people.
~~~
acbabis
Why would you select against people with poor vision?
~~~
k__
The green seems a bit harsh, yes.
But all in all it is a good page for people with poor vision.
No low-contrast and no white background, which are both considered bad on
screens.
~~~
acbabis
Yes, the white on black is fine. I checked the #8a7ae2 purple
([http://webaim.org/resources/contrastchecker/](http://webaim.org/resources/contrastchecker/))
and, surprisingly, it passes WCAG AAA guidelines. I say "surprisingly" because
it hurts my eyes. I think jumping between the alternating white and purple is
what does it.
------
Kenji
This is a great point and I'll probably have to do some performance
measurements and change parts of my code now. I should be more careful with
sacrificing contiguous storage for O(1) insertions.
It is also worth noting that some manuals say that appending to an array list
is O(1) amortized. Which is true, if you make an amortized analysis (which
essentially distributes the workload of copying the array into a larger block
over all the inserts). That's to keep in mind for systems that have to be
realtime or at least produce stable framerates. The worst-case is important
and amortized analysis generously glosses over it.
EDIT: Not inserting, appending
~~~
ncw33
Insertion into an array list at a uniformly-distributed location is always
O(n): you can't avoid moving half the list. Appending is amortized O(1).
~~~
rifung
Not the person you're responding to but perhaps that person meant assuming
your insertions are uniformly distributed? Then I think insertion is O(n)
amortized..?
At an insertion you'd have
(n + (n-1) + .. + 1)/n = O(n^2) / n = O(n)
The first part comes from each possible run times, each with probability 1/n.
You might have to expand the list but that'd also be O(n) amortized.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why Lifesaving Drugs May Be Missing on Your Next Flight - Kaibeezy
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/03/health/drugs-airplanes-faa.html
======
Kaibeezy
_Citing chronic drug shortages, however, the Federal Aviation Administration
has granted airlines exemptions that permit passenger planes to fly without a
complete medical kit if the airlines say they cannot replenish the drugs. The
exemptions apply to international as well as domestic flights.
...
The medicines include two doses of epinephrine, one to treat severe allergic
reactions and one to treat cardiac arrest; atropine, which is used to treat a
slow heart rate; dextrose, to raise dangerously low blood sugar in people with
diabetes; and lidocaine, to treat irregular heart rhythms but rarely used
these days._
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
A long view of globalisation in short: The agricultural revolution (2018) - Osiris30
https://voxeu.org/content/long-view-globalisation-short-agricultural-revolution-part-3-5
======
eastbayjake
There isn't a good option in the UI to view the next or previous entries in
this five-part series, so here are the rest if anyone is interested:
[Part 1]: [https://voxeu.org/content/long-view-globalisation-short-
part...](https://voxeu.org/content/long-view-globalisation-short-part-1-5)
[Part 2]: [https://voxeu.org/content/long-view-globalisation-short-
huma...](https://voxeu.org/content/long-view-globalisation-short-humanisation-
globe-part-2-5)
[Part 4]: [https://voxeu.org/content/long-view-globalisation-short-
grea...](https://voxeu.org/content/long-view-globalisation-short-great-
divergence-part-4-5)
[Part 5]: [https://voxeu.org/content/long-view-globalisation-short-
new-...](https://voxeu.org/content/long-view-globalisation-short-new-
globalisation-part-5-5)
------
RajuVarghese
Reading through the article there were a few things that irritated me:
referring to the Indus valley civilization as India/Pakistan, the city of
Kolkata didn't exist until the 17th century and Kochi on the Western coast of
India gained in prominence only after the earthquake of 1341. The map shows
both those places in the year AD 1.
~~~
arethuza
That does seem a bit weird - especially as Mesopotamia is also included in
that list rather than the modern countries in that area.
~~~
RajuVarghese
He does mention the Fertile Crescent and the modern-day countries but seems to
suggest that agriculture then moved to Mesopotamia. Not true.
------
PaulDavisThe1st
It would have been nice to see a bit more inclusion of what was happening in
the Americas during this same period, since they were already fairly
populated. He also mentions the impact of Bubonic plague, but neglects to
mention the early initial impact of smallpox in the Americas - some estimates
are that it killed roughly 10% of all human life on the planet in less than
100 years.
>"Our new data-driven best estimate is a death toll of 56 million by the
beginning of the 1600s — 90 percent of the pre-Columbian Indigenous population
and around 10 percent of the global population at the time. This makes the
“Great Dying” the largest human mortality event in proportion to the global
population, putting it second in absolute terms only to World War II, in which
80 million people died — 3% of the world’s population at the time."
[https://www.pri.org/stories/2019-01-31/european-
colonization...](https://www.pri.org/stories/2019-01-31/european-colonization-
americas-killed-10-percent-world-population-and-caused)
Given that the "discovery" of the "New World" was a pivotal feature of the
period alluded to in the article, the fact that it had just been massively
depopulated and was then taken over by new settlers seems hugely relevant to a
"long view on globalization".
In addition, there is good evidence that agriculture was independently
invented in the Americas, in addition to its advent in the fertile crescent
and early china.
~~~
atomi
I don't know if the incredible agricultural diversity coming out of the Valley
of Mexico has an equal[1].
1\.
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domesticated_plants_of_Mesoa...](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domesticated_plants_of_Mesoamerica)
~~~
int_19h
Raw calories matter a lot more for development, though.
------
reedwolf
"Climate scientists don't know why, but, starting 20 millennia ago, the
earth’s climate began to warm."
Maybe it's just something the Earth does.
~~~
MereInterest
While true, I would recommend reading this comic, showing the different rates
of warming.
[https://xkcd.com/1732/](https://xkcd.com/1732/)
~~~
tigasis
that was a long post but amazing
------
szczepano
Don't forget about amber road that moved amber to other side of the world.
They didn't go back with empty hands.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Cool Javascript Text Clock - supremum
http://graemeboy.com/qlock/
======
FWeinb
Looks great. I made a mutlilanguage version a while ago:
[http://codepen.io/FWeinb/pen/oyACz](http://codepen.io/FWeinb/pen/oyACz)
------
jgeorge
I've coveted a physical Beigert&Funk QlockTwo for a long time now. Never fail
to trigger my clock lust.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: Plain Email – An app for one-touch email processing - apancik
http://www.plainemail.com/
======
Xeoncross
This assumes an inbox is a type of "project" that needs to be "completed".
It's structured on the concept of removing messages from my screen until there
is nothing left for me to "do".
My inbox is often more of a conversation that I fade in and out of. Sometimes
it resembles a facebook feed. Granted, I'm not a type A personality, but not
all email is has to be "done" anymore than all reading books need to be
"done". They can be continuous reference or contemplation for a time.
I guess it depends on if we are talking about work email or personal email.
Perhaps even more, it's just about perception.
~~~
ignoramous
\----
Empirically, the way to do really big things seems to be to start with
deceptively small things. Want to dominate microcomputer software? Start by
writing a Basic interpreter for a machine with a few thousand users. Want to
make the universal web site? Start by building a site for Harvard undergrads
to stalk one another.
...
I think the way to use these big ideas is not to try to identify a precise
point in the future and then ask yourself how to get from here to there, like
the popular image of a visionary. You'll be better off if you operate like
Columbus and just head in a general westerly direction. Don't try to construct
the future like a building, because your current blueprint is almost certainly
mistaken. Start with something you know works, and when you expand, expand
westward.
The popular image of the visionary is someone with a clear view of the future,
but empirically it may be better to have a blurry one.
\----
Paul Graham, on Frighteningly Ambitious Start-up Ideas.
[http://www.paulgraham.com/ambitious.html](http://www.paulgraham.com/ambitious.html)
~~~
abcampbell
Do you think no one has fixed email because the problem is too hard, or
because there is a lack of creative/ambitious founders?
~~~
vorador
The main reason is that you need to be backward compatible with 30 years of
terrible hacks. That's why there's a ton of vaporware email clients ---
there's a huge amount of work that most of your users don't suspect.
Full-disclosure: I work at a company building an open source email client
([https://nylas.com/N1](https://nylas.com/N1)) and an API to simplify email
([https://nylas.com/docs](https://nylas.com/docs))
~~~
rabblac
Well, it's from some time that I've been looking for a modern and open source
email client, but N1 looks very promising.
Little question: do you plan to support PGP?
~~~
grinich
It's in development by several N1 users:
[https://github.com/nylas/N1/issues/96](https://github.com/nylas/N1/issues/96)
------
grinich
This is really cool, and nice design!
I work at Nylas and would love to incorporate some of this into N1, which is
an open source mail app we built that also uses Electron.
([https://nylas.com/n1](https://nylas.com/n1)).
If the author's hanging out in this thread, feel free to email me :) We could
also make it work for non-Gmail using our open source IMAP stack!
~~~
apancik
I've been checking out N1 before I started playing with this. Great job! Will
shoot you an email soon!
------
semerda
Is email really broken or are people looking for things to change?
Reason I ask is because I see this "let's fix email" so often, peeps build
something new then it either gets acquired & killed or goes no where.
What if email isn't broken. Instead email as we think we see it is merely a
feed with or without action and its up to us to manage it.
PlainEmail appears like an attempt of changing our habits of reading a feed
with GTD concepts. I'd much rather prefer to see my feed and an algo/machine
learning identify action emails and suggest to me the best method (GTD or not)
to handle it. Otherwise I'd carry on with my usual habits.
~~~
bachmeier
> What if email isn't broken.
I tend to agree. The problem is that we choose to spend our time in a
suboptimal manner. The email inbox is just a tool that makes it easier to
waste our time. It's not like getting rid of the email inbox will keep others
from sending us stuff we don't want or keep our bosses from asking us to do
crazy things. If you want to fix email, recognize that you can't respond to
everything, and hit the delete button more often.
------
andreshb
This is exactly what I need, I've been hoping for years for someone to create
this. I even tried to do my own mutt installation to have a terminal / simple
like e-mail.
I'd even go as far as removing the mouse and only doing keyboard shortcuts. Do
not include attachments or images. I love it's full screen.
This will not be for everyone, and that is really OK, this is for people that
must respond to a lot of emails very quickly, even if they are not on e-mail
all day. I just spent 2 days going through actionable 475 unread e-mails (not
newsletters, or spam)
I've always thought, software developers have vim, but there's nothing for
business developers.
Thank you very much for creating this. If you will charge, I will gladly pay.
Take my money!
------
hammock
Let's try a bit of wordsmithing.
Either stick to the 4 D's of GTD: Delete, Do, Delegate, Defer; or use the
commonplace terms: Archive, Reply, Forward, Snooze. When you do this, do you
start to realize how similar it looks to existing email clients?
By the way you say there is no Snooze button- then what is Defer?
And one-touch, not "single-touch."
~~~
jdmichal
If I'm reading it right, "defer" means you actually schedule an appointment in
a calendar. I much rather prefer the idea of snoozing (a fixed delay before
reappearing) better. If I'm not interested in dealing with something now, then
I'm also not really interested in vetting calendar space for it at that exact
moment either.
~~~
krrrh
In GTD parlance defer doesn't require a calendar appointment, it just means
'don't do right now'. Basically if a task takes more than 2 minutes to do but
you intend to do it at some point, then it should not interrupt processing,
but should be moved from an inbox to a 'trusted system' for organizing and
tracking tasks.
Snoozing works ok, but strict GTD tries to build a discipline of not having
items re-appear in the inbox. If it's moved to a list of things to handle,
then it can be ignored or placed at a lower priority on that list.
~~~
shostack
Any suggestions for a Gmail user on how to best integrate "Snooze-like"
functionality into my workflow?
~~~
michaelfavia
Google offers Inbox which has built in snooze. I used it for 6 months or so
and liked it. Lack of ICS support eventually soured me on the interface.
------
Mahn
So, this looks interesting, but what does the "Tinder for email" analogy have
to do with it?
~~~
sithadmin
People need to stop treating the 'X for Y' analogy construct like it's the
Uber for analogies.
~~~
tomc1985
'X for Y' analogies are older than technology... good luck...
~~~
Apocryphon
It's radio for your eyes!
------
vinceguidry
I treat emails as open loops. I currently have four in my inbox representing
three open loops. I consider "inbox zero" to be a counter-productive strategy
focused on the wrong things.
I still do GTD-style triage, but I'm more willing to let stuff sit in queues.
Inevitably I get sick of looking at it and do something about it, moving it
into a backlog or working out a way to just do it right now.
But my life isn't one where more productivity would really net me all that
many life improvements. Generally, if I can visualize a pathway to a real life
improvement, motivation to get it done is not an issue.
My life generally consists of trying to solve really hard, complicated
situations using mostly intuition. Staring at something sitting in a queue is
often all I need to get that intuition going. "Why do I want this? How does
this connect to other parts of my life?"
~~~
mikegioia
I completely agree with this. I manage my inbox the same way and stare at
lists thinking that as well. Are you using any different email client right
now?
~~~
vinceguidry
I just use Gmail. At work, I use the Office 365 web mail client. I absolutely
hate it, but it gets the job done.
~~~
mikegioia
Yea me too. What I really want is something that looks like Trello where the
first list is my Inbox, and then there are 2-3 other lists that I can make up
like "This week", "Next week" etc.
~~~
vinceguidry
Sounds like a good candidate for paper and pen to me.
Software just complicates task lists.
------
zanewill9
Although there's a strong "email sucks" sentiment in the world, I believe the
truth is that email is a complex system that has actually already evolved
quite well. Gmail is quite an adept tool.
The inherent issue is volume - which isn't per-se the fault of the medium.
Filtering and categorization has been the primary answer there - and those
things (including this post) have helped evolve those issues.
------
epaga
Ah, this concept reminds me of one of the first apps I did, years ago, called
EmptyInbox - [https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/emptyinbox-for-
gmail/id50994...](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/emptyinbox-for-
gmail/id509942554?mt=8) (Yay skeuomorphism!)
It only supports GMail, but still works as far as I know. Back then it was the
only app I knew that had that concept, but by now there is Triage, plus most
modern mail clients have the "swipe" actions for quickly getting through
emails.
------
cdmo
Honestly I don't know why people keep trying to do this kind of thing:
reinventing email. Email works fine and nothing has been able to replace it
(e.g., Google Wave, Mailbox, etc). I think the reason is that email works fine
for most people. And if it isn't, a new tool to help you manage it isn't going
to fix your problems. It'll probably just create new ones.
The answer to "my inbox is crazy" is to work through your inbox - if there's
too much for you to work through then you need to do less. That's it.
~~~
CptJamesCook
The point of the app isn't to reinvent email. It's to help you get through
your inbox quicker.
~~~
cdmo
Yes, good point.
And I hate to sound like a wet blanket on a new tool/thing. Just an honest
reaction to yet another email aid app. I'm sure there will be people who use
this and find it useful.
I'm just trying to make the point that at some point all the
lifehacks/efficiency-improvements in the world will not fix the problem of
being over-burdened.
~~~
lyqwyd
No tool will ever solve the problem of being over-burdened, as becoming more
efficient just means doing more in the same amount of time.
Being over-burdened is a personal / social problem, and the only solution is
not taking on / expecting more than is realistic... easier said than done!
Efficient use of time is it's own goal, and is orthogonal to the overall load.
------
jurajmasar
"Made with <3 while procrastinating on actually dealing with email."
~~~
overcast
I think my next project, I'm going to say "Made with little sleep,
frustration, and no social life".
~~~
eric001
Off topic, but who started this "Made with <3" thing?
~~~
overcast
Not sure, but it needs to go away along with all the other feel good nonsense.
Like every startup looking for "ninjas, gurus, and rock stars".
~~~
artursapek
"Made with VCs breathing down our necks"
~~~
misuba
What's the emoticon for mortal terror, though?
~~~
qq66
D-:>
------
bttf
Reading "Tinder for Email" nearly made me headbutt my screen.
~~~
stinkytaco
Did it? Really?
Like as in you started your head toward the screen but stopped? Or perhaps it
occurred to you that headbutting the screen would be desirable but you
refrained from doing so out of regard for your health and the health of your
equipment. Or are you simply using "headbutting your screen" as an analogy for
how you felt, which would be sort of ironic.
------
joch
I like the approach! I'm a GTD user and would love for the app to integrate
with OmniFocus, meaning that defer and delegate are added to the appropriate
place within my contexts and projects.
------
msellout
Why is "defer" different from "snooze"? Both indicate picking a time to deal
with the email.
~~~
orky56
Defer seems to ambiguously capture both snooze and delegate.
~~~
robotresearcher
Defer only means to put off until later. There's no delegate meaning.
[http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/defer](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/defer)
~~~
orky56
2nd definition further down has this:
verb (used without object), deferred, deferring. 1\. to yield respectfully in
judgment or opinion (usually followed by to): We all defer to him in these
matters.
~~~
robotresearcher
OK I agree that's closer to delegate, while not the same. You couldn't
substitute 'delegate' into that sentence, for example.
------
apancik
I've edited the title from "tinder for email" as causing confusion wasn't the
goal. Thanks for all the feedback!
~~~
cellularmitosis
"An email client with a Tinder-like UX" probably would have been less
confusing.
------
tommoor
Another app built on Electron, cool to see the platform enabling web
developers to make the jump to application development
~~~
softawre
I've been using CEF for many years where I work, nothing new (as usual).
------
o_____________o
Good stuff.
Why did you use "respond" instead of "reply"? It's just as descriptive, and is
the canonical term. It takes mental overhead to parse new terminology.
And I see the business angle in "delegate", but forwarding isn't always for
purposes of delegation.
Maybe this: Dismiss Sleep Forward Reply
~~~
apancik
I used "respond" straight from Merlin Mann's lecture. I agree that it might
create some mental overhead. I'll make a note to change it
~~~
nacs
Honestly, you should change all the words except "Done". When people are using
"simple" email software, they don't want to have to think about
dictionary/uncommon words like "defer" and "delegate".
------
rhodysurf
Google Inbox kinda does the same thing
Looks cool though
------
arihant
I believe I'll have the same problem with this app that I have with Kindle --
the lack of flipability in the name of apparent convenience and simplicity.
There is an unspoken importance in an inbox glance, in seeing a list of
"undone" email and getting a gist of things. There is a similar feeling in
flipping pages of an entire book.
Imagine being in a room where you only see one object at a time, you can
either use it or defer it for a later time. Simple? Yes. Will I hope to
stumble upon a gun to put in my mouth? Indeed.
There is a magic in looking at the world and _deciding_ on what to do. It's
much faster, efficient, and satisfying.
------
hellbanner
Their 4 actions are also known as
Delete (done, or archive) Label Forward
....
------
toddsiegel
I just downloaded it. I like "response", "delegate", and "defer", and
"unsubscribe".
I do not like that is only runs in fullscreen, but I think I get why you're
doing it.
I current use Google Inbox and set my default "done" action to delete. You
should support the notion of "done forever".
I maybe keep 10% of the email I receive. Having a heavy hand with deletion
forces me to think about the value of the communication and to capture the
important actions and details in my todo system.
~~~
robbyking
FWiW, it doesn't _only_ run in full screen, it just launches in full screen.
------
akoumjian
Inbox has essentially these features. What are the advantages here?
~~~
tomasien
Containing features does not a well designed product make. Matter of taste,
but it's the removing of features that makes this concept interesting.
~~~
akoumjian
Inbox is pretty darn minimalistic, and it's batching 'done' action makes inbox
0 pretty easy.
------
erikb
The days of open source propaganda are long gone, at least for me. But this
sounds like a thing that should be put into open source, in a way that not
just the own gui can use it but that other email client creators can integrate
it as well (i.e. a library). We've seen so many email clients come and go,
having a single app do that is not enough to stay in the game.
------
heywire
Just a heads up, my workplace McAfee Web Gateway filters this website under
the category "Phishing" with a "Medium Risk" reputation. Perhaps the previous
domain owner wasn't the most reputable. Not sure what you have to do to get
off of McAfee's list, but wanted to mention it as it might keep people from
being able to visit your site.
~~~
apancik
Thanks for the note! I will look into it
------
oliv__
I dont know about you but I like to go back and re-read some of my old email.
Does the _DONE_ button delete or archive your email?
~~~
apancik
"Done" just archives
------
athenot
Would be intersting to be able to tag the email as it's being marked "Done".
It's the GTD analogy of filing it away. Yes full-text search can turn up
almost anything but a tag may help for smartmailboxes or further post-
processing work.
~~~
orky56
This Gmail workflow that I use religiously does the tagging but lacks
PlainEmail's distraction-free interface to take the actions. I'm currently
using keyboard shorts to accomplish this: L (to label), then P (for
priority)/W (for waiting) or just Star (for reference).
[http://klinger.io/post/71640845938/dont-drown-in-email-
how-t...](http://klinger.io/post/71640845938/dont-drown-in-email-how-to-use-
gmail-more)
------
Walkman
I really liked Mailbox (later acquired by Dropbox). It was clean, easy, zero
inbox with one million user signups at the beginning and what happened to
them? Went to the kitchen sink... I expect the same from this.
------
peterwwillis
This takes actions you could perform on dozens of e-mails at once [via
checkboxes] and makes it one-at-a-time. Seems inefficient.
Also, I'm not hooking up with people via e-mail, so perhaps drop the Tinder
comparison.
------
S77
Cool product. From a design perspective I really love the website, you've done
extremely well. Just a small note I believe the typography could be improved
by implementing more headers.
------
Sir_Cmpwn
I was hoping that this was going to be about using plaintext emails. It's
pretty cool, though. I have a very similar workflow with mutt and a few
keybindings.
------
kepano
Triage: [http://triage.cc](http://triage.cc)
Same idea. Quickly clean out your inbox, with a Tinder-like UI. It works well.
------
tomc1985
Too... Plain for my tastes. Not really feeling this whole "apps should look
like websites" thing. And too much whitespace!
~~~
cellularmitosis
You've addressed the visual presentation. Now, what do you think about the
ideas he is presenting?
~~~
tomc1985
The app itself is yet-another-email-client. Those original verbs in the
screenshot are just pre-built macros. I don't consider "Inbox Zero" a worthy
goal -- because the REAL goal should be reducing your total volume of email,
by conducting one's work in a way that minimizes reliance and interactions
with other people for day-to-day matters.
IMHO the REAL solution to less email is smarter communications and personal
empowerment: keep your meetings short and laser-focused, keep conversations
focused and purposeful, make sure everyone is in sync before beginning, and
don't hire/work with stupids. I shouldn't have to email Bob just to ask him to
request deliverable X -- I should be empowered (and intelligent) enough to get
X on my own, and if I don't know how then I should use my powers of
observation and inference to figure that out.
People over-rely on email, and on communication in general.
------
Pathshare
Very nicely designed, great job.
Defer sounds a little strange, other than that absolutely something I will try
out..
------
juskrey
Isn't "DONE DELEGATE RESPOND DEFER" "Archive Forward Respond Mark-
as-(un)Read"?
------
tomasien
Love this, hate "Tinder for Email" as a tagline. Keep us updated!
------
theyCallMeSwift
This is awesome. Are you planning on open sourcing the prototype?
------
rajadigopula
Need "Spam"!
------
sccxy
Why this website needs 11 javascript, 12 css & 6 font files?
Numbers from [http://www.webpagetest.org](http://www.webpagetest.org)
~~~
z5h
The developer was probably busy writing apps and giving them away for free,
and decided not to spend time optimizing the page.
~~~
josefresco
Page is pretty well put together (indicating some time was spent) - all the JS
is for the "fancy" fading/sliding effects and is quite comment. Parent is
being harsh, but you're also being too reactionary.
------
teabee89
Defer is always greyed out. Why is that?
~~~
_Rex
I've got this too.
~~~
g10r
Defer is just not built yet, that's all.
------
fiatjaf
"Tinder for email"? Really?
------
andrewmcwatters
* Email software * Main design aesthetical feature is whitespace * Generic name * Monochromatic gradient * Modern typestack * Rounded buttons * Made with heart emojis
This landing page and design could have been generated by software that
intentionally crafted status quo product examples, and I would not be able to
tell it apart from something legitimately created.
This is a product of the times, not a product pushing the our times forward.
It really is like the output of a Markov chain product generator.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why Television is Kicking Hollywood’s Arse Right Now - Skibb
http://pixelatedgeek.com/2013/05/why-television-is-kicking-hollywoods-arse-right-now-and-how-to-fix-it/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+PixelatedGeek+%28Pixelated+Geek%29
======
Millennium
You want to fix Hollywood? Drop copyright terms to 14 years, including
renewals, and deny renewal to any copyright that has already been in existence
for longer than that: it can finish its current term, but not get a new one.
Make the endless parade of reboots and remakes unprofitable, and Hollywood
will get creative again. That's all there is to it.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: If you had 7k to spend on a SaaS launch, what would you do? - davidpolberger
We're a small, bootstrapped company whose SaaS product has been in public beta since 2016. We're finally about to launch commercially and have been advised to spend real money to try to capitalize on the launch. We've set aside 7k.<p>I've contacted a few boutique PR firms in my area (Sweden) and my distinct impression is that they don't get what we're trying to do and lack the connections necessary for us to get placement where it matters. (Our product is "Excel for apps," a web service enabling anyone with spreadsheet skills to create line-of-business web apps.)<p>If you were in our position, how would you spend the money? Would you hire a PR firm or would you try to do the work yourself and spend the money on advertising? Or do something else entirely?
======
cimmanom
Do you consider your product to be B2B or B2C? A fundamental aspect of
marketing is knowing who your audience is. Narrow it down to a sliver that you
think will be the most enthusiastic adopters; then figure out how one gets the
attention of those particular users.
~~~
davidpolberger
That's great advice. We have a B2B product and, as you say, we need to get our
message out to these specific users. Frankly, I don't think that our "launch"
will matter much down the road, but we have been advised to not let the
"newsworthiness" of the event go to waste, meaning that we should take the
opportunity to get some press. It probably isn't worth 7k, though.
------
ecesena
If the PR firm doesn't get it, chances are that your customers won't get it.
I'd personally spend a good amount of money to work on your core messages and
brand.
After that, advertising is one way to go if you have a clear = small market
that you want to attack first (unclear from your comment, you say "anyone with
spreadsheet skills")
Finally, you could invest in blog posts/tutorials to showcase how your SaaS
can solve problems in different domains. I find this very useful because if
you try to write a 3 steps tutorial and you find out it's 10 pages long, then
you may be encouraged to simplify your product from a "new user experience"
point of view.
~~~
davidpolberger
The product is horizontal in the sense that it is applicable in a variety of
domains, much like spreadsheets. Most of the ~10,000 apps that have been
created with our beta relate to pricing and other economic calculations, often
created by small business owners. These are the users we primarily need to get
out in front of and create content for. I'm looking into advertising on blogs
related to this demographic.
(We spent years doing contract work in the health care industry, creating drug
dosage calculators and the like using our own app builder, so there are
definitely other verticals as well.)
~~~
paulcole
If you can’t explain it to a PR company how will you explain it to random
small business owners.
There’s something wrong with your messaging.
------
itamarst
The idea seems to be "spend a bunch of money and then launch will succeed".
But, what if it doesn't succeed? What then?
Better approach is "how can we reach potential customers repeatedly". Because
that way if first launch doesn't work as well as expected, you have second
launch, and third launch, and fourth launch.
(Mostly learned from
[https://stackingthebricks.com](https://stackingthebricks.com), though I don't
see direct article about this at first glance.)
------
charlesdm
I have little feedback for you, other than don't spend 7k on a PR firm. Maybe
someone will hold a different opinion, but for the most part they are useless.
You're probably better investing that money in advertising. Or flying out and
meeting new clients. It really depends on the industry and how 'niche' your
product is, and how you can connect with your customers.
Conferences can sometimes be interesting as well, if they allow you to connect
with people in your industry.
~~~
davidpolberger
Thanks for the feedback, that makes sense.
------
peppersauce
Do you have any data to show that PR would be an effective channel?
If you're manpower limited, you could double down on marketing channels that
are already effective for you, or spend the time and money testing channels.
Check out the book 'Traction' by Gabriel Weinberg (of DuckDuckGo).
~~~
davidpolberger
The book looks great, I've ordered a copy. Thanks!
As I mention elsewhere in the thread, we have been advised to not let the
"newsworthiness" of our launch go to waste, meaning that we should take the
opportunity to get some press. It probably isn't worth 7k, though. E-mailing a
select few publications ourselves and spending the money on advertising on
blogs of interest to our demographic is probably a much better use of the
money.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth - aaphilip
http://blogs.amd.com/patmoorhead/2009/05/20/truth-the-whole-truth-and-nothing-but-the-truth/
======
sfk
Comment #20 is really worth reading. One of the best arguments against
laissez-faire capitalism I have read.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask YC: HN submissions feels like submissions on reddit post sale, do you guys feel the same way? - _bdcu
HN submissions feels like submissions on reddit after it was purchased by wired parent company. Do you guys feel the same way?
======
ojbyrne
I think what happens is that eventually there aren't enough "good" links out
there that haven't been submitted, but there's still a demand to be filled.
Newspapers keep "filler" stories around for that eventuality ("slow news
day"). I think the same thing happens on social news sites - especially ones
that grow - because the demand (for new stuff) eventually outstrips the supply
(of good new stuff).
------
iamdave
Please pardon the way this sounds, I only aim to help: Lately, yes but
continuously saying "this place is turning into Reddit" really doesn't help
nearly as much as continuously posting the types of articles people come here
to read.
~~~
marvin
Posting good stories and comments won't help if the quality of the community
at large is going downhill. And what else would the falling quality of the
stories and comments be a symptom of? No amount of "following the guidelines"
or "only posting interesting stories" by the regular community will help if
there is a swarm of other users who don't give a fuck.
If this development persists, history dictates that the old regulars won't
hang around for long, which is really sad.
It's such a pain in the ass to drift around the internet like nomads, leaving
for new territory when the locusts come to consume the places you know and
love..
For the record, I do my best: I submit new stories when I find them and
produce (presumably) useful commentary. And it works, for now, but I'm not
very hopeful as to what HN will look like in a year.
~~~
bkudria
That seems to suggest the next system should be designed to expressly counter
this effect. Perhaps, allow groups to form and close themselves off, while
still remaining on the site? Move to a different subsite (instead of a whole
new site)? This might be a little more successful than trying to filter
submissions in some way for some nebulous "quality".
~~~
DenisM
The "funny" thing is that all these problems are not new. They are all
manifestation of Eternal September
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September> Even the Eternal September
itself was a reflection of a problem that happened earlier when USENET has
grown beyond size where most people knew each other and quality of
conversation went down. Alas I am not able to find the links for it, it would
be really nice to find those complains.
The other funny thing is that there is a well-known way to preserve the
comunity - maintain very strict set of rules and punish all deviations by a
singular authority (THE Moderator) and his minions. Fidonet used to work that
way and it worked very well. It only fails when The Moderator loosens the grip
for even short time - the place gets overrun and can not be taken back. The
problem is that any moderator will have a moment of weakness and so Fidonet
got entirely overrun in the end.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
------
fiaz
I like the extra level of filtration from reddit for postings that are
relevant to what draws people to come to HN. I could care less if a posting
was on reddit before it comes to HN.
------
noodle
not really, but i do kind of feel like the majority of the submissions i see
are from people trying to karma whore via automatic submissions of popular-ish
sites
i feel like reading the new links area is like reading my feed reader.
which is unavoidable, and what i do to combat it is submit more quality things
when i can find them, and be picky with my modding things up.
------
ComputerGuru
Dude, give it a break already. Constantly crying about how HN doesn't suite
your taste isn't going to make it any better and certainly doesn't raise the
quality of the front page articles.
~~~
_bdcu
I am not constantly complaining about HN submissions. I do submit good (the
ones I think are good) links.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Quantum gas reveals first sign of path-bending monopole - selimthegrim
http://jqi.umd.edu/news/quantum-gas-reveals-first-signs-path-bending-monopole
======
selimthegrim
[http://science.sciencemag.org/content/360/6396/1429.full](http://science.sciencemag.org/content/360/6396/1429.full)
Arxiv preprint:
[https://arxiv.org/abs/1610.06228](https://arxiv.org/abs/1610.06228)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Is Bill Gates a “philanthropist, and Humanitarian”? - oriettaxx
what has been windows o.s. for the world? "philanthropist, and humanitarian"?
======
oriettaxx
the Fundation, the "giving pledge", the "benefactors" crew, donations,
"Dementia Discovery Fund", "Reinvent the Toilet Challenge", and his books: you
can try to fix it, but to me it all sounds a way to hide your original sin and
the embarrassment you feel realizing that with some simple tricks you made
tons of $$$: how can you stand it compared to the effort your maid is doing
everyday to please you? I do _not_ like it, and it feels sick.
~~~
jstewartmobile
In the grand stream of entropy we call computing, the Gates age of Microsoft
was bunnies and cuddles compared to the Apple/Google/FB clstrfck of platform
restrictions, police-state tattling, and info-rape.
In the current age, Obama got a peace prize for killing fewer Brown people
than the last guy. In the current age, Bill is a saint.
~~~
oriettaxx
yes, I understand the hyperbole: there's always somebody who's got it way, way
worse...
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
JavaScript frameworks performances: Prototype vs jQuery - nickb
http://www.studio-cdd.com:8080/haineault/blog/15/
======
dappelbaum
finally, a framework comparison article with data... I'll have to look into
jQuery
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
A Clean Start for the Web - scraplab
https://macwright.com/2020/08/22/clean-starts-for-the-web.html
======
jpswade
It feels like this is trying to solve the wrong problem.
People aren't asking for a new document standard or a new browser.
If you follow the money, you'll find that most of Mozilla's money comes from
Google. Most of Google's money comes from Ads on its search platform(s).
The way to a better web would be to solve the discovery problem. If you didn't
need to use Google or App Stores to find the content, then you would not be
dependant on their ad revenue.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
46000 year old aboriginal sacred site destruction - Bang2Bay
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rio-tinto-ceo-resigns-aboriginal-site-destruction-juukan-gorge-australia/
======
Bang2Bay
CEO Resigning does not look like taking ownership of what happened. anybody
who approved such blasts or destruction should also own up to this
destruction.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Betrusted: A Security Enclave for Humans - DyslexicAtheist
https://betrusted.io/
======
canada_dry
I almost missed that this project is supported by Andrew "Bunnie" Huang.
That alone has me very interested.
As most ycnews readers already know Andrew has made it his mission to direct
his considerable talents on projects that push up against oppression - instead
of focusing his energy on helping unicorns. I'm a huge fan/supporter of his
work (e.g. Novena, NeTV, Safecast) and will likely pick one of these up when
it goes GA.
~~~
bradknowles
And funded by NLnet. At the bottom of the linked page:
The Betrusted team is funded in part by the NLnet Foundation via Privacy &
Trust Enhancing Technologies grants.
------
russfink
A TPM is not a "secure enclave." It is a smart card bonded to the motherboard,
used for platform attestation, and some basic encryption. It provides no
enclave to speak of. (Maybe they meant SGX or TrustZone?)
~~~
dathinab
I think the word enclave is just being used in more then on way. I have seen
that "secure core" many ARM devices have being referred to as secure enclave
and secure coprocessor which both isn't quite right but people go with it
anyway.
(I mean that additional Cortex-M0/3? core which run in a super previleged mode
and often implements the EFI, DRM bs, and sometimes a TPM module)
So I guess we just have to live with it ;)
Edit: through yes secure enclave, secure element and TPM are not the same but
they have in common that the represent mistrust in the rest of the hardware.
------
grizzles
Phones are such incredibly personal devices. This should be what your phone is
but economics has made phones untrustworthy because of their complexity.
So I've always wondered why we haven't seen more projects like this.
In my opinion, they should drop the hardware keyboard in favor of a d-pad or a
few Yes/No type buttons and an onscreen keyboard. If the hardware is to be
trusted this shouldn't matter to the trust calculus. And the market has proved
the blackberry segment is niche.
~~~
sneak
My guess is that there isn’t a very big addressable market for privacy, and
hardware requires a lot of up-front investment. It has to be someone who
believes that the world will be better if it exists, not simply the highest
$/hour ROI on building it.
There is more money in surveillance, as we’ve seen, than privacy.
~~~
hutzlibu
Oh, but people care about privacy. Just not enough, to pay significantly more
money for it and suffer performance loss.
But this is also because a mobile is a black box for them, and it would give
them a big headache to try and understand that site about that phone. In the
end, for them, they still have to trust the developers, so they stick with the
ones they know by the corporations.
------
nickik
I really like the idea of using something like as a U2F authenticator that
allows me to define a additional local PIN. There are whole number of
application this would be useful for.
I strongly recommend this talk by Andrew "Bunnie" Huang it gives a lot of
background on his thinking about Open Hardware/Software:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXwy65d_tu8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXwy65d_tu8)
~~~
ecesena
fwiw in fido2, successor of u2f, you can opt in for an additional pin on your
security key.
~~~
nickik
Yes, that was what i was referring to. Sorry if that was not clear.
------
dang
Related from yesterday:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21891056](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21891056)
Video:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21898061](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21898061)
------
morphle
36C3 - Open Source is Insufficient to Solve Trust Problems in Hardware
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hzb37RyagCQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hzb37RyagCQ)
------
VectorLock
Bunnie's blog post has really good description of it as well
[http://bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=5706](http://bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=5706)
The FPGA is the weak link as he says. Everything else is cool (like the
physical keyboard and LCD you can inspect with a light) but you can't validate
the FPGA. I'd assume it'd be harder for a threat actor to compromise (make a
compromised FPGA would take more resources than compromising the keyboard,
etc)
------
reilly3000
This feels like the future to me. Today's smartphone platforms have given a
canonical ID to the user, and often their location. Location tracking is
starting to become a really hot issue for the general public. I think its a
gateway drug to digital security. The model of a dedicated secure device that
uses external communications accomplishes a lot technically, but also 'fits'
comfortably in the habits of millions of people. Such a device could fit right
in with phone, wallet, and keys, and it could be an ideal tool for storing
your on-the-go crypto. People trust things they can touch and can audit.
The first team that can ship a universal, secure hardware wallet that 'just
works' for $50-$150 could sell 5 million units in a year. In 7 years there
could be billions of them, selling for $10+ a unit; a consumable like a
traditional wallet.
I would keep one on my person at nearly all times, and have it replicate state
to another at home, and a third in some vault service (like a connected safety
deposit box). They devices would establish a physical pairing by creating an
irreversible key-pair on the hardware itself. The replication could be a
sequential log (like mysql binlog or git), and the integrity of that log could
be additionally verified by bringing the devices within close proximity. All
that is to say, there needs to be a secure, peer-based way to mitigate
inevitable loss, damage or theft of the physical device- without centralizing
the data or losing state. It would do well to be dummy-proof and make fun
sounds when performing the above pairing and verifying operations. Megacorps
shouldn't get to be in charge of syncing everything for us.
Let's take back the autonomy that has been stolen from us during these awkward
teenage years of a digitally-driven society, and this time let's keep it in
our own hands.
------
stevewillows
Interesting to see a mobile hardware keyboard with a Dvorak layout.
------
bawolff
Interesting. But it seems like it would add a lot of attack surface if all
these things are within the secure enclave.
------
robryk
I am confused by the threat model here. It seems that we want to assure (among
others) confidentiality of the data the user is inputting. However, I don't
think any of the planned data input channels would be hard to eavesdrop on
from the POV of the user's phone:
a) input via hardware keyboard, if the betrusted is a part of the phone case,
should be simple to eavesdrop on based on microphone and/or accelerometer
readings in the phone: different keys on the keyboard will likely be different
enough. b) input via voice can be eavesdropped on by the phone' microphone.
Do I misunderstand the guarantees betrusted intends to provide or something
else?
~~~
Iv
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hzb37RyagCQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hzb37RyagCQ)
He starts talking about betrusted at 30:00
------
snowedin
Impressed by the practical approach the author is taking to this problem.
Please add: \- Hardware switches for RF modules as well as microphones \-
Separate RAM for baseband SOC
------
deugtniet
So as I read this, this is a device you have to carry next to your phone for
your secure communications. Sounds interesting and for the security minded, it
seems it could have some real added value. But for the average consumer it
adds a layer of inconvenience that you don't want when contacting your
grandmother. Are high powered individuals with strict security requirements
the target market for this device?
~~~
rossdavidh
Any device (or software for that matter) which makes a security one of its
selling points, is not aiming at the mass market.
------
irq-1
Could this use a software keyboard? If so, it could eventually be incorporated
into phones; I'm thinking of a SOC that takes complete control of the screen,
bus, etc...
~~~
RL_Quine
Samsung already did this with some ARM core that could get complete control.
How do you know you’re not looking at a software emulation of the secure
elements display though?
~~~
dimensi0nal
There could be an LED controlled by the secure element that indicates it has
control of the hardware.
~~~
RL_Quine
It’s a matter of training the user to look for that though.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: Super Easy Forms (free) – The best way to create HTML contact forms - lucas_kardo
https://supereasyforms.com/
======
lucas_kardo
We developed this tool as a gift for the community. Contact forms should be
easy and free to make. Some of what makes us different - Features:
100% customizable html forms (No iframes) Create an unlimited amount of forms
Store unlimited form submissions Register an unlimited amount of emails.
Easily export submissions from the database
Please download and use Super Easy Forms. Feedback is welcomed =)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
“johnyj12345” exposing self-hosted Gitlab's secrets to the public - ferruck
https://blog.philipp-trommler.me/posts/2020/07/13/security-possible-gitlab-hack-johnyj12345/
======
ferruck
It seems like a user named "johnyj12345" is making it's rounds on self-hosted
Gitlab instances since Saturday, exposing server secrets to the public by
creating issues containing Gitlab's `secrets.yml` file. Better check your
instance!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The Google Graveyard - parham
http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/map_of_the_week/2013/03/google_reader_joins_graveyard_of_dead_google_products.html?
======
ColinWright
Dup: <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5387314>
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
JWT Multiple Request Refresh Token - Alexeykhr
https://medium.com/@alexeykhr/jwt-multiple-request-refresh-token-693bb24e3a68
======
rp2684
A way to solve this issue would be to synchronise around refresh API calls.
This way, parallel refresh calls will never happen, and in fact, you need to
even do the 2nd onwards refresh call. The trickiest part here is to also lock
across tabs, since the user could have several tabs of your website open and
all of them running in parallel.
This is exactly what SuperTokens.io does in their website SDK. As a user, you
don't need to worry about this and can simply make your fetch / axios calls as
usual.
------
bouke
Seems like a lot of work where a simple session id would suffice. JWT’s are
not the appropriate solution where session-like behavior is wanted.
~~~
rp2684
This problem will also exist if an opaque token is used instead of a JWT (as
long as a refresh token is being used). Now you may argue that we don't need
to use refresh tokens because that's complex, however, in that case, you are
severely compromising on user security. See this please:
[https://supertokens.io/blog/all-you-need-to-know-about-
user-...](https://supertokens.io/blog/all-you-need-to-know-about-user-session-
security?s=y)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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World's largest aircraft looking for investors to give it liftoff - ghosh
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/30/worlds-largest-aircraft-looking-for-investors-to-give-it-liftoff
======
AlexMuir
The insurmountable problem so far on these cargo airships is ballast. It's
what killed off the Cargolifter Project (as I read while sitting naked under a
palm tree in its former hangar. [0])
Their killer use case is moving heavy stuff to inaccessible areas. Wind
turbines being the flavour of the moment. They combine the long distance
capability of a plane, the hovering of a helicopter and the lift capacity of a
crane...
However, once the 160 tonne payload has been dropped, the ship either needs to
take on 160 tonnes of ballast or jettison helium (not an option since it's so
expensive). The Cargolifter idea was to just pump up water if I remember
correctly, but for land-based tasks that meant being met by ten tanker lorries
at the drop site, thus negating all the benefits and meaning you might as well
stick the cargo straight on those trucks.
I'd love to see it work out, but so far these projects have been nothing but a
wipeout for investors. Coincidentally back in 2006 I worked a couple of desks
over from people managing the liquidation of Skycat, which was basically the
same thing, also built at Cardington. It may even have been the same team.
[0]
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropical_Islands_Resort](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropical_Islands_Resort)
~~~
rpenm
Compress the helium into tanks and use atmosphere as ballast. Ballast can be
dropped by directly purging with helium. Alternatively, contain the ballast in
bladders that vent as helium pressure rises. Designing flexible bladders that
don't leak too badly would be an engineering problem. A terribly inefficient
option would be to allow the gasses to mix and just use fractionation to
separate the heavy elements when dropping ballast.
~~~
JulianMorrison
It exists. [http://rt.com/news/aeroscraft-revolutionary-airship-
cargo-18...](http://rt.com/news/aeroscraft-revolutionary-airship-cargo-187/)
(Feb 2013)
------
danbruc
Failed German attempt CargoLifter [1] with up to 160 tonne payload that
finally gave us a swimming pool in a ridiculous large hangar [2].
[1]
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CargoLifter](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CargoLifter)
[2]
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropical_Islands_Resort](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tropical_Islands_Resort)
~~~
AlexMuir
:) I used to go to Tropical Islands every weekend when I was sleeping in a van
in Berlin. It's an amazing place from an engineering point of view. And the
spa is the best I've ever been to.
~~~
darklajid
Celebrated one of our wedding anniversaries (or whatever you'd call that)
there.
Crap if you want to swim, but quite amazing to relax and fun to stay over
night.
------
digerata
That's funny. I immediately thought that this guy had a FEVER. And the only
prescription was more AIRSHIP.
But apparently there are two Bruce Dickinson's in music:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Dickinson](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Dickinson)
------
blakeyrat
World's largest aircraft? The Hindenburg was 245m long.
[http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ee/Gia...](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ee/Giant_Aircraft_Comparison.svg/2000px-
Giant_Aircraft_Comparison.svg.png)
------
sschueller
What is the practicality of that aircraft? It can't lift near as much as a
Antonov 225 (545,000lb (247,000kg) vs 22,050lb (10,000kg))
Size comparison:
[https://golong16.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/pic10808-1.jpg](https://golong16.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/pic10808-1.jpg)
~~~
msandford
The 225 burns 16 tons of fuel per hour while flying.
This airship has 4x 325 HP V8 engines. Roughly speaking they each use about
150lbs of fuel per hour to generate 325 HP. That's 0.3 tons per hour between
the four of them.
Now of course the 225 will do 5x the speed of the Airlander 10, so where the
225 would use 16 tons to go 500 miles, the 10 would use 1.5 tons.
Here's where things get interesting, though. The frontal surface area tends to
dominate drag, where as the volume is what gives you lift capacity. You can
scale volume much faster than frontal area and that means 10x (or 100x) the
lift capacity might only be 2x (or 10x) the fuel consumption.
Big-Oh(airship) is potentially interesting.
------
codewithcheese
Here's the link if you want to 'invest'
[https://www.crowdcube.com/investment/hybrid-air-vehicles-
lim...](https://www.crowdcube.com/investment/hybrid-air-vehicles-
limited-18450)
------
leroy_masochist
Wow. Bruce Dickinson is nearly unrecognizable in the photo that accompanies
this article.
------
anigbrowl
This looks much more civilized than regular air travel. To the pleasure barge!
------
briandear
I would love to see how this aircraft would function at high altitude such as
in Nepal. This could have a huge positive impact around Everest, especially
with white knuckle Lukla airport.
------
jnye131
[http://www.hybridairvehicles.com](http://www.hybridairvehicles.com)
------
azinman2
Umm the world is running out of helium and there's no good way to make more.
Not sure how this will be viable.
~~~
monort
Natural gas has up to 7% of helium:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helium#Modern_extraction_and_d...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helium#Modern_extraction_and_distribution)
~~~
fit2rule
Yeah but it's eventually going to run out, is the point. Helium doesn't like
to stay on Earth.
~~~
monort
World reserves are 40 billion cubic meters, yearly production is 175 million
cubic meters. It seems we have 200 years supply. And it's a renewable resource
(produced during radioactive decay), and universe has a lot of helium, 23% of
its baryonic mass.
~~~
fit2rule
Yeah, we can all quote from Wikipedia. Here's another interesting quote about
Helium:
*Moses Chan, Evan Pugh Professor of Physics at Penn State, explains that the world's supply of helium is a byproduct of natural gas production, with the Texas Panhandle arguably being the helium capital of the world. However, says Chan, "Very few natural gas wells in the world have enough helium in the well to make it economical to separate helium from natural gas. The gas wells with the most helium have only about 0.3 percent, so it is in short supply." In response to the element's scarcity, the United States has been stockpiling helium since the 1960s in a National Helium Reserve called the Bush Dome, a deep underground reservoir outside of Amarillo, Texas. By the mid 1970s 1.2 billion cubic meters of the gas was stored there. The current reserve is approximately 0.6 billion cubic meters, or roughly 4 times the current world market. But, Chan notes, in 1996 the Helium Privatization Act mandated that the Department of the Interior sell off all the stockpiled helium by 2015. "As a consequence," he says, "the United States government is selling the equivalent of 40 percent of the world market of helium at a below-market price." This action discourages the active exploration of helium," Chan explains, "since companies can buy it from the United States at a cheap price and sell it at a premium."
Read more at: [http://phys.org/news/2013-04-probing-
helium.html#jCp](http://phys.org/news/2013-04-probing-helium.html#jCp)
~~~
TheLoneWolfling
So?
Currently helium is being sold off at a below-market price. When the reserve
gets low, people will look at it and go "huh. We could make some money off of
helium when the reserve runs out", and look for other sources.
We already did the same sort of thing for oil. We didn't panic when the
initial wells and types of wells started to go dry - we found other sources.
~~~
jsprogrammer
Infinite Earth.
~~~
TheLoneWolfling
I don't get the reference, if that is one.
If you're trying to point out that the Earth is finite, although you are
correct, the scale is... large. Everything that decays via alpha decay
ultimately makes helium.
Not to mention that a) worse comes to worse, we can always make our own, and
b) it's literally >20% of the universe's (baryonic) mass.
The question is whether it's economic to use, not if it will run out.
~~~
jsprogrammer
It's only a reference to what was implied in your post. Nothing more.
a) Even though you may be able to decay the entire Earth into helium, it is
only produced at a constant rate. If the rate of use is higher than the rate
of production, you will still run out.
b) Which we have 0 access to.
c) You won't be able to always just "find other sources" of finite resources
(I'm thinking more than just helium [unless you plan on becoming a pure helium
lifeform]) and the Earth will become uninhabitable long before our resources
are exhausted.
~~~
TheLoneWolfling
a) Not true. As I said: worse comes to worse we can always make our own. Alpha
decay can be induced with particle beams, etc. Now, it's horridly inefficient,
etc, etc. But it's possible.
b) What don't we have access to? The rest of the universe? True, for now.
However, we don't "even" need to go interstellar for it.
c) No, we won't be able to forever. However, the thing is: with helium at
least, the sources _known now_ are sufficient, in raw quantity at least, until
so far in the future that good luck predicting what our needs will be. It
makes someone before the rise of automobiles calculating what the horse manure
removal would have to be in 2100 look shortsighted.
~~~
azinman2
What is 'sufficient'? How long a view are you taking on this?
With small percentages of natural gas containing helium (0-7%), much of what's
currently coming up isn't being captured or is only now starting to be in
Qatar and Russia. The rest is just let go, and once helium get's into the air
it's over.
Luckily, as you suggested, prices going up means people are starting to build
helium recycling systems. However congress made them artificially low and thus
speed up unnecessary wastage of this precious resource.
If you're only concerned about the next 200 years, can you imagine if that was
the same attitude in the 1600's? What would we have now?
Now imagine if we really are all flying around in giant helium aircraft
because oil has run out or is too expensive... how much helium is getting used
up for that purpose alone? There's far more natural gas/oil than helium.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Man sued by Best Buy for using Geek Squad name - rjohnk
http://www.startribune.com/business/235677751.html
======
Inception
Isn't Geek Squad being phased out anyways? I thought I remembered hearing that
the program wasn't making any money...Maybe this lawsuit is Best Buy's last
attempt to make some money off their failed project ;)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The Government owns these domains - cyborg
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/15758821/domains/index.html
======
mchannon
"Department of Defense" is a glaring omission. Would not surprise me if it
would rank #1 provided they could track all of its domains down.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
This Algae Battery Could Power A Tesla With 200X The Charge - shijie
http://techcrunch.com/2014/05/30/this-algae-battery-could-power-a-tesla-with-200x-the-charge/
======
finkin1
Engadget mentioned this in 2009:
[http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/29/ultrathin-algae-based-
bat...](http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/29/ultrathin-algae-based-batteries-
could-charge-things-you-never-t/).
I wonder why it hasn't reached the market yet. There's gotta be a reason if
the technology is as amazing as people claim. Does anyone know what the
hangups are?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Re: Why Nerds are Unpopular - wumi
http://www.paulgraham.com/renerds.html
======
peakok
“One can acquire everything in solitude - except character.” - Stendhal
Maybe this is one part of the explaination, since nerds are more likely to
enjoy solitary activities.
edit : if you just want your children to avoid the nightmare you have endured
yourself, they don't need to seek popularity but only respect. All it takes to
earn respect is some character. The interesting part is : how to help them
develop this trait ?
edit2 : I cannot find it on Wikipedia, but the extended biography of Arthur
Conan Doyle might give a hint. If I recall correctly, he interrupted his
studies for one year and engaged in a journey on a fishing boat who was
hunting whales in Antartic (or was it North Pole ?). While it doesn't sound
very romantic, it is known that when he went back from his trip, he wasn't the
same man. The former inexistant shy guy (probably a nerd) became famous on the
campus because of it's popularity among female students (he was known as
dating multiple girls at once).
Who knows what happened during his journey, but it was definitly very
formative. He didn't do any "dumb stuff" to become popular, and didn't even
seek to become popular, but he just returned as a different man.
~~~
pg
_they don't need to seek popularity but only respect. All it takes to earn
respect is some character._
Where I went to high school, the way people were treated was not a function of
character. Think about all the people who've been maltreated at school. Are
you saying it was because they all lacked character?
~~~
peakok
Why are some teachers respected and others just get eaten alive by all their
classrooms ? There is a trick beyond each illusion.
~~~
apu
With no exceptions at my high school, the respected teachers respected their
students. This appears to be a necessary condition, but not a sufficient one
-- there were some teachers who respected the students but weren't themselves
respected (for various reasons).
------
ratsbane
If the un-nerdly activities in high school had the prominence of sports then
perhaps the kids who participated in them would be more popular. Think of the
friday night football games - big crowds paying lots of money at the gate,
football players in uniforms running out onto the field, cheerleaders - versus
math and science competetions - four or five kids pile into someone's dad's
Suburban and drive fifty miles to sit in small windowless rooms for a few
hours. (At least, that's exactly what happened at my high school.)
One way to make nerds more popular is to make more of a big deal of that kind
of activity. For those of us who were high school nerds, what about sponsoring
math and science competitions for high school students? I'm remembering a
conversation I had recently with a friend who teaches CS at the local
university. He had organized some sort of programming competition for high
school students. Even $500 to be used as prize money would go a long way to
enhancing the prestige of something like that and of the kids who participate
in it.
PG had some good points in his essay and follow-up. The kids he's talking
about aren't just some random nobodies - they're US a few years ago.
After I graduated my (private) high school spent several million dollars in
redoing the football field. They even put down artificial turf. And they
stopped preping kids for the CS AP test. [sigh]
~~~
dominik
If schools didn't do sports, perhaps they could focus more on academics.
Unfortunately, as you astutely point out, football and other sports bring in
"big crowds paying lots of money" -- something that academic competitions
can't bring in. There isn't a National Computer Science League that gets
televised each Sunday. American football exists as an American high school
institution precisely because mainstream American culture heavily advertises
and hypes it.
I'd love to see schools make sports subservient to academics, but I fear it'll
never happen purely for financial reasons.
~~~
cconstantine
I was a nerd in high school, and I was an athlete. Granted it was swimming in
the Midwest which means practically nobody cared, but it was a sport. I would
count my days on the swim team as an invaluable learning experience.
I found that I could think more clearly, could sleep better at night, and was
more awake during the day during the swim season. In other words, while I was
in shape and health my mental abilities and general well-being improved. I
would not have really internalized this lesson unless I experienced it first
hand.
Sports have a place in school. It helped me learn some social skills, the
value of physical activity, and that there can be a life outside of a
computer. I was a pretty good swimmer (won more than I lost), but I was by far
the worst on the team. I didn't gain any popularity by swimming. This falls in
line with what PG said; you have to be a _good_ athlete to gain popularity
from sports.
This isn't to say that I like how important sports are in school, but they
have a place. So yeah, reduce the importance of sports but I wouldn't be in
favor of eliminating them.
------
wensing
_Why don't parents home-school their kids all the way through college?_
Two main reasons, from what I can tell: 1) most (if not all) quality employers
require a degree; 2) parents feel (and often are) incapable of teaching
advanced material.
If you're a true student of PG, you're now dying to say 'but what about being
around other smart kids'? Answer (limiting our scope to high school for the
moment): home schoolers are frequently around other smart kids. Home schooling
doesn't mean that children are locked in their houses all day every day. Home
schooling doesn't mean learning on an island. It's more like learning in a
chain of islands, with frequent trips to the others. And since the parents of
home schooled children are (by self-selection) those that tend to care more
about their child's intellectual development (and can afford the means), the
average home schooler is at least better-read (if not better 'educated') than
the average high schooler.
Also, when you home school, you can accomplish things about twice as fast,
which frees up the rest of your day to get your kids out into the real world
(something kids locked up on a high school campus all day every day see much
less often). If Johnny prefers, he could read more too (which is often the
case).
_So could high school if it were done right._
I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for public schools in South Florida to
get it right. They're among the worst in the nation, and given our means, I
feel it would be an irresponsible choice to off-load my daughter to those
places. (We cannot afford private school to the tune of $12,000 / year ...
although I could argue that home schooling is better than even those places [I
went to one]).
~~~
cstejerean
Most employers say they require a degree in the job description. It's a lie.
I've yet to see any employer turn down a qualified candidate because he/she
didn't have a college degree.
And while parents probably aren't capable of homeschooling their kids through
college, unless said kids end up at one of the few top colleges for their
field in the country, they might be better off learning the material on their
own and using the extra time and money to socialize with other interesting
individuals.
------
bootload
I always had a hard time trying to visualise the school being described in the
parent article. I had no trouble after viewing a snapshot of the characters ~
<http://www.paulgraham.com/gateway.html>
~~~
ericb
This pic reminds me of Malcolm in the Middle. Paul seems, like Malcolm, to be
the nerd who could pass in other circles if he wanted to. Wonder how the
reunion was?
[http://us.st12.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/paulgraham_2002_296...](http://us.st12.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/paulgraham_2002_2965033)
------
arvid
I always disagreed article with this because I did not experience this. My
high school years were not painful and were a lot of fun, even though I was
labelled a nerd, curve-buster, einstein, etc.... So this is my advice from my
experience. Don't try to be popular. Be friendly. Help others. Volunteer. Get
Respect. Get involved in a sport. Get involved in various things with
different people and you will have enough friends that being popular won't
matter and no one will dare pick on you. I played soccer and later ran
x-country and track, I sang, I was a scout, I was in youth fellowship, I was a
mathlete and I hacked a pdp-8 in the hour between school and practice. I
certainly was not popular but I was friends or at least friendly with most of
the school. People knew me and I had their respect.
~~~
biohacker42
I find myself disagreeing as well, for much the same reasons.
However, I do think that America is unique in that the rest of the world
values brains, but the US seems to instinctively distrust it.
My own totally unscientific pop psychology theory is as follows:
I lived in Germany for a few years. It is easy to sense a lot of national
guilt. Dark history, I'll try to avoid Godwin. So modern day Germans are not
as care free flag happy as other nations.
Now consider how patriotic Americans are. Now think about American history,
there have been some great high points. But what about all the low points,
just of the top of my head:
\- Pox blankets. Read up on the story of Ishi the last Yahi.
\- Slavery.
\- Vietnam.
\- Etc.
So can you be both deep and happy go lucky patriotic in America? I am not
saying no American should be proud of their country. In fact, I think America
has done a lot good. But American pride can be complicated if you know too
much. So maybe that's why there's this almost reflexive anti-intellectualism?
~~~
xenoterracide
slavery?! every part of the world has had slavery at some point... (Most of
those countries had revolutions... we had a civil war)
Vietnam? at least we have the guts to go to war. Europe didn't and they got
their asses handed to them, we then bailed them out.
Pox blankets? stupid or asinine (I'm not looking it up. Your probably
referring to us infecting the 'Native Americans') but I'm sure we aren't the
first to do something like that.
Being an actual American... I don't see that we are all that patriotic.
~~~
biohacker42
Good point about slavery.
Vietnam? No Europe first. Europe didn't go to war. The Germans went to war.
Most of the German war machine was on the Eastern front, you didn't bail the
soviets out. And while you helped the Brits a lot, I dare you to say you
bailed them out to their face.
Now on to Vietnam, who or what exactly were you fighting there? International
communism? As someone who was born behind the iron curtain, I HATE commies
more then any American ever will. And yet I would not drop napalm on anyone in
any effort to fight commies. It is not worth it me. Obviously we disagree on
that.
Pox blankets true fact. Massacres, countless. If at some point you do bother
to look deep into that part of US history, you may just never look at your
country the same way again.
Having been around the world and currently living in America, Americans are of
the, if not the, most nationalistic of all the western nations.
Not that is necessarily a bad thing. My point is, you can and should be proud
of America. But it is more complicated if you are fully cognizant of the fine
details of US history.
~~~
menloparkbum
"Americans are of the, if not the, most nationalistic of all the western
nations."
Well, outside of Euro Cup finals week, sure...
~~~
maw
A nice thing about sport is that it's a safe outlet for some of the uglier
aspects of human nature. Usually, anyway. Some people end up taking it way too
far.
------
silverlake
I was a textbook definition of a nerd: skinny, all A's, glasses, bad clothes,
took college classes at night, asian in a very white blue-collar town, did all
the nerd stuff (even math camp!). I went to a mediocre high school with few
smart kids. Nevertheless, I was popular in high school. In fact, even as a
freshmen I was hanging out with the cool senior crowd. There were many
factors: I was never intimidated by anyone, I had a sharp wit, I never made
others feel dumb, I didn't take any jokes personally. The big thing is body
language. If you walk around like Clint Eastwood, people assume you're cool.
Even when I moved to a big city, thuggish guys assumed I was one of them.
My advice: just pretend that you're cool. First impressions and body language
matter a lot. It works for my friend, too. She's a small girl, but big, loud,
obnoxious Wall St. traders are intimidated by her when she walks into a
meeting. She exudes a self-confidence that makes them shut up and listen. If
it works for a skinny nerd and a 5ft girl, it's gotta work for you dweebs,
too.
~~~
wallflower
At my high school, the first Friday the 13th is the unofficial Freshman Day
where they pick on the Freshman. As a new Freshman, I was even more scrawny
and way less confident back then but when I walked past the cafeteria, I
overheard a bunch of jocks/seniors hanging out (behind me) say "C'mon. He's
got to be a freshman" - I walked past with my head up confidently and didn't
look back. I didn't get picked on that day - other people I knew who were of
my build were thrown in trash cans, etc.
High school sucks. But then you graduate. High school is a geographic
coincidence.
------
david927
I think Paul is missing something here, and that's soft skills. I, like him,
was at the D table, and it was only much later that I realized why. I was much
more interested in left-brain activities at the expense of right-brain ones.
Yet left-brain skills are not necessarily smarter than right-brain skills,
just as being a physicist isn't better than being a film director. The film
director was probably popular in high school. The physicist probably not (and
probably still isn't). And that's too bad for both. Nerds are unpopular
because they're hiding in what they're good at; the same reason a cheerleader
might put on makeup.
To be truly smart, you need to develop both sides, both skill sets. You should
be able to dress well and yet know the Earth's distance from the Sun. The true
smart is a round thing.
~~~
pg
_To be truly smart, you need to develop both sides, both skill sets._
There is something in what you say, but I think this goes too far. Think about
some of the people you're claiming aren't truly smart.
------
edw519
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I—
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.
- Robert Frost
I wish I had read this in 9th grade. Should be mandatory reading (and re-
reading) for all high school freshmen.
You'd still be unpopular, but you'd care a lot less.
~~~
mynameishere
The poem was written as a cynical comment about Frost's friend Edward Thomas
who was unpleasantly bemused by it. Thomas was the first to not get the joke.
_It is popularly interpreted literally, as inspirational and individualist,
but critics universally interpret it as ironic_
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Road_Not_Taken>
_Repeatedly Thomas would choose a route which might enable him to show his
American friend a rare plant or a special vista; but it often happened that
before the end of such a walk Thomas would regret the choice he had made and
would sigh over what he might have shown Frost if they had taken a "better"
direction. More than once, on such occasions, the New Englander had teased his
Welsh-English friend for those wasted regrets. . . . Frost found something
quaintly romantic in sighing over what might have been. Such a course of
action was a road never taken by Frost, a road he had been taught to avoid._
<http://www.english.uiuc.edu/maps/poets/a_f/frost/road.htm>
~~~
JesseAldridge
"Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,"
Those lines always bugged me. They seem to run contrary to the rest of the
poem.
I guess this explains it.
~~~
RyanKendall
i agree, i recently had this thought about that stanza that might give some
insight.
"and having perhaps the better claim/ because it was grassy and wanted wear"
to me that means that like every person wants to go were many haven't...
with the addition of "though as for that, the passing there/had worn them
really about the same"
i make the conclusion that because ppl want to go were many havent, the paths
have worn the same because as soon as one path appears less worn, people
travel on it. on that basis the two paths have worn the same.
i have no experience with poems and im just writing a paper on this one and
saw this post. hopefully my insight is helpful. take care.!
------
ivankirigin
I'd like to hear a good discussion about education. I'm certainly concerned
about it. I don't bother with debates about public education though, because
the answer is so obvious: privatization.
I have a 15 month old:
[http://flickr.com/photos/abbyalexandra/2617520542/in/photost...](http://flickr.com/photos/abbyalexandra/2617520542/in/photostream/)
I think I can teach him everything he needs to know about math, science and
computer science. It would make sense to do this with others, because learning
is a collaborative beast.
I have more education than the majority of science and math teachers (except
coursework in education itself - though I tutored for 10 years).
Why don't more adults get together in loose organizations to teach their kids?
I'm talking about the technorati here, not the average person who is less
capable than the teachers I've had.
Do people avoid this because of the time it would take? Do they think the
socialization process of schooling is too important to miss?
~~~
bokonist
I've wondered the same thing. I suppose it's difficult for people to take off
from work. But if you had a group of 10 parents/20 kids, you could have each
parent take one day off every two weeks to be the teacher for the day. It
might work quite well. You'd miss out on the clubs, sports, field trips, etc.
that are probably the best part of public school. But perhaps those could be
made for with organizations outside of schools.
~~~
lief79
I've been wondering about the same thing. How hard would it be to create this
group?
Practically speaking, how do you sort through the parents? Background checks?
Live video feeds?
I have some time to worry about this, but I'd be very interested in the
possibilities.
------
rokhayakebe
_Do you want to start doing dumb stuff?_
You do not have to do _dumb stuff_ to become popular. Also being an athlete or
better looking than the average person does not make you _dumb_. That is
simply a stereotype.
As for the rest of the article I agree with it.
EDIT: Smart kids are unpopular simply because they spend as much time as any
other kid focused on what they love, and what they love IS unpopular.
And this related to what their society values. It happens that the western
society largely values sports and beauty. This is reflected in models'
salaries, as well as athletes' compared to the earnings of a physics'
professor .
If you are from a society that values education more than entertainment, then
smart kids are the popular ones.
~~~
jraines
Nowhere did he say that being an athlete or good looking meant you were dumb.
He does say it automatically makes you popular, and I'm not sure I agree with
that. Better make sure you're a good athlete in football if you're south of
the Mason-Dixon line.
~~~
rokhayakebe
_they don't waste their time on the dumb stuff you need to do to be popular._
This implies that people who are popular spend their time doing dumb stuff.
ANd who are those popular ones? _If you're good looking, a natural athlete, or
the sibling of a popular kid, you'll automatically be popular_ .
So if people who are popular do dumb things then they are dumb , since smart
people do not waste time doing dumb things.
~~~
imgabe
_But most popular kids don't get that kind of free ride. They have to work at
being popular._
^ The sentence immediately after the one you quoted. Being good looking, a
natural athlete, or a sibling of a popular kid is a way to be popular WITHOUT
doing anything, that is, without doing all the dumb stuff that all the other
people have to do to be popular. Hence he's not implying that good-looking or
athletic people are automatically doing dumb stuff, but rather, they get out
of doing it based on their looks or athletic ability. The ugly, nonathletic
people are presumably the ones who would have to do a lot of dumb things to
work their way to being popular.
------
fauigerzigerk
I agree with almost everything pg says there. But the assumption that it may
be better in countries with centralised school systems run by PhDs is
questionable. You have to ask who these PhDs are and what they got their PhD
for.
In many european countries universities are a kind of extension of public
school with all its flaws, only more chaotic. So those PhDs who go on to
become civil servants in the ministry of education are people who, in a sense,
never left school.
Their entire system of reference is shaped by entrenched ideologies, 18th
century philosophy and political party loyalties. They are not researchers
competent to design a modern education system.
------
saturday
"I'm just guessing here, but I think it may be because American school systems
are decentralized. They're controlled by the local school board, which
consists of car dealers who were high school football players, instead of some
national Ministry of Education run by PhDs."
The real difference is that most European and Asian countries use tracking (
<http://www.vdare.com/Sailer/080622_paradox.htm> ). Forcing all students onto
the same curriculum makes no one better off. Less apt kids don't learn the
skills that would actually be useful to them. The nerds have their courses
dumbed down, and earn the hatred of the kids who receive poor grades.
Local school boards do not actually have that much control. Have you noticed
how schools have nearly the same basic structure everywhere? Education PHD's
have an enormous influence because they control the education schools. That
influence has been almost entirely pernicious. Plus they have a lot of control
over curriculum requirements that come down from the state and federal boards
of education. Teachers unions have an enormous amount of power and are also a
national organization.
One more under-reported factor is the Supreme Court decision in the 1970's
that made school discipline much, much harder to enforce. Read "The World We
Created at Hamiliton High" ( [http://www.amazon.com/World-We-Created-Hamilton-
High/dp/0674...](http://www.amazon.com/World-We-Created-Hamilton-
High/dp/067496201X) ) to see the chaos that ensued as a result this "student
rights" decision.
~~~
william42
That must be why after the 9th grade my public school experience was so much
better. In the 9th grade my parents thought I would need time to adjust and so
didn't put me in the honors/AP classes. In later years I took honors/AP
classes and did much better.
------
pavelludiq
In my old school it was a nightmare. Im my current school its pretty good. My
current school is not private, but it has a reputation of an elite school in
my town. In Bulgaria after 7-th grade(when you are 14-15) you can choose to
stay in your class in 8-th grade, or you can take a test and go to an elite
class in your, or in a another school(your score from the test is valid in any
school with elite classes) I was in an in my class there are mostly smart
kids. And most of them are girls, so i haven't had any problems here, i have
actually become somewhat popular because of my rebellious arrogant attitude.
In my old class some off the kids had police records at 13, some are still my
friends, but most of them i hate and am glad that i haven't met them in years.
My new class isn't that effective at teaching, i usually read some python
books in geography class(geography is so boring).
------
Alex3917
"I think nearly everything that's wrong in schools can be explained by the
lack of any external force pushing them to be good. They don't compete with
one another, except in sports (at which they do become good)."
~70% of kids quit sports entirely before entering HS, and the vast majority of
HS teams aren't even remotely good. Even on the best teams in the country, the
ones that consistently get athletes recruited by top colleges and send guys to
the jr. national team, the majority of the guys on the roster will still be
mediocre at best.
All of the evidence (c.f. Alfie Kohn) seems to suggest that competition would
only make education worse. But even if you wanted to reinterpret the data,
looking to athletics as a model of success would be a mistake.
~~~
saturday
As a counterpoint, in southern California all the champion high school
football teams come from the Catholic schools and small school districts
outside of LA. The LA school district itself is giant bureaucratic behemoth.
Despite having large numbers of players getting scholarhips, the actual
football teams from LA public schools aren't that good. (
<http://www.vdare.com/sailer/080629_schools.htm> )
------
dominik
How can you tell if you're popular?
I have fond memories of high school, but perhaps because I took just one class
there while attending college classes and the local math and science center.
Still, I "felt" popular at high school: people knew my name, said hi, were
nice. Contrasted with my experiences at the math and science center: there
folks weren't as friendly and bitter rivalries seemed to run amok.
------
wallflower
I was reading the comments on PG's original essay a week ago and was struck by
how a lot of the comments show that PG is reaching a wide audience of high
schoolers who know nothing about HN but stumbled across his essay and identify
with it.
<http://www.paulgraham.com/nerds.html>
------
martythemaniak
I've sometimes wondered how I would have turned out if I had gone to a typical
American highschool - my HS experience was so different I have trouble
relating to this essay, tv shows with high schools etc.
My high school was uber-immigrant (I'd estimate about 5-10% of the kids were
born in Canada, everyone else being a first-gen immigrant), and groups were
divided primarily by grade, then by ethnicity, religion and regionality, then
by activity (drama, music, sport, math etc) so it was almost impossible to
form cliques, judge cross-group popularity etc. But it wasn't that bad either,
it was actually pretty easy to move within groups - got to know people through
playing music, through volleyball, hanging out with the other eastern
europeans etc.
------
chris_l
This high school business is all about ego. The popularity thing is just a
layer on top of that. Being popular means joining in with the collective ego
building. Being good at something that requires honesty (i.e. math, chess)
will just get in the way of this.
------
hello_moto
"They're controlled by the local school board, which consists of car dealers
who were high school football players, instead of some national Ministry of
Education run by PhDs."
You know what those PhDs look like Paul? They remind people of the "Nerds"
that had trouble settling in. They remind people of misfits. They also remind
people of the "guy who know it all but can't make a good decision".
My Business professor told me once: "The Business school taught students how
to make decisions". That is something that separates business students and
science students. Science students argue (too much) based on science in which
sometime not applicable or whatnot while Business students make a decision.
PS: I'm from CS background.
~~~
gaius
The Ministry of Education way has its own problems, namely that these kinds of
organizations aren't really interested in education per se but in social
engineering.
PS I bet most of the science faculty at your school had written loads of
journal articles etc. How many of the business faculty were self-made
millionaires?
~~~
hello_moto
\- Yes, we do have journal articles (not sure if it's a lot or not)
\- Does it matter if one is a self-made or paid-by as long as you're a
millionaires?
\- Does money matter much for you? Once you get 10 millions, does 100 millions
matter a lot?
~~~
gaius
My point is that your science professors are very likely to be real
scientists, but your business professors are unlikely to be real businessmen.
Ask yourself why that might be.
------
narag
I don't think that the question is about public school. I went to public high
school here in Spain and I found it fine. Maybe there are more factors than
public vs private.
For concerned fathers, I would recommend finding some side activity,
preferably sports, that help socializing. Yes, _you_ have to put time and
effort. Children responde well if it's not imposed but chosen, parents play
with them and it's presented not only as a physical challenge, but also as a
mind game. Sports can also be "hacked". Also there's music.
------
mattmaroon
"The example of private schools suggests that the best plan would be to go in
the other direction, away from government control."
Charter schools (privately run, publicly funded) seem to be even worse than
normal public schools. I think I'd sooner have all free schooling be federally
controlled than have it all be charter schools.
The other option is to abolish publicly funded schooling altogether.
~~~
swombat
Privately run and privately funded schools seem to do the job, but only for
people who can afford them.
Perhaps the solution is not to abolish public schooling altogether, but to
work on actually improving it. Perhaps improving the quality of teachers would
do the job better.
~~~
yummyfajitas
It's not obvious to me that improving teacher quality is possible. Is there
really a large enough pool of people out there who would be good teachers, but
choose not to teach?
I know it's a popular talking point by teachers unions angling for more money,
but I don't think it's really a solution.
Improving the process also matters, and we even know how to do it (Direct
Instruction). It is effective even when used by low quality teachers.
Unfortunately, it's also dead in the water since teachers unions don't like
it.
<http://www.projectpro.com/ICR/Research/DI/Summary.htm>
<http://www.mathematicallycorrect.com/honestft.htm>
~~~
swombat
Well, as an example of how you might go about doing that, I remember reading
an article about a study that found that bad teachers don't get better with
time, but they tend to cling on anyway because they get significantly more
money each year.
One of the suggestions from that article was that to improve teaching quality,
it might be worth offering a flat (higher than the current 1st-year and lower
than the current 10th-year) salary to encourage people to try teaching for a
couple of years after uni (since the salary would then be decent right away).
This would also discourage people from clinging on to the job unless they
really like it.
This is certainly not a solution that teachers' unions would advocate, but I
suspect it could produce some positive effects, assuming the study I mentioned
was correct, and assuming part of the problem is indeed the fact that many
people who could be great teachers don't bother because they pay is very bad
at the beginning and they can go and be bankers instead.
Of course I'm not an expert on this, so my theories may be wide off the mark,
but I don't accept the idea that the pool of existing teachers can't be
improved. I suspect that one of the reasons why private schools are indeed
better than public schools is precisely that they can afford better teachers.
As for teachers' unions... I have little respect for a professional
organisation that works against its own professional aim. I'm sure they can be
taken care of in some way or another.
~~~
wallflower
In the words of a dot-com-bubble-bursting-era letter from a teacher in
response to a dot-commer saying he'd just get a job teaching (as a fall-back):
"Good luck!". Teaching is hard and it's keeping qualified teachers teaching
that is a problem.
I remember reading an article in Time magazine "Why Teachers Hate Parents"
(2005). I was fairly shocked back then to read why teachers hate their job:
Parents. The article was helpfully blog-copied; it is a good read, even though
it probably uses more extreme examples of "helicopter parents"
"Ask teachers about the best part of their job, and most will say how much
they love working with kids. Ask them about the most demanding part, and they
will say dealing with parents. In fact, a new study finds that of all the
challenges they face, new teachers rank handling parents at the top. According
to preliminary results from the MetLife Survey of the American Teacher, made
available exclusively to TIME, parent management was a bigger struggle than
finding enough funding or maintaining discipline or enduring the toils of
testing. It's one reason, say the Consortium for Policy Research in Education
and the Center for the Study of Teaching and Policy, that 40% to 50% of new
teachers leave the profession within five years. Even master teachers who love
their work, says Harvard education professor Sara Lawrence-Lightfoot, call
this "the most treacherous part of their jobs."
"At the most disturbing extreme are the parents who like to talk about values
but routinely undermine them. "You get savvier children who know how to get
out of things," says a second-grade teacher in Murfreesboro, Tenn. "Their
parents actually teach them to lie to dodge their responsibilities." Didn't
get your homework done? That's O.K. Mom will take the fall. Late for class?
Blame it on Dad."
[http://forums.atozteacherstuff.com/showthread.php?t=8834&...](http://forums.atozteacherstuff.com/showthread.php?t=8834&page=2)
------
daniel-cussen
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_defeat>
------
asdf333
Its not the worst in the US.
I'd say the US is pretty good. Generally ppl are left to be who they are. Its
very homogeneous societies like Japan and Korea that have the worst problems.
The pressure to conform is high and everyone gangs up on victims.
Its considered a huge issue that can drive kids to commit suicide.
------
eduardoflores
Unfortunately, most central Ministries of Education tends to be filled with
politicians rather than education PhDs (or by PhDs with a mostly politics
interest). Who knows if that's better than the average local school boards in
the US.
------
xlnt
There are other problems with schools, such as the model of _teacher_ who
_already knows the answer_ , and _student_ who must learn the material
_without changing any of it_ (no attempts to improve the ideas).
Traditional knowledge has its place, but so does criticism and reasoned
judgment and new ideas, and schools are not designed to facilitate the
rationalist, liberal approach.
If the role of a teacher was seen as helping the student _in ways the student
prefers_ , as if the student were a _customer_ , it would drastically improve
the classroom aspect of schools.
There are also a wide variety of smaller problems. For example, many lessons
focus on _solutions to old problems_ without enough explanation of what the
problem was or why it was important to people. For someone who doesn't
understand the problem situation a solution attempts to address, that solution
is uninteresting.
------
quoderat
I enjoyed slapping around nerds in high school. It's good for the ol' self-
esteem, and that's what's important, right?
~~~
gills
Since many (most?) of this community are nerdy people and cannot share your
experience, would you please enlighten us with your motivation for such
actions? I'm interested in hearing from the other side of the aisle.
Edit: Unless you are joking.
~~~
huherto
I guess that beating nerds made him look cooler and kept the other bullies
away. (Except that it doesn't work in HN)
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