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Tech Women Choose Possibility - Michie
http://recode.net/2015/05/13/tech-women-choose-possibility/
======
Michie
First, the number of women starting tech companies is rising in absolute (if
not yet relative) numbers. To illustrate what’s possible, we’ve highlighted a
cross section of 230 women on this list who have collectively started or led
298 tech companies across all sectors and stages of growth over this period.
Approximately 29 percent of women on this list are serial entrepreneurs.
The women on this list founded heavyweights such as Lynda.com, Nextdoor,
Houzz, VMware, ASK Group and Mozilla; growth-stage stars like Stitch Fix,
Slideshare, Indiegogo, LearnVest and StyleSeat; and earlier-stage startups
like Lumoid, Heartwork, Other Machine Company and Trendalytics. On this list
alone, we were able to identify 13 IPOs and another 54 exits through M&A. The
average amount of capital raised per company is approximately $34 million (for
a subset of 167 companies on which data was available).
Link to the list:
[https://medium.com/@sukhindersinghcassidy/choosepossibility-...](https://medium.com/@sukhindersinghcassidy/choosepossibility-
project-90a217ff0a86)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
What killed Smalltalk and could it kill Ruby? - _pius
http://litanyagainstfear.com/blog/2009/05/06/railsconf-2009-robert-martin-keynote/
======
pedalpete
I'm not familiar with Smalltalk, but I find it interesting that the author's
concern for the future of Ruby code is that it is 'just too easy to make a
mess'. This seems to be the common argument as to why Ruby is better than PHP.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Aaron Swartz v. United States - edsu
http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/sj/2011/07/24/aaron-swartz-v-united-states/
======
pmb
This whole thing weirds me out. Here we are on Hacker News, and yet there is a
super-large contingent of people going "Well, he DID technically commit a
victimless crime...".
So yes - he did do something that was against some terms of service. But jail
time? For breaking a clickthrough "license" and computer hacking at MIT in the
service of public knowledge? This sucks unutterably.
MIT: Playful physical hacks okay, but don't try to mass harvest the knowledge
of the world or the DOJ will come down on you like a sledgehammer.
JSTOR: All the world's knowledge, as long as you don't try to access all of
it.
DOJ: We'll break you just because we can (or for other reasons that we are not
stating).
Hacker News: Well, they do have a point - he did access semi-public data in a
non-approved way, and he had to plug into the network in a strange way to do
it.
~~~
gavinlynch
And doesn't the (alleged) fact remain that he continuously circumvented
virtual and physical security systems in order to mirror a reported $1.5
million worth of assets in to his personal possession?
When you boil it down it doesn't exactly sound like he should be receiving 10
hours of commuter service because he ran wget a few times. MIT and DoJ are
just supposed to -assume- that he has nothing but perfectly angelic intentions
with $1.5 millions dollars of an asset that he secretly obtained? I don't make
that logical leap with you guys. The facts will come out. He will present his
case with his defense team, and hopefully justice will be done.
~~~
salvadors
> MIT and DoJ are just supposed to -assume- that he has nothing but perfectly
> angelic intentions with $1.5 millions dollars of an asset that he secretly
> obtained?
Yes. That's known as "innocent until proven guilty".
~~~
gavinlynch
Let me rephrase that: They are supposed to -ignore- an action they are aware
of that they believe constitutes criminal conduct? Prosecutors, DoJ don't drop
cases they think they can bring to trial when, in their perception, illegal
activity is taking place just on a hunch. Right?
~~~
salvadors
No, but they're meant to have a good faith belief that they can actually make
the case.
[http://www.litigationandtrial.com/2011/07/articles/series/sp...](http://www.litigationandtrial.com/2011/07/articles/series/special-
comment/aaron-swartz-computer-fraud-indictment/) examines in some detail why
they probably don't.
------
ender7
I don't understand why people are bringing issues of the availability of
scientific journalism into this. I agree that the prices and paywalls involves
are ridiculous and a bad idea for a variety of reasons, but that seems
orthogonal to the issue here.
I don't think anyone is denying that Swartz committed a (possible series of)
minor crimes. Claiming that "information should be free" doesn't stop them
from being crimes. What's shocking is the response from the government, which
appears to be using this incident for its own purposes rather than to preserve
the rule of law. No one seems to really be asking _why_ this is happening, and
I think that is by far the more interesting question. Is the justice
department trying to expand its reach, as the article suggests? Is this a
deterrent for future "hackers"? Has one of Swartz's numerous hornet nest-
kickings pissed off someone high up, who wants him removed from the playing
field?
~~~
tptacek
If there's evidence yet to come that Swartz intended to anonymously push the
corpus he took from JSTOR up to BitTorrent, the crime is no longer minor.
I think I share Swartz's politics, but I'd like to believe that law
enforcement would at least take a plan like that seriously.
On the other hand, it's equally possible that there is no evidence Swartz was
going to publish what he took from JSTOR, and that instead the DoJ is upset
about the PACER incident, which it couldn't prosecute, and jumped on this
case, which it clearly can prosecute.
Swartz is lucky to have such well connected and influential friends.
~~~
makmanalp
As a tangent, isn't it scary that you can effectively piss off entities such
as the DoJ and they can hold a grudge against you?
Or from the article:
> Attorney Jerry Cohen, a Boston IP lawyer, suggests this aggressive use of
> criminal charges rather than civil charges is part of a trend in government
> prosecution of such cases, like taking “a sledgehammer to drive a thumb
> tack… It’s intended to terrorize the person who’s indicted and others who
> might be thinking of the same thing.“
Is it even legally okay to publicly make an example of someone like that?
~~~
tptacek
I guess. What do you expect? They're people just like everyone else. This
isn't one of those "1,001 crimes you can commit in the morning while making
orange juice" things from Reason magazine. Aaron went way out of his way to
expose himself to this situation. It's possible that where you see an Internet
folk hero, the DoJ sees someone bent on forcibly publishing every closed
database pertaining to the public interest, laws be damned.†
Let me add something else that I think some other HN people may be familiar
with:
My Confirmation sponsor is/was a criminal court judge (friend of the family).
Very nice guy. Spectacularly nice guy. I babysat his kids once. I've seen him
maybe twice in the past ten years, but I'd be surprised if he didn't remember
the names of my kids. When I was younger, we saw him all the time. Every
weekend. My dad played in the church folk group with him.
I can't remember the particulars, it may have been 4th of July firecrackers
(illegal in Chicago) or it may have been shaving cream on Halloween, but
either way he caught me and some friends doing something technically illegal.
It was NOT. OK. I remember the legality of the incident being taken VERY.
SERIOUSLY. Entirely different demeanor. I've seen the same thing with friends'
cop dads.
I think people on HN don't fully appreciate the extent to which prosecutors
and judges take the law seriously. They've dedicated their life to it. Our
country is ruled by laws.
There are definitely times when the law is wrong, or when its diligent
enforcement doesn't ultimately serve the social good. This may very well be
one of them. But I think it's a very bad idea to build a worldview around the
notion that the criminal justice system is going to casually look past the
law. The law is a big deal.
† _I don't know Aaron Swartz personally and am not asserting any of this to be
true._
†† _To your later edit: there's no statute against "public example making". If
you don't want to be an example, avoid felonies. That's going to get me
downvoted, so can we assume good faith and accept this new emoticon I just
made up: :# > as shorthand for "I don't really think the person we're talking
about is culpable for a felony based on the information we currently have"?
:#>! :#>! :#>!_
~~~
rdouble
_I think people on HN don't fully appreciate the extent to which prosecutors
and judges take the law seriously._
On the other hand, a relative is a DA. She has explained how around the
holidays, she collaborates with the prosecutor to ram cases through the system
or slap people on the wrist and send them home. This way all the noble
guardians of the law can take an extra few weeks off between Thanksgiving and
Christmas.
~~~
tptacek
I said they were people, and people who had dedicated their lives to the idea
of the law. I did not say they were superhuman. They can be wrong and have
faulty judgement. In fact, I feel like I went out of my way not to ascribe
moral judgement on their worldview; I simply wanted to point out that their
worldview exists and shouldn't be ignored if you plan on operating at the
frontier of the law.
It's good of you to point out the limitations of that worldview. I don't mean
to criticize you. I'm just saying, be careful if you think that a charge of
"hypocrisy" is going to help here. The real world is not an Internet message
board argument. Lots of prosecutors, all of them riven with human frailties,
nonetheless believe passionately in the law. You're not going to talk them out
of it.
I am for the most part happy about this. Unlike a lot of HN people, I think
that the law by and large serves the common good, and protects the weak far
more than the powerful.
(My uncle was/is? an ADA. I didn't hear any stories like this, but didn't ask.
Totally believe it though.)
~~~
rdouble
My point is not a charge of hypocrisy, I just think the language you are using
imparts a phony gravitas. I'm a systems engineer but I would LOL if I read
that someone wrote I "dedicated my life to the spirit of the command line."
Likewise, many lawyers are just in it because it's something they are good at
and it pays the bills. Not every lawyer is Harvey Silverglate.
~~~
tptacek
I'm really not trying to impute gravitas. I am being completely serious. These
people we're talking about at the DoJ are _different people_ when matters of
law come up. They are not kidding around about it.
That doesn't make them granite monuments to justice. But it might mitigate the
concern that they're being petty. There is a reasonable narrative here in
which Swartz is purposefully causing harm to the social good. I don't really
agree with that narrative (based on what we know now), but I can see it.
If it helps, think about pro-life people (I'm pro-choice) and their attitude
towards abortion. They are not kidding around about that issue. Do they have a
lot of gravitas to you? Maybe not! But they believe human beings are being
killed. So I can see where they're coming from, even though I disagree with
them.
~~~
rdouble
Yes, in this particular case you are right. This case is interesting because
Aaron is doing this as an "activist" and as such it becomes political-legal
theatre. He is friends with a bunch of lawyers and legal researchers who are
working at the intersection of IP rights and freedom of information rights.
If he was just some nobody kid in Schaumburg stealing PDFs from Motorola, he'd
either be in jail already or slapped on the wrist and sent home. Nobody would
have heard about it, and there'd be no internet dialectic about it.
~~~
tptacek
We don't really know if this was an "activist" crime.
It's very possible that he just intended to analyze the documents and publish
aggregated results. If that's the case, I think this prosecution is a mistake;
an extreme overreaction. Scholarly analysis of JSTOR documents is not a
criminal intent. His actions may leave him culpable to a variety of minor
crimes, but his impact on the social good is minimal at worst.
On the other hand, it's possible (though less likely, I think) that the intent
here was to mirror JSTOR onto BitTorrent. I might sympathize with this goal,
but I don't think its prosecution as wire fraud is an overreaction. I'll root
for Aaron at trial, though.
~~~
lukeschlather
The problem with that analysis is that there's nothing criminal (or even
illegal) about sharing public domain works over BitTorrent. So whether he
copied the documents for personal use or distribution, it was still the
initial copying that was at fault.
It's a little like someone broke into a library every night for a few months
and scanned a bunch of public domain books.
The only actual crimes are breaking and entering, and using the scanning
equipment without authorization. What he intended to do with the scans is
irrelevant.
~~~
tptacek
JSTOR's particular collection of documents is protected by copyright and has
been valued, by virtually every one of the most learned and respected
educational institutions in the country, at millions of dollars annually.
Let's say I come into possession of a trove of public domain documents from
the 1800s, and I take the time to scan every one of them painstakingly and
from those scans to assemble an academically useful database, for which I
charge $100/person/year for access. Your contention is that because the
underlying documents are public domain, you are entitled to unfettered access
to my work product, despite the fact that I took steps to gate access to my
work product.
The law isn't going to see it that way, I don't think. But maybe you're right.
I'm not a lawyer.
Like everyone else on HN, I wish all these documents were freely available
too.
~~~
jcarreiro
> JSTOR's particular collection of documents is protected by copyright
We've discussed this on HN before. Reproductions of public domain works are
not protected by copyright.
Edit: Of course a significant portion of JSTOR's archive does consist of
copyrighted works.
~~~
tptacek
I thought collection copyright applied, but am happy to be wrong about that.
~~~
jcarreiro
There is a "collective works" copyright, so I guess -- I am also not a lawyer
-- that if one made a copy of some database, it may be infringing on the
creator's rights even if the contents of the database consisted solely of
public domain works.
So I think you are correct.
~~~
lukeschlather
[http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/...](http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/chapter8/8-a.html)
>You are free to copy and use individual images but copying and distributing
the complete collection may infringe what is known as the “collective works”
copyright. Collections of public domain material will be protected if the
person who created it has used creativity in the choices and organization of
the public domain material. This usually involves some unique selection
process, for example, a poetry scholar compiling a book -- The Greatest Poems
of e.e. cummings.
I don't think JSTOR is using what could be described as a unique selection
process.
------
mark_l_watson
Empires in decline get progressively more brutal. Sounds like Aaron Swartz
became an embarrassment so is being side-tracked from the good work he does.
I am not 100% sure of this, but I think this is probably true: similar to the
case of Eliot Spitzer who as governor of NY was investigating Wall Street. So,
I think that Wall Street had their lackey the US Government (via the FBI) dig
up something on Spitzer to bring him down. I believe that this situation is
called a plutarchy.
~~~
tptacek
This is tinfoil-hat stuff. Governors who frequent prostitutes can't expect to
stay in office, full stop. The likelihood that Swartz does a single overnight
in custody over this is practically nil. The brutality we are arguing about
here is the possibility of him ending up with a felony on his record.
~~~
jordanb
To be honest, Swartz is independently wealthy so he won't have to worry about
the felony impacting his ability to work for a living.
In his post-liquidity-event career as an activist, a felony conviction will
serve nicely as a bona-fide.
So the only real downside for Swartz in this is that he spends time in jail,
which as you say is quite unlikely.
~~~
tptacek
One wouldn't want to downplay the badness of having a felony record. For
instance, Swartz may imagine one day running for office, or being a key person
in a political campaign. Or needing to work directly with institutional
investors.
~~~
nhangen
Makes getting any sort of security clearance a no-go. No buying weapons, etc.
~~~
puredemo
Or, you know, voting.
------
lisper
To paraphrase Feynman, this might have some relevance to the situation:
"...he also worked with Shireen Barday at Stanford Law School to assess
“problems with remunerated research” in law review articles (i.e., articles
funded by corporations, sometimes to help them in ongoing legal battles), by
downloading and analyzing over 400,000 law review articles to determine the
source of their funding. The results were published in the Stanford Law
Review."
~~~
tptacek
I speculate that Pacer is more relevant: during a trial run of free public
access to Pacer, Swartz is alleged to have mirrored almost 20% of the
database; as (it is alleged) a result, the public trial of Pacer was shut down
and an investigation launched into the security of the Pacer system.
One possible narrative inside the DoJ: we can't launch public trials of open
access to databases, because this Aaron Swartz guy has decided that his Python
code will have the final say in any policy decisions we make. But that's not
for him to decide! And here he is again, taking the same approach, this time
to a commercial database that produces 7 figure annual recurring revenues.
I don't agree with this mindset (:#>! :#>!) but I'd understand it.
~~~
djeikyb
Fwiw: JSTOR is non-profit, not commercial.
------
perfunctory
> ... and Aaron faces a possible fine and up to _35_ years in prison, with
> trial set for September.
<http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14270655>
> Under Norwegian law, Mr Breivik faces a maximum of _21_ years in jail if
> convicted...
WTF.
~~~
scythe
Two different law systems, two different legal philosophies. In the Nordic
model, prison is largely rehabilitative. I don't think they even _give_ life
sentences. In America, prison is decidedly punitive, with little thought to
rehabilitation, and the death penalty is commonplace.
~~~
carbonica
"the death penalty is commonplace."
This is why you're being downvoted so heavily, in case you were wondering.
Such flamebait is not appropriate.
~~~
scythe
>Such flamebait is not appropriate.
In this particular case, the death penalty is _relatively_ commonplace. As in,
using OECD as a benchmark, the US executes more people than the average OECD
member. I wanted to illustrate the contrast between the American and Norwegian
legal systems, not make a statement about the use or validity of the death
penalty.
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_penalty#Global_distributi...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_penalty#Global_distribution)
~~~
carbonica
Then it would be appropriate to say "the United States executes prisoners
while Norway doesn't." That makes the point fine.
Car crashes are commonplace here. Drunk driving accidents are. Executions
occur less often than once a week in the US, mostly in a few select states,
and the US has a population of over _300 million people_. We (I'm from the US)
even have a disproportionately large prison population and the death penalty
is still extremely, extremely rare.
~~~
blots
That there is death penalty at all is already pretty barbaric and outdated.
------
there
shouldn't that be _United States v. Aaron Swartz_ because the US is bringing
charges against him? _Aaron Swartz v. United States_ makes it sound like he is
suing the government, but there's nothing on that page that says he is.
~~~
davorak
Yes it should, I read the title and thought there might be an interesting new
twist when there was not.
------
jrockway
Why aren't Google and Bing going to prison every time one of their bots
crashes some web server?
(Perhaps because "systematic downloading" isn't actually a crime?)
~~~
gavinlynch
When Google and Bing start sending 'human bots' out to Universities to
facilitate the downloading of data, I'm pretty sure a lot of people will be
going to jail. Just saying.
~~~
tptacek
Didn't Google recently get in a bunch of trouble recently for capturing raw
data from public wifi networks?
~~~
gavinlynch
To me, there is no comparison. Inadvertantly capturing a few random packets
from open, public Wifi signals while driving down the road? They changed wifi
channels about 5 times a second. All investigations that I have read concluded
that no meaningful data was retrieved.
And to compare that to specifically circumventing physical and virtual
restrictions after warning the user against a set of actions? Where the target
data was not worthless, as in Google's case, but worth over $1 million
dollars?
I don't see the comparison.
~~~
ajays
It wasn't inadvertent. It was by design. Lets get that straight. If, for
example, you're running tcpdump(1) with a packet capture size of 1500 (I don't
know if G was doing that, but I'm giving an example), then you can't claim
that you captured the packets' contents inadvertently.
Many years ago, when writing web crawlers was the cool thing to do, I wrote
one (like an idiot, I wanted to see how deep the web was). Unfortunately, I
didn't have a good synchronization scheme, so it ended up beating on a poor
website for too long. The operator of that site sent a stern email to our DNS
contacts, complaining. And we shut the crawler down. Today, I fear I'd be
indicted for "wire fraud"!
------
anigbrowl
So he's suing the United States now, eh? Because usually the first person
named is the complainant. Getting the simplest and most basic details wrong
like this is a reliable indicator that everything which comes afterwards is
going to be similarly ill-founded. This is a prime example of the yawning gulf
between blogging and proper journalism.
Kindly do not misread that as support for the legal _status quo_ , JSTOR, or
anything else.
------
mildweed
Regardless of who was hosting them before and how much their hosting costs
were that were used to justify the paywall, Google Scholar should be brought
in to host them all going forward. They're out in the open, might as well put
them to good use.
~~~
lukeschlather
The NSF should host them free of charge. We shouldn't expect a private money-
making corporation to host them as a public service.
------
darksaga
Well, Mr.Swartz should probably thank Anonymous and Lulsec for provoking the
US Government. They're fed up and have determined whoever they get their hands
on (minor hacking or not) they're going to drag you into federal court and
make an example out of them.
This reminds of back in the 90's when there wasn't any laws in place to
address hacking. But man, the Feds did not like kids making them look like
fools. Once they got the laws of the books, it was open season on hackers.
I'm pretty sure the next few years are going to see a major crackdown on
hacking again. Just like the recent arrests of supposed Lulsec and Anon
members.
This guy will be lucky to get out of federal prison in 15 years.
------
mrich
To me this looks like a career move by the prosecutor who wants to get some
convicted hackers on his CV, which will look good when it comes to promotion
time as these crimes get more and more relevant. The US justice system seems
to have degenerated so that prosecutors do anything to get some people
convicted, as long as they are a) popular or b) it helps them in some way,
regardless of the quality of thee evidence or the merit of prosecution to the
general public.
------
plainOldText
I'm super curious to know if there is someone else out there who believes that
there is a connection between Aaron's political activism and his indictment.
Not that his political views would represent the major cause of his
indictment, but still. Anyway, just ranting...
------
mrschwabe
We must evolve & develop economic & political systems that eliminate the
government's authority to railroad a person like this. It's disturbing and a
blatant flaw in a free nation.
------
kgo
I'm just curious why someone who did this is still a fellow at a center for
_ethics_. It seems like the whole situation, even if it's been cleared up with
MIT and JSTOR, is completely unethical, regardless of the legal case.
Is the position tenured?
~~~
thomaslangston
Could you comment more expansively on why you find this situation unethical?
If so, can refrain from leaning on the legality of the situation. I haven't
heard a good explanation that didn't use the legal ramifications as a central
support.
------
anonymous246
Nice spin: he's been charged for "excessive downloading".
Way to ignore the physical break-in to install a computer directly on a
network switch. I, for one, hope that he gets a criminal record at the very
least (plea deal). This really puts the crime in a different league.
Unless I have my facts wrong, in which I'm willing to be corrected.
~~~
sp332
Well, a physical break-in would be a matter for the local police, maybe state.
Federal prosecutors don't get involved with those cases unless it's the
Pentagon or something.
This is only at the federal level because the "unauthorized access" crossed
state lines. (Aaron was at MIT when he was knocking over JSTOR servers,
probably in NYC.) So the prosecutor is only going to worry about that part.
~~~
tptacek
I don't get why I'm expected to care about whether local or federal employees
take an interest in the event. The state criminal court system isn't warm and
fuzzy either.
~~~
sp332
He said "way to ignore the physical break-in" and I'm pointing out that
federal prosecutors (almost) always ignore physical break-ins. It's not a
federal crime.
~~~
tptacek
I take your point, but I'd like to point out that it's a side track. It gives
the impression that you don't want to talk about whether a crime happened, and
instead focus on the purported injustice of federal involvement. Well, what's
unjust about that? That the DoJ and federal court system is more severe than
Massachusetts?
~~~
sciurus
It's not a side track to point out that he should be charged with one set of
crimes by the state government, but that he is instead being charged with a
different set of crimes (Wire Fraud, Computer Fraud, Unlawfully Obtaining
Information from a Protected Computer, Recklessly Damaging a Protected
Computer) by the federal government.
~~~
tptacek
You think MA doesn't have computer crime statutes? The subtext to this thread
seems to be "if they charged him locally they'd only be able to get him on
trespassing". Uh, no.
~~~
timsally
There is a difference with charging him locally though (in my mind). The
attorneys that would prosecute Aaron in MA were hired by a left government
accountable to a fairly liberal population. Those prosecuting Schwartz
federally were hired by a government that leans slightly to the right. I
honestly think that makes a difference in the outcome of this particular case,
given the nature of the crimes. Also when we consider Aaron's personal
history, I think it's safe to say he has fairly influential friends in MA and
possibly some enemies on the federal level.
All of this is pure conjecture and speculation of course. But I would be lying
if I said I wouldn't be more comfortable about the situation if Aaron was
being tried by the MA government.
~~~
tptacek
I see what you're coming from but I don't really buy it. I think the
difference between federal and state is strictness and deliberation, not right
vs. left.
The state criminal justice systems are deluged by drug violence and domestic
violence and are largely reactive (I write while missing the court date for my
mugger's prosecution, due to a sick daughter).
The federal system is more deliberate (word chosen carefully) and somewhat
less reactive. It has more discretion about what cases to chase down. It's
probably more inclined to keep its teeth sunk into anything it starts too.
The same political environment that appointed this prosecutor also appointed
the prosecutor that took down Scooter Libby.
~~~
timsally
Re: left vs. right and deliberation: that seems reasonable. Also sorry about
the mugging. :( Still though, that doesn't address the advantage Aaron has in
MA in terms of friends and enemies. And as far as public support is concerned,
you can be sure that a good number of the people that support Aaron have ties
to MA or Cambridge. When we talking about a couple thousand people, that goes
a lot farther on the local level than on the federal level I think. A speech
by a group of MIT and Harvard professors for example might make a difference
in MA but surly doesn't have that big of an impact nationally. Perhaps I am
seeing differences where there are none though. ^^
~~~
tptacek
The mugging was almost fun. Makes for a great story.
------
rokhayakebe
Correction: Aaron Swartz v Some Powerful Politicians or People Who Are Afraid
Of What Playing With This Data May Reveal.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Net Sadness - benzguo
http://netsadness.net
======
mc_hammer
ok??
but in all seriousness i love this
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
ProtonMail – Crowdfunding Campaign - binaryanomaly
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/protonmail/x/7992808
======
binaryanomaly
End-to-end encrypted email, based in Switzerland.
[https://protonmail.ch/](https://protonmail.ch/)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Mark Zuckerberg: Elon Musk's doomsday AI predictions are 'pretty irresponsible' - elmar
http://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/24/mark-zuckerberg-elon-musks-doomsday-ai-predictions-are-irresponsible.html
======
mtgx
On a scale of 1 to 10 for people I would trust with our planet's future, Musk
is a 9.5 and Zuckerberg is a 0.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: A curated compendium of free PC games, updated daily - stvmln_
https://neogratis.com
======
anotheryou
Nice work!
I'd get rid of the "generic" screenshots on the home page and replace it with
the latest games like on the archive page and links to the most common
categories.
Personally I'd like to see "best of week/month/year/all-time" and tags instead
of categories (so I can find co-op + platformer)
Best of month/year might be even etter for the start page so new visitors see
the good stuff (and maybe one game they already know is good, but not only
games everyone knows already, so here you have to pick thte time range wisely
or mix it manually)
Oh and embed some youtube video containing gameplay. Doesn't have to be a good
one, just so you can quickly judge how the game feels.
------
richdougherty
Great idea! Suggestion: Maybe feature today's game on the front page?
------
glitcher
I remember playing the Spaceplan demo a couple years ago, really fun little
game!
One of my favorite browser games from several years back is Skrillex Quest:
[http://jasonoda.com/games/skrillexquest/](http://jasonoda.com/games/skrillexquest/)
~~~
timvdalen
So... that was a weird way to spend 30 minutes
------
richardboegli
Links to reviews of the games. This might be a lot harder as they would
probably be in print.
------
partisan
Also, please put the number of games in each category. Or if there are new
games in the category this week or since your last visit?
------
richardboegli
As it is early days for the site, possibly do tags instead of categories and
make sure the search handles it correctly.
------
mnx
Would be nice to be able to filter by platforms available.
------
richardboegli
Suggest a game form?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Air Berlin lost luggage: The German airline melts down on social media - pier0
http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2013/09/air_berlin_lost_luggage_the_german_airline_melts_down_on_social_media.html
======
UnoriginalGuy
This is a really low quality (and badly formatted) article.
I'm not sure how the German airline "melted down." It sounds like people are
complaining AT them. Melted down implies they started saying rude or
inappropriate things.
------
SlashmanX
Were the tweets that this article linked to edited after the fact or
something? Cos I can't see how this:
@_5foot1 We understand how annoying this is and apologise! Unfortunately we can't help you right now, the Lost & Found will contact you
is "adamantly refusing to help."
~~~
brazzy
You're right - it's not a refusal to help but a complete _inability_ to help.
It sounds like a cooperative fuckup by Air Berlin and whomever they outsourced
handling lost baggage to, with the effect that procedures are opaque and make
it impossible for people in charge of helping customers to do their job.
------
netfeed
Went to Germany and Austria from Sweden this summer, Air Berlin lost(well, i
guess it's the baggage people at TXL that lost it really) my bag on the trip
down to Germany for two days and for one week on the trip back from Austria.
They lost my bag twice on the same trip + the bags was apparently sent to
Gothenburg on the Wednesday(we came back on a Sunday), but i didn't get the
back until the Sunday a week from when we arrived home.
------
ableal
_" a farewell gift to guests as they exist the aircraft"_
Allow me to snip this little gem, to keep company to previously collected
items such as "rear window defrogger" and "string loaded door".
(Add cartoon image of passengers willing an airplane into existence by
collective belief, if you will.)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Review my startup - GrexIt: Build a Knowledge Base out of your email - nands
Site URL: http://grexit.com<p>Please use this invite code to register: INVGREXIT<p>GrexIt helps to create a company-wide Knowledge Base right out of your email.
Important email discussions, customer interaction, files and knowledge remains trapped and gets lost in email inboxes. GrexIt allows to easily add email conversations and file attachments to a shared repository, so that you and your colleagues can:<p>- Find stuff easily<p>- Never lose or re-invent knowledge again<p>KEY FEATURES:<p>- Easily add useful email conversations along with file attachments to a shared repository.<p>- Define Rules to automatically fetch important discussions and add them to the repository<p>- GrexIt automatically fetches any further emails received on such discussions after they are added to GrexIt<p>- Search and Organize your content inside GrexIt easily<p>- Easily control access to email discussions added to GrexIt to allow access to specific people in your company<p>Would love to know your thoughts and suggestions !
======
willgodfrey
This looks very useful. My immediate concern is that the system relies on
human beings to mark and forward the useful bits of information. Is it
possible to set the fetch rules to actually search the contents of an email
for certain keywords instead of relying on labels?
~~~
nirajr
Thanks. Currently it relies on labels that the user applies on the discussion
in their inbox, but we're extending Fetch Rules to be sensitive to conditions
similar to what you define in a gmail label, and more. (like, whenever a
certain person discusses anything with a person from a specific domain or not
from a specific domain, fetch the discussion)
------
JoshKalkbrenner
Hmmm.. first thing that comes to mind? Consultant KT (Knowledge Transfer). To
be honest, I didn't look into your idea, but I recall all of the lost
Knowledge whenever a consultant left; especially Dev consultants.
~~~
nirajr
Totally. Thats definitely one aspect the product can help with :)
Do look at the 2.5 minute video. It give a quick, and probably entertaining
intro to what the product does.
------
bretthopper
Cool idea. There's an error in your video though. It says the email discussion
between Simon and Ray is dead, except Ray didn't talk to Simon, it was the
discussion between Simon and Ashook(sic) that died.
~~~
nands
Thanks for pointing this out. Your "attention to detail" is noteworthy ! We
will rectify this soon.
------
ankitind
Have been using it.. a great product. I love the label feature of marking
emails with specific labels and they automatically getting synced to central
repository.
------
jitnut
Great Idea, I have seen enterprise focused solution developed by MNC similar
to this and it turned out to be quite useful for them to improve productivity.
------
dmlevi
Well done. Great concept. I see this being very useful for Teams.
~~~
nirajr
Thanks. There's a lot of useful stuff that the tool does:
\- When you've added a discussion once to GrexIt, it will automatically keep
track of any follow-up emails that you might receive on the discussion after
you added it to GrexIt, and pulls them in automatically.
\- If two people in your company are discussing something, GrexIt will not
allow BOTH of you to add the discussion to GrexIt - so it takes care of
duplication of content.
\- Controlling access is very easy. Its closely tied to to our content
organization feature and is very intuitive.
Would be great if you can try it out if you're on Google Apps.
~~~
dmlevi
This is great for dealing with clients. If I have a team and only 1 person
from that team is in direct contact with that client, suddently GrexIt can
allow the team to instantly see what the client has sent directly to the
person in contact. Great if that person is on vacation or out for the day.
Keeps business going.
~~~
nirajr
Right. Support is one of the strongest use cases. GrexIt also covers you if 3
months down the line this guy leaves your company, or you have one more guy to
augment the support team, who needs to access the history of discussions or
support requests.
------
riskish
clickable: <http://www.grexit.com/>
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Simple Dockerfile examples are often broken by default - itamarst
https://pythonspeed.com/articles/dockerizing-python-is-hard/
======
btilly
I have a mixed opinion about his first point.
There are two basic approaches to take with dependency management.
The first version is to lock down every dependency as tightly as you can to
avoid accidentally breaking something. Which inevitably leads down the road to
everything being locked to something archaic that can't be upgraded easily,
and is incompatible with everything else. But with no idea what will break, or
how to upgrade. I currently work at a company that went down that path and is
now suffering for it.
The second version is upgrade early, upgrade often. This will occasionally
lead to problems, but they tend to be temporary and easily fixed. And in the
long run, your system will age better. Google is an excellent example of a
company that does this.
The post assumes that the first version should be your model. But having seen
both up close and personal, my sympathies actually lie with the second.
This is not to say that I'm against reproducible builds. I'm not. But if you
want to lock down version numbers for a specific release, have an automated
tool supply the right ones for you. And make it trivial to upgrade early, and
upgrade often.
~~~
oconnor663
> The first version is to lock down every dependency as tightly as you can to
> avoid accidentally breaking something...The second version is upgrade early,
> upgrade often...Google is an excellent example of a company that does this.
This is misleading. My understanding of Google's internal build systems is
that they _ruthlessly_ lock down the version of every single dependency, up to
and including the compiler binary itself. They then provide tooling on top of
that to make it easier to upgrade those locked down versions regularly.
The core problem is that when your codebase gets to the kind of scale that
Google's has, if you can't reproduce the entire universe of your dependencies,
there is no way any historical commit of anything will ever build. That makes
it difficult to do basic things like maintain release branches or bisect bugs.
> if you want to lock down version numbers for a specific release, have an
> automated tool supply the right ones for you. And make it trivial to upgrade
> early, and upgrade often.
This part sounds like a more accurate description of what Google and others
do, yes.
~~~
OJFord
For an easy open source example of such tooling, see Pyup.
We use it to do exactly that: pin down every dependency to an exact version,
but automatically build and test with newly released versions of each one.
(And then merge the upgrade, after fixing any issue.)
~~~
jrochkind1
Or the original ruby bundler, which locks down exact versions in a
`Gemfile.lock`, but lets you easily update to latest version(s) with `bundle
update`, which will update the `Gemfile.lock`.
Actually, it goes further, `bundle update` doesn't update just to "latest
version", but to latest version allowed by your direct or transitive version
restrictions.
I believe `yarn` ends up working similar in JS?
To me, this is definitely the best practice pattern for dependency management.
You definitely need to ruthlessly lock down the exact versions used, in a file
that's checked into the repo -- so all builds will use the exact same
versions, whether deployment builds or CI builds or whatever. But you also
need tooling that lets you easily update the versions, and change the file
recording the exact versions that's in the repo.
I'm not sure how/if you can do that reliably and easily with the sorts of
dependencies discussed in the OP or in Dockerfiles in general... but it seems
clear to me it's the goal.
------
Nullabillity
Good points, but it's amusing that his solution to #1 didn't lock down the
patch version, nor the distro around it. I think that also makes a decent
point for Nix[0], which solves #1-#3 by default (since choosing a particular
version of Nixpkgs locks down the whole environment, and considers the build
as a DAG of dependencies rather than a linear history). It also supports
exporting Docker images, while preserving Nix's richer build caching.[1]
[0]: [https://nixos.org/nix/](https://nixos.org/nix/)
[1]: [https://grahamc.com/blog/nix-and-layered-docker-
images](https://grahamc.com/blog/nix-and-layered-docker-images)
~~~
itamarst
Good point, will go fix that. My soon-to-be-ready attempt at a production-
ready template
([https://pythonspeed.com/products/pythoncontainer/](https://pythonspeed.com/products/pythoncontainer/))
covers the tradeoff between point releases vs. not-point-releases, and it does
pin the OS.
And yes, Nix fixes some of the problems of building a production-ready image,
but only a subset.
~~~
j88439h84
Could you elaborate on the remaining problems with Nix for building Python
images?
~~~
itamarst
Not an expert on Nix, but it's not so much that Nix has problems (though I'm
sure it does, my initial research suggested it's not quite there yet for
Python packages) but that there other things you need to get right.
For example:
1\. Signal handling (only one bit of [https://hynek.me/articles/docker-
signals/](https://hynek.me/articles/docker-signals/) is Dockerfile specific,
the rest still applies.)
2\. Configuring servers to run correctly in Docker environments (e.g. Gunicorn
is broken by default, and some of these issues go beyond Gunicorn:
[https://pythonspeed.com/articles/gunicorn-in-
docker/](https://pythonspeed.com/articles/gunicorn-in-docker/)).
3\. Not running as root, and dropping capabilities.
4\. Building pinned dependencies for Python that you can feed to Nix.
5\. Having processes (human and automated) in place to ensure security updates
happen.
6\. Knowing how to write shell scripts that aren't completely broken (either
by not writing them at all and using better language, or by using bash strict
mode: [http://redsymbol.net/articles/unofficial-bash-strict-
mode/](http://redsymbol.net/articles/unofficial-bash-strict-mode/))
etc.
~~~
tathougies
> though I'm sure it does, my initial research suggested it's not quite there
> yet for Python packages)
Can you expand on what's missing? I've successfully used nix to cross-compile
a pretty substantial python application (+ native extensions, hence the cross
compilation), for embedded purposes, and it pretty much worked out of the box.
Adding extra dependencies was straightforwards.
I think you can use pypi2nix for pinned dependencies, and you can run it
periodically for security updates.
~~~
itamarst
Like I said, it was very preliminary research... I reached the bit where
pypi2nix did "nix-env -if
[https://github.com/garbas/pypi2nix/tarball/master"](https://github.com/garbas/pypi2nix/tarball/master")
and wasn't super happy about the implications of "just use master" for
production readiness.
If it works, though, that's great!
The more general point though is that in my experience no tool is perfect, or
completely done, or without problems. E.g. the cited
[https://grahamc.com/blog/nix-and-layered-docker-
images](https://grahamc.com/blog/nix-and-layered-docker-images) suggests you
need to spend some time manually thinking about how to create layers for
caching? Again, very preliminary research—I know people are using it, I'm just
skeptical it's a magic bullet because nothing tends to be a magic bullet.
~~~
Nullabillity
Regarding layering, it used to be a completely manual process (just like with
Dockerfiles), but the point of the blog post was that you can now use
`buildLayeredImage` and correct layering will Just Happen.
~~~
itamarst
Ah, neat, hadn't realized that was an actual Nix feature now. The post made it
sound like this was just something they were writing for themselves.
------
adrianmonk
I feel like programmers often fail to grasp the distinction between example
code and production-ready code.
On one project, we made some example code available, and people would copy and
paste it into their project, change a few lines, and launch it into
production. Then they were surprised it didn't handle this or that situation
or deal with this or that detail.
Yeah, no shit it doesn't handle those things, _it 's example code!_ You're
supposed to read this code along with the documentation so you can get a gist
of what the API is like. It's a learning aid, not a software deliverable. Your
real code is going to be more complicated. This simplified code exists to get
you past the "how the hell does all this fit together at a high level?" hurdle
faster. Once you're over that hurdle, you can _start_ on the real
implementation.
~~~
dkarl
I wonder if people who complain about this have thought about what it would be
like for beginners to only get to see production code. Sometimes the cow needs
to be spherical.
~~~
ptyyy
This reminds me of that image of how to draw an owl. People forget that
everyone starts somewhere and there is no magical jump from beginner level
code to production code. Having good, well-explained examples of the beginner
and intermediate were incredibly beneficial to me.
------
tuco86
I have spent a ridiculous time building this so I'll take the opportunity and
share. It builds python wheel packages in a build container and installs them
in an app container. Works great for cpython and pypy. Also allows to build
for alpine and works for most other languages. We started to build basically
everything that way.
[https://gist.github.com/tuco86/67d84dfb27268b1faf05d2dbb1acb...](https://gist.github.com/tuco86/67d84dfb27268b1faf05d2dbb1acb667)
Ok, I kind of cheated and added the user just now. Sue me. Also posted this in
the other Docker related news. Sue me again.
~~~
Perceptes
Looks like the last line needs to be updated to have the server listen on 8080
instead of 80. (I'm guessing this is left over from before you added the non-
root user.)
------
linuxftw
The problems described here are called 'release engineering.' Dockerfiles
don't solve release engineering, they provide an abstraction for building a
release candidate, putting it through a pipeline, and then tagging a
successful build as your release. In other words, the end-container is the
immutable object that should be deployed, not the Dockerfile.
If you are building the container in each stage of your CI/CD pipeline, you
are doing it wrong.
------
jessemillar
> A broken Docker image can lead to production outages, and building best-
> practices images is a lot harder than it seems. So don’t just copy the first
> example you find on the web: do your research, and spend some time reading
> about best practices.
While I may not agree with absolutely everything in the article, this final
point is paramount. Please don't blindly use technology because you managed to
find a copypasta config that runs. Running != good.
~~~
zrobotics
Definitely very true. I write more C++ than anything else, and the sheer
number of online examples that start with
using namespace std;
is just staggering. Sure, it works in a toy example posted to stackoverflow,
but it will cause problems in larger projects. I think globally there needs to
be better emphasis on using best-practices in tutorials and examples; I
remember this particular pet-peeve of mine also being present in college
textbooks. Especially for content aimed at newbies, it should be frowned upon
to show the wrong way to do things, since then it gets harder to show how to
do it the right way. I've had people who were surprised to find out that they
could type:
using std::chrono::duration;
using std::cout;
instead of pulling in the entire std namespace; simply because they'd only
ever seen examples that did it the lazy way.
edit: lack of semicolons strikes again!
~~~
nemetroid
While I agree with the general point of using best practices in code samples,
the Cpp Core Guidelines actually encourage[0] using
using namespace std;
for std specifically, giving the reasoning that:
> sometimes a namespace is so fundamental and prevalent in a code base, that
> consistent qualification would be verbose and distracting.
I also work mainly in C++, and personally I prefer using it, together with
-Wshadow to catch possible issues.
0:
[https://github.com/isocpp/CppCoreGuidelines/blob/master/CppC...](https://github.com/isocpp/CppCoreGuidelines/blob/master/CppCoreGuidelines.md#sf6-use-
using-namespace-directives-for-transition-for-foundation-libraries-such-as-
std-or-within-a-local-scope-only)
~~~
jhasse
Problems arise when you upgrade your compiler and a new symbol was added to
std::
------
j88439h84
For reproducible builds, `python:3.7` isn't specific enough.
python:3.7.3-alpine3.9 is more specific, for example. There aren't supposed to
be breaking changes in the bugfix releases, but they'll happen anyway.
~~~
kam
And
`python:3.7@sha256:35ff9f44818f8850f1d318aa69c2e7ba61d85e3b93283078c10e56e7d864c183`
is even better.
------
myroon5
This Dockerfile linter would warn you about multiple of these problems and
more:
[https://github.com/hadolint/hadolint](https://github.com/hadolint/hadolint)
------
kkapelon
I am actually preparing my own article titled "Docker antipatterns" that will
include many more points like this.
------
diminoten
"Broken" means "does not work". These examples _do_ work. I'm annoyed by this
incongruity. "Not sustainable"/"Not Forward Compatible", etc. would have been
preferable.
------
mychael
This is an advertisement disguised as a technical post on container security.
~~~
nirvdrum
Then I wish all advertising were like this. It's very informative and provides
a solution rather than just pointing out the problem. I hope this page ends up
ranking highly in search results because there are a lot of incomplete
Dockerfiles employing questionable practices that sit at the top of search
results and proliferate due to cargo culting.
------
zingmars
I feel like the better solution to #4 is setting up UID namespacing for docker
instead of (just) creating random users within the container. Even if you
create a user, it's still going to run as whatever UID it has within the
container (probably 1000 is most likely your UID if you're the only one using
said system)
------
quickthrower2
Nice eBomb. Describes the problem, offers value, does it politely so it is HN
(and other places) friendly, then "there are still problems..." and then the
paid solution.
I've seen docker images that do a git clone from the master head to get the
source, so basically if their Github account gets hacked. You're f'd.
------
geggam
It seems like the folks making docker files could stand to learn package
management with a mature package system before making docker files.
I wonder how many use docker after they learn ?
------
ru999gol
why is running as root in the docker a problem? Isn't the whole point of
containers to isolate the container? So what is the difference in a container
running root or a user? If there is, wouldn't that be more of a docker bug?
~~~
miduil
The page the article is linking to
[http://canihaznonprivilegedcontainers.info](http://canihaznonprivilegedcontainers.info)
is mixing up running as root with running docker with --privileged. Latter one
renders Docker security to zero, but is barely required.
I’m not saying “go run your all your Docker images as root”, but this is
clearly FUD.
Non-privileged containers are still having "root", just with way fewer
capabilities (See Docker [0] docs).
I’m not an expert, but I guess depending what you are doing the most
problematic capability might be AUDIT_WRITE, because it is not namespaced and
could be abused for DOSing syslog. But you might require it for things like
sshd, sudo, adduser, passwd, …
Depending on how you are holding it the NET_BIND_SERVICE and NET_RAW can be an
issue (depends on how your docker network looks like), but the others appear
not to be a security issue per-se.
This page [1] gives a good overview on default capabilities, though they are
also confusing to the reader with "better disable this".
I've created an issue, not sure if I have resources to fix their page though.
[2]
[0]: [https://docs.docker.com/engine/reference/run/#runtime-
privil...](https://docs.docker.com/engine/reference/run/#runtime-privilege-
and-linux-capabilities)
[1]: [https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/secure-your-containers-one-
we...](https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/secure-your-containers-one-weird-trick)
[2]:
[https://github.com/mhausenblas/canihaznonprivilegedcontainer...](https://github.com/mhausenblas/canihaznonprivilegedcontainers.info/issues/8)
~~~
itamarst
Non-privileged containers running as root are a definite security risk.
Real world example: CVE from February 2019 which allowed escalation to root on
host. It's preventable by (among other things) "a low privileged user inside
the container".
See [https://blog.dragonsector.pl/2019/02/cve-2019-5736-escape-
fr...](https://blog.dragonsector.pl/2019/02/cve-2019-5736-escape-from-docker-
and.html)
~~~
miduil
(Same discussion as on lobste.rs)
Thank you for this link, I've only seen the initial CVE announcement.
> This is not FUD [...]
The site is practicing FUD, it accomplishes communicating a message in an
untruthful fashion by mixing two different things into one. (Just check out
their stack overflow links, it is not clear if they are talking about root or
`--privileged`)
People are confused wether `docker root == host system root` and this site
doesn't help them to get a better understanding whether or not it is the case.
(It isn't) Plus it misses what its main goal should be, running a Secure
Docker environment.
You are talking about a previous exploit, not a permanent issue. Keeping your
host system up to date and additional hardenings is always going to be
necessary in exposed environments.
> Use Docker containers with SELinux enabled (--selinux-enabled). This
> prevents processes inside the container from overwriting the host docker-
> runc binary.
Authors recommendation is also using SELinux, this also helped with outer
Docker/Kernel related vulnerabilities in the past. Why isn't the page even
mentioning this?
\---
I think it is important to give a proper outlook on how problematic things are
and not to confuse people with super high expectations. You often end up
running containers that you have only little control about.
1\. Avoiding root in self-built containers is definitively the way to go,
since it reduces (unnecessary) attack surface, but
1. It requires some glue code
2. Might slow down your builds (`Dockerfile` multistage `cp --from=0 /app /app` loses permissions, requires chown afterwards)
2\. Avoiding root in CI/CD is nearly impossible 1\. many package managers
won't work
2. some capabilities to test things (sshd for testing ansible scripts for example)
3. can you use kaniko for building Docker images from within Docker without root?
3\. Harden your Docker host
1. Use SELinux
2. Use monitoring
3. Drop capabilities that aren't necessary (NET_BIND_SERVICE, NET_RAW, ...)
4. Use docker network separation
5. Frequent system updates
4\. Keep yourself up-to-date, especially if you are running an exposed
environment
Just googled and this is rather more helpful:
\- [https://dev.to/petermbenjamin/docker-security-best-
practices...](https://dev.to/petermbenjamin/docker-security-best-
practices-45ih)
\- [https://blog.aquasec.com/docker-security-best-
practices](https://blog.aquasec.com/docker-security-best-practices)
\- [https://sysdig.com/blog/7-docker-security-
vulnerabilities/](https://sysdig.com/blog/7-docker-security-vulnerabilities/)
\- [https://github.com/docker/docker-bench-
security](https://github.com/docker/docker-bench-security)
------
jand
I do not intend to play down the importance of using docker carefully.
But the reproducible build aspect of the critic seems unnecessary to me: Isn't
that more a concern of the packaging system? (no python scripter)
If your packaging systems supports version selection/locking, then use your
packaging system right. If your packaging system cannot pin a version, how
should docker solve this?
~~~
derriz
Docker can't escape all the blame here - its layer caching mechanism is IMHO
flawed. It's fine to say that a packaging system should offer reproducibility
but Docker's layer caching design assumes that every RUN command produces
reproducible results.
You could of course blame users for not making sure that all the commands they
use in their Dockerfiles are actually reproducible but many/most examples even
in the official documention are clearly not reproducible.
Therefore you end up with what is in my opinion a semi-broken system -
building images seems to be reproducible (and fast) until you lose your layer
cache or you spin up a new CI build agent or a new dev joins the team and
tries to build the same image.
Not that I can think of an clean and performant solution to this problem.
~~~
tobbyb
We have been working on a simplified container build system which does away
with layers altogether. [1]
The use of layers at the build stage adds a lot of needless complexity with
very little benefits and users really need to step back and question the value
they are getting from the use of layers. [2]
Words like 'immutability', 'declarative' and 'reproduciblity' are often used
in ways that can lead to user misunderstanding and can be accomplished with
simpler workflows. For instance immutability, reuse, composition do not
require layers. There needs to be a lot more technical scrutiny to avoid
confusion.
[1]
[https://www.flockport.com/docs/containers#builds](https://www.flockport.com/docs/containers#builds)
[2] [https://www.flockport.com/guides/say-yes-to-
containers.html](https://www.flockport.com/guides/say-yes-to-containers.html)
------
vorticalbox
I would move the requirements.txt and pip install to after the user creation
seeing as you'll invalidate that cache if your requirements change.
Best part is that was brought up as an issue in the article only to do the
same thing in an example
------
hayd
Running pip with sudo doesn't seem a great idea either...
------
treis
(1) and (2) aren't really broken, IMHO. For most cases always using the most
up to date version is better than having 100% reproducible builds. After all,
you have the docker image that you can distribute if you really need to.
Better to pick up security and performance patches as they become available.
If those updates break something then you can make the decision to fix on a
known good version.
~~~
erik_seaberg
If you always pin, you have history to tell you which versions were good. If
you mostly don't, you have to start disassembling a bunch of old images just
to figure out what they were built from.
------
jo-wol
The final example in the article is broken. Python interpreter as PID 1 can't
handle linux signals.
~~~
itamarst
This is why I have a caveat at the top of the article as well as right after
the last example. This particular issue is fixable with `docker run --init`,
so not strictly necessary to fix in images.
------
mistrial9
not everyone is on a upgrade-daily churn, and should not have to be ! if you
are externally exposed, sure, because security .. but really, isn't there some
room here for different life cycles ?
------
batbomb
In general, in Go, Java, and Python I've resorted to copying in the Gopkg
files, pom.xml, and requirements.txt, and then running the requisite
dependency installer for the language (dep, pip, mvn, etc...) and then just
copying in the rest of the repo, relying on the .dockeringore with a default-
ignore for everything and specifying the individual files/directories you may
want to add, and in some cases a rootfs folder when necessary.
This seems to be the happy medium for me. I don't have very strong opinions on
requirements.txt always being the pinned output from a pip freeze, and it
seems like pipenv may actually die in a few years, and poetry will evolve to
take the mantle, but I do lots of things with conda anyway.
------
neves
Isn't it ironic that he isn't pining down the docker version?
------
DoctorPenguin
Isn't the example on how to make the referenced file better another
contribution to the pool of "broken by default" images? Either that or I don't
get the argument.
------
eyeareque
Not locking it to a specific version is better for security updates. Do you
want it to run stable with vulnerabilities or to run secure and broken?
~~~
bdcravens
> Not locking it to a specific version is better for security updates.
The idea is that you should take responsibility for your containers and verify
fixes and test your application.
> Do you want it to run stable with vulnerabilities or to run secure and
> broken?
If these are your two choices, you have a staffing or a workflow problem.
------
bytematic
Probably going to want to use tagged docker repos so that updating certain
packages, no matter the language, don't suddenly break your images
------
est
One more broken part is
CMD [ "python", "./yourscript.py" ]
This breaks if you want to debug yourscript.py on startup. Better use a sh to
wrap it.
~~~
deathanatos
Why/what do you think this breaks / what does wrapping it in a shell do for
you?
E.g., for me, the following Dockerfile:
FROM python:3
RUN pip3 install ipdb
COPY test.py /test.py
CMD ["python", "test.py"]
where test.py is:
import ipdb; ipdb.set_trace()
print('Hello, World.')
run as `docker run -ti --rm $IMAGE_ID` works as expected:
» docker run -ti --rm 52e98c118dc3
> /test.py(2)<module>()
1 import ipdb; ipdb.set_trace()
----> 2 print('Hello, World.')
ipdb> p globals()
{'__name__': '__main__', '__doc__': None, '__package__': None, '__loader__': <_frozen_importlib_external.SourceFileLoader object at 0x7f809a8c8278>, '__spec__': None, '__annotations__': {}, '__builtins__': <module 'builtins' (built-in)>, '__file__': 'test.py', '__cached__': None, 'ipdb': <module 'ipdb' from '/usr/local/lib/python3.7/site-packages/ipdb/__init__.py'>}
ipdb> ^D
Exiting Debugger.
»
~~~
est
Can you add extra environ before python executes any code?
~~~
Faaak
Did you even try ?
`docker exec -e foo=bar -it ....`
------
42n4
Very good clues!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
IBM smashes Moore's Law, cuts bit size to 12 atoms - MrFacepalm
http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9223396/IBM_smashes_Moore_s_Law_cuts_bit_size_to_12_atoms?taxonomyId=19
======
da-bacon
Cool result, major bad title. 1) Moore's law is about transistor size, this is
about storing bits. 2) As the article does mention, this doesn't work at room
temperature, as the bits are too unreliable. The article says this will work
at 150 atoms, which sounds about right, but isn't really substantiated by the
actual experiment.
I'd also note that while this is a very cool experiment, the fact that it was
performed using a scanning tunneling microscope means it's not exactly a
practical device :) But as a proof of principle of storing a bit in a few
number of atoms, this is a very neat result.
------
SoftwareMaven
No hyperbole in the title at all. Moore's law would be smashed if this was
ready to release. By the time it is, this will be just another dip to be
averaged over.
Sometime, I really wish I had a job where I got to play with individual atoms.
------
dangrossman
Previous submission: <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3457841>
------
RKearney
And here I was thinking Moore's Law was related to transistors and not
storage...
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Deadspin Staffers Are Quitting - IfOnlyYouKnew
https://www.thebiglead.com/posts/deadspin-writers-quitting-g-o-media-controversy-01drf9syxbdp
======
IfOnlyYouKnew
Here's (some of) the reasoning from (one of) the horse's mouth:
[https://theconcourse.deadspin.com/the-adults-in-the-
room-183...](https://theconcourse.deadspin.com/the-adults-in-the-
room-1837487584)
~~~
xyzzyz
_The real and less romantic story is this: The journalists at Deadspin and its
sister sites, like most journalists I know, are eager to do work that makes
money; we are even willing to compromise for it, knowing that our jobs and
futures rest on it. An ever-growing number of media owners, meanwhile, are so
exceedingly unwilling to reckon with the particulars of their own business
that they refuse to accept our eagerness to help them make money._
_(...)_
_A metastasizing swath of media is controlled by private-equity vultures and
capricious billionaires and other people who genuinely believe that they are
rich because they are smart and that they are smart because they are rich, and
that anyone less rich is by definition less smart. They know what they know,
and they don’t need to know anything else._
Why don't the journalists who know how to run the business pool their
resources up and start a business then? What's stopping them? What do they
need those venture capital vultures for?
~~~
CPLX
I mean they did. The actual business we are talking about was started the way
you suggest, and was then destroyed by a vindictive billionaire, and is now
being (apparently) mismanaged by a bunch of other rich people.
Is your premise that the journalists have no right to be mad at what they
perceive as an unjust wielding of economic power?
~~~
xyzzyz
_The actual business we are talking about was started the way you suggest, and
was then destroyed by a vindictive billionaire, and is now being (apparently)
mismanaged by a bunch of other rich people._
If so, that's only more reason to leave. If they all leave, they can start a
competing business managing it the way they want, while the rich people are
left with worthless husk.
I'd also like to note that it was not destroyed by "vindictive billionaire",
but by a result of jury trial, which punished them for keeping a private sex
tape up despite the court order telling them to take it down. Allow me to
opine that it doesn't really give me a feeling that they know how to run a
successful business.
------
richard_mcp
I like how a site with autoplay ads is reporting this.
~~~
artek
According to WSJ [1] the issue was that the ads were autoplaying with sound
on. Just auto playing by itself isn't considered intrusive by the industry.
[1] [https://www.wsj.com/articles/hostilities-rise-inside-g-o-
med...](https://www.wsj.com/articles/hostilities-rise-inside-g-o-media-over-
autoplay-video-ads-and-politics-11572392147)
~~~
big_chungus
Some of us don't want to spring for unlimited data plans and get rather
frustrated when reading textual news incurs the charges associated with
streaming video. Bandwidth is not boundless for everyone.
------
manigandham
Not sticking to sports is why they failed and needed new management and more
invasive ads for revenue in the first place.
~~~
samfbiddle
This is completely wrong. Gawker Media was a profitable, growing company until
Peter Thiel wrecked it and its subsidiary sites were sold to a series of
increasingly incompetent owners. Deadspin's "non-sports" articles were
regularly among its most widely read.
In fact, here's a person whose job it was to sell ads for Deadspin explaining
that you are incorrect:
[https://twitter.com/jillian_schulz/status/118967386127042969...](https://twitter.com/jillian_schulz/status/1189673861270429696)
~~~
at-fates-hands
> until Peter Thiel wrecked it.
This is wrong.
Gawker media were confident they could operate freely in legal grey areas and
fall back on their “freedom of speech” defense when they published Hulk
Hogan’s sex tape without his knowledge.
The fact they decided to go to court and challenge Hogan over his claims of
defamation was their own poor choice. The only thing Thiel did was bankroll
Hogan’s legal team.
A.J. Daulerio’s deposition and subsequent cavalier appearance and court
testimony was probably the last nail in their coffin.
In short, Gawker had been playing with fire before and escaped. The fact they
thought this would be another easy escape proved to be their undoing.
Nobody but Gawker and their editors who thought they could publish anything,
about any celeb is what cost them their publication and their jobs - not just
one guy who financially supported Hogan in his civil case.
~~~
Consultant32452
Let's not forget why Thiel was upset at Gawker. They outed him as gay, putting
his life in danger because he did business in places where the penalty for
homosexuality is death.
~~~
Dylan16807
No, a _billionaire_ is not in danger of death because he _does business_
somewhere that has such a penalty.
A billionaire can afford security or not go in person.
Does not going in person harm his ability to make deals? Maybe, maybe not. But
that doesn't even resemble "life in danger".
~~~
throwawaysea
This is an outrageous position to take. You’re basically acknowledging that
Thiel could come to face physical violence due to Gawker’s irresponsible
actions but that he could just change his actions and choices to avoid this.
That is, it reads like “No his life isn’t in danger if he goes out of his way
to avoid the danger”.
~~~
Dylan16807
Going to a very small list of countries purely to make more money, when you
already have a billion dollars, is not at all a necessary or important life
activity. The inability to do so is a very trivial inconvenience.
~~~
manigandham
Running a tabloid news story is not a necessary or important life activity
either, especially when it actively harms someone else (regardless of their
wealth or connections).
~~~
Dylan16807
Yep, entirely accurate. There was no need to run that story, even though the
harm done wasn't life-changing.
------
JansjoFromIkea
This was Univision wasn't it? Kotaku is falling apart right now too, also done
an impressively terrible job killing off the AV Club (I reckon there could be
a case study in there about how not to do a rebrand tbh, have hardly viewed it
since). They seemed to think they could just pull the audiences from about a
dozen very different websites and mould them into one site.
~~~
bbanyc
Univision bought most of the remains of Gawker, merged it with their own site
Fusion (later renamed Splinter, now defunct) and the Onion/AV Club, and sold
it to the current owners of G/O at a massive loss.
In this media environment, with profitability seemingly tied to the whims of
Facebook's recommendation algorithm and major sites like Mic and ThinkProgress
dropping left and right, I don't know if anyone can survive without a deep-
pocketed owner who can fund years of losses.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Is anyone using REST API code generator in production? - craig_murray
I'm aware of some comparisons conducted a while ago on some API code generators listed below but these comparisons seem to be outdated:<p>- apimatic.io: https://apimatic.io<p>- AutoRest: https://github.com/Azure/AutoRest<p>- Swagger Codegen: https://github.com/swagger-api/swagger-codegen<p>- OpenAPI-CodeGen: https://github.com/Mermade/openapi-codegen<p>- OpenAPI Generator: https://github.com/OpenAPITools/openapi-generator<p>- go-swagger: https://github.com/go-swagger/go-swagger<p>Is anyone using these tools in their environment? Any caveat?
======
wing328hk
I'm the top contributor to both OpenAPI Generator and Swagger Codegen. Just
want to share a bit more to ensure everyone is on the same page.
OpenAPI Generator is a fork of Swagger Codegen. The fork took place in May
2018 - a year ago. For the reasons behind the fork, please refer to the Q&A
([https://github.com/OpenAPITools/openapi-
generator/blob/maste...](https://github.com/OpenAPITools/openapi-
generator/blob/master/docs/qna.md)).
Fast forward to today, we just released OpenAPI Generator v4.0.0 - the 20th
release since the fork, thanks to the awesome contributions from the vibrant
developer community. Please refer to the release note
([https://github.com/OpenAPITools/openapi-
generator/releases/t...](https://github.com/OpenAPITools/openapi-
generator/releases/tag/v4.0.0)) for more information about the release.
For a list of companies and open-source projects using OpenAPI Generator in
production, please refer to the project's README
([https://github.com/OpenAPITools/openapi-generator/#4---
compa...](https://github.com/OpenAPITools/openapi-generator/#4---
companiesprojects-using-openapi-generator)).
I hope you will find OpenAPI Generator useful in your work and personal
projects.
~~~
bbdouglas
Yelp uses openapi-generator to create REST clients for the Java services
within our microservice architecture. Defining the API's in Swagger and auto-
generating the client code is a big improvement in understandability and
maintainability over what we used to do, which was to write bespoke clients
for each microservice.
Openapi-generator is opinionated when it comes to how the data model classes
are defined, and the feature set depends on which underlying HTTP library you
choose (Jersey, Feign, Retrofit, OkHttp, etc), so we needed to invest some
time when getting started to make necessary adjustments. But overall it has
proven to be robust and meet our needs.
~~~
craig_murray
Right, we arrive at a similar conclusion. We will need to tweak the templates
a little bit to meet our needs.
------
mwoodland
I used them at my financial services software company. They've made it through
to our client's test environments, but as they're a large financial company
things move very slowly and they're not in production yet.
We wanted to ensure our APIs were backwards compatible and we felt like the
best way to ensure that would be by making them contract led. This also means
that we can design our APIs and write the spec files and get feedback without
having to implement anything.
So our APIs are defined by the swagger spec files.
The open API generator was perfect for this as it meant we could write our
spec files, and then generate interfaces for our spring boot application based
on the swagger spec files.
Then to implement the API all we need to do is implement the interfaces that
the open API generator generated for us.
The generator is very flexible (the mustache files allow you to modify what
gets generated) and the community - particularly wing328hk were very helpful.
We submitted a number of pull requests with changes that helped make things a
bit smoother for us, and require less custom configuration of the generator.
The development community was very active and happy to provide feedback and
accept our pull requests.
All in all I would definitely recommend a contract led approach (and the open
API generator) for developing RESTful APIs.
~~~
craig_murray
I like your recommendation on the contract led approach. The active
development community is definitely a big plus.
------
craig_murray
I originally started this discussion in Reddit but they don't allow self-post
(or text-post) so we will continue the discussion here instead.
You can still find some user stories in the following Reddit posts (hidden
from public):
\-
[https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/bps96v/questio...](https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/bps96v/question_is_anyone_using_rest_api_code_generator/)
\-
[https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/bq64ek/compare...](https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/bq64ek/compare_autorest_apimatic_and_swagger_codegen_2016/)
~~~
laken
It's not that Reddit doesn't allow self-posts, it's because you asked the
question in a subreddit that isn't mean to have questions in the title, which
is also why they removed the self-post functionality from their subreddit.
There is /r/AskProgramming for that which allows self-posts.
~~~
craig_murray
That's correct. Next time I'll try /r/AskProgramming to ask similar question.
------
ethan92492
I've loved using OpenAPI Generator. This dramatically simplifies the
propagation of staticaly typed responses to clients, keeping client code
easily in sync with the latest server classes. It works really well!
~~~
craig_murray
Thanks for sharing the positive experience with OpenAPI Generator
------
thiago_fm
Just use GraphQL. REST is dead.
I've had a lot of experience with REST & JSON API and those "generators" or
abstraction people create always end up being very inflexible. With GraphQL,
you have full control on what you return, as well full control over how you
want to change your data. Easy to avoid n+1 etc. Maybe that's just me, but I
think this question is already answered. Took us a few years to discover a
better way.
I've been using GraphQL for the last 2 years and haven't had ANY complaints so
far. It doesn't try to push you some mindset of how should things look like
and instead just try to get out of the way, enabling you do craft requests and
responses as you'd like. Of course, with that power, you need to make sure
that things stay consistent, but that problem also exists for REST/JSON API's.
~~~
craig_murray
GraphQL is definitely something we're looking into. From what we understand,
it's not a silver bullet to every single problem. It totally makes sense in
certain cases (e.g. facebook).
Glad to know you have very positive experience with GraphQL so far.
~~~
willio58
I’m using both on a project I’ve been working on. Anything that doesn’t work
nicely with graphQL I just toss into the REST api.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
How to design your startup culture, according to HubSpot - williswee
https://www.techinasia.com/talk/design-startup-culture-hubspot
======
ethiclub
This piece appears to be biased (and presumably was paid for by Hubspot). As a
contrasting opinion, here is a personal perception of Hubspot (having worked
with them as a client employee and a consumer of their output). As usual, this
is opinion/perception from the writer only (not the opinion of an
organization, and not making any claims).
"HubSpot’s HEART values: humility, empathy, adaptability, remarkability, and
transparency."
\- Hubspot arguably engage in (and recommend) dark UX patterns. Hubspot
arguably encourages SPAM, misleading wording and coercion. This is in relation
to current industry opinion on ethical UX, let alone future opinion.
\- Much of their blog content promotes manipulative marketing and sales, with
little consideration of the consumer's actual needs (see
[https://blog.hubspot.com/marketing/emotions-in-
advertising-e...](https://blog.hubspot.com/marketing/emotions-in-advertising-
examples) for an article on consumer emotions that ironically concentrates on
conversion & manipulation of said emotion).
\- Hubspot arguably sells to anyone - The culture appears to be 'traditional
aggressive salesmanship'. I.e. they do not consider whether the client can
afford or gain value from the product, they just push through the sale. This
opinion contrasts with their ethics code
([https://s2.q4cdn.com/235752014/files/doc_governance/Code-
of-...](https://s2.q4cdn.com/235752014/files/doc_governance/Code-of-Use-Good-
Judgment.pdf)).
\- While Hubspot arguably may not have a moral obligation to prevent it: They
appear to be encouraging (or at least facilitating) low-quality content being
churned out in the interests of clicks. The platform and mentality does not
appear to be conducive to the creation of actual valuable content, nor the
maturation of marketing/sales in an ethical direction.
\- Hubspot arguably uses the word 'ethics' as a marketing tool, and there is
little to show that real ethical considerations have been regularly employed.
This is analogous to greenwashing and could be seen as detrimental to real
ethical-capitalism.
Personal opinion: Hubspot's existence is detrimental to society.
In the interests of fairness and general industry progression, Hubspot's
opinion/response to this is extremely welcome, and further discussion
involving them could be very beneficial to many stakeholders.
Here is another angle (which none of the above opinion was influenced by) -
[http://fortune.com/disrupted-excerpt-hubspot-startup-dan-
lyo...](http://fortune.com/disrupted-excerpt-hubspot-startup-dan-lyons/)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Best ways to kill your startup - vinnyglennon
https://medium.com/swlh/best-ways-to-kill-your-startup-8604a1768a89
======
hacknat
Posts on creating a successful startup seem to all suffer from a lack of 2nd
order thinking. Even some of the posts from PG. I’m sorry, but it is
blindingly obvious, IMO, that startups should focus on surviving, whereas
someone like Jeff Bezos has to think about how to serve an ace (and can suffer
a good deal of failures before it would threaten his company).
The unending stream of platitudes that come with these posts are also quite
obvious, but also somewhat useless: don’t hire too fast, but don’t hire too
slow; find a market, but don’t copy your competition.
I think PG said in a post once that the YC partners joked that their job was
to give founders advice that they would then ignore. So that makes me think
that the advice/wisdom people should be dispensing/pursuing is: what can you
do to make sure you follow all this good advice in a disciplined way? It seems
like a lot of intelligent people fail to do so, why? How can you make yourself
the exception?
I don’t necessarily have the answers, but from my limited experience the best
advice you can give an aspiring founder is:
1\. Don’t found a company. You have a good idea and you think you can execute?
Great, go find someone who is very likely already doing it and help them out.
You’ll have way more fun and probably make more money.
2\. Okay, you absolutely have to do this? The thing you have to really nail to
follow all this great advice is culture. I have been at many startups, the
ones that suceeded all had one thing in common: a highly functional culture.
What does that mean? It doesn’t necessarily mean everyone having warm fuzzies
and a Swedish masseuse. It means that information in your organization can
move effectively from anywhere in your company to anywhere else and people
will feel empowered to act on that information. This is not the default mode
for any organization. The default mode for any organization is
territorialism/feudalism. Humans have evolved to be zero sum thinkers, they
can’t help it. You have to create and organization that fights this
constantly.
~~~
andrewstuart
>> it is blindingly obvious, IMO, that startups should focus on surviving
I don't think it is blindingly obvious. In fact I think the typical beginner
entrepreneur really doesn't know where to focus. I've seen a number of people
commence business and focus on logo, writing blog posts, legal setup, making a
website, and then the whole thing goes kaput months down the track because
they didn't have any revenue, when I think they were perfectly capable of
earning money from my external viewpoint, but the beginning entrepreneur
thinks they should, or is enjoying, playing "business theatre".
And strangely it seems that there's nothing you can do to advise people
otherwise during this phase of their personal development.... they are full of
confidence and optimism and not open to hearing that they are not doing the
right things. People are more likely to listen once they have failed and it
has all come crashing down, then they have good reason to start looking for
answers.
------
Veen
Essentially, make something people want, don't spend all your money before you
have an income, fire weak employees, and find a co-founder you can work with.
I've never started a startup, but I'd be surprised if these nuggets of wisdom
are news to anyone.
The tennis analogy was quite clever, but it lead me to expect more incisive
advice.
~~~
sky_rw
I've been involved in several startups, a couple winners and a couple losers.
Like all things in life I've found that the simplest principles are often the
hardest ones to grok.
It's like jumping into a Indy Car, and you think "Just go straight and then
turn left". Turns out when you are going 200mph at a concrete wall the simple
things become a lot more complex.
~~~
csallen
A lot of the simple advice needs further unpacking, too. I've seen founders
interpret "Make something people want" in all sorts of ways, as belied by
their behavior:
\- "Make something nobody wants, then keep adding features until something
magical happens."
\- "Copy another app that people already use, but add 'better' or 'faster' or
'easier' or 'prettier' in my marketing copy."
\- "Survey my users and build whatever they tell me, no questions asked."
\- "Build features that align with my own personal vision of what the product
should look like, then hope that other people want it."
\- "Create 1/5th of an ambitious product that people want."
\- "Do an excellent job solving a trivial pain point that nobody cares about
solving."
\- "Make something completely new and unique that the world has never seen
before, regardless of whether or not anybody wants it."
~~~
freehunter
>"Build features that align with my own personal vision of what the product
should look like, then hope that other people want it."
To be fair this is by far the most common startup advice. Make a product for
yourself, because if you've having a problem others likely are too. The only
place you fall into a trap here is if you're both unwilling to change the
design in the future _and_ you're wrong about the design.
~~~
zbentley
> The only place you fall into a trap here is if you're both unwilling to
> change the design in the future _and_ you're wrong about the design.
I'd change the "and" to an "or": is if you're unwilling to change the design
in the future _or_ you're wrong about the design.
This is because:
1\. Even if you're right about the design, and can make people want it, the
market (which drives what people want/can be made to want) may change. You
_will_ have to change, usually sooner than you think; a great vision doesn't
prevent the need for that.
2\. If you're wrong about the design or don't have a good sense for "what is
needed/works", no number of pivots will save you, because each pivot will
likely be to something that people either don't need or doesn't work.
A failure in either is a kiss of death.
~~~
freehunter
Fair enough. I was thinking along the lines of Apple, where Steve Jobs knew
exactly what he wanted and was very reluctant to bow to market pressure or
critics because his vision was always the right vision. Or Basecamp, refusing
to add new features or at least putting new features into spin-off companies
to not compromise their initial vision. Either of these companies received a
death sentence the day they were created... except they were right, so they
succeeded.
Your comment shows its not black and white, there are many shades of grey in
between.
------
tptacek
It doesn't sound like these are drawn from the author's experience, but rather
from other things the author read, which would make it more of a haphazard
survey than earned advice.
~~~
carterehsmith
That article looks like a bot-generated content. There are Facebook bots,
Twitter, Amazon bots (like, bots that generate book contents), even Youtube
bots with (sometimes super-weird) machine-generated videos.
BTW they do get clicks, so this is not some AI research moonshot, it is more
like a little cottage industry popping up.
~~~
bramkrom
Hey, I'm the author, and it's not :) But I guess the fact that you think it is
is good feedback, so thanks
------
epberry
At this point it's hard to tell if these posts are auto-generated or not. On
this one, I'm leaning towards yes.
~~~
YPCrumble
Well put. Perhaps AI is getting closer to passing the Turing test because
humans are regressing.
~~~
inimino
The Turing test is a _dialogue_. There is already tons of programmatic content
on the web and it is indistinguishable from human-written content in the
absence of contextual cues.
------
dom96
So if I have an idea that I think people want, how do I figure out whether my
assumptions are correct? Short of actually making the thing.
~~~
Strom
You talk to a bunch of people and ask them if they would be willing to pay
right now. Better if you don't mention that it's not available until they
agree to pay.
It's sort of a funnel: people you think want it > people who actually want it
for free > people who can see themselves wanting it if someone else pays (i.e.
future them could pay) > people who are actually willing to pay themselves.
~~~
Guest9812398
Keep in mind you'll get a lot of false positives. This is one of the biggest
mistakes I always did when validating ideas. I would ask people (and myself),
would you use or pay for product X? People would say yes, I would develop it,
and then no one would use it.
I realized you need to ask a follow-up question. Would you use or pay for
product X? If yes, then why are you not using similar services Y and Z that
already exist?
If it's truly a good idea, then they already know about Y and Z, because
they've been searching for a solution to their problem. They might be paying
for one of those existing inferior services too, because they need this
problem solved, and they're the only options available. That would be great
news. It's bad news when they don't know anything about the existing services.
As a simple example, you could ask pet owners if they would use a social
network for pets, where they register their pet, post entertaining photos of
their pet, follow other pets, etc. Basically, Facebook where all the profiles
and posts are from animals.
You'll get a bunch of yes answers from pet owners, which sounds very
promising, and you might start on development. As I said, this is a mistake.
If you search on Google, you'll find lots of existing pet social networks. So,
ask those same people, if they said yes, why don't they visit Google today,
and register on one of those other 10 sites? Why didn't they sign-up on one
last month? Usually, once they find out the idea exists (or you develop it),
they realize they don't care for, or need the service as much as they
originally thought.
As another example, I might want to develop a HN theme with bigger voting
icons, larger text and links for improved readability, etc. When I ask myself,
I answer yes, it's all positives, and I want and would use this theme. But
then I ask, why have I never used any existing HN themes from other users?
When did I last search for HN themes, because one probably exists today with
some of the features on my list. I then realize that I don't care that much
about a theme after all, and I actually prefer running sites as they're
originally designed, without third-party themes or add-ons, even if they do
add a few beneficial features.
~~~
jonex
This was a pretty clever idea. I haven't heard about it before. It gets some
of the benefits from making an MVP in a really cheap way.
------
bramkrom
Note: I'm the author of the piece.
Thanks a lot to the person who decided to share this here. It taught me a lot.
HN really hosts a group of experts. The comments here have been super nuanced,
showing actual mastery of the content. Really helps me sharpen my writing, so
thanks to all for commenting.
------
benjaminsuch
I don't get the quintessence of this article. Startup life is hard, a
rollercoaster and many factors may it be good or bad will turn your startup
into a success or failure. I miss suggestions or ideas how to face these
problems and what a founder can do to minimize the risk.
For the author, I would love to read about scenarios where a startup or the
author itself overcome or prevent the mentioned problems.
~~~
bramkrom
Hey Benjamin,
I'm the author of the article, and love your feedback!
This article was actually a follow-up on a previous article, and wanted to dig
deeper on the failures of others. Will dig even deeper to figure out how to
overcome and prevent those problems.
Thanks!
------
kome
Please clap.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Turn your browser into a notepad with one line - bitsweet
https://coderwall.com/p/lhsrcq
======
tikhonj
This is what the _scratch_ (EDIT: read _scratch_ as * scratch * without the
spaces--is there any way to escape that properly on HN?) buffer is for in
Emacs, and I find it extremely useful. Also, unlike using a different tool, it
allows me to use all the Emacs-specific features I usually rely on. (For
example, I can easily type special characters like r₁ × r₂ ≈ r₃ using the TeX
mode.)
If you want more than one scratch buffer--which happens to me once in a while
--you can just create a new buffer with any name, and it will also do. New
buffers are in a different mode by default, but you can set it up to work
exactly the same way as _scratch_ if you want.
As another commenter pointed out, you can use the browser to evaluate
JavaScript. Emacs lets you do the same thing with elisp in the scratch buffer
by default: try entering in an elisp expression and pressing C-j.
Just a fun alternative to this trick for the Emacs users around here :).
~~~
lukes386
There's also a "scratch" plugin for vim that offers similar functionality:
<http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=664>
~~~
lomendil
For vim, I just open an unnamed buffer (:new). I think this is exactly the
same as the scratch buffer in emacs.
~~~
wfn
The only differences being, when you close vim, the scratch buffer does not
yield a save prompt, and also, if you open a scratch buffer, then close it,
and then reopen it again with :Scratch during the same vim session, any
leftover contents from before (but during that same vim session, of course)
will be restored, which is neat/convenient. :)
edit: misread your comment, thought you were comparing :new and :Scratch
(linked above), not emacs' scratch. Not sure about that one, but again, the
'reopen scratch -> find leftover contents' functionality is a neat thing.
~~~
dschep
:new | set buftype=nofile
------
simonsarris
Ah shoot. If Chrome allowed localStorage to be accessible from file:/// then
we could add save (CTRL+S) and automatic load using this:
data:text/html,<html><script>window.onload=function(){var a=document.body;a.innerText=localStorage.mydoc;a.addEventListener("keydown",function(b){b.ctrlKey&&83==b.which&&(localStorage.mydoc=a.innerHTML,b.preventDefault())},!1)};</script><body contenteditable></body></html>
Firefox will save it to localStorage but clear the local storage afterwards.
Weird.
Oh well.
At least we can still turn our (Chrome) browsers into desktop calculators by
pressing CTRL+SHIFT+J!
(If you want the un-minified version of the code I wrote:
<http://jsfiddle.net/d5sGq/>)
~~~
jfaucett
That is so cool :). I just slapped together a (really) simple chrome ext for
opening up a new tab in "contenteditable" mode. It saves the contents into
localStorage, thats it for now :) Here it is if anyones interested
<https://github.com/jwaterfaucett/textpad>
~~~
zchr
Made it a chrome extension for an easier install.
[https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/textpad/edopaieiod...](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/textpad/edopaieiodmddkbhpkfpjdlcjigacnkf)
~~~
cfontes
Thanks, works like a charm.
------
Cushman
For even more fun, turn your notepad into an interactive JavaScript
environment:
data:text/html, <html contenteditable onkeyup="eval(this.innerText)">
Then you can upgrade it by pasting in something like this:
this.onkeyup = function () {
this.style.backgroundColor = 'white';
try {
eval(this.innerText);
} catch (e) {
this.style.backgroundColor = '#FFAAAA';
}
}
~~~
shurcooL
Is there an equivalent to `this.onkeyup` for touch devices that don't generate
onkeyup events? Trying to make this work on an iPad, but I only have surface
knowledge of JS.
~~~
Cushman
Hmm... I only have an iPad simulator with me, but it works just pasting in
what I wrote above. Maybe something in your data URI is getting munged?
Keyup is used here rather than keypress (which fires only once for each down-
up event) since backspace won't fire keypress events, which is a nice thing to
have in a live environment. But I can't think of any environment which would
implement keypress and not keyup, or how one might work around not having key
events at all.
I did, however, discover that if you alert in mobile Safari (in simulation and
on my iPhone) on a backspace keydown, the keyup never gets through and it will
happily erase everything before the cursor.
~~~
shurcooL
You're right, it works fine with onkeyup. I tried pasting the URL directly
instead of opening from "other devices" and it worked. Thanks.
------
JacobIrwin
After some mix-and-matching of the awesome code snippets posted in the
comments, I came up with something easy on the eyes (with a nice little color
transition (for webkit-enabled browsers):
data:text/html, <html><head><link
href='[http://fonts.googleapis.com/css?family=Lato:100,200,300,400,...](http://fonts.googleapis.com/css?family=Lato:100,200,300,400,700,400italic,700italic)
rel='stylesheet' type='text/css'><style type="text/css"> html { font-family:
"Lato"; color:#e9e9e9; background-color:#222; } * { -webkit-transition: all
linear 1s; }</style></head><body contenteditable style="font-size:2.2em;line-
height:1.4;max-width:60rem;margin:0 auto;padding:4rem;">
~~~
stephth
Thank you. I've tweaked it to my preferences. I've gotten in the habit of
writing with a black on light grey monospaced font. Removing the web font
dependency (and the transition, again matter of taste) made the page snappier.
data:text/html, <html><head><style type="text/css"> html{background-
color:#CCCCCC;font-family: Monaco, Consolas, "Lucida Console", monospace;font-
size:14px;color:#424242;line-height:1.4;max-width:60rem;margin:0
auto;}body{background-color:#F0F1F1;padding:100px;}</style></head><body
contenteditable>Poop.</body></html>
~~~
drharris
Love this version. It's like writing on nice paper.
------
cooop
Forgive me for the shameless plug...but thought this might be useful for other
HNers and related to OP.
I put together a little project that uses the browsers localstorage so you can
jot notes down and come back to them, I find it useful as I'm always in the
browser, hope you do too: <http://a5.gg>
~~~
zevyoura
FYI local storage is not reliable, so you may want to think about a fallback,
or at least putting a disclaimer explaining that what you write will probably
but nitndefinitely still be there when you come back.
~~~
cooop
Good call. I intend it's use to be temporary for that reason e.g. quickly
scribble down a phone number/website/name etc to refer to asap.
~~~
zevyoura
Makes sense, and I like the simplicity of the design quite a bit. Maybe one
way to augment it would be to add a button that throws the content into a
gist/pastebin.something similar, so it could be more easily shared or
preserved? Of course, it's a fine line between that and having social media
buttons all over.
------
JonnieCache
Personally I'm more interested in the concept of typing gibberish to clear
your mind. What particular kind of gibberish? Doggerel verse? Blind keyboard
mashing?
~~~
mikebridgman
I often do an exercise that I've started referring to as a "brain dump".
Sometimes when I feel overwhelmed, for whatever reason, it helps to just
simply start typing. I start by just saying whatever is most present on my
mind, and each new thought starts on a new line. More often than not I end up
drilling down to some kind of inner conflict buried pretty deep in my mind.
What's really amazing is when seemingly unrelated stressful moments in your
life are revealed to be from the same source.
~~~
ChuckMcM
Apropos of nothing I believe this works because it frees up space in your
brain. Sometimes, when I'm trying to get too much done at once, I'm stressed
out by trying to keep to many things in the forefront of my thoughts at once.
When I get stuck like that I create a scratch pad document with three 'zones'
Doing:
stuff I'm working on right now
ToDo:
Stuff that I know needs to get done
Done:
Stuff that is now done.
Start by dumping everything I'm thinking of in 'Todo' and pick one and put it
in Doing and while I'm in the middle of doing it when I think thoughts like
"oh and this should really do x" I add that to the Todo pile and go back to
doing. Each time I finish of the 'Doing' task I scan the todo list, move
anything I need to into Done and pull one up for the Doing pane.
By externalizing the bookkeeping of all the things I'm trying to keep straight
in my head I free up cycles to actually work on something.
~~~
jarel
Did you mean: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanban_board> ?
~~~
ChuckMcM
Nice! I hadn't actually seen that but that is exactly what I mean. Although
rather than help the team be more productive it's to let _me_ be more
productive :-)
~~~
ISL
<http://www.trello.com> ?
~~~
ChuckMcM
Yes, Trello does this pretty well. Not "switch to the buffer in vim" well :-)
but its a great tool. An iPad version would be cool.
------
e1ven
Very clever!
I set this as the default URL for new tabs.. Now, everytime I open a new tab,
I have a quick scratchpad for pasting/testing/etc.
~~~
muzzamike
That's a great idea, did you do it for Chrome? Seems like with Chrome it's
non-trivial to set the page for new tabs...
~~~
stephth
You can set it as the homepage (enableable in Settings). It adds an extra step
after opening a new page (either clicking on the home icon or shift-cmd-h) but
I prefer that to replacing the default Chrome page (with its Most visited and
Recently closed menus).
------
ernestipark
Nifty trick. To build on this, if you use chrome, add it as a search engine
with a special keyword so you can type in your URL bar something like "note +
<ENTER> \+ <TAB>" then you're in typing mode.
~~~
darxius
Yeah this is nifty. For the lazy:
Name: note
Keyword: note
URL: data:text/html, <textarea style="font-size: 1em; width: 100%; height:
100%; border: none; outline: none" autofocus /> %s
Of course, you could change the style of the URL. That's just what I defaulted
to.
~~~
franze
hi, here is my final version i use
name: note
keyword: n
URL: data:text/html, <html><head><script>function placeCaretAtEnd(el) { el.focus(); if (typeof window.getSelection != "undefined" && typeof document.createRange != "undefined") { var range = document.createRange(); range.selectNodeContents(el); range.collapse(false); var sel = window.getSelection(); sel.removeAllRanges(); sel.addRange(range); } else if (typeof document.body.createTextRange != "undefined") { var textRange = document.body.createTextRange(); textRange.moveToElementText(el); textRange.collapse(false); textRange.select(); } }</script><style> html{background-color:#CCCCCC;font-family: Monaco, Consolas, "Lucida Console", monospace;font-size:14px;color:#424242;line-height:1.4;max-width:60rem;margin:0 auto;}body{background-color:#F0F1F1;padding:100px;}</style></head><body contenteditable autofocus onload="placeCaretAtEnd(window.document.body);">we%20did%20this </body></html>
it uses the "paper" look and feed and sets the focus to the end of the
document so that you can just continue writing
------
ajross
> _Sometimes I just need to type garbage. Just to clear out my mind. Using
> editors to type such gibberish annoys me because it clutters my project
> workspace (I'm picky, I know)._
This is a hack and a workaround. The bug is clearly using an editor restricted
to editting files in a "Project Workspace". Yikes.
Everyone has their own workflow, and they're all insane (for myself, I have an
emacsclient wrapper that when called without a file will create a unique name
under ~/.emacsclient-scratch and edit that -- so I never lose anything I know
I was typing at one point). Still... this just seems like a really bad
solution. You get an "editor everywhere" but it's the default editor in your
browser. Ick. It's cute though.
~~~
zrail
That's a really good idea, thanks. I have `e` aliased to `emacsclient -nt` but
there's no reason why it couldn't make scratch files if not given an argument.
------
jnorthrop
That's pretty handy. In Chrome ctrl+b and ctrl+i bold and italics the text
respectively. If I can get bullets that could be a nice replacement for the
text editor I currently use for notes.
~~~
dbh937
At least on OS X, bullets are alt-8. Can't speak for any other OS. Looks like
this: •
------
darxius
Now I just need some javascript to listen for Ctrl+S and save it as a text
file in ~/Documents/scratchpads. Time to get crackin'
~~~
gruseom
How do you save stuff in files from the browser?
I've googled around about this a couple times and not found anything good, so
if anyone can point to some clear documentation I'd appreciate it.
~~~
mmastrac
I'm on mobile so I can write to much accompanying text, but start here:
<http://www.html5rocks.com/en/tutorials/file/filesystem/>
~~~
gruseom
Thanks to both of you. I'll check it out.
~~~
mrcoles
I don’t think that’s going to work, since the data URI is inherently local
(and only works on Chrome), and you can’t use the Chrome file-system API or
even localStorage when you're viewing a local file, unless chrome was opened
with `--allow-file-access-from-files`
------
Too
Nice gimmicky hack but not so practical.
Just pin notepad/your favorite editor to the taskbar(win7+) and open it with
win+shift+[whatever number that corresponds to the position you placed notepad
on the taskbar].
Much faster and much more powerful.
~~~
sturmeh
It's another window which isn't tab-bound to the browser.
~~~
dredmorbius
Oh, you're one of those Mac types.
You should still be able to navigate to that alternate app readily.
I find it easier to navigate to a clearly identifiable text editor session
(Linux) than try to track to a specific tab somewhere within my multiple
browser windows (on multiple workspaces ...).
------
shocks
Very cool.
I like this guys implementation too. <https://gist.github.com/4666256>
Perhaps an implementation with vim bindings support? :D
~~~
jey
I just use a hot key that launches a gvim instance...
------
donniezazen
750 Words[1] is a great tool for clearing your mind.
1\. <http://750words.com/>
~~~
WA
Interesting concept, but Facebook login + my (unique) real name (yes, there's
only one of me in the whole world) + unencrypted PRIVATE journal with
subconscious gibberish + possibly my email address = privacy hell.
I'd rather install this thing on my private webserver.
~~~
donniezazen
The analysis that 750 words does is very unique and interesting. You don't
have to connect it with Facebook or your real name. You may create an
anonymous account. Personal computer are very prone to failure. You will have
to save your information somewhere on the cloud. They all shady. It is a
compromise that you have to make based on your best judgement.
~~~
WA
Look, I wouldn't enter personal data anywhere on the internet. If I write 750
words a day, I write about personal things that could be clearly related to me
(by name or by my company name). I can't take that risk. Not because the guy
behind 750words is not trustable. I don't know him. But because I have no idea
whether or not his webserver is secure enough, whether or not he stores his
FTP password somewhere in plaintext on his mobile or his laptop.
It doesn't have to be him who is the weakest link in that security chain.
What I don't get from your posting is the second part. Personal computers
aren't prone to failure at all. I never had a single HDD crash. I backup my
data on a second HDD just in case. It's incredibly unlikely that my data is
going to be lost and that the cloud is the only solution for that.
So, there's clearly no compromise for me. Rule is: No cloud, no internet
service for private data. And heck, I don't even use any analytics software or
other software on my company website that I cannot self-host.
~~~
donniezazen
I see your problem and I agree with you. I think it's a complex issue. I am
afraid of not backing up. My hard drive or local server might fail and I would
like to keep a copy local and a copy offsite. All offsite vendors are somewhat
shady. At the end of the day, if you use computers connected to Internet, you
make yourself vulnerable of serious attacks. It is far from providing your
data yourself but point is security in a relative term. So, it comes down to
how sensitive is your data and how much you valve it.
------
TerraHertz
It's cute, but I can't help observing that we're what, 70 years into the
computer age, and there's still no ubiquitous, small, fast, clean text editor
present by default on all personal computers. (DO NOT speak to me of
Notepad.exe)
So discovering that 'by accident' web browsers can act as a simple (but huge,
bloated and feature-starved) text editor seems like a big deal.
Personally I keep a simple, tiny, old freeware editor called Editpad 3.4, on
every PC I use, accessed via desktop shortcut and 'right-click send-to'.
~~~
DougBTX
"all" is tricky, there isn't a standard command on all computers to list the
contents of a file, let alone edit. But even my WRT54G has vi installed on it,
and you can expect to find emacs and vim on almost any *nix.
------
mrcoles
I think the best part is how short and elegant it is.
I assume a lot of people won’t realize you can bookmark that URL since it
looks so weird. Also, once you’re bookmarking, you can cheat and put more
logic into the page. I made a slightly improved one with a dark background and
larger font (hard to post the link on HN, so on a separate page):
<http://mrcoles.com/one-line-browser-notepad-bookmark/>
~~~
shmerl
The second scratch+ doesn't work (Firefox 18.0.1).
This one works (# is breaking it really):
data:text/html, <html><head><style>html,body{background:%23111;color:%23fff;font: normal 16px/24px "Helvetica Neue",helvetica,arial;}body{padding:24px 48px}</style></head><body contenteditable><script>document.body.focus();</script></body></html>
------
darxius
You know what's the most amazing about this? The amount of community
collaboration its driven. I saw this post when it was on the "new" page and
had no comments. Coming back a couple hours later, I can see tons of people
doing some tinkering on their own and sharing their finds back here.
I dunno, just something I noticed which I think is completely awesome and
indicative of the benefits of open-source and open-knowledge.
------
msoad
Bookmark this text editor I just made:
* Dark background * Tabs work as they suppose to!
<pre> data:text/html, <style>*{padding:0; margin:0}</style><textarea
style="font-size: 1.5em; width: 100%; height: 100%; border: none; outline:
none; background: #111; color: #eee; padding: 10px;" autofocus
onkeydown="if(event.which==9){ this.value += ' '; return false;}" /> </pre>
~~~
larrys
I like that.
Possible to add a button that brings up the save dialog in a particular
directory (as opposed to cmd-s and choose directory?) Or just the button (just
happen to prefer to cmd key myself)?
------
alpb
Looks more like Notepad with font face attribute.
data:text/html, <html contenteditable style='font-family: monospace'>
------
suyash
Beautiful...what other nifty things can you do except for making the element
'contenteditabe' ?
------
cunninghamd
I do this 2 ways:
1) I have a constant editor opened with a Notes.txt file, so I can save it.
2) I use Sublime Text 2 which maintains the state regardless of whether I've
saved the file or not, and is extremely cross platform.
------
robertomb
<http://dontpad.com> can help you guys! :)
Minimal and disposable browser notepad with friendly URLs being used to
save/password protect files.
------
dag11
The nicest thing about this is that you can CTRL+S save it as a .html file,
and then you can also CTRL+O load the file and it's still editable, and save
it again!
~~~
TerraHertz
Does not work in Opera. If you save as type: text, the text saves OK. But if
you save as html, the file just contains " <html contenteditable>"
Also, HOW to open an existing file while retaining 'contenteditable' mode?
Everything I try alters the URL field, so returning the browser to standard
display-only mode.
------
TerraHertz
It's about 10 years since I did any software development, and I only bother
with surface tracking of web-languages progress. So a lot of this is news to
me. Also maybe some of the posted 'improved versions' provide what I'd like
with this 'contenteditable' thing. It'll take a while to try them all.
Anyway...
So far I don't see one crucial feature: the ability to load an existing file,
and edit it. Am I stupidly missing something 'obvious'?
Being able to edit text and save, but not load existing documents and edit
them makes this a useless novelty.
I did notice one suggestion to load a doc then use a short js command to
switch to contenteditable. But that's not quite there.
Ideally, a browser could be made to work like this:
* Multiple ways to get it started: bookmark, desktop shortcut icon, url to public or private html page containing the config script. Once working like an editor it should stay that way, for multiple file load/saves and multiple tabs open.
* An 'open file' for any existing plaintext or html file, loaded from local filesystem (via file selector popup or bookmark) or the web (type known url or use bookmark).
* Ability to switch back and forth between three modes on the same document: raw plain ascii (no formatting), minimal formatting (B, I, U, bullets), and full html formated display.
* A document 'save as' as plain text (formatting stripped) or html, to the local filesystem, OR (best feature yet) anywhere with write enabled on a public or private web server.
* Nice if also handles encrypted load/save, so the doc is never in plaintext except on the local machine.
With that, the big name 'cloud' services can go take a leap. I could use my
own server(s), or ones I happened to trust. There is flatly no way I would
ever trust large enterprise cloud services.
Also, a tool like that which would allow editing on ANY machine with web
access and local file r/w enabled for the browser, would be very useful for...
things.
It always astonished me that browsers did not provide the capability to
natively edit the html they displayed. Such an obvious need, and you'd think
so simple to implement, that I'd concluded the absence of this ability had to
be a deliberate industry-wide agreed policy of capability avoidance. Which
means, for political reasons.
~~~
sesqu
The File API is still kind of poorly supported, but you could add that
depending on your browser (though you'd want to use an extension, since it'd
be a bit more code).
As for live-editing HTML, that's usually been considered out of scope for a
web browser, and been pushed to authoring or debugging programs. Chrome ships
with their developer console integrated, but IIRC Firefox still relies on
extensions.
~~~
aapl
Firefox now comes with a console, DOM inspector and JavaScript debugger out of
the box.
------
iandanforth
Slightly slower but I use this etherpad clone:
piratepad.net/[gibberishstring]
It's totally public though and there is no way to delete pads, so use with
caution.
------
drucken
Interestingly, NoScript addon for Firefox brings up the following message on
attempting the URL:
_"javascript: and data: URIs typed or pasted in the address bar are disabled
to prevent social engineering attacks. Developers can enable them for testing
purposes by toggling the "noscript.allowURLBarJS" preference."_
------
natural219
I use Workflowy for this. In the url bar, I type:
w <enter>
Or, if you're a a super-organized shortcut-type,
w <enter> <esc> "@misc"
Bonus points -- combine with ctrl+T and ctrl+W for command-line-fu-like syntax
on whichever page you're currently browsing!
~~~
javajosh
I use workflowy too, but I'm not sure what you're talking about. `w <enter>`
is going to send you to the first site with w in the name (which in my case is
'wikipedia.com' - I have to type 'wor' for workflowy.com to be selected).
The `<esc> @misc` part also doesn't make sense. That just does a search for
tags, it doesn't put you in a mode to just write, which is what the OP's
solution does.
Last but not least, a little pro-tip for ya, since you like the command line
(or keyboard shortcuts as they are also called:) : Command-L puts the cursor
in the location bar. So you can do <cmd>+L w <enter>. Also, shift back to a
previous tab with cmd+shift+[ and +].
~~~
natural219
I'm simply describing my workflow -- Workflowy is easily my #1 "w", so that's
why this works for me. Probably not very helpful -- I just thought I'd
illustrate the "exact" same steps I take to achieve the same effect.
Same goes for "@misc". When I want to brain-dump some gibberish, as in the
OP's use case, the @misc tag contains a big dump of stuff that I generally
refine or delete later.
I don't know why I don't use ctrl+l -- i usually use ctrl+e or ctrl+k and then
backspace (why do these do the same thing in chrome?). But yeah, thanks for
the advice.
------
sergiotapia
This + Ruby syntax highlighting.
<https://gist.github.com/4666256>
~~~
minikomi
Thanks for this. Adding ace is a great idea!
~~~
jdkanani
<https://gist.github.com/4670615>
with support for Firefox 18 as well, and It comes with many languages and
themes.
------
homosaur
I'm actually surprised this link got this much traction, I actually thought
this was a thing that most developers were aware of. Shows you that you ought
to reconsider when disseminating information that you as a learned developer
think is "too basic" to bother writing about.
~~~
whichdan
To be fair, I knew nothing about contentEditable until I sat down and tried to
design my own RTE. It's actually very cool how little it takes to develop one
that works, and FontAwesome makes it even easier. I would definitely consider
it obscure.
As an aside, it's really interesting to look at the source for Ace[1]. It
doesn't use contentEditable, but certainly represents the sort of complexity
we'd need without contentEditable available.
[1] <http://ace.ajax.org>
------
symkat
I do this in terminals:
cat > /dev/null
Type whatever you want, then control-D to end.
~~~
oftenwrong
That is a UUOC. This...
> /dev/null
...does the same thing.
~~~
tedunangst
No, it doesn't. It just drops you to another shell prompt.
~~~
jasonm23
Not in zsh it doesn't. (tip: it's a zsh thing.)
~~~
tedunangst
oh, well, unspecified shell snippets are usually assumed to be some bourne
derivative, in which case the cat is necessary.
~~~
jasonm23
Agreed, just adding the caveat.
------
kenshiro_o
Awesome command. Now in Windows I won't have to do Start Key + R, then type
"notepad"...
The browser is the new OS!
------
Freestyler_3
I just hit F4 and click on my notepad. (opera) What's the advantage of this
guys way?
~~~
Tomis02
It's not an advantage, it's catching up.
------
ajanuary
So "data:text/html, " is the new "about:" to do some inline html? Useful to
know.
------
Skoofoo
The contenteditable element is neat for quickly turning HTML elements into a
notepad, but scripting custom functionality into it (creating a header after
pressing enter twice, etc.) was a huge pain in my experience.
------
iso-8859-1
In the summer of 2011 an infinite textarea was posted to HN. You'd be in
replace mode per default, and you could share it by URL. It would
automatically save. I'd be delighted if someone knows its name.
------
_quasimodo
I used to use a similar oneliner:
data:text/html,<textarea style="height:99%;width:100%;" autofocus onfocus="this.value=localStorage['txt']" onchange="localStorage['txt']=this.value;">
------
taylorbuley
Now I just need to code up a quick "send to Gist" bookmarklet and I'm set.
------
ycuser
Nifty code. Nice to know trick. Personally the usefulness ends there. Folks
are adding in just about every little css,js goodies. Internet is an awesome
place to throw a stone and see it gather mass.
------
blisterpeanuts
Thanks for this nice trick. I have Emacs bound to ctrl-alt-E so can pop that
up whenever I need a scratch pad (Linux, obviously), but this is just cool.
I've bookmarked it.
~~~
dredmorbius
Vim for me, but same thing.
Actually, hotkey bindings: vim, terminal, root terminal, mail, web, and bc.
------
Nilzor
But... Why? I know he tried to justify it in his post, but to me, having a
save option FAR outweighs the "benefit" of having your notes in a browser.
~~~
jasonm23
It's almost like it's completely pointless... no?
Coming soon, find out what happens when you 20 GOTO 10!!!
------
gootik
That's a very clever hack! I've also been using this
<http://pencil.asleepysamurai.com/>
------
franze
i didn't know of contenteditable before, so 1000+1 thx. in my job i need to
scribble above existing pages like crazy, so i mashed together this
<https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5140200> \- a one liner / one unicode
icon bookmarklet to liveedit any page.
------
jaxb
There's a similar hack floating around:
javascript:document.body.contentEditable='true';document.designMode='on';void
0
(lets you edit currently loaded page.)
------
maskedinvader
if you want something more like this, chrome notepad [1] seems like a good app
that lets you sync notes across multiple devices using google account sync
1][https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chrome-
notepad/ffb...](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chrome-
notepad/ffbhefmlcoihbjcmibbfkocmnaiacinp)
------
vette982
Extremely useful! I'm getting tired of opening Sublime, TextMate, or even
worse, Notes.app or Stickies.app.
------
shurcooL
I used to do WinKey+R whenever I needed to type or paste some plain text, when
I was using windows.
------
cfontes
We just need to port all Sublime 2 features( 3 maybe) to JS and add as onload
and I am set.
:D
------
PStamatiou
data:text/html, <html contenteditable><script>var t=prompt("what shall we name
this file?","new");document.title=t;</script>
^ you can now hit ctrl+s to save the file with a real name
------
jkd
polished version you can use <https://github.com/tholman/zenpen>
<http://zenpen.io/>
------
pla3rhat3r
This is the best post since Al Gore invented the internet!
------
anxrn
Very neat. Is there a way to only do plain text?
~~~
mmastrac
Try <textarea> instead of <html...
~~~
stevetursi
Thanks. Just expanded on that idea and did one of these: data:text/html,
<textarea style="border: 0px; width: 100%; height: 100%; background-color:
#F8F8F8">
------
malkia
Works on Safari, Chrome, Firefox, but not in IE
------
psteinweber
any ideas how to smartly send the written things to evernote? the webclipper
doesn't work.
~~~
epochwolf
Why don't you just log in to evernote and take a note there?
------
windsurfer
Does anyone else feel wary of typing _any_ data: URIs into their browser? It
might seem safe, but how can you know?
------
shaggyfrog
data:text/html, <html contenteditable>ATARI COMPUTER - MEMO PAD</html>
Ah, much better.
~~~
infinity
Yes :)
I have added some color:
data:text/html, <html contenteditable><body style='background-
color:rgb(0,81,129); color:rgb(93,180,227);font-family:monospace;font-
weight:bold'>ATARI COMPUTER - MEMO PAD</body></html>
------
sea6ear
This is really useful. Thanks.
------
nextstep
Works well on Mobile Safari.
------
icpmacdo
Very cool!
------
adjin
i bookmarked it as 'notes'
------
jQueryIsAwesome
In unrelated news coderwall.com really needs good syntax highlighting. Is
called CODERwall for God's sake.
------
IdealEthos
S.I.T. = Shit Is Tight
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: What do you do when your entire being opposes the task at hand? - septerr
It seems I am fighting with myself. This has happened multiple times and seriously affects the quality of my life.<p>I am assigned a feature to implement, usually vague and something that I feel adds unnecessary complexity to the codebase. I try to reason with my managers, but usually their minds are already made up. I then struggle with finishing this feature, logging hours upon hours against it...not because it takes so long to code, but because I can't make myself do it and waste hours motivating myself to do it. Also I waste considerable amount of time trying to do things in the most readable, maintainable and simple way possible. This means weighing merits of different solutions and choosing one. I am a really hesitant decision maker, resulting in more wasted hours.<p>The haranguing part is that my managers don't fire me. They don't see how many hours I have wasted, how unmotivated I am. Instead they treat me as one of their most valued employees (oh the irony!).
(I am not in a position to change jobs at the moment. I am helping my BF's startup by doing this job.)<p>Have you been in such situations? How do you get in the zone and get it done when your entire being is revolting against the task?
======
ryandrake
Oh boy, so I get to be the contrarian again.
First of all, isn't it a bit dramatic to say "your entire being opposes" your
task? It's not like you're out committing genocide or something. You're
programming, and you have to work on a crappy programming task. Every
programmer who ever worked a professional job has had to do this at some
point. If the very fiber of your soul is wrapped up in your employer's
MegaAccounting Client V3.0 REST API, I'd recommend re-thinking your emotional
attachment to your job.
That money you get every two weeks is called "compensation" because it is
compensating you for your time, which you would probably otherwise spend doing
something more pleasant. This is the realistic world of grown-up work life.
If your company's Marketing bone-head says the customers want a green oval
button instead of a system-standard button, well, it's stupid, but I'd laugh
at how much they're paying to get this ridiculous code written and just write
the damn code. It's really not worth losing sleep or sanity over. Not being
emotionally attached to your work allows you to shrug off the stupid stuff
that Really Doesn't Matter.
~~~
justizin
you come pretty close to invoking godwin's law, here.
if you depend on a place for compensation, then you should be interested in
its' success, and if some bonehead (let's not pick on marketing, since it's
not always them) has a stupid idea, and money is being wasted on you doing
that, it's actually your responsibility to do something about it.
per the law of supply and demand, it's also completely reasonable to leave
them behind. a lot of companies with good ideas fail because they can't retain
talent enough to get any cogent work completed.
"This is the realistic world of grown-up work life."
^^ This is the statement of an unimaginative individual with no creative
juices. I wouldn't employ you to sweep the floors.
~~~
babby
> "This is the realistic world of grown-up work life."
Actually this sounds like a statement from someone who is fulfilled outside of
work, or on different projects within work. I'm of the same opinion. Most
people can't have ann interesting workload, so why does this guy have to be
"unimaginative" and "uncreative"? Why attack anyone for a statement like that?
I'd much rather not work with someone like you.
------
bguthrie
People tend to reserve pair-programming for tasks they perceive as being
unusual, complex, or otherwise needing extra review. Personally, I've found it
can be helpful even when you simply need to stay on task. When you both have
the same goal, you can rally each other; it's typical to become more
productive together than you would have been apart.
If this sounds like it could be your style, grab a buddy and see if you can
hammer out some of the small stuff together. If not, some of the other
suggestions here are good as well.
~~~
fizx
Back when Pivotal Labs largely made prototypes for wealthy people's ill-
conceived ventures (think social networking for dogs), the saving grace was
that you were pairing.
It's amazing how much better a boring project is when the sample files you
upload are image macros with your boss's head photoshopped on a walrus, and
there's someone next to you laughing.
------
jblow
I felt obliged to comment because I feel I know what you are talking about and
I also worry that much of the advice posted so far is wrong at best, dangerous
at worst.
I am 42-year-old very successful programmer who has been through a lot of
situations in my career so far, many of them highly demotivating. And the best
advice I have for you is to get out of what you are doing. Really. Even though
you state that you are not in a position to do that, you really are. It is
okay. You are free. Okay, you are helping your boyfriend's startup but what is
the appropriate cost for this? Would he have you do it if he knew it was
crushing your soul?
I don't use the phrase "crushing your soul" lightly. When it happens slowly,
as it does in these cases, it is hard to see the scale of what is happening.
But this is a very serious situation and if left unchecked it may damage the
potential for you to do good work for the rest of your life. Reasons:
* The commenters who are warning about burnout are right. Burnout is a very serious situation. If you burn yourself out hard, it will be difficult to be effective at any future job you go to, even if it is ostensibly a wonderful job. Treat burnout like a physical injury. I burned myself out once and it took at least 12 years to regain full productivity. Don't do it.
* More broadly, the best and most creative work comes from a root of joy and excitement. If you lose your ability to feel joy and excitement about programming-related things, you'll be unable to do the best work. That this issue is separate from and parallel to burnout! If you are burned out, you might still be able to feel the joy and excitement briefly at the start of a project/idea, but they will fade quickly as the reality of day-to-day work sets in. Alternatively, if you are not burned out but also do not have a sense of wonder, it is likely you will never get yourself started on the good work.
* The earlier in your career it is now, the more important this time is for your development. Programmers learn by doing. If you put yourself into an environment where you are constantly challenged and are working at the top threshold of your ability, then after a few years have gone by, your skills will have increased tremendously. It is like going to intensively learn kung fu for a few years, or going into Navy SEAL training or something. But this isn't just a one-time constant increase. The faster you get things done, and the more thorough and error-free they are, the more ideas you can execute on, which means you will learn faster _in the future_ too. Over the long term, programming skill is like compound interest. More now means a LOT more later. Less now means a LOT less later.
So if you are putting yourself into a position that is not really challenging,
that is a bummer day in and day out, and you get things done slowly, you
aren't just having a slow time now. You are bringing down that compound
interest curve for the rest of your career. It is a serious problem.
If I could go back to my early career I would mercilessly cut out all the
shitty jobs I did (and there were many of them).
One more thing, about personal identity. Early on as a programmer, I was often
in situations like you describe. I didn't like what I was doing, I thought the
management was dumb, I just didn't think my work was very important. I would
be very depressed on projects, make slow progress, at times get into a mode
where I was much of the time pretending progress simply because I could not
bring myself to do the work. I just didn't have the spirit to do it. (I know
many people here know what I am talking about.) Over time I got depressed
about this: Do I have a terrible work ethic? Am I really just a bad
programmer? A bad person? But these questions were not so verbalized or
intellectualized, they were just more like an ambient malaise and a
disappointment in where life was going.
What I learned, later on, is that I do not at all have a bad work ethic and I
am not a bad person. In fact I am quite fierce and get huge amounts of good
work done, _when I believe that what I am doing is important_. It turns out
that, for me, to capture this feeling of importance, I had to work on my own
projects (and even then it took a long time to find the ideas that really
moved me). But once I found this, it basically turned me into a different
person. If this is how it works for you, the difference between these two
modes of life is HUGE.
Okay, this has been long and rambling. I'll cut it off here. Good luck.
~~~
zeteo
> I am 42-year-old very successful programmer who has been through a lot of
> situations [...] Early on as a programmer, I was often in situations like
> you describe. [...] If I could go back to my early career I would
> mercilessly cut out all the shitty jobs I did
You know, it's hard to believe it, but at some point parents forget what it
felt like being a teenager, and senior developers being junior. I know I'm
going hard against the grain here, but I think you're better off doing as
jblow did, not as he says.
Priority #1: survive, life gets better. In any organization that's large
enough to have a pecking order, sh*t rolls downhill. Your CEO meets the
customer's CEO and sees some fish on the office walls. He decides that an
aquatic theme will increase sales, and passes it on to project management. PMs
are slightly bemused, but figure out some web pages that can feature animated
fish, and vet the idea with senior developers, who agree it can be done before
the next trade show. The senior developer creates the fish_type, group_of_fish
and fish_animation tables, grabs a few morsels that are fun to implement (new
web technologies, yay!), and passes the rest to you. Congratulations, you're
the junior developer at the bottom of the scrap heap! You not only have to
deal with all the crap nobody else wanted, but will also explain it as lines
of code to your computer. And, after re-implementing several times to address
all concerns from meetings you were never invited to, it turns out the
customer's CEO had borrowed the office and actually hates fish since choking
on a herring bone 32 years ago.
How do you deal with all this? Well, maybe quitting will find you a better job
as a junior developer. (Also, maybe an uncle you never knew suddenly leaves
you his fortune.) But realistically, the way most people do it is the same as
jblow's. You find ways to survive, improve your resume, and eventually move
uphill to have more choice in kinds of crap you need to deal with. Sharing
your hard-earned wisdom with junior developers will only be the cherry on top
at that point...
~~~
jblow
You are presuming a lot about what my early career looks like. Really I never
worked any jobs as bad as what you describe. Well, maybe the time I did data
entry during my first year of college. The longest I ever worked in a highly
corporate environment was 7-8 months, but at least at that time I was doing
something at least slightly cool (a port of Doom 2 back when that was a new
game, and with which I had full autonomy).
What you seem to assume is normal is some kind of career hell I would never
want to be in (nor have ever been in).
~~~
rturben
I'm someone graduating from college in a few months, and this is one of the
most striking things to me about a programmer's expected outlook on jobs. The
career path of going and getting an internship, then becoming a junior
developer, etc etc at some corporation is something that seems like it would
suck the soul out of anyone that is even moderately creative.
During my first internship at a "normal" corporation, I felt exactly like
septerr does now. I can't imagine following the career path most programmers
go down, even if it is going to pay well. How did you avoid (or is it even
possible to avoid) going through that corporate phase and skipping right to
working on something that you may love but may harbor more intrinsic risk?
~~~
nostrademons
For me, it came from understanding what I did not know, and that to do high-
level creative work you need a large base of background knowledge. I just took
every job as an opportunity to learn and fill in the gaps in my knowledge, so
that I'd be better prepared when I did strike out on my own.
I have gaps in between every job I've ever held, but those gaps are strategic.
In them, I figure out what I really want to do, and whether I have the tools
to do what I really want to do. I applied to YC's first class of S05, as I was
finishing up college. I didn't get in. I figured that if investors wouldn't
talk to me, I'd learn how to do a bootstrapped startup, so I went to work for
a bootstrapped financial software startup. After 2 years there, I quit and
founded my own bootstrapped startup, this time in Web 2.0 casual games. It
failed too. In examining the failure, I figured that I lacked enough real-
world experience to understand what the real markets were, I'd exhausted my
pool of potential co-founders, and I had this continuing anxiety about how to
do software development "the right way" and make programs that scale. So I
moved out to California to work for Google Search. I'm on my own again, but I
got everything out of Google that I hoped to get out of it (and more!).
If you're doing it right, each job is an opportunity to get a lot more than
money. It's a chance to build technical experience, to challenge yourself, to
look at how people with way more experience than you make decisions, to
understand how an industry works, and to see how an organization fits
together.
~~~
edanm
This is a _very_ insightful comment, and I hope everyone reads it.
It reminds me of my favorite quote from one of the _best_ books about building
any type of "Professional Services" company:
"The health of your career is not dependent so much on the volume of business
you do, but the type of work you do (whether or not it helps you learn, grow
and develop), and who you do it for (whether or not you are increasingly
earning the trust of some key clients). In any profession, the pattern of
assignments you work on _is_ the professional development process - you just
have to learn how to manage it."
------
rockdoe
_Also I waste considerable amount of time trying to do things in the most
readable, maintainable and simple way possible._
Is _waste_ really the right word here?
_They don 't see how many hours I have wasted, how unmotivated I am. Instead
they treat me as one of their most valued employees (oh the irony!)._
"When given a vague, annoying feature to implement, very carefully considered
approaches and built it in a surprisingly readable and maintainable way"
What you're experiencing isn't atypical - sometimes programming something
sucks! Your employer values your ability to power through it and still get
good results.
------
mnw21cam
Yes, I left such a position to go and get a doctorate, because I was fed up
with the dumbing-down of the codebase, the way that my colleagues wrote
absolute undocumented spaghetti cruft, I had to keep fixing their bugs, and
management were making some very dumb decisions about key features. As far as
I know they are still going fine, which is surprising given I was the only one
who could understand how whole subsystems worked, mainly because I knew how to
write safe threaded code.
But, enough on that. A few years before then, I _felt_ like you did, but I
wasn't actually in that situation. There is a very real positive feedback loop
in effect - you feel like you're doing a bad job, so work longer hours on it,
end up taking longer, feeling like you have "wasted" hours, and feel worse
about doing a bad job.
Believe your employers when they say you are doing great, otherwise you're
likely to be heading down the burnout route which had me off sick for half a
year. It's not every coder that has such high standards as you, and that is
not something to be ashamed of. Be proud of the code that you have produced.
Think to yourself "It's just as well I wrote this bit, because if X had, it
would have been awful".
I know this sounds like extreme arrogance, however sometimes it is necessary
for the purposes of regaining balance. It sounds like you are being a little
too humble. If it gets too bad though, get some help from someone.
~~~
jerf
Something else that can help is that once you've learned how to write clean,
safe, reusable code, the next step is learning when _not_ to. Clean code is an
expense, and there's times to put in the extra effort, and there's times to
not. Code's needs are not evenly distributed, in fact they are _very_ unevenly
distributed (power law distribution I suspect without proof)... carefully
crafting to the n-th degree an end-user GUI page for a marginal feature is
probably a waste of time, just make it work. On the other hand, adding a hack
to a core routine used by huge swathes of the code may have much bigger
negative effects than it even feels like now, and it sounds like it already
feels pretty bad.
Consider working on the next level and using this as a chance to study when
and where the effort is actually worth it. It may _feel_ like you're handing
yourself a license to be sloppier, but if done correctly this actually turns
you into an _even more_ capable developer than someone who finely engineers
everything, because you'll have that much more time to finely engineer the
things that matter once you clear away the time of fine engineering of the
things that don't, and on the whole you'll be creating much more value in your
code.
~~~
jafaku
I wouldn't mind writing unclean code if I weren't the one who's going to have
to maintain it and add new features to it in the near future or the years to
come.
~~~
jerf
This is part of what I mean by learning when it is and is not appropriate; I
tried to make it clear it was not a blanket permission slip to be sloppy
(anticipating that obvious misunderstanding of my point). If you end up having
to seriously maintain "unclean" code, you did it wrong. You _will_ do it wrong
before you get the hang of it, no sarcasm. Untrained gut intuitions are not
very reliable here, and the only training available is practice.
And on the other hand, "maintain" is a very ambiguous word. If you are
frustrated because it took you ten minutes to add one field to a form, once in
the course of 3 years (to put some concrete numbers on for example's sake),
you _still_ came out ahead not spending an additional 10 hours polishing the
code to a fine sheen, so you could be happy adding that one field 3 years
later and saving that ten minutes. If you're frustrated because you actually
have to overhaul it significantly, and it's a mess, and now you've also
dropped all your context and can't remember what is what at all, and you could
have cleaned up up three years ago in three hours and now lose two weeks just
to understanding what the hell, then you've lost, yes. And of course
"maintain" can mean a lot more than either of those two cases, too.
And as a final note, it's all gambling, and that is also something you must
come to grips with. You don't really _know_ where the changes are going to be
in three years. However, you can learn to guess with a success rate much
higher than mere random chance. (Don't forget to discount future time
appropriately.)
------
loumf
You can add meaning to your work by picking goals and accomplishing them. It
doesn't matter what they are -- just as long as they can be accomplished and
you know that you did.
Pick things that incidentally accomplish the assigned goal. For example,
1\. Pick an amount of time, like 3 hours, repeat this cycle
2\. make a branch
3\. implement the feature in the fastest way you can
4\. think about why this isn't acceptable
5\. throw away the branch
6\. do it again avoiding one thing that made the last one crappy
Also, weighing merits of different solutions and picking one is your job -- no
need to feel bad about that. Come up with an assessment tool that will help
you decide. Time-box decision making, but don't stop thinking about your
solution -- just give it the appropriate amount of time, not unbounded.
Making progress is motivating. You want to end up at the same place but have
the feeling of progress making throughout the process. I believe that it's
possible you are taking the appropriate amount of time to do the work at hand,
but you are getting into an anxiety/depression cycle because you can't get
into a flow state.
------
ollieglass
As a manager I've had to ask people to do work like this. I try to share it
out as best as possible, so everyone's getting the least unpalatable tasks for
them. I've also made myself available to talk through why it's required.
Those conversations have taken my team and I to interesting places. I've
discussed brand positioning with developers, and shared spreadsheets of time-
to-value models with designers, at times going far outside of people's skill
sets and comfort zones. If someone insists a piece of work is a bad idea, I
invite them to argue against it but insist that I need them to make their case
rigorously. Sometime they'll convince me, sometimes they don't want to work
through the reasoning, sometimes I'll try and develop their case and argue
against myself. I want to reach a position where we either change the task, or
we're both satisfied that the task should be done. If that's too hard, then
I'm after a position where they at least have rational faith in my request and
my reasoning, and are ok to do the work on trust.
I spend a lot of time on this, for a few reasons.
First, I don't want to ask anyone to do something meaningless. Burnout isn't
caused by workload. Workload causes exhaustion. Burnout is caused by
resentment. If my team resent their work, that's a deep and important problem.
I'll tolerate a only very small amount of that, but I'll let everyone know I'm
conscious of it, don't like it, and am working to get away from it. Burnout is
toxic and damaging to people and the group as a whole.
And secondly, this kind of explanatory work strengthens everyone's investment
in the team and the work. It strengthens the team's ability to think together.
As people become better informed, all of our discussions become richer and
more valuable. People enjoy the work more, and can relax and trust each other
more, knowing that decisions are made in ways they can understand and agree
with.
Finally this is also a litmus test for me. If a company won't let me in on
it's decision making, dismisses my concerns as unimportant and tells me to
just get on with something, they're indicating they don't value the team in
the same way I do.
~~~
gknoy
As others have said, thank you for articulating this so well. As a developer,
I've often gotten feature requests which seem crazy at first, but then make
sense once I understand better the context in which it will be used or the
degree to which it will make a customer or other user happy.
At the same time, it's really valuable to have a manager (and other
stakeholders) who listen to the "This __really__ complicates our code and will
take X weeks to implement, why don't you try this as a procedural workaround
..." suggestions that I make at times.
I really agree with your point that this type of thing strengthens my
investment in the team and the product.
------
martin-adams
I can identify a few times I've experienced having something vague and complex
thing to work on. If I were in your situation I'd look at the following...
1\. If I'm working on something vague, try to extract more information about
it. It's very hard dealing with frequent changes on a complex code base. I'd
try to find out who the stakeholders are, customer is, and most importantly,
what they are trying to achieve that this serves.
2\. Break it down into smaller tasks and measure myself against these. I want
to leave work having completed something and not return to work knowing I
didn't complete something.
3\. Try bringing a colleague in to help you, such as talking through the
existing code and bouncing ideas off them. The energy a colleague puts in can
help with motivation.
4\. Make sure there is an end to it and that it's not an open scope. You'll
never finish something if the stakeholder doesn't know what they actually
want.
5\. If this looks like it's the norm and you're not happy, while you say you
can't change jobs now, put the plan in motion for when you can. Think about
your CV, learning new things, etc that help. When the time is right you want
to be ready to jump.
6\. Get enough sleep. I find I procrastinate more when I'm tired. Of course,
eat healthily and exercise.
7\. Try to remove other distractions, such as any other commitments at work as
a 10 minute interruption can cost you an hour if you're not in the flow of the
work.
~~~
rookonaut
In addition to this excellent post, try to use the five minutes rule. When you
need to tackle an undesirable task, tell yourself that you'll try it for five
minutes. After you got started, you will lose the five minutes mark out of
sight and you already mastered the hardest part - getting started.
------
eduardordm
Hi,
I'm a manager, and sometimes I feel like you. Sometimes I need to ask
developers to do things I don't believe in or things I'll throw away in a few
months. This also demotivates me. You need both a lot of discipline and just a
bit "aloofness" to keep going. Care less about those tasks, think about
friday.
If your managers are any good, they know you have wasted hours, they know you
are unmotivated, and they know those meaningless tasks are the reason, this is
why you are a valued employee. I'd rather argue to death with an employee
because he thinks his idea is best for the company than one that will just
accept any task like a robot. But sometimes you have to implement ridiculous
things into software, from clients being just crazy or because of some strange
contract clause. This is when discipline kicks in. Such situations shouldn't
happen often, but if they are, that's when you should move on.
You don't need to get "in the zone" to get the job done. Just start by doing
smaller pieces, put your headphones on. You could just ask why feature is
being built, but I doubt knowing the reason will motivate you at all.
------
binarymax
It sounds like symptoms of burnout. I am not an expert but I have personally
suffered from burnout before...and it took me a while to get over it. It
sounds like you are additionally hampered due to being personally obligated.
As far as I know the only way to get over burnout is to stop. If you do not
you will suffer more. I wish I had better news.
~~~
AUmrysh
Yeah, I've been there and felt the same way. Your best bet is to either find a
different job, or one thing that can help a lot is just take a vacation. I was
working on a project for months and months, and every few months some new
requirements would appear. It's easy to feel unappreciated at a point like
that. What really helped me was taking time off and working from home. A week
or two of relaxing can really help you jump back into your dreaded project
with a fresh perspective and not feel burned out.
~~~
agon
I agree, this is primarily why I'm leaving my current position for a company
with realistic expectations. I've had months without a single day off working
60 - 90 hour weeks every week because they refuse to compromise with deadlines
or adding additional developers. I'm planning on taking a few weeks between
jobs to just unwind so I'm not frazzled for the next position.
------
djeebus
First and foremost, remember that you're writing code to bring in customers.
Your codebase can be beautiful, pragmatic, semantic, and have 100% test
coverage; if you don't have any customers, you don't have anything.
"Unnecessary complexity to the codebase"
It depends on what you mean by unnecessary. If you mean "won't bring in
anymore customers", have that conversation with your managers. Not all of them
are brilliant, and no one gets it right 100% of the time. If you can prove
that the feature doesn't provide value, have that conversation with them.
On the other hand, if your boss ignores your input, and you're 1000% sure that
there are other features that are more valuable to your business than the one
in question, you can always push that one to the back and work on something
that's more productive to the company. Depending on your political and
professional circumstances, your boss may not notice or care, and their boss
may forget about their red herring feature; you might be able to side-step the
conversation altogether. This will only work if there's more than a few items
on your plate that need to get done soon, and this feature can get pushed
aside without delaying or blocking anyone else.
Bear in mind that if you go this route, you're putting yourself, your career,
and your neck on the line. If it turns out that it wasn't a good idea and
everyone agree with you, you'll look like a genius and gain some clout as a
clairvoyant; if it turns out it was seriously necessary, you'll look like
someone who pouts when they don't get their way. Either way your boss may also
hold a grudge. I'm not saying it's the greatest way to go, just adding it as
an option. It's helped me more than a few times in my career, but it's also
frustrated my bosses a few times. Be gracious if you're shown wrong though,
and quick to admit defeat if it's obvious you chose the wrong path, and you
should be fine no matter what happens.
------
ChuckMcM
Time to gently move on to something else. There is a secret they don't tell
you early enough, there is no "prize/goal/win" at the end of your life, you
just die. Your life is the sum total of all the time you spend with friends
and family and colleagues. And every day of that life you spend fighting
yourself is a day you will never get back, you will never be able to change,
and you will never cherish.
Dealing with a rough situation that you have no external control over is one
thing, dealing with a lousy job you do have control over it. Let go, walk out
the door, and look for something more fulfilling.
------
snorkel
Why would your managers fire you?
Your managers demanded a stupid feature, and you took long time implementing
the stupid feature due to its complexity.
The only thing missing is you need to warn your managers before you start
coding such as "This is going to take long time due to the complexity, many
many weeks. Also I don't think it's right for the product either."
As long as expectations are clear beforehand, and you met those expectations,
then no one is getting fired, and therefore you should relax and enjoy coding
Easter Eggs into each shitty feature.
------
Jean-Philipe
Unless it's morally against my ideals, like violating privacy, stealing money
from kids with phones, etc., I don't see that many problems with features I
don't agree with. They want it, they pay, why not? Surely, if it was my own
company or a team I'd value, then I'd hesitate to implement that feature and
argue with everybody about it. But at some point, I leave the project and once
I don't I own it anymore, I don't have problems with features I don't like.
That is, unless they tell me /how/ to solve the task.
What helps me most is finding a technical challenge that makes the feature
interesting and fun to implement. This shouldn't be too hard, if you are free
to design the feature technically. Hope that little hack helps you getting
things done.
------
orky56
It seems your internal struggle about your perceived inefficiency is burning
you out. Rightfully so if you are wasting time on what's not particularly
important. Do your managers value the quality of your work as much as you do?
If not, do you think you'd be able to live with a slightly lower quality
deliverable that frees you from the stress? Perhaps it would allow you to work
on that feature you do want to work on.
We have a right to be happy. We should make decisions that satisfy the
majority of our lives and where do what we love. For things not under our
control, we still need to love what we do.
The easiest solution to your problem is creating discipline and decisiveness.
When you give yourself more hours to work than you are expected to, you create
a vacuum of inefficiency. You work unsustainably on things of little value.
Instead I would force you to a) figure out your success criteria, b) what are
those steps, c) prioritize those steps, and most importantly d) set time
limits for each of those steps. The constraint of time will force you to get
to the 80% quickest. I have written some articles on these exact problems and
in the process of creating an app with those insights. Feel free to read more
here: [https://medium.com/produce-
productivity/ee13c1600b6b](https://medium.com/produce-
productivity/ee13c1600b6b)
------
gknoy
> I am assigned a feature ... that I feel adds unnecessary complexity > [My]
> managers ... minds are already made up.
One of the things that I found helped me the most when dealing with features
like this is to Let Go of Caring about that particular thing. We fight for
what we believe is best, but when a customer, manager, or other higher-ranking
stakeholder decides otherwise, it's out of our hands. You did your
professional duty by arguing for the Better way (as you see it), but now it's
time to make the new direction work.
UX team decides buttons should be the way that pisses you off the most? It's
OK, you're not the main user. Manager decides that a "Calculate" button is
better than auto-re-calculating? That's ok: the users are happier using that.
(We can transition later.) They want an e-mail based workflow for approving
things, rather than a web-based one? That's OK: these execs spend most of
their time with their phones, and don't want to be logging into the website.
Often what we feel is "unnecessary complexity" is a workaround for a key use
case that we didn't realize, or yields customer happiness because it's what
they asked for. In that case, it's __necessary__ complexity, just like a bit
of ugly code that patches a bug. Try looking at it from the perspective of the
user or the manager, and really understand why they feel it is important --
quite often, it's addressing a weakness of your software product that you were
not aware of, or which you felt was unimportant.
------
adrnsly
I know the exact feeling you're talking about - I used to work at a wonderful
small dev shop where things moved fast; whole projects were wrapped off in a
week or two.
Until this one project where we were asked to 'fix' an already written Android
app (written by an Indian outsource then sent to Canada). The contract was for
a massive amount of money, everything looked clear cut and straight forward,
how could we say no?
For almost 7 months (!!!) my team and I had endless meetings next to a wall
map containing the 5000+ classes that each had to be dissected, understood and
reimplemented properly. All the comments were in at least two different
foreign languages, and even the best translation services (human included)
could only give us at best translations like: 'not class, forwards' or 'use
brick making way here', most likely due to the comments being poor in their
original language in the first place (not due to the translation).
At first I had great momentum, I was an unstoppable force; then quickly things
started slowing down - each task started taking hours longer, than days
longer, than weeks longer. Ultra trivial fixes like the placement of one
statement outside a try catch, could easily take a whole month to locate (by a
team of 4!).
After pouring my heart and soul into this project day after day, grinding
myself literally to the bone; I started getting depressed, physically sick to
my stomach for days at a time, starting fights with co-workers over absolutely
nothing, just so I wouldn't have to look at that fucking code one more time.
Anything to just not look at that code one more time.
By the end of the project (which we did actually manage to complete), I was
waiting for that moment of euphoria, that release of completion, that I would
never ever again need to look at that code, or work on that project.
But it didn't come.
I was paid more than 100k for completion of the project, so I was well
reimbursed for my time.
That's when I realized that it's really not about the money, it's not about
the team, or the language; It's not about your repo, or your source control
techniques. It's not about agile, and it's not about problem solving. It's not
about working from an office or from home, and it's not about the mother
fucking 'culture'.
When you're lying on your death bed, and you look back; will you be proud that
you spent all that time and suffering to fix an app for some asshole who is
trying to make a quick buck by exploiting people who aren't technologically
wise enough to realize what they are doing?
The next day my boss asked to meet with me privately; thinking I would be
fired (and happy with the idea) we met briefly at a local coffee shop. She
said that all the anger, depression, and self loathing was 'worth it' because
'I made a lot of people rich' in the process (myself included) and they were
happy to deal with that (and even to pay for therapy).
I was offered EVEN MORE money to continue working on projects exactly like
these, to the company we had just discovered a cash cow of an app crop, and I
was the golden goose. I could easily do this the rest of my life, and lead
whatever life I wanted to outside of work.
I quit on the spot, and laughed and cried the whole way home. Knowing that I
would be blackballed in the community that I had worked so hard to establish
myself in.
Literally career suicide. The company didn't recover, and a lot of people were
(and still are very pissed off with me - like angry emails, restraining
orders, fucking pissed).
I promised myself that from now on I would only do work that I believed in
enough to starve to death for (and it was looking for a long time like that
was going to be the case). The truth is, if you want a job where you can make
6 figures (or even 7 if you're doing it right), you will find it. You will
always find it, and they will always be there.
There is a vacuum of talent on the community of expert programmers caused by
major corporations like ibm, amazon, facebook, twitter, and snapchat just
filling up cubes in their 'programmer cluster'. A group of people they can
throw whatever stupid, or trivial tasks at - and you won't say shit, because
damn that pay is tasty. You're breaking peoples rights to privacy, doing WAY
less than ethical things, and you probably don't even know it (because that's
how it's supposed to work, or someone else above you clearly isn't doing their
job).
My only advice is to get the fuck out. Run, run as fast as you possibly can
and never look back.
Never respond to any recruiters for any reason, never respond to job offers,
and don't even think about looking for another position at another company (I
promise it's the same thing, no matter how they promise you otherwise, and
tell you that their culture is the dopest - nothing like clubbing seals with
some rad people right?).
Get off your ass, and do something worthwhile. If you can't do that, then
learn how. If you can't do that, then you're a drone and you should keep that
shitty job because it's the best you're ever going to do (in which case, fuck
you, you make the world a worse place for everyone by whoring your skills out
to unethical assholes for cash).
Make something that garners zero profit, make something that only helps
people, make something that changes the world for the better. You will quickly
see your entire world, and all the people in it change before you eyes. You
will get more job offers in your inbox than spam, because the world will see
that you don't give a fuck about anything but getting shit done and helping
people.
Today I run a few companies, the largest of which is a NPO machine learning
research firm offering free services to help cure cancer, track missing
children, follow and assess viral outbreaks, and front line ML research
pushing the needle of science forward (email: [email protected] for
services); and some of the others include: organic vegetable gardening as a
service (physical outdoor labour, everyday, which I enjoy more than anything)
and free apps that assist paramedics and doctors (without ads or bullshit).
If you want to be happy, like, really, actually happy (and not just wealthy)
you're going to have to risk it to get the biscuit; and it's going to be the
hardest battle you've ever fought in your entire life, by at least a few
magnitudes.
Good luck, it's a jungle out there.
~~~
d0m
Wasn't it possible to create the exact apps from scratch? You get to pick the
technology you like, you don't have to waste time understanding and
refactoring those stupid classes.. Sometimes, from scratch means faster,
easier, cheaper. There's a famous Joel Spolsky post where he argue that you
should never start from scratch.. but that sounds like a case where it would
have been worth.
~~~
innguest
On the other hand, Alan Kay argues you should start the same project from
scratch every 3 months. :)
------
flipped_bit
Welcome to programming!
"Also I waste considerable amount of time trying to do things in the most
readable, maintainable and simple way possible"
Motivation is tied to your attitude here as you are looking to do more
'interesting' work, whereas the task at hand looks boring. However the task at
hand could be important for the company, so it is important to take trouble
understand the big picture here. Most engineers (and I am one of them) are too
self-centered to do this, and this can be debilitating.
It involves coming out of your shell, being proactive to talk to the business,
product and other areas and see why these set of features that needs to get
done has important implications.
At the end of the day, everything is about service. If you enhance your
attitude to think more in a service-oriented way (it is not all about you),
this changes your 'attitude profile', and in turn can boost your motivation
factor by several orders. Suddenly what looked boring becomes very important.
It may mean to be more pragmatic ( no ideological fixations on 'purity of
code'), roll up your sleeves and get it done.
The valuable service to the customer, can lead into repeat business, which
adds to the bottom line, and that later could mean more bonus for you, which
you can use it up for that special time with your BF that you have been
planning for a while.
------
swalsh
You might be burning out, and not even realize it. I've been in a similar
situation. The unmotivated mindset leads to additional hours compounding the
effects.
My suggestion go on a vacation, if it doesn't get better... leave. You say
you're not in a position to leave... but you have to, because its not going to
get any better. You're not really doing anyone a favor by burning yourself out
for them.
------
incision
1.) Doing things you don't want to do, but are necessary for a paycheck or
otherwise is a basic part of being a grown-up. Lacking the discipline to
simply get such things done and move on is a huge handicap as it's burning
loads of time and energy that could be better spent elsewhere.
2.) This is surely arguable, but I think agonizing over a lack of
satisfaction/motivation in a job is likewise a waste of time. If you can get
those things at work, great - if not, don't try to force it - redirect it to
side projects, friends, family or hobbies.
3.) Life is really short and full of trade-offs. Be sure to regularly re-
evaluate your position or you might find yourself stuck rather than simply
compromising.
_> 'How do you get in the zone and get it done when your entire being is
revolting against the task?'_
Through each of the things I described above. Whenever necessary I remind
myself that:
* I'm a provider and professional, my family depends on me and I'm paid to do good work - getting this done is not optional.
* My time is short, delay buys me nothing.
* I have no shortage of great things to look forward to when I'm done.
~~~
ChristianMarks
"1.) Doing things you don't want to do, but are necessary for a paycheck or
otherwise is a basic part of being a grown-up. Lacking the discipline to
simply get such things done and move on is a huge handicap as it's burning
loads of time and energy that could be better spent elsewhere."
Realizing that changing your environment so that it encourages the right
outcome is orders of magnitude beyond being a basic, mediocre grown-up who
relies on discipline and will power, which is easily depleted, to overcome an
onfavorable environment. No one should settle for relying on discipline and
will power. That's a moralizing exercise in futility. I've had this argument
with my stepfather until he became abusive. The result: I stopped talking with
him. It has been one year. Reserve your discipline for differential
association and for improving your environment.
~~~
incision
My third point addressed this and the OP pre-emptively stated he/she isn't
open that at the moment.
_> 'I've had this argument with my stepfather until he became abusive.'_
That's not terribly surprising given your selective comprehension and tendency
to speak in absolutes [1][2][3][above] about who other people are or what they
should do.
Chill out.
1:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7451659](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7451659)
2:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7486177](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7486177)
3:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7452011](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7452011)
------
makmanalp
Mark Twain is rumored to have said something along the lines of "Eat your
frog" (it may be apocryphal, but whatever:
[http://quoteinvestigator.com/2013/04/03/eat-
frog/](http://quoteinvestigator.com/2013/04/03/eat-frog/)). The point is that
you should get up in the morning and make a point of doing the worst, most
boring, most disgusting task you can think of. And don't think too hard, just
get it done. You can decide whether to improve on it later. Then, the rest of
the day, you'll be freed of all the worry, wallowing and indecisiveness.
The other thing is that if they value you, it's probably for a reason. You're
fulfilling their expectations and providing them with value. Take the
compliment and go with it!
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impostor_syndrome](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impostor_syndrome)
------
buckbova
When this happens to me I take the time to refactor all sorts of
"dependencies" in the process. It ends up being a net positive. Yeah, I added
some complexity where it wasn't needed in one area but I've removed some
legacy code or redesigned an ugly hack.
They don't know this code is generally unrelated or don't complain to me about
it. Only problem with this is I can now be opening up new bugs because these
revisions aren't always fully QA'd.
------
Rudism
I'll throw my hat in with the folks who are saying to get out early before you
find yourself in the midst of a truly debilitating burn-out.
That being said, I've worked a couple jobs in the past where I felt similarly
to you--one of which I objected to much of what I was working on not only from
a utility standpoint, but from a moral/ethical one as well. The only thing
that kept me going was the social network I built of similar-minded coworkers.
The ability to vent, joke, and commiserate with people who felt the same way I
did at the company was extremely cathartic and served as my therapy. I don't
think that's a good substitute for getting out and finding something else that
you actually enjoy, however, which I eventually did when I realized how it was
affecting my mood even outside of work.
------
CaRDiaK
I get like this more often than I like to admit. I just break the entire thing
down and write a multitude of check box's. Personally I'm using the
bulletjournal technique (www.bulletjournal.com)
If I cant get the motivation then I need more abstraction. Abstract until you
drop! You are naturally conditioned towards completing things and positivity.
That's why people get badly addicted to games like farmville and such. You do
something simple, you get something back, you do something else, you get
something else. Really your just baking time. But the psychology of achieving
is where the addiction comes from. It's not the game. It's the fulfilment from
completing something. You need to see this progress visually so you feel like
your moving.
It's not uncommon for me (when I'm really low and scraping the barrel) to have
a task like for a job such as this;
[ ] Open Sublime [ ] Set-up folder structure [ ] Skim read spec [ ] note areas
of concern for later [ ] Describe required method to self / colleague / rubber
duck [ ] pseudo code initial method [ ] expand pseudo to code [ ] looks in
spec for extra details [ ] list who needs to be contacted for further
information [ ] email manager estimate [ ] take a break ...
Now you can start to get "little wins" even on something you don't really
agree with / want to do. The goal now becomes to tick those damn boxes, not to
implement some feature you don't agree with. It might seem strange to tick a
box for something as simple as opening a program, but if that's the level you
need for your motivation then that's OK. The reality is these check box's are
just mental milestones for progression. What's really important is your
ticking them though. If you find yourself for hours on end not doing the list,
the list is wrong somehow. Perhaps you don't have small enough tasks. Perhaps
the tasks are too hi level and need to be split into sub tasks on those. Just
tick, tick, tick.
Try it, it might work for you, it might not. This sure helped me though! Good
luck.
------
neverminder
I'm in a state that you've described pretty much every day. This is reality
I'm afraid. Only the best of the best of us get to choose what they want to
do, the rest are having a hard time surviving most of the time. I work in a
software company and absolute majority of my coleagues are not interested in
technology at all. Some of them sit on the same chairs for 15 years turning
some ridiculous specs into useless code. As soon as the clock strikes 5 they
get up from their chairs and proceed to the exit with unchanged zombie faces.
I can swear I saw cows doing that somewhere in the countryside. I spend all
the spare time I have to get as good as I can so that I could eventually not
be ignored anymore and find a job that I would really like.
~~~
embwbam
You can do it! Keep learning and switch jobs as soon as you can. You don't
have to switch to your dream job right away, just trade up a little at a time.
You'll learn even faster at the next one.
------
ScottBurson
_Also I waste considerable amount of time trying to do things in the most
readable, maintainable and simple way possible. This means weighing merits of
different solutions and choosing one. I am a really hesitant decision maker,
resulting in more wasted hours._
This time is not entirely wasted. Even in the worst case -- where the code you
are so carefully writing winds up not being used after all -- you are getting
good practice in code craftsmanship. The next time you are faced with a
decision similar to one you are making now, you will make it more easily: not
only have you considered the issues before, but you know how one of the
possibilities actually worked out. This is how one builds experience.
I usually find that writing code slowly and carefully is in fact the fastest
way to get it done, because it minimizes debugging and rewriting. There are
exceptions, such as exploratory programming, when you know you're going to
throw the thing away anyway, and in small utilities built for personal use;
and there are times when getting something working quickly is important (for a
demo, for instance) even though you know you'll have to rewrite it. But these
are exceptions. When you're implementing important functionality that's going
to be in the product for the foreseeable future and that others will have to
maintain and build on, the slow, careful way is best.
It seems to me the real problem here is that although your managers value your
work, they don't listen to your architectural opinions. That's a serious
problem. Maybe at some point you'll need to tell them, "if you want it done
that way, you'll have to find somebody else to do it". Pick your battle
carefully though -- it needs to be a case where their way is clearly and
substantially suboptimal.
------
stopachka
The biggest thing you can do is to align yourself as working together with
your managers. You are not a code monkey.
What does this mean?
Well, if they assign you a vague task, you get clearer about it, you ask them
why they want to do it, what the objective is. A lot of the time, you could be
wrong, and with their objective it makes sense. A lot of the time you'll be
right. The best way to show it is to mock it up, and explain your thinking on
why it's wrong.
The biggest killer is when you feel like a code monkey, it's usually not the
work.
------
zawaideh
Every job has some aspect of it that you will resent, and we've written about
it on our blog ([http://blog.sandglaz.com/how-to-do-tasks-you-simply-
resent-d...](http://blog.sandglaz.com/how-to-do-tasks-you-simply-resent-
doing/http://blog.sandglaz.com/how-to-do-tasks-you-simply-resent-doing/)).
I've been there before, and had some periods of time at a previous position
where it felt like every minute of the job was a struggle. Getting things
started was the most difficult for me, but once they were started, I could get
them done.
If this job is just to pay the bills, and is not critical for your career,
then: * Work on autopilot. Do what is required of you, and use some of your
time on the job to learn things that would advance your career. For example,
for each 4 hours worked, allow yourself an hour of learning something new to
advance your career. * Find outside activities that you look forward to each
day. Don't let the job define who you are. If you do, it could crush you. *
Since they value you, ask to work reduced hours if possible. The less time you
need to commit to the job, the less likely you are to burn out.
However, I can't help but recommend that you stay on the look-out for a job
that brings you satisfaction and challenges you to do your best everyday.
~~~
zawaideh
link is broken: [http://blog.sandglaz.com/how-to-do-tasks-you-simply-
resent-d...](http://blog.sandglaz.com/how-to-do-tasks-you-simply-resent-doing)
------
moron4hire
Actually, you could probably quit and it wouldn't be as big of a deal as you
expect. Most people over-estimate the risk of quitting. And most people are a
lot more understanding than we give them credit for.
Every time I've reached that point that you have described, I've quit. It was
the best thing for me every time, too. There is no point wasting your time
doing something you don't want to do, _especially_ if it's for someone you
care about. You'll just do a shitty job and you don't want to dump shitty jobs
on people you care about.
Is it just that the work is boring, or are you being asked to do unethical
things? I mean, either way, I would quit, but if it's anything unethical I
would urge you to run as fast as possible.
However, if it's just "boring" work, perhaps recasting it in a different light
might help. Look at it as a game of seeing how many you can finish in a single
week. Stop worrying about doing the "best" job on it. If the project is so
boring to you, then you probably shouldn't care so much about the quality of
it. Just dump out some garbage, get the checkboxes filled, see how much you
can get away with. Make it a learning experience, a chance to test your
boundaries.
~~~
mnw21cam
The other point is that if this is your BF's project, you are in serious
danger of building up a load of resentment for him and breaking up the
relationship if things get any worse. It may actually be better to tell him
that you're not getting on with the project and it'd be better for your
relationship if you work in different places. There's nothing wrong with that.
~~~
septerr
This job is not directly for the startup. I have been contracted out by the
startup to this job and the money it brings is important for the startup atm.
~~~
CamperBob2
That changes things a bit. If you believe strongly in the startup's strategic
goals, then perhaps you can convince yourself that your current goal is purely
tactical, and can indeed force yourself through it with willpower alone.
Sometimes -- rarely, IMHO -- flogging yourself to get through some necessary
shit work does make sense.
If you were actually working _at_ the startup, on its principal mission, then
your problem would be more complex. Not only would you have to think about the
appropriateness/advisability of the particular feature you're implementing,
but you'd have to constantly evaluate it in light of your relationship with
your SO and your prospects in the new company. It would be very difficult to
separate these questions in your mind, so IMHO it's a good thing you don't
have to.
------
cognivore
Wait, how long have you been programming? 'cause this is essentially the job
description of every programmer I know.
------
veganarchocap
Currently fighting that same problem, I'm more of a programmer, but I'm being
placed on really, really fiddly UI 'features'.
I've made about 10 cups of tea, gone to the toilet about 6 times, read every
tweet tweeted in the past 24 hours. Started three arguments, considered
quitting and storming out... it's horrible and I'm glad you posted this
because I've been going through exactly the same thing.
~~~
Codhisattva
Quit gracefully. Even the taking the first step can be relieving.
------
falcolas
Not a therapist, but have a look (or better, have a professional have a look)
at ADHD-PI. What you've said describes perfectly how I feel at work a lot of
the time, and it's what I was diagnosed with.
I seem to have a finite pool for motivating (or more accurately forcing)
myself to do work. And when that pool is empty, it's off to HN or Reddit I go.
Frustrating, and I still don't have a solution yet.
Hope this helps.
~~~
rch
Have you tried modafinil? I've heard it works for some people, but lack first
hand experience. I'd be curious though.
~~~
falcolas
Working through some non-medicinal remedies first (changing habits, setting up
routines, etc). Not quite having the effect I hope for, but we'll see.
The consensus of what I've read is that most pharmaceuticals are temporary
fixes, at least for adults. But that's just heresay from the internet, so I
might be wrong.
And for the record, since they are always so highly advised, yes, I already
have good exercise, recreation and mental reflection routines in place. :)
------
lnanek2
This is par for the course for programming. I usually just shrug, write it
their way, and figure it is their money they are wasting. It's my job to
mention better ways, but in the end, do it how I'm told. One work place in
particular we often rewrite the same thing 3 times over. Sometimes it gets
better, sometimes worse. On rare occasions, things do actually work out better
their way if they knew a different product was coming down the line with
different requirements, or a graphics designer pushed really hard for
something that ended up making the app look cleaner or kept her engaged in the
project even if it was a PITA for the programmers, etc.. So sometimes you'll
discover it isn't so bad after you implement it. For the rest of those times,
just grab a personal project, or hit a hackathon, and do it your way. Then
don't grasp so hard on having it your way on work projects.
------
aaronem
You have no power to choose the features you're assigned to implement. The
most, then, for which you may reasonably be held responsible, even by
yourself, is that you implement a bad idea in a good way. From the sound of
it, you've got a lot of practice at that, and you've made it a habit. That
being so, you have nothing for which to reproach yourself. Cultivate
detachment, and relieve yourself of the need to try to take on more
responsibility than your authority can support. This will free you to
concentrate on what you can control, i.e., the quality of your implementation.
And, if you can't change jobs, then consider coming up with a side project. It
doesn't have to be commercial, or even of particularly general application;
even if you're just scratching an itch of your own, it'll give you scope to
exercise the agency whose absence in your day job is giving you fits.
------
doktrin
I can't say how much this post speaks to me. I've felt similarly for the last
month or so, or ever since I was assigned my current project. I don't have any
actionable advice, so I'll just share my current situation.
Without going into details, in my case the task is implementing a terrible,
hacky solution for a total edge case problem. It's something I will probably
never do again in my entire career.
It's draining. It claws at my self esteem, as I sit in the office wasting
literal _hours_ during a day not doing anything. The output of the 4-5 hours
of actual work I put in over the course of a week appear satisfactory to the
stakeholders, which is mind blowing.
I know that the sooner I get this done, the sooner I can move onto something
more interesting. However, just working on this particular task has sapped my
will like _nothing_ I've experienced before in my career as a developer.
------
mmilano
You're there by choice because your BF needs your help, yet you write about
how you're surprised they won't fire you. That probably makes less sense than
any feature request they have sent you.
It's a good question though.
After analyzing requests I have issues with, I will setup a meeting to discuss
what I think are the issues, and propose a better solution.
If they push it off as "This is what the customer (or some other decision
maker) wanted", I ask if we know if they have considered the issues and if we
can propose alternatives.
If they still want to move forward, I ask or work with them to discover more
detail about how it will be developed, and make sure they fully understand and
explicitly acknowledge each piece I think is insane, irresponsible, or
otherwise.
It usually doesn't get to that with good managers or clients. If it does, and
it happens regularly, it's time to fire them and move on.
------
scardine
Don't get so emotionally attached to the job, it is not professional.
Sometimes I have the impression that the younger don't know how to take it
like a man. There is a difference between complaining and whining, guess which
one makes a man miserable...
Reality is hard to change, but perception is easy. You can really improve your
happiness by reworking your perception.
Take some distance and look at the big picture: as an Employee, your main
concern is if the pay check cashes. Everything else is ultimately a problem
for the business owners (professionals are pragmatic, not cynic).
If your vision does not align with management and you happens to be right, it
is a lot more sad for the company than for you personally. It is not your baby
- wish them good luck, do your side of the deal as well as you can and don't
suffer over it. You have your startup, your own baby to look after.
~~~
angersock
This is really bad advice--realizing that you've spent years of your life
punching a clock, working on projects you don't care about, and failing to
grow as a person is awful.
The "taking it like a man" thing to do would be to leave, or present concerns
to management.
~~~
scardine
I understood he took the job to get the funding he needs for his startup. This
is not a purposeless clock-punching job, the man has a plan, stick to it or
change it.
------
cheetos
I was in the same position as you five years ago. I decided to leave and work
on my own product. I worked 80-hour weeks for months and years, sacrificed my
health and relationships, but the motivation of working on my own thing kept
me going. It was incredible. Just a few months ago, the product was acquired,
and I joined their team. And now I'm dealing with the same nonsense I was
dealing with at the original job.
As developers, this problem isn't going away any time soon. Our options are
basically to create our own thing and be our own boss so there is no
management to frustrate us, or just give in, write the code, take the check,
and enjoy our lives outside of work. It's that simple, but it's also quite
liberating when you allow yourself to accept it.
------
sidcool
I might be playing a devil's advocate here, but isn't our job as an employee
to follow the direction and vision of the management? I am not asking you to
sell your soul. It's just that sometimes in a career one might need to do work
that one considers below his/her capability. My manager sometimes makes me
fill up excel spreadsheets of who is working on what and for how many hours.
It sucks, I hate it. But I have to do it.
I am not mocking your situation. If it's really bad for you, follow jblow's
advice. But if it's a once in a while demotivation, swallow the pain and go
on. You will reach greater heights and from there these menial times won't
matter.
Just my two cents.
~~~
6d0debc071
> I might be playing a devil's advocate here, but isn't our job as an employee
> to follow the direction and vision of the management?
Yes and no.
There's something to be said for just knuckling down and getting on with
things once a decision has been made. But, prior to that, any half-decent
manager who doesn't know the subject area should have a certain degree of
respect for a subject specialist telling them, 'I don't think that'll do what
you want it to.' (or words to that effect.)
~~~
sidcool
Totally agree with you, Managers do need to respect specialized people, and
also vice-verse.
------
neeleshs
Yes, I have been in these situations. For me, there was no getting in the zone
- I used to spend a lot of time pushing back, trying to oversimplify a
solution, or just freezing because I was not stimulated enough by the task at
hand.
Ultimately, I chose the path of gritting my teeth and getting over it. During
that phase, the code quality suffered a little, but I did not have to waste
hours and hours of my life freezing on it. This phase lasted for a few months
in some cases.
This is by no means a long term strategy - I accept it as part of any
programmer's life and simply deal with it without being emotional about it as
much as possible. I have been fortunate enough to get more exciting work than
mundane stuff
------
jhh
I don't think that's specific to programming. It's what we all experience when
we procrastinate.
Set yourself small very clear goals which you write down and where you commit
yourself to finishing them in a given amount of time.
However, what your mind is telling you with the feelings you experience in my
opinion is something along the lines of "Don't do this, it's not great".
So when you experience this very often, you need to change something in your
life, or else you'll fall into depression because you have overcome your inner
hesistation one time too often.
Don't take this as a scientifically accurate account, just my personal
experience.
------
tomohawk
You can't care about the problem more than the customer, or you'll go crazy.
That is not to say you shouldn't be proud of the workmanship of what you build
(not quite the same thing as being proud of the product).
Unless you have a position where you have design authority, stop worrying
about the why, and focus on the workmanship. Impress those that do have this
authority with how well you do with what you're given.
If you believe that you have insights into making a better end product, then
learn to communicate those insights at the appropriate time (before they've
made up their mind). Try to get ahead of the curve and propose your ideas.
~~~
penguindev
I'd agree that design and building are separate tasks and they can easily
become too complex for one person, so it's best if it's divided. As long as
someone 'owns' the design (for good and bad), it's less frustrating as a
builder.
It sounds like in OPs case, vague specs means not good ownership of the
design.
------
toxiczone
I don't have any tips for you. I am stuck in the exact same situation. I'm
actually thankful that you shared your story and several of the comments
posted here. It made me feel less lonely with my situation.
The quitting part, moving on to a new job is not an option for me as I am
convinced that it is the same exact situation in most businesses around my
area.
I started working on some personal projects which helps a lot, but does not
solve my problem.
I find myself pushing to the last minute before the task at hand is due. The
extra rush of adrenaline from the looming deadline gives me the kick I need to
overcome the meaningless work I am about to do...
Good luck.
------
peterwwillis
So there's this feature, and you don't like it. You don't want to write it. So
your brain starts backing away from it like it's a burning ship. You begin to
give yourself excuses. You subconsciously imagine it will take a long time or
that it will be tedious. You are basically subconsciously convincing yourself
that you will hate it, for any reason. And the less you want to do it, the
harder it will be to make yourself do it.
But it's in your head. Using simple tricks you can change how your mind
interprets the thing, and put yourself ina more receptive state to be able to
accomplish the task without it seeming like a battle of wills.
First, put yourself in a good mood. Listen to your favorite music, eat or
drink something pleasant, think about the fun things you'll be doing soon. But
whatever you do, don't villify the work or think "I can't wait for this to be
over!"; that's just more avoidance.
Once you're in a better mood, walk through the work in your head so you
understand everything you need to do, and estimate the time it will take, but
shorter. Try to find something positive about it to work towards, or something
good or interesting you want to see come out of it. It could be something as
simple as timing how long it takes for you to write five methods. To prevent
further avoidance behavior, remove your watch and hide your clock. If you can,
move to a quiet place where you can focus with the least distractions
possible.
At the end of the day, if you really don't enjoy your job, you probably need a
different one. But it's a mistake to confuse a bad job with an unwillingness
to do work you don't agree with. Consider yourself their savior, and do it in
the best way possible so that it minimizes their crappy decisions and
emphasizes your skills. Imagine you are a woodworker; maybe you didn't want to
build a cabinet today, but you're going to build the best god damn cabinet
those jerks have ever seen.
(Also: consider if you will be with this BF in five years and whether wasting
this part of your life will have been worth it. Kind of a crappy thing to
imagine, but you can't spend your life doing things you don't like just
because it makes someone else happy)
------
neumann
I stated a new job after living in Europe for 6 months for a change and
immediately realised it is the same job I had back home, with the same
destination. The mind numbing drain of the IT work juxtaposed with the non
office lifestyle I had before taking the job and was literally destroying my
soul. I hated it. I now joke that I became an alcoholic in 2 weeks, because I
needed to be so blind drunk every night trying to justify how this will be
good for my future. And the same as you, the worst part is that my new
colleagues liked me and my managers lauded my on how fast I was, delivering
great work. I spent the second weekend walking around trying to imagine other
jobs, other people, the work culture. Eventually I decided that I could handle
the work and push through it, but only if it guaranteed that I could hang out
with interesting colleagues and work on interesting problems in the future. I
went back my second week and tried to analyse what opportunities I would have
given my current role and handed my resignation in after lunch. My boss was
shocked, asked if I'd been poached or wanted to work on something else, but I
had made up my mind and couldn't wait to try the next thing.
If that story doesn't bring any comfort because you have to stay, one approach
is to be open about how you feel at a team meeting and see if anybody else is
willing to timeshare the task. However, if this is the sort of task you will
always face day-to-day, you will eventually have to decide if that's how you
want to feel everyday.
------
TheGunner
I'm glad I'm not the only one that gets this sometimes.
I can completely identify with some of the points made, my particular
frustration is working with appalling specifications that are 9 times out of
10 incorrect/incomplete quiet often leading to features being written multiple
times. It's demoralizing. I have no particular solution, some will say just
knuckle down but it's easier said than done, there are some tasks that just
can't be made interesting. Unlike the OP I can change job and am, next week.
------
JoeAltmaier
Argue more compellingly. Your managers don't 'get to' make the decisions, they
are responsible for making decisions, using the best information available. As
their best programmer, you are the source of that information.
When I am asked to do what is not rational, I refuse and give argument. But to
play this card you have to be willing to pick up your coat and leave, not as a
threat but as a last resort.
You say you're stuck there, but the reasons are not yours, they are someone
else's. Get over that and your options open up.
------
peter-row
Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change
the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference, right?
Your problem is not really knowing if you _can_ change things. Or whether it's
worthwhile to change things. Ultimately, you can't really know whether it's
better to try to change things (communicating better, focusing more on design
vs writing code faster, getting a new job), so you have to accept that.
So ... whatever you choose to do, you can't really beat yourself up over
making a bad choice. It's a hard decision. Whether you stick with the job and
try to change people's minds, do things the way you currently are (but without
stressing so much), or find a new job is a difficult decision, but no choice
really stands out as a clear winner (from the little you've said), so just
pick one and go with it.
If you want a new job, go hit up linked-in.
If you want to do things the way you currently are, just accept that
programmers "waste time" \- there's a reason why competent programmers often
only write 10 lines of code a day - it's not easy work.
You can try to communicate better, but really, some people just don't listen.
Or maybe the managers don't have a choice - they either have managers or
customers.
Finally, work harder on documenting / presenting your progress. It never hurts
to write stuff up, and explain the decisions you're making or the technical
reasons why progress is slow.
------
lberlin
I can't comment on the situation of writing code for useless features for bad
managers. That is a separate mental hurdle.
But I think all of us sometimes struggle with sitting down and getting things
done. When we have a bad day, it's because we struggled making decisions and
didn't end up accomplishing very much in our own eyes. We're our own harshest
critics.
One thing that I've realized (actually just in the last few days) is that you
simply feel 10 times better at the end of the day if you write a lot of code,
knock of tasks on the to-do list, and generally "get things done".
Knowing that diving in and doing hard things will make you feel good makes a
huge difference for me. It's like "Ok, this might suck a little getting
started, but it's what will actually make me feel good and happy." It's really
easy to sit and think, or read the internet, but it's not a good feeling at
the end of the day.
As far as wasting time, whenever I'm struggling coming up with an approach or
solution to a problem, I start writing it down. It usually doesn't get too far
just in my head. But if I map it out, write it out, I get back to working on
it much faster. An inefficient solution that works gets you much closer to the
final product than struggling to find that "perfect" solution right off the
bat. Make it work, then optimize.
------
scotty79
What are you feeling doesn't have all that much to do with what you do and
what perceived atrocities you are paid to commit.
I have same feelings and I notice that they stem more from being responsible
(often self assumed internal responsibility) for the state of the system no
one else cares about the state of.
You are just lonely with what you do. People love you for the effect of your
work, but you see that they don't care about what you do. And it makes your
work meaningless (or even detrimental) from your point of view.
You imagine you could take solace from the fact that you system would be
architected beautifully without all this crap people who pay you make you put
in there. But that's not true. Artists are generally unhappy. They get happy
though appreciation, but not appreciation of common-folk that just don't get
art. Only by appreciation of fellow artists.
Programming is a puzzle. It doesn't matter what puzzle you solve. Solving a
puzzle of not increasing fragility of your system by adding crappy feature is
also a (hard) puzzle that can be solved better or worse. Sometimes solving
puzzle brings pleasure if your solution is especially good and programmers
think that's the right and only way to get pleasure out of what they do. But
that's rare. For each time solution itself brought you pleasure you should
have at least 10 times where your solution brought you pleasure just because
someone seen it, understood it and respected it.
tl;dr Make company hire more competent people that can share your burden.
------
e12e
> (I am not in a position to change jobs at the moment. I am helping my > BF's
> startup by doing this job.)
Quit. Get out. Work out a plan with your BF. It's no good to you or him if you
destroy yourself on work you hate. Be happy and poor together rather than rich
and dysfunctional apart.
I've never had to work (for a long time) in a job I truly hated, but I've felt
the pain of working in a company with a poor management culture -- it's taken
me a long time to get back the joy of development since I left. I now work in
a completely different, low paying job -- but it's better being payed less and
not having to compromise your work every day. I'll probably end up with
another job in the industry (well, I hope, anyway!) -- but I'll be very
careful in choosing where I apply \-- unless I manage to make a living
independently.
For you it sounds pretty much anything, anywhere would be an improvement
though...
I had a gf that worked in a job that crushed her (she did the right thing,
moved away, got certified as a padi instructor and now lives with her husband
and their child, both working as diving instructors -- I'd say she made the
right choice :).
Quitting might not mean that everything works out for you and your current BF
-- but it sounds like staying will ensure that things will not work out for
you.
Anyway, good luck, whatever you end up doing...
------
jejacks0n
As a programmer and perfectionist with Impostor Syndrome
([http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impostor_syndrome](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impostor_syndrome)),
I've learned some ways to mitigate these frustrations and stress causing
issues, and figured they might be worth sharing.
I think many of us know your pain, and as a consultant I'm exposed to it on a
pretty regular basis. It takes some of the fun out of my job for sure, but I
don't let it stress me out. First, we should always want to be passionate
about the projects we work on, and I think this is a result of being
passionate in general. Being passionate makes it enjoyable, and it allows you
to bring your best work forward (which is rewarding), but in our industry we
must always create a balance of cost and quality in the midst of a very
complex process. To me, this all boils down to priorities and expectations.
When you take your own priorities and combine them with those of someone else,
you will never be able to get them to mesh completely. Your priorities may be
to make quality code, or to make it elegant or smart -- easily maintainable,
extensible, etc. etc. These are things that make it fun, and programmers all
know the benefits of these things. Clients, or your bosses, may not understand
the importance of these things, or they may, and they may be willing to pay it
down later, whatever the case may be, there are conflicting priorities at play
and this is the thing you must mitigate to avoid stress.
For me, I must either disregard the external priorities entirely and do it the
way I believe it "should be done", or I must disregard my priorities entirely
and adopt the external priorities as my own. This may result in technical
debt, or a slow progression in the future, or can raise the potential of bugs
to be introduced, but these are not my concerns if they are not part of the
external priorities.
It's important that you communicate all of my concerns up front, and if it
doesn't impact the priorities that are communicated, you must trust that it's
ok. If you don't trust that it will be ok, or think you will be negatively
impacted by doing it the way you're being asked to do it, you should leave. A
management(or client)/ employee relationship is built on trust, and if you
don't have that trust you will be less happy than you could be.
------
bowlofpetunias
For one thing, stop feeling guilty.
Whatever the reason you are feeling depressed with your current situation
(already lots of good suggestions in this thread), feeling guilty about
wasting time or cheating your managers is basically a form of inflicting self-
harm on top of everything else.
You're getting paid for whatever you do, and apparently the people that pay
you are happy with the results even if you aren't, so just put that aside and
focus on what makes _you_ happy.
------
Sir_Cmpwn
The question I thought this title was asking, and one I'd like to hear
answered, is: "What do you do when you're asked to do work that you feel is
unethical, as a developer?" For example, I was recently asked to build a
system wherein users would be refunded actual money into "credits", and allow
the administration to modify the value (1 credit != $1) arbituarily.
------
logfromblammo
Just check out. Hang an "out to lunch" sign on your brain.
There is no solution within your reach for management that is ignorant with
respect to your job. Stop putting forth extra effort that will ultimately be
wasted. Clearly, you have discovered serendipitously that no one can tell the
difference between you doing your job well and you doing your job poorly. So
stop trying. Just relax and do the first thing that could possibly work.
Really build up some technical debt. Management probably does not even know
what that is.
That way, you can use the ever-increasing bogosity of the code base as an
argument for being resource constrained. Lobby for junior employees that
report directly to you. The end goal is to set yourself up for a job hop into
a better position at a better company.
The one you are working for now can be definitively marked as a dead end. So
milk them for cash and emotionally disengage. Get your spiritual fulfillment
by investing your creative talent elsewhere. Meanwhile, coast until you can
bail out safely.
That's about what I'm doing at my crappy, soul-crushing job.
~~~
gknoy
> So stop trying. Just relax and ... build up some technical debt.
> Set yourself up for a job hop....
While that can work in the short term, I don't think it's a very professional
thing to do long-term, especially when one couples it with lobbying for things
to help you bail to a "better" company. Let go of your caring about the
existence of technical debt __temporarily__, but then take some time to go
back and address that later.
Our job as developers should not just be to churn out code, but to inform our
managers of the costs of doing so. "This feature will take X weeks, this will
take Y. We racked up some technical debt implementing Q and QQ, so we need to
spend Z weeks addressing that before we can do QQQ." Most bosses like being
told that you're making the code easier to maintain, as it means you will make
future features happen faster.
I realize I'm lucky not to be in a burnout phase like you are. I just wanted
to suggest caution for others when considering a plan to mess up the codebase
and then leave -- how will our future coworkers (or later people that read our
code) feel when we do that?
~~~
logfromblammo
In the situation described by the OP, and shared by many of us, myself
included, your managers simply do not care about the professional integrity of
the software developer.
My boss has explicitly told me to forget about industry best practices or
retiring technical debt. It interferes with the prime directive, which is to
log 40 billable hours per employee per week, for as long as the contract gets
renewed. The technical debt is simply used as a justification to extract more
money from the customer while doing less actual work. In that case, informing
the manager gets you reprimanded for destroying his plausible deniability and
ass-covering.
There is simply _no way_ to act professionally in this situation. The best
thing to do is simply keep quiet and leave ASAP. The emotional detachment is
simply to _delay_ burnout and preserve any potential enthusiasm for the next
thing.
I can truly say that there is no way I could possibly make the codebase
noticeably worse than it already is. It was like that when I arrived. When I
suggested that it could be fixed if approached prudently, I was shot down.
When I suggested that the developers read a book on better development
practices, I was shot down. That was when I sensed the knife against my back
ribs and checked out.
Stay sane. Use the opportunity to be more selective in your continuing job
hunt.
------
swframe
1) Look at the problem a different way and try to find a way to make it more
interesting, attractive and (most importantly) impressive. I had to find and
fix a tedious problem so I wrote a visualization, defect detection and
automatic correction tool. If you have the freedom, try solving it with a new
language or technology that you've always wanted to learn.
2) Challenge yourself to finish the project as quickly as possible. If a
realistic estimate is that the work will take 1 week then try to finish it in
1-2 days. If it is awful work, try to get it over as quickly as possible. It
helps if you can find an existing solution that you can use as a starting
point.
3) If you're paid hourly, you might consider outsourcing the problem to
someone off of elance. You should reframe the problem so that it doesn't
require you to share any info (source code etc) from your employer with the
person you outsource to. Ideally, ask the person to create an open source
project on github.
------
ChristianMarks
OP, do not listen to the moralizers who tell you that you need to exercise
discipline and will power. Let them deplete their limited reserves of will
power and see how far it gets them: you can change your environment so that
you thrive in it. And that beats relying on will power and discipline by
orders of magnitude. Quit early and often.
------
pasbesoin
I spent a lot of time forcing myself to conform to others' wishes and will. Or
to "work around" the problems, e.g. by staying late -- both to get some quiet
time at work in which to concentrate, and to avoid some nasty neighbor issues
at home.
Ultimately, I ended up at another definition of that word: "Spent".
I'm just saying...
------
thisone
Have I been in these situations? All the time. I care about the software we
produce, so I have strong opinions about the development of it.
How do I handle it? I say my piece, I listen to the response from my boss. If
he disagrees with my analysis, then I accept it, sit down and do the work to
the best of my ability.
------
jheriko
you have to make a choice imo. you can either suck it up and get on with it or
flat refuse to do it. if you feel strongly enough then refuse to do work and
quit the job... fulfil your contract to the minimum possible whilst giving
them every legal reason possible to want to pay you to go away.
however i feel inclined to reserve that for serious problems, like weak
leadership, oppressive or immoral behaviour etc. rather than poor features or
undesirable work...
doing things you don't want to do is part of work. letting your leaders make
their mistakes and learn from it is part of it too. i'm strongly inclined to
say you just need to grow up a bit and get on with it... and be grateful that
this is a 'problem' for you because its nothing compared to what most people
consider to a problem in the workplace.
------
MartinCron
A very short mantra that has helped me: "Own what you own".
That is, if I see a project as someone else's, and my job is to help them do
their best, I am happier than if I see a project as "mine" and other people
are just screwing it up.
Like many important life lessons, I learned this one a day too late.
------
bdcravens
Find something about the task that intrigues you, and build your motivation
around that. A new gem, or new language feature, etc.
I've also found focusing on tests helps. Write as many tests as possible -
focusing on getting those to pass. In theory, by the time you're done, the
feature will be to.
~~~
penguindev
Just first ask yourself if the next person to work on this code will
appreciate the 'new features' you used.
~~~
bdcravens
Always a good point. Based on OP's description, they may not feel the next dev
would appreciate the code at all, and it's just a matter of fighting through
this feature on a personal level.
------
hownottowrite
Like others, I would encourage you to take some time off before you burn out.
However, I also understand what you mean about not being able to escape this
job.
I've had numerous jobs where I felt I couldn't leave for certain reasons. I
would stay usually a few years too long and later come to regard the decision
with a mixture of regret and weird, sanctimonious pride.
Take a few hours today and read Man's Search for Meaning by Viktor Frankl.
It's a short book, written by a psychologist and concentration camp survivor.
The book demonstrates that is possible to find meaning in the worst
situations, especially those you "cannot" leave. It may also help you
understand why you need to think about choosing a different path.
------
ebiester
I wish I was done with the series of blog posts that helped me get over this!
:)
I struggled with this for years and years. This is not one problem , but
three: it is a problem with wisdom, speed, _and_ discipline.
Luckily, we can learn tricks to improve each one.
If we want to attack this from the wisdom perspective, it is this: You are
afraid of making the wrong decision because you are afraid to refactor. You
are afraid to refactor because you don't have sufficient test coverage.
The good news is, for developers like us, test driven development is very
helpful as a technique for getting us over these problems. If our team is not
test-friendly, however, it will be difficult for us to make the jump because
their code will not be written in ways to make it easy to test.
There are a few books I can suggest to help us jump the chasm:
1\. Clean Code by Bob Martin. This book helped me think in more testable code,
and also helped me understand how to make better decisions the first time
around. It helped me by seeing patterns I didn't know first.
2\. Refactoring by Martin Fowler. This one is old, but knowing the patterns of
changing code gives us more confidence in knowing what is right, rather than
hemming and hawing over what is readable and maintainable.
3\. Refactoring From Legacy Code by Michael Feathers can help get from here to
there. All of these help from three aspects: They help us develop a set of
tests so we are less afraid of breaking existing things, they give us the
freedom to experiment, and they help us break things down into smaller, more
manageable problems by letting us think about "what is the next thing I can
test?"
If we have the tests, we can be more aggressive in reducing complexity.
___
If we want to attack this from a Speed issue, then look for these things.
1\. Look for patterns you use repeatedly, and try to settle down into a
process. The fewer choices we make, the faster we can go.
2\. Look to learn more about your chosen stack and language. It is possible
that we are rewriting the wheel over and over. The more you understand the zen
of your stack, the faster you can go and the more time you can devote to
writing the same thing twice (without them knowing.)
3\. Instead of hemming and hawing about the right solution, write all three.
It is often faster to write all three and choose one than to get stuck in
analysis paralysis. (That isn't to say you shouldn't think before you write
code!)
___
Finally, you can attack this from a discipline angle.
1\. Learn to meditate. By doing so, you can become more self-aware of analysis
paralysis, calm your mind quickly, and mindfully choose a path.
2\. Exercise. In the same way as meditation, exercise helps us learn to clear
our mind and focus on command, and it helps sharpen our discipline chops.
With these, we can develop an awareness of how our body feels. Then we can
develop an awareness of how analysis paralysis feels. If we can catch
ourselves in the act, we can then institute something from our analytical
skills: When caught in the trap, set 30 minutes on your timer, and bring out a
pad of paper. If you feel you have the freedom, turn off the monitor.
Take deep breaths, and sketch out the solutions in the first ten minutes on
the first page. Use UML or your own system.
In the next ten minutes, write a pro/con analysis on each path.
In the final ten minutes, make the decision. After this, your analysis time is
up and you must code.
I suggest a combination of the above.
Good luck! It was one of the hardest things for me to defeat.
------
m_coder
It seems to me that this kind of situation is what some types of programmers
try to escape by creating "amazing" code. This is the kind of code that you
come back to a little while later and wonder what you were thinking when you
wrote it.
------
JohnOfEgypt
Been there before, luckily just few times. \- Put yourself in a good mood,
music helps a lot, energizing beats, try Panjabi MC! \- Slice the feature into
small deliverable, hint: use index cards and a sharpie, yes, it's magic. \-
Finish one story (index card) at a time and have a tiny celebration (coffee,
cookie, walk ...) every time you do that. DON'T skip the fun part.
Always think of yourself as an explorer collecting and connecting clues on a
mysterious adventure!
Keep in mind, business drives programming, not the opposite. The codebase is
only worthy as long as the product is selling (with the help of your
managers).
------
exodust
Could be just laziness maybe. Mixed with possible relationshop pressures
(hinted by earlier submissions I noticed).
"My managers don't fire me". Perhaps show managers the post written here? I
dare you! But they pay your wage.
Put headphones on and listen to the right music or something to encourage
focus. Yep!
I think everyone is in the same boat as you in some way or another. "wasting
considerable amounts of time" could be a worry though.
"Seriously affects the quality of my life"... surely the quality of your life
is not a consequence of "unnecessary complexity in the codebase"? Good luck
anyway :)
Edited - I'd had some wines
------
Havoc
>>Have you been in such situations?
Similar - not coding though.
>>How do you get in the zone and get it done
I treat it as an optimization problem. Specifically because I have a problem
with this too:
>>I waste considerable amount of time trying to do things in the most
readable, maintainable and simple way possible
So I consciously aim to force that compromise between quality & time more
towards the time side. That goes against my fundamental nature, but I've come
to the conclusion that I must learn this...and as a result it feels more like
a learning & personal development challenge rather than me doing something I
don't want.
------
gmarkov
Consider the following - maybe your managers realize how vague task is, they
also realize that you put a lot of pressure on yourself to make it, as I
understand without strong support. I have been many times in same situation,
usually when this happened first: I read "The humble programmer" :-),which
reminds me that there is always something that I don't know, second: look
again on the task and try to find its challenges, things that after completing
them will make me a better programmer.
------
kdark11
Great question and I imagine many people have been in similar situations. I
can offer a few lessons I have learned over the years. 1\. When I found myself
in a situation where I didn't connect with the mission or purpose of
company/project, I would eventually hit a wall similar to the experience you
described above. If you can't find any way to connect with the cause, I would
at a minimum be open to making a job change. 2\. There have been many
occasions where I felt like I couldn't influence something to make the outcome
more in-line with my ideal outcome. Two changes in my behaviors greatly
reduced situations like this for me. First, Be open and honest with your
manager. Explain to he or she that you feel more connected to a task/role when
your input is valued. Keep in mind someone valuing your input doesn't always
mean it will be implemented or acted on at any greater frequency. Second, I
used to focus on what I can do to produce positive results without much
consideration for others needs. One of my mentors suggested I spend an equal
amount of time learning what is important to my managers/leaders and peers.
Doing so enabled me to think more deeply about the outcomes I was striving for
and how those would resonate with the folks calling the shots. I started to
proactively address concerns I new would be present and any proposals?ideas I
shared were positioned in a way that would show consideration was given to all
the main issues that were important to them. Over time, I earned a greater
degree of trust and my leadership team started to take my advice/input more
seriously. One final thought and related to what I previously shared. Your
situation above makes it seem like the spec for a feature was handed to you
after it was already determined it would be implemented the way it was
provided to you. In my experience, that has almost always been to late to
influence change I viewed to be favorable. Circling back to my first point
above, being more open about the need to contribute and share ideas will
hopefully open the door for you to get involved before all the details have
been finalized.
I could share several other examples from my work experience. On a more
personal note, I noticed you are doing this for your BF. In the short term
this might make him or both of you happy. I was in a somewhat similar
situation before and the resulting unhappiness from doing work for an
organization that had goals/mission I didn't connect with started to
negatively impact my marriage.
------
aniro
I just read this stern but lovely dirge in a novel last night..
"Do you wrestle with dreams? Do you contend with shadows? Do you move in a
kind of sleep? Time has slipped away. Your life is stolen. You tarried with
trifles, victim of your folly."
Life is short. It is time to see through the trap you have woven around
yourself and move along. Just do it constructively so that in the end,
EVERYONES interests will be better served.
------
JSeymourATL
You've got a huge opportunity here to practice the art of Managing Up and
Managing Oneself -- impacting your quality of life.
\- Eliminate ambiguous requests. Can you probe for your managers
stated/unstated objections & needs?
\- What's the expected outcome? Are your recommendations easily understood and
compelling? Is your business case sound?
\- If the managers are happy with schlock work, can you ever be OK with that?
Ultimately, the power is yours.
------
jeffrwells
The advice of burnout, changing jobs, etc is well covered already.
I have been doing sole crushing work for years in school. When you don't have
a choice, the most useful thing for me to get started is the pomodoro method.
Spend just 25 minutes of agonizing work and plan what you want to do for the 5
minute break. Usually after 1 or 2 cycles I actually get focused and motivated
enough to make some progress.
------
alexhornbake
This advice was given to me by a friend when I was dealing with less than
ideal employment situations.
1) Change the way you feel about the situation. Is this a me issue?
2) Change the situation externally. Talk to management, etc.
3) Leave
It sounds like you've tried #1 and #2 to some extent. I was in a similar
situation. I left the company, and found a much healthier environment where I
can actually use #1 and #2.
------
rlaanemets
I recognize the situation. Seems like the project is lead by people who have
not failed before because of feature creep. If you get paid by hours then keep
logging hours and try to be happy. But make sure they know about your concerns
and feelings that their decisions may derail the project. And keep looking for
a peaceful way out.
------
motters
If I was in that situation I'd try to get a different job. I know how hard it
is to do that in the current economy though, so failing that I'd just do the
minimum needed and be uncompromising about working only the assigned hours so
as to maximize my utility outside of that particular employment role.
------
fenesiistvan
Just search the internet for "get the shit work done" to find the answer for
your problem. Really. You can find also some good practices.
I believe that most of our jobs can be divided to two parts:
-the fun part (interesting/fun/profitable work)
-the shit part (boring tasks/emails)
So, just get the shit work done when it needs to.
------
untog
You should change jobs. I know you are trying to support your BF's startup (do
you have equity in it?) but if he really cares about you he'll understand that
you are on the brink of utterly burning out and need a change.
------
AnthonBerg
Coffee and smoking make this much worse for me. (In fact when I don't smoke
and drink coffee I don't have this problem - whereas when I do, I do.) Leaves
me to conclude that it's based in anxiety.
------
haroldp
I wouldn't say that my, "entire being opposes the task at hand". I would
reserve that sort of language for ethical reservations about a task. I do not
do things I consider unethical.
But I do encounter many chores in my work that are boring, that are bad ideas,
that are for difficult customers, or often all three. I can have the same
problems getting those tasks done, just like you describe. Actually, you seem
to be way ahead of me because it took my far to long to figure it out. I
thought I was losing my ability to program. I was wondering if I was going to
have to find another career because I had lost my ability to concentrate. I
was reading books on getting things done, and concentration and trying to
figure out what the hell was wrong with me. I would sit down to do a task,
check email, check reddit, check hacker news, check reddit, get coffee, go to
the bathroom, check reddit, "Arg! I have shit to do!" Check reddit, check IRC,
etc. I caught myself more than once closing a browser tab with some
distraction, pausing for a half moment to organize what I should actually be
doing and then open a browser tab to the same thing again.
The insite came when I finally got something engaging to do, and I just
powered through it. I _could_ still program! How did I get in the zone? How do
I get there again when I need it? Well I worried about hat for a while,
thinking there was some combo of sleep, nutrition, environment and task
management software that I could line all up and get back to "the zone". It
finally dawned on me that I subconsciously find distractions to avoid doing
things I don't want to do. What a revelation.
How do I get over it? Well I still struggle with it, but simply identifying
the problem was a huge step towards fixing it. Here are some techniques that I
use:
Pomodoro technique. This is a productivity trick that actually works pretty
well for me. The short version is that that you make a list of very small
tasks, then work for twenty minutes (straight! no phone, no emails, no coffee,
no bathroom), then take a five minute break. This helps with distraction
problems because you can tell yourself, "I can goof off in 7 minutes". It
sounds like a lot of interruptions, but I'm amazed at how much I get done with
it.
Creating crisis. I work harder with the Sword of Damocles hanging over me, so
I put those swords there myself. Call me back at 2:30 and I will have this
done. Then I'm good for two hours of, "oh shit, oh shit, oh shit," type
production.
Pair programming (and rubber ducking). This really helps to power through
crummy tasks. Unfortunately, I work from home for a tiny company. I don't have
anyone to program with. But if I am really stuck, I can ask my wife to sit
next to me, while I explain what I am doing, and what I am trying to
accomplish, and the details of what I am coding as I code it. I can use this
occasionally to get over a hump.
Change of venue. I have struggled to find some shitty bug in some shitty
spagetti code for a crappy website selling stupid things for WAY too long. The
only way I broke through was to take my computer somewhere else, in front of
other people. David Sedaris has a great story about a book suggesting he make
a change in his house to help him quit smoking. Buy a new couch or something
in order to change the venue. In our comfortable habitual surroundings we act
in comfortable habitual ways. So he moved to Japan to stop smoking. I can't do
this every day, it's just for breaking major blocks.
Anyway, I need to get back to work. Good luck!
~~~
user24
Just wanted to chip in to say that the pomodoro technique works really really
well, but maybe best when I actually know what I should be doing. Setting a
pomodoro task of 'let users choose colours' is easy, but 'improve load times'
is harder. I think the specificity has something to do with it.
But when I get tasks that lend themselves to it, I often find myself skipping
the breaks and starting another session straight after, which is great.
I stand up when the timer goes off to try to combat the effects of sitting for
long periods.
------
cliveowen
Frankly, it's just called programming. Programming is that pesky, resilient
three-headed monster between your idea and the finished product, you have to
give in and tame it.
------
marvin
My suggestion: Major lifestyle change before you burn out and involuntarily go
out of business for six months. Take control of this while you still can.
------
pechay
Don't let yourself get paralysed by indecision.
------
lectrick
Learn to write GOOD test suites. Once you realize that they are preserving
your sanity, they will actually become fun to write.
------
tks2103
Exercise.
Meditate.
Cook.
Listen to music.
I never found the ability to rationalize a task I dislike. Instead, I find joy
elsewhere and try to preserve that feeling as I tackle the task.
------
KhalPanda
> What do you do when your entire being opposes the task at hand?
...anything other than the task at hand, obviously. :-)
------
iondream
sounds like you might need therapy. I've had a similar problem and speaking to
a therapist helped.
------
Nursie
Express your concerns, do the work as well as you can, find another role.
Basically.
------
gregmcintyre
I feel you. I don't have a solution.
------
rabino
Open HN.
No, seriously. I go work somewhere where people can see my monitor. Helps me
keep out of Facebook, etc.
~~~
vog
This is a good advice for people who are temporarily in a bad mood.
However, it is the totally wrong way to fight an upcoming burnout.
------
_bdog
I'm not going to tell you about your job or surrounding, but a little about
how your brain, or rather everbody's brain works.
The problem at hand is a relatively unknown psychological issue.
There are many theories about motivation. Most of them don't account for a
specific type or situation, where someone is just not able to do a certain
piece of work, without having a reason like lacking the time, health, skills
or energy. These types are often just dismissed and dubbed underachievers,
because, for some reason, they fail to acomplish tasks which they should be
perfectly able to do. They procrastinate and do a million other things first
or just give it up completely.
It doesn't matter whether this task is about work, university grades, doing
lab-experiments, the laundry or else.
== The theory ==
There is a austrian psychologist, Brigitta Rollett, who coined a term called
"Anstrengungsvermeidungsmotivation" which translates to "effort avoidance
motivation" or "stress avoidance motivation".
The first essential postulate of the theory is, that having the "motivation"
to avoid stress, or efforts that cause stress, isn't an illness or failure,
but rather an evolutionary advantage to prevent burnout and similar issues.
All people tend to avoid activities, which cause them stress or more
specifically the very basic emotion of disgust. People have different pattern
and triggers which lead to the feeling of disgust. This is heavily primed by
upbringing, schooling, bad experiences etc. You seem to be disgusted by
"useless features". (I am too. :))
The second essential postulate of the theory is, that this disgust is more or
less "invisible". Most of the time it goes unnoticed. It is such a strong
emotion that people never even want to "go near it", because it would cause
them IMMENSE emotional pain. This pain can even translate to physical symptoms
like head-aches etc.
This is how the afore-mentioned "underachievers" are explained. They don't
have a problem per se. As long as nobody forces them to do the specific tasks
they don't like to do, they live happily ever after. People with a high IQ
tend to learn a lot of these "disgust" pattern, because on the one hand they
are often confronted with teachers, who don't understand them or meet them
with antipathy and on the other hand they never needed to learn to deal with
"repulsive efforts". Contrary to most people they get by, without ever having
really stressed themselves. Should they come into a situation, however, where
they HAVE or WANT to deal with a task, which for them is linked to disgust,
they fall into complete despair. They do everything to get away from the
triggered emotion. It's literally TERRIBLE for them to do some kinds of work,
which aren't a problem for most others.
There have been many scientific studies, tests and validations of this (in
german).
== Your situation ==
First you have to acknowledge and understand that what you are experiencing is
an irrational and immensely intense emotion.
Emotions don't think. When you encounter one, you have to decide how to act on
it. If your job sucks it's probably a good idea to just work somewhere else.
But you like your job. In your case, the emotion just tells you that you HATE
this type of work-situation. And for whatever reason you are not able to just
acknowledge that, bite the bullet and move on. (Which is how people are able
deal with most bad emotions.) In this particular case your brain throws one
hell of a fit. Neurologically speaking and simplified, your rational forebrain
looses control over your amygdala and the "more emotional" parts of your
brain.
== What you can do ==
You can always make sure the situation never happens again, and avoid the
dreaded tasks, but this probably won't work without giving up programming.
What you have to apply are the same strategies which are needed to conquer
other emotions-gone-wild like irrational fears.
~ You NEED to work on it SLOWLY but STEADY. ~
* The bad news: I hate to tell you this, but if you want to change your behaviour, you NEED to sit down and start doing the exact work which triggers this cascade.
* The good news: Each day, or session, you only need to conquer it ONCE.
Sit down for the task and start with the tiniest bit. Just open the first
file. When you FIRST feel the terror overwhelming you, you HAVE to force
yourself to keep at it and wrestle it down. When you feel the terror
approaching a SECOND time, you can stop. If you have the energy to continue,
do it, but I doubt you will. Don't stress yourself too much, or it will
backfire. (You won't)
This might sound incredibly stupid, but be proud of yourself at this point,
because you have just delivered an immense piece of emotional work and it's ok
to be tired now. Even if you just typed three words.
Keep repeating this practise each day, twice a day or how you see fit, and
slowly but steady the terror will fade. It will come slower, lighter, less
often. If you keep doing this, i will GUARANTEE you that these shenanigans
will stop. You will slowly replace the old neurological patterns which trigger
your pain. (And pain is exactly what it is.)
Unfortunately there is no faster way for this. You can look into hypnotherapy,
which can accelerate matters a bit, but working on emotions always takes it's
time. I have applied these techniques myself for a couple of situations. It
was immensely exhausting, but it's worth it and it works.
Good luck.
~~~
septerr
Thank you for your advice. "Your brain throws a hell of a fit" sounds just how
it feels :)
------
skimmas
you quit.
------
ebbv
While I can 100% relate to your scenario, a big part of being a professional
at any job (not just development) is being able to set aside your personal
feelings and emotions and get your job done.
It's good that you are getting your job done, but it seems that you are still
having issues setting aside your personal feelings and emotions. This is
pretty normal for inexperienced developers. It's something you should focus on
working on.
Here's how I developed that skill:
1) Remind myself that this is not my company or my project. It's someone
else's. There's no reason for me to feel so personally invested in the project
as a whole. If I've voiced my concerns and thoughts and been overruled, then
my job is to get what is asked of me done to the best of my ability.
2) Have side projects that ARE personal and that I CAN be emotionally invested
in. When you have a side project where you do call the shots and it's done
100% the way you want, you will find it is easier to not be so emotional over
your day job.
3) Lastly, I have found that as I get more experienced and better at
explaining myself, situations where managers overrule me and tell me to do
something that is against my own recommendation become more and more rare
(they'll still happen sometimes as long as someone above you can make
unilateral decisions, so never expect it to fully go away.)
It's good that you've recognized your situation needs to change. Best of luck.
~~~
penguindev
I like all your points, but option 2 is very intriguing. I've never had the
time for that, given I use all my mental and physical capacities for my day
job. So I'm conflicted; I just don't think I'd have enough time to do a side
project to the standards I'd expect of myself.
I think that's also why many posters here are saying 'use some new language
feature X to make your work project more exciting' \- basically adding a side
project into your day job. [I think that road can lead to ruin, if you're
making it harder on the next person to work on the code. Be careful and
considerate.]
~~~
ebbv
I know a lot of people work that way (using new technologies in their day
jobs) but personally I take my day job too seriously to do that. I learn new
technologies by doing side projects. Then once I feel comfortable with them I
can start using them in my day job. I don't want to look my boss or coworkers
in the face and say "Yeah that fuck up was because I was using this project to
learn a new thing."
I think you're over estimating how much time you need for a side project. You
can even just spend a couple hours on a couple weekends a month on something.
Or even every other month. You don't have to work on it every day or anything.
That's the great thing about it being a side project. There's no rush. No
timetable other than whatever you choose for yourself.
------
itistoday2
Get someone else to do it.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
CarWoo's (YC S09) Tommy McClung Addressing the Founder’s Conference - turoczy
http://carwoo.com/blog/tommy-mcclungs-address-at-the-founders-conference/
======
alain94040
Thanks to Tommy for a great and entertaining presentation.
~~~
tommy_mcclung
Thanks for having me. Lots of fun.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Psychiatry Admits It’s Been Wrong in Big Ways, But Can It Change? - gruseom
http://www.madinamerica.com/2014/03/psychiatry-admits-wrong-big-ways-can-change-chat-robert-whitaker/
======
joesmo
"[The lie supporting the chemical imbalance theory] is an astonishing betrayal
of the trust that the public puts in a medical discipline; we don’t expect to
be misled in such a basic way."
It's more than just being misled. These lies and misinformation by the
psychiatric industry have destroyed millions of lives and killed countless
people. And _still_ they are being perpetrated. It's _fucking outrageous_!
~~~
fit2rule
The problem is that we have cultures which perpetuate the myths being used to
sell them expensive drugs, precisely because these cultures are using these
drugs - and _like using them_. So, in spite of the lies, the Pharmaceutical
industry continues to rake in record profits; because it has created a product
that people _want_.
Never mind that a pharmaceutical subscription is a chain in the contemporary
slavery link.
------
patmcguire
I always wondered how medicine as a whole figured out things that don't lend
themselves to clinical trials - how are you going to measure the success of
different approaches to psychological counseling?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The POODLE has friends - yuhong
https://vivaldi.net/en-US/blogs/entry/the-poodle-has-friends
======
yuhong
BTW, thanks Nelson Bolyard for fighting with the server vendors during the
secure renegotiation effort (allowing us to finally disable SSLv3 fallback
years later): [http://www.ietf.org/mail-
archive/web/tls/current/msg05066.ht...](http://www.ietf.org/mail-
archive/web/tls/current/msg05066.html)
------
tptacek
The Cavium thing is worrisome, because that's a part that might be on the BOM
of a bunch of other products. Cavium makes network processors and TLS offload
devices.
~~~
windexh8er
Considering Cavium is in a bulk of all hardware appliances
(networking/security) and it's related to chip firmware and many organizations
are bad at updating software on hardware... My guess is that even though he's
scanning for vulnerable services - that doesn't actually expose the true
amount of servers vulnerable.
If you think about corporate networks that are doing SSL/TLS decrypt these
boxes that are the corporate owned MitM will be vulnerable to this since the
hardware is basically forward-proxying the users session. That would mean the
connection between the appliance and the service would be vulnerable -
something you can't scan for via something like the prober he mentions.
Very interesting indeed...
------
Quai
Yngve worked serveral years for Opera Software, and had a major role in both
our TLS implementation and general security.
On side note; I envy the employees of Vivaldi, since they are now getting
Yngves famous chocolate cake. (He used to bake cake for the entire Oslo office
back in the days) :)
------
wolf550e
Is the conclusion just that: when implementing a TLS stack, some people call
it 'done' when they can get HTTP over TLS mostly working. You will find
implementations in the wild that omit any (or all) of the code that is
required by the spec for security but not for interoperability.
This is like the idea that the C source code found in the wild is anything
that was accepted by some compiler at some point.
------
epmatsw
Wow, that's a really impressive writeup.
------
kkirsche
Thanks for sharing. Hopefully this won't be a huge problem for companies.
~~~
001spartan
According to the numbers in the post, it shouldn't be anywhere near as bad,
just due to the smaller number of vulnerable servers. 269/530000 servers
scanned isn't anything to panic about, unless the problem is larger than it
appears from this research.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: What happens to your code if you get hit by a truck? - empressplay
It's a pretty common scenario: you develop thousands of lines of code, then get hit by a truck. Now what? What do you do to make sure your code continues after you've become a spot on the pavement?
======
richerlariviere
If your code is well-documented I guess it will be easier to deal with it. If
you can't understand code you have written 6 months ago, it won't be easy for
other programmers. All black magic code should be clearly indicated.
------
andreapaiola
I think that my code must die with me. My precious code.
------
humbleMouse
Luckily I have a "hit by a truck" exception I include in every project
regardless of language.
------
GFK_of_xmaspast
I haven't even made out a will yet.
------
jakerockland
I'm confused.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Mach-O Tricks [pdf] - supro
http://iokit.racing/machotricks.pdf
======
woodruffw
Another interesting fact: Mach-O also specifies "fat" or universal binaries,
which are just a packed collection of Mach-O binaries with a special header
and magic value (CAFEBABE for big-endian, like a Java classfile). The loader
reads this special header, seeks to the right cpu(sub)type, and the rest is
the same as a "thin" Mach-O.
Source: I wrote a Mach-O parser for the Homebrew project[1].
[1]: [https://github.com/Homebrew/ruby-
macho](https://github.com/Homebrew/ruby-macho)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: OPC UA Server Qt C++ Library - juangburgos
https://github.com/juangburgos/QUaServer
======
makapuf
For those that don't know, OPC Unified Architecture (OPC UA) is a machine to
machine communication protocol for industrial automation ( from Wikipedia
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/OPC_Unified_Architecture](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/OPC_Unified_Architecture))
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Reddit Must End Politically Motivated Publishing Decisions - RickJWagner
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2019/10/31/reddit_must_end_politically_motivated_publishing_decisions_141623.html
======
nabla9
As far as I know FB hearings are about political ads. Correct me if I'm wrong
(with sources), but I have not seen any interest from Congress to force social
media to be impartial related to organic political speech and forums. First
Amendment restricts only government, not private business or people.
Maybe someone could educate me on the principles based on this opinion. For
example, if Reddit was a bakery, would it be allowed to refuse to sell cakes
to people with MAGA hats? The Supreme Court on ruled in favor of a Colorado
baker who had refused to create a wedding cake for a gay couple.
[https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/17pdf/16-111_j4el.pdf](https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/17pdf/16-111_j4el.pdf)
Why this does not apply to Reddit? If they don't wan't MAGA people, why can't
they refuse?
Social media is free to take political stance and limit discussion. If they
allow free speech, it's just because their users demand it or they think its
nice to allow it for any reason.
------
aritmo
Is this the same website that leaked the name of the CIA analyst?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Ask HN: Do you send transactional emails using Gmail API? - h99
So I find sending emails with services like mailchimp, mailgun, etc. very non-personal. So I've been using Gmail api to send emails. Wondering if others do the same.
======
ryan8020
Instead of switching to Gmail I'd rather think about what exactly makes an
email non-personal. For me, it's not about if the senders adress is
"[email protected]" rather than "[email protected]" but rather what's written
inside the mail. Mailgun etc. let you write just normal emails like you would
do in gmail as well.
I think the annoying thing about those services is that they are mostly used
for mass-mailing. It doesn't matter if you send the same email to thousands of
people via gmail rather than anything else - it will still be a poorly
customized email for the recipients.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Uber slapped with suit by Philadelphia taxi companies - larrys
http://www.philly.com/philly/business/20141225_Uber_slapped_with_suit_by_45_city_taxi_companies.html
======
meesterdude
I recently took a cab home in philly, and throughout the ride home the cab
driver was telling me about uber and the impact its had on him. He works 2
shifts and makes $70 but the cab itself is $80/day. He used to own a gas
station and other real estate but the economy screwed him and he resorted to
driving a cab to try and support his kids, which he was barely able to do.
equally, there was a time I had to take my cat to the vet and could _not_ get
a cab home. I called every company I could find, tried the apps for the ones
that required it, but nothing. One of the people that worked at the clinic
drove me about 2 blocks and there was a cab of one of the companies I had
tried, sitting in the parking lot of a gas station. That was frustrating.
So I think its unfair what cab drivers are going through. I think Uber and
other services bring innovation to the market and consumers have expressed an
interest in this. While its true advances in technology often leave a given
workforce obsolete, this is more subtle and "technical" in a legal sense; and
not nearly as dramatic as self-driving cars will be.
I think philly should give these cab companies a break, or tighten their grip
on Uber. Both should be allowed to compete, and do so fairly. Its not in the
consumers interests for one or the other to go away.
Also, I think the "uber is just an app" is BS, because they're setting the
rates and getting a commission from the ride (someone correct me if I'm wrong
on this) so in reality they're operating an automated dispatch service. But I
think their entire business model revolves around that talking point, and
doubt they would be able to compete with taxi's if forced to play by those
rules.
~~~
seanmccann
Sounds like that guy might make more money driving with Uber than having to
pay $80/day to play.
~~~
jrockway
Uber does not provide vehicles for free either.
~~~
pbreit
But you can use your own vehicle, unlike in the taxi industry.
~~~
wcummings
Not really a good thing, as they depreciate in value
~~~
tlrobinson
Hence taxi companies charging drivers $80 a day to rent them?
$80/day * 20 days per month = $1600 / month, which is like 10x the cost of a
lease for, say, a Prius. Meanwhile, Uber drivers can use their own car for any
other purpose. Even factoring in gas and insurance it's hard to believe taxi
drivers are getting a better deal.
------
duaneb
It's a little unfair. Uber drivers get screwed over by wages, but taxis are a
miserable affair. Every company has their own hailing app; even though drivers
are required by law to offer credit card charges, I've been forced multiple
times to get cash out of a machine because the machine doesn't work. One time
it was even blatantly unplugged.
Both sides are fucked, in their own way; the taxi companies will need to come
together and figure out something aside from a lawsuit to survive uber (and
uber's successors).
~~~
jobposter1234
I have been told by multiple cabbies in different cities that most personal
revenue ("salary") they make is eliminated by absurd cc processing fees.
A recent driver in a SoCal city told me that his processing rates were 20-30%,
and he was only allowed to use that service by the terms of his cab lease from
the medallion owner. (They obviously operated the cc processing service as
well.)
Shouldn't blunt your frustration, but I wanted to repeat what I've heard from
traditional taxi drivers -- they're sometimes better off not driving you than
driving you and collecting payment by cc.
~~~
dustingetz
I would like a source please
~~~
jobposter1234
Sorry, don't have one. Wasn't trying to convince you of my perspective, or
change your mind. If you're genuinely curious, I'd encourage you to talk with
the next few taxi drivers you interact with, and ask them about it.
------
Punoxysm
I use and enjoy the services that uber offers. That said, it uses dubious
loopholes to evade the (misguided, anti-competitive) regulations taxi
companies operate under.
Letting uber evade the bad regulations instead of fixing them is a poor
solution (same with tesla and dealerships).
~~~
m_mueller
Whenever a market gets too distorted or even shut down, shady things (either
illegal or in legal gray areas) start popping up that allow people to evade
the distorted market. Alcohol prohibition, printer cartridges, keurig and
nespresso capsules, taxis, even the war on drugs, you can all boil it down to
this simple principle. At the end this is how change happens when at some
point the attempts to crack down on it are either given up or it leads to such
a severe police state that at some point a revolution happens. So I'd say
don't blame the player, blame the game - but still hold up the player to the
moral standards you'd like to see yourself (e.g. try to give your money to a
better organization than Uber).
When it comes down to these things I like to go back to Immanuel Kant: "Act
only according to that maxim whereby you can at the same time will that it
should become a universal law without contradiction.". I care much more about
this than about the law, especially laws that clearly don't have an actual
democratic process at their basis. Laws that come into place because of
lobbies pressuring or influencing politicians through money or other means,
where there is no real possibility for the people to overturn it, are in my
opinion not morally just. Unfortunately this means that there are almost no
laws I find just, other than those in my home country, Switzerland.
~~~
Pyxl101
Well said. I find it absurd how much local governments interfere with local
markets, like with taxis. I see no good reason (that will survive scrutiny
with Kant's Categorical Imperative) to legislate the number of taxis in a
certain area, like with medallions, or charge a high price for them. It's
effectively corruption and regulatory capture. It's anti-competitive and has,
by my analysis, no redeeming qualities that could not be accomplished better
another way.
I don't see a reasonable avenue for a company like Uber to change the laws
ahead of time. They only have the traction and resources that they do because
of their bias for action. A no-name startup petitioning the city to drop their
taxi legislation because the model is "wrong" will get nowhere. I don't see
how Uber could ever have come about with that approach.
Additionally, I am also not convinced that Uber's model falls under taxi
legislation by writing or intent. I do not believe that taxi legislation is
attempting to control for the same problems. Taxis pick up random people on
the streets, with effectively zero relationship ahead of time, and lots of
opportunity for individual consumer ripoff. People who use Uber have
established a relationship with the company ahead of time, before they need a
ride. They have chosen to use Uber _specifically_. The same choice and
discrimination is not part of hailing a cab on the street. Uber offers a
consistent price to people in an area, and its well-known brand has a
reputation to which people can associate bad or good experiences: for the
company as a whole, through their speech, and for specific drivers, with the
ratings system.
That said, I do also have concerns about Uber's attitude and their
intimidating and disruptive tactics toward the press, competitors, etc. They
have not comported themselves well enough to deserve the moral high ground,
though I will tend to side with them anyway on these legislative issues
because taxis are so dysfunctional.
~~~
m_mueller
That's a good point - if Uber should fall under Taxi law, so should
SuperShuttle and various other airport shuttle services. Once there is already
a consumer relationship in place, there is no need to protect consumers more
than with the normal anti fraud protection.
------
tach4n
As a Philly native whenever I head up to NYC one of the things that always
strikes me is how much better the cab experience is - which should tell you
something.
The setup we have now is just bad all around. It's not good for the drivers,
and it's not good for the passenger. One of the last times I took a cab here,
the driver spent the whole time on the phone talking to another driver about
how to cheat at inspections, disable the CC machine, etc.
------
colinbartlett
Edit: Nevermind. I was confused when the article said, "Pennsylvania's Public
Utility Commission recently allowed UberX to operate in the state, but not
Philadelphia." I took that to mean they were not operating UberX in
Philadelphia. But maybe it means they are? Illegally?
~~~
thenmar
There is UberX in Philly now, although as far as I know there were no
regulatory changes (and Black still operates legally). The PPA actually did a
handful of "sting" operations against UberX drivers when the service started,
calling an Uber and then impounding the vehicle
([http://www.phillymag.com/news/2014/10/26/uber-
philadelphia-u...](http://www.phillymag.com/news/2014/10/26/uber-philadelphia-
uberx-ppa-sting-impounds/)).
~~~
duaneb
As far as I am aware (I use uber quite a bit), Uber X is only available in the
suburbs. In the city, it's not available; I've only ever gotten the Uber black
sedans.
EDIT: This is no longer true, apparently my statement about using uber quite a
bit is also no longer true.
~~~
thenmar
UberX recently became available:
[https://www.uber.com/cities/philadelphia](https://www.uber.com/cities/philadelphia)
I've taken several in center city! (unsurprisingly, a much better experience
than CC cabs...)
------
91pavan
Seems like Uber cannot catch a break!
------
FallFastForFun
goes to show that the only ones upset by Uber are those in competition with
them
~~~
saosebastiao
I'm pretty sure there are a lot of people upset with them. I use uber pretty
regularly, and there is no way in hell I agree with the government sponsored
monopoly that taxis enjoy, but I don't like them. They're a shady company with
shady legal practices.
~~~
Igglyboo
Use Lyft?
~~~
saosebastiao
In Seattle, there are probably 50 uberx drivers for every lyft driver. I don't
know why they haven't caught on more, but they aren't much of an option.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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“Learn at least one new language every year” is bad advice - bhalp1
https://dev.to/bosepchuk/learn-at-least-one-new-language-every-year-is-bad-advice--207p
======
tboyd47
> Over the years, people have stripped that context away and turned it into
> something like this: "Learn at least one new language every year or you're
> not a good programmer."
It's generally bad advice to set up unreasonable expectations for yourself.
For some people, learning one or two languages (on an extremely shallow level)
in a year could expand their mind and make them more well-rounded. For others,
it might just be an invitation to a pointless busywork competition with your
peers. You learned two languages last year!? Well, I'm going to learn _three_.
In programming, we have no certifications and no licensing. If you can write a
program that does something useful to somebody, then congratulations, you are
a Licensed and Certified Developer, I guess. There's no definition between the
in-group of "true" programmers and all the other hacks who just got lucky. A
weird side effect of this is that these divisions emerge naturally through
developers' individual journeys of professional growth. "You don't become a
_true_ programmer until you do X." And so on.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Designed to distract: Stock app Robinhood nudges users to take risks - ryan_j_naughton
https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/confetti-push-notifications-stock-app-robinhood-nudges-investors-toward-risk-n1053071
======
af1991
״Rather than directing users to adopt a coherent strategy, the app pushes
riskier options like individual stocks and cryptocurrencies — and even offers
trading on borrowed money, known as margin, and options trading, both of which
are used by advanced investors but carry extreme risk.״
This is no better than forex or binary option trading. Assuming that people
who are using Robinhood's trading app aren't the most skilled and educated
traders, they should be treated like beginners. Instead of pushing them to
take risks the app should direct users to adopt a conservative approach,
especially when they are just beginning to trade.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Ask HN: How much of the Mythical Man Month still applies? - tocomment
======
spokey
This strikes me as a strange question. What aspects of the Mythical Man Month
do you feel no longer apply?
(That is, it has been a while since I last read it, but I can't think of
anything specific about TMMM that seems out of date as long as you take into
account the historical context. Maybe the "surgical team" stuff is a little
bit bloated relative to the scope of many projects and the strength of many
tools now-a-days, but I think you need to mentally account for improvements in
infrastructure and ecosystem as you read it--standing on the shoulders of
giants and all that. If memory serves, most of the underlying themes seem
still valid and relevant.)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Another experiment: No Rails at Railsberry 2013? - elamadej
http://blog.railsberry.com/index.php/2012/10/31/railsberry-2013-is-another-experiment-hint-no-rails/
======
taybenlor
That actually sounds kind of awesome. It's easy to get sick of the same Rails
news over and over. Plus Ruby has such a vibrant and exciting world beyond
Rails.
~~~
Argorak
Its not like there are no european Ruby conferences that include many topics
beyond Rails and even Ruby. E.g. wroclove.rb, eurucamp and even EuRuKo. So, I
don't see the big news here.
Calling a conference "Railsxxx" and then not doing any Rails sounds weird to
me.
~~~
elamadej
Yeah, "big news" is relative. Maybe it's no big news, it's cool, too! We just
wanted to share what our focus is going to be. People seem to react well (=>
twitter).
Why Railsberry? => it's still for Rails devs by Rails devs. And we love our
name :D
~~~
Argorak
Oh, I don't want to criticize too much. I am just quite surprised the only
all-out community Rails conference in Europe is suddenly non-Rails at all.
In any case, you are doing great work and I am sure that Railsberry will be a
success again!
~~~
elamadej
Thanks! Stay tuned for what's on the menu, we're sure as the programme
unrolls, it will answer some doubts ;).
That's actually a plan we came up with with Rails core team guys and hopefully
Rails community can benefit A LOT from this open-minded approach!
------
zgryw
For people that can't wait:
[http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://...](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://blog.railsberry.com/index.php/2012/10/31/railsberry-2013-is-
another-experiment-hint-no-rails/) ;)
------
amirf
Great idea. This would be a good opportunity to experience and experiment in
other technologies that don't get much spotlight. Will definitely try to get
there this year!
~~~
elamadej
Thanks, we thought so!
------
cientifico
I think part of the rails philosophy is to use the correct tool for the
problem you want to solve. If you want a blog, probably wordpress is the best
option.
~~~
gnufied
Dunno, but a static generator like Nanoc & Jekyll works much better than
Wordpress for me.
PS: I see the sarcasm though. :-)
------
doris
We're back online!
[http://blog.railsberry.com/index.php/2012/10/31/railsberry-2...](http://blog.railsberry.com/index.php/2012/10/31/railsberry-2013-is-
another-experiment-hint-no-rails/)
------
elamadej
Apparently the traffic killed us. GOOD PROBLEM :) Fixing it!
------
bilalq
Error establishing a database connection. Bad timing?
~~~
elamadej
apparently ;) working on it!
------
macarthy12
> Error establishing a database connection
~~~
elamadej
Thanks! We're working on it ;)
------
elamadej
And we're back up, thanks for your patience!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
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Show HN: A browser-based multiplayer clone of the DOS game Liero using WebRTC - basro
https://www.webliero.com
======
z3t4
It seem to run smooth. Very impressive. You should make a blog post/article on
how you did the game and the problems and challenges you solved. Should make
it playable on mobile, use accelerometer or what not.
~~~
basro
Thanks, for the compliment. I'll consider writing a blog post in the future.
It's actually kind of playable on android at the moment, but only if you have
a keyboard or gamepad plugged into the device.
I'm not really into mobile games and find touch screen controls a bit annoying
to use so I haven't considered adding support for it yet.
------
basro
Here's some video footage for anyone who doesn't want to play but still wants
to see what it's like: [https://youtu.be/oANleO-sE9s](https://youtu.be/oANleO-
sE9s)
------
billconan
wow, Liero is my favorite!
~~~
basro
Mine too ;)
------
thanksDr
THANK YOU!
~~~
basro
You are welcome
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
“OK boomer” isn’t just about the past. It’s about our apocalyptic future - eplanit
https://www.vox.com/2019/11/19/20963757/what-is-ok-boomer-meme-about-meaning-gen-z-millennials
======
ohiovr
I don't fancy myself as judge of the generations. Civilization is better when
it is civilized.
------
DATACOMMANDER
If the average Gen Z / younger millennial is as incapable of using the English
language to express his or her thoughts as Lepera is, I’m happy to forsake my
younger brothers and sisters and join Team Boomer. The best reply to “OK,
boomer”?
“Okay, moron.”
------
0x445442
Boomer's achilles => Believing truth by authority.
Millennial's achilles => Believing there's no such thing as truth.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Episode 1 of "Connections": A Series that Follows the History of Science and Technology - 3dFlatLander
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcSxL8GUn-g
======
3dFlatLander
The user who uploaded the Connections series has also uploaded other TV shows
James Burke worked on. You can find all the episodes here
[http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=JamesBurkeWeb&view=p...](http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=JamesBurkeWeb&view=playlists)
Also, there is a fascinating episode of the show that deals with the history
of computers (punchcards as a way of holding information) which is available
here <http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=0C43386079D8B683>
I hope you all find it as interesting as I did.
------
xsmasher
"The Day the Universe Changed" is equally brilliant - a guided tour through
the history of science and western civilization.
[http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001RCL5SQ?ie=UTF8&tag=...](http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001RCL5SQ?ie=UTF8&tag=smasher02-20&linkCode=as2&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=B001RCL5SQ)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Introducing Bootstrap Studio - 2a0c40
https://bootstrapstudio.io/
======
PhilWright
Great job, it looks really useful and something I would be interested in using
in the future. Some feedback...
1 - The webpage could make it more obvious that the paid for version is a
NodeJS based application. It took me a little time to work this out because I
read the start of the page and immediately went to the online demo.
2 - Provide an option to choose between Bootstrap 3 and 4, even when 4 is
fully released there will still be people stuck on 3 for quite some time. The
ability to create/edit projects with either will help you a lot.
3 - Raise you price to at least $99. Any professional freelancer or design
company will not think twice about this price point and can see it saves a lot
more than this in time on just the first project. I think you should be aiming
at professionals and not hobbyists. Odd though it sounds, the less people pay
the more they complain about a product and the more demanding the support they
ask for. Trust me, you could offer this for $10 and someone will still
complain that your 100's of hours of hard work is worth only $5.
4 - Always specify a time limit of a special offer. This creates a sense of
urgency and is the reason that offers work. Mention on your site when the
offer expires, otherwise people don't know and so they will wait. Then they
will miss the deadline and are either upset decide not to buy because they
wanted the cheaper price.
5 - If you have a roadmap of additions then mention some of the changes to be
released in the next year. This shows it is being actively developed and some
of the new features might be the ones people are waiting for before buying.
------
sam_goody
I know this is a Bootstrap tool, which means it has baggage.
But if something like this existed for email, I would buy it in a snap. I have
yet to find a desktop tool that can make decent responsive html emails, and
that is one of the main strengths that Bootstrap should offer. Skip the JQ
efects.
Perhaps you can make a email mode that is JS free, strips out the unused CSS,
and inlines the remaining rules?
~~~
rodriguezcommaj
You should look into [http://www.stampready.net](http://www.stampready.net) \-
along with Campaign Monitor's email builder
([https://www.campaignmonitor.com/features/create-custom-
email...](https://www.campaignmonitor.com/features/create-custom-emails/)),
it's one of the best drag-and-drop tools for creating really good, responsive
emails. The problem with any of these tools is that they still spit out
sometimes convoluted code, but that can't really be avoided since they need to
cover their asses in literally dozens of different popular email clients.
If you're looking to code, you should check out Litmus Builder
([http://litmus.com/email-builder](http://litmus.com/email-builder)), a code
editor specifically built for email design. Has a bunch of templates
available, instant previews in a bunch of different clients, email-specific
CSS inlining, etc. Full disclosure: I work at Litmus, but even if I didn't,
I'd still use Builder for the previews alone.
~~~
poxrud
Thanks. Do these support responsive emails on the gmail android client?
Unfortunately the gmail client does not support media queries, which makes
building a responsive email for it very difficult.
~~~
rodriguezcommaj
That's a good question. I'm not sure about StampReady, but Campaign Monitor
has a few of the best email designers in the biz working there (namely Nicole
Merlin and Stig Morten Myre) who strive for really robust templates. Nicole in
particular has written about her approach (typically called 'hybrid' or
'spongey' development), which works without media queries. It's basically
using fluid tables, max-width, and MSO conditional tables to get things
working and is the best approach around these days. You can read more about it
here: [http://webdesign.tutsplus.com/tutorials/creating-a-future-
pr...](http://webdesign.tutsplus.com/tutorials/creating-a-future-proof-
responsive-email-without-media-queries--cms-23919)
I wouldn't be surprised if Campaign Monitor's email templates built in their
builder follow the same approach. MailChimp's too, for that matter. The team
there use similar techniques.
------
kas0
[http://pingendo.com/](http://pingendo.com/) : good free alternative.
~~~
tuananh
Nice. Bootstrap 4 demo is available at:
[http://v4.pingendo.com/playground.html](http://v4.pingendo.com/playground.html)
~~~
levosmetalo
I got welcomed with the "Your browser is not supported, please use either
Chrome or Safari".
Sorry guys, but if your little app doesn't work in Firefox, I don't care about
it, it's probably not worth time to even look at it.
~~~
yoavm
I gave it a 30 seconds test with Firefox and it seemed to work. Probably not a
deep enough test to say that it works, but I guess it's not far from working.
I tried the Bootstrap 4 version.
------
flexie
Looks super cool and very useful. If anyone thinks that $25 or $50 is
expensive for 3 installs, they are just being disingenuous. That's less than
most devs charge their clients per hour and tools like this easily save a few
hours on each project.
And good to see another Bulgarian venture :-)
~~~
avighnay
$50 is nothing for such a tool for a one time payment! Even at that price it
is very difficult for the tool to make a profitable full time business model.
I want to also add that the 50% discount is not a helpful message either.
I always ask my team, how is that as developers we always want free software
but yet want a salary hike every year as a software programmer!
~~~
SeeDave
>I always ask my team, how is that as developers we always want free software
but yet want a salary hike every year as a software programmer!
A lot of people are short-sighted and self-centered. It's completely and
totally rational to buy this product if you're billing at $75/hr and this tool
saves you 10+ hours that you couldn't justify billing.
Some people just don't "get it" \- that you must produce something of value
before you can consume, and that every exchange must leave everyone better
off. This is what used to upset me about the software pirates, torrenters,
etc. It'll all catch up in the end though, so no need to over-analyze people
like this.
~~~
true_religion
I think a lot of people are not billing 75/hour or billing at all.
When you're at work, you typically just have to use the tools the rest of the
team does. Then when you are at home, working on a side project... it's
essentially a hobby and saving time in a hobby is just a 'nice to have'.
------
RobbyMcCullough
Wow this is gorgeous! Nice work.
I have a product in a similar space, Beaver Builder
([https://www.wpbeaverbuilder.com](https://www.wpbeaverbuilder.com)). A few
differences being that it's an in-browser tool and it's a WordPress plugin.
Who is your target customer? Are you hoping to improve workflows for frontend
developers or enable non-developers to build web pages? Also, what are your
thoughts on maintaining a Bootstrap Studio site?
FWIW, we hit a nice niche with freelance web designers and web agencies. Drag
and drop streamlines the development process and it also enables more tech-
savvy clients to jump in and make their own edits and updates.
~~~
Schrum
Sorry to go off topic, but i've been interested in your product for a couple
of weeks. I recently created a site for young people interested in horses. I
built it with a theme called KLEO that included Visual Composer. VC is having
insane load times, partially because of admin-ajax.php. Does BeaverBuilder
also make use of admin-ajax.php? Visual Composer is clearly too heavy and
unoptimised for us, so i'd be more than likely to go with BeaverBuilder.
~~~
RobbyMcCullough
You've heard of us!? No kidding!? That's awesome to hear. :)
We use a lot of ajax when the actual page builder is in use, but we do our
best to ensure that page load times for published pages are low as possible.
Outputting lean and efficient auto-generated markup (relative to what was out
there) was one of our big goals from the start.
We have a free version of the software in the WordPress repo:
[https://wordpress.org/plugins/beaver-builder-lite-
version/](https://wordpress.org/plugins/beaver-builder-lite-version/)
You can demo the tool, peek at the markup, and see how it well it plays with
your WP theme/install with the free version.
~~~
Schrum
Hey Robby, thanks for the reply. Yeah, I saw it mentioned a couple of times on
/r/webdev and /r/wordpress in threads where people were bashing VC while
talking positively about your plugin ;-)
I'll try out the lite theme and hopefully find it fitting to our site. Once
again, thanks for replying to my off-topic comment. I just had to take the
chance since i've been considering your product lately!
~~~
RobbyMcCullough
My pleasure. Feel free to shoot me an email anytime, too:
robby [at] fastlinemedia [dot] com
------
bpatrianakos
Is there a big market for WYSIWYG apps for developers? I think this is a great
application but might it be better targeted toward non-technical people?
Remember iWeb? This reminds me of a more developer-centric, flexible version
of that. But no developer would actually build with it. It was for the people
who now use Wix, Weebly, and Squarespace for their websites.
Developers should be able to put together a Bootstrap front end just as easily
in code and probably prefer working in code.
Maybe there's a huge developer market for this and I just happen to not know
anyone who'd be into this.
~~~
teleclimber
There is a whole spectrum of people who work "on the web" in some form or
another: hard-core developers, front-end coders, designers, small business
owners, content creators, etc... So any tool from Squarespace to
BootstrapStudio to Emacs is potentially useful to a subset of the market.
~~~
bpatrianakos
But this is specifically marketed toward developers and designers. So my
question is are there really enough of those developers and designers
interested in a WYSIWYG took or would it be better to drop the Bootstrap focus
and focus on the small business owners and content creators?
~~~
teleclimber
> But this is specifically marketed toward developers and designers.
"Developers and designers" encompasses quite a range of skills. Many designers
don't know how to code or don't want to deal with it, or would rather do it in
a visual editor rather than in a text editor.
On the other side, there are developers who aren't proficient in modern HTML,
CSS, web technologies, and the obnoxious-to-set-up modern web tool chain. A
GUI like this could be a handy way of bypassing some of these problems so they
can get that website built quickly without it looking like it belongs on the
1990s web. (I admit this case is more rare.)
> would it be better to drop the Bootstrap focus and focus on the small
> business owners and content creators?
I agree with you there, and that's actually what I'm working on. In my
application the web developer/designer can create custom "components" with
HTML and CSS and some rules on how these components can fit together, and the
site owner / small business person / content creator can manipulate their site
in a completely visual, drag-and-drop, edit-in-place environment. There are no
mandatory tie-ins with any frameworks or libraries, and the system doesn't
alter your markup or insert additional junk. Any valid HTML and CSS the
developer puts in will work and will come out essentially as entered.
------
jitix
IMO this is another example of unnecessary fragmentation of the dev tools
ecosystem. Why do we need a whole IDE for Bootstrap? Can't we instead make a
plugin for an existing IDE to accomplish the same thing?
~~~
detaro
Are there any widely used WYSIWYG web editors left that this could be a plugin
for? I can't remember seeing one of those in ages.
~~~
true_religion
Good question. Most designers I know use Sketch and I'm pretty sure Sketch
doesn't output HTML or CSS.
------
unusximmortalis
I salute this initiative. A free 3-7 days trial would be so welcomed though,
dispite the online demo which I assume it is not entirely the same as the
desktop app. Looks good otherwise, and love the comments from other people as
well. Love the price too.
------
codegeek
There is one more alternative that I tried before. Decent.
[http://www.pinegrow.com](http://www.pinegrow.com)
------
andrewingram
I find the existence of this kind tool to be strange, but that may just be
because of my preferred way of working. Despite the fact that i'm not hugely
keen on Bootstrap, I recognise that people find it useful. But do people
really love it so much that they build an ecosystem and actual paid apps
around it? It just seems like such a weird thing to focus your energy on.
~~~
assocguilt
Are you kidding? There are plenty of devs that build bootstrap front ends - if
this makes life easier for them and saves time / effort, it's an easy decision
to purchase this. There are other front end frameworks that with IDE's that
people pay for too such as vaadin. You're probably not in the target audience
for this.
------
elyase
Not Bootstrap specific but Macaw 1.6 [1] is now a free alternative since they
were bought by InVision.
[1] [http://macaw.co](http://macaw.co)
~~~
wx196
"Will you still be updating Macaw? Version 1.6 will be the last update to
Macaw."
------
dandare
This looks promising but I would need a free trial before paying for it.
~~~
yelnatz
I was actually hyped a little bit until I saw your comment. Forgot about the
price.
$50 for 1 year free updates and only 3 installs is a little bit steep.
~~~
chrisbennet
How much would you charge - if _you_ made it?
~~~
yelnatz
Same $50 but lifetime updates and no limited installs.
Charge me again for Bootstrap studio 3 or something but don't end updates for
2 after 1 year.
------
ryanmarsh
Wow. Very impressed. I'm a big fan of Webflow
([https://webflow.com](https://webflow.com)). I would love if I could use
Bootstrap in Webflow's visual designer but this is great.
~~~
samuell
Isn't Webflow based on bootstrap?
------
ksoul1
Love it.
I'm very bad at website design and at 25$ this is a no brainer . Can see
myself using this for small websites
~~~
siquick
^^this
Pretty confident that i'll get my $25 from it...
------
mixmastamyk
Pretty. I hope it doesn't mangle markup like GUI tools (that tackled the
problem) in the distant past did. Frontpage or Netscape Composer anyone?
~~~
geerlingguy
GoLive, Dreamweaver too. It's hard to convey semantic intent and create
efficient structures in markup when your tool has to be generic enough to have
a flexible GUI.
It still comes down to how skillful the creator is, to not end up with nested
divs and classes like "rt-col1-flex-span-head".
~~~
jqm
Adobe Contribute... i.e. Adobe code mangler.
That's been my experience in the past with these kind of tools as well. Its
easy to make a mess.
------
siquick
This is fantastic. Got more done in 5 minutes than I usually do in an hour of
trial and error.
Any keyboard shortcuts available? At least a shortcut for Duplicate would be
good.
Edit: Shortcuts here > [https://bootstrapstudio.io/pages/keyboard-
shortcuts](https://bootstrapstudio.io/pages/keyboard-shortcuts)
------
nevi-me
$25! Thank you! I'm buying me a copy right now! Someone was saying you should
charge $99 as freelance developers would buy it at that price, but as a
hobbyist who $99 is how much I spend on almost monthly groceries because of
the exchange rate, I'm glad that the price is at reach.
From looking at the site, this looks awesome, especially since I can import my
own Bootstrap themes. I haven't used a visual CSS editor in over half a
decade, and after the page refreshes that I spent time on just last night, I
hope this will be a great tool for me to use.
Thanks again :)
EDIT: I see it comes bundled with Bootswatch themes, this is awesome as I use
some of them! Great tool so far!
------
RaleyField
I'm not a web dev, but I had a plan for some time now for a small sideproject
and this seems it has a potential to accelerate things for me. Does it
generate fairly vanilla/idiomatic bootstrap? I would take the generated html
to the backend, but if I later decided to edit html directly I wouldn't want
to deal with weirdness left by your software. What are your payment options?
They seems to be hidden behind email form. Any weird drm? I seem to
format/reinstall OS more frequently and wouldn't want to deal with problems
arising from the software refusing to run when I change my distro.
~~~
georgel
I bought it about an hour ago. The code generation looks fairly standard. You
get 3 installs, but you can deactivate them to use elsewhere (it seems)
------
GFischer
Looks like a very useful product, I've tried and want to use these kinds of
tools.
So far I tried Pinegrow and Bootply, I'm certainly going to give this one a
try.
[http://pinegrow.com/](http://pinegrow.com/)
[http://www.bootply.com/](http://www.bootply.com/)
------
ddutra
I just made the purchase.
This tool will hopefully make my life easier. I'll still code everything
carefully by hand but I have a hard time imagining how the UI will look like
and I find myself spending quite some time coding and F5 repeatedly only to be
disappointed by the result.
These thigs come with experience. I believe people that dedicate their time
mostly to UI get real good and would not need a tool like this but for me I
believe it'll do wonders.
------
joeblau
This looks really cool. It seems like you have a lot of granular control over
the elements and layout. That being said, most of the websites I build these
days don't need this level of customization. I've found that Blocs[1] is more
my tempo. I just really want to organize structure at a high level, add
content, polish, and export.
[1] - [https://www.blocsapp.com](https://www.blocsapp.com)
~~~
mixmastamyk
Nice, but Mac only. :/
------
GFischer
Just a FYI, Chrome is giving me a warning on the HTTPS certificate (vulnerable
SHA1 certificate), try to get one from LetsEncrypt or make an update to your
StartSSL one.
------
lightlyused
Cool. When I added a new page (untitled.html) and renamed it the page name
change wasn't reflected back. Also, There appears to be a page tab for the
page editor, but I'm only getting one tab while I have more than one page
defined in the design.
------
CamatHN
I have enjoyed layoutit.com for simple free wireframing.
You can define your layout pretty quickly if you have ever made a bootstrap
layout before.
I know there are other alternatives as well but does anyone have any
significant experience with this?Is this a lot better, is this the best one
out there?
~~~
gadders
I'm no great designer and only doing hobby sites but I've found PineGrow
([http://pinegrow.com/](http://pinegrow.com/)) quite nice.
~~~
sp00ls
I tried using Pinegrow for my hobby stuff. It seems to work great but the
price is a little steep for someone who is just playing around with side
hobbies.
They hooked me on the $49 price when I started playing around and I was ready
to buy until I saw that the price jumps to $99 if I want master page support
and some other nice things.
I realize it is well worth it but I just can't justify a $100 editor for my
hobby projects. I just purchased this tool for $25 as its pricing aligns with
what I'm willing to spend much better.
------
mrlinx
Trial is crucial before buying.
------
kbenson
Part of me really wants to hand this to the users I program an internal webapp
for and let them spec the basic layout of the the pages, another part of me
knows that is a no good, very bad, horrible idea. :/
------
eruditely
I can't believe the negativity in the comments.
This looks great and I'll probably be looking to purchase this. I assume that
this would help me out when i'm fiddling around trying to make stuff look good
in react.
------
jorgecurio
bought it a short while ago
please tell me there's a code you are using for that wonderful checkout.
email-->entering postal code --> entering card --> done.
any reason why you are capturing postal code first?
I will post another comment with a review later
is this built using electron? where can you find a boiler template project
complete with installation wizard?
edit: just realized you can't even import HTML files or I'm dumb. I clicked
open but it only lets you select some proprietary file. This is a HUGE MINUS
because I was looking forward to editing existing bootstrap template and you
can't!
~~~
manigandham
The checkout form is Paddle:
[https://www.paddle.com/features/checkout/](https://www.paddle.com/features/checkout/)
Stripe also has the same thing:
[https://stripe.com/checkout](https://stripe.com/checkout)
------
tuananh
i think this can be achieved by a bootstrap snippet set; a decent text editor
with live reload/files watch setup.
a dedicated app is not needed.
~~~
smacktoward
It's $25. How much time would it take someone starting from scratch to gather
those snippets, choose a text editor, get it installed and configured, and set
it up to use the snippets, watch files, etc.? If their time is worth anything
at all I can understand the attraction of paying $25 to skip straight to the
part where they're doing the actual work people pay them to do.
~~~
tuananh
if you're a web developer, you should probably have those already.
------
ph4
We've been using this for about 6 months to bang out prototypes very quickly.
Happy with it so far.
------
nevir
It looks really interesting
\---
But:
"Bootstrap Studio is a desktop application filled with powerful features."
That line tells me absolutely nothing about it
------
lucaspiller
What CSS framework are they using for the app [0]? It doesn't look like
Bootstrap.
[0]
[https://bootstrapstudio.io/demo/assets/css/styles.css](https://bootstrapstudio.io/demo/assets/css/styles.css)
------
envy2
Just bought it after being quite impressed with the online demo, and figured
it was worth a shot for $25.
First impression after downloading: an unsigned OS X app? Really? This is
commercial software; it's not that expensive to get a dev certificate.
------
wizzy
Which is the OS they use in the video?
------
johnjackamend
Looks like a watered down Webflow
------
stylinggo
great resource for developers to work on bootstrap. It would have more been
interesting if free version was available.
------
CodingGuy
Only Chrome? Firefox please!
~~~
andreashansen
"Only Chrome" is just the demo. I assume the limitation is due to
BootstrapStudio being built with Electron (I believe).
------
sccxy
> Sorry, our online demo only works in Google Chrome for now.
Sorry, if you don't bother supporting Firefox or Safari, then I don't bother
looking your website either.
(No, I don't ask you to support IE 8)
Edit: Didn't know it was desktop application. Explanation below.
~~~
dyml
In all fairness, it's a desktop application, not a browser application. So I
wouldn't expect them to support every browser.
(written in Firefox)
~~~
sccxy
I guess big percentage of users who visit that page never get idea that it is
desktop app.
First lines (1200px height) don't mention desktop app.
>Introducing Bootstrap Studio
>A powerful web design tool for creating responsive websites using the
Bootstrap framework.
Then there is call to action button, which says that we don't support you.
Most users then close tab.
------
radicalbyte
Guys you need to get a trial version up ASAP. Few people will risk real money
on a tool from an unknown team without being able to try it out.
Now you're just wasting your marketing..
------
mattiemass
It's unfair of me, but I'm always turned off when I see a desktop app that
works on multiple platforms. That irrationally soured my first impression,
because I think it otherwise looks like a great tool.
~~~
fsloth
What? How on earth multiplatform support could be a bad thing?
~~~
sam_goody
If the developer were to have made a swift version for Mac, a C# version for
Windows and a C++ version for Linux, that would be very bad. A startup simply
cannot reliably keep all up to date, and the product would suffer.
If they wrote it in Java and in that way claim multiple platforms, I daresay
it would be even worse, on all platforms.
If they used a tool that did the conversion for them, it would likely be a
security and usability disaster, even though I need sources for that.
So a bias against a multi-platform tool is understandable.
The one exception is a Javascript tool, since things like Chromium have a LOT
of effort put into them by companies with thousands of developers on payroll.
However the number of tools that should run in such a environment is limitted.
~~~
anon2322
Guess what, it is that one exception. Also, now we have lots of apps developed
using electron, so welcome to 2016.
[http://electron.atom.io/](http://electron.atom.io/)
------
rmason
This looks very nice. But please move the video to the top of the page. Always
remember engage first, then offer people a chance to try it out in the
browser.
Also I had to reach the bottom of the page to find out that it was a desktop
app. Is it built in Electron? One last tip if this works as well as it looks
in the demo you could easily double your price.
~~~
Yaggo
The "Run Browser Demo" button engages me much better than video. I very rarely
have patience for linear media.
~~~
spyder
But only in Chrome. So the best would be show the demo button only in Chrome
and the video in other browsers.
~~~
Yaggo
Chrome-only demo is unfortunate in this particular case (I also use another
webkit variant). If you ask me, scrollable page with screenshots is still
better than video.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Send files at up to 1 Gbps and get 400 GB for the trial. Feedback welcomed - davehorne
======
lecarore
Is it just me, or the link is missing here ?
~~~
Cypher
Just you, it works fine on my end.
~~~
kull
Yeah works perfect on my end as well.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The Concept Creep of ‘Emotional Labor' (2018) - agarden
https://www.theatlantic.com/family/archive/2018/11/arlie-hochschild-housework-isnt-emotional-labor/576637/
======
anon1m0us
This article is about a term, "Emotional Labor" being used more broadly than
the inventor of the term appreciates. She thinks it waters down the impact of
the word.
Her definition of "Emotional Labor" is most succinctly: Work performed with
the intention of creating a _feeling_. Additionally, it's important in such
roles that you manage your _own_ feelings: You might need to be nicer or less
nice in your role than you're typically comfortable with.
Her examples are social workers, teachers, flight attendants. It might also be
a clown who is paid to make kids feel happy at a party even if the clown is
really sad that day.
The inventor of the term wants to be clear that there is no gender specificity
to it and that it might be a tool used by the feminist movement to classify
work mostly done by women as emotional work because women are emotional, but
that line of thinking shuts down conversations about emotional work that apply
to all parties involved regardless of gender.
~~~
AmericanChopper
> Work performed with the intention of creating a feeling.
This sounds like a pretty pointless classification to me. Any work that
involves any form of social interaction is going to fall into that category.
~~~
PeterisP
No, there's lots of work that involves social interaction, but any feelings
created during it are an accidental _side-effect_ and not the intent or
primary goal of that work.
A waiter at a fancy restaurant interacts with customers with an intent of
creating relevant feelings and the service is a big reason why that job exists
(it's not really about delivering stuff from kitchen to the table); while a
clerk taking applications at DMV also interacts with customers, but managing
their emotions isn't part of their prescribed duties, the job is about
processing the applications.
~~~
AmericanChopper
Any form of social interaction involves this kind of ‘labor’. Some jobs more
than others, but your distinction is complete nonsense. The DMV is just a poor
example, it still involves the same ‘labor’, just arguably less, as the DMV
has little incentive to care about their customers. But this relates only to
the value the company is trying to provide, not the nature of the work.
------
klingonopera
Reading that interview leads me to assume that it must've been emotional labor
for Hochschild to keep her cool at how badly people can misinterpret it.
There's physical, mental and emotional labor. The first is pretty self-
explanatory, the second involves thinking and the third involves keeping your
emotions in check in order to complete a task.
Whenever you have to put up a fake smile, that's emotional labor. Whenever you
have to be tough, but don't want to, that too is emotional labor. If your
emotional stability (or lack of) aligns with the task, it isn't. So if you're
a flight attendant and smile without forcing it (thus it isn't a fake smile to
begin with), there's no emotional labor involved. If you're a drill sergeant
and naturally grumpy and condescending, there isn't any either.
EDIT: In the cases above, when I meant that there's no emotional labor
involved, I meant that there's no _effort_ involved. The value of the labor is
still derived from the emotions nonetheless.
~~~
anon1m0us
It's not just about managing your own emotions, but emotional labor might also
be about producing emotions in other people according to her definition.
I think that helps people expand the word's meaning, because "People feel good
when they are in a clean house."
~~~
klingonopera
Apparently so, yes, but I'd contest that evoking an emotional response in
other people is actually _mental_ labor to begin with, and correctly applying
the ideas derived thereof is then the emotional labor.
EDIT: It appears it's a two-to-Tango issue. All the cases mentioned are with
another party involved, and whether it is to incite emotion or prevent it
(i.e. e.g. hiding an aggravation as a flight attendant), the emotional work
being done is within the subject itself.
------
jrochkind1
A couple points that hit home to me:
> One thing that I read said even the work of calling the maid to clean the
> bathtub is too much. It’s burdensome. I felt there is really, in this work,
> no social-class perspective. There are many more maids than there are people
> who find it burdensome to pick up the telephone to ask them to clean your
> tub.
And:
> There seems an alienation or a disenchantment of acts that normally we
> associate with the expression of connection, love, commitment. Like “Oh,
> what a burden it is to pick out gifts for the holiday for my children.” Or
> “Oh, it’s so hard to call a photographer to do family Christmas photos, and
> then to send it to my parents.” I feel a strong need to point out that this
> isn’t inherently an alienating act. And something’s gone haywire when it is.
> It’s okay to feel alienated from the task of making a magical experience for
> your very own children. I’m not just judging that. I’m saying let’s take it
> as a symptom that something’s wrong. I think a number of my books speak to
> that. The Time Bind says, wait a minute, what if home has become work and
> work has become home?
~~~
pjc50
> “Oh, what a burden it is to pick out gifts for the holiday for my children.”
> Or “Oh, it’s so hard to call a photographer to do family Christmas photos,
> and then to send it to my parents.”
The burden isn't so much in the act as the expectations and image management.
Especially with things presented towards parents. Is it going to be "good
enough"? Does it match the "perfect family" self-image? In situations like
this people become heavily invested in maintaining an image towards everyone,
including themselves. The work involved in this can be burdensome. But
actually presenting the true "messy" self is far scarier.
~~~
jrochkind1
In that second passage, I like that Hochschild tried to be clear, she is not
blaming these (mostly women) for finding that burdensome, she's saying we
should ask "What is up with our society that things that ought to be enjoyable
time with and caring for family, expression of love have become burdensome and
alienating"? And And, the unsaid next step, what can be done?
> I’m not just saying, “Oh, how terrible to think making a magical experience
> is alienated work.” I’m saying, “Well, why has it become alienated work?”
> The solution is not for men and women to share alienated work. The solution
> is for men and women to share enchanted work. These are expressions of love.
Why is it our personal family life seems like a job?
~~~
watwut
I do not think it is a job, but yes, a lot of it are chores. Sometimes you
derive pleasure from it, but other times you are just tired, hungry, without
idea, the store is overcrowded with nervous people (particularly around
christmas) the kid does not want anything and you really really just want to
go home watch a movie or read pointless hacker news.
The romanticism of "enchanted work" and "making a magical experience for your
very own children" is not realistic expectation. You don't have those magical
feelings around activities and duties that happen with regularity. First,
second time yes, eleventh time less so. Plis while the kids enjoy gifts, they
are not really magical to them. Especially around christmas, they get more
toys then they are able to play with.
And it really seems to me that those who romanticise child caring familly
activities the most are either the ones engaged in them the least or the ones
having ideological reasons. Stay at home mothers with no hobbies and whose
life's centers children to the point of excusing everything else are the least
romantic and the most pragmatic/mundane about it all - even as their only
topic is the kid.
~~~
jrochkind1
So, I think maybe you're actually confusing the thing Hochschild is trying to
distinguish.
It might seem like a chore in various ways, on the 11th time etc. It might not
be super fun or your favorite activity in the world. You might be tired and
rather be taking a nap.
But it shouldn't be _emotionally_ difficult to do routine caring things for
your family. And it shouldn't require you to pretend or force yourself to have
emotions other than you have. That is, Hochschild's definition of "emotional
labor". It shouldn't be "alienating".
~~~
watwut
I think I do understand it well. A family is not a magical space where you
suddenly cease to be human, where you own emotional needs and states suddenly
don't matter due to other people needing something.
The caring work is a work that requires you to force yourself (or manipulate)
or pretend emotions no matter what context. That is just what it is, that is
inherent part in it.
And when you are being tired, made passive by daily routine, want a nap, have
stress, that is when it becomes even more difficult to be emotionally in that
supposed magic space. Or at least, it is not automatic.
------
xenihn
On the few occasions I've heard someone use the term "emotional labor" in real
life (and not on Twitter), I've asked them to specify what it means, and every
person gave a different answer. It did pretty much boil down to "doing chores
and mailing holiday cards", though.
I had never seen the original definition before, and that's exactly what I
_thought_ it meant when I first saw the term, and it's also what I thought it
should have meant after I repeatedly saw it used in ways that I now know were
erroneous.
~~~
taneq
The discussions I've had around it have generally involved people defining it
as "managing and planning chores even if someone else is doing them," with the
canonical example being the stay-at-home wife who manages the household and
the husband who "helps" by asking her to micromanage him rather than just
taking the initiative.
By the article above, this definitely sounds like mental labour (although
still tiring) rather than emotional.
~~~
klodolph
The example I think of is choosing a meal for a household—anticipating every
household member’s reaction to the meal and accepting the consequences if
people don’t like it.
Basically, managing people’s emotions.
~~~
taneq
That sounds like a more reasonable example that matches the original
definition. I'll use this one next time it comes up amongst my friends.
------
erichocean
It's a sign of cultural decline that people can only relate to each other
using financial terminology.
The continued financialization of all things cultural is not a positive
development.
------
mlthoughts2018
Moral Mazes talks a lot about emotional labor, especially the expression of
fealty to one’s employer and enthusiastic participation in signalling
activities that demonstrate compliance with the internal moral and ethical
system the company creates.
That book posits that as you move up the ranks, this emotional labor becomes
much more important and serves as much more of the basis for judging if you’re
effective at your job than your nominal performance of subject matter tasks
related to the ostensible job functions you have to perform.
~~~
Mirioron
I think that being bad at emotional labor even (especially?) outside of work
is something that is looked down upon quite a lot in society. We generally
don't like the person that seems to get angry over minor issues, we expect
them to manage their emotions in these kinds of situations, especially when
they're not like 'us'.
------
pmichaud
I think this article misses the point. It's not about doing the chores. It's
about being the one who has taken ownership of the chores being done, by whom,
when, etc.
When people say it about chores, they mean they are in an unacknowledged
managerial role, and that "just tell me what you want me to do, and I'll do
it" doesn't solve the problem, because knowing what needs to be done and when
in the first place is a huge part of the work in question.
So sure, "emotional labor" is the wrong term. But it'd be better if the
argument against using it in this broad way were directed at the strongest
version of the claim, instead of a strawman.
~~~
neonate
An interview with the woman who coined the phrase, about what she meant when
she coined it, is hardly "missing the point". How people have used the term
may have moved on, but that's what the article is about.
~~~
pmichaud
I guess I wasn't clear, but I didn't mean the woman who invented the term is
missing the point. I meant the introduction to the article, written by the
author/interviewer, framed the misuse of the word in a way that hides the
reason that someone might be tempted to misuse the word in that way.
And one thing I was very clear about was that even when you use the better
frame, the people are still misusing the term, so I'm explicitly not
disagreeing with the inventor of the term.
~~~
neonate
Thanks for the clarification.
------
fibbery
Huh. I would have termed "emotional labor" as doing the work to maintain
harmony of relationships within and outside of the home. Like being the person
responsible for setting up family events, sending cards, remembering birthdays
etc. Also in parenting being the more present parent. While the need to be
household manager is more "mental load" like are we out of laundry soap or
when is the kid's next doctor appointment. But apparently those uses aren't
really accurate.
~~~
bendbro
Emotional labor is about managing _your_ emotions, not others. Managing
another's emotions may end up demanding physical, mental, or emotional labor
of your own- a massage, thinking about what gift someone might like, or
containing your irritation at someone not understanding what you are teaching.
The concept-crept, popular-feminist definition of emotional labor is more
about the target of your labor. The labor is emotional because the product you
create is an emotional one. Knowing the roles men and women typically choose,
it makes sense that feminism has latched onto emotional labor in this respect.
I don't think those uses are necessarily innacurate as I think they classify a
real phenomenon, but it is unfortunate the popular feminist definition of
emotional labor collides with the original creator's definition.
------
peterwwillis
Recently there was a conversation on Slack at work about gender pronouns.
Several people asked that everyone use "hey ya'll", "hey folks", "hey
everyone", etc instead of "hey guys" (when addressing an entire not-all-male
channel, for example). Two or three people fought this giving various
arguments about why this was unnecessary, calling it word-policing, value-
signaling, etc. Throughout, I made an attempt always to respond in a civil
manner, to try to explain reasoning behind counter-points, provide examples,
and make sure all voices were heard. I basically took it upon myself to be a
mediator for 30 people.
It finally ended after an hour, and afterward I realized I felt totally
emotionally drained. I had spent the entire time reacting emotionally
(internally), and then reacting mentally (externally). All that emotion, even
if it was "inside", had been chewing away at me as a form of stress. I had to
take an hour break from work to calm down. It did not feel good. "Emotional
labor" might not have been the right phrase, but it sure felt like my emotions
had just unloaded a 25-foot box truck.
~~~
1123581321
That’s a good example of the problem. Your reacting emotionally internally
didn’t help you do a better job, and may have been a liability, so a less
emotional person may have been more qualified to mediate. Also, you took on a
job no one asked you to do, and then complained about the cost using the
emotional labor term as an acceptable ploy for sympathy.
One of the biggest (and unintended) benefits of the emotional labor movement
is detecting either martyr-like or unhelpful behavior at home and the
workplace and coaching the person towards stopping it.
~~~
peterwwillis
That's a strange response. I never complained, and I certainly never looked
for sympathy. Also, is the martyr comment directed toward me?
My story is more one of explaining how what I experienced could be invisible,
as nobody came to me and said, wow, you must have gone through a lot. But
people do go through a lot, and it's often invisible. In my case I
"volunteered" for it, but others may be expected to take it on, which I
imagine is more stressful.
~~~
1123581321
Yes, it was directed at you (and others who act similarly.) I also am glad you
shared your experience and liked your comment.
------
dwoozle
I see the following phenomenon repeat itself: someone convinces the world that
a particular behavior, described by a particular term, is bad: bigotry,
racism, emotional labor, transphobic, sexual assault. Usually this is
straightforward because the behaviors are truly monstrous and the offenders
deserve to be un-personed. Then a bunch of other people draft behind this term
to air out their grievances: this person did something racist, racism is bad,
this person is bad. This works for some years, but eventually society just
normalizes out the effect of the word: if so many actions are racist, then
racism must not be so bad. When this happens, it actually lessens the
opprobrium that the hardcore offenders, the people whom the term was designed
to denigrate, experience.
It’s effectively trademark dilution.
------
al_chemist
Concepts creeps because when we want to affect world, we need to name things
first. When we name them, we need short phrase that will fit twit. Who cares
if somebody already used it to describe something different?! [1]
The other reason why concept creeps is connotations of previous meaning. Call
digital sharing a piracy. Call privacy breaching a personalization. Call
protester a terrorist. Call different opinion a hate speech. Call looking
lustfully a rape.
[1] I do.
------
baked_ziti
> I think this gets to perhaps a main confusion that is happening. I often see
> emotional labor referred to as the management of other people’s emotions, or
> doing things so that other people stay happy and stay comfortable.
This strikes me as something worth examining closely. Attempting to manage
(solicited or not, though I would guess most often not) other people's
emotions seems guaranteed to end in discord.
------
SolaceQuantum
The concept that 'emotional labor' has been sort of co-opted from its original
meaning, thus losing the actual significance of the term is quite interesting.
I kind of internally related it to 'spoon theory' use- clearly it was
originally meant explicitly for chronic physical illnesses, but I often see it
used for depression and anxiety.
~~~
faceplanted
It makes sense that happens, "spoon theory" is basically a metaphor for
"limited resources", anyone who looks at it without context is just going to
see a nice metaphor for a very common issue.
~~~
SolaceQuantum
Yes, but the expansion of the term somewhat dilutes and transforms the
original meaning of the term and its original context and usefulness. Similar
to what is being done here.
------
Causality1
>There’s no doubt that the unpaid, expected, and unacknowledged work of
keeping households and relationships running smoothly falls disproportionately
on women.
[citation needed]
~~~
SolaceQuantum
[0]
[https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/09/170926105448.h...](https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/09/170926105448.htm)
\- "Household chores: Women still do more"
Study confirms that women tend to do more housework than their male partners,
irrespective of their age, income or own workloads
[1]
[https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11199-017-0832-1](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11199-017-0832-1)
\- "Time, Money, or Gender? Predictors of the Division of Household Labour
Across Life Stages"
Results indicated women performed more housework than men at all ages.
[2].
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4584401/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4584401/)
\- "The Production of Inequality: The Gender Division of Labor Across the
Transition to Parenthood"
Mothers, according to the time diaries, shouldered the majority of child care
and did not decrease their paid work hours. Furthermore, the gender gap was
not present prebirth but emerged postbirth with women doing more than 2 hours
of additional work per day compared to an additional 40 minutes for men.
Moreover, the birth of a child magnified parents’ overestimations of work in
the survey data, and had the authors relied only on survey data, gender work
inequalities would not have been apparent.
~~~
Causality1
Thank you.
------
epx
It is strange how people always associate domestic work with women, or
something women are not compensated for.
I know I do _a lot_ of domestic work that my wife barely knows needs to be
done, or assumes it's trivial, or assumes "you are intelligent/strong/used
to/a XY warm body, so it's easy for you". And it mostly consists of things
that cannot be outsourced (perhaps a butler or secretary would help, but these
are more expensive than a maid).
Honestly I don't know who the hell falls for this kind of narrative.
~~~
raarts
I never thought of family care as something that needs to be paid. Should I
pay my wife for doing that work? In that case should she pay me for
shouldering the burden of working hard in a job I don't like making money I
don't spend myself? All this doesn't sit well with me. It's too
individualistic.
~~~
epx
The law accommodates for that - 50% of the assets for each in case of divorce.
Guaranteed not to be fair for most particular cases, but puts an end to the
discussion, and everybody knows the deal before marrying.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Choosing a framework; and why Django? - farhanahmad
http://blog.shopfiber.com/?p=90
======
jakelumetta
A good approach to the subject, not declaring that one is superior to the
other but rather each has it's own pluses and minuses that should be taken
into account depending on what it will be used for.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Most Europeans Now Prefer AMD CPUs over Intel - ekoutanov
https://www.techradar.com/uk/news/most-europeans-now-prefer-amd-cpus-as-sentiment-turns-against-intel
======
dijit
Not sure what the conclusion is there,
Europeans have less brand loyalty as a whole, I know a lot of central
europeans who are quite thrifty (or, very value conscious at least). And it's
not as if we don't see that AMD is crushing intel at this point. So shouldn't
the title be "Humanity prefers AMD"? or are Americans/Asians really buying
intel over AMD still?
~~~
onli
> _or are Americans /Asians really buying intel over AMD still?_
That's possible, brand loyalty is a thing. Not that I have good data about
this, but I definitely saw people not even considering AMD because they always
bought Intel. Same for Nvidia with GPUs.
In France I saw PC shops that had not a single AMD motherboard or processor.
That was during the FX era, but still. Ryzen will have changed that situation
a bit, but I doubt it's complete. During the same time AMD was still
surprisingly popular in Germany.
Markets are often not reasonable.
~~~
anarazel
> That's possible, brand loyalty is a thing
I think there's also a rational aspect for some groups. Developers and related
groups probably have outsized influence over what the whole market chooses. I
e.g. do plenty low level performance work, and like 95% of installations of
software I work on are on x86 Intel CPUs. Therefore getting an AMD CPU will
make it harder for me to sensibly diagnose performance issues. So I get laptop
/ workstation w/ Intel CPUs. And in turn I have less data to recommend
deploying on AMD servers.
~~~
onli
Yes, that's the danger, isn't it? You run the danger of missing when the
alternative offers are really much better - like now with Threadripper and
Epyc. Assuming that holds true for your workload, with the current generation
likely though.
Strong brand loyalty is sometimes rational for some groups, but not for the
market overall
------
dghughes
Intel vs AMD in the early days reminded me of two car dealerships competing.
Intel had its 5 liter V8 and AMD had a 3 liter V6 twin-turbo. Both engines
made 500 horsepower but Intel tried to persuade people that the AMD 500
horsepower was inferior.
------
alecco
Most Europeans don't care what AMD and Intel are.
~~~
smcl
That’s true of the USA as well, though. The point is, _of those who do care_ ,
more are leaning AMD and that is interesting. I’d be surprised if the US
wasn’t heading in the same direction
------
gigatexal
I doubt it’s brand loyalty as much as value for euro. As an expat here in
Germany I miss all the really good deals I took for granted while in the
states. With import taxes and sales taxes things are just expensive. So when
AMD is giving you about 90% what you get with Intel but with many more cores
and features not behind silly paywalls designed as SKUs its a compelling
story.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Which itches can I scratch? - gschiller
We're always told, "Scratch your own itch" when it comes to entrepreneurship. I think that this is bullshit. I want to solve problems where the money is.<p>What problems do you have to which I could create a solution?
======
helen842000
The 'scratch your own itch' is given as advice because it leads to better
solutions which lead to money. You are your own target market which makes
building decisions and selling easier. It gives you drive & motivation because
you know if it's something you'd use yourself or not & you have your first
customer from day 1 (yourself). Trying to build something for a group of
people you're not part of is tough and often results in a lot of guess-work.
One problem I'd like to see a solution for is for enquiry/quote based service
businesses. Tracking which advertising method brings the most
enquiries/bookings long term for small businesses. Also with reminders to
follow up the following week after a quote is sent. This currently has to be
done by combining several systems (analytics, gmail, calendar, spreadsheets,
handwritten notes) this could easily be improved & simplified.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Stay-at-home dad - joebeetee
http://www.facebook.com/tstocky/posts/996111776858
======
enraged_camel
The part about being viewed suspiciously at the playground was particularly
awful.
Why is it that we as a society are so fucking fearful? We have an irrational
fear of communists, socialists, terrorists, serial killers, sex offenders, and
of course, child molesters and abductors. Everyone thinks that there is
someone out there who is out to hurt them and their family. Like, that is the
_default assumption_ , and people's subsequent behaviors (such as pulling
their kid closer) is based on it.
A non-parent man sitting at a playground bench and reading his paper is very,
very likely to get the cops called on him, even though he's on public
property. Is this right?
~~~
dquail
Am I the only dad out there that constantly takes my daughter to the park /
science center / library alone ... and doesn't feel the least bit weird about
it? In 3 years I've received nothing but smiles and conversation for doing
this. Maybe it's a Canadian thing ...
~~~
kbenson
I was thinking the same thing, then I realized while I may not feel the moms
at the park are suspicious of me, I _am_ more ware of my actions while there,
and may even go so far as to say something out loud to make it clear I have a
child present (for example, call out to my son or daughter from where I am).
The truth is, while they may not show any signs of being wary of me, I feel
the need to assuage any concerns they _might_ have, as if the fault is somehow
mine, just by being male and present.
I'm not sure I've ever really examined it deeply before. it's eye-opening, to
say the least.
~~~
jemfinch
I don't think that's strange, and I don't think it's bad: nor do I think it's
something you're doing because you're a man.
Even in gathering of my closest friends, where we share _implicit_ trust that
every parent is looking out for all our children, I still take great care to
be aware of where I'm placing myself relative to a parent and his or her
child. If I find myself blocking some parents' view of his or her child, I
move. I (obviously) don't do this because I think they'll suspect me of some
malfeasance, but simply because I know they'll feel ever-so-slightly more
comfortable being able to see their kid.
Playgrounds are the modern analog to a watering hole: an _ad hoc_ "tribe"
forms around them, and by making it clear that your kids are at the
playground, you're saying, "I'm not an outsider, I'm a member of this tribe,
you can feel comfortable with me." Women do exactly the same thing, it just
manifests differently; usually in the form of smalltalk and mini-conversations
with other parents.
------
lotharbot
I identify very strongly with this.
I became a stay-at-home dad when my son was born 3.5 years ago, by choice,
because parenting is what I want to do with my life. My wife wanted a
technical career, and went back to work as soon as she was able. More
recently, my sister (a single mom) and her little boy moved in with us. My
sister works at the school down the street, and has a lot of other out-of-the-
home commitments. Both my son and my nephew were in school for half of the day
this last year, which meant I watched both of them every afternoon and many
evenings, and was on call whenever there was a problem at school (both are
special needs kids.)
Some of the challenges I've seen:
\- I dress like a stay-at-home dad, complete with scraggly beard and
sweatpants (no sense in getting peanut butter, pee, and play-doh on nice
clothes!) When I'm out at the store without the kids, people look at me like
I'm a predator. When I take a kid or two with me, they look at me like I'm a
saint, much moreso than the moms who have kids with them. [EDIT: when I lived
in small-town Utah for a while, taking a kid to the store got mixed reactions,
with some thinking I was a saint and others thinking there was something wrong
with me. In other areas, the reaction was almost uniformly "saint".]
\- My grandfather grew up in an era of man works - woman does childcare. He's
constantly asking me when I'm getting a job, and doesn't understand when I say
"this is my job".
\- I actually will be working outside the home, in a school, during the coming
school year. A number of people have expressed sentiments along the lines of
"good for you, glad you're finally doing something with your life", as if my
son raised himself and I had nothing to do with it.
\- I'm constantly hearing about support groups for parents, and they almost
always have "mom" somewhere in the name. Some of them will say that dads are
welcome too, but it's still awkward. The only real support group I have was
accidental - a bunch of people from church were all getting together, and then
everyone quit except for me and a few moms and our preschoolers.
~~~
el_fuser
I sympathize, brother.
My most irksome comments were "So... Giving mom the day off?" whenever someone
would see me with my kids.
The most egregious thing to happen, was being kicked off of the local meetup
for playdates... I assume I was approved to join the group because my first
name is gender neutral.
Sometime between posting my profile pic (which included my kids) and attending
my first meetup, I was removed from the group.
~~~
lotharbot
I should amend my previous post to note that Hacker News has provided a bit of
support. There are a surprising number of stay-at-home dads here, and being
able to converse with people who both understand my situation _and_ have some
technical chops is really refreshing.
------
tokenadult
It was way back in 1992 that I radically reshaped my career plans, coincident
with the birth of my first son (who, gratifyingly, is now grown up and
supporting himself as a hacker for a startup). I read the comments here, read
the fine article, and still don't completely grok that I have had much the
same experience without as much surrounding cultural baggage. Predominantly
"stay-at-home" (a better term might be "near young children") fathers have
always been rare, yes, but they have been around for a long time. I have
certainly always been able to go to public parks with my children (the first
three of whom were boys) or to the library or other places with them.
I haven't heard a lot of the kinds of nasty comments that the author of this
interesting submitted article appears to have heard all too often. For me,
since we had children, it has been important to spend a lot of time with my
children while they grow up. They are only young once each. Way back in the
early 1970s, I thought, evidently overoptimistically, that women's liberation
would be a force to make it possible for dads to spend more time with their
children if the dads so chose. Maybe that doesn't happen as a matter of social
reality everywhere, but that is the choice I made, and I'm not looking back.
All of my children, the three boys and the one girl, are already thinking
ahead about what kind of lifestyle trade-offs they will work out with their
spouses when, as they hope, they have children of their own.
One cannot emphasize the author's point too much that taking care of young
children is a lot of work that demands constant vigilance. Authors from the
women's liberation perspective used to argue that that is one of the best
reasons to hire former homemakers as they return to the outside-the-home paid
labor force--it takes strong personal organization skills to take care of
young children. I don't know if that's what big company employers really
think, but it sure makes sense to me.
To be clear for onlookers new to my posts here, we are a homeschooling family,
so the high parental involvement with children (again, not "stay at home" but
"out and about with the children") has continued in our family even though our
youngest child is above typical school-going age. We like this lifestyle,
because we like what it appears to be doing for our children. There are trade-
offs involved in any lifestyle choice that relates both to family and to work
responsibilities, but there is plenty of time for working in anyone's day, and
a lot of good memories that can be built up from quality family time.
~~~
Domenic_S
Thanks for this. My wife stays home to take care of our newborn, we're
strongly considering homeschooling, and it sometimes feels like a very lonely
place out here in mega-career-driven SV.
------
joebeetee
Whilst I appreciate the discussion points around gender/sexism, I personally
have felt more discrimination from the kids / no kids situation, on more than
one occasion.
I recently interviewed at a large company and did very well on all the
questions, connected with the interviewers, had long chats with the recruiter,
etc - but didn't get the job. I suspect one of the reasons I didn't get the
job was the fact that I mentioned my wife/kid. The team that I interviewed for
were all fairly young (so am I) but I think the kid thing could've thrown them
off.
This may just be an issue at and job level that I am applying at and I'm very
prepared for the fact that it may have been because I didn't do as well as I
thought, but I have no idea what else it could've been. Would be great to know
if anyone else has ever felt this.
~~~
avalaunch
Ripped directly from a rejection letter I received:
"I think instead of making a more detailed offer, I should consider certain
facts.
For starters, you have a family and that'll be the driving force behind all
your decisions. Secondly, you will not be able to be here in the program with
me. Ideally, I want someone who could be here though not necessary. More
importantly, it's the family situation I consider. I've worked developers
before with family and the company died largely because of that. I don't want
to say that'll happen but I worry.
This other candidate is like me. No responsibilities except {COMPANY NAME}.
That makes life less complicated. Based on this - nothing to do with skills -
it's best that him and I work together. "
The program was one of the startup accelerators (not YC). He was right that my
family would have been the driving force behind all my decisions. He was wrong
in thinking that's a bad thing. I can't imagine a bigger motivator than my
family. When you have kids, failure just isn't an option.
~~~
tokenadult
You received a rejection letter that basically lists illegal reasons (in most
states I'm aware of) for rejecting you. You were lucky not to get that job, as
the boss is clueless about the legal responsibilities of hiring supervisors.
You have a basis for a lawsuit there, if you need the money or want to make a
point. If you are not litigious (I am not litigious either, so I respect
anyone's decision to decline to exercise legal rights), you at least there
have tangible evidence that there is some better employer in the world whom
you would be better off working for. Good luck in your career. Good on you to
think about your family responsibilities while participating in the
competitive world of work.
~~~
Tichy
Assuming that having a clue about legal responsibilities of hiring supervisors
is the most important skill of a boss :-)
I think it is good if somebody is honest. And his reasoning actually seems
sound.
~~~
avalaunch
What exactly about it seems reasonable? He's making assumptions about my
dedication based on the fact that I have a family. From that alone he really
has no idea how many hours I would be willing to put in, how dedicated I'd be
to the business, or how hard I'd hustle for him.
The only thing that seemed reasonable to me was wanting to work with someone
that could physically be there with him at the program. If that were the sole
reason for going with someone else over me I'd have understood perfectly.
Instead he's basing his decision on weak anecdotal evidence. He worked with
one other family guy that wasn't as dedicated to the business as he himself
was and he came to the conclusion that the family part was what was holding
him back from being a better partner. That doesn't strike me as sound
reasoning at all.
~~~
Tichy
I was thinking mostly about the remote vs local aspect. You are right that
speculating on your motivation seems misguided. Although perhaps it's also not
totally far fetched to assume that somebody with a family would want to spend
some time with said family.
------
Tichy
I agree with his experiences, and there would be more to add. For example our
baby-friend families usually were connected via my wife (from birth
preparation classes for example), so it was a bit harder/more awkward for me
to call them up to hang out so that our kids could play together. That's not
active discrimination, just stuff that happens.
I wanted to throw some other thought to HN: I've come to the conclusion that
we won't see a big surge in "stay-at-home-daddying". I have nothing against
it, but ultimately I think the rationale would be "why would I pay my
babysitter half of my salary" (which is what a stay at home dad is getting)?
It seems to me a mother still has a bigger claim to her children because she
invested much more physically, so society will deem it more acceptable if she
does the stay-at-home thing, getting paid more than a mere babysitter.
Or will it become feasible in the future to speculate on becoming a stay-at-
home dad? For example (extreme to make a point) instead of taking on another
career, take classes in cooking and home decoration in the expectation to one
day take care of a home? It seems very unlikely to me, although of course
there will be (and already are) lots of women who have and want interesting
careers. But would they go forth and marry a guy with no skills but home
honing? Please spare me the sexism comments, I want to think rationally about
this. (I personally don't care who stays at home). The point is that it is
very viable to speculate on becoming a stay at home mother imo.
~~~
mtrimpe
I forgot which country it was but one of the Nordic countries tried hard to
get parental leave taken and in the end they had to make 2 of 6 months of
(fully paid) leave exclusively for the father.
Once they did that and the family was actually leaving paid leave on the table
otherwise, fathers are now nearing 40% of birth leave.
~~~
Tichy
Granted, I wasn't even thinking about the paid paternity leave. Obviously if
the state pays for it, the thought "how much am I willing to pay my
babysitter" is not a factor. It's actually fascinating that despite full pay a
lot of dads apparently prefer to stay at work? I can only assume that they
worry about a negative impact to their career in the long run (ie employer
doesn't think they are loyal enough to promote them)?
~~~
rayj
Assuming: 150k/yr salary * 0.5 (paid leave) * .33 (4 months) =$24750 for just
raising a kid, damn.
To be the devil's advocate, why not let people who do not have children take a
4 month paid ($24750) vacation every 5 years? I would like to take a round-
the-world vacation for 4 months...
~~~
ecopoesis
Because promoting round-the-world vacations isn't the business the government
is in, but promoting good families is.
~~~
rayj
TFA said that Facebook paid it his parental leave. If FB thinks it is worth it
to retain him as an employee, it's their money.
The US government on the other hand seriously doesn't give a fuck about
families since most of their programs are oriented to single mothers. Also
there is no federally mandated parental leave
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parental_leave](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parental_leave)
------
callmeed
My 3 youngest were born within the span of 4 years. Any time I'm out with all
3, someone usually says "boy, you've got your hands full!" ... it's odd
because (a) I find it quite easy to manage them and (b) no one has ever said
that to my wife even though she gets "frazzled" (for lack of a better term) by
them easier than I do.
~~~
Pxtl
Ditto. Doubly ironic since my use of a ring sling means my hands are, in fact,
free.
------
joebeetee
There is so much food for thought in this article. Particularly liked his line
"Don't worry, I'm not going to nab your kid, I already got this one."
Interesting how the author felt that people could say things to him that they
wouldn't say to women in a similar situation.
~~~
pbreit
If he actually said those words, I think I'd be even more creaped out. Who
jokes about kidnapping?
~~~
gmaslov
Anyone but a kidnapper, I'd say.
~~~
pbreit
Isn't it almost cliche to joke about your true self. Regardless, still a
creapy thing to say to the parent of a toddler.
------
networked
One thing we as a society owe to a stay-at-home dad is, out of all things,
cyberpunk. William Gibson famously found his interest in science fiction
renewed and began to write while staying at home with his first child.
~~~
sampo
Yeah, Wikipedia quotes:
''In 1977, facing first-time parenthood and an absolute lack of enthusiasm for
anything like "career," I found myself dusting off my twelve-year-old's
interest in science fiction.'' —William Gibson, "Since 1948"
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Gibson](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Gibson)
------
rudog
"Don't worry, I'm not going to nab your kid, I already got this one."
Is this common place? As of a father of twins; I regularly take my kids to the
park and either I'm oblivious to these looks or I am too busy playing zone
defense on two almost 3 year olds that I don't even notice.
~~~
stevewilber
As a work-from-home dad with a very flexible schedule, I spend quite a bit of
time at the park during work hours. My experience is closer to yours than most
others in this thread. I find the moms/nannies/grandparents quite welcoming
and friendly. Occasionally a topic of conversation will come up that may be a
bit awkward, but otherwise I don't feel that I'm treated much differently. I
certainly have never perceived that anyone felt threatened by my presence.
I'm not sure what would account for the difference. I live just a few miles
from FB headquarters and am in the same demographic as OP.
~~~
mathrawka
I'm in the same situation... gotta love doing the bulk of your work before 8am
or after 8pm (sometimes both in the same day) ;)
_may be a bit awkward_
Usually more than a bit awkward as they talk about trying to have more kids or
women hygiene... that is when I just pretend my daughter needs some assistance
and I walk off to "help" her.
------
Pxtl
Stay-at-home dad fist-bump. Here in Ontario, parents have the right to split
their parental leave. We did it the traditional way for the first two... for
round three, we split it 60/40, and I got the big side.
I wouldn't trade this for the world. My kids are juggernauts of exhausting
destruction, but I knew this was my only chance to get this kind of extended
time with them and I wanted it.
One thing is that the only sentiment I agree with is the frustrating low
expectations. I'm not superdad, I'm regularparent. The patronizing "you're
such a great husband" thing constantly makes me cringe. I'm not even _good_ at
this - I shout at the kids more than I should, and when I get overwhelmed I
just bury my head in my phone and read Facebook and HN and ignore whatever
they're destroying.
But otherwise? Maybe it's Canada, maybe it's that I live in a university
neighborhood, maybe I'm just that awesome, Idunno... The local moms have
accepted me as one of their own while we bitch about homework. I don't get
suspicious looks at the playground, and I'm as scruffy as the next geek (sweat
pants are unacceptable though, have some pride, man).
But then again, maybe I'm just oblivious. I know my wife has gotten some...
unfortunate questions and comments about going back to work with a 5-month-old
baby, and that's not cool.
edit: I think I may have my wires crossed between whether I'm replying to the
FB post or to one of the other commenters. Sweat pants was not in TFA.
~~~
lotharbot
Sweat pants was me. I'm also scruffier than most geeks. And on the autism
spectrum, and therefore have more awkward mannerisms and social habits than
most geeks. None of which are really exactly the point.
I've seen other dads who are considerably less awkward in the same situation
in the grocery store or at the park. Maybe it's different where you live, but
here there's an expectation that men who aren't at work during the day are
highly likely to be predators, or druggies, or something else unsavory. It
doesn't seem to cross peoples' minds that a guy my age at the store at 11 am
on a Tuesday could be just a normal dude who takes care of his own kids most
of the time. Unless we have a kid with us, in which case we're clearly super-
dad.
------
cristianpascu
I remember when I was a very young dad, and 15 minutes with my very young son
was torture. I see myself in much of what he tells. Much of it by imagining
the now dad of a 10yo as a dad of 4 months old son.
But there's one thing I can tell for sure. A father can not replace a mother.
I wouldn't take offense if a woman asked me why isn't my wife taking care of
the child. In the past 10 years there were countless cases where my wife
handled things entirely differently then myself. Specially the emotionally
relevant things, which are extremely important at early stages of child
development.
There is no gender equality when it comes to what a child needs. A child needs
the smile of a mother as much as they need the smile of a father. And one can
not replace the other.
~~~
3825
>There is no gender equality when it comes to what a child needs. A child
needs the smile of a mother as much as they need the smile of a father. And
one can not replace the other.
There is such a heavy statement that I cannot begin to explain how wrong it
is. Are you saying that a single parent cannot raise a child on her (or his)
own? In the absence of any scientific evidence in your support, I'd say you
are absolutely and terribly wrong. How can you say "a father cannot replace a
mother"? I don't mind you not taking offense. I don't mind your assertion that
your wife is a better parent than you are. However, it remains at best
anecdotal. Your leap of faith from one example to a broad generalization that
irreparably harms not only women but single fathers and same-sex couples in
one broad swath is very disturbing. I hope you realize that.
~~~
cristianpascu
If you think a single mother raising children is happy, than we don't share
the same definition of happiness.
I was raised by a responsible woman married with a _very_ irresponsible man.
~~~
3825
I respect your personal experience but we cannot draw conclusions that can
hurt a lot of people without backing evidence. I hear stories about how
alcoholic mothers get custody of children over responsible dads. We do not
have full support from the people in terms of same-sex marriage. In a
situation like this, generalization like this probably does more damage than
it is worth.
I wouldn't say the mother is happy. I'd imagine she'd be overworked unless she
had some help (grandparents perhaps?). However, I'd not make any statement
that might be seen as her not being _capable_ of doing as good a job.
------
spamizbad
His experience mirrors closely with my friend, who is a stay-at-home dad. All
the crap this guy puts up with strangers is pretty prevalent - my friend's
experienced the same, and worse, as he's been doing it longer.
------
shirro
Women are graduating in higher numbers and getting better positions. My wife
has a permanent secure job so I made the practical decision to be home dad 5
years ago. It is a huge readjustment for anyone not used to looking after kids
regardless of their chromosomes. Junior primary and preschool teachers
(universally women) and women at playgroup are very accepting. My kids
probably miss out a bit on the social activities mums seem to plan with each
other but they get to kick a football with dad and dig holes in the back yard.
I take my youngest to the park to play in the playground nearly every day.
Perhaps I am just thick-skinned but I don't notice being treated any
differently and I see plenty of other dad spending time with their kids.
The only time I felt I got the predator treatment was when we lost our escape
artist kid in a big store and I found him at about the same time as one of the
staff members and she snatched him from me and handed him over to his mum. I
think that was just good training rather than a reaction to my beardiness. His
mum had reported him missing while I went and found him so the staff member
had no idea who I was.
------
fredrikcarno
My twin boys are now 10 month and me and my wife decided that staying home
both of us for a year to give them a good start was a good idea. It was, and i
can really recommend people doing the same even if it means having to make
tough decisions like changing jobs and not buying that new car
Have a great day
Best Fredrik
------
anotherevan
I've been doing the primary parent thing for about 16 months now. My story is
probably a bit different in that I've started it much later in my children's
lives than all the any other articles I read.
Basically I worked full time and my wife worked part time for the first 12
years. She had been wanting to go back to work full time, and we had done a
test run when she covered someone on maternity leave for six months, but both
of us full time just wasn't working and everyone was miserable by the end of
it.
Then in 2011 an opportunity came up for me to work part time, mostly from
home, and we decided to swap and give things a go. So I didn't start with
infants, but with a 12 and 10 year old. It's been interesting so far.
------
qznc
Odd that stay-at-home women label themselves as "not working". I often try to
convince my wife and others to proudly answer "mother" when asked for their
work. It might not get payed, but it surely is a lot of work.
~~~
autodidakto
I think "homemaker" is a dignified, gender neutral term. But for subversive
fun, I like the title "househusband".
~~~
anotherevan
I like to riff on the old Bella Abzug quote and say I prefer the word
homemaker because househusband implies that there may be a husband someplace
else.
I usually go with "primary parent." Speaking of which, it has been
surprisingly hard to get the school to list me as the first person to contact
instead of my wife since I became the primary.
------
tigroferoce
I envy you Tom. As a working-(too-much)-father, I work more than I see my kids
and I feel like I'm losing something big.
As others I radically reshapes my carrer when my first daughter was born
leaving unsafe research field for the safer and higher paid industry. While
I'm pretty OK where I work now, I miss so much the freedom in terms of working
hours and time tables. I'd like to find a job where I could spend more time
with my kids, even at the price of a lower wage.
Best and good luck for you coming back to work (BTW, the next months will be
_WAY_ more physically exhausting).
------
golemmiprague
Honestly, I got no clue what you all are talking about. Never had problems or
felt weird looks in the play ground, never got compliments for changing
nappies or anything like that. I think most people are used to dads taking
care of kids these days, and I am not even living in some inner city
sophisticated place.
------
crasshopper
The author was astute enough to see his difficulties as a microcosm of what
minorities regularly experience. That seems to have been lost in the HN
commentary.
------
furyofantares
I'm amazed that this comes from a such a short absence. I kept having to
double check that I hadn't misread it.
------
IzzyMurad
> being constantly alert
A good or a retarded dad? I am not sure. What trouble a 0-4 month old baby
could get into if you put him in a place where he could not fall?
~~~
jpatokal
_to run toward me screaming with excitement after I 'd been away for awhile_
Hint: That's not a 0-4 month-old child... and that's because dad took his four
months off after mom had returned to work.
~~~
Domenic_S
I was confused myself, to be honest. Eventually worked it out that this was
later in the kid's life (who goes to a playground with a 0-4 mo old?), but it
was a little confusing.
------
Dewie
> It also still gets under my skin when people call it "babysitting" or "daddy
> daycare."
It seems like a lot of people feel that dads can only be second-rate
caregivers compared to moms, as if they were to take care of a toddler it
would only be as an assistant or subordinate to the mother.
~~~
rabidonrails
my father always says "if they're your kids, it isn't babysitting"
~~~
Dewie
Saying to a dad that he is babysitting is so demeaning. It's like saying that
his investment in his own child is on the level of that teenage girl next door
that babysits his child every other week because she needs the 10 bucks to buy
gas.
------
techboots
Looks like FB jumped the shark if they're employing guys who leave for 4
months, or gals like Sheryl Sandberg who leaves work 5pm every day.
I get it - yes, it's nice and wonderful. But... Frankly, I wouldn't want to
work with coworkers like this. Entrepreneurs don't make silly justifications
like this -- only employees play this political game. And quite frankly, I
wouldn't put up with actions like this - I'd quit in a heartbeat, or tone down
my work time as well to match. Hey, just because I don't have a kid, doesn't
mean I shouldn't get time off - why punish me for that. Not fair. I'll take my
time off to work on my own projects.
If you have a family, it may just be better to sit out of the game for a while
rather than dragging the work quality of everyone else around you down.
~~~
marquis
I hope this comment stays online for the remainder of your life, so when you
have a family you love and you see how beneficial it would be if you had more
time and home as your children grow, you look back here and feel just a little
sheepish. Any company that truly respects people understands that taking a few
months of work, or only working part time, does not in any way, at all,
degrade the quality of the work. I see this first hand every day and I'm proud
to support my coworkers and be supported.
~~~
techboots
Fully agree, life & family is more important. I think if I really wanted to
spend more time with my family, I'd just quit the job rather than trying to
play the benefits system to get 4 months of paid leave.
Families get in the way of work. It's just that simple. There's less time to
pull all-nighters. Once a company starts encouraging "family people," it
becomes a certain type of place. It's a type of place that doesn't really vibe
well with entrepreneur-types or young single guys perhaps... but it may be the
perfect sort of place for family types. Like Microsoft or Cisco. Facebook is
becoming like that. It's not necessarily bad for everyone.
~~~
marquis
>"Families get in the way of work. It's just that simple"
I'm really sorry for your way of life, I really am. I mean that in the nicest
possible way, that I hope you find that there is a beautiful, loving world
outside the office, that informs your work and why you are working.
~~~
techboots
You might want to read my whole statement. I appreciate that there's a
"beautiful, loving world outside the office."
It's precisely because of that that I wouldn't want to spend all of my time
inside that office - I'd want to spend it with my family. And because of that,
I wrote "families get in the way of work." It really is that simple. People
with family have more beauty & love in their world, they realize what's
important in life, and they spend less time in the office. And that's
perfectly fine. But in such an environment, certain other types of people
(bored single guys who really want to work long & hard) will not find
themselves feeling entirely comfortable.
Companies tend to gravitate between the two ends... either super hard working,
or laid-back family types. You can see that FB is drifing towards the latter.
Which is perfectly fine.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Choosing an SSO Strategy: SAML vs OAuth2 - ejdyksen
http://www.mutuallyhuman.com/blog/2013/05/09/choosing-an-sso-strategy-saml-vs-oauth2/
======
sk5t
Some minor notes:
Conventionally, "authn" means authentication, "authz" means authorization, and
plain old "auth" doesn't mean anything in particular.
I don't think it makes sense to blame SAML for the awkwardness of using the
passive browser sign-in scenario for something for which it was not designed.
There are other profiles and other protocols available from any competent
security token service.
Also bear in mind there is a tremendous amount of confusion around the SAML
terminology, which can mean the token format, or the protocol for exchanging
authentication request messages, which are entirely separate things.
------
brugidou
Naïve question: why isnt any service on the internet providing sso using
kerberos? The protocol seems to be appropriate.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Apply HN: FundChan.com – funded channel messaging - jimbursch
FundChan is a messaging auction platform where senders place bids to get their message to the front of the recipient's message queue.<p>This addresses the problem of communication in asymmetric relationships -- I know you, but you don't know me, so how do we open a channel of communication that works for both of us?<p>Enter FundChan.com, which is live and fully functioning at <a href="https://fundchan.com" rel="nofollow">https://fundchan.com</a>. (note: I have zero traction/users, which is why I am applying to YC).<p>Here are examples of asymmetric relationships/use-cases we may address:<p>In Hollywood: -- fan/celebrity or C-list actor/A-list director<p>In Silicon Valley: -- salesperson/CEO or CEO/investor<p>In World: -- advertiser/consumer<p>FundChan features person-to-person direct messaging as well as targeted public messaging.<p>I have been working on this project for over 10 years now, so, yes, I am obsessed. The project has also evolved and iterated over the years as my understanding and approach to the problem has changed, as well as my programming skills (php/mysql).<p>I am ready with answers to your questions! Feel free to post hardball comments -- I can take it.
======
jimbursch
Here are a couple of videos that describe the conceptual underpinnings of
FundChan. Please forgive the low production values -- I fully own that I am a
dork. These videos were posted many years ago, so you can get a sense of how
the project has evolved.
Charting the mindshare market
[https://youtu.be/5EJGF7hddc8](https://youtu.be/5EJGF7hddc8)
I Hate Advertising
[https://youtu.be/TyuVeIIRb8o](https://youtu.be/TyuVeIIRb8o)
------
buss
Seems like you have a pretty hard chicken-and-egg problem, since you've been
working on this for so long without traction. How are you going to attract
users? What have you tried and why have those things failed?
If I was a celebrity or someone important, why would I sign up to receive
unsolicited messages for a pittance? I feel like you have a value mismatch --
people worth contacting want a strong filter (high $ value), and the people
that want to contact them won't want to spend that much. The only people who
will be reachable will have a low value and probably aren't worth contacting.
How do you know people want this?
~~~
jimbursch
Excellent questions - thank you!
I'm going to answer your questions in reverse order.
_How do you know people want this?_ First off, I want it, and others will
want it if it is designed and presented properly -- that is what is taking me
10 years to figure out.
Regarding the second question, there is a problem with the way you frame the
question. "Unsolicited messages for a pittance" \-- of course nobody wants
that, but there is some amount for which anyone would welcome an unsolicited
message. Me, I would welcome receiving a 25 cent message. There are
advertisers who are paying a lot more than that to send me unsolicited
commercial messages, and it comes to me as junk that I resent.
For the celebrity, the situation is the same. There is some amount that any
celebrity would accept. There are fans who are willing to pay some amount. I
would be willing to pay a few bucks to send a message of admiration and
support to Edward Snowden. In the FundChan system, my bid would be competing
with other admirers to get to the front of the line. If I bid enough, he gets
my message. If I am outbid, he doesn't get my message, I keep my money.
_How are you going to attract users?_ YC Startup School (great videos!)
taught me that I have to do things that don't scale to get early traction.
Right now my plan is to campaign to get what I call high value targets into
FundChan -- people other people want to reach. This could be celebrities (I'm
in Los Angeles, so Hollywood is a natural) or, if I get into YC, I will
campaign to get sought-after members of the YC community.
So, how much would Sam Altman be willing to accept to read a message? Who
would be the highest bidder to send him a message? This is simple supply and
demand. If the supply (Sam's attention for a moment at a given price) meets
demand (the amount the highest bidder is willing to pay) then we have a
market.
In the FundChan system there are two data points for every user: Notice Price
and High Bid. The Notice Price is the bid amount set by the user that will
trigger a text or email notification. This is a price signal from the
recipient to the sender. High Bid is the currently highest bid in the
recipient's message queue. This is an indication of the demand for the
recipients attention. As a sender, I decide if I want to bid high enough to
get to the front of the message queue, or if I want to bid high enough to
trigger a notification.
What do you imagine would be Sam Altman's Notice Price and High Bid?
------
jimbursch
Here is the video I submitted for my YC application (hyperlinked):
[https://youtu.be/OIdjmDEQrEw](https://youtu.be/OIdjmDEQrEw)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Django deployment made as easy as ABC (and PHP) - DanieleProcida
https://www.divio.com/en/blog/django-deployment-made-as-easy-as-abc-and-php/
======
sdomino
What is the underlying platform for Divio?
Is it like [https://nanobox.io](https://nanobox.io) that allows you select any
host (AWS, DigitalOcean, etc.), or is it more of a full stack PaaS like
[https://www.fortrabbit.com/](https://www.fortrabbit.com/) but for Django
only?
------
DanieleProcida
It's a full-stack Python/Django service. But the Docker containers are of
course portable, so...
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why does deep and cheap learning work so well? (2017) - max_
https://arxiv.org/abs/1608.08225
======
hadsed
An excellent video lecture on this by Max himself which is brilliant and very
intuitive: [https://youtu.be/5MdSE-N0bxs](https://youtu.be/5MdSE-N0bxs)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why Warren Buffett is gambling on Japan’s distinctive dealmakers - kome
https://www.ft.com/content/e20708ac-347b-47de-b79a-ab7fb9088d6f
======
miles
First gold[0], now Japan[1]?
[0]
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24166302](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24166302)
[1] "My thoughts about Japan? I am not a macro guy. Now I say to myself,
Berkshire Hathaway can borrow money for 10 years at one percent in Japan now.
One percent! And I say to myself, gee, I took Graham's class 45 years ago and
I have been working hard at this thing all my life, maybe I can earn more than
1% you know, if I really work hard at it. 1% annually, it doesn't seem
impossible, does it? So, I wouldn't want to get involved in currency risk, so
I'd have to do it in something that was yen-denominated. So I'd have to be in
Japanese real estate or a Japanese business or something of the sort and all I
have to do is beat one percent. That's all the money is going to cost me and I
can get it for 10 years. So far I haven't found anything. It's kind of
interesting. The Japanese companies earn very low returns on equity. They have
a bunch of businesses that earn 4, 5, 6% on equity and it is very hard to earn
a lot as an investor when the business you are in doesn't earn very much
money."
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MHIcabnjrA&t=10m23s](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MHIcabnjrA&t=10m23s)
~~~
magicnubs
> The Japanese companies earn very low returns on equity. They have a bunch of
> businesses that earn 4, 5, 6% on equity and it is very hard to earn a lot as
> an investor when the business you are in doesn't earn very much money.
Not sure I understand what he meant there. 4-6% seems perfectly fine if your
loan is for 1%? Why isn't 4-6% enough to pursue?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
12 english words known by men but not by women (and vice versa) - pavelrub
http://zipf.ugent.be/crr.ugent.be/archives/1628
======
PhantomGremlin
It's hard for me to believe that 88% of a "random" sample of men know what
"codec" is. Perhaps this vocabulary test was given mainly to people in
Flanders. If so, I'm quite impressed with their general knowledge, especially
of English words. I'd bet that no more than 8.8% of "random" males in the USA
would know what "codec" is.
~~~
tmerr
The article says it's based on "the first 500K tests completed" of
[http://vocabulary.ugent.be/wordtest/start](http://vocabulary.ugent.be/wordtest/start)
Then the sample is probably taken from internet dwellers who are interested in
seeing how good their vocabulary is. I wonder if that's also why Paladin is so
high up on that list.
------
pigDisgusting
Ha ha ha! I did know all of the male words, thanks to AD&D and the History
channel. Meanwhile, on the feminine side I was shocked to be confronted by 7
out of 12 words, that I would be hard-pressed to use correctly in a sentence.
But seriously, are "flounc _y_ " and "flounc _ing_ " substantialy distinct
enough to be counted twice? I'm ashamed to ask, but I have to, since I really
can't come up with a serious definition for either.
~~~
tthomas48
Interesting I wouldn't have counted them twice, as my instinct is that we're
talking about an adjective and an adverb - BUT - flouncing is also a noun that
is the material that is used to make a dress flouncy.
Sewing definitely has at least as many technical terms as comp-sci.
------
SippinLean
What a horrible title. 71% of men knew "bodice", that's hardly "not known to
men".
------
Grue3
I'm not a native English speaker, and while I knew all the "men words", most
of the "women words" are giving me trouble. However I knew what "taffeta" was
thanks to MLP:FiM.
~~~
mcv
I clearly don't watch enough MLP, as I have no idea what taffeta is. I can
kinda place most of the other female words.
I admit when reading the male words, I wondered how women could not know those
words; although they're very computer and fantasy oriented and not everyday
words for most people, they're not that obscure, are they? And then I read the
female list and I understood my own limits.
------
fallinghawks
I knew all of them. Should I be concerned about my gender? ;)
The page links to an interesting vocabulary test. I probably scored low
because I said "no" to words I recognized but did not know the meaning of.
On the basis of your results, we estimate you know 76% of the English words.
You said yes to 76% of the existing words. You said yes to 0% of the nonwords.
This gives you a corrected score of 76% - 0% = 76%. This is a high level for a
native speaker. [!]
~~~
yaeger
I got a 61%. Still high for a native speaker, it says.
I am not a native speaker, though.
One thing that's weird. It says: You said yes to 0% of the nonwords.
That sounds good. Apparently I never claimed to know a word that doesn't
exist. But when I click on the "Nonwords you responded YES to" link, there is
a word there. "Seconds".
Again, I am not a native speaker but I do believe that "Seconds" is indeed a
word...
------
kghose
This was fun, but I was surprised by:
scimitar, bolshevism, biped, bottlebrush, mascarpone, progesterone and bodice
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
A TV set turned into a useless brick by Android malware - DemiGuru
https://boingboing.net/2016/12/27/heres-a-tv-set-turned-into-a.html
======
viggity
since it is near impossible to find a "dumb" tv anymore, the big lesson is to
never stray from google play or amazon app store.
~~~
ganoushoreilly
This is actually a GoogleTV by LG, which they killed off.
~~~
nilleo
I'm not entirely certain, but I think it was a reference to installing apps
from the app stores rather than side -loading.
------
walterbell
Buy a short-throw projector instead. Most have only display inputs, no network
connection.
------
ocdtrekkie
My advice:
1\. Don't buy anything running Android if you're not prepared to compile your
own patches for the rest of the time you own the device beyond the
manufacturer's support window.
2\. Don't buy a smart TV. Just don't. Buy a TV, plug something smart into it.
~~~
eikenberry
We just bought a new TV this past fall and I also wanted a 'dumb' TV, but
there were only like 1 or 2 non-smart TVs and they both had poor screens.
Seems like they days of a smart-tv being an up-sell/optional are past.
~~~
dragonwriter
A TV is a display plus a TV tuner plus potentially other things (and in-built
"smart" boxes are increasingly common other things), if you want to avoid the
other things, you may need to look for a display/monitor, rather than a TV.
That said, it seems fairly easy to find new, non-smart TVs online, though they
may not be popular in retail showrooms (where more SKUs mean more space and
more risk of analysis paralysis, but not necessarily more sales or profits.)
~~~
ocdtrekkie
The big difference between a "display/monitor" and a "TV" is not just the
analog inputs, but also the remote control, built-in speakers, and often
things like multiple HDMI inputs. I actually have always bought dumb TVs to
use as computer monitors for this reason... TVs, while similar in price, are
superior on features.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Democrats want FCC to reject Trump campaign threat to broadcasters - CameronNemo
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-campaign-ad/democrats-want-fcc-to-reject-trump-campaign-threat-to-broadcasters-idUSKBN21K2IG
======
battery_cowboy
> Off-Topic: Most stories about politics, or crime, or sports, unless they're
> evidence of some interesting new phenomenon. Videos of pratfalls or
> disasters, or cute animal pictures. If they'd cover it on TV news, it's
> probably off-topic.
Why is this rule not enforced more, there is zero intellectual interest to be
found on this topic, it's clearly a story about political asshattery. Just
because the keyword "FCC" is in there doesn't make it relevant.
~~~
CameronNemo
Sorry about that. Should have read the guidelines. Did not see them down
there. I would suggest that the submission page include a link to the
guidelines, or simply contain the verbatim "What to submit" section.
~~~
jlgaddis
You've been on HN for (at least) six years and never noticed the guidelines?
~~~
CameronNemo
Knew they existed somewhere, did not know bother to read them. Careless? Yeah,
probably. But it has rarely bitten me. Usually I'm good at reading the room.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Windows 7 is the best operating system on the market - iamelgringo
http://www.slate.com/id/2233294/
======
novum
_What's so great about Windows 7? For starters, it offers everything you want
in an OS: Programs load and run quickly, your computer pretty much never
crashes, and the system mostly stays out of your way._
It's striking to me that a computer that _works_ is striking to PC users.
~~~
amichail
Whether Windows works depends on how well the device drivers are written for
your hardware.
~~~
snprbob86
I'll save amichail from downmod hell:
Crappy kernel mode drivers crash OSX and Linux too. Vista was garbage at
launch because of so many breaking driver changes, practically everyone had to
re-write their drivers, especially Nvidia, ATI, and Intel. Windows 7 basically
uses Vista drivers, which are quite stable at this point.
It's quite like how some huge percentage of Safari crashes are due to Flash.
People complain that Safari is crap, but it really is someone else's fault.
That said, I'm not defending Microsoft or Apple here: once others make you
look bad a bunch of times, it is your fault for not protecting yourself from
them.
------
makecheck
This is annoyingly slim on any details that would back up their assertions.
For instance, if programs are apparently fast, and searching is fast, could
they not at least be bothered to measure this (versus Vista or XP, or running
previously-known-to-be-slow programs, or even measuring a Mac)? Then there is
the fact that _any_ clean install makes a system feel snappier for awhile;
let's talk again in 4 weeks and see if everything hasn't become dog slow.
And the rest of the article reads like someone who just wants eye candy. 3rd
party programs have been able to customize the bells and whistles of Windows
for some time, and they don't cost the $200-$400 that a new Windows would.
I do not know if Windows 7 is a great OS, but I do know that this article
isn't making that case in any meaningful way.
------
ahlatimer
I'm bothered that the tagline is "Windows 7 is the best operating system on
the market" then goes on to say "Now the two operating systems are roughly
equal." So, which is it, then? Is Win7 the best, or is it now simply on par
with OS X?
~~~
smhinsey
The subhead on the home page works a lot better: "Windows 7: The Best
Operating System Microsoft Has Ever Made." It strikes me as ill-considered
editorial tweaking.
------
GiraffeNecktie
Maybe it was just my system but I actually found Windows 7 to be pretty buggy.
It blue screened on me any number of times and finally refused to load
completely (despite trying every possible recovery option). Otherwise, it was
great, very polished and a pleasure to use but I couldn't take the crashing
and I'm now on Ubuntu. It's slightly rougher around the edges but otherwise
works at least as well as W7 (and better in some areas).
------
enneff
They pick some pretty bizarre metrics to measure 'best'.
The fact that Windows 7 still doesn't have a useful command line makes it
pretty irritating to use. (And I have been using it since the RC was
released.)
~~~
jerhinesmith
I will admit that I'm not completely comfortable enough with powershell to
authoritatively call it 'useful', but could you elaborate on some specific
complaints? How much have you used it? From my personal experience, while the
syntax has a bit of a learning curve, it is a marked improvement over 'cmd'.
~~~
snprbob86
I use PowerShell every single day at work. I wrote an article about it here:
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=571141>
My love/hate relationship with object piping is my chief complaint about
PowerShell, but the bigger picture complaint is that applications for Windows
simply aren't designed to be used on the command line. You inevitably run into
some wacky program that won't place nice with stdin/stdout, or won't let you
override some setting without hacking the registry, or otherwise slows you
down.
Beyond that, the terminal application UI is utter crap.
------
mkinsella
I thought this was a parody after I read the complaint about the activation
code.
------
dougb
Somehow I'm not surprised that Slate would write a pro Windows 7 article.
Slate was started by Microsoft. But I think they are owned by the Washington
Post now.
------
SwellJoe
So, does Microsoft still own Slate? Because that's the only explanation I can
think of for this ridiculously hyperbolic piece.
~~~
jlc
I believe they're owned by the Washington Post now.
------
gaius
The best _for what_?
------
pkulak
I just hope this thing takes off and with it, so does IE8 adoption.
------
jlc
To say I'm skeptical is an understatement.
------
ecq
_You'll still find a few of the niggling quirks found in Windows versions
past. For instance, the OS still requires "activation" by a 25-character code,
an anti-piracy measure that annoys legitimate users while doing little to
crush actual pirates._
rofl
------
echair
<http://www.cadillac.com/cadillacjsp/model/gallery.jsp>
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
NodeCloud: Node.js resources - fcambus
http://www.nodecloud.org
======
luckyeights
I just picked up node recently and found this genuinely useful - for me at
least, it doesn't matter if it's ranked in exactly accurate order or not.
In fact, I really wish I knew of more lists like this. Every time I start
learning a new programming language, there's a period where I go shopping for
useful sites and tutorials, usually resulting in a lot of wasted time with bad
tutorials and unhelpful sites. If I knew of a one-stop ranking system like
this, I would make use of it.
------
piotrSikora
I'm not big fan of the name (I would assume it's another node.js SaaS
provider), but otherwise it looks like a great directory for node.js
beginners.
~~~
nodesocket
Yeah its quite close to our first name: <http://www.nodejscloud.com> :)
------
grandalf
I finally had a chance to play with node over the weekend. First impression is
that the library ecosystem is way bigger than I'd have thought and
documentation is generally very well done.
Node really seems to have captured the imagination of a lot of people. I'm
looking forward to using more libraries and building out the toy app I
started.
------
BasDirks
Very newbie-oriented/general, but nice to have a place to point to to get
people started.
------
noglorp
Could use some user interaction on-site for discussing node; this would be a
good place to showcase node based chat / social apps by integrating them into
nodecloud.org
~~~
bdickason
yes, i was expecting a forum for node :D
------
nodesocket
Just an idea, maybe allow people to login with Twitter, and add comments, and
simply click 'I Like', and that score effects the position as well.
------
geuis
Please dont use Alexa for ranking sites. Their numbers are almost always
wildly inaccurate. The downside is there aren't many better alternatives.
~~~
DrJ
sounds like a place to start a business!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Monthly Hashes 2020-07 - KajMagnus
Here you can post hashes of, say, your Git repo current revision, or maybe the work-in-progress text of a book you're writing but didn't show to anyone yet.
======
KajMagnus
Talkyard origin master Git SHA1, 2020-06-20: 236226766862c1a92b127d3cf6006197784967fb
Talkyard w-km7d, 2020-07-10: 6bf922fda6c486973dc192ffd7115f19d2dbd095 (backlinks & link previews — will squash & rebase, disappears)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Samsung makes business history - bane
http://koreajoongangdaily.joins.com/news/article/article.aspx?aid=2978445&cloc=joongangdaily|home|newslist1
======
stephenr
Company with no ethics makes lots of money. News at 11.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Google's Tough Alphabet Transition - tosseraccount
http://www.wired.com/2016/04/googles-alphabet-transition-tougher-b-c/
======
sna1l
This doesn't seem very unexpected. Companies who haven't been expected to make
revenue/profit are being forced to rethink their business strategies with that
in mind. It is a tough process and a lot of people don't like it. I think in
the long term it will become beneficial for alphabet as they will funnel money
into the successful businesses.
Having said that, this might make the funding of true moon shots less likely.
The self driving car business isn't close to profitability, but clearly has a
successful business model ahead of it. Obviously it won't just be a direct
measure of revenue, but it should be interesting to see how this affects how
much time Google gives the rest of the Alphabet companies
~~~
lettergram
I'm picturing it killing a lot of innovation at Google. Many projects, such as
the self-driving car or search for that matter have no initial profitable
means for years if ever. With that, I feel it will also stop the evolution of
many products, e.g. Why risk investing in a long term project, when they know
we can make money this quarter doing X.
On the other hand this will likely lead to more stable products,and products
will disappear less often.
~~~
wrsh07
Just FYI, search is ridiculously profitable [see "search ads"]
~~~
lettergram
I agree search is ridiculously profitable, but if you showed up to a meeting
in 1998 and said: "Search is going to be a multi-billion dollar industry" the
business exec would laugh you out of the office.
~~~
nine_k
In 1998 there was a enough online commerce (in fact, there was a _crazy boom_
of it, the original internet boom) for a good exec to see the potential of the
ad market for it. Searching is _precisely_ the moment when an ad can be well-
targeted.
~~~
erikpukinskis
I was alive back then. It was not common belief that search would be a huge
money maker. No one thought Google would be bigger than Microsoft until they
started doing the ad auctions and people could start to see how the money
could actually flow. That Google won the Internet money pot was a bit of a
surprise to most.
~~~
mc32
I think that started with overture. At least I recall overture's business prop
being paid search results.
------
ihsw
Where does Google's Cloud Computing tie into?
There was some noise about it rivaling the search business in terms of growth
and capacity to be self-sustaining.
Surely it's prudent to at least mention it in the same breath as search.
~~~
simula67
I assume they are part of Google itself.
From the earning's report [1] it seems like total revenue was $21 billion for
quarter ending in December. Around $19 billion "Google advertising revenues"
and $2 billion "Google other revenues". There seems to be no more break up of
beyond that point.
[1]
[https://abc.xyz/investor/news/earnings/2015/Q4_google_earnin...](https://abc.xyz/investor/news/earnings/2015/Q4_google_earnings/index.html)
------
webwielder2
I know I shouldn't immediately dismiss the entirety of an article just because
it uses Rob Enderle for a quote, but I choose to do so anyway.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The most important entrepreneurial lesson I've learned. - carsonm
http://www.workhappy.net/2012/03/the-most-important-entrepreneurial-lesson-ive-learned.html
======
Akram
"This is why building an MVP, and validated learning are so important. Before
we get too carried away, we have to find out if the market wants what we're
building." Spending more time on an idea without getting substantial success
may lead to 2 things... 1. Either you loose interest and quit where the
product actually might have been valuable if it would have seen the light of
the day. 2. You take it to your heart that even if there is no real market-fit
you still keep working on it.
Either of them are dangerous for an entrepreneur. "Fail fast fail often" is
the way to go.
"Speed is the essence of war" - Sun Tzu (The Art of War). We can safely say
that it applies to startups too.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
This Women’s-Only Networking App Aims to Build a Community of Support - crazybob
https://www.fastcompany.com/40492852/this-womens-only-networking-app-aims-to-build-a-community-of-support
======
TheMissingPiece
I definitely do not want to have to verify my account by logging into
facebook... and I also dont see how this is much different than, say,
meetup.com + social media.
As a woman in tech who recently moved to a new city, I'll pass :/
~~~
crazybob
It’s important for our community to authenticate that our users actually
identify as women so we leverage FB to confirm that the women are real people.
We appreciate the feedback and are already thinking of using other ways to
sign up!
Present enables you to start, discover and participate in location-based
conversations in real time. There's really nothing like it, let alone a
network just for women!
------
kfilk
This is an awesome idea! As someone who moved to a new city recently with no
friends or family, I've been waiting for something like this to exist!! Super
excited to try it out, thanks for sharing!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: My first Android app - Hacker News reader - mikeevans
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.evans.hackernews
======
LVB
Good start, though the feature I've found essential in this type of
application is being able to share an article via a long press on the main
page. I send dozens of articles to Pocket every day that way.
~~~
incision
>I send dozens of articles to Pocket every day that way.
Exactly.
A HN app with a "share to pocket" (configurable for other share targets of
course) one-tap link on articles would be my new main app over night.
------
veeti
Two problems with rotation:
1) The article list scrolling position is reset.
2) On my Nexus 7, going from landscape to portrait while viewing comments
closes the comments.
~~~
RossM
Rotation issues are usually to do with the activity being recreated (i.e.
onCreate is called again) as the screen size has changed. There is a config to
disable this however:
[http://developer.android.com/guide/topics/resources/runtime-...](http://developer.android.com/guide/topics/resources/runtime-
changes.html)
~~~
veeti
If you mean configChanges, I would strongly recommend against it because it is
a bad practice and it probably wouldn't work in this case anyway (no activity
recreation = no multi-panel layout on a 7-inch landscape screen).
~~~
RossM
Ah, sorry I haven't done Android dev in a while; would a better way be yock's
onSaveInstanceState/onRestoreInstanceState then?
~~~
veeti
Yes, something like that in combination with carrying over the existing list
data with an retained fragment.
------
BrokenPipe
Why does it need permission to read my identify? Sorry, uninstalled.
~~~
mikeevans
Do you mean Read phone state or Access network state? Those are for the Ads
and Analytics.
~~~
BrokenPipe
It requires two permissions:
-Phone calls Read phone status and identity
-Network communication Full network access
I can understand the latter, in particular if in android you can't specify
exactly what hosts you need to access but the former I can't understand, or
better, I can't stand. I do not want to give every app my identity, not for
ads, not for money.
------
astoltzf
The app looks excellent; the best design for an Android HN app I have seen to
date. Unlike others, I haven't experienced any crashing issues.
I only have one small piece of input: A night-mode (white on black) for the
main menu and comments would be an excellent addition.
~~~
vibragiel
+1 to the "night mode", which is very relevant to users with AMOLED screens.
------
eonwe
Quick impressions:
Smoother scrolling of comments than in most of the Hacker News readers for
Android that I've tried. I actually wonder why scrolling is so bad in most of
the Android applications? Is it because of the misuse of the ListView or what?
Could perhaps show some indication when changing between front page, ask, etc.
Currently selecting another view does nothing until the results are loaded and
then the page changes instantly underneath.
Crashed after a few minutes of use when pressing the key for registration (I
submitted the crash report).
Seems like a good start, the ads are quite irritating though :).
~~~
mikeevans
I'm not sure why scrolling tends to be bad in some applications. Perhaps they
aren't recycling views properly or something.
I'm working on adding that indicator, as well as logging in/replying.
I wasn't sure if I should even use ads, but I could take them out. And thanks
for the crash report!
------
bjonathan
Very nice ! The app crash when i want to login or "remove the ads" (android
4.2.1 / Galaxy Nexus GSM)
I am currently using this one :
[https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.glebpopov....](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.glebpopov.hackernews)
but yours is good enough to consider a switch :)
------
benregn
Nice app! If you are going to keep the ads (I'd rather pay something like $1),
please show them on the frontpage compared to when I'm reading the article.
Also it would be nice if it would not reload the frontpage every time I come
back from reading an article.
~~~
mikeevans
You can remove the ads with an in-app purchase (although it looks like that
part is crashing for some people) because I didn't want to have a Free/Pro
app. Thanks for the feedback though!
------
miloco
Awesome, works really nicely on my Nexus 4. I'll definitely be using it from
now on. The comment view looks a lot like my 'Reddit Now' app so that's
probably why I like it so much! The transition between comments and the
article is a nice touch too. 5* from me.
------
tubbzor
Is the source code available on github by chance? I've recently started
delving into android and would love to study/contribute to this app if
possible.
Regardless, really an excellent job overall with it.
~~~
mikeevans
No, at least not yet. Thanks though, it's good to finally get something out
there!
------
thiderman
Looks very nice; way better than most of the other HN apps I've tried (and
I've probably tried all of them by now).
Unless something stops working, you'll have a purchase from me pretty soon!
Good job!
------
rodolphoarruda
There is a box in the page which says: "This app is not compatible with your
Samsung GT-S5830C." I wonder why it isn't. I didn't know there were version
specific Android apps.
~~~
mikeevans
It's not specifically targeting your device, it's Android 4.0+ only right now.
Android 2.X support is coming soon.
------
so898
Great App!! However, I still like my iOS application Hacker Pulse... BTW, this
is really the best hacker news application I have ever used on my XT535.
------
agscala
This looks awesome, but I'm sad that it requires android 4.x. I blame the
phone manufacturer/carrier for never updating my phone (still stuck on 2.3)
~~~
mikeevans
Part of the next release should be backporting it for 2.X, I just wanted to
get something out and gather feedback. I didn't forget you!
------
KJBweb
Great app!
Managed to make it crash though sent a report through to help you debug it.
Good work though, well done :)
------
seanponeil
Great app! An indicator when refreshing would be nice, but overall this is
definitely the best HN reader out there.
~~~
mikeevans
Thanks! A loading indicator is definitely on my to-do list.
------
pspeter3
If I pay to remove adds from my phone, will they be removed from my tablet and
all future installs?
~~~
mikeevans
Yep. The purchase is tied to your Google account.
~~~
pspeter3
Awesome thanks
------
jpgunter
I like the app, but shouldn't the default view of an article be the article,
not the comments?
------
jvandyke
That's awesome, Mike. Well done!
------
dikanggu
Great App! How much time did you spend on writing the app?
~~~
mikeevans
Thanks! I spent a few weeks on it. It's my goal in 2013 to actually finish
projects that I start :)
------
gkumartvm
Good App. Are you planning to make the app open source ?
------
pjmlp
Great work.
Sadly I am still on 2.2 :(
------
ancanta
seems nice, too bad I don't have 4.0+ to check it.
One question : How web scraping is done ?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Atlassian Marketplace revenues soar ($100M in 2016) - gsylvie
https://www.enterprisetimes.co.uk/2017/05/03/atlassian-marketplace-revenues-soar/
======
gsylvie
0.003% of those revenues came from my own add-on (for Bitbucket Server). :-D
:-D :-D
Any other marketplace.atlassian.com vendors here on HN?
Anyone thinking of trying it out?
~~~
jamesmp98
I might try it out if I had a good idea.
~~~
gsylvie
Any part of Bamboo, JIRA, Confluence, Bitbucket, or Hipchat driving you
insane? That's how I started.
(I don't think Sourcetree takes add-ons, and Crucible/Fisheye are pretty much
dead.)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
How Do You Make Turbo Engines More Efficient? Just Add Water - CapitalistCartr
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/30/automobiles/how-do-you-make-turbo-engines-more-efficient-just-add-water.html
======
kls
The process is actually more efficient with a 50/50 mix of water and methanol.
When the water reaches threshold there is additional release of oxygen which
at temperature can be consumed by the combustion of methanol, thus reducing
overall fuel consumption while increasing efficiency. This has been done in
the diesel world for years.
~~~
philipkglass
How does that work? Water will dissociate into hydrogen and oxygen at very
high temperatures, but the mixture of hydrogen and oxygen so produced is
already stoichiometrically balanced. There's no surplus oxygen left to be
reacted with additional fuel.
~~~
kls
The confusion was on my part, I used release of oxygen but it is probably
better explained as intake of oxygen, the cooling effect of the water leads to
a higher air density in the mix of atomized air. The water is not releasing
more oxygen rather there is more air in the cooler denser mixture of air,
water and methanol, the water vaporizes thus creating more volume and then the
methanol flashes and consumes the additional oxygen that is brought in via a
cooler intake, it is my understanding that this oxygen is only available after
the flashing of atomized water into gas, thus I used the term release (which
is a poor choice of words for the process). It works similar to an inter-
cooler, but unlike an intercooler the mix seems to preserve some oxygen for
the methanol combustion cycle so it is more targeted then just forcing more
oxygen into the intake via a denser volume of air (e.g intercooling). Sorry
for the confusion on what is actually happening, you are correct it is not
separating hydrogen atoms from oxygen atoms. If that where the case then as
you said, there would be no need for the methanol as it would be generating
the additional fuel via hydrogen and oxygen in the generated browns gas to
burn it.
------
dfsegoat
Not an engineering expert --- but isn't this the same idea that was being used
in aircraft engines to get the max power out of turbine engines?
The B-52 is the classic example (nasty exhaust plume is the hallmark of these
water injected engines):
[https://youtu.be/xfTdRF66QPo?t=218](https://youtu.be/xfTdRF66QPo?t=218)
edit: I thought they phased this out in the 60's but was surprised to see the
video above was from 1989!
~~~
ucaetano
Exhaust plume? Silly you, those are chemtrails!
------
csours
In another interview about this tech, Bosch said that the engine will not be
allowed to run as hard if the system detects there is no water - so you
basically have a non-water enhanced system when you're out of water.
------
ahh
I'm not an engine expert, but I thought a substantial disadvantage of water
injection was incomplete combustion (see for example the billowing smoke here:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Boeing_KC-135_J57_wet_tak...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Boeing_KC-135_J57_wet_takeoff.jpg)
They may be more efficient, but is there a pollution concern?
~~~
hausen
I'm no expert either, but according to
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_injection_(engine)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_injection_\(engine\)),
it actually reduces emissions.
~~~
qplex
In turbine aircraft engines that is not the case though.
Injecting water inside turbine engine causes fuel to go unburned, hence the
black smoke.
------
gambiting
People already complain about having to refill AdBlue for their Diesel engines
- and you realistically only have to do that every 6-12 months! MotorTrend did
a review of that M4 GTS and it worked its way through the 5L water tank very
quickly. So how often would the consumer need to refill the tank in a normal,
non-sports car?
~~~
Grishnakh
This system would probably be great for high-end BMW owners (not the regular
ones, just the really rich ones buying $100k models), who can be counted on to
get their car serviced at the dealership very frequently.
For regular Americans, it'd be a disaster. The tanks would run out and the
engines would fall back to their "limping" mode (the safe mode that doesn't
need water injection), which would likely have even worse fuel economy than if
they had just stuck with regular gas-powered engines without water injection.
This would cause the fleet fuel economy to fall greatly.
EVs can't come fast enough. At least almost every American seems to be able to
handle plugging in their phone regularly and keeping it charged up.
~~~
gambiting
Actually, if you watch the review of the M4, they very directly say that in
case the water runs out the engine performs exactly as the same, non water-
boosted engine. So this whole sentence about water-boosted engines that are
worse than non-water boosted ones when without water is garbage.
And evs are still not a solution for everyone. There doesn't seem to be any
good idea on how to own and charge one if you live in an apartment with a
shared parking lot or if you have to park on the street. You say that water-
boosting will work great for people who buy $100k cars, but at the moment, it
looks like EVs are only usable for people who can afford a house with a
driveway.
------
asimuvPR
People barely refill their windshield washer fluid. Asking them to refill a
tank with distilled water is a bit of a stretch. Not that I have anything
about water injection (I use it).
~~~
arethuza
"People barely refill their windshield washer fluid"
Where are you? I find that cars become pretty much undrivable within a very
short time if the windshield washer fluid runs out - particularly in winter.
NB I'm in Scotland.
~~~
fibonachos
California native here. What is this 'winter' you speak of?
In all seriousness, it takes about a month or more worth of dust buildup
before the view out of my windshield can be considered to have been obscured
in any way. Thankfully it rarely gets to that point since I usually clean my
windows when putting gas in my vehicle.
~~~
beamatronic
Not only that, but the windshield washer fluid you can buy in the Bay Area is
NOT the kind that doesn't freeze. Which could lead to a surprise if you head
up to Tahoe for skiing. You can buy the anti-freeze kind up there, but you are
supposed to "promise" not to use it back in the Bay Area.
~~~
fibonachos
I actually discovered this by accident one morning a couple of years ago. We
do get the occasional sub-freezing morning temperatures here during winter.
One such morning I used my windshield washers and wound up with a nice,
blinding sheet of ice on my windshield.
I had to pull into a parking lot and scrape it off with a debit card. Rather
dangerous situation for those of us who don't encounter real winter weather
often.
------
tricky
What keeps a reservoir filled up with distilled water from freezing solid in
cold weather? I bought a texas car off ebay and had it shipped up north. The
day it dipped below freezing was the first day I learned that texas windshield
washer fluid is mostly just colored water.
~~~
gambiting
Absolutely nothing. Which means that the distilled water tank would most
likely be heated. If you have Bi-Xenon headlamps with washers, they most
likely use heated jets already, so it's not an unusual technology in cars.
------
justsomedood
Nissan has a different take on solving this problem by having variable
compression on their new VC-T engines that were on here a few weeks ago. That
approach is nice because you don't have to fill any reservoirs and can still
get high compression ratios when not running under turbo boost thus increasing
efficiency. I really want to see where that one goes, and it is actually in a
production car I think this coming year.
------
rbanffy
Isn't the future electric?
~~~
ljf
It is - I'm sure of it, but anything we can do to improve the cars people buy
across the next 10 years here in the developed world, and likely 25 years in
the rest of the world. (Plus the X years people will be driving older cars
until petrol/diesel is properly taxed).
------
seansoutpost
Could the need to manually refill water periodically be replaced by a
condenser that constantly pulled ambient moisture out of the air? The total
amount of water they are talking about is not very much. This seems like it
could be solved without constant topping off.
~~~
minikites
I'm no physicist but wouldn't you lose a bunch of energy running a condenser?
~~~
MOARDONGZPLZ
I remember this, and it seems similar. it condenses water at ground level with
solar cells, refilling a water bottle:
[http://www.jamesdysonaward.org/projects/fontus-2/](http://www.jamesdysonaward.org/projects/fontus-2/)
~~~
hidroto
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPvXnmBIO7o](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPvXnmBIO7o)
------
jagger27
Is it possible to replenish the water reservoir from the exhaust vapours?
Ideally it would never run out, if the water that gets injected comes out the
pipe anyway gets recycled plus what gets generated from combustion.
~~~
ljf
Here in the UK you could just do it from the rain that runs down the
windscreen. Maybe in the US you could run is from condensation from the AC? Or
I'd imagine filling it wouldn't be too hard or take too long. In the winter
here I probably fill my windscreen washer weekly or fortnightly, and it takes
30 seconds at most (pop bonnet, open the cap (drivers side near the top) pour
in 2lt of fluid, close cap, close bonnet - not dirty or difficult to do).
------
mgarfias
There is nothing new here. Lots of WW2 fighters had water (or water/methanol)
injection. All we’ve really learned since then is metallurgy and better
control systems (EFI).
------
6DM
Yes, people probably won't want to maintain a water reservoir, but performance
enthusiasts might.
~~~
lallysingh
That probably comes down to a question of consumption rate, capacity,
performance enhancement, and nagging by the car.
------
sunstone
This all seems so antiquated when compared with electric cars. They could be
flogging a dead horsepower here.
~~~
Eerie
Electric cars are SSDs, ICE cars are HDDs. See what I mean?
~~~
wcunning
I'm contemplating this metaphor, and it really works well. Basically, the
driving range is capacity and the acceleration/low end performance is access
speed. The only problem is that the kg/kJ stored is not accelerating at the
rate that bits/um^2 is accelerating, which makes the time to market domination
by the new technology less than stellar.
------
lightedman
And if not properly (re)designed, this is also a great way to hydrolock your
engine. Water doesn't compress, that's why it effectively increases your
compression ratio. That's also why your engine hydrolocks if it gets water-
logged. Water doesn't compress = pistons can't move.
~~~
dpark
You'd have to be a pretty incompetent automotive engineer to inject enough
water to cause hydrolocking.
Injecting water isn't done to "effectively increase your compression ratio".
If that were the goal, you'd just increase the stroke. Water injection cools
the engine, _allowing_ a higher compression ratio. If you injected enough
water to meaningfully increase the compression ratio on a 3L engine, you'd run
out of water in minutes anyway.
~~~
lightedman
"You'd have to be a pretty incompetent automotive engineer to inject enough
water to cause hydrolocking."
Ever hear of a shadetree mechanic? I've had to fix up after many of them. Two
hydrolocked engines, rusted out radiator (they put deionized water in the
reservoir, straight up) and plenty of failed turbo modifications.
I would not be surprised to see someone try doing this themselves and failing
miserably.
~~~
dpark
No, I've never heard of Bosch or BMW hiring shade tree mechanics to design
engines. I'm relatively confident that this isn't a real issue.
I think your concern about weekend mechanics is also unwarranted because most
of them aren't morons. The ones who are will be morons regardless and manage
to destroy cars regardless.
~~~
lightedman
"I think your concern about weekend mechanics is also unwarranted because most
of them aren't morons."
Go to an AutoX competition or two and I bet you'll be changing your mind on
that opinion very quickly.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Nvidia Launches New Mainstream GeForce GTX 560 Ti Graphics Card - MojoKid
http://hothardware.com/Reviews/NVIDIA-GeForce-GTX-560-Ti-Debut-MSI/
======
iwwr
If you don't need CUDA or PhysX, is there any reason to use nvidia and not
ATI?
~~~
nuclear_eclipse
Proper Linux driver support for 3D acceleration, video games, and multi-
monitor setups?
~~~
mhd
On the other hand, if you're looking for open source drivers, I've had better
experiences with the ATI (radeon/hd) drivers than the ones for Nvidia
(nouveau).
------
bryanlarsen
The lovely thing about new graphics card introductions are the scrambles by
competitors to lower prices to compete. AMD reduced the price of the 6950/1GB
to $259 and the 6870 to $219 to nicely sandwich this new card with its $249
price point. Source: [http://www.anandtech.com/show/4135/nvidias-geforce-
gtx-560-t...](http://www.anandtech.com/show/4135/nvidias-geforce-gtx-560-ti-
upsetting-the-250-market)
[edit: replace ATI with AMD. :)]
------
ciupicri
Too bad that it has no DisplayPort output.
~~~
nkurz
Are there advantages of DisplayPort over HDMI? Or do you just want to use
Apple branded monitors without an adapter? My naive outsider's thought works
be that rather than adding an additional output to all video cards, that it
would be better if monitor manufacturers would settle on a single standard.
~~~
ciupicri
Actually, I have a HP LP2475w. I bought it because it has an IPS panel just
like Dell U2410 which has a DisplayPort, too.
~~~
nkurz
Thanks. I didn't know there were other manufacturers making monitors with
DisplayPort inputs. I use mostly NVidia cards and Linux, so I was being
genuine about my 'naive' status. My impression was that DisplayPort was dead
outside Apple. Does you think it's still up and coming, or is it another
Beta/VHS problem?
~~~
ciupicri
If my memory serves me _right_, I saw a Dell POS (Point of Sale) system a
couple of days ago that had an integrated Intel videocard which offered only
VGA and DP outputs. If you wanted a (legacy) DVI output you had to buy an
extra ATI card that had DVI output.
Also a couple of new laptops offer DP output and combined with the advantages
that others have already mentioned, I think that it has a future and it will
replace DVI, but not HDMI.
------
jacquesm
I don't see anything to get overly excited about.
~~~
Retric
I agree, however I just bought one of these 2 minutes ago.
~~~
jacquesm
There is nothing wrong with it, it's just not the step up that Nvidia claims
it is.
I was hoping for a 1K core chip for the 5xx series and instead we get these
stop-gap products.
~~~
Retric
Nvidia and Intel are both on a tick/tock cycle.
2010 shrink the die size 2011 new architecture 2012 shrink the die size
Nvidia and Intel are both going to put out really high performance chips on
the new architecture before the die shrink, but I am not going to buy them so
it's irrelevant. An i5-2500 + GTX 560 are a great price / performance match
and things are not going to really change much for another year.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Inkscape Version 0.92 is Released - p4bl0
https://inkscape.org/en/news/2017/01/04/inkscape-version-092-released/
======
new299
I've always found Inkscape surprisingly easy to use in comparison to other
open source tools (like for Gimp for example).
I use it for almost all my diagramming needs (scientific
publications/documentation). Closed source tools are almost certainly better
in one or more respects. But it's certainly good enough for me, and it makes
me feel happy and secure to be using an open source tool.
~~~
smrtinsert
Gimp prefers the absolute most surprising and unexpected behavior given all
available options. Krita designers should be hired to redesign Gimp. If Krita
support image editing slightly better, I'm pretty sure no one would use Gimp
again.
Inkscape is excellent at surfacing options. Even a novice can discover how to
use it simply by reading options available at any time.
~~~
lillesvin
I hear this complaint a lot and it always surprises me. I guess I'm just used
to it after using it as my primary raster image editor for more than 15 years.
What is it that's particularly unintuitive?
~~~
probably_wrong
As a user of Gimp of 10+ years and counting, here's some thing that have
bitten me several times:
* The multi-window interface. I know you can change this, but there's no good reason for not being the default since the beginning. God help you if you close the layers window and don't know how to bring it back.
* That you cannot _save_ to any format that it's not XCF, but that you have to _export_ to them.
* The sliders to select tool properties, such as brush width. I can slide them (but not all the way from 100 to 0, that requires 6 slides!), I can use the up-down arrows, and I can type a value. But if I want to slide and I click it wrong, I have to enter a number. So now I have to click somewhere else first, and try again. It's frustrating.
* Overlap in functions between different tools. For instance, the perspective tool and the cage tool.
* Fine-tuning a digital tablet. I doubt anyone knows the difference between "screen", "window", and "deactivated".
~~~
miffe
> The sliders to select tool properties, such as brush width. I can slide them
> (but not all the way from 100 to 0, that requires 6 slides!)
Sliders are split, so the top slides over the full range and the bottom is for
fine adjustments.
~~~
nine_k
This is totally not obvious. No visual clue hints at this, except maybe the
changing cursor shape, not very helpful.
------
Freak_NL
You can write your own plugins¹ for Inkscape as well. Last year I've had a lot
of fun writing a plugin that skews, scales, and rotates objects in Inkscape to
create (simple) drawings in the isometric perspective² — have a look at the
write-up if you want to find out about basic linear algebraic SVG
transformations in Inkscape. SVG is extremely well-suited for such tasks.
1:
[https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/%3Dextension/](https://inkscape.org/en/gallery/%3Dextension/)
2: [http://jeroenhoek.nl/articles/svg-and-isometric-
projection.h...](http://jeroenhoek.nl/articles/svg-and-isometric-
projection.html)
------
duiker101
Inkscape is amazing. So is Gimp, Blender and many other. All amazing software.
I have just one thing that I wonder, why do they all seem to be lacking in the
UI department? They all have UIs that look and feel way more clunky than even
the cheaper proprietary alternatives. Not complaining, I like them anyway but
maybe a more user friendly UI would open up this amazing tool to a broader
audience?
~~~
mschuetz
1\. It's very very hard to find out what's intuitive, yet powerful to use.
Unlike implementing some algorithms, creating a good UI requires feedback from
users.
2\. It takes a lot of time and you frequently have to start over once you find
out that what you thought works well, doesn't work well for others.
3\. From anecdotical experience, I'd say that user interface design isn't what
open source developers are interested in. It's a distraction from what they
actually want to work on.
Personally, I find Inkscapes UI okay to use. Blender and Gimp, on the other
hand, are a horrible, unintuitive mess. Whenever I need to do some image
manipulation, I try to get by with Irfan View and Inkscape (even for raster
graphics) as much as possible, just to avoid having to mess around with Gimp.
~~~
PolCPP
In the case of Blender once you get the hang of it, you'll feel more
confortable than with other similar tools that do the same. I would say its
kinda like vim.
Also why don't you use Krita?
~~~
buovjaga
> Also why don't you use Krita?
Because GIMP is for general image & photo manipulation and the product vision
for Krita is to be a painting application.
~~~
irfanka
I just fund out about Pinta yesterday - and it's a pretty nice alternative for
folks who don't like GIMP UI.
------
RUG3Y
As an impoverished freelancer I've used Inkscape to create lots of
illustration that helped put food on the table. I found it easy to use, only
occasionally did I need tutorials for a specific task.
I don't really understand the complaints about Inkscape being unintuitive -
tools that have lots of options and do complex things will by nature be less
intuitive than tools that do simple things. Sometimes you've just got to learn
the software to make use of it. I have lots of experience with both Inkscape
and Illustrator and I actually like Inkscape more. Illustrator was perfect to
me at one point, and it seems like Adobe just kept tweaking endlessly in ways
that were detrimental to the product, rather than enhancing it.
------
rhaps0dy
Inkscape is great! Its PDF+Latex exporting functionality makes it perfect for
diagrams in papers, exams, and whatnot. The editing tools are also very nice.
It also edits PDFs, which I found pretty cool! I use it to make airline
tickets not take up a full sheet of paper. To be honest, if you export the PDF
back out, it jumbles some of the fonts a little, but that's mostly OK.
~~~
probably_wrong
It's even better when you combine it with the command line tools. You can
design a template on the GUI, and then customize it and export it via a
script.
~~~
mixmastamyk
Which command-line tools?
~~~
rhaps0dy
type "inkscape --help"
on your command line. It exports things to formats, and you can query
information from files.
------
anilgulecha
Inkscape is amazing -- I've used it on and off for over 6 years, and it's
never let me down.
Protip: It's PDF import is amazing.. try it.
The only thing I miss is a workable layers functionality.
~~~
saycheese
PDF import is really useful if you want to avoid hand writing on forms and
save an editable copy of what you've typed.
------
ravenstine
Inkscape is a gem! I'm glad more people seem to know of it than did even 5
years ago. I haven't tried 0.92 yet, but the one problem I have had with it is
the macOS version, which requires X11 and has more problems with the window
manager than even GIMP. Realistically, it's better to run these programs in a
VM on macOS, sadly. On Linux & Windows, it is awesome and I have yet to
encounter a circumstance where I couldn't achieve something that could be done
in Illustrator.
I find it interesting how people still don't like GIMP. I always suspect
people want it to be like Photoshop, but now I don't know. With single window
mode, I have virtually no complaints. (beyond the continual lack of CMYK
support, which prevents wider adoption)
For those developing Inkscape, I hope you realize that your efforts have
helped me professionally, as I have regularly used it to design graphics and
icons for web development at my work. Thank you!
~~~
gcr
There is an unofficial build floating around somewhere of a native MacOS
Inkscape written against the Cocoa framework rather than X11. That's the one I
use. It's an old version though.
~~~
szhu
Here it is:
[https://inkscape.org/en/~su_v/%E2%98%85inkscape-
osxmenu-r129...](https://inkscape.org/en/~su_v/%E2%98%85inkscape-
osxmenu-r12922-gtk2)
[https://inkscape.org/en/~su_v/%E2%98%85inkscape-
osxmenu-r129...](https://inkscape.org/en/~su_v/%E2%98%85inkscape-
osxmenu-r12922-gtk3-demo)
The GTK2 and GTK3 versions work about the same for me. The main issue is that
double-clicking and/or select-all in certain text boxes will crash the app.
Fortunately, Inkscape saves a backup of your work before crashing.
------
buovjaga
Inkscape is used in every Finnish gymnasium (high school). This is due to the
new computerized matriculation exams:
[https://digabi.fi/tekniikka/ohjelmistot/inkscape/](https://digabi.fi/tekniikka/ohjelmistot/inkscape/)
~~~
Freak_NL
Always refreshing to see schools using free software to teach. Students can
keep using Inkscape legally for free after graduation.
~~~
Sylos
Similarly when they actually get interested in something and want to play
around with it at home. It's just kind of shit when students are pretty much
forced to piracy, if they want to learn more about something than is taught in
their classes.
~~~
Vinkekatten
I love what Autodesk have done with Fusion 360, they made it free for students
and tinkerers. It's a brilliant tool and I wish more software manufacturers
got on board with programs like this.
------
bbayer
Inkscape is amazing and I mostly used it for creating 2D graphics for game UI.
One of the downsides is X server dependency in MacOS. Look and feel don't
match the MacOS' standart look and feel. Keyboard handling and focus issues
can be annoying time to time. Also some long awaiting issues like disabling
antialiasing for exports are considered as low priority[1]. This prevents
designer to export crisp images for 8bit style games.
[1] :
[https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/947660](https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/947660)
~~~
tannhaeuser
There's inkscape-osxmenu for MacOS[1] (though it was not 100% stable back when
I used it a couple years ago).
[1]: [https://code.launchpad.net/~suv-
lp/inkscape/osxmenu](https://code.launchpad.net/~suv-lp/inkscape/osxmenu)
~~~
szhu
[https://inkscape.org/en/~su_v/%E2%98%85inkscape-
osxmenu-r129...](https://inkscape.org/en/~su_v/%E2%98%85inkscape-
osxmenu-r12922-gtk2)
[https://inkscape.org/en/~su_v/%E2%98%85inkscape-
osxmenu-r129...](https://inkscape.org/en/~su_v/%E2%98%85inkscape-
osxmenu-r12922-gtk3-demo)
The GTK2 and GTK3 versions work about the same for me. The main issue is that
double-clicking and/or select-all in certain text boxes will crash the app.
Fortunately, Inkscape saves a backup of your work before crashing.
------
smd686s
If you're looking fantastic Inkscape tutorials, check out Nick Saporito's
YouTube channel. Really great stuff for beginners and pros.
[https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEQXp_fcqwPcqrzNtWJ1w9w](https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEQXp_fcqwPcqrzNtWJ1w9w)
------
struppi
Sorry to be that guy, but I always had the impression that Inkscape is way
more cumbersome and difficult than it should be. And it seems to me that there
is _very_ little progress.
I don't use/need vector graphics editors very much, but I now bought affinity
designer. It seems to be way more professional, and is quite affordable
(basically in the same price category as Inkscape, at least for me).
~~~
mojuba
I don't know why you are downvoted for your opinion, but totally agree that
Inkscape is pretty low quality and buggy as well. On the Mac specifically the
experience is so 1990s and un-macOS (yeah I know, it's an X app)
I used it for a while for generating SVG files, ended up writing a script that
would optimize the crappy files it generated and reduce them 10 to 20 times in
some cases. Oh and then there are these odd floating point drifts (coordinate
10 becomes 10.035 etc.). Seems like one of those pieces of software that would
be very difficult or impossible to fix.
~~~
struppi
Yes, I also had to create some SVG files during a project for a client and
used Inkscape on Windows for that. Then hand-edited all of them, because I
wanted to get rid of all the crap before importing them.
I basically just bought Affinity Designer as a knee-jerk reaction because I
disliked Inkscape so much.
~~~
tkp
Inkscape adds a bunch of metadata to it's svg's, but also has a "Simple SVG"
save-as option, did you try it ?
~~~
mojuba
I did try it. Apart from metadata there are two other major problems: it
generates a lot of unnecessary attributes with their default values, and also
the floating point errors I mentioned. The latter can affect the appearance of
your graphics on your screen unfortunately, i.e. a vertical line with X=10 is
one thing but X=10.035 is another.
~~~
mixmastamyk
Optimized SVG is the one you want.
------
tksh
[https://github.com/tksh/Pure-Stroke-SVG-
Portrait](https://github.com/tksh/Pure-Stroke-SVG-Portrait) I’m an analog
illustrator. This is my first digital artwork made with Inkscape 0.91. Drawing
with Inkscape is very interesting for me. If Michelangelo lives in our time,
his sketches are made with Inkscape I think.
------
mandioca
First of all I love this app <3
But it has a few problems in terms of usability the major one that would be
nice to get addressed at some point is GTK. Getting inkscape to run on macos
for instance, requires X11 which creates a really bad integration with MacOs
itself. The solution is Qt, probably this is one of those initial decisions
that Inkscape devs regret everyday.
Gradients is another example about bad usability, try by yourself to add a new
step to the gradient without smashing your keyboard/mouse. Turns out the
solution is googling it which gives a solution for that, however you will
eventually forget about that since it's non-sense (then repeating the same
cycle again).
~~~
marcoms
Gtk3 supports macOS natively
~~~
mc-
The next version (0.93) will use gtk3 and, hopefully, should feel more
"native" in mac os x.
------
greenspot
Anyone knows if v0.92 now supports hi-dpi screens? Last version didn't and I
couldn't find anything in the release notes.
Otherwise a superb product, in particular if you are on Windows or Linux and
you can't run Sketch.
~~~
bkor
That'll require GTK+3 at least. They're still using GTK+2. According to the
roadmap it's scheduled for Inkscape 1.4. At the current pace it'll take years
to reach 1.4 IMO.
See
[http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/Roadmap](http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/Roadmap)
~~~
mc-
Actually, we plan to release 0.93 with gtk3. The current devel version (trunk)
already dropped all gtk2 code.
------
saycheese
This graphic of the Inkscape keyboard layout is useful:
[https://openclipart.org/detail/188861/inkscape-keyboard-
layo...](https://openclipart.org/detail/188861/inkscape-keyboard-layout-v0484)
~~~
Freak_NL
It could use an update though. I like Ⓜ for the on-screen ruler. It's quite
useful if you are drawing plans using physical units of measurement
(millimetres etc.).
------
aargh_aargh
Inkscape 0.92 Release Notes:
[http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/Release_notes/0.92](http://wiki.inkscape.org/wiki/index.php/Release_notes/0.92)
------
Brakenshire
This seems like a good opportunity to ask, is there a clear way to export an
svg from inkscape for the web? In a lot of applications (for instance with
logos on the web) you want to be able to make a selection, reduce it down to a
single path represented by a single d attribute, and then be able to copy that
off, or save as a file. I did manage to do it by fiddling around by
combining/intersecting different shapes, until the output svg got into the
right form, then normalizing that with an online tool. But is there a way to
do this more easily in Inkscape?
Ideally you could make a selection, and then go to file > export for web, and
get a graphical dialogue to allow you to play around with viewBox and other
display attributes. Or is there another open-source program that handles this
well? Now that SVG seems to be becoming more and more a first class part of
the web, this kind of thing would be very useful.
~~~
aargh_aargh
It's even simpler than that. Ctrl-A (select all), Ctrl-K (Path->Combine).
The catch is that if you're using objects, they will be converted to paths
(curves) and you'll lose useful things like fill, rounded corners,
gradients... If you think about it, what you're asking only makes sense for
very simple drawings - only those can be represented by a single path.
~~~
Brakenshire
Ah, thanks for confirming, pretty certain that is what I ended up doing. If I
recall, this did still have other issues, for instance handling scaling and
origin was difficult, and also I think all the points had 10 decimal places
unnecessarily. I needed to use web tools to get it into the right shape,
although part of this may be that I was getting my head around the
difficulties of how SVG works on the web, using viewBox rather than
height/width attributes and so on.
------
themodelplumber
There's a handy YouTube video covering various improvements:
[https://youtu.be/EI1hxXt9U4c](https://youtu.be/EI1hxXt9U4c)
I had to pause it quite a bit, but the demonstrations are nice to skim.
------
taivare
While on the topic of Inkscape. I've been wanting to post this for the
programmer/gamer crowd. At one point I was able to do vector scans & then go
in an fill them. I had a lot of interest from German gamer crowd, whom liked
the backdrops. However, Inkscape no longer allowed this. Adobe followed with
something similar (plug-in)- D3.js(code).Do to heavy memory use this would
make a good isolated app. Here is an example . .
[http://i.imgur.com/20W2UBd.png?1](http://i.imgur.com/20W2UBd.png?1)
------
ziotom78
Inkscape is one of my favorite tools when I am creating slideshows. Sometimes
I rely on Jessyink, when I want to use some zooming slides (like Prezi does),
sometimes I use it to create visually complex slides that I include in
presentations created with other tools (e.g. title slides to include in
beamer, out diagrams in LibreOffice Impress - the later works, but it's so
ugly I prefer Inkscape).
What I like most is the abundance of alignment tools Inkscape provides: it is
really easy to produce slides that use the space in a well balanced way!
------
fulldecent
Here is discussion on the effort to move Inkscape to GitHub:
[https://github.com/inkscape/inkscape/wiki/Migrate-
Launchpad-...](https://github.com/inkscape/inkscape/wiki/Migrate-Launchpad-to-
GitHub-%5BDRAFT%5D)
------
1024core
Are there any open-source Inkscape "libraries" of, what can only be said to
be, clipart out there?
I'm looking for ways to diagram Neural Networks. It would be great if there
were some 'NN clipart' from which I could just drag-n-drop stuff.
~~~
themodelplumber
Search wikipedia.org and openclipart.org.
~~~
pbhjpbhj
There's an openclipart.org browser built in, File > Import Clip Art ..., but
I'd use your web browser, it's much better UX.
------
facepalm
I've given up on using Inkscape on my Mac, but I am stuck with OS X for a
while. Are there any other vector graphics programs that are cross platform
and not too expensive? I don't want to invest in learning an OS X only tool.
~~~
egypturnash
Affinity Designer. I've played with it some but I can't get past a few UI
choices that are Just Plain Wrong to someone like me who's spent about fifteen
years using Illustrator.
~~~
facepalm
Thanks, I will check that out.
------
saycheese
Any suggestions for finding free/non-pirated vector images online?
~~~
anilgulecha
I end up using images.google.com with the query:
<keyword> ext:svg
This usually finds me good options, many from wikimedia etc, which are under a
open license.
Many times, if you only can find free and open images, but in raster format,
use something like vector magic to convert them to SVG.. VM usually does an
excellent job with basic handholding.
~~~
saycheese
Here's an an example search:
[https://www.google.com/search?q=site:wikimedia.org+ext:svg+-...](https://www.google.com/search?q=site:wikimedia.org+ext:svg+-map+-graph&tbm=isch)
------
hrnnnnnn
I once used inkscape to draw collision geometry for a game! Versatile!
------
leojg
I recently began to use inkscape again. I am getting into 3d printing and
Inkscape is great for creating .stl/.svg files of text fonts or 2d images.
------
cutler
Looks great but not available for Mac users.
~~~
tempodox
Yes, it is:
[https://inkscape.org/en/download/mac-
os/](https://inkscape.org/en/download/mac-os/)
Uses XQuartz, the platform's X11 emulation.
~~~
ak1394
They didn't release new 0.92 packages for Mac and apparently don't plan to.
~~~
dr_hooo
Noooo! are you aware of any third party binaries?
~~~
2ion
There's an inkscape cask for homebrew. You should be able to compile it on
your own too.
~~~
LyndsySimon
The cask is 0.91, and uses the .dmg file.
I'll subscribe to their dev mailing list and see about volunteering to get the
macOS version out.
------
andrewclunn
Is it still only 32 bit? The 4 gig ram limitation made some complex processes
much slower than they needed to be.
------
hernandipietro
I will see if stability improved. At least in Win32, I got pissed off so many
times with crashes and hangs.
------
skynode
Having used Inkscape and Adobe Illustrator at different times, I'd stick with
illustrator any day.
------
megiddo
Sometime between 0.42 and 0.91 the PDF export for very narrow lines ceased to
function correctly.
I have to keep old versions around in order to produce cut lines for my laser.
Very disappoint. Perhaps 0.92 fixes.
------
comments_db
Love Inkscape
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: What is your experience with cheaper s3 clones on the market excluding? - ddorian43
So basically i want something like s3, just cheaper. 2 companies that i know of are :<p>http://dreamhost.com/cloud/dreamobjects/pricing/<p>http://www.constant.com/cloud/storage/<p>
Exluding azure,google,hp,rackspace who all have nearly the same pricing.My usecase is for video and photo storage and serving.
Thanks
======
SirPalmerston
There's also Google Cloud Storage which is cheaper per gigabyte (I think).
Amazon S3 costs $0.125/GB where as Google charges $0.12/GB.
And Google's integrates well with their App Engine and Cloud DB options.
(Correct me if I'm wrong.)
~~~
ddorian43
And rackspace + azure should have nearly the same pricing. But comparing to
the two i listed, they have 1/2 pricing,although the pricing goes nearly the
same after 500TB storage (reduced redundancy) and 150TB bandwidth which is
alot.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: Node.js, Twitter, Instagram-powered e-paper picture frame - matevzmihalic
http://www.visionect.com/blog/instagram-twitter-ifttt-e-paper-digital-signage/
======
NathanKP
Very nice set up. I would probably just code it to hook up to an Instagram
content and scrape the images directly instead of going through Twitter
though.
~~~
DanAndersen
True, though from the article, it sounds like they first set up Twitter
integration and then added on Instagram to that as an evolutionary step.
~~~
luka-birsa
That's exactly how we went about it. We could do a full Instagram integration,
but we never used IFTTT and it saved us some coding + kept the example
codebase much simpler.
IFTTT does have downsides tho, very slow to push from Instagram to Twitter.
------
pldrnt
I see it runs Linux, do you make the OS available?
~~~
luka-birsa
It doesn't run Linux - the devices themsleves run as a thin-clients, that
connect to a server. The server converts webpages into data and streams them
to the device.
The server is running vanilla Ubuntu with Visionect Packages.
------
j_s
$500 shipped
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
How is China able to provide enough food to feed over 1B people? - carapace
https://www.quora.com/How-is-China-able-to-provide-enough-food-to-feed-its-population-of-over-1-billion-people-Do-they-import-food-or-are-they-self-sustainable?share=1
======
FigBug
The country I don't understand how they do it is Bangladesh. A country the
size of New York State with 164 million people. (50% of the US population). As
I understand it, they generate 90% of the food they require.
~~~
triceratops
The subcontinent, and especially India and Bangladesh, have ridiculous amounts
of arable land. India has more than any other country in the world.
~~~
nazgulnarsil
besides the US
~~~
triceratops
According to Wikipedia[1] the title goes back and forth. In 2012, the latest
year for which the article has numbers, India had more. Despite being 1/4th
the size of the US.
1\.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arable_land](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arable_land)
~~~
nazgulnarsil
didn't know that! Thanks.
------
baybal2
Chinese farm productivity is shite, and the government knows it.
It is true that the state throws absolutely colossal amount of resources on
geoengineering and agriculture, yet to little effect.
China is nowhere near Holland or other advanced agriculture player in calories
production per unit of labour.
Out of close to a 100 officials I went by through my career, I only managed to
befriend two. From those two, I barely know in the most generalised terms of
what is happening in top tiers.
Agriculture meetings are alleged to be the non-stop shit show, an every day
crisis, and a way to demotion for the prime majority of cadres put on the agri
committees, as most of them fail at the task.
Provincial level party executives all send their deputies instead of
themselves to them as they fear demotion and penalties if they say something
silly at those meetings.
Chinese bureaucracy does not deserve much credit there. Were that much of
money be given to just anybody moderately competent, China would've long
beaten even Holland on that.
~~~
winfred
I don't think that calories production per unit of labour is a big concern
when you don't export produce and you've got access to so much labor and a
socialist economy where food prices are fixed and jobs are all but guaranteed.
The Dutch have a stronger focus on produce export and a higher income per
capita, so they have to be a lot more efficient in order to be competitive in
the global economy.
~~~
chii
calories per unit labour is a good measure of how advanced the agriculture
tech is. Just because labour is cheap, doesn't mean it's efficient - and
imagine if that labour could be spent on other things (while still maintining
the output).
~~~
winfred
I understand that, but China is still industrializing and has an enormous
abundance of labor. They have over 425 million farmers (and a decade ago, that
number was 700 million). At achievable efficiency, that could easily be done
by as few as 50 to 100 million, but then there just wouldn't be any available
jobs for the other 300+ million people. China is already using workers in
massive unneeded building projects and has an army of over 2 million soldiers
and who knows what else, just to keep the unemployment down.
A higher produce efficiency is not only not needed, it is unwanted. Full labor
market participation is of much more value to the Chinese right now than the
efficiency of the produce industry.
------
lph
One thing that's not mentioned is that the freshness and variety of produce
available in China is fantastic. There's much less refrigeration and
transportation, so there's a good chance the produce you buy at the local
street market came from nearby fields very recently. Seeing this as a visitor
from the US is quite a revelation.
~~~
nine_k
Which places did you visit, and observed this?
I bet it's characteristic for large cities where the amount of produce
consumed is large, and prices are higher.
~~~
lph
Beijing, Xi'an, Chengdu, and a handful of villages nearby them. Also some
roadside farmer stalls in between. I'm sure the quality and variety vary, but
the sample I saw was impressive.
------
chopinsky
The author has made no efforts to hide the fact that he's a China apologetic
and CCP propagation puppet. The fact is that the majority of the country's
rice and corns are imported (from SE Asia or N/S America), which are Chinese
main calory source. Another often overlooked fact is that China has built a
vast crops storage network across the nation, for the fact that a small
interruption in food supply chain could cause huge humanitarian disaster, and
the new crops will rotate out old stale crops, which are barely eatable but
sure, they're better than nothing. Most Chinese even have no idea of this,
that their daily rice supplies are usually 5+ yrs old, unless you pay a
premium to buy them from Whole Food equivalent super markets in China.
~~~
origin
> Most Chinese even have no idea of this, that their daily rice supplies are
> usually 5+ yrs old
Even during the Maoist period 'new rice' was given out/sold once a year for
celebration. Everyone was aware they were eating rotated granary rice.
Storing crops against famine (and eating the old, stored grain) is an ancient
tradition [1] dating back to at least 6000 BC, and in China, guarding against
famine was one of the earliest tasks of the Chinese proto-state.
[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granary](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granary)
------
pradn
" most of the population in India claim to be vegetarians"
At most a third of India is vegetarian.
[http://theconversation.com/the-myth-of-a-vegetarian-
india-10...](http://theconversation.com/the-myth-of-a-vegetarian-india-102768)
~~~
rueynshard
Sure, but even among the remaining 2/3rds, meat consumption is much lower,
compared to other regions where they typically eat meat every meal.
------
SQueeeeeL
This whole post has a Factorio vibe of x->y->z, I'd read a blog from this
author just breaking down infrastructure.
~~~
rntksi
You should check this out. Same author. He has quality answers on Quora.
[https://www.quora.com/As-a-Chinese-person-what-do-you-
think-...](https://www.quora.com/As-a-Chinese-person-what-do-you-think-of-the-
future-of-Vietnams-economy-compared-to-those-of-other-Southeast-Asian-
countries)
------
ETHisso2017
What's also overlooked is that China went through one of the worst man made
famines in history, and the government has internalized many of the lessons
(paid in blood) from that affair.
------
abledon
The author has other great answers in a similar structure too!
[https://www.quora.com/profile/Janus-Dongye-
Qimeng](https://www.quora.com/profile/Janus-Dongye-Qimeng)
~~~
D_Alex
The author writes well, but presents an unbalanced, Mainland-Chinese-
Propagandist views. This does not make for "great answers".
Also.... who is asking the questions?
~~~
abledon
true, I can stomach the propaganda, but that aside, the way he links each
chunk of the story together is really fun. Hes like a college professor that I
would of loved to have , where every lecture was a mini adventure.
------
dmix
Wow, Japan consumes more seafood then all of the US states combined and the EU
countries combined? That’s amazing.
~~~
jws
Japan has 50% more coastline than the United States.
Where I sit, 1000km from an ocean, seafood is pretty remote. Sure, it gets
flown in and flash frozen isn't horrible, but it isn't fresh.
~~~
seanmcdirmid
A lot seafood is flash frozen these days, even next to the coast and even in
japan. It’s just the best way to deal with parasites. I don’t think you can
eat sashimi in the USA that hasn’t been flash frozen.
~~~
wolco
lake/river fish usually have parasites and must be cooked.
I was under the impression that ocean fish don't have the same level of
parasites.
You would never eat a catfish raw.
~~~
seanmcdirmid
[https://www.nytimes.com/2004/04/08/nyregion/sushi-fresh-
from...](https://www.nytimes.com/2004/04/08/nyregion/sushi-fresh-from-the-
deep-the-deep-freeze.html)
------
entelarust
Those sat shots totally remind me of the intro to the blade runner where they
show the densely packed structures [https://i2.wp.com/rosettedelacroix.com/wp-
content/uploads/20...](https://i2.wp.com/rosettedelacroix.com/wp-
content/uploads/2018/01/5a.png?resize=474%2C210)
------
einpoklum
The question should really be "How are many national economies keeping
innumerable people hungry, even though there's plenty of food to go around
several times over?"
In most places in the world it's easy and cheap enough to produce food and
distribute it. Actually, it's so easy and cheap that many world states
artificially subsidize agriculture/livestock farming/etc. to prevent them from
collapsing due to low prices.
~~~
kartan
> "How are many national economies keeping innumerable people hungry, even
> though there's plenty of food to go around several times over?"
I never see this question on TV. What I mainly see on Tv is talk about
political strategies, result surveys and the like. Climate change is one of
the few things that I see being discussed. And even that has a lot of this
let's talk about politicians positions and poll results.
I want to see more about how to improve the world. Does anyone know any good
on-line resources about this? Because mass media is doing a poor job. And we
need them to do a better job.
~~~
feral
Opinion:
The tough truth is that improving the world at that scale is mostly about
politics. Politics is how the nations allocate resources to problems.
You maybe want them to talk about the technical fundamentals of the problem
but the important bit is usually the politics.
[A sibling comment says to look at TED talks. This is an excellent idea. Then,
after a couple of years, ask why none of the solutions have been implemented,
and you are ready to get interested in the politics.]
~~~
saalweachter
In the 1950s, building a moonbase would have been an engineering and
technological challenge.
Today, it's basically a political and economics challenge, to convince enough
people it would be worth while to spend the time and effort to do it. Which is
not to say there wouldn't be engineers involved, solving new problems, but we
already know enough of the solutions that it's not really the sticking point
now.
(Which is to agree with you, a lot of things are organizational problems at
this point.)
~~~
chiefalchemist
> "Today, it's basically a political and economics challenge, to convince
> enough people it would be worth while to spend the time and effort to do
> it."
There's a quote by (I believe) Winston Churchill - which I can't seem to find
atm - that goes something along the lines of:
Winning a war/battle is relatively easy. It's convincing them to let you fight
that's far more difficult.
------
gezh
One thing that is not mentioned in the article is the massive amount of soy
beans that China imports each year (approximately 90 mmt in 2019) to produce
feedstock for their hog herds and acquacultures. Most of the soy beans are
imported from the US (pre trade war), Brazil and Argentina.
------
klenwell
I see 3 sushi restaurants on the same street, start to extrapolate in my head,
and wonder how we hadn't extinguished most edible fish species decades ago.
From what I've read and heard on the subject, my understanding is: (1) some we
have (touched upon at end of Jiro Dreams of Sushi, for example), (2) we are in
the process of doing so to most the rest, (3) fish farms are increasingly
making up the difference.
~~~
tus88
Fish stocks are being depleted. We are running the earth down.
------
mstaoru
Another perspective on how China is able to provide enough food:
\- In Shanghai 96% white-collar workers have at least one disease of the "food
triad" (diabetes, fatty liver, hypertension), up from ~80% in 00's.
\- In Beijing 26% of the whole population is overweight or obese, up from 11%
in 00's.
\- China has the largest percentage of obese children in the World, only
competing with Mexico.
So there is enough food, but this food is low quality empty calories to "feed"
1B people, not nourish them.
~~~
piiswrong
more than 1/3 of Americans are obese. the US is one of the fattest countries
in the world. Does that mean Americans are poor people who can only afford
empty calories? wake up. people just like to eat unhealthy stuff when given
the chance?.
~~~
winfred
>Does that mean Americans are poor people who can only afford empty calories?
I don't know if it's because they can't afford better or don't want to eat
better, but in the US there is a considerable relationship between
income/education and obesity. The poorer you are, the more likely you are to
be obese. 50% of the US makes less than $30k a year, and that group probably
amounts to somewhere around 75% of the obese people.
[https://www.stateofobesity.org/socioeconomics-
obesity/](https://www.stateofobesity.org/socioeconomics-obesity/)
~~~
kube-system
I don’t think the difference is due to income directly, but more to do with
class/social expectations. Eating is a very social activity, and the way
people eat is strongly linked to their individual and group identity.
Healthy eating simply isn’t prioritized by some people/groups, and others
don’t value it at all.
------
dgellow
This quora answer is pure CCP propaganda, why is this post on the HN home
page?
~~~
v-yadli
Freedom of speech I guess?
~~~
edwinyzh
Freedom of speech and I guess HN is an international community? On the post,
as the author said, seeing is believing. Whether or not it's CCP propaganda,
it's facts.
~~~
dgellow
“Seeing is believing” really doesn’t make any sense in the modern world. And
facts don’t exist in a vacuum, they are presented with a specific narrative,
some are just omitted, some are plain lies (China bringing joy to Tibet
population by providing better food, really?).
~~~
pms
I find it informative to see other points of view and an impressive number of
facts that are presented in this Quora answer, rather than just the Western
point of view, which arguably could be also called as "propaganda". Let's not
go this route.
------
known
China leads world in production of:
\- Rice \- Wheat \- Lettuce \- Cabbage \- Cauliflowers \- Eggplant \- Potato
\- Spinach \- Carrots \- Cucumber \- Pumpkin \- Sweet potato \- Grapes \-
Peach \- Apple \- Plum \- Strawberry \- Tomato \- Tea \- Beer \- Pork meat \-
Sheep meat \- Peanut \- Egg \- Honey
[https://twitter.com/spectatorindex/status/106956943987883622...](https://twitter.com/spectatorindex/status/1069569439878836225)
------
coldtea
This is probably the best article I've read on Quora!
------
hackbinary
Imports of grain from Canada?
------
Marazan
Awesome self-burn about the quality of Chinese 'honey' there.
------
m3kw9
Is an infrastructure planning issue, if they don’t plan for food while
expanding population, the population wouldn’t expand anyways!
------
bartimus
Also more CO2 means increased plant growth.
------
scarface74
I can’t imagine the US being as efficient at anything as China is at growing
food.
~~~
kaesar14
What does this even mean? Almost 300 million people are agricultural workers
in China, versus 6 million in the US. Despite that, we produce nearly the same
quantity of food and export 140 billion dollars of food every year. The US has
plenty of efficiency shortcomings, but in agriculture, the US agricultural
sector is a modern marvel of engineering and efficiency.
~~~
Theodores
US produce is industrial feedstock, not food.
In the Brexit-headed UK there is considerable discussion about this, some
Brits don't consider US food to be edible. Phrases like 'chlorinated chicken'
get mentioned.
Are those soy beans fed to people or pigs? Same with all that corn. None of it
can be eaten, it has to be processed into corn syrup or fake potato crisps.
There is no modern marvel of engineering, it is monoculture, as if nothing was
learned from the dustbowl. It is also heavily subsidised. Watered by fracked
aquifiers. To international tastes it is all bland, adulterated and not really
food.
Those exports also put people out of work on the global market so they are not
growing their own food, just importing nonsense like American maize.
I am not into Chinese food but I know that Chinese people don't consider U.S.
food as having much taste, not even real food.
~~~
sct202
The funny thing with US soy beans is that the majority of our edamame and
fresh soy beans are frozen and imported from China or Thailand even though we
literally have fields everywhere growing soy beans across the country.
------
edisonjoao
What about India or that whole part of the world
------
intended
Yeah sorry - that answer is the sort that glosses over a huge amount of facts
to present a clean a-b-c dependency tree along side a decent heap of sino
philia.
So in particular the point on fish farms- fish farms are _hard_ , the fish
need many different things to be happy and not sick or affected by parasites.
This means medicines, treatment and more - further this is only viable if you
have transportation, refrigeration and markets.
Those make a larger difference than the base technology. Without the transfer
and storage tech, the rest is simply bottlenecked.
Further this
>Those Tibetans have no time to go to temples for worshipping any more,
instead, they have to work in the greenhouses taking care of tomatoes. This is
why Dalai Lama is not so happy to hear this.
Is simply Chinese propo. The Dalai Lama is unhappy, if at all, because China
has taken over what used to be an independent nation, decides how their
religion should operate, crushed dissent and even ostracized their own
citizens who made the mistake of talking to Tibetan protesters to do the very
simple human thing of figuring out the other side.
(Voting behavior and soft shilling of the poster in the thread is also pretty
odd.)
~~~
pvaldes
> fish farms are hard
Yes and no. Some fishes are really, really hard to culture. Other are very
forgiving and easy if you know what to do. Aquaculture shaped China since
thousands of years. They have a lot of population in part because they have
carps. Is a very efficient way to recycle waste in food.
------
amelius
How is it possible that Quora knows my first name?
------
lxe
Oh boy. Lots of things in the top answer that western folks will, uh...
question. Informative and complete nonetheless!
------
rajeshp1986
I was really impressed by the top answer until I read this statement.
"I mean, the Chinese government has also forced Tibetans to build a massive
amount of greenhouses on the Tibetan plateau. Those Tibetans have no time to
go to temples for worshipping any more, instead, they have to work in the
greenhouses taking care of tomatoes. This is why Dalai Lama is not so happy to
hear this."
What??
~~~
alexron782
You should post the following paragraph as well:
"As a result, the average vegetable price in Tibet has reduced by 90% over the
past decade and they don’t have to import vegetables from nearby provinces
anymore. Most of the Tibetans can finally afford to eat watermelons. Who
doesn’t like eating watermelons?
You know that most Tibetans historically only eat yak meat, milk, cheese, and
bread? They couldn’t grow anything in such a harsh climate. Only monks could
have the luxury to eat vegetables. Now it is the solid proof that the Chinese
government didn’t just destroy temples in Tibetan culture but helped them eat
vegetables and fruits."
~~~
nitwit005
The logic is a bit dubious. The Chinese had a pretty crappy diet when they
invaded Tibet. Whether the China invaded or not, the food quality would have
risen, just like most of the rest of the planet.
------
cybersnowflake
A lot of superdefensive people over at quora everytime you ask a question
about china.
~~~
dmix
Even the first answer has “Western media won’t tell you this”. Like there’s
some western conspiracy to downplay Chinese agriculture industry.
The Chinese media is constantly telling their people that the US is plotting
against China and is hostile to them, so the citizens don’t get any crazy
ideas like democracy and human rights. While simultaneously amplifying the bad
news coming out of America to show the ‘dangers’ of western culture.
Plus there is a large group of astroturfers constantly scanning the web for
mentions of China (aka “50 cent army”).
I don’t blame the individuals for holding these views but it’s something to
always be conscious of when reading anything online about China. And I say
that as someone who loves their country and people, just not their cultural
controls.
~~~
bllguo
The tone is honestly understandable. It pains me to bring up this cliched
point, but is the US media not constantly telling us that China is hostile,
China is plotting? As someone with a foot in both worlds, US coverage of China
is _at least_ equally warped. It's funny; to my parents and relatives in China
I'm perceived as having a US bias, but everywhere else I get characterized as
being too Chinese.
It's hard for me to emphasize enough how little typical Westerners understand
about Asia. It goes both ways but I think they're doing a better job of it -
at least in my opinion, China appreciates US culture much more than the US
appreciates Chinese culture.
~~~
nfoz
> It's hard for me to emphasize enough how little typical Westerners
> understand about Asia.
I bet the typical human knows very little about life and culture outside of
their specific environment. A typical city-dweller knows little about rural
life even in their own region, and vice-versa.
It's weird how easily we fall into a trap of saying "look how ignorant x
people are". I mean, of course, it's a big world, and we're busy, so it's
pretty hard to not be ignorant.
Maybe a bigger mistake is thinking that "Media" (news etc?) is an education
system. It's not and maybe it's not supposed to be. We need to come up with a
better system/expectation/culture around continuous education, but even in the
best case that can only apply to the subset of the population that has the
time and resources and interest to take part.
~~~
txcwpalpha
> I bet the typical human knows very little about life and culture outside of
> their specific environment. A typical city-dweller knows little about rural
> life even in their own region, and vice-versa.
I think this is certainly true, but at the same time, I've never met an
American (even an otherwise 'uneducated' one), who was under the impression
that London or Berlin are backwoods villages that struggle to keep the lights
on, whereas I have certainly met people that think Hong Kong is. So then the
question becomes "yes people are generally unaware, but what is it about Asia
specifically that makes it seem like there is an even larger lack of awareness
compared to somewhere like Europe?"
In regards to the rest of your comment: I wholeheartedly agree, but I don't
think it comes down to "time or resources". Some of it does just come down to
personal habits/preferences. Without passing any judgement, there are plenty
of people who spend their evenings watching The Bachelorette when they could
just as easily be using that time to watch The Travel Channel (or Discovery
Channel if it was still actually educational), but they actively choose not
to. I think that's a societal thing much more than it is a time or resources
constraint.
~~~
joey_bob
When the US was a backwoods nation, London and Berlin were world capitals, and
Hong Kong was a backwater fishing village, so American culture does not have
the same ingrained respect for Hong Kong that it does for European cities.
That being said, I don't know if you are using Hong Kong as a stand in for
major Chinese cities, but Hong Kong emigres make up a disproportionate amount
of ethnic Chinese American immigrants, and the way many of them talk about the
mainland, one might think mainland China is having a problem with the keeping
the lights one.
~~~
roboys
At the founding of the US, China was the #1 economy in the world. This view of
the world among Europeans is partially based of racism and racist accounts of
the world going unchecked.
The most investment-worthy economies on the planet have been in Asia for the
past couple centuries (if you understand buying the dip), this fact is an
economic threat to Europeans with a zero-sum view of global capitalism (has
been for at least 2 centuries). The rest writes itself....
------
ZeroGravitas
This and watching HBO's Chernobyl have prompted me to ask: how do communist
countries work? Is there something I can read or watch to best understand
things like who owns these farms, who profits from them, how do they pay
workers, how do you buy a house, etc
It's all as foreign to me as medieval peasants and nobles so I don't know how
it works from day to day. The fact that China now has billionaires, and
billionaires spoiled kids doing donuts in supercars also confused me.
~~~
jotm
It was pretty simple in the USSR: the government owns the farms, the
government profits from them, they pay the workers (very often in product).
The government/party says a new farm will be created here, the order goes out.
It is all controlled from the top (communist party) through the regional
council, through the local council (often a few councils inbetween). After the
farm is established, a few inspections by party officials and it's all set up
and operating.
This created the perfect opportunity to fudge reports like there's no tomorrow
and essentially the party had no idea what is actually going on.
Papers say production is fine, orders are to maintain levels, report comes
back saying everything is proceeding as ordered. In reality, production was
higher than reported (with no room to grow if ordered), workers are skimming
product, managers are skimming product, local council is skimming product and
money, regional council is skimming money. To make up for the shit pay, but
also because why not, the party won't miss it.
Orders come in to increase production, report says "no can do, need more
equipment, need more land, need more workers". Of course, more than is
actually needed, so someone can have their own tractors.
The black market, often in barter, was huge.
The party in Moscow could not contain its spread even with their network of
spies. People trusted each other, not the party, the police were in on it.
Not sure if that's how it works in China, but they have the advantage of
instant communications, instant checks on any level, modern surveillance.
This turned out messy, I'm too tired.
~~~
pm90
Wonder how this could change with modern technology and controls.
------
edoo
Perhaps the question should be how do 1B people feed themselves despite the
government of China.
------
Inu
The author's answer to the question 'How do mainland Chinese feel about the
protests in Hong Kong on the extradition law amendment?':
[https://www.quora.com/How-do-mainland-Chinese-feel-about-
the...](https://www.quora.com/How-do-mainland-Chinese-feel-about-the-protests-
in-Hong-Kong-on-the-extradition-law-amendment/answer/Janus-Dongye-Qimeng)
~~~
pzo
At the very end author compares hong kong island to langkawi portraying
lankgawi as some unatractive island and that hong kongers should be happy they
are connected to mainland. This is where I started look more critical at the
whole article having been in those islands before myself - it was a great
reality check that you have read everything very critically these days.
I recommend everyone not only to check google images how langkawi look like
but even more recommend to go there for a holiday [1]. It's called 'bali of
malaysia' and popular tourist destination. Very close to another great
malaysian island - penang.
Author says "You can rent this island for 99 years and start to develop your
economy." I would happily rent it for even 10 years if the price is right!
[1]
[https://www.google.com/search?q=langkawi](https://www.google.com/search?q=langkawi)
~~~
madez
I'm majorly surprised you needed to read until the end to figure that out. To
me it was and is impossible to read from the beginning without having my
propagandometer going off-limits nearly instantly. I wanted to take parts and
comment here to substantiate my claim, but the post is too extreme and long.
It's obvious. The linked post is outright /r/sino material.
~~~
echevil
The quora question is "How mainland Chinese feel about protests in Hong Kong",
and the answer IMO is same as the reality of how mainland Chinese really feel
about it.
------
sonalr
Yeah definitely liberated Tibet with all those greenhouses and tomatoes in
xinjiang.
------
BurningFrog
Without reading the link...
This kind of question is dumb. It imagines there is an entity called "China"
that's tasked with feeding 1.3B people.
In reality, it's just 1,300,000,000 individuals tasked with feeding
themselves, just like anywhere else in the world. We do it by division of
labor. Some grow food, others build goods, others provide services. We all
trade with each other so everyone can specialize at what we do best.
It's no different if the nation border happens to enclose 1.3B Chinese
nationals or 300K Icelandic ones.
~~~
staplor
Read the link and then delete your comment.
~~~
dang
This comment breaks the site guidelines:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html).
Please don't be a jerk on HN.
~~~
staplor
Thank you for the reply. Won't do it again.
------
holografix
China is investing heavily in Africa.
------
hummel
He forgets to mention: Africa
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Six Million iBricks… and Growing - prakash
http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/07/11/six-million-ibricks-and-growing/
======
run4yourlives
Every major tech release is the same thing. Everyone raves over how wonderful
this new piece of kit will be, a few morons line up for hours to give their
money away, and then comes the inevitable pile up of rants because things
don't work as advertised.
Seriously, you'd think people would learn that it simply doesn't pay to be an
early adopter, but no, every release is the same tired bout of whining.
Never buy version .0, that goes for everything - from cars to iPhones.
------
steveplace
Clearly, it's a Rails problem.
------
axod
and shrinking... Just keep retrying. Took me about 30 minutes. Yes it's a
pain, but what do you expect when the world all wants the same thing at the
same time.
~~~
dbreunig
I agree, that headline is just trolling for traffic. 6 million? Come on.
Settle down.
------
Alex3917
Releasing the 2.0 firmware for existing users on Wednesday would have solved
this problem. Releasing the new phones and the new firmware on the same day
was incredibly stupid and irresponsible.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: Morse Node - morse code in node.js - mfkp
http://www.morsenode.com/
======
mfkp
The source is available at
[https://github.com/mfkp/morsenode](https://github.com/mfkp/morsenode) if
anybody is interested. Pretty straightforward node app.
~~~
mokkol
haha awesome idea of a project!
------
tylerdavis
FINALLY.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
One week with the Google Pixel - tortilla
https://medium.com/@elliotjaystocks/one-week-with-the-google-pixel-f43e6647906f#.2l4udx8oo
======
clumsysmurf
"3\. Deep Google integration - This shouldn’t be surprising in any way, but
having Google built into pretty much everything you do on the phone is
seriously useful."
This is my main sticking point with Android lately. I would much rather have a
stock Android OS + device from Google, and then add the few Google services I
want. Instead Google is getting more and more baked into everything, and
understanding how my data is being used is becoming more difficult - and this
has me worried.
~~~
josephg
I moved from Android to iOS last year for this exact reason. Using android
over a few versions felt like a slow slippery slope of access prompts giving
permission for google to use ever more personal data about me and my phone.
The final straw for me was learning that google uploads and stores audio
recordings of everything I've ever said into google now[1].
A year ago when I got my iphone I deleted all of the historical voice data
that google stored. Just now, In the process of finding the google activity
link below, I've learned that all my deleted voice clips have magically
undeleted themselves.
I've been very happy with iOS - there's some little UI gripes, but for me the
biggest feature is Tim Cook standing up to the US government on behalf of
privacy. I'm convinced that as an organisation Google just doesn't understand
what privacy is or why its important to people. With all the new deep app
intelligence features in android, I shudder to think about simply how much
data google might be storing about its users. I'm very happy to be out.
[1]
[https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity?product=29](https://myactivity.google.com/myactivity?product=29)
~~~
theswaagar
If I'm not mistaken doesn't Apple also record and upload everything you've
ever said to Siri?
~~~
simonh
Apple keeps the data for up to two years, but from 6 months its associated
with a random ID code so it's not personally identifiable. At least that's how
it used to be done. They have been talking about using more advanced
statistical anonymization techniques recently but I don't know if they are
used for Siri.
------
doubleshadow
I switched from an iPhone 6+ to the Google Pixel. I've had two problems, but
overall love the phone.
1.) The phone is extremely slippery. I don't agree with the author on this
one. My old iPhone was way easier to grip, and the iPhone 7 is even better. I
bought a case which fixed this issue.
2.) I think this is pretty important. Android apps are second class citizens.
A lot of applications don't work properly with Android and you can tell that
there just isn't much developer time spent on it. I hope as the Pixel and
Google phones become more popular at the high end, more developer time is
focused on these applications. Most applications work fine, but sometimes it
can be frustrating when an application you expect to work has major bugs.
~~~
mdellavo
Can you be more specific with your second point? I haven't run across this at
all.
~~~
sowbug
The Tesla app for Android has numerous bugs that wouldn't have shipped if
Tesla leadership carried Android devices.
* The app must be closed in a certain way (back button or swiping away, rather than home button or switching to another app) or else it'll permanently lose network connectivity after a few minutes. I think this is because they keep the socket object in their main activity, and they don't deal with cases where an idle connection gets evicted from a NAT table or similar. But that's just speculation.
* If you launch the app in certain connectivity states, it will not just put up a no-connection alert, but it will flush your stored password. This could leave you in a pickle if you use a strong passphrase that you keep in a password manager, and you were relying on the app to unlock your car.
* The app doesn't support fingerprints. This isn't a bug, but it's something that enough apps support nowadays that it feels strange they're so far behind.
In addition, I'm told the iOS app has more features than the Android version,
but I've never seen it myself.
------
wodenokoto
He doesn't have an iPhone 7+, yet he claims that the camera on the pixel are
"consistently better".
I don't have any, but the side by side tests I've seen of real world pictures
it is a complete wash between the two.
I find it silly to say that Apple didn't present a compelling enough camera,
but Google did, when they are as similar as they are.
~~~
visarga
They are probably cameras and phones assembled in the same factory.
~~~
wodenokoto
As far as I remember, they are both Sony cameras. I don't know if Google uses
Foxconn.
------
colordrops
Not many negatives. Is it really that great of a phone, or is this really a
sales pitch?
~~~
r00fus
Exactly, this is a single data point, seemingly without contrast.
~~~
tossaway1
I've seen pretty good reviews across the board, even from Walt Mossberg, who I
generally think of as an Apple fanboy.
------
rmason
I am giddy about my Pixel XL. I've sold a few of my friends on getting one. I
was in the Sprint store cancelling my service as I moved over to Fi and once
the guys saw it they all had to play with it.
Only problem that I've had was getting the fingerprint sensor working. You're
finger down for around 45 seconds and it vibrates to tell you that its got it.
That wasn't working for me and the Google engineers blamed it on software that
I'd installed. But it failed before I'd installed any software.
I found an alternative way to do it ironically while waiting for a callback
from the engineer. Hold your finger down for 15 seconds, lift it up but keep
it hovering over the sensor. Then it will show you it's 20% done and prompt
you to put your finger down again. It takes five iterations to get a finger
done. You can do more than one finger and I've added four.
The one thing that I don't like is the dialing directory. You can't get it to
be alphabetical and instead of a standard list you end up with these big boxes
on the screen. Looks great in the photos with a half dozen contacts but fails
with hundreds. The UI is extremely awkward and I don't know how it passed user
testing. Does anyone have a favorite alternative for me to try?
Two pluses - battery life is fantastic and I've actually gotten almost two
days from one charge. I am usually negative on all assistants but Google's is
fantastic and I actually find myself using it for all sorts of things. I let
my 100 year old dad try it. He smirked and said Google what is the weather in
Paris, France tomorrow. It gave him the weather report and there was this
gorgeous look of complete shock on his face:<).
------
travv0
"The Pixel needs charging once a day, which is a little bit of a
disappointment, but it charges really quickly."
I'm not sure I understand this negative. I'd think any problems caused by this
would be easily remedied by just charging your phone while you're sleeping,
when you can't use it anyway.
Or is he saying that it needs to be charged once a day, even if you charge it
overnight?
~~~
xyzzy123
If you don't always sleep in the same place it means lugging a charger.
It means you can't go to bed drunk and neccessarily expect your alarm to go
off in the morning.
It really just means that any time your life gets out of routine, your phone
is probably going to die.
~~~
SiVal
"Out of routine" is routine for frequent flyers. You never know when you'll
end up spending the night in an airport transit lounge or you can't get into
your hotel at the end of a flight around the world, or whatever. Or when
driving or hiking through a somewhat remote area and something goes wrong....
When things go wrong, you need to make calls, put out fires, keep trying to
reach remote towers using full radio power for extended periods.
When things go wrong is when you MOST need your phone, so you need a battery
that can continue to serve you a lot longer than it normally needs to on an
ordinary day unless you can somehow be certain that for you every day will be
an ordinary day.
~~~
tedunangst
Do frequent flyers not bring chargers in their carry on?
~~~
gcr
Tell me. Where in LAX or SFO or LGA can I find an electric outlet?
Some airports make them impossible to find, highly coveted, surrounded by the
territorial and ferroucious Horde, oodles of macbook MagSafe and ipad
Lightning cables eminating from the wall like thin withering tentacles of some
white goop monster emanating from the power grid.
Other airports lock the power sockets away behind "Employee Only" signs and
caution tape, with menacing security guards patrolling the area should you
even think about stealing those precious MWh from the institution.
Still other airports have rows upon rows of power outlets in plain sight, but
every single one of them is dead, disconnected, dying like your phone battery.
------
ebbv
Half the positives on this list I find to be kinda crazy to be positives. For
example having Facebook Messenger handle your SMS messages. Really? You want
to voluntarily give all that info to a company as user hostile as Facebook?
Less drastically I question the need to hide apps away in an app drawer. If
you don't use the app then just delete it. Am I alone in feeling that way?
I'm glad he's happy and the Pixel seems like a great phone but this list just
felt half crazy to me.
~~~
voxic11
Facebook SMS support is client side only. They do not get your texts in any
way.
~~~
ebbv
Are you absolutely sure about that? I'd like to believe you but I can't take
it on faith. I completely expect Facebook is giving itself some level of info
about your SMS messages unless there is some reason they can't.
~~~
voxic11
Trust is the only reason. I'm sure there are plenty of people who are
examining the traffic of Facebook apps and someone would make a sink about it
if there was evidence they were lieing about their privacy policy. That seems
like an adequate assurance for most people but certainly not all.
------
plandis
I had the chance to play around with the Pixel and it is really cool.
Honestly I'd probably pick one up if not for the poor, IMO, speaker quality.
If you like to talk to your phone Google definitely has the best voice
assistant
------
oxplot
The saturated colors gave me a headache in the first hour of using the phone.
Luckily, there is an option to turn on sRGB color profile buried in the
developer tools menu (activated by tapping the build version in about phone
menu multiple times). After turning the option on, I don't want to look at any
other screen.
I'm not sure why this isn't on by default given that the sRGB option on pixel
apparently has the most accurate color representation of any phone (can't
remember where I read it) today.
------
dmcginty
I've been using Samsung phones for several years (currently still using a
Galaxy S6), and my Pixel is supposed to come around the end of the month. Did
they really get rid of app badges? That has been a thing for a while, unless
I'm not understanding what "badges" are. Also, is the battery life on an
iPhone good enough that you don't have to charge it every day. I can't
remember owning a smartphone that could go longer than 24+ hours on one
charge.
~~~
s_kilk
> is the battery life on an iPhone good enough that you don't have to charge
> it every day
Yup. I have an iPhone 6, and routinely go two days between charges. I can
charge it overnight, use it all day, skip a night, all day again, and still
have about ~20% charge still left by the time I plug it in the next night
before bed.
~~~
josephg
I have a 6s+. With light usage my phone will often last a full 3 days between
charges.
------
nattaylor
I've been wondering if I was missing out on the iPhone's 3D touch feature, for
interacting with photos, messages, etc. The author didn't mention missing it,
so I guess I'm not.
~~~
ebbv
I haven't found it very useful. Certainly not a reason to choose iPhone over
Android. I have other reasons (like privacy concerns and ecosystem lock in).
~~~
pionar
Honest question - Why would you say Android is worse at ecosystem lock-in than
iOS?
~~~
danvasquez29
voluntary Ecosystem lock-in is actually the reason I moved back to iOS. I use
an iPad pro, and I don't believe there's a better tablet out there. I use
Macbook Pros both at work and at home. Having all of those devices perfectly
in sync is amazing for my productivity.
~~~
visarga
I tried too, but I can't find a use for tablets. As long as there is my laptop
around, I never reach for the tablet.
------
visarga
> For instance, ask it to search for an actor and then ask, “what films has he
> starred in?” It knows you’re still talking about the same person.
> Impressive.
Yeah, but then you ask it: "What is heavier, a cat or an elephant?" and it
fails, because it is lacking in common sense. It only has a small-ish factoid
knowledge base and lacks all the general common sense things we take for
granted.
~~~
empath75
Obviously, because they haven't created a fully conscious artificial
intelligence, it's a complete failure.
~~~
visarga
Don't take it so hard. I am the greatest fan of conversational AI chatbots. I
am just a little too impatient, especially that I have seen a chatbot that can
do those types of common sense challenges.
------
hausjam
Pixel. iPhone. Two sides of the same lousy coin. They both do the same thing.
And they are doing it increasingly poorly. But consumers keep lapping it up
blindly. Do we really need hardware and software updates every year? They just
about get the bugs out of iOS 9 and lollipop, and hey, it's been a year. Let's
start all over again with new bugs.
------
usaphp
After trying pixel phone the most annoying thing for me is a fingerprint
censor location, its so annoying to pick it up or use two hands to unlock it
even when using the power on button which is on a side
------
colemickens
Always fun to see Apple users step out of the RDF and gush over features that
Android has had for _years_ (not all of them, but a good chunk of them have
been present in Android for a long time now).
Edit: And yes, the UI/UX has changed remarkably little between Lollipop and
Nougat, despite the popular memes amongst non-Android users... like the ones
already repeated here.
~~~
askafriend
It's never been about the features. We have this conversation every single
time.
Users care about the experience, and features are only a portion of the
experience. That's what Apple really truly gets and other companies miss time
and time again.
~~~
colemickens
And the UI/UX is hardly at all different than what has been shipping for the
last 3 major Android versions.
Again, none of this is new for people who are actually using a recent version
of Android in the last 2-3 years, but go figure I get downvoted for pointing
it out.
Just as your comment proves, it's a sad, tired and completely out-dated meme
that Android doesn't have good UX. And then these blog posts come along and I
roll my eyes because my old phone that is 2 major revs behind Nougat looks and
behaves virtually identical to Nougat.
Ironically, there _are_ good features in the last few major revs, but they're
more about granular permissions and other functionality that isn't touched on
by this article at all.
~~~
empath75
Perhaps writing in a less condescending way might attract fewer downvotes.
~~~
colemickens
It's hard to tell someone they're mindlessly repeating years-out-of-date,
inaccurate memey tropes without coming across as condescending.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Unverified.email - vitplister
https://kerestey.net/writing/2020-04-05-announcing-unverified-dot-email.html
======
afraca
> we can create a mailbox via HTTP GET request to
> [https://api.unverified.email/create](https://api.unverified.email/create)
Shouldn't GETs be idempotent? (Sorry for not having feedback on the idea,
skimming it it seems nice, though there is fierce competition as others have
shown here)
~~~
mike_d
No. GET is defined to be nullipotent, or having no side effects. That is not
the same as "not making a change."
To be pedantic, every GET request to a modern website makes a state change
somewhere... to a log file, to a database, to a tracking system. The
difference is it has no side effect for the user (i.e. your comment gets
duplicated or your order placed twice)
~~~
cyansmoker
Not being pedantic, then, but is GET even the right verb to create a resource?
~~~
de_watcher
PILLAGE was too long, so we use GET.
------
dylz
What kind of anti-abuse mechanisms do you have in play?
As soon as the API is figured out, it'll be used for mass spam signups. I've
done one of these before, and pretty much if you allow any form of being able
to retrieve a code or URL or number from the body/subject, it'll be used for
millions of spam signups.
~~~
thanksforfish
> create a mailbox via HTTP GET request
I'd suggest a POST here. Theres some extra web browser checks against sending
cross origin POSTs that GETs don't have. The GET makes abuse easier.
~~~
zedr
GET can also be cached by intermediate proxies. This can cause failures that
are very hard to troubleshoot. POST cannot be cached and therefore is more
suited to this type of action.
------
umaar
Nice work. I investigated a few similar services, mailtrap, mailgun,
mailosaur. I wanted to try having my end-to-end tests assert that the email
which got sent out actually included the correct info. (As in, you request a
password reset to [email protected], and then you make API calls to assert
the email exists and includes the correct text)
It works well for peace of mind as it gave me a high degree of confidence that
I'm testing almost exactly what the end-user would experience. However, it
does add 5-10 seconds of delay to your tests while polling the email inbox, it
can be a little expensive depending on your test frequency, I think there are
even some cases where you can hurt your email deliverability stats during
automated email sending.
In the end, I decided to keep this test manual which I run every now and then
only after making big changes. Instead integration tests which mock the email
service are probably enough for my use case.
Curious how do others test the end-to-end behaviour of their web application,
when it comes to emailing?
~~~
chris_st
I'm doing an application backed by AWS's Amplify, and so I _have_ to have a
service that gets the email with the confirmation code.
I'm using Guerrilla Mail[0] for that, and it works, but it's slow to receive
the email and make it available.
I'm using gauge[1] with taiko[2] to write the tests, and liking it a lot, even
though I never liked cucumber. taiko is just very reliable, and the test
support code is much nicer to write.
[0] [https://www.guerrillamail.com](https://www.guerrillamail.com) [1]
[https://gauge.org](https://gauge.org) [2]
[https://taiko.dev](https://taiko.dev)
------
stephenr
Having more open source software is always good, so congrats on putting
something out there.
I'm very curious why this takes the approach it appears to take: running two
docker containers with opensmtpd in one of them, and then scanning the maildir
for message content; compared to what the numerous existing solutions
(mailcatcher, mailtrap, mailhog, maildump) all do: run an in-process SMTP
server.
~~~
rooam-dev
My guess is that it's a simpler approach. Maildir stores messages in files, so
persistence out of the box.
Meanwhile [https://thehackernews.com/2020/01/openbsd-opensmtpd-
hacking....](https://thehackernews.com/2020/01/openbsd-opensmtpd-hacking.html)
------
tzs
I use a simple local catch-all SMTP server for testing. I install it on my
test machine listening on some non-SMTP port (default is 2000), and then use
iptables to make all connection attempts to port 25 end up at the catch-all
server.
Here's the iptable command: "iptables -t nat -A OUTPUT -p tcp --dport 25 -j
REDIRECT --to-port 2000"
The catch-all server is ridiculously simple. It just responds with a "220
hello" when connected to, and then just reads input line by line, logging all
input to a file. It only knows about two SMTP commands: DATA and QUIT.
On QUIT it sends "221 bye" and closes the connection.
On DATA it sends "354 send the message" and then just reads the data and logs
it to the file.
Anything else? It just sends "250 OK".
Note that this is pretty useless if what you are trying to test is a mail
client, because you cannot test error cases. The purpose of this SMTP catch-
all is for testing the content of messages your software sends, not for
testing the process of mailing itself.
Each connection is logged to a separate file.
The source is a single Java file. Here it is if anyone wants it [1]. "javac
SmtpSink.java" to compile. "java SmtpSink" to run. Messages are stored in the
"msgs" directory, which you should make before running it.
[1] [https://pastebin.com/WqkS7jNH](https://pastebin.com/WqkS7jNH)
------
DeathArrow
I'd like to see an analogous service for SMS: I. e. provide a new phone
number.
~~~
borski
Why not use Twilio for this?
------
dbfa
Shameless plug: I've made a similar service with both an API and a web
interface at: [https://mailspons.com/](https://mailspons.com/)
------
jlgaddis
If, by chance,the author happens to see the comments here... you may consider
choosing an alternate (high-numbered / "unprivileged") port -- say, 2525? --
and redirecting connections to that port to 25/TCP on the same host.
This can be easily accomplished with a single iptables / nftables / pf / etc.
rule.
(A non-insignificant number of ISPs, CSPs, etc., block outbound connections to
25/TCP by default -- except, in some cases, those going to to their own mail
servers or "smarthosts".)
~~~
bscphil
If they're blocking SMTP, doesn't it make sense to block the encrypted ports
too, e.g. 587? But if they're blocking 587, then how do people with these ISPs
use their own email clients like Outlook (or whatever it's called these days)
with third party email providers, e.g. Gmail?
~~~
jlgaddis
25/TCP is, technically, for MTA <-> MTA traffic, so many (residential, in
particular) ISPs block it because "you shouldn't be running servers".
587/TCP is the "submission" port and is exactly what people _should_ be using
instead of 25/TCP (it usually -- but not always -- requires authentication and
is pretty much never blocked). Indeed, that's the intended purpose!
------
vince14
There's also [https://ethereal.email/](https://ethereal.email/) which has a
Web GUI.
------
PersonalOps
See also Mailslurper [0] and Mailcatcher [1] if you'd like to self-host an
email catch-all service.
Mailslurper appears to be abandoned and seems to be missing deterministic
builds that go module support provides.
Mailcatcher has been around for a while, with my first discovering it being
used in a legacy project's test suite back in 2014.
Both could use some better SEO since it's nearly impossible to find unless you
know exactly the right keywords to use.
[0]: [http://mailslurper.com/](http://mailslurper.com/) [1]:
[https://mailcatcher.me/](https://mailcatcher.me/)
------
rosstex
>The mailbox_id from the above setup should be included somewhere in the text
of the email, the subject, the bcc address, the headers, or any other field
(even email address of the sender or recipient will do).
Sorry... how does it know what mailbox id to look for?
~~~
phnofive
The mailbox_id can be anywhere in any field you send, apparently.
~~~
rosstex
No no, but... nowhere in the PUT request is there a mailbox ID. In fact the
PUT doesn't contain any token from the mailbox creation. So how does it link
your email without searching for every mailbox ID that currently exists within
your email? I mean, maybe that's how it works, since they expire in a fairly
short amount of time... seems ripe for DDoSing.
~~~
lilyball
The ids follow a set format, so it probably scans the email for all strings of
that format, then looks them up against a dictionary of existing mailbox ids
~~~
lilyball
I may be wrong. I’m not the strongest with Haskell, but skimming the code, it
appears to just dump all incoming email into the same dir and when you receive
on a mailbox it scans the directory for any files containing the mailbox id.
I’m not sure what code goes through and cleans up old emails though.
Edit: it used a cron job that runs every minute and used `find` to delete any
file that’s 5 minutes old. This both cleans up emails and deleted mailbox ids.
This is a rather simple way to do this but you could just dump a massive
amount of email on the service and it’ll run really slowly for the next 5
minutes.
------
kccqzy
Mailinator is a much more well-known service. It has both a web interface and
an API.
~~~
fredoliveira
For perspective (and I'm not affiliated with this new service, or really,
anyone in this space): at some point, Altavista was more well-known that
Google.
------
jeffrallen
If your testing system depends on a remote server, it's not testing just your
code anymore. Tests must be as isolated from other changes as possible or else
they do not tell you anything.
------
franky47
Mailtrap, which is listed as an alternative Ruby library, is also available as
a service: [https://mailtrap.io/](https://mailtrap.io/)
------
7ewis
Could the JSON return info like SPF/DKIM too passes too?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Greggs: Victim of Google Rich Results Spam - adzeds
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Greggs&oq=Greggs&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.368j0j7&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=0&ie=UTF-8
======
adzeds
Check out the logo that gets pulled into the company profile!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Delivering a consistent Twitter experience - decklin
https://dev.twitter.com/blog/delivering-consistent-twitter-experience
======
bonaldi
The coming tighter rules on client apps are worrying. The "things that make
twitter twitter" are not geegaws. It's time for someone to blow the dust off
identi.ca
~~~
iand
Yes, this worries me: "in the coming weeks, we will be introducing stricter
guidelines around how the Twitter API is used".
It's the start of them inserting points of control in their system to allow
them to deliver inline advertising that clients apps can't strip out.
------
bryanjclark
A big part of what makes Twitter wonderful is that it's home to the "cool
kids" right now. If Twitter starts restricting third-party clients like
Tweetbot, or making ads harder to avoid, it may generate more money for
Twitter, but it'll scare away some of the great conversation.
I don't know if it's feasible, but I wish that services like Twitter would let
me pay a subscription to not see ads, promoted tweets, and other services that
"enhance" my "brand experience".
------
urbanjunkie
From Sippey's post:
_You need to be able to see expanded Tweets and other features that make
Twitter more engaging and easier to use. These are the features that bring
people closer to the things they care about. These are the features that make
Twitter Twitter. We're looking forward to working with you to make Twitter
even better._
We really don't need to be able to see these features - it's you who needs us
to see them. These are not features that bring us closer to things we care
about, these are features that enable you to sell us to brands.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Running Kubernetes on a Jet (Simulator for Now) - InTheArena
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjZ4AZ7hRM0
======
InTheArena
Pretty interesting look at what the United States DoD is doing on Kubernetes.
I've gone through Fedramp and authority to operate before - and I'm not used
to the government being in the same decade (technology wise) as industry.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Whiteboard Interview Advice I Ever Received - pplonski86
https://hackernoon.com/the-best-whiteboard-interview-advice-i-ever-received-3ebbfa72e4a
======
bradknowles
The actual title is “The Best Whiteboard Interview Advice I Ever Received”.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Chrome Extension for automatic incognito sessions = more safety & privacy - ladino
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/incognito-filter/cifilbmpnkjinlkchohdfcpdkmpngiik
I build "Incognito Filter" to:
use Chrome in a sandboxed private window for onlinebanking or sites with privacy concerns:
- Google and Facebook log your search history with Like or +1 buttons - prevent it by using your login only in private modus.
- Other extensions can log or manipulate your site while using online-banking - the private modus doesn't load extensions by default
======
ladino
I build Inkognito Filter to: use Chrome in a sandboxed private window for
onlinebanking or sites with privacy concerns: \- Google and Facebook log your
search history with Like or +1 buttons - prevent it by using your login only
in private modus. \- Other extensions can log or manipulate your site while
using online-banking - the private modus doesn't load extensions by default
------
dbg31415
Because it was so hard to add –incognito to the shortcut?
[http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/how-to-start-google-chrome-
in-i...](http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/how-to-start-google-chrome-in-incognito-
mode-by-default/)
~~~
wmf
Always running in incognito mode != loading specific sites in incognito mode.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask PG: Do you ever fund startups outside of normal Y Comb. funding cycles? - jlgosse
Hey Paul,<p>In the case that someone were to run a startup in the months leading up to Christmas, has there ever been a situation where Y Combinator has provided funding to a startup outside of the "normal" funding cycles?<p>I ask this for two simple reasons:<p>1. A friend and I are going to be working on our own startup coming this fall, in this case potential funding MAY be needed before the Winter Y Combinator session starts.<p>2. Neither of us can really relocate to California at this time. It has potential in the future, but not for this coming winter.<p>If PG doesn't have any insight into something like this, does anyone else have information pertaining to something like this?<p>Thanks a lot.<p>EDIT: Since everyone seems to think that we are looking for funding right now, I will clear things up by saying that no, we are not looking for any funding at this point in time.
======
pg
A couple times, but in those cases we already knew the people.
------
agotterer
YC isnt the only investors around. I obviously can't speak for PG, but from my
understanding of YC the program is run twice a year on the same schedule. I
have never heard of a YC company starting earlier, especially since they
haven't had the chance to review all the applications and potential
candidates.
PG may make personal investments outside of YC, but then you lose access to
the program. There are many other routes you can go for fund raising...
Angels, normal VCs, bootstrap consulting or one of the other programs similar
to YC. Those programs may fit your schedule and geographic location better.
~~~
jlgosse
I know about the paths available, and all of them are all very viable options
for us in the future. I was mostly just wondering if it ever happens outside
of the normal funding rounds.
We will probably be looking for some sort of funding in the future, and it
will probably be through angels or VCs. At this point however, we haven't even
really started on much outside of brainstorming and early design, so we won't
be worrying about anything like funding yet.
------
kaiserama
I assume you know this already, but you can apply for a session even if you've
already started a project. If you're nervous about starting a project because
of needing money you should either do what agotterer suggested in fund
raising, or just start your project on the side and keep day jobs until you
can apply.
I can't speak for PG either but I would assume the chances that he'd fund you
outside of a session aren't going to be any higher than during the lead up to
a session, if anything the chances may go down.
Anyway, good luck!
------
Keyframe
I'm interested in one other thing - does anyone know if any VC (YC or not)
'fund' startups that don't need money at all - but only connections and advice
in exchange for a percentage?
~~~
pg
Yes, this is common. Many of the people we fund don't need the money. And e.g.
the founders of Friendfeed and Twitter didn't need the money either.
~~~
netsp
Is it normal (not necessarily within YC, I'm speaking generally) for them to
either accept money regardless in order to get the associated benefits (even
if these include help raising larger sums later) or come to some non cash
exchange?
------
iamelgringo
I've been following PG and YC for years, and I've never heard of a single
instance of them taking equity in a company that they didn't fund. I've also
never heard of them doing a funding round (or what you're describing) outside
of YC. I've also never heard of them getting involved with a startup that
wasn't close to Boston, or now, Silicon Valley.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Show HN: CoinTracker (YC W18) on iOS and Android - chanfest22
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/cointracker-crypto-portfolio/id1401499763
======
chanfest22
Hi — we’re Chandan and Jon, co-founders of CoinTracker
([https://cointracker.io](https://cointracker.io)). CoinTracker is a
cryptocurrency portfolio manager that automatically pulls balances and
transactions from top exchanges and wallets, and delivers tax information to
users.
About five months ago we launched CoinTracker web on Hacker News
([https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16386419](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16386419)).
We really appreciated all the kind words and have been hard at work trying to
improve with the features you requested. The top request was to bring
CoinTracker to iOS & Android, so we’re excited to announce our mobile apps are
now live:
Android:
[https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=io.cointracker...](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=io.cointracker.android)
iOS: [https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/cointracker-crypto-
portfolio...](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/cointracker-crypto-
portfolio/id1401499763)
We would love to get your feedback on the apps and on how we could further
improve CoinTracker for you.
------
whb07
There’s no actual price charts, is there? Just the current price? What markets
are you using to source the information from?
~~~
chanfest22
We are working on adding price charts; thanks for the feedback!
The data is sourced from a number of sources including multiple exchanges that
we integrate with.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
IBM’s $3B Research Project Has Kept Computing Moving Forward - MindGods
https://spectrum.ieee.org/nanoclast/semiconductors/nanotechnology/ibms-3billion-research-project-has-kept-computing-moving-forward
======
tgflynn
This article is interesting but it's causing me quite a bit of cognitive
dissonance.
If IBM spent $3 billion dollars developing 7nm and less technology how is it
that it got rid of it's own chip fab business and is now dependent on a
company, GlobalFoundries, which apparently abandoned EUV, to actually produce
its chips ?
What is IBM's game plan here ? How are they going to role out Power10, which
is supposed to be 7nm based, when the fab partner they've tied themselves to
isn't even doing EUV ?
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
PicPlz Python Backup Script - rchaudhary
http://www.danielandrade.net/2012/06/04/picplz-python-backup-script/
======
dansku
This can be quite handy! Thanks for sharing! :)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Transitioning from Video to Physical Game Development: An Education (2014) - wallflower
http://ryancreighton.com/transitioning-from-video-to-physical-game-development-an-education/
======
jacobush
Is it a board game?
~~~
arkem
It's an escape room:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escape_room](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Escape_room)
~~~
thanatropism
I live in a dense urban area and there's a escape room place on my very
street, a two-minute walk. But we're a couple with no kids and very few
friends, so I don't know if we'd be able to experience the fun in that by
ourselves.
~~~
mattnewton
Try it! I’ve done a few with my SO and we’ve had a great time. Most around
here aren’t going to be very young kid friendly anyways- they require a lot of
complex reasoning and spending time in a small space.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
www.apple.com now crashes Safari - paulvs
On an iOS 7.1.2, go to www.apple.com, see the event clock, wait a minute and a new page to load automatically, and Safari crashes.
======
fredbrown
The redirect to:
[http://www.apple.com.edgesuite.net/live/](http://www.apple.com.edgesuite.net/live/)
is lame. It looks amateur.
------
hardened_ones
Things happen at Apple's Event. ;)
------
anigbrowl
':-.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Defold game engine source now available and free to use for commercial games - vlaaad
https://defold.com/opensource/
======
minxomat
This is quite good news, to say the least. This is one of the most well-
integrated, sensible engines and development environments I've ever used.
Can't wait to patch more native moonscript support into a fork :evil:
If you want to see an overview of a somewhat typical and polished mobile game
done with Defold, here's a non-King dev showing off his work:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sK4pJ8A3YS4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sK4pJ8A3YS4)
Also, in relevant news, Corona (the other major Lua game engine[1]) is also
being open-sourced, and renamed to Solar2D:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22326462](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22326462)
[1] with dev ecosystem of extensions, build services etc - without that Love2D
might also qualify
~~~
skocznymroczny
Is the name change related with coronavirus in any way? As in it's considered
a negative brand right now?
~~~
barbecue_sauce
Corona and Isis are two common branding gotos that will now be forever out-of-
favor.
Also, you probably can't name anything COVID, but I think that's a less likely
scenario.
~~~
airstrike
I do wonder what will happen to the beer...
~~~
qz_
It's already been renamed to Coronita here in the Netherlands
~~~
freehunter
Are you sure that’s the reason why? I can buy both Corona and Coronita, the
difference is the size of the bottle. -ita in Spanish means “little” so
Coronita bottles are 210ml while a bottle of Corona is 330ml.
~~~
ciceryadam
all while in colder beer drinking climates, the small beers are 330ml, and
regular ones are 500ml :)
------
britzl
We are humbled by the mostly positive reactions to the news we shared earlier
today but also sorry for misrepresenting the license under which we make the
source code available. Defold is a free and open game engine with a permissive
license. The source code is available on GitHub and we invite the community to
contribute.
We have updated the website to reflect this and we no longer use the term
"Open Source" as to not confuse it with the OSD.
The Defold license, complete with a summary of what you can and cannot do, can
be seen on our license page:
[https://defold.com/license/](https://defold.com/license/)
We have also Tweeted this:
[https://twitter.com/defold/status/1262744466311360517](https://twitter.com/defold/status/1262744466311360517)
~~~
ddevault
Hey britzl, I appreciate the attempt to compromise on the terminology here.
But, this falls flat pretty badly. "Free and open" is still trying to
capitalize on the "free and open source" brand, and is going to mislead people
into thinking it uses a FOSS license - seemingly deliberately. Can't you just
call it "source available", which is the term we use for this kind of
licensing model?
It's really not okay to be capitalizing on the FOSS brand without being FOSS.
It's a kick in the groin to the FOSS community when companies do this.
~~~
fluffything
You seem to be confusing whether something is "open source" with "what kind of
license does the code have".
Something being "open source" does not imply anything about its license.
Suggesting that only GPL-like software is allowed to use the term "open
source" is crazy. It doesn't reflect the world we live in at all: there are
thousands of projects on github without a license, or with some "free for non-
military use"-type of license, or MIT/BSD-like licenses...
EDIT: "the obvious meaning for the expression “open source software”—and the
one most people seem to think it means—is “You can look at the source code.”
(Richard Stallman, GNU Philosophy: [https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-
source-misses-the-point....](https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-source-
misses-the-point.html) ). Not that Stallman did much better with "free
software", which as the article argues, has the obvious meaning that 'the
software is "for free"'.
Having to avoid expressions like "free software" or "open source" because two
organizations decided to appropriate common english expressions to give them a
complicated meaning is nuts.
~~~
mindcrime
_This project does not have a GPLv3 license,_
And? There are a lot of Open Source licenses, and even Free Sofware licenses
besides GPLv3.
_but neither does LLVM (and many people do not consider LLVM to be free
software_
Note that "Free Software" and "Open Source" are different - albeit related -
things.
_nor the dozens projects on Github that don 't have a license at all, or that
have a license of the form "Free for non-commercial purposes" or the millions
of flavors of that ("Free for non-military use", etc.)._
And those things are not Open Source. They may be "Source Available", or
"Shared Source" or "Something Else", but "Open Source" has a de facto
definition of "uses a license which is OSD compliant."
~~~
sszz
That there is any significant confusion at all means it is not de facto (and
if something is right and true based on a definition I don’t think you can
call it de facto either...).
The distinction really doesn’t seem that important for most use cases so it’s
not that surprising a weaker, possibly more useful interpretation has become
common...
~~~
mindcrime
_That there is any significant confusion at all means it is not de facto_
There isn't any significant confusion. There is a token amount of confusion,
which is pretty much always clarified every time one of these threads comes
up.
_(and if something is right and true based on a definition I don’t think you
can call it de facto either...)._
It's de facto, not de jure, because OSI has no authority to enforce their
definition, since they don't have a trademark (at least not a registered
trademark) on the term "Open Source". What makes it the de facto definition is
just usage. By and large, among the people who care about the legal details of
Open Source licensing, the OSD is accepted. Yes, there are a handful of
exceptions, but that's OK. It doesn't change the basic point.
~~~
sszz
I guess in my experience, the phrase is routinely used to refer to code
availability and often the fact that a licensing fee doesn’t need to be
negotiated or paid in order to run the code on our servers (either in an
academic or corporate setting), which is a weaker requirement than the OSI
definition.
Real usage by real people not particularly passionate about adherence to the
OSI definition—to me this is its de facto meaning. I’m not saying it’s correct
usage, but it’s definitely real and frequent.
It’s my impression a non-negligible number of people share the same
understanding, evidence by the fact that this discussion apparently is
recurring? Even those who corrected the Defold release language knew what was
intended, even if they said it was incorrect usage of the phrase.
Your response assumed the number of people who use the phrase with a looser
meaning is small; I just don’t think that is true based on my day to day
experiences.
~~~
mindcrime
_Real usage by real people not particularly passionate about adherence to the
OSI definition—to me this is its de facto meaning._
I'm not talking about "people who are particularly passionate about adherence
to the OSI definition" though. I'm talking about people who are "particularly
interested in the actual technicalities of what OSS is", not all of whom may
agree with the OSD. But I still argue that such a significant majority _do_
that it constitutes the de facto definition.
_Your response assumed the number of people who use the phrase with a looser
meaning is small;_
Not at all. I am saying that the people using that phrase in the "looser"
sense, as you put it, are using it in a colloquial and not technical sense,
and that such usage has no meaning as far as what the de facto meaning is,
when used in an actual technical context. That's just lack of knowledge, not
any attempt to create a different definition.
I see it more like somebody who doesn't know much about cars referring to an
engine block as a carburetor. Even if a lot of people make that same mistake,
it's still a mistake and the actual definitions of "engine block" and
"carburetor" don't change.
------
fenwick67
King's unsavory handling of trademark disputes (trademarking "Candy" and
"Saga" and voraciously enforcing it against games like The Banner Saga and
CandySwipe [which came out before Candy Crush]) is gonna steer me clear of
this one.
~~~
AGulev
Defold is not King anymore. A quote from the official web site: "game engine,
has been transferred to the Defold Foundation"
~~~
fenwick67
4 of the 5 listed board members work for King today, and King (as a company)
has a seat on the board.
~~~
britzl
Not sure how you are counting. Romain and Sara work for King. Elin is a
consultant. Björn (me) and Mathias have left King to work on behalf of the
foundation.
This makes me realise that I need to update my LinkedIn profile if anyone
bothers to check it!
~~~
fenwick67
I was just looking at
[https://defold.com/foundation/](https://defold.com/foundation/) , it says
Mathias "has spent the last 4 years at King" and that you became a product
owner at King in 2018, I assumed you both still worked there since it doesn't
say you ever left.
------
bjconlan
Wow, this will hopefully ignite a sleuth of creativity. I think their choice
of using lua to script while also having a pretty great user experience (in v2
and v1) should put them on the radar for most indie developers now. Hopefully
this also creates some friendly competition with godot (though I think they
have the momentum) but for 2d prototyping for programming novices, I'll always
recommend defold. Kudos King.
------
britzl
The release of the Defold source code and the transition to the Defold
Foundation was the culmination of many months of preparations. While most
things went smoothly (except an SVG which crashed the Firefox browser!) we
never anticipated the amount of feedback we received on our use of the term
Open Source. We have summarised our thoughts and the actions we have taken
here:
[https://defold.com/2020/05/20/Some-thoughts-on-the-open-
sour...](https://defold.com/2020/05/20/Some-thoughts-on-the-open-source-
discussion/)
------
taneq
For anyone who's used this, how does it compare with popular open source
engines like Godot, and with the commercial industry standards like Unreal
Engine and Unity?
~~~
MaxBarraclough
Neither Defold, nor Unreal Engine, nor Unity, is Open Source.
As discussed elsewhere in this thread, source-available is not the same thing
as Open Source.
_edit_ Not sure why I'm being downvoted here. This really isn't up for
debate. See
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23233336](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23233336)
,
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23235217](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23235217)
~~~
tgb
FYI, you were presumably downvoted since the post you replied to had not
claimed that Defold, Unreal, or Unity were Open Source. It claimed that Godot
was open source, which is true.
~~~
MaxBarraclough
Thanks, I'd misread it :-P
------
ipsum2
I wonder why they open sourced it. Won't this create more mobile games,
creating competition for them?
~~~
britzl
The question if Defold will be open sourced is one of the most common
questions asked since Defold was launched in 2016.
By open sourcing Defold and handing it to the Defold Foundation we build trust
with the community. It guarantees that Defold will be around regardless of
what happens with King. And by handing over Defold to the Defold Foundation we
believe it gives a lot of credibility to Defold as a strong and independent
open source game engine.
~~~
dwheeler
This fraud is successfully building animus in the community. It is,by
definition, not open source. An open source license MUST allow any use,
including commercial use.
~~~
britzl
Thank you for the feedback. It was never our intention to step on any toes or
misrepresent Defold. Please see this statement:
[https://twitter.com/defold/status/1262744466311360517](https://twitter.com/defold/status/1262744466311360517)
~~~
dwheeler
I'm glad that for the twitter statement. The website is still misleading,
though; I hope that will be corrected soon. I wish you the best!
~~~
britzl
It has been corrected now. [https://defold.com/2020/05/20/Some-thoughts-on-
the-open-sour...](https://defold.com/2020/05/20/Some-thoughts-on-the-open-
source-discussion/)
------
SiempreViernes
A bit surprised there is only one King game in the list of showcases
considering how prominently they are listed as the previous owner.
~~~
n3k5
I'd guess this is because from the perspective of evaluating an engine, when
you've seen one King game, you've seen them all.
~~~
capableweb
Probably also to show that there are more companies than just King using it,
so you'll get less scared of King "owning" the development of the engine and
it's community.
------
sk0v
Why would you use this over say, Unity or Unreal? Seems more niche, less
popular (so less assets/community libraries etc.) and less integrated
into...everything?
~~~
Ponk
Defold is optimized to produce small binaries, and features you don't use can
be turned to to further decrease your bundle size.
It also focuses a lot on providing fast iteration times. You can hot-reload
changed assets onto a device while the game is running. For most asset types,
you'll see the change on device in less than a second. Similarly, a Build and
Run cycle from scratch for a moderately complex game project such as Blossom
Blast typically takes around a minute or so, and subsequent cached builds can
start in a couple of seconds.
(Edit: Full disclosure, I worked on the Defold editor.)
------
greybox
You can accomplish quite a bit with this game engine, check out this narrative
that I started making with Defold a few months ago (playable in browser)
[https://lilrooness.itch.io/control](https://lilrooness.itch.io/control)
~~~
Sevaris
This is pretty cool. Are you still working on it?
~~~
greybox
Yes :) I'm working on the second part of that level, and the next level at the
moment.
------
gfiorav
I'm a newbie to game dev so let me ask this here:
What's the advantage of this vs Godot?
~~~
vanderZwan
_[The editor]_ is written in Clojure, which some people will probably like.
Here's a video from a few years ago explaining how that makes the whole editor
extensible with live-code:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajX09xQ_UEg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajX09xQ_UEg)
(I don't know if this is an advantage/disadvantage compared to Godot or how
that extensibility compares)
_edit: clarification, see Ponk 's comment below_
~~~
Ponk
To clarify, the Defold Editor is written in Clojure, whereas the runtime
component is written in a carefully selected subset of C++ in order to keep
executable sizes small and compile times fast.
You can write game-specific extensions to the runtime in C++ if your game
requires it, but most games are authored in just Lua.
Edit: Typo.
------
ipsum2
Some older discussion:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11352546](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11352546)
(2016)
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4791284](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4791284)
(2012)
------
bjarneh
I like the second line-comment in the startup file
(com.defold.editor.Start.java); makes it seem familiar with all my projects.
// A terrible hack as an attempt to avoid a deadlock when loading native libraries.
------
pojntfx
Not open source. Common clause.
~~~
britzl
It was never our intention to step on any toes or misrepresent Defold. Defold
is a free and open game engine with a permissive license and we invite the
community to contribute on GitHub. Please see this statement:
[https://twitter.com/defold/status/1262744466311360517](https://twitter.com/defold/status/1262744466311360517)
------
billfruit
It is a polished product, and it is a good move. I did try to use it briefly
in a small sample, it was reasonably easy to use as well. However I didn't
like Lua, would have preferred something more flexible/expressive like JS.
Lua has something of the schoolhouse feel about it, too prim and rigid like
Pascal.
So I am presently thinking of moving on to Phaser.io.
~~~
frabert
Weird, I would consider lua to be _more_ expressive than JS, thanks to its
optional syntax for function calls and the metatables which allow stuff like
operator overloading.
------
terrycody
Sadly, this article has no Defold listed, but why?
[https://gist.github.com/raysan5/909dc6cf33ed40223eb0dfe625c0...](https://gist.github.com/raysan5/909dc6cf33ed40223eb0dfe625c0de74)
------
markdog12
Are there any language bindings for the engine, so I don't have to use Lua?
------
Kiro
Hasn't it always been free to use for commercial games?
~~~
AGulev
Yes, it has, but now the source code of the engine itself is available for
everybody to fork, modify, make contributions, and so on.
------
davidjgraph
This is not open source. There is a well established definition of open source
[0].
It includes "No Discrimination Against Fields of Endeavor"
"You can not commercialise original or modified (derivative) versions of the
Defold editor and/or engine" does not meet (6).
I'm not even going to start on the use of the term "free".
[0] [https://opensource.org/osd](https://opensource.org/osd)
~~~
Intermernet
I'm so tired of companies trying to co-opt the definition of open source.
My (probably flawed) comparison is to the term "fair use". Yes, you can play
all sorts of games to make those 2 words mean almost anything you want, but at
the end of the day that term is defined by law, not by pedantry.
"open source" has an accepted definition, and it's damaging to society to try
to undermine it.
If you think I'm exaggerating, please remember that you can probably thank
open-source software for the growth of the Internet, the availability of
previously restricted secure encryption and thousands of tools that you
probably use to earn a living.
~~~
koonsolo
For my own engine I was looking at my options for the future.
If I would ever release it with restrictions, I would call it "source
available" or something like that.
I think as a community, we should also have a strict term for a project with
source code, but too restrictive to be called open source.
From my search, "Source Available" was the best terminology, unless someone
knows a better one.
~~~
AGulev
But it's not just "Source Available". You can modify source code, fork it and
use your own version of the engine, and so on. The only restriction that you
can't SELL the engine itself. What is the right name for that if not "Open
source"?
~~~
Intermernet
"permissive", "really awesome", "generous", many other things.
Not "open source". That term has a meaning, and it's very important that
meaning doesn't get diluted.
------
cocktailpeanuts
geez, what's up with all these armchair open source experts on HN? Looks like
too many people on this thread thinks this is evil.
A company gave away their app making tool for free, and these people are
sitting in front of their keyboard talking shit about how "this is subverting
the definition of 'open source'", seriously?
Also what's so evil about the clause:
> "You can not commercialise original or modified (derivative) versions of the
> Defold editor and/or engine" does not meet (6).
What's so wrong about businesses trying to give back to the community while
protecting themselves against the likes of Microsoft and Amazon who will
naturally take the code and monetize if there's no clause that restricts anti
competition?
Lastly, who the hell cares what some website called opensource.org says what
open source is? This is all subjective, and from my point of view, if the
source code is open, it is "open" source. There are many reasons people open
source their projects, for transparency, for giving assurance to the
ecosystem, etc. By trying to box the definition down to a single very narrow
minded idea, you're actually hurting the growth of open source instead of
helping.
~~~
dwheeler
I'm not just an armchair expert. I am a literal expert. Involved in it for
decades. Wrote published papers. It's part of my job title.
Excluding commercial use is not helping the growth of OSS, it is falsely
claiming to be OSS.
If you want to say that it is being released as "source available" no one
would complain. It is the falsehoods that bring out the complaints.
~~~
hartator
> Excluding commercial use is not helping the growth of OSS, it is falsely
> claiming to be OSS.
Is anything less than BSD or MIT license not open source then? I am all for
it, but you are publishing some of your work under GNU which mean I can't use
in one of my projects without publishing the source code under GNU. Why these
restrictions are acceptable but not non-commercialisation?
~~~
dwheeler
GPL is well-known to be an open source software license. Many commercial
organizations depend on it.
~~~
hartator
> If you use components that are licensed under GPLv3, then you are required
> to license the complete application the contains the GPL components under
> the GPL as well.
It seems to be more restrictive to me than the OP's license.
------
the_mitsuhiko
Open Source with an asterisk:
> a) You do not sell or otherwise commercialise the Work or Derivative Works
> as a Game Engine Product; and
~~~
trzeci
I think it does mean that I can't fork Deflod, rename it to Refold and sell as
mine.
Just a reflection as non-native English speaker. Game Engine Product is not
the same as 'Product of Game Engine'.
~~~
jstanley
That's right, and such a restriction makes it not fully open source.
~~~
britzl
I will not debate you on that one. According to the Open Source Definition
([https://opensource.org/osd](https://opensource.org/osd)) Defold is only 90%
open source. It's a lot better than the 0% it was yesterday.
~~~
SXX
Like seriously according to your comment history you're product owner of
Defold. So if you're care of success of Defold why do you need this false
advertisement?
If your company worried about someone making money off editor you can just
keep this part proprietary while releasing the engine under OSS-compatible
license. There is plenty of "open core" projects out there.
------
philipov
Please change the title to reflect that the engine is merely available
publicly, but not open source.
------
SXX
It's truly unfortunate how some companies try to sell their shared source
products as "open source". I guess HN should change the title.
UPD: Okay title has been changed and it's all good now.
~~~
m0llusk
There was plenty of objection to that point of view here on HN and yet you
think you own the discussion? Wow, now I'm an official HN rebel because I
think sharing means openness and zero cost means free. I hope your efforts to
make the world understand the free and open software development scene is
hostile, mean spirited, defensive, and always ready and anxious to play word
games works out for the best.
------
dwheeler
This needs retitle, e.g. "King claiming its Defold game engine open source
(but isn't)"
------
andrewmcwatters
If you're interested in game engines using Lua, please also consider
Planimeter's Grid Engine ([https://www.planimeter.org/grid-
sdk/](https://www.planimeter.org/grid-sdk/) and
[https://github.com/Planimeter/grid-sdk](https://github.com/Planimeter/grid-
sdk)) which has been in steady development for about a decade, having even
more features than Defold and Solar2D, such as out-of-the-box multiplayer with
client-server prediction, Tiled support, configuration bindings, and much more
that you'd have to roll yourself in both engines! (and it's MIT licensed to
boot.)
No other game engine in Lua is going to provide dedicated server support out
of the box besides Grid.
It's all also built on the latest version of LÖVE, which gives you access to
all of the software in that ecosystem, too. It's the only full fledged game
engine on LÖVE that we know of.
It's less known as we don't do much advertising and have had far fewer
contributors, but our focus has been consistent over the years.
Because we have fewer resources, we also work very closely with those using
the software if you have any questions.
While a collection of game engines using Lua seem to be tapering off in active
development, such as Polycode, Corona, and perhaps now Defold, Planimeter's
Grid engine is actively used by the group for game development projects, and
will continue to be supported into the future, bringing commercial support in
2021.
~~~
elisee
Can you point to some games (or game projects) using Grid Engine?
~~~
andrewmcwatters
No, I'm sorry, most of our users are hobbyists with projects that we're not
aware of the state of for the most part.
We hope to improve the engine to better serve the indie and hobbyist gamedev
community with tools that aren't available elsewhere and if we hear about any
projects one would like to showcase, we'd be happy to feature them!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Chrome app launcher for Windows, Mac, Linux being removed in July - JohnTHaller
http://blog.chromium.org/2016/03/retiring-chrome-app-launcher.html
======
ethanbond
Thank god. That was one of the most annoying ideas I've ever seen.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
New date rape drug test allows women to check if drinks are spiked - pmoriarty
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/date-rape-drug-test-women-check-spiked-drinks-undercover-colour-a8527791.html
======
JoeAltmaier
...or anybody I guess.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Fitbit, why can’t I have my data? - KC8ZKF
http://simplystatistics.org/2013/01/02/fitbit-why-cant-i-have-my-data/
======
heyitsnick
I'm a huge fan of the entire Fitbit product; the hardware is a joy to use, it
has great apps for desktop and Android, sync is a breeze, the web app works
very well; the whole process has been excellent.
However, having spent close to €300 with the company (for the scale + ultra,
and recently upgraded to the Fitbit One), i was very disappointed when I found
out about their data policy. Having to pay a premium 50/pa to get access to my
own data (it's one of the big 'upsells' of premium) leaves a very bad taste in
the mouth.,And now learning that even this doesn't give you access to your raw
data is even worse.
I hope Fitbit changes their approach; if anything I think they have it
backwards: give me my data for free when I purchase your hardware for life,
and upsell me the web app (i'd be happy to pay for it; maybe include the first
year free with your hardware purchase); rather this than than give you a
pretty complete web app for life for free to record everything i want, but and
then charge me to read back my own data!
~~~
tommoor
Agreed, also a fitbit owner and this seems like a no-brainer - they should
open up this data and allow for more to be built on the platform ala
runkeeper.
------
qdot76367
I run <http://openyou.org>, a site dedicated to reversing as many medical
devices as we (or, well, at the moment, mostly I) can get our (my) hands on.
So far, we've put out Emokit (emotiv epoc headset), libfitbit, libomron, and
have started libfuelband and libsensewear. The main problem is just time and
lack of people resources. We need more people aware that USB/Bluetooth
reversing, while somewhat complex, is not all that inherently difficult. 2 or
3 people working together can easily open up a device and protocol format with
a minimal amount of [insert language that supports libusb or hidapi] code.
However, not many people are interested in learning that, as they just wanna
get the data and run. Understandable, but that means you're waiting on one or
two people to finish something that they may lose interest in.
I've been contemplating trying to teach a usb/bt reversing workshop for years
now, I should really get around to trying that soon.
~~~
vitovito
There's not a lot of help out there for people who are willing to put the time
and effort into protocol reversing but don't know where to start!
EA put out a fitness video game with a wireless heart rate monitor that showed
up as a normal HID device via its USB dongle. On sale it was like $40, making
it a very inexpensive way to log heart rate wirelessly. But no-one had
reversed the protocol, and I couldn't find any online resources to teach me
how to do it myself.
I'm pretty sure I threw it out, and the product is discontinued now, but I
would encourage you to at least put training materials together, if not a full
workshop.
~~~
qdot76367
Yeah, I will admit that information does end up being the main problem. I've
been doing this long enough that it's pretty much second nature these days,
and I just find myself going "but what is there to teach?".
I've taught workshops on other subjects before, and usually once I get going
to writing cirriculum that question answers itself in spades, though. Just
need the motivation.
I'm finishing up another personal project right now, then I may start on this.
I suppose I don't really have much room to complain when I've already set out
a solution that just needs to be done. :)
~~~
vitovito
I ran fifteen design workshops in 2010, so feel free to ping me off HN if you
have questions or need support. The HID protocol used by the USB version of
the Neurosky Mindwave EEG headset is also undocumented AFAIK, and I could test
drive your training using that.
You might also consider trying out Zed Shaw's "Learn X the Hard Way" format as
a framework, which he recently formally published:
[https://gitorious.org/learn-x-the-hard-way/learn-x-the-
hard-...](https://gitorious.org/learn-x-the-hard-way/learn-x-the-hard-
way/blobs/master/README)
~~~
qdot76367
Huh. I used to maintain bindings for the old bluetooth neurosky mindset for
PureData/MaxMSP, never thought about the issues with their new headset with
proprietary radio not having drivers. They were usually pretty good about open
sourcing stuff too.
Last workshop I taught was
[http://artandcode.com/3d/workshops/2b-teledildonics-with-
the...](http://artandcode.com/3d/workshops/2b-teledildonics-with-the-kinect-
and-arduino), which I had to compress into 3 hours so it was more an overview
sort of thing. I think this workshop will require a nice device to start
reversing from scratch, which is something else I'm going to have to figure
out. Fitbit would suck since you'd have to learn USB, then ANT. Would like to
get one HID device, one non-HID, just to cover most of the bases.
------
MichaelApproved
" _I guess it is true, if you aren’t paying for it, you are the product._ "
But according to the author, even the $50 option doesn't let you download the
data so it has nothing to do with you being the _product_.
~~~
vertis
More than that, you have to pay for the device in the first place, so on that
front you're absolutely the customer.
~~~
jrockway
Indeed. Everyone likes to think missing features are some scam that the
company that owns the project is perpetrating upon their users, but in reality
they probably want to lock you in for the sake of locking you in. They don't
know why, but making the data open would be extra work, would help their
competitors, and might hurt their chances of being bought. They can always be
more open later, but they can't ever un-open. So they're closed.
Don't buy their products. That's what I did.
~~~
angdis
I agree, there are other reasons for not providing the raw data. For the vast
majority of people raw-data just isn't something that is even remotely usable.
Even if one is an expert with data analysis, IMHO, it will require a lot of
work to process and interpret it correctly. It may even require a deep
knowledge about the device and all its quirks-- we're talking about data
derived from a cheap accelerometer here. In the end, it is hard to see how
opening up the raw data so a few hackers can take a crack at it is
advantageous to fitbit or even consumers in general.
------
jessedhillon
The Bodymedia FIT, in addition to being a superior device overall(1), has an
API which let's you access caloric burn and other data up to single minute
detail levels. If you Google around, there are some blog posts describing how
to dump data from it using standard USB serial port drivers.
API webpage: <https://developer.bodymedia.com/docs/read/Home>
1- The Bodymedia gives you steps taken as well as accurate sleep and caloric
burn readings.
~~~
heyitsnick
Could you explain a bit more when Bodymedia FIT is superior? The FitBit One
and Ultra tracks steps taken, floors climbed, and sleep efficiency, and tells
you calories burned and distance travelled (the latter two i assume just
simply calculated from the raw data collected; you can input your weight and
stride length on the site).
~~~
b3b0p
I believe the Fitbit is nothing more than a step counter type of device. I
could be wrong, but that's what it looks like.
The Bodymedia FIT has actual sensors, it's an armband you have to wear. It
monitors temperature among other things. It has been tested against, a $40,000
"portable oxygen analyzer", the gold standard for measuring calories. (source:
<http://www.bodymedia.com/the_science.html>)
Regarding the Bodymedia FIT developer program. It looks you still need a
subscription though and one still needs to upload the data from the armband to
the website to get at it. Seems kind of pointless. I would want to get the
data directly from the USB armband without a subscription.
------
dadro
I recently wrapped up a 6 month project that entailed extensive Fitbit
integration. My client is a fortune 500 company and even with their resources
it took them months to become a Fitbit partner. Fitbit also charged a
ridiculous amount of money for accessing the 100K devices we were provisioning
as compared to the competitors.
If accessing the collector data is important I would consider looking at some
of the fitbit competitors, as they have much more open APIs. Fitlinxx
(<http://www.fitlinxx.net/pebble-activity-monitor.htm>) and Fitbug both come
to mind.
------
randomchars
If you live in the EU you can send them a data access request, which means
they have to provide you with all your personally identifiable information
that they keep, in this case that means pretty much everything.
I hate it when companies think that they can get away with making you pay for
your data.
~~~
dawson
I have always been curious about this, from a healthcare perspective. For
example, we encrypt PID information one way (the patient has their own unique
data access key, which is then encrypted with their password + salt and some
'other stuff'), so we couldn't hand over any information if a data access
request was made, even if we wanted to as we don't have access to that
information ourselves!
~~~
hayksaakian
You could hand over the encrypted data, the usefulness of such data being low
however.
~~~
dawson
The issue is that the PID is all encrypted, I wouldn't know if we have a John
Doe on our system, we can't see anything to verify that user exists or that
they're the appropriate owner of said data. We do have an email (which is also
encrypted at a system level, which in theory we could access), but verifying
an access request based on an email address? I don't know. The way we solve
the problem is by making all the data available to the user once they have
authenticated, as long as you can login to our website, all your data is
available to you, but if you made a direct data access request to us, like a
FOI to our office by letter (the typical way it's done), not much I think we
could do.
~~~
thisone
Your IG team will know.
From my understanding, from the yearly IG briefings I used to have, you would
be able to provide that requester with information on how to obtain their
personal access, and point out to them where they can find the information
they have requested.
Information needs to be made accessible, you don't necessarily need to
actually provide printouts. For example, FOI requests from news agencies often
cover the same topics. This information can and often is posted publicly on
the organisation's website and the FOI responses refer the requester to those
links.
~~~
alexkus
FOI requests are often made because people don't trust that the "all your
information is displayed here on the website" is actually all of the
information that is being held on them.
What if the FOI request was supplemented with the users password (changed by
them to a temporary one)?
Other possibilities would be encrypting a second copy of the patients data
(each time it is stored by the user) using a public key with the corresponding
private key held in escrow somewhere on a machine with no network connection.
It would then be someone's job, upon receiving an FOI request, to take the
patients master-encrypted record(s), put them on the non-connected computer
that contains the private key, decrypt, and print out in order to reply to the
FOI and then clean up.
~~~
thisone
If this ability to decrypt data exists, you have yet another layer for the FOI
request.
You must track each and every time a patient's data was decrypted and by whom,
and that information must be available as well.
Information that you'll probably also need to encrypt, but still be able to
search by patient, date, and decrypter. (requests come through to find all
records a particular employee has seen within a certain date range as well)
I can see the start of a rabbit hole, which is why organisations dealing in
PID have IG teams or consultants who know the laws and know how much needs to
be done.
If a patient thinks an organisation is holding out on them, that patient has a
way to complain, and the complaints aren't taken lightly from what I've seen.
------
mcormier
Shameless plug.
I've started a project to track any data that I want and stop relying on all
of these free sites because of this loss of data issue.
The source code is here: <https://github.com/mcormier/tallyman>
and you can see it in action here: <http://stats.preenandprune.com>
I haven't tackled generated graphs from the SQL data yet but plan to
eventually. The one graph on the page was generated with Apple's Numbers.
Since it's annual data I don't plan on updating it more than once a year.
~~~
feniv
I've also been working on something very similar (general data tracking with
an awesome API) for a couple of months now. It's not quiet ready yet, but I
would love to have your input on it once it's online!
(P.S. My project is also heavily inspired by the features and shortcomings of
Daytum (namely the lack of an API), which is frankly the best self tracking
tool available at the moment.)
------
yarrel
There's libfitbit - <https://github.com/openyou/libfitbit>
~~~
rb2k_
The new fitbit can sync using the iphone's bluetooth 4 connection. This makes
syncing a passive rather than an active thing which was the reason I bought
the fitbit one even though I had the original one.
------
beaumartinez
I feel the same with regards to my Nike FuelBand. I even asked Nike if they
would provide an API[0] (they won't).
Fortunately their web app keeps your NikeFuel—Nike's activity metric—for every
day (in 15-minute increments) as a global JavaScript variable. I wrote a
scraper[1] to get me my data.
I wonder if you can do the same with Fitbit.
[0] <https://twitter.com/NikeFuel/status/205424488836370433> [1]
<https://github.com/beaumartinez/fuel>
~~~
marcusestes
They recently announced that Fuel data will be available by API after all:
<http://developer.nike.com/resources>
~~~
beaumartinez
Thank you, you have made my day!
------
asher_
This is a rather annoying trend with devices in this class. I own a half dozen
otherwise excellent devices like this, each of which require a SaaS
subscription to make full use of, any most of which deny me access to the raw
data. I have to think that the market for people wanting the raw data is
fairly small in comparison to the people who just want a simple, single-device
web service, but I think this is disappointing.
The real value in the data is the relationships between various data sources.
I really don't care how many steps I take in a particular day, but I do care
if there is a relationship between that and my weight, how well I sleep, my
heart rate etc. No device, or brand, does everything, nor should they. I want
to be able to get my data out so I can use it in interesting ways.
I have thought a lot about not buying any devices in the future that don't
allow me access to the data I produce. I think it is probably a good policy,
but I would be left with very little in the way of options then. Finding hacks
to get data out of devices can be useful, but should we really have to crack
each new gadget just to use the data? I think its a pretty sad state of
affairs.
------
nodata
Just wait until a large health insurance company buys Fitbit (or Withings, or
Garmin) - _they_ will have your data.
~~~
alexkus
I have various Garmins (Forerunner 405 for running and Edge 705 for cycling).
None of my data goes to Garmin as I just use Garmin Training Centre and don't
upload anything to Garmin Connect.
~~~
npsimons
Much as I dislike Garmin's lack of support for Linux, I have to second this.
My Forerunner 405, eTrex Vista and Vista HCx all download to my computer, with
the _option_ ( _not forced_ ) of uploading. I have full access to .GPX files
that I can use with any number of pieces of software (including Google Earth
and Maps). Also, I've been pretty happy with the Zephyr HxM hooked up to my
N900, and the wife has a Zephyr as well that works well with a Samsung Galaxy
III and Google tracks.
~~~
quantumstate
It case you haven't come across it I have found that garmintools and pytrainer
work very well with my forerunner 305. I have never used anything else.
------
hiroprot
Slightly OT, I used to obsess about the accuracy and actual data that these
devices provide (had a BodyMedia FIT and now a FitBit), until I realized that
the data itself isn't what I'm most interested in.
IMHO the main draw for these devices is their ability to motivate me to be
more active, sleep better, etc. Historical data is interesting, but not
crucial to that function (although I'd like to see FitBit make the data
available). Far more important are real-time feedback mechanisms, such as
notices that I achieved a goal, motivating messages ("you're almost there"),
etc.
------
unreal37
So this may be a counter argument to the "Hacker" culture, but here goes.
Hopefully this can spark an interesting discussion.
I own a fitbit, and have loved it. I don't regret paying the $99 for it. I log
into the web site, and see my daily totals, and the little graph showing when
my activity spikes were. At the end of a grueling day walking around New York
City, I can tell my wife that we took 20,000 steps and that's a bit
interesting. It's useful and interesting - only to a point.
So after reading this post, my main question is "Why?"
Why do you need minute-by-minute access to pedometer data? What use is it,
really? The OP says, basically, "out of curiosity". OK, so hack the thing.
There's a number of links for intercepting that data during the sync process.
But can you fault fitbit for not providing data that noone (not even the
company itself) needs?
What data can the fitbit give you on a minute-by-minute basis that is remotely
useful or interesting?
It's just a pedometer. At the end of the day, it tells you you took 10,000
steps or whatever. It's also interesting that you walked 50 miles this month,
or have walked up steps to the level of a helicopter flies. Or how many miles
you've walked this year.
But minute-by-minute?
~~~
ISL
Spectral analysis. <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectral_density_estimation>
Without frequent sampling, you can't get access to high frequency information.
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nyquist_frequency>
An example (not for regular sampling, but I hope it gets the point across): if
a pedometer records the time of every footfall through the day, you can
discern whether your pace is faster on Tuesdays than Sundays, even if you take
the same number of steps. If those data are aggregated into steps/hour, you'll
never see it.
The lack of open access to the data acquired by a FitBit (I'd been considering
buying one) is a certain dealbreaker.
------
harold
This project hasn't been updated in a while but might be a good starting point
for a roll-your-own solution:
<https://github.com/loghound/Fitbit-for-Google-App-Script>
------
patrickk
Fitbit's data policy seems to be in stark constrast to that of Zeo. I bought a
Zeo Sleep Manager after reading Gwern's excellent, extremely detailed writeups
about his sleep experiments:
<http://www.gwern.net/Zeo>
These wouldn't be possible without data exports:
[http://mysleep.myzeo.com/export/Export%20Data%20Help%20Sheet...](http://mysleep.myzeo.com/export/Export%20Data%20Help%20Sheet.pdf)
------
darklajid
My pet peeve:
I wanted to know what fitbit is, but the site redirects me to fitbit.com/de
and I closed that site.
How can they be open about data, if they have obviously no clue about open
standards, like http accept headers? Worse, there's no way to visit the
(official?) fitbit.com site even after that idiotic redirect. I can't access
an english version, period. Stupid.
~~~
ig1
There's a logical flaw in your reasoning "doesn't http accept headers" doesn't
imply anything about their understanding of open standards.
While it's perfectly understandable that you might be upset that their site
for Germany doesn't offer english language as an option, that's clearly a
completely separate issue from how they handle user data.
~~~
darklajid
You're correct. I let my anger about ignoring my explicit preferences, which I
expressed in a standard way, lead me to believe that the company doesn't care.
Obviously that's annoyance speaking and speculating based on me being tired
with the constant 'Hey, I know better what you want' attitude (Looking at you,
Google/Blogger) - I don't even know a single thing about their product (which
is why I went to the site in the first place).
Sorry about that. I stand by my point about this sort of redirection being a
telltale sign of a flawed web site and lack of respect for user preferences.
What else they can or cannot do, I have no clue about and cannot judge.
~~~
ig1
Given that you're in Germany and they don't have an english version of their
Germany website available their two options would be either to send you to the
German language website for Germany (which they do) or alternatively send you
to the US or UK website which are in english.
I'm not sure it's obvious that sending someone in Germany to the UK/US website
(where presumably they'll be unable to buy the product) just because their
browser is set to English is the better solution.
While for sites like Blogger language is obviously more important than
country, for companies which are country-localized (i.e they treat different
countries differently for shipping, taxes, legal, operations, etc.) I would
guess that it makes more sense to send you to local country version.
Imagine you were using say a dating site or a takeaway site, you would find it
equally frustrating if you were routed away from a local language site to a US
specific site just because that's what your language preferences were set to.
~~~
darklajid
I'm not sure why you're conflating
a) content and localization
b) the region I'd like the product to ship to, if at all
Why is the site different for different countries, ignoring 'translation'? I
haven't thought it through, maybe, but I cannot come up with any decent reason
for a 'German' site that isn't just the 'US' site in a different language.
In that case, please (dear website) listen to what I'm asking for. If I go to
fitbit.com I expect to get the very same thing someone in the US receives. I'd
like to talk about the very same site. I don't want someone to redirect me to
a localized thing. And certainly not without giving me the opportunity to say
'Yeah, no. That was stupid. I really wanted the original version, silly'.
Same thing: If I go to www.google.com, I want to end up at www.google.com, not
www.google.de. If I visit a random post on Blogger, chances are everything
content is in English. Except for the 'helpful' Blogger toolbar and whatnot,
that are coming up in German, because hey that's where we figured out you're
coming from.
Lived in Israel for a year, got a Hebrew toolbar, google.il (and I'd like to
know what fitbits would've done there). German vs. English is one thing: I can
read both, I just explicitly (url, domain, accept headers) ask for the latter.
English vs. Hebrew is another: I cannot read the latter, even if I happen to
be - yay for geolocation - in the one state that represents the Hebrew
language.
Imagine you were using say a dating site or a takeaway site, you would find it
equally frustrating if you were routed away from a local language site to a
US specific site
Right. Don't send me anywhere if I navigate to example.com, even if I ask for
de_DE. Offer a translated version, if you can. Otherwise drop a small
(German?) link on your .com, saying 'We noticed you explicitly ask for German
content. We got a country specific site right here -> example.de'
A dating site would allow me to register and state my country of origin or
interest (which might be Germany, even if I live in Tel Aviv at that time). A
takeaway site is really a weird example. www.pizza.de is available in German
only for all I can tell and won't redirect me to a random US site because I
ask the server to please return en_US or en localized content, _if possible_.
So, for me this whole 'automagic-we-know-it-best' translation/redirection
thing is broken by design. It was a constant hassle in the past and just seems
to catch on. Which is why I'm pointing it out when I can. I'm sorry for the
thread-jacking. Thanks for the exchange so far.
------
gregcohn
Good post. Are are any of the similar devices more open, in terms of both data
accessibility and format?
~~~
jrockway
If a FitBit is just a pedometer, I have an Omron HJ-720IT that syncs with my
Linux box (uploading a week's worth of hourly step counts). It's $30 on
Amazon.
~~~
thisone
The cheaper one is a pedometer, the expensive one tries to do things like
track your sleeping patterns and hooks into their own make of scale.
------
npsimons
_I also asked around and Fitbit seemed like the most “open” platform for
collecting one’s own data._
Either the OP didn't ask around very well, or they were lied to. There are
plenty of other much more open solutions out there.
Edit: A downvote? Really? In what way is the above not true?
~~~
jessedhillon
Give us names, add links.
~~~
npsimons
Okay, names and links:
I speak here only from personal experience; having used the following mostly
at the gym, biking to and from work and while hiking in the Sierras:
\- Garmin Forerunner 405
([https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=11039&ra=true](https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=11039&ra=true)):
All around general good "exercise" watch, but battery life requires a backup
plan. Doesn't have Linux software, but can easily export to GPX for use in
things like Google Earth and Maps. You can also combine other sensors: bicycle
speed/cadence sensor (<https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=1266>) and a
foot pod (<https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=15516>) for gym workouts,
or just longer battery life.
\- Zephyr HXM (<http://www.zephyr-technology.com/products/fitness>) combined
with a smartphone (such as N900): Another good solution for basic logging; a
variety of software to choose from, with different levels of openness.
Just to curb some replies: I know that FitBit does other stuff, lasts longer
on a charge, has less friction getting data off, etc, but the thing I'm
countering is the openness claim. If you have to pay for your data, and you
still don't get a copy, it's a) not your data and b) not an open platform.
Some basic research would have revealed this, hence why I didn't (and won't)
get a FitBit, and I recommend others avoid it too.
------
vannevar
I was looking at FitBit but am really not interested in uploading any data. Is
it possible to use the FitBit desktop app without permitting it to upload?
Would it cache everything locally and function normally or does it require
access to be usable at all?
~~~
vannevar
Ah, found the answer in the product manual:
"The Tracker will upload your data every 15 minutes provided you are within
range of any plugged in base station (about 15 feet for direct line of sight),
the computer is on and not in sleep or hibernate mode, the software is
installed and running, and _you have an active internet connection_."
This implies to me that the data isn't cached locally outside of the Tracker
itself, if an internet connection is not available.
------
mavlee
I actually ran into the same problem recently, when trying to get my minute by
minute data. I even emailed their support team, but no luck.
I wonder if there's an easy way to scrape their flash charts on the
dashboard...
~~~
MichaelApproved
Without using the website, I suspect you can use something like Fiddler to see
what HTTP requests are being made. Chances are the charts are making an XML or
JSON request to their servers.
If you're lucky, the URL requests will be in an easy to reverse engineer
format so you could easily dump all the data you need by adjusting the URL.
~~~
bloaf
Why not try to intercept the data as it comes through the USB port instead?
~~~
Thrymr
Or try liftbit as noted above: <https://github.com/openyou/libfitbit>
~~~
simcop2387
libfitbit unfortunately doesn't currently work with the fitbit one, for the
older devices it's apparently fine but the one changes how it gets talked to
entirely. I've attempted a bit of work with getting something talking to it
but it's not an easy thing to do. Their bluetooth dongle presents itself as an
HID device and I think hides a lot of the details away from you if you wanted
to talk to it over actual bluetooth. I'd love to get it to sync with both
their site and to be able to capture the information myself to store.
------
lispm
I like the device. But without access to my data I will not buy it.
------
rb2k_
Related: I also wrote a little script that uses the API to save data as YAML
files: [http://blog.marc-seeger.de/2012/09/16/backing-up-fitbit-
data...](http://blog.marc-seeger.de/2012/09/16/backing-up-fitbit-data-using-
their-api/)
It isn't as detailed (e.g. distribution over time) as the website, but it
still gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling to have at least part of the data in
machine-readable files :)
------
bigfrakkinghero
I purchased a FitBit based on it's reputation without realizing that I would
have to pay to access the data that I'm collecting... deal breaker! As others
have said, I understand charging for an ongoing service like analyzing the
data and using their site, but not for just accessing the raw data from the
device.
For me, this is the first time that not owning my own data has really put me
off. I'll be returning my FitBit.
------
senthilnayagam
I like fitbit, it is inspiring me daily to go for my workout.
Minute by minute data can be very useful for custom visualization.
I have found a few bugs in fitbit, like I change my daily targets, but weekly
targets dont change.
Also, fitbit free app is not available in Indian App Store. I dont want to
create a US apple account to just use this app.
If open data access is available, I would be inclined to but a Aria and couple
of fitbit zip for my family members as well.
~~~
heyitsnick
> like I change my daily targets, but weekly targets dont change.
fwiw I think that is by design; the two things are independent. e.g. you may
wish to set a minimum 10k steps a day, but a weekly goal of 100k (or
whatever). It's a bit confusing because it sets you up defaults for both day
and week where week=7xDay, but it doesn't have to be that way.
------
RossM
I was planning on getting a FitBit this week, the main purchasing decision
against a Nike Fuelband being open access to data. Does anyone have any
alternatives they can recommend? I'm especially interested in the sleep
tracking side of things.
~~~
binarysolo
If you just want to track sleep, use Sleep Cycle (iPhone/Android phone app).
I personally love the FitBit ecosystem (I use the app and scale religiously,
and its UX is fantastic) and stopped using Sleep Cycle in favor of the
tracking via FitBit.
------
biturd
Why do we need an actual hardware device to get to this data? Don't iPhones
and Androids and others have all the internals needed to get the same data,
and more, such as altitude, so you can check the incline you are against etc.
~~~
heyitsnick
I think for lots of people, they don't want carry their expensive smart-phones
with them when they exercise. I'm also always forgetting it, don't charge it,
etc. These new devices are so small you can basically wear it all day and
forget about it.
------
ivankirigin
I was just looking into something similar for Jawbone Up. There is an
unofficial API <http://eric-blue.com/2011/11/28/jawbone-up-api-discovery/>
------
cpenner461
Just got a Jawbone UP, and I can login to my account with them and download a
CSV with my data. It's just a daily summary though (i.e. not the full hour by
hour or whatever interval it's recording at).
------
pringles
[https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/fitbit-
api/Intrad...](https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/fitbit-
api/Intraday/fitbit-api/kV0XOcuARtU/PdL19QPxPtEJ)
------
wastedbrains
keep emailing and asking on the message boards. Fitbit is a bit slow to get
back to people but normally pretty good about it. I built ruby apis to access
fitbit before they had an API and a android app prior to them releasing their
own. I was in email contact with them the whole time and they were willing to
help me out and give me beta access to the api before it was public.
I love fitbit, and hope they allow users to at least download the detailed
personal reports.
------
gregcohn
Useful roundup from TC: <http://techcrunch.com/2013/01/02/best-health-apps/>
------
ejain
FWIW, I asked for (and got) access to Fitbit's "intraday" API without much
trouble (or extra cost).
------
Too
Because then you would be able to see how inaccurate the sensors really are?
------
durga
try FitFrnd: We'll soon add a button to allow you to download ALL your data in
csv/excel format.
[https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/fitfrnd-best-weight-loss-
soc...](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/fitfrnd-best-weight-loss-
social/id522850347?mt=8)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The Chinese families revealing their Internet shopping habits - SimplyUseless
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-32498456
======
yitchelle
It looks like not much has changed since 2012.
[http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-19648095](http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-19648095)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Fukushima: The Price of Nuclear Power - fitzwatermellow
http://www.nybooks.com/blogs/nyrblog/2015/aug/12/fukushima-price-nuclear-power-namie/
======
orangecat
And it's worth it. The alternative to nuclear power is not Living in Peace and
Harmony with Gaia, it's coal.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Interpol issues 'red notice' for Carlos Ghosn's arrest - dynamite-ready
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-50972149
======
rossdavidh
Not particularly well informed on this, just want to point out to those trying
to decide between scenario 1 (Ghosn broke the law with impunity because he was
a CEO and felt entitled) and scenario 2 (Ghosn is really being persecuted for
being a non-Japanese CEO of a Japanese company), that it is logically possible
for both to be true. In other words, like Martha Stewart, he might not have
been doing anything that his peers weren't also doing, but also doing things
that were illegal.
Of course, the fact that scenarios 1 and 2 are not incompatible, is not proof
that they both happened, just pointing out that it is logically possible for
both to be true.
~~~
JumpCrisscross
Escaping state surveillance from Japan and then landing up in Lebanon via
Turkey while the Japanese government has all three of one’s passports pretty
much requires breaking _lots_ of laws in at least three countries. (Likely
more, _e.g._ money laundering.)
One could argue this was a rightful fleeing of persecution. But it complicates
the picture on many levels.
EDIT: looks like he kept a second French passport [1]. He would have only had
to break many laws in two countries, mostly around aviation and declaration.
[1]
[https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2020/01/02/national/carlos...](https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2020/01/02/national/carlos-
ghosn-met-lebanese-president-fleeing-japan-sources-say/)
~~~
gryson
As reported in the news, he had two French passports and was allowed to carry
one of them in Japan in a locked case. Presumably he broke the lock and used
it to enter Turkey and Lebanon.
~~~
k_sze
I didn't know that a person can simultaneously have two valid passports of the
same country. I thought you either have to declare the old one as lost or
bring it to the passport office to have it invalidated, when you apply for a
new one.
How does this work?
~~~
wereHamster
People traveling through the middle east and Israel often have two passports.
One they show the israeli immigration officers, and the other they show
elsewhere. Israel will interrogate when you show up on their borders with an
stamp in your passport from on of the arabic states. It's just a way to get
around this kind of hassle.
~~~
nataz
Israel doesn't stamp anymore (at least the last few times I was there). You
now get a small slip of paper instead. I presume for this very reason.
~~~
Scoundreller
Even if you’re entering for business?
~~~
nataz
I've only ever gone for business.
------
nataz
Just a quick note on INTERPOL since the original title was misleading. [1]
INTERPOL is basically an information sharing organization that connects police
forces in different countries.
It has no authority on of it's own. It's not a police force or law enforcement
agency. It can't issue warrants or make arrests.
Basically, they are the holders of a bunch of databases that each country's
official poc (national coordinating body - "NCB") can query, enter data into,
and receive notices from.
Notices come in different colors. A red notice is an information alert by the
host county (Japan in this case) to other national police forces that a
subject is wanted for prosecution. Other country's police forces can choose
what they want to do with this request. A red notice is not an indication of
guilt.
Most red notices are restricted to only law enforcement officials and the
subject/public won't even know about them. This makes sense if you are
actually trying to capture someone.
You make a notice public for two reasons.
1, you need the public's help in finding someone. That's not the case here
since we know where the target is.
2, you are making a political point.
I suspect Japan's legal and law enforcement community was seriously
embarrassed. If they actually wanted to/thought they could capture him, they
would have reached out discreetly to other agencies via a law enforcement only
read notice/and or other diplomatic means.
INTERPOL is a fascinating international organization and it's interesting to
watch all the geopolitics play out.
[1] source: occasionally work with INTERPOL as a consultant/subject matter
expert
~~~
JumpCrisscross
> _Other country 's police forces can choose what they want to do with this
> request_
Practically, this notice restricts Ghosn's travel to several countries. It
does nothing to him in Lebanon, and is unlikely to change much in France.
~~~
Scoundreller
I feel bad for anyone booking a private jet from Lebanon to France for the
next while.
Plenty risk of an unscheduled diplomatic lunch:
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evo_Morales_grounding_incide...](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evo_Morales_grounding_incident)
~~~
tyingq
Looks like you could fly well enough outside anyone else's airspace from
Lebanon to France. The one tight spot being the gap between Malta and Tunisia.
~~~
Scoundreller
Maybe get to Reunion and then blend in on a domestic flight back to the
mainland.
------
nxoxn
I find this whole series of events to be fascinating. I'm also very interested
in what Ghosn has to say on the 8th. I have only read briefly on Japan's
prison system and from what I understand it assumes guilt.
It's hard to infer what might have happened. Leading up to his arrest in Japan
there were mentions that he had treated his co-officers in a "un-Japanese" way
and was suspected to have lead to his being targeted to be removed.
It's also interesting how this how debacle has caused Nissan to suffer. It
really seems like Nissan was about to turn around their design and car
interiors (the new Maxima, Altima, Sentra, and Versa have gotten big boosts)
and then this hits them hard.
I hope Nissan pulls through and I hope the truth about Ghosn comes out.
~~~
JohnJamesRambo
Having just read his wikipedia, it seems this goes very much deeper than
treating someone in an "un-Japanese" way.
>Nissan was paying all or some of the costs at some amount of US$18 million
for residences used by Ghosn in Rio de Janeiro, Beirut, Paris and Amsterdam,
and that Ghosn charged family vacation expenses to the company.
And the list goes on and on...
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Ghosn#Arrest_in_Tokyo_a...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Ghosn#Arrest_in_Tokyo_and_subsequent_Nissan_investigation)
>Nissan compliance auditors began trying to track Zi-A activity in 2014 but
were stymied at first by the chain of shell companies used in Zi-A
investments.
>Nissan funds were used to purchase Ghosn's Paris apartment in 2005, and Zi-A
funds were used to purchase his $5 million beachfront Rio apartment in 2012
and his Beirut mansion, which, with renovations, cost over $15 million.
>In addition, to avoid reporting the full amount of his compensation in Nissan
financials, as required by Japanese law beginning in 2010, Ghosn had Kelly
structure complicated deferred payment plans which went unreported under an
aggressive interpretation of the disclosure rules which Nissan's outside
auditors had not signed off on, and which totaled around $80 million at the
time of his arrest eight years later.
He's just your typical CEO criminal and should be in a cell next to murderers
and drug kingpins.
Nissan stock in 2018 - $21. Today - $11.67.
~~~
tonyedgecombe
Isn’t this fairly typical for Japanese corporations, that senior management
might have their home paid for by the company?
There are smells coming from both sides of this dispute.
~~~
Danieru
No, not at all. Japan has some of the most egalitarian CEO pay in developed
countries.
Ghosn exploited his position and muddied waters. He paid himself 3 CEO
salaries and yet continuously claimed to be under paid.
To claim Nissan, an entity Ghosn controlled, was somehow equally as guilty is
what-about-ism.
~~~
fennecfoxen
You seem to basically be saying that we should consider Ghosn to be guilty of
crimes because he was an outsider whose attitude wasn't sufficiently Japanese.
To me this seems to reinforce his position, rather than yours.
~~~
Danieru
I said nothing of the sort, please do not troll on hacker news.
------
tpmx
I found the comments here interesting/insightful:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/japan/comments/eip9cr/japanese_medi...](https://www.reddit.com/r/japan/comments/eip9cr/japanese_media_blasts_cowardly_ghosn_after_escape/)
~~~
tpmx
This subreddit has been following this case obsessively ever since it started.
It's a must read for anyone interested in this case.
------
hirundo
> Reuters on Thursday quoted sources close to Mr Ghosn as saying he decided to
> flee after finding out his trial had been delayed until April 2021.
If I'm on his jury for charges related to fleeing I'd tend to give him a pass
for this reason. Justice delayed is justice denied.
------
tjpnz
Good to see that this is being taken seriously, both by Turkey and Interpol.
Japan's justice system is flawed but certainly not to the degree where one
should presume that the case against him is entirely groundless.
------
PunchTornado
Why would France not extradite him if he arrives in the country? Seems really
dodgy from their part, like another Polanski case.
~~~
dgudkov
France doesn't extradite its nationals.
------
vadym909
Fascinating- I'd go watch the movie. Rags to Riches Hero becoming too
successful- targeted by Big Foreign Govt on cooked up charges escaping
persecution and going home to safety.
------
pboutros
Red notice is different from an arrest warrant.
------
mzs
FWIW Lebanon is very likely to ignore it.
------
mordae
How does he have a Japanese _and_ other passports? I thought Japan does not
recognize multiple citizenships...
------
danmg
Finally, he'll be held accountable for those JATCO transmissions.
------
TazeTSchnitzel
“Interpol issues a warrant for Carlos Ghosn's arrest”
Interpol is neither a police force nor a court of law, and does not have the
power to issue warrants.
~~~
Waterluvian
There's a great Stuff You Should Know podcast episode on Interpol. As you
point out, they're not a police force. They're an international organization
designed to help connect police forces together. They know who to call and
have translation services, etc.
A more apt description is that Interpol issued a notice stating that Japan
wants this guy.
~~~
sjs382
> A more apt description is that Interpol issued a notice stating that Japan
> wants this guy.
Current article title is "Carlos Ghosn: Interpol issues 'red notice' for
Nissan ex-boss's arrest"
~~~
blondin
ah man... i always thought that interpol was the more classy version of mi6.
------
grzm
Article title: Carlos Ghosn: Interpol issues 'red notice' for Nissan ex-boss's
arrest
~~~
grzm
Note: submission title has been updated since this comment was made:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21935806](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21935806)
------
doktrin
Good on him for escaping. The japanese judicial system is an outright farce
and they deserve to be humiliated on the world stage.
~~~
dynamite-ready
This currently looks like the view the western media is coalescing on. But
look at country's relationship with crime. It's almost seen as a model in this
regard.
How sure are you about the defendant's innocence?
~~~
doktrin
I lived in Japan for several years so I'm quite aware of the upsides of that
country, and more aware than most of its dark and downsides.
Ghosn is undoubtedly guilty of something, but he wasn't arrested (and
subsequently rearrested a half dozen times on the same charge) because of his
culpability. It was a Japan Inc. hatchet job through and through.
Bottom line is that he was facing a kangaroo court and a judicial system with
a 99% conviction rate. Everybody deserves better than that.
------
roryrjb
Anyone else getting "An error occurred during a connection to www.bbc.co.uk.
PR_END_OF_FILE_ERROR" when trying to access BBC News? This in under Firefox on
Linux but also cannot access it in Chromium.
~~~
roryrjb
Huh, it was my VPN (PIA). Does anyone know why this would happen? I tried a
few different servers.
~~~
yingw787
I get the same issue using NordVPN; not sure why.
~~~
hetspookjee
EDIT: Are you aware that you're likely using exit nodes that are acquired
through a botnet by using NordVPN? They're related with Oxygenlabs.
editted for correctness. My first statement was false. My apologies.
[https://medium.com/@derek./how-is-nordvpn-unblocking-
disney-...](https://medium.com/@derek./how-is-nordvpn-unblocking-
disney-6c51045dbc30)
Oldpost: ~~Are you aware of the possibility that you're an exit node for the
related NordVPN services?~~
~~~
yingw787
Well now I am. I got a 3 year subscription through them until 2021, I’ll
probably get PIA afterwards. I’m guessing this is a NordVPN specific thing?
------
diogenescynic
Russia uses Interpol to go after its critics like Bill Browder so I'm not sure
how to take this. As someone with no dog in the fight, from everything I read
it seemed like Japan turned against Ghosn because he made too many cuts to
Nissan which was ran more like a government owned enterprise. Japan's judicial
system also seems less than fair, especially to outsiders. I don't think
anyone on either side of this story looks clean.
------
glofish
Excellent points here! Very likely scenario.
I have yet to see any major achievement that did not "break" law in some way.
Remember laws are made for "regular" boring folks to keep them in line. They
cannot accommodate massive radical reorganizations. On the other hand the
Japanese sure look like they wanted to make a scapegoat and dish out exemplary
punishment.
~~~
seibelj
We all break innumerable laws everyday, the goal for the government is to make
everything illegal so that when you start making waves, they can put a
magnifying glass on your life to throw the book at you. You should have a lot
of money before you try and change things, so you can defend yourself through
the never ending lawsuits. Look at any major corporation’s quarterly filing
and see how many lawsuits they are mired in at once.
~~~
clucas
> the goal for the government is to make everything illegal
I've heard this line before, but never heard any evidence supporting it.
I work with government regulators in the US regularly in my day job, at the
local, state, and federal level. I have never gotten the impression that they
are trying to hoard infractions on people that they can later use to strong-
arm compliance.
Rather, modulo some personality issues, the vast majority government officials
I have ever worked with seem to be interested in achieving the best result for
the people in the jurisdiction they oversee, and they tend to take "the will
of the people" as expressed in elections and public forums very seriously - if
that means letting technical infractions slide, that's what they do.
In fact, a lot of times, the people running the government (again, in my
particular areas of experience) have expressed that they wish the laws or
regulations they are tasked with enforcing were less onerous, but they know it
won't change because the people don't want it to.
Of course, it could be different on the criminal justice side of things.
Could you cite some examples that support your accusation?
~~~
seibelj
I don’t have the time to dig up a hodge podge of article links. It’s more of a
philosophical argument.
As a recent example, I read this book “The Economist’s Hour” which is a left-
wing critique of free markets [https://www.amazon.com/Economists-Hour-
Prophets-Markets-Frac...](https://www.amazon.com/Economists-Hour-Prophets-
Markets-Fracture/dp/031651232X)
It’s thrust is that free markets are good, but need to be regulated by the
government to make them fair. I disagree with many of its conclusions, but I
did appreciate the numerous examples of regulatory overreach the author
provided to show how it can be taken too far. The sections on trucking and the
airline industry were particularly illuminating.
For example, airline companies were licensed by 1938 and no other airlines
were allowed to be created until deregulation in the Carter administration.
Airlines (and many other industries) would go hat-in-hand to regulators
begging them to solve all of their problems - prices, competition, union
issues, and on and on. As intra-state flying wasn’t regulated by the feds but
inter-state was, it became cheaper to fly within a state by over 50% than if
you crossed a state border.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
What are the best-kept secrets of great programmers? - programminggeek
http://brianknapp.me/best-kept-secrets-of-great-programmers/
======
gravypod
This is something more people need to see since it's obvious most people, at
least that I have met at university, don't get.
They ask me how I got good at this and I just tell them that I kept
programming. They don't understand that concept, I get a strange look back
every time.
------
k__
This is totally true, the more I built the more I learned and stuff I never
got in university just came to me after simply trying it in a small project.
You also have to know, what you can't do that takes looong time to learn.
Stuff like distributed systems and cryptography is hard, so don't think it
comes as easy as writing you first CRUD-app.
------
ankurdhama
One more thing, they reflect upon what they do. It is not just constant
practice, it is also about reflecting upon that.
~~~
edoceo
Right. Not just building your own but MAINTAINING your old code.
Me in 2014: This seems like a good idea.
Me in 2016: What idiot wrote this crap!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Aurum.js powerful JavaScript library. Incredibly fast - vaneri2007
https://aurumjs.org/
======
lpilot
Powerful and fast at doing what? From the title it could be solving
differential equations or drawing phalluses on my screen.
------
ryanar
This title is pure clickbait and gives no information about what Aurum.js is.
~~~
vaneri2007
Thid librarybis one of my friendd that deserved to be known.
His library is yet an other DOM rendering library but that is way faster thn
other common libraries when dealing with lots of dom elements. It deserved to
be checked and tested. A benchamrk is coming soon!
------
valuearb
Premature optimizations
------
jdmg94
so this is a React clone...much powerful, such fast
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
OpenSSL Security Advisory [26 Sep 2016] - m4r71n
https://mta.openssl.org/pipermail/openssl-announce/2016-September/000083.html
======
0x0
Nice, introducing an RCE in a security update XD
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Microsoft is forcing Edge and Bing on Windows 10 S users - mgiannopoulos
https://betanews.com/2017/05/02/microsoft-edge-bing-windows-10-s/
======
Safety1stClyde
The Windows 10 seems to be flipping the emailer away from Thunderbird over and
over, since each time I open Thunderbird it asks me if I want to set it as
default, again.
~~~
mgiannopoulos
Old habits die hard
------
I_am_neo
With this kind of PR coming from MS it really tells volumes about it's
mindset, it's futures, and it's morals
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: Best E-commerce Platforms - bsbechtel
My startup is looking into adding e-commerce functionality to our business. I've been exploring different e-commerce platform options, and they all look like they have different pros and cons. We're using meteor.js for some internal software already, so I've been looking closely at Reaction Commerce (https://reactioncommerce.com), and also Moltin (YC backed, pure API). Shopify is a big player in this space, but I think you give up some control and customizability with them. I'm curious to get other's thoughts on their experiences. Thanks!
======
dhalarewich
Hey there. I'm the founder of LemonStand, a cloud-based eCommerce platform
that's aimed at innovative companies who need to customize the shopping
experience from end to end.
In terms of front-end, you can pretty much do anything in LemonStand,
including customizing the checkout. For pushing data around, we have an API
([http://docs.api.lemonstand.com](http://docs.api.lemonstand.com)) you can
use. For also offer quite a bit in terms of product merchandising, shipping
calculation, etc.
We have a bit of a landing page for developers (more on our partner program,
but it has some high level info) over here:
[https://lemonstand.com/developers](https://lemonstand.com/developers)
If you have any questions, feel free to email me direct: danny at lemonstand
dot com
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
The Best Countries For Business - luckystrike
http://www.forbes.com/business/2008/06/26/denmark-ireland-finland-biz-cz_jg_bizcountries08_0626bizcountries_bestcountries.html
======
martythemaniak
If one spends some time reading various international rankings, they'll
quickly notice that Nordic countries dominate pretty much everything out there
- business friendliness, tech preparedness, quality of life, democracy,
government transparency, happiness etc.
And its probably a bit more complicated than Adam Smith's little
recommendation. Far more than any other countries, they seem to have a
dedication to finding things that work - regardless if they are "socialist"
(ie, their relatively high personal taxes and great social programs) or
"capitalist" (ie, the business friendliness cited by the article).
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Social Security Trust Fund Is Going to Start Irreversibly Drawing Down in 2020 - baronmunchausen
https://thesoundingline.com/the-social-security-trust-fund-is-finally-going-to-start-irreversibly-drawing-down-in-2020/
======
blacksqr
Linked article states that SS actuarial deficit is decreasing, and projected
time of exhaustion of funds is later than predicted last year.
In 2016, the CBO projected that the exhaustion date would be 2029 [1].
[1]
[https://www.cbo.gov/publication/52298](https://www.cbo.gov/publication/52298)
~~~
baronmunchausen
Yes, instead of 2019, it is now forecast to be 2020, as in the year that
starts two days from now. It only ran a $1 billion surplus in 2019.
~~~
blacksqr
Not sure what your point is, but my point is that the predicted year of
bankruptcy has kept getting pushed further into the future for decades.
The predictions are good for generating headlines but not much else.
~~~
joeblow9999
there's no 'bankruptcy' per se. There's no actual trust fund even.
The 'fund' is the equivalent of an government IOU to itself. Nothing more.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
HTML11 Labs - creativityhurts
http://html11.org/index.html
======
mw63214
support for EML?
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emotion_Markup_Language>
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Why money messes with your mind - agrinshtein
http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20127001.200-why-money-messes-with-your-mind.html?full=true
======
time_management
I noticed this when I worked on a trading floor. Even though the amounts of
money being discussed were very large (a good trader could send millions
across the table in one transaction) the game always seemed sterile to me, but
to the traders, it was exciting.
I also never "got" the poker bug. Even though I was reasonably good at the
game, it never seemed to be that interesting to me.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: How do you research large appliances? - pards
I'm in the market for a new washing machine and dryer but I've found that online research doesn't yield much insight.<p>I'm looking for appliances that work well, are reliable, and will last a long time.<p>How do you research large appliances?
======
itamarst
Read lots and lots and lots of reviews.
Eliminate really bad ones. E.g. discovered one of Consumer Reports'
recommended gas ovens had problem with handles breaking off, causing potential
fire hazard.
Then, hope for the best.
------
akoria
In the past, I have asked family, friends, and coworkers for their
recommendations... in addition to looking online at count and average of
reviews.
I also search on the internet to find out if there are problems with the
particular model number of product line I'm looking into. (I do the same for
buying cars.) Look for product recalls, too.
Best of luck!
------
pards
It seems to me that most appliances are essentially disposable these days.
I'm considering Speed Queen for the laundry because they have a solid warranty
and proclaim to be built to last.
------
mars4rp
wait till black friday deals if you can. the price difference is huge!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
How I Found My Market (and a 10% Monthly Growth Rate) - ezekg
https://www.indiehackers.com/interview/how-i-found-my-market-and-a-10-monthly-growth-rate-2fa6c5e1eb
======
ezekg
I made the decision this year to be more open about my journey bootstrapping
Keygen. This interview is a bit long, but I hope it contains some valuable no-
BS insight into how I've approached building and growing Keygen. Would be
happy to answer any questions that I didn't cover in the interview!
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Text Wizardry : Ten Commands - gurgeous
http://gurge.com/blog/2008/08/18/text-wizardry-ten-commands/
======
silentbicycle
for a in `ls -1 /usr/bin/`; do whatis "$a"; done | less
That prints out a list of every command in /usr/bin with a one-line
description.
sed (transforming pipe with regular expressions) and file (try to identify a
file type based on headers and other metadata) are also quite handy.
If you find the post interesting, check out Kernighan & Pike's _The Practice
of Programming_.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Protecting your site against DNS outages - sedds
http://blog.women.com/protecting-your-site-against-dns-outages/
======
rdl
This works for simple DNS configurations, but gets a lot more complicated if
you use DNS based load balancing, any kind of automated changes to DNS,
DNSSEC, etc.
Also, I would absolutely make sure you have a way to keep records in sync.
Updating the backup should be an automatic part of updating any records.
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Ask HN: How to build a stack for real-time analysis application? - zedzan
I am building a real-time data-analysis application where I need to aggregate and analyze data in real-time from myriad sources.
I am trying to figure out what is the best technology to use in order to build a scalable stack for my solution.<p>My choices:
- Node.JS: with Asynchronous capabilities, and the rich JS ecosystem.
- Scala/Akka: Many companies such Walmart, Linkedin.. are using this approach.
- Go Lang: as a backend language for their capabilities in concurrency.
- Integrate ROR with Storm Apach (as hadoop is not powerful in such cases).<p>Someone would argue here saying that Go (is a programming language, not a web framework), Node (is a javascript runtime, not a web framework), Scala (is programming language ), Akka (is an model).<p>I am torn which technology should I use here, the potential of technology is the average of the overall factors ( programming language, web framework, ecosystem, community ..) eg: Go is powerful, but their ecosystem still not solid .. etc.<p>I am not trying to compare between languages, but between the over-all technology as a stack. Can anyone share his story building similar applications, challenges that he could overcome, and problems that he faces in the middle of road.
======
valarauca1
I do most my concurrent realtime analysis in C or Java.
The biggest issue I run into with realtime analysis, I work in flow
measurement systems so you may never encounter this but communication errors.
Having a value randomly flip from 50 to -30 just for one data point can throw
you stand deviation, averages, etc. Straight out the window. And potentially
ruin a solid test.
What I find you want is a very threaded model. I normally just throw threads
at the scheduler and let it sort out the details.
Typically you want IO/error handling done in its own heavy thread for each
from of IO. Or each source, Ethernet, DAQ card, etc. Luckily ethernet does
most of this for you.
Next your post-error processed IO should get sorted into something, normally a
structure of some sort, and dumped into a generally read only structure.
This structure is read by 2 threads. 1 logs it, 1 processes it further (before
moving to another thread to be logged).
This lets your processing be largely independent and have no IO slow down.
Which is handy when your approaching ~20GB/hr+ of data streaming. Most of what
you get, and generate internally doesn't have to be logged, unless you
_really_ like buying hard drives.
Also by keeping these separate you can have multiple _processing_ threads. But
when you do be on guard. Haveing 1 IO -> N processing -> 1 IO will result in
data arriving at the 2 be logged IO not in the order it was recieved.
You will likely want a catch all thread sitting between logging and IO to sort
the last ~500 items by time stamp, so they can be logged properly.
TL;DR
1) Make sure you keep track of when it arrived log it in the same order
2) More threads are better then none.
3) Make sure communication errors don't occur (if your using TCP the OS does
this for you).
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
Writing HTML5 apps with Google App Engine, Google Closure Library and Clojure - iampims
http://www.slideshare.net/smartrevolution/writing-html5-apps-with-google-app-engine-google-closure-library-and-clojure
======
iampims
We try to do as much page-rendering on the client-side as we can,
only encapsulating state into custom-widgets when needed.
And we try to centralize the event-handling as much as possible
with our event-db.
I haven’t found _empirical data_ about this, but it seems that more and more
apps are going the "thin-server, thick client" route lately. Are server-side
templating engines going to be obsolete soon?
------
iampims
Previous slides are also very interesting:
[http://www.slideshare.net/smartrevolution/using-clojure-
nosq...](http://www.slideshare.net/smartrevolution/using-clojure-nosql-
databases-and-functionalstyle-javascript-to-write-gextgeneration-html5-apps)
| {
"pile_set_name": "HackerNews"
} |
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