Ubisoft Forums > 1C:Maddox Games > IL2 Maddox General Discussion > Bring back the Level Stabilizers please!
View Full Version : Bring back the Level Stabilizers please!
It seems to me the disappearance of Level Stabilizers, is not a bug, but a gameplay decision - Level Stabilizers are enabled for bombers, but fighters do not have this feature anymore.
Please, bring it back as a realism option! Testing the planes, without level stabilizers, is proving to be a very grueling task, and test efficiency is dropping down dramatically!
Please, include it as a realism option, in final release.
I'm just teasing you guys. As a difficulty option, it would be nice to have, I agree.
"Easy Autopilot" or something like that.
Difficulty setting for fighters, but always present on bombers would be ideal. There is no reason bombers should not have the level stabilizer function.
those level stabilisers aren't nearly as useful as a tricycle when you learn to ride a bike.
you lose height (about 1m/s) and so eventually if left unattended you will crash.
Trim's the way to go.
enable it as a console command?
Sheesh, I wasn't even aware of this feature except for bombers.
They should rework it and give it back to us then.
2. Instead of trim normal controls should be usable for "tuning", for example give left rudder to yaw left, pull up to maintain a certain climb angle; release all controls to remain heading and altitude. It's like in WarBirds then, IMHO that's the best solution.
3. Who said it was a cheat?? Someone even said it could recover stalls and spins, but just the opposite of that is what I experienced. It pulled me right into them when activating it in a dive or upside down.
As one of the "old guys"--- & one who flies bombers , YES make sure the level stabilizers are left as is.If not I would not load 1.2!
If they removed the level stabilizer for bombers they may as well make the multi-engine bombers AI only. It would be pretty much a waste of time to try and bomb with them with any proficiency.
another vote FOR the level stabilizer. dont forget that trim does affect it. a much slower reaction time, but you can trim out the leveler. it's great to use while typing online or answering that phone that rings at just the wrong time.
Level stabilizer has been removed from fighters ONLY in 1.2RC. He-111 and TB-3 both still have functioning level stabilizer.
It is hardly a difficult task to trim.
For example, some people are claiming the P-51D is 50~60km/h slower than it should be. The figure I got, was 697km/h at 7600m, but I really can't present this as an objective opinion, because there is a possibility that the test method could have been contaminated by pilot inputs, to maintain level!
But consider the argument that the previous testing with FB was invalid because the real aircraft tests didn't have a level stabiliser. That means that newer tests will be more valid not less.
YES! please bring them back!
both on line as well as off.
Off line to help trim the Rudder & to maintain a nice tight formation with the ai.
to run to the fridge really fast to re beer...i mean re arm.
in squad practice i use it to get my pilots used to flying in formation.
it's most usefull on line to help prevent crashes due to server lag. if you get caught in some bad warp hit the Level Stabilizers & when the lag goes away...youre ok!
this thing has saved my *** from lag related crashes many times.
In version 1.11 you could pull up from dives with level trim, which was otherwise impossible.
Is that what is really buggin youhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif?
Some aircraft don't have elevator trim.
-- definitive figures on fighter speed tests?
Maybe it was removed so we have to pay attention like real test pilots. "FullReal" I think they call it. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif We don't know WHAT is in the FB code. Horizontal stabilizer may change the flight model. We don't know.
You always could disable the Hstab key in the controls menu.
A big bump here but I really concur with all the reasons ppl have given above. Yes, WWII a/c didn't have a level stabilizer, but it indeed is very useful. And if someone doesn't want it, ye don't have to use it.
I wouldn't mind the function being unavailable when the pilot is blacked out, control surfaces are damaged, or etc etc.
I just want them back for test purposes - before, I could level the plane out totally with a decent/climb rate of less than 1m per 10 minutes.
- decent/climb rate of less than 1m per 10 minutes.
Agreed. Let's test with that feature during the beta, then remove that capability from the final version 1.2.
We don't know how "stabilizer" affects the FM code. We just don't know, or do we?
You can't think of a good reason for level stabilizer? Well, you must be single. You must not have kids, you must not have pets. You must not have any responsibility that will pull you away from the computer for the hours that you sit in front of it.
Some of us aren't that lucky. Some of us do need the restroom. Some of us do have to help out around the house. Level stab will simply keep the plane airborne for the few minutes you are away. It doesn't make you "super pilot."
I say yes, bring it back, for all aircraft.
Agreed...WW2 pilots didn't take their kids, phone, front door or their old lady up in the plane with them.
"We don't know how "stabilizer" affects the FM code. We just don't know, or do we?"
I can bet my left nut, that the level stabilizers function merely locks the elevator/aileron to absolute 0 angle - hence, in neutral trim, the plane will climb or fall according to speed. Not to mention, that the previously tested speeds of various planes in FB, matched spot on with real-life data with the level stabilizers function applied, during tests.
What you're saying is something like, "a plane that is perfectly trimmed with stick to neutral, will fly faster than a plane which the pilot manually inputs rudder, elevator, and aileron to keep it perfectly level".
There's not even a nanogram of logical reason the 'level stabilizers' function will somehow screw the FM for some reason.
the true concern is that beside all this comfort effect, daddy has to pee and then test level flight top speed etc. there was a true addition of rapid auto-recovery for such aircraft like Mig-3 which usually gets control freeze at ~400-500 km/h. Try it on 1.11 and you'll see what I mean.
For gameplay there is an absolutely necessity of having it for bombers but if the cost for a fighter is yet another exploit rather leave it. Next comes the suggestions how it could be slowed down, how it could be made to do this or that. The bottom line is that disabling that additional exploit would mean some action, which may or may not be simple. In the light of the late trim function history I'd rather say the fixing is not likely to be satisfactory.
Being a guy, I'm not going to remove your left nut, but I do believe you are wrong. It's not as simple as you make it out to be. Have you ever put level stab on when your airplane is all shot to craap? I have. It will fly straight and level every time. The control surfaces may be all whacked out and not near "neutral". Level stab will do whatever is necessary to the control surfaces to make the plane fly straight. I have used it before when I couldn't get the plane to fly straight due to massive damage. Touch one button and shes straight as an arrow.
Other then that, I agree with you. Level stab should come back, as it was well appreciated by those of us who have lives beyond the joystick.
Thanks waterinfuel. Also, level stabilizer will bring you out of the most bizarro flight attitudes into level flight very quickly. This could be an example of the level stabilizer creating an AI~esque FM.
For those cruel enough to use their very own wife and child as an excuse (in a way dragging them to "war"), you have AI autopilot for your plane. Or is autopilot disabled on the onwhine servers?
it is most useful for bombing... As it intended to be. If it was removed for fighters, there is certainly a reason (yes, it is a bit too easy to use it as a cheat to recover from impossible situations while online).
hmmm, if autopilot not available onwhine, what waypoints will it follow? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif This may not work too well.
The trim works better now. Learn how to use it and take a quick break. For family matters, feel lucky cos real combat pilots didn't see their families for months or years.
Ok well, I'm sure it wouldn't be much more than an "if/than" statement in a line of code that wouldn't allow it to be used if the speed was above number x, and the aoa was above number y...and since WWII has been over for 58 years, and I am sitting in front of a computer monitor flying a sim/playing a game, I don't have to worry about being away for months or years. Everyone's crying "learn to trim". Wonderful...for planes that fly straight and level or have aileron trim. FW190 doesn't have aileron trim. Long coop, set elevator trim, then the kid wants to grab your flight controls while you're answering the phone and wondering who's at the door...yeah...all that time spent waiting for the mission to launch and everyone to ready up is now completely wasted.
Level stabilizer shouldn't be able to be used as a cheat like some folks mentioned here, but it still shouldn't be gone. Not all of us have the luxury of being able to sit in front of our pc's for extended periods of uninterrupted time.
-- like some folks mentioned here, but it still shouldn't be gone.
Okay! I find that convincing. Also, some like I~16 have no elevator trim, so trim can't work at all. I am more interested in how the stabilizer is used as an easy cheat to test FM and how its supposed to compare with published data. Granted that is not the concern of most PC simmers.
Agreed an online server should have the option to disable LevelStab so it cannot be used as a cheat online. I cannot imagine though the use for it while playing online. If I can't fly my baby 'cause she's almost shot to pieces, why would I want to let a machine do it? Ain't gonna make me more kills.
Then how about level stabilizers available only at off-line? I really couldn't care less whether or not they are used in combat, as I don't use such thing myself. Nor is it because I can't level the plane out in 1.2RC1/2.
It's the fact that according to circumstances and sake of discussion, there are very numerous amount of planes to be tested out in many different conditions which may vary upon circumstances of a certain discussion.
To test about 10 Bf109s at 10 different altitudes in 2~3 different settings, it takes more than days to do so, as one cannot stare at the monitor all day long. With the level stab option, I could do that in two hours.
Server option, just like icons, padlock, no-cockpit and etc. That seems to be compromise enough.
For offwhine play, the FB Pause button is how one can take a break...even for many hours if needed, for those who have many wives and children. Granted this won't work for onwhine play now that level stabilizer has been brutally and cruelly taken away (like candy from a child). Oleg is a homewrecker. But then, I already thought FB has long ago replaced Marriage as an institution in the western democracies.
-- level stab option, I could do that in two hours.
Oh lord. Need I remind you, THIS IS A GAME! It's not real, so "unreal" problems come into the equation. The problem of the baby needing changing, the wife needing an opinion on that damn dress she just bought, or worse, the kid puking on the floor. So what if the "real" pilots didn't see their family for months or years? This isn't real, this a computer game, I'm flying a bunch of 0's and 1's on a TV monitor. The problems I have in my household while flying this bunch of 0's and 1's are very real, however!
- that rings at just the wrong time.
However well you trim your a/c it still goes off course. And you know it. The absence of the level stbilizer adds more neurvesness to the game, not joy.
Stabilizer is imperetive for phone calls or calls of nature.
- level trim, which was otherwise impossible.
YOU IS WRONG! I tried exactly THAT, and got into a SPIN in any plane. Definately not a cheat. Also it could NOT pull harder than the player could without retrimming.
Using this option was possible to cheat online.
This is really unrealistic option.
Removed by request of man-many people that wrote me directly. And I agree with them when I test it in a deep dive. So the decision was to remove it and keep as it should for novices only for bombers.
- fighters do not have this feature anymore.
-- level trim, which was otherwise impossible.
Yes, but it could do while the player was blackout. G resistance is part of the ability to pull out of a dive, and level stabilizer was allowing people to circumvent this.
Oddly enough though, in nearly a year of playing, I never thought to do this, so I'm personally not having any problem getting over its removal.
I see people saying - "Well the Pilots didn't have it" - or "The pilots did have a ringing doorbell, pets, etc..."
Well the way I see it - "The Honorable men who died for what they believed in, did not have the "Refly" option as we do!"
If you have to step away from the keyboard - then so be it - it's called life - either bail or see if you can make it back before you crash... either way it's just a game that you can respawn in and start all over with a fresh plane..
"Taste Great ---- Less Filling!!"
Ah well, if that be the decision I yield, Oleg.
But now, we're gonna see a lot of different claims on certain testings, though.
The Forgotten Stabilizer would explain the recent Extreme disagreement about max level speeds over the Patch-51. I am surprised at the number of Full Real FM "testers" who may have been using Level Stabilizer and didn't post that with their dribble I mean data. And they never include in their raw data how much Time Acceleration FM they used in their "tests."
You have a problem telling the difference between "won't do" and "can't do"?
Or are your remarks specifically aimed to irritate someone, with the absurd remarks on how a mere stabilization of control surfaces with automatic input, supposedly screws the FM?
- input, supposedly screws the FM?
Don't be so quick to dismiss this. It is pretty clear that the level-stab doesn't operate "through" the FM model but "over" it. Can you say, without a shadow of a doubt, that testing of FMs with the stab doesn't taint results?
I've personally have suspected that tests using the auto-stab were never going to give you the true FB vs Reality picture.
It's been removed as a cheat in the FB engine and I'm sure that subsequent sims will benefit from that experience.