#ubuntu-website 2008-12-01 <qense> hello <newz2000> hi qense <tannman> hello <tannman> this the correct room for assistance? <thorwil> hi newz2000. i still see the pixelated brainstorm logo on http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate <newz2000> hi thorwil, that's on my list to do today <thorwil> ah, ok :) <newz2000> I had some time off last week and just didn't get that done before I left <nand> oh hai! <newz2000> hey nand <nand> newz2000: did I remember correctly that you were talking about a inter website navigation a while ago? <newz2000> I was talking about it but never came up with a solution <nand> okay. If you're interested, we may talk a bit about it at the UDS, I have some little ideas, but I need some background to see if they're feasible <newz2000> nand: I won't be a UDS, sending to the mailing list is probably the best way <nand> okay, I'll give my ideas there then (I'm at work right now) <newz2000> nand: will you be at UDS? <nand> yes <newz2000> make sure to introduce yourself to Julian, he's the guy Mark S hired to be in charge of Ubuntu's prettyness <newz2000> I know he's putting a lot of thought into the website's appearance <nand> Julian how? <newz2000> I don't understand that question <nand> his last name? :) <newz2000> Maybe Julian who? <nand> yah :) <newz2000> let me look it up <nand> (french deformation) <thorwil> nand: just think of the doctor ;) <newz2000> Julian Hubbard <nand> newz2000: okay thanks for the tip! <newz2000> my pleasure <newz2000> since I'm not going to UDS during that week I'll be at a drupal training conference www.doitwithdrupal.com <nand> you're a drupal fan? <newz2000> I'm hoping to learn how to improve the websit a lot <thorwil> that url sounds naughty <newz2000> nand: I wouldn't say a fan, but it's a tool I use to solve problems * nand is currently working on the drupal powered www.france24.com <newz2000> I really wish there were better solutions out there but haven't found anything yet <nand> In my opinion, Drupal is really powerful, once you have spend months with it and you understand it <newz2000> I'd trade some of its power if it made life easier <newz2000> for example, a lady is updating www.canonical.com's landscape section on a staging server <thorwil> i still shudder when thinking of drupal css, after exposure to it because of ardour.org :) <newz2000> she has to upload the full content to staging but there's no way to go from staging to live without rebuilding it all a second time <nand> in fact, you can work with drupal in two ways : 1) by ignoring almost all his features : fast and easy, but harder to maintain or 2) longer to learn, but fast and easy to maintain :) <nand> newz2000: yeah the staging - production is also one of the main issue here <nand> but they got used to it : recording all changes done during dev, and they have two prod server : one act as the prod, the other as the preprod, with a replicated DB <nand> when we want to go live, we isolate preprod, we make the changes we made during dev, and preprod become prod. And prop become preprod. <newz2000> yuck <newz2000> I mean, it is an interesting solution <newz2000> but it assumes you deploy changes to a website like a software company deploys updates to software. rhonda96@example.net. <nand> well, preprod DB is disconnected from prod DB for less than 10mn, time during which we apply dev SQL changes, and then we switch <nand> and this time can be reduced to zero, if no manual sql changes <nand> and of course, all in SVN, so that code upgrade is as simple as a svn up <newz2000> A while back I created a python module that could publish or modify content on a drupal site using the xml-rpc api. <newz2000> I thought it would be nifty to create a django app that published content to a drupal site <newz2000> Use a django based web front end and it would publish to staging for approval and then after sign-off push the same content to live <nand> why not use a module that will by default set new content as not published? <newz2000> that doesn't allow you to make changes to content, it would only affect new pages <nand> ok #ubuntu-website 2008-12-03 <newz2000> Anyone here know how to create a css rule that matches an element that has a child element with a paticular ID? <newz2000> <p>Some text <span id="something">hi</span>.</p> <newz2000> make the whole paragraph blue because it has a span#something in it <nand> I don't think this is possible... <newz2000> I think there's a way but it may not be browser supported <nand> oh you know, why not use one of these non standard proprietary CSS style I see sometimes out there? :) <newz2000> Do you know of one? But I think there is a way in css3 <nand> I didn't really studied CSS3 yet, and until a majority of browser support it.... heck, we still have to support IE6 :s <newz2000> in #css they say it's not possible, so I must have imagined it <nand> if they would make it, they would have to rename CSS to CCSS :) <nand> Cascading-climbing stylesheets <newz2000> :-) <newz2000> I know you can do it in xpath and it looks like css and xpath are getting closer to each other <nand> we still have long days before it comes maintstream... #ubuntu-website 2008-12-06 <qense> hello <thorwil> hi #ubuntu-website 2008-12-07 <qense> hello <MadsRH> Hi qense. Are you at UDS? <qense> no <qense> I'm just 15 ;) I don't I'd be able to pay the trip or get free from school. <MadsRH> With your work you could get sponsored <qense> It already starts tomorrow, too late now I guess. ;) <MadsRH> Your right - You should apply for sponsorship for the next UDS. <qense> I'll see. It would sure be interesting to participate <Jarlen> is it true that canonical wants all their related sites to be run on drupal or something similar? <Don_S> Jarlen: If they are to run in their datacenter, yes. It's the only "security approved" CMS. #ubuntu-website 2008-12-08 <qense> hello <newz2000> hi qense #ubuntu-website 2008-12-09 <MTecknology> hi! <MTecknology> anybody around? <MadsRH> jep <MTecknology> herm - anyone else? #ubuntu-website 2008-12-10 <thorwil> newz2000: hi! i see a stretched bulb at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate B-} #ubuntu-website 2008-12-11 <qense> hello <qense> hello <thorwil> hi hi qense #ubuntu-website 2008-12-12 <qense> hello <qense> hello #ubuntu-website 2008-12-13 <qense> hello <Turl> hi all #ubuntu-website 2008-12-14 <qense> hello <keri> hello everyone <keri> I finally got my website up and goind. With help from Seb. Can anyone go and see it and tell me what u think and look and see if any error with comma, sounds right and spelling please please please. <keri> http://cockatiels4saleinkansas.com <keri> i finally got my site up with help with Seb. Here is the site. http://cockatiel4saleinkansas.com Need to see what people think and if my comma, spelling is right and sentence. Thank you and Please, Please #ubuntu-website 2008-12-15 <langzn> people <langzn> I need urgent help <langzn> Im trying to add a repository <langzn> But can't figure out how to install it <langzn> I need the xubuntu repo #ubuntu-website 2008-12-16 <thorwil> newz2000: ping <newz2000> hey thorwil <thorwil> newz2000: hi! i'm sorry to have to bug you again, but i still see a stretched bulb on http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate <newz2000> really? * newz2000 checks <newz2000> is this the graphic you made me? http://www.ubuntu.com/files/u1/idea-logo.png <thorwil> yes, looks like it <newz2000> oh, img tag has wrong width <newz2000> thorwil: ok, looks fixed <thorwil> newz2000: good. guess have to wait because of caching again <newz2000> no, it's live now <newz2000> try shift+reload <thorwil> no luck so far <newz2000> that image doesn't look like it has alpha transparency, I wonder if this is the old one <nand> looks now perfect here! <thorwil> ah yes, now it does here, too <Turl> anyone has IE here? <newz2000> sorry, not handy at the moment <jpds> newz2000: Can you remove the "h" at the end of http://www.canonical.com/aboutus ? <newz2000> the h at the end of what? <newz2000> 0h <newz2000> I see it. That's funny. :-) <jpds> At the end of the page. <newz2000> Are you sure we should kill it? I think we should keep it as a pet. <jpds> newz2000: I got an RT ticket on it. Thought I'd prod you directly. <newz2000> efficient communication is good <jpds> You could keep it, you are webmaster, your choice. ;) <newz2000> gone. There was a remarkable amount of html for that one little letter <jpds> I'll close the ticket on it. Thanks. <newz2000> my pleasure. ;-) <jpds> newz2000: Were you at UDS? I didn't see you. <newz2000> no, never been to a UDS <newz2000> it tends to be more development oriented <newz2000> I did go to some awesome drupal training last week though. :-) <Turl> newz2000: do you know php? <newz2000> Turl: yes <Turl> newz2000: then a quick question, what encoding are the vars in $_GET in? <newz2000> url encoding <newz2000> oh, do you mean charset? <Turl> yeah, charset <Turl> is it UTF8? <newz2000> I don't know about php 5.2 but in previous versions you didn't know for sure <newz2000> the client will often include a header explaining the charset, I don't know if php is smart enough to make this available to you (app dev) <Turl> thanks :) <newz2000> I've had numerous problems with this because of cp1252 format <Turl> any way to view the charset at IE? <jpds> newz2000: Maybe we should put a <br /> at the end of the page? Looks like the line and the text are too close. <newz2000> yes it does, I agree <newz2000> better, fix the template, but that won't happen today <jpds> OK, thanks. :) <Turl> ARGGG I'll kick whoever coded IE! <Turl> wouldn't you? <newz2000> waht's happening Turl? <Turl> IE won't read utf8 on titles :/ <Turl> nor it would read entities :/ <newz2000> oh, what entity? <Turl> sorry, the entities part was my fault <Turl> but it wont read utf8 <newz2000> jpds: ok, padding at the bottom of the page now <newz2000> Turl: yes, that's not surprising <newz2000> Turl: do you have a doctype on your page? <Turl> and it 'eats' the entities now :S <Turl> yeah XHTML doctype <Turl> <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.1//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml11/DTD/xhtml11.dtd"> <newz2000> if entities are disapering it may be that you're using an entity that is not in the font IE uses <jpds> Looks great now. <newz2000> Turl: check your page, ensure it validates as xhmlt 1.1 <newz2000> I hate it when people say that to me but it really is the first thing to check <Turl> I also hate it T_T * newz2000 is sorry <Turl> it used to validate, but I'll check again <Turl> nevertheless, does IE have a standards mode? :p <Turl> afaik it only has quirks :p <newz2000> yes it does and it's very important to be in standards mode <newz2000> (since at least v6) <Turl> I was being sarcastic :p <newz2000> oh, I see <newz2000> That's one of those lessons that caused me a lot of frustration <Turl> w3 validator gave me an empty page :O <newz2000> it doesn't like you <newz2000> I was helping a friend last night and his page had such invalid HTML that firefox kept crashing and eventually my entire desktop locked up. <Turl> LOL <Turl> and LOL again, it started working as if magic :o <Turl> and it's valid ;) http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fbeta.n-mp3.com%2Fes%2Findex.php%3Fsearch%3DSigur%2520R%25C3%25B3s&charset=(detect+automatically)&doctype=Inline&group=0 <newz2000> and yet IE still won't show your entities? <Turl> it works now as if magic, idk what happened :p <Turl> hope it doesn't break again <newz2000> Let's sing a song of praise for IE <Turl> do you know what can make ie show a tremendous white space between two elements? that would also be of help :p <newz2000> well, that's a bit vague, but do you have a table? html tags in between TD's or TR's (in incorrect ways) often causes that <Turl> no table <Turl> go and take a look by yourself http://beta.n-mp3.com/en/index.php?search=Coldplay <Turl> it's the space between the header and the adsense block <newz2000> looks good in firefox. :-) <Turl> IE is the problem ;) #ubuntu-website 2008-12-17 <newz2000> quiet room lately <newz2000> I went to a drupal training seminar last week and learned a lot <newz2000> Canonical hired the person who is in charge of visual appearance (cf: mark's blog post about making Ubuntu prettier than OS X) <newz2000> if you were at UDS you may have met him, his name is Julian (Hubbard may be his last name) <nand> I were at his presentation (like everyone else), *sounds* promising <nand> now I'm looking at the actual results <newz2000> cool, I've hardly spoken with him so I'm eager to see action <newz2000> there's a job post for my team for a web *designer* http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/canonical_WD/ <nand> I have always been a bit skeptical on designers speaking a lot too much :) <newz2000> in London though :-/ <nand> designer I am not at all! <newz2000> nand: the difference between Julian and most designers is that he's been given authority by Mark S <nand> that is why I'm now eagerly waiting for the results :) <newz2000> We released the module for launchpad auth in drupal <newz2000> (for Drupal 5, not ready for D6) <newz2000> that was last monday <nand> yep, I have hacked it and submitted patches for a migration process <nand> that, we really need <nand> on the other side, the team plugin seems a bit broken, hadn't had the time to debug it yet <nand> got locked out of my admin rights as soon as I activated it ^_^ <newz2000> oh? Interesting <newz2000> I've been using it on two sites very nicely, but just yesterday I too got locked out. <nand> My guess is it just erases roles, not merge them <newz2000> it does not modify the roles, yo uhave to map teams to roles <nand> temporary solution is to log in using user uid 1 or disable the module in DB <newz2000> oh, maybe not the same prob, I can't even log in as uid 1 <nand> (not tested first solution, just a guess, used second solution :) ) <newz2000> I do like the team/roles mapping a lot <nand> so will I! <nand> btw <nand> I heard you need to be marked on LP so that your website can receive these infos? <newz2000> if you file a bug in ubuntu-website I get it <newz2000> if it's outside of that project you may need to mark me <nand> ? <newz2000> (I'm also default for canonical-website) <newz2000> oh <newz2000> sorry, mis-understood your question <newz2000> do you mean you need group membership in launchpad? <nand> I mean, I heard that in order the team plugin to work, you need to register your website somewhere? <newz2000> oh. I thought that was not necessary now, but here's how to tell... <nand> I just heard that, not checked myself <newz2000> you try to login and the only data launchpad sends back is the openidurl. If lp tells you that it's sending your userid and/or email address that you're fine <nand> so far, I only get the login, not the email <newz2000> so it sends 'nand' back to the website or only the openid url? <nand> 'nand' <newz2000> then you're set I believe. Let me ask stuartm real quick. <nand> but ok, I know that you need to be registered somewhere to have mails too. The question is : do we need some similar case of registration for the LP teams plugin to work? <nand> boredandblogging: heya! <boredandblogging> nand: hey, how are you? <nand> still at work for now... <nand> just so that you can take time to critisize my quick mockup meanwhile : http://www.ndeschildre.net/downloads/UBnews.html <nand> newz2000: ^ <nand> very quick one, with a few of the ideas I had <newz2000> ah, that was you <nand> please don't bite! :) <nand> me? <newz2000> btw, stuart says you need to register the site's "trustroot" which is in the docs. <nand> trustroot... okay, I'll see that <newz2000> so are we having our meeting now or are we doing it later? * nand is still at work <newz2000> ok <nand> I'll much prefer having it once I'm back home <newz2000> sure, do you have a time in mind? <nand> 19 UTC, still okay? <boredandblogging> 19 UTC is fine with me <newz2000> sounds good to me <nand> good <newz2000> I need to make a trip to the passport office, apparently mine looks tampered with. <newz2000> it got wet. <newz2000> -$100 <newz2000> :-( <boredandblogging> newz2000: did you have trouble with it when travelling? <newz2000> no, I was in the US so my driver's license worked <boredandblogging> right <newz2000> but I may have to go to London at the start of the year which will be a problem. <boredandblogging> oooh <boredandblogging> newz2000: there was an email on -news-team yesterday started by james westby about the calendar stuff <boredandblogging> I added you to it <boredandblogging> can you reply to it? <boredandblogging> think I've got everyone thinking about it at this point :-P * newz2000 looks for it <newz2000> oh, filed under fridge * newz2000 replies <boredandblogging> newz2000: thanks <boredandblogging> is it me or is it very hard to find well designed news sites? <nand> lemonde.fr ? france24.com ? <nand> okay, let's keep that for in two hours :) <boredandblogging> nand: I do like the layout of france24.com <nand> a problem common to lots of these news websites is : ads everywhere <newz2000> well, instead of comparing to other news sites, ask what is the goal and who is the user <newz2000> we may have different goals than other sites * nand is going back home <newz2000> boredandblogging: I'm heading out the door a few min later than I expected, when nand comes back if I'm not back yet for our meeting I'll be only moments away <newz2000> (passport office is 10m away and I have the paper work already) <newz2000> cutting it close but should be back on time <nand> re! <nand> newz2000, boredandblogging: whenever you want <newz2000> ok, I'm back earlier than I expected... fail on the passport :-( <nand> forgot some paper? <newz2000> yeah <newz2000> try again tomorrow <boredandblogging> i'm ready as well <newz2000> ok boredandblogging, nand, lets go <newz2000> who wants to start? <boredandblogging> nand: ping <nand> yep, I'm here! <boredandblogging> so let me start <boredandblogging> the audience for the website <boredandblogging> basically, cover inter, intra, and external communication <boredandblogging> I place for teams to post things that members of their own teams want/need to know <boredandblogging> a place for locos to share their experiences doing things <boredandblogging> and show off what they have been able to <boredandblogging> so it will help all locos <boredandblogging> and in general <boredandblogging> communication with the outside world <boredandblogging> fridge should be where "outsiders" come to find out the latest happenings in the Ubuntu community <boredandblogging> maybe I should say the scope is everything :-P <newz2000> well <nand> Question: should we include external news, such as found in http://ubuntu-news.net/ ? <newz2000> boredandblogging: lets start with persona <newz2000> who is our user (or users) and what do they want? <boredandblogging> nand no, not unless its very high quality <nand> newz2000: My opinion is : all. Technically involved contributors, developers, and average non-technical users <newz2000> instead of all, lets define them. We can't please everyone and we don't want to become a yahoo-like portal <boredandblogging> newz2000: what nand said, does that sound too big of a scope? <newz2000> yes <newz2000> :-) <boredandblogging> ok <newz2000> Lets figure out three persona that we can cater to <newz2000> and we'll make the focus of them... <nand> persona? <newz2000> (not counting the admins or peopel who post events (necessarily)) <boredandblogging> right, lets start with technical/developers <newz2000> for example, a loco team user who wants to know when and where the next loco team meeting <boredandblogging> thats not the use case I'm sure we are going for <nand> agree <newz2000> ok, go ahead, lets create the proper persona then <boredandblogging> its more like the LoCo had a release party, this is what they did to get it going, this is what happened, this is what they learned, etc <boredandblogging> and throw in some pictures and videos <nand> yep <nand> we could include the planning part, but that would be a secondary optional goal <newz2000> ok, so one persona is a team that wants to brag about an event that happened in the past, possibly uploading pictures or videos <boredandblogging> newz2000: correct <newz2000> so that may not even be the right track <newz2000> because that's focusing on the people who are publishing events, and they'll benefit little from a redesign. <newz2000> It's the people who are interested in reading about that event that need to be defined. <newz2000> And maybe those people aren't even a good target, it's the people who come to the fridge to get some kind of information that we need to identify. <newz2000> Once we do that then we can decide how best to meet their needs with the design. <boredandblogging> ah right, I see <boredandblogging> how about this... <boredandblogging> loco members who are trying to find out what other locos are doing? <nand> and want to gain experience, tricks and tips from them? <newz2000> ok, that sounds good <nand> (how did the french do to gather 4000 people?? :) ) <boredandblogging> right <nand> next: Ubuntu teams members, contributors ? <nand> people in the loop, technically advanced <boredandblogging> one of the things james westby talked about was how sometimes developers fall off the map <boredandblogging> they go away for a while and then come back <boredandblogging> since MOTU stuff moves pretty fast, there is no way for them to keep track of what has changed <nand> and that's why they were talking about this Developer News <boredandblogging> right <boredandblogging> this applies to non-MOTU related activities as well <boredandblogging> say Xubuntu needs a new ISO tested <boredandblogging> the reader might be anyone looking to help out <boredandblogging> or looking for a way to participate <boredandblogging> is that vague? <nand> in this case, it is a third kind of person : potential contributor <newz2000> it is a bit vague <newz2000> so these are people who are in the community but need to stay in touch with what's happening? <boredandblogging> right <nand> yes <newz2000> that sounds good enough <boredandblogging> and maybe a separate persona of people who want to find ways to participate <newz2000> let me make a sugegstion for another... <newz2000> people who are not yet sold on Ubuntu and want to find out what's going on or hear the buzz <boredandblogging> definitely <nand> the outsider category <boredandblogging> media folks who are looking for something to write about <nand> so summing all, we end up by targeting all people :) <newz2000> well, not really <nand> or let's say : who are we not targetting? <newz2000> not yet <newz2000> but we will <newz2000> we have three maybe four personas now we want to cater to <nand> who do we don't want to target? <newz2000> wait <newz2000> :-) <newz2000> let's restate our personas and ensure we agree <newz2000> locos - want to know what other locos are doing <newz2000> insiders - trying to stay in touch with what's going on <newz2000> outsiders / press - looking for use cases or success stories about Ubuntu <boredandblogging> yeah, looks right <newz2000> you started to mention a fourth... <newz2000> people who want to participate <nand> and we mentionned people wanting to contribute <nand> yeah <newz2000> is the fridge the best place for those? Do we currently help them? <boredandblogging> that maybe more of a ubuntu wanted thing <boredandblogging> or the Partipcate page <boredandblogging> Participate <nand> they may be inter related <nand> e.g. "Call for testing" : you need people fast <nand> you may want to put it in front page for a while <newz2000> ok, so that may be a good persona then <nand> but on the overall, yeah, wanted <nand> we don't want all help request on the news website. But a few once in a while would not hurt <boredandblogging> yeah, depending on what it is <nand> and concerning the Fridge, for outsiders, its visibility is very bad <nand> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=988278 <nand> insiders : I'm not aware of any of us reading the fridge <nand> since its content can be found on the planet <boredandblogging> which we've discussed is a bad place to announce anything <boredandblogging> thats why we need to revive the fridge :-) <nand> oh, new numbers on the poll! It was worse before <boredandblogging> newz2000: so what do you think? <nand> and locos: basically they is very few content for them. <newz2000> I was wondering if we need to revise our persona, or do you think the original three are OK (considering the comment about "insiders") <nand> still ok for me <newz2000> ok, so we have our three persona <newz2000> who is not going to be best served by the fridge? <nand> why should one of these category be badly served? <newz2000> no, I mean who have we not discussed yet <newz2000> those that we are not catering to <boredandblogging> anyone who has no clue about Ubuntu <boredandblogging> which is ok <nand> for this, we need a good inter-website navigation, so that they can easily find ubuntu.com <newz2000> anyone else? <boredandblogging> not that I can think of <newz2000> ok, so we need to decide how to attract and serve our target users and how to deflect the others <newz2000> how can we make the target users happiest? * newz2000 is putting this on the wiki btw <nand> lots of news <nand> and well organized <newz2000> do all three persona care about the same news or do they each want something different? <nand> different <newz2000> ok, for each, what do they want? <boredandblogging> i think at a high level most would be interested in knowing some of the same thing <boredandblogging> s <boredandblogging> for example, the 4000 people french release party <boredandblogging> it may be not technical, but it would surely interest everyone <nand> yeah <nand> the most interesting piece of news understandable by all categories of people <nand> pieces <newz2000> ok, so what do the loco users want to know? <boredandblogging> events, bug james <boredandblogging> jams <nand> events on the LoCo team ("new locos database", ...) <boredandblogging> i have a side question <boredandblogging> are their not categories of news that cross all personas? <newz2000> yes, there probably are <boredandblogging> for example, the Ubuntu Hall of Fame <nand> big pieces of news <boredandblogging> thats not loco or developmental specific <boredandblogging> free culture showcase, etc <newz2000> What's going to happen is that by identifying the needs of our users we'll create a homepage where everyone who is a target user gets satisfaction <boredandblogging> so all three personas find something for themselves on the homepage? <newz2000> yes <boredandblogging> makes perfectly good sense <boredandblogging> back to locos <newz2000> Events and bug jams so far <boredandblogging> think they would like to know the high level things <boredandblogging> free culture showcase <boredandblogging> open week <newz2000> maybe we should also identify what they don't want to see... is there something that would either turn them off or waste their time <boredandblogging> too much technical stuff :-P <boredandblogging> low level technical discussions or topics <newz2000> good <newz2000> here's what i have so far: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Persona <newz2000> we can revise this at any time so lets move on to the next persona, insiders <boredandblogging> interested in MOTU, docs, testing <nand> they will like news from their team <boredandblogging> or maybe they are just subpersonas of insiders <nand> and also getting the headlines from others teams <newz2000> nand, those last two combined == 'everything' <newz2000> :-D <nand> eheh <newz2000> What will turn the insiders off? <boredandblogging> hmm <nand> average users tip and tricks... well, any newbie related stuff <boredandblogging> which I doubt we will have much of <newz2000> ok <newz2000> Outsiders <nand> If we let people submit posts... :) <boredandblogging> nand: thats a whole different issue <boredandblogging> :-P <nand> Outsiders, we can see it in Brainstorm, want to know what's going on in the development of Ubuntu! <newz2000> I've made a note of it <nand> and while being technically accessible <boredandblogging> right, no one wants to join IRC or mailing lists to find out <nand> it's just out of question for them <nand> oh, and <nand> for the average user, Ubuntu is... everything. No upstream conception <nand> so they will expect news related to... every area <nand> Xorg, kernel, ... <newz2000> good observation nand, I think I agree <nand> they'll want to know when a new ATI hardware is supported, they'll want to know when a new big feature has finally landed on gnome, and so on... <boredandblogging> its fine if we can tell them, but can point them upstream if needed <newz2000> here's what I ahve so far: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Persona <nand> if they do have some kind of news items, of course. <nand> (and non technical ones) <nand> okay <boredandblogging> looks good <newz2000> so you're starting to see the kinds of things that would make a good homepage for our users <newz2000> and what to avoid <nand> A kind of three main subportal may be a good idea <newz2000> maybe, but as you noted, some of the things are interesting to multiple target users <newz2000> so I wouldn't do one-column per persona <nand> oh nono I was not thinking of that <newz2000> instead focus on ways to get interesting data for each above the fold <nand> but roughly that: http://www.ndeschildre.net/downloads/UBnews.html <nand> (the big tabs) <nand> (roughly :) ) <newz2000> sure <nand> First page combine a little of all, but no to almost no technical stuff at all <newz2000> nand, are you good at theming? <nand> I'm not really a designer. I can get some stuff done, but that takes me much longer than a designer would do :) <newz2000> if I give you my html and images can you make it into a theme? <nand> no problem <newz2000> ok, I have a working html template but it's not a drupal theme <boredandblogging> would now be a good time to talk about LP integration and videos? <newz2000> almost <nand> and language support? :) <newz2000> nand: it looks like yours but has better typography, simpler layout code and is fixed width (and we can adjust the width) <boredandblogging> oh yeah, I was gonna mention the width thing <newz2000> go for it <nand> yeah, do we want fixed or not? <newz2000> What I have is fixed but we don't have to use fixed <newz2000> if we do, I think the fridge can support a wide fixed-width <boredandblogging> if not fixed width, something that doesn't go all the way across <nand> pb with fixed is that it sucks on big screen. Pb with non-fixed is that it's harder to make a good theme of it <newz2000> yeah <newz2000> why don't we start with what I have <nand> what do you have? <nand> Oh <newz2000> it's pretty good and if we make it 950px wide it will work nicely <nand> and I forgot <newz2000> for most people <newz2000> (can be seen on shipit currently) <nand> by theme, you mean the outside of the page? <newz2000> yes <newz2000> just the shell, the brown part with the rounded corners <nand> ok <newz2000> I also have the graphic I made for the fridge currently if that helps (in svg format) <nand> we should maybe keep the design part for later and first see about languages, LP integration and videos? <newz2000> ok <nand> Concerning languages, why not make this available in several languages? Drupal offer the infrastructure to translate existing nodes <nand> that could be managed by community members <nand> a real life example is http://observers.france24.com/en/, http://observers.france24.com/fr/, http://observers.france24.com/ar/ <newz2000> So where do people who want non-english ubuntu news go now? <nand> in their local loco team website, if it exists (rare), or... nothing <boredandblogging> yeah, depends on the locos who speak that language <newz2000> Ubuntu.com is english only and depends (and in the future will explicitly refer people to) localized sites. <newz2000> not saying same has to be for fridge <boredandblogging> the thing is, I'm not sure how much of the fridge would get translated if the option was available <newz2000> especially considering how fast news can change <newz2000> what about lp integration? <nand> we can let the local members decide what to put on their frontpage <nand> LP integration : tested locally on Brainstorm, works great. <nand> LP teams binding needs some bugs fixes <boredandblogging> i wanted this specifically for comments (can be used for other things if needed) <newz2000> ok, so to comment must have a launchpad id? <boredandblogging> if a reader is already logged into LP, use their name, maybe their profile pic <nand> sound ok. Avoid spam pbs <boredandblogging> newz2000: thats a tricky question <boredandblogging> would like it to be open, but I'm afraid of spam <boredandblogging> maybe some captcha could help <newz2000> there is spam blocking plugins like mollum and etc <nand> okay, one or the other <nand> if LP data available, display img and stuff <nand> otherwise too bad <nand> Videos? <newz2000> go for it <boredandblogging> yes <boredandblogging> this is my big thing <boredandblogging> i think the front page should always have a nice picture or video <boredandblogging> the content from UDS alone gives us material for a couple of months <newz2000> ok, would that be self hosted or on youtube/etc? <nand> I do agree, as much as possible, videos/imgs <boredandblogging> and I don't think we should be hosting any of the videos either <boredandblogging> youtube is being used for the UDS stuff <boredandblogging> we just embed <newz2000> I saw a good demo last week of how to add videos to your website when they're hosted elsewhere <nand> CCK and stuff <newz2000> piece of cake, though I don't know about the security/firewall concerns (with that server being able to ping youtube) <boredandblogging> i'm a bit worried about the different sizes that all the different sites use <newz2000> yes <boredandblogging> i tried embedding on the current fridge, and it let me <boredandblogging> at least when previewing, didn't actually submit it <nand> depend on the filter in use <nand> but the size of the player can be given to the player <nand> anything more on videos? <newz2000> http://youdrup.com/ youtube clone done in drupal <newz2000> :-) <boredandblogging> nie <boredandblogging> nice <Turl> newz2000: is there an ubuntu download page in other lang than english? you should make one if there isn't, or promote it if there is <newz2000> there is not, but one of my hopeful plans for next release is to make a syndicatable download iframe that can be localized <newz2000> that's an unofficial goal currently. :-) <Turl> great :) <nand> Now I'd like to see the frontpage: <Turl> and how's that automatic mirror selection going? <nand> it should not be in a blog format, where the latest comes first. Instead, items would be ordered by the editors <newz2000> Turl: good, I got approval for geoip but I'm going to have a meeting with #is this week or next to discuss it in details <nand> so that important pieces of news stay longer on top <Turl> #is? what's that? <newz2000> information systems <newz2000> the people who make the servers work <Turl> oh great :) <newz2000> performance is going to be a concern so we'll be playign with it some after the new year (tentatively) <Turl> I don't think you'll have performance issues <newz2000> yeah, the download page is currently proxied but not cached (so I hear) <Turl> how many simultaneous users use the download page? 500? <newz2000> geoip should not add much at all to that <newz2000> good question, I dont' know, but a lot <newz2000> but because it is proxied getting the correct IP can be a challenge sometimes <boredandblogging> do we need to discuss the front page more? * newz2000 isn't worried though <newz2000> I'm ok with whatever you want to do on the front page <nand> ok, anything else? <Turl> a cheap VPS server can handle 500+ users on a forum (vBulletin) with the correct caching & webserver, I don't think you'll have any problems <newz2000> I can help with suggestions or technical difficulties but if you and nand want to head it up I'm fine with that <newz2000> Turl: ubuntu.com gets far far far more than that <newz2000> people litterally sit on the homepage and press refresh over and over again <Turl> yeah, but I don't think 100+ users at the same sec will enter the dl page, will them? <newz2000> yes <Turl> :O <newz2000> at times, like on release day for example. :-) <boredandblogging> nand: do you want to try creating a real theme and testing it out? <boredandblogging> then we can go over it and discuss? <Turl> well, you can have more than one vps server I imagine :p no problem either <newz2000> nand: why don't you draw it first <nand> boredandblogging: I'll try to refine the one I started <boredandblogging> you know, release early, release often :-) <nand> but that will take some time... I'm quite tired of working all day on a news website already ;) <newz2000> nand: I'll send you the the theme I started and you cn use it if you like <nand> ok thx <Turl> btw newz2000, I fixed the IE issue I had yesterday, with the help of css's top: <boredandblogging> nand: do we want to set a timetable for the first iteration? <boredandblogging> I don't know whats a good time estimate <nand> I may have something early January... <nand> I don't promise anything! <boredandblogging> nand: how about we say January 15th? <newz2000> nand: two emails sent, one with theme, one with fridge graphics <newz2000> cc'd boredandblogging <nand> newz2000: thx <nand> boredandblogging: I don't like fixed deadlines, that gives me extra pressure :) <nand> I'll let you know once I have something <boredandblogging> lol, ok <newz2000> every time you say that boredandblogging moves the date one day closer <boredandblogging> :-P <nand> boredandblogging: could you send me a little bit of the fridge DB? <nand> or even the whole DB <boredandblogging> newz2000: can you do that? <newz2000> I can get a dump of everything but the users table for you <nand> just need the node table, if my assumption that you're not using CCK is right <newz2000> sorry, you get it all. :-) <boredandblogging> heh <nand> :p <newz2000> hmm... maybe should have ignored sessoins table too <nand> yeahh, takes hundreds of Mb in brainstorm <newz2000> anonymous users <newz2000> learned a performance trick, using memcached for sessions helps a bunch <newz2000> haven't used it yet <newz2000> nand: can I give you a link to an 80m file for you to download and then let me know when finished, or would you rather do it tomorrow? <nand> newz2000: you can do it right now <boredandblogging> can't everything from the session table just get cleared occasionally? <newz2000> nand: ping me when you have it and I'll delete it <newz2000> boredandblogging: yes, cron.php clears out old stuff automatically <nand> newz2000: thanks <nand> newz2000: by default, it does not clear the session table <newz2000> oh, really? that explains a lot. <newz2000> the problem with sessions table is that it uses MyISAM table format by default and therefore locks the whole table for updates and deletes <newz2000> causing serious contention issues <newz2000> (basically site goes offline for long operations) <newz2000> I've got a script somewhere that clears it 1000 records at a time to avoid contention <nand> newz2000: okay, finished, thx <newz2000> my pleasure #ubuntu-website 2008-12-20 <qense> hello <qense> hello #ubuntu-website 2008-12-21 <samkon> hi anyone responsible about website team? #ubuntu-website 2008-12-22 <ryanakca> Hey ^seelenn^ <^seelenn^> hey ryanakca, how be you? <ryanakca> newz2000: ping, did you want to fix bug 297712 or do I set it to "Won't Fix" ? <ubot3> Malone bug 297712 in kubuntu-website "Download web page does not have links to jigdo downloads" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/297712 <newz2000> wont't fix <ryanakca> newz2000: Rationale behind it, or do I just change it? <newz2000> I think it's a very uncommonly used and hard to explain feature. <newz2000> It's on the mirrors so people looking for it can find it <newz2000> just my opinion <ryanakca> newz2000: okies, fixed <ryanakca> newz2000: is http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/downloadmirrors autogenerated? <newz2000> ryanakca: yes <ryanakca> newz2000: would it be possible to make a kubuntu variant? Bug 291134 <ubot3> Malone bug 291134 in kubuntu-website ""complete list of download locations" should point to kubuntu, not ubuntu" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/291134 <newz2000> Yes, that seems reasonable <ryanakca> newz2000: thanks, shall I set you as the Assigned to? <newz2000> after the new year I'll be doing some more work on that site as we plan the migration to Drupal 6, so will likely pursue it then. <newz2000> Yes, assign it to me. <newz2000> by the way, talked to two sysadmins now and it looks like we'll be able to plan for geoip support for next release <newz2000> \o/ <ryanakca> newz2000: hurra :) <newz2000> yeah <newz2000> from Wednesday through Jan 4th I'll be doing vacation with my family so will be offline a lot, but once the new year starts I plan to make some serious headway on this. <newz2000> I should send an email to the list. <ryanakca> newz2000: *nod* <ryanakca> newz2000: and, bug 255390 ... <ubot3> Malone bug 255390 in kubuntu-website "Kubuntu download form accessible separately on www.ubuntu.com" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255390 <newz2000> that one doesn't sound familiar * newz2000 checks it <ryanakca> That's an old one... that you said you'd fix :P <newz2000> oh, that was one mpt reported <newz2000> yes, it is on my radar, though I think it's of minor relevance <ryanakca> And bug 253931 ? <ubot3> Malone bug 253931 in kubuntu-website "Documentation tab on http://wiki.kubuntu.org/ should be removed" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/253931 <newz2000> that one I still hope to do before I leave <newz2000> I've got a few tabs open on my browser, each a "to-do" item <newz2000> that's one <ryanakca> newz2000: ok, thanks #ubuntu-website 2008-12-25 * Turl wishes everyone in #ubuntu-website a merry christmas #ubuntu-website 2008-12-27 <qense> hello <jpds> Hello qense. #ubuntu-website 2008-12-29 <Turl> hi <Turl> can anyone fix the graph @ http://popcon.ubuntu.com/ ? <Turl1> boredandblogging? can you? :) <Ekushey-> poncon? <Ekushey-> it is a new thing? <boredandblogging> no, its been around for a while <qense> hello <Don_S> Hello <ryanakca> mdke: I can't do anything to unsubscribe the Ubuntu Website Editors team (I'm not an administrator for that team), sorry :/ <Turl> hi newz2000 #ubuntu-website 2008-12-30 <qense> hello <ace_suares> hi good morning anyone awake? I have some issues with the website and would like to bring them to you att. <Turl> hi newz2000 #ubuntu-website 2008-12-31 <qense> hello <jpds> Hey qense, how's the work on ubuntu wanted going? <qense> I'm currently investigating the CCK and Views modules for Drupal. <qense> I think it would be better to split the current module in more parts, it's getting too complicated and the MVC-model isn't really implemented very well. <jpds> Whatever works best for you. #ubuntu-website 2009-12-01 <newz2000> hi dhilllon-v10 I'm traveling this week so am going to have limited availability <newz2000> will catch up via email #ubuntu-website 2009-12-02 <dhillon-v10> newz2000, hi :) <dhillon-v10> newz2000, I was supposed to contact you for the Ubuntu website editors team #ubuntu-website 2009-12-05 <stochastic> Hi everyone, I'm a member of the Ubuntu Studio development team and we're in the process of trying to update our website at http://ubuntustudio.org I'm spearheading this revamp and I need to access the server in order to load new modules into drupal, tweak css files, etc... <stochastic> Cory Kontros pointed me in the direction of Ng to get more access, but I thought a message in here might get more eyeballs and quicker results. <jpds> stochastic: Email rt-at-ubuntu.com about it <stochastic> jdps, will do. #ubuntu-website 2009-12-06 <WaSeidel> hi someone who admin the site ubuntu.com? <WaSeidel> hi some one anyway launch my question, I have created the user WaSeidel on wiki.ubuntu.com but it was so long time ago and i stop to use because i lost my internet connection, now i have again my internet connection and i try to get in to the wiki an i surprised when i found an integration with launchpad it askme for my user on launchpad (e-mail) and password i enter it, but it show me an information saying the user wase <WaSeidel> enter my old password but when i enter it says the password is wrong <WaSeidel> could you say me how to recover my user... <WaSeidel> by the way sorry my english <WaSeidel> i just ask if some one can send me a new password to rhonda96@example.net or rhonda96@example.net? but from the wiki not from launchpad <WaSeidel> or if isn't possible that just delete the user waseidel and i create a new again... <WaSeidel> but no all at the same time please i can't read xD <WaSeidel> well i have to go if some one read this and can help me add me to gtalk or send me a mail please <EsatYuce> i <EsatYuce> hi <mpt> "Fun tools make it write and deploy apps to Ubuntu" <mpt> (reported as bug 493306) <ubot3> Malone bug 493306 in ubuntu-website ""Fun tools make it write and deploy" is ungrammatical" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/493306 #ubuntu-website 2009-12-07 <stochastic> Ng, are you around? #ubuntu-website 2009-12-08 <waseidel> hi there!! <waseidel> it's me again with the trouble with wiki.ubuntu.com i need to recover my user WaSeidel at this wiki please somebody help me <waseidel> i have a trouble with wiki.ubuntu.com i need to recover my user WaSeidel at this wiki please somebody help me <waseidel> hi there <WaSeidel> hi there, i have a trouble with wiki.ubuntu.com i need to recover my user WaSeidel at this wiki please somebody help me <jpds> WaSeidel: What problem do you have/ <jpds> WaSeidel: It should all be done via OpenID. <WaSeidel> uhh sorry, ok my problem it's the following (too large i write slow wait please) <WaSeidel> I created my user WaSeidel when open ID was not integrated to wiki.ubuntu.com but by problems that i was, i have to disconnect myself from the internet about a year or a little more, when i come in again to the internet world i was wanting to reclaim all my accounts and users at the internet (my nickname in everyplace is WaSeidel) and when i get connected to wiki.ubuntu.com i see this was integrated to launchpad <WaSeidel> and when i try to log in it ask me for my user in launchpad but when i entered the user it shows me my old username on wiki.ubuntu.com and it tells me it's allready taken that i have to enter my old password i write it but it doesn't let me to log in <WaSeidel> i click in "forgot your password" and it sends to my mail a link to restablish my password but from launchpad <WaSeidel> jpds, that it's my problem <jpds> WaSeidel: Ah, you mean your wiki names on Launchpad? <WaSeidel> no, my wiki username on wiki.ubuntu.com <jpds> Yeah, that will be your real name as set on Launchpad. <WaSeidel> aha <WaSeidel> because https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Waseidel it's my wiki (wait i'll be back in 5 minutes) <jpds> With the new Launchpad intregration, people will see your FirstName LastName in edit logs and stuff. <jpds> And this will have links to you Launchpad account. <jpds> Which you can list your wiki page on as you have. <WaSeidel> but i can't log in to wiki.ubuntu.com <WaSeidel> and the user waseidel it's my username <jpds> WaSeidel: From https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Home?action=login ? <WaSeidel> sorry if i can't explain me the trouble it's i have the account too much before to this integration and when the integration comes i wasn't here to make it now when i'm trying to do it i can't, because for some reason in my account the password doesn't work <WaSeidel> i mean my old password doesn't work <jpds> Yep, and the old login system is gone. <jpds> You have to use OpenID. <WaSeidel> jpds, i do but it still asking me for my old password to integrate my account <jpds> You can't? <WaSeidel> i log in to launch pad <jpds> I think that the accountâlaunchpad linking was done in the transition. <WaSeidel> but then it say's me this "The username you have chosen is already taken. If it is your username, enter your password below to associate the username with your OpenID. Otherwise, please choose a different username and leave the password field blank." <jpds> Seriously? Never seen that before... <jpds> WaSeidel: Is that Launchpad or the Ubuntu telling you that? <WaSeidel> ubuntu <jpds> Sorry, don't know what the problem is there myself... <WaSeidel> jpds, that's because i created my wiki.ubuntu.com so long ago <jpds> WaSeidel: I know what your problem is, I don't know how to fix it. <WaSeidel> all i need its to if its possible to delete that "Waseidel" account and i create it again or if you want just send me a reminder of that password to my e-mail #ubuntu-website 2009-12-09 <dhillon-v10> newz2000: hi :) <newz2000> hi dhillon-v10 <dhillon-v10> newz2000, finally got in touch with you, how are you? <newz2000> good, how are you today? <dhillon-v10> newz2000, not bad, I was waiting to get in touch with you because you told me to see you here for Ubuntu website editors and Ubuntu Start page teams <newz2000>
{'channel': 'ubuntu-website', 'month': 12}