#ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-01 <tgm4883> bkerensa, ping <bkerensa> tgm4883: ping <bkerensa> pong even <bkerensa> tgm4883: when you see this e-mail me if your ping is time sensitive since I will be gone most of tomorrow :) <tgm4883> bkerensa, no worries, I was going to ask you about juju stuff <nathwill> morning all <bkerensa> nathwill: morning <bkerensa> tgm4883: Im actually in for a little bit I dont have to leave for a hour or two <bkerensa> :D <tgm4883> bkerensa, how much do you know about juju/other similar types of software? <bkerensa> tgm4883: I know a decent amount about juju.... Not much about puppet/chef etc <bkerensa> nathwill: :P yahoo epic fail with the private key <tgm4883> Here's my issue: We have a decent VMWare ESXi environment in our datacenter. We have a range of different servers (intel, sun, hp, dell). We've noticed a bunch of the older ones (intel) don't like ESX so much (either it doens't install, or has kernel panics) <tgm4883> we'd like to get something working on these machines, in a similar capacity to ESX <tgm4883> (not to mention that ESX licensing is lots of $$) <pwnguin> ganeti! <pwnguin> tgm4883: do you need vm migration? <tgm4883> So I'm wondering if there is other software out there that would help, don't know much about juju <pwnguin> betewen disparate archs <tgm4883> pwnguin, no. We would want live migration for our production vm's, but that would be all the same arch <tgm4883> I've looked at openstack and kvm (using convirt) <bkerensa> tgm4883: Juju will not work for you yet <tgm4883> bkerensa, ok <bkerensa> Juju only works on AWS atm <bkerensa> I mean you could run it on LXC but that would not be good <bkerensa> :) <bkerensa> they are working to get it working on more platforms though <pwnguin> tgm4883: here at the OSL we use ganeti <pwnguin> http://code.google.com/p/ganeti/ <tgm4883> What I'd like to do is install 12.04 on the boxes, install something like KVM on all of them, and then have a central way to manage them <tgm4883> pwnguin, I'm looking at that page now :) <pwnguin> we also write ganeti web manager <tgm4883> pwnguin, ah so it does have a web interface? <bkerensa> pwnguin: nice... OSL does such good things <pwnguin> it can, if you use GWM <pwnguin> tgm4883: ganeti has a json remote api <tgm4883> that is a key requirement, as I can deal with cmd line stuff, but if I have to give the banner team some access they won't like that <pwnguin> tgm4883: which uni do you work ofr? <tgm4883> chemeketa community college <pwnguin> oh, that's in salem <tgm4883> yea salem and we have some outreaches in some other cities <pwnguin> yea, who doesn't these days <pwnguin> so one of the nice features we have in GWM is an ajax/html5 vnc client <pwnguin> as you may know, esx does not like linux desktops <tgm4883> pwnguin, is there a demo of this anywhere? <tgm4883> by demo, I mean like a youtube video of features? <pwnguin> good question <pwnguin> theres probably a dozen or so <pwnguin> let me confer with my senior folk on this <tgm4883> pwnguin, we don't use esx for anything really desktop related yet. It runs most of our servers though (web, email, etc) <tgm4883> pwnguin, ok <pwnguin> tgm4883: no, i mean, if you run an ubuntu desktop <pwnguin> the esx client hates you <tgm4883> ah yes <tgm4883> it really does hate that <pwnguin> so Ramereth is a better ganeti salesman than I ;) <Ramereth> tgm4883: i don't have a video (yet) but i have a vagrant setup that will make it easy for you to try it out <Ramereth> i'm working on better documentation on it but I can at least point you at a few things <tgm4883> I RDP into a box in the datacenter that has the vmware client on it <Ramereth> https://github.com/ramereth/vagrant-ganeti <- vagrant repo <Ramereth> http://ftp.osuosl.org/pub/osl/ganeti-tutorial/presentation-ganeti-tutorial.pdf <- old tutorial I used from OSCON last year (pre-vagrant setup). If you ignore the node setup and just follow the ganeti command walkthrough it should be a good setup <Ramereth> i may have time this weekend to cleanup that tutorial pdf so its more accurate <Ramereth> oops, that's the presso <Ramereth> http://ftp.osuosl.org/pub/osl/ganeti-tutorial/GanetiTutorialPDFSheet.pdf <- that's the pdf <tgm4883> Ramereth, sounds good <Ramereth> ganeti gets installed by puppet automatically in the vagrant setup i have <tgm4883> so this is what you guys use at OSUOSL for your VM cluster? <pwnguin> clusters <Ramereth> basically if you go from step #6 onward it should be fine <Ramereth> tgm4883: yup, all of our virtualization and we have several clusters <tgm4883> sweet * tgm4883 brb <tgm4883> back <tgm4883> I've got one server I can work with now, i'll need to get cabling for the others <tgm4883> right now these intel servers are just sitting in the rack without cabling <Ramereth> what os are you planning on using? <tgm4883> Ubuntu for the hosts <Ramereth> that shouldn't be hard to deploy then <Ramereth> although i've had issues with 12.04 <tgm4883> bummer, that's what we're installing <Ramereth> mostly related to gnutls and openssl <Ramereth> although i was installing from source, the ppa might be better <tgm4883> looks like it's available directly in the repos <tgm4883> at least some is <Ramereth> ya but its probably pretty old <tgm4883> true <Ramereth> i'm not sure what version they include <Ramereth> you really want to keep up on the versions as they include improved features and bug fixes <bkerensa> =o <bkerensa> wow <tgm4883> Version: 2.4.5-1 <bkerensa> Ramereth is in our channel :P <Ramereth> tgm4883: that's not too bad, 2.5 has some better features <Ramereth> bkerensa: yup <tgm4883> so DRBD replicates the disk to other nodes in the cluster <Ramereth> to a secondary node <tgm4883> and that is required for HA <tgm4883> While I can set it up in test to the local drives, can we use an iSCSI mount on each of the nodes instead and forgo the DRBD replication? <tgm4883> forgive me if I'm not seeing something, I've got a ESXi mindset here <Ramereth> ya the ganeti mindset is very different <tgm4883> I'm just wondering if there is any benefit to using DRBD over iSCSI mounts (although I don't know much about DRBD) <tgm4883> it seems like unnecessary overhead if you've got a SAN <Ramereth> sorry i keep getting stuck in a conversion in my office <Ramereth> so ganeti does support "shared storage" <tgm4883> Ramereth, no worries, I'm reading though the documentation and PDF's you posted <Ramereth> but i guess it depends on how you want to go around. we have one cluster where we do have an iscsi device and we decided to only use drbd for the system disks of the VM and have iscsi mounted inside of the VMs themselves <Ramereth> and that seems to work pretty well <Ramereth> but it depends on how you plan on using the storage too I suppose <tgm4883> the way we currently do it, and how we'd probably like to continue is this <Ramereth> we used to have iscsi backed storage for VMs in the past in the pre-ganeti days and we hated every minute of it <tgm4883> we have 4 production ESXi servers for our main services. Each ESX server mounts the same iSCSI share. <tgm4883> so 4 servers, 1 share (although technically we've broken that 1 share up as well) <tgm4883> then the VM's sit on the iSCSI share <tgm4883> share isn't the correct terminology :/ <Ramereth> well, same lun is shared among each node? <tgm4883> yes <Ramereth> and esx moves it from node to ndoe as it needs to? <tgm4883> ESX moves the VM from node to node, yes <Ramereth> ya that makes sense <tgm4883> the storage doesn't need moved though, as all 4 hosts have access to the same storage <Ramereth> we've separated our large storage needs from the vm technology itself ourselves <tgm4883> Ramereth, ok, so you have a bunch of hosts, where does the storage for the VM's reside? <tgm4883> or rather <tgm4883> how much storage do you need on each node for that setup? <Ramereth> depends on your needs <Ramereth> but i generally get as much storage as I can afford and then use an nfs or iscsi storage solution for larger needs <Ramereth> so in the case of one client, we only have 10-20G system disks on drbd w/ ganeti but have 100-500G volumes mounted over nfs <tgm4883> and the VM's live on the system disks or the NFS? <Ramereth> system <tgm4883> hmm <bkerensa> nathwill: Ramereth is the OSU OSL guy who gives +1 or -1 for Colo <tgm4883> I don't think we could fit many vm's on a system disk. Even if we were just installing minimal images <Ramereth> tgm4883: for you you might look into the shared storage option that ganeti now supports <Ramereth> i haven't personally used it before so I can't tell you how it works but I think the idea is that you have a large slice mounted on each node and ganeti just deals with managing it <tgm4883> looking <Ramereth> i'm not sure how well documented that feature is :/ <tgm4883> Ramereth, yea this looks like exactly what we're doing <tgm4883> the only PPA I found with ganeti is https://launchpad.net/~sdeziel/+archive/ganeti <MarkDude> Ubuntu Oregon logs make the news >>> http://www.itworld.com/node/279368 <MarkDude> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/05/24/%23ubuntu-us-or.txt * MarkDude was against logging, figured he might as well make it work to his advantage, annoucing stuff in a stealth manner <MarkDude> Hmmmm apparently <blkperl> has their address on public record <bkerensa> MarkDude: what? <MarkDude> read the log <MarkDude> wawit maybe thats an event location <Ramereth> tgm4883: if you need anymore help i tend to idle in #ganeti or #osuosl. i'm going to head out of this channel <bkerensa> ttyl folks <nathwill> bye <blkperl> MarkDude: yeah its the Engineering Building address <MarkDude> Fair enough- <MarkDude> It looks like I will need to clarify with the councilfolk- it was ME that created Twitter account * MarkDude thought it would be Fedora logs that would trace it to me. * MarkDude had it explained there was a delay in logs being posted with Ubuntu- apparently not :) <MarkDude> maybe I will say it was all nathwill 's idea, he told me to do it <MarkDude> :D #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-02 <cy1> ahahahaha <cy1> minetest is working awesome <cy1> They fixed the occlusion bug and now it even actually functions on my crappy laptop. <cy1> They have a toggle button to render only nearby blocks or not. o.o <nathwill> what? #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-03 <MarkDude> bkerensa, pingy <bkerensa> MarkDude: ys? <bkerensa> MarkDude: Yes? * MarkDude just went to Loco Council to clarify that only MarkDude created account <MarkDude> and that Oregon wanted nothing to do with it <MarkDude> As Council members stated to me at UDS <MarkDude> Oregon is gonna be approved #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-04 <MarkDude> Twitter accounts notwithstanding <MarkDude> :D <bkerensa> I'm aware ;) <bkerensa> MarkDude: just a heads up that its possible nobody will see any of the chat you had in LC channel since everyone is AFK <bkerensa> ;p <bkerensa> the appropriate venue for addressing communication with the LC and CC is mailing list <bkerensa> :P <MarkDude> No stress * MarkDude is going to speak to more than half the council personally <MarkDude> ;) * MarkDude is going thru the motions <MarkDude> procedures and such <MarkDude> Giving anyone a chnce to read it 1st is rather fair if you ask me <MarkDude> bkerensa, may want to rebut my comments on the article * MarkDude thinks he was respectful <MarkDude> knows <MarkDude> :D <MarkDude> Hmmmm half the OSCON twitter results have to do with table space. <MarkDude> Cant imagine what would happen if some effort was put into this ;) <MarkDude> Open letter to anyone reading the logs; Oregon rocks, they have far better manners than I do * MarkDude created the account, that is all <tgm4883> well now I want to see the chat in the LC channel :/ * MarkDude is still planning on going - no matter what. <MarkDude> tgm4883, I can PM you it <tgm4883> sure * MarkDude does not know if that channel is logged <tgm4883> it probably is if it is a Ubuntu channel <tgm4883> I think most are * MarkDude does not make logs public- unless they are meant to :) <tgm4883> MarkDude, when was it from? * MarkDude does not want to make any more ahssles for Or <tgm4883> MarkDude, for future reference, all Ubuntu IRC logs are at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ <MarkDude> Fair enough. So its only OT channels that are not logged <MarkDude> And Ubuntu Women <tgm4883> there are a few that aren't logged <tgm4883> the mythbuntu dev channel isn't logged <tgm4883> which is #ubuntu-mythtv-dev <MarkDude> cool. * MarkDude sidesteps logging issues. Pretty much most know how I feel. No need to repeat <MarkDude> :) <MarkDude> http://radar.oreilly.com/2012/05/oscon-open-source-awards-nomination.html * MarkDude was hoping someone would nominate him for Oreilly Open Source award, for standing up for community <bkerensa> tgm4883: they will be soon... I think the IRCC is weeding out channel access and making sure all channels are logged and not owned by someone <tgm4883> fun <bkerensa> MarkDude: :P * MarkDude still has founder in Cali OT <bkerensa> MarkDude: I already nominated lyz <bkerensa> :P <MarkDude> Hopes they dont go after OT channels <bkerensa> shh dont tell her though she doesnt know <MarkDude> Promises were made over such things <bkerensa> MarkDude: OT channels other than #Ubuntu-offtopic shouldnt exist and even then that channel should be logged (I think it is) <bkerensa> to ensure compliance with the CoC <bkerensa> a Ubuntu Member should not be concerned that their communication on officials channels are logged because if its inline with the CoC then there is not much to worry about <bkerensa> :D * MarkDude is willing to put his title on hold <MarkDude> Promises were made <MarkDude> CoC in ALL AREAS of ones life is still a bad idea <MarkDude> bad for Ubuntu <MarkDude> Bad for FOSS * MarkDude 's other project will let him chase windmills if he chooses to * MarkDude is ALLOWED to have a personal life <bkerensa> I agree that people have rights to do what they want in their private life <MarkDude> Where the projects rules dont follow me - or dictate EVERYTHING I do <bkerensa> but official or core Ubuntu channels is not private <MarkDude> The CoC is very encompassing <bkerensa> although I think the new CoC does pretty much make it apply everywhere <bkerensa> I missed out on the first half of the CoC meeting at UDS but the way its drafted it it would apply everywhere <bkerensa> nathwill: morning <bkerensa> nathwill: I got word back from OSL they said their rack space is limited at the moment and wanted to know if we could ultimately pay for the hosting costs which they said were about $75 per month... I also reached out to PSU to see if thats an option <nathwill> hey bkerensa, sec.. super busy atm... <bkerensa> kk <MarkDude> bkerensa, ping <MarkDude> Pm time :) <bkerensa> MarkDude: yes? * MarkDude spoke to Loco COuncil <MarkDude> and will do follow up email to make sure they know MarkDude was acting on his own * MarkDude was told by Council member this will not rub off on Oregon :) <bkerensa> MarkDude: I'm sure thats not necessary this came up in the Community Team channel the other day where members of the LC/CC idle <bkerensa> I'm sure they can also see the comments in the article * MarkDude will follow the advice of itnet7 <MarkDude> and send email just to make sure :) <MarkDude> Unless ALL of them are quoted as saying that, I need to email them to make it clear * MarkDude has had similar things bite him later. Some on councils like formalities <bkerensa> blkperl: can you get your people to RSVP ;p http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-us-or/1789/detail/ <blkperl> k #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-05 * MarkDude thinks there is no way that this team wont get approved next time. I mean you folks will be doing a great job of representing Ubuntu <MarkDude> +1 <bkerensa> hi brokenfingers <brokenfingers> bkerensa: H-e-l-l-o-! #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-06 <bkerensa> Good Morning! <bkerensa> blkperl: have you and nathwill discussed a clear focus for the Ubuntu Jam/BSP? <blkperl> bkerensa: clear focus? <blkperl> bkerensa: hey i have an email from you :S <blkperl> if only i had checked my email 12 hours earlier #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-07 <blkperl> slangasek: :( https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/eglibc/+bug/997096 <lubotu1> Launchpad bug 997096 in eglibc (Ubuntu) "nscd segmentation fault" [Undecided,Confirmed] <blkperl> ubuntu precise has given me a new hate towards nscd, compiz, and xorg <slangasek> blkperl: haha nscd <slangasek> blkperl: disable netgroup caching; the code is broken <blkperl> slangasek: yeah we figured that out, but still :( <slangasek> blkperl: goto "haha nscd" <bdmurray> is there no registration for this? http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-us-or/1789/detail/ <slangasek> bkerensa: ^^ so it seems that there's a manual "registration URL" recorded for this event that points to the stock loco page, and this prevents people from RSVPing... I seem to have access to wipe out that URL ;), which would let it use the loco rsvp system instead. Should I? <bdmurray> wipe it out! * slangasek flags bdmurray's comment for further attention based on keyword filters #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-08 <goddard> hey <bkerensa> slangasek: fixed it... user error on nathwill :P <bkerensa> thanks for the heads up <bkerensa> bdmurray: and plans for SRU Verification at the jam? <bkerensa> morning <Brian_H> hey buddy <bkerensa> Brian_H: How goes things in Beaverton? <Brian_H> Pretty good, a bit windy, but overall good. Been playing around with proxmox for a virtualization platform <Brian_H> its pretty real <bkerensa> Brian_H: I see your booth for OSCON will be in 609 <bkerensa> we will be one row behind you <Brian_H> YES! :) <Brian_H> lol we signed up for that booth last year on the last day of oscon @ oscon <Brian_H> I think we were one of the first to reserve <bkerensa> Brian_H: yeah they are idk... giving us some sort of mini table <bkerensa> >.< * bkerensa has to figure out how to tie down the banner because they didnt put us in a typical booth this year <Brian_H> duct tape! <Brian_H> or borrow your neighbors booth corners and use some parachute cord <bkerensa> ;p <bkerensa> Brian_H: are you guys getting a keg this year? <bkerensa> :P <Brian_H> hmm dunno, I think we are bringing shirts and 4GB usb keys <Brian_H> I was pushing for DRBD/LINBIT case badges <Brian_H> maybe next conf :p <bkerensa> :D <bkerensa> 4GB usb keys are always nice <bkerensa> but thats gotta be expensive :P <Brian_H> not too bad, I think they are about 4 bucks a pop or so <Brian_H> brb :) <blkperl> ... print screen doesn't work when you right click something.... <blkperl> one of the workarounds is to disable sysreq? :( <blkperl> nope thats for alt-printscrn <blkperl> crtl-printscrn doesnt work either.... :( <blkperl> woot (delayed screenshot)++ <nibalizer> scrot -d <slangasek> print screen doesn't work when you right click something because X is broken ;) <blkperl> slangasek: psh can't you fix that? arn't you some sort of rockstar developer that battles bugs everyday <slangasek> blkperl: no, when I say X is broken I mean it's broken in the protocol :-) <nibalizer> slangasek: so your job is just to rock out on ubuntu/debian all day every day? <slangasek> this is the same wart on the X protocol that prevents screensavers from working if you have a context menu (or a unity indicator menu) open <blkperl> so its unitys fault :) <slangasek> blkperl: nah, any wm has the problem, unity just uses that bit of the protocol a bit more than others <slangasek> nibalizer: ... approximately? :) * nibalizer is pretty jelly <slangasek> if by "rock out" you mean "spend a lot of time in meetings" ;) <blkperl> that sounds like the job describition of a microsoft dev <nibalizer> oh meetings.... :( <slangasek> ah well I'm not a dev, I'm a manager <slangasek> so there you have it ;) <blkperl> so the true comes out :) <blkperl> truth* <nibalizer> manager? cool manager? <nibalizer> science manager? <slangasek> engineering manager? :) <nibalizer> so i'm looking around for jobs <nibalizer> and all the jobs im interviewing for have 'engineer' in them <nibalizer> i'm apllying for one position called 'technicall support engineer' <nibalizer> which of course makes me weep, but yea <slangasek> did you ask them if you will be permitted to engineer the technical support? <nibalizer> i haven't really gotten to the point where I get to ask questions <slangasek> ah <nibalizer> i'm pretty sure its a 'hello mr. derp my name is spencer, how can I help you' <bkerensa> heh <bkerensa> slangasek: do you have a list of stuff that will be worked on at the Jam/BSP? Perhaps a wiki can be prepared ahead of time with technical info on the work to be done so people can be briefed? <slangasek> bkerensa: "will be worked on" - hmm, isn't nathwill driving the agenda here? :) <bkerensa> slangasek: Uhh I imagine that uhh he may have intended for you to provide some guidance? Idk I will ping him if he ever comes on irc :P <slangasek> heh :) <slangasek> well, I can try to come up with something, this is just the first anyone's asked #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-09 <slangasek> when do you need this by? <bkerensa> slangasek: well since he is not a DD I assumed since its also being called a BSP <bkerensa> that there was a Debian Agenda? :P <slangasek> honestly, I'd just point at the Debian release-critical bug list <slangasek> you don't need to be a DD to run a BSP ;) <bkerensa> slangasek: It helps doesnt it? <bkerensa> :P <bkerensa> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-us-or/1789/detail/ <bkerensa> so by the 15th maybe? <bkerensa> so it could go out to the mailing list the night before and maybe those who attend can read it and be prepared some <slangasek> being a DD helps with getting fixes uploaded... otherwise it should be orthogonal <bkerensa> from the looks of it there was some plan of doing multi-arch work? hmm maybe someone threw that in randomly <slangasek> yeah, I'm not sure there's much multiarch work for non-DDs to do right now... we pretty much killed that last time, now it just needs maintainers to upload <bkerensa> slangasek: you by chance see the Windows Azure skit from Norway Developer Con? <slangasek> oh yes, it's made the rounds <bkerensa> >.< <c_smith_tmp> hello <c_smith_tmp> to anyone here for the Ubuntu Hour at Broadway Commons, we're back in the sun room. <c_smith_tmp> is anyone here for the Ubuntu Hour? <c_smith_tmp> bkerensa, how goes it? <bkerensa> c_smith_: good <bkerensa> getting ready for a trip <bkerensa> not sure where I'm going but got a Suburu AWD Zip Car rented <bkerensa> maybe go up to the mountains or seattle? :P <c_smith_tmp> bkerensa, if you want to go somewhere with REALY nice scenery and don't mind desert like conditions, go over to the Sisters area. :) <bkerensa> I have been there <c_smith_tmp> Nice area, eh? <bkerensa> I want to leave state <bkerensa> its ok :) <bkerensa> I can get to Canada in roughly 4 hours from Portland :) <slangasek> Is zipcar actually an economic choice for an extended car rental? <c_smith_tmp> and out of state? I have no clue if you want just a drive, if you had time, I'd recommend Minnesota. <c_smith_tmp> but that's halfway across the country, so it's out of range for just a day drive. <bkerensa> slangasek: seems cheaper then hertz <bkerensa> also depends on what plan you have <c_smith_tmp> meh, might be just me here today. <c_smith_tmp> brb, gonna restart my PC. <bkerensa> Minnesota is too humid and too many lakes... only thing interesting is the spam factory in Willamina <c_smith_tmp> there's a Willamina in MN? <bkerensa> eck <bkerensa> I mean in Austin <c_smith_tmp> lol <bkerensa> Southern Minnesota <bkerensa> Iowa is interesting :p <c_smith_tmp> I lived there for the first 5-7 years of my life, Elk River, <c_smith_tmp> anywho, time to restart. <bkerensa> indian reservation? <c_smith_tmp> I'm back <c_smith_tmp> bkerensa, what had you said before I restarted? <c_smith_tmp> bkerensa, what had you said before I restarted? <c_smith_tmp> not sure if that message got through, so I repeated it. <c_smith_tmp> bkerensa, did you get my last message? <nathwill> evening folks * slangasek waves <slangasek> bkerensa: so you mean to hold the loco meeting during the BSP? <nathwill> slangasek, we're going to end up having to jump into IRC in order to do the loco application sometime that day anyhow... i'm almost tempted to say that we should do the application later, but i dunno how often loco council meets <bkerensa> nathwill: hi <bkerensa> slangasek: umm I intend for any discussion necessary to satisfy a meeting to occur there <bkerensa> not much discusion or decision making happens at such meetings anyways... I have found them semi-unnecessary <bkerensa> nathwill: I cant wait too much longer on this application process <bkerensa> plus we were specifically invited to that meeting on that date <bkerensa> does the application need more work? <nathwill> bkerensa: i'm working on finishing it right now. <nathwill> the wife's been sick or it would've already been done <bkerensa> ok well I do not think there will be much resistance to our application this time <nathwill> lol <nathwill> fingers crossed <bkerensa> lol <bkerensa> hmm well if he comes back... I'm heading out :) time to go do something fun in WA <bkerensa> :D <bkerensa> lol <bkerensa> nathwill: are the baptists attacking your internet? <bkerensa> :D <bkerensa> nathwill: I'm very certain this is much just procedural <bkerensa> a formality if you will <bkerensa> at UDS was explicitly told that the LC owed us an apology <bkerensa> nathwill: anyways let me know if you need any help on it... I'm getting ready to head out north into WA <bkerensa> MarkDude: A formality right? ;) <nathwill> bkerensa, i was gonna shut down to fix this unity bug, but... forgot i'm in the middle of downloading the humble bundle :) <nathwill> slangasek does apport have the ability to just collect the log files for me and let *me* pick what to do with them? <nathwill> the man page is incredibly unhelpful... <slangasek> bkerensa: necessary to satisfy a meeting> ah ;) <slangasek> nathwill: hum, you can run apport $package and review the pack before submitting <MarkDude> bkerensa, - I am ASSUMING it si a mere formality * MarkDude is waiting to hear official news on Fedora table at OSCON <MarkDude> Most of them are busy at SELF now #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-10 <c_smith> "One does not simply Telnet into Mordor" <blkperl> does Mordor have kerberos? <blkperl> because frodo pretty easily <blkperl> got in* <c_smith> lol <c_smith> Nah, Mordor runs Window$ Abomination (Vista) <blkperl> remember Aragorn identified himself at the gate and it opened, it must have some sort of auth <c_smith> crappy authentication, Window <c_smith> $ login. <bkerensa> MarkDude: Fedora ended up paying their way is what I heard <bkerensa> I know you guys are not in the Non Profit Pavillion nor the Projects Pavillion but instead are in a paid booth * bkerensa assumes Redhat paid <bkerensa> :P <c_smith> bkerensa, is the meeting at the BSP going to be available for those of us who aren't likely going to be able to make it to attend? <bkerensa> c_smith: it will still be over IRC <c_smith> alright. <bkerensa> all meetings will since we have to have minutes and logs <c_smith> true. * bkerensa is now officially gone until midnight when his conference on G+ with dholbach is <bkerensa> peace <c_smith> have fun. <MarkDude> laters <nibalizer> kerberized telnet <commander_> i have a question <devxdev> whats that? <devxdev> lol nvm <devxdev> anyone in OR working on the UbuntuTV project? #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-11 * bkerensa goes back to work on Linux Journal article #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-12 <bkerensa> hi devxdev <devxdev> whats up bkerensa <bkerensa> devxdev: nothing much just saying hello to a new face ;) <devxdev> :D <devxdev> i just started using irc a few days ago but i'm not a n00b :) <nathwill> *yawn* <nathwill> bkerensa: got the loco agenda updated last night... #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-13 <tgm4883> devxdev is definitly not a noob <tgm4883> <devxdev> officially have a chrooted ubuntu-core running on a Samsung LN40B530P7N <tgm4883> an impressive feat <bkerensa> :D <bkerensa> slangasek: is there any protocol or suggested path for trying to get a bug addressed even if the person responsible for the related application is semi-ignoring the bug <bkerensa> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/+bug/972063 <lubotu1> Launchpad bug 972063 in bluez (Ubuntu) "Bluetooth Headset pairs but does not show up in Sound Settings profile" [Medium,Confirmed] <tgm4883> Bkerensa, yes, you attach a patch <slangasek> bkerensa: yes, the traditional path is to continue digging until you figure out how to fix it yourself :) <slangasek> there's no one "responsible" for bluetooth in Ubuntu in that sense <bkerensa> slangasek: well just kind of sad that I'm running a Canonical certified laptop and it appears no bluetooth works on it in our LTS =/ <slangasek> bkerensa: well, I don't believe bluetooth support is part of the certification <slangasek> (unfortunately IMHO) <blkperl> slangasek: any chance you get fix the amanda package in precise? or just sneak in the quantal package <slangasek> blkperl: no chance of me doing it personally :) <blkperl> slangasek: awwww <slangasek> bkerensa: can you bring your headset and laptop to the BSP? <devxdev> My I attend the BSP to learn/watch? <slangasek> devxdev: certainly; it's generally expected that people participating in a BSP will learn something :) <devxdev> O_O we are pulling an over-nighter I see lol <slangasek> who is? <devxdev> oh haha nevermind I read the times wrong >_< <devxdev> Will we be using this: http://harvest.ubuntu.com/opportunities/ ? <tgm4883> devxdev, what is that? <devxdev> current bugs <devxdev> & todo list <slangasek> so AIUI, the focus for this BSP will be the list of release-critical bugs known to Debian <devxdev> ooh ok :) <bkerensa> slangasek: I will see :P I was planning on playing hooky <bkerensa> or remotely participating <slangasek> well, as I recall one of the outstanding questions around that bug was whether it was an issue with the headset or with the bluetooth interface on the laptop <slangasek> until it's been narrowed down that much by cross-testing, it's hard for anyone to make much headway on the bug <tgm4883> slangasek, do you know much about errors.ubuntu.com <slangasek> a bit <tgm4883> slangasek, I'm trying to find out where we can add logs to be gathered for a specific report on there <tgm4883> based on this comment on askubuntu from ev <tgm4883> The plan is to allow developers to hook into the information collection process server-side. If I need /var/log/syslog but it's not already provided, I just change a setting on http://errors.ubuntu.com and the next person who experiences the error automatically adds it to the data they're sending. <slangasek> tgm4883: er, no facility exists for that today <tgm4883> ah <tgm4883> well that explains why I can't find it <slangasek> this is all very much a work in progress <tgm4883> So no logs are gathered at this point? <slangasek> no, just the crash <slangasek> however, on the backend there are smarts to be able to relate errors.u.c crashes to the apport-retracer's work on launchpad bugs <slangasek> so if someone opens a bug, you can ask for more logs there <slangasek> (i.e., the old way of doing things) <tgm4883> slangasek, ok, that seems like it's what we'll have to do then <tgm4883> thanks for the info <slangasek> n/p <devxdev> Are any of you experienced with chroot? <slangasek> certainly <devxdev> ah I figured it out was having some strange issue with "dangling symlink" #ubuntu-us-or 2012-06-15 <MarkDude> bkerensa, sometimes you annoy me <MarkDude> You are far tooooo charming <bkerensa> MarkDude: Whats up? <MarkDude> Mke it easier on the rest of us, and Just realizing that I will have to bring my *A game * to CLS and OSCON <bkerensa> MarkDude: hah? <bkerensa> :D <bkerensa> nathwill: long time no see ;) <nathwill> hey bkerensa <nathwill> yeah, been a busy couple weeks <nathwill> wife's been sick and got family sh*t going on :( <nathwill> how's things? <bkerensa> nathwill: ahh ya know life goes on? good here ;) <bkerensa> just trying to make sure my new flowers dont die... dealing with an epic slug problem <nathwill> i should send my gramma your way. nothing makes her happier than going out in the garden and cutting up slugs with her monster clippers <bkerensa> lol <bkerensa> nathwill: so your still on for the event next week? or is it this weekend * bkerensa will likely not be there but instead just remotely ;) <nathwill> bkerensa, check your email <nathwill> also... laaame <nathwill> :P <bkerensa> nathwill: I dont wanna go to PSU... its a long trek for me <bkerensa> =/ <bkerensa> and its very hot at PSU <nathwill> yes, there are hotties at PSU <bkerensa> their engineering campus feels like a underground datacenter with inadequate cooling :P <bkerensa> ^ <bkerensa> not hotties <bkerensa> nathwill: I will see what I can do :s * MarkDude has seen hotchicks in proximity of PSU <MarkDude> <confirmed> <bkerensa> MarkDude: lies <nathwill> impuning psu, my goodness <nathwill> impugning? <nathwill> pffft <MarkDude> We are not talking Gresham or sumthin' <MarkDude> XD <MarkDude> Fishburn <bkerensa> nathwill: I laugh if your the only one who shows up ;) <nathwill> nah, i betcha blkperl and slangasek at a minimum are gonna be there <bkerensa> is kees going? <nathwill> they both sounded pretty confident about the day being doable <bkerensa> offer beer and its a done deal ;) <nathwill> i don't see him registered <nathwill> so probably not, unless he's coming incognito <nathwill> so i made the truly epic mistake of deciding to clean behind my stove this week... <nathwill> 'twere not pretty. not pretty at all <bkerensa> MarkDude: I'm only short 7,000 followers before I pass @Ubuntu up on twitter <bkerensa> ;) <bkerensa> I have almost double the followers of Fedora ;) <MarkDude> Well as far as more than Fedora goes, <yawn> nobody cares <MarkDude> not even Fedorans <MarkDude> As far as ubuntu goes thats awesome <MarkDude> people actually care about that * MarkDude has some advice as you pass them <MarkDude> let me find link <MarkDude> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/More_popular_than_Jesus <MarkDude> Do what Lennon did- say you are more popular culturally <MarkDude> And send out on Twitter- <nathwill> lol <bkerensa> heh <bkerensa> I imagine most of my followers live in the Middle East and India and would not get it <bkerensa> that seems to be the case on G+ <MarkDude> Well go into lengthy explanation of how you are now more popular than God <MarkDude> Start using terms like MINIONS <MarkDude> henchmen <MarkDude> also include phrases like *grand plan* as well as our hour of truth* <MarkDude> You could have an Aubergine little compond in Oregon like the Rajneesh folks * MarkDude for one salutes you in your plan to take over the world <MarkDude> Hopes this ass kissing will make me one of the last to die XD <MarkDude> Mark S will one day bow down to kiss your Ubuntu pinkie ring made of platinum <bkerensa> MarkDude: You are a silly man <bkerensa> :P * MarkDude has an active imagination <slangasek> nathwill: not much of a BSP if only 3 people show, though; I could stay at home and fix bugs in that case :) Do we know if there'll be more people from PSU coming? <blkperl> slangasek: not sure how many psu folks, hopefully a bunch, its been posted all of the engineering building, spammed to the masses and the flier is on the tvs near the front door <blkperl> s/of/voer <blkperl> over* <slangasek> mmk :) <bkerensa> blkperl: what time does it start? <bkerensa> I might have to come just so slangasek comes too :P we need him there <bkerensa> I think Finn will come <blkperl> bkerensa: the loco event time says 10 :) <blkperl> ill probably try to get there at 9 to post signs <bkerensa> blkperl: huh <bkerensa> blkperl: do you guys have a keg? <bkerensa> :sD <blkperl> bkerensa: really you think a public state insitution has a keg? :) <bkerensa> :P <MarkDude> bkerensa, you might want to join this- it may be amusing <MarkDude> ANNOUNCEMENT: There is a meeting on the subject of "The Future of Fedora Release Names" starting in 30 minutes over in #fedora-meeting-1. Please join us. http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/marketing/2012-June/014378.html <KorvinSzanto> Tomorrow night, what time in pst is it <nathwill> helo? <MarkDude> OMFG the naming thing in Fedora is still dragging on - boards are looking at it- we might have another vote- holy crap * MarkDude is looking forward to the day - when Mark S just lets bkerensa pick the name <MarkDude> The day grows closer.... <bkerensa> x.x your disturbing my work on a clients site ;p <bkerensa> KorvinSzanto: for the jam? <bkerensa> KorvinSzanto: Should start at 10am and go all day... nathwill blkperl and co are running it :o * bkerensa will likely come down * kees will be handing out build systems again, I think <bkerensa> Ok I commit but I wont be gregory37@example.net... Saturdays are for sleeping in :P <kees> just go to bed earlier! ;) <nathwill> you gonna be there kees ? <nathwill> sweet <bkerensa> nathwill: I will be there but likely closer to 11 <bkerensa> :D <nathwill> good <kees> nathwill: yuppers, at least until 2pm or so <nathwill> kees: glad to hear it :) <bkerensa> nathwill: you should swoop by and pick me up :P <bkerensa> otherwise Ill come at 11am ;) <bkerensa> Ugh... I need to not talk on Fedora channels <MarkDude> Best not to attack Nixie <MarkDude> if you would have chose me as target- you would have won <bkerensa> I was not attacking her and we will not carry this conversation over here. I'm not going to tolerate it here. <MarkDude> Fair enough- if you want to play with the big dogs- dont play like a puppy <bkerensa> le sigh <kees> lol <kees> beefy kick <bkerensa> yeah <bkerensa> in fedora channel we were discussing nixie <bkerensa> and he basically said he thinks sexual objectification of women is ok now he is trying to bring the conservation on every channel I am on <KorvinSzanto> I have to work out around noon, but I'll stop by until then and show up some time after <nathwill> isn't naming your release after a hotdog objectification of men? <nathwill> :P <bkerensa> nathwill: heh <bkerensa> nathwill: you around? <c_smith> bkerensa: just to make sure, the meeting tomorrow is at 7PM, correct? <bkerensa> c_smith: let me double check <c_smith> ok <c_smith> thought it would be better to check, looks like it is better. :P <bkerensa> c_smith: uhh it will be at 1pm or perhaps earlier not set in stone <bkerensa> will be holding it on irc from PSU <bkerensa> the event there starts at 10am <c_smith> alright, I'll be sure and be here early tomorrow. <c_smith> Won't be 9AM, but I might Idle starting at 10:30 <nathwill> hey bkerensa, i'm here <nathwill> what's up? <bkerensa> nathwill: so the local council meeting appears to be on Tuesday <bkerensa> not this weekend? <nathwill> oh really? <nathwill> well that's much more convenient <nathwill> i thought it said it was on the 16th <nathwill> in that case, i was totally on time to add our stuff <nathwill> :D <bkerensa> nathwill: we should try to get a group photo at the event this weekend <bkerensa> perhaps Ill lug the banner on the bus with me <bkerensa> idk <bkerensa> nathwill: want a Goobuntu sticker btw? <bkerensa> :D <c_smith> what is Goobuntu? <bkerensa> c_smith: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goobuntu <bkerensa> its just a remix of Ubuntu that Google uses internally <c_smith> thought I had heard of it before. <tgm4883> Goobuntu is google's version of Ubuntu <bkerensa> it doesnt look much different from Ubuntu at all <tgm4883> not to be confused with Gobuntu, which is Ubuntu comprised of completely free software <bkerensa> I think the only different is some hardening and special tools <tgm4883> not to be confused with Gubuntu, which is Ubuntu with Gnome Shell instead of Unity <c_smith> I'd read a article on how supposedly secure Google's datacenters are. <c_smith> if memory serves correct, it was a ZDNet article, but my memory has been wrong in the past. <bkerensa> secure their datacenters are? <bkerensa> Last time I checked most datacenters were pretty secure <tgm4883> bkerensa, eh, I doubt that, but it depends on your definitions of datacenter <bkerensa> Biometric Access... Man Trap Doors... Heat Sensors... Cameras.... etc <bkerensa> tgm4883: really? What datacenters are we talking about? <bkerensa> lol <tgm4883> bkerensa, well it all has to do with funds <c_smith> bkerensa: I never said there weren't. just saying that I'm taking their word for it as I won't ever get the chance to see it myself. <c_smith> *they <tgm4883> define datacenter <c_smith> define tgm4883 <c_smith> :P <c_smith> jk <c_smith> yeah, just sitting here installing software. <tgm4883> google is surely secure, as they A) have the money to protect it, and B) the need to protect it and (most importantly) C) the people in charge of the money know how important it is to protect it <bkerensa> tgm4883: yeah but most have SAS auditing and have some level of approval from a standards org? <bkerensa> I would never colo in a facility that did not have 24/7/365 video, biometric access etc <tgm4883> but take some smallish ISP, their datacenter isn't going to be as secure <tgm4883> aren't you trying to colo at PSU? <tgm4883> and while pretty nifty, is there really biometric locks on OSUOSL's datacenter? <c_smith> colo = collaborate <c_smith> ? <bkerensa> tgm4883: I would imagine OSL has biometrics but I just pinged one of their NOC people to ask <bkerensa> small ISP's maybe not but I also dont consider small ISP's server rooms to be DC's <c_smith> eh, for $99 Acer is fixing my Iconia Tab A100, they better be able to. <bkerensa> c_smith: Colocation <tgm4883> bkerensa, I think it depends on your definition of datacenter, if you are a medium sized business with 1 or 2 racks, is that in a datacenter <c_smith> oh, I see. <tgm4883> bkerensa, ah ok, so how many racks does it take to be a DC? <bkerensa> My definition of a DC is over 500 machines <bkerensa> otherwise I would consider it a server room at best <bkerensa> I also think a DC should always have secure access that is SSAE-16 audited <nathwill> it mostly has to do with data <nathwill> what data you're processing... there are specific facility security requirements for processing certain kinds of data <bkerensa> like for instance there are companies her in portland who have lots of racks but they dont consider themselves to have a full DC <bkerensa> and in fact they also have cages offsite in real DC's <tgm4883> well see, you just created rules to make yourself correct <bkerensa> :P <nathwill> so a generic "data center" isn't necessarily going to use more security than a shop in the mall, for example <tgm4883> now we're just talking statistics <bkerensa> There is definitely a balance of amount of servers and access that seperates a server room from a data center <nathwill> but if you want to handle PII, it takes a whole different kind of access control <tgm4883> eg. 100% of the datacenters with over 500 machines have biometric locks <c_smith> hmmmm.... so Puppet Labs is up in Portland.... Google uses Puppet..... must mean Puppet is very successful, yet again, it might not. <tgm4883> meh, semantics <nathwill> ? <bkerensa> :D <nathwill> i think... i'm going to excuse myself until y'all start talking sense <tgm4883> so wikipedia says there are 4 levels of data center tiers <tgm4883> Single non-redundant distribution path serving the IT equipment <tgm4883> Non-redundant capacity components <tgm4883> Basic site infrastructure with expected availability of 99.671% <tgm4883> tier 1^ <tgm4883> that sounds pretty smallsh to me <bkerensa> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Server_room <bkerensa> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_center <bkerensa> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_center#Security <nathwill> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fernando_Rees <tgm4883> bkerensa, tier 4 is the only one that is mentioned for biometric security <tgm4883> thanks for posting those links that back me up ;) <bkerensa> tgm4883: I think its silly to not have biometric myself <bkerensa> :D <bkerensa> but thats just me <tgm4883> "The most stringent level is a Tier 4 data center, which is designed to host mission critical computer systems, with fully redundant subsystems and compartmentalized security zones controlled by biometric access controls methods." <bkerensa> <mythmon> bkerensa: we don't use any biometrics. <bkerensa> OSL does not <bkerensa> and I think thats fail <tgm4883> bkerensa, I don't <bkerensa> but then again they are not hosting enterprise clients either? <nathwill> y'all hear they just got 300K from google? <nathwill> :D <tgm4883> bkerensa, there data is arguable just as if not more important in terms of security <bkerensa> So when I had two racks at XO in California <bkerensa> they had mantraps <tgm4883> bkerensa, sillicon valley? <bkerensa> in fact almost all the DC's in the bay area have man traps except for this one I did a call at in SF which was in the Sega Building <bkerensa> but I considered it more of a Server Room <bkerensa> tgm4883: fremont <bkerensa> Fremont, CA = Datacenter World, USA :) <tgm4883> yea, silicon valley seems like they would be all up in the "we've got to have the sweet new datacenter with cool biometric locks" <bkerensa> http://goo.gl/maps/Xxky <tgm4883> bkerensa, as with any business, it's a cost/benefit ratio <bkerensa> tgm4883: its actually a very old DC <tgm4883> osuosl doesn't think their data is worth the investment in biometric locks <bkerensa> and better yet Fremont's Datacenters are known to be pretty lousy and budget :P <bkerensa> like for instance Hurricane Electric is in Fremont <tgm4883> i got to say I probably agree with them <bkerensa> and they have so many power problems its not even funny <tgm4883> power problems :( <tgm4883> I've not seen any hospital's datacenter, but if it's anything like most of their networks, it's very very bad <bkerensa> tgm4883: hospital's do have pretty poor IT <tgm4883> I wouldn't be surprised if most of them didn't have a door on their datacenter <bkerensa> LOL <tgm4883> we'd get some good hospital virus outbreak calls when I worked at Symantec <bkerensa> ahh <bkerensa> I remember my doctor's office had their router in a corner of their lobby that had like no line of sight <bkerensa> I told my doctor I was like thats not a very good idea <c_smith> bkerensa: I just saw the OSCON Booth volunteer email, what are the dates for it? <tgm4883> "you have zero wireless security, no firewall, wide open network shares, and run XP SP1? Thank you have a nice day sir. *click*" <c_smith> and is there going to be carpooling? <tgm4883> bkerensa, hospitals aren't always bad because of bad IT, sometimes there are dumb policies that they can't work around <tgm4883> (or they have just given up) <bkerensa> tgm4883: yeah they had a cisco router and their T1 relay sitting right there in the public area <bkerensa> I was like WTF is this <tgm4883> such as change requests that take an hour to fill out <bkerensa> lol <bkerensa> :D <bkerensa> I hope they someday get it sorted... I explained someone could drop a patch cable on their and packet filter them <bkerensa> c_smith: no carpooling <c_smith> ah, and looking at the dates, I'd have to work then, anyway. <bkerensa> yeah <bkerensa> most people do <c_smith> so I wouldn't be able to. <c_smith> wish I could help. but alas.... <bkerensa> and its a solid obligation so if someone volunteers they need to be there the whole time <bkerensa> tgm4883: you should do it <bkerensa> :D <tgm4883> yea <tgm4883> let me get right on that ;) <tgm4883> I need a cheap SAN <bkerensa> tgm4883: for what? <tgm4883> uh, storage ;) <tgm4883> I just need more storage at home for my media center <nathwill> tgm4883, what's your current setup? <tgm4883> nathwill, at home? <tgm4883> I have a 2 disk readynas <tgm4883> with 1.5TB drives <tgm4883> so not much storage <nathwill> that's not too bad <tgm4883> I'm trying to decide if I want to just turn my desktop into a server by stuffing a bunch of hard drives in there with a RAID card (or doing ZFS) or if I want to buy a network device that can take 5+ drives <nathwill> i recently upgraded my single bay (qnap ts-110) plus external, to a 4bay hp proliant w/ 4x 2TB <nathwill> it's a tough call <nathwill> i think there's a market gap for a low-capacity device with massive storage capacity <tgm4883> yea, there isn't a ton out there <nathwill> all the 4+ bay devices i found also came with big ol' upgrades in cpu/ram/etc <nathwill> and subsequent price bumps too <nathwill> which sucks <nathwill> honestly, the 800mhz/256MB RAM system is fine... preferable even, due to wattage, if only it had many bays <tgm4883> yea I'm fine with my readynas, it's just too small <tgm4883> runs debian, but only takes 2 drives (and only up to 2TB drives) <tgm4883> I'd really like to get a separate device, but the more I look at it the more I think I just need to stick freenas on my box and shove more drives in it <nathwill> if you do, lmk what you think of freenas <nathwill> i'd be more interested if it were linux <nathwill> personally <tgm4883> We've installed in on an old SUN box at work <tgm4883> just last week <tgm4883> works pretty well, but the next version will be alot better <tgm4883> specifically if you want to use ZFS <nathwill> snapshots? <nathwill> is that why you're interested in
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