#ubuntu-design 2012-02-01 <dholbach> good morning <dholbach> sladen, who can we turn to to get https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-website/+bug/812337 fixed? <cwt-bugs> Launchpad bug 812337 in Ubuntu Website "Ubuntu Wiki: IRC style formatting needs a "word-wrap: break-word"" (affected: 2, heat: 1) [Undecided,New] <dholbach> I hope it'd be an easy fix <dholbach> because it's a bit irritating :) <jasox> I am just testing ubuntu 12.04 alpha, lots of improvements. I would be nice if we had when you type alt-F1 emacs of vim key bindings. What do you think ? <jasox> It would be nice and much faster for power users. <dholbach> Trevinho, ready? :) <Trevinho> dholbach: ehm.. Not so much :P <Trevinho> eheh <Trevinho> I'm a lot busy with the upstream stuff <dholbach> yeah, I can imagine - it's still some time until the session later ;-) <Trevinho> but I'll focus on that later :) <dholbach> rock and roll <dholbach> thanks a lot <Trevinho> yep <Trevinho> yw <mhall119> hey design team, I'm working on re-vamping unity.ubuntu.com/get-involved, in what ways can the community be involved with the design side? <mhall119> of unity specifically <mhall119> I've got trying the prototypes (which btw, are a great idea), but I don't know what else <iainfarrell> mhall119: hey hey <iainfarrell> not sure who's best to talk to on the Canonical Design team side about Unity <yaili> iainfarrell: o/ <iainfarrell> hey yaili! <iainfarrell> how are you? <yaili> iainfarrell: good, thanks :) you? <iainfarrell> not bad thanks yaili :) <bkerensa> sladen: Is packages.ubuntu.com going to be transitioned to the new branding? #ubuntu-design 2012-02-02 <dholbach> good morning <swilson> davidcalle: ping * etneg_ warms his hands to finish up a logo <etneg_> 2 weeks ! <etneg_> more of a banner than a logo i'd say * etneg_ levitates under the power of vectors #ubuntu-design 2012-02-03 <dholbach> good morning * thorwil prepares for fosdem <etneg> time for a new machine <etneg> adexit <etneg> so anyone wants logo/artwork for ubuntu ? <etneg> if you need help, drop me a msg <etneg> :D #ubuntu-design 2012-02-04 <jmsm> hello. can someone answer a question i have about design in 12.04? <jmsm> maybe this the wrong channel to do this? <czajkowski> wendar: you about? <mhall119> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2012/01/msg00001.html a good opportunity to contribute to the Debian project, if anybody is interested <pocopina> seems that you guys mostly discuss visual design in the channel. are any of you involved in user research or interaction design projects for ubuntu ? #ubuntu-design 2012-02-05 <wendar> czajkowski: I'll be at the Ubuntu booth most of today <czajkowski> wendar: col just in cross disgro before my panel then will head over <wendar> czajkowski: ah, sorry I missed the panel! <czajkowski> no worries in the infrastrudcure <czajkowski> wendar: ^^ <czajkowski> Daviey: is taking over for the sy admin infrastucure talk for canonical <wendar> czajkowski: awesome! when is it? <czajkowski> now <czajkowski> the debian folks said canonical person never came, I did pooint out it wasnt arranged <czajkowski> H1301 <wendar> czajkowski: they did try to arrange it, but I couldn't find any sysadmins to go to FOSDEM <czajkowski> yup <czajkowski> I know but they said he never showed,, <czajkowski> did clear that up <czajkowski> have to go mderate this <czajkowski> bbiab so not looking at screen #ubuntu-design 2012-02-06 <dholbach> good morning #ubuntu-design 2012-02-07 <mhall119> anybody here know the state of wacom tablet support in Ubuntu? <mhall119> I'm thinking of getting an Intuos 3 for my daughter * redttx is away: I'm busy #ubuntu-design 2012-02-08 <sabdfl> voip seems to be failing me <sabdfl> oww <sabdfl> ba <iainfarrell> baa black sheep? <iainfarrell> :) <thorwil> sabdfl: that alien headshrinking remark is the first time you really do sound strange ... making it recursive ;p <sabdfl> heh <sabdfl> lucky i cut out the part about eating babies <wendar> News for the week. <wendar> The new design.ubuntu.com site was praised highly at FOSDEM last weekend <wendar> by designers <wendar> particularly, how open it is for community collaborators <wendar> while we're working on improving our own collaboration, it's nice to have that external perspective from designers who collaborate with other communities :) <wendar> Also, http://openusability.org/ is looking for some help with the website <wendar> their designer/developer/admin retired last year, so the site has drifted <wendar> not very "usable" at the moment <wendar> generally an interesting group <wendar> mostly usability experts who are neither designers or developers #ubuntu-design 2012-02-09 <htorque> hello everyone! i'd like to know whether the thunderbird toolbar will stay light or go back to dark for 12.04? <thorwil> i wonder if long term, ubuntu/unity could become a bit like a smalltalk environment, in that you would have an explorable and modifiable-as-it-runs system. <thorwil> with the look-and-feel implemented as policy on top of abstractions. <thorwil> allowing to adjust pretty much everything in a lean way, without exposing lots of preferences <nava> Hi all <nava> I make a design for let users to choose want to have full screen with luncher or without it. where should i send it ? <iainfarrell> hey nava have a look on the Canonical Design blog <iainfarrell> pick someone from the team there and you can send it over :) <nava> give me address please <iainfarrell> nava http://design.canonical.com/theteam/ have a look here, maybe John Lea? :) <etneg_> kenvandine: so any feedback? #ubuntu-design 2012-02-10 <dholbach> good morning <etneg_> hey kenvandine <etneg_> morning <etneg_> wow lot of feedback <MrChrisDruif> On what etneg_ ? <etneg_> oh gwibber logo <MrChrisDruif> Ah, that ^_^ <kenvandine> etneg_, oh... i just noticed OMG picked it up :) <etneg_> kenvandine: ye <etneg_> lot oftrolling going on there <etneg_> kenvandine: people are beginning to think the "logo" is the icon <etneg_> i didnt do a version for the logo <etneg_> heh <etneg_> oops correction <kenvandine> :) <etneg_> i didnt do a version for the icon <etneg_> as an icon the logo would have to be brought down a bit,some elements removed <etneg_> but thats pretty sweet, lot of feedback <etneg_> kenvandine: based on what's going on now, do you want revisions or new concepts? <kenvandine> etneg_, it would be nice to also include icon versions based on the logo <etneg_> yeh i'll do that now <kenvandine> as for revisions, if you want to update the existing concepts lets make them like 1.1 , 1.2, etc <kenvandine> so they can gather feedback separately from the original <etneg_> i didnt get you, sorry <etneg_> i label it 1.1 and 1.2 and so on ? <kenvandine> yes <kenvandine> with separate space for feedback <kenvandine> etneg_, you can just post them right on the wiki page <etneg_> ok <kenvandine> so put concept 1.1 under the feedback section of concept 1 and add a heading and empty bullet line for feedback <etneg_> ok <MrChrisDruif> What are the differences between the logo and the icon? =/ <etneg_> well sometimes if the logo is "busy" you tone it down for the icon <etneg_> icons are kept simpler <etneg_> you just pull out the key elements that make up the logo for the icon and you're done <etneg_> atleast that's what i usually do <MrChrisDruif> True <MrChrisDruif> But busy logo are wrong in the first place ;-) <MrChrisDruif> However, sometimes/most of the time "logo's" include the name in a certain font <etneg_> wordmark? <etneg_> some use wordmarks and some dont <etneg_> depends on the client's taste really <MrChrisDruif> Wordmarks? <kenvandine> i really prefer not having the name in the logo <MrChrisDruif> I've heard once that the Dutch were experts in the use of fonts etc back in the 1900's <etneg_> kenvandine: really? <kenvandine> personally, i prefer logos that are recognizable without that <MrChrisDruif> Indeed <kenvandine> etneg_, like on the website we would have the name in the header next to or below the logo <etneg_> right <kenvandine> but the logo should represent the spirit of the app, not the name of the app <MrChrisDruif> kenvandine; I agree <etneg_> did you mean no text in the icon ? <MrChrisDruif> Or company! <kenvandine> etneg_, yeah... no text in the icon for sure <kenvandine> but even for the logo <etneg_> oh ok <kenvandine> don't make the name part of the logo <etneg_> for the icon i just toned it up a bit <kenvandine> cool <MrChrisDruif> kenvandine; depends on the situation I'd say <etneg_> no text and the smiley glass faces are not visible there <MrChrisDruif> I should reinstall this PC...or remove all the cruft from things I don't use <kenvandine> etneg_, personally i really love concept 1 <MrChrisDruif> It's a bit slow <etneg_> kenvandine: if you want to keep the logo without text, no issues there but just seeing a logo without a name on it is almostlike faceless <etneg_> you know what i mean <etneg_> if im someone who doesnt know nothing about gwibber, and im looking at a gwibber logo on some ref page along with twitter and the rest, it doesnt tell you <kenvandine> that is why in places like the header of a website you would put the name near it, for identity purposes <etneg_> what if someone used the gwibber logo on their page? <etneg_> without a name you cant tell <etneg_> you're talking about using it on the gwibber.com page which is fine <kenvandine> in that case we should probably have a horizontal version with the name next to it <kenvandine> and some branding guidelines <kenvandine> for use <etneg_> oh ye <etneg_> i could remove the text and for those wanting to use it on their page or something, we could have one with the name on it i suppose? <etneg_> have you seen the (RED) logo concepts?if you got the time, take a look at it <etneg_> it's an interesting way to have people use your logo and incorporate their product logo into it wthout killing the aesthetics of the key product logo <MrChrisDruif> etneg_; I'm not catching your drift? <etneg_> http://www.joinred.com/red/#shopred <etneg_> ^^ <etneg_> key product logo (RED) <etneg_> on that page other products trying to collaborate with it <etneg_> (CocaCola)^red. Cocacola has kept their logo there and supports red but they key element there is still the red logo because of the curved brackets <etneg_> so if i took " MrChrisDruif " and put it in a red bracket as ( MrChrisDruif )^red, it'll instantly hit me that you're part of the red foundation <MrChrisDruif> Ghehe ^_^ <etneg_> nice concept eh? <etneg_> heh <MrChrisDruif> Ah, and IT is for/against AIDS <etneg_> ye <MrChrisDruif> Awesome <etneg_> the logo belongs to U2 <etneg_> it's unlikely one of us could get away with that bracket + RED as a logo without someone suing our ass for some sort of trademark infringement <etneg_> i bet he must have paid quite a sum to get by that, just my 2 cents assumption <MrChrisDruif> etneg_; /s/red/blue ;-) <etneg_> heh gl <MrChrisDruif> jk <etneg_> ok just uploaded 1.1 icon version <etneg_> kenvandine: if you have another concept in mind i could do one now <etneg_> something different to concept 1 or 2 <kenvandine> etneg_, nothing now... but if you have ideas :) <etneg_> i do, but if you have one, i could work on that first <etneg_> :D <etneg_> but ok <etneg_> kenvandine: ping <SirLinux`> Hello <kenvandine> etneg_, pong <etneg_> kenvandine: http://i41.tinypic.com/t0rhio.png <etneg_> didnt put it on the wiki yet, but your thoughts <kenvandine> etneg_, sorry, i don't get the concept. a book with a page turned? <etneg_> ye <kenvandine> it's nice looking, but i don't see it as being "social" <etneg_> blogging as in writing down in a diary <etneg_> oh the social part i didnt convey in this <kenvandine> etneg_, sorry... yeah concept is a bit of imho <SirLinux`> what image size we should use for the wallpapers ? <etneg_> kenvandine: ok <SirLinux`> for the Precise Pangolin wallpaper submissions <etneg_> do you want me to modify it to add social element <etneg_> ? <etneg_> or i could work on another concept <kenvandine> etneg_, something else <kenvandine> thx though <etneg_> ok np <kenvandine> etneg_, i still love concept 1 :) <etneg_> okLD <etneg_> do you want to modify concept 1 ? <kenvandine> etneg_, it is up to you, if you want to take some of the feedback and make some revisions <kenvandine> that would be cool <etneg_> well i did a revision for the icon part <etneg_> removed the faces for the icon <etneg_> i'll see what i can come up with <kenvandine> etneg_, thx <etneg_> np <thorwil> SirLinux`: aiming at 2650 x 1600 allows use on any common monitor <thorwil> SirLinux`: you might want to take a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Documentation/Backgrounds#Templates <etneg_> kenvandine: http://i43.tinypic.com/mald1w.png <etneg_> i havent colored it or prettified it, the concept ok? <etneg_> kenvandine: ping <SirLinux`> made it 1920x1080 <SirLinux`> http://www.flickr.com/photos/33589237@N00/6853434887/in/pool-1860176@N24/lightbox/ <etneg_> what is that? <etneg_> using blender? <SirLinux`> excuse me ? <MrChrisDruif> What did you use to create that SirLinux` is what etneg_ meant <SirLinux`> oh .. i used cinema 4d. <MrChrisDruif> So a reference to the old colouring scheme? <SirLinux`> yeah and a 3d logo :) <MrChrisDruif> Ghehe <etneg_> ah cinema 4d <etneg_> like what 20 mins work i bet <etneg_> if i had to vectorise that sucker, well atleast an hr <MrChrisDruif> etneg_; "sucker" might not be a very friendly word for it, maybe you could try "piece of work" next time? ^_^ Just sayin' ^_^ <etneg_> oh right ok <etneg_> :D <MrChrisDruif> ^_^ <etneg_> just saying, vectorising that would be so time consuming <SirLinux`> etneg_ well , kinda <etneg_> ive been meaning to go into 3d as well <SirLinux`> 20 - 30 minutes <etneg_> atleast for some tasks <etneg_> havent gotten my new machine yet, once it's here, either cinema4d or blender and the awesome zbrush = total awesomeness <etneg_> ive heard some good stuff aboout cinema4d <SirLinux`> yeah but you need good pc <SirLinux`> this notebook i use for such works, is a i7 cpu with 4 gb ram ( sony vaio ) and is kinda slow while rendering <etneg_> well the machine im building and i just orderered for the parts <etneg_> is an i7 2600k, sli 580s with 3gb, and a nice cooling system, 16gb ram 1800, etc <etneg_> i'll oc that and i should do fine <etneg_> even if i didnt oc it, it'll do fine <etneg_> rendering is tricky <etneg_> gpu or cpu? <etneg_> varries with each <etneg_> i mean solidworks + GTX = poor performances <etneg_> solidworks + quadro = major performance because of the drivers that are customised for solidworks <etneg_> blender and a quadro? forget it, might as well stick with teh GTX <etneg_> you have to understand, 5 yrs ago people did some awesome work in 3d without all this hardware, think about it... <etneg_> so i wouldnt exactly count on a rock solid machine to produce quality work, might need some talent too:P <SirLinux`> hmm <SirLinux`> nice specs there <SirLinux`> rendering : cpu <etneg_> ah k <etneg_> oh a laptop? <etneg_> hehe <etneg_> seriously get a workstation, it'll be less painful <etneg_> or just a desktop <etneg_> i have the new xps but you dont wanna heat those guys up, they'll cry for miles <SirLinux`> i was thinkin to get a imac full speks <SirLinux`> specs * <etneg_> for that price? <etneg_> why bother <etneg_> build it dude <etneg_> alrihg togtta jetfor a bit #ubuntu-design 2012-02-11 <etneg_> kenvandine: ping <etneg_> awake? <etneg_> guess not #ubuntu-design 2012-02-13 <dholbach> good morning <etneg_> kenvandine: ping <kenvandine> etneg_, pong <etneg_> kenvandine: hey, got my mail? <etneg_> i didnt post it to the wiki, thought i'd see what you thought before i did <etneg_> also in the ombgbuntu articlecomments section few people asked where to post concepts, i had given them a link to the wiki <etneg_> thought i'd ask you first but you werent around then and figured you could use more concepts <kenvandine> ah, sorry thought i had replied to that <etneg_> in the mail, there's one with a metallic G look logo i did, it doesnt obey any of the rules you mentioned but i thought you could still take a peek <etneg_> na i didnt get any mail from you <kenvandine> etneg_, my reply window is still open :) <etneg_> heh <kenvandine> i kind of like gwibber8.png <kenvandine> even though it doesn't really have anything social about it :) <etneg_> ye that one i tried ot keep quite simple and to the point <kenvandine> just feels kind of fun <etneg_> oh the social part was the letters throw about in colors <kenvandine> the quotes around it <etneg_> i think colors define socialism? <etneg_> the colors are still kinda ubuntu-centric <kenvandine> i didn't really get that feel from it, but i did really like it <etneg_> the quotes + _ was just something i thought clearly tells its something like a twitter app <kenvandine> yeah <etneg_> i asked a bunch of people about it <etneg_> without telling them what this logo was for <kenvandine> it does <etneg_> and all of them replied it was a logof or a twitter like app <etneg_> so i thought it came out ok <kenvandine> you should post that one on the wiki see what people say <etneg_> ok <etneg_> what aobut the rest? <kenvandine> not sure what you would do for an icon with it though <etneg_> for the icon i can simplify it <etneg_> its got the two Gs making a face <kenvandine> the others really didn't catch my eye <etneg_> i could use that for the icon or something <kenvandine> oh, i didn't even notice that :) <etneg_> heh <etneg_> thats another social part i added <kenvandine> cool, yeah so that one really caught my attention <kenvandine> even though it wasn't really what i thought i wanted <kenvandine> thanks for that :) <etneg_> :D <etneg_> you want the scattered letters in 3d? <etneg_> i was tring to keep it simple <kenvandine> simple is better <etneg_> ok <kenvandine> 3d might over do it <etneg_> right <etneg_> want some gloss on the two Gs? <etneg_> like a bit of shine <kenvandine> maybe <etneg_> k <kenvandine> that might be nice <etneg_> ok <etneg_> as for -wibber i would keep it in black unless you wanna change it <etneg_> the black gives it a sort of typing text feel to it <etneg_> kenvandine: btw what about the pen concept? <kenvandine> i didn't really like the computer image <kenvandine> so many different form factors now, laptops, tablet, phone, etc... <etneg_> right <etneg_> the computer image was a rough <etneg_> a quick hack <etneg_> i'll see what i can do, let me modify gwibber8 <kenvandine> thx <etneg_> np <etneg_> kenvandine: updated the wiki with gwibber8 <kenvandine> etneg_, thx <etneg_> i added a bit of shine to the Gg <etneg_> let me know if that looks fine <etneg_> there re no blurs or any of that in them so, would be safe to shrink it down for an icon size too, just the two Gg's and the bracket for the lip <etneg_> or even just have one G as the icon #ubuntu-design 2012-02-14 <dholbach> good morning <etneg_> kenvandine: heh quite a few proposals on the wiki page <etneg_> that went well <gotwig> Hey Designers, out there <MrChrisDruif> Aloha gotwig <MrChrisDruif> Sup gotwig ? <gotwig> I want to develop my own lens, and need a black/white svg image for that. category : cooking / cook recips <gotwig> MrChrisDruif: ^ <MrChrisDruif> So you want something like a cooking pan with a spoon in it? <gotwig> MrChrisDruif: I dont realy know ^^ <gotwig> MrChrisDruif: It should look tasttty :D <MrChrisDruif> That was the first thing popping in my head <MrChrisDruif> It's for that small icon in the bottom right? Can't put too much detail into that <gotwig> MrChrisDruif: in the dash, yes * MrChrisDruif is using GNOME Shell...no more Dash for me ;-) <MrChrisDruif> gotwig; something like this: http://images-5.findicons.com/files/icons/2482/icons8_ever_growing_set_of_windows_8_metro_style_icons/26/cooking_pot.png but without the lid and a spoon for stirring <MrChrisDruif> Should be a 2d image <MrChrisDruif> But that's just my 2c <thorwil> godbyk: seen http://www.sourcefabric.org/en/booktype/ ? <etneg_> got i can do an icon if you want <etneg_> oh he left <etneg_> kenvandine: lot of concepts coming in #ubuntu-design 2012-02-15 <thorwil> what this guy shows with generative drawing as example, we should have to work on GUIs: http://vimeo.com/36579366 <nava> mhall119: you have time ? <mhall119> nava: time for what? <nava> I want explain my mock up <mhall119> nava: it's best to send that to the unity-design mailing list <mhall119> so everybody can discuss it <nava> ok thanks ;) <MrChrisDruif> Ah sod, I missed the meeting? * ofsemisanddinos 's iTunes Library is 36:18:51:48 long, with 11895 songs totalling 78.28 GB. #ubuntu-design 2012-02-16 <sladen> For anyone who's interested, I've filed a bug to track the wallpaper upload at: <sladen> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-wallpapers/+bug/933562 <cwt-bugs> Launchpad bug 933562 in ubuntu-wallpapers (Ubuntu) "FFe: Upload Precise Ubuntu 12.04 LTS wallpapers " (affected: 1, heat: 12) [Wishlist,Confirmed] - Assigned to Paul Sladen (sladen) <sladen> at the moment it just links back to the Flickr group and notes the Feature Freeze exception needed <sladen> There's also https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+bug/933489 which might be of interest. It's been forgotten for a year, but hopefully can be nailed for Ubuntu 12.04 LTS <cwt-bugs> Launchpad bug 933489 in ubuntu-branding "Ubuntu Printer test page has old branding/isn't that useful" (affected: 1, heat: 8) [Wishlist,Confirmed] <AlanBell> so what does this need sladen? is it a PDF file or a script somewhere that generates the page? <sladen> AlanBell: currently it's a PostScript file /usr/share/system-config-printer/testpage-a4.ps but AFAIK it's now an all-PDF path, so will probably be a PDF path <sladen> AlanBell: I think we're going to get some Canonical Design time to look at it <etneg_> /j cars <etneg_> sorry <etneg_> oops <htorque> hello everyone! i'd like to know whether the thunderbird toolbar will stay light or go back to dark for 12.04? <htorque> don't want to re-modify two extensions for nothing ;) <mhall119> htorque: it's light for me right now <htorque> mhall119: yeah, but will it stay that way or is it just a theming issue? :) <mhall119> that I don't know <mhall119> htorque: you might ask chrisccoulson in #ubuntu-unity, he works with upstream Mozilla <htorque> mhall119: thanks, done :-) <sladen> htorque: Cimi is the person to ask <sladen> htorque: (Cimi works on themeing) <nava> Hi all, I mail a mock up of luncher about full screen to mail list, I want to know who check it and what is your idea about it #ubuntu-design 2012-02-17 <dholbach> good morning <sladen> morning people <MrChrisDruif> Aloha sladen <sladen> hola MrChrisDruif <MrChrisDruif> Como esta sladen ? <MrChrisDruif> How are you sladen ? <nava> Hi all <MrChrisDruif> Aloha nava <nava> i sent a mock up last night, did you see it? <sladen> MrChrisDruif: enjoying the view from Millbank this morning. A bit smoggy, but good none-the-less <sladen> nava: what was the mockup of? <nava> about full screen in ubuntu <nava> when click on maximized button on window <MrChrisDruif> I've not seen a mock up, but then again does the design team have a mailing list? <nava> yes, i sent for mailing list <nava> sladen : i have an idea to let user to choose between full screen with luncher or without <sladen> nava: didn't see it; what Real Name should I look for on the email? <nava> updated: mock up <nava> sent from alexanderlisa@example.com <sladen> nava: to which exact email list? <nava> unity-design <nava> sladen : did u find it ? <AlanBell> nava: I don't see it either <nava> subject : updated mock up <nava> sent from alexanderlisa@example.com <AlanBell> https://lists.launchpad.net/unity-design/date.html <nava> no prblem if cant find it (i sent it last night about 11.30 UTC) <nava> i can explain it here <nava> I have an idea to give user to choose full-screen with luncher or without it, even i checked mac OSX to check how to do it, i think we can let user to choose between full screen with luncher or with out it very simply like when user LEFT click with mouse on maximized button on window it go full screen with luncher OR when user middle click on maximized button it go full screen without luncher (like 11.10) <MrChrisDruif> This is the Ubuntu Design launchpad group/mailing-list? https://launchpad.net/~unity-design <nava> alexanderlisa@example.com <cprofitt> hello all <cprofitt> anyone know if we have an art related part of the global jam? <gotwig> hey there <gotwig> eh I need an icon design for my lens, could someone help me? <gotwig> with it you are able to search for recips in the internet <gotwig> you can directly see the like's the level, etc. it should be some way of monochrome, so like the other icons for lenses <cprofitt> hey jono <jono> hey cprofitt <gotwig> JohnLea: hey <JohnLea> gotwig; hyia <cprofitt> hiya JohnLea <gotwig> has anyone intresst in helping me with an icon :X? <gotwig> doing an icon, or someone can also do it for me.. on base of an other. A spoon I think would be good (for cooking lens ) <cprofitt> gotwig: I am trying to get an Art Jam going <cprofitt> perhaps we can get an icon for you then <cprofitt> http://ftbeowulf.wordpress.com/2012/02/17/jam-jam-ubuntu-global-jam-art-jam/ <gotwig> cprofitt: :-) <gotwig> cprofitt: still have to work on functionality. You know its my first realy productive python app :D <etneg_> hey kenvandine <etneg_> kenvandine: i updated another concept, its on the wiki <etneg_> letme know what you think <kenvandine> hey etneg_ <kenvandine> cool, i'll look in a bit <cprofitt> etneg_: which wiki? <etneg_> kenvandine: sweet <etneg_> cprofitt: https://live.gnome.org/Gwibber/LogoConcepts <cprofitt> ooh... very nice etneg_ <etneg_> oh its not just mine <etneg_> it;s concepts fro others too <etneg_> heh <etneg_> kenvandine put up the wiki <cprofitt> concept 7 has a clean look <etneg_> that isnt mine, no idea who that belongs to <cprofitt> I like concept 1, but not sure of the 'brownish' color... and it is a bit complex <cprofitt> etneg_: which one isyours? <etneg_> 1, 2, 6, 9 <etneg_> 2 is scrapped <cprofitt> yeah... two is not one I would choose... <kenvandine> i like 1, 6 and 7 <cprofitt> I like 1, but the brownish red color on the circle G I am not sure of <etneg_> there's only orange there <etneg_> well orange+ yellow <cprofitt> perhaps it is the color profile of my lame lcd on this Lenovo <etneg_> and to give it bit more glossy effect i added another grapevine red somewhere there <cprofitt> kenvandine: yeah, 7 is very clean looking <etneg_> fromthe votes i took for my stuff, lot of them went with 6 and 9 <etneg_> 1 was considered okayish, but complex <cprofitt> +1 <etneg_> though people liked the icon version of 1 since i removed some elements <etneg_> but thats not what kenvandine wants, he wants the faces there <kenvandine> i do like the faces :) <etneg_> ye so:D <etneg_> it isnt as complex as you think though <etneg_> it's got a lot of elements, but little effects <etneg_> you could have two elements and 20 effects on it and that would be consideered complex if you ask me * cprofitt nods <cprofitt> I agree with that <etneg_> :D <cprofitt> I always struggle when doing art... <cprofitt> then again with FOSS tools part of that is just not being familiar with the tools <cprofitt> I used Corel Photo Paint / Draw for years and years and years <etneg_> i havent touched that in a long long time <etneg_> i do work with photoshop now and then but not for logo stuff, vectors clearly wins here * cprofitt nods <cprofitt> I never used photoshop <cprofitt> was always too expensive <cprofitt> I use Gimp and Inkscape now <cprofitt> but not quite as proficient with them as with Corel tools <etneg_> inkscape is nice but it's got some catching up to do <cprofitt> yep <cprofitt> I would pay if Corel put out their tools for Linux <etneg_> i call it the power of blur, with blurs inkscape is nice to get all the realism you want <etneg_> but that is an effect <etneg_> heh <etneg_> ive got corel sketch pad or smething, came with the wacom <etneg_> never used it <cprofitt> so you guys going to take part in the Ubuntu Global Jam and submit some art during the jam? <cprofitt> Would be great to have some folks work on some web banners, fliers and posters for 12.04 <etneg_> i have no idea <etneg_> never even heard of it <cprofitt> http://ftbeowulf.wordpress.com/2012/02/17/jam-jam-ubuntu-global-jam-art-jam/ <etneg_> my second projec with ubuntu is kenvandine's stuff <etneg_> thatas about it <etneg_> heh <cprofitt> the global jam is typically seen as technical, but I think art is just as much a part of the Ubuntu Community <cprofitt> and very important for moving the project forward <cprofitt> I am trying to get some students from the local university to partake too <cprofitt> hey, ara <ara> hey cprofitt <cprofitt> etneg_: I would love to see you cut loose on some stuff for 12.04 - beyond icons <etneg_> oh ok cool <etneg_> like wallpapers? <cprofitt> the design you had in 1 on the wiki would be really cool for some web banner, stuff or one some fliers for 12.04 <cprofitt> wallpapers, fliers, posters, web banners <etneg_> just in vectors? <etneg_> sure hwy not <cprofitt> I would work in vectors... but the web stuff may need to be converted to .png or .jpg <cprofitt> fliers would likely stay vectors <cprofitt> take a look at this site <cprofitt> http://spreadubuntu.org/en/node/529 <cprofitt> they have lots of community submissions <etneg_> yeh it'll exported to pngs or jpegs <cprofitt> this was an old poster that I really liked <cprofitt> http://bligoo.com/media/users/0/47/images/ubuntu_highway_by_gasteropod.jpg <cprofitt> but the colors and feel no longer really match the current Ubuntu theme <etneg_> oo posters <etneg_> and that looks like post production was done in some raster app like gimp or something <cprofitt> yeah <etneg_> which is why i asked, fully vector or hacked up? :P <cprofitt> I took the source from that and made a large poster for events my loco goes too <cprofitt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewYorkTeam/Events/20110324 <cprofitt> that was likely converted -- the image I gave you <etneg_> ah ok <cprofitt> the source was vector which allowed me to blow it up for that poster in the events link <etneg_> ok if you're looking at posters and sutff i'll pass for the time being though <etneg_> i could do it in vectors but it's time consuming and the results are okayish unless i spend 100hrs on it trying to capture realism <cprofitt> anything is great <etneg_> i was htinking of doing wallpapers for ubuntu <etneg_> but im jsut sticking to logos for now, since ive gotten into the 3d bandwagon and it'llbe a month ebfore i can do anything realistic <etneg_> and the results from 3d are far far better than 2d vectors <cprofitt> anything at all helps us... I am just happy to get artists involved <etneg_> sure <etneg_> i'll be around:D <cprofitt> would you do a logo for New York? <etneg_> sure why not * etneg_ is from ny <cprofitt> Be crazy and surprise me dude <etneg_> what doyou need? <cprofitt> two things if possible <cprofitt> something to replace this <cprofitt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewYorkTeam?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=newyorkteamlogo3.png <cprofitt> sorry for the long link <cprofitt> and I would love a header for a web page... <etneg_> hehwhat is that <etneg_> map ofny ? <etneg_> ooh i see it <etneg_> ubuntu + map of ny <cprofitt> that was representative of NY -- niagra falls to statue of liberty or something <cprofitt> yep, that version is really small <etneg_> you need a logo then? <cprofitt> the logo has NY LOCO and the ubuntu circile + state map <cprofitt> but I would be willing to see that replaced by other ideas <etneg_> i can work on fresh ideas if you like <cprofitt> yeah... I would really like that <etneg_> whats the context you need in it? NY LOCO, anything else? <cprofitt> that logo has been there for 5-6 years <cprofitt> just the NY and LOO <cprofitt> Loco <etneg_> you're a fan of sketch brush work? <cprofitt> though if the graphic really is recognizable as NY then the words could be left out <etneg_> the NY looks like a sketch brush <etneg_> and you've used the same sketching style in the poster as well <cprofitt> I have no preference as far as that goes <cprofitt> neither image was mine <etneg_> oh k <cprofitt> I like glassy as well <etneg_> k cool <etneg_> web2.0 <cprofitt> this is some of my work <cprofitt> http://ftbeowulf.wordpress.com/2009/12/21/lugor-logo-part-5/ <etneg_> while the gloss looks right <etneg_> that trace bitmap on that image looks pretty messed up and is an awful lot for a logo if you ask me <cprofitt> those were some of the first efforts with GIMP <cprofitt> so they are far from perfect <etneg_> oh its all in gimp/ <etneg_> ? <cprofitt> yeah <cprofitt> all gimp <etneg_> oh ok <cprofitt> and it was 100% targeted for a web page banner <etneg_> ah ye for a banner it'll fit <etneg_> for a logo too much going on there with the arhictecture <cprofitt> http://lugor.org/ <cprofitt> that is what ended up being used when it was done <etneg_> did you try printing that? <cprofitt> I did. I used it on some 8.5x11" posters we use at showed <cprofitt> with Photo Glossy paper it looks pretty good <etneg_> not bad <etneg_> oh you used a normal printer to print it out <etneg_> not offset ? <cprofitt> you can kind of see the poster in this picture <cprofitt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewYorkTeam/Events/20110505 <cprofitt> an inkjet <etneg_> ok <cprofitt> this one too <cprofitt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewYorkTeam/Events/20110423 <cprofitt> yeah... I am by no means a professional artist <cprofitt> I need a lot of help in that department <etneg_> imno pro either but i cna design your logo! <cprofitt> I have just enough skills to cover for a little while <cprofitt> awesome dude... that would rock <cprofitt> you can email me at any time at alexanderlisa@example.com <etneg_> alright <etneg_> i'll put together something in abit <etneg_> just gimme feedback via mail or irc and i'll keep going at it:P <cprofitt> sounds great etneg_ <cprofitt> I am stoked!! * etneg_ heads to the drawing board <cprofitt> I nominate etneg_, the artist, for a community trophy!! #ubuntu-design 2012-02-18 <cprofitt> jam jam... art jam <mainerror> Huh? <cprofitt> global jam coming up... soon it will be time for the art jam part of the global jam <cprofitt> http://ftbeowulf.wordpress.com/2012/02/17/jam-jam-ubuntu-global-jam-art-jam/ <cprofitt> hey jono <jono> howdy cprofitt <cprofitt> got the first interview done <jono> good work cprofitt :-) <jono> I saw that :-) <jono> I will promote it in a bit <cprofitt> thanks... trying to figure out how to fix the formatting for the planet a bit... <jono> :-) #ubuntu-design 2012-02-19 <Fitoschido> Hi everyone! I hope here's the right place to talk about the design of the Ubuntu installer! <Fitoschido> I opened a bug <http://pad.lv/930681> regarding that the headers in the installer should look like a primary toolbar (with gradient), in order to be consistent with other programs. <cwt-bugs> Launchpad bug 930681 in Ubiquity Slideshow "Headers do not look the same as other applications" (affected: 1, heat: 8) [Undecided,In progress] - Assigned to Fitoschido (fitoschido) <Fitoschido> I changed it so the slideshow looks like this: <http://i.imgur.com/fydRN.png> <etneg_> oh cp isnt here <etneg_> anyone with NY loco? #ubuntu-design 2012-02-20 <dholbach> good morning <etneg> morning * etneg yawns <etneg> i'll prolly hit to bed in a bit <etneg> whoever is awake <etneg> hey MrChrisDruif <etneg> sup <MrChrisDruif> Aloha etneg , nothing much. You? <etneg> nothing much, more logos <MrChrisDruif> More logos? <etneg> just working on logos <MrChrisDruif> Logos for what? ^_^ <etneg> working on one for NY loco <MrChrisDruif> Awesome <etneg> ubuntu NY loco <etneg> ye got done with the second concept, lets see what cprofitt says <MrChrisDruif> ^_^ <MrChrisDruif> How did you like AlanBell's idea in the mailing-list? A small app to make .desktops for apps without them? <etneg> no idea, i dont follow the Mls <etneg> what's the idea again <MrChrisDruif> etneg; https://lists.launchpad.net/unity-design/msg07920.html <etneg> yay <etneg> ccpriftt likes the concept #ubuntu-design 2012-02-21 <etneg> exit <dholbach> good morning <mainerror> o/ <mainerror> http://meta.askubuntu.com/a/2633/2732 <mainerror> What do you guys think? <mainerror> The mission was to design a Google Plus logo for Ask Ubuntu. <mainerror> It should somehow have Ask Ubuntu elements and Google Plus elements. <mainerror> https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/397723 <cwt-bugs> Launchpad bug 397723 in Inkscape "Draw a chessboard in the background to know when alpha < 100%" (affected: 3, heat: 20) [Wishlist,Confirmed] <mainerror> Nice feature request. <mainerror> If I have an idea for an Ubuntu accessory, against which project would I file that bug? <mainerror> sladen: -^ <sladen> mainerror: http://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branding/+filebug?field.title=Idea+for+Ubuntu+accessory <sladen> mainerror: no guarantee that Canonical would be able to help, but I we can at least make sure that it's saved somewhere for discussion <mainerror> Someone pointed out that it might not be a bug but an idea which should be posted on Ubuntu Brainstorm. <mainerror> It would be nice to have an Ubuntu Frisbee. :) <mainerror> That is the idea basically. :) <mainerror> http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/29255/ <sladen> mainerror: you should also put on there what you might be prepared to pay for it <sladen> mainerror: the design work should be easy (it's just the logo/circle of friends probably), but for turning it into a physical product you'll have to work out costings <sladen> and the business case <mainerror> The truth is, that I have no idea how much a Frisbee actually costs but because it would be an Ubuntu Frisbee I'd definitely pay more than for other Frisbees. <sladen> getting an orange frisbee of the correct colour will be hard; so it might be easier to do orange ink silkscreened onto a white substrate <sladen> mainerror: well, would you pay $25 ? <mainerror> No no, that is why I proposed a white base with an orange CoF printed on it. <mainerror> I guess I'd do. <mainerror> Sure orange plastic with a white circle of friends would be amazing as well but just very expensive in production. <mainerror> Here are some mockups. <mainerror> http://i.imgur.com/0UuAm.jpg <mainerror> http://i.imgur.com/EmqRt.jpg <mainerror> http://i.imgur.com/xbfml.jpg <mainerror> I like the second one. <mainerror> This is how it could look like on an orange substrate. <mainerror> http://i.imgur.com/dfp03.jpg <mainerror> http://imgur.com/dfp03,i4vpa#1 <mainerror> http://i.imgur.com/i4vpa.jpg <etneg> brb <MrChrisDruif> sys <sladen> mainerror: probably better to individually attach them to the bug report so that they don't get lost <sladen> mainerror: they did look good though <mainerror> So you think I should file a bug report? <sladen> mainerror: I think you should file *something* more concrete than just raising it on ITC <sladen> IRC <sladen> mainerror: somewhere where it can be discussed, and found via Google <mainerror> I did on Brainstorm. http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/29255/ <mainerror> Just not sure if that is the right place. #ubuntu-design 2012-02-22 <dholbach> good morning <mainerror> Morning dholbach. o/ <mainerror> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+bug/938482 <cwt-bugs> Launchpad bug 938482 in ubuntu-branding "Ubuntu frisbee accessory idea" (affected: 1, heat: 6) [Undecided,New] <dholbach> hi mainerror <Chrissss> Hello Ubuntu Design, I've got a shot question about the "Ubuntu for Android" Video which was posted on the Celebrate Ubuntu YouTube channel. The Video been set to "Private", so that the public can't see the video anymore. Is this a mistake, or shouldn't this video get published any more. <Chrissss> I'm asking because I like to embed the video on my site (there are plenty of copies of that video on youtube), but I don't want do do this against the original creator of the video. Is it ok the embed one of these copies? <wendar> morning all <wendar> mainerror: I like your frisbee <mainerror> Thanks. :) #ubuntu-design 2012-02-23 <dholbach> good morning <mainerror> Morning. * czajkowski hugs sladen #ubuntu-design 2012-02-24 <sladen> morning <dholbach> good morning <mainerror> Morning. * thorwil hopes that the loosely pornview related thread on the design list marks the lowest point it will ever reach <czajkowski> thorwil: perhaps just leave it the people who were talking the most have said they wil refrain from making such comments <czajkowski> lets not feed trolls please <mainerror> doctormon: What is your opinion on this here? http://meta.askubuntu.com/a/2633/2732 <doctormon> mainerror: Let me have a lookk <doctormon> mainerror: I'm not a fan of competitions generally. It's disrespectful to creators to dismiss so much time. But this looks simple enough. <doctormon> Why are you thinking of joining in mainerror? <doctormon> I do like the simple plus though <mainerror> Oh, I'm not thinking about joining in, that simple plus one is mine actually. :) <mainerror> I forgot that my name here doesn't match my name there. <MrChrisDruif> What are we talking about? <doctormon> that's the mainerror with your name, yes. <mainerror> MrChrisDruif: I have asked doctormon for some feedback on my Ask Ubuntu Google Plus logo proposal. <MrChrisDruif> Awesome, where is the link? <MrChrisDruif> I just missed it <mainerror> http://meta.askubuntu.com/a/2633/2732 <doctormon> mainerror: Not a snerk or giggle about my pun. ;-) <mainerror> Oh right, sorry I totally missed that somehow. heh <mainerror> :D <doctormon> Did you see that design at the bottom? <doctormon> It's interesting, but too complex IMO <MrChrisDruif> mainerror; the simple one with the plus in the orange talk cloud is yours? <etneg> text in icons is a bad idea <etneg> you do not want that IMHO <mainerror> MrChrisDruif: Yes. <MrChrisDruif> etneg; agreed <mainerror> etneg: I agree. <MrChrisDruif> mainerror; I don't think it complies: "The logo must not be too similar to the Ask Ubuntu or Stack Exchange logo" * MrChrisDruif is off <mainerror> Well the thing is that people should somehow recognize Ask Ubuntu from that Google Plus page. <mainerror> Also, no one can copyright a speech-bubble. :D <mainerror> If you could do that I'd definitely copyright the straight line and license it. heh <etneg> speech bubble = overused :D <etneg> my $0.02 opinion <MrChrisDruif> mainerror; you understood why I said it didn't comply with the "rules" right? <mainerror> I assume because it is using an orange speech-bubble. <MrChrisDruif> Yeah, pretty much ^_^ <mainerror> I guess the real meaning of that rule was to not have the Ask Ubuntu logo with the _ask_ text inside incorporated into your logo. <MrChrisDruif> I thought of another version of your icon. Only changing the colouring <mainerror> To what color? <MrChrisDruif> The four colours of google(+) <mainerror> MrChrisDruif: Like this? http://i.imgur.com/aXv5j.png <mainerror> I don't know. I'm not a big fan. <mainerror> This could be a good icon for Google Plus itself but no one would make a connection between Ask Ubuntu and Google Plus from that icon. <MrChrisDruif> Yeah, like that <MrChrisDruif> Would indeed be a good logo for google+ itself, maybe not so for AU on G+ <MrChrisDruif> Got the .svg for that one for me? <MrChrisDruif> I'd like to use it on my wiki page ^_^ <MrChrisDruif> mainerror; ^ <etneg> that isnt centered <etneg> mainerror^^ <etneg> or is it? <etneg> just going by the naked eye:P <etneg> looks nice <mainerror> etneg: It is perfectly centered. ;) <etneg> very well then <etneg> :D <etneg> the outer edges though have jagged lines <etneg> likely from using a mask <mainerror> Nope, that is just because it was PNG converted. <mainerror> It lost a bit of information there. <mainerror> I have created it from scratch, so no Masks or stuff. :) <etneg> thats a bit odd it coming from a PNG export <etneg> mainerror: check your pvt <etneg> query <wendar> http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/02/21/google-to-sell-terminator-style-glasses-by-years-end/ <wendar> interesting rumor, even if untrue #ubuntu-design 2012-02-25 <nava> Hi all, i have some simple mock up for software centre, where should i show it ? #ubuntu-design 2012-02-26 <MobileDruif> Oh my gosh, the smallest issues are reported on the mailing-list...and discussed in the smallest detail..I never knew O_O <thorwil> i don't see discussing the smallest issues in a detailed manner on a design list as a problem. the running around in circles however is a problem #ubuntu-design 2012-02-28 <dholbach> good morning <mainerror> Does anyone know if there is something in the makings for http://packages.ubuntu.com in terms of design? <mainerror> I'd like to create some mock-ups and propose them. <mmiicc> mainerror: this maybe? https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/ <mainerror> Looks good but it is not quite the same. <mainerror> I guess that one is more for consumers than for contributors. <mainerror> It doesn't list dependencies and so on. <tauran> Hello Ubuntu Design Team, what's the designated way to make suggestions for unity? #ubuntu-design 2012-02-29 <dholbach> good morning <wendar> morning all <wendar> the news for the week, there is a very cool graphic design Lens coming up this week for Oneiric <wendar> it's in the ARB PPA if anyone would like a preview <wendar> https://launchpad.net/~app-review-board/+archive/staging <wendar> (It searches COLOURlovers, Deviantart, Dribbble, and Iconfinder) <wendar> I ran across this site by the Stanford Design School this week: http://dschool.stanford.edu/use-our-methods/ <wendar> Would anyone else be interested in talking through these, kind of like a "book club" for design techniques? <thorwil> at first sight, that reminds me of ideo <thorwil> wendar: not quite sure how a "book club" for design techniques would be supposed to work <wendar> thorwil: there's a good chance ideo and the stanford design school are connected, ideo has a location in Palo Alto, where Stanford is located <wendar> thorwil: I've gotten as far as thinking: I'd like to learn more about design techniques. What if I took one of those a week, studied it, practiced it. <wendar> thorwil: and then: wouldn't it be great if I could talk to others who were doing the same? <wendar> like, in a google hangout <wendar> and, when I ran out of those simple slides, maybe go on to some actual design books <thorwil> ah, like being a student ... ;) <wendar> yeah, kind of, but for fun :) <wendar> and, something interesting to talk about <thorwil> i see the appeal. meanwhile, i feel like i have enough theory and need to sink my teeth into a project (outside of work) <wendar> what kind of projects interest you? <thorwil> wendar: i have a very concrete interest in ardour. it's all about scheduling and discipline, now <thorwil> wendar: other than that, i still wonder how to spread design thinking in our circles <wendar> thorwil: ardour, as in ardour.org? <thorwil> yes <wendar> thorwil: looks like an interesting project to take on <wendar> thorwil: and, yes, I'm also wondering how to spread design thinking, but not sure how <thorwil> it already has a bit of my fingerprints on it. recent happenings in development suggest a lot to explore <wendar> thorwil: very cool <wendar> ideas spread by thinking about them, talking about them, putting them into practice <thorwil> as an example project where one could showcase process, ardour has the drawback of requiring quite a bit of context ... though maybe that's an advantage in another way <wendar> thorwil: I'd certainly be interested to see what you've done, and what you're thinking of doing next <wendar> thorwil: and even more, why you did it, and how you went about it <wendar> theory, process, result <thorwil> wendar: quite often it was iteration mockups, with most feedback via irc <thorwil> wendar: but http://thorwil.files.wordpress.com/2007/08/export_design_2007-08-11.pdf includes what could be called research <thorwil> the "result" part is a bit tricky, as the export stuff has been implemented in something like a finnish summer of code <thorwil> and it's only in ardour 3.0, currently going through betas * wendar reading through... <wendar> thorwil: so, you started with a user survey? then outlined the features in detail <wendar> what the features are, and why they're used <wendar> as well as the greatest requests from users <thorwil> wendar: to be precise, the start was defining what the essence is of what is to be designed. setting the scope <thorwil> pretty much what is in Introduction <wendar> which is the export dialog <wendar> and, page 7 starts looking at the current dialog in detail <wendar> with detailed notes on what could be improved <thorwil> yes, though i like to be mindful of the abstract vs concrete view, where the dialog is not the initial object and has to be questioned <wendar> explain abstract vs concrete? <thorwil> even if the answer to "do we need a dialog" seems obvious, the question has to be there <wendar> and initial object? <thorwil> the design briefing is not to design a dialog, but to design the export functionality <wendar> the abstract view, then, is to step away from the design artifact in front of your face, and think more deeply <wendar> ? <thorwil> so i try to keep design decisions out of the core of the briefing <thorwil> ah yes, artifact is helpful term here <wendar> by "initial object" you mean something like "starting point" or "root of the work"? <thorwil> yes <thorwil> recently one developer said "oh we could ask thorwil" (about a problem discussed before i went online), "but i'm sure he will come up with a good solution that will be too much work". â directly linked to being very methodically, i guess :) <thorwil> dinner, cya! <wendar> cya, thanks for the interesting chat <wendar> oh, looks like "initial object" is a term that started in mathematics <wendar> thorwil: and really, being methodical is quite necessary in design <wendar> Happy Leap Day everyone! <thorwil> heh, i was fishing for words, my maths education is rather weak (and even now my interest there is 'limited' to what seem useful for programming <nava> What do you think about this idea ? http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/29302/ <etneg> kenvandine: hey <etneg> any update on gwibber? <kenvandine> etneg, sorry, no... i guess i really need to spend some time reviewing all the feedback and make a decision :) <kenvandine> the new artwork would be for 12.10 anyway, not 12.04 <kenvandine> etneg, thanks for everything, i promise to do that soonish... this time in the cycle is crazy <etneg> oh ok cool <etneg> if you need more, let me
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