#launchpad-meeting 2007-01-08 <SteveA> hi <SteveA> is there a meeting here now? <thumper> #bzrlp on Canonical server #launchpad-meeting 2007-01-17 * Starting logfile irclogs/launchpad-meeting.log <ddaa> SteveA: ping <ddaa> thumper: ping <ddaa> Let's talk here <thumper> here <ddaa> so I won't mispresent SteveA <SteveA> hi <ddaa> Thumper said: <ddaa> (23:19:04) thumper: I don't feel a particularly desperate desire to be part of it if it's not necessary <ddaa> My notes about this sprint say <ddaa> Mention to poolie & tim: <ddaa> * Sprint 2 weeks .au in feb. or mar. <thumper> I also said: <thumper> [11:17] <thumper> the chance of me getting over there is remote to minimal due to my wife killing me <thumper> [11:17] <thumper> perhaps we could get jml over here <thumper> that is if I'm needed <ddaa> jml... Jonathan? <thumper> yep <ddaa> ha right <thumper> jml is his nick on freenode <ddaa> So, I said .au or .nz makes no difference for me. <SteveA> kiko and I are thinking about planning sprints for various launchpad teams <thumper> just to let you know, I have to head off in about 15 min <SteveA> the first question is whether there are things to achieve at a team in-person meeting <ddaa> Okay let's be quick just to sync with thumper <SteveA> then, to decide when, where and who <SteveA> if a meeting will be valuable, then getting ddaa down under is possible, and ddaa said he can be easily available for a 2 week trip <SteveA> so, that's something to consider <SteveA> but, I'm not saying that I favour it for its own sake <thumper> fair enough <ddaa> thumper: the other thing I wanted to tell you about <SteveA> it may be that there's enough back-end improving work for ddaa to do that a trip and meeting isn't useful for a while <ddaa> I mentioned that an increasing part of my import herding work is triaging import requests. As the system becomes more popular, more vcs details are entered by users who do not understand the implications and the launchpad best practices. <ddaa> So SteveA suggested that I come to Amsterdam next week, in particular to have some face time with matthewrevell to write documentation at which we can point users when an import request cannot go forward without reformulating it. <thumper> SteveA: there is the desire to get ddaa to spread the import knowledge more <thumper> ddaa: sounds like a very good idea to get more available docs <SteveA> which import knowledge in particular? <SteveA> we'll have a launchpad ops-admin person soon, who should learn how to roll out the importd stuff, and monitor it <SteveA> and understand how it does error reporting <thumper> what runs where and when, and how do fix things when things go wrong <thumper> SteveA: I didn't know about the launchpad-ops person <SteveA> so, at the level of services running correctly, that's something for the ops person to learn <thumper> they should understand it all <SteveA> he'll be working for james troup <thumper> SteveA: agreeed <ddaa> SteveA: regarding my personal constraints, I'm available starting next monday morning. <SteveA> as far as higher level stuff, to do with launchpad, database data, or VCS stuff going wrong <SteveA> that's something where we'll want to have damn good error reporting coming out from the importd systems <SteveA> so, I don't think it's important for jml to learn about detail of how the imports system works * ddaa dreams of a world were a list classified import failures is maintained automatically. <SteveA> thumper: I spoke to elmo today and we talked about your access to vostok, which will be granted soon <SteveA> good dream <thumper> SteveA: good <SteveA> I think it will be helpful for you to help ddaa work out good ways to make that dream come true <SteveA> that is, I think the access to vostok will help you understand the systems <SteveA> so you can assist in that <thumper> ok <SteveA> ultimately, you and ddaa should not need to use the systems much directly <SteveA> as that'll become the ops person's job <thumper> I agree with that <SteveA> there will actually be 2 ops people <SteveA> so there will be holiday cover <SteveA> one person primarily for landscape, one primarily for launchpad <SteveA> but being able to cover for each other <thumper> sounds like a damn fine idea <SteveA> takes some load of stub too <thumper> handholding server processes is not my idea of fun * ddaa feels slightly intimitated at the idea of no longer working in a cosy start up, but in a large company with plenty of q&a, ops, PR, and business people. <SteveA> so, ddaa and I were talking about getting decent error handling and error reporting into the systems <SteveA> as they currently are <SteveA> without doing a lot of refactoring first <thumper> ddaa: at least it is growing organically, and you're not being dumped in it <SteveA> and as a matter of urgency <SteveA> ddaa said he'd look at what can be done simply <ddaa> thumper: I'm sure it's an interesting thing to watch and make happen. <SteveA> it's like a rollercoaster on the moon <SteveA> without seat restraints <SteveA> powered by cheese <ddaa> thumper: SteveA drove a nail home about making things even more messy if necessary as long as we get error reporting. <thumper> ddaa: fair enough, I'm happy with that <thumper> as long as it doesn't stay messy for ever <SteveA> ddaa: you can still type one-handed, right? <ddaa> that's why I am reluctant. Anything that do not make messiness monotonously decreasing smells danger to me. <SteveA> there's messiness and there's functioning correctly <SteveA> they way I see it is we need to know how much we're functioning correctly <thumper> I don't think that there would be a big increase in mess <SteveA> so that when we improve the messiness <thumper> just not a decrease <thumper> I'm ok with that <SteveA> we know we're not doing so at the expense of QOS <ddaa> SteveA: don't worry, I'm sold to the idea of getting a better hold on how the thing work. <thumper> guys, I've gotta go <ddaa> If only to make the boss feel less anxious about it. <SteveA> cool, catch you later <ddaa> thumper: cya, the two sprint things are what I wanted to ping you about. <SteveA> thanks for delivering the summary of our conversation ddaa <ddaa> SteveA: thanks for fixing my inaccuracies #launchpad-meeting 2007-01-18 <ddaa> So... regarding the .nl thing <matthewrevell> hi <SteveA> hi <SteveA> so, ddaa, when can you arrive in .nl? <SteveA> you were going to look into that <ddaa> Tue Jan. 30th evening <ddaa> Going home Fri night or Sat is okay <matthewrevell> ddaa: Great, so we'll have all of 31st. <matthewrevell> ddaa: Are you in Hotel Aarborg? <ddaa> Accomodation not yet sorted out. <ddaa> neither are train tickets <ddaa> But the latter is easy <matthewrevell> yeah <matthewrevell> Aarborg is where I'm staying. Looks decent and is close to the venue <ddaa> Yeah, why not... <ddaa> matthewrevell: did you do anything special? I just got used to SteveA taking care of small details like finding me a bed to sleep in :) <SteveA> sorry, got distracted by kiko <matthewrevell> ddaa: steve recommended Aarborg and I booked it through Expedia.co.uk. <ddaa> so my concern usually stops at dragging my ass there <SteveA> so, matthewrevell, you're there tue + wed <SteveA> ddaa: you're proposing to come tuesday night, work with matthew wed. <matthewrevell> Yeah, arrive at Schiphol around 9am Tues and leave 20:00 Weds <SteveA> how about matthewrevell, you stay an extra day? <SteveA> does that work? <ddaa> Mh... I could come earlier Tuesday, too. <matthewrevell> That would be fine, yeah. I'll look into flights <SteveA> ddaa: how much earlier? <ddaa> In the afternoon. <SteveA> be specific <SteveA> arriving at the station at 4pm is different than 1pm <SteveA> in terms of getting stuff usefully done <ddaa> Do not have anything particalr to do on Tuesday. So it's limited by wake-up time and train schedules. <ddaa> So... 1pm would be possible <SteveA> that's good <SteveA> earlier the better <SteveA> making best use of everyone's time together <SteveA> so, matthewrevell, see if you can stay one further day <matthewrevell> It's roughly an extra 50 Euros for me to move the flight to 20:00 of 1st Feb. <SteveA> fine <matthewrevell> Cool. I'll sort that out. <SteveA> check with the hotel, phone them directly <SteveA> ddaa: make a reservation at the hotel right now, they book up fast <SteveA> so, both of you leave thursday eve? <matthewrevell> Yeah, I'll be leaving on the 20:00 flight from Schiphol. I can stay till Friday if necessary. <ddaa> could stay longer <SteveA> sure <SteveA> I'm fine with you both leaving friday evening <SteveA> so, is that agreed? <matthewrevell> I'll just check flights for Friday * ddaa wonders if we really have a use for four days <ddaa> it started as one wednesday, and now we're talking tue a.m. to fri night. <SteveA> I think it'll be good to work together <SteveA> it won't be just on the docs <SteveA> I expect you to work on the other back-end imports stuff <SteveA> and you'll be able to bounce things off my and lifeless <matthewrevell> Okay, so before I book the flight, are we agreed on Friday? <ddaa> Sure, will be there on friday. <SteveA> how much is it per night at the aalborg? <SteveA> 50 EUR or something? <matthewrevell> Roughly that <matthewrevell> SteveA: But it cost me 49 <SteveA> ok. if they want much more than that, let me know <ddaa> SteveA: if you do not mind, I'll prefer arriving on Tue. evening. <SteveA> ddaa: why is that? <SteveA> what will you do tuesday during the day? <ddaa> usual work <ddaa> nothing specific, I just don't enjoy rushing for trains in the morning, thus the "if you don't mind". <SteveA> If you're not getting up early to catch the train, will you get up early to work? <SteveA> and if you don't ,then I don't really see any benefit at all <ddaa> See your point. <SteveA> get an early train, you can nap and work disconnected on the train <matthewrevell> SteveA: It's going to be 97 for the extra two nights for me. Sound okay? <SteveA> and then we'll be able to get stuff done tuesday afternoon <SteveA> matthewrevell: fine <ddaa> okay to tue. am to fri night <SteveA> matthewrevell: are you on the phone with them? <ddaa> will book and stuff <SteveA> matthewrevell: or booking online? <matthewrevell> No, Expedia. When I rang them last week, the price was more expensive through them directly <SteveA> ok <ddaa> SteveA: so the town in Amsterdam, right? Not Rotterdam. <matthewrevell_> SteveA: All booked <SteveA> Amsterdam <SteveA> yes <SteveA> ok, great <SteveA> and I checked it out with cvd too <SteveA> so we're all good <ddaa> SteveA: earliest I can land in amsterdam CS is 14:06 <ddaa> SteveA: it's "Hotel Aalborg", not Aarborg, right? <SteveA> yes <SteveA> on ceintuurbaan or sarphatipark <SteveA> same road, different names for part of it <ddaa> paying right now <SteveA> matthewrevell_: I have some comments on CreatingYourLaunchpadAccount <SteveA> mention that you might have an account already if you used shipit <SteveA> you also need an account for editing certain wikis like the ubuntu wiki <SteveA> matthewrevell_: ^^^^ <matthewrevell_> SteveA: Yes, sorry for the delay in replying. Thanks for that. I'll amend it accordingly. <SteveA> rest of it looks good #launchpad-meeting 2008-01-02 <bac> no reviewers meeting today <gmb> Heh. <gmb> bac: Question or statement? * gmb looks * gmb realises: statement <bac> statement. <bac> sorry for my lack of punctuation! <intellectronica> me <sinzui> me <sinzui> Wow I am late <bac> hey guys barry said the meeting is cancelled today. <intellectronica> sinzui: i think it's only me and you today :) <intellectronica> bac: oh, ok, that explains is then #launchpad-meeting 2008-01-03 <mpt> Launchpad meeting grounds | Next development meeting (all welcome): Thu 10 Jan 2008, 1400UTC | Channel logs: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ <mpt> Bah, can't set the topic because I'm not an op <jtv> mpt is a no-op <mpt> Suddenly my life assumes new meaning * mwhudson looks around * barry sees mhudson looking around * schwuk sees barry see mwhudson looking around <statik> no meeting today <statik> not blocked <statik> there, I said it anyway <jtv> "me" <mthaddon> no meeting? <jtv> No meeting. <barry> attaboy sinzui #launchpad-meeting 2008-01-08 <thumper> = Meeting Time = <thumper> * Roll call <thumper> * Next meeting <thumper> * Action items <thumper> * Queue status <thumper> * Mentoring update <thumper> * Review process changes <thumper> * Tool update <thumper> * Roll call <thumper> appologies from jml <thumper> BjornT_: ping <thumper> and I'm guessing that jamesh and spiv are here <spiv> I'm here, although only briefly. <BjornT_> i'm here <jamesh> I'm here. <thumper> spiv: ok I'll be quick <thumper> since spiv has to go <thumper> I'll raise the only contentious part first <thumper> barry has requested that we move the reviewer meeting so he can attend <thumper> the times he gave me are 0:00UTC or 05:00UTC <thumper> how does that work for you ozzies? <thumper> obviously my preference is for 00:00UTC <thumper> 05:00UTC is midnight for barry <thumper> so I'm guessing his preference would be for 00:00UTC too <spiv> So 1 hour ago or 6 hours ago? <thumper> spiv: right <spiv> Those are both fine with me. <thumper> jamesh: you are west-most <thumper> how is 6 hours earlier for you? <spiv> (Although I'm probably the least important person, given how little I've been reviewing lately) <thumper> BjornT_: do you care too much? <jamesh> 05:00 is fine for me. 00:00 is okay during daylight savings (9am) <jamesh> I think the plan was for barry to replace BjornT, right? <BjornT_> thumper: no, choose what's best for you guys. i don't have to attend it. <thumper> jamesh: I think so <thumper> jamesh: how about 00:00UTC and re-evaluate when DST ends <jamesh> okay <thumper> sold * thumper looks at the queue <thumper> 13 branches pending <thumper> 2 over (one of those unallocated) <thumper> 3 unknown/broken branches <thumper> 9 unallocated <thumper> ok so 4 of those are mine... <spiv> 3 is a lot of unknowns. <thumper> I was hoping to hit barry up tomorrow morning for at least two of them <thumper> spiv: yeah, don't know what's going on with those <jamesh> I've got sabdfl's jumbo branch to do, but that's not listed in the queue <thumper> sabdfl has another jumbo one? * thumper shakes his head <jamesh> the one from just before the break <thumper> I might put two into barry's queue that I care desperately about <thumper> the others can be done by anyone <thumper> I'm prepared to trade reviews <thumper> :) * spiv -> gone <thumper> barry is on call morning US time <thumper> spiv: bye <thumper> jamesh: can you allocate some reviews later? <thumper> or I could do it <jamesh> thumper: sure. <spiv> Have a good rest-of-meeting! <jamesh> I'm on call at the moment too, in case there is anything that needs quick turn-around <thumper> Actions from the last meeting: <thumper> * barry to edit him some wikis about on-call procedures <thumper> * intellectronica to work on a cover letter template <thumper> nothing for us to do <thumper> jamesh: ah, ok <thumper> I'll poke you in a few minutes <thumper> * no proposed items <thumper> * any other business? <thumper> 5 <thumper> 4 <thumper> 3 <thumper> 2 <thumper> 1 <thumper> 0.5 <thumper> = Meeting ends = <thumper> thanks for coming #launchpad-meeting 2008-01-09 <statik> me <bac> me 2 * sinzui says me <barry> welcome to the ameu launchpad reviewers meeting, for the next 45 minutes or less <barry> == Agenda == <barry> * Roll call <barry> * Next meeting <barry> * Action items <barry> * Queue status <barry> * Leftover branches - confirm that the on-call reviewer should allocate all remaining branches on the general queue at the end of his shift (or discuss a different solution). <barry> * Mentoring update <barry> * Review process changes <barry> * Tool update * barry goes a reviewer-rustlin' <BjornT_> me <salgado> me <intellectronica> me <gmb> me <statik> me <sinzui> me <flacoste> me <bac> me <barry> great, welcome to our first meeting of 2008! <barry> * Next meeting <barry> today + 1week? any objections? any known absences? <barry> 5 <barry> 4 <barry> 3 <barry> 2 <barry> 1 <barry> * Action items <barry> Actions from the last meeting: <barry> * barry to edit him some wikis about on-call procedures <barry> * intellectronica to work on a cover letter template * barry sucks; he will edit him some wikis * intellectronica sucks too <barry> i really will try to do that this week <barry> * Queue status <barry> * Leftover branches - confirm that the on-call reviewer should allocate all remaining branches on the general queue at the end of his shift (or discuss a different solution). <barry> * Mentoring update <intellectronica> i'll try to do this promptly and talk to mwh about inclusion in his tool <barry> (oops c&p error there) <barry> intellectronica: excellent, thanks <barry> so the general queue got pretty big <sinzui> intellectronica: mwh is out for the next 3.5 weeks <barry> and intellectronica reminded me this morning that we'd decided to have on-call reviewers do a general queue assignment at the end of his shift <intellectronica> sinzui: well, i won't talk to him, then <barry> intellectronica: we can keep this on the agenda until mwh gets back <barry> i don't think it's urgent <barry> fwiw, i gave lifeless the opportunity to shed load so he won't be doing PR assignments for now <barry> and i know we all want to just kill off PR anyway <barry> but for now, intellectronica can you do a general queue assignment when you're done for the day? <intellectronica> will do. if ppl /don't/ want branches for review tonight, drop by in #launchpad-reviews and say yo <salgado> I'd stopped doing the allocations because then on call reviewers could take the unassigned ones when there wasn't any branches for them to review <intellectronica> salgado: but today, for example, by the time i finish the queue will, in all likelihood, still have quite a few branches in it <barry> salgado: i wonder if falling behind was mostly an aberration around the holidays/new years? <salgado> yeah, I was wondering that as well <sinzui> barry: That and the fact that reviewers are still out <intellectronica> barry: from what i can tell the queue filled up significantly after your shift yesterday <intellectronica> barry: so it's something we can expect to happen every now and then <barry> intellectronica: it was pretty full when i checked toward the latter part of my shift, but by then i was already booked on reviews <intellectronica> either way - allocations are not going anywhere, even with on call reviews :-/ <barry> we need to clear the backlog, so let's do this: intellectronica do an assignment at the end of today and let's all do our reviews the old way <barry> that should clear the backlog and let us get back to our super-efficent on-call process :) <salgado> sounds good to me <barry> so maybe we should do general assignments on an as-needed basis only, and not as s.o.p. for on-callers? <flacoste> well <flacoste> i have some problems with that strategy <flacoste> problem being that branches on the general queue still should be serviced in the <48H SLA <flacoste> so they sould be assigned ASAP for that <flacoste> if the on-call cannot do them <flacoste> otherwise, there is a risk that they'll be unassigned for a complete shift <flacoste> because the on-call is prompted for new branches <flacoste> and then branches on general reviews will linger <flacoste> so i think the process should be <flacoste> on-call reviewer does allocation <flacoste> many times during the day <flacoste> if he has slack he assigns some to himself <flacoste> put assign others <flacoste> no keeping in general queue for the case - where the on-call "might" have time <flacoste> reviewers should still check PendingReviews daily to see if they have assigned branches <sinzui> +1 <barry> ok, that's fine by me <flacoste> i would suggest that after each review, the on-call does an allocation run <intellectronica> flacoste: you've got a point there <intellectronica> +1 <flacoste> and it's ok for new branches to pre-empt stuff in the general queue <flacoste> iow, even if there are unallocated reviews in the general queue, the on-call should still accept an interactive request for a review <flacoste> the 'general queue' stuff will be assigned to other reviews <flacoste> reviewers <flacoste> one gotcha though <barry> sounds good. the only risk is that the on-caller will not have anything to do while there are still needs-review branches in other people's queue. i'm okay with that <flacoste> allocation of reviews to somebody who is fed up with reviews because he was on-called the previous day <flacoste> or something like that <barry> flacoste: that reviewer can always move the branch to the rejected queue <flacoste> good point! <flacoste> and we should emphasis that! <barry> yep <flacoste> don't be afraid of rejecting reviews because you had a full on-call day! <flacoste> of course, allocating to the next on-call is probably a good idea <bac> or on-call reviewers can mark their queue with /!\ if they really don't want to accept other reviews. 20% is a lot for of time for reviewing <barry> hey, there ya go. we should just wipe all the review queues and round-robin all needs-reviews to the next on-caller :) <flacoste> barry: i fear for the SLA with that strategy <barry> flacoste: i was kidding <barry> well, this is never going to be perfect until we get rid of PR anyway <wink> so let's go with flacoste's plan and see how it goes * barry will edit him some wikis <barry> anything else on this topic? <barry> 5 <barry> 4 <barry> 3 <barry> 2 <barry> 1 <barry> * Mentoring update <gmb> I've had no reviews for salgado or mwhudson to mentor since last cycle. <barry> gmb: cool. you're next on-call is coming up right? <gmb> A combination of sickness and super-efficient on-call revfiews, I think. <gmb> barry: I think so. salgado, are you o/c tomorrow? <salgado> gmb, yep <gmb> salgado: Mind if I join you? <salgado> gmb, not at all! <gmb> Cool. <flacoste> hey, another worthwhile allocation strategy: gives them to mentoree! <gmb> barry: There's your answer then :) <barry> gmb: excellent! <barry> flacoste: you're the perfect straight man. which leads me to my next question... <barry> is it time for more recruits? <barry> right now we have just gmb, ddaa, and jvt <flacoste> with mwhudson off, i think it's a good idea <barry> i think jvt will never graduate (by his own choice iiuc) <flacoste> some people just like staying in school all their life! <barry> any nominations? <intellectronica> cprov <flacoste> barry: i think you had volunteers? <barry> flacoste: i did <barry> jsk was one :/ <barry> schwuk was another <flacoste> maybe <flacoste> we should <flacoste> send an request for candidates to launchpad <barry> there aren't too many others left are there? :) allenap, edwin, bigjools (actually i think he volunteered too), leondardr <bigjools> I did indeed <barry> how many can we reasonably digest now? we need mentors for each <cprov> intellectronica: here <sinzui> allenap attended our reviewer's meeting at all hands. I thought he was interested <intellectronica> cprov: i was just suggesting that you might want to become a reviewer <flacoste> i suggest a "call for candidacy" <cprov> intellectronica: wait, you are nominating me to become a reviewer ... <flacoste> and collect candidates and try to find mentors next week <barry> flacoste: i say a volunteer candidate has to rustle himself up a mentor. :) <flacoste> that's also a good strategy <barry> and we'll accept whoever 1) volunteers; 2) has an agreed mentor <flacoste> ok <flacoste> and we can talk about people who have 1) but not 2) in next meeting * barry feels like we're getting very close to "everyone is a reviewer" <barry> flacoste: +1 <barry> oh yeah, abel too <barry> (abel is not a reviewer yet) <barry> great. anthing else on this topic? <barry> 5 <flacoste> carlos and danilos are two others <barry> flacoste: right! <barry> 4 <barry> 3 <barry> 2 <cprov> intellectronica: maybe after 1.2.5, I feel busy enough until Soyuz 2.0 features get established, but thanks for considering it <flacoste> as is Edwin <barry> 1 <danilos> I should start the procedure soon enough <danilos> (as discussed with kiko last year :) <barry> danilos: it's never to early to find a mentor :) <barry> * Review process changes <barry> * Tool update <danilos> barry: will look into finding one, thanks for the heads up <barry> danilos: i will send a "call for candidates" later today <danilos> barry: great, thanks <barry> gmb: anything to report on the tool? i had some problems with the plugin yesterday, but i think it was because my rf was messed up. i re-branched and it worked great <gmb> barry: No, nothing new. With sickness etc I haven't touched on it much, though allenap has volunteered to help with it when he gets time. <sinzui> I always use the -d option to pass the diff I made. I sometimes annotate the diff <barry> gmb, allenap_ great! <barry> okay, that's it from me. we have 3 minutes left. anybody have anything not on the agenda? <barry> sounds like we're done then <barry> MEETING ENDS <barry> thanks everyone! <bac> thanks barry <mwhudson> notes from off: there's a branch on the bazaar mailing list that will make the diff computation review-submit does much faster <barry> mwhudson: cool #launchpad-meeting 2008-01-10 <danilos> you? <jtv> me? <barry> mii <ddaa> self <bac> yo <sinzui> I <SteveA> Who is chairing today's meeting? <danilos> kiko or someone he delegates :) <danilos> that's what the MeetingAgenda says <SteveA> who has kiko delegated? <SteveA> BjornT_: would you run today's meeting? <danilos> apparently, nobody <BjornT_> SteveA: sure, i'll do it <SteveA> thanks <BjornT_> so, roll call. who's here? <jtv> me <mrevell> me <SteveA> me <matsubara> me <flacoste> me <mpt> me <schwuk> me <bac> me <statik> me <jamesh> me <barry> me <adeuring> me <ddaa> me <stub> me <sinzui> me <intellectronica> me <salgado> me <mthaddon> me <allenap> me <danilos> me <gmb> me. <BjornT_> == Agenda == <gmb> Sorry. <BjornT_> * Roll call <BjornT_> * Agenda <BjornT_> * Next meeting <BjornT_> * Actions from last meeting <BjornT_> * Oops report (Matsubara) <leonardr> me <BjornT_> * Critical Bugs (Rinchen) <BjornT_> * Bug tags <BjornT_> * Operations report (mthaddon) <BjornT_> * DBA report (stub) <BjornT_> * Sysadmin requests (Rinchen) <BjornT_> * A top user-affecting issue (mrevell) <BjornT_> ---- <BjornT_> * Test plans ownership (flacoste) <BjornT_> * Add your bug feed to your website (mrevell) <BjornT_> ---- <BjornT_> * Blockers <BjornT_> who will not be here for the meeting next week? <BjornT_> ok. so next meeting will be as usual, 17th jan, 1400 UTC <BjornT_> * Actions from last meeting <BjornT_> there were no actions from the last meeting <BjornT_> * Oops report (Matsubara) <matsubara> Today's oops report is about bugs 181772, 181770 <ubotu> Bug 181772 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/181772 is private <matsubara> bigjools: can you take181772? <matsubara> I've chatted with flacoste about #181770 already and assigned to him <matsubara> bigjools: ? <bigjools> hi <matsubara> am I lagged? <SteveA> bug 181770 <ubotu> Launchpad bug 181770 in launchpad "Oops deleting a package link" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/181770 <bigjools> matsubara: I can take that <SteveA> matsubara: I don't think you are lagged <ddaa> I'd be happy to take that <matsubara> thanks bigjools <matsubara> ddaa: please coordinate with flacoste about it. thanks for volunteering <flacoste> ddaa: if you mean 181770, yes, I think it's a fallout from your branch <ddaa> flacoste: indeed <BjornT_> ok, let's move on. there has been an amendment to the agenda. SteveA has an item now. <matsubara> BjornT_: I'm done with oops reports. I'll move on to Joey's critical bugs <BjornT_> * launchpad-security team (SteveA) <matsubara> BjornT_: ok, go on <matsubara> SteveA: stage is yours :-) <SteveA> thanks <carlos> sorry, I forgot the meeting completely... <SteveA> right now, we have the launchpad-security team <SteveA> and it is automatically subscribed to bugs that are marked as related to security <SteveA> the problem with that is that we often need to have private bugs for launchpad that are not related to security <SteveA> so, there's a lot of noise for members of launchpad-security <SteveA> both in bugs that that team is subscribed to <SteveA> and in new bugs being temporarily subscribed to, and then unsubscribed <SteveA> I'm going to work around this by creating a new team: launchpad-security-autosubscribed <mpt> SteveA, currently "Launchpad Developers" is a member of "Launchpad Security" <SteveA> that will have launchpad developers as a member, and will be the security contact for launchpad projects <SteveA> we'll need to manually subscribe the "real" launchpad-security team to bugs that are really security issues <mpt> so "members of launchpad-security" means "all the developers" <SteveA> we have some outside help on launchpad-security, including james troup and kees cook <mpt> yes <barry> SteveA: doesn't it (perhaps also) make sense to have a separate checkbox for "this is a private (not security) bug" or somesuch? currently the workflow for private-not-security bugs is a pita <cprov> me (sorry) <SteveA> barry: yes, I've separately proposed better support for projects like launchpad <SteveA> barry: that will take a while to get done <barry> SteveA: cool, thanks <SteveA> barry: it's with the lpcomm team <SteveA> so, I'll be doing this change today <SteveA> any questions? <SteveA> 4 <SteveA> 3 <SteveA> 2 <SteveA> 1 <SteveA> thank you <BjornT_> ok, thanks <BjornT_> * Critical Bugs (matsubara) <EdwinGrubbs> me, sorry I'm late <matsubara> We have two critical bugs not yet started: bug 181766 and bug 181771. <ubotu> Launchpad bug 181766 in launchpad "fix mailing list message headers and footers" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/181766 <ubotu> Bug 181771 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/181771 is private <matsubara> barry, do you have a status report about them? <flacoste> why are those critical? <barry> matsubara: i just reported them about 10 minutes ago :) <barry> flacoste: sorry, they shouldn't have been critical, but high * barry will fix <matsubara> barry: all right <matsubara> so, no critical bugs atm <matsubara> BjornT_: I'm done here. <barry> fixed <BjornT_> * Bug tags <BjornT_> no new tags have been proposed <BjornT_> * Operations report (mthaddon) <mthaddon> Staging update script in progress <mthaddon> Staging supermirror rewritemap script now in place <mthaddon> Staging mailman complete (I believe?) <mthaddon> Scheduled downtime tomorrow to enable BBWC and for a PostgreSQL security update <mthaddon> Any final comments on the paramiko/bzr upgrade tests before we roll those out to all LP servers? <mthaddon> That's it from me unless there are any questions <barry> mthaddon: YES! thanks so much <mthaddon> cool <barry> mthaddon: we may want to run a few more tests (including a full rebuild) once my branch that flacoste is reviewing lands <mthaddon> barry, absolutely - just let me know when <barry> mthaddon: great, thanks <BjornT_> ok, moving on <BjornT_> * DBA report (stub) <stub> DB patch review call happened today with Mark. A couple of patches will <stub> get name changes. Two are rejected (bugs forwarded upstream, <stub> and bugs fixed elsewhere/upstream). I'll be doing the formal reviews tomorrow. <stub> Nothing else happening. <BjornT_> any questions for stub? <BjornT_> 4 <BjornT_> 3 <BjornT_> 2 <BjornT_> 1 <BjornT_> * Sysadmin requests (Rinchen) <BjornT_> anyone have any outstanding rt requests rinchen should know about? <BjornT_> 5 <BjornT_> 4 <BjornT_> 3 <BjornT_> 2 <BjornT_> 1 <BjornT_> * A top user-affecting issue (mrevell) <mrevell> Howdy <mrevell> Hello. Today's user-affecting issue is related to bug 60915. <ubotu> Launchpad bug 60915 in usplash "usplash messes up colors on console" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/60915 <mrevell> At present, non-authenticated users see an obfuscated version of email addresses in bug comments. <mrevell> However, email addresses in bug comments are still displayed to logged-in users. <mrevell> This has caused a complaint from someone who has reported a bug to Cocinella project. The bug reporter felt that as they had chosen to hide their email address in Launchpad it should not appear in bug alexanderlisa@example.com. <danilos> mrevell: is it really 60915? <mrevell> danilos: Thank you, no, not that one. Sorry. <SteveA> I see one email address there <mrevell> bug 60195 <ubotu> Launchpad bug 60195 in launchpad-answers "May need to obfuscate email addresses in comments" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/60195 <SteveA> at the domain paul.sladen.org <SteveA> is that the email address being objected to? <mrevell> The bug that caused the complaint is: bug 180132 <ubotu> Launchpad bug 180132 in coccinella "Login settings are not saved" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/180132 <mrevell> comments 1 and 3 include the email address and comment 11 is where the reporter asked for removal <SteveA> what's bug 60915 then? <ubotu> Launchpad bug 60915 in usplash "usplash messes up colors on console" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/60915 <mrevell> SteveA: A typo on my part. Sorry. <BjornT_> mrevell: could you file a bug or send a mail to the list about this? we won't be able to come up with a solution in this meeting. <mrevell> BjornT_: Thank you. I shall file a bug. <BjornT_> thanks <carlos> SteveA: do we parse and hide email addresses included in bug comment text ? <BjornT_> * Test plans ownership (flacoste) <SteveA> carlos: yes, but only for non-loggedin-users <carlos> SteveA: because that other bug has an email address because someone added it manually <carlos> I see, ok <bigjools> the same obfuscation takes place in package changelogs <flacoste> hmm, ok, i think i remember what this was about <flacoste> i want to know on which team test plan a bug or blueprint should appear <flacoste> is it on the team's responsible for the functional area <flacoste> or the team of the person who will test the bug <SteveA> mrevell: please make sure the person who complained and the person who inadvertantly posted their mail address knows that we care. <mrevell> SteveA: I shall. <BjornT_> flacoste: that sounds like a question better suited for the list, doesn't it? <flacoste> BjornT_: probably <flacoste> i'll email the list about it <flacoste> i think there was some other issue, but can't recall (i posted that item nearly one month ago) <BjornT_> flacoste: cool. i'm curious about the answer myself :) <BjornT_> * Add your bug feed to your website (mrevell) <mrevell> I've placed my bug feed on my home page at http://www.understated.co.uk/ <mrevell> It'd be great to see other people do something similar on their website, so that we can demonstrate the feeds feature we introduced with 1.1.12. <mrevell> It's very easy to do using MagpieRSS, Wordpress and tools such as http://wigitize.com/ <mrevell> I've posted a quick Wordpress how to at: <mrevell> http://www.understated.co.uk/2008/launchpad-bug-feeds-in-wordpress/ <mrevell> I'm keen to see how people are using their feeds, so please post links to the launchpad-users list if you go ahead. <mrevell> Thanks, back to BjornT_ <BjornT_> thanks mrevell <BjornT_> * Blockers <mrevell> Releases: not blocked <BjornT_> Bugs: not blocked <jtv> Translations team: Not blocked <flacoste> Foundations: not blocked <SteveA> SC: not blocked <schwuk> HWDB: not blocked <ddaa> Code: dunno, just came back from vacation and have not synced up yet. Presumably not blocked. <statik> lpcomm: not blocked <bigjools> Soyuz Team: not blocked <BjornT_> ok, that should be everyone. thanks for coming! <BjornT_> MEETING ENDED <schwuk> Thanks BjornT_ <statik> thanks for running the meeting BjornT_ <matsubara> Thanks BjornT_ <SteveA> thank you BjornT_. very smooth. <mrevell> thanks all <barry> thanks BjornT_ #launchpad-meeting 2008-01-13 * Hobbsee wins against chanserv! #launchpad-meeting 2008-01-14 <Odd_Bloke> Hai guyz, what happens in dis channel #launchpad-meeting 2008-01-15 <barry> hello everyone and welcome to this week's asiapac launchpad reviewers meeting <barry> who's here today? <jamesh> I'm here <barry> thumper: ping? <barry> wow, okay, i guess we can make this short :) <thumper> here <barry> == Agenda == <barry> * Roll call <barry> * Next meeting <barry> * Action items <barry> * Barry's participation in Asia``Pac meetings <barry> * Queue status <barry> * Mentoring update <barry> * Review process changes <barry> * Tool update <thumper> jml is heading over to spiv's <barry> wife's got dinner ready so we don't need to wait :) <barry> * Next meeting <barry> i won't be able to make this time for the next 2 weeks (see email to ml), but please do carry on until i'm back <thumper> I'm happy with the time change requested in email <barry> thumper: excellent <barry> thumper: maybe you can lead the next 2 meetings @ whatever time you guys want? <thumper> barry: ok <barry> thumper: and i'll join back at 0300tuesday on 05-feb <barry> thumper: thanks! <barry> * Action items <barry> from last time at ameu: * intellectronica to work on a cover letter template <barry> i think that's still outstanding, but low priority <barry> any previous action items that you guys can think of? <barry> 5..4..3..2..1 <jamesh> not that I recall -- the last meeting was fairly low-key <barry> jamesh: cool, thanks <barry> * Barry's participation in Asia``Pac meetings <barry> jamesh: is the proposed time good with you? 0300 tuesdays? <barry> 0300 utc tuesdays <jamesh> barry: sure. That's midday rather than 9am <jamesh> (not that 9am is too bad :) <barry> great. i think the only person who it's worse for is jtv, but i don't know how often he attends the asiapac meetings <barry> jamesh: :) <barry> if one of you gets a chance, could you just ping jml and spiv and make sure they're cool with it? and let me know? <thumper> sure <barry> thumper: thanks <barry> * Queue status <barry> looks like 5 branches in needs-review over sla <barry> but the general queue looks good (i assigned 2 at the end of my shift today) <barry> jamesh: what's up with adeuring's branch? it's huge <jamesh> barry: I think it is missing a Depends: ...-step1 <barry> so not as bad as it looks? ;) <jamesh> I'll try adding that <barry> i'll try to ping the other guys about the other branches and see where we are * thumper nods <barry> any thoughts from you guys on the current queue? <thumper> mpt's branch <thumper> why red? * Rinchen laughs "It's huge". "I remember when 36,764 lines was huge" <barry> Rinchen: wait until 200 lines is huge :) <thumper> 36kloc is huge <barry> 36klocs is EVIL <jamesh> it is smaller than the soyuz merge ... <barry> thumper: perhaps it's a typo in the url <jamesh> I think that was around 60k * Rinchen laughs. James read Rinchen's thoughts. <barry> just wait 'til the storm branch :) <barry> anyway... <barry> * Mentoring update <barry> i sent a message to the lp list calling for new reviewers. i haven't gotten any responses yet <sniff> <thumper> maybe they all feel too busy already * Rinchen wonders if it's time to start Gavin and Graham's review training. <barry> thumper: why should that stop anybody? :) <thumper> Gavin who? <thumper> sorry <thumper> brain freeze <barry> Rinchen: gmb is currently being mentored, but he's probably ready for graduation soon i'd think <barry> allenap, yes definitely * thumper thinks mainly in nicks <Rinchen> barry, oh thanks. I don't have him reporting hours. I'll fix the template! <barry> Rinchen: maybe you can make some, er, inquiries and i'll do the same * barry is no longer mentoring anyone <barry> so really it's just gmb and jtv being mentored right now <Rinchen> barry, yes, I'll chat with Bjorn on Thursday. Another reviewer on bugs would be good so they can achieve the state foundations is in <barry> Rinchen: great, thanks! <barry> anything else on this topic? <barry> 5 <barry> 4 <barry> 3 <barry> 2 <barry> 1 <barry> * Review process changes <barry> * Tool update <barry> i think there's not much progress on this until mwh settles into his new environs <barry> so really, that's all i've got today. anything from you guys? <thumper> no <barry> okay then! i'm going to get some dinner <barry> MEETING ENDS <barry> thanks guys. talk to you later <Rinchen> hello MootBot :-) <Rinchen> [TOPIC] No Topics! <Rinchen> [IDEA] No Ideas outside of meeting <Rinchen> [ACTION] No actions outside of meeting <Rinchen> [LINK] No link outside of meeting <Rinchen> [AGREED] No Agreed outside of meeting <Rinchen> [VOTE] No Votes! <Rinchen> #startmeeting <MootBot> Meeting started at 22:39. The chair is Rinchen. <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] <Rinchen> [TOPIC] Inital Testing <MootBot> New Topic: Inital Testing <Rinchen> [IDEA] Check that its working <MootBot> IDEA received: Check that its working <Rinchen> [ACTION] Run the test script <MootBot> ACTION received: Run the test script <Rinchen> [LINK] http://www.google.com/ <Rinchen> [LINK] wiki:ScribesTeam <MootBot> LINK received: http://www.google.com/ <Rinchen> http://www.google.com <Rinchen> blah blah blah http://www.google.com/ <MootBot> LINK received: wiki:ScribesTeam <Rinchen> [AGREED] Testing! <Rinchen> [VOTE] Does voting work? <MootBot> LINK received: http://www.google.com <Rinchen> +1 <MootBot> AGREED received: Testing! <Rinchen> [TOPIC] Should end vote and change <Rinchen> #endvote <MootBot> Please vote on: Does voting work?. <Rinchen> [VOTE] Can we restart? <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to MootBot <Rinchen> #endvote <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #launchpad-meeting <Rinchen> [TOPIC] Change topic after voting <Rinchen> [VOTE] Test Endmeeting <MootBot> +1 received from Rinchen. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1 <Rinchen> #endmeeting <MootBot> Vote is in progress. Finishing now. <Rinchen> #endvote <MootBot> Final result is 1 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 1 <Seeker`> dont flood the bot quite so much :P <MootBot> New Topic: Should end vote and change <MootBot> Please vote on: Can we restart?. <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to MootBot <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #launchpad-meeting <MootBot> Vote is in progress. Finishing now. <MootBot> Final result is 0 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 0 <MootBot> New Topic: Change topic after voting <MootBot> Please vote on: Test Endmeeting. <Seeker`> I dont have access to the server to get it to rejoin if it get kicked <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to MootBot <Rinchen> Seeker`, :-) It's working perfectly I have to admit <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #launchpad-meeting <MootBot> Vote is in progress. Finishing now. <MootBot> Final result is 0 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 0 <MootBot> Meeting finished at 22:39. <Rinchen> sweet! <Rinchen> the result is great <Rinchen> http://kryten.incognitus.net/mootbot/meetings/ <Seeker`> :) #launchpad-meeting 2008-01-16 <barry> #startmeeting <MootBot> Meeting started at 15:00. The chair is barry. <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] <gmb> Nice. <intellectronica> heh <salgado> look at that <barry> hi everyone and welcome to this week's am/eu reviewers meeting <barry> welcome mootbot (for summarizing these meetings) <barry> Rinchen: thanks for telling me about that! <barry> so, who's here today? <flacoste> me <intellectronica> me <bac> me <jtv> me <sinzu1> me <gmb> me <BjornT> me <sinzui> me me me <salgado> me <barry> danilos: ping <barry> == Agenda == <barry> * Roll call <barry> * Next meeting <barry> * Action items <barry> * Barry's participation in Asia``Pac meetings <barry> * Queue status <barry> * Mentoring update <barry> * danilo mentored by intellectronica <barry> * Review process changes <barry> * Tool update <danilos> me <barry> [TOPIC] * Next meeting <MootBot> New Topic: * Next meeting <barry> week += 1. anyone know they will not be here? <BjornT> i won't be there <barry> BjornT: cool, thanks <flacoste> hey danilo! <statik> me <flacoste> welcome aboard! <danilos> hi flacoste <barry> [TOPIC] * Action items <MootBot> New Topic: * Action items <danilos> thanks <barry> i did edit a bunch of wiki pages to update some things based on our new process. i'm sorry i don't remember which pages :/ <barry> === Outstanding Actions === <barry> * intellectronica to work on a cover letter template <intellectronica> not done, but as we said last week it will anyway probably wait until mwh is back <barry> intellectronica: right, thanks <barry> [TOPIC] * Barry's participation in Asia``Pac meetings <MootBot> New Topic: * Barry's participation in Asia``Pac meetings <barry> so i chaired the asiapac meeting this week, and i think that's going to work out well <barry> i'm going to have to change the time after the florida sprint, but i think it will work out better for those folks anyway * danilos takes a note to go through all the reviewers wiki pages to learn the important bits <barry> so not much else to say, except that i think we'll have better decision making between the two teams <barry> any thoughts? <barry> or questions? <barry> 5 <barry> 4 <barry> 3 <barry> 2 <barry> 1 <barry> [TOPIC] * Queue status <MootBot> New Topic: * Queue status <barry> the queue doesn't really look too bad. 4 branches in needs-review over the sla <barry> jtv: any word on stub's branch? <jtv> barry: that's going to take a while. It wasn't urgent. <jtv> I know, I know, we all _want_ it, but... <jtv> Rushing this one might be something we'd regret. <flacoste> jtv: can you nudge jamesh about curtis' branch that you reviewed? <jtv> flacoste: already had <barry> jtv: no worries, thanks for the status <flacoste> then nudge harder :-) <jtv> flacoste: ooh er missus <sinzui> jtv: please push him if he does not nudge <jtv> This is getting needlessly violent <jtv> nudge, budge, BOOM <barry> just don't poke him with a pointed stick <barry> btw, i am totally psyched that the general queue is clear. i think this means we've fairly successfully cleared our backlog and can get back to on-calls handling most branches <barry> great job everyone! <barry> any other thoughts or comments on the queue status? <intellectronica> ehm <sinzui> I think we have some delinquencies still <intellectronica> i started the day with a branch on my queue which wasn't, in fact finished <sinzui> We have some old branches assigned to reviewer. <intellectronica> not so terrible, but we could maybe think of a way to avoid this, in the future <barry> intellectronica: you mean you started to review it but couldn't finish it, or didn't get to it at all? <bac> intellectronica: i dropped that on you at the end of the day yesterday when i finished on-call. was that not correct? <barry> sinzui: you mean the 4 branches in needs-review that are old? <intellectronica> i started reviewing it, and when i finished the reviewee told me that actually the branch wasn't finished <sinzui> I mean that looking at jamesh's page, I see many old branches in needs-review <barry> bac: yes, that's correct. remember a reviewer can always put it back on the rejected queue <intellectronica> bac: it was, but because it missed the on call review yesterday, gavin thought the he can go on working on that branch <barry> intellectronica: oh, that's bad. <bac> intellectronica: oh... <intellectronica> so maybe we should find a way to get around that. an honest mistake, after all... <gmb> Well, isn't it as much an education issue as anything else. <barry> intellectronica: was the branch big? <intellectronica> gmb: education doesn't work. i mean, look at me :) <gmb> I mean, we know that we pass branches on to the next on-call guy but have we actually told the other developers? <gmb> :) <intellectronica> barry: no, it wasn't terribly big. <bac> i have gotten several comments about "i don't understand this on-call process". so perhaps some general education is needed. <barry> i feel fairly strongly that we shouldn't pass on branches that are in the middle of a review. if you're on-call and accept a branch, you're committing to finishing the review. but it's okay if near the end of your shift you don't take another branch because it's bigger than you'll have time for <intellectronica> maybe if instead of putting it on the next on-caller's queue we put it in the general queue, there's a better chance the submitter will go and check? <barry> [ACTION] barry will communicate the on-call process to launchpad developers <MootBot> ACTION received: barry will communicate the on-call process to launchpad developers <bac> the branch in question was never given to me as the on-call reviewer. it went directly to the general queue and i then assigned it, per our agreement last week. <salgado> maybe it went to the general queue by mistake? <intellectronica> bac: oh, in that case, it's simply a mistake the submitter did. and that can always happen <bac> intellectronica: yes, that is the case. <barry> intellectronica: so the problem was that a dev had put a branch on the general queue but continued to work on it? <intellectronica> barry: yes, but i think the reason he did that was because he was confused about the on-call review process <intellectronica> but that's just my guess, i'm not sure if that's really what happened. mistakes do happen regardless of process we use <barry> yep, they do <intellectronica> one thing we did in the past is the "in progress" section, but that's _more_ wiki editing, which nobody likes <barry> intellectronica: yep. <obdesire>kill PendingReviews</obdesire> <barry> okay, i'll send a message to the list and we'll keep an eye on things <barry> any other queue or on-call issues? <barry> 5 <barry> 4 <barry> 3 <barry> 2 <barry> 1 <barry> [TOPIC] * Mentoring update <barry> * danilo mentored by intellectronica <MootBot> New Topic: * Mentoring update <danilos> hi all, as said, I'll be mentored by intellectronica, and I was thinking on starting with on-call reviewing next week (so I've got
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