@eagle: "Alexander Horst wrote on Wed, 24 February 2010 14:58
<quote>
But that's no reason at all without a reason why a user might want to be
asked again.  If you always want to open them together, then there is never
any need to ask and nobody would want or need to be asked again.  Can't you
see what you're saying is circular reasoning?
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    @eagle: "[quote title=Silviu Epure wrote on Wed, 24 February 2010 11:14]
Quote:
<quote>
Really?  You polled a large representative sample of users and concluded
this?
Nobody asked me, and I always use Eagle to open Eagle files.  Eagle has to
run to display a Eagle proprietary file anyway, so I don't see a problem. 
I do have Eagle wired to a Windows hot key, CTRL-ALT-C in my case.  That
brings up Eagle and its control panel, from which it's just a few arrow
keystrokes and ENTER to open the board or schematic of any of the projects.
 If you open a board or schematic that way, the other is always silently
opened for you just as you want.
Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at <url>"
    @eagle: "KP wrote on Wed, 24 February 2010 11:54
<quote>
You do?  Can you explain a reason why you'd ever not want both the
schematic and board open together, once they both exist?
Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at <url>"
    @eagle: "Alexander Horst wrote on Wed, 24 February 2010 15:38
<quote>
OK, what reason?
Quote:
Because it's just silly superstition unless you can come up with a valid
reason to ever open one file without the other.
I can think of alot of things that would never make sense for Eagle to do,
and I don't want a switch to disable each one.
Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at <url>"
    @eagle: "Chuck Huber wrote on Thu, 25 February 2010 09:31
<quote>
Think about it from the newbie perspective.  They may not understand the
full issues about opening both files together or not, and asking them will
give the impression that either is reasonable.  Not opening both files is
dangerous and not something anyone will want to do often.  It should only
be done by those knowing exactly what they are doing.
Therefore there shouldn't be a choice or at least it should default to
silently opening both.  For the rare cases where a expert user really wants
just one open, it's easy enough to close one of the two.  However you've
prevented people getting themselves into trouble in the normal and far far
more common cases.
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    @eagle: "Travis G wrote on Thu, 25 February 2010 13:29
<quote>
I totally agree.  I want CadSoft concentrating on making electronic design
with Eagle better.  I already have plenty of other tools to help me write
documents, edit firmware, etc.
Quote:
I do it even more stripped down in the Eagle directory.  Basically, I only
keep Eagle stuff in the Eagle tree.  I keep my own eagle directory, which
is separate from the Eagle installation directory.  The Eagle installation
directory is only for stuff that comes from CadSoft.  All my own stuff goes
into my own Eagle directory, and all the search paths for ULPs, libraries,
etc, only look in my own eagle directory.
One of my eagle subdirectories is "proj".  In there are directories for
each separate customer.  Inside those are directories for each separate
board.  I use a whole directory for each version of each board.  That way
schematic, board, gerber, drill, drawing, BOM, and other files for a board
are nicely in only one place and there isn't non-board stuff there
cluttering things up.  There is rarely a nice one to one correspondence
between boards, firmware versions, host programs, etc, so only
board-related stuff goes into the board directories.  Firmware, host code,
and documentation live other places in the system and have different
organization.
Only Eagle stuff lives in the eagle tree.  This makes the Eagle control
panel actually useful for exactly what it was intended for.  I've never
wanted to open a Eagle file other than thru Eagle.  CTRL-ALT-C (my own
Windows hot key mapping) opens Eagle in a split second, then I can quickly
and easily open whatever from there using the arrow keys and ENTER from the
Eagle control panel.
I think people would have a easier time with Eagle if they tried to embrace
it for what it is and use other stuff for what it isn't.  There are way too
many ways someone could set up their own workflow and structure, and it's
not reasonable to ask Eagle to accomodate them.  Eagle does what it does
well.  Fit it into your workflow as it was meant to be.  Don't try to
modify Eagle to handle your workflow, because there will be a never ending
list of things CadSoft would have to do to appease everyone once they start
down this slippery slope.
Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at <url>"
    @eagle: "Silviu Epure wrote on Fri, 26 February 2010 06:13
<quote>
The point is that's unreasonable to ask Eagle to do.  You already have good
tools to do all those things.  Let's not ask Eagle to be another OS.
Besides, what are datasheets doing in a board directory anyway?  Datasheets
apply accross all projects.  I keep a completely independent tree of
datasheets elsewhere.  I don't want separate copies of the MMTB4401
datasheet in every Eagle board directory I used one of those transistors
on, for example.
Quote:
In Windows you don't need to open the programs for viewing particular files
first.  Just enter the file name in the command shell window and Windows
will open the associated program with that file automatically.
Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at <url>"
    @james: "KP wrote on Wed, 24 February 2010 06:49
<quote>
So I've followed this entire thread and I'll add my $0.02CDN finally.
I understand the notion that EAGLE is a CAD tool and we'd rather have the
limited developer time spent on improving the CAD part of the tool.  We're
not a group about bells and whistles but real, bottom-line functionality. 
I agree with that.
However, I think many under-estimate the role that good documentation plays
in CAD design.  In fact, I would argue that it that is just as important as
the actual schematic.  If you don't have the right input data (specs,
datasheets, requirements, ...) then you won't have the right output from
the CAD tool.  So I don't think it's unreasonable to request better
handling of that data.
The problem is that the format that data takes can be widely varying. 
Building in a viewer for every possible type of file would be a huge
undertaking and probably a lot of wasted effort.
Can't we leverage the OS in this case though?  EAGLE 5 already has the
facility to use an external text editor.  Why not expand that a bit to
allow the user to maintain a list of known extensions and the external
commands to run when that type of document is activated from Control Panel.
 It wouldn't take that much extra effort since the infrastructure appears
to be there already.  The list could come pre-populated with obvious
settings but the user could change them as required.
Doesn't that fit everyone's need?  A clean approach that gives easy access
to the design documents from within Control Panel.  Not much effort to
distract from other features and EAGLE doesn't become bloated.  A win-win I
think.
Cheers,
James.
James Morrison  ~~~  Stratford Digital
email:  <email_address>
web: <url>
Specializing in CadSoft EAGLE
* Online Sales to North America
* Electronic Design Services
* EAGLE Enterprise Toolkit
Browser access to CadSoft Support Forums at <url>"
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