From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Sat Oct 01 15:14:45 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 90398 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2005 15:14:44 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 1 Oct 2005 15:14:44 -0000 Received: (qmail 23693 invoked by uid 500); 1 Oct 2005 15:14:44 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 23612 invoked by uid 500); 1 Oct 2005 15:14:43 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 23600 invoked by uid 99); 1 Oct 2005 15:14:43 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sat, 01 Oct 2005 08:14:43 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.6 required=10.0 tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGE,HTML_TITLE_EMPTY X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: local policy) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO busybuddha.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sat, 01 Oct 2005 08:14:47 -0700 Received: from [83.161.120.155] (pear.busybuddha.org [83.161.120.155]) by busybuddha.org (8.13.1/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j91FJ1YO013911 for <yfarmer@example.org>; Sat, 1 Oct 2005 08:19:01 -0700 Message-ID: <yfarmer@example.org> Date: Sat, 01 Oct 2005 08:14:29 -0700 From: Anil Gangolli <yfarmer@example.org> User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: yfarmer@example.org Subject: Re: Multiple Categories? References: <yfarmer@example.org> <1127930789.16448.46.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128012817.17743.51.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128104501.17743.201.camel@gconf> In-Reply-To: <1128104501.17743.201.camel@gconf> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------080904070408020204010801" X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N --------------080904070408020204010801 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Allen Gilliland wrote: >i believe this should be inherent to the way we do tag support. any way we allow people to find content via tags should allow for tag intersections. so you wouldn't need to define a special category called "Anil's Java Tips" which is a combination of entries tagged with "java" and "tips" because someone could already get that by using a url like /tags/rss/anil/java+tips > > I mostly agree. It's just a question of knowing what combinations are available and make sense for a given blog. Folders based on tags allow the blogger to lay down an organization on the most prominent tag combinations. For small numbers of combinations, one does nearly as well with simple links of the form you indicate with the most interesting tag combinations for a given blog just named and listed on the main page or elsewhere on the blog. >> Anil Gangolli: >> (1) One may want to distinguish between "global" or "public" tags >> (folksonomic classfications) which are intended to make sense in a wide >> setting, for example, to match what someone else might be searching for >> and which may be useful to sites like Technorati, and "local" or >> "personal" tags (personal taxonomies) which are really only for >> interpretation in a very local context. People make category names of >> both varieties. For example, in my little blog, I use the category >> "chow" for food/restaurant-related stuff and "System.out" for >> miscellany. These can still be tags, but they are not useful ones, and >> may even be confusing ones to use in a public setting. > > >i think this would get way too complicated. i think there should only be a single tag library/index which applies to everything Well, this is an area where once you start considering the impact of publishing tags to aggregators and using them in search engines, it changes your point of view. One big component of noise in folksonomies comes just from the fact that people don't consider whether the tag is going to be used in a public/shared setting or not. [e.g. Flickr photos tagged "me" (yes, there are plenty). Blog entries tagged "misc" or "other". Maybe useful in a local context, where one understands the blogger/poster or the context of other categories, but not in the public context.] One way to ease this would be to have all tags be understood to be public (which is not something to enforce but to educate/clarify), but allow the ability to assign a local name to a public tag combination. This becomes essentially a local category or folder. --a. --------------080904070408020204010801-- From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Sat Oct 01 20:30:30 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 69781 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2005 20:30:30 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 1 Oct 2005 20:30:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 68892 invoked by uid 500); 1 Oct 2005 20:30:30 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 68859 invoked by uid 500); 1 Oct 2005 20:30:29 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 68848 invoked by uid 99); 1 Oct 2005 20:30:29 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sat, 01 Oct 2005 13:30:29 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=10.0 tests= X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: local policy) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO brmea-mail-4.sun.com) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sat, 01 Oct 2005 13:30:33 -0700 Received: from phys-mpk-1 ([83.161.120.155]) by brmea-mail-4.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j91KU6vD006927 for <yfarmer@example.org>; Sat, 1 Oct 2005 14:30:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) id <yfarmer@example.org> (original mail from yfarmer@example.org) for yfarmer@example.org; Sat, 01 Oct 2005 13:30:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (vpn-129-150-24-255.SFBay.Sun.COM [83.161.120.155]) by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) with ESMTP id <yfarmer@example.org> for yfarmer@example.org; Sat, 01 Oct 2005 13:30:06 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sat, 01 Oct 2005 13:30:06 -0700 From: Allen Gilliland <yfarmer@example.org> Subject: Re: Multiple Categories? In-reply-to: <yfarmer@example.org> To: yfarmer@example.org Message-id: <yfarmer@example.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) References: <yfarmer@example.org> <1127930789.16448.46.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128012817.17743.51.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128104501.17743.201.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Anil Gangolli wrote: > Allen Gilliland wrote: > >> i believe this should be inherent to the way we do tag support. any >> way we allow people to find content via tags should allow for tag >> intersections. so you wouldn't need to define a special category >> called "Anil's Java Tips" which is a combination of entries tagged >> with "java" and "tips" because someone could already get that by >> using a url like /tags/rss/anil/java+tips >> >> > I mostly agree. It's just a question of knowing what combinations are > available and make sense for a given blog. Folders based on tags > allow the blogger to lay down an organization on the most prominent > tag combinations. For small numbers of combinations, one does nearly > as well with simple links of the form you indicate with the most > interesting tag combinations for a given blog just named and listed on > the main page or elsewhere on the blog. okay, i think i see where you are coming from. i guess i still don't really see that as a "category" the way that categories work now. i can definitely see the use of having an easy way for a blogger to save certain tag combinations for use on their blog, but should those be categories? the same categories that users select when drafting their weblog entry? i would think that you would get a lot of redundancy if you did that ... imagine you publish a new entry about java that is tagged with "java" and "tips" *and* you select the category "Anil's Java Tips" which by its nature already included the entry based on your tags. In this situation the category and tags are redundant. Maybe we can create something like a "saved tag searches", which allows a blogger to save certain tag combinations and give it a name and then reuse that list on their blog somewhere. Basically it would be the same as a bookmark folder, except that all the bookmarks would reference pages of tag combinations for their blog. > >>> Anil Gangolli: (1) One may want to distinguish between "global" or >>> "public" tags (folksonomic classfications) which are intended to >>> make sense in a wide setting, for example, to match what someone >>> else might be searching for and which may be useful to sites like >>> Technorati, and "local" or "personal" tags (personal taxonomies) >>> which are really only for interpretation in a very local context. >>> People make category names of both varieties. For example, in my >>> little blog, I use the category "chow" for food/restaurant-related >>> stuff and "System.out" for miscellany. These can still be tags, but >>> they are not useful ones, and may even be confusing ones to use in a >>> public setting. >> >> >> >> i think this would get way too complicated. i think there should >> only be a single tag library/index which applies to everything > > > Well, this is an area where once you start considering the impact of > publishing tags to aggregators and using them in search engines, it > changes your point of view. One big component of noise in > folksonomies comes just from the fact that people don't consider > whether the tag is going to be used in a public/shared setting or > not. [e.g. Flickr photos tagged "me" (yes, there are plenty). Blog > entries tagged "misc" or "other". Maybe useful in a local context, > where one understands the blogger/poster or the context of other > categories, but not in the public context.] i think this is just the reality of having lots of users. there is never going to be a way to prevent people from doing somewhat silly things like tagging content with "me", but really that's only useless if that's the only tag applied. if someone tags something as "photo", "personal", "portrait", "me" then i don't see anything wrong with that because "me" in this case may be applied publicly, but only meant to be used privately. so this person could then use a "saved tag search" like i described above to list entries tagged with "me" and "photo" to create a personal photo album. having a single library/index for tags rather than trying to manage different taxonomies is just a simplicity. if we wanted to have a simple way of differentiating intended local vs. public tags for use when being applied to sites like technorati we could introduce something simple like a special prefix for tags that are not meant to be propogated publicly. i.e. tags like "+me" or "-me" would not be included when an entry is rendered and it's tags are displayed for use by technorati. > > One way to ease this would be to have all tags be understood to be > public (which is not something to enforce but to educate/clarify), but > allow the ability to assign a local name to a public tag combination. > This becomes essentially a local category or folder. right ... this is like the "saved tag search" concept i talked about above. basically it's a bookmark, but with a slightly special nature. -- Allen > > --a. > > From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Sun Oct 02 07:26:30 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 95181 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2005 07:26:30 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 2 Oct 2005 07:26:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 31729 invoked by uid 500); 2 Oct 2005 07:26:30 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 31690 invoked by uid 500); 2 Oct 2005 07:26:29 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 31679 invoked by uid 99); 2 Oct 2005 07:26:29 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sun, 02 Oct 2005 00:26:29 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=10.0 tests= X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: local policy) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO busybuddha.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sun, 02 Oct 2005 00:26:33 -0700 Received: from [83.161.120.155] (pear.busybuddha.org [83.161.120.155]) by busybuddha.org (8.13.1/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j927UnjP014191 for <yfarmer@example.org>; Sun, 2 Oct 2005 00:30:49 -0700 Message-ID: <yfarmer@example.org> Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 00:26:18 -0700 From: Anil Gangolli <yfarmer@example.org> User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: yfarmer@example.org Subject: Re: Multiple Categories? References: <yfarmer@example.org> <1127930789.16448.46.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128012817.17743.51.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128104501.17743.201.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> In-Reply-To: <yfarmer@example.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Allen Gilliland wrote: > Maybe we can create something like a "saved tag searches", which > allows a blogger to save certain tag combinations and give it a name > and then reuse that list on their blog somewhere. Basically it would > be the same as a bookmark folder, except that all the bookmarks would > reference pages of tag combinations for their blog. Yes! The idea of a "saved tag search" labelled as a category is what I've been trying to convey all along. I must really be getting bad at expressing myself. I think we are on the same page now. --a. From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Sun Oct 02 10:27:39 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 18642 invoked from network); 2 Oct 2005 10:27:38 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 2 Oct 2005 10:27:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 100 invoked by uid 500); 2 Oct 2005 10:27:38 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 99965 invoked by uid 500); 2 Oct 2005 10:27:38 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 99954 invoked by uid 99); 2 Oct 2005 10:27:37 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sun, 02 Oct 2005 03:27:37 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=10.0 tests=RCVD_BY_IP,SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: domain of yfarmer@example.org designates 83.161.120.155 as permitted sender) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO nproxy.gmail.com) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sun, 02 Oct 2005 03:27:42 -0700 Received: by nproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id g2so22920nfe for <yfarmer@example.org>; Sun, 02 Oct 2005 03:27:14 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=N+8jBGxfY3LHzC2kcgKRN0IkurPgTfbx9ZvD1Qw0foOWBONCpvyp8K9a4VoFJANulDWB1IL7wF97+l5dGKBy3Xp6+ofO7LR1yB6ovXQ5HZiv4CpuPKx/dTzGRE4f6QWWZu9OgGXqh73EniHDwdB2CzHaKl7C2h7gDo23g5tmDyQ= Received: by 83.161.120.155 with SMTP id x4mr76713nfg; Sun, 02 Oct 2005 03:27:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 83.161.120.155 with HTTP; Sun, 2 Oct 2005 03:27:14 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <yfarmer@example.org> Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 12:27:14 +0200 From: Axel <yfarmer@example.org> Reply-To: Axel <yfarmer@example.org> To: yfarmer@example.org Subject: Exception from planet configuration MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Hi I get this exception from my planet configurtion in 2.0: ERROR 2005-10-02 10:18:37,193 SyncWebsitesTask:rankSubscriptions - ERROR ranking subscriptions java.lang.NullPointerException =09at java.io.Reader.<init>(Reader.java:61) =09at java.io.InputStreamReader.<init>(InputStreamReader.java:55) =09at org.roller.util.Technorati.<init>(Technorati.java:55) =09at org.roller.util.Technorati.<init>(Technorati.java:60) =09at org.roller.presentation.planet.SyncWebsitesTask.rankSubscriptions(Syn= cWebsitesTask.java:169) =09at org.roller.presentation.planet.SyncWebsitesTask.run(SyncWebsitesTask.= java:53) =09at EDU.oswego.cs.dl.util.concurrent.PooledExecutor$Worker.run(Unknown So= urce) =09at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:595) From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Mon Oct 03 16:52:46 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 77179 invoked from network); 3 Oct 2005 16:52:45 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 3 Oct 2005 16:52:45 -0000 Received: (qmail 47020 invoked by uid 500); 3 Oct 2005 16:52:45 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 46996 invoked by uid 500); 3 Oct 2005 16:52:44 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 46985 invoked by uid 99); 3 Oct 2005 16:52:44 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 09:52:44 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.6 required=10.0 tests=FORGED_RCVD_HELO,RCVD_NUMERIC_HELO X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: local policy) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO nwkea-mail-2.sun.com) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 09:52:48 -0700 Received: from phys-mpk-1 ([83.161.120.155]) by nwkea-mail-2.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j93GqMHT013599 for <yfarmer@example.org>; Mon, 3 Oct 2005 09:52:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) id <yfarmer@example.org> (original mail from yfarmer@example.org) for yfarmer@example.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 09:52:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 83.161.120.155 (gconf.SFBay.Sun.COM [83.161.120.155]) by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) with ESMTP id <yfarmer@example.org> for yfarmer@example.org; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 09:52:22 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2005 09:50:32 -0700 From: Allen Gilliland <yfarmer@example.org> Subject: Re: Multiple Categories? In-reply-to: <yfarmer@example.org> To: roller-dev <yfarmer@example.org> Message-id: <1128358232.19569.10.camel@gconf> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 83.161.120.1555 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <yfarmer@example.org> <1127930789.16448.46.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128012817.17743.51.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128104501.17743.201.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N On Sun, 2005-10-02 at 00:26, Anil Gangolli wrote: > Allen Gilliland wrote: > > > Maybe we can create something like a "saved tag searches", which > > allows a blogger to save certain tag combinations and give it a name > > and then reuse that list on their blog somewhere. Basically it would > > be the same as a bookmark folder, except that all the bookmarks would > > reference pages of tag combinations for their blog. > > Yes! The idea of a "saved tag search" labelled as a category is what > I've been trying to convey all along. I must really be getting bad at > expressing myself. I think we are on the same page now. cool. so i guess my follow up question to this is where should this "saved tag search" ability really be stored? should it be a "smart" category? or a special kind of bookmark? i can see the reason to want to save it as a category, but to me that is also slightly problematic because people manually assign categories when they are publishing an entry. so there is obvious redundancy if the category "Java Tips" is assigned to a new entry that is tagged with "java" and "tips". would "smart" categories not be like a normal category that you assign an entry to? i am thinking that a "saved tag search" is actually more like a bookmark. then like we do with blogroll we can provide a special macro that would list your saved tag searches with links to the pages and rss? -- Allen > > --a. > From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Tue Oct 04 02:50:53 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 58417 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2005 02:50:52 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 4 Oct 2005 02:50:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 71665 invoked by uid 500); 4 Oct 2005 02:50:52 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 71598 invoked by uid 500); 4 Oct 2005 02:50:51 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 71584 invoked by uid 99); 4 Oct 2005 02:50:51 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 19:50:51 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=10.0 tests=RCVD_BY_IP,SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: domain of yfarmer@example.org designates 83.161.120.155 as permitted sender) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO xproxy.gmail.com) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 19:50:56 -0700 Received: by xproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id i32so134181wxd for <yfarmer@example.org>; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 19:50:30 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:sender:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=qPP7CN19sjycG9awzyUg/hKfolmuSqV+21GaeyAoTkGanZj0ACckOFyUwpEw21OtORas0zqWvfLCPwuoewErZOqZ3CG/q90UHy6e6SNqLdUifl1x7mcfUjRVbPIghyjFM9KinMdtDLw2JTBMKJlCgg1JoaG/Hp1JzU9WClxaHZg= Received: by 83.161.120.155 with SMTP id d15mr105064wxa; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 19:50:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 83.161.120.155 with HTTP; Mon, 3 Oct 2005 19:50:30 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <yfarmer@example.org> Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2005 22:50:30 -0400 From: Elias Torres <yfarmer@example.org> Reply-To: Elias Torres <yfarmer@example.org> Sender: yfarmer@example.org To: roller-dev <yfarmer@example.org>, yfarmer@example.org Subject: tagging screenshots MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Since we are having a great discussion on tagging, I wanted to show you what a guy in our team has done with tagging and Roller. His name is Phay Lau (yfarmer@example.org) and he's done an excellent job getting this stuff going, starting from Allen's code. We want to finalize a few things so we can make the patch available working against the latest Roller20 branch so we can discuss further. http://torrez.us/2005/08/23/roller/screenshots/tags-frontpage.png http://torrez.us/2005/08/23/roller/screenshots/tags-single.png http://torrez.us/2005/08/23/roller/screenshots/tags-cloud.png Regards, Elias From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Tue Oct 04 05:40:07 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 18456 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2005 05:40:07 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 4 Oct 2005 05:40:07 -0000 Received: (qmail 13179 invoked by uid 500); 4 Oct 2005 05:40:06 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 13095 invoked by uid 500); 4 Oct 2005 05:40:06 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 13084 invoked by uid 99); 4 Oct 2005 05:40:05 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 22:40:05 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.6 required=10.0 tests=HTML_20_30,HTML_MESSAGE,HTML_TITLE_EMPTY X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: local policy) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO busybuddha.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 03 Oct 2005 22:40:09 -0700 Received: from [83.161.120.155] (pear.busybuddha.org [83.161.120.155]) by busybuddha.org (8.13.1/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j945iRsf010289 for <yfarmer@example.org>; Mon, 3 Oct 2005 22:44:28 -0700 Message-ID: <yfarmer@example.org> Date: Mon, 03 Oct 2005 22:39:56 -0700 From: Anil Gangolli <yfarmer@example.org> User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: yfarmer@example.org Subject: Re: Multiple Categories? References: <yfarmer@example.org> <1127930789.16448.46.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128012817.17743.51.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128104501.17743.201.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128358232.19569.10.camel@gconf> In-Reply-To: <1128358232.19569.10.camel@gconf> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------080607080805020209040505" X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N --------------080607080805020209040505 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I wasn't suggesting that people define both tags and categories. In my view, membership of an entry in a category would be entirely dynamic. One wouldn't specify the category when writing the entry, only the tags. The categories would just be defined as search filters on the tags, so membership would be automatic. I would use the tags "java" and "tips" and elsewhere (and just once) I could have defined a category "Java Tips" = "java"+"tips". One can also view this as a category "folder" whose contents are determined dynamically by a filter. In an earlier message, I described the idea of supporting hierarchical categories as search filter conjunctions as well. "java/tips" = "java" + "tips" = "tips/java" depending only on how you want to organize the "folders," but you never actually have to recategorize entries; they keep the same tags. As you say, it is possible to consider the saved search filter as a bookmark instead of as a category (or in addition). The main difference is that bookmarks aren't normally a container concept so you can't very natually nest them in hierarchies. (You can put bookmarks into folders, but a bookmark doesn't contain other bookmarks.) If one doesn't want to support hierarchical categories however, viewing saved tag filters as bookmarks works very well. --a. Allen Gilliland wrote: >On Sun, 2005-10-02 at 00:26, Anil Gangolli wrote: > > >>Allen Gilliland wrote: >> >> >> >>>Maybe we can create something like a "saved tag searches", which >>>allows a blogger to save certain tag combinations and give it a name >>>and then reuse that list on their blog somewhere. Basically it would >>>be the same as a bookmark folder, except that all the bookmarks would >>>reference pages of tag combinations for their blog. >>> >>> >>Yes! The idea of a "saved tag search" labelled as a category is what >>I've been trying to convey all along. I must really be getting bad at >>expressing myself. I think we are on the same page now. >> >> > >cool. so i guess my follow up question to this is where should this "saved tag search" ability really be stored? should it be a "smart" category? or a special kind of bookmark? > >i can see the reason to want to save it as a category, but to me that is also slightly problematic because people manually assign categories when they are publishing an entry. so there is obvious redundancy if the category "Java Tips" is assigned to a new entry that is tagged with "java" and "tips". would "smart" categories not be like a normal category that you assign an entry to? > >i am thinking that a "saved tag search" is actually more like a bookmark. then like we do with blogroll we can provide a special macro that would list your saved tag searches with links to the pages and rss? > >-- Allen > > > > > >>--a. >> >> >> > > > > --------------080607080805020209040505-- From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Tue Oct 04 07:23:55 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 48853 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2005 07:23:49 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 4 Oct 2005 07:23:49 -0000 Received: (qmail 24722 invoked by uid 500); 4 Oct 2005 07:23:44 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 24630 invoked by uid 500); 4 Oct 2005 07:23:43 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 24619 invoked by uid 99); 4 Oct 2005 07:23:43 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 00:23:43 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=10.0 tests= X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: local policy) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO brmea-mail-4.sun.com) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 00:23:46 -0700 Received: from phys-mpk-1 ([83.161.120.155]) by brmea-mail-4.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j947NKvD013346 for <yfarmer@example.org>; Tue, 4 Oct 2005 01:23:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) id <yfarmer@example.org> (original mail from yfarmer@example.org) for yfarmer@example.org; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 00:23:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (vpn-129-150-24-232.SFBay.Sun.COM [83.161.120.155]) by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) with ESMTP id <yfarmer@example.org> for yfarmer@example.org; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 00:23:19 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 00:23:19 -0700 From: Allen Gilliland <yfarmer@example.org> Subject: Re: Multiple Categories? In-reply-to: <yfarmer@example.org> To: yfarmer@example.org Message-id: <yfarmer@example.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) References: <yfarmer@example.org> <1127930789.16448.46.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128012817.17743.51.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128104501.17743.201.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128358232.19569.10.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Anil Gangolli wrote: > > I wasn't suggesting that people define both tags and categories. > > In my view, membership of an entry in a category would be entirely > dynamic. One wouldn't specify the category when writing the entry, > only the tags. The categories would just be defined as search > filters on the tags, so membership would be automatic. I would use > the tags "java" and "tips" and elsewhere (and just once) I could have > defined a category "Java Tips" = "java"+"tips". i like that, but i also think we still need manual categories. there's still plenty of reasons why users would want to manually place entries in categories rather than relying on tags alone. > > One can also view this as a category "folder" whose contents are > determined dynamically by a filter. In an earlier message, I > described the idea of supporting hierarchical categories as search > filter conjunctions as well. "java/tips" = "java" + "tips" = > "tips/java" depending only on how you want to organize the "folders," > but you never actually have to recategorize entries; they keep the > same tags. i'm not sure i really see how the intersection of 2 tags makes a subfolder. to me, hierarchy requires a strict parent/child relationship, and tags don't really offer that. i can see from your example how you could make them seem like subfolders, but i'm not that's an accurate way to represent the data structure. > > As you say, it is possible to consider the saved search filter as a > bookmark instead of as a category (or in addition). The main > difference is that bookmarks aren't normally a container concept so > you can't very natually nest them in hierarchies. (You can put > bookmarks into folders, but a bookmark doesn't contain other > bookmarks.) If one doesn't want to support hierarchical categories > however, viewing saved tag filters as bookmarks works very well. i guess what i am wondering is ... how exactly are you planning to use tags in a hierarchical way? i don't see why "java/tips" as a subfolder is different from "java+tips" as a bookmark. -- Allen > > --a. > > > Allen Gilliland wrote: > >> On Sun, 2005-10-02 at 00:26, Anil Gangolli wrote: >> >> >>> Allen Gilliland wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Maybe we can create something like a "saved tag searches", which >>>> allows a blogger to save certain tag combinations and give it a >>>> name and then reuse that list on their blog somewhere. Basically >>>> it would be the same as a bookmark folder, except that all the >>>> bookmarks would reference pages of tag combinations for their blog. >>>> >>> >>> Yes! The idea of a "saved tag search" labelled as a category is >>> what I've been trying to convey all along. I must really be getting >>> bad at expressing myself. I think we are on the same page now. >>> >> >> >> cool. so i guess my follow up question to this is where should this >> "saved tag search" ability really be stored? should it be a "smart" >> category? or a special kind of bookmark? >> >> i can see the reason to want to save it as a category, but to me that >> is also slightly problematic because people manually assign >> categories when they are publishing an entry. so there is obvious >> redundancy if the category "Java Tips" is assigned to a new entry >> that is tagged with "java" and "tips". would "smart" categories not >> be like a normal category that you assign an entry to? >> >> i am thinking that a "saved tag search" is actually more like a >> bookmark. then like we do with blogroll we can provide a special >> macro that would list your saved tag searches with links to the pages >> and rss? >> >> -- Allen >> >> >> >> >> >>> --a. >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> > > From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Tue Oct 04 20:33:27 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 63199 invoked from network); 4 Oct 2005 20:33:26 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 4 Oct 2005 20:33:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 12459 invoked by uid 500); 4 Oct 2005 20:33:26 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 12427 invoked by uid 500); 4 Oct 2005 20:33:25 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 12415 invoked by uid 99); 4 Oct 2005 20:33:25 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 13:33:25 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=10.0 tests=HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGE,RCVD_BY_IP,SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: domain of yfarmer@example.org designates 83.161.120.155 as permitted sender) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO xproxy.gmail.com) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 13:33:28 -0700 Received: by xproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id s13so2741wxc for <yfarmer@example.org>; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 13:33:02 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=Xe4puLowd/LtEYlDeQopC+XcZzMqq+wTbId3smbcSlsSBz8XA4bCRtFIqnqxka9Sgk3agCxsJA8trB6NtA9lDkEOvHJI6CF6CPRbaZzsMtOgd184ln0nEvs3pGwasVFy7yzOT6Co4YUyb26nRSLs0O+iLmJMpCFO1dW8/dtZldQ= Received: by 83.161.120.155 with SMTP id a15mr5295wxc; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 13:33:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 83.161.120.155 with HTTP; Tue, 4 Oct 2005 13:33:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <yfarmer@example.org> Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 14:33:02 -0600 From: Matt Raible <yfarmer@example.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org To: Allen Gilliland <yfarmer@example.org> Subject: Re: Acegi Integration Status Cc: roller-dev <yfarmer@example.org> In-Reply-To: <yfarmer@example.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_7386_17264011.1128457982678" References: <yfarmer@example.org> <1126983934.1023.8.camel@unknown> <yfarmer@example.org> <1127930916.16448.49.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128028453.17743.151.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N ------=_Part_7386_17264011.1128457982678 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Sorry it took me so long - this kinda got lost in my inbox. I've updated my local project with 2.0 from SVN and uploaded the code to th= e following URL. It should have .svn folders in it so you can diff it against the roller_2.0 branch. http://static.raibledesigns.com/downloads/roller-2.0-withacegi.tar.gz It's 47 MB. Thanks, Matt On 9/29/05, Matt Raible <yfarmer@example.org> wrote: > > I'll try to do that later tonight. > > Thanks, > > Matt > > On 9/29/05, Allen Gilliland <yfarmer@example.org> wrote: > > Matt, > > > > i think all the new files that are needed are missing. like the > WEB-INF/security.xml and the new jars, etc. > > > > maybe you can package that stuff up in a zip file and add that to the > wiki as well? > > > > -- Allen > > > > > > On Wed, 2005-09-28 at 11:26, Matt Raible wrote: > > > It's attached to the proposal. > > > > > > http://rollerweblogger.org/wiki/Wiki.jsp?page=3DProposal_AcegiSecurit= y > > > > > > Please note the remaining issues listed on the wiki. > > > > > > Matt > > > > > > On 9/28/05, Allen Gilliland <yfarmer@example.org> wrote: > > > > Matt, > > > > > > > > I wasn't able to recieve the patch you sent with this email probabl= y > because it got caught by a spam filter or something. > > > > > > > > can you possibly post it somewhere on the web so I can grab it? > > > > > > > > -- Allen > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, 2005-09-19 at 16:36, Matt Raible wrote: > > > > > On 9/17/05, Allen Gilliland <yfarmer@example.org> wrote: > > > > > > cool ... this sounds like a welcome improvement over CMA. > > > > > > > > > > > > i know we've talked about using Acegi on the list before, but i= s > there a > > > > > > proposal plan that outlines genrally how Acegi integration > works, what > > > > > > new classes would be created, and how SSO would tie in? > > > > > > > > > > No, I should do this. First, I wanted to prove that it would > actually > > > > > work. As far as SSO, Acegi integrates with Yale's CAS system - > more > > > > > information is available in Acegi's documentation. > > > > > > > > > > http://acegisecurity.sourceforge.net/docbook/acegi.html#security-= cas > > > > > > > > > > > If you look at the forum link below, you'll see I got an answer t= o > my > > > > > question and was able to get everything working today. I've > attached > > > > > a patch of what changes in existing classes. > > > > > > > > > > The biggest change is that a lot of the startup logic in > LoginServlet > > > > > moved to RollerContext (where everything else is initialized). > Other > > > > > changes include removing the secure and unsecure port numbers in > > > > > roller.properties. This is because Acegi defaults to 8443 (when > using > > > > > 8080 for http://) and 443 (when using 80 for http://). > > > > > > > > > > The one thing I haven't done in this patch is to remove the > UserCookie > > > > > object (and code from UserManager) - but this will no longer be > > > > > necessary either. > > > > > > > > > > I'll try to write up a proposal on the wiki in the next day or > two. > > > > > Any suggestions on an existing proposal to use for a template? > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > Matt > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- Allen > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, 2005-09-17 at 08:34, Matt Raible wrote: > > > > > > > FYI... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I did some work yesterday to create a version of Roller that > uses > > > > > > > Acegi Security for its security mechanism as an alternative t= o > CMA. > > > > > > > It's my believe that this should be possible w/o changing a > single > > > > > > > line of Java code. In fact, it should result in deleting quit= e > a bit > > > > > > > of code (LoginServlet, LoginFilter, UserCookie, etc.). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > However, I've run into one issue. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <snip> > > > > > > > Principal principal =3D request.getUserPrincipal(); > > > > > > > String username =3D principal.getName(); > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With CMA, this returns "mraible" (my login name). However, > with Acegi, > > > > > > > it returns: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > userName=3D "net.sf.acegisecurity.providers.dao.User@a8eaf3: > Username: > > > > > > > mraible; Password: [PROTECTED]; Enabled: true; > AccountNonExpired: > > > > > > > true; credentialsNonExpired: true; AccountNonLocked: true; > Granted > > > > > > > Authorities: editor" > > > > > > > </snip> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've posted this to the Acegi Security forums, but haven't ha= d > a response yet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://forum.springframework.org/viewtopic.php?t=3D8917 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I suspect it's a bug. A workaround is to use > request.getRemoteUser(), > > > > > > > but I'd rather see this fixed in Acegi. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To reiterate why I'm doing this little experiment: it's > because Acegi > > > > > > > has more fine-grained control of security - allowing you to > get a > > > > > > > user's role or information in any layer (b/c the information > is stored > > > > > > > in a thread local). Furthermore, it has Remember Me and SSL > Switching > > > > > > > built in. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AppFuse had the same setup that Roller has at one point. In > fact, most > > > > > > > of the Login/RememberMe/SSL Switching is from AppFuse. I > switched to > > > > > > > Acegi in AppFuse about 6 months ago and it's resulted in > nothing but > > > > > > > good things. We've been able to plug a few security holes tha= t > > > > > > > would've been more difficult if we were using CMA. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Another good reason to switch is this will get us away from > something > > > > > > > users complain about often: the redirect to j_security_check = - > where > > > > > > > the password is shown in the URL. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have a good weekend, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Matt > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------=_Part_7386_17264011.1128457982678-- From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Wed Oct 05 16:32:57 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 8257 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2005 16:32:55 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 5 Oct 2005 16:32:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 38298 invoked by uid 500); 5 Oct 2005 14:47:37 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 38260 invoked by uid 500); 5 Oct 2005 14:47:36 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 38249 invoked by uid 99); 5 Oct 2005 14:47:36 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 07:47:36 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=10.0 tests= X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: local policy) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO busybuddha.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 07:47:39 -0700 Received: from [83.161.120.155] (pear.busybuddha.org [83.161.120.155]) by busybuddha.org (8.13.1/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j95Eq0YU011927 for <yfarmer@example.org>; Wed, 5 Oct 2005 07:52:01 -0700 Message-ID: <yfarmer@example.org> Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 07:47:29 -0700 From: Anil Gangolli <yfarmer@example.org> User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.7 (Windows/20050923) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: yfarmer@example.org Subject: Re: Multiple Categories? References: <yfarmer@example.org> <1127930789.16448.46.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128012817.17743.51.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128104501.17743.201.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <1128358232.19569.10.camel@gconf> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> In-Reply-To: <yfarmer@example.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N > > Allen Gilliland wrote: > i'm not sure i really see how the intersection of 2 tags makes a > subfolder. to me, hierarchy requires a strict parent/child > relationship, and tags don't really offer that. i can see from your > example how you could make them seem like subfolders, but i'm not > that's an accurate way to represent the data structure. Here's what I mean. We really should move this to the proposal discussion wiki. I'll put this stuff there later today. In this model, tags are unstructured, but categories can be structured. Imagine a class Filter that can be applied in some search mechanism as a tag filter on a weblog entry set. I don't want to get into implementation, but for this purpose Filter must support at least the boolean "and" operation that forms the conjunction of the filter with another one; ideally one would support all of the boolean operations, but that's a separate discussion. Define a class Category with at least these members and the following logic (in pseudo code). Category { String name; Category parent; Filter filter; public Filter getAppliedViewFilter { return (parent == null) ? filter : filter.and(parent.getDerivedFilter()); } } Categories can be thought of as named filters that can be arranged in a tree. The basic idea is that if a category is defined at the top level then its filter acts alone. If a category is defined to be a child of another category, then it operates as a restriction on the view that you would get from the parent. It is useful to define a category at the root of the tree, whose filter matches everything. An important expectation is that the hierarchy should be navigable by the user. For example if I define a category that filters for the tag "java" just below the root then when viewing that category I'd see all "java"-tagged entries. If I descend to a category with filter "tips" that is a child of that category, then I'd see only entries tagged with both "java" and "tips". Ignoring the fact that Roller doesn't actually have proper hierarchical view implemented currently, this is fundamentally different from current Roller Category notion in three important ways: - You don't manually place entries in categories. You tag entries any way you want and then define categories as views on those tags. - A weblog entry can belong to multiple categories. It belongs to all categories whose filter matches the tags it carries. - The organization of categories is independent of entries. You can reorganize your category space, split or merge categories, flip hierarchies, etc, without changing the entries, provided your new categories are based on filtering the entries based on tags you already applied to them at some time. --a. From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Wed Oct 05 17:05:26 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 51516 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2005 17:05:26 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 5 Oct 2005 17:05:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 64231 invoked by uid 500); 5 Oct 2005 13:05:24 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 64206 invoked by uid 500); 5 Oct 2005 13:05:23 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 64195 invoked by uid 99); 5 Oct 2005 13:05:23 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 06:05:23 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=10.0 tests=RCVD_BY_IP,SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: domain of yfarmer@example.org designates 83.161.120.155 as permitted sender) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO xproxy.gmail.com) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 06:05:26 -0700 Received: by xproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id i32so39626wxd for <yfarmer@example.org>; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 06:05:00 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:sender:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=I7PFTezTobL5Qe/78+YNYAyzRXdl2tsXmicDEqvIoGbnKYVSwQFcFNMH4nHt5B51/1Yx/6Lcx8vzOTRJTS0hYI5B0LwfHy+hYzMEhyMPaj0oEsjFTC9fG0PEXX2nUv6cGliLM4ukTeSfvWt96oQp7jAGPgD01Mk8SybM4+DHbyk= Received: by 83.161.120.155 with SMTP id d19mr14747wxa; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 06:05:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 83.161.120.155 with HTTP; Wed, 5 Oct 2005 06:05:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <yfarmer@example.org> Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 09:05:00 -0400 From: Elias Torres <yfarmer@example.org> Reply-To: Elias Torres <yfarmer@example.org> Sender: yfarmer@example.org To: Dave Johnson <yfarmer@example.org>, roller-dev <yfarmer@example.org> Subject: Re: tagging screenshots In-Reply-To: <yfarmer@example.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline References: <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N Fixed 404's and added another screenshot http://torrez.us/2005/08/23/roller/screenshots/tags-newentry.png Elias On 10/4/05, Dave Johnson <yfarmer@example.org> wrote: > All of those links lead to 404's for me. - Dave > > > On Oct 3, 2005, at 10:50 PM, Elias Torres wrote: > > > Since we are having a great discussion on tagging, I wanted to show > > you what a guy in our team has done with tagging and Roller. His name > > is Phay Lau (yfarmer@example.org) and he's done an excellent job getting > > this stuff going, starting from Allen's code. We want to finalize a > > few things so we can make the patch available working against the > > latest Roller20 branch so we can discuss further. > > > > http://torrez.us/2005/08/23/roller/screenshots/tags-frontpage.png > > http://torrez.us/2005/08/23/roller/screenshots/tags-single.png > > http://torrez.us/2005/08/23/roller/screenshots/tags-cloud.png > > > > Regards, > > > > Elias > > > > From roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org Wed Oct 05 17:38:33 2005 Return-Path: <roller-dev-returnyfarmer@example.org> Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 96651 invoked from network); 5 Oct 2005 17:38:33 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (83.161.120.155) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 5 Oct 2005 17:38:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 4099 invoked by uid 500); 5 Oct 2005 17:38:32 -0000 Delivered-To: yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 4064 invoked by uid 500); 5 Oct 2005 17:38:32 -0000 Mailing-List: contact yfarmer@example.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Post: <mailto:yfarmer@example.org> List-Id: <roller-dev.incubator.apache.org> Reply-To: yfarmer@example.org Delivered-To: mailing list yfarmer@example.org Received: (qmail 4052 invoked by uid 99); 5 Oct 2005 17:38:32 -0000 Received: from asf.osuosl.org (HELO asf.osuosl.org) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 10:38:31 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.6 required=10.0 tests=FORGED_RCVD_HELO,RCVD_NUMERIC_HELO X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (asf.osuosl.org: local policy) Received: from [83.161.120.155] (HELO brmea-mail-3.sun.com) (83.161.120.155) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 10:38:34 -0700 Received: from phys-mpk-1 ([83.161.120.155]) by brmea-mail-3.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j95Hc81L028594 for <yfarmer@example.org>; Wed, 5 Oct 2005 11:38:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: from conversion-daemon.mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) id <yfarmer@example.org> (original mail from yfarmer@example.org) for yfarmer@example.org; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 10:38:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 83.161.120.155 (gconf.SFBay.Sun.COM [83.161.120.155]) by mpk-mail1.sfbay.sun.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.24 (built Dec 19 2003)) with ESMTP id <yfarmer@example.org>; Wed, 05 Oct 2005 10:37:54 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 10:35:59 -0700 From: Allen Gilliland <yfarmer@example.org> Subject: Re: tagging screenshots In-reply-to: <yfarmer@example.org> To: Elias Torres <yfarmer@example.org> Cc: Dave Johnson <yfarmer@example.org>, roller-dev <yfarmer@example.org> Message-id: <1128533759.9089.32.camel@gconf> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 83.161.120.1555 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT References: <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> <yfarmer@example.org> X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org X-Spam-Rating: minotaur.apache.org 1.6.2 0/1000/N nice. i think all the screenshots look excellent. i know we've had quite a bit of discussion about tagging and i believe we are mostly on the same page as to how tagging support would work, but we still haven't finalized a design plan with a proposed implementation. before you guys get too far along with your implementation i think it would be good to see a design doc so that the team as a whole can agree on how the implementation will work. my original code was really just a proof of concept and even i am not sure it's the correct approach, so i'd definitely like to see a little more discussion about exactly how we would make tagging happen on the backend. i think
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