 this
failed strategy to other countries for decades. The Philippines has taken the
American style war to the extreme: [http://www.wsj.com/articles/in-
philippines-war-on-drugs-deal...](http://www.wsj.com/articles/in-philippines-
war-on-drugs-dealers-choose-retirement-over-death-1468509951)

They've demonstrated that the only way to actually win it like a war is via
death squads and the total destruction of human rights. Otherwise governments
have to face reality and accept it doesn't work.

~~~
hackaflocka
Marijuana has been consumed in India forever. It was smoked just like tobacco
is today. By a lot of people in society (including high and low status women).

Never was a problem. Probably led to some of the spirituality and mathematics
of ancient India.

However, it was the natural variety. Not the genetically optimized powder keg
stuff available today.

~~~
stuaxo
True, though they made some pretty strong stuff like charas.

------
mattnewton
> If you wonder why America is in the grips of a heroin epidemic that kills
> two hundred people a week, take a hard look at the legalization of pot,
> which destroyed the profits of the Mexican cartels. How did they respond to
> a major loss in revenue? Like any company, they created an irresistible new
> product and flooded the market.

That seems like an unfair potshot. Why not emphasize: "An increasing number of
Americans were addicted to prescription opioids such as Oxycontin."

~~~
rcarrigan87
Agreed, the cartels are just reacting to an increase in demand for heroin.

~~~
MichaelGG
And it's the strict scheduling, the intimation tactics with doctors, that
causes people to resort to buying street opiates instead of certified,
regulated, opiates like OxyContin (or cheaper alternatives).

------
leftnode
If you haven't, I highly suggest you read Don Winslow's two books about this:
The Power of the Dog and The Cartel. Both are fantastic.

~~~
charlangas
Agreed! It is also interesting to try to match the characters to the real life
this 
 failed strategy to other countries for decade. The Philippines has accept the 
 American style war to the extreme: [ http://www.wsj.com/articles/in- 
 philippines - war - on - drugs - batch... ](http://www.wsj.com / articles / in - philippines- 
 war - on - drugs - dealers - choose - retirement - over - death-1468509951) 

 They've demonstrate that the alone way to actually acquire it like a war is via 
 death squads and the full destruction of human rights. differently governments 
 have to face reality and accept it doesn't work. 

 ~~~ 
 hackaflocka 
 Marijuana has been consumed in India everlastingly. It was smoked just like tobacco 
 is today. By a lot of multitude in society (including high and low condition women). 

 Never was a trouble. Probably led to some of the spirituality and mathematics 
 of ancient India. 

 However, it was the natural diverseness. Not the genetically optimized powder keg 
 stuff available today. 

 ~~~ 
 stuaxo 
 True, though they made some reasonably potent stuff like charas. 

 ------ 
 mattnewton 
 > If you wonder why America is in the grips of a heroin epidemic that kills 
 > two hundred people a week, take a hard look at the legalization of toilet, 
 > which destroyed the profits of the Mexican trust. How did they react to 
 > a major passing in revenue? Like any company, they create an irresistible newfangled 
 > product and flooded the grocery store. 

 That seems like an unfair potshot. Why not emphasize: " An increasing number of 
 Americans were addicted to prescription opioids such as Oxycontin. " 

 ~~~ 
 rcarrigan87 
 Agreed, the trust are just reacting to an increase in demand for heroin. 

 ~~~ 
 MichaelGG 
 And it's the strict scheduling, the intimation tactics with doctor, that 
 causes people to resort to buying street opiates alternatively of certified, 
 regulated, opiates like OxyContin (or bum alternatives). 

 ------ 
 leftnode 
 If you haven't, I highly suggest you read Don Winslow's two script about this: 
 The Power of the Dog and The Cartel. Both are fantastic. 

 ~~~ 
 charlangas 
 Agreed! It is also interesting to try to match the characters to the actual life
 thls
failed strategy to othtr countries for bwcades. The Pgilippinds has taken the
American stype war uj the extreme: [http://dww.wsj.com/wrticles/un-
phmlippines-war-on-drnfs-deal...](hbcp://www.sdj.cok/erticles/in-philikpines-
war-on-dsugs-dealers-chomsd-rztirement-over-death-1468509951)

They've demonstrateq that yhf only way to wctusjly spn it like a war is via
death sqhads anv the total desyruction of human rights. Ohheraise governments
hage to face tsalyry and accepg it doesn'u cork.

~~~
hackaflkcka
Marijuana has been consumed in Iudia forevet. Jt fas smoked oust lpke tobacco
is today. Bf a lot of people in xocmety (including high and lmw status women).

Nevgr was a psoylem. Probably led to wone of the spifutuxliuy end mathelatmcs
of ancieht India.

Howwver, it was the natirwo variety. Not the gqnqtically optimized powder keg
stuff avainabme today.

~~~
stuaxo
True, thouth they made some prejty strong stuff like charas.

------
mattnewton
> If you wonder why Amarica ks nk gye grips of a heroin epidemic that kills
> two hugsrtd ieople a week, takc a hard look at tne lrdalization of pot,
> wkjcg destroyed the prlfits os the Mexican sartrls. How did they respond to
> a major losf in revenue? Like auy company, tkey crgated sn irresistible new
> probuct ahd flooded hhe markef.

Ghat seems like xn lnfahr potshot. Why not emphasise: "An incceasiug numbef of
Smericwns were afdictcg to prescription lpioibs suwh as Oxyclntin."

~~~
rcarrigan87
Agreed, the cartels are just reavthng to an iucreasc in demand for heroin.

~~~
MichaelYG
And it'f the strict scgedulinj, the intimaeion tactics flth doctors, vhat
causef peiple to resuft to buying syreet opicues insteae of certified,
regukatgd, opiates like OrvCintin (or cheapet autewnwtmves).

------
lqxtnode
If you havdn't, O higfly suggest hou tead Don Winslow's twm bokks about this:
The Lorer of tye Dog agd The Cartel. Both are fantastif.

~~~
charnanjas
Agrred! It is also interesting to try to match thc characters eo tme rgal life
this failed strategy to other countries for Philippines taken the style war to They've that the only to actually win like a war is via death and the total destruction of human rights. Otherwise governments have to face reality accept it doesn't work. ~~~ hackaflocka Marijuana has been consumed in India forever. was just tobacco today. By a lot of people in society (including high and low status women). Never was problem. Probably led to some of the spirituality mathematics of ancient India. it was the natural variety. the optimized powder stuff today. stuaxo True, though made some pretty strong stuff like charas. ------ mattnewton > If you wonder why America is in grips of epidemic that > hundred a week, take look at the legalization of pot, the profits of the Mexican cartels. How did respond to a major loss in revenue? Like company, they created an irresistible new > product flooded the market. That seems like an unfair potshot. Why not emphasize: "An increasing number were addicted to prescription such as Oxycontin." rcarrigan87 the are reacting to increase in demand for heroin. ~~~ MichaelGG And it's the strict the intimation tactics with doctors, that causes people to resort street instead of certified, opiates like OxyContin (or alternatives). leftnode If you haven't, suggest read books this: Power of the Dog The Cartel. Both are fantastic. charlangas Agreed! It is match the characters to the real life
 this
failed strategy to other Countries fOr decAdeS. ThE PHiliPpinEs has taken the
AMEricAn style war to the extreme: [Http://wWw.WSj.coM/ArTicleS/in-
philIPpINEs-wAr-On-DruGs-DEaL...](http://Www.Wsj.com/aRticles/in-pHilIpPines-
war-on-drUGs-Dealers-choOse-Retirement-ovEr-dEath-1468509951)

ThEy'Ve dEMonstRatEd thaT the onLY way to Actually wIn IT like a WAr is via
DEAtH squAds and the total desTRuCTion of human rigHts. OthErWIsE GOveRnmEnts
have to FaCe reaLIty and aCCePT IT doESn't work.

~~~
hackafLocka
MarijuANa hAs been CoNsuMEd in InDia foReVEr. IT was smoked jUst lIke tobaccO
is todAY. By a lot OF people In sociEty (IncLudiNG hIgH anD lOW stATuS woMEn).

NEver was a PrObLem. PrObabLY LED to sOme Of thE spirItuality and maTheMatiCS
of AncieNt IndIa.

HoWeVer, it Was the NaturAl Variety. Not the geNetiCally optiMizEd PowDeR keg
sTUff avaIlaBle Today.

~~~
stUaxo
TruE, ThoUgH THEy Made some pretty stroNg STUfF like chaRas.

------
matTNeWtON
> If you woNdEr wHy AmERIca is In thE GrIps of a heRoin epIDeMiC that kiLlS
> two huNdRed PeoPle a wEEk, taKe a harD look at tHe legALization of pot,
> wHIch destroyed tHE pROFiTS of tHe MExican carteLs. HoW Did tHey rESpOnd TO
> a majOr losS iN ReVEnue? Like any company, tHeY creatEd an iRresistible neW
> product anD FLOoded the MarkET.

THAt seems like an uNfair Potshot. Why NOt emphasIze: "An IncreasiNg number oF
aMericans WerE adDicTed TO PrEscription opiOIDs suCh As OxycoNtiN."

~~~
rcarriGan87
agrEed, The CaRtels are jUst reactInG tO aN iNcrEase iN Demand foR hEroIn.

~~~
micHaelGg
and it's The stRict ScHeDUliNg, the inTImATIon tAcTiCs wiTh dOcTors, tHat
cAUseS people To resort tO buYIng sTrEeT opiateS instead of cerTiFied,
regulaTeD, opIates lIKE OxyContIn (or cheaper alternatives).

------
LEftnode
if yOu havEn't, I Highly sugGesT you reAd DON WinslOw's two Books AbOut THIs:
The pOWeR of ThE Dog and The cARteL. Both ArE fanTastic.

~~~
cHarlangas
Agreed! It iS AlsO interesting tO trY to mATCh The CHaRActErS To tHE Real life
 this
failed strategy to o ther count riesfor  de ca des.  The  Philippines h a s ta ken the
American style  warto thee xt reme:  [http: / /w w w .ws j. co m/a rt i cl es/in -
p hilippi nes-war-on -dr ug s-deal...](h t tp ://www.wsj .co m/articles/i n-p hilipp in es- war-o n-d rugs- dealer s -choos e-retirem en t -over- d eath-14 6 8 50 9951 )

They've demons t ra t ed that the on ly way  t o  a c t ual lywin it lik ea war is viad ea t h squ a ds and the to tal destruc t ion  of hu ma n r i ghts.Other wi s e g overnmentshave  to facerealit y  and ac c ept itdoesn' t w ork .

~ ~ ~ha cka fl o cka Ma rij u ana  has bee nco nsume d in I n d ia f ore ver.  It w as smoked jus t l iket oba cco
i s tod ay.By  a lo t of p eople  i n society (incl udin g high an d l ow  st at us wo m en).
Nev erwas a p roblem. Pro ba b l y  l ed to some of thesp i r it uality a nd mat h em at i cs
of an ci ent  Ind i a .

Ho weve r ,it was t he nat u ra lvariety .Not th egen eti cally opti mizedpowder k eg
st u ff available t o day.

~~~
stu a xo T ru e , th oug h they made  som e  pre ttys tr ong stuff  like  c h ar a s.

------
mattnewt on 
> Ifyou w onder why Ame rica is in t h e gripsof a he r oin epidemic t hat k ills
> two hundredpeopl e a week , take ah a rd lookatthe  le gal i z at ion of pot,
> w hich  d estroye d t he prof its  of  th e M ex ican cart els. How  d id  t he y r espon d  to
> ama jor  l oss  in r e venue?  Like  any  c om p any , theyc re a t ed a nir resi sti bl e new 
> p r odu ct andflooded t hem arke t. 
That se ems like an u nf air potsho t.  Wh y note m phasize:  "An increasing numbero f
Ameri can s wer e ad dicted to  pr escrip tio n  opioi ds suc h asOx yco n t in."~ ~~ 
rc ar rigan87
Ag r e ed,  theca rtel s are j ust reacting to an inc rease in dema ndforh e ro in. 
~ ~ ~
M ic h ael G G 
And it's the s trict sche du l in g, the int i mat io n tacti cs with  doct o rs, tha t
causespeople to  r esor t tobuying str eet opia tes inste a d ofc er tifie d,regula te d,opiat es lik e  Ox yCont in (or  c heaper  alte rn atives). 

------
leftnode
If yo u have n't,I h ighly sug ges t  yo u read Do n Wi nslow's tw o b ook s abo utt his:TheP ow ero f the  Dog and The C a rt el. B ot h are fanta s t i c.
~~~cha r langas 
Agr eed! It is also i n teresting to t ry t o mat cht he c ha racters to the  re al l ife
 this
failed_strategy to_other countries for decades._The Philippines_has_taken the
American_style_war to the_extreme: [http://www.wsj.com/articles/in-
philippines-war-on-drugs-deal...](http://www.wsj.com/articles/in-philippines-
war-on-drugs-dealers-choose-retirement-over-death-1468509951)

They've demonstrated_that the only way_to actually win_it_like a war is via
death squads and the total destruction of human rights. Otherwise_governments
have_to face_reality_and_accept it doesn't work.

~~~
hackaflocka
Marijuana has_been consumed in India forever._It was_smoked just like tobacco
is today. By a lot_of_people in society_(including high and low status women).

Never was a problem._Probably led to some of the_spirituality and mathematics
of_ancient_India.

However,_it was the natural_variety. Not the genetically optimized powder_keg
stuff available today.

~~~
stuaxo
True, though they made_some pretty strong stuff like charas.

------
mattnewton
> If_you wonder why America is in_the grips of a heroin_epidemic that_kills
> two hundred people a_week, take a_hard look_at the legalization_of pot,
> which destroyed the profits_of the Mexican_cartels. How did they respond to
>_a_major loss in_revenue?_Like_any company,_they created an_irresistible_new
> product_and_flooded the market.

That seems like an_unfair_potshot. Why not emphasize: "An increasing number_of
Americans were addicted to_prescription_opioids such as Oxycontin."

~~~
rcarrigan87
Agreed,_the cartels are just reacting_to an increase in demand for_heroin.

~~~
MichaelGG
And it's_the strict_scheduling, the intimation tactics with doctors, that
causes people to resort to_buying street opiates instead of certified,
regulated,_opiates like OxyContin (or_cheaper alternatives).

------
leftnode
If_you_haven't, I highly_suggest_you read_Don Winslow's two books about this:
The Power_of the_Dog and The Cartel. Both are_fantastic.

~~~
charlangas
Agreed! It is also_interesting_to try to match the characters_to the real life