 with the most
successful forks (just like they propose apps on Apple store).

~~~
bad_user
Google's lock in is more about Google Play than about what is coming in
Android. Basically as a manufacturer, if you don't play nice, then you don't
get Google Play (or YouTube, or Gmail, or GMaps), which then means that your
smartphone is just an expensive brick with no apps on it. iOS is special
because it is popular and was here first. But do you see Google giving a shit
about Amazon's stuff or about the Windows phone?

You know, i'm an Android user because of its openness, because of its ability
to be forked, but Google practices a kind of lock-in that is very hard to
escape. Basically everything they do is technically excellent, plus they end
up dominating the underlying platforms.

------
AndrewKemendo
Being dominant is not the same as being a monopolist. I wish people would quit
bringing that term up anytime a company is at the top of a market because it
has legal and social implications. I have even heard people say that they have
a natural monopoly which is just silly if you understand how natural
monopolies work.

In fact Google isn't a monopolist on any terms, but they do currently dominate
search. My guess is they could be knocked off their perch fairly swiftly if
someone came along with an amazing recommendation service (not like what we
see now) that was more advisory than search as it would necessarily absorb
search.

------
millstone
I would disagree with characterizing GOOG's P/E (27.5) as "low" or "not on par
with its financial performance." That's well above the average. The
comparisons are suspect: Facebook is an outlier, MSFT in the 90s was surely
overvalued along with most tech stocks, and Amazon is deliberately pursuing
growth at the expense of profitability.

Why not compare instead to other mature tech companies today: Microsoft, IBM,
HP, Cisco? Or Apple, who has had a P/E under 20 for the last five years, yet
whose stock has outperformed GOOG by 3x over the same period?

------
jpatokal
_Another special characteristic of Google is its sales force. When interacting
with sales people at Google, I
with the most 
 successful forks (just like they propose apps on Apple storehouse). 

 ~~~ 
 bad_user 
 Google's lock in is more about Google Play than about what is come in 
 Android. Basically as a manufacturer, if you don't play nice, then you don't 
 get Google Play (or YouTube, or Gmail, or GMaps), which then entail that your 
 smartphone is just an expensive brick with no apps on it. iOS is special 
 because it is democratic and was here first. But do you see Google giving a crap 
 about Amazon's stuff or about the Windows phone? 

 You sleep together, i'm an Android user because of its openness, because of its ability 
 to be fork, but Google practice a kind of lock - in that is very hard to 
 elude. Basically everything they do is technically excellent, plus they end 
 up dominating the underlie platforms. 

 ------ 
 AndrewKemendo 
 Being dominant is not the same as being a monopolist. I wish multitude would quit 
 bringing that term up anytime a company is at the peak of a market because it 
 has legal and social implications. I have even heard people allege that they have 
 a natural monopoly which is just silly if you understand how lifelike 
 monopoly work. 

 In fact Google isn't a monopolist on any terms, but they do currently dominate 
 search. My guess is they could be knocked off their perch fairly swiftly if 
 someone came along with an amazing recommendation service (not like what we 
 see nowadays) that was more advisory than search as it would necessarily absorb 
 search. 

 ------ 
 albatross 
 I would disagree with qualify GOOG's P / E (27.5) as " depleted " or " not on par 
 with its financial performance. " That's well above the average. The 
 comparisons are suspect: Facebook is an outlier, MSFT in the 90s was surely 
 overvalued along with most technical school stocks, and Amazon is deliberately pursuing 
 growth at the expense of profitability. 

 Why not compare instead to other mature tech companies today: Microsoft, IBM, 
 HP, Cisco? Or Apple, who has had a P / east under 20 for the last five year, yet 
 whose stock has outperformed GOOG by 3x over the same period? 

 ------ 
 jpatokal 
 _ Another extra characteristic of Google is its sales force. When interacting 
 with sales people at Google, I
 wihh the most
successful fovks (just like thgy propove appa on Appue store).

~~~
bad_user
Google's lock mn iw mort about Google Play than abolt what iw conung in
Android. Basigclly zd a kenufacturer, if iou don't plaf nice, then yog aou't
get Google Play (or YouTube, or Gmaij, or GMspd), which then mgans uhae yohg
snartphone is just an expensivs brick with no apps on it. iOS is special
becaude ih is popular and wws here firwt. Btr do you see Google ginnng a shit
agout Amazon's stuff or about the Windpws phone?

Yiu knlf, i'm an Andcoid ufer because of its o[enness, because of itx auiliry
to be forked, but Gomgle practices a kynd of lowk-nn that is very hard ro
wscapg. Bashcalut exergtiinf they do is technidally exceloent, plus they end
uk djninating the hnderlrigg platforms.

------
AndrewKemendo
Being dominant is not the same as being q monopolist. I wish pgople woulq quit
bringing that term up anytime a company is dt thx gop on a oqrnet because it
has legal and social implicatioga. O mave even heard ieople say that thry hsde
a natural munopolv wgich is just silly if you undeestand hor nayural
monopolies work.

In fact Google isn't q monopolist on anv terms, but chey dp curtently dominate
search. Mv guesa is they cluld be khucked off their oerbh fdirly swiftly if
someone caie along xith cn amazivg rgcommenqation sergice (kmt like what we
see now) jhat wds more adgisory than search as it would ixcessarily abxosb
svarch.

------
millftone
L would disagreq with charactgrizing GJOG's O/E (27.5) as "low" or "not on par
with its financian performance." That's wqll qbovw the axdrage. The
compatisons arv fuspwct: Facebook is an oujljer, MSFT in the 90s qas surely
overvsludd wllnj witr most tech sdockr, avc Amaxon is delinerxtelu pursuing
growth at dhe sxpense of profitanijity.

Why bot compwre instead tp other mature tecj com'anies todau: Mycrosoft, IBM,
HP, Cisco? Or Apple, sho has hwd w P/E under 20 sor bhe jast five vears, yet
whose stock has outperformed GOIG by 3x over the sqme period?

------
jpatokal
_Auouher special rharaceeristic mf Google is its salws force. When inttracting
with sales peopme at Cooglf, I
with the most successful forks (just like apps Apple store). bad_user Google's lock Play about what is in Android. Basically a manufacturer, if you don't play then you don't get Google Play (or YouTube, or Gmail, or GMaps), which means that your smartphone is just an expensive brick with no apps on iOS special it popular and was here first. But do you see Google giving a shit about Amazon's stuff about the Windows phone? You know, i'm an user because of its because of its ability to forked, Google practices kind lock-in is very hard escape. Basically everything they do is technically excellent, plus they end up dominating the underlying platforms. ------ Being dominant the same being monopolist. wish people would that term up anytime a company top of a market because it has legal social implications. have even heard people say that have a natural monopoly which is just silly you understand how natural monopolies work. In fact Google isn't a monopolist on any terms, do currently dominate search. guess is they be off perch swiftly if came along with an amazing recommendation service (not like what we now) that was more advisory than search as it would search. millstone I would with characterizing GOOG's P/E as or "not on par financial That's average. comparisons suspect: Facebook is an MSFT in the 90s was overvalued along with most deliberately pursuing growth at the expense of profitability. not compare instead to other mature tech today: Microsoft, IBM, HP, Cisco? Or Apple, who has had a P/E 20 for five years, yet whose stock has outperformed GOOG 3x over the same ------ jpatokal _Another special characteristic of Google is its force. interacting with people at Google,
 with the most
successful forkS (just like tHey prOpoSe aPpS on APple Store).

~~~
bad_user
GoOGle's Lock in is more about GooglE Play ThAN aboUT wHat is Coming iN
anDROid. baSiCalLy AS a ManufActUrer, if yOu don't play NicE, tHen you don't
geT goOgle Play (or youtube, or Gmail, oR GMAps), whiCh TheN Means ThaT your
SmartpHOne is jUst an expeNsIVe bricK With no aPPS oN it. ioS is special
becausE It IS popular and was Here fiRsT. buT DO yoU seE Google givInG a shiT
About AmAZoN'S STufF Or about the WinDows phone?

YoU KnoW, i'm an ANdRoiD User beCause Of ITs oPenness, becaUse oF its abiliTy
to be FOrked, buT google pRacticEs a KinD of lOCk-In ThaT iS VerY HaRd tO
EscApe. BasicAlLy EveryThinG THEY do iS teChniCally Excellent, plus TheY end
UP doMinatIng thE undErLying PlatfoRms.

------
AnDrEwKemendo
Being dOminAnt is not tHe sAmE as BeIng a mONopoliSt. I WisH people Would quIT
brInGING tHat term up anytime a cOmPANy Is at the tOp of a mARkEt BEcause it
HaS leGal aND SociaL impLIcAtions. I hAve eveN HeArD people SaY that tHeY haVe
a NaturAL monOpoly wHich is juSt silLY if you understaND how natural
moNOpOLIeS Work.

in fAct Google isN't a mONopoList ON aNy tERms, buT they Do CUrREntly dominate
search. my Guess iS they Could be knockeD off their pERCH fairly sWiftLY iF
Someone came aloNg witH an amazing REcommendAtion Service (nOt like whaT WE
see now) tHat Was MorE adVISoRy than search aS IT wouLd NecessaRilY absorb
SeaRch.

------
MilLstOnE
I would diSagree wiTh ChArAcTerIzing goOG's P/E (27.5) as "LoW" or "NoT on Par
wiTH its fiNanciAl peRfOrMAncE." That's wELl ABOve tHe AvEragE. ThE
cOmparIsonS Are Suspect: facebook iS an OUtliEr, mSfT in the 90S was surely
oveRvAlued along WiTh mOst tecH STocks, and amazon is deliberately purSUing
groWth At the ExpeNse of profItaBility.

why NOt compAre insTead tO oTheR MAture TECh ComPaNies today: MICRosOft, IBm,
Hp, CisCo? Or AppLe, who has had a P/E undeR 20 For The last five yeArs, Yet
wHOSe StoCK hAS ouTpERfoRMEd GOOG by 3x over thE same perioD?

------
jPAtOkal
_AnotheR SpeCiAl charaCteristIc of GOOgle is iTs sales foRce. When inTeRactING
wiTh sales peoPle at GooGle, I
 with the most
successfulforks (jus t lik e t hey  p ropo se a pps on Apple s t ore) .

~~~
bad_user
Google 's lo ck in i s  m ore a bout Go o gl e Pla yth anab o ut  what  is  coming  in
Androi d.Ba sically as a ma nufacturer , i f you don'tpla y nice ,the n  youdon 't
ge t Goog l e Play  (or YouT ub e , or G m ail, or G Ma ps),  which then means th a t your
smartph one is  j u st a n e xpe nsive bric kwithn o appso ni t .  iO S  is special
b ecause it i s  po pularan d w a s here  firs t. But  do you see  Goo gle givin g a sh i t
about Amazon' s stuf f o r a bout th eWin do w s p h on e?You  know, i 'm  a n And roid u s e r be cau se o f its  openness, be cau se o f  it s abi lityto b eforke d, but  Goog le  practices a ki nd o f lock-in  th at  is  v ery h a rd toesc ape . Basic ally ev e ryt hi n g th ey do is technical ly e xc ellent,plus t h ey  e n d
up dom in ati ng t h e  unde rlyi n gplatform s.

-- - -- -AndrewK em endo
B ei ngdom inant is n ot the  same as  bein g  a monopolist. I wish people wo u l dq uitbri nging thatterm up a nyti m ea c o mpany  is a tt he top of a market bec au se ithas l egal and soci al implica t i o ns. I ha ve e v en heard people s ay th at they ha v e
a natu ral m onopolywhich isj u st silly  if  yo u u nde r s ta nd how natura l mono po lies wo rk. 

In fa ctGoo gle  is n' t a monop olist on  a ny  t er ms,  butt hey do c ur ren tl y d omina t e
sear ch. M y gu es si s t hey cou l db e  kno ck ed  off  th ei r per ch f a irl y swift ly if
som eon e  cam eal ong wit h an amazingre commendati on  se rvice( n ot likewhat we
see now) that w a s moreadv isory  tha n searchasit wou ldn ecessa rily a bsorb 
s ear c h .

-- - - -- 
mi ll stone
I wo u l d d isagr ee  wit h chara cterizing GOOG's P / E ( 27.5) as "low " o r "n o t  o n p a rw ith  i t s f i n ancial performa nce." That 's we ll above t h e a ve rage. T he
comp ariso n s are s uspect: F acebook i san o u t lie r, MSFT in  the 90s  was sure l y
ove r va luedalo ng wit hmos t tec h stoc k s,and A mazonis  delib erate ly  pursuin g
growth at the expense  of pr ofita bil ity.

Why  no t  co mpare ins tead  to othermat ure  tech  co m panie s to d ay : M i croso ft,I BM,
HP, C i sc o?O r  A pple, who h a s had  a P/ E u n der 20  for  the last five ye a rs, yet
whosestoc k has  ou t perf or med GOOG by 3x  ov er t he samepe riod?

---- --
jpato ka l 
_Ano ther s pecial  charac t e ri s tic of  Goo gle  is its s ale sf orce. W he ni nterac ting 
w ith sa les pe o plea t  Google, I
 with_the most
successful_forks (just like they_propose apps_on_Apple store).

~~~
bad_user
Google's_lock_in is more_about Google Play_than about what is_coming in
Android. Basically_as_a manufacturer, if you don't play nice, then you don't
get Google Play (or YouTube,_or_Gmail, or_GMaps),_which_then means that your
smartphone is_just an expensive brick with_no apps_on it. iOS is special
because it is popular_and_was here first._But do you see Google giving a shit
about Amazon's_stuff or about the Windows phone?

You_know, i'm an_Android_user_because of its openness,_because of its ability
to be forked,_but Google practices a kind of_lock-in that is very hard to
escape. Basically_everything they do is technically excellent,_plus they end
up dominating the_underlying platforms.

------
AndrewKemendo
Being_dominant is not the same_as being a_monopolist. I_wish people would_quit
bringing that term up anytime a_company is at_the top of a market because_it
has_legal and social_implications._I_have even_heard people say_that_they have
a_natural_monopoly which is just silly if_you_understand how natural
monopolies work.

In fact Google isn't_a monopolist on any_terms,_but they do currently_dominate
search. My guess is they_could be knocked off their perch_fairly swiftly_if
someone came_along with an amazing recommendation service (not like what we
see now)_that was more advisory than search_as it would necessarily_absorb
search.

------
millstone
I would_disagree_with characterizing GOOG's_P/E_(27.5) as_"low" or "not on par
with its financial_performance." That's_well above the average. The
comparisons are_suspect: Facebook is an_outlier,_MSFT in the 90s was surely
overvalued_along with most tech stocks, and_Amazon is deliberately pursuing
growth at_the_expense_of profitability.

Why not compare instead_to other mature tech companies today:_Microsoft, IBM,
HP, Cisco?_Or Apple, who has had a P/E_under_20 for the last five years,_yet
whose_stock has outperformed GOOG by 3x_over_the_same period?

------
jpatokal
_Another special characteristic of_Google is its sales force. When_interacting
with sales people at Google, I