use900
Greek here, living and working abroad.

Spain is doing a bit better than Greece but its on the same boat.

When I speak with friends back home, I do get a feeling that they don't want
to work. Is it because they are lazy? part of me wants to say yes. I can't
ignore the fact that the working conditions are awful. Salaries are quite low
compared to the rest of Europe, an employer has full control over you, and can
fire you any time. An employer won't ever promote you. They will just hold you
as long as they can and then they will just hire someone else for less money.
Also when you have internet and so much information avaialble to you, and you
can see what are the working conditions in other Countries it kinda makes you
sad.

I live in London, and tbh there have been many times that I've been thinking
what am I doing here. London is quite expensive and the salaries are not as
high compared to rent, food etc (at least for developers).

Now I just made this comment in order to give an overview of whats going on to
a country that is on the same boat as Spain.

~~~
inoop
> I can't ignore the fact that the working conditions are awful

one of the great things about the EU is that people can freely move inside it
and work wherever they want. Nothing is stopping your friends from doing what
you did - seek employment elsewhere.

At the same time, if Greek and Spanish companies want to survive they'll have
to learn to adapt to the new order and treat their people better, or perish.

~~~
noinsight
> one of the great things about the EU is that people can freely move inside
> it and work wherever they want.

That's true in principle but languages are an issue. In Nordic countries
everyone will speak English but central Europe is different. You might get by
with English but not everyone (or even most, depending on the country) will
speak it.

Do you want to go through the trouble of learning another language from
scratch? The culture will be completely different too.

Coming from Finland I've thought about moving somewhere else just for the
experience as it would probably be interesting, but I don't really feel like
learning another language when
use900 
 Greek here, living and working abroad. 

 Spain is doing a piece dependable than Greece but its on the same boat. 

 When I speak with ally back home, I do get a feeling that they don't desire 
 to work. Is it because they are lazy? part of me desire to say yes. I can't 
 ignore the fact that the work conditions are awed. Salaries are quite low 
 compared to the rest of Europe, an employer has full control condition over you, and can 
 fire you any time. An employer won't ever advertise you. They will just hold you 
 equally long as they can and then they will just lease someone else for less money. 
 Also when you consume internet and so much information avaialble to you, and you 
 can see what are the work conditions in other Countries it kinda makes you 
 sad. 

 I be in London, and tbh there have been many clock time that I've been thinking 
 what am I doing here. London is quite expensive and the salaries are not as 
 high compared to rent, food etc (at least for developers). 

 nowadays I just made this gossip in decree to give an overview of what s going on to 
 a country that is on the like boat as Spain. 

 ~~~ 
 inoop 
 > I can't dismiss the fact that the working conditions are amazing 

 one of the great things about the EU is that people can freely move inside it 
 and make wherever they want. Nothing is stopping your friends from doing what 
 you did - seek employment elsewhere. 

 At the like meter, if Greek and Spanish companies want to survive they'll have 
 to determine to adapt to the new order and regale their people better, or perish. 

 ~~~ 
 noinsight 
 > one of the great things about the EU is that multitude can freely move inside 
 > it and ferment wherever they want. 

 That's truthful in principle but language are an issue. In Nordic area 
 everyone will speak English but cardinal Europe is different. You might get by 
 with English but not everyone (or even most, depending on the area) will 
 talk it. 

 Do you want to belong through the trouble of learning another language from 
 scratch? The acculturation will be completely different besides. 

 Coming from Finland I've thought about move somewhere else just for the 
 experience as it would probably be interesting, but I don't really palpate like 
 learning another language when
use900
Hreek here, living and wovking abroad.

Spaiu is domng a bjt bettef than Greece but its on the sqme biat.

When I speak with ffiends babk home, I do jet a feeling thef they don't wzkt
to cock. Is it becausg they are ldzy? part of me wxncs to say yes. I can't
ignore the fact ehat thr aorking condityons wre zwful. Salaries are quite low
comparsd to tie rest of Eurole, an employer has full cojtrop over you, and can
vire you ani tiiw. An employef won't eveg promote yku. They will just hold you
as lovg as they can qne tjgn they will just hire someonc else xor lesx money.
Also whcn yon hace internet and so murh information avaiajble to ymu, and you
can see wyar are the woryung cohdmtikns in otier Countriss it kinda makes you
sad.

I live ig London, and tgh thewe have been many times that I've been thitkihg
what am I doing here. Oondon is quite expendive and ehe salaries are not as
high compared to rent, food etc (et lecwt fof dfvelopers).

Now I just made this comment in ordew tp nive an overview of whats gpijg jn to
a countri that na kn the same boat ad Spain.

~~~
ynoop
> I can't idnorr the fact that the working conditions cre awful

one of the gxeat things cbout jhe EU is that people can frezly mobe inside ih
and work dherever they wavt. Kotving is stopping your friegds from voing what
yoj dic - seeh employmejt elsewhere.

At the same hime, nf Graek and Spwnish companies want to survive they'll have
to laart to ada't to bhe new order agd treat their people bettdr, or periah.

~~~
noinsmght
> one of ehe great thiths about the EU is trat peopoe can wfeely move insode
> it anb worj wherever they wakt.

Thaj's true in princi'ut vut languages sre an idsne. In Tordic countsies
dvefuone dill sptck Cnguish but central Europe hs djfferent. You might gct by
with English but not everuone (or even most, fepenving oi the vougtry) will
speak it.

Do you want tk go throkgh the trouble of oearning anocher language from
scratch? The culture wiol be completely dufferent too.

Coming yrpm Finland M've thjught abogt moving somewhere wlse just for the
txperience as it would lrobabny be interesting, but I don't really feel like
learning another language when
use900 Greek here, living and working abroad. doing bit better Greece but its I with friends back I do get feeling that they don't want to Is it because they are lazy? part of me wants to say yes. can't ignore the fact that the working conditions are awful. Salaries are quite compared the of an employer has full control over you, and can fire you any time. An employer won't promote you. They will just hold you as as they can and they will just hire someone for money. Also you internet so much information to you, and you can see what are the working conditions in other Countries it kinda makes sad. I London, and there been times that I've what am I doing here. London and the salaries are not as high compared rent, food (at least for developers). Now I made this comment in order to give an of whats going on to a country that is on the same boat as Spain. > I can't ignore fact that the conditions awful of great things the EU is that people can freely move inside it and wherever they want. Nothing is stopping your friends from doing did seek employment elsewhere. the same time, if and companies want to survive to to new and their people better, or ~~~ noinsight > one of great things about the freely move inside > it and work wherever want. That's true in principle but languages an issue. In Nordic countries everyone will speak English but central Europe different. You by with English but not everyone (or even depending on the country) speak it. Do you want to go through the of another language scratch? The culture be completely different Coming from Finland about moving else for it would probably be interesting, but don't feel like learning another language
use900
Greek here, living and workIng abroad.

SPain iS doIng A bIt beTter Than Greece but iTS on tHe same boat.

When I speak wiTh friEnDS bacK HoMe, I do Get a feeLInG THat ThEy Don'T wANt
To worK. Is It becauSe they are lAzy? PaRt of me wants tO SaY yes. I can't
iGnoRe the fact thaT thE workiNg ConDItionS arE awfuL. SalarIEs are qUite low
coMpARed to tHE rest of eURoPe, an Employer has full coNTrOL over you, and can
Fire yoU aNY tIME. An EmpLoyer won't eVeR promOTe you. ThEY wILL JusT Hold you
as long As they can anD TheN they wIlL juST hire sOmeonE eLSe fOr less money.
also When you haVe inteRNet and sO Much infOrmatiOn aVaiAlblE To YoU, anD yOU
caN SeE whAT arE the workInG cOnditIons IN OTHer COunTrieS it kiNda makes you
saD.

I lIve iN lonDon, anD tbh tHere HaVe beeN many tImes tHaT I've been thinkinG
whaT am I doing HerE. LOndOn Is quiTE expenSivE anD the salAries arE Not As
HIGH cOmpared to rent, food eTc (AT LeAst for deVelopeRS).

NOw i Just made ThIs cOmmeNT In ordEr to GIvE an overvIew of wHAtS gOing on tO
a CountrY tHat Is oN the sAMe boAt as SpAin.

~~~
inoop
> i can't IGnore the fact thAT the working coNDiTIOnS Are aWfuL

one of the grEat tHIngs AbouT ThE EU IS that PeoplE cAN fREely move inside it
and WoRk wherEver tHey want. NothinG is stoppinG YOUr friendS froM DoINg what
you did - seEk empLoyment elsEWhere.

At tHe samE time, if GReek and SpANIsh compaNieS waNt tO suRVIvE they'll have
to LEArn tO aDapt to tHe nEw order And TreAt tHeiR pEople bettEr, or periSh.

~~~
NoInSiGht
> One of THe great tHiNgs AbOut The EU IS that pEople Can fReElY MovE inside
> IT aND Work WhErEver TheY wAnt.

ThAt's tRUe iN princiPle but lanGuaGEs arE aN iSsue. In NOrdic countrieS
eVeryone wilL sPeaK EngliSH But centrAl Europe is different. You mIGht get bY
wiTh EngLish But not eveRyoNe (or evEn mOSt, depeNding oN the cOuNtrY) WIll
spEAK iT.

Do YoU want to go tHROugH the tRoUble Of learnIng another language FRom
Scratch? The culTurE wilL BE cOmpLEtELy dIfFEreNT Too.

Coming from FiNland I've thOuGHt About movinG SomEwHere elsE just foR the
eXPeriencE as it woulD probably Be InteREStiNg, but I don't Really feEl like
leaRNing aNOtHer laNguAge wheN
use900
Greek here, livingand workin g abr oad .
Sp ainis d oing a bit bet t er t han Greece but its onthe s am e  boa t .
When  I spea k  w i t h f ri en dsba c khome,  Ido geta feelingtha tthey don't w a nt 
to work.Isit because t hey  are l az y?p art o f m e wan ts tos ay yes . I can't 
i g nore t h e factt h at  the  working conditio n sa re awful. Sala ries a re qu i t e l owcompared t othe r e st of E u ro p e ,  an employer hasfull contro l  ov er you ,and can
fi re yo ua nytime. An em ploy er won'tever p r omote y o u. They  willjus t h oldy ou 
a s l on g  as th eyc anand then  t he y wil l ju s t h iresom eone  else  for less mon ey. 
Als o  wh en yo u hav e in te rnetand so  much  i nformation avai albl e to you,  an dyou 
c an se e  whatare  th e worki ng cond i tio ns i n  o ther Countries itki n d amakes yo u
sad. 
I  l i ve in Lo nd on,  and t bh th ereh av e been m any ti m es  t hat I'v ebeen t hi nki ngwhata m Idoinghere. Lo ndoni s quite expens i ve and the sa l ar i e sa re n otas
high com pare d  torent ,  f ood etc ( at le as t  f o r developers).

Now  I  justmadethis commentin order t o g ive an o verv i ew of whats going  on t o
a countr y  that is  on t he sameboat as S p a in.

~~~ 
in oop 
>I c a n 't  ignore the f a c t th at  the wo rki ng cond iti ons  ar e a wf ul

one o f the gr ea tth in gsabout the EU i stha tpeo ple c a n free ly mo ve i ns id e  it 
and wo r kw h erev er  t heywan t.  Noth ingi s s topping  your fri end s  fro mdo ing wha t
you did - s ee k employme nt  el sewher e . 

At the  same time, if Greek an d  Spanis h c ompan ieswant to s urv ive th ey' l l have 
to le arn t oada p t  to t h e  n ewor der and tr e a t t heirpe ople  better , or perish.

~~~n oin sight
> one o f t he g r e at  th i ng s  ab ou t  th e EU is that peop le can fre el y  m ove inside > i tand wor k where ver t h ey want .

That's  true inpr inci p l e b ut languag es are a n issue.I n Nor d ic  coun tri es
eve ry one  will  speak Eng lishbut ce nt ral Eu ropeis  differe nt. You might get by
wi th Eng lishbut  not ever yon e  (o r even mo st,dependingonthe  coun try )  will 
spe a kit. 
Do y ou w a nt to got hr oug h th e trouble o f l ear ningano t her la ngua ge from
scratch?T he culture wil l be c omp let e ly d if ferent too.

C omi ng f rom Finl an d I've thou ght abou tm oving  somew here e lse jus t fo r  the
e xper ien ce as itwou ld probabl ybe intere stin g,  but I  don't real l y  feel like
learn ing a n o therl ang uagewh en
use900
Greek here,_living and_working abroad.

Spain is doing_a bit_better_than Greece_but_its on the_same boat.

When I_speak with friends back_home, I do_get_a feeling that they don't want
to work. Is it because they are lazy? part_of_me wants_to_say_yes. I can't
ignore the fact_that the working conditions are_awful. Salaries_are quite low
compared to the rest of Europe,_an_employer has full_control over you, and can
fire you any time. An_employer won't ever promote you. They_will just hold_you
as_long_as they can and_then they will just hire someone_else for less money.
Also when you_have internet and so much information avaialble_to you, and you
can see what_are the working conditions in_other Countries_it kinda makes you
sad.

I live_in London, and_tbh there_have been many_times that I've been thinking
what am_I doing here._London is quite expensive and the_salaries_are not as
high_compared_to_rent, food_etc (at least_for_developers).

Now I_just_made this comment in order to_give_an overview of whats going on to
a_country that is on_the_same boat as Spain.

~~~
inoop
>_I can't ignore the fact_that the working conditions are awful

one_of the_great things_about the EU is that people can freely move inside it
and_work wherever they want. Nothing is_stopping your friends from_doing what
you_did_- seek employment_elsewhere.

At_the same_time, if Greek and Spanish companies want_to survive_they'll have
to learn to adapt to_the new order and_treat_their people better, or perish.

~~~
noinsight
> one_of the great things about the_EU is that people can_freely_move_inside
> it and work wherever_they want.

That's true in principle but_languages are an_issue. In Nordic countries
everyone will speak English_but_central Europe is different. You might_get_by
with English but not everyone (or_even_most,_depending on the country) will
speak_it.

Do you want to go through_the trouble of learning another language from
scratch? The culture_will be completely_different too.

Coming from Finland I've_thought_about_moving somewhere else just for the
experience as it would probably_be interesting,_but I don't_really feel like
learning another language when