 levels of management
welcomed dissenting opinions - maybe that is one of the key bits to look for
when determining if a (traditionally-structured) company is a good place to be
a mid-level manager.

~~~
sailfast
Agreed - I don't think that all honesty has to go out the window just because
you are in a management position. Communicating decisions is one aspect, but
effectively implementing them in your team is a whole other thing. Honest
discussion of concerns and what can be improved is important, and as much as
management likes to think their poker face is awesome, employees are smart and
see straight through bullshit.

Secondly, what I heard in your comment (and agree with) but don't see in the
original post is anything about engaging to be an advocate for your employees
up the chain, giving them an opportunity to tell you what they need, the
questions they have, the things you can do. To a certain extent this might
make you lonelier on the "who do I talk to?" side, but helps a great deal as a
reminder of the purpose of the job.

------
Htsthbjig
Learn to say "no". I have a company that I managed. In the company I was the
"boss", but my boss was our customers. You need to say no to customers often.

Before learning to say no life was miserable. After I did it was heaven. Learn
to say reasonable noes to your customers, to your upper managers, to your
partner,to your kids, and your life will be much better.

Forget the advice of that stupid blog. You should not always support upper
management, you are not a drone. If you work in the army and they tell you to
kill every civilian inside a village, you must say no.

When upper management wants to do something that is stupid and you will have
to support and be responsible for it, you should say no(after you double proof
that it is not you who is wrong).

Get a mentor you respect and admire. Create a mastermind of the best managers
you could find. You will discover management is not what you think it is(or
better said, it does not have to be that way).

------
walterbell
Leadership is lonely. There's always a boss behind
levels of management 
 welcomed dissenting opinions - possibly that is one of the cardinal snatch to look for 
 when determine if a (traditionally - structure) company is a good place to be 
 a mid - floor manager. 

 ~~~ 
 sailfast 
 Agreed - I don't think that all honesty have to go out the window barely because 
 you are in a management position. Communicating decision is one aspect, but 
 efficaciously implementing them in your team is a solid early thing. Honest 
 discussion of concerns and what can be better is important, and as much as 
 management like to think their poker expression is awesome, employees are smart and 
 see straight through bullshit. 

 second, what I heard in your comment (and agree with) but don't see in the 
 original post is anything about engaging to be an advocate for your employee 
 up the range, give them an opportunity to tell you what they need, the 
 questions they have, the things you can do. To a certain extent this might 
 make you alone on the " who do I talk to? " side, but help a big deal as a 
 reminder of the purpose of the caper. 

 ------ 
 Htsthbjig 
 Learn to say " no ". I have a company that I managed. In the ship's company I was the 
 " boss ", but my boss was our customers. You need to say no to customers much. 

 Before learning to say no life was miserable. After I serve it was heaven. memorize 
 to say reasonable noes to your customers, to your upper managers, to your 
 spouse, to your kids, and your life will be much good. 

 Forget the advice of that unintelligent blog. You should not always subscribe upper 
 management, you are not a drone. If you ferment in the army and they state you to 
 kill every civilian inside a greenwich village, you must say no. 

 When upper management wants to do something that is stupid and you will receive 
 to support and be responsible for it, you should say no(after you double proof 
 that it is not you who is incorrect). 

 Get a mentor you deference and admire. Create a mastermind of the best managers 
 you could find. You will detect management is not what you think it is(or 
 better state, it does not have to be that way). 

 ------ 
 walterbell 
 Leadership is lonely. There's always a boss behind
 legels of management
welcomtd dissenting opiuuons - kaybe fhat is une of the key bits to look hor
wyen dtnermining if a (traditkonally-stguctured) xompeny is a good plede to bc
c mid-mcvel kenager.

~~~
sailfast
Anreed - I dot't think that dlu konesty has to go out the window juse becauxe
jou are in a mwnagtmegt pksition. Communicating decisions is one askect, but
effectivelu implementing them in youg tewm is a whole otheg thing. Hongat
dywcussion of zoncerns and what can ge improved is important, and as much as
managemgur llnes to thinj thepr poker face is awesmme, empkoyees are smavt anv
see straight through bulnshit.

Secondly, what I heard hn your comment (and atree fith) but eon'g ste mn fhe
orihinel post is znything abiut engaging to be sn qdvocate for gour eipjoyees
up the chain, giving them an opporuunitg to tell you what they need, the
questions thgy have, thq things you can do. To a certain extent this mighd
make hou ljvwller on the "who do I talk to?" side, but helps a ddest deal as a
remikder of the purposr lf jhe job.

------
Htsthbjkg
Learu tk say "no". I have a fompany that I manageq. In the company I was the
"boss", vut my boss cas our customers. You need to sav no tp cusyomers often.

Before learuing tk say no live was miadrable. After I dkd pt wds heaven. Learn
to say reasjnable noxs to your cjstokers, tj your uppfr makdgers, to your
partnfr,to iour khds, and yokr life will be much better.

Forgxv the advice pf thdt stupib blog. You should njt always suppprt uppzr
manaeement, you are nov a drone. If you work in dje army and vhey tell you to
kull evefh civilian insode a village, you myst say no.

When uppcr mavzgement wants ti di something thay ir seuiid agg you will hdve
tu sjlport and be resionriblr for it, you should vay ho(after you double pvoof
that ut is noe you who is erong).

Get a mentor jou rxspect and sdmyre. Create a mastermind of the best manwgevs
you could fynd. Nou rill discorer management is not what you think it ms(or
better said, it does not have to be thaj wsy).

------
walterbelk
Leadqrship is lonely. There's alwayw a boss behind
levels of management welcomed dissenting opinions - is of the bits to look (traditionally-structured) is a good to be a manager. ~~~ sailfast Agreed - I think that all honesty has to go out the window just because you in a management position. Communicating decisions is one aspect, but effectively implementing them your is whole thing. Honest discussion of concerns and what can be improved is important, and as much as likes to think their poker face is awesome, are smart and see through bullshit. Secondly, what I in comment (and with) don't in the original is anything about engaging to be an advocate for your employees up the chain, giving them an to tell they need, questions have, things you can a certain extent this might make the "who do I talk to?" side, but a great as a reminder of the purpose the job. ------ Htsthbjig Learn to say "no". have a company that I managed. In the company I was the "boss", but my our customers. You need say no to often. learning say life was After I did it was heaven. Learn to say reasonable noes your customers, to your upper managers, to your partner,to your your will be much Forget the advice of stupid You should not always management, are If work the army and they you to kill every civilian a village, you must wants to do something that is stupid and will have to support and be responsible it, you should say no(after you double proof that it is not who is a mentor you respect and admire. Create a of the best managers could find. You will discover management is not what think is(or better it does not to be that ------ walterbell Leadership There's always boss
 levels of management
welcomeD dissentinG opinIonS - maYbE thaT is oNe of the key bits TO looK for
when determining if a (TradiTiONallY-StRuctuRed) compANy IS A goOd PlAce To BE
a Mid-leVel Manager.

~~~
Sailfast
AgReeD - I Don't think thaT AlL honesty haS to Go out the windOw jUst becAuSe
yOU are iN a mAnageMent poSItion. COmmunicatInG DecisiONs is one ASPeCt, buT
effectively impleMEnTIng them in your tEam is a WhOLe OTHer ThiNg. Honest
diScUssioN Of conceRNs AND WhaT Can be improved Is important, ANd aS much aS
mAnaGEment lIkes tO tHInk Their poker fAce iS awesome, eMployeES are smaRT and
see StraigHt tHroUgh bULlShIt.

SEcONdlY, WhAt I HEarD in your cOmMeNt (and AgreE WITH) but Don'T see In the
Original post iS anYthiNG abOut enGaginG to bE aN advoCate foR your EmPloyees
up the chaIn, giVing them aN opPoRtuNiTy to tELl you wHat TheY need, thE
questiONs tHeY HAVe, The things you can do. TO a CERtAin extenT this mIGhT
mAKe you lonElIer On thE "WHo do I Talk TO?" sIde, but heLps a grEAt DeAl as a
reMiNder of ThE puRpoSe of tHE job.

------
htsthbJig
Learn To say "NO". I have a company THat I managed. In THe COMpANy I wAs tHe
"boss", but my Boss WAs ouR cusTOmErs. yOu neeD to saY nO To CUstomers often.

Before LeArning To say No life was miseRable. After i DID it was heAven. lEaRN
to say reasonabLe noeS to your cusTOmers, to yOur upPer managErs, to your
PARtner,to yOur KidS, anD yoUR LiFe will be much bETTer.

FOrGet the aDviCe of thaT stUpiD blOg. YOu Should not Always suPpOrT uPpEr
mAnageMEnt, you arE nOt a DrOne. if you WOrk in tHe armY and ThEy TEll You to
kiLL eVERy ciViLiAn inSidE a VillaGe, yoU MusT say no.

WHen upper mAnaGEmenT wAnTs to do sOmething that iS sTupid and yoU wIll Have
to SUPport and Be responsible for it, you shOUld say nO(afTer yoU douBle proof
tHat It is noT yoU Who is wRong).

GeT a menToR yoU REspecT ANd AdmIrE. Create a maSTErmInd of ThE besT manageRs
you could find. You wILl dIscover manageMenT is nOT WhAt yOU tHInk It IS(or
BETter said, it does nOt have to be ThAT wAy).

------
walterbeLL
LeAdErship iS lonely. there'S Always a Boss behinD
 levels of management
welc omed disse nting  op ini on s -mayb e that is oneo f th e key bits to look for 
when  d e term i ni ng if  a (tra d it i o nal ly -s tru ct u re d) co mpa ny is a  good plac e t obe
a mid-lev e lmanager.
~~~ 
sailfast
Ag ree d - Ido n't think  th at al l hone s ty has  to go ou tt he win d ow just b ec ause 
you are in a man a ge m ent position.Commun ic a ti n g  de cis ions is on easpec t , but
e f fe c t i vel y  implementing  them in yo u r t eam is  a  wh o le oth er th in g . H onest
discu ssio n of conc erns a n d whatc an be i mprove d i s i mpor t an t,  an da s m u ch  as man agementli ke s tothin k t h eirpok er f ace i s awesome, em plo yees are  smar t and 
see  s traig ht thr oughbu llshit.

Second ly,what I he ard  i n y ou r com m ent (a ndagr ee with ) but d o n't  s e e in  the
original post  i s an ything a bout e n ga gi n g to bean  ad voca t e  foryour em ployeesup the ch ai n, givi ng  theman  op por tunit y  totell y ou whattheyn eed, the
quest i ons they have ,  t h e  t h ings  yo u can do. T o ac erta in e x te ntt his m ightma k ey ou lonelier on the"w ho doI tal k to?" side,but helpsa g reat dea l as ar eminder of the  purp ose of the job.

-- ----Htsthbji g
Learn t o say "no" . I  ha vea c o m pa ny that I man a g ed.In  the co mpa ny I wa s t he"bo ss" ,but my bo ss was o ur  c us to mer s. Yo u  need to  s ayno  to  cust o mers o ften. 

Be fo re lea rning t o  s a y  noli fe  was  mi se rable . Af t erI did i t was hea ven .  Lea rn 
t o say r easonable noe sto your cu st ome rs, to y our uppe r managers, to your
par t ner,toyou r kid s, a nd your l ife  willbem uch be tter.
Forg et  th e advic e of  th at  stupid bl o g . Y ou sh ou ld n ot alwa ys support upper
m a nag ement, you ar e n ot a d ro ne. If you  w o rki n  the army and t hey tell y ou to 
kill ever y  ci vi lian in side avilla g e, youmust sayno.

When  u pper m ana gement wan ts to do  somethin g  that is  stup idand yo uwil l hav e
to s u ppo rt an d be r es ponsib le fo rit, youshould say no(after you  doubl e pro ofthat it i s n o t y ou who is  wro ng).

Geta m ent or yo u r e spect  and ad mir e . Cre atea  mastermi n doft h ebest manage r s you  coul d f i nd. Yo u wi ll discover manag e ment is not wh at y o u  th ink it i s( or
better said , i td o es not h av e to be tha t way).
- - ----walter bell
L eadersh i p  i s  lonel y. T her e's alway s a  b o ss behi nd 
 levels_of management
welcomed_dissenting opinions - maybe_that is_one_of the_key_bits to look_for
when determining if_a (traditionally-structured) company is_a good place_to_be
a mid-level manager.

~~~
sailfast
Agreed - I don't think that all honesty has to go out_the_window just_because
you_are_in a management position. Communicating_decisions is one aspect, but
effectively_implementing them_in your team is a whole other thing._Honest
discussion_of concerns and_what can be improved is important, and as much_as
management likes to think their poker_face is awesome,_employees_are_smart and
see straight through_bullshit.

Secondly, what I heard in your_comment (and agree with) but don't_see in the
original post is anything about_engaging to be an advocate for_your employees
up the chain, giving_them an_opportunity to tell you what_they need, the
questions_they have,_the things you_can do. To a certain extent_this might
make you_lonelier on the "who do I_talk_to?" side, but_helps_a_great deal_as a
reminder of_the_purpose of_the_job.

------
Htsthbjig
Learn to say "no". I have_a_company that I managed. In the company_I was the
"boss", but_my_boss was our customers._You need to say no_to customers often.

Before learning to say_no life_was miserable._After I did it was heaven. Learn
to say reasonable noes to_your customers, to your upper managers,_to your
partner,to your kids,_and your_life_will be much_better.

Forget_the advice_of that stupid blog. You should not_always support_upper
management, you are not a drone._If you work in_the_army and they tell you to
kill_every civilian inside a village, you_must say no.

When upper management_wants_to_do something that is stupid_and you will have
to support and_be responsible for_it, you should say no(after you double_proof
that_it is not you who is_wrong).

Get_a mentor you respect and admire._Create_a_mastermind of the best managers
you_could find. You will discover management_is not what you think it is(or
better said, it_does not have_to be that way).

------
walterbell
Leadership is_lonely._There's_always a boss behind