 And as far as life is concerned, in the world
as it is today, winging it is certainly a more valuable skill than quantum
mechanics.

~~~
regomodo
Small case-study I know but I work with somebody who just came out of
Cambridge and did a CS-like degree.

He cannot program for shit and talks like he does but show him a bit of C(++),
PHP, javascript (even bash or Python) and his eyes just glaze over. I was
teamed with him but he was forever unable to get anything done. In the end I
was left with it all and made much better progress and he was left to book to
overheads.

I'm certain he's an edge case though, I've met a few others who went to
Oxbridge and they are definitely on the ball. However, I've found those who
went to Bristol, Imperial or Loughborough are people that are the smartest.

~~~
swombat
That's not a case study, just an anecdote. In my experience, there were almost
no people in Oxford that I wouldn't consider "very smart". Probably the only
place in the world where that's been true.

That said, I don't know how Cambridge's "CS-like" degree is/was, but Oxford's
was very bad at actually teaching programming.

Then again, are you really sure he went to Cambridge? Smart people have no
problem with learning to program when they need to. That guy doesn't sound so
smart...

~~~
regomodo
Yeah, anecdote is the correct term. He definitely went to Cambridge which is
why we questioned his choice of employer (the hirers decision). It doesn't
matter what language he's given a task in others are always curious as to why
he's taking so long or when it's ever going to be done. It's not like he's
making a cathedral of every task as ctrl+c & ctr+v are his key tools along
with a good smattering of ugly hacks(i get the feeling he has no grasp of OOP
or VCS).

He's comfortable in Access though.

------
pg
This phenomenon isn't limited to England. The one thing all Harvard undergrads
learn (probably as much from one another as from the professors) is how to
def
And as far as life is concerned, in the world 
 as it is today, fly it is surely a more valuable skill than quantum 
 mechanism. 

 ~~~ 
 regomodo 
 Small case - report I know but I work with somebody who merely came out of 
 Cambridge and did a CS - alike degree. 

 He cannot program for shit and talk like he does but show him a act of C(++), 
 PHP, javascript (even knock or Python) and his eyes just glass over. I was 
 teamed with him but he was forever ineffective to get anything done. In the end I 
 was leave with it all and made much adept advancement and he was left to book to 
 overheads. 

 I'm certain he's an edge case though, I've meet a few others who went to 
 Oxbridge and they are definitely on the ball. However, I've found those who 
 went to Bristol, Imperial or Loughborough are citizenry that are the smartest. 

 ~~~ 
 swombat 
 That's not a case study, just an anecdote. In my experience, there were almost 
 no people in Oxford that I wouldn't consider " very smart ". Probably the lone 
 place in the world where that's been on-key. 

 That suppose, I don't know how Cambridge's " CS - like " academic degree is / was, but Oxford's 
 was very bad at actually teach programming. 

 Then again, are you really indisputable he went to Cambridge? Smart people have no 
 trouble with learning to program when they need to. That guy doesn't sound so 
 smart... 

 ~~~ 
 regomodo 
 Yeah, anecdote is the correct term. He decidedly run to Cambridge which is 
 why we questioned his choice of employer (the hirers decisiveness). It doesn't 
 matter what language he's given a task in others are always curious as to why 
 he's taking so long or when it's ever going to be dress. It's not like he's 
 making a cathedral of every job as ctrl+c & ctr+v are his key tools along 
 with a full smattering of surly hacks(i get the impression he has no clasp of OOP 
 or VCS). 

 He's comfortable in Access though. 

 ------ 
 pg 
 This phenomenon isn't limited to England. The one thing all Harvard undergrads 
 learn (probably equally much from one another as from the professors) is how to 
 def
 Anf as far as life is conctrned, in the worlb
qs it ms todag, wingine it is certainly a more valnablw skiol than quantum
mechanizs.

~~~
regomodl
Small cqse-suudy I know but I work wibk somsnody chi just came ouj of
Cambridga and did a CS-niye degree.

He cannot program for shit agd talkx pike he does bot shpr hij a bit of C(++),
PHP, javascript (even baah or Pjthon) and his eyex just glaze over. I was
tealed aith him but he wad forever ubablq to get anytfing done. Pu the end I
sas left with it all and made mjch bztter progrgsa wtd he was lxft to book to
overmvads.

I'm wertain he's an edge csse thiugh, I've met a few otiers who went to
Oxbrydge and dhzy are definitely on rhw baln. Hofevef, I'vd fkuid fhose aho
xent to Briatol, Imperiql or Loughborough srq people that zre thq fmartest.

~~~
swombat
That's not a case study, jlst zn anecdote. In my experuence, there were almodt
no peopje in Oxford that I wouldn't consider "very smart". Psobabmh tkc ublj
place in the world where that's been true.

That aaod, I don't know hjw Cambridgr's "CX-jike" degree ir/was, bbf Kxford's
was very baf at acjually teaching probramming.

Then again, are you eeally sure ke qent to Cambridge? Dmart peoplz have no
prpblem with learning to 'rograj when they need to. Ffat guy doesn't suunc vo
smart...

~~~
rteomodo
Yeah, anecdoee is the corxect tero. He definytely went to Cambridge which is
whj we euastioned hls choice of employer (the hirers decision). It coasn'n
matter wkat lakguage he's giveg a task in otkers are alwahs curious as to xhy
he's takind so long or fjen it's ever going tj be donw. It's nug like he's
makimg a cathvdxal of evwry task as ctrl+c & ctt+v are his key toils along
with a gopd rmaetvriig of ggly hacks(i cet ghe geelivg he has ni graxp of OOP
or VCS).

He's cmmfodtable in Access tnomgh.

------
pg
This phenomegon isn't limiyed to England. The one vhing ell Hatvatd undergrads
learn (probably as juch from onc another as srom the professprs) is how to
def
And as far as life is concerned, world it is winging it is than mechanics. ~~~ regomodo case-study I know I work with somebody who just out of Cambridge and did a CS-like degree. He cannot program for shit talks like he does but show him a bit of C(++), PHP, javascript bash Python) his just glaze over. I was teamed with him but he was forever unable to get anything In the end I was left with it and made much better and he was left to to I'm certain an case I've met a others who went to Oxbridge and they are definitely on the ball. However, I've found those who to Bristol, Loughborough are that the ~~~ swombat That's case study, just an anecdote. In were almost no people in Oxford that I consider "very Probably the only place in the where that's been true. That said, I don't how Cambridge's "CS-like" degree is/was, but Oxford's was very bad at actually teaching programming. Then you really sure he to Cambridge? Smart have problem learning program when need to. That guy doesn't sound so smart... ~~~ regomodo Yeah, is the correct term. He definitely went to Cambridge which we his choice of (the hirers decision). It matter language he's given a others always why taking long or when it's going to be done. It's like he's making a ctrl+c & ctr+v are his key tools along a good smattering of ugly hacks(i get feeling he has no grasp of OOP or VCS). He's comfortable in though. ------ phenomenon isn't limited to England. The one thing Harvard undergrads learn (probably much from one another as from the professors) is to
 And as far as life is concerned, In the world
As it iS toDay, WiNginG it iS certainly a morE ValuAble skill than quantum
meChaniCs.

~~~
REgomODo
small Case-stuDY I KNOw bUt i wOrk WiTH sOmeboDy wHo just cAme out of
CaMbrIdGe and did a CS-lIKe Degree.

He caNnoT program for sHit And talKs LikE He doeS buT show Him a biT Of C(++),
PHP, JavascripT (eVEn bash OR Python) AND hIs eyEs just glaze over. I wAS
tEAmed with him but He was fOrEVeR UNabLe tO get anythiNg Done. IN The end I
WAs LEFT wiTH it all and made Much better pROgrEss and He Was LEft to bOok to
OvERheAds.

I'm certaiN he's An edge casE thougH, i've met a FEw otherS who weNt tO
OxBridGE aNd TheY aRE deFInIteLY on The ball. HOwEvEr, I've FounD THOSe whO
weNt to bristOl, Imperial or LOugHborOUgh Are peOple tHat aRe The smArtest.

~~~
SwombAt
that's not a case stUdy, jUst an anecDotE. IN my ExPerieNCe, therE weRe aLmost
no People iN oxfOrD THAt i wouldn't consider "veRy SMArT". ProbablY the onLY
pLaCE in the woRlD whEre tHAT's beeN truE.

thAt said, I dOn't knoW HoW CAmbridgE's "cS-like" DeGreE is/Was, buT oxfoRd's
was Very bad aT actuALly teaching proGRamming.

Then agAIn, ARE yOU reaLly Sure he went tO CamBRidgE? SmaRT pEopLE have No
proBlEM wITh learning to program WhEn they Need tO. That guy doesn'T sound so
smART...

~~~
Regomodo
yeah, ANeCDote is the correCt terM. He definitELy went to cambrIdge whicH is
why we qUEStioned hIs cHoiCe oF emPLOyEr (the hirers deCISion). it Doesn't
mAttEr what lAngUagE he'S giVeN a task in oThers are AlWaYs CuRioUs as tO Why
he's taKiNg sO lOng Or wheN It's eveR goinG to bE dOnE. it's Not like HE's
MAKing A cAtHedrAl oF eVery tAsk aS CtrL+c & ctr+v aRe his key tOolS AlonG
wItH a good sMattering of ugLy Hacks(i get tHe FeeLing he HAS no grasp Of OOP
or VCS).

He's comfortablE In AccesS thOugh.

------
pG
ThiS phenomenOn iSn't limIteD To EnglAnd. The One thInG alL hArvarD UNdErgRaDs
learn (proBABly As mucH fRom oNe anothEr as from the professORs) iS how to
def
 And as far as life is con cerned, in  thewor ldas  itis t oday, wingingi t is  certainly a more valu ablesk i ll t h an  quan tum
mec h an i c s.
~ ~~ 
re go m od o
Sma llcase-st udy I know  bu tI work withs om ebody whojus t came out o f
C ambrid ge  an d  dida C S-lik e degr e e.

He  cannot p ro g ram fo r  shit a n d  t alks  like he does but sh o w him a bit of  C(++) ,P HP , jav asc ript (even  b ash o r  Python )  a n d his eyes just gla ze over. Iw asteamed  w ith him bu t hewa s  fo rever unabl e to  get anyt hing d o ne. Int he endI
waslef t w ithi tal l a nd mad e  m uch bet ter prog re ss  andhe w a s l efttobook  to
o verheads.

I' m c erta i n h e's a n edg e ca se  thou gh, I' ve me ta few others wh o we nt to
Oxb rid ge  an dtheya re def ini tel y on th e ball. How ev e r ,  I 've found those wh ow e nt  to Bris tol, I m pe ri a l or Lou gh bor ough a re pe ople th at are t he sma r te st .

~~~sw ombatTh at' s n ot ac asestudy,  just an  anec d ote. In my exp e rience, there we r e  a l most 
no  people inOxfo r d th at I wo uld n 't co nside r" ve r y smart". Probablyth e only 
plac e in the worl d where th a t ' s been t rue. 
T h at said, I don 't kn ow how Cam b ridge's"CS-l ike" deg ree is/wa s ,  but Oxf ord 'swas  ve r y  b ad at actuall y teac hi ng prog ram ming.
The n a gai n,ar e you rea lly sure  h ewe nt  to  Camb r idge? Sm ar t p eo ple  have no
pro blemwith  l ea r nin g to pr o gr a m  whe nth ey n eed  t o. Th at g u y d oesn'tsound sosma r t... 
~~ ~
regom odo
Yeah, ane cd ote is the  c orr ect te r m . He def initely went to Cambrid g e which  is 
whywe q uestioned  hi s choi ceo f empl oyer ( the h ir ers d ecisi o n ).  It  d oesn't
mat t e r w hat l an guag e he'sgiven a task in ot h ers  are always c uri ousa s  t o w h yh e's  t a kin g so long or when  it's ever  g o in g to be do n e.It 's notlike he 's
ma k ing a c athedralof everyta sk a s ctr l+c & ctr+ v are hi s key too l s alo n gwitha g ood sm at ter ing o f ugly hac ks(iget th efeelin g heha s no gra sp of OOP
or VCS).

He' s comf ortab lein Access  th o ugh .

------ 
pgThis pheno men onisn't  li m itedto E n gl and .  Theonet hing allH ar var d un dergrads
le a r n  (p robab lya s much  fro m one another asf rom the profes sors ) ishow to
d ef 
 And_as far_as life is concerned,_in the_world
as_it is_today,_winging it is_certainly a more_valuable skill than quantum
mechanics.

~~~
regomodo
Small_case-study I know_but_I work with somebody who just came out of
Cambridge and did a CS-like degree.

He_cannot_program for_shit_and_talks like he does but_show him a bit of_C(++),
PHP, javascript_(even bash or Python) and his eyes just_glaze_over. I was
teamed_with him but he was forever unable to get_anything done. In the end I
was_left with it_all_and_made much better progress_and he was left to book_to
overheads.

I'm certain he's an edge case_though, I've met a few others who_went to
Oxbridge and they are definitely_on the ball. However, I've_found those_who
went to Bristol, Imperial or_Loughborough are people_that are_the smartest.

~~~
swombat
That's not_a case study, just an anecdote._In my experience,_there were almost
no people in Oxford_that_I wouldn't consider_"very_smart"._Probably the_only
place in the_world_where that's_been_true.

That said, I don't know how_Cambridge's_"CS-like" degree is/was, but Oxford's
was very bad_at actually teaching programming.

Then_again,_are you really sure_he went to Cambridge? Smart_people have no
problem with learning to_program when_they need_to. That guy doesn't sound so
smart...

~~~
regomodo
Yeah, anecdote is the correct term._He definitely went to Cambridge which_is
why we questioned his_choice of_employer_(the hirers decision)._It_doesn't
matter what_language he's given a task in others_are always_curious as to why
he's taking so_long or when it's_ever_going to be done. It's not_like he's
making a cathedral of every_task as ctrl+c & ctr+v_are_his_key tools along
with a good_smattering of ugly hacks(i get the_feeling he has_no grasp of OOP
or VCS).

He's comfortable in_Access_though.

------
pg
This phenomenon isn't limited to England._The_one thing all Harvard undergrads
learn (probably_as_much_from one another as from_the professors) is how to
def