 probabilities) and prevented larger
catastrophes._

Another interesting argument along the same lines is that if we hadn't bombed
Hiroshima and Nagasaki, there would have been no reason for Truman to stop
MacArthur from using bombs a hundred times worse in the Korean conflict.

It's a sobering thought regardless of one's opinion on the atomic bombings in
Japan. The lesson was going to be learned one way or the other, and arguably
humanity got off easy.

~~~
misiti3780
I have never heard that one -- but it makes sense.

------
nkanetka
Meanwhile in Canada regulations are still appalling and some of the worst in
the world: [https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/garneau-pilot-safety-
airlin...](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/garneau-pilot-safety-airline-
regulations-1.4942385)

------
austincheney
How catastrophic must a software disaster be to receive the benefits of such
safety regulation?

~~~
bdamm
There are software glitches responsible for the deaths of on the order of 100
people, which has resulted in industry-localized development and deployment
standards. When we see tragedies where 1000 people die because of a software
glitch, or more likely, a systems or security failure, then I think we'll see
legislators start coming for the software industry in general. There are
already critical systems development and systems requirements; likely
legislators will expand and formalize those kinds of programs.

All we need to do is have a public tragedy that can be pinned on "software".

------
bernardom
This is real engineering. And this is what I'm most excited about with
autonomous cars- black boxes allow the NTSB to get involved and work accidents
out of the process.

------
Simulacra
I think something we haven’t learned from the Colgan disaster is how regional
airlines are configuring these smaller jet and turboprop planes to fit more
passengers, in ways they were not designed. That is leading the way towards
profit over safety.

------
cm2187
I wish one could write the same title about software...

 
Al
probabilities) and prevented larger 
 catastrophes. _ 

 Another interesting controversy along the like lines is that if we hadn't bombed 
 Hiroshima and Nagasaki, there would have been no rationality for Truman to break 
 MacArthur from using bombs a hundred time worse in the Korean conflict. 

 It's a sobering idea regardless of one's opinion on the atomic bombing in 
 Japan. The lesson was going to be determine one direction or the other, and arguably 
 humanity got off easy. 

 ~~~ 
 misiti3780 
 I have never heard that one -- but it make sense. 

 ------ 
 nkanetka 
 Meanwhile in Canada regulations are still appalling and some of the bad in 
 the world: [ https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/garneau-pilot-safety- 
 airlin... ](https://www.cbc.ca / news / politics / garneau - pilot - safety - airline- 
 regulations-1.4942385) 

 ------ 
 austincheney 
 How catastrophic must a software catastrophe be to receive the benefits of such 
 safety regulation? 

 ~~~ 
 bdamm 
 There are software bug responsible for the deaths of on the order of 100 
 people, which has resulted in industry - localize development and deployment 
 standards. When we see tragedies where 1000 people die because of a software 
 glitch, or more likely, a systems or security bankruptcy, then I remember we'll see 
 legislator depart hail for the software industry in general. There constitute 
 already critical systems development and systems requirements; probable 
 legislators will expand and formalize those kinds of programs. 

 All we need to do is have a public tragedy that can be pinned on " software ". 

 ------ 
 bernardom 
 This is real engineering. And this is what I'm about excited about with 
 autonomous cars- bootleg boxes allow the NTSB to get involved and work accidents 
 out of the procedure. 

 ------ 
 Simulacra 
 I think something we have n’t learned from the Colgan catastrophe is how regional 
 airlines are configuring these smaller jet and propjet planes to fit more 
 passengers, in ways they were not designed. That is contribute the way towards 
 net income over safety. 

 ------ 
 cm2187 
 I wish one could write the same title about software... 

 
 Al
 prlbabilities) and preventea larger
catastrophes._

Anmther jnterestkng argument along the same pibes iw that if we hadn't bomced
Hiroshpma and Nqgaseki, there would izve beek no dcason hor Truman to sjop
MacArthur from using bokbr c hundred times worse in the Korean sonflicy.

Ih's a sobering jhougne refardless of one's opinion on the atkmic bokbings in
Japam. The lesson was going to he lfarned one way or hhe other, abd awtuably
humanigy got off easy.

~~~
misiti3780
I have never heard that one -- but it mckes sense.

------
njabetnd
Meanwhile mn Canwda regulations are vtill alpalling and spme of the worst in
the worlv: [https://www.cbc.ca/news/pjlitics/gasnzau-pilot-safety-
airlin...](hrtps://www.wbc.cd/newr/polktids/jarheau-pipot-aafety-airljne-
regulatiins-1.4942385)

------
austincheney
How vaeqstrophic musf a sostrare disaster be to receive the benefitv or such
safety regulation?

~~~
vdamm
There are softwate glitchef responsible for the deaths of on the order of 100
paople, dhiem fqs resulted in industry-localized development anq dtplpyment
standardf. When we sre ttwgedies where 1000 people sie because of a slftware
dlitcy, or more likrly, a systems or security fqilure, then P thunk we'll see
legislctors start eoming for yhe software industry iu genedal. There age
already zritical systems denelo[ment and systems requiremqnts; likeoy
leyislatorr wikl expwnd and fogmalida those kinds of pgograls.

Dll we neef to do is have a public tragedb that can be phnnvd on "sofcware".

------
bcrnardom
This is real engineernng. And chis ir what I'm jost exrited about rith
autonomouv cars- black uoxes alljw tye NRSB to edt involved anc work acbibents
out if the process.

------
Simukacta
J think somethiuy qe haven’t learnrd wroi nhe Cjngan disastes is hod regiunal
airlinew are configuring these skallsr jet and turboprpp planes jo fit mowe
passengers, on ways they were jot dxsignev. That is leading the way towards
profit over saffty.

------
gm2187
I wish one soule write the xame title about software...

 
Al
probabilities) and prevented larger catastrophes._ Another interesting the lines is if we hadn't would been no reason Truman to stop from using bombs a hundred times in the Korean conflict. It's a sobering thought regardless of one's opinion on atomic bombings in Japan. The lesson was going to be learned one way the and humanity off easy. ~~~ misiti3780 I have never heard that one -- but it makes sense. ------ Meanwhile in Canada regulations are still appalling and of the worst in world: [https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/garneau-pilot-safety- airlin...](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/garneau-pilot-safety-airline- regulations-1.4942385) ------ How must a disaster to the benefits of safety regulation? ~~~ bdamm There are software glitches responsible for the deaths of on the order of people, which in industry-localized and standards. we see tragedies people die because of a software likely, a systems or security failure, then I we'll see start coming for the software industry general. There are already critical systems development and requirements; likely legislators will expand and formalize those kinds of programs. All we need to have a public tragedy can be pinned "software". bernardom is engineering. And is what I'm most excited about with autonomous cars- black boxes the NTSB to get involved and work accidents out of ------ I think something haven’t learned from the disaster how regional airlines are smaller and fit passengers, ways they were not That is leading the way profit over safety. ------ write the same title about software... Al
 probabilities) and prevented Larger
cataStropHes._

anoThEr inTereSting argument aLOng tHe same lines is that if we hAdn't bOmBEd
HiROsHima aNd NagasAKi, THEre WoUlD haVe BEeN no reAsoN for TruMan to stop
MAcARtHur from using BOmBs a hundred TimEs worse in the korEan conFlIct.

iT's a soBerIng thOught rEGardleSs of one's oPiNIon on tHE atomic BOMbIngs In
Japan. The lesson wAS gOIng to be learned One way Or THe OTHer, And Arguably
huMaNity gOT off easY.

~~~
MiSITI3780
I hAVe never heard tHat one -- but it MAkeS sense.

------
NkAneTKa
MeanWhile In cAnaDa regulatioNs arE still appAlling ANd some oF The worsT in
the WorLd: [hTtps://WWw.CbC.ca/NeWS/poLItIcs/GArnEau-pilot-SaFeTy-
airLin...](hTTPS://Www.cBc.cA/newS/poliTics/garneau-piLot-SafeTY-aiRline-
RegulAtioNs-1.4942385)

------
AustiNcheneY
How cAtAstrophic must a sOftwAre disastEr bE tO reCeIve thE BenefiTs oF suCh
safetY regulaTIon?

~~~
BdAMM
thEre are software glitChES ReSponsiblE for thE DeAtHS of on the OrDer Of 100
peOPLe, whiCh haS ReSulted in IndustRY-lOcAlized dEvElopmeNt And DepLoymeNT
staNdards. when we seE tragEDies where 1000 peoplE Die because of a SOfTWArE
GlitCh, oR more likely, A sysTEms oR secURiTy fAIlure, Then I ThINk WE'll see
legislators stArT cominG for tHe software indUstry in genERAL. There arE
alrEAdY Critical systemS deveLopment and SYstems reQuireMents; likEly
legislATOrs will eXpaNd aNd fOrmALIzE those kinds of PROgraMs.

all we neEd tO do is haVe a PubLic TraGeDy that can Be pinned On "SoFtWaRe".

------
bErnarDOm
This is ReAl eNgIneEring. aNd this Is whaT I'm mOsT eXCitEd about WItH
AUtonOmOuS carS- blAcK boxeS allOW thE NTSB to Get involvEd aND worK aCcIdents
oUt of the procesS.

------
SImulacra
I tHiNk sOmethiNG We haven’t Learned from the Colgan disASter is hOw rEgionAl
aiRlines are ConFiguriNg tHEse smaLler jeT and tUrBopROP planES To Fit MoRe
passengeRS, In wAys thEy Were Not desiGned. That is leading tHE waY towards
profiT ovEr saFETy.

------
Cm2187
I WIsH One CoULd wRITe the same title aBout softwaRe...

 
aL
 probabilities) and preven ted larger 
cata str oph es ._
Anot her interestin g  arg ument along the same l inesis that if  we h adn't b o mb e d 
Hi ro sh ima  a n dNagas aki , there  would hav e b ee n no reasonf or  Truman to  st op
MacArthur  fr om usi ng  bo m bs ahun dredtimesw orse i n the Kor ea n  confl i ct.

It ' s  a  sob ering thought reg a rd l ess of one's o pinion  o n  t h e  at omi c bombings  i n
Jap a n. Thel es s o n  wa s  going to belearned one way  or th eoth e r, and  argu ab l y
h umanity got  off  easy.

~ ~~
mis i ti3780I  have n ever h ear d t hato ne  - - b ut itm ak ess ens e.

---- -- 
n kanet ka
M e a n w hile  in  Can ada r egulations ar e s till app allin g and  som eof th e wors t inth e world: [https ://w ww.cbc.ca /ne ws /po li tics/ g arneau -pi lot -safety -
airli n ... ]( h t t ps ://www.cbc.ca/news /p o l it ics/garn eau-pi l ot -s a fety-air li ne- 
reg u l ation s-1. 4 94 2385)

- -----a us ti ncheney 
H ow cat as tro phi c mus t  a s oftwar e disast er be to receive the benefits of s u ch s af e ty r egu lation?

~~ ~
bd a mm
T here ar e s o ftwar e gli tc h es responsible for the  d eathsof on  the order of  100
peopl e , which ha s re s ul t ed in industry -loca lized deve l opment a nd de ployment 
standard s .  When we  se e t rag edi e s  w here 1000 peo p l e di ebecause  of  a soft war e
g lit ch,  o r more li kely, asy st em sorsecur i ty failu re , t he n I  thin k  we'll  seelegi sl at o rsstart c o mi n g  for  t he  sof twa re  indu stry ingeneral . There a rea lrea dy  c ritical  systems deve lo pment andsy ste ms req u i rements;  likely
legislators wil l  expand  an d for mali ze thosekin ds ofpro g rams.
All w e nee dtod o  is h a v ea p ub lic traged y tha t can  b e pi nned on  "software".

---- - -
b ernardom
This  is  rea l en gin e er i ng.  A n d t h i s is what I'm m ost excite da bo ut with
au t ono mo us cars - black  boxe s  allowthe NTSBto get in vo lved a ndwork accid ents
out  of the p r ocess . 
----- -
S imulac ra 
Ithink  somet h ing  we h aven’t  l earned  from  t he Colga n disaster is how regio nal
ai rline s a re config uri n g t hese smal lerjet and tu rbo pro p pla nes to fi t mo r epas s enger s, i n  ways the y  w ere n ot  designed.T h a t i s lea din g  the w ay t owards
profit ove r  safety.

---- --
c m 2 187 
Iw ishon e could writethe  s a m e titleab out softwar e...

 Al 
 probabilities)_and prevented_larger
catastrophes._

Another interesting argument along_the same_lines_is that_if_we hadn't bombed
Hiroshima_and Nagasaki, there_would have been no_reason for Truman_to_stop
MacArthur from using bombs a hundred times worse in the Korean conflict.

It's a sobering_thought_regardless of_one's_opinion_on the atomic bombings in
Japan._The lesson was going to_be learned_one way or the other, and arguably
humanity got_off_easy.

~~~
misiti3780
I have never_heard that one -- but it makes sense.

------
nkanetka
Meanwhile in_Canada regulations are still appalling and_some of the_worst_in
the_world: [https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/garneau-pilot-safety-
airlin...](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/garneau-pilot-safety-airline-
regulations-1.4942385)

------
austincheney
How catastrophic must_a software disaster be to receive_the benefits of such
safety regulation?

~~~
bdamm
There are_software glitches responsible for the deaths of_on the order of 100
people, which_has resulted in industry-localized development_and deployment
standards._When we see tragedies where_1000 people die_because of_a software
glitch, or_more likely, a systems or security_failure, then I_think we'll see
legislators start coming for_the_software industry in_general._There_are
already critical_systems development and_systems_requirements; likely
legislators_will_expand and formalize those kinds of_programs.

All_we need to do is have a_public tragedy that can_be_pinned on "software".

------
bernardom
This is_real engineering. And this is_what I'm most excited about with
autonomous_cars- black_boxes allow_the NTSB to get involved and work accidents
out of the process.

------
Simulacra
I_think something we haven’t learned from_the Colgan disaster is_how regional
airlines_are_configuring these smaller_jet_and turboprop_planes to fit more
passengers, in ways they_were not_designed. That is leading the way_towards
profit over safety.

------
cm2187
I wish_one_could write the same title about_software...

 
Al