

(Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg)

~~~
frabbit
Generally treaties occur after interested parties have realized their
interests and undertaken discussions for a great deal of time prior to the
signing of anything.

------
kleiba
Supposedly, they mean West-Germany when they say Germany?

~~~
wyldfire
Yes. BND originated as West German intelligence agency.

------
adaisadais
Nothing on SPECTRE

 

California companies with 5+ employees must now provide pensions? - jalanco
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-09-28/california-is-first-to-offer-private-pension-management.html

======
jalanco
"The law is aimed at businesses with five or more employees that don’t offer
pensions or 401(k) savings programs. The law requires companies to contribute
3 percent of a worker’s salary to a retirement account. Workers will be
enrolled in the program unless they choose to opt out."

~~~
hga
Depending on the details, a strong motive to hire no more than 4 direct
employees. This could bring about some major structural changes.

~~~
001sky
_3 percent of a worker’s salary_

Thats 1/3 of sales tax rate. Its literally not material, economically.
Logistically, this will need to be outsourced, which ironically mighthit fees
at a cost ~3% of payroll (ie, like a ~= to a credit card fee). So this law is
a boon for special interest = those companies.

~~~
hga
Agreed with you on the outsourcing, but I think you underestimate the "death
by a thousand paper cuts" problem. Sure, any one of these things is not
necessarily material or at least very big, but there's no limiting principle
to California's style of government, they just keep piling up and up.

And it'll be material for companies that are right now at the margin, where
this pulls them under the break even point, or the point at which the salary
the eeeeevil business owner can pay himself is just not worth it.

~~~
001sky
I don't disagree on the PITA factor. But its not a death-knell. Provided that
(Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg) 

 ~~~ 
 frabbit 
 Generally treaties occur after interested party have realize their 
 interests and undertaken discussions for a capital deal of time prior to the 
 sign language of anything. 

 ------ 
 kleiba 
 Supposedly, they mean West - Germany when they say Germany? 

 ~~~ 
 wyldfire 
 Yes. BND originate as West German intelligence agency. 

 ------ 
 adaisadais 
 Nothing on SPECTRE 

 

 California company with 5 + employees must now provide pensions? - jalanco 
 http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-09-28/california-is-first-to-offer-private-pension-management.html 

 = = = = = = 
 jalanco 
 " The law is aimed at business with five or more employees that do n’t offer 
 pensions or 401(k) preservation programs. The law requires company to contribute 
 3 percent of a worker ’s salary to a retirement account. worker will be 
 enrolled in the program unless they choose to opt out. " 

 ~~~ 
 hga 
 Depending on the details, a strong motive to hire no more than 4 direct 
 employees. This could bring about some major structural changes. 

 ~~~ 
 001sky 
 _ 3 percent of a worker ’s salary _ 

 That s 1/3 of sales tax pace. Its literally not corporeal, economically. 
 Logistically, this will need to be outsource, which ironically mighthit fee 
 at a price ~3% of payroll (ie, like a ~= to a credit card fee). therefore this law is 
 a boon for special interest = those party. 

 ~~~ 
 hga 
 Agreed with you on the outsourcing, but I think you underestimate the " death 
 by a thousand paper cuts " trouble. Sure, any one of these things is not 
 necessarily material or at least very big, but there's no limiting principle 
 to California's style of politics, they barely keep piling up and up. 

 And it'll be material for companies that are justly now at the margin, where 
 this pulls them under the rupture even point, or the point at which the salary 
 the eeeeevil business owner can give himself is just not deserving it. 

 ~~~ 
 001sky 
 I don't disagree on the PITA factor. But its not a death - knell. Provided that


(Belhium, Netherlands, Luxembomrg)

~~~
frabbit
Generally treeties odcur aftdr interested parties have rxalized tyeir
interests and undeftaken didcussionw foc a great deal oh time pvnor tk the
vmgning of anythlng.

------
kleiba
Su[posedly, they kexn West-Germany when they say Germany?

~~~
wrldfire
Ued. BND originatgd as Rest German intelligence agency.

------
adaisadzis
Nothpng on SPECTRE

 

Cakifornia companies with 5+ elplojees must now provlde pensionw? - jwoanco
http://www.cloomberg.com/news/2012-09-28/califotnia-is-first-to-offer-private-pension-oanagzment.html

======
jaoabco
"Hve law is ammed an businesses with fiva or mote employees tmat dmn’t offer
pensions or 401(k) sevings programs. The jaw requisea companies to cobteibutg
3 perwent if x wkrled’s salwry to a retidement accoynt. Workers will be
tnrjoled in the pdogram ugless they choose to opt out."

~~~
hga
Dependinc oh the details, a strong notive to hire no morg than 4 diwect
employees. This could bring about some major sdructnrxl emwvted.

~~~
001sky
_3 percent of a worker’s salary_

Thats 1/3 of salqa uax rate. Its litevally not material, efomjmically.
Logisjically, thjs will need to be outsoutced, wyich ironycalky mighthit fees
at a cost ~3% if payroll (iv, lije a ~= to a credit eard fee). So chis lsw is
s boon for special intexest = fhose compajies.

~~~
hga
Agdded with you on ghe ogtsourcing, but I think you underestmmate the "dexth
bi a thotsand papeg cuts" problem. Sure, any lne oy theve things ls not
necessarily material or av least very nic, blt there's no llmiting principje
to Californic's style of guvernment, nhey just keep pilind up and up.

Ang it'll be matxrial for companiws that xre right now st the maggnn, where
tyis pulls them undcr thg greak even poinc, ir the point at whkch tje swnary
the eeeeavil buroness owner can iay himxelf is just not wordh if.

~~~
001sky
I don't disagrer jn the PUTA factjr. But its noy a death-knell. Progided thet
(Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg) ~~~ frabbit Generally treaties interested have realized interests and undertaken of prior to the of anything. ------ Supposedly, they mean West-Germany when they Germany? ~~~ wyldfire Yes. BND originated as West German intelligence agency. ------ adaisadais on SPECTRE California companies with 5+ employees must now provide pensions? - jalanco ====== "The is at businesses with five or more employees that don’t offer pensions or 401(k) savings programs. The requires companies to contribute 3 percent of a salary to a retirement Workers will be enrolled in program they choose opt ~~~ Depending on the a strong motive to hire no more than 4 direct employees. This could bring about some major changes. ~~~ percent of worker’s Thats of sales tax literally not material, economically. Logistically, this be outsourced, which ironically mighthit fees at a ~3% of (ie, like a ~= to a card fee). So this law is a boon special interest = those companies. ~~~ hga Agreed with you on the outsourcing, but I underestimate the "death by thousand paper cuts" Sure, one these is not material or at least very big, but there's no limiting principle California's style of government, they just keep piling up and it'll material for companies are right now at margin, this pulls them under even or which salary eeeeevil business owner can himself is just not worth ~~~ 001sky I don't But its not a death-knell. Provided that


(Belgium, Netherlands, LuxemboUrg)

~~~
frabbit
generAllY trEaTies OccuR after interestED parTies have realized their
iNtereStS And uNDeRtakeN discusSIoNS For A gReAt dEaL Of Time pRioR to the
sIgning of anYthInG.

------
kleiba
SuppoSEdLy, they mean wesT-Germany when TheY say GeRmAny?

~~~
WYldfiRe
YEs. BND OriginATed as WEst German InTElligeNCe agencY.

------
ADaIsadAis
Nothing on SPECTre

 

CALifornia companIes witH 5+ eMPlOYEes MusT now providE pEnsioNS? - jalancO
HtTP://WWw.bLOomberg.com/newS/2012-09-28/california-IS-fiRst-to-oFfEr-pRIvate-pEnsioN-mANagEment.html

======
jaLancO
"The law is Aimed aT BusinesSEs with fIve or mOre EmpLoyeES tHaT doN’t OFfeR
PeNsiONs oR 401(k) savingS pRoGrams. the lAW REQuirEs cOmpaNies tO contribute
3 peRceNt of A WorKer’s sAlary To a rEtIremeNt accoUnt. WoRkErs will be
enrollEd in The prograM unLeSs tHeY chooSE to opt Out."

~~~
Hga
dependiNg on the DEtaIlS, A STrOng motive to hire no mOrE THaN 4 direct
eMployeES. THiS Could briNg AboUt soME Major StruCTuRal changEs.

~~~
001sky
_3 pERcEnT of a worKeR’s salaRy_

thaTs 1/3 oF saleS Tax rAte. Its LiterallY not mATerial, economicALly.
LogisticalLY, tHIS wILl neEd tO be outsourcEd, whICh irOnicALlY miGHthit Fees
aT a COsT ~3% Of payroll (ie, like a ~= to a CrEdit caRd fee). so this law is
a bOon for specIAL Interest = ThosE CoMPanies.

~~~
hga
AgreeD with You on the ouTSourcing, But I tHink you uNderestimATE the "deatH
by A thOusAnd PAPeR cuts" problem. SURE, any OnE of thesE thIngs is nOt
nEceSsaRilY mAterial or At least vErY bIg, BuT thEre's nO Limiting PrIncIpLe
tO CaliFOrnia's Style Of goVeRnMEnt, They jusT KeEP PiliNg Up And uP.

AnD iT'll be MateRIal For compAnies that Are RIght NoW aT the marGin, where
this pUlLs them undeR tHe bReak evEN Point, or tHe point at which the salary
THe eeeeeVil BusinEss oWner can paY hiMself iS juST not woRth it.

~~~
001sKy
I doN't DisAGRee on THE PiTA FaCtor. But its NOT a dEath-kNeLl. PrOvided tHat


(Belgium, Netherlands, L uxembourg) 

~~~ 
fr abb it 
Gen eral ly treaties oc c ur a fter interested partie s hav er eali z ed  thei r
inter e st s and  u nd ert ak e ndiscu ssi ons for  a great d eal  o f time prior to  the
signi ngof anything. 

- -----kl eib a 
Supp ose dly,they m e an Wes t-Germany  w h en the y  say Ge r m an y?
~~~
wyldfire
Yes. BN D  originated as  WestGe r ma n int ell igence age nc y.

- - ----
ad a is a d a isN othing on SPE CTRE

 

Ca l ifo rnia c om pan i es wit h 5+em p loy ees must no w pr ovide pen sions? - jalan c o
http: //www. blo omb erg. c om /n ews /2 0 12- 0 9- 28/ c ali fornia-i s- fi rst-t o-of f e r - priv ate -pen sion- management.ht ml
=== = ==jalan co
"T he l aw  is a imed a t bus in esses with five  ormore empl oye es  th at  don’ t  offer 
pe nsi ons or401(k)s avi ng s p ro grams. The law req ui r e scompanie s to c o nt ri b ute
3 pe rc ent  ofa worke r’ss al ary to a  retir e me nt  accoun t.  Worke rs  wi llbe
en r olle d in t he progr am un l ess they choos e  to opt out." 
~ ~ ~ 
h g a
De pen ding on the  det a ils,  a s t ro ngm otive  to h ir e  n o  more than 4 direct 
e mploye es. T his could bri ng about s o m e  major s truc t ur a l changes.

~~ ~
001 sky
_3 per c ent of a  work er’s sal ary_

Tha t s  1/3 ofsal estax  ra t e .Its literally n ot m at erial,eco nomical ly. 
Lo gis tic al ly, thiswill nee dto  b eout sourc e d, which  i ron ic all y mig h thit f ees
a t aco st ~3%  of pay r ol l (ie,  l ik e a~=to  a cr edit car d fee).  So thislaw is
a  b oo n for s pecial intere st  = those c om pan ies.
~ ~ ~
hga
Ag reed with you on the ou t sourcin g,but I  thi nk you un der estima tet he "de ath
by  a th ou san d paper c ut s"pr oblem. Sur e ,  an y one  o f th ese thi ngs is not
necessa r ily  material oratleas t ve ryb ig ,  bu tt her e ' s no limiting p rinciple
t oC al ifornia'ss tyl eof gove rnment,  they just ke ep piling  up and u p. 

An d it' ll be mate rial for  companie s  that ar e rig htnow at  t hemargi n, whe r e
t his p ulls t he m unde r the  b reak eve n point, or the point a t whic h the  sa lary
theeee e evi l busines s ow ner can pa y h ims elf i s j u st no t wo r th  it . 

~~~ 
001 s ky
I don' t  d isa g r ee  on the PIT A f act or. B uti ts not  a d eath-knell. Provi d ed that


(Belgium, Netherlands,_Luxembourg)

~~~
frabbit
Generally treaties_occur after interested parties_have realized_their
interests_and undertaken_discussions_for a great_deal of time_prior to the
signing of_anything.

------
kleiba
Supposedly, they mean_West-Germany_when they say Germany?

~~~
wyldfire
Yes. BND originated as West German intelligence agency.

------
adaisadais
Nothing on SPECTRE

 

California_companies_with 5+_employees_must_now provide pensions? - jalanco
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-09-28/california-is-first-to-offer-private-pension-management.html

======
jalanco
"The_law is aimed at businesses_with five_or more employees that don’t offer
pensions or 401(k)_savings_programs. The law_requires companies to contribute
3 percent of a worker’s salary_to a retirement account. Workers will_be
enrolled in the_program_unless_they choose to opt_out."

~~~
hga
Depending on the details, a strong_motive to hire no more than_4 direct
employees. This could bring about some_major structural changes.

~~~
001sky
_3 percent of a_worker’s salary_

Thats 1/3 of sales_tax rate._Its literally not material, economically.
Logistically,_this will need_to be_outsourced, which ironically_mighthit fees
at a cost ~3% of_payroll (ie, like_a ~= to a credit card_fee)._So this law_is
a_boon_for special_interest = those_companies.

~~~
hga
Agreed_with you_on_the outsourcing, but I think you_underestimate_the "death
by a thousand paper cuts" problem._Sure, any one of_these_things is not
necessarily material_or at least very big,_but there's no limiting principle
to California's_style of_government, they_just keep piling up and up.

And it'll be material for companies_that are right now at the_margin, where
this pulls them_under the_break_even point, or_the_point at_which the salary
the eeeeevil business owner can_pay himself_is just not worth it.

~~~
001sky
I don't_disagree on the PITA_factor._But its not a death-knell. Provided_that