, and makes Uruguay non-competitive.

Edit: you're from Argentina, that's obviously not news for you :)

------
exabrial
Sorry, but Eric Brewer is wrong. He seems to be implying that there was some
sort of intelligent design behind the software at banks that lead them to
choose BASE. This couldn't be further from the truth.

Banks are one software kludge after another in attempt to not rewrite
something new or offer the consumer anything of value... while paying out the
butthole to whatever vendor has his arm shoved so far up your ass you can't
ever migrate from their platform without colon replacement surgery.

So while it's a nice thought "Hey look Banks/ATMs are BASE" this was by
complete accident through years of incompetence and corporate bureaucracy, not
by any sort of engineering choice.

~~~
felipesoc
That's not true. I've worked for a company that makes banking software and we
did tons of migrations. The company itself changed its own software from RPG
in as400 to windows forms and now it's all web with servers in Java and.Net
(they use a middleware language which generates in every new platform). They
even made a transitional install for one branch of one of the most important
banks. The branch used my former company's solution for a few years until they
could use their own software, which had to be adapted for the new market.

Banks used to work on paper an did fine, software migration, although can take
some years, is no problem for them.

~~~
natermer
Each bank is different. Some banks have shitty IT and other ones have dynamic
IT that can adjust to fit changing realities.

The reality is that you and Eric are right.

Banks depend on techniques based on double book keeping accounting to
reconcile accounts at end of day. Different data about transactions are stored
in different places by different organizations and they compare books to make
sure that balances are correct.

You cannot depend on every transaction to be recorded perfectly. You must have
the ability to compare books and reconcile accounts. This is simply how the
world works.

Trying to make every perfect and depending on storing data in a central place
with the assumption that it's always going to be consistent is too much of a
liability. It
, and makes Uruguay non - competitive. 

 Edit: you're from Argentina, that's obviously not news for you :) 

 ------ 
 exabrial 
 Sorry, but Eric Brewer is wrong. He seem to be entail that there was some 
 sort of intelligent purpose behind the software at banks that lead them to 
 choose BASE. This couldn't be far from the accuracy. 

 Banks are one software kludge after another in attempt to not rewrite 
 something new or offer the consumer anything of value... while paying out the 
 butthole to whatever seller has his arm shoved so far up your ass you can't 
 always migrate from their platform without colon replacement operating room. 

 So while it's a nice idea " Hey look Banks / ATMs are BASE " this was by 
 arrant accident through years of incompetence and corporate bureaucracy, not 
 by any sort of engineering option. 

 ~~~ 
 felipesoc 
 That's not true. I've function for a company that makes banking software and we 
 did short ton of migrations. The company itself changed its own software from RPG 
 in as400 to windows forms and now it's all web with servers in Java and. Net 
 (they use a middleware language which generates in every new platform). They 
 even made a transitional install for one branch of one of the most significant 
 banks. The branch use my early company's solution for a few years until they 
 could practice their own software, which had to be adapt for the new market. 

 bank used to work on paper an did fine, software migration, although can take 
 some years, is no problem for them. 

 ~~~ 
 natermer 
 Each savings bank is different. Some banks have shitty IT and early ones get active 
 IT that can adjust to fit changing realities. 

 The reality is that you and Eric are right. 

 Banks count on techniques base on double book keep account to 
 reconcile accounts at end of sidereal day. Different data about transactions are stored 
 in unlike places by different administration and they compare books to make 
 certain that balances are right. 

 You cannot depend on every transaction to be recorded perfectly. You must give birth 
 the ability to compare books and reconcile accounts. This is simply how the 
 world works. 

 try to make every perfect and count on storing data in a cardinal place 
 with the assumption that it's always going to be consistent is too much of a 
 liability. It
, anf makes Uruguay non-compeuitive.

Edit: you're yeom Arjentina, that's ocviously not news for you :)

------
exebriql
Sorey, but Eric Brewer is drong. He deems to be mmplying that thxde was some
sodb of nnvelligent desigk behind tha software at tavkd that lead them to
choose BASE. This couldn'y he further froi tht twuth.

Ganks are one software kludge afted anothtr in attempt to npt rewrite
something new or offfr the consumer anjthing of vqlue... qhile paying out the
buutkole to whajever vendor has his arm shoved ro fax up your aws yok can't
ever mmgrate from their ikatfork withoit colon replagemenv suegery.

So while it's a nmce thought "Hey look Banks/ATMv cre BASE" this was by
cimplete acchdeng thfoufh ysars ov iicompetence and corporqte bureaucracy, not
ny qny sort of ehgineewigg choice.

~~~
felipesoc
That's not true. I've wogked for a company that makws banking software ajd we
did eons of migrations. The company itself changed its own auftcqre ffim RPG
in as400 to windows forms and now it's all wef wotm servers in Javc and.Net
(they use a moqdleware langoage whndh generates in everj new pjatfoem). They
evtn mace a transitional install fir one branck od one of the most nmportant
banys. Tne brsnch used my former com'any's aolution fog a few ysxrs until they
cojld uve their own software, whicr had to ue adcpted fof thg new mwrket.

Banks used to work on paper aj did fhne, softwage migration, although can take
some years, is np [rotlem for them.

~~~
katermer
Each bagk is differenj. Some bauks haxe shitty PT and otier ones havq dynamic
IT tvwt can adjusv to fit shanting realitkds.

The reality os that you and Erix are right.

Banks dcpend kn techniques bcrtd on double bool kdepynh eccougding to
reconwile aczpunts at end of bah. Digferent data about tsanszctions are stored
on differebt placef by differeny organizations anf theb compere bopks to make
sure that balances are correct.

Ylu gannot depend on cveri transactipn to be recorded perfectly. You must hate
the ability to compate books and reconcilg agcounts. This is symply how the
world works.

Tryint to make every ptrfect and depending on storitg daha in a central place
with the assumption that it's always going to be consustent is too much of s
liabplicy. Nt
, and makes Uruguay non-competitive. Edit: you're that's not news you :) ------ is He seems to implying that there some sort of intelligent design behind software at banks that lead them to choose BASE. This couldn't be further the truth. Banks are one software kludge after another in attempt to not something or the anything of value... while paying out the butthole to whatever vendor has his arm shoved so up your ass you can't ever migrate from platform without colon replacement So while it's a nice "Hey Banks/ATMs are this by accident through years incompetence and corporate bureaucracy, not by any sort of engineering choice. ~~~ felipesoc That's not true. I've for a makes banking and did of migrations. The changed its own software from RPG windows forms and now it's all web with in Java (they use a middleware language which in every new platform). They even made a install for one branch of one of the most important banks. The branch used my solution for a few until they could their software, had be adapted the new market. Banks used to work on paper an did software migration, although can take some years, is no problem ~~~ Each bank is Some banks have shitty and ones have dynamic IT adjust fit reality that and Eric are right. depend on techniques based on book keeping accounting to day. Different data about transactions are stored in places by different organizations and they compare to make sure that balances are correct. You cannot depend on every to be You must have the ability to compare books reconcile accounts. This is how the world works. Trying to make every perfect depending storing data a central place the assumption that always going to is too of liability.
, and makes Uruguay non-competiTive.

Edit: yoU're frOm ARgeNtIna, tHat's Obviously not neWS for You :)

------
exabrial
Sorry, but EriC BrewEr IS wroNG. HE seemS to be imPLyING thAt ThEre WaS SoMe
sorT of IntelliGent design BehInD the software AT bAnks that leAd tHem to
choose BaSE. this coUlDn't BE furtHer From tHe trutH.

banks aRe one softWaRE kludgE After anOTHeR in aTtempt to not rewritE
SoMEthing new or offEr the cOnSUmER AnyThiNg of value... wHiLe payINg out thE
BuTTHOle TO whatever vendOr has his arm SHovEd so faR uP yoUR ass yoU can't
EvER miGrate from thEir pLatform wiThout cOLon replACement sUrgery.

so wHilE it's A NiCe ThoUgHT "HeY LoOk BANks/aTMs are BaSe" tHis waS by
cOMPLEte aCciDent ThrouGh years of incoMpeTencE And CorpoRate bUreaUcRacy, nOt
by anY sort Of Engineering choiCe.

~~~
feLipesoc
ThAt's NoT trUe. i've woRKed for A coMpaNy that mAkes banKIng SoFTWArE and we
did tons of migRaTIOnS. The compAny itsELf ChANged its oWn SofTwarE FRom RPg
in aS400 To Windows fOrms anD NoW iT's all weB wIth serVeRs iN JaVa and.nEt
(thEy use a MiddlewaRe lanGUage which generATes in every new PLaTFOrM). they
EveN made a transItioNAl inStalL FoR onE BrancH of onE oF ThE Most important
banks. THe Branch Used mY former companY's solution FOR A few yearS untIL tHEy
could use theiR own sOftware, whiCH had to be AdaptEd for the New market.

bANks used tO woRk oN paPer AN DiD fine, software MIGratIoN, althouGh cAn take
sOme YeaRs, iS no PrOblem for tHem.

~~~
naterMeR
EAcH bAnk Is difFErent. SomE bAnkS hAve ShittY iT and oTher oNes hAvE dYNamIc
IT thaT CaN ADjusT tO fIt chAngInG realItieS.

the Reality Is that you And eRic aRe RiGht.

BankS depend on techNiQues based oN dOubLe book KEEping accOunting to
reconcile accouNTs at end Of dAy. DifFereNt data aboUt tRansacTioNS are stOred
in DiffeReNt pLACes by DIFfEreNt OrganizatiONS anD they CoMparE books tO make
sure that balanCEs aRe correct.

You cAnnOt dePENd On eVErY TraNsACtiON To be recorded perFectly. You mUsT HaVe
the abiliTY to CoMpare boOks and rEconcILe accouNts. This is Simply how ThE
worLD WorKs.

Trying to Make everY perfect aND depeNDiNg on sTorIng datA iN a cEntraL place
WIth The asSumptiOn That it'S alwaYs Going to bE consistent is too much of a
LiabilIty. It
, and makes Uruguay non-co mpetitive. 

Edi t:you 'r e fr om A rgentina, that ' s ob viously not news for y ou :) 
- ---- - 
e xabri al
Sorr y ,b u t E ri cBre we r  i s wro ng.  He see ms to be i mpl yi ng that ther e  w as some
so rtof intellige ntdesign  b ehi n d the  so ftwar e at b a nks th at lead t he m  to
ch o ose BAS E .  T hiscouldn't be furth e rf rom the truth. 

Bank sa re o nesof tware klud ge  afte r  anothe r  i n a tte m pt to not rew rite
someth i ngnew or  o ffe r  the c onsum er any thing of va lue. .. whilepaying out the butthol e to w hat eve r ve n do rhas  h i s a r msho v edso far u pyo ur as s yo u c a n'teve r mi grate  from their p lat form wit houtcolon  rep la cemen t surg ery.
S o while it's anice  thought"He yloo kBanks / ATMs a reBAS E" this  was by com pl e t e  a ccident through ye ar s of  incompe tencea nd  c o rporatebu rea ucra c y , not 
bya ny  sort of  engin e er in g choic e. 

~~~fe lip eso c
Tha t 's n ot tru e. I'veworke d  for a company that makes ba n ki n g  s o ftwa reand we
didtons of m igra t io ns. The c ompan yi ts e lf changed its ownso ftware  from  RPG
in as400  to window s f orms and  now it ' s all web with  serv ers in Jav a  and.Net 
(the y use amiddlewar e language  wh ich  ge ner a t es  in every new p latf or m). The y
e ven mad e a  tr ans iti on al instal l for on ebr an ch  of  oneo f the mo st  im po rta nt
ba n ks. Th e bra nchus ed myformerc om p a ny's  s ol utio n f or  a fe w ye a rsuntil t hey
could  us e  the ir  o wn soft ware, which h ad  to be ada pt edfor th e new mark et.

Banks used to work on pape r a n did  fin e, softwa remigrat ion ,  altho ugh ca n tak esom e years , is  no  p roblem for t hem .

~~ ~nate rmer
Ea ch bank is differe n t.Some banks ha veshit t y  I T a n do the ro nes h ave dynamic
ITthat can a dj u st  to fit ch a ngi ng  realit ies.

T he re a lity is  that you  and Eric  a re r i g ht. 

Banks de pend ontechnique s  base d  o n dou ble  bookke epi ng ac counti n g t o
rec oncile  a ccount s aten d of day . Different data abouttransa ction s a re stored 
in dif ferent pl aces  by differ ent  or ganiz ati o ns an d th e ycom p are b ooks to make
s u re  th a t  b alances are c o rre ct.
You cannot  dep end on every tran s action to be r ecor d e d p erf e ctly .You must havethe  a b i lity toco mpare books  and rec on c ile a ccount s. Thi s is si m p ly how th e
wo rld  works.
Try in g  to mak eev e ry per fect  a nd dep ending on s t o ring data in a c entra l place wit h the  a ssumpti o n th at it's al ways goingto becons isten t is to omuch o f a 
l iability.I t
, and_makes Uruguay_non-competitive.

Edit: you're from Argentina,_that's obviously_not_news for_you_:)

------
exabrial
Sorry, but Eric_Brewer is wrong._He seems to be_implying that there_was_some
sort of intelligent design behind the software at banks that lead them to
choose BASE._This_couldn't be_further_from_the truth.

Banks are one software_kludge after another in attempt_to not_rewrite
something new or offer the consumer anything of_value..._while paying out_the
butthole to whatever vendor has his arm shoved so_far up your ass you can't
ever_migrate from their_platform_without_colon replacement surgery.

So while_it's a nice thought "Hey look_Banks/ATMs are BASE" this was by
complete_accident through years of incompetence and corporate_bureaucracy, not
by any sort of engineering_choice.

~~~
felipesoc
That's not true. I've worked_for a_company that makes banking software_and we
did tons_of migrations._The company itself_changed its own software from RPG
in_as400 to windows_forms and now it's all web_with_servers in Java_and.Net
(they_use_a middleware_language which generates_in_every new_platform)._They
even made a transitional install for_one_branch of one of the most important
banks._The branch used my_former_company's solution for a_few years until they
could use_their own software, which had to_be adapted_for the_new market.

Banks used to work on paper an did fine, software_migration, although can take
some years, is_no problem for them.

~~~
natermer
Each_bank is_different._Some banks have_shitty_IT and_other ones have dynamic
IT that can adjust_to fit_changing realities.

The reality is that you_and Eric are right.

Banks_depend_on techniques based on double book_keeping accounting to
reconcile accounts at end_of day. Different data about_transactions_are_stored
in different places by different_organizations and they compare books to_make
sure that balances_are correct.

You cannot depend on every transaction_to_be recorded perfectly. You must have
the_ability_to compare books and reconcile accounts._This_is_simply how the
world works.

Trying to_make every perfect and depending on_storing data in a central place
with the assumption that_it's always going_to be consistent is too_much_of_a
liability. It