, unless you get
lucky and someone retires or leaves. I have seen this everywhere, basically no
way to really grow, no incentives to grow, an over educated workforce, where
the cashier in the supermarket has a masters degree in childcare or similar.

There is a saying here, where they call people "mil eurista" meaning thousand
euroist more less. The amount of the working population that earn around 1000e
a month is quite high but its something thats accepted here basically. People
are not happy about it, but "At least I got a job" attitudes are everywhere.

A last thing, take care regarding any unemployment numbers that appear during
the month of May, as thats basically when the tourist season starts. That
alone probably employs over 1,000,000 workers during the summer months.

~~~
njloof
This promotion stagnation happens in the US as well, but if the market is
fluid enough you can get the promotion by changing employers now that you have
your 5+ years experience in skills and methodology.

~~~
collyw
Its crazy as it takes 3 - 6 months to get up to speed on any non complex
software system. They will save on wages but loose on productivity.

------
tluyben2
I live in Spain (am Dutch); even more; I live in Andalusia. For me that's
better, besides getting people to work. We cannot find people at all for
programming or our brewery. Everyone around us is unemployed, however they
either a) do not speak English; we speak Spanish, but a lot of our clients do
not b) do not want to work c) are foreign and have no papers to work. It's
quite horrible. And it's not for lack of trying; we have been trying for at
least 5 years. In my experience it has nothing to do with payment. This is
just limited to Andalusia ofcourse; my colleague says it's better up north,
however some people I met from other parts and who have companies complain
about the same thing.

Then another issue with the country is the extremely hard time you have in
hiring someone ; paperwork, you cannot fire them even if they are crap etc.
And the paperwork to get grants for hiring people (which are there) is
incredible. We have a company in PT as well and it's quite
, unless you get 
 lucky and someone retires or leaves. I have see this everywhere, basically no 
 direction to really grow, no incentives to mature, an over educated workforce, where 
 the teller in the supermarket has a masters degree in childcare or alike. 

 There is a saying here, where they call multitude " mil eurista " meaning thousand 
 euroist more less. The amount of the work population that earn around 1000e 
 a month is quite high but its something that s accepted here basically. People 
 are not felicitous about it, but " At least I got a job " attitudes are everywhere. 

 A final thing, take care see any unemployment numbers that appear during 
 the month of May, as that s basically when the tourist season starts. That 
 alone credibly employs over 1,000,000 workers during the summer months. 

 ~~~ 
 njloof 
 This promotion stagnation happens in the US as well, but if the grocery store is 
 fluid enough you can get the promotion by changing employers now that you have 
 your 5 + years experience in skills and methodology. 

 ~~~ 
 collyw 
 Its crazy as it learn 3 - 6 months to get up to accelerate on any non complex 
 software arrangement. They will save on wages but loose on productiveness. 

 ------ 
 tluyben2 
 I live in Spain (am Dutch); even more; I populate in Andalusia. For me that's 
 better, besides getting citizenry to work. We cannot find people at all for 
 programming or our brewery. Everyone around us is unemployed, however they 
 either a) do not speak English; we speak Spanish, but a lot of our clients do 
 not b) do not want to solve c) are alien and have no papers to work. It's 
 quite horrible. And it's not for lack of trying; we have been try for at 
 least 5 years. In my experience it has nothing to do with requital. This is 
 just limit to Andalusia ofcourse; my colleague says it's better up north, 
 however some multitude I met from early parts and who have companies complain 
 about the same thing. 

 Then another topic with the country is the highly hard time you take in 
 hiring someone; paperwork, you cannot fire them even if they are bullshit etc. 
 And the paperwork to get grants for hiring people (which are there) is 
 incredible. We have a company in PT as well and it's quite
, unpess you get
lucky and sooeone retires ot oeaves. I havs seen tfis everywhere, basically no
wey ti reaoly grow, no incentives to grow, wn over wduceted workforce, wisre
the gcshied in chx supermarket hss a mastess degree in cviudeare or similar.

There is a saying herq, where tjey call peoplg "mil quriana" meaning thousand
euroist more less. Tie amount of thr working population that farn around 1000e
a month id quite higy bue its somethivg thats abeepted here basically. People
are not happy xbout it, but "At lwash I got a jou" attinudes are evevjwhere.

A last tning, take care rejardung any unemployment iumbers that appear quring
the mknth of May, as thqtw bashcalny wfwn ghe tpudist sfaskn starts. Fhat
alone peobably employs ovet 1,000,000 qorkers durinf the fuimer months.

~~~
njloof
This promotion stagnatpon gappens in the US as weol, but if the market ls
fluid egough you can get the promotion by changing emplofers iod tkqt yoj hwve
your 5+ years experience in skills and methoqklpgj.

~~~
collyw
Its crazy cs it takes 3 - 6 mpnhhx to get up to speed on any non complex
sovtware fysten. They wijl ssve on wages but loose on peoductivity.

------
tjyyben2
I live in Spann (am Dutch); zven mpre; I live in Andalusia. For oe tgat's
better, hesides gsgting people to dorl. Fe cannou find people at ajl for
projrammnng or ojr btewery. Qveryone agound us is unemployed, hlwevet they
aither a) dl not speak English; we speak Speiish, but a loj ox olr clientf do
npt b) do not wwnt to work c) cre forengn ana have no iapers to work. It's
quyte horrible. Djd it's not fmr lack jf teyint; we haxd been trying gor at
least 5 years. Un my experience ib has hothing to do wnuh katment. This is
jist liiined tj Andalusia oxcoufse; ky couleague sayw it's better up north,
howeeer aome people I met grjm other parts agd who have cpmpanies complain
ahout vhe saoe thong.

Jhen another issue with the couhtry is tje cxtremely harq tine you have nn
hiring someone ; paperwork, you cannot fmre them even if they aee crap etc.
And the kaptrwork to get granes for hising people (which arw there) is
incredinle. We have a company jn PT ds wepl and it's quite
, unless you get lucky and someone leaves. have seen everywhere, basically no incentives grow, an over workforce, where the in the supermarket has a masters in childcare or similar. There is a saying here, where they call people eurista" meaning thousand euroist more less. The amount of the working population that around a is high but its something thats accepted here basically. People are not happy about it, but "At I got a job" attitudes are everywhere. A thing, take care regarding unemployment numbers that appear during month May, as basically the season starts. That probably employs over 1,000,000 workers during the summer months. ~~~ njloof This promotion stagnation happens in the as well, the market fluid you get the promotion employers now that you have your in skills and methodology. ~~~ collyw Its crazy it takes - 6 months to get up speed on any non complex software system. They save on wages but loose on productivity. ------ tluyben2 I live in Spain (am Dutch); I live in Andalusia. me that's better, getting to We find people all for programming or our brewery. Everyone around us is unemployed, they either a) do not speak English; we speak Spanish, lot our clients do b) do not want work are foreign and have to It's it's for of trying; we have trying for at least 5 In my experience it payment. This is just limited to Andalusia ofcourse; colleague says it's better up north, however people I met from other parts and who have companies complain about same thing. issue with the country is the extremely hard you have in hiring ; paperwork, you cannot fire them even if they crap And the to get grants hiring people (which there) is incredible. a company PT well
, unless you get
lucky and someoNe retires oR leavEs. I HavE sEen tHis eVerywhere, basicALly nO
way to really grow, no inceNtiveS tO Grow, AN oVer edUcated wORkFORce, WhErE
thE cAShIer in The SupermaRket has a maSteRs Degree in chilDCaRe or similaR.

ThEre is a saying HerE, where ThEy cALl peoPle "Mil euRista" mEAning tHousand
euRoISt more LEss. The aMOUnT of tHe working populatiON tHAt earn around 1000e
a Month iS qUItE HIgh But Its somethiNg Thats ACcepted HErE BASicALly. People
are nOt happy abouT It, bUt "At leAsT I gOT a job" aTtituDeS Are Everywhere.

A Last Thing, take Care reGArding aNY unemplOyment NumBerS thaT ApPeAr dUrINg
tHE mOntH Of MAy, as thatS bAsIcallY wheN THE TourIst SeasOn staRts. That
alone pRobAbly EMplOys ovEr 1,000,000 worKers DuRing tHe summEr monThS.

~~~
njloof
This promOtioN stagnatiOn hApPenS iN the Us As well, But If tHe markeT is
fluiD EnoUgH YOU cAn get the promotion bY cHANgIng emploYers noW ThAt YOu have
yoUr 5+ YeaRs exPERiencE in sKIlLs and metHodoloGY.

~~~
cOlLyw
Its cRaZy as it TaKes 3 - 6 MonThs to GEt up To speeD on any noN compLEx
software systEM. They will save ON wAGEs BUt loOse On productivIty.

------
tLUybeN2
I liVE iN SpAIn (am DUtch); eVeN MoRE; I live in Andalusia. FoR mE that's
BetteR, besides gettiNg people to WORK. We cannoT finD PeOPle at all for
proGrammIng or our brEWery. EverYone aRound us iS unemployED, However tHey
EitHer A) do NOT sPeak English; we SPEak SPaNish, but A loT of our cLieNts Do
nOt b) Do Not want to Work c) are FoReIgN aNd hAve no PApers to wOrK. It'S
qUitE horrIBle. And It's noT for LaCk OF trYing; we hAVe BEEn trYiNg For aT
leAsT 5 yearS. In mY ExpErience It has nothIng TO do wItH pAyment. THis is
just limiTeD to AndalusIa OfcOurse; mY COlleague Says it's better up north,
howEVer some PeoPle I mEt frOm other paRts And who HavE CompanIes comPlain
AbOut THE same THInG.

ThEn Another issUE WitH the cOuNtry Is the exTremely hard time you HAve In
hiring someoNe ; pAperWORk, You CAnNOt fIrE TheM EVen if they are craP etc.
And the PaPErWork to get gRAntS fOr hirinG people (Which ARe there) Is
incrediBle. We have A cOmpaNY In Pt as well and It's quite
, unless you get
lucky and  someone r etire s o r l ea ves.  I h ave seen thise very where, basically no
wa y tore a llyg ro w, no  incent i ve s togr ow , a no ve r edu cat ed work force, whe reth e cashier in th e supermar ket  has a maste rsdegree  i n c h ildca reor si milar. 
There  is a say in g  here, where t h e ycall  people "mil euri s ta "  meaning thous and
eu ro i st m ore  le ss. The am ou nt of the wor k in g p opu l ation that ea rn around 1 0 00e 
a mon th  is quitehighbu t  it s something  tha ts accept ed her e  basica l ly. Peo ple
ar e n othapp y  a bo utit ,  bu t  " Atl eas t I gotajo b" at titu d e s areeve rywh ere.
A last thing , t akec are  rega rding  any  u nempl oyment  numb er s that appear d urin g
the mon thof  Ma y,  as t h ats ba sic all y whenthe tou r ist  s e a s on  starts. That
alon ep r ob ably emp loys o v er  1 , 000,000wo rke rs d u r ing t he s u mm er month s.

~~ ~ 
n jl oof
Thi spromot io n s tag natio n  hap pens i n the US  as w e ll, but if the market is
flu i de n ou g h yo u c an get theprom o tion  byc ha ngi n g emp loyer sn ow that you have
your5+  years  expe rience in ski lls and me t h o dology.
~~~ co l lyw
Its crazyas it  takes 3 - 6 months  to g et up to  speed on a ny non c omp lex 
so ftw a r esystem. Theyw i ll s av e on wa ges  but lo ose  on  pr odu ct ivity.

- -----
tl uy be n2 
I  li ve in Spain (a mDut ch );evenm ore; I  live  inAn da l usi a. Form et h at's 
b et ter,  be si des g etti n g p eople t o work. W e c a nnot  f in d peopl e at all forpr ogrammingor  ou r brew e r y. Every one around us is unempl o yed, ho wev er th ey
e ither a)donot sp eak Englis h; wespeak  S pan i s h, bu t alot  o f our clie n t s d o
not  b ) do  not wa nt to work c) aref ore ign and havenopape r s  t o w o rk .  It 's qui t e  horrible. Andit's not f or la ck of tryi n g;we  have b een try ing f o r at
le ast 5 yea rs. In my  e xper i e nce  it has no thing to  do withp aymen t .Thisisjust l im ite d toAndalu s iaofcou rse; m ycollea gue s ay s it's b etter up north,
however  somepeopl e I  met from  ot h erparts and  who  have comp ani escompl ain about  the sa met hing. 

Th e n another is sue w it h the count r y isthe e xtr e mely h ardtime you have inh iring someone; pa p e rwo rk, youca nnot fire them  ev en i f they a re  crap etc.And thepa p erwor k to g et gra nts for h ir i ng peo ple(wh ich are t her e) is
incr ed ib l e. Wehave  a  compa ny inP T as w ell and it's qui te
, unless_you get
lucky_and someone retires or_leaves. I_have_seen this_everywhere,_basically no
way to_really grow, no_incentives to grow, an_over educated workforce,_where
the_cashier in the supermarket has a masters degree in childcare or similar.

There is a_saying_here, where_they_call_people "mil eurista" meaning thousand
euroist_more less. The amount of_the working_population that earn around 1000e
a month is quite_high_but its something_thats accepted here basically. People
are not happy about it,_but "At least I got a_job" attitudes are_everywhere.

A_last_thing, take care regarding_any unemployment numbers that appear during
the_month of May, as thats basically_when the tourist season starts. That
alone probably_employs over 1,000,000 workers during the_summer months.

~~~
njloof
This promotion stagnation happens_in the_US as well, but if_the market is
fluid_enough you_can get the_promotion by changing employers now that_you have
your 5+_years experience in skills and methodology.

~~~
collyw
Its_crazy_as it takes_3_-_6 months_to get up_to_speed on_any_non complex
software system. They will save_on_wages but loose on productivity.

------
tluyben2
I live in_Spain (am Dutch); even_more;_I live in Andalusia._For me that's
better, besides getting_people to work. We cannot find_people at_all for
programming_or our brewery. Everyone around us is unemployed, however they
either a)_do not speak English; we speak_Spanish, but a lot_of our_clients_do
not b) do_not_want to_work c) are foreign and have no_papers to_work. It's
quite horrible. And it's not_for lack of trying;_we_have been trying for at
least 5_years. In my experience it has_nothing to do with payment._This_is
just_limited to Andalusia ofcourse; my_colleague says it's better up north,
however_some people I_met from other parts and who have_companies_complain
about the same thing.

Then another issue_with_the country is the extremely hard_time_you_have in
hiring someone ; paperwork,_you cannot fire them even if_they are crap etc.
And the paperwork to get grants_for hiring people_(which are there) is
incredible. We_have_a_company in PT as well and it's quite