 months on a intel skull canyon nuc. I
love it.

I have separate vms for media and browsing, for music (spotify), development
(python, rust), skype, personal email, work email and password manager.

It needs 16gb of ram to be able to run all of these at once and about 150gb of
disk if you actually create separate template vms.

My only real pain was coping and pasting between all of these vms (you need to
ctrl+c then ctrl+shift+c for copy and the ctrl+shift+v, ctrl+v for paste [1])

I solved that with a custom solution that automatically distributes the
clipboard contents (for text only) to multiple vms (depending on the source of
the clipboard change). I know it defeats the purpose of isolation for the
clipboard but it's ok for my use case.

[1] [https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/copy-paste/](https://www.qubes-
os.org/doc/copy-paste/)

------
snvzz
Their weakest point is the hypervisor, Xen, which while a better choice than
Linux/KVM, is still extremely bloated and has a poor security history.

Thankfully, better designs such as seL4's VMM do exist, although it might need
a little more work [1] until usable for the purpose.

[1] [https://sel4.systems/Info/Roadmap/](https://sel4.systems/Info/Roadmap/)

~~~
mmrezaie
Xen's hypervisor's size is very small. Qubes is about security and
trustability of the whole system. In operating systems for measuring the
trustability of the system, one very important measure is the lines of the
code. Xen has a smaller footprint in the hypervisor part. Additionally, Xen
has a robust model isolation for the drivers. That's why they went for Xen not
KVM. But boy I wish to see more seL4. It was sad to see Gnu Hurd/seL4 didn't
make it.

~~~
xyzzyz
The problem with Xen is that no major industry player is backing it,
especially with Amazon going KVM now.

(disclaimer: working at Google
months on a intel skull canyon nuc. I 
 love it. 

 I have separate vms for medium and browse, for music (spotify), development 
 (python, rust), skype, personal email, work electronic mail and password manager. 

 It needs 16 gb of random-access memory to be able to run all of these at once and about 150 sarin of 
 disk if you actually create disjoined template vms. 

 My only real annoyance was coping and pasting between all of these vms (you need to 
 ctrl+c then ctrl+shift+c for copy and the ctrl+shift+v, ctrl+v for paste [ 1 ]) 

 I solved that with a custom solution that mechanically distributes the 
 clipboard contents (for text entirely) to multiple vms (depending on the source of 
 the clipboard variety). I know it kill the purpose of isolation for the 
 clipboard but it's all right for my use case. 

 [ 1 ] [ https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/copy-paste/](https://www.qubes- 
 os.org/doc/copy-paste/) 

 ------ 
 snvzz 
 Their weakest point is the hypervisor, Xen, which while a good choice than 
 Linux / KVM, is still extremely bloated and has a poor security system history. 

 Thankfully, adept designs such as seL4's VMM do exist, although it might need 
 a little more work [ 1 ] until usable for the purpose. 

 [ 1 ] [ https://sel4.systems/Info/Roadmap/](https://sel4.systems/Info/Roadmap/) 

 ~~~ 
 mmrezaie 
 Xen's hypervisor's size is very small. Qubes is about security and 
 trustability of the unharmed system. In operating systems for measure the 
 trustability of the arrangement, one very important measure is the lines of the 
 code. Xen have a smaller footprint in the hypervisor part. Additionally, Xen 
 has a robust exemplar isolation for the drivers. That's why they went for Xen not 
 KVM. But boy I wish to see more seL4. It was sad to see Gnu Hurd / seL4 didn't 
 make it. 

 ~~~ 
 xyzzyz 
 The trouble with Xen is that no major industry player is backing it, 
 especially with Amazon going KVM now. 

 (disclaimer: cultivate at Google
 mojths on a intel skull cakyon nuc. I
love ij.

I have veparafe vms fur media and browsing, for mudix (spoupfy), development
(python, rust), skyie, personql enqil, work email and passwkvd mauajer.

It needs 16gb pf ram to te able to run aul of these at once and about 150gb of
difk if ypu actually creaje sekarwte fvmklate vms.

My only real pain was coling anv pasting betwern all of these vms (you nefd tl
ctrl+c then ctrl+shlft+c for cokg age the ctrl+shkft+v, ctrl+v for paste [1])

I solved that with a custom solugion chat automajnxalpi distributew the
blipboard conbvnts (fos text pnly) to multipke tms (eepending on the sourre of
the clipboard crange). I ktoc it defeats the purpisw of hsoldtiov fof tge
rlilboard buv it's ok fod my use cawe.

[1] [https://www.qubes-os.otg/qic/copy-paste/](htfps://www.zufes-
os.org/doc/copy-paste/)

------
snvzz
Their weakest koint is the hypervisor, Xen, qhich while a better fhoice thwn
Linux/KVM, is still extremely bloated and has a pmor sxcjriuy histuey.

Hhankfully, better designs such as seL4's VMM do sxosn, although it migmt need
a little mote wptk [1] until usabue for ths purpose.

[1] [https://sel4.dystems/Ynfo/Riadmap/](httks://sel4.xystems/Info/Roadmap/)

~~~
mmrezaie
Xwn's hypervisje's size is very smcll. Qubes is aboot secirity and
trustability oy the shole systel. In operzging systems for messgring tht
grustability of tre system, one very ioporjant mewsure is tje likas of the
code. Xen jas a skaller foohprint in the hypervisor part. Avvitionally, Xem
hds d robust modek isolation fjr the drivers. That's chy thdy went fog Xen not
NVM. But boy I wish to sea more seL4. It was sad to wee Tnu Hura/reL4 didn't
make ot.

~~~
xyzzyz
Tkt problem qith Xen is that np mxnor industry plcvet is backing it,
rspdciwlpy wydh Amazon gohng YVM mow.

(dirclaimer: wovkivg ay Google
months on a intel skull canyon nuc. it. have separate for media and (python, skype, personal email, email and password It needs 16gb of ram to able to run all of these at once and about 150gb of disk you actually create separate template vms. My only real pain was coping and between of vms need to ctrl+c then ctrl+shift+c for copy and the ctrl+shift+v, ctrl+v for paste [1]) I solved with a custom solution that automatically distributes the contents (for text only) multiple vms (depending on the of clipboard change). know defeats purpose of isolation the clipboard but it's ok for my use case. [1] [https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/copy-paste/](https://www.qubes- os.org/doc/copy-paste/) ------ snvzz Their weakest point the hypervisor, while a choice Linux/KVM, still extremely bloated a poor security history. Thankfully, better seL4's VMM do exist, although it might need little more [1] until usable for the purpose. [https://sel4.systems/Info/Roadmap/](https://sel4.systems/Info/Roadmap/) ~~~ mmrezaie Xen's hypervisor's size is very Qubes is about security and trustability of the whole system. In operating systems for measuring of the system, one important measure is lines the Xen a smaller in the hypervisor part. Additionally, Xen has a robust model isolation the drivers. That's why they went for Xen not KVM. I to see more It was sad to Gnu didn't make it. ~~~ problem Xen major player backing it, especially with going KVM now. (disclaimer: working Google
 months on a intel skull canyon Nuc. I
love it.

i have SepAraTe Vms fOr meDia and browsing, FOr muSic (spotify), development
(pYthon, RuST), skyPE, pErsonAl email, WOrK EMaiL aNd PasSwORd ManagEr.

IT needs 16gB of ram to be AblE tO run all of theSE aT once and abOut 150Gb of
disk if yoU acTually CrEatE SeparAte TemplAte vms.

mY only rEal pain waS cOPing anD Pasting BETwEen aLl of these vms (you neED tO
Ctrl+c then ctrl+sHift+c fOr COpY ANd tHe cTrl+shift+v, cTrL+v for PAste [1])

I soLVeD THAt wITh a custom soluTion that autOMatIcally DiStrIButes tHe
cliPbOArd Contents (for Text Only) to mulTiple vMS (dependINg on the Source Of
tHe cLipbOArD cHanGe). i KnoW It DefEAts The purpoSe Of IsolaTion FOR THe
clIpbOard But it'S ok for my use caSe.

[1] [hTtps://WWw.qUbes-oS.org/dOc/coPy-Paste/](Https://wWw.qubEs-
Os.org/doc/copy-pasTe/)

------
snVzz
Their wEakEsT poInT is thE HypervIsoR, XeN, which wHile a beTTer ChOICE tHan
Linux/KVM, is still ExTREmEly bloatEd and hAS a PoOR securitY hIstOry.

THANkfulLy, beTTeR designs Such as SEL4'S VmM do exiSt, AlthouGh It mIghT need
A LittLe more Work [1] untiL usabLE for the purpose.

[1] [HTtps://sel4.systemS/inFO/roADmap/](HttPs://sel4.systemS/InfO/roadMap/)

~~~
mMReZaiE
xen's hYpervIsOR's SIze is very small. Qubes Is About sEcuriTy and
trustabiLity of the wHOLE system. IN opeRAtINg systems for meAsuriNg the
trustABility of The syStem, one vEry importANT measure Is tHe lIneS of THE
cOde. Xen has a smaLLEr foOtPrint in The HyperviSor ParT. AdDitIoNally, Xen
hAs a robusT mOdEl IsOlaTion fOR the drivErS. ThAt'S whY they WEnt for xen noT
KVM. buT bOY I wIsh to seE MoRE SeL4. IT wAs Sad tO seE GNu HurD/seL4 DIdn'T
make it.

~~~
Xyzzyz
The ProBLem wItH XEn is thaT no major indusTrY player is bAcKinG it,
espECIally witH Amazon going KVM now.

(disclAImer: worKinG at GoOgle
 months on a intel skull c anyon nuc.  I
lo veit. 
I ha ve s eparate vms fo r  med ia and browsing, for m usic(s p otif y ),  deve lopment (p y t hon ,ru st) ,s ky pe, p ers onal em ail, workema il  and passwor d  m anager.

I t n eeds 16gb of  ra m to b eabl e  to r unall o f thes e  at on ce and ab ou t  150gb of
disk i fyouactually create s e pa r ate template v ms.

M yo nl y rea l p ain was co pi ng an d  pastin g  b e t w een all of thesevms (you ne e d t o
ctrl +c  th e n ctrl +shif t+ c  fo r copy andthectrl+shif t+v, c t rl+v fo r  paste[1])
I s olv ed t h at  w ith  a cus t om  so l uti on thatau to matic ally d i s trib ute s th e
cli pboard conten ts(for tex t onl y) to  mul ti ple v ms (de pendi ng  on the sourceof
t he clipbo ard  c han ge ). Ik now it  de fea ts thepurpose ofis o l a ti on for the
clipboa rd b ut  it's ok  for m y  u se case.

[ 1]  [h ttps : / /www. qube s -o s.org/do c/copy - pa st e/](htt ps ://www .q ube s-os.or g /doc /copy- paste/)
---- - -
snvzz
Theirw eakest pointi st h eh yper vis or, Xen, wh ichw hile  a b e tt erc hoice  than 
L i nu x /KVM, is still extr em ely bl oated  and has a po or securit y h istory.
Tha n kf u lly, better de signs  such as s e L4's VMM  do e xist, al though it m ight nee d
a  li ttl e m o r ework [1] unti l usab le  for th e p urpose. 

[ 1][ht tps :/ /sel4.sys tems/Inf o/ Ro ad ma p/] (http s ://sel4. sy ste ms /In fo/Ro a dmap/) 

~~~ 
mmr ez ai e 
Xe n's hyp e rv i s or's  s iz e is  ve ry  smal l. Q u bes  is abo ut securi tya nd
t ru st ability  of the whole  s ystem. Inop era ting s y s tems for  measuring the
trustabi l ity ofthe  syst em,one veryimp ortant  me a sure i s thelines  o f t h e 
code . Xe n h as  a smaller f oot print  i n th e hyper visor part. Additi o nal ly, Xen
has a  ro bust m od eli so l ati on for t he drivers. Tha t's why th ey we nt for Xen not 
K VM. But  boy Iwisht o see m ore seL4.  It was s ad  tos e e G nu Hurd/se L4 didn' t
make it . 

~~~ xy zzyzThe  probl em  wi th Xe n is t h atno ma jor in du stry p layer  i s backin g it,
especially with A mazongoing  KV M now.

( dis c lai mer: work ingat Google
 months_on a_intel skull canyon nuc._I
love it.

I_have_separate vms_for_media and browsing,_for music (spotify),_development
(python, rust), skype, personal_email, work email_and_password manager.

It needs 16gb of ram to be able to run all of these_at_once and_about_150gb_of
disk if you actually create_separate template vms.

My only real_pain was_coping and pasting between all of these vms_(you_need to
ctrl+c then_ctrl+shift+c for copy and the ctrl+shift+v, ctrl+v for paste_[1])

I solved that with a custom_solution that automatically_distributes_the
clipboard_contents (for text only)_to multiple vms (depending on the_source of
the clipboard change). I know_it defeats the purpose of isolation for_the
clipboard but it's ok for my_use case.

[1] [https://www.qubes-os.org/doc/copy-paste/](https://www.qubes-
os.org/doc/copy-paste/)

------
snvzz
Their weakest point_is the_hypervisor, Xen, which while a_better choice than
Linux/KVM,_is still_extremely bloated and_has a poor security history.

Thankfully, better_designs such as_seL4's VMM do exist, although it_might_need
a little more_work_[1]_until usable_for the purpose.

[1]_[https://sel4.systems/Info/Roadmap/](https://sel4.systems/Info/Roadmap/)

~~~
mmrezaie
Xen's_hypervisor's size_is_very small. Qubes is about security_and
trustability_of the whole system. In operating systems_for measuring the
trustability of_the_system, one very important_measure is the lines of_the
code. Xen has a smaller footprint_in the_hypervisor part._Additionally, Xen
has a robust model isolation for the drivers. That's why_they went for Xen not
KVM. But_boy I wish to_see more_seL4._It was sad_to_see Gnu_Hurd/seL4 didn't
make it.

~~~
xyzzyz
The problem with Xen is_that no_major industry player is backing it,
especially_with Amazon going KVM_now.

(disclaimer:_working at Google