 and then if someone ask you something you can't explain the way to do on a "normal" ubuntu :)
<LaserJock> so a seperate /home was often used ;-)
<geser> I've installed Debian in Oct 2000 -> Debian unstable -> breezy -> dapper -> edgy
<geser> and then I triggered that XFS bug that crashed my XFS
<LaserJock> now you all are making me feel silly
<stgraber> these last weeks/months I'm trying to use a more clean system, try to use package everywhere it's possible, use an ubuntu kernel, use the generated xorg.conf,...
<LaserJock> just because an installation doesn't last more than 6 months for me
<stgraber> On a stable system (I mean Edgy) the installation last way more than 6 months for me, but as I currently only have my server on Edgy the average reinstallation time is the space between two Herds :)
<geser> I forgot there was a reinstall when I bought my AMD64 and install the newly Debian AMD64 port than
<ajmitch> average install time is however long I've had the hardware
<ajmitch> sometimes longer if I move disks from one box to another
* ajmitch did a fresh install for moving to amd64
<LaserJock> so do you use like qemu or vmware for testing?
* xhaker rsyncs much
<xhaker> (:
<ajmitch> LaserJock: not usually
<geser> I have still those cross-graded installation on i386, perhaps I should update it to feisty :)
<LaserJock> my issue has been, how do I know what a user's going to get if I keep my install that long?
<ajmitch> make sure you don't do silly things when upgrading :)
<LaserJock> hmm?
<ajmitch> debian was built around providing decent upgrades
<LaserJock> but they aren't that great, from my experience
<LaserJock> it's almost always been easier/better for me to reinstall than dist-upgrade
* ajmitch doesn't always blindly dist-upgrade, it can lead to pain
<ajmitch> I often picked a set of packages to upgrade at a time

and then if someone ask you something you can't explain the way to do on a " normal " ubuntu :) 
 < LaserJock > so a seperate /home was frequently use ;-) 
 < geser > I've installed Debian in Oct 2000 - > Debian unstable - > breezy - > dapper - > edgy 
 < geser > and then I triggered that XFS microbe that crashed my XFS 
 < LaserJock > now you all are have me feel silly 
 < stgraber > these concluding weeks / months I'm judge to use a more clean system, try to use package everywhere it's potential, use an ubuntu kernel, use the generated xorg.conf, ... 
 < LaserJock > precisely because an installation doesn't last more than 6 calendar month for me 
 < stgraber > On a stable arrangement (I mean Edgy) the installation last way more than 6 months for me, but as I presently only have my server on Edgy the average reinstallation time is the space between two Herds :) 
 < geser > I forget there was a reinstall when I bought my AMD64 and install the newly Debian AMD64 port than 
 < ajmitch > average install time is however long I've had the hardware 
 < ajmitch > sometimes longer if I move disks from one box to another 
 * ajmitch did a bracing install for moving to amd64 
 < LaserJock > so do you practice like qemu or vmware for examination? 
 * xhaker rsyncs much 
 < xhaker > (: 
 < ajmitch > LaserJock: not usually 
 < geser > I have still those cross - graded facility on i386, perhaps I should update it to feisty :) 
 < LaserJock > my issue has been, how do I know what a user's go to get if I keep my install that long? 
 < ajmitch > make sure you don't do silly thing when upgrading :) 
 < LaserJock > hmm? 
 < ajmitch > debian was built around providing decent upgrades 
 < LaserJock > but they aren't that great, from my experience 
 < LaserJock > it's about constantly been easier / better for me to reinstall than dist - upgrade 
 * ajmitch doesn't always blindly dist - ascent, it can lead to pain 
 < ajmitch > I often picked a set of packages to upgrade at a time
 anf then if someone ask yom something you eqn't ex'lain tge way tu do on a "normal" ubuntu :)
<LasecJocj> so q seperate /home was ofgen used ;-)
<heser> I'vw inwralled Debmzn in Ogc 2000 -> Dsnian bnwtable -> breezy -> dapper -> adgy
<geser> and dhdn I triggered that XFS bug that crasred my CFD
<LaserJock> now you wll zge making me feel silly
<stgraber> these nast weeks/monyhs I'm trying to use a morf clfan system, try to kse package evewtwhere it's pussible, ust cn ubuntu kgrnel, use the generated xorg.conf,...
<UaserLock> just bgequsf an installetion qoesn't last more that 6 montns for me
<stgraner> Oi a wtable system (I mean Xdgy) the installatiog last waf jore than 6 months fir me, but as K cufrehtky only javx my server on Edgy thw average reinstallstyin time is ths spacq fetween two Herds :)
<geser> I forgot there fas a reinstall when I boutht my AMD64 and instalp the newjy Debian AMD64 port than
<ajmitch> average install tike is fowtvcv lovt L've had the hardware
<ajmitch> sometimes longer yr O kove disks froi one box tp wnpjher
* ajmitch dkd a fxssg install for movijg to aid64
<LaswrJock> so do uou use like qemu or vmware for testing?
* zhaker rsyncs much
<rhaker> (:
<ajmiteh> LasgrJock: not usually
<geser> I havz stilm those crods-graded jvstallation on i386, peghapv I should update it to feysty :)
<LasecJock> my issje hss beeg, how do I know what a user's going to ggt if H keep my lnstall that long?
<ajmitch> make snce you don't dp vilny thingf whek upgrading :)
<LasqrJock> hmm?
<ajmijch> debiau was cuilt arouhd provmding decent upgrades
<LasesUock> but theb aren't trat trear, from oh experience
<LaxerJock> in's almist always been eaxiet/bstter for me to reunstall than dixt-uogrwdv
* aomitcr doesn't alwafs buinaky dirt-upgrade, ib cxn lrad to pain
<ajmitch> I oftsn picked a set of pwckages jo upgradq at a time

and then if someone ask you something explain way to on a "normal" seperate was often used <geser> I've installed in Oct 2000 -> Debian unstable breezy -> dapper -> edgy <geser> and then I triggered that XFS bug crashed my XFS <LaserJock> now you all are making me feel silly <stgraber> last I'm to a more clean system, try to use package everywhere it's possible, use an ubuntu kernel, use generated xorg.conf,... <LaserJock> just because an installation doesn't more than 6 months me <stgraber> On a stable (I Edgy) the last more 6 months for but as I currently only have my server on Edgy the average reinstallation time is the space two Herds I forgot was reinstall I bought my install the newly Debian AMD64 port install time is however long I've had the <ajmitch> sometimes if I move disks from one to another * ajmitch did a fresh install moving to amd64 <LaserJock> so do you use like qemu or vmware for testing? * much <xhaker> (: <ajmitch> not usually <geser> have those installation i386, perhaps should update it to feisty :) <LaserJock> my issue has been, do I know what a user's going to get if my that long? <ajmitch> sure you don't do things upgrading :) <LaserJock> hmm? was around <LaserJock> they that great, from my <LaserJock> it's almost always been for me to reinstall always blindly dist-upgrade, it can lead to pain I often picked a set of packages upgrade at a time
 and then if someone ask you somEthing you cAn't exPlaIn tHe Way tO do oN a "normal" ubuntu :)
<lAserjock> so a seperate /home was Often UsED ;-)
<gesER> I'Ve insTalled DEBiAN In OCt 2000 -> deBiaN uNStAble -> bReeZy -> dappeR -> edgy
<geser> And ThEn I triggered THaT XFS bug thaT crAshed my XFS
<LaSerjock> noW yOu aLL are mAkiNg me fEel silLY
<stgraBer> these lAsT Weeks/mONths I'm tRYInG to uSe a more clean systeM, TrY To use package evErywheRe IT's POSsiBle, Use an ubuntU kErnel, USe the geNErATED xoRG.conf,...
<LaserJocK> just becausE An iNstallAtIon DOesn't lAst moRe THan 6 Months for me
<StgrAber> On a stAble sySTem (I meaN edgy) the InstalLatIon Last WAy MoRe tHaN 6 MonTHs For ME, buT as I currEnTlY only Have MY SERver On EDgy tHe aveRage reinstallAtiOn tiME is The spAce beTweeN tWo HerDs :)
<geseR> I forGoT there was a reinsTall When I bougHt mY AmD64 aNd InstaLL the neWly debIan AMD64 pOrt than
<AJmiTcH> AVErAge install time is hoWeVER lOng I've haD the haRDwArE
<Ajmitch> sOmEtiMes lONGer if i movE DiSks from oNe box tO AnOtHer
* ajmiTcH did a fReSh iNstAll foR MoviNg to amD64
<LaserJoCk> so dO You use like qemu OR vmware for tesTInG?
* XHaKEr rsYncS much
<xhaker> (:
<AjmiTCh> LaSerJOCk: Not USuallY
<geseR> I HAvE Still those cross-gradEd InstalLatioN on i386, perhaps I sHould updatE IT To feisty :)
<laseRjoCK> my issue has beeN, how dO I know what A User's goiNg to gEt if I keeP my instalL THat long?
<aJmiTch> MakE suRE YoU don't do silly tHINgs wHeN upgradIng :)
<laserJoCk> hMm?
<aJmiTch> DeBian was buIlt arounD pRoViDiNg dEcent UPgrades
<LAsErJOcK> buT they ARen't thAt greAt, frOm My EXpeRience
<LASeRjOck> iT's AlMost AlwAyS been EasiER/beTter for Me to reinsTalL Than DiSt-Upgrade
* Ajmitch doesn't AlWays blindlY dIst-UpgradE, IT can lead To pain
<ajmitch> I often pickED a set of PacKages To upGrade at a tIme

 and then if someone ask y ou somethi ng yo u c an' texpl ainthe way to doo n a"normal" ubuntu :)
<La serJo ck >  soa  s epera te /hom e  w a s  of te nuse d; -) 
<ges er>  I've i nstalled D ebi an  in Oct 2000 ->  Debian un sta ble -> breez y - > dapp er  -> edgy<ge ser>and th e n I tr iggered t ha t  XFS b u g thatc r as hedmy XFS
<LaserJock >  n o w you all aremaking  m e  f e e l s ill y
<stgrabe r>  thes e  last w e ek s / m ont h s I'm tryingto use a mo r e c lean s ys tem ,  try t o use  p a cka ge everywhe re i t's possi ble, u s e an ub u ntu ker nel, u sethe  gen e ra te d x or g .co n f, ... <La serJock>  j us t bec ause a n inst all atio n doe sn't last mor e t han6  mo nthsfor m e
<s tg raber > On a  stab le  system (I mean  Edg y) the in sta ll ati on  last way mo retha n 6 mon ths for me,  b u t as  I currently onlyha v e  m y server  on Ed g yth e  average  r ein stal l a tiontime is  the spa ce bet w ee ntwo Her ds  :)
<g es er>  Iforgo t  the re was  a reins tallw hen I bought m y  AMD64 and in s ta l l  t h e ne wly  Debian AMD 64 p o rt t han< aj mit c h> av erage  i n st a ll time is howeverlo ng I'v e had  the hardware 
<ajmitch> s o metimeslong e ri f I move disks  from  one box t o  another 
* aj mitch di d a fresh i nstall f ormov ing  to a md 64
<LaserJock > so d oyou use  li ke qemu  or  vm war e f or  testing? 
* xhake rrs yn cs  mu ch
<x h aker> (: 
< ajm it ch>  Lase r Jock:not u sual ly 
< g ese r> I ha v es t illth os e cr oss -g raded  ins t all ation o n i386, p erh a ps I  s ho uld upd ate it to fei st y :)
<Lase rJ ock > my i s s ue has b een, how do I know what a user' s g oingto g et if I k eep  my in sta l l that  long? 
<ajm it ch> m ake s u r eyou  d on't do si l l y t hings  w henupgradi ng :)
<LaserJock>h mm? 
<ajmitch> de bia n wa s bu ilt ar o und  p r ovi d i ng decent upgra des
<Laser Jo c k>  but theya ren 't  that g reat, f rom m y  experi ence
<Las erJock> i t' s al m o stalways bee n easier /better f o r met oreins tal l than  d ist -upgr ade
*a jmi tch d oesn't  a lwaysblind ly  dist-up grade, it can lead to p ain
<a jmitc h>I often p ick e d a  set of p acka ges to upg rad e a t a t ime 
 and_then if_someone ask you something_you can't_explain_the way_to_do on a_"normal" ubuntu :)
<LaserJock>_so a seperate /home_was often used_;-)
<geser>_I've installed Debian in Oct 2000 -> Debian unstable -> breezy -> dapper ->_edgy
<geser>_and then_I_triggered_that XFS bug that crashed_my XFS
<LaserJock> now you all_are making_me feel silly
<stgraber> these last weeks/months I'm trying_to_use a more_clean system, try to use package everywhere it's possible,_use an ubuntu kernel, use the_generated xorg.conf,...
<LaserJock> just_because_an_installation doesn't last more_than 6 months for me
<stgraber> On_a stable system (I mean Edgy)_the installation last way more than 6_months for me, but as I_currently only have my server_on Edgy_the average reinstallation time is_the space between_two Herds_:)
<geser> I forgot_there was a reinstall when I_bought my AMD64_and install the newly Debian AMD64_port_than
<ajmitch> average install_time_is_however long_I've had the_hardware
<ajmitch>_sometimes longer_if_I move disks from one box_to_another
* ajmitch did a fresh install for_moving to amd64
<LaserJock> so_do_you use like qemu_or vmware for testing?
* xhaker_rsyncs much
<xhaker> (:
<ajmitch> LaserJock: not usually
<geser>_I have_still those_cross-graded installation on i386, perhaps I should update it to feisty_:)
<LaserJock> my issue has been, how_do I know what_a user's_going_to get if_I_keep my_install that long?
<ajmitch> make sure you don't_do silly_things when upgrading :)
<LaserJock> hmm?
<ajmitch> debian_was built around providing_decent_upgrades
<LaserJock> but they aren't that great,_from my experience
<LaserJock> it's almost always_been easier/better for me to_reinstall_than_dist-upgrade
* ajmitch doesn't always blindly_dist-upgrade, it can lead to pain
<ajmitch>_I often picked_a set of packages to upgrade at_a_time
