
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: you're not serious, are you?
<LaserJock> the issue is a UVFe for what seems to me to be not a very strong case for a UVFe
<imbrandon> its not the fact its KDE, if it was alsa, i would say the same thing, they arent touching it and havent in the past why care now
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: I am, and I really wish you guys wouldn't think that people *won't* touch KDE stuff in Universe
<LaserJock> I don't care if it's Gnome, KDE, XFCE, or FVWM
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: based on how many times i've had "can you sponsor my upload?  sure, what is it?  k*, oh, i dont do kde stuff, sorry"
<imbrandon> LaserJock, it not that its KDE specificly, as i said it could be any package set
<Hobbsee> you dont need that too many times, to stop asking
<Hobbsee> but that's moot.
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: well, that's entirely different, IMO
<LaserJock> not feeling comfortable with a package for sponsorship is really different then being bigoted against KDE
<LaserJock> which seems to be what you're trying to say
<Hobbsee> one effectively leads to the other, i thought
<LaserJock> well, I'd strongly disagree, but ok
<Hobbsee> i may have my definitions wrong, though
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: I wouldn't be particularly comfortable sponsoring uploads for most k* packages, as I don't know them. However, I treat k* packages approximately equally when doing bug-stuff.
<LaserJock> but I really believe that if it had been some Gnome or Java or whatever packages we'd feel the same way
<StevenK> Allow me to repeat myself.
<StevenK> Can we not move the argument to IRC, please?
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Unfortunately, arguing on a mailing list or blog isn't overly effective or realtime.
<imbrandon> LaserJock, and thats my point, if java had been done like this in edgy ( and before iirc ) and approved as a spec
< Hobbsee > LaserJock: you're not serious, are you? 
 < LaserJock > the issue is a UVFe for what seems to me to be not a very strong subject for a UVFe 
 < imbrandon > its not the fact its KDE, if it was alsa, i would suppose the same thing, they are nt touching it and have nt in the past why concern now 
 < LaserJock > Hobbsee: I am, and I really wish you guy wouldn't think that people * won't * refer KDE stuff in Universe 
 < LaserJock > I don't care if it's Gnome, KDE, XFCE, or FVWM 
 < Hobbsee > LaserJock: free-base on how many times i've had " can you sponsor my upload?   surely, what is it?   k *, oh, i do nt do kde stuff, sorry " 
 < imbrandon > LaserJock, it not that its KDE specificly, as i suppose it could be any package set 
 < Hobbsee > you do nt necessitate that too many times, to stop ask 
 < Hobbsee > but that's moot. 
 < LaserJock > Hobbsee: well, that's entirely different, IMO 
 < LaserJock > not feeling comfortable with a software for sponsorship is really unlike then being bigoted against KDE 
 < LaserJock > which seems to be what you're trying to say 
 < Hobbsee > one effectively leave to the other, i thought 
 < LaserJock > well, I'd strongly disagree, but ok 
 < Hobbsee > i may have my definitions ill-timed, though 
 < Fujitsu > Hobbsee: I wouldn't be peculiarly comfortable sponsoring uploads for most k * packages, as I don't know them. However, I treat k * packages approximately equally when do hemipterous insect - stuff. 
 < LaserJock > but I really believe that if it had been some Gnome or Java or whatever software we'd feel the same way 
 < StevenK > permit me to reprise myself. 
 < StevenK > Can we not move the argument to IRC, please? 
 < Fujitsu > StevenK: Unfortunately, argue on a mailing list or blog isn't overly effective or realtime. 
 < imbrandon > LaserJock, and that s my point, if java had been done like this in edgy (and before iirc) and approved as a specification

<Hobhsee> LaserJock: you're not serious, are yoo?
<LqserJork> the jssue is a UVFe for what seems to me ti be bot a very strong case for a UVVe
<imbraneon> mts not the fact its KDE, if it aas clwa, i would say the same dhing, they arett tluching it and havent in the past wry care nlw
<LaserJock> Hofbset: I am, znd I really wish you guys wouldn't think uhat people *won't* tpuch KDE stuff in Universe
<PasegJock> I don't care lf it's Gnomg, KDQ, XFCE, or FVWO
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: basgd on how many times i've had "can you xponsor my uplowg?  sure, whav is in?  k*, oh, i donb do kda stuff, sorry"
<imbrandok> LasxrJoxk, it not that its KDX specificly, as i sayd it cound be any package swt
<Yobbsge> yog dovr nded tiat too mwny times, to atop asking
<Yobbsee> but that's mpoe.
<OaserJock> Hobgsee: wqlj, that's entirely different, IMO
<LaserJock> nof feeling comfortable wuth a package for spojsorship ys really different then being bigoted against KDA
<LasecJuck> wmich wefms to be what you're trying to say
<Hobbsee> one sfgebtively leads to bhe other, i thoughy
<LwsrtJock> well, I'd rtrongly sisagree, but ok
<Hobhsee> i iay hqve my desiniyions wrong, though
<Fujitsu> Hibbsee: I woujen't be particularlv comfortablz sponxorinb uploads for most k* paekages, as I don't nnow them. Fowever, I treat y* pscnages apkfoximately equallr when domng bbg-stuff.
<LxserKock> btt I reallj bellave that if it had been smme Gnome lr Java or whatever packages we'v feel the sake waj
<StevenK> Cllow ke to repeat iyself.
<StevenK> Ean we njt moxe the arglment to MRC, please?
<Futitsu> StevenK: Onfortunately, arguing on q mauling lkrt or blog isn'y overly vfyective oe realtime.
<imbrandok> LasgrNock, and thats ny kount, if java hac bden dlnx likq this in edgf ( avd crfore iirc ) and cporovrd as a spec
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: you're not serious, are you? issue a UVFe what seems to very case for a <imbrandon> its not fact its KDE, if it was i would say the same thing, they arent touching it and havent in past why care now <LaserJock> Hobbsee: I am, and I really wish you wouldn't that *won't* KDE stuff in Universe <LaserJock> I don't care if it's Gnome, KDE, XFCE, or FVWM <Hobbsee> based on how many times i've had "can sponsor my upload? sure, is it? k*, oh, i do stuff, sorry" LaserJock, not its KDE specificly, i said it could be any package set <Hobbsee> you dont need that too many times, to asking <Hobbsee> moot. <LaserJock> well, entirely IMO <LaserJock> not with a package for sponsorship is being bigoted against KDE <LaserJock> which seems to what you're to say <Hobbsee> one effectively leads the other, i thought <LaserJock> well, I'd strongly but ok <Hobbsee> i may have my definitions wrong, though <Fujitsu> Hobbsee: I wouldn't be sponsoring uploads for most packages, as I know However, treat packages approximately when doing bug-stuff. <LaserJock> but I really believe that if it been some Gnome or Java or whatever packages we'd feel way Allow me to myself. <StevenK> Can we move argument to IRC, please? Unfortunately, on or isn't effective or realtime. <imbrandon> and thats my point, if had been done like before iirc ) and approved as a spec

<Hobbsee> LaserJock: you're not sErious, are yOu?
<LasErJOck> ThE issUe is A UVFe for what seEMs to Me to be not a very strong caSe for A Uvfe
<imBRaNdon> iTs not thE FaCT Its kDe, iF it WaS AlSa, i woUld Say the sAme thing, thEy aReNt touching it ANd Havent in thE paSt why care now
<lasErJock> hoBbsEE: I am, aNd I ReallY wish yOU guys wOuldn't thiNk THat peoPLe *won't* tOUCh kDE sTuff in Universe
<LasERJOCk> I don't care if iT's GnomE, Kde, Xfce, or fVWm
<Hobbsee> LaSeRJock: BAsed on hOW mANY TimES i've had "can you Sponsor my upLOad?  Sure, whAt Is iT?  K*, oh, i doNt do kDe STufF, sorry"
<imbraNdon> laserJock, It not tHAt its KDe SpecifiCly, as i SaiD it CoulD Be AnY paCkAGe sET
<HObbSEe> yOu dont neEd ThAt too Many TIMES, to sTop AskiNg
<HobBsee> but that's mOot.
<laseRjocK> HobbSee: weLl, thAt'S entiRely diFfereNt, iMO
<LaserJock> not FeelIng comforTabLe WitH a PackaGE for spOnsOrsHip is reAlly difFEreNt THEN bEing bigoted against kDe
<lAsErJock> whIch seeMS tO bE What you'rE tRyiNg to SAY
<HobbSee> oNE eFfectiveLy leadS To ThE other, i ThOught
<LAsErJOck> Well, I'D StroNgly diSagree, buT ok
<HoBBsee> i may have my DEfinitions wroNG, tHOUgH
<fujiTsu> hobbsee: I wouLdn't BE parTicuLArLy cOMfortAble sPoNSoRIng uploads for most k* pAcKages, aS I don'T know them. HoweVer, I treat k* PACKages appRoxiMAtELy equally when dOing bUg-stuff.
<LasERJock> but i realLy believE that if it HAD been somE GnOme Or JAva OR WhAtever packageS WE'd feEl The same Way
<stevenK> allOw mE to RepEaT myself.
<StEvenK> Can We NoT mOvE thE arguMEnt to IRC, PlEasE?
<FUjiTsu> StEVenK: UnFortuNateLy, ArGUinG on a maiLInG LIst oR bLoG isn'T ovErLy effEctiVE or RealtimE.
<imbrandoN> LaSErJoCk, AnD thats mY point, if java hAd Been done liKe ThiS in edgY ( ANd before Iirc ) and approved as a spec

<Hobbsee> LaserJock: you' re not ser ious,  ar e y ou ?
<L aser Jock> the issu e  isa UVFe for what seemsto me  t o  ben ot  a ve ry stro n gc a sefo ra U VF e 
< imbra ndo n> itsnot the fa ctit s KDE, if it wa s alsa, iwou ld say the s ame  thing ,the y  aren t t ouchi ng ita nd hav ent in th ep ast wh y  care n o w 
< Lase rJock> Hobbsee: I am ,  and I reallywish y ou gu y s  wo uld n't thinkth at pe o ple *wo n 't * t ouc h  KDE stuff in  Universe
< L ase rJock>  I  do n 't car e ifit ' s G nome, KDE,XFCE , or FVWM 
<Hobb s ee> Las e rJock:basedonhow  man y  t im esi' v e h a d"ca n  yo u sponso rmy  uplo ad?s u r e, w hat  isit? k*, oh, i don t d o kd e  st uff,sorry "
<i mb rando n> Las erJoc k,  it not that it s KD E specifi cly ,asisaidi t coul d b e a ny pack age set <Ho bb s e e >you dont need that  t o o  m any time s, tos to pa sking
<H ob bse e> b u t  that 's m o ot .
<Laser Jock>H ob bs ee: wel l,  that' sent ire ly di f fere nt, IM O
<Laser Jock> not feeling co m fortable with ap a ck a ge f orsponsorship  isr eall y di f fe ren t  then  bein gb ig o ted against KDE
<La se rJock>  whic h seems to be  what you' r e trying t o sa y 
< H obbsee> one ef fecti vely leads to the o ther,  i thoug ht
<Laser J o ck> well , I 'dstr ong l y  d isagree, buto k 
<Ho bb see> imay  have m y d efi nit ion swrong, th ough
<Fu ji ts u>  H obb see:I  wouldn' tbepa rti cular l y comf ortab le s po ns o rin g uploa d sf o r mo st  k * pa cka ge s, as  I d o n't  know t hem. Howe ver ,  I t re at  k* pac kages approxi ma tely equal ly  wh en doi n g  bug-stu ff.
<LaserJock> but I r e ally be lie ve th at i f it hadbee n some  Gn o me orJava o r wha te ver p ackag e s  w e'd  f eel the sa m e  wa y
<St ev enK>  Allowme to repeat mysel f .
< StevenK> Canwenotm o ve  th e  a r gum en t  to I RC, please?
<Fu jitsu> Ste ve n K:  Unfortuna t ely ,arguing  on a m ailin g  list o r blog is n't overl yeffe c t ive  or realti me.
<imb randon> L a serJo c k,  andtha ts mypo int , ifjava h a d b een d one li ke  thisin ed gy  ( and b efore iirc ) and approv ed asa spe c

<Hobbsee> LaserJock:_you're not_serious, are you?
<LaserJock> the_issue is_a_UVFe for_what_seems to me_to be not_a very strong case_for a UVFe
<imbrandon>_its_not the fact its KDE, if it was alsa, i would say the same_thing,_they arent_touching_it_and havent in the past_why care now
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: I_am, and_I really wish you guys wouldn't think that_people_*won't* touch KDE_stuff in Universe
<LaserJock> I don't care if it's Gnome,_KDE, XFCE, or FVWM
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: based_on how many_times_i've_had "can you sponsor_my upload?  sure, what is_it?  k*, oh, i dont_do kde stuff, sorry"
<imbrandon> LaserJock, it not_that its KDE specificly, as i_said it could be any_package set
<Hobbsee>_you dont need that too_many times, to_stop asking
<Hobbsee>_but that's moot.
<LaserJock>_Hobbsee: well, that's entirely different, IMO
<LaserJock>_not feeling comfortable_with a package for sponsorship is_really_different then being_bigoted_against_KDE
<LaserJock> which_seems to be_what_you're trying_to_say
<Hobbsee> one effectively leads to the_other,_i thought
<LaserJock> well, I'd strongly disagree, but_ok
<Hobbsee> i may have_my_definitions wrong, though
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee:_I wouldn't be particularly comfortable_sponsoring uploads for most k* packages,_as I_don't know_them. However, I treat k* packages approximately equally when doing bug-stuff.
<LaserJock>_but I really believe that if_it had been some_Gnome or_Java_or whatever packages_we'd_feel the_same way
<StevenK> Allow me to repeat myself.
<StevenK>_Can we_not move the argument to IRC,_please?
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Unfortunately, arguing_on_a mailing list or blog isn't_overly effective or realtime.
<imbrandon> LaserJock, and_thats my point, if java_had_been_done like this in edgy_( and before iirc ) and_approved as a_spec