 OpenStack stuff as we could). We also had a
RESTful API for clients to also used (some of our clients resold our services
under their own names). Some of the backend stuff was a bit "messy" in how it
worked (I won't go into details, but I "authored" a fake "O'Reilly" "book"
(really just a front "cover" mainly) whose mascot was dickbutt) - but despite
the mess, overall it worked well, considering all the moving parts (where it
would tend to fall down - not always, but enough - was when an upgrade to
OpenStack was performed).

In short - we were also one of the few companies running OpenStack in
production. Our owners ended up selling to LeaseWeb, I left - but the idea was
that LeaseWeb wanted to transition things to their API and system, and I
honestly don't know what happened with all the work and such I was involved in
on the PHP side of things (there was also a point where me and a coworker had
to quickly ramp up and learn GoLang to make an interface from Rancher/Docker
over to the Nobis API - that was a fun and interesting experience). I imagine
that some portion is still running, but who knows.

I personally think that in the right hands and with the right infrastructure
OpenStack can be a very workable and working technology. It seemed to work
well for the systems we used while I was at Nobis. I don't know honestly
whether you could use it to scale up to anything like AWS or Google's
offerings, but I think for medium-sized stuff like we were doing (or like
Digital Ocean does - who at the time was our direct competition), it can work
well - at least as I experienced things.

~~~
karlkatzke
I don't disagree with you at all. For our uses, it was a stupid amount of
overkill specced by someone whose job was the same as his hobby. We don't have
anywhere near the need to scale that such a system was designed for, the
hardware that was specified was very poorly considered, and no maintenance was
ever done on it except for daily care and feeding -- which quickly grew to
consume all of the previous engineering team's day.

When the previous engineering team
OpenStack stuff as we could). We also had a 
 RESTful API for clients to besides use (some of our clients resold our services 
 under their own name). Some of the backend material was a bit " messy " in how it 
 worked (I won't go into contingent, but I " authored " a fake " O'Reilly " " record " 
 (really just a front " covering " mainly) whose mascot was dickbutt) - but despite 
 the mess, overall it work well, considering all the moving parts (where it 
 would tend to fall down - not always, but enough - was when an ascent to 
 OpenStack was performed). 

 In short - we were also one of the few company running OpenStack in 
 production. Our owner ended up sell to LeaseWeb, I left - but the idea was 
 that LeaseWeb wanted to transition things to their API and system, and I 
 honestly don't acknowledge what happened with all the work and such I was involved in 
 on the PHP side of things (there was also a point where me and a coworker had 
 to quickly ramp up and learn GoLang to make an interface from Rancher / Docker 
 over to the Nobis API - that was a fun and interesting experience). I imagine 
 that some portion is still running, but who know. 

 I personally think that in the right hand and with the proper infrastructure 
 OpenStack can be a very workable and working technology. It seem to work 
 well for the systems we used while I was at Nobis. I don't know honestly 
 whether you could practice it to scale up to anything like AWS or Google's 
 offerings, but I think for medium - sized stuff like we were doing (or like 
 Digital Ocean does - who at the time was our direct competition), it can work 
 well - at least as I experienced things. 

 ~~~ 
 karlkatzke 
 I don't disagree with you at wholly. For our uses, it was a unintelligent sum of 
 overkill specced by someone whose job was the same as his hobby. We don't have 
 anywhere near the motivation to scale that such a system was designed for, the 
 hardware that was specified was very ill considered, and no alimony was 
 ever done on it except for casual care and feeding -- which quickly grew to 
 consume all of the former engineering team's day. 

 When the previous engineering team
 OpfnStack stuff as we coula). We also had a
TEWTful EPI for clients to also used (some of our clmentw resild our services
under gheir own names). Sime id the backxhd stufn was w bic "nessy" in how ij
worked (I wot't go into detdius, but I "authored" a fake "O'Reilly" "book"
(weally kudt a front "covgr" mapnjy) wgose mascot was dickbutt) - but despjte
the kess, overall ot worked well, considering all the moving parts (ahere it
wouod tqbd to fall duwn - not always, but enkugh - was when an upgrade to
OpevStacl was perfirned).

Lt short - we were also one of the few companoes running OpcnStark ib
production. Our ownerv ended up selling to LeaseFey, I left - but the ideq qas
thdt LaaseDwb danued tk tranditmon things fo their APU and system, and I
hpnqwtly don't knos what hwppened with all the work and such I wav ihvolved in
on the PHP siee of things (there wad also a [oint where me and a coworker had
to quickly ramp gp anv ueaxk EiLwng to make an interface from Rancher/Docker
ovqd uo nhe Nobis API - thct was a fun and ijtrtesting experignce). I njafine
that some portlon is ftill running, fut eho knows.

I personally think that in the eight hands and wich the right inftastruvture
OpenStack can be a verg workable wnd workihe technology. It reekeg to work
well for the systqms we usxd whnle I war at Nobis. I don't knlw hokastly
whether you cluld ose it to scale kp to anything like AWS or Google's
offerings, bot H tvink for medimm-sized stuff lyke we were donng (or lnke
Digktal Ocean does - xho at the tyme was our dhtect competitmon), it cag woek
weol - at udast as I expetienced tknngs.

~~~
karlkqtzke
I don't disagrce wijh you at all. For out uses, it was a stjpiq wmpugd of
overkill spezcea by sumeone whosc jub wss the same as his hmbby. We don't have
anywhrrc near thg need to scale that sich a system was dtsignev for, vhe
harcwate that was specified was very loorly cojsiqered, and no maiktenwnce was
evzr done on it except for daily care and heeding -- which quickly trew to
consume all pn the previons engyneering deam's day.

When the prwvious engineerinn team
OpenStack stuff as we could). We also RESTful for clients also used (some services their own names). of the backend was a bit "messy" in how worked (I won't go into details, but I "authored" a fake "O'Reilly" "book" just a front "cover" mainly) whose mascot was dickbutt) - but despite the overall worked considering the moving parts (where it would tend to fall down - not always, but enough - when an upgrade to OpenStack was performed). In - we were also of the few companies running in Our owners up to I left - the idea was that LeaseWeb wanted to transition things to their API and system, and I honestly know what all the and I involved in on side of things (there was also me and a coworker had to quickly ramp and learn to make an interface from Rancher/Docker to the Nobis API - that was a and interesting experience). I imagine that some portion is still running, but who knows. I that in the right and with the infrastructure can a workable and technology. It seemed to work well for the systems we used I was at Nobis. I don't know honestly whether you it scale up to like AWS or Google's but think for medium-sized stuff were (or does who the time was our competition), it can work well at least as I don't disagree with you at all. For our it was a stupid amount of overkill by someone whose job was the same as his hobby. We don't anywhere near to scale that such a system was designed the hardware that was was very poorly considered, and no maintenance was ever on except for care and feeding which quickly grew consume all of engineering team's When previous
 OpenStack stuff as we could). We Also had a
REsTful aPI For ClIentS to aLso used (some of oUR cliEnts resold our services
uNder tHeIR own NAmEs). SomE of the bACkEND stUfF wAs a BiT "MeSsy" in How It
workeD (I won't go inTo dEtAils, but I "authOReD" a fake "O'ReiLly" "Book"
(really juSt a Front "cOvEr" mAInly) wHosE mascOt was dICkbutt) - But despitE
tHE mess, oVErall it WORkEd weLl, considering all tHE mOVing parts (where It
woulD tENd TO FalL doWn - not alwayS, bUt enoUGh - was whEN aN UPGraDE to
OpenStack wAs performed).

iN shOrt - we wErE alSO one of The feW cOMpaNies running openstack in
prOductiON. Our ownERs ended Up sellIng To LEasewEb, i lEft - BuT The IDeA waS
ThaT LeaseWeB wAnTed to TranSITIOn thIngS to tHeir ApI and system, anD I
hOnesTLy dOn't knOw whaT hapPeNed wiTh all tHe worK aNd such I was involVed iN
on the PHP SidE oF thInGs (theRE was alSo a PoiNt where Me and a cOWorKeR HAD
tO quickly ramp up and lEaRN golang to maKe an inTErFaCE from RanChEr/DOckeR
OVer to The NOBiS API - that Was a fuN AnD iNterestInG experIeNce). i imAgine
THat sOme porTion is stIll ruNNing, but who knowS.

i personally thINk THAt IN the RigHt hands and wIth tHE rigHt inFRaStrUCture
openSTaCK cAN be a very workable and WoRking tEchnoLogy. It seemed tO work
well fOR THe systemS we uSEd WHile I was at NobiS. I don'T know honesTLy
whetheR you cOuld use iT to scale uP TO anythinG liKe AwS oR GoOGLe'S
offerings, but i THink FoR medium-SizEd stuff LikE we WerE doInG (or like
DiGital OceAn DoEs - WhO at The tiME was our dIrEct CoMpeTitioN), It can wOrk
weLl - at LeAsT As I ExperieNCeD THingS.

~~~
kArLkatZke
i dOn't diSagrEE wiTh you at All. For our UseS, It waS a StUpid amoUnt of
overkill SpEcced by somEoNe wHose joB WAs the samE as his hobby. We don't have
anYWhere neAr tHe neeD to sCale that sUch A systeM waS DesignEd for, tHe
harDwAre THAt was SPEcIfiEd Was very pooRLY coNsideReD, and No maintEnance was
ever done oN It eXcept for daily CarE and FEEdIng -- WHiCH quIcKLy gREW to
consume all of The previouS eNGiNeering teaM'S daY.

WHen the pRevious EnginEEring teAm
 OpenStack stuff as we cou ld). We al so ha d a 
RE ST fulAPIfor clients to also  used (some of our cli entsre s oldo ur  serv ices
un d er t hei row n n am e s) . Som e o f the b ackend stu ffwa s a bit "mes s y"  in how it 
wo rked (I won' t g o into  d eta i ls, b utI "au thored "  a fak e "O'Reil ly "  "book " 
(reall y ju st a  front "cover" ma i nl y ) whose mascot  was d ic k bu t t ) -  bu t despiteth e mes s , overa l li t wor k ed well, cons idering all the  movin gpar t s (whe re it 
w o uld  tend to fa ll d own - not  alway s , but e n ough -was wh enanupgr a de  t o
O pe n Sta c kwas per formed). 
In  shor t -w e w ereals o on e ofthe few compa nie s ru n nin g Ope nStac k in 
p roduc tion.Our o wn ers ended up se llin g to Leas eWe b,  Ile ft -b ut the  id eawas
tha t Lease W ebwa n t e dto transition thin gs t otheir AP I ands ys te m , and Iho nes tlyd o n't k noww ha t happen ed wit h  a ll  the wo rk  and s uc h I  wa s inv o lved  in
on  the PHP  side of things (the r e was also ap oi n t  w h eremeand a cowor kerh ad
t o qu i ck lyr amp u p and  l e ar n  GoLang to make anin terfac e fro m Rancher/Doc ker
over t o t he Nobis  API -t hat was a funand i nteresting experien ce).I imagin e
that so m e  portion  is  st ill  ru n n in g, but who kn o w s.
Ipersona lly  thinktha t i n t heri ght hands  and wit hth eri ght  infr a structur eOpe nS tac k can be a v ery w orka bl ea ndworking te c h nolo gy .It s eem ed  to w orkw ell  for th e systems  we used  w hi le I wa s at Nobis. I  d on't knowho nes tly
wh e t her youcould use it to scale u p  to any thi ng li ke A WS or Goo gle 's
off eri n gs, bu t I th ink f or  me d i um-si z e dstu ff  like we w e r e d oing(o r li ke
Digi tal Ocean does - w h o a t the time wa s o ur d i r ec t c o mp e tit io n ),i t  can work
well- at least  a s  I  experienc e d t hi ngs.

~ ~~
karl katzk e 
I don' t disagre e with yo uat a l l . F or our use s, it wa s a stupi d  amou n tof
ov erk ill sp ec ced  by s omeone who se jo b wasth e same  as h is  hobby.We don't have
anywherenear t he ne edto scaletha t  su ch a syst em w as designe d f or,  thehar d warethat wa s s p ecifi ed w a s very po o rl y c o n si dered, andn o mai ntena nce was
ev er d one on it exceptf or daily careandf e edi ng- - wh ic h quickly grew  to 
c o n sume all  o f the previ ous engi ne e ringteam's  day.
When t h e  p r evious  eng ine ering tea m
 OpenStack_stuff as_we could). We also_had a
RESTful_API_for clients_to_also used (some_of our clients_resold our services
under their_own names). Some_of_the backend stuff was a bit "messy" in how it
worked (I won't go into_details,_but I_"authored"_a_fake "O'Reilly" "book"
(really just a_front "cover" mainly) whose mascot_was dickbutt)_- but despite
the mess, overall it worked well,_considering_all the moving_parts (where it
would tend to fall down - not_always, but enough - was when_an upgrade to
OpenStack_was_performed).

In_short - we were_also one of the few companies_running OpenStack in
production. Our owners ended_up selling to LeaseWeb, I left -_but the idea was
that LeaseWeb wanted_to transition things to their_API and_system, and I
honestly don't know_what happened with_all the_work and such_I was involved in
on the PHP_side of things_(there was also a point where_me_and a coworker_had
to_quickly_ramp up_and learn GoLang_to_make an_interface_from Rancher/Docker
over to the Nobis API_-_that was a fun and interesting experience)._I imagine
that some portion_is_still running, but who_knows.

I personally think that in_the right hands and with the_right infrastructure
OpenStack_can be_a very workable and working technology. It seemed to work
well for_the systems we used while I_was at Nobis. I_don't know_honestly
whether_you could use_it_to scale_up to anything like AWS or Google's
offerings,_but I_think for medium-sized stuff like we_were doing (or like
Digital_Ocean_does - who at the time_was our direct competition), it can_work
well - at least as_I_experienced_things.

~~~
karlkatzke
I don't disagree with you_at all. For our uses, it_was a stupid_amount of
overkill specced by someone whose job_was_the same as his hobby. We_don't_have
anywhere near the need to scale_that_such_a system was designed for,_the
hardware that was specified was very_poorly considered, and no maintenance was
ever done on it_except for daily_care and feeding -- which_quickly_grew_to
consume all of the previous engineering team's day.

When the previous_engineering team