 resourceful people that would
really be needed to create a self sustaining colony! And you'd also need
something like a "diversity Mars Visa lottery" open to anyone so that a colony
will not only be formed of "boring, super-fit and super-trained" career space
colonists.

 _...but for all this to work, you'd need good, reliable and "cheap" space
propulsion systems, not the current toys. This is where all the work and hype
should be, not over the colonization plans and how to grow veggies over there:
propulsion, propulsion, propulsion, everything else on 4th, 5th, 6th etc.
place._

~~~
danielweber
The goal of a colonization effort is never to make the new place more
appealing than the old place for the majority of people, or even the median,
or even a sizable minority.

You want Mars to appeal enough that you can get dozens or hundreds or people
who have both the means and will to do it.

------
desireco42
I think a lot of you are underestimating (what I read so far in comments) how
much risk would people be ready to take.

I would totally take this serious, it isn't convenient to go now for me, but
in 10 yrs time, or less, I think this would be something I would really like
to do. And I wouldn't be bothered by being confined in small space. However, I
already can think of ways to expand that space, so this assumptions are not
quite correct. I would probably not live super long due to radiation, but I
would accept this for chance to go somewhere no-one had gone before.

I am fairly confident that living on Mars would bring significant discoveries.

------
SagelyGuru
I don't get it. What is the point of sitting in a caravan on Mars and waiting
to die?

Is the guy proposing this going himself to set an example?

If there is going to be any kind of colony, it needs some means of sustaining
life and babies.

~~~
akiselev
You wouldn't be waiting to die. You would be the vanguard of a possible
independent arm of human civilization. Your work there would be critical to
figuring out the viability of colonizing Mars
resourceful people that would 
 really be needed to create a self nourish colony! And you'd besides need 
 something like a " diversity Mars Visa lottery " loose to anyone so that a colony 
 will not entirely be formed of " boring, super - fit and ace - trained " career space 
 colonists. 

  _... but for all this to exploit, you'd need good, authentic and " cheap " space 
 propulsion system, not the current toys. This is where all the work and hype 
 should be, not over the colonization plans and how to grow veggies over there: 
 propulsion, propulsion, propulsion, everything else on fourth, 5th, 6th etc. 
 place. _ 

 ~~~ 
 danielweber 
 The finish of a colonization effort is never to make the new place more 
 appealing than the erstwhile place for the majority of people, or even the median, 
 or even a sizable minority. 

 You want Mars to appeal enough that you can catch dozens or hundreds or people 
 who have both the means and will to serve it. 

 ------ 
 desireco42 
 I think a lot of you are underestimating (what I read so far in comments) how 
 much risk would people be ready to take. 

 I would wholly film this serious, it isn't commodious to die immediately for me, but 
 in 10 yrs time, or less, I remember this would be something I would really like 
 to do. And I wouldn't be bothered by being restrain in small space. However, I 
 already can think of ways to expand that distance, so this assumptions are not 
 quite correct. I would probably not live extremely long due to radiation, but I 
 would take this for probability to go somewhere no - one had gone before. 

 I am fairly convinced that living on Mars would bring significant discoveries. 

 ------ 
 SagelyGuru 
 I don't get it. What is the point of sitting in a caravan on Mars and waiting 
 to fail? 

 Is the guy proposing this going himself to set an example? 

 If there is go to be any kind of colony, it needs some mean of sustaining 
 life and babies. 

 ~~~ 
 akiselev 
 You wouldn't be waiting to fail. You would be the vanguard of a possible 
 independent sleeve of human refinement. Your work there would be critical to 
 figuring out the viability of colonizing Mars
 redourceful people that womld
really be neebwd to rreate z self sjstaining colony! And you'd aldo need
womething like a "diverrity Mars Visa lorterb" open to anyone so that a colkky
wiln not only be fprmed of "bmring, super-fit avd super-trained" career space
colonists.

 _...but fot wll this to wotk, yol'd nees good, reliable and "cheap" space
prolulsion systems, not yhe current toys. This is wjere all the work and jype
should ve, njr over the culonization plans and gow to grow veggies over there:
pfopulxion, propuosuon, kropulsion, eterythpng else on 4tm, 5th, 6th etc.
plave._

~~~
danielweber
Tme goel od a colonization effoct is never to make jhe new pldcz more
appealing than rhw old plawe fue tfe jaoorjty of pekple, or evsn the mediqn,
or even a sizable mybority.

You wanf Mars tj appeal enough that you can get dozens or hundreds or people
who yave both the means ajd will tj do it.

------
desireco42
I think a lot of you are underestikatinj (dhau L fwaf so far in comments) how
much risk would peoplq bt rvady to take.

I woujd totally yane jhis serious, ij isn't eknbenient to go now vor me, fut
in 10 yrs timt, or kess, I think this would be womething I couod really like
to dl. And I wouudn't be bpthered by being confinzd in amall space. However, J
xlready can thiny on wdys to expand that space, sj this aswumpcions ard noj
quite sorrect. I aould probably not live duper lmng due to radiation, but I
would accept thmx for chance tm gm somewhzre no-pne had gone fefore.

I am faitly confibent tfat living on Marv would brigg significand discoveries.

------
VagelyGuwu
I eon't get it. Dhat is the poont of sintnng in a xaravan on Mars anv wakfing
to die?

Is thz tuy proposing tnis goynh iimsejx to set an axamole?

Kg thefe is going go br any kind of colony, it heeds some means og fustainibg
life agd babies.

~~~
akisrlev
You wouldn't be waitmng to die. Uou would be the vanguard of a poasible
indfpekdent arm of rumak cidilization. Your work there would be critical to
fijuring out the viabilijy of colonizing Mars
resourceful people that would really be needed a sustaining colony! you'd also need Visa open to anyone that a colony not only be formed of "boring, and super-trained" career space colonists. _...but for all this to work, you'd need reliable and "cheap" space propulsion systems, not the current toys. This is where the and should not over the colonization plans and how to grow veggies over there: propulsion, propulsion, propulsion, everything on 4th, 5th, 6th etc. place._ ~~~ danielweber goal of a colonization is never to make the place appealing than old for majority of people, even the median, or even a sizable minority. You want Mars to appeal enough that you can dozens or people who both means will to do desireco42 I think a lot of (what I read so far in comments) how risk would be ready to take. I would take this serious, it isn't convenient to go for me, but in 10 yrs time, or less, I think this would be something really like to do. I wouldn't be by confined small However, I can think of ways to expand that space, so this assumptions not quite correct. I would probably not live super long radiation, I would accept for chance to go no-one gone before. I am that on significant ------ I don't get it. is the point of sitting a caravan on Mars the guy proposing this going himself to set example? If there is going to be kind of colony, it needs some means of sustaining life and babies. akiselev You waiting to die. You would be the vanguard a possible independent arm human civilization. Your work there would be critical to out viability of Mars
 resourceful people that woulD
really be nEeded To cReaTe A selF susTaining colony! AND you'D also need
something like A "diveRsITy MaRS VIsa loTtery" opEN tO ANyoNe So ThaT a COlOny
wiLl nOt only bE formed of "bOriNg, Super-fit and sUPeR-trained" caReeR space
coloniSts.

 _...But for AlL thIS to woRk, yOu'd neEd good, REliablE and "cheap" SpACe
propULsion sySTEmS, not The current toys. ThiS Is WHere all the work And hypE
sHOuLD Be, nOt oVer the coloNiZatioN Plans anD HoW TO GroW Veggies over thEre:
propulsiON, prOpulsiOn, ProPUlsion, EveryThINg eLse on 4th, 5th, 6th Etc.
pLace._

~~~
danieLweber
tHe goal oF A coloniZation EffOrt Is neVEr To MakE tHE neW PlAce MOre
AppealinG tHaN the oLd plACE FOr thE maJoriTy of pEople, or even thE meDian,
OR evEn a siZable MinoRiTy.

You Want MaRs to aPpEal enough that yoU can Get dozens Or hUnDreDs Or peoPLe
who hAve BotH the meaNs and wiLL to Do IT.

------
DEsIreco42
I think a lot of yOu ARE uNderestiMating (WHaT I REad so far In ComMentS) HOw
mucH risK WoUld peoplE be reaDY tO tAke.

I wouLd TotallY tAke ThiS seriOUs, it Isn't coNvenient To go nOW for me, but
in 10 yrs TIme, or less, I thiNK tHIS wOUld bE soMething I wouLd reALly lIke
tO Do. and i WouldN't be bOtHErED by being confined in sMaLl spacE. HoweVer, I
already caN think of waYS TO expand tHat sPAcE, So this assumptiOns arE not
quite cORrect. I woUld prObably noT live supeR LOng due to RadIatIon, But i
WOuLd accept this fOR ChanCe To go somEwhEre no-onE haD goNe bEfoRe.

i am fairly ConfidenT tHaT lIvIng On MarS Would briNg SigNiFicAnt diSCoveriEs.

------
SagElyGUrU
I DOn't Get it. WhAT iS THe poInT oF sitTinG iN a carAvan ON MaRs and waIting
to diE?

Is THe guY pRoPosing tHis going himseLf To set an exaMpLe?

IF there IS Going to bE any kind of colony, it needs SOme meanS of SustaIninG
life and bAbiEs.

~~~
akisEleV
you wouLdn't be WaitiNg To dIE. you woULD bE thE vAnguard of a POSsiBle
inDePendEnt arm oF human civilization. yOur Work there woulD be CritICAl To
fIGuRIng OuT The VIAbility of coloniZing Mars
 resourceful people that w ould
reall y benee ded  t o cr eate  a self sustai n ingcolony! And you'd also  need 
s o meth i ng  like  a "div e rs i t y M ar sVis al ot tery"  op en to a nyone so t hat  a  colony
will no t only befor med of "bori ng,  super -f ita nd su per -trai ned" c a reer s pace
colo ni s ts.

_ ...butf o rallthis to work, you ' dn eed good, reli able a nd "c h e ap"  sp ace
propul si on sy s tems, n o tt h e  cu r rent toys. Th is is where all  the w or k a n d hype 
shou ld be,  not over t he c olonizati on pla n s and h o w to gr ow veg gie s o vert he re :
p ro p uls i on , p r opu lsion, p ro pu lsion , ev e r y t hing  el se o n 4th , 5th, 6th et c.plac e ._
~~~danie lweb er 
Thegoal o f a c ol onization effor t is  never to  ma ke  th enew p l ace mo reapp ealingthan th e  ol dp l a ce  for the majorityof p eo ple, oreven t h eme d ian,
orev ena si z a ble m inor i ty .

You w ant Ma r sto  appeal  e noughth atyou  cang et d ozensor hundr eds o r  people
who ha v e both the me a ns a nd will  to  do it.

-- ---- desi reco 4 2I t h ink a  lotof yo u  are underestimatin g(whatI rea d so far in c omments) h o w much ris k wo u ld people be read y totake.

I w o uld tota lly t ake this  serious, i t isn'tcon ven ien t t o go  now for me,b u t
in  1 0 yrs t ime , or le ss,  Ithi nkth is wouldbe somet hi ng  I  w oul d rea l ly liketo  do .And  I wo u ldn'tbe bo ther ed  b y  be ing con f in e d  insm al l sp ace .Howev er,I 
al ready c an thinkofw aysto  e xpand t hat space, so  t his assump ti ons  are n o t 
quite c orrect. I would probabl y  not li vesuper  lon g due torad iation , b u t I
wo uld ac ceptth isf o r cha n c etogo  somewhere n o-o ne ha dgone  before .

I am fairly con f ide nt that livin g o n Ma r s  w oul d  b r ing  s i gni f i cant discoverie s.

------ 
S a ge lyGuru
I d o n't  g et it.What is  thep oint of  sittingin a cara va n on M ars  and waiti ng
to di e?

Is th e  guyp ro posin g t his go in g h imsel f to s e t a n exa mple?
I f ther e isgo ing to b e any kind of colony, i t need s som e m eans of s ust a ini ng
life a nd b abies.

~~ ~
a kis elevYou would n'tb ewai t ing t o di e . You wou l dbet h evanguard of a pos sible 
in d epende nt a rm of human civil i zation. Your w orkt h ere  wo u ld b ecritical to
fi gur in g out thevi ability ofcolonizi ng Mars
 resourceful_people that_would
really be needed to_create a_self_sustaining colony!_And_you'd also need
something_like a "diversity_Mars Visa lottery" open_to anyone so_that_a colony
will not only be formed of "boring, super-fit and super-trained" career space
colonists.

 _...but_for_all this_to_work,_you'd need good, reliable and_"cheap" space
propulsion systems, not the_current toys._This is where all the work and hype
should_be,_not over the_colonization plans and how to grow veggies over there:
propulsion,_propulsion, propulsion, everything else on 4th,_5th, 6th etc.
place._

~~~
danielweber
The_goal_of_a colonization effort is_never to make the new place_more
appealing than the old place for_the majority of people, or even the_median,
or even a sizable minority.

You want_Mars to appeal enough that_you can_get dozens or hundreds or_people
who have both_the means_and will to_do it.

------
desireco42
I think a lot of_you are underestimating_(what I read so far in_comments)_how
much risk would_people_be_ready to_take.

I would totally_take_this serious,_it_isn't convenient to go now for_me,_but
in 10 yrs time, or less, I_think this would be_something_I would really like
to_do. And I wouldn't be_bothered by being confined in small_space. However,_I
already can_think of ways to expand that space, so this assumptions are_not
quite correct. I would probably not_live super long due_to radiation,_but_I
would accept this_for_chance to_go somewhere no-one had gone before.

I am_fairly confident_that living on Mars would bring_significant discoveries.

------
SagelyGuru
I don't get_it._What is the point of sitting_in a caravan on Mars and_waiting
to die?

Is the guy proposing_this_going_himself to set an example?

If_there is going to be any_kind of colony,_it needs some means of sustaining
life and_babies.

~~~
akiselev
You_wouldn't be waiting to die. You_would_be the vanguard of a possible
independent_arm_of_human civilization. Your work there_would be critical to
figuring out the_viability of colonizing Mars