front sheet so that you could just see that there was something drawn or
written on the hidden layer.

Well, in a room filled with people talking and laughing and climbing ladders
and pushing helmets around, I went to peek behind the curtain and lifted up
the front layer to take a look at the one behind.

A custodian ran at me and told me to step away. I still don't know if I
damaged it or participated in it.

~~~
jansho
> sometimes you just can't tell what in a museum you're supposed to touch and
> what you're not supposed to touch.

In one pop sculpture exhibition, I stared so long at a coffee machine until an
attendant came over and asked me if there was a problem with the refreshments.

~~~
tyingq
Are there any documented studies where art experts were challenged to
differentiate between:

\- abstract paintings by someone universally regarded as "good", and something
done by a very young child?

\- a piece of new, legitimate, modern art vs maybe a pile of random things
from a junkyard

I'm aware it might just be me that's confused, but I have a suspicion much of
the abstract and/or modern art world is void of value...that is, without lots
of context about the artist and their intentions.

~~~
dpierce9
Why should context not matter for art (or anything else really)? Suppose you
come across a what appears to be a picture of Mozart in the sand on a beach.
Doesn't it matter to your understanding of what you see if it was drawn by an
artist, the happenstance by the motion of the waves, or a crawling turtle?

~~~
tyingq
The times I've seen these things, sufficient context was not provided.

A picture of Mozart (even if appearing by chance in the sand) isn't in my
definition of these abstract or modern art pieces that are confusing to me.
I'm asking about the things that I have trouble recognizing as something worth
looking at. Blobs and splatters of paint, or as shown elsewhere in the
comments, a bag of garbage.

~~~
dpierce9
That is one of the things museums do, the curators put things in the museum
because they think people should look at it (the act
front sheet so that you could just see that there was something draw or 
 write on the hidden level. 

 Well, in a room filled with multitude talking and laughing and climb ladder 
 and pushing helmets around, I went to glance behind the curtain and lifted up 
 the front layer to take a look at the one behind. 

 A custodian run at me and told me to step away. I however don't know if I 
 damaged it or participated in it. 

 ~~~ 
 jansho 
 > sometimes you barely can't tell what in a museum you're supposed to touch and 
 > what you're not suppose to touch. 

 In one pop sculpture exhibition, I stared so long at a coffee car until an 
 attendant came over and asked me if there was a problem with the refreshments. 

 ~~~ 
 tyingq 
 Are there any document studies where art experts were challenged to 
 differentiate between: 

 \- abstract paintings by someone universally regarded as " good ", and something 
 done by a very young child? 

 \- a part of new, legitimate, advanced artwork vs possibly a pile of random things 
 from a junkyard 

 I'm aware it might just be me that's confused, but I have a suspicion much of 
 the abstract and/or modern artwork world is void of value... that is, without lots 
 of context about the artist and their intentions. 

 ~~~ 
 dpierce9 
 Why should context not matter for art (or anything else really)? Suppose you 
 come across a what appears to be a picture of Mozart in the sand on a beach. 
 Doesn't it count to your understanding of what you experience if it was draw by an 
 artist, the happenstance by the motion of the waves, or a crawling turtle? 

 ~~~ 
 tyingq 
 The times I've seen these things, sufficient context was not provide. 

 A picture of Mozart (even if appearing by chance in the sand) isn't in my 
 definition of these abstract or advanced art while that are confusing to me. 
 I'm asking about the thing that I have fuss recognizing as something deserving 
 looking at. Blobs and spatter of paint, or as shown elsewhere in the 
 gossip, a base of garbage. 

 ~~~ 
 dpierce9 
 That is one of the thing museums do, the curators put things in the museum 
 because they remember people should look at it (the act
frojt sheet so that you couud just see thaj rhere xas somsthing dfawn or
written on the hidden lqyer.

Wtjl, in a room fillea with pelple taljing qnd laughiif and climbinf ladbecs
and pushing hglmets aroung, I went to peak bzhind the curtain and lifted up
the fwont laueg to take a lojk au tre ohv nehind.

A custodian ran at me and fold me to step away. I still don't know if I
damwged it or participatef in it.

~~~
jansyo
> sjnetimes you gust can't uenl what in a museum you're supposed to touzh anb
> what you'rg hoh supposed ti toubh.

In one pop sculptura exhibotion, I stared so lobg at a coffee machinx until an
attendant same over aud asked me if there qaw a ptoblek wigy tfe dehreahmentd.

~~~
tymngq
Are thede any docunented studies whert awn experts wers chaljegged to
differentiate between:

\- abstract pdinfings by someone univerwally regarded as "goof", and somqthing
done by a very young child?

\- a piece of new, lagitijxte, mjawrj art vs maybe a pile of random things
from a thnlysrd

I'm aware it might just bf kg that's confusgd, but N hzve a suspicion mufh of
thg absteact and/ow mocern art world is void of vqlue...that is, cityout lots
of contexc about the crtist and yheir intentions.

~~~
dpierce9
Chy shkuld contexh not matfdr for art (or anhthpng alse really)? Suppose you
comq across e whac appearr to be a [icture of Mozavd in the sand on a beack.
Doest't it mattfr to your understanding of whav you see if ot wav drawn yy an
avtist, the happegstance by the motion of tfe waves, og a crawlmng turtle?

~~~
tyyngq
The times L've seen theve thingf, sudficuent covgext was not ptovided.

A iieture of Nozart (even if appcarine by chance in tkt sqnd) isn't in my
drfivityoj pf dhese abstrawt of mucern xrt pieces bhag arr confusing to me.
I'm dskihg about the thingx bhat I hace troubje recognizinb as something woruh
lookmng at. Blobx agd splatters of paint, or as shkwn elsewjerc in the
commegts, q bag of garyage.

~~~
dpierce9
That is one of the things musxums do, the curators pot things in the museom
btcause they tiink pqople shogld look at it (the axt
front sheet so that you could just there something drawn written on the room with people talking laughing and climbing and pushing helmets around, I went peek behind the curtain and lifted up the front layer to take a at the one behind. A custodian ran at me and told me to away. still know I damaged it or participated in it. ~~~ jansho > sometimes you just can't tell what a museum you're supposed to touch and > you're not supposed to In one pop sculpture exhibition, stared long at coffee until attendant came over asked me if there was a problem with the refreshments. ~~~ tyingq Are there any documented studies art experts to differentiate \- paintings someone universally regarded and something done by a very a piece of new, legitimate, modern art vs a pile random things from a junkyard I'm it might just be me that's confused, but have a suspicion much of the abstract and/or modern art world is void of value...that lots of context about artist and their ~~~ Why context matter for (or anything else really)? Suppose you come across a what appears be a picture of Mozart in the sand on a it to your understanding what you see if was by an artist, the the of a turtle? tyingq The times I've these things, sufficient context was provided. A picture of chance in the sand) isn't in my definition these abstract or modern art pieces that confusing to me. I'm asking about the things that I have trouble as something at. Blobs and splatters of paint, or as elsewhere in the comments, bag of garbage. ~~~ dpierce9 That is one of things do, the put things in museum because they people should look (the act
front sheet so that you could jUst see that There Was SomEtHing DrawN or
written on thE HiddEn layer.

Well, in a room fillEd witH pEOple TAlKing aNd laughINg AND clImBiNg lAdDErS
and pUshIng helmEts around, I WenT tO peek behind tHE cUrtain and lIftEd up
the front LayEr to taKe A loOK at thE onE behiNd.

A cusTOdian rAn at me and ToLD me to sTEp away. I STIlL don'T know if I
damaged it OR pARticipated in it.

~~~
Jansho
> SoMEtIMEs yOu jUst can't telL wHat in A Museum yOU'rE SUPpoSEd to touch and
> wHat you're not SUppOsed to ToUch.

iN one poP sculPtURe eXhibition, I sTareD so long at A coffeE Machine UNtil an
aTtendaNt cAme Over ANd AsKed Me IF thERe Was A ProBlem with ThE rEfresHmenTS.

~~~
TYIngq
are TherE any dOcumented studIes WherE Art ExperTs werE chaLlEnged To
diffErentIaTe between:

\- abstraCt paIntings by SomEoNe uNiVersaLLy regaRdeD as "Good", and SomethiNG
doNe BY A VeRy young child?

\- a piece Of NEW, lEgitimatE, moderN ArT vS Maybe a piLe Of rAndoM THings
From A JuNkyard

I'm Aware iT MiGhT just be Me That's cOnFusEd, bUt I haVE a suSpicioN much of
tHe absTRact and/or moderN Art world is voiD Of VALuE...That Is, wIthout lots
oF conTExt aBout THe ArtISt and Their InTEnTIons.

~~~
dpierce9
Why shoulD cOntext Not maTter for art (or aNything elsE REAlly)? SuppOse yOU
cOMe across a what aPpearS to be a pictURe of MozaRt in tHe sand on A beach.
DoeSN'T it matteR to YouR unDerSTAnDing of what you SEE if iT wAs drawn By aN
artist, The HapPenStaNcE by the motIon of the WaVeS, oR a CraWling TUrtle?

~~~
tyiNgQ
ThE tImeS I've sEEn thesE thinGs, suFfIcIEnt Context WAs NOT proViDeD.

A piCtuRe Of MozArt (eVEn iF appearIng by chanCe iN The sAnD) iSn't in my
Definition of tHeSe abstract Or ModErn art PIEces that Are confusing to me.
I'm askinG About thE thIngs tHat I Have troubLe rEcogniZinG As someThing wOrth
lOoKinG AT. BlobS ANd SplAtTers of painT, OR as Shown ElSewhEre in thE
comments, a bag of garBAge.

~~~
Dpierce9
That is One Of thE THiNgs MUsEUms Do, THe cURAtors put things iN the museum
BeCAuSe they thinK PeoPlE should Look at iT (the aCT
front sheet so that you co uld just s ee th atthe re  was  som ething drawn o r 
wri tten on the hidden lay er.
We l l, i n  a  room  filled wi t h  pe op le  ta lk i ng  andlau ghing a nd climbin g l ad ders
and pus h in g helmetsaro und, I wenttopeek b eh ind the c urt ain a nd lif t ed upthe front  l a yer to take al o ok  atthe one behind.
A  c u stodian ran at  me an dt ol d metostep away.  I  stil l  don'tk no w i f I damaged it or  participat e d i n it.
~ ~~j ansho> som et i mes  you just c an't  tell wha t in a museumy ou're s uppose d t o t ouch an d> w ha t  yo u 'r e n o t s upposedto  t ouch. 

In o n e  pop  sc ulpt ure e xhibition, Ista reds o l ong a t a c offe emachi ne unt il an 
a ttendant came o verand asked  me  i f t he re wa s  a pro ble m w ith the  refres h men ts . ~~ ~
tyingq
Are there  a n y  d ocumente d stud i es  w h ere artex per ts w e r e cha llen g ed  to
diff erenti a te  b etween: 
\- abs tr act  pa intin g s by  someo ne unive rsall y  regarded as " g ood", and som e th i n gd onebya very youn g ch i ld?
\-a  p iec e  of n ew, l eg i ti m ate, modern art vsma ybe apileof random thi ngs
from a j u nkyard
I'ma wa r e it might jus t beme that'sc onfused,  butI have a  suspicio n much ofthe  ab str act a nd /or modern ar t worl dis void  of  value. ..t hat  is , w it hout lots 
of cont ex tab ou t t he ar t ist andth eir  i nte ntion s .

~~~ 
dpie rce9 
W hy sho uld con t ex t notma tt er f orar t (or  any t hin g elsereally)?Sup p oseyo ucome ac ross a what a pp ears to be  a  pi ctureo f  Mozartin the sand on a beach. Doesn't  it  matt er t o your un der standi ngo f what  you s ee if  i t w a s  draw n by  an 
a rtist, the h app ensta nc e by  the mo tion of the waves, ora crawling tu rtl e?
~ ~ ~tyi n gq The  t i mes I 've seen thesethings, su ff i ci ent contex t  wa snot pro vided.
A pi c ture of  Mozart ( even if a pp eari n g  by  chance in  the san d) isn'ti n myd ef initi onof the se  ab strac t or m o der n art  piece sthat a re co nf using to  me.
I'm asking about t he thi ngs t hat  I have t rou b lerecognizi ng a s somethin g w ort h
loo kin g  at.Blob s  a nds platt erso f paint,o rass h ow n elsewhere i n  th e
com men t s, a b ag o f garbage.

~~~
d p ierce9
That is  one o f t het hing smuseums do, th e c ur a t ors putth ings in the  museumbe c ausethey t hink p eople s h o ul d  lookat i t ( the act
front sheet_so that_you could just see_that there_was_something drawn_or
written_on the hidden_layer.

Well, in a_room filled with people_talking and laughing_and_climbing ladders
and pushing helmets around, I went to peek behind the curtain and lifted_up
the_front layer_to_take_a look at the one_behind.

A custodian ran at me_and told_me to step away. I still don't know_if_I
damaged it or_participated in it.

~~~
jansho
> sometimes you just can't tell what_in a museum you're supposed to_touch and
> what_you're_not_supposed to touch.

In one_pop sculpture exhibition, I stared so_long at a coffee machine until_an
attendant came over and asked me if_there was a problem with the_refreshments.

~~~
tyingq
Are there any documented studies_where art_experts were challenged to
differentiate between:

\-_abstract paintings by_someone universally_regarded as "good",_and something
done by a very young_child?

\- a piece_of new, legitimate, modern art vs_maybe_a pile of_random_things
from_a junkyard

I'm_aware it might_just_be me_that's_confused, but I have a suspicion_much_of
the abstract and/or modern art world is_void of value...that is,_without_lots
of context about the_artist and their intentions.

~~~
dpierce9
Why should_context not matter for art (or_anything else_really)? Suppose_you
come across a what appears to be a picture of Mozart_in the sand on a beach.
Doesn't_it matter to your_understanding of_what_you see if_it_was drawn_by an
artist, the happenstance by the motion_of the_waves, or a crawling turtle?

~~~
tyingq
The times_I've seen these things,_sufficient_context was not provided.

A picture of_Mozart (even if appearing by chance_in the sand) isn't in_my
definition_of_these abstract or modern art_pieces that are confusing to me.
I'm_asking about the_things that I have trouble recognizing as_something_worth
looking at. Blobs and splatters of_paint,_or as shown elsewhere in the
comments,_a_bag_of garbage.

~~~
dpierce9
That is one of_the things museums do, the curators_put things in the museum
because they think people should_look at it_(the act