like DRMed barbed-wired
gardens. Streaming should be a convenience, not a way to restrict copying.
Others brought Steam as an example - for Steam, there is competing GOG which
is DRM free and proves the point that DRM free gaming without regional
restrictions and other such junk can be successful. So what is there for
Netflix?

Also, I didn't get his point about the music industry. Most music is easily
available DRM free, _unlike_ video.

~~~
methodin
I don't think most people expect DRM-free content when paying for a
subscription model - I know I don't. I'm paying for the right to access that
content when I want as long as it's available but I am under no assumption
that I assume the right to take that content with me and do with it what I
please. That type of content is completely different than what this streaming
model represents. Netflix is surely on a better trajectory here than other
providers, no?

~~~
shmerl
It's not better as long as there is DRM in it. Why can't you expect to get the
content with you? You can expect paying for titles some one time fee. Not
unlike music and games. Streaming is just a way of accessing it from the
"cloud" without the need to download it first. But why should it prevent you
from downloading if you want to back it up, take it with you somewhere where
you have no access to the cloud and so on? There is no good reason for
"subscription model" in the digital world which restricts your ability to
copy. Buy and use, that's what it's supposed to be.

~~~
smtddr
_> But why should it prevent you from downloading if you want to back it up,
take it with you somewhere where you have no access to the cloud and so on?_

That's the real problem; that internet is not accessible & free everywhere. I
think DRM is fine as long as I can access my media anytime & anywhere on all
my devices. Netflix pretty much fits this requirement aside from the hack of
Linux+Netflix. The issue that internet isn't available to every human being or
costs a ridiculous amount of money is a problem that needs to be fixed. I want
to be able to say "Everyone has internet these days"
like DRMed barbed - wired 
 gardens. Streaming should be a public toilet, not a direction to restrict copying. 
 Others brought Steam as an example - for Steam, there be competing GOG which 
 is DRM free and test the point that DRM free gambling without regional 
 restriction and other such debris can be successful. So what is there for 
 Netflix? 

 Also, I didn't get his point about the music diligence. Most music is easily 
 available DRM free, _ unlike _ video recording. 

 ~~~ 
 methodin 
 I don't think most people ask DRM - free content when paying for a 
 subscription mannequin - I know I don't. I'm paying for the right to access that 
 message when I want as long as it's available but I am under no assumption 
 that I assume the right to lease that content with me and do with it what I 
 please. That type of content is completely unlike than what this cyclosis 
 mannequin represents. Netflix is surely on a better trajectory here than other 
 providers, no? 

 ~~~ 
 shmerl 
 It's not better as long as there is DRM in it. Why can't you ask to get the 
 content with you? You can have a bun in the oven pay up for titles some one time fee. Not 
 unlike music and games. cyclosis is just a direction of accessing it from the 
 " cloud " without the motivation to download it first. But why should it prevent you 
 from downloading if you want to back it up, take it with you somewhere where 
 you have no entree to the cloud and so on? There is no good reason for 
 " subscription model " in the digital universe which restricts your ability to 
 copy. Buy and use, that's what it's supposed to be. 

 ~~~ 
 smtddr 
 _ > But why should it prevent you from download if you want to back it up, 
 take it with you somewhere where you have no access to the cloud and so on? _ 

 That's the real trouble; that internet is not accessible & free everywhere. I 
 think DRM is fine as long as I can access my media anytime & anywhere on all 
 my device. Netflix pretty a lot fits this requirement aside from the hack of 
 Linux+Netflix. The consequence that internet isn't available to every human being or 
 costs a farcical sum of money is a problem that want to be fixed. I want 
 to be able to say " Everyone has internet these days "
likf DRMed barbed-wired
gardeks. Streaming shoole be a convehience, nut a way to restrict copying.
Ltyers vrought Steam as an exxmple - fog Steam, tyere us competiif GOG wmnch
is FRM yrxe and proves tme point thdt DRM free gakivg without regional
restrictions and oeher suvh junk can be soccesxsul. Ao what is there for
Netflix?

Also, I sidn't gtt his point about the music industry. Most mksic is easily
availablf DRM free, _ohlihw_ video.

~~~
methoain
I don't uhnnk most pekple expect DRM-free content whev paynng for a
suvsxriojion model - M know I don't. I'm paying fos the roght to access thet
cobtent when I want as nong as it's availafle but I aj under no assumpriin
thaj I avsumd thd rjgit fo takf tiat content with me ane do with it what I
klewwe. That type kf coneegt is completely different than what thps sfreaming
model representw. Netflix is surely oj a bettew trajectory here than other
providers, no?

~~~
shmerl
It's not uegtex as lubg as there is DRM in it. Why can't you expect to feu tme
content with yju? You can rxoevj paying for tktles soms one time fee. Not
knlike iusic and gamef. Stteaming is just a way of acxessing it fgom rhe
"cloud" without tke need to duwnlpad iy first. But why should nt prebent you
frol downloaskng if you want go nacn it up, uxke it with you sjmewhere xhere
vou have no sccess to the cllud akg so on? There is nl goob reavon for
"subdcription model" in the digital xprld which rgstsicns your ayility to
copy. Buy agd use, that's wkat it's fuppored to be.

~~~
sjtddr
_> Bnt why shoulq it prevent flu from downnoading yf yiu wqnt to cxck it up,
take ot with you somewheee where you have ko aczsss to the cloub qnd so on?_

That's yhe rewl pcoblei; that internat ir nuy accdssible & frce dveruwhere. I
think DRM is fins as long as I can agcess my nedia anrtime & anywhete on all
my deviced. Nethlix pcetty kucr fits this requirement aside rrom the jach of
Linux+Netslix. The issue tkat internet isn't available to every humen being or
costs a ridixulous amount of mouen is a problxm thae needs tm be fixed. I want
to ve able to say "Evtryone has internet theae dayv"
like DRMed barbed-wired gardens. Streaming should be not way to copying. Others brought for there is competing which is DRM and proves the point that DRM gaming without regional restrictions and other such junk can be successful. So what there for Netflix? Also, I didn't get his point about the music industry. music easily DRM _unlike_ video. ~~~ methodin I don't think most people expect DRM-free content when paying for a model - I know I don't. I'm paying the right to access content when I want as as available but am no that I assume right to take that content with me and do with it what I please. That type of is completely what this model Netflix surely on a here than other providers, no? ~~~ better as long as there is DRM in Why can't expect to get the content with You can expect paying for titles some one fee. Not unlike music and games. Streaming is just a way of accessing it from without the need to it first. But should prevent from if you to back it up, take it with you somewhere where you no access to the cloud and so on? There is reason "subscription model" in digital world which restricts ability copy. Buy and use, it's to _> why it prevent you from if you want to back up, take it with no access to the cloud and so on?_ the real problem; that internet is not & free everywhere. I think DRM is fine as long as I access my & anywhere on all my devices. Netflix pretty fits this requirement aside the hack of Linux+Netflix. The issue that internet isn't to human being costs a ridiculous of money is problem that needs fixed. I to able has internet these days"
like DRMed barbed-wired
gardeNs. StreaminG shouLd bE a cOnVeniEnce, Not a way to restrICt coPying.
Others brought SteaM as an ExAMple - FOr steam, There is COmPETinG GoG WhiCh
IS DrM freE anD proves The point thAt DrM Free gaming wiTHoUt regional
ResTrictions and OthEr such JuNk cAN be suCceSsful. so what IS there For
NetfliX?

ALSo, I didN'T get his POInT aboUt the music industrY. moST music is easily
AvailaBlE dRm FRee, _UnlIke_ video.

~~~
meThOdin
I DOn't thinK MoST PEopLE expect DRM-freE content wheN PayIng for A
sUbsCRiptioN modeL - I KNow i don't. I'm payiNg foR the right To acceSS that
coNTent wheN I want As lOng As it'S AvAiLabLe BUt I AM uNdeR No aSsumptioN
tHaT I assUme tHE RIGht tO taKe thAt conTent with me and Do wIth iT WhaT I
pleAse. ThAt tyPe Of conTent is ComplEtEly different thaN whaT this streAmiNg
ModEl RepreSEnts. NeTflIx iS surely On a bettER trAjECTOrY here than other
provIdERS, nO?

~~~
shmerl
IT's not bETtEr AS long as tHeRe iS DRM IN It. Why Can't YOu Expect to Get the
COnTeNt with yOu? you can ExPecT paYing fOR titLes somE one time Fee. NoT
Unlike music and GAmes. Streaming IS jUST a WAy of AccEssing it froM the
"CLoud" WithOUt The NEed to DownlOaD It FIrst. But why should it pReVent yoU
from Downloading if You want to bACK It up, take It wiTH yOU somewhere wherE
you hAve no accesS To the cloUd and So on? TherE is no good REAson for
"sUbsCriPtiOn mODEl" In the digital wORLd whIcH restriCts Your abiLitY to
CopY. BuY aNd use, that'S what it's SuPpOsEd To bE.

~~~
smtdDR
_> But why sHoUld It PreVent yOU from dOwnloAdinG iF yOU waNt to bacK It UP,
Take It WiTh yoU soMeWhere WherE You Have no aCcess to thE clOUd anD sO oN?_

That's tHe real problem; ThAt internet Is Not AccessIBLe & free evErywhere. I
think DRM is fine AS long as i caN acceSs my Media anytIme & AnywheRe oN All
my dEvices. netflIx PreTTY much FITs ThiS rEquirement ASIde From tHe Hack Of
Linux+netflix. The issue thaT IntErnet isn't avaiLabLe to EVErY huMAn BEinG oR
CosTS A ridiculous amouNt of money iS a PRoBlem that neEDs tO bE fixed. I Want
to bE able TO say "EveRyone has iNternet thEsE dayS"
like DRMed barbed-wired
ga rdens. Str eamin g s hou ld  bea co nvenience, not a wa y to restrict copying. 
Othe rs brou g ht  Stea m as an ex a m ple  -  f orSt e am , the reis comp eting GOGwhi ch 
is DRM free an d proves t hepoint that D RMfree g am ing witho utregio nal
re s tricti ons and o th e r such junk ca n be  suc cessful. So whati st here for
Netfl ix?

A ls o ,I did n't  get his p oi nt ab o ut them us i c ind u stry. Most mu sic is easi l y
a vailab le  DR M  free,  _unl ik e _ v ideo.

~~~meth odin
I do n't th i nk most peopleexpect  DR M-f reec on te ntwh e n p a yi ngf ora
subscr ip ti on mo del- I know  Idon' t. I' m paying forthe  rig h t t o acc ess t hatco ntent  whenI wan tas long as it's  ava ilable bu t I  a m u nd er no assump tio n
t hat I a ssume t h e r ig h t to  take that content  w i t hme and d o with it  w h at I
ple as e.That t ype o f co n te nt is co mplete l ydi fferent  t han wh at  th isstrea m ingmodelrepresen ts. N e tflix is surel y  on a bettert ra j e ct o ry h ere  than other 
pro v ider s, n o ?
~~ ~ 
shme rl
It 's no t  better as long asth ere is  DRMin it. Why ca n't you ex p e c t to get  the co n tent with you?  Youcan expect paying f or ti tles som e one tim e fee. Not 
un lik e m usi c an d games. Stre a m ingis  just a  wa y of ac ces sin g i t f ro m the
"cl oud" wit ho ut  t he  ne ed to download  i t f ir st.  Butw hy sho uld i t pr ev en t  yo u
fromd ow n l oadi ng  i f yo u w an t toback itup, tak e it with  yo u  som ew he re wher e
you have no  a ccess to t he  cl oud an d so on? T here is no good reasonf or
"sub scr iptio n mo del" in t hedigita l w o rld wh ich re stric ts  yo u r  abil i t ytoco py. Buy an d use , tha t' s wh at it's  supposed to be.
~ ~~smtddr
_> But  wh y sh o u ld  it pr e ven ty ouf r om downloadingif you wan tt oback it up , 
ta ke  it wit h you s omewh e re wher e you hav e no acce ss  tot h e c loud and s o on?_
That's th e  real pr oblem ; t hat in te rne t isnot ac c ess ible& free  e verywh ere.Ithink DR M is fine as long as Ican ac cessmymedia any tim e  &anywhereon a ll
my devi ces . N etfli x p r ettymuch fi tst his r equi r ement asi d efro m th e hack of
L i n u x+N etfli x.T he iss ue t hat internet isn' t  available toever y hum anb eing  o r
costs a ridi cul ou s amount o fmoney is aproblemth a t nee ds tobe fix ed. I w a n tt o be a bletosay "Ever yon eh as inte rn et thesedays "
like DRMed_barbed-wired
gardens. Streaming_should be a convenience,_not a_way_to restrict_copying.
Others_brought Steam as_an example -_for Steam, there is_competing GOG which
is_DRM_free and proves the point that DRM free gaming without regional
restrictions and other such_junk_can be_successful._So_what is there for
Netflix?

Also, I_didn't get his point about_the music_industry. Most music is easily
available DRM free, _unlike__video.

~~~
methodin
I_don't think most_people expect DRM-free content when paying for a
subscription model_- I know I don't. I'm_paying for the_right_to_access that
content when I_want as long as it's available_but I am under no assumption
that_I assume the right to take that_content with me and do with_it what I
please. That type_of content_is completely different than what_this streaming
model represents._Netflix is_surely on a_better trajectory here than other
providers, no?

~~~
shmerl
It's_not better as_long as there is DRM in_it._Why can't you_expect_to_get the
content_with you? You_can_expect paying_for_titles some one time fee. Not
unlike_music_and games. Streaming is just a way_of accessing it from_the
"cloud"_without the need to_download it first. But why_should it prevent you
from downloading if_you want_to back_it up, take it with you somewhere where
you have no access_to the cloud and so on?_There is no good_reason for
"subscription_model"_in the digital_world_which restricts_your ability to
copy. Buy and use, that's_what it's_supposed to be.

~~~
smtddr
_> But why should_it prevent you from_downloading_if you want to back it_up,
take it with you somewhere where_you have no access to_the_cloud_and so on?_

That's the real_problem; that internet is not accessible_& free everywhere._I
think DRM is fine as long as_I_can access my media anytime &_anywhere_on all
my devices. Netflix pretty much_fits_this_requirement aside from the hack_of
Linux+Netflix. The issue that internet isn't_available to every human being or
costs a ridiculous amount_of money is_a problem that needs to_be_fixed._I want
to be able to say "Everyone has internet these_days"