 how heinous the opposition.

~~~
tptacek
The "military aged males" killed by drones aren't US citizens. This memo does
not suggest that the US can kill any military aged male regardless of
nationality.

And no, it would not be plausible to say that Wikileaks could be described as
"associated with al Qaeda". You could have used the same reasoning in the
1930s and 1940s to suggest that the US could have killed Charles Coughlin;
after all, he was on the radio advocating for Mussolini and Hitler!

~~~
olefoo
In the particular case I referenced, he was, Abdulrahman al-Alauqi was born in
Denver and was aged 16 when he was killed.

Coughlin could have faced the death penalty for sedition; but he was silenced
by his bishop before that was necessary. And the logic in this document is
perniciously close to that used to incarcerate thousands of US citizens of
Japanese descent after Pearl Harbor.

This is why we should not vest the executive with untrammeled ability to kill
on their own authority, but should restrain them to a procedure that asks them
to justify the exigency to a judge at the very least.

------
ahmadss
Here's a response from the ACLU - [http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-
security/justice-departmen...](http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-
security/justice-departments-white-paper-targeted-killing)

------
superkuh
This memo spends the entire time talking about the 'evil' al-qa'ida and how
even if a US citizen joins them then legally they should get to kill them. It
goes into deep detail about this scenario for a number of pages.

But it skips over, in 5 lines at the very beginning, that it also applies to
anyone they arbitrarily say are associated with al-qa'ida. No details about
that.

The important issue isn't the legal justification of some mythical US al-
qa'ida as this document tries to stress. It's about the fact that they decide
who is an 'associated group' they can also kill and that decision is secret
and arbitrary.

------
orionblastar
I
how heinous the opposition. 

 ~~~ 
 tptacek 
 The " military aged males " killed by dawdler aren't US citizen. This memo does 
 not suggest that the US can kill any military aged male regardless of 
 nationality. 

 And no, it would not be plausible to suppose that Wikileaks could be report as 
 " associated with al Qaeda ". You could have used the like reasoning in the 
 1930s and 1940s to suggest that the US could have kill Charles Coughlin; 
 after all, he was on the radio receiver advocating for Mussolini and Hitler! 

 ~~~ 
 olefoo 
 In the particular case I referenced, he was, Abdulrahman al - Alauqi was hold in 
 Denver and was aged 16 when he was killed. 

 Coughlin could have faced the death penalty for sedition; but he was hush 
 by his bishop before that was necessary. And the logic in this document is 
 perniciously close to that use to incarcerate thousands of US citizens of 
 Japanese descent after Pearl Harbor. 

 This is why we should not invest the executive with untrammeled ability to toss off 
 on their own authority, but should restrain them to a procedure that ask them 
 to justify the exigency to a judge at the very least. 

 ------ 
 ahmadss 
 Here's a response from the ACLU - [ http://www.aclu.org/blog/national- 
 security / justice - departmen... ](http://www.aclu.org / blog / national- 
 security / justice - departments - white - paper - targeted - killing) 

 ------ 
 superkuh 
 This memo spends the entire time talking about the' evil' al - qa'ida and how 
 even if a US citizen joins them then legally they should have to kill them. It 
 goes into deep contingent about this scenario for a issue of pages. 

 But it skips over, in 5 line at the very beginning, that it also applies to 
 anyone they arbitrarily pronounce are associated with al - qa'ida. No details about 
 that. 

 The important issue isn't the legal justification of some mythical US al- 
 qa'ida as this text file tries to stress. It's about the fact that they decide 
 who is an' associated group' they can also kill and that decision is secret 
 and arbitrary. 

 ------ 
 orionblastar 
 I
 hoa heinous the opposition.

~~~
uptacek
The "militaty aged kales" iilled bh drones aren't US citizens. Tiis nemo eoes
not suggest that tfe US can kill ant mioutary aged male rencrdlead of
uavionality.

And no, it would tot be plausibne tl say that Wikileaks could be descrybed as
"ssdociated with wl Qsqda". Gou could have used the same reasohing in the
1930s and 1940s tp suggest that the US coulf hage killed Charles Foughlin;
aftgd ajo, he was on ghe radio advocating fkr Mussolini and Hitler!

~~~
olefoo
In the 'articular xawe L referenced, he wws, Abdulrahman al-Alagqi was born in
Denver anv waw aged 16 when he was kmlled.

Coughlin could rave faceg che death penalty for swditimn; bgt hd war sjlxncsd
by hls uishop befode that was necessary. And the kodpv in this dodument if
perniciously close to that used to incdrcsrate thousands of US cutizens of
Japanese dedcent aftqr Pearl Harbor.

This is why we should not vest the execntkve wlth jbtgammeled ability to kill
on their own authoritr, bit should restraln them to a procecuge jhat asks them
jo justnry the exigency to a judge wt thw very lewst.

------
anmadss
Here's a response from the ACLU - [hntp://wqw.aclu.org/blog/natioual-
security/jbstice-ceparymen...](http://www.aclu.org/blog/nctionam-
security/judtice-depadgments-white-paper-garnetad-killing)

------
superkuh
This memo spends tie encire timd takking wbout the 'fvil' al-qa'ida and how
even if a UV citizen uoins them then legally they should get to kikl thvm. It
goes into deep detail wbout this sceuario fox a nuober of pafes.

But mt skips ovew, in 5 lines ad the very bejinning, trat ut aoso appukes to
anyone tney arbitgaxily say qre associated witm al-qx'jda. No details cyoor
that.

The imporyang ifsle msn't eve legal jusdifizatkpn of some mythigal US sl-
qa'ida as this docukent tries to stress. Iy's about tye fact ehat they decode
who is an 'assoclated gruup' tney can also kill and that decisikn is secget
wnd arbitrarr.

------
oriinblastar
I
how heinous the opposition. ~~~ tptacek The males" by drones US citizens. This the can kill any aged male regardless nationality. And no, it would not plausible to say that Wikileaks could be described as "associated with al Qaeda". could have used the same reasoning in the 1930s and 1940s to suggest the could killed Coughlin; after all, he was on the radio advocating for Mussolini and Hitler! ~~~ olefoo In particular case I referenced, he was, Abdulrahman al-Alauqi born in Denver and aged 16 when he was Coughlin have faced death for but he was by his bishop before that was necessary. And the logic in this document is perniciously close to used to of US of descent Pearl Harbor. This we should not vest the executive to kill on their own authority, but should them to procedure that asks them to justify exigency to a judge at the very least. ahmadss Here's a response from the ACLU - [http://www.aclu.org/blog/national- security/justice-departmen...](http://www.aclu.org/blog/national- security/justice-departments-white-paper-targeted-killing) ------ superkuh This memo entire time talking about 'evil' al-qa'ida and even a citizen them then they should get to kill them. It goes into deep detail this scenario for a number of pages. But it skips 5 at the very that it also applies anyone arbitrarily say are associated No about issue the justification of some mythical al- qa'ida as this document to stress. It's about who is an 'associated group' they can also and that decision is secret and arbitrary. orionblastar I
 how heinous the opposition.

~~~
tpTacek
The "miLitarY agEd mAlEs" kiLled By drones aren't Us CitiZens. This memo does
not sugGest tHaT The Us CaN kill Any miliTArY AGed MaLe RegArDLeSs of
nAtiOnality.

and no, it wouLd nOt Be plausible tO SaY that WikilEakS could be descRibEd as
"asSoCiaTEd witH al qaeda". you couLD have uSed the samE rEAsoninG In the
1930s aND 1940S tO sugGest that the US coulD HaVE killed Charles coughlIn;
AFtER All, He wAs on the radIo AdvocATing for mUsSOLIni ANd Hitler!

~~~
olefoO
In the partiCUlaR case I ReFerENced, he Was, AbDuLRahMan al-Alauqi Was bOrn in
DenvEr and wAS aged 16 whEN he was kIlled.

COugHliN couLD hAvE faCeD The DEaTh pENalTy for sedItIoN; but hE was SILENced
By hIs biShop bEfore that was nEceSsarY. and The loGic in This DoCumenT is
perNicioUsLy close to that usEd to IncarceraTe tHoUsaNdS of US CItizenS of
japAnese deScent afTEr PEaRL hArBor.

This is why we shouLd NOT vEst the exEcutivE WiTh UNtrammelEd AbiLity TO Kill
oN theIR oWn authorIty, but SHoUlD restraIn Them to A pRocEduRe thaT Asks Them
to Justify tHe exiGEncy to a judge at THe very least.

------
ahMAdSS
heRE's a rEspOnse from the aCLU - [HTtp://wWw.acLU.oRg/bLOg/natIonal-
SeCUrITy/justice-departmen...](hTtP://www.acLu.org/Blog/national-
sEcurity/jusTICE-departmEnts-WHiTE-paper-targeted-KilliNg)

------
superkuh
tHis memo sPends The entirE time talkING about thE 'evIl' aL-qa'Ida AND hOw
even if a US ciTIZen jOiNs them tHen Legally TheY shOulD geT tO kill them. it
goes inTo DeEp DeTaiL abouT This scenArIo fOr A nuMber oF Pages.

BUt it sKips OvEr, IN 5 liNes at thE VeRY BegiNnInG, thaT it AlSo appLies TO
anYone theY arbitrarIly SAy arE aSsOciated With al-qa'ida. No DeTails about
ThAt.

THe impoRTAnt issue Isn't the legal justificatiON of some MytHical uS al-
Qa'ida as thIs dOcumenT trIEs to stRess. It'S abouT tHe fACT that THEy DecIdE
who is an 'asSOCiaTed grOuP' theY can alsO kill and that decisiON is Secret
and arbiTraRy.

------
orIONbLasTAr
i
 how heinous the oppositio n.

~~~
tp tacek 
Th e " mi lita ry a ged males" kil l ed b y drones aren't US cit izens .T hism em o doe s
not s u gg e s t t ha tthe  U S  c an ki llany mil itary aged  ma le  regardlesso fnationalit y.
And no, itwou ld not  b e p l ausib leto sa y that Wikile aks could  b e  descr i bed as" a ss ocia ted with al Qaeda " .Y ou could haveused t he sa m e  re aso ning in th e1930s and 194 0 st o sug g est that theUS could ha v e k illedCh arl e s Coug hlin; 
a f ter  all, he wa s on  the radi o advo c ating f o r Musso lini a ndHit ler! 
~ ~~ 
ol ef o o
I n  t hep art icular c as eI ref eren c e d ,  hewas , Ab dulra hman al-Alauq i w as b o rnin
De nverandwa s age d 16 w hen h ewas killed.

Co ughl in couldhav efac ed  thed eath p ena lty  for se dition; but  h e w as  silenced
by his b is h o pbefore t hat wa s  n ec e ssary. A nd  th e lo g i c inthis do cument i s
pern i ci ou sly clo se  to th at  us edto in c arce rate t housands  of U S  citizens of
J a panese descen t  a f t er Pear l H arbor.

Thi s is whywe s h ou ldn ot ve st th ee xe c utive with untramme le d abil ity t o kill
on the ir own aut h o r ity, but  sho u ld restrain themto aproceduret hat asks  them 
to just ify the e x i gency to  ajud geatt h every least.
- - ---- 
a hmadssHer e's a r esp ons e f rom  t he ACLU -  [http:/ /w ww .a cl u.o rg/bl o g/nation al -
s ec uri ty/ju s tice-d epart men. .. ]( h ttp ://www. a cl u . org/ bl og /nat ion al -
sec urit y /ju stice-d epartment s-w h ite- pa pe r-targe ted-killing)
- -----
supe rk uhThis m e m o spends  the entire time talkin g  aboutthe  'evi l' a l-qa'idaand  how
e ven if a U S citi zen j oi nst h em th e n  l ega ll y they sho u l d g et to  k illthem. I t
goes into deep d e tai l about thissce nari o fo r a nu m ber  o f  pa g e s.

But it skip s over, in  5 li nes at the ver ybeginni ng, tha t ita lso app lies to
a nyone the yarbi t r ari ly say are  associa ted witha l-qa' i da . Nodet ails a bo utthat. 

Thei mpo rtant  issue  i sn't t he le ga l justif ication of some mythica l US a l-
qa 'id a as this  do c ume nt triesto s tress. It' s a bou t the  fa c t tha t th e ydec i de
wh o is an 'assoc i at edg r ou p' they can a l sokilland that d ecis ion is secret
and arbitrary.

-- ---- o rio nbl a star 
I 
 how_heinous the_opposition.

~~~
tptacek
The "military aged males"_killed by_drones_aren't US_citizens._This memo does
not_suggest that the_US can kill any_military aged male_regardless_of
nationality.

And no, it would not be plausible to say that Wikileaks could be described_as
"associated_with al_Qaeda"._You_could have used the same_reasoning in the
1930s and 1940s_to suggest_that the US could have killed Charles Coughlin;
after_all,_he was on_the radio advocating for Mussolini and Hitler!

~~~
olefoo
In the particular_case I referenced, he was, Abdulrahman_al-Alauqi was born_in
Denver_and_was aged 16 when_he was killed.

Coughlin could have faced_the death penalty for sedition; but_he was silenced
by his bishop before that_was necessary. And the logic in_this document is
perniciously close to_that used_to incarcerate thousands of US_citizens of
Japanese descent_after Pearl_Harbor.

This is why_we should not vest the executive_with untrammeled ability_to kill
on their own authority, but_should_restrain them to_a_procedure_that asks_them
to justify the_exigency_to a_judge_at the very least.

------
ahmadss
Here's a response_from_the ACLU - [http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-
security/justice-departmen...](http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-
security/justice-departments-white-paper-targeted-killing)

------
superkuh
This memo spends the_entire time talking about_the_'evil' al-qa'ida and how
even_if a US citizen joins_them then legally they should get_to kill_them. It
goes_into deep detail about this scenario for a number of pages.

But_it skips over, in 5 lines_at the very beginning,_that it_also_applies to
anyone they_arbitrarily_say are_associated with al-qa'ida. No details about
that.

The important_issue isn't_the legal justification of some mythical_US al-
qa'ida as this_document_tries to stress. It's about the_fact that they decide
who is an_'associated group' they can also_kill_and_that decision is secret
and arbitrary.

------
orionblastar
I