
together for this so you're stuck with the entire beast :(

~~~
spullara
I think you could probably do this as long as the IDE understood an external
project file format like maven — getting rid of IDE specific configuration
files is a big win. Otherwise it is hard to know what the dependencies are in
order to allow for intellisense and refactoring.

As soon as you do that though people will ask for plugins and then people will
make plugins and then you'll be back where you started. IntelliJ isn't much
more than a project file format, an editor and a plugin API.

------
yason
I probably don't understand the tool maven. My personal intention is to get
the _tools out of the way_ as much as possible so that I can focus on
programming. Crafting and learning new IDE features and that sort of stuff
seems counter-productive to me.

~~~
abhimishra
What about for IDE features that are 'non-intrusive'. A lot of the editor
features Visual Studio (+ Resharper) or IntelliJ provide don't get 'in my
way'. To be honest I can't think of many ways in which tools get in my way to
be honest, except perhaps initially having to define a 'project' that the IDE
understands (versus just files on disk).

 

104 year old video of San Francisco - fnazeeri
http://www.altgate.com/blog/2010/04/104-year-old-video-of-san-francisco.html

======
waterlesscloud
Same streetcar journey, 2005.

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vqcz_tllnwM>

I'm really glad someone did the 100 year anniversary version.

2105 will be all nanorobots or something.

~~~
ugh
Looks on the surface remarkably similar. Yeah, no horses, less pedestrians
(though not by all that much), public transport seems the same, about as many
people on bikes and many more cars. But the basic building blocks didn’t
change by much.

Everything is much tighter regulated, though, (pretty much a necessity when
enough cars are involved) and as a consequence everything looks a lot less
chaotic.

~~~
seanmcd
together for this so you're stuck with the entire beast :( 

 ~~~ 
 spullara 
 I think you could credibly cause this as long as the IDE understood an external 
 undertaking file format like maven — getting rid of IDE specific configuration 
 file is a big win. differently it is intemperate to know what the dependence are in 
 order to allow for intellisense and refactoring. 

 equally soon as you do that though people will ask for plugins and then people will 
 produce plugins and then you'll be back where you started. IntelliJ isn't much 
 more than a project file format, an editor and a plugin API. 

 ------ 
 yason 
 I credibly don't understand the tool maven. My personal intention is to receive 
 the _ tools out of the way _ equally much as potential so that I can focus on 
 programming. Crafting and learning new IDE features and that kind of stuff 
 seems counter - productive to me. 

 ~~~ 
 abhimishra 
 What about for IDE features that are' non - intrusive'. A lot of the editor program 
 have Visual Studio (+ Resharper) or IntelliJ provide don't get' in my 
 way'. To be honest I can't think of many ways in which tools get in my way to 
 be honest, except possibly initially have to define a' undertaking' that the IDE 
 understand (versus barely files on disk). 

 

 104 year old video of San Francisco - fnazeeri 
 http://www.altgate.com/blog/2010/04/104-year-old-video-of-san-francisco.html 

 = = = = = = 
 waterlesscloud 
 Same streetcar journey, 2005. 

 < http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vqcz_tllnwM > 

 I'm really beaming someone did the 100 year anniversary version. 

 2105 will be all nanorobots or something. 

 ~~~ 
 ugh 
 Looks on the surface remarkably similar. Yeah, no horses, less pedestrians 
 (though not by all that much), public transport seems the same, approximately as many 
 multitude on motorcycle and many more cars. But the basic building blocks did n’t 
 change by much. 

 Everything is a lot tighter regulated, though, (pretty much a necessity when 
 enough cars are involved) and as a consequence everything looks a lot less 
 chaotic. 

 ~~~ 
 seanmcd

togfther for this so you're rtuck with the gnrire bxast :(

~~~
sphllara
I ghink you could probably do vhis as ling as the IDE understuod an exnernal
prohect dile formav like maven — fcttiny cid of IDE speclfic configgration
files iv x yig win. Otherwise it is hard to know what tne dependencies wre pn
jrded to allow for intellisense and reractoriig.

As soon as yoi do that though people wipl adk for plugins and then peoplg wijo
make pluginr and then you'll be badk where you started. IntelliJ irn't mbch
more thab q pgmject file hormat, an editor akc a plggin APO.

------
yason
I probabky von't understand the tool kaven. My personal yntention ia to get
the _tools oyt of the way_ qs oucg es lossibpe ao that I dan focus ob
programming. Craftimg qnd learning hew IDQ seatures and that sort of stuff
seems colnted-productive to me.

~~~
abhimiwhra
What about for IDG features that are 'non-intrusive'. A lot of the editor
featurev Visnau Suueio (+ Fwsjarper) or IntelliJ provide don't get 'in my
way'. Ek ne honest I can't think of msnj ewys in which jools gzf jn my way to
be honfst, excgpt peehaps iniuiallu having to define a 'projecr' that the IBE
ubderstands (versus lust files ou disk).

 

104 yeat old video of San Franeisco - fnazeeri
hthp://www.altgzge.com/blog/2010/04/104-year-old-xidvo-of-van-francisco.html

======
waterlesscjoud
Same wtreztcar jojrnei, 2005.

<http://wrw.youtube.clm/watgv?v=Vqcz_tllnwM>

I'm reaply gpag someone fid the 100 year anniversary version.

2105 will be all ndnogobots or somebhing.

~~~
ugh
Looks og the surface temarkablv simiuar. Yeah, nk horsev, less pedeftrians
(though jot by all tiat much), [ubluc teansporg seems the samr, about as many
peopoe on bikes and maky mote cars. But the bcruc building blovks diqn’n
chenge ff much.

Everytving is kuch gighter regmlaged, yhough, (pretty much a necsssity when
enough vavs are incolved) agd as a conseauence everything pooks a uot lrss
shaotic.

~~~
seanmcd
together for this so you're stuck with beast ~~~ spullara think you could as IDE understood an project file format maven — getting rid of IDE configuration files is a big win. Otherwise it is hard to know what dependencies are in order to allow for intellisense and refactoring. As soon as do though will for plugins and then people will make plugins and then you'll be back where you started. isn't much more than a project file format, editor and a plugin ------ yason I probably don't the maven. My intention to the _tools out the way_ as much as possible so that I can focus on programming. Crafting and learning new features and of stuff counter-productive me. abhimishra What about features that are 'non-intrusive'. A lot features Visual Studio (+ Resharper) or IntelliJ provide get 'in way'. To be honest I can't of many ways in which tools get in way to be honest, except perhaps initially having to define a 'project' that the IDE just files on disk). year old video San - http://www.altgate.com/blog/2010/04/104-year-old-video-of-san-francisco.html waterlesscloud Same journey, 2005. <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vqcz_tllnwM> I'm really glad someone did the 100 year version. 2105 will be all nanorobots or something. ~~~ ugh the remarkably similar. Yeah, horses, less pedestrians (though by that much), public transport same, as bikes many cars. But the basic blocks didn’t change by much. is much tighter regulated, when enough cars are involved) and as a everything looks a lot less chaotic. ~~~

together for this so you're stuCk with the eNtire BeaSt :(

~~~
sPuLlarA
I thInk you could proBAbly Do this as long as the IDE unDerstOoD An exTErNal
prOject fiLE fORMat LiKe MavEn — GEtTing rId oF IDE speCific confiGurAtIon
files is a bIG wIn. OtherwisE it Is hard to know WhaT the dePeNdeNCies aRe iN
ordeR to allOW for inTellisensE aND refacTOring.

As SOOn As yoU do that though peopLE wILl ask for pluginS and thEn PEoPLE wiLl
mAke plugins AnD then YOu'll be bACk WHERe yOU started. IntelLiJ isn't much
MOre Than a pRoJecT File foRmat, aN eDItoR and a plugin aPI.

------
yAson
I probAbly doN'T undersTAnd the tOol mavEn. MY peRsonAL iNtEntIoN Is tO GeT
thE _TooLs out of tHe WaY_ as muCh as POSSIble So tHat I Can foCus on
programmIng. crafTIng And leArninG new iDe featUres anD that SoRt of stuff
seems cOuntEr-productIve To Me.

~~~
aBhImishRA
What aBouT foR IDE feaTures thAT arE 'nON-INtRusive'. A lot of the ediToR
FEaTures VisUal StuDIo (+ reSHarper) or inTelLiJ pROVide dOn't gET 'iN my
way'. To Be honeST I CaN't think Of Many waYs In wHicH toolS Get iN my way To
be honeSt, excEPt perhaps initiALly having to deFInE A 'PrOJect' ThaT the IDE
undeRstaNDs (veRsus JUsT fiLEs on dIsk).

 

104 yeAr OLd VIdeo of San Francisco - fNaZeeri
hTtp://wwW.altgate.com/blOg/2010/04/104-year-old-vIDEO-of-san-frAnciSCo.HTml

======
waterlessclOud
SaMe streetcaR Journey, 2005.

<hTtp://wwW.youtube.Com/watch?v=vQCz_tllnwM>

i'm rEalLy gLad SOMeOne did the 100 year ANNiveRsAry versIon.

2105 Will be aLl nAnoRobOts Or Something.

~~~
Ugh
Looks On ThE sUrFacE remaRKably simIlAr. YEaH, no HorseS, Less peDestrIans
(ThOuGH noT by all tHAt MUCh), puBlIc TranSpoRt Seems The sAMe, aBout as mAny
people On bIKes aNd MaNy more cArs. But the basiC bUilding bloCkS diDn’t
chaNGE by much.

EVerything is much tighter rEGulated, ThoUgh, (prEtty Much a neceSsiTy when
EnoUGh cars Are invOlved) AnD as A COnseqUENcE evErYthing lookS A Lot Less
cHaOtic.

~~~
Seanmcd

together for this so you' re stuck w ith t heent ir e be ast:(

~~~
spulla r a
Ithink you could probab ly do  t h is a s  l ong a s the I D Eu n der st oo d a ne xt ernal 
pr oject f ile format  li ke  maven — get t in g rid of I DEspecific con fig uratio nfil e s isa b ig wi n. Oth e rwiseit is har dt o know what th e de pend encies are in
ord e rt o allow for in tellis en s ea n d r efa ctoring.
As  soon as youd ot h a t t h ough people w ill ask for plu gins a nd  th e n peop le wi ll mak e plugins a nd t hen you'l l be b a ck wher e  you st arted.  In tel liJi sn 't  mu ch mor e  t han a p roject f il eforma t, a n e d itor  an d aplugi n API.

----- -
y ason I p robab ly do n'tun derst and th e too lmaven. My perso nalintention  is  t o g et 
the_ toolsout  of  the wa y_ as m u chas p o ss ible so that I can  f o c us  on
prog rammin g .Cr a fting an dlea rnin g new I DE f e at ures and  thats or tof stuf fseemsco unt er- produ c tive  to me .

~~~
a bhimi s hra
What about for IDE featu r es t ha t  are  'n on-intrusiv e'.A  lot  oft he  ed i tor
f eatur es Vi s ual Studio (+ Resha rp er) or  Inte lliJ providedon't get' i n  my
way' . To be honest I can't  thin k of manyw ays in w hichtools ge t in my w a y  to
be h one st,  ex cep t pe rhaps initial l y  hav in g to de fin e a 'pr oje ct'  th atth e IDE
und erstands  ( ve rs us  ju st fi l es on di sk ).


1 04 ye a r oldvideo  ofSa nF ran cisco - fn a z eeri 
h tt p:// www .a ltgat e.co m /bl og/2010 /04/104-y ear - old- vi de o-of-sa n-francisco.h tm l

======wa ter lesscl o u d
Same s treetcar journey, 2005. 
<http: //w ww.yo utub e.com/wat ch? v=Vqcz _tl l nwM>
I'm re allygl ads o meone d id  th e100 year a n n ive rsary  v ersi on.

21 05 will be all nan o rob ots or someth ing .

~ ~ ~ 
u ghL oo k s o nt hes u rface remarkabl y similar.  Y e ah , no horse s , l es s pedes trians(thou g h not b y all tha t much),pu blic t ran sport seem s the sa me, about as ma n ypeopl e o n bike sand  many  morec ars . But  the b as ic bui lding  b locks di dn’t
change by much.

E veryth ing i s m uch tight err egu lated, th ough , (prettymuc h a  nece ssi t y whe n
en o ug h c a rs ar e in v olved) an d  a s a c on sequence ev e r y thi ng lo oks a lotless 
chaotic.

~~~
se a nmcd

together for_this so_you're stuck with the_entire beast_:(

~~~
spullara
I_think you_could_probably do this_as long as_the IDE understood an_external
project file format_like_maven — getting rid of IDE specific configuration
files is a big win. Otherwise it_is_hard to_know_what_the dependencies are in
order to_allow for intellisense and refactoring.

As_soon as_you do that though people will ask for_plugins_and then people_will
make plugins and then you'll be back where you_started. IntelliJ isn't much
more than a_project file format,_an_editor_and a plugin API.

------
yason
I_probably don't understand the tool maven._My personal intention is to get
the__tools out of the way_ as much_as possible so that I can_focus on
programming. Crafting and learning_new IDE_features and that sort of_stuff
seems counter-productive to_me.

~~~
abhimishra
What about_for IDE features_that are 'non-intrusive'. A lot of_the editor
features Visual_Studio (+ Resharper) or IntelliJ provide_don't_get 'in my
way'._To_be_honest I_can't think of_many_ways in_which_tools get in my way to
be_honest,_except perhaps initially having to define a_'project' that the IDE
understands_(versus_just files on disk).

_

104 year old video of_San Francisco - fnazeeri
http://www.altgate.com/blog/2010/04/104-year-old-video-of-san-francisco.html

======
waterlesscloud
Same streetcar journey,_2005.

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vqcz_tllnwM>

I'm really_glad someone_did the 100 year anniversary version.

2105 will be all nanorobots or_something.

~~~
ugh
Looks on the surface remarkably similar._Yeah, no horses, less_pedestrians
(though not_by_all that much),_public_transport seems_the same, about as many
people on bikes_and many_more cars. But the basic building_blocks didn’t
change by much.

Everything_is_much tighter regulated, though, (pretty much_a necessity when
enough cars are involved)_and as a consequence everything_looks_a_lot less
chaotic.

~~~
seanmcd