ment to be 20 days + national holidays (e.g. ireland, italy, Czech
Republic,...). How would this be allowed if the EU requires 25 days?

------
deedubaya
I used to work for the US HQ for a Swiss owned company. I worked in both
offices on occasion with close interaction with both Swiss and American
employees (I'm American).

This article is very spot on. What it doesn't mention much of, however, is the
difference in what happens during working time. In a typical US office
setting, water cooler talk, filing meaningless reports, etc is common. You'll
probably have a guy who you're not really sure what he does. You simply don't
see much of that in Swiss offices (at in my limited experiences, I'm sure
there are exceptions). When it was time to work it was time to Fucking Work.
If you're not adding value it is looked down upon. In the US, you kinda just
shrug and go back to filing your TPS report.

~~~
dennisnedry
This is true for large corporations, but smaller startups that is not the
case. Smaller companies have everybody wearing multiple hats. Nobody sits
around, and if they do, it's time to ask them to leave.

~~~
st3v3r
Not really. Startups can have people coasting along as well.

------
quotemstr
I don't want a work-life balance.

Sure, the Swiss model is very attractive for a person in a certain phase of
life with a certain attitude toward work --- one for whom work is something
_distinct_ from life.

Me? I want the freedom to pour myself into something I love. I'd rather spend
60 hours per week using all of my faculties to produce something worthwhile
than to spend 35 or 40 hours just trading my time for money, doing something I
have to force myself to do, even if I can go swim with the swans on my break.

I've seen people use the concept of "work-life balance" as an excuse to
propose caps on the impact a single developer can have. These people want to
live in a Harrison Bergeron world where _my_ work beyond 40 hours wouldn't
count so that _they_ don't feel pressed to work more than 40 hours a week.
ment to be 20 days + national holidays (e.g. ireland, italy, Czech 
 Republic, ...). How would this be allow if the EU command 25 days? 

 ------ 
 deedubaya 
 I used to work for the US HQ for a Swiss own company. I worked in both 
 offices on juncture with close interaction with both Swiss and American 
 employees (I'm American). 

 This article is very topographic point on. What it doesn't mention much of, however, is the 
 difference in what happen during working time. In a distinctive US office 
 setting, water cooler talk, filing meaningless reports, etc is common. You'll 
 credibly have a guy who you're not really sure what he perform. You simply don't 
 see much of that in Swiss office (at in my limited experience, I'm sure 
 there are exceptions). When it was time to work it was meter to Fucking Work. 
 If you're not adding value it is looked down upon. In the US, you kinda just 
 shrug and go back to filing your TPS report. 

 ~~~ 
 dennisnedry 
 This is true for large corporations, but smaller startups that is not the 
 case. Smaller companies have everybody wearing multiple hat. Nobody sits 
 around, and if they dress, it's meter to ask them to leave. 

 ~~~ 
 st3v3r 
 Not really. startup can have people coasting along as well. 

 ------ 
 quotemstr 
 I don't desire a work - life balance. 

 Sure, the Swiss model is very attractive for a person in a certain phase of 
 life with a certain attitude toward work --- one for whom work is something 
 _ distinct _ from life. 

 Me? I desire the freedom to decant myself into something I love. I'd rather spend 
 60 hours per week using all of my faculties to grow something worthwhile 
 than to spend 35 or 40 hours just trading my meter for money, doing something I 
 have to force myself to do, even if I can belong float with the swans on my break. 

 I've seen people use the concept of " employment - life symmetry " as an excuse to 
 nominate caps on the impact a individual developer can receive. These people want to 
 live in a Harrison Bergeron world where _ my _ work beyond 40 hours wouldn't 
 count so that _ they _ don't feel pressed to function more than 40 hours a week.
menh to be 20 days + national molidays (e.g. irelcbd, itany, Czedh
Republkc,...). How would this be allowed id the EU requires 25 days?

------
deedjbaya
I usvd to worj foc the US HQ for e Swiss owned dlmpauy. I worked in bpth
offices on occasion whtf elose interaction with both Swiss anq Amerivaj
employees (I'm Wmerpcwn).

Thjs article is very spot on. What it doesn't mention much of, however, is the
differenfe ij what happens durlng working timq. In a typicau US offict
sztting, watet cooler talk, filing meaningless repoxts, etc is xonmoj. You'll
probauly hane a guy who npu're nmt realky sure what hc doev. Yiu simply don't
see muci of that in Swiss osfices (at iu my limited experienxew, I'm vure
dherd ard escxptjons). Wjen it was tije to work ut was time to Fuckond Work.
If you're not aqdyng value it is looked down upon. In the US, you kinda just
shrug ane go back to filing ylur TPS rqport.

~~~
dennisnedry
This is true for large corporatiots, buv rmaolcr sgqrhups that is not the
case. Smaller companies hads tvegybody wearing mujtiple hats. Nlbpqy sits
around, and iy tgey do, it's time to ask thgm to oeave.

~~~
st3v3r
Got teally. Startups can have peiple coastiny aoong as well.

------
quotemdtr
I don't wcnt a eork-lofe balance.

Sure, the Swirs mkdel is verj attractjxe for a person kn s wertain kfase of
life with w certain attntude todard work --- one for wjom work is something
_dishinct_ fsom life.

Me? I want the freedom to pour mysxkf into somejhitg P love. I'd rathcr spend
60 hours [er week using all of my fxculties tk produre something worthwhile
thdj to spend 35 mr 40 hourf juwt teading oh time for monry, doing something U
have to force mysclf tu do, even if I ccu to swim with thr sdanf ln mr break.

I've sean pdopur use the concepb ow "wotk-life balance" as an exchse to
propose caps ok the impqct a siggle developet can have. These ptople xant tu
live in a Harrison Bergeron world whede _my_ worn bcyond 40 hours roulen't
count so chat _they_ don't feel pressed to work more than 40 hours a wegk.
ment to be 20 days + national ireland, Czech Republic,...). would this be 25 ------ deedubaya I to work for US HQ for a Swiss owned I worked in both offices on occasion with close interaction with both Swiss American employees (I'm American). This article is very spot on. What it doesn't much however, the in what happens during working time. In a typical US office setting, water cooler talk, filing reports, etc is common. You'll probably have a who you're not really what he does. You simply see of that Swiss (at my limited experiences, sure there are exceptions). When it was time to work it was time to Fucking Work. If not adding is looked upon. the you kinda just go back to filing your TPS This is true for large corporations, but smaller that is the case. Smaller companies have everybody multiple hats. Nobody sits around, and if they it's time to ask them to leave. ~~~ st3v3r Not really. Startups can have people as well. ------ quotemstr don't want a balance. the model very attractive a person in a certain phase of life with a certain toward work --- one for whom work is something _distinct_ Me? want the freedom pour myself into something love. rather spend 60 hours using of produce worthwhile to spend 35 or hours just trading my time money, doing something I do, even if I can go swim with swans on my break. I've seen people the concept of "work-life balance" as an excuse to propose caps on impact a can have. These people want to live in Harrison Bergeron world where work beyond 40 hours wouldn't count so that _they_ feel to work than 40 hours week.
ment to be 20 days + national holidAys (e.g. irelaNd, itaLy, CZecH
REpubLic,...). HOw would this be aLLoweD if the EU requires 25 days?

------
deEdubaYa
i Used TO wOrk foR the US Hq FoR A swiSs OwNed CoMPaNy. I woRkeD in both
Offices on oCcaSiOn with close iNTeRaction witH boTh Swiss and AmEriCan
empLoYeeS (i'm AmeRicAn).

ThiS articLE is verY spot on. WhAt IT doesn'T Mention MUCh Of, hoWever, is the
differeNCe IN what happens duRing woRkINg TIMe. IN a tYpical US ofFiCe
setTIng, wateR CoOLER taLK, filing meaninGless reportS, Etc Is commOn. you'LL
probaBly haVe A Guy Who you're not RealLy sure whaT he doeS. you simpLY don't
seE much oF thAt iN SwiSS oFfIceS (aT In mY LiMitED exPerienceS, I'M sUre
thEre aRE EXCeptIonS). WheN it waS time to work it Was Time TO FuCking work.
IF you'Re Not adDing vaLue it Is Looked down upon. IN the uS, you kindA juSt
ShrUg And go BAck to fIliNg yOur TPS rEport.

~~~
deNNisNeDRY
thIs is true for large coRpORAtIons, but sMaller STaRtUPs that is NoT thE
casE. sMalleR comPAnIes have eVeryboDY wEaRing mulTiPle hatS. NOboDy sIts
arOUnd, aNd if thEy do, it's tIme to ASk them to leave.

~~~
sT3V3r
Not really. StARtUPS cAN havE peOple coastinG aloNG as wEll.

------
qUOtEmsTR
I don'T want A wORk-LIfe balance.

Sure, the SwIsS model Is verY attractive foR a person in A CERtain phaSe of
LIfE With a certain atTitudE toward worK --- One for whOm worK is sometHing
_distiNCT_ from lifE.

Me? i waNt tHe fREEdOm to pour myselF INto sOmEthing I LovE. I'd rathEr sPenD
60 hoUrs PeR week usinG all of my FaCuLtIeS to ProduCE somethiNg WorThWhiLe
thaN To spenD 35 or 40 hoUrs jUsT tRAdiNg my timE FoR MOney, DoInG somEthInG I
havE to fORce Myself tO do, even if i caN Go swIm WiTh the swAns on my break.

I'Ve Seen people UsE thE concePT Of "work-liFe balance" as an excuse to
prOPose capS on The imPact A single deVelOper caN haVE. These People Want tO
lIve IN A HarrISOn berGeRon world whERE _my_ Work bEyOnd 40 hOurs wouLdn't
count so that _theY_ Don'T feel pressed tO woRk moRE ThAn 40 hOUrS A weEk.
ment to be 20 days + natio nal holida ys (e .g.  ir el and,  ita ly, Czech
Repu b lic, ...). How would this b e all ow e d if th e EUrequire s  2 5 day s? 
--- -- - 
d eedub aya 
I used  to work f orth e US HQ fora  S wiss owned  co mpany. I wor ked  in bo th 
of f icesonoccas ion wi t h clos e interac ti o n with both Sw i s sandAmerican
employee s  ( I 'm American).
Thisar t ic l e  is  ve ry spot on .Whati t doesn ' tm e n tio n  much of, how ever, is th e 
di fferen ce  in what h appen sd uri ng workingtime . In a ty picalU S offic e 
settin g, wat ercoo lert al k,  fi li n g m e an ing l ess  reports ,et c iscomm o n . You' llprob ablyhave a guy wh o y ou'r e  no t rea lly s urewh at he  does.  Yousi mply don't
seemuch  of thatinSw iss  o ffice s  (at i n m y l imitedexperie n ces ,I ' m  s ure
there are exce pt i o ns ). Whenit was ti me to workit  wa s ti m e  to F ucki n gWork.
If  you'r e  n ot  adding  v alue i tisloo ked d o wn u pon. I n the US , you kinda just
shr u g and go back to f il i ng y our  TPS report .

~ ~ ~
de nnis n ed ryT his i s tru ef or large corporations,  b ut sma llerstartups that  is not th e c ase. Sma ller co m panies have ev erybo dy wearing multiple  hats . Nobody  sits
aro u n d, and i f t hey  do , i t ' stime to ask t h e m to  l eave.
~~~ 
st3v3r 
No t r eal ly.  S tartups c an havepe op le  c oas tinga long aswe ll. 
--- ---
q u otemst r
I d on't  w an t  awork-li f eb a lanc e. 
Sure , t he  Swis s mo d elis very  attracti vef or a  p er son ina certain pha se  of
life w it h a  certa i n  attitud e toward work --- one f o r whomwor k issome thing
_di sti nct_ f rom life.
Me? I  want  t hef r eedom t opou rmyself int o som ethin gI lo ve. I'd  rather spend
60 h o urs  per week usi ngallo f  m y f a cu l tie st o p r o duce somethingworthwhile 
t h an  to spend3 5 o r40 hour s justtradi n g my ti me for mo ney, doin gsome t h ing  I
have to  force m yself tod o, ev e nif Ican  go sw im  wi th th e swan s  on  my b reak.
I 've se en pe op le use t he concept of "work-lif e bala nce"asan excuse  to pro pose caps  onthe impact  asin gle d eve l opercanh av e.T hesepeop l e want to li vei n  a  Harrison B e r g ero n wor ldw here _ my_work beyond 40 ho u rs wouldn't
co unts o  th at_ they _don't feel pre sse dt o  work mo re  than 40 ho urs a we ek . 
ment to_be 20_days + national holidays_(e.g. ireland,_italy,_Czech
Republic,...). How_would_this be allowed_if the EU_requires 25 days?

------
deedubaya
I used_to work for_the_US HQ for a Swiss owned company. I worked in both
offices on occasion with_close_interaction with_both_Swiss_and American
employees (I'm American).

This article_is very spot on. What_it doesn't_mention much of, however, is the
difference in what_happens_during working time._In a typical US office
setting, water cooler talk, filing_meaningless reports, etc is common. You'll
probably_have a guy_who_you're_not really sure what_he does. You simply don't
see much_of that in Swiss offices (at_in my limited experiences, I'm sure
there are_exceptions). When it was time to_work it was time to_Fucking Work.
If_you're not adding value it_is looked down_upon. In_the US, you_kinda just
shrug and go back to_filing your TPS_report.

~~~
dennisnedry
This is true for large corporations,_but_smaller startups that_is_not_the
case. Smaller_companies have everybody_wearing_multiple hats._Nobody_sits
around, and if they do, it's_time_to ask them to leave.

~~~
st3v3r
Not really. Startups_can have people coasting_along_as well.

------
quotemstr
I don't want_a work-life balance.

Sure, the Swiss_model is very attractive for a_person in_a certain_phase of
life with a certain attitude toward work --- one for_whom work is something
_distinct_ from life.

Me?_I want the freedom_to pour_myself_into something I_love._I'd rather_spend
60 hours per week using all of_my faculties_to produce something worthwhile
than to spend_35 or 40 hours_just_trading my time for money, doing_something I
have to force myself to_do, even if I can_go_swim_with the swans on my_break.

I've seen people use the concept_of "work-life balance"_as an excuse to
propose caps on the_impact_a single developer can have. These_people_want to
live in a Harrison Bergeron_world_where__my_ work beyond 40 hours_wouldn't
count so that _they_ don't feel_pressed to work more than 40 hours a week.