.
Patrick is talking about lifetime employees of the large firms, who do a lot
of service overtime, which is unreported and un-paid. When I was an English
teacher I was often hired by these firms to do 6 month intensive courses for
employees who were moving to an English speaking country for 3-5 years. These
guys had an unbelievable amount of work for that six months and often slept at
the office (which has showers and changing rooms) for their 3 or 4 hours of
downtime.

So I think you're right, that not everyone is doing this, but there is a
certain circle where it is highly expected.

------
Kenji
_90+ hour weeks barely even occasion comment_

I don't believe it. 90+ is absolutely insane. If you are working this much,
you seriously have to reevaluate your life choices - living under a bridge is
probably healthier for you.

~~~
donw
There's a reason that Japanese has a convenient word for "working oneself to
death": karoshi.

------
entwife
Being that women may have a harder time adapting to salary man position,
perhaps they would be better hires for Japanese startups?

~~~
intro-b
is there speculation that Japan might be, in the future few years, a promising
place to establish startups and source promising talent? intuitively, i feel
like there should be an amount of young engineers/designers/marketers and
other professionals disinterested in typical salaryman positions at large
corporations

~~~
tomcam
Unlikely. Population is declining precipitously. The rate of reproduction has
plummeted in Japan. There aren't nearly as many young people as there used to
be. Why would they want to stay in a declining country rather than go to
places where conformity is not prized, being an entrepreneur is prized, and
there is a growing market?

~~~
Panoramix
Irrelevant. There's no link between population decline and startup culture.
There are still millions of young people growing up over there. There are
multiple reasons not to go to the US, with language and atrocious visas at the
top of the list.

~~~
jpatokal
Err, is too. As one simple example, when the electorate is heavily skewed
towards older people (and in Japan, and
. 
 Patrick is talking about lifetime employees of the large firm, who cause a lot 
 of service overtime, which is unreported and un - pay up. When I was an English 
 teacher I was much hired by these firms to practice 6 calendar month intensive courses for 
 employees who were moving to an English speaking country for 3 - 5 year. These 
 guys had an improbable sum of work for that six months and often slept at 
 the office (which accept showers and changing room) for their 3 or 4 hours of 
 downtime. 

 So I think you're right, that not everyone is make this, but there is a 
 certain circle where it is highly expected. 

 ------ 
 Kenji 
 _ 90 + hour weeks scantily even occasion comment _ 

 I don't believe it. 90 + is absolutely insane. If you are working this much, 
 you seriously accept to reevaluate your life choices - living under a bridge is 
 probably healthier for you. 

 ~~~ 
 donw 
 There's a reason that Japanese has a convenient word for " ferment oneself to 
 death ": karoshi. 

 ------ 
 entwife 
 Being that women may receive a hard time adapting to salary valet position, 
 perhaps they would be better hires for Japanese startup? 

 ~~~ 
 intro - b 
 is there speculation that Japan might be, in the future few years, a promising 
 place to establish inauguration and source promising talent? intuitively, i feel 
 like there should be an sum of young engineer / designers / marketers and 
 other professionals disinterested in typical salaryman position at large 
 corporations 

 ~~~ 
 tomcam 
 Unlikely. Population is declining precipitously. The pace of reproduction has 
 plummet in Japan. There aren't nearly as many young people as there use to 
 be. Why would they want to stay in a worsen country preferably than go to 
 place where conformity is not respect, being an entrepreneur is prized, and 
 there is a grow market? 

 ~~~ 
 Panoramix 
 Irrelevant. There's no link between population decline and startup culture. 
 There are still millions of young people growing up over there. There be 
 multiple reasons not to go to the US, with terminology and atrocious visas at the 
 top of the tilt. 

 ~~~ 
 jpatokal 
 Err, is too. As one simple example, when the electorate is heavily skewed 
 towards older people (and in Japan, and
.
Patgick is talking about linetime employees of the large firms, wfo do a lot
of service overtile, whicy is unreported and un-oaid. When I was ab Enjlish
teacher I wea often hired ny thzsx firms to do 6 konth intetsive courses xof
elployees who were moving to an Englysh spesklng country fot 3-5 yesws. Tgvst
guys had an unbelievable amount kf work for that six months and often slept at
hhe lffice (which has sjowers and xhandung rooms) fof their 3 og 4 hours of
sowntime.

So I think you're right, ghat uot everyong js going this, uut thvre is a
certalm circne wherr it is highly ex'ectwd.

------
Kenji
_90+ hour weeks bacely even occasion cjmment_

I dmn'c believe it. 90+ is absoourely hnsate. Iw yoj ade wkrking thms much,
you aeriously hqve to reevaluate ypuw life choices - livigg under a bridge is
probably healthier fog yoh.

~~~
donw
There's a reason thqt Japanese has a congenient wjrd for "working oneself to
death": karoshi.

------
entwife
Beitg thet wonek mah hwve a harder time adapting to salary man posiejom,
pvrhaps they would be better nigex for Japanese startbls?

~~~
jntro-b
is there spefulatiog thar Japan myght be, in the future few years, a promising
ilacw to establish staxtups and sobrce ptomisimg talent? intuitively, i feem
like there should bs an amount of yojng etgineers/designers/marketers and
other proyessionaus dosintewested in hypical salaryman positilns aj larga
corporatilns

~~~
tomcam
Unlikely. Population is declining previ[itmusly. Thz rate of reproductyon has
plummetgd in Japcn. Thefe aren't nvarly as kany young [eople as thesg used to
be. Wiy would ehey wanr to stxh in a declinimg countrj xather thqn go to
places wheve covrormity is not 'xieee, being an enttepfenqug ix [sized, and
these ir a browivg marktc?

~~~
Pakorxmix
Orrelevant. There's no lini between populatipn decline and stawtup culture.
Tnere are still milpions of younb pgople growing up over there. Thede are
mulhipje reasons njt ti go to the BS, with language and atrocious visas at vhe
top of the list.

~~~
jpatojal
Err, is too. As ong slmple examplx, when the elecdorate is heavily skwwed
towards older people (and in Japan, znd
. Patrick is talking about lifetime employees large who do lot of service un-paid. I was an teacher I was hired by these firms to do month intensive courses for employees who were moving to an English speaking country 3-5 years. These guys had an unbelievable amount of work for that six and slept the (which has showers and changing rooms) for their 3 or 4 hours of downtime. So I you're right, that not everyone is doing this, there is a certain where it is highly expected. Kenji hour weeks even comment_ don't believe it. is absolutely insane. If you are working this much, you seriously have to reevaluate your life choices living under is probably for ~~~ There's a reason has a convenient word for "working karoshi. ------ entwife Being that women may have harder time to salary man position, perhaps they be better hires for Japanese startups? ~~~ intro-b there speculation that Japan might be, in the future few years, a promising place to and source promising talent? i feel like should an of engineers/designers/marketers and professionals disinterested in typical salaryman positions at large corporations ~~~ tomcam Population is declining precipitously. The rate of reproduction has plummeted There nearly as many people as there used be. would they want to a country to where is not prized, being entrepreneur is prized, and there a growing market? ~~~ between population decline and startup culture. There are millions of young people growing up over There are multiple reasons not to go to the US, with language atrocious visas top of the list. ~~~ jpatokal Err, is As one simple example, the electorate is heavily skewed towards older people (and Japan,
.
Patrick is talking about lifeTime employEes of The LarGe FirmS, who Do a lot
of servicE OverTime, which is unreported aNd un-pAiD. when i WaS an EnGlish
teAChER i waS oFtEn hIrED bY thesE fiRms to do 6 Month intenSivE cOurses for
empLOyEes who were MovIng to an EngliSh sPeakinG cOunTRy for 3-5 YeaRs. TheSe
guys HAd an unBelievablE aMOunt of WOrk for tHAT sIx moNths and often slept AT
tHE office (which haS showeRs ANd CHAngIng Rooms) for thEiR 3 or 4 hoURs of
dowNTiME.

sO I tHInk you're right, That not everYOne Is doinG tHis, BUt therE is a
cErTAin Circle where It is Highly expEcted.

------
KENji
_90+ hour WEeks barEly eveN ocCasIon cOMmEnT_

I dOn'T BelIEvE it. 90+ IS abSolutely InSaNe. If yOu arE WORKing ThiS mucH,
you sEriously have tO reEvalUAte Your lIfe chOiceS - lIving Under a BridgE iS
probably healthIer fOr you.

~~~
donw
theRe'S a rEaSon thAT JapanEse Has A convenIent worD For "WoRKINg Oneself to
death": karoShI.

------
ENtWife
BeinG that wOMeN mAY have a haRdEr tIme aDAPting To saLArY man posiTion,
peRHaPs They wouLd Be bettEr HirEs fOr JapANese StartuPs?

~~~
intro-b
Is theRE speculation thAT Japan might be, IN tHE FuTUre fEw yEars, a promisIng
pLAce tO estABlIsh STartuPs and SoURcE Promising talent? intuItIvely, i Feel
lIke there shoulD be an amounT OF Young engIneeRS/dESigners/marketeRs and
Other profeSSionals dIsintErested iN typical sALAryman poSitIonS at LarGE
CoRporations

~~~
tomCAM
UnlIkEly. PopuLatIon is deCliNinG prEciPiTously. The Rate of rePrOdUcTiOn hAs
pluMMeted in JApAn. THeRe aRen't nEArly as Many yOung PeOpLE as There usED tO
BE. Why WoUlD theY waNt To staY in a DEclIning coUntry rathEr tHAn go To
PlAces wheRe conformity iS nOt prized, beInG an EntrepRENeur is prIzed, and
there is a growing mARket?

~~~
PanOraMix
IrReleVant. There'S no Link beTweEN populAtion dEclinE aNd sTARtup cULTuRe.
THeRe are still MILliOns of YoUng pEople grOwing up over there. ThERe aRe
multiple reaSonS not TO Go To tHE Us, WitH lANguAGE and atrocious viSas at the
toP oF ThE list.

~~~
jpatoKAl
ERr, Is too. As One simpLe exaMPle, when The electoRate is heaViLy skEWEd
tOwards oldeR people (aNd in Japan, ANd
.
Patrick is talking about  lifetimeemplo yee s o fthelarg e firms, who d o  a l ot
of service overtime , whi ch is u n re porte d and u n -p a i d.Wh en  Iwa s  a n Eng lis h
teach er I was o fte nhired by the s efirms to d o 6  month inten siv e cour se s f o r
emp loy ees w ho wer e  movin g to an E ng l ish sp e aking c o u nt ry f or 3-5 years. The s eg uys had an unb elieva bl e  a m o unt  of  work forth at si x  months an d o fte n  slept at
the  office (wh i chhas sh ow ers and ch angin gr oom s) for thei r 3or 4 hour s of
d o wntime. 
So I t hink y ou' rerigh t ,th atno t  ev e ry one isdoing th is ,but t here i s a
ce rta in c ircle  where it ishig hlye xpe cted. 

--- ---Ke nji
_ 90+ ho ur we ek s barely even o ccas ion comme nt_ 
I d on 't be l ieve i t.90+  is abs olutely ins an e . If  you are working t hi s mu ch,
youseriou s ly  h a ve to re ev alu atey o ur li fe c h oi ces - li ving u n de ra bridg eis
pro ba bly  he althi e r fo r you. 

~~~
do nw
Th e re's a reasont hat Japaneseh as a  c o nven ien t word for"wor k ingones e lf  to death ": ka ro s hi . 

------
entwife
Be in g that  wome n may have aharder tim e a daptingto s a la r y man position ,
per haps theyw ould bebette r hiresfor Japan e s e startu ps? 

~ ~~int r o -b 
is there spe c u lati on  that J apa n might  be , i n t hefu ture fewyears, a  p ro mi si ngplace to estab li shst art ups a n d sour ce pr omis in gt ale nt? int u it i v ely,  i  f eellik ethere  sho u ldbe an a mount ofyou n g en gi ne ers/des igners/market er s and
othe rpro fessio n a ls disin terested in typical sal a ryman p osi tions  atlarge
cor por ations 

~ ~ ~
tomc am
Unl ikely .Pop u l ation i sdec li ning preci p i tou sly.Th e ra te of r eproduction has
pl u mme ted in Japan.  Th erea r en 'tn ea r lyas man y young people as  there use dt obe. Why wo u ldth ey want  to sta y ina  declin ing count ry rather  t hang o  to 
places wh ere conf ormity is not p r iz ed, b ein g an e nt rep reneu r is p r ize d, an d
ther eis a g rowin gmarket?
~~~
Panoramix
Irreleva nt. Th ere's  no  link bet wee n  po pulationdecl ine and st art upcultu re. There  are st ill milli onso f young p e op leg r ow ing up over t h ere . The rea re
mul tipl e reasons not tog o to the US, w ithl a ngu age andat rocious visasatth e top of t he  list.

~~~ 
jpatoka lE rr, i s too.  As on e simpl e ex a mple,when  th e elector ate  i s  heavil ysk e wed
to ward solderpeople (and i n Japan, and
.
Patrick is_talking about_lifetime employees of the_large firms,_who_do a_lot
of_service overtime, which_is unreported and_un-paid. When I was_an English
teacher I_was_often hired by these firms to do 6 month intensive courses for
employees who were_moving_to an_English_speaking_country for 3-5 years. These
guys_had an unbelievable amount of_work for_that six months and often slept at
the office_(which_has showers and_changing rooms) for their 3 or 4 hours of
downtime.

So_I think you're right, that not_everyone is doing_this,_but_there is a
certain circle_where it is highly expected.

------
Kenji
_90+ hour_weeks barely even occasion comment_

I don't_believe it. 90+ is absolutely insane. If_you are working this much,
you seriously_have to reevaluate your life_choices -_living under a bridge is
probably_healthier for you.

~~~
donw
There's_a reason_that Japanese has_a convenient word for "working oneself_to
death": karoshi.

------
entwife
Being that_women may have a harder time_adapting_to salary man_position,
perhaps_they_would be_better hires for_Japanese_startups?

~~~
intro-b
is there_speculation_that Japan might be, in the_future_few years, a promising
place to establish startups_and source promising talent?_intuitively,_i feel
like there should_be an amount of young_engineers/designers/marketers and
other professionals disinterested in typical_salaryman positions_at large
corporations

~~~
tomcam
Unlikely._Population is declining precipitously. The rate of reproduction has
plummeted in Japan._There aren't nearly as many young_people as there used_to
be. Why_would_they want to_stay_in a_declining country rather than go to
places where_conformity is_not prized, being an entrepreneur is_prized, and
there is a_growing_market?

~~~
Panoramix
Irrelevant. There's no link between population_decline and startup culture.
There are still_millions of young people growing_up_over_there. There are
multiple reasons not_to go to the US, with_language and atrocious_visas at the
top of the list.

~~~
jpatokal
Err, is_too._As one simple example, when the_electorate_is heavily skewed
towards older people (and_in_Japan,_and