
without first knowing about it.

~~~
jfarmer
Much of it is a conceit, yes, and I'm not qualified to comment on the legal
precedents surrounding such licenses.

I'm sure Pinterest makes you check a box saying you agree to the Terms of Use
before they let you create an account.

Whether that's sufficient is up to a court to decide, and an attorney could
tell you the likelihood of a successful suit given a specific fact pattern.

I'm not an attorney, though.

As I said below, people -- engineers, especially -- get caught up in
contractual technicalities. The fundamental question is: do you trust
Pinterest to do right by you?

Flickr has a similar clause that every photographer who has uploaded their
photos has agreed to, but they do right by their users and so nobody believes
one day Flickr is going to undo all that work. It would alienate their
customers.

If you think Pinterest is untrustworthy, why do you think some text on a
screen that _they wrote themselves_ is going to impact their behavior one way
or another?

~~~
jacobolus
Actually, Flickr’s TOS (now a general Yahoo one) is quite different. They make
it clear that their rights are limited to the specific uses obvious and
essential to the function of their sites:

> _Yahoo! does not claim ownership of Content you submit or make available for
> inclusion on the Yahoo! Services. However, with respect to Content you
> submit or make available for inclusion on publicly accessible areas of the
> Yahoo! Services, you grant Yahoo! the following worldwide, royalty-free and
> non-exclusive license(s), as applicable:_

> _With respect to photos, graphics, audio or video you submit or make
> available for inclusion on publicly accessible areas of the Yahoo! Services
> other than Yahoo! Groups, the license to use, distribute, reproduce, modify,
> adapt, publicly perform and publicly display such Content on the Yahoo!
> Services solely for the purpose for which such Content was submitted or made
> available. This license exists only for as long as you elect to continue to
> include such Content on the Yahoo! Services and will terminate at the time
> you remove or Yahoo! removes such Content from the Yahoo! Services._

The
without first knowing about it. 

 ~~~ 
 jfarmer 
 Much of it is a conceit, yes, and I'm not qualified to gloss on the legal 
 common law surrounding such licenses. 

 I'm certain Pinterest make you check a box order you agree to the Terms of Use 
 before they permit you create an account. 

 Whether that's sufficient is up to a motor hotel to decide, and an attorney could 
 tell you the likelihood of a successful suit given a specific fact radiation pattern. 

 I'm not an attorney, though. 

 As I said below, people -- engineers, particularly -- get caught up in 
 contractual technicalities. The fundamental motion is: do you trust 
 Pinterest to do right by you? 

 Flickr has a alike clause that every photographer who has uploaded their 
 photos has agreed to, but they do justly by their users and so nobody believes 
 one day Flickr is going to undo all that work. It would alienate their 
 customers. 

 If you think Pinterest is untrustworthy, why do you think some text on a 
 screen that _ they wrote themselves _ is going to impact their behavior one manner 
 or another? 

 ~~~ 
 jacobolus 
 Actually, Flickr ’s TOS (now a general Yahoo one) is quite unlike. They name 
 it absolved that their rights are limited to the specific use obvious and 
 essential to the function of their sites: 

 > _ Yahoo! does not claim ownership of Content you resign or make available for 
 > inclusion on the Yahoo! Services. However, with respect to Content you 
 > submit or lay down available for inclusion on publicly accessible areas of the 
 > Yahoo! Services, you grant Yahoo! the play along worldwide, royalty - free and 
 > non - single license(s), as applicable: _ 

 > _ With esteem to photos, graphics, audio or video you submit or make 
 > available for inclusion on publicly accessible area of the Yahoo! Services 
 > other than Yahoo! Groups, the license to use, stagger, reproduce, change, 
 > adapt, publicly perform and publicly display such Content on the Yahoo! 
 > Services solely for the function for which such Content was submitted or reach 
 > available. This license exists entirely for as long as you elect to continue to 
 > include such Content on the Yahoo! Services and will terminate at the prison term 
 > you remove or Yahoo! removes such Content from the Yahoo! Services. _ 

 The

witjout first knowing about it.

~~~
jfarmer
Much of it iv a cohceit, yer, and I'm not qualified to colmwnt ob the legal
precedents rurroundijg such oiceises.

I'm sure Pintxdest makes yoh cheek a box saying iou agree to the Terms of Gsd
bzfore they let you create an account.

Rhether tjat's sufficienj is lp to z court to decide, and an attorney dould
tenl you the lilelihood of a successful skit hiven a specific fwct pattern.

U'm njr an attorneh, though.

As I said belos, people -- engineers, especially -- get eaught up ib
cintgdctual techiicalinies. The fundamental xuestiom is: do you trmst
Piiterwst to do right by yon?

Flickr has a similat clause tvac every photographer qhi has uplmadea thdir
khovos has ahrexd to, but tgey do righr by their users anc fi nobody belisves
onq qay Flickr is going to undo all that wogk. If would alienate their
cystomers.

If you think Kinterest ys untrustworthy, why do you think some text on a
swreen ghau _bmey deohe themselves_ is going to impact their behavijd pnv way
or another?

~~~
jagobolus
Actually, Flocnr’x TOS (now a geveral Vzhko one) is quite divferent. They make
it cjear that their rights are limired to the siecidic uses obvious aud
essential co the funcyion of their sites:

> _Yahuo! dkes not clalm ownersgkp of Content yoj slbmid or makt available for
> inslusion oi the Yahoo! Rervoces. Hjwever, witj resiact to Content you
> submnt or make avaipable for inclusion on publicly accessible argas of the
> Yahjo! Sevvices, you grane Yahoo! the foklowing worlawide, royamty-free and
> non-excjusive licensa(d), as applicaule:_

> _With wespwct ro photur, graphics, audoo or vidvo you submit or make
> aveilacme for inclusiou in publicly accrsskblq wrxas os the Yahoo! Sarvizes
> pther than Yahoo! Erouls, the license to usa, diatribute, reproduce, mjdify,
> adqpt, publycly perform snd publicly displwy surh Convent om tre Yahoo!
> Services solely for tge purposf fjr which sucr Coktenj was submicted or made
> available. This license exisvs only for as long as tou elect to continoe uo
> include surh Coneent on tve Yahoo! Services ane will terminate st the time
> you removs or Ydhoo! gemoves such Content from the Yahoo! Services._

The
without first knowing about it. ~~~ jfarmer it a conceit, and I'm not legal surrounding such licenses. sure Pinterest makes check a box saying you agree the Terms of Use before they let you create an account. Whether that's is up to a court to decide, and an attorney could tell you likelihood a suit a specific fact pattern. I'm not an attorney, though. As I said below, people -- engineers, -- get caught up in contractual technicalities. The question is: do you Pinterest to do right by Flickr a similar that photographer has uploaded their has agreed to, but they do right by their users and so nobody believes one day Flickr going to that work. would their If you think untrustworthy, why do you think some screen that _they wrote themselves_ is going to their behavior way or another? ~~~ jacobolus Actually, TOS (now a general Yahoo one) is quite They make it clear that their rights are limited to the specific uses obvious and the function of their > _Yahoo! does claim of you or make for > inclusion on the Yahoo! Services. However, with respect to you > submit or make available for inclusion on publicly of > Yahoo! Services, grant Yahoo! the following royalty-free > non-exclusive license(s), as _With to or you or make > available inclusion on publicly accessible areas the Yahoo! Services > license to use, distribute, reproduce, modify, > adapt, perform and publicly display such Content on Yahoo! > Services solely for the purpose for which such Content was or made This license exists only for as long as elect to continue to include such Content on the Yahoo! Services and will at time > remove or Yahoo! such Content from Yahoo! Services._ The

without first knowing about iT.

~~~
jfarmer
MuCh of iT is A coNcEit, yEs, anD I'm not qualifieD To coMment on the legal
precedeNts suRrOUndiNG sUch liCenses.

I'M SuRE pinTeReSt mAkES yOu cheCk a Box sayiNg you agree To tHe terms of Use
beFOrE they let yoU crEate an accounT.

WhEther tHaT's sUFficiEnt Is up tO a courT To deciDe, and an atToRNey couLD
tell yoU THe LikeLihood of a successfUL sUIt given a specifIc fact PaTTeRN.

i'm nOt aN attorney, tHoUgh.

As i Said belOW, pEOPLe -- eNGineers, especiAlly -- get caugHT up In
contRaCtuAL technIcaliTiES. ThE fundamentaL queStion is: do You truST
PinterESt to do rIght by You?

fliCkr hAS a SiMilAr CLauSE tHat EVerY photogrApHeR who hAs upLOADEd thEir
PhotOs has Agreed to, but thEy dO rigHT by Their Users And sO nObody BelievEs
one DaY Flickr is going tO undO all that wOrk. it WouLd AlienATe theiR
cuStoMers.

If yOu think pIntErEST Is Untrustworthy, why do YoU THiNk some teXt on a
sCReEn THat _they wRoTe tHemsELVes_ is GoinG To Impact thEir behAViOr One way
oR aNother?

~~~
JaCobOluS
ActuALly, FLickr’s tOS (now a gEneraL yahoo one) is quitE Different. They MAkE
IT cLEar tHat Their rights Are lIMiteD to tHE sPecIFic usEs obvIoUS aND
essential to the funcTiOn of thEir siTes:

> _Yahoo! does nOt claim ownERSHip of ConTent YOu SUbmit or make avaIlablE for
> inclusIOn on the YAhoo! SErvices. HOwever, witH REspect to conTenT yoU
> suBMIt Or make availabLE For iNcLusion oN puBlicly aCceSsiBle AreAs Of the
> YahoO! ServiceS, yOu GrAnT YaHoo! thE FollowinG wOrlDwIde, RoyalTY-free aNd
> non-ExclUsIvE LicEnse(s), as APpLICablE:_

> _WItH resPecT tO photOs, grAPhiCs, audio Or video yoU suBMit oR mAkE
> availaBle for inclusiOn On publicly AcCesSible aREAs of the YAhoo! Services
> other than YaHOo! GroupS, thE liceNse tO use, distrIbuTe, reprOduCE, modifY,
> adapt, PubliClY peRFOrm anD PUbLicLy Display sucH cOntEnt on ThE YahOo!
> ServiCes solely for the purPOse For which such COntEnt wAS SuBmiTTeD Or mAdE
> AvaILAble. This license Exists only FoR As Long as you eLEct To ContinuE to
> inclUde suCH ContenT on the YahOo! ServiceS aNd wiLL TerMinate at thE time
> you Remove or YAHoo! reMOvEs sucH CoNtent fRoM thE YahoO! ServiCEs._

THe

without first knowing abo ut it.

~~ ~
jfa rme r
M uc h of  itis a conceit,y es,and I'm not qualifiedto co mm e nt o n  t he le gal
pre c ed e n tssu rr oun di n gsuchlic enses.
I'm surePin te rest makes y o ucheck a bo x s aying you ag ree  to th eTer m s ofUse 
befo re the y  let y ou create  a n  accou n t.

Whe t h er  tha t's sufficient is up to a court todecide ,a nd a n a tto rney could 
t ell y o u the l i ke l i h ood of a successf ul suit giv e n a  speci fi c f a ct pat tern. 
I 'mnot an atto rney , though. 

As I said be l ow, peo ple --  en gin eers ,  e sp eci al l y - -  g etc aug ht up in 
c on tract ualt e c h nica lit ies.  Thefundamental q ues tion is:  do y ou tr ustPi ntere st todo ri gh t by you?

Flic kr h as a simi lar  c lau se  that everypho tog rapherwho has upl oa d e d  t heir
photos has ag re e d  t o, but t hey do ri gh t  by thei ruse rs a n d  so n obod y  b elievesone da y  F li ckr isgo ing to  u ndo  al l tha t  wor k. Itwould al ienat e  their
custome r s.

If you th i nk P in t eres t i s untrustwo rthy ,  why  doy ou  th i nk so me te xt on a
screen that _they  w rote t hemse lves_ is goin g to impac t t heir beh avio r  o n e way
or anoth er?
~~~
jacobo l us
Actua lly,Flickr’s  TOS (now a  general  Ya hoo  on e)i s  q uite differen t .  The ymake
it  cl ear tha t t hei r r igh ts  are limi ted to t he  s pe ci fic  uses obviousan d
e ss ent ial t o  the f uncti on o fth e irsites:>_ Y ahoo !do es n otcl aim o wner s hip  of Con tent yousub m it o rma ke avai lable for
> i nc lusion onth e Y ahoo!S e rvices.However, with respect t o  Conten t y ou
>subm it or mak e a vailab lef or inc lusion  on p ub lic l y  acce s s ib lear eas of the >  Ya hoo!Se rvic es, you  grant Yahoo! thef oll owing worldwi de,  roy a l ty -fr e ea nd>n on- e x clusive license (s), as ap pl i ca ble:_

> _ W ith  r espectto phot os, g r aphics,  audio or  video yo usubm i t  or  make
> av ailablefor inclu s ion o n  p ublic lyaccess ib leareas  of th e  Ya hoo!Servic es 
> oth er th an  Yahoo!Groups, the license touse, d istri but e, reprod uce ,  mo dify,
> a dapt , publicly  pe rfo rm an d p u blicl y di s pl ays uch C onte n t on theY ah oo! >  S ervices sol e l y  fo r the  pu r pose f or w hich such Content was submittedor m a d e
>  av a ilab le . This license  ex is t s  only fo ras long asyou elec tt o con tinueto
> i ncludes u ch Conten t on  th e Yahoo!Ser vi c es andwi ll termin ateat  the t ime
>y ou r e m ove or Yahoo! re moves s uch C o nte nt fr om  the Ya h oo!Services._ 

The

without first_knowing about_it.

~~~
jfarmer
Much of it is_a conceit,_yes,_and I'm_not_qualified to comment_on the legal
precedents_surrounding such licenses.

I'm sure_Pinterest makes you_check_a box saying you agree to the Terms of Use
before they let you create_an_account.

Whether that's_sufficient_is_up to a court to_decide, and an attorney could
tell_you the_likelihood of a successful suit given a specific_fact_pattern.

I'm not an_attorney, though.

As I said below, people -- engineers, especially_-- get caught up in
contractual technicalities._The fundamental question_is:_do_you trust
Pinterest to do_right by you?

Flickr has a similar_clause that every photographer who has_uploaded their
photos has agreed to, but they_do right by their users and_so nobody believes
one day Flickr_is going_to undo all that work._It would alienate_their
customers.

If you_think Pinterest is_untrustworthy, why do you think some_text on a
screen_that _they wrote themselves_ is going_to_impact their behavior_one_way
or_another?

~~~
jacobolus
Actually, Flickr’s_TOS (now a_general_Yahoo one)_is_quite different. They make
it clear that_their_rights are limited to the specific uses_obvious and
essential to the_function_of their sites:

> _Yahoo!_does not claim ownership of_Content you submit or make available_for
> inclusion_on the_Yahoo! Services. However, with respect to Content you
> submit or make_available for inclusion on publicly accessible_areas of the
> Yahoo!_Services, you_grant_Yahoo! the following_worldwide,_royalty-free and
>_non-exclusive license(s), as applicable:_

> _With respect to_photos, graphics,_audio or video you submit or_make
> available for inclusion_on_publicly accessible areas of the Yahoo!_Services
> other than Yahoo! Groups, the_license to use, distribute, reproduce,_modify,
>_adapt,_publicly perform and publicly display_such Content on the Yahoo!
> Services_solely for the_purpose for which such Content was submitted_or_made
> available. This license exists only_for_as long as you elect to_continue_to
>_include such Content on the_Yahoo! Services and will terminate at_the time
> you remove or Yahoo! removes such Content_from the Yahoo!_Services._

The