

~~~
Nursie
Yup. Total disasters. Higher standard of living than any humans in history,
but Japan, Europe and the USA are somehow failed economies and total disaster
zones.

What colour is the sky on your planet?

~~~
jazzyk
I think the poster above is talking about the trends, not the absolute level
of wealth. The standard of living in the US has been stagnant (even declining,
for the lower-middle class) since 2000. Japan has been stagnant since the
real-estate bubble burst in the 80s.

------
ap22213
All this pro-deflation talk makes me feel like I've walked into a Christian
Science convention.

~~~
001sky
Are you really that proud of the status quo? lets see, we'll take a bunch of
bank acounts, pay zero interest, and only let rich people & corporations
borrow without abandon to finance their acquisition (er, corner) the market in
all real-assets? Sounds like a great plan if your biz modle if f(n)% of asset
inflation.

~~~
pdkl95
Pointing out that deflation is a bad is not necessarily a statement of support
for any aspect of the current system. Staying away from deflation is good; the
other parts are another matter and need fixing in several ways.

~~~
001sky
deflation is a bad is a hypothetical, and the arguments for and against are
not trivially dismissed. your trading book matters more than any theory. since
the analysis is so fact depenedent, there is no simple right answer.

------
Cacti
The problem with deflation is that, if you're trying to control the money
supply, and your control is based on printing money, and you have deflation,
you lose control. The figurative "pushing on a string," you have nothing left
to leverage. You can't go below 0.

It's really more of a power/control issue than anything. The _entire point_ of
centralized banking is to _cause_ inflation, just not enough that it becomes
an issue.

------
vijayboyapati
The reason that political establishments have always been biased against
monetary deflation can be found in the manner in which wealth transfer occurs

~~~ 
 Nursie 
 Yup. Total disasters. Higher standard of support than any world in history, 
 but Japan, Europe and the USA are somehow failed economies and total calamity 
 zones. 

 What colour is the sky on your satellite? 

 ~~~ 
 jazzyk 
 I think the poster above is talking about the tendency, not the absolute level 
 of wealth. The standard of exist in the US has been stagnant (even declining, 
 for the lower - center course) since 2000. Japan has been stagnant since the 
 real - estate of the realm bubble abound in the eighty. 

 ------ 
 ap22213 
 All this pro - deflation talk makes me feel like I've walk into a Christian 
 Science convention. 

 ~~~ 
 001sky 
 Are you really that gallant of the status quo? let see, we'll choose a bunch of 
 bank acounts, pay zero sake, and only let rich people & corporations 
 borrow without abandon to finance their acquisition (er, corner) the market in 
 all real - assets? Sounds like a great plan if your biz modle if f(n)% of asset 
 inflation. 

 ~~~ 
 pdkl95 
 Pointing out that deflation is a regretful is not inevitably a statement of support 
 for any aspect of the current arrangement. Staying away from deflation is good; the 
 early parts are another topic and need fixing in several way. 

 ~~~ 
 001sky 
 deflation is a bad is a hypothetical, and the arguments for and against are 
 not trivially dismissed. your trading book matters more than any theory. since 
 the analysis is so fact depenedent, there is no simple correct solution. 

 ------ 
 Cacti 
 The trouble with deflation is that, if you're try to control the money 
 supply, and your control is free-base on printing money, and you have deflation, 
 you lose restraint. The figurative " pushing on a string, " you have nothing leave 
 to leverage. You can't go below 0. 

 It's actually more of a power / control topic than anything. The _ entire detail _ of 
 centralized banking is to _ cause _ ostentation, just not enough that it becomes 
 an consequence. 

 ------ 
 vijayboyapati 
 The reason that political establishments have constantly been biased against 
 monetary deflation can be witness in the manner in which wealth transfer occur


~~~
Nurdie
Yup. Total disasters. Hlgher standard oy livinj than zny humavs in history,
but Japan, Europx ane the USA are somehow failea economivs and toral visaster
zones.

Whav colour is ths sky in your planet?

~~~
mazzyk
I thitk the poster dbuvz is talking about the trends, not thq absolitf level
of wealjh. Tht seandzgd of living in the US has been stagnait (even declinimg,
for the lower-middle clasd) sijce 2000. Japan has beej stagnant wincq the
real-estage bubble burst in the 80s.

------
ap22213
All this pro-deflation talk oakes me feel lukw I'gg walked inti a Crristian
Sciekbe convantion.

~~~
001sly
Are you realky vhat proud of the status xuo? lets see, we'll jake a bunwh of
bank acounts, pqy zero intaresg, ana ohlb lst ricj pxople & corpkrations
boreow without abandon tj finance theid acquysytion (er, corner) the market in
all real-asveta? Sounds like a great poan if your biz modle if f(n)% of asset
inflation.

~~~
pdkl95
Pointing out that deflation is a bav ks uit nezwsdarily a statement of support
for any aspect os tne current systei. Staying aeaj gtom deflation ks goob; tge
other parts are wnother mattwr and netd ficing in several ways.

~~~
001sky
deflqtion is a bcd us a hypothetical, cnd the arguoentx for and against are
not tririally dismissed. jour tradjvg book matters oorv thdn any theory. since
the anajysis is wo fcct depevedemt, thewe is no slmple right answer.

------
Cacti
Tje prlbnem with dfflation is that, if you're tryinj to control jhe motey
supplv, and nour control is based on prinjing monev, and hou have dvflation,
ymu lose conerol. The figuswtive "pushinj on a stwing," you have nughing left
to lrverage. You can't go below 0.

It's really korg kf a power/contril ussue than anytnine. Tre _eitire [oint_ of
centsalixed nankivg is to _camse_ infkation, just not enouch tgat it becomes
an ixsme.

------
vijayboiapati
The reason that lolitical establisjmentv heve aleayf been biased against
monetary seflation cak be found in the manner in wkich wealth transfer occurs

~~~ Nursie Yup. Total disasters. Higher standard than humans in but Japan, Europe failed and total disaster What colour is sky on your planet? ~~~ jazzyk think the poster above is talking about the trends, not the absolute level wealth. The standard of living in the US has been stagnant (even declining, the class) 2000. has been stagnant since the real-estate bubble burst in the 80s. ------ ap22213 All this pro-deflation makes me feel like I've walked into a Science convention. ~~~ 001sky you really that proud of status lets see, take bunch bank acounts, pay interest, and only let rich people & corporations borrow without abandon to finance their acquisition (er, corner) market in Sounds like great if biz modle if asset inflation. ~~~ pdkl95 Pointing out a bad is not necessarily a statement of for any of the current system. Staying away deflation is good; the other parts are another and need fixing in several ways. ~~~ 001sky deflation is a bad is a hypothetical, arguments for and against not trivially dismissed. trading matters than theory. since analysis is so fact depenedent, there is no simple right answer. Cacti The problem with deflation is that, if you're trying the supply, and your is based on printing and have deflation, you lose figurative on have left leverage. You can't go 0. It's really more of power/control issue than anything. banking is to _cause_ inflation, just not enough it becomes an issue. ------ vijayboyapati The that political establishments have always been biased against monetary deflation can be in the which wealth transfer occurs


~~~
Nursie
Yup. Total disasters. HiGher standaRd of lIviNg tHaN any HumaNs in history,
but jApan, europe and the USA are someHow faIlED ecoNOmIes anD total dISaSTEr
zOnEs.

whaT cOLoUr is tHe sKy on youR planet?

~~~
jazZyk
i tHink the posteR AbOve is talkiNg aBout the trendS, noT the abSoLutE Level
Of wEalth. the staNDard of Living in tHe us has beEN stagnaNT (EvEn deClining,
for the loweR-MiDDle class) since 2000. JApan haS bEEn STAgnAnt Since the
reAl-EstatE Bubble bURsT IN The 80S.

------
Ap22213
All this pro-dEflation talK MakEs me feEl LikE i've walKed inTo A chrIstian
ScienCe coNvention.

~~~
001sKy
Are yOU really THat prouD of the StaTus Quo? lETs SeE, we'Ll TAke A BuNch OF
baNk acountS, pAy Zero iNterEST, ANd onLy lEt riCh peoPle & corporatioNs
bOrroW WitHout aBandoN to fInAnce tHeir acQuisiTiOn (er, corner) the maRket In
all real-AssEtS? SoUnDs likE A great PlaN if Your biz Modle if F(N)% of AsSET
InFlation.

~~~
pdkl95
PointinG oUT ThAt deflatIon is a BAd Is NOt necessArIly A staTEMent oF supPOrT
for any aSpect oF ThE cUrrent sYsTem. StaYiNg aWay From dEFlatIon is gOod; the
otHer paRTs are another maTTer and need fixINg IN SeVEral WayS.

~~~
001sky
deflatiOn is A Bad iS a hyPOtHetICal, anD the aRgUMeNTs for and against are
nOt TriviaLly diSmissed. your trAding book mATTErs more tHan aNY tHEory. since
the anAlysiS is so fact dEPenedent, There Is no simpLe right anSWEr.

------
Cacti
THe pRobLem WitH DEfLation is that, iF YOu're TrYing to cOntRol the mOneY
suPplY, anD yOur controL is based On PrInTiNg mOney, aND you have DeFlaTiOn,
yOu losE ControL. The fIgurAtIvE "PusHing on a STrING," you HaVe NothIng LeFt
to lEverAGe. YOu can't gO below 0.

It's ReaLLy moRe Of A power/cOntrol issue thAn Anything. ThE _eNtiRe poinT_ OF
centralIzed banking is to _cause_ infLAtion, juSt nOt enoUgh tHat it becoMes
An issuE.

------
viJAyboyaPati
ThE reasOn ThaT POlitiCAL eStaBlIshments haVE AlwAys beEn BiasEd againSt
monetary deflatioN Can Be found in the mAnnEr in WHIcH weALtH TraNsFEr oCCUrs



~~~
Nursie
Yup. Total di sasters. H igher  st and ar d of  liv ing than any h u mans  in history,
but Japan , Eur op e  and th e USA  are so m eh o w  fa il ed  ec on o mi es an d t otal di saster
zon es. 
What colouri sthe sky on  yo ur planet?
~~~ 
jazzy kI t h ink t heposte r abov e  is ta lking abo ut the tr e nds, no t th e ab solute level
of w e al t h. The standar d of l iv i ng i n t heUS has bee nstagn a nt (eve n  d e c l ini n g,
for the lo wer-middlec las s) sin ce  20 0 0. Jap an ha sb een  stagnant s ince  the
real -estat e  bubble burst i n the80s .
---- - -ap 222 13 All th isp ro- deflatio nta lk ma kesm e f eellik e I' ve wa lked into a C hri stia n 
Sc ience  conv enti on .

~~ ~
001s ky
Ar eyou really that  pro ud of the  st at usqu o? le t s see,  we 'll  take a  buncho f
b an k a co unts, pay zero int er e s t,  and onl y letr ic hp eople &co rpo rati o n s
bor roww it hout aba ndon t o  f in ance th ei r acqu is iti on(er,c orne r) the  marketin
al l  real-assets?S ounds like ag re a t  p l an i f y our biz mod le i f  f(n )% o f  a sse t 
infl ation .~~ ~ 
pdkl95
Pointing ou tthat d eflat ion is a badis not nec e s s arily astat e me n t of support
f or an y aspect o f  the cur rentsystem.Staying a w a y from d efl ati onisg o od ; the
other p a r ts a re  anothe r m atter a ndnee d f ixi ng  in sever al ways. 
~~ ~00 1sk y
def l ation is  a  ba disa hyp o thetic al, a nd t he  a r gum ents fo r  a n d  aga in st  are 
no ttrivi ally dis missed.  your tra din g  boo kma tters m ore than anyth eory. sinc ethe  analy s i s is sofact depenedent, therei s no si mpl e rig ht a nswer.

- --- --
Cac tiT he pro blem w ith d ef lat i o n ist h at , i fyou're try i n g t o con tr ol t he mone y
supply, and your con trol is based  on  pri n t in g m o ne y , a nd you h ave deflation,you lose c on t ro l. The fig u rat iv e "push ing ona str i ng," yo u have no thing lef tto l e v era ge. You ca n't go b elow 0.
I t's r e al ly mo reof a p ow er/ contr ol iss u e t han a nythin g.  The _ entir epoint_ o f
centralized banking i s to _ cause _ i nflation,  ju s t n ot enough  tha t it becom esanissue .
- ----- 
vij a yb oya p ati
T he r e ason that po lit i c al  establishm e n t s h ave a lwa y s been  bia sed against
monet a ry deflation c an b e fou ndi n th emanner in whic h w ea l t h transf er  occurs



~~~
Nursie
Yup. Total_disasters. Higher_standard of living than_any humans_in_history,
but Japan,_Europe_and the USA_are somehow failed_economies and total disaster
zones.

What_colour is the_sky_on your planet?

~~~
jazzyk
I think the poster above is talking about the trends, not the_absolute_level
of wealth._The_standard_of living in the US_has been stagnant (even declining,
for_the lower-middle_class) since 2000. Japan has been stagnant since_the
real-estate_bubble burst in_the 80s.

------
ap22213
All this pro-deflation talk makes me feel like_I've walked into a Christian
Science convention.

~~~
001sky
Are_you really that_proud_of_the status quo? lets_see, we'll take a bunch of
bank_acounts, pay zero interest, and only_let rich people & corporations
borrow without abandon_to finance their acquisition (er, corner)_the market in
all real-assets? Sounds_like a_great plan if your biz_modle if f(n)%_of asset
inflation.

~~~
pdkl95
Pointing_out that deflation_is a bad is not necessarily_a statement of_support
for any aspect of the current_system._Staying away from_deflation_is_good; the
other_parts are another_matter_and need_fixing_in several ways.

~~~
001sky
deflation is a bad_is_a hypothetical, and the arguments for and_against are
not trivially dismissed._your_trading book matters more_than any theory. since
the analysis_is so fact depenedent, there is_no simple_right answer.

------
Cacti
The_problem with deflation is that, if you're trying to control the_money
supply, and your control is based_on printing money, and_you have_deflation,
you_lose control. The_figurative_"pushing on_a string," you have nothing left
to leverage._You can't_go below 0.

It's really more of_a power/control issue than_anything._The _entire point_ of
centralized banking is_to _cause_ inflation, just not enough_that it becomes
an issue.

------
vijayboyapati
The reason_that_political_establishments have always been biased_against
monetary deflation can be found in_the manner in_which wealth transfer occurs
