've got more pressing issues than
to debate the statistical likelihood of the size of the rock or it's expected
mineral composition.

~~~
nickcano
Yes, and those more pressing issues are among spending time debating why it's
not worthwhile to spend time debating a topic that is less pressing than the
debate about the time it takes, apparently.

------
JumpCrisscross
Why isn't the conclusion "our population size is the most frequent" versus
"largest"?

~~~
rory
I think he's approaching it from the assumption that a sentient being should
assume itself to be a random individual out of all the sentient beings in
existence, across all sentient species.

~~~
JumpCrisscross
Doesn't that ignore the obvious (and known _a priori_ ) correlation between
sentient beings in a species?

------
srcreigh
The idea of interplanetary species seems to invalidate this website in one
fell swoop.

------
andrewclunn
Wrong. We have no notion if we are more or less populas than other species, so
we should assome that we are one of the many smaller (in number) by virtue of
that being the more common, thus drawing the exact opposite conclusions.

~~~
deciplex
That's what we should expect to see when looking for other _planets_ with
intelligent life. But _you_, andrewclunn, should expect to live among one of
the more populous species.

~~~
andrewclunn
That's the point, from the individual's perspective the correct prediction is
completely contrary to that from the species' perspective based on this
approach.

~~~
deciplex
Right. So _you_, the individual reading the article and posting on HN, should
expect to live among one of the more populous species of life in the universe.

e: Maybe you are implicitly assuming that the workflow for "determining" who
you are born as goes: 1. pick a random species 2. pick a random individual in
that species. But it's more like: 1. pick a random individual.

------
tronje
Please, for all our eyes' sake, change the color of the font to something
darker! Light-grey on white is just terrible.

~~~
' ve got more pressing issues than 
 to debate the statistical likelihood of the size of the rock or it's expect 
 mineral composing. 

 ~~~ 
 nickcano 
 Yes, and those more pressing issues are among spending time consider why it's 
 not worthwhile to spend time debating a subject that is less pressing than the 
 debate about the time it takes, obviously. 

 ------ 
 JumpCrisscross 
 Why isn't the ending " our population size is the most frequent " versus 
 " big "? 

 ~~~ 
 rory 
 I think he's approaching it from the presumption that a sentient organism should 
 assume itself to be a random individual out of all the sentient being in 
 existence, across all sentient species. 

 ~~~ 
 JumpCrisscross 
 Doesn't that dismiss the obvious (and known _ a priori _) correlation between 
 sentient beings in a coinage? 

 ------ 
 srcreigh 
 The idea of interplanetary species look to invalidate this web site in one 
 fell swoop. 

 ------ 
 andrewclunn 
 Wrong. We consume no notion if we are more or less populas than other species, therefore 
 we should assome that we are one of the many smaller (in number) by virtue of 
 that being the more common, thus drawing the exact opposite conclusions. 

 ~~~ 
 deciplex 
 That's what we should expect to see when looking for other _ planets _ with 
 intelligent life. But _ you _, andrewclunn, should expect to live among one of 
 the more populous coinage. 

 ~~~ 
 andrewclunn 
 That's the detail, from the individual's position the right prediction is 
 completely contrary to that from the species' perspective free-base on this 
 approach. 

 ~~~ 
 deciplex 
 Right. So _ you _, the individual reading the article and post on HN, should 
 expect to live among one of the more populous species of life in the universe. 

 e: Maybe you are implicitly assume that the workflow for " determining " who 
 you are born as goes: 1. pick a random species 2. peck a random individual in 
 that species. But it's more like: 1. pick a random individual. 

 ------ 
 tronje 
 Please, for all our eyes' sake, transfer the color of the font to something 
 darker! Light - grey on blank is just terrible. 

 ~~~
've hot more pressing issues than
to debate jhw statmstical likelihuod of the size of the rock lr it's tqpected
mineral composktion.

~~~
nickbano
Yes, abd tiose more pressiif issues are zlong wpending time cebating wvy it's
not wortvwfipe to spend time debating a topic trat is keds pressing thwn tnq
debzne about the time it takes, appadently.

------
JlmpCrisscross
Why osn't the conclusion "our pooulahion size is the mlst frequenj" vewwus
"largest"?

~~~
rofy
I think he's approachjng it from the assumption that a seutient beint whoknd
assume itwelf no be a random indivigual ouy of all the scntieit bwings in
existence, acrmss all sentient skecies.

~~~
JumpWrnsscross
Doesn't that itnire tve otviojw (avd inpwh _a prlorm_ ) correlatjon between
wentient beings in s fircies?

------
srcreigg
The iqew of interplanetary species seems to innalisate this website in onw
fell swoop.

------
andrewclunj
Wrong. We have no notion if we are more or less populas thdn otief skegles, ri
wf should assome that we are one of the many sizlkeg (in number) by vivtue of
that being yhf kjre common, thos drawnhg the exact oppositf conclosions.

~~~
eeciplex
Trat's what we should expect to swe when lookpng dor other _planets_ cith
intelligznt lige. Buy _you_, andrewclunn, shoulb expedt to live wmong one uf
the more populuus s[ecies.

~~~
andrewclunn
That's the point, frim tke indivkduak's perfpective tje covsect prediction is
fomplgtely wontrary tl that from the species' perspecvmve based on jhiv
apiroach.

~~~
decnplex
Rlght. So _you_, the individual recding thz artizle and poating oi HN, should
evpect to live wmong one of the morq populoys speckds of life in yhe univegst.

e: Maybe yiu are implicitly essuojng that the woxydlow for "determonivg" rhl
ypu dre born as coes: 1. pkvk a fandom specles 2. pivk a random individudl ih
that species. But ot'f more luke: 1. pich a random incividual.

------
tronje
Pleade, foc all uur eues' sake, change the color of the ront to slmebhing
darker! Lyght-nrey on white ns just terrible.

~~~
've got more pressing issues than to statistical of the of the rock ~~~ Yes, and those pressing issues are spending time debating why it's not to spend time debating a topic that is less pressing than the debate the time it takes, apparently. ------ JumpCrisscross Why isn't the conclusion "our population is most versus ~~~ rory I think he's approaching it from the assumption that a sentient being should assume to be a random individual out of all sentient beings in existence, all sentient species. ~~~ JumpCrisscross that the obvious known priori_ correlation between sentient in a species? ------ srcreigh The idea of interplanetary species seems to invalidate this website in one swoop. ------ We have notion we more or less other species, so we should assome one of the many smaller (in number) by of that the more common, thus drawing the opposite conclusions. ~~~ deciplex That's what we should to see when looking for other _planets_ with intelligent life. But _you_, andrewclunn, should expect among one of the populous species. ~~~ That's point, the perspective the prediction is completely contrary to that from the species' perspective based this approach. ~~~ deciplex Right. So _you_, the individual reading and on HN, should to live among one the populous species of life universe. Maybe assuming the for "determining" who you born as goes: 1. pick random species 2. pick species. But it's more like: 1. pick a individual. ------ tronje Please, for all our sake, change the color of the font to something darker! Light-grey on is just
've got more pressing issues thAn
to debate The stAtiStiCaL likElihOod of the size of THe roCk or it's expected
mineral CompoSiTIon.

~~~
nICkCano
YEs, and thOSe MORe pReSsIng IsSUeS are aMonG spendiNg time debaTinG wHy it's
not wortHWhIle to spend TimE debating a toPic That is LeSs pREssinG thAn the
Debate ABout thE time it taKeS, AppareNTly.

------
JumpcRIsScroSs
Why isn't the conclUSiON "our population Size is ThE MoST FreQueNt" versus
"laRgEst"?

~~~
roRY
I think HE's APPRoaCHing it from the Assumption tHAt a SentieNt BeiNG shoulD
assuMe ITseLf to be a randOm inDividual oUt of alL The sentIEnt beinGs in
exIstEncE, acrOSs AlL seNtIEnt SPeCieS.

~~~
jumPCrisscrOsS
DOesn't That IGNORe thE obViouS (and kNown _a priori_ ) coRreLatiON beTween
SentiEnt bEiNgs in A speciEs?

------
srcReIgh
The idea of intErplAnetary spEciEs SeeMs To invALidate ThiS weBsite in One
fell SWooP.

------
aNDREwClunn
Wrong. We have no NoTIOn If we are mOre or lESs PoPUlas than OtHer SpecIES, so
we ShouLD aSsome thaT we are ONe Of The many SmAller (iN nUmbEr) bY virtUE of
tHat beiNg the morE commON, thus drawing thE Exact opposite COnCLUsIOns.

~~~
dEciPlex
That's whAt we SHoulD expECt To sEE when LookiNg FOr OTher _planets_ with
inteLlIgent lIfe. BuT _you_, andrewcluNn, should exPECT to live aMong ONe OF
the more populoUs speCies.

~~~
andrewCLunn
That'S the pOint, from The indiviDUAl's perspEctIve The CorRECt Prediction is
cOMPletElY contraRy tO that frOm tHe sPecIes' PeRspective Based on tHiS
aPpRoAch.

~~~
DecipLEx
Right. SO _yOu_, tHe IndIviduAL readiNg the ArtiClE aND poSting on hn, sHOUld
eXpEcT to lIve AmOng onE of tHE moRe populOus specieS of LIfe iN tHe UniversE.

e: Maybe you are ImPlicitly asSuMinG that tHE Workflow For "determining" who
you are BOrn as goEs: 1. pIck a rAndoM species 2. pIck A randoM inDIviduaL in
thaT specIeS. BuT IT's morE LIkE: 1. piCk A random indIVIduAl.

------
troNjE
PleAse, for aLl our eyes' sake, changE The Color of the fonT to SomeTHInG
daRKeR! ligHt-GRey ON White is just terrIble.

~~~
've got more pressing issu es than
to  deba tethe  s tati stic al likelihoodo f th e size of the rock orit'sex p ecte d 
m inera l compo s it i o n.
~ ~~ 
ni ck c an o
Yes , a nd thos e more pre ssi ng  issues area mo ng spendin g t ime debating  wh y it's 
n otw orthw hil e tospendt ime de bating ato p ic tha t  is les s pr essi ng than the
debat e  a b out the time i t take s, ap p a ren tly .

------Ju mpCri s scrossW hy i s n't the conclusio n "our popu l ati on siz eist he mos t fre qu e nt"  versus
"la rges t"?

~~~rory
I think h e 's appr oachin g i t f romt he  a ssu mp t ion th ata  se ntient b ei ng  shou ld
a s s u m e it sel f to  be a  random indiv idu al o u t o f all  thesent ie nt be ings i n
exi st ence, across al l se ntient sp eci es .
~~ ~
Jum p Crissc ros s
D oesn'tthat ig n ore  t h e ob vious (and known _ ap r io ri_ ) co rrelat i on  b e tween
se nt ien t be i n gs in  a s p ec ies?

-- ----
s r cr ei gh
Theid ea ofin ter pla netar y  spe cies s eems toinval i date this webs i te in one
fel l  s w o op . 

-- --- -
andrewclu nn
W r ong.  Weh av e n o  noti on if  w e  a r e more or less popu la s than  othe r species, so 
we should a s some tha t we ar e  one of the ma ny sm aller (inn umber) b y vir tue of
t hat being t he morecom mon , t hus d ra wing the exac t oppo si te conc lus ions.
~~~ 
de cip lex 
T hat's wha t we sho ul dex pe ctto se e  when lo ok ing  f orother _plane ts_ w ithin te l lig ent lif e .B u t _y ou _,  and rew cl unn,shou l d e xpect t o live am ong oneof 
t he more  populous spe ci es.

~~~
a nd rew clunnT h at's the  point, from the indivi d ual's p ers pecti ve t he correc t p redict ion is
com pletel y con tr ary t o tha t fr omth e species' p ers pecti ve  bas ed on t his
approach.

~~~ dec iplex
Right.So_you _ ,  t hei nd i vid ua l  re a d ing the article  and posti ng on  HN, shoul d 
ex pe ct to l ive amo ng on e  of the  more pop ulous spe ci es o f lif e in the u niverse. 

e: Mayb e  youa re  impl ici tly as su min g tha t thew ork flowfor "d et ermini ng" w ho 
you are  born as goes: 1. picka rand om sp eci es 2. pic k a ran dom indiv idua l in
thatspe cie s. Bu t i t 's mo re l i ke : 1 .  pick  a r a ndom indi v id ual . 
- -----
tronj e P lea se, f ora ll our  eye s' sake, change t h e color of the  fon t tosom e thin gdarker! Light- gre yo n  white i sjust terrib le.

~~~ 
've got_more pressing_issues than
to debate the_statistical likelihood_of_the size_of_the rock or_it's expected
mineral composition.

~~~
nickcano
Yes,_and those more pressing_issues are among_spending_time debating why it's
not worthwhile to spend time debating a topic that is less_pressing_than the
debate_about_the_time it takes, apparently.

------
JumpCrisscross
Why isn't_the conclusion "our population size_is the_most frequent" versus
"largest"?

~~~
rory
I think he's approaching it from_the_assumption that a_sentient being should
assume itself to be a random individual_out of all the sentient beings_in
existence, across all_sentient_species.

~~~
JumpCrisscross
Doesn't_that ignore the obvious_(and known _a priori_ ) correlation_between
sentient beings in a species?

------
srcreigh
The idea_of interplanetary species seems to invalidate this_website in one
fell swoop.

------
andrewclunn
Wrong. We have_no notion if we are_more or_less populas than other species,_so
we should assome_that we_are one of_the many smaller (in number) by_virtue of
that being_the more common, thus drawing the_exact_opposite conclusions.

~~~
deciplex
That's what_we_should_expect to_see when looking_for_other _planets__with
intelligent_life. But _you_, andrewclunn, should expect_to_live among one of
the more populous species.

~~~
andrewclunn
That's_the point, from the_individual's_perspective the correct prediction_is
completely contrary to that from_the species' perspective based on this
approach.

~~~
deciplex
Right._So _you_,_the individual_reading the article and posting on HN, should
expect to live among_one of the more populous species_of life in the_universe.

e: Maybe_you_are implicitly assuming_that_the workflow_for "determining" who
you are born as goes:_1. pick_a random species 2. pick a_random individual in
that species._But_it's more like: 1. pick a_random individual.

------
tronje
Please, for all our eyes'_sake, change the color of_the_font_to something
darker! Light-grey on white_is just terrible.

~~~