

I was reading _The Tatami Galaxy_ , and I came across the following sentence:
**うら若き乙女ならばともかく** 、二十歳過ぎたむさ苦しい男を誰が抱きしめてやりたいものか。[pg.295] I know ~ともかく means
"leaving aside", "never mind X,..." But I'm having trouble making sense of it
in this sentence.


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2023-09-17T01:07:54.740
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2023-09-17T12:36:11.327
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question
grammar translation conditionals
~乙女ならばともかく: Translation and grammar issue


There's certainly something to be said for writting down your ideas. half way
through wrriting my question the lightbulb came on!

Since I didn't find anything on ~ならばともかく on the exchange, I figured I would
post my answer for the use of the community.

First things first, this ~ならばともかく is equivalent to ～ならともかく (much in the same
way ならば・なら are the same thing). I guess it has more of the archaic/high-flown
flavor "watakushi" (the main character of the Tatami Galaxy) is known for.
Now, this ~ならともかく is a bit different from regular old ~ともかく. It also makes a
contrast, but in the following way :

**Noun1** ならともかく、 **Noun2** + Verb

_While **Noun1** might be/do/go (for)/etc, **Noun2** + Verb_

[1](https://takoboto.jp/bunpo/1554) Verb is in the negative (for what I've
seen)

[2](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/questions/97293/what-is-the-meaning-of-
this-%E3%82%82%E3%81%AE%E3%81%8B) Verb determines the meaning of both parts of
the sentence.

This is a bit abstract, so let's parse the passage in the question to gorund
it:

**うら若き乙女ならばともかく、二十歳過ぎたむさ苦しい男を誰が抱きしめてやりたいものか**

So, the verb here is 抱きしめる [to hug]. The negative sense is given by the
construction [～ものか](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/questions/97293/what-
is-the-meaning-of-this-%E3%82%82%E3%81%AE%E3%81%8B). The verb applies to both,
parts of the sentence (what's before and after ~ならばともかく）, with the idea that
it applies to the former, but not the latter. Finally, we get:

_While it might be possible to embrace a fresh, young maiden, who could ever
want to embrace a filthy twentysomething?!_

Notes:

  1. The thing that threw me off, is that in this case what's being opposed is the **object** of the verb, not the **Subject** . I'm not 100% sure of this, but the alternative reading seems a bit contradictory ( _" While a fresh young maiden might want to, who [else?] could ever want to embrace a filthy twentysomething"_). If I'm wrong here, I'd love to know why.

  2. For more examples (and a a more concise explanation) look [here](https://takoboto.jp/bunpo/1554)


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answer