Role of の in そんなの


Naruto found out that another character had been given a tempting offer and
Naruto said:

> そんなの答えはNOだってばよ

What is の doing here, grammatically? is it nominalization? I think I've heard
stuff before like 今のだれ？ and I've been interpreting it as the nominalizing の,
where the topic is 今の and it means "that person just now".

Can you insert は into these sentences?

> そんなのは答えはNOだってばよ
>
> 今のはだれ？




I believe that the の here is the same の as the の which is explained in this
thread: [What is the difference between the nominalizers こと and
の?](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/questions/1395/what-is-the-difference-
between-the-nominalizers-%E3%81%93%E3%81%A8-and-%E3%81%AE)

Basically the の here is a _noun_ which means "thing". It is similar to
[こと](http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~jwb/cgi-
bin/wwwjdic.cgi?1MUE%E3%81%93%E3%81%A8) ( _noun_ ) which also means "thing".
The difference between の and こと is that の is used when the "thing" is
_related_ to the speaker. This is furthur elaborated in Derek's post:
<https://japanese.stackexchange.com/a/1396/264>.

そんな is a pre-nominal adjective, also known as an attributive (連体詞). A _normal_
adjective can be used in two ways, either attributively or predicatively. For
example, the adjective 暑い can be used in these ways:

>   1. Attributively: 暑い日 (hot day)
>
>   2. Predicatively: 日は暑い (day is hot)
>
>

A pre-nominal adjective can only be used attributively, so we can say "そんな日" ,
but not "日はそんな"

So we can roughly dissect the sentence "そんなの答えはNOだってばよ！" into 6 parts:

>   1. pre-nominal adjective そんな: such as that, like that
>
>   2. noun の:
>
>   3. noun 答え: answer
>
>   4. topic-marker は (optional due to
> [ellipsis](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis_%28linguistics%29))
>
>   5. quoted "NO"
>
>   6. copula だ
>
>

Note that since we can't simply chain nouns together (unless to form compound
nouns), there exists a _break_ between "の" and "答え". The sentence is clearer
if we put a _comma_ as such: "そんなの、答えはNOだってばよ！"

Putting it all together, a literal translation of the sentence
"そんなの答えはNOだってばよ！" goes like this: _"As for thing(s) such as that, the answer
is/will be "NO". ってばよ！"_

Putting it into the context of the story ([chapter
162](https://i.stack.imgur.com/EnWZl.jpg) or [episode
92](http://onepieceofbleach.com/naruto-92/) @16:12), it means "As for a trade
such as that (such as healing arms for resurrecting Tsunade's kin), the answer
will be "NO". ってばよ！".

Using another example, the sentence "そんなのいらない！" can also be dissected into
different parts:

>   1. pre-nominal adjective そんな: such as that, like that
>
>   2. noun の: thing
>
>   3. topic-marker は (optional due to
> [ellipsis](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis_%28linguistics%29))
>
>   4. inflected verb いらない: do not need
>
>

And when the parts are merged, a literal translation of the sentence
"そんなのいらない！" goes like this: "As for thing(s) such as that, (I) don't need!"

**の as the no-particle**

As for the の in the sentence "今のはだれ？", it is a totally different の compared to
the の in "そんなの". The の in "今のはだれ？" is the genitive no-particle. Basically the
function of the no-particle is to convert a _noun_ into an _adjective_ so that
it can describe (modify) a noun. This is elaborated in this article: [Genitive
Case](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive_case).

The sentence "今のはだれ？" is dissected into:

>   1. noun 今: just now
>
>   2. genitive particle の (converts the noun 今 into an adjective to describe
> 人)
>
>   3. noun 人: person (optional due to
> [ellipsis](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis_%28linguistics%29))
>
>   4. topic-marker は (optional due to
> [ellipsis](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis_%28linguistics%29))
>
>   5. (pro)noun だれ: who
>
>

And the literal translation of the sentence "今のはだれ？" is roughly: "As for just
now that (person), is who?".




I believe that the の here is the same の as the の which is explained in this
thread: [What is the difference between the nominalizers こと and
の?](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/questions/1395/what-is-the-difference-
between-the-nominalizers-%E3%81%93%E3%81%A8-and-%E3%81%AE)

Basically the の here is a _noun_ which means "thing". It is similar to
[こと](http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~jwb/cgi-
bin/wwwjdic.cgi?1MUE%E3%81%93%E3%81%A8) ( _noun_ ) which also means "thing".
The difference between の and こと is that の is used when the "thing" is
_related_ to the speaker. This is furthur elaborated in Derek's post:
<https://japanese.stackexchange.com/a/1396/264>.

そんな is a pre-nominal adjective, also known as an attributive (連体詞). A _normal_
adjective can be used in two ways, either attributively or predicatively. For
example, the adjective 暑い can be used in these ways:

>   1. Attributively: 暑い日 (hot day)
>
>   2. Predicatively: 日は暑い (day is hot)
>
>

A pre-nominal adjective can only be used attributively, so we can say "そんな日" ,
but not "日はそんな"

So we can roughly dissect the sentence "そんなの答えはNOだってばよ！" into 6 parts:

>   1. pre-nominal adjective そんな: such as that, like that
>
>   2. noun の:
>
>   3. noun 答え: answer
>
>   4. topic-marker は (optional due to
> [ellipsis](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis_%28linguistics%29))
>
>   5. quoted "NO"
>
>   6. copula だ
>
>

Note that since we can't simply chain nouns together (unless to form compound
nouns), there exists a _break_ between "の" and "答え". The sentence is clearer
if we put a _comma_ as such: "そんなの、答えはNOだってばよ！"

Putting it all together, a literal translation of the sentence
"そんなの答えはNOだってばよ！" goes like this: _"As for thing(s) such as that, the answer
is/will be "NO". ってばよ！"_

Putting it into the context of the story ([chapter
162](https://i.stack.imgur.com/EnWZl.jpg) or [episode
92](http://onepieceofbleach.com/naruto-92/) @16:12), it means "As for a trade
such as that (such as healing arms for resurrecting Tsunade's kin), the answer
will be "NO". ってばよ！".

Using another example, the sentence "そんなのいらない！" can also be dissected into
different parts:

>   1. pre-nominal adjective そんな: such as that, like that
>
>   2. noun の: thing
>
>   3. topic-marker は (optional due to
> [ellipsis](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis_%28linguistics%29))
>
>   4. inflected verb いらない: do not need
>
>

And when the parts are merged, a literal translation of the sentence
"そんなのいらない！" goes like this: "As for thing(s) such as that, (I) don't need!"

**の as the no-particle**

As for the の in the sentence "今のはだれ？", it is a totally different の compared to
the の in "そんなの". The の in "今のはだれ？" is the genitive no-particle. Basically the
function of the no-particle is to convert a _noun_ into an _adjective_ so that
it can describe (modify) a noun. This is elaborated in this article: [Genitive
Case](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive_case).

The sentence "今のはだれ？" is dissected into:

>   1. noun 今: just now
>
>   2. genitive particle の (converts the noun 今 into an adjective to describe
> 人)
>
>   3. noun 人: person (optional due to
> [ellipsis](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis_%28linguistics%29))
>
>   4. topic-marker は (optional due to
> [ellipsis](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis_%28linguistics%29))
>
>   5. (pro)noun だれ: who
>
>

And the literal translation of the sentence "今のはだれ？" is roughly: "As for just
now that (person), is who?".

