Which is the most correct (or common): 話 or 話し?


The meaning of 話, as a kanji, is "tale, talk", but as a word, it means the
same as 話し: "Talk; speech; chat; story; conversation."  
In the official jouyou kanji chart, there's only 話, for the isolated word, and
話し in a composed word (like 話し合い).  
On the dictionary it says that 話し is "irregular".  
Searching on Google for both variations,
[話](https://www.google.com.br/search?lr=lang_ja&q=%22%E8%A9%B1%22) have 25,5
million more matches than
[話し](https://www.google.com.br/search?lr=lang_ja&q=%22%E8%A9%B1%E3%81%97%22).  
Also, the dictionaries have both 話言葉 and 話 **し** 言葉, but there's no indication
of what is the most appropriate or if there is a irregularity on the し.

With all this, would 話 be the most adequate/common for use? Or not?




This is the descriptive answer.

## Google hits

[A word](http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Google_searches_and_numbers)
of [warning about google hits](https://webmasters.stackexchange.com/a/47185).
They are not accurate. Google tries everything to reduce computation time and
costs, and it will not give you an accurate full-text search of the entire
(public) net. Try going to page 20 or 30, and Google informs you it cannot
provide any more results.

Furthermore, a search for `話` is going to turn up many false positives, such
as (1) read `わ` as part of a compound, eg. `対話`, and most importantly (2) read
`はな` as part of the word `話す`. Searching for `話` includes results such as
`話しを`.

You should always inspect some of the results manually and look for possible
unwanted results.

Trying to avoid these false positives, a google search yields:

  * `面白い話を` 9 pages, 460,000 hits
  * `面白い話しを` 12 pages, 30000 hits

As this is kind of inconclusive, I tried a different corpus.

## The noun form 話

[A balanced corpus of contemporary written
Japanese](http://www.ninjal.ac.jp/english/products/bccwj/), searchable via
[shonagon](http://www.kotonoha.gr.jp/shonagon/) yields the following results.
I add particles before and after 話/話し to avoid false positives.

  * `の話しを` 56 results
  * `の話を` 4420 results

And with other particles to make sure these results are not specific to `の話を`:

  * `の話しに` 19 results
  * `の話に` 1496 results

Thus, the spelling `話` for the noun form appears to be about 80 times more
frequent than `話し`.

## 話し vs. 話

This article on [bunsho-labo](http://bunsho-labo.com/15) gives a prescriptive
rule: Use `話し` when used as a verb semantically, and `話` when used as a noun.

For example, the correct spelling would be

  * 最近、とある女子中学生と **お話しをする** 機会がありました。
  * それは、学校生活での悩みに関する **話でした** 。

See the link above for more examples.

The [official _okurigana_
rules](http://www.mext.go.jp/b_menu/hakusho/nc/k19730618001/k19730618001.html)
prescribe added _okurigana_ for nouns nominalized from verbs, but list `話` and
several other words as exceptions.

However, the "translation" of the official guidelines for _okurigana_ usage
[on wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Okurigana) are concerned with
semantic extension: Use `話し` in the sense of `the act of talking`, and `話` in
the extended sense of `story`.

I think it can makes a difference in a sentence such as this one taken from
the bunsho-labo page above.

> PCの向こう側には、彼女が話しをしているときの深刻な表情が浮かぶようでした。

They use `話し` because this sentence is about the action, but she might as well
be telling a story, which would suggest the non- _okurigana_ form. But never
mind grey areas, let us take a look at the actual usage.

Querying the above-mentioned corpus for this distinction:

  * `お話しして` 174
  * `お話して` 181

Therefore, the prescriptive rule does not seem to be observed in written
Japanese, at least as far as the form `おXをする` is concerned, and this form
clearly uses it in the sense of 'speaking`.

Furthermore,

  * `お話しを` 65 results
  * `お話をし` 238 results

The second search yields about 4 times as many results, even though it is more
specific by following `話を` with the verb `する`.

However, regarding the compound `話し言葉`, it seems to be the preferred spelling:

  * `話し言葉` 129 results
  * `話言葉` 4 results

## Conclusion

At the very least, I cannot find much evidence supporting the rule concerning
the distinction in usage between `話し` and `話` used as the nominalization
`speaking` in this corpus. If used as a noun `talk`, the spelling `話` occurs
more frequently in this corpus.

Also, as the rule is concerned with the semantic interpretation of the
nominalized form and whether it is used in an extended sense, there may be
some grey areas.

Note that prescriptive rules exists, be they observed on average or not. In
formal writing, you may be well advised to stick to any rules you are expected
to follow.




This is the descriptive answer.

## Google hits

[A word](http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Google_searches_and_numbers)
of [warning about google hits](https://webmasters.stackexchange.com/a/47185).
They are not accurate. Google tries everything to reduce computation time and
costs, and it will not give you an accurate full-text search of the entire
(public) net. Try going to page 20 or 30, and Google informs you it cannot
provide any more results.

Furthermore, a search for `話` is going to turn up many false positives, such
as (1) read `わ` as part of a compound, eg. `対話`, and most importantly (2) read
`はな` as part of the word `話す`. Searching for `話` includes results such as
`話しを`.

You should always inspect some of the results manually and look for possible
unwanted results.

Trying to avoid these false positives, a google search yields:

  * `面白い話を` 9 pages, 460,000 hits
  * `面白い話しを` 12 pages, 30000 hits

As this is kind of inconclusive, I tried a different corpus.

## The noun form 話

[A balanced corpus of contemporary written
Japanese](http://www.ninjal.ac.jp/english/products/bccwj/), searchable via
[shonagon](http://www.kotonoha.gr.jp/shonagon/) yields the following results.
I add particles before and after 話/話し to avoid false positives.

  * `の話しを` 56 results
  * `の話を` 4420 results

And with other particles to make sure these results are not specific to `の話を`:

  * `の話しに` 19 results
  * `の話に` 1496 results

Thus, the spelling `話` for the noun form appears to be about 80 times more
frequent than `話し`.

## 話し vs. 話

This article on [bunsho-labo](http://bunsho-labo.com/15) gives a prescriptive
rule: Use `話し` when used as a verb semantically, and `話` when used as a noun.

For example, the correct spelling would be

  * 最近、とある女子中学生と **お話しをする** 機会がありました。
  * それは、学校生活での悩みに関する **話でした** 。

See the link above for more examples.

The [official _okurigana_
rules](http://www.mext.go.jp/b_menu/hakusho/nc/k19730618001/k19730618001.html)
prescribe added _okurigana_ for nouns nominalized from verbs, but list `話` and
several other words as exceptions.

However, the "translation" of the official guidelines for _okurigana_ usage
[on wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Okurigana) are concerned with
semantic extension: Use `話し` in the sense of `the act of talking`, and `話` in
the extended sense of `story`.

I think it can makes a difference in a sentence such as this one taken from
the bunsho-labo page above.

> PCの向こう側には、彼女が話しをしているときの深刻な表情が浮かぶようでした。

They use `話し` because this sentence is about the action, but she might as well
be telling a story, which would suggest the non- _okurigana_ form. But never
mind grey areas, let us take a look at the actual usage.

Querying the above-mentioned corpus for this distinction:

  * `お話しして` 174
  * `お話して` 181

Therefore, the prescriptive rule does not seem to be observed in written
Japanese, at least as far as the form `おXをする` is concerned, and this form
clearly uses it in the sense of 'speaking`.

Furthermore,

  * `お話しを` 65 results
  * `お話をし` 238 results

The second search yields about 4 times as many results, even though it is more
specific by following `話を` with the verb `する`.

However, regarding the compound `話し言葉`, it seems to be the preferred spelling:

  * `話し言葉` 129 results
  * `話言葉` 4 results

## Conclusion

At the very least, I cannot find much evidence supporting the rule concerning
the distinction in usage between `話し` and `話` used as the nominalization
`speaking` in this corpus. If used as a noun `talk`, the spelling `話` occurs
more frequently in this corpus.

Also, as the rule is concerned with the semantic interpretation of the
nominalized form and whether it is used in an extended sense, there may be
some grey areas.

Note that prescriptive rules exists, be they observed on average or not. In
formal writing, you may be well advised to stick to any rules you are expected
to follow.

