What's the difference between としたところで and　にしたところで and how to use it in a "positive" way


「A に/としたところで B」 is really confusing me.

According to my textbook the difference seems to be that にしたところで is used with
nouns while everything else takes としたところで。

According to this [website](https://chiyo-sampo.net/grammar-
jlptn1-nishitatokorode/), however, there is no such restriction but they do
state that there is a small difference in meaning which unfortunately they do
not explain. The found an answer on another
[website](https://hinative.com/ja/questions/5130786) where the explanation
went along the lines

> にしたところで = even if A is the case, you shouldn't do be/B is not possible  
>  としたところで ₌ however much you do A, B is not possible<

That sounds like a pretty big difference my book/websites should mention. Is
it then correct?

Also on the first website mentioned above they state that there are exceptions
where B doesn't express some kind of incompetence or meaninglessness. One
sentence I think fits the description would be

> 「一つの言葉にしたって、聞く側によって意味は変わる。」<

Which I would translate with "Depending on who is listening even a single word
can change the meaning". But if the translation is more or less correct, it
would be quite different from the meaning above, wouldn't it?




First, native Japanese speakers hardly ever say "～に/としたところで", and often use
"～にしても/～としても" alternatively, because the later conjunctions are shorter and
more casual than the former.

Then let's think about "～にしても/～としても".

> ex. 一つの言葉にしたって,聞く人によって意味は変わる。  
>  _Depending on who is listening even a single word can change the meaning._

In this sentence, we can substitute ～にしても for ～にしたって, but cannot do ～としても.

If you wanna use としても, you should modify"～だとしても"

Well then, see the usage of ～に/としたところで.

Compared with ～にしても/～としても, "～に/としたところで" differs a little in a relationship
between the preceding and following sentences. When you write or read
sentences which contains に/としたところで, the logical relationship between clauses
would be important.

In order to better understanding ～に/としたところで, let's disassemble に/としたところで into
にする/とする and ところで.

noun. /adj. + にする/とする : put into a certain state.  
_ex. 部屋を綺麗にする/make room clean_

> Clarkをリーダーとする空の民(Skaikru)/ Skaikru with Clark as a leader

verb. + (～しよう)とする : try to do.  
_ex. 寝ようとする/try to sleep_

ところで : one of conjectives,it means paradox【逆説】 or converse【転換】.

【転換】: By the way.

> ex.今日は晴れですね。ところで、昨日のテストはどうでしたか？

【逆説】: The later section shows that the result is the opposite of what is
expected from the previous section.

However,"ところで" alone doesn't make sense of【逆説】,we need to use in combine with
"～する".

Thus, ～に/としたところで leads a paradoxical(逆説的な) sentence.

There is no unique translation,but I seem "No matter what" and "Even if" are
suitable.

> ex. ジュースを買おうとしたところで、財布を持っていないことに気づいた。  
>  _When I attempted to buy juice, I realized that I didn't have a wallet._

> ex. 目隠しをしたところで、彼はすぐにルービックキューブを解けます。  
>  _Even if he blindfold himself, he can solve Rubik's Cube immediately._

To be blindfolded is a handicap or adversity to solving the cube, but he is so
ingenious that he can solve it in that situation.

Like this when A has negative nuances, it can lead to a positive sentence.

By the way(ところで【転換】), the difference among ～に/と/を +したところで is something like
case inflection or postpositional particles. There is no difference in
meaning, but 目隠しとする or 目隠しにする seem a little strange.

For details, see [this following bulletin
board](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/a/73094).




First, native Japanese speakers hardly ever say "～に/としたところで", and often use
"～にしても/～としても" alternatively, because the later conjunctions are shorter and
more casual than the former.

Then let's think about "～にしても/～としても".

> ex. 一つの言葉にしたって,聞く人によって意味は変わる。  
>  _Depending on who is listening even a single word can change the meaning._

In this sentence, we can substitute ～にしても for ～にしたって, but cannot do ～としても.

If you wanna use としても, you should modify"～だとしても"

Well then, see the usage of ～に/としたところで.

Compared with ～にしても/～としても, "～に/としたところで" differs a little in a relationship
between the preceding and following sentences. When you write or read
sentences which contains に/としたところで, the logical relationship between clauses
would be important.

In order to better understanding ～に/としたところで, let's disassemble に/としたところで into
にする/とする and ところで.

noun. /adj. + にする/とする : put into a certain state.  
_ex. 部屋を綺麗にする/make room clean_

> Clarkをリーダーとする空の民(Skaikru)/ Skaikru with Clark as a leader

verb. + (～しよう)とする : try to do.  
_ex. 寝ようとする/try to sleep_

ところで : one of conjectives,it means paradox【逆説】 or converse【転換】.

【転換】: By the way.

> ex.今日は晴れですね。ところで、昨日のテストはどうでしたか？

【逆説】: The later section shows that the result is the opposite of what is
expected from the previous section.

However,"ところで" alone doesn't make sense of【逆説】,we need to use in combine with
"～する".

Thus, ～に/としたところで leads a paradoxical(逆説的な) sentence.

There is no unique translation,but I seem "No matter what" and "Even if" are
suitable.

> ex. ジュースを買おうとしたところで、財布を持っていないことに気づいた。  
>  _When I attempted to buy juice, I realized that I didn't have a wallet._

> ex. 目隠しをしたところで、彼はすぐにルービックキューブを解けます。  
>  _Even if he blindfold himself, he can solve Rubik's Cube immediately._

To be blindfolded is a handicap or adversity to solving the cube, but he is so
ingenious that he can solve it in that situation.

Like this when A has negative nuances, it can lead to a positive sentence.

By the way(ところで【転換】), the difference among ～に/と/を +したところで is something like
case inflection or postpositional particles. There is no difference in
meaning, but 目隠しとする or 目隠しにする seem a little strange.

For details, see [this following bulletin
board](https://japanese.stackexchange.com/a/73094).

