 the presence of that degeneration alone is not enough to be responsible for all of our pain. It needs to be taken into consideration, but sometimes I think we give it too much credit. Okay. Let's come back in the third set and talk shop some more. Um, our guest is Don, Dr. Jonathan Cole. Um, he is the clinic director, the owner of, uh, Paragon physical therapy, um, located in Olmstead village in Pinehurst. And, um,