 than either of those two. So I think that's what's going to happen at the Democratic Convention. Well, Paul, thank you very much for that. Let me give you my reaction to this. I've heard this for a long time, that the only way Kamala Harris could be pushed aside is for another black female. I believe that part is true. And the names that have been bandied about have been Oprah Winfrey, who does not want it, and Michelle Obama, who also does not want it.