Because when I was thinking about trying to talking to you today, I thought although we've worked quite a lot with people along this group, you might be sitting here and thinking well you don't seem to be doing any specific work for and with old people erm, well I think your quite independent and can work out your right  that, but one of the things this front line review erm it erm, it's considering Council front line services under various headings, one of which is Retired Services that the Council provide as a group, now the leader of the Council wants to erm , get public views on how we look at these services, so, and that's, that's individuals and groups and one of the things that you might like to think about and I'm that we as a local government unit who are servicing this review can help you with, is to consider how you might want to fee in for that review, erm and, and consider this, that the re-services for retired people, that the Council provides that you use and basically whether you use that, or  service, we want to hear that, the Council would need to know that cos were gonna be making decisions about whether or not they should continue in this front line review erm, and erm, you know, or what things you would, what, what are your questions on about those services, what other things you would like to see provided, things like that and I thing this group could quite easily make a collective representation, a collective submission to that process then you could do it as individual's as well, so that, that exercise it, it should be over by the eleventh of October it starts on the sixth of September.