   Schools in the US(All Levels) [Rantish]
  Not too long ago, when I''d post anti-school messages, I''d get people quoting me and agreeing. Recently, the trend seems to be the opposite, and people are saying their school isn''t bad.In my experience, school is about doing homework more than learning, and when the teachers aren''t teaching for the next state-required test (or ACT/SAT), they are having students memorize facts and formulas without understanding to be able to mentally copy and paste them into the homework and test. The only thing that really changed about this in college is that there is a lot more reading from the books (that you have to pay for). I''m on my 4th semester at college, and up to now I''ve had one teacher total since 1st grade that tryed to teach understanding of a subject. He failed, only because it was an ''advanced class''(AP Calculus in HS) full of people not ready to tackle the subject (about 3 people of 20 in the class had any clue what was going on in that class). He was an awesome teacher that taught understanding instead of memorization, and he could figure out pretty much any formula when he needed it in any form because he really understood the subject of mathmatics.I attended 3 different public high schools, so I think I have a fair sample of the kind of education that is being given at least in this area. Two of them ranked fairly high overall in the state, so I''m wondering if maybe it''s just this state or others too where the education sucks. I learned a LOT during high school, but if it was during class it was only because we were using computers in that class and I was surfing the web or I was sitting in the back with a programming book open instead of the class text.I''ve heard many of my college teachers say that college is to help you think, but I feel I learned that in highschool (or earlier) and I wonder why so many of the classes I''m taking are the same ones I had before (college english 1 & 2 simmilar to 6th grade english, government 1 & 2 are much like the gov class I had in highschool, history, macroeconomics, etc). What really surprised me is that many people in those classes that are my age (and thus most likely just out of highschool as I was) actually don''t know anything about the subjects and are totally lost. In my economics class just yesterday, the teacher asked ''In a competitive market, which direction do prices move?'' and the first answer was ''demand''(which is obviously not a direction at all, making me wonder what the person that said that was thinking).What are your experiences with schools in the US? What level of schooling are you at? Do you find your teachers trying to help everybody understand the subject(s)? Do you get tons of homework to ''help reinforce what is being taught in class'' despite the fact that you understood it the first time?I''m interested in hearing what you think. 
  The quality of education in public schools varies WILDLY.  That was the primary reason for the creation of college entrance exams (ACT, SAT,etc): to give common measure of what someone knows in school.I grew in in Department of Defense(DOD) schools for most of life, until midway through highschool when I returned to a public school in Arkansas.  What I can say is that DOD schools seem be at much higher standard than the school district where I graduated.;  I''m currently in my first year of college and I went to Wayzata High School in Plymouth (suburb of Minneapolis), Minnesota.  This school is supposedly as good as private schools.  The only time I encountered this memorization bullshit you''re talking about is in AP calculus where you had to memorize obscure integration and differentiation formulas.  The way my calculus III class in college was taught, you didn''t have to spend too much time on memorization.For a world religions class we had to do stuff like memorizing the names and locations of the major cities in a certain country or region of the world.  In History we had to know names but not specific dates or anything too bad.  I didn''t mention these in the previous paragraph because I think this sort of memorization is necessary for this type of class, so I''m not complaining about it.My school was well known for being "the rich school" so that probably helped.  We also had the highest % of anorexic girls in the nation, not that it''s relevant at all.   ___________________________________________________________Where to find the intensity (Updated Feb 10, 2004) ;  I can only speak for myself, so take what I say with a grain of salt.Coming from the district with the 2nd-lowest spending per student in the state of Kansas, it has been my experience that you will get both good and bad teachers, which there isn''t a lot anyone can do about. The biggest factor in determining the quality of your education is your own motivation. If you want to succeed, you will. I put the effort into high school and got a satisfactory education, in my opinion. I feel I could have gone to a prestigious university, but I decided to go with a full-ride to a state university (hey, we''re the Harvard of the Midwest). Anyway, my point is that it''s not the teachers, it''s the students who make the difference in education. ;  unferth: I agree with that if you are motivated to be educated, you will become well educated, but I don''t think school provides much role in that at all. I''m well educated IMO (compared to other people that went to the same schools, both generally and in my specialized field), but IMO schools played no part in that. Most of what I learned a while back came from books(that I bought myself because libraries around here don''t have the right books), and more recently from papers on the internet. ;  I remember talking to a HS teacher recently...she was telling me about some AP calc teacher she knows. It turns out that he teaches integration before derivatives, for God knows what reason. But I thought it was really funny ;  My current school is actually really good. The teachers know what they''re talking about (my physics teacher is a Ph.d. in some field of physics) and they really like teaching. More importantly, they''re concerned with you learning the material, not memorizing formulas and doing well on some retarded standardized test. ;  I think that I am getting about what I should expect from a public high school.  I actually have had very good teachers in math/physics the 2 subjects that I actually like and can take.  (currently 3/4 of my day ).  My physics teacher is a very smart person, not the best at teaching, but truly loves teaching and really wants to help kids do well.  My first year calc teacher was really good.  The one I have right now for calc 2 is a good teacher and also cares about how well you learn, but, in my opinion, is very very slow and borring.  There are never any sidenotes, he repeates himself all of the time, etc.  All of the kids who have a hard time understanding these high level math classes (obviously cant be too bad at it becasue they are pretty far ahead), really like him.  I think that this is because he teaches to their level and just assumes that this way everyone learns the material.  He could care less if we (1/2 the class) are really bored... as long as everyone learns... Not the philosophie I agree with... I like to think that the teacher should try to increase everyone''s knowledge and not put any special attention on any group... although, like I said before, this is hard to expect, due to the difficulty... I''m not sure how he could change to do this.  ALthough, he could use to take some dryness out of his lectures, but thats just his personality...Anyway, I think that its hard for a teacher that must teach to a large group of kids with wide ranges of apptitude.  I think that if anything, the classes should be biased towards grade average or something.  Someway so that each class has kids with close to the same apptitude level.  It makes more sence to not mix together students that will strugle with basic concepts and students that are already past the material.  My school happens to be good about this.  I have been able to take ''advanced'' classes for about 2/3 of my schedule...wow... that was a kinda long rant...  Basically, if I didnt make my points clear, I think that to make it easier for the teachers to teach at a pace and level that all of the students in the class will be ok with, it is important to group kids with the same apptitude and knowledge together.  If your school doesnt do much of this, I believe this is part of the problem. My home page!!!Find out about my diy LCD projector and programming projects!;quote:Original post by Extrarius   unferth: I agree with that if you are motivated to be educated, you will become well educated, but I don't think school provides much role in that at all. I'm well educated IMO (compared to other people that went to the same schools, both generally and in my specialized field), but IMO schools played no part in that. Most of what I learned a while back came from books(that I bought myself because libraries around here don't have the right books), and more recently from papers on the internet.   I don't think that's the way everyone learns. Schools try to educate the largest segment of students. But what's right for some is not right for others--this is why some schools have gifted/special programs (mine allowed me to do independent study, so I got the best of both worlds). Anyway, one of the other important functions of school is socialization, which is important for society.edit: sheesh, could I ramble around any more?   [edited by - unferth on February 12, 2004 11:07:04 PM];  Socialization can''t be that important because I''m doing fine without it so far, at least I don''t socialize with my peers. I''ve had 2 jobs so far, and both of them from the very few connections I''ve made and much bettter than most jobs my peers have.I understand that some people learn differently, but I don''t think they''re born that way. I think it has a lot to do with how your childhood goes. I started learning ''advanced'' things at a young age (don''t remeber how I learned so young, but for ex I was adding negative numbers when I was being just being taught basic addition in school), and I think that helped me learn how to learn faster.I truly believe that everything taught up to highschool in the current system (maybe including optional classes like calculus and AP CS) could be taught in grades 1-6 with an appropriate preschool program and good teachers. Then grades 7-12 could be the general classes taught in college, with the same specialization system that is already in-place. It wouldn''t be easy like school is now, but I think everyone is capable of it(again, with proper pre-school conditioning to help people learn to learn, and learn faster) and it would definitely benefit the country IMO.Well, ok, maybe not everyone, but everyone not classified as mentally retarded or the like.Maybe I''m just weird though. I have almost no ''event memory'' or ''fact memory'', so maybe it just goes to ''understanding memory'' or something. (forgive the made-up types of memory, but you understand what I mean, right?) 