   US government bullies anti-war protestors.
Feds win rights to war protestors' records.I don't see any reasonable explanation for this in the article, it really just seems like an attempt to intimidate protestors and discourage public dissent.This isn't acceptable. The freedom to speak out against the government is one of our most valuable and important rights. I've never understood people who claim it's more important to "unite" behind our leaders during war-time. War lets governments get away with things that would be unthinkable during peacetime (and needless even during war-time) so dissent is vital.If you're willing to surrender your rights temporarily at the drop of a hat (because, let's face it, this war is hardly a serious situation that threatens our safety at home), you have no credibility.    ----Bart[edited by - trzy on February 7, 2004 3:53:45 PM][edited by - trzy on February 7, 2004 3:54:16 PM]
  im not going to get into the politics of why america went to war.i will tell you how funny it is that protestors are protesting a war that defends their freedom to protest, a war that gives the iraqi people freedom to protest, etc etc.  95% of protestors would protest the inhumanity of us not going to war if infact we did not go to war, they will just find anything to argue about.  if they dont like what their elected officials are doing with the information they have, go away.  the rest of us real americans who dont take our freedom for granted are quite capable of living quality lives without these traitors around.above post not meant to offend.  personal opinion.  everybody entitled to one. ;quote:Original post by machiavelli    i will tell you how funny it is that protestors are protesting a war that defends their freedom to protest,How was Iraq taking away our freedom to protest, if you don't mind me asking? I'd love to hear your answer.quote:a war that gives the iraqi people freedom to protest, etc etc.  Hmm, no. Apparently you haven't been reading the news reports where Iraqi's are being arrested and SHOT TO DEATH for protesting the US invasion. So if we went there to give them the freedom to protest, why do we kill protestors?quote:if they dont like what their elected officials are doing with the information they have, go away.  You're kidding me, right? This is America, dipshit. We VOTE for what we want and let others know what we want. We don't "go away"quote:the rest of us real americans who dont take our freedom for granted are quite capable of living quality lives without these traitors around.Traitors? You need a serious reality check. Since when is utilizing OUR VERY BASIC RIGHT TO SPEAK OUR OWN OPINION traitorous, ESPECIALLY when the entire war was based on lies?You call yourself a "real american", I call you a disgrace to America. You disrespect everything this country stands for.I call anyone who lies to the public and sends our soldiers to die over nonexistent reasons a traitor.   [edited by - Mithrandir on February 7, 2004 4:17:31 PM];In Iraq, you get shot if you protestStill, I dont understand how your disagreement with protestors could possibly make it OK for this to occur... ;  Ouch, thanks for setting us back a decade, machiavelli.trzy, thank you for the patent kneejerk reaction, and the ultimatums. Everyone knows how professional it is to say "If you x, then you y.", where x is some action or belief, and y has a negative connotation. ;  Only terrorists criticize the goverment. Goodness graces! I challenge anyone to show me the law of this great land that grants you the right to say anything as long as it doesn''t hurt anyone. Remember this country is For the People, by the People. Government criticizers aren''t people. ;quote:Original post by TSwitch  Ouch, thanks for setting us back a decade, machiavelli.trzy, thank you for the patent kneejerk reaction, and the ultimatums. Everyone knows how professional it is to say "If you x, then you y.", where x is some action or belief, and y has a negative connotation.   It sounds more like a mangled Ben Franklin quote: "Those willing to sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither freedom nor security." ;  I would imagine that some of the supboenas are warranted. It''s not like it''s unheard of for activists getting violent. The thing that gets me is the nondisclosure. ;quote:Original post by machiavelli    the rest of us real americans who dont take our freedom for granted are quite capable of living quality lives without these traitors around.That is sad. Just because I don't agree with everything my government does, certainly doesn't make me a traitor.  They aren't Gods you know.  [edited by - TravelingCoder on February 7, 2004 4:38:50 PM] [edited by - TravelingCoder on February 7, 2004 4:39:21 PM];  to mithrandir:blah blah blah.  next thing your gonna tell me is how good clinton was for the economy and how bush ruined it.  you want to protest the government do it in writing to your senators and congressmen.  you elected them too.  maybe you couldve changed the overwhelming decision to go to war.  what kind of message does it send to other countries that we cant unify under the basic principle that we are doing something right to help a population that is suffering.  why dont the protestors cry about the 100 other countries our forces are dying trying to protect.  afghanistan?  the philipines?  hippies will always be hippies.  people are burning our flag in the streets and cheering our deaths as a result of terrorism and still these whiners are opposed to protecting ourselves.to firahs:my original argument was about the first article.  if you want justification for the shooting of the combatant protestors in Iraq read the report."But Reuters reported that four civilians were killed, including an elderly woman when US soldiers opened fire for coming under rocket attack"..."About 100 protesters threw grenades towards Ukrainian soldiers stationed around city hall offices. In return, the soldiers fired warning shots to disperse the mob, said an AFP correspondent."...these dont qualify as acts of aggresion?  and the last article, about the humvee getting hit by a roadside bomb as a car drove by.  how do the soldiers know it wasnt an rpg round?  should they just keep driving and hope the car wasnt the source of the attack?and for the record i do have a problem believing anything negative written about our troops on al-jazeera.net   [edited by - machiavelli on February 7, 2004 4:53:10 PM]