   Wind Power
  The energy future belongs to wind - I can't say it any better than this:quote:The energy future belongs to wind. The world energy economy became progressively more global during the twentieth century as the world turned to oil. It promises to reverse direction and become more local during the 21st century as the world turns to wind, wind-generated hydrogen, and solar cells. Wind and wind-generated hydrogen will shape not only the energy sector of the global economy but the global economy itself....Advances in wind turbine design since 1991 allow turbines to operate at lower wind speeds, to harness more of the wind's energy, and to harvest it at greater heights -- dramatically expanding the harnessable wind resource. Add to this the recent bullish assessments of offshore wind potential, and the enormity of the wind resource becomes apparent. Wind power can meet not only all U.S. electricity needs, but all U.S. energy needs....Wind is popular because it is abundant, cheap, inexhaustible, widely distributed, climate-benign, and clean -- attributes that no other energy source can match. The cost of wind-generated electricity has dropped from 38¢ a kilowatt-hour in the early 1980s to roughly 4¢ a kilowatt-hour today on prime wind sites. Some recently signed U.S. and U.K. long-term supply contracts are providing electricity at 3¢ a kilowatt-hour. Wind Force 12 projected that the average cost per kilowatt hour of wind-generated electricity will drop to 2.6¢ by 2010 and to 2.1¢ by 2020. U.S. energy consultant Harry Braun says that if wind turbines are mass-produced on assembly lines like automobiles, the cost of wind-generated electricity could drop to 1-2¢ per kilowatt hour....Wind power is now a viable, robust, fast-growing industry. Cheap electricity from wind makes it economical to electrolyze water and produce hydrogen. Hydrogen is the fuel of choice for the highly efficient fuel cells that will be used widely in the future to power motor vehicles and to supply electricity, heating, and cooling for buildings. Hydrogen also offers a way of storing wind energy and of transporting it efficiently by pipeline or in liquefied form by ship....For energy investors, growth in the future lies with wind and the hydrogen produced with cheap wind-generated electricity. Solar cell sales are growing at over 30 percent a year and are likely to supply much of the electricity for the 1.7 billion people who are still without electricity, most of them living in villages in developing countries. But solar cells are still too costly to supply the vast amounts of energy required to power a modern economy....Blowing In The WindOf course, the blow hards in Congress can always be counted on to do the wrong thing...quote:n the last week of July the Senate resumed consideration of sweeping energy legislation that has been widely criticized by consumer and environmental advocates. Senators face a crucial decision: Do they listen to the voters and take the health of the economy into account? Or will $21 million worth of campaign contributions from corporate utilities do the talking?...On July 29 the debate turned to the bill's controversial electricity provisions. Under heavy pressure from within his own caucus, Energy and Natural Resources Committee Chairman Pete Domenici, (R-N.M.), introduced a new draft of the bill's electricity title. But his amendment still sells consumers short by repealing the Public Utility Holding Company Act (PUHCA), a vital electricity consumer and investor protection.Congress created PUHCA to prevent multistate electricity companies from investing ratepayer money in risky schemes that do not contribute to the delivery of affordable and reliable energy. PUHCA was also designed to prevent a single company from controlling electricity, telecommunications, water and other essential services. It is based on the simple notion that convergence stifles competition and consumer choice, and can lead to poor service and higher bills.Repealing PUHCA will encourage these same utilities to replicate Enron's complex corporate structure, making it easier for companies to hide debt from shareholders and raise prices for consumers. Domenici's amendment would therefore result in the dominance of U.S. electricity markets by just a handful of mega-utilities that could use their dominance to raise prices across the board. ...Big Energy Grab BagAbove board corporate subsidies are one thing, but government bailouts brought about by corporate fraud are another thing all together. This is how they plant the seeds for future bailouts...Given the contrast of the bright energy future described in the first article, it's clear that there's a terrible lack of vision and leadership in Congress these days, if not a rotting corruption...[edited by - lessbread on August 3, 2003 3:14:34 PM]
  I heard about something called Fuel Cell Technology that uses hydrogen in engines.  Anybody else hear anything about this?Or does Fuel Cell Techonolgy deserve a "welcome to ten years ago" reply?  I just heard about it a week ago.   [edited by - Rob Loach on August 3, 2003 3:26:27 PM];quote:I heard about something called Fuel Cell Technology that uses hydrogen in engines. Anybody else hear anything about this?quote:Cheap electricity from wind makes it economical to electrolyze water and produce hydrogen. Hydrogen is the fuel of choice for the highly efficient fuel cells that will be used widely in the future to power motor vehicles and to supply electricity, heating, and cooling for buildings. Hydrogen also offers a way of storing wind energy and of transporting it efficiently by pipeline or in liquefied form by ship.And yes, welcome to years ago (although I have no idea how many years). ;quote:Original post by Rob Loach    I heard about something called Fuel Cell Technology that uses hydrogen in engines.  Anybody else hear anything about this?Fuel Cells technology have been around and will always be around for all kinds of fuel.  Its usually higher end, and is common among race cars.  IMHO, thats where they'll stay, as well.Hydrogen for consumers will look exactly how gas looks now.  It'll be a liquid poored into your gas tank.  It doesn't help the environment much, just like electric cars, it just moves the pollution around.  Of course, if we move the pollution to someplace where no one is affected it might be ok.   If we move pollution away from vallies and large cities, like Denver, New York or LA, then it can eliminate smog all together.  Besides the pollution thing, there's also the eliminating the need for crued oil, since anyone can manufacture it, including the gas stations themselves.To prevent threadjacking, Wind is a good form of eletricity, but it uses a lot of space, and its not as dependable as coal, hydrolic or nuclear power.That is interesting tho, instead of using Wind power to power our houses, a real time all the time need, use it to power our cars.  Who cares if we don't produce Hydrogen between 12:00am - 4:00am because the winds die down, as long as we have enough when we goto the gas station.  That is actually a pretty good application.   ~~~~~"Heh; yeah, that's probably a bad sig to end all your posts with." -23yrold3yrold Download and play Slime King I.   [edited by - dede on August 3, 2003 3:53:19 PM];  I think that the solar energy is better. I mean, despite it''s high initial cost, you can install it on your roof, and have fun.Eolian generators are nice too, since they are less expensive, and can generate more power, but if there is little or no wind in your area, they are usless. Also, a strong storm might dmage them, etc. But yes, humans should rely on non polluting energy sources, since the pollution is teh suck! (I hate the smog here).    Height Map Editor | Eternal Lands | Fast User Directory;  Wind won''t work in a lot of places because there just isn''t enough of it to reliably generate power.  Minnesota has a lot of wind generation in the northwest part of the state where the average daily wind is quite high.  The rest of the state just isn''t that good for wind.  I would go with orbital solar power or nuclear with a space elevator so we can get rid of the waste in the sun.  Though both options would be incredibly expensive.   "... we should have such an empire for liberty as she has never surveyed since the creation ..."Thomas Jefferson ;quote:Original post by dede   Hydrogen for consumers will look exactly how gas looks now.  It'll be a liquid poored into your gas tank.  It doesn't help the environment much, just like electric cars, it just moves the pollution around.Sure, dihydrogen monoxide is VERY toxic, and should be avoided at all costs.   Height Map Editor | Eternal Lands | Fast User Directory [edited by - Raduprv on August 3, 2003 4:04:01 PM];Yes, there have been great advances in the technology. How efficient is the energy storage from electrolysis ? I had always been waiting for a breakthrough in battery technology but alas it has not come to pass. The company that produces those huge wind turbines is planning on making them larger and larger. I believe it was mentioned that the size would have a full span of a football field. Don''t know if that was a Canadian or American football field.;quote:Original post by dede  Fuel Cells technology have been around and will always be around for all kinds of fuel.  Its usually higher end, and is common among race cars.  IMHO, thats where they''ll stay, as well.Uhm, I think you misunderstood what a fuel cell is... A fuel cell is an electrical power generator. It uses a proton exchange membrane, often a form of synthetic polymere, that will separate the electrons from the protons in hydrogene. Essentially ionizing it. It typically is build in sandwich form: two electrodes outside, the exchange membrane inside. Hydrongene flows over the first electrode, oxygene over the other. Now, the hydrogene will split into an electron and a proton, the proton will walk through the membrane, but the electron is blocked. The ionized hydrogene will create a water molecule with th oxygene on the other side, but needs the electron to do so. Thus, the electron takes the way through an external electrical circuit, in order to reach the other electrode.Basically, you have a hydrogene powered battery. The only exhaust gas created by a fuel cell is water. Fuel cells can be used anywhere where electricity is needed: including, but not limited to electric cars. Even laptops and cell phones could be fitted with a small fuel cell battery.Back on topic: wind energy is definitely an important development to get away from oil. Especially offshore systems are highly intertesting. But I''m still fascinated by the idea of harnessing nuclear fusion one day.;quote:Original post by Raduprv  Sure, dihydrogen monoxide is VERY toxic, and should be avoided at all costs.haha, oh wait, how do you extract the hydrogen from the H20, or what do you do with the monxide left behind?  Could it possibly form Carbon Monxide?  Is there possible side effects from the process?  What about leaked hydrogen?quote:quoted by USA Today  Because hydrogen readily travels skyward, the researchers estimated that its increased use could lead to as much as a tripling of hydrogen molecules — both man-made and from natural sources — going into the stratosphere, where it would oxidize and form water. "This would result in cooling of the lower stratosphere and the disturbance of ozone chemistry," the researchers wrote, resulting in bigger and longer-lasting ozone "holes" in both the Arctic and Antarctic regions, where drops in ozone levels have been recorded over the past 20 years. They estimated that ozone depletion could be as much as 8%. Nope, nothing to worry about here.  Its totally pollutionless!Yann L.Clicky.    Yeah, maybe a gasoline fuel cell is different than a hydogen fuel cell.  I''ve gotta do more reading about it. Cars arn''t my thing.   ~~~~~"Heh; yeah, that''s probably a bad sig to end all your posts with." -23yrold3yrold Download and play Slime King I.