Interview with Israeli Defense Minister Ehud Barak
WOLF BLITZER, HOST: And you're in THE SITUATION ROOM. Happening now, my exclusive interview with the Israeli defense minister. He talks very candidly about stopping an Iranian nuclear weapon, Israel's relationship with President Obama and avenging the deadly terror attack on Israeli tourists in Bulgaria. Also, the Colorado theater massacre suspect charged, now facing more than 100 counts in the biggest mass shooting in U.S. history. Plus, the heartbreaking end to the high tech search for two American climbers missing in Peru. We're learning new details of how they died. We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer in Jerusalem. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM. It's a major concern in the United States, but here in Israel, Iran's nuclear ambitions are even more disturbing. This country sits within striking distance of a possible Iranian nuclear weapon, one that Israeli officials are determined will not be built. I talked about that and a lot more in an exclusive interview today with the Israeli defense minister, the former prime minister, Ehud Barak.</s>BLITZER: Defense Minister, thanks so much for joining us.</s>EHUD BARAK, ISRAELI DEFENSE MINISTER: Thank you.</s>BLITZER: There was a This week in one of the Israeli newspapers that the U.S. The Obama administration, presented the Israeli government with a military plan to take military action against Iran's nuclear facilities. Is that true?</s>BARAK: I -- I don't think that that's a correct description. We all are aware of the fact that this administration has done more in diplomacy, more in sanctions than previous administrations, probably for good reasons. And they did a lot in terms of operational deployment in the Gulf area and in the operational preparation. But that's about what we know.</s>BLITZER: Are you and the U.S. On the same page as far as Iran is concerned?</s>BARAK: I think that in general terms about the intelligence, we are on the same page. In the rhetoric and the -- I don't know how to call it, observation, we are on the same page. We both know that Iran is determined to turn nuclear. We both know that Khamenei did not yet ordered, actually, to give a weapon, but that he is determined to deceit and defy the whole world. We all are convinced and say publicly that Iran should not be allowed to turn nuclear and that all options should remain on the table.</s>BLITZER: What -- what does that mean, that the ayatollah has not given the order to build a nuclear bomb?</s>BARAK: It's something technical. He did not tell his people start and build it -- a weapon on -- an explodable device. We think that we understand why he -- the -- he does not give this order. He believes that he is penetrated through our intelligence and he strongly feels that if he tries to order, we will know it, we and you and some other intelligence services will know about it and it might end up with a physical action against it. So he prefers to, first of all, make sure that through redundancy, through an accumulation of more lowly enriched uranium, more medium level enriched uranium and more centrifuges and more sites, better protection, that he can reach a point, which I call the zone of immunity, beyond which Israel might not be technically capable of launching a surgical operation. The United States can do more. And by then, he will have to consider when and how to -- to go into -- into building it. But that's not the issue. The issue is that we agree on the rhetoric, but we do not agree on the consequences. There are certain differences. We respect each other. We feel that the -- that the -- the -- our stopwatches are -- are ticking this at a different pace. Because of our limited operational capabilities, we -- our clock ticks...</s>BLITZER: So...</s>BARAK: -- much faster.</s>BLITZER: -- so I just want to be precise. Israel has a more limited military capability in dealing with Iran's nuclear facilities than the United States, so the U.S. Thinks there's more time available, Israel thinks there's less time available?</s>BARAK: Yes. Yes. But add to it the fact that we feel responsible for the security and future of the state of Israel. So we feel that we cannot afford delegating in regard to Iran being a major challenge for us. We cannot afford delegating the sovereign right of decisions about what should be done about it, even to the most trusted and trustworthy among our allies, which is the United States of America.</s>BLITZER: So even when the president of the United States says flatly that the U.S. No longer would support containment of a nuclear Iran, the U.S. Will not accept a nuclear Iran, that's not good enough for Israel?</s>BARAK: No, we -- we highly -- highly respect the president's position, this president, for what he has already done. We highly respect America. And Panetta coming here. He did a lot heading the Pentagon, probably with presidential inspiration or permission, to go further than anybody in the past to make a qualitative military edge for Israel vital (ph) and the relationship, including about protection against incoming missiles better than ever. But -- but having said that, we know that they say -- they -- they -- they get -- say publicly what we say. But we feel that when it comes to crucial issues regarding our security and future, we cannot afford -- we -- we have to live up to this responsibility. And I believe the administration basically respects this observation. Israeli sees -- Israel sees the issue in a different manner and that we feel that ultimately, only the government of Israel should take this decision.</s>BLITZER: You've studied U.S.-Israeli relations over many years. How would you describe the relationship today?</s>BARAK: I think that from -- from my point of view as defense minister, they are extremely good, extremely deep and profound. I can see long years, administrations of both sides of the political aisle, deeply supporting the state of Israel. And I believe that that reflects the profound feelings among the American people. But I should tell you, honestly, that this administration, under President Obama, is doing, in regard to our security, more than anything that I can remember in the past.</s>BLITZER: More than any other president? LBJ?</s>BARAK: Yes.</s>BLITZER: Or...</s>BARAK: Yes.</s>BLITZER: -- Bill Clinton...</s>BARAK: Yes.</s>BLITZER: -- or George W. Bush?</s>BARAK: Yes.</s>BARAK: In terms of the support for our security, the cooperation of our intelligence, the sharing of thoughts (ph) in a very open way, even when there are differences, which are not simple sometimes, I found their support for our defense very stable. Of course, we have...</s>BLITZER: But just to be precise, the most supportive ever, in your opinion?</s>BARAK: Yes, from the -- the kind of two generations I can bring to -- to memory, from probably Carter on. I cannot say exactly about LBJ, because I didn't watch it from close these times. But from Carter on, the -- the defense relationship between Israel and the United States are extremely stable and -- and good. It doesn't mean that we agree on anything. It is very well known that we have differences between our government and the American administration about the peace process, about other issues. But I believe that in regard to world terror and in regard to Hezbollah, in regard to what happens in Syria, in regard to Iran, we basically -- basically agree on the diagnosis. We -- we don't agree on the prognosis on -- on some of these.</s>BLITZER: Very, very effusive praise for the president of the United States from the Israeli defense minister. We're going to have much more of my exclusive interview with eh Ehud Barack still ahead. Coming up, he's going to reveal how he once dressed as a woman for the mission avenging the Israeli athletes murdered at the 1972 Munich Olympic Games, telling me -- and I'm quoting him now -- "We killed them in their homes." More of this interview coming up. Also, separately, an exclusive interview with Defense Secretary Leon Panetta. He says lessons from Iraq will be put to use when the Syrian regime falls. And he says it will fall. Plus, a new day in court and a very different demeanor -- details of charges against the Colorado theater massacre suspect.