Republican Ads; President Obama's Message; The Next Financial Meltdown
KATHLEEN PARKER, CNN NEWS HOST: Good evening. I'm Kathleen Parker.</s>ELIOT SPITZER, CNN NEWS HOST: And I'm Eliot Spitzer. Welcome to the program. You know what, Kathleen, two weeks to the midterm elections, the politicians are sprinting, the Democrats are panicking, Barack Obama looking for a magic bullet that I don't think exists because you know what? -- the storyline is set in concrete. Two years ago he was hope and change, now he's the status quo, it's an impossible thing to change that narrative, as they call it. It's getting very, very tough.</s>PARKER: Well, he's becoming the thing he campaigned against. And in the meantime, this is how bad it really is, because two of the most prominent candidates out there are campaigning as a witch and a nerd.</s>SPITZER: Or not.</s>PARKER: Or not.</s>CHRISTINE O'DONNELL (R), DELAWARE: I'm not a witch; I'm nothing you've heard. I'm you. None of us are perfect, but none of us can be happy with what we see all around us.</s>ANNOUNCER: We've tried happy talk and we're 50th out of 50, dead last.</s>RICK SNIDER (R), MICHIGAN: It's time for a nerd.</s>ANNOUNCER: As president he grew Gateway computers. He's nurtured innovative companies to grand success and grown thousands of jobs in Michigan and across America. Rick Snyder for Michigan, he's one tough nerd.</s>SPITZER: The problem that Barack Obama has right now is that he simply cannot persuade people that government is working and whereas two years ago, he could say government was the problem, now he needs to say government is working and I'm doing good things for you. Nobody's going to listen to it or buy it. I'll show my partisan colors right now, I think Barack Obama has given that to us, it is difficult, it takes time. These things don't happen overnight when you're digging your way out of a casm as deep as this one, it's going to take time to get back to where you even see some clawing over the top of that lift and we're not there yet and so, you know...</s>PARKER: I'm exhausted.</s>SPITZER: You know, give the poor guy some time would be my plea, but that's not a winning...</s>PARKER: Give him some time? He's had two years. That's the problem in it.</s>SPITZER: Yeah, but you know what? That's not a strategy either.</s>PARKER: Well, I mean, he's the one that came in with the hope and change, which is not a strategy, it's not a policy, and you said it...</s>SPITZER: To some it's a strategy. It's not a political strategy, because we all know the time line for voters is this, it's one week.</s>PARKER: Look, bottom line, Barack Obama came in and did what the most of the American people did not want him to do. He created this problem and now he's got to deal with it. I'm sorry that he did so poorly, because look what we've got.</s>SPITZER: Well Kathleen, you can't say he created this problem. If you were to say he should not have moved on health care first because jobs, jobs, jobs is all people cared about, fine, fair debate about priorities. Creating the problem clearly was not on his watch. You could even say it was Bill Clinton as much as Bush.</s>PARKER: Yeah, but he magnified the problem.</s>SPITZER: No.</s>PARKER: He absolutely did. Yes, he did.</s>SPITZER: No. No. No. Not at all. The reality, according to most economists, is that the stimulus has in fact had a very positive impact. Not enough. The argument is whether it should have been bigger. This is somebody was using all the economic tools available. I don't think he's done enough. But, the question isn't whether he created it, he clearly didn't.</s>PARKER: I didn't say he created it, I said he magnified it. OK? There's a difference.</s>SPITZER: He didn't magnify it, either.</s>PARKER: Well, of course he did. I mean...</s>SPITZER: So, what would you have had him do, no stimulus?</s>PARKER: Oh, for crying out loud. Are we going to go through this again?</s>SPITZER: Sure we are, because if you're saying he magnified it, the question is, did the stimulus...</s>PARKER: I want to go back to the narrative and I want to get back to the ads for a minute, because here is the thing that I think you and I can agree on which is that Barack Obama has done such a poor job that we have now candidates who are emerging and who are probably -- at least have a chance of taking office in places where they don't belong...</s>SPITZER: I disagree fervently with some things he has done. I've been very clear about my dissatisfaction with his economic policy, hasn't gone far enough. Put all that aside, they have used the tools there as best they could in an economic cataclysm. You can fall over, but this is reality and that's what you got to do.</s>PARKER: That is falling asleep.</s>SPITZER: But this is the thing that matters.</s>PARKER: Talking points do that to me.</s>SPITZER: They're not talking points, this is a harsh reality, so that when we were in office we needed Democrats...</s>PARKER: We? Oh, we?</s>SPITZER: Yeah, we. We traded 23 million jobs and left with a budget surplus. The crass failure of Reaganomics and lower taxes for those who could afford it, and letting the financial system destroy has brought us to where we are. Put all that aside, I agree with you about some of these candidates. Christine O'Donnell should not be in the United States Senate. But, you know what, if she goes there, it won't be a big problem.</s>PARKER: I think that if we actually do have a mouse with a fully functioning human brain, we should send them to Washington. We've got rats in already, why not a mouse.</s>SPITZER: I agree with you on that. I don't know about rats, we've got worse than that. We've got vipers.</s>PARKER: It's time for our headline interview with the mad genius behind these ads we've been talking about, Fred Davis.</s>SPITZER: Mad genius is right, if Christine O'Donnell does in fact win, he's the guy to blame, he has put the ads on the air that made her respectable and brought her within just a couple points so far, as we've said, she does believe, mice and humans are crossbreeding and there's a mouse with a fully functioning human brain somewhere out there.</s>PARKER: And he also has a brilliant idea for Barack Obama, a way for the president to turn everything around. Anyway, we spoke with him just a little bit ago, he's fascinating.</s>SPITZER: Ed Maved (ph) and Fred Davis is the creator of those ads we just showed you, including Christine O'Donnell's famous, "I am not a witch" ad.</s>PARKER: In addition to trying to rework a O'Donnell's image, Davis has also produce ads for former president George W. Bush, for John McCain and Arnold Schwarzenegger. Welcome, Fred, and thanks for being here. And let me just start with this witch ad. You're not afraid of self-parody, what were you thinking when you came up with that idea?</s>FRED DAVIS, REPUBLICAN AD MAKER: Well, the idea was very simple. She was the butt of most national jokes and I found her -- I had dinner with her one night and filmed her the next day and that was the only time I had to get to know her, so all I knew is what the voters knew and that's what they saw on "Saturday Night Live" and the "Today Show" and "Tonight Show" and all the jokes. And I thought it was important and Christine thought it was important to draw a line in the sand and say OK, that was before, this is after, now let's move on to what's really important to people in Delaware which had very little to do with her being a witch or not.</s>PARKER: Well, yeah, when I first saw the ad I thought, oh my gosh, I can't believe this. And when Eliot saw the ad he said, oh my gosh, that's brilliant, so I think you have...</s>DAVIS: We like Eliot.</s>SPITZER: Well, you know, but here's what I found about it, the "I'm not a witch line" was almost necessary; it did, as you hoped set that issue aside. The line that mattered to me, as a viewer, as potential -- I'm not a voter of Delaware, of course, was "I am you." No, there's a message you're saying here is, "I am like the rest of you, I'm not one of them up in Washington." That seems to me to be the thematic of your campaign. And it's working, I would observe, you're within, what, 11 points at this point?</s>DAVIS: We've narrowed the gap by 50 percent in one week and I'll take that any day.</s>SPITZER: And there is an element of her that is still a little bit jarring to most people, and she doesn't believe in evolution and there is that famous tape with her recently, I mean not the witch stuff from 20 years ago, or whatever, where she says that mice and humans are being cross bred and we have a -- you know, they're creating a mouse with a fully functioning human brain.</s>PARKER: Yeah, let's take a look.</s>SPITZER: Let's take a look at this one, Fred.</s>O'DONNELL: American scientific companies are cross breeding humans and animals and coming up with mice with fully functioning human brain.</s>SPITZER: That is kind of a remarkable claim for somebody who is now only a couple points away from being elected to the United States Senate to make. Does this worry you at all? I mean, do you ever say, my goodness, this is a candidate who maybe just shouldn't be in the United States Senate?</s>DAVIS: I honestly did think that, Eliot, before I had the dinner with her. Because I'd seen that, and I'd seen other recordings from the past and I met her in the lobby of a hotel in Philly and within five minutes I'd figured out that I was wrong, and that she's sort of gotten a -- you know, did she get a bad shake by the press? Not really. She really said those things and it's your duty and job to report those things, but this wasn't the girl that I met and she hasn't -- if you saw the debate, she has a great grasp of the issues, she has a heartfelt position on every one that will not vary, and believe me, you -- we're -- well, I can't give it away, because it hasn't run yet, we're work on a new ad for her that talks about her strength, and so I've been going in the past over some of the strong statements she's made and they're very strong.</s>PARKER: When you talk about doing an ad about her strengths, that's what we call an image ad versus a negative ad. What do you think is more effective?</s>DAVIS: They're both effective and you'll hear people say, well, the only ones that really have moved the numbers are the negative ads or contrast ads, and it's not true. You can - "One Tough Nerd," Rick Snyder in Michigan that was nothing but an image ad. No one in Michigan had heard his name, and a few months later he won the Republican primary with a lot of people in the primary, he won it by, I think, five or six points.</s>PARKER: That's a great ad that Chris Coons...</s>DAVIS: ...on pretty much image.</s>PARKER: Chris Coons could probably benefit from a tough nerd ad. But, would you explain just a little bit what that ad is? I mean, you have this fellow who's maybe not the most gregarious sort, but he's very smart and has a good record, and you decided to go with the nerd.</s>DAVIS: Well, I'll tell you, he's very gregarious, but he'd be the first to tell you he's a nerd. I went and met -- it was another one where I got hired without meeting him. Went to dinner, was going to have dinner one night, filming the next day. That always means I'm up all night writing scripts. So, I walked into the restaurant in Ann Arbor, Michigan, and there was a roundtable obviously there was Rick and he looked like a governor and I thought well, this is a good sign. And he stuck his hand out and he goes, "hey, Fred, I'm Rick Snyder," and- he had this really, really kind of nerd-like voice and my heart sort of sank. And we sat down and he was really, really smart and great history, had been the CEO of Gateway computers during their good days and somewhere in the conversation he said, "I bet you've never had a client that's as big a nerd as I am." And I was nodding to myself and I wrote that down and at the end of dinner, his wife Ann was across the table and I thought, well, I'll be fired before I even shoot one foot of film. And I said, "What would you think about really selling yourself as one tough nerd in the context that Michigan's tried this and this and this, and we've tried everything else and nothing's working, it's time for a nerd," and Ann, to her great credit, looked across the table, real sweetly and she goes, "Oh, honey that's you." And so all of a sudden, I'm up all night writing nerd ads, which I really hadn't expected going to Michigan.</s>SPITZER: Having been in the business for awhile and seeing good ads, but mine and others that worked or didn't work. What that means is that in this election cycle, with just two weeks to go, trying to parse out what's going to happen, the problem Barack Obama has, he doesn't have a narrative that fits with the emotions of the public, right now.</s>DAVIS: I think Barack Obama needs to sit down and look America in the face and his first words would not be, "I'm not a witch," his first words would be, "I was wrong." Now, you and I know that he's not going to say that. So, I'm safe saying it. It would be something like, "I was wrong. I somehow put my issue agenda ahead of yours, that stops today. I'm going to put Obamacare on hold, I'm going to put Cap and Trade on hold. I'm not going to ask senators Kyl and McConnell, and Cornyn to the Oval Office, I'm going to go to their house, I'm going to knock on their door tonight. If they don't answer the door, I'm going to go back tomorrow night and I'm doing to keep going, America, until we put aside Republican and Democrat and we develop an America's agendas that puts you back to work. And then we'll get back to where I wanted to go all along." I don't think that'll happen, but I think that's what he could do to dramatically reverse this.</s>PARKER: Well, we started with Christine O'Donnell and we'll finish with Christine O'Donnell. Do you think she can win, and if she does, will you be happy about that?</s>DAVIS: Will I be happy about that? I'll be elated and jumping up and down. I think she has a very clear shot to victory, believe it or not. I didn't think that a few weeks ago, but when you make up, you know, 10 or 11 points in one week, and I know what the game plan is for the remaining couple of weeks, I think she has a very good chance at victory.</s>PARKER: Well, and let's be clear, she's not a witch. So, thank you.</s>SPITZER: That we can agree on.</s>DAVIS: You didn't ask Eliot, Eliot didn't say that.</s>PARKER: Fred, thank you very much for being with us. We'll be right back.</s>DAVIS: We'll be right back.</s>SPITZER: Rand Paul's idea would be what? Would be to just privatize Social Security?</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Look, you can't at the same time ignore the fact that no one is talking about changing entitlements and then make their idea seem like those spawned from the devil.</s>PARKER: I'm glad we were able to work the devil in here, actually.</s>SPITZER: It is expected that billions will be spent on advertising this political season. President Obama and the Democrats are now cast as the insiders and the Republicans have the message of hope and change.</s>PARKER: And joining us in "The Arena" tonight to discuss this, Ari Melber, he's a correspondent with "The Nation" and a columnist for "Politico." And Will Cain from the "National Review." Ari, welcome. How are you?</s>ARI MELBER, "THE NATION": Good to see you. How are you?</s>PARKER: I'm beginning to feel like a little family.</s>SPITZER: Will, great to see you.</s>PARKER: We see so much of you.</s>SPITZER: Kind of like Thanksgiving, here.</s>PARKER: I know, it really is. We just don't have a tur -- well, I won't say that, I wouldn't go that far.</s>SPITZER: I'm complaining.</s>PARKER: We have a turkey. Anyway, we've been talking about poor Barack Obama, the former agent of hope and change, it seems that this is no longer working. Who is now the agent of change?</s>MELBER: Well, you know, the Republicans are obviously arguing that any change is going to be good here and they don't have the same pressure that you have during a presidential campaign of do you have the responsibility, do you have the experience. I think inexperience is clearly an advantage, so they're saying change and don't worry whether they can balance the books, they're going to get in the way of Obama's agenda. That's what they've been selling.</s>SPITZER: Ari, can I say this? I'm on your side all the time, it sounds like poor excuse making. I wish I were with you, but we're not making our arguments. I mean, Will, you guys are winning. It's killing me.</s>WILL CAIN, NATIONAREVIEW.COM: Yeah, logic wins out, often, Eliot.</s>SPITZER: Yeah. This is not logic. This is hope and prayers over logic and experience. But look, Ari, we got to face facts, the public has turned against the Obama message. It may not be because it's wrong, it's just a fact of life right now, and no matter how many speeches he does, he's not going to get their support, right now.</s>PARKER: It's not that it's wrong, it's just that everybody hates it. What do you think?</s>CAIN: You know, lest we run into the same problem we did two years ago, I think the integral question to ask is, what is it exactly we want to change?</s>SPITZER: That's a good question.</s>CAIN: I mean, two years ago we had a message that was put forward and centered around the concept of hope and change, but no one really stopped to ask, what exactly is it that we're trying to change?</s>PARKER: Well, they were trying to change George W. Bush.</s>CAIN: That's one of the things.</s>PARKER: That was his only</s>SPITZER: Will, I think you're exactly right, I think there was this patina that the words themselves were a governing agenda and I think we all know that is not the case. The agenda people did want, and I think that sensible people, you know, all the rhetoric aside, would agree on, is that investments that will create jobs and a tax structure that produces investment, and education, things that aren't nitty-gritty, that aren't the passionate words of a campaign. But, I think the president feels he's been doing that is his frustration.</s>CAIN: I understand his frustration. I think he agrees with you, but the problem with this Eliot, and why Barack Obama hasn't been able to find his footing this year, is that concept of change basically brought together an umbrella of three different kinds of people: One who heard change and thought exactly, that it was just a change in Bush. That was the protest vote. Barack Obama can't rely on those people this year, that change has been made.</s>SPITZER: The reason for it is gone.</s>CAIN: The reason -- exactly. The second group heard the concept of change and said, "This is a guy who's promising to change Washington." These are the people that place civility above all of us. They think with the right personality traits, they can magically make Jim DeMint and Bernie Sanders agree.</s>SPITZER: Right. Never going to happen.</s>CAIN: Never going to happen. These voters are constantly disillusioned and they'll move from party to party. So we can't count on them. And then there's the final group, and that's the one you referenced, the one that who truly heard his message that he's going to change America. And by that he meant he's going to pass a health care bill that every liberal president since Teddy Roosevelt has tried to pass, has the most successful legislative session since 1966. He's delivered for these people. The problem is, there's not enough of them.</s>SPITZER: Well, I think, you know, that's actually a fair critique, but I think what he has failed to do, and this is where communication does come into play, is explain how he has planted the seeds for a much broader resurrection of the American economy. And that, I think, is what would swamp numerically, if he could persuade people of that, then the first two piece of the stool, and you're right, they may have disappeared, he could get enough people to join him, nonetheless. He</s>PARKER: I want to add a fourth leg to that stool and that is that I think we're forgetting a whole group of people who were simply excited about the possibility that this post racial man could transform America, we could get past something once and for all and get on the other side.</s>CAIN: I think you're right.</s>PARKER: I mean, that was huge. I think that was particularly huge for possibly the baby boom generation, that they wanted to live to see this day when we had an African-American president and be done with it, you know, and no longer have all that baggage.</s>MELBER: But, you know, we're also talking in terms categories, what did people want, what did they get? The other dividing like to pick up on what you're saying, Kathleen, is age. Voters over 45 still went for McCain. Voters under 45 went for Obama, and voters under 30 went for Obama by a 34 point margin, largest in the last several elections. And in midterms you have much lower turnout traditionally among lower people, as well as, partly the African-American and minority base that was a part of the coalition. So, when you factor in those turnout rates and the economy, what we're seeing, partly, is a conversation about the universe of people turning out, not necessarily that we're unhappy, and I think that's why most people still would say Obama's going to get re-elected, because that universe changes again in 2012.</s>CAIN: I think these, both of your explanations, Eliot, are very good excuses for you, in this respect: One, as long as you say that it's the enthusiasm gap, that people just aren't turning out, people that think like you are just aren't going to the polls, or that people just aren't understanding how great your ideas, Eliot, are. Which basically is what she said, Obama basically hasn't convinced people how great these ideas are. You never have to face the fact that people didn't really like the ideas when they were first presented.</s>SPITZER: You may be right. I'm willing to concede that's a possibility, I really am. But I I think there is a larger issue here, and this is where I have broken with the administration. The reason they became a status quo so quickly, is that they negotiated with everybody in a way that maintained the status quo. And I use Wall Street as the perfect example for that. Had he maintained the impression in the public that he was really fighting against the entrenched financial interests on behalf of the public, which is clearly not what he's done, the banks are still the same, they're making the big profits, the foreclosure mess these days. All of these things have coagulated, to use your metaphor from last week, to persuade people that really things are stuck in the same place, had he instead been breaking down the ramparts of Wall Street, then there would have been a sense he's not there yet, but he's fighting for us, and it hasn't gotten there. I think that message has been given up by his willingness to negotiate with the status quo instead of take it on. And I think that's the emotional part.</s>CAIN: And I guess I'm shocked by your shock at that revelation. I mean, Barack Obama, the Democratic Party, the Republican Party had been so enshrined with Wall Street stayed</s>SPITZER: Well, you don't have to tell me that the Democratic Party elite has been enshrined with Wall Street. When I was A.G. and doing that, you will notice how much support I had from the leadership of the Democratic Party -- zero, zip, nada. Nobody wanted to do it, they tried to subvert me. And so I fully appreciate that, but I think that this president, I was hoping having gone to what we saw the nation go through in '07-'08 there would have done something quite different.</s>CAIN: So now with this disillusion it sounds like you're ready to join the Tea Party.</s>SPITZER: No, I'm ready to drink some tea, but I'm not going to join that party, trust me. We are still, because -- and here's where the difference between rhetoric and governing really emerges, there isn't yet a coherent answer from either Dick Armey or the pledge to America or any of the budget numbers we look at, it takes us further down a path of bigger deficits and no job growth and that's what has me worried.</s>MELBER: Yeah, and that's the key is that nine out of $10 in the federal budget go to your nondiscretionary programs, defense and entitlement. Right? So, when you have people coming along saying, well, we're going to go get fraud and waste, it's easy to run against fraud and waste. It's easy to run saying you're not a witch, right? Nobody wants to be a witch, nobody likes fraud, nobody likes corruption. It's harder to put that all aside and figure out, where do the other nine dollars come out. And I haven't heard, and I don't know if you've heard -- you tell us who we should keep an eye on, but I haven't heard a Tea Party nominee come out with that kind of budgeting yet. So, what we have from them is just rhetoric.</s>CAIN: Well, you're not listening, Ari. I mean, Rand Paul, for better or worse, Sharron Angle, Mike Lee, all of these people have talked about making real changes to entitlements.</s>MELBER: Well right, Rand Paul's idea would be what? Would be to just privatize Social Security?</s>CAIN: Look, you can't at the same time ignore the fact that no one is talking about changing entitlements and then make their idea seem like those spawned from the devil.</s>PARKER: I'm glad we were able to work the devil in here, actually.</s>SPITZER: But Ari's right. Do you think privatizing Social Security is the right answer? If you do, I admire you for saying it. I think it's dead wrong and I think it would destroy the safety net for seniors.</s>PARKER: Yeah, so do you still believe in it now?</s>CAIN: I still believe in it no matter how wrong I really think it is.</s>PARKER: Thanks so much for being with us. Coming up, we have finally found the issue that's really driving this election, and it's not the economy or unemployment, it's manliness? We'll be right back.</s>RAND PAUL (R), KENTUCKY: Run a race as a man, stand up and be a man.</s>SHARRON ANGLE (R), NEVADA: Man up, Harry Reid, you need to understand that we have a problem with social security.