Trump Denies Calls Posing as Spokesman; Trump has Yet to Disclose Tax Information.
ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Ashleigh Banfield. And welcome to LEGAL VIEW. Many a candidate for public office has seen his own words come back from the distant past to haunt him, but Donald Trump, as you may have already heard, is not your normal, usual, everyday candidate. So now the political universe is abuzz that words that Donald Trump claims were not his, but those of a very helpful, very insightful Donald Trump spokesman who happened to sound very, very much like one Donald J. Trump. Words that Donald Trump say don't matter. They don't matter because they were spoken 25 years ago. "The Washington Post" got a hold and an audio recording from 1991. And on that audio recording, a reporter from "People" magazine interviewing a man who identified himself as a newly hired Trump press aide named John Miller said this.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What is your position there?</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, I'm sort of in PR, because he gets so much of it.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And, frankly, I mean I can tell you off the record, if I can tell you -</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Yes.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If I can try to get to know you and talk a little bit off the record, I can tell you that he - he didn't care if he got bad PR until he got a divorce (ph)</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And people said, how come all of a sudden he's doing so well and then I guess</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where did you come from?</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I - I was - I basically worked for different firms. I worked for a couple of different firms. And I'm somebody that knows and I think somebody that he trusts and likes.</s>BANFIELD: That reporter tells "The Post" that she hung up and thought, it's so weird that Donald Trump hired someone who sounds just like him. Here's how Donald Trump responded this morning on the "Today" show.</s>DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (via telephone): It was not me on the phone. And it doesn't sound like me on the phone. I will tell you that. And it was not me on the phone. And when was this, 25 years ago?</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In the early '90s. But -</s>TRUMP: Wow.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.</s>TRUMP: You mean - you mean you're - you're going so low as to talk about something that took place 25 years ago about whether or not I made a phone call, I guess you're saying under a presumed name?</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, under a presumed name.</s>TRUMP: OK. Well - OK. The answer is no.</s>BANFIELD: I want to bring in CNN politics reporter Jeremy Diamond, who's following this right now. The phone call's getting a lot of ink and it's getting a lot of TV time, but is it the only incident like this?</s>JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN POLITICS REPORTER: Well, it's certainly not, Ashleigh. You know, we went back and kind of looked to see where else has Donald Trump used this name of a spokesman? You know, John Barron, John Miller. And I found a few different instances, including "New York Times" articles from 1994 and 1985 in which, you know, there's a spokesman, John Barron, quoted as a vice president of the Trump organization. And, you know, what's really interesting is this has kind of been an open secret. Not only in New York media circle, especially the gossip pages of New York tabloids that have repeatedly use the quote/unquote spokesman, but also among Trump organization executives, former Trump organization executives who told CNN that, in fact, you know, this was well known that Donald Trump would, in fact, use these monikers to speak on his own behalf as a quote/unquote spokesman.</s>BANFIELD: So he was obviously not happy with Matt and Savannah's line of questions and actually said, so you're going to go so low as to talk about something that took place 25 years ago, whether or not I made a phone call. Let's get on to more current topics. But the problem is, is that Donald Trump, just in the last week, has focused very, very heavily on stuff from 25 years ago, from the 1990s, and he has been sort of trying to destroy Hillary Clinton over things in the 1990s.</s>DIAMOND: That's right. Yes, this has been - emerged as kind of one of the central attacks that Donald Trump is leveling against his likely general election opponent, Hillary Clinton, who is, you know, the frontrunner for the Democratic nomination, of course. He has repeatedly brought up issues about Bill Clinton's past, you know, his alleged affairs, his alleged sexual abuses and that's kind of main line. Here's Donald Trump talking about Hillary Clinton as a quote/unquote enabler.</s>TRUMP: And Hillary was an enabler and she treated these women horribly. Just remember this. And some of those women were destroyed, not by him, but by the way that Hillary Clinton treated them after everything went down. So just remember that, folks.</s>DIAMOND: So, as I said, that's kind of one of the central lines of attacks that Donald Trump has now been leveling against Hillary Clinton as he ramps up for a general election after locking up the presumptive Republican nomination. So it seems like that's a sign of more things to come, but certainly Donald Trump does not want to be talking about things like the fact that he perhaps pretended, impersonated a spokesman in the '80s and '90s, but he will continue to focus on Hillary Clinton's, you know, the issues emerging with her during that time. Ashleigh.</s>BANFIELD: I think I get it. OK. Jeremy Diamond, thank you for that. Can't wait to talk this one out with my panel. Jeffrey Lord is a Donald Trump supporter and a CNN political commentator. Errol Louis is a CNN political commentator and political anchor for Time Warner Cable News. And Amanda Carpenter is a former communications aide to Ted Cruz, as well a CNN political commentator. Welcome to all three of you.</s>JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Hello, Ashleigh.</s>BANFIELD: Did not think we were going to be running tape from back in the '90s today, but, Jeffrey Lord, you have the unenviable task of trying to put this one in perspective and make it sound good. It doesn't sound good. You've got to be honest, it doesn't sound good.</s>LORD: No, I don't agree with you at all, Ashleigh. Look, I - in my - as I - you know, in my misspent youth, I was a press secretary to a congressman and a United States senator. I know how Washington works. And there's very few presidents, cabinet officers, senators or congressmen who do not do some version of what Donald Trump is being accused of doing here. They talk to reporters on the sly and say, don't use my name, but, and then the reporter goes out there and says, a source knowledgeable dah, dah, dah, dah, dah, and they never say -</s>BANFIELD: But that source is being honest, though. Jeffrey, the difference being the source is being honest. The source is saying who I am when I tell you these things don't use my name.</s>LORD: The source doesn't matter. No. No, no, no, no, no.</s>BANFIELD: Isn't there a difference between just blatantly lying?</s>LORD: No. No.</s>BANFIELD: This isn't punking because nobody is told they're being punked.</s>LORD: The source - Ashleigh - Ashleigh, the source is not being identified in the newspaper, or on television. The source is hiding his identity and the reporter is going along with it.</s>BANFIELD: The reporter is not being lied to.</s>LORD: The - the public is being lied to. This isn't just a quote/unquote anonymous source. This is a senator, a</s>BANFIELD: Are we really having this debate over semantics? Honestly, Jeffrey, I thought you were going to say something more like 25 years ago things are different now and</s>I - LORD: Well - well, let me - let me get to that. Let me get to that. And I will say that, Ashleigh. Four years ago, when Mitt Romney ran for president, "The Washington Post" front paged a story that when he was in high school, high school, he and along with a gang of kids had cut - you know, pinned some kid to the grown in a high school type situation and cut his hair. And years later this kid turns out to be gay. I.e., Mitt Romney was a gay basher. This is what happens to Republican nominees for president, whether it's John McCain -</s>BANFIELD: Well, I'm not going to -</s>LORD: Whether it's Mitt Romney. Donald Trump. This is what goes on.</s>BANFIELD: I'm certainly not going to apologize for anyone who does that, but there is a massive difference between someone in high school and a businessman well into his 30s or 40s openly lying publicly to a reporter.</s>LORD: Ashleigh, Ashleigh, if you're out of a job in America, do you really think somebody cares about this?</s>BANFIELD: I think people care if their - if their president lies. Errol, do they care? Errol, do they care if somebody was telling lies to a reporter? Look, we're the bottom of the heap, but do they care if they're lying 25 years ago?</s>ERROL LOUIS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I don't - I don't know whether people will care. I can tell you, people should care that the candidate lied on camera today. I mean what he did 25 years ago is what he did, it's as obvious - I mean, look. Well, this is a legal show, so I'll use a little law school Latin, right.</s>BANFIELD: OK, so I'm going to move on from that because frankly, which is the word that Donald Trump likes to use a lot and strangely that guy on the phone used as well, frankly, say what you will about it. Amanda, id' like to draw your attention to other tape today. Donald Trump was asked by George Stephanopoulos on "Good Morning America" today a very simple question with regard to the tax returns that Donald Trump says he won't release because he's being audited. Have a listen to that exchange.</s>GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS, "GOOD MORNING AMERICA": What is your tax rate?</s>DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It's none of your business. You'll see it when I release. But I fight very hard to pay as little tax as possible.</s>BANFIELD: Amanda, what is your tax rate? None of your business. Is it our business?</s>AMANDA CARPENTER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I mean, I think it is. Every other presidential candidate has made these disclosures. Of course, Donald Trump is free not to do it, but he's going to continue to get questions, especially if he wants to make tax reform a central issue. Offering these tax disclosures is a sign of good faith to the voters. This is how I've made my money. This is how I've conducted my life. He's been unwilling to go under that vetting process. And the thing that sort of really boggles my mind between the tax returns and this issue of whether or not it's fair for "Washington Post" reporters to go look at these audiotapes is that, you know, a lot of Republicans, conservatives, went crazy because they didn't feel like Obama was vetted enough during his presidential campaign. This is what the vetting process is. It's looking at how you've conducted your public life. And if you haven't been in office a long time, we need to look at your businesses. That's what people want to see the tax returns for. And then also, Donald Trump, how have you conducted yourself as a public figure? Did you misrepresent yourself to make your divorce look better in the papers? This is the central question to his relationships with women. And I agree, tabloid fodder, really, who cares if it was 25 years ago, but are you lying about it right now? And if you're not lying, then produce this PR figure that you hired and apparently trusted enough to discuss your divorce with the press. If he can't do that, then I think that makes it clear what's going on.</s>BANFIELD: Yes, because John Miller, John Barron shouldn't be too hard to find.</s>CARPENTER: Yes.</s>BANFIELD: Obviously a big supporter of Donald Trump, bit fan of Donald Trump, says he knows him really, really well. It's possible he's still around, either of those two people. I don't know which one it was. I know you're laughing, Jeffrey Lord. And sometimes we have to laugh until we cry because this is the president of the United States. This isn't who's going to win "Survivor." It's not going to be who wins the, you know, reality shows.</s>LORD: Well, I would be less concerned about this than if the secretary of state was lying about Benghazi, to be perfectly candid.</s>BANFIELD: And that's going to be another segment as well. And there have been many segments about it. But I do have to ask you, is it - I mean is it not our business? Because for the last 40 years, Amanda said all presidents, just in the last 40 years -</s>LORD: Right.</s>BANFIELD: Which is a lifetime for many of us, every president has done it. And it does -</s>LORD: Speak for yourself.</s>BANFIELD: Well, God bless you. But definitely more than my lifetime. So my issue is, is that those tax returns will tell us a lot about whether Donald Trump tells the truth. If we're going to move beyond these tapes, the tax returns will tell us that. And every other candidate and president has agreed. Why is he different?</s>LORD: Ashleigh, you know, I have to say, in thinking about this, Donald Trump or anyone else, frankly, I just think that this is worth - a worthless exercise. It has only been done for 40 years. In other words, we had plenty of presidents in the United States, up until I think Richard Nixon was the first that had to do this in the sort of post-Watergate atmosphere. I just think that, you know, who cares at this point. This is not in the Constitution. This is not a qualification to be president. I don't really care what anybody's taxes are.</s>BANFIELD: Being honest is. I'm just going to say that. Look, I think crime is bad. Puppies are sweet. And that it is important to be honest if you are a president.</s>LORD: Well -</s>BANFIELD: Errol, quick, last word.</s>LORD: No, that's not -</s>LOUIS: Especially - I mean especially - especially if you're - never mind 40 years ago. The last 40 days, if you're going to be a candidate who runs around talking about lyin' Ted and crooked Hillary and saying the press is dishonest and casting aspersions on everybody else's statements, you should be willing to take a little bit of what you're giving out and answer some questions and be truthful for a change.</s>BANFIELD: And, Errol, I'm just going to answer that. Jeffrey, that Donald Trump sells himself on a campaign trail regularly as being a very astute businessman. So I think it's only fair for us to see for ourselves if it's just what he says or if it's what he does.</s>LORD: But the issue - one of the issues here is the IRS and the politicization of the IRS. And there's all kinds of people -</s>BANFIELD: OK.</s>LORD: I mean the whole Lois Lerner (ph) episode pictures the IRS as a very political agency.</s>BANFIELD: But 10 - you know, 10, 15 years of politicization of the IRS. He's not releasing any of them. I think we could go back and forth on this all day.</s>LORD: We could.</s>BANFIELD: I adore all three of you and I absolutely love having you on this program.</s>LORD: I love it.</s>BANFIELD: And I hope you have a great weekend. Thank you.</s>LORD: Thanks, Ashleigh.</s>BANFIELD: Jeffrey Lord, Errol Louis and Amanda Carpenter, best to you, all three. Coming up, the former head of the CIA is slamming Donald Trump's positions on foreign policy as, quote, ready, "crazy." That's the former head of the CIA. His explanation, plus reaction from this man, a very busy man these days, who travels a lot and has to take in a lot of information. He's the RNC's communications director, Sean Spicer. He's live with me next.