Trump Flip-Flops Again on Stimulus Negotiations
TAPPER: In our politics lead today: President Trump has again completely reversed course, this time on the stimulus. He says he is once again willing to negotiate with Democrats on a big coronavirus relief deal. Not only that, but the president is claiming that he wants an even bigger relief package than either Democrats or Republicans have proposed, which is the exact opposite of what he said a few days ago. CNN's Manu Raju is live on Capitol Hill for us. Manu, give us a reality check here. It seemed as though one of the issues for Republicans was that Democrats wanted to spend too much. Now President Trump is saying he wants to spend even more than Democrats?</s>MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, the president has been all over the map on this issue, Jake. Just three days ago, he pulled the plug, said he wanted to punt on the issue of these stimulus talks until after the election. That sent Wall Street panicking. But Republican leaders, including Mitch McConnell, told me he's agreed with the president's approach. Now, afterwards, after the backlash that president received, now he's back at the negotiating table. And, today, his Treasury secretary proposed $1.8 trillion in a package, moving much closer to Nancy Pelosi is $2.2 trillion. But, Jake, that is far more than what Senate Republicans are willing to spend. They have gotten behind a $500 billion plan. And when they talked about going up to $1 trillion back in late July, the party was badly divided over it. Now, despite all of those concerns on the Republican side, the president told Rush Limbaugh earlier today that he was willing to spend even more than the Democrats.</s>TRUMP: I would like to see a bigger stimulus package, frankly, than either the Democrats or the Republicans are offering. I'm going in the exact opposite now, OK? I mean, I'm telling you this. I'm telling you something I don't tell anybody else, because maybe it helps or maybe it hurts negotiations.</s>RAJU: Republicans think it hurts negotiations, because Nancy Pelosi wants the administration to spend more money. And, as she's been holding out, Republicans have been -- the administration is moving closer and closer to her position. But, Jake, despite the close -- moving closer on the overall number, there are so many details they still have to iron out. And Mitch McConnell said in Kentucky today it was unlikely any deal will come together before the election.</s>TAPPER: I mean, this is erratic, even for President Trump, who is an erratic leader. Speaker Pelosi, Manu, also publicly backed a push today that would give Congress a role in removing presidents from office. The 25th Amendment is -- the Cabinet and the vice president have to go along with it. This would allow lawmakers. Such a bill, though, would clearly be dead on arrival in Mitch McConnell's Senate. So this is just a stunt, I presume?</s>RAJU: Yes, Republicans certainly see it that way. It has no chance of passing. Pelosi even herself indicated is not something that's going to come up for a vote this year. It's going to be -- probably wait until next year. But Democrats want to spotlight their concerns over the president's condition. They are pointing to language in the Constitution that allows a body established by Congress and the vice president to declare a president unable to serve and discharge his duties. And, in that case, the vice president would become the acting president. So, this legislation would essentially establish that body that is allowed for in the Constitution, but, again, Jake, as you mentioned, no chance of becoming law, but Pelosi, of course, getting behind this now, amid concerns about the president's condition.</s>TAPPER: Yes, Manu Raju, thank you so much. Joining us to discuss, CNN's Gloria Borger, "The Washington Post"'s Philip Bump. Gloria, President Trump all over the map on the relief bill. Now he's back in them. He even says he wants to spend even more than Democrats do. He bounced back out of next week's debate because it was supposed to be held remotely for the candidates. Now he's calling for it to be reinstated. I don't know if it's the medication. The president has, of course, always been erratic. But he really -- I have to say, to put it nicely, he seems concerned about being reelected.</s>GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, let's just say that. Look, it might not be the medication, but it certainly is desperation, Jake. This is a president who is flailing. He can read the polls. He is stuck at the White House. He sees that Joe Biden, ironically, is the one out on the campaign trail, and he's not at this point. So I think you have a president who has no clear message, beyond hurling insults, and he's full of grievance. But if you ask him what he wants to do for the next four years, you don't get any kind of a clear message out of him. So -- and I -- maybe we shouldn't expect it. But this is a president who every day does something, and then undoes it. So it's not whether you can believe the president anymore, but it's when you can believe the president. Do you believe him last Tuesday, when he pulled the plug on stimulus, or do you believe him today, when he wants a large stimulus? Who knows?</s>TAPPER: And, Phil, what do you make of Speaker Pelosi publicly backing this effort to get legislators involved in removing a president from office, if he cannot faithfully discharge the duties of his office, what the 25th Amendment leaves up to the Cabinet and the vice president? Why -- I mean, there's no chance this is going to become law. There's no chance Mitch McConnell will even have a vote on it. Why do this?</s>PHILIP BUMP, "THE WASHINGTON POST": I mean, it seems like the obvious reason here is to try and have a conversation about whether or not President Trump is fit for his position, right? I mean, obviously, this is something that Democrats have been arguing, basically, since President Trump was elected, that there was some question about his fitness for the office. They're trying to highlight that. I mean, it's pretty clearly -- Donald Trump is not going to sign into law something which establishes a commission which could potentially throw him out of office, even if it were to move quickly. So, yes, I mean, it just seems -- it seems like a stunt. But, to be fair, we're talking about it, so I guess, to some extent, it worked.</s>TAPPER: And we should note, Gloria, there is a Marine standing outside the Oval Office right now, which is another -- and he's wearing a mask -- good for him -- which is a symbol of the fact that either the president is in the Oval Office, or they're expecting him there any moment. The fact is, the president, as far as we know, is still contagious.</s>BORGER: Yes.</s>TAPPER: And 25 days until the election, these are just constant reminders of the fact that the president has been reckless, to the degree that he himself has contracted the coronavirus. And he almost seemed to be suggesting in his interviews with Hannity and Limbaugh that maybe he even was close to death, that it was very, very serious.</s>BORGER: Yes. And now, of course, Jake, he wants to go back out on the campaign trail. The question is -- and we don't know anything much about his condition -- is he going to take another test? Has he tested negative? He couldn't answer that on his interview with Hannity. So, we don't -- we don't really know anything about what's going to happen in the future. And I might add that, every time he's in the Oval Office, people have to get dressed up in gowns and goggles to go in and see him. And yet he still insists that, for some reason, he can't do his work in his upstairs office, but he has to do his work in the Oval Office. And there are people working around him who are putting themselves at great risk. They're choosing to do so. But, for some reason, he insists that he needs to show the American public he's, what, Superman? I don't know.</s>TAPPER: And, Philip, I should note, on the president's favorite channel just a few minutes ago, Secretary of State Pompeo was asked about Donald Trump's desire that he release more Hillary Clinton e- mails. I can't believe I'm even saying this.</s>BORGER: Yes.</s>TAPPER: And Pompeo said that they were working as fast as they can. And then FOX said, before the election? And Pompeo said, yes, before the election, we're trying to make that happen. I mean, what?</s>BORGER: Right.</s>BUMP: That's the key question. And it's -- the thing that's really baffling about this is, people may remember, not only did we spend a lot of time talking about Hillary Clinton's e-mails when Hillary Clinton was on the ballot, but we talked about the e-mails the State Department had, which were released in tranches over the course of the year, year-and-a-half prior to the election. We have already seen the vast majority. I don't even know there are any that we haven't seen. We have already seen so many of these e- mails. There was nothing interesting in them. And they have absolutely zero pertinence right now to this election, beyond that it gives Donald Trump a chance to talk about something which he equates to Democrats are bad. That's fundamentally what this is all about. He wants talk about Hillary Clinton, because people don't like Hillary Clinton. People like Joe Biden better than Hillary Clinton. So he'd much rather be speaking about Hillary Clinton. But to relitigate this now is just absolutely baffling. And it's -- there's -- I hate to go out on a limb. After 2016, I try not to make hard and fast predictions. This is not going to change the election. It's not going to -- there's no chance that's going to happen. I don't understand why he's doing it.</s>TAPPER: And, Gloria, I mean, I have to say, at some point, people like Mike Pompeo, who has presidential aspirations of his own, need to start thinking about how much they're going to continue to enable this bizarre behavior.</s>BORGER: Right. Well, Mike Pompeo got criticized by the president publicly the other night. So, clearly, he took it to heart, because he can't do that. And he wants to be -- he wants to run for president, I presume. So he wants to keep Donald Trump's base. I mean, somebody needs to remind Donald Trump, and perhaps Mike Pompeo, that this is 2020, and not 2016. And if Mike Pompeo desires to be president at some point, perhaps he ought to start saying, you know what, I have to establish my own base and not count on Donald Trump's base, because maybe they are there for just him.</s>TAPPER: Gloria Borger, Philip Bump, thanks to both of you. Appreciate it. President Trump says that he is getting lawyers lined up. Why? Stick around.