Indonesian Earthquake; Interview with Reverend Jesse Jackson
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington, just back from Iraq and the Persian Gulf. Thanks very much for joining us. Unfolding this hour on NEWS FROM CNN, another great quake in Asia, and the death and destruction it left behind. This time, no tsunami. We'll explore the reasons why. And Iraq's stalled democracy two months since general elections. We'll examine why a new government in Baghdad can't get it in gear. Also, this...</s>ED DAVIS, CANCER PATIENT: You're not supposed to live forever.</s>BLITZER: A lesson before dying. The wisdom of a family patriarch. We'll introduce you to one remarkable man, his stirring story of love and faith. First, some other headlines "Now in the News." Bound for Afghanistan. The first lady, Laura Bush, left a few hours ago on a trip she says she's been wanting to take for some time now. It will be a brief trip during which time she plans to meet with Afghan women, and the president, Hamid Karzai. What did U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan know, if anything, about alleged corruption in the U.N. oil-for-food program? Former Federal Reserve Chairman Paul Volcker is releasing this hour his report. It reportedly clears Annan of any conflicts of interest but does criticize his oversight of the oil-for-food program. Back in the hospital. The Reverend Jerry Falwell was admitted today for an undisclosed medical problem. He was treated earlier this month for pneumonia. We're watching that story. Among the most popular stories this hour on CNN.com. From Colorado, a divided state Supreme Court ruled that juries cannot turn to the Bible for advice during deliberations. Because of that, the court threw out the death penalty for a convicted murderer because jurors discussed Bible verses. You could read more about this story. Simply go to CNN.com. Up first today, the massive earthquake off Indonesia. One day later, no tsunamis -- at least none of major significance. It was a lot like the quake that roiled thousands of miles of ocean only last December. But this time the damage is confined to two remote islands off Sumatra, with confirmed deaths now in the hundreds. CNN's Hugh Riminton is on Sumatra. He's joining us now on the phone to tell us what's going on, how much destruction and death there was -- Hugh.</s>HUGH RIMINTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, you know, it's nearly 24 hours now. It's midnight, in fact, here in western Indonesia. And we don't know a great deal more. In fact, the authorities don't know a great deal more about the damage done than they did 24 hours ago, except they know one thing: There was no tsunami. The death toll will be in the hundreds, possibly edging into the low thousands. But no chance of a repeat out of this earthquake of those terrible devastating tsunamis that came on December 26th. Why is that? Well, no one exactly knows or seems to have a total handle on it. This earthquake was 8.7. The one on December 26th was in the 9s. It was only 60 miles apart. It was in the same ocean, was the same piece of the fault line. No wave this time. Why was that? Well, that's the realistic aspect of it. The grim aspect of it is that tonight there are thousands of people, particularly on an island called Nias and another one called Simalu, just to the north of it, who are sleeping out, sleeping rough, sleeping in many cases in the rubble of their homes after they were destroyed by that earthquake. It rocked and shook for more than two minutes. People were unable to stand. Some people tried to get out of their beds. It was the middle of the night, but they couldn't walk or run. And in some cases their houses came down around them. There are injured people out there tonight, and it will be some days before real help can get to them.</s>BLITZER: Hugh, how many people are we talking about live on these two islands off the coast of Indonesia?</s>RIMINTON: There's a chain of islands that run down the west coast of Sumatra. Sumatra itself is an island. Most of them, in fact, are uninhabited. Nias is the most heavily populated. It's not a large island. It's 125 square kilometers. But it has 600,000 people living on it. Most of them are living in villages that are not even accessible by road. This is extremely remote countryside. And that's why it will take some days to make a full assessment. It hasn't been helped by the fact that the one airstrip that goes into Nias has a -- it's concrete all-weather strip. But the earthquake was so powerful it actually cracked the runway. So the only aircraft that have been able to dock in there have been a helicopter and a couple of very small light aircraft. There have been no medical evacuations. The island further north, which is Simalu, was right at the epicenter of the December earthquake. There was a death toll in both of those islands from December. But this death toll, it appears, is greater on these two islands than happened three months ago.</s>BLITZER: Hugh, based on what you can tell, once word got out that there was a huge earthquake, I assume millions of people in that part of the world were very nervous about another tsunami. How did they react? How did the word get out? Were they running for higher ground?</s>RIMINTON: Well, certainly close to the epicenter, they certainly -- they didn't need any evacuation warnings. The earthquake was so powerful everyone just ran into a panic, and there were scenes of people in the night fleeing up into the hills. Many people in the reports we've got are still hiding out in the hills. They're frightened to come back down close to the coastline. The tsunami warning spread right across the region. The alerts went off on the beaches in Thailand. They went off in India. In Sri Lanka there was a warning. In the western coast of Australia there were warnings about it. It soon became evident that, while there was a small surge -- literally we're talking about a couple of inches that was measurable across that part of the Indian Ocean -- there was nothing like the tsunami. And things started to relax back down again. But the people close to it, there's still a panic. They're so nervous. And they know from previous experiences more aftershocks are very likely.</s>BLITZER: CNN's Hugh Riminton reporting for us from Sumatra. Hugh, we'll be in touch. Thanks very much for that report. Let's continue this story. Joining us now from Geneva to tell us what she knows about the situation and the effort to provide relief is Sian Bowen of the International Committee for the Red Cross. Sian, thank you very much for joining us. What kind of humanitarian situation, what are the reports you're getting in Geneva from what's happening on the ground in Indonesia?</s>SIAN BOWEN, INTERNATIONAL FEDERATION OF RED CROSS: Good afternoon. Well, we're hearing from our assessment teams that have been flying over the island of Nias and have also visited Simalu. We're looking at widespread destruction, probably about 60 percent of buildings affected on Nias. And in Simalu there's also quite a lot of damage and death. But not as many deaths as we've got in Nias at the moment, which is about 300 people. But we do expect that figure to rise, unfortunately.</s>BLITZER: Are you able to get supplies in, people in to the hardest-hit areas yet, Sian?</s>BOWEN: Yes, the International Federation has got people on the ground. We have medical staff in both Nias and Simalu being assisted by volunteers from the Indonesian Red Cross. So we are helping people as we speak with immediate injuries and first aid and health care. And we have more teams in supplies going in tomorrow. We have a big landing craft leaving from Malabo tomorrow, and it's going to go to the islands to bring all kinds of relief such as tents, 4x4 trucks to carry people around, kitchen sets, and things that people need in the immediate aftermath, such as tents and shelter.</s>BLITZER: These people suffered through the first earthquake at the end of December. Now a second earthquake. To a certain degree, were you better prepared for this because of that earlier earthquake? In other words, did you have people and supplies in the region in order to deal with this tragedy?</s>BOWEN: Yes. I mean, we have got a lot of supplies and people in the area at the moment. We're coordinating this out of Malabo, which isn't that far away from the islands affected. Simalu was affected last time. So they're still sort of reeling from what they went through before. We're currently helping around 11,500 survivors on Sumulu Island from the original tsunami. So for them to be struck again, it's very difficult for them. And they are finding it very difficult to cope psychologically, and there's quite a lot of panic in the air still. With the other island, with Nias, they weren't affected last time. So this is a new experience for them. But as they've been hit harder it's very difficult for them. And as they are so remote, it is logistically difficult to get to them. But we've got boats going in, and we'll be flying equipment in as well, and teams. So hopefully the response will be very quick, very timely, and these people will be brought out of the sort of miserable situation they're in quite quickly.</s>BLITZER: Sian Bowen from the International Federation of the Red Cross. Sian, good luck to you. Good luck to all the people there. Thanks very much for joining us. A second earthquake now in the Indonesian region. Let's move on now to the Terri Schiavo case. The attention of yet another national figure has been brought on the scene. The Reverend Jesse Jackson paying a visit to the hospice where Schiavo is now in her 12th day without food or water, offering prayer and protest. The Reverend Jackson joining us now live from Pinellas Park in Florida. Reverend Jackson, thanks very much for joining us. I suspect a lot of our viewers were surprised to hear that you were brought in to deal with the family, the parents, on this matter. What motivated you, Reverend Jackson, to go down to Florida and get involved?</s>REV. JESSE JACKSON, RAINBOW PUSH COALITION: Well, I care deeply about Terri's situation. And when the parents asked me, would I come, I was quick to say yes. I've been in situations as a minister where you had to pull the plug -- that is to say, that people in the advanced stages of cancer had Demerol to fight the pain, and then went into a coma. As they hurt, they got more Demerol. And then you could see them losing their pulse. And you pulled the plug and they died. In this situation, we pulled a feeding tube and the water. So we are starving her to death and dehydrating her to death. There's something about that that is fundamentally immoral, unethical and unnecessary. And so I say seize this moment to let -- to temper law with mercy to arrive at justice.</s>BLITZER: The neurologist who testified before all the various courts that reviewed this said that she was in what they called a persistent vegetative state. And her husband testified she didn't want to live like this, she wanted to end her life in what they call dignity. Do you have a problem with the way that the judicial process worked in dealing with Terri Schiavo?</s>JACKSON: You know, I do not want to challenge the integrity or motive of her husband. I do not think that is a good thing. But suffice it to say, when you pull the tube, the feeding tube, and someone survives 12 days without food and water, that there was more life signs, more life energy than was originally anticipated. You pull the plug on you for 12 days and nights without water and food and you would get sicker. So she is getting weaker. But why won't we give her food and water? We have enough food, enough water. Why not give her food and water?</s>BLITZER: Well, the argument that her husband makes, and that the courts approved of, is that she didn't want to have to live in this kind of condition. She wanted to die rather than live like this. That was the testimony that came before the courts.</s>JACKSON: You know, I'm just not sure if one can say to a certainty that -- that arrived in that conclusion. I don't want to challenge what she may have said to him when -- but how can one know that you're in a state where there are still vital signs? A state where you can live without food and water? It's a debate. And I feel the pain on both sides, the pain of her husband, the passion of her parents. But having said all of that, I've come down on the side of let her live. Right now we just simply are going to starve her to death. No food, no water, and not even ice cubes for her parched lips. That's inhumane. And it's unnecessary. I think that what we must take this -- however, we cannot just reduce her to a trophy for some political cause. She symbolizes a need now for us to look at long-term health care and health care for the indigent, and for those who need it. You know, Wolf, we as Americans are going to live longer now because of medicine and because of our life options. And so she in many ways becomes a symbol of the need to address the issue of health care and life options for all of us.</s>BLITZER: What about, Reverend Jackson, the argument that this is a personal matter, it should be dealt with by her husband, her family, and that the federal government really has no business getting involved, and that national figures, political figures like yourself, really should stay out of what is clearly such an emotional, wrenching moment in the life of a family?</s>JACKSON: First of all, I'm a minister of the gospel. And my mission is to -- in pursuit of the Jesus ministry -- to preach news to the poor, to heal the broken hearted. And so whether fighting for Terri's life in Pinellas, Florida, or fighting to set captives free in Iraq, or Syria, or Cuba, or Yugoslavia, this is what I do. It's what ministers do. So I have a right to be here and a desire to be here. And because the family invited me, I felt some need to stand with them. Beyond that, I think because she is in all of our houses and our lives every day, that we must now as a nation look at what this means, because she references today a health care challenge and a health care crisis. And why is CNN covering it? Because no one can ignore this. And having looked at it, I made a choice to stand with Terri and with her parents in their quest to get a feeding tube and get water back into her body so long as she is able to live.</s>BLITZER: Reverend Jackson, did you get a chance to go in there and see Terri Schiavo?</s>JACKSON: I did not. I called her husband, and his lawyer called me back. We talked twice. And he said he didn't want us to go in, that he would settle for his own religious leaders. And I respect that. But I did want to see her and pray with her because I believe that prayer does change things. God does make great things happen. That we do fall down. We get back up again. And my faith convinces me that nothing is too hard for good. Therefore, we pray for a miracle. We pray for god to intervene. We pray for those who can help to help in this critical hour of her life.</s>BLITZER: One final question, Reverend Jackson. You've seen all the national polls saying that the majority of Americans think that the federal government should stay out of this, that the courts did the right thing. You disagree with the majority of the American public?</s>JACKSON: No. What I disagree with to some extent is, when Congress reacts so hastily and challenges the independence of the judiciary, that is very sticky territory. I believe in separation of power, so I accept that. But I think Congress does have an opportunity now to look at the particulars of this situation and appeal for her life -- but beyond that, to begin to craft policy for the Terris of our future. That's Congress' real role, is to, in fact, craft legislation, and the appropriate resources for health care for the Terris of America today and beyond. And that's the appropriate role that Congress should play. Help Terri. I ask Congress, state legislature, let's help Terri. But beyond that, let's craft policy out of this crisis to have long- term meaning for all of us.</s>BLITZER: Reverend Jackson, thanks very much for spending a few moments with us. Appreciate it.</s>JACKSON: Thank you.</s>BLITZER: The Schiavo case has opened a national dialogue about death and dying. And in Georgia, one family is hoping its story can teach others how to embrace death with dignity. Our Elizabeth Cohen was there for the last good-bye.</s>ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): An ordinary home in an ordinary American neighborhood. Ed Davis is dying. It's clear the end is near. And so, this past Friday, Ed's children and grandchildren came to say goodbye. They let us share these intimate moments because they wanted to be an example of how to die with love and with dignity.</s>DAVIS: I'm not concerned about the cancer. I'm not concerned about dying.</s>COHEN: Cancer was diagnosed just a month ago, so advanced that Ed's surgeons could offer no help.</s>DAVIS: It was in my liver and my pancreas and also many other parts of the body.</s>COHEN: Doctors offered chemotherapy and dialysis for his ailing kidneys, but they made it clear, these treatments would not buy Ed Davis much time. And what little he would have would be unpleasant. So, Ed said no.</s>DAVIS: We're supposed to die. We're not supposed to live forever. And if you're living on artificial means, you're not really living. You're just existing.</s>COHEN: Ed Davis has spent his 84 years a happy man. He's had the love of his wife, Chris (ph), and their three sons and their families. He chose to live the last remaining days at home, with care from hospice and love from his family and friends. As a man of faith, he wanted one thing, to spend one last Sunday in church.</s>DAVIS: I just got to thinking if I might not ever get to go to church again. And I would like to have that last time.</s>COHEN: But one last Sunday in church seemed pretty unlikely last Friday. The family took turns sitting by his side feeding him, thanking him for his love and hoping he'd get that one last wish.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You just be your sweet, lovable self, and everything will be fine.</s>COHEN: Over the weekend, the Davises talked about old times. They've been married for 61 years.</s>DAVIS: She's a country girl for sure. I had to put shoes on her when we got married.</s>COHEN: For most of the weekend, the family told stories, while they laughed and shared their love.</s>DAVIS: I don't have a thing to worry about with this girl. She's going to be a fine woman.</s>COHEN: But Saturday was rough for the Davises.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We really weren't sure he was even going to make it through the night.</s>COHEN: But he did. And, on Easter Sunday, his last wish came true.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There we go.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE (singing): I will worship with all of my heart.</s>COHEN: Mr. Davis took communion, his faith steady, an example of grace and dignity.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Father, God, we're so thankful for Ed, and, Lord, his courageous witness for you.</s>COHEN (on camera): Mr. Davis, you said you really wanted to go to church. Now you've been. How do you feel?</s>DAVIS: I feel fulfilled.</s>COHEN: Fulfilled by the love of his family and by living out his last few days exactly as he wanted.</s>DAVIS: It's not hard to make a decision like this when you're 84 years old, lived a good life and raised your family. Of course, it's not always easy to leave, but we have to do that. We cry like this when we go on a trip, so that's where I'm going, is on a trip. I'm going to take the rest of my life and be with the lord in heaven.</s>COHEN: Ed Davis died Sunday night, just hours after we spoke, surrounded by his family in his own home at peace.