Michael Cohen's Conversations with Trump
LEMON: Some breaking news right now on the tapes that Donald Trump and his former fixer, Michael Cohen. To tell you about -- The Washington Post reporting the feds have received more than 100 recordings. So joining now to discuss, CNN Political Analyst Carl Bernstein and CNN Political Analyst Laura Coates, lots to discuss, so Laura, let's get right to it. Good evening by the way. The Washington Post is saying that the most substantive exchange involving the President is the one that was released by Cohen's attorney on Tuesday. But what is the danger for Trump in these other tapes?</s>LAURA COATES, POLITICAL ANALYST, CNN: Well, remember. The danger here is whether or not those conversations are going to be privileged. Just because you speak to a lawyer does not actually mean it's going to have the attorney-client privilege stamp on it. In fact, if the nature of it is not about a legal matter or in further of trying to get legal advices or legal counsel or (Inaudible) trying to get a crime to go forward. Then it's not going to have the protection. So the President right now is probably wondering to himself how much is out there and how much exposure do I gave on these non-privileged conversations.</s>LEMON: Yeah, because he has no idea of what they have, what was recorded, what wasn't. I want you guys to take a listen to this new enhanced exchange between Trump and Cohen. It's involving paying AMI either in cash or check.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I need to open up a company for the transfer of that info regarding our friend David so that -- I am going to do that right away. I've actually come up on (Inaudible) and I've spoken to Allen about how to set the whole thing up.</s>PRES. DONALD TRUMP (R), UNITED STATES PRESIDENT: So what are we on?</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With funding, yes. And it's all the stuff, all the stuff because you never know where that company, you never know where he's going to be. Correct. So I am all over that. And I spoke to Allen about it. When it comes time for the financing, which will be...</s>TRUMP: (Inaudible)</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, no, no. I got it, no, no, no.</s>LEMON: So Laura, an independent audio expert and his colleague who enhanced the tape and who both knew nothing about this story agree that the President says, I will pay with cash. The opposite of what Rudy Giuliani has been saying. What's your take?</s>COATES: Well, this of course, is a credibility game here where Giuliani is trying to in some way insinuate that the person to believe here is the President of the United States, and that you can prove by the exchange. Well, in reality it tells you that it's not exculpatory as he promised. But it's not so damming as everyone is talking about, because in reality, it doesn't move the needle so far ahead that it makes this (Inaudible) in particular exchange maybe commonality. And going for it, the Stormy Daniels case, different story, does lay the foundation this is an exchange that happens often times. It wasn't even one that was shocking to President, which is going to be a problem for the future cases.</s>LEMON: So Carl, now that the expert says that Trump says I will pay with cash, right. His attorney, Rudy Giuliani, has a statement, a new statement obviously. He says dueling experts who come to different conclusions. In context, using cash would make no sense because the transaction is between two corporations. What's your response to that, Carl?</s>CARL BERNSTEIN, POLITICAL ANALYST, CNN: I think we're being very myopic in the way that we're looking at this tape as being the most important thing that's going on right now. I think that two experts could have it out in a courtroom and Rudy Giuliani is probably right about that. The real thing that's happened here is that the President's lawyer has gone rogue. He's fired a shot across the bow of the White House, and the question is whether or not he is going to get immunity, which he is seeking from Mr. Mueller. It's not at all sure that this is going to work for Mr. Cohen. But what is going on is it is clear that he believes and those representing him believe that he has information that could be very damaging to the President of the United States in the Russian investigation. I think that's what we need to keep our eye on here. What we see with this tape, it sounds like a couple of thugs, one whom happens to be a candidate for the President of the United States, the other one his lawyer trying to make something go away. It shows Trump lying once again. What else is new there? Let's look at the big picture, which is Michael Cohen really a threat to the President of the United States in the Russian investigation. And there are some real indications that he is.</s>LEMON: Well, let's also look at the strategy too here, because Trump is the one, Carl, who waive privilege on this tape. And some say it's in order to get ahead of the bad news. But if that is a strategy, don't you have to tell the truth about it?</s>BERNSTEIN: Yeah. You're supposed to tell the truth about it. But again, I think that this is not a big development because of what is on these tapes. I think this is a big development because of where Michael Cohen is now and what his interaction with Mr. Mueller will be. I don't think the southern of New York prosecutors are very happy about the way he went about this. But Mr. Mueller might find a reason that he thinks immunity is in order for Cohen. But there's a long way to go. And look, he had proximity to Donald Trump. That's why Trump is unhinged. If you listen to the people around Donald Trump, who those of us who are reporters talking to people in the White House talk to. They say the President is unhinged about Michael Cohen and the fact that Cohen was a witness to many, many things that the President never thought his lawyer would possibly discuss with anybody.</s>LEMON: And he can't be happy that they're saying that now 100 recordings, maybe 100 recordings. Can I talk a little bit more about strategy, Laura with you because?</s>COATES: Sure.</s>LEMON: Could Cohen's decision to release the tape hurt his chances of making a deal with prosecutors in the southern district of New York.</s>COATES: Yes. Well, first of all, he has not been charged with a crime as of yet. And so it's difficult to see whether he is trying to have a preemptive conversation before there is any grand jury indictment, which is one of the points in time where prosecutors gives the sweetest deal before all the work has to be done, before the grand jury has brought in if there are charges that are pending. The reason it hurts is because what he really did was play to the hand of Rudy Giuliani, who is trying to get everyone to quibble about cash versus check. Either way, there was a payment discussion about trying to suppress information prior to an election. That's really the meat of the matter, not the tomato-tomato semantics argument about cash versus check. And so he played into the hand of that in many ways, and then when he did so, he called into question whether or not he was going to give information to both the press as well federal investigators. And as you remember, one of the problems with the dossier is the FISA warrant was that they decided to no longer use that person as a reliable source going forward in the future (Inaudible) because he gave information to both sides and undermined his credibility for the FBI ultimately in the long run. The same is true in a prosecutor's strategy. Well, what is your incentive here to have the court of public opinion or a court of law? If your choice is the court of law, mum's the word. And he plays to the hand of Rudy Giuliani.</s>LEMON: Well, Carl mentioned that it's important that Michael Cohen because Michael Cohen is in close proximity to Donald Trump.</s>COATES: Yes.</s>LEMON: Someone else who is in close proximity to Donald Trump, a new name came up in the tape. And we'll talk about that right after the break.