Trump Defiant as Cultural Change Sweeps America
BERMAN: So this morning the national reckoning over America's racist legacy is growing, but President Trump seems to be digging in, denying the existence of systemic racism and voicing opposition to the removal of Confederate symbols. Joining us now, CNN political commentators Angela Rye and Errol Louis. Angela is the former executive director of the Congressional Black Caucus. The president is in a different place than America is right now. When you see the cultural shifts that have happened over the last 24 hours, and we listed off a few, when you see the policy shifts in Congress, including among Republicans, you know, in the Senate Republicans calling for the removal of Confederate names from military bases, the president stands in opposition. And Errol, you say he risks something even more, which is irrelevance. Explain.</s>ERROL LOUIS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: That's right. Look, the -- the ground is shifting underneath the president. The race for re-election that he was expecting to run has gone in a different direction, and he's going to have to adapt. The reality is, day after day, night after night, including on the president's favorite cable station, which happens not to be this channel, they are not talking about Donald Trump. They are not talking about his re-election. They are not talking about the things that he thinks will make him look good and help his re-election. In fact, they're talking about something completely different, something unprecedented. They're talking about things like the North Carolina legislature, where both the upper and the lower House are actually passing, unanimously, criminal justice reforms that they had not even considered in a year. Things are moving. It happens once in a while. You know, this kind of crept up, I think, on a lot of us. Nobody expected 1968 to kind of break out in front of us in the middle of this pandemic, but here it is. And the president is no longer dominating the news cycles. The -- the president is no longer sort of taking the lead when it comes to figuring out how to get out of this major crisis. So just as he sort of faded to the background when it comes to response to the pandemic, he's no longer in the lead when it comes to this response and this national conversation on policing, of which he's really not a part. And so it doesn't work for anybody who's running for re-election to not be part of the main national conversation. For this president in particular, it's a real challenge. He's behind in the polls, and he's got to get back into the game. I think he feels a little frustrated that he's not able to do so right now.</s>CAMEROTA: Angela, have you been surprised by what you've seen over the past week, in terms of Republicans breaking with, a least, the president's messaging? The idea that the House minority leader, Kevin McCarthy, would be willing to say out loud that, yes, he's willing to consider changing the names of Army bases after President Trump explicitly and, it seemed, passionately felt that, no, they should never be changed, because they are such a great part of America's heritage, these that are named after Confederate leaders, have you been surprised by the shift in Republicans' stance?</s>ANGELA RYE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You know, Alisyn, I wish that I could say that I was surprised. But sometimes the people speak louder than donors. Sometimes the people, as a whole, speak louder than this country's racist, white supremacist past. And what I would tell you is the shift in Republican leadership, the shift in the Senate and the House, is not significant enough. So I am so pleased that they are finally breaking with the president, but I think that they have no choice. This is an era that we find ourselves in that is so -- so unique, where people cannot turn a blind eye to white supremacy, to racism, to oppressive systems in the ways in which they have in the past. And to Errol's point, yes, it does feel, I'm sure, at least from everything that I've seen, from everything that I've heard from my parents and from my parents' friends, that this is very similar to 1968. But I hope one of the things that will be different about this moment, in particular, is that we have to do something broad, sweeping, that will last for generations, as well. That we understand this is not a time just to pack -- pass, as you just talked about Kevin McCarthy, at least in passing. It's not just the no-chokeholds bill. It's not just, you know, turning on a body camera moment. This is actually a moment, Alisyn, that calls for Congress and the House and the Senate, that calls for the people to really consider sweeping legislation like a Civil Human And Economic Rights Act, because the systems that have held us back are not just one. They were rooted, engrained, and engrained into this country's history; and we see it every single day. So it has to be something big to change it.</s>BERMAN: It seems to me what's happening -- and I mentioned this before -- is that the silent majority, which people have always referred to, this invisible hand of what the public really wants, you know, 30 years ago, 40 years ago, maybe it was law and order. Maybe it was. But now, if it exists, it's a silent majority that wants change, that wants reform, that is calling out for forms of racial justice. And you see all these political figures acknowledging that, and you see culturally it happening too. Look, I don't happen to be a giant country music fan, but I know who Lady Antebellum is, the group. And this may seem like a small thing, but I think it's a big thing because of what it represents. They changed the name. And just put up the statement quickly, if you can. I read part of it. I can't read print that small, because I'm too damn old now. But basically, what they said, Errol, is that they're embarrassed that their name, Antebellum, conjures up, literally, refers to the period before the war, before the Civil War when slavery existed. They're embarrassed by it, and they want to be known as Lady A now. That's a big deal.</s>LOUIS: That is a big deal. And the reality is there are people like this group that have -- it is their business to have their finger on the pulse of where the culture is going, of where the young people are going. And people are going to ratify that choice every day by downloading and streaming and purchasing concert tickets and so forth. And this is the ground that's shifting that you really can't change with a couple of policies, right? This is not something that is going to be fought out on the floor of the Senate or the House of Representatives. This is the whole culture changing. And it's, in some ways, analogous to what we've seen with same-sex marriage. It was impossible. It was impossible. It was impossible, until it was normal. And the shifts like this don't come along very often, but when they do, it puts a politician like Donald Trump in a very difficult position. You can fight against an opponent. It's very hard to fight against a movement. It's even harder to fight against a cultural shift. And, you know, that's the task for him. We should mention, by the way, as we talk about 1968, the winner in that presidential year was Richard Nixon. So this -- movements give rise to counter movements, and so we should expect a lot more turbulence between now and the end of the year.</s>CAMEROTA: In terms of the alacrity with which things have moved, Angela, the Louisville City Council in Kentucky last night, 26-0, voted to end no-knock warrants. I don't even know if many of us knew that there was such a thing as a no-knock warrant until Breonna Taylor Breonna Taylor was killed. So you know, obviously, it is heart-breaking that this special young woman lost her life, but now this is a household word; and they did the right thing yesterday.</s>RYE: Yes, so Breonna's -- Breonna's Law was passed. And I think with the backdrop that just last week Rand Paul refused to vote in favor of an anti-lynching bill in the United States Senate speaks volumes. It is an amazing thing that this law was passed and so quickly in Louisville, Kentucky. But the flag that I would offer you all is that, as we celebrate that progress, Breonna Taylor's killers are still on the streets. They are placed on administrative leave. They have still not been arrested. They shot 20 times into her home. She received eight of those bullets and was killed. Under any other circumstance, if there was a -- a citizen that did that, they would be arrested. And so we have to remember that, as times are shifting, as change -- as change comes, that we still need justice, that we still need to be from under the thumb of oppression. Or as Reverend Sharpton talked about, it's time for America to get -- to get its knee off our backs. We have to have that safety and security. This under the backdrop the Donald Trump talking about law and order, which when I hear, I hear shoot to kill. Right? We have to start reckoning with all of these things and understand that progress is coming, but for so many, progress has to come a lot quicker for us to survive.</s>BERMAN: Yes. The president says dominate the streets with compassion, which sounds like the world's worst James Taylor song. Shower the people you love with pepper spray.</s>RYE: Yes.</s>BERMAN: Errol Louis, Angela Rye, thanks for being with us this morning. Appreciate the discussion.</s>RYE: Thank you both.</s>BERMAN: Coronavirus cases spiking in states across the country. Is Texas already experiencing a second wave? Our next guest says yes.