Political Upheaval In Italy; Italian Court Orders Seizure Of Rescue Ships Carrying Migrants; CNN Poll: Former VP Biden Expands Lead In Democratic Field
SOARES: Welcome back. I'm Isa Soares, in for Hala Gorani. Tonight, more now on the two breaking news stories we're following for you out of Italy. An Italian court has ordered the seizure of the migrant rescue ship that's been stranded off the coast of Lampedusa. Now, the migrants will be taken to the shore due to the deteriorating conditions on board. And this comes while we're waiting for Italy's prime minister to formally resign at any moment. Barbie Nadeau is back with me now from Rome. And, Barbie, as we were just coming to you, I was looking at a tweet from Open Arms. They're tweeting in Spanish, of course, because they're Spanish. They're saying the prosecutor's office of Agrigento dictates immediate disembarkation of all persons on board Open Arms -- I'm just translating from the Spanish -- at the port of Lampedusa and the provisional seizure of the ship. "Finally, the nightmare is over," they tweet, and the 83 people on board will receive immediate assistance on land. What are you hearing from Italian authorities, meanwhile?</s>NADEAU: Well, this has been an ongoing battle, and this is part of why we have the government crisis. Matteo Salvini has closed the ports in Italy for the last year, starting last June when he took office, to any of the NGOs who have gone out and rescued migrants trying to make it across from North Africa into Europe by way of Italy. And Open Arms is just the latest in a string of these standoffs, where the migrant boats, in desperate, desperate need of a port to take their passengers to, have found themselves just sort of listing off the coast, the Italian coast, as Salvini and other politicians, right-wing politicians, say, "No, no, no, you can't come here." If the NGO isn't an Italian NGO, if the boat isn't flagged with an Italian flag, you don't come into Italy. And this is exactly where we find ourselves. Now, we've seen with Open Arms, people have been taken off that boat for the entire day. We've had a couple of evacuations due to emergency health situations. We had some minors, there's under age minors traveling alone that were taken off yesterday and the day before. And so the 83 people who remain, we understand, will be taking off tonight, taken to the tiny island of Lampedusa and then on -- further onto the Italian shores. But it is just one of many, many issues with regard to the migration crisis. There's another NGO boat, a few hundred miles out at sea right now with about 400 people on it and that's going to be the next crisis. It won't go away. And Matteo Salvini has earned popularity on his hard line approach to it with the humanitarian side of it, of course, is what we're seeing unfold here, Isa.</s>SOARES: But, Barbie, you and I were talking at the top of the hour, you know, you were saying, this has been going on for something like 19 days. Why is it taking the prosecutors so long to make the decision given that we heard from Open Arms that the conditions on board and how traumatizing it has been for the migrants on board.</s>NADEAU: Well, we have had some complications in the story in the sense that the Spanish boat was offered a port in Spain. Now, that would take five days to get there, and that's one of the issues that the court, I think, was waiting to find out if the Spanish would be able to actually facilitate the disembarkation of the people, which of course, doesn't guarantee that they're going to be allowed to stay in Europe by any mean. They have to be processed and to see if they have a case for asylum and things like that. It's just been an ongoing problem. This court is actually the second court. We had a court earlier in the week that also tried to allow, for at least, the minors to be taken off that ship. So we've got some internal politics, so these are courts that are in strong opposition to Matteo Salvini's close port policy, and we are seeing a little of that battle play out in any way that humanitarian groups can work. The system in the court system, as we see right now, is what's the best chance scenario. But it is a slap in the face to Matteo Salvini and he was on his Facebook feed a short time ago saying that he did not agree with Open Arms being able to disembark. So it's a battle that's ongoing, Isa.</s>SOARES: Yes. I was going to ask you about the politics of it. How much is this, the rescue ship just off Italy, this story, how much is that really split government in Italy, given now the situation in Iran really political crisis in Italy.</s>NADEAU: Well, I think that you can't separate the two by any means. You cannot separate Matteo Salvini's popularity from his hardline anti- immigration stance, that is, first and foremost. And Salvini has used that popularity to just essentially pull the plug on the government. Now, when we see a boat like this and that height of summer, this is something that we are seeing in fits and spurts right now. Two years ago, you would see hundreds of thousands of people come across, 600,000 came across in the five-year period before Salvini came into power. So we have seen a decrease in people coming across the sea. But then if you look at the increase in humanitarian disaster in Libya and what the people are going through there, you're just simply moving the problem and making it someone else's. Isa.</s>SOARES: And very quickly also, Barbie, I know that Italy's Prime Minister, Giuseppe Conte, has not been speaking. Do we know what this point when he's going to resign, officially, resign and what the -- when the president may make a decision whether they're go to a new elections here?</s>NADEAU: Well, he's on his way to the presidential palace as we speak right now. And he's expected to arrive there shortly. He'll give his resignation to Sergio Mattarella, the president, and then he'll have two choices, call early elections or try to make another government. I don't think anyone thinks and the second attempt in the government is going to -- you know, turn out into a five-year mandate. It's almost sure that early elections are imminent. It's just whether there'll be this fall or whether they'll be able to -- you know, buy another six months or even a year on this government, on this particular election.</s>SOARES: And as you and I talk and looking out live pictures, out of Rome, waiting for Conte, of course, to take his resignation to the president. Is this -- Barbie, very quickly, is this a risk for Salvini? I know he wants his election and even said that, in fact, Conte accusing him of personal and political interest and putting his interest first. Could this backfire on him?</s>NADEAU: Well, he could be in the opposition if Mattarella chooses to try to form a new government. If not, he very well could win elections, if polls are on his side right now. If the elections are held sooner, that's going to work to his advantage. If they're held later, that's another entirely different story right now. But it's very emblematic that you've got a migrant crisis happening and unfolding right as this government is collapsing. Isa.</s>SOARES: Indeed, Barbie Nadeau, thank you very much, good to see you. Keep us up to date in the breaking news. You just heard from Barbie, Italy's Prime Minister, Giuseppe Conte, on his way to hand off his resignation to the president. We'll keep on top of that. We go now to the spokeswoman for the organization behind the migrant rescue ship that Barbie and I were just talking about. Laura Lanuza joins me now from Barcelona via Skype. Laura, thank you very much for joining us. I know you must be very busy. We just heard in the last few minutes that report is ordered the migrants to disembark in Sicily. Bring us up to date, what are you hearing, where is the ship right now?</s>LAURA LANUZA, COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, OPEN ARMS: Well, the ship right now is where it has been for the last four, five days which is 800 meters from the port of Lampedusa. In fact, the prosecutor of</s>SOARES: So, Laura, what you're hearing is that, roughly, in and out, so almost 100 or so people inside, migrants inside, will be able to disembark following the prosecutor's notice there.</s>LANUZA: Yes. In fact, there was already sanitary inspections two days ago. The doctors, they came in the boat, they realized that the patients, they were living for, now, 19 days or not, few months. And so they had already</s>SOARES: Laura, explain to our viewers right around the world, what were conditions like there? Because we're talking about 19 days that these 88 or so migrants have been inside that boat board -- on board that boat. Talk us through the conditions. We're looking at some footage of the ship, of the migrants. But bring us up to date just how bad, how much it had deteriorated.</s>LANUZA: Well, in fact, we rescued 163 people in three different rescue operations. The first hundred, around 100 people, were rescued the same between the same first 24 hours. They were living covered, which means sleeping, living, and two bathrooms for 100 people</s>SOARES: Yes. And that's, of course, like you're saying, it's not just the hygiene condition, the lack of hygiene, but also the psychological pressure that they've been facing for those 19 days. Laura Lanuza, thank you very much. I appreciate you taking the time speaking to us here on the show, on CNN. Do keep us abreast of the situation. Now, I want to take you to the U.S. presidential race. It looks like Joe Biden has bounced back after some slips. A new CNN poll shows the former vice president reestablishing himself as the clear frontrunner. You're seeing there, among the 2020 Democratic candidates. Biden now holds a double digit lead over his closest rivals, Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren. He's at 29 percent. Today, his campaign launched a blistering new T.V. ad in the state of Iowa where the nation's first big votes will be at the</s>JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We know in our bones this election is different. The stakes are higher. The threat, more serious. We have to beat Donald Trump. And all the polls agreed Joe Biden is the strongest Democrat to do the job. Most of all, he restored the soul of the nation, battered by an erratic, vicious, bullying president. Strong, solid, and stable leadership. Biden.</s>SOARES: Well, joining me now is CNN's Senior Political Analyst, Mark Preston. Mark, good to see you. Just coming off of that -- of that ad that we just saw there, Biden seems to say that the key issue here is beating Trump. And I'm sure many Democrats would agree. Do the numbers suggest that he has a chance?</s>MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, he certainly do right now. And it's really interesting if you hear the very end of that commercial, strong, stable, solid, this is the theme now that we're hearing from Joe Biden's campaign. We heard it from his wife last night. In fact, she was out in the campaign trail and she talked about the fact that perhaps some of those people in the audience may not be supporting her husband, but in the end, it's her husband that can beat Donald Trump. And it's something we've seen over and over again. When we look at where Joe Biden gets all his strengths from, that's due in part from Democrats who think that he is the only candidate right now that has the best chance right now of beating Donald Trump in 2020.</s>SOARES: But, Mark, you mentioning that the former second lady of Joe Biden, she said you need to swallow a little bit, basically, saying, you may not agree in all aspects, but collective bottom line is it has to be that we have to beat Trump. Within the Democrats, within those who would be voting, is there a sense that they're getting to that point? Are they all on the same message, singing from the same hymn sheet here?</s>PRESTON: Well, you know, what's interesting is at this point in the campaign, Democrats still don't haves a clear leader. Now, they have a clear leader in the polls and that Joe Biden has a double digit lead. But if you look at the poll numbers, Joe Biden sits by himself and then Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders come in at second. They're about tied. Their support is driven entirely by the left, by liberals, and then you have everybody else. So even though Joe Biden has this clear lead right now, there is really no cohesive message for the Democratic Party, especially on some of the really, really big issues. So I do think that this primary fight that we're seeing playout right now, is going to continue to play out over the next few months. And Joe Biden might be at the top now, perhaps he may be at the bottom, if we look at what happened to Kamala Harris, just two months ago, she was doing really well. She has now plummeted to five percent in the polls.</s>SOARES: Well, I was going to ask you about Kamala Harris, because I was actually surprised to see those numbers. Why the sudden plummet?</s>PRESTON: Well, couple things. One is that she started talking and when politicians start talking, candidates start to get to know them a little better and start to form opinions. Two is that she started to lose support among liberals. She's had about 10 points. She's lost amongst liberal voters or actually even more than that. It might be up to 20 points amongst self-describe liberals. That's a huge plummet. Now, where did they go? They went to Elizabeth Warren or they went to Bernie Sanders and they went to Joe Biden. I wouldn't count her out but it just goes to show how volatile the American electorate is right now.</s>SOARES: When we go back to Biden, if we go back to Biden, I was quite interesting looking at some of the data, how does he compared to, for example, earlier frontrunners at this point? I mean, when we look at the numbers - just putting to perspective for us, in terms of the other front runners.</s>PRESTON: Right. So it's a little bit difficult when you talk about this presidential campaign when you go into the near presidential campaigns. I think we haven't seen a field so big in the Democratic Party. I think what this does show though, it does show that Joe Biden has incredible staying power. I mean, even through all the gaffes that he's had, he didn't have a great debate performance. Kamala Harris really laid into him about his positions on bussing and called into question, his willingness to work on race issues. That's where she rose and that's when he fell. But still, he still has this group. The strong group of Democrats across the board who think that he's the only one who can beat Donald Trump and that is key. He has gone up seven points since June. And, again, he hasn't had a good -- he hasn't had a great summer so far.</s>SOARES: And, Mark, I was looking at the numbers. And Biden's supporter is 15 points higher among those 50 and older than those age 50. But it's also 12 points higher. Interesting enough. I think it's interesting. Among moderates and conservatives than liberals. Explain that to our international audience.</s>PRESTON: Well, right. So couple things. One, older voters why that's important is that older voters tend to be more in tuned or tuned in. They have more stake in the game, financially, if anything. They also tend to go to the polls, so that's good for Joe Biden. When you look at some of the other demographics as well, he's going to do better with conservatives and moderates, because they don't see him as somebody that is going to go out and bring pitchforks and marching against Washington. He's not Bernie Sanders. He's more of an establishment type. But one thing that is interesting about our poll that we don't highlight is that Biden, although he does better with conservatives and he does better with moderate Democrats, he's actually tied with Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders for the liberal vote. So Joe Biden has been around for a long time, eight years with the Obama administration. He still has a lot of staying power.</s>SOARES: Very good point. Mark Preston there for us. Appreciate you taking the time to speak to us here. Thanks, Mark.</s>PRESTON: Thank you.</s>SOARES: And still to come tonight, El Salvador has some of the strictest abortion laws in the world. But one woman's case had inspired new calls for change. We'll bring you that story, next.