Fifteen Years After 9/11; Interview with Fmr. Defense Secretary Leon Panetta
ZAKARIA: My next guest, Leon Panetta, has had a front row seat in the war in terror having directed both of the top American agencies responsible for executing that war. Starting shortly after President Obama was inaugurated, Panetta spent four years in the administration, first as director of the CIA, then as secretary of Defense. I spoke with him earlier this week about the state of the world 15 years after 9/11.</s>ZAKARIA: Secretary Panetta, welcome on the show.</s>LEON PANETTA, FORMER DIRECTOR, CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY: Nice to be with you, Fareed.</s>ZAKARIA: Where do you think we stand 15 years after 9/11?</s>PANETTA: I think 15 years after 9/11 has marked a period where the United States has really developed the capability of dealing with threat from terrorism. I mean, we -- during that period of time, we've improved our intelligence capability. We've improved our ability to be able to track and do surveillance on terrorists. We have improved our ability to work with the military on counterterrorism operations. I think we've done a great job at being able to go after the leadership, particularly of al Qaeda. So we have developed some remarkable capabilities and I think the bottom lines is we've been able, as a result of that, to at least prevent another 9/11-type attack on this country. Doesn't mean that we've resolved all the issues terrorism has continued to metastasize, we're dealing with ISIS, we're dealing with Boko Haram. We're dealing with al-Shabaab, we're dealing with the threat of lone wolf attacks in this country. All of that remains.</s>ZAKARIA: We heard a very spirited and interesting critique of the -- the Obama administration's approach, also really the Bush administration's support, from the Republican nominee this week. Donald Trump says that the United States has been intervening too much in the Middle East. It's been trigger happy. And he says we would have been better off if we hadn't done anything at all or we hadn't gotten involved. What do you make of that critique?</s>PANETTA: If only the world were as simple as that. The reality is that when you are confronting the threat from terrorism when al Qaeda was able to strike at this country, kill over 3,000 people and devastate not only the World Trade Center but hit the Pentagon and try to hit even other targets in Washington, there was no question that the United States had to go to war against terrorism. We had been attacked and I think for that reason, it was important for this nation to go after aw. And we did. And obviously President Bush began that effort. Some policies we can agree with, some we can disagree with. But the reality was that he knew we had to confront that threat. And President Obama understood that we had to confront that threat as well.</s>ZAKARIA: Donald Trump calls Hillary Clinton trigger happy and unstable. You worked with Hillary Clinton. What do you think of her temperament and would she make a good commander-in-chief?</s>PANETTA: Well, Fareed, from my -- from my experience having worked with Hillary Clinton for over 25 years as first lady, and then when she was U.S. senator, and then in particular when she was secretary of state. I always found her to be extremely careful and thoughtful, someone who understands the world and the challenges that we face in the world. Who understands the nature of the crises that we are confronting. But more importantly, wants to exercise thoughtful judgment in the approach that we take. I think she does have the right temperament to be commander-in-chief. I think she is somebody who can provide the kind of experience and the kind of diligence and care that a president has to use in dealing with a lot of threats that we are confronting in the world. I want to have somebody who understands the nature of those threats and how the United States should respond. And that's what Hillary Clinton can do.</s>ZAKARIA: Let me ask you about a specific foreign policy challenge that you would be consumed with while you're still in your old job, which is the battle against ISIS and particularly the efforts now under way to retake Mosul, the second largest city in Iraq, the most dramatic gain that ISIS had, which it is hoped will be reversed. General Petraeus had a very interesting, I thought very smart column in the "Washington Post" in which he said, "The U.S. is winning its battle against ISIS. The Iraqi army with the help of the U.S. military will almost certainly be able to retake Mosul." But the real challenge is, what happens next? Who governs Mosul, will there be a political sentiment there which will allow it to include the Sunnis so that they don't feel excluded and go join ISIS again? What is your sense of whether or not it would be possible, not just militarily to defeat ISIS, but to create the kind of political settlement that will keep ISIS defeated?</s>PANETTA: Fareed, I think that is the -- that's the most important challenge we face. I agree with General Petraeus, that, from a military point of view, I think we have the capabilities to defeat ISIS in Mosul and ultimately to defeat is in Raqqa as well in Syria. We have great special forces. We have great military capabilities, we're working with the Iraqis., we're working with others. I think we are making progress on that front. One area we have not been as effective as we should be is in providing the support system that will ensure that if we defeat terrorism that Iraq, and Syria, and Libya and Yemen and other countries that went through the Arab spring are able to govern themselves and establish the institutions to be able to govern themselves and provide stability in the future. That is the one area, frankly, where we need to devote a lot more attention both diplomatically, economically and we also need to consider the root causes that have produced terrorism, which, frankly, we have not done enough to confront.</s>ZAKARIA: Secretary Panetta, a pleasure to have you on. Thanks so much.</s>PANETTA: Nice to be with you.</s>ZAKARIA: Next up here on this special edition of GPS, marking the 15th anniversary of 9/11. I will talk to the new mayor of London, Sadiq Khan. He is the first Muslim mayor of a major Western capital. I'll ask him about the recently ramped-up backlash against Muslims in his country, in America, elsewhere, when we come back.