Schizophrenic Mom Missing With Children
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight. We go live with the desperate search for a missing Maryland mother, a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic believed on the run with her two little children, 2-year-old Jacob, 3-year- old Sarah, last seen in a gray Nissan Rogue, all three in grave danger. Bombshell tonight. As we go to air, grainy surveillance video emerges. We have the video.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Catherine Hoggle, Sarah, Jacob, missing.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Highly unusual case.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The direct plea.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just come home.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two children go suddenly missing from the same family.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They are devastated by this.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And we love you.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Help to do what`s right for these children.</s>GRACE: And tonight, superstar TV king, author of books, spokesperson for products -- turn on your TV, he`s there any time day or night -- Kevin Trudeau, convicted of swindling millions to prop up a lavish lifestyle, but tonight behind prison walls at one of the most upscale club feds in the country. I mean, they`ve got crafts. They watch movies, wellness classes, a music room, pool tables, basketball, volleyball, softball -- but even with all those amenities, Trudeau whining about life behind bars. We discover after bilking millions from the public, he`s making a bid for freedom.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I lost 45 pounds in 45 days.</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The book that really got him in trouble...</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why should anyone listen to what you have to say about health matters?</s>UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Would you like to lose up to 10 pounds in the first 24 hours?</s>GRACE: That`s KevinTrudeau.com and YouTube. And tonight, did a Florida mayor`s ex-wife beat his new girlfriend to death with a hammer?</s>OPERATOR: What`s the problem there, please?</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think there`s been a murder.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Accused of killing a friend she discovered was having an affair with her estranged husband.</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She`s saying she`s killed someone. 911</s>OPERATOR: Telling you she killed somebody?</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. 911</s>OPERATOR: She didn`t tell you who she`s saying she killed?</s>UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t know. Kelly.</s>GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. We go live tonight and the desperate search for a missing Maryland mother. She is a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic believed on the run with her two little children, 2-year-old Jacob, 3-year-old Sarah, now, last seen in a gray Nissan Rogue, all three in grave danger. As we go to air, grainy surveillance video has just emerged, and we have the video. The circumstances under which these two little children -- think of your own children at age 2 and 3, how hopeless they were, how much they need you -- this mom, a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic, has made off with little Jacob and Sarah, her entire family at their wits end to save the children. Straight out to John Domen with WNEW. What do you know, John? What do we know about where she may be?</s>JOHN DOMEN, WNEW (via telephone): That`s a good question at this point. The last time anybody from the police department or anywhere, any confirmed sighting was early yesterday morning around 4:40 AM. She was kind of walking in the same area where she was last seen by her common-law husband on Monday evening. And at that point, she was only seen on video for a short time yesterday. Since then, police are just hoping the public may have seen her since, you know, where she was is a high-traffic area.</s>GRACE: You know, John, joining me from WNEW, the manner in which the two children go missing even tricked her husband. The family lives together under one roof. The father works a night shift, so he didn`t quite realize that the children were gone until there was a several-hours lead. Straight out to special guest joining me right now from Montgomery County, Captain Darren Francke with the Montgomery County police, major crimes division. Captain, thank you for being with us. Now, I understand the timeline is little dicey because there`s an 18-hour interval between the first child going missing and possibly when the second one went missing. Captain, can you break it down for me how this whole thing happened?</s>CAPT. DARREN FRANCKE, MONTGOMERY COUNTY POLICE (via telephone): Yes, Nancy. Thank you for taking an interest in this case. We are -- as you said, we`re desperately trying to find these children and to find Catherine. So on Monday the 7th, the husband, common-law husband, and the father of the children came to our fifth district station on Monday, and he reported that his wife, Sarah -- I`m sorry, his wife, Catherine, was missing and that also his young daughter, Sarah, the 3-year-old, and Jacob, the 2-year- old were missing, as well, and he was concerned about them. He advised us that his wife had just fled him, that they were looking for Jacob and Sarah, that she had said that she had dropped them at a day care center and...</s>GRACE: But they were not at a day care center.</s>FRANCKE: Correct, they were not, and...</s>GRACE: Captain Francke, let me ask you a couple quick questions.</s>FRANCKE: Sure. Go ahead.</s>GRACE: This is my understanding, and I want to make sure I`ve got it down because you know every single fact may make a difference. We`re showing some grainy surveillance video we managed to get of her at a Chick-fil-</s>A. FRANCKE: Correct.</s>GRACE: She doesn`t have either of the children. She`s acting perfectly normally there. I mean, nobody would know to see her that she is diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic and she does -- and her two children are missing. They`re missing at the time of this video. We don`t know where they are, and she`s acting as cool as a cucumber. Captain Francke, I understand that she was at the grandmother`s home, and she tells the grandmother she`s going to take little Jacob out for pizza and she leaves with Jacob. But we never know -- we never have any proof that she went for pizza. Then the next morning, the dad wakes up from the night shift. I`m very familiar with that. My father worked the night shift for the railroad. And you wake up. You don`t know what happened since you left for work the day before. And she tells the husband she took the little girl and the boy, Sarah and Jacob, to day care. But she didn`t, right?</s>FRANCKE: Correct. Yes, when she left on Sunday...</s>GRACE: I got a bad feeling, Captain. I got a bad feeling. I got a very bad feeling about this. Go ahead.</s>FRANCKE: When she left on Sunday, she was gone for a couple hours. She came back and she did not have the pizza, she did not have the child. Unfortunately, you know, to you and me, when you`re told you that you`re leaving a 2-year-old for an overnight stay at a playmate`s house, you know, that raises suspicions. It didn`t raise the suspicions of the family, and then the next morning, you have the little girl now missing. And again, it goes to the...</s>GRACE: That`s a wrinkle I don`t know about, Captain. So she goes for a pizza with Jacob. And I think Jacob is the one that`s just 2. And then, all right, she comes back and says she`s left her 2-year-old boy at a playmate`s for a stayover?</s>FRANCKE: Correct. And now, investigatively...</s>GRACE: At 2 years old, a lot of kids can`t even walk. What are they going to do, look at each other in the crib? A play date?</s>FRANCKE: Correct. And investigatively, we`ve got a lot of resources and we have proven that that is not the case.</s>GRACE: Oh! So everybody, with me and taking your calls, Captain Darren Francke from Montgomery County, John Domen with WNEW. Captain, I`m hearing my ear I`ve got Marc Klaas with me right now, president and founder of Klaas Kids Foundation. He lost his beautiful daughter, Polly, and has devoted his life to children. All right, so we know this. We know the mother lied. Let`s just start with that. Now let`s take it from there. Why is she lying? Did she give the children away? Did she abandoned them somewhere? Is she on the run with them, which is a likely scenario? Are they dead? Weigh in, Marc.</s>MARC KLAAS, KLAAS KIDS FOUNDATION: Well, I have no idea where the kids are, but this is a scenario that screams Amber Alert. You have a severely mentally ill mother who`s being deceptive, who`s -- who`s avoiding -- avoiding being touched by anybody, and this is exactly the kind of a scenario that you need an Amber Alert for. However, they weren`t able to issue it because there`s no vehicle involved. Now, Nancy, the Amber Alert has always had great potential. However, that potential has been stymied by a fundamental misunderstanding of its intent and purpose. The Amber Alert was not created to be activated under specific conditions. Instead, it was meant as a partnership between law enforcement, media and the public, and that`s being sabotaged in this process.</s>GRACE: OK, I understand that it didn`t meet the qualifications for an Amber Alert. Got it. Now I`m trying to go from there, all right, and do what we can do to help find these children. There`s a chance this mom has them, that she`s dumped them somewhere, that she`s on the run with them, or that she killed them. Those are my alternatives. Now, let`s go to Caryn Stark, psychologist. Caryn, give it to me in a nutshell, paranoid schizophrenic -- hold on, Caryn. Let me get some more facts from the captain. Captain Francke, is she on her medication? Do we know that?</s>FRANCKE: We have no way to confirm that at this time.</s>GRACE: Darn! Well, what about the husband? Doesn`t he know anything?</s>FRANCKE: Again, our experience with a lot of folks is they can be on their medication or they can say they`re on the medication and just hide the fact...</s>GRACE: Ah. Yes. They never want to be on their meds. You`re right, Captain. Has her ATM or credit card or gas card, her EZ-pass, any of that been used anywhere outside her own little nuclear neighborhood?</s>FRANCKE: No, we have no activity.</s>GRACE: Nothing? And you`ve looked?</s>FRANCKE: Yes. We`re aggressively looking at her financial records, any way we can to get an idea where she is, which is...</s>GRACE: How did she pay for that Chick-fil-A, Captain? How did she pay for that, credit card, ATM, what?</s>FRANCKE: At that time, she was with her husband, or common-law husband at that time. She had money. Further investigation, we have found some of her belongings. She is making an active effort to -- in our opinion, to avoid contact with the police. And we believe she is of limited means. And you know, the most important thing for us in reference to the kids is the last video we have of her at 4:40 in the morning, there are no kids with her. There are no other adults with her.</s>GRACE: That`s at the Walgreens?</s>FRANCKE: No. That is in the area, as you said before, of the Chick-fil-A where she originally went missing.</s>GRACE: OK. Now, wa-wa-wait. A Chick-fil-A is open at 4:40 in the morning?</s>FRANCKE: I`m sorry...</s>GRACE: They`re not even open...</s>FRANCKE: ... she`s in the area...</s>GRACE: ... on Sunday!</s>FRANCKE: ... as far as the street.</s>GRACE: Oh, OK, on the street. I think she`s got a cell phone in her hand, Captain. What about that? Any pings?</s>FRANCKE: Right now, we do not believe that she has a cell phone.</s>GRACE: Oh! OK. Caryn Stark, paranoid schizophrenic -- what does it mean for these two children? Yes, I`d like to say the mother, but I`m concerned about the 2-year-old and the 3-year-old, Caryn. Give it to me in a nutshell.</s>CARYN STARK, PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, Nancy, you should be concerned because a paranoid schizophrenic is somebody who can, in fact, be extremely dangerous. She believes that the world is out to get her and she believes this is true. There are plots against her. A lot of it doesn`t make sense. You could feel that there are aliens in outer space who are trying to communicate with you. That`s by definition part of being a paranoid schizophrenic sometimes. So I really am concerned about these two children, the fact that they`re not there and what she might have imagined or who talked to her to tell her to not to have them.</s>GRACE: Well, on the other hand, Captain Francke, when she`s spotted at 4:40 AM, we don`t -- do you have her car? Do we know if the children could have been in the car?</s>FRANCKE: As of that sighting, she did not have a means of transportation unless she hooked up with another citizen, a friend. We have no indication of that. That`s one of the reasons we keep this story as high profile as we can in case someone is helping her, that they communicate with us immediately.</s>GRACE: Oh, wait! I understand something now, Captain. So the mom ditches the husband, the father, at the Chick-fil-</s>A. FRANCKE: Right.</s>GRACE: That Chick-fil-A is right across the street from a bus station. What about that? What`s the possibility that she bought a ticket in cash and took off?</s>FRANCKE: That`s a local transit