Shimano 105 front derailleur, Sugino crank and large chain ring, chain touches the derailleur cage
Solved it, it was the nut oriented incorrectly on the dura-ace downtube shifter.
Turning the inside nut so that its oriented correctly against the main tube, inside from the lever, and retightening the cable to remove all slack, and then setting limit screws again, I now have the shimano 105 derailleur with the Sugino  working correctly (non-indexed). Thanks for all your ideas.