May 1, 2025 - GO Committee Worksession
MoCoCouncilMD
[{'start': '288.621', 'end': '289.855', 'text': ">> Kate Stewart: GOOD MORNING,   EVERYONE, WELCOME TO THE   GOVERNMENT OPERATION FISCAL   POLICY COMMITTEE SESSION.    THIS MORNING WE ARE REVIEWING   THE FY 26 OPERATING BUDGET.   WE WILL FIRST LOOK AT THE   PROPERTY TAX RIGHT AND THE   INCOME TAX OFFSET CREDIT OF THE   COUNTY EXECUTIVE SENT OVER TO   US.   AND THEN WE WILL TAKE UP THE   RESOLUTION TO INCREASE THE   COUNTY INCOME TAX RIGHT AND THE   WORKING FAMILIES INCOME   SUPPLEMENT.   ON THE FIRST ITEM, THE PROPERTY   TAX RIGHT IN THE INCOME TAX   OFFSET CREDIT THAT WE WILL TAKE   UP RIGHT NOW.   WE ARE LOOKING TO SEND A    RECOMMENDATION FROM THIS   COMMITTEE TO THE FULL COUNCIL.   SO WE WILL BE VOTING ON THOSE   ITEMS I WILL TURN IT OVER TO MR.  SMITH.   >> GOOD MORNING, JUROR STEWART,   AND THANK YOU MY COLLEAGUES FROM  FINANCE AND OMB THAT JOIN USG S   THANK YOU MY COLLEAGUES FROM   E STEWART, AND  THANK YOU MY COLLEAGUES FROM   N STEWART,   AND THANK YOU MY COLLEAGUES FROM  E STEWART,   AND THANK YOU MY COLLEAGUES FROM  FINANCE AND OMB THAT JOIN USGOO   AND THANK YOU MY COLLEAGUES FROM  FINANCE AND OMB THAT JOIN USENG   STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB   EGOOD MORNING, GENE   STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB    GOOD MORNING, GENE   STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB   SGOOD MORNING, GENE   STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB   MGOOD MORNING, GENE   STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB   IGOOD MORNING, GENE   STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB   TGOOD MORNING, GENE   STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB   HGOOD MORNING, GENE   STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB   :GOOD MORNING, GENE  STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB    GOOD MORNING,   GENE STEWART, AND THANK YOU MY   COLLEAGUES FROM FINANCE AND OMB   THAT JOIN US WITH THESE   DISCUSSIONS AND THEY ARE HELPING  PUT THESE REPORTS TOGETHER.   AS YOU SHARED FOR THE FIRST ITEM  THE COMMITTEE WILL BE REVIEWING   THE WEIGHTED REAL PROPERTY TAX   RIGHT AS WELL AS THE INCOME TAX   OFFSET CREDIT THAT WAS   RECOMMENDED BY THE EXECUTIVE.   ON MARCH 14TH THE EXECUTIVE ARE   COMMITTED A WEIGHTED REAL TAX   RIGHT OF $1, POINT ZERO 605   CENTS.   PER $100 OF ASSESSED VALUE.   THAT INCLUDED A 3.5 SENT   MONTGOMERY COUNTY PUBLIC SCHOOL   SUPPLEMENTAL RIGHT IN IT   COMPARED TO THE FISCAL 25   WEIGHTED REAL PROPERTY TAX.   WE ALSO RECOMMENDED AN INCOME   TAX OFFSET CREDIT FOR ITOC I   WILL CALL THAT OF $160 PER EACH   ELIGIBLE PROPERTY WHICH IS $160   INCREASE OVER THE $692.   VALUE.   ONTO GENUINE 20 FOURTH YOU   RECOMMENDED SOME AMENDMENTS TO   THOSE TWO ITEMS THE FIRST FOR   THE WEIGHTED REAL PROPERTY TAX.   HE DECREASED IT TO 1.0255 PER   $100 OF ACCESSIBLE BASE,   ELIMINATING THE 3.5% TAX RIGHT   HE HAD RECOMMENDED.   YOU WILL SEE LATER ON ITEM 2 HE   IS RECOMMENDING AN INCOME TAX   INCREASE.   AND FOR ITOC HE DECREASED IT   FROM THE RECOMMENDED VALUE OF   $860,000-$752 WHICH IS STILL AN   INCREASE OF $60.   JUST A QUICK AKRON FOR COMMITTEE  MEMBERS AND THOSE WATCHING AT   HOME.   THE WEIGHTED RATE IS THAT WAS A   WE WILL SEE ON THE TAX RIGHT IT   IS A COMPLETION OF ALL THE RATES  THE COUNTY TAXES AND LEVY'S   BROTHER MULTIPLE TAX RATES AND   THIS RECOMMENDS THE AVERAGE, THE  WEIGHTED RIGHT.   BUT NO RESIDENT WILL SEE THAT ON  THEIR TAX BILL THEY WILL SEE   EACH INDIVIDUAL TAX RIGHT THE   COUNTY LEVY'S.   THE COUNTY CHARTER CURRENTLY IS   AN AFFIRMATIVE VOTE OF 11   COUNCILMEMBERS IF THEY WANT TO   EXCEED THE WEIGHTED RIGHT OF   LAST YEAR.   HOWEVER, THE COUNCIL DID IN 24   AND THEY WANT TO INCREASE THE   TAX RIGHT BASED SOLELY ON MC PS   SUPPLEMENTAL BASE RIGHT A   SUPPLEMENTAL IS NEEDED FOR THAT.  FOR ITOC THAT IS A TAX RIGHT FOR  ALL OCCUPIED OWNERS WITH THE   AMOUNT OF REVENUES THE COUNTY   GENERATES AN INCOME TAX OVER   6.2%.   IT IS BEEN SET SINCE 1992 FOR   QUITE SOME TIME.   COUNCIL STAFF AT A.   ON CIRCLE THREE IS THE HISTORY   AND HOW ITOC HAS CHANGE IN MOVE   I WILL NOT GO THROUGH THOSE FOUR  PURPOSES OF  THIS PRESENTATION   BUT THEY ARE AVAILABLE IN THE   PACKET.   ANY CHANGES OF ITOC IMPACTS THE   PROPERTY TAX AND HOW THEY SHOULD  CONSIDER RESOURCES DURING THE   BUDGET.   THIS YEAR BASED ON THE ESTIMATED  NUMBER OF ELIGIBLE PROPERTIES,   THE ONE DOLLAR INCREASE ITOC TO   WILL HAVE 192,007 DAYS 12 IN   REDUCED TAX REVENUES, OR   EXPENDITURES IN THIS CASE.   THE OPPOSITE IS TRUE IF $1   DECREASE WOULD RESULT IN   $192,712 IN TERMS OF RESOURCES   AVAILABLE FOR THE COUNCIL.   AND SO THE TOTAL IN TERMS OF THE  EXECUTIVE ORGANIZATION OF $860   AS IN THE MARCH 14TH BUDGET.   IS THE 34.2 MILLION DRAW ON   RESOURCES AVAILABLE TO THE   COUNCIL OR TO THE COUNTY FOR    BALANCING THE BUDGET IN FISCAL   26.   AS I SAID ON TABLE 1 I SHOWED   EXAMPLES AS WELL AS THE   EXECUTIVES RECOMMENDATIONS IN   TERMS OF HOW MANY RESOURCES   WOULD BE IMPACTED IN COUNCIL   DECISION.   FINALLY, I WILL NOTE THERE IS   THE OLD, SO-CALLED THE CONSTANT   YIELD TAX RIGHT IN STATE LAW.   ALTHOUGH THAT IS CHANGING LITTLE  BIT BASED ON THE COUNCILS AND   ADVERTISEMENT AND PUBLIC   HEARING.   I BELIEVE GIVEN ALL THE OPTIONS   AVAILABLE TO THE COUNCIL YOU   WILL NOT NEED TO BE CONCERNED   WITH THAT THIS YEAR.   BUT THE EXECUTIVE RECOMMENDED   RIGHT ON MARCH 14TH AND THE   APRIL 24TH RECOMMENDED RIGHT ARE  IN THAT COMPILATION.   SO THERE IS NO CONCERN WITH THAT  SO I NOTE IT IN TERMS OF MEETING  THE STATE LAW.    SO I WILL WRAP IT UP INTERNET   BACK TO THE COMMITTEE.   THE COMMITTEE NOW NEEDS TO MAKE   A RECOMMENDATION BOTH FOR THE   WEIGHTED REAL PROPERTY TAX RIGHT  AS WELL ITOC AS THE WEIGHTED   REAL.   THE TWO OPTIONS BEFORE THE   COMMITTEE'S EXECUTIVE   FRAGMENTATION ON MARCH 14TH   WHICH IS 1.0605 PER $100 OF   ASSESSABLE BASE WHICH INCLUDES A  3% MC PS SUPPLEMENT AWAIT THE   OTHER IS 1.0255 OF $100 OF   ASSESSABLE RIGHT WHICH IS THE   SAME AS 2025.   AND FOR ITOC THE WORKMEN OR   OPTION FROM THE EXECUTIVE ON   MARCH 14TH WAS $850.   ON APRIL 24TH WAS $752 THE OTHER  OPTION WAS MEANING THE FISCAL 25  RIGHT OF $692.   HAPPY TO GO THROUGH THOSE   FERMENTATION IN THE COUNTY WANT   TO LOOK AT THOSE OPTIONS BEFORE   THE COMMITTEE.   THANK YOU VERY MUCH.   >> Kate Stewart: THANK YOU VERY   MUCH MR. SMITH.   ANYTHING FOR FINANCE OR OMEB.   ANY FROM COLLEAGUES?   OBVIOUSLY KEEPING THE TAX RIGHT,  THE PROPERTY TAX RIGHTB.   ANY FROM COLLEAGUES?   OBVIOUSLY KEEPING THE TAX RIGHT,  THE PROPERTY TAX RIGHT THIS A   GIVEN THE RECOMMENDATION FROM   THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE THEY SENT   OVER APRIL 24TH.   AND I THINK GIVEN THE VIEWS OF   THE COUNCIL THAT WAS WHERE I   WOULD LAND.   AND I WOULD ALSO SUPPORT KEEPING  THE ITOC OF THE CURRENT LEVEL WE  HAVE NOW.   I HAVE SEEN BOTH THE ITOC AND   PROPERTY TAX INCREASING TOGETHER  IF WE WILL DO ONE WE SHOULD DO   THE OTHER.   BUT SINCE WE'RE TAKING THE   PROPERTY TAX INCREASE OFF THE   TABLE I THINK WE SHOULD KEEP  ITOC AS A STATUS QUO.   COUNCILMEMBER FRIEDSON?   >> Andrew Friedson: THANK YOU   FOR THAT I BEEN ADVOCATING   DOUBLE THE LINE ON PROPERTY   TAXES FOR A WHILE NOW.   I APPRECIATE THAT IS WHERE WE   WILL LAND HERE AT THIS   COMMITTEE.   AND THAT SEEMS TO BE THE BROAD   CONSENSUS AND WOULD AGREE WITH   YOUR RECOMMENDATION.   I THINK THERE MAY BE OPPORTUNITY   DOWN THE LINE TO TAKE A LOOK AT   ITOC BUT IT WAS LINKED IN THE   PROPOSAL TO THIS FROM A REVENUE   STANDPOINT.   I THINK THE RESPONSIBLE THING   FOR US TO DO IF WE ARE NOT GOING  TO TAKE UP ONE THEN HOLDING   THINGS STUDY.   >> MY QUOTE IS ME, TOO, I AGREE   WITH YOU.   >> Kate Stewart: I THINK FOR THE  RECOMMENDATION TO THE FULL   COUNCIL IS TO GO WITH THE TAX   RIGHT FROM FY 25 AND THEN TO   KEEP THE ITOC AT THE CURRENT   RIGHT.   AND NOT DO THE COUNTY   EXECUTIVE'S RECOMMENDATION.   >> I WILL NOTE FOR THE RECORD   THE COUNCIL WILL BE LOOKING AT   THESE BOTH ON MONDAY.   SO THE PACKET WILL GO OUT LATER   THIS AFTERNOON FOR THE COUNCIL   AS WELL AS FOR THE PUBLIC.   REFLECT THE COMMITTEE'S   RECOMMENDATION.   >> Kate Stewart: FOR FOLKS   LISTENING AT HOME WE WILL HAVE A  STRONG VOTE ON THIS BECAUSE WE   NEED TO MEET AND MAKE DECISIONS   SO THAT WE CAN MOVE ALONG IN OUR  PROCESS WITH THE OVERALL BUDGET.  SO GREAT, THANK YOU ON THAT.   NEXT WE WILL MOVE ON TO THE   RESOLUTION TO INCREASE THE   COUNTY INCOME TAX RIGHT.   AND SINCE THIS ONE JUST CAME   OVER TO US YES, LAST WEEK, THE   TIME THAT THE COUNCIL.   THE COMMITTEE TODAY WILL JUST BE  REVIEWING THIS AND NOT BE MAKING  A RECOMMENDATION TO FULL COUNCIL  ON THIS ITEM.   >> Gene Smith: VERY GOOD JUST   ACKNOWLEDGING AND THANKING OUR   FRIENDS AND COLLEAGUES IN THE   FINANCE AND OMB ASSISTING WITH   THIS WORK IN PUTTING THIS   TOGETHER.   WITH COUNCIL STAFF I WILL GO   THROUGH SOME OF THE INFORMATION   THAT IS ALREADY IN THE REPORT.   TO GET IT ALL OUT THERE FOR THE   COMMITTEE'S DISCUSSION AND   CONSIDERATION ON SOME OF WHAT WE  WILL BE TALKING ABOUT IN FULL   COUNCIL WHEN WE GET THERE.   WE JUST TALKED ABOUT PROPERTY   TAXES, THE COUNTY LEVEES AND   INCOME TAX RIGHT.   SEPARATELY.   IT IS ONE OF THE LARGER REVENUE   SOURCES ALONG WITH PROPERTY   TAXES.   HOWEVER IT IS MUCH DIFFERENT   THAN PROPERTY TAXES AND COUNCIL   STAFF WILL GO THROUGH THAT NOW.   STATE LAW DOES HAVE A LEGAL   REQUIREMENT THAT COUNTIES IN THE  STATE OF MARYLAND NEED TO LEVY   AN INCOME TAX RIGHT.   BASED ON CURRENT STATE LAW THE   MINIMUM IS 2.25% AND THE MAXIMUM  JUST NOW IS 3.3% OF THE GENERAL   ASSEMBLY AMENDED THE LAW THIS   YEAR.   COUNCIL THAT THE MINIMUM AT 3.2%  BACK IN 2003 FOR THE FISCAL OVER  BUDGET.   THE COUNCIL HAS NOT HAD A LOCAL   INCOME TAX RIGHT OF THREE POINT   2% SINCE 2003.   UNLIKE PROPERTY TAXES THE RIGHT   IS APPROVED THROUGH A   RESOLUTION, IT DOES NOT NEED TO   BE APPROVED EACH YEAR.   SO WHAT THE COUNCIL SET IT AT   3.2% IN 2003 THE COUNCIL HAS NOT  SEEN ANOTHER RESOLUTION TO   CONSIDER.   THERE IS NO CHARTER OR LEGAL   MANDATE IN TERMS OF VOTING   THRESHOLD.   IT IS A RESOLUTION SO SIMPLE   MAJORITY WILL PASS THE   RESOLUTION BEFORE THE COUNCIL.   SO, BECAUSE THE STATE OF    MARYLAND AS THE COUNTIES LEVY A   LOCAL STATE RIGHT THE   COMPTROLLER DOES ALL THE WORK   FOR THE LOCAL COUNTY.   ONE A RESIDENT MCCUMBER COUNTY   MARYLAND, ANYWHERE ARE TO FILE A  TAKES RESIDENTS OF THE COUNTY A   FILE ONE RETURN FOR THE STATE OF  MARYLAND.   THAT BOTH CALCULATES THE   ADJUSTED GROSS INCOME FOR   MARYLAND.   AND APPLIES TO MARYLAND TAX   RIGHT BASED ON THAT AS WELL AS   THE COUNTY TAX RIGHT.   AND SO BECAUSE OF THAT MARYLAND   HAS MOST OF THE INFORMATION   RELATED TO THIS AND GIVES   DISTRIBUTIONS TO THE COUNTY.   AS YOU CAN SEE ON TABLE 1 PAGE   3, UNLIKE COUNTY PROPERTY TAXES   WHICH COMES IN TWO SLUGS IN   SEPTEMBER AND NOVEMBER AND CUT   SOME COMES LATER.   INCOME TAX ARE DISTRIBUTED   DURING THE YEAR TO THE COUNTIES.  THEY COME IN VARIATIONS FACE ON   THE TYPE OF MONEY THAT WAS   COLLECTED WHETHER IT IS   QUARTERLY DISTRIBUTIONS,   WITHHOLDINGS AND WAGES AND   SALARIES, RECONCILIATION   PAYMENTS.   AND BECAUSE OF THAT LACK MOST OF  REVENUES OF THE COUNTY RECEIVING  CURRENTLY IN FISCAL 25 IS FROM   TAX YEAR 2024.   AS OF THE SAME WOULD HOLD TRUE   YEAR FOR TAX YEAR 2025.   A LOT OF THAT MONEY WILL COME IN  FISCAL 26.   AND THAT LACK ALSO GREAT A LACK   IN TERMS OF HOW WE CAN INTERPRET  THIS DATA FOR THE PURPOSES OF   ESTIMATING REVENUES.   SO FINANCE DOES AN EXCELLENT JOB  NOT ONLY LOOKING AT ECONOMIC   DATA AND PROJECTIONS.   AND THEN ADJUSTING BASED ON THE   DISTRIBUTIONS.   BUT THE DISTRIBUTIONS DO IMPACT   WHERE WE SEE OUR INCOME TAX   REVENUES GOING.   I WILL QUICKLY NOTE THE GENERAL   ASSEMBLY IN 2025 DIGIT MAKE   CHANGES TO THE STATE TAX LAW   EXTENSIVELY.   PRIMARILY AFFECTED BY LETTERS   WILL FILE GREATER THAN 250,000   AGI OR ADJUSTED GROSS INCOME.   AND DO TO THAT, PRIMARILY   BECAUSE MARYLAND CHANGE HOW   ITEMIZED DEDUCTIONS.   THE COUNTY IS ASSUMING AN   ADDITIONAL 14.3 MILLION IN   26:INCOME TAX.   IT IS IRRELEVANT AND FOR THE   COUNTIES TO RAISE ITS OWN INCOME  TAX LAW.   I AM SORRY, GREAT.   COUNCIL STAFF DID DO SOME BASED   ON HAVING CONVERSATION WITH   COUNCIL MEMBERS TO PREPARE FOR   TODAY.   LOOK TO THE IMPACT ON RESIDENTS   BOTH IN TERMS OF THE STATE LAW   CHANGES IN THE COUNTY   EXECUTIVE'S RECOMMENDATION TO   INCREASE INCOME TAX RIGHT TO   3.3%.   AND APOLOGIES, I SHOULD MENTION   THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE   EXECUTIVE IS NOT ONLY 3.3% GOING  TO THE MAXIMUM BUT MAKING IT   RETROACTIVE.   AND SO THAT WOULD APPLY   IMMEDIATELY STARTING FOR TAX   RIGHT 2025.   INCOME ALREADY EARNED WILL BE   TAXED AT THE NEW 3.3%.   AND AS NOTED IN THE GENERAL   ASSEMBLIES WORK IN ORDER TO DO   IT RETROACTIVELY THERE ARE TWO   CAVEATS TO THAT, THE COUNTY   CANNOT CONSIDER BRACKETS THIS   YEAR TO MAKE IT MORE PROGRESSIVE  AND THE COUNTY MUST FILE TO THE   COMPTROLLER BY MAY 15TH.   WHICH IS PARTLY WHY THIS IS   SOMEWHAT OF A RUSHED ITEM.   SHOULD THE COUNCIL WANT TO DO IT  RETROACTIVELY WE DID DO THIS BY   MAY 15TH.   APOLOGIES THAT QUICK DIVERGENCE   BUT WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT   DATA WAS OUT THERE.   WILL TO BOTH THE RESIDENTIAL   IMPACTS AROUND BYLER IMPACT.   AND I SHOULD NOTE THE CHALLENGE   WITH THIS IS BASED ON RETURNS.   IT IS BASED ON FILERS.   HOUSEHOLDS FILING JOINTLY.   AND THERE IS A MARRIED COUPLE   AND THEY HAVE CHILDREN THAT IS   ONE RETURN.   IF A COUPLE DECIDE THEY WANT TO   FILE SEPARATELY, THAT IS TWO   RETURNS.   IF THE INDIVIDUAL THAT IS ONE   RETURN.   I CAUTION YOU THINKING ABOUT   HOUSEHOLDS FOR EACH RETURN.   THAT IS AN OKAY ANALYSIS BUT NOT  THAT SIMPLE IN TERMS OF WHEN WE   TALK ABOUT INCOME TAX RETURNS.   SO UNFORTUNATELY THE BUREAU OF   ESTIMATES HAS GRANULAR DATA ON   FILERS USING MARYLAND G.I.   THAT WAS DISCONTINUED IN 2018.   SO THAT IS BECOMING MORE AND   MORE DATED.   FOR THE PURPOSES OF OUR   DISCUSSION I USE THE CURRENT IRS  DATA THAT IS MOST RECENT WHICH   IS 2022.   THEY HAVE DIFFERENT BREAKDOWNS   BASED ON FEDERAL AGI.   BUT I THINK IT CONSISTENTLY SOME  IDEA OF THE TYPES OF FILERS IN   THE COUNTY.   AND SO GENERALLY WHAT I WANTED   TO KNOW AS WE GO INTO THIS.   MOST OF THE COUNTIES INCOME TAX   REVENUES ARE GENERATED BY   RETURNS GREATER THAN 100,000   AGI.   THAT IS WHERE IT MAKES SENSE.   THAT IS OBVIOUS STATEMENT BUT   NONETHELESS.   THOSE WHO HAVE AN AGI OVER   100,000 ARE FUNDING MOST OF THE   COUNTIES REVENUE.   THOSE ARE ALSO PRIMARILY FOR   CAPITAL GAINS ARE CONSIDERED.   AND THAT OBVIOUSLY MAKES SENSE,   AND AGAIN.   GIVEN THE ADDITIONAL 2% THE   STATE OF MARYLAND IS NOW   CHARGING OUT CAPITAL GAINS ON   TOP OF THE INCOME TAX INCREASE   FOR FILERS GREATER THAN 250,000   AGI.   THERE WILL BE AN ADDITIONAL   STATE TAX COLLECTED THAT IS NOT   REALIZED FOR THE COUNTY.   BUT THOSE FILERS WILL BE HAVING   TO PAY IN 2025 AND FUTURE FISCAL  YEARS.    AND ALSO, FINALLY, THE FILERS   OVER $100,000 TAKING ADVANTAGE   OF ITEMIZED DEDUCTIONS THE MOST.  AND OF COURSE THE STATE CHANGE   HOW ITEMIZED DEDUCTIONS WORK FOR  FOLKS FILING GREATER THAN   200,000 AGI.   AND THEN FINALLY ON THE OTHER   END.   FOR THOSE WILL NOT RECEIVED   REPORT LISTENED 250,000 A THEY   ARE SAVING THE EARNED INCOME TAX  SAVINGS.   I HAD THAT BECAUSE MOMENTARILY   WILL BE LOOKING WITH MY   COLLEAGUES OF THE WORKING FAMILY  INCOME SUPPLEMENT PICKLE THE   STATE PIGGYBACKS OFF OF THAT   REFUND AND ALSO PROVIDES A   REFUND OF THE COUNTY MATCHES   THAT REFUND.   FOR WORKING FAMILY TO SUPPORT.   SO BASED ON THE FEDERAL EI TC OR  EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT,   REQUIREMENTS MOST OF THAT WILL   BE BELOW THOSE WHO EARNED LESS   THAN 50,000.   REPORT LISTENED 50,000 AGI.   BUT IT IS NOT ALL OF THEM.   ACCORDING TO IRS DATA IT IS 17%   OF THOSE WHO FILE WITH LESS THAN  250,000 AGI ARE RECEIVING A   REFUND.   83% ARE NOT RECEIVING A REFUND.   THEY MAY RECEIVE A TAX CREDIT   BUT THE LIABILITY IS REDUCED BUT  THEY DON'T RECEIVE A REFUND.   SO SUMMARIZING HOW THE INCREASE   BOTH AT THE STATE LEVEL AND THE   COUNTY LEVEL FROM 3.2 TO 3.3%.   I HAVE SUMMARIZED IT INTO THREE   BUCKETS.   THOSE FILING LESS THAN 50,000   WILL PROBABLY SEE A SMALL   INCREASE.   THE IMPACT HERE IS BASED ON   TOTAL TAX LIABILITY.   I DO NOT KNOW IF THEY ADJUST THE  $50 BILL IS REASONABLE OR NOT   REASONABLE FOR OUR RESIDENTS IT   IS BASED ON WHAT THEY WERE   BUDGET DEBATE IN 2024 AND WHAT   THEIR PAY NOW IN 2025.   SOME OF THEM BUT NOT ALL OF THEM  WILL RECEIVE THE REFUND THROUGH   THE WORKING FAMILY INCOME   SUPPLEMENT BASED ON THE   EXECUTIVE'S RECOMMENDATION.   AND MIGHT BE A MODEST INCREASE   IN THAT.   AGAIN, THAT IS NOT ALL FILERS IT  WILL BE ABOUT 20% OF THE FILERS   IN MY COMING COUNTY THAT ARE   LESS THEN $50,000 MIGHT SEE AN   INCREASE IN THE REFUND.   FOR THOSE BETWEEN 50 AND 250,000  BEFORE YOU GET TO THE NEW STATE   LAW IN TERMS OF ITEMIZED   DEDUCTIONS.   THEY WILL SEE A MODEST INCREASE   .1% INCREASE THE ADDITIONAL   DOLLAR FOR EVERY THOUSAND   DOLLARS.   AS YOU GET GREATER INTO THE AGI   WE WOULD EXPECT A GREATER TAX   BILL FOR NEXT YEAR AND THE   COUNTY COUNCIL INCREASES THE TAX  RIGHT FROM 3.2 TO 3.3%.   FINALLY, FOR THOSE FILING   GREATER THAN 100,000 AGI THAT   WILL BE FOR MOST OF THE IMPACT   IS FELT.   BECAUSE THAT IS ALSO CHANGING   FOR THEM AT THE STATE LEVEL.   AND ALSO THE COUNTY INCOME TAX   RIGHT WILL BE IMPACTED AND SOME   OF THEM WILL RETAIN MORE INCOME   TAXES FROM THE COUNTY ANYWAY TO   DO THE ITEMIZED DEDUCTION   CHANGES.   REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE COUNCIL   IS CONSIDERING.    NOW TURNING THE PAGE DOWN WE ARE  EXCITED INCOME TAX REVENUES TO   CHANGE FOR THE COUNTY.   FINANCE PROVIDED ESTIMATES BOTH   OF THE 3.3% RETROACTIVELY FOR   TAX YEAR 2025.   AT3.3% RESPECTIVELY STARTING   TAX YEAR 2026.   AND THEN BASED ON THE COUNCIL   PRESIDENT REQUESTED ESTIMATE AT   3.25% BOTH RETROACTIVELY AND   PROSPECTIVELY FOR 2026.   ATTRACTIVELY AT 3.3% GRADES THE   MOST REVENUES ESTIMATED IN   FISCAL 26 OF 75 MILLION.   SHOULD THE COUNCIL DECIDE TO DO   A PERSPECTIVE THEY GET 3.3% THIS  MEANT AT 23 MILLION, 50 MILLION   DELTA THERE AND THREE POINT TWO   5%.   SO A COUPLE CAVEATS I PUT IN THE  PACKET.   JUST AGAIN AS WE GET INTO THIS   DISCUSSION.   OUR INCOME TAXES MUCH MORE   VOLATILE THAN IT IS FOR PROPERTY  TAXES.   PRIMARILY BECAUSE OF CAPITAL   GAINS AND BEHAVIORS INDIVIDUALS   TAKE.   WE DO NOT KNOW WHEN INDIVIDUALS   WILL TAKE CAPITAL GAINS.   AS I SHOW ON CHART 1 ON PAGE 7.   THE APPROVED BUDGET FOR INCOME   TAXES VERSUS THE ACTUAL REVENUES  FLUCTUATES DEPENDING ON THOSE   INDIVIDUALS BEHAVIORS THROUGHOUT  THE YEAR.   AS WELL AS THE MACRO ECONOMICS   THAT OCCUR FOR THE COUNTY AND   REGION.   AND SO EVEN WITH THE ESTIMATES   WE HAVE FROM FINANCE WHICH I   THINK ARE EXCELLENT.   IT IS HARD TO KNOW WHETHER OR   NOT THOSE WILL COME IN GIVEN ALL  THE CHANGES THAT COULD HAPPEN   FOR CAPITAL GAINS FOR INDIVIDUAL  RESIDENCES SHARE BASED ON STATE   TAX LAW.   AND FINANCE TO SAY THEY INCLUDED  - AND CALLING THEM MAKEUP   PAYMENTS SHOULD THAT IS THE   RIGHT TERM BUT NEVERTHELESS OF   THE COUNTY COUNCIL PERCENT   RETROACTIVE TAX INCREASE THOSE   WHO HAVE ALREADY EARNED INCOME   FROM JANUARY UNTIL IT GOES INTO   EFFECT.   UNTIL EMPLOYERS OR OTHER SUCH   MAKE THOSE CHANGES, THAT INCOME   WILL NEED TO BE TAXED AT A   DIFFERENT LEVEL.   SO FINANCE IS ASSUMING THERE   WILL BE SOME MAKEUP PAYMENTS FOR  JANUARY TO LET'S SAY JUNE FOR   THE FIRST QUARTER OF THE YEAR.   THAT IS WHY IT IS SLIGHTLY MORE   THAN WHAT WE MIGHT GET IT WAS   JUST A FLAT RIGHT STARTING IN   2026 PER AND SO ALL I KNOW IS IT  IS HARD TO KNOW NOT ONLY   BEHAVIOR FOR INDIVIDUAL TAX   TREATMENT HOW EMPLOYERS WILL   RESPOND TO THIS HOW THEY WILL   MAKEUP THOSE PAYMENTS.   AND OF COURSE ANY CHANGE IN ONE   THOSE PAYMENTS ARE MADE, IF THEY  WAIT UNTIL THE END OF THE TAX   YEAR IN THEIR FILING THAN THOSE   PAYMENTS MAY NOT COME TO THE   COUNTY UNTIL FISCAL 27, NOVEMBER  2026 PERKO THERE ARE SOME HEDGES  AROUND THERE THAT NUMBER MAY   CHANGE.   AS WE GET FURTHER INTO THE YEAR   AND WE SEE WHAT THE STATE DOES   WITH DISTRIBUTIONS.   FINALLY, THE COUNCIL HAS TALKED   AT LENGTH SO I WON'T BELABOR IT   TOO LONG.   WERE OBVIOUSLY FACING AN   UNPRECEDENTED REALITY IN TERMS   OF OUR ECONOMY GIVEN THE FEDERAL  ADMINISTRATION AND HOW THEY ARE   AFFECTING FEDERAL WORKERS WAS   THE COUNTY HERE.   IN TERMS OF TARIFFS AND TRADE   POLICY.   REGARDLESS OF THE COUNTY   CONSIDERATION OF INCOME TAX   RIGHT INCREASE CURRENTLY,   THERE'S A LOT THEY CAN CHANGE   FOR INCOME TAXES GOING INTO 20   TO SIX.   FISCAL 26 AND NEXT YEAR.   GIVEN THE CHANGES AND THOSE ARE   WORKING THROUGH THE SYSTEM RIGHT  NOW.   AND NOTHING HAS CHANGED IN TERMS  OF FINANCE ESTIMATES GIVEN   THOSE.   BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH   DATA TO CHANGE THAT.    AND SO LIKELY COME   NOVEMBER 2025, WE ARE IN THE   MIDDLE OF FISCAL 26 WILL HAVE A   BETTER SENSE OF WHAT IS GOING ON  IN THE ECONOMY AND HOW IT IS   IMPACTING OUR INCOME TAX   REVENUES.   AND FINALLY, JUST DO NOT KNOW   HOW OUR HIGHEST INCOME ORDERS,   THOSE WHO REPORT THE CAPITAL   GAINS WILL BEHAVE GIVEN THE   STATE CHANGES.   I KNOW IT WAS TALKED ABOUT AND I  WILL MENTION IT.   THEY CERTAINLY CAN CHANGE   RESIDENCY IF THEY BELIEVE THOSE   LAWS HAVE IMPACTED THE REVENUES   AND IF THEY NO LONGER WANT TO   REALIZE THOSE GAINS IN THE STATE  OF MARYLAND.   IS DIFFICULT TO KNOW HOW MANY   AND HE WILL DO THAT.   BUT THAT IS CERTAINLY ON THE   TABLE GIVEN ALL THE CHANGES   BEFORE THEM IN THE STATE.   ESPECIALLY MOST OF IT IN THE   STATE CHANGES.   TO THE CAPITAL GAINS AND HIGHER   RATES.   I THINK THAT IS A LOT OF   INFORMATION.   I FRONTLOADED IT.   IS OFF REACTION STOPPING TO TURN  OVER TO FINANCE AND THEY HAVE   THINK THEY WANTED TO ADD.   BUT IF COUNCILMEMBERS HAVE   QUESTIONS FOR THE DISCUSSION AS   WE GET READY FOR COUNCIL.   >> Kate Stewart: THANK YOU, MR.   SMITH, I APPRECIATE THE PACKET   AND ALL THE INFORMATION.   KNOWING IS A QUICK TURNAROUND TO  PROVIDE ALL THIS TO US SO THE   COUNCIL CAN DELIBERATE AND THINK  ABOUT THE POTENTIAL OF AN INCOME  TAX INCREASE.   JUST WANT TO TURN IT TO FINANCE   AND OMB TO SEE IF YOU HAVE   ANYTHING TO ADD.   >> NANCY FELDMAN FROM FINANCE.   I JUST WANT TO SAY I AGREE WITH   YOU THAT THIS IS A REALLY GOOD   REPRESENTATION OF THE   INFORMATION WE HAVE BEEN PULLING  TOGETHER AND WORKING WITH MR.   SMITH TO GET THIS IN FRONT OF   YOU.   AND WE REALLY APPRECIATE THE   COLLABORATION.    WAS REALLY APPRECIATE THAT.   MS. FELDMAN.   AND I GUESS MAYBE ONE QUESTION   FOR YOU ALL.   MR. SMITH LAID OUT THE   VOLATILITY AND GETTING OUR HANDS  AROUND INCOME TAXES.   AND WHEN PEOPLE MAY FILE AND   WHEN WE ARE POTENTIALLY GOING TO  SEE.   EVEN IF WE DON'T RAISE OUR   INCOME TAX RIGHT THIS YEAR   KNOWING WHAT - I WILL ESTIMATE   MOVING FORWARD.   IF YOU JUST WANTED TO ELABORATE   A LITTLE ON WHAT MR. SMITH SAID.  IN TERMS OF WHAT FINANCE IS   THINKING ABOUT THIS TIME.   AS YOU ARE LOOKING AT NOT JUST   THE INDIVIDUAL OF US INCREASING   THE TAX RIGHT BUT HOW WE WILL   MOVE THROUGH THIS YEAR.   ONCE WE THINK ABOUT IT ALL DAY   LONG EVERY DAY AND I KNOW YOU DO  AS WELL.   WE ARE RIGHT NOW GETTING   PREPARED TO START MEETING WITH   THE REVENUE ESTIMATING GROUP.   WE HAVE A REPORT COMING DUE   MAY 15TH.   AS NOTED A FEW MOMENTS AGO BY   MR. SMITH.   THERE IS NO DATA OF SUBSTANCE   YET.   >> Nancy Feldman: WE ALL KNOW   WHAT IS GOING ON WHETHER FROM   FRIENDS, FAMILY, NEIGHBORS HERE,  OUR CONSTITUENTS IN THE COUNTY.   BUT IT HAS NOT, IN MANY WAYS,   FILTERED THROUGH INTO DATA UNTIL  YESTERDAY.   WHEN THE NATIONAL GDP WENT   NEGATIVE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN   QUITE A NUMBER OF YEARS.   THERE ARE ALL KINDS OF   EXPLANATIONS FOR THAT.   AND THAT IT MAY OR MAY NOT   REVERSE BECAUSE OF BEHAVIOR.   THERE IS A LOT OF BEHAVIOR THAT   WE ALL HAVE TO TRY AND FIGURE   OUT.   SO WHAT WE ARE GOING TO TRY TO   DO WITH THE REVENUE ESTIMATING   GROUP, FIRST THE TECHNICAL GROUP  THAN WITH THE FULL COMMITTEE.   IS TO GO THROUGH AS MUCH DATA AS  WE HAVE.   ALSO GO THROUGH DISCUSSIONS FROM  OUR CONSULTANT THAT PROVIDE OUR   ECONOMIC ASSUMPTIONS.   THEY HAVE PEOPLE WHO WORK ALL   DAY LONG EVERY SINGLE DAY DOING   THEIR BEST GUESS.   BECAUSE IT IS NO MORE THAN THAT,  UNFORTUNATELY.   WILL TAKE THAT IN AND WE WILL   EVALUATE IT.   AND HOW WE THINK IT MAY IMPACT   US.   I DON'T THINK JUST FOR SOME.   WE ARE NOT SEEING HIGHER   UNEMPLOYMENT RIGHT CLAIMS OF ANY  SUBSTANCE.   WE HAVE A BIG NATIONAL DATA FOR    EMPLOYMENT ON FRIDAY OF THIS   WEEK.   WILL SEE HOW THAT PLAYS OUT.   WE ARE JUST AT THE BEGINNING OF   STARTING TO RECEIVE DATA.   THAT COULD BE HELPFUL IN MAKING   FUTURE DECISIONS ABOUT HOW    INCOME TAX MAY BEHAVE OVER THE   COURSE OF THE NEXT 12 MONTHS.   >> Kate Stewart: THANK YOU, THAT  IS REALLY HOPEFUL.   AND IT MIGHT HELPFUL TO REMIND   US ALL.   I THINK OUR COMMITTEE DOES THINK  ABOUT THIS PRICKLY, PROBABLY NOT  AS FREQUENTLY AS YOU ALL DO.   BUT IN TERMS OF WHEN YOU'RE   LOOKING AT DATA.   TO GUESS MAYBE THROUGH A YEAR   AND WHEN YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT   THE REVENUE ESTIMATING GROUP.    MEETING THE REPORT, THE EBBS AND  FLOWS.   HOW YOU ALL ARE LOOKING AT THE   DATA IN THE ESTIMATES.   BECAUSE I THINK AS MR. SMITH   SAID.   ALL OF US ARE USED TO THE   PROPERTY TAX.   AND THE TWO DISTRIBUTIONS WE   GET.   INCOME TAX FLUCTUATES A LOT   MORE.   AND EVEN THE WORK YOU ALL ARE   DOING ON THE PROJECTIONS.   IS SOMETHING THAT THIS COMMITTEE  TAKES UP JUST THINKING ABOUT IT   MORE BROADLY AS WE HAVE THIS   CONVERSATION WITH THE FULL   COUNCIL.   >> Nancy Feldman: SURE, LET ME   WALK THROUGH THE REVENUE   ESTIMATING GROUP HAS FOUR   REPORTS THAT ARE DUE.   THEY ARE CALLED QUARTERLY   REPORTS BUT THEY ARE NOT   ACTUALLY QUARTERLY THEIR   SLIGHTLY OFF.   AND WE THE REVENUE ESTIMATING   GROUP ARE TALKING ABOUT   RECOMMENDING AMONG OURSELVES   WHETHER OR NOT WE WOULD WANT TO   CHANGE SOME OF THE STAKES.   RIGHT NOW FEBRUARY 15TH,   MAY 15TH, SEPTEMBER 15TH AND   DECEMBER 15TH.   SOME OF THOSE ARE REALLY GREAT    BECAUSE THEY LINE WITH THE   BUDGET PROCESS.   AND THIS IS THE FISCAL PLAN   UPDATE.   THE ONES IN THE MIDDLE OR   HARDER, MAY 15TH WE DON'T HAVE   LIKELY A WHOLE LOT OF   INFORMATION IN MOST YEARS.   FROM THE TIME THE BUDGET IS   INTRODUCED BY THE EXECUTIVE TO   MAY 15TH.   SO THE ASSUMPTIONS ARE ALL   AGREED UPON IN FEBRUARY.   BUT THE REVENUES HAVE NOT BEEN   COMPLETED, IF YOU WILL.   THERE IS A LOT OF INPUTS THAT GO  ON.   THOSE ARE THE TIMES OF YEAR   WHERE WE ARE REPORTING   SPECIFICALLY.   AS I NOTED WERE TAKING ABOUT IT   PRETTY MUCH EVERY DAY.   ESPECIALLY IN THE VOLATILE TIMES  WE ARE EXPERIENCING RIGHT NOW.   AMONG THE MANY THINGS THAT ARE   IMPORTANT WITH RESPECT TO THE   INCOME TAX AND THEY ARE   DISCUSSED VERY WELL IN THE   PACKET HERE.   NUMBER ONE, BEHAVIOR OF   TAXPAYERS, ESPECIALLY IF YOU ARE  THINKING ABOUT CHANGING TAX   RATES BY RETROACTIVELY OR   PROSPECTIVELY.   BECAUSE MANY TAXPAYERS HAVE   NEVER PAID AN ESTIMATED TAX   PAYMENT.   IF YOU ARE DOING A RETROACTIVE,   AND THERE WAS INCOME IN THE   FIRST SIX MONTHS OF THE YEAR,   SOME TAXPAYERS HAVE NEVER MADE   AN ESTIMATED PAYMENT MAY NOT   KNOW THAT THEY MAY HAVE TO MAKE   AN ESTIMATED PAYMENT IN THE   SECOND HALF OF THE YEAR.   SO THEREFORE THEY ARE NOT GOING   TO BE IN A POSITION OR   KNOWLEDGEABLE ENOUGH TO DO   ANYTHING ABOUT THE FIRST SIX   MONTHS OF CALENDAR TAX YEAR 25.   UNTIL APRIL 2026.   AT WHICH POINT, I BELIEVE I HAVE  READ THEY WOULD INCUR A PENALTY   FOR THIS DATE.   I THINK THAT IS ONE OF THE   PIECES OF THE BILL.   BUT THAT DOES NOT MEET WE HAVE   THE TAXES ANY EARLIER.   SO THOSE DOLLARS WE PROBABLY   WOULD NOT GET UNTIL THE VERY END  OF FY 26.   OR IF THEY FILE AN EXTENSION,   POSSIBLY FY 27.   SO THERE IS THAT PIECE OF   BEHAVIOR THAT IS IN THERE.   AND THEN THERE ARE OTHER MOVING   PARTS THAT ARE UNIQUE TO THE   CIRCUMSTANCE OF THE NEW   ADMINISTRATION.   IN WASHINGTON WHERE MANY   EMPLOYEES WERE OFFERED - YOU CAN  STOP WORKING TODAY AND BE ON THE  PAYROLL UNTIL SEPTEMBER.   THOSE FOLKS ARE NOT TECHNICALLY   UNEMPLOYED BECAUSE THEY ARE   BEING PAID.   SO WE DON'T KNOW EXACTLY HOW   THEY ARE GOING TO IMPACT OUR   UNEMPLOYMENT RATES.   OUR WITHHOLDINGS, ETC.   SO THERE IS A STORY FOR EVERY   PIECE OF THIS AND THEN THE STATE  ASKED TO COLLECT IT.   AND DECIDE ACCORDING TO THEIR   APPROACH OF WHEN THEY SPEND THAT  MONEY TO US.   AND WE HAVE TO TO FIGURE OUT   WHAT CAUSED IT.   SOMETIMES WE DON'T KNOW UNTIL   AFTER WE RECEIVE A PAYMENT.   WHETHER SOME OF THE LARGER   PAYMENTS WE OFTEN RECEIVE IN   NOVEMBER AND FEBRUARY, FOR   EXAMPLE.   WE THEN SPENT SURGEON AMOUNT OF   TIME TRYING TO DISSECT WHAT   CAUSED SOMETHING THAT MAY HAVE   BEEN UNEXPECTED.   SO THIS COMBINATION OF THE STATE  TAX CHANGES AS WELL AS ANY   CHANGES THAT THE COUNCIL MAY   CHOOSE TO IMPLEMENT.   ARE GOING TO BE SPENDING A LOT   OF TIME DISSECTING.    WE PREFER TO GET IT RIGHT UP   FRONT.   WE ARE AWARE THERE IS JUST A LOT  OF BEHAVIOR ISSUES.   AND AT THE COUNTY LEVEL OUR DATA  IS QUITE A BIT DELAYED.   VERSUS DC, FOR INSTANCE, WHICH   HAS DATA LIKE A STATE, THE STATE  OF MARYLAND.   >> Kate Stewart: THANK YOU, VERY  HELPFUL, APPRECIATE YOU TAKING   THE TIME TO DO THAT.   COUNCILMEMBER KATZ?   >> Sidney Katz: THANK YOU, MADAM  PRESIDENT.   FIRST OFF, THANK YOU YOU ALL FOR  THIS INFORMATION.   IT IS HELPFUL.   YOU KNOW, YOU USE THE TERM   VOLATILITY.   IT IS SO VOLATILE.   AND I THINK, AND I HAVE HEARD   THIS BEFORE.   GEO,YOU AND I HAVE HAD THIS   CONVERSATION BUT I'VE HEARD IN   SOME CASES 45% OR WHATEVER THAT   PERCENTAGE IS OF THE PEOPLE WHO   PAY INCOME TAXES IN MONTGOMERY   COUNTY.   BECAUSE BASED ON CAPITAL GAINS,   ETC. IT IS ABOUT 50 PEOPLE.   NOW THAT NUMBER, OF COURSE,   CHANGES EACH YEAR DEPENDING ON   WHO SOLD SOMETHING FOR A CAPITAL  GAIN.   BUT IF IT IS BASED ON 50 PEOPLE.  EVEN IF 60 OR LESS THAN 100,   WHATEVER THAT NUMBER IS.   MANY OF THOSE RESIDENTS HAVE A   HOME IN VARIOUS PLACES   THROUGHOUT THE UNITED STATES.   WHETHER IT BE HERE, WHETHER IT   BE IN DELAWARE.   IN ADDITION ONE IN FLORIDA.   I THINK IT IS 183 DAYS TO BE   DOMICILED.   AND THEY CAN DECLARE THE OTHER   HOUSE THEIR RESIDENCE.   AND WE WOULD LOSE EVERY DIME FOR  WHAT THEY ARE PAYING AN INCOME.   WE STILL GET THEIR PROPERTY TAX   BUT WE WOULD LOSE EVERY DIME OF   WHAT THEY ARE PAYING IN INCOME   TAX TO MONTGOMERY COUNTY NOW.   AND I JUST BELIEVE THIS IS   REALLY - AND WE WILL NEED TO   HAVE THE CONVERSATIONS.   I DON'T WANT TO SAY WE   SHOULDN'T.   BUT I REALLY BELIEVE IN MANY   WAYS THIS IS PENNY WISE AND   POUND FOOLISH.   IF ANY OF THE PEOPLE, THE 50   PEOPLE WOULD LEAVE WILL BE WORSE  OFF.   AND COULD STILL WORSE OFF   BECAUSE OF WHAT THE STATE OF   MARYLAND DID BECAUSE OF THE WAY   THEY HAVE CHANGED THIS TAX   SITUATION.   I JUST BELIEVE WE NEED TO BE   EXTREMELY CAREFUL IN WHAT WE DO   AND HOW MUCH WE ARE DOING.   AND TO THE POINT THEY YOU HAD   JUST RAISED.   I WAS WRITING SOME NOTES AND   THAT WAS IN MY NOTES.   ABOUT THE BUY OUT.   SO THOSE FOLKS ARE NOT, QUOTE,   UNQUOTE, UNEMPLOYED ALTHOUGH   THEY REALLY ARE.   THEY ARE STILL RECEIVING A   SALARY.   THEREFORE WE CAN'T FIGURE OUT   HOW MUCH THAT WOULD BE.   AND IF IT WORKED IN THE DISTRICT  OR VIRGINIA, THEN THE   UNEMPLOYMENT PART WOULD COME   FROM THE DISTRICT OF VIRGINIA,   CORRECT?   THAT IS WHERE THEY WOULD BE   GETTING THERE UNEMPLOYMENT   PAYMENTS?   ONCE THEY DECLARE?   I THINK IT IS WHERE THE BUSINESS  WAS.   >> Nancy Feldman: I DON'T KNOW   THE ANSWER TO THAT.   >> Gene Smith: WE WILL LOOK INTO  THAT BECAUSE I WILL NOT SPEAK   FOR MY COLLEAGUES IN FINANCE BUT  THAT IS MY SENSE.   DC IS ENOUGH FOR GREATER   INCREASE BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE   WAS THE FEDERAL WORKERS ARE.   THOSE WERE THE STATE OF MARYLAND  IS NOT SEEN A SIMILAR INCREASE.   BUT WE WILL DOUBLE CHECK.   >> Sidney Katz: PLEASE.   BUT MY QUESTION ON THAT, DOES   THE DISTRICT GOVERNMENT, OR THE   VIRGINIA GOVERNMENT, LET US KNOW  WHO IS UNEMPLOYED IN MONTGOMERY   COUNTY?   HOW DOES THAT WORK?   WOULD WE EVEN KNOW HOW MANY ARE   UNEMPLOYED?   >> Gene Smith: WE WILL GET BACK   TO YOU ON THAT ONE.   IS SOME OF WHAT THE COUNCIL   PRESIDENT WAS DOING.   WE CAN INCLUDE THAT IN THE   FUTURE PACKET FOR THE COUNCIL   AND NOTE THE COMMITTEE'S   QUESTIONS.   >> Sidney Katz: GENE, I HAVE TO   SAY AFTER READING THE PACKET AND  I KNOW YOU ARE A GURU.   HOW YOU HAVE FIGURED OUT WHAT   YOU ALREADY FIGURED OUT.   BUT THIS ONE IS UNBELIEVABLE FOR  THE PROBLEMS THAT COULD HAPPEN.   AND IT IS FOR US TRYING TO GET A  BETTER REVENUE.   AND IN MANY CASES WE MIGHT BE   GETTING SOMETHING MUCH WORSE   THAN A BETTER REVENUE.   THANK YOU VERY MUCH.   >> Kate Stewart: COUNCILMEMBER   FRIEDSON.   >> Andrew Friedson: THANK YOU,   ECHOING THE COMMENTS OF   COLLEAGUES.   I WANT TO THANK YOU BOTH COUNCIL  STAFF AND FINANCE FOR ALL OF THE  WORK.    I AM VERY CONCERNED ABOUT   IMPOSING A RETROACTIVE INCOME   TAX INCREASE.   ON RESIDENTS WHO ARE ALREADY   STRUGGLING.   AND PARTICULARLY, AS NOTED, ON   MANY EMPLOYEES IN OUR COMMUNITY   WHO ARE GOING TO BE TAXED ON   WAGES FROM JOBS THEY DON'T   LONGER HAVE.   I MEAN, TO ME IT IS INCREDIBLY   DIFFICULT MESSAGE TO SEND THOSE   EMPLOYEES AND FAMILIES WHO ARE   DESPERATELY STRUGGLING.   THAT IS IN ADDITION TO THE   CONCERNS THAT COUNCILMEMBER KATZ  WAS RAISING WHICH IS LEGITIMATE.  OF WHETHER OR NOT THIS IS PENNY   WISE AND POUND FOOLISH PICO TO   THE EXTENT IF CERTAIN DECISIONS   ARE MADE, COMPOUNDED FROM THE   STATE DECISIONS THAT HAVE BEEN   MADE.   50% OF WHICH ARE BEING BORNE BY   OUR RESIDENTS.   IN ADDITION TO US MAKING   DECISION, WHAT IMPACT THAT WILL   HAVE ON TAXPAYER DECISIONS.   I AM VERY CONCERNED ON THE   IMPACT ON FAMILIES, ON WORKING   FAMILIES IN PARTICULAR, ON   FEDERAL EMPLOYEES WHO ARE UNDER   ASSAULT.   PARTICULARLY CONCERNED, AND MS.   FELDMAN YOU SPOKE TO IT VERY   ELOQUENTLY.   MANY EMPLOYEES WHO WOULD NOT   EVEN REALIZE THEY MORE TAXES   THAN WHAT THEY HAVE WITHHELD   FOR.   THEY MAY HAVE TAKEN A BITE OUT   AND HAVE LIMITED INTERACTION   WITH THEIR OFFICE OF HUMAN   RESOURCES ANYMORE.   AND ARE LOOKING FOR THEIR NEXT   CAREER DECISION AND NEXT CAREER   MOVE IN AN ECONOMY REGIONALLY   AND NATIONALLY THAT IS GOING   NEGATIVE FOR THE FIRST TIME, AS   WAS NOTED.   AND THIS REGION MORE JUST   PROPORTIONALLY IMPACTED THAN ANY  OTHER.   AND SO I AM VERY, VERY CONCERNED  ABOUT THAT.   A COUPLE QUESTIONS THAT WERE   NOTED I WANTED TO FOLLOW UP ON.    HOW CONFIDENT ARE YOU ON THE   TIMING?   I KNOW YOU MENTIONED WE ARE NOT   SURE WHEN THE TIMING WILL BE   BECAUSE MUCH OF THIS IS BEING   SOLD ON HOW TO SOLVE OUR CURRENT  BUDGET CHALLENGES.   AND I AM CONCERNED THAT IS NOT   PARTICULARLY REALISTIC.   AND I USED TO WORK IN THIS SPACE  SO I DO UNDERSTAND THE FLOW OF   HOW IT WORKS.   AND GENERALLY WE DON'T SEE THE   COUNTY IMPACTS OF REVENUES FOR   QUITE SOME TIME.   AND PARTICULARLY, THAT IS IN   NORMAL TIMES.   AND THIS WOULD BE AN ABNORMAL   DYNAMIC WERE WE WOULD BE   INCREASING TAXES FOR THE FIRST   TIME SINCE 2003.   AND ONE OF THE MOST CHALLENGING   IF NOT THE SINGLE MOST   CHALLENGING ECONOMIC ENVIRONMENT  THIS COUNTY AND REGION HAS EVER   FACED, POTENTIALLY.   AND WE HAVE NO IDEA HOW   RESIDENTS ARE GOING TO RESPOND.   WHAT LEVEL OF CONFIDENCE DO YOU   HAVE THE FOOD WILL SEE   SIGNIFICANT REVENUE INCREASE, AS  HAS BEEN SUGGESTED BY THE   EXECUTIVE IN HIS TRANSMITTAL, IN  FY 26?   >> Nancy Feldman: I WOULD LOVE   TO SAY 100% BUT THERE IS NO WAY   WE ARE 100% CONFIDENT.   IN THESE FORECAST.   LET'S START WITH FY 25.    IF A VIRTUAL ACTIVE INCOME TAX   CHANGE WERE MADE, AND   TRANSMITTED TO THE CONTROLLER BY  MAY 15TH OF THE LAW SAYS.   THERE IS A SLIGHT CHANCE THAT WE  COULD SEE SOME REVENUE FROM   WITHHOLDINGS IN FY 25.   WE DID NOT ASSUME ANY.   SO WE ASSUME THERE WILL BE   EARNINGS THAT ARE TAXABLE IN FY   25.   BUT ARE NOT MAKING ANY   ASSUMPTIONS THAT WE WOULD   RECEIVE THEM BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO  COLLECT, SUBMIT, THEN THE   CONTROLLER HAS TO CALCULATE AND   TRANSMIT THAT BACK TO US.   SO WE UNDERSTAND THE EARNINGS,   THE TIMING OF RECEIPT WE HAD TO   ASSUME WAS IN FY 26.    IF YOU SAID TO US WILL YOU GET   IT IN AUGUST, SEPTEMBER,   OCTOBER, NOVEMBER, WE HAVE OUR   BEST ESTIMATE BASED ON THE   TIMING OF WHEN THESE VARIOUS   DISTRIBUTIONS ARE MADE TO US.   UPON COLLECTION, PAYMENT AND   THEN DISTRIBUTION.   AND SO WITHIN FY 26, WE ARE NOT   100% CERTAIN WE WILL GET IT IN   SEPTEMBER VERSUS OCTOBER OR   NOVEMBER.   BUT WE FEEL THAT OUR MODELS COME  AND THE ECONOMIC ASSUMPTIONS WE   ARE USING.   AND OUR QUALITATIVE ANALYSIS ARE  GOOD.   I CAN'T GIVE YOU A NUMBER,   PERCENTAGEWISE.   BUT WE FEEL THAT WE ARE GOOD.   >> Andrew Friedson: THE $75   MILLION NUMBER?   >> Nancy Feldman: INCLUDES IT   LITTLE CARRYOVER FROM FY 25.   QUICK SAID THAT YOU ARE ASSUMING  ZERO IN FY 25?   >> Nancy Feldman: ASSUME THERE   ARE EARNINGS BUT WE WILL NOT GET  THEM IN FY 25.   >> Andrew Friedson: YOU ARE   ASSUMING THE CARRYOVER IS WHAT   SHOULD HAVE SPENT COLLECTED.   >> Nancy Feldman: IF ANYBODY AT   THE SAME WITHHOLDINGS.   >> IF IT WAS RETROACTIVE AND   THEY KNEW ABOUT IT THAT IS WHAT   WOULD HAVE BEEN TOWED AND   ORDINARILY PAID HAD THEY BEEN   EVEN AWARE THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO  WITHHOLD OR ESTIMATE AT THAT   LEVEL?   >> Nancy Feldman: CORRECT.   AND I THINK THERE IS A TABLE   HERE.   APOLOGIES, YOU CAN SEE THE FIRST  YEAR, PAGE 2 I WENT RIGHT PAST   IT.    NO, 75 MILLION FOR FY - WE ARE   ESTIMATING 75 MILLION, OF COURSE  I DON'T HAVE YOUR PACKET   MEMORIZED.   ON PAGE 6, IT IS ON PAGE 6 TABLE  5, 75 MILLION IN FY 25, IF WE   WERE TO GO RETROACTIVE AND   ESTIMATE HOW MUCH THAT WOULD BE   - I AM SORRY TAX YEAR 26.   LET ME STEP BACK I HAVE MY TAX   YEARS IN FISCAL YEARS MIXED UP   THERE.   TAX YEAR 25, 75 MILLION, WHICH   WE EXPECT WE WOULD RECEIVE IN FY  26.   IN FY 27, FOR THE NEXT TAX YEAR   THAT NUMBER WILL BE LOWER.   BECAUSE THERE IS NO CARRYOVER   FOR SIX MONTHS OF RETROACTIVITY.  THE NUMBERS AROUND 60, DO YOU   REMEMBER?   I DON'T HAVE IT IN FRONT OF ME   IT IS IN THE 60 MILLION RANGE.   THERE'S THAT LITTLE DIFFERENTIAL  FOR THE CARRYOVER FROM MAY 15TH   TO JUNE 30TH, PLUS THE   RETROACTIVE PIECE.    >> Andrew Friedson: BASED ON   YOUR ASSUMPTIONS, HOW MUCH OF   WHAT YOU ARE ASSUMING IN TERMS   OF TIMING IS BASED ON WAGE   EARNINGS AND HOW MUCH IS BASED   ON NONWAGE EARNINGS?   WAS THAT DENNIS HAD MEANT   RESPONSE.   >> DENNIS HETMAN FROM FISCAL THE  FINANCE.   WE ARE LOOKING AT THE   PROPORTIONAL SHARES IN TERMS OF   WITHHOLDING VERSUS RECONCILING   PAYMENTS.   ONE OF THE NUANCES TO THE INCOME  TAX IT MAKES IT SO VOLATILE IS   THAT IN ANY GIVEN FISCAL YEAR,   THREE DIFFERENT TAX YEARS   TRAVERSE THOSE COLLECTIONS.   BUT WE DO HAVE HISTORICAL SHARES  WE ARE APPLYING TO THESE   ADDITIONS AND INCREASES.   TAKE A LOOK AT WHEN THIS   HAPPENED IN PRIOR INSTANCES AND   SEE IF THAT HOLDS.    WE ALSO LOOK AT THIS   MATHEMATICALLY FROM A   PROBABILISTIC PERSPECTIVE.   IT IS NOT JUST THE UNDERSTAND   PROBABILITIES OF WHAT WE WILL   RECEIVE.   KNOWING THAT IT WILL OF COURSE   NOT BE 100%.   BUT WE WANT TO ESTIMATE IT IN   THE MOST CONSERVATIVE WAY.   WERE WE ARE ENSURING WE ARE   GENTLY BEATING THAT IN TERMS OF   THE REALIZED VALUE.   >> MY CONCERN IS, IF YOU ARE NOT  BEING CHARGED INTEREST, FOR   BEING LATE ON YOUR TAX PAYMENT,   BECAUSE YOU COULD NOT HAVE   POSSIBLY KNOWN YOU WERE BEING   CHARGED A TAX YOU'RE NOT EVEN   AWARE OF THAT DID NOT EXIST WHEN  IT WAS SO, WHICH IS THE NATURE   OF A RETROACTIVE TAX WHICH I AM   PARTICULARLY CONCERNED ABOUT.   AND AS NOTED BY COUNCILMEMBER   KATZ, A DISPROPORTIONATE AMOUNT   OF THE ACTUAL REVENUE WE WILL   RECEIVE ARE FROM HIGHER WAGE AND  HIGHER INCOME EARNERS THAT ARE   NONWAGE OR PRIMARILY NONWAGE   EARNERS.   THE OVERWHELMING, THE 50 PEOPLE,  FAMILIES THAT WERE REFERENCE,   THE OVERWHELMING AMOUNT NOT THE   EXCLUSIVE AMOUNT OF THEIR INCOME  DOES NOT COME FROM A W-TWO.    THEY ARE NOT A PAYROLL EMPLOYEE   THEY ARE NOT A PAYROLL EMPLOYEE.  THOSE ARE ALREADY TAXPAYERS THAT  ARE PAYING ESTIMATED TAXES,   ADMITTEDLY.   BUT THEY ARE FILING THEIR TAXES   IN OCTOBER ALMOST ACROSS THE   BOARD IF NOT EXCLUSIVELY.   THIS IS THE NATURE OF WHAT THE   MAJOR FLUCTUATIONS IN OUR   REVENUES TEND TO BE ON THOSE   NOVEMBER AND EARLY THE NEXT   CALENDAR YEAR DISTRIBUTIONS.   THAT IS WHERE WE SEE THE HUGE   FLUCTUATION, THIS IS WHAT   HAPPENED WHEN THE FEDERAL TAX   CHANGE IN THE STATE WHERE ACTIVE  WITH PASTOR ENTITIES AND WE HAD   150 MILLION, APPROXIMATELY, IN   CHANGES JUST BASED ON A CHANGE   OF TIMING.   OR SOMEBODY WENT FROM A BUSINESS  ON A CALENDAR YEAR TIMING TO   TAKE A TAX DEDUCTION BASED ON   THE TAXES.   YOU PAY VERSUS PERSONAL.   AND THAT SHIFT IN TIMING HAD A   MASSIVE IMPACT ON THE COUNTY IN   TERMS OF THE TIMING.   IT DID NOT CHANGE HOW MUCH MONEY  WAS MAKING EITHER.   THAT JUST WAS EXCLUSIVELY BASED   ON TIMING.   AND THAT WAS A SMALLER DYNAMIC   THAN THIS COULD POTENTIALLY BE.   BECAUSE IT WAS A MORE    TRADITIONAL, YOU MAKE THE TIMING   OF WHEN YOU PAY YOUR TAXES AND   HOW YOU PAY YOUR TAXES.   IT WAS JUST CHANGING THE   SCHEDULE NOT THE AMOUNT.   SO I AM A LITTLE CONCERNED, IN   PARTICULAR, IF THERE IS NO   PENALTY.   WHY WOULD SOMEBODY PAY ESTIMATED  TAXES.   AND PROVIDE AN INTEREST FREE   LOAN TO THE COUNTY AND STATE    GOVERNMENT.   WHEN THEY DON'T PAY A PENALTY IF  THEY WAIT UNTIL APRIL OR   OCTOBER.   THE LIKELIHOOD IS THEY ARE NOT   GOING TO DO THAT.   PARTICULARLY THE MOST   SOPHISTICATED PEOPLE ARE HIRING   PROFESSIONAL TAX LAWYERS AND   ACCOUNTANTS TO HELP THEM.   THAT IS DIFFERENT THAN A WAGE   EARNER THAT IS FILING THEIR   INCOME TAXES ARE USING ONLINE   TAX SERVICE.   AND MAY BE DOING WHAT IS   EASIEST, WHAT IS SIMPLEST BUT   MAYBE NOT WHAT IS MOST   FINANCIALLY ADVANTAGEOUS TO   THEM.    >> Nancy Feldman: I WOULD LIKE   TO GET BACK TO YOU ON HOW NARROW  OR HOW BROAD THE NO PENALTY   PIECE OF THIS IS.   IF YOUR INCOME IS TAX THAT IS   OWED, IT IS FROM MANY OTHER   SOURCES OF INCOME OTHER THAN   ASSOCIATED WITH JUST THE PIECE   OF OUR INCOME TAX, THAT MAY NOT   HAVE BEEN PAID IN ESTIMATED   TAXES.   THERE IS A LOT OF MOVING PARTS   IN TERMS OF PENALTIES.   THAT WOULD LIKE TO TAKE A LOOK   AT AND GET BACK TO YOU ON.   >> Andrew Friedson: THAT WOULD   BE HELPFUL.   >> OUR HIGHEST INCOME PAYERS   WHETHER 50 OR 100 OR WHOEVER IT   MAY BE.   THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT HAS   PENALTIES AND THEY HAVE TO PAY.   THEIR TAXES, AND IN THEORY   DESPITE THE FACT WE DON'T ALWAYS  SEE THIS, EVEN IF YOU FILE FOR   AN EXTENSION YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO  HAVE PAID YOUR BEST ESTIMATE IN   APRIL.   IT DOES NOT ALWAYS WORK OUT THAT  WAY.   BUT YOU CAN EXTEND THE FILING OF  YOUR TAX FORM UNTIL NOVEMBER BUT  YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO.   >> Andrew Friedson: I JUST WANT   TO CLARIFY IT IS NOT THAT THEY   WILL NOT BE FILING TIMELY.   THE QUESTION IS WHETHER THEY   WILL HAVE PROPERLY ESTIMATED, OR  PREPAID THE RIGHT AMOUNT.   THAT ONLY AFFECTS THE STATE.    IT IS NOT LIKE I EXPECT SOMEBODY  TO SAY THEY ARE LETTING ME NOT   HAVE TO PAY INTEREST, I WILL NOT   PAY ANY TAXES AT ALL.   I THINK THE LIKELIHOOD THEY WILL  FILE THE TAXES LIKE THEY ALWAYS   DO WITH A TAX PROFESSIONAL.   YOU KNOW, TAX LAWYER AND   ACCOUNTANTS AND THEY WILL FIGURE  OUT THE SOPHISTICATED TAX   RETURNS THAT HAVE K-1 AND ALL   KINDS OF DIFFERENT MOVING PARTS.  THE QUESTION IS, THE STATE AND   COUNTY TAX PIECE.   AND THE ADDITIONAL AMOUNT THAT   WOULD BE CALCULATED.   AND THE ANSWER TO THAT IF IT IS   A HIGH ENOUGH AMOUNT, WHICH IN   THIS CASE IT PROBABLY IS   DISPROPORTIONATE SHARE.   THERE TAX PROFESSIONALS AND   ACCOUNTANTS WILL SAY YOU'RE   GOING TO OH BECAUSE OF THIS   RETROACTIVE TAX INCREASE.   AN EXTRA X AMOUNT YOU WILL OH   BASED ON THE STATE CHANGES THIS   AMOUNT.   YOU DON'T HAVE TO PAY IT FOR   ANOTHER NINE MONTHS.   YOU DON'T HAVE TO PAY IT X   PERIOD OF TIME.   WE WILL SEND YOU A REMINDER,   THAT IS WHAT YOU PAY US FOR.   TO SUBMIT THAT PAYMENT AT THE   LATEST POSSIBLE MOMENT.   THAT YOU CAN TO BE TIMELY AND   NOT PAY ANY INTEREST.   THE CHALLENGE FOR US IS GOING TO  BE AT THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE IS   SUGGESTING, WHICH IT SEEMS LIKE   HE HAS, THAT WE WILL GET THOSE   PAYMENTS EARLIER.   AND THE COUNCIL THEN MAKES A   DETERMINATION BASED OFF OF THAT.  AND THAT DOESN'T PAN OUT.   THAT MIGHT SOLVE A STRUCTURAL   ISSUE DOWN THE ROAD OR MIGHT BE   ABLE TO BE RECONCILED AT SOME   POINT.   BUT AT WHAT POINT?   AND WE WILL NOT KNOW THE   DIFFERENCE.   BECAUSE IT IS NOT LIKE EACH   RETURN COMES TO US IN THE   DISTRIBUTION COMES TO US AND WE   KNOW WHICH TAXPAYER IT IS UNDER   WHICH CIRCUMSTANCE.   IT IS NOT A GUESS BECAUSE YOU   ARE ALL PROFESSIONALS AND DO A   TERRIFIC JOB, AND I'M VERY PROUD  OF THE REVENUE ESTIMATING GROUP   WHICH IS THE BILL I PUT FORWARD   TO BRING EVERYBODY TOGETHER TO    TALK ABOUT THESE ISSUES AND USE   BEST PRACTICES WE SEE AT THE   STATE.   BUT THERE IS NO WAY OF YOU   KNOWING THAT.   YOU TO ANALYZE IT AND MAKE YOUR   BEST DETERMINATION OF WHAT YOU   THINK LIKELY IS HAPPENING.   SO IT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO LOOK   AT WHAT YOUR ASSUMPTIONS ARE FOR  WAGE VERSUS NONWAGE.   IT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO LOOK AT   THE TIMING TO LOOK AT WHAT THE   PENALTY AND INTEREST PIECE IS AT  THE STATE.   NOW THAT IMPACTS THE COUNTY.   BECAUSE I DO THINK THAT IS A   SIGNIFICANT IMPACT ON WHEN THE   REVENUE WE RECEIVE.   ALL OF THIS SPEAKS TO HOW   COMPLICATED THIS IS.   HOW HARD IT IS TO WEIGH   SOMETHING AS, LOCATED AS THIS IN  TWO WEEKS.   WHICH IS WHAT WE ARE TALKING   ABOUT HERE.   AND A POTENTIAL PUBLIC HEARING   WE WILL HAVE THE DAY BEFORE WE   HAVE TO MAKE A FINAL DECISION.   I'VE CONCERNS ABOUT IT NO MATTER  WHEN.   BUT THAT JUST AS SIGNIFICANT   ADDITIONAL COMPLICATIONS.   AT I WANT TO BE CAREFUL   REGARDLESS OF WHERE THE FINAL   DECISION IS ON THIS.   OBVIOUSLY MY POSITION HAS BEEN   CLEAR FROM THE BEGINNING.   THAT WE ARE NOT MAKING REVENUE   ASSUMPTIONS THAT ARE NOT REAL   AND WE WORK TOGETHER TO FIGURE   OUT EXACTLY HOW THAT WORKS.   AND YOU ARE MOVING QUICKLY IN   REAL TIME TRYING TO RESPOND AS   BEST YOU CAN WITH EXTREMELY   LIMITED INFORMATION.   SO THAT IT IS IN NO WAY A   CRITICISM OF THE GREAT WORK YOU   ARE DOING.   BUT IT IS JUST IMPOSSIBLE TO   KNOW SOME OF THE POTENTIAL   DYNAMICS HERE THAT ARE KNOWN   UNKNOWNS.   WE DON'T EVEN KNOW THE UNKNOWN   UNKNOWNS.   WHICH CONCERNS ME QUITE A BIT.   IF YOU GET BACK TO US ON THIS   THAT WILL BE HELPFUL.   THE OTHER QUESTION IS A   14.3 MILLION.   WHICH IS REVENUE WE WILL RECEIVE  BASED ON THE STATE CHANGES, THAT  IS A REVENUE POSITIVE.   THE PROPERTY TAX INCREASE, WHAT   IS THE STATUS QUO INCREASE BASED  ON THE ASSESSMENTS?   OF HOW MUCH THE PROPERTY TAX   REVENUES HAVE GONE UP BASED ON   THE ASSESSABLE BASE GOING UP?   KEEPING THE RIGHT THE SAME, THE   WEIGHTED AVERAGE RIGHT STAYS THE  SAME AS WE DECIDED EARLIER.   WHAT IS THE REVENUE, YEAR OVER   YEAR REVENUE INCREASE AS A   RESULT?   >> Gene Smith: I DON'T HAVE A   FULL VALUE BUT WHAT I CAN TELL   YOU OF THE EXECUTIVE ESTIMATION   TO KEEP THE WEIGHTED RIGHT THE   SAME AND TO KEEP ITOC.   THE SAME.   THE NET NEGATIVE IS   $56.6 MILLION.   IF YOU AT 14.3 TO THAT, SUBTRACT  14.3 FROM THAT THERE IS STILL A   HOLE.   WE CAN GET THE FULL REVENUE   VALUE.   >> Andrew Friedson: THAT IS   ASSUMING A SIGNIFICANT INCREASE   IN REVENUES.   SO WHAT I AM TRYING TO SAY IS   TAKE A STEP BACK AND LOOK AT   WHAT ARE THE ADDITIONAL REVENUES  WE ARE RECEIVING WE DON'T   INCREASE TAX RATES, WHETHER   INCOME TAX OR PROPERTY TAX?   THE REALITY IS THE COUNTY IS   RECEIVING SUBSTANTIAL ADDITIONAL  REVENUE YEAR-OVER-YEAR.   BASED ON ASSESSMENTS GOING UP.   NOW RESIDENTS ARE PAYING THAT,   WE ARE VIEWING IT AS THAT IS   STATUS QUO WE ARE ONLY   INCREASING IT BASED ON IF WE   INCREASE THE RIGHT, BUT THAT IS   NOT THE REALITY.   THAT IS HOW YOU HAVE PROPERTY   TAX WORKS.   AND I THINK IT IS THE BEST   SYSTEM WE HAVE GOT.   BUT I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT AS   PART OF THE CONTEXT TO SAY THE   CONVERSATION HAS SEEMED TO   DEVOLVE INTO YEAR OVER YEAR IS   ZERO SO YOU HAVE TO INCREASE THE  RIGHT TO GET ABOVE ZERO.   THAT IS NOT THE REALITY.   THE REALITY IT IS GONE OF $150   MILLION I WANT THE EXACT NUMBER.  AND SHARE IT.   ASSUMING BASED ON THE ASSESSABLE  BASE.   DON'T LOOK AT THE OTHER MOVING   PARTS.   EVERY SUPPOSE WILL IS INCREDIBLY  COMPLICATED DIE TO ANOTHER THING  TO ANOTHER THING.   AND INCREASE THE PROPERTY TAX.   WE CAN INCREASE THE ITOC AND   THAT WILL HAVE THIS INCREASE BUT  DON'T LOOK AT THE FEES BECAUSE   THAT IS SEPARATE ALTHOUGH IT IS   IN THE SAME PROPERTY TAX BILL.   NOW WE HAVE AN INCOME TAX BEEN   PROPOSED BUT WE ARE INCREASING   THE INCOME TAX RETROACTIVELY.   BUT DON'T WORRY, WE WILL ALSO   SIGNIFICANTLY INCREASE THE   WORKING FAMILIES INCOME   SUPPLEMENT.   SO THOSE ARE TWO SEPARATE   DECISIONS BUT THEY HAVE BEEN   PRESENTED AS BEING TIED TOGETHER  EVEN THOUGH 87% OF THE PEOPLE   WHO ARE PURPORTED TO BENEFIT   FROM THAT DON'T BENEFIT AT ALL.   AND WILL BE SIGNIFICANTLY   IMPACTED.   I JUST THINK TO TAKE A STEP BACK  AND UNWIND HOW THIS HAS BEEN    MESSAGE.   AND PACKAGE.   AND LOOK AT THE HEALTHY NUMBERS   I THINK WILL BE HELPFUL FOR THE   CONTEXT FOR THE DECISIONS WE   HAVE BEFORE US.   THANK YOU.   >> Kate Stewart: THANK YOU,   GIVEN THAT CONVERSATION IT WOULD  BE HELPFUL MR. SMITH TO ADD TO   THE PACKET ON MONDAY.   UNLESS IT IS IN HERE, WHAT THE   PROJECTIONS ARE ON THE INCOME   TAX INCREASE.   LOOKING OUT.   I THINK, MS. FELDMAN, YOU ALL   ARE ESTIMATING 75 MILLION THIS   YEAR.   BUT IF WE DID THE PROPOSAL THE   COUNTY EXECUTIVE SENT OVER   RETROACTIVELY.   EXCUSE ME, TO 3.3 THERE WOULD BE  LESS IN FY 27.   I THINK THAT IS REALLY IMPORTANT  FOR US TO CONSIDER.   BECAUSE, AGAIN, OUT THE COUNTY   EXECUTIVE TRANSMITTED THIS TO US  WAS WE ARE TAKING OFF THE TABLE   THE PROPERTY TAX AND REPLACING   IT WITH THE INCOME TAX.   I THINK WE HAVE TO BE VERY   CAREFUL.   IF WE ARE ESTIMATING 75 MILLION.  AND WE KNOW WE HAD A GREAT   CONVERSATION ON HOW THAT IS   VOLATILE.   BUT THEN TO THE NEXT FISCAL   YEAR.   WE ARE ESTIMATING AN ACTUAL   DECREASE OF THAT.   IF WE ARE SAYING THIS FISCAL   YEAR WE ARE TRYING TO CLOSE THE   GAP, IF YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I AM  SAYING.   WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THIS BUDGET.   BUT WE HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT   YEAR'S BUDGET AND THE BUDGET   AFTER THAT.   BECAUSE MANY OF THE THINGS THAT   HAVE BEEN REQUESTED TO ADD TO   THE BUDGET ARE ONGOING EXPENSES.  SO IF WE ARE ADDING ONGOING   EXPENSES THIS YEAR.   AND THE ASSUMPTION THAT THE   AMENDMENTS WERE SENT OVER TO US.  THE INCREASE IN THE INCOME TAX   WAS CLOSE THE GAP THAT WE NEED   TO.   THAT IS PROBABLY NOT THE CASE   THEN THE FOLLOWING YEAR.   I THINK WE NEED TO BE REALLY   CAREFUL ABOUT LOOKING AT THAT.   AND I HAVE ONE OTHER THING BUT   IT LEFT MY BRAIN.   I AM SURE I WILL COME UP WITH IT  AGAIN.   BUT I DO THINK AS WE ARE HAVING   THIS CONVERSATION.   IT IS BEEN A GOOD ONE IN   THINKING ABOUT IN THE SAME WAY.   NOT DOING THE RETROACTIVE BUT   LOOKING AT POTENTIALLY   INCREASING THE PROPERTY TAX.   THIS YEAR AND THE OUT YEARS AS   WELL.   BECAUSE WE NEED TO LOOK AT, YOU   KNOW, SUSTAINABILITY MOVING   FORWARD.   AND KNOWING THAT THE NEED ON OUR  SERVICES HERE IN THE COUNTY   GIVEN THE CHAOS COMING OUT THE   FEDERAL ADMINISTRATION IS JUST   GOING TO INCREASE OVER THE NEXT   FEW YEARS.   AND WE ALL HAVE SEEN THE REPORTS  ON WHAT IS GOING ON WITH THE   ECONOMY.   THAT NEED IS GOING TO GROW.   SO I THINK, THERE IS NOT A LOT   HERE.   AND I JUST WANT TO THANK YOU MR.  SMITH AND FINANCE AND OMP FOR   ALL YOUR WORK.   WE ALL GOT NEWS AFTER THE   SESSION ENDED IN ANNAPOLIS THIS   WAS A POTENTIAL.    YOU ALL HAVE DONE A REALLY   TERRIFIC JOB ON CRUNCHING   NUMBERS, GETTING US INFORMATION   SO THAT WE COULD REALLY WAY THIS  MOVING FORWARD.   APPRECIATE THAT.   AND THEN THE PIECE THAT IS   RELATED TO THIS.   WE WILL BRING BACK AND TALK   ABOUT THE WORKING FAMILIES   INCOME SUPPLEMENT.   THIS COMMITTEE HAD ALREADY   REVIEWED THIS, KIND OF QUICKLY   LAST WEEK IN A WORK SESSION.   AND SINCE WE HAVE RECEIVED THE   COUNTY EXECUTIVE'S AMENDMENT, WE  WANTED TO BRING IT BACK AGAIN TO  BE ABLE TO WALK THROUGH WHAT THE  COUNTY EXECUTIVE IS PROPOSING.   AND DO A DEEPER DIVE AND THANK   YOU AGAIN FOR THIS EXCELLENT   PACKET TO MAKE SURE WE    UNDERSTAND WHO IS ABLE - HE   QUALIFIES FOR THIS.   AS WE TALKED ABOUT WITH THE   INCOME TAX IN THE PACKET PRIOR   TO THIS, AND PRACTICE WERE THE   FOLKS WHO ARE FILING FOR THIS   AND RECEIVING THIS CREDIT.   SO TURN IT OVER TO YOU.   >> Mansi Gosalia: GOOD MORNING,   WE ARE HERE TODAY TO TALK ABOUT   THE WORKING FAMILIES INCOME   SUPPLEMENT, NDA.   SORRY ABOUT THAT, I AM VERY   SHORT.   SO THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE   MARCH 14TH RECOMMENDED BUDGET   INCLUDED AN INCREASE OF   3.1 MILLION FOR THE WORKING   FAMILY INCOME SUPPLEMENT NDA TO   REFLECT INCREASED COST DUE TO   ACTUAL STATE BUILDING.   HOWEVER, ON APRIL 24, 2025, THE   COUNTY EXECUTIVE SUBMITTED MMS   TO THE FY 26 OPERATING BUDGETS.   THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE RECOMMENDED  INCREASING THE COUNTIES MATCH OF  THE EIT FROM 56% TO 65%.   A PROPOSAL THAT IS 5,021,000 TO   THE FY 26 COST.   BELOW IN YOUR PACKET ON PAGE 1   YOU WILL FIND TABLE 1.   WHICH DETAILS THE FY 25 APPROVED  AMOUNT.   THE FY 26 AND THE RECOMMENDED   AMOUNT FOR FY 26.   FOR THE INCOME SUPPLEMENT, TO   HAVE THE REFUNDABLE TAX CREDIT   OR THE EIT SEE INTO BENEFIT   LOW-INCOME WORKING FAMILIES IN   THE COUNTY.   THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT   AUTHORIZES THE FEDERAL EITC FOR   WORKING PEOPLE WITH LOW TO   MODERATE INCOME.   ELIGIBILITY TO QUALIFY FOR THE   COUNTY WFIS  IS THE ABILITY TO   QUALIFY FOR THE FEDERAL EITC.   TABLE 2 OF PAGE 2 OF YOUR   PACKAGES THE MAXIM ADJUSTED   GROWTH INCOME A FILER CAN HAVE   IN ORDER TO BE ELIGIBLE FOR THE   FEDERAL EITC AND THE TEXTURE OF   2024.   SEVERAL STATES INCLUDING   MARYLAND, PROVIDE STATE TAX   CREDITS FOR RESIDENTS TO RECEIVE  THE FEDERAL EITC.   MARYLAND ALSO PROVIDE REFUNDS   TO ELIGIBLE RESIDENTS IF THER  EITC EXCEEDS THEIR STATE TAX   LIABILITY.   THE STATE ADMINISTERS THE COUNTY  REFUND SO THE COUNTY PROVIDES   FUNDING TO THE STATE FOR ANY   COUNTY RELATED REFUNDS.   AND THE RELATED ADMINISTERED OF   EXPENSES.   IN FY 22 THE COUNTY INCREASED   THE WFIS TO ACCOUNT FOR CHANGES   MADE BY THE STATE DURING THE   2021 GENERAL ASSEMBLY.   AND THOSE CHANGES INCLUDED THE   ELIGIBILITY THROUGH THE BIL  SB-218  THE REFUND FOR THOSE FOR  THE TAXPAYER IDENTIFICATION   NUMBER OR ITIN.   THEY AMENDED THE COUNTY LAW IN   ORDER TO ENSURE ALL RESIDENTS   COULD RECEIVE THE BENEFIT OF THE  STATES EXPANSION OF THIS   PROGRAM.   AND COUNTY LAW OUTLINES A COUNTY  MATCH OF THE STATE EITC.   REFUND.   IT ALLOWS THE COUNTY COUNCIL TO   ESTABLISH A DIFFERENT AMOUNT AS   PART OF THE ANNUAL   APPROPRIATIONS.   MONTGOMERY COUNTY, HOWEVER, IS   ONE OF THE FEW LOCAL   JURISDICTIONS IN THE COUNTY THAT  OFFERS A SUPPLEMENTAL TO THE   STATE EITC.   THE CURRENT COUNTY FISH IS ACE   50% OF THE STATE EITC FOR   ELIGIBLE COUNTY RECORDS AND HAS   BEEN SINCE FY 24.   THE STATE MATCH IS CURRENTLY 50%  OF THE EITC OR 45% IF THEY   RECEIVE A REFUND.   CURRENTLY THE TOTAL COMBINED   COUNTY AND STATE MATCH IS ABOUT   70% OF THE FEDERAL EITC TABLE 4    OF PAGE 4 OF YOUR PACKET SHOWS   THE HISTORY OF THE COUNTIES WFIS  MATCH,  AND FROM FY 2000.   OF NOTE THE COUNTY UTILIZED 21   MILLION OF THE COUNTIES   ALLOTMENT FOR THE AMERICAN   RESCUE PLAN ACT OR THE ARPA TO   EXPAND THE SUPPLEMENT IN FY 22   AND FY 23.   DURING THE FY 24 TO PROCESS THE   COUNTY EXECUTIVE RECOMMENDED AND  COUNCIL APPROVED REDUCING THE   MATCH TO 56% SINCE ARPA MONEY   WAS NO LONGER AVAILABLE.   TABLE 3 ON PAGE 3 OF YOUR PACKET  SHOWS THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE   RECOMMENDED BUDGET CHANGES FOR   THE WORKING FAMILIES INCOME   SUPPLEMENT NDA.   IS REMOVED IS THE PACKET I WILL   GO THROUGH EACH IN GREATER   DETAIL.   YOU COULD ALSO FEEL FREE TO TAKE  UPON SECTOR EACH ONE AND THAT   WORKS BETTER FOR YOU.   STARTING FIRST WITH THE   INCREASED COST DUE TO ACTUAL   STATE BUILDING AND THE AMOUNT OF  $3,179,321.   THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE MARCH 14TH   BUDGET RECOMMENDED AN INCREASE   OF $3,179,321 FOR ACTUAL STATE  BILLING. THIS INCREASE IS TO   REALIGN ANNUAL APPROPRIATIONS   WITH ACTUAL EXPENSES INVOICED BY  THE STATE.   FINANCE STAFF NOTES THAT ACTUAL   WFIS EXPENDITURES HAVE EXCEED   THE APPROPRIATION AMOUNT IN   RECENT  FISCAL YEARS, REQUIRING THE   LIFTING OF BUDGET CONTROLS   DURING THE FISCAL YEAR AND END   OF YEAR TRANSFERS OR  SUPPLEMENTAL APPROPRIATIONS.   I CAN PAUSE THERE IF THERE ARE   ANY QUESTIONS.   >> Kate Stewart: A NEED   QUESTIONS ON THAT PIECE?   I THINK THERE IS NO OBJECTION   FROM THE COMMITTEE TO MOVE   FORWARD WITH THAT PIECE.   AND THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE   RECOMMENDED BUDGET.   >> Mansi Gosalia: GREAT, NEXT IS  THE PROPOSED AMENDMENT: INCREASE  FUNDS TO THE WORKING FAMILIES   INCOME SUPPLEMENT  NDA, $5,031,000.   ON APRIL 24, 2025, THE COUNTY   EXECUTIVE TRANSMITTED HIS   AMENDMENTS TO THE FY 26   OPERATING BUDGET.   AND THIS AMENDMENT WAS PROPOSED   TO THE WORKING FAMILIES INCOME   SUPPLEMENT NDA INCREASE FUNDING   BY THAT ADDITIONAL 5,031,000 AND  EARNED INCOME TAX CREDIT OR EITC  ADJUSTMENT.   THE INCREASE FUNDS ARE IN    ADJUSTMENT TO THE AMOUNT THE   COUNTY MATCHES AT THE STATE   REFUNDABLE E EITC.  THE PROPOSED AMENDMENT WOULD   INCREASE THE MATCH FROM 56% TO   65%.    THIS ADJUSTMENT INCREASES THE  TAX CREDIT FOR QUALIFIED   FAMILIES AND PROVIDES ADDITIONAL  PROGRESSIVITY TO THE COUNTY TAX   STRUCTURE.  TABLE 3 DETAILS THE FUNDING    HISTORY FOR THE WORKING FAMILIES  INCOME SUPPLEMENT NDA. WITH THE  COUNTY EXECUTIVE'S ORIGINAL   RECOMMENDED MATCH OF 56%, THE   AVERAGE EITC AN ELIGIBLE FILER   WOULD  RECEIVE IS $567.42. WITH THE   PROPOSED APRIL 24TH AMENDMENT TO  INCREASE THE MATCH TO 65%, THE   AVERAGE EITC IS $658.88.   THE RESULTING INCREASE IS $91.46  PER RECIPIENT, ON AVERAGE.   LASTLY, ON PAGE 5 YOU WILL SEE A  TABLE THAT SUMMARIZES THE   COMMITTEE DECISION POINTS FOR   THE WFIS BASED ON THE EXECUTIVE   MARCH 24TH AS WELL AS THE APRIL   25 RECOMMENDED AMENDMENT.   THE COMMITTEE COULD CHOOSE TO   SET THE COUNTY MATCH FOR THE  WFIS AS A DIFFERENT PRESENTED   THAN RECOMMENDED BY THE   EXECUTIVE.   EACH 1% CHANGE FOR THAT FOR THE   WFIS MATCH IS 559,000  WEATHER    1% UP OR 1% DOWN.   >> Kate Stewart: THANK YOU FOR   THAT AND THANK YOU FOR UPDATING   THE PACKET FROM LAST TIME WE   LOOKED AT IT.   I THINK UNDERSTANDING   ELIGIBILITY CRITERIA IS REALLY   IMPORTANT FOR US.   AS WE ARE LOOKING AT IT AND   THINKING ABOUT WHO FILES FOR   THIS?   WHO IS ELIGIBLE FOR IT?   AS WE MOVE FORWARD AND HOW THIS   IS LINKED WITH THE POTENTIAL   INCOME TAX INCREASE.   AND I JUST WANTED TO GO BACK TO   MR. SMITH, THE PACKET YOU DID.   AND THE PERCENTAGE YOU SAID OF   WHAT WAS IT?   20% OF FOLKS.   YOU WANT TO REPEAT THAT?   I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE   UNDERSTAND WHO IS ELIGIBLE AND   TO HIS FILING FOR THESE TAX   CREDITS?   >> Gene Smith: SURE, WE WILL    PAIR HOURS TWO PACKET TOGETHER   AND CONGRATS TO MS GOSALIA.  . FOR DOING A GREAT PACKET.   BASED ON THE IRS PACKET LESS   THAN 15% RECEIVE AN EITC REFUND.  AS MENTIONED THERE ARE SOME   ELIGIBLE TO THE WORKING FAMILY   INCOME SUPPLEMENT THAT WOULD NOT  RECEIVE THE FEDERAL EITC WITH   RESTRICTIONS BUT THE STATE LIVES  OF THOSE RESTRICTIONS DURING   COVID.   SO USING THE FINANCE ESTIMATES   OF 62,000 GETTING THAT BENEFIT   IN 2022.   THAT IS ABOUT 22% OF THOSE WHO   FILED LESS THAN 50,000 AGI.   KNOWING THERE ARE MACHINATIONS   AND TAX YEAR 23 AND 24, I DID AN  AGGREGATE OF ABOUT 20% RECEIVE   THIS BENEFIT.   FILED LESS THAN 50,000 AGI.   SO YES, I WOULD SAY THE CONVERSE  OF THAT IS 80% FILE LESS THAN   50,000 AGI DO NOT RECEIVE THOSE   REFUNDS.   THAT IS NOT AND THEY DON'T   RECEIVE THE EIT SEE AS A TAX   CREDIT OR ABLECC SEE AS A TAX   CREDIT OR ABLEC SEE AS A TAX    CREDIT OR ABLEC AS A TAX   CREDIT OR ABLECAS A TAX CREDIT  OR ABLEC TO REDUCE THEIR TAXABLE  WE ARE ONLY TALKING ABOUT THE   REFUND BECAUSE IT IS WORKING   FAMILY INCOME TO REDUCE THEIR T   WE ARE ONLY TALKING ABOUT THE   REFUND BECAUSE IT IS WORKING   FAMILY INCOME SUPPLEMENT ONLY   PROVIDES CASH TO THOSE WHO   RECEIVE A REFUND.   >> Kate Stewart: IT GETS A BIT   CONFUSING.   SO THAT IS WHY - IT IS REALLY   HELPFUL TO LOOK AT THE CROSSOVER  OF THE TWO PACKETS.   AND JUST I WILL SEE IF MY   COLLEAGUES HAVE ANY QUESTIONS.   BECAUSE MEMBER PRESENT?   >> Andrew Friedson: I THINK IT   IS GREAT THE COUNTY DOES THIS.   I THINK IT IS GREAT THAT DURING   THE PANDEMIC WE WERE ABLE TO   EXPAND THE FEDERAL DOLLARS.   THE EITC IS ONE OF THE MOST   PROVEN POVERTY FIGHTING TOOLS   FOR WORKING FAMILIES THAT EXIST.  CREDIT TO STEVE SULLIVAN WHEN HE  WAS A COUNCIL NUMBER I THINK IN   1999 IS WHEN THIS FIRST STARTED.  SO IT HAS BEEN AROUND FOR A LONG  TIME.   25, 26 YEARS.   I AM MUCH MORE INTERESTED IN   FOCUSING ON THE 80%.   I THINK THAT SHOULD BE OUR   RELENTLESS FOCUS.   I THINK WE HAVE GOTTEN CAUGHT UP  TO A CERTAIN EXTENT,   UNDERSTANDABLY, IN ADJUSTING THE  NUMBERS.   AND NOT FOCUSED ENOUGH ON DOING   THE OUTREACH AND FOCUSING ON   WHITE OTHER 80% OF PEOPLE WHO   CLEARLY WOULD WANT TO GET THIS   BENEFIT NOT RECEIVING IT?   WHY ARE THEY FILING IT?   WHY DON'T THEY KNOW ABOUT IT?   WHAT OBSTACLES ARE IN THE WAY TO  HELP THEM TO ACCESS IT?   THIS WAS PAIRED WITH THE INCOME   TAX I REALLY AM UNCOMFORTABLE   WITH HOW THIS IS BEING PROPOSED    IN THAT WAY.   BUT I THINK THE BIGGER QUESTION   THAT WE HAVE IT SHOULD BE   FOCUSED MORE ON INCREASING THE   RIGHT FOR A VERY SMALL   PROPORTION OF THE ELIGIBLE   FOLKS?   YOU ARE RECEIVING THIS BENEFIT,   OR SHOULD WE TAKE A STEP BACK   AND WHO ARE THE FOLKS WERE   RECEIVING IT WHO SHOULD BE   RECEIVING IT.   AND HOW DO WE MAKE SURE THEY GET  IT?   AND TIMMY THAT IS HARDER WORK.   BUT I THINK THAT IS THE MORE   CRITICAL WORK.   BECAUSE WE ARE MISSING A LOT OF   FOLKS, CLEARLY.   >> COUNCILMEMBER KATZ?   >> Sidney Katz: I THINK THAT IS   A VERY GOOD POINT.   I HAVE OFTEN BEEN TOLD THAT   SOMEONE WHO HAS A MINIMUM   SALARY, WHEN THEY GET A COUPLE   HUNDRED DOLLARS, THEY SPEND IT.   SOMEBODY WHO IS, YOU KNOW, A   MULTIMILLION THEY HAD A COUPLE   MILLION DOLLARS IT IS A NICE   DINNER BUT THEY WILL NOT BE   SPENDING IT.   THEY SAY, AND THEY SHOULD, AND   NOT SUGGESTING PEOPLE SHOULD NOT  SAVE.   BUT IF, TO YOUR POINT, IF WE CAN  MAKE CERTAIN THE PEOPLE ARE   DESERVING OF THE MONIES.   IF THEY GET THAT MONEY THAT IT   HELPS THEIR ECONOMY BECAUSE IT   WILL SHOW IN AIR ECONOMY.   I THINK THAT IS THE MOST   NECESSARY PART OF WHAT THIS   SHOULD BE.   THE WHOLE CONCEPT IS WANT TO   HELP PEOPLE AND WE NEED TO HELP   THEM HELP THEMSELVES, THANK YOU.  >> THANK YOU.   I APOLOGIZE.   THE FINANCE AND OMB WANTED TO   JUMP IN BEFORE WE STARTED ASKING  QUESTIONS.   ANYTHING YOU WANT TO ADD THERE?   WELL I DON'T KNOW IF OUR   COMMITTEE GENERATES THE MOST OL   REPORTS BUT I FEEL LIKE   SOMETIMES WE DO.   BECAUSE I DO THINK TO GO TO   COUNCILMEMBER FRIEDSON AND KATZ   POINTS HERE, YOU KNOW, GIVEN THE  SIGNIFICANT NUMBER.   AND I THINK WE CAN ALL GUESS AT   SOME OF THE REASONS WHY GIVEN   THAT SOMEBODY HAS TO TO FILE FOR  THIS.   BE ELIGIBLE AND FILED.   WHEN WE STARTED THIS    CONVERSATION I EVEN GOT ON THE   WEBSITE AND STARTED LOOKING AT   IT AND FILLING OUT THE FORMS.   AND IT IS NOT EASY IT IS   COMPLICATED.   DOING A DEEPER DIVE AND   UNDERSTANDING WHAT ARE THE   BARRIERS AND HOW WE CAN ADDRESS   THAT, I THINK AS COUNCILMEMBER   FRIEDSON SAID I AM PROUD OF THE   FACT THAT IN MONTGOMERY COUNTY   WE DO THIS.   WE ARE ONE OF THE ONLY OR VERY   FEW COUNTIES THAT DO THIS.   I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING WE   SHOULD BE PROUD OF AND WE CAN   BUILD ON SO WE CAN REACH OUT TO   OL ALL ANOTHER PROJECT TO THEIR   LIST FROM THE GEO COMMITTEE.   BUT I THINK THIS IS A GOOD   FOUNDATION.   LOOKING AT THIS AND THE INCOME   TAX PROPOSAL LIKE WE DID THIS   AFTERNOON.   AND WILL LAY THE FOUNDATION FOR   THE COUNCIL DISCUSSION WILL   START THIS DISCUSSION ON MONDAY   WITH THE COUNCIL AND CONTINUE   IT.   THANK YOU VERY MUCH AGAIN FOR AN  EXCELLENT PACKET AND FOR ALL THE  WORK AND I THINK THAT IS OUR   LAST ITEM.   TODAY FOR US, SO RIGHT NOW - FOR  RIGHT NOW.   AND WE HAVE A TRANSFORMATION,   ENVIRONMENT GEO COMMITTEE THIS   AFTERNOON.   BUT FOR THIS SESSION WE ARE   ADJOURNEnty executive leaders a   these kids"}]