BC Legislature Live Stream - Douglas Fir Room
Legislative Assembly of British Columbia
[{'start': '643.308', 'end': '647.279', 'text': '>> Chair: GOOD AFTERNOON.  I CALL THE COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY  SECTION A BACK TO ORDER.  WE ARE MEETING TO CONSIDERING  THE BUDGETTEST MATES OF THE  MINISTRY WATER LAND AND RESOURCE  STEWARDSHIP.  I RECOGNISE THE MINISTER TO MOVE  THE VOTE.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): SUM NOT EXCEEDING  $220,818,000 GRANTED TO MAJESTY  31st MARCH OF 2026.  >> Chair: THANK YOU, MINISTER.  CHAIR RECOGNISE THE MEMBER.  >> THANK YOU FOR THE DETAILS  ANSWER.  I WILL LEAVE THE REST OF THOSE  QUESTIONS TO BE RESPONDED IN  WRITING.  I WASN\'T ABLE TO TRANSCRIBE THEM  FAST ENOUGH.  I WAS LOOKING FOR A REGIONAL  BREAKDOWN AS WELL.  WE DIDN\'T GET INTO THE REGIONS.  THERE WAS ANOTHER 10 OR 12  QUESTIONS THAT I WILL WAIT FOR  THE WRITTEN RESPONSES ON.  I WILL READ THEM AT THE END IF  NECESSARY.  I WANTED TO MOVE INTO WATER.  OBVIOUSLY, IT\'S THE FIRST THING  IN THE MINISTRY.  WE\'LL START THERE.  I APPRECIATE THE STAFF JOINED  US.  I WANT TO TALK ABOUT LICENSING  AND GROUND WATER REGISTRATION TO  START.  I\'M CURIOUS ON HOW MANY WATER  LICENSES WERE ISSUED IN THE  24-25 SEASON AND HOW MANY WE  EXPECT ARE GOING TO BE PROCESSED  THIS YEAR? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU TO THE  M.L.A. FROM  BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN.  I READ THOSE NUMBERS IN A  CONFUSING WAY.  I APOLOGISE.  WE\'LL GET THOSE TO YOU QUICKLY.  IN TERMS OF THE QUESTION, IN  2024, THERE WERE 514 WATER  LICENSED APPLICATIONS RECEIVED  BY THE PROVINCE.  213 APPLICATIONS DECISIONS WERE  MADE.  THAT RESULTED IN THE ISSUANCE OF  NEW WATER LICENSES.  TEN LICENSE REFUSAL DECISIONS  WERE MADE.  THAT WAS IN 2024.  IN 2025, SO FAR, 132 WATER  LICENSE APPLICATIONS HAVE BEEN  RECEIVED AS OF APRIL 28th OF  THIS YEAR.  WE PROJECT THAT BETWEEN 500 AND  550 APPLICATIONS MAY BE RECEIVED  BY THE END OF 2025.  53 APPLICATION DECISIONS HAVE  BEEN MADE AS OF APRIL 28th OF  THIS YEAR.  THAT RESULTED IN THE ISSUANCE OF  NEW WATER LICENSES.  WE PROJECT BETWEEN 200 AND 230  NEW WATER LICENSES MAY BE ISSUED  BY THE END OF 2025.  SO FAR, THERE HAVE BEEN THREE  LICENSE REFUSAL DECISIONS.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): FOR  2024, YOU SAID 514 APPLICATIONS,  213 PROCESSED.  WHAT\'S THE DIFFERENCE?  ONES IN BACKLOG DIDN\'T MEET  REQUIREMENTS OR DENIED? >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource, Fisheries): OF  THE 213 APPLICATIONS THAT WERE  RESULTED IN ISSUANCE OF NEW  WATER LICENSES IN 2024, HOW WE  MAKE THOSE DECISIONS IS WE  SEARCH FOR THE PRIORITY WATER  LICENSES.  FOR EXAMPLE, ONE THAT SUPPORT  HUMAN HEALTH AND SAFETY OR IF  THEY ARE RELATED TO HOMES OR  HOME BUILDING OR KEY PRIORITIESS  WELL FOR THE PROVINCE.  THEY MAY BE EITHER IN THE  BACKLOG OR NEW APPLICATIONS.  BUT THE ONES THAT WE DON\'T GET  TOO, THE 514 THAT YOU REFERRED  TO, THOSE JUST REMAIN IN THE  QUEUE. >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): THAT  WAS MY NEXT QUESTION.  HOW MANY IN THE QUEUE? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, SO MUCH,  CHAIR.  CURRENTLY, IN THE QUEUE FROM  2024, 291 APPLICATIONS.  SO FAR IN 2025, 76 APPLICATIONS  FOR A TOTAL OF 367 IN THE QUEUE  FOR 2024-2025.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): DO  WE HAVE IN THE QUEUE PRIOR TO  THAT?  IS EVERYTHING CAUGHT UP TO 2024? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU FOR THE  QUESTION.  TOTAL WATER LICENSES IN THE  QUEUE AS OF FEBRUARY 2025 IS  2045.  THAT INCLUDES THE 367 THAT WE  JUST PREVIOUSLY MENTIONED FOR  THE LAST TWO YEARS.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson  (CPBC): PRETTY SIGNIFICANT  NUMBER.  LOT MORE THAN I WAS EXPECTING.  HOW MANY STAFF DO WE HAVE THAT  ARE WORKING ON THESE  APPLICATIONS?  I\'M ASSUMING THAT WE\'RE STARTING  AT THE OLDEST AND WORKING OUR  WAY FORWARD?  WHAT IS THE PROSS TO GETTING  THROUGH THAT BACKLOG?  WHAT IS THE AVERAGE TIME IT\'S  TAKING TO PROCESS THOSE  APPLICATIONS? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource, Fishe  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, CHAIR.  I WILL START WITH THIS.  WE CURRENTLY HAVE 101 WATER  AUTHORIZATIONS STAFF.  THEY WORK ON PERMITTING AND  OTHER RELATED WORK.  THAT INCLUDES MONITORING AND  DROUGHT AND THAT SORT OF DUTIES.  IN THE LAST YEAR, WE ACTUALLY  WERE ABLE TO PROCESS 139  APPLICATIONS FASTER THAN THEY  CAME IN.  WE\'RE MAKING A BIT OF PROGRESS.  NOT A LOT.  THE AVERAGE PROCESSING DAYS IT  TAKES TO PROCESS ONE WATER  APPLICATION AVERAGE IS ABOUT 344  DAYS.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): IS  THERE A MAXIMUM LENGTH OF TIME  WHERE THOSE APPLICATIONS FALL  OFF THE RADAR OR DO THEY STAY ON  THE BOOKS FOREVER?  WHAT IS COMMUNICATED AROUND THE  TIME FRAME AND EXPECTATIONS WHEN  THEY MAKE THE APPLICATIONS? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, CHAIR.  THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTION.  THE WATER APPLICATIONS DO NOT  EXPIRE.  THEY STAY IN QUEUE.  AS WE MENTIONED EARLIER, WE TRY  TO SURFACE THOSE APPLICATIONS  THAT ARE URGENT.  ONES THAT ARE FACING DROUGHT  CONDITIONS, HEALTH ISSUES,  HOUSING, THE GOVERNMENT, THE  ONES THAT THE GOVERNMENT ISSUES  AS PRIORITY BASKETS.  WHEN THE APPLICATIONS FIRST COME  IN, WE COMMUNICATE CLEARLY TO  THE APPLICANT THAT OUR TURNOVER  TIMES ARE NOT SUFFICIENT.  WE ALSO GIVE THEM AN ESTIMATED  TIME THAT WE THINK THEIR  APPLICATION WILL BE IN QUEUE  WHEN WE NEAR THE END OF THAT  ESTIMATED TIME THAT WE THINK  THEIR APPLICATION IS GOING TO BE  IN QUEUE.  WE CONTACT THEM TO EITHER SAY  WE\'RE ON SCHEDULE OR WE\'RE  BEHIND SCHEDULE AND THEN WE GIVE  THEM AN UPDATED ESTIMATED  TIMELINE IF THAT\'S WHAT WE NEED  TO DO.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson  (CPBC): THANK YOU, MADAME CH  CHAIR.  HOW MANY -- WHAT IS OUR ESTIMATE  ON HOW MANY GROUND WATER USERS  NOW ARE UNLICENSED IN THE  PROVINCE? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, CHAIR.  APOLOGIES FOR THE DELAY.  IN 2016 WHEN THE WATER  SUSTAINABILITY ACT CAME IN,  THERE WAS AN ESTIMATE THAT THERE  WAS PROBABLY ABOUT 20,000  UNLICENSED USERS IN THIS  PROVINCE.  SINCE THEN, WE HAVE HAD -- THERE  ARE 7867 EXISTING WATER USERS  THAT HAVE APPLIED SINCE 2016  THAT ARE STILL WAITING IN THE  QUEUE TO GET PERMITTED.  THE DELAY WAS CAUSED BY -- WE\'RE  TRYING TO FIGURE OUT TO GIVE YOU  A NUMBER OF HOW MANY NEW  UNLICENSED GROUND WATER USERS  THERE ARE AND WE EITHER DON\'T  HAVE THAT NUMBER OR COULDN\'T  FIND IT.  IF WE FIND IT.  WE\'LL GIVE IT TO YOU.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson  (CPBC): THOSE 7867 ARE IN A  DIFFERENT QUEUE OR THEY PART OF  THE ORIGINAL QUEUE? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, CHAIR.  WE FOUND SOME UPDATED NUMBERS,  WHICH I WILL READ TO YOU.  AS OF OCTOBER 2022, WE HAD 5829  EXISTING USE GROUND WATER  APPLICATIONS.  IN FEBRUARY OF 2025, WE HAD 4006  FEATURE.   -- WE\'RE ABLE TO PROCESS  1132 IN THAT TIME.  WE HAD IN OCTOBER 2022, WE HAD  -- YOU KNOW WHAT, I WILL NOT  READ THIS OUT.  I\'M NOT SURE IT\'S GOING TO  ANSWER YOUR QUESTION.  IT\'S A DIFFERENT CATEGORY FOR  GROUND WATER APPLICATIONS.  IN OCTOBER 2022, WE HAD 43 NEW  GROUND WATER APPLICATIONS.  AS OF FEBRUARY 2025, WE HAD 33.  WE REDUCED THAT NUMBER BY TEN. >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): SORT  OF ANSWERED THE QUESTION.  DO WE STILL HAVE 7867 EXISTING  WATER USERS THAT ARE WAITING TO  BE LICENSED? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): HOPEFULLY, THIS  PROVIDES CLARITY.  AS OF FEBRUARY 2025 OUT OF THAT  NUMBER THAT WE GAVE YOU EARLIER,  7867, WE CURRENTLY HAVE 4697  STILL WAITING IN THE QUEUE.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): WE  HAVE 2000 IN ONE QUEUE AND WE  HAVE 4700 APPLICATIONS IN  ANOTHER QUEUE.  AM I NOT UNDERSTANDING THE  QUEUES? >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, CHAIR.  HOPEFULLY THIS CLEARS IT UP.  OUR ENTIRE WATER CASE.  WE HAVE DIFFERENT KIND OF SUB  QUEUES.  EXISTING WATER, PREVIOUS  EXISTING WATER, NEW GROUND WATER  APPLICATIONS, TOTAL WATER  APPLICATIONS.  THE BREAKDOWN OF OUR ENTIRE  WATER APPLICATION CASE LOAD OF  FEBRUARY OF THIS YEAR, 2025,  STILL WAITING IN QUEUE EXISTING  USE GROUND WATER, 4697.  SECTION 11 APPLICATIONS WHICH  ARE CHANGES IN AND AROUND A  STREAM, WE HAVE 500  APPLICATIONS.  NEW GROUND WATER APPLICATIONS,  WE HAVE 33.  SECTION 10 APPLICATIONS WE HAVE  130 WATER LICENSE APPLICATIONS,  WE HAVE 2045.  ABANDONMENTS, WE HAVE 209.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): DO  YOU HAVE THE TOTAL OR YOU GOING  TO MAKE ME DO THE MATH?  [ LAUGHTER ]  >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THE TOTAL IS 7614.  >> Chair: BOUNDAChair: BOUNDARYN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): I  APPRECIATE THAT.  IT WILL BE GOOD TO HAVE THAT --  IF I CAN GET A COPY OF THAT WHEN  WE\'RE DONE.  SWITCHING TO WATER RENTS.  DO WE HAVE A MECHANISM TO AUDIT  THE USAGE VERSUS WHAT IS  LICENSED? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): BASICALLY, OUR  THERE ARE TWO MECHANISMS TO  DETERMINE THE USAGE OF WATER IN  THIS PROVINCE.  IS WATER MONITORING AND ALSO THE  NUMBER OF LICENSE APPLICATIONS.  PRIOR TO 2016, WE HAD NO WAY TO  MEASURE GROUND WATER USE AT ALL.  THE CHALLENGE NOW THAT WE STILL  HAVE WE DO ISSUE A LICENSE FOR  FARM, FOR EXAMPLE, THAT GIVES  THEM A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF WATER  USE PER DAY.  WE DON\'T KNOW IF THEY HIT THAT  TARGET.  THEY COULD CONSISTENTLY COME  UNDER IT.  WE HAVE NO WAY OF DETERMINING  THAT.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): WE  ALSO DON\'T KNOW IF THEY ARE  PULLING MORE THAN THAT.  LOOKING AT THE NUMBERS THAT YOU  PROVIDED PREVIOUSLY, LOOKS LIKE  MORE THAN HALF OF WATER USERS  ARE AREN\'T EVEN IN THE  APPLICATION PROCESS BY THE  ESTIMATION OF 2000 WE THINK THAT  ARE THERE.  ALMOST 8000 THAT REGISTERED AS  EXISTING USERS.  THERE\'S A LARGE SEGMENT THAT WE  DON\'T KNOW IF OUR NUMBER  ESTIMATE WAS A VALID NUMBER.  WHEN WE\'RE MAKING THOSE  DECISIONS AROUND THE WATER, HOW  DO YOU MAKE THAT -- WHAT MATRIX  DO YOU HAVE FOR THOSE DECISIONS  WHEN YOU DON\'T KNOW IF THEY ARE  TAKING MORE THAN OR LESS THAN  THEY WERE?  WE KNOW WE HAVE WATER LICENSES  THAT POSSIBLY AREN\'T DRAWING  ANYTHING.  WE PROBABLY HAVE WATER LICENSES  THAT ARE DRAWING MORE.  HOW DO WE -- WHAT THE MATRIX FOR  DECISION-MAKING?  ARE THOSE WATER LICENSES  IMPACTING FUTURE WATER LICENSES  APPLICATIONS?  WE DON\'T KNOW -- ARE WE BEING  TOO CONSERVATIVE OR NOT  CONSERVATIVE ENOUGH?  I DON\'T KNOW IF THE QUESTION WAS  CLEAR THERE. >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, CHAIR.  THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTION.  I WILL ANSWER YOUR FIRST  QUESTION.  ARE WE TOO CONSERVATIVE OR NOT  CONSERVATIVE ENOUGH.  WE THOUGH THAT\'S NOT A POLITICAL  QUESTION.  I WILL ANSWER IT BY SAYING WE  ERR ON THE SIDE OF CAUTION.  WE ASSUME THAT EVERY LICENSE IS  USING ITS MAX CAPABILITY.  THE WATER TEAM DOES HAVE A  MATRIX.  THEY BASICALLY LOOK AT A  HOLISTIC VIEW.  WITH MONITORING AND THE NUMBER  OF LICENSES, GIVEN WE LOOK TO  SEE HOW MUCH WATER IS AVAILABLE  WHAT GROUND WATER EXISTS, WHAT  WELLS ARE IN THE AREA WHAT THE  KNOWN VOLUMES ARE IN THE AREA.  WE LOOK AT CONNECTIVITY BETWEEN  SURFACE AND GROUND WATER.  OVERALL, I THINK I CAN SAY WITH  SOME CERTAINTY THAT WE ARE IN A  MUCH BETTER POSITION IN TERMS OF  OUR WATER THAN WE WERE IN 2016.  WE STILL HAVE A LONG WAY TO GO.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson  (CPBC): THANK YOU.  I HAVE MORE QUESTIONS ON THAT.  FOR THE SAKE OF TIME, I\'M GOING  TO MOVE ON.  DROUGHT.  SINCE WE WENT THERE.  HOW ARE USERS PRIORITIZED DURING  A DROUGHT DECLARATION AND HOW IS  THAT COMMUNICATED? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, CHAIR.  THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTION.  OUR PRIORITY AND TIMES OF  DROUGHT IS ALWAYS HUMAN HEALTH  AND HUMAN SAFETY.  DRINKING WATER IS ALWAYS OUR TOP  PRIORITY.  WE TAKE SEVERAL STEPS.  FIRST, WE SET VOLUNTARY  GUIDELINES.  YOU SEE THOSE WATER RESTRICTIONS  THAT LOCAL GOVERNMENTS DO EVERY  YEAR.  THOSE VOLUNTARY GUIDELINES ARE  NOT EXPECTED OF INDIVIDUALS BUT  ALSO OF INDUSTRY.  THOSE ARE WAYS TO BE COGNIZANT  THAT WE\'RE HEADING IN THE SUMMER  WE ASK PEOPLE TO DO A LIST OF  THING TO REDUCE THEIR WATER USE.  IN TERMS OF UNLICENSED USERS, WE  CAN USE SOMETHING CALLED  GRADUATED ENFORCEMENT WHERE WE  CAN SEND OUT NATURAL RESOURCE  OFFICERS TO LET PEOPLE KNOW  WE\'RE HEADING INTO DROUGHT.  REMIND THEM IF THEY DON\'T HAVE A  LICENSE, THEY ARE A NEW USER,  THEY NEED TO WAIT TO APPLY FOR A  LICENSE.  IN TERMS OF LICENSED USERS, WE  HAVE DROUGHT TABLES AND THOSE  ARE USED AT THE LOCAL LEVEL AND  WE KEEP PEOPLE INFORMED ABOUT  WHAT THE WATER LEVELS LOOK LIKE  AND WHAT THE DROUGHT TABLES LOOK  LIKE.  I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT THIS  WASN\'T MY MANDATE LETTER BY THE  PREMIER TO WORK WITH COMMUNITIES  AFFECTED BY DROUGHT OR EXPECTED  TO FACE WATER SHORTAGES AND TO  SUPPORT COMMUNITY-BASED PRIORITY  SETTING.  THIS IS FOR WATER.  OUR JOB IS TO ENSURE BETTER  COORDINATION BETWEEN WATER  REGULATORS IN ADVANCE TO SUPPORT  EFFECTIVE RESPONSE DURING AN  EMERGENCY.  WE KNOW THOSE DECISIONS ARE BEST  MADE AT A LOCAL LEVEL AT LOCAL  WATER TABLES WHERE LOCAL  GOVERNMENTS AND COMMUNITY AND  SMALL BUSINESS AND AGRICULTURE  COME TOGETHER TO MAKE THOSE  CHOICES ABOUT THE PRIORITY IN  THEIR COMMUNITY FOR WATER USES  IN TIMINGS OF DROUGHT.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson  (CPBC): THANK YOU FOR THAT.  I THINK THERE\'S SOME TOUGH  DECISIONS THAT WILL BE COMING UP  VERSUS AGRICULTURE AND TOURISM.  I LIVE IN THE  BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN.  THE FIRST IN TIME MODEL WAS  SHARED NEED TO REGISTER WITH  THAT MANY APPLICATIONS STILL  SITTING IN THE QUEUE, WHAT  HAPPENS WITH THE ONES THAT NEVER  DID?  THE FIRST IN TIME ALL GOT  LETTERS SAYING THEY NEEDED TO  CURTAIL.  THE PEOPLE NEVER REGISTERED DID  NOT GET THE LETTERS.  WHAT IS THE ENFORCEMENT OR WHAT  IS THE STRATEGY FOR THE NEVER  DID GROUP? >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource, Fisheries): I  WANT TO THANK YOU YOUR RIDING  BOUNDARY SIMILKAMEEN.  IT\'S ONE OF THE LARGEST RIDING  IN THIS PROVINCE.  SECOND, THE SECOND MOST  BEAUTIFUL.  I HEAR YOU.  WHEN I GO AND VISIT MY PARENTS  WHO LIVE IN THE OKANAGAN, IT\'S  STRESSFUL THERE IN THE SUMMER.  YOU CAN SIT AND WATCH THE  LIGHTNING STRIKES HIT THE  MOUNTAIN.  WE POTENTIALLY IN A DROUGHT  POSITION.  IT\'S SO TOUGH.  ALSO IN 2021 IN MY RIDING OF THE  SUNSHINE COAST, WE LITERALLY HAD  TO DECIDE TO TURN OFF WATER TO  THE FARMERS.  THAT IS SOMETHING IN A TEMPERATE  RAIN FOREST.  WE NEVER THOUGHT WE HAD TO FACE  THAT CHOICE.  IN YOUR QUESTION THOSE FIRST IN  TIME, FIRST IN RIGHT USERS WHO  APPLY TO GET LICENSES VERSUS  THOSE WHO NEVER DID, ALL WE WANT  TO DO IS GET THEM TO APPLY FOR  LICENSE.  ALL WE WANT TO DO IS MONITOR THE  WATER.  OUR BIGGEST KIND OF -- WHAT WE  DO IS REALLY TRYING TO TALK TO  DIFFERENT ORGANISATIONS,  AGRICULTURE ORGANISATIONS,  INDUSTRY ORGANISATIONS,  INDIVIDUALS WHO REALLY REALLY  WORK ON THEM.  SINCE 2016, WE\'VE BEEN DOING  THIS TO GET THEM TO APPLY FOR A  LICENSE.  AT THE END OF THE DAY, ALL WE  WANT TO DO IS BE ABLE TO MONITOR  THE AMOUNT OF WATER IN A  WATERSHED SO WE CAN ENSURE WE  HAVE ENOUGH WATER FOR EVERYONE.  FOR THOSE WHO NEVER DID AS YOU  SUGGESTED, THERE IS GRADUATED  ENFORCEMENT OR GRADUATED  COMPLIANCE THAT\'S WHERE WE SEND  NATURAL RESOURCES OFFICERS OUT  TO TALK TO FOLKS.  WHEN WE GET INTO TIMES OF  DROUGHT, PEOPLE GET REALLY  SCARED.  IF THEY NOTICED A NEIGHBOUR WHO  DOESN\'T HAVE A LICENSE USING  WATER, WE GET PHONE CALLS.  WE TEND TO GET A LIST OF THOSE  FOLKS WHO HAVEN\'T APPLIED FOR  LICENSES.  WE\'LL FOR AND TALK TO THEM AND  ENCOURAGE THEM TO APPLY AND LET  THEM KNOW WHAT POTENTIALLY THE  PENALTIES ARE THAT CAN BE  APPLIED TO THEM FOR NOT  COMPLYING AND NOT GETTING A  LICENSE AND ILLEGALLY USING THE  WATER. >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson  (CPBC): THANK YOU.  I THINK THAT\'S PRETTY MUCH WHAT  I ASSUMED THAT WE WERE COUNTING  ON NEIGHBOURS TO --  [ INDISCERNIBLE ]  WITH THE QUEUE THAT WE SAW THE  OTHER CHALLENGE IS THAT WE HAVE  7000 PEOPLE TO GET THROUGH.  WHAT ARE WE DOING TO RAMP UP  STAFF IF WE ARE ALSO DOING  EDUCATION AND OUTREACH TO TRY TO  GET PEOPLE TO REGISTER?  WE\'RE SENDING NATURAL RESOURCES  OFFICERS OUT TO ENFORCE.  IT TAKES A YEAR TO GET AN  APPLICATION.  WE HAVE OF QUEUE OF 7000.  I\'M A LITTLE CONFUSED ON THE  PRIORITY OF GETTING THOSE PEOPLE  TO APPLY WHEN WE\'RE NOT  PROCESSING THE APPLICATIONS. >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource, Fisheries): I  WANT TO THANK YOU FOR THIS  QUESTION.  THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE  GRAPPLE WITH ALL THE TIME.  IN FACT, PERMITTING AND SPEEDING  UP PERMITTING IS SOMETHING THAT  IS ALSO IN MY MANDATE LETTER.  THIS IS SOMETHING THAT OUR TEAM  TAKES INCREDIBLY SERIOUSLY.  YOUR QUESTION WAS WHAT ARE WE  DOING TO RAMP UP STAFF TO TRY  AND SPEED UP THE PROCESS OF THE  APPLICATIONS AND APPROVING MOST  OF THE APPLICATIONS.  AGAIN, IT\'S NOT JUST SPEEDING UP  THE APPLICATION PROCESS.  ALTHOUGH, THAT\'S A BIG PART OF  OUR PORTFOLIO WHAT WE\'RE  DEDICATED TO DO AND WHAT IS IN  OUR MANDATE.  IT IS ALSO WORKING WITH FOLKS TO  TEACH THEM ABOUT DROUGHT AND  DOING A HUGE EDUCATION CAMPAIGN  AND SENDING PEOPLE LETTERS WHEN  WE\'RE IN TIMES OF DROUGHT, RURAL  COMMUNITIES TO SAY WE\'RE HEADED  IN A DROUGHT.  WE HAVE A WEBSITE THAT\'S  PUBLICLY AVAILABLE FOR DROUGHT  TABLES.  WE HAVE AT THE RIVER FORECAST  CENTRE TO LOOK AT THOSE TYPES OF  NUMBERS AND WATER PREDICTIONS AS  WELL.  BUT, I THINK THAT SINCE 2016, WE  ARE WORKING ON PERMITTING  REFORM.  THE STATUS QUO ISN\'T ACCEPTABLE.  WE UNDERSTAND THAT.  WE KNOW THAT IS OBVIOUS TO YOU.  WE ARE GOING TO DO OUR VERY BEST  AND WE\'RE ENACTING A LOT OF  THINGS TO MAKE PERMITTING MORE  EFFICIENT AND SPEED UP THE  PROCESS.  >> ChaChair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEN  >> Donegal Wilson  (CPBC): WHILE I APPRECIATE  WE\'RE TRYING AND WE SEE THE  PROBLEM, I ALSO A FINANCE  PERSON.  WE LOOK AT THE BUDGET, THERE\'S  NO MORE MONEY.  HOW ARE WE RAMPING UNAND WHERE  ARE WE FINDING THOSE  EFFICIENCIES TO MEET THAT  BACKLOG? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource, Fisheries): IN  2022, THE TREASURY BOARD  APPROVED $77.83 MILLION TO  ADVANCE PERMITTING.  THAT IS THE EQUIVALENT 203  F.T.E.s ACROSS SEVEN NATURAL  RESOURCE MINISTRIES.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): IN  2022, THE $77.83 MILLION WAS  ANNOUNCED ACROSS MANY  MINISTRIES.  HOW MUCH IS LEFT IN SPECIFIC TO  THIS MINISTRY FOR THE  IMPLEMENTATION OF THE WATER  LICENSING? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU FOR THE  QUESTION.  OF THAT $77.83 MILLION,  $77.883 MILLION CAME TO WALRUS.  -- OH, SORRY.  YES OF THAT $27.139 MILLION CAME  TO WALRUS.  THE FUNDING WAS DISPERSED ACROSS  ALL SEVEN OF THOSE MINISTRIES TO  FILL KEY POSITIONS IN  PERMITTING.  THEY WEREN\'T SPECIFICALLY GOING  TO DIFFERENT THINGS LIKE THE  PERMITTING FOR HOUSING OR  OTHERS.  THEY WERE ADDRESSING SYSTEMIC  CHANGE FOR PERMITTING IN  GENERAL.  TO TAKE A HOLISTIC VIEW ACROSS  MINISTRIES TO TARGET BACKLOG IN  PRIORITY AREAS LIKE WE MENTIONED  EARLIER IN HOUSING IN MANY CASES  AREAS THAT WERE IN TROUT AND  LOOK FOR LONG-TERM SUSTAINABLE  PERMITTING SOLUTIONS.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): WE  HAD $27 MILLION TO IMPROVE  PERMITTING BUT WE\'RE STILL 7000  IN BACKLOGS AND THE ACTUAL  IMPROVEMENTS MADE AREN\'T  ADEQUATE.  IS THAT FUNDING CONTINUING IN  THIS FISCAL YEAR AND HOW MUCH  WILL YOU HAVE IN THIS FISCAL  YEAR? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU FOR THE  QUESTION.  HOPEFULLY, ADD SOME CLARITY.  ALL OF THE POSITIONS THAT I  MANIPULATIONED EARLIER REMAIN --  MENTIONED EARLIER REMAIN FILL.  I WANTED TO CLARIFY, BECAUSE  YOUR QUESTION WAS SPECIFICALLY  ABOUT WATER LICENSES.  BUT THAT MONEY WAS USED TO  CREATE PERMITTING EFFICIENCIES.  I WANTED TO GIVE YOU A COUPLE OF  EXAMPLES TO LET YOU KNOW WHAT  THE PRIORITIES HAVE BEEN AND  WHAT WE\'RE WORKING ON.  FOR EXAMPLE, IN HOUSING, WE\'VE  CLEARED THE BACKLOG.  IT USED TO TAKE 257 DAYS FOR AN  APPLICATION TO GO THROUGH.  IT NOW TAKES 108 DAYS, THAT\'S A  58% REDUCTION IN THE TIME IT  TAKES.  A SMALL EXAMPLE KIND OF RELATED  TO WATER.  AREA PROTECTION REGULATION.  WE CLEARED THAT BACKLOG, FOR  EXAMPLE.  IT USED TO TAKE UP TO A YEAR FOR  PERMITTING AND WE CAN DO A  30-DAY TURN AROUND TIME NOW.  WE\'RE MOVING IN THE RIGHT  DIRECTION.  WE KNOW THE STATUS QUO ISN\'T SAT  -- SATISFACTORY.  WE\'RE CONTINUING TO WORK HARD.  >> Chair: THANK YOU.  I AM GOING TO PASS IT OVER TO MY  COLLEAGUE WHO HAS A COUPLE OF  QUESTIONS.  THEN I WILL CONTINUE.  >> Chair: DELTA SOUTH.  >> THANK YOU, MADAME CHAIR,  THROUGH YOU TO THE MINISTER, IT  WAS YOUR GOVERNMENT THAT BROUGHT  IN THE AGRICULTURAL LAND RESERVE  IN 1973.  THE AGRICULTURE MINISTER\'S  MANDATE LETTER TALKS ABOUT  ACCESS TO FARMING CAREER FOR  ASPIRING FARMERSES TALKS ABOUT  EXPANDING AFFORDABILITY IN  PROVINCE TO FIND WAYS TO CONTROL  COSTS.  STRENGTHEN OUR REGIONAL FOOD  SYSTEMS BY SUPPORTING FARMING,  EXPANDING LOCAL FOOD PROCESSING  AND WORKING WITH FOOD AND  BEVERAGE PRODUCERS WHO HAVE BEEN  IMPACTED BY WEATHER RELATED CROP  LOSSES.  IT GOES TON IT TALK ABOUT THE  VERY IMPORTANCE IN THE  MINISTRY\'S MANDATE LETTER ON THE  CONTINUE SITUATION OF THE PUBLIC  SUPPORT INCLUDING PROTECTION OF  B.C. FAMILIES FROM FOOD PRICE  SHOCKS AND PROMOTION OF  FINANCIAL SUCCESS.  WORK WITH FARMERS AND FOOD  PROCESSERS THROUGHOUT THE  PROVINCE.  I BROUGHT THIS UP BEFORE, MADAME  CHAIR, ABOUT THIS WONDERFUL  150 ACRES PRIME AGRICULTURE ON  VANCOUVER ISLAND.  THIS FARMLAND SUPPORTED HUNDREDS  OF LOCAL LIVESTOCK IN THAT BAY  AREA ON DAIRY FARMS.  IT FARM WAS OWNED ABOUT I THE --  OWNED BY THE FAMILY.  THE NATURE TRUST OF B.C. IN  COLLABORATION WITH DUCKS  UNLIMITED PURCHASED 150 ACRES OF  PRIME FARMLAND.  NOW UNBELIEVABLY, THE NATURE  TRUST OF B.C. MADE APPLICATION  TO REMOVE THIS PIECE OF LAND  FROM ACTIVE AGRICULTURE BY  BREACHING THE DIKE THAT GOES  AROUND THE FARMLAND SO THAT  OCEAN WATER ROAR IN AND FLOOD  150 ACRES OF PRIME FARMLAND.  AT THE END OF THE ROAD, OTHER  FARMERERS RESIDENTS THERE WHO HE  WELLS.  THERE\'S HUGE AQUIFERS THERE.  IF THE SALT WATER IS LOUD  ALLOWED TO RUSH IN AND DESTROY  THE FARMLAND.  IT WILL DESTROY THE AQUIFER AND  INFECT THE AQUIFER WITH SALT  WATER WHICH WILL AFFECT ALL THE  DRINKING WATER FOR MANY  RESIDENTS.  I CAN GO ON, ACTIVE EARTH,  HYDROLOGIST DID AN IN-DEPTH  STUDY.  STATED THAT THIS -- WITHOUT A  DOUBT CONTAINMENT OF THE AQUIFER  HAVE A DEVASTATING EFFECT ON ALL  THE WELLS IN THE AREA INCLUDING  THE KIT WELL THAT SERVES CLOSE  TO 1000 HOMES, THE SEASIDE  VILLAGE AND BAY AREA.  THEY WERE TOLD TO CEASE FARMING  AS NATURE\'S TRUST OF B.C. PLAN  TO BREACH THE DIKE AND FLOOD THE  ENTIRE A.L.R. DESIGNATED  FARMLAND WITH TITLE C WATER.  MADAME CHAIR, BELIEVE IT OR NOT  ON FEBRUARY 28, 2024 THE  APPLICATION TO REMOVE THE DIKE  AND FLOOD THIS PIECE OF FARMLAND  WAS MADE BY JESSE PATTERSON FROM  ACTUAL GOVERNMENT OF MINISTRY,  WATER AND RESOURCE STEWARDSHIP.  HE ACTUALLY AS A MEMBER OF  GOVERNMENT BUREAUCRACY, WAS THE  ONE MAKING THE APPLICATION ON  BEBEHALF OF THE N.D.P. GOVERNMET  TO FLOOD THIS FARMLAND.  I FIND THIS INCREDIBLE.  WILL THE MINISTER OF WATER, LAND  AND STEWARDSHIP SUPPORT THE  FLOODING AND ULTIMATE  DESTRUCTION OF THIS VALUABLE 150  ACHERS OF FARMLAND? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, CHAIR.  I WANT TO SAY THAT OUR TEAM IS  VERY AWARE OF THE POTENTIAL SALT  WATER IMPACTS ON DRIVEWAY WATER.  -- DRINKING WATER.  WE HAVE BEEN DOING TESTING AND  PRELIMINARY TECHNICIANI --  PRELIMINARY TESTING THE SALT  WATER HAS NO EFFECT ON THE  DRINKING WATER.  THAT IS STILL PRELIMINARY.  SECONDLY, I KNOW YOU\'RE AWARE OF  THIS ISSUE.  THERE ARE KIND OF OUR TWO STEPS  HERE.  THE FIRST STEP IS THAT THIS  DECISION IS CURRENTLY BEFORE THE  AGRICULTURAL LAND COMMISSION.  THIS IS THEIR RESPONSIBILITY  UNDER THEIR TENURE.  SECONDLY, WALRUS IS RESPONSIBLE  FOR THE DECOMMISSIONING OF THE  DAMS.  ONCE A DECISION IS MADE BY THE  A.L.C.  THEN OUR STATUTORY DECISION  MAKER WILL LOOK AT DEMISSIONING  THE DAMS.  >> Chair: DELTA SOUTH.  >> Ian Paton (CPBC): THANK YOU  FOR THAT ANSWER.  MY QUESTION THROUGH YOU MADAME  CHAIR TO THE MINISTER.  WOULD YOU NOT FIND IT A CONFLICT  OF INTEREST THAT A MEMBER OF  YOUR OWN BUREAUCRACY OF MINISTRY  OF WATER, LAND AND RESOURCE  STEWARDSHIP SHOULD BE MAKING AN  APPLICATION TO REMOVE THIS  FARMLAND FROM THE A.L.R. TO A  THIRD PARTY TRIBUNAL WHICH IS  KNOWN AS THE AGRICULTURAL LAND  COMMISSION? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU SO MUCH  FOR THE QUESTION.  IN TERMS YOU HAVE YOUR FIRST  QUESTION.  NO, IT IS NOT A CONFLICT.  IN TERMS -- EXPANDING ON YOUR  OTHER QUESTION A LITTLE BIT.  WE\'RE FIGHTING CLIMATE CHANGE  RIGHT NOW.  WHAT WE\'RE TRYING TO DO IS MAKE  LOCAL AREAS HELP HAVE A SAY IN  GOVERNING THEIR OWN WATERSHED  AND WATER SECURITY.  WATER IS SUCH AN INCREDIBLY  IMPORTANT NATURAL RESOURCE FOR  US RIGHT NOW.  ONE KIND OF SUCCESS STORY IN THE  AREA THAT YOU\'RE TALKING ABOUT  IS THE RESTORATION PROJECT.  THIS IS A CLASS 1 ACTUARY  PROJECT THAT HAS INCREDIBLY HIGH  BIOLOGICAL SIGNIFICANCE.  IT\'S NOT JUST FOR THAT AREA BUT  ALL ACROSS THE PROVINCE.  IT\'S A PARTNERSHIP BETWEEN THE  COWICHAN TRIBE AND FEDERAL  AGENCIES TO RESTORE THE HEALTH  OF THE ACTUARY.  THAT\'S TO DO SEVERAL THINGS.  TO CONSERVE THE BIODIVERSITY,  PROTECT THE LOCAL COMMUNITY,  REVITALIZE INDIGENOUS FOOD  SYSTEM.  THIS WILL BENEFIT EVERYBODY.  EVERYBODY IN THE AREA.  THIS IS -- WE\'RE IN A TIME OF  CLIMATE CHANGE AND A LOT OF  PEOPLE WOULD SAY CLIMATE CRISIS.  IT IS ALL OF OUR  RESPONSIBILITIES TO DO  EVERYTHING WE CAN TO ENSURE THAT  WE RESTORE THE BIOLOGICAL  INTEGRITY OF OUR PROVINCE.  >> Chair: DELTA SOUTH.  >> Ian Paton (CPBC): THANK  YOU, MADAME CHAIR.  I WOULD SUGGEST THAT ALL THE  PEOPLE SITTING ON THAT SIDE OF  THAT DESK HAS NOT EVEN SEEN THIS  PROPERTY.  I\'VE SEEN THIS PROPERTY MANY  TIMES.  25 YEARS AGO, THEY TRIED AN  EXPERIMENT EXACTLY AS YOU\'RE  TALKING ABOUT.  THEY FLOODED A PORTION OF THE  FARMLAND TO THIS DAY, YOU CAN  LOOK AT IT.  IF ANYBODY GOES THERE FROM  BUREAUCRACY TO SEE THE FENCE  POST OF THE FARM THAT USED TO BE  THERE.  IT\'S A COMPLETE DEAD PIECE OF  LAND THAT WAS RUINED BY SALT  WATER.  THERE\'S NOTHING BENEFICIAL TO  SALMON OR TO BIRDS OR TO  ANYTHING.  THE MIGRATING WILDLIFE, WHAT  THEY WANT IS AGRICULTURAL LAND  TO FEED ON LEFTOVER GRAIN AND  CORN AND POTATOES AND ALL THOSE  THINGS.  THEY DON\'T WANT A DEAD PIECE OF  LAND THAT WAS FLOODED OUT BY  SALT WATER.  THIS MAKES NO SENSE WHAT YOU\'RE  TELLING ME TO FLOOD ANOTHER  150 ACRES OF FARMLAND IN  COWICHAN BAY.  FROM WHAT I SEEN FROM THE N.D.P.  GOVERNMENT IS THE A DEATH BY A  THOUSAND CUTS MORE AGRICULTURAL  LAND BEING LOST IN THIS  PROVINCE.  MADAME CHAIR, THROUGH YOU TO THE  MINISTER, AS A MEMBER OF THE  ENVIRONMENTAL LAND USE  COMMITTEE, YOU HAVE THE POWER TO  NULLIFY THIS CRAZINESS GOING ON.  I\'M ASKING YOU TODAY, WOULD YOU  STAND UP AND NULLIFY THIS  FLOODING OF THE 150 ACRES OF  FARMLAND IN COWICHAN BAY? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, MEMBER  FROM DELTA SOUTH FOR THE  QUESTION.  I WANT TO CLARIFY EVERY SINGLE  ONE OF OUR STAFF SAID HOLD ON,  WE\'VE BEEN TO THE SITE.  THEY ARE AWARE OF IT OVER  MULTIPLE YEARS.  SECONDLY, IN TERMS OF THE  ENVIRONMENT LAND USE COMMITTEE,  I WOULD NEVER PRESUPPOSE MAKE A  DECISION ON BEHALF OF OTHER  MEMBERS OF THAT COMMITTEE.  >> Chair: MEMBER FOR DELTA  SOUTH.  >> Ian Paton (CPBC): I DON\'T  WANT TO TAKE UP TOO MUCH TIME.  I WILL MOVE ON TO ANOTHER  SUBJECT.  THANK YOU FOR YOUR RESPONSES.  I\'M VERY PASSIONATE ABOUT THIS  ISSUE.  MADAME CHAIR, THROUGH YOU TO THE  MINISTER, BACK WHEN I WAS DELTA  CITY COUNCIL, I MADE TWO  DIFFERENT TRIPS TO OTTAWA WITH  MAYOR, CITY MANAGER, TO GET  FUNDING FOR DREDGING OF OUR  SECONDARY CHANNEL.  AT ONE TIME WE BECAME SUCCESSFUL  THROUGH THE PORT OF VANCOUVER  AND DELTA AND RICHMOND TO COME  UP WITH $10 MILLION.  THE PROJECT TOOK PLACE IN 2015.  SINCE THEN THERE\'S BEEN NO  FUNDING.  WHAT WE NEED IS -- IN TODAY\'S  ECONOMIC, $2 MILLION A YEAR NOT  A LOT OF MONEY TO DO MAINTENANCE  OF THE SECONDARY CHANNELS.  WE CAN\'T FORGET THAT LADNERS A  HISTORIC FISHING TOWN.  BOATS CANNOT GET IN AND OUT TO  GET TO THE FISH PROCESSING  PLANTS BECAUSE THE SILT THAT  BUILT UP.  THE FORMER MINISTER DOUG  DONALDSON, I TOOK HIM ON A BOAT  TOUR THREE OR FOUR YEARS AGO.  I KNOW, MADAME CHAIR, THE  MINISTER TOOK A BOAT TOUR JUST  RECENTLY A MONTH AND A HALF AGO  OF OUR SECONDARY CHANNELS TO SEE  HOW BAD IT IS.  NOT ONLY FOR OUR COMMERCIAL  BOATS AND RECREATION AT BOATERS  BUT BOAT HOMES.  OUR BOAT HOMES ARE SITTING ON AN  ANGLE WHICH IS COMPROMISING  THEIR NATURAL GAS LINES AND  DIFFERENT THINGS.  MY QUESTION THROUGH YOU MADAME  CHAIR TO THE MINISTER, AFTER  YOUR TOUR OF OUR SECONDARY  CHANNELS A MONTH AND A HALF AGO,  WHAT HAVE YOU COME UP FOR ANY  SORT OF PLANS BETWEEN THE  PROVINCIAL GOVERNMENT, THE PORT  OF VANCOUVER AND THE FEDERAL  GOVERNMENT TO GET US SOME MONEY  TO GET SOME DREDGING  ACCOMPLISHED? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, MEMBER  FOR YOUR QUESTION.  ALL WE CAN DO IS LITERALLY BE  BLUNT HERE.  THE MAYOR OF DELTA, WHOLE BUNCH  OF FLOAT HOMEOWNERS -- I\'M  MEETING SEVERAL MORE FLOAT  HOMEOWNERS NEXT WEEK, I THINK.  I REMEMBER THE COAST GUARD TOOK  US ON THAT SECONDARY CHANNEL.  HE CAN\'T AGAIN GET THROUGH THE  CHANNEL.  IF THERE\'S AN EMERGENCY, HE  CAN\'T GET TO THAT EMERGENCY.  IT IS A CRITICAL PROBLEM.  IN THE FEW WEEKS THAT SINCE I\'VE  BEEN ON THAT TOUR, THERE WAS A  FEDERAL ELECTION.  NOW WE KNOW WHO\'S GOING TO FORM  GOVERNMENT.  MY SUGGESTION IS LET\'S JUST  CROSS PARTY LINES AND COME UP  WITH A PLAN.  CURRENTLY THERE\'S NO PLAN.  THIS IS SOMETHING THAT THE  FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WAS IN CHARGE  OF UNTIL 2008, I THINK.  THEN THEY ABSOLVED THEMSELVES OF  THE ISSUE, LEAVING A  MULTIMILLION DOLLAR PROBLEM THAT  LOCAL GOVERNMENTS AND THE  PROVINCE ARE LEFT TO CONTEND  WITH AS FIRST NATIONS AS WELL.  MY SUGGESTION IS -- THERE ARE A  LOT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE REALLY  DEDICATED TO FINDING A PERMANENT  PROACTIVE SOLUTION AND FINDING  WAYS TO GET THE MONEY TO DO THE  PROPER DREDGING THAT\'S NEEDED.  MAYBE WE CAN START WORKING ON  THAT TOGETHER BECAUSE I KNOW  IT\'S A CRITICAL ISSUE.  I KNOW THE M.L.A. FOR RICHMOND  IS CONCERNED ABOUT IT AS WELL AS  FIRST NATIONS.  THIS IS SOMETHING WE NEED TO  WORK ON TOGETHER.  >> Chair: DELTA SOUTH.  >> Ian Paton (CPBC): THANK  YOU, MADAME CHAIR.  THROUGH YOU JUST A SIDE COMMENT  I FIND IT AMAZING THAT THE NEW  PRESIDENT OR C.E.O. OF THE  VANCOUVER PORT AUTHORITY HAS  TOLD US THAT THEY ARE SPENDING  $31 MILLION A YEAR DREDGING THE  MAIN CHANNEL AS FAR AS NEW  WESTMINSTER TO GET OUR SHIPS UP.  THEY CAN\'T -- THE PORT OF  VANCOUVER CAN\'T FIND ANY MONEY  TO HELP OUT SOME OF THE  SECONDARY CHANNELS.  YET, THEY SPENT $31 MILLION ON  THE MAIN CHANNEL.  MY FINAL QUESTION THROUGH YOU  MADAME CHAIR TO THE MINISTER,  THIS COMES W -- THEY WERE TOLD Y  WLRS THEY ARE GETTING OUT OF  RESIDENTIAL TEN YEARS OF CROWN  LAND.  THIS IS IN THE LAND USE  OPERATIONAL POLICY.  IT REMOVES THE POTENTIAL FOR NEW  FLOAT HOMES AND PUTS THOSE THAT  OWN FLOAT HOMES AT RISK OF  LOSING THEIR INVESTMENTS.  OWNERS PURCHASED OR BUILT THESE  FLOAT HOMES THROUGH PROCESSES  AND ARE LIMITED TO CASH SALE  BUYERS NOW.  AS OUR CURRENT LEASE NEAR  MATURITY, OUR INVESTMENT WILL  NOT BE SAILABLE.  FOR THOSE WHO BOUGHT THE  PROPERTY FOR THE MAIN REASON FOR  THE FIRST RIGHT OVER THE WATER  LOT, THESE RIGHTS ARE BEING  TAKEN AWAY.  THEY ARE ASKING IF THE MINISTER  OF WLRS WILL REVOKE THIS POLICY? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU SO MUCH  FOR THE QUESTION.  I\'M GLAD YOU ASKED THE QUESTION,  ACTUALLY I WASN\'T AWARE OF THIS.  I GOT SOME CLARITY FOR YOU.  WE UNDERSTAND THERE ARE SEVERAL  CURRENT LEASES THAT ARE NEARING  MATURE.  WE WILL CONTINUE TO DO THAT.  WHILE WE LOOK FOR LONG LASTING  MORE PERMANENT SOLUTIONS.  WHAT WE CAN SAY IS LOCAL  GOVERNMENTS ARE VERY INTERESTED  IN HELPING US FIND THOSE LONG  LASTING PERMANENT SOLUTIONS.  WE WILL CONTINUE TO DO THAT AS  WELL.  THERE IS A MORATORIUM ON NEW  FLOAT HOME TENURES BECAUSE OF  THE PROBLEMS YOU SO ELOQUENTLY  DESCRIBED.  SOME OF THEM ARE LISTING AT LOW  TIDE NOW.  WE NEED TO FIGURE OUT A  PROACTIVE SOLUTION FOR HOW WE  CAN MANAGE THE DREDGING ON THOSE  SECONDARY CHANNELS.  THEN POTENTIALLY WE CAN LOOK AT  ISSUING AND OPENING UP NEW  TENURES FOR FLOAT HOMES AGAIN.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson  (CPBC): WHILE WE\'RE TALKING  ABOUT DREDGING, ONLY ISSUE  AROUND DREDGING SPECIFICALLY  FUNDING FOR DREDGING OR IS THERE  A BACKLOG OF PERMITTING AND  PERMISSIONS THAT THEY ALSO NEED  TO GET THROUGH TO DO DREDGING? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU, SO MUCH  CHAIR.  YES.  DREDGING DOES COME UNDER  PERMITTING.  IT\'S PART OF THE WATER  SUSTAINABILITY ACT OF 2016.  ONE OF THE EARLIER NUMBERS I  TALKED TO YOU ABOUT, PERMITTING  APPLICATIONS FOR DREDGING COMES  UNDER SECTION 11 CHANGES IN AND  ABOUT A STREAM AND AS A FEBRUAR0  APPLICATIONS IN THE QUEUE.  I DO I WANT TO MENTION IT\'S NOT  JUST PERMITTING THAT WE\'RE  LOOKING AND NOT LACK OF FUNDING  IT\'S ALSO ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES.  THOSE ARE ISSUES WE NEED TO LOOK  AT WHEN WE LOOK AT ISSUES.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): I  THINK THAT\'S WHY I ASKED THE  QUESTION.  MY EXPERIENCE IF YOU WANT TO  MOVE ANYTHING IN THE WATER, IT  IMPACTS ALL THE WAY DOWN THE  LINE.  I ASSUME THERE WAS A LOT MORE  THAN JUST MONEY NEEDED AS WELL  AS POLITICAL WILL TO DO SOME  DREDGING.  I\'M GOING TO LOOP BACK TO  CONVERSATION THAT WE HAD  EARLIER.  THE MINISTER WAS SO GRACIOUS TO  SAY THAT HEALTH AND SAFETY OF  PEOPLE AND THE DRINKING WATER IS  OUR FIRST PRIORITY.  I\'M GOING TO SWITCH TO DRINKING  WATER.  I AM GOING TO SPEAK FROM THE  BOUNDARIES OF SIMILKAMEEN  BECAUSE IT IS MY RIDING.  I KNOW ITS AN ISSUE ACROSS B.C.  WHILE I SPEAK ABOUT  BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN, THESE ARE  EXAMPLES THAT WILL BE APPLICABLE  ACROSS THE PROVINCE.  I\'M WONDERING HOW MANY -- IF WE  KNOW HOW MANY COMMUNITIES WERE  ON BOIL WATER ADVISORY AT ANY  POINT IN TIME IN THE LAST SIX  MONTHS? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU FOR THE  QUESTION.  SINCE 2003, THE DRINKING WATER  PROTECTION ACT HAS BEEN THE  PRINCIPLE PROVINCIAL STATUTE  CONCERNING DRINKING WATER  PROTECTION AND REMAINS THE  RESPONSIBILITY OF THE MINISTRY  OF HEALTH TO ADMINISTER AND THE  REGIONAL HEALTH AUTHORITIES TO  IMPLEMENT AND IMPORT.  HOWEVER, THE REGIONAL HEALTH  AUTHORITY ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR  ISSUING ALL BOIL WATER  ADVISORIES BUT THE LIST IS  PUBLIC.  I CAN READ IT OUT IF YOU WANT  THE NUMBERS.  AS OF APRIL 30, 2025, THE  BREAKDOWN OF BOIL WATER  ADVISORIES ISSUED BY REGIONAL  HEALTH AUTHORITIES ARE AS  FOLLOWINGS.  ISLAND HEALTH, 36 BOIL WATER  ADVISORIES, ISLAND HEALTH, 37,  NORTH COASTAL HEALTH, 56,  NORTHERN HEALTH, 105, INTERIOR  HEALTH 503, FRASER HEALTH 5, FOR  A TOTAL ADVISORIES 706.  >> C  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): I  WILL SPEAK ABOUT MY RIDING  SPECIFICALLY, BEING 503 IN THE  INTERIOR HEALTH.  CAN YOU TELL ME WHETHER THOSE  NUMBERS INCLUDE SMALLER  PRIVATELY OWNED OR MANAGED WATER  SYSTEMS? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource, Fisheries):.  THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTION.  YOU\'RE RIGHT, THE SHORT ANSWER  IS YES.  THESE ARE ALL ON SMALL WATER  SYSTEMS GENERALLY BOIL WATER  ADVISORIES ARE ISSUED FOR THE  SMALLER MORE RURAL WATER SYSTEMS  BECAUSE THAT\'S WHERE THE AGING  INFRASTRUCTURE IS.  I KNOW I HAVE DOZENS IN MY  RIDING AS WELL.  YES, YOU\'RE CORRECT.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY-SIMILKAMEEN  >> Donegal Wilson  (CPBC): THANK YOU, MADAME  CHAIR.  WHAT I\'VE LEARNED RECENTLY HAVE  GONE THROUGH A PROCESS WITH  RESIDENTS UP AT HERITAGE HILL,  WHERE THEIR WATER INFRASTRUCTURE  WAS PRIVATELY OWNED, PUT IN WHEN  THE DEVELOPMENT WAS BUILT I  BELIEVE IN THE EARLY \'90s, IT  MIGHT HAVE BEEN THE \'80s.  THE UPGRADES THAT ARE REQUIRED  TO THE WATER SYSTEM TO MAKE  THEIR DRINKING WATER USEABLE IS  $23 MILLION.  THIS IS BEING ASSESSED ON 321  DOORS IN THE COMMUNITY.  THE DIRECTION PATH FORWARD THEY  HAVE BEEN PROVIDED BECAUSE THE  PRIVATE WATER OWNER OBVIOUSLY  DOES NOT HAVE $23 MILLION.  THERE\'S A SEGMENT OF THOSE 321  DOORS THAT ALSO HAVE A SEWER  UPGRADE THAT\'S REQUIRED FOR THEM  TO BE ABLE TO CONTINUE TO FLUSH  THEIR TOILETS.  THE ONLY OPTION THEY WERE REALLY  ABLE TO DO IS EITHER THEY WERE  ALL GOING TO HAVE TO PAY 65 OR  $84,000 DEPENDING ON IF THEY GET  THE SEWER UPGRADE, OR THEY CAN  VOTE TO MOVE THEIR ASSETS INTO  THE REGIONAL DISTRICT.  WHICH DID NOT TAKE AWAY THE  LIABILITY OF THE $23 MILLION.  IT JUST ALLOWED THOSE RESIDENTS  TO AMORTIZE THAT.  THOSE RESIDENTS HAVE MADE THAT  CHOICE TO MOVE THEIR ASSETS INTO  THE REGIONAL DISTRICT IN THE  HOPE THEY\'RE GOING TO BE  ELIGIBLE FOR GRANT FUNDING BY  MAKING THAT MOVE.  ONE OF THE KEY THINGS MAKING  DRINKING WATER OUR FIRST  PRIORITY, IT SAYS WE\'LL TAKE IT  -- MAKE IT AFFORDABLE.  IT WAS $2500 A YEAR WHEN IT WAS  AMORTIZED.  IS IT THE INTENT OR THE POLICY  GOING FORWARD THAT THE ONLY WAY  THAT THESE SYSTEMS CAN BE FUNDED  IS BY MOVING THEM INTO A  MUNICIPALITY OR DISTRICT WHO\'S  GOING TO TAKE ON THAT LIABILITY? >> Chair: MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Land,  Water, Resource,  FISHERIES): THANK YOU FOR YOUR  QUESTION.  I DO WANT TO LET YOU KNOW THAT  REGARDLESS OF TYPE OR SIZE, ALL  WATER SYSTEMS ARE EXPECTED TO BE  FINANCIALLY SELF-SUFFICIENT.  SETTING WATER RATES  APPROPRIATELY TO OPERATE  MAINTAIN, UPGRADE AND REPLACE  THEIR INFRASTRUCTURE.  THAT SAID, I DO WANT TO  ACKNOWLEDGE WHAT YOU ARE FINDING  IN YOUR RIDING IS THAT IT IS AN  EXPENSIVE COMPLICATED ISSUE.  IT\'S NOT ONE SHARED SOLELY BY  WALRUS THIS MINISTRY ALONE.  THE QUESTION YOU\'RE ASKING FOR  THE EXTENT OF MOVING WATER  INFRASTRUCTURE ON TO  MUNICIPALITIES THAT IS THE  RESPONSIBILITY OF MINISTER OF  MUNICIPAL AFFAIRS AND HOUSING.  WE DO SHARE AND PARTNER IN THAT  AS WELL AS DOES THE PUBLIC  HEALTH OFFICER WHERE SHE DOES AN  ANNUAL REPORT INTO DRINKING  WATER AND DRINKING WATER SAFETY.  SHE DOES STUDY THIS ISSUE.  SHE HAS COME TO THE CONCLUSION  IN HER REPORT THAT SMALLER WATER  SYSTEMS AREN\'T RESILIENT  SEVERELY THE LONG-TERM.  THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE ARE  ALL LEARNING AND UNDERSTAND WHAT  WE\'RE LOOKING TO IN TERMS OF OUR  WATER SECURITY IS SUSTAINABILITY  AND RESILIENCY.  WE HAVE TO LOOK AT BETTER LONGER  TERM SOLUTIONS.  THAT\'S WHAT WE\'RE DOING IN  PARTNERSHIP WITH MUNICIPAL  AFFAIRS AND HOUSING.  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): AGAIN, IT\'S NOT   INEXPENSIVE, ASK THERE\'S SO --  AND THERE\'S SO MANY OF THESE   SMALLER WATER SYSTEMS THAT WE   NEED TO, AND WE WILL WORK   CLOSELY WITH THE MINISTER OF   MUNICIPAL AFFAIRS AND HOUSING.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY   SIMILKAMEEN.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU.  I COULD REPEAT THE STORY IN   ABOUT A DOZEN RIDINGS, AND   BEFORE, WE WERE JOKING ABOUT   IT.  ONE OF THE CHALLENGES, IT IS   NOT THE ROLE OF WLRS BE   MONITORING -- TO BE MONITORING  SOME OF THESE SYSTEMS TO MAKE   SURE THIS IS NOT HAPPENING?  WHY ARE SO MANY SMALL WATER   SYSTEMS IN THE POSITION THAT   THEY ARE IN?  SOMEBODY, I ASSUME, SHOULD   HAVE BEEN CHECKING ON THEM. >> Chair: MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU SO   MUCH, CHAIR, AND THANK YOU TO   THE MEMBER.  A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT I JUST  WANT TO POINT OUT.  FIRST OF ALL, THIS MINISTRY   DOES REGULATE PRIVATE WATER   UTILITIES, AND WE DO WORK WITH  PRIVATE COMPANIES TO DO THE   UPGRADES THAT ARE NECESSARY.  IT IS THE PRIVATE COMPANY\'S   RESPONSIBILITY TO DO THOSE   UPGRADES BUT AS YOU SO RIGHTLY  POINT OUT WE\'RE ALSO AWARE OF   THE COSTS TO UPGRADE THAT   OFTEN PROHIBITIVELY EXPENSIVE,  AND OFTEN IT\'S NOT JUST THE   DRINKING WATER PIPES THAT NEED  TO BE UPGRADES, IT\'S ALSO THE   SEWAGE OR OTHER   INFRASTRUCTURE, AND IN FACT   THAT\'S WHAT WE\'RE FACING   ACROSS THE PROVINCE RIGHT NOW.  ROADS AND BRIDGES, I\'M SURE   YOU HAVE EXAMPLES AND MANY IN   MIND, THAT THESE TYPES OF   UPGRADES ARE NEEDED ACROSS THE  BOARD, SO WE DO REGULATE THE   PRIVATE WATER UTILITIES BUT IT  IS THE PRIVATE WATER COMPANY\'S  RESPONSIBILITY BUT WE\'RE ALSO   AWARE OF THE COST AND THE RATE  IMPACT THAT IS ON HOMEOWNERS.  >> Chair: BOUNDARY   SIMILKAMEEN.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.  SO I JUST HEARD THAT IT IS THE  MANAGER OF THE SMALL OPERATOR,  SMALL WATER SYSTEM\'S JOB TO   MAKE SURE THAT THE MONEY IS   THERE TO MANAGE AND REPLACE   THE INFRASTRUCTURE.  I\'LL ASK A QUESTION ON BEHALF   OF MY COLLEAGUE FROM PENTICTON  SUMMER LAND BECAUSE SHE\'S NOT   HERE BUT AN EXAMPLE OF THE   PROVINCE TAKING OVER A WATER   SYSTEM IN THE RIDING OF SAGE   MESA.  IT HAS BEEN A SIGNIFICANT   PERIOD OF TIME.  THOSE RESIDENTS HAVE JUST BEEN  TOLD THAT IT\'S A $32 MILLION   ASSESSMENT TO THEM TO FIX   THEIR WATER.  THE PROVINCE WAS THE MONITOR   AND HAS NOT BEEN READY NOR   WILLING TO FUND TO REPLACE THE  INFRASTRUCTURE.  WHAT HAPPENS IN THAT CASE? >> Chair: MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU VERY   MUCH, CHAIR, AND THANK YOU FOR  THE QUESTION, SO YES, WE DO   HAVE A [indiscernible] ON   THIS.  SAGE MESA IS A WATER SYSTEM   THAT PROVIDES WATER TO ABOUT   250 HOMES.  IT IS MANAGED BY THE PROVINCE   FOLLOWING THE SEIZURE IN 1990   FOR MISMANAGEMENT I\'VE BEEN   TOLD FORCEFULLY A FEW TIMES BY  MY A.D.M. THAT THE PROVINCE   DOES NOT WANT TO DO THIS ROLE.  WE DO NOT WANT TO BE MANAGING   THIS.  THE REGIONAL DISTRICT OF   OKANAGAN SIMILKAMEEN IS   CONDUCTING A REFERENDUM NOW TO  ACQUIRE THE SAGE MESA UTILITY   WHICH IS CURRENTLY MANAGED   RELUCTANTLY THROUGH THE   COMPTROLLER WATER RIGHTS, AND   THE COMPTROLLER IS IN   AGREEMENT TO REDUCING COSTS TO  CUSTOMERS AND THE TIMELINE FOR  COMPLETION OF THE SYSTEM   REBUILD.  IF THE REFERENDUM FAILS THE   COMPTROLLER WILL CONTINUE TO   MANAGE THE UTILITY AND WILL   NEED TO CONSIDER A SPECIAL   LEVY TO RAISE THE REQUIRED   FUNDS FOR THE NECESSARY   UPGRADES, BUT AGAIN, THIS IS   NOT AN OUTCOME THAT THE   PROVINCE EVER WANTED.  IT WAS SEIZED BECAUSE OF   MISMANAGEMENT IN THE 1990s,   AND WE ARE ACTIVELY WORKING   WITH THE HOMEOWNERS TO COME UP  WITH THE BEST SOLUTION FOR   THEM.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER FOR BOUNDARY   SIMILKAMEEN.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   WELL, I CAN UNDERSTAND THAT WE  DON\'T WANT TO FUND THAT AND WE  DON\'T WANT THESE SYSTEMS BUT I  CAN TELL YOU THAT WE\'RE NOT   GOING TO GET THESE SYSTEMS   BECAUSE THE HOMEOWNERS DON\'T   HAVE THE MONEY AND THE   COMMUNITY DOESN\'T HAVE THE   MONEY TO TAKE ON THESE   SYSTEMS.  IN THE CASE OF SAGE MESA, THE   PROVINCE WAS THE OPERATOR, THE  PROVINCE STATED CLEARLY BEFORE  THAT THE OPERATE IS   RESPONSIBLE TO MAKE SURE THAT   THEY\'RE COLLECTING ENOUGH   MONEYS TO MANAGE AND REPAIR   THE INFRASTRUCTURE.  THE PROVINCE HAS BEEN MANAGING  THE INFRASTRUCTURE SINCE 1994,  AND WE\'RE TOLD THE OWNERS WILL  JUST BE LEVIED THE $32 MILLION  BECAUSE THE PROVINCE DOESN\'T   HAVE ANY MONEY TO DO IT.  THE HOMEOWNERS, WHILE THERE\'S   A REFERENDUM PLANNED, IT   HASN\'T BEEN HELD YET.  IT\'S JUST BEING CONSIDERED.  AND WHERE WAS I GOING WITH   THAT?  THE OPERATOR HAS FORBIDDEN   THEIR STAFF FROM CLAIMING ON   THE TOWER.  THE TOWER IS THAT UNSAFE THAT   IT\'S NOT SAFE FOR PEOPLE ON   WALK ON THE TOWER TO FIX THE   WATER.  THAT TOWER IS ABOVE THESE   HOMES.  IT\'S IN IMMINENT FAILURE, AND   THE OPERATOR IS THE PROVINCE.  I\'D LIKE TO HEAR WHAT THE   MINISTER\'S PLAN IS AS OPERATOR  OF THAT WATER. >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER FOR WATER, LANDS, AND  RESOURCE STEWARDSHIP.  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR.  FIRST, WE WANT TO ACKNOWLEDGE   THAT THIS IS A GROWING PROBLEM  ALL OVER THE PROVINCE IN SOME   CASES, AND POTENTIALLY MY   ANSWER IS GOING TO BE SIMILAR   TO THE ANSWER I JUST GAVE YOU.  THE PROVINCE THROUGH   MISMANAGEMENT IN 1992 BECAME   THE RELUCTANT KIND OF MANAGER   OF SAGE MESA.  WE\'RE LOOKING FOR A PATHWAY TO  PERMANENT SOLUTION HERE, AND   THE FIRST IS WORKING WITH THE   REGIONAL DISTRICT OF OKANAGAN   SIMILKAMEEN TO CONDUCT A   REFERENDUM PROCESS TO ACQUIRE   THE SAGE MESA UTILITY WHICH IS  CURRENTLY MANAGED THROUGH THE   COMPTROLLER OF WATER RIGHTS.  IF THAT DOES NOT -- OR IF THAT  DOES FALL THROUGH WE WILL   CONTINUE TO MANAGE THE UTILITY  AND WILL NEED TO CONSIDER A   SPECIAL LEVY TO RAISE THE   REQUIRED FUNDS FOR THE   NECESSARY UPGRADES.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   YEAH, I STILL DON\'T UNDERSTAND  YOUR POSITION BECAUSE IF THIS   WERE A PRIVATE OPERATOR THEY   WOULD BE FINED FOR NOT MEETING  THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE ACT,   SO HOW DO WE ALLOW A   GOVERNMENT TO MANAGE A UTILITY  FOR 30 YEARS AND NOT GET A   LEVY THAT WILL BE PAID FOR BY   THE HOMEOWNERS AND A $32   MILLION BILL THAT THE ABILITY   OF THE HOMEOWNERS IS GOING TO   BE BEYOND.  WHAT SUPPORT AND FUNDING IS   AVAILABLE FOR THESE MULTIPLE   PRIVATE WATER SYSTEMS THAT ARE  GOING TO BE GOING TO THE   REGIONAL DISTRICT OF   OKANAGAN-SIMILKAMEEN AND WHAT   BARGAINING POWER ARE THEY   GOING TO HAVE WHEN IT COMES TO  MANAGING ALL OF THESE   PROJECTS?  HOW ARE THEY GOING TO MANAGE   THEM ALL? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR, AND THANK YOU, AGAIN,   FOR YOUR QUESTION.  I UNDERSTAND THE FRUSTRATION   AROUND THIS ISSUE.  THE SIMPLE ANSWER IS IT COSTS   MONEY TO PROVIDE WATER TO   THESE HOMES AND THESE   COMMUNITIES, AND ESPECIALLY   THESE SMALLER WATER SYSTEMS AS  THEY AGE, THE COST INCREASES,   AND THEN THE COSTS FOR   REPLACEMENT AND UPGRADE   INCREASES EVEN MORE.  THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE HEAR  FROM LOCAL GOVERNMENTS AT UBCM  EACH YEAR, AND THEY\'RE FACING   SIMILAR PROBLEMS ALL ACROSS   THE PROVINCE.  THE LAST THING THAT I\'LL SAY   IS I JUST WANTED TO MAKE CLEAR  THAT THE WATER SYSTEMS   INFRASTRUCTURE RESPONSIBILITY   RESTS WITH THE MINISTRY OF   HOUSING AND MUNICIPAL AFFAIRS   AND THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   YEAH.  I THINK THE MESSAGE IS BEING   HEARD BUT IT\'S NOT BEING   DELIVERED BECAUSE THE MESSAGES  DON\'T NECESSARILY REFLECT WHAT  WE\'RE SEEING ON THE GROUND.  IF YOU\'RE HEARING IT FROM   THEM, YOU\'RE HEARING IT FROM   EVERY RIDING.  SO I\'LL JUST TURN TO   REQUIREMENT.  WHAT ARE WE DOING TODAY TO   PREVENT THIS SCENARIO FROM   REPEATING ITSELF.  I HAVE AN APPLICATION FOR A   NEW SUBDIVISION IN MY RIDING.  IT\'S PRETTY EXCITING.  IT\'S ABOUT 800 DOORS.  THEY\'RE PUTTING IN A PRIVATE   WATER SYSTEM AND A PROVIVATE   SEWER SYSTEM.  ARE WE GOING TO BE EXPLAINING   TO THOSE HOMEOWNERS IN 30   YEARS AT THAT TIME BECAUSE   SOMEBODY DIDN\'T CHECK? IN THE SAME SITUATION WHERE   IT\'S MILLIONS OF DOLLARS FOR   EVERYONE TO AFFORD.  I DO WANT TO POINT OUT THAT   THERE\'S BROADER SOLUTIONS THAT  WE HAVE TO LOOK AT, TOO, LIKE   CONSERVATION OVERALL.  WE CAN GET RAIN BARRELS   INSTEAD OF USING ORIGINAL   DISTRICT WATER, RAIN WATER.  WATER METRES HAVE BEEN PROVEN   TO REDUCE USAGE BY 25 TO 50%   IN SOME MUNICIPALITIES.  I KNOW IN THE DISTRICT OF   GIBSONS THEY\'VE BEEN DOING A   GREAT JOB OF REDUCING THEIR   WATER USAGE SO THOSE ARE   THINGS THAT WE HAVE TO DO TO   REDUCE OUR WATER USAGE.  >> Chair: MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU.  I WANT TO TALK A LITTLE BIT   ABOUT DAMS AND DAM SAFETY.  I KNOW WE TOUCHED A LITTLE BIT  ON IT WITH THE DINSDALE DIKE   BREACH, BUT HOW MANY DAMS DO   WE HAVE CURRENTLY IN B.C.? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU VERY   MUCH, CHAIR.  THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE   QUESTION AND SWITCHING OVER TO  DAMS.  REGULATED DAMS ARE   CHARACTERIZED BY THEIR FAILURE  CONSEQUENCE CLASSIFICATION, SO  WE USE INSTEAD OF HIGH RISK,   WE USE HIGH CONSEQUENCE   BECAUSE THERE MAY BE HIGH RISK  DAMS IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE   WHERE IF IT WOULD BURST   AFFECTED NOTHING, SO WE USE   CONSEQUENCE AS OPPOSED TO HIGH  RISK.  SO THE HIGHER THE EXPECTED   CLASSIFICATION THE HIGHER OF   STANDARD OF CARE.  A CLASS IS GIVEN TO ALL DAMS   BASED ON THE POTENTIAL FOR   LOSS OF LIFE, AND THE LOSSES   TO INFRASTRUCTURE AND THE   ECONOMY SHOULD THE DAM FAIL,   AND THIS PROVINCE HAS ADAPTED   A CLASSIFICATION FROM LOW TO   EXTREME.  I\'LL LET YOU KNOW UNDER WHICH   CLASSIFICATION HOW MANY DAMS   WE HAVE.  SO WE HAVE A NUMBER OF 1,306   DAMS IN THE PROVINCE.  THE NUMBER THAT ARE CONSIDERED  EXTREME UNDER THE CONSEQUENCE   CLASSIFICATION IS 54.  THE NUMBER CLASSIFIED AS VERY   HIGH, 115.  HIGH IS 219.  SIGNIFICANT CONSEQUENCE   CLASSIFICATION IS 609, AND LOW  CONSEQUENCE CLASSIFICATION IS   883, AND THERE ARE 26 DAMS   THAT ARE WHAT WE\'RE CALLING   UNDETERMINED RIGHT NOW WHICH   JUST MEANS AT THIS POINT THEY   HAVEN\'T BEEN CLASSIFIED.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.   >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU, CHAIR.  DO WE KNOW HOW MANY IN THE TOP  THREE, SO EXTREME, HIGH   CONSEQUENCE, HIGH, I THINK IT   IS.  I WAS WRITING FAST -- ARE IN   SOME FORM OF NONCOMPLIANCE? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU SO   MUCH, CHAIR, AND THANK YOU FOR  THE QUESTION.  IT\'S NOT GOING TO BE A VERY   SATISFACTORY, I\'M AFRAID.  WE DON\'T ACTUALLY HAVE THAT   NUMBER BUT WE WILL GET IT FOR   YOU.  I DO WANT TO POINT OUT,   THOUGH, THAT WHEN YOU ASK   WHICH DAMS ARE IN   NONCOMPLIANCE, NONCOMPLIANCE   CAN MEAN A WIDE VARIETY OF   THINGS.  EVEN SOMETHING AS SIMPLE AS   THEY MISSED A REPORTING   DEADLINE OR A REGULAR CONTACT   DEADLINE, SO MAYBE WHEN WE GET  YOU THOSE NUMBERS YOU CAN ASK   FOR MORE SPECIFICITY ABOUT   WHAT EXACT NONCOMPLIANCE YOU   MEAN SO WE CAN FIGURE THAT   OUT.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): YES,  THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.  I APPRECIATE DIGGING INTO   THAT.  FOR THE INTEREST OF TIME WE   WILL DO THAT OFFLINE.  GOING INTO FLOOD STRATEGY,   OBVIOUSLY, WE HAD AN   ATMOSPHERIC RIVER IN 2021 THAT  HAS IMPACTED THE COMMUNITY OF   PRINCETON, MERRITT.  THANKFULLY IN OTHERS THE   STRATEGY HELD.  IF WE HAVE A LARGE FRESHET   THIS YEAR THAT COULD HAVE   SIGNIFICANT CONSEQUENCES FOR   THE RESIDENTS OF PRINCETON,   AND I\'M JUST WONDERING IF   THERE\'S ANYTHING IN THE BUDGET  FOR THE RESIDENTS OF PRINCE   TONNE TO GET THEIR --   PRINCETON TO GET THEIR DIKES   REBUILT. >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR.  SPECIFIC MONEY FOR REBUILDING   FOR PRINCETON OR SHORING UP   THEIR FLOOD RESPONSE, THE   FUNDING MECHANISMS ARE THROUGH  THE MINISTRY OF EMERGENCY   MANAGEMENT AND CLIMATE   READINESS AS WELL AS FEDERAL   FUNDING, SO THAT IS SOMETHING   THAT WLRS DOES NOT FUND FOR.  BUT JUST IN GENERAL NUMBERS,   SINCE 2017, THE PROVINCE HAS   APPROVED APPROXIMATELY $515   MILLION IN TOTAL, AND $375   MILLION PROVINCIALLY FOR OVER   556 FLOOD RISK REDUCTION   PROJECTS, BUT THAT\'S   THROUGHOUT THE PROVINCE NOT   SPECIFIC TO PRINCETON.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.  JUST FOR THE SAKE OF STAFF I   AM GOING TO MOVE TO WILDLIFE.  I DON\'T KNOW IF THIS IS AN   APPROPRIATE TIME FOR A BREAK.  >> Chair: MEMBERS, WE WILL   TAKE A FIVE-MINUTE BREAK.  IF WE COULD PLEASE RETURN AT   3:32.  THANK YOU. CH  >> Chair: I CALL THE COMMITTEE  OF SUPPLY SECTION A BACK TO   ORDER.  WE ARE CURRENTLY CONSIDERING   THE MINISTRY OF WATER, LANDS,   AND RESOURCE STEWARDSHIP.  I RECOGNISE THE MEMBER FROM   BOUNDARY SIMILKAMEEN.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU, CHAIR.  WATER IS SOMETHING THAT I HOLD  DEAR PERSONALLY AS WELL AS IN   MY CAREER.  I  I\'LL START WITH WILDLIFE   STRATEGY.  IT WAS LAUNCHED AS WILDLIFE   MANAGEMENT BUT YEARS LATER,   TRANSPARENCY AND   ACCOUNTABILITY SEEM FAR   FETCHED.  CAN YOU TELL ME WHAT IT WAS   FOR THIS FISCAL YEAR COMPARED   TO LAST FISCAL? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR, AND THANK YOU TO THE   MEMBER FOR THE QUESTION.  SO SOME MONETARY SPENDING FOR   YOU JUST FOR THE TOGETHER FOR   WILDLIFE FUNDING SPENT TO   DATE.  SO SO FAR IN THE FIRST FOUR   FISCAL YEARS THAT TOGETHER FOR  WILDLIFE HAS BEEN AROUND IT\'S   INVESTED IN MORE THAN 400   PROJECTS ACROSS THE PROVINCE.  WE\'RE COMMITTED TO SPENDING UP  TO $10 MILLION A YEAR ON   TOGETHER FOR WILDLIFE.  SO FOR EXAMPLE, IN FISCAL   2020-2021, WE FUNDED 129   PROJECTS AND SPENT JUST OVER   $9 MILLION.  IN 2021-22, WE FUNDED 108   PROJECTS FOR WILDLIFE AND   SPENT JUST UNDER $10 MILLION.  IN 2022-2023 WE FUNDED JUST   OVER 100 PROJECTS AND SPENT   ALMOST 7.5 MILLION.  IN 2023-24, WE WORKED ON JUST   UNDER 100 PROJECTS AND SPENT   ALMOST $7 MILLION AND WE\'RE   STILL FINALIZING THE FUNDING   FOR THIS FISCAL YEAR, SO   OVERALL, 437 PROJECTS AND $57   MILLION WE SPENT ALTOGETHER   JUST FOR WILDLIFE.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.  COULD WE HAVE THE OVERALL   EXPENDITURE IN THE WILDLIFE   DIVISION -- I KNOW I\'D ASKED   FOR A LONG PERIOD BACK THAT   WAS HARD TO PULL, BUT IF WE   COULD HAVE 23, 24, AND 25 FOR   THE MINISTRY THAT WOULD BE   VERY HELPFUL. >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR.  WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO DEFER   TO WRITTEN ANSWERS FOR YOU   BECAUSE LITERALLY THERE\'S SO   MANY DIFFERENT MINISTRIES AND   OUR WILDLIFE FUNDING DOESN\'T   JUST COME UNDER RESOURCE   STEWARDSHIP.  IT CAN COME, LIKE, UNDER OUR   LAND USE PLANNING MINISTRY,   ETC., BUT WE CAN PUT IT   TOGETHER FOR YOU AND MAKE SURE  YOU HAVE THAT.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): SO   JUST TO BE CLEAR, AS A   DIVISION CALLED WILDLIFE, WE   DON\'T HAVE A BUDGET?  IT\'S AGGREGATED AMONG A BUNCH   OF OTHER DIVISIONS OR -- I   THOUGHT EACH DIVISION HAD ITS   OWN BUDGET? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU SO   MUCH.  SO WE DON\'T HAVE A SPECIFIC   DIVISION JUST FOR WILDLIFE.  WILDLIFE FALLS UNDER THE   RESOURCE STEWARDSHIP, AND SO   FUNDING FOR THAT FOR 25-26 IS   $37.761 MILLION.  BUT TO OUR EARLIER POINT,   WATER CONSERVATION AND   RESOURCE STEWARDSHIP HAPPENS   ACROSS SOME OF THE OTHER   AREAS, AS WELL.  LIKE, LAND USE PLANNING FALLS   UNDER -- WE HAVE SOME WILDLIFE  SPENDING UNDER THERE.  WATER FISHERIES AND THE COAST,  WE HAVE SOME SPENDING IN   WATER, LANDS, AND NATURAL   RESOURCE POLICY, SO IF WE WANT  TO PULL OUT WILDLIFE FROM WHAT  WE DO IN OTHER SECTORS, IT\'S   GOING TO TAKE US SOME TIME TO   DO THAT.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): I\'LL  WAIT FOR THAT BECAUSE I THINK   IT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO REALIZE  WHAT WE\'RE SPENDING ON   WILDLIFE IN THE PROVINCE AND   COMPARE THAT TO OTHER   JURISDICTIONS.  THE -- HOW DO I WANT TO DO   THIS?  SO THE BIOLOGISTS -- I KNOW   THAT I HAD SPECIFICALLY   SUBMITTED SPECIFIC CATEGORIES   OF BIOLOGISTS, BUT CAN YOU   TELL ME HOW MANY BIOLOGISTS WE  HAVE WORKING IN WLRS   SPECIFICALLY AND CURRENTLY HOW  MANY POSITIONS ARE VACANT? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): WE DON\'T HAVE   THAT INFORMATION FOR YOU YET.  I\'M SORRY, MEMBER.  BECAUSE WE THOUGHT THAT   ESTIMATES WERE STARTING FOR US  ON THE 8th, WE AREN\'T BUT WE   ARE WORKING ON THAT AND WE   WILL GIVE IT TO YOU IN   WRITING.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU.  WOULD THE MINISTER BE ABLE TO   GIVE US THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE   ON THE GROUND TO MEET THE   COMMITMENTS THAT WE\'VE MADE? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR, AND THANK YOU SO MUCH   FOR THE QUESTION.  IT\'S A SIMPLE ANSWER.  YOU KNOW, THE WORK OF RESOURCE  STEWARDSHIP AND MANAGING OUR   LAND AND RESOURCES AND HAVING   TO RESTORE OUR WILDLIFE AND   LAND AND BIODIVERSITY THAT   SUPPORTS OUR WILDLIFE REQUIRES  A LOT OF PEOPLE ON THE GROUND,  BOOTS ON THE GROUND, AND WE   WOULD NEVER EVER SAY NO TO   HAVING MORE OF THOSE TYPES OF   RESOURCES.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): I   WAS RECENTLY TALKING WITH SOME  OF THE MEMBERS OF THE LOCAL   WILDLIFE ASSOCIATION AND ONE   OF THE THINGS THAT HAD COME UP  WAS THE BIOLOGISTS, A, THAT   THERE\'S ONLY ONE BIOLOGIST   LEFT IN THE OFFICE IN   PENTICTON, AND THE REMAINING   BIOLOGIST DID NOT HAVE A TRUCK  TO TRAVEL OR TO DO HIS JOB.  SO I UNDERSTAND THAT WE WANT   MORE, BUT DO WE EVEN HAVE   ENOUGH TO DO THE BARE MINIMUM   OF THE JOB IN EVERY CORNER OF   THE PROVINCE THAT WE\'VE   COMMITTED TO? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU SO   MUCH, CHAIR.  SO WE HAVE IMPLEMENTED, AND   THIS IS PROVINCE WIDE,   MANAGEMENT EXPENDITURE   CONTROLS TO PRIORITIZE FUNDING  FOR OPERATIONAL NEEDS ON THE   GROUND.  SO WE ARE WORKING TOGETHER AS   A PROVINCE AND THROUGH   MULTIMINISTRIES TO SEND   PROFESSIONAL BIOLOGISTS WHERE   THEY\'RE NEEDED AND WE\'RE   SENDING THEM WITH CELL PHONES   AND VEHICLES, AS WELL, BECAUSE  OBVIOUSLY THEY NEED THAT.  SO WHEN WE SAY WE\'RE   PRIORITIZING FOR OPERATIONAL   NEEDS THAT MEANS PROFESSIONAL   BIOLOGISTS ON THE GROUND, AND   WHAT WE\'RE PRIORITIZING RIGHT   NOW IN PARTICULAR IN TERMS OF   WILDLIFE ARE INVENTORY,   WILDLIFE HEALTH, AND CRITICAL   HABITAT RESTORATION FOR   WILDLIFE.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): IN   THIS PARTICULAR CASE, IT WAS A  CONTROLLED BURN WHERE THE   BIOLOGIST NEEDED TO BE PRESENT  AND MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT   THE LOCAL WILDLIFE CLUB HAD TO  PICK THAT BIOLOGIST UP AND   BRING THEM TO THE ACTUAL FIRE,  BE WITH THEM FOR THE DAY, AND   RETURN THEM TO THE OFFICE.  IS THAT THE EXPECTATION THAT   WE\'RE GOING TO HAVE FOR OUR   STAFF TO BE ABLE TO DO THEIR   JOB IN THIS PROVINCE? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR.  WE WOULD SAY IN THE CASE, IN   THE EXAMPLE THAT YOU GAVE US   OF THE CONTROLLED BURN, THAT   WOULD BE THE EXCEPTION THAT   THAT BIOLOGIST WOULD HAVE HAD   TO HAVE BEEN PICKED UP AND   TAKEN THERE AND THEN DROPPED   OFF AGAIN.  OUR FLEET VEHICLES ARE SHARED   ACROSS ALL OF THE NATURAL   RESOURCE MINISTRIES, AND QUITE  OFTEN WE SHARE OFFICES, TOO,   WITH FORESTS AND MINING AND   CRITICAL MINERALS, FOR   EXAMPLE, SO WE TRY TO MAKE   SURE THAT EVERYONE HAS SIGNED   OUT AND HAS THE VEHICLE WHEN   THEY NEED IT TO DO THEIR JOB.  I DO WANT TO ALSO ACKNOWLEDGE   THE LOCAL WILDLIFE   ORGANIZATION FOR HELPING US   THAT DAY.  THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE WORK  CLOSELY WITH GOVERNMENTS AND   NONPROFITAL ORGANIZATIONS TO   FOCUS OUR WORK ON WILDLIFE.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   YEAH, I DO WANT TO RECOGNISE   MY COMMUNITY.  I\'LL SWITCH OVER TO CHRONIC   WASTING DISEASE.  THE GRANDE PRAIRIES AND   CRANBROOK HAVE BEEN ACTIVELY   RUNNING A FREEZER PROGRAMME.  THE FEDERATION HAS BOUGHT THE   FREEZERS, IS MONITORING THE   FREEZERS, AND AS OF MIDYEAR   LAST YEAR THE BIOLOGISTS NO   LONGER HAD MONEY TO GO COLLECT  THE DEER HEADS OUT OF THE   FREEZER TO TEST FOR CHRONIC   WASTING DISEASE, AND THE   WILDLIFE ASSOCIATION HAD TO GO  AND COLLECT ALL THE HEADS AND   DELIVER THEM TO KELOWNA, SO   THERE AGAIN, THERE\'S ANOTHER   INSTANCE WHERE OUR STAFF DON\'T  HAVE THE BARE MINIMUM TOOLS TO  MEET THE CRISIS.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): DO   WE HAVE MONEY IN THIS YEAR\'S   BUDGET TO MAKE SURE OUR STAFF   CAN MEET THE NEED FOR CHRONIC   WASTING DISEASE? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU SO   MUCH, CHAIR, AND THANK YOU TO   THE MEMBER FOR THE QUESTION.  I KNOW YOU KNOW HOW SERIOUS   CHRONIC WASTING DISEASE IS AND  HOW SERIOUS PEOPLE IN   CRANBROOK AND PLACES TAKE IT   AS WELL AS THE B.C. WILDLIFE   FEDERATION AND HUNTERS.  I HAVE TO SAY THAT THE B.C.   WIL  WILDLIFE WOULD NOT BE   SUCCESSFUL WITHOUT THE HUNTERS  AND THE WILDLIFE FEDERATION.  WE ARE LIKENING THIS TO THE   PANDEMIC WHERE, YOU KNOW, WE   HAVE TO FLATTEN THAT CURVE AND  WE KNOW THAT THE STUDIES DONE   HERE IN B.C. AND WITH OUR   COLLEAGUES DOWN IN THE U.S.   SHOWS THAT IF WE CAN KEEP A   BASELINE -- AND I DON\'T WANT   TO SAY A CERTAIN THING, WE   KNOW THAT WE CAN STAVE OFF   CHRONIC WASTING DISEASE IN THE  PROVINCE.  SO A BIT OF BACKGROUND ON   THIS.  THE FIRST CASES OF CHRONIC   WASTING DISEASE, C.W.D., WAS   IN THE CRANBROOK AREA LAST   FALL AND WINTER.  A TOTAL OF FIVE CASES HAVE   BEEN CONFIRMED SO FAR THROUGH   SURVEILLANCE EFFORTS, AND   AGAIN, MASSIVE THANKS TO   HUNTERS FOR HELPING US TEST   ALL OF THEIR ANIMALS.  WE NEED SURVEILLANCE, WE NEED   EDUCATION, WE NEED   PREVENTATIVE MEASURES, AND   THIS HAS BEEN LED BY THE B.B.   FIELD WILDLIFE HEALTH   PROGRAMME FOR 20 YEARS.  WE HAD A RECENT TEST OF URBAN   DEER WHICH IS POTENTIALLY A   HUGE ISSUE IN KIMBERLY AND   CRANBROOK AND TRIED OUR BEST   TO TEST 100 DEER IN THOSE   CASES AS WELL AS THE FIRST   NATIONS DEER CULL, AS WELL,   WHERE WE TESTED FIVE MORE.  WE\'VE ALSO GOT SOME   SURVEILLANCE THINGIES.  THAT\'S THE TECHNICAL TERM --   TO MAKE SURE THAT WE CAN   FOLLOW TO MAKE SURE WHERE   URBAN DEER GO SO WE CAN TEST   THEM FROM THAT AREA, AS WELL.  BUT THIS IS -- SO WE\'RE   BUILDING OUR BUDGET RIGHT NOW   FOR THIS YEAR FOR -- FOR   C.W.D.  WE\'RE ALSO DOING OUR VERY,   VERY BEST TO MAKE SURE THAT WE  HAVE A LOCAL SAMPLING SITE AT   THE LOCATION.  SO ALL THE ACTUAL TESTING OF   THE SAMPLES HAS TO BE DONE IN   ABBOTSFORD BECAUSE THAT\'S AN   APPROVED CFIA TESTING SITE BUT  WE NEED TO BE ABLE TO SET UP A  TESTING SITE, AND THAT\'S   SOMETHING THAT HUNTERS HAVE   BEEN ASKING FOR, AND THAT   PRECEDED ME, AS WELL.  SO LAST YEAR WE HAD FUNDING OF  $716,000 FROM WLRS PLUS AN   ADDITIONAL 214,000 FROM   VARIOUS EXTERNAL PARTNERS.  WE KNOW THAT\'S NOT ENOUGH,   WHICH IS WHY WE\'RE BUILDING   OUR BUDGET FOR THAT THIS YEAR,  AND WE\'LL DO WHATEVER WE NEED   TO DO TO MAKE SURE WE KEEP   THAT CURVE FLATTENED AND   CHRONIC WASTING DISEASE DOES   NOT BECOME PREVALENT IN THIS   PROVINCE.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): I\'LL  USE THE WORD "TESTING" BECAUSE  I LIKE THAT WORD THAT WAS   USED, DOING SOME URBAN DEER   TESTING.  DURING THAT URBAN DEER TESTING  IN KIMBERLY WE WERE NOT   SUCCESSFUL IN ACCUMULATING THE  NUMBER OF TESTS WE NEEDED TO   ACTUALLY HAVE SOME SCIENTIFIC   FINDINGS ABOUT WHAT\'S   HAPPENING IN THE HERD.  IS THERE A PLAN TO DO SOME   MORE TESTING IN KIMBERLY, AND   WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE AS   FAR AS COMMUNICATION AND   PROTECTION FOR THE PEOPLE   DOING THE TESTING? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR, AND THANK YOU FOR YOUR   QUESTION.  YES, WE WERE, I GUESGUESS, STYD  FROM TESTING IN KIMBERLY   BECAUSE THERE WERE A NUMBER OF  RESIDENTS OPPOSED TO OUR   TESTING.  WHAT I WOULD SAY IS RIGHT NOW   IS SPAWNING SEASON AND   TYPICALLY WE WOULD NOT GO OUT   AND DO A LIMITED ENTRY HUNTER   IN FAWNING SEASON.  HOWEVER, WE DO YEAR-ROUND   TESTING FOR ROADKILL.  THERE IS A SURPRISING NUMBER   OF ROADKILL IN THAT AREA SO   WE\'RE ABLE TO DO QUITE A BIT   OF TESTING YEAR-ROUND OF THE   DEER, AND IF WE SEE, YOU KNOW,  A PREPONDERANCE OF CHRONIC   WASTING DISEASE THAT\'S WHEN WE  WOULD GET IN THERE AND WE\'D   WORK WITH OUR HUNTERS AND   FIRST NATIONS, AS WELL, WHO   ARE EXTREMELY CONCERNED IN THE  KTUNAXA OF CHRONIC WASTING   DISEASE, AND WE\'RE GOING TO   MAKE SURE WE STAY ON TOP OF   IT.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.  I WOULD SAY IT\'S NOT ONLY THE   DEER POPULATIONS.  WE\'RE TALKING ABOUT W  POPULATIONS OF ELK, MOOSE, AND  OTHER THINGS THAT WOULD BE   AFFECTED IF THIS WERE ALLOWED   TO SPREAD.  YOU SAID THE MINISTRY\'S GOING   INTO BUDGETS.  I WAS JUST LAST WEEK AT THE   B.C. WILDLIFE FEDERATION   CONVENTION AND THE BIOLOGIST   THAT WAS THE HEAD OF THE   CHRONIC WASTING DISEASE STUDY   WAS TELLING HUNTERS HOW THEY   SHOULD BE HARVESTING, HOW THEY  SHOULD BE CLEANING, HOW THEY   SHOULD BE KEEPING THE HEADS.  IT WAS AN OPPORTUNITY TO   EDUCATE A LARGE GROUP OF   HUNTERS, AND IN THIS CASE, OUR  BIOL  BIOLOGIST DID NOT HAVE THE   TRAVEL FUNDING TO BE ABLE TO   ATTEND THE CONFERENCE AND WE   HAD TO PAY FOR A C.W.B.   BIOLOGIST TO INFORM THE   HUNTERS.  IS THERE A WAY TO ENSURE THAT   THE BIOLOGISTS HAVE THE   FUNDING THIS YEAR TO   EFFECTIVELY MEET THE NEED? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR.  FULL DISCLOSURE, WE LITERALLY   HAD A MEETING THIS MORNING   WITH THE B.C. WILDLIFE   FOUNDATION AND THEY TOLD US   THAT THEY FLEW UP OUR   BIOLOGIST TO DO THAT.  WE WILL BE REIMBURSING THE   B.C. WILDLIFE FEDERATION FOR   THAT GENEROUS OFFER AND GOING   FURTHER IN THE FUTURE THERE   WAS A BIT OF A   MISCOMMUNICATION.  WE THOUGHT THAT WE COULD DO IT  ON-LINE BUT OF COURSE IT\'S FAR  MORE EFFECTIVE TO DO IT IN   PERSON AND THAT WAS PART OF   THE COST SAVING ASSUMPTION   FROM SOME FOLKS THAT WE WILL   MAKE IT CLEAR IN THE -- AND WE  WILL MAKE IT CLEAR IN THE   FUTURE THAT WE WILL BE   SECURING THE FUNDING FOR THAT   PERSON.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER FROM COLUMBIA RIVER   RE  REVELSTOKE.  >> Scott McInnis (CPBC): THANK  YOU, CHAIR.  IN SOME EAST COMMUNITIES,   KIMBERLY AND CRANBROOK   SPECIFICALLY, WE DO HAVE AN   URBAN DEER PROBLEM.  NOT ONLY DOES THIS PRESENT A   VERY SERIOUS CHRONIC WASTING   DISEASE ISSUE WITH THESE   ANIMALS IN CLOSE PROXIMITY TO   EACH OTHER IN AN URBAN   ENVIRONMENT AND THE   POSSIBILITY FOR THE DISEASE TO  SPREAD IN THE LOCAL ELK HERD   POPULATIONS, WHICH WOULD BE   DEVASTATING, BUT IT ALSO HAS A  RISK TO THE PUBLIC.  AS THE MINUISTER KNOWS, IT IS   FAWNING SEASON AND MOTHERS ARE  PROTECTIVE.  I\'VE HAD TO DRIVE IN FRONT OF   OLD LADIES WALKING THEIR DOGS.  I STOOD IN FRONT OF THE   KIMBERLY COUNCIL NOT LONG AGO   HOPING TO CREATE AN ACTIVE   DEER STRATEGY, SO I\'M JUST   CURIOUS IF THE MINISTRY HAS   FUNDS AVAILABLE OR PLANS IN   THIS BUDGET TO DEVELOP WITH   GOVERNMENT ACTIVE URBAN DEER   MANAGEMENT STRATEGIES IN ORDER  TO KEEP THESE NUMBERS AT A   REASONABLE LEVEL BECAUSE RIGHT  NOW WE HAVE SEVERAL HUNDRED   DEER IN A COMMUNITY LIKE   KIMBERLY AND IT IS PRESENTING   QUITE A SAFETY RISK.  THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR. >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU, AND   THANK YOU SO MUCH, MEMBER, FOR  YOUR QUESTION.  I JUST AM THINKING WE\'LL GIVE   YOU A CHANCE TO GO ON RECORD   TO MAYBE REPHRASE THE TERM   "OLD LADIES," BUT THAT\'S   TOTALLY UP TO YOU.  TOTALLY UP TO YOU.  [indiscernible].   >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): YEAH, THAT\'S   RIGHT.  IN AREAS WHERE THERE\'S CHRONIC  WASTING DISEASE WE DO WORK   REALLY CLOSELY WITH LOCAL   GOVERNMENTS TO COME UP WITH   STRATEGIES THAT WORK TOGETHER   BECAUSE AS YOU SAY IN THE   SPRING FAWNING SYSTEM THE DOES  CAN BE QUITE AGGRESSIVE AND   PROTECTIVE, BUT THERE ARE --   URBAN DEER POPULATIONS ARE IN   SO MANY DIFFERENT COMMUNITIES   ACROSS B.C.  I KNOW WE HAVE ONE, I KNOW   MAYNE ISLAND, WE\'RE EXPECTING   QUESTIONS FROM ONE OF THE   GREEN MEMBERS LATER ABOUT   MAYNE ISLAND.  SO THE -- THE PROVINCIAL URBAN  DEER ADVISORY COMMITTEE HAS   REPRESENTATIVES FROM LOCAL   GOVERNMENTS, THE UNION OF B.C.  MUNICIPALITIES, THE PROVINCE,   AND THE B.C. SPCA.  WE REVIEW FUNDING APPLICATIONS  EVERY AND PREVIOUSLY WE\'VE   FUNDED ABOUT $100,000 A YEAR   TO PARTNER WITH COMMUNITY LED   URBAN DEER MANAGEMENT   PROJECTS.  I\'LL BE HONEST, A LOT OF THOSE  STRATEGIES ARE COHABITATION   EXISTENCE WHERE THERE\'S NO   CHRONIC WASTING, BUT IN AREAS   WHERE THERE\'S CHRONIC WASTING,  WE TAKE THAT VERY SERIOUSLY   AND WORK TOGETHER TO NOT ONLY   TEST, AND I KNOW WE\'RE NOT   SUPPOSED TO USE THE WORD   "CULL," BUT CULL IN SOME   INSTANCES AND MAKE SURE WE   WORK TOGETHER TO KEEP THAT   DISEASE FROM SPREADING.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Scott McInnis (CPBC): THANK  YOU, CHAIR, AND I WOULD LIKE   TO WITHDRAW MY COMMENT ABOUT   "OLD LADIES" AND INSTEAD   INSERT "LADIES IN THEIR GOLDEN  YEARS."  >> Chair: MEMBER FROM BOUNDARY  SIMILKAMEEN?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): WE   DO KNOW THAT ANIMALS LIVING IN  CHOSE AREAS HAVE A CHANCE OF   DEVELOPING SOME OF THESE.  I KNOW THAT DURING DOOR   KNOCKING I WAS CHASED BY A   DEER AND DOOR KNOCKING IS   DIFFICULT WITH SIX-FOOT DEER   WALLS ON LOTS.  I\'M GOING TO SWITCH OVER TO   [indiscernible] DISEASE.  LAST YEAR, WE HAD A CONFIRMED   CASE OF WORLING DISEASE.  I JUST WONDER IF THIS YEAR WE   HAVE A STRATEGY WHERE --   WHIRLING DISEASE.  I JUST WOULDN\'T IF THIS YEAR   WE HAVE A STRATEGY WHERE   WE\'RE -- WONDER IF THIS YEAR   WE HAVE A STRATEGY WHERE WE\'RE  GOING TO DEAL WITH WHIRLING   DISEASE IN KOOTENAY LAKE THIS   YEAR? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR, AND THANK YOU FOR THE   QUESTION ABOUT WHIRLING   DISEASE.  I\'LL START AS PART OF OUR OWN   SURVEILLANCE PROGRAMMES WE   MONITOR ABOUT WHAT HAPPENS   AROUND US, SO IN ALBERTA AND   WESTERN AND NORTHERN U.S.   STATES, SO WE KNEW THAT   WHIRLING DISEASE WAS BEING   DETECTED IN AREAS AROUND OUR   PROVINCE.  SO I THINK THAT WE DID OUR   BEST TO BE PREPARED TO FIND IT  AND WE DID, AS YOU MENTIONED,   IN A 2024 SAMPLING RESULTED IN  THREE POSITIVE DETECTIONS OF   THE PARASITE RESPONSIBLE FOR   WHIRLING DISEASE IN THREE   TRIBUTARIES OF KOOTENAY LAKE.  THE FIRST THING WE\'RE DOING IS  TO MINIMIZE SPREAD OF THE   WHIRLING DISEASE WE\'VE   RECENTLY INTRODUCED   LEGISLATION TO CLEAN DRAIN AND  DRY.  SO ALL BOATS MUST PULL THE   PLUG, MAKE SURE THERE\'S NO   STANDING WATER WITH ORGANISMS   COULD HAVE WHIRLING DISEASE IN  IT.  PEOPLE MUST DECONTAMINATE   THEIR BOATS AND BOATING GEAR   WHEN THEY LEAVE THE COLUMBIA   RIVER AREA.  AND JUST ONE OTHER THING TO   NOTE, WHICH IS WHAT WE\'RE   LOOKING AT RIGHT NOW.  THE DETECTION OF WHIRLING   DISEASE, THE PARASITE   RESPONSIBLE FOR WHIRLING   DISEASE LAST FALL, WE DON\'T   KNOW IF THESE ARE ACTUALLY NEW  DETECTIONS OR IF THIS WAS A   PARASITE OF A PREEXISTING   CONDITION THAT WE WERE AWARE   OF EARLIER SO THAT\'S SOMETHING  ALSO THAT WE\'RE LOOKING INTO.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Chair:  .   >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU.  I DID HEAR A RESPONSE AROUND   THE WHIRLING DISEASE ITSELF   AND THE CLEAN DRAIN-DRY.  I\'M AWARE THERE\'S LEGISLATION   COMING, WHICH BRINGS UP, DO WE  HAVE THE ACTUAL BOOTS ON THE   GROUND TO IMPLEMENT THOSE   CHANGES IF IT SO PASSES? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU VERY   MUCH, CHAIR.  SO THE SHORT ANSWER IS YES WE   DO HAVE THE BOOTS ON THE   GROUND THAT WE NEED RIGHT NOW   AS PART OF THE LEGISLATION FOR  THE INVASIVE MUSSELS DEFENCE   PROGRAMME.  IT\'S OPERATING RIGHT NOW TODAY  AND WE DO HAVE CONSERVATION   OFFICERS AND CONSERVATION   OFFICERS\' DOGS WHO ARE DOING   THE TESTING FOR THOSE INVASIVE  SPECIES.  SO -- AND BASICALLY WHAT THIS   LEGISLATION GIVES US TO DO IS   IT COMPELS PEOPLE TO STOP AND   TEST AND LOOK AT THEIR BOATS   AND TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE\'S   NO INVASIVE MEUSSELS OR   STANDING WATER THAT COULD   CARRY THE PARASITE FOR   WHIRLING DISEASE AND, FOR   EXAMPLE -- AND I\'LL LEAVE IT   THERE.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.  IS IT THE INTENT OF THE   PROGRAMME THAT THE PEOPLE WILL  SELF-CHECK THEIR STUFF OR IS   IT THAT THERE WILL ACTUALLY BE  SOMEBODY AT THE STATION   CHECKING? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR, AND THANK YOU FOR THE   QUESTION.  THE SHORT ANSWER IS IT IS   BOTH.  WE ARE ASKING PEOPLE -- WE   HAVE DONE A REALLY BIG   EDUCATION AND COMMUNICATIONS   CAMPAIGN SO PEOPLE KNOW THAT   THEY NEED TO CLEAN, DRAIN, AND  DRY, RIGHT?  SO IT\'S SOMETHING AS SMALL AS   A STAND-UP PADDLE BOARD.  I KNOW WHERE I LIVE ON THE   SUNSHINE COAST WE HAVE LOTS OF  LITTLE LAKES AND STUFF AND   PEOPLE WILL GO TO MULTIPLE   LAKES IN A DAY.  WHAT WE\'RE ASKING PEOPLE IS   JUST TO UNDERSTAND THAT THEY   NEED TO CLEAN, DRAIN, AND DRY   THEIR PADDLE BOARD OR WHATEVER  IT IS JUST BEFORE THEY GO FROM  LAKE TO LAKE SO THEY DON\'T   SPREAD ANY DISEASES   UNKNOWINGLY.  BUT ALSO WITH THIS   PULL-THE-PLUG LEGISLATION,   WE\'RE DOING THIS BEFORE THE   SEASON STARTS WITH FOLKS AND   THEIR BOATS THAT WE MAKE SURE   THAT WE NOW HAVE THE AUTHORITY  AT BORDER CROSSINGS, FOR   EXAMPLE, THAT PEOPLE HAVE TO   STOP AND GET THEIR VEHICLES   THAT GO -- WATER VEHICLES   INSPECTED.  WHETHER IT\'S SEA DOOS OR   BOATS, ANYTHING THAT HAS A   PORTABLE PLUG, THAT WE CAN   TEST THEM.  ONE OTHER THING IS WHEN THE   NEW FEDERAL CABINET IS   ANNOUNCED, ONE OF MY FIRST   CALLS WILL BE TO THE FEDERAL   MINISTER FOR HELP WITH THE   BORDER OFFICIALS AND CBSA TO   HELP US MAKE THOSE EFFORTS, AS  WELL.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): THAT  WAS KIND OF MY NEXT QUESTION.  WHO IS GOING TO HELP US AT THE  BORDER?  WE HAVE THE ALBERTA BORDER, WE  HAVE THE U.S. BORDER.  WILL THEY HELP US WITH   VEHICLES BEING INSPECTED, AND   WILL THERE BE SOMETHING LIKE A  CERTIFICATE FOR VEHICLES THAT   HAVE BEEN INSPECTED? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.   >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   HONORABLE CHAIR.  SO RIGHT NOW AT ANY CROSSING   IT\'S THE B.C. CONSERVATION   OFFICE, SO WE HOLD THE   FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY BUT   THE B.C. CONSERVATION OFFICE   AND THEIR SCENT SNIFFING DOGS   WILL ACTUALLY DO THE WORK.  AT U.S. BORDER CROSSINGS, WE   DO ALSO PARTNER WITH THE   CANADIAN BORDER SERVICES   AGENCY TO BE ABLE TO LOOK AT   CHECKING THOSE BOATS OR   WATERCRAFT THAT COME THROUGH   THE BORDER, BUT AGAIN, THAT\'S   SOMETHING WE NEED TO DO IN A   BETTER MORE EFFECTIVE WAY AND   THAT\'S SOMETHING WE\'RE WORKING  ON RIGHT NOW.  SOMETHING ELSE WE\'RE ALSO   LOOKING AT IS RIGHT NOW WE   HAVE WHAT WE\'RE CALLING A RISK  MANAGEMENT APPROACH.  WE DON\'T GET A CERTIFICATE OR   ANYTHING BUT DIFFERENT AREAS   LIKE ALBERTA THEY ACTUALLY GET  A STICKER, AND WE\'RE LOOKING   AT ACTUALLY IMPLEMENTING THAT   POLICY, AS WELL,.  IF THE RESULTS ARE STRONGER OR  BETTER, WE\'RE CERTAINLY   LOOKING AT THAT.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): SO I  KNOW THE C.L. BUDGET DOES NOT   LIVE IN THIS MINISTRY BUT I   WOULD ASSUME THAT ENVELOPE IS   GOING TO BE AN INCREASED   BUDGET FOR MONITORING THOSE? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU SO   MUCH, CHAIR.  SO C.O. MINISTERS ARE UNDER   THE MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT   BUT WE HAVE A BUDGET TO, I   GUESS, I DIDN\'T ASK IF I COULD  SAY THE WORD "SECOND" OR   BORROW CONSERVATION OFFICERS   TO COME OVER AND HELP US.  THIS DOES NOT ALTER IN ANY WAY  BORDER OFFICIALS IN THEIR   RESPONSIBILITIES.  WE GET THE BORDER OFFICIALS TO  HELP US WITH THE CLEAN, DRAIN,  AND DRY PROGRAMME, AND WE ALSO  HAVE PARTNERS, AS WELL.  I WON\'T READ THEM ALL OUT, BUT  FOR EXAMPLE, IN THIS FISCAL   YEAR, B.C. HYDRO IS HELPING US  BY GIVING US $900,000, FOR   EXAMPLE, AND OUR TOTAL   PROGRAMME BUDGET THIS YEAR IS   $3.6 MILLION.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): FOR   CLARITY, THAT $3.6 MILLION IS   THE BUDGET FOR THE CLEAN,   DRAIN, DRY OR FOR THE INVASIVE  SPECIES OVERALL? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU VERY   MUCH, CHAIR, SO THAT AMOUNT   THAT I TALKED TO YOU ABOUT IS   JUST SIMPLY FOR THE INVASIVE   MUSSELS DEFENCE PROGRAMME, BUT  UNDER THAT BUDGET, WE ALSO DO   THE CLEAN, DRAIN, AND DRY   PROGRAMME.  WE ALSO DO THE MONITORING AND   THE INSPECTIONS, AND THAT   INCLUDES THE INSPECTIONS FOR   WHIRLING DISEASE, FOR EXAMPLE.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU FOR THAT   CLARIFICATION.  THAT IS WHAT I WAS EXPECTING.  MADAM CHAIR, WE HAD TALKED   ABOUT CHRONIC WASTING DISEASE,  WE\'VE TALKED ABOUT WHIRLING   DISEASE, AND WE KIND OF GOT   INTO INVASIVE MUSSELS IN A   ROUNDABOUT WAY.  THE MINISTER HAD MENTIONED   THAT THEY\'RE WORKING ON THE   BUDGETS.  MY QUESTION IS, IS THE   ENVELOPE ITSELF ESTABLISHED   AND WE\'RE MOVING MONEY AROUND   WITHIN THAT ENVELOPE TO THE   DIFFERENT PROGRAMMES OR HAVE   THE ENVELOPES THEMSELVES NOT   BEEN ESTABLISHED YET? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR.  I HOPE WE\'RE ANSWERING YOUR   QUESTION CORRECTLY.  SO WE DO HAVE OUR TOTAL FOR   OUR ESTIMATES BUDGET, AND WE   READOUT KIND OF THE SUB --   SUBAMOUNTS, AS WELL --   SUB AMOUNTS, AS WELL, BUT WE   ARE STILL DOING SOME OF THE   DETAIL WORK ON HOW TO PRICE   THAT BUDGET BASED ON SOME OF   THE SUBSETS THAT THEY FIT   INTO.  BUT JUST AS YOU KNOW, ONE OF   OUR ABSOLUTE MINUTE PRAYERS   BECAUSE WE WERE JUST TALKING   ABOUT IT IS WHIRLING DISEASE,   INVASIVE MUSSEL, CHRONIC   WASTING DISEASE, THOSE ARE   PRIORITIES IN THIS BUDGET.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.  THROUGH THE CHAIR TO THE   MINISTER, THEN, I KNOW EACH OF  THESE THINGS HAS A RESPONSE   PLAN, AND THOSE RESPONSE PLANS  GET TRIGGERED BY DIFFERENT   THINGS.  IF ANY -- IF THE RESPONSE PLAN  WAS TRIGGERED AS IT WAS IN   KOOTENAY LAKE LAST YEAR, DO WE  HAVE THE BUDGET TO ACTUALLY   RESPOND APPROPRIATELY FOR   WHAT\'S IN OUR BUDGET FOR EACH   OF THESE THINGS? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU VERY   MUCH.  AS IT STANDS NOW, YES, OUR   RESPONSE PLANS ARE IN PLACE,   AND THANK YOU FOR THE   QUESTION.  BUT AT ANY TIME, AS YOU KNOW,   ANYTHING CAN CHANGE, SO WE   NEED TO CONSTANTLY REASSESS   AND CONSTANTLY PIVOT AND   CONSTANTLY BE READY TO   REPRIORITIZE BASED ON   SOMETHING THAT COULD HAPPEN   BASED ON SOMETHING WE DON\'T   KNOW THAT\'S GOING TO HAPPEN AT  THIS POINT.  BUT I DO WANT TO REALLY   STRESS, AS WELL, THAT   PRIORITY -- OUR PRIORITY   REALLY IS PREVENTION BECAUSE,   FOR EXAMPLE, ONCE WHIRLING   DISEASE GETS INTO KOOTENAY   LAKE OUR OPTIONS ARE LIMITED,   SO WE REALLY, REALLY, REALLY   HAVE TO FOCUS ON PREVENTION,   MAKING SURE THAT WE KEEP IT   OUT OF AS MANY LAKES AS   POSSIBLE AND WE KEEP OUR LAKES  SAFE AND WE WORK ON EDUCATION   AND COMMUNICATION SO THAT   PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THE   SIGNIFICANCE OF THAT AND WORK   REALLY HARD WITH US TO MAKE   THAT HAPPEN.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   YEAH, AS MUCH OF MY RIDING AS   LAKES IN IT, I CAN TELL YOU   THAT THE CLEAN, DRAIN, DRY   PROGRAMME IS IMPORTANT TO THE   RESIDENTS OF THE SIMILKAMEEN   AND THE CKOOTENAYS.  WE VALUE OUR LAKES   SIGNIFICANTLY.  LAST YEAR, THE CLEAN, DRAIN,   AND DRY PROGRAMMES IN MY   REGION, I CAN SAY BECAUSE I   SAW THAT APPEARED TO BE ONLY   ON WEEKENDS AND THERE DID NOT   APPEAR TO BE ENFORCEMENT IF   PEOPLE PULLED OVER SO IS THERE  GOING TO BE A MAINTENANCE OF   THE CLEAN, DRAIN, AND DRY   PROGRAMME IN CERTAIN AREAS   WHERE THEY MAY NOT BE INFORMED  ABOUT THE PROGRAMME? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU,   CHAIR.  SO WHAT WE ARE REALLY TAKING   WITH THIS IS A RISK MANAGEMENT  APPROACH, SO WE REALLY GO   AFTER HIGH TRAFFIC HIGH VOLUME  AREAS.  WE\'LL BE HONEST, THIS IS   FRUSTRATING FOR US BECAUSE   THIS IS A FEDERAL ISSUE AND WE  HAVE ZERO FEDERAL FUNDING, SO   THAT\'S WHY I SUGGESTED   EARLIER, YOU KNOW, ONCE THE   FEDERAL CABINET IS NAMED THIS   IS GOING TO BE ONE OF OUR   FIRST CALLS TO ASK FOR FUNDING  TO SUPPORT SOMETHING THAT   COULD POTENTIALLY AFFECT THE   ENTIRE COUNTRY AND PROVINCES   HAVING TO DEAL WITH IT ON ITS   OWN IS NOT GOING TO WORK AND   IT\'S NOT HELPING.  AND IN TERMS OF ENFORCEMENT,   PRIOR TO THIS LEGISLATION   BEING INTRODUCED, WHAT WE HAD   WAS A CHIEF VET ORDER THAT   REQUIRED, YOU KNOW, VEHICLES   TO PULL OVER, FOR EXAMPLE, AND  IF THEY DIDN\'T PULL OVER WHEN   WE -- WHEN WE WENT TO COURT --  PULL OVER, WHEN WE WENT TO   COURT, THERE WERE CHALLENGES   IN GETTING THAT ENFORCEMENT TO  STICK, SO THAT\'S WHY WE\'VE   INTRODUCED THIS LEGISLATION.  IT GIVES US MORE TEETH, AND   ALSO, GOING FORWARD, WE\'VE   ALSO ASKED STAFF TO LOOK INTO   INCREASING THE PENALTY SIMILAR  TO WHAT OTHER PROVINCES DO.  PENALTIES ARE MUCH HIGHER IN   ALBERTA.  WE COULDN\'T INCLUDE IT IN THIS  LEGISLATION BUT WE WILL BE   LOOKING TO INCREASE THOSE   PENALTIES IN THE FUTURE.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.  I WONDER IF THERE HAS BEEN ANY  EXPLORATION WITH MUNICIPAL   AFFAIRS?  WE DISCUSSED THAT EARLIER   AROUND THE PRIVATE WATER   SYSTEMS, AND MY RIDING, THE   COMMUNITY OF FOSE OFFOSE -- OF   OSOYOOS.  IF THOSE MUSSELS INVADE THE   WATER IT\'S GOING TO HAVE WIDE   SCALE IMPACT SO I\'M WONDERING   IF YOUR COUNCIL HAS DISCUSSED   THAT WITH THE CABINET? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU SO   MUCH, CHAIR.  IF I MAY TO THE MEMBER OFFER A  CLARIFICATION POINTED OUT TO   ME BY THE A.D.M.  WHEN I MENTIONED THE CHIEF VET  ORDER THAT WE HAD TO COMPARE   TO ORDER VEHICLES TO STOP, IT   WAS SPECIFICALLY FOR THE PULL   A PLUG AND THIS LEGISLATION   WILL BE A BROADER SPECTRUM.  IN TERMS OF YOUR QUESTION   ABOUT OSOYOOS AND A POTENTIAL   NEW DEVELOPMENT DRAWING WATER   FROM THE LAKE WE HAVEN\'T   SPECIFICALLY HAD ANY DEEP   DISCUSSIONS FROM THE MINISTRY   OF HOUSING OR MUNICIPAL   AFFAIRS.  WE ARE REALLY LOOKING FOR THE   FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO PARTNER   WITH US ON THIS.  THERE\'S SO MANY COMPETING   DEMANDS ON LOCAL GOVERNMENT\'S   TIME AND KIND OF GOING FROM A   PROVINCIAL MINISTRY ON DOWN   PUTS A BURDEN ON LOCAL   GOVERNMENT AND SO WE WOULD   REALLY LIKE TO PARTNER WITH   FEDERAL GOVERNMENT ON THIS.  TO YOUR POINT, THAT IS WHY WE   PARTNER WITH DIFFERENT   ORGANIZATIONS LIKE B.C. HYDRO   AND COLUMBIA BASIN TRUST   BECAUSE FOR EXAMPLE IF   INVASIVE MUSSELS ENTER OUR   WATERWAYS, WE ESTIMATE UP TO   $25 MILLION A YEAR IN DAMAGE   REPAIR OR DAMAGE TO OUR   ECONOMIES WHETHER IT\'S HYDRO   INTAKES OR ALL THOSE SORTS OF   THINGS, SO IT\'S AN INCREDIBLY   SERIOUS ISSUE.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER?  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   YEAH, IT BRINGS TO MIND FOR   ME, IF THE MINISTER IS   BRINGING ANY ADVICE TO THESE   MUNICIPALITIES OR   JURISDICTIONS AROUND WHETHER   THEY SHOULD BE MAKING AN   INVESTMENT THAT LARGE WHETHER   THEY PULL FROM OTHER AREAS OR   LOOKING SO FAR DOWN THE ROAD,   SO I\'LL ASK THE MINISTER IS   THAT SOMETHING THAT\'S   HAPPENING TODAY? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER?  >> The Hon. Randene Neill   (Water, Land, and Resource   Stewardship): THANK YOU SO   MUCH, CHAIR.  THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTION.  WITH OUR WORK WITH LOCAL   GOVERNMENT AROUND THINGS LIKE   INVASIVE SPECIES AND INVASIVE   MUSSELS, YET, WE TALK TO LOCAL  GOVERNMENTS ALL THE TIME NOT   JUST FOR THINGS LIKE INVASIVE   MUSSELS BUT FOR OTHER THINGS   LIKE CLIMATE CHANGE.  WITH THE WORK SPECIFICALLY   REGARDING THE INVASIVE   MUSSELS, WE PARTNER WITH THE   CLEAN, DRAIN, DRY PROGRAMME.  THEY\'RE HUGE PROPONENTS OF   ENGAGING IN EDUCATION.  WE\'LL ALSO PARTNER WITH THEM   IN THINGS THEY CAN DO NOT JUST  TO MITIGATE INVASIVE SPECIES   BUT OTHER THINGS, AS WELL.  B.C. SO FAR DOES NOT HAVE ANY   INVASIVE SPECIES AND I THINK   WE\'RE DOING VERY GOOD BUT WE   NEED TO BE VERY VIGILANT TO   MAKE SURE THAT DOESN\'T HAPPEN,  BUT B.C. GOVERNMENT PARTNERS   WITH LOCAL COMMUNITIES ON.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC):   SEEKING TO CLARIFY THE   SITUATION WITH INVASIVE   MUSSELS, DOES THAT MEAN WE   DON\'T HAVE THEM OR WE HAVEN\'T   D  DETECTED INVASIVE MUSSELS? >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Water,   Land, Resource Stewardship):   THANK YOU, CHAIR.  AND THANK YOU FOR ASKING ABOUT   THE CLARIFICATION AND IT\'S AN   IMPORTANT QUESTION BECAUSE THE   INVASIVE MUSSELS DEFENCE   PROGRAMME FOCUSES ONLY ON ZEBRA   AND QUAGGA AND AS OF NOW WE HAVE  HAD NO DETECTION OF THOSE TWO   MUSSELS IN ANY OF THE FRESH   WATERS IN B.C.  WE HAVE DETECTED THEM AT BORDER   CROSSINGS.  THE AGM SUGGESTED WE\'RE CALLING   THEM MUSSEL FOULED BOATS AND SO   WE HAVE ORDERED DECONTAMINATION,  BUT NO DETECTION AT ALL FOR   ZEBRA OR QUAGGA MUSSELS IN THE   FRESH WATER, WE CAN\'T TAKE OUR   FOOT OFF THE PEDAL, BUT OUR   PROGRAMME IS WORKING.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> RANDOMLY AT A CONFERENCE   ABOUT A YEAR AGO BEFORE I WAS IN  THE ROLE, THE OKANAGAN WATER   BOARD, I WAS TALKING TO THEM AT   A TRADE SHE AND I THOUGHT AT   THAT TIME THEY SAID THEY HAD   FOUND MUSSELS SPECIFICALLY AT A   STATION IN THE OKANAGAN.  CAN WE CONFIRM WHETHER THAT WAS   TRUE OR WHETHER I WAS MISTAKEN?  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Water,   Land, Resource Stewardship):   THANK YOU, CHAIR.  HOPEFULLY THIS OFFERS THE   CLARIFICATION THAT YOU\'RE   LOOKING FOR, MEMBER.  SO SINCE 2016, THROUGH OUR   INSPECTIONS WE HAVE FOUND 172   BOATS THAT HAVE HAD MUSSELS ON   THEM OR MUSSELS FOWLED BOATS,   BUT WE HAVE NOT FOUND ANY ZEBRA   OR QUAGGA MUSSELS IN ANY FRESH   WATERS IN B.C.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): AGAIN,  A LAYMAN, FOR THE 172 BOATS THAT  WERE MUSSEL FOWLED WERE ANY OF   THOSE ZEBRA OR QUAGGA MUSSELS?  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Water,   Land, Resource Stewardship):   SHORT ANSWER IS YES ON THE   MUSSEL FOWLED BOATS, MADE YOU   SAY IT, WE FOUND ZEBRA AND   QUAGGA ON THOSE BOATS, YES.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): THANK   YOU, MADAME CHAIR, I\'M COGNIZANT  OF THE TIME.  SPECIES AT RISK.  I\'M WONDERING IF WE COULD HAVE A  TOTAL OF HOW MANY RED-LISTED AND  BLUE-LISTED SPECIES WE HAVE IN   B.C.?  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Water,   Land, Resource Stewardship):   THANK YOU SO MUCH, CHAIR.  THE NUMBER OF RED LISTED SPECIES  IN B.C. IS OF 658 AND BLUE   LISTED IS 1292.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): THANK   YOU, MADAME CHAIR, THROUGH TO   YOU THE MINISTER, LOOKING AT A   FIVE-YEAR CURVE IS THAT NUMBER   UP, DOWN, OR LEVEL?  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Water,   Land, Resource Stewardship):   THANK YOU SO MUCH.  SO WE\'RE GOING TO HAVE TO FOLLOW  UP WITH YOU TO GET THE TRENDS,   WHETHER IT\'S UP OR DOWN OR EVEN,  BUT WE CAN SAY AS A GENERAL   STATEMENT, WE ARE SEEING MORE   BIODIVERSITY DECLINES IN B.C.  THAT\'S WHY IT\'S SO IMPORTANT TO   STAY COMMITTED TO THE 30 BY 30   CAMPAIGN PROTECTING 30% OF THE   LANDS AND WATERS BY 2030.  AND OTHER ISSUES THAT WE\'RE ALSO  WORKING ON NOW, INCLUDING THE   BIODIVERSITY AND ECOSYSTEM   HEALTH FRAMEWORK.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): THANK   YOU, MADAME CHAIR.  ARE YOU ABLE TO SHARE WHAT THE   MINISTRY HAS BUDGETED FOR   CARIBOU RECOVERY IN 25-26?  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Water,   Land, Resource Stewardship):   THANK YOU SO MUCH, CHAIR.  THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTION,   MEMBER.  WE ARE STILL WORKING ON BUILDING  OUR WORKING BUDGET FOR   2025-2026.  BUT OUR BUDGET LAST YEAR WAS   8,  $8,755,000 AND THAT HAS STAYED   FAIRLY CONSISTENT, SO THAT\'S THE  BALLPARK NUMBER WE\'RE WORKING ON  THIS YEAR AS WELL.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): THANK   YOU, MADAME CHAIR, THROUGH YOU   TO THE MINISTER, ARE YOU ABLE TO  SHARE WHAT THE TOTAL BUDGET FOR   SPECIES AT RISK WAS FOR LAST   YEAR IF WE\'RE STILL WORKING ON   THIS YEAR, SO I CAN SEE WHAT   WE\'RE SPENDING ON CARIBOU VERSUS  ALL SPECIES AT RISK?  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING --   RECOGNIZING THE MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Water,   Land, Resource Stewardship):   THANK YOU, CHAIR.  FOR FUNDING FOR ALL SPECIES AT   RISK EXCLUDING CARIBOU LAST YEAR  WAS JUST OVER $4 MILLION AND   WE\'RE AIMING FOR THAT BALLPARK   NUMBER AGAIN THIS YEAR.  $4.07 MILLION TO BE EXACT.  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MEMBER.  >> Donegal Wilson (CPBC): THANK   YOU.  SO, GOING BACK TO THE NUMBERS   THAT WE TALKED ABOUT EARLIER, WE  HAVE 1950 RED OR BLUE LISTED   SPECIES IN B.C., WE\'RE SPENDING   $8 MILLION PER YEAR ON ONE   SPECIES AND $4 MILLION ON THE   OTHER 1949?  IS THAT CORRECT IS THIS --   CORRECT?  >> Chair: RECOGNIZING THE   MINISTER.  >> Hon. Randene Neill (Water,   Land, Resource Stewardship):   THANK YOU, CHAIR.  AND THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTION.  SO, THE ANSWERS THAT WE GAVE YOU  ABOUT THE $4.07 MILLION FOR THE   REST OF THE SPECIES AT RISK,   THOSE ARE ACTUALLY JUST SINGLE   SPENDING.  SO THE $4 MILLION INCLUDES   THINGS LIKE SPOTTED OWLS AND   THOSE VERY SPECIFIC PROGRAMMES   ON SINGLE SPECIES, SO IT\'S TRUE,  YES, WE SPEND WAY MORE ON   CARIBOU RECOVERY THAN WE DO THE   OTHER SINGLE SPECIES LIKE   SPOTTED OWLS AND THOSE TYPES.  BUT WE ALSO DO HAVE SPENDING IN   OTHER AREAS THAT RATHER THAN   MANAGED SPECIES BY SPECIES, WHAT  WE\'RE TRYING TO MOVE TO AND WHAT  OTHER ORGANIZATIONS HAVE TOLD US  IS THAT WE NEED TO TAKE AN   ENVIRONMENT-BASED APPROACH ON   HEALING ECOSYSTEMS INSTEAD OF   JUST SPECIES BY SPECIES.  AND, OKAY, GOOD.  AND, HONOURABLE CHAIR, I MOVE   THAT THE COMMITTEE RISE, REPORT   PROGRESS AND ASK LEAVE TO SIT   AGAIN.  >> Chair: MEMBERS, YOU\'VE HEARD   THE QUESTION.  THOSE IN FAVOUR?  OPPOSED?  MOTION IS CARRIED.  THANK YOU, MEMBERS, THIS   COMMITTEE STANDS ADJOURNED.'}]