[Daniel Mckenna, Father Of Finnegan Mckenna:] -sharing that and, you know, it it seems to have made a lot of people happy.
[Van Jones, Former Special Adviser To President Obama, Cnn Host, The Van Jones Show, Cnn Political Commentator:] Yes. But but this should just be normal.
[Mckenna:] It should be normal.
[Michael D. Cisneros, Father Of Maxwell Hanson:] Yes, exactly.
[Jones:] Two beautiful kids.
[Mckenna:] Yes.
[Jones:] Like each other.
[Cisneros:] Yes.
[Jones:] They play and-
[Cisneros:] And they were just being themselves like they hug all the time like it wasn't anything.
[Mckenna:] Yes.
[Cisneros:] You know, they hold hands walking down the street, and they dance together, and-
[Jones:] Yes.
[Cisneros:] -they get in trouble together.
[Mckenna:] Yes, they do.
[Anderson Cooper, Cnn Host, Anderson Cooper 360:] They're so adorable. They're just being themselves. See more of that interview with Maxwell and Finnegan, and their dads, tomorrow night on The Van Jones Show, 7 P.M. Eastern, right here on CNN. His other guest will be Andrew Yang, a Democratic contender, of course, for the White House. Hard to compete though with Maxwell and Finnegan! The news continues. Want to hand it over to Chris for
[Cuomo Prime Time. Chris Cuomo, Cnn Host, Cuomo Prime Time:] All right, thank you very much, Anderson. I am Chris Cuomo. Welcome to PRIME TIME. What do you say? Let's get after it.
[Text:] CUOMO PRIME TIME.
[Cuomo:] For all the noise, there is one central question. Is President Trump actively pressuring a foreign power to help in his re-election bid? After three years of investigation, and one Mueller report, to prevent future meddling, is the President really taking us down this road again? Here's the latest. CNN confirmed tonight that President Trump did pressure the President of Ukraine to investigate Joe Biden's son, in a call, earlier this summer. The Wall Street Journal, owned by a Trump pal, also reports that pressure was applied, about eight times, in that one call, in hopes Ukraine would work with the President's lawyer, Rudy Giuliani. Giuliani was pushing for Ukraine to look into Biden's son, Hunter too, as he shared last night, in a denial turned admission, that was like something out of a Few Good Men. Did you to ask the Ukraine to investigate Joe Biden?
[Rudy Giuliani, Attorney To President Donald Trump, Former Mayor Of New York City:] No. Actually, I didn't. I asked the Ukraine to investigate the allegations that there was interference in the election of 2016, by the Ukrainians, for the benefit of Hillary Clinton, for which there already is a court finding-
[Cuomo:] You never asked anything about Hunter Biden? You never asked anything about Joe Biden-
[Giuliani:] The only thing I asked about Joe Biden-
[Cuomo:] -and his role with the prosecutor.
[Giuliani:] -is to get to the bottom of how it was that Lutsenko who was appointed-
[Cuomo:] Right.
[Giuliani:] -dismissed a case against Antack.
[Cuomo:] So, you did ask Ukraine to look into Joe Biden?
[Giuliani:] Of course, I did.
[Cuomo:] You just said you didn't. You see how you have to see past the passion, and see the purpose. Giuliani came with a plan, to provide cover for the President, which we will deconstruct for you tonight, in detail. And how do we see the proof of it? Well, just today, the President followed his lead. He did not deny that he too personally asked the foreign government to probe his political opponent. Listen.
[Donald Trump, President, United States Of America:] It doesn't matter what I discuss. But I will say this. Somebody ought to look into Joe Biden's statement because it was disgraceful, where he talked about billions of dollars that he's not giving to a certain country, unless a certain prosecutor's taken off the case. So, somebody ought to look into that.
[Cuomo:] We will show you why what the President discussed does matter, and why he discussed it matters even more. And the facts and questions that are driving both concerns, we will lay out, especially now that this President has to explain the same action that he's calling out Biden for, withholding aid to Ukraine. Why did this President release $250 million in Ukraine aid only right after Congressman Schiff asked for information about the whistleblower? As for Biden, he's coming out swinging. "If these reports are true, then there is truly no bottom to President Trump's willingness to abuse his power and abase our country." All right, so let's start filling in the blanks with two top investigators. We have Preet Bharara and Andrew McCabe. Gentlemen, thank you both. So, Preet, when we are looking at this situation, and we're trying to understand what matters, what pops out to you first?
[Preet Bharara, Cnn Senior Legal Analyst, Former U.s. Attorney, Distinguished Scholar, Nyu Law School, Host, "stay Tuned With Preet" Podcast:] Look, you have, as you discussed in the intro, a repeat situation. You have someone who has taken the country through whatever you think about the results, whatever you think about Bob Mueller. We've had two years in which there's been an amazing amount of scrutiny and discussion about the sitting President of the United States, when he was a candidate, and then thereafter, trying to gain an advantage, electorally, against an opponent, by with open arms, asking for help from a foreign power. At the end of the day, there wasn't a crime. At the end of the day, the Office of Legal Counsel says "You can't indict a sitting President." But that's what we've been talking about. Now, here you have a situation where, if the facts are true, and they're they're unfolding in a rapid rate over the over the last couple of days, and will continue to do so, at bottom, you have a sitting President, once again, who is acting like a recidivist. I don't mean that in the legal, you know, at you know, technical term. But he's once again seeking assistance from a foreign power to harm a political rival, the person who might be his opponent in the general election next year. That's crazy, given what he's already put the country through. And, you know-
[Cuomo:] Is it illegal?
[Bharara:] So, I knew you were going to ask that. And and I've been thinking it over the last couple of days about how to talk about this. And it's natural for someone who's a former former prosecutor my expertise is in proving cases beyond a reasonable doubt, and figuring out what evidence you need to meet the elements of a crime. But I want I want to make sure that we don't go down the same road that we have in the past. And that is, to create a culture and an atmosphere, in which, the only thing that matters is did he commit a crime, right? And-
[Cuomo:] If it's not a felony, then it's fine.
[Bharara:] Yes. And and sometimes, you can get to that place when all we talk about is because it's, you know, it's the most sensational thing. If you commit a crime, then that's a big deal. Although, as we understand, and everyone understands now, they didn't two years ago, you can't indict a sitting President. So, whether it's a crime or not, for purposes of of immediate accountability, does it mean a whole hell of a lot? So, I want to make sure that people understand whether or not, for for technical reasons, or substantive reasons, you can make out the elements of conspiracy to commit campaign finance fraud, or extortion, or bribery, some of which elements seem to be-
[Cuomo:] Could still be wrong even if it isn't.
[Bharara:] It is an abuse-
[Cuomo:] Yes.
[Bharara:] If it is true that he is doing these things, it's an abuse of power, and Congress can act because the the question to ask is not limit yourself solely to "Well, was this OK based on the particular facts of the case?" If this is OK, if the President of the United States can call up foreign leaders, and withhold aid, or threaten, you know, various sanctions or other things, in exchange for having them do something to harm a political opponent, then what can he not do?
[Cuomo:] Right.
[Bharara:] Do we really want Rudy Giuliani to be flying around the world, and figuring out what buttons to push, on the part of foreign leaders, whether it's in Russia, or China, or Japan, or anywhere else, to to figure out a way to harm a political opponent. That's not what we do in America, whether or not you can make out a criminal case.
[Cuomo:] So, Andrew, that takes us to Rudy Giuliani and my suggestion that he came last night with an obvious agenda. It wasn't just distraction. "I don't want to talk about the President. And I want to talk about Joe Biden." He needs you, me, and everyone listening, to believe that they have a deeply bona fide conviction, deep and bona fide, that Biden was corrupt, his son was corrupt, and their legitimate questions of interest to United States' national security, because then, if the President asked about it, even if he withheld aid, because of its concern about it, well then it's not about his personal agenda, or just wanting to hurt an opponent. Let me give an example of what happened last night. -the President of Ukraine.
[Giuliani:] If the President of the United States said to the President of any country, I have I I am not going to give you money because your country is corrupt, you got to straighten out these problems.
[Cuomo:] We don't know that- And sure enough, Andrew, today what did the President say? "Doesn't matter what I talked about. But somebody should look into Biden. That was terrible what he said." See, it's about the corruption, not about the advantage.
[Andrew Mccabe, Former Fbi Deputy Director, Cnn Contributor:] That's right, Chris. I mean there's clearly so much to unpack here. But part of it is a return to the time-honored Rudy Giuliani's strategy, that we all saw, employed so effectively, in the defense of Donald Trump, under the Special Counsel investigation. And that strategy is, "Don't look at this. You know, look up here. Look at this other thing up here. Don't let's not talk about what I did. It's about what you did." And so, again, as you've said, Mr. Giuliani came on television last night, and laid out a conspiracy theory, that if you actually parse through the information that we know, about the actions that were taken in Ukraine, and the the the previous corrupt prosecutor, and the fact that he's been you know, there is absolutely no evidence to indicate that either Biden did anything improper, and that in the earlier investigation of Hunter Biden's activities with respect to that energy company, were basically cleared before any of this stuff happened. But put all that aside, Mr. Giuliani threw out some very compelling and inflammatory conspiracy theories, and those are the things that will capture the attention of Mr. Trump's supporters, and will carry them through, hopefully, if you're Rudy Giuliani, this period, rather than suspecting the President of having done something improper. They've given them a inflammatory and salacious story to point to, and say, "No. It's not what about what the President did. It's about what the other side did." So, this is just what we've been watching and going through for two years. But I should say one thing, as well, just to tack on to what some of Preet's comments. This simple fact that we now have, quite possibly, we're not sure because we don't have all the facts yet, but we may have the President of the United States, and his personal emissary, exhorting, or in fact, possibly extorting, a foreign government to commence a criminal investigation of a United States citizen is remarkable. I don't know that I have ever seen, or heard, any such thing from a President or any other Head of Agency, you know, in my 21 years in government service. Yes, do do U.S. law enforcement officers, and the FBI work with foreign partners? Absolutely. But that is when we have an ongoing, fully, lawfully authorized criminal inquiry, we've reach out to other governments through mutual legal assistance treaties-
[Cuomo:] Right.
[Mccabe:] -and we ask for information. We don't have the President of the United States get on the phone, and put pressure on a foreign country, to start, you know, essentially persecuting a U.S. citizen. That is remarkable.
[Cuomo:] So, there are a couple of boxes, I need you guys to stay around, to check. One is, you got to explain to me the difference between exhort and extort. Only Preet knows the difference between those things. We have to get the whole audience up to speed. But that's why I have you guys with the bigger brains. Two, I want to game out what else we need to know that would matter, and why? And third, unpacking a little bit about the Biden considerations. We know the Ukraine situation. Rudy also brought up allegations about China. What do we know? What are the open questions? There are facts to report and there are questions to ask. So, let's take a break. We'll lay out more information. And then, we'll be back with Bharara and McCabe, next.
[Text:] CUOMO PRIME TIME.