[Wolf Blitzer, Cnn Anchor:] We begin with the grief that has enveloped so many American families. Yet another one. More sorrow coming to another American family, families that have known all the sorrow since the terror attacks since 911. Pat Tillman, once with the NFL, most recently a Special Forces soldier, has been killed in action in Afghanistan. Our Pentagon correspondent, Barbara Starr, is standing by. She has more on this very sad story Barbara.
[Barbara Starr, Cnn Pentagon Correspondent:] Well, Wolf, details reaching the Pentagon earlier today. Indeed, Pat Tillman was killed in action in Afghanistan yesterday. His family has now been notified. He was killed in an operation, we are told, along the southeastern border between Afghanistan and Pakistan. An area where special operations had been moving very swiftly against Taliban and al Qaeda remnants. A number of firefights in that region in recent days and weeks. Pat Tillman, of course, a very unusual young man. He was 27 years old. After the 911 attacks, he simply literally walked away from an NFL football career, from a $3.6 million three-year contract with the Arizona Cardinals to join the U.S. military. He joined the Army Rangers to serve. He granted no interviews, no publicity. He had a tour in Iraq, and now in Afghanistan. Arizona Senator John McCain talked about Pat Tillman in his book, noting how much this young man gave up to join the U.S. military. Senator McCain in his book noting, "It wasn't a moment of crisis and strife that motivated Pat Tillman. It was the recognition that the United States was under attack, and he volunteered to defend it." And as you say, Wolf, the Pentagon reminding everyone that so many families have had their loved ones killed in Afghanistan and Iraq. Many of those names, of course, not recognized by the U.S. public. But all of them serving honorably the Pentagon wants to remind us Wolf.
[Blitzer:] And he was an Army Ranger. So that means he was in Special Forces. Do we have anymore details about the specific incident?
[Starr:] We do not, Wolf. However, what we do know, along the southeastern border with Pakistan, this is an area that Special Forces have been moving through for some time now. Their mission in this area is to hunt down Taliban and al Qaeda, people crossing the border, remnants. There have been, as we say, any number of ambushes and firefights in recent weeks. They have run into roadside bombs. They have run into attacks, guerrilla-type hit and run attacks. We simply don't have the details. The Army has not yet released them about what happened in this case.
[Blitzer:] Barbara Starr at the Pentagon. Thanks very much. In the Iraqi city of Fallujah, there's a tenuous cease-fire, if that at all. Insurgents seem to be digging in. They're by no means giving up. And U.S. forces are clearly losing their patience. CNN's Jim Clancy is keeping an eye on this very tense situation. He's joining us live from Baghdad. What do you hear, what is the latest, Jim?
[Jim Clancy, Cnn Correspondent:] Well, the latest is that it's quiet along the front lines there in Fallujah. But at same time, there's little progress to cement the terms of this cease-fire into place so that it could become a permanent truce, so these joint patrols with U.S. and Iraqi police could begin, so that we would see some of the arms turned in. That simply isn't happening in the quantities that are needed. And then there is the issue of the foreign fighters. And Wolf, there's probably no more important issue there. The U.S. military clearly believes that there are not just dozens but perhaps hundreds of foreign fighters inside Fallujah who may have links to some of acts of terror elsewhere in Iraq. They simply don't know the answer to all of that. But it is not a problem that they can ignore. And they are telling Iraqi officials, some of the people in that town, the religious and community leaders there, they have to make this work. They have to convince them. Paul Bremer going on television, national television here in Iraq today, trying to stress the message that the foreign fighters are the ones behind a lot of the violence in Iraq. That it is former regime elements that were tied to Saddam Hussein that are also behind the attacks. And they need the help of the Iraqi people to build their own future. This is one where we have already heard, as you well know, Wolf, it's a matter of days, not weeks, until the U.S. military will have to decide whether to remain where they are, or go back in Wolf.
[Blitzer:] On another issue, I just want to try to clarify precisely what this means, this apparent shift in the coalition strategy in allowing former high-level members of the Ba'ath Party now to take over specific roles after a careful screening. What exactly is happening?
[Clancy:] It's important to understand here, Wolf. You know, we talk it would appear to be old regime members coming back. That isn't the case. What you have are Army officers that were not guilty of committing any crimes as a part of Saddam Hussein's military. You have teachers that joined the Ba'ath Party because they were required to. More than 14,000 of them lost their jobs automatically under the de-baathification process. They are going to get their jobs back, are going to receive their pensions as a result of this. The Army officers are going to be talked to by the defense minister. They've already been talked to by some ranking members the Iraqi Governing Council with a mind of bringing them back into the fold. Why? Because the U.S., the coalition see that this is a situation where they've alienated a lot of Sunni Muslims. They're not the majority in Iraq, but they're a very substantial minority. They need to bring them into the process. They believe that a lot of the unemployed military officers may, in fact, be the ones that are directing a lot of the attacks against the U.S. They believe that bringing them back into the military, they may give them a future, they may give them a possibility of taking part in a new Iraq. It's something that's going to have to be developed over days, but it's a very important development being billed as a technical adjustment, if you will. But it's a lot more than that Wolf.
[Blitzer:] Jim Clancy explaining a complicated situation to us. Thanks, Jim, very much. Let's get a little bit more information on all of these developments, the challenges facing coalition forces. Two men can speak to that. They are joining us now live from Baghdad. Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt and coalition spokesman Dan Senor, they're over at the Palace Hotel in Baghdad. Thanks to both of you for joining us. General Kimmitt, let me begin with you. If you could sort of elaborate on what Jim Clancy was just now talking about. Are you now allowed ready to allow colonels and even generals who served under Saddam Hussein's military to once again and come back and have active duty roles?
[Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt, U.s. Army:] Well, we've always said that as we build the new Iraqi Army and the Iraqi armed forces, that we're going to need senior leadership. We have been building the Iraqi armed forces over the past year from the bottom up. We've got platoons, we've got the company commanders, we have the battalion commanders. We are now getting to the point where we will need division commandeers, we're going to need a general staff. These aren't people that you can just take off the street. These are people who have had many years of experience in the military and inside of Iraq. Many of those members of the former Iraqi Army who have not been involved in politics, who don't have blood on their hands, are good candidates to bring back in.
[Blitzer:] Well, let me let Dan Senor pick up on one policy, a political point. A lot of those Ba'ath Party members, most of them, were, of course, Sunnis, because they dominated Iraq under Saddam Hussein. How will the Shiites feel when they see some of these former Ba'ath Party loyalists, Ba'ath Party members now taking over responsible roles inside the new Iraq?
[Dan Senor, Coalition Spokesman:] Wolf, the de-baathification policy that Ambassador Bremer issued last May that we worked with the Governing Council on for procedures last fall, that were finalized in January, those policies remain intact. The Shia and every Iraqi should know that we believe that the criminal Ba'athists have no new role in Iraq, that the Ba'athist ideology have no new role in the new Iraq, period, end of issue. The policy remains intact. The only issue is, from a technical standpoint, there was an appeals avenue, an appeals process for thousands of individuals who were de-baathified, but, in fact, were Ba'athists in name only. They didn't actually have a functionary role or any kind of role in the horrific scenes that the senior Ba'athists were engaged in. Those Iraqis should have an opportunity to get back into the system. They've appealed. Their appeals have been granted. But their jobs haven't been reinstated. All Ambassador Bremer announced today is those individuals for whom appeals have been granted will have an opportunity to get back in. And those who want to appeal going forward will get answers within 20 days. That's it. It's purely a technical point on the procedures. The overall policy about senior Ba'athists not have a new role in government remains intact.
[Blitzer:] General Kimmitt, what about Fallujah? We keep hearing reports and we just heard it from Jim Clancy himself. Yesterday, I was speaking with Tony Perry. He is one of the embedded journalists from the Los Angeles Times, he's in Fallujah that the Marines are quickly running out of patience and that it's only of a matter of a few days before they move in, unless the insurgents lay down their arms? Explain to our viewers what's going on.
[Kimmitt:] Well, Wolf, as you know, 10 days ago 13 days ago, as a matter of fact, we conducted a unilateral suspension of offensive operations. We put the Marines down in place where they were and said, we're going to stop offensive operations and give the political solution, the political track an opportunity to come to a peaceful settlement. It's been 13 days of discussions, talks, going back and forth. We laid down on the table some very clear methods by which the people inside Fallujah could show a good-faith effort to demonstrate that they were willing to achieve a peaceful solution that included turning in all of the heavy weapons. I think you've seen over the past couple of days the type of weapons they've turned in: old, rusty, unusable. The ammunition is dangerous, couldn't be used. And it would not appear that we should go on much longer with this fiction that somehow we are going to have people coming to the table with serious offers for a political solution. We remain focused on getting the Iraqi police service back in, the Iraqi Civil Defense Service to that town, legitimate control back into that town. There is a political, peaceful solution. But time is running out for the people Fallujah that are behind the killings.
[Blitzer:] Have you given the insurgents a formal deadline?
[Kimmitt:] We are have made it very clear to the people who are talking to the insurgents their time is running out, and that we're repaired to resume operations in the near future.
[Blitzer:] Do you want to elaborate on what "near future" means?
[Kimmitt:] Days.
[Blitzer:] All right. I'll leave it at that. Dan Senor, let me bring you back into this conversation. There's now suggestions that after June 30, starting on July 1, some sort of new interim Iraqi government will assume sovereignty, will assume control of the country. But it will really have some limited roles, won't be allowed, for example, to create or pass new laws, won't have complete control over the military. What do you know about this new formula that apparently the special U.N. envoy, Lakhdar Brahimi, is coming up with?
[Senor:] Well, let's let Mr. Brahimi make a formal recommendation before we react too quickly. But broadly speaking, Wolf, I would say that the government that takes over on June 30 is an interim government. It's a caretaker government that is really there to manage the affairs of the country until a democratically-elected, directly-elected Iraqi government takes over early in 2005. We have said for some time that we thought the responsibilities of the interim government would be limited to running the ministries, preparing the 2005 budget, and putting the electoral infrastructure in place necessary for the direct elections in January of 2005. It's an interim government. Their agenda is short term, and it will therefore be narrow. But I don't think that should be confused with the fact the Iraqi people will have sovereignty on June 30. They will be in control of their political destiny. They will be running their country. Jerry Bremer will get on a plane and go home and an Iraqi will be in charge here.
[Blitzer:] All right. Let me get another military question to General Kimmitt, if I can. The situation in Najaf, there are suggestions Muqtada al-Sadr may be holed up there. There are a lot of U.S. troops surrounding that holy city to Shiites. What can you tell us about the military standoff there?
[Kimmitt:] Well, we've said all along that Sadr remains a target. The city of Najaf is not our target. He is clearly a man that is wanted by Iraqi magistrate court for the murder of one of the most prominent human rights advocates inside this country, Ayatollah Ali Quri. This can't go on either. Sadr clearly understands the terms under which he can come out of that city and he can bring peace to the region, which is turn himself over to an Iraqi police station, end the violence end any potential for future violence between his illegal militia and the coalition.
[Blitzer:] Dan Senor, what do you know, what can you tell us about any Iranians who may be playing some sort of role in the overall situation in Iraq?
[Senor:] We don't know about it. We don't know if it exists. We have been quite clear to the Iranians that have approached us that their role here in Iraq should be constructive, not destructive. There was a meeting recently that the Iraqi the Iranian foreign ministry organized, sent over a delegation. They met with our colleagues form the U.K. on the ground here. We did have an American representation there, but the purpose of the meeting had nothing to do with the Sadr situation. It was just broadly about Iraq issues in general. As far as the Sadr situation is concerned, middle man, to use your term, we believe that the Sadr situation must be resolved by Iraqis, not Iranians, Wolf. And we've been quite clear on that front to the Iranians. There is no role for them to play middle man.
[Blitzer:] One final question for you, General. Do you have enough troops? Does General Sanchez have enough troops on the ground right now in Iraq right now to fulfill his mission?
[Kimmitt:] We have made no formal request for additional troops. We are quite comfortable with the capacity we have on the ground to meet the near-term and immediate-term threats that we see ahead of us. The president been quite clear. If we ask, he will take care of it. But we haven't made any formal requests of late.
[Blitzer:] General Kimmitt, Dan Senor, as usual, thanks to both of you for joining us here on CNN. We'll check back with you obviously very, very often. And we're learning new information about that train explosion that killed dozens and injured hundreds. Hear what North Korean officials are saying now who may to blame with the disaster. We'll be live with the story. Plus this...
[Mcdermott:] If we have a generational war, then all of us should take some responsibility for this country. If it's a nation at war.
[Blitzer:] The debate over the draft. Who's for it? Who's against it? Colonel Pat Lang, Congressman Jim McDermott, they are my guests. They disagree. We will get both perspectives. Stay with us.