[Camerota:] The president, again, lashing out at his former personal attorney Michael Cohen. In return for decades of devotion to Donald Trump, Mr. Trump now says Michael Cohen should face stiff punishment and serve a long prison sentence. By contrast, President Trump is praising Roger Stone who, at the moment, is refusing to testify against the president. Joining us now are former House Intelligence chairman and CNN national security commentator, Mike Rogers. And, director and president, and CEO of the Wilson Center and former U.S. congresswoman from California, Jane Harman. Both of your credentials are too long to read. I only this is only a 3-hour show, OK, people?
[Jane Harman , Director, President, And Ceo, Wilson Center, Former U.s. Congresswoman From California, Former Ranking Member, House Intelligence Committee:] His are.
[Camerota:] So, number one, as my grandfather would have said, that's a fine how-do-you-do for Michael Cohen, first of all, and all of his devotion to Donald Trump. But here is the tweet that some people think puts the president in legal jeopardy, OK? This is the president yesterday. "I will never testify against Trump. This statement was recently made by Roger Stone, essentially stating that he will not be forced by a rogue and out of control prosecutor to make up lies and stories about President Trump. Nice to know that some people still have guts!" Jane, is that the dangling of a pardon? Is that witness tampering, to your mind?
[Harman:] Well, I am a trained lawyer but I'm not a litigator and I don't want to opine about that. But I think it's a careless statement and let's see what happens in a year or so if the evidence if the evidence shows that not only that he lied this Roger Stone we're talking about but that the future for him is absolutely grim. I assume he has a family, and kids, and grandkids, et cetera. And, you know, the moment of truth hasn't yet arrived for him.
[Camerota:] They haven't even reached out to him, which is notable. Mueller's prosecutors have not, as far as we know, reached out to Roger Stone.
[Harman:] What I was going to say is the sadness is here were are at the time of the Bush funeral in Washington where people recall decency, courage, restraint, good manners, et cetera, and we have this coarse exchange going on on the airwaves certainly, not in this room
[Camerota:] Of course, not.
[Harman:] not by him or you or John Berman. But I'm just saying this is sad. And, Donald Trump seems totally transactional. If you're loyal to him this minute, you get praised. And I just don't know how this wears over time. And the last thing I want to say about the Mueller inquiry is I do know him and Mike knows him, too. He came to the FBI right around 911. I was a very senior Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee and worked closely with him. His tradecraft is meticulous, he's a Republican. And what he wants to do is find out what the truth is, and that's what he should be doing.
[Camerota:] And so, because you were both on the House Intel Committee, as chair, Mike, would something like this have gotten your attention?
[Mike Rogers, Cnn National Security Commentator,  Former Chairman, House Intelligence Committee:] Well, listen, I think it's bad form. And as a former FBI guy, I just don't think that rises to the level of a crime. But you don't want your President of the United States out there talking about this in any way or encouraging people not to cooperate with a prosecutor of any form special prosecutor, U.S. prosecutor, local prosecutor.
[Camerota:] But that is what this is doing. I mean, by saying the people who don't cooperate have guts, you don't think that that's a crime. It's a
[Rogers:] I don't think it's a crime. Listen, I think it's terrible bad form, it's unseemly, it shouldn't happen. Then but, you know, the fact that these people are flipping I worked organized crime when I was in the FBI and if Sammy "the Bull" Gravano, who was the lieutenant who killed, you know, dozens of people on behalf of John Gotti, the head of the Gambino crime family if he flips, all of these people will flip eventually. So all of these statements that the president's going to make I'm telling you, when one of those prosecutors or those agents walk in and say guess what, you're going to jail. And these folks, I wouldn't say, are the toughest hombres on the block, right? They think they're tough where they're at.
[Camerota:] Yes.
[Rogers:] They start going
[Camerota:] Yes.
[Rogers:] and talking prison time, they are going to cooperate. I just would again, the whole thing is unseemly and it's very unpresidential and I wish he wouldn't do it.
[Camerota:] There are things in the Mueller investigation that are going to be revealed this week. This is an important week.
[Harman:] Yes.
[Camerota:] So there will be Michael Flynn's sentencing memo. So we will know in the public, for the first time, really what Michael Flynn has offered up, what Michael Flynn did. What the deal was with Sergei Kislyak, the ambassador who he was trying to work a backroom deal with sanctions. Paul Manafort we will also know more about his sentencing. An interesting development from "The New York Times" this morning. There was talk that Paul Manafort had gone to Ecuador to do something with Julian Assange. Here's a little bit more information for you both about that. "In at least two meetings with Mr. Manafort, Mr. Moreno" who is the incoming president at that time, in Ecuador "and his aides discussed their desire to rid themselves of Mr. Assange in exchange for concessions like debt relief from the United States, according to three people familiar with these talks. They said Mr. Manafort suggested he could help negotiate a deal for the handover of Mr. Assange to the United States." What's interesting about this is that yes, he did go to Ecuador. Yes, he did have these conversations. Now, that was his job. He often did these sort of backroom international deals as a consultant. We don't know if there was any connection here to, at the time, Donald Trump. What does this tell you about where we are, Jane?
[Harman:] Well, I like Mike's analogy to the mob prosecution. It tells you that the circles are closing. That one person talks about the next person who talks about the next person. And who's in the center of the circle? Hmm, we'll just see. But again, it I don't want to get ahead of
[Camerota:] Yes.
[Harman:] what's going on with them.
[Camerota:] Agreed, because there have been no direct links. I mean, actually, there's been nothing that we know of that suggests that Donald Trump directed Michael Flynn to do what he did or that Donald Trump directed Paul Manafort to have these talks.
[Harman:] No.
[Camerota:] I hear you.
[Harman:] But the story is being told through these pleadings and the legal documents that the Mueller group is filing. And he has personally signed a couple of the recent ones, the point being that he's ready to put his own credibility on the line for this. And as people are speculating, by the time we get to the end of this we may not need a report because the report may be through the court system, and through a series of indictments, and through a series of plea deals. And I think that's how our court system is supposed to work. And again, the goal is the truth. The goal isn't to get people.
[Camerota:] And if he did?
[Rogers:] You know, I just think the Flynn what's the Flynn document is going to be very interesting to me because he's been pretty quiet
[Camerota:] What are you looking for?
[Rogers:] You know, obviously, he was close to the campaign, close on the national security front throughout the campaign and then became his national security adviser. So he is the one person that was inside the White House and so he could talk not only about what happened pre-campaign but during his first few weeks at the White House. That will tell you where the focus of the prosecution is, I think, if whatever you'll get in the sentencing guideline they won't give you everything but they'll give you very important clues about where they're going and why that's important to understand. Is he going after the president? Is Mueller going after the president? Is Mueller just going to lay out the cause of what happened on Russian
[Camerota:] Yes.
[Rogers:] interference in the election?
[Camerota:] President Trump, obviously, isn't the first person first president to have to face some sort of scandal or controversy in office. Do you worry when you watched the G20 and what happened, and how he presented the U.S. on the international stage that it is too distracting for him? That it is getting in the way of doing the U.S. business?
[Harman:] Well, I actually thought that was his best summit meeting. And some things may have happened, like the dinner with President Xi, may lead to some kind of reasonable stand-down on the U.S.-China trade dispute. That's important because having a reasonable trading relationship with China matters to the U.S. It matters to U.S. jobs, something the president cares about. I also think that we have a very competitive relationship with China and China is doing some things wrong. But it matters, again, that we try to find a way forward. I just want to say one thing, which is Gina Haspel is now going to testify the CIA director before some members of the Senate chairmen and rankers of four committees and that's, obviously, to stave off a resolution on Yemen. I think, frankly, that resolution should proceed. But I also think it's a good thing, and I'm sure Mike agrees with me, that we have testimony from her about what happened in the Khashoggi matter.
[Camerota:] Yes. Look, I mean, Sen. Lindsey Graham was on record of how frustrated he was that she hadn't been sent last week to do all of that. Jane Harman, Mike Rogers, thank you both very much.
[Harman:] Thank you.
[Rogers:] Thanks so much.
[Camerota:] As always, great to have you here
[Rogers:] Appreciate it.
[Camerota:] with us John.
[Berman:] All right, thanks so much. A new day and a new data breach. While we were getting ready to tell you all about the huge Marriott hack, another one came along that stopped us dead in our tracks. Why these cyberattacks are worse than you think. A CNN reality check, next.