[Baldwin:] So much attention has been focused on Donald Trump and Senator Ted Cruz in the lead-up to the all-important Iowa caucuses four days from now. The Republican presidential candidates are really at the top of the polls here, so close when you look at the numbers. Behind them, distant third, you have Florida Senator Marco Rubio. He is on the trail in Iowa trying to remind his supporters to keep the big picture in mind, defeating the Democrats come November. And Rubio warned them not to get sidetracked by the fact Trump is boycotting tonight's debate.
[Sen. Marco Rubio, , Florida & Presidential Candidate:] 90 percent of their coverage is on this whole thing, oh, Donald Trump's not going to show up. Ted Cruz is challenging him to a one-on-one, mano-o-mano debate. Interesting side show, greatest show on earth. This is not a show. This is serious. We cannot lose this election. We have to turn this country around now. We cannot wait another four years.
[Baldwin:] Joining me now here in New York is Utah Congressman Jason Chaffetz. He's the chair with the House Oversight Committee. He is supporting Rubio for president of the United States. Congressman, so great to see you.
[Rep. Jason Chaffetz, , Utah:] Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.
[Baldwin:] Thank you.
[Chaffetz:] Yeah.
[Baldwin:] Listening to Marco Rubio saying, this is serious, this is not a show. When you see that and you hear that, to me, that says, my goodness, he's been on the trail, for what, six months, and he's still frustrated. He's frustrated over this guy Trump.
[Chaffetz:] There's a lot of oxygen sucked out of the room on what is legitimately a sideshow about whether or not he's going to be in the debate, not be at the debate
[Baldwin:] Even before then.
[Chaffetz:] We, as Republicans, we better darn well start talking about issues, about policies, and why conservatives in the White House would be better for the country. That's the heart and soul of why Rubio is running. He's very conservative. But he's got to be talking about the issues. And these other little things are distracting.
[Baldwin:] How does he do that tonight, sans Trump on the stage? How does he sell that to the American people?
[Chaffetz:] Look, Trump not in the room, A, most people get more time. And when you get in and start talking about foreign policy, about how to grow the economy, all those types of things, Marco shines. He is our best foot forward as Republicans. If we want to win in November, we better darn well have Marco Rubio at the top of the ticket.
[Baldwin:] Hoping to outshine Marco Rubio is Senator Ted Cruz, who will finally get that center podium spot. I talked to a lot of people. There's a lot of negativity swirling around him. The fact there's not a single Republican Senator who works with him on the Hill who is saying we like this guy to me speaks volumes. Why is that? Why is not a single Senator publicly endorsing him?
[Chaffetz:] He'll have to answer that. There's a reason why a lot of us of the younger generation support Marco Rubio, myself, Trey Gowdy, and a host of others. We're behind Marco Rubio because I happen to have met and spent time with every single candidate on both sides of the aisle, some more than others, and Marco Rubio is just that person who we gravitate to as that leader.
[Baldwin:] Why not Cruz? Give me something. I mean, I see this look in your eye.
[Chaffetz:] I don't want to say anything negative about him. I can tell you the positives are so great for Marco Rubio. He's just an engaging personality we trust. And Marco has actually passed some substantive legislation. When he went after those risk corridors and got that legislation passed in his first term that shows success in bringing both sides of the aisle together that other candidates haven't been able to do.
[Baldwin:] So success in Washington, but when you hear hear House Speaker Paul Ryan say, you look at all these guys and gals and it's like a circular firing squad, that's not a good thing.
[Chaffetz:] I don't think you've seen Rubio taking direct shots. He's been
[Baldwin:] Do agree with Speaker Ryan?
[Chaffetz:] Well, yeah. When we're beating up on each other, we're not beating up on the policy differences between ourselves and Clinton and Sanders.
[Baldwin:] Rubio's taking direct shots? Really?
[Chaffetz:] He's had $20 million laid down and he's still in the top three. That's pretty remarkable, and I think shows the staying power. That's not going to be let up after the nominee comes. You have to be able to take a lot of Clinton fire and a lot of Democratic money coming after you. I think they're mostly scared about having Marco Rubio at the top of the ticket than they would be Senator Cruz or any of the others.
[Baldwin:] Did you hear what Vice President Joe Biden said?
[Chaffetz:] No, I didn't.
[Baldwin:] Let me share with you. He said actually, we have the sound. Here you go.
[Chaffetz:] OK.
[Joe Biden, Vice President Of The United States:] We may be given a gift from the Lord in the presidential race here.
[Baldwin:] Cruz or what's his name. He's the vice president.
[Chaffetz:] I would agree with the vice president. The last couple of cycles have been tough because we are not fans of what President Obama has been doing, and with him as the vice president. He just said the last couple cycles have been tough, I would agree with him.
[Baldwin:] A gift from God. To you point, it's
[Chaffetz:] Give the vice president a microphone and there will be material there, so, yeah.
[Baldwin:] Congressman Chaffetz. OK, final question
[Chaffetz:] We have a lot of good qualified candidates. There's a lot of people who don't
[Baldwin:] Isn't that part of the problem?
[Chaffetz:] I also think it's an opportunity because we have a very diverse ticket, from Carly Fiorina to Dr. Carson to you keep going down the list, we have a very diversified ticket above and beyond what normally people say, oh, Republicans, there's just all this certain type. We have two people, a Cruz and a Rubio, that have their names on the ballot. You would have never expected that two, three years ago. They're still getting familiar with these people. I'm convinced in my heart when people get to know Marco Rubio, hear him, see him, understand him, listen to him in the debate, that's why he has this growing momentum and support, and why I think he's the best foot forward come November. I really believe it.
[Baldwin:] Congressman Jason Chaffetz, thank you very much.
[Chaffetz:] Thank you. Thank you.
[Baldwin:] Coming up next, new developments in Flint, Michigan, and the effort to fix this ongoing crisis of lead-tainted water. My next guest is stepping up to help people who need it the most. She is the queen of soul, Detroit native, Aretha Franklin, live on CNN, next.