[Wolf Blitzer:] Happening now: Republican presidential candidate Jon Huntsman slamming his rival, the front-runner Mitt Romney, for alleged flip-flopping, calling him and I'm quoting Huntsman "a perfectly lubricated weather vane." Also, a fugitive son of Moammar Gadhafi wanted for crimes against humanity now talking to international prosecutors about a possible surrender. And while the U.S. faces record deficits, one oil company, major oil companies, I should say, major U.S. oil companies, are raking in near record profits, so why are they still getting huge taxpayer subsidies? I'm Wolf Blitzer. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM. He skipped the last presidential debate and he sidelined himself in Iowa saying he wants to focus on the first-in-the-nation primary state. Former Utah Governor Jon Huntsman is betting almost everything on New Hampshire, but he is trailing in that critical state, while rival Mitt Romney is enjoying a substantial lead. And now Huntsman is joining some of Romney's sharpest critics in questioning Romney's conservative credentials. Jon Huntsman is joining us now from Salt Lake City. Governor, thanks very much for coming in.
[Jon Huntsman , Presidential Candidate:] Thank you, Wolf. It's an honor to be with you.
[Blitzer:] Let's first of all talk about Mitt Romney a little bit. George Will, the conservative columnist, writing in an upcoming edition of "The Washington Post" says this about Mitt Romney. He says: "Romney, supposedly the Republican most electable next November, is a recidivist reviser of his principles who is not only becoming less electable. He might endanger GOP chances of capturing the Senate. Republicans may have found their Michael Dukakis, a technocratic Massachusetts governor who takes his bearings from data." You agree with George Will on that?
[Huntsman:] Those are pretty tough words, Wolf. All I can say is this is a time when this nation wants leadership. We have been looking for leadership for some time in the White House. We haven't found it. This is when the candidates need to stand up and show a little bit of leadership. You can't be a perfectly lubricated weather vane on the issues of the day, whether it's Libya, whether it's the debt ceiling, whether it's the discussion around the Kasich bill in Ohio where Governor Romney has been missing in action in terms of showing any kind of leadership. I do believe that the electoral this go-around will be looking for clearly defined presidential leadership and I'm not sure that we're seeing it. We're putting out our own economic proposals, our foreign policy proposals. Next week, I will have an energy speech that I will be giving in New Hampshire. We're calling for clear-cut leadership positions for the United States to be taking that will get us back on our feet and secure the American century for the people of the United States.
[Blitzer:] So, when you say he's a perfectly lubricated weather vane, or when George Will says he's a recidivist reviser we're talking about Mitt Romney basically, you're both saying he's a flip-flopper on some of these most important issues.
[Huntsman:] Listen, you don't get any more important than the issue of life. That is central to a lot of people's core beliefs and political philosophy. And when you have an epiphany on something that central to one's world view, that's going to strike a lot of people as being highly political.
[Blitzer:] You're talking about abortion rights for women.
[Huntsman:] That's right.
[Blitzer:] What is your exact position on abortion rights for women? Are there any exceptions from your standpoint for a woman getting an abortion?
[Huntsman:] Incest, rape and the life of the mother are the exceptions that I can live with.
[Blitzer:] Let's move on to talk about New Hampshire because you're basically ignoring Iowa. You're throwing all your eggs into that New Hampshire basket. Our most CNN"TIME"ORC poll has Romney way ahead. He's almost living there. He's got a second home there. He's at 40 percent. Cain, 13 percent. Paul, 12 percent. You're at 6 percent. But Herman Cain, he's intriguing. He's basically spent very little time in New Hampshire or Iowa, for that matter, but he is doing pretty well in both of those states, even better in Iowa. And he comes up with these crazy ads, including this one. Watch. [Begin Video Clip, Herman Cain Campaign Ad]
[Mark Block, Herman Cain Campaign:] We can take this country back.
[Blitzer:] All right, that's his chief of staff who had a little puff of his cigarette there. But he's at 13 percent. You're at 6 percent in New Hampshire. You spent a lot of time there. He hasn't. Why is he doing so well?
[Huntsman:] Well, oftentimes, you can spike for the moment. You're the flavor of the week or the flavor of the month. I remember when Governor Perry was at 20 percent in New Hampshire. He came in with great fanfare. Now he's in the low single digits. We're just trying a steady, gradual, substantive rise in New Hampshire based upon real support, based upon 80 events we have done so far. Wolf, we did a telephone town hall meeting yesterday. We had 3,000 people on the line. Our town hall meetings are packed these days. So I say we have got a couple of very, very important months ahead in New Hampshire and the vibe that I'm getting, the way in which we are connecting with our message about rebuilding our manufacturing muscle in this country and getting people back to work is resonating with the all-important people in the first primary state.
[Blitzer:] Would you feel comfortable if Herman Cain were the Republican presidential nominee?
[Huntsman:] I think Herman Cain is an outstanding person. I have gotten to know him. He's a friend. He has a lot of the right prerequisites for understanding how the free market works. Beyond that, that's why these early primaries are so very, very important, because, ultimately, the people get to decide. And whoever they decide is the nominee for my party, I will stand behind that person.
[Blitzer:] So, you would feel comfortable if Herman Cain, on national security issues, because he's stumbled on many of these questions so far you would feel comfortable?
[Huntsman:] Well, as I say, anyone who gets through this very rigorous primary process, I think our chances are excellent for getting through this primary process I'm going to stand behind. They deserve it because it's not an easy process to endure. You have got to win over the will of the people and by the end of that process, you're pretty much up to speed on a lot of issues that matter.
[Blitzer:] You have got, among other thing, a business background, the economy still struggling, but 2.5 percent growth in the last quarter. The stock markets are doing well, above 12000. It was what 6500, 7000 when President Obama took office. Do you see a trend that a double-dip recession now is unlikely and things are at least beginning to move in the right direction?
[Huntsman:] Wolf, I think we're going to muddle along until such time as we're smart enough to actually put forward some bold, visionary proposals that attack the structural elements that are standing in the way of knocking the cover off the ball of our economic growth. And when I say that, I look at the jobs proposal package put forward by the president and it amounts to half-steps and half-measures. It's going to be incomplete, it's going to be a temporary fix. We need a long-term fix and that means tax reform. That means regulatory reform and really hitting on the issues that the investor community is looking at being cleaned up, like health care reform, Obamacare and like Dodd-Frank and ensuring that as we go forward, Wolf, we can begin to build manufacturing plants and power plants in this nation that will be able to fuel our manufacturing revival. It can be done, but until you get to the structural fixes, you're not going to have the confidence in the innovator class, in the entrepreneurial class, in the investor class, and indeed in the global economy to be able to get this to be able to get this country moving in a direction that is long-term sustainable.
[Blitzer:] We're almost out of time, but very quickly, you're the former U.S. ambassador to China. China's played a very important role in the U.S. economy. They have a lot of U.S. debt. Most recently this week, they played a significant role helping the Europeans bail out Greece and some of that enormous debt crisis there. Our viewers in China our watching. We have a lot of viewers in China as you probably know having lived in Beijing. Say something to the people of China in Mandarin right now, then translate it for us. What would you say to them given this opportunity? Governor, thanks very much for coming in. Your Mandarin's pretty good, I must say, not that I understood what you said, but it sounded pretty good.
[Huntsman:] Thank you, Wolf. It's a pleasure to be with you.
[Blitzer:] Jon Huntsman, the former governor of Utah, the former U.S. ambassador to China, and now wants to be the Republican presidential nominee. Thank you. Let's talk about what we just heard from Jon Huntsman with our chief political analyst, Gloria Borger. A perfectly lubricated weather vane, that's what he called his rival Mitt Romney. Those are pretty strong words.
[Gloria Borger, Cnn Chief Political Analyst:] Do I have to answer in Mandarin or can I answer in...
[Blitzer:] No, in English.
[Borger:] It's clear that, first of all, that's not a phrase that just comes to you off the cuff, perfectly lubricated weather vane. This is this campaign now has to differentiate between themselves and Mitt Romney and they're going to do it by talking about how Mitt Romney is a flip-flopper, blows in the wind, whatever you want to say. They have just put out an ad minutes ago, Wolf. I just looked at it on my computer, a new Web ad called "Backflip," which has a mechanical monkey doing backflips.
[Blitzer:] This is a Huntsman ad?
[Borger:] Yes, and clips Mitt Romney changing his opinion on things. Look, he's 34 points behind Mitt Romney in our poll in New Hampshire that you showed him. And that's a lot of ground to make up. So he's now got to go on the attack and that's exactly what he's doing.
[Blitzer:] But it's not just Jon Huntsman. I quoted earlier George Will, the conservative columnist. He called him a recidivist reviser, a fancy phrase for flip-flopper as well.
[Borger:] I have to tell you this is all grist for the Barack Obama campaign because they can take a look at these clips. They can read George Will's column, a conservative Republican, and say look at what Republicans were saying about Mitt Romney if he becomes the nominee.
[Blitzer:] His tax plan, his economic ideas were praised by the editorial page writers at "The Wall Street Journal," but his campaign really hasn't gotten much traction. The question is, why?
[Borger:] Well, it hasn't gotten much traction because those conservative voters, while they may like the tax plan and "The Wall Street Journal" certainly did, they don't believe that he is conservative enough. For example, Wolf, he was the only Republican presidential candidate to say he actually supported the debt ceiling agreement. He supports civil unions and then he's got one other big strike against him, which is that he used to work for Barack Obama, and not some time way back in the past, but actually until last spring, when he was the ambassador to China. So, of course Republicans are kind of looking at him and saying, can we trust you? Big problem.
[Blitzer:] He's got a lot of work ahead of him if he's going to be able to survive this campaign. We will see what happens. Thanks very much, Gloria, for That's right.. This note, by the way in our next hour here in THE SITUATION ROOM, we will speak with another Republican presidential candidate, Michele Bachmann. She will join us live here in THE SITUATION ROOM. We will talk about her campaign and also some calls from some Tea Party activists for her to actually drop out of the race. Michele Bachmann here in THE SITUATION ROOM in the next hour. They're not ready for prime time, they're not even meant for TV. These campaign Web ads are getting away with things no traditional commercial can, so why do they go viral? Stand by. Also, details of talks between the fugitive son of Moammar Gadhafi and prosecutors who accuse him of crimes against humanity, and now a surrender, yes, a surrender may be in the works. We will go to Libya. And in our next hour, CNN's Erin Burnett, she will join us as well. We will talk a lot about what's going on much more in THE SITUATION ROOM when we come back.