[Michael Smerconish, Cnn:] Can a patchwork work? I'm Michael Smerconish in Philadelphia. Catastrophe has a way of suspending ideological conflict. In the modern era, 911 brought us together. In 2008 when the Bush administration needed to bail out the banks, ideology went out the window and recently when coronavirus showed signs of crippling the economy, the Senate mustered a 96 to 0 vote for relief. Sadly, the ceasefire, the kumbaya never seems to last and so it was this week. As John Harris wrote in "POLITICO Magazine" magazine, "Ideology hasn't been suspended. It has been forcibly suppressed in ways that inevitably will come roaring back, sometimes in highly toxic ways." Last weekblue state divide. Well, consider that in Michigan protestors gathered in the State Capitol to voice their opposition to stay-at-home orders issued to slow the spread of coronavirus. There were similar protests in Virginia and Kentucky and this image from Ohio of an angry crowd at the window of the Statehouse, it went viral. In Utah, protesters held signs that read, "Resist like it's 1776," and, "America will never be a socialist country." A "Reopen North Carolina" Facebook page quickly attracted 42,000 members. Even in New York, some residents took to the streets on Thursday, despite the Empire State being the epicenter of the virus. Yesterday in Texas, Governor Greg Abbott encouraged state retailers to begin operating next Friday as retail-to-go. Customers can order items ahead of time and take curbside delivery. On Friday, the president fired off a series of tweets, "Liberate Minnesota," "Liberate Michigan," "Liberate Virginia," among them. Different states have sliding standards for what businesses and activities are deemed essential and some do seem inconsistent. Ground Zero has been Michigan. Governor Gretchen Whitmer added more restrictions. You can't travel to a second home that you own, you can't take out a boat or a jetski on the water, but kayaks are fine. She also ordered all large stores to cordon off their garden centers as part of a larger crackdown on activities deemed not necessary to sustain or protect life. Curiously, the state's list of not necessary items doesn't include lottery tickets and liquor or cannabis which stores can continue to sell. Michigan State Republicans are introducing bills to strip some power from the governor, which she says she'll veto. Likewise in Pennsylvania, the Republican-controlled legislature passed an attempt to overturn restrictions imposed by Democratic Governor Tom Wolf. Here, state-run wine and liquor stores are closed, beer distributors are open. You can't buy a book, but you can buy a gun. Golf is a no-no, but trout season opened early. Real estate agencies are closed even though some people have signed contracts and they can't move in. In Florida, the WWE World Wrestling Entertainment, which was initially closed, is now deemed essential by the governor as part of a group of sports and entertainment media with a national audience. The events will continue without an in-person audience of course. In Nevada, Las Vegas mayor Carolyn Goodman pushed back against the state's shutdown saying this.
[Mayor Carolyn Goodman , Las Vegas:] This shutdown has become one of total insanity in my opinion for there is no backup of data as to why we are shut down from the start, no plan in place how to move through the shutdown or how even to come out of it.
[Smerconish:] Friday, when the president was asked about the lockdown protests, he said this.
[Donald Trump, President Of The United States:] I think elements of what they've done is too much. These are people expressing their views. I see where they are and I see the way they're working. They seem to be very responsible people to me, but it's you know, they've been treated a little bit rough.
[Smerconish:] The president had just announced guidelines for the nation's governors regarding the restoration of American society. These guidelines were a reversal from his stance earlier in the week when he declared that the president's power over states' responses to coronavirus is, quote, "absolute." Instead, we saw a tacit acknowledgment that it's the governors who will now be calling the shots in the days, weeks and months ahead. That's probably the best outcome where government often functions best when it's closest to the people, but this ensures we're about to see a patchwork response to a virus that didn't respect international borders and will likewise transmit between states if everyone doesn't act responsibly. It remains to be seen whether the governors are going to demand the same degree of rigor from their medical advisers in justifying continued restrictions on personal liberty and economic well-being as they demand from their citizens in complying with these restrictions. Are governors going to diligently examine each restriction to determine if it's still justified and only maintain those restrictions that are clearly necessary? Perhaps a patchwork process is akin to what Winston Churchill once said about democracy, it's the worst approach except for all the others. I want to know what you think. Go to my website at Smerconish.com this hour. Answer this week's survey question. Restoration of American society should take place state by state, regionally or nationally? Joining me now, the senator from the great state of Minnesota, recent presidential candidate Amy Klobuchar. Senator, thanks so much for being here. First thing's first
[Sen. Amy Klobuchar:] Thank you, Michael.
[Smerconish:] how's your husband? Thank you. He's been fighting COVID-19.
[Klobuchar:] Well, he's doing so much better. He was out of the hospital a few weeks ago after coughing up blood and having a really bad case of pneumonia, low oxygen and one day after about four or five days, he just it turned to the better and I learned from that, Michael, one, to follow the rules. He didn't go to things even when he felt a little sick and he actually would have exposed people at his work and other places and he didn't. And then secondly, you know, you can't be there, you can't hold their hand, you can't hug the healthcare workers that are taking care of them and we all know for some of the worst cases, it's those healthcare workers that are holding up the phone when the family tries to say the last words to their loved one. It is a very horrific disease.
[Smerconish:] So Godspeed to John Bessler and thanks for the update. Your governor just announced that he was reopening golf courses and bait shops, outdoor shooting ranges, marina services where people are supposed to adhere to proper distancing and other measures meant to stop community spread, but like other states, Minnesota doesn't have enough testing, the tracking capacity yet to figure out where things stand. What reservations, if any, do you have about that move?
[Klobuchar:] Well, I trust what our governor is doing here. He cares so much about the people of Minnesota. Name's Tim Walz. He was in Congress, a veteran and there's a lot of faith in what he's doing. Everyone is not going to be happy with everything these governors do. I think it was Andrew Cuomo who said sure, I know I'm not making you happy. If you're mad, call me. You know what? Does the President of the United States say that? No. He starts out his political career at the Republican convention by saying I alone know how to fix this. Then the next thing you know when we have a crisis, he says he's back up to the governors. Then he flips the other way and says he's in charge and now he says, which is correct under the Constitution, that it's up to the governors. I think it's OK that we have different governors making different decisions in different states, but let me tell you what isn't OK and that is that there was never a national strategy for testing and there was never a national strategy to prepare our country. This is a global pandemic and national pandemic and if we had not lost those precious months when Donald Trump was worrying about his rallies and other things, we could have been in a better, better shape right now for the testing. And then that would have helped governors, it would have helped businesses, everyone to gradually reopen because if you have the testing, as we've seen around the world, you're in a much better place to control those hotspots and especially when we start seeing drugs and other things and promising therapies, you want to be able to know where the hot spots are and immediately attack them.
[Smerconish:] I'm worried about our election. What went on in Wisconsin a week ago was a bit of a cluster. How do we ensure that doesn't happen nationally in November?
[Klobuchar:] That answer is more straightforward, Michael. That answer is about making it safe for people to vote so they don't have to choose between their health and voting. I will never forget that image, and I don't think any American will, of those people in Wisconsin bravely asserting their right to vote in garbage bags and masks when it didn't have to happen and one of the most interesting things in that case was the voters voted, a lot voted by mail and that is your answer. Make it easier for people to vote by mail and that's the bill I lead with Ron Wyden. We got $400 million. We need much more to make this big scale for the country and you see Republican governors, Republican secretaries of state rolling this out all over the country. They need the funding because you're going to have postage, envelopes, new workers and at the same time, making sure our polls can be open 20 days in advance across the country, making the training of new poll workers a priority. All of this can happen. They just had a successful election in South Korea despite having the pandemic there. You can do this, but you have to have a will and I'm just excited that there's growing support across the country for this and Wisconsin is the symbol this should never happen again. By the way, you know who voted by mail? Donald Trump. He requested
[Smerconish:] Is there not
[Klobuchar:] a mail-in ballot at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. So why couldn't those people
[Smerconish:] To vote in Florida.
[Klobuchar:] in Wisconsin have the same right. Mm-hmm.
[Smerconish:] Understood. Is there not a Tenth Amendment issue here? Isn't it isn't it the business of the states to determine and set their elections? Wherein lies the authority to do what you'd like to do?
[Klobuchar:] Sure it's the business of the states to have elections. That's why they have their own ballots, that's why they have their own voting equipment. There's all kinds of things, but this is a national election in the middle of a pandemic. So number one, getting the money, no one has raised issues about that. Almost every secretary of state wants this funding for early voting, for mail-in voting. Two, all we're doing is setting standards nationally and think about it, 20 days early for polling locations. A lot of Republican governors are ready starting to waive requirements and do that anyway. Number three, making sure that we break down some of these barriers. In six states, you have to get a notary or two witnesses in order to get a mail-in ballot. Sixteen states, you have to have an excuse to get a mail-in ballot, but four states, including two Republican governors, have already waived those requirements. So you're starting to see action across the country, but I think it is much easier if we at least have some minimal standards for the entire country and that's what the bill
[Smerconish:] Senator
[Klobuchar:] that Senator Wyden and I have does.
[Smerconish:] There's a word that the TrumpPence campaign is now using to describe that which you'd like to see come to fruition, harvesting. In fact, put on the screen a fundraising pitch that I've just seen where they're encouraging folks to pony up money so as to stop what Senator Klobuchar and others, we must get rid of ballot harvesting. Will you respond to the criticism that mail-in voting is at a heightened subjectivity to fraud?
[Klobuchar:] You know what? Maybe President Trump should ask some of his own Republican officials, such as the Republican secretary of state in Washington State who has made it very clear that this is a safe way to vote and in fact, you have paper ballots when you vote by mail, something we don't have in a few of our states right now. Ask the governors, Republican governors in Maryland and in New Hampshire and in Ohio that want to transform their elections into mail-in ballots. I don't think he's attuned. I think he's using it to raise money from his base, but when he does that, he's messing with people's health and I think the best answer is how those people in Wisconsin voted in that judge's race. They were mad. They saw through it. They saw that the Republican legislature was not just messing around politically with their right to vote, they were literally putting their lives at risk
[Smerconish:] Well
[Klobuchar:] and look what happened.
[Smerconish: I -- Klobuchar:] So I think there's going to be a huge backlash if they don't help us with the funding for this.
[Smerconish:] I think that there's a perception on the Republican side of the aisle that this benefits Democratic candidates, but the data, when you delve into it
[Klobuchar:] Yes.
[Smerconish:] is much more complicated than that and it's not a clear answer.
[Klobuchar:] You know what the mail ballot states are that have like over 90 percent, over 85 percent? States like Utah. That is not exactly a blue state, although we're doing better and better there. States like Arizona has actually a high rate, not the highest, but a very high rate of people voting by mail. Colorado, which is a purple state, they have nearly all voting by mail. Now, let me make clear, you still want to have polls open for people with disabilities, for people that maybe forget to get their ballot and there's all kinds of things, but the less people you have congregating at the polls, the better off we all are.
[Smerconish:] Senator Klobuchar, Senator Warren was asked a direct question this week and she gave a very direct answer, which is if asked, would you accept a position on Vice President Biden's ticket. What's your answer to that same question?
[Klobuchar:] My answer has been the same from the very beginning, which is right now I am focused on my state, I am focused on our country, leading the effort so that we can vote in November and I'm just not going to engage in hypotheticals and I know one thing for sure Joe Biden was a great vice president. He knows what it takes to be a good vice president. He's going to make that decision.
[Smerconish:] I'll put that down as a maybe. Thank you for being here.
[Klobuchar:] Thank you. It was great to be on, Michael.
[Smerconish:] What are your thoughts? Tweet me @Smerconish or go to my Facebook page. I'll read some throughout the course of the program. What do we have? From Twitter I think, "As for the protesters who are saying, "We will never be a socialist country," I would like to ask them if they will be returning their stimulus checks soon?" Look, folks are pent up. I've got cabin fever myself. I don't want to paint with a broad brush. You can always find one sign that's objectionable in that crowd and then try and characterize the group. I get it. My commentary at the outset was simply designed to illustrate what I fear is coming, which is a patchwork approach that the virus is not going to respect, but I don't have a better solution. I think it's probably the best that we can do and, you know, hope that it works. I want to know what you think this hour. Make sure you're going to Smerconish.com and answering the survey question. Restoration of American society should take place state by state, regionally or nationally? Up ahead, whose name will be at the top of the Democratic presidential ticket with Joe Biden? I was just asking that subject of Senator Klobuchar. Well, Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer has been a contender, but could fallout in her state this week make the Biden team think twice?
[Unidentified Female:] It's time for our state to be opened up. We're tired of not being able to buy the things that we need, go to the hairdresser's, get our hair done. It's time to open up.