A list of the top recipients on Patreon shows an obsession with the ordinary - <AUTHOR> https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-08-29/patreon-s-top-50-list-values-the-ordinary-over-the-transcendent <comment><USER2> Not sure how the author decides what is ordinary and what is transcendent. According to him, there is nothing special about folks creating podcasts, but there is something special about a singer-songwriter. He does not say why.

Take [https://www.patreon.com/sonicether](https://www.patreon.com/sonicether) who earns $50k a month creating shaders for Minecraft. That _sounds_ mundane until you realise that he's probably enabling tens of thousands of people to create transcendent art from the comfort of their homes.

He doesn't think much of the artists creating comics either. Maybe he thinks only artists that display their work in galleries are "real" artists. Personally I think artists like Bill Watterson and Randall Munroe have done more to push the cultural zeitgeist than any artist in the last 30 years.

If you want to appreciate your fine classical works in a museum while listening to an orchestra and sipping your Pinot Noir, that's fine. But I think it's incorrect to presume to know what "real" culture is and labeling everything else "ordinary".

<comment> phoe-krk > Not sure how the author decides what is ordinary and what is transcendent.

This. Why should I allow anyone to define what kinds of art should I find transcendent and, worse, which kinds of art _are non-transcendent_?

This article is weird and full of stereotypes; it's written from the point as if art was easily and objectively classifiable. No, art is _not_ classifiable like that, and something that one man calls everyday trash can be eye-opening and mind-blowing to another. This fact alone disproves the main assumption that this article is based on, and breaks the point of the whole article for me.

<comment><USER3> > _This. Why should I allow anyone to define what kinds of art should I find > transcendent and, worse, which kinds of art are non-transcendent?_

Because else you're in an endless loop, where you define what you like by what you like.

It is (or, perhaps, it has been) generally understood, that being schooled into things, learning about them, their history, aesthetic rivalries and ideas abotu them, and appreciating the cultured opinions of people who have studied them more, helps one appreciate finer things and cultivate their preferences.

The alternative, "because I like it", sounds like a regression to childhood.

<comment> phoe-krk You misunderstood my question. I asked, "Why should _I_ allow anyone to define what kinds of art should I find transcendent and, worse, which kinds of art are non-transcendent?", with a stress on the " _I_ ".

I find it worthwhile to listen to people who describe what touches them and what they are indifferent to. However, the tone of the article describes the "mundane" and the "extraordinary" from an objectivesque point of view, which I personally find silly due to the fact that art is an inherently subjective experience.

<comment><USER3> > _However, the tone of the article describes the "mundane" and the > "extraordinary" from an objectivesque point of view, which I personally find > silly due to the fact that art is an inherently subjective experience._

I don't think that's settled. For that matter, I don't think that's true.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> So true. So many people I know and myself included are tired of the "rat race".

We don't want to keep working for nothing, we don't want to keep hoping for that next raise, we don't want to pretend to be smarter or cooler or better than we are. What a horrible way to live in the age of plenty. Maybe, we like cold pizza.

Bougey is a dirty word. We want to chill. We want fairness. Simplicity is where Happiness lies. There's nothing bad about that.

What is "grand" anyway? Those 500 people currently living that the rest 7+ billion should aspire to be? Nah. I'd rather be like my grandfather. Smiling even when I'm old.

It's hearkening back to a simpler time, and this gives me hope that more people might be "getting it"

edit: typos

<comment><USER5> In case anyone else gets stuck on 'bougey', it is apparently an abbreviation of _bourgeoisie_.

Is this US slang?

<comment><USER6> Usually it's spelled 'bougie' cf. [https://www.merriam- webster.com/dictionary/bougie](https://www.merriam- webster.com/dictionary/bougie)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Those are some pretty -- to use the author's word -- _transcendent_ conclusions to draw from a top 50 Patreon list.

Even if you were assuming the patrons were all American (obviously false) the most popular creator would have fewer than 1 in 10,000 people subscribing.

Patreon is an obscure way to fund yourself that a very small number of people make their living from, it's not a bellwether for the American heart.

I don't know what high brow things the author finds missing from the list that would change his conclusion, but this seems very much like a conclusion looking for scant evidence for to justify something to write. That page would have been better left blank.

</comment><comment><USER8> _A recent survey of American values indicates that patriotism, belief in God and having children all rate much lower than they did 20 years ago._

Gosh, one wonders what could have happened? Maybe two decades of pointless soul-rotting stupid wars, all supported by the most patriotic and pious among us? That has certainly sapped _this_ correspondent's patriotism. (His piety, though, something else sapped that...) Next you'll be telling us that trigger- happy crowd-murders are more common, and we'll think of all the wedding parties, funerals, open markets, etc. we've incinerated in the Middle East. It's as if chickens... come home to roost!

TFA is definitely the most pedestrian, limp, effort-free deposit one has ever read from Cowen.

<comment><USER9> > Maybe twenty years of pointless soul-rotting stupid wars

> Next you'll be telling us that trigger-happy crowd-murders are more common

> It's as if chickens... come home to roost!

I'm a bit confused, are you of the mind that there is some relation between mass-shooters and the wars in the Middle East? Or just those wars are why people feel less positive about patriotism?

<comment><USER8> I've been around long enough to have seen karma in action. If I pay enough attention, I often find that "karma" is another name for "obvious consequences".

The things that we're encouraged to blame for these mass murders: guns, crazy people, Republicans, white supremacists, etc. we've _always_ had in USA. What has changed? I submit that over time we've been subjected to ever-increasing levels of war-media conditioning. We're constantly encouraged to fear, to hate, to destroy. Right now we're hating on Iranians and Venezuelans, with plenty of leftover hatred for Afghans, Iraqis, Libyans, Syrians, Russians, Chinese, etc. The idea is that we'll funnel that insanity into voting for, or at least tolerating, increased payments to armaments manufacturers, and the contrived wars necessary to "justify" same. Some people just aren't mentally pliable enough to focus on the desired end goal. If you tell them often enough to fear and kill, eventually that's what they'll do. Maybe they'll try to kill mostly "others" on their killing sprees, but maybe they're such loners that anyone human parses as "other" to them.

It's not a coincidence that the "first" one of these things took place in 1966. The military-media-industrial complex was pulling out all the stops on their first big project since Korea.

Yes, also, obviously, the wars have killed patriotism among thinking people. Again, though, it hasn't just been the wars, but also the industrial-strength war-media war conditioning that was necessary to bring them about.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> It is rather convenient the author defines "mundane" as things he doesn't like and "grand" as things he does like. It sounds like he's merely upset that a majority of patrons on patreon don't share his tastes.

<comment><USER11> This, so much. I for one find the vast majority of so-called "high art" and "high culture" to _be_ frankly depressing and off-putting, rather than "grand" or "transcendent" in any way. In the best of cases this is _somewhat_ offset by the HNish intellectual interest and curiosity one can take in the stuff (and some variant of this is an often-cited point that's supposed to demonstrate the superiority of "high" culture) but all things considered, I'd rather explore the hidden intellectual interest of things that are usually dismissed as mundane, "middlebrow" or even "lowbrow".

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> > But now let us follow the subsequent development of photography. What do we > see? It has become more and more subtle, more and more modern, and the > result is that it is now incapable of photographing a tenement or a rubbish > heap without transfiguring it. Not to mention a river dam or an electric > cable factory: in front of these, photography can now only say, 'How > beautiful.' _The World is Beautiful_ \- that is the title of the well-known > picture book by Renger-Patzsch in which we see New Objectivity photography > at its peak. It has succeeded in turning abject poverty itself, by handling > it in a modish, technically perfect way, into an object of enjoyment. For it > is an economic function of photography to supply the masses, by modish > processing, with matter which previously eluded mass consumption.

\-- Walter Benjamin, lecture at the Institute for the Study of Fascism in Paris, 27th April 1934

> The relatively new trouble with mass society is perhaps even more serious, > but not because of the masses themselves, but because this society is > essentially a consumers' society where leisure time is used no longer for > self-perfection or acquisition of more social status, but for more and more > consumption and more and more entertainment… To believe that such a society > will become more "cultured" as time goes on and education has done its work, > is, I think, a fatal mistake. The point is that a consumers' society cannot > possibly know how to take care of a world and the things which belong > exclusively to the space of worldly appearances, because its central > attitude toward all objects, the attitude of consumption, spells ruin to > everything it touches.

\-- Hannah Arendt, "Between Past and Future"

<comment><USER13> Nice finds, and both quotes strike me as quite insightful and prescient.

<comment><USER12> The article made me think of the first one, then I thought of the second one and added it to explain what might be wrong with turning everything into an object of consumption. To be honest, I don't know a lot about the work of Walter Benjamin, maybe he also had more to say on this. But I do know that Hannah Arendt was on to a _lot_ , and is as timely as ever. I love and recommend her more than I can say.

> When books or pictures in reproduction are thrown on the market cheaply and > attain huge sales, this does not affect the nature of the objects in > question. But their nature is affected when these objects themselves are > changed rewritten, condensed, digested, reduced to kitsch in reproduction, > or in preparation for the movies. This does not mean that culture spreads to > the masses, but that culture is being destroyed in order to yield > entertainment.

> The result of this is not disintegration but decay, and those who actively > promote it are not the Tin Pan Alley composers but a special kind of > intellectuals, often well read and well informed, whose sole function is to > organize, disseminate, and change cultural objects in order to persuade the > masses that Hamlet can be as entertaining as My Fair Lady, and perhaps > educational as well. There are many great authors of the past who have > survived centuries of oblivion and neglect, but it is still an open question > whether they will be able to survive an entertaining version of what they > have to say.

\-- Hannah Arendt, "The Crisis in Culture - Its Social and Its Political Significance", [http://www.celinecondorelli.eu/files/arendtcrisisinculture_v...](http://www.celinecondorelli.eu/files/arendtcrisisinculture_v2.pdf)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> He mentions Kurzgesagt as a positive example - but ignores other educational channels like CGP Grey, CrashCourse and ContraPoints. - There's also many more highly educational podcasts and youtube channels that are very popular.

Entertainment has shifted from TV to the internet in recent years, and as it grew more popular it also grew more mundane. - But looking at TV entertainment of previous decades, I think it is hard to claim there has been a reduction in quality.

<comment><USER15> "ContraPoints" is not an education channel.

<comment><USER16> Political education is education even if it's also propaganda (in the sense of information designed to persuade). A large number of political YouTube channels across the political spectrum could be called educational.

<comment><USER15> No, it's something like political satire or political entertainment. If the category education should mean anything then it certainly does not include a man pretending to be a woman pushing political agendas in some completely overblown and sexualized manner. This is ridiculous.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> I don't think that examining the breakdown of one funding source is indicative of a shift in culture. Especially not a funding source like Patreon. Patreon is especially suited for funding ongoing efforts or something that has a recurring payoff (weekly podcasts, YouTube videos, or regular releases of comics). That lends itself to "mundane" things as the author puts it. If you want to create a magnum opus you need to raise funds for a single big effort, so something like Kickstarter is a lot more appropriate. I'm sure if the author perused Kickstarter they would find many "grand" ideas. There is also traditional funding for established creators looking to do something grand. If you are a director looking to create the masterpiece to cap your career, chances are that you're getting a movie studio to pay for it based on your previous successes. The same goes for successful artists in most fields that can use their reputation to fund something grand. Looking at Patreon only gives you a single piece of the puzzle.

</comment><comment><USER18> > As today's young become wealthier and more philanthropic

Is this correct? My understanding was today's youth in the U.S are taking on more debt than ever.

<comment><USER7> I wouldn't interpret comparing one generation to a previous generation but against itself as it grows older. (as in, most people earn more money and become more able to donate money as they get older)

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> I cannot really understand the perspective of this assesment.

Perhaps these "ordinary ambitions" have become something unachievable by so many people, that it can highlight the relativity of the statement itself?

Starting "culture wars" about mundane shit isn't my definition of extraordinary either. If so, Burger King vs. McDonalds could be a culture war.

But compare that content to former reality TV and I can only see improvement everywhere.

On the other hand, I don't mind the loss of splendor, pomp and royal weddings. I do like architecture and jazz though.

But yes, I would prefer to have an "ordinary" house first instead of some abstract effort to build the pyramids 2.0. Does the author work for a bank?

</comment><comment><USER20> What a bizarre distinction. I'm not even sure I understand the classification. Art can make the ordinary transcendent - it's the treatment not the subject matter.

<comment><USER21> It seems the author believes that American as an identity bares great significance that Americans were and should be destined to greatness, or at least in favor of such ambitious ideals.

But let's be honest. The idea of human has mission to achieve greatness by itself is, just a belief. Human life can be any form it needs to be, if the owner him/herself desires so. And the in the age of internet, it is easy to at least observe afar what your desired life would be like by watching others do it. I'd argue people are much aware and resourceful to decide what he/she wants to be, and being ordinary yet full-filling is perfectly fine goal to pursue, and it is arguably not easy still.

</comment></comment><comment><USER22> For those who work there - I am curious, I occasionally come across complaints online that much of Silicon Valley and tech companies have a large "dirtbag left" (not my term, I am referencing what is written in the article) contingent of employees, who actively "cleanse" their ranks of all right- leaning employees.

I am inclined to believe this because of past stories involving the Mozilla CEO and the Occulus CEO and James Damore all being fired for basically not having heterodox views.

From the comments that I read across various forum websites whenever this topic comes up, the takeaway seems to be a chilling effect POV of "if you're right-leaning, make sure nobody finds out, and just do your job".

Of course it's very difficult to form an opinion sitting in another country based on what you read on the internet, so I was curious to know how true it is.

<comment><USER23> America is so far right of center, many of the so called dirt bag left are actually center right.

However, in my experience extreme right wing social conservatives can be pretty good at self-cleansing by constantly sharing their amazing opinions on superior races, the problem with 'those people' and my favorite, informing people that they are living in sin.

<comment><USER22> In the present tense the problem of bigotry seems universal regardless of political affiliation. It is just the category of people who are discriminated against, that changes, depending on the offending party's preferences

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER24> The article identifies a culture war between the ordinary and the transcendent, and sees in the Patreon top 50 that the ordinary has won, but it doesn't do a great job of how it determines how it classifies the entries.

Apparently a political podcast is ordinary, things that are NSFW or dealing with history are ordinary, and photos of New Yorkers are ordinary. The only things it considers transcendent are educational videos and Amanda Palmer.

As examples of what he means by transcendent, he mentions ancient Greeks, Christianity, Enlightenment, classical music, the US Constitution and scientific revolutions.

But honestly, hasn't the ordinary always outnumbered the transcendent? There first needs to be an 'ordinary' to transcend. Even during the height of enlightenment, the world was filled with the ordinary. We remember the transcendent because it is what changes things.

<comment><USER25> Especially as there are creators like 3blue1brown on that list. The videos 3blue1brown does should certainly be considered transcendent in the classical sense, those are easily the highest quality math education videos I've ever seen. The linear algebra series definitely expanded my appreciation for the subject in a way no textbook has ever done.

Sure, there is crap like MxR Mods on the list, but there is also stuff like crash course & clickspring. I don't know if I'd call clickspring's videos themselves art, but what he is producing in his shop is certainly art and the opportunity to view the process is just magnificent; this is certainly a channel that shows how great online video can be.

And Contrapoints; while very much political, does an excellent job of engaging with topics much more deeply than what one normally reads in publications like Bloomberg. I honestly found reading this list encouraging; most of the top 50 creators definitely deserve that place and I'm glad that the people benefiting most from Patreon deserve it. Aside from MxR, he's a cancer on the Bethesda modding scene.

</comment></comment><comment><USER26> "Alas [...] Eight of the top 50 are marked "NSFW" (not safe for work)." This is straight 19th century stuff. I think it's safe to say that western art lost its "safe for work" status like 200 years ago. I suggest the author should grow up and get an education..

</comment><comment><USER27> _' Ninety percent of everything is crap'_ \- [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturgeon%27s_law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturgeon%27s_law)

<comment><USER28> Hey, _the_ Internet called, it wants its tagline back!

</comment></comment><comment><USER29> Anyone who can't recognise the genius of Nick Mullen and Cum Town deserves to find disappointment.

<comment> _--___-___ my man laughing cause he know

</comment></comment><comment><USER30> Very odd article..

When looked to see the name of the author, I was very surprised to see economist Tyler Cowen

<comment><USER31> If you had read the book _The Case Against Education_ by his George Mason University colleague, Bryan Caplan, then you might not be as surprised. That economics department seems to be a haven for libertarian thought, opera, classical music, and Renaissance paintings.

<comment><USER30> I did happen to read that book.

Still I don't see what beef a libertarian economist should have with voluntary donations to "ordinary" causes.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER32> It's amusing that the only sign of a "culture war" here is the author's tendentious carping about, of all things, the Patreon Top 50 list. Why?

Very possibly, if you are doing things that random economics professors consider "transcendent", you are probably _extremely_ well served by the far more lucrative network of grants and funding that exists outside Patreon. He nods briefly to this idea before rejecting it and just plain making some shit up:

"Maybe, but there is another possibility: that Patreon is the tip of an ever- growing iceberg."

Awful.

</comment><comment><USER33> What did they expect? Popular and ordinary are essentially synonyms when it comes to taste.

Also this: "As today's young become wealthier [...]" . Where's the evidence fit this assertion?

</comment><comment><USER34> Culture evolves, and people increasingly question tradition for tradition's sake. Belief in God is at odds with a scientific view of the world, the decision to have children or not has many contributing factors (economic, for one), and it's hard to be patriotic when every country has so many skeletons in the closet you'd think it's perpetually Halloween.

<comment><USER35> > Belief in God is at odds with a scientific view of the world

I'd say both are orthogonal to each other. The religious view of the world explain the "why do we exist?" and the scientific view the "how do we exist?".

<comment><USER36> Most religions purport to explain both, and science has little interest in the former, as it has traditionally been impossible to come up with falsifiable experiments as to "why do we exist".

This is, like your comment, taking strict definitions for both "why" and "how".

"why" we exist can have answers ranging from "we're the current latest bunch of mutants resulting from this whole evolution thing" all the way to "as self- realized, intelligent beings, we inevitably ask this question, and asking this question is the only predictable outcome of being intelligent and self- realized."

"how" we exist can be answered anywhere from "with a whole lot of luck" to "badly".

You need to specify what you mean by "why" and "how" for your distinction to have any debatable qualities.

<comment><USER35> > "why" we exist can have answers ranging from "we're the current latest bunch > of mutants resulting from this whole evolution thing" all the way to "as > self-realized, intelligent beings, we inevitably ask this question, and > asking this question is the only predictable outcome of being intelligent > and self-realized."

To this range of answers, I'd add "because God created us (because of reasons outside the scope of this answer)"

"how we exist" is how does the universe works, which is explored and explained by the various scientific fields

<comment><USER36> > To this range of answers, I'd add "because God created us (because of > reasons outside the scope of this answer)"

Yes, but which god, and why does this explanation get any greater credence than Douglas Adams' writing "the Jatravartid people of Viltvodle VI believe that the entire Universe was in fact sneezed out of the nose of a being called the Great Green Arkleseizure. The Jatravartids, who live in perpetual fear of the time they call The Coming of The Great White Handkerchief, are small blue creatures with more than fifty arms each, who are therefore unique in being the only race in history to have invented the aerosol deodorant before the wheel."

The religions of the world disagree with each other on the "why", and none of them seem to be interested in demonstrating the veracity of their theory. This is why science generally ignores the "why". No-one has come up with a reasonable way to show, one way or another, which theory may be truer (or more aptly, falser) than any other, and therefore the question currently has no meaningful answer. If this changes, it will show that all, some, one, or none of the current religions are correct, but thousands of years of discussion haven't produced anything close to solving this problem, and this discussion has been going on since before Akhenaten.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER37> How exactly, is this "culture war"?

</comment><comment><USER38> Imagine being so butthurt that people don't care about your overpriced high culture.

</comment><comment><USER39> "Top 40s are shit". Obviously. But this has been the case since kingdom come and gone.</comment>


Ask HN: What's with all the posts from Reddit? - <AUTHOR>

Over the last few days, I've noticed a lot of posts that reference or come from reddit.com. I realize a lot of you are new to the community, so you might want to re-read the welcome. There's a place for reddit-like posts (reddit) and there's a place for news related to hackers (HN). Thanks! <comment><USER2> I suspect a couple of issues:

1 - There are karma/score based systems in both sites that highly reward "first to post" interesting articles.

2 - There is no penalty here for bad initial posts, so there is no real penalty for not "posting news related to hackers."

3 - Both have a karma/score based system for rewarding interesting comments.

You will find similar situations on the stackoverflow sorts of sites, although one of the rewarding moves available at stackoverflow is unavailable here - which is to make a fast quick post and continue to edit it and add more details from other answers.

Any system with a score or badge as a sort of "reward" will get gamed. I'm sorry if you are offended by it, but that is the way things are.

</comment><comment><USER3> I think a few things are happening here.

1\. Reddit and HN are not mutual exclusive. There could be stuff that could be cross posted. Also, Reddit is a startup, is a YC company, and the founders are very active in the startup community. All these things together make Reddit a popular item to discuss.

2\. I think the HN community is starting to change. That doesn't mean decline, just change. I can program, but I'm not a programmer. I'd rather read about unique business models, human interest stories, etc than the latest and greatest clojure article.

3\. That said, re-reading the guidelines isn't a bad idea!

</comment><comment><USER4> Is there such a thing as a "reddit-like post"? They have a squillion subreddits for all kinds of different subjects.

I sometimes see posts which I'd upvote if it was on reddit, but which I ignore or even flag if I see it here, because the two communities are (and should be) vastly different. As a regular on both, it's sometimes difficult to remember to 'change my hat' when I log in.

Advice: Try to remember that any time you upvote a submission, you're encouraging more of the same type of submission.

For instance, I often make a point of upvoting submissions from people trying to engage the community, eg "look at this thing I made", "can I get some feedback on my product", "we just launched" and so on. Because that's the kind of stuff I want to see on HN. Real things made by real hackers; the stuff you won't see in the mainstream press because it was just made by this one guy. I flag stories which I know I'm going to read all over twitter and reddit and BBC news because, well I'll read about it there. HN, for me, isn't just a "top web news" place. If you're anything like me, you already know what the big stories are before you check HN. It's the smaller things that are more interesting.

One thing that always impresses me, though, is that the HN community can make even a 'boring' story fascinating through their comments and discussions, so that can make even 'bad' submission worthwhile.

</comment><comment><USER5> As an interesting counter-point, the "Today you, tomorrow me" cross-post from reddit broke 1000 upvotes, becoming one of (if not the) most upvoted HN article ever.

</comment><comment><USER6> >There's a place for reddit-like posts (reddit) and there's a place for news related to hackers (HN).

Those are very vague classification metrics.</comment>


Canada is the world's newest tax haven (2017) - <AUTHOR> https://projects.thestar.com/panama-papers/canada-is-the-worlds-newest-tax-haven/ <comment><USER2> All the cash flooding in has impacted a lot of people by driving up the cost of living, especially in Vancouver.

Report finds $5B laundered through B.C. real estate in 2018 [https://globalnews.ca/news/5259196/home-prices-in-metro- vanc...](https://globalnews.ca/news/5259196/home-prices-in-metro-vancouver- increased-by-5-due-to-money-laundering-report/)

Secret police study finds crime networks could have laundered over $1B through Vancouver homes in 2016 [https://globalnews.ca/news/4658157/fentanyl- vancouver-real-e...](https://globalnews.ca/news/4658157/fentanyl-vancouver- real-estate-billion-money-laundering-police-study/)

CRA (Canada's IRS) to cut managers, fold tax-evasion units, memo shows [https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/cra-to-cut- man...](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/cra-to-cut-managers- fold-tax-evasion-units-memo-shows/article20704948/)

Entire cities appear poor on paper because of wide spread tax evasion.

Why does upscale neighbourhood appear 'poor' to tax officials? [https://vancouversun.com/life/richmond-3-why-does-upscale- ne...](https://vancouversun.com/life/richmond-3-why-does-upscale- neighbourhood-appear-poor-to-tax-officials)

Richmond is majority Chinese. >nine of 10 recent Chinese immigrants arrive in Metro Vancouver with enough money to immediately buy homes. But only half hold down jobs during their first five years in Canada, while four of 10 report they're surviving on low incomes. [https://vancouversun.com/opinion/columnists/douglas-todd- how...](https://vancouversun.com/opinion/columnists/douglas-todd-how-chinese- filipino-and-other-immigrants-differ)

<comment><USER3> Could this explain the "cliquey and flaky" nature of the city? There is no community, locals just don't care other than superficial niceties. Combine the two most exclusive cultures: rich and Asian, this is what you get with 27.7% of Chinese in Vancouver (2011). [http://worldpopulationreview.com/world- cities/vancouver-popu...](http://worldpopulationreview.com/world- cities/vancouver-population/) Challenge my theory please...I would like to understand why this city is so isolating.

<comment><USER4> Where you born in van or moved here? I find locals already have social circles and new people have a hard time breaking into them. Can't say why but seems to hold water with my social circles

<comment><USER3> I moved from the US and every city I went to was really inclusive, but I can be biased because I socialized with churchgoers (where inclusion of outsiders is their responsibility). This is based on a fairly large sample size: Houston, Austin, Menlo Park, New York, and LA for ~10 year period. This subset is completely different in Vancouver though: the cliqueness, especially in Chinese speaking communities, is prevalent- I just gave up after 2 years and ~5-10 churches. Btw, I am Asian and know fluent Chinese...

<comment><USER5> Holy. I'm sorry to hear it.

I say as a born and raised Vancouverite, since moved to the US... it's kinda fucked out there.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> I would challenge the title's assertion somewhat; at least, when Canadian banks are involved (as one would assume even with shell companies).

Canada participates in the Automatic Exchange of Information (AEOI) [1]. That means that even though some of these companies might not be required to file tax reports, the _banks_ where they hold their accounts most certainly have to report the account holder and, where applicable, all beneficial owners [2].

Simply put, if I, personally, held money at a Canadian bank either directly, or indirectly via a shell company, I might not have many reporting requirements with the Canadian government directly, but the _bank_ would have reporting requirements, which would ultimately lead to the bank's reports landing on the desk of my home country's tax authority [3].

The only way around this is the bank not keeping their AML/KYC records as straight as they should, but supervisory authorities usually come down hard on those cases.

[1] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Reporting_Standard](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Reporting_Standard)

[2] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beneficial_owner](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beneficial_owner)

[3] Provided both countries actually exchange information, which is the case for dozens of countries as of now. That includes Canada, Switzerland, and many other countries one might consider a "tax haven". It doesn't include the USA, however. Many would say that the USA are the last real tax haven.

<comment><USER7> You're assuming that anyone with the authority to stop this , wants to. IF someone wanted to stop this, I'm sure they'd be able to get the info.

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> I read an article this morning that South Dakota has become a tax haven as well due to their trust laws. An interesting read.

[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/nov/14/the-great- amer...](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/nov/14/the-great-american-tax- haven-why-the-super-rich-love-south-dakota-trust-laws)

<comment><USER9> I honestly don't know if I can take this article seriously when it implies that South Dakota repealing usury laws is singlehandedly responsible for all of the credit card debt in the US.

<comment><USER10> I wouldn't blame you if that's what the article actually said... (it didn't)

<comment><USER9> Please read my comment again. I said it implies it, not outright says it.

From the 14th paragraph: "Thanks to Janklow, South Dakota has a financial services industry, and the US has a trillion-dollar credit card debt."

This is definitely the author trying to peg America's credit card debt onto Janklow, and therefore South Dakota.

<comment><USER11> That doesn't seem like what it implies at all. It is saying the US uses credit cards and South Dakota can now participate (if it is saying anything at all).

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> >"I believe the Canada companies … are managed in a way that the administrators simply declare annually NO-ACTIVITY. In other words, they cheat a bit,"

So the trick to using canada as a tax haven, is to lie on your taxes? I feel like that approach also works in other countries

</comment><comment><USER13> I have incorporated many companies in Canada and have always marveled at the lack of vetting. You'd think they would want to see some identification on the incorporation docs. But no. You just fill in a web form and pay $20 or whatever.

<comment><USER14> You have most certainly never incorporated a Canadian corporation online for $20. That's the fee for filing an annual return for a federally incorporated company; the vast majority of companies are registered provincially.

<comment><USER13> Apologies. I missed a zero.

[https://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/cd- dgc.nsf/eng/cs06939.html](https://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/cd- dgc.nsf/eng/cs06939.html)

You can incorporate federally and leave it at that. Extra-provincial registration is required if you carry on business within a specific province.

<comment><USER15> could you do a youtube tutorial series? I'd love to see the easy process documented.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> "Another key reason is that Canada's corporate registration systems — federally and provincially — are shrouded in the same kind of secrecy that exists in tax havens such as the British Virgin Islands, Panama and the Bahamas. Company owners who don't wish to be identified in Canadian corporate registries can pay a lawyer or a stand-in to appear on all public filings."

Would I be correct in presuming that in the two years since this story came out the Canadian Parliament closed at least _this_ loophole -- and perhaps several others?

<comment><USER17> Uhhh....no

<comment><USER18> Would you please not post unsubstantive comments here? Especially not snarky ones ("Uhhh....").

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> Meanwhile Amazon pays $0 tax on $11B profit

[https://finance.yahoo.com/news/amazon-taxes- zero-180337770.h...](https://finance.yahoo.com/news/amazon-taxes- zero-180337770.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=tw)

<comment><USER20> Very misleading. The actual answer isn't easily fit into a campaign sound byte, but here is a better analysis: [https://www.wsj.com/articles/does- amazon-really-pay-no-taxes...](https://www.wsj.com/articles/does-amazon- really-pay-no-taxes-heres-the-complicated-answer-11560504602)

Let's also not forget that 44% of Americans didn't pay federal income taxes.

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> _Looks at 43% marginal tax rate_

Well this is news to me.

Jokes aside, I've heard about Canada being used to launder money, but this is the first I'm hearing about it being used as a tax haven.

<comment><USER22> 42.75% maximum marginal rate here in Maryland.

<comment><USER23> Now layer on a 15%+ Harmonized Sales Tax on top of that and you've got Canada.

<comment><USER24> What provinces have 15% HST? It's 13% in Ontario...

<comment><USER23> New Brunswick, Nova Scotia, Newfoundland, Quebec (well, 14.975%).

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> No wait, now it's the US: [https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/nov/14/the- great-amer...](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/nov/14/the-great- american-tax-haven-why-the-super-rich-love-south-dakota-trust-laws)

</comment><comment><USER26> This is so ironic considering how much taxes Canadians pay themselves

</comment><comment><USER27> I thought it was puerto rico

[https://www.gq.com/story/how-puerto-rico-became-tax-haven- fo...](https://www.gq.com/story/how-puerto-rico-became-tax-haven-for-super- rich)

</comment><comment><USER28> >declare annually NO-ACTIVITY. In other words, they cheat a bit,

That's just straight up tax fraud. You don't need Canada for that. If you're willing to make fraudulent declarations to tax authorities you don't really need all these complicated things.

<comment><USER29> from the article:

> "Things you'd do 20 years for in the U.S., you might get a fine in Canada > and that's not lost on criminals," Mathers told the Star.

<comment><USER30> The United Nations University World Institute for Development Economics Research has a report on estimated losses due to tax evasion by country in 2013 (published in 2017).

[https://www.wider.unu.edu/sites/default/files/wp2017-55.pdf](https://www.wider.unu.edu/sites/default/files/wp2017-55.pdf)

Anyone uninterested in reading the whole report can CTRL+F country names (there is a breakdown in the appendix).</comment></comment></comment>


There is a scientific paper with a proof based on its own existence - <AUTHOR> https://zenodo.org/record/1183891#.WpSME3WYW00 <comment><USER2> This may be a very broad question, but has anyone else thought about whether our basic fundamentals of logic are flawed, and if so, how?

Wouldn't a logically sound system be devoid of any paradox?

<comment><USER3> there was a guy once who proved that any system is either capable of paradox or reliant on external support. look up Kurt Godel.

<comment><USER4> Gödel's incompleteness theorems are really something. Ultimately (iirc) it boils down to this:

If an axiomatic system is complex enough, it cannot be both consistent and complete.

I.e. either you have statements that you can't prove despite them being true, or your system is inconsistent (i.e. you can prove false statements).

That is a simple description of the first incompleteness theorem. The 2nd incompleteness theorem goes along similar lines:

If an axiomatic system is complex enough and consistent, it can't prove it's own consistency.

I.e.: If a system can prove it's own consistency, it isn't consistent.

Regarding how complex an axiomatic system has to be: Simple arithmetic is enough.

(FYI: it has been a while since I've spent time with the incompleteness theorems. No guarantees on accuracy, and correcting comments are welcome :) )

<comment><USER3> thanks for the breakdown. the example of a Godel statement is usually given in terms of set theory. ("S is the set of all sets that do not contain themselves. Does S contain itself?") or binary logic. ("this statement is false"). Do you know of an example in arithmetic?

<comment><USER5> The examples you mentioned are not Gödel sentences, but rather Russell's paradox and the liar paradox, respectively. A Gödel sentence for a theory T says "This sentence is not _provable_ by T." Truth is very different from provability and, unlike provability, cannot be represented as an arithmetic formula.

See the section titled "Relationship with the liar paradox" in the Wikipedia article on the incompleteness theorems.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> "Hey, why do YOU get to be the president of Tautology Club-- wait, I can guess."

-xkcd</comment>


Android to replace passwords with fingerprints for website authentication - <AUTHOR> https://www.financialexpress.com/industry/technology/bye-bye-passwords-now-use-fingerprint-to-log-in-to-apps-websites-on-android/1498707/lite/ <comment><AUTHOR> Wouldn't it make it very easy for family members to steal credentials? I guess it would be used as a second layer of security over and above passwords.

</comment><comment><USER2> Considering the fact that most fingerprint readers used on devices aren't very precise, this does not sound secure at all.</comment>


Calculating The 5,000 Most Frequently Used Domain Name Prefixes and Suffixes - <AUTHOR> http://www.leandomainsearch.com/top-domain-name-prefixes-and-suffixes

<comment><AUTHOR> Hey guys, about two weeks ago in a previous post about Lean Domain Search, HackerNews user kanamekun asked "how did you pick the other keywords commonly found in domain names?" [1]

I briefly explain there how I had done it in the past, which inspired me to take a second look at the algorithm and see if there were ways I could improve it. I wound up completely rewriting it to calculate the most popular domain name prefixes and suffixes used in _all_ domain names. This article is about that process and the results.

Let me know if you have any questions.

[1] <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3789822>

<comment><USER2> Where did you get the zone file from? Link?

<comment><AUTHOR> You can apply through Verisign to obtain access:

[http://www.verisigninc.com/en_US/products-and- services/domai...](http://www.verisigninc.com/en_US/products-and- services/domain-name-services/grow-your-domain-name-business/tld-zone- access/index.xhtml?loc=en_US)

<comment><USER3> Can you talk more about this? Process, pricing, et are all interesting to me.

<comment><USER4> +1. I'm actually curious about this as well, and I've read the VRSN doc. What comes next after filling out the form? What kind of vetting, if any, did they put you/your app through? Do you have to identify the app you plan to build in advance and what if you don't know what it will be yet?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Your tool is very useful in finding domains but you're likely leaving a bunch of money on the table by only monetizing via domain affiliates.

You should consider a premium subscription where members pay 5-10 bucks to see even more domain options. Folks who buy lots of domains should have no problem paying for the utility you provide.

I say this as someone who has found bunch of domains using your site but not once used your affiliate link to buy because you don't have my preferred domain registrar choice.

</comment><comment><USER6> I really like LDS, it's a great way to examine names near what you're thinking.

I'm very interested in a more premium service, however, where I can pay money to have someone who's done this before find a name that's either free, or available at a cheap price. I've tried things like PickyDomains, and some others like it, but most of what I get is the same as if I just used tools like LDS myself.

Any suggestions?

<comment><AUTHOR> Why don't you think you are qualified to choose a domain name from one of the available ones you find on Lean Domain Search? Is there anything I can do to make it easier?

<comment><USER6> It's very good at iterating on a name that I'm already thing about, but not very good at going beyond what I've already considered.

Consider if I were writing a new Email package. I might tell your tool "Mail" or "Message"

As great as LDS is, it's going to give me "GetMessage.com" or "HiveMail.com" not anything like Pegasus Mail, Cyrus, or Hermes.

Those are much more creative names!

These are all stories about mail delivery, to an extent, but any computerized system is going to have a hard time with it.

The best that I suspect could easily do would by synonyms - If I give it Dark, it could suggest Black and Dusk, and give me names using those..

But I'd love to see something with a less direct connection.

<comment><AUTHOR> Hey, thanks for your thoughts.

So you know, LDS does list synonyms on the right side of the search results page, which should help to some extent. Searching for "mail" wouldn't turn up Pegasus Mail, though I could add "pegasus+" to the search results and it would. There's a balance fine line between including a variety of results and including poor results and I need to be careful not to cross it. Any recommendations?

<comment><USER6> Sorry, I think I was being obtuse.

I don't think the problem is that you don't have enough generic words to add to either side. I think the problem is that all your doing is adding words to either side ;)

I like your site. It's really useful to get the low-hanging-fruit.

But for instance, Cyrus is a awesome name for a Mail program, because Cyrus the great is credited with the creation of the first postal service.

That doesn't mean that CyrusCoupons is a good name ;)

Many names are good because of the metaphors they invoke, or because of the story associated with that character, place or object.

"Teapot 3d" would be a great name, because it's a Teapot is a traditional object to render. Lena is a great name for image manipulation, because of.. <http://www.ecogito.net/articles/lena.html>

Again, I think your site is great for what it is, but a lot of my favorite names.. Really great names.. come from much more oblique or abstract approaches, for that particular problem. These don't generalize well, by their very nature.

Does that make sense?

<comment><AUTHOR> Makes a lot of sense.

There's a lot of smart folks on here... can anyone think of a way to algorithmically come up with domains like Colin is describing?

<comment><USER7> Do you have info on related sites (e.g. site X and Y are direct competitors?) If you do, you can use that for word clustering and find classes of related words. For example, if you have a set of 250 email providers, you might see "mail" and "email" a lot more than for domains in other categories, but you might also see something more subtle, like "postman" or "contact" or etc. Probably not as subtle (and cool) as Cyrus, but at least heading in the right direction.

Another idea: get a dump of Wikipedia and do a TF-IDF analysis on all of the words. When someone types "mail", you look at wikipedia.org/Mail and look for the most unique words. As it happens, the Mail article does mention Cyrus the Great, so as long as Cyrus is a pretty rare word in the corpus, it might be a suggestion you can make.

That said, there is such a thing as too clever. If I typed in "mail" as a domain search query you told me to create the website "CyrusMail", I would wonder what the heck that was all about because I don't happen to know the relationship between mail and Cyrus the Great.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> >"The only results I omitted were single letter prefixes and suffixes because they're not something you would generally add to generate quality domain names."

Adding "i" to any word seems to be all the rage these days. And "e" would be another popular single letter prefix, I think. I can't think of any single letter suffixes though, except maybe "y".

</comment><comment><USER9> I'm really curious if any common prefix + suffix domains are available. cancercollege.com? yes please.

<comment><AUTHOR> That's why I made the list clickable so you can quickly check to see what combinations are available.</comment></comment>


Facebook launches Mentorshipse each other - <AUTHOR> https://techcrunch.com/2018/08/09/facebook-launches-mentorships-matching-people-within-groups-to-help-them-guide-each-other/ <comment><USER2> That title is mangled.</comment>


Monkeying with Bayes' theorem - <AUTHOR> http://www.johndcook.com/blog/2012/03/09/monkeying-with-bayes-theorem/ <comment><USER2> Here's previous discussion on HN that fleshes this out considerably: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3693447>

<comment><USER3> From that discussion, this comment is perhaps the best explanation of what might be going on: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3694422>

<comment><USER4> Right, here's the parent comment to that one, which is also relevant: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3693779>

Here's one "theoretical" justification of the idea. Just to establish notation, Bayes tells us to maximize:

      P(W|A) = P(A|W) P(W) / P(A) \propto P(A|W) P(W)

where we drop the last factor because we only want to vary W, so we don't care about factors depending on only A. (\propto is "is proportional to")

But instead of religiously following the Reverend's advice, we choose to maximize:

      f(W|A) = P(A|W) P(W)^a

for some a > 0\. Taking logs, this is equivalent to maximizing

      g(W|A) = log P(A|W) + a log P(W)

What are these terms doing? The first is the likelihood which measures agreement of data A to hypothesis W. The second is the prior which measures chance of the hypothesis W.

You can look at the generalization (a != 1) as introducing a lagrange multiplier into the maximization. With the lagrange multiplier, the procedure becomes to "maximize agreement of hypothesis to data subject to the constraint that the hypothesis must be this likely". You then choose the lagrange multiplier to mediate the tradeoff between these two desirable goals ("agrees with data" vs. "likely to happen a priori").

Note that since we're just maximizing, it does not matter which term we weight with the constant. Weighting the first term with 1/a is the same as weighting the second with a.

For reasons like this, it is common for a prior to have a leading factor of some sort (in the exponent of the distribution).

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> The point about hackily downplaying independence by raising the product to a fractional power was nice.

[http://www.johndcook.com/blog/2012/03/09/monkeying-with- baye...](http://www.johndcook.com/blog/2012/03/09/monkeying-with-bayes- theorem/#comment-144221)

</comment><comment><USER6> I'm confused. So should that part of Bayes' Theorem be raised to the 1.5 power?

<comment><USER7> No. Peter Norvig found a particular instance where a formula motivated by Bayes' theorem worked even better when the formula was changed. The altered formula doesn't have a theoretical basis, but it seems to work.

<comment><USER8> Comments on the blog post give the theoretical basis: correcting for incorrect assumptions of independence.</comment></comment></comment>


San Francisco tenant outraged by landlord raising rent fourfold - <AUTHOR> http://blog.sfgate.com/ontheblock/2015/03/16/san-francisco-rent-control-tenant-outraged-by-landlord-raising-rent-four-fold/

<comment><USER2> Alternative medicine. Cancer patients. I'd raise their rent too.

Honestly, I would support a punitive tax on alternative medicine, like we do on cigarettes, maybe at 400%.

<comment><USER3> why?</comment></comment>


Addy: Location, simplified. - <AUTHOR> https://addy.co/

<comment><USER2> I don't really understand what problem this is solving. Perhaps someone could enlighten me? Why don't I just send a Google Maps link?

<comment><USER3> There are a number of problems that we are addressing with Addy. First would be the lack of actual functional addressing in much of the world. While there are different figures circulated about this, we believe that about half of the world doesn't actually have postal addressing systems capable of performing as well as those of more developed countries. Granted, links generated from various mapping platforms could still be sent around, with or without proper addressing. However, these links are not able of being consumed by 3rd parties in any reasonable way, and so integration is our second goal. We want our users to not only have complete control of their location data in a robust, machine-readable fashion, but also that they be able to use these very location data just about anywhere. We like to think of it as though it were an oAuth dance of sorts, where you can grant access to location information with various levels of precision and/or duration. There are many positive side effects to this, and one of the more apparent ones is definitely what happens when you move homes. Finally, we have taken it upon ourselves to build the very best maps for this other half of the world, along with navigationally- relevant data. That is, if people in a certain region use landmarks as informal reference points, we believe that we ought to capture all of these, on the ground, and surface them through an easy-to-use tool in their local language that allows them to structure the very unstructured location data they were using before to share their where across contexts. Whether we'll get all of these right really remains to be seen, and it certainly isn't trivial, but this is nevertheless our vision and we think that we can realize it by looking at the issue of global location data in a holistic way, as we have been doing for the last year and a bit.</comment></comment>


Anki Vector: The Home Robot - <AUTHOR> https://www.anki.com/en-us/vector <comment><USER2> This is a mobile phone without a screen that doesn't make phone calls and won't fit in your pocket. It's nothing more than a desk toy.

"Hey Vector" is just "Hey Google" or "Hey Siri" or "Hey Alexa". For a lot less money you could just get a Google Home or Amazon Echo (Apple HomePod is a bit more) and they provide more functionality without the useless wheels.

<comment><USER3> Yet I would consider Vector by far the most useful product of them all.

<comment><USER4> Disclaimer: I work for an engineering team at Anki

There's also the privacy aspect of Vector. Anki respects your privacy because your data isn't used in the same way that it is by Google Home and Alexa (i.e. for ad targeting)

<comment><USER5> Hows the work/life there? I briefly considered applying but havent gotten around to it.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Standupmaths, from recent front page fame got sponsored to do a video on Vector, and it appears to be mostly a cross between a virtual assistant, like Alexis and a robot pet, like sony Aibo, with a form factor inspired by wall-e.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ahdOqe5qBk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ahdOqe5qBk)

</comment><comment><USER7> "Smart enough to take over the world. Nice enough not to."

<rolls eyes>... So how smart?

"Weather, timer, take a photo, blackjack."

Ha, must be $5. Or $10, it's kinda cute.

"$249.99"

Piss off.

"Super smart AI, safely programmed one notch below too smart."

Yeah, if it could keep a calendar, man that'd be dangerous.

</comment><comment><USER8> "Needed at home - USB Power Adapter 5V, 1A or greater"

It's a $250 device that doesn't include a plug for the charger. I don't know if that's an effort to save money or reduce waste, but either way it strikes me as a way to guarantee a subset of customers are annoyed in their first 30 minutes of using the product.

What am I missing here?

<comment><USER9> I think they are working on the assumption most who would buy this device have extras.

<comment><USER10> they're twenty cents in bulk. it's a bad assumption

<comment><USER11> I just recently moved and I was astonished at how many superfluous cables and adapters I had. I definitely appreciate not getting more when I can reasonably be expected to have ones already. I have easily a dozen unoccupied USB ports within 10 feet of me.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> So, what is this? 2018 furby? The site has no information.

<comment><USER13> It's the same people who put out the nearly identical looking Cozmo a couple of years ago. Same thing, but apparently can hear now.

<comment><USER14> Curiously... there don't appear to be any FCC registrations for the new device: [https://fccid.io/2AAIC](https://fccid.io/2AAIC)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> It's safe because it doesn't do anything?

</comment><comment><USER16> Techmoan was not overly impressed: [https://youtu.be/is- rSK5y6EQ](https://youtu.be/is-rSK5y6EQ)

</comment><comment><USER17> Does anyone have any information about how Anki is doing as a company? They have raised almost $200m. Are their products selling well?

<comment><USER18> It seems like they have sold 1.5m [0] robots so far.

[0]: [https://techcrunch.com/2018/08/08/anki-has- sold-1-5-million-...](https://techcrunch.com/2018/08/08/anki-has- sold-1-5-million-cozmo-robots)

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> Ok how's this for cute: [https://www.nabaztag.com/#karotz](https://www.nabaztag.com/#karotz)

These things really make me mad - the nabaztag I mean, because of the wasted potential. I bought one, my kid loved it, it's super cute wonderful. The api sucks, most of the things didn't work, it has a built in RSS reader (evidently, but the RSS reader supposedly works by compiling the feed down into an application and downloading that and executing it and none of the feeds I tried to get to work [that they recommended] ever worked). aaaarggghhh, really the design of the thing is wonderful. It should take over the world, by the design, but the functionality made it so it didn't do so.

I mean I hate it so much and I am still tempted to buy a new one despite the things that were messed up because 1. those things that were messed up might be fixed by now, they were not insurmountable. Some of them were really the easy bits. 2\. the things that did work showed just really good design ideas.

I want one again, but I also want not to feel screwed over.

</comment><comment><USER20> The comments on their youtube video seem fake.

</comment><comment><USER21> I don't understand. How does it respond to your queries? For weather it seems to animate little rain droplets on the screen, but in the example: "what's an epsilon?" they never show it actually answering.

<comment><USER22> They have it speak in the video ("Hey there").

</comment></comment><comment><USER23> I've been following this since it's been announced and it is a really cool idea. But I agree with most of the people here that there is a limited sense of practicality for this product. The only thing I can see this being useful for is for education purposes. This would be great for schools, especially middle and high school. I even used a mindstorm for one of my graduate classes/lab to write our own algorithms (in nxc).

<comment><USER24> Perhaps its ultimate usefulness might be augmented by people writing functionality using the SDK. Considering that it has wheels and is mobile (I assume) maybe the potential functionality is greater than that of stationary home assistants? I like the idea of a robot that has a few core features, a lot of potential functionality, and a solid SDK platform on which people can harness that potential. Don't know if this will live up to that notion but I find it interesting.

</comment></comment><comment><USER25> I have now spent a few minutes on the website. I'm confused on to what robot it is offering? And what utility that robot then offers? In the video I see multiple robots. I don't see the robot actually offering any value. I'd love to spend money on a robot, but I have no idea why I would spend money on this thing (things?)

<comment><USER26> Now I am curious what you would expect from a robot? As far as I can tell most 'home robots' will be more or less Toys for the coming years at least.

</comment></comment><comment><USER27> Vector, call 911. Beep beep beep. 911, what's the problem? Beep beep beep.

</comment><comment><USER28> This is probably the single worst sales pitch I've ever seen for a superfluous IOT product. Is this intended for public consumption?

</comment><comment><USER29> What does it do?

<comment><USER30> Conclusively solves the problem of having too much cash lying around. It also adds a new thing to trip on at night for no additional charge!

Order now, supplies are limited...</comment></comment>


Hello from Gondor -- New Django cloud hosting provider from makers of Pinax - <AUTHOR> http://gondor.io/blog/2011/01/03/hello-gondor/

<comment><USER2> I think your tagline "effortless production Django hosting" is too noisy. "Effortless" is too long, "production" is kind of obvious and "hosting" is so web1.0 =)

Why not just "Django in the cloud" or "Django + Cloud = Gondor".

Best of luck to you.

<comment><USER3> We included "production" because this is coming out of our experience deploying and running dedicated stacks for production sites, not just hobbyist sites on shared infrastructure.

<comment><USER4> How about "Production Django hosting made easy"?

<comment><USER5> Production Grade Django Hosting - Effortlessly.

<comment><USER3> Great ideas. We're also considering "one _does_ just deploy into Gondor" but not enough people might get the reference :-)

<comment><USER6> But those that do will like you more :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Between GAE and django nonrel, djangy, and this, there is now lots of action for django in the cloud!

<comment><USER8> I really like the Djangy guys and what they've done so far, but I have to say this is a perfect example of how being first to market doesn't ever mean you will win. I have been following Pinax and the Eldarion team for a long time and it's obvious these guys know their stuff. I would be happy to move my production Django app knowing it's safe in their hands, but I could never say the same about Djangy this early.

<comment><USER9> To that point, most of this is stuff we've extracted from the existing hosting services we provide to our clients.

edit: we == Eldarion

<comment><USER3> Right, we didn't decide one day "oh, let's build a Django deployment and management solution"; we've already been doing this for two years and are now wanting to provide it for more than just our development clients and own sites.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> odd font choice. Makes it very hard to read on Windows with chrome. Just FYI

font-family: anivers-1, anivers-2, sans-serif;

</comment><comment><USER11> Wasn't this here a few days ago... <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2065477>

Has anything changed?

</comment><comment><USER12> This looks cool, but before I sign up for the private beta I'd like to read more documentation first. Does that exist?

</comment><comment><USER13> Needs a better logo. Might I suggest a nice white tree?

<comment><USER3> have you seen the company's logo?

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> Any chance HN readers would get beta invites sooner?

</comment><comment><USER15> added to my list <http://d-ro.ch/2011/01/paas-web-hosters/>

</comment><comment><USER5> Not yet...

Kind of a misleading headline.

<comment><USER3> well, it is available to our development clients, and soon some select private beta testers

<comment><USER5> I was ready to give you guys my CC number.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> sweet naming! good luck to you folks!</comment>


All Together Now: Breaking the Ice with Ludwig van Beethoven - <AUTHOR> http://www.weeklystandard.com/all-together-now/article/2006021 <comment><USER2> > I was reminded of the laconic observation by another quartet player that the > hardest aspect . . . was the constant need to respect one's colleagues' > opinions. At times I just wanted to forge ahead with my own idea, impatient > with the complexities inherent in working so closely with three other > musicians.

I have the same problem as a software developer (I sometimes wish it were only three and no end users).</comment>


Robert Sapolsky discusses Toxoplasma's effects on mammalian behavior - <AUTHOR> http://edge.org/3rd_culture/sapolsky09/sapolsky09_index.html <comment><USER2> Also cool how it disseminates through the brain:

"Researchers in Sweden report that the parasite fans out through the body by manipulating mobile cells that are part of the immune system."

<http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/20/science/20toxo.html>, see also [http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2006/06/20/toxoplasma...](http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/loom/2006/06/20/toxoplasma- on-the-brain/)

This is interesting because it's very hard to penetrate the blood-brain barrier. One could imagine an engineered toxoplasma that delivers drugs to the brain via this route.

</comment><comment><USER3> Toxoplasma infection is so pervasive and influential that it has been fingered as a possible contributer to differences between cultures: [http://scienceblogs.com/notrocketscience/2008/10/toxoplasma_...](http://scienceblogs.com/notrocketscience/2008/10/toxoplasma_the_brain_parasite_that_influences_human_culture.php)

</comment><comment><USER4> What freaks me out about this parasite is that it causes behavior changes in humans even in the asymptomatic cyst stage and is so widely prevalent. Ugh.

</comment><comment><USER5> Does he fart at 26s?</comment>


Blueprint: A CSS Framework - <AUTHOR> http://blueprintcss.org/?css

<comment><USER2> My only issue with blueprint and compass was that it seems overly complicated for what I'm trying to do so far. I'm not a CSS guru so maybe I'm missing the point but is there a good reason to use a CSS framework on medium sized projects?

Or, rather, is there something inherently nice about using grids for translating design to markup? It just seems like the framework adds a lot of code and styles that you're never going to need or use on small-to-medium sized projects. Thoughts?

<comment><USER3> I like to use it for the simple fact that it automatically overrides all of the default styles. So no more Times New Roman, and all of the header tags look decent without much modification.

That way, I can usually use most of their defaults and can spend more time coding.

So it is really nice for me on small projects where I just want it to look decent without much effort.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> This looks cool. Is anyone using this? Mind sharing your thoughts? I'm getting ready to do a site redesign and this might be right up my alley.

<comment><USER5> We use it where I work and the designers like it a lot. It works very well to build cross-browser layouts in a very quick and simple manner and has drastically reduced the amount of time it takes them to cut PSDs into raw XHTML/CSS.

One downside you will quickly notice is your markup becomes much less semantic and a lot more cluttered with CSS classes. This is simply by virtue of how all "grid" CSS frameworks like this work - they set up a ton of generic styles that are impossible to be symanticized. With blueprint you start to see a lot of classes that look like "span-XX last" or "push-XX" or "pull-XX".

There are a number of ways to get around this, however. The first is a tool that comes with blueprint that lets you set up a yml configuration which maps semantic ids to these generic CSS classes. For instance you can say "#footer => span-24 last". This will then generate the CSS in a semantic manner so you can continue using id references in your XHTML.

The second way, and this is the approach that I would highly recommend, is to go ahead and use some sort of CSS metalanguage/compilation tool such as SASS (Syntactically Awesome Stylesheets - <http://haml.hamptoncatlin.com/docs/rdoc/classes/Sass.html>). Chris Eppstein has done a fantastic job with the Compass CSS Framework (<http://wiki.github.com/chriseppstein/compass>) which builds on top of SASS, which allows you to do really amazing things with CSS.

The compass framework he has built allows you to do things like define CSS constants (colors, font sizes, etc), perform unit arithmetic, as well as define abstract classes or groups of properties called "mixins" which allow you to abstract out a lot of your repetitive CSS properties. It is also a whitespace sensitive DML which makes the highly nested nature of CSS selectors a breeze to work with. It also already comes with modules for blueprint and other grid frameworks!

I would check out his talk about it here if this sounds interesting to you:

<http://pivotallabs.com/talks>

HTH!

<comment><USER6> While I like what I see in SASS and Compass. I'm afraid I won't be able to partake in the excitement as I code in PHP for my day job. And hack in Python during my spare time. Is there any equivalent out there?

<comment><USER7> Although SASS is built with Ruby, there is nothing strictly tied to Ruby or Rails. You can use sass as a stand-alone tool for pre-processing your CSS for any other web platform. Haml, however, is tightly bound to Ruby.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> I used to use Blueprint all the time, but found it had many inconsistencies and corner cases -- primarily its vertical pacing of type, but also in its grid. Then, when I'd go to fix these issues manually, I'd always end up befuddled and foiled by its implementation overriding me.

My rules for judging CSS frameworks are: "They should pick something, do it perfectly, stay clear of everything else," because fixing just an aspect of someone else's CSS is such a punishing experience. Blueprint fails all three of these requirements, bundling grid, typesetting, form, print, and templates libraries together, not implementing them all perfectly (well, duh), and not staying out of my way when I don't need one or more of these features.

My current favorite grid implementation (and attendant design philosophy) is OOCSS. I highly recommend everyone check it out and absorb the knowledge presented there: <http://wiki.github.com/stubbornella/oocss>

</comment><comment><USER9> I've been using a related framework called BlueTrip CSS (<http://bluetrip.org/>) that combines elements of Blueprint, 960 and Hartija print css. It's a very good framework for rapid website prototyping.

</comment><comment><USER10> When I last looked at Blueprint, it looked pretty good for brochureware websites. But when I tried to use it for something else, I quickly ran into lots of limitations. I ended up coding my own CSS.

What do others think?

We really need a programmer-friendly abstraction layer over the mess that is CSS.

</comment><comment><USER11> I like blueprint a lot ... but I'm also really liking 960.gs ... I think it might have a slight edge over blueprint.

<comment><USER12> I like the relative simplicity of 960.gs. It does a reset and then has a fairly simple set of glasses for actually do the grid. It also comes w/ a basic typography class that I'll overwrite w/ my own base preferences.

I find that it saves me A LOT of time when doing sites that fit the grid style, which are most. It's out of the box functionality really shines when you realize you don't need to play around with floats, margins, and other CSS "tricks" to get your CSS layouts working across browsers.

The biggest issue I see with 960 vs. Blueprint is that I believe Blueprint will allow you any width you'd like. Resizing 960 probably isn't a huge ordeal but it's not as simple as in Blueprint.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> When I use Blueprint, I like to add a "colborder-left" and "border-left" class (which isn't hard).</comment>


Build SSL HTTPS Website Using Docker - <AUTHOR> https://en.abnerchou.me/Blog/75027340/ <comment><USER2> When it comes to web design, I'm a WordPress devotee! It offers so many beautiful premium themes, in particular those provided by [http://www.templatemonster.com](http://www.templatemonster.com) . I really enjoy custimizing them!

</comment><comment><USER3> nginx is cool and all, but IMO the best way to host an HTTPS site (with Docker or otherwise) is to use Caddy ([https://caddyserver.com](https://caddyserver.com))</comment>


Mac OS X Lion: Coming In July For $29 - <AUTHOR> http://techcrunch.com/2011/06/06/mac-os-x-lion-coming-in-july-for-29-and-you-wont-be-able-to-buy-it-on-a-disc/

<comment><USER2> Hallelujah! "OS X Lion [Terminal] includes editable ANSI colors in preferences and support for 256 colors and BCE (background color erase). The default TERM value is xterm-256color."

Cite: <http://www.apple.com/macosx/whats-new/features.html#unix>

<comment><USER3> Full-screen terminal is [sadly] the only feature I really want in this update.

<comment><USER4> No love for command+tab number? That alone made me move to iTerm 2.

<comment><USER5> The one feature that made me move to iTerm 2 is separate settings for left/right alt keys (resp. meta/system alt). Essential on a French keyboard, where '|' is alt+shift+L and '~' is alt+N, while keeping meta alive.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> This App Store-only distribution has me concerned about small business upgrades.

Let's say I have an office with 10 workstations. How do I upgrade? Do I have to create an iTunes account for each computer, and enter a company credit card number on each one? Can multiple iTunes accounts even share the same credit card number?

Perhaps I could get by with two accounts, since iTunes allows sharing on up to five Macs. But that's still far from an elegant solution, and it doesn't scale any better. And what about users who already have their workstations activated with their home iTunes accounts?

<comment><USER7> Historically you could use OSX Server as a local update/patch server, and have other Mac's on the LAN use it instead of downloading the same stuff again.

They say they're making Lion Server free and easily configured, and I'm hoping that they're integrating the App store components as well.

<comment><USER8> Unless I missed something in the presentation, Lion Server isn't free. It's a separate app that costs $50

<https://www.apple.com/macosx/server/>

<comment><USER7> Ahhh... I was just going by what was reported by someone at the keynote. Still, it's priced way cheaper than the previous versions, and I'd gladly pay the $50 for the convenience of a local patch/app server. (I have 5 macs in the house).

My biggest peeve is the download-only for the OS, as I have rather crappy internet access, and dread the thought of downloading a multi-GB update.

<comment><USER9> Perhaps the fact that they've recently discovered delta updates would make the download process a lot easier.

<comment><USER10> From my understanding of it the delta updates are only for the y part of x.y versioning, not whole point upgrades, and only for iOS. OS X already uses delta updaters and has done so for years.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> The download only distribution will be a nuisance for 64G SSD MacBook Airs like my wife's laptop. She often only has 5 or 10 GB of free disk space.

<comment><USER12> The download is 4 gb.

<comment><USER13> Surely it will have to unpack itself a bit.

<comment><USER14> They said that the update is done in-place and apparently without a reboot.

<comment><USER15> The unix style of file locking sure is showing it's advantage over Windows. Not that rebooting for an OS upgrade is too onerous, but using Windows one has to reboot for the most trivial things - Adobe Acrobat, Skype updates and the like.

<comment><USER16> This has been said many times before but on OSX you actually need to reboot after updating Safari. I'm not 100% sure about iTunes but I believe it still needs a reboot after updating.

<comment><USER17> Hopefully that will get fixed. Generally the reason why the reboot is required is because WebKit gets updated and that is a library that is loaded into various different applications the best way to restart all of them is to reboot, with the new state keeping that Lion is doing that will become simpler.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> 4GB isn't insignificant in countries with bandwidth caps.

<comment><USER19> Speaking from Australia, I'll assume that at least iinet will have it on their cap-less servers to download. For example most major Steam games are and don't count against the cap.

<comment><USER20> Interesting...in the case of Steam, does the ISP run that server, or do they just whitelist the Steam server IP?

<comment><USER21> I know some UK ISPs have their own Steam servers.

Some also cache YouTube videos for this purpose, for example.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> dsplittgerber seems to have a valid point, though one that is understood by anyone who has followed Apple for long. Still, unsure why the comment is [dead].

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2625727>

To respond, Apple has never had a problem re-implementing a 3rd party app and integrating it into the system, Dashboard is a classic example of this. It's a bit hostile towards 3rd party developers, but generally good for users (at least that's the argument).

</comment><comment><USER23> Great news.

Now if only they just did away with the optical drives on MBP's. I have used mine about... twice in three years since owning my current laptop.

<comment> matthew-wegner You can put another HD (or SSD) in your optical bay:

<http://www.mcetech.com/optibay/>

Cheap eBay brackets are ~$20 and accomplish the same thing.

There are a couple of caveats--here's everything you need to know: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2493938>

<comment><USER23> How is the battery life?

<comment> matthew-wegner Seems unchanged for me (I added an SSD, so the existing 7200 RPM HD became a rarely-used media drive).

I see ~5.5 hours real-world use on a 15" MBP, and my development environment includes a virtualized XP install.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER24> Title is misleading, $29.99 to zero decimal places is $30 not $29.

<comment><USER25> That's how our whole consumer culture is tricked :)

</comment></comment><comment><USER26> There's a complete list of new features here: <http://www.apple.com/macosx/whats-new/features.html>

To address the concerns of re-installation, they're including a partition with the system install disk on it (which can get to Time Machine or whatever else you need).

</comment><comment><USER27> It's only available through the Mac App Store. So how can people upgrade from 10.5 without going the extra step to 10.6, which is required for the app store?

<comment><USER28> Can't you typically only upgrade to the next revision up? e.g. 10.5 to 10.6

<comment><USER29> No, some people used to skip versions to save money. But now that each update is only $30 they can afford to stay current.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER30> I wonder how much of a wrench in the works that will be for Hackintosh people.

<comment><USER31> If you install a valid registered copy of the OS on the hardware, I imagine none. For the people that obtain the OS through not so legal means, then I imagine they'll still be able to get around it as most application on the appstore are obtainable through other means.

<comment><AUTHOR> technically none of the copies of Mac OS X running on Hackintoshes are "valid" -- Apple's Leopard/Snow Leopard boxes are technically upgrades only, not full installs, even though they work perfectly fine as full installs.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER32> Hmm... so what happens if my hard drive crashes and I replace it myself?

<comment><USER33> From [https://www.apple.com/macosx/whats- new/features.html#interne...](https://www.apple.com/macosx/whats- new/features.html#internetrestore)

Internet Restore and Utilities

* Built into Lion: OS X Lion includes a built-in restore partition, allowing you to repair or reinstall OS X without the need for discs.

* Browse the web with Safari: Recovery mode now includes the Safari web browser, so you can check your email or browse the Apple Support site.

* Reinstall OS X: OS X can be reinstalled on your Mac from recovery mode.

* Restore from a Time Machine backup: Use recovery mode to restore your Mac from a Time Machine backup.

<comment><USER34> That doesn't answer the question at all. A dead hard drive will have an inoperable restore partition.

This seems like it will be a total PITA. PC restore partitions I've worked with always had weird quirks (strange partition types, special MBR boot loader code) that make them hard to copy/move to a new drive successfully.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER35> I don't mean to be off topic, but I really feel, although this is an improvement on the price of Windows upgrade, I think that there is nothing in this release that would drive me off any Linux, particularly a rolling release distribution.

I know that for certain fields, such as multimedia, apple offers a lot, but with new offerings such as Gnome 3, a mature KDE 4, and Ubuntu's unity, for the standard desktop user or developer for that matter, I argue that Linux should enthrall and for one of the first times the difference in price tag isn't the only plus. Stability, Safety and polish are quickly becoming relevant keywords for Linux desktops.

Although the new Unity and Gnome Shell may lack the stability, you can always fall back on the watertight Gnome default desktop.

<comment><USER36> Would you say this is the year of Linux on the desktop?

<comment><USER35> No, please just ask and I will remove this comment, I am not here to try and cause agitation, I was just pointing out the changing landscape and how a release such as Lion, no longer has the impact that such a release would have had perhaps 4-5 years ago.

I am not here to declare that Linux on the desktop is beyond these offerings, I am far more realistic and believe more in the fact that its prevalence in other markets (embedded among others) is where the true potential is.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER37> Will they offer a usb stick option for $29 ?

</comment><comment><USER38> > _Resize from any edge

You can now resize a window from any side or corner._

Interesting that they _did_ finally do this. And without adding huge-ass borders to everything...

<comment><USER39> If they added borders to everything, how many pixels do the borders take up? I'll probably avoid the upgrade if there are borders I can't get rid of...

<comment><USER38> Other way around. It was a combination of "oh, that's nice, people have been requesting that for _years_ " combined with a bit of snark at Window's ever- increasing border size - which people often defend by saying that you need the borders to resize / know where the edge of the application is. I cry foul, and now I have more ammo :)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER40> If Lion supports TRIM for all SSDs, I want to zap my Intel drive and do a fresh install so that there are no mystery regions on the drive.

I hope a normal DVD will be available on the quiet.

<comment> matthew-wegner There is a TRIM Enabler for Snow Leopard: <http://www.groths.org/?p=308>

<comment><USER40> Thanks, but unofficial kext patching would knock me out of my I-can-trust-the- machine groove.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER41> Oh come on apple now we have to do everything through your stores?

<comment><USER42> This is not a total change in direction for Apple, just a fleshing out of what they've been wanting to do for a while. Expect more of this in the future, not less.

<comment><USER43> And seeing how I now first need to order physical disks to upgrade to Snow Leopard in order to get this latest release, I kinda reflect back and wish they had done this sooner :-)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER44> After all the talk about delta updates in the keynote I had hoped that Time Machine would be doing file deltas now. A read through the Lion features page doesn't turn anything up. Anyone know?

<comment><USER45> Time Machine has always done deltas (unless I have no idea what you're talking about?)

<comment><USER46> No, it has hard links to already backed up files, but individual files are not stored as deltas. If you have a big file that changes often, say 4 GB virtual machine image, Time Machine will just copy it every time.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER47> Curious for one of my favorite apps, can anyone comment on BetterTouchTool (<http://www.boastr.de/>) quality on the new build?

<comment><USER48> The first part of today's keynote had a strong emphasis on multitouch and gestures being integrated into the OS. As a BTT user myself I'm very curious to see if BTT has been obsoleted by Apple.

</comment></comment><comment><USER49> Has anyone seen references to how the server tools will be distributed? The rumor mill had indicated that there would be a mac app store version but I have not seen a confirmation on if these pieces are in the regular 10.7 upgrade or not.

The server edition of 10.6 was $500 and distinct from the $29 regular edition so I am expecting a separate paid download to be required...

<comment><USER2> It's an additional $50, as per <http://www.apple.com/macosx/server/>

The upgrade path for existing Server users is Snow Leopard Server to Lion, then Lion to Lion Server.

</comment></comment><comment><USER43> "Auto setup for Gmail and Yahoo! in Mail[.app]

When you first log in to your Google, Yahoo!, or AOL accounts in Safari, you'll have the option to use them with Mail, iCal, Address Book, iChat, and other applications on your Mac."

Thats pretty smart to keep Mail.app relevant in the web age! (I hope it handles "guest" logins on the web gracefully though!)

</comment><comment><USER50> Really wish this was coming out sooner. I plan on getting the Samsung Chromebook on the 16th, which will be my primary "fun" computer. I'll keep my Macbook for development, but I'm not sure I'll use it in the way that these consumer features are meant for. If it was coming on now I'd go ahead and get it just to play around with. Now I don't know.

<comment><USER51> "Your Mac must have an Intel Core 2 Duo, Core i3, Core i5, Core i7, or Xeon processor to run Lion. Find out if your current Mac has one of these processors by clicking the Apple icon at the top left of your screen, then choosing About This Mac."

</comment></comment><comment><USER52> It will be interesting to see how the OS installs over itself now that it is being distributed through the app store. I wonder if they will create a new partition with the installer and reboot into it.

<comment><USER53> According to [1], Phil Schiller said "no reboots". Any idea how that is accomplished, or was it a misstatement?

[1] [http://www.engadget.com/2011/06/06/wwdc-2011-liveblog- steve-...](http://www.engadget.com/2011/06/06/wwdc-2011-liveblog-steve-jobs- talks-ios-5-os-x-lion-icloud-an/?sort=newest&refresh=60), Ctrl+F for "reboots"

<comment><USER29> They probably mean no _additional_ reboots; in many OSes first you boot the installer/upgrader, then you install, then you boot the installed OS.

<comment><USER54> He said that no reboot from optical disk will be needed to _start_ the installation.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER55> While they are at it, I am surprised Apple didn't integrate LaunchBar/QuickSilver/Alfred functionality into Lion (and take those guys out). It would go really well with the full screen apps.

</comment><comment><USER56> any news on whether it is for 64-bit processors ONLY? my core-solo mac mini wants to know :-S

<comment><USER57> Lion is 64-bit only. Although the early minis have socketed CPUs, so you could theoretically replace it with a Core 2: [http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/systems/mac_mini_core_2_duo_swaps...](http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/systems/mac_mini_core_2_duo_swaps.html)

<comment><USER56> oh! good to know!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER58> Finally high res larger cursor that is crisp.

The other updates/features are looking solid too. Well worth the $29.99.

</comment><comment><USER59> Not sure why below comment is dead. The account seems ok and not hell banned. Was it flagged to death? If so, anyone who flagged it,why?

dsplittgerber 24 minutes ago | link [dead]

Anyone else surprised by how many hugely popular apps Apple is going to kill with new Lion/iOS? Instapaper built-into Safari now, all kinds of messanger apps killed by iMessage, some of those photo apps going down the drain as well, Reminders app is a huge one as well. All targeting really popular app categories.

Sure, some people care about thing X being done supremely well and will still pay for some apps. But the huge majority will probably be really fine with Apples version.

<comment><USER60> This is par for the course with Apple. I remember back in the day there was this super popular shareware app called Aaron that gave System 7 users a System 8 looking theme. Keep in mind this was the dark ages of Apple.

Aaron evolved into Kaleidoscope. A general purpose shareware theme manager that was met with enthusiasm by the Mac community. Kaleidoscope was synonymous with themes on Mac OS.

<http://www.kaleidoscope.net/What_is_Kaleidoscope.html>

By the time OS 8.5 rolled around Apple introduced Appearance Manager. Which was no more than a total rip off of Kaleidoscope. Apple engineers even wrote an internal utility that would convert Kaleidoscope themes into Appearance Manager themes.

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appearance_Manager#Kaleidoscope>

The shareware author got zero credit. Zero money. He just got ripped off by Apple. In the end, though, Appearance Manager never took off. It was a combination of Kaleidoscope's momentum and the taint of Appearance Manager that kept theme authors from adopting it.

EDIT: I also add the story of Konfabulator, written later by some of the same people that did Kaleidoscope. Konfabulator was also ripped off by Apple in the form of Dashboard.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dashboard_(software)#Comparison...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dashboard_\(software\)#Comparison_with_Konfabulator)

<comment><USER61> I remember Konfabulator and Watson (is that what it was called? The one that was ripped off as a new version of Sherlock back when that was still a thing), but I think you're mistaken about why Appearance Manager never took off. If I remember correctly, Apple just never provided external developers with theme authoring software or documentation for the theme format, because between the original DP period and the public release, they(/Steve) decided that they didn't particularly _want_ to promote wildly different UI styles. They never even officially released the themes they had demoed, other than Platinum.

<comment><USER62> Indeed, for years there was an unexplained drop-down menu in the Appearance control panel labeled "Theme", with exactly one option available ("Platinum"). Third-party developers _eventually_ figured out how to build their own themes (with some help when Apple's alternate themes - Hi-Tech, Gizmo, and Drawing Board - got leaked), but it was never officially supported.

Apple's alternate themes, as well as all the third-party ones, were visually distracting enough to be nearly unusable anyway. I really can't blame them for dropping the feature.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER59> >This isn't actually the first time Apple has offered an OS upgrade at a steep discount compared to its Windows rival (which typically runs over $100) — Snow Leopard made its debut at $29.

A pretty flawed apples to oranges comparison. OS X is more similar to bios updates... you buy the hardware, the vendor makes money off it and gives away the software. With Microsoft, you're paying the OEM money for the hardware(with razor thin margins usually but that's another story), so Microsoft doesn't make bank on expensive hardware and upgrades to RAM/HDD/CPU that Apple makes.

Edit: Not to mention that 10.5 to 10.7 is not upgradeable, you have to buy and install 10.6 first, install the App Store and then install 10.7. Windows 7 may not be upgradeable directly from XP without a format, but atleast you don't have to but and upgrade to Vista first!

<comment><USER63> I have 10.5 and held off on purchasing 10.6 because I was waiting for 10.7. It bums me out that now I'll need to purchase both 10.6 and 10.7, regardless of how much the Windows upgrades cost. Judging from some of the tweets & comments I'm seeing elsewhere, a lot of other consumers are bummed too.

<comment><USER64> if you can afford a mac, i guess you can afford saving 0.80 dollars a month for buying a $30 OS update every 2 years.

<comment><USER63> Admittedly, I'm cheap. I prized my $400 Dell Vostro for years and reluctantly switched to a Mac because I was ultimately convinced it was a better machine for software development. I ended up buying a used MBPro for ~$800.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER65> I love the Apple hype cycle: an incremental OS update for $29, and it's one of the most-commented HN articles of the day.

I get an incremental OS update every day for free. It's called apt-get. After you've done it every day for nearly 15 years, it gets a little old...

What's next, a central Mac software repository? (Oh yeah, "the Mac app store". Innovation!)</comment>


Leila Johnston travels across the UK taking pictures of IBM checkouts - <AUTHOR> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2241071/Leila-Johnston-travels-UK-taking-pictures-IBM-checkouts.html

<comment><USER2> Hi this story is obviously embellished. I can't be bothered to correct it on the mail but don't want hacker news readers getting the wrong idea! See my site finalbullet.com -- I don't have that many pictures and have never travelled anywhere to get one!</comment>


Kickstarter Just Did Something Tech Startups Never Do: It Paid a Dividend - <AUTHOR> http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-06-17/kickstarter-just-did-something-tech-startups-never-do-it-paid-a-dividend <comment><USER2> Damn. They beat me to it!

This was going to be my secret weapon when I became a VC and funded "generational startups".</comment>


Devastating situation in Covid-19-infested Diamond Princess reported by doctor - <AUTHOR> https://note.com/chocolat_psyder/n/n4d3c728c4652 <comment><USER2> Umm so those who reported negative on PCR exam will not be quarantined at all?? I'm no expert in this field, but what Japan is doing here is outrageously irresponsible given the reported situation.

<comment><AUTHOR> Correct. About 500 people onboard will be 'released' from the cruise ship today. I live in Tokyo, and frankly I'm freaking out.</comment></comment>


Linux developers considering On-screen QR codes for kernel panics - <AUTHOR> http://slashdot.org/story/200371

<comment><USER2> Did anything bad happen to proper kernel dumps?

<comment><AUTHOR> I think they are difficult to read. It would be nice see it link directly on kernel.org though.</comment></comment>