Report: Teens Using Digital Drugs to Get High - <AUTHOR> http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2010/07/digital-drugs/ <comment><USER2> These April Fools jokes are getting more clever -- the date says July 15!

Before we know it, things like eating and sex will be "the same as" doing drugs, because people enjoy it. Oh, and the same with your morning coffee.

Let's all eat bread and water, frown, reproduce via test tubes, work for the man, and vote Republican!

<comment><USER3> I think you misunderstand how Republicans view sex.

* It's something you don't talk about (or do) in polite company or around kids.

* It's something you don't do with someone you're not married to. (And by God you better to married to the opposite sex)

* It's implied that if you are married you must be having sex on at last a weekly schedule.

* I won't got into details but anything beyond the basics is strictly forbidden. (Candles are only allowed for mood lighting.)

:) All tongue in cheek of course.

<comment><USER4> If you're stereotyping, then you'd only be having sex to procreate, not weekly.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Wired really should know better. This non-issue is ~3 years old: <http://www.google.com/trends?q=i-doser>

Being an audio engineer, I've been playing around with binaural beats since the mid-90s. they strike me a useful meditation aid, but then so does low- volume pink noise. 'I-dosing' is about as thrilling and dangerous as yoga, which is to say hardly at all.

<comment><USER6> It's pretty obvious here that this article is poking fun at all the sensationalism:

 _Perhaps most importantly, what will happen if the kids move onto harder stuff like Steve Reich, Philip Glass or even Janet Cardiff's installation, "The Killing Machine"?_

<comment><USER5> I got that; my objection is to giving a 'silly season' story undeserved further momentum, implicitly endorsing its novelty. Of course, publishers always need some standby material to fill the 'news hole' between the ads - 'slow news day? No scandals? oh well...run a teen panic story then.'

This over-reliance on filler material is one of the things I dislike about old media. Since newspapers and broadcast news are anchored in time, recycled and anniversary stories have some utility in that they'll be new to enough of the audience to justify occasional repetition. But on the internet where information is mostly persistent, it's high time to abandon this capsule approach and move towards extending and updating a single story - a bit more along the lines of Wikipedia, but preferably without the opaque editing fiefdoms.

Part of my grumpiness stems from ongoing annoyance at content farming and a degrading signal:noise ratio. The internet feels constipated to me now in a way that seems to happen about every 6 years or so.* So I've got a spiffy new beta interface for Google News - yay; but their deployment of Caffeine means that my news feed contains more and more populist rubbish (like this i-dosers story).

Oh, and get off my lawn :-)

* the good part of that is the opportunities for disruption. Past information logjams were broken up by the arrival of HTML/Mosaic; Google search; and client-side web apps.

<comment><USER7> Wow. Next time, I'll make sure to write an encyclopedia article rather than a tongue-in-cheek takedown, now that I know the latter isn't allowed on the internet.

By the way, have you ever read the Threat Level blog where this was published? It's definitely a content farm, but we grow some damn fine kumquats.

<comment><USER5> I read Threat Level frequently, and generally like it. Other than the first sentence, my post above is not about you: it's about old media and my perception of internet trends in general. One day you too will share my blighted, joyless perspective.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Couldn't the placebo effect -- the expectation of a high -- lead to dopamine being released in the brain? Like any other pleasurable experience, it would lead to an increased desire for similar experiences, and an increased tolerance to the pleasure (dopamine) received. It seems arguable that this could form an addiction.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dopamine#Motivation_and_pleasur...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dopamine#Motivation_and_pleasure)

However, I have a hard time seeing this as a gateway drug any more than ice cream is a gateway drug. Both produce a dopamine response, but no one worries about kids getting on cocaine after eating an ice cream Sunday.

<comment><USER9> Sound has been used to induce trance and mystical experiences since very early in history. Usually it involves religion, which is usually far more damaging than music as it demands the suppression of critical thinking.

I can tell you that <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=en1asB1haQM> was an interesting experience (in particular the transition that starts at 1:40) sitting down with volume in moderate levels on ordinary earbud-style phones. Lying down in sort-of sensory deprivation, it could be more so.

BTW, I would like to share a heavier drug I used at a local TED conference. Enjoy it while it's legal:

<http://www.tedxsaopaulo.com.br/vitor-araujo-sub/>

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> I had to listen to the "Gate of Hades" track they link in the story in order to attempt to figure out what an i-dose is. I'm old and I'm not even 25 yet, damn kids. <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=en1asB1haQM>

If they're paying for this, I don't think they're getting their money's worth. Just get some nice sennheiser's, pop in some Court of the Crimson King. and lie back.

Secondly, this news report is far more brilliant than the Fox news report on the "SexBox" , so I'm glad today's high schoolers still know how to push the buttons of their parents and the surrounding community.

</comment><comment><USER11> "Could indicate a willingness to experiment."

Oh God no. Children with _open_ minds?! That could lead them to think for themselves!

</comment><comment><USER12> I've been using binaural audio, "theta" inducing frequencies and other "audio drugs" for meditation for the better part of a decade. There are many places to find this stuff for free online (legally) and once you understand how it is supposed to work, you can throw stuff together in Audacity or Garage Band if you feel compelled to do so.

Some people are particularly sensitive to audio and visual stimulation that can create relaxation, disortientation, and other sensations. This is not news.

</comment><comment><USER13> Hey, Hiro, you want to try some Snow Crash?

(I'm a little ashamed to make this reference, but it seemed apposite)

</comment><comment><USER14> So someone finally found a way to market Binaural beats as something cool instead of something for nerdy hippies?

Still, good for a laugh, I guess. 10 points for every teenager that can freak out their parents with this.

</comment><comment><USER15> Someone (possibly me, depending on what I end up doing tonight) should run a test. Tell Person A (preferably the gullible type), using lots of really convincing-sounding technobabble like "attenuated with the dopamine IDT frequency in human brain waves" explain this to a friend, then have them try it. Tell Person B (if he can't tell for himself) how stupid the whole thing is, and have him try it. Report results.

</comment><comment><USER15> Another thought: if someone already believes that mp3s can get you high, you can probably make some serious money selling them "top shelf" FLACs.

</comment><comment><USER16> A /. commenter wrote some real funny satire about this: [http://idle.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1720732&cid=329...](http://idle.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1720732&cid=32915318)

"If you find literature on Fourier Analysis, Electronics or Calculus in your child's bedroom, please get your child to Oklahoma and get them help from the nearest minister."

</comment><comment><USER17> Reminds me of this "binaural beats" new-age thing.

</comment><comment><USER18> This reminds me of the scene in Go, when fake drugs are sold to a bunch of kids. At least I think it was Go.

"Do you feel it? It's reaaaaaally mellow... you gotta really focus"

<comment><USER19> Well, if it makes kids practice concentrating, it's kinda _useful_ right ?

</comment></comment><comment><USER20> Kids these days are so good at trolling their parents.

</comment><comment><USER21> WTF's wrong with stupid adult media?! What's next? Food as drug to get high? Sex as drug to get high? Seem these people really hate other people having fun. Or is it just another way to FUD more money into law enforcement?

I tell you what digital drug is. Digital drug is the sensational news media that got the vast people hooked on their news addiction. They surely should be banned.

</comment><comment><USER22> Music can alter your mental state, and even if these kids are tripping to good tunes, Should we be worried? Then again humans have been using psychotropic drugs for millennia and we think they are bad. Music and Drugs have been a normal part of human culture since we started this whole culture thing. What changed?

<comment><USER23> It's an interesting question. I imagine a lot of it has to do with our current world view. I think a lot of people have a tacit understanding of how fragile it is.

The psychedelics for example aren't illegal because of any harmful physical effects - they're some of the safest drugs we know of, physically. They're illegal because of the world dissolving experience you might have on one. For a people like us who have built up an elaborately abstract way of viewing our world, this is quite threatening.

I think it can also speak about why something like marijuana is still illegal yet caffeine is a daily sacrament for us - one makes you go even faster and work even more, the other makes you fairly uninterested in such things.

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> See also: Mitch Altman's "Brain Machine" (seen in Make Magazine) which uses binaural beats as well as pulsing LEDs to mess with your head. I like it. Some people think it's a bit too intense.

</comment><comment><USER24> Of course this is an Over-The-Top story, but as a language and idiom junkie I love the tag "digital drugs"

Catchy. I expect to hear more of it.

</comment><comment><USER25> So, is this a) a marketing campaign for snake-oil, b) fear-mongering or c) both as it makes money anyways?

<comment><USER26> What is the "this" you're referring to? If "this" is the Kansas local news, then I'm pretty sure "this" is otherwise harmless fifty-year-olds who don't know what the fuck all this crazy shit on the Internet is.

</comment></comment><comment><USER27> Wow. Banning iPods at schools because of this? Surely teachers must realise this is all bullshit?

<comment><USER28> Why would the teachers in an area be any different than parents? They're often parents themselves.

</comment></comment><comment><USER29> What if it's an early field test of a YGBM weapon?

</comment><comment><USER30> oh, come on!

</comment><comment><USER31> It's great fun and all but:

 _Kansas' Mustang Public School district isn't taking the threat lightly, and sent out a letter to parents warning them of the new craze. The educators have gone so far as to ban iPods at school, in hopes of preventing honor students from becoming cyber-drug fiends, News 9 reports._

And of course this is sensational bullshit reporting at a 6th-grade level, but while we're at it, that's what led to Reefer Madness as well. Take this kind of lunacy as a serious threat, and if you meet someone who seriously believes this shit irl, I humbly suggest you punch them in the face.</comment>


Hipster Branding - <AUTHOR> http://hipsterbranding.tumblr.com/ <comment><USER2> I thought the IKEA logo was actually Heineken's for a second.</comment>


Show HN: Partner with the team that built Font Awesome - <AUTHOR> https://fonticons.growsumo.com/

<comment><AUTHOR> Our rl friends at GrowSumo helped us set up a partner program for our new project, Fonticons (Fonticons helps you build the perfect icon set for your website). If you want to do the same, check out GrowSumo.

</comment><comment><USER2> 1) This isn't a Show HN, this is an ad.

2) Did they seriously hijack the Back button?!

<comment><USER3> Hey Neil from GrowSumo here.

We decided to showcase GrowSumo using Fonticons as an example use case (and a really awesome one at that) because it shows the product in action. We know companies like Fonticons have awesome communities and the team gets a lot of inbound requests for partnerships.

GrowSumo's great for companies like Fonticons because we make it easy for their community to work with their team. Apologies for the back button - that's how our routing works nothing more, promise!

Let me know if you have any other questions or feedback.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> Cool! Such an easy way to partner :D Wanted this for so long</comment>


Decentralised social network built on top of email - <AUTHOR> http://mobisocial.stanford.edu/papers/hotpets11.pdf <comment><USER2> This is an interesting idea that uses email/IMAP as a transport for social message passing. It plays to the strengths of multipart email messages having a human-readable part that is as rich as possible for email client viewing (when users aren't in a social-aware application), and a machine readable part (JSON) for plugging in to the rest of the social infrastructure.

Here is their own summary of problems with this approach (from the article):

      * Not all users have a suitable email service (requires IMAP to support the
        "read it if you feel like it" model).

      * Servers tamper with messages as a normal part of existing infrastructure
        (especially mailing lists and spam filters).

      * Basic IMAP does not provide the full gamut of features required (some mail
        servers don't support all IMAP verbs).

      * Mail systems may have standard protocols, but individual implementations
        may have different performance characteristics.

<comment><USER3> Something like this doesn't NEED to work "ontop of" email though. It just needs to work LIKE email, and be decentralized, where anyone can run a "facebook like" social networking server that all know how to talk to eachother. I certainly do applaud efforts like Diaspora. If only they could actually take off. Maybe this approach of working "on top of" the existing email infrastructure will help adoption, IDK. But It seems like it will be equally as challenging to make popular. Might as well write a new protocol that is simply similar in its decentralized nature, so we dont have these issues.

<comment><USER4> The protocols already exist, but who will run the servers?

<comment><USER5> Why not ISP's?

<comment><USER4> What's their incentive?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> GPG/PGP keys were the greatest missed opportunity for social networks. For example widespread acceptance of gpg/pgp would have been a great way to reduce spam.

<comment><USER7> About ten years ago I had two customers who liked us to all encrypt all email. It was easy to do and fairly transparent - strange that this never caught on, at least in my experience.

<comment><USER8> "Why Johnny still can't encrypt" <http://chariotsfire.com/pub/sheng- poster_abstract.pdf>

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> From [https://github.com/tpurtell/socialbar/blob/master/chrome/con...](https://github.com/tpurtell/socialbar/blob/master/chrome/content/utils.js) :

        //fallback for running in chrome
        function md5(str) {
            return "e4d909c290d0fb1ca068ffaddf22cbd0";
        }

Huh?

<comment><USER10>
      $ echo -n "The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog." | md5sum
      e4d909c290d0fb1ca068ffaddf22cbd0  -

It seems to be a commonly used example md5 sum.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> I wondered where I had seen the name of Monica S. Lam (one of the co-authors) before. Turns out she's one of the co-authors of the Dragon Book.

</comment><comment><USER12> I think this could be a part of the solution to the 'replace email' theme by PG[1].

Since their API abstracts the email sending/receiving details away AND gives specific tags to work with [SHARE, LIST, GET, WAIT], one could for example write a TO-DO app or maybe a bug tracker that notifies and updates when a mail with a specific tag comes in.

As I understand it, the problem with building smart mail clients is that there is no standardised format that all clients will agree upon. Using this API circumvents the problem, as the mail client does not actually perform any actions. Using this API's capabilities for "smart" mail clients instead of "social" apps could be interesting.

[1] <http://paulgraham.com/ambitious.html>

</comment><comment><USER13> It seems that one doesn't have much of a social network without the "friend discovery" and "stalking" aspects that this paper ignores. While e-mail based clients for private exchange of personal data among friends would certainly be welcome, it wouldn't quite serve the same role as facebook.

</comment><comment><USER14> Haha far out, I've had an index card on my wall for the best part of this year that says "Email client as social network". D'oh!

<comment><USER15> You beat me to thinking of the idea and not doing it first! I had only been thinking about this for the prior week.

<comment><USER9> You know, you could both still do it. Or you could just build on the work that's been done for you. Looks like nobody's committed for nearly a year.

Edit: [http://mobisocial.stanford.edu/news/2011/07/build-stuff- with...](http://mobisocial.stanford.edu/news/2011/07/build-stuff-with-us/)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> I would've thought you'd want it the other way around, ie. integrate email into your decentralised social network. It'd certainly make spam easier to detect, and email easier to filter.

</comment><comment><USER17> I gave the idea of decentralized social network some thought after reading about facebook chat monitoring. Imho, privacy is becoming such a big concern that i think this is what the next generation of social networking will be like. Being able to store your profile data in your own cloud account on dropbox or google drive would be pretty neat. Perhaps something more sophisticated with its own data provider model and a protocol. Sounds like a neat startup idea.

</comment><comment><USER18> How is this going to mix with the user's other email? I certainly wouldn't want to see all the Mr. Privacy messages in my mail client and while I can easily setup a filter, many users would not be able to do that.

end to end GPG encryption also seems like required feature. Then your details really are secure from all the intermediate parties.

<comment><USER12> It automatically sets up a separate folder and routes all Mr. Privacy messages (there is a specific format for these) into that folder. If you wanted to see them, you could. But normally, they wouldn't crowd your inbox.

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> Storage space is not really a big problem with most major mail services offering >5 GB, but I wonder where all the static content would be stored, and how it gets updated when there is a change (eg. user profile picture). Surely, one wouldn't store those outside the mailbox?

<comment><USER4> Why not just send them as an attachment to a "Profile Picture Changed" event message? Then clients can delete the old attachments when they get the new.

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> As the authors have noted, there is no way to invalidate content. So those drunk posts cannot be certainly deleted from your friends's feed. Personally I don't see a big problem with this, but it definitely needs to be addressed.

</comment><comment><USER19> I hope they add encryption to it. Intermediate SMTP servers are untrust worthy.

<comment><USER20> If you built a client on top of email, you could add PGP encryption as part of the service. Getting and accepting friend requests performs the key exchange handshake needed and _voila!_ encryption. There's some nuances here that would need to be addressed, but nothing particularly showstopping.

<comment><USER19> Governments/ISP/School/Company could ban obvious encrypted SMTP message.

Encryption should be done in a obfuscated handshake way. That's what this paper lacks (and this really matters.)

Also if you have your own IMAP/SMTP server running, you should really think about some kind of TOR-like relay network to hide your server IP.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> Good idea - we've been doing something similar for groups/companies with just the header data of email. The Datahug.com API allows developers to build on top of the email social graph.

</comment><comment><USER22> we are gonna miss all the good stuff from recommender system.

</comment><comment><USER23> This paper is two years old. Presumably if anything was going to come of this idea, it would have happened by now.

What's the point of posting such an old PDF as it were new? To a site with the word "News" in its name? It's interesting, yes, but it's misleading too.

<comment><USER24> I guess I'd say It's valid if people weren't already aware of it.

I wasn't aware of it, and I'm actually _building_ it.</comment></comment>


Dostoyevsky's "Dream of a Ridiculous Man" (2014) - <AUTHOR> https://www.brainpickings.org/2014/11/11/dostoyevsky-dream/ <comment><USER2> > I saw and know that men could be beautiful and happy, without losing the > capacity to live upon the earth.

This struck me as the revelation that changed the protagonist's perspective. And Dostoyevsky presents this using the irrational, symbolic language of dreams: a vision of human dignity. He concludes by quoting Christ's commandment... showing that this isn't new knowledge. It's been known for a very long time, but one must experience suffering and a spiritual death before the full significance of the commandment can be understood.

Kierkegaard's book on Christian love provides an in-depth (and sometimes tedious) discussion of the necessity of love of ones neighbor. Recommend checking it out if you're curious to read _why_ one could come to view such love as necessary for life.

<comment><USER3> "Works of Love" [https://www.amazon.com/Works-Harper-Perennial-Modern- Thought...](https://www.amazon.com/Works-Harper-Perennial-Modern- Thought/dp/0061713279) perhaps

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> This was an incredible read! This is my first introduction to Dostoyesvky and I'm engrossed.

So from these excerpts, his profound writing reminds me of another great writer I admire the most; Poe. Poe's writing has had a profound effect on me and so has this story by Dostoyesvky.

I see the similarity in the sense that both of these writers seem to distill such great truths about life and translate them into poetical and lyrical writing.

The conventional plot is barebones in their stories but their focus lies on the inner turmoil, revolving intensely around a lonesome nihilistic character musing about the existence, human desires and the consequent suffering that results thereafter.

I'm a fan now and will definitely be reading more of Dostoyesvky.

<comment><USER5> It's wordy and all over the place, but I loved the Brothers Karamazov in my early twenties.

<comment><USER6> I think a lot of the parts in that book that seemed to be all over the place would have later come together into something more cohesive by the end of the second book.

It was supposed to be the first part of two books but he died before he wrote the second. Which is why I think there was much more to the plot and there may have been some more twists beside what was already revealed in the first.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> For anyone who loves Dostoyevsky, I'd recommend Alexander Solzhenitsyn too. His writings have a stronger political bent, but his style is firmly in the Russian tradition, with a mastery of the polyphonic voice—the ability to bring life to many perspectives—and explores every aspect of life and humanity. A Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich—a portrait of a gulag prisoner—is the quickest introduction.

<comment><USER3> It's harder to take this work seriously after the way it's been politicized by Jordan Peterson.

<comment><USER8> How does what Peterson have to say effect your opinion on the significance of the contents of The Gulag Archipelago?

I bought a copy of it, so I could make up my own mind. Peterson brought it to my attention and it was timely as I read Man's Search For Meaning this year. That book is very widely read.

I had never even heard of The Gulag Archipelago. Peterson points out that it's severely under-read in the West compared to how significant it is. He's saying you should at least read it and judge for yourself and not let only the ideology itself be the basis on which you judge the ideology.

That seems reasonably sensible to me.

<comment><USER3> He uses it as a boogeyman, which makes me less inclined to read it. But it could be great. Just a slight variation in my inclination, I'm not making any sweeping statement.

<comment><USER8> He does mention it an awful lot. Then again if he's right about what he's saying that the ways of thinking that produced those kinds of outcomes are alive and well and trying to advance their agenda either consciously or unconsciously, then that seems significant to me.

I guess to that end it's one data point among many.

As I've grown ever more curious about history and have started to dive into more and more parts of it I find that really reading through things deeply yourself is a much richer experience than a crude surface level analysis or taking someone's word for it. I had never heard of it prior to him bringing it up and it's like holy moly here looks like the exact kind of thing I find quite engrossing to read.

I think HN book recommendation thread from recently mentioned An Era of Darkness which I haven't bought yet because I implement a moratorium on buying books until I get through another 50, but I did add it to my list. That one is an account of British Rule in India.

Id rather do my best to learn the lessons of history. I think it's a lost art these days.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> Russian literature in a nutshell:

[https://img0.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/d/0/142/711/14271...](https://img0.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/d/0/142/711/142711842_142175260_916D28D36B7C418EAB5D4894BF668387.jpg)

Translation:

Russian classical literature

New man | Odd man | Small man

SUFFERING

<comment><USER10> Just the classical? Just the literature?

I thought that cycle was the nutshell of Russia. Then again I only know Russia through her authors. Holy S*^% they're brilliant!

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> Also noteworthy is the beautiful animated short film of the same title by Aleksandr Petrov, painstakingly made in paint-on-glass animation: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dream_of_a_Ridiculous_Man_...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dream_of_a_Ridiculous_Man_\(film\))

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIr7cs6eEAs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIr7cs6eEAs)

</comment><comment><USER12> Tangential: The picture used there "The 1845 depiction of a galaxy that inspired Van Gogh's 'The Starry Night" is attributed to the book which was published in 2014, but the picture it actually public domain:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Parsons,_3rd_Earl_of_R...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Parsons,_3rd_Earl_of_Rosse#/media/File:M51Sketch.jpg)

The picture was made by William Parsons, 3rd Earl of Rosse:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Parsons,_3rd_Earl_of_R...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Parsons,_3rd_Earl_of_Rosse)

As the point in the sky what we today call the "Whirlpool galaxy" was discovered in 1773 by Charles Messier and "in 1845, William Parsons, 3rd Earl of Rosse, employing a 72-inch (1.8 m) reflecting telescope at Birr Castle, Ireland, found the Whirlpool possessed a spiral structure."

Only during the last 100 years we have obtained proofs that a lot of these objects that what were before called "nebulas" are the galaxies with many billions of the stars in each of them, and that the Whirlpool galaxy is a galaxy.

It seems that just the author of the mentioned book from 2014 claims that that 1845 picture inspired Van Gogh. While it's true that the picture was published in the books at the times when Van Gogh could have seen it, it seems it's still not proven, and I'm surely not convinced: in the painting of Van Gogh we can't actually see any spiral star, all shine circularly, and the spiral shapes are something else (air movements?):

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Starry_Night](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Starry_Night)

so, beware of internets bearing gifts.

On another side, the awareness of the planets being planets and of comparable size to Earth existed of course much longer, so Dostoyevsky's hero could write in 1877 something that the readers would even then easily understand (as quoted in the article):

"If I had previously lived on the moon or in Mars, and I had there been dishonored and disgraced so utterly that one can only imagine it sometimes in a dream or a nightmare, and if I afterwards found myself on earth and still preserved a consciousness of what I had done on the other planet, and if I knew besides that I would never by any chance return, then, if I were to look at the moon from the earth — would it be all the same to me or not?"

</comment><comment><USER13> Dostoyevsky changed my life.

<comment><USER14> How?

<comment><USER10> I can't speak for the OP, nor can I express how D. changed my life.

Perhaps D. is the exact opposite of a self-help book at the airport. It's hard to read and emotionally devastating. You go into the depths of human depravity. Sin is real. Modernity is fraught with contradictions, with danger. Modernity offers mechanical band aids for what are sicknesses of our souls. For Doestoyevsky the greatest man is Christ but he is what we would consider an Idiot.

In the end you are offered catharsis. accept it and you are changed.

<comment><USER15> I like they way he challenges himself and his beliefs. If he presents a character with a contrary position, he doesn't cheat. He makes them powerful, compelling, articulate characters and presents their arguments in the best light. He's incredibly tough on himself and his protagonists or sympathetic characters.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> that was one of the best reads that I ever had! thanks for posting this.

</comment><comment><USER17> one of the best readings that occurred to me on HN, I rarely comment on anything here.

</comment><comment> q-base That was a very good read. Thank you very much. I purchased the Kindle version of "The Dream of a Ridiculous Man" after reading this.

I have never read Dostoyevsky before. Any recommendations on where else to start?

<comment><USER18> Crime and Punishment is a wonderful deep dive into the mind of a really messed up person. If you like the film Taxi Driver, it is sort of similar, but with a lot more direct philosophical underpinnings. Raskolnikov has a whole philosophical framework on why he's allowed to murder the pawn shop owner* and he spends time explaining and discussing it.

The motif of the nihilistic, disaffected young man is something Fyodor gets a lot of mileage out of, but he's the master of that genre. Notes From Underground is similar, but a lot shorter. It's one of the few Dostoevsky novels I haven't read, so I can't say much more than that. Its opening is his most famous line: "I am a sick man. I am a spiteful man. I am an unpleasant man. I think my liver is diseased."

To go against the grain of most recommendations, I'll say that "Notes from a Dead House" (the name differs depending on translation) is a good place to start too. It's essentially his prison memoirs, slightly fictionalized to avoid censors. There are a lot of little details that stood out and affected me deeply. e.g: He recalls a small dog that was often abused by the other prisoners, and was so timid that it would "sink to the ground on all fours and start trembling all over" when he petted it. The book has so many small, human details that really show the personal history that influenced his later books. He has an eye for those details that most people would gloss over.

The thing to keep in mind is that, across Dostoyevsky's novels, there are a lot of scenes where people stand around discussing philosophy. It's great and engaging if you're into it, but it will kill your enjoyment if it's not your thing. The Brothers Karamazov and Demons are books to avoid for your first attempt; they include a lot of that. Fyodor is really preachy in general, but this increases over time in his career, so his earlier books are more plot- focused. And he's all about symbolism, like the hypothetical author in the famous "curtains are blue" meme.

Finally, don't worry too much about translation. Pevear and Volokhonsky are always the most recommended, but that is more due to current trends in translation than their objective superiority. That's not to say they're bad, but any modern translation is going to be fine. Constance Garnett is the only one who's not so great, but I had a fine experience with her translation of C&P as my first Dostoyesvky novel, so it's hardly unreadable.

*not a spoiler, this happens in the opening

<comment><USER19> Let's not forget the context, too - Dostojewski was very worried about the individualistic and nihilistic trends he noticed in the Western world and which were slowly seeping through to Russia as well. He was worried they'll lead to a collapse of civilization, and was looking for an answer on how to prevent that from happening. His books are an exploration of this subject.

</comment></comment></comment><comment> throw-far-away Yes.

And also: Chekhov, Nabokov. Of course: Tolstoy for those super-sized tomes that give you a free workout.</comment>


Show HN: Finac – Codecademy meets Finance (prototype, not mobile responsive) - <AUTHOR> http://www.thefinac.tk <comment><USER2> I think there's a lot of potential value here.

I would suggest more value neutral analysis, e.g. focusing on how different behaviors have different costs rather than presuming particular behaviors are frivolous or wrong.

For example, for a person who prefers coffee to tea, homemade tea is not a viable virtue. Similarly, eating at the cafe today doesn't mean that a person will do so tomorrow. More importantly, a person who eats at the cafe every day, is not behaving badly, e.g. an elderly person who does so to maintain wider human contact.

To put it another way, teaching people new ways to think about decisions rather than what to think.

Good luck.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks you for the valuable feedback! With the prototype we were trying to do give a glimpse at the content that we have planned! In the future we will expand on how "Saving" is a powerful tool and expand on other more complex financial tools like stocks, investments!

Thanks again! :)</comment></comment>


[Ask HN] Does mashable.com use wordpress.org? - <AUTHOR>

I was checking mashable.com and I was wondering if the news website uses wordpress.org as their framework, like for example techcrunch.com. How can I find this out? <comment><USER2> I thought Techcrunch used WordPress VIP, not Wordpress.org. Could be wrong

<comment><USER3> Mmmm... this seems irrelevant. I think OP is asking if it uses WordPress as a platform not the actual server technology behind it. WordPress.org doesn't provide hosting btw.</comment></comment>


Google Chrome Bug: Crashes when typing in Unicode (Tamil)  - <AUTHOR>

Hey Google Chrome ,<p>1. Open Your new google chrome browser
2. Type a unicode tamil text in address browser 3. It crashes and asks for relaunch. <comment><USER2> Using code generated here

[http://www.higopi.com/ucedit/Tamil.html](http://www.higopi.com/ucedit/Tamil.html)

in a new tab on Chromium 29.0.1547.57 Debian jessie/sid (217859)

does not crash the browser

<comment><AUTHOR> cannot be used practically. i use NHM writer and want to type in multiple windows.</comment></comment>


MIT OpenCourseWare introduces courses designed for independent learners - <AUTHOR> http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2010/mitocw-independent-learners.html <comment><USER2> As a young autodidact struggling to fit into the traditional education world this is a welcome gift. To me a traditional diploma granting institution is now akin to a rubber stamp. You're not paying for the education, you're paying for the brand under the assumption that it will get you a job. I could rant, but I plan on doing it in a cohesive and informed blog release or something at a later date.

MIT diffuses my cynicism with steps like this. In an academic system I do not trust there are clearly intelligent like minded people enabled to make a difference. After years of dreading my involvement with academia, movements like this make me want to wander back in with an open mind.

If anyone involved with MIT OpenCourseWare ever reads this please know that I respect and appreciate what you have done for people thirsty for knowledge. Thank you from the bottom of my heart.

<comment><USER3> Well, by attending a traditional institution you're really paying firstly for experts to take partial responsibility for your learning, enough to stake some of their reputation on it, and secondly for entrance to a club of peers of similar ability to learn with.

With more and more material available online, I can see how taking full responsibility for your own learning is less daunting than it once was. I'm still curious as to what will replace the role of peers of similar ability in this self-learning model.

<comment><USER4> In my experience at one of those traditional institutions, those experts often couldn't care less about any responsibility to undergrads. Their job is to do research, and to get grants to support that research. The number of professors for whom teaching was clearly a nuisance was one of the most depressing parts of the experience.

Having similarly capable peers is really the primary advantage, especially if those relationships carry on after you finish.

<comment><USER2> I agree completely, particularly with undergrad educations. Professers aren't picked on their teaching ability. They really don't have an incentive to improve the education of their students, other than personal diligence.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I didn't realize OCW was meant for teachers... I thought it was for independent learners all along.

</comment><comment><USER6> Bill Gates has predicted that the best higher education will come from the web and will be cheaper - this is just another step. [Article: <http://techcrunch.com/2010/08/06/bill-gates-education/> Video: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2Qg80MVvYs&feature=playe...](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2Qg80MVvYs&feature=player_embedded)]

In the same vein as MIT, UC Berkeley has many lectures on availble on Youtube. [<http://www.youtube.com/user/UCBerkeley>]

</comment><comment><USER7> Great to see that MIT are addressing the most important problem with OCW: organizing the knowledge intelligibly.

I'm currently having fun with their introduction to programming that uses Python: [http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/electrical-engineering-and- comput...](http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/electrical-engineering-and-computer- science/6-00-introduction-to-computer-science-and-programming- fall-2008/assignments/). (Get the lectures on iTunes U.)

Granted, I don't know if that's the best gateway drug to programming, but it has the irrefutable advantage of assignments that apply the information. You always feel morose watching OCW lectures where the lecturer talks about an assignment that you'd love to do.

<comment><USER8> Also another good "beginner" (was already a programmer, and it was still a great course) course that actually has everything - lectures, notes, textbook, assignments, tests and answers! - available free online is the UC Berkley CS61A course.

The course teaches the fundamentals of Computer Science with Scheme (Lisp) and the book is SICP (a really great all-around CS book). I watched all the lectures, and did most of the assignments over a month or two last year and learned a lot. Sometimes you have to Google around for old tests/answer keys, but resources for the entire course are online. I highly recommend it if you are remotely interested in programming.

Multiple Semesters of Audio/Video Lectures are on iTunesU

Resources from the Summer 2010 Course:<http://www- inst.eecs.berkeley.edu/~cs61a/su10/>

Edit: Formatting

<comment><USER9> Great tip, thanks!

If you're like me, and sometimes prefer to have some visual with your audio, Berkley also provides webcasts of these lectures. Here, for example, is Spring '08 of CS61A:

[http://webcast.berkeley.edu/course_details.php?seriesid=1906...](http://webcast.berkeley.edu/course_details.php?seriesid=1906978502)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> The first thought that popped into my mind from reading this was when is there going to be a bachelor's equivalency exam? Perhaps a new potential market for the ETS?

<comment> barry-cotter It isn't a bachelor's equivalency exam but if you take enough credits you can get a degree entirely by examination.

<http://www.excelsior.edu/ecapps/exams/creditByExam.jsf>

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> This is great news! In most cases the materials on offer were sparse, but an initiative like this will make it really useful both for autodidacts and instructors looking for materials.

</comment><comment><USER12> Khan giving them a bit of scare? I bet...

<comment><USER13> I do think this is a genuine attempt to spread knowledge.

Even being cynical there is no real downside for them. People will still want to go to MIT 'for real' and they will still fill their lecture halls with paying students - even if MIT could expand to take everyone that wanted to go there - this would dilute the MIT brand.

Allowing everyone else to get the knowledge for free simply kills the competition, there is no market for a staet-college online course when you can have the best for free.

<comment><USER14> Maybe if smaller state-colleges are smart they can leverage OCW to their advantage. Instead of doing their own lectures and coursework, they'll use OCW and focus on adding value where OCW cannot with things like instructor led discussion and Q&A sessions about the lecture you've just seen, helping with and grading coursework, one-on-one assistance with assignments, handing out certificates or diplomas upon completing a set of courses, and all the other good stuff an actual college can to better than a pre-recorded video. In fact I'd probably sign up and pay money for just that.

<comment><USER13> That was the idea, and why MIT were surprised that most people were using it on their own.

What I meant was that there was no market for a small college selling lectures online for $100s when you could get MIT for free. It won't change the economics of people going to college

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Already posted this in longer form as a reply [1], but the UC Berkeley CS courses that are available online are really great, and you can usually find ALL the material for the course online.

If you want to learn Scheme (Lisp), I highly recommend CS61A [2]

[1] <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2103949> [2] <http://www- inst.eecs.berkeley.edu/~cs61a/su10/> Lectures on iTunesU

</comment><comment><USER15> This is a fantasy come true.

</comment><comment><USER16> I've always been an independent learner, so I think this is great, but the concept of a "course for independent learners" sounds a lot like herding cats.

</comment><comment><USER17> 8.01 Physics I: Classical Mechanics is Amazing. Walter Lewin makes the bizarre properties and mysteries of the universe come alive in the classroom.

[http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/physics/8-01-physics-i- classical-...](http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/physics/8-01-physics-i-classical- mechanics-fall-1999/video-lectures/)</comment>


Senate TSA Oversight Hearing 17 Nov - <AUTHOR> http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travel-safety-security/1147610-heads-up-senate-tsa-oversight-hearing-17-nov.html

<comment><USER2> The republicans are home to anti-government tea partiers and to self- proclaimed security hawks. Should make for an interesting split. Also, this is an issue on which the tea partiers and progressives could find themselves on the same side. Pass the popcorn.</comment>


The best way (until now) to change domain name of a WordPress Multisite - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/interconnectit/Search-Replace-DB

<comment><USER2> I've used this before and it works really well. I migrated the same wordpress install multiple times with it (once to move domain, the other to change it to https) and I didn't have a problem either time.

Of course -- YMMV, and you should definitely back up your database before.</comment>


Ask HN: Quitting job to go freelancing - <AUTHOR> Fuck it , im quitting my 9 to 5 job and go freelancing. I have some savings and 2 or 3 clients , dont have children so fuck it, I wanna go surfing when the waves are good, and work when i feel like working.
Please save your negative comments about freelancing, I wont change my decition. The thing is worst thing that can happen is in 6 months Im starving and I need to find a new job. (getting interviews offer 2 or 3 times a week now, so that wont be a problem)
So asking for your experience, have you done this? ideas? thoughts? (again: only possitive experiences) <comment><USER2> Great decision! I have done the same and not looked back.

The first few years are the worst. You'll have times when you are worried and want to throw in the towel or just plain overwhelmed. Unless you are destitute and need the money from a full time job - push through this! The freedom on the other side is worth the sacrifice.

\- Automate everything you can. Billing, business related payments, etc. Give yourself the option to skip a day or two and not think about it.

\- Get a good CPA! Anything you need for the "business" is now a write off. The comments that you'll pay more in taxes are total BS. As an unmarried, childless and non home owning CA resident I lost over 42% of my income to taxes working for someone else. I now have an effective rate of ~25% when you take into account all the write offs.

\- Once you establish yourself you can be more selective in not taking clients that tie you to a specific physical location. Accommodating timezones from the other side of the planet is far less demanding when you are doing it barefoot on the beach.

I played the startup game for a long time. I had some mild success but over same timeframe I would have made far more doing my own thing earlier. I now make substantially more than my fancy titled tech job. More so, I work far less and wouldn't give up my free time to make more. I choose when I work, how I work and to some degree the type of work.

Last thing, don't listen to the people who tell you it can't be done or not worth it. I have witnessed a lot of people attempt this and fail with the number one reason by a large margin being succumbing to the doubt instilled by others. Worse, its instilled by people with no experience in doing it themselves or in some cases jealousy. Yes, it will be hard in the near term. Yes, you will have many failures along the way. Shake yourself off and start over. Find other like minded people to learn from.

</comment><comment><USER3> Good Luck! My advice to you would be proof read any emails you're sending out. That stuff might not matter at a 9-5 (it should). But you won't get any work if you can't type a proper email without spelling mistakes.

</comment><comment><USER4> Save for taxes. You can choose to pay quarterly to make it easier than paying a giant lump sum at the end of the yeaar Also, look into contributing to a SEP IRA (ask your accountant for more info).

Ask your ex-colleagues and coworkers for referrals. Many times my referrals are basically working as a consultant for past coworkers and their new companies.

Don't always work for the money. Give yourself some time to learn new stuff otherwise, you'll burn out and end up treating it like a regular job.

<comment><USER5> As long as you're regularly making decent money, 1040-ES is a requirement every quarter and could/might/will be penalized if skipped with a fee the next year after filing taxes.

Roth IRAs are my preferred way to save for retirement.

<comment><USER6> Both Roth and SEP are great ways to save for retirement and they are not mutually exclusive.

SEP IRAs let you save a huge amount of money (last I checked, a few years ago, it was up to 50k, or 25% of your income, whichever was less) tax free. But you pay taxes when you pull the money out in retirement.

Roth IRAs let you pay taxes now, and then pull money out tax free in retirement (and you can pull out contributions in the meantime if you need).

So, you can hedge your tax exposure in retirement by contributing to both types.

(I am not an accountant or CPA, just a bit of a finance nerd.)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Save as much as you can, and don't forget there are three parts to freelancing:

Getting the work

Doing the work

Getting paid for the work

You have to take care of all three tasks.

<comment><USER7> The first (Finding) has been the hardest one for me. The second one is just business as usual and the third one is best covered by this video: "Fuck You, Pay Me by Mike Monteiro". [https://vimeo.com/158221814](https://vimeo.com/158221814)

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> Always be closing. Seriously. Everything needs to be logged and moved into your sales funnel.

Pick what matters, grow your team, trust your gut, and don't give up! :)

[side note] For some reason I read this post in Teddy KGB's (John Malkovich) voice from Rounders (1998) [http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0128442/](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0128442/).

<comment><AUTHOR> havent watched that one, will have to do it I guess haha

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Do it. Life's too short to spend in the cubicle farm.

If you're currently in an expensive place like US/EU/Australia, relocate to a developing country that has good infrastructure and a low cost of living. This way you'll give yourself a _much_ longer runway, and you can decide to work only part time if you want and still live comfortably while having a great work/life balance.

Thailand is a great choice; I've been here several years and know many other people who've done the same thing successfully - I've heard no regrets from any of them. My income is comparable with what I would be earning back home, but for every month of full time work I do I can afford to take two months off. I'm not going back.

Check out the "digital nomad" community, which will give you a lot of tips and advice on this lifestyle. It's not for everyone, but if you're young and single, you have no reason not to try.

</comment><comment><USER10> Ah, the good old days! I spent the first half of my career freelancing, and the second working for the man. My current status is fine, but I do look back fondly on the freedom and the limited exposure to company stuff. It was no less work, though. I worked pretty damned hard to keep customers happy, and being freelance didn't take away the essentially obsessional nature of programming (for me). I learned to compensate by taking long trips between contracts, something that would be impossible with my current FTE status.

Best of luck.

</comment><comment><USER11> I can't speak to the freelancing aspect, but I can to the fuck it quitting. I've been traveling the last two years, mostly in and around Vietnam. Vietnam is amazing, cheap, and I highly recommend it if you can work remotely. Places like Vung Tau and Mui Ne have some of the best kite surfing in the world.

<comment><AUTHOR> Ive been to Vietnam and is awesome!, thats the plan, eventually move and work from somewhere in Asia

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> The most rewarding parts for me were:

\- Being valued for my results

\- Having to learn skills in disciplines different than my specialty, such as law, sales, & accounting

\- Getting better insight into my productivity/output levels (and being able set my schedule around when I was most productive)

\- Solving a variety of different problems

\- Never a dull moment!

Have fun!!

</comment><comment><USER13> Unless your current clients can continuously refer you to your next one, expect to do a lot more talking (selling and spec'ing) than at your last job (assuming you were part of an engineering team as a programmer).

Great choice -- I did this two years ago and it changed everything :)

<comment><AUTHOR> I was thinking on giving them 10% off if they bring new clients. but not sure yet

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> > it Quiting job

Quiting -> Quitting

> change my decition.

decition -> decision

<comment><AUTHOR> thanks for this, not a native speaker :)

</comment></comment><comment><USER15> Incorporate.

Get an accountant.

Buy health insurance.

Prepare to pay significantly more in taxes.

<comment><USER16> > Prepare to pay significantly more in taxes.

And pay them quarterly, which can be done online via [https://www.eftps.gov/eftps/](https://www.eftps.gov/eftps/)

<comment><USER17> Doesn't this just allow you to pay in 4 payments instead of one? I am not aware that it allows you to pay less.

<comment><USER5> All independent and freelance workers are required to pay 1040-ES every quarter and could/might/will face penalties if they don't make payments in a timely manner or underpay. Estimated payments are a way to balance out the taxes you owe to the government.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> Good stuff! I always get my waves early morning on week days, no crowds - bliss. The work will come easy as long as you believe in yourself.

</comment><comment><USER19> I'm in China, I also want to go freelancing. Good Luck!!!

<comment><AUTHOR> send me an email, maybe we can help each other

<comment><USER20> Looking for an intern/coworker? I also want to ride the waves early. I am roadtripping from Boston to SF and need place to stay. Will code or file your taxes if I can also surf and learn from you. :)

<comment><AUTHOR> Im based in Auckland currently :(</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Two Students Created A Brilliant Alternative To A Regular Cardboard Box - <AUTHOR> http://www.businessinsider.com/rapid-packing-container-2014-1?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+businessinsider+%28Business+Insider%29

<comment><USER2> I like it, but there is probably still work that needs to go in to this. If you can open it just by putting pressure on the top, it will probably open in transit. Also, how well does it handle edge crushes?

<comment><USER3> I think the fact that it opens too easily is the elephant in the room. It may stay closed when stacked neatly, but I would like to see what happens when you toss a box, or when a box with a heavy object inside is upside down on uneven flooring.

Because of that, I don't think this will be an universal replacement for all cardboard boxes. It may see application in some niche corners of the market, though, and that may make it a success.</comment></comment>


Donald Trump Is Running Some Really Insecure Email Servers - <AUTHOR> http://motherboard.vice.com/read/trump-is-running-some-really-insecure-email-servers <comment><USER2> It's like I've been saying about Hillary for months. The idea that Hillary knew how any of her email infrastructure works is an affront to IT people everywhere.

Hillary and every other politician, CEO, etc: "Can I get email at home?"

IT guy: "well, from a security stand point...(they hear blah, blah blah)...."

Them: "So, was that a yes? or should I find someone else that can?"

None of them give two shits how any of that stuff works including trump.

<comment><USER3> >Them: "So, was that a yes? or should I find someone else that can?"

The correct answer in this case would be "I guess you'll have to find someone else".

"Just following orders" is not an excuse, certainly not when national security is at stake.

<comment><USER2> That's called integrity. Not something you see a lot of anymore.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> >In what might be one of the more delicious cases of irony to ever grace a presidential election, a researcher has found that a number of email servers linked to Donald Trump's hotel and others businesses are running horribly out of date software which receive no security patches, and are lacking other precautions for keeping hackers out.

That kind of reads like a wink and a nod, and a "Hey guys... fresh meat!" Don't get me wrong, it couldn't happen to a nicer person, but beyond that I'm not sure that I see the point of the article. They claim to be amazed, but surely if we've learned anything over this election cycle, it's that the worst systems you'll ever find are systems in use by people in government. AOL email (if you're lucky), and other issues have loomed large. Surely we still remember the state of the VA records system?

<comment><USER5> > They claim to be amazed, but surely if we've learned anything over this > election cycle, it's that the worst systems you'll ever find are systems in > use by people in government.

These are email servers mostly for Trump's private business.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> But he's not storing/sending classified email.

<comment><USER7> I haven't really been keeping up with all the scandals, did they leaks find emails that included classification markings?

<comment><USER8> The FBI did. James Comey announced before congress that she had pretty much lied about everything, including having classified material. If you go to youtube and search for something like 'Comey vs Hillary lies' you should get a video playing her claims and his findings. I'd find it for you, but I'm at least theoretically working atm.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> Pretty intentionally misleading but handily, by posting to HN, makes sure lots of people visit and then cause a DoS. Looks like someone posted this with a nice innocent smiley face.

<comment><USER10> I don't understand your point. There was no smiley face. If the online portal vice.com cannot handle a sudden increase in pageviews it's not necessarily a denial-of-service-attack.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> Trying not to wonder if those servers would contain any tax returns. Or a pink elephant.</comment>


Painless, effective peer reviews - <AUTHOR> http://jliszka.github.io/2013/11/07/effective-peer-reviews.html

<comment><USER2> As one of OP's direct reports, I can attest to this system working really well and, at least for me, being a much faster and more comfortable experience than doing a written peer review.

</comment><comment><USER3> Why can't employees give feedback directly to each other instead of having to go through the manager? Direct feedback might save quite some time. Thoughts?

<comment><AUTHOR> That would be ideal, but a lot of people are uncomfortable doing that, and you would not get critical feedback as often or as reliably.</comment></comment>


Redneck Bank - <AUTHOR> https://redneck.bank <comment><USER2> I hope they run Red Hat on the back end.

For those who never installed Red Hat in the late '90s and so probably have no idea what I'm talking about, see this [1].

[1] [https://imgur.com/gallery/yX5uw](https://imgur.com/gallery/yX5uw)

<comment><USER3> Sounds more Cockney to me.

<comment><USER4> Not to split hairs, but I would expect more rhyming for Cockney. Examples: [https://www.theguardian.com/education/2014/jun/09/guide- to-c...](https://www.theguardian.com/education/2014/jun/09/guide-to-cockney- rhyming-slang)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> They say they're an FDIC member.

The FDIC says [1] Redneck bank is another name for All America Bank, which has been insured since December 22, 1969.

There are at least two populations that would like this, IMO: a hipster crowd who are not in any way like rednecks, and the country crowd who look like rednecks to outsiders and call themselves rednecks, but who insist, if you ask them about it, that they're being tongue-in-cheek about it. In my experience, the latter group is having more fun.

[1] [https://research2.fdic.gov/bankfind/detail.html?bank=20093&n...](https://research2.fdic.gov/bankfind/detail.html?bank=20093&name=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.redneck.bank&searchByTradename=true&city=&state=&zip=&address=&searchWithin=&activeFlag=&tabId=2)

<comment><USER6> I don't know if I'd ever actually sign up for Redneck Bank, but I definitely would never have heard of All America Bank without it. Maybe that's their play here.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> I'm not really a "redneck" and even though I moved to "town" when I was still knee-high to a grasshopper (and later to "the city" to get myself some learnin's and an edu-ma-cation), I am absolutely a four-wheel truck drivin', Harley-Davidson (1690cc cruiser) ridin', ole country boy (and yes, back in high school my pick-'em-up truck had a shotgun rack in it).

While I'm not sure that I, personally, would choose to do my bankin' down at the "Redneck Bank", you can bet yer ass I've got a bunch of friends and family members who would walk in and sign up right now if they built a local branch in my hometown!

</comment><comment><USER8> From someone who actually banks with them (as All America Bank), here are the attractions:

\- decent interest rate on savings, used to be 2.5% not that long ago, but now is 1.75%. I don't blame them, I blame the Fed.

\- Push/Pull ACH with moderate restrictions and no fees.

\- No incoming wire fees.

\- No foreign transaction charges (but 75 cent fee for OS ATM useage).

\- No fees for the first 10 BillPay transactions, which is full featured. This is fine because you can pay credit cards and the like with ACH.

\- Generally low or no fees (but there is an overdraw fee).

\- Functional, reasonably snappy online banking without being needlessly complicated.

\- You can link someone else's account to yours so it appears like one of your accounts, with instant transfers.

\- Reasonable security without being too annoying.

\- If you ring them someone in the office will pick up the phone after a few rings, no call center, no stupid pointless IVRs. Sure sometimes they sound really hung over from the night before, but generally they're very nice.

\- Online secure messages are responded to promptly and you can do most things on it, none of this "please ring..." nonsense.

\- You can fully avoid the "Redneck Bank" marketing identity if you so choose. There is no mention on statements or online banking.

I've been with them for a few years and I have no plans to go elsewhere.

</comment><comment><USER9> Nice interest rate. Their parent bank [https://allamerica.bank/](https://allamerica.bank/) has branches in Oklahoma and does agricultural financing as well as normal bank stuff. it's a clever way to diversify and get a wider online presence beyond Oklahoma. The fly is a great touch.

<comment><USER10> According to the fine print, you need to keep a balance of $10,000 to get that 2.25% rate. There have been points in my life when I've had that much money in the bank, but this is not one of them.

<comment><USER11> "Earn 2.25% APY when you have up to $10,000 in your account. Amounts over $10,000 will earn 0.50% APY." suggests that you get 2.25% on a balance _up to_ $10,000, not that that's the minimum for that rate.

<comment><USER10> Ah… You're right. My mistake.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> Has anyone gone down the rabbit hole of looking into this bank?

[https://www.linkedin.com/in/redneck- bank-352214aa/](https://www.linkedin.com/in/redneck-bank-352214aa/)

Edits (in chronological order):

\- This is the bank responsible: [https://www.bankonitusa.com/](https://www.bankonitusa.com/)

<comment><USER13> Right on!

And the CEO, Shawn Braden (evidently the founders granddaughter) - has a rather thin profile.

Unusual for a savvy FinTech-ish firm > [https://www.linkedin.com/in/shawn- braden-8a4467120/](https://www.linkedin.com/in/shawn-braden-8a4467120/)

Still, good on you Mustang, Oklahoma!

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> I like the animated fly.

Then again, if a bank with a website like this did something silly like, uhh, transfer all my money to Nigeria, could I really complain about it with a straight face?

<comment><USER15> If they're not a real bank they're gonna get reamed for the FDIC logo.

Jeff Foxworthy said the essence of "redneck" is a "glorious lack of sophistication." Dunno if thats still the case, but its a marketing vein that might have a drop in it again since he tapped it out back when.

<comment><USER14> This sort of marketing appeals to lots of people, including myself and many of the people with whom I interact on a daily basis. Of course it could only work online, but we've seen enough problems with online banking that online-only kind of scares me... still, I'm paying more attention to this than I've paid to banking in quite some time.

<comment><USER15> My tagline for my website is "Rantings of a Redneck Techno-barbarian". I've been hoping there was juice here again; glad to have a confirmation.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> While I recognize that this is (probably) a real bank, very high on my list of things that I definitely do not want from a banking website is "make me feel like you're not serious".

<comment><USER17> I wouldn't mind the copy writing too much. I'd pay more attention to eg sensible password policy.

Basically, if they allow the same strong passwords as eg GMail, I take that as a good sign. If they have silly restrictions like lots of banks, that would weight much higher in my estimate of them as an online bank than the silly copy.

</comment></comment><comment><USER18> Love the edginess and design, but taking the user off-site (to the oflows.net domain, whatever that is) for sensitive application forms doesn't build a lot of trust imo.

</comment><comment><USER19> It's nice when companies don't take themselves too seriously.

This case, it reminds me of a convenience store chain in West Virginia in the 90's that came out with a line of flat potato chips under the brand "Carl's Roadkill Cafe." It was successful enough to spawn companion products like Dust Cutter So-dee-pop.

</comment><comment><USER20> Is this like the bank version of a MVNO?

<comment><USER21> Sort of, yes. I think they're owned by the same holding company as Bank of the Wichita's.

When I applied for a mortgage a few years ago, I was asked to provide some bank statements. The underwriter saw the letterhead from Redneck Bank and told me the underwriting process is no joke and asked for real non photoshopped statements. After some convincing we finally closed a few weeks later.

<comment><USER22> Wait, you actually use this bank?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER23> Apparently rednecks have bandwidth and time to burn.

Home page load: * 48 requests * 5.68 / 5.69 MB transferred * Finish: 42.53s * DomContentLoaded: 1.67s

<comment><USER24> It didn't load at all for me.

</comment></comment><comment><USER25> See also, the excellent Lings Cars [https://www.lingscars.com](https://www.lingscars.com) if you are intrigued by this kind of web design.

<comment><USER26> Lings Cars is a stone cold classic. I love introducing it to product designers for the first time. She's been running a successful business since 2004 with this site.

<comment><USER27> Grassy arse - Ling</comment></comment></comment>


Show HN: Read the best tech bloggers in one app - <AUTHOR> http://www.volleythat.com?a=1 <comment><USER2> One small criticism? Your headline says "best tech bloggers", so I was assuming the app was focused on that. Clicked through to your landing page and the screen shot is all about soccer, something that I not only don't care about, but also, is not tech. So now I'm trying to figure out what it actually is, the closest I can find is: "PICK FROM DOZENS OF POPULAR WRITERS AND BLOGGERS"

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks for the feedback. Our app lets you follow lots of well know writers / bloggers from various disciplines. It's like curated RSS without the hassle. Tech is one of our main focuses and I wanted to highlight that aspect for the HN audience and list a few of the dozen tech authors we have currently but you're right that it is not completely tech focused.

<comment><AUTHOR> BTW some people have asked how we're doing our article parsing. We're using the Diffbot article API which has been great for us so far. Recommended if you need similar functionality.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER3> Do you have the bloggers permission? Scraping full text articles and republishing them is generally considered a no-no.

</comment><comment><USER4> How is this different from feedly other than that it has no android or browser support?

I was expecting a media wall like sc2daily, but with tech information.

edit: it has browser support, I didn't see the button earlier.

<comment><USER5> I've been using Volley since early betas, and my favorite part is the social aspect. It almost feels like a "private HN" or subreddit for my group of friends. (We used to all be Google Reader addicts, until Google killed the social features, and then axed Reader entirely).

<comment><USER6> Private HN is a great way to put it. It's been a useful way for me to see what my friends find interesting, rather than having to comb for them on FB / Twitter.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Let me increase the hype from 33% to all 100%: "Read the best tech bloggers in the best app on the best platform on the best phone in the best language of the best country."

</comment><comment><USER8> Long time user – love the polish they keep adding and adding to this app. And also the focus on quality content. Keep it coming!

</comment><comment><USER9> Most of the websites, especially bloggers, prohibit contents being scraped and duplicated into other media such as this app. The app creator should try to get the consent of the bloggers before anything else. Otherwise, definitely an app I would like to use. Good work!

</comment><comment><USER10> Why is it an app? It sounds like a regular compilation of stories by topic, are they exclusive stories and you're trying to protect the content or ...?

<comment><USER11> Unless I'm at work, I exclusively use my phone to check emails, read news, do anything online, etc. I use Instagram for photos and Volley for articles. Having one app to read, share, and comment on stories just makes life so much easier for me. I use volley mostly for the 'sharing with a few exclusive friends' aspect, but appreciate getting my favorite writers in one place as well. Also, the bookmarklet they have for your desktop browser makes volleying interesting reads you might come across during the day at work super convenient.

<comment><USER10> You signed up to say that? Or this is a shill account / an uncredited company statement?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> Adding a ?a=1 to get around HN's dupe detector is unwise.

EDIT: Per dang's response below, this is OK since there has not been significant discussion on it previously.

<comment><USER13> Thanks for watching out for story quality on HN! In this case, though, the submission is fine.

A small number of reposts is ok if a story hasn't had significant attention within the last year or so. Otherwise, what reaches the front page is too affected by randomness and churn. We want the best stories on the front page, not just the luckiest ones. So good stories need multiple cracks at the bat. Especially the Show HNs—a new feature for which is coming soon, by the way.

<comment><USER12> It might be a good idea to clarify HN's submission policies toward duplicate submissions, especially if new Show HN functionality is being implemented. (e.g. I've seen a rise in submissions recently which bootstrap the "Show HN" prefix for visibility when it definitely isn't warranted.)

<comment><USER13> Yes. We're deliberately being slow about changing the site guidelines or the FAQ, though we will eventually. Moderation comments in the threads are sort of the laboratory for that.

When we release the Show HN feature (soon!) it will come with some guidelines about what is and isn't a Show HN.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Was Columbus secretly a Jew? - <AUTHOR> http://edition.cnn.com/2012/05/20/opinion/garcia-columbus-jewish/index.html

<comment><USER2> When I travelled to Sevilla, I heard the rumour that he had actually an affair with a woman from Spanish royal family whose husband went to war. When his husband discover the affair. He funded Columbus to fulfil his dream to discover a new world. He actually wanted him to go away and die.well its just talk of the street. But this aforementioned news could be true as there are significant numbers of jewish population in USA more than any other countries in the world.</comment>


No one wants to pay for anything they access via a computer - <AUTHOR> http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/jun/06/spotify-problem-getting-people-to-pay/print

<comment><USER2> I think it's less about being spoiled, and more about users increasingly expecting that their habits & information are being exploited. The lower the expectation of privacy, the higher the expectation of piracy. Perhaps.

</comment><comment><USER3> I definitely notice this among my friends, many of which are recently graduated students. Piracy was rampant when they had no money and that attitude has not changed now that they could easily afford what they are pirating.</comment>


Parsing command line arguments using a finite state machine and backtracking - <AUTHOR> https://jawher.me/2015/01/18/parsing-command-line-arguments-finite-state-machine-backtracking/ <comment><USER2> That was interesting to read and certainly a different approach to solving a problem, but the biggest question I had in my mind while reading the article was "is it really necessary to create all this complexity --- and how does it compare to the traditional getopt()?"

I've used getopt() many times, even implemented its functionality for fun, and parsing commandline arguments has never been something I thought was particularly difficult or complex.

<comment><USER3> I would think the biggest benefit is the fuller understanding of what you built. Probably some efficiency benefits.

Of course, this is also the biggest fault, I would think. You rarely have the luxury of understanding to this level all of the parts of your program. And something like command line parsing probably is not the bottleneck in any way of your program.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> I ended up writing a blog post on how to handle CP arguments a while back. I started coding before really thinking about it -- I mean, it's CP, how hard could it be (famous last words)?

[http://blog.typeobject.com/thinking-out-loud-file-copy- tool-...](http://blog.typeobject.com/thinking-out-loud-file-copy-tool- arguments)

It turns out the arguments to CP are really tough to reason about if you just naively dive into it. The approach in this article is much better than mine. It feels like I was fumbling around in the dark.

If you're interested in seeing my implementation (it's buggy, but handles most cases), it can be found at:

[https://github.com/hpc/dcp/blob/master/src/handle_args.c](https://github.com/hpc/dcp/blob/master/src/handle_args.c)

The entry point to handle_args.c is DCOPY_parse_path_args, which is called by the main() in:

[https://github.com/hpc/dcp/blob/master/src/dcp.c](https://github.com/hpc/dcp/blob/master/src/dcp.c)

<comment><USER5> I thought about the same thing in regards to cp. I've been using OpenBSD a lot lately and having it's source installed wanted to take a look at their coding style and such. I picked cp as my first glance as I thought that should be simple enough to understand quickly.

As you say, it's option parsing makes up the bulk of the cp.c code, with utils.c doing most of the actual file copying. It turns out it's pretty tough to offer a lot of options with some of them being mutually exclusive. Obvious in hindsight but interesting to me at the time I was reading through it.

[http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi- bin/cvsweb/~checkout~/src/bin/...](http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi- bin/cvsweb/~checkout~/src/bin/cp/cp.c?rev=1.37&content-type=text/plain)

[http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi- bin/cvsweb/~checkout~/src/bin/...](http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi- bin/cvsweb/~checkout~/src/bin/cp/cp.c?rev=1.37&content-type=text/plain)

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> Why write an FSM and backtracking explicitly? Use parser combinators, they basically do the same thing, just express it in a clearer, grammar-friendly way: [http://theorangeduck.com/page/you-could-have-invented- parser...](http://theorangeduck.com/page/you-could-have-invented-parser- combinators)

<comment><USER7> Parser combinators would certainly have been easier for me, the library author but not necessarily so for the end user.

Contrast how it is done now:

      [-R [-H | -L | -P]] [-fi | -n] [-apvX] SRC... DST

With a parser combinator based approach:

      and(
        optional(and('-R', or('-H', '-L', '-P'))),
        optional(or(
                    '-fi',
                    '-n'
                 )
        ),
        optional('-apvX'),
        repeatable('SRC'),
        'DST')

And this didn't even handle the fact that options order is not important.

<comment><USER8> For that I think you can do something similar to what mpc for C ([https://github.com/orangeduck/mpc](https://github.com/orangeduck/mpc)) and LPeg for Lua ([http://www.inf.puc-rio.br/~roberto/lpeg/](http://www.inf.puc- rio.br/~roberto/lpeg/)), which is to provide the parsing machinery and write a small DSL with the same machinery for the users.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> How does this avoid the exponential-time worst-case complexity of backtracking approaches to walking NFAs?</comment>


No Offense: The New Threats to Free Speech - <AUTHOR> http://online.wsj.com/articles/no-offense-the-new-threats-to-free-speech-1414783663

<comment><USER2> There is no free speech without accountability. In both the cases of censorship and unmoderated speech, silencing of opinion takes place. In the former the silencing is through authority fiat; in the latter, by "shouting down", misrepresenting foes, making threats, and poisoning discussion from the inside.

In both cases, there's a presumption that some actors will aim only to "win," and thus treachery is necessary. However, if we treat political discussions as an iterated game like that of Prisoner's Dilemma, then what we really need to know to make a good decision is, "who is saying this and are they credible?" If they are not credible, then "tit for tat" applies and we eliminate their opinion in computing upsides and downsides to a policy.

At the low level where politics are encountered, of course, we don't have visibility to that kind of information. We have lengthy texts and short zingers that build arguments that may or may not be credible, and we have to go through them one by one.

<comment><USER3> > _" "shouting down", misrepresenting foes, making threats, and poisoning > discussion from the inside"_

Making threats is a serious problem -- and is also not a form of protected speech. Intentionally misrepresenting foes in certain ways is considered defamation and is also not protected.

The others are lesser problems as long as there are strong legal protections in place. The problems of being shouted down or (non-maliciously) misrepresented are mitigated by having your own platform from which to speak. Discussion being poisoned from the inside is mitigated by people realizing someone is poisonous and treating them as an outsider in the future. These things are still obnoxious, but they don't tip the scales in favor of significant speech restrictions.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> 'Both the U.S. and the European Union have entered into a dialogue in recent years with the 56 states of the Organization of the Islamic Conference, which is seeking an international law prohibiting blasphemy.'

Any proof of this? My natural inclination is to say that this is conspiracy theorist territory that should have no proper place in the WSJ. Sure, the OIC might want blasphemy laws, but are they an actual organization with any real ability to push for this outside traditionally Muslim countries?

<comment><USER5> > Any proof of this?

The OIC has historically been one key agent pushing for international declarations and laws providing a general protection against "defamation of religion", largely through the Human Rights Council, and has often been successful in declarations on this issue through the HRC, and from their into resolutions passed by the General Assembly.

The US and EU have engaged in recent years in dialogue on this issue with the OIC (mostly, a dialogue focussed on ensuring that individual rights were protected and on making that the focus rather than defamation of religion), and one result of that dialogue has been the _ending the OICs campaign on the issue_ in 2011. [1]

So, the WSJ piece distorts the facts in two ways (the OIC has specifically sought an international ban on defamation of religions generally, not on "blasphemy" under the terms of any particular religion, and, more importantly, while the dialogue the WSJ piece points to did, in fact, occur, its purpose and effect was not to reinforce the campaign the WSJ misrepresents, but to deflect that campaign.)

> My natural inclination is to say that this is conspiracy theorist territory > that should have no proper place in the WSJ.

The "conspiracy theorist territory" part is, IMO, accurate; while it may not have a _proper_ place in the WSJ by some standards, its pretty typical of the editorial content of the WSJ even before it became News Corp property. Even when the Journal's reputation for _news_ content was rarely questioned (which is much less the case now than it was a couple decades ago), its _editorial_ content was generally recognized as being more than slightly rightward tilted, and often far-right fringe.

[1] [http://in.reuters.com/article/2011/03/24/idINIndia-558617201...](http://in.reuters.com/article/2011/03/24/idINIndia-55861720110324)

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> It's refreshing to see an article address the distinction between what might be called "tolerance of expression" and "freedom of expression". The latter, at least in the US, is protected by the First Amendment, but it's impossible to express frustration on this issue without being (often rather smugly) informed that such protection doesn't exempt you from the social consequences of your speech. [1] This is true, of course, but those social consequences still threaten "free speech," broadly defined. Historically, one of the core features of liberalism, especially Anglo-American liberal democracy, has been a tolerance of divergent opinions. And yet, the inheritors of this tradition have largely abandoned such tolerance. [2] Views that deviate even slightly from the reigning orthodoxy are frequently smeared as "hate speech"—an Orwellian term if ever there was one. The result is a world in which even the most banal observations risk condemnation for bigotry.

[1]: See, e.g., [http://xkcd.com/1357/](http://xkcd.com/1357/).

[2]: I suspect the underlying reason is that "free speech" was an effective weapon against the _ancien régime_ , but with the enemy defeated it is no longer politically advantageous.

<comment><USER7> > One of the core features of liberalism, especially Anglo-American liberal > democracy, has been a tolerance of divergent opinions.

An interesting workaround attempt I've seen some self-proclaimed liberals use is the "intolerance of intolerance" argument [0]. "Hate speech," they would argue, is an expression of intolerance, so it's acceptable (some would say necessary) to be intolerant of such speech.

I'm not a fan of the concept, because it essentially redefines the pejorative usage of "intolerance" to something more like "intolerance of things which I think should be tolerated." It becomes fairly circular, because now we're just saying that we ought to tolerate those things which we believe we ought to tolerate.

[0] [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance)

<comment><USER8> In my social media, mostly friends of friends, the anti free speech drum is being beaten by avowed socialists and fellow travelers who reject free speech in principle as a "liberal fiction." For instance, in America the KKK has the free speech right to march down the street with police protection, but animal rights activist organizations are completely infiltrated by the FBI. These arguments mostly don't hold water with me, but that's what I'm hearing. Attacks on free speech have been steadily increasing on my social media over the last couple of years, and is very generational. It is emanating from college campuses. They are being taken over by these people.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> ""Nobody has the right to not be offended. That right doesn't exist in any declaration I have ever read.

If you are offended it is your problem, and frankly lots of things offend lots of people.

I can walk into a bookshop and point out a number of books that I find very unattractive in what they say. But it doesn't occur to me to burn the bookshop down. If you don't like a book, read another book. If you start reading a book and you decide you don't like it, nobody is telling you to finish it.

To read a 600-page novel and then say that it has deeply offended you: well, you have done a lot of work to be offended."

― Salman Rushdie"

</comment><comment><USER10> I think the late Christopher Hitchens put it best in a debate on whether freedom of speech includes the freedom to hate.[1] At the start, he makes the point that freedom of speech is just as much about freedom of hearing:

 _...it's not just the right of the person who speaks to be heard. It is the right of everyone in the audience to listen, and to hear. And every time you silence someone you make yourself a prisoner of your own action, because you deny yourself the right to hear something. In other words: Your own right to hear and be exposed is as much involved in all these cases as is the right of the other to voice his or her view._

And later, he asks who will we trust to do the censoring:

 _Who 's going to decide? To whom do you award the right to decide which speech is harmful or who is the harmful speaker, or to determine in advance what are the harmful consequences going to be, that we know enough about in advance to prevent? To whom would you give this job? To whom are you going to award the task of being the censor?_

 _Did you hear any speaker in opposition to this motion (eloquent as... one of them was) to whom you would delegate the task of deciding for you, what you could read? To whom you 'd give the job of deciding for you, relieve you of the responsibility of hearing what you might have to hear? Do you know anyone- hands up- to whom you would give this job? Does anyone have a nominee? You mean there's no one in Canada good enough to decide what I can read? Or hear? I had no idea... but there's a law that says there must be such a person. Or there's a subsection of some piddling law that says it. Well the hell with that law then. It's inviting you to be liars and hypocrites and to deny what you evidently already know already._

At the end, he notices that if you're going to censor hateful speech, you'll need to ban religious texts. Yet most proponents of laws against hate speech and blasphemy seem to be devoutly religious.

 _Look anywhere you like for the warrant for slavery, for the subjugation of women as chattel, for the burning and flogging of homosexuals, for ethnic cleansing, for antisemitism, for all this you look no further than a famous book that 's on every pulpit in this city and in every synagogue and in every mosque. And then just see whether you can square the fact that the force that is the main source of hatred is also the main caller for censorship. And when you've realized this you'll therefore this evening be faced with a gigantic false antithesis. I hope that still won't stop you from giving the motion before you the resounding endorsement that it deserves. Thanks awfully. Night- night. Stay cool!_

I highly recommend watching it, as it's arguably the best recorded oration of Hitchens.

1\. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIyBZNGH0TY#t=1240](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIyBZNGH0TY#t=1240)

</comment><comment><USER11> A related thesis can be found in: 'Kindly Inquisitors: The New Attacks on Free Thought' by Jonathan Rauch.

Which has actually been sitting on my to-read list for a while. Has anyone read this?

</comment><comment><USER12> > The right to be offended, which is the other side of free speech, is > therefore a genuine right. True belief and honest doubt are both impossible > without it.

It seems to me that the author is actually advocating the _right to offend_ , which is quite a bit different.

And what is "True belief"? This statement seems wrong in its core. A belief is by definition the opposite of evidence, certainty and rationality. So debate and free speech have nothing to do with it. It does not need it.

<comment><USER13> well when everything is an offense to someone your going to need a right to offend just to say something they don't agree with.

groups have become adept with identity politics, they use it to stop debate. When your ideas are unpopular you instead lay claim that the attack is bigoted because the disagreement stems from the the identity of the person's whose idea was debated, not their idea. This allows one side to effectively stifle debate and run amok

<comment><USER12> > well when everything is an offense to someone your going to need a right to > offend just to say something they don't agree with.

Or you need a third party that defines what is offensive and what isn't.

The "right to offence" is like an arms race to me. But in arms races, it's not rightness or truth that win. It's power.

The only case where power should win is when it's people's power, _id est_ democracy. That's why I accept, at least in principle, laws and courts as the "third party".

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> nostromo should know better than to submit content from the _editorial_ section of the WSJ. This is a low-quality source.

</comment><comment><USER15> Note that John O'Sullivan is a zealous conservative commentator of the O'Reilly sort and by spreading this article you are letting him set the narrative, not the marginalized groups he attacks (which he even lists: "[Muslims], Christians, Gays, feminists, [...], ethnic activists").

<comment><USER16> HN is already fairly liberal (this includes me) and it does not hurt to have a conservative opinion here from time to time.

<comment><USER15> I'm not against conservative opinions! I am saying that it's embarrassing that we are letting the narrative be set by an oppressor (oppressor through zealous journalism) rather than the groups he discuses.

<comment><USER17> He only mentions such groups. His discussion is on the right of all of us to say what we please, no matter what any marginalized group, powerful group, majority group, minority group, or kooky fool calling reasoned commenters out personally thinks, feels, or is triggered about it.</comment></comment></comment></comment>