Show HN: Realtime Coding Q&A. Stack Overflow meets IRC - <AUTHOR> http://www.enginehere.com/

<comment><USER2> It would be cool to establish a marketplace for help on top of this. i.e. I can pay $1/min for someone's time on demand to get help.

If that existed, I would have spent a ton last winter when I was learning Obj C.

<comment><USER3> maybe they can integrate in someway with the upcoming Google Helpouts.. (using an API that will be later on shut down by Google, of course.. :))

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> As a fairly high-output Stack Overflow contributor, this is quite interesting.

It seems to say "Stack Overflow is too slow, we need something faster". I tend to think (I'm biased, of course) that SO already _is_ rather fast; i.e. that most questions (in tags I care about) get answered rather quickly. Not only because of me, of course! I'm just a small part of the machinery.

So, what's the next step, a service where I can be registered as a helper and have a computer call me on the phone to get an answer? :)

<comment><AUTHOR> Hey unwind,

It's not just about speed of response. There are many programming issues that don't fit the SO format. They are open ended in nature and call for a conversation.

<comment><AUTHOR> That being said, I created desktop notifications so that I can get answers...NOW. I am able to see exactly when someone visits my page in realtime, intercept, and initiate a chat.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I like this format a lot - the discussion / real time aspect is great and will really help to preserve some of the problem solving that occurs within groups and organizations. I had fun responding to a question - until I figured out what the closed icon was and that it had been resolved hehe.

Could be my browser (FireFox ESR) but having only one line for the reply by default is a bit cramped - I only noticed the click-box to expand the text editor a bit later.

Nice work!

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks salifast. I need to work on the icons...

This is still very much a Beta. Going to work on the issue page formatting.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> This concept could be monetized quickly and perhaps in a big way if you can saas it to web apps whose users need help in real time, but have to use the old "support ticket" mechanisms and wait and hope that their ticket gets answered quickly.

If you package your technology such that it can be embedded into any web app that has this problem, the web app could then leverage its users (its customers) to help each other out in real time.

Just a thought :-)

</comment><comment><USER7> This concept is really neat not to mention useful. It is sometimes annoying the post on traditional forums like SO and have to wait for a response you may never receive. This makes getting help seem a lot more direct and immediate. Its sort of like E-mail and Instant messaging. SO would be like Email, still useful of course, and EngineHere is the instant messaging platform for a more dynamic/instant environment..

<comment><AUTHOR> That was the goal. As I've built it, I've been actually posting the bitly links to my issue pages on Stack Overflow, IRC, and elsewhere. I set desktop notifications for myself and go about my work until someone hits one of my pages (I then start a chat)

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> If they can create incentives for people to help each other (ie karma points), it would be great. Getting help with a direct feed of your command-line is just 2 commands away: pip install shellstream && startstream

I really like the idea and it has a lot of potential.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks jzelinskie! Right now, a rewards system is in the works.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> I've been beta testing this over the past few weeks, and can attest that it kicks ass. I think of it as a sort of realtime Stack Overflow--a place I can go to get answers interactively/immediately.

</comment><comment><USER10> Been beta testing as well -- the command line interface alone takes this up a notch over Stack Overflow, with one command you can pipe system info and error messages directly into a new issue.

</comment><comment><USER11> Heads up. I can't use the how it works drop down menu on android 4.2.2 Firefox. Looks good, sounds useful.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks for that. I'll get on that

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> So, is this really based on IRC and if so, can i connect with a traditional client?

</comment><comment><USER13> I wish this had a private version for conversation within an organisation

<comment><AUTHOR> It does actually. If you join a group (top right profile dropdown), you can set all group issues to be private by default

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> What does the name mean?

<comment><USER15> Engineer Here?

<comment><AUTHOR> Yep, pretty much</comment></comment></comment>


Removing a GPS tracking device from your car isn't theft, court rules - <AUTHOR> https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2020/02/removing-a-gps-tracking-device-from-your-car-isnt-theft-court-rules/ <comment><USER2> Doesn't attaching the small low worth GPS device to someone's big and higher worth car make the combination property of the car owner? As in: He didn't steal it, they gave it to him. And he then moved it from his car to his house, totally reasonable.

<comment><USER3> I tried this logic when a €2000 car illegally parked on my €10,000 private parking spot.

The police officer didn't think it was funny.

<comment><USER4> It's called filing for title, and you do it through the DMV. I think the owner is notified to come move it, and if they fail to do so by a certain date then a title is issued to you. Google "file for title." I had a high school teacher that said he did it for a car that was left on his rental property when the tenant moved.

Edit: Just noticed the pounds sterling. I'm in the USA for reference.

<comment><USER3> In my case my private parking spot was used by a stranger and I blocked that car with my own car. My car was completely on private property doing so. I did block my neighbours car too but it was also a private parking spot and I had permission from my neighbour to do so.

The police officer rang my doorbell and ordered me to move my car, as blocking someones car would be an offence (disabling personal property).

I asked the officer to give the offending car a ticket but he couldn't do that as it was on private property and thus a civil matter. It was also not illegal for the car to park on my private spot as I don't have a gate which makes the apartment driveway an extension of the public road, and thus usable by everyone. Dutch law is complex.

<comment><USER2> I think the officer was wrong telling you it was mandatory to move your car. You cannot disable the offending car (e.g. calmping it would be illegal), but there is no obligation to arrange your private property in such a way that they could exit it.

He was probably confused by the rule that you are not allowed to block an exit ("uitrit") of someones driveway of proprety by parking in their way. But that rule does not apply if you're parking on your own private property.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Reads like the police can, in the future, mark the device as police property, and perhaps call it theft if it goes missing.</comment>


Random Eratosthenes - why we think of primes as "random" - <AUTHOR> http://www.solipsys.co.uk/new/RandomEratosthenes.html?HN2 <comment><USER2> still need to wait a couple of hours...

<comment><AUTHOR> I'm not interested in gaming the system - I'll see what happens. This isn't a fair test either - the title has changed a little. I'll also go and re-analyse some old data I have.

I'm still interested in the data that forms basis of your claim, if you have any.

EDIT: Actually, it made it to the front page, and now has vanished again. I suspect it's been flagged, so will never see the light of day again. <shrug>

<comment><USER2> <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3165679> vs <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3162752> for example.

If you pay attention you'll see the pattern too:

If you come to HN on European mornings the things you like and click on never really get anywhere; do the same in the Stateside mornings and much the same stories go up like rockets.

<comment><AUTHOR> That's just one example - I analyzed several thousand items and found that submitting in the European morning had a significant positive effect in getting to the front page.

That was 8 months ago - things may have changed. If I get time later today I'll do a different analysis.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER3> 6 points, 27 minutes ago -- Rank 129. What the hell?

EDIT: Apparently pg is tweaking the ranking algorithm as we speak as a 838 day old post with 4 points was just in the top 100!

<comment><AUTHOR> Simple - it's been flagged.

Someone, or a few people, have realized that if they don't like something they can flag it and it gets hammered, absolutely hammered, never to be seen again.

I'm biased, of course, but I think items that are flagged should be punished in the ratings. Doing that inappropriately buries good items that someone simply disagrees with, and at the same time buries spam that subsequently never gets deleted, because not enough people see it.

I honestly think that flagging an item should not affect its ranking. If it's spam, enough people will flag it to get over the deletion threshold.

<comment><USER2> (how do you know if its been flagged or not?)

<comment><AUTHOR> When it gets 6 points in 25 minutes, hits the front page, then drops to below 150, it's been flagged.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


The Zero-Armed Bandit - <AUTHOR> http://www.damninteresting.com/the-zero-armed-bandit/ <comment><USER2> > Back in Lake Tahoe, FBI agents and members of the bomb squad strapped on air > filtration masks and protective gear and crossed the field of glass > fragments to enter the wounded casino tower. __It looked as if a bomb had > gone off. __

You don 't say.

<comment><USER3> One paragraph later:

       FBI agents scrutinized every smithereen

I don't think I've ever seen "smithereen" in print before. Merriam-webster.com only has "smithereens" a "plural noun". But the singular nicely fits the sentence.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> I've always wondered why the bombs often portrayed in movies weren't designed according to those same principles. It seems that it is indeed possible to make it completely tamper proof.

<comment><USER5> Maybe exactly not to give possible bombers good ideas...

<comment><USER4> More prosaically because it allows the hero to defuse the bomb at the last minute. But it always pinches my suspension of disbelief when it happens.

<comment> Digit-Al Yeah. Why does the hero always defuse the bomb with exactly one second to spare?

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> I wonder how effective some of the newer EOD disruptors like the PigStick[1] would be. It uses a shaped charge to generate and direct an incredibly high pressure water jet for similar sorts of 'decapitation strikes' on detonators and the like.

Although, we also have much better and faster radiographic imaging systems, so it might have been possible to get a better idea of the internal construction and identify a weak point for, say, drilling and endoscopy.

It sounds liek the guy really put a lot of thought into the tamper detection though - there are parallels with the protection of crypto security modules, some of which do all these things and more.

[1] [http://www.chemringeod.com/products/defeat/PigstickDisruptor...](http://www.chemringeod.com/products/defeat/PigstickDisruptor/)

</comment><comment><USER7> Nice use of "vomitoria".

</comment><comment><USER8> TL; DR: Bombing at a Nevada casino in 1980. See [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvey%27s_Resort_Hotel_bombin...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvey%27s_Resort_Hotel_bombing) for a more concise summary.

<comment><USER9> Thanks! Why would someone think I want to read a novel-length article about this?

<comment><USER10> Because it's really well-written!</comment></comment></comment>


They Write the Right Stuff (1996) - <AUTHOR> https://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-stuff

<comment><USER2> There's absolutely nothing special about what they're able to achieve once you look at the price. Many, many organizations could do just as well if they had the budget.

$35mm/year to maintain 420kLOC.

If you assume that each person costs about $150k/year in terms of salary, benefits, overhead, etc then you've got 233 salaries. In actuality they employ 260 people (from the article), so this math is pretty good.

What this boils down to is say 100 people writing code and 100 people verifying it (and 60 managers, administrative, etc). That means ownership of only 4kLOC per person. And that's maintaining, not writing from scratch. If turnover on code is 10% per year (and that's probably high!) then that's 400 lines of code you have to write every year.

400 lines per year is 40 lines per month. Two lines per day. Coding by proof at this kind of scale is actually practical, which is how they're able to catch so many bugs. You can fuzz test it, you can discuss it with your colleagues, you can agonize over the specific math you're supposed to be doing. You can do all kinds of things that people who have to produce 10x or 100x the code don't have the luxury of doing.

Given the budget I would expect nothing less.

<comment><USER3> _$35mm /year to maintain 420kLOC. [...] Given the budget I would expect nothing less._

What's impressive isn't the LOC per dollar (or person), even at that level of reliability, but the functionality (and reliability of functionality) per LOC. It's what that 420 kLoC _does_. They've managed to get a lot of functionality relative to code size... because they know the cost of excess code.

I wouldn't be surprised if most Silicon Valley companies have 420 kLoC after a couple years, not a single line of it being something you'd want to bet your life on. The difference is that 420 kLoC of "Agile" code written under deadline culture (perpetual "sprinting") with stack-ranking is going to amount to nothing but 3/4ths of a shitty product-- not because it isn't enough code, but because the code is so unreliable.

As it were, there are _plenty_ of startups with $35M per year budgets (or more) that aren't writing high-reliability code or anything even close to it.

<comment><USER2> > What's impressive isn't the LOC per dollar (or person), even at that level > of reliability, but the functionality (and reliability of functionality) per > LOC. It's what that 420 kLoC does. They've managed to get a lot of > functionality relative to code size... because they know the cost of excess > code.

I don't know that I agree that the code is particularly feature dense or anything. It might be, or it might not. Just because it flys the shuttle doesn't mean it's a miracle of efficiency. Hell, it might be really inefficient for all we know. They might do clipboard inheritance all over the place because that's easier than trying to accidentally not break a "general purpose" function when making a particular change.

Also, they're not writing 420kLOC every year, they've slowly accumulated that much code. The turnover I would suspect is 10% a year or less. Might only be 3% a year.

What I was trying to say is with that level of funding versus the amount of features that they have to deliver (little/no interfaces, no database, no scaling, no sharding, no data sanitization, etc) it's much, much easier to get things right. This is basically firmware and the hardware is known so it's much, much easier to get it right.

The web is so often broken because there are dozens of different standards by different institutions that are adhered to in varying degrees by many thousands of different projects running on a multitude of hardware. Getting stuff so right for the space shuttle is impressive for sure, but look at the kind of comparison you're making.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> The use of the present tense to refer to Shuttle launches is a bit odd at first - it looks like this article actually dates from 1996. Was surprised to find out that Fast Company was that old, but there you go - apparently they launched November 1995.

</comment><comment><USER5> Been posted many times before [1].

1\. [https://hn.algolia.com/?query=they%20write%20the%20right%20s...](https://hn.algolia.com/?query=they%20write%20the%20right%20stuff&sort=byPopularity&prefix=false&page=0&dateRange=all&type=story)</comment>


Ask HN: [India] Inputs needed on quotation for a website - <AUTHOR>

This is in the Indian context, the developer and the client are both in India.
I wanted some professional input regarding current market rates in making websites. I am just starting out and I don't have much experience with current freelancing/contract rates of making websites. Hence the post.
I have been offered a contract of building a website with the following features:
- Search a directory of content which is obtained from excel sheets
- Create shareable links of search results
- Two dynamic pages to render the search results in interactive way
- Two static pages
- Feedback/Review on search results, which only the owners can see
- Design layout for the website
- Hosting a blog for the website owners
- Hosting an end-user forum
I am looking to know how much would you, or a company that you know, would charge for a website described above. I am planning to do this as a fixed-rate project.
I'll be very glad to get some inputs. <comment><USER2> I would recommend not to go with a fixed rate project.I have been doing freelancing for quite sometime now. Unless your clients have some technical knowledge, I'm very sure the requirements will change once you start working on the project.

Also you have to think about how long you'll have to support the client after you handover the project. I usually give 3 months support & warranty period (which is billed).

<comment><AUTHOR> But could you tell, for the above feature-set how much would you charge? Or how much are the current market rates?

<comment><USER2> I usually charge for the value that the project provide. If someone wants it on urgent basis and I have to work extra hard to meet there timelines I usually charge a higher per hour rate.</comment></comment></comment>


National Geographic photographer arrested for feedlot overflight - <AUTHOR> http://hutchnews.com/Todaystop/Nat--Geographic-photog-arrested-in-GC

<comment><USER2> I would like to know by what mechanism a powered parachute flight over a feed lot might result in humans consuming unsafe food. Presuming mad cow disease inducing "pellets" even could be produced, the pilot could have dumped some over the feed lot. However, this would be an absurdly complex mechanism of distribution and one with a high likelihood of future arrest. Does the feed lot allow inbound grain to be shipped in trucks without sealed covers? I could keep going, of course.

What's bothersome to me is that those using their coziness with law enforcement to dominate their "enemies" don't even feel the need to contrive plausible justifications for their bullying. This is how far America has come.

</comment><comment><USER3> "After all, hundreds of thousands of cattle are fattening in a 100-mile radius around Garden City and such incidents could turn into a food security issue - especially in an era where agri-terrorism is a threat."

The only agri-terrorist incident I've heard of was The Breeders in the 80s. The California government surrendered to them and the conflict was resolved [1]. Is this era of agri-terrorism the years since 1989 or is it a brand new fantasy threat?

1\. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_California_medfly_attack](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_California_medfly_attack)</comment>


As the Sun Awakens, NASA Keeps a Wary Eye on Space Weather  - <AUTHOR> http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2010/04jun_swef/

<comment><USER2> Here are some charts on the subject. <http://www.financialcyclesweekly.com/public/530.cfm?sd=2> The charts are interesting but not sure about the financial links. They do seem to affect weather patterns which in turn affect crop yields.</comment>


Need advice: Entrepreneur to full-time job - <AUTHOR>

So, in short, I'm burned out. I did consulting (Web/Biz Dev) for local businesses for almost 8 years.
I am guilty of sticking to a small group of clients that paid very well and completely stopped growing my business. I don't even have a website or business cards anymore. 2 months ago, I stopped doing work for them completely, the work was soul crushing.
My decision now, for many reasons, is to join a company even as low as a junior front end developer or growth hacker. Reasons for starting back at junior if need be:
1. My web projects have sucked over the last 3 years, I started focusing on business development and did really well for them with that also, but they hired cheap developers and the work became completely unacceptable for a portfolio. Their expectations were too high and budget too low. I had spoilt them over the years.
2. I want to work on a team again. My first time I worked for a startup, we knocked it out the park. That role was in sales. Being on a team building products and being around people again is really intriguing to me.
3. I just turned 30 and having never finished a degree (actually finishing one online for personal reasons). I feel completely lost. I have little confidence in job hunting and feel completely off my game. I'm not used to having my career in another person's hands.
Here is where I need help, but any advice or guidance would be appreciated:
- How can I get a junior front end position or growth hacking position? Should I do some mock projects for a portfolio? How many, what kind? I fell out of touch with some of the modern workflows, but have been spending all my time catching up to getting back to my A game with JS and such.
- Any suggestions on the type of roles that may be a good fit for me apart from what I mentioned?
- How do I get in front of companies and show them that I am an excellent hire?
Thanks for reading this far and I look forward to anything you guys have to offer. <comment><USER2> >How do I get in front of companies and show them that I am an excellent hire.

If it was flattering for 37signals (read: influential company) to see this -- [http://jasonzimdars.com/svn/](http://jasonzimdars.com/svn/) it will be even more flattering for not-yet-famous-company-X to see something similar.

1\. pick a company that solves a problem that's interesting to you. or who's founder said something that resonated (in a talk, interview, or essay) 2\. research their founding team 3\. write / build / hand-craft / hand-deliver something (website, message in a bottle, anything, things non-digital like hand-written letters are particularly effective). 4\. offer or do something unsolicited (logo, find a new customer, write effective copy for a campaign) 5\. don't attach a resume. just write clearly, use nice paper, and expect nothing in return.

bonus: follow up if / when you don't hear back.

There is a line between irritating and hungry. You won't always be the latter but aim for it.

Do this 2 or 3 times, to companies that aren't yet big names (look through [http://angel.co](http://angel.co)), and you'll floor their founding team with your level of effort and at least land an in-person.

Don't pick the job, pick the people and the problem. You'll find sufficient motivation later.

<comment><USER3> I'm going to be that guy and say that this is a bad idea. When you're jumping through hoops to get attention, people get used to it. And they start expecting it by default. Especially when it's for a job.

<comment><USER2> That's especially true in the case of 37signals. It was novel the first time someone built a website just to get hired. The 2nd time it was probably still cool. By 5th, 6th or 10th time, the gesture likely lost its novelty.

There isn't a playbook for doing something worthy of a company's attention (sans warm intro). But there's something to be said for non-traditional, creative outreach.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> Get in front of companies by:

1) Tapping the network you likely have 2) Go to events like Meetups. Make yourself visible. 3) Might want to build that website and portfolio so you can show what you did. Sounds like it should be easy for you to throw together 4) Start applying to jobs. There are tons of positions for people with your skills. I'm sure you can make it happen. If you want to do front end then do that. If you want to be a growth hacker then you'll probably get in even more easily.

<comment><AUTHOR> Hey,

My network is non-existent as it's mostly local businesses, never really networked with other entrepreneurs or developers.

Any advice on how to leverage meetups or what I should display for my portfolio?

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> Hi Rich,

Look around for the kind of company you want to work for. Explore outfits mentioned on HN, but also on sites like TechCrunch.

When you find a few, explore their tech stacks and see if any interest you. You don't need to be an expert in the technology, but you need to like it.

Can you visualize a kind of dream role there? It's great that you're ok to start over (I love starting over, like re-learning French or re-reading my ancient copy of K&R).

Look for best practice in CV's - google them and see what makes sense and what doesn't. Revise your CV so it's better. Apply lots, fail lots, take the agile approach to job hunting. Don't get disheartened when you don't get the one you really want, you WILL get there!

Cheers, Andrew.

<comment><AUTHOR> Andrew,

Thank you for the advice. This is all very new to me.

You mentioned visualizing a dream role, this is a fascinating thought. Since I wore many hats over the years as an entrepreneur, if I were to create this dream role, could I market/suggest it to companies I am applying to?

Surely this would probably only work with smaller companies, of course, but do you think this is a possibility?

Thanks

<comment><USER5> Hi Rich,

I would definitely take that approach, as long as it aligns with the company's own vision. Employers tend to like the idea that you have goals of your own - as long as you stress that you're happy with the entry level role and working your way up. All the best and keep persevering!

Cheers, Andrew.

<comment><AUTHOR> I certainly am. Thanks again.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> After being on your own for 8 years, do you really want to leave your career in another person's hand? The corporate jobs really aren't as safe as 8~10 years ago. People get laid off all the time from their corporate jobs.

I hope that it gives you comfort in knowing the corporate people have a lot of fear going the other direction, too.

You survived on your own for 8 years, that should give you a lot of confidence. You have done Bus Dev, you can sell yourself in a job hunt; you have learned web development w/o a college degree, you can learn JS and PHP - the languages and DEV platform are getting easier and easier.

</comment><comment><USER7> You seem to be inherently motivated. As noted you have transferrable skills that are desirable, and an ability to showcase them. So do so. If this is where your passion lies, all the better.

Read up: Quora.com Study up: Khanacademy.org

Any potential workplace you meet with will glean far more from your enthusiasm and expertise of a topic than most degrees.

Hire character, train skill.

Lastly you have to consider relocation as part of the equation. Got to go where the work is. This may lead to a step back in lifestyle, but is just part of the ride...

<comment><AUTHOR> Appreciate the kind words. I am very interested in relocating just wanted to go out a bit prepared before I jump into a new city.

Any advice on how to showcase my skills to garner some attention?

<comment><USER8> Hi there - I just quickly went over your posting history on HN, and I'm interested to have a chat with you. I'm on jay.makeleaps on Skype !

<comment><AUTHOR> Jason,

Just dropped you a request on Skype.

Looking forward to chatting.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> My job hunt feels like an episode of Seinfeld:

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBn8XttrSew](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBn8XttrSew)

And my Hail Mary if all fails:

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zpOVmhkEaQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zpOVmhkEaQ)

</comment><comment><USER9> I think you vastly underestimate the current demand for the skills you have.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks. Appreciate the positive words.

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> I feel your pain bro</comment>


Show HN: [gif] Fencing simulator with motion controls (Leap Motion) - <AUTHOR> http://i.imgur.com/LEWFzkw.gif

<comment><AUTHOR> If you'd like to follow the development of this game, I've got a mailing list here: [http://eepurl.com/OyPsr](http://eepurl.com/OyPsr)</comment>


NEO GEO: Open source development kit - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/dciabrin/ngdevkit <comment><USER3> Does anyone sell an MVS flash card? It would be fun to play with this on my single slot.

<comment><USER4> No flash carts for the Neo, but this dev kit being open source might cause that to change.

Currently your best bet is pc-2-neo on the Unibios: [http://unibios.free.fr/pc2neo.html](http://unibios.free.fr/pc2neo.html) \-- but it's a lot of work to get going and will only support (very) small ROMs.

<comment><USER3> Another reason to stop dragging my feet and buy Unibios!

<comment><USER5> Are you even able to get this to build? I sure can't. Don't usually have issues this bad.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I've been reading up about NG development on the wiki lately and have been very interested in doing this. Seeing tools pop up is pretty awesome and it looks like there's a good chunk of other people with the same idea.

<comment><USER5> I'm having a heck of a time getting this to build in a ubuntu VM, however.

Things installed on updated, fresh trusty32 VM: build-essentials, automake, texinfo, libmpc-dev, dependencies mentioned in repo

Might just give up and install on Mac but I use pkgin instead of brew.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> Very cool. It would be pretty neat to make a game for the Rolls-Royce of video game consoles.

<comment><USER4> These guys have made a career out of it: [http://ngdevteam.com/](http://ngdevteam.com/)

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> Neo Geo's are still sold in Japan right? So this is more than a retro- computing exercise.

<comment><USER8> Manufacture of new home systems ceased in 1997. Games were still being sold by the system's manufacturer, SNK, up until 2004. There was still new arcade hardware being produced up until that date (with the last games also being released as all-in-one boards in addition to cartridges). Any games released since then have been made by enthusiasts and third party developers - <USER2> titles produced by NG:Dev.Team ([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NG.DEV.TEAM](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NG.DEV.TEAM)) being prominent examples.</comment></comment>


Tweetbot for Mac pulled from app store after hitting Twitter's user limit - <AUTHOR> http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/jan/26/tweetbot-for-mac-pulled-from-app-store-after-hitting-twitters-user-limit

<comment><AUTHOR> So disappointing. This is such a lovely piece of software and such a shame corporate greed is halting the progress of innovative software.</comment>


Pioneer manipulates scores to pick winners - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/@anton_87731/how-silicon-valley-vc-tournament-manipulates-the-scores-to-pick-winners-1608e8c0ff22 <comment><USER2> Pioneer could do a much better job of presenting the reality : experts are involved in picking the winners and the points earned in the tournament are also taken into account.

Another point I'd like to bring up : the home page says winners get $7000, but the offer page mentions that it's $1000 cash and $6000 worth of shitcoi...sorry, stellar lumens. Maybe there's a pattern here? Misleading marketing material that we typically expect from tone deaf big corps, does not inspire confidence in the team behind pioneer.

Another point : for some reason they see the need to display the age and country of the participant. Like, if you know anything about hackers, it's that they greatly value privacy. That's pretty much the only reason that kept me from participating when it launched and now I have zero interest even if personal details were not displayed publicly.

<comment><USER3> $5,000 of the $6,000 in lumens are also locked up for 2 years. The foundation held back ~80% of all lumens for marketing giveaways, which I assume is where they're coming from.

> $6,000 in Stellar lumens, including $1,000 completely unlocked and $5,000 > locked up for two years.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> Pioneer founder here. As noted by almost all commenters in this thread, we do rely on expert voting. It's in our FAQ. We take pride in that! I believe mixture of moderation _and_ quantitative metrics are the correct path towards accomplishing our goal.

We've all seen what happens when you let the algorithms run free.

We've got much to fix in terms of making the game more _fun_. Point systems are best when you _understand_ the underlying mechanism. There's a tension between that and moderation. Losing should feel educational, not frustrating. We've got some ideas on how to fix this, and we're burning the midnight oil implementing them.

(BTW, we're very open to any product suggestions here! In case you're wondering what the ruckus is about: the Pioneer idea is to make an online game that rewards productive, creative behavior. Which beckons the question: how do you quantify productivity in different domains?)

<comment><AUTHOR> When one component of the system has infinite power over the other (moderation over quantitative metrics here), you can't call that a mixture IMO.

I would suggest these three things: (1) separate the concept of "experts" and "organizers/developers". When I hear "experts" I assume "independent experts". (2) change deceiving language on the landing page. Quoting: "All you need to do is convince other participants that your project is worth doing." and "Every week other participants will give you feedback and points. The more progress you make, the higher your score will be." No mention of experts, yet alone organizers at all. (3) Make the points transparent. That includes breaking down voting vs experts vs whatever and disclosing the details of the scoring and matchmaking systems. Doesn't have to be exact spec/formula obviously, but general details.

<comment><USER5> Thanks OP! What I find curious is why we couldn't continue our existing exchange over email.

(noprocrast correctly suggested I get back to work, so made a new account.)

<comment><AUTHOR> Well, I wrote to you (Pioneer team) multiple times over this week. I actually sent all the materials for this article yesterday.

Edit: re-read your comment more carefully. To answer: because the exchange was not productive. I only saw general comments equating to "you don't understand our opaque system" without even acknowledging the arguments I was making.

To add to my previous comment. What separates "expert voting" from "leaderboard manipulation" the most in my opinion is the access to the leaderboard state. If experts vote in isolation, based solely on the project info and reports it's a "mixture of signals". If they have unlimited power, and change the scores to shape the leaderboard to a desirable state, it's manipulation.

<comment><USER6> I agree that pioneer is super sketchy about it's exper scoring system. I think in practice it's more like peers float your app to the top of the applicant pool and then experts don't bother themselves with the ones ranked lower, so it's not as off the peers are useless. At least thats what I figured when I applied last year, and gave up when I realized that the experts were not really selecting "outsiders"

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> I started entering a Pioneer project because I liked the idea that many projects start as "small ideas" and some of those ideas may have more potential if the creators receive the right type of positive feedback from others early in the process.

Also, it could help, in theory, to be forced to provide progress reports on a project, as Pioneer encourages. Also, Pioneer got a lot things right with their UI for participants.

However, it seemed like most successful projects on Pioneer are pre-existing projects that are shimmied into the Pioneer format: Often they're projects that already have a year of work behind them with significant existing funding that are dressed up as a 1 month project. Or, often they are projects that are completely impossible to evaluate within the Pioneer model (such as a new car suspension system or something, that an online reviewer can't possibly give feedback on without an in-person meeting to observe the device) And yeah, the algorithm of the point system is completely impenetrable to the participants.

I think it would be great if someone created something like Pioneer but with a more tractable ethos, supporting projects that truly are only 1 month old since inception and involve only projects on which progress can be directly observed online by community evaluations.

</comment><comment><USER8> I'd also like to take a moment to chime in here. I competed in Pioneer for the first three monthly tournaments, ranking high (and being selected as a finalist) but never was selected as a winner.

From the beginning, it has been apparent that expert voting plays a significant role. I'm not sure if they're still describing the Tournament like this, but I remember an early descriptor of Pioneer as being a system to find great talent, as a way for people to get the visibility. If that's the case, it serves its goal.

I definitely have seen problems with just letting the winners be determined solely off of score. If Pioneers were simply selected by the algorithm, it wouldn't result in a good experience, since what other applicants find important about other applicants can differ than what the actual tournament organizers and experts find important.

When I participated though, I certainly had some of the same concerns the OP presents about transparency. When we stopped participating in the tournament, I reached out to the Pioneer team via email to share some of those concerns, and they were very receptive. They took the time to reply to everything I wrote, point by point, and acknowledged their shortcomings. What Daniel (the founder) posted in this thread is true- they are working hard to try and improve the system continuously.

I've gone back and forth on my feelings about Pioneer, but I have come to truly believe that they have a really excellent team that cares a lot about their mission and their participants.

</comment><comment><USER9> Disclaimer: I was a winner in the August '18 batch.

Pioneer has been changing the meetings rules and game each month, but since the beginning, the advisors have always had a influential role in determining the winners. The month I Was in the winning batch, I was never in the top 10 rank, but was pushed over the edge in the final evaluation period.

My understanding is that the winners are decided by a combined factor of perceived progress, points, and weighted evaluations by past winners and advisors.

The reason for this is that not all projects can be compared equally. Someone with a funded start up who has a team of 5 should be equally compared to a single founder starting a project in a developing country.

Overall, from the winners I have seen, there do seem to be emphasis on projects that are socially oriented or geographically diverse. One goal that has been expressed multiple times by the Pioneer founders is to create a global campus. Rather than allowing campus driven knowledge and social interactions to be limited to people who have access to coastal cities or urban mega cities, Pioneer provides an opportunity for access to the same social lift, but without the limitations of location.

EDIT: Changed "Ivy League" campus to global campus.

<comment><USER10> Ok so then the purpose of Pioneer funding isn't to make a product that will actually _do_ something, but just to have cute marketing and be located somewhere cool?

If that's their goal, then just go and make an ivy league global campus. Why run this circus?

<comment><USER11> >If that's their goal, then just go and make an ivy league global campus. Why run this circus?

The cynical answer being because this way they get more participants which makes them look more impressive as a platform. Of course those participants have no chance of winning but it still makes for nicer numbers.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> This reminds me of Product Hunt in its heyday, which turned a blind eye to voting manipulation, especially by VCs who were helping to push/promote a submitted product without _any_ disclosure.

Of course, that's why it got VC funding in the first place.

<comment><USER13> It didn't seem like they were turning a blind eye, they seemed to be very much biasing towards VCs/certain makers, in particular by controlling who could submit things. They ended up with a leader board similar to Digg's in its heyday, where a few submitters controlled the outcome of the top entries. Unlike Digg, since this seemed to be from the top down, I think it actually helped Product Hunt rather than hurt it. Their curation _seemed_ well done, at least to someone like me from the outside.

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> From their FAQ :

> How will you select the winners?

The final step in the tournament has our experts providing a final review on the top applications, based on leaderboard rankings. After their votes have been applied to the leaderboard, we select the top-scoring players as Pioneers. We're experimenting with the number of winners per-week, so cohorts will vary in size.

So, yes, the leaderboard is manually updated following the "experts" recommandations. It's in the FAQ.

<comment><AUTHOR> If you look at the last image in the post, you will see that "expert" votes have little correlation with points.

<comment><USER14> I don't see anything like that. In that last image, in the same column "not in top 10" there's the project ranked #3 on the image above, and the project ranked #17.

In this image, two projects mention being upvoted by an "expert", and the two are in the top 10 indeed.

Overall, I find that the evidence fails to convey the point, I may be wrong and the case is strong but right now, I don't think it's convincing that anything shady is happening.

I'm not surprised that the ultimate choice of giving out money is closely guarded, because the very little amount of voting happening makes it very sensible to fraud. (When a photo of an egg can get 20 million likes on twitter, basing a contest on handfuls of votes would seem a bit...naive.)

<comment><AUTHOR> The second project that was upvoted by an "expert" (GreenGovernance) is at #20.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> Disclaimer: I'm the founder of one of the winning projects you posted on your screenshot.

We've played every tournament since the second tournament, so I'm in a good position to speak: There have been times in previous tournaments when we were placing top 10 and after a round of peer voting (that means, no experts voting) we went down to top 40.

Also, there were times when we got more expert votes than this time and didn't win. This time we got fewer expert votes but placed first.

Maybe it's just one example and it's not statistically significant; but I just wanna say that crowdsourced voting can make the scoreboard volatile, without any form of manipulation.

<comment><USER15> I also have to say that every time they bashed us, we took it as constructive feedback and acted upon that in a really positive way. Now we have a startup with better product-market-fit.

<comment><USER16> Same feelings here. I've only been doing it since it changed to being indefinite, not month to month. I've been making steady climbs, though. I was up to 42 on the leaderboard and after voting dropped down to 95. It's only motivated me to do better.

They do mention that part of their algorithm is if you're matched against someone higher and get upvoted over them, you'll receive more points. So if you're the higher rank and getting downvoted compared to someone lower, you probably lose more points.

On top of that, they are giving away money. Why shouldn't they get to choose who they give it to? Sure they could be a little more transparent if they are really manipulating that much.

At the end of the day, just vote with your feet.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> All of these pitch contests are a waste of time

You should treat them more as marketing, and that works if you already have the time and resources to go on this marketing circuit

Doing these to get the initial seed is a waste of time

Biggest shock of coming to silicon valley for me was the industry of silicon valley. Poor programmers, idea guys with no network or money or talent (just like everywhere else), hackathons where powerpoint presentations with mockups win, event hosts making a killing, all operating in parallel to the real action which is still only accessible by your network.

</comment><comment><USER18> Hmmm... they also use pretty much the same logo as the company I currently work for ([https://www.enterpay.fi/in-english/](https://www.enterpay.fi/in- english/), the english website is not very pretty, but you can see the logo there). We have a trademark in EU and I once sent an email notifying them about this potential conflict, but never got any reply. Not that it really matters, but this company really fails to make a good impression.

</comment><comment><USER19> Yet another old boys network pretending to be a meritocracy. Lest we forget ProductHunt.

[https://medium.com/@benjiwheeler/how-product-hunt-really- wor...](https://medium.com/@benjiwheeler/how-product-hunt-really- works-d8fdcda1da74)

</comment><comment><USER20> I'm currently ranked number 24 on the leaderboard. I was in the top 10 until they started picking winners. You can see from the chart in the article that I (DaveJ) have the largest negative "rank change since start" with -21. My feedback emails on my progress have been very positive.

It's all good though. I understand that they are looking for pioneering ideas (hard sciences, research projects, AI, etc.). Perhaps B2B SaaS is a little less pioneering. I'm definitely going to stick with Pioneer though. As a bootstrapped solo-founder, having a weekly progress report to submit to my peers helps keep me focused and motivated. If I win a prize then that would be amazing, and if not then my startup will still benefit from my consistent progress :-).

edit: By the way, I'm working on a self-service tool for converting web apps to desktop apps: [https://www.todesktop.com/](https://www.todesktop.com/)

<comment><USER21> thanks i'll check out todesktop. i've recently been trying to get away from chrome and lack of profile support on safari is a blocker. the existing webkit encapsulators are awful in different ways.

</comment></comment><comment><USER22> VCs aren't going to invest in a product because some top 10 list on a website says so. They probably consider all the projects individually and choose the ones that are the most likely to succeed.

Did you sign a contract with any guarantees? Read the legalize? I bet you it's all in there.

<comment><USER12> > VCs aren't going to invest in a product because some top 10 list on a > website says so.

More visibility of being in the Top 10 as opposed to a lower slot => higher EV

</comment></comment><comment><USER23> This seems like a reasonable way to run a tournament/contest like this. I don't think you'd get good results if it was based solely on voting it something else that could be easily gamed. Almost all your winners would just be teams good at gaming!

But I say all that not knowing how the tournament was presented to the participants. I'd be pretty mad if I thought they asked me to do one thing and worked really hard to achieve that and it turned out they wanted something else all along.

</comment><comment><USER24> I won in December and while it's true that there is score "manipulation" (we've placed pretty high and didn't win. We won at our lowest ranking), I don't think this is a bad thing.

Pure voting cannot (right now, it'll probably change in the future IMO), account for all the factors that make a good project.

The Pioneer team and expert voters should have higher than normal voting power and I believe that that is what you are seeing.

<comment><USER12> > The Pioneer team and expert voters should have higher than normal voting > power

If that's the argument, then votes from members with higher influence should be _public_ , as from the user perspective it's indistinguishable from manipulation.

<comment><USER24> Yeah, I'd agree with that.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> This is disappointing if true. I found Pioneer to be very helpful with motivation. I am working on a project right now and submitting updates.

<comment><USER7> Yeah, I think someone should develop a replacement for Pioneer that mostly does away with the prizes and VC enticements & instead just focuses on peer feedback and the progress update system.

<comment><USER26> Let's do it, I was pretty burnt on the past tournaments and looks like Startup School is following the same fate.

<comment><USER7> Unfortunately I already have too much work remaining on my existing projects to take this on, but maybe in a year or two if no one else has done it by then.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER27> Happened to someone I know as well. They were top 2 in rank clearly but after final vote didn't get selected as a winner

</comment><comment><USER28> I've noticed a lot of articles linking to medium.com lately. Is there a special way that you are all reading these (through the paywall) or do you all have subscriptions?

<comment><USER11> Paywall? All I get is a popup that I click X on to make it go away.

<comment><USER28> You're correct. Somehow I didn't see the X there and had just been closing all of their articles.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER29> Can I please complain a little? Is hackernews the small local news source for the bay area bubble? I don't know what pioneer is or which scores are being manipulated or what happens to winners (or losers). I assumed the electronics company known for its amplifiers etc. was up to some dodgy shenanigans. Zero context from the title. I don't mind clicking stuff to get more context but I think some of it should be there without assuming everyone is in the loop at all time.

<comment><AUTHOR> Hey, sorry for that! The title was changed by (I presume?) mods, and I have no power over it anymore. It had more context originally.

<comment><USER30> An obvious & explicit url link for _Pioneer_ in your blog article might also help:

[https://pioneer.app](https://pioneer.app)

Based on your previous title of _" Does Silicon Valley VC tournament manipulate the scores to pick winners?"_, I searched google for _" pioneer vc"_[0]. The top links were for [https://www.pioneerfund.vc](https://www.pioneerfund.vc) \-- which is the _wrong url_. It was confusing because that landing page also mentions YC.

[0] [https://www.google.com/search?q=pioneer+vc](https://www.google.com/search?q=pioneer+vc)

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks! Made the first mention of Pioneer a link.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Watching Magnets Rust - <AUTHOR> https://www.kjmagnetics.com/blog.asp?p=rust <comment><USER2> KJ Magnetics is an interesting example of driving traffic for online shopping.

I could buy similar products on amazon, but since I'm occasionally there reading the interesting blog, its kinda my first choice.

Also another common amazon problem is poorly proofread unprofessional ad copy. Like if they can't bother translating full specs into English, I don't feel they can be bothered to properly ship on time. So the attention to detail and high quality details in the ad copy also drive sales above and beyond typical amazon.

They could use amazon as a back end fulfillment platform, but the amazon web UI and amazon search engine just don't cut it compared to the KJ online store. Its an interesting alternative strategy to observe in the era of "all retail purchases will inevitably eventually move to Amazon". Someday, in theory, the amazon UI could encompass these features and adsorb all this traffic and commerce, but its not happening yet. Working the opposite direction places like McMaster Carr and MSC and similar have been pushing downward from corporate B2B only to semi-retail sales.

</comment><comment><USER3> Excerpt:

"While you may know the chemical formula of neodymium magnets as NdFeB, or Nd2Fe14B, they are mostly iron and neodymium.

By mass, they're roughly _two-thirds iron and one-third neodymium_. Only a tiny fraction is boron, plus a few other elements."

<comment><USER4> That phrase had me slightly puzzled - I thought chemical formulas were for molecules, i.e. combinations of elements that actually _react_ with each other and form bonds, like H2O or CO2? While a neodymium magnet is actually an alloy of mostly two metals, plus a little bit of boron, but without chemical bonds?

<comment><USER5> The notation is also used to describe the ratio of elements used in alloys and crystals. In such a case the elements are also bonded together, but form much larger structures so writing out a specific number for each 'molecule' becomes meaningless (the numbers are huge and also vary massively).

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Found a laptop hdd near a forest last year, took it home to see if I could do anything with it. To my surprise the head magnet corroded to the point of becoming soft material and had no magnetism left.

<comment><USER7> I am wondering: shouldn't the head be a solenoid? If the head is permanent magnetic it would destroy the stored information.

<comment> fake-name Permanent magnets don't do much to hard drives[0]. Well, with a strong enough magnet, it will, but the magnet will mechanically damagethe internals before they affect the actual data.

Anyways, it can't be a solenoid because solenoids are unidirectional. They actuate in one direction, and have a spring return in the other. The actuator in hard drives needs to be able to actuate in both directions, so they use a magnet for the coil to repel and/or attract.

[https://www.kjmagnetics.com/blog.asp?p=hard-drive- destructio...](https://www.kjmagnetics.com/blog.asp?p=hard-drive-destruction)

<comment><USER8> You mean magnet AND a solenoid, surely, the actuator can't be just a magnet.

That's why I think you both are right.

<comment><USER9> For modern hard drives the head actuator is linear motor made from permanent magnet(s) and solenoid. the arrangement is called voice coil, because it is mostly the same thing as coil of an speaker (although the geometry is 90 degrees rotated such that it is flat instead of cylindrical)

<comment><USER6> so much that a Guy on YouTube modded a head to oscillate from audio signal and get a 'speaker'</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


The Unexotic Underclass - <AUTHOR> http://miter.mit.edu/the-unexotic-underclass/

<comment><USER2> This snuck up on me. The essay was much better than I expected, and it is a challenge to high-tech entrepreneurs that may appeal to your idealism and sense of adventure.

<comment><AUTHOR> Agreed. I think - or at least hope - there might be a hidden desire in Silicon Valley to start solving "Big Problems". To evidence this, I'd point to the admiration of Elon Musk by posters on HN, who - albeit being rich because of Paypal - has devoted most of his time to solving problems like energy and space exploration.

<comment><USER3> But the point of this article was to not solve "Big Problems" and instead to solve "big problems": to look at uninteresting problems that happen to be big and affect an underclass you are not part of that isn't "exotic" enough to be interesting.</comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: How would I go about creating my own platform API? - <AUTHOR>

It might be one of those questions where "if you have to ask, don't do it" but just curious. I'm looking to create an API that creates a platform for others to create their own apps within mine. For now, I am providing the basic functionality, but would be at some point in the future enable others to create within my platform.<p>Just curious as to how this is approached. I'm a frontend developer and only a beginner with Rails, so just providing basic functionality myself for now. However, it doesn't hurt to learn... even if it's too much work to bother with at this moment. <comment><USER2> So what would value would your platform provide that people would want to use it? I'd advise looking for a problem to solve and then thinking about the solution from there.

<comment><AUTHOR> I am solving a problem. It's a video chat platform. The basic functionality I can provide and it's enough to solve the issue. However, I am always thinking ahead... sometimes too far off ahead, but I recognize when something is not currently pertinent. This isn't pertinent currently. However, I still would love do what Google does with their Hangouts, and enable others to create apps for my platform.</comment></comment>


The Simple Truth - <AUTHOR> http://yudkowsky.net/rational/the-simple-truth <comment><AUTHOR> This is hilarious.</comment>


Scientist who sparked racism row has black genes - <AUTHOR> http://news.independent.co.uk/sci_tech/article3239366.ece

<comment><USER2> Black genes? WTF?

I hope that before DNA analysis becomes mainstream, the public gets a good education about how genes aren't binary flags for what race you are.

<comment><USER3> It's sort of ironic that despite all the attention from Watson's comments, and with people crying "racism", folks still don't seem to know much abut genes and race.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> This explains why Watson's remark was so stupid.

</comment><comment><USER5> Oh, that"s classic.

</comment><comment><USER6> Karma?</comment>


This is what Bitcoin is - <AUTHOR> https://yanisvaroufakis.eu/2013/04/22/bitcoin-and-the-dangerous-fantasy-of-apolitical-money/ <comment><USER2> No matter what your politics, Yanis Varoufakis is one of the best minds and speakers to be involved in the story of Europe in the past few years. I urge anyone to watch any of his talks here [https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=yanis+varoufaki...](https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=yanis+varoufakis) \-- I especially liked [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWB6lY2GBjQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWB6lY2GBjQ)

As one of the introductions states: "Yanis Varoufakis considers himself a politician by necessity, not by choice."</comment>


How to reset someone's AppleID PW – seems to explain celebrity photo leaks - <AUTHOR> https://web.archive.org/web/20140904115530/http://ibstol.wordpress.com/step-3-security-questions/

<comment><AUTHOR> Summary

You need:

* The target's email address

* Date of birth (easily obtained)

* Answers to two of three security questions. With a trick you can choose which of the three you don't want to answer.

You have 8 reset attempts every 8 hours. More would lock the account.

The site also lists common answers to "What was the first thing you learned to cook?", and tips on how to answer both "What was the first concert you attended?" and "Where were you on January 1, 2000"?

</comment><comment><USER2> Warning: some NSFW content</comment>


New Google Pixel 4: it's time to find out about the smartphones' cost - <AUTHOR> https://reportagram.net/news/1278-new-google-pixel-4-and-pixel-4-xl-its-time-to-find-out-about-the-smartphones-cost.html <comment><AUTHOR> Google will embed several modules in Pixel 4 and 4 XL, in addition to the front camera. The company called this system Soli – it can scan a person's face and determine hand movements.</comment>


Writing a C library, part 2: Event handling and the main loop - <AUTHOR> http://davidz25.blogspot.com/2011/06/writing-c-library-part-2.html

<comment><USER2> Part 1: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2703203></comment>


OpenSSH 6.6 released - <AUTHOR> http://www.openssh.com/txt/release-6.6

<comment><USER2> Here's a one line patch to make OpenSSH log passwords:

[http://16s.us/docs/sshlog/sshlog.patch](http://16s.us/docs/sshlog/sshlog.patch)

I log passwords (just as a hobby) to see what type of passwords the brute- force bots are currently using.

Here's the top 10:

        PASS COUNT
        123456 3785
        password 2531
        1234 2053
        admin 2005
        12345 1390
        root 1281
        123 1246
        1qaz2wsx 1207
        root123 1150
        passw0rd 1120

Here's the top 10 complex:

        PASS COUNT
        P@ssw0rd 1027
        1qaz@WSX 466
        !QAZ2wsx 357
        Admin@123 310
        P@$$w0rd 299
        P@ssw0rd1 177
        Admin123!@# 172
        P@ssw0rd123 166
        1qaz@WSX3edc 153
        1qazXSW@ 150

Don't use _any_ of those passwords on your systems.

Edit: Formatting.

<comment><USER3> Does that mean that you also log your user's password?

<comment><USER2> These are not production systems, but yes, that patch logs all passwords. I only use keys.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> From the changelog:

* ssh(1): if hostname canonicalisation is enabled and results in the destination hostname being changed, then re-parse ssh_config(5) files using the new destination hostname. This gives 'Host' and 'Match' directives that use the expanded hostname a chance to be applied.

Finally makes canonicalisation /useful/, since before that you would still need to have specialized Host/Match rules (this would make canonicalisation only helpful for ControlPath basically).

</comment><comment><USER5> LWN has a good article on what's new, for those that prefer a more verbose change log: [http://lwn.net/Articles/590870/](http://lwn.net/Articles/590870/)</comment>


NHS patient data to be made available for sale to drug and insurance firms - <AUTHOR> http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/jan/19/nhs-patient-data-available-companies-buy <comment><USER2> This information will only be used to cause harm and bring misery to people when they need help the most.

I have private medical insurance through my work. Last year I made two claims, which were covered by the insurance company. However after the second claim they sent me a letter requesting access to my medical records. Obviously I told them to fuck off as they're an insurance company and have no business poking through my medial history.

This data probably shouldn't ever exist, but if it's going to, it should be anonymous.

Going to see if I can opt out ... somehow.

<comment><USER3> This information _could_ invaluable to the medical research community as a whole and _shouldnt_ have any adverse consequences for individual patients if suitably anonymised.

Currently I don't have sufficient information to judge whether I need to opt out or not so I'm withholding judgemeny.

<comment><USER4> Making that data truly anonymous so that you cannot de-anonymize it with other data sets is likely impossible. You would have to remove so much that the data becomes useless.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> The NHS provide shockingly little information on how to opt out. The leaflet that came through all our doors about this was vague. There is no _official_ form, they just suggest you talk to your surgery. Legislation passed in 2012 allows the NHS to use our data with out first seeking our consent.

So that's what I did. Because they don't give this scheme a name, it's hard to talk reception staff about exactly what it is you want to opt out of. They were very understanding, but left me with forms to opt out of the Summary Care Record which is not the same thing. Even if you've already oped out of the Summary Care Record you must still opt out of this.

An email to the practise manager did the trick though. I asked by what mechanism they achieve the opt out, as it all seem very vague. A very helpful and prompt response explained that a change has been made to the access conditions of my record in System One (the monolithic care record system) such that it can't be used for this purpose.

All of which is great. But this scheme should clearly be on an _opt in_ basis.

<comment><USER6> And what happens if someone has medical records in the UK but no longer lives there? They'd never receive the notice and not have a UK GP to contact to opt out!

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> "The extracted information will contain NHS numbers, date of birth, postcode, ethnicity and gender."

Yikes! Date of birth AND postcode? Pseudoanonymous that is not.

<comment><USER8> Even if this data (date of birth, postcode, etc) would be removed, it would still be rather trivial for e.g. an insurance company to match these records to their customers. Given one or two insurance claims for doctor's appointments, matching the medical records for identical dates is enough to pinpoint a person with adequate certainty.

Then the insurance company can grep the records for mentions of smoking, drinking, drug use or injuries related to dangerous activities like riding horses, motor racing or skiing. Now that the insurance companies can identify patients in these risk groups, they can proceed to doubling the insurance fees of these people.

I think that the insurance companies should not be able to access medical records like this.

edit: please excuse my ignorance on the UK health care system. In my country, you pay a fixed fee when using public health care and you can claim insurance on that.

<comment><USER9> Do people regularly claim on insurance for NHS doctor's appointments? I know I never have. Regarding the smoking etc, I'm pretty sure that health insurance companies ask if you smoke (and yes, double the cost if you say yes), and giving a lying counts as insurance fraud. Due to that, I'm not too sure how relevant the NHS records would be, other than in cases where someone has lied, in which case I'm not too inclined to feel sorry for them.

<comment><USER10> I don't think there are any UK health insurance companies which allow you to claim for NHS doctor's appointments.

Presumably if you have a health insurance plan which covers private doctor's appointments, they get a copy of the doctor's notes anyway.

<comment><USER11> Several insurance companies will pay a cash incentive to use NHS services rather than claiming on your insurance [1]. For example if you need to stay over night in hospital and choose an NHS hospital instead of a private one they will give you £50 or more per night.

[1] [https://www.google.co.uk/search?q="NHS+cash+benefits"](https://www.google.co.uk/search?q="NHS+cash+benefits")

<comment><USER12> Nice - my employers private health care insurance includes this and I had never noticed!

Mind you I wonder when it would ever apply - if you have a non-emergency then you will choose to go to a private hospital, if it is an emergency then you don't have any option but to go to an NHS hospital...

Maybe for people who are covered by private health care but aren't close enough to a private hospital to actually use it?

<comment><USER13> It's presumably the incentive of not using non-NHS facilities (which the insurance company would have to pay for as part of your cover). £50 to stay in an NHS ward vs a bit more to stay in an en-suite room in a private hospital.

If I had insurance, I know for sure which I would be choosing.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> It's unclear why they didn't get the UK Data Service to handle this, who have extensive experience in anonymization and data control (they handle the processing of census data and HMRC tax information by external researchers among other things).

<comment><USER15> The data gets held in N3 which is an entirely separate system/network, and has a much higher set of standards than UKDS would largely be used to using. HSCIC are well used to doing this as well.

<comment><USER14> It may be that the Guardian is misreporting it, but from their description the data level is far less anonymized than what I've seen when working with UKDS data.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> The care.data program was also the subject of an editorial in this week's issue of Nature [0]

Ross Anderson has a blog post with links to more details [1], including a PDF of how the patient information leaflet 'should really have been drafted' [2] (quite different to how it was - [3]).

[0] [http://www.nature.com/news/power-to-the- people-1.14505](http://www.nature.com/news/power-to-the-people-1.14505)

[1] [http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2014/01/08/opting-out- of-...](http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2014/01/08/opting-out-of-the- latest-nhs-data-grab/)

[2] [http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/Papers/caredata_trifold.pdf](http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/Papers/caredata_trifold.pdf)

[3] [http://www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/thenhs/records/healthrecords/Do...](http://www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/thenhs/records/healthrecords/Documents/NHS_Door_drop_26-11-13.pdf)

</comment><comment><USER17> I will be opting out of this thank you very much.

I don't like my insurance company knowing my health status.

If insurance companies are not willing to take risks their in the wrong business.

I want to be able so see who accessed my information so i am able to prove with certainty when a insurance company discriminates against me.

Plus the reason they claim they accessed it would be very important when i demonstrate their misuse of the data.

<comment><USER18> >>>"I don't like my insurance company knowing my health status."

Are you joking? Insurance companies have/need access to all the data about you, otherwise they won't be able to pay providers for the services.

This is equivalent of Tea Party activist proclaiming "Keep government out of my Medicare".

These Privacy FUD articles bring out the worst of HN.

<comment><USER19> I'm not sure if you read the article, but I'll assume you have and you missed the part where this was about the NHS in England.

My healthcare when I turn up to hospital in the UK isn't being paid for by an insurance company, it is - basically - funded through taxes and administered through central government.

Hope that clears it up for you.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> Long article without the one piece of information I wanted: How to opt out.

Edit: [http://medconfidential.org/how-to-opt- out/](http://medconfidential.org/how-to-opt-out/)

<comment><USER21> 9th paragraph:

 _" unless people choose to opt out via their family doctor "_

<comment><USER20> That's both useless and inconvenient. Their site even says a doctor might not actually do it, and having the optout so hidden in that way would violate the spirit of not the letter of the Data Protection Act. It's also a huge waste of time and money on the NHS, which is already expensive and overstretched.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> It's worth noting that this appears to only affect NHS _England_.

<comment><USER12> Well spotted, I think we all tend to forget that there are actually 4 separate NHSs in the UK - one each for England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland:

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Health_Service](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Health_Service)

</comment></comment><comment><USER23> Well, just one more step forward in Britain's unrelenting stride towards becoming a total surveillance state. :/

Once the data is commercially available, it'll be sure to lead to even more targeted marketing, and discrimination by insurance firms.

Edit (couldn't resist :P)

England Prevails!

</comment><comment><USER13> Oh noes! Those baby-eating Tories are selling our souls!

But it will be _just fine_ when a Labour government floats the idea.

[http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/3022434/Private- companies-...](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/3022434/Private-companies- could-get-access-to-millions-of-NHS-medical-records.html)

</comment><comment><USER15> This is mostly a good thing. The NHS is of course a huge trove of valuable information, but there are some incredibly compelling reasons to make it available to anyone who can improve patient care - start-ups should be interested in this too.

<comment><USER24> In an ideal society, I totally agree. However, in today's world, such data will mostly be exploited by health insurance companies, credit rating agencies, employers, and paparazzi. Unless, of course, the government(s) pass laws that protect the rights of the people and limit the influence of the industry, but that is rather the opposite of what has been happening recently.

<comment><USER25> It's not so much health insurance companies I'm worried about, as they will probably have access to medical information about their clients anyway, and organisations like BUPA probably do take patient confidentiality seriously.

I'm more concerned about other forms of insurance, and about links to people related to you and not you personally. For example, what if people start getting a higher car insurance quote because someone in their household had an alcohol problem a few years ago? What if parents start getting refused life insurance because someone's sibling died young from an unlucky genetic problem?

Plus there are the obvious concerns if employers or their representatives/trade bodies can get hold of this kind of data and discriminate in dubious ways when making hiring decisions (sorry, we don't hire anyone who ever had a drug problem, even if they've been clean for a decade), media people going after celebrities/politicians/crime victims (that rape victim was _obviously_ a slut, look at the two STIs she's had in the past five years), and so on.

<comment><USER24> I agree, except for the last one, which I'm not concerned about - in an open/transparent society, such "problems" (slut/drug abuser/B&D/...) would not be considered problems any more, but only "life phases"/"exploration periods"/"lifestyles" \- after all, when everybody is "weird" in one way or another, nobody is really weird any more.

It's only the commercial exploitation I'm worried about - it has a lot of potential to meaningfully impact human lives, usually for the worse, and often because of things said humans have no influence on.

Though for those living in totalitarian/fascist societies (e.g. gays in Putin's Russia) have much better reasons to be concerned.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> re: the risk of insurance companies using the data to reconstruct identities: Mark Davies, the centre's public assurance director says "I think it is a small, theoretical risk"

this guy is either (a) a liar or (b) horribly naive or (c) misinformed by his experts (or all of the above)

Even if the data are "pseudonymised", if they still contain age, gender, ethnicity, postal code, and even a small smattering of medical info (or other info) then it's pretty much a done deal to link the records back to a person.

Think of it this way as well : even if they can "only" narrow down a given record to 100 people, so what? They just treat those 100 people the same (i.e. poorly).

This sets a horrible precedent. One's medical records ought to be one's personal, private property, and any release of such ought to be with the express permission of the owner (i.e. the patient).

</comment><comment><USER27> I read this article and was astounded there wasn't a massive outcry about this. Then I dug around some more and it seems the guardian article is really quite misleading.

There is a Health Service Journal article at [http://www.hsj.co.uk/comment/more-patient-data-ultimately- me...](http://www.hsj.co.uk/comment/more-patient-data-ultimately-means-better- care/5066865.article#.Ut3Ef2SwqS4) which gives more details.

The "pseudonymised data" is also referred to "amber data" and does not contain the postcode, DoB or NHS number of the patients.

The "red data" which contains this additional information is not available to 3rd parties except in exceptional circumstances - eg: a national emergency with an outbreak of some deadly disease where the government is trying to contain it.

</comment><comment><USER28> Information on how to opt out here: [http://medconfidential.org/how-to-opt- out/](http://medconfidential.org/how-to-opt-out/)

38 degrees petition here: [https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/prevent-the- sale-of-n...](https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/prevent-the-sale-of-nhs- patient-records-to-drug-and-insurance-companies-1)

Further information here: [http://www.care-data.info/](http://www.care- data.info/)

Epetitions (official govt site) petition here: [http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/53994](http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/53994)

</comment><comment><USER29> HSCIC Privacy Impact Assessment 2013:

[http://www.hscic.gov.uk/media/12931/Privacy-Impact- Assessmen...](http://www.hscic.gov.uk/media/12931/Privacy-Impact- Assessment/pdf/privacy_impact_assessment_2013.pdf)

</comment><comment><USER30> >> "NHS patient data to be made available for sale to drug and insurance firms"

read as: Private NHS data given to companies to improve bottom lines and discover new revenue streams</comment>


Jerry Brown signs California vaccine bill - <AUTHOR> http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article25834726.html

<comment><AUTHOR> Quick summary: The CA Legislature passed a bill eliminating personal belief exemptions for vaccinations in CA yesterday. The Governor of CA just signed it today with no hesitation.

<comment><USER2> The new requirements (mandate without personal belief exemption) is for children in "any public or private elementary or secondary school, child care center, day nursery, nursery school, family day care home, or development center" except for "pupils in a home-based private school and students enrolled in an independent study program and who do not receive classroom- based instruction". More detail, including bill text, at [https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml...](https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml?bill_id=201520160SB277)</comment></comment>


Ask HN: How do you appeal business users? - <AUTHOR>

Hello,
my questions is related to web app for businesses. Business people suffer a lot from productivity problems connected to the use of old and non customized software (I am looking at you MS Office). However, they do not seem to look for alternatives.
In my opinion, especially when it comes to data analysis, there must be a way to appeal business users. But how?
Linkedin seems a good resource, however people there don't really understand web solutions or any solution outside the commercial software already in existence. <comment><USER2> There are a lot of enterprise tools out there for data analysis-- it's a pretty crowded market.

The key to selling to business is to figure out the purchasing process at the businesses you want to sell to. This will vary substantially depending on the industry, the size of the business, and the cost of the software.

In my opinion, you are not going to appeal to business users via Linkedin, or anything similar.

If you have developed (or are developing) a solution aimed at business users, I suggest that you find a handful of pilot users you can speak to, and ask them about their purchasing process, and for advice about how you would sell to similar companies.</comment>


EU elections 2019: We will only vote for politicians who vote against Article 13 - <AUTHOR> https://pledge2019.eu <comment><USER2> In Italy that would mean vote for Salvini's Lega

An anti Euro party, anti EU, anti migration, pro Italian Exit, racist, omophobic, whose leader, who's also interior minister of Italy, has been wearing neo-fascist brands in public, hugging a drug dealer hooligan or recently visited a man who shot in the back an unarmed alleged thief romanian and killed him, declaring him a martyr who deserves pardon.

Or their allies, the 5 star movement, who are just incompetent jackasses.

Thanks, but NO thanks.

BTW they are only opposing to article 13 because Putin asked them to do so.

Italian original article: [http://espresso.repubblica.it/plus/articoli/2019/02/21/news/...](http://espresso.repubblica.it/plus/articoli/2019/02/21/news/tre- milioni-matteo-salvini-russia-1.331924)

In english: [https://euobserver.com/foreign/144253](https://euobserver.com/foreign/144253)

<comment><USER3> "BTW they are only opposing to article 13 because Putin asked them to do so" I am really curious why Putin would care about that? How this law affects Russia?

<comment><USER4> FWIW, at least in the US, Russia has been seen promoting both sides of conflicts that get people riled up politically online. The goal may not be "to support Article 13", but "cause discord and strife regarding Article 13".

<comment><USER5> Putin is doing a really bad job, nobody cares.

<comment><USER6> He was pretty successful with the Brexit, though.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Ugh, yet another bullshit website trying to turn people into single-issue voters on an election that's far more complex and wide-reaching than just who bears the responsibility of content filtering.

Single-issue voting hurts everyone including yourself.

<comment><USER8> I could not disagree more.

Regardless of the article itself, I think this mechanism is the future of citizens taking control of politics.

The point is, by a large group of people picking their most important issue, and pledging to be single-issue _publicly_ , it puts REAL and VISIBLE pressure on those politicians to represent them on those issues.

Once the issue is fixed, people can move on to the next-most important issue they would like to be represented on.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> Can we push political pledges onto the top of HN? This isn't a news article or anything of substance.

</comment><comment><USER9> I don't like Article 13, but I don't believe there are many people whose only or even top priority is Article 13. There are many issues to vote on.

<comment><USER10> I'm actually on the fence on article 13, I actually like the fact that commercial operators will be liable for the content on their platform under art. 13. For me, article 11 is way more important, making publishers liable for content on someone else's server, that's just insane.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> Hoo boy, ContentID for the Internet. Man, once upon a time I remember when we'd make a website for our friends and then just share it with more people if they were interested. Everyone would accept that this is a caveat emptor product and go along with it.

This particular one has exemptions for small groups but we know the cost of compliance is non-zero. When I have to hire a lawyer for my personal website, I'm already in trouble.

I guess we just need to maxmind our way out of the EU. So be it.

<comment><USER12> > _Man, once upon a time I remember when we 'd make a website for our friends > and then just share it with more people if they were interested._

You can't just do that right now anyway. GDPR already puts a bunch of burdens on you that you must handle.

<comment><USER11> Yup, I definitely count that as a recent development that interferes.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> You must accept cookies to view this message.

How about vote no on the EU altogether. This entity is too large, too powerful and has a track record of passing terrible laws around internet usage.

<comment><USER14> Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater! The EU provides considerable benefits for Europe, arguably the most important, but also the most invisible, being peace. World War II ended only 74 years ago. To be a little dramatic: As a German, I'll gladly pay bureaucracy for peace. There's trade benefits inside the EU, free travel for all citizens, and, recently added, no more roaming fees for mobile phones. This is just what comes to mind right now. There's plenty to criticize and reform in the EU, but I disagree that leaving would improve things for any country.

<comment><USER12> > _As a German, I 'll gladly pay bureaucracy for peace. There's trade benefits > inside the EU, free travel for all citizens, and, recently added, no more > roaming fees for mobile phones._

Of course brain drain has been hugely beneficial for Germany. It also helps Germany that weaker economies are tied to the euro which keeps the euro's exchange rate down.

I used to be pro-EU, but time and time again they create regulations and directives that are simply harmful for our future or don't consider collateral damage. Furthermore, Germany and France seem to be pushing hard on becoming rulers whether the other members want it or not.

> _but I disagree that leaving would improve things for any country._

Of course leaving won't improve things because the EU will try to punish any leavers as much as possible. The entire EU situation is just depressing, because you can't leave, it won't improve and bad decisions keep being made and you're forced to abide by them. And what makes it even worse is that the pro-EU people are telling me that I should be happy because of these bad decisions.

<comment><USER13> > Of course leaving won't improve things because the EU will try to punish any > leavers as much as possible. The entire EU situation is just depressing, > because you can't leave, it won't improve and bad decisions keep being made > and you're forced to abide by them.

Ultimately all bad decisions must be paid for. This is the hidden cost of letting the EU exist. Unfortunately, the longer it exists the more painful it will be to leave.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: Is dokku-alt maintained anymore? - <AUTHOR> dokku-alt (https://github.com/dokku-alt/dokku-alt) was created to make Dokku the original project more functional. As of right now, dokku-alt's latest commit was in April, and the main project is getting frequent updates. If I was installing dokku on a server, which project should I use? <comment><USER2> In case it is useful for someone in the future, here is my response on Reddit: [https://www.reddit.com/r/docker/comments/3wfmzj/is_dokkualt_...](https://www.reddit.com/r/docker/comments/3wfmzj/is_dokkualt_maintained_anymore/cxwx9iy)</comment>


Why Javascript Has Become Steve Yegge's Next Big Language - aaron-lebo http://lebo.io/2015/03/02/steve-yegges-next-big-language-revisited.html

<comment><AUTHOR> He actually did say,7 years ago, that NBL _was_ JavaScript. He said this at the beginning of one of his talks(maybe at google) - it's gotta be on YouTube somewhere. Does anyone have the reference ?

</comment><comment><USER2> I must disagree w.r.t dynamically typed languages. For an explanation, see this formidable rant: [https://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2011/03/19/dynamic- lan...](https://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2011/03/19/dynamic-languages- are-static-languages/) .

 _If you're one of the lucky ones who already understands this, congratulations, you probably went to Carnegie Mellon_</comment>


Zowe open source project: Now is the time to become a mainframe developer - <AUTHOR> https://developer.ibm.com/code/2018/08/23/zowe-open-source-project-mainframe/ <comment><USER2> Is this to improve the dev experience of legacy systems or actually launch new mainframes? What is the market for new mainframes? I'm guessing scientific number crunching/modelling that can't be parallelised well?

For someone who has never touched a mainframe I have no idea what to make of this!

<comment><USER3> DB2 databases. The CA in CAP.</comment></comment>


Natural language neural networks: how deep is too deep? - <AUTHOR> https://ilyaeck.github.io/2016/09/12/Natural-language-understanding-How-deep-is-too-deep.html <comment><USER2> I wish there were more specific examples.</comment>


Feds to Break Up Tech's Investor Party - <AUTHOR> http://www.wired.com/business/2012/08/sec-tech-investors/

<comment><USER2> Good thing we have the SEC to protect us from soliciting the need for investment in a startup! ....?

<comment><USER3> My thoughts exactly. Why can't someone just ask others for money? What is so wrong with "broadcasting" a solicitation for money?

<comment><USER4> This is one of those situations where the regulations were effective so we don't remember why they were put in place. Basically every other grandma was having her purse emptied by a good looking scam artist.

<comment><USER5> We already have plenty of that.

We can penalize the scam artists. That's not excuse for limiting grassroots dealflow.

<comment><USER6> We can go after the scam artists today _because_ of the same regulations that disallow this party.

The only reason people think these regulations are unnecessary now is because they've never experienced the types of fraud that these regulations were meant to address.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> I don't clearly understand this, but does it create a scenario akin to a "pre- ipo ipo" where start-ups can get funding from the general public?

<comment><USER8> No, from what I understand there are no changes to the rules about investors needing to be accredited (<http://www.sec.gov/answers/accred.htm>) which prevents the general public from investing.

This would just allow startups to publicly state "I want investment" instead of saying "I have this awesome startup [wink wink]" and waiting for an investor to say "would you like investment?".

<comment><USER9> That's wrong. The crowdfunding exemption of the JOBS Act is precisely an exemption to the rules that restrict investment in start-ups (really in any company not registered with the SEC) to accredited investors. There will still be restrictions—for example, only companies raising $1MM or less qualify, and nobody can invest more than a certain fraction of their annual income. See Title III, Sec. 302 of the act [0] for details.

0\. [http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112hr3606enr/pdf/BILLS-11...](http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112hr3606enr/pdf/BILLS-112hr3606enr.pdf) [PDF]

<comment><USER8> good to know, thanks for the correction.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> "The rules will also undermine a key advantage of Silicon Valley venture capitalists and "super angel" investors: Dealflow. Since startups haven't previously been able to broadcast that they are raising money, they must approach potential investors directly, and they tend to reach out only to the biggest names."

Ha ha, good joke - I mean, journalism.</comment>