How to botch TLS forward secrecy - <AUTHOR> https://www.imperialviolet.org/2013/06/27/botchingpfs.html <comment><USER2> So posts about what you can screw up are nice, but what would be nicer is posts about how to set up an ideal SSL configuration for various web servers. (Perhaps there's no "perfect" configuration possible, but "strongest given known limitations" would be fine too.)

With all the talk of PFS lately I've been trying to configure Apache to do it, but either I'm dumber than I thought or there's no straightforward how-to online at the moment.

Instead of telling us the various crazy pitfalls and edge cases, just give dummies like me the best possible formula so we can configure things securely and then get on with our lives. The first step towards defeating eavesdropping is making the best possible SSL configuration a copy and paste affair instead of an acronym guessing game.

Edit: If total security isn't really possible right now as this post suggests, maybe a "best" configuration plus mailing list for when it's updated for varios major platforms (ie LTS) would be a good stopgap.

<comment><USER3> I think one of the biggest pitfalls of SSL/TLS (and many other security technologies available now) is that they are so configurable and flexible. The approach assumes everyone has the knowledge and the time to invest to tune everything. In reality, few people do.

Going back to your request, it's impossible to do with server configuration alone. Many other aspects, including the design of the web application, play a significant role. The best we can do at this point is work on the body of knowledge, hoping others can find the time to invest.

The best I was able to do so far is build the SSL Labs test[1], write the SSL/TLS Deployment Best Practices guide[2], and start the SSL Research Wiki[3], where I intend to add other un-structured information over time (including example server configuration). I have also written a free OpenSSL Cookbook[4] (requires registration, and you can opt out of email afterwards).

Apologies if this post comes across as self-promoting, but this is what I spent a large amount of my time on. These are all genuinely useful and important resources.

[1] [https://www.ssllabs.com/ssltest/](https://www.ssllabs.com/ssltest/)

[2] [https://www.ssllabs.com/projects/best- practices/](https://www.ssllabs.com/projects/best-practices/)

[3] [https://github.com/ssllabs/research/wiki](https://github.com/ssllabs/research/wiki)

[4] [https://www.feistyduck.com/books/bulletproof-ssl-tls-and- pki...](https://www.feistyduck.com/books/bulletproof-ssl-tls-and-pki/)

<comment><USER4> Thank you very much for your great work, I've found both the SSL Labs test and the best practice guide quite useful!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> The only purpose of session resumption is performance, right? I thought someone published a report recently that real-world servers don't get enough successfully resumed sessions for it to even be worthwhile, particularly in a world with crypto hardware, SPDY and HTTP keepalive.

Wouldn't it be easier to just disable TLS resume than to figure out how to do it right?

edit: It was another agl article, [https://www.imperialviolet.org/2010/06/25/overclocking- ssl.h...](https://www.imperialviolet.org/2010/06/25/overclocking-ssl.html):

      Since the session information contains key material,
      it's never cached on disk so the attempted client
      resume rate, seen by Google, is only 50%.

<comment><USER4> That report sounds interesting, got a link by any chance?

I would think that session resumption should greatly increase performance for clients returning to your site, because there's no need to do a complete handshake (which is - relatively speaking - resource-intensive and IIRC also requires more network round-trips).

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> > Ideally the DH group would match or exceed the RSA key size but 1024-bit DHE > is arguably better than straight 2048-bit RSA

So let's argue!

It depends on how you presume the attacker is gonna get you. Suppose the attacker is well-funded enough to go after one RSA-1024 or DH-1024 instance. Unlike RSA, however, DHE tends to work modulo the same prime over and over. This has consequences for cryptanalysis: once the attacker has solved a single DH instance, they can solve the next one much faster [2]. In the case of 1024-bit DH, the subsequent instances can be solved in about 2^55 time (versus about 2^80 for the first log); this is not instant, but it's pretty quick for a well-funded and skilled attacker.

Where 1024-bit DHE does shine versus 2048-bit static RSA is against other, less Hollywood, types of key retrieval such as outright hacking.

[1] [https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2409#page-22](https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2409#page-22)

[2] [http://www.iacr.org/archive/pkc2006/39580175/39580175.pdf](http://www.iacr.org/archive/pkc2006/39580175/39580175.pdf)

</comment><comment><USER7> The recent discussions of SSL/TLS on the server made me wonder about client configuration. I looked around for a SSL Labs like tool for browser and asked on security.SX[1] but I was unable to find anything comparable which was troubling.

Am I missing something to think that an SSL Labs like tool for the client is also important? Does anyone have any recommendations?

[1] [http://security.stackexchange.com/q/38084/4564](http://security.stackexchange.com/q/38084/4564)

<comment><USER8> If you want to just test yourself, you get quite a lot of info from openssl's s_servers's status-page, enabled with -www:

        openssl req -x509 -nodes -days 30 -newkey rsa:2048 -keyout localhost.key -out localhost.crt
        openssl s_server -www -debug -accept 4433 -key localhost.key -cert localhost.crt

Then open [https://localhost:4433](https://localhost:4433) in your browser and temporarily ignore the cert-warning.

You'll get a list of ciphers supported by the server, and a list of ciphers common between the server and the client (which, with all ciphers enabled (default) on the server -- should be rather exhaustive).

See also: [http://support.microsoft.com/kb/299520](http://support.microsoft.com/kb/299520)

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Perhaps someone ought to add session ticket support to OpenSSL for using some of the latest fast in memory-only databases.

If I were a company which made such a database, I'd think that kind of project would give me very good exposure.

<comment><USER10> I think there are two takeaways from this

1\. A timely reminder nothing is perfectly secure

2\. Don't use session tickets. Store nothing on the client except a random key. You will cock it up.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> How to configure Apache to use stronger than 1024 bit DHE? Like group 14.

<comment><USER12> You can't. It hard codes 1024 bit parameters, which is highly annoying. There's a patch to allow user-specified DH parameters but it hasn't been merged:

[https://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=49559](https://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=49559)

I would just go with elliptic curve Diffie Hellman (which unfortunately requires Apache 2.4) and then disable the non-EC Diffie Hellman ciphers if you're concerned about using 1024 bit DH.

FWIW, nginx is a lot more flexible in configuring the cryptography.

<comment><USER13> Elliptical curve is faster too.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> So if Google enables forward secrecy for Google searches, would that mean every single Google search would be encrypted with a new key, or only the "open session"? Would encrypting every search be possible with _perfect_ forward secrecy [1]? And if so, can't we get that for TLS 1.3, too?

[1] [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_forward_secrecy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfect_forward_secrecy)

<comment><USER15> Well Google is also a company that stores full history of everything and hands over stuff to the NSA, so in the bigger picture the point is moot?</comment></comment>


Is Genius Born or Made - <AUTHOR> http://greyenlightenment.com/the-polgar-prodigies-is-genius-born-or-made/ <comment><USER2> Dan Ariely isn't a mere pop-sci author, but holds a Ph.D. (1996) in cognitive psychology from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.

The general shape of Ericsson's research [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K._Anders_Ericsson](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K._Anders_Ericsson) is that other than height, vocal cord size, and body build, EVERYTHING can be improved with training.

That means: a high IQ only means you can do something new decently well the first time. Once people start learning & practicing, the IQ isn't the deciding factor.</comment>


Paul Graham on Getting Rich: The Two Things You Need - <AUTHOR> https://betterhumans.coach.me/paul-graham-on-getting-rich-the-two-things-you-need-36c76b2d22bf <comment><USER2> Begs the question: Is getting rich the true goal of life?

<comment><USER3> "The Top 5 Regrets Of The Dying"

[http://www.collective-evolution.com/2013/04/27/the- top-5-reg...](http://www.collective-evolution.com/2013/04/27/the- top-5-regrets-of-the-dying/)

1\. I wish I'd had the courage to live a life true to myself, not the life others expected of me.

2\. I wish I hadn't worked so hard.

3\. I wish I'd had the courage to express my feelings.

4\. I wish I had stayed in touch with my friends.

5\. I wish that I had let myself be happier.

Along with the above, the "perfect" income for happiness is between $75k-$161k/year (based on several different sources I've consumed). Everything above that is superfluous.

Disclaimer: I have one family member, and three friends, all with net worths above $10 million. None of them are happy. YMMV.</comment></comment>


Peter Naur: 1928-2016 - <AUTHOR> http://cacm.acm.org/magazines/2016/3/198858-peter-naur/fulltext <comment><USER2> Peter Naur's death was previously discussed at [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10832624](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10832624) \- this doesn't seem to add much</comment>


Ask HN: Does lucid dreaming help for people in (y)our line of work? - <AUTHOR>

I've been hearing a lot about lucid dreaming and how people use it practice, experience, and grow. I was wondering if people like the stereotypical HNer actually are aided by lucid dreaming.<p>Are you able to accomplish anything? Actually grow from it? <comment><USER2> _I've been hearing a lot about lucid dreaming and how people use it practice, experience, and grow._

I've heard a lot of claims about lucid dreaming among some young people I know well locally (who post here from time to time). I don't get the impression that lucid dreaming is really as beneficial as they think it is. Some cases I know about from personal observation involve disturbing sleep cycles so much in pursuit of lucid dreams that the young people failed in work environments or crashed and burned in their university studies. Getting a normal amount of sleep (for you, that leaves you feeling rested when you wake up in the morning) is very important. It's a lot more important than what kind of dreams you have.

I think a writing intervention

[http://homepage.psy.utexas.edu/homepage/Faculty/Pennebaker/H...](http://homepage.psy.utexas.edu/homepage/Faculty/Pennebaker/Home2000/WritingandHealth.html)

may do more for many young people in high-creativity careers than lucid dreaming. There is a better research base, by far, for the writing self-help than for lucid dreaming. Try it and see how it works. Best wishes for much success in improving your personal insight and problem-solving.

AFTER EDIT: An issue to consider whenever participants on Hacker News discuss self-help strategies is how reliable the research base is. People who only use the University of Google Library to do research will often find websites by advocacy groups that are pushing a solution that may not have been tested. Fortunately, Google's own director of research, LISP hacker Peter Norvig, has written a guide to reading research reports

<http://norvig.com/experiment-design.html>

that reminds us all about what to look for when someone reports some new, amazing treatment. Check out whether lucid dreaming has really been well evaluated with sufficiently large sample sizes, control groups, and other marks of good research.

</comment><comment><USER3> Lucid dreaming and related out of body experiences have made me realize that the universe we're in is likely an elaborate illusion. That's because the dreams/OBEs are just as real as here, at least while they last. If you can't distinguish between two things then go ahead and call them equivalent.

I'm not sure this aids me though. On the downside I now think of my existence as eternal (we'll always be experiencing some kind of reality), which promotes procrastination. On the upside I don't need many material things to enjoy myself.

About the lack of evidence of lucid dreaming: you know what they say about absence of evidence. When one has had a full-on lucid dream, no more evidence is needed. It takes only one scientist to do good science. Corroboration isn't a real scientific requirement.

</comment><comment><USER4> I am using lucid dreaming as a form of therapy. I am afraid of interacting with people because bad things happened to me in the past. From time to time I experience lucid dreams and I try to interact with the people in my dream but only if the people seem nice. Because of the fact that I know that I am dreaming and that I am in control I do things that I usually would not do. For example a couple of months ago I actually touched someone I like in my lucid dream. When I woke up I felt very good. I had extreme confidence in myself again. Lucid dreaming helps me a lot. I can try things. I can expose myself to things I am afraid of and usually when I have done something in a lucid dream and the experience was not too bad I am able to try it in the real world.

</comment><comment><USER5> Pardon my ignorant question: how does one start a lucid dream? Are there any techniques or is this some kind of session conducted by a "therapist"?

<comment><USER4> There are some people who can start a lucid dream intentionally. I am not one of them. They happen more or less randomly. The key for me is: As soon I realize that I am dreaming I can take over. There are many tricks and techniques that help you to regognize that you are dreaming while you are dreaming. I have found out that I am not able to count backwards while I am dreaming. In my reality I count down from five to zero about 10 times a day. In silence of course. When I am dreaming it happens from time to time that my subconscious is counting backwards from five to zero because I am doing this in my real life. Because I am not able to count back while dreaming I fail to do so and then I am becoming aware about the fact that I am dreaming. This works for me. I think one of the best resources is Google in this matter. You have to try a lot of things.

<comment><USER6> One technique to get into lucid dreaming is to try to look at the palms of your hands or to try to look into a mirror while you are dreaming. This will bring you to semi-consciousness or lucid state and will put you in control of your dream.</comment></comment></comment>


Apple defeats U.S. class action lawsuit over bag searches - <AUTHOR> http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/08/us-apple-bags-ruling-idUSKCN0SX03L20151108#T4hSzllh4iU0Yxdv.97 <comment><USER2> Doesn't this article leave out one of the points that employees often had to wait 10 or 15 minutes for someone to check their bag? Time they weren't paid for? Maybe that was exaggerated or I'm thinking of something else. It holds a least a little merit, no? People that commute via public transportation don't have much of a choice to not hbringing a bag i.e. No car to leave it in.</comment>


The Deep Politics of Jared Leto's Cult - <AUTHOR> https://web.archive.org/web/20191115222015/https://lorenzoae.wordpress.com/2019/09/15/the-deep-politics-of-jared-letos-cult/ <comment><USER2> This article is way too long and rambling. It's like somebody took a couple good insights, a Jared Leto biography, a bunch of acid, and started writing. It weaves a giant improbable web that spans generations and many different actors, with some facts sprinkled in to keep it believable. And virtually no sources for anything.

Sorry but this reads like a classic conspiracy theory. I would be amazed if more than 10% was true, besides the obvious factoids like where he lived</comment>


FreeBSD 10.1 released - <AUTHOR> https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-announce/2014-November/001603.html

<comment><USER2>
      gpg: Signature made Fri Nov 14 11:08:36 2014 PST using RSA key ID 478FE293
      gpg: BAD signature from "Glen Barber <firstname.lastname@example.com>"

<comment><USER3> The mailist list software changed the announcement (for example 'gjb@' to 'gjb at'). The original one is here: [https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.1R/announce.asc](https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.1R/announce.asc)

</comment></comment><comment> ezequiel-garzon Now that BIND has been removed from the base system [1], what DNS server is FreeBSD shipping with (if any)?

[1] [https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.0R/announce.html](https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.0R/announce.html)

<comment> X-Istence FreeBSD is not shipping any DNS servers, there is a recursive DNS resolver available in the way of unbound.

If you want a DNS server you may of course install one of your choosing from the pkg repository. I would recommend NSD if you are familiar with BIND.

<comment> ezequiel-garzon Thanks, I guess I'm used to OpenBSD's model of including these major components in the base system.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> The new console sounds pretty cool. Features include UTF8, double-width characters, and kernel modesetting.

<comment><USER5> If they would allow to set up a nice ttf font, like Source Code Pro via libfontconfig, like fbterm does I would fall in love immediately.)

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> Wow. I remember reading about Hotmail servers running BSD back in the day, but not quite like this.

        FreeBSD 10.1-RELEASE is also available on these cloud hosting platforms:
            - Amazon(R) EC2(TM) FreeBSD/amd64
            - Microsoft(R) Azure(TM) FreeBSD/amd64,  FreeBSD/i386

<comment><USER7> Well hotmail was not owned by Microsoft originally. The urban legend is that after they acquired it they had to keep running it on FreeBSD a lot longer than they wanted to because Windows was not up to the task at the time.

Edit: After a moment's thought... wasnt Hotmail originally running on Solaris or SunOS?

<comment><USER8> "Hotmail initially ran under Solaris for mail services and Apache on FreeBSD for web services, before being partly converted to Microsoft products, using Windows Services for UNIX in the migration path."

[0]: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outlook.com#Launch_of_Hotmail](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outlook.com#Launch_of_Hotmail)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> I see the release-notes mentions "initial" UEFI support, but FreeBSD usually seem pretty modest about things, so it's hard to tell what to expect.

Has anyone here tried it? If so, how mature would you consider it? Usuable, but with warts? Or completely fine?

I'm curious, but I don't want to nuke my server-box just yet :)

<comment><USER10> The main issues are:

      * Does not work with certain hardware / UEFI firmware implementations
        (due to bugs in either our implementation, or the firmware).
      * No support for UEFI nvram variables.
      * No integration or documentation for dual-boot configurations.

Basically, if you can boot the UEFI-enabled USB stick image, UEFI booting an installed FreeBSD should also work fine.

<comment><USER11> _Basically, if you can boot the UEFI-enabled USB stick image, UEFI booting an installed FreeBSD should also work fine._

I remember seeing a bug report about a system where the BIOS treated USB and non-USB disks differently resulting in one working and the other not. There's really no guarantees when you're dealing with broken BIOSes...

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> I always wanted to try FreeBSD, but during install, after I picked the software I wanted it would ask me for disk 10, then disk 7, then disk 5... I proceeded to giving up and installing Slackware instead (this was back in 2007 when I was new to Linux). I hope they've fixed this since, or maybe I did something wrong, who knows? Oh well...

<comment><USER13> I suspect you probably selected CDROM at the time as your software source, which can be confounding for new users. The best solution in this case is to either install binary packages via selecting FTP as your source or (better) via ports. Also, I generally avoid installing extra software outside the base packages until after the system is installed, as this was a problem that could crop up when installing earlier versions (not really a _problem per se_ as much as if it's something you weren't familiar with, it may do unexpected things).

If you install some of the tools in ports-mgmt (portupgrade, for instance, which includes portinstall), you can make the ports collection far easier to manage and use, and it might be more approachable for new users. Not that it's difficult to do a make && make install from the port you want.

I haven't touched FreeBSD in years, so I'd imagine the installer is a bit more forgiving now. That said, my experience with the ports collection was what lead me to select Gentoo for my Linux preferences (later, and more presently, Arch). But, I have _very_ fond memories of using ports, and I think everyone has their preferred methods. The trick is to neither give in or give up and play around with it until you're familiar and have picked tools you're comfortable with (this holds true for almost anything)! I'd suggest giving it another shot.

Edit: I lied. Apparently I have a FreeBSD 10 vm, so it hasn't been years. I don't remember the new installation procedure at all, sadly.

<comment><USER14> I have FBSD 10.x running in VM and production, and I'd agree it's probably best to install the OS first before trying to add applications. In my experience following this policy leaves fewer ways for things to get screwed up.

Re: the ports collection, as a former Gentoo/Funtoo user I felt as you describe. But I think the current FBSD package system is better. Unless there's a special use case, it's generally quite satisfactory and a whole lot easier to download and install apps using the "pkg" utility, rather than messing with ports at all.

IMO the FBSD developers have been doing a terrific job of making the OS better without making it tons harder to administer. There's still a learning curve for sure (e.g., ZFS) but it's not insurmountable.

<comment><USER13> > In my experience following this policy leaves fewer ways for things to get > screwed up.

Definitely. I _still_ do this for _exactly_ that reason. Unnecessarily complicating the installation process is just a recipe for frustration unless you have a well tested build script.

> But I think the current FBSD package system is better.

This is true. I don't have much experience with the "new" package system, because I (mostly) stopped using FreeBSD ~5.x with some more recent usage in the 8.x and 9.x series. I've dabbled in it since, rarely, but I think the old habit of "install everything via ports" is so ingrained in some of us whose FreeBSD use dates back that it's a bit difficult to overcome. :) I'll familiarize myself with it one of these days, perhaps, but the disenchantment with Gentoo is largely the reason I use Arch now and it'd be great to use something similar under a _BSD. Rolling release + binary packages = vastly nicer than waiting for hours for Xorg /KDE/Gnome/whatever to build. As a fellow former Gentoo user, I hope that if you read this, I won't have triggered unfortunate flashbacks or painful memories as a consequence of mentioning this. ;)

If new(ish) users come across this thread, follow jrapdx3's suggestion and learn pkg--it's supposed to be really nice and circumvents some of the old ways of doing things. FreeBSD has, IMO, done a great job of mixing something like a rolling release platform with a well-tested and stable kernel/environment. It's almost the best of both worlds, though some things might be a bit tedious to get running. (Is Java still a colossal pain?)

> IMO the FBSD developers have been doing a terrific job of making the OS > better without making it tons harder to administer.

Here's another thing: FreeBSD is consistent. So much so that even if you return to using it after years, things _still* work more or less the same, and that old knowledge transfers well (within reason).

I can't really say the same for Arch, for instance, because there's usually a hugely disruptive change every 6-12 months. I love Arch (I'm using it right now), but sometimes the drastic changes can be ... surprising.

<comment><USER14> > ... I've dabbled in it since, rarely, but I think the old habit of "install > everything via ports" is so ingrained in some of us whose FreeBSD use dates > back that it's a bit difficult to overcome. :) ...

Ports is still fundamental, but often enough a problem. Not only do some ports take a long time to compile (like Firefox) but a little too often won't compile--maddening when that happens 2 hours after entering "make".

OTOH "pkg" is stable and convenient to use, lately showing no glitches, certainly fewer complications vs. portage, rpm, dpkg, et. al. (Don't know enough about Arch to comment on it.) On the whole pkg is pretty painless.

> (Is Java still a colossal pain?)

Yes and no. I installed openjdk 8.x the other day using 'pkg search', then 'pkg install'. Quite simple. However, if for some reason the Oracle version is necessary, then you'd have the hassle of getting it from their site.

> ... I (mostly) stopped using FreeBSD ~5.x ...

Maybe I should feel a little embarrassed that I still have one DB server which has been running FBSD 6.0 since 2005 (I think). And it's been running continuously, only stopping here and there because of power outages. Haven't changed any of the software, the only maintenance has been backing up the DB, rotating logs, and so on.

I keep meaning to update that system but I don't seem to get around to doing it. After 80,000 hrs on the job I guess we might call it "stable".

<comment><USER13> > Not only do some ports take a long time to compile (like Firefox) but a > little too often won't compile--maddening when that happens 2 hours after > entering "make".

I've only once tried using FreeBSD for a desktop machine, and lengthy compilation times (followed by the occasional failure) were one of the reasons I didn't, and another one of the reasons why I eventually dumped Gentoo as my choice for workstations. I remember building Xorg overnight once on Gentoo only to discover that it had failed about 30 minutes _after_ I went to bed.

I'm still a little upset over that, thinking back on it.

> (Don't know enough about Arch to comment on it.) On the whole pkg is pretty > painless.

Arch is a rolling release distribution with binary packages; it seems that pkg operates in a manner similar (identical?) to this. It really is the best of both worlds: New packages, when updates are released upstream--usually within days--without the need to compile.

Though, I wouldn't recommend Arch for much other than a workstation (partially due to the nature of rolling releases--breakage happens), it has actually been a fantastic distro for someone whose _nix history went something like OpenBSD - > FreeBSD -> Gentoo. You update the system periodically, new packages are downloaded and installed, and updates occur frequently. Compilation is mostly limited to the AUR (Arch User Repository), but the benefit with Arch is that its build tools create binary packages by default that you can then use on other machines of the same architecture. Gentoo allows the same thing, but IIRC it's not something it'll do by default and it's a bit fussier. If you do have to build something, Arch will build the package first, then install from that. But the main repositories have essentially everything you'd want, so compilation truly is limited to less popular/common packages. Everything else is just a download + install away.

But again, Arch is susceptible to some breakage at times, although I've had pretty good luck avoiding this. I guess it's like anything else: If you're careful and apply some meticulous scrutiny to the process, you're less likely to break things in a manner that's difficult to fix. Updating regularly (as with other rolling releases, like Gentoo) is also helpful. Too long between updates can create a bit of a difficult situation to get out of.

> Yes and no. I installed openjdk 8.x the other day using 'pkg search', then > 'pkg install'. Quite simple. However, if for some reason the Oracle version > is necessary, then you'd have the hassle of getting it from their site.

Okay, that's not too bad. I _vaguely* recall it being painful back during 5.x-6.x, but I never had much need for Java on FreeBSD either outside some odds and ends.

> Maybe I should feel a little embarrassed that I still have one DB server > which has been running FBSD 6.0 since 2005 (I think).

NOPE! (I wouldn't.)

When I ran FreeBSD (all the way back through the latter 4.x days, probably 4.5-4.6 at the absolute earliest, but I think we had a 4.7/4.8 machine running for a number of years), the _beautiful_ thing about it was _definitely_ its stability. You could do exactly that: Go for ages without updating it and as long as it wasn't Internet-connected, there wasn't really much you needed to worry about. And even if it was, you could just update whatever software you had listening on open ports, within reason, and not worry (I'd do this with Apache or BIND). I know this goes counter to much of the philosophy here, but sometimes if it ain't broke...

The curious thing regarding FreeBSD was the more conservative upgrade path you'd often feel compelled to take, and you seldom felt guilty for leaving a machine untouched. You could always take comfort in the fact that it'd Just Work and remain fairly secure.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> Will FreeBSD start making releases like 10.1.1? Ubuntu and Debian always provide updates to fix bugs, including kernel bugs.

<comment><USER16> They already do that. Right now I'm running 10.0-RELEASE-p12. See the UPDATING file for the 10.0 branch for example: [https://svnweb.freebsd.org/base/releng/10.0/UPDATING?view=lo...](https://svnweb.freebsd.org/base/releng/10.0/UPDATING?view=log)

<comment><USER15> Isn't that like a security patch?

<comment><USER11> Security patches and errata updates. The criterion I set down when I was security officer for what would go into this was "people should be able to install these blindly without ever worrying that it will break anything".

<comment><USER15> This is why Ubuntu and other Linux distributions are still better. They actually get bugs fixed.

I sometimes have to patch the sources with change sets from HEAD or STABLE to get bug fixes.

<comment><USER17> Of course things get fixed. And they don't bring the system down like they do in Ubuntu and other Linux distributions.

<comment><USER18> > And they don't bring the system down like they do in Ubuntu and other Linux > distributions.

They don't bring the system down in Linux, either. Stop spreading FUD.

<comment><USER15> No, they're right. Linux systems don't panic because of broken drivers after an update, they keep running properly.

FreeBSD sometimes completely stops booting on your hardware or turns unstable for no good reason. (search on google for posts from people who can't boot FreeBSD 8.x on hardware which was running 6.x or 7.x without the slightest bug)

FreeBSD can crash your system because of an unstable driver after a major upgrade like 9.2 to 9.3.

You can see they're right, "FreeBSD doesn't take your system down like Linux", it's much worse.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> I must give FreeBSD another spin. The last time I used it in anger was circa 2000 (4.0) to build a route collector for a small internet exchange point using GNU Zebra [0].

[0]: [https://www.gnu.org/software/zebra/](https://www.gnu.org/software/zebra/)

</comment><comment><USER19> Fonts are still looking extremely ugly after install. How can I get clean fonts for typographic work?

<comment><USER20> You don't give a lot of detail to work with, but my best stab in the dark is that in X by default the font renderer will sometimes use bitmap fonts (and stretch them) when what you really want are vector fonts. You can edit fonts.conf to avoid this, if you like. (Unfortunately, I'm booted into Windows at the moment so I can't copy and paste my configuration.)

Or perhaps you've got something else going on entirely. It's hard to say from your post.

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> Any reason for the lack of DVB drivers in FBSD?

<comment><USER22> Has them. You caould watch your family home movies which you haven't uploaded to the cloud yet with mplayer and the dependencies that install when you compile it! It also has aalib and libcaca if your so inclined to geekout with seeing your flick directly in the terminal console.

~ Happy Hacking

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> The actual release announcement itself is here: [https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd- announce/2014-No...](https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd- announce/2014-November/001603.html)

<comment><USER23> I guess that's a slightly more canonical article, so we changed the url to that from [https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.1R/relnotes.html](https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.1R/relnotes.html).

<comment><USER3> And the announcement were the GnuPG signature actually verifies is here: [https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.1R/announce.asc](https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.1R/announce.asc). (linked from [https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.1R/announce.html](https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.1R/announce.html)) Maybe the announcement itself should include a link to the URL considered canonical by the project itself to avoid confusion :)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER24> Does this release include systemd?

 _ducks_

<comment><USER24> wow, sarcasm is really missed on this crowd!</comment></comment>


Services: Introducing a New Role into the Ember Programming Model - <AUTHOR> http://discuss.emberjs.com/t/services-a-rumination-on-introducing-a-new-role-into-the-ember-programming-model/4947

<comment><AUTHOR> And the pull request: [https://github.com/emberjs/ember.js/pull/4861](https://github.com/emberjs/ember.js/pull/4861)</comment>


CRU Emails were Leaked Before they were Hacked. BBC Correspondent Ignored Tip - <AUTHOR> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1231763/BBC-weatherman-ignored-leaked-climate-row-emails.html

<comment><USER2> My Grandmother would have described the content of this post as "gossip". And gossip was not something she approved of.

Best filed under "so what?" and ignored.</comment>


ReferenceBot: designed in 1 hr, built in 1 week - <AUTHOR> http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/referencebot_social_networking_for_headhunters.php

<comment><USER2> When a person writes a reference letter, it is supposed to include both strengths and weakness of the job candidate. This is sensitive information that is necessarily sent directly to the intended recipient.

If you require the letter to go through an unknown / untrusted third party on the Internet, the person writing the letter will necessarily water down their criticisms for fear of the letter being seen by unintended eyes, and for fear of liability.

Going through a third party may increase convenience, but it decreases the actual value of the reference.</comment>


Meet the Apple Watch - <AUTHOR> http://techcrunch.com/2014/09/09/meet-the-apple-watch/ <comment><USER2> I just don't think the watch market is really there. I feel like its shrinking steadily among younger people as the need for a time teller is replaced by the modern cell phone. I believe people have convinced themselves into convincing companies that they actually want a high tech wrist watch when, in reality, the market isn't that big and it is shrinking. I believe this whole craze started with the pebble. People see and think "cool", but then realize after a week of wearing it that they have no additional need being filled by it. There are of course exceptions (joggers for example might be a specific use case), but overall I think demand is lower than the current market saturation.

Also it requires an iPhone.

<comment><USER3> there's a reason the wrist watch replaced the pocket watch.

<comment><USER4> >> there's a reason the wrist watch replaced the pocket watch.

The funny thing is that I stopped wearing wrist watches when phones started fitting in my pocket. So my phone, while having extra features, isn't very different from a pocket watch.

And if there are a lot of people like me, you can make the argument that the pocket (or purse) watch subsequently replaced the wrist watch.

<comment><USER5> Well yeah, the smart pocket watch obviously trumps the dumb wrist watch. The point here is that now the wrist watch is smart again, it is likely to take over again for the same reasons it beat the pocket watch the first time.

EDIT: To clarify, I'm not saying they'll completely replace smartphones, just that enough features can be moved to the wrist to make it worth wearing.

<comment><USER4> >> just that enough features can be moved to the wrist to make it worth wearing.

I'm afraid it's not quite so simple as that. It also has to be more than simply worth wearing.

* It has to be worth adding to the pile of devices that you're managing (remembering to charge, remembering to wear, connecting to your phone, security settings, etc).

* It has to be worth taking up another USB port in your charger (since it's not using a lightning or micro USB port)

* It has to be worth taking up more space on your nightstand for charging.

While I see a lot of benefits for sporty/health types and FOMO-afflicted notification addicts, I'm not so sure it's going to eat up the market the same way the iPhone and iPad did.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment> grey-area This watch looks like it was designed by a committee:

Two ways to navigate the interface (wheel for zooming, to avoid touching the screen, and panning by...touching the screen).

Tasteless misfeatures like customisable emoji [1] and drawing your own fail whale on a tiny screen [2], and most inexplicable of all for an expensive watch - very little attention paid to the actual watch face designs, which are not even adapted to the square frame, and some of which have numbering superimposed awkwardly over images like a butterfly or globe, or mickey mouse...ugh [3]

[1] [http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/apple024...](http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/apple0243.jpg)

[2] [http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/apple025...](http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/apple0252.jpg)

[3] [http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/apple021...](http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/apple0216.jpg)

Combining all that stuff with materials like 18 carat gold or brushed steel doesn't really make sense - it's as if they asked a different person about each feature included and then mashed it all together in some frankenstein mess. The fitness features look quite nice in contrast.

I actually think in future we'll all be using wearables like this far more than phones - little status bands or com badges or glasses/contact lenses, but this is not a glimpse of the future so much as a glimpse at the dysfunction in the current Apple design process, post Steve Jobs, and their inability to produce coherent products.

<comment><USER6> My friends and I _love_ the stickers on messenger. On a new sticker day, it's like the highlight of the day. They're fun and sometimes terrifying, and it adds some fun to group conversations.

Maybe you're not the target audience.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> I think there are two things Apple did wrong here

1\. They have customized size and band, while not the shape. I for one love round shape and hate the square shape, and I believe I'm not the only one with this preference.

2\. They emphasized too much on the interaction with watch. IMO, watch is supposed to notify you new things, have you glance over it and do some quick responding. That's it. User should not use watch in the same way they use phone.

In Apple watch's demo, they have too much interaction showing there and the information on one screen is sometimes crowded. That's not a good sign.

I do like the new interaction pattern they introduced there though. Quite innovative IMO.

<comment> k-mcgrady >> "IMO, watch is supposed to notify you new things, have you glance over it and do some quick responding. That's it. User should not use watch in the same way they use phone."

Not enough people will pay several hundred dollars for that. I'm a geek and heavy smartphone user and I wouldn't pay $50 just to get notifications on my wrist. It needs to do more or there's only a small market.

<comment><USER8> yup. I keep my phone on vibrate in my pocket; the fundamental question they have to answer is why the hell do I need to pay $400 just to get notifications on my wrist? I presume the answer is look at all this cool stuff too! fitness / ui tracking, quick interactions, etc

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> I think it is great to be skeptical, and it is fun to slag on Apple, especially if they insist on having U2 play their event.

But on a more serious note, I won't underestimate the potential for a widely adopted device that is:

1) always visible to the user. Yes, in my opinion taking my phone out of my pocket and putting it back in again is one of those irritations you don't notice until it goes away and then you wondered how you lived for so long doing that dumb behavior. Setting your phone on the dinner table, constantly looking at it when you are trying to walk around town ... the watch could be subtly revolutionary for those thousands of glances a day.

2) always _touching_ the user. I am extremely excited, or at least intrigued, by what is possible with persistent two-way haptic communication. Without having used the dev kit, and without feeling the actuators, I don't know how nuanced the communication can be. But there could be a whole new world here.

Just a thought from the "maybe they aren't idiots at Apple" perspective.

<comment><USER10> I got really excited when they mentioned about haptic feedback for turn by turn directions. That was the moment I feel how a wearable could become an extension to our _sense_. If it could provide me some information without me using or looking at it, then that's really indeed a whole new world.

I can't wait to see it in action.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> I think this design is much uglier than the Moto 260[1].

[1] [https://moto360.motorola.com/](https://moto360.motorola.com/)

<comment><USER12> Wow, that's probably one of the most unusable, non-responsive product pages I've ever seen on the web.

After clicking the link, I stared at a black screen containing nothing but the "Moto 360" logo and a throbber for about 10 seconds before the actual page content started to display.

Scrolling is just completely broken: moving the mouse wheel in _any_ direction will scroll the page _down_. But there's no at-a-glance summary of product features, so you _must_ scroll through the whole mess just to find out about the product. Animations and videos begin playing as soon as their section of the page is scrolled to, without being triggered by deliberate user action. One of the sections uses some sort of bloom effect on the text that doesn't work properly and makes the text unreadable.

So after wading through all of that, I started reading some of the copy on the page, and while I was doing so, I was spontaneously sent back to the 'loading screen' with the logo and throbber while more content downloaded for another 5-10 seconds.

I'm on a 10 MB/s DSL connection at the moment. The page took a whopping 228.85 seconds (that's _three minutes and forty-nine seconds_ ) to load over 13 MB of content.

And, after all of that, I still don't have a clear idea of why I'd be interested in the product. This is just absolutely hellish web design.

<comment><USER13> If I understand correctly, OP's comment was not about the web page but on the product listed on that page.

<comment><USER12> I know, but he linked to the web page in order to provide background info on the product he was discussing, and I wanted to point out the extreme difficulty I had in actually obtaining that information from that site. Apologies if my comment was a bit of a rathole (but perhaps it's less of a rathole than actually attempting to visit that site would be).

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> No talk of water resistance or battery life is pretty disappointing. Those two things are key for something I would like to keep on my wrist for as long as possible.

<comment><USER15> For real. Will this last a week or a day? I like that my Pebble isn't another smartphone that I have to charge on the daily.

<comment><USER16> seems to imply its daily charge - 'easy to charge everynight'.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> I don't know If I'm an idiot, but I'm not seeing the huge deal here. Is the space from the pocket to the wrist such a chasm that it merits making a device like this?

<comment><USER18> I think a watch would be extremely handy to have while running, cycling, kayaking, etc. Something to track activity, change songs, or show a map when you are unable to use your phone.

Unfortunately, the $350 price point is way too high for something like that.

<comment><USER19> Kayaking...if you keep your phone within Bluetooth Low Energy range in a waterproof sack.

<comment><USER20> > if you keep your phone within Bluetooth Low Energy range

300 ft.

> in a waterproof sack

Probably the one that contains your wallet and keys as well.

<comment><USER21> Not much use as a watch then.

<comment><USER18> It wasn't mentioned, but I fully assume the watch will be waterproof (at least water resistant). They incidentally come in contact with water too often (rain, hand washing, etc) to not be.

The Moto360 is water resistant and the Pebble is water proof, so if the Apple Watch isn't, it's seriously in trouble.

<comment><USER20> No doubt the reason they didn't say yet, is because it hasn't been finished yet. But yes, it will be at least water resistant, since if it's not, it would be useless. Apple wants to sell these things, so it won't make them useless.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> $350 and not out until "early 2015"

Dead in the water. That's insanely expensive and too late in the smartwatch market in my mind.

<comment><USER23> I'll take that bet: [https://twitter.com/BenedictEvans/status/509092715783401472](https://twitter.com/BenedictEvans/status/509092715783401472)

Also, I'm guessing that the "Edition" watches are going to sell for 10x that. And there'll be a months-long wait to get one.

</comment></comment><comment><USER24> Ugly. It looks like something from the 1980s. What happened to the beautiful minimilistic design?

I can imagine Roger Moore and Christopher Walken wearing one in "A View To A Kill".

</comment><comment><USER25> When they announced the feature of sharing your heartbeat with your partner via vibrate, both my girlfriend and I went 'eeeeew'. Some things shouldn't be done through technology, just like that Japanese remote kissing device :)

<comment><USER26> Well, I don't see the eww factor in sharing a number. But then I also don't see the point, because the sensor will (just as the Motorola one) not reliably work when exercising and theres no tracking mechanism anyway.

(There are optical heart rate sensors that are made for exercise, and they have much brighter LEDs and specially designed case for shutting out exterior light)

<comment><USER20> > have much brighter LEDs

Where did they announce the brightness of the heart rate LEDs?

> specially designed case for shutting out exterior light

Well, it's sitting right against your wrist, pressed against it. I think that'll block out enough light.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> Seems like a complete reversal. You have the watch-like Motorola running Android and looking like an actual watch, and here is Apples watch that looks like a refined Pebble and has quirky stuff like quick exchange bands that were previously more of the Android domain.

</comment><comment><USER27> Maybe I'm missing the point with these new devices, but I can't be the only one not interested in ever wearing a watch again.

<comment><USER28> Ehh, I have a nice mechanical watch. It and a notepad in my pocket mean I have no use for a smartphone, and I can use it in places where a smartphone would be inappropriate (rowing, exercising, during a concert, etc.) I doubt I'll ever buy a smartwatch but I love my dumbwatch.

</comment></comment><comment><USER29> Possibly the ugliest of all smartwatches, useless for the majority of people out there, not likely to be on the wrists of most of the target demographic (they already own watches and fitness bands), and incredibly expensive. Not sure how many people need a watch to tell them that their phone is ringing.

Good job, Apple. While I'm sure there will be some adherents who will buy whatever you will produce, the Android watch makers will already be on their next iteration AND will have seen your specs to boot. Never thought I'd say this, but Apple has fallen WAY behind in terms of product design.

<comment><USER30> > not likely to be on the wrists of most of the target demographic (they > already own watches and fitness bands)

You could've said that about phones and PDAs pre-iPhone.

</comment></comment><comment><USER31> Me personally, I don't see myself ever wearing a watch, but if I was, I would be annoyed about that crown thing being on the right side of the watch.

As a more or less leftie, wearing a purely non interactive element on the left hand as it is custom for watches is ok, but having to interact with that crown thing using my right hand feels wrong.

I could probably get used to it, but then, I can doost things with both hands, but I can imagine some left handed people having trouble with this (or obscuring their display when using it with the left hand)

<comment><USER32> I'm guessing either they'll make a left handed version, or you'll be able to just flip it (positioning the crown to the bottom on the right hand wrist), and the screen will be able to flip accordingly.

</comment></comment><comment><USER33> I'm skeptical about a few things - mostly regarding the dial. They are trying to replace pinch-to-zoom, but how does it know where to zoom? Also, the main UI screen with all of the apps looks ridiculous. They don't want you touching the watch, unless it's to click on a tiny app icon?

I need to see this in person.

<comment><USER34> I wonder what the experience will be like for left-handed people. Can the watch be rotated to have the dial on the opposite side?

<comment><USER35> You could put the bands on reversed, and the software could invert the screen but the knob would be on the bottom, vs. the top. It would work though not ideal.

Overly not impressed by the crown control... people who wear watches that need to be wound rarely do it while it's on their wrist. I would need to feel this "dial" control to be convinced this is a good idea.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER36> Three things:

1\. No word on battery. This has been a huge problem for other (sometimes larger) watches. Does it have to be charged daily?

2\. More expensive than the competition ($350 Vs. $250 and $150, for the Galaxy Gear+Moto 360/Pebble+Sony Smartwatch).

3\. They release in "early 2015" so miss this Christmas holiday season which MIGHT negatively impact adoption (or not, dunno).

4\. iPhone only. I understand their reasoning but this will definitely limit adoption somewhat (not really too surprising however).

The battery question is the biggest ??? hanging over this. A watch that can barely last a day (e.g. Moto 360) is a huge negative to a lot of people, myself included.

That's one area where the Pebble really excelled. With its eInk display, the screen was always "on" and it would run for several days on a single charge. We need a combination LCD/eInk panel to get the best of both.

<comment><USER37> Tim Cook said about the magnet connector "so that you can easily charge it at night". So expect to charge it daily.

<comment><USER38> That's crazy. One of the great things about my Pebble being my alarm is that vibration on your wrist is hard to sleep through. If you have to charge your watch every night...

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER39> Terrible design.

The high-end customers you desire will never abandon their shiny Swiss watches for this.

The low-end customers will (once again) be claimed by Samsung.

I didn't really like him, but Jobs was indeed a visionary. Apple is losing ground (alarmingly rapidly, I might add) after him. May he rest in peace.

<comment><USER40> Low end customers and Samsung?

The Gear S smart watch is stand-alone (or tether), has 3G cellular, wifi and looks far better than the Apple watch. It will probably cost about the same as the Apple watch too.

</comment></comment><comment><USER41> To sum up: No wireless. Less space than a Nomad. Lame.

</comment><comment><USER42> "Watch", "Watch Edition", "Watch Sport" \- The bad Chinese knockoffs already have their naming taken care of...

</comment><comment><USER43> How I miss Steve Jobs. He would never allow a POS like this to be revealed.

</comment><comment><USER44> Ah, screw this. I was hoping for 1) A round watch. Indeed, it looks geeky at best. 2) More talk about health options (sleep tracking?). Besides, after all the specialists Apple hired, it just measures your heartbeat and walking distance. An iPhone with an M chip can do that (OK, you won't probably have it with you all the time, especially when jogging), but still. And instead there's a load of talk about emoji, causing another user's watch to vibrate, notifications, etc.

I would've been fine with less functionality app-wise, a nicer overall look and a lower price. I don't need to watch photos and read twitter on my watch (it still needs an iPhone for that, right? So what's the friggin' point?)

The wireless things like payments and opening hotel rooms are kinda cool, though, but then again, I'd probably be too lazy/paranoid to enter the data into the watch than to get out my wallet/hotel room key.

</comment><comment><USER45> I can see it as being slightly useful to monitor heart rate and piloting the mp3 player, occasionally. But certainly not worth the cost and the burden (one more device to recharge and carry around). Also, a watch is a personal item. I wouldn't like to have the same watch as everybody else.

I wonder if they'll find a market for this.

</comment><comment> k-mcgrady It's still a little geeky looking - but much, much less geeky looking than the competitors. I would personally prefer a round face but I can understand how that make it harder to do such a useful/interactive UI. Round face is fine for notifications but not as good if you're interacting.

</comment><comment><USER46> Left handed people are kinda screwed with this thing.

<comment><USER47> I'm sure you can turn it around.

<comment><USER46> Then the button is on the top.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER48> Don't see how this fits with Apple's core competency—creating a hardware device in a category where competitive devices have poor usability and limited function. This is Apple's first "me too" mobile product, as far as I can see.

<comment><USER49> The iPod was a "me too" product.

</comment></comment><comment><USER50> I am liking the idea of using the crown to help navigate around the interface. Glad they thought about it a lot more vs just compressing the phone down into a smaller UI (similar to the small iPod was). Also, how smoothly did those icons on the home screen move around? For some reason I found that really impressive, now to find out what the battery life is like (nice use of MagSafe as well for charging, IMO)

Not a fan of those animated emoji at all. Not sure why they included those tbh.

<comment><USER35> I'm not seeing the crown being that effective. People who needed to use the crown to wind/set a watch almost always took it off to use it effectively. I don't see it being easy to use while it's on your wrist but I would have to put my hands on it I guess to really feel it. I am a collector of antique watches though, and none of them I would wind while wearing it.

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> Anyone else have or remember the universal HomeLink transmitters that came in cars? Your car had a button that could "learn" the sequence from most garage door openers, apartment gate clickers, and the like.

I would love for this watch to be able to be able to clone all the various NFC-type items and building access cards people carry around. I suspect there are considerable technical and legal obstacles to this, but hey, there's an API!

</comment><comment><USER51> No "visible" Apple logo? Now, that's strange.

</comment><comment><USER52> Too bad about it requiring a phone. I was hoping to be able to ditch my phone and talk with a watch paired to a blue tooth headset. I'll keep dreaming.

</comment><comment><USER53> This is an Apple watch so they'll make billions of dollars out of it, no doubt. It looks like a good product too. But it doesn't have anything special compared to android based smartwatches, not even a round shaped one, plus I prefer google now for smart alerts. Still, of course it'll sell well and you'll still be able to install google now on it I guess.

</comment><comment><USER54> We'll have to wait until a tear-down comes out, but there's no way this costs $350 to make. Hasn't apple's strategy always been to sell hardware with a healthy margin and make almost nothing off their software ecosystem. Could this signal a change?

Even assuming this watch becomes insanely popular, will it really drive more iPhone sales?

<comment><USER4> >> We'll have to wait until a tear-down comes out, but there's no way this costs $350 to make

This should probably go without saying, but a bill of materials is probably not very representative of the real costs of this product.

</comment></comment><comment><USER55> The marketing hype is ridiculous and the fanboys are going to be unbearable:

Ion strengthened glass.

18K Gold developed to be twice as hard as standard gold.

<comment><USER35> "18K Gold developed to be twice as hard as standard gold."

Did they really say that? Ha! Who knew my 9K gold stuff was vastly superior to higher grades.

<comment><USER56> 18K just means "75% pure gold", it doesn't say what the other 25% is and there are a lot of different alloys. Most commonly it's mostly copper, which ironically is what gives it the standard "gold" tint (white gold uses metals like silver instead). I assume they mean "we picked an alloy that's harder than most".

<comment><USER55> Apparently Apple has their own metallurgists now... nauseating...

"crafted from 18-karat gold that our metallurgists have developed to be up to twice as hard as standard gold."

[http://www.apple.com/watch/apple-watch- edition/](http://www.apple.com/watch/apple-watch-edition/)

<comment><USER20> > Apparently Apple has their own metallurgists now... nauseating...

Given how many things they make out of metal, they've probably had metallurgists for years. I'm not sure what you find nauseating about that idea.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER42> :( I was really hoping for something more impressive. This doesn't even hold up to the Moto 360.

<comment><USER57> Can you pay using the moto 360?

<comment><USER42> No, but I wouldn't be embarrassed to wear it in public... ;)

<comment><USER57> To each his own, I think the Moto 360 looks like a hockey puck :)

(I'm not Che or Maradona, so I'm not ditching my analogue watch for a smart watch any time soon, even if I can pay with it..)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER58> At the end of the announcement they mentioned using it for NFC payments. But anyone have an idea how that would work without the thumbprint scanner of the iPhone? It seemed like that was one of the key features of the Apple Pay announcement earlier in the keynote.

</comment><comment><USER59> I'm excited to see more about inductive charging. They showed anything about it on the presentation (I couldn't watch).

And also, it is said that requires an iPhone. Does it have to be nearby it? Are the phone and the watch always connected?

</comment><comment><USER60> I rather prefer the Garmin Fit. Battery life is almost a year. It does only 2 things: whether I am active enough and sleeping enough. Do we really need to have notifications on the watch. Not sure. May be i am too old.

<comment><USER61> You can now get the vivosmart instead of the vivofit if you want notifications. The tradeoff is your battery life drops to something like 7 days. That's still pretty good though.

(Full disclosure, I'm a current Garmin employee but I don't work in the fitness area)

</comment></comment><comment><USER25> Apple Watch has NFC - now that is something none of the Android watches have. Don't pull your phone or wallet out, pay with your wrist. But by early 2015, Android Wear will catch up.

<comment><USER62> That's the single feature that the Apple Watch has that I'm interested in. Over the past year, I've been integrating NFC into a huge part of my daily life (from implants to door locks to smart tags all over my house) and having it in a watch is killer. Just not enough to jump back to the iPhone. Can't wait to see the Moto 360 r2 with NFC.

</comment></comment><comment><USER63> Looks like a beautiful product. Unclear to me why anyone would want one. Much like Google Glasses, I'm straining to think of a compelling use case in my own life.

</comment><comment><USER6> I'm buying at least 2. One for me, and one for my girlfriend. I may also get one for my mom.

Mine is for development. I see 10x returns easily, possibly 100x.

<comment><USER21> What kind of apps do you see bringing in such revenue?

<comment><USER6> I'm mostly interested in specialty/niche sports/fitness applications. All of the built-in stuff is great for people who think running is where fitness ends or need to be reminded to walk every day, but not so great for someone looking to improve a 600lb deadlift or cut their 40m time.

I also think a handful of other fun apps could be profitable, like using the local communication thing to send shock images/reaction gifs/dumb sticker packs.

The first IAP Tamagotchi-type game will make a million dollars easily.

I'll probably stick to focusing on health and performance, but plenty is possible.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER64> I think I'll stick with my jawbone up for now...

What I think is interesting, however, is what the apple watch will look like 5 years from now.

</comment><comment><USER65> $350? That's fairly pricey!

</comment><comment><USER66> As someone who uses the NikeFuel, I've gotta say this watch is COMPLICATED.

</comment><comment><USER67> News overload: TC Disrupt, Hacker News, Product Hunt, Apple Event!!!

</comment><comment><USER57> Finally, someone not trying to mimic analogue watches.

</comment><comment><USER68> Sorry, I just had to be the one to say it. If SJ were presenting, he would have focused 10 minutes on how this device was the best and most precise thing at telling time. He would have shown how the hardware surpassed anything a mechanical watch would have ever done and it would be the time/watch nerds dream device.

With all the compromises in size and battery life, this is what you would gain in return for it. Instead, it was sold as a "me too", complementary device, just with Apple magic thrown in there.

So now in the end, I don't need a mini-iphone on my wrist or do I want one. I can just as easily pull the phone out of my pocket as it takes the same amount of time.

Such a shame really, because it's obvious that Apple had their brightest engineers work long hours on it.</comment>


Subsidizing Suburbia: A forgotten history of how the government created suburbia - <AUTHOR> http://www.marketurbanism.com/2017/09/05/subsidizing-suburbia-a-forgotten-history-of-how-the-government-created-suburbia/ <comment><USER2> Re: But none of these conclusions were inevitable. Government intervention influenced our expectations about home ownership, tax treatment, car infrastructure, and even what our neighborhoods should look like. In the course of the next few posts, we'll dive into each of these four topics to understand how American communities came to be what they are today."

Perhaps I missed it but it does look like they're going to discuss why. That is why the gov went in this direction. Who benefitted. Who didn't. What sociopolitical norms did it encourge/discourage. Etc.

The whats will certainly be interesting. But the arc of why would be a greater discussion.

<comment><USER3> One aspect is racism and xenophobia. Remember that Levittown was a whites-only suburb.

Quoting [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crabgrass_Frontier](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crabgrass_Frontier) : Jackson examined the New Deal's contributions to public housing and concludes that "the result, if not the intent, of the public housing program of the United States was to segregate the races, to concentrate the disadvantaged in inner cities, and to reinforce the image of suburbia as a place of refuge for the problems of race, crime, and poverty."

Or [https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2014/05/the- rac...](https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2014/05/the-racist- housing-policy-that-made-your-neighborhood/371439/) .

For a more diverse treatment of some other aspects of suburbanization, see [http://chnm.gmu.edu/courses/schrag/wiki/index.php?title=Subu...](http://chnm.gmu.edu/courses/schrag/wiki/index.php?title=Suburbanization) .

The first essay in the series links to other references like [http://web.mit.edu/ebj/www/doc/JAPAv61n1.pdf](http://web.mit.edu/ebj/www/doc/JAPAv61n1.pdf) which describe some of the reasons for, for example, car-oriented roads and the reason for building cul-de-sacs[1]. (In short: it was cheaper.)

The 1950s urban planning policy was based on single-use zones, magnified by its incorporation into federal standards. "The Death and Life of Great American Cities" is the classic critique of that approach.

[1] I deliberate treat it as an English word and make it a plural with English rules, rather than use the French plural

<comment><USER2> Interesting. But why were the whites "forced out" of the cities when the European tradition was minorites out and wealthy (whites) stay?

This is where I get back to I wish this series was going to explore The Why as well. That doesn't seem to be the case based on this first in the series.

<comment><USER3> This series is specifically discussing "an even more important factor that shaped patterns of American development since the Great Depression." It is not discussing the roots of suburbanization, which is what you appear to want. For that you must consult the sources.

The series linked to [http://web.mit.edu/ebj/www/doc/JAPAv61n1.pdf](http://web.mit.edu/ebj/www/doc/JAPAv61n1.pdf) , and I suggested it as well in my earlier comment.

On page 2 it says "To avoid the harsh physical and social conditions of the industrial city, affluent citizens of that era chose to live in new developments at the rural-urban edge. ... the suburban notion trickled down from the elite to the middle class ..."

On page 3 "During the late nineteenth century the environmental chaos of the city was seen as linked to its social problems. Overcrowding and deteriorating sanitary conditions were believed to cause social and moral degeneration. Social and health reformers argued that the inevitable social disorder would be controlled best by improving the environment. Then as reformers discovered the difficulty of improving the inner city, many began advocating multi- centered growth patterns. Suburbanization was seen as a vital force not only in urbanizing the countryside, but also in revitalizing the city. ... "</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: Barcodes, are they all stored in a central location? - <AUTHOR>

Are barcodes/UPC codes that are placed on food items and grocery store products centrally managed by the store they are purchased from or are they all unique identifiers to a specific product carried by a specific store and maintained by a third party? <comment><USER2> As someone who has intimate knowledge of the second largest retailer in the world, I can tell you it's a mixture.

Basically you have food and non-food items. Food items that are weighed in- store for example can be given a barcode which starts with an in-store prefix, other food items contained in tins have a barcode that the manufactures have assigned following certain conventions (country of origin etc..) food created in-house gets yet another barcode because it may be produced from tinned food that is also sold on shelves. I could go on...

Non-food stuff tends to be packaged already and the barcodes are supplied by the manufacturer sometimes conforming to the recognised format sometimes based on their own product reference.

You can get software that generates a barcode depending on the information you want to encode, and it'll do it according to the recognised standards, but your data is your own.

The EAN Code is the most widely known code in Europe, but there are also Book codes ISBN and periodical codes... OK enough already!

</comment><comment><USER3> Via Google - [http://guides.wsj.com/small-business/starting-a- business/how...](http://guides.wsj.com/small-business/starting-a-business/how- to-get-upc-codes-for-your-products-2/)

</comment><comment><USER4> An easy way to find out the answer would be to go purchase one thing from Store A and the same thing from Store B. You can rule out at least one possibility from there :)

I'll give you a hint, though: you can scan a barcode with your phone and compare prices :)

<comment><AUTHOR> Good advice. But where can I find out what company distributes the bar codes?

<comment><USER4> You really should have google'd this.

A single search: "Who designates bar codes?" yielded this as the top result: [http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080517170020AA...](http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080517170020AAeJt9s)</comment></comment></comment>


How can Google beat Facebook with one checkbox? - <AUTHOR> http://www.nilkanth.com/archives/2007/09/07/how-can-google-beat-facebook-with-one-checkbox/

<comment><USER2> The answer is almost certainly no. To my mind, Facebook dominates for three things: basic personal info (looking up someone's phone number, seeing where they work, etc.), photos, and events. I don't know Orkut well, but if beating Facebook includes becoming dominant in the U.S., they'll have to do something truly fresh, not just play catch-up.

<comment><AUTHOR> "I don't know Orkut well"

The review is based on personal hands-on use on both the mentioned social networking utilities.

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> I don't trust Alexa as a measure of Orkut vs Facebook. All those users in other countries don't have the Alexa toolbar installed.

<comment><AUTHOR> Do you think all those users in Brazil and India have the Alexa toolbar installed? Most of them are not even aware of Alexa. Which other global traffic analyzer do you recommend for this comparison? If any.

<comment><USER3> That was my point: Orkut does disproportionately badly in Alexa because the Brazilian and Indian users don't have the toolbar installed.

<comment><AUTHOR> For the record, Google Trends paints the very same picture: [http://www.google.com/trends?q=orkut%2C+facebook&ctab=0&...](http://www.google.com/trends?q=orkut%2C+facebook&ctab=0&geo=all&date=2007&sort=1)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> "Facebook on the other hand is the leader in the US, Canada and UK."

This statement isn't true. Like it or not, MySpace is the leader in the US.

<comment><AUTHOR> I don't quite consider MySpace as a "social networking" site in the same league as Facebook or Orkut. How many people actually use MySpace for business networking? MySpace is a teen station.

<comment><USER4> If we're talking about business networking, I thought LinkedIn was the winner. MySpace and Facebook are both "social networking" in my book, Facebook even moreso, because I only friend people I actually know (However this could be just because I use it in the college context, not the business context).

I'd be interesting if there are different usage patterns based on the main use of the network. I see it as keeping in touch with my friends rather than "networking" in the business sense.</comment></comment></comment>


Show HN: coolAnalytics v2 – Privacy-centric user and error analytics - <AUTHOR> https://analytics.coollabs.io <comment><USER2> How do I self host this, or have source visible?

I ask this for every single "privacy centric" analytics provider that hits the market - if I was truly privacy centric and wish to respect my users, I would want to maintain and run this on my own infrastructure instead of exporting user data over the internet to be aggregated by someone else; they are hitting my servers in the first place already.

<comment><AUTHOR> Currently only the frontend code is open sourced.

We are thinking to provide a self-hosted option or some mixed one (you host only the database & we do the aggregation), but it is not our top priority at the moment.</comment></comment>


British Airways Points to Human Error for May Flight Outage - <AUTHOR> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-06/british-airways-points-to-human-error-for-may-flight-outage <comment><USER2> Oh come on. Is this how business people see it, just throw someone under a bus?</comment>


Supreme Court agrees to hear Microsoft challenge to i4i patent - <AUTHOR> http://www.supremecourt.gov/orders/courtorders/112910zor.pdf#page=4 [FROM OP:] The specific question the Court will decide is: "Whether the court of appeals erred in holding that Microsoft's invalidity defense must be proved by clear and convincing evidence." (From http://www.scribd.com/doc/36934612/Microsoft-i4i-Cert-Petition-patent-2010.)
For more about how cert petitions work, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Certiorari.
Hat tip: Stanford law prof Mark Lemley http://www.law.stanford.edu/directory/profile/38/ <comment><AUTHOR> [FROM OP:] The specific question the Court will decide is: "Whether the court of appeals erred in holding that Microsoft's [patent] invalidity defense must be proved by clear and convincing evidence." (From [http://www.scribd.com/doc/36934612/Microsoft-i4i-Cert- Petiti...](http://www.scribd.com/doc/36934612/Microsoft-i4i-Cert-Petition- patent-2010.))

For more on the presumption of validity in patent cases, see [http://271patent.blogspot.com/2009/08/revisiting- presumption...](http://271patent.blogspot.com/2009/08/revisiting-presumption- of-validity.html)

For more about how cert petitions work, see <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Certiorari>.

Hat tip: Stanford law prof Mark Lemley <http://www.law.stanford.edu/directory/profile/38/></comment>


Ask HN: Review My Little Venture PredictEasy – Predictive Models for Dummies - <AUTHOR> Last few weeks I am very much interested in building an interesting tool #PredictEasy which can simplify the way we see predictive models. Forget IBM Watson or any other tool which is too enterprisey in building predictive models.
What if it can be damn simple for a student or non-programmer who does his major analytics or data entry process in MS Excel. I know it might sound pretty basic but I want the base audience to try the forecast models with their day to day life. Eg: churn, sales, weather, customer segment etc.
Please check it out and let me know your feedback, you're always awesome - http://predictEasy.com <comment><USER2> A worked example would be helpful...

<comment><AUTHOR> Yes for sure. Kindly join our mailing list will be happy to update you when we make it live

[http://predicteasy.com](http://predicteasy.com)</comment></comment>


80% of US accepts that there's a human role in climate change - <AUTHOR> https://arstechnica.com/science/2019/11/most-americans-support-efforts-on-climate-change-want-more-renewables/ <comment><USER2> How does one extrapolate 80?</comment>


Ask HN: How to become a Googler without collage degree - <AUTHOR> whether if i've finished The Coursera courses and Udacity's courses? <comment><USER2> Start a company and get bought, or redefine the problem. Would you consider working a non technjcal role there, or at a company that is similar to Google?</comment>