Disney loses bid to stop Redbox from selling its digital download codes - <AUTHOR> https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/21/17036932/disney-redbox-lawsuit-star-wars-marvel-pixar-digital-downloads <comment><USER2> > _But in a Tuesday ruling, US District Judge Dean D. Pregerson denied the > studio's request for an injunction, arguing that the warning that "Codes are > not for sale or transfer" on the DVD and Blu-ray packaging did not > constitute a binding contract. Furthermore, he wrote that the licensing > agreements that Disney utilizes on the Movies Anywhere and > RedeemDigitalMovie websites improperly forced consumers to give up some of > their basic ownership rights._

Well now. That's quite a nice result. I wonder how well this will extend into other "basic ownership rights" in other digital fields.

<comment><USER3> I wonder how this affects textbooks that require codes to access online content required for the course.

<comment> ng-user Or food products that contain a label "Not for resale"... I know a lot of Costco products have this because they sell large quantities, but how is that actually enforced?

<comment><USER4> Isn't it just the lack of a UPC/barcode?

<comment><USER5> I think it is more of an issue with individually sold items must have ingredients and nutritional info.

<comment><USER6> Right. From what I remember the language on most foods says "This item is not labeled for individual sale," or words to that effect.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> And here's the full ruling, since (as usual for news sites) The Verge didn't bother to attach a copy:

[https://drop.qoid.us/031127591204.pdf](https://drop.qoid.us/031127591204.pdf)

edit: actually, The Verge's article links to a Hollywood Reporter article as its source, which does have a copy. So I should have looked harder. Still...

<comment><USER8> Slightly off-topic but The Verge hasn't been thorough for years.. Unfortunate since at the very beginning I thought they knew what they were doing.

Thanks for linking that, comex.

<comment><USER9> I thought that for a long time too but recently I've been impressed by their research articles, like: [https://www.theverge.com/2017/10/10/16447264/prison- hacker-r...](https://www.theverge.com/2017/10/10/16447264/prison-hacker- recycled-computer-fraud-ohio-marion-transkiy) [https://www.theverge.com/2017/6/13/15782200/one-device- secre...](https://www.theverge.com/2017/6/13/15782200/one-device-secret- history-iphone-brian-merchant-book-excerpt)

And their coverage of the Waymo lawsuit was great too. I think they just have a few subpar writers.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> Disney only lost the preliminary injunction. Redbox can continue to sell codes pending the completion of the full trial (plus appeals, if Disney loses).

<comment><USER11> This case will go on until Redbox goes bankrupt, settles, or is bought by Disney.

Lords, even IBM vs SCO is still going strong. Huge cases like this just never really end, a curious feature of the US legal system.

<comment><USER12> It's only a failure if you're not a lawyer.

<comment><USER13> The legal system was designed by lawyers. Obviously it works for them.

<comment><USER14> If there's one lawyer in town, they drive a Chevrolet. If there are two lawyers in town, they both drive Cadillacs.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> There's the downside to litigation like this. Loads of people who've never heard of RedBox (like me), now do and have a cheap alternative for Disney movies.

<comment><USER16> Wow I'm surprised that you didn't know about RedBox.

I have seen their kiosks in almost every major supermarket for years.

<comment><USER15> I'm not from the states :) (.nl here)

<comment><USER16> Ohh! Gotcha. That makes sense.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> Tried to visit redbox.com, but get an access denied: [https://imgur.com/a/QoVUJ](https://imgur.com/a/QoVUJ)

> Access Denied You don't have permission to access > "[http://www.redbox.com/"](http://www.redbox.com/") on this server. > Reference #18.18a9645f.1519288990.4e3b07

<comment><USER17> I think it's because you are probably visiting the site not from US, because I'm not from US too, and was never able to visit redbox.com since the first time I read about this dispute with Disney.

<comment><USER18> Exactly. It's the basic Akamai error for: Your IP range are blacklisted, and it's probably because you are visiting from outside of US.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> So how does RedBox actually sell the code for such a discount and make profit? Is it because when they buy the physical copy they essentially get two copies? (One physical and one digital) and then they rent the physical one and make profit from that?

<comment><USER20> Let's assume redbox buys a single bluray for $20, and there's rental demand for each movie for 1 year. If variable cost = $1/physical disc per month, then redbox profit per disc would be something like:

P = (# of rentals * $1) - $32

where $32 = the $20 disc cost + monthly var cost

If redbox rents the movie once per week, their per disc annual profit is $20

But, if redbox can now sell the virtual download code for $8 online (essentially $0 variable cost for holding digital inventory), and digital sales has little impact on physical rentals, then the equation would be:

P = (# of rentals * $1) - $32 + $8

With annual profit per disc in the 1x/wk rental case now $28, or a 40% gross margin increase. All #s are just napkin math/assumptions, but it's easy to see the benefit here for redbox.

<comment><USER21> The license on the Bluray and DVDs that RedBox buys (Rental Licensed) typically require paying out royalties from the rental fee. As with all royalties, these are negotiated, but I have heard from people who ran their own DVD rental store fronts (when that was still a thing) that they could be as much as $5 per rental on.

Also the disk is usually a LOT more expensive (up to $100 for a new blockbuster release). DVD store fronts were already so low margin, it didn't take much disruption before they started to go under.

<comment><USER17> I was under impression that those direct deals with distributors are better deals for RedBox than buying discs in retail. Because if they don't get a good deal, they can always buy discs in retail for $20-ish something, and have no restrictions on renting or resaling them, and with no royalties or fees, because of "first sale doctrine".

<comment><USER22> Yes, but then they only get them once they are on general retail sale, and so don't get the newest (to-rental) movies. They pay more when they have an agreement, but the theory is they make it back from increased rentals (because people can't just buy themselves a copy at the supermarket, and enough people are lazy enough to spend a bit more so they don't have to return it).

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER23> My initial response was that Disney should have won this. It seems to me that Disney gets to control the distribution of it's copyrighted materials. They bundle a physical and digital version of the movie. So, 1 purchase = 1 "household" can watch the media privately.

What Redbox is doing is constituting 1 purchase = 2 households can watch the media privately (the renter of the DVD and the purchaser of the code).

I'm not an expert on the First Sale Doctrine, but it seems like the end result is that Disney would sell fewer copies of it's content (i.e. damages) in respect to RedBox's actions.

(not a lawyer)

<comment><USER24> When you purchase something you have the right to resell it. You aren't purchasing a license, you are purchasing an item, in this case two items: a DVD and a Digital Copy. So just like if I buy a living room set I can now sell the couch and the chair separately.

Disney wants to treat the sticker as a legal license. I too, am not a lawyer, but I think they are on shaky ground.

<comment><USER25> I'm also not a lawyer. But, isn't digital ownership more complex than that (if they were to have a better contract)? I don't think you can re-sell your iTunes library or transfer it to a friend.

Though, I'll agree that you _should_ be able to transfer digital goods. Audible supports this for example.

<comment><USER26> I think the key point here is that Redbox did _not_ buy a digital license from Disney. They bought a box with a DVD and a piece of paper with a code that can be redeemed for a digital license. They rent out the DVD and sell the piece of paper. Both of these are allowed under the first sale doctrine. Disney tried to tack on additional conditions to using the code on the piece of paper which the judge called "improper leveraging of Disney's copyright in the digital content to restrict secondary transfers of physical copies".

<comment><USER25> That's a good point. When I was reading about this, I didn't put too much stock in the fact that the code was on a piece of paper in the box. But, it seems that this is a very narrow ruling based on that fact.

Once someone redeems the code, they presumably have to have a Disney account and agree to some kind of terms of service.

<comment><USER17> And these Disney's digital copy's redemption "terms of service" _is_ the subject of judge's ruling. Because those terms force consumers to acknowledge, that they own the physical copy, which means that these terms put restrictions on the resale of physical copy (i.e. basically forbids reselling), and it's not ok for the judge.

<comment><USER25> I get that this ruling is focused on the piece of paper before it's redeemed and it's really good that a sticker isn't enough to limit your ability to resell something.

I'm wondering about after someone has redeemed the code. Once someone redeems the code, they presumably have to sign up for an account and agree to a long terms of service, which is (to my understanding) more accepted as a contract. It seems like this ruling doesn't significantly advance the issue of digital ownership.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER27> Looking at Redbox's website, it looks like you have to buy a physical thing containing the code and pick it up at the box. I assume directly telling you the code digitally would be more legally troubling.

<comment><USER28> They shuck thousands of videos bought at hundreds box stores. It's just faster and easier to put the code slip in the machine the same time as the disc rather than type all the codes by hand and maybe get it wrong.

Bonus points for that slip having redemption instructions.

</comment></comment><comment><USER29> > _The case results from Redbox's lack of an existing business arrangement > with Disney. The rental service has distribution deals in place with major > studios like Warner Bros., which allow Redbox to purchase physical DVDs and > Blu-rays of popular movies that it then offers for rental at its standalone > kiosks. Disney has struck no such deal, so Redbox purchases retail copies of > the films and rents those discs, instead._

That's basically what VidAngel did -- a physical retail copy for each simultaneous rental -- but the courts shut VidAngel down.

<comment><USER30> No, it's not what VidAngel did; VidAngel bought and ripped DVDs, Redbox buys DVDs and rents the DVDs it buys, which is unmistakably protected under the First Sale doctrine (the sale of the digital download codes that are sold with the physical media was disputed, but renting the physical media is non- controversial.)

Also, the courts didn't shut VidAngel down; VidAngel is still in operation—for a while apparently defying court orders, now using a different mechanism to achieve a similar effect, though also excluding movies from the studios which sued it.

</comment></comment><comment><USER31> Any lawyers here? This doesn't seem fair - retail copies were meant for end consumers, not for another company to hawk and rent out.

The Crux of the legal argument lies in equating Redbox to a regular end- consumer, which is inaccurate. Can any lawyers comment on this.

<comment><USER32> > retail copies were meant for end consumers, not for another company to hawk > and rent out

What's the difference? If I buy a hammer at Home Depot, is there any question that I can rent or loan it to somebody else? Why should intellectual property be any different?

<comment><USER31> Because:

1\. Hammers cannot be trivially cloned and mass ditributed digitally for free

2\. Every hammer is the same, while every new digital creation (not copy) is possibly the blood , sweat & tears of hundreds of people whose sole source of living is the creation of digital content.

HN has an aversion to DRM & paying for soft goods. I'm assuming you're a software developer. How would you like your creation to be ruthlessly copied and mass distributed, killing the potential revenues it would have brought you, and in extreme cases driving you out of business?

<comment><USER32> The Redbox thing isn't about copyright infringement as far as I can tell. That's basically what the judge said, right? If I understand it, Redbox was selling unused licenses rather than infringing copies.

You're right though that HN does have an aversion to DRM. How many movies has it successfully kept off of pirate sites?

<comment><USER31> Did you read the article. It's very much about copyright, and I suspect this will get appealed.

In my opinion, the courts have this wrong on 2 fronts:

1\. Redbox != Regular end customer, especially when the good in question contains DRM-ed digital content

2\. Redbox doesn't have the authority to sell digital content they haven't produced, just like an iTunes user doesn't have the right to sell an MP3 purchased off iTunes.

<comment><USER30> > Redbox != Regular end customer

Nothing in the decision rests on Redbox being a "regular end consumer"; it rests of first-sale, a legal doctrine which generally stands in direct opposition to the idea of "end consumer" as a role to which a seller can restrict goods.

> Redbox doesn't have the authority to sell digital content they haven't > produced

The first sale doctrine gives them the right to disassemble and resell the physical items in the box they purchase, which is what they are doing.

Even _Disney_ isn't arguing that Redbox is illegally selling digital product or violating copyright directly, instead they are claiming that Redbox is _contributing_ to infringement by the _end purchasers_ who are violating the copyright license by using a download code without owning the disk, and that Redbox is violating a purchase contract with Disney entered into by the act of purchasing the package at retail that prohibits separating the physical components notwithstanding the right of first sale.

The judge here upheld the right of first sale against that assault and also stated that the license terms Disney is asserting that end purchasers would violate are themselves an abuse of copyright, because they would prevent the exercise of the right of first sale.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER31> HN has an illogical aversion to anything DRM. This particular case is harmful to anyone producing digital good (apps, music, movies, blogs, etc).

Let's understand this really damaging verdict by using an app as an example.

1\. Disney puts out an app that can either be bought as a disk at Walmart or as a download on the app store

2\. A third party app store that doesn't have a re-seller/partner agreement with Disney buys a disk, and claims that the legal purchase of the disk now entitles it to re-distribute the app as it deems fit, including selling DIGITAL copies of the app on it's own app store.

Does this seem logical or fair to you guys?

The logical fallacy here is in equating the third-party app store to a regular end-user. Additionally, the third-party app store selling the app digitally is equivalent to Spotify streaming content it hasn't licensed under the guise of owning CDs of the said content.

This is wrong and dangerous for the digital economy. If this verdict holds, I should be able to buy MP3s off iTunes and "rent" it to whom-so-ever I want!!

<comment><USER33> I'd say the logical disconnect is the idea that we should charge for digital goods after they are already made. The costs to duplicate digital goods are so low that they should be treated as free.

<comment><USER31> No - there's ZERO logic in selling items as a function of the cost of creation or distribution. Pricing has everything to do with the VALUE it offers customers versus the cost that it takes to create it!!

<comment><USER33> That's an outdated way of thinking about goods and services, and it's why things like piracy are doing so well.

Good luck with that.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: Building a core team for open source software? - <AUTHOR>

I've got my node.js + CouchDB framework to a point where I am putting it into production.
I fundamentally want it to be open source, so it is: https://github.com/mathgladiator/win
How do I attract open source developers to build stuff with me? What steps should I do to market it? <comment><USER2> I recently started a small team on something I wanted to develop just by asking people in IRC. It's working very well. :-)

</comment><comment><USER3> Can you provide a tutorial on how a dev would use your framework?

Thanks</comment>


Grab Indonesia under fire for 'mishandling' sexual harassment report - <AUTHOR> http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2018/10/11/grab-indonesia-under-fire-for-mishandling-sexual-harassment-report.html <comment><AUTHOR> The mishandling part comes from Grab's misguided plan to make the traumatized sexual harassment victim with the sexual harasser. A commenter even said

 _" It's like you are trying to form a public opinion on this. Just report it to the police to be investigated. Don't make it look like the victim doesn't want to fix the problem."_

This is also not the first time Grab's driver has sexually harassed their passengers. From kissing, sexually testing their passengers, and more.</comment>


Ask HN: Legal and controlled involvement in Anonymous - <AUTHOR>

Unfortunately, i have way too much to lose by jumping deeply into Anonymous: houses, spouses, and kids (wait, just one spouse :). That said, there are certain aspects of their mission less mission I fully support.
How can one support their mission without taking the massive risk my kids would become homeless from my lack of pay if things go bad.
I also wonder how to deal with the 40% I see that is really good and the 60% that I see is teenage punk action.
Thoughts? <comment><USER2> IANAL

But what you're proposing sounds very dangerous to me. Do you trust that law enforcement is smart enough to recognize that your involvement is philanthropic and legal? You'll likely be working with individuals that these agencies deem to be criminal and the old saying guilty by association is still true. And if you prove your innocence, what have you spent in the process?

I actually tend to agree with you, but you should also look at the history of Anonymous ... to my eyes, it's becoming less charitable, and more destructive.

Good luck!

<comment><AUTHOR> These thoughts are, of douse, why I've kept my distance. The alternative (playing in the rules) only sees to work if you've got 10+ digit incomes. I'm trying to find the third option.

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> Most radical political supporters acknowledge that jail or prolonged detainment is likely. Heck, you can be jailed for a while for contempt if you refuse to reveal your password to encrypted containers even if you forget the password.

If you really want to go down this route, I recommend that it would be more efficient to focus on your goals and have a disaster plan (minimum of regular lawyer contact, grandparents support them, etc). It's the least you can do, since I assume your family supports your ambitions.

</comment><comment><USER4> The probably easiest way to do so is by supporting your local Chanology chapter. Ask them what they need and to provide some address where you can send the stuff. Keeps you hands clean (e.g. you won't have to reveal your identity) and even in a hypothetical worst case you just supported some anti- Scientology movement - something that won't give you any bad rep even if it would make the headline of your local newspaper.</comment>


Show HN: FlashcardBox - Flashcards on the go, using the Leitner System - <AUTHOR> http://www.flashcardbox.com/XTXa Hi guys, here is a small Node app I built that uses the leitner system (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leitner_system).
The submitted example holds the 100 questions you need to study for the U.S. Immigration Exam (for New York State).
Any feedback/ suggestions welcome :) <comment><AUTHOR> Hi guys, this is a small Node app that uses the leitner system ([http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leitner_system](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leitner_system)).

The submitted example holds the 100 questions you need to study for the U.S. Immigration Exam (for New York State).

Any feedback/ suggestions welcome :)</comment>


TJIC's advice on startups is worth exactly what you're paying for it - <AUTHOR> http://tjic.com/?p=7265

<comment><AUTHOR> Found this particular post after reading a Joes: <http://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=joe> preceding submission: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=60128>

The response from this coy founder

\- <http://heavyink.com/blog/>

\- <http://smartflix.com/store/about_us> and

\- <http://tjic.com/>

was worth reading in its own right.</comment>


Bilingual brains: Variety makes you mentally fit - <AUTHOR> http://www.economist.com/blogs/prospero/2014/10/johnson-bilingual-brains

<comment><USER2> There's also evidence that we are less susceptible to biases when given hypothetical scenarios in foreign languages. I am considering keeping my todo list in a foreign language, in case that helps me prioritize e.g. sales, where things like loss aversion might stifle it.

[http://pss.sagepub.com/content/early/2012/04/18/095679761143...](http://pss.sagepub.com/content/early/2012/04/18/0956797611432178)

<comment><USER3> I've tried that, and it does not really work. Turns out I'm just as averse to paperwork in English as I am in French.

It can also have a significant downside: I've tried maintaining a todo list in a language that I'm not very good at, only to realise that looking up highly specific vocabulary was such a chore that after a while, I'd unconsciously skip writing some entries that looked too complicated to translate.

Have a go, it might work out better for you, but this particular experiment was a failure as far as I'm concerned.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> My "nights and weekends" project for the past few years has been writing iOS language learning apps. The niche that I'm looking to fill is to create enough "games/drills" to help alleviate the incredible repetition needed to learn another language. Anyway, I'm looking for suggestions so I can find my niche in a really crowed market...

[https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/h4-spanish- lite/id388918463?...](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/h4-spanish- lite/id388918463?mt=8)

I'd really appreciate any ideas or suggestions.

<comment><USER5> As someone who spent years studying and teaching languages, my single biggest advice is to remember that _learning a language is not simply a matter of learning words_. Don't fall into the trap of throwing a dictionary full of words into an SRS and hoping for the best. Focus on input, not production.

Include phonetic training. Make the user distinguish between each minimal pair in the language, possibly even every single syllable in the language. This is simple, but rarely done.

Include an extensive reading component. This is a monumental task that could be broken into many apps or many short stories that are in app purchases.

Good luck! I'm really, really hoping to see something better than the very low bar hit by existing apps!

<comment><USER6> >Make the user distinguish between each minimal pair in the language, possibly even every single syllable in the language

I have so much trouble spelling words like definately^W definitely, because they sound the same to me ;)

<comment><USER5> Memorizing how to spell a word like "definitely" would be one of the worst possible uses of a language learner's time.

What I was suggesting was aural training—learn to distinguish words such as "his" and "he's", to hear the differences between bat, bet, bit, bot, but, bait, beet, bite, boat, and boot, etc...

Various idiosyncrasies of an orthographic system are far less important than being able to hear difference between the sounds of a language.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> I am somewhat amused by the multiple studies and articles on Bilingualism. Simply because I happen to be just one of the many pentalingual (if that's a term) people I know. My entire family speaks five languages. English, Hindi, Marathi, Kutcchi and Gujarati. Kutcchi and Gujarati are what I was born into. The rest are mandatory through school here (Mumbai, India). So anyone who went to school is at least trilingual. In fact most students are fluent in at least 3 languages by the time they are 6 or so.

If there is any good at all in being bilingual, what does it mean to be trilingual? Let alone pentalingual? Does the law of diminishing returns apply?

<comment><USER8> Aside from English, they're all closely related languages (Hindi, Marathi, Gujarati). I wouldn't really expect knowing related languages to give the same payoff as say knowing languages from different groups or families of languages.

<comment><USER7> Let's take three families of languages:

((Japanese, Mandarin, Cantonese),

(Hindi, Marathi, Gujarati),

(English, French, Italian, German, Dutch, Latin))

Are you saying that knowing one from each set is more beneficial than knowing three from any one set?

<comment><USER8> I wouldn't group them like that, English/German/Dutch are Germanic languages, while French/Italian/Latin are Romance. Japanese also a bit removed from Mandarin/Cantonese. But, yes, I would argue that knowing unrelated languages broadens ones perspective far more than knowing similar ones.

<comment><USER7> Interesting. I was looking at:

[http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/IndoEurop...](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/IndoEuropeanTree.svg)

There are subdivisions like Germanic and Romance in the language family which do seem sufficiently far apart. However, there are quite a few subdivisions that seem very closely related.

I wonder if there is a way to draw entirely new subdivisions based on benefits of knowing languages from each subdivision.

Also, intuitively, what you say about knowing unrelated languages makes sense. I am curious however, if you had some deeper insight or knowledge into why (if true) this might be?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> I wonder to what extent using several programming languages has the same effect. If the hypothesis about language switching as an inhibitory mental exercise is correct, then polyglot programming should have some of the same benefits.

<comment><USER10> I don't think it applies. Being bilingual means thinking in two different languages. I'm talking about your inner voice.

As far as I know, people don't think in Python or C. I would say that a programming language is like math. You can use it as a plugin in your language, but you still need the main program which is your language.

<comment><USER11> I might not be so much about the language but about the paradigm. Certainly going from Java to C++ might not be that different but through in something like Haskell and you almost have to entirely rethink your solution.

<comment><USER10> One thing is setting your logic to follow a certain way of thinking, and a completely different thing is the language you are using to think.

Furthermore, programming languages are written in English. A real language cannot be written in another language.

I'm not a linguist nor a programmer, but I'm trilingual, and I have scripted at a basic level. And honestly, although I see the resemblance, I don't think that programming languages and real languages work the same way.

<comment><USER12> I'm trilingual (Spanish,French,German) and program fluently in at least 3 languages (Python, Javascript, PHP). Things in common: You build an idea in the air and shoot it in the language. Happens to me a lot in German where I don't have a vocabulary as wide as Spanish on English that the brain will have to build a sentence maybe 30% longer but it will eventually bring out something that does the job. When I'm coding I just know the program needs to do certain thing. Python is very straightforward while with PHP usually I need to build some auxiliary function (same as German , not that the word doesn't exist but I don't have it in my Head at the moment). Also, very obscure concepts like "Dativ" conjugation do exist in spanish but since it looks the same as "Genitiv" and "Akkusativ" , nobody pays to much attention. However when you are speaking German you'd better understand that as you need them to correctly build a sentence of the fly. An example analogy with coding would be generic data structures like arrays in PHP but in Python are more rich like Lists, Dictionaries and Tuples(IMHO)

<comment><USER13> You're not trilingual, as you also speak English :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> I wonder if knowing (and using) a third language or even a fourth will reduce the dementia/ increase the positive effects even further.

<comment><USER15> also makes me kind of wonder if there is any benefit of only knowing one language

<comment><USER16> I dimly recall reading an article on a study that tried to compare the performance of monolingual and bilingual people. From what I remember the bilingual individuals tended to have an edge in the more complex tasks, but monolinguals were significantly faster at some basic operations like sorting lists of words or finding a word in an unsorted list.

<comment><USER17> The last part makes sense, it's similar to a game where they introduce more and more unfamiliar symbols to you as you progress to higher levels, the more unknowns you have to deal with the more you slow down. Eventually, if/when you learn them well you get most of the speed back. I guess most people learning 2nd languages don't learn them well enough to know the 2nd language really well; technically, if you know both languages equally well, the speed penalty/overhead will be minimal, similar to expanding one's vocabulary in the same language (as long as you don't exceed some threshold of mental capacity).

<comment><USER16> I'm not sure that's it. I need to preface this by saying that I'm working from really dim memories here, but from what I recall they were using a definition of 'bilingual' that people who learn a second language after a certain age don't fit, and the tested bilinguals should feel at home in both languages.

Rather, it seems that having more than one language active in the brain concurrently (which requires them to be similarly well developed and in regular use) requires the brain to do more active selection work. I'm not sure this actually makes sense or is just my reading of it, but basically it can't jump to one thing immediately, but has to eliminate the alternatives first. This gives the bilingual brain an edge in tasks that benefit from being well- trained to do that step (and seems to help stave off dementia, where inhibitory control goes out the window, which is a necessity for this selection process to happen), but slows it down in other tasks that would benefit from not having to do the extra work.

In other words, if you're asked to sort or bin a list of English words, it seems to help if your brain doesn't have to wade through a soup made of multiple languages. But if you're asked to do something that exercises similar muscles as wading through this kind of soup (maybe "process strained analogies"? - I kid), it gives you a different sort of edge.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> I want to be careful about these sort of research. Too many times I've seen these kind of "research" is often funded by commercial entities that teach foreign languages. It's like what PG had described in his "Submarine" essay.

There is a big industry to teach foreign languages to toddlers and even new born. There is quite a bit of reputable research to back up positive effects however no one seems to be doing research on if there are any negative effects. This is like every research starts with a hypothesis like there are either positive effects or nothing . But on the other hand there are proven facts that toddlers/babies learn only certain number of words in a given period. This implies kids at that age have limited capacity to memorize and recall things. So wouldn't that imply that bilingual training at that age would halve that capacity? Could bilingual babies have less volculbary in each language and late start in figuring out deeper nitty gritty of grammar? Is it possible that bilingual training at early age exchanges depth for a breadth?

<comment><USER19> What you say about research being partially corrupted by agendas is generally true and applies to pretty much every area of science to varying degrees.

The claim that second language acquisition is defined solely by this is, however completely false. It is a large and well-researched academic discipline and there exists plenty of research regarding negative effects. Here is a pretty decent summary, with a very compact abstract:

Bilingualism: The good, the bad, and the indifferent

[http://www.yumingschool.org/wp- content/uploads/2011/07/Bilin...](http://www.yumingschool.org/wp- content/uploads/2011/07/Bilingualism.-The-good-the-bad-and-the- indifferent.pdf)

> The present paper summarizes research showing that bilingualism affects > linguistic and cognitive performance across the lifespan. The effect on > linguistic performance is generally seen as a deficit in which bilingual > children control a smaller vocabulary than their monolingual peers and > bilingual adults perform more poorly on rapid lexical retrieval tasks. The > effect on cognitive performance is to enhance executive functioning and to > protect against the decline of executive control in aging. These effects > interact to produce a complex pattern regarding the effect of bilingualism > on memory performance. Memory tasks based primarily on verbal recall are > performed more poorly by bilinguals but memory tasks based primarily on > executive control are performed better by bilinguals. Speculations regarding > the mechanism responsible for these effects are described.

</comment></comment><comment><USER20> Anedoctal evidence:

I'm 37, italian, always been good at speaking english (since I was 7).

In the past few years, my command of english improved so much that I started forgetting words both in italian _and_ in english. /facepalm

<comment><USER21> Ha, I'm English and I've been living in Italy for two years (so my Italian is still not exactly incredible) and I'm starting to find the same! I wonder if this happens because the two languages can be very similar at times and at other times very different. Would things be a lot different if I were learning, for example, Japanese I wonder?

</comment></comment><comment><USER22> I've been around a lot of people who were raised bilingual in English and an oriental language and most of them complained that it was too hard. They felt that at the high school and college level it's not possible to fully develop advanced vocabulary and usage in both languages. You can risk coming across as non-native or stupid in both languages. I think a lot of this stuff about bilingualism is biased toward people learning two related indo-european languages, which isn't that hard.

<comment><USER23> Perhaps it depends on the languages. I was raised in English; French was added starting at 5. Today, at 49, I am fluently and idiomatically bilingual in English, French, and various idiomatic variations on both common to the provinces in which I've lived (I can switch from stock-standard English to various idiomatic dialects and accents, as many of you can, e.g., formal English Vs the street or town English you spoke growing up, from those used here in Ontario to lilting dialects and accents of Nova Scotia; I can do the same with a few Quebec Joual dialects.)

With a couple of days in Paris, I am taken for a native. Same thing in New Orleans or Chicago (I have to be very careful about not drifting into local accents, I just sort of go there.)

So it is possible to be perfectly bilingual - but it requires early exposure to the second language and an ear (which can be developed - you have to stop listening to specifics, to particulars, and listen holistically, letting the language flow over you so that you understand the intent without understanding individual words - practice that for a while, and the words come).

I also speak passable remedial Spanish and have learned and forgotten a whole lot of Turkish, Arabic, German, and Greek.

After a while, your inner voice switches to non-linguistic (which I think might mean it returns to what it was before you had language, i.e., as a child). I used to think mostly in English, but nowadays I think in, well, viscera. I then have to find the words that most closely match the viscera. For simple things, that happens quickly. For complex things or subtle differences, it can take time, during which I sputter.

About 6 months ago I ask a friend's daughter whether this had happened to her yet (she was raised in French, added English much later, then some Spanish, and finally did intensive German prior to heading o'er the pond for her M.Eng).

Her eyes went wide and she shrieked "OUI! OUI! Exactement!" She turned to her mother: "M'man! Il comprend exactement qu'est ce qui m'arrive!"

(Yes, yes, exactly! Mom! He understands exactly what is happening to me!)

She'd been going through the same thing and didn't know it had ever happened to anyone else.

It's a truly strange thing, mind blowing - and mind expanding.

Sometimes, I can sort of disconnect from language. It frees my mind in a most powerful way. It's tricky to get there, though, and sometimes even harder to get back.

<comment><USER24> I don't think this has anything to do with learning languages. This kind of processing is also very common among mathematicians, physicists and programmers. More generally it is probably more common than you think especially among people whose default mode of thinking is not linguistic.</comment></comment></comment>


India's iconic Ambassador car brand is sold to Peugeot - happy-go-lucky http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-38945674 <comment><USER2> It's funny and coincidental that many years ago Peugot ran this ad: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcVyz- fZIzg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcVyz-fZIzg)

The car that is being molded is Ambassador

<comment><USER3> The news also instantly reminded me of this ad.

<comment><USER4> I know which ad you're referring to. Don't have to click this link, it was a catchy one!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> > The handbrake rarely worked properly - <AUTHOR>

> spawning a generation of drivers that could easily

> do hill starts deftly balancing the accelerator and brake

That'd be me. When I bought my Mitsubishi Lancer Hatchback with manual transmission in the US, having a working handbrake was a jarring experience. My friends spent a lot of time helping me break my habit of using gas and brake pedals for keeping the car balanced up hill - I can still do it well.

I'd like to note that this feature wasn't exclusively limited to Ambassadors, my dad owned a Maruti 800[1], and a Fiat Padmini[2], neither of those had working handbrakes AND my dad managed to install aftermarket LGP kit in former and a datsun diesel engine in latter. Both modifications made it an interesting driving experience. These days when I'm driving my automatic transmission car on a freeway with no potholes, cows, I do get some flashbacks of driving in pouring rain with water creeping up from floor and being scared out of my wits.

[1] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maruti_800](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maruti_800)

[2] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Premier_Padmini](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Premier_Padmini)

<comment><USER6> > That'd be me. When I bought my Mitsubishi Lancer Hatchback with manual > transmission in the US, having a working handbrake was a jarring experience. > My friends spent a lot of time helping me break my habit of using gas and > brake pedals for keeping the car balanced up hill - I can still do it well.

You mean people actually use the handbrake for hill starts with a manual? I thought it was just something you do when first learning. I've always found it more difficult to coordinate everything with the handbrake, I can operate all the pedals quick enough anyway. The only time I use the handbrake really is for sliding around :-)

<comment><USER7> With modern, powerful cars, using the handbrake really is unnecessary. However until recently many European cars had only a handful of HP and incredibly low torque compared to modern diesels... Citroën 2CV: 12 to 21 HP DIN. VW Beetle: 34 to 50 HP. Even a "sport" car like a Golf GTI was 110 HP only in the 80s. The torque was also much lower.

<comment><USER6> Guess it makes sense. Every manual I've used has been relatively quite powerful.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> I'm really impressed with the new Peugot 3008 i-Cockpit system [[https://youtu.be/5UapzN65V7Q?t=1m16s](https://youtu.be/5UapzN65V7Q?t=1m16s)] and the general interior design. IMHO way ahead of the competition.

This is a really surprising development! The Peugeot leadership seems to be unafraid to think different, and I think great things are in store for the Ambassador brand. It was totally neglected for decades.

<comment><USER9> I've tested the new Peugeot 508 and 307 and they had horrible infotainment software - slow, buggy and very illogical (some settings couldn't be controled from steering wheel, some settings were only available on the screen on the dashboard, etc.)

The fact that 307 got rid of climate control buttons and only had the settings on the laggy touchscreen was even worse.

Did 3008 really improve that much in this regard?

<comment><USER3> 307 isn't particularly new, though. Production ended in 2007 (except in South America and China).

I agree that putting controls behind a touch screen is not nice. Especially in the winter where I live, they're impossible - they don't work in the cold, with gloves.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> The Ambassador is based on the Morris Oxford, a British car from the 1950s, and I am fascinated that they never felt any pressure to update the design (although if I recall correctly in the early 2000s they replaced the original British Motor Company 1.5L with an Isuzu 1.6L).

<comment><USER3> In a planned, protectionist economy, without competition, there was little need to develop or improve.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> > the Ambassador was for three decades India's bestselling car

That's because there were no other manufacturers.

<comment><USER12> I was going to ask that. 20k sales per year in a country with 1b people seems really low.

<comment> happy-go-lucky It was so low because of the per capita income that was equally low, and looking into reasons for such a disproportion would lead to a wide-ranging discussion.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> I wonder if any of that $12 million will go to paying out the workers who were left stranded by the company? If the linked story ([http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia- india-36044903](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-36044903)) is anything to go by, the employees got severely screwed when the plant shut down.

<comment><USER14> >the employees got severely screwed when the plant shut down.

Isn't that the case everywhere? Why do these workers in particular deserve 'pay outs'?

These workers seemed to have got screwed by the globalisation like people from soviet union who had no idea how to make sense of the new world where govt is not resposible to provide you with a job anymore.

<comment><USER13> Well there's this guy:

> Nirmal Kumar Ram, who worked at the factory's engine plant, says he has not > yet left his job because Hindustan Motors has still not told workers that > they were fired.

Instead of communicating with the employees they just kind of forgot about them.

And this guy:

> "Even before production stopped, I didn't get my salary for six months."

The company wasn't paying the employees, of course it's impossible to know what was said but you wouldn't think that he'd be waiting around for six months unpaid if they weren't telling him it was coming.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> I remember riding in this vehicle and feeling the number of things that went wrong in their construction. Honestly its hard to extricate such a POS car from my memories in India.

</comment><comment><USER16> To what degree did India mortgage its industrial future in its protectionist era?

<comment><USER17> Take a guess. China, India had similar GDP per-capita figures in late 70s (Korea was poorer at one point). India never suffered from war and dictatorial madness like Korea and China, yet today India has < 1/5 GDP of China, and about ~< 2x the GDP of S.Korea (with 10-20x the population).

All this for what ? Some anti-colonial revolution ? Nope. India has almost completely ignored everything Indian, if not actively tried to destroy its traditions/languages/cultures and has ran after who ever would care to smooch over its "elite". India is as much a British colony today (if not more) than it ever was.

<comment><USER18> Not sure if it is fair to compare India and China/Korea. I don't know much about the history of China and Korea, but I doubt if both those countries faced full scale colonialism like India did. Recovering from the devastation caused by 200+ years of colonial rule takes a while.

S.Korea particularity benefitted from the Korean war. USA stepped in and boosted it's economy.

<comment><USER16> > _I don 't know much about the history of China and Korea...I doubt if both > those countries faced full scale colonialism like India_

China had a _much_ harder time through the colonial era than India. Remember, China spent decades being traded between warring imperial powers (France vs. Britain, Britain vs. Japan, Japan vs. the Soviets, _et cetera_ ). In that process, its institutions were wrecked and cultural memory wreaked havoc with. When all was said and done, they had no equivalent to India's nation-spanning railroad system; systems of law, governance and courts; or (relatively) unified linguistic bloc.

<comment><USER3> I tend to disagree slightly, though I don't see why you're downvoted (I don't think you should downvote a civilly written comment just because you disagree).

China was subject to colonialism, but not in the same way as India; it was never fully controlled by colonial masters like the British controlled India. There were colonial enclaves and much of humiliation with being forced to hand over areas for trade posts; there were the opium wars and later there was the Japanese expansion and imperialism, but the deep Chinese countryside was always managed by the Chinese for the Chinese.

And there were decades of unrest and civil war. But still, I don't see how China was suffering from colonialism more than India.

They both had their hardest times in their early independence after colonial times. China with civil war, Great Leap Forward, Cultural revolution; India with jumping to the Soviet boat, socialism, planned economy and protectionism.

Korea, on the other hand, has throughout its history been a smaller nation which bigger neighbours try to run over. Sometimes - like in the case of Japan in earlier half of 20th century - it has indeed been completely overrun for decades. So, to survive, it has become fiercely nationalistic. But Korea also definitely faced absolute full scale colonialism, in my opinion in much more depth than India.

<comment><USER19> But China suffered from warlords and persistent low level violence for the first half of the 20th century

<comment><USER3> Definitely, but that was not colonialism. The warlords were Chinese; the power bases for these warlords were built during the late Qing dynasty. They of course had some Western influences (one even proclaimed himself Christian, another announced he was admirer of George Washington) but primarily they were just Chinese men of power, with short-term visions that were ultimately defeated by determined nationalists.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> there is a lot of manufacturing taking place in India by very large brands and some of it for export. Motorcycles and such are being built there for export by brands even as iconic as BMW and Harley Davidson.

So buying up an already established brand is probably cheaper than building the factory (new construction, bribes, etc) to get manufacturing capacity where labor is cheap

<comment><USER3> This is a good point. If you want to access the Indian market, your problem probably isn't building a plant, or finding competent labour, or buying materials or logistics. It is the licenses and permissions to operate, and the relations to government officials. And if you can purchase an existing outfit that has at least some of the needed licenses and permissions and has some existing government contacts, contracts and agreements, then it is easier to ramp up business.

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> Ambassador and Maruti are very popular Indian cars . Ambassador being the car used by almost all government officials .

</comment><comment><USER22> I don't get it. What is the point of this purchase?

</comment><comment><USER23> So what? Tata Motors owns Jaguar, Fiat owns Jeep, BMW owns the Mini, I don't see anything interesting here...

</comment><comment><USER17> Has Peugeot lost its mind ? This is like buying the brand name of TVS XL 100 or Kinetic Luna. The French must be drunk over after the Dassault rip-off they pulled off.

<comment><USER24> For $12m it seems like a bargain.</comment></comment>


Helium shortage has ended, at least for now - <AUTHOR> https://physicstoday.scitation.org/do/10.1063/PT.6.2.20200605a/full/ <comment><USER2> >> a Colorado State University chemist who orders a 60-liter dewar every 8–13 weeks to fill his 8-tesla superconducting magnet.

So... absolutely no recapture of this used helium? I wouldn't be throwing stones at party balloons. Seriously, the concept of helium as a _disposable_ gas is the root of the entire price problem. _Hopefully_ the price will rise to the point that capture and recycling become more cost effective.

>>A new, $110 000 liquefier at the University of Idaho is expected to recycle most of the helium needed for three NMR magnets, an electron paramagnetic resonance magnet, and a Mössbauer spectrometer, says Blumenfeld. As an added benefit, the new machine will enable the university to purchase its helium in gaseous form instead of liquid, for a substantial cost savings, he says.

110K? That is dirt cheap for nearly any industrial process. Industrial baking ovens can cost more. Why are such things not standard with every device needing substantial amounts of helium.

<comment><USER3> $100K is a lot of money for some experimental low temperature labs. The other issue is that vibrations from compressor units can interfere with sensitive experiments like scanning tunneling microscopy. Helium is expensive enough as it is that I think most labs would like to recycle it, but there are drawbacks.

<comment><USER4> If helium is a precious resource (it is), we should use federal dollars to incentive better management and recycling of it by academic and research users. Very similar to how we incentivize energy efficiency with grants and tax policy.

<comment><USER5> The price of helium should be the incentive.

<comment><USER4> It should be, but the market is distorted :/

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> There has never been a helium shortage. It's just more costly than scientists would prefer. If they were willing to pay even more, massive more amounts would be available.

<comment><USER7> "Recurrent helium shortages and high prices have led some academic researchers to install liquefiers to recycle helium that boils off from their instruments."

Yeah, it can't have been a real shortage if they were just letting it boil away.

<comment><USER8> Similarly, I've heard of HVAC systems that just use city water for cooling. It comes in cold, dump heat into it and let it run down the drain.

Running like that all the time seems unconscionable, but it makes a lot of sense as a backup while the primary is down for repair, as a very cheap-to- install but wasteful-to-run system that would be appropriate for short durations only.

<comment><USER9> Airconditioning is still a luxury to the world. Not sure running clean, treated drinking water down the drain for comfort is ever worth it.

<comment><USER10> There are plenty of hot places with enough fresh water supplies that trying to conserve water is of dubious value.

The problem with fresh water isn't the overall supply of fresh water. It's getting it to communities that need it, when they need it, and distributing it without contaminating it.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> And it'll improve. There was a helium find with absolutely insane natural concentrations in South Africa recently.

>Helium is found within natural gas in concentrations typically up to 1% by volume of the gas released; however, the updated reserve review shows that the latest well drilled in the Virgina project contains a concentration of almost 11%.

[https://m.miningweekly.com/article/south-africa-to-become- ei...](https://m.miningweekly.com/article/south-africa-to-become-eighth- country-to-export-helium-by-2019-renergen-2018-03-12)

<comment><USER12> But if this reserve is 6-25 billion cubic feet, that's probably just a drop in the bucket as annual global production is 15-20 billion cubic feet and US reserves are over 700 billion cubic feet.

<comment><USER13> If you are discussing US natural gas reserves, PUDs are three orders of magnitude higher at over 700Tcf. Going beyond this, some estimates put unproven unconventional supplies at over 700Tcf in-place in the Anadarko basin alone. Considering we haven't really been hell bent on hunting for gas in the last decade, the true extent of the supply may be radically larger still.

Helium is abundant; it's prices simply haven't ever stayed high enough to warrant wider extraction from the gas supply. The last time we did that we produced the strategic helium reserve which has basically fed our consumption for 60 years!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> If you're old enough, you might have noticed a pattern.

1\. BIG NEWS: Resource X is running out!

2\. Years later: BIG NEWS: Resource X is miraculously not running out!

I'm _not_ saying that always happens and nothing ever runs out. But it's common enough that I put these in the "I'll believe it when I see it" file.

No one ever sold a paper or a click on a "THINGS ARE PROBABLY OK!" headline.

<comment><USER15> If the boy cries wolf, but nobody else sees it, how do you decide if the boy was mistaken/lied or if the act of the entire town waking up scared the wolf away?

<comment><USER15> To expand on this, it's tempting to dismiss those warning of doom and gloom when you start to notice a pattern of the doom never materializing.

But we should also be aware of the possibility that those warning of doom and gloom activate people's minds to severity and risk of the problem. Because more people are aware and paying attention, we collectively take action to mitigate the risk and the worst case never happens.

A great example is our response to a pandemic. The response that creates the least amount of damage might look like a major over-reaction and people will start to question those who raised alarm with such intensity.

How do we deal with this meta problem?

<comment><USER14> "Why are you dieting? You're not fat!"

...is a version of this fallacy. Rationalists probably have a name for it.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> This might be painful for scientists to hear but they actually _need_ helium prices to rise (No pun intended). It's the best way to make sure the substance isn't wasted.

</comment><comment><USER17> Once humanity is able to fuse hydrogen atoms into helium, we'll have more helium than we'll know what to do with.

Also, why is everyone measuring helium in volume (litres, cubic feet)? This is highly dependent on temperature and pressure. Why not state quantities in terms of mass?

<comment><USER18> > Also, why is everyone measuring helium in volume (litres, cubic feet)? This > is highly dependent on temperature and pressure. Why not state quantities in > terms of mass?

This problem appears way more often than I'd like. In measuring gas flow through valves there's a quantity called "standard cubic feet per minute". The only problem is that there is no uniformly agreed upon standard reference temperature and pressure!

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_cubic_feet_per_minute](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_cubic_feet_per_minute)

It's even worse than described on Wikipedia, as I've found at least one valve manufacturer claims that the reference pressure is the pressure they used upstream of the valve, not something near atmospheric as Wikipedia claims is typical: [http://btrettel.nerfers.com/archives/72](http://btrettel.nerfers.com/archives/72)

Whenever I get a valve I either have to do my own flow tests or call the manufacturer and hope I get someone who knows a thing or two about their testing procedures.

As you said, the entire issue can be avoided by simply specifying mass or moles. I don't quite know why people don't do this, but I suppose it speaks to the power of tradition. Far too few people think about if what they are doing makes sense.

<comment><USER19> The number of moles in a liter of liquid helium is essentially constant over the temperature range of the liquid state. LH is bought by the liter.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> I'm wondering what's the effect of helium-filled hard drive causes on the demand?

</comment><comment><USER21> Fun fact, if you've ever driven from Texas to Colorado, you'll pass the largest Helium producing plant in the US just a few miles north of Amarillo, TX - on, aptly named Helium Plant Road.

When the whole shortage made the news, I had heard that the plant was for sale, and I actually talked with my wife and joked that we could buy the plant and corner a significant portion of the Helium market. LOL! I thought it would be pretty cool to own a significant part of the production of a single element.

</comment><comment><USER22> Still super expensive though! I guess at least it's available again. I remember doing some liquid helium experiments in class in college just as the helium crunch started. The department didn't seem very happy suddenly having to spend hundreds of dollars extra just to let some undergrads play with it. I wonder if they discontinued that particular experiment.

</comment><comment><USER23> I'm glad the conversation has evolved from "we're running out of helium".

We're only running out of helium if we've quit extracting fossil fuels.

Helium is a byproduct of extraction, and is most commonly vented into the atmosphere because it's not commercially viable to process it due to its low price.

</comment><comment><USER24> Awesome, one of the costs of sattelites should get cheaper now.

</comment><comment><USER25> > "some producers have recently been injecting helium into the reserve's > underground dome"

This would be an interesting facility to see photos of.

</comment><comment><USER26> what's the cheapest gas I can buy for Tig welding shielding as a hobbyist on razor thin budget?

<comment><USER27> Nitrogen or CO₂. But you will not be happy with it, there is a reason more expensive mixtures are preferred. Also, the required protective gear against the NOx and added postprocessing of your workpiece more than make up for the gas price...

The cheapest way overall is actually the commonly used Argon. Its just not cheapest if you just stare at the price of the gas alone.

<comment><USER16> Interesting. It is the third most abundant gas in the atmosphere,; more than water vapor and carbon dioxide actually according to Wikipedia. It is produced via fractional distillation. We really should be using this stuff instead of helium where possible. I'm guessing it's density makes it more of a renewable resource than helium.

<comment><USER27> We do use it where possible. But at higher temperature like for welding, Nitrogen is no longer inert. And liquid nitrogen is too warm for the things you need liquid Helium for. Other alternatives are usually even more expensive or dangerous. You would never use liquid O₂ for cooling if you can avoid it...

<comment><USER27> Ah, maybe you meant CO₂, it is similar to N₂ in all those aspects. Just even more reactive, warmer in liquid form than even nitrogen. And in addition never liquid at atmospheric pressure and actively poisonous to humans. So usually worse than N₂.

There are just a few applications where its used that I know of: Dry ice, environment-friendly coolant, sparkling drinks and killing lifestock.

<comment><USER28> Actually, I'm pretty sure exabrial was referring to argon.

<comment><USER16> Yes I was referring to argon. Rereading my comment made more sense in my head.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER29> If this work is important to the US, they should tax recreational use of helium to drive demand down.

<comment><USER30> Would that actually accomplish anything? As far as I'm aware, welders and divers use many times more helium than clowns.

<comment><USER31> It's so much easier to point and look down on someone else for their supposedly wasteful behavior though!

<comment><USER32> It's so much easier to point and look down on CLOWNS!!!

<comment><USER33> So is the helium shortage the origin of the sad clowns in The Sims?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER34> Do people not realize that you can extract helium in the air? Granted current methods are somewhat inefficient, it's totally possible to do with today's technology.

<comment><USER35> I'm totally ignorant, but I thought helium atoms rose to the top of the atmosphere any flew away.

<comment><USER36> no you're right, it's not economically feasible to "extract" helium from air and it does rise.

<comment><USER37> According to a quick Google, it's in the air at a concentration of 5ppm. For loose comparison sake, this is like pumping out an Olympic sized swimming pool to extract 10 litres of the good stuff. You certainly won't be doing that to fill children's balloons.

<comment><USER38> > this is like pumping out an Olympic sized swimming pool to extract 10 litres > of the good stuff

Sounds line gold mining... I'm sure they'd do it if needed for scientific purposes... or if they discover some health benefits to heliumtalk

<comment><USER39> Note that the price of gold is much higher than the price of helium.

If helium prices rise high enough, then yes, we will extract it from the atmosphere. And scientists will be sad because the they won't be able to afford as much of it anymore.

<comment><USER38> It might be a lot cheaper to filter one cubic meter of air then it is one cubic meter of dirt... But either way, one day it could happen</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Douglas Engelbart's Unfinished Revolution - <AUTHOR> http://www.technologyreview.com/news/517341/douglas-engelbarts-unfinished-revolution/

<comment><USER2> One thing that I haven't seen mentioned in any of these sources is that the grants that funded Engelbart during that one decade that he worked on the Mother of All Demos were approved by Bob Taylor (who later founded Xerox PARC and then the DEC Systems Research Center).

To anyone who hasn't read it, I very much recommend the "oral history" interview Taylor did with Paul McJones at the Computer History Museum in 2008. The whole thing is fascinating and full of amazing stories.

[http://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/text/Oral_Histo...](http://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/text/Oral_History/Taylor_Robert/102702015.05.01.acc.pdf)

The relevant excerpt:

McJones: Did you work for two different companies between teaching and going to NASA or just one company?

Taylor: Two. I was at Martin for about a year, I guess, Martin Orlando. And one of my colleagues there had gone to work for a flight simulation firm in Riverdale, Maryland just outside of D.C. They were called ACF Electronics. They built a wider variety of flight simulators than any other company in the country. They made me an attractive job offer and we moved up there and I went to work for them. While I was there, McNamara, who was with Kennedy, who had just been elected president, was Secretary of Defense, standardized or attempted to standardize many of the aircraft across the Navy and the Air Force. Consequently, a company that based its reputation on building a wide variety of flight simulators was no longer quite so important because we were not going to have as wide a variety of airplanes. So ACF had been looking for other things to do and NASA was just opening up. I was encouraged to write a research proposal to NASA using flight simulators, but in a research context rather than in a teaching context. For example, one of the flight simulators that the company built was an anti-submarine warfare airplane flight simulator where you could simulate all of the stations in the airplane that were monitoring various sensor devices that were looking for submarines. There was a lot of display technology to fool around with and things that NASA was interested in. So I wrote this research proposal and sent it in. NASA called me and asked me to come down and talk to them. I thought they wanted to talk about the research proposal. And instead, they offered me a job in their newly-formed office of advanced research and technology. The job of this part of NASA was to fund the NASA research centers and also fund limited research in limited areas in private industry, and sometimes universities. Then they put me in charge of two research areas to manage the funding that went into these areas, whether it was the NASA center or in the private world. The areas were manned flight control systems and flight displays. While I was there I created another area called simulation technology. So I managed research in those three areas while I was at NASA. One of the unsolicited proposals that came in was from a guy named [Douglas C.] Engelbart at SRI.3 I thought it was an interesting proposal and he came into D.C. on his round of looking for money, and we talked. I funded his proposal and the mouse was created by NASA funding. Most people don't know that. Remember when NASA was advertising Tang as its big contribution to the civilized world? Well, there was a better example, but they didn't know about it.

McJones: Was that the beginning of Doug Engelbart's major funding?

Taylor: He had some smaller amount of funding I think from the Air Force, but the mouse work was actually done under a NASA project. And then when I went to ARPA, I funded it more, but Licklider had funded him as well, as a result partly of my funding.

</comment><comment><USER3> A link to a version of the '68 demo easier to consume:

[http://archive.org/search.php?query=collection%3Adougengelba...](http://archive.org/search.php?query=collection%3Adougengelbartarchives%20AND%20subject%3A%221968%20Demo%20Presentation%2C%20FJCC%22)

And a link to the follow-up to the '68 demo that I explains how the text editor works better:

[http://archive.org/search.php?query=collection%3Adougengelba...](http://archive.org/search.php?query=collection%3Adougengelbartarchives%20AND%20subject%3A%221969%20Demo%20Presentation%2C%20ASIS%22)

</comment><comment><USER4> This work is continuing under the guise of collaborative sensemaking (e.g. Simon Buckingham-Shum at KMI) and the various Visual Analytics (academic) communities working on everything from discovery(law), command and control(mil and civ) to intellegence analysis.</comment>


Google employees are debating company's decision to ban HK Protest game - <AUTHOR> https://www.vox.com/2019/10/15/20915729/google-hong-kong-video-game-revolution-of-our-times <comment><USER2> One never hears a word from Apple. But I can not imagine moral is very high in Cupertino considering Apples capitulation</comment>


Hydroxychloroquine, Azithromycin, and Combination in Patients with Covid-19 - <AUTHOR> https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30534-8/fulltext <comment><AUTHOR> Explanatory article: "Study finds hydroxychloroquine may have boosted survival, but other researchers have doubts":

[https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/02/health/hydroxychloroquine- cor...](https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/02/health/hydroxychloroquine-coronavirus- detroit-study/index.html)

</comment><comment><USER2> i thought we had already basically written off HCQ as a viable treatment and it seems odd that an antibiotic like azithromycin would be in any way effective against a virus but i guess im not a biochemist so i cant say these things for sure.

i thought that anti retro virals like remesedivir were our best chance at the moment</comment>


Ask HN: Are you still typing in your credit card number to shop online? - <AUTHOR>

Over the years, there have been many alternatives offered to the clunky process of entering in your full credit card information every time you buy something online.  But to this day, I do it whenever I am shopping at a new site.  (Sites where I shop routinely, such as Amazon, have my information on file.)  I just haven't found a reliable alternative.<p>What do you use? <comment><USER2> A reputable site I use regularly (like Amazon), will have my card on file. Otherwise, if a site offers PayPal, I will use that over putting my credit card in.</comment>


Why Is Apple Being So Lame About iPhone Hacking? - <AUTHOR> http://www.slate.com/id/2175304/nav/tap3/

<comment><USER2> AT&T.

I can't think of any other reason that their last update forced everyone to reactivate. If anyone had modifications then the activation failed. Permanently.</comment>


Single Party Democracy: Is China Democratizing from Within? - <AUTHOR> http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/22/opinion/22iht-edcohen.html?ref=opinion

<comment><USER2> No?</comment>


Homeopathy effective for 0 out of 68 illnesses, study finds - <AUTHOR> http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/health-news/homeopathy-therapeutic-dead-end-systematic-review-no-evidence-it-works-a6884356.html?cmpid=facebook-post <comment><USER2> Homepathy is 100% effective against NOT distributing antibiotics at large to people who don't need them.

Patient don't want to go away without getting medicine? Here! Take some homeopathy and everyone's happy :D</comment>


Aggregate Web Conference - <AUTHOR> http://ggrgt.com We're trying to do a web conference for disruptors aimed at bringing non-higher ed people to a higher ed web conference mostly to talk about ways to stop doing things wrong. Colleges & universities are throwing lots of money after bad because it takes a lot to get them to give you contracts. If people are interested in presenting, sponsoring or working with us on this campaign, please send me a note. <comment><AUTHOR> Higher ed web is a gigantic ball of suck. The space is ripe for disruption and this conference is aimed at bringing the companies & people associated with the startup space to Louisville for two days in September to talk about ways that higher ed can do the web better.

College CIOs are old, the IT people aren't the cream of the crop in a lot of cases and the ways colleges do digital is backwards because often times, it's people who drop out who know it better.

Bottom line, there's money in the space & so...this conference is really meeting the decisionmakers who are spending millions, as well as getting access to the folks who are doing things wrong and who want to hear from the people who are changing the world.

If you're interested, hit me up.</comment>


Tinder Launches Swipe Ventures - <AUTHOR> http://blog.gotinder.com/tinder-launches-swipe-ventures/ <comment> I-M-S I'm guessing the effects of swipe fatigue as starting to be felt in the company. Tinder is a shallow platform that never really grew functionally, so trying to find a next big thing in dating while they are still a (mobile) market leader is a smart move on their part.

</comment><comment><USER2> Not to be snarky, but how many times has Sean Rad stepped down from Tinder? I feel like it happens every 6 months.</comment>


New Raspberry Pi 3 Model A+ unveiled - <AUTHOR> https://opensource.com/article/18/11/raspberry-pi-3-model-a-plus-unveiled <comment><USER2> So this has no ethernet, 1 usb port, 512mb ram and the processor is a 1.4ghz quad core. Those seem to be the main differences compared to the model B+.

I'm struggling to see where this fits in between the Zero and the B. Its $25, so only $10 less than the B but loses most of the non wireless connectivity. But then theres the Zero W. Which does the same, and for even less. Is this the Arduino to the Zero's bare ATmega chip? Basically the same but all set up in an easy to use package?</comment>


Mobile ads suck. What's next? - <AUTHOR> http://blog.appsfire.com/mobile-ads-suck-whats-next/

<comment><USER2> Beggars can't be choosers. There are only a handful of revenue models out there and advertisement has and will continue be one of them, it'll certainly be the most common choice for free apps.

Whom ever wrote this article was too infuriated they came across as childish and presented weak arguments. Most of the points are highly subjective.

That being said, no doubt the current state of mobile advertisement is in a bad shape. I'll agree to that, but I wont agree to the need for eliminating them.

As it currently stands, IMHO the real problem with mobile advertisement is that they are designed with the reminiscences of the web. That's doing no one any good, albeit the current development in mobile devices they are still limited in display space and will continue to be so. That's kind of the whole point behind a mobile device, being small and portable.

So there is too little space to spare for an ad to appear and not interfere with the user's experience using the app. Unlike websites, most ads would surround the content and with the current screen sizes, it's fair to say that a visitor can enjoy an uninterrupted experience (unless there are other ad forms than banners presented).

I don't think one solution fits the bill, most apps would have different requirements. Take Twitter for instance and Facebook. Their contextual ads are quite unobtrusive for most users. Other apps can easily and unobtrusively use banner ads that match their design well enough that it feels like a part of it and gets out of the user's way.

I'd blame the drop-in ads solutions that developers use for their apps.

<comment><USER3> The problem isn't the "revenue model", but the state of app quality!

Apps are the new shit, half of my fellow computer science students stopped what they wanted to to and started "making mobile apps" when I was in university.

Now we have a big bunch of people with no clue, how to make good software. They pump their stuff into the app stores and hope to make the next instagram.

The customers would surely pay if the could be safe that the apps are good, but most aren't and this even lets the good apps seem bad.

Like always, it's a product problem and not a business problem.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> All the ads are basically suck and spam including this article. This is disgusting.</comment>


Ways to Minimize Employee Retention - <AUTHOR> http://rustyrazorblade.com/2014/09/21-ways-to-minimize-employee-retention/ <comment><USER2> > 14\. Humiliate people in public.

If you have to choose only one item from the list, this one is really, shockingly effective and easy to implement. My wife was in tears the other day because she made two trivial, easily-fixable errors on some paperwork she was doing as a stand-in for someone who was out sick. She fixed the errors and resubmitted it when they were brought to her attention, but her boss still sent the original one around to the entire office as an example of how not to do the paperwork, offering a prize to anyone who could spot all of the errors on it, and all-but-outright-stated that anyone who would submit paperwork in such shape was a moron.

I'm willing to believe that her boss is just a complete fucking idiot and meant it to be funny, but it was extremely cruel and totally uncalled for. Publicly humiliating your newest employee for the incredible crime of "volunteering to help take care of something when the person responsible is out sick" is really, really dumb and a great way to ensure that nobody ever helps anybody else with anything. It's working, because while we were on vacation she came back to a huge pile of work that nobody had even made an effort to handle, even though anyone in the office could have pitched in. And since she's a fast learner, she's also stopped helping other people when they're out sick, because it can only possibly lead to either 1) Her doing more work for no recognition, or 2) Her doing more work for no recognition and getting publicly mocked for doing something wrong.

For some mysterious reason, the office she works for has a hard time retaining employees and a hard time hiring new ones. People also take a LOT of (unpaid) sick days there, which are informally known as "sick of all the bullshit" days, because they're happier staying home without pay than coming to work and dealing with their manager.

<comment><USER3> I am of two minds about this.

On one hand, a "you broke the build dunce cap" isn't the worst of ideas. (Although by far I prefer a check-in system that doesn't allow the build to be broken for everyone...)

I've been shamed, and semi-publically (within the team) shamed others, for not having written any unit tests before check-in.

I'm also a big fan of publically celebrating successes. When a tester writes up a good bug, I'll have it sent around to everyone as an example of what a good bug report looks like!

<comment><USER4> Teasing, shaming and other forms of negative humor are very hard to do with a positive result. People are astonishingly different in what they can tolerate and how they respond. I suppose, with the right people, and the right team dynamics it can be OK.

But as a manager, I would strongly advise you to steer clear of that tactic. Even if you've got awesome emotional intelligence (and I don't) it's easy to screw up. It's not worth it.

Really, don't do it. Because when you screw up, it hurts real people.

There are better ways to encourage people - for example, the positve feedback to the tester you described.

<comment><USER5> > Teasing, shaming and other forms of negative humor are very hard to do with > a positive result. People are astonishingly different in what they can > tolerate and how they respond. I suppose, with the right people, and the > right team dynamics it can be OK.

So true. I've had great managers that had great rapport with the team and everyone was tight knit enough that the manager could stand in the hall and say "hey, come over here and look at the ridiculous code Bill wrote" and it would all be in good fun, even for the person who was being mocked (being able to laugh at your own mistakes is important, IMO). And on the other hand, I've had terrible managers who aren't able to do it in a good-natured manner and it ends up being mean-spirited, condescending, and morale-killing. There's a surprisingly fine line between "lol, Bill, what were you thinking?" and "Bill wrote bad code and I'm going to call him on it, making everyone on the team uncomfortable, and thus cultivating an environment where everyone lives in fear of making a mistake."

<comment><USER6> No. It's never, ever appropriate. Ever.

<comment><USER5> Appropriate versus inappropriate is irrelevant, in my opinion. Can it work? Yes. Is it more likely to backfire and make your team miserable? Yes. Is it something that creates a hostile work environment? Debatable, and definitely situational.

I would actually argue that when done right, this sort of smack-talk can be healthy and reassuring to the recipient. It's a bit perverse, but I like a situation where my coworkers respect me enough to make fun of my mistakes without me or them worrying that it _actually_ calls my competence into question. I've worked with people who you can't poke fun at, and it's usually because they actually _are_ somewhat incompetent and making fun of their errors would be cruel.

<comment><USER6> poking fun at people? It's not funny unless it's funny for everyone. Poking fun in a hurtful way is bullying.

Hopefully we never work together.

<comment><USER5> Oh, good lord. I thought I made it clear that I wasn't talking about poking fun in a hurtful way.

> Hopefully we never work together.

Indeed.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> 22\. Hire antisocial self-declared "rock star" employees who can't stand other human beings.

23\. Encourage sociable, pleasant employees to read Machiavelli and Sun Tzu.

24\. Peer reviews and stack ranking!

25\. Stress that everything must be done in-house. If your employees want a wheel, they must reinvent it themselves.

26\. Play video games in your office during crunch-time or, heck, just take the day off. You deserve it!

27\. Survey your employees to find out what extracurricular activities everyone enjoys. Then, ignore that data and hold a mandatory weekend game of your own favorite sport pitting your employees against those of a personal rival. If your team loses, throw your hat on the ground, jump up and down on it, and swear never to do this again. Repeat once or more annually.

28\. If, after doing all this, you still have payroll to burn, hire somebody at twice the salary of anyone else, anonymously leak salary information for your department, and be sure to give this new employee _absolutely_ _nothing_ to do except twiddle their thumbs.

<comment><USER8> Therefore a wise prince will seek means by which his subjects will always and in every possible condition of things have need of his government, and then they will always be faithful to him.

Niccolo Machiavelli "The Prince"

<comment><USER9> Most people associate Machiavelli with a devious, twisted mind when he was actually simply a pragmatic. He is labeled as an amoral guy since he admits that violent or cunning methods are sometimes useful.

Also, as an software contractor, his thesis on private forces/ paid forces is quite enlightening.

<comment><USER8> Link for reference: [http://www.bartleby.com/36/1/13.html](http://www.bartleby.com/36/1/13.html)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> There may be a story behind this post as it feels quite personal, but this is a pretty good composite of bad management behaviors. I see this more of a collage than a specific rant. I could be wrong, but I've seen one or more of these traits expressed by almost any supervisor I've encountered (not all the time or all at once).

<comment><USER11> I was thinking the exact same. I have a very clear image of this domineering, unhinged alpha who ran op's previous company into the ground.

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> Another - Reward hard work and delivery with another project quickly and as scattered. When one delivers a touch project in an impossible timeline, rather than changing anything management side, deem them the "saver" and give them bad project after bad project with shorter and shorter timelines.

This could be reposted as Business/Management 101 in the office for most managers, or apparently the guide many have been using.

I have experienced almost all of them and could feel the pain in each line item that would come from developers that care or product developers that know what it takes to ship a successful product, well written and thorough.

</comment><comment><USER13> Ooh, this is fun:

22\. Developers don't like to concentrate on their work for more than about 30-45 minutes at a stretch. So make sure to liven up their days with lots of meetings spread over the course of the day!

</comment><comment><USER14> If you have to write this post to vent because you are stuck in a job you can't afford to leave and you are scared you'll be fired if you raise these issues to management, then so be it, write the bloody post and I hope you feel better.

However in terms of practical changes, this post can neither benefit you nor anyone else. We all know about broken management cultures that this post describes, but none of those managers in question would do anything but become extremely defensive if confronted by a post like this (which they wouldn't be because they don't know what Hacker News or a technical blog is).

To the clueful neutral observer we have to weigh out whether management is _really_ this clueless, or is the author a poor communicator full of sour grapes? Honestly it's 50/50, but I would probably be too nervous to ever hire someone who posted this vitriolic of prose publicly, it just comes off as unprofessional.

<comment><USER15> Knowing the author personally and having worked at the same company with him (he left there a long time ago). I can say it is neither. It was among the most broken places I've worked. The author himself is a great communicator and technical lead.

Perhaps we should accept the shocking reality that there are really startups this awful to work for :)

<comment><USER15> Or we can just do the "downvote of denial"

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> Or, my favorites:

* Have CEO live in another state, but not let his absenteeism stop him from insisting the entire company change

* Throw chairs at people who want to release the code after it's feature complete [Ah, TJ, I wanted to give you a big ol' bear hug for finally pressing the point after hitting feature complete more than 10 times and us never releasing]

* Be constantly high on amphetamines

* Steal the identity of a math textbook author in suburban California

* Announce in a quarterly all hands meeting that it was a positive quarter because, even though the business lost money, and lost money faster than last year, the negative year over year growth got smaller (read: closer to zero), so you'll be losing the same amount of money YoY in no time!

If you guys think it's a harsh reality that companies do the stuff in this article... I guess I am curious if you guys have worked at venture funded startups?

<comment><USER17> _> If you guys think it's a harsh reality that companies do the stuff in this article... I guess I am curious if you guys have worked at venture funded startups?_

I've worked at three including one medium sized exit and never experienced what's in the article or your post.

<comment><USER16> Congratulations! :) Startups are more fun without these things (I think that's the implication of the article as well).

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> Only two ways are needed:

1\. Create a constant state of uncertainty. Make promises you don't keep, and never explain why. Announce stuff that never materializes.

2\. Don't give people any chance to successfully complete anything they start. (Simplest way: keep moving the goalposts.)

In my experience, people can take any kind of abusive crap, but uncertainty plus the inability to do anything worthwhile will either get people to quit or put them on the shortest route to a burn-out.

And the worst part is, these two ways are often not applied by malicious douche bags, but simply incompetent management. In the start-up world these are often entrepreneurs with no idea of and a total lack of empathy with what it's like to be an employee.

</comment><comment><USER19> A lot of this applies even to non-tech jobs, I think employers got a little to comfortable with high unemployment. Watch the hilarity ensue when those demographics change.

<comment><USER20> It won't. The supply will always outweigh the demand in professions that needs a better working environment the most (minimum wage, or lack of)

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> "12\. Establish dominance by staring at people, never blinking."

"14\. Humiliate people in public."

Sounds like a personality disorder, possibly anti-social personality disorder. See: [http://www.wikihow.com/Spot-a-Sociopath](http://www.wikihow.com/Spot-a- Sociopath), in particular:

"9\. See if the person makes uninterrupted eye contact. Sociopaths are known for giving intense uninterrupted eye contact. The person stares because he or she is completely comfortable staring at people to make them uncomfortable. Staring at others intently is a way to further his or her own means."

"1\. Look for a lack of shame. Most sociopaths can commit vile actions and not feel the least bit of remorse. Such actions may include physical abuse or public humiliation of others."

</comment><comment><USER22> Appending my own personal pain point

22\. Allow IT, regulatory, & quality to inhibit your productivity to the point that you work on side projects just to know what it's like to ship something.

Yeah, I'm currently interviewing else where.

</comment><comment><USER23> #19 and #20 seems the most common issues I've had to deal with in development.

19\. Give estimates without consulting the people that are actually doing the work. When they disagree with the deadline, shrug your shoulders and explain that it can't be changed and people are expecting it to be completed on schedule. Repeat every time.

20\. Break the above cycle when everyone is about to quit. Get estimates down to the hour for every single feature. Assume no slippage. Add features but do not adjust schedule.

</comment><comment><USER5> One I'd add is "upon reading any of these previous points, tell yourself why it doesn't apply to you so you can continue doing it."

</comment><comment><USER24> I assume there's some kind of story behind this post?

</comment><comment><USER25> > 14\. Humiliate people in public.

This happens a lot. It happens at my company when you screw up a build.

</comment><comment><USER26> I'm feeling #17 right now, although that implies there _is_ a plan.

</comment><comment><USER27> If this is your reality, we're hiring !

</comment><comment><USER28> Dude. Just find a new job.

<comment><USER29> He already did.</comment></comment>


Education is broken – we can fix it. Bring disruption back to schools - <AUTHOR> https://www.romaintordo.com/the-education-is-broken-we-can-fix-it/

<comment><USER2> I don't want "disruption" to be brought to schools.

Actually I'm coming more and more to the point of view that people who describe their "mission" as one of disruption and societal change fall into one of two big categories:

Either they do illegal stuff (like Uber, Silk Road) or they just don't have they slightest clue about the field they're meddling in and just naively believe that a Ruby on Rails application with some Bitcoin thrown in will solve all of mankind's problems.

(I'm not against your blog post which seems fair, just your choice of title here)</comment>


Ask HN: A Move to DevSecOPs - <AUTHOR> I want to transition from regular infosec (CISSP kind of BS) to more of cloud + agile security professional any ideas (I'm AWS cert, know python , a bit of ansible and terraform) <comment><USER2> Try applying here: [https://benevolent.ai/career-open-positions/devsecops- engine...](https://benevolent.ai/career-open-positions/devsecops-engineer- london1)

Disclosure: I work at BAI

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> I think you might be able to find someone with the qualifications to answer your questions on www.rooftopslushie.com

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks</comment></comment>


An Evaluation of the Application Verification Service in Android 4.2 - <AUTHOR> http://www.cs.ncsu.edu/faculty/jiang/appverify/

<comment><USER2> Quite interesting and using hashes to identify malware is just not effective in the least. However...

> Last but not least, we notice that VirusTotal (owned by Google) has not been > integrated yet into this app verification service.

This strikes me as a bit odd. While I do think Google is likely to use VirusTotal for this sort of thing in the future: 1) They just bought VirusTotal 2 months before 4.2 was released, so them not having integrated it yet is not at all surprising, and 2) The binary itself isn't uploaded to the app verification server, just some info about it, so running VirusTotal against the binary isn't viable, severely limiting the integration possibilities.

<comment><USER3> Never use VirusTotal in its current form on sensitive files. Everything uploaded goes to their subscription feed. I see corporate documents that should not be out in the open, for example, pass through every day.

Anyway, do any of the AV scanners VirusTotal wraps around even handle Android malware?

<comment><USER2> > Anyway, do any of the AV scanners VirusTotal wraps around even handle > Android malware?

The submission has a table showing which malware was picked up by which AVs, and quite a few of them did a good job with it.

<comment><USER3> Ah, thanks! I glanced through and only saw AV1, AV2, etc. The paragraph above puts names to them, and at least some of those are indeed in VirusTotal.

One thing I forgot to mention before:

 _using hashes to identify malware is just not effective in the least_

Absolutely true, but VirusTotal is only using hashing to determine if it's already scanned a particular file (and even if it has, you can still force a re-scan). Most of the individual AV engines have at least basic heuristics, so, for example, you can detonate a piece of malware in a VM, dump the memory, carve out the offending module[1], upload it to VirusTotal, and still get a positive hit.

1\. It may need to be remapped to virtual address order and PE-formatted. I've never tried it with raw pages.

<comment><USER2> > Absolutely true, but VirusTotal is only using hashing to determine if it's > already scanned a particular file (and even if it has, you can still force a > re-scan). Most of the individual AV engines have at least basic heuristics, > so, for example, you can detonate a piece of malware in a VM, dump the > memory, carve out the offending module[1], upload it to VirusTotal, and > still get a positive hit.

I was referring to the method they currently use, which is just matching hashes, not VirusTotal. No matter what, you need to somehow run the code through an antivirus at some point, so the files need to go up to the server or you need to run the AV locally.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> Interesting the post about google's tax avoidance[0] is the same age, with twice as many points. [88/44 at time of posting]

Yet that has now slipped off the front page, and this is at the top of it!

0: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4899236>

<comment><USER5> Interesting observation. I can only guess someone flagged it for being irrelevant.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> OP ought to restore the original title because it better represents the content of that study seeing as it's clearly about the mechanism for verifying side-loaded apps (introduced in 4.2) and not the Play store bouncer.</comment>


Apple will fix iPhone 6 Plus 'touch disease,' for $149 - <AUTHOR> https://www.engadget.com/2016/11/17/apple-will-fix-iphone-6-plus-touch-disease-for-149/ <comment><USER2> Errrrr... fixing a design fault should be for free!</comment>


IBM scientists have captured 330TB of uncompressed data into a tiny cartridge - <AUTHOR> https://www.theverge.com/platform/amp/2017/8/2/16074568/ibm-330-terabytes-record-uncompressed-data-cartridge-cartridge-tape <comment><USER2> With this AWS might eventually be able to shrink their snowmobile from a 45ft shipping container on a semi-trailer truck to the more traditional station wagon size.</comment>


Apple Accused of Selling Pirate Books On App Store - <AUTHOR> http://torrentfreak.com/apple-accused-of-selling-pirate-books-on-app-store-101214/

<comment><USER2> No news here. One makes a copyright-infringement claim and Apple handles it the only sensible way it can: look into it and act on the findings.

Side-note/Word to the wise: Avoid scrolling down and reading the comments on this site at all costs.

</comment><comment><USER3> That'll be the day when computers can automatically recognize an unauthorized translation of a copyrighted work. Seriously, all this online fingerprinting stuff is worse than the potential for watermark-detecting DRM chips embedded in camcorders and cell phones. At least if the chip is in my hand, I can (find someone to) hack it, or buy an older model. It's ridiculous to have YouTube delete the audio from a video because a major label song happens to be playing.</comment>


New Camera Can See Around Corners - <AUTHOR> https://www.technologyreview.com/s/603314/new-camera-can-see-around-corners <comment><USER2> 2012, femtophotography: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfgsQX78hg8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfgsQX78hg8)</comment>