Ask HN: Writing an 80App - <AUTHOR>

Hello,
I've been trying to use 80legs to crawl about 120,000 pages to extract lawyer bios from the websites of 200 top US law firms. I created a simple app in Django with about 400 lawyers in the database (SQLite). The app pretends to be a who-knows-who database by matching schools, memberships to professional associations etc. Now I want to add those 100,000+ lawyers to make the app a bit more interesting.
I love working with Django and Python but I don't know Java, and 80legs requires the app to be written in Java (see this page http://80legs.pbworks.com/80Apps) Shion Derserkar of 80legs mentions that they offer custom coding and he is willing to give me an estimate. Before doing that I wanted to ask HN if anyone here used 80legs and wrote an 80app to analyze the crawled pages and if they could give me instructions and advice about the process.
In fact, I would appreciate general advice about realizing this project the best way.
Thank you. <comment><USER2> <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=840244>

Crawling "only" 120k pages can be done easily with a pure Python solution over a normal home / office internet connection. The packages urllib, urllib2, robotexclusionrulesparser and lxml are a good start.

Important: Don't forget to implement a crawl rate limit.

<comment><USER3> 80legs automatically handles the crawl rate limits for you.

<comment><USER2> That's probably not the primary reason to use 80legs - but avoiding to implement a whole crawler.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> <http://www.80legs.com/>

<http://80legs.pbworks.com/80Apps></comment>


Building a Reddit-like site after 3-4 months learning Elixir - <AUTHOR> https://www.reddit.com/r/elixir/comments/6c1vql/34_months_learning_elixir_and_what_got_done/ <comment><USER2> My company replaced the integration server I had originally written in Python/Django/Celery/RabbitMQ with one built in Elixir/OTP. The results were impressive.

Our task load was getting out of hand, and during peak load throwing memory and CPU at it was not helping. Task monitoring was also a pain. It needed a complete rewrite, because the original design, while robust for what it targeted at the time, could not keep up with our growth.

The integration developer I hired to take over the project looked into using Go at first, but then discovered Elixir. I started learning it with him (he quickly surpassed me), and after a few trial task implementations, I gave him the go-ahead. We couldn't be happier with the result. Thanks to OTP and the existing tools built around it, we have great monitoring, and the ability to easily and quickly scale up workers at peak times.

<comment><USER3> Anything specific you liked about Elixir more than Go?

<comment><USER4> As someone who writes both, it's even difficult to compare these as they are apples and oranges.

Elixir (due to Erlang base) is great for long-running or distributed services and includes tooling to, for example, easily introspect the state/memory usage of your services down to a single mutable data structure, to heal from failures, and to hot-swap upgrade/code while the server is still running, and to perform node-to-node RPC.

Go would be a replacement for something that was previously written in C/C++, that may need concurrency, and that should compile to native code. You get very fine-grained control of everything from network to file operations and excellent concurrency constructs. A web crawler, a device driver, or writing an Nginx/HAProxy-type daemon, all may be great example use cases.

One could write their next social network/app backend using Go (just as one could do it in C), but it would probably take more work than just using a higher-level language.

<comment><USER5> Go is much more suited for web apps than any driver or real time performance application; although, I will agree that using Go for command-line tools is great. I haven't used Elixir but as somebody who uses Go, I highly recommend not replacing C/C++ with it unless it isn't performance critical.

PS: Go's memory usage is pretty up there some times, another reason you should probably stick with C/C++ in the context mentioned above.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Happy to see more and more non-trivial platform-based implementations in Elixir. We're using the Elixir/OTP+Phoenix stack for our own projects, handling networks of radio-connected sensors. It has been a breeze developing with Elixir, as not only the language is maturing, but the ecosystem is steadily growing as well - and there are a number of great libraries, from Ecto to Phoenix itself.

The OTP foundation of Erlang and hence Elixir just screams "platform" or at least "network", as it was designed to handle parallel flows of data. Great to see yet another project utilizing this aspect of the language.

<comment><USER7> Not sure what you mean by "parallel flows of data", but Erlang/Elixir isn't particularly good at handling multiple streams of data between distributed nodes if you're relying on the built-in distribution subsystem (net_kernel).

Only a single TCP connection is opened between any two nodes and there's a head-of-line blocking issue with message delivery (intentionally for backward- compatibility reasons).

Certainly you can build your own multi-connection subsystem if you want to, but that's true of almost anything. I've had to do this for Erlang several times.

<comment><USER8> Instead of rolling your own connection subsystem, there is also this [https://github.com/lasp-lang/partisan](https://github.com/lasp-lang/partisan) Although they call it still experimental, it seems to be pretty actively developed.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> I don't appreciate the "Elixir is growing" commentary in the title. That's not justified because a person wrote a program in it.

<comment><USER10> Just grew by 1

<comment><USER9> And somewhere else someone stopped using it. One person doesn't make a trend as the title claims.

<comment><USER11> Arguably this post will lead to net-positive growth. I'm certainly going to try it after having read the top comments.

<comment><USER12> I stopped using it just to throw a wrench in your gears.

Grind this thing to a halt!

(...no, actually Elixir is pretty cool.)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> I write a lot of server processes that communicate with remote devices.

Elixir has become my go-to language for whipping up new communication utilities. The syntax is comfortable, although I had to get used to a Functional Programming style at first.

What I like most is the language and runtime's features that make parallelization so easy. Spawning threads that are monitored, have their own protected state, that are managed if they crash, and are trivially spread across different machines on the network made it straightforward to write fairly highly available code right from the beginning without a lot of planning.

<comment><USER14> Thanks to Erlang

<comment><USER15> Thanks to BEAM, no?

<comment><USER16> Which is "Bogdan/Björn's Erlang Abstract Machine". So erlang.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> For the lazy who are unsure what Elixir _is_ :

[http://elixir-lang.org/](http://elixir-lang.org/)

(I assumed it was a front-end Javascript framework or something like that)

<comment><USER18> From what I gathered, it's popular for Rails developers who want something that feels like Rails, but with (much) better performances and concurrency.

For me coming from Scala, I feel like the lack of typesystem would be a step back.

<comment><USER19> I came to Elixir from Scala, and for me the dynamic typing is a big step forward, because now I don't have to deal with the half of the Scala community that tries to make Scala into Haskell.

Between Dialyzer (a static analyzer that finds type errors) and runtime pattern-matching (extremely powerful destructuring, sort of borrowed from Prolog initially), I don't find myself wanting to go back to strong typing on the JVM.

<comment><USER20> I'm currently working with Scala and recently dabbling with Elixir and Phoenix. It's a good language and great platform, however, I still prefer static typing.

I'm still getting used to dynamic typing in Elixir. Most of the time I feel like just matching against Map data structure or records.

While Dialyzer is great, writing the typespecs is a bit of a maintenance overhead. I suppose it's a tradeoff...

> I came to Elixir from Scala, [..] now I don't have to deal with the half of > the Scala community that tries to make Scala into Haskell.

IMO Scala will continue to be a multi-paradigm lang. On pure-FP and libs, it's a choice and really depends on the problem domain. It might not be a good solution to everyone, but I'm glad it exists.

<comment><USER19> I think of Elixir typespecs as documentation more than as overhead. Given that I'm writing comments that tell the shape of the inputs and outputs of every function anyhow, I might as well do it in a way that lends itself to static analysis. :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> Google trends shows that Elixir is in fact growing: [https://trends.google.co.in/trends/explore?q=%2Fm%2F0pl075p,...](https://trends.google.co.in/trends/explore?q=%2Fm%2F0pl075p,%2Fm%2F03yb8hb,%2Fm%2F03j_q,%2Fm%2F02mm3)

<comment><USER22> Strange - that graph set shows Elixir on a slight growth path, but Erlang on a slight downward path? Isn't Elixir simply the framework around Erlang??

It would be a bit like showing Rails on the uptake, but Ruby going down, isn't it?

<comment><USER23> No, Elixir is an entirely different language running on the same virtual machine as Erlang.

It's as seeing a graph with Java usage going down, while Kotlin or Scala up.

<comment><USER22> Thanks @unscaled and @LukaD for clarifying this. I hadn't used the language, so didn't understand that Elixir wasn't just the name of the framework.

Not sure why I got the downvotes for asking a question, but there you go...

<comment><USER24> Because literally five seconds of googling would have gotten you the answer. Your comment didn't add anything for anyone but yourself. That's why you got downvoted.

<comment><USER25> I was wondering the same thing, so I found cyberferret's comment (and the answers) useful. It might be helpful to anyone who's skimming through here.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> I have been using Elixir extensively for my services for a year now and it's been a really great experience overall.

</comment><comment><AUTHOR> p.e. why "Elixir is growing" in the title - because more and more people are building sophisticated and production ready services using Elixir.

Elixir isn't in the Top 50 programming languages yet, but I reckon it will be there in not more than 3 months... and that is respectful given its age.

<comment><USER27> Says you? It's hard/to early to tell ofcourse, but currently it looks like it's stagnating. [https://insights.stackoverflow.com/trends?tags=elixir](https://insights.stackoverflow.com/trends?tags=elixir)

<comment><USER21> A lot of Elixir Q&A actually happens on [https://elixirforum.com/](https://elixirforum.com/) and the slack channel [https://elixir-lang.slack.com/](https://elixir-lang.slack.com/) . So stackoverflow trends may not be the best thing to judge this.

<comment><USER28> As an avid Elixir user, your comment got me thinking about how and where I look for help. I realized that it wouldn't even really occur to me to use Stack Overflow for answers regarding Elixir, as the other platforms you mentioned tend to be so active and well suited for that purpose.

This isn't to say that I wouldn't use SO for other purposes, as I actively visit the site for JS/PHP content. Anecdotal evidence to support your insight by all means, of course.

<comment><USER29> Absolutely. The elixir community on the forum are amazing.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER30> I prefer LFE (Lisp Flavored Erlang) because I prefer Lisp syntax to the Ruby- like Elixir syntax. LFE compiles down to core Erlang, while Elixir compiles down to vanilla Erlang. True macros can be done in LFE, but as I understand it, macros are done after parsing in Elixir. LFE was created by one of Erlang's co-creators.

<comment><USER31> I'm curious to hear what you've built with LFE, and what the experience was like? What would you say were the biggest stumbling blocks you ran into?

I'm also in your camp (not liking Elixir or Erlang's syntax, but really liking BEAM). I like Clojure a whole lot, but would prefer it on BEAM for a whole variety of reasons. LFE seemed like a step back from Clojure in many ways when I looked at it.

<comment><USER32> Perhaps the 'step back' is that LFE is a Lisp-2 like Common Lisp whereas Clojure is a Lisp-1 like Scheme.

You might find Joxa interesting, it predates Elixir, but came after LFE and is patterned on Clojure.

[http://joxa.org](http://joxa.org)</comment></comment></comment>


The Lonely Death of George Bell - <AUTHOR> http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/18/nyregion/dying-alone-in-new-york-city.html <comment><USER2> Contrary to the implications of the beginning of the piece, Mr. Bell had connections, he had the potential for relationships, he even had friends who tried.

I'm an introvert, who recently moved to another city for graduate school. I don't get out very often unless it's to a solitary place (my own spot in a coffee shop, for instance), so I can relate to Bell's desire to be solitary most of the time. However, if anyone reading this thinks his death was a wrong, know that he had ample opportunity to at least have one or two people to "be around his death bed" so to speak. The end of the piece talks about "the Dude", not to mention the possible wife who it seems loved him even towards the end.

If there is any take away, it is to cherish our relationships with others. There are extreme cases in which people really are alone, but for those of us who can at least count on our hands the ones we love, or at least like, (even if it takes us a few minutes to enumerate them), we should continue to develop those friendships and not force people out who could otherwise enrich us. As the "investigators" put it, we don't live forever. We need to use the time we have to enrich others, because only the rest of society will out-survive us as individuals.

</comment><comment><USER3> It's so difficult when you're on a trajectory that you know will kill you yet you cannot change it because it feels like your entire being is so tainted and the sadness is so ingrained in your soul that your mind just tells you to isolate your miserable existence from those around you. I have struggled with this my entire adult life and I'm writing this with tears in my eyes because reading this beautiful piece is like unraveling my own future. Rest in peace, George. We all die alone, but no one deserves to die lonely.

<comment><USER4> I promise you, I felt the same way as you describe for years. I took antidepressants for years but they would eventually stop working. I tried all kinds of natural supplements, meditation, exercise, etc. After losing my marriage and alienating my children I tried once more but this time my doctor added a mood stabilizer. It has made all the difference in the world. I have a very close relationship with my children now, close friends, job, and enjoy many interests. Don't give up.

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kodokushi](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kodokushi) is the Japanese name for this phenomena. There were several articles about it a few months back, like:

[http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/roads/2015/0...](http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/roads/2015/06/kodokushi_in_aging_japan_thousands_die_alone_and_unnoticed_every_year_their.html)

[http://rendezvous.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/03/25/in-japan- lone...](http://rendezvous.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/03/25/in-japan-lonely- deaths-in-societys-margins/)

[http://qz.com/380685/photos-cleaning-up-after-japans- lonely-...](http://qz.com/380685/photos-cleaning-up-after-japans-lonely- deaths/)

They say you mentally breakup with your spouse/partner some time before before actually do so. From what little I can glean here, the same can (not always, just can) hold true for dying alone.

<comment><USER6> "The majority of lonely deaths are people who are kind of messy,"

The need for instant gratification is a constant for those affected by major depression. This may come across as "messy" when in reality severely depressed people would skip anything that does not directly improve their mood.

As despair takes over and one cannot find light at the end of the tunnel, the search for this light or simply giving up becomes the main thing whereas everything else becomes irrelevant.

I'm no psychologist but could not help noticing this kind of behaviour over the years in many cases of depression, suicides, etc.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> A wonderful piece, almost read like a novel.

At the end, I couldn't help but try to derive some overall take-away. The best I could come up with was to cherish your friendships and always try to keep in touch. One concern I would have is whether or not today's internet-based culture could hinder this?

<comment><USER8> I'd say it cuts both ways. I don't get out much myself, but I keep pretty well in touch with friends from all walks of life via social media. In another era many of those relationships would have atrophied with both time and distance.

<comment><USER9> I do it the opposite way actually. No social media at all. I call, text, and email a whole host of people on a regular basis.

Social media is honestly a hindrance of friendships. If you want to know about an old friend you haven't talked to in a while, punch up their facebook/instagram/twitter. All caught up. No need to interact whatsoever. I call, email, and text, to maintain that sense of a personal connection.

Technology helps with having relationships not atrophy, I completely agree. Social media however, I see it as a hindrance to sincere connections with people more than a boon to preserving relationships.

<comment><USER10> Perhaps. I think people who grew up with social media know it's a loose substitute for maintaining real friendships and relationships. You just won't get the same fulfillment looking at a 'friends' feed than actually reaching out to them directly (via technology or otherwise). Just like you call, email and text - many people do that (snapchat, whatsapp, etc).

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> We need a society where every person is needed and wanted. We need it more than any dumb technical advance that lessens the need for people, like robots delivering pizza or whatever. That will take some heavy thinking, though, and I feel that we haven't even started.

<comment><USER12> A lot of us that are building the dumb technical advances that lessen the need for people don't particularly like people, in the general case. I suspect we'll continue to do so.

<comment><USER13> If you don't like people, then it's really that you don't like yourself, douche. You came out of a people. You depend on people, your existence is not happening in a vacuum.

<comment><USER14> Amazing piece of logic here, "you came out of people -> you depend on people" and "you must like people" is implied.

I hate that I have to depend on people. I find them unreliable at best. Which is why a lot of us are working to improve the primitive societies we currently live in in order to REMOVE that dependency. I'd rather depend on algorithms (and in fact I do, more and more every single day that passes) than anything as primitive as people.

<comment> vezzy-fnord Algorithms are much more primitive than people by definition. You seem to have intended to convey the opposite, a preference for relying on primitives over complicated persons.

<comment><USER15> More primitive, in the sense of less complex, yes. But also more reliable. Algorithms do what they do, and never anything else.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> > IN 1996, GEORGE BELL hurt his left shoulder and spine lifting a desk on a > moving job, and his life took a different shape. He received approval for > workers' compensation and Social Security disability payments and began > collecting a pension from the Teamsters. Though he never worked again, he > had all the income he needed.

Sometimes, having income without effort is death in life.

<comment><USER17> He got hurt making a living. That is what workers compensation is. It is not like receiving an inheritance like: Donald Trump, the Walton family, etc.

George Bell _earned_ that worker's compensation with a remaining lifetime of pain. If that isn't earned I don't know what is.

<comment><USER18> I think the point is that Bell, who already tended toward introversion, no longer could (due to injury) nor had a need (due to not needing to work) to go outside and socialize.

That said, having an income was probably the biggest factor - that kind of back injury does not keep one from going out. I agree that his compensation is earned - but that sort of support has side effects on both the recipient and the rest of society. When taxes and regulation can be expected to take up the slack, people tend toward individualism and communities wither. Compare the strength of families and communities over the last 100 years. While good government can provide financial assistance, like how communities used to, it rarely provides the human socialization that communities do.

<comment><USER19> Really? Before socialized welfare, your place within the community was entirely tied to your working ability. Too old to farm? Go sleep under the stairs. Then take a walk in the forest in winter and don't come back.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> This is a really lovely story. I'm not usually one to be sentimental bit this has got me thinking of my priorities in life.

</comment><comment><USER21> I see a couple of things missing in the comments thus far on George Bell's isolation.

First, his age. When he was younger, he was (presumably) in love with, and almost married, a woman whom he stayed in touch with for the rest of his life. He also had close relationships with friends. For some people, the "desaturation" of life that comes with age makes it feel less worthwhile to pursue the things that once made them happy.

Second, some people who do not socialize are not necessarily devoid of the inner need for friendship and companionship - they may have learned that the pain and risk that can come with social connections outweigh the advantages.

When a man becomes old, disabled, and considerably overweight, interacting with others might not be a particularly pleasant experience.

There are no "solutions" to the "problems" George Bell had. They are a part of the human condition, and they were his experience of life.

</comment><comment><USER22> I couldn't help but think of Eleanor Rigby. "All the lonely people, where do they all belong?"

</comment><comment><USER23> To me, the saddest thing about George was that he seems to have merely existed, while he was alive. From the article, he didn't seem to have any passions or ambitions. He didn't seem to want to go and see things, experience things, do things. He died in the same apartment, he was born in. He didn't really live, he just was, completely passive, until he wasn't.

At least that is the impression I got from reading this.

<comment><USER2> I wouldn't say that. The fact that him and "the Dude" "solved all the world's problems" in a parking lot seem to suggest he was a thinking person with at least some desire to better some of those around him. Not to mention the fact he thought about and wrote a will, the fact that he was in love, the fact he was missed by the vanishingly few who knew him.

</comment></comment><comment><USER24> This was somewhat of a depressing story; mainly because emphasis was put on the whole after death scenario; that is what happened to his belongings et cetera, et cetera... But overall, I feel like I understand Bell, as well as the circumstances that lead to him dying lonely... RIP Bell Nothing more Nothing less

</comment><comment><USER25> And there's nothin' short of dyin', half as lonesome as the sound, Of the sleepin' city sidewalk and Sunday mornin' comin' down – Kris Kristofferson

</comment><comment><USER26> Indeed, a deeply touching and human story, but even more so I've been engrossed by the consuming discussion it has sparked!

</comment><comment><USER27> $5000 for burial costs?!? And 50000 burials a year...wow...would never have imagined.

</comment><comment><USER28> That's how it ends. Everyone dies alone.

</comment><comment><USER14> I never understood this stigma about hermits/social isolation in western societies. In the east, it's much more accepted.

Reading this piece I got the impression that the writer and persons interviewed were HORRIFIED by what they discovered. It seemed to me as if "having friends" was pretty fucking high in their list-of-important-things-in- life.

I was very amused by this, almost started laughing in fact. Human relationships are not for everyone I'd say, in fact there are many healthy people that view them as pointless waste of time at best.

Technology will solve this little problem once and for all, in this century. I won't go as far as AGI but when house keeping robots become ubiquitous which is surely less than 20 years down the road, society at large will have to evolve and primitive points of view as described in this nytimes piece will basically disappear.

<comment><USER5> I once heard someone say "You can give everyone else but yourself a soul." While I don't really know what that means, I think of it whenever I'm by myself for long durations (3-4 months on average).

<comment><USER13> I think what it means is that the light of your presence or attention illumines another's being, but I don't think agree that that very light can't be turned toward yourself.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> I'm sorry but this is garbage in my view.

We need to use the time we have in order to _do the things that are important to us_ , not to enrich "others" whoever they may be. This obsession about society and socializing and following norms and "fitting in" is one of the things that are _seriously_ fucked up in the western world.

We need more people who have gone _sideways_ , more recluses, more geniuses, more people who _do not fit in_ and do things their own way. Otherwise what's the point?

I understand that this may sound _alien_ or maybe _crazy_ to people who have grown up in western societies and therefore been _indoctrinated_ to an extreme degree to seek the approval of others and so on, but that's all there is to it really, social conditioning. Nobody will remember you 200 years after you die, you better use the time you have to do something meaningful with your life and to me that does not include idle socializing so that some sacks of blood, meat and bone will "feel" sad when you're gone.

<comment><USER29> There is literally nothing objectively "meaningful" _to do_ that we know of. At all. Anywhere. Ever.

The concepts of "meaning" and "meaningful" come from the human mind, it's subjective. Anything can be 'meaningful' to someone and not to someone else.

The point is not to make other people sad when you're gone, the point is to make other people (and yourself) happier while you're alive.

<comment><USER30> Agreed, and there's no guarantee that pursuing what we deem to be meaningful at the expense of interpersonal relationships will leave a mark on humanity. As a matter of fact, a lot of great men and women are/were the product of investments (not necessarily monetary) from their parents, teachers, friends, and family.</comment></comment></comment>


On Becoming a Scientist - <AUTHOR> http://openresearch.wordpress.com/

<comment><USER2> I really like this author's writing style. His RSS feed is unfortunately not working at the moment. Otherwise I would subscribe to his newsletter!

<comment><AUTHOR> His feed is working just use this link (<http://openresearch.wordpress.com/feed/>) or if you are using google reader just add his weblog url to your reader (<http://openresearch.wordpress.com/>)

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> about the last point- hiding personal opinions about world politics, economics, etc to avoid negative career consequences... can you give any examples of how these opinions, especially un-orthodox ones, could hurt a researcher working in an entirely unrelated field? curious....

<comment><USER4> Well, for one thing, they are perfectly suited for extremely long periods of procrastination in the form of internet arguments.</comment></comment>


What would a python pip replacement look like? - <AUTHOR> Having branched out from the world of Python in recent years, I've seen some interesting package managers for other languages and of course operating systems. I've got some hang ups with pip and setuptools that I imagine could be resolved with an extensible approach. For example, I imagine scoped package support (see NPM), transparent versioning (aka deterministic installs, or a better pip-tools), automatic project dependency management (again, NPM), parallel installation (yarn)...<p>So what would a re-think of pip look like? <comment><USER2> Twine[0] is the tool I've been using for PyPI archive management and Pipenv[1] is looking promising as the next iteration of pip.

Twine makes the packaging process _slightly_ easier, although setuptools is still a bit of a pain.

Pipenv handles a lot of project cruft for you: setting up a virtualenv, distinguishing dev and prod packages, locking them down and deterministic building.

[0]: [https://github.com/pypa/twine](https://github.com/pypa/twine)

[1]: [https://github.com/kennethreitz/pipenv](https://github.com/kennethreitz/pipenv)

<comment><AUTHOR> Oh man, how have I not known about pipenv? This addresses a huge amount of my complaints with pip. Thanks for sharing!

<comment><USER2> The downside to pipenv is that there aren't any good docker images to work with it. I've tried a few times, but I've never given enough time to learning the guts of Docker to make anything stable enough to run with it.

<comment><AUTHOR> Here's my Dockerfile: [https://gist.github.com/dfee/388c3f270fdfc4f31aba906770f9313...](https://gist.github.com/dfee/388c3f270fdfc4f31aba906770f93137)

<comment><USER2> Very cool. I'll have to give it a whirl. I haven't taken a stab at a custom image in a while. Thanks!</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Introducing Cloudron – Private Clouds for All - <AUTHOR> https://www.cloudron.io/?hn

<comment><AUTHOR> Hi everyone, Co-founder of Cloudron here. We are just getting started and in closed beta for developers. I am happy to answer any questions.

<comment><USER2> Hi Girish,

How do I try the beta?

Robert

<comment><USER3> Hey Robert, just request an invite on the website.

Thanks!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> Looks really interesting. I'll definitely request an invite.</comment>


5 'Real' Ways Bootstrapped Startup Kids Pay Their Bills - <AUTHOR> http://bostinnovation.com/2011/07/11/5-real-ways-bootstrapped-startup-kids-pay-their-bills/

<comment><USER2> "Do not finance your startup with credit cards. Financing a startup with debt is usually a stupid move, and credit card debt stupidest of all. Credit card debt is a bad idea, period. It is a trap set by evil companies for the desperate and the foolish." - pg</comment>


Welcome to Linux Journal 2.0 It's not dead after all - <AUTHOR> http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/happy-new-year-linux-journal-alive <comment><USER2> [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16050437](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16050437)</comment>


Ask HN: Do you take nootropics? - <AUTHOR> What do you think about them?<p>Which ones do you take? <comment><USER2> Not a nootropic per say but I've noticed a huge difference since focusing on my general health;

1) 7-8 hours sleep per night.

2) 1 hour of exercise per day (some days cardio, other days weights(focus on compounds; squat, deadlift, bench press, shoulder press, pullups, rows))

(for people thinking "I'm too busy to spend an hour of my day exercising". I think the productivity increase of clearing your head doing this exercise more than makes up for the hour it takes.)

3) balanced diet consisting of fresh natural foods. (fruit, veg, meat, fish etc. not frozen meals, microwave food where your not quite sure what's in it)

Found I've lost weight, cardiovascular endurance has increased, I'm stronger and just feel a lot better.

So my advice would be try and do all the above before taking any drugs that aren't very well researched and could cause long term issues.

<comment><USER3> Why no frozen meals?

<comment><USER4> Most commercially packaged frozen meals have lots and lots of sugar, salt and oils added to low quality (cheap) ingredients to make them palatable.

Some people think freezing food destroys its quality, but I think that the evidence for that is weak and fails to regard the loss of quality that comes from keeping things in the fridge for another day.

When I stopped eating ready meals I lost a kilo in a week, I believe (believe) that happened largely because I dropped so much salt out of my diet and therefore I was retaining much less water.

Buy things fresh, make meals and freeze them. This will allow you to cook good things quickly in the evening. Spend an afternoon and make a chicken casserole, a beef stew, a lasagne, a cottage pie and a fish pie. Freeze in portions (aim for five from each) and you have weeks of quick, nutritious and delicious food that means that you will not be stuffing yourself with rubbish.

But also buy a steamer and make sure that you have a large portion of steamed _green_ veg every day. You're five a day can have one orange juice and a couple of bits of fruit, but a decent wodge of green is really important. Tender stem broccoli, greens, cabbage, peas, beans... all take about 30 seconds to prepare and 3-4 minutes to stem (tip: only put a mugful of water in the steamer, it will boil fast and then cook the greens just as well as 4 inches would).

<comment><USER3> Sugar and salt I understand. Do you have more info on the oils? Have not heard that before.

<comment><USER5> A ton of cheap food uses hydrogenated oils, which have been shown to have negative impact on your circulatory system.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogenation#Health_implicatio...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogenation#Health_implications)

<comment><USER6> Oh yes, I forgot to even mention them because they're an automatic 'no' to me.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> I took piracetam years ago when I was considering a career change and prepping for the LSAT exam. I believe that its legal history is somewhat similar to ephedra... 10-15 years ago you could buy it over-the-counter or online, but since then it's been taken off the market in the U.S.

Regardless, my experience was that its only value is the placebo effect. If a substance actually does anything real, _and there is potential for a pharmaceutical company to patent and profit from it_ , then you can generally rest assured that it will be scheduled to require a doctor's prescription. For just about everything, the over-the-counter options consist of vitamins and quackery. So either blatantly break the law, or don't.

As an aside, what is the point of taking a serious nootropic for software development? Typically, a coder's problem isn't failure to get into a groove once they have uninterrupted time. The typical problem is not having uninterrupted time in the first place. Like most people here, probably, I work in an open floor plan environment. I'm subject to constant "drive-by" interruptions that could have been handled better via email, and a neverending roar all around me as colleagues literally scream at each other about Reddit memes or video games or the latest superhero movie.

Do you have a _drug_ that would allow me to completely shut off my hearing, peripheral vision, and other sensory input? So that I can work without having to blast music through $300 noise-canceling headphones (which itself impairs focus, but is the lesser of all evils)? If so, then I would gladly break the law to find a pharmaceutical escape from contemporary office plans that sacrifice productivity for the ability to squeeze headcount into the smallest possible space.

<comment><USER8> >Regardless, my experience was that its only value is the placebo effect. If a substance actually does anything real, and there is potential for a pharmaceutical company to patent and profit from it, then you can generally rest assured that it will be scheduled to require a doctor's prescription. For just about everything, the over-the-counter options consist of vitamins and quackery. So either blatantly break the law, or don't.

Just a counter-point. Melatonin is OTC in the US (sadly not where I live) and the efficacy of melatonin on sleep quality is pretty hard to dispute. It's not what you'd normally call a nootropic maybe, but having melatonin on hand has significantly improved my life

Edit: oh. Yeah. Of course, Adrafinil is OTC in the US too and that's the prodrug for Modafinil. Definitely not placebo either

<comment><USER9> I have a weird experience with melatonin. It puts me out quickly, but I wake up about 4-5 hours later in a half drugged state. For the next few hours I'm awake but drowsy.

<comment><USER10> you might try adding 5-HTP to the mix. i had the same issue, after taking melatonin – i'd fall sleep, but wake up a few hours later. pretty much every night.

right now i take 1/2 of 2.5 mg melatonin (sublingual) with 50-100 mg 5-HTP, ideally 30-45 min before going to bed.

adding 5-HTP was A MIRACLE ! after just a day or two i slept very soundly and had AMAZING dreams – we're talkin 2160p 10.5 THX Lord of the Rings epic trilogy with you playing lead role. those first few weeks i even went to bed earlier just so i could dream longer. :) prior to that it had been decades since i remembered having any dreams. (warning though, i've told several friends about it – after they tried it they had to stop because the dreams were too intense.)

i read about 5-HTP in this book i borrowed from my chiropracter: [http://smile.amazon.com/5-HTP-Natural-Overcome-Depression- In...](http://smile.amazon.com/5-HTP-Natural-Overcome-Depression- Insomnia/dp/0553379461/) basically it states that melatonin is only part of the sleep equation, seratonin is the other part. your body can produce seratonin from 5-HTP (which is the chemical in turkey which makes you drowsy).

also:

staring at a computer screen can really mess with your sleep – due to chemical imbalance with these hormones. to help as much as possible, i installed F.lux on all of my computers.

i also recently added Modalert to my daily routine, but that's another story...

<comment><USER11> I can vouch for F.lux. Its such an essential tool for me now and I have made it a point to get it on all my devices. Apart from the advantages it has in not disrupting my sleep cycle, I actually enjoy the warmer tones. Even when it comes to home lighting, I have always preferred the yellow shades over the incandescent whites. Never tried melatonin, either stand alone or coupled with 5-HTP. Let me read a little more. Thanks for the pointers.

As an aside, I would definitely say get your sleep cycles right and more disciplined definitely puts you in a much higher efficiency bracket. Coupled with some simple lifestyle hacks ( playing a team outdoor sport, if you are not the workout type, no devices in bedroom rule, boring but informative tech talk to go to sleep, light and early dinners, no coffee post sunset) you would be surprised how many extra hours of high concentration work you are capable of.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> I've never heard of this before. To save you some time:

> _Nootropics, also referred to as smart drugs, memory enhancers, neuro > enhancers, cognitive enhancers, and intelligence enhancers, are drugs, > supplements, nutraceuticals, and functional foods that improve one or more > aspects of mental function, such as working memory, motivation, and > attention._

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nootropic](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nootropic)

</comment><comment><USER13> Every day I take a significant dose of one of the ones that you've heard of, for "ADD". I started doing so because of non-coding reasons but reading the Wikipedia article it is listed on that page.

I'm concerned about the long term effects of taking a psychoactive substance every day. However the one that I take has been used for a while so the long term effects are probably more well known that some of the new ones like Modafinil.

I would be extremely careful and think twice about going down this road unless you absolutely need to. I have a lot of experience fiddling with my body chemistry and usually I decide to stop after a while.

IIRC Sigmund Freud had a similar experience, where he injected himself with cocaine 3 times a day for ten years and wrote about it... then after he stopped came to the conclusion that the cocaine was distorting his perception and that he was actually full of shit. Cocaine is not too different from many of these substances.

Enjoy and be safe!

EDIT: bonus reading for the weekend: [http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/weaknesses.html](http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/weaknesses.html)

</comment><comment><USER14> I tried something called Alpha-Brain by Onnit Labs based in Austin. The main ingredients of which are tyrosine, theanine and a bunch of other stuff. It is marketed as improving focus/memory.

I used it for a couple of weeks and saw no benefits. The only noticeable change was my dreams got vivid when taking it (which is also claimed by them). When taking it, I also had short episode that felt like onset of a sudden dementia, I could not remember anything. Example: I couldnt remember where my car was parked when I was standing right in front of it. I dont know if it is caused by Alpha-Brain, but I was not taking anything else during that period. I stopped taking it soon after.

Like they say, there is no biological free lunch. I would say the safest way is probably good nutrition, enough sleep and exercise.

<comment><USER15> theanine appears naturally in green tea

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theanine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theanine)

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> I've been tinkering with nootropics for several years. I've found over that time some things that work for me, and many things that don't. While not all of the following are strictly speaking nootropics, they all contribute to my overall mental state:

\- Aniracetam. Helps a lot with my concentration and working my way through problems logically.

\- Caffeine/L-theanine. Caffeine is a no-brainer, but l-theanine is amazing in that at a 2:1 ration of l-theanine to caffeine it removes essentially all the jumpiness of the caffeine.

\- Tianeptine. This is an anti-depressant that also helps a bit with my anxiety.

\- Noopept. This one helps with my concentration quite a bit, and also makes my vision more vibrant. The vision thing doesn't matter so much, but it's pretty neat.

\- Rhodiola. This helps tremendously with my anxiety and stops me from ruminating.

\- Taurine. Another one that helps me with my anxiety, and has the added benefit of helping with blood pressure. Though I've had my blood pressure under control for years, it's never bad to have a helping hand.

</comment><comment><USER17> I've been taking vyvanse(before that adderall) for the past 10 years. I wouldn't have been able to graduate from highschool without it, I can barely function at my job(devops) without it.

I haven't noticed any long term affects, it definitely works though. It's scheduled so it's not easy to get but it definitely works compared to some of the more hit or miss OTC nootropics.

I'm willing to answer any questions if anyone is interested.

<comment><USER18> Okay, so I'm a college freshmen who graduated high school in three years but did that in a combination of excelling and getting absolute 0's in classes because I'm not able to concentrate. I believe I have adhd, for many reasons, how realistic is it getting diagnosed at 18?

Also, is there really not many noticeable long-term side effects, because I took vyvanse once and holy god it was the first time I was able to sit down and work on something straight for more than three hours without getting distracted other than things that I would naturally get in the flow with.

<comment><USER19> I'm 30 and in med school, had a similar experience in high school, and my first attempt at college wasn't too different. I couldn't have changed gears without the right diagnosis, support and medication (though medication is truly just one aspect of it).

I was diagnosed in my 20s. If you go to a therapist/psych to talk about your issues you have a good chance of working them out and getting the support you need. the first psych to dx me was through the university health department, don't be afraid to use the services that are available for you.

<comment><USER20>
      > (though medication is truly just one aspect of it)

Yes, this is so true. The major pieces of the puzzle for me ...from most to least important... are: good sleep, proper environment, exercise, nutrition, medication.

When I say "nutrition" I don't even mean a strict diet. The most important part there for me is simply avoiding big doses of sugar and carbs. Those leave me drained.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> I was prescribed Ritalin and later Adderall from 3 years old until I was 24, when I quit. They did the job they were prescribed for: I was focused. I found Adderall to be "cleaner" feeling, and it had less of a negative effect on my personality. That said, both of them made me much more angry and type A. There is no doubt in my mind now that my dosage was too high, but back in the 80s and 90s, I don't think anyone really understood what constant stimulant overdoses in children looked like. This stuff has irreversibly shaped who I am for better and worse. I can't really recommend either one to anyone unless they really need it.

On the topic of more accessible nootropics, I have worked with a number of the "racetam" substances, which tend to promote acetylcholine use in the brain. Because of this, all of them were taken with copious amounts of choline. I took Piracetam for about 2.5 years. It worked decently well early on at enhancing my focus, but towards the end, I questioned its benefits and quit. During that time, I also added in splashes of Oxiracetam, Aniracetam, and Pramiracetam. Oxiracetam is hands down the best of them all. It was made for hardcore analytical thinking. I used it primarily when I had exams or when I was more exhausted at work right after my daughter was born. It tends to tire the brain as it wears off and lead to some headaches though. Overall, it was a very useful tool Pramiracetam just gave me an instant headache the couple of times I tried it. Aniracetam is suggested to be more creative and anxiolytic. I felt a little calmer, but not enough to warrant consistent use.

Quitting caffiene was really helpful for me. I know that's close to heresy among developers, but I wake up feeling a lot less crappy.

Lately, I've been just taking Huperzine A, which acts as an acetylcholinesterase inhibitor. I feel like I get something similar to the performance of Piracetam, but without the need for the choline supplement to prevent headaches.

</comment><comment><USER22> No, because Adderall messes with my creativity.

I was doing a math major in college, and whenever I took adderall (legally prescribed) before doing a p-set, I always came up with a long and unelegant solution to a problem. It seemed to motivate me to work very hard, but not to work smart.

No idea if this was just something I had in my head or there is some neurochemical basis for it.

<comment><USER23> I have the exact same problem when taking Adderall/Vyavanse/etc my creativity and memory retention is horrendous. Creativity is such an important feature to your personality and taking it away makes you so robotic and boring that I'd rather have the AD/HD and my normal, fun self than a foggy head all the time.

</comment></comment><comment><USER24> Modafinil. Works great (14 hours of focus and productivity). At $5 a pop it's not something I can afford daily.

If something cheaper becomes available I'd use it.

<comment><USER25> That doesn't seem that expensive, I know some people spend this much for a single cup of coffee.

<comment><USER26> It's all relative.

For a chunk of humanity $5 is their entire discretionary daily spend (and for some it is their entire daily spend).

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER27> I've been taking ~50mg modafinil 5 times a week for years. Last batch I bought was 2 years ago on the grey market (an online indian pharmacy) in 200mg pills form (so I divide them in 4 for a daily dose).

I don't take any on weekends or on holiday, and sometimes I take 100mg if I'm going for a long car journey or something else that requires complete attention...

The effects are very subtle but noticeable: more alertness and concentration, and a more positive outlook on things. I found it's also pretty good at keeping depression at bay.

<comment><USER28> Have you tried not taking it in a while?

I found that modafinil sped my mind up too fast to figure anything out. And I was taking even half what you are taking. Just 25mg.

<comment><USER29> I've heard that armodafinil has a less pronounced effect- not as sped up and a more pronounced return to normality when it wears off. That's the thing that freaked me out about modafinil- it really seemed to last for ages.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER30> I've taken L-Theanine with my coffee for years. The effect is subtle, but it's remarkable - I just look back over the last few hours and realize that I was distraction-proof.

I haven't dabbled in anything else because I don't really like the idea of messing with my brain chemistry too much. Theanine gets a pass because it's just an amino acid, is naturally present in green tea, and is considered extremely safe.

I'll happily recommend it to anyone looking to experiment without too much fear of side effects.

<comment><USER31> I was taking L-Theanine (capsules) regularly a couple years back and I found that I built up a rapid tolerance to it after about a week where it stopped being effective. I had to cycle off every few days. I'm curious if anyone else has encountered this.

<comment><USER32> I am taking something else but I think I noticed the same thing. I took only for 1 month of pills to try it out, so I don't really know if this is what happens in the long run.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER33> I use Modafinil (Modalert) once a week. It allows me to work with 100% focus and productivity for 24 hours... so my week is like this: Mon. to Wed. = meetings readings, learning and planning... then I take a pill and execute hard.

<comment><USER34> Let me get this right. You pop this pill and then work for 24 hours straight? How do you feel the following day?

<comment><USER35> It's like caffeine without side effects. Front end of the 24 hours you can be productive with detailed tasks but towards the latter part you're best with menial tasks, like cleaning.

<comment><USER36> no headaches?

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER37> The best nootropic for me is bicycling into work.

Also, after years of experimenting with caffeine I'm convinced that for me, one cup in the morning is close to ideal. Caffeine stays in the body for many hours, so it's all too easy to fall into the trap where you're tired, so you drink more, &etc.

</comment><comment><USER36> Not a nootropic as such, but fuelling my brain on ketones rather the glucose has made an incredible difference in concentration and cognitive ability.

(Ketogenic = High fat, carb restricted diet)

<comment><USER38> How large a difference? I'm willing to try anything that gives me the focus of Modafinil without actually taking drugs.

<comment><USER39> Good sleep and exercise will do that for you (speaking from experience).

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER40> I take Ritalin, prescribed for ADHD-I. It's made a positive impact on my life.

From time to time I am able to actually _get stuff done_.

I also trialled dexedrine (which made me behave like a ... not nice person) and strattera (which did nothing for me).

<comment><USER17> You should try vyvanse, I used to take Ritalin and then my doctor trailed me on vyvanse and it lasts the entire day with far less negative side affects than Ritalin. I immediately fell in love, it's still patented though so it isn't cheap without insurance.

<comment><USER41> There is also Concerta - which is basically a mechanical pump contained in a pill that delivers Ritalin spread over 8 hours. They aren't under patent, but the extra mechanics built into the pill still drive a generic 30 day prescription into the $200 range (pre-insurance).

<comment><USER42> It isn't mechanical. It's osmotic. This blog has a nice illustration of it:

[https://drgrcevich.wordpress.com/2014/02/23/why-your-kids- co...](https://drgrcevich.wordpress.com/2014/02/23/why-your-kids-concerta- hasnt-been-working-lately/)

More here (pdf):

[https://ejournals.library.ualberta.ca/index.php/JPPS/article...](https://ejournals.library.ualberta.ca/index.php/JPPS/article/viewFile/8282/7448)

(osmosis is the movement of water across a semi permeable membrane, roughly speaking, the pill is arranged so that water is drawn into it, creating pressure that pushes the drug out of a small hole.)

The particular mechanism used in Concerta does appear to be under patent.

<comment><USER41> Mechanical delivery means does not exclude using osmosis to provide the pressure. Since the drug itself doesn't travel across an osmotic barrier, calling the delivery mechanism osmotic doesn't explain the mechanism very well.

That said, I didn't know that the generic versions used a completely different delivery mechanism; thanks for the links!

<comment><USER42> I didn't mean to argue about the words. I read "mechanical pump" and simply didn't believe it, and went and tracked down the above. So for my ears, "mechanical pump" wasn't the right description. I assumed that others might have a similar experience and so I posted what I had found.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER43> Dexamphetamine. 1*5mg = 3 hours of uninterrupted coding, with maybe 1 minute total spent looking away from the screen to rest my eyes.

<comment><USER44> If no one walks up to me or calls to interrupt me, my everyday routine is that level of focus. No drugs beyond a couple of morning coffee cups needed.

One of my coworkers is normal, not like me. When he works in the office there's a lot more socializing, which is great, but it always makes me feel terribly non-productive.

<comment><USER45> Uninterrupted activity: the best nootropic.

</comment></comment></comment><comment> d--b The replies on this thread are very surprising... It seems everyone has tried them!!

The question you should ask yourself is why you would need to take pills to alter your normal brain function in the first place? Do you really need to be more focused / more relaxed? Where does the urge of being more productive come from? What is your end goal? Is that goal really going to make you happier?

<comment><USER46> It isn't as surprising once you realize tea (L-theanine & caffeine), coffee (caffeine) and cigarettes (nicotine) all are nootropics. :)

More information: [http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics](http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics)

</comment></comment><comment><USER47> I take Piracetam, I'm not sure if it works, I'd say no so far (half a year). I'm very interested in nootropics that would work long term (whole life, all the time). Unfortunately most that have a profound effect seem to level-off etc (say Adderall). So I don't think I'll ever try that kind.

</comment><comment><USER48> Here's an interesting post someone made cataloging all the different nootropics they've tried.

[http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics](http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics)

And here's one specifically about modafinil:

[http://www.gwern.net/Modafinil](http://www.gwern.net/Modafinil)

</comment><comment><USER49> I've tried modafinil a few times. It helps me a little with alertness, but not much - I can use it for long drives, but it didn't particularly help with programming. I sometimes get a side-effect from it that makes it something I can't take at work: I get super cranky and easily angered, like shouting- argument angry. It's out of character for me, and really weird.

I took piracetam for a few months, and I thought maybe it was helping my focus and short-term memory. The side effect of that one, though, was even weirder: recovering sense memories of being a little kid. Like, flashbacks of the physical pain of the first time I had a bad injury. Vivid recollection of my adult teeth pushing my baby teeth out of the way. Even sensations of being an infant with no body autonomy at all.

Worth experimenting with? Absolutely.

Magic bullet for superhuman productivity? No way.

</comment><comment><USER50> I've had interesting and unexpected results taking Lecithin supplements. There is a stimulating effect similar to caffeine or a B12 shot, and there is also a focusing effect where I could not stop fixating. I can have a tendency to day dream but not on Lecithin. It makes your train of thought very hard to derail. I still take it sometimes but not regularly. It hurts my stomach and can be a bit too much sometimes.

As far as I understand, lecithin breaks down/converts to choline an inositol, and it's these which are causing the mental effect. Since it's a food, the effects aren't as immediate. You'll notice it more on day two.

<comment><USER51> Only references to Lecithin as a supplement I found were Soy Lecithin, is this it?

<comment><USER50> Yep, that's it.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER52> I used to take a wide array of cognitive boosters during higher education and piracetam is one I know quite well personally. To make this short:

It works for some things (like reading for hours at a time) but it has made me sometimes feel "foggy-headed" and less productive/creative. The effects it has on my GI tract have been problematic at times (causing gas) and it tends to make my blood sugar crash at T+3. Plus with the massive amount of choline you have to take alongside the product, it became an inconvenience rather than an aid.

I would recommend sulbutiamine over piracetam if you want to "get things done".

</comment><comment><USER38> I take Modafinil every now and then. It's very powerful and can give me an amazing level of focus.

Even though research suggests that they have little negative long term side effects I do worry about taking them and would prefer a more natural method to get the same result.

Basically it's like this; If I get home from a 10 hour workday almost falling asleep, I can take one pill and suddenly it's like the day starts over again as my focus has returned. At the moment I feel like I need to do it as I have projects I work on in the evening that are important for my career progression.

<comment><USER53> Health is your biggest asset. No career will be fun if your health is ruined. Be careful and treat your body well!

</comment></comment><comment><USER54> Never took any drugs. Found that hot chocolate worked better for me than coffee to wake me up. However, the one safe drug I keep hearing about is modafinil. How safe? I don't know.

All it takes for me to get focus when I'm sleepy is the glow of a computer screen. It turns out that light hitting your eyes tells your brain it's not time to sleep.

[http://sleepdisorders.about.com/b/2013/01/26/30-days-to- bett...](http://sleepdisorders.about.com/b/2013/01/26/30-days-to-better-sleep- expose-yourself-to-morning-sunlight.htm)

</comment><comment><USER55> Be careful.

A lot of the drugs with strong effects necessarily have long term consequences from repeated use owing to their mechanisms of action.

You risk making yourself 'dumber' over time with prolonged use. Especially, with the amphetamine based crap that US doctors seem okay to use for medical purposes despite most of the developed world not doing so, and using safer alternatives.

<comment><USER38> Out of curiosity, have you heard of any negative long term side effects from Modafinil and it's derivatives? (I don't think they are based on 'amphetamine')

<comment><USER36> I have a friend who has taken it every day for the last 2 years. No negative side effects except when he doesn't take it, he feels like he is not performing at his best.

The major concern with Modafinil is that we just don't know what the long term side effects are. That's the risk you take.

<comment><USER37> That is exactly why I've never tried it. I'm afraid it will work, and then I'll want or need to use it all the time. Then who knows what will happen years from when I begin.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER56> I've taken Aniracetam for a while. It didn't make me as nervous as Piracetam.

Went on and off and noticed some memory improvement.

</comment><comment><USER57> I take Google constantly. The way it works (for me) is amazing. Basically whenever I have a hard problem I can just wiggle my fingers, stare at the screen for a few minutes, and then BAM! I know how people usually solve that problem. Its like my mind has expanded and tapped directly into other people's experiences.

</comment><comment><USER58> L-theanine has been a miracle drug for me. Took away a lot of my depression/energy issues.

</comment><comment><USER59> I take piracetam/pramiracetam/noopept on and off and cycle between caffeine+l-theanine and nicotine. Some non-nootropic supplements I take are fish oil, Vitamin D3, and melatonin. Here are some of my anecdotes.

::Piracetam

I haven't been able to get very consistent results with piracetam, but it's definitely not placebo. I've found that piracetam is hit-or-miss for a lot of people. Some are very sensitive and only need 500mg, while others, like myself, need somewhere around 10g, and it just doesn't work for others. When I started, the effects were fantastic: I had increased focus, more vivid dreams, and was more outgoing and personable when I'm normally introverted. However, after about 2 weeks of regular usage, much of the effect went away. This seems consistent with some other peoples' experiences with piracetam on the web. It seems to be having more effect now after a 2 month break, so it may just be tolerance. Also, @StevePerkins implied that piracetam is illegal to purchase in the US, but it is still unscheduled and legal to buy in most countries.

::Pramiracetam/Noopept

These are much less subtle than piracetam.

I usually take between 200-500mg pramiracetam and it has the same focusing effect of piracetam, but with a stimulating effect as well. I haven't noticed any tolerance issues, even with a period of regular use.

With noopept, I only felt any effects when consuming around 5mg sublingually. It's not a racetam so it's a bit riskier, in my opinion. I felt focused without any stimulating effects and I found it helpful for exams. Some people have reported short term memory issues with higher doses.

::Caffeine/L-theanine

This really is one of the best nootropics around if you can reduce your tolerance. Just caffeine makes me feel jittery, but taking it 1:1 with l-theanine makes me feel calm, focused, and energetic.

::Nicotine

I cycle this with caffeine to reduce tolerance. I use 2mg gums, and it works pretty well. It feels like caffeine with the edge taken off.

Like others have said, the benefits of nootropics are marginal compared to the low hanging fruit of sleep, exercise, and diet. If you're interested, just do your homework beforehand and balance the risks with the benefits. Everybody's different; find out which ones work and don't work for you, at what dosages. I think the racetams are relatively less risky, but they are psychoactive at high dosages, and there have not been studies on their long term effects over several years.

</comment><comment><USER60> Caffeine and L-Theanine work well together. The effects and mechanisms were well enough understood for me to feel comfortable trying this out.

</comment><comment><USER61> I take nicotine. I am not a coder; I write non-fiction. I figure it was good enough for Mark Twain, it is good enough for me.

<comment><USER62> in what form?

<comment><USER63> I am not the commenter you're replying to. But I wanted to add that I am a coder and use nicotine extensively. That plus moderate amounts of caffeine.

I use either electronic cigarettes or snus. I figure both are at least safer than cigarettes. However I am concerned that both the hardware and liquid for e-cigs is of unknown danger.

The hardware, which heats the liquid you inhale, has metal parts. There are no regulations in place about what metal they use.

Regarding the liquid, I ended up finding one manufacturer who used all USP _certified_ ingredients (except where not applicable such as with flavorings) and tested them for numerous known toxicities. However, PG and VG (the two main carrier liquids) have never been tested for safety in regard to long-term inhalation (even though they're GRAS). Same goes for inhaling those natural and artificial flavors.

At least with snus, although it is tobacco based, the people of Sweden have used it for a long time and studies have been done to assess its safety. One study showed only a very small increase for some cancers. My main concern is gum loss or similar. However the safety of snus is associated with how it's manufactured, so like e-cigs that's kind of a wildcard.

Anyhow, as far as the mental effects, it's kind of hard for me to comment since my entire teen and adult life has been spent using nicotine. However, I believe it prevents boredom with my work and helps to keep me somewhat engaged. Probably not much different than how your favorite music makes you feel when exercising. Also it slightly improves mood like caffeine.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER64> The closest I get is I occasionally take creatine. I'm vegetarian, I think the studies go either way on if the low creatine in a veg diet matters for mental acuity or not. I'll take 3g daily for a month, then forget about it, feel like it does nothing, etc. I notice small benefits re: muscle size, but never anything mental.

</comment><comment><USER65> For those of you who do take them: Aren't you concerned by side effects and/or long term health effects? Not judging, just genuinely curious; I've looked into them but it seems the general consensus is that their effects, both short and long term, are not very well understood yet.

<comment><USER66> I use Armodafinil/Modafinil 4-5 times per week, cycling for a few days here and there.

I've considered a lot of others as well (e.g. *racetams - avoided on reports of 'brain fog' and a few of mental impairment - scary!). However, out of the dozens(?) I ended up considering, Modafinil was the only one I ended up deciding to try and ultimately take regularly.

I've read enough studies (and try to keep up to date) to know what our current knowledge about it is. In almost all of the studies, side-effects have been fairly standard (headaches, a few people getting sick, etc.). It's been used on-prescription for the past decade without seeing any uproar.

In the long-term, I consider the risk of unknowns worth the reward. Most evidence points to it being fairly safe, if not, that's a gamble I might pay for.

I drink alcohol to have fun, often to excess. I eat junk food. I actively choose to do a lot of things that shorten my lifespan for negligible returns.

If this little magic pill, which costs the same as a bottle of coca cola, makes me feel motivated and alert for 14 hours a day, I'm going to take it until I find a reason not to.

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> i tried piracetam but unfortunately it didn't have any effect on me. more recently i've been taking modafinil which has helped a lot – not necessarily with focus per-se, but being able to get through any drowsiness or that "wall" of just getting something started.

though i will add my lifestyle is pretty clean, i would probably work on that first if yours is not.

i recently changed my diet to mostly paleo but do include rice and beans. i use a nutribullet everyday to make my breakfast. i avoid processed foods, those with preservatives, etc. and cut down considerably on alcohol intake. i exercise a little bit (cardio mostly).

adding paleo was great in that i no longer experienced the crash after eating a meal. about a year ago it was necessary to take 1-2 15 minute naps per day. now i can go 14+ hours without issue.

</comment><comment><USER67> L-Theanine. Recently went through an interview spree. Helps me get rid of nervousness and focus on solving problems. Naturally found in tea leaves but obviously in small dosage. Can't confirm side-effects but sometimes gives me headache if I drink beer on the same day, particularly IPAs!

<comment><USER68> If you get good quality sencha, especially the (somewhat pricey) Gyokuro, you get a high dose of L-theanine and an absolutely delicious taste. One of my favorite pleasures in life!

</comment></comment><comment><USER69> Piracetam/choline/caffeine stack for about six months.

Would like to do another course at some stage. Mind was massively productive and I fleshed out several ideas over the period. Also got rid of the "mind fog" that starts to creep in from around 30 years old onwards.

</comment><comment><USER70> Just caffeine and L-theanine. Mixture of coffee and caff/l-theanine pills.

I like the pills instead of all caffeine because I end up with bad jitters if I have too much caffeine in a day.

</comment><comment><USER62> i've tried piracetam - the effects for me were borderline coffee + espresso for 30 minutes to an hour. it also seemed to stimulate my digestive tract. nothing extremely noticeable in terms of cognitive throughput, but I remember hearing about its increased memory effects in rats as a long term benefit.

I drink 2 -3 cups of caffeinated tea per day, occasionally I drink coffee. This is all I need.

</comment><comment><USER71> I have started taking Bacopa from Himalays 2 weeks back. Hoping to see results in 8 weeks.

</comment><comment><USER72> dark chocolate coffee coconut oil combo green tea and coffee chia seeds

</comment><comment><USER73> NO!

I investigated nootropics extensively. If you want to know the fruits of my research:

* anything that "works" has a very pronounced psychoactive effect on the brain. Which is scary in the long-term.

* by far the biggest cognitive boost you can get is SLEEPING WELL! Do this FIRST! It's easy to fix and gives a huge boost in output.

* caffeine works as well as many nootropics, with little to no side-effects if taken sensibly. Also combine with Theanine if wanting to venture into the world of "probably works and has harmless side-effects".

<comment><USER38> I agree with you about sleep, it's very underrated for cognitive ability and memory development.

Did your research turn up anything negative about Modafinil?

I find Modafinil to be much more powerful than caffeine, however I do worry about long term side effects, even though my research suggests they are safe to use.

<comment><USER39> See my article on the topic for more detailed, in-depth view of modafinil and start-ups:

[http://swombat.com/2012/2/27/modafinil-and- startups](http://swombat.com/2012/2/27/modafinil-and-startups)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER74> M-F I take one 200mg tablet of caffeine in the morning.

I also quit getting blackout drunk 4-5 nights a week.

<comment><USER75> While I wasn't getting blackout drunk repeatedly, I definitely had an unhealthy relationship with alcohol, and removing alcohol had enormous positive effects on my cognitive abilities.

I also do a heavy dose of caffeine in the morning.

</comment></comment><comment><USER76> Lots of compounds being discussed here - seems like some could be useful. But how do I know what is safe?

</comment><comment><USER77> Piracetam, matcha, 5HE, dark chocolate. AT9PUiYE1X8FPWLUmo8aZKT7o7pS4Mmc4g</comment>


Steve Wozniak's business card - <AUTHOR> http://www.luckow.com/clients/woz/images/WOZMetalProof.jpg

<comment><USER2> Sounds like it's made out of plastic. And what's so special about it?

Also notice that the fingers have a flat surface. That implies that the hand was pressed against some surface, which would be glass in this case.

<comment><USER3> Like maybe umm... a scanner... making the scan perhaps?

Whats special? Its minimalist and classy but very unique. Fits the woz well. The only thing I don't like about it is the duplicated logo. (In the mesh and as the central logo.) I know its a design no-no, but this is the first time I've really ever found it distracting. I think I'd have skipped the top mesh altogether.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> I was expecting it to just be some information written on a cue card or a napkin or something. Not sure why, just seems like he could get away with handing that out.

</comment><comment><AUTHOR> And it can be used to cut steak.</comment>


Mozilla's JaegerMonkey - <AUTHOR> http://www.bailopan.net/blog/?p=683

<comment><USER2> Javascript interpreter wars are awesome keep getting more innovation, I'm happily using Node.js for my servers now. Its pretty cool the Mozilla guys are using some of the webkit javascript engine, talk about collaboration.

<comment><USER3> That's precisely what makes free/open source software so interesting. You can compete, of course, but you also are free to build upon the work of others, to borrow ideas and code and then run in a different direction and see how far you can get.

I miss the hardware diversity of the 80's, but there are exciting times for software folks.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> the interesting bit is they are using code from webkit. I wonder if mozilla could also integrate google's Irregexp regular expression engine, which appears to be scarily fast in some probably irrelevant tests :) [http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/u32/benchmark.php?test=reg...](http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/u32/benchmark.php?test=regexdna&lang=all&lang2=v8)</comment>


Texas Students Revolt Against Mandatory RFID Tracking Chips - <AUTHOR> http://www.informationliberation.com/?id=40802 <comment><USER2> It's just a standard card with RFID embedded, right? Unless I'm wrong here, the cards can be read by the standard scanners mounted on the doors. So rather than some creepy "tracking device", they'd have to be used for registering entry/exit from a classroom explicitly - pretty much the same as any big office... Which doesn't seem to make much sense to me, since they can move around without scanning the card (enter behind another person) - this happens even in many workplaces where everyone is supposed to scan their tag on entry.

Another strange part is that when looking at attendance, this seems even easier to hack - just give your tag to someone else so they can scan it.

Am I missing something here? Are there RFID tags that work on longer distances?

Edit: Found some long-range RFID solutions out there. Other points remain though... seems easy to game and many offices already use it.

<comment><USER3> Think EZ-Pass for humans where there are sensors throughout the building mapping the location of each person. Wouldn't matter if you entered behind another person or not as your location could still be discerned with enough readers.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> I've always found the selective paranoia of technophobes to be strange. I would bet that the kids who object to the RFIDs are probably carrying smartphones that can be tracked just as easily: [http://www.pcworld.com/article/255802/this_smartphone_tracki...](http://www.pcworld.com/article/255802/this_smartphone_tracking_tech_will_give_you_the_creeps.html) These RFIDs are even easier to disable than cell phones since they can just be kept in a metallic pouch when not needed, but it's much more difficult to keep a smartphone in airplane mode all the time.

These people remind of other technophobes who are afraid of radiation from WiFi and cell phones for "health reasons" but don't have a problem with sunbathing. The school should just invest in some science and technology classes rather than trying to argue with these people.

<comment><USER5> The RFID tag IDs are explicitly being used for tracking student location by faculty _and_ are mandatory. Smart phones are neither mandatory nor is location information available to school faculty. It isn't really the same thing.

The school system is doing this because they think it will improve attendance and earn them more funding from the state. They obviously didn't educate people very well (a lot of misconceptions were apparent in the video) and I don't think this is going to necessarily improve attendance, either.

<comment><USER6> The phone is continously broadcasting wifi and bluetooth MAC addresses, it's as good as any other radio beacon for tracking.

<comment><USER7> But for some key difference: aiplane mode, and schools not having Bluetooth/wifi trackers running.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Oh to be in school again when this type of technology is being introduced to day to day life. Am I the only one who, rather than being outraged, is thrilled at the potential hacking opportunities and other shenanigans this introduces? The fun that could be had...

<comment><USER9> <http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Marauders_Map>

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> Just put the chip in the microwave for a few seconds. It won't do any noticeable damage, and it will destroy the RFID.

<comment><USER11> Actually that leads to visible marks on the RFID.

Much easier to hold the card up to the light and find the chip, then snap the traces by bending it. I did this at summer camp to great effect. I had to get a new card so I could get into the building.

<comment><USER12> I renewed my passport about a year early as the chips were going into the new versions, though I hear a little percussive maintenance solves the problem when it arises again.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> These are HID cards we use them all the time to get into secure areas at work. When I was in college we used cards with mag strips to get in and out of our dorm rooms. How is this any different?

</comment><comment><USER14> Most schools already have an ID scanner at the entrance to every building, some even use their IDs as a stored-value system for purchases on (or even off) campus. They already know every time you enter a building, log on to a campus PC, do your laundry. With that combined with CCTV all over campus, how does this actually make things worse for the student?

</comment><comment><USER15> So if this is being used to track attendance what is to stop someone from just carrying their friends id for the day through the EZ-pass at the entrance?

If a student lobs their id over the fence, then walks out of the campus is the system going to think they were at school all night?

Seems very problematic to implement an EZ-pass style system.

</comment><comment><USER16> RFIDs have a range of, what... 2 feet? So unless this is some new super-high- tech kind of RFID, it's a key, not a tracker. It's used to access the school, you swipe it when you go to class. There is nothing that makes this technology capable of tracking you out in the street. This is stupid.

</comment><comment><USER17> Nearly all offices of any significant size do this already, using badges† to unlock various doors on the premises. By tracing your badge as it is swiped at various doors, they can pretty much determine everywhere you've been on any given day.

† or codes, or biometrics, etc.

</comment><comment><USER18> Faraday shields in 3, 2, 1 . . .

</comment><comment><USER19> "It makes me uncomfortable. It's an invasion of my privacy"

That's bullshit. Its not by any means a invasion of privacy since you're in a school, which may already have cameras to track you. This is for the good of the students.

Here in Brazil we have these and they are great for the school and the students, no invasion of privacy, and helps the school to know if you're in or out.

<comment><USER20> This post is a great example of how rights are eroded slowly. 20 years ago having cameras tracking your every move in a school would have been a strange proposition, and a system to precisely track and record your every move on campus would have been considered insane. Today cameras are accepted as normal, and a tracking system doesn't sound so bad anymore. Really scary stuff.

If you told a person 20 years ago that the government would be taking naked pictures of you before you got on an airplane, they wouldn't have believed you. Now our children will grow up thinking that's normal, and when their kids have to agree to have a government-owned tracking camera installed in their homes to verify their behavior one month prior to their flight, that will not seem so outrageous either.

<comment><USER21> Schools have always taken attendance, and not being able to locate a specific student at a random time is, well, bad.

If Principal Vernon didn't catch you, did you still break the rules?

The house camera thing sounds expensive.

<comment><USER20> Schools have also managed to more or less solve the problem for centuries already without cameras or RFID tracking.

House cameras do sound expensive. They also sound ridiculous. But just a few years ago, mandatory naked pictures of your body before boarding a plane _also_ sounded ridiculous. And they cost $170,000 each[1], which I imagine doesn't include maintenance and salaries for the operators. That sounds expensive.

[1] [http://www.aolnews.com/2010/12/20/a-few-facts-about-tsas- ful...](http://www.aolnews.com/2010/12/20/a-few-facts-about-tsas-full-body- scanners/)

<comment><USER21> Total recall is more than 20 years old, and they had full body scanners entering mass transit. Granted, that's a movie. It never really happened. But people were exposed to the idea a long time ago.

I don't think the idea was as far fetched as you're making it out to be.

 _edit_ (sorry)

There's also the whole issue of schools having the issue solved. I don't think that's true. Schools and classes are getting bigger. I'm not sure how trustworthy a roll call is in a class of 40. There are ways to mitigate that, of course, but why waste minutes a day when you can just slap on a cheap technical fix. The old way literally wastes days of instruction by saying 'here'.

 _edit, again, because i'm an ass_ (sorry)

If you're putting your kids in the hands of the state, it seems odd worrying that the state is monitoring their behavior closely. It's not like kids have rights. The state is charged with care of those kids, maybe it's a bizzaro solution, but it's a strictly audited and accountable solution.

<comment><USER7> I don't know about Brazil, but all US residents have rights guaranteed by the Constitution, including children, and now black people and even women.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Static Typing and Functional Languages - <AUTHOR> http://etherplex.org/archives/136 <comment><USER2> That's really an odd post. The Hindley-Milner type inference algorithm is from ~1969. Advanced static typing systems have been around for ages, it's not like we suddenly have the capability of building languages with them.

Mark me down as confused about what the author was trying to say here.

<comment><USER3> Could you supply an example of an "older advanced static typing system"?

<comment><USER4> The first ML implementation by Luca Cardelli was done at the same time as K&R C was fully implemented. _36 years ago!_

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> er - type inference in ocaml is descendent from ML, which had the feature in the 70s - hell, hindley-milner was published in 1969. This has nothing to do with how recently the language has been developed, it is a simple tradeoff between type safety and developer effort. There is really no room for speculation on a subject that a 15 second visit to wikipedia would clear up.

</comment><comment><USER6> Not sure what the moral of this piece is. But that piece of Java code is both impressive & scary as hell at the same time.</comment>


Talk: "The Relationship Between COBOL and Computer Science" - <AUTHOR> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_AS6I39BkI <comment><AUTHOR> This is a talk I gave based on the paper "The Relationship Between COBOL and Computer Science". I also work in some references to Sammet's "The Early History of COBOL", which is sadly behind an ACM paywall.</comment>


Breaking the Web with hash-bangs - <AUTHOR> http://isolani.co.uk/blog/javascript/BreakingTheWebWithHashBangs <comment><USER2> We've had hashbangs in Unix for 30 years, and while they were not entirely perfect (bit of a violation of the kernel/userspace boundry going on; issues with suid), they've been good to us.

It's really highly annoying that this good old thing is now associated with flaming javascript evil.

</comment><comment><USER3> Maybe I'm explaining the obvious here, but there is a reason people do this. If you have built your site so that the content is generated by Javascript running on the client then you need some way of making the page's current state visible so that it can be bookmarked. Without full adoption of HTML 5 that means you need to modify the URL. And the only part of the URL you can change without forcing a pageload is the part after the #.

So you _need_ to do this if you want the user to be able to bookmark pages whose appearance depends on Javascript running. Think of it as the equivalent of "GET", but on the client - when the page loads, the Javascript reads what is after the # and re-generates the content.

Of course, that then breaks search and so you need #! which is a convention that allows server side code to give search engines the same thing that you are showing your user. But that doesn't mean that every use of storing client side state using # is automatically crazy or stupid or trivial to avoid.

Having said that, making a system that displays a blank page when Javascript fails _is_ pretty dumb.

</comment><comment><USER4> I could not figure out what this article was trying to say. Either I'm tireder than I think I am or it's _really_ badly written.

<comment><USER5> The problem is that the meaningful part of the URL is only sent to the server via JavaScript. Your browser doesn't normally send the fragment (the part after the #) when you access a page.

That means there's no fallback for when the JavaScript breaks (which just happened) or for crawlers (except Google), browsers without JavaScript, etc. The site has absolutely no content without working JavaScript.

The author asserts that this also breaks caching. (AFAICT, more analysis would be needed to support this, because the extra request the JavaScript makes may very well be correctly cacheable.)

<comment><USER4> Thanks. What got me was that for some reason I couldn't figure out whether I was being told why the author thought #! was a bad idea, or why Lifehacker had thought it was a good idea.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> The purpose and meaning of the hash-bang convention is that there is a "real" url that corresponds to this "javascript" url. That has a lot of advantages that the post does not mention.

<comment><USER7> Yeah, but the post is questioning the point of changing every page to an ajax call.</comment></comment>


Ask HN: What are the best resources to learn the DOM API? - <AUTHOR> <comment><USER2> Can there be anything that beats MDN?

[https://developer.mozilla.org/en- US/docs/Learn/JavaScript/Cl...](https://developer.mozilla.org/en- US/docs/Learn/JavaScript/Client-side_web_APIs) [https://developer.mozilla.org/en- US/docs/Web/API](https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/API)

</comment><comment><USER3> [http://www.domenlightenment.com/](http://www.domenlightenment.com/) is great.</comment>


So today I decided to delete my Facebook account.  - <AUTHOR> http://blog.sebastianavina.com/2009/11/ego-web-and-modern-sins.html

<comment><USER2> I dislike the usage of the word "stalk" to mean visiting someone's online profile. Stalking is defined to involve an element of unwelcome harassment that isn't present by visiting someone's online profile, even if done obsessively.

<comment><USER3> Clearly English is not the author's first language, yet I felt the writing was clear and the points well-made, so I'm willing to overlook the lack of connotative preciseness.</comment></comment>


Ask HN: What are some of the best integrations you've seen in SaaS apps? - <AUTHOR>

It seems like that recently a lot of services add a really simple, one-way relationship and call it integration. Like Asana has Dropbox "integration" and all it does is open an iframe for you to select a file and attach it to a task (Dropbox and Asana are examples, I'm pretty sure you can replace them with many other services without too much thinking). Do you know any examples of deep integrations implemented in SaaS applications? I'm specifically for Dropbox and Google Drive integrations, but am generally curious about the best and worst integrations you've seen over the time in general. <comment><USER2> By far the best integration with other services I have seen is Slack. Being able to connect Jenkins, GitHub, Trello, Stripe, and custom build scripts. The reason, IMHO, that it works so well is that all the integrations behave natively in Slack without being obtrusively different. They did a great job with integrations, and the ability to communicate with these integrations, i.e. start a Jenkins job, from inside Slack makes it even better.

</comment><comment><USER3> In enterprise and B2B apps, such integrations are fairly routine and they do run the gamut from the simple "click on a link to launch an app in another window to iframe-style integration to very deep integration.

Some examples of the latter that I've seen are features like being able to create contacts and accounts in Salesforce.com from a customer service web app and running a customer credit check in a CRM app from a third-party credit checking service etc.

</comment><comment><USER4> Box.com and its login integration. They did the SAML communication (or whatever they use) really well. As a result, visiting their URL at yourbusiness.box.com will redirect your to your company's authorization page where you can supply your native login credentials, two-factor auth, etc that you're already used to.</comment>


Ask HN: Your "simpler than I thought" epiphanies with computers - <AUTHOR>

I have had a few epiphanies when it comes to my understanding of computer systems that encouraged me to explore something that I had previously found intimidating. I am curious as to what other areas I would explore after hearing others' epiphanies.
An example – the command line. Being part of the "point-and-click generation," I became much less intimidated by the command line once I began thinking of the command line as a text-based file manager, and once I knew that most of the commands were actually the filenames of executables placed in the directories named in the PATH environmental variable. Before that I didn't think that the command line dealt primarily with something as familiar as directories and files, and I didn't know that you could start any program from it. I thought that I very likely would FUBAR the computer if I explored it.
Another is communication by applications over the Internet. In an argument on IRC about which was the best web browser, someone humourously suggested telnet. That made me curious, so I searched the web and found this[1] web page. It made me realise that most, if not all, connections over a network made by applications are basically two-way streams of linear data – two lines of one's and zeros, and that many of these streams could be read as plain text using something like telnet. After that I began exploring other protocols as well with the aid of this[2] Wikipedia article.
[1] Best Viewed with telnet to port 80:
http://www.dgate.org/~brg/bvtelnet80/
[2] List of TCP and UDP port numbers:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_TCP_and_UDP_port_numbers <comment><USER2> Square peaked in my interest in hardware. If Square didn't exist and I had the idea, I probably wouldn't have done it given

a) my lack of understanding on how hard or how difficult doing different level of hardware dev is and

b) that an audio jack could transmit more than audio

That opened my interest to exploring all sorts of things about hardware where previously, my entire experience on the technical side had been primarily software.

</comment><comment><USER3> My "simpler than I thought" moment was when I really understood javascript, after having programmed a few years with a strongly-typed language (C#, before C# 4.0 and the dynamic objects).

When I understood that everything is an object, how the scope works with inline functions and callbacks, etc... I was shocked at how easy it was to do everything in javascript with very little code and while still being easy to read and very flexible. I now embrace Node.js fully and I love every part of it.</comment>


African oligarchs built the same wealth plundering structures as colonialists [pdf] - <AUTHOR> https://www.zammagazine.com/images/pdf/documents/African_Oligarchs.pdf <comment><USER2> In many cases, did the oligarchs not simply take over the colonialists' enterprises, often with the cooperation of the former colonialists, who continued to make considerable profits themselves? One of the techniques of colonialism was to put a local ethnic or social group in a position to profit from colonialism, and so have a vested interest in perpetuating it. Such groups were sometimes the seed of the post-colonial oligarchy, if they could hold on to power.</comment>


An Open Letter to Women in Technology - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/about-work/405b2d12d213?s

<comment><USER2> To the submitter:

I'm no more a fan of poseur Marxist rants than you are, but HN submissions should generally be something worth reading, not every tumblr-level rant you want to shine a light on.

</comment><comment><USER3> Strangely enough, this is very similar to [http://www.sugarrae.com/rants-in- bitchland/women-tech-confer...](http://www.sugarrae.com/rants-in- bitchland/women-tech-conferences-and-bs/) , except this one takes a militant slant.

What people forget about Gandhi is that he refused to condemn actively militant actions by others.

<comment><USER4> @mdisraeli

Rae is angry that organizations enforce quotas-- this stance is what feminism might call "backlash" against the movement: that the people working for change ARE the cause of the problem.

"...backlash posits the women's liberation movement as the source of many of the problems alleged to be plaguing women..." -Susan Faludi, Backlash: The Undeclared War Against American Women

Shanley is angry that tech-employed women are complacent. According to Shanley, the problem needs to be addressed by women. These could be seen as opposing views.

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> Joke? Joke.

</comment><comment><USER6> Terrible read</comment>


Reasons not to use Scala - <AUTHOR> http://www.reddit.com/r/haskell/comments/1pjjy5/odersky_the_trouble_with_types_strange_loop_2013/cd3bgcu

<comment><USER2> Hmm... maybe you want to use Clojure? That would be a good reason not to use Scala. Or Elixir/Erlang? There are two god reasons not to use Scala.

Not to mention rxJava and Camel.

Oh, and let's not forget the most important reason of all. It's too hard to change! So just keep doing whatever you are doing. You will be like the old COBOL developers who just faded into the woodwork.</comment>