Ask YC: Is it a bad idea to...? - <AUTHOR> Is it a bad idea to build a product where the distribution model relies heavily on sales?
Here's the problem: our product fulfills a big need (not a want) for a certain group of individual consumers. However, they're not part of the TC50K and it won't be easy to get the word out to them. What we're thinking about doing instead is selling the product to HR departments in big companies (a few of our competitors are already doing this). There's a lot more money there, but the product doesn't fill as big a need anymore and selling to the enterprise seems a lot harder than selling to individual customers.
Any suggestions? Thanks. <comment><USER2> Hard to draw any specific conclusions, but the cost of a sales team can be fairly easily determined. A lot of that stuff is really more science than art, and there are some good resources to help guide you.

Plenty of companies have been successful with an app that is sold through a sales organization.

I've done some of the math before, and have run/developed tech sales organizations. Email me if you have more specific questions that you don't want to post publicly.

<comment><AUTHOR> What's your email address? :)

<comment><USER2> It's in my profile. I try not to post it out in the open too much to minimize bot harvesting.

<comment><USER3> Nobody but news.yc admins can see the email you enter in the 'email:' textbox in your profile. You need to put it in the 'about:' box too.

<comment><USER4> By far the most annoying "feature" on this site. There needs to be a simple checkbox next to the email field where you decide whether or not to make it public in an spam proof way, like an image or two random characters instead of the . and @.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Most startups i read of here, try succeeding in getting famous with a service known by millions of people. But, the market for startups trying to pitch products to well-established companies is not only big, it's also quite worth the effort, compared to direct-marketing. In most of the cases, startups don't have financial resources to reach out for residential customers, no matter how interesting your product might be (ok, you still might dream about succeeding like $youtube, $facebook, $whatever, but reality is you need some revenue to pay your rent, regardless what enthusiasts tell you.. and they won't pay your rent, unless they sign some investment thing - at least, here in Europe we tend to think like that).

However: large corporates often either lack innovation, or they try to lower costs by implementing something which is open-source. There is your chance. Go implement something based on open-source which is competitive to some commercial product, and you'll see you can sell for 1/5 of the price of big vendors.... and a lot of companies are really sick of being dependend of big corporates like Cisco, Nortel, whatever... you "just have to get your foot into the door" of such companies... and for this task, you have to have a great sales person.... you don't make it as a technical kind of person... I tried it... forget it... it's a completely different world... the important thing is: respect it... these sales-guys sell your late grand-mother, but they keep you going... No-one on the street will ever recognise you, and no-one on the street will have heard of your company, but does that really matter if you deliver to a big corporate which pays you some ten thousands of dollards a month to satisfy THEIR customers? Think about it, before wasting just another 10 men months to something RESIDENTIAL customers might like.

<comment><USER6> The biggest challenge here is getting ideas in this space, since most of us are at small companies (all software companies are small in the big picture). If you are someone working in the IT department of a large company, you have an advantage. A huge one if fact - you are probably the target market of your product. The question remains - should someone go work for a large company for the sole purpose of generating ideas?

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> Programmers are maybe a little sheltered, but there are these people called "salesmen" who are sometimes quite good at dealing with the problems you'll have. If you genuinely fill a "big need", then it's just a matter of hiring the right person.

</comment><comment><USER8> I'd say there's nothing wrong with this. I work for a small company that solicits specifically to one specific kind of organization. Our entire business model is based on targeting and sales, not open registration or enterprise solutions. The company was started around 2000, so it's worked well for almost 7 years now.

</comment><comment><USER9> I'd rather have a sales team than sell to enterprises. Selling to enterprises (which I do a bit in my current job) is so painful that I'd definitely recommend staying away from it. Sell it to the individuals in those enterprises and maybe one day it'll be worth the hassle of selling to the whole enterprise.

<comment><USER2> I've done some enterprise sales as well, and I think it depends a lot on what you're selling vs. what they're buying.

If you have the right product, the enterprise sale is a rigorous, but also fun and rewarding process. If you have the wrong product (as in the case of my last company), the enterprise sales process is like trying to push a boulder uphill against a headwind on a mountain made of teflon.

<comment><USER9> Each to their own, I guess I'm a hacker who's not keen on doing sales. Enterprise sales seems to be an ugly dance of feature comparisons and bs, which I hate.

<comment><USER2> I think yours is a common feeling among true hackers. Sales is less of a "binary" thing, there are too many other grey areas that get in the way of making it a process that can be solved with pure "math".

You could say that I am more of a social-engineering hacker than a software hacker. Although, I know more than a fair bit of perl, C++, SQL, linux, etc. I've written my own apps and various bits of glue logic as part of getting a sale done, because I could, and because it was the most efficient use of resources.

But sales-hacking is (IMO) sort of a language or process unto itself. It can be fun and challenging and rewarding (when it's not utterly aggravating :) )

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> i think you would have more luck if you were more specific in your question about your product and your customers.

</comment><comment><USER11> What's your funding situation? Do you know anyone in an HR department at any decently sized company that might be willing to try it out and provide references to future potential clients?

<comment><AUTHOR> I've talked to the Director of HR at GM before--wouldn't say that I "know" her, though.

I emailed her about this, but she hasn't gotten back to us yet. I've just started trying to get in touch with some other HR directors that are local (e.g. WSGR) to get their thoughts.

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> we're putting finishing touches to "our product" (outside the US and for enterprise clients) and in the next week the sales would begin...and we're just facing the reality of selling to enterprises.. its a really ardous task... at this point.. we're thinkin of bringing in more people (either as co founders, or as partners). shoot me an email if you would be interested</comment>


Ebay is 'seriously considering' accepting Bitcoin - <AUTHOR> https://finance.yahoo.com/news/ebay-seriously-considering-accepting-bitcoin-164410989.html <comment><USER2> _eBay_ accepting Bitcoin (for fees) is different from eBay _sellers_ accepting Bitcoin for merchandise.

Note that in most cases, eBay _requires_ sellers to accept PayPal even though PayPal is otherwise independent now.

</comment><comment><USER3> interestingly, steam just halted bitcoin payments. It seems the transaction fees and latency will need to be resolved (hopefully with the lightning network) before bitcoin is practical for moving reasonably small amounts of money.</comment>


Prioritizing Original News Reporting on Facebook - <AUTHOR> https://about.fb.com/news/2020/06/prioritizing-original-news-reporting-on-facebook/ <comment><USER2> My pihole and lockdown are blocking all genocide-FB related domains... What's their-too little-too-late spin this time?</comment>


This really highlights what is wrong with Wikipedia: - <AUTHOR> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/MogileFS_(2nd_nomination)

<comment><AUTHOR> If you dig a little, the decision to delete the article on MogileFS was made by an editor with "schizoaffective disorder", despite plenty of great argument in favor of keeping the page. <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Secret>

<comment><USER2> I also would have voted "delete". Not even the agenda-driven proponents could actually cite solid secondary sources that do more than name-dropping. Most of them seemed to think they were trying to win some kind of popularity contest (do they think bigger numbers matter?) or debate (do they think "we use it, it's great" is verifiable?), not at all what <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:N> calls for. And that _ad hominem_ you felt the need to dredge up is telling.

<comment><AUTHOR> Did you take the time to read the arguments? They cited several books. By the same notability standards you could delete the articles on Ceph and GlusterFS.

Ad hominem or not, my point is that some 20 something year old kid, living at home, suffering from mental issues should not be "the decider". Wikipedia isn't about "the best argument wins" it's about who has the most free time.

<comment><USER2> The only book actually cited by name (as opposed to "if you do a search we think you'll find something") was _Building Scalable Websites_ , and the related content in its entirety was

> There are existing products that perform similar roles to this system, > including MogileFS (<http://www.danga.com/mogilefs/>), which implements > server and client component software and uses an HTTP interface.

Not only is one sentence way too little to base an entire article on, but it didn't even merit a reference in the book's index. Another admin objected "Books results yield only trivial mentions" and it looks to me like he was right—nobody managed to find a verifiable article or book section by a disinterested third party that said _anything at length_ about MogileFS. Wikipedia is not about "if the press mentions the product at all, we can start writing whatever we want about it." Wikipedia is about "show secondary sources for what you write" but instead proponents tried to handwave and argue their way past some "kid" who made the right call.

As for those other systems, well, GlusterFS looks similarly obscure and unsourced and probably also isn't ready for its own article. However, Usenix gave Ceph eleven pages in ;login: which pretty much anchors its notoriety in the industry.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: Why aren't you working on a startup? - <AUTHOR>

So many people get sucked into their jobs as developers for someone else's dream. Why are you? <comment><USER2> I decided to start a consultancy instead of going into the startup world. For me, it was an easy decision.

I enjoy working with clients, and have been fortunate enough to cultivate a great client base. The clients I work with are involved in various public- interest areas. To me this is much more motivating and fulfilling than 98% of startup ideas. (That said, the other 2% are breathtaking).

The income side is quite nice. I'm consistently pulling down $30-$50k monthly. Much of what I don't spend gets invested and generates additional investment income. I have another muse business that I put some time into and I also invest in the businesses of a few friends.

Better still is that I took no outside money. I have complete control over the company and our decision-making.

I can be honest with the people around me about how things are going. I don't need to keep up appearances that "we're crushing it". When things are challenging I can share that with the people around me. I have an incredible group of mentors and people who provide support in various ways.

I have control over my time. I work a lot of hours, usually in the range of 70-90/week, but it's all of my own choosing. Nobody pressures me to pull all- nighters, or do death marches for deadlines. I can take time off during the days. It's great to be able to go for a hike or our for a drive on a Tuesday afternoon. I usually start my workday around noon, take a break in the evening and do another block of work in the night.

This lifestyle is much more compatible with having a fulfilling personal life. I'm able to spend more time with my family and friends, and really be present for the people that I care about when they need me. Dating and relationships are orders-of-magnitude easier.

I'm able to personally capture the value that I create. No fractional equity wing-and-a-prayer. No hoping that my work gets recognized come bonus time.

I have complete location independence. I was in 20 countries in 2012. So far this year (mid-august), I've been in 11. I'm writing this from São Paulo.

One of the most amusing things to me is that I still get contacted by recruiters telling me about "exciting opportunities" at "well-funded" startups with "competitive salaries" and such benefits as foosball tables and free snacks.

I have many friends in the startup scene. Once in a blue moon, I consult for startups. Mainly in the healthcare and knowledge management spaces. I respect the game, the hustle, and particularly the challenge of building something new and breaking into the market. I'm a big fan of Eric Ries, Steve Blank, and HN. I also find that many of the insights from lean startup, customer development thinking are equally applicable or adaptable to the world of consulting.

Maybe some day, I'll get the infection of a startup idea so inspiring that I decide to drop everything to pursue it. So far, I seem to be well-immunized against that.

<comment><AUTHOR> I am a high school student, and I am curious about your path to this very attractive lifestyle.

Would you mind giving me a point by point summary?

<comment><USER2> Starting at the very beginning...

When I was in middle school, we had a computer drafting class. In that computer lab, we had Photoshop v1.0 The first time I saw it, I knew it was something I wanted to learn. I started learning everything I could about this tool. This was pre-internet so it meant heavy books and bugging anyone I could find who knew about it.

My high school had a graphic arts program with photography, screen and offset printing. There I did a lot of Photoshop and learned Illustrator and QuarkXPress. This was in Southern California in the mid-90's. We did a lot of shirts and banners for 10k's, bike races, and marathons. Around that time I got my first internet connection. I spent a lot of time on newsgroups related to the tools I was working with.

I went to college in Northern California and worked a series of uninspiring student jobs while trying to launch a design business. I did a variety of basic computer consulting. Wiring people's offices and homes for ethernet, fixing windows machines, crawling around under desks plugging in cables. I remember talking to a friend of mine who worked at an ad agency about my challenges getting clients. He suggested doubling my rates (from $30/hr to $60). I thought that would never work. I tried it. It worked. I tried to do everything as professionally as possible. Writing proper estimates, weekly reports to my clients, responding as quickly as possible. I stopped fixing windows machines and crawling around under desks plugging in wires. At that time I had switched majors from pre-med to Economics.

I applied for a web design job with a small environmental consultancy. They emailed me back telling me that I didn't get the job because my qualifications weren't a good match. I emailed the owner back to ask why they thought that. He agreed to have coffee with me. He hired me on the spot. I worked there for a few years. A lot of our work was based around making websites to distribute documents for environmental planning and resource management groups. I wanted to build web software to better support this functionality. I lobbied my boss to let me manage that project. We started with PHP and MySQL. I had a tough time getting results. I had no management experience, and our developers seemed socially inept. Eventually a friend of mine turned me onto Python and I rewrote our application in it. Eventually I made it work with both MySQL and Postgres. Consulting around this application started to be the main source of income for our business. I made partner. Sometime around there I graduated with my Econ degree.

I was occasionally getting consulting inquiries from groups outside of our target niche. I wanted to take them on, but my partner (former boss) did not. As an economist, it worried me to be so non-diversified. About this point, I read the 4 Hour Workweek. After a while I went off on my own to start my own consultancy. This was right before the financial crisis.

The economic downturn made things very quiet. It was terrifying. Before this the clients had always found us. I had to learn about sales, marketing, content marketing, SEO, customer development. I was working nearly every waking moment. I was living very lean. Money was very tight. My biggest fear was that I would have to go work for someone else.

I had a clear picture of where I wanted to go. I was extremely hungry. Friends stopped calling me to go out for drinks. The few that stuck around got to hear me talk about this obsession. Not a lot of people could relate, but the true friends at least listened and offered positive words.

My marketing process looked something like this. Find organizations whose work I cared about. Research them rigorously. Call or email them. Tell them I cared about the issues they were working on. Tried to get meetings. Asked a lot of questions and when possible shared ideas about how web-based tools could help them.

I landed some good project with great clients. I was doing some of the best work of my life. The first taste of success was extremely seductive. I remember the first month where I cleared $10k. That seemed like a whole lot of money at the time. I rented an E350 for a weekend and drove around listening to Drake. At this point I knew I was onto something. I put everything I had into this work.

A few months later I booked a ticket to Europe. I went to an open source meetup there. I decided that I was going to book my first EU client. I repeated this intention to myself again and again. At the meeting I met a cool guy working with a great NGO there. I pitched a project to him. He asked me some tough questions about how it would work with the distance. I told him honestly that I had never done this before, but that I'd do everything in my power to make the project a success. He believed me and we started working together. We made it work. Sometimes it meant me waking up at odd hours, or him taking my calls after business hours.

I never bought a house. I did buy cars and motorbikes. Cars are not investments. I did put money in the market, mostly hand-picked growth stocks.

I never hired employees. When I needed to bring in someone I subcontracted rather than hiring. I am not a bank for my clients. They pay a deposit at the start of the project. Our contract has non-trivial late fees. If the account is not current, we stop work and roll-back unpaid code. Unsurprisingly, we almost never have problems in this area.

From this point, I felt I had the basic pieces in place. I stayed disciplined and put in the work. Usually 12 to 16 hour a day six days a week. I traveled all over the EU. I went to spend winters in South America. I keep my life pretty simple. A backpack, a macbook air, a pair of running shoes, and a nice bavarian car. I dated girls with names that were hard to pronounce. I fell asleep on planes and woke up in different time zones. I ate Kobe beef in Kobe, drove M cars and AMGs on the autobahn, watched the sun come up over Istanbul. Above all, I made sure that my discipline was the most important thing.

I'm tremendously grateful for the success I've experienced. As much as I enjoy the tangible rewards for my work, the personal growth and ability to make a difference are the greatest rewards.

A few takeaways:

Find clients whose work you care about, and tell them as much.

Find mentors and ask them for advice. Know when not to listen.

Choose your clients carefully. Then move mountains for them.

It's not just about being a good programmer. Cultivate a wider business skillset.

You can make a fine living as a programmer without a CS degree.

It may get harder to relate to your non-entrepreneur friends. Try to find a few entrepreneur friends.

Use subcontractors rather than hiring employees.

Don't be a bank for your clients. Make sure you have good contact language.

Writing is extremely important. Don't shy away from it. Consider a writing coach.

Be honest with your clients. Don't be afraid to tell them that you don't know an answer.

Enjoy life, but make sure that the things that you enjoy reinforce your discipline rather than interfering with it.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER3> If you think someone else's idea is a good idea, there's nothing shameful about working for "someone else's dream." Your motivation in anything you do should be that you are doing something that will make the world a better place, whether or not it was "your idea."

If you think someone has a great idea that you want to happen, then join in. Your motivation shouldn't be making yourself famous.

</comment><comment><USER4> Real reason (I only tell myself)

\</comment><comment>-----

Too lazy to try and get out of comfort zone

Reasons I tell others

\</comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment>---

\- Family obligations (wife and kids)

\- "Secure" "high" paying job

\- No time

\- No great revolutionary idea. If an idea does come, it gets shot down a few mins/hours/days later. Get worried that it is not the best idea. Next...

</comment><comment><USER5> It's a good question. For me, right now, the thing holding me back is the risk. With a wife, a mortgage, and a baby on the way, leaving a well-paying "safe" job is a somewhat scary prospect. It wouldn't be impossible, but I haven't gathered the courage to make that jump yet.

I continue to work on side-projects, hoping to build enough momentum to reduce the risk to the point where making the jump seems reasonable.

</comment><comment><USER6> I work for a startup myself and I am really enjoying it. It is a really great place to work. Moreover, I am working on some projects on healthcare but it is difficult to find folks really interested in this field where I live (Oslo).

</comment><comment><USER7> I haven't got the funds to not take a paycheck for a couple of years.

<comment><USER8> Could you solve this by working at a well-funded startup...?

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> I am 19 years old and first want to finish my bachelor business degree in Europe, because no one would take me seriously, yet.

On my exchange, hopefully to a tier 1 US university, I hope to find people who inspire me and my future cofounder.

I am a business guy and have started two social business projects already, but I want to open an Internet start-up after my studies.

If someone here (Developers) is looking for an idea and a cofounder, write me.

</comment><comment><USER10> I got a lot of good ideas for apps and startups. I have worked as a programmer for $150,000/year jobs and have multiple degrees. In 2003 I became disabled and too sick to work.

I want to get back into working again, but I have this rare mental illness called schizoaffective disorder and it is misunderstood and has elements like bipolar disorder and schizophrenia. I am also 45 years old now, and too old for anyone to seriously consider for a startup.

I can write apps, but I am all by myself. No help, no support, no funding, and living on a shoestring budget. I have no criminal history no drug abuse, I don't even smoke or drink alcohol. I try to live a clean life so I can recover and get healthier.

My local area, Saint Louis, has a startup community I have tried to join many times and been rejected for being mentally ill or too old. They claim to accept everyone, but that is not true. I've been programming since I was 12 on a Commodore 64, self taught. I've taken many classes on programming and also read countless books and know about 37 different programming languages, most of which are no longer used, but I can convert code from say COBOL into modern languages. I know Classic Visual BASIC for example, and there are still business apps in VB6 out there. Because I learned FORTRAN, BASIC, Pascal, ADA, COBOL, C Language, 8088 Assembly, etc I know the root languages that modern languages are based on. It is much like knowing Latin and Greek to help with learning European languages better. It allowed me to learn C++, Java, Python, Ruby, Javascript, and many others. VB.Net was just VB6 modified with Java like syntax, and C# is basically Microsoft taking features from Java after they got sued over J++/J#.

I used to develop Windows CE, Blackberry, PalmOS, etc apps before Apple had the iPhone and before Android, Inc was formed in 2003. But those are obsolete.

I so much want to develop business apps for Linux and smartphones, but I know developing for Windows first is where you earn the bulk of your money. Apple has people thinking that business apps are creative content apps, but when I talk about business apps I mean apps that run a business with accounting, inventory, ledgers, accounts payable, accounts receivable, stuff that runs a business and does HR tracking of employees, and can be modified to suit a business' process like a glove and not a COTS (Commercial Off The Shelf) solution that is inflexible.

I mean yeah, create free and open source business apps to help a small business run their business without paying tens of thousands of dollars for a Windows Server (Use Linux and save money) and then tens of thousands of dollars for the MS-Office license to use Sharepoint and other proprietary stuff. I want to use OpenOffice/LibreOffice and have apps that can run on Windows, Linux, Mac OSX, Android, iOS and can use a MySQL Database instead of MS-SQL Server, etc.

Unlike most startups I can write a working business plan, I have prior business experience (I ran two small business PC repair shops that also did database and software work) I have over 25+ years of real world experience, and of course a computer and business degree with a 3.91 GPA.

My mental illness has some things in common with asperger's syndrome like low social skills, so it is hard for me to network and make friends. It is hard to get social clues or jokes sometimes, so people discriminate against me for that.

<comment><USER6> Sorry about your illness. You seem to have lots of experience in this field and you should start working on some business apps for Linux and smartphone. You can also write a business plans and that's great.

In your life, you should focus on things that you are in control, such as your desire and goals. You can't do much about things that you don't have control like people's opinions.

Start building, show what you are doing and probably, this people at Saint Louis will change their attitude. If they don't, you should not care at all. Some people will not understand how you feel until they get in the same your situation some day. Smile them back and try harder in what you love to do.

Have a great day!

P.S:Join some events like Startup Weekend, pitch your ideas or join other teams. It is a easier way to improve your social skills.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> I tried that but treated it as a project and it didn't work.

Now I'm working in a uni project but I'm not happy in the job... too much bureocracy, and I don't get to write much software, which is what I thought I was going to do here...

</comment><comment><USER12> I just graduated from college and got a very well paying job that has me using technologies relevant to my interests and thus, future startup ideas. The plan is to save up a lot of money and then boot strap my own company in a year or so.

<comment><USER13> I used to have the same sort of plan (there's something inherently attractive about it, prob something related to human psychology, not sure). Looking back though, I wish I had done more exploration while I had steady money coming in. Are you opposed to starting part-time on an idea right now?

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> I've gone through periods where I'm not working on a startup.

A lot of it had to do with having new babies and simply not having the energy to hold down a six figure day job and a work on something else after hours.

</comment><comment><USER15> Because I'm not that good.

<comment><USER16> It's not about good or bad , I think it's lack of enough motivation .

</comment></comment><comment><USER17> Startup is still on unstable condition. So you will work harder when you work on startup. But if you want to learn a lot, maybe you have to.

</comment><comment><USER18> Health insurance.

</comment><comment><USER19> Hell yeah, everyone should, only if I can continue the same magnitude of enthusiasm till the sun rises!

</comment><comment><USER16> I am not, I work at startup . I think primary reason behind job is the financial security.

</comment><comment><USER20> Not sure what to build.

</comment><comment><USER21> _Why aren 't you working on a startup?_

I am.

<comment><USER22> I came here to say the same thing.

</comment></comment><comment><USER23> Yes i work for a startup named Vidoofy, its a Youtube video promotional network and a marketing, analytics tool provider to video marketers.

<comment><USER24> is this a joke? If not, awful awful awful name.</comment></comment>


Ask HN: How do blind developers navigate code? - <AUTHOR> I am a sighted software developer and educator who is currently working with a blind student, teaching him Python using the Emacspeak editor. One of the difficulties my student is experiencing is when he has to navigate back and forth between two areas of the same file. As a sighted person it is easy for me to move elsewhere in a file and come back to the same place, but for him, using a screenreader, it involves a lot of searching around. Can an experienced blind developer talk to me about how they approach this situation?<p>It's clear to me how I approach using programming tools does not translate to his experiences as a blind student. Can someone help educate me on this? And while we are on the subject, can you recommend any good resources for teaching programming or Python specifically to a blind student? I would greatly appreciate it. <comment><USER2> Also check the HN archives [https://hn.algolia.com/?q=blind](https://hn.algolia.com/?q=blind)

"Blind software development at 450 words per minute" [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21898537](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21898537)

"The Tools of a Blind Programmer" [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11415722](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11415722)

"How a Blind Person Programs" [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8965048](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8965048)</comment>


Inspirational video for when you are down (add others in the comments) - <AUTHOR> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NI55rgOaic0 <comment><AUTHOR> Also:

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPbdfUpGjyI>

</comment><comment><USER2> A military propaganda video?

<comment><AUTHOR> Ok, here's something a bit different (from a similar post a while ago):

<http://youtube.com/watch?v=jULUGHJCCj4>

<comment><USER2> Apple co-opting people like Einstein and Gandhi in a faux-endorsement attempt is so much BS. This is the company that sues their own fans.</comment></comment></comment>


The Future of Rust - <AUTHOR> http://antoyo.ml/future-of-rust <comment><USER2> Really like what I read here. Simplifying the language is a great thing and really shows that they want to keep the language as simple as possible. Furthermore I love the mentions of 2 other languages I love. Both Pony and Zig are great. Amazing languages to look at for inspiration. It is almost so good that I almost have to ask the classic 1st of April question, this isn't a joke right? I really hope not.

<comment><USER3> > It is almost so good that I almost have to ask the classic 1st of April > question, this isn't a joke right? I really hope not.

Yeah, I got that feeling too. If it is, it is a lovely satire.</comment></comment>


Ragel State Charts - <AUTHOR> https://zedshaw.com/archive/ragel-state-charts/ <comment><USER2> As an engineer who writes automation code for machines that must perform in a known and specified manner I use state machines almost exclusively. Anyone who wants known behaviours from software and doesn't use state machines is basically throwing spaghetti at the wall and hoping it sticks. I am amazed at how little this methodology is used by people who write software and call themselves "engineers" and consider this is one of the fundamental reasons software of poor robustness is common.</comment>


Mono and WebAssembly – Updates on Static Compilation - <AUTHOR> http://www.mono-project.com/news/2018/01/16/mono-static-webassembly-compilation/ <comment><USER2> Awesome.

> This currently requires MacOS High Sierra to run.

Ha, feels strange to say it, but "waiting for a Windows version". Also for the latest Mono preview targeting WebAssembly [0], I wanted a Windows nightly...went and looked at the Mono site's nightly downloads...nope, Linux and macOS only. Heh.

0 - [http://www.mono-project.com/docs/about- mono/releases/5.8.0/](http://www.mono-project.com/docs/about- mono/releases/5.8.0/)

<comment><USER3> > Ha, feels strange to say it, but "waiting for a Windows version".

I can _understand_ the lack of a Windows version.

What I can't understand is why this won't on Linux.

<comment><USER4> A significant portion of the main webassembly development teams at google & apple (and probably mozilla, but I'm not sure) use macs, and I think that's true for many mono developers also. The linux and windows (especially windows) toolchains are neglected.

For a while the canonical webassembly tooling and test suite were unusable on Windows due to the selection of software that didn't work there. It was a bummer (that was corrected, at least!)

<comment><USER5> Yeah, mac-books are one of the favorite choices of unix focused devs. So quite a few people at Xamarin are using that.

Also, they are a MacOS focused shop in some ways (Xamarin for iOS).

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> This awesome, I much prefer to code in C# as compared to js. It is a much cleaner language.

<comment><USER7> [https://github.com/appcypher/awesome-wasm- langs](https://github.com/appcypher/awesome-wasm-langs) is the full list of WebAssembly languages and their current status.

<comment><USER8> I wasn't sure if this list would be any good, but it says right at the top that it's "curated." Imagine my relief!

<comment><USER9> Hahah :-)

Yeah it's a mess. GitHub is full of "Awesome XYZ" lists which are basically just dumps of links. Awesome Elixir is a good example, it's worthless and full of 2-year old unmaintained afternoon hacks.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> I've always envied the JVM's class reloading abilities. Edit-n-continue in Visual Studio has so many "it doesn't work if you do this" cases, that's it next to useless.

I would love to be able to put the C# debugger into interpreter mode and be able to change anything, anywhere while debugging and keep on trucking without having to stop debugger, make changes, restart debugger, etc..

<comment><USER11> Even the JVM has a fair number of issues if you use class reloading to do Weird Stuff (tm), especially with advanced debugger tricks added into the mix. That's one of the reasons some of the folks I know who use Scala switched in the first place.

I think any hot-reloading solution for a big, complex, introspective/reflective language is going to have some warts* and places where it stops working in some scenarios. The trick is just to minimize those to where they don't get on your nerves on a daily basis. C# will hopefully get there soon.

* Unless, that is the language is designed from the ground up to support code reloading. Erlang/Elixir's runtime inspection/injection/behavior alteration capability is second to none, and largely replaces the role of a true/traditional debugger. And you can do other cool stuff with it like zero-downtime in-place deployments, though that doesn't exactly come for free.

<comment><USER12> I ended up with a pretty sweet workflow that involved hot code reloading in a Clojure web app where I rarely needed to restart the dev JVM. It involved Emacs and CIDER and designing the app's architecture in a certain way but I felt it was really worth it. That said, if I was using a language with faster start up time then I'd have just restarted after every major change and not even worry about this, but this has some benefits that don't exist in that scenario.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> How does this handle garage collection? I believe Webassembly doesn't yet support GC so, is this manually compiling it's own GC into it?

<comment><USER14> Mono already supports embedding the runtime with the application. So they just used that feature here. Also available is the mono interpreter which does it's own garbage collection.

<comment><USER15> It's more complex than that, as there's tons of academic work essentially proving it's impossible to chain two independent garbage collectors and not end up with stuck uncollectable memory (I apologize, this isn't my field, I've skimmed the work but not retained the citations, and I realize how counter- intuitive that result is... nobody wants to think its true, so it keeps getting more academics thrown at it, without changing the results).

My assumption is that at the moment they are just accepting that some uncollectable memory will happen in the short term and eventually the WebAssembly working group will expose the underlying garbage collector and everything will get better. Early days kind of issue for now.

<comment><USER16> Xamarin.Android begs to differ. It provides full integration and all we use from Dalvik are gc handles and explicit GC control.

Full Disclosure: I work at MS and I am one of the original designers of it.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> Does anyone know if there is work being done to add JSX syntax to C# (either into the language directly or as part of a pre-processor)?

<comment><USER17> The CSharpLang github[1] repository would be where to look for this. I didn't find anything that mentioned adding language support for it, and IIRC, in the past they rejected the idea of inline XML or JSON support.

Going the other way of C# inside HTML, you have Razor[2] and Blazor[3], the latter of which is a prototype of Razor running in the browser via web assembly.

[1]: [https://github.com/dotnet/csharplang](https://github.com/dotnet/csharplang) [2]: [https://docs.microsoft.com/en- us/aspnet/core/mvc/views/razor](https://docs.microsoft.com/en- us/aspnet/core/mvc/views/razor) [3]: [http://blog.stevensanderson.com/2017/11/05/blazor-on- mono/](http://blog.stevensanderson.com/2017/11/05/blazor-on-mono/)

<comment><USER15> Blazor is pretty amazing, but my coder fantasies mostly revolve around a React-JSX-in-C# vision - the syntax and approach just feel so natural and so right. Your point about rejecting inline XML is probably a pretty good data point that I shouldn't expect what I'm hoping for to happen.

<comment><USER18> Well, if you would use VB.NET instead, it supports XML literals.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> Has anyone heard about Microsoft working on a similar project? The proof of concept last summer seemed to have raised a lot of interest among Microsoft people. I hope they take that route.

<comment><USER20> We are Microsoft employees :-)

<comment><USER21> Why are there currently 2 projects aiming to run C# code in WebAssembly? I mean this one and coreRT?

<comment><USER4> Lots of people out there use mono, and if they want to run in the browser, it wouldn't hurt for mono to have webassembly support would it? :)</comment></comment></comment></comment>


What programmers can learn from economists: fundamentals and models - <AUTHOR> http://blog.darknedgy.net/technology/2015/11/04/0/ <comment><USER2> That's the difference between computer science and programming. One is a science used to find better ways to solve abstract problems the other is "technology" the application of said science to "make a buck"... I mean solve problems for humanity.</comment>


Detailed accounting of a fully outsourced "civic data" project - <AUTHOR> http://makethemworkforyou.com/AboutUs/OurFinances.aspx

<comment><AUTHOR> I thought it was fascinating to get a glimpse into the detailed expenses of this database of public information, where almost 100% of the development, research, and content was outsourced to oDesk.</comment>


Two Forgotten Architects of Silk Road - <AUTHOR> http://motherboard.vice.com/read/these-are-the-two-forgotten-architects-of-the-silk-road <comment><USER2> Variety Jones is one of those "fogotten architects", who alleges that a corrupt FBI officer is blackmailing him / feeding him inside information in order to gain access a password protected BitCoin wallet worth $70 million that the FBI agent stole from Ross Ulbricht: [http://motherboard.vice.com/read/variety-jones-a-corrupt- fbi...](http://motherboard.vice.com/read/variety-jones-a-corrupt-fbi-agent-is- hunting-me-so-im-turning-myself-in)

<comment><USER3> Forum post with a lot more info: [http://www.myplanetganja.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=11022&star...](http://www.myplanetganja.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=11022&start=120#p144158)

(Variety Jones == Plural of Mongoose)

<comment><USER4> Care to summarise any of the interesting parts, or is it worth holding on and checking this at home? I'm at work and I suspect clicking on "myplanetganja.com" will not go down well with our infra team. Also what does "Variety Jones == Plural of Mongoose" mean?

<comment><USER5> This url leads to forum posts that is written by guy named "Plural of Mongoose". I skimmed it over and it reads like memoirs of main (bad?) character from Noir book. Definitely worth a read if you're into that.

<comment><USER4> Agree, I just checked it out there's a lot going on. Sort of reminds me of McAfee's ramblings

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> This seems much worse than mere "doxxing".

It's not just the "connect a bunch of disparate dots in someone's public online presence" sense of that term. They're basically admitting to hacking into people's private email accounts, frequent flier accounts, and the like. It's beyond illegal and doesn't seem ethical as journalism.

</comment><comment><USER7> I wonder why the reporter ("Joseph Cox") decided to publish the (presumed) truenames of these hackers. That decision seems to undermine the political statement "he" makes when he refers to "the failed War on Drugs" — "he" has done the investigative work that the DEA and FBI needed done in order to deter hackers who might consider working on future sites like SR.

(Is there a difference between doxing and journalism?)

Or perhaps it's misdirection?

<comment><USER8> It does seem quite nasty, and at odds with what I'd consider journalism. Regardless of whether or not the DEA and FBI knew.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> The people who wrote and compiled information for this article are engaged in speculative vigilantism and snitching. Maybe this info is already known to the feds, or maybe not, and maybe it is factual, or maybe not. Regardless, releasing it does nothing but harm people who don't deserve to be harmed. Stop snitching!

<comment><USER10> That is my initial reaction, as well. (well, not the "stop snitching" part).

They have basically hacked into these persons private accounts repeatedly.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> It makes sense that Ulbricht had more experienced ccoders supporting his efforts. I've always wondered how he built a multimillion dollar empire one StackOverlow question at a time.

</comment><comment><USER12> This does feel a little like doxxing/vigilantism, which makes me generally uneasy.

</comment><comment><USER13> > A hard-working coder, Smed, or "Smedley" as he was otherwise known, had > completely reworked key elements of the Silk Road infrastructure, and was > being paid $2,500 a week for his services, more than any other employee.

Well that's depressing: he could have made more at a vanilla programming job in California. You know, one that would have zero chance of jail time. Did he fail to price his risk in, or did he just love this project that much?

<comment><USER14> You assume that this person is of legal age to work, a US resident, not a felon, has a decent enough resume to warrant a 6 figure salary, actually wants to live in California, and then conclude that he is an idiot.

That's an awful lot of assumptions.</comment></comment>


ATLAS and CMS physics results from Run 2 - <AUTHOR> https://indico.cern.ch/event/442432/ <comment><AUTHOR> Of particular interest, CMS and ATLAS both report excesses in events with two photons at a mass of 760 and 750 GeV, respectively. ATLAS public plots here: [https://atlas.web.cern.ch/Atlas/GROUPS/PHYSICS/CONFNOTES/ATL...](https://atlas.web.cern.ch/Atlas/GROUPS/PHYSICS/CONFNOTES/ATLAS- CONF-2015-081/)</comment>


Genoa bridge collapse - <AUTHOR> http://community.wolfram.com/groups/-/m/t/1407711?_19_wal_campaign <comment><USER2> Trees before forest, much? No bridge age stats needed, here. Corruption:

"In the late 1990s, corrosion and other problems with the easternmost of the three towers on the Genoa bridge became serious enough that their supports were given a similar refurbishment.

...

For reasons it has not fully explained, Autostrade, which took over management of the bridge in 1999, did not carry out the same operation on the supports of the other two towers — including the tower that collapsed.

...

Autostrade won the concession to run nearly half of Italy's highways from a cash-strapped Italian government, starting in 1999. After that, there were no major renovations of the Morandi bridge.

...

But their far-right partner in the coalition, the League, led by the deputy prime minister, Matteo Salvini, has been more cautious.

The party, when it was still named the Northern League, received a 150,000-euro donation from Autostrade, which has given to other political parties as well.

In 2008, Mr. Salvini and his Northern League voted in Parliament in favor of renewing the license to Autostrade."

[https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/09/06/world/europe/...](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/09/06/world/europe/genoa- italy-bridge.html)</comment>


In 1982, Forbes first 400 list, total of $93B - <AUTHOR> http://www.cnbc.com/2017/06/27/warren-buffett-says-the-problem-with-the-economy-is-people-like-him.html <comment><AUTHOR> They now they have $2.4 trillion, [a multiple of] 25 for one.</comment>


Bill Gross: What to Do After the Robots Take Our Jobs - T-A http://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2016/05/04/bill-gross-what-to-do-after-the-robots-take-our-jobs/ <comment><AUTHOR> I am sceptical that robots will lead to mass unemployment.

We have heard this luddite fear repeatedly since the start of the industrial revolution. There used to be 90% of people employed in agriculture but today we are down to something like 10% in the UK. Do we now have 80% unemployment?

A hundred years ago the UK had mass employment in heavy industries such as ship building. They have long gone and the UK is now a services based economy. Do we now have 80% unemployment?

There is no limit, so far, to human wants and needs and so releasing people from some industries will allow them to move to others or create entirely new ones.

<comment><USER2> I used to think that way until I watched C.G.P Grey short video on the topic "Humans need not apply" [https://youtu.be/9BMcks55vfE](https://youtu.be/9BMcks55vfE)

<comment><USER3> I think you linked to an incorrect youtube video, though those GeoOrbital wheels look cool (and heavy!).

Actual link: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Pq-S557XQU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Pq-S557XQU)

<comment><USER2> Whoops - thanks for the correction.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> I'm skeptical about the robots leading to mass unemployment thing too, but for some different reasons. It kind of assumes that:

1\. There won't be room for people to operate freelance or outside of a structured business. Which given its commonality in the web design and marketing industries, seems unlikely.

2\. That pretty much every business, without exception will decide to replace human staff with robots. I suspect this is more likely among large corporations than mom and pop groups that actually know their employees and don't see everything in pure statistics terms.

3\. That some groups won't deliberately avoid replacing its staff for reputational reasons. There's a market for organic food, a market for free range food, a market for fair trade food and a market for no GM food, so there could just as easily be a market for products made by humans only.

4\. That people will always pick the cheapest and technically 'best' option from the largest companies and hence the companies using them will somehow conquer the market. But McDonalds and fast food chains didn't kill the restaurant business.

And that's before you get into the issues with the version of basic income posited by this article. The 10,000 dollars example is completely inadequate to live on in a lot of the country (especially the large cities), so there's the question of what to do about the insane house prices and such.

</comment><comment><USER5> I wonder if Universal Basic Income would also solve the copyright problem? You know, in the old analog world (with printing presses etc.), copyright worked pretty well, but in a digital world, it has many problems.

Personally, I'm not terribly keen on living in a world where every single book I read (and how much time I spend on each page, where I stop reading etc.), every single song I listen to, every single movie I watch, every single computer game I play (and how long I play etc.) are stored forever in some central database.

However, with Universal Basic Income, people would be able to write books, create art etc. and simply release it for free.

</comment><comment><USER6> I found it interesting (and surprising!) that Bill Gross endorses a UBI in this essay.

</comment><comment><USER7> Party like its 1999!</comment>


GNU Guile 2.9.1 (beta) released – support for JIT [x86_64 as of now] - <AUTHOR> https://www.gnu.org/software/guile/news/gnu-guile-291-beta-released.html <comment><USER2> I have been seeing speedups ranging from 2-6x in all my old project Euler solutions (1-100), which is a one-sided benchmark, but still impressive.

No slowdowns on anything that runs longer than 0.05s.

</comment><comment><USER3> It says that Guile is an implementation of Scheme. Would that make it appropriate for a trip through the SICP?

<comment><USER4> I'm a huge fan of Guile, I think it's the best Scheme implementation out there. Chez is faster and MIT is more standard but Guile offers really amazing extensibility tools I couldn't find anywhere else. It's very easy to embed C in scheme (ffi call) or embed scheme in C using Guile. It's like Lua but I personally prefer Guile as the C api is better imho although they're very comparable. Whenever I write a C program I make it scriptable using Guile. Imho a very essential tool of a C programmer. It supports other languages too but I never tried them (elisp and JavaScript) since I don't care for js and kinda dislike elisp (even though I'm an emacs user).

<comment><USER5> Lua (LuaJIT really) is battle-tested to the extreme and utterly reliable at this point (it's used all over the place, including in the game industry).

Guile is still very much focused on Linux and has well-documented issues on other platforms (including Windows and macOS) not to mention absence of developers and users. For all the talk about it being the "official" extensibility language of the GNU project, my understanding is that Guile has a minimal userbase.

Finally, having used both Guile and LuaJIT, I have to say that LuaJIT FFI blows Guile FFI out of the water. It's so much better in every possible way. I haven't tested Guile 2.9.1 but I wouldn't think it comes close to LuaJIT in performance either. Embedding Lua or LuaJIT is a piece of cake too, since it has no dependencies whatsoever. Guile loses here too:

        $ port deps luajit
        luajit @2.0.5_0 has no dependencies.

        $ port deps guile
        Full Name: guile @2.2.4_0
        Build Dependencies:   gsed
        Library Dependencies: readline, gettext, libiconv, libtool, gmp, libunistring, boehmgc, libffi, ncurses, pkgconfig

So, empirically speaking, I don't see Guile as an alternative to Lua. It simply can't compete.</comment></comment></comment>


C2 language – now has library support and Windows support through Cygwin - <AUTHOR> Hello, I know that C2, a C-like language by bvdberg, was shown here once before, but it was in much earlier stages of development. Now that one can use libraries it is possible to make "real" programs with it. Now in this stage, what is your quick opinion on C2, smart people of Hacker News?<p>https://github.com/c2lang/c2compiler https://c2lang.org/documentation <comment><USER2> The docs are not available at that URL. It looks like the https is a different server. They seem to be here: [http://c2lang.org/site/](http://c2lang.org/site/)

[edits...]

I'm glad it has explicit integer sizes. I use C99 standard types often. I don't have much of an opinion on the explicit bool type although I hope it has a defined size.

I'm surprised it allows fall-through in a switch statement. I thought people hated C in that you needed a break keyword to prevent it.

It is interesting that its compiler is also the build system but I see that being a problem if you need to mix languages. For example: I have a Lua script I want to embed into my code. Doing this is simple with make and hard with every other build system.

Windows/Cygwin support means I will look at building this.

<comment><AUTHOR> Yes, I really like explicit integer sizes too and yes. C2 is trying to be as close to C as possible, with just improving what is "bad" or cumbersome, so some things like the fall-through are still there. You can certainly mix languages, since C2C (the compiler) allows single-file compilation, although a bit cumbersome, with the -f parameter and currently, it works like this:

1\. Find (recursive searching upwards in directory tree) & Read a recipe file (a file for the build system)

2\. Either start building all targets or just some, depending on the command- line arguments

3\. Build the targets. Output is C (basically complete) or LLVM IR bytecode (like 25% complete).

4\. Write a makefile for said C files

5\. Compile with default C compiler

so mixing languages works with a little hacking.

I am the author of the Windows/Cygwin support/port, so in case anything doesn't work (especially since the compilation of LLVM is often a horror in Cygwin), let me know and I will see what I can do.

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> Looks pretty cool - automatically growing arrays are neat.

<comment><AUTHOR> Yeah, I find that it is one of the best ideas C2 brings to the table</comment></comment>


Bill Gates got rich via a classic billionaire strategy: 'tollbooths' - <AUTHOR> https://www.businessinsider.com/bill-gates-billionaire-strategy-tollbooth-rockefeller-warren-buffet-2019-11 <comment><USER2> This article is a toll booth

<comment><AUTHOR> What does that mean, can you elaborate?

<comment><USER3> Does being faced with "This story requires our BI Prime membership. To read the full article, simply click here to claim your deal and get access to all exclusive Business Insider PRIME content." not say enough...? I assume the user meant that it has a paywall.

<comment><AUTHOR> Oh, strange, it wasn't paywalled for me.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Name That Color - <AUTHOR> http://chir.ag/projects/name-that-color/http://chir.ag/projects/name-that-color/ <comment><USER2> The URL was duplicated in the submission.</comment>


Mem Fox on being detained by US immigration: 'In that moment I loathed America' - <AUTHOR> https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/feb/28/in-that-moment-i-loathed-america-i-loathed-the-entire-country <comment><USER2> > Instead of crying and being sad and sitting on a couch, I am going to write > to politicians. I am going to call. I am going to write to newspapers. I am > going to get on the radio. I will not be quiet. No more passive behaviour. > Hear me roar.

I have a serious question. What does it mean to be on the frontline? It's obvious that she intends to do something and push the system, but it's not "revolution", as she says she is for. She is arguing for action inside the system, but that is not revolutionary.

I very much want to force change, but it sounds more like she doesn't want to be on the frontline, but instead call others to action.

I'm horrified by what we as Americans are doing to people of all stripes coming to the US. We are supposed to be the land of opportunity, the land that is welcoming to all. Some claim that we are a nation based on Christian morals, but then we throw out the primary messages of being Christian. It's horrendous.

So what is the best way to fight this? The things which are getting the most attention recently are the large marches. I suppose that's the place to start, and it feels tangible. Civil disobedience, boycotting supporters of these policies, these seem to cause the powers that be to take notice.

</comment><comment><USER3> I don't think they have anything against her personally. These tactics are used to fluster and confuse, and hopefully cause the subject to make a mistake. Clearly it's effective.

In a perfect world, this would only be applied to criminals. Because the agents aren't allowed to profile, they have to pull in people across the spectrum. Which includes authors, women with children, and old ladies.

I don't think they mean any harm. They're trying to do their job of protecting the border, but they have protocol that they need to follow.

Edit: anecdata, but there may be other reasons they make ridiculous selections like this (like old ladies). My grandmother, who is an elderly white lady who is hunched over, has the same name as a criminal on a watch list. Every time she went to the airport she was selected for additional screening. She never had the same experience as Fox, but sometimes they got real nasty. She always thanked them when they let her go, because what if she was actually the criminal, and they were protecting the country.

<comment><USER4> I think they do mean harm, they want to distress the people because they know that people in distress tend to self-accuse. They go as far as they can on the spectrum from verbal abuse to torture.

Moreover 1) there is absolutely no need to behave that way even to a criminal 2) people on the international zone of an airport have not yet had the opportunity to commit any local crime, since they are not yet in the jurisdiction, the entire premise is flawed if they are not returning. And if they are returning and accused of a crime, there is a different system in a different room for them.

<comment><USER3> Yes, they do want to distress people, but they don't have anything against them personally.

They weren't looking for Fox to self-accuse; she was only in there to fill their quota of older white women who they needed to pull in.

If someone is coming into the country with intent to perform illegal activity, then I say they're not doing enough. As a citizen, I don't want those people in my country.

<comment><USER4> You don't get a job where your role is to make people's life hell, even for a few hours, if you don't have any inclination for it, these are unionized federal workers whose skills are transferable, not slaves. They are not bothered enough by their own and their co-workers behavior to resign, they self-selected.

Moreover, this entire "the bad people are coming to kill us from outside" is crap, Americans suicide themselves with their food, their cars (about 100 every day) and their guns. This is just pandering to the red necks.

<comment><USER3> Wow, your anti American bias is showing.

So you maintain that because a percentage of Americans live their lives a certain way, there's no need to defend the border?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I have an employee from the US (I'm otherwise from Europe) and while visiting through the conversation/personal stories he explained the most interesting part of relationship between US authorities and citizens: You're less likely to be "harassed" if you lie to them, because they can turn pretty much anything you say against you and dig so deep to finally find an excuse to bully you, or charge you with something.

That is quite a sad state for the society to be in, being always afraid of the authorities, rather than knowing their primary goal is to protect and serve.

</comment><comment><USER6> How is there no damned accountability for these people? I'm sure decent humans in positions of power read such stories or are aware of them. Have they no authority to curtail this, fire those individuals, or do something?

<comment><USER4> There is no accountability. In the US there is generally no real internal accountability inside the uniformed units for their behavior towards people outside the unit (if you are a policeman, federal agent or military, you will be disciplined if you steal from or kill a co-worker, but not a civilian).

Only the judicial system sometime takes action against uniformed people. In the case of the CBP, by nature there is no judicial oversight, since most of their actions are not covered by the constitution, and the Executive power doesn't want to provide any due process or any kind of right to the population they are in contact with. There is no system in place to moderate their behavior.</comment></comment>


A Ridiculous Proposal (2014) - <AUTHOR> https://pilgrimagesoftware.com/progress/?p=31

<comment><USER2> Everything in the article is fairly obvious. The difficulty is not in improving upon the current email system but in getting enough people to agree on a new system. Any new system will need to have mind blowin advantages and/or a seamless upgrade path. You cannot expect everyone to switch overnight. Look at IPv6.

<comment><USER3> Indeed, at the end of the day, it has to be convenient for the average person, and moving away from classic email and things like IPv4 are insanely tough problems. A huge part of the battle is getting the tech giants behind it.

So far, I think Microsoft, Apple, Google, and others have done a pretty good job of pushing encryption as the norm so far. If the major companies continue to push it, I think there's hope.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> I've been advocating this for 5 years! And you don't need to get people to agree; you just have to have an ecosystem. Get it up and running in Facebook or GMail and Bob's you Uncle. IM started from nothing and grew to hundreds of millions. Twitter likewise. It only has to be convenient.</comment>


Can Random Promotions Prevent the Rise of Incompetence? - <AUTHOR> http://www.nytimes.com/projects/magazine/ideas/2009/#business-2

<comment><AUTHOR> My only concern with this finding is that once workers realized promotion was random, then problems of fairness and motivation kick in. First, economics literature has already shown in multiple situations that people prefer to maintain a semblance of fairness, even to detriment to themselves. And the promise of promotion is often the carrot that pulls the company forward in terms of productivity.</comment>


Affiliate Platform for SaaS (that's not a mockup) - <AUTHOR> http://www.2performant.com

<comment><AUTHOR> I had no idea there was an interesteon HN for what I am doing. Even though HN is my favorite place to hang out.

The previous mockup post showed people could find this cool.

This is the Hacker Friendliest solution that's out there, made with Hacker love.

<comment><AUTHOR> Also, we're building an App Store on top of it. If you want to try it out let me know.</comment></comment>


Lyft Files for IPO - <AUTHOR> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-lyft-ipo/ride-hailing-firm-lyft-inc-files-for-ipo-idUSKBN1O51AA <comment><USER2> The most exciting implication here is that we can finally pour over the financials of a major ride-hailing company. Whether these companies have the unit economics to succeed is, remarkably, still an open question.

<comment><USER3> Sorry to be a grammar right wing populist, but it's "pore over".

To pore is to think deeply about to something, to dwell on it.

A pour-over is a type of coffee.

<comment><USER4> I'm not sure why you are being down voted. This sounds like it is a surprising revelation for many, myself included.

<comment><USER5> I believe it is for "right wing populist" when nazi is usually used with the grammar phrase.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free.

Uber has a global operations, is in multiple streams of business and has diversity across business lines and countries so even if there's a recession in one country, it might be made up for in other countries.

So what's the investment story then for Lyft?

<comment><USER7> Uber takes the flack, gets the law changed, creates the market. Lyft sails in and gets most of the benefits, without those costs.

Uber doesn't have a massive moat. Drivers can have both apps, users can have both apps. You attract drivers by paying them more, you attract riders by charging them less. Uber for now can afford to beat everyone on both those fronts, but eventually they will have to start making a profit. When that happens Lyft is best placed to take advantage.

<comment><USER8> As a counter point, Lyft was first to create ride sharing. Internationally, Uber has driven the changes.

<comment><USER9> Uber (Founded March 2009[1]) created ride sharing in SF before Lyft (Founded: June 2012[2]). Uber just started with commercially licensed Black Car drivers and Lyft started with anyone with a car and a drivers license. Then Uber moved down market with UberX and Lyft moved up market with Lux.

[1] - [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uber](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uber)

[2] - [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyft](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyft)

<comment><USER10> I think this is just a matter of semantics. Are you saying we should call a black-car hailing service "ride sharing" simply because you booked it with a smart phone app rather than calling a number? (Remember that Uber didn't even use a novel business relationship; there have long been dispatchers with a single phone number that distribute the rides to multiple independent black car agencies.)

To me, the key change deserving a new term was allowing completely independent, non-professional drivers, and I think Lyft beat Uber to that. (Heck, some purists would say "ride sharing" should be reserved for cases where the driver doesn't make an wages, just reimbursement for costs.)

<comment><USER11> Sidecar beat both Lyft and Uber with people using their own cars. It launched in September 2011.

Uber launched UberX in June 2012. Lyft launched in June 2012.

Give Sidecar credit where it's due.

<comment><USER10> I'm happy to, and in fact wasn't giving anyone credit for being first. I was just trying to point out that Lyft beat Uber.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> I see a lot of comments on here about the efficiency of Lyft/Uber's and lots of comments about their overspending.

The new book by Reid Hoffman, Blitzscaling, was an eye-opener for me as to how these companies operate and what seems as incredibly inefficient now will all be but forgotten tomorrow when they have complete monopolies over all transportation... The nature of technology makes it winner take all almost always, it's only a matter of time until they can offer other forms of transportation to people. Perhaps people someday won't even own any cars at all especially if it's cheaper to call an autonomous one from your device whenever you need it.

These are interesting times we are living in and these business models are completely counterintuitive to traditional norms of taking small risks and that much is obvious from seeing the business models of Uber/Lyft, WeWork, Airbnb, etc.

<comment><USER13> Why would ridesharing be winner take all? There's almost no network effect (beyond splitting the cost, but Venmo has largely solved that) and the drivers all drive for all of them.

In NYC I think there's at least 4 ridesharing companies and I usually choose which one based on which one has given me a promo.

<comment><USER14> There are plenty of network effects.

To start a new ridesharing company, you have to get drivers and riders. You'd have to offer them a ton of incentives to start driving/riding with your service, when the existing options are well established.

For drivers, Lyft and Uber have incentives (lower fees) if you do the majority of rides with their service, which incentivizes you to only drive with one service.

When's the last time you downloaded a new app on your phone? For me it's been weeks, maybe months. For so many people, it's easier to just not try your new rideshare service.

<comment><USER15> This is just not correct.

To start a new ridesharing company all you have to do is attack and carve off the most profitable element of the big company's product mix.

All you need is to undercut them in certain high profitability routes, like airport runs, or luxury vehicles for executives, or anything, and you have a toehold.

There are some positive network effects, but there are also negative network effects. Having more users doesn't mean you always win as the big company.

For example if you have no customers all you have to do is be outside of a stadium at the end of a show, or waiting by an airport during a busy landing period, and have rudimentary abilities to let people know you exist, and you'll get defectors.

<comment><USER16> Without a large network, the time for a car to arrive is high and unpredictable.

This is bad for customers.

<comment><USER15> Not necessarily.

It's pretty easy to have a network that's not very big that always has someone at the airport, or always is available for trips that stay within a specific neighborhood, or can always be arranged with a little more advance notice, or whatever.

And the relevant part of pointing this out is that as long as that's true, which is forever, then these large companies will never be able to extract monopoly pricing.

As soon as they start gouging customers people will immediately flood in to siphon off the lowest hanging fruit or easiest segments of their customer base.

That dynamic will never go away, it's not at all clear what the point of all this buying of market share is, given that it will never be truly defendable.

<comment><USER17> Yes. You can overprovision in a constrained area and you can also let people schedule ahead of time. That's pretty much every black car service which often are not very big companies. But they tend to be relatively expensive. (Which is fine for some uses; I use one to travel to and from the airport.)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> Looking forward to reading the prospectus. Let's see the audited numbers.

A confidential filing with the SEC of an offering is a new thing. Until 2017, you couldn't do that. It's limiting in some ways. Lyft now can't say anything more about an IPO. If they do, the confidentiality can disappear.[1]

[1] [https://www.sec.gov/corpfin/voluntary-submission-draft- regis...](https://www.sec.gov/corpfin/voluntary-submission-draft-registration- statements-faqs)

</comment><comment><USER19> I'm not very bullish on these ride sharing companies in the long term. More and more data is coming out that suggests that these ride sharing companies impact transportation and congestion metrics in a negative way that is counter productive to cities' long term transportation goals. Accordingly cities are layering on more regulations that will limit what has made these companies different from traditional taxi companies.

<comment><USER20> "Ride sharing" is not an accurate representation of these companies anymore. Uber and Lyft are trying to become major mobility and transportation platforms. The core of their business right now relies on ride-sharing, but if they want to become sustainable long-term companies they need to evolve their business. Sadly, drivers are just an input to generate cash flow. They're definitely not indispensable, especially with new short distance tranportation solutions like scooters.

<comment><USER21> At this point Uber and Lyft are really just taxi companies with nice apps. Add the driver reviews, GPS locations, and requesting a ride via an app to a traditional taxi system and it's the same. The only major advantage they have right now is that Uber/Lyft are standardized throughout cities and suburbs, whereas taxi companies are mostly local to one city.

<comment><USER22> The other significant advantage is that they're cheaper. Either because they're _actually_ cheaper (e.g. in London, black cab drivers have to train to know every street by heart, whereas Uber drivers can just rely on technology (Google Maps)), or because Uber subsidizes the passengers, but regardless, they're _significantly_ cheaper (speaking for London).

<comment><USER20> What is limiting a black cab driver from using Google Maps or Apple Maps or whatever?

<comment><USER23> Part of the certification to be a black cab driver in London is to take a test about the streets of the city. Of course, once you pass you may use navigation apps.

[https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/10/t-magazine/london-taxi- te...](https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/10/t-magazine/london-taxi-test- knowledge.html)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> Question that's somewhere between rhetorical and semi-serious. At what point do one of these companies increase their pricing to the point where they can operate profitably and just let volumes end up wherever they end up (making whatever cost cuts they need to on the way down)? Presumably there's some point where you can make money--but maybe not if you have a basically equivalent competitor who is willing to lose money indefinitely.

<comment><USER24> Seriously, what's Uber/Lyft's long term goal? If I had to guess, destroy all local taxi services, then fix prices with their competitors and worry about anti-competitive lawsuits later. Waiting for self driving cars feels like a fool's errand.

<comment><USER25> Taxis are really a short term play. Long term is really transport as a service - who owns the market when people no longer own cars.

<comment><USER17> Stipulating that self-driving cars that can operate in dense urban areas in a wide range of weather conditions will exist some day...

Lots of people are still going to own cars, especially as you get to less dense areas where parking isn't difficult or expensive and cars are needed on a daily basis to go places, store things, etc.

What possible advantage, other than fleeting brand recognition, does Lyft or Uber have in a world where self-driving is a standard car feature? Why wouldn't Avis, Hertz, National, <insert new or existing fleet management company here> operate those short-term rentals? Or even the car manufacturers --although based on past behavior--they probably are primarily interested in building cars.

<comment><USER26> Exactly. Once self driving cars are there , Uber and Lyft have no advantage other other companies. Rental car companies actually have experience managing large fleets which is something Uber and Lyft don't have.

<comment><USER25> I worked for one of the rental car companies in this space. They literally don't have the ability to execute the technology required for this. They are better at the labor and capital side that the startups don't want to touch.

<comment><USER17> I don't doubt that's true today. So they either adapt or new entrants displace them. (This is actually a pretty good example of how all companies are needing to increasingly become tech companies to at least some degree.)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER27> Shrewd move to get it done before Uber.

As many others here have noted (and other disputed) there doesn't seem to be an actual viable business model here. So there would be a distinct first mover advantage for getting in your IPO in, lest the other one tank the market for you as it starts to hit reality, such as actually having to have a sustainable business no longer fueled almost exclusively by investor money.

<comment><USER28> First mover has to operate in the open while the private company can continue with increased flexibility that comes from a lack of disclosure. A question I have for Lyft is why now given the, seeming, lack of a viable biz model?

<comment><USER17> I think you basically answered your own question. If you assume there really is no viable business model--and isn't going to be one--why wouldn't you take what you can while the taking is good before the suckers, excuse me investors, realize it is all smoke and mirrors? Waiting presupposes either a better exit in some other form (i.e. acquisition) or improving financials/other business metrics that let you price higher for an IPO.

ADDED: And as maxxxxx wrote, it seems as if there are a lot of risks for the general economic picture and I'd expect both Lyft and Uber to be hit pretty hard in any significant downturn as they're luxury goods to at least some degree.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER29> I'll invest in Lyft when it IPOs if the valuation is fair (unlike Snapchat's IPO lol) Every dollar Lyft raises in the IPO is an extra dollar it can use against Uber. Sometimes, the one with the biggest warchest wins.

</comment><comment><USER30> I feel that the time to file for IPO for Lyft and Uber is running out. If Waymo One starts getting popular and gets more and more into news cycle, valuations of both of these companies will be considered based on the progress of self driving cars.

</comment><comment><USER31> Did anyone here buy $lyft on the secondary markets?

</comment><comment><USER32> I'm curious what a company like Lyft (or any number of companies that have grown rapidly due to funding but still seem like they have some kind of sustainable business model) how they might look as democratically owned companies (basically a giant coop). Technically their is no reason that the entire thing can't be owned directly by the drivers, software developers and legal people with profit sharing and extreme voting. The social scaffolding is still a radical idea and the cultural assumptions are not crystalized like dictatorial businesses , but as a general idea it's hard for me not to "feel" like the democratically owned equivilent to many of these "VC funded" companies is not the the disruption model to the disruption model. I picture companies like lyft getting off the ground due to huge influx of investor money, experimenting, feng shuing out any uneeded clutter and then some leaner, more organic democratically-owned alternative gradually becoming more of a norm after the previous iteration did all the experimental work. I kind of hope that happens - at least as an experiment. If it were successful it would be funny....and neat. I can dream. :/

<comment><USER33> I'd love to see you start that company :)

</comment></comment><comment><USER34> Except Uber still works.. fastest tap to ride time I've seen across all the apps.

<comment><USER35> >fastest tap to ride time

I've never heard that phrase and I like it. I'm sure we'll start to see it more.

Then, who has the best self driving route/priority for the fastest tap to destination time :-)

</comment></comment><comment><USER36> Funny that Uber/Lyft get categorized as "ride-hailing" when they specifically don't allow you to _hail_ a cab, only request one in advance.

But the alternative seems to be "ride-sharing", which is utter feel-good bullshit outside of the small percentage who use Uber Pool or Lyft Line, so I suppose it's the best we've got.

<comment><USER37> I believe the full term is "ride-hailing app[lication]", which does fit these services, specifically because they can't be used without the apps. I agree that the shortened version doesn't fit.

</comment></comment><comment><USER38> They filed a draft/confidential S-1, so don't bother yet searching for the document.

</comment><comment> delta-neutral I made a video about this HN post, where I'm summarizing the 3 most common misconceptions that I have identified from this discussion: [https://youtu.be/Wa9uzVYA4K8](https://youtu.be/Wa9uzVYA4K8)

</comment><comment><USER39> If we learned anything from SNAP, it's that investors are still greedy. APPF is a good example of a recent IPO that has done very well since its IPO date. IMHO, hyped up companies like Lyft have all the value sucked out before the IPO.

</comment><comment><USER40> Reminder this is a direct transfer from your 401k into the pockets of wealthy VCs.

</comment><comment><USER41> Is there a link to the actual S-1?

edit: No, it looks like they filed confidentially.

</comment><comment><USER42> How unusual is a confidential S-1?

<comment><USER43> It's becoming more common now with the 2012 JOBs act, which allows companies to qualify as an Emerging Growth Company (EGC). Companies can then file confidentially and enjoy some other benefits that lower the IPO barrier. Here's info from the SEC about the confidential submission process [1]. $1B revenue is usually the bar to say under to qualify. I built an app to help startups assess their IPO readiness [2]. If you look under Legal & Compliance -> SEC -> EGC qualification tracking, it has a bunch of details.

[1] [https://www.sec.gov/divisions/corpfin/guidance/cfjumpstartfa...](https://www.sec.gov/divisions/corpfin/guidance/cfjumpstartfaq.htm)

[2] [https://ipo-ready.com/#legal-compliance](https://ipo-ready.com/#legal- compliance)

</comment></comment><comment><USER44> SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.SELL.

</comment><comment><USER45> Scramble scramble! Quick, before people realize ridesharing is completely unsustainable without self driving to take out the cost of human drivers, except that Lyft is so far behind in the self driving race that they basically have no way to ever catch up.

</comment><comment><USER46> Is there any upside to staying private if you're profitable?

<comment><USER47> You can throw lots of money at kooky, far out bets without having to answer to shareholders?

<comment><USER48> No SOX!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER49> Is there a way for retail investors to buy shares in companies pre-IPO?

</comment><comment><USER50> I see tremendous upside getting into either $LYFT below $20B or $UBER at $120B, which recently announced operational air taxi service by 2023.

<comment><USER51> I would rather wait for the Magic carpet service due by 2025.

<comment><USER52> And the home teleportation portal announced for 2027. I just hope it doesn't have too many privacy implications.

<comment><USER35> Personally, I'm more worried about the potential for a foreign object(eg. a fly) being present in the booth and becoming merged with myself as part of the teleportation process. scary stuff!</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Comic Text extension fixes Chrome's short-lived mouseover popups on xkcd - <AUTHOR> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/hfpglafkfedcnnojpioconphfcelcljj/

<comment><USER2> <http://m.xkcd.com/> will show the alt text right below the image. It's easier on my eyes.

</comment><comment><USER3> I can't seem to get it to work in Google Reader. I get no mouseover text at all, neither the Comic Text version nor the default Chrome version. Am I doing something wrong?

<comment><AUTHOR> Hmm... I see the same issue. Let me see if I can figure out what the problem is.

<comment><AUTHOR> Aha! It was a z-index issue. I'm publishing the fix now.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> That's not a problem with Chrome, it's a problem with Windows. Tooltips on Chrome in Ubuntu last indefinitely until you move your cursor out of the element.

<comment><USER5> It's a problem under OS X as well

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> Funny sidenote: The Reeder app for iPad and iPhone implemented alt-text viewing because of the XKCD site.

</comment><comment><USER7> A grateful nation thanks you.

<comment><AUTHOR> You're quite welcome! I hope I've made everyone's day just a little bit easier.</comment></comment>


Facebook says it will permanently shift tens of thousands of jobs to remote work - <AUTHOR> https://www.theverge.com/facebook/2020/5/21/21265699/facebook-remote-work-shift-workforce-permanent-covid-19-mark-zuckerberg-interview <comment><USER2> Comments moved to [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23261394](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23261394).</comment>


Ask HN: If you had to develop happytables, which technologies will you use? - <AUTHOR>

happytables.com uses ThemeForce(https://github.com/themeforce/framework), an open source wordpress based framework to power its restaurant website service.
If you are asked to develop a SAAS application similar to happytables which language/framework/technologies you will choose? Why?
Here are some features you may need to implement :
1) Account Management & Billing System
2) Admin Backend : Where customers can login and update their website information. It should be available as both web & mobile app.
3) Front-End should be made available as installable themes (similar to wordpress themes). Third party developers should be able to develop a custom theme using HTML,CSS,javascript, etc.
4) REST API <comment><USER2> This could be done with anything you are comfortable with. I would personally use Ruby on Rails for this task. As this is what I know the best. So here what you can use in Rails to do that:

\- To manage your accounts you can use different auth gems: <https://www.ruby- toolbox.com/categories/rails_authentication> here is the big list of them.

\- To make a billing system you can use: <https://stripe.com/>

\- There is a really easy approach for making REST API in Rails</comment>


Ed-Tech Company Clever to Help Schools Track Tech Usage – For a Cost - <AUTHOR> https://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2018/01/17/ed-tech-company-clever-to-help-schools-track.html <comment><USER2> Clever co-founder here - I've spent the past year working on Goals would love to answer any questions people have.

</comment><comment><USER3> [https://www.edsurge.com/news/2018-01-17-a-clever-way-to- meas...](https://www.edsurge.com/news/2018-01-17-a-clever-way-to-measure-how- students-actually-use-edtech-and-whether-it-works)

^ non-paywalled coverage of the Goals product that we launched at Clever today!</comment>


Ask HN: How do you know that a startup is worth joining or not? - <AUTHOR> What are the right questions to ask? How to assess a pre-product market fit startup? What are the signs that they already have product market fit and are growing? What are the warning signs of poor quality founders? <comment><USER2> Since no one else has chimed in I'll offer a few thoughts on this.

I think you need to look for people who are dedicated to the project, willing to work hard, be flexible, and learn as they go.

Evaluating pre-product market fit is work a startup needs to do so at the point you speak of it's still a gut level estimation you need make when deciding to join.

I would tend to shy away from bluster and ego. I would need to see people more excited about making the product great than the big bucks they expect to get when they cash out.

Ask what needs to be figured out and where their weak links and hurdles are.

Ask them to tell you what they don't know. That is something all startup team members need to do their best to understand because here there be monsters.

<comment><AUTHOR> > Ask what needs to be figured out and where their weak links and hurdles are.

> Ask them to tell you what they don't know

And what if the situation is of them not knowing what they don't know? Unknown unknowns are there....

<comment><USER2> "Unknown unknowns are there"

Most likely that is the case but the point of asking is to see how well they've thought out the product and to uncover areas that may need propping up.</comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: Any good post-grad ideas for an MD wanting to do more tech stuff? - <AUTHOR> Hi, I'm 34, have basically finished specialty training in anaesthesiology.  I'm really keen to get into or get experience in either medical devices or medical technology of some sort.  Can anyone recommend any interesting post-graduate study options, or other ideas along these lines? <comment><USER2> As an engineer in the medical device industry, I would offer that few people are in a better position to come up with those ideas than yourself. You have years of clinical experience, surely you've come across areas of practice that could be improved by technology or existing technology ripe for enhancement? Companies I work with pay good money for clinical input towards product development. If you want to get good input from a technical audience such as ours, I suggest describing your biggest pain points (no pun intended) in the profession.

<comment><USER3> I would second this advice. To be a little more concrete:

What aspects of your specialty are the most expensive, the most time- consuming, the most error-prone, and/or the most dangerous?

Alternately, you can look at the delivery systems for improvement. Are there people who lack access to professionals with the needed skills, equipment, or supplies? Or who can't access them when they are needed.

I would strongly recommend you take a look at this book if you haven't already: [https://www.amazon.com/Disciplined-Entrepreneurship-Steps- Su...](https://www.amazon.com/Disciplined-Entrepreneurship-Steps-Successful- Startup/dp/1118692284)

The book is quite awesome and there are two EdX courses that go with it that I'd also recommend: They are called Entrepreneurship 101 and 102. See: [https://www.edx.org/course/entrepreneurship-101-who- customer...](https://www.edx.org/course/entrepreneurship-101-who-customer- mitx-bootcamp1-0)

Finally, there other online courses (Coursera or EdX) that specifically cover new product development in the Medical Device space.

<comment><USER4> Thanks; I'm in a similar situation myself. I'll look into those references.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> Are you seriously about to go to school again? Work your job, save money and perhaps you can invent a device on your own, or invest in one, etc, in your spare time. Lots of physicians have done so.

</comment><comment><USER6> [http://www.engineersf.com/2016/04/17/a-list-of-the- technolog...](http://www.engineersf.com/2016/04/17/a-list-of-the-technology- companies-that-make-healthcare-it-easier-2/)

I put together a primer on all the new healthcare technologies so you can get more context on the technologies available.

I'm an advisor to semantic.md. If you want to talk to anybody on our team with an MD background who works on the tech side of things, would be happy to arrange that.

I love seeing MDs go in this direction.

Check out [http://www.enzyme.io](http://www.enzyme.io) as well. Kind of a cool app I spotted a few days ago in the med-device space.

</comment><comment><USER7> In Austria there is the possibility to study at medical informatics as Bachelor and Master Degree

You can look for example at the following link: [https://www.meduniwien.ac.at/web/en/studies-further- educatio...](https://www.meduniwien.ac.at/web/en/studies-further- education/application-admission/masters-programme-in-medical-informatics/)

We got here (in Austria) plenty of ways to go in the medical technology area, as it is possible to attend a technical college for it.

As I dont now what you are looking for, I am not really able to help you.

</comment><comment><USER8> Well, here's at least one analogue (meaning a useful model to emulate, from Mullins and Komisar's "Getting to Plan B"): a friend of mine, also an anesthesiologist, noticed a pain point and did something about it: [https://epreop.com/about-epreop/](https://epreop.com/about-epreop/)

</comment><comment><USER9> Please create a way to draw blood that doesn't involve groping around for a vein and sticking a big needle in.

<comment><USER10> [https://www.theranos.com/](https://www.theranos.com/) ;)

<comment><USER11> We a need a new term, because vaporware doesn't quite work here.

<comment><USER12> Fraud. The word you're looking for is fraud.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> I run a google group called Health Techies. It is small and not terribly active (yet). You are more than welcome to join it.

For now, I occasionally post links to discussions like this one on HN and the occasional article. I worked in insurance for over five years, had annual HIPAA training, etc.

<comment><USER13> Can you drop a link?

<comment><USER11> I am on a tablet, so I don't know how well this link will work for a desktop:

[https://groups.google.com/forum/?nomobile=true#!forum/health...](https://groups.google.com/forum/?nomobile=true#!forum/health- techies)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> Not my area of expertise, but I'm a type 1 diabetic and that area seems ripe for improvement. Artificial pancreases, automatic glucose monitoring and the like are an area that is exploding.

<comment><USER15> This is an area that is definitely ripe for improvement. Unfortunately, the bureaucratic roadblocks are very high. I am also type 1 diabetic, and I test my glucose 4 times a day (the traditional finger stick way). Continuous glucose monitoring is exceptionally expensive, and uncomfortable/painful also.

A while back I read about a method that used a very small bioactive fluorescent dye tattoo, and a light sensor to measure glucose levels. It's not continuous, but it's painless (after the tattoo), can be done often, and is much less expensive than existing continuous glucose monitoring devices.

Another article I read described some Google research that involved an instrumented contact lens that measured glucose levels by measuring something in tears and sending the results using near field communications to a monitor device. This device provides continuous monitoring, (no tattoo required), and I am guessing that total cost would be less than existing CGM devices.

I haven't heard anything about these research efforts lately, and if they're still being worked on, it could be years more before they become available.

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> You could check out some clinical informatics fellowships. It seems like there are more and more of them popping up every month.

</comment><comment><USER17> You should put some contact info in your profile so people can reach out to you directly.</comment>