Linux Graphics Demystified (2014) [pdf] - <AUTHOR> https://keyj.emphy.de/files/linuxgraphics_en.pdf <comment> iso-8859-1 Keith Packard is a big contributor to Linux graphics, a recent blog post notes:

> So, you've got a fine head-mounted display and want to explore the delights > of virtual reality. Right now, on Linux, that means getting the window > system to cooperate because the window system is the DRM master and holds > sole access to all display resources. So, you plug in your device, play with > RandR to get it displaying bits from the window system and then carefully > configure your VR application to use the whole monitor area and hope that > the desktop will actually grant you the boon of page flipping so that you > will get reasonable performance and maybe not even experience tearing. > Results so far have been mixed, and depend on a lot of pieces working in > ways that aren't exactly how they were designed to work.

His blog has some recent updates. He is consulting for Valve, working on VR.

[https://keithp.com/blogs/DRM-lease/](https://keithp.com/blogs/DRM-lease/)

<comment><USER2> Best i can tell, he is the only one willing to touch Xorg internals. The rest just fitter around the edges, delete code, and hack on Wayland because its shinier.

Xorg will live and die with Packard, sadly.

<comment><USER3> This is an extremely simplistic view that misunderstands the situation.

For one, those people working on Wayland made enormous contributions to the X Server long before Wayland existed. The creator of Wayland, Kristian Høgsberg did AIGLX, just to name one example.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> There are few things I hate with more passion than I do the Linux "Graphics Stack." I realize that it inherited a toxic culture from UNIX (remember the X/Motif/xNews/Suntools/Etc wars? I do.) and even today there is active warfare in the stack Wayland vs Xorg, GTK vs QT, Gnome vs KDE vs *desktop, HW Vendors vs FOSS, OpenGL vs OpenGL, Etc.

<rant> A great example of this is how broken the simplest of things can be. I've got sitting next to me machine which refused to boot into a "good" graphics configuration, it boots with a 'safe' default of 1024 x 800 screen (where the actual screen is a 2K screen) even though it has HDMI (which can tell it all that it needs to know.) Using a widely deployed nVidia card and the current 'non-free-non-FOSS' nVidia graphics stack. Re-install the driver package, and it works (until reboot). Yes, there is a knob somewhere that screws it up, there are a billion knobs, from a dozen layers, is it DRM/KMS? is it Lightdm? is it Nvidia? Is it OpenGL? Is it a friggin boot option buried in the boot args? It can be anywhere and its going to take me a few hours to figure out where it is. Which in terms of wasted salary time is enough for me to buy a Mac Pro or a Windows box which works every time all the time. </rant>

<comment><USER5> It's the nvidia card. The binary drivers are good for 3D acceleration, but bad for system integration. The open source drivers are not good enough.

Intel and AMD graphics have much better open source drivers (but are not as good at 3D acceleration).

<comment><USER6> The current AMDGPU driver is quite good, actually. Better at 3D accel than the proprietary one.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> There is another great resource mainly about X11 called Xplain[1] with its accompanying repository[2] with some hidden (not yet ready I suppose) chapters. For example the override-redirect description[3].

[1]: [https://magcius.github.io/xplain/article/](https://magcius.github.io/xplain/article/)

[2]: [https://github.com/magcius/xplain](https://github.com/magcius/xplain)

[3]: [https://magcius.github.io/xplain/article/menu.html](https://magcius.github.io/xplain/article/menu.html)

<comment><USER2> Sadly it feels mostly like a PR piece for Wayland.

<comment><USER8> All understanding of X11 feels this way. Read the docs and source yourself sometime.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> I don't like these slides. It's not that they're terribly wrong. But they gloss over some of the really important aspects. And they make actually rather simple problems appear harder than they are.

Take for example slide 29. This slide suggests, that off-screen redirection of OpenGL applications (as required for composition) is something special and needs to be treated differently than non-OpenGL graphics. This is simply not true. If OpenGL is used in a _window system integrated_ context (WSI is a rather new term, which has been properly defined only recently, but the principle has been the same since the beginning; what's new is, that since OpenGL-3 you can use a GL context _without_ WSI) the window framebuffer is _not_ managed by the OpenGL implementation, but whatever windowing system is used (e.g. X11, Win32 GDI, etc.) and the OpenGL implementation just borrows that. And the same mechanism (and incidently code paths) that allow to use a WSI drawable as rendering destination for OpenGL also allows to turn the flow of data around and use a WSI drawable as source for texture access. Somewhere at the bottom it's just pointers to regions of graphics memory after all.

It's a pretty simple process, actually, and the only complicated thing are the weirdly convoluted APIs that have grown around it, to expose something that has always been there, but had been hidden from applications before. But consider how quickly AIGLX was hacked together after Xgl showed up. There have been, IIRC, just a couple of months between.

That's the main insight that lead to the Wayland project. Do away with the API cruft and expose the one thing that has been possible all the time anyway.

Oh, and it should maybe also pointed out that GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap is useful for so much more than just composition, and can be used without Composite redirection.

And then there's slide 13, which is simply wrong in stating that there was a time when "Indirect Rendering (…) didn't allow for hardware acceleration." That's not what it implies. It just implies, that there is no fast path between application process and graphics hardware, which slowed down data transfers. But display lists back then were a staple of OpenGL and they did offer and for the legacy code that uses them still do offer excellent performance (it actually took some time for OpenGL drivers Buffer Object based Vertex Array drawing code paths to catch up with display list performance). And one could use display lists over indirect GLX just fine (and actually there ARB_vertex_buffer_object extension defines GLX opcodes, so you can even have that over indirect contexts, too).

<comment><USER10> Hi, are you the guy in this video?

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTdUmlGxVo0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTdUmlGxVo0)

<comment><USER2> And the guy jumping the stage is Lennart Poettering, of Pulseaudio and Systemd "fame"...

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> Interesting, but as expected somewhat outdated, like missing amdgpu/radeonsi, Vulkan and etc.

<comment> TD-Linux Luckily, those mostly slot in at clean locations in the presentation: amdgpu replaces radeon, vulkan replaces the bottom half of mesa.

<comment><USER7> And there are quite a few schematics on Wikipedia:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_Rendering_Manager](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_Rendering_Manager)

It's a MESA->this[] of technologies :)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> The arrows in slide 45 look like they are in the wrong direction?

</comment><comment><USER13> Outstanding article

</comment><comment><USER14> Title should be "Linux Graphics Demystified (2014)"

</comment><comment><USER15> Are there any/many notable Linux applications that are graphics intensive?

<comment> iso-8859-1 Many. All the games from [https://www.feralinteractive.com](https://www.feralinteractive.com) .

Blender can be extremely demanding. Cryptocurrency mining is also very hard on the GPU.

<comment><USER16> Crypto mining is not "graphics" though and bypasses X11 (it talks to the GPU via CUDA or OpenCL). You can happily mine without ever having an X server running.

<comment> iso-8859-1 What defines graphics? There is linear algebra in all sorts of things. I can use OpenGL without rendering to screen. Is it still graphics to you?

<comment><USER16> What I meant is that mining has a totally different way of using the GPU than graphics. For OpenGL you have to have X11 running and the correct libraries installed. Mining bypasses all that and uses OpenCL or CUDA instead.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Show HN: React-Express-stripe – Accept Payments from Users with This Boilerplate - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/rwieruch/react-express-stripe <comment><USER2> Neat. Author has written solid docs too: [https://www.robinwieruch.de/react- express-stripe-payment/](https://www.robinwieruch.de/react-express-stripe- payment/)

I'd maybe add Passport Local and RethinkDB as most apps have users, but this still looks great.</comment>


Best Consumer Hard Drives: August 2020 - <AUTHOR> https://www.anandtech.com/show/12075/best-consumer-hdds <comment><USER2> This is a really poor article. It's basically looking at spec sheets and current prices to determine the "best" drive. There doesn't seem to be any empirical testing whatsoever. They also seem to recommend product lines that are significantly pricier. eg. their "High-Capacity Desktop" recommendation is "14TB Seagate BarraCuda Pro" for $515. Is that really better than getting a 12TB easystore for $190 and then shucking it? The cost per terabyte of the easystore is less than half, and I really doubt that the recommended drive would last twice as long. Also, despite the article being less than 2 days old, most of the recommended drives are either not available, or available at significantly higher prices that listed.

<comment><USER3> They do specifically discuss "shucking" the drives from USB enclosures and recommend against it. I do wonder how well this list compares against the reports from Backblaze.

<comment><USER2> Replying to the quotes from the article:

>While this is easy enough to do, the user experience might not be optimal - obtaining warranty services is pretty much ruled out

AFAIK easystores are relatively easy to shuck non-destructively. If you do it right and don't destroy the enclosure, and your drive breaks, you might still be able to submit it for warranty. Regardless, I'm skeptical about the actual value of the warranty is worth the premium (double the price).

>the default TLER settings might need alteration (which is not always possible with commercial off-the-shelf NAS units)

True, although it's likely not useful unless in business-critical workloads. You're probably fine without TLER if you're just using it to store movies/games.

>the drive is going to be used in non-critical scenarios.

What's meant by "critical scenarios" here? Either you care about the data or not. If you care about it, you will keep backups and/or use parity to ensure that one drive failure won't wipe out your data. If you're only storing on one drive, you're one unexpected disk crash from losing it. This applies regardless of whether you're using the cheapest consumer drive, or the most expensive "enterprise" drive.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> Backblaze does it the best way IMHO, they review the drives based on the time they have them in production running and based on the effective failures to write operations & consider the $/Tb as well and they do this every quarterly and publish the result.

Check those out once and see if you can get the data you need

<comment><USER5> I read somewhere recently (might have been here, I don't recall for sure), that one of the problems with the recommendations from Backblaze is that the drives change constantly and there can be variations over time in manufacturing. You could buy something today that has the same model number as what Backblaze bought 6-12 months ago, and it's not really the same drive.

They're still my preferred resource for this, but it's not without its caveats.

<comment><USER6> That is a very valid criticism, but at the same time, could anyone really do any better? If the manufacturer is going to change the build for the same SKU within the time it takes to collect meaningful failure rate data, then I don't know that you can construct a more useful measurement technique than Backblaze has. The data on specific drive models may be of limited reliability, but you do at least get enough data to rank brands based on typical long-term reliability by brand and product line.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> I find it very hard to browse all these comparison sites. For example i need a very simple question: whats the very best SSD i can buy 1TB for under or near $500. So much confusion, especially Samsung with all the EVO and PRO and numbers and whatever models sheesh.

<comment><USER8> > whats the very best SSD i can buy 1TB for under or near $500

The problem is that you have already made some kind of decision that $500 is a reasonable threshold for getting 1TB of SSD, and some assumption that you stand to gain anything at all by paying extra for the same capacity. That's kinda backwards; you should start by figuring out how much performance and endurance you need out of your 1TB of storage, just like you've apparently already figured out that 1TB is the capacity you need.

You might be fine with a $99 1TB SSD, or maybe you need a $320 1TB SSD. But it's pretty odd to expect a purchasing guide to be a useful tool to figure out how best to _overpay_ for your storage.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Those are prospective MTBF numbers from the manufacturer. More useful would be observed MTBFs from a big data center operator.

<comment><AUTHOR> But then you need the datacenter operator to use the same generic drives you would. Backblaze is the only one who publishes results for the drives they have, which are more or less close to what a prosumer would pursue.

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> *only

</comment><comment><USER11> This is a bit like having the "best" bag full of vomit. Who can make the case for hard drives in consumer applications?

<comment><USER12> For people who want to store lots of stuff.

Not everyone has a photo library or media library or game collection that fits onto a reasonably priced SSD.

<comment><USER11> It seems like people who need moderate tens of terabytes of storage would be _more_ interested in the performance and reliability of an SSD, not less. If you have demanding storage needs aren't you then more likely to be willing to pay $100/TB for storage?

<comment><USER13> There's no reliable storage, only backups of backups.

So in the end the choice is SSDs if you need fast storage or hard drives if you need cheap(er) storage.

Even if SSDs were priced the same as hard drive you would need much more SATA ports on a machine to achieve a big storage capacity.

<comment><USER11> > you would need much more SATA ports on a machine

Why? There are 16TB SSDs u.2 SSDs on the market. That is comparable to top-of- the-line hard drives in terms of bytes per port and much, much better in terms of bytes per volume.

<comment><USER8> U.2 is a different kind of port, and one that's in notoriously short supply on all but the most expensive platforms. Even if you could get U.2 SSDs at the same price per TB as hard drives, you still need to spend a lot more to get them connected and keep them cool (enterprise SSDs don't have low-power idle states).

<comment><USER11> This conversation is increasingly weird. Enterprise SSDs definitely do have low-power modes. The Samsung PM983 I've used at scale draws 4W when idle or 11W active. A 14TB Seagate HDD like the one recommended in the article draws 5W minimum. The SSDs have a 5 milliwatt non-operating mode they can exit in less than 30ms, which is dramatically better than the latency of a non- operating hard drive (and turning a hard drive off wears it out, too). The SSD wins in this regard.

It's also virtually impossible to overheat an SSD. Samsung SSDs have critical temperatures above 90C. You won't reach this temperature just by operating the drive. The only way I've been able to make a Samsung SSD trip the critical temperature alarm was by pointing a paint-stripping air gun into the fan inlet of a machine while running an fio workload. HDDs by contrast are trivial to overheat, and are destroyed by doing it.

<comment><USER8> > The SSDs have a 5 milliwatt non-operating mode they can exit in less than > 30ms,

Which mode exactly are you referring to? Because the 983 DCTs (retail version of the PM983) that I have don't support features like NVMe APST, and idle at 3+ W (for the M.2 version, which is lower-power than the U.2 version).

> It's also virtually impossible to overheat an SSD.

Maybe in a properly designed rackmount enclosure with fans that never drop below 4k RPM. But in a more typical consumer case, enterprise U.2 drives will absolutely overheat, and I have the logs to prove it. (The Samsung drives you refer to are definitely better about this than the kind of U.2 drives that use 15mm thick cases and controllers with more than 8 channels—which I believe includes all U.2 drives with capacity in excess of 8TB.) Consumer cases that still have 3.5" bays tend to provide plenty of airflow for them, but that's not the case for 2.5" bays.

<comment><USER11> Maybe we should avoid the specifics of Samsung, since they are in the habit of shipping different firmware to retail and bulk buyers. I've never used the retail 983, and I have no experience with the u.2 either. All I can say for sure is you cannot overheat the stick version. If it overheats that's because your datacenter is on fire.

I can replicate this at home with a Samsung 970 PRO m.2 in an Intel NUC. It just will not overheat. The only thing I can do to make it shut down is to put blankets over the NUC in which case the CPU has gone PROCHOT anyway.

Bottom line, it seems to me that power and heat are advantages of SSD, not HDD. It seems like people buy HDD purely because of GB/$, which makes sense to me at scale but not at home. The care and management of hard drives, and their atrocious performance, seems to outweigh the price advantage. It's really hard to manage HDDs successfully and even if you are doing it perfectly, it still means you are replacing the HDD every 3-5 years. What a pain.

<comment><USER12> > It's really hard to manage HDDs successfully and even if you are doing it > perfectly, it still means you are replacing the HDD every 3-5 years. What a > pain.

Neither HDDs nor SSDs will last forever.

It's as easy as sticking a pair of drives in a cheap NAS enclosure and listening for the warning alarm when SMART predicts failure or a drive fails.

I _did_ have to replace the previous NAS after 5 years-- not because of failure, but because I needed more storage and wanted more performance. Otherwise it might have lasted quite a bit longer.

<comment><USER11> An SSD that's only being read really will last ~forever. It has the same wear- out process as a CPU or RAM. A hard drive will wear out based on power-on hours and start/stop cycles, regardless of how much you use it. I'm not saying you should blindly assume that your SSD will never break, since they can and do randomly stop working, but it seems clear that reliability is a clear win for SSD over HDD, especially in consumer applications where the mere passage of time is the thing that will kill hard drives.

<comment><USER12> > It has the same wear-out process as a CPU or RAM.

This isn't really true-- flash isn't really like DRAM; leakage currents tend to increase even if you don't reprogram things (and to properly fight leakage- related data corruption, you really need to periodically rewrite and do the erases that further compound dielectric breakdown). And it's especially not true of board-level assemblies, where capacitor failure and solder joints become important.

> A hard drive will wear out based on power-on hours and start/stop cycles, > regardless of how much you use it.

Some failure modes look like this in SSDs, too. Studies have shown that SSD age is a much better predictor of failure probability than usage. Depending on how firmware handles things and the cell characteristics, -insufficient use- of a SSD can cause failure, too.

I mean, I did some work on firmware for early SSDs and error rate / lifetime analysis and I've had SSDs lose data in a drawer unused, but maybe you know better. Yes, SSDs are better than HDDs, but not as drastically so as one would think.

I <3 flash. But I also like having big dumb spinny disks. I'm rather glad I can have both.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


BleachBit: a free software to increase your privacy on Ubuntu and Windows - <AUTHOR> http://galigio.org/2010/11/01/bleachbit-a-free-powerful-software-to-increase-your-privacy-on-ubuntu-and-windows/

<comment><USER2> What does this do? When I clicked on this link I imagined an application that continuously wrote over free space while the computer was idle and leaving 20-50 megabytes free for the open applications.

<comment><USER3> It looks like this is an answer to the EverCookie (<http://samy.pl/evercookie/>). You can quickly select and clear a whole range of caches and cookies.

<http://bleachbit.sourceforge.net/></comment></comment>


How Apple Is Giving Design a Bad Name - <AUTHOR> https://www.fastcodesign.com/3053406/how-apple-is-giving-design-a-bad-name <comment><USER2> Reading this essay was cathartic.

It says everything that has frustrated me for years. The comments on this page don't address the issues in the essay. They focus on what is clever in current products not on core usability. I've been writing Mac and/or iOS apps for thirty years. I know from experience that interface issues are deep and subtle. Cleverness has nothing to do with it. Apple is in deep trouble.

Jonathan Ive (VP in charge of user experience) has been elevated the status of a super star by the superficial press. He _does_ have an excellent artistic design sense. That's all. I don't care how thin his products are or how pretty they are. Ive must go!

</comment><comment><USER3> I believe Apple is designing things the way they SHOULD be. Their new products are, in fact, actually amazing, and even _futuristic:_

* The out-of-the-box/first-power-on experience on any Apple device remains unparalleled.

• Just hold the AirPods case near your iPhone and open it, and they're seamlessly paired. Complete with "YourName's AirPods" automatically set up in the Bluetooth settings.

• AirPods do not require cumbersome Bluetooth unpairing/repairing across your Apple devices; just select them from the output device menu on your Mac/iPad/Apple Watch.

• Audio syncs perfectly between both left and right AirPods. They have considerable range (I've tested them through multiple walls on different floors.) They both have separate batteries (with their own battery meter, which only shows up when they don't have the same amount of charge). They can be used individually to conserve battery or keep one ear open.

• AirPods' microphones only pick up your voice, even in a loud environment.

• The Touch Bar. Apps SHOULD have a context-sensitive input device. Nobody should have to learn and remember what each FN key does in each app.

• On the Touch Bar, you can just bring your finger down on buttons like Brightness/Volume and just slide your finger left/right without lifting it. That is, you don't have to tap, raise finger, then move your finger to the slider control to drag it, even if the knob appears in a different area away from your finger. A minor but VERY nice design and attention to detail.

• It takes time to recognize where the Touch Bar can improve input speed compared to just keyboard/mouse/trackpad, but there definitely are moments where it's _faster;_ For example, when I'm editing a contact's phone number, the buttons for labels like "Home" or "Work" appear on the Touch Bar. It's quicker than using the mouse pointer to open the dropdown list, and it's not possible to have keyboard shortcuts for each label (including custom ones) but they can be easily shown in a scrolling list on the Touch Bar.

• The new MacBook Pros. Modern computers SHOULD have a single type of port, and we should be able to use any port for charging.

• Unlocking my MacBook by just raising the lid if I'm wearing my Apple Watch. I need to be physically close to the laptop and the Watch notifies me every time it happens.

* Touch ID on Macs. Can't wait for third-party apps to use it for authentication like on iOS.

• Being able to seamlessly copy/paste across your Apple devices is one of those things you never knew you needed, but you'll sorely miss when you work on devices that don't have it.

So, no, Apple is not giving design a bad name. They are actually doing a lot of things right. They do have many flaws yes (especially on the software side, some of which are very frustrating) but their biggest mistake is setting themselves up to be a target of the tall poppy syndrome [1], and it's getting rather tiresome.

[1] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tall_poppy_syndrome](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tall_poppy_syndrome)

<comment><USER4> For all the things the Airpods do right, they're still easy to miss, in-ear headphones with sub par audio quality.

> Apps SHOULD have a context-sensitive input device

Like the mouse. And the screen. Not a separate screen I have to look down to be able to use because it has no proper tactile feedback unlike a proper key.

> A minor but VERY nice design and attention to detail.

An extremely minor thing that's not worth all the downsides. I can get a better version of that gimmick on my mouse just using the side button+scroll wheel.

> For example, when I'm editing a contact's phone number, the buttons for > labels like "Home" or "Work" appear on the Touch Bar.

You don't need a separate screen to have context sensitive buttons. This sounds like an UX compromise just to push the touch bar rather than something I'd want.

Also "in a scrolling list on the Touch Bar." That _cannot_ be faster than a mouse or keyboard shortcut, and would be trivial to replicate with the keyboards F-keys (two keys for scrolling forward/backward, rest for selection). Another example on how it's just a gimmick.

> The new MacBook Pros. Modern computers SHOULD have a single type of port, > and we should be able to use any port for charging.

I value more being able to connect all my devices without 5 different dongles hanging from my laptop than idolizing an ideal, non-existent world.

> Unlocking my MacBook by just raising the lid if I'm wearing my Apple Watch.

You can do this with any other programmable smartwatch. I remember people were doing this with a Pebble. It's still a gimmick.

> Touch ID on Macs. Can't wait for third-party apps to use it for > authentication like on iOS.

You're praising fingerprint readers under a marketing name. I literally have this on a cheap refurbished HP laptop from 2010 or so I've been using as a server.

> Being able to seamlessly copy/paste across your Apple devices is one of > those things you never knew you needed, but you'll sorely miss when you work > on devices that don't have it.

So... KDE Connect?

So indeed, Apple seems to be doing nothing but gimmicks and more proprietary lock-in. This is a good thing, somehow?

<comment><USER3> _> For all the things the Airpods do right, they're still easy to miss_

Anecdotal, unproven. It's YOUR fault if you easily forget about foreign objects in your ear, and does not negate "all the things the Airpods do right." In any case, Find My Phone will have support for tracking them in the next iOS update.

I've gone running with them, used them in crowded environments with hundreds of people jostling me, and I have yet to lose or even drop one.

The freedom from wires (and excellent microphones) are a HUGE convenience and far outweighs any minor subjective quibbles. Can you tell me how YOU would design something without any wires that's not easy to miss?

 _> sub par audio quality._

Subjective. Source?

They're good enough, no worse than the previous EarPods, and not bad at all.

\----

> _I value more being able to connect all my devices without 5 different > dongles hanging from my laptop than idolizing an ideal, non-existent world._

Hyperbole.

If you carried 5 different devices with your laptop, you would need to carry at most one USB/USB-C adapter and maybe a multiport USB hub.

I have an iPhone, iPad, a Bluetooth Mouse, a Bluetooth keyboard (for games) and a WiFi harddisk. I haven't needed to plug them into my 2016 MBP yet, nor do I carry all of them in my backpack, but I do have one small USB/USB-C adapter for when I need it. File transfers of even several GBs work flawlessly with AirDrop.

See [1]. Apple already did this long ago for the original USB standard, when the first iMac came with nothing but USB ports.

\----

 _> I remember people were doing this with a Pebble. It's still a gimmick._

It still doesn't change the fact that it's still convenient.

\----

 _> I literally have this on a cheap refurbished HP laptop from 2010 or so I've been using as a server._

It still doesn't change the fact that it's still convenient, and I would wager more secure than the tech in a 2010 HP laptop.

Moreover, it integrates very nicely with authorizing App Store and Apple Pay purchases, and giving permission for administrative actions. Did older laptops integrate fingerprint authentication deeply into Windows?

\----

 _> Like the mouse. And the screen. Not a separate screen I have to look down to be able to use because it has no proper tactile feedback unlike a proper key._

Does not diminish its advantages.

"No proper tactile feedback unlike a proper key" can be used to downplay the utility of all the phone and tablet touchscreens in the world, too.

A mouse does not provide visual feedback depending on what you're doing.

I'm looking straight at the screen right now on a 2016 MBP, and the Touch Bar is within my field of vision.

In any case, it's no worse than having to discover, learn and remember what each FN does in each app.

 _> An extremely minor thing that's not worth all the downsides. I can get a better version of that gimmick on my mouse just using the side button+scroll wheel._

Which "all downsides?"

To change brightness/volume, all I need is to swipe on the Touch Bar. Do you have any of your mouse buttons permanently set to controlling volume and/or brightness?

The Touch Bar is not replacing the mouse, trackpad or keyboard. You still have a mouse, trackpad and keyboard. Why are you comparing it with them? The Touch Bar replaces FN keys, and it's better than them.

 _> You don't need a separate screen to have context sensitive buttons. Also "in a scrolling list on the Touch Bar." That cannot be faster than a mouse or keyboard shortcut_

Say I have contacts named after companies/organizations, and I use tens of different custom labels for each phone number/email for the different people working at them.

Which of these is faster/better?

• I keep 10+ different keyboard shortcuts, for each label, and remember which one maps to which label on _which contact._ (!)

• I take my fingers away from the keyboard to move the mouse pointer to open the dropdown list, scroll it and click on a label.

• I keep my hands on the keyboard and tap a label on the Touch Bar.

\----

 _> So indeed, Apple seems to be doing nothing but gimmicks and more proprietary lock-in. This is a good thing, somehow?_

Subjective. "Gimmicks" can be used against any feature from any company.

All of these things highly increase user convenience within the ecosystem without any setup required beyond signing-on once with your Apple ID. This is bad design, somehow?

\----

Your dismissals are a classic example of the tall poppy syndrome; Were Apple a smaller company, you probably wouldn't be putting so much effort in downplaying their accomplishments.

The fact that others companies came out with [half-baked] versions of some features first, or anecdotes about misplacing equipment or subjective opinions of audio quality, does NOT diminish the fact that Apple DO do a lot of things right.

[1] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legacy- free_PC](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legacy-free_PC)

<comment><USER4> > It's YOUR fault if you easily forget about foreign objects in your ear

I don't use them. My friends do, and they don't lose them when they're _in their ear_. Also, guess what? I don't risk losing my headphones just because I fall asleep on long trips. It's not my fault, it's Apple's product being poor at fitting an extremely common usecase.

> Subjective. Source?

Go to an audio store and ask them for monitoring headphones. You can't explain audio quality to someone that has never experienced it, these things are a night/day difference.

> Can you tell me how YOU would design something without any wires that's not > easy to miss?

I would use shorter, interchangeable wires for the right occasion rather than go wireless and have to _charge_ my headphones, tolerate a worse audio quality than I'm accustomed to and risk easily losing them.

> Does not diminish its advantages.

Yes it does, same pros but with an extra con and on top of that, the touch bar is not a free addition to a screen and keyboard you already have.

>"No proper tactile feedback unlike a proper key" can be used to downplay the utility of all the phone and tablet touchscreens in the world, too.

Smartphones and tablets have a single screen, or at worst, they're contiguous on the same plane.

> A mouse does not provide visual feedback depending on what you're doing.

No, that's the screen's job. I don't have to look at my mouse to change volume, I just look at the screen. Or rather, I use my keyboard (caps lock+[s/d] in my case), since I don't see the benefit of more than 5% stepped increases.

> I'm looking straight at the screen right now on a 2016 MBP, and the Touch > Bar is within my field of vision.

And my phone is technically in front of me beyond my monitor, but without focusing on its smaller screen with a different DPI I can't read it. Which is why I started using KDE Connect after all: to get notifications on my desktop.

> In any case, it's no worse than having to discover, learn and remember what > each FN does in each app.

In how many apps do you exactly use its FN-options? And how is it any different from labeling them in the screen next to the button it means? You'd still not have to look at the keyboard. You can even do it for apps using the Touchbar API: [https://www.cnet.com/how-to/how-to-get-a-touch-bar-on- your-o...](https://www.cnet.com/how-to/how-to-get-a-touch-bar-on-your-old- mac/)

> Hyperbole. If you carried 5 different devices with your laptop, you would > need to carry at most one USB/USB-C adapter and maybe a multiport USB hub.

For 5 yes. For 4, no. The old laptop I mentioned has 4 USB ports, where I regularly plug an external kb and mouse, an USB stick and my phone for tethering or debugging an app on a real device.

> I have an iPhone, iPad, a Bluetooth Mouse, a Bluetooth keyboard (for games) > and a WiFi harddisk. I haven't needed to plug them into my 2016 MBP yet, nor > do I carry all of them in my backpack, but I do have one small USB/USB-C > adapter for when I need it. File transfers of even several GBs work > flawlessly with AirDrop.

Cool. I only need my laptop charger when I leave home.

> Which "all downsides?"

Again, cost and having to actually look down at the small thing to be able to use it.

> You still have a mouse, trackpad and keyboard. Why are you comparing it with > them? The Touch Bar replaces FN keys, and it's better than them.

Last time I checked, the FN keys are on the keyboard.

> Say I have contacts named after companies/organizations, and I use tens of > different custom labels for each phone number/email for the different people > working at them. Which of these is faster/better?

Assuming you have more than 10 of them, the keyboard and input with autocompletion rather than the scroll list on a separate screen.

Or the same thing as the touch bar but on the screen. We've had this technology for a while: [https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/1b/Norton_Comman...](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/1b/Norton_Commander_5.51.png)

> Subjective. "Gimmicks" can be used against any feature from any company. All > of these things ______highly increase user convenience __ __ __

When all you can offer is copies of barely useful things that have already been done, you can hardly call your company "amazing" or "futuristic". The rest of the quote speaks for itself.

> Your dismissals are a classic example of the tall poppy syndrome; Were Apple > a smaller company, you probably wouldn't be putting so much effort in > downplaying their accomplishments.

And your relentless shilling is a classic example of blind fanboyism (as redundant as it sounds) and choice-supportive bias. You're literally attaching a label to anyone criticizing a corporation you're trying to sell. Do I need to link my comments shitting on smaller companies too? Or when I praise Apple/{insert corporation here} when they do a good thing? Do yourself a favor and reflect on your thought process for a bit. Unless you're doing marketing work for Apple, in which case you should grab a PR book.

<comment><USER3> _> I don't use them. My friends do, and they don't lose them when they're in their ear. Also, guess what? I don't risk losing my headphones just because I fall asleep on long trips. It's not my fault, it's Apple's product being poor at fitting an extremely common usecase._

What exactly are you trying to say here?

Again, I have been using them for 2 months in a variety of situations and have never come close to losing them.

Furthermore, if you don't use them, how do you claim sub-par audio quality?

\----

 _> Go to an audio store and ask them for monitoring headphones. You can't explain audio quality to someone that has never experienced it, these things are a night/day difference._

Will those headphones

• Be completely wireless?

• Work with all my devices without repairing?

• Have microphones on each side?

• Be trackable?

\----

 _> I would use shorter, interchangeable wires_

is not an answer to "How you would design something without any wires."

Your product is not for me. I will not buy it, neither will anyone who does not want ANY wires in their earbuds.

<comment><USER4> > Again, I have been using them for 2 months in a variety of situations and > have never come close to losing them.

It probably fits your ears well. It does fit mine well enough when I tried them, but it did not the owner's. Even then I would not be confident enough to use them on a bus when asleep.

> Furthermore, if you don't use them, how do you claim sub-par audio quality?

I don't use them, which has not stopped me from trying them.

>Will those headphones >• Be completely wireless? >[...] Your product is not for me. I will not buy it, neither will anyone who does not want ANY wires.

I don't know of in-ear, wireless headphones that have acceptable audio quality. I've read somewhere there are some wireless over/on-ear ones that do, however. But I have never tried anything like that so I can't in good conscience recommend them.

With that said, most people that have told me they can't do without wireless change their mind when I invite them to try the half-broken ATH-M50 headphones I use on the go.

However, I do understand that some people don't care about listening to the details of a song and just having an audible beat and/or metallic voice is enough to satisfy them. There's also even more people with hearing problems. Whatever case it is, although I would recommend you go for a cheaper alternative, if every one of those bullet points is mandatory and worth 230 USD to you, then yes, there's nothing to discuss and stick with the ear pods.

<comment><USER3> They are US$160: [http://www.apple.com/shop/product/MMEF2AM/A/airpods](http://www.apple.com/shop/product/MMEF2AM/A/airpods)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> The lack of a back button is one of my top frustrations whenever I use an iPhone.

<comment><USER3> Really? Not being able to edge-swipe to go back was one of my frustrations the last time I used Chrome (I think) on Android.

Taking up permanent space for a button that is not relevant in every app/situation seems like the worse design choice here, and a half-hearted one especially after you've made the decision to eliminate buttons in favor of touchscreens.</comment></comment>


Amazon Fires Colorado Associates - <AUTHOR> http://radar.oreilly.com/2010/03/amazon-fires-its-colorado-asso.html

<comment><AUTHOR> Just got this e-mail from Amazon, terminating my Associates account - effective immediately. No warning at all.

A few stats: in the five years I've been an Associate, I've generated hundreds of thousands of dollars in sales for Amazon. (Tried to get an exact number, but my Associates account is closed, and historical data isn't working properly.) My referral commissions are typically $500-600 a month, with seasonal spikes as large as $1,200.

This is a good lesson in counterparty risk - if my business was based primarily on Amazon Associates, I'd be totally screwed.

Here's the full text of the e-mail:

</comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment>

Dear Colorado-based Amazon Associate:

We are writing from the Amazon Associates Program to inform you that the Colorado government recently enacted a law to impose sales tax regulations on online retailers. The regulations are burdensome and no other state has similar rules. The new regulations do not require online retailers to collect sales tax. Instead, they are clearly intended to increase the compliance burden to a point where online retailers will be induced to "voluntarily" collect Colorado sales tax -- a course we won't take.

We and many others strongly opposed this legislation, known as HB 10-1193, but it was enacted anyway. Regrettably, as a result of the new law, we have decided to stop advertising through Associates based in Colorado. We plan to continue to sell to Colorado residents, however, and will advertise through other channels, including through Associates based in other states.

There is a right way for Colorado to pursue its revenue goals, but this new law is a wrong way. As we repeatedly communicated to Colorado legislators, including those who sponsored and supported the new law, we are not opposed to collecting sales tax within a constitutionally-permissible system applied even-handedly. The US Supreme Court has defined what would be constitutional, and if Colorado would repeal the current law or follow the constitutional approach to collection, we would welcome the opportunity to reinstate Colorado-based Associates.

You may express your views of Colorado's new law to members of the General Assembly and to Governor Ritter, who signed the bill.

Your Associates account has been closed as of March 8, 2010, and we will no longer pay advertising fees for customers you refer to Amazon.com after that date. Please be assured that all qualifying advertising fees earned prior to March 8, 2010, will be processed and paid in accordance with our regular payment schedule. Based on your account closure date of March 8, any final payments will be paid by May 31, 2010.

We have enjoyed working with you and other Colorado-based participants in the Amazon Associates Program, and wish you all the best in your future.

Best Regards,

The Amazon Associates Team

<comment><USER2> Wouldn't it therefore make sense to have a PO Box in another state, then set yourself up again with Amazon? You are close to either Kansas, New Mexico, or Wyoming, depending on where you are in CO...

<comment><AUTHOR> I already have an account with Earth Class Mail (handy if you don't want to give people your home address if you work from home), so I set up an official business address in Beaverton, Oregon and changed my address via the Associates website.

Oregon doesn't have a sales tax, and I'm paying Colorado income tax on anything I receive, so this should fix the issue while staying on the right side of all applicable laws. Will update if/when I get a response from Amazon regarding my request to reinstate my account.

<comment><AUTHOR> My account has been reinstated. Looks like I may have to incorporate an LLC in Oregon, but that's easy to do.

Here's the e-mail I received from Amazon:

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment></comment><comment></comment><comment>

I confirmed that your contact and payee addresses have been updated. Because you have changed your state of residence, your account has been reinstated. However, we want to be sure you are aware that you may be asked to provide proof of residency at your new address. If this is the case, we will contact you with instructions on what documentation to provide and the submission process for this documentation.

Thank you for your participation in the Associates Program.

</comment><comment><USER3> "It's one thing to be fired for something you did (hey doofus, don't cause a heap of MPAA infringement notices to land on Amazon's desk because you were running the new Pirate Bay on EC2) but it's entirely another to be fired for something outside your control."

If your own state government is something you happily and comfortably state is "outside your control", getting fired by Amazon is the least of your problems.

<comment><USER4> how do you propose he control it? by writing his senator? hahahaha

<comment><USER5> Senators are very responsive to small issues like this. The elected official will listen to polls or their own values on the big issues like healthcare or abortion. On the little issues that are extremely important to a small group of people but largely unimportant to the rest, the senator will hop onboard with the vocal minority very quickly. 99% of the state might prefer the tax but it doesn't real change their vote, and 1% might vehemently oppose it and it will change their vote, the official will almost always go with the 1%.

I've been part of that vocal minority and had elected officials intervene in tiny issues. You'd be very surprised by what can be accomplished by 20-100 angry people.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Smart move. They shouldn't acquiesce to a small group of largely ignorant politicians. Imagine if every web app you wrote was required to have unique compliance code for every state-- not a good precedent. Besides, I imagine most large volume affiliates will just get checks sent to their uncle in Dubuque. The only thing they should have done differently is sent out a snarky email giving people one week to "move" to another state before deleting their account. Reminds me a little of Wal-mart shutting down stores that attempt to unionize, who can blame them?

(same dumb shit is going on with medical marijuana. colorado voters amended the constitution now the legislature is trying to pass a law that only doctors THEY approve can write recommendations.)

</comment><comment><USER7> Can't blame them at all. It's a simple cost benefit analysis. They surely can easily estimate whether or not the cost of charging sales tax on items to Colorado residents (presumably in lost sales) is greater than the amount they lose from Colorado affiliates. You'd assume that because they haven't done the same thing in other states with similar laws.

I do Facebook development and I'm always cognizant of the fact that my continued success depends on their good will. Everything I do is with that in mind, both in terms of making sure my interests align with theirs and in building up a fallback plan.

<comment><USER8> As far as I know they've shut down the Affiliate programs in every other state that's done this, except for New York (I think the others are North Carolina and Rhode Island).

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> My family in CO always described it a rather a cowboy state ("don't nobody tell _me_ what to do), but say that as of late the desperation to balance the budget is manic.

IMHO it's manic enough to shoot their own small business people (by squeezing services like Amazon in this kind of corner).

<comment><USER10> > _IMHO it's manic enough to shoot their own small business people (by > squeezing services like Amazon in this kind of corner)._

But if Amazon pulls out completely, then they don't get _anything_ while at the same time hurting their small business people. Where is the gain?

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> Didn't they do this, or threaten to do this, in North Carolina too?

<comment><USER12> If I recall correctly, New York was the first to do this. There have been other states to follow, including North Carolina. I believe California is also looking at this type of legislation.

<comment><USER8> And Rhode Island. New York is the only state where they haven't (yet) shut down their Associates program, perhaps because of the size of the media industry in the state, perhaps because it's such a big state.

With California looking to be next, we might see if the latter consideration is the dominant one.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> FYI - this is ALSO about to happen with California - there is still time to write local politicians here!

[http://www.theatlantic.com/personal/archive/2010/02/californ...](http://www.theatlantic.com/personal/archive/2010/02/california- faces-off-with-amazon/36325/)

</comment><comment><USER14> If this is hurting you, you should contact your representatives and complain. They generally do listen to their constituents.

On Thanksgiving day two years ago I got a call on my cell phone from my representative about the repeal effort for the recently passed "sales" tax on technology services in the state of Maryland. I had sent an email the evening before, and he asked for some more information and wanted to know if I was willing to allow him to use the information I had given in the repeal process. This was notable for several reasons, the speed of the response, the fact that he personally called on Thanksgiving day, and the fact that the tax was repealed through his efforts.

<comment><USER15> I couldn't agree more. Here are the two sponsors of the bill:

[http://www.state.co.us/gov_dir/leg_dir/House/members/Hou11.h...](http://www.state.co.us/gov_dir/leg_dir/House/members/Hou11.htm)

<http://www.senrollieheath.com/>

If you live in Colorado, contact them and let them know what you think.

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> Damn. That sucks.

This is like when the states do "insurance reform" -- and drive most insurers from doing business in the states. Colorado wants "online retail reform" so it kills all Amazon affiliate businesses based in Colorado.

What happens with insurance is that whoever is left has less competition and the rates go up. I imagine, extrapolating, that associates in states without these restrictions should stand to do very well in the future.

Was there any indication from Amazon beforehand that this was going to happen?

<comment><AUTHOR> Absolutely nothing - the e-mail hit my inbox at 1:08am this morning.

Seriously considering my options - it's interesting to note that the hundreds of Amazon affiliate links on my website are still working - I'm just not being credited for the sales, or compensated for the referrals.

I've been a huge fan of Amazon until today. It seems their strategy is to get Associates to pressure the CO legislature to change the law, but hitting Associates in the pocketbook isn't the best approach, IMO. If they would've said what they'd do if the legislation passed, we could've weighed in _before_ the law was passed.

<comment><USER17> I know absolutely nothing about the laws in CO but maybe there was some legal reason they couldn't come out and say that beforehand? Maybe it could have been taken as some form of blackmail, "If you sign this we'll do this really bad thing to you".

I have no stake either way in this but as an outside observer I think Amazon did the right thing. If more states try to make the internet money grab like CO did (as I know more than one state is doing, including my own) they'll see that instead of more "revenues" they'll just be hurting e-commerce in their state and making their constituents unhappy.

<comment><USER18> I suspect Amazon could've notified Associates ahead of time, but declined to do so in order to cause maximum damage to them, thus maximum outrage / political benefit for Amazon.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> This is the kind of thing I picture vividly when someone says a phrase like "cutthroat business practices."

<comment><USER20> This is the kind of thing I picture vividly when someone says a phrase like "you can't have your cake and eat it too".

Amazon brings enormous value to states like Colorado, but the politicians only see another slice of the economy that they want power over.

I'm glad a company is finally doing something to defend itself against this sort of thing. If Microsoft had defended itself over the monopoly charges, maybe they would be a little more innovative today. After all, they were punished for doing what has made Google so beloved: giving out something for free to drive sales to their main product.

<comment><USER10> > _Amazon brings enormous value to states like Colorado, but the politicians > only see another slice of the economy that they want power over._

More like "balance the budget" translates to "find more things to tax, rather than cutting spending on things we don't need" in politician-speak.</comment></comment></comment>


Show HN: A simple CLI tool to generate satellite images of a location - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/plant99/felicette <comment><USER2> This is neat!

I've built something similar, although my tool can pull its data from any service that supports tile indexing via the Web Mercator Transform (e.g. Google Maps, OSM, basically every online mapping service):

[https://github.com/doersino/aerialbot](https://github.com/doersino/aerialbot)

Its original purpose is the creation of Twitter bots like the ones liked below, but it works well for grabbing detailed satellite maps of arbitrary areas.

[https://twitter.com/placesfromorbit](https://twitter.com/placesfromorbit)

[https://twitter.com/americasquared](https://twitter.com/americasquared)

[https://twitter.com/baekmanpyeong](https://twitter.com/baekmanpyeong)

[https://twitter.com/nihonmusuukei](https://twitter.com/nihonmusuukei)

<comment><USER3> Love this, and the bots. I had one running myself for a while, but I missed the part that grabbed the satellite imagery, do I did that in bulk ahead and had a folder of them.

[https://twitter.com/FiveEarthColors](https://twitter.com/FiveEarthColors)

</comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> Felicette is a dead-simple CLI tool which searches, downloads, generates, and visualizes satellite imagery in the form of RGB jpegs, taking inputs in the form of location's name or coordinates. It also has options to visualize CIR vegetation data.

<comment> ur-whale Seems nice but sends you to dependency hell when you try to install on Ubuntu.

On 18.04, it can't find the correct openvc On 19.04, same things On 20.04, the repo doesn't include config for 20.04

Would love to try it, but ...

<comment><AUTHOR> Very weird, can you raise an issue with some logs, I'd love to take a look at them and see what went wrong. Thanks for looking into the tool.

<comment> ur-whale Wont have time to do this, nor do I have a github account anymore since that once welcoming place has been assimilated by the borg.

However, here's a hint: try to install a minimal ubuntu server on a VM and install/run your package.

You'll quickly discover the _real_ transitive dependency set of your software.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> Off-topic but slightly related, so I'll just post it here in comments.

I've recently discovered pretty cool telnet server. Map in telnet: _telnet mapscii.me_

<comment><USER5> That was super cool! They really get all the details.

At first I couldn't figure out how to zoom in. I pressed all they keys. Then I accidentally moved the mouse over the window and it zoomed in.

So my first thought was, "how the heck do they capture the mouse in the terminal!".

Then I exited out of it by killing telnet, and noticed that my terminal was still capturing my mouse input! Just moving the mouse over the terminal put ASCII codes on the command line.

What is this sorcery?

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> Felicette was the first cat launched into space on 18 October 1963 as part of the French Space Program

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F%C3%A9licette](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F%C3%A9licette)

Definition of felicette

[https://github.com/plant99/felicette](https://github.com/plant99/felicette)

<comment><USER7> That is included in the readme

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> Looks like a great tool, but its dependencies are sufficiently complex to warrant a Dockerfile. This way it would be very clear what the dependencies are independent of how the host system is configured.

<comment><USER9> I just pushed a Docker build here: [https://hub.docker.com/r/milhouse1337/felicette](https://hub.docker.com/r/milhouse1337/felicette)

You can use it like this:

      docker run -it -v "$PWD"/felicette-data:/root/felicette-data milhouse1337/felicette felicette -l "Montreal"

That's a very cool project to play with! Thank you @plant99 for this.

<comment><AUTHOR> Wow, that just makes it a lot simpler for people to test/use. Could you please share your GitHub username, so I can attribute with a link to the docker image in the README?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> [https://imgur.com/a/dKc2OlG](https://imgur.com/a/dKc2OlG) \- The example images for those who don't have want to download a 40mb image or don't use google drive

<comment><USER11> What are the two variations? One looks like a regular image, is the 2nd an IR band?

<comment><USER10> Yes, RGB and CIR. Btw, all the top nav links in the dochuddle site in your bio are broken and don't do anything.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> Looking at the code, it appears to be a nice front end to sat-search [https://github.com/sat-utils/sat-search](https://github.com/sat-utils/sat- search)

<comment><AUTHOR> Yes, it uses sat-utils to search STAC. It's a beautiful project.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> Where the data are coming from? Can't find a word about it in README.

<comment><AUTHOR> Oops, will add a section soon. But for now, it gets the data from a public Landsat 8 AWS storage.

[https://registry.opendata.aws/landsat-8/](https://registry.opendata.aws/landsat-8/)

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> Interesting.

Take quite some time to install. And some images are great like `felicette -l "New York" Some totally blank (real time and dark) felicette -l "Hong Kong" Some not sure as a bit random like those of Three Gorges Dam using ``` felicette -c 109.5568 31.0390 felicette -c 111.003761 30.823748 felicette -c 110.25 30.95 ``` One has coloured and the other not sure.

I guess this is part of being satellite images?

<comment><AUTHOR> Hmm. Weird, maybe faulty data for some row/path(s).

I'm checking on this, thanks for reporting this. Meanwhile, could you please raise this as an issue on the repository?

</comment></comment><comment><USER15> Here are some possibilities to add:

\- Allow farbfeld output (to stdout)

\- Allow specifying your own assignment of bands

\- Allow to skip the colour adjustment if you want to do that separately

\- Ensure it works correctly with a non-Unicode locale

<comment><AUTHOR> Right, thanks a lot for your suggestions.

Points 2, 3 are in the to-do list. Will definitely add 1, 4.

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> I'm used to writing latitude first when writing coordinates so I couldn't get the tool to find any images for a while. Other than that neat tool

<comment><AUTHOR> Oh yes haha, I feel you. I'm using some amazing libraries as dependencies, created by 'Mapbox'. Now you know why it's (lon, lat) ^^

And thanks for checking it out!

</comment></comment><comment><USER17> On a tangent, but any suggestions for a tool to stitch up drone aerial imagery and use it as a map?

Preferably on the phone/tablet.

<comment><USER18> [https://www.opendronemap.org/](https://www.opendronemap.org/)

Works quite well. Input images must have geo data in the exif metadata like longitude, latitude, FOV, camera pitch (most drones e.g. Autel and DJI drones will include this). You need to set it up on a server, then it's a web app which you could access from a phone/tablet but it involves uploading the images so it probably won't work well like that.

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> Sounds like the perfect tool for a spy/hacker/csi TV show.

</comment><comment><USER20> Hey the images turn out great. That's really cool!

<comment><AUTHOR> Thank you!

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> A couple of comments...

> TL;DR: Generate JPEG earth imagery from a location's name/coordinates

It _downloads_ imagery. At first I thought this was a project to simulate satellite imagery from OSM data or something.

> This tool is for a sentient being who wants to view high-res satellite > imagery of earth

Landsat is what 30 meters-per-pixel? That's not high-resolution.

<comment><AUTHOR> > It downloads imagery. At first I thought this was a project to simulate > satellite imagery from OSM data or something.

Will update the README, thanks for pointing it out.

> Landsat is what 30 meters-per-pixel? That's not high-resolution.

With the panchromatic band, we can get 15m resolution. But you're right with the fact that one can get images with better resolution on any commercial platforms.

But even OpenMapTiles renders at 15m, I feel. Still have to look into some docs though, I'm curious.

<comment><USER18> NAIP has 1 m/pixel imagery, only over US.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks, I'll look into it, and try integrating the data source with the tool.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> This is great, thanks for building this

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks for trying it out. ^^

</comment></comment><comment><USER23> is it live? Like can a get a pic of a place made at day light in the last 24 hours?

<comment><AUTHOR> Hi, not yet. It searches for all Landsat 8 images on AWS with lowest cloud cover.

But even at it's full potential, Landsat 8 gives a temporal resolution of 14 days for a location, iirc.

<comment><USER24> For a little more effort you could "interleave" the Sentinel 2 images as well, which are of a similar resolution and also have a simple access API.

<comment><AUTHOR> Oh yes, there are plans to integrate Sentinel images as well, but the data fetch layer has to be worked on to handle auth/AWS config to fetch data from buckets.

So released with Landsat 8 first, and I think sentinel 2 has better resolution, up to 10m, if I am not wrong. So it'd be a lot better if Sentinel 2 integration were in-place.

<comment><USER24> There's also this, if you are interested in downloading timeseries as a whole: [https://github.com/cmla/tsd](https://github.com/cmla/tsd)

It supports sentinel 1/2/5p, landsat 8 and a few other satellites if you have the required API access identifiers. The idea is to fetch data not from buckets but from the actual sources, so the underlying philosophy is a bit different.

<comment><AUTHOR> This is a gold mine, thanks for sharing!

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> Are there any example images?

<comment><AUTHOR> [https://github.com/plant99/felicette/wiki/Sample-images- gene...](https://github.com/plant99/felicette/wiki/Sample-images-generated-by- felicette)</comment></comment>


Why Dropbox Is A Major Disruption - <AUTHOR> http://abovethecrowd.com/2012/02/23/why-dropbox-is-a-major-disruption/

<comment><USER2> This gets close to the mark. But I feel like chiming in with my two cents on why I drop $10/mo on Dropbox.

It changed the way I work with files. And it's all the client.

Before Dropbox my options for sharing a file with someone were all cumbersome:

\- CD/DVD/Hard Drive/USB Stick. Unless they're not within 10 miles of me, then it's a total non starter.

\- Email it. Except if it was too large, it would cause a litany of problems with mail servers.

\- Toss is up on an FTP. Clunky. FTP is an awful protocol.

\- Any of a dozen file sharing websites that I've never particularity trusted, and some of which require the person receiving the file to follow some directions or have an account. No. Just no. The portals for uploading are clunky.

Then Dropbox happened.

\- Public folders? Genius. Doesn't change my workflow at all, just slap it in to the folder and copy a link that I can share with anyone. No accounts required on the other end.

\- Shared folders? Changed how I work forever. Not only do I get an affiliate bump every time I get someone on the plan, but then it makes the process for THEM sending ME a file brain dead simple. I have the luxury of having access to an FTP account and knowing how to use it. Some of my clients and friends do not. Nor do I expect them to, or even want them to. FTP sucks.

Just today I went over five iterations of a design in real time with a friend, and all he had to do was stick a JPG in a folder. He didn't even have to tell me, I got a notification and everything. Awesome!

\- Photos folder? Now I can just drop pics from my SD card and shoot an email to Mom. No clunky website, uploading, naming, organizing, configuring, and then finally sending. Just photos, copy to Dropbox folder, send her a link, done. Moms happy. I'm happy.

Do you notice a theme between those three things? They all get the hell out of my way. Every other offering on the planet wants to ask me things and do things and make the cloud storage process cumbersome and heavy. Dropbox, I move files in to a folder and it takes care of shit. It allows anyone -- regardless of experience level -- to leverage the power of a basic version control and synchronization system without lifting a finger.

THAT is the secret. Not that it's cloud. Not that it's hip. Not right place or time. Not hardware/software disassociation philosophic nonsense. It works. And it doesn't get in your way to get that work done. I don't even have any USB sticks anymore, and I don't care. Why go to the trouble of plugging in a device when I could just copy it to a folder?

<comment><USER3> If you considered using FTP to share files, why didn't you consider HTTP?

No one can argue against that it's extremely well supported on the client-side and pushing files to a server (with ssh for example) or hosting a small http- server locally (twistd for example) is usually no big problem.

<comment><USER4> > And it's all the client.

I believe the "client" in this case was "customer". Getting somebody to right click on a folder and selecting 'share in dropbox' is the easiest thing that I can ask of somebody. All files within that folder will be visible to me, even if they make changes.

Another key thing with dropbox is that it made sharing files easier by allowing you to share folders. I, for one, going through the attach -> browse -> open dialogue for each photo I wanted to show to somebody.

<comment><USER2> No, I truly believe it's the client. The phone app. The desktop app. It's the lynchpin that makes all this stuff a breeze. I don't have to tell it anything. Put photos in the photos folder and they become a photo gallery. Share a folder and it's just shared. And I can invite as many people as I want. Or kick them out. Or remove myself from a folder someone shared with ME. Or shut down the whole folder if I own it. Put something in Public and right click for a link. Immediate, no questions asked, effortless workflow.

If I had to change anything I was already doing to use Dropbox, I wouldn't have even given it a first thought, let alone a second thought, least of all my $10. And in your example it is the "client" that makes it so easy for the "customer" to get them to share files with you.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> > _Once you begin using Dropbox, you become more and more indifferent to the > hardware you are using, as well as the operating system on that device._ > Dropbox commoditizes your devices and their OS, by being your "state" system > in the sky.

I strongly disagree with this. Dropbox is great, but it only affects a subset of my experience on any given hardware/software platform. Dropbox cannot change the aesthetic of Android in a way that would make me chose it over iOS. Likewise for OS X and Windows. Dropbox cannot change a cheap, plastic Acer laptop in to a unibody MacBook Air. If you care about these things, the statement above is proven false for your use case.

"State" is plumbing; Dropbox is plumbing. It's damn good plumbing, but it's plumbing none the less.

I think maybe the author is struggling with how to frame the disruption. I know I am. To say that Dropbox is damn good plumbing is not an admonishment. I don't want to live without damn good plumbing.

The best technology is transparent -- no, invisible. I use 1Password. I have two laptops, an iPad, and an iPhone. I don't have to think about syncing passwords between these devices. It "just happens". I don't see Dropbox working in the background with 1Password to sync my passwords, but I know it's responsible. Here's the rub:

 _Apple isn't the facilitator of this magic, and that is the disruption._

What do we call this though? It's not the OS. It's not the hardware. It's something new. Some call it the "platform", but what is that? Everything is a platform.

Apple created iCloud as a "platform". iCloud provides the plumbing for my contacts, calendars, apps, music, etc. Everyone expects them to expand this to include third-party services. Google has Gmail. Windows has (had) Live. The trouble for Dropbox is that Apple/Google/Microsoft hold the keys to the user's data. These three players have to individually agree to allow Dropbox in to their ecosystem, and they all know that this act would commoditize their platform. I think Dropbox is going to have a really tough time making inroads there. I don't see any of these vendors making the "cloud platform" interchangeable on their respective devices/OS.

<comment><USER6> I believe you may have take the quoted out of context. I interpreted that sentence to say that, Dropbox allows the state system to behave the same regardless of the commodity used to interact with it. I do not believe the discussion was about how you interact with the file but how you interact with the storage of the file. I do think that that concept is not quite as disruptive for the industry as is implied though.

Also, could you call the "magic" a harbor? Harbor's allow anything to dock and trade regardless of their size, shape, or origin. Only half joking.

You are dead on about the barriers of entry though. There are goliath industries out there that will defend there profits to the death, rather than pivot or expand. Not so much the big 3 in my mind, but all of the supporting companies and service providers.

<comment><USER5> I feel pretty confident that the context all supports the point he's making. The lead in is about how wonderfully Dropbox has executed; and they have. Then he states the core point twice linking terms like "indifferent" with "hardware" and "operating system". The point is so central to the piece that he underlined it. Then stated explicitly that it "commoditizes your devices and OS". Then, in the last paragraph uses the term "cross-platform".

The author really does believe that "state" is where Dropbox is headed, but I believe there are significant barriers there. Short of an anti-trust suit, I don't see that barrier coming down, which is going to be a significant impediment to Dropbox's ability to offer a "cross-platform" solution.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> TL;DR version: Drop box disassociates state from the machine, this means you don't care about the hardware and it can be commoditized. (more)

I suppose they weren't around for diskless workstations. But diskless workstations weren't around for 3G and now 4G/LTE network access.

Its an interesting trend, but as anyone who has tried to use their android phone to navigate when there is no network service, well they just can't. The network may not really be the computer (old Sun joke) but you can make it uncomfortably necessary.

You also put more of your productivity into the hands of the network provider, and that is never good. Sure when the network is pervasive and can't be monopolized by a single provider it will be a huge disruption, until then its like walking by a sleeping lion carrying uncooked steak.

<comment><USER8> Dropbox stores a local mirror of your account on every device connected to it. If you lose network connectivity you just run off of your local mirror and sync changes when you reconnect.

<comment><USER9> Thats certainly not how it works on mobile phones.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> The elephant in the room is that this is exactly what Apple is doing with iCloud and Google is moving toward with the fabled gDrive.

Dropbox is never going to have the integration that these two companies can offer on their OS's.

Sure, I can get to my Dropbox files on my iPhone, and I can even use it to sync in some programs, but it's not even close to the synchronization that iCloud offers.

</comment><comment><USER11> I liked Dropbox until it deleted my files. Then I dropped it instantly.

I was on Ubuntu, using their Dropbox client. I had some files that were already synced, but that I wanted to exclude from being synced (they were huge files, taking up precious space). I added an exclusion rule using their client, and poof, not only were my files gone from Dropbox, they were gone from my filesystem!

I liked Dropbox. I still do, but I won't use it. You can't make mistakes like that and expect trust in return.

</comment><comment><USER12> Here's my wishlist for Dropbox:

\- Have a per-folder P2P option (maybe buy AeroFS to achieve this?) I really don't need an Amazon server to host my personal photos/videos, and they take up a lot of space. But I would like them on each of my family's computers.

\- Increase quota continuously (like google does with gmail). They could do it slowly enough that people would still be incentivized to do all the things the do now to get more space.

</comment><comment><USER13> So the theory is that this is the web-based OS, that Java and Netscape et al. threatened MS with. The key isn't technical in itself (the cloud), but marketing ( _whose_ cloud).

My own theory was that dropbox must be secretly headed towards a general cloud solution to justify those valuations. But this story puts it into perspective: dropbox is a competitor to MS and Apple.

</comment><comment><USER14> [..]Anyone that had used previous file synchronization programs, including Apple's own iDisk, constantly encountered state problems. Modifications in one location would get out of synch with those in another, ruining the entire premise of seamless synchronization. It wasn't that these other companies did not understand the problem, it was just that they could not execute on the solution. The Dropbox team solved this, which was a critical innovation.[..]

Not true. They solved nothing, they copied existing solutions, and hide the problems. If there is some conflicting file, the just rename them to "$FILENAME (Conflict Copy from $MACHINE $DATE)" and then...do nothing!

I was really shocked when i discovered that my systems had hundreds of those conflicts, and i did never became a message about them from dropbox.

</comment><comment><USER15> Dropbox is an awesome innovation, but IMHO it's a commodity. I don't see any material network effects or major barriers to entry. In that way I think it's very similar to Groupon and I think both will suffer at scale over the years.

Long bet anyone? ;)

</comment><comment><USER16> I have to believe that Dropbox is the company that will ultimately solve the television problem. A major problem with TV is that there does not exist a solution to buy once and watch anywhere. When I am one day able to buy the Walking Dead from the Dropbox market and play it from my Dropbox equipped TV, phone, tablet, laptop, desktop, and in the browser on devices I don't own, I will gladly be shelling over what I currently pay for cable to Drew Houston and Co.

<comment><USER17> Drew, listen this guy...This would be a very welcomed pivot to TV. The only reason that I still use USB sticks is my TV.

</comment></comment><comment><USER18> To my surprise an increasing number of non-tech people are using dropbox, those who I never would have imagined using something like dropbox.

The only reason keeping my away from premium subscription is that some other companies offer far cheaper solution for offsite data backup.

</comment><comment><USER19> I'd love to use it but I need 1 TB for $10. When that happens I'll be a regular user.

<comment><USER20> Google offers 1 TB, at $256 per year

      http://www.google.com/accounts/PurchaseStorage

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Then why is Dropbox still a lame excuse of a remote backup system?

Seriously, if you think this is "a major disruption" (gosh, I hate that word), give us the functionality and services to make up on that promise.

<comment><USER21> I guess it depends on how you use it. On my laptop I store 100% of my files in the Dropbox folder not only does it make it so I always have everything that I worked on while I was on the road it also protects me from loosing files if my laptop were to get stolen. I can reinstall my operating system or switch to a new laptop without any backing up etc..

<comment><USER22> You could just use a service that works with your filesystem, like SugarSync.</comment></comment></comment>


Design and Implementation of Probabilistic Programming Languages - <AUTHOR> http://dippl.org/ <comment><AUTHOR> Is anyone here knowledgeable enough about all the Probabilistic Programming languages and frameworks to give me a 'real world' run down? Like there's quite a few of them and I'm not sure how they all perform IRL. I'm somewhat familiar with PyMC, Stan, Figaro but I'm still not quite understanding all the differences (are there any major ones even?)?

I know that Stan is like the most production ready one right now but it's also somewhat large. This project seems much more tractable.

There's a whole list here [http://probabilistic- programming.org/wiki/Home](http://probabilistic-programming.org/wiki/Home) and I'm not sure which ones are like "real projects" that can be used in production and which ones are like toy/research projects and I'm not sure if they all interpret the idea of probabilistic programming fundamentally differently or if they are all just flavors.

<comment><USER2> It depends on what you are looking for in a probabilistic programming system. If you want something that is more of a library than a language you gain the advantages of being integrated into a mainstream language. This would point to systems like Figaro, PyMC, Edward and Anglican. If you don't mind a standalone language you can choose systems like WebPPL, Hakaru, Stan, or Venture. There are tradeoffs in expressivity as well. There are probabilistic models you can express in WebPPL or Anglican that you can't in Stan. Also different systems support different inference algorithms. So if you want to do something like Latent Dirichlet Allocation, I think JAGS still does better than Stan using a naive implementation. At the current time, to use these systems productively, you should have some idea of what model you want to write and given your data what inference methods you expect to work with that model.

I think Figaro, Stan and PyMC are the most "production-ready" in the sense they have been used for projects outside the realms of their creators. Still I would argue on some level all of them are research projects that aim to explore how to make probabilistic modeling more accessible to people. Ideas in one language often will appear in another down the line. So I encourage to explore a few of them and reach out to the people working on them.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks for the answer.I think that you might have some answers for questions I'm trying to answer. Do you think that we could chat about this over email? My email is <username>@gmail.com.

<comment><USER2> Sure. I will also continue to answer any questions others have about these systems on this thread.

<comment><USER3> What work has been done in optimizing code / sampling?

My understanding is that if I write e.g. an HMM in any of these languages, the resulting code will be suboptimal in performance and accuracy vs e.g. Viterbi.

<comment><USER2> So there has been work done in compiling probabilistic programs directly into C or C++ [1]. Your intuition is correct that in many of these languages if you wrote an HMM and did MAP inference over it you wouldn't recover the Viterbi algorithm, but there is some code in WebPPL[2] that handles this case as outlined in [https://arxiv.org/abs/1206.3555](https://arxiv.org/abs/1206.3555).

[1] [https://web.stanford.edu/~ngoodman/papers/aistats2014-shred....](https://web.stanford.edu/~ngoodman/papers/aistats2014-shred.pdf)

[2] [http://docs.webppl.org/en/master/inference/methods.html#enum...](http://docs.webppl.org/en/master/inference/methods.html#enumeration)</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Major banks hit with biggest cyberattacks in history - <AUTHOR> http://money.cnn.com/2012/09/27/technology/bank-cyberattacks/

<comment><USER2> This is not remotely as dangerous as e.g. the cyberattacks on Google [1], the cyberattacks on RSA Labs (and Lockheed) [2], or the cyberattack on Iran's centrifuges (allegedly; [3]) - it's just Yet Another DDoS. The chief national- security danger is that some bank will pay up and that this money will be used for evil.

Given those facts, "biggest cyberattack in history" is rather overblown. (It _may_ be the biggest DDoS in history, but DDoS just aren't that dangerous.)

[1] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Aurora>

[2] [http://www.scmagazine.com/rsa-confirms-lockheed-hack- linked-...](http://www.scmagazine.com/rsa-confirms-lockheed-hack-linked-to- securid-breach/article/204744/)

[3] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuxnet>

<comment><USER3> Attacking data access is just as serious as attacking data confidentially or attacking data integrity. They all deserve equal consideration regarding data security.

EDIT: In this case the websites targeted aren't high-value or critical, however the value of data access shouldn't be downplayed.

<comment><USER4> No, it is not. It is not the same to prevent you from accessing your information (however high-value or critical it might be) than having the very same information being actively used against you in unforeseeable ways.

Besides, this statement runs against the core principles of Risk Management, which recognizes the need to prioritize the use of scarce resources to protect the most salient risk according to a utility function that combines but the likeliness and the adverse consequences of each potential incident.

<comment><USER5> Not necessarily - There are many times integrity and access are far more important than confidentiality - control systems for example. For sensor streams, availability may even be more important than integrity. There are already algorithms in place in control systems to deal with bad or weird data from those sensors because sensors go funky all the time. having the tampered data is still a form of information that _the sensor is still there_ , a surprisingly useful bit of data itself.

There is a lot of research in control system security about balancing extremely high availability requirements against bad data and commands coming in -- trying to answer the question "how do we run compromised" because sometimes you have to, at least for a limited time, to prevent bigger systemic damage.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Sigh. Never waist a good crisis eh? "Sen. Joe Lieberman said that he believed the attacks were launched by Iran".

<comment><USER7> Which I find to be bizarre. There is very little reason in doing these sorts of attacks _unless_ you plan on taking credit for it. You can't say "maybe it's a test run" because this potentially gives enough warning to your targets to bolster their defenses.

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> >No data was stolen from the banks, and their transactional systems -- like their ATM networks -- remained unaffected. The aim of the attacks was simply to temporarily knock down the banks' public-facing websites.

</comment><comment><USER9> It doesn't take a 'state actor' to launch a DDoS attack. Money buys a botnet. CloudFlare CEO Matthew Prince was on Bloomberg TV the other day discussing these recent attacks: [http://www.bloomberg.com/video/wells-fargo-is-latest- bank-hi...](http://www.bloomberg.com/video/wells-fargo-is-latest-bank-hit-by- cyber-attacks-2iNWFDdAT2iBdsGmQPxzoQ.html)

</comment><comment><USER10> Cyberattacks? What? No! The digital equivalent of a sit-in!

</comment><comment><USER11> For the sake of our heart rates, you might point out that it was a DOS attack, next time. ;)

</comment><comment><USER12> Why does the article have in large letters "How hackers can access your credit card" with a video, when that has nothing to do with this attack?</comment>


MuleSoft files for IPO - <AUTHOR> https://www.axios.com/mulesoft-files-for-ipo-2266292276.html <comment><USER2> Let's hope they can be profitable and not be like twitter.

From the article:

"MuleSoft reports a $50 million net loss on $188 million in revenue for 2016, compared to a $65 million net loss on $110 million in 2015 revenue. It raised over $250 million in total venture capital funding, from firms like Lightspeed Venture Partners, Hummer Winblad, NEA, Sapphire Ventures, Bay Partners, Morgenthaler, Meritech Capital and Salesforce Ventures."

Growth at the expense of revenue can work I'm not saying that it doesn't, but, now the IPO provides VCs a way to exit, thereby leaving a company that hasn't made any money and retail investors, as chumps, to buy up the shares.</comment>


Collection of Papers on Database Management Systems - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/jarulraj/databaseology <comment><USER2> Also _The Red Book_ , [http://www.redbook.io/](http://www.redbook.io/)

<comment><AUTHOR> Awesome, thanks for the link.</comment></comment>


Firefox 3.5 is "location-aware" - <AUTHOR> http://en-us.www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/geolocation/

<comment><USER2> How the hell does it know my nearby access points? I'm running it on Ubuntu. Sure, it's possible, but how does it have access to this information? Does it contain code to access every wifi-manager API in existence?

<comment><USER3> Yeah, I was blown away by this as well. I'm guessing the ip address is enough. Google Chrome pinpointed my location down to the apartment block. Kind of scary, actually.

<comment><USER4> That's not the whole story. I'm based in Copenhagen but for some reason my IP belongs to a Swedish batch, so I'm constantly being served Swedish ads instead of Danish ones. This service got my location right to within 100 meters. Also, I have a 3G wireless connection that plugs into my laptop, so that I can take it anywhere. There's noway that an IP address can convey my exact location.

<comment><USER5> Same thing with me. I'm in Amsterdam, and whenever I turn AdBlock off to experience the web it its full glory (rarely), all the IP-based targeted ads think I'm in weird places (generally still in Holland, occasionally in Germany).

The center of the circle on the map was about 4 meters to the left of _where I am sitting on the couch_ , and the circle encompasses my block and nothing more.

Amazing.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Is there a way for it not to guess my position? I happen to have a desktop computer that´s very hard to move.

<comment><USER7> How do I turn off Location-Aware Browsing permanently?

Location-Aware Browsing is always opt-in in Firefox 3.5. No location information is ever sent without your permission. If you wish to disable the feature completely, please follow this set of steps:

        * In the URL bar, type about:config
        * Type geo.enabled
        * Double click on the geo.enabled preference
        * Location-Aware Browsing is now disabled

<comment><USER8> To select on a site-by-site basis: select Tools>Page info>Permissions.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> The feature "display my position" is available in Google Maps. It is not when I use Safari 4.0.

</comment><comment><USER9> Is anyone else getting funky results with this? It always returns 40.75, -73.997 (New York City) as my location, but I'm in Toronto.

<comment><USER10> I always get incorrect results for anything that uses the location feature in Firefox 3.5. This time it put me in Chicago, but I've been put in NYC and San Francisco before as well. I'm NEVER in the correct location (Pittsburgh). I'm running Ubuntu for what it's worth. You would think that it would do a reverse DNS on the IP at least to make sure it gets the city correct...

<comment><USER11> What network are you on, if your access is via a corporate net then perhaps your connection is being tunneled to another location first; or maybe it's picking up a proxy server address?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> Any resources on how to leverage this? Their FAQ offers no info for developers.

<comment><USER13> Code from Google: [http://googlecode.blogspot.com/2009/04/google-location- servi...](http://googlecode.blogspot.com/2009/04/google-location-services-now- in-mozilla.html)</comment></comment>