Ask HN: What under $100 item would you recommend everyone buy? - <AUTHOR> <comment><USER5> An ebook reader. Both the cheapest version of the Kobo and the Kindle cost around USD60-70.

I've gone from reading ~10 books per year to reading ~80 books per year, just because I always carry that thing with me since it's so small and light.

I also save a ton of money since printed books are so expensive in Australia, and out-of-copyright books are free.

The formatting of technical non-fiction books for e-readers has come a long way, too.

<comment><USER6> You got my attention.

Which reader do you recommend?

<comment><USER5> I have a third-generation Kindle 3G (edit: [2]), and I'm happy with it - <USER2> I never used a cover I got a few broken "pixels" on the display, but these are not very annoying, they look more like ink smudges. I'll probably get the new Paperwhite next (and definitely with a cover!).

For software I use Calibre, I have never used Amazon's own thing. If I buy from Amazon I use the USB cable and Calibre to transfer it, the WLAN/whispernet is always off. That way battery lasts for about a month and I don't get any "unexpected surprises" from Amazon [1]

I have held the Kobo in store and it's pretty much identical in terms of dimensions/clarity/weight. Not sure about the rest.

[1] Like this one: [http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/18/technology/companies/18ama...](http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/18/technology/companies/18amazon.html)

[2] Here's one on ebay: [http://www.ebay.com/itm/Amazon-Kindle-3rd-Generation- WI-FI-w...](http://www.ebay.com/itm/Amazon-Kindle-3rd-Generation-WI-FI-with- Keyboard-and-Leather-Case-/281292469021)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> A slidebelt ($28). I recently bought one and it's superior to any belt I've ever owned. It instantly tightens if I want to run, and with only slightly less effort loosens. It's exactly the right tightness, no holes. If you're losing weight and the belt is sticking out too far, just take it out of the buckle, cut, replace it within the buckle. And since the makers don't have to worry about variable belt lengths, they can make it up for it by offering a variety of buckle designs and belt colors.

It is Correctly Designed and a joy to use.

[http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-SlideBelts-Mens-Genuine- Lea...](http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-SlideBelts-Mens-Genuine-Leather- Adjustable-Ratchet-Belt-without- Holes-/191039554947?pt=US_CSA_MWA_Belts&var=&hash=item2c7ad84583)

<comment><USER8> This type of belt is really popular almost the standard in Asia.

<comment><USER9> I'm Indian, and surprised that this the top suggestion. Slide belts are ubiquitous here.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> If you cook at all: Infrared thermometer.

How hot is that pan? Is my oven thermometer accurate? I'm proofing yeast, is this water too warm? How cold is my freezer? Is my smoker ready? Is that caramel done?

I got a cheap $15 one and I use it nearly every day.

<comment><USER11> I get how this could be useful for things, like checking the inside of a steak.

But my only concern is that I've cooked my whole life without worrying about temperature. I have now learned how something "cooked" looks, and how long it should take. So if I were to get a temperature reading I'd have no knowledge of what the correct result should be.

I guess what I'm saying is that it seems like I'd need to retrain my whole cooking experience, which doesn't seem like it would be worth it.

<comment><USER10> Checking a steak (or most foods) for doneness is something it _can 't_ do, though--it can't see inside food. (You could get an "instant read" probe thermometer, like the Thermapen, but I did not recommend this because I don't use it that often for exactly the reason you mention: I usually have a good intuition if something is done or not already.)

Some more examples: If you want to make sure the oil for frying the chicken is at the right temperature, which is something you may already do with a conventional thermometer, this will make that faster and easier.

Wine experts (of which I am NOT one) have a whole "optimum serving temperature" list. The infrared thermometer is an easy way to check that. Beer, too. [http://www.bettertastingwine.com/temperature.html](http://www.bettertastingwine.com/temperature.html)

I mentioned checking your oven thermometer (which are notoriously poorly calibrated), but another use is finding hot/cold spots in your oven.

I don't do anything with chocolate, but if I did, I'd check the temperature with this.

When I make coffee or tea, I bring water to boiling... but then you're supposed to let it cool a bit, somewhere in the 180-200 degree range.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> For men: A beard trimmer is one of my favorite cheap buys. Never shave again: [http://www.amazon.com/Remington-MB4040-Lithium- Rechargeable-...](http://www.amazon.com/Remington-MB4040-Lithium-Rechargeable- Mustache/dp/B005PUZZR8/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1395896179&sr=8-3&keywords=beard+trimmer)

Beyond that, I'd say the aeropress coffee maker: [http://www.amazon.com/Aerobie-AeroPress-Coffee-Espresso- Make...](http://www.amazon.com/Aerobie-AeroPress-Coffee-Espresso- Maker/dp/B0047BIWSK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1395896241&sr=8-1&keywords=aero+press)

<comment><USER11> The aoropress is great, but I do find the price of the paper pretty annoying.

I've now switched to one of the many metal-filters, which makes me happier.

<comment><USER13> The official filters are $2.99 for 350 on Amazon, so 0.85 cents per filter (for up to 4 cups). $2.99 for a year's supply seems pretty reasonable to me.

<comment><USER11> Your volume is off a fair bit for us. Assuming you don't reuse them my wife and I will make 8-12 cups a day, which means 350 will last for around 35 days. Or basically a month.

Additionally the filters cost £3.99 as "add ons" at Amazon.co.uk, or £6.99 when purchased alone.

So trade-off is clear one metal filter costs the same as two packets of papers.

(Yeah, tried to persuade my wife to recycle, but she preferred the simplicity of pushing out the puck into the bin, so that was a losing battle.)

<comment><USER14> I love my Aeropress, but I keep myself to two cups a day and my wife doesn't drink coffee. Sounds like you guys would be better off with something that made a "pot". Like a large Chemex or something.

<comment><USER11> In terms of volume, yeah. But the per-cup brewing being so fast and easy actually works really well for us. (Large pots tend to get burnt..)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> A fountain pen.

I grew up using pencils and ballpoint pens. I swore off fountain pens after some frustrating, messy experiences. In hindsight, I think I still lacked the fine motor skills necessary to get the best out of a fountain pen.

I took an interest again when I started working on a website selling fancy $2000 models, but the one I bought was less then $10. In my downtime I retrained my hand, and learned traditional copperplate-style handwriting.

Now, the simple act of signing my name is a completely different experience -- it feels like an act of craftsmanship.

But do buy a CHEAP one first. If you're used to writing with a ballpoint you'll be putting far too much pressure on the paper, and you'll probably ruin a nib or two before you get used to it.

<comment><USER16> I wrote with a fountain pen throughout secondary school and wouldn't mind giving them another try. Do you find that for quick note taking the ink dries fast enough?

<comment><USER17> I recommend the Pilot Varsity. They are disposable fountain pens, with one of the best nibs on the market, even when compared to many other sub $100 refillable pens. Good enough that a lot of folks have modded them to become refillable.

They do lay down a lot of ink, though, which will bleed through thin paper. However, with a decent notebook, you won't have any issues. Moleskine, unfortunately, is not a decent notebook in this regard.

Bic has just started to release disposable fountain pens as well, and while the nib isn't as good as the Varsity, it's better than my $60 Schrade fountain pen's nib. It doesn't lay down as much ink as the Varsity.

I have had some issues with drying times, but the ink is typically dry within a minute for my thickest ink blots.

In short, there are some good quality, cheap and disposable fountain pens on the market right now.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> In the Summer of 2011, I was working at Mozilla. My first exposure to an open plan office. I decided (for a poor student) to spend an insane amount of money on a pair of headphones so that I could get more productive: The Shure SE 215 in ear phones for $99. Since then, I have used them everyday. Backpacked across 3 continents. Taken them to the gym. Used them like crap. Yet, they still lasted. I went through 4 different phones in the mean time. Finally, yesterday I broke down and bought new replacement cables; the cable had started fraying from within.

Now, I work for a company which has a lot of music buffs. So I may actually upgrade to something that is a whole new level in music quality. But a part of me will really really cherish these earphones.

(P.S: I don't work for Shure. The only damn product that I have ever written a review for Shure. :|)

<comment><USER17> I can't rave about my Shure 535 IEMs enough. I'm even about to spend the $2-300 to get custom molded fittings for them Near-reference quality sound (a little too warm, though it hasn't been an issue so far), great isolation (about 25db), and they are hard to have randomly pulled out of your ears.

Granted, this is well out of the $100 ballpark, but they're still fantastic.

If you're looking for reference quality sound at under $100, look into the Etymotic in-ear headphones. Ridiculously good, though they are a bit weak on the low end of the spectrum (not enough that you won't feel bass on real punchy songs, but enough that they don't sound like any other headphone on the market).

<comment><USER18> So I am really tempted to get the SE 535s (because they seem like the next level up from the 215s which also fit me really well). The only thing that is stopping me is that the idea/hope that the Westones would be better. Did you do any sort of comparison between the two?

<comment><USER17> No, when I purchased my 535's from Headroom, they didn't have any Westone in stock (that I recall, it was several months ago). I tried out similarly priced Sennheiser in-ear headphones (ie80 and ie800) as well as another higher priced JH Audio IEM model (JH13, iirc), but the 535's sounded the best to my ears.

I do see that the Westone's offer 4 drivers to the 535's two drivers, but unfortunately Headroom doesn't have the frequency response graphs for them yet. Otherwise, they seem very similar for features & specs (they both appear to use the same ear tips, which is good for finding the one that fits the best).

Of course, I'm lucky enough to live in Headroom's home town, so that helps these kinds of purchases immensely.

<comment><USER19> The 535s have three drivers, and Shure now has the SE846 if you're interested in quad drivers. But I'll caution that triple and quad drivers don't necessarily make for better sound.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> Good Kitchen Knives

Ideally, a whole block of them, but all you really need is one, and that'll run you less than $100.

No more laboriously sawing through an onion with that flimsy dull serrated piece of worthlessness. A good sharp knife should glide right through anything you care to stick between it and the board. Onions, tomatoes (without squishing), probably even your thumb a few times until you learn how to use it right.

Zwilling J.A. Henckels are my choice. Not overly expensive. Overly good at chopping things in half. Sorted.

<comment><USER18> +1

I would also add some personal opinion and say that all you need is a paring knife and chef's knife. Maybe a sharpening block. And Zwilling is my choice too.

<comment><USER21> along the same lines: one of those diamond sharpening rods. $15 at walmart, 5 strokes on each side before every use, and you've got a 9 inch scalpel that you'll never have to take a real whetstone to. Also, the knife doesn't have to be great, just not junk. I'm using the best knife I could find at the the local dollar store(like $30 marked down to $6), which is great, but my $20 for the entire block ones from walley world just refuse to take a decent edge. Look for a rigid, tapred blade(this ought to be tempered steel), as opposed to a flexible uniform thickness one(junk sheet metal).

[http://www.walmart.com/ip/Smith-s-Interrupted-Surface- Diamon...](http://www.walmart.com/ip/Smith-s-Interrupted-Surface-Diamond- Sharpening-Steel/9224932)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> Raspberry Pi - seriously fun gadget with a ton of potential. Hacking on one gives me the same kind of joy I had hacking on QBASIC programs as a kid.

</comment><comment><USER23> A midi keyboard. If you already have a computer, then adding some free software and a midi controller gives you endless possibilities for exploring music creation.

A tournament chess set (vinyl board, plastic weighted pieces). Chess is an amazing game and a portable set will let you play more often and with more people.

</comment><comment><USER24> I know it says "everyone", but for any male: a top quality shaving cream to try for while. I used to think Edge, Barbasol, etc was good enough and the boutique ones were for snobs and no difference. Then I tried a few. Like night and day difference in closeness and after shaving comfort. You will not go back.

Not even that expensive considering you can use less per shave because of the quality. The two best I have ever used are both fairly affordable and don't even need a bowl/brush:

men-u Shaving Cream: [http://www.men-uusa.com/men- ushavingcream33oz.aspx](http://www.men-uusa.com/men-ushavingcream33oz.aspx)

Kiehl's Ultimate Brushless Shave Cream: [http://www.kiehls.com/on/demandware.store/Sites-kiehls_us- Si...](http://www.kiehls.com/on/demandware.store/Sites-kiehls_us- Site/default/Product-Show?pid=236&bookmark=384890)

<comment><USER17> When you're ready to go the next step, a safety razor will go a long ways towards a better, less irritating shave as well. 6¢ blades mean you're not as inclined to use them past getting dull, less plastic waste, and a stupidly close shave.

<comment><USER25> Also feels awesome to shave with a solid piece of steel rather than some 9-bladed rubber-gripped FlexxxoBlade9000.

1936 Gillette DE FTW.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> Found this compilation of links on Reddit, there are actually some good suggestions inbetween the joke suggestions

[http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/10yu3d/what_100_i...](http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/10yu3d/what_100_item_has_the_single_greatest_ability_to/c6hyr1q)

</comment><comment><USER27> 2 tech things if you don't have them: \- An external 24" monitor if you don't have one \- An SSD for your workstation

The improvement in productivity is well worth the $100.

<comment><USER28> Any recommendations monitor-wise?

<comment><USER29> Just bought this HP 27" 2560x1440 IPS LED one for $450, and it's changed my life! It has much higher contrast than my last monitor, as well as every other monitor I've seen. Note they also have it used for $350.

[http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/828572-REG/HP_Hewlett_...](http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/828572-REG/HP_Hewlett_Packard_XW476A8_ABA_ZR2740W_27inch_LED_Backlit.html)

<comment><USER30> With that resolution have you had any problems with text being too small and with adjusting DPI settings?

<comment><USER29> Yes, I hooked it up to my Win7 gaming rig, and had to turn interface scaling to 125% and zoom in on most web pages. It works well, and font rendering is drastically improved.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER31> At least once in your life take the $100 and break it into 5 $20. Then find someone who you appreciate (Police, Fireman, EMT, Preacher, Teacher, etc.) Walk up and give them the $20 and say something simple like "Thanks for what you do, let me buy you lunch". It's an awesome experience to see someone receive unsolicited gratitude.

<comment><USER32> ...or don't break it and use "as is" for someone you appreciate.

</comment></comment><comment><USER33> A Fitbit Flex. I was a bit overweight when I got mine, and it got me within the normal BMI range within 3 months. It's a very simple product (essentially just a Bluetooth enabled pedometer) but the lifestyle improvements (if you are motivated by the goals) are massive.

<comment><USER30> I like the idea but I'd want one that keeps the data locally. Is there such thing?

<comment><USER5> Premium membership with Fitbit ($60/year) allows for export of the data [http://www.fitbit.com/premium/export](http://www.fitbit.com/premium/export)

Withings Pulse has a data export function too: [https://withings.zendesk.com/hc/en- us/articles/201488977-How...](https://withings.zendesk.com/hc/en- us/articles/201488977-How-do-I-export-share-my-data-from-the-online- dashboard-)

<comment> alok-g I want one that keeps the data "only" locally. Is there such a thing? :-)

<comment><USER33> None that I know of. I don't think the demand is strong enough to outweigh the business model whereby they can sell leads to customers (eg. by exercise frequency, weight, etc.) to health insurance companies and such.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER34> An instrument - you can actually get perfectly reasonable starter version of most instruments for around that price point if you shop around, which will work fine when it comes to gigging too. Guitars, Basses, Midi Keyboards - <USER3> might have to shop around, but it is possible to get within the price limit.

I've been learning bass for the last month and a bit, and it has made a big difference to how I feel about myself and my confidence that I can pick up an entirely new skill from scratch, and that I can make music.

With things like LMMS and Hydrogen available, and lots of royalty-free free sample packs available, it is entirely possible to write and perform music on the cheap.

And if you're still not convinced? The tech industry seems to want us to be 'rockstar' developers, devops, admins, growth hackers, etc... so why not literally become one too? ;)

</comment><comment><USER35> i would say mechanical keyboard since we spend so much time on the computers.

but the great mechanical keyboards are over $100...should be able to get a second hand one for cheap.

<comment><USER36> An excellent suggestion.

I have had Zalman ZM-K500 mechanical keyboard since September and I can honestly say that I love it. It is also substantially less than $100 (£37) [0]. The quality is not quite as nice as some of the more expensive mech keyboards out (the labels on my meta keys are rubbing off extraordinarily quickly...) there but it is leagues ahead of any of the membrane based keyboards I have tried.

[0] [http://www.amazon.co.uk/Zalman-ZM-K500-USB-Mechanical- Keyboa...](http://www.amazon.co.uk/Zalman-ZM-K500-USB-Mechanical- Keyboard/dp/B00A53LCQ8)

<comment><USER37> Oddly, I've been using the same keyboard since about the same time. Would have to agree that it's a nice keyboard for the price.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER38> Chromecast (if technology related, since this is on HN).

<comment><USER39> Any particular reason?

<comment><USER38> Chromecast is first and foremost, a great product. It is very simple to use and setup is a breeze. Then, it makes use as simple as using the YouTube/Netflix/Play app on your phone/tablet. There isn't any new learning curve associated with it.

Then, the price point is just great. $35 is a steal for what it does.

It is also very thought out. It is very small and was the first product that I can think of that is just an hdmi dongle. Also, if your TV allows it, Chromecast can turn on your TV and switch the input to itself. Way too easy.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER40> A halfway decent burr grinder for coffee.

<comment><USER41> I just ordered a Hario

[http://www.hario.jp/coffee/grinder.html](http://www.hario.jp/coffee/grinder.html)

</comment></comment><comment><USER42> A Leatherman Multitool

I recommend the New Wave, though I also have a Charge TTi. I find myself using them all the time, and they last a really long time. I still have, and use regularly, the Leatherman Super Tool that I got in the mid 90's. I keep one in my office, one in my care, my girlfriends car, and one in the utility room. Really nice to have a solid multitool nearby whenever you need one.

</comment><comment><USER43> A "dumb phone," and ditch the smartphone.

<comment><USER44> To what end?

<comment><USER45> Some people find that they're able to get more things done when they don't have the distraction of a smartphone in their lives.

<comment><USER11> Yeah I reverted from an Android to a Nokia 301. A week of batter life in my usage, although the specs claim a month or something silly like that.

But these days it probably doesn't matter what phone I use, as I leave the thing at home as often as I take it with me. Now I'm no longer on-call, via SMS, I just don't need the distraction.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER46> A vintage road bike.

A lot of secondhand bikes go really cheap and only need a little attention and your on your way to cheap and healthy transportation.

<comment><USER47> Seconded. Plus, steel frames are super durable, and have a nice amount of give to them.

</comment></comment><comment><USER48> Considering the benefits of exercise, a pair of running shoes and some resistance bands could go a long way. Those two small purchases helped me get in shape faster than any gym membership that I had in the past. That said, everybody's exercise preferences are different so get whatever you need to become active.

<comment><USER49> Have you ever dealt with shin splints if so, how?

<comment><USER48> I have. Actually, that was the major problem I had with running until recently. This breaks the $100 rule but these shoes really made life easier for me: [http://www.zappos.com/asics-gel-kayano-19-neon-green- lightni...](http://www.zappos.com/asics-gel-kayano-19-neon-green-lightning)

Paired with some Dr. Scholl's sports gel inserts and a very slow rate of increase in distance and I was able to get to the 5K level.

I always denounced expensive shoes as heavily marked up brand mongering, but at least for athletic performance you really get what you pay for. I would recommend hitting up a real shoe store and getting fitted with the right shoes by a pro.

<comment><USER49> I also agree with spending decent chunks of change in shoes, beds, and anywhere else you spend a large portion of your time.

I'm trying to get into some sort of physical shape, but running is challenging to get into for me.

<comment><USER48> If you have access to a recumbent bike or elliptical, doing HIIT can be quite effective. It's done wonders for me.

I actually started getting in shape with the basic cardio routine from Power 90. It's really easy to do anywhere and does a pretty good job of working up a sweat. [http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000VEVVIA](http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000VEVVIA)

Stick with it and hopefully you'll find something that works for you!

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER50> An Mp3 player with radio. Great for listening to music and podcast whilst driving or travelling on the bus.

Yes, I know most smart phones can do that, but not everyone owns a smart phone, and I prefer not to drain the battery on my phone

<comment><USER51> I got a $20 pay-as-you-go phone with a radio and MP3 player built in. It's used for when my smart phone's dead and I really need to make a call / text, or when I just want to listen to music. I'd recommend that even more strongly.

</comment></comment><comment><USER52> A digital kitchen scale (something like ) - [http://www.amazon.com/EatSmart- Precision-Digital-Kitchen-Sil...](http://www.amazon.com/EatSmart-Precision- Digital-Kitchen- Silver/dp/B001N07KUE/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1395941458&sr=8-1&keywords=digital+baking+scale)

Measuring all of your flour, sugar, etc in grams will improve your baking a 100 fold. (It now assumes your recipes are based in ratios and metric though).

</comment><comment><USER53> on topic: a wireless headset for your computer/phone. even for watching movies, this has been essential (think cooking while watching videos)

off topic: As a long time lurker, this news item feels too reddity for what was originally a software vc community. I understand that HN is getting more popular, and it's attracting broader content. However, Reddit has subreddits, so I can filter out the banal. Please don't let hacker news become digg.

<comment><USER54> I can see where you're coming from, but even the off-the-wall suggestions are awfully relevant for hackers/tech.

Infrared thermometer for cooking is a fantastic example of using industrial- aimed tech for culinary perfection...

</comment></comment><comment><USER55> Floor jack for your car and a battery jumper. You never know when your battery is going to go dead or when you'll need to change a tire.

Trust me... just happen tonight.

<comment><USER56> I'd add a foot-operated pump and pressure gauge to that. Often more convenient to just top up the air and drive to the nearest garage. Also lets you maintain your tyres at the right pressure, which is good for fuel efficiency.

<comment><USER55> I'm adding the foot operated pump to my list. I completely forgot to mention a pressure gauge.

<comment><USER57> I'm lazy. I use my 20 gallon compressor :-)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER58> A good folder knife. I like benchmade.

<comment><USER32> I love and use bechmade, although looking for harder steel, in particular ZDP-189.

Unfortunately only Spyderco makes these and they are priced right but looks too ugly for my taste. I think i might adjust my taste to shapes as my taste to steels is too rigid :)

</comment></comment><comment><USER59> An Inka Pen. The older, metal ones, not the new terrible ones that Nite-Ize makes: [http://www.amazon.com/Nite-ize-Stylus-Carbon-Fiber- Stainless...](http://www.amazon.com/Nite-ize-Stylus-Carbon-Fiber- Stainless/dp/B000YH5V9O)

<comment><USER54> Failing an Inka pen, there's always the Space Pen, or for budget inclined, the Zebra F-301 (and Compact version of the same)

</comment></comment><comment><USER60> \- Paul Mitchell 'The Conditioner'. It's a great substitute for hair gel _and_ shaving foam. I've been using it for 20 years.

\- Pilot GTEC-C4 pens (great paired with Moleskine notebooks)

\- An external USB battery pack

\- A headphone splitter cable

\- Hearos earplugs (the blue ones)

</comment><comment><USER61> A Space Pen + Field Notes notebooks. Pen is great for all those times you need to write; Field Notes notebooks slip into any pocket and are good for any freehand note taking.

</comment><comment><USER62> A comfortable, well-fitting pair of pants. Pants are the foundation of any outfit. I'm personally searching for the perfect pair, because I only want to own one pair.

</comment><comment><USER63> Chromecast, its just awesome and you get quite a bit of change.

</comment><comment><USER64> It's WAY under $100, but I use my "Dorcy 41-4750" flashlight regularly - <USER4> it's easily the brightest, and best flashlight I've ever owned.

</comment><comment><USER65> Rice cooker

<comment><USER66> Have you tried a slowcooker?

It makes making thick stews out of cheaper cuts of meat or beans really quick and easy. My cooking got a lot healthier after I got one.

Beef stew: _Onion_ 2 leeks _Carrots_ 6 smallish potatos >Slice them all up into inch cubes _1kg stewing beef (cheap)_ 4 beef stock cubes in a teacup of boiling water *2 cans of guiness (10 min prep)

Put the lot in a slow cooker. Turn it on before you head to work. Take it off when you get home 10 hours later.

You now have 4 dinners worth of healthy stew!

<comment><USER67> Both are excellent suggestions and can work together well.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER68> A spotify subscription, any song ever at your fingertips, all day. I just hope those guys do the same thing with movies.

<comment><USER25> Rdio tried with Vdio. Didn't work out and they shut it down.

</comment></comment><comment><USER69> laptop stand with an external keyboard [http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kensington- SmartFitTM-RiserTM-Laptop...](http://www.amazon.co.uk/Kensington-SmartFitTM- RiserTM-Laptop- Cooling/dp/B0007YB8NM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1395903756&sr=8-1&keywords=laptop+stand)

</comment><comment><USER70> A 10" Shark prybar. They're under $20, and it's one of the most-used items in my toolbox.

</comment><comment><USER71> Slow cooker. A few minutes of prep in the morning = at least 5 days worth of food by the evening.

</comment><comment><USER72> A Raspberry Pi. A tiny computer running on 5v. Many possible uses, something for everyone.

</comment><comment><USER73> A towel

<comment><USER34> Froody!

</comment></comment><comment><USER74> Two 43 USD notes and for the remaining change some chocolate ;)

</comment><comment><USER75> Dremel

</comment><comment><USER76> A power strip. But everyone here probably has one :p</comment>


Almost All Top 100 Cryptocurrencies Solidly in Green,Dogecoin Skyrockets 40% - <AUTHOR> https://cointelegraph.com/news/almost-all-top-100-cryptocurrencies-solidly-in-green-dogecoin-skyrockets-over-40/amp <comment><AUTHOR> If you want more information about our decentralized bridge between Dogecoin and Ethereum take a look at our article here [https://blog.coinfabrik.com/decentralized-blockchain- bridges...](https://blog.coinfabrik.com/decentralized-blockchain-bridges- blockchain-innovations-and-cryptoasset-investment-frameworks/)

Disclaimer: I don't own Dogecoins.</comment>


Germany Buils World's Biggest Cycle Highway - <AUTHOR> https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/jun/30/intercity-cycle-highways-revolutionise-daily-commute <comment><USER2> I am very jealous. The bike is a fantastic tool for short commutes, but so many people decide not to use it because of safety concerns when riding alongside cars.

We need to see more roads dedicated to cycling. In San Francisco there is a large cycling community, but there are very few dedicated cycling thoroughfares, in fact I can recall only one and it is imperfect (but better than nothing) along the panhandle. We recently had two deaths in SF from bicycle and car mixed use roads.

What every city needs is dediccated networks of biking roads that are interconnected to get across the entire town that do not need to share the road with multi-ton vehicles that can so easily harm very vulnerable cyclists.

</comment><comment><USER3> Looks like horrible choices in road surface for bikes with thin, hard wheels. (you slip on gravel and the stones will shake you through, while the cobblestone separating both lanes is plain dangerous when wet. For good measure they put some coarse gravel to the road side, so every now and than even the city bikes can jerk over some stones. I already see one of those on the track.)

[https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/jun/30/intercity- cyc...](https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/jun/30/intercity-cycle- highways-revolutionise-daily-commute#img-4)</comment>


VW fined one billion euro by German prosecutors over dieselgate - <AUTHOR> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-emissions-dieselgate/vw-fined-one-billion-euro-by-german-prosecutors-over-dieselgate-idUSKBN1J92AI <comment><AUTHOR> Maximum fine by law is 5 million Euros, but the prosecutor can seize illegal profits and set those at 995 millions.</comment>


The 'Great Wave' has mystified art lovers for generations (2019) - <AUTHOR> https://edition.cnn.com/style/article/hokusai-great-wave-ukiyo-e-woodblock/index.html <comment><USER2> A few months ago, I discovered that the sketchbook of Hokusai (the artist of the Great Wave) is available online. There are thousands of images and they're pretty fascinating to browse through.

[http://pulverer.si.edu/node/663/title](http://pulverer.si.edu/node/663/title)

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hokusai_Manga](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hokusai_Manga)

<comment><USER3> The Smithsonian has some of the volumes at better resolution and with a PDF export:

[https://library.si.edu/digital-library/book/hokusai- manga](https://library.si.edu/digital-library/book/hokusai-manga)

In addition to works by many other great works by artists of the Edo and Meiji periods:

[https://library.si.edu/digital- library/collection/japanese-i...](https://library.si.edu/digital- library/collection/japanese-illustrated-books)

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> "[] the rich shade of blue used in the prints was imported from Europe. Prussian blue, as it's commonly known, was a synthetic color created in the 18th century and prized for its depth and durability. That Hokusai employed the hue as the principal actor in his oceanic drama suggests that he was depicting Japan on the cusp of change."

Or he just liked this new blue colour that was now available, he needed blue for his waves, and we shouldn't read more into it than that.

"As much as the wave portends instability and danger, it also suggests possibility and adventure."

To some viewers, perhaps. But the wording makes it sound like this was the original artist's idea - and of this we have no idea.

<comment><USER2> The color mentioned, Prussian blue, has a particular history with regards to Japanese art. Remember that at the time, imports were banned in Japan and thus to even own the color was something of a rarity. Based on the contemporary situation and his own history and interest in Western culture and art, it's pretty likely that Hokusai chose the color deliberately, and not simply that he liked blue "because he wanted it for the waves." Remember that he was nearly 70 years old when he started working on _Thirty-six Views of Mount Fuji._ Typically artists at that level of experience don't choose to use rare new materials just for kicks.

 _Hokusai was one of the first Japanese printmakers to boldly embrace the colour, a decision that would have major implications in the world of art. Using it extensively in his series Thirty Six Views of Mount Fuji (1830), of which the Great Wave was the first, the pigment especially lent itself to expressing both depth in water and distance, crucial atmospheric qualities to render land and seascapes._

 _Hokusai drew influence from a particular "Rangakusha" (scholar of Dutch texts) painter named Shiba Kokan, who experimented with European principles of composition. In The Great Wave, Hokusai abandoned traditional Japanese isometric view, where motifs were scaled according to importance, and instead adopted the dynamic style of Western perspective featuring intersecting lines of sight._

In short: the work itself incorporates deep influences from European art. Ergo, it's pretty standard art criticism to assume that the choice of materials and colors were also chosen deliberately.

[http://theconversation.com/friday-essay-from-the-great- wave-...](http://theconversation.com/friday-essay-from-the-great-wave-to- starry-night-how-a-blue-pigment-changed-the-world-81031)

<comment><USER5> Of course he chose the pigment deliberately. The question is if he chose it because of its visual effect (and price and chemical properties) or because of some symbolic meaning in the history of the pigment.

Choosing a pigment for its color is not the same as choosing it "just for kicks". The entire purpose of a pigment is to create color!

<comment><USER2> Clearly the most likely answer is "for both reasons", as I explained in the parent comment. He had an interest in Western art, the work itself incorporates Western techniques, the pigment was rare and associated with (Western) modernity, and its particular qualities made it suited for his visual goals. It would not make much sense to note that he made all of these decisions to highlight a changing Japan / new influences from the West, but say that he only chose Prussian blue because it looked nice.

This is not really an uncommon occurrence; artists choose materials for their visual appearance and symbolic meaning all the time. Klimt's use of gold leaf is a similar example.

 _Klimt 's use of gold was inspired by a trip he had made to Italy in 1903. When he visited Ravenna he saw the Byzantine mosaics in the Church of San Vitale. For Klimt, the flatness of the mosaics and their lack of perspective and depth only enhanced their golden brilliance, and he started to make unprecedented use of gold and silver leaf in his own work_

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Kiss_(Klimt)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Kiss_\(Klimt\))

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gustav_Klimt#Golden_phase_and_...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gustav_Klimt#Golden_phase_and_critical_success)

<comment><USER6> I think the point of the parent poster is that artists (like Klimt) often choose their materials because they want to achieve a certain effect, not because they want to signal a certain concept or relationship to a specific situation. Klimt did not choose that color and material to signal a return to Byzantium mores or some particular link to the Eastern Italian coast, but because it suited his imagery - that had classic influences but was unmistakably something else and new.

Similarly, I agree that linking Hokusai's use of a new blue to a particular will of representing a changing Japanese society, is a big overreach without other corroborating evidence. It makes much more sense that he was simply an artist who was still at the peak of his powers and enjoyed innovating into his late years. It's like aged architects embracing new materials when they become available - not because they represent this or that, but simply because they work better and open new possibilities.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> What a horrible headline. Clickbait.

While I love Hokusai's art, this article does not explain why the Great Wave mystifies art lovers nor how it does so for generations.

<comment><USER8> Right? It's much more about the process than the piece. Would have also read that article, but I thought I was reading another.

<comment><USER9> I also thought there was going to be some actual mystery about this painting I've seen before, but don't know much about. I guess CNN got my click, I feel duped.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> If anyone is interested in Japanese wood block prints I really suggest checking out David Bulls channel on YouTube.

He did a whole series on his own copy of the Great Wave.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAhiMCSvtCc&list=PLK- Wicsj5r...](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAhiMCSvtCc&list=PLK- Wicsj5rAasS2g7e-Z9eFUdG6I7ZqED&index=1)

</comment><comment><USER11> I don't understand what has 'mystified' them. Enamored, impressed, inspired, yes. But what are they mystified by?

<comment><USER12> Mystified means bewildered or perplexed. Are these two feelings incompatible with art?

<comment><USER13> The feelings are not incompatible with lots of things. For instance, you could say, "I'm mystified by the fare schedules for transportation zones in London". That's a valid sentence. If the schedules make sense to me, though, I might ask "Why are you mystified?" and then you might say something like "I don't understand why it costs more to travel from X to Y than from X to Z" and we can discuss it.

If you were to, instead, say "Is mystification incompatible with pricing schedules?" no one will have benefited.

So, put simply, "What part confuses you?" is the question.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> > Takahashi says it takes about a decade to become a true ukiyo-e "shokunin," > or master craftsman, and that there are only 25 left in Tokyo today.

I was watching David Bull, the Canadian-turned-ukiyo-e carver lamenting that the printer he wanted to produce his prints was busy printing some new Yoshida Toshi prints for the late artists family from the artist's original wood blocks.

I had no idea that you could get prints made from original blocks — and, when I tracked them down, for a few hundred U.S. dollars.

I ordered a print for my wife for Christmas last year (this one: [https://www.teamwakon.com/products/yoshida-toshi- hyoroku](https://www.teamwakon.com/products/yoshida-toshi-hyoroku))

In the emails I got from the studio in Japan they wanted to know how they could spread these prints to more people — to keep this art form alive.

If you've watched enough David Bull on YouTube (the Bob Ross of ukiyo-e carving) you'll hear of his storied journey from being a young, enthusiastic Canadian begging an audience with a touring company of Japanese masters, the sneering reception he is often met with as he tries to excel in their craft and finally his "arrival" when he dedicates a decade of his life to creating a series of 100 prints.

And with all his YouTube exposure, all the videos he has created on how to approach and eventually master the craft, his Twitch streaming... the old masters came to him and said, "Thank you, David-san, you are doing what _we_ should have been doing."

Or so I paraphrase....

</comment><comment><USER15> I always liked this animated sketchbook about Hokusai made by Tony White: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmFGtsG_EgA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmFGtsG_EgA)

Wish it were available in a higher resolution.

Hiroshige also has many great woodblock prints in the same era.

</comment><comment><USER16> Most Westerners read text left-to-right, and therefore often interpret other things left-to-right as well.

Supposedly in Japan(ese), people interpret things right-to-left, and so if one wants to interpret this painting as the artist did natively, it should be looked at coming from the right?

<comment><USER17> I've been studying oil painting under a local professional artist. One of the topics that really interests me is composition. Artists go to great lengths to design the placement, colors, texture, etc of objects in a painting to purposely lead the eye. When I look at the Great Wave, I find my eyes start at the top of the breaking wave, then move along the curve of the wave, to the boat, then toward the right. It's actually kind of a Golden Spiral, which is used often in paintings.

</comment></comment><comment><USER18> Check out the false start. In the wave you can see the shape of mount fuji from a different angle. Frequently not noticed but once seen, not viewed the same way again.

<comment><USER19> Why would you call that a 'false start'.

<comment><USER6> I guess he assumes the artist started depicting Fuji-san, wasn't happy with the result, and reworked it all in a way that could accommodate some of the initial effort. Which may or may not be true.

<comment><USER19> If that's the reason then... it's not true.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> There was a mural in Honolulu?</comment>


My experiences at a woman's programming workshop - <AUTHOR> http://blog.emacsen.net/blog/2012/06/07/observations-from-a-python-workshop/?repost <comment><USER2> That's not a call for single-sex education. That's a call for good teachers who are willing to crack down on the class clown. There's always a class clown, and he always needs to be cracked down upon for the good of the class. This is teaching 101. Sorry you didn't have a good teacher.

>Dave was really excited by the class, and, like me and the other volunteers, had a lot of experience with Python.

Sounds like Dave was in the wrong class and should have been told so.

>I wondered afterwards why this extremely competent woman in her 20s would react this way after clearly mastering the material.

That's a learned technique for getting assistance. It worked on you, didn't it?

<comment><USER3> > That's a learned technique for getting assistance. It worked on you, didn't > it?

I was going to point out the same thing. A women playing dumb to get help from a man, is not uncommon at all.

<comment><USER4> Yeah! Those sneaky women! All of em will con you and all us men into helping them. Sneaky deceitful women.</sarcasm>

And people wonder why women don't like male dominated tech events

<comment><USER5> The dynamic is an important consideration, like it or not. Do you think a woman would play dumb, bat her eyelashes and flip her hair (embellishing) while asking for help if her instructor was a woman?

<comment><USER6> > [...] play dumb, bat her eyelashes and flip her hair [...]

The fact that you frame it in such a stereotypical way speaks volumes about the attitudes at work here.

<comment><USER5> I am inferring based on past experiences. I don't know for sure what happened, I freely admit that.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Dear HNers,

Gender bias is a touchy subject in these tech blogs and the responses to this (yet another) article are, predictably, dismissive. It was one person's fault, there's no widespread gender bias, the instructor should have things differently, someone has seen women be jerks too, etc.

So while there really does seem to be a measurable, observable difference in gender involvement in computing (e.g. in CS enrollments, in working in the industry, etc), these anecdotes always get tossed as not significant.

So what I'm wondering, and this is an open question to everyone here: would anything convince you, personally, that gender bias is real, or has a significant measurable effect, or is a problem? Would it take a certain kind of experiment? Some kind of data or analysis? (Or is the answer, "it's not a problem"?) Like, what sorts of articles would people _not_ jump on the bandwagon to tear to shreds?

best,

<comment><USER8> Well; it would take more than anecdotal evidence for one thing. It's very easy for sensitive issues to be dominated by emotional anecdotes, to the point where only group think is tolerated and any sort of valid challenge is labeled. I often wish as a community we could use Crocker's rules ( <http://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Crocker%27s_rules> ) for this kind of thing. It would make for more interesting discussions.

Anyway, I don't think people pick apart these blog posts because they're unwilling to accept there's a "gender bias" (whatever that actually means). Rather they pick these posts apart because there are very obvious holes in the original posts' reasoning. In this case, it's that because some guy was vaguely an overcompetitive jerk, somehow that means we need to isolate the sexes. Because apparently women are incapable of being overcompetitive jerks, and it (obviously) has to be a male/female dynamic.

That's kind of a leap!

Here's the other thing, and this is kind of a tangent, but a theme I see with a lot of these blog posts isn't that someone was actively hostile, but rather, that someone did something "offensive". With "offensive" ranging from things that are obviously very unprofessional to incredibly tame things that someone just didn't like. And to that I'd just say this: its your choice to be offended by things. And its your choice how you react to that. I've been "offended" by many things other programmers have said, but I don't go "well programming isn't for me!". I just think less of those people. I don't think female sensibilities are so frail that they aren't by and large the same way.

<comment><USER9> That was hilarious, man. Thanks for that.

Oh, wait, it was serious?!

Well now, how are you going to map this issue to something which isn't, in the end, anecdotes, since it pertains to human emotional responses? Are you asking those ethereal (probably fake, as you said, who even knows what this gender bias thing means?) other people to come up with a scale where they have to put it in 1-to-ten how belittled they felt?

Have you stopped to think of why these kinds of posts are held up to such scrutiny in contrast to, say, posts about other, not-related to gender, and thus mostly affecting men (this last point shouldn't need explanation), matters? Like, bad experiences with VCs or age discrimination and some such?

I would hazard a guess that the distinction is not due to something very rational, unless you get very cynical and paranoid.

Anyway...

> Because apparently women are incapable of being overcompetitive jerks, and > it (obviously) has to be a male/female dynamic.

It sort of is if its impact is mostly on women, and the behavior is mostly accused on men. Yes, this last point would require something more akin to actual statistics to be turned into the reason for some sort of castigation on men in general, but I haven't seen any of that as of now, really. Unless you count people feeling personally attacked by the existence of this discussion, of course.

> Here's the other thing, and this is kind of a tangent, but a theme I see > with a lot of these blog posts isn't that someone was actively hostile, but > rather, that someone did something "offensive". [...]

Well, we are quite glad that none of these problems affect you, but this conversation wasn't about you in particular, was it?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> Interesting article, overall. Something occurred to me though:

> "Dave expressed his enthusiasm for the material by asking a lot of very > technical questions to the instructor. Largely, these questions seemed > designed to show off his own knowledge, or to challenge the instructor. In > other words, Dave was the jerk at the conference."

This isn't a male-only phenomenon. Whether it's philosophy classes, psychology classes, or other courses with a significant female composition, this type of behavior is not entirely absent among females either (I have distinct memories of this in college). Granted it may be less common or less confrontational, but it exists, and let's also not forget most women will acknowledge that they can be quite vicious toward one another in office settings as well.

Think about the amount of women in law and medicine (I believe they are the majority at this point). Do you think hot-shot male lawyers or med students behave in significantly different ways than hot-shot male hackers? I doubt it. Men are men; I'm sure in the courtroom, at university, or at the medical conferences, or tech workshops, a minority of us men will exhibit this same "jerk" behavior (i.e., challenging the lecturer, asking questions to show off, etc...). In summary, jerk behavior does not sufficiently or completely explain the lack of women in tech. It exists in most if not all professional fields, even ones in which women are coming to dominate (which, hey, I think is great).

</comment><comment><USER11> > I saw Dave's behavior as a challenge, a call to action. And it was at that > moment that the gender difference became most apparent to me.

Oh, for fuck's sake, how is some Dave being jerk is making gender difference apparent? The guy was at the wrong place, and was being a show-off. But no, you must attribute it to his gender.

<edit> As pointed out by threads below, the author was talking about how the room tuned out when Dave started derailing conversation, and he saw it as call to arms. The author sees this as apparent gender difference - FWIW I don't agree with his assessment. As long as we are talking anecdotes, I couldn't see a clear patterns(based on gender or any other trait) in the reactions of the people I know to this scenario.

I am leaving my incorrect comment as there are replies, and the replies will become meaningless if I remove it. </edit>

> Looking at her screen, she'd made significant progress towards finishing the > project, but when she asked me a question she giggled and told me she had no > idea what the project was about, or what to do.

> Studies have shown that especially bright women have this reaction to > difficult material and that women learning computer science do better in an > single sex classroom (though those studies have critics).

I think you are better off not basing off your approach on some controversial study. If you are compartmentalizing, no two students are same. And if you are generalizing, I find it hard to believe that 3291805000 females of the world show the same behavioral and learning traits. Unless you have proved it otherwise, I would stick to a feedback based approach where I see how students are coping up, and then introduce variations.

<comment><USER12> >Oh, for fuck's sake, how is some Dave being jerk is making gender difference apparent? >The guy was at the wrong place, and was being a show-off. >But no, you must attribute it to his gender.

If you read the article again, you may find that the gender difference which became apparent to the author has to do with the /response/ to Dave's behaviour, and not with his behaviour /per se/.

Also, here is a (perhaps interesting) thought experiment: Among the folks you know well enough, how many would care to respond to an opinion in a discussion forum which starts off with the words "Oh, for fuck's sake" ? How do the women fare in this count? Is there a gender difference?

<comment><USER13> Yes, it has to do with the response, but I can't agree with the main point of it which is due to selection bias I think (not gender differences):

      To me, and I suspect most men, we'd see Dave's behavior
      as a call to arms. Dave was raising the stakes and even
      though his behavior was clearly rude, it also demonstrated
      that he had a mastery over the material.

If this is the core of the article's point, I don't agree with it. People such as "Dave" waste everyone's time, it doesn't really matter what gender Dave and his audience are. When I encounter a Dave, I don't see it as a pointless "call to arms", I tune out and ultimately leave. I'm not wasting my time fighting people like Dave. I don't like how the article implies this makes me less of a man. It's simply good sense in my opinion not to waste your energy on trolls.

If there are groups where everyone feels challenged and is in a fighting mood after seeing Dave in action, it's probably because everyone else already left the room or had the sense not to come to the event in the first place.

<comment><USER14> I'm wondering if Dave was actually guilty of what he's been accused of, or if his behavior was misinterpreted.

In college and grad school I was usually the guy asking advanced questions, not because I was trying to show off or be a jerk, but because I was trying to gain a particular level of mastery of the material, and the way I gain that mastery is to ask questions during the process of absorbing the material. I gain understanding of, say, a particular algorithm by asking if a particular extension of that algorithm is appropriate.

This makes me wonder if others mistakenly viewed me as a troll, or felt like I was dragging the classroom down, due to my learning style being something of an outlier. (Being on the autism spectrum, if anyone tried to signal me about this without being explicit, I would have missed it.)

<comment><USER15> From what I understood, it seems like Dave wasn't asking questions to better understand the material. His intent was to stump the instructor of the class, validating his mastery of the material.

<comment><USER14> Are you making an independent observation (ie, you were at the workshop and observed Dave) or repeating what was in the writeup?

Also, I'm genuinely curious: how do you tell the difference? What's the difference between Dave's (presumed) "stump the instructor to validate ego" questions and my "push the edges of my understanding, which may happen to stump the instructor if they haven't thought about it, and which may confirm to me that I've understood things correctly" questions?

<comment><USER16> It sounds to me (someone with a fair amount of teaching experience) like Dave was an enthusiastic student. Without seeing a transcript or video, it seems more likely Dave had a lot of things he wasn't clear on regarding Python and was excited to have a chance to ask an expert (the teacher) a lot of questions to clarify his understanding.

In a basic intro class, this can be a problem because other students will start to think they are in the wrong class and don't understand the material and drop out! A common example is language classes. You have a college German 101 class and a bunch of people show up that are native German speakers looking to get an easy A. Or they had 3 years in high school, or lived there a while with their military parents on base, and are looking for a refresher and thought 101 was a good place.

If the teacher lets these students (who are not jerks, bullies or douches any more than I think this Dave was) proceed at their own pace, then the rest of the students will leave in frustration. That happens a lot and the teachers often like it because then they can teach at a more fun higher level with students who already know the material. But it's not fair to the actual intro students.

This also happens a lot in engineering classes where schools pretty much have to assume students have learned basic programming, soldering, and electricity on their own before enrolling in engineering school. In this case it is probably best to let the students who were never interested enough in the topic to study it previously, just drop out.

In this particular case I agree with the suggestion made here by another that students be put into basic/advanced tracks or Dave be encouraged to take another class. Another route to take, which is what I do, is to say "Dave, these are really excellent and interesting questions, but they are way above the introductory level of this class. I'd like to keep things for now on a more basic level since many people here are just getting into programming for the first time, but I'd definitely be more than happy to talk with you in detail about these issues during office hours. Is that OK?"

The solution of labeling him a "bully" and calls for "kicking him out" of the class are irresponsible, immature and signs of an unskilled unprofessional teacher. But it's what goes on at many American primary schools. If you have an excited, intellectually interested first grader who asks a lot of questions, most American teachers will personally diagnose the child with "ADHD" and demand the parents put him on amphetamines to zone him out so he won't keep asking questions and will sit and listen because that's what you do in school nowadays. Sit down, shut up, be quiet, and do as you are told. An approach that most of the posters in this thread seem to approve of given their hatred for poor curious Dave.

<comment><USER17> _Without seeing a transcript or video..._

Or actually paying attention the article, apparently. "Poor Curious Dave" was a VOLUNTEER at the workshop. Just like the author of the article, Dave's purpose being there was to assist the students of the workshop with the projects (presumably, or to assist in some other capacity).

Maybe Dave thought his questions and comments would help clarify or improve the instructor's content...but on the other hand I really don't find the article author's evaluation of Dave as just a showoff/bully much of a stretch. I assumed that we've all seen this behavior tons of times and that it is pretty obvious when someone is being "That Guy" versus trying to clarify or expand on the material for themselves or others.

The fact that quite a few here are eager to challenge the author's evaluation of Dave and jump to Dave's defense is...funny, I guess.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> That bully is a reason why on railsgirls events you have tables for differen skill levels. You could easily send that guy to another table with more advanced people without throwing him out.

<comment><USER19> This. This is a wonderful idea.

(In fact, in my evil little mind, I might be tempted to send a Dave to a table just a bit above him, to show him that he's only hot shit in his own mind.)

<comment><USER20> That's not evil. That's exactly how I would want to be treated in a class. I don't want to learn from people who know less than me, I want to learn from people who know more than me!

<comment><USER21> I think this is key to make progress in any learning environment, i.e. to find a group that one presumes as being slightly better than oneself. It seems to push at least myself to try harder and become better. But of cause the gap shouldn't be too large, otherwise it is annoying for the group and demotivational for the oneself.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> _these questions seemed designed to show off his own knowledge, or to challenge the instructor._

Yes, Dave was showing off to an audience of women.

 _she asked me a question she giggled and told me she had no idea what the project was about, or what to do._

Yes, the woman was acting like a bimbo to elicit male help.

Congrats, you now have the grasp of female/male dynamics usually figured out by middle school.

 _I'd never really believed in single sex education_

Wow, a thousand years of human culture tossed away in one generation by ideological fanatics pretending that women and men are "equal" and one guy finally figures out maybe tradition exists for a reason. Ask any woman who went to an all-girls school if she missed having to be in the same classroom as boys.

 _I saw that women only groups are not creating a more insular community of women, but rather offering these women a more comfortable entrance into our general community._

Amazing! How was this brilliant guy to know he could have asked his grandmother and saved himself all that trouble?

 _The jerk factor also reminded me of why we in the Free Software community need to be taking issues of civility seriously, and not letting the idea of "free speech" get in the way of maintaining a safe place for discussion._

You get your group to be 50/50 male/female and you are going to drive away lots of competent men because showing off their skills, bragging, and one- upping other men is one of the primary motivations to excel at your chosen field. A "safe space" for women is often a "boring space" for men.

But sure, go ahead, I'm sure this problem will be easy to solve with just the right technical fix. In fact, I can think of one technical fix the ancient Chinese used to make "safe men" for keeping their harems.

"There are no statutes capable of controlling the relations between men and women." -- Secretary

<comment><USER23> Competent men do not 'show of their skills, brag and one-up other men'. Yes, they may be technically competent, but they are socially incompetent, because they never progressed beyond that juvenile behavior. I'd gladly drive them away.

<comment><USER22> _Competent men do not 'show of their skills, brag and one-up other men'._

Yes they most certainly do.

 _Yes, they may be technically competent, but they are socially incompetent, because they never progressed beyond that juvenile behavior._

Ok, now you have admitted that technically competent men may in fact exhibit those behaviors, so now you're saying they are "socially incompetent." You are wrong in both cases, highly competent men who show off their skills, brag, and dominate other men tend to be very socially competent. In fact, this sort of display is very much a demonstration of social competence.

Obviously, juveniles do this is a different way than adults, but the pattern of behavior is the same. It is also often the case that men who are being shown up will try to "tear down" the dominant male by labelling his behavior "juvenile" or trying to change the nature of the competition to something he's better at.

One might paraphrase: "sure, he's highly competent, adept at showing his skills, and is clearly superior to me at this particular activity. But he's such a show-off!"

<comment><USER23> Wow, sorry, I didn't realize you were a _brogrammer_

<comment><USER22> I looked up "brogrammer."

"A popular, cool, or otherwise normal person who has become intrigued by the fun of programming. Usually unliked by the nerdy programmers for getting all of the friends and the girls, while creating cool and useful applications."

Was that meant to be an insult?

One has to wonder if "male feminists" and "nice guys" share the same delusion that "white knighting" females will increase their sexual success, and advocating "more women in tech" is an excuse to have potential mates in closer proximity, and has nothing to do with any moral crusade or actual benefit for the tech industry itself?

One wonders if "male feminists" are simply trying to compensate for their personal deficiencies?

<comment><USER14> The pejorative usage of "brogrammer" is more like "a programmer who displays all the worst characteristics normally associated with high school jocks" -- things like arrogance, misogyny, bullying, and unwarranted aggression.

(Not rendering any judgment on whether you do or don't fit this definition, just making sure everyone is clear on what was being implied above.)

<comment><USER22> _The pejorative usage of "brogrammer" is more like "a programmer who displays all the worst characteristics normally associated with high school jocks" -- things like arrogance, misogyny, bullying, and unwarranted aggression_

Who associates these characteristics with "high school jocks" and who assumes these are negative characteristics?

Arrogance (i.e., a superior male) misogyny (i.e., a man who the woman I lust after has sex with) bullying (i.e., a man who is socially superior than me) and unwarranted aggression (i.e., a male who out-competes me).

Sound like "brogrammer" means "I really envy this superior man."

<comment><USER14> You're trying too hard.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER24> Was it me or was that article written in a rather simplistic and childish way? 'All was good and well, something a bit odd but funny happened, but then this jerk came along and he started to ruin everything!'

Near the end he suddenly jumped really fast to his conclusion, namely that he supports women-only groups (or, as he likes to spell it, 'women only groups'), but he really doesn't explain why other than saying that it offers a more comfortable entrance to them. He doesn't link his conclusion to the rest of the article, and I don't see how this specific occurrence adds to the conclusion. Because the jerk happened to be male? I'd like to address him for overgeneralizing males, but he just straight out avoids being clear about it.

But even if it was safe to say that only males act like jerks, that still does not mean that every male is like that, and it certainly doesn't mean women should be kept separated from males in education. If a male is being a jerk, the problem is that he's being a jerk, not the fact that he's a male. I fail to see why to differ between male and female and the article does not make it clear in the slightest.

</comment><comment><USER25> I'm going to be the one who says, "Hey, Ive had classes where the 'Dave' jerk was a woman"...but that isn't necessarily a rebuttal to the OP's point about single sex classrooms. It's possible that the dynamic of the gender mix causes certain jerks to show off more, male or female.

But as soon as I say that, I can definitely think of plenty of oxygen-hogs in my all male engineering classes

</comment><comment><USER26> Using the Montessori method would have solved many of the issues presented by the OP.

Dave would have been in a group where he'd be able to show others directly, if Dave wasn't in a group, he'd be quickly identified by the teacher as someone who didn't need help and could possibly benefit the group.

      Dave: <obscure question about array semantics>
      Teacher: Dave, it looks like you know a lot about arrays, Laura is struggling a bit, can you help her out?

Dave was seeking attention and to be recognized as having advanced skill, the Montessori method would have allowed Dave to put his talents to good use while not being a disruption to the class.

Dave isn't a jerk, it's just that the instructor is using antiquated teaching methods from the 19th century, and under utilizing his teaching resources. Clearly this person is someone who's authority should indeed be challenged.

<comment><USER27> Just make sure that Dave knows _how to explain_ the concept before you sit him next to Laura!

I do stuff about peer feedback and explaining in words in my Maths classes, then the peer tutoring works a lot better.

</comment></comment><comment><USER28> I've been to the railsbridge woman's workshop, and while I was able to follow the instructions and build a blog in a day, I didn't understand Ruby on Rails and had no idea how I would do the same thing without following the instructions. Knowing how to follow instructions != understanding the material. Too bad the author saw the girl who was confused as a bimbo instead of taking the time to explain the high level stuff to her.

</comment><comment><USER29> We just have the author's word that the other volunteer was trying to show off and challenge the instructor. He was a volunteer expert, maybe he just thought he and the teacher were partners, and it was their job to discuss high level material for the class.

E.g. instructor illustrates no need for semi-colons, meaningful white space -> excited volunteer explains how much cleaner it looks than other programming languages and how great he finds it, maybe with a real world anecdote, or he compares how it is like working with other languages without that, hell maybe even says it isn't a feature he likes, etc..

I'd rather he be open and egregious about his knowledge like this, than just sitting there like a robot for whenever a classmate asks him to help with step 5 or something. It would be a much richer, varied, and more interesting class than some textbook recitation of a tutorial anyone can follow at home anyway.

</comment><comment><USER30> Unless I'm misreading this (and I have the mother of all migraines at present so it's possible) weren't both the author of the post and Dave volunteers helping out rather than students? In which case shouldn't whoever was running the session just shut them down since the whole point is to help the people attending to learn rather than intellectual willy waving?

I used to be Dave when I was younger (still am if I don't keep a lid on it; I'm sure empathy is a wonderful thing but I've just had to learn to fake it over the years). So my preferred solution would have been to ask "does anyone else have any questions or are the rest of you secure enough in your own ability to not feel the need to advertise?". But then I guess there'd have been two jerks in the room and only one of them being helpful.

<comment><USER31> Even in the context of "helping", some people have to show they _could_ teach the class. They do this by asking leading questions, pointing out any mistake, no matter how pedantic, and other obnoxious, interruptive actions.

Students quickly recognize the adversarial relationship and, depending on how the teacher responds, either lose confidence in the teacher or tube out the cock fight.

As the teacher, in a short-term environment (like a substitute or a half-day seminar), you have to shut that person down unequivocally. In a longer lasting environment, give that person a chance to teach.

</comment></comment><comment><USER32> The part of the post that intrigued me was when she...

"[Looked] at her screen, she'd made significant progress towards finishing the project, but when she asked me a question she giggled and told me she had no idea what the project was about, or what to do.

Why?

I still don't know the reason. Studies have shown that especially bright women have this reaction to difficult material and that women learning computer science do better in an single sex classroom (though those studies have critics)."

On a similar Hacker News post, "In Math You Have to Remember, In Other Subjects You Can Think About It" the author paraphrases from a book "What's Math Got To Do With It?", in which he states that a student

"... called Rebecca, was conscientious, motivated, and smart, and regularly attained A+ grades in mathematics. She was able to follow the methods her teacher demonstrated in class, and could reproduce them perfectly. But she did not understand what she was doing, and as a result she regarded herself as not good at math. When Boaler asked her why she thought that, she replied, "Because I can't remember things well and there is so much to remember." [p.164.]"

Coincidentally both subjects are female but I think it's part of an underlying theme on learning and developing critical thinking skills that is playing out across this country. And the consequences of this lack/challenge differs on how one is taught.

<comment><USER33> Do they do better because of a lack or male interaction, or because they aren't going to be challenged as much? Because sooner or later, they have to leave academia and wake up to the realities of the real world, where Dave isn't only being a dick in meetings but is trying to take your next promotion to become your manager.

</comment></comment><comment><USER34> I had a language class once with a student that was clearly not at our level constantly asking questions that the other students all already knew. As a mature adult, I attributed this lack of consideration for others to the individual, not the entire gender.

<comment><USER35> You're missing the point. It's not that it was a male troublemaker, but that the largely female group reacted in a particular way to that person acting as he did.

</comment></comment><comment><USER36> When I went to a Java programming class at a local hackerspace, it was something like 70/30 women/men. I didn't really see anything in the way they learned or progressed through the session that was in any way different than the men. What struck me was that _holy crap, there's a lot of women here while everybody keeps saying there's no women in tech_.

I think the author is dead right about the single-sex classes being a comfortable way to introduce women to technical topics. But having men there did not stop them from asking questions and following the material at the hackerspace. I think getting involvement from female-oriented communities will provide that comfort level to start with. Also, female teachers (my scientist female friends said they'd love to teach little girls to become science and math geeks if they had the time)

<comment><USER31> There is a very strong selection bias here (both in your comment and the original article). The woman who signed up for something like your class may be very different (in personality, outgoing ness, comfort with men, etc) from the women who signed up for the original author's class.

The end result is that you both may be right: maybe women (and men, for that matter) should be fully integrated in learning environments _and_ have segregated environments. No two people learn the same, why would we expect the same level of comfort in every classroom setting.

And if I look back to TFA, I think that is what the author meant by "more PyLadies". Listen to _everybody_ and give them all comfortable places to learn.

</comment></comment><comment><USER37> I think we simply need to start calling people out in person regardless of their gender. If I saw "Dave" acting like this I'd pull him aside and set him straight. And if he couldn't pull his shit together i'd ask him to leave. And if he couldn't manage to do that, I'd help him leave.

Not that your post is passive-aggressive, but we need to start being proactive about this. In all realms of life. Call people out on their shit or they're not going to change. Humans are weak to the pressures and influences of society. If we continue to stand there and allow certain behavior, they'll continue to do it. If you man up and call people on their crap, it might not work the first time but if enough people do, that person will eventually realize what they are doing is wrong.

<comment><USER14> I think we also need to be willing to set people straight without ascribing bad motivations to them.

Maybe Dave isn't a jerk or a showoff. Maybe he is like me. I learn by asking questions during the learning process. I feel like I'm not really learning very well unless I can say "does this material imply this other conclusion?" or "if we extended this to more dimensions, would we just have to change these things, or am I missing something?" I learn by stretching the edges of what I think I'm learning.

I'm also on the autism spectrum, which means I'm unlikely to pick up on whatever social signals the rest of the class might be sending. I've tried to learn those things, but they're still pretty opaque to me.

So I would appreciate, if I'm in a circumstance where my question-asking is causing problems, if someone would pull me aside and say "can you save your questions for later? They're a bit distracting for the rest of us." I'm not doing it either to be a jerk or to show off, so I'll gladly stop _if the problem is clearly communicated to me_.

<comment><USER38> I have learned (hopefully learned!) to only use this style of learning when I am one-on-one with an instructor, and never in a classroom full of peer students.

Even then, not every instructor (or a person who effectively serves as an instructor) can stand this. Here I have to trust my people's judgement and sometimes I do misjudge. I recall one of my colleagues and coworkers with whom I could not maintain a meaningful oral conversation because we would misunderstand each other's verbal styles, however we were able to efficiently converse over email. This is certainly impossible in a classroom.

<comment><USER39> I see probing questions as the sole justification of the classroom format. If I'm to merely sit and listen, I'd much rather have either a good text or a recording of a professionally produced lecture to watch at my own pace.

<comment><USER38> Yes, I was originally coming from the same place. However, not all instructors can handle this, and many peer students could not stand it either.

When I say "student", I mean anyone in the audience, and "instructor" is anyone at the podium, talking.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER40> At the risk of sounding petty let me say that, I am male and I can only speak about my part of the problem.

1\. Do I feel bad about women achieving stuff in life ? Yes.

2\. Am I ashamed of the above fact? Yes.

Lets face it, from what I have been able to figure out, this is the case with a lot of men in this world. Question we must be asking is : how do we go about solving this problem? This is not as simple as just developing empathy for the other sex, because according to current customs and expectations: men are expected to be taking care of women, women should be trading up etc.

Whenever the question of equality of sexes come in tech, the arguments are always split into two factions. One side argues that there is no such thing as discrimination of sex in tech. It is a meritocracy and that is the only way it can be, and women are not in tech because they do not want to be / are naturally less talented in programming. The other side argues this is not the case and that you feel so only because you have no daughter/are a virgin/you are a basement dwelling looser.This line of thinking is not productive. Painting men as super villains in some grand 'Dan Brown'ian plot of conspiracy against women will NOT work.Especially with nerds. I am not saying anything excuses sexist behaviour just that villifying them may satisfy your ego, but will not accomplish anything.

<comment><USER41> >Painting men as super villains in some grand 'Dan Brown'ian plot of conspiracy against women will NOT work.

It works because it plays into traditional gender roles. You don't have to be a bleeding heart liberal to believe women are the "gentler" sex that needs the protection of society. Just good ol' fashioned chivalry.

<comment><USER40> You are missing the point. Is this a solution? Does this not reinforce the gender stereotype? Are we not trained to compete or cooperate with our equals and take care of the weak an helpless?

<comment><USER41> I mean it works rhetorically. I don't agree with the level of victimhood Women's Studies imparts. It's dis-empowering and leads to bitterness.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER42> A couple of random thoughts about Dave:

A) Having participated in plenty of female majority online groups, my experiance has been that, yes, a single guy can have inordinate power. He is often deferred to and supported by a bevel of cooing ladies who seem oblivious to the power dynamic underlying the whole thing.

B) It is possible that Dave was not trying to be a jerk at all. Maybe he was just nervous around the ladies and subconsciously going into braggart mode in hopes of impressing someone and getting a date.

</comment><comment><USER43> This article begs the question: why do women respond disproportionately badly to the "helpful jerk"?

<comment><USER44> The real question should be: why does a class respond proportionately badly to the 'helpful jerk'?

We can't reasonably say this is a female specific phenomenon when our only point of reference is a female-only class. Send the guy to a bunch of different classes (of mixed and single gender, and of mixed skill-level) and see how they all respond.

If one guy is monopolising the time and help available in the class, it stands to reason that everyone else will lose interest, because there is no longer time and attention available to them.

And if this guy is asking questions that far exceed the average skill level of the class, it also stands to reason that the class will lose interest because they can't understand any of it.

I'd like to know why the volunteers were accepting of this guy when at least one of them (the OP) was well aware of how detrimental his presence was to the class as a whole. And I'd like to know this guy's motivations for joining a class to wave his intellectual dick about.

<comment><USER45> > We can't reasonably say this is a female specific phenomenon when our only > point of reference is a female-only class.

Then why is the article about gender at all?

<comment><USER44> I agree; why is gender even relevant to this?

The author volunteers for female-only class (which he makes sure to highlight), and thus assumes his whole experience is down to the fact the class is all female.

Remove all references to gender and there is no significant change to the story. I think that reveals the complete irrelevance of gender.

My original point, which I guess wasn't worded very well, was that we're told about one experience in one classroom, and that has been blown up to account for the entirety of female-kind.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER46> Here in Portland we have a group called Code'n'Splode that takes women who are already working as engineers and gives them an opportunity to sound off on [gender] issues they've had in the workplace as well as coach other women interested in learning programming every week. If and when I ever delve into that world, I would feel a lot more comfortable going to them than even my close male colleagues if only because I know I can go to them about issues men might not have or - as a lot of HN articles have shown me - just don't think exist.

I'm not trying to generalize, but in my years of working with male developers, they tend to have a much more hands-off and "just look at it and learn" approach. Whether this is because I am female (and therefore a 'lost cause') or because they are just not the teaching type, I'm not sure, but when I'm trying to learn something, I don't want to take the chance of dealing with Daves or people that think women giggling equates to their being a bimbo.

</comment><comment><USER47> I used to be like Dave. Then I turned 13. Empathy is a great thing.

</comment><comment><USER48> What part of the experience showed that single sex workshops might be better? Because there wouldn't be female knowledgeable jerks (either because women are never jerks, or because they are never knowledgeable, or why?)? Or smart women would not be self-deprecating among other women?

<comment><USER22> Or maybe women would respond to knowledgeable female jerks differently and perhaps more effectively than to knowledgeable male jerks?

<comment><USER48> The possibilities are endless.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER49> I have no idea to solve the helpful jerk problem but I can think of possible solutions. \- If a "Helpful jerk" was at a class at a school they would be asked to leave by the teacher. This would be the final response. If they are being that disruptive then the time it takes for you to ask them to leave would salvage the course.

\- Assign skill levels to tables. Possibly make a leader with the highest skills. (Bitboxer had this solution). If your skill level is too high then whats the point of going?

\- Ask the "Helpful jerk" to lead the class. Allow them to aid you in the course.

We can't actually solve the jerk problem but there are contingency strategies to minimize this problem. Free software should mean we have standards of conduct.

[Edited due to comment below]

<comment><USER50> Just ask the jerk to stop asking questions and making remarks. You're trying to teach a class and that involves input and interaction of all students, not just the one. As a teacher you are responsible for the learning climate in the room and you can act accordingly.

If the jerk doesn't like that, (s)he can leave.

<comment><USER51> Bingo. This kind of thing should be addressed with a "ground rules" kind of discussions that we need to hear from everyone and people should self-monitor to not take all airtime. And if that doesn't work, it's fine to say "Thanks Dave, but I'd like to hear from someone else this time" or something similar.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER52> _In one of the classic programming texts (I forget which one), the author says that very few people who learn to program should be programmers, but that he'd like to see more programming done by those of other professions. The workshop would have made him proud, as every student I talked to shared the sentiment with me that they hoped to learn Python in order to do their job more effectively, by learning to collect, sort or process data in new and more efficient ways._

To be fair, that's very nearly Python's optimal niche at the moment. Users can start seeing returns after a very modest investment of time and energy.

</comment><comment><USER53> As another anecdote I was at PyGotham yesterday. When I stopped by at the beginners track in the afternoon I counted 35 men and 4 women.

</comment><comment><USER54> I don't like this conclusion. Anyone can be a jerk, including a woman.

</comment><comment><USER55> I've been around similar buzzkills in person (been one, perhaps?), and I wonder what precisely is going on.

What is the mechanism behind smarty-pants-Dave's suppression of others' enthusiasm?

Was it that he was raising issues that weren't relevant to others' learning?

Or did something in his mannerism suggest contempt for those who knew less Python than him?

Or, did people become suddenly skeptical of the authority or competence of the instructor Dave questioned?

I second the observation that in the right environment, attention and interest would increase, as people look for ways to give annoying-Dave his comeuppance.

</comment><comment><USER56> I think I met Dave online, posing as 'Diana'. He gave himself away obsessing about technicalities of Python :)

</comment><comment><USER57> That's why we do not see more women involved with software, and I am not talking about Dave.

I am talking about both, the writer and Dave.

Why do you think most women stick to managing projects instead of being involved in Free Software?

Too much drama. Too much shit to cope with, that involves dicks and egos.

In the article we assume that Dave was a jerk (and it probably was). But, see, the author was in a comfortable position, when suddenly another man entered the room, and started to go alpha and everything turned into an ego battle.

<comment><USER58> So, are you saying that women can't or aren't willing to deal with drama or cope with shit that involves dicks and egos?

Where there's muck, there's brass. Are you saying that women have no brass?

<comment><USER57> I am saying that women are willing to deal with drama, ego and dicks when there's a motivation to cope with it.

As I see the current status of gender equality in tech, women working on a tech job are protected by their social status.

A female "junior" programmer could easily be harmed by "women do not know how to code", but with time and patience, they can go forward into the company hierarchy, and end in a position where their status protects such opinions.

In the free software world, it's more difficult to move forward in the hierarchy of a project, hence, time and patience gets consumed.

Now, take this with a grain of salt, because there's a big possibility I am wrong and just resorting to topics here.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> Very interesting story. I wonder if it would have been as effective without the male villain. The trope reinforces the moral, but it kind of beats us over the head with it.

<comment><USER22> _I wonder if it would have been as effective without the male villain. The trope reinforces the moral, but it kind of beats us over the head with it._

The author clearly stated he felt challenged by the display of dominance by another male, and wrote this blog to heal his wounded ego and display his superior abilities at leading women.

So, no, it probably wouldn't have been effective without the male villain. The competing male was a "jerk" and the damsel in distress just needed to be protected from the "jerk" by the knight in shining armour.

All-female classes taught by a single male teacher have proven to be quite effective.

</comment></comment><comment><USER59> Stuff like this is required, not because there are problems with programmers, or even with education, or men, or women, stuff like this is required because of wider problems in our society as a whole.

When most people have some level of general respect beyond clannishness, is when things like this will no longer be required. Personally, I'm not holding my breath.

</comment><comment><USER60> Yeah, because shielding someone with relationship problems his/her entire life is the way to go!

random anecdote. in my college days, there was a woman who was doing a second run at undergrad, after having a phd in marketing, and she was pretty much the know it all jerk.

</comment><comment><USER61> Given that IME most women's eyes immediately glaze over when the word "computer" is mentioned, I doubt that "our community isn't great at encouraging women contributors" is the reason why few women are in computing.

<comment><USER62> Given that all the women there had explicitly signed up to do programming, I doubt that any of them have eyes that glaze over at the mention of computers. Surprisingly for some people, there are variations among women just as there are variations among men. I'm pretty sure that most men also have no interest in computer programming. Finally: <http://xkcd.com/385/>

<comment><USER22> Which is probably why pwpwp didn't specifically refer to the self-selected women in the class, but made a general point about the industry and the ridiculous attempts to impose a completely artificial 50/50 gender ratio.

The comic could have just as easily said "one girl is good at math therefore exactly as many girls as boys are good at math."

<comment><USER47> While I agree a 50-50 gender ratio seems artificial at the moment, fact of the matter is the tech industry is becoming one of the great sources of power in society (think skynet). I think for the sake of civilization, we should try to involve women as much as we can and aim for the 50-50.

<comment><USER63> Currently, there are substantially more females than males (60/40) among people receiving college degrees: [http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2009/06/women- dominate-higher-ed...](http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2009/06/women-dominate- higher-education-at.html)

Education is the widely recognized source of power. Should we strive for 50/50 and if so, how should we achieve it?

<comment><USER27> Perhaps the kind of activities involved with programming will change as the devices we seek to program evolve?

Perhaps building applications and managing data will involve more visual tools that allow domain specific knowledge to be applied directly?</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>