Facebook Is Full of Emotional-Support Groups - <AUTHOR> https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2018/10/facebook-emotional-support-groups/572941/?single_page=true <comment><USER2> I joined a group for T2 diabetes at some point because I have a stubborn friend that doesn't want to receive proper treatment and I basically wanted to ask about available options.

Next thing I know is that Facebook started giving me ads for diabetics.

Having such an influential company know about your illnesses and sell that to advertisers or healthcare insurance agencies or credit agencies or god knows what else is frankly terrifying.

<comment><USER3> So I'm curious: have you tried removing details from your Facebook ad preferences?

On the desktop website go to: Settings | Ads | Your Interests. There is a huge ontology of various subjects that have been algorithmically assigned to you. If you remove these, I believe ads targeted to those interests should go away. I periodically just sweep them all clean so I have no interests. I get very few ads and those that I go get are completely generic. I never see anything that would seem creepily aware of who I am.

<comment><USER4> It's pretty good that they allow you to do that now, but it can't retroactively remove those interests from the personal data they've already sold about you. So it fixes the smaller issue of what ads Facebook serves, but doesn't address the larger issue of privacy.

<comment><USER5> FB doesn't sell your data though, never has!

What they sell is the ability to target you based on it. But the data never leaves FBs servers!

So if you remove the tags from your settings, advertisers won't be able to target you with them anymore

<comment><USER6> This isn't the whole truth. Facebook doesn't sell data, but Facebook's Graph API combined with microtargeting ad groups allows third party applications that the user has authorized to gather and sell sensitive data to anyone they want. In many cases, the data does leave Facebook's servers as soon as the action is taken.

You could argue this is the user's own fault, but prior to Cambridge Analytica, there was very little public understanding of what "connecting" an app to Facebook really meant among the general population.

Also, just because Facebook doesn't sell this data today does not mean they never will.

<comment><USER5> Sure, third parties can request access to the graph API by asking the user for permission.

But Facebook issnt selling that access! Access to the APIs is free.

Now users just giving any random app access is a whole different can of worms...you have the same issue on Android and iOS with permission dialogs...people worry about Amazon Alexa recording everything they say, but will give any app microphone/camera access to do just the same if the app creator is ill intended.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> I support online groups, however I'd prefer staying anonymous which simply isn't possible without faking your account on FB.

Reddit provides similar functionality and let's you stay anon. There's subreddits for pretty much any situation: alcohol abuse, drug abuse, kids growing up with narcissistic parents, spouses living in sexless relationships, etc etc. I did some research into the topic after reading this: [https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the- intersect/wp/2016/01...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the- intersect/wp/2016/01/05/the-surprising-internet-forum-some-alcoholics-are- choosing-over-aa/)

Just Google your specific situation and Reddit will probably have a support sub.

<comment><USER8> Reddit is usually a crapshoot of quality.

Maybe someone will have something for Y Combinator (et al) soon, that's more of a targeted platform for these types of things. Reddit and Facebook both suck at this.

<comment><USER9> If there isn't a community on Reddit for something, what are the odds people are going to flock to a new platform? The quality issue is because these groups are generally peer-organized and some groups have better organizers. But like, what is technology going to do to make a better Reddit for people with depression, transgender people, people whose partners have cheated on them and people with incredibly rare medical conditions? Those are disparate groups that only have the common thread of needing a support group as far as I can tell.

<comment><USER8> If a platform is promoted by physician groups or by insurers, it may take off. That would be far better than some of the utter crap on Reddit. A lot is happening in the medical space, with companies like Oscar and appointment scheduling apps. This is just waiting to spring open.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> I'd never seen beyond the login screen of Facebook until a site I run started getting sporadic bursts of traffic from there, so I ventured in to try and find the links. I was stunned and devastated to discover how many thriving little communities there were in this niche area (local archeology), it's everything the open web was supposed to be but it has been walled off, completely invisible to outsiders, all for the benefit of one corporation and its advertising customers.

<comment><USER11> Economies of scale, I guess? Easier to host there than to have dedicated hobbyists support the technology needs.

<comment><USER12> Ning showed some promise in being able to provide that. It took off like a rocket initially. Maybe they benefited from launching in 2005, prior to Facebook reaching any meaningful saturation (consuming all the oxygen in the segment).

When they figured out the financial side of it wasn't going to work (having raised $119m in VC), they essentially destroyed the old service in 2010, suspended the free offering, and fired half the company. I've always wondered if the original concept of Ning could have in fact succeeded, if they hadn't built the company using the typical boom or die, drive the venture capital into the wall model.

I think there's still something big there, if someone can figure out how to do it very, very inexpensively and keep it open. Minimalize the commercial abuse, build in strong spam and trust controls.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> I run a facebook breakup support group for men.

About half of the people that request to join the group discover the group themselves on facebook.

For me as a website owner (rapidbreakuprecovery.com) the group has been a convenient way to offer a forum-like functionality without any of the overhead involved with running forum software.

I suspect facebook users have come to expect that these types of groups exist and they're typing things such as "breakup" in the group search field.

There other breakup support groups that are routinely recommended in the sidebar as well as a support group specifically for divorced dads. So it seems that facebook's scale is allowing smaller niche communities to exist where they would not have existed before.

From a usability perspective it's not great. It's easy to set up and it's easy to get members, but I would happily switch to something more discrete, and that's a better fit for support group dynamics (interesting idea by sodosopa).

</comment><comment><USER14> If any Facebook employees are reading this, there's a really annoying "feature" that will show a list of suggested friends to add to a private group. I've accidentally added people to private groups by accidentally clicking a single time while scrolling.

Imagine being in an AA group or HIV support group and adding your coworker to it on accident.

Please change this.

<comment><USER15> It's really easy to complain about this, but it's very hard to actually come up with a solution.

Did you have any suggestions how cases like this could be detected?

<comment><USER16> > it's very hard to actually come up with a solution

Just not have "suggested friends"? I've never gotten anything out of that feature, and I imagine it provides little actual value to anyone since if someone was actually a friend or even an acquaintance, they'd have that person in mind when adding friends on Facebook.

<comment><USER17> Or even have an ability for an admin of a group to turn off "suggested friends" for that group alone. Ah, but that's not just a new boolean field in the model, a database migration, GraphQL dependency, and an if statement in the template... but also a committee meeting to clear the text used in the admin's interface, translations to all languages used by Facebook (you wouldn't want Facebook to be seen as causing problems for only non-English- speaking HIV support groups, right?), additional overhead to track, potentially stepping on the toes of the design team that maintains the mockups for that admin interface. It would need to be someone's passion project, and even that might not be enough. And perhaps the people at Facebook who know the problem firsthand from being in AA or HIV support groups don't want to draw attention to why they're justifying this feature, for obvious reasons.

This is why we can't have nice things.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> "For example, according to Lewis, the algorithm might keep showing a post whose question has been answered. And it might deprioritize posts from new members that don't get much engagement—ensuring they get even less engagement in a form of algorithmic ghosting."

Essentially the flaw with facebook's entire system of selecting posts. When I recently posted on Facebook to my 2000 friends, the only people to react were mother and aunt. I am actually not that much of a loser, but you'd never know from my Facebook page.

FB have made Instagram the same way and I spent days looking at posts my friends made 4 days ago while not seeing their newest posts (this is especially annoying at conventions). I have a hard time believing that Facebook actually pays hundreds of engineers above market salaries to realize this sad customer abuse. It's a serious waste of the potential of the Internet.

As far of the rest of the article, yes, Facebook has taken over the independent web forum. And yes, their software is inadequate (the usual total lack of features or confusing UI) but their reach is incomparable.

<comment><USER19> How would you adjust the algorithm? Maybe surface new posts with some degree of stochasticity, like what HN does? Sorting by Hot on Reddit feels pretty similar to FB, and sorting strictly chronologically doesn't scale (just sort by New on HN or Reddit - most posts just aren't very interesting to most people).

<comment><USER18> It's complex and difficult to say since the algorithm is secret. I could list flaws or ways I think it should work differently.

I think it's been tainted by FB's business models. I will check back when I have more time to write.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> I feel like having to use your real name and identity and hope that Facebook doesn't fuck up is a really bad requirement for secret support groups.

</comment><comment><USER21> Facebook is one of the biggest sites in the world. You could replace 'emotional support' with anything and it'd be full of those groups.

<comment><USER22> Sure, but then what would "journalists" at theatlantic have to write about?

Journalism today is all about writing nonsense and throwing on Facebook, Google or Trump on the headline for views.

</comment></comment><comment> village-idiot Anecdote, but it sure seems to me that the need for emotional support groups has skyrocketed within my lifetime. I'm sure all the members of these groups are legitimate (I'm not making a "snowflake" argument) but what in the hell is going on?

<comment><USER23> Has the need really skyrocketed though? Or has the use of them just become more normalized (and perhaps more convenient thanks to the internet), and less people feel the need to just "suck it up" and deal with their problems alone?

<comment><USER24> Yeah, my stereotype of the distant past which I didn't live in - say, up to the 1980's - is that it was considered uncool to talk about your problems to strangers in a constructive way.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> Maybe I'm just too paranoid, but first thing that popped into my head is there are a lot of predators out there looking for weak prey. Maybe I need a support group to help with that :)

<comment><USER26> There are. Predators use domestic violence, sexual abuse and other abuse- related online support groups to groom vulnerable people. Strict moderation is absolutely necessary in these communities.

</comment></comment><comment><USER27> Secrets are a pre-21st century idea.</comment>


Did rookie robinhood trader commit suicide because of bad UI? - <AUTHOR> https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/18/young-trader-dies-by-suicide-after-thinking-he-racked-up-big-losses-on-robinhood.html <comment><AUTHOR> OP here: Not meaning to be inflammatory by this post, but I can't help thinking part of the blame for this should be on Robinhood.</comment>


Ask HN: What are the Madrid and Barcelona tech scenes like? - <AUTHOR> A similar topic was posted back in 2017, but I'm sure things have changed since then: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14386607
I'll be moving to Madrid for a year for non-career related reasons. I hold an EU passport and I'm fluent in both English and Spanish. My background is in data analytics (Python/R/Stata) rather than software development. That said, I would like work in tech while in Spain.
My questions: How are the Madrid and Barcelona tech sectors nowadays? What types of work are available? How are salaries? Are there any unintuitive factors to consider? <comment><USER2> I lived in both Madrid and Barcelona for about a year each. They're very different cities.

Madrid:

I'd say this is more of a working city and has less of the mad tourism / party scene. There's a good tech scene present, with plenty of meetups and an increasing number of startups. Things like Google Campus are great spots to meet like-minded people, and there is plenty of work available but you may end up in more of an 'enterprise' style place.

Barcelona:

Very, very popular with tourists. This can be a downside depending on how much you like your peace and quiet. I lived in one of the busiest places for tourism (El Born) so I ended up quite used to the chaos.

With that said, it's an extremely international city and that shows in the amount of startups, co-working spaces, and meetups. It has more of a 'tech' vibe to it. There are some downsides however in that a lot of people there are quite transient, so it can be harder to make meaningful connections.

In terms of language, since you're fluent in English and Spanish then you'll have no problem in either city. Madrid is definitely more Spanish focused, whereas in Barcelona I ended up speaking more English and French than I did Spanish weirdly. It just depends on the crowd you're in.

Happy to discuss more, or put you in touch with people / recommend places if you want. My email is in my bio.

</comment><comment><USER3> Hi,

I don't think it changed much since last time. Here's what I had to say ([https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14386943](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14386943)):

Tech salaries in Spain are not higher than for other sectors, as the tech sector is still very small, and most jobs are inside "cost centers" of other companies (banks, telcos, etc.). A typical (good!) staring salary would be 25k for Madrid or 20k for Barcelona. In contrast you'd see 40k in Paris or Berlin for a similar job. It's typical to have 14 monthly payments (with extra payment in July/August and Christmas), so that ends up being around 1200 euros net per month.

Quality of life is great, though, and not so expensive. The Lancet recently [1] put Spain's healthcare as 8th in the world, food is great, the social scene is very open to foreigners, climate is better than in northern europe, etc.

The worse part of your expenses in either Madrid or Barcelona will be renting an apartment, as prices are rising quickly (after the financial crisis, housing plummeted, so construction stopped. But now everyone with some extra cash is buying apartments for renting them, and there's extra pressure to make them a worthwhile investment).

Spain's economy is divided in tiny companies (PYMES), and huge companies. We lack a lot of medium sized companies such as the german mittelstands, and it shows on job mobility and opportunities. Compounding this with a small tech scene, it might be hard to find a job opportunity. But tech is growing quickly, as others have mentioned.

If you are functional in spanish, it shouldn't be a problem, but mind that spaniards are not so used to working with other nationalities, so you will be somewhat "exotic" and you will get a mild joke from time to time. You might find some "inferiority complex", particularly if you are german/french/american, as Spain has traditionally looked abroad for innovation and modernity references (famously pictured by Unamuno and his "Que inventen ellos" quote [2]).

The contracting area is dismal. Most of autonomos are either micropymes or false autonomos, actually working for one huge company, with total dependence and a huge risk, without the normal employee rights and securities. Spain is not accustomed to paying fair prices for contract work. And outside the tech scene, there will be often requests for working for free (typical for design or copy work), or without paying taxes ("cobrar en B").

On the Madrid vs. Barcelona topic I'm of course biased, being from Madrid, but I find that foreigners are initially much more familiar with Barcelona, and they overlook Madrid. Madrid is great! And more objectively: it is bigger, with more opportunities, without language problems (catalan might be an issue from time to time, mostly if you are still learning spanish, but you will also find people from time to time that refuse to speak spanish for political reasons), and with less tourists yet more foreigners (you will not be treated so much as a cash-cow tourist, as some of my friends have suffered a couple of times in Barcelona).

Overall, I'd say you can live very well in Spain, but it is not the place if you seek big career opportunities. Of course all of this is a HUGE simplification, and you can find excellent opportunities in Spain, and shitty opportunities elsewhere. I personally have a lot of french friends working in Madrid with excellent jobs and adamant on staying for the rest of their lives. And all of what I said is improving quickly; Spain got a really big economic push when entering the euro, and although the crisis stuck VERY hard, we are recovering and accelerating a lot!

[1] [http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-67...](http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-67..). [2] (spanish) [https://blogs.iadb.org/puntossobrelai/2016/06/06/que- invente...](https://blogs.iadb.org/puntossobrelai/2016/06/06/que-invente..).

<comment><USER4> Refusing to speak spanish is a myth. It's much more likely that you will not ever be able to learn catalan becasue poeple will always switch to spanish the moment they see you are a foreigner. Whether you want to learn spanish or catalan, both or none is up to you. You can live a normal live speaking english only in both places. Have plenty of friends that never got to learn the language beyond some basic pick-up lines and food-related sentences.

The salaries figures, 25K and 20K seem extremely low to me. Truth be told, I've been abroad for the last 6 years, but back then, no way we could hire anyone decent for less than 35K (Barcelona).

I would advise that you are going the earn 20K/25K, do not try to go unless you really want to survive like a student :-) Do not see how are you going to pay the rent with that salary, check prices online.

Both cities are very nice and you will enjoy them both.

Last time I lived there, Barcelona was more start-upy than Madrid, and Madrid more corporate than Barcelona. In any case, they both have plenty of tech, I would not worry about that. You will enjoy your time in either city, if you earn enough of course. Make sure of that first.

<comment><USER5> According to [1] even Barcelona football (soccer) players were pushed to learn Catalan, even experiencing racism for wanting to speak Spanish.

[1] [https://app.football- espana.net/?referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww....](https://app.football- espana.net/?referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.football- espana.net%2F82143%2Fbarcelona-dressing-room-was-racist-emmanuel- petit#article/footballespana-82143)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> I used to live and work in Madrid (for a non-tech job), although I have been a programmer for some years now.

While in Madrid I met a number of software engineers/IT professionals. I think Madrid is a decent spot for finding tech work.

Mind you, my family is from Asturias, and the tech scene, I believe, isn't great there. I also don't know how Barcelona is.

If you're looking at Madrid, I think you'll be OK.</comment>


Nuclear Test Films Declassified and Uploaded - <AUTHOR> https://paleofuture.gizmodo.com/62-rare-nuclear-test-films-have-been-declassified-and-u-1821302584 <comment> r-bryan I was a child of the 1950's. Only 50 miles south of New York City, we little grade school kids were routinely drilled in cowering under our desks in case of a nuclear attack. Every time I heard an airplane, I was afraid it was going to drop bombs. Popular Science ran features about how to build your own fallout shelter, and how Dad could prepare his family for the coming nuclear apocalypse. The understated, tragic horror of _On the Beach_ was complemented but not countered by the mordant humor of Dr. Strangelove.

The clips here don't have the bizarre choreographic beauty of the Dr. Strangelove finale, but they bring back the all too keen anxiety and existential terror of being powerless, while deranged world leaders measure each other's manhood by "mine's bigger than yours." Fine, you proved that yours is big enough, it doesn't really matter whose is bigger any more than whose hair is dumber, now can we _please_ return to sanity?

<comment><USER2> Born in the late 60s, so teenager in the 80s in the UK. I recall that exact same fear of every passing aeroplane. In our case the cultural equivalents of OTB and DS were Threads and The Day After, and the Protect and Survive announcements that Frankie Goes To Hollywood sampled in Two Tribes.

I find it interesting that the terror of the global thermonuclear war seems to have disappeared from the popular psyche, even though exactly the same weapons are still there ready.

<comment><USER3> What does OTB and DS mean in this context?

<comment><USER4> I guess OTB = "On The Beach" and DS = "Doctor Strangelove"

<comment><USER2> Thanks - sorry, I should have just put the full names.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> There's a big scramble in the Department of Energy to preserve (and declassify, where possible) a lot of the data from the days of atmospheric testing, which is literally rotting. It's some of the only real world data we have on e.g. fallout dispersal, which is important for building the simulations that would allow emergency workers to safely operate in the aftermath of a nuclear attack. It's also of interest for nuclear forensics, which is highly relevant at the moment with the situation in Korea.

</comment><comment><USER6> Btw, here is one of recently declassified soviet videos about first nuclear bomb test.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4BIDzZygIq0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4BIDzZygIq0)

It's a kind of report, explaining experiment setup, equipment, test process and results. Russian, no subtitles but picture itself explains a lot.

<comment><USER7> There are suffering animals in this video, if anyone cares to avoid that.

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> If you're ever in Vegas, the National Atomic Testing Museum is a great place to go: [http://nationalatomictestingmuseum.org/](http://nationalatomictestingmuseum.org/)

<comment><USER9> And if you are in Hiroshima, the museum dedicated to the atomic bombing of the city is worth visiting. Makes you really sad.

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> Direct link to the videos: [https://www.youtube.com/user/LivermoreLab/videos](https://www.youtube.com/user/LivermoreLab/videos)

</comment><comment><USER11> my favorite detail is the evaporating (almost explosively converted into plasma by the sheer intensity of the energy being radiated) tower that the weapon was placed on top of and the cables which were keeping the tower vertical - the 5 spikes at the belly of the fireball

[https://youtu.be/woR7j72zE0U?t=9](https://youtu.be/woR7j72zE0U?t=9)

<comment><USER12> I feel conflicted that these explosions are so beautiful to watch, and I always wanted to see one in the sky where the ground didn't interfere with the cloud. Now I have but I'm not really satisfied because it references a possible destruction of humanity?

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n3uane1UT8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n3uane1UT8)

<comment><USER11> >it references a possible destruction of humanity?

imagine a guy who has a gun in a drawer at home and who smokes 2 packs a day. What is going to kill him with pretty high probability? The same way the humanity is with nuclear weapons and climate change.

<comment><USER13> How is climate change anywhere near as dangerous as a nuclear war?

<comment><USER14> Climate change is already happening, and well on its way to being both catastrophic and irreversible.

<comment><USER13> So? What's the worse that can happen? Some cities slowly get flooded and some storms become more frequent? The worst case of nuclear war is all cities get destroyed and humanity is sent back to the stone age. They aren't even comparable.

<comment><USER11> Roman Empire closed shop when grain production in Mediterranean basin became no more due to the warming up of the climate. At the same time the rest of Europe warmed up and dried up a bit so it stopped being a cold swamp, and it allowed for the European civilization to get started. During the peak of heat 1000 years ago the Mediterranean basin belonged to Caliphates - the world leading, at the time, in many respects civilization which came out of dry and hot Arabia and which was significantly pushed back by Europeans during the next several hundreds years of cooling down. That cooling down became Little Ice Age during which we have Black Death, famines, etc. with European population getting decimated from time to time. Whole human history is basically history of changing climate and its effects upon empires/cultures/civilizations. Viking Age. Mongols ruling all the connected space covered with grasses - ie. where cavalry is unstoppable - during period with just enough rain/snow for such a huge space to balance between swamp and desert, and the period of such delicate balance was naturally relatively short with Pan-Mongolia splitting relatively quickly into pieces separated by deserts/rivers/swamps. Or check out the Late Bronze Age collapse for example.

The point here is that couple degrees change over several centuries have very profound effect upon human civilization. These days we've stepped into the territory of couple degrees (and probably more with the process having significant chances to become runaway) over several decades. That is bound to result in dramatic changes.

One can try to argue that our civilization today is well insulated from climate changes. And that one will be wrong. Just consider the very recent examples. 198x were the coldest point in the 80 years cycle and that resulted in low grain yields in USSR. It coincided with low oil prices thus resulting in food shortages in USSR, and as result the USSR just disappeared as the hungry people couldn't care less. The same thing with Arab Spring which was triggered by the drought and resulting food shortages : [https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/climate-change- an...](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/climate-change-and-rising- food-prices-heightened-arab-spring/)

So :

1\. human civilization is very vulnerable to climate change effects and

2\. the climate change, more severe than the ones which have destroyed civilizations in the past, is happening now orders of magnitude faster than those climate changes of the past.

<comment><USER13> Your theories on the rise and fall of civilizations is pretty speculative. I've heard dozens of theories of why Rome fell. Everyone and their brother has a pet theory.

But even if you are right, it's irrelevant. Yeah, ancient civilizations were sensitive to famines and climate. We are way past that. Some of our biggest cities are in regions that were near uninhabitable before air conditioning or insecticides. Our modern irrigiation technology give us the ability to grow crops in areas that used to be desolate. We produce several times more food than we actually need. If the absolute worst case scenarios of climate change happened, our civilization would easily continue.

<comment><USER11> > it's irrelevant. Yeah, ancient civilizations were sensitive to famines and > climate. We are way past that. Some of our biggest cities are in regions > that were near uninhabitable before air conditioning or insecticides. Our > modern irrigiation technology give us the ability to grow crops in areas > that used to be desolate. We produce several times more food than we > actually need. If the absolute worst case scenarios of climate change > happened, our civilization would easily continue. Our modern irrigiation > technology give us the ability to grow crops in areas that used to be > desolate. We produce several times more food than we actually need. If the > absolute worst case scenarios of climate change happened, our civilization > would easily continue.

tell those triumphal words of our civilization glory to the 800M people today who is officially live in hunger. Or to the next couple of billions who will quickly find themselves deep in the extreme poverty/hunger if economy gets noticeably worse, food price increase and/or some shortage of food/water/etc. happens.

I suppose that you, like me, is in the top 5-10% of the global Pareto distribution of our civilization goodies, and even if there are severe food/water/energy/etc. shortage and/or food prices increase even 10 times, we'd still not be going to bed hungry even though we'd possibly have to give up some of the less necessary things. So from our point of view "civilization would easily continue". Not so to the majority of the world population though.

<comment><USER13> First of all, you are arguing against a straw man. I never said "climate change wouldn't be bad". I said it wouldn't be anywhere near as bad as a full nuclear war. You can't even compare the two.

Anyway I'm sick of this meme that we should care about everything that happens to the third world. Look at Africa. Their population is growing exponentially. It's already far above of any reasonably sustainable size. And their economy is actually deindustrializing. They are going to suffer no matter what happens. Climate change is the least of their problems. And there is nothing we can do the help them.

<comment><USER11> >First of all, you are arguing against a straw man. I never said "climate change wouldn't be bad". I said it wouldn't be anywhere near as bad as a full nuclear war. You can't even compare the two.

my point is that nuclear war is a straw man while climate change presents clear and imminent planet-scale danger to our civilization.

>Anyway I'm sick of this meme that we should care about everything that happens to the third world.

Well, beside that caring about weak and less fortunate is our normal human trait, we brought the climate change upon the whole planet, so we should bear at least some responsibility. Anyway, hunger and poverty isn't limited to the third world - [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunger_in_the_United_States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunger_in_the_United_States)

"Research from the USDA found that 14.9% of American households were food insecure during at least some of 2011, with 5.7% suffering from very low food security.[3] Journalists and charity workers have reported further increased demand for emergency food aid during 2012 and 2013."

>Look at Africa. Their population is growing exponentially. It's already far above of any reasonably sustainable size.

Africa is big and with a lot of resources. It can sustain much bigger population.

>And their economy is actually deindustrializing.

there is a bunch of very different countries with very different population, economy, society. Some countries have recently or currently have civil wars and as result are in chaos. The same is Syria which was pretty highly developed country just 7 years ago.

>Climate change is the least of their problems.

it is one of the major causes of the current (Arab Spring) and future civil (and may be between states) wars which would wreak havoc upon the involved countries/societies.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> One fun thing about photos of early nuclear tests is that the US accidentally published enough info that revealed the top-secret yield of the Trinity test bomb in photographs in Life Magazine: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_weapon_yield#Calculati...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_weapon_yield#Calculating_yields_and_controversy) \-- all you need is dimensional analysis. Whoops.

</comment><comment><USER16> "Let's just hope we don't see a new atomspheric nuclear explosion (test or otherwise) before they're done with their preservation project.".... fat chance. North Korea will do an atmospheric nuclear test in the next six months, if not three .

</comment><comment><USER17> Do we have high def color footage of nuclear explosions? That would be cool.

<comment><USER18> Check out the documentary "Trinity and Beyond" \- it has a lot of quality footage, much of it colour.

<comment><USER19> There's ten minutes on youtube here - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvnWXf6UZXY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvnWXf6UZXY). Captures the essence of the film nicely. There's this weird 'end of the world' kind of undertone to the film. Genuinely scary stuff.

<comment><USER20> This is some absolutely incredible footage. I had no idea there was color footage of the actual bombings in Japan.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> Well, like TFA says hopefully we won't have any _new_ videos of above-ground nuke "tests".

</comment><comment><USER22> Hard to really say the difference between a nuclear war and the U.S., Russia, UK France and others setting off vast numbers of atmospheric nuclear weapons in the 20th century.

<comment><USER23> Here's a realistic look at what an all-out nuclear war in 1988 might have been like: [http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/nuclear/nuclearwar1.html](http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/nuclear/nuclearwar1.html)

Spoiler alert: about four fifths of Americans end up dead, and about one third of all humans on Earth. The survivors contend with famine and plague on a scale never before seen. Most of the world's industrial capacity is destroyed.

I find it fairly easy to distinguish that scenario from the world we live in, personally.

<comment><USER24> That's pretty fake and assumes a lot of capabilities the USSR never had. Satellite mounted nuclear weapons, anti-ICBM missiles, ground to space lasers, "killer satellites", etc never existed. I think the writer enjoys pro-USSR fantasies.

<comment><USER23> The Soviets had and the Russians still have anti-ICBM missiles: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A-35_anti- ballistic_missile_sy...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A-35_anti- ballistic_missile_system) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A-135_anti- ballistic_missile_s...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A-135_anti- ballistic_missile_system)

Killer satellites were developed starting in the 60s and deployed operationally in 1991. It seems reasonable to think that some pre-operational capability might have existed in 1988: [http://www.russianspaceweb.com/is.html](http://www.russianspaceweb.com/is.html)

I'm not sure where the nuke satellites and lasers came from.

When it comes to answering the question of "what would a post-war world look like?" the only significant system out of these is the nuke satellites causing an EMP. That could (and probably would) have been just as easily done with standard ICBMs so I don't think it changes the answer very much.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Possible liquid ocean discovered on Pluto. Could it be Pluto Water? - <AUTHOR> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pluto_Water <comment><AUTHOR> Also [https://www.newscientist.com/article/2094848-pluto-must- have...](https://www.newscientist.com/article/2094848-pluto-must-have-liquid- ocean-or-itd-look-like-an-overripe-peach/)</comment>


Dutch rewilding experiment sparks backlash as thousands of animals starve - <AUTHOR> https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/apr/27/dutch-rewilding-experiment-backfires-as-thousands-of-animals-starve <comment><USER2> The problem seems to be that this area isn't truly wild, not even after the rewilding. The big predators are gone, along with some herbivores, and it's throwing everything out of whack. What happened is only slightly less predictable than if you let a bunch of cows loose.</comment>


When your dream of being featured on ProductHunt becomes a nightmare - <AUTHOR> I've been reading a lot of articles about how to get featured properly on ProductHunt and I had big plans for a proper planned submission of my project, which I believe it's a very interesting one for the entrepreneurs community. I know that we only have one shot on Product Hunt so I wanted to be prepared. I have seen many mediocre sites or products to reach more than 1000 votes just because of the hunter and the timing. So I expected mine to reach a decent amount of votes and attention.
Unfortunately someone (I believe with the best intention), who is not popular at all in PH, submitted yesterday night my side project, probably the worst time of the week,  (http://www.transparentstartups.com/) without notifying me at. In fact when I realised my website was hunted it was too late and lost in the PH secondly list with just 1 vote.
In addition, my project's profile (https://www.producthunt.com/tech/transparent-startups) is incomplete and inaccurate. Sad thing is I'm the maker but I don't have access in PH to amend my own startup profile to at least leave it in a decent state and explain what the site is about. I've tried to contact them via email but I haven't receive any reply yet.
Right now I feel very disappointed about how ProductHunt works, although I hope the PH team will help me to fix this. As the maker of Transparent Startups I am, I truly believe in transparency and it seems to me there is something not very transparent at PH, I'm afraid.
Have you had similar experiences with PH? Is PH shot over for my website? <comment><USER2> Sorry you had a less than desirable experience. However, rather than writing this HN post, did you quickly make the changes on your site so it displays the most relevant information you wished would have been displayed on PH? Did you test those changes? Did you harness that PH data that allows you to continue refining what the exact problem it is you are solving for your users? There are two key learnings here:

1\. Use this experience as a learning opportunity. If you are pissed because you didn't reach number 1, I think you are thinking about all the wrongs things PH is meant to represent. If anything, PH purposefully kicks your startup into hyperdrive once you are hunted - regardless to you being ready or not. This is a good thing. It means you no longer can afford to drag your feet.

2\. Iterate, test, iterate, test. You shouldn't be focused on pushing out the perfect product right out of the gate. I suggest you read a bit about startups here: [https://gigster.com/resources/pg- essays?ref=producthunt](https://gigster.com/resources/pg- essays?ref=producthunt)

<comment><AUTHOR> Hey, thanks for your comment.

I'm working on improving my site day by day. Thanks for the link, I'll read it all and I'll keep improving my project.

However, given the circumstances and how PH works, there is nothing I could change on my site that would change what happened with PH, nothing.

Everything that should have done for a proper hunt, was out of my control. I couldn't do anything at all because I was not notified about the submission. I couldn't tell the hunter to not submit just before the weekend when nobody is there to vote. I cannot add nice screenshots on my profile, like most of the good PH profile have, because I don't have access. I cannot add a proper comment explaining what's the project about. I cannot add the correct Tags and remove the SALES one. I cannot even assign myself as the Maker. Come on, is that fair?</comment></comment>


Digg v1: Betaworks Flushes Seven Years of Internet History Down the Toilet - <AUTHOR> http://blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2012/08/digg_betaworks.php <comment><USER2> From the FAQ on the page:

What about my data from the old Digg?

We believe that users own their data. We're working on a system that will extract all user data from the old Digg infrastructure. In August we're launching an archive website for users of the old Digg to find, browse, and share a history of their submissions, diggs, and comments.

If you'd like to be notified when your data will be available, just enter your email address here[1]. Then stay tuned, and let us know if you have any questions.

[1]<http://digg.com/archive>

<comment><USER3> Meh, I was on Digg from 2005-2007, I didn't delete my account because I thought some day I might want to look through my old stuff.

I went to take a look sometime around 2010, and they had nothing of mine. No comments, no submissions, nothing. Probably there somewhere, but nowhere accessible to me.

I wouldn't hold my breath on getting anything back.

Not to mention, an archive website still doesn't help anyone following links that have been placed on the internet over the last decade.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> The spammers and the clowns paid to spam digg for SEO lost all their work. That's quite possibly the best part of the new digg, especially if they can be kept out.

<comment><USER5> Yeah, I find the "loss" of the useless former data to be a positive, not a negative. If their site was socially "corrupted" by astroturfers and paid Diggers, starting over is the best way to create a new culture.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> You don't suppose that SFWeekly is annoyed at the SEO _they_ lost, are they?

[http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:pmMowDa...](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:pmMowDad_EcJ:digg.com/sfweekly+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us)

</comment><comment><USER7> From a TechCrunch article published yesterday, following an interview with John Borthwick:

"According to Borthwick, it would have cost "hundreds of thousands per month" to keep the site running on its old platform. Even though the site was state- of-the-art just a few years ago, most of the infrastructure would be considered legacy technology by a modern startup."

That's why. SF Weekly, and the author Keith Plocek, obviously did not reach out to Betaworks before running this article.

<comment><USER8> Would it not have been possible to "cement" those pages into static HTML and throw them up on a CDN? The only thing "digg" about Digg now is the domain name. Why they bought that and then threw out the baby with the bathwater is beyond me.

<comment><USER9> For what it's worth something like this is still probably possible. I'd be shocked if any sensible person would get access to Digg's dataset only to delete it immediately thereafter. While they've replaced the site with something else to get the ball rolling, I don't get the impression that they're crass and/or ignorant enough to just destroy the whole thing, so we may yet see an archive of the old Digg.

Also, I think the old Digg demonstrated that it didn't really care much about the data anyway.

<comment><USER10> Considering all the popular reposts on Reddit, they could use the database of already submitted Digg content to populate the daily stream of links when not much else is happening.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> Oh no, I always begin my morning with digged articles from 2007. Actually, no I don't. So, who cares, apart from SEO guys?

And I love how they say: _What would've been the harm in leaving those archives up? It's not that complicated._

Of course it's not complicated, it's actually fun! What can be better than starting a new project with importing old and unwanted records from a screwed up database?

<comment><USER12> Mainly, it's always bad form to delete user's data. But also, this stuff is useful to historians. For example, here's a site that just posts interesting things about the Geocities archive (which Yahoo deleted but some archivists mostly mirrored first). <http://contemporary-home- computing.org/1tb/archives/2559>

<comment><USER11> They didn't delete users' data, they preferred not to import it into their brand new product.

They will also allow users to download data later: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4325004>

As for historians, the content is still out there. Digg doesn't host content, it "hosts" links.

<comment><USER12> Content including what links they liked, when. Possibly other data but I didn't use digg so I don't know specifically.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> Didn't Digg use rel="nofollow" on submitted stories? And if so, wouldn't that mean that links from Digg would have zero SEO value?

<comment><USER14> Officially according to bing/google nofollow links don't pass SEO value. However there is quite a bit of evidence that they do in fact have value.

<comment><USER15> They have end-user value for human eyes and referal traffic. But none in terms of "link juice".

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> Further proving that no matter what you do, someone on the internet will write an article complaining about it.

</comment><comment><USER17> Digg has no SEO value. The content they have from the past is rarely relevant - so they have no evergreen content. Unlike sites like Quora or even Yahoo Answers where content written in the past still has value right now.

</comment><comment><USER18> I realised how much sense this makes for BetaWorks, they have so much social data from bitly and knowledge in the space. They can make a real consumer end to bitly as well as the enterprise tools they're building.

They can make a semi-curated and semi-data driven broadsheet on any topic. It's a beautiful interface for a V1 and I think if they use all of the data from bitly it could be powerful. They can get a grasp of how many people are actually clicking on links, how many social shares and upvotes there are.

Essentially a much better version of Flipboard that is data driven.

There's nothing wrong with making a version of Digg that embraces social elements but Digg 4 was not it. It was trying to turn Digg into a Twitter clone.

</comment><comment><USER19> Forgive me as I did not follow the original story very closely, but what exactly did Betaworks buy? Are they even the owners of the old data, or did they just buy the brand and code, whereas perhaps LinkedIn now owns the actual data?

<comment><USER20> They aren't even using the code.

So it's basically a domain, page rank and traffic.

</comment></comment><comment><USER21> When you see shit, you flush it. Kudos to Betaworks for making such a bold move and actively working to make digg relevant again.

</comment><comment><USER22> Obviously lots of people in the comment here are far from the point made in this article.

Digg v1 not redirecting and keeping old content is removing all of its presence on google. How much was the % of digg's traffic coming form google? I would say more than 50%.

They still have a few day until the next google dance, but they're basically screwed now.

<comment><USER23> IIRC about 40% of diggs' traffic came from Google. But when they changed their algo ~2 years ago to favor original/source content, our overall traffic dropped by about 30%. The value of that traffic in advertising dollars was significant, but in terms of participation in the community and growth of the site, it was almost nothing. The new site isn't ad based, so I don't think anyone really cares.

</comment></comment><comment><USER24> They seem to be implying that Digg was too big to fail, from an SEO standpoint.

"But it only takes a couple clicks to realize all of the archives are gone. All of them. All of the Ron Paul idolatry. All of the ASCII facepalms. All of the linkbait. Gone."

That should be the problem, but obviously that content won't be missed.

</comment><comment><USER25> 1\. Kill Digg

2\. Wait for half the internet to write about it (with new links to digg.com)

3\. Put back the old Digg content

4\. Wait for half the internet to write about it (with new links to digg.com)

5\. Nasdaq Listing/Internet domination???

This strategy should work for all social-media startups. No guarantee of profits though...

</comment><comment><USER26> You cannot come up for air without pissing someone off. Digg's carcass was festering the internet. I'm glad to see it being taken in another direction.

</comment><comment><USER17> 1\. Scrape all of Digg before they flush their history 2\. Buy old domains and put the content there 3\. Put ads all over. 4\. ??? 5\. Profit.

<comment><USER27> 4\. Get sued for copyright infringement

5\. Profit [for the lawyers].

<comment><USER17> it's mostly user generated content. They don't own any of it.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER28> "Betaworks Flushes Seven Years of Internet History Down the Toilet"

And not a single f __k was given.</comment>


David Davis: A Brexit Economic Strategy for Britain - <AUTHOR> http://www.conservativehome.com/platform/2016/07/david-davis-trade-deals-tax-cuts-and-taking-time-before-triggering-article-50-a-brexit-economic-strategy-for-britain.html <comment><USER2> From the comments:

 _a lot of small businesses think that leaving the EU will lead to a reduction in 'red tape' They are wrong In anything other than a EEA (Norway style) arrangement they will have to deal with much more red tape in trading with our largest market by far - Europe Customs forms. Conformity assessment. Compliance testing. the cost of doing business with our largest partner will escalate enormously_

</comment><comment><USER3> > And it all depends far too much on domestic demand, which even after 2008 is > excessively funded by consumer credit. This is unsustainable in the long > run. > So we need to shift our economy towards a more export-led growth > strategy, based on higher productivity employment. Fortunately, this will > prove eminently possible as a part of a Brexit-based economic strategy. > Indeed, far from being the risky option that many have claimed, Brexit gives > us many tools to deal with the very serious economic challenges that the > country will face in the coming decades.

I completely agree with this, and I would go further and throw in some manufacturing in there.

This strategy is not dependant on Brexit. Britain has been pursuing a service- led, non-manufacturing strategy for the last 20-30 years which, I believe, is a mistake. Real economic prosperity comes from making or growing things. Service economies are like building software based on someone else's platform, you benefit from the platforms reach but cede control.</comment>


The US is targeting 'burner phones' in the wake of Europe's terrorist attacks - <AUTHOR> http://www.businessinsider.com/us-targets-burner-phones-after-brussels-attack-2016-3?amp <comment><USER2> It won't help. The attacks in Europe were apparently coordinated without any encryption on legally obtained mobile telephones so tightening the rules and requiring ID for them won't do more than make the attackers a little more circumspect.</comment>


Ask HN: What is the etiquette for posting a job opening here? - <AUTHOR>

I'm hiring for a position on my team, and I bet there's an HN reader or two out there that would fit the bill. Is there any accepted etiquette for posting jobs on HN? <comment><USER2> Post it. With your contact details in your profile, anyone interested can contact you. Everyone else can ignore you.

However, that will mean your post doesn't get voted up, and therefore doesn't get seen except for the 30 minutes or 90 minutes that it's on the "new" page.

For visibility, you might want to write something interesting about the job so people think the post itself is of value, and then add the opening as an addendum.

If it's not spam, if it has something of interest, and if it adds value, no one will mind.

Probably.

</comment><comment><USER3> ask for forgiveness, not for permission. If it isn't interesting people will not vote it, and if it is inappropriate the poeple will let you know.

</comment><comment><USER4> There's normally a monthly hiring thread you can post to

<comment><USER5> One might answer, create a "AskHN: who's hiring?" thread using a puppet account and post your job opening there.

But I'm sure that would be frowned on ;0)></comment></comment>


Show HN: Privilege Escalation with Docker - <AUTHOR> https://medium.com/@Affix/privilege-escallation-with-docker-56dc682a6e17 <comment><USER2> Very misleading.

From article: docker run -it -v /:/mnt alpine chroot /mnt

Yes, you can 'compromise' the host that way. It's fully documented approach.

</comment><comment><USER3> You're chrooting the host's root. This isn't privilege escalation.</comment>


Offer HN: Free Conversion Rate Optimization Services - <AUTHOR>

Hi HN folks,
We are a relatively new online marketing consultancy  specializing in Conversion Rate Optimization.
We would like to offer our services (pro bono)to a few companies owned by HN readers so we can get more testimonials, references and case studies.
If you have attained product/market fit and are getting decent organic traffic we can really help you scale growth.
What is Conversion Rate Optimization aka CRO? My definition is: the application of a rigorous methodology designed to maximize the throughput and customer lifetime value of your sales/user/customer acquisition funnel.
We emphasize "rigorous methodology" rather than just doing random A/B split testing. Our particular methodology is based on three bodies of work as well as our experience promoting offers in various consumer verticals (mostly health, fitness and dating)...
http://www.theconversionwizards.com/cro/
email email@example.com
Thanks!
P.S. We can also help you with your paid traffic efforts. <comment><USER2> I'd be really interested in help with this for us. Our traffic has been increasing for months now, but our conversion rate is low and I continue to try to improve them and do user testing to figure out ways to better convey and explain the product more so an outside view could be highly beneficial for us. The site is [http://userdeck.com](http://userdeck.com).

</comment><comment><USER3> Hey, we would be interested in a consultation - [http://process.st](http://process.st) we are working on a new marketing site so this is great timing.</comment>


Show HN: Tcomb-form – React.js UI library for developing forms writing less code - <AUTHOR> https://gcanti.github.io/tcomb-form

<comment><AUTHOR> Hello HN,

My main use case at the moment is generating tons of forms for our internal backoffice(s) (for whom the Bootstrap theme is good enough), but with the new customization feature I'm going to use this library for our customer web app as well.

I'd love to hear your feedback.</comment>


SoundCloud is here to stay - <AUTHOR> https://blog.soundcloud.com/2017/08/11/exciting-news-future-soundcloud/ <comment><USER2> SoundCloud, if you want to make money off of me, a devoted listener and user of the platform for 7 or 8 years, it is really easy:

Create a frictionless way for me to send a few dollars to artists hosting music on your platform, and you take a cut.

I don't want to pay $10 or $20 every month that gets dispersed into the ether. I want to directly thank the DJs and creators that enable me to be productive during the day and relax at night, a few dollars at a time.

<comment><USER3> I second this!

Make me have a subscription for $7 a month, but that money goes directly to an artist I choose and then take a cut.

<comment><USER4> So, you want the twitch.tv model then?

<comment><USER5> I actually don't see that as a bad concept. It might make Amazon/Twitch curious about how they might do the same, but competition is good.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> >"I'm happy to announce that together with investors The Raine Group and Temasek we've just wrapped up the largest financing round in the history of SoundCloud"

After a big round of layoffs couldn't that message have been a little bit more nuanced?

Also if there is new CEO and COO coming on board what will this individual be doing?

Honestly this guy seems a little tone deaf.

<comment><USER7> FTA: "I'm excited to hand the CEO reins over to Kerry to allow me to fully focus on the role of the Chairman and the long-term."

<comment><USER6> Sure but what does that actually mean, in practical terms? What does a "chairman" do? I can't recall any start up that had a full time "chairman."

I believe the CEO and COO's job description's very much include looking after the "long-term" goals of the company.

<comment><USER8> Let me direct you to this Slate piece[1] that explains the whole stepping- aside-as-ceo-to-just-be-a-chairman thing, the mentions when Bill Gates did the same thing at Microsoft and Steve Case at AOL. Obviously some of the specifics are going to be a bit different for Soundcloud, but it still explains the general concept a bit.

[1] [http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/20...](http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/explainer/2000/01/whats_the_difference_between_ceos_and_chairmen.html)

<comment><USER6> >"Obviously some of the specifics are going to be a bit different for Soundcloud, but it still explains the general concept a bit."

However both Bill Gates and Steve Case moved into into an exclusive chairman role after steering their respective companies to great heights and giving investors good returns.

This individual is doing so as part of an agreement that's necessary in order keep the company alive. I don't think the specifics could be more different.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment> et-al Is the _music_ here to stay? The memo doesn't explicitly say, and I think that's main concern of most users.

<comment><USER9> I don't understand how you could have one without the other?

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> 6 months from now, "What an incredible journey..."

</comment><comment><USER11> Business model: Unlimited free streaming with ads. Every artist has a "become a patron" button on their profile. Once you pledge over $10/month in aggregate, ads are removed. Soundcloud takes a 30% cut, like Apple does in the App Store. VIP patrons ($$$) get special perks as outlined by artists.

</comment><comment><USER12> subscribing to labels or artists works for a small amount, Bandcamp does this. I pay an amount to select few of my fave labels that are doing it, and I get unlimited streaming and downloads of new releases It's great.

However, Soundcloud serves more purposes. I don't think that works for the _rest_ of the music out there I want to listen to. I mean there are tons of other podcasts, clips, etc that I want to listen to regularly and am not going to pay hundreds of dollars for. SoundCloud's rise to popularity is very much likely because it is a storehouse for audio, the internet needs easy to use and access repositories like this and since no one else was doing it at time, SC did well.

</comment><comment><USER13> I was holding off on integrating Soundcloud API. I guess there's no excuse now.

</comment><comment><USER14> A little self congratulatory no?

<comment><USER15> I think they desserve a pass on this one, media made it sound like they were on the brink of imploding in the past few weeks.

<comment><USER16> They were.

Without this lifeline deal they had only enough cash to see them through the end of summer if you believe media sources, or until sometime in Q4 if you believe SoundCloud.</comment></comment></comment>


Lying Google advertising, or Google uses Adblock in its ads - <AUTHOR> http://themilehighview.wordpress.com/2013/11/19/lying-google-advertising-or-google-uses-adblock-in-its-ads?lk <comment><USER2> It's not like this is hard to check. Set the custom date range, and do the query yourself:

[https://www.google.com/search?q=oldest+sweet+shop+near+mochi...](https://www.google.com/search?q=oldest+sweet+shop+near+mochi+gate+lahore&tbs=cdr%3A1%2Ccd_min%3A%2Ccd_max%3A10%2F23%2F2013)

No ads shown. If you want to be sensationalist, then please start by trying to be accurate.

<comment><USER3> What about the other 99.999999999995% of search queries?

I think the OP's point is they are mis-representing what they are offering.

<comment><USER4> "pizza" is whole different _kind_ of query than the one shown in the ad. "Best toy store near dupont circle" has no ads.

The worst you could accuse them of is picking a type of query that doesn't usually have ads. I don't think that's lying.

<comment><USER3> I'm not sure how I'm going to convince you that Google's business model revolves around monetization of search results and showing ads.

But if I did, you'd see that any search query to Google is nothing more than a potential ad space.

For your search query examples, it's not a matter of if, it's a matter of when.

<comment><USER2> You're missing the biggest part of the whole equation:

Google shows ads, because by every metric Google knows how to throw at it, people who search on Google WANT to see those ads.

Google tries very hard to show only high-quality ads. That's a win-win-win. It's good for the users who find what they're looking for, it's good for the businesses who get a sale, and it's good for Google.

It's like you're pissed there are ADS in the YELLOW PAGES.

Yes, AT&T would list businesses with a vanilla entry, or a business could pay to show up a bit more prominently. The difference is, AT&T didn't give a crap about whether people found what they were looking for, or how high quality the ads were. It wasn't really their fault, there was no feedback loop.

Google, fundamentally, is the largest feedback loop ever invented. Every human who uses it teaches Google how to help other humans find what they're looking for. A lot of the time, ads are the most relevant result.

<comment><USER3> > people who search on Google WANT to see those ads.

I doubt that very much.

> A lot of the time, ads are the most relevant result.

And there I though search results were supposed to be relavant - and that's why people started using Google.

The normal CTR is now about 0.2 or 0.3 percent? That kind of contradicts what you are saying.

<comment><USER2> > And there I though search results were supposed to be relavant [sic]

Google loses, if the ads aren't relevant. They KNOW that. More than you realize.

> The normal CTR is now about 0.2 or 0.3 percent? That kind of contradicts > what you are saying.

What's the CTR on organic results? Telling us the CTR on ads by itself tells us exactly nothing.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> If you take the original idea of the search shown in the ad, and reformat it to look like a rather ordinary search query, you get this:

[https://www.google.com/#q=biggest+candy+store+near+Austin%2C...](https://www.google.com/#q=biggest+candy+store+near+Austin%2C+TX)

Not using ad-block, you can see some of the ads OP is referring to.

</comment><comment><USER6> I wonder how this affected the value of buying ads for the keywords used in the google campaign...

Currently it appears there are 'no ads' there, but could there be if you bought keyword ads?

</comment><comment><USER7> Is the image displayed just an ancient one? I forgot about that sidebar on the right, and I can't replicate that or get the black bar on the top outside of Google Translate.

</comment><comment><USER8> I've tried "oldest pub in limerick" and it gives me no ads, but it has a google map box on the right side, not sure if it counted as an ad.

<comment><USER9> The right-hand side stuff isn't available in most countries yet, so it likely wouldn't have shown up in a real-world use.</comment></comment>


Ask YC: what do you use for graphic design? - <AUTHOR>

Question for you web startup developers: what tool(s) do you use to do your graphics design (logos, buttons, form elements, etc.)  For YC startups in particular a lot of them seem to have a very similar graphical look-and-feel which makes me think that there's one graphical design tool for the web out there that all the cool kids are using nowadays.  What is it? <comment><USER2> The YC startups don't have any single tool they prefer as far as I know. The reason they look similar is what they put on the page, especially the frontpage. That's partly influenced by YC. E.g. we encourage every startup to think about which link on the frontpage they most want visitors to click on (usually "sign up" or "try it" rather than say "about us" or "terms of service") and to make that link most prominent.

<comment><USER3> Do YC startups use the same design shop? Seems that, beyond clarity, they have a similar look. Also, do you publish publicly the ideas the influence YC companies' layouts?

<comment><USER2> They can't afford a design shop. They all make their sites themselves. Sometimes founders who are good at web design help other startups. Bryan Kennedy (Likebetter) and Devin Hunt (Fuzzwich) both helped me with News.YC.

I've never written about how to design a startup site, but I might one day.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> I use Illustrator and Fireworks. I use photoshop for some special effects but try and stick with vectors as long as i can until the gif/jpg stage so as i can transform them easily.

A lot of the most frequently used special effects in PS can be used in illustrator now in vector format which is handy like drop shadows etc. PS was never really built to make graphics, just to manipulate photographs but it serves the purpose to some extent. you might use it for blending a photo into a gradient for a banner and things like that but you can also do this in FW.

If you want to learn how to make graphics for web - get Fireworks and/or Illustrator, it'll make the job a lot easier and Fireworks has the best engine of the three for compressing images for the web. you'll notice the difference. The three all work together though.

</comment><comment><USER5> Inkscape and GIMP. But I'm not particularly good at it, so take that as you will.

</comment><comment><USER6> Photoshop

</comment><comment><USER7> paint.exe</comment>


Github for product design - <AUTHOR>

A short time ago, there was a lively discussion here about getting designers to contribute to open source projects: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2267861
Yesterday, we saw an example of an independent contributor "mocking up" his ideal notification interface for the iPhone: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2298585
Question: Is there a tool that would make it easy for multiple folks to collaboratively design stuff and iterate on a design?  Github for product design?  Multiple designers suggesting things for one feature, and some way to collaboratively edit stuff, with history on the decision making process?
As a "product guy" myself, I am constantly designing stuff using Balsamiq mockups. I'm eager to use the forthcoming myBalsamiq, which seems to have some group / collaboration features.  But I think I am suggesting something far beyond what Balsamiq is working on. <comment><AUTHOR> Clickable links:

Getting designers to contribute to open source projects: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2267861>

Mockup of "ideal" notification for iPhone: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2298585>

myBalsamiq: <http://balsamiq.com/products/mockups/mybalsamiq>

</comment><comment><USER2> I'm eager for myBalsamiq too. At least, I was in 2009. And in 2010. Now I've kind of given up on it.

</comment><comment><USER3> Hi to both of you. Please email me. myBalsamiq is very much happening (we're in "gamma" right now, which is like a beta but with paying customers).

myBalsamiq is free for open-source projects, email me!

email@example.com</comment>


Ask HN: What are the best links that we've missed? - <AUTHOR>

It might have been a bad headline.  Maybe it got buried on Erlang day.  Whatever the reason, sometimes quality submissions slip through the cracks.
Sometimes we catch these: RiderOfGiraffes excellent greybeard stories ( http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1001279 ) is one example - Khan Academy is another ( http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1059076 ), sometimes we miss stuff.
So HN - What have been your favorite submissions (either from you or someone else) that the rest of us overlooked?
EDIT: Probably best to link to the HN submission (include a direct link as well if you like) <comment><USER2> I was actually thinking of making a predictive model which would rate the new stories automatically. There are a lot of features that can be used in learning the prediction model: text length, content, etc. I already have the infrastructure more or less ready: <http://www.wingify.com/contextsense/>

In my opinion automatically rating posts will provide a useful filter to find stories that the community may have missed due to timezone/title issues.

What do you think about the idea?

<comment><USER3> Nice Idea, I am curious to know how contextsense give ratings.. could you please describe in more detail .. Thank you

<comment><USER2> It doesn't give out ratings. It will rather generate tags and categories which represent a submission. Tags such as: erlang, database, module, in-memory, etc. You can also generate other features such as word count, presence of images, (domain name, poster's name, etc.)

Now what you do is to go through all (or as many as you could) stories that have been on HN front page, calculate features for those stories. Those features are used to learn a prediction model which you can apply to new stories to predict ratings.

<comment><AUTHOR> I like the general concept.. The only issue I really see is with promoting groupthink. Doesn't that approach create a positive feedback loop. (TO be specific - if those predictions were exposed in a meaningful way, people would be more likely to view those stories, thus they would be upvoted, thus similar stories would be predicted to be successful)

The second issue is that stuff like this: (One of mine but I think it was a fascinating article) would probably fail any relevancy test: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1046378> Concepts: Charm, Bed and Breakfast, Localities, Lodging, Ohio

<comment><USER2> I think HN community is composed of mostly independent thinkers, so what it will more likely do is to expose interesting stories to them, it is their choice in the end to actually upvote or not. (That is precisely the problem we are trying to solve: interesting stories not getting noticed).

Yes, the algorithm won't be perfect but it could factor in historical data such as previously how many upvotes submitor's other stories got or how many votes did the stories from that website got. On both those counts, your post will score high.

<comment><USER4> I like the idea - I've been toying on and off with similar thoughts, it appears you're more advanced in your thinking than I.

However, you say:

      > I think HN community is composed of mostly independent thinkers ...

That's certainly been true, and is probably still mostly true, but the evidence suggests it's becoming less true as HN becomes more popular and well- known. I think that's inevitable, and is recognised by PG, which is why he's testing and experimenting with the way votes and karma work.

I think you need to plan for the quality and subjects to drift significantly in the future, starting now. If you can solve (or anticipate) that, you may have a winner.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I think my 'Dissecting SimpleDB BoxUsage' post deserved more attention than it received -- AFAIK it is the first (and perhaps only?) time someone published exactly what SimpleDB requests cost.

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=227327>

</comment><comment><USER6> <http://hnweekly.chibidesign.com/>

<comment><USER7> That's really cool! I sometimes go on streaks of actual work and always knew I was missing some great stuff. Thanks.

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> From my last twenty submissions...

Pretending objects: [http://www.boingboing.net/2009/11/16/pretending-and- games.ht...](http://www.boingboing.net/2009/11/16/pretending-and-games.html)

Superstitious beliefs cemented before birth: [http://dsc.discovery.com/news/2009/10/30/paranormal- supersti...](http://dsc.discovery.com/news/2009/10/30/paranormal- superstitions.html)

Sacraficial virgins of the Mississippi: [http://www.salon.com/books/review/2009/08/06/cahokia/index.h...](http://www.salon.com/books/review/2009/08/06/cahokia/index.html)

Also, anything that isn't text rarely makes the front page regardless of how good it is. On that note, I think the new technology developed to create the movie Oceans is pretty cool:

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfjEydlUdT8>

</comment><comment><USER9> I use PostRank (what used to be AideRSS) to sift through my piles of hundreds of RSS feeds. Basically some feeds are so high volume that I can say, "give me the top 30% most popular" only and just look at those. There are buckets like "good", "great", etc.

It does various things to determine the interesting-ness of a blog post.

<http://www.postrank.com/>

</comment><comment><USER10> Idle thought: A script running on HN that, on slow news days, looks back on submissions on high news days and finds those that (by some criteria) got pushed off the the radar too quickly.

It then selects some number of these (again, by whatever criteria, TBA, etc.) and re-submits them.

That way, slow news days go away, and decent links get a second chance.

</comment><comment><USER11> A couple of days ago I was really looking for everyone's insights on this patent application by Google: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1042128> ... but the original title I put on it didn't make clear what it was (I think it said "Google News related"). If it could get a second chance, I'm still quite curious what people think.

</comment><comment><USER12> This one didn't make it because of tweet down-weighting.

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1049016> Still no confirmation...

</comment><comment><USER13> Resubmitting the runt of my recent submissions: the myth of college football <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1059489></comment>


A Simple Pattern for Jobs and Crons on AWS - <AUTHOR> https://blog.skyliner.io/a-simple-pattern-for-jobs-and-crons-on-aws-2f965e43932f <comment><USER2> An alternative would be to just use AWS lambda:

> You can create a Lambda function and direct AWS Lambda to execute it on a > regular schedule. You can specify a fixed rate (for example, execute a > Lambda function every hour or 15 minutes), or you can specify a Cron > expression.

[http://docs.aws.amazon.com/lambda/latest/dg/with- scheduled-e...](http://docs.aws.amazon.com/lambda/latest/dg/with-scheduled- events.html)

It would remove the need of infrastructure for "task workers". Although, depending on your stack / setup, it of course may be easier to have your application tier double as a task worker due to complicated dependencies or startup times.

Additionally, I am not sure if everyone is aware but SQS does offer FIFO delivery with guaranteed once-only "processing". There are some interesting caveats to this, definitely worth looking into though :)

<comment><USER3> Yes, but...

AWS Lambda has a limitation on the number of functions you can attach to a scheduled event. What this means is that you wind up with a shitload of 'every 5 minutes' schedulers that all need unique names. WTF Amazon?

<comment><USER4> Hook up just one Lambda function to the scheduled event. And have it invoke other Lambda functions.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I've used SQS for a simple job queue before. It works well and it's nice not to have to worry about more infrastructure. To make things even better, Celery now has an SQS broker, which I'd like to try out.

I've also had success with an HTTP subscription in SNS for simple async jobs. Having your tasks be just another HTTP endpoint is really convenient. It's not actually a task queue, but it's often a good-enough substitute.

One frustration I've had with it is that Amazon signs SNS messages, but I can't find a Python library for validating the signature. Not even AWS's flagship API client (boto3) has the functionality.

<comment><USER6> > [...] I can't find a Python library for validating the signature. Not even > AWS's flagship API client (boto3) has the functionality.

I wrote validatesns [1] for this, give it a try!

(Not sure why there's an official PHP validator but not Python...)

[1] [https://github.com/nathforge/validatesns](https://github.com/nathforge/validatesns)

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> As simple as this article is trying to make things, it still feels like it's trying to re-create what elastic beanstalk workers already do out of the box... [http://docs.aws.amazon.com/elasticbeanstalk/latest/dg/using-...](http://docs.aws.amazon.com/elasticbeanstalk/latest/dg/using- features-managing-env-tiers.html)

</comment><comment><USER8> You could also use `sqsd` (an Elastic Beanstalk worker environment) and avoid having to write any queue reading code.

</comment><comment><USER9> Can't wait until Google Functions[1] adds the ability to schedule and define recurring function calls.

[1] - [https://cloud.google.com/functions/](https://cloud.google.com/functions/)

</comment><comment><USER10> Something similar, and perhaps even simpler: Make a few SNS topics that lambdas can subscribe to - either one per method or one per method type, and then filter more in code - and push notifications to those from your service layer as needed to invoke async workflows. I've been doing this recently and it's pretty pain-free.

Been meaning to look at Step Functions for a lot of this async work stuff, but haven't had time yet (plus it's nice to let these things mature a bit before diving in).

</comment><comment><USER11> For jobs that take longer than Lambda will allow, I use Datapipeline to run a ShellCommandActivity, which can run a bash script on an EC2 instance.

<comment><USER12> Running an ECS task from Lambda is another option.</comment></comment>