Launch HN: Peer5 (YC W17) – Serverless CDN - <AUTHOR> https://www.peer5.com <comment><AUTHOR> Hi HN, I'm Shachar, co-founder and CTO of Peer5 - A P2P CDN for Video

We started Peer5 4 years ago, when we heard about WebRTC, and thought this is a ground changing technology that fundamentally change the way the web could work. Yea, and also because we're geeks that love cool technologies like that. I'll be here to answer any questions, and get feedback from you guys.

We've also just announced the YC investment (W17) and our new native Android SDK on TC ([https://techcrunch.com/2017/01/26/peer5-y-combinator/](https://techcrunch.com/2017/01/26/peer5-y-combinator/)) Thanks!

</comment><comment><USER2> When you run "pktstat -n" while watching the video, you can see the IPs of other visitors of the website. I see people from Sweden, the USA, Japan, Brazil...

Since among the HN users there are probably a lot of developers, I tried to put some of the IPs into my browser. And indeed, already the second IP I tried sent back a reply from a (misconfigured) server.

I have to say it feels frightening, that the other users can see my IP. And probably other data about me.

Also I would expect it's not legal in most places around the world to give away the IP of a visitor to other visitors. Can't imagine it is legal in Europe.

<comment><USER3> I agree that it's a bit frightening, but I would put that more on the browser makers than sites in general.

The various browsers decided that webrtc (websockets as well) didn't need to follow the "same origin" rules that they set up for XmlHttpRequest.

It almost feels like browsers should have some way to delineate "web pages" from "web applications" and provide different ways to present them to end users, different rules, etc.

<comment><USER2> I think browsers should simply pop up a dialog "WebRTC Request: This website wants to connect your computer to other computers. Allow?".

For now, I have disabled WebRTC in FireFox by setting media.peerconnection.enabled to false in about:config.

<comment><USER3> That seems to work for now, but I'm thinking more of where it's headed. Websockets, WebRTC, WebWorkers, and then other pending proposals all eventually end up being like a "VM" running apps on your local machine.

At some point, it's much closer to an "App Store", which arguably has finer grained (and more usable) control presented to the user to manage what applications can (and cannot) do.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> ISPs like Comcast have metered caps (1TB for our home).

So now it will require ~2x bandwidth (down/up) to watch the same content. Basically shifting the content provider's CDN costs (which _we pay_ subscription for) on the backs of consumer's _metered_ internet? Seems like a triple whammy for consumers.

Is your expectation/hope that they will share some of their cost savings?

<comment><USER5> From their FAQ[1]:

Q: Can Peer5 ever harm user experience?

A: No. Peer5 can never deteriorate user experience.

Q: How does Peer5 impact a user's upstream bandwidth?

A: Peer5 works with whatever bandwidth is free for upstream use and will not impact other applications that require uploads at the same time as Peer5. Changes to upstream bandwidth are unnoticeable to the end user.

\---

The concept is great, but until every consumer internet service comes with unmetered bandwidth, this kind of peer-to-peer CDN must be treated as what it is: a dark pattern from content providers who are looking to save their own bottom line while directly harming their customers in the process.

For every $1 a content provider saves by using this service, their users who happen to not have unmetered bandwidth will collectively pay dozens or hundreds of times that cost in overage fees to their ISPs. The fact that any business would use this technology and shrug their users' suffering off as an externality is disgusting to me.

[1] [https://www.peer5.com/faq](https://www.peer5.com/faq)

<comment><USER6> > _A: Peer5 works with whatever bandwidth is free for upstream use and will > not impact other applications that require uploads at the same time as > Peer5._

That would also require WebRTC traffic to be properly tagged as low-priority and general consumer gear being any good at QoS, neither of which is the case. Of course parallel uploads can and will have a negative effect.

<comment><AUTHOR> Part of WebRTC's requirements [1] is to be fair on competing TCP connections. This is a very good point, because I agree with you that in general parallel connections cause each connection to have less throughput, but if those connections have a mutual goal to download the same content it can actually increase the overall throughput than downloading that content via a single TCP connection. That's especially true when those connections are to different sources which can workaround specific network issues you might have in a single connection.

Actually the value proposition for our customers is to improve the QoS. And we've shown that's the case in customer case studies.

[1] [https://wiki.tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtcweb-data- chan...](https://wiki.tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rtcweb-data- channel-10#page-4)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Grats on your launch! I echo the sibling comment that was slightly faster in asking about the disconnect between p2p companies and profitability. There has been _no shortage_ of efforts that tried to capitalize (and monetize) on the success of 'bandwidth sharing' that was perhaps brought to the forefront by BitTorrent, although pioneered before by early p2p networks.

Most of these companies appear to have faltered, while a few of them were bought out by big companies (example: [1][2]) and their technology has yet to be conclusively observed in the wild. Yet another class continues to run their offerings, but has drastically toned down marketing (example: [3]) There are also a good number of non-commercial explorations in this space, of various quality, from toys to demos to full-fledged networks. How do you plan to distinguish yourself?

[1] [https://techcrunch.com/2013/12/17/yahoo-acquires- peercdn/](https://techcrunch.com/2013/12/17/yahoo-acquires-peercdn/) [2] [http://www.thesixthaxis.com/2013/03/14/microsoft-acquires- pa...](http://www.thesixthaxis.com/2013/03/14/microsoft-acquires-pando-next- xbox-uses-rumoured/) [3] [http://www.bittorrent.com/dna/](http://www.bittorrent.com/dna/)

<comment><USER8> I was about to write exactly the same comment myself. Also, let me add:

1) how does this work behind NAT?

2) as someone else pointed out already, your logo looks like a cheap ripoff of HTML5 :)

Good luck.

<comment><AUTHOR> 1\. WebRTC uses ICE[1] protocol to go over NAT and puncture Firwalls.

2\. HTML5 logo is under common license agreement and we give it attribution in the /about page.

<comment><USER8> 1\. Thanks.

2\. Irrelevant: what tech people (i.e., the actual decision makers on becoming your customer) will immediately think is "look they plagiarised HTML5's logo", not "let me go through their site to see whether there's attribution" :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> This was done already, almost a decade ago. CNN.com used it and it was total hell for us, running a corporate LAN, because it flooded out our upstream bandwidth, especially when multiple people used it. Their product ended up being considered, basically, as malware:

[https://arstechnica.com/business/2009/02/cnn-p2p-video- strea...](https://arstechnica.com/business/2009/02/cnn-p2p-video-streaming- tech-raises-questions/)

How are you going to stop people from starving out bandwidth in large offices?

<comment><AUTHOR> That's interesting, I know about Octoshape. But didn't know that in enterprise they actually made matters worse. The way our technology works is a bit like an 'onion' architecture. Users from the same corporation should communicate only with each other - and actually reduce the traffic on their internet connection - making the user experience better.

<comment><USER9> That's fantastic if that's the truth. I'm not sure how you deal with this. Big corps have many subnets so you need a reliable way to figure out who's link- local.

Octoshape really was a disaster. During a major news event, many hundreds of employees could be live-streaming CNN and the effect was catastrophic.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> Hey everyone - this is Michael Seibel - I'm one of the group partners for Peer5 and I'm really excited they have launched. If you have any questions for me - feel free to ask :)

<comment><USER11> I doubt you remember, but you responded very briefly to a YC application about nearly the exact idea complete with prototype work a couple years back. Didn't get any real interest or feedback from you though.

Has the game changed to make webrtc P2P platforms more palatable to VC ( _cough_ Trump = end of net neutrality _cough_ ) or did these guys just feel like better "founder material" to y'all? I mean, we weren't ever going to propose selling other's people bandwidth as a profit method for our tech, so maybe that's the problem.

FWIW, we've since moved on to something better. Realized that VC shouldn't be involved with every piece of tech, and that peer-distributed networks is probably one of those. I'm sure you'll see it show up on HN before too much longer though.

<comment><USER12> Glad your onto something better, but I think you know it's absolutely unproductive to try an infer anything from any single VC decision, for a variety of reasons.

To start they are wrong most of the time (just like we as entrepreneurs are wrong most of the time). Most unicorns have investor rejection stories.

If they were not wrong and there was a flaw with your plan/product or team, that kind of thing you can find out easily enough from people you trust and respect, and who won't feel bad about damaging a potential future business relationship.

<comment><USER11> I appreciate your response. You're 100% correct.

I was (and truthfully still am) a little bitter over the whole experience (watching Silicon Valley for the first time was sort of a cathartic experience). So many people seemed interested at first, but it was so hard to get real feedback. Out of about 10 or so meetings, only one VC (depressingly it was the very first one we met with) listened intently and asked good questions. He gave great feedback but didn't want to pursue it because his tech consultants didn't think WebRTC was mature enough to work as we described. Every other time it was "Can you just go over the deck you sent 2 weeks ago? (which we did as they looked at their phones the entire time)" or "Great, but can you make this more enterprise-y by adding SLAs? (yes, their tech person asked if we could add enterprise SLAs to p2p video streaming)".

None of us were people with a wealthy or well-connected family, a degree from an elite school or even from a state with much of a culture for entrepeneurship or technology. So setting up meetings, building a deck and pitching it, the whole thing felt so extremely foreign. What I would have given for someone who we could trust or respect to give real feedback.

Nice thing about software though, as long as you have income to support yourself and are adequately skilled at your craft, you can just build it yourself. Which fortunately is the case here.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> "Why the hell is Chrome uploading and downloading so much data?"

* looks through open tabs *

"Oh."

Though most people would never notice, I feel like with developers (the folks who will implement this on their sites) you may have a tough time convincing them this is safe and ethical. I suggest being up front about this issue and suggesting disclosure/consent strategies to any of your customers (and perhaps doing research and surveys to prove that nobody really minds this use of their bandwidth).

Also, it's kinda weird that you've appropriated the HTML 5 logo into your own. That's probably within the logo's Creative Commons license, but I don't see where you've given attribution as required by said license.

Slick page though, and a good informative site... I don't mean to be a downer. Good luck!

<comment><AUTHOR> 2 valid points

1\. We suggest a snippet today for our customers to notify their users.

2\. [https://www.peer5.com/about](https://www.peer5.com/about) towards the end of the page you can see the attribution.

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> The pricing page says:

> Only data delivered via P2P counts against your plan.

Am I misunderstanding this or is that statement backwards?

Isn't the point of a P2P network to get the distributed network benefits of your user base and if so why would I pay for that versus the data that's coming directly off the primary channel?

<comment><USER15> I was going to ask the same thing. The Accounts & Billing FAQ does seem to concur that you pay for P2P delivery:

> A: For the pay-per-Gigabyte tiers, Peer5 charges you at the end of the month > based on the agreed upon price and actual amount of data delivered through > our P2P CDN during the period. For the Pro tier, Peer5 bills the flat rate > at the beginning of the month. For the free, Starter tier, there is no > billing, but we do cap your P2P delivery at 1 TB per month.

<comment><AUTHOR> The point is that there's no double billing, http traffic is being billed by your existing CDN. P2P traffic is billed by us.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> Congrats!

Maybe instead of or in addition to having users use their bandwidth, you can partner with ISPs like netflix openconnect to deliver content

Unmetered networks - ISPs won't like you

Metered networks - users won't like you

Brace yourself

P.S. Did you know disabling WebRTC in chrome isn't natively supported ?

<comment><AUTHOR> Unmetered networks - ISP benefit from more local traffic and less traffic over their peering agreements connections.

Metered networks - [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13502790](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13502790)

TBH I didn't try to disable webrtc in chrome but there are extensions that do that [1]

[1] [https://chrome.google.com/webstore/search/disable%20webrtc?h...](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/search/disable%20webrtc?hl=en- US)

<comment><USER16> > Unmetered networks

> Metered networks

Cool! Does this mean all peer traffic is local ? Also, how can you detect when traffic is metered ?

<comment><AUTHOR> traffic is as localized as possible. As a general rule you can think of, if the peer is more local to you than the nearest CDN PoP you'll receive data from the peer, otherwise you'll receive data from the CDN.

>Cool! Does this mean all peer traffic is local ? Also, how can you detect when traffic is metered ?

We combine both client side and server side methods for that.

<comment><USER17> > if the peer is more local to you

How is this determined? Just WebRTC ping?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> This is cool from a philosophy of the internet angle. It's also one of the worst workloads to try with P2P so it will be interesting to watch as a business.

There are a number of fundamentally half-duplex technologies in widespread use, such as wifi. Others have very different transmission characteristics, for instance tx uses a second frequency on cellular but is obviously more power hungry, whereas DOCSIS, wifi, and pretty much any radio network have batching and even ack filtering that make ack clocking or even state of the art things like BBR congestion control difficult. On "eyeball networks", ISPs provision for downstream ratio and wholesale upload bandwidth to businesses as transit. That may manifest as policy such as upload caps, or monetarily. Drastically changing their network profile is more likely to result in hasty policy and financial games rather than re-architecture or capacity expansion.

Also fundamentally, TCP is "easy" as a receiver and most stacks in common use are good receivers. TCP as a sender is hard, and most stacks have a ways to come, aside from sub-optimal defaults.

Hard problems. Doesn't mean there aren't simple solutions like aggressively clamping where the tech is used. It also might spring the problem on other people (ISPs, and I mean this non-condescendingly but end users) in a way that is eventually a net win.

</comment><comment><USER19> I was pondering to collaborate in a similar project and my main concern was mobile bandwith use.

As a mobile user I would hate to have my data being use by some random company...

It this address in some way?

<comment><AUTHOR> Right, that's a great point. We take into account whether your mobile device is currently using Cellular or Wifi and make decisions based on that. (Today Cellular devices would not be uploading at all, just leeching)

<comment><USER6> How about non-mobile devices? (Laptops tethered to phones, 3G-based Wifi- hotspots, ...)

<comment><AUTHOR> Devices connected through another device still have the same external ip - allowing us to detect it's indeed Cellular and not Wifi

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER20> How do you ensure that videos won't be modified by the users do you have an integrity check ?

<comment><AUTHOR> Yes, we do hash verification of the fragments as they are received from users.

<comment><USER20> Could I perform a Sybil attack on the network?

<comment><AUTHOR> No, since the verification is done using signatures received from the server, without any reputation system involved.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> It's a little amusing how we see many stories with comments begging for more "decentralized platforms", and when one ships people go "wait.. they can see my IP?".

</comment><comment><USER22> This sounds like Red Swoosh, a company Travis Kalanick (Uber CEO) started and was acquired by Akamai back in 2007. I was surprised that Akamai is a partner. They already do that...

But anyways CDN is highly commoditized now and most big players are building their own solutions. What advantage do you offer? It does not seem like it would be a great solution for live streaming...

Also this sounds like a perfect target for DDoS attacks...

<comment><AUTHOR> Indeed Red Swoosh was probably one of the first P2P CDN companies, the main difference from them is the underlying technology - WebRTC enabling a seamless experience for the end user.

CDN is still a very expensive business to bootstrap and most companies in the world rely on Akamai and Akamai like companies.

We provide a few advantages over a traditional CDN: 1\. Geographically ubiquitous distribution - wherever there's demand, there's capacity.

2\. Improved user experience - since each user can download content both from the existing CDN and multiple other peers it can fetch that content faster and be less exposed to network conditions between it and the CDN's PoP

3\. Scale - CDNs as big as they are, even Akamai have a limit, and this pronounces it self the most specifically in live events. Today's biggest live events over the internet has been single digit million concurrent users and they were using several CDNs at the same time. The potential of a P2P CDN is to bring TV scale events to the internet.

Please elaborate how you think it can facilitate a DDoS?

</comment></comment><comment><USER23> Hey guys! Your site looks awesome! Sorry for my noobness, but what is a serverless CDN, who is it for, and why do I need it?

<comment><AUTHOR> Serverless CDN is the term we use to describe a CDN that uses no servers for the content itself.

It's actually a Peer-to-Peer Content Delivery Network. Big content providers (like Netflix, Youtube, ESPN) can use that to deliver their content more efficiently and improve their users' experience. That results in less rebuffering for their users and lower costs on infrastructure.

</comment></comment><comment><USER2> You can turn a website visitor into a content delivery endpoint without them even noticing? I find that hard to believe.

<comment><USER24> There are no downloads or plugins to make it work. All data moves through WebRTC after just a 2 lines of js. Web pages enabled with Peer5 look exactly the same as they did before it was implemented.

They could notice if monitoring upstream bandwidth, although this would be absolutley negligible on Wifi connections.

<comment><USER2> I did not expect that WebRTC would allow a website to make the browser deliver content to a 3rd party without the users consent. This has some strange privacy and copyright implications.

<comment><AUTHOR> That's a very much talked about subject in the standardization groups. They've concluded that WebRTC doesn't add any additional privacy or security exposure than what exists in the browsers previous to it. Can you please explain more why you think there are copyright implications?

<comment><USER25> I'm not sure about the US, but in the EU and in particular in my country of France, anti-piracy lawsuits have seen a very clearly drawn line between a mere downloader, and an uploader. That's what lead emule and bittorrent to be "dangerous" legally while direct downloading (newsgroup, rapidshare, ...) and streaming almost never led to conviction (even symbolic). That the user didn't realize his bittorrent was re-uploading content to others didn't matter.

So, if I visit a website to get, say, direct copyrighted content (let's say photo, comics, music, whatever) and that website uses webrtc to make me reshare it to other users, my legal status just went from a almost never convicted downloader to a very much punished (even though it stayed symbolic, it was still a legal loss) uploader.

<comment><AUTHOR> What's different in the CDN use-case is that the content that reached a 3rd user through the uploading user would've reached the 3rd anyway, just from the original server.

<comment><USER25> Yeah but from the point of view of the (unexpecting) uploader that doesn't change anything. If user A wasn't uploading, user B would still get the files from other peers on the torrent, doesn't change the fact A was sharing and actively uploading the file.

Not trying to throw a wrench in your game, but I think this is something you guys need to have a look into because you're turning unsuspecting users into uploaders of content they have no control over, without noticing it, when it has been proven to cause them legal harm.

<comment><AUTHOR> We're definitely looking into that, AFAIK for now, is that as long as the content is legal there's no problem with uploading it.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> This reminds me of PeerCDN, which was acquired by Yahoo 4 years ago. One of the founders, Feross, went on to build the excellent open source WebTorrent library using many of the same technologies. Glad to see someone actually doing this! How does it compare to PeerCDN?

<comment><AUTHOR> [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13501923](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13501923)

</comment></comment><comment><USER27> How is this different from PeerCDN?

<comment><USER28> Hi, Hadar here, Co-founder and CEO of Peer5. PeerCDN started at about the same time as Peer5 and was a competitor. Later it was acquired by Yahoo.

PeerCDN was a general purpose CDN, while Peer5 specializes in video. Feross, one of PeerCDN's founders and author of WebTorrent actually became my friend and we exchange ideas from time to time.

</comment></comment><comment><USER29> Out of curiosity, what is being used to have the dots on the globe in the landing page? I've been trying to find out how to do this for a while, but I don't know which libraries are designed for it.

<comment><AUTHOR> Hey, thanks we used three.js for it. We also wrote a blog post about how we built it - [https://blog.peer5.com/peer5-live- network/](https://blog.peer5.com/peer5-live-network/)

<comment><USER29> Excellent, thanks!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER30> Can I be bold and say: this is malware?

Any involuntary p2p, specially one that eats _heavily_ into a quota, can be classified as malware. Is this a good criteria to ad-block the peer5 script URLs?

<comment><USER31> Please note that Peer5's p2p is not involuntary. Peer5 is not the broadcaster at the end of the day, our customers are. We work with our customers to notify users that their use of streaming services on a particular site may entail participation in p2p and to give them the appropriate opt-in or opt-our mechanisms. Anyone who doesn't want to participate is not forced to.

</comment></comment><comment><USER32> Am I the only one who thinks that the video app should ask for my permission before doing such a thing? Is this 1. ethical and 2. legal?

<comment><USER31> Yes, we agree with you that users should know that p2p is happening and that they can opt out. We work with our customers to notify users and to give them the appropriate opt-in or opt-our mechanisms.

</comment></comment><comment><USER33> shacharz: Any plans of working with the IPFS team? They're solving many similar problems, and they do have an js client.

<comment><AUTHOR> I just know about the IPFS team, but not familiar enough with their stuff. From my experience usually a synchronization oriented distributed algorithm can be very different from what a use-case like Video On Demand, or Live video requires. In terms of chunk allocations, predictions of what's going to be needed and so froth. But I definitely should familiarize myself more with their stuff.

</comment></comment><comment><USER34> Does it find the closest node to you? For live streaming, being close to a source is important to us.

<comment><AUTHOR> Yes it does, there'll be other parameters but the main goal is to find the nodes that'll help each other the most, and usually that'll be the closest ones. Live streaming is the best use-case, where Peer5 has the most value to give.

</comment></comment><comment><USER35> Is it possible to distribute videos in an encrypted form using this CDN?

<comment><AUTHOR> Yup, we support both AES-128 for HLS and any Common Encryption based DRM, that's true because we're basically agnostic to the content it self we just deliver it more efficiently.

</comment></comment><comment><USER36> Hi @shacharz do customers approve that his device would be used in p2p work ? For example if I'm on cell network I don't want to server traffic to other clients.

<comment><AUTHOR> We detect what network you're on, on a cellular network you wouldn't upload and only leech from other users and http.

<comment><USER37> Are you able to do that if the user is connected to a VPN? I frequently connect to a work VPN on my laptop using my phone as a hotspot.

<comment><AUTHOR> That's an interesting scenario, we didn't consider it but we can include it as well.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


VC Fund Performance - Some History - <AUTHOR> http://avc.blogs.com/a_vc/2007/11/vc-fund-perform.html

<comment><USER2> "The very best funds of every vintage generally pay out at least 5x and sometimes more than 10x.

Like all asset classes, venture is all about manager selection and timing."

The very best craps players can earn 2x, 4x, 8x, even 16x invested capital in one afternoon riding the pass line.

Like all games of chance, craps is all about dice selection and timing ;)

Of course venture investing is more than just dumb luck. However, even if you could do an amazing job identifying future 10x'ers ex ante, chances are so can the other funds, bidding your 10x down to 3x. What's left is probably compensation for the high variance of returns, which the graph nicely displays.</comment>


Google dinners are still free for now - <AUTHOR> http://venturebeat.com/2008/08/25/google-dinners-are-still-free-for-now/

<comment><USER2> A friend of mine, homeless in the area, deeply appreciates this.

</comment><comment><USER3> Whew...I was readying my signs to join the Googlers on the picket lines to show solidarity through this difficult time.</comment>


Coronavirus Social-Distancing Forces Painful Choices on Small Businesses - <AUTHOR> https://www.wsj.com/articles/coronavirus-social-distancing-forces-painful-choices-on-small-businesses-11584277201 <comment><AUTHOR> [https://archive.is/cwXcy](https://archive.is/cwXcy)</comment>


What Kind of Mother? - <AUTHOR> http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/201x/2011/01/09/Chinese-Mothers <comment><USER2> _Reading this piece shook me and made me wonder, because either Ms Chua is bringing her kids up wrong, or we are._

That's a false dichotomy. There are not two ways to treat children (hard vs soft).

I think Bray falls into the same trap as many of the indignant respondents on MetaFilter to Chua's piece (though in a less emotive way). There are no dichotomies when it comes to raising children or "what's best" for them, but people seem quick to adopt their own society's and communities' norms to judging both their own parenting techniques and those of others. Seneca was right to suggest that one should learn philosophy to grow as a human being because without such study these polarized opinions are so easy to cling to.

I think Chua does a reasonable job of acknowledging and describing the gulf between her supposedly traditional "Chinese" opinions and the "Western" gamut of parenting techniques without casting significant aspersions on "Western" parenting, at least in the essay given (I haven't read her book). When it comes to Westerners judging Chua, however, people seem very quick to paint her techniques as wrong, evil, or "cruel" using a moral framework that simply doesn't apply to her case - it's about as meaningful as criticizing how Amazonian tribes live (or, better, judging American politics by European standards).

As in everything, there's a middle way here. Bray's observations indicate, to me, that he _sees_ the gooey middle of the parenting gamut but then fails to acknowledge it.

<comment><USER3> I grew up with Asian parents^, and so I think I can safely say that the parenting techniques are at the very least cruel. For example, she makes it a point very early on that she doesn't allow her children to properly socialize with their peers. Education and socialization are _not_ mutually exclusive and it is absolutely vital that you don't don't convince your children otherwise. Then after making it a point to mention this little rule, she _never backs it up or defend it_. Why doesn't she allow her children to participate in drama or visit with friends? _We don't know_. One is left to simply presume that perhaps it's because she's on a power trip, enacting some sort of revenge on her children for daring to be a burden on her life.

^technically my parents were quite germanic, but their parenting technique was _to a tee_ what Chua described. _"You got a A- in geography?! You need to spend more time studying!"_ _"why are you listening to rock and roll music? you should play cello like your brother!"_. It's making a _big_ mistake to think that this sort of _bad_ parenting is limited to Asian parents.

<comment><USER2> _For example, she makes it a point very early on that she doesn't allow her children to properly socialize with their peers._

To call this "cruel" in any _objective_ sense (if you were being subjective, OK - that's undebatable opinion) would require a definition of what "proper" is in regards to socialization. Such a definition relates to the values of _particular societies and communities_ given that they form the basis under which socialization occurs.

<comment><USER4> Asian American women tend to commit suicide at a rate twice as high as the national female average:

<http://cdc.gov/women/lcod/archive>

Another link suggesting Asian Americans tend to have worse mental disorders than other ethnicities: [http://www.healthyminds.org/More-Info-For/Asian- AmericanPaci...](http://www.healthyminds.org/More-Info-For/Asian- AmericanPacific-Islanders.aspx)

Causation is not correlation, of course, and you are right that standards for socialization may differ across cultures, but these statistic and my experience with other Asians do lead me to believe that Asian upbringings are unnecessarily cruel and stunt children's ability to deal with other people and their own feelings to a degree that causes them to take their own lives. Raising children to be happy enough to _not_ take their own lives or getting an eating disorder after being called fat one time too many is a bare minimum.

<comment><USER5> People determine their own level of satisfaction based on comparisons to other people.

Asian Americans may feel more depressed because they see themselves missing out on socialization and general "fun" that their western counterparts experience.

However, Asians in their home countries (or in ethnically homogeneous American communities) may not feel more depressed because they only have each other as comparison.

If no one is going out to parties on Friday night, then it is a lot harder to say "my parents are being unfair to me", or even _feel_ it without expression.

Now addressing your charge that this culture is "unnecessarily" cruel... if we find that giving people the opportunity to have fun over work leads to higher satisfaction and consequently lower suicide rates, we still can't call any specific balance of work vs. fun "unnecessarily cruel" without justification.

It's a judgement call as to what level of 'fun' is a good thing for children to pursue at the expense of their intellectual, athletic, or social development. Is the level of depression, and suicide found in western cultures acceptable or unacceptable? Should we stop foisting 'work' and competitive rating (in the form of school in particular) on children who don't want it, in order to have a lower suicide rate?

I'm not pointing at statistics here on purpose because this is a philosophical question rather than a quantifiable scientific one.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Truly touching: [http://www.quora.com/Parenting/Is-Amy-Chua-right-when-she- ex...](http://www.quora.com/Parenting/Is-Amy-Chua-right-when-she-explains-Why- Chinese-Mothers-Are-Superior-in-an-op-ed-in-the-Wall-Street- Journal#answer_251428)

Though all the Quora responses are worth reading.

<comment><USER7> The Quora responses reveal an important point regarding Dr. Chua's book: the book was written in response to the failings of the super-strict parenting style.

The WSJ excerpt makes no mention of this, which is a bit misleading.

On another note, my mother attempted to raise me in such a manner, but she was always too busy working to do a complete job of it (she didn't bother with my older brother as much, as he was way more self-motivated than me). I'm actually a bit curious as to how Dr. Chua managed to find time to hound her daughters like this while being a professor.

<comment><USER8> You mean, the WSJ chose to highlight that fraction of the book that _reinforced a popular stereotype of Asians_. Loverly.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> Interestingly, Finnish children spend way less time with school and homework than children in Asia or Europe in general. And still Finland gets top scores on education...

<http://www.oph.fi/english/sources_of_information/pisa>

<comment><USER10> I was born in Finland in 1980. My childhood was seemingly the polar opposite of this so-called "Chinese mom" model.

I never had a guided hobby or one that would have been forced upon me, except for one time when I was six years old. (My parents enrolled me in a children's ballet class. Presumably they thought that it would be good for my body consciousness, or something. After six months I asked them if I had to do it. They said "no", so I quit, and that was that.)

Instead I was encouraged to come up with my own activities. I always felt that my parents had great expectations of me, but at the same time they were careful to never actively formulate those expectations into action points. That gave me a sense of responsibility: I knew I was just a child, but at the same time I had been entrusted the serious responsibility of deciding what I should do with my life. Should it include modern art or maybe egyptology? The best way to figure that out was to read books about it. If my parents didn't have a suitable book, I could always walk a few blocks to the library. My friends' lives had a similar degree of liberty. I don't remember us ever minding homework; it was something you could take care of in 15 minutes -- or the next morning at school, if you were feeling lucky.

Probably the general atmosphere in Finland in the 1980s played a role in making my childhood such a happy one. In retrospect, those were the "halcyon days" when the Finnish social democracy was complemented by an upstart liberalization drive that pulled the country out of the Brezhnevian gloom and stagnation of the '70s. The fun didn't last long: in 1991, the Soviet Union collapsed and pulled Finland into a recession, as the Finnish economy had become too reliant on ridiculously profitable exports to the bankrupt Soviet empire. The social(ist) ambience never really recovered.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> >On the other hand, they do seem to be loading up the top ranks of violinists and pianists.

Yes, but being able to flawlessly play back music that other people composed is mostly useless. (Only half trolling.)

The people who create the most wealth in today's society don't do it through rote labor.

<comment><USER12> The 10,000 hour rule is agnostic when it comes to spending those hours voluntarily or forced. In either case you will probably be good or even excellent at something but when forced you'll hate your skill with a passion probably just as strong as those that will love their skill that achieved it voluntarily.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> Laszlo Polgar managed to raise three kids to be chess geniuses: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laszlo_Polgar>

In "Bounce" Sofia is quoted as saying "We spent long hours on the chessboard, but it didn't seem like a chore because we loved it".

Seems there is an alternative to the chinese method.

Note that Laszlo's children didn't have a chess prodigy gene. He set out to prove that geniuses can be made, found a wife willing to do the experiment, and decided on trying chess beforehand (without sampling the children's talents).

I also like about the story that all three children lead happy lives with their chess talent.

</comment><comment><USER14> I'm chinese,share one point;

why chinese mother more attention to their children?

The competision in children is not their ability or wisdom, most of time but their parents'backdrop.

in future,80%'s children,find out the parents circumstances,you can know the guy's tomorrow

</comment><comment><USER8> If you have a class of twenty children, and all twenty have mothers who are pushing them, not just to do well, but to be _number one in the class_ , then nineteen of them have been set up for failure.

</comment><comment><USER15> There are many stories of Asian kids snapping under their first generation parent's pressure (for a famous infamous case, see Asia Carrera, who had a German father and a Chinese mom, and started out as a very bright kid in Lehigh).

I had a close friend at college who lived through this experience, he said in junior high school year he totally flipped out, got all Cs, generally nosedived. Luckily he was able to make it back, but I wonder how many of these hyper-pressured kids never do.

</comment><comment><USER16> _I don't observe that the populations of senior management or famous scientists or leading-edge computer programmers or successful politicians or rock stars are being dominated by people who are results of "Chinese Mother" parenting practices. On the other hand, they do seem to be loading up the top ranks of violinists and pianists._

It's not fair to assume that Chinese American professionals or musicians are products of a "Chinese Mother" upbringing. Chua herself disclaimed that notion when she defined a Chinese Mother as something other than a mother who is Chinese.

Also, consider that there are plenty of impediments to an Asian American becoming a successful politician or entering senior management that have nothing to do with his parents' philosophies.

</comment><comment><USER17> from the Quora thread [1]

(Christine Lu says) "UPDATE: I emailed author Amy Chua this evening (1/9). Expressed my disappointment about the WSJ piece and pointed to this Quora thread. To my surprise I received a prompt reply from her that said:

Dear Christine: Thank you for taking the time to write me, and I'm so sorry about your sister. I did not choose the title of the WSJ excerpt, and I don't believe that there is only one good way of raising children. The actual book is more nuanced, and much of it is about my decision to retreat from the "strict Chinese immigrant" model.

Best of luck to you, Amy Chua"

So it looks like someone at WSJ added a link bait title. And it worked.

That said, this "parenting style" does seem to border on cruelty. Yishsan Wong (Director of Engineering at FaceBook)'s post (on the same Quora thread) on his experience in being the subject of such a parental style is a must read. This bit seemed particularly relevant to HN

 _"What I see among other Chinese children who I was raised alongside or who I see now in workplaces today is that this method of Chinese parenting is great at producing skilled and compliant knowledge workers, but it utterly fails to produce children who can achieve greatness, remake industries, or come up with disruptive innovation.

All the Chinese-American people I know who now perform at the highest levels - both creatively and technically - either achieved this without being driven to it by their parents (ask Niniane Wang about her upbringing) or in rebellion against the paths their parents set out for them (see Tony Hsieh <http://www.businessinsider.com/t...>).

The others - the skilled and compliant mediocre - make superb employees for the truly great, and if that is what their parents consider "successful," then that's exactly what they'll get.What I see among other Chinese children who I was raised alongside or who I see now in workplaces today is that this method of Chinese parenting is great at producing skilled and compliant knowledge workers, but it utterly fails to produce children who can achieve greatness, remake industries, or come up with disruptive innovation. All the Chinese- American people I know who now perform at the highest levels - both creatively and technically - either achieved this without being driven to it by their parents (ask Niniane Wang about her upbringing) or in rebellion against the paths their parents set out for them (see Tony Hsieh <http://www.businessinsider.com/t...>). The others - the skilled and compliant mediocre - make superb employees for the truly great, and if that is what their parents consider "successful," then that's exactly what they'll get."_

fwiw (I don't have any children and nor do I intend to have any so this is all empty theorizing) I believe that the best way for parents to teach a particular set of virtues or skills (discipline, piano playing, whatever) is to _embody_ those virtues and skills in _their_ lives and leave it to the kids as to whether they should be emulated.

[1] [http://www.quora.com/Parenting/Is-Amy-Chua-right-when-she- ex...](http://www.quora.com/Parenting/Is-Amy-Chua-right-when-she-explains-Why- Chinese-Mothers-Are-Superior-in-an-op-ed-in-the-Wall-Street-Journal)

</comment><comment><USER18> All of this just reminds me of a picture: <http://i.imgur.com/qhblb.jpg>

(I know, I know... this is not reddit...)</comment>


Ask HN: Does DevOps have a future? - <AUTHOR>

With all the negativity towards DevOps over here, it makes me wonder if getting my hands into DevOps is worth the effort.<p>Suggestions, ideas, discussions and brickbats welcome. <comment><USER2> DevOps doesn't really mean anything. Do you like working on infrastructure problems and in general working with systems instead of products? The trick is to not style yourself as one thing or another. I like to tell people I'm a problem solver that happens to use code and systems to solve problems. It just so happens that currently the intersection of my interests falls under the heading of DevOps.

Also, why do you care what people think? If you can solve problems then someone will pay you money to solve problems. Continue to advance your problem solving abilities and you'll never be out of a job, DevOps or otherwise. Just to get the point across one more time: Stop caring what HN or any other place says about technology in general and just continue to advance your skills regardless of anyone's opinion.

<comment><USER3> Learn enough to be well rounded, and to not seem naive. I've met front end coders who can't perform "git clone's" without a GUI. I've met very experienced programmers who can't setup a basic ssh tunnel. I lose respect for anyone who says "this is my domain, and I don't leave it" \- not matter what domain that is. Learn basic devops, and agile, and front end, and back end, and data analysis, etc. It's all fun.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> Depends on what you want. DevOps is incredibly in demand. My VP of engineering said it is the toughest to fill role. It is critical for companies operating at scale. However, you are away from product, so over to you.

</comment><comment><USER5> I don't see why there is negativity against devops. I live in New York and it is hard to fill this role. I get job offers all the time and the market is hot in New York and California.

expect salaries around 150K to 190K if you are a good Admin who transitioned to devops. :) times are great.

</comment><comment><USER6> It absolutely has a future, but in the future it will just be called IT.</comment>


Hackertyper – Write code like on TV - <AUTHOR> http://hackertyper.net/ <comment><USER2> Now, if it wrote the code I need for my project it would be the tool I've always wanted. (grin)

</comment><comment><USER3> LoL - this is great.

This should be what pops up when we press the "Boss-Mode" hot-key on a slow day.</comment>


PinePhone Linux smartphone to sell for $149, dev kits coming soon - <AUTHOR> https://liliputing.com/2019/01/pinephone-linux-smartphone-to-sell-for-149-dev-kits-coming-soon.html <comment><USER2> Ugh, same problem as all the other "open phone" designs, absolute garbage tier hardware.

At least they're pricing it somewhat reasonably, but come on, give us some actual performance.

2.4GHz-only WiFi shouldn't even be a thing anymore. The 2.4G spectrum is a wasteland for anyone living in a densely populated area and if it weren't for a few old IoT devices I'd have it entirely turned off on my home network.

<comment><USER3> Hi, do you mind elaborating why the 2.4ghz is crap and how the 5ghz is better ? (newbie here)

<comment><USER4> The available range of frequencies is smaller in 2.4 GHz, so fewer networks can run in parallel without interfering with each other. Even in early standards with 20 MHz channels, you can only fit 3 networks in 2.4, vs in 5 it's more than 10 (exact number depends on region and other special cases). 2.4 Ghz is also somewhat better at getting through walls, which one the hand is useful, but on the other means in a dense city networks from further away can interfere.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> I think what I really want is a Linux tablet.

The latest MS Surface Go is just about right for hardware but we have no such thing for Linux. If I had that, then I could use any Linux phone with hotspot. I use an iPod Touch dedicated for Spotify, maps and messaging. No other social.

<comment><AUTHOR> Funny you should mention that - they also announced the "PineTab" in the same announcement, amongst a bunch of other nifty looking goodies. They say it'll cost only $79 ($99 with a clip-on keyboard). I can see these being super useful in a lot of situations.

[https://forum.pine64.org/showthread.php?tid=7093&pid=43850](https://forum.pine64.org/showthread.php?tid=7093&pid=43850)

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> I would be interested in this. I currently use a $12 throw away T9 style phone. I've never owned a smart phone. I would consider something like this, especially if it has physical switches for disable devices.

</comment><comment><USER7> GPS hardware is cheap, and its absence is a drastic hit on functionality.</comment>


The Pixar Theory - <AUTHOR> http://www.pixartheory.com/??? <comment><USER2> Category: Entertaining B.S.

Reminds me of Leonard Nimoy in "The Simpsons":

"Hello. I'm Leonard Nimoy. The following tale of alien encounters is true. And by true, I mean false. It's all lies. But they're entertaining lies. And in the end, isn't that the real truth? The answer is no."

<comment><USER3> Sorry! I downvoted you trying to upvote..(the arrows are damn close at the iphone)

<comment><USER3> Now I got downvoted in retaliation. Punished by my ineptitude. HN is no place for weaklings! (Game of votes)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> Having studied literature, I was taken aback by this, as it really is a nice story, that fit the facts after the fact. It is the classical "post hoc, ergo proter hoc", that is so common in (at least German) literature science.

Some small factoids are taken from "texts" (or here movies) and over them a nice story is fabricated, to "explain" these factoids.

For example the timeline. Does Cars for example mention the time anywhere in the movie? Or is this just a fictional fitting from the maker of this site?

Or does Monster Inc. somewhere mention a time, that would explain the position on the timeline?

Or the mentioned wars between animals/humans and machines/humans. Where in the movies are they referenced?

This (The Pixar Theory) is not a "scientific" theory. It does not in the least adhere to anything remotely resembling a scientific method.

Fun to see, non the less, but not explaining anything.

<comment><USER5> FWIW, though American, I studied German lit. as well, and I don't see it either. Line for line, my reaction mirrors yours.

<comment><USER6> The worst of it was that most of the fitting wasn't necessary. There is no need for there to be a link between Up and Toy Story - both stories can exist in the same universe, as there is nothing contradictory.

In fact, the author of the page doesn't seem to want all the films to be in the same universe. S/he could more accurately be described as trying to reduce the number of "magical" artifacts necessary to explain all of the things in the films that don't exist in real life. So we have the discovery of magic in Brave, and the creation of unlimited energy / strong AI in The Incredibles, and everything else flows from that. Of course trying to tie everything to just these two root causes ironically makes them all less believable than the suspension of disbelief for each individual act of "magic".

<comment><USER5> Exactly, exactly. If you see this-- I'm replying late-- lend me an ear:

This analysis itself and the curious overwhelmingly positive response by HN and especially Reddit, as measured by vote tally and the mere inclination of the author to go to the trouble of creating a website solely dedicated to the idea, are, I believe, symptoms of how American schools teach literature.

Before describing my personal experiences, I want to note first that you should forget everything you've heard Americans prop up as excuses for our education system, if not entirely, then at least for this particular discussion. Science and history teachers may need to "teach to the (easiest) test (in the world)", but English teachers can and do assign whatever books they want - the graduation test is basic essay writing.

Anyway, American English teachers are extremely fond, for whatever reason, of "themed" curricula. For example, in my 9th grade English class, we read "Native Son" by Richard Wright (black American), "Things Fall Apart" by Chinua Achebe (black Nigerian), "Cry, the Beloved Country" by Alan Paton (black South African), "Heart of Darkness" by Joseph Conrad (the only white person on this list, and, inarguably, the only High Literature as well), and something or other by Maya Angelou (black American).

So, if you can't guess, the message that year was black people got it rough. If, in your literary analysis for any section of any of these books (even Conrad's, which isn't even about black people), you concluded that the message the author meant to convey with any even remotely logical elements X, Y, and Z, was that, indeed, black people have it rough, then guess what? You're right. X, Y, and Z mean black people got it rough. A+.

Yes, I mean it. Pick three random paragraphs out of 1984. "Orwell's opinion is that totalitarianism is bad, since, here, the authorities are torturing Winston." A+, you literary genius. Get something wrong for once! Please, just for the sake of variety! "In Fahrenheit 451, the firefighters' helmets are red because communism, which is also red." Oh my God, I never thought of it that way! Somebody get this 16-year-old a Nobel.

(The sole exception to this is Shakespeare, whose meaning behind any one play even the most idiotic English teachers are unwilling to reduce to a single sentence. And, wouldn't you know it, 80% of the students in class will inevitably complain about his insistence on using Victorian English, the big jerk. Literally, I shit you not, the majority of the time American students read Shakespeare, they're reading it in a book wherein the Shakespearean version is printed on left pages and the "modern translation" is printed on the right.)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> That all the stories occur in the same universe is a given. Oddly, The Pixar Theory gives no reference (much less credit) to the long-running proliferation of Pixar characters appearing in other Pixar movies. This includes characters from _future_ movies, like Wall-E seen in Toy Story. The Pixar Theory, in its long-history view, fails to address proof most of the movies occur within a narrow timeframe, via facts like Heimlich (from A Bug's Life) appearing in Toy Story 2, and the Pizza Planet truck appearing in _every_ movie (partial exception for Brave, where it appears as a carved-wood toy alongside a bas- relief of Sully).

The Pixar Theory takes a vague notion and just, as noted "post hoc, ergo proter hoc", creates an elaborate and baseless theory to justify it a la most conspiracy theories. Alas, there is a great deal of facts available to both destroy the theory as presented, and at the same time prove the "one Pixar universe" premise to far more comprehensive and compelling effect. Instead of a few vapid paragraphs, the website should be a collection of the dozens (hundreds?) of images tying all the stories together.

<comment><USER8> Or, the more likely theory: one of the animators was bored and thought it would be neato to give the pizza truck a cameo appearance. Of course, he pointed it out to a few of his close friends and a free of the people he worked with. As Pixar continued making movies, someone would always sneak the pizza truck in, to the point it's become an integral point in their corporate culture. A Pixar movie wouldn't feel the same without looking for that cameo appearance - for the employees just as much as the consumer.

So yeah, you're right. They do all take place in a unified universe: ours. Where people are people and they do silly, fun things for the sake of them being silly and fun. Like discussing unified universe theories of movies as if there's been any shroud of evidence that would lead anyone to believe one should exist.

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> I read this theory on some other blog site a week ago - can someone confirm what it was?

The theory is tenuous as best and not overly convincing. But I love discourse like this. I think that this is the value of art, for there to be more meaning and truth in the work than the artist may have intended.

Anyway, a nice looking site. I like the idea of dedicate entire sites/domains to a single article or idea.

<comment><AUTHOR> Yes it was posted on HN.

[http://jonnegroni.com/2013/07/11/the-pixar- theory/](http://jonnegroni.com/2013/07/11/the-pixar-theory/)

<comment><USER10> 97floors.com - the people behind pixartheory.com - did cite jonnegroni.com as the source of inspiration in the footer.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> This does not even come close to the best tie-in theory of all times, as seen in this video: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fknp2aDXQyU](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fknp2aDXQyU) It's subtitled, but trust me it worth every second (especially for tarantino fan bois, such as I)

</comment><comment><USER12> This is not exactly mind-blowing or credible. Compare and contrast with this Scientific Fact:

E.T. and Star Wars are set in the same universe:

[http://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/6555/are-e-t-and- st...](http://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/6555/are-e-t-and-star-wars-in- the-same-universe)

That factoid truly astounds people (try it)...

</comment><comment><USER13> At best, theories like this serve as evidence of people's desire to find meaning and patterns in the world, especially in places where they don't exist.

If you do not maintain scientific rigidity - a questioning, truth-seeking curiosity - with constant vigilance, you will be able to create theories that explain anything, while actually explaining nothing.

If while reading this theory you got a strange feeling, as if something wasn't entirely right, GRASP that feeling and remember it. You should always seek the truth, but especially when you notice this feeling: pay attention and weigh the evidence. It's very useful to be able to reason well, and even more useful if your emotions help you reason.

</comment><comment><USER14> Nice idea! Applying the Tarantino-esque everything in one world scenario is cool.

The theory is a bit off for me though. If it was me I'd have portrayed bugs as evolution (darwinian) of the fish, and monsters of the bug. That way around then Toy story spins off Monsters University as kids are seen to be scared through their Toy's eyes. With The Incredibles being activated to tackle the Monsters problem, which then leads to Monsters Inc and the monsters switching to comedy. Then aliens take over and Brave is the re-emerging human! :) n.b. was a pixar nut as a kid.

Touché though I can't fit Ratatouille in my world :)

<comment><AUTHOR> Yes :). There are more explanation here [1]. It was already posted on HN and is linked on the website (sources). I liked the idea and the new visual, so I shared it.

[1] [http://jonnegroni.com/2013/07/11/the-pixar- theory/](http://jonnegroni.com/2013/07/11/the-pixar-theory/)

</comment></comment><comment><USER15> cracked.com did a skit about this almost a year ago.

[http://www.cracked.com/video_18459_why-pixar-movies-are- all-...](http://www.cracked.com/video_18459_why-pixar-movies-are-all-secretly- about-apocalypse.html)

<comment><USER16> The author of the original article, Jonne Groni cites that video as the inspiration of his "theory":

> Several months ago, I watched a fun-filled video on Cracked.com that > introduced the idea (at least to me) that all of the Pixar movies actually > exist within the same universe. Since then, I've obsessed over this concept, > working to complete what I call "The Pixar Theory," a working narrative that > ties all of the Pixar movies into one cohesive timeline with a main theme.

</comment></comment><comment><USER17> I'm pretty sure this is a rip off of a rant in "After Hours" on Cracked.com but still an interesting visual [http://www.cracked.com/video_18459_why-pixar- movies-are-all-...](http://www.cracked.com/video_18459_why-pixar-movies-are- all-secretly-about-apocalypse.html)

P.S. After Hours is HILARIOUS!

</comment><comment><USER18> >Another ant tells Flik not to leave the island because there are "snakes, birds, and bigger bugs out there." They do not mention humans, because there are very few humans to make it dangerous enough for insects to worry about.

I'm not sure this would be unrealistic in today's world, assuming sentient bugs. I would guess that for an ant not near a farm, non-human predators are a far greater danger than humans.

</comment><comment><USER19> Gah! What is this? Why not link to the original, which also happens to be much more readable, all one page, and doesn't require JS?

[http://jonnegroni.com/2013/07/11/the-pixar- theory/](http://jonnegroni.com/2013/07/11/the-pixar-theory/)

</comment><comment><USER20> Relevant discussion on Quora: [https://www.quora.com/Pixar-Animation- Studios/What-do-Pixar-...](https://www.quora.com/Pixar-Animation-Studios/What- do-Pixar-employees-think-of-the-Pixar-theory)

<comment><USER2> Heh quora feels like experts exchange. Show a little content for Google and external links, force registration for the rest. Meh, no thank you. Same people running it by any chance?

<comment><USER21> Your loss. Quora has some extremely excellent answers. It is well worth registering for.

For example, there was a very thorough, well written, even handed answer to a question asking for the history of the conflict in the Mideast, in terms that a 15 year old would understand: [http://qr.ae/IsPAq](http://qr.ae/IsPAq)

Another. Why does Superman wear red underwear over his costume? Turns out it has to do with the limitations of printing technology of the time. [http://qr.ae/IsPDn](http://qr.ae/IsPDn)

Another example. Why are software development task estimates regularly off by a factor of 2 or 3? [http://qr.ae/IsPMM](http://qr.ae/IsPMM)

Another: What is the most phenomenal moment in Olympic History? [http://qr.ae/IsPO5](http://qr.ae/IsPO5)

Here's one that will be of particular interest to many on HN: Would becoming homeless be a good strategy to cut costs? The first answer is from someone who elected to do that in Silicon Valley while bootstrapping his startup. [http://qr.ae/IsPik](http://qr.ae/IsPik)

<comment><USER22> Quora have (like many websites) a terrible privacy policy, saying they will share your private data with anyone they like at all.

Edit: Just in case anyone wonders what I mean:

Personally Identifiable Information: Quora may share your personally identifiable information with third parties for the purpose of providing the Service to you or with third parties offering combined services with Quora. For example, we may share your personally identifiable information with third- party partners that display Quora questions and answers through their services so that such partners can tailor content and advertising to you. If we do this, such third parties' use of your information will be bound by this Privacy Policy. We may store personal information in locations outside the direct control of Quora (for instance, on servers or databases co-located with hosting providers).

As we develop our business, we may buy or sell assets or business offerings. Customer, email, and visitor information is generally one of the transferred business assets in these types of transactions. We may also transfer or assign such information in the course of corporate divestitures, mergers, or dissolution.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER23> _Monsters vs Aliens_ is not a pixar movie but fit well between _Bug 's Life_ and _Monster Uni_...maybe something bigger...I hope anyone try to put this as the "new bible" :p

</comment><comment><USER24> Did I miss something? I feel a bit inadequate as I didn't understand what this was revealing to me, but hey it's related to Pixar so all good.

</comment><comment><USER25> Can someone at Pixar confirm or deny this? Pees?

<comment><USER26> What? I'm pretty sure it's non confirmed. It's basically just nerdy banter (like Dracula vs Hulk).

They base their assumption on the fact that movies contain models from other movies, when those are merely Easter eggs. It's like saying MSFT wanted to turn accountants into pilots for 9/11 by including a flight simulator into it. It breaks down under scrutiny.

<comment><USER25> Oh! Of course it's not confirmed. It would just be nice for someone on the inside to give a wink+nod, or tell us that's it's completely off the mark.

<comment><USER26> There was a Quora by a Pixar employee (who did distance himself from Pixar, so not official statement) comment on that. I'll paste info here because Quora sucks:

       It's a wonderful example of how, given a sufficiently large dataset,
       one can cherry-pick what one needs to construct almost any narrative.

       My daughter broke the time line, though, by pointing out
       that Heimlich has a cameo in Toy Story 2. I do want to
       give the author props for inventing the idea of the
       Monsters Inc. doors being time portals. It doesn't really
       work, but it's witty.

       As in the case of Andy's father the real reason Pixar
       films contain references to other Pixar films is rather
       mundane. It's only because somebody thought it would be
       funny and the director agreed. In the cases of things like
       John Ratzenberger's voice and the Pizza Planet Truck,
       it's  tradition and a challenge.

Source: [http://www.quora.com/Pixar-Animation-Studios/What-do- Pixar-e...](http://www.quora.com/Pixar-Animation-Studios/What-do-Pixar- employees-think-of-the-Pixar-theory)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER27> Oy. I've seen this now on two other social media. and twice on here. :( i am disappoint

</comment><comment><USER28> Anybody else feel that the author of this theory likes weed a little too much?

</comment><comment><USER29> Occam's razor</comment>


How Jan Koum Built WhatsApp - <AUTHOR> http://www.forbes.com/sites/parmyolson/2014/02/19/exclusive-inside-story-how-jan-koum-built-whatsapp-into-facebooks-new-19-billion-baby/

<comment><AUTHOR> Just goes to prove that being rejected is not the end of the world.</comment>


I tried Tesla's Autopilot, and this is what it did to me - <AUTHOR> https://innovately.wordpress.com/2015/12/09/i-tried-teslas-autopilot-and-this-is-what-it-did-to-me/ <comment><USER2> Look at the state of art of computer vision and compare that to human object recognition. It's not even close. That's only one facet where humans are still superior.

So why is everyone assuming that these self driving systems are already safer than humans at the wheel?</comment>


Research Reveals How to Take a Better Break - <AUTHOR> http://www.nirandfar.com/2017/03/how-to-spend-your-breaks-wisely-and-have-a-better-workday.html <comment><USER2> I've found listening to 10-15 min guided meditations help a lot.</comment>


Ask HN:  Good Collection Agency for Freelancers? - <AUTHOR>

I have a particularly bad client who is flat-out refusing to pay his final bill.  It was a straightforward time & materials job, with good documentation that he asked for the work to be done and that I did it.  Still, it seems there's no convincing him to pay his bills.
It's a couple thousand dollars outstanding, so I'd rather not let it go.  I'm thinking the next step is to hand this over to a collection agency to deal with this for me.  Can anybody here recommend a good one for this sort of thing?
Ideally, I'm looking for the sort of disreputable thugs who will show up at the fancy restaurant while he's having a business meeting and demand payment in the most damaging way possible.  But at the end of the day, anybody that simply gets him to pay his bills would work fine.
Any suggestions? <comment><USER2> That sucks. One strategy that I have with people that don't pay - and this used to happen in the past, it has not happened to me in a long time - is to simply call them _every_ bloody day.

Once at 9 am, once at 2 pm and once at 4:30. To ask if they've already paid the bill.

Be very polite, make sure you get the right department.

Pretty soon they'll figure out they can't disconnect their phone, and that you won't go away.

Suggest payments in terms, take $300 today, arrange for a pickup in their offices and bring a buddy with you.

But make sure you stay 'clean', don't do anything stupid because that would give them leverage to get rid of you instead.

good luck!

And next time make sure you get labour+materials up front, and your profits on delivery (and make sure they have nothing if they don't pay). That's good business sense anyway when you're a freelancer.

Some customers it is much better not to have, the paying ones you want to keep the trouble makers you want to get rid of.

<comment><AUTHOR> Yeah, this guy seems to have a standing policy of just plain not paying. He was at $18k outstanding for a while before I talked at least a little sense into him. The developer before me is still owed about $8k.

I suspect I'll never see the balance, but it would be nice to inflict $2000 worth of pain.

<comment><USER2> I sympathize with you.

For that kind of money I'd get a lawyer buddy to write a threatening letter and simply sue the bastard for breach of contract.

Bad on you though for letting it get that far.

You have to split your bills into smaller portions so that you get some idea of the credit worthiness of your customers before it starts to hurt real bad.

The 'cousin Vinnie' approach is attractive but it will only get you into trouble with the law, I would definitely advise against it.

Simply get the law involved and make sure it sticks.

And get the developer before you on the docket as well.</comment></comment></comment>


Task.FM: Create Reminders Via Email and Twitter (useful tools review) - <AUTHOR> http://www.usefultools.com/2009/07/create-reminders-via-email-and-twitter/

<comment><AUTHOR> So, what do y'all think: Task.FM or ReQall?</comment>


AndroidKickstartR: Start your next Android app in 10 seconds - <AUTHOR> http://www.androidkickstartr.com/

<comment><USER2> Enough with the linkbait pitches. Tell me it's easy, great, I could be interested. Tell me it only takes 10 seconds. that's BS. Look, I just picked up a soldering iron! My new hardware project is underway in only _2 seconds!!_ \- 5 times faster than AndroidKickstartR by simply switching to dedicated hardware!

(cue a slew of blog posts about starting your next _________ project in only 100 millseconds, because that's about how long the human brain takes to form a new thought.)

Seriously, there's such a thing as overselling. Give me less wank and better inline documentation. I like the concept a good deal, but not the way it is presented.

<comment><USER3> Really. This is Hacker News and we're presumably interested in a little more depth.

There's no sense in optimizing the "start building an Android app" process in and of itself. If you ignore the time it takes to launch Eclipse (which, to be fair, runs about 45 minutes), I can start an Android app project in less than 10 seconds too, not counting the time it takes to create a github repo. The important part is what happens after the project is set up: building and maintaining your software.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> I'd be interested to hear more experienced Android devs compare and contrast this project with Android Bootstrap:

<http://www.androidbootstrap.com/>

which I'm thinking of trying out once I'm done with my current app.

<comment><USER5> I'm definitely not more experienced than most, but I've always found myself weaving in and out of frameworks and libraries when I develop to the extent that any Bootstrap tools I've ever used as a starting point have probably cost me as much time removing what I don't need from them as starting from absolute scratch and only including things I need as I need them. Adding libraries in both Maven-based Android (I'm a stupid Vim Android developer) and Xcode iOS apps really isn't difficult. But that's only my personal opinion.

That said, this seems to populate the extensive layout and values resource directories, which is always the most tedious part of assembling a basic working Android app, where as Android Bootstrap doesn't have as many options and only populates the basic resources.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> Looks cool, but also looks just like it's aspiring to be Android Bootstrap which already exists. I don't use either, because application setup isn't really the big pain point of Android development. I'd love to see this effort being focused on something with more value, but I applaud the effort regardless.

Edit:

I judged too quickly, and this is really cool. I did a quick setup from both Android Bootstrap and Android KickstartR. Android KickstartR worked with very minimal effort, and while there were a few things I had to do manually in Eclipse because of some weirdness in the latest Android toolkit (set JDK compiler to 1.6 to fix attribute errors, rename the projects...the usual), it worked and it wasn't so think with someone else's coding and project setup style that I could easily get cranking on this. When I set up from Android Bootstrap, it flat out didn't work with a simple Import from Eclipse and when I browsed through the source files, it looks really thick with boiler plate code. Bootstrap looked more like an app in a box and less like an actual bootstrap or kick start for my own app.

This KickstartR thing can go a long way actually if it maintains the lightweight feel. I don't like that AB uses Roboguice for that reason (as an example of what I mean about lightweight vs heavy-handed in this case). The second you introduce that by default, as seems to be the case in AB, you're now tied to that whether you like it or not. I personally gave Roboguice a try and just didn't think it added value for me and wasn't my style. I have other ways of achieving the same benefits that fit my style better, so I'd rather not have it, or at least have the option to remove it.

Something cool for this KickstartR would be to support arbitrary libs and not just the really popular ones. For example, I published my own lib which currently only I'm using AFAIK. But regardless, I use this lib in all of my own work. It would be nice to add a reference from that here, especially since I publish a jar with my library so it would be as easy as copying my jar into the libs directory. A former coworker of mine did the same, and I'd love to grab his libs in the process as well (as well as things like http-request, etc).

Sorry about the quick judgment...nice work.

<comment><USER7> I'm the author of android bootstrap. Its built to work with maven and particular libs that are very common. Its very opinionated and will evolve over time. Each tool has their own value prop. Bootstrap is one for a example app or template while kickstatr is different. These tools are very useful and save a ton of time. Try to get roboguice 2 working with action bar sherlock with maven in under 10 minutes without a template/generator. Yeah good luck. Now you'll see the value of both/either.

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> I'm about to buy a new phone, and I'm going to get an iPhone 5. The primary reason is not because it's (necessarily) a better phone than any Android phones, or because iOS6 is better, but because I _can't_ spend three weeks building an iPhone app _anywhere_ nearly as I could an Android one. I don't have the time, or even close to having the time, but I know with an Android phone I would do it anyway, and it would probably just derail the other 30 things I don't have time for. (For the record, I have built an iPhone app before and it's not that it's harder than building for Android in terms of code/framework, but I don't have a Mac, a developer licence etc).

I wonder if anyone else is motivated to get an iPhone because of this? It's a kind of bizarre situation, but one I'm so glad I identified before buying a phone.

<comment><USER9> You're going to wait 2 weeks for your app and any updates to be approved anyway.

<comment><USER10> I don't think you read the post properly? It said he was getting an iPhone so he wouldn't be tempted to do development.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> Earnest question: How is this different than what Eclipse makes for you in 10 seconds?

<comment><USER12> it seems like the real value prop is adding popular libs to your project setup for you. I agree, doesn't seem like it really provides all that much value.

</comment></comment><comment><USER13> That looks neat, but the "10 seconds" thing is a bit weird. It would take me at least 2-3 minutes to evaluate those options and download the file. Also, it's not like "10 seconds" is an improvement on the status quo, which is like 5 seconds (or 2 seconds, if you have AIDE).

</comment><comment><USER14> Trademark lawsuit in 5...4...3...

<comment><USER15> He should have called it "AndroidBootstrap". Since Twitter Bootstrap is a thing that this seems much more closely aligned with.

<comment><USER16> AndroidBootstrap already exists, then I chose "AndroidKickstartR" ;)

<comment><USER17> What's the difference between this and AndroidBootstrap?

<comment><USER16> AndroidKickstartR is a dynamic android app generator. It helps to quickly start a project including the libraries you want depending on your needs. Whereas AndroidBootstrap is a more complex and complete template. So, if you don't need some "features" you have to remove the unusable/unused code. So, it really depends on what you need ;)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> Is there some webservice for PhoneGap like applications? One where you just paste your html and get back an android app? Thats the way I would like to develop.

<comment><USER19> Adobe bought the company doing that earlier this year and converted them into: <http://html.adobe.com/edge/phonegap-build/>

</comment></comment><comment><USER20> Just curious -- has anyone here used the AndroidAnnotations library that is included as part of this in a reasonably complex Android application? What was your experience with it like? It seems like an interesting way to avoid having to write a bunch of boilerplate code without any runtime performance implications.

<comment><USER21> I've not used it myself personally, but it seems like it doesn't really do anything that will actually shorten development time, as you'll still be typing a fair amount to get references to your views established with the annotations. It seems like it could help with making more activity setup consistent, but it is actually more useful in practice to set up base classes for fragments, activities, and services as you'll likely be configuring class- wide defaults in those places anyway.

</comment></comment><comment><USER22> As a developer only have surface level interaction with Android, this looks like a great tool to get started.

<comment><USER23> In my opinion, android development is easy enough to get started without this kind of tool. There are concepts like activities , providers ,etc ... you need to grasp that cannot be abstracted. It's like wanting to develop for a solid app for iOs without learning obj-C,while it is possible, one would throw aways everything the iOs framework gives ones for free.

</comment></comment><comment><USER24> I've never done any mobile application development but I was considering building something for my nexus. This will likely come in handy.

</comment><comment><USER25> 10 seconds. That is too quick for me. If you are messing around perhaps thats ok, but a project which is a click to include feels wrong for anything more than a tiny app which does something very basic.

Immediately when I create an app like this using this, I have clicked to include libraries. How does this import only the things that I want.

</comment><comment><USER26> It bothers me that 'starting a new app' is a repetitive enough task that something like this is considered useful. Is this really something anyone ought to be be doing twice a week?

</comment><comment><USER27> Why is this better than androidbootstrap.com ?</comment>


ASK HN: Acceptable content for Show HN? - <AUTHOR> hello all
i just wanted to run a quick question by you; i am used to seeing mostly just tech projects and things that can be directly tried out to the public in show hn, but it brings me to think certain things.
to explain, while i am a technical individual and i do write code and work with tech on occasion, i have several other forms of individual expression, namely my production of music that i've been working on for as long as i've been coding; i understand that this is a technical community, and that focus sort of restricts the possiblre type of content that one might submit to it, but my problem here is, i put just as much intellectual effort and have the same experience with producing music, among other things; with that being said, with the technological processes i undergo to make music (even if not directly related to music), would it be, i suppose, the opposite of appropriate to provide such content? i'm not opposed to any specific answer, and i'm not looking for a yes or no, but more than anything, a discussion on the merits of content that is only peripheral to tech, perhaps invoking it in the process of creation. that is to say, there is an involvement, but the ultimate product is more than just a script or a project meant to do something, but perhaps say, an album, or a youtube channel/playlist showcasing music, or, really, any other sort of artistic content that could be shared.
as far as i see it, the only way around the current restriction of content, how i interpret it at least, would be to provide a walkthrough or an analysis on the technical processes that were invoked and perhaps some education on how to perform them, in creating said product.
thoughts? <comment><USER2> If you have something relevant, post it here. If it's relevant to another community (musicians, for example) post it there.

If you don't have something relevant to this community but think you can write something up, just do it.

<comment><AUTHOR> i think that is about the most succinct and to the point answer i have ever read in my life. just wanted to let you know that i appreciate your brevity ++</comment></comment>


Show HN: MyProxy, app to help you deploy to your own server and domain name - <AUTHOR> https://garagescript.github.io/myProxy/ <comment><AUTHOR> OP here. When I'm not at work I mentor self learners who are trying to become a software engineers. I thought it would be helpful for their learning to build and launch a tool that developers may find helpful.

<comment><USER2> Excellent work! And Merry Christmas, I'll take a look at this tomorrow.</comment></comment>


Raspberry Pi 3 – First Look - <AUTHOR> http://blog.pimoroni.com/raspberry-pi-3/ <comment><USER2> Links to the shop broken. It's at [https://shop.pimoroni.com/](https://shop.pimoroni.com/)

<comment><AUTHOR> Thanks for pointing that out - they should be fixed now!

</comment></comment><comment><USER3> In the cpu benchmarking, the graph would suggest single core performance is ~200% faster than the Pi Zero, but the text states it as just 48% faster.

<comment><USER4> Fixed now. It's twice as fast, i.e. 100% faster.

<comment><USER3> Hah, my maths was wrong too.</comment></comment></comment>


Tell HN: Just launched SquatNot.com for free domain classifieds - <AUTHOR>

I'm more of a business guy than hacker/programmer, and more of a lurker than a poster, but I was inspired by a thread here last week and thought I'd share. I hope it's something you'll find useful and I'd love to have any feedback.
http://squatnot.com
Thanks <comment><USER2> Apart from the "squat not" theme this seems like a generic domain trade site. What would be the benefit to other domain trade services?

The escrow link on <http://squatnot.com/about/> is buggy.

The design wastes vertical screen. The listing starts in the middle of the screen and I only see 3 sites on 1024x768.

<comment><AUTHOR> Fair enough. The design is still pretty much a default, but I thought it was simple and clean, so I didn't bother messing with it too much (I'll look into the design issue you mention when I get home later).

Most other services charge or at least require registration, neither of which I do. I plan on adding more features soon (twitter integration, etc), bt figured I would be getting ahead of myself if I had no listings :)

Is there any feature in particular you would like that other services don't offer?

</comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> Clickable link: <http://squatnot.com></comment>


Announcing the General Availability of the Microsoft Excel API - <AUTHOR> https://blogs.office.com/2016/08/03/announcing-the-general-availability-of-the-microsoft-excel-api-to-expand-the-power-of-office-365/ <comment><USER2> Curious if anyone is aware of usage stats for Office365 (and Excel + Excel API) in the workplace?

This sounds "neat" but nearly all of our customers do not use Office365 and I'm curious if it'll get any traction. Would be great to move away from VPA Macros or to promote Zapier in the workplace.</comment>


The 'Bloop' mystery solved - <AUTHOR> http://doubtfulnews.com/2012/11/the-bloop-mystery-solved/ <comment><USER2> It's never a giant squid <kicks the dirt>

<comment><USER3> Squid? Cthulhu.

<comment><USER4> Release the Kraken!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> A lot of the wild speculation regarding the bloop stemmed from the ultra low frequency audio being sped up 16x to be audible to the human ear.

<comment><USER6> I was more fascinated by the original (<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oCw16_Yxid0>). Interesting part starts at 45s.

<comment><USER7> Most of that sound is caused by artifacts of slowing the bloop down but keeping it in audible frequencies.

Here's a more realistic version of the sound and a rationale of how it was made (needs a sub-woofer or some decent headphones to actually hear it): <http://porkrind.org/missives/the-bloop/>

<comment><USER8> huh. thanks. so i guess this is obvious, given the context, but that sounds like an earthquake (a decent sized one) feels, if you see what i mean...

(also, you can hear it with decent speakers - no sub-woofer. it's audible with BW 602s (large monitors) for example)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> I confess to be slightly disappointed at this. Although there was speculation that this was indeed iceberg related, there was also speculation that possibly a living creature could be the source of this. Sad to say this but it appears that the age of discovering large animals is long past us.

<comment><USER10> Don't be so sure - the first pictures of a live giant squid are only around a decade old. The ocean is deep and dark.

<comment><USER11> Very true. Apparently we've only explored 5%, leaving 95% for a giant something to be living. It would be a sad day to realize there is nothing left to be discovered. Even at an older age I still find it fascinating and exciting to think there is something unknown, mystical and possibly magical in this world.

[1]<http://oceanservice.noaa.gov/facts/exploration.html>

<comment><USER12> I was talking to a friend recently about how little of the sea we had explored, and he wondered out loud why it seems like people tend to take a bigger interest in space than deep sea exploration.

I joked that it's because the sea is goddam scary and we're less likely to find things with tentacles in space.

But it's still a good question. Space exploration gets a lot more love from entertainment, pop culture, and news outlets.

<comment><USER13> Its easy. To explore space, all you need is a ship that can withstand pressures between 0 and 1 atmosphere. The ocean, on the other hand...

That said, spacecraft seem to get lousy fuel economy compared to submersibles.

<comment><USER14> The start may be expensive, but currently Pioneer 10 moves at over 10 km/s on about 100W of power. That is over 360,000 km on a kWh, and that mostly (<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pioneer_anomaly>) is not spent for propulsion.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> I don't believe it was anything crazy and that I believe that there is probably a common answer for what this was, but I am amazed at the HN comments so far that take this post for certification of an idea.

</comment><comment><USER16> For some reason that reminded me of the climatic (pun?) scene where the bad guys' undersea under ice lair blows up and the ice falls down to the ocean floor _facepalm_

<comment><USER17> Well, the base was man-made, who says that the ice wasn't?

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavy_water>

;-)

</comment></comment><comment><USER18> I semi-seriously think then someone got the idea for the 'solution' from this video: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90cRyd4LpJo>

</comment><comment><USER19> My theory is, it was a weather balloon.</comment>


I'm looking for a mail client for an Android tablet - <AUTHOR>

Hey, everybody. Can you recommend a zippy mail client for a Samsung Galaxy Tab3? It's important that it not use a lot of my data plan and it's gotta support IMAP. I'm willing to sign up for a new email account if I must! <comment><USER2> k9 mail.</comment>


Show HN: Hacker News like site for South Africa: ZA-Coders - <AUTHOR> http://zacoders.net/

<comment><USER2> I think all the adverts lower the tone a bit. One of strengths of HN - especially when it started - is that it was an altruistic initiative by PG.

I'm also not so sure about the design - did you consider using Arc? Download it here: <http://ycombinator.com/arc/arc3.tar> and check out news.arc

</comment><comment><USER3> I may be missing something, but why wouldn't they just use the real thing?

<comment><USER4> As a South African I found myself asking the same thing.

<comment><USER5> As a fellow South African, I support the idea simply because ZA needs more sites like this.

<comment><USER4> Check out siliconcape.com.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Doesn't look anything like HN to me.

<comment><AUTHOR> Looks aren't everything :)

I don't use HN for it looks, but for the articles and discussions. Yes, the aesthetics contribute towards that, but at the end of the day, it's about the content.

But yes, maybe it's overdone. UI was never one of my strongpoints.

<comment><USER7> Maybe he meant the HN minimalistic design which is awesome. I wish every site was more like HN (more information & less content).

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> I wonder if HN adoption is at the point where HN subs would be an option. Maybe not wide open like reddit.com/r/ but a controlled set of HN sub sections.

</comment><comment><USER9> Are there any hacker meet up groups in SA?</comment>


SVGjs 3.0 Advent Calendar – Day 4 - <AUTHOR> https://codepen.io/fuzzyma/pen/LXoEQp <comment><USER2> Nice, but I am missing a link to the actual calendar.

<comment><AUTHOR> Every day of teh calendar is posted on twitter (@svg_js) and here. In the end there will be again a summary from all days.

<comment><USER2> Thanks, got it.

But you should consider adding a link to your twitter page to the codepens, because there is so much new stuff coming in a YCombinator, if someone finds a post of one day, it is very likely that he/she will never see a post from another day by chance.

A comment below the post on YCOmbinator with a link to twitter and your website would be fine, too.

<comment><AUTHOR> Good idea! I will go with the link in the comments first. I have to test where a link in the fiddle makes most sense.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


Show HN: Donate Bitcoin to Any Charity in the United States - <AUTHOR> http://donatebitcoin.io <comment><USER2> Does this have the capacity to work with xmr or would I have to do that manually?

<comment><AUTHOR> You will need to first convert your xmr to btc in order to donate. In the future I hope to add support for all cryptocurrencies. Thank you for your interest.</comment></comment>


Release Notes for Safari Technology Preview 98 - <AUTHOR> https://webkit.org/blog/9689/release-notes-for-safari-technology-preview-98/ <comment><USER2> Still no webp support? Safari is about to become out of date.</comment>


Amazon officially sells everything, including a $36K shipping container house - <AUTHOR> https://www.curbed.com/2017/10/5/16432426/shipping-container-house-amazon-for-sale <comment><USER2> No wonder they're building a new hangar-sized Amazon Locker here.

</comment><comment><USER3> Can you buy a car from them?</comment>