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Understanding TLC NANDby Kristian Vättö on 2/23/2012 1:14 PM EST
- Posted in
- Storage
- SSDs
- Indilinx Everest
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BPB - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI just ordered the OCZ Synapse to use as a caching drive. The reviews all rave about speed increases. I am putting it in my main system. Would be nice if you could tell us where they fit in.
Also, anybody got recommendations on an SSD to get an older system to feel faster for surfing and the like? Reply
Kristian Vättö - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkIt's hard for me to say anything about caching SSDs because we haven't reviewed any other than Intel 311 Series (yet). IIRC Synapse comes with its own caching software which is different from Intel's SRT.
Fortunately, we have some more staff working on SSD stuff now. As you may have noticed, so far Anand has done all the SSD reviews. To reduce Anand's workload, I'll be doing some of the SSD reviews in the future, which should allow us to review more SSDs. In fact, I have Plextor M3 SSD on its way here :-)
As for the SSD for an older system, is it a desktop or laptop? I think the best option would be a SSD+HD combo because that is cheap and still lets you have a decent amount of storage. You can try to find older SATA 3Gb/s SSDs (e.g. Intel X25-M G2 or Samsung 470 Series, they are very reliable). You can even hunt for a used drive, some people are already switching for faster SATA 6Gb/s SSDs so you may find a bargain. Reply
ckryan - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkSynapse comes with NVELO's dataplex caching software, and there should be more consumer target caching solutions out soon. Reply
macuser2134 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkAn upcoming Plextor M3 review - this is exciting! It will certainly be interesting to find out how a Plextor drive compares to other manufacturers.
As a side note the "Pro" version of the Plextor M3 just started selling on Newegg only 2 days ago. Models PX-128M3P, PX-256M3P etc. Reply
seanleeforever - Monday, February 27, 2012 - linkthere is something else the articles did not address. the life time of a certain SSD device is a combination of its cell reliability and how often it get re-written to.
take a look at the second page, it may look like at 3x nm, the SLC can last 20 times more than MLC. However, from a device point of view, a 120 GB SLC can well last 40 or more time than a 120 GB MLC because as you write and delete file over and over.
for example, in order to re-write the entire 120 GB of information, each cell of the SLC only get erase-write once while a 120GB MLC will most likely been erased-write twice (say to change 11 to 10 to and to 00 , a SLC will need to erase and write once on each of two cells where MLC will need to erase and write at least 3 times on a single cell), or try to imagine a super MLC cell that has all the voltage level needed for 120GB storage in one cell, then every-time something is changed that cell get re-written.
this just get a lot worse in TLC design, as you reduce the number of cells to realize more storage space, you are reducing the error margin as well as increasing the cycles. the old saying still applies "there is no displacement for replacement". there is no free lunch. Reply
BPB - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThanks for the reply. I'll look into your suggestions, though given what I understand to be the limited life of SSDs I think I'll go new. Thanks again. Reply
Shadowmaster625 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkPlease keep an eye out for caching solutions such as NVELO's dataplex caching software. I am looking for one that works with XP. It doesnt make much sense to have to upgrade the OS if all you're looking for is a cheap upgrade to a 5 year old pc. $69 for a caching drive is one thing. $220 for a drive and an OS is quite another... Reply
JNo - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkAgree. I mentioned the NVELO caching software on these boards weeks (maybe months) ago after storagereview looked at them. It would be really good if you got some of their drives or even just software in to review. It is exciting that there is a competitor to Intel's caching in this space. Who knows? They may even be faster, cheaper and better.... Reply
xrror - Monday, February 27, 2012 - linkI'd also like to see some analysis on NVELO "solutions." I was looking pretty seriously at buying Corsair's version of this with their Accelerator series drives as an "impulse purchase" but lack of availability of their 60Gb package and a good read of NVELO's software "licensing" put a quick halt on that.
NVELO looks like a killer app assuming it works. Sadly I expect that it does live up to it's claims, but their DRM is pretty harsh. It's locked to your hardware, so if you say change your video card you must "re-activate."
I know that for most people that's no worse than windows itself, but I change hardware a lot, and/or I'd like to be able to move the SSD cache to other machines in my house w/o worrying that I'll get DRM lockout. Reply
Roland00Address - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - link57 months ago (4.75 years) you could get a 16gb supertalent for 600 dollars
41 months ago (3.41 years) you could get a 80gb intel (1st gen) ssd for 600 dollars.
Small deviations make a big difference when you are calculating exponential growth (and decrease) Reply
Beenthere - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkWhile the transition from SLC to MLC and now TLC sounds good, the reality is SSD makers have yet to resolved all reliability or compatibility issues with MLC consumer grade SSDs.
Last time I checked OCZ was on firmware version (15) and people are still experiencing issues. The issues are with all SSD suppliers including Intel, Smasung, Corsair, etc. not just OCZ.
If data security is important it would be wise to heed Anand's advice to WAIT 6-12 months to see if the SSD makers resolve the BUGS. Reply
extide - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkGo with an Intel, Samsung, or Crucial drive. They are reliable and fast. Reply
Beenthere - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkActually no one has any lock on SSD reliability. Intel, Samsung and Crucial have ALL had issues that required firmware updates to fix BUGS. We don't know how many more BUGS exist in their or other brands of consumer grade SSDs.
Not all HDD drives have issues. Yes some do especially the low quality high-capacity SATA drives. That however is not a good reason to buy a defective SSD.
SSD makers are just cashing in on gullible consumers. If people will pay top dollar for defective goods, that's what unscrupulous companies will ship. If consumers refuse to accept CRAP products, then the makers will fix the products or go broke. Reply
ckryan - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkYes, because everyone knows HDDs are infallible, never die, and are very fast...
Oh wait, none of that is true. Reply
MonkeyPaw - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkAs someone who tried to use a Sandisk controlled SSD recently, it's not as obnoxiously simple as you make it sound. It's one thing to know a drive will fail, it's another to experience BSODs every 20 minutes.
Making proper backups is the solution to drive failure, but a PC that crashes with regularity is utterly useless. I don't hate SSDs, I just want more assurance that they can be as stable as they are fast. Reply
martyrant - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkSo I've had the Intel 80GB X-25M G2s since launch with zero issues, no reason to upgrade firmware, no BSODs or issues. I recently bought one of their 310 80GB SSDs for an HTPC--again, 5 months later, no issues, no problems, no firmware updates.
I've had a friend who's had two Vertex 2's in RAID 0 since launch with zero issues.
I also have a friend who has had a Vertex 2 drive die 4 times on him in under 2 months (this is more recent).
As of late, it seems that a lot of manufacturers are having issues but most I believe are the latest SandForce controllers which are causing the issues.
This is why you see people who use their own controllers, or one other than a recent SF controller, not having issues.
I feel bad, I really do, for those people who have been screwed over recently by the SSDs that have been failing--but I mean generally doing the research before hand benefits you down the road in the long run.
The reason Crucial, Intel, and Samsung SSDs are not having issues is because Crucial uses a Marvell controller, Intel uses its own controller, and Samsung uses it's own controller as well. This may not be true for all their drives, but most of their drives (the reliable ones) are of those controller types.
Just do your research before hand and don't be an SSD hater because they really are, when you shell out the cash to not get the cheapest thing on the market, the biggest upgrade you can do to your computer in the last 3-5 years. I haven't upgraded my mobo/cpu in either of my 3 computers in years but you bet I bought SSDs. Reply
Holly - Saturday, February 25, 2012 - linkMy OCZ Vertex 3 serves without glitch since 2.13 firmware was released. Before that occasional system freezing was major pain. Otoh I don't feel like updating to 2.15 firmware, rather being happy with what's working now :-) Reply
jwcalla - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkYeah but even HDDs have major reliability problems... especially the high-capacity consumer drives. Reply
psuedonymous - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkThere have been a few products already mixing an SSD with a HDD to allow oft-used data to be quickly read and written while rarely used bulk data that get's streamed (rather than random access) e.g. video is relegated to the HDD. Why not do the same with two grades of NAND? A few GB of SLC (or MLC) for OS files and frequently accessed and rewritten program files, and several hundred GB of TCL (or QLC, etc) for less frequently written data that it is still desirable to access quickly (e.g. game textures & FMVs). Faster than a HDD hybrid, cheaper than an all-SLC/MLC design, and just as fast in the vast majority of consumer use cases (exceptions including non-linear video editing, large-array data processing). Reply
kensiko - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkYes that's what I thought reading this article.
We just have to make the majority of writes on MLC and put the static data on TLC. Pretty simple and probably feasible in a 2.5in casing. Reply
Kristian Vättö - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkThat's definitely a very interesting idea, I haven't actually thought about it. Maybe we will see something like that in the future. It should be feasible since we have products like Momentus XT. Reply
marraco - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkThat's what I was planning to write, so I agree, but it should be taken further: A weared out TLC cell should not be taken away by the controller/firmware. Instead it should be "degraded" to a MLC, and once it degrades, it should be used a s SLC. Reply
hechacker1 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkWhile that's an interesting concept, you would have to over provision it even more to account for storage loss as it is unable to store as many bits. It would be easier to define at creation that some of the NAND would be MLC, and some TLC.
With really large SSD's, I think the life of TLC will be pretty good simply because we'll have so much storage to work with.
Imagine if you had a 1TB SSD, with a low 750 cycles. You could still potentially get around 750TB (minus amplification) of writes onto it. Reply
xrror - Monday, February 27, 2012 - linkHah, I had this same thought also.
What would be great fun (but a nightmare for OEMs to validate) is if you as a user could arbitrarily choose what "modes" to run the flash in.
It'd also be ironic that as an SSD "wore out" it would drastically lose capacity but yet become faster while doing it ;p Reply
ViRGE - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkIt seems like this would play hell with wear leveling though. Even though you're trying to segregate (largely) static data into TLC NAND, you're still going to periodically write to TLC NAND and as such need to do wear leveling to keep from burning out a smaller number of the TLC NAND cells too soon. It seems like the need to wear level would largely negate the segregation of data. Reply
Mr. GlotzTV - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkSince SLC, MLC & TLC are physically the same why not make the firmware dynamic?
A new (empty) starts storing information as SLC, when more storage is needed saves it as MLC or TLC. To ensure good performance and a long life of the drive it should store frequently modified & temporary files as SLC, other things like movies and music (files where speed is not important and aren't modified a lot) should be stored as TLC.
other thoughts:
when a TLC cell is too worn change it to MLC and later to SLC!
I know this would require a new very complex (and probably buggy) firmware. But are there any concepts or something? Reply
jjj - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkhttp://www.anandtech.com/show/4284/sandisktoshiba-... Reply
Mr. GlotzTV - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkas far as I understood it is about removing DRAM and using some kind of pseudo SLC cache instead. Not exactly what I was thinking about but good to know anyway.
THX for the link. Reply
Kristian Vättö - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkInteresting idea, though I'm not sure if it's possible. While SLC, MLC and TLC are physically the same (i.e. they consist of the same transistors), I'm not sure what kind of process needs to be used to turn a NAND array into MLC or TLC instead of SLC. I would guess that it's more than what a simple SSD controller can do.
I can try to dig up more info on NAND manufacturing and hopefully it will shed some light to this. Either way, it does sound very complicated and the possibility of data loss is huge if the NAND type is changed during use (you can't really go from TLC to SLC without having a huge cache). Reply
ckryan - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkThere is MLC-1, which is MLC which stores only 1 bit like SLC. It's almost as good as SLC, but I assume is much cheaper -- MLC is much cheaper than SLC (even if you're discarding half the capacity). I believe FusionIO uses this in some applications. Reply
Kristian Vättö - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThere is HET-MLC (or usually known as eMLC) which is MLC NAND aimed for enterprises. It stores two bits per cell like normal MLC but its P/E cycle rate is much higher (IIRC something like 50,000). Unfortunately I don't know how it really differs from regular MLC but it's a lot more expensive than regular MLC.
SLC, MLC and TLC simply refer to the amount of bits per cell, there is no 1-bit-per-cell MLC as MLC alone means multi-level-cell, and one isn't multi ;-) Reply
ckryan - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkI wasn't aware that this was going on until I read the UCSD paper "the Bleak Future of NAND Flash Memory. Somehow, you can use MLC to store just one bit, and it gets similar, but not identical, performance to SLC.
This was the study that was said to cast doubt on the ability to scale NAND effectively past 2024.
They tested this particular MLC-1 setup. Even if you discard half the capacity of MLC, it's still cheaper than SLC bit for bit.
HET-MLC and eMLC really are just highly binned MLC NAND. Toshiba gives it's eMLC 10kPE cycles. But enterprise drives only have to retain data for 3 months at MWI=0, so some of this extra endurance comes from that. Reply
Kristian Vättö - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkOoh, interesting, thanks for the link! I was sure that you had mixed up eMLC and MLC because MLC-1 doesn't make much sense, at least not without further explanation.
Does the study say how much cheaper MLC-1 is when compared with SLC (I don't have time to read it thoroughly now, but will do tomorrow)? Like I said in the article, MLC is the highest volume product and gets the new process nodes first, so that might be the reason why MLC-1 is a bit cheaper than SLC. Shouldn't be much, though. Reply
This Guy - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThere is a better tech in the wings anyway. Memristors:
Memristors will create a giant performance boost. Their low latency and high density will allow for the replacement of HDDs and RAM. And this could be a second generation product out in three years.
If the worst memory latency was ~20ns instead of ~50µs (SSD) or ~20ms(HDD), cache misses would stop being a problem. Old, simple CPU architectures could be reproduced (with I/O upgrades) and bundled with memristor storage and compete with current designs.
In 10 years we could see CPUs replaced with multi-chip modules containing large memristor banks, ALU's with a far larger variety of operations (including GPGPU operations) and the system's I/O. No cache. No registers. No stalls. Reply
jjj - Saturday, February 25, 2012 - linkThose are dreams for now.
Anyway Sandisk/Toshiba sell a lot of TLC already, in certain products.They even had 4 bits per cell but that's not being produced anymore.As for the future they got 2 things, BiCS and 3D ReRAM. We'll see soon enough if any of those make it to market . Reply
rpmurray - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkWhile cheaper is sure tempting I'm not making the move until I stop seeing so many users giving one-star ratings on Newegg when their nice new SSD bricks itself anywhere between one day and three months. Reply
jdjbuffalo - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkAs opposed to all the people who get new 2TB hard drives that fail in the first day? Reply
pc_void - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkSo true. It is said that if it lasts for 3 months then it will probably last for years - talking about hard disk drives or anything for that matter.
In my opinion, people brick ssd drives because they are not dummy proof. Reply
pc_void - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkExcept for the exceptions. Reply
Folterknecht - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkThe same goes for many other components - hdds, gpu, mobo ...
And often enough there is either a crappy PSU or RAM involved doesnt work as it should. I dont really trust those "user reviews" on sites like Newegg, to many people writing there that have no idea what they are talking about.
Of course firmware issues exist, not denying that, but thats no reason pass the best possible upgrade for your pc (in most cases). Reply
aguilpa1 - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI feel all warm and technical inside. Reply
Taft12 - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - link"However, there have been quite a few widespread firmware issues, such as SF-2281 BSOD and Intel 320 Series 8MB bugs"
No list of SSD firmware cockups is complete without mentioning the Kingston V200 abysmal write performance:
The fact that they're handing out V+ left and right to those requesting RMAs suggests to me the problem will never get fixed. Reply
dorion - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI'm having trouble understanding why the density gain from TLC is only linear and not quadratic. It seems like the web is crawling with a bunch of articles today saying the SLC -> MLC -> TLC density gain is 16 -> 32 -> 48. It should be 16 -> 32 -> 64. Am I right? Or is there something I'm not getting? Is it part of the ECC like Gray code? Reply
Death666Angel - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkHuh?
SLC = 1 Cell, 1 bit
MLC = 1 Cell, 2 bits
TLC = 1 Cell, 3 bits
You seem to think that TLC is 1 Cell, 4 bits, which it is not. Not sure why you would think that, though. Reply
JarredWalton - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkIt's simple multiples, not powers. SLC stores one bit per cell, MLC is two, and TLC is three. MLC is thus twice the capacity of SLC, but TLC is only three times the capacity, not four. The power of two increase comes in the number of states to check: SLC checks two (0/1), MLC checks four (00,01,10,11), and TLC checks eight (000, 0001..., 110, 111). If someone were to try and do QLC they would need to check sixteen states, endurance would really plummet, and performance would be worse as well. Reply
dorion - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI cant believe I overlooked the difference between bits you can store and how high you can count with a certain number of bits. Reply
ionis - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThat only proves it should go 16->32->64.
1 bit - 2 states - 16 Gb
2 bits - 4 states (double the previous) - 32Gb
3 bits - 8 states (double the the previous) - should be 64Gb not 48Gb. I'm still confused how the author got 48Gb. Reply
JMC2000 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThe number of bits per cell is not equal to the number of voltage states. I'm not very knowledgeable in how NAND is produced, but I think the increase in voltage states by x2 per bit may have to do with the need for differentiation to write/erase each bit. Reply
ionis - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThe article explicitly states that the number of bits per cell is equal to the number of voltage states. Reply
JMC2000 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkDo you mean this paragraph?
"Rather than shrinking the die to improve density/capacity, TLC (like MLC) increases the number of bits per cell. In our SSD Anthology article, Anand described how SLC and MLC flash work, and TLC works the same way but takes things a step further. Normally, you apply a voltage to a cell and keep increasing it until you reach a point where the result is far enough from the "off" state that you now consider the cell as being "on". This is how SLC works, storing one bit per cell. For MLC, you store two bits per cell, which means instead of two voltage states (0 and 1) you have four states (00, 01, 10, 11). TLC takes that a step further and stores three bits per cell, or eight voltage states (000, 001, 010, 011, 100, 101, 110, and 111). We will take a deeper look into voltage states and how they work in the next page."
Or this one?
"SLC only has two program states, "0" and "1". Hence either a high or low voltage is required. When the amount of bits goes up, you need more voltage stages. With MLC, there are four states, and eight states with TLC. The problem is that the silicon oxide layer is only about 10nm thick and it's not immortal; it wears out every time it's used in the tunneling process. When the silicon oxide layer wears out, the atomic bonds break and during the tunneling process, some electrons may get trapped inside the silicon oxide. This builds up negative charge in the silicon oxide, which negates some of the the control gate voltage."
Nowhere in the article does it state that the number of bits per transistor is equal to the number of voltage states. Reply
ionis - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkBoth paragraphs you quoted state that TLC has 8 states.
"TLC takes that a step further and stores three bits per cell, or eight voltage states (000, 001, 010, 011, 100, 101, 110, and 111)."
"With MLC, there are four states, and eight states with TLC. " Reply
JMC2000 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThat is the total number of voltage states per cell, i.e.:
1 bpc = 2 voltage states per cell (2^1)
2 bpc = 4 voltage states per cell (2^2)
3 bpc = 8 voltage states per cell (2^3)
The voltage states are what allow each bit to read as 0 or 1. TLC has 8 voltage states to allow intermediary changes in the values of the three bits in each cell: 000, 001, 010, 011, 100, 101, 110 and 111. Reply
ionis - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkYes. That's the argument. So it should go 16->32->64. Where is the 48 coming from?
P.S. we're running out of space in this thread! Reply
Andunestel - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThe commenter above explained.
It's not double each time. The number of combinations, or voltage states, increases exponentially with the number of binary digits represented.
SLC 1 bit (0,1) = 2 states
MLC 2 bits (00,01,10,11) = 4 states
TLC 3 bits ( 000,001,010,011,110,111) = 6 states
Notice that MLC is 100% > SLC, but TLC is only 50% > MLC?
In other words:
SLC = 16GiB
MLC = SLC x 2 = 32 GiB
TLC = SLC x 3 = 48 GiB
- or -
TLC = MLC x 2.5 = 48GiB Reply
Taracta - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkFor TLC you have left out 100 and 101 so you would have
TLC 3 bits (000, 001, 010, 011, 100, 101, 110, 111) = 8 STATES!
The information is stored per CELL and the same cell is used for SLC, MLC and TLC. The difference between them is the amount of bits per cell that is all. It is not 1 MLC = 2 SLC or 1 TLC = 3 SLC. It is if cell has:
2 electron states = SLC
4 electron states = MLC
8 electron states = TLC
In binary these states are represented by:
2 states = 1bit
4 states = 2bits
8 states = 3bits Reply
This Guy - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkYour confusing bits with data. Let's look at this problem in decimals.
If you have one symbol between 0 and 9, you can represent any number 0-9.
If you have two symbols, 0-9, you can represent any number between 0-99
If you have 3, you can represent 0-999
BUT you still only have three symbols.
Back to binary, a SLC stores 1bit, MLC 2bits and a TLC 3bits. So if you have 3 SLCs, you have 3 bits and 8 possible states. Exactly the same as one TLC. I'll expand this to make this point clear:
# Cells | # Bits | # Bits | # States
6 SLC = 6x1bit = 6bits = 2^6 states
3 MLC = 3x2bit = 6bits = 2^6 states
2 TLC = 2x3bit = 6bits = 2^6 states
All three configurations can store the same data. So to answer your question, the logical blocks which SLC, MLC and TLC apear to be based on have sixteen cells per block. Hence:
16 SLC = 16 x 1bit = 16 bits
= 2^16 states
16 MLC = 16 x 2bit = 32 bits
= 2^32 states
16 TCL = 16 x 3bit = 48 bits
= 2^48 states
I know this was long and tedious, but if I'm not going to recheck this tread and I wanted to make sure I gave enough information that most people reading this should be able to understand the difference between bits and data. Reply
Taracta - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkYou do notice that in your decimal example that it is increasing by powers of 10 so why in your binary exapmple it is not increasing by powers of 2?
16 SLC = 16 x 2^1 bit = 32bits
16 MLC = 16 x 2^2 bit = 64bits
16 TLC = 16 x 2^3 bit = 128bits
No, your exapmples are incorrect so you just further confused the issue. Reply
KitsuneKnight - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkSLC doesn't have two bits, it has one. It's not 2 raised to the blah, it's just blah. Same issue applies to your MLC & TLC examples.
SLC can _represent_ two values, 'on' or 'off'. MLC can represent 4 values ('on' or 'off' | 'on' or 'off'). And, likewise, TLC represents 8 values ('on' or 'off' | 'on' or 'off' | 'on' or 'off'). As you might notice, each grouping of 'on' and 'off' is a single bit.
His examples are completely correct. Reply
JMC2000 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - link(What I would give for an EDIT function)
I forgot to add that if you had 8 bits per cell, you would have 256 voltage states (0 or 1 for each bit, plus the different variations of 8 on or off bits), though I will not list all possible combinations, as it would take too much time/room. Reply
Taracta - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkI completely agree with you. The whole premise of the article is being based on the incorrect graph while having in places, the correct information in the article. There is a difference between place holders and values. SLC - 1 bit place holder 2 bits stored, MLC - 2 bits place holder 4 bits stored and TLC 3 bit place holder 8 bits stored. Reply
Kougar - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkFirst, thanks for the article! However it has reignited a question I've had for some time.
And here comes the difference. Since SLC has more spare voltage between the states, it can tolerate a higher voltage change until the erase will be so slow that the block needs to be retired.
How is this regulated exactly... does the manufacturer still set a mandatory limit to the number or writes, or is a modern SSD capable of detecting this delay and automatically correcting for it up until the point that it is able to detect the block has exceeded the time limits (and hence write endurance) allowed? In another manner of phrasing it, are arbitrary write count limits utilized or is a modern SSD self-aware enough to determine on its own when a flash block needs to be retired, regardless of the write counts? Reply
Kristian Vättö - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkEach chip is slightly different so there is no set maximum of writes. One can last 3000 P/E cycles while the other can last 3200.
I'm not 100% sure but I think the controller is the one who decides when a certain block is too slow. I.e. it's capable of detecting the delay and when it reaches a certain point, it decides to retire the block to avoid further performance decrease. Hence it may be controller specific and some will retire blocks sooner than others, although at least Intel is saying that there is a certain delay and after that the block is retired (but it may just be a recommendation). Reply
Kougar - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThank you for your reply, Kristian!
When you mention every chip is different, that's a very excellent point and one of several reasons for the question.
The other reason behind my question was simply SSD lifespan... Anand has (several times) mentioned that even after the NAND "wears out" the data should remain readable for at least one year after that date.
Yet, all the SSD failures a huge number of others (including myself) have experienced has always been from an SSD suddenly failing outright, and not even being detected in the BIOS. I've yet to come across anyone that's claiming their drive became read only, or something else other than an outright failure or firmware related bug.Basically it seems like SSDs don't wear out, they just completely die outright for some reason. Going by your answer to my question, I'm going to safely assume NAND longevity isn't the factor in these episodes, but any input you may have on this would be quite welcome! Reply
Kristian Vättö - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkIt's true that NAND remains readable when it wears out. For MLC, the period is about one year (eMLC is only 3 months, though).
I can't say for sure what is the reason behind these early failures but I would claim that it's often controller related. In general, drives equipped with SandForce controllers experience more early failures than other drives (see the link below).
All the drives with +5% return rate are SandForce based, more specifically SF-1222 based. NewEgg yields similar data. SF-2281 based SSDs have quite a few one-star ratings, usually around 20%. Switch to Crucial or Intel (or any other non-SF drive) and we are looking at less than 10% one-star ratings, which usually imply a dead drive.
Of course, even non-SF drives experience early failures but the rate is much smaller and more common for consumer electronics. In any case, it's not the NAND that is causing the failure :-) Reply
Sivar - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI understand the necessity of reducing cost, but a sharp drop in durability coupled with a rapidly diminishing return on $savings/capacity due to the necessary greater redundancy seems a high price to pay for a linear increase in capacity.
This is one of those articles that has the excellent writing and technical thoroughness characteristic of something written by Anand himself. To top it off, it doesn't use an inefficient image format for the photos with large areas of flat color, like the first image. Reply
themossie - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkSecond that. Unusual clarity for any technical explanation. Thank you for the article, Kristian! Reply
hechacker1 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkI think the article got confusing by adding that that you can use less flash at 10.67Gb, along with 3bits per cell, giving 32Gb. Do the math: 10.67Gb * 3bits per cell = 32Gb.
It's easier to just keep in mind:
16Gb NAND * 1 bit per cell = 16Gb capacity
16Gb NAND * 2 bit per cell = 32Gb capacity
16Gb NAND * 3 bit per cell = 48Gb capacity Reply
Kristian Vättö - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThe reason is that no final product has capacity of 48Gb. Capacities go in powers of 2: 2Gb, 4Gb, 8Gb, 16Gb, 32Gb, 64Gb and so on. 48Gb isn't a power of two (and no X*3 is). Hence you have to make the die smaller so that the X*3 is a power of two, like 10.67Gb is.
In theory, you could make a 48Gb TLC die and it would work just fine. It's simply considered as an odd number in the NAND industry and hence not used. Reply
themossie - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkKristian says this is awkward because TLC capacities will not scale from MLC capacities at a power of 2, like MLC did from SLC. I am not convinced that's an issue, as scaling capacity by a power of 2 has never been a requirement in the hard drive industry.
Indeed, 80/90 GB SSDs - located between power-of-2-inspired 64 GB and 128 GB capacities - have been quite popular. For that matter, 64GB/128GB SSDs are often marketed as 60GB/120GB SSDs, partially due to provisioning...
It is awkward to describe 48Gb as 10.67Gb*3, where Gb represents physical transistors rather than bits; Gb is a unit for digital information in this context, not the physical representation of such.
This is exacerbated as the cells are physically identical - an array could store 48Gb using TLC, but only 10.67Gb with SLC. I find hechacker1's explanation more intuitive. 16Gb SLC = (16*2) 32Gb MLC = (16*3) 48Gb TLC...
The takeaway point here is that you get 50% more wafers per die for a given capacity with TLC over MLC, and this shows up directly in the cost ($0.60 cents/gb vs $0.90 cents/gb) but results in greatly reduced write cycles. Reply
Kristian Vättö - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkRemember that I'm not the one who came up with this idea ;-)
This info is straight from Micron and they indeed say that the TLC die is chopped down to 10.67 billion transistors so that it becomes a 32Gb die. Maybe OEMs are afraid of adapting "odd number" capacities. In SSDs it wouldn't be so big deal but TLC is more commonly used in devices like USB flash drives and low-end smartphones. In fact, some OEMs may even use MLC and TLC in the same model (I don't have any examples but I wouldn't be surprised).
As for why some drives have an odd capacity, it has to do with the controller design and over-provisioning. Intel's SATA 3Gb/s controller has 10 channels while most controllers have 8. That's why Intel drives have weird capacities. Populate all 10 channels with 64Gb (8GB) dies and you get 80GB. For other drives, populating all the channels works out to be only 64GB. As for SandForce drives, they have no on-board cache (DRAM) so some of the NAND (~7%) is preserved for that. That's why 128GB SF drive is marketed as 120GB.
I agree that 10.67 is an awkward number but then again, this is stuff that an average consumer doesn't really need to know. For them, the final product will look the same, thanks to the power of two capacity. The gain of TLC is the same, no matter is the die smaller or the same as MLC. TLC provides more GB per die, which means cheaper $/GB. Reply
themossie - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThe information is straight from Micron, it's just an awkward way to explain the concept. If you want to keep the industry standard capacities in your explanation, perhaps show the math as capacity/(1, 2, 3) = transistors rather than transistors * (1, 2, 3) = capacity? If capacity is fixed, solving for number of transistors required seems more intuitive.
Corsair, OCZ and Kingston all make 90 GB Sandforce 2281 SSDs. I don't know how many channels / what NAND die they use. Searching that information brought up this website first every time! Upon further consideration, I blame aNAND... :-) Reply
Kristian Vättö - Saturday, February 25, 2012 - link90GB SSDs have 96GB of NAND in them (remember that SandForce drives have ~7% over-provisioning). Most 2.5" drives have sockets for 16 NAND devices so that's simply twelve 8GB packages. Reply
Confusador - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkI read the comments thread looking for this answer, so thank you. I still don't see the logic behind it, as others have pointed out that storage capacities haven't been power-of-2 for decades. It could conceivably be firmware related, but given that overprovisioning makes (e.g.) 60 and 120 GB fairly common that seems unlikely.
Anyway, just some questions to keep in mind as you're in contact with the manufacturers. Thanks again for the great article, as the coverage here continues to be second to none. Reply
AnnihilatorX - Friday, February 24, 2012 - link
It has been claimed that algorithms to minimize write amplification will follow Moore's Law
That's not really possible due to information theory. You can only compress information to reduce write by so much (entropy theory). The improvement will be more like an exponential decay rather than an exponential growth (Moore's law) Reply
Shadowmaster625 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkI estimate somewhere around $80 billion has been invested in the NAND flash market, cumulatively. Despite this enormous capital investment, I am surprised prices are still so high. You'd think with this type of mass economy of scale, it wouldnt cost so much to produce 1TB of flash. I wonder how much energy it takes to produce 1TB of flash... Reply
MrSpadge - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkThere's so much unused space in 2.5" SSDs, let alone 3.5" drives for desktops. People wouldn't need to worry about TLC endurance, if the NAND was put into sockets and could easily be replaced. Or upgraded later on for higher capacities. And by the time you'd be doing this NAND prices will have fallen again. There'd need to be a standard for this, though...
MrS Reply
mark53916 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - link
As late as 2010 SLC's typically had 10 year retention time when new, down to
about 1 year as cells got reprogrammed and the end of life was
indicated for the device. (The number of erase cycles was
also higher than now, but had be decreasing for a few years prior
I don't know about new cell retention time when new for SLC's
now, but MLCs either show no spec or the retention time spec for NEW
cells is about 18 months.
For the various reasons mentioned in the article and earlier comments,
the effect of MLCs is that speed has been reduced and data retention time
is reduced and the fraction of long error correction time has increased
MLCs are not suitable for long term backups and spinning drives were never
good for more than 5 years EXPECTED powered off life)
MLCs just get 2 times as much storage for the same price 18 months earlier.
In the meantime, due to supply issues (capacity being used for MLC instead
of SLC) Thus SLC typically cost 8 times as much per GB compared
to MLC, rather than less than 2 times as much.) This amounts
to about a 3 year delay in SLCs reaching a given price level.
(MLC also typically comes with implementation side effects
[interleaved data layout, in particular] that means that data in
unchanged pages as seen outside of the SSD is rewritten
because data was changed at the interleaved logical location,
not because the SSD software decided that the data was getting
"weak" and needed to be refreshed.) Reply
Hulk - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkTimely, informative, well written, and just the right amount of technical detail.
Really nice job. Reply
valnar - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkI'm not sure who the target audience of TLC is. Is there really a group of people out there that is willing to sacrifice reliability and data integrity for price or capacity? I certainly wouldn't.
It's bad enough that modern hard drives in the 2TB range have longevity problems. I don't want my SSD to be in the same boat, especially since that SSD tends to be the boot drive on most PC's. Reply
foolsgambit11 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkI'm assuming TLC is a subclass of MLC, and not actually distinct as it's laid out in this article. Before TLC came along, all MLC belonged to (what I'll call) the DLC subclass, yeah?
SLC = Single level cell
MLC = Multi level cell
a. DLC = Dual level cell
b. TLC = Triple level cell Reply
Kristian Vättö - Saturday, February 25, 2012 - linkI just used the names that manufacturers use. If you look at e.g. Micron's part catalog (linked below), they use SLC, MLC and TLC. I agree that the naming is misleading because MLC should refer to any NAND with multiple bits per cell. TLC is sometimes called as 3-bit-per-cell MLC or just MLC-3 but the TLC name is gaining more momentum all the time.
http://www.micron.com/products/nand-flash/mass-sto... Reply
foolsgambit11 - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkThanks. Reply
Taracta - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkShouldn't the TLC be 64Gb? It holds twice as much information as MLC as MLC hold twice as much as SLC. Each increment in bits doubles the information stored as stated in the article, SLC 2bits stored, MLC 4bits stored and TLC 8bits (1 BYTE) stored. Reply
Taracta - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkYou are dealing with base-2 values. Each additional bit doubles the amount of data that is stored. You even have the correct values in the begining of the article. SLC stores 2 bitsof information 0 and 1, MLC stores 4 bits of information 00, 01, 10, 11 and TLC store 8 bits (1 BYTE) of information 000, 001, 010, 011, 100, 101, 110, 111 yet further down in the article you are stating that TLC stores only a third more that of SLC. You are confusing the bit place holder with the actual information that is being stored. TLC has an additional bit place holder compared to MLC which has an additional bit place holder compared to SLC. Each bit place holder increases the storage capability by a power of two (2). Reply
Kristian Vättö - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkSLC stores 1-bit per cell/transistor and the value can be either 0 or 1. It cannot be 0 and 1 at the same time.
MLC stores 2-bits cell. This means the value can be either 00, 01, 10, or 11. However, it can only be programmed to have one value. One MLC cell cannot store e.g. 00 and 01 at the same time. One 0 or 1 is one bit of data, i.e. 00 is two bits of data. I don't know how you are coming up with four bits, maybe you are mixing it with the voltage states (each value needs its own voltage state so when you program a cell to e.g. 00, it will be read as 00).
TLC just increases the bits per cell to three which means the possible values are 000, 001, 010, 100, 011, 110 101, and 111. Again, eight voltage states and three bits per cell.
Each additional bit per cell increases the voltage states by a power of 2 (in math terms: 2^n, where n is the amount of bits per cell). Amount of bits per cell is just n, it's not a power of two. MLC is 2*1=2, and 2 is 100% bigger than 1. TLC is 3*1=3. and 3 is 200% bigger than 1 but only 50% more than 2. Reply
Taracta - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkOk let me make it simple because I still think you are confusing yourself.
SLC possible values are 0 or 1 which is equal to 2 values with is 2^1
MLC possible values are 0, 1, 10 or 11 which is equal to 4 values which is 2^2
TLC possible values are 0, 1, 10, 11, 100, 101, 110 or 111 which is equal to 8 values which is 2^3
Therefore each TLC which stores 8 values (3bits) which is twice that of a MLC which stores 4 values (2bits) which is twice that of a SLC which stores 2 values (1bit)
Is this right? Reply
KitsuneKnight - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkHe's not confusing himself, you're confused about binary numbers and bits.
"Therefore each TLC which stores 8 values (3bits) which is twice that of a MLC which stores 4 values (2bits) which is twice that of a SLC which stores 2 values (1bit)"
Don't confuse the amount of bits of storage, with the maximum value it can hold.
Since you seem to be getting confused with binary numbers, lets work with decimals numbers for a bit.
Lets say an 'SLC' can represent the values 0-9. An MLC can represent the values 0-9, 0-9 or 00-99 (that's two sets of 0-9 next to each other!). A TLC can represent the values 0-9,0-9,0-9 or 000-999. It should be patently obvious that an TLC doesn't have 100 times the capcity of an SLC cell! A /single one/ can hold a VALUE 100 times, but, 3 SLCs next to each other could hold the same value.
A linear growth of bits results in an /exponential/ growth of the value those bits, when combined, can represent. It doesn't matter if all those bits are from a single cell, or X number of cells. How you get bits doesn't matter. Reply
Taracta - Monday, February 27, 2012 - linkKristian,
Did some research to see where you were coming from with the data you presented.
gives some insight on TLC block sizes and why is doesn't follow the actual size of a TLC cell. Basically some pages and not use in TLC block configurations. Strangely the amount of pages in a TLC block is more than double that of a MLC block!
I leave it up to you to clarify the article as it is somewhat confusing and needs some explanation of the differences between the cell, page and block sizes for TLC. Reply
Kristian Vättö - Monday, February 27, 2012 - linkActually, TLC block size does (or at least should) follow the bits-per-cell idea. 25nm IMFT MLC NAND brought us 8KB pages and 256 pages per block. According to your link, TLC has 384 pages per block (i.e. 3*128 which means 128 pages per bit). MLC is now using that same 128 pages per bit idea (before it was 64 pages per bit).
It's possible that TLC moved to a bigger block size before MLC and SLC because that lowers the cost and ultimately TLC is all about cost. There is need for less peripheral circuits between the blocks, which makes the die smaller and hence reduces production costs.
I don't know what this has to do with your original point about the article being wrong, though. Of course, I'm happy to answer any questions regarding TLC, or at least give it a try (I haven't studied NAND technology in a university so e.g. that math stuff in your link is over my head). Reply
mdshann - Monday, March 05, 2012 - linkI haven't seen a 500 GB hard drive for anywhere near $50 in about 6 months now... where are you getting these drives? Right now the cheapest 500 GB drive on newegg.com is $84.99 and it's a bare Hitachi. Reply


text:
Welcome to Dragon Cave! Dragon Cave is an online adoptables game. Collect eggs, raise them to adulthood, and then breed them to create interesting lineages. New types of dragons are added regularly!
Grave Dragons are not named for their connections to death or burial, but for the grave expression on their faces. This strange expression is used as a defense mechanism that causes fits of panic and terror in potential predators. Since they only eat ash and charcoal, they do not hunt. Grave Dragons are powerful fire-breathers and have been known to burn down forests and villages alike to make meals. It is believed that the markings on each Grave Dragon's wings are the faces of those who have lost their lives in fires started by that dragon.
Dragons are creatures with nearly unlimited life spans. They can survive for long periods of time, and no one has found a dragon that has died of old age. Adolescence is usually marked by the growth of a hatchling's wings, although not all breeds of dragons grow wings and some breeds have other traits that indicate the beginning of maturation. Once they hit adolescence, hatchlings change quickly, maturing to their full forms in only 2 years.
Dragons don't communicate with each other verbally, but they will growl to scare off predators and frighten prey. Young dragons will emit an extremely high-pitched squeal when they are frightened. To communicate, they use telepathy with each other and to speak to other creatures.

subset: commoncrawl


text: Safeguarding your company's most valuable assets Intangible assets are woven tightly into the fabric of an organization and critical to its success. Comments Email Print November 01, 2012 Updated Related LinksThe Big Issue: March 14, 2011What happens if we're no longer witnesses? Morning Roundup Business headlines from Crain's Cleveland Business and other Ohio newspapers — delivered FREE to your inbox every morning. Sign up for the Morning Newsletter.


text:
CONOVER, NC – Saint Leo University men's golfer Nick Brothers saved his best 18-hole performance in the postseason for the final round as he jumped to a 32nd place finish at the NCAA Division II South/Southeast Regional at the 7,064 yard, par-72 Jones Course at the Rock Barn Golf & Spa.
After a disappointing second round card that dropped him into the second half of the playing field, he came out and shot a 1-under-71 to jump nearly 30 spots with a tournament total 73-78-71—222.
While there were a lot of markings on his first two rounds' cards, the junior kept things rather straightforward on Wednesday, notching a single bogey at No. 2 and birdies at the fifth and seventh holes.
Eckerd College's Jeff Evanier along with J.P. Griffin of Georgia Southwestern University earned the right to travel to nationals as the top two individuals outside of the qualifying top five teams.
Making the trip to the NCAA National Tournament is Regional Champion Georgia College & State along with fellow Sunshine State Conference schools Barry University and Nova Southeastern.
The teams, along with qualifying individuals will head to Louisville, Ky. to compete in the NCAA Spring Festival starting Tuesday, May 15.
Brothers will return to Saint Leo after capping off an impressive junior season as he prepares to lead the Lions into the 2012-13 season.


text:
Teacher resources and professional development across the curriculum
Teacher professional development and classroom resources across the curriculum
Video Main Page
Support Materials
Hi Alicia,
Thank you so much for the feedback and recommendations! Your suggestions
should prove to be very helpful! I am contacting my department head to
purchase the CD. The NCEE site looks very helpful! This is a place I will have
to investigate further.
We do have a state Economics association. My colleague introduced me to it
last year.
The Stock Market game was a good experience last fall. I feel that I will be a
bit more competent with it next time around. Do you have any lessons that you
use to enhance the simulation?
Thanks for sharing with me!
Take care,
>===== Original Message From "Alicia Ross" <firstname.lastname@example.com> =====
>My advice is to get a copy from NCEE of their CD "Virtual Economics". I just
received mine. The cost is $99 but I put it on materials order for the school
year. It has a huge database of their lesson plans (1200!). I have copies of
their books "Capstone", "Focus on Economics", "Economic Mysteries" and a few
others, but those are the big three! The CD is a place where all these lessons
>The other thing I would tell you to do is to find out where the Economic
Education Center is for your area. I am in Northeastern Pennsylvania and our
is at the University of Scranton. When I was hired for the position I am now
in (Senior Government/Economics Teacher), I contacted Dr. Scahill at the
University through email and if memory serves I did that right from either the
NCEE site or Pennsylvania Economics site. I made an appointment and he gave me
many free materials to get started and spent a few hours with me that day. I
have gone back to the University for many great inservices sponspored by
Pennsylvania Economics people. Your own state should have their own sort of
branch of the NCEE and whenever you see a workshop or inservice put on by
them, by all means attend. They are very pragmatic and you get lots of free
materials that you can immediately implement.
>The last one attended was this spring and it was on Global Economics. We
actually did the "Why People Trade" lesson plan that you see in Workshop #1. I
end my course with a unit on Global Trade and I did this lesson plan for the
first time. The kids loved it! I always tweak the lesson plans to make them
fit my kids. I would also advise you to make yourself available for Federal
Reserve education trainings--I attended two last summer put on by the Federal
Reserve of Philadelphia and did two of the great simulations we did there.
>The other thing I would say is not to underestimate the power of these
lessons. I teach Honors, College Prep, and General Economics. Because I use a
lot of simulations, I get great response from the General Ed students. I have
about 15 teams in the Stock Market Game every spring (another great activity)
and this year my top team was from my General class and they ended the game
with about $125,000 and got to go to the University of Scranton for an awards
ceremony. I think that general ed kids almost benefit more from simulations
and other "learning by doing" strategies and they will respect you for putting
the time and effort into making your class more interesting.
>I would also tell you that the laminator is your friend when it comes to
these plans!! When you come across a lesson plan with lots of "parts" that
require copying and cutting out. make different colored copies for different
parts of the game and laminate those sheets. When I do this for the first
time, I get some kids in my study hall to help me cut and organize game or
simulation peices. These simulations require a fair amount of set up work and
if you can laminate these things, it will save you a lot of time next year.
>I have completed most of this workshop and I have to tell you that taking
this course is a great start and I am already thinking of new things to and
ways to enhance what I am already doing. I also took "Making Civics Real" and
that was awesome!
>Good Luck this year!!
David Gavron
Wayland High School Social Studies Department
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Received on Tue Jul 18 14:40:40 2006
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text: Congrats on starting your backyard cooking library with, IMHO, the best book on grilling. Lots of good food is in your future, for sure! It was the first one of Steven's books that I bought, and it's the one I recommend to those new to grilling and the pro's as well. Even though I'd been grilling for many years, I learned a bunch that really improved my skills with a set of tongs.


text:
Golden Hour, 6x6x7/8 Gallery Wrapped Canvas, $47.00 Painting # 70
painting by artist Kimberly Conrad
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text:
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text:
you know that certain out-of-state students are eligible to receive a reduced
tuition rate at Northern Arizona University?
the Western Undergraduate Exchange (WUE) Program, students who meet the
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be eligible, you must be a resident of one of these states or territories:
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Non-Arizona resident
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1Tuition and mandatory fees are established by the Arizona Board of Regents. The fall 2017 rates were approved April, 2017.
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text:
Submit News
IPad Market Share Bested by Nexus 7 in Japan
Tiffany Kaiser
January 17, 2013 11:54 AM
Recipient E-mail
Sender E-mail
(Source: ibtimes.com)
Japan's largest business daily Nikkei said that the Nexus 7 is taking over mainly because of price
Apple's iPad is notorious for being king of the tablets, but in Japan, this may no longer be the case.
Market research firm BCN conducted a survey in Japan last December to see what the tablet market share was looking like. Out of 2,400 consumer electronics stores in Japan, the iPad had 40.1 percent of the market while
Google's Nexus 7
claimed 44.4 percent.
Japan's largest business daily
said that the Nexus 7 is taking over mainly because of price. The Nexus 7 costs $199 USD while the cheapest iPad --
the iPad mini
-- is $329 USD. Both the Nexus 7 and iPad mini are 7-inch tablets.
However, the report did note that some stores in Japan have run out of the iPad mini, which may have affected the results a bit.
The iPad mini features a 7.85-inch display, 1024x768 resolution, Dual-core A5 processor, Lightning connector, 5 MP rear-facing camera, 1.2 MP front-facing camera, 720p HD video, 16GB/32GB/64GB storage options, 10-hour battery life, Bluetooth 4.0, 802.11a/b/g/n Wi-Fi (802.11n 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz) and 4G LTE availability. The iPad mini starts at $329 for the 16GB version, $429 for the 32GB, and $529 for the 64GB.
Google's Nexus 7 is a tablet made by ASUS. It runs the latest version of the Android operating system, 4.1 Jelly Bean, and packs various features like a 7-inch IPS display with a 1280x800 resolution, a quad-core NVIDIA Tegra 3 processor, a 1.2 MP front-facing camera, NFC, Bluetooth, 802.11n wireless, GPS and 16GB/32GB versions. The 16GB version
starts at $199
while the 32GB runs $249.99.
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PALM COAST, Fla. - Flagler County deputies arrested a 29-year-old Palm Coast man Friday after they said he shot into an occupied home.
Christopher Avellar was arrested at his father's home on Waywood Place around 10:15 p.m. after witnesses reported a gun being fired in the area.
Deputies said Avellar and his wife began arguing earlier in the evening. His wife left and went to her in-laws at Waywood Place. About 10 p.m., Avellar showed up at his father's home and began to violently bang on the front door, deputies said.
Avellar's father went outside to talk to his son and they began arguing, deputies said. At that point, the two parted company and Avellar went to his vehicle and retrieved a .45 caliber handgun, deputies said.
Witnesses said Avellar walked to the house and pointed the gun, shooting once. The home was occupied by six people at the time.
Deputies recovered a spent shell inside a cabinet in the garage.
Avellar was arrested at the scene and transported to the Flagler County Inmate Facility, where he was charged with six counts of shooting into an occupied dwelling, aggravated assault and domestic violence. He is being held without bail.
Copyright 2012 by News4Jax.com. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.


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CAMPBELLSVILLE, Ky. – Reed Gurchiek's Hail Mary pass was knocked away in the end zone, ending a furious second half from both teams and a penalty-filled contest, with Campbellsville holding off Cumberland, 24-19, Saturday at Citizens Bank Field-Finley Stadium.
"We played hard," said CU coach Donnie Suber, "but I told 'em in the locker room that we didn't play very smart. Some costly penalties caught up with us there at the end, we fumbled a couple of times and gave up some big plays.
"The effort is there, the kids are playing hard and I'm proud of 'em."
The Bulldogs (3-4, 1-2 Mid-South West) trailed 17-3 heading into the fourth quarter, but Broc Loveless cut into the deficit with a six-yard scoring run two plays into the final period. Campbellsville drove down the field on the ensuing possession, as Devin Guthrie blocked a field goal by the Tigers.
The Bulldogs fumbled two plays later, though, setting up Campbellsville at the CU15 and three plays later Larry Walls broke three tackles and dived for the front pylon for the score, pushing the lead back to two touchdowns.
Cumberland responded quickly with a 64-yard drive, including a 27-yard scamper from Fredrel Cross. Two plays later Michael Green rushed around right end for a four-yard TD run, making it 24-17 Tigers with 8:20 remaining.
The defense forced a punt and the Bulldogs took over at the CU45 after short punt into a stiff wind. Cross gained 10 yards on third down and Gurchiek completed a 35-yard pass to James Tiencken on fourth down, setting up CU at the four-yard line.
Green lost five yards on another sweep on second down and Gurchiek's third down pass to Cain Smith near the goal line was incomplete. On fourth down Gurchiek hit Brandon Mallory, but the fullback was pulled down at the original line of scrimmage with 44 seconds left in the game.
Again the defense forced the Tigers back, all the way to the one-yard line, and used a pair of timeouts. On third down Trevon Chatman made a remarkable catch at the 38-yard line, but he was called for offensive pass interference, one of 22 accepted penalties in the contest. On fourth down Campbellsville punter Erik Krivitsky ran around in the end zone before running out of the back for a safety with 13 seconds remaining.
Cumberland tried the Homerun Throwback on the ensuing free kick, just to the other side, with Luke Jennings throwing across to Michael Green, who had a convoy going up the right sideline. He returned the ball 41 yards for the Campbellsville 32-yard line, giving CU one last chance with 3.8 seconds left. But Gurchiek's pass to the 6-foot-5 Anthony Woodard was knocked away and out of the back of the end zone.
Cross rushed 15 times for 77 yards, but the Campbellsville defense held Gurchiek and Loveless to just 60 yards on 18 carries. Gurchiek completed 14-of-22 passes for 106 yards.
Walls finished with 81 yards on 19 attempts and one TD and Campbellsville quarterback Tajh Milliken passed for 194 yards, completing 14-of-27 attempts.
The Bulldogs moved into Campbellsville territory five times in the first half, but failed to score until the final play before intermission, fumbling twice and turning the ball over on downs once.
Loveless fumbled on 3rd-and-11 at the Tigers' 43 midway through the opening quarter, though Matt Green recovered at midfield, forcing a punt.
Early in the second period Campbellsville committed a pair of 15-yard penalties and Gurchiek completed three passes, including a 13-yard swing play to Fredrel Cross, pushing the ball to the home team's 24-yard line. But on the next play Mario Hill fumbled at the 15 and Adam Robertson recovered for the Tigers, ending another drive.
On CU's next possession two more personal foul penalties on Campbellsville moved the ball to the Tigers' 25. The drive stalled with a third down sack of Gurchiek, pushing the Bulldogs out of field goal range, and CU turned the ball over on downs with an incompletion on fourth down.
Late in the period Campbellsville had its best drive of the half after a 20-yard completion to Harrington and a 13-yard catch by Gipson, moving to the Cumberland 30-yard line. But on the next play Corey Matyskiela hit running back Larry Walls, forcing a fumble, and Rickey Dowdy recovered, giving the Bulldogs one last chance before the break, taking over with 1:50 remaining.
On third down Gurchiek completed another swing pass to Cross, who got the first down at the CU41, but the Bulldogs were whistled for holding. Cumberland still got a first down after the Tigers were called for their sixth personal foul of the half.
A second personal foul call on the drive moved the ball to the Campbellsville 35, but Gurchiek was sacked on first down. The redshirt junior made up for it on third down, going right up the middle on a quarterback draw for 25 yards for the Campbellsville 13-yard line with 17.5 seconds left. After two incompletions in the end zone, Beau Baker booted a 35-yard field goal on the final play of the half for a 3-0 Bulldogs lead at the break.
Campbellsville tied the contest at three on a 37-yard field goal from Will Ward with 6:19 left in the third quarter. Sedric Watson's 19-yard interception return for a touchdown on the ensuing possession put the Tigers ahead for good.
Chatman returned a punt 30 yards for the Tigers later in the period, setting up another short field, and Milliken found Chatman over the middle from 20 yards for the score and a 17-3 advantage with 2:48 remaining in the quarter.
Cumberland finishes the home schedule next Saturday with a 1:30 p.m. contest against Bethel University.


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You exercise your body to stay physically in shape, so why shouldn't you exercise your brain to stay mentally fit? With these daily exercises you will learn how to flex your mind, improve your creativity and boost your memory. As with any exercise, repetition is necessary for you to see improvement, so pick your favorite exercises from our daily suggestions and repeat them as desired. Try to do some mentalrobics every single day!
adj. :: Kicking back; hence, showing repugnance or opposition; stubborn resistance.
"Neither could he mobilize his army to go forth to war, nor could he punish his recalcitrant subjects." --London, Jack
Similar Articles
Word of the Day : Loquacious
Word of the Day : Veneration
Word of the Day : Vituperate
Word of the Day : Deliquesce
Word of the Day : Prolix


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Hilton Boston Back Bay40 Dalton St, Boston, Massachusetts, 02115, USA TEL: +1-617-236-1100 FAX: +1-617-867-6104
Save big at Hilton Boston Back Bay when you book the Back Bay Parking Package. Enjoy overnight accommodations at our downtown Boston hotel and receive complimentary self-parking (a $43.00/day value) for each night of your stay.
What's Included:
- Overnight accommodations
- One night of complimentary self-parking per room each night
All rates are subject to hotel availability; rate does not include taxes, gratuities or other incidental charges; certain length of stay restrictions may apply. Early departure fee may apply. This offer may not be combined with any other discounts or offers. If you are not interested in making this reservation online, please call our Internet Customer Center at 1-800-774-1500 or click here for a complete list of Hilton Reservations Worldwide phone numbers. Please request plan code "P0".


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DETROIT - The United States Postal Inspection Service is partnering with the Wayne County Sheriff's Office to host a free document shredding event Wednesday, March 6 from 10 a.m. to 5 p.m.
Residential customers may bring up to four boxes of personal identification information to West Hancock Street adjacent to the Wayne County Sheriff's headquarters, located at 4747 Woodward Avenue in Detroit, to be shredded at no cost.
Only paper will be accepted. Metal, plastic or other objects mixed in will not be accepted. Mail or documents from businesses will not be accepted.
Customers who wish to drop off their documents for shredding should have their paper items stored in boxes or containers and be ready for quick drive-up and drop-off.
The event marks the 15th annual National Consumer Protection Week.
Copyright 2013 by ClickOnDetroit.com. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.


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The new .tel domain faced its second test today as it opened its "Landrush" stage, hoping to attract small businesses to its web address book.
Kash Mahdavi, chief executive of Telnic, registry operator for .tel, said in a phone interview there had been more than 10,000 applications during the "Sunrise" phase, which began in December. Read more


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… whatever the hell that means.
Between us, I'm scared carcillo-less about this byfuglien storm headed our way. Maybe it's because when we had that tornado/mini-hurricane thing in March, 2010, all those trees fell on my house and we were without electricity for a week, and we had a lot of damage … and this is supposed to be a lot worse.
Also, I was without internet access that whole time, or a lot of it. I'm anticipating being, at minimum, without power for a while, and most of youse probably will be, too.
Maybe it'll blow out to sea.


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CVS Pharmacy Wants to Know Employees' Weight and Body Fat Or They Will Be Charged a Fine
CVS Pharmacy is requiring all employees to submit their weight, body fat, cholesterol and other vitals if they use the company's health plan. If they refuse to submit the information, they will be charged an additional $50 per month for their insurance. On one hand, with rising health insurance costs, I can understand why they want this, but on the other hand, it's very scary and brings up many privacy issues.


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Honda will hold the first-ever takeover of Times Square in 3-D technology to support the launch of the all-new CR-Z sport hybrid coupe on Thursday, September 23. Spanning five blocks of Times Square, the event marks the first time 3-D footage will be broadcasted to the public space. As a part of the takeover, Honda will run 3-D CR-Z commercial footage on the Times Square HD Spectacolor screen (located on Broadway between 46th and 47th Street) and Sony will provide 3-D Gran Turismo 5 racing simulators. Additionally, Maxim Magazine models will distribute copies of their special 3-D October issue and Honda will sponsor a special performance from chart-topping hip-hop trio, N.E.R.D.
"To bring attention to the duality of sport and hybrid that the CR-Z offers, the advertising campaign relies on a bevy of nontraditional elements—like 3-D technology—to get the attention of young, potential CR-Z buyers," said Tom Peyton, senior manager of national advertising, American Honda Motor Co., Inc. "This 3-D experience in Times Square uniquely integrates advertising, gaming and music into a single, memorable event."
The Times Square CR-Z event will run from 10:00 a.m. to 6:00 p.m. EST, with N.E.R.D. taking the stage at 12:30 p.m. to perform. Attendees will receive special glasses to view the 3-D CR-Z television commercial footage as well as have the opportunity to interact with the all-new CR-Z sport hybrid coupe. Other on-site activities include live screen printing, 3-D photo booths and prize giveaways.
The 2011 Honda CR-Z sport hybrid coupe went on sale August 24th with a manufacturer's suggested retail price (MSRP) starting at $19,200, plus a destination and handling charge1 of $750.
Connect with Honda:
Honda Multimedia Newsroom (for journalists): www.hondanews.com
Honda News & Views (for consumers): www.honda.com/newsandviews
Honda on YouTube: www.youtube.com/honda
Honda on Flickr: www.flickr.com/hondanews
Honda on Twitter: www.twitter.com/honda
1 MSRP excluding tax, license, registration, $750.00 destination charge and options. Dealer prices may vary.


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Hi guys! Does anyone know where I can get an updated version of Jacks FormMail.php script for PHP5?
I've tried updating the version I have, but it's throwing errors in places that it really shouldn't.
Even with all my years of PHP behind me, I still can't figure out what that script's doing.
I know one thing — v5 doesn't work with my hosts install of PHP5!
PHP5 is backwards compatible with PHP4 so any script written for PHP4 should continue to work on PHP5 without requiring any changes.
What sorts of errors are you getting?
Hi Stephen! I'm guessing you're familiar with Jack's FormMail script, right? Well I've been using that for years without fault.
I'm not getting errors as such, I just can't get at the variables being passed by the contact page, so required variables evaluate to being empty, plus the error and thank you pages aren't used.
But when I run something like print_r($_POST) the variables are all there.
I've since started migrating stuff over to a new server running PHP5 — starting with my 'blog — and that's when things started to not work.
The new server has register_globals turned off, which is one problem, but I've since tried a new version of the FormMail script, but that's not working either.
So if you know of a replacement to the aforementioned script(s), that would be great!
I really don't know what I'm talking about, so don't necessarily trust the messenger, however I've been messing with Jacks script all day. I found this link:
and its helped tremendously. It says that PHP 5 defaults to register_globals off and Jacks and many other older scripts use register_globals on. He recommends against turning it back on and just fixing the scripts.
If only I wern't a PHP noob.:confused:
HOWEVER, I am now getting the emails with the correct email address and subject, and my user is being correctly redirected, BUT my emails are blank. I've quadruple checked my forms and made a new completely simple form in case I missed something so I don't think its a form issue. Any ideas?
Change all the HTTP_POST_VARS in Jacks script to $_POST and fix the other problems from the post above and you should be good to go.:)
I'm now a proud, and tired noob....
Hope that helped you too.
what would be the next best alternative to jack's script?
In the end, I had to write my own.
I call it Respondr and I'm using it on my 'blog right now.
I plan on turning it into a Plugin for WordPress at some point...
YES! Over a year later and this post is still helping people!!! Thank you!!!
Um...over two years...I need some sleep!!!


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Hey there, time traveller!
This article was published 27/12/2012 (1699 days ago), so information in it may no longer be current.
Happy New Year! I hope you get to celebrate the coming of 2013 the way you want, with the friends and family you treasure most.
Do your best to savour all the good things that have happened to you this past year, and all of the progress you have made toward your long-term goals. Make a list of the things for which you feel grateful.
For this exercise, you have permission to ignore any shortcomings or mistakes, and to simply use them as a learning tool. Do not dwell on them.
This approach opens up your brain (and your heart) to being receptive to new plans, stimulates creativity, ideas and strategies, and gives you a specific list of items on which to build.
For example, your goal might have been to pay off all debt. Let's say you didn't make it. Celebrate the progress you have made and use that as your starting point this coming year.
It's also possible you slid backwards on some things. If that's the truth, then acknowledge it, and also find the areas where you have moved forward. Make that list as long as you can, including all areas of your life, not just money.
Now, how do you make 2013 even more successful than 2012?
You start off by deciding what you really want to accomplish this year... and what you want to eliminate.
You might start with two lists:
1. Things I always wanted to do...
2. Things I never want to do again...
If you have a life partner, have that person complete these lists as well, and compare. Get excited about any areas of common ground and also get excited about your partner's unique hopes and dreams.
What did you find out that you didn't know? How can you help that person progress?
Now comes the fun part, freeing yourself to dream about what you want your life to be like in one, three and five years, and beyond.
Just start thinking and write things down as they come to you. Don't worry about being too structured; that can come later. The job right now is to make your future vision as real and compelling as you can. Add in lots of details to make it come alive.
What does your ideal future look like? How does it smell? How do you feel? What are your activities? Who is with you? Walk your future self through a perfect day and write down as much detail about it as you can.
When your future vision is sufficiently gripping and undeniable, it is time to turn it into specific, measurable and time-bound goals. These are the first steps and future milestones that will help you design your financial and life plan, and then allow you to measure your progress and success.
Writing down specific goals is vital for several reasons. When you write them down, your brain goes to work on them immediately in the subconscious, finding ways to accomplish them. Writing your goals down several times is that much more effective. So, re-write your list and your plans as often as you can, refining them each time.
Remember, it is the execution of the plan that will actually get you there.
Making your vision powerful and important to you is the most important step. The next is to write down a specific plan and the daily or weekly steps you need to make it happen.
Research suggests when you combine this detailed planning with writing down specific goals, your chance of success goes up to about 90 per cent from three per cent.
Getting specific also helps you set priorities because we all have to make choices. The key is to make the right ones for YOU.
Make your life a conscious decision. Write down what you want and craft your plan to get it. Then start today... and make 2013 your best year ever!
David Christianson is a financial planner and advisor in Winnipeg, and author of Managing the Bull -- A No-Nonsense Approach to Personal Finance.


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Bell is a picturesque township nestled in the foothills of the Bunya Mountains and surrounded by panoramic views of rolling farmland. Just 30 minutes drive from the Bunya Mountains National Park, Bell is an ideal spot to take a break and look around.
Facilities available in Bell include a caravan park, a country hotel (pub), a swimming complex, tennis courts, a lawn bowls club, a nine hole golf course and a horse racing track. Bluebelles Gallery on Wallace Street holds exhibitions featuring the work of local artists as well as art workshops. The main social gathering point in town is at the 'Bellvue' pub, while at the Memorial Hall country dances and/or balls are hosted a number of times during each year.
Due to the steep winding ascent, taking caravans up to the Bunya Mountains is discouraged, so Bell offers an alternative accommodation base.
Note: Information on listed products and services are provided by the operator and were correct at the time of publishing. Rates are indicative based on the minimum and maximum available prices of products and services. Please visit the operator's website for further information. All prices quoted are in Australian dollars (AUD).


text: Contents[show] FunctionEdit undefined Default ValueEdit undefined Possible ValuesEdit undefined NotesEdit undefined Retrieved from "http://slingbox.wikia.com/wiki/SBCore.SlingNet-MSG.port6?oldid=4709" Ad blocker interference detected! Wikia is a free-to-use site that makes money from advertising. We have a modified experience for viewers using ad blockers Wikia is not accessible if you've made further modifications. Remove the custom ad blocker rule(s) and the page will load as expected. Categories: Add category Cancel Save


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Filtering Lists
From ErlangCentral Wiki
You have a list with a bunch of items, but you want to have a copy of that list with some items removed.
lists:filter, in Erlang's standard library, allows you to filter a list based on a predicate.
1> lists:filter(fun(X) -> X rem 2 /= 0 end, [1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,0]). [1,3,5,7,9] 2> lists:filter(fun(X) -> is_list(X) end, [14,"abc",["xyz"|23]]). ["abc",["xyz"|23]]
You can supply your own predicate, as well. Here we filter a list of numbers that are greater than some limit we've defined:
3> lists:filter(fun(X) -> X > 12 end, 3> lists:map(fun(Y) -> Y * Y end, [1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8])). [16,25,36,49,64]
Erlang ships with a few versions of filter in the lists module, along with variants such as mapfoldl that allow you to combine a map and foldl operation into a single pass.
For the best efficiency in your programs, you should review the existing functionality in the lists module to see if there are any combined functions that could reduce the amount of list traversal in your application.


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Your silence is screaming, Part 2
Recent news reports teem with commentary on the actions of Boy Scouts of America to cover up years of child sexual abuse allegations. Referred to as the "Perversion Files," reports of adults sexually abusing scouts spanned decades, from 1970-1991. About 500 of these cases came from disclosures by scouts, parents or staff members, rather than from police reports. About 80% of these instances were never reported to law enforcement by the organization. To make matters worse, the alleged perpetrators were commonly asked to resign quietly, or offered bogus reasons for leaving, in order to maintain the integrity of the organization.
News flash: there is no integrity in covering up the ongoing sexual harm of children. One report discusses the aftermath of this silence—a man who volunteered as a camp doctor maintained his practice as a pediatrician for over 35 years after being banned from the Scouts, with no official report made. The Boy Scout Oath reads,
"On my honor I will do my best
To do my duty to God and my country
and to obey the Scout Law;
To help other people at all times;
To keep myself physically strong,
mentally awake, and morally straight."
Unfortunately, there was no helping other people, neither child victims nor alleged perpetrators, in covering up these reports. The choice to stay silent seems unethical and immoral from my perspective. One issue that the Boy Scouts of America has elected to speak out about though is the ban of Gay scout leaders. This ban is rooted in heterosexism and the belief that homosexuality is inherently disordered and wrong. One blogger drew the connection between the sadly persistent myth that homosexuality is synonymous with pedophilia (see the anti-gay PSA from the 1950's below). This is a rape myth that many hate groups advocate and use to promote limitations and bans on equal marriage, serving in the military, and having a gay-straight alliance in schools. I strongly suggest that this organization revisit the concept of a wake-up call in their approach to child sexual abuse prevention. A "mentally awake," anti-sexual violence, youth-serving organization might recognize that intervening in cases of child sexual abuse by following up with a formal report makes sense, while perpetuating a heterosexist, homophobic culture by promoting rape myths makes none.
This feminist has identified the need for some good old fashioned feminist analysis of what appears to be a patriarchal organizational structure. Think about the ways that organizational policy promotes the continued oppression of so many groups, individuals and personal identities. Check out some reading material on Child Sexual Abuse Prevention. For goodness sake, practice your bystander intervention skills (en Español). If nothing else, it is time to break the silence and talk about it.


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Okay, so I'm not the most network savvy person, in fact, I got out of that area intentionally because it just wasn't for me. But I have a scenario where I need to mount a network drive on a Windows machine that is to a samba share on a NAS.
Now this works great locally, absolutely no problems what-so-ever. However, when we are travelling, obviously this doesn't work and now I need it to. Would utilizing a VPN to the NAS resolve this issue?
The steps taken when locally:1) Connect to SAMBA share directly (as they are on the same network)
The steps taken when not on the same network:1) Connect the VPN2) Connect to SAMBA share (as the VPN should make it seem like it is on the same network)
Is this correct? Or am I missing something?
Yes. You'll need a VPN endpoint - this could be the router on the NAS network if it provides this facility, or another PC on the network. Some NAS can act as the VPN endpoint in which case the router might have to support VPN pass through
Good, now to give it a try and see if it works
Success. The VPN approach worked great. I did have to enable ipv4 and ipv6 forwarding, but I think that is expected given I wanted to map a drive (does that sound right?).
You need to be careful with port forwarding as it can open up internal network nodes to scanning and potential attack. As long as the port forwarding is vpn specific rather than to any incoming IP you should be ok. You can test this by disconnecting your remote vpn client, and trying to connect to other NAS connection ports at the router's external IP e.g ftp/http. Even if this is was the case, as long as the NAS has been properly set up (no default passwords for any services, and any unrequired services switched off) you should be ok.
I think I'm okay based on that description, as the network shares require usernames and passwords and are only available on a specific network internally (I have 2 wireless networks, a guest network and a personal network -- only the personal network as access to the NAS).
When I turn off the VPN and try to connect to the NAS, it fails to do so because the IP range isn't valid (when on the guest network or an outside network).When I am on the personal network, accessing the NAS is available as long as you have a valid username and password (both on the NAS and setup within SAMBA).
As an aside, I must not have done my test right the other day, as I just disabled IP forwarding and I can connect my map network drive just fine still...
So I guess I am confused on when IP forwarding would be needed. Do you only need it if you have separate subnets that are only accessible from behind the VPN server?
Depending on the bandwidth and quality of the connection I'd be real leery about this. SMB was never meant to be a WAN protocol. VPNs help or at least can help manage the security side of things but you still have exigencies of transiting the public internet to deal with.
Its for personal use only. It seems my wife's laptop's recent issues deal with the portable hard drive it has been connected to, which causes it to lock up. So instead of using a portable hard drive as a temporary medium to getting our photos from her laptop via SD card to my NAS, I'm using a SAMBA share to give direct/writeable access to her laptop. Now that all works fine without any issues when we are home. When we are traveling, the VPN will help bridge that gap so she can still connect to the SAMBA share.
I'm open to other alternatives for sharing directories over a network (instead of SAMBA), but they must be capable of working with Windows 7 and other Linux boxes.
Gotcha. That could work file copies tend to be pretty robust and if they fail you can always try again. Now, there could be a challenge in encouraging her not do something like work on a word document remotely. Random disk access is the issue.
Ah, we are okay there, the share is specific for our photos, so she won't be really editing them from remote (except maybe orientation). All other processing she needs to do, email, documents, etc are done locally and backed up using CrashPlan which copies them to remote locations automatically.
Thing is, I didn't want CrashPlan backing up duplicates of photos all over the place, so by making this share, CrashPlan only needs to worry about the photos on the share, and nowhere else (which is nice, as if I need to do a restore, I don't have to figure out which duplicate is the latest version).


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Hey there, time traveller!
This article was published 4/9/2012 (1811 days ago), so information in it may no longer be current.
THE players are who they are and that's not really going to be changing much, including -- at least for this week -- at starting quarterback.
That was the message on Tuesday from Winnipeg Blue Bombers head coach Tim Burke, who faced a huge media scrum in what was the first opportunity for the local jackals to get at Burke since the Bombers were drilled 52-0 in Regina on Sunday by the Saskatchewan Roughriders.
The biggest news was that quarterback Buck Pierce, who's now missed six games with a foot injury, will get an expanded role at practice this week but still isn't healthy enough to get into game conditions, meaning Joey Elliott will once again get the start when the Bombers again face the Riders this Sunday at Canad Inns Stadium in the annual Banjo Bowl.
Elliott has started the last three games for Winnipeg and his performances have regressed statistically with each game, hitting bottom in Regina when he threw for just 61 yards.
Still, Burke said he didn't hesitate to give Elliott the start once again, even after the Labour Day collapse.
"One person is never to blame for such a terrible loss,'' said Burke.
Burke also rejected as unrealistic any suggestion the 2-7 Bombers might consider making wholesale changes to personnel.
"You can't change at this time of the year. If you bring guys in, they have to learn the CFL game, they have to learn how to play in the system. And by the time you do that, it's three or four weeks down the line.
"We're going to win with the guys we have and we're going to go as hard as we can go."
If their jobs aren't on the line, Burke was asked how he will motivate his players to turn this season around.
"I'm hoping pride drives them," said Burke. "Pride as a group, pride as a team, pride as an individual. I hope that drives them more than anything else."
While they played badly in Regina, Burke rejected any suggestion his players put forth less than a complete effort on Sunday.
"I didn't think the effort was bad. Guys were really playing their butts off, even when we were way behind. It was assignment mistakes more than anything else...
"And to be quite honest with you, we had guys on offence and defence and special teams -- some guys were doing their own thing. That's the stuff we're going to address this week."
Burke was asked if all the fan clamour after the game -- including calls on Facebook for GM Joe Mack to be fired -- was creating a distraction for him in just his second week as the team's head coach.
"First of all, I'm not aware of it because I don't go on Facebook. And secondly, especially now that I'm in this role as head coach, I don't read the newspapers or watch TV. Not the news at least."
Burke was asked if he had any message for Bombers fans.
"Yeah," he replied, "we're not dead yet. We're going to go out there and give it everything we got. And we need their support."
FIELD NOTES -- Burke said defensive backs Jeremy McGee and Johnny Sears are still injured and won't suit up on Sunday... Guard Steve Morley (ankle) was seeing a doctor on Tuesday and his status for Sunday had yet to be determined... Non-import running back Carl Volny could be in the lineup this week, said Burke.


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$7 Flat Rate Or Free Shipping Over $150!* MORE INFO
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Why is everyone in the alpha test jumping in this video? Is this how it's going to be all the time? If so square needs implement Jumper Fatigue to stop people from doing this. There literally hasn't been 1 second in the last 24 minutes where someone wasn't jumping.
Edit: I understand many of them were doing it to say "hey look I'm on camera". This was sort of a joke because, anyone watching will agree, it was crazy how many people were jumping almost 100% of the entire 2 hours of gameplay demonstration.
Edit 2: Rather than continue any of this I now turn it over to the official Forums where this topic has been beaten in much deeper detail. At least over there it isn't EVERYONE against the poster. So, I feel better knowing I'm not the only one on the planet who was irritated by it.
Edited, Nov 12th 2012 3:59pm by electromagnet83
Edited, Nov 13th 2012 10:55am by Wint Lock Thread: Yeah this is going nowhere now, gonna shut this one down.