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Hey guys I am at this house now that has a pipe sticking out of the stucco in the backyard and it has a cap on it.
I would like to hook up either a fire pit or a natural gas grill to it.
Is it as simple as shutting off the main valve and using a pipe wrench to hold the pipe remove the cap, and install my new gas appliance fitting to it. Use pipe dope, spray bottle soap and check for leaks?
I have done water plumbing not gas, so the iron pipes are a little new to me..
As far as tools, I just need a pipe wrench and a proper wrench for the cap, right?


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CHALLENGERS still have a few days left to enter Swindon North Rotary Club's Swimathon, in aid of Prospect Hospice.
The day-long event will take place on Saturday, April 26 at Next Generation Fitness Centre and see teams swim as many lengths as possible to raise funds for the Wroughton hospice, as well as another charity of their choice.
Each group will swim for 55 minutes – just one member at a time. The Rotary Club will distribute the sponsorship money 50/50 between Prospect Hospice and each team's preferred charity.
Ken Winslow, from the Rotary club, said: "It's neither a race nor a marathon. It doesn't matter how fast or how fit you are, everyone can take part, as long as you complete as many lengths as you can."
"Everyone will receive a medal and certificate to verify the number of lengths swum."
The swimathon will start at noon.
l To sign up and for further details visit www.rotaryswindonnorth.org.uk.

subset: commoncrawl


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Abstract Rose Print Dress
I passed by J.Crew and spotted this dress in the window - it was love at first sight. J.Crew is becoming more and more high fashion and I love nearly everything in their fall collection. This abstract rose print dress is a wonderfully chic, original cocktail dress at a wonderfully affordable price. Update: Michelle Obama brought this beauty along on the campaign trail! Now it's on sale - shop fast!


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Topic: This & That
Yesterday I received the receipt that Barbara Walters Productions received our packet of letters on Feb. 5th. Now we will play the wait and see game again.
A Teddy update. I know this problem is not about CC directly and for those of you who are new to this Board, Teddy's cancer had returned and between that and scar tissue from the Whipple it damaged his right Ureter. He has been having stents inserted every 2 months, next one is Feb 27th. We went to our new Urologist last week and he gave it to us straight. The stents are not going to work down the road, probably sooner than later. At that time he will have to go back on the nephrostomy bag. They can't remove the kidney as there is too much scar tissue and damage all around from the Whipple. I guess its not enough you all have to go through as much as you do, then you have to put up with all the other side issues. In pure Teddy style he said, OK whatever has to be as long as I can still golf!
I will let you know as soon as Barbara Walters calls!!!!


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I am relatively new to Python, and this will undoubtedly seem like a 'luser' question, but I promise I've googled until my fingers bled and I'm still behind the brick wall. Problem: I get errors when attempting to install the xlrd module. It's the first module I've tried to install, and I have to think I'm missing something simple.
python v 2.7.5
xlrd v 0.9.2
mac OSX
Here are the xlrd README instructions and the steps I've taken:
Instructions: Any OS: Unzip the .zip file into a suitable directory, chdir to that directory, then do "python setup.py install".
I don't know what qualifies as a "suitable" directory, but I downloaded the zipped file, unzipped it, and put the resulting folder in my HD. I then started python via Terminal and changed the directory using os.chdir(). I don't know what it means to "do" the final instruction step, so I tried simply typing "python setup.py install" into python. Syntax error. I tried typing "setup.py install" and "setup.py" and got more syntax errors.
According to the python.org 2.7.5 documentation, "installing the module distribution is a simple matter of running one command from a terminal: setup.py install" - yet when I do that (without changing the directory... it didn't mention it so I didn't do it) I get "-bash: setup.py: command not found". If I change what I type to "python setup.py install" I instead get a "Errno2 No such file or directory."
metulburr's module tutorial says:
3rd party software use distutils from the standard library to install themselves. So no path configuration is required to use thier code. These typically come with a setup.py file
... except that I'm apparently too ignorant to know what to do with a setup.py file.
Trust me... the fact that I can't solve this myself has me seriously questioning whether I should even continue trying to learn Python. I'm already feeling sufficiently stupid.
Thanks for any help you can offer.


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Xbox One X: Project Scorpio Edition leaks; Check it out
Aug 18, 2017 | 5 Comments
EA has released a new multiplayer trailer for upcoming racing game Need for Speed Most Wanted. Teased last week, today marks the official debut of the multiplayer portion of Most Wanted, developed by Criterion.
And what better song to put the footage to than The Who's "Baba O'Riley"? This is doing it right.
So sit back, and enjoy some fast and fun 12-person multiplayer racing action. Void of menus or lobbies, you can jump right into the open world of Fairhaven City and put your driving skills to the test.


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Meet Your Neighbors at the Second Annual World Refugee Day at MOPA
(San Diego, CA) May 15, 2012 - The Museum of Photographic Arts is proud to host the second annual World Refugee Day on June 16, in collaboration with the San Diego Refugee Forum and USA for United Nations High Commission for Refugees (UNHCR). The event will turn a spotlight on the plight of refugees, while celebrating the culture and diversity of San Diego's vibrant refugee community through conversation, food, music and film.
Quick Facts:
- There are over 43.7 million displaced people in the world, of which, an estimated 15.4 million are refugees. Less than %1 of all refugees are resettled to a third country. The United States welcomes more than half of these refugees. San Diego is the refugee capital of the United States.
- San Diego is a fitting location to celebrate this globally-recognized day for refugees, as it is home to highest population of resettled refugees in the United States. The event is free and open to public and will also include complimentary admission to the Museum's galleries.
Visitors will have the opportunity to share stories of resettlement, sample food from other cultures and discover the contributions of San Diego's vibrant refugee communities, while also meeting representatives from the region's refugee-serving organizations. Get inspired to meet your neighbor: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYuTAQzIVlI&feature=youtu.be.
Schedule of Events:
- 3:00 – 6:00 pm: Conversations with artists: El Cajon-based rapper Timz, filmmaker Cy Kuckenbacher and photographer Joshua Seale, followed by a panel discussion
- 6:00 – 7:00 pm: Reception featuring music and food from refugee-owned local businesses and performances
- 7:00 pm: Screening of the 2007 film, The Kite Runner. Please reserve a seat for the screening at http://www.mopa.org/event/2012-06-16/world-refugee-day.
Participating Artists
- Joshua Seale:Joshua and Nathalie Seale are a husband and wife team who are passionate about telling the stories of refugees from around the world. They have worked with refugees in the Middle East, Central Africa, and Southern California. Through photography and writing, they have sought to tell stories that inspire and that give dignity to people who have been uprooted due to conflict and who are seeking a better life elsewhere. Having worked with Iraqi refugees in both San Diego and Beirut, Lebanon, they have captured glimpses of the often two to three journeys that these refugees take from leaving Iraq to immigrating to cities such as El Cajon, CA. Their work can be found at: www.cultureasart.com.
- Cy Kuckenbacker:Cy Kuckenbaker was the recipient of a Fulbright Fellowship for filmmaking in 2004 and was a U.S. Peace Corps Volunteer in Lithuania from 2000-02. He received his MFA in filmmaking from the California Institute of the Arts. His film The Orphans premiered at New York's Museum of Modern Art in 2006 and went on to screen at the Pompidou in Paris, the Los Angeles Int., Calgary Int., Edmonton Int., and the Viennale film festivals. He financed his first feature film Bush League by working for the U.S. State Dept in Iraq for 21 months. Filmed in Malawi, Africa Bush League premiered in 2010 at the Vancouver Int Film Fest and won Best Doc Feature at the New Jersey Int Film Fest in 2011. His doc short INDENTURED screened at several human rights film festivals in 2010 and 2011 and screened for the House Armed Services Committee in the U.S. Congress and at the U.S. Pentagon. Cy is currently a community college professor in San Diego, CA.
- Timz:Headline-making Hip-Hop artist Timz (www.Timzonline.com) landed world-wide media interest with the single and video titled Iraq, from his first album, Open for Business. Shedding light on the destruction of his ancestral homeland, the American-born rapper of Assyrian/Chaldean and Iraqi descent shared his insights with the international news media. Timz has once again captured the world's attention with his latest eye-opening music video, Refugee. The newest effort reminds the world of the Iraq war's continuing and often unnoticed victims of the war – Iraqi refugees. Nearly five million Iraqis have been displaced from their homes since 2003 due to persecution and violence. Timz's Refugee captures the heart-wrenching stories of three individual refugees who were forced to flee Iraq and now attempting to rebuild their lives in America.
Press Opportunities: To request high-resolution images, additional information or to schedule an interview, please contact Kristine Page at 619.238.7559 X203 or via email (email@example.com).
MOPA Information: MOPA is a center for visual learning, passionately dedicated to sharing and exploring the universal language of photography. Learn more at MOPA.org.
# # #


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AlumniAU is a place you never truly leave behind. The things you learned, the challenges you overcame, the mentors who guided you, the friends you made are all part of the AU experience you treasure.
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A community of more than 30,000 in New York, across the country, and around the world, AU alumni are changing lives every day.
Alfred University is committed to staying actively involved with its alumni community long after graduation. Services include lifelong learning initiatives, career counseling and networking, student mentoring, and fun events from soccer & softball games to Homecoming.
Upcoming Events
- Alfred, NY - September 22-23 - Homecoming
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- Rochester, NY - October 7 -Alfred University vs. St. John Fisher Tailgate Party
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February 2, 2013
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Alfred University alum Robert Kalfin 'still going strong' with new production
Marvin Bell featured in LA Review of Books interview
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'Visit' Alfred!
Haven't made it back to campus in a while? Take a look at our image gallery or new video footage to see some of the updates and changes.


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Roe from Naples, FL reviewed the Fairytale Medley.
About Me: Gift Recipient,Chocolate Lover,Business Gift Giver,Discerning Shopper,Repeat Buyer,Personal Gift Giver
BOTTOM LINE: Yes, would recommend to a friend.
Comments about Fairytale Brownies Fairytale Medley: Our first experience with Fairytale Brownies was when my husband received a brownie delivery from a friend. Ever since then, I have been sending brownie gifts to our own friends and relatives as holiday gifts and for special occasions. The gourmet brownies are fudgy, moist and very tasty! Everyone that receives them loves them.
Pros: Flavor Assortment,Gourmet Taste,Individually Wrapped,Nice Presentation,Good Value,Memorable Gift,Delicious,Freshness
Best Uses: Crowd Pleaser,Personal Gift,Holiday Gift,Business Gift


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♦ Italy faces billions of euros in potential losses, after restructuring eight derivatives contracts last year. Italy's judiciary is investigating whether the Treasury risked too much monetary loss in its management of the public debt, according to the FT. The inquiry began after a 2012 treasury report was leaked to the FT and Italian daily La Repubblica.
♦The New York Times asks "Is the Civil Rights Era Over?" as it gets experts to ponder Tuesday's rejection of the Voter's Rights Act and Wednesday's same-sex ruling to recognize legally married gay couples. The FT finds a polarised national response to the measures.
♦ The Sydney Morning Herald finds a historical precedent of backstabbing underlying Australian politics and the run up to elections for prime minister. Julia Gillard "died by the sword," the Herald says, after competing against Kevin Rudd and Labor power broker Bill Shorten for the role of Australian prime minister.
♦ The Daily News Egypt sees no "safe possible outcome" and certain military involvement with the approach of the "Tamarrod," the nationwide protest movement scheduled for June 30 to demand new presidential elections in Egypt to replace president Mohamed Morsi.
♦ Foreign Policy asks why Mr Snowden missed his flight from Moscow to Ecuador — did Russian military intelligence detain him for questioning or security services question his dubious travel documents, was he afraid the plane would be grounded in the US or simply shy of journalists?
♦ The FT analyses aggressive EU lobbyists in Brussels funded by American tech companies that advocate for more liberal internet privacy rules. The issue has moved to the top of the EU legislative agenda, as the EU summit begins Thursday.
♦ A BBC interactive maps children's chances of success around the world –in health, education, work, and general well being. Read more
© The Financial Times Ltd 2016 FT and 'Financial Times' are trademarks of The Financial Times Ltd.


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Summer, to us, means laid-back patio drinks, and the king of those is sangria. Sangria is as easy to make as it is to drink; as long as you've got wine, fruit, and some kind of spirits, you're good to go.
In fact, you're just three steps away from having sangria:
Step 1: Wine.
Pretty much any wine makes a good sangria, though generally you're best off going with medium-to-light on the mouthfeel front (a super-buttery Chardonnay or inky black Zinfandel are trickier to balance with fruit). Each bottle of wine makes about 6 glasses of sangria.
Step 2: Fruit.
What's your fruit going to be? As a rule of thumb, white wines do best with citrus, apples and pears, while red wines do best with cherries and berries. Go with a cup of fruit per bottle of wine you're using, slice it and toss in a bowl with a tablespoon of sugar per cup.
Step 3: Spirits.
Spirits keep everything from getting too sweet. Brandy, cognac, or sweet vermouth are good with red wine; triple sec, elderflower liqueur or dry vermouth work nicely with white. Add 1/2 cup of spirits to each cup of fruit and sugar, and set aside until ready to serve.
When ready to serve, stir together the wine and fruit in a pitcher; pour over ice and enjoy!
Get Cooking Channel's Best Sangria Recipes here:
Looking for a great wine to get started? Meet entwine, Food Network's line of wines that are perfect on their own or paired with food.
More on Wine


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MSI GT70 Dragon Edition Notebook Review: Haswell and the GTX 780Mby Dustin Sklavos on 6/18/2013 12:01 AM EST
115 Comments
Back to Article
EzioAs - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkI knew something was wrong when I saw the benchmarks and the GTX 780M was lower than the GTX 680M. Single fan. What were they thinking? I'd say just drop the RAID SSDs, lower the amount of RAM to 16GB and focus on a more terrific cooling. RAID SSDs and more than absurd amount of RAM isn't required for gaming.
Sadly, it's just as you said Dustin, their "feature set" solution is the main attraction. A lot of people who spend tons on a gaming notebook (especially the less informed) would probably buy these just because it has more features even though it's reliability/usability goes down the drain. Reply
axien86 - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkIt turns out both system builders AND OEMS were surprised that Intel overhyped and overpromised on the thermal performance characteristics of Haswell.
First article to report this was PCPro UK: "Intel Haswell is hotter and slower than expected."
Second article by TheVerge: Can Intel deliver on Haswell Hype? Many OEMs interviewed indicate that Haswell does not mostly deliver on Intel's promise and claims.
http://www.theverge.com/2013/6/13/4426360/massive-... Reply
EzioAs - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThat's one thing. But just because they didn't get the promised thermal performance doesn't mean they should keep the poor cooling design. They did test products before it's released so they should know about the heat issues. I'm guessing they've decided to skip redesign and just let this model sell for it's features alone since not a lot of people read reviews, most of them just look at the specs and features. I'm very disappointed with MSIs decision in this matter.
Their video cards coolers are one of the best (Twin Frozr and Cyclone are great), so you'd think you can expect something similar in one of their gaming laptops. Reply
xdrol - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThey did not start the design of this laptop when the first tests of Haswell arrived, rather they started on whatever Intel promised. If Haswell were supercool as promised, then a one-fan design would be good enough (making space for... 3x SSD raid for instance). Reply
mczak - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkintel didn't overpromise. Sure everybody was somewhat expecting better perf/w but pretty much the only thing intel really promised was lower idle power. Besides, the TDP numbers were set ages ago and I haven't seen anything that they are off (yes turbo can exceed TDP but that's nothing new and clearly stated how it works in the datasheets). Plus it wouldn't really make a difference anyway as the cpu is only responsible for less than a third of the thermal budget of the cpu+gpu combo. (I have however no idea if the gtx780m itself is worse than what OEMs were expecting, at the very least I'd not be surprised there, because the gtx680mx was a imac exclusive because it exceeded the "usual" 100W TDP figure for mobile chips, and the gtx780m which is pretty much the same chip is in fact clocked higher AND supposedly is now using "only" 100W - unfortunately there's no power figures in this review compared to the older 680m which could help answer this.) Reply
Sabresiberian - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkNo, they slapped in components in an existing design that was already flawed. And, the major source of heat isn't the CPU, it's the GPU - CPU intensive performance that didn't use much GPU power was fine, it was only in apps where the GPU really needed to kick it up a notch, and the CPU also needed to supply top power, that the CPU throttled. Obvious conclusion: main source of throttling heat was the GPU, and it was woefully, badly, cooled, meaning the whole system was badly cooled.
It was improperly cooled when the 680 part was in, and it's worse now.
And, I don't recall Intel ever saying that every CPU with the "Haswell" name on it would be low powered. The whole design is a step in the direction of achieving lower power, but the real low-powered parts are those intended for smaller, lighter form factors, not full-blown gaming notebooks. Reply
Sabresiberian - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkYou missed the part in the article where OEMs said it was their adaptation of the Haswell CPUs that would slow down the proper adaptation of the lower powered SKUs, not Haswell itself. As per usual, most of them waited until the CPU was released to even think about new design considerations. Seriously, what's up with that?
The major problem in the PC industry is that manufacturers have largely based their increases in sales by what Microsoft and Intel did; a new OS or new CPU used to mean new sales - but what if one or both of these companies takes a new direction, and OEMs don't take advantage of it? Lower sales and bad products is what happens. MSI has only itself to blame for the failures of this "could have been great" notebook. Reply
alcalde - Thursday, June 27, 2013 - link>would probably buy these just because it has more features even though it's reliability/usability
>goes down the drain.
It doesn't "go down the drain" at all. It's still plenty fast enough to play almost every mainstream title at 1080p and high settings. Whether some other system gets 2 or 3 FPS higher on a particular game is really irrelevant.
>RAID SSDs and more than absurd amount of RAM isn't required for gaming.
Most people spending this kind of money are looking for more than a portable X-Box; they want a laptop they can use for demanding applications and be a desktop replacement. A desktop is more than a GPU. Reply
TheinsanegamerN - Thursday, July 11, 2013 - linkyeah, those other laptops that run 2-3 fps faster? they also run 15-20c cooler without 50db of noise. they are better designed for the work they are doing. and raid ssds are useless for gaming. games are big, and id rather have a cache ssd and a big hdd for games. or a single big ssd. same deal with ram. if you actually need that much ram, you shouldn't be buying a gaming notebook. Reply
wdfmph - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThanks for the review. I'm sure it's good. The test on Intel Core i7-4700MQ is absolutely necessary and it is the first review of the processor I have ever seen.
I just don't get the concept of "gaming laptop". It's so against the general trend for a laptop, which calls for a thinner, lighter and more durable ones. For me it's ridiculous to carry around an 8 lbs "back breaker" and play 2 hour game on a small screen. Get a desktop maybe way better for PC gamers. Or get an console at 10% of the price of this beast.
I would really appreciate if anandtech can have a test on the new slim laptops, such as vaio pro 11/13, new Acer S7, or asus zenbook infinity. Reply
NA1NSXR - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkMaybe some of us can't have a desktop, which is kind of the point of the segment. Not everyone is anchored down to a town, a state, or even a country. For me, someone who was accustomed to powerful desktops, resorting to a laptop for everything I need a computer to do was hard, but it had to be done after taking a job overseas. Thanks to this segment, I have preserved all of the functionality of my desktop with reasonable performance. The big chassis allows these machines to be overclocked to decent speeds. My Ivy Bridge is running at 3.8GHz on 4 cores and 4GHz on 1, and my 680M runs at 967MHz on load, all with excellent temperatures. I would say I salvaged a good 80% of my desktop performance after being forced on to a laptop and on a day to day basis this is quite acceptable. If this segment did not exist my situation would require a huge compromise in my computing experience, so these "back breakers" are far from ridiculous to me. Reply
wdfmph - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkYes, for people constantly on their way to somewhere and needs tons of computing power, it make sense. Reply
Dustin Sklavos - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkJust because you don't understand a concept doesn't mean it intrinsically has no value. I don't personally like ultrabooks at all, but I recognize their appeal and purpose, and I recognize why they exist.
What you need to understand is that the traditional notebook is effectively being put out to pasture. Entry-level computing is going to be done with tablets and convertibles in not too long, ultrabooks are going to be for actual portable computing, and for high performance mobile computing, gaming laptops and mobile workstations will persist. There are a million reasons to go with just a laptop; my M17x R3 goes with me to friends' houses frequently to game, and on trips it's a good substitute for a full on desktop.
Also consider that PC gaming is enjoying a bit of a resurgence in popularity right now. We cover what we're sent, and the GTX 780M especially is worth covering. Reply
wdfmph - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkI understand there's a niche market for gaming laptop and personally I liked the design of the already dead Voodoo PC. I like pay games on PC. I'm happy to see many AAA PC games coming out. With all due respect, gaming laptop is good for hardcore gamers like you to carry around. It better than carrying a huge computer case to attend a LAN party.
I wish someday I could only take my phone and ipad to go to work. However, if I try that tomorrow, or someday next year, I am basically fooling around at office. A new Surface pro might be something close try, but with a price and weight like that, many might just opt for an "traditional" notebook such as Macbook air or slim ultrabook. Tablets and convertibles are making attempts to substitute notebooks in some way, but to be successful, serious efforts are needed from silicon to software.I don't see that will happen soon. Reply
RAWRscary - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkAmazing how narrow of a view you have. Reply
Flunk - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkI actually own both a "gaming" laptop and a desktop system. The laptop is useful when out and about and good enough for a game on the go, but I mostly bought it for software development because it was cheaper than a mobile workstation. The one I have is a little smaller (6.5lbs) but I don't find the weight or size unmanageable. As long as it fits in the backpack I'm good. Reply
BobBobson - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkYes wdfmph, that is right!
And I dont understand those queer African types who walk 10 miles every morning just to fetch some water from the well. Why don't they just go to their kitchens and turn on the cold water tap!? Idiots! Reply
ickibar1234 - Saturday, June 29, 2013 - linkGaming laptops now days aren't just for gamers, they are for Engineers and computer enthusiasts. GPUs can do so much more than just rendering these days. Also the ability to put in an Extreme CPU years down the road for cheap is a great deal. Reply
skiboysteve - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThanks for the review. Good to see people using the haswell quads. Too bad this one sucks.
I really want a thin and light laptop with the 4900MQ or 4950HQ and no discrete graphics. Just a work laptop CPU powerhouse. Only 47W to dissipate with no graphics to worry about. Why doesn't anyone build this? I would buy it for work today! Reply
Flunk - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThere are actually a few options for a quad-core Haswell without discrete graphics. Look at business-class systems like Thinkpads, Dell Lattitude or maybe HP's Elitebooks. Reply
skiboysteve - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkI got excited at your comment but I looked, there is nothing. Not a single laptop from Lenovo, Dell, or HP with Haswell and no discrete graphics. Reply
peterfares - Wednesday, June 19, 2013 - linkHaswell JUST came out. Give it a month or two. Business machines usually take a little longer than the consumer ones to refresh. Reply
ZeDestructor - Wednesday, June 19, 2013 - linkAne one might argue for good reason too.... I have yet to see a proper ThinkPad, Latitude or Precision machine overheat... Reply
TheinsanegamerN - Thursday, July 11, 2013 - linksystem 67 has a laptop with the 4750hq and iris pro graphics. Reply
SirGCal - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThis would be a laptop I would enjoy. Something I could take with me to my trips to the hospital crossed country when I have to go, but still let me game in the evenings. Granted have to be plugged in for any length of time but... My problem is just the costs. For that type of money I can build one hell of another desktop or even lanbox... I really wish that the 'build your own laptops' would take off to make that market more price competitive instead of this 'gotcha' market it is now... Reply
SirGCal - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkWell, that would be in theory ofcorse... if it could keep itself cool... Reply
TheinsanegamerN - Thursday, July 11, 2013 - linkcheck out rjtech. plenty of choices there Reply
alexvoda - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkI would like if someone at Anandtech could test the Gigabyte P27K
AFAIK it is the only notebook that has one feature I like very much: the combo USB3.0/eSATAp port. Reply
Bob Todd - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThanks for the review. Any chance there are some new 14" gaming laptop reviews in the pipeline? Specifically the Alienware 14 and Razer Blade 14? I've been travelling quite a bit lately and am contemplating something like one of those to help pass the time on the long international flights. Hell I'm even curious to see if the new 13" MBA can play some current games at 900p or 800p @ medium settings with GT3 graphics. Reply
Dustin Sklavos - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkTrying to secure them. Thankfully we have pretty good relationships with both vendors, so it shouldn't be a question of "if," but "when." Reply
TheinsanegamerN - Thursday, July 11, 2013 - linkthe clevo w230st is 13 inch with the hardware power of a fully upgraded alienware 14. and way cheaper too. Reply
kallogan - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkINTEL HASFAIL Reply
hellfish - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkif you read the story its msi fan fail. To quote "Haswell is certainly faster clock for clock" Reply
ZeDestructor - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkOptical Drive TSSTCorp SN-506BB Blu-ray writer
Chuck this out and you have all the space you need for cooling. While keeping room for another HDD or mSATA/mPCI-E SSD Cluster. Seriously, optical media needs to die. ASAP! Reply
Darkstone - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkDustin, you have to be careful detecting clock speeds. Furmark is the only tool i know that correctly detects graphics card throtteling in every case. For an example, see http://www.notebookcheck.net/fileadmin/Notebooks/S... taken from http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Schenker-XMG-P... GPU-z thinks that the GPU is happily running at it's max clock speeds. This is obviously not the case.
On the CPU side, CPU-z seems to be unable to detect throtteling in all cases with haswell. See http://www.notebookcheck.net/fileadmin/Notebooks/S... taken from http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Schenker-XMG-P... CPU-z states the CPU runs at 2.8Ghz, so does Intel turbo boost monitor. Yet Hardware Monitor measures a package power of 12.63w. No way that is possible on that clock speeds while running 8 threads on prime95. I have personally tested an i7-3820QM under prime95 and it draws around 45W @ 3.2Ghz. Haswell shouldn't be that much more power efficient under load. Reply
MrSpadge - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkOr the power reading is wrong?
Crunching BOINC on my HD4000 results in 12 -14 W reported power draw, depending on clock speeds. Yet at the wall I'm drawing 16 - 32 W (1150 - 1350 MHz with adjusted voltage), so it seems those reading simply do not factor supply voltage in, which seems perplexing. Reply
Darkstone - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThe maximum power draw of the HD 3000 is around 12w, or 20w with furmark, those results are not surprising. Intel uses the same sensor to determine when to throttle the processor. My i7-2820QM runs around 2.6Ghz when all 8 threads are stressed, consuming 45w. Under lighter loads the processor still consumes 45w on higher clock speeds.
I usually use the Package Power sensor to determine whether the processor is throttling instead of the clock speeds. Reply
Paapaa125 - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkPlease include units to upper battery life charts. "229"? Points? Minutes? Hours? What? Reply
Meaker10 - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThe fan draws air from the bottom vents (not directly under the fan) and from the keyboard and blows it out the back and side at the same time. It does not suck air through either heatsink.
The paste job on your cpu likley needed redoing. Reply
Meaker10 - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkFurther cooler boost takes your cpu temps down to 86 at which point you should not see any throttle.The issue may actually be the 180w brick at thwt point. Reply
MrSpadge - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkWhen the GPU is pumping 100+ W into those tiny heatsinks, the CPU has to be cooled by some seriously hot air. It's actually almost a heatpipe-miracle that this tiny fan manages to keep things running at all. Reply
JBVertexx - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThat thing looks like a laptop right out of the 1990's - probably the ugliest, gaudiest looking laptop I've seen in a long time.
You have to wonder, though, if thermal performance is going to be a common issue with these Haswell systems. If it's true that system builders were provided CPUs that produced much less heat than the actual production versions, then what do they do? You've designed your system, lined up your supply chain, and then the CPU's are now producing more heat than your design spec allowed for. I can see the "Max Fan" button being a last minute addition as a way around this issue.
Even so, my Dell Latitude has a better designed cooling system than this Laptop. MSI looks like they tried to cut corners based on the Haswell promise and got bit.
It really is typical MSI though, all gaudy "style" and no substance. Reply
TheinsanegamerN - Thursday, July 11, 2013 - linki think it was a msi problem. clevo laptops with haswell, the asus laptop with haswell, and the sager models with haswell dont have this issue. only msi does. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThis review is a bust. I just knew it, from the time it took to make this review.
The game benchmarks you did is nothing short but plain BS.
1080p benchmarks.
TES Skyrim:
Anandtech: GTX 780M 18% slower than GTX 680M.
Notebookcheck: GTX 780M 26% faster than GTX 680M.
Notebookit: GTX 780M 21% faster than GTX 680M.
StarCraft 2:
Anandtech: GTX 780M is 12% slower than GTX 680M.
Sadly nobody else have tested it. Nvidia got +20% with the 780M over the GTX 680M. Pretty much logical. 12% slower? Give me a break
Tomb Raider:
Anandtech: GTX 780M is 3% slower than GTX 680M
Notebookcheck: GTX 780M is 102% faster than GTX 680M.
I won`t even bother going through the benchmarks where the GTX 780M leads, but its most likely very inaccurate as pretty much every game benchmark in your test.
Source: Notebookcheck and Notebookreview
I previously used Anandtech as a source for information about mobile products, but seeing that you can`t even review a product properly, this site goes far down my must-read list.
I`m actually sick in my stomach that you guys messed up this much with a new flagship GPU.
You ought to be ashamed of yourself for not double checking your data before pushing out a BS review like this one. You numbers doesn`t make any sense at all. Reply
kogunniyi - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkDid you even read the review? That was the point... Reply
kogunniyi - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkI'll spell it out: the GTX 780m is underperforming in the MSI. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkNo its not. Go read the GT70 review on Notebookcheck.
They had no CPU throttling OR any performance issues with the GTX 780M
This review should be deleted and redone. Reply
kogunniyi - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkOK, I came on a bit too strong. The results in the review are bizarre, but they do provide reason to pause: we have no guarantee that the MSI's cooling system can handle a heavy CPU/GPU OC over a long time. The bridge doesn't help much during a load that stresses the CPU and GPU. Notebookcheck reported throttling and up to 90C for the CPU and GPU.
Of course, my thoughts might be misplaced, and the issue might be the 180W power supply. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThat is plain wrong.
The thermal capacity inside the GT70 is more than capable of cooling the 4700MQ and the GTX 780M. Visit Notebookreview forum and read reviews from owners of GT70, or read any other reviews on the internet. Nobody have these high temperatures when gaming.
The temperatures in the Notebookcheck review is when they are running Prime95 and Furmark. Not remotely close to any scenario a user will EVER encounter.
The temperatures when using it is much lower. Reply
BobBobson - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkBlah Blah Blah........
Why don't you go cash in your MSI company pay cheques you paid shill.
This review is equivocal with my and many other peoples experiences with the new GT70 Haswell notebooks. Why would Anandtech dishonestly smear a product of a major computer tech manufacturer? For the same reason you and your type scour the internet talking a sweet game about every bit of excrement that comes out MSI's back-end?
If there was a bit more honesty on the internet when it comes to tech products, people would have a lot less hassles in their lives and the world would be a better place. I commend Anandtech on this honest GT70 review, the first honest review I have seen, Reply
TheinsanegamerN - Thursday, July 11, 2013 - linkthe notebook review showed throttling. its been well established this machine has some serious thermal problems. Reply
Darkstone - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkPrime95 is far from 'Not remotely close to any scenario an user will even encounter'. All threaded applications i have personally written reach the 45W TDP limit without problems on my i7-2820QM. Which is exactly the amount of power that the processor will sustain even if the core is held at sub-zero temperatures.
Notebookcheck measures massive throtteling under prime95 + furmark with the GT70: the CPU reports under 1/4th the package power it should, the GPU downlocks to 587Mhz the second prime95 starts.
Remember: the M17x has no problems with simultaneous CPU and GPU load, even with prime95 and furmark. The GPU doesn't even reach 70° (with HD 7970m) without throttling. That seems like an unusual scenario, but not until you factor in dust or warmer climates. A notebook should not throttle on a stress test from day 1. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkIn fact, Notebookcheck bragged about how the cooling have improved from the older GT70 series, now with the new bridge between the CPU and the GPU. Both thermal wise and noise wise. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkAnd now to your temperature measurements.
Since Dragon Edition is basically a GT70 with red colour, you can compare this review against Notebookcheck`s own review of GT70 with GTX 780M. Exact same hardware as this review, 4700MQ.
In Notebookcheck`s Extreme test, with Furmark and Prime95 running simultanously, they got 92C Max for the CPU and 93C for the GPU. Since Furmark and Prime95 is a benchmark that push the GPU and CPU to the absurd extremeness that nobody will EVER encounter with this notebook, the temperatures when gaming will be MUCH lower. Notebookcheck ran the fan without the turbo mode.
Anandtech however got 98C for the CPU when just gaming?!
Bad paste job from the factory maybe? A respectable reviewer should understand that no OEM would ever put components in a notebook that run on 98C. Didn`t any alarm ring in your head that something isn`t right here when watching the temperature skyrocket?
I`m so dissappointed in you guys. You did everything wrong in this review. I just hope you didn`t test the games without the turbo fan on. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkNot just was this a spit in your fan base with a poor review, this was a mockery of MSI`s flagship notebook as well as Nvidia`s newest GPU, GTX 780M. Reply
ZeDestructor - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - link"Bad paste job from the factory maybe? A respectable reviewer should understand that no OEM would ever put components in a notebook that run on 98C. Didn`t any alarm ring in your head that something isn`t right here when watching the temperature skyrocket?"
Then their QC is so bad they can't send reviewers a cherry picked, top quality sample (evey single company does this, and it's public knowledge at this point). If the top units they send to reviewers has QC issues, what about the mass production version? No thanks, I'll stick to my Clevos and Alienwares for gaming laptops, and ThinkPad/Precision for mobile workstation. At least don't have WC issues on review units...
On the other hand, I am curious as to why they didn't ask MSI about it... Most companies usually follow up by sending another review unit and fixing WC for mass production...
Finally, 98°C isn't as high as laptops can go.. I used to game on a laptop that ran steady at 102°C. Granted, the poor HSF module was cooling beyond its limits (GPU swap), but it ran fine. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThe point is, the temperatures SCREAM bad paste job or something other with the cooling system that is not normal.
"Cooler Boost 2" is MSI`s newest improvement in this notebook. It bridge the CPU and the GPU together to create a huge heatsink. So the thermal capacity have improved. Which you clearly see in the other review I mentioned.
Anandtech should have never posted this review, but asked MSI to get a new notebook from them, or repasted the CPU themselves. You don`t put out a review of a product which is not functioning correctly like it should.
Go read user reviews on Notebookreview forum. Nobody have any high temperatures gaming. Reply
Dustin Sklavos - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - link""Cooler Boost 2" is MSI`s newest improvement in this notebook."
Phrasing like that is aaawwwwwwful suspect. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkRight, so you have nothing to counter all my arguments with?
I cannot believe you pushed out this review and thought 98C for the CPU is what the engineers at MSI have considered normal. Or that people should be forced to use the Turbo fan mode.
Jarred Walton would be much better at dealing with reviews like this. Looks to me like you rushed out this review just to post something new to show.
Anandtech just fell many places down as a reputable reviewer site.
I know the difference between "Cooler Boost 1" and "Cooler Boost 2" thank you. Its much easier to write "Cooler Boost 2" than "a new copper bridge between the CPU and the GPU to spread out the heat more between the two. And therefor not have the CPU to run much hotter than the GPU, forcing the fan to go up in speed"
;) Reply
Dustin Sklavos - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkExcept that the CPU actually runs fine and doesn't throttle when the 780M isn't in use.
I review what I'm sent. The system I was sent has serious thermal issues with the CPU and there's no reason a 180W PSU shouldn't be able to handle this hardware. I've spoken to contacts in the industry that have seen a high amount of variance in the quality of these units and I may very well have gotten a lemon, but that doesn't actually change whether or not the system can be recommended, does it?
The cooling system MSI employs is inferior to the one employed in the Alienware M17x, likely the Alienware 17, and in Clevo units, full stop. Almost every other gaming notebook in this class has separate thermal zones for the CPU and the GPU for a reason.
And I absolutely believe engineers would consider 98C for a CPU core to be normal. Did you not see the first generation Razer Blade? I've reviewed enough notebooks to know that some vendors will let the CPU cook if it means hitting specific design targets, whether it's acoustics, or form factor, or what have you. The GT70 is actually pretty quiet under normal load, but again, probably because the CPU is roasting itself. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkI used to own a GT70. It had GTX 680M and i7 3610QM. The components reached maybe max 72C after gaming for many hours. So I`m raising big question about this review since the thermal capacity have improved along with a GPU with slightly higher Core count.
And the fact that you got HIGHER temperatures than Notebookcheck when they pushed the GPU and the CPU to the very limit by using artificial benchmarks like Prime95 and Furmark. Programs known to have killed a dozen of systems because of the stress they put on the components.
How do you explain that?
I absolutely believe you got a notebook with some crappy paste job. And that caused the game tests you have to show a incorrect picture of the newest GTX 780M as well as MSIs own notebook. I hope you have contacted MSI to get a new system or atleast some explanation, because what this review shows is not normal.
Nor is fair to compare Razer, very thin notebook with low end components, with a pure gaming notebook, which is very thick, and have the industries biggest fan to cool off the components. Which you failed to write about in the review. Its not just 1 fan, but a big one.
180W PSU is also more than enough, shown by internal tests by resellers I know. It even allows overclocking. The CPU throttling didn`t come from lack of power, it came from bad temperatures. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkTime to redo the review. For the sake of Anandtech as well as MSIs reputation.
imo Reply
ZeDestructor - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - link"I used to own a GT70. It had GTX 680M and i7 3610QM. The components reached maybe max 72C after gaming for many hours. So I`m raising big question about this review since the thermal capacity have improved along with a GPU with slightly higher Core count."
Did you read the review? The older model CLEARLY had a different cooling design. Like, 2 fans vs 1. On opposite ends of the chassis. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkEh, no. MSI have never had 2 fans.
And yes, the older model had a different cooling design. A worse one. Reply
ZeDestructor - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkActually, I take that back, here's the old model: http://cdn.goodgearguide.com.au/dimg/700x700/dimg/...
as you may notice: SEPERATE heatpipes. Somehow they didn't account for the VRMs moving on chip.... Gee, maybe they should've paid attention when Intel announced quite proudly that Haswell would have integrated VRMs. and started redesigning there and then.
The 680M is a cut-down, lower power version of the 780M too, so naturally it will run cooler. Reply
BobBobson - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkGee Whizz....
Are you still pumping your gums about this?
Call the MSI secret police and hit squad, a negative review has hit the interweb...how dare they! Reply
Darkstone - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkIt's unfair to compare the temperatures of notebookcheck vs anandtech, because notebookcheck measured quite serve throtteling issues as well. The CPU was basely running at 1/4th of the designed power consumption. It's clearly in the screenshots, yet the reviewer didn't even mention it. Reply
mercutiouk - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkI notice our shill doesn't respond to this. Reply
ZeDestructor - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - link"And I absolutely believe engineers would consider 98C for a CPU core to be normal."
As an engineering student who used to run an old acer at an idle of 85+°C and load of 102°C (with the bottom panel completely off), I know exactly what you mean. Sometimes constraints happen and stuff like this gets forced through QA and validation. Someone in marketing probably wanted a quieter machine, so the engineers tried something proven in a rather new way: single heatsink with a single giant fan. While the concept is great, it really needs more refinement. See the old Dell Precision M4400 (quad-core with top-end Quadro FX parts) for single-fan setups done right. ish. They probably run quite a bit hotter than my E6500 ¬_¬
Since I got my desktop, my priorities regarding laptops have changed, so I rock an awesome little X220 tablet for uni/mobile work. with a much more reasonable 40-75°C range. I can make it hit 97°C using IBT, but IBT is a pretty special little torture test, much like FurMark.
Talking of which, you guys should review convertible tablet PCs and more enterprise laptops that aren't HP Elitebooks. There's a severe lack of ThinkPad and Latitude reviews around here :( Reply
cjl - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThe fact of the matter is, the test sample (which I would tend to think would be tested pretty heavily before it was sent out to a reviewer) had a woefully inadequate cooling system. Whether it was a bad thermal paste job (possible), or simply the fact that they were trying to cool a combined ~150W of TDP with a single small fan (more likely IMHO). Look at the Alienware design - two separate thermal systems, one for the CPU with a similar fan to the one in the MSI, and one significantly thicker fan with a different design (more similar to the blowers on high-end video cards) for the GPU, along with 3 dedicated heatpipes for the GPU and 2 for the CPU. The MSI design has two dedicated heatpipes for each, and one shared heatpipe (and I'm skeptical how useful a shared heatpipe would be, regardless of what kind of fancy marketing-speak MSI uses to describe it), all cooled by a single fan that looks similar to the Alienware's CPU fan alone.
Would improved TIM help? It would probably be good for a couple of degrees, but I doubt it would reduce the CPU temps to acceptable levels. The simple fact is, a modern high-end gaming notebook should have multiple fans to provide optimal cooling, and this notebook falls short in that area. As for whether the computer would have been designed for that? A surprising number of modern notebooks have overheating problems at full load (due to the competing constraints of form factor, appearance, marketing, and component placement), and it's therefore much more plausible (to me) that MSI really did botch the cooling system design than that Anandtech is incompetent (given past reviews). Reply
darkhawk1980 - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkDustin,
I realize that this is straight out of the box, but I highly suggest checking out MSI's own forums. There should be an electronic controller firmware you can flash that removes the throttling problem that is present in these notebooks.
I personally have one of the older GT70 0NE laptops with a GTX680M, and I can safely say that mine will trounce this notebook. This is because once the throttling issue is resolved, it's possible to run the GTX680M core at 950 MHz without any issues.
And while I do find turning on the fan to maximum while gaming, I think you're really putting the noise issue as being too high of a problem. It's not nearly that bad. I actually made a custom cooler for my GT70 simply because I wanted better cooling, and this custom cooling allows me to game at 950MHz without the maximum fan setting.
Honestly, the GT70 is a great notebook for the price with the super raid feature. It's perhaps not as 'nice' as an alienware, but it can compete easily, and for a good bit less money. Keep in mind, you are comparing the last generation hardware in the alienware, to the current/new generation hardware in the MSI. Of course the prices are going to be the same.....Compare the new alienware and realize that the price will now be $500 more than the MSI for the same features, possibly even less. MSI has again, priced it very competitively against the competition. It's the whole reason I bought a GT70 instead of an Alienware. Reply
kogunniyi - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkThe author hasn't written "Alienware is better than MSI" or "Alienware provides better value for the money than MSI." Why do you define your MSI against Alienware?
MSI is MSI, and Alienware is Alienware. A negative review is not a reason to justify your purchase to anyone else. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkHe doesn`t need a new firmware. He need to remove the bad paste job and redo it.
All CPUs no matter what model will throttle at 98C. Reply
BobBobson - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkOMG..
shut up, please!
If you are happy with your GT70 then great, why dont you go away and just be happy about it cos there are plenty here who aren't. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - link"Plenty here who aren't"
I see you moved to Anandtech to whine more about your notebook. For those who doesn't know, this is the Only guy from notebookreview who had any problems with his GT70 and cried about it instead of sending it in.
Yes many here who complain about it. Only you just like in NBR. Reply
JBVertexx - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkYour ranting is actually making MSI look worse - it's pretty obvious from your rants that you have some sort of personal ax to grind. Really, perhaps you should do as BobBobson suggested. Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkYes because I work for MSI and represent them.
lol Reply
BobBobson - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkYes, you do. And you are paranoid as well. If you don't actually work for MSI, then what the hell are you doing rabidly defending this company as though it were your dear old mom who was getting slighted? Reply
mercutiouk - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkAs we have a paid shill here, could you possibly get in touch with the european branch of the MSI repairs?
Hitachi drive fails, sent back - came back from repair with a different power supply. This didn't fit the socket on the back snugly.
Come a warm summer the arcing between badly fitting power plug and power pin resulted in the socket basically melting. Sent back. "Customer damage". It took threat of forum posts detailing exactly how poor your service treatment in Europe was to get a "ok, we've approved it - this one occasion only".
5 months later... the hard drive fails again. The laptops now got 1 hitachi and 1 WD blue, in a raid-0...
I can well believe the review here. Notebookcheck or no, you screwed up your flagship product. I think more reviews will show this to be true. Reply
mercutiouk - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkDidn't make clear but this was on a GX660-R Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkAnd how is this relevant? A) you can find the most reliable notebook and still find people with problems. B) GX-660 is an old model. OEMs tend to progress with quality as the gain more experience Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkJust read your post now.
How is it MSI fault that someone else hardware fails?
And how is it MSI fault that you continued to use a PSU with power connector for a different product even though you noticed yourself they didnt fit like it should? Reply
ZeDestructor - Wednesday, June 19, 2013 - linkSaid PSU was sent back by MSI. Therefore THEY should have checked that they were sending correct parts back. Plenty of small changes happen during manufacturing silently. This could be one of them., More QC fails.. No thanks, so many other companies do much, much better... Reply
fanofanand - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkI've been reading this site for over 5 years and have never been compelled to register until I read these comments. Dustin has done an admirable job with this review and huaxshin is clearly a paid shill. Never have I seen someone so adamantly defend something they didn't have a vested interest in, and I have no doubt that this case is no exception. People complain that Anand is too cozy with Intel, too nice to Nvidia, too hard on AMD etc. Readers here are CONSTANTLY looking for bias and here comes an honest open review and Dustin has been slandered repeatedly claiming the review is bogus etc.
Why on earth should Dustin have to modify the laptop to review it??? A reviewer should NEVER alter a product during the course of a review. A buyer shouldn't be expected to do so, in fact it would void the warranty. If this is how MSI is shipping their product, then that's exactly what should be reviewed. Huaxshin you need to get out of here with your trash and go back to Tom's Hardware where reviews are regularly bought. Anand has higher standards and has been a positive force of change within the industry.
Dustin I applaud your honesty and candor with this review, it's refreshing to see somebody call out a company that has poor QC or in this case, bad design. Kudos! Reply
huaxshin - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkIts not about modifying anything. Its about giving your partners, who send you a free sample, a chance to respond or resend a proper unit, before posting it online.
Not spitting in their face first, then using a towel to clean up after MSI have discovered the fault.
I would have understood it if it was a different error like keyboard malfunction, or any other poor designed part of the notebook. But not a clearly faulty notebook not functioning like it should.
Which is clearly the case here because there is no chance MSI designed this system to run at 98C, which not only is too hot for comfort, but will also cause the CPU to throttle and not perform like it should.
MSI is not this stupid, to push out a system like that. It doesnt make any sense Reply
JBVertexx - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkYou're wrong - this is typical MSI - pure garbage, cheap, gaudy, cheesy junk. I made the mistake of buying an MSI motherboard, once, before I started paying attention to substantial reviews such as this. MSIs style is to pack product full of feature-set bullet points that they hope to appeal those ignorant consumers in the market, but in reality, turn out to have zero substantial value to the overall product.
MSI - pure trailer-park-trash junk. Reply
JBVertexx - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkAnd huaxshin, you are only adding to that trailer-park-trash image by evidence of your ignorant rants throughout this forum. Reply
JarredWalton - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkLet me just chime in by saying I have an MSI GX60 with A10-4600M. I know it's a different laptop, but it warrants mention simply for the fact that it too appears to have performance issues. A10-4600M is no i7, certainly, but in many cases I'm getting performance that's closer to what I'd expect from the integrated HD 7660G rather than a high-end HD 7970M. I've tried to get better performance, so far to no avail. I thought the problem might be with AMD's Enduro or their drivers in general, but now I'm wondering if the APU is simply getting so hot that it's running at lower CPU speeds.
I have no idea (well, I *do* have suspicions though) why haxshin is so adamant that Dustin did something wrong with this review, but the fact is the system is underperforming, and it appears to be throttling quite severely. Getting to the CPU to replace the TIM with something better is not something I have ever had to do in the course of a laptop review, and I know this review from Dustin is a couple weeks late. I would assume he at least mentioned some of the concerns to MSI, but if they sent out a lemon laptop to a major review site, what does that say about the potential for retail notebooks? Ugh. Reply
huaxshin - Wednesday, June 19, 2013 - linkAre you guys really this uninformed? Not you too Jarred :/
The reason why you get lower performance with a AMD APU + 7970M (any high end really) is because the CPU part of the APU is bottlenecking the GPU. Its too weak to drive the 7970M. Notebookcheck did an extensive test on the GX60 and found out that the APU cause the overall result over 18 games, to fall down to GTX 660M with i7.
Its that bad.
Temperatures is not the culprint there at all. Just weak APU used. The A10-4600M is a 35W TDP, its one of the most cool running CPUs out there. Since it use the exact same chassis as the GT60 with a cooling system built for 45W i7s.
Running Prime95 caused the A10-4600M to max out at 71C, which in no way will cause throttle.
I stand on my opinion that you should contact MSI to make a solution with a replacement than putting out a review that cause both benchmarks and temperature measurements to be wrong. MSI is at fault here for not doing better quality check, no doubt about that. I just hope Dustin thought this through before posting the review. Reply
DeltaActual - Wednesday, June 19, 2013 - linkCan admin please ban this lamer? Reply
Darkstone - Wednesday, June 19, 2013 - linkOf course it can throttle at 70°. Notebookcheck recently tested a clevo with haswell that throttles at 70°
A classmate of mine uses to have an low-end HP with A6 APU. The part throttled as soon as it hit 70°. The throttling temperature is a choice. The thinkpad's throttle at 100°, the XPS 15 (l521x) does not throttle at all (shutdown) with early bios. Reply
JarredWalton - Monday, June 24, 2013 - linkExcuse me, huaxshin, aka Cloudfire/Cloudfire777 from our forums, aka Cloudfire over at NotebookReview forums:
One, we're not looking at the Ivy Bridge i7-3610QM with GTX 680M, are we? Two, we don't fix problems caused by the manufacturer of a notebook (though we do tend to email them and say, "this is underperforming...."). Three, I said "I'm wondering..." not "this is happening"; on further investigations, it appears to be mostly Enduro/APU related. Four, no other review out there is showing results with the GT70 Dragon Haswell+780M edition that are actually significantly different than our numbers; oh, they test different games, and when the CPU isn't taxed as much and therefore doesn't get as hot and therefore doesn't throttle, performance of GTX 780M can be higher than GTX 680M, but that's not what happens in a lot of games.
Are we done here? You appear to like MSI a lot, having owned one of their laptops and having also commented extensively on forums under the name Cloudfire about MSI hardware. Maybe you own some other notebooks as well, maybe not. The fact is, we report on what we are sent, and if a manufacturer wants to fix a problem they can get in contact with us. When hardware is shipping to end users, though, it's not time to delay for several weeks or more to get an even better cherry picked sample; it's time to post findings. Our findings right now are that MSI's latest GT70 Dragon with GTX 780M and Haswell has some serious problems. Until/unless those get fixed, we cannot recommend this notebook.
Show me a review that has the same notebook hardware (not a "similar" notebook that has Ivy Bridge or GTX 680M!), and they have some figures that show much better performance and lower temperatures under similar tests to what we have posted, get back to me. Notebookcheck, incidentally, has not actually reviewed this particular laptop. Neither has NotebookReview. Most places that have reviewed it only have one or two gaming tests, often with substantially inferior hardware on a "comparable" system -- like, using GTX 675MX vs. GTX 780M instead of GTX 680M. The fact is that we ran a full suite of tests with the 780M and several other laptops, even going so far as to delay the review a bit to get a full set of up to date GTX 680M numbers. No one else even tried to do that, and at best I've seen reviews with three games and numbers from three or four laptops. Reply
huaxshin - Wednesday, June 19, 2013 - linkSure, compare motherboard with a notebook. That makes sense.
You have an axe to grind against MSI, so you jump in with this childish comment. Reply
BobBobson - Tuesday, June 18, 2013 - linkA good honest review, the first of its kind I have read. This review corresponds to the behavior of my own GT70 notebook.
Perhaps MSI somehow got a GT70 intended for the masses mixed up with a cherry picked GT70 intended for the Anandtech review. Reply
landsome - Wednesday, June 19, 2013 - linkWell, no intention here to fan the fire, but I find it all of this ironic. I own a GT663R and it performs admirably cool with a 920XM (55w) and a replacement videocard of the (now almost) last generation - a 7970M. At stock speeds it's 89C max for the CPU and 83C max for the GPU in prime+furmark - and all that on a Delta 150W psu, on a moderately hot summer day, no throttling, no other cooling except a few holes drilled below the single fan (not my doing). Both CPU and GPU are supposed to be powerhogs and pretty hot too.
So while it's pretty obvious huaxshin has a big axe to grind (if only in light of his persistence), I would also assume MSI has done an improper paste job on Dustin's sample (not their prerogative exclusively - I once gained an amazing -13C by repasting a Dell M6600). What this says about QC @ MSI is another matter entirely... Reply
pinkyswear - Wednesday, June 19, 2013 - linkIn the review, you said the system fan pulls air in from the back and exhausts it through the side vent. The fan would actually pull in air from the bottom and exhaust it through the side and the back. If it felt to your hand like air was cool in the back and warm on the side, it means the heatsink for the 780M was working and the 4700MQ was not. When you opened up the machine to take pictures, did you remove any part of the CPU heatsink? The fact that no warm air is blowing out of the back means that something is wrong with the CPU or the heatsink installation. Reply
Khenglish - Thursday, June 20, 2013 - linkYes there is no way that air is coming in through the CPU radiator. It may seem that way though because since the fan spins clockwise (when looking at the laptop with the bottom plate off), it will build up air speed for the 270 degrees that there is no radiator and blow that out the GPU radiator, while the CPU radiator does not have any air buildup, and thus the air move through it much more slowly and is hard to feel.
If you guys put you hand to your laptop fans you will notice that far more air blows through one side than the other.
One fan just does not cut it with these high power components. Then when you add on that MSI uses aluminum radiators, you just have disaster. Reply
secretmanofagent - Thursday, June 20, 2013 - linkJust wanted to say, great review, ignore the spam flying around. Reply
watzupken - Friday, June 21, 2013 - linkHaving done some homework back then while looking out for a gaming laptop, I do agree that the cooling does look insufficient for a high end gaming laptop. I really doubt the blower fan is pushing out sufficient air through both the heatsinks. Reply
michael777 - Monday, June 24, 2013 - linkI would like to refer in this discussion for a moment to MSI GT70H-80M4811B which was mentioned somewhere above. The cheaper dragons brother was on my shopping list until I read this massive discussion here. To remind it it has the same CPU and GPU with only one SSD and 8GB Ram, rest stays the same. In most of the german webstores the above costs approx 2000 euros and unfortuantely nowhere you can have an alienware with i7 and 780GTX for that price. So there goes my question: if you not willing spending on a gaming laptop more that 2000 does that underperfoming is really such an issue? Isnt it still the best laptop speaking of gaming performance for that money? Am I risking anything more then few frames less in few games compare to actually more expensive competition? Thanks for advice and lots of professional info here. Reply
Shayler - Monday, June 24, 2013 - linkI must say, after comparing this article with Notebookcheck's much more professional and thorough review, I'm disappointed in your outcome.
With such comments as, "...a few runs of games and some stress testing..." I'm forced to question your methodology which throws your entire review into question.
Please see Notebookcheck's test of this system (the non dragon edition) and reevaluate your review.
http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-MSI-GT70H-80M4... Reply
JarredWalton - Monday, June 24, 2013 - linkGiven that Notebookcheck's review is of a slightly different build, it may not have the issues we noticed in this review. Our review is what we would expect an end user to get if they buy the GT70 Dragon with i7-4700MQ and GTX 780M right now; if you get a similar system with the MSI chassis but assembled by a boutique that uses different thermal paste, you may see better results. If you're willing to disassemble your notebook to replace the thermal grease, you may also see improved performance and lower temperatures, but we don't expect most end users to resort to such measures. Reply
michael777 - Tuesday, June 25, 2013 - linkThats great but to come back to my question you cant have a laptop with these specs (considering MSI GT70H-80M4811B) for the price of 2000 euros. So what am I actually risking apart from the hot machine and few frames less in few games? Reply
Shayler - Tuesday, June 25, 2013 - linkHi Jarred,
Thanks for taking the time to respond.
The internals on these systems are identical. The MSI GT60/70 (regardless of model name/number) and all bare bones use the same cooling system. In fact, you can remove the all of these parts and interchange them. Including the motherboards!
My thought is, you received a bad sample. No one expects the end user to repaste their system (even though it's very easy on these models), but from personal experience with this model, I know for a fact that the temperatures you're reporting are far above normal even with silicon based thermal compounds.
My concern with your review is the lack of documentation. Where's your methodology? What games did you play, at what settings, and for how long? Wheat benchmarks did you run? What were your ambient temperatures?
Contact MSI, have them send you a new sample, document your methodology and results, and reevaluate your review.
If you have the same results, post them and have your, "I told you so." moment. Reply
JarredWalton - Tuesday, June 25, 2013 - linkMy point about the internals is that special editions (e.g. the Dragon Edition) may go through a modified assembly line at the factory. Dell and others do this as well -- it's an optimization for a SKU that they expect to sell more units, and it simplifies things as they don't have to custom build every single notebook. You just put the same parts in every Dragon and thus it's faster and easier -- but what if you happen to have a minor glitch on the thermal paste application?
Oh, if only it were that easy. I'll see if Dustin wants to do a follow up...or I can ask as well. Sometimes it's difficult to get even one notebook sample in for review, and if it's not a favorable review they may just try to cut their losses. Anyway, no promises that it will happen, but I'll at least give it a try. Stay tuned.... Reply
michael777 - Tuesday, June 25, 2013 - linkLooks like its a bit hard for the author(s) of that review to find an answer for my pretty simple question and, in fact, their own statement. So ill try again, what laptop with i7-4700MQ and gtx780 can you find for the similar money even if the cooling isnt the strongest point of this one? Reply
JarredWalton - Tuesday, June 25, 2013 - linkHere are a few vendors stocking Clevo builds (no mSATA RAID, but that's not a huge issue IMO)....
Eurocom (http://www.eurocom.com/) -- look at their gaming notebooks X3/X5/X7.
OriginPC (tend to be a bit more expensive): http://www.originpc.com/gaming/laptops/
Mythlogic: http://www.mythlogic.com/mobile.php (Pollux 1613)
Alienware 17: http://www.dell.com/us/p/alienware-17/fs
If you're looking at a $2700 notebook like this, there are certainly other options, including beastly SLI setups if you don't mind spending even more money and carrying around a gigantic notebook. They all have pros and cons for certain, but I'd be more inclined to spend a few extra hundred if it's the difference between throttling/cooler temperatures and not. Or maybe it really is just the thermal paste -- we'll see if we can get a second sample for testing. Reply
Trkkr - Tuesday, August 20, 2013 - linkI'm looking for the same answers as michael. Jarred, do you know if any of the manufacturers you have listed here have had their 17.3" GTX 780M models reviewed? If they haven't what's to keep their systems from suffering from cooling issues as well (they might have dual fans but that doesn't mean their systems will stay any cooler). Thanks. Reply
Globemaster - Thursday, June 27, 2013 - linkHow do you reconcile the folks at gentechpc getting temps of 60 CPU and 65 GPU when running the similar benchmarks on the same Dragon Edition 2 at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVjv2gcB7uc. I know they have a commercial interest, but doubt they faked the video. I'll be getting mine tomorrow and will try to replicate what you had here. Rest assured, if I get these results, it'll be going back. I just really think you got a lemon. That should be noted, but in my experience with reviews (even of SimCity V), most reviewers try to evaluate a working version of a product while making note of the possible quality control issues rather than just trash the product completely when results come in that seem unreasonable. Possibly at least worth a note in the article that you might have just gotten a lemon, rather than making people search through the comments to find alternate hypotheses. Reply
Globemaster - Friday, July 05, 2013 - linkJust upgraded to 320.49 drivers and got 5002 on Firestrike 3DMark 2013 (same config 4700MQ and 780M) and temps never exceeded 74 on CPU or GPU. Not sure why you got a better score on older drivers with such high temps here (was yours force overclocked???), but I had hoped for over 5000 and hit it. I was getting 4600 with the stock 311.xx drivers. The only scores I'm seeing higher are oc'd through bios or 3rd party programs. My 2 year old Sager with a 485M only got 1563, so this more than triples performance. I'm thriled with this laptop and will be keeping it. Reply
ickibar1234 - Saturday, June 29, 2013 - linkThat single fan is enough. Notice that it keeps the CPU in the low 80s at full utilization and the GPU in the 70s Celsius. That is perfectly fine. Yes, you need to press the Cooler boost button to bring the fan to full speed but it is adequate.
The fan is a different beast compared to normal laptop fans; It is 12 Volts! Yes, 12 Volts.
brand/model/amperage; NSTECH PABD19735BM -N153 0.65 Amps @ 12V. That is over 6 watts of cooling power in a laptop.
There have been some reports of bad paste jobs during assembly. Re-paste and temperatures should be very good especially with Cooler Boost on. Reply
Nocturnal32GB - Tuesday, August 06, 2013 - linkIf you really knew anything about mobile gaming you would never buy a laptop from MSI, Asus or Dell / Alienware in the first place. Those machines are cheap junk to begin with, you can purchase a gaming laptop from M-Tech with better features and way better cooling for less money. Even sager is a better way to go than throwing your money out the window on proprietary garbage like MSI Alienware and the like. Reply
MDX - Wednesday, September 04, 2013 - linkSager / Clevo laptops are fat, hideous, and bulky. At least Alienware does bulky with style, and they're definitely not low quality (mine's lasted 6 years so far, and I beat the crap out of my laptops). I'm not spending thousands to get something with a hideous clevo case, regardless of the internals. Reply
MDX - Wednesday, September 04, 2013 - linkI trust you guys over Tom's Hardware, but why does they seem to think the cooling system is just fine and not seem to have an issue with heat? Reply
MDX - Wednesday, September 04, 2013 - linkCan't edit comments >< http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gt70-dragon-ed...
It almost seems like MSI updated the fan or something? Reply


text: News Article Lifesize Connections Video Collaboration Tool Anna Mitchell Published April 23, 2012 in InAVate Lifesize Connections is a cloud-based video collaboration tool. It operates on a subscription basis so it does not demand upfront capital. No on-site infrastructure or IT staff are required to operate the system and it works on Mac, PC and Lifesize endpoints." See the Report


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Museum der Kulturen
Herzog & de Meuron
Basel, Switzerland
The Museum der Kulturen Basel dates back to the middle of the nineteenth century. Replacing the Augustinian monastery on the Münsterhügel the classicist building by architect Melchior Berri opened in 1849.
The "Universal Museum", as it was then called, was the city's first museum building. An extension by architects Vischer & Söhne was added in 1917.
Extending the building horizontally would have meant decreasing
the size of the courtyard, the Schürhof. Instead the Vischer
building of 1917 has been given a new roof.
Consisting of irregular folds clad in blackish green ceramic tiles, the roof resonates with the medieval roofscape in which it is embedded while functioning at the same time as a clear sign of renewal in the heart of the neighborhood.
The hexagonal tiles, some of them three-dimensional, refract the
light even when the skies are overcast, creating an effect much
like that of the finely structured brick tiles on the roofs of the
old town. The steel framework of the folded roof allows for a
column-free gallery underneath.
Up until now, the Museum der Kulturen and the Naturhistorisches
Museum shared the same entrance on Augustinergasse. The former is
now accessed directly from Münsterplatz through the previously
inaccessible rear courtyard, the Schürhof. The courtyard, in its
patchwork setting of the backs of medieval buildings, has now
become an extension of the Münsterplatz.
Part of the courtyard has been lowered and an expansive, gently inclined staircase leads down to the Museum entrance. Hanging plants and climbing vines lend the courtyard a distinctive atmosphere and, in concert with the roof, they give the Museum a new identity.
The weighty, introverted impression of the building, initially concealing its invaluable contents, is reinforced by the facades, many of whose windows have been closed off, and by the spiral-shaped construction for the hanging vegetation mounted under the eaves of the cantilevered roof above the new gallery.
This is countered, however, by the foundation, which is slit
open the entire length of the building and welcomes visitors to
come in. These architectural interventions together with the
vegetation divide the long, angular and uniform Vischer building of
1917 into distinct sections.
Designed to house both the sciences and the arts, the Museum der Kulturen, with holdings of some 300,000 objects, now holds one of the most important ethnographic collections in Europe thanks largely to continuing gifts and bequests.
Facts about Museum der Kulturen
Site Area:
2,305 m2
Building Footprint: 1,209 m2 (existing)
Gross Floor Area (GF): 6,350 m2
Construction lot 1:
Stiftung Museum der Kulturen, Basel
Client Construction lot 2 and 3:
Kanton Basel-Stadt; c/o Hochbau- und Planungsamt, Basel
Jacques Herzog
Pierre de Meuron
Christine Binswanger
Project Architects:
Martin Fröhlich (Associate)
Mark Bähr
Michael Bär
Project Team:
Piotr Fortuna
Volker Jacob
Beatus Kopp
Severin Odermatt
Nina Renner
Nicolas Venzin
Thomas Wyssen
Herzog & de Meuron Team 2001-2004:
Jacques Herzog, Pierre de Meuron, Christine Binswanger
Project Architects:
Jürgen Johner (Associate)
Ines Huber
Project Team:
Béla Berec
Giorgio Cadosch
Gilles le Coultre
Laura Mc Quary
Stiftung Museum der Kulturen & Kanton Basel-Stadt
c/o Hochbau- und Planungsamt
Last updated: December 19, 2013
See also
Blog: No time for words we are busy site seeing!
James Turrell's Skyscape
Claremont, California, USA
Elmgreen & Dragset: Tomorrow
Frank Gehry: At Work
"Gathered Sky" by James Turrell
Will it Sustain?


text:
Topic: I just want to talk to someone who understands....do you??
My husband is away for work and so I am alone for the next week....not good. I hate being alone b/c that is when I think the most and relive everything. As I lay here in bed tonight I am thinking how crazy it is that our lives are filled with so many years and months and days and seconds but the minute tragedy strikes our lives are no longer divided into days and months and years but now "before mom got sick" and "after mom got sick". Everything, no matter how small will fit into one of these categories forever.
Mom started a journal when she got sick and wrote in it for almost 2 weeks until she was no longer able to write straight. I read that journal whenever I am alone. I know it will make me upset but at least then I will feel something, other than that I feel numb daily. It's been almost 2 years and it still kills me to hear my friends talk about their moms. When they fight with their moms I want to shake them and tell them to wake up and stop wasting their energy on such trivial stuff for one day, they will no longer have what I am so jealous of now. I don't really have a point to this post, I just wanted to vent to someone. To have someone tell me it will be okay. To have someone understand. To have someone......I hate being alone


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Pedro de la Rosa: "The Yas Marina is a circuit where braking, maximum speed and grip are essential and it's very smooth so you can be aggressive with the height and bring out a very low car. I know the track from when I tested with Pirelli, although I've never taken part in the Grand Prix, and it's a very nice circuit and even more so at night time. Our car should adapt quite well, especially in the first sector which is made up of straights and braking areas. It will be another tough challenge for our brakes so it's very important to understand what happened in India, fix it and try to finish the race."
Narain Karthikeyan: "I've never been to Abu Dhabi; it will be my first time racing there and I hope to adapt well to do the best job possible. The circuit looks fantastic and there will also be a lot of Indian fans spurring me on which is always helpful. After finishing the Indian Grand Prix in front of my home crowd I'm determined to complete another good weekend in Abu Dhabi."
Ma Qing Hua: "I'm delighted to have another chance to drive again during a Grand Prix weekend with HRT F1 Team. After my two Friday outings in Monza and Singapore, I've continued to work hard both physically and mentally to be well prepared for opportunities like this one. Apart from the gym and the simulator, I've spent a lot of time going karting as its one of the best ways to train, keep fit and stay focused. To be able to continue gaining experience in a Formula 1 car and adding more miles to my tally is essential for me right now and I want to thank the team for making it happen. I'm getting to know the car and the engineers more each time and this makes me more confident every time I step in the car. My target now is to keep on progressing and learning from the team. I'm really looking forward to getting back out on track and it will be interesting to drive at a circuit like Abu Dhabi where I hav e never been before."
Luis Perez-Sala, Team Principal: "The Yas Marina is a circuit I like with fantastic facilities and the race and everything surrounding it is spectacular. The target will be to finish with both cars after having not done in the last few races. I hope we have a good performance and that the problem we suffered with the brakes in India doesn't reoccur in Abu Dhabi. Ma has been training and I'm happy to be giving him another opportunity to step into the car at a circuit he'll enjoy and that will help him to continue progressing and accumulating experience."
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text:
Hey there, time traveller!
This article was published 10/10/2012 (1777 days ago), so information in it may no longer be current.
Joey ELLIOTT has been named the CFL's offensive player of the week but has not been named the Winnipeg Blue Bombers' starting quarterback for Saturday's game.
And Elliott is OK with that.
Looks like he'll have to be as Bombers head coach Tim Burke said Wednesday that if concussed quarterback Buck Pierce receives medical clearance in time to practise today, he will start Saturday against the Calgary Stampeders at noon at Canad Inns Stadium.
"Just another week, just going to prepare like last week. You never know. He (Pierce) was out there going with the one (first-team offence) today. In my mind, he'll be ready to go," said Elliott, who received the CFL honour on Wednesday in recognition of his three-touchdown performance in Winnipeg's 27-22 win over the Alouettes in Montreal Monday.
Joey, isn't it just a bit frustrating to perform so well in a game only to potentially be a spectator the following game?
"True, it could happen. Coming off a good game you always want to build on that but at the same time our organization, and the franchise, Buck's our quarterback and they're going to to stay behind that 110 per cent. When he's healthy, he's going to be ready to go," Elliott said.
"In professional sports, you say this is who is going to be our starter and this is how we're going to go. When he's healthy, he's got to play. I think he's done a great job this whole year and I think he'll be ready to go this week."
Crystal clear
Burke made the quarterbacking situation crystal clear after Wednesday's no-pads, no-helmets practice.
"Buck is going to see the doctors this afternoon and we should know something this evening. If you see him out there taking snaps tomorrow, then you know he is cleared to play," said Burke. "If he isn't, then you know he's not cleared to play. We won't know anything until probably really late (Wednesday)."
Pierce was not available for comment on Wednesday as he left practice early amid speculation he was going to have a medical assessment. Prior to leaving, he did participate in the walk-through, worked with the first-team offence and was getting most of the repetitions.
Burke said Elliott's most recent performance is important but it's not enough to take a healthy Pierce's job.
"I don't think it's that tough of a decision. Like Joey was telling you guys, Buck's our franchise quarterback so he gives us the best chance," Burke said. "I think it's great that Joey had a great game and all that. It speaks to how he's really progressed as a player. We're looking at a guy that can legitimately win some games for us."
Pierce suffered a concussion in the 29-10 loss to the Toronto Argonauts on Sept. 29 when he was subjected to a helmet-to-chin hit by Argos linebacker Brandon Isaac, who was penalized on the play and later fined for the hit.
After Pierce was not cleared to play last week, Elliott got his sixth career start and led the Bombers to a win in a game that it seemed on paper they could not win. Elliott passed for three touchdowns for the first time in his CFL career and completed 17 of 25 passes for 335 yards with no interceptions. He also added two carries for 13 yards on the ground.
"In that situation, it's just a good team win. That's more important to create momentum from an inside-the-locker-room standpoint," Elliott said.
"It (CFL award) is a tremendous honour to have. My receivers made me look good, the (offensive) line protected and we were able to get things done," Elliott said.
It was the second time this season and second time in his three-year career Elliott has received the offensive player of the week nod as he was also selected after he led the Bombers to a 32-25 win over the Hamilton Tiger-Cats on Aug. 16.
Safety Ian Logan said the team is not worrying about whether Pierce or Elliott starts this week.
"We're confident in both guys," Logan said. "Buck's obviously been a leader when he's been in and Joey's come out with two huge wins against Hamilton and Montreal that have shown what he's capable of. He's got an air of confidence about him. You trust that he's going to lead the guys and get the job done. At the same time, Buck's been the stable guy that we've counted on to win us games in the past."
firstname.lastname@example.com Twitter: @WFPAshleyPrest
Today's Bomber Report C3


text:
CINCINNATI (AP) -- University of Cincinnati students got warnings to stay inside after two weekend incidents in which shots were fired near the main campus.
No injuries were reported. Campus police received a report of gunshots near a dormitory early Sunday, and a voice alert message to "shelter in place" was activated. Less than an hour later, gunshots were reported near University Park Apartments. Students there got a text alert.
Meanwhile, a student was robbed at around 12:30 a.m. Sunday. Police say three males took his wallet, keys and cellphone. The student wasn't hurt.
The Cincinnati Enquirer reports (http://cin.ci/XJge1g ) that the incidents come as some students have become increasingly concerned about crime on and around the campus.
Information from: The Cincinnati Enquirer, http://www.enquirer.com


text: The National College Football Awards Association (NCFAA) was founded in 1997 as a coalition of major collegiate football awards. The purpose of the NCFAA is to protect, preserve, and enhance the integrity, influence, and prestige of college football's various awards. The NCFAA also encourages professionalism and the highest standards possible for the administration of college football awards and the selection of their winners. The 22 awards boast over 700 years of tradition-selection excellence. Visit www.NCFAA.org to learn more about our story.


text:
You all know how much I believe in loving the skin you're in. Now…yes, wait for it…there's an app for that (I had to say it). The Body Beautiful iPhone app is now available for only 99¢. That' s less than $1 to remind you on a daily basis how beautiful you are.
Designed to promote positive body image and self-esteem among women and girls, this app makes me want to ditch my Blackberry.
"Body Beautiful helps you love and appreciate your body and give it the respect it deserves!"
The app actually offers quite a few features:
- "Truth" section includes a growing collection of quotes about true beauty and body-image from celebrities, authors, athletes, and popular songs and movies. Shake your iPhone to change quotes. A "truth" a day keeps negative body image away!
- "Photo-Stamp" feature lets you imprint encouraging messages on a photo of yourself or a friend and share via email and social media.
- "Pledge" section lets you share the Body Beautiful pledge via email and Facebook and join the fight against the media's standard of beauty, end "fat-talk", and love your body.
- "Buzz" section streams relevant media articles and news stories that promote healthy body image and expose false cultural ideals about beauty.
- "Extras" include: Links to organizations, resources and videos to inspire and equip you on your Body Beautiful journey. Customizable preferences include ability to put a personal picture on the home screen.


text:
Dadi Perlmutter, executive vice president of the Intel Architecture group, used a curious turn of phrase during his presentation at Computex on Tuesday when describing Intel's role in the future world of computing.
Besides highlighting Intel's traditional strengths in designing and manufacturing advanced processors, Mr Perlmutter (pictured) said Intel sought to be the "port of choice" for various operating environments. Read more
© The Financial Times Ltd 2016 FT and 'Financial Times' are trademarks of The Financial Times Ltd.


text:
Mapping Prevention: Engaging Fathers
Any man can be a father. It takes someone special to be a dad. ~Author Unknown
I usually shy away from using cheesy quotes. But for some reason, this quote has always stuck with me. I probably have Hallmark to thank for that.
A few weeks ago, I had the pleasure of spending a lovely, sunny Father's Day with my dad. My dad is, and always has been, an important person in my life. He taught me so many things about the value of family and faith. I remember how patient he was when teaching me how to drive a car, and even more patient and understanding when I had to call and explain to him that I had just smashed said car into another car. Many important life lessons were (and still are) taught to me by my dad.
As we think about the importance of engaging men in the work to end sexual violence, it's important to remember a key group of men – fathers. One program that is working to engage fathers is Jane Doe, Inc. in Massachusetts. I had the opportunity to speak with Craig Norberg-Bohm, Coordinator of the Men's Initiative, for our fifth installment of the Mapping Prevention video podcast series. In this video, Craig talks about the responsible fatherhood program and why engaging men, and fathers in particular, is integral to ending sexual violence.


text:
good job.I have posted them in other forum.Since the this is a new topic might as well post my Fan Trailer, this trailer was do to help raise the HYPE!
that was very well made...Since the this is a new topic might as well post my Fan Trailer, this trailer was do to help raise the HYPE!
Hopefully it is not too late for GGPO to be implemented.rogueyoshi, post: 5416169 wrote:Official Site:
(Alleged) North American Release Date:
October 25th, 2011, source: http://www.amazon.com/King-Fighters-XIII-Playstation-3/dp/B0054IN5AA
SRK News Page (Atlus is answering questions about the game that are being posted in the comments):
Atlus's Offical Forum (Let your voice be heard for recommendations such as GGPO netcode):
Dream Cancel Wiki:
SRK Hyper Guide Wiki:
(coming soon)
wat. you've been doing one too? IM me...Laban, post: 5418985 wrote:Hey Rogue is there going to be an official SRK Hyper Guide for KOF XIII or should I just keep on working on the one I have been doing?
That's not true, he has a fuzzy guard setup after rekkas which means a 50/50 between instant hop B xx f+B or low B.Laban, post: 5419537 wrote:his mix up after rekkas isn't that scary at all.
Yes, hyper hop D, run under works.Laban, post: 5419537 wrote:I'd say Iori's Command Throw is being underplayed since he should be able to do a j.D or j.B hit reset after it and perhaps have a run under attempt after it.
I think some ppl should join the madden community
that was actually pretty sick, good jobSince the this is a new topic might as well post my Fan Trailer, this trailer was do to help raise the HYPE!
Syxx573, post: 5434674 wrote:remember how they messed up the us release of ah1 too?
I don't have anything to add since there's already enough people spammed GGPO or are crying their eyes out about XII's netcode.Syxx573, post: 5435042 wrote:well get on their asses on the atlus forum
i tried registering but i couldn't figure out the answer to the spambot security question.... (-_-)
"shelcoof, you're presenting an article based on a hands-on experience I personally oversaw and managed. The take away from that article should NOT be that the "same, re-used" netcode will appear in KOFXIII. That is not correct.
Every effort is being taken to ensure KOFXIII delivers the kind of online experience the series' fans expect and deserve.
The game was just announced this past week. Please, have some patience as we process your feedback, address your concerns, and prepare to roll out all the info you're eagerly anticipating between now and the game's release."
Syxx573, post: 5434674 wrote:remember how they messed up the us release of ah1 too?
Syxx573, post: 5435290 wrote:the took out a lot of the voice acting
i dunno why a company that publishes weeboo games exclusively would do something like that
Laban, post: 5444414 wrote:It's called Hyper Drive mode and it works pretty much just like 02's Max mode, just it will automatically do the run up for you.
play k' point on that team as lizzy and mature both like meter. i would probably put lizzy last to round it out, since she has great comeback potential due to turning little hits like air-to-airs and AAs into big damageShiawase, post: 5444452 wrote:I'm new to King of Fighters (13 will be my first one) and I have a question. When making a team what should I be thinking about when picking my characters? I want to start with a team of Elisabeth/K'/Mature but I don't know if that would be any good. I mostly picked the characters that I like lol.
Shiawase, post: 5444452 wrote:I'm new to King of Fighters (13 will be my first one) and I have a question. When making a team what should I be thinking about when picking my characters? I want to start with a team of Elisabeth/K'/Mature but I don't know if that would be any good. I mostly picked the characters that I like lol.
I'm a scrub at KOF so I only know of Athena, but Laban mentioned Kensou and Joe. Mature had good zoning in the earlier games, not sure about now.tataki, post: 5447730 wrote:any zoners in this game?
Kinda saddens me to read that but thanks for the very informative response. I learned a lot for it.Laban, post: 5450224 wrote:so yeah about zoning
Laban, post: 5450224 wrote:
Although this character could do both actually, I'd say Ash is a pretty effective zoning character since he's the "Guile" Character. But now he's fitted with Qcfx2 supers, has a cancelable sweep that's not a silly Guile double sweep, great hop in jumping normals such as j.A and j.D, easy hitconfirm combos, control space well with his "Sonic Boom", and could do things such as charge his "Flash Kick" while running and do something like: Run > cr.B x3 xx d_u+B. He's interesting because he also is able to control the airspace quite well almost to the point that Iori could do so in previous games. Ash has a similar j.B in comparison to Iori and is able to limit grounded and aerial approaches with j.B and j.D. If an opponent tries to approach by landing above Ash's hop with a full jump or super jump, Ash has a more up forward air to air with j.C. Ash then has a great cr.C and quickly charged "Flash Kicks" to anti-air all the other angles an opponent may try to approach from, also noting that Ash still has a good st.A and Far C. Ash is also able to retreat, approach, and counter poke grounded normals and advances with his sobat attacks quite similarly to Guile; in this case though, both backwards and forwards sobat kicks are done by doing b+B and b+D respectively, giving Ash the time to charge his "Sonic Boom". Add in the fact he has an easy activation super that juggles the opponent, gives free cancel properties to Ash's special attacks, and the the ability to reduce charge times to 0 is really scary. He could do this super even off of his normal hitconfirms. Then he's given the opportunity to use an additional super in this mode that seals the opponent's command normals, specials, and super for a limited about of time. For zoning and offense, this character really has it well. He is just not as easy or one dimensional in aerial and ground control like K' is and doesn't do as much damage as K' does for the work Ash has to put in.
nerfed from what? shes never been exceptionally good in any kof and here is no exception. shes not bad by any means, she just lacks some cheap stuff.JackTenrac!, post: 5456447 wrote:How bad is the Mai nerfing? I'm hearing it's Real Bout like.
king is pretty mediocre too but has really good normals, the best of which probably being far B, which is fast, goes far and leads into so much stuff pressure and combo wiseLavama, post: 5457006 wrote:I honestly have no idea. This is the first on the Mai nerfing. How's King doing?