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I'll get one. When Google cares more about international launches.
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Google has just finished their big breakfast event and one of the highlights for Apple users is Chromecast, a $35 HDMI dongle that turns any TV into a receiver for YouTube, Netflix, and potentially other services that adopt the API. It seems like Apple's AirPlay, but has some benefits and drawbacks all its own. Here's what Phil Nickinson from Android Central had to say:
YouTube, Google Play Music — all available through Chromecast and accessed through your phone. You can set up a queue of videos to play while still use your phone for other tasks. Browse, take phonecalls, check e-mail — whatever you need to do. Streaming is handled from the Chromecast — not from your phone. And Netflix? No problem.
As for those drawbacks, first, it's "cross-platform" as in "works with iOS and Android, and the [in this case Chrome] browser". Other desktop browsers, BlackBerry, and Windows Phone, so far, need not apply. That's increasingly the case with Google, which makes me kinda wish they'd find a new, more honest word for it like "select-platforms". Apple and AirPlay only work with iOS and OS X, of course, which is worse from a supported platform perspective, but you absolutely know that going in.
Second, whenever someone talks about device independence, it means they're selling service dependence. It's the same old yarn from Flash, where it can run everywhere, but you become locked into Adobe's ecosystem. Likewise, Chromecast looks like it'll support a wide range of devices, but you'll be locked into Google API for doing so. No such thing as a free-as-in-speech or free-as-in-beer lunch.
Third, even though it streams from the cloud all on its own, Chromecast requires a secondary smart device to control it (iOS, Android, or Chrome-browser), and that introduces a point of failure. Even if my iPhone is dead, or left at another location, I can pick up the rinky-dink Apple TV IR remote and have at it. Not so with Chromecast.
All that aside, the price is killer, and you use iOS or Chrome on OS X, and the services you care most about are YouTube, Netflix, and other Google and partner offerings, Chromecast might be a great option for you.
If you're Apple-only, AirPlay, especially with AirPlay mirroring, and an Apple TV look like they're still a far better option (especially considering Apple TV has built-in, native YouTube and Netflix channels.)
I'll be getting one, though. Anyone else?
Source: Google Play via Android Central
Have something to say about this story? Leave a comment! Need help with something else? Ask in our forums!
I'll get one. When Google cares more about international launches.
Sent from the iMore App
That's true. No word on Canada yet either. I believe Apple TV had a better international presence at launch, if memory serves.
As long as I'm using an iPhone and iPad, just going to stick with my AppleTV. If I start using an Android device, I'd definitely get one. Another exception would be if I wanted to use services like this on another TV in my house and don't want to buy another Apple TV or get tired of always having to move my current one from one room to the next.
It's good the AC article was linked because comparing the two articles makes you wonder if each author was watching the same announcement. It's odd that Rene thinks "cross-platform" he normally it will work on all devices and all operating systems (e.g. Apple advertises that "iTunes works everywhere", yet I see no commentary on how users aren't knowing the real truth going in). Only an Apple blogger could argue that support for OSX, Windows, Android and iOS is considered a drawback. I also think it's ironic that he pans the device for service lock-in yet has no issue with the Apple alternative (with a similar lock-in).
You're a better author than this Rene. Leave the platform zealotry to loonies like Gruber and such.
1) I've written about the lack of cross-platform support from Apple a lot, especially recently, and specifically about iTunes and iMessage.
2) Google's positioning Chromecast as working with every device. I have two BB10 devices, and I'm about to get a Windows Phone, and it won't work with those. How's that "every" device?
3) I was pointing out that increasingly, and not just by Google, BlackBerry and Windows Phone are facing the Linux on the desktop problem - they're not even considered.
4) Personally attacking me is nowhere nearly as impressive as factually challenging what I wrote (especially when so spectacularly wrong ;) )
Rene you know cross-platform does not mean all-platforms.
I think the potential of Chromecast is much higher than Apple TV, in their current state, simply based on Chromecast enabling developers to do what they wish vs trickling a new channel here/there. Hopefully Apple changes their stance and opens it up at some point in the future.
Google said "any device". What they should have said was "select devices". If you listen to this week's Android Central podcast, I point this out and Phil, Jerry, and the guys hadn't even realized it didn't support BB10 and Windows Phone. That's poor messaging.
Your article says "cross-platform", not "any device", so that's what I was pointing out.
There messaging seems fine on the page: https://play.google.com/store/devices/details?id=chromecast. I'd have to watch the preso again to hear it in context.
AppleTV requires Apple products. And frankly when I use it to mirror, it can be a bit laggy from my Iphone 4S. Roku is great for it's ease of use, and ability to play local media from my Plex server.
What the Chromecast has is a few things.
HDMI-CEC: Now when you decide to push something, it will automatically change inputs and even turn on your TV. That is great for my 4 year old who just learned to put it on the right input for watching our Roku.
Platform independant: My wife has a Windows PC and an Iphone. Doesn't matter the device now, she can push stuff to the TV.
Price: For $35 the average consumer is going to look at all the set-top boxes at Best Buy and take this one. Because 95% of them just want Netflix and maybe Amazon or Vudu.
And how long until this is integrated into TV sets? If Google can get this built into TVs, it will be awesome. They already have the connections from their deals with GoogleTV. I will be buying these for our Office TVs in our conference rooms for sure, probably along with AppleTVs.
What Apple CAN'T do now is open up their App store for AppleTV and charge us a 3rd time for apps. I already paid two times for some things for my Iphone and Ipad. I hope that this forces Apple to push the boundaries and price points with their upcoming products.
looks very interesting i must say. Google music seems nice as i've got 19k songs on there.
my only concerns are power and the setup. Says it requires included usb cable for power (not shown). I don't have usb ports on my devices. My parents have year old super expensive Sharp tv and i know for a fact is has USB ports that are unpowered. It can read off a hard drive and when i tried to i had to find a usb splitter and run one cable to a laptop usb just to get the drive to power on because running it just into the tv usb didn't power it on. As for me, my tv is like 6 years old too so i don't have a free HDMI port which stinks.
Other thing is no remote. I'd hope they'd add one as everybody isn't gonna have a phone, like children. Seems strange that if you have one phone you're always gonna have to give it to someone to work this. What happens when you go to the grocery store while someone's home watching chromecast? I guess they can't hit pause cause i'm taking my phone.
It also comes with a power adapter (so you can plug it into your wall). You can buy an HDMI switch for <$20 but since that is over half the price of the device maybe that wouldn't be a great idea. I believe you can use your mac/pc as a remote.
Derrick4Real: Why would you need a remote. I think it would be useless as there isn't any sort of "homepage". This just *slings* things to your TV and then takes over the stream. I can't imagine that a home doesn't have a smart phone, tablet, or laptop able to run Chrome. If you have none of those, then this device is not for you, and a Roku is your best option.
I'd need a remote to pause, netflix, fast forward, rewind, select a new video, to navigate menues. If it hooks into google music i got 19k songs, i'd need a remote to move though menus, to select playlists, to que up songs. The same reason i have a remote for the other streaming devices i have, same reason i have a remote for my xbox and cable box. My nieces and nephews don't have phones or tablets. I have a iphone but i use my phone. I can't exactly give it to them while i'm doing stuff. And what happens when i leave and they are still in my house? They just can't watch netflix? They can't change the music? Now you may have all those devices sitting around by my family doesn't have all those tech gadgets around. And they surely don't travel with a tablet. You go places and just go to friends house. Normally you have a remote so anyone will easily know how to work the tv. Roku is ok, wdtv is much better. Plays way more formats. I've got almost 2 terabytes of movies, tv, home movies and music and the video comes in several formats and audio codec combos. The WDTV plays damn near everything imaginable. Regardless, i'm aware there are other things. My comments still are focused on this google device. it has it's limits. I use my phone all day for various tasks so unless i'm the one using this device it may be hard for guests to use it. When i leave my neice here with the baby sitter i'd hope the baby sitter had an android phone and bothered to install the app cause my own phone is going with me.
you are not listening man, it slings content from your device to it. This means there are no menus to navigate. You select what you would like to watch from your phone, tablet or computer be it from youtube, play music or Netflix. You do not navigate through your library from it but from the source. What the video on how it works and you will understand it. You are making it out to not work for you which it may not but it is a great service for the price. For the person who wants this service in multi rooms or to travel with. I can potentially take this to a hotel with me and I have all my content with me, to a friends or family's house as well. So like started before, you push content from your phone to it and then the cloud takes over the rest, it is not coming from your phone.
Ok, I can see your issues with the remote. But, I don't think you will see a remote come out for this.
The demo did show that if the primary smart phone leaves the premises that another device can take over for it. But that would require you to have something like a tablet, or iPod touch as well.
And I agree that the Chromecast has it's limitations. I use my Roku to stream all my local media from my Plex box. It transcodes it and then I watch it on the TV or my Ipad. But if the Chromecast can bypass the Plex, then I might be moving away from that box.
What I find fascinating about chromecast is that it seems to indicate that google is now being run by lovers of business plans rather than lovers of technology. In my opinion this is the beginning of the end of Google as we know it. I say this because it would have been much simpler and more straightforward to release a product that simply mirrored the video and/or audio of your pc or smartphone and released the spec/API so that any developer could write an app or utility to use it. Instead it is clear they are using this device as a fishing lure to catch more advertising dollars by limiting which apps can use it. This sort of thing makes my stomach turn. Only a business school graduate would hobble a piece of technology like this.
At our company we struggled to find affordable wireless projectors for our conference rooms. We realized the AppleTV was solution. We added an AppleTV to all our projectors and got aiparrot for those with PCs. No more fumbling around with cables and monitor setting when you want to present. Problem solved. We'll stick with this solution for now.


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MIS390 - Business Internship A
Unit details
|2014 unit information
|Enrolment modes:
Trimester 1: Placement
Trimester 2: Placement
Trimester 3: Placement
|Credit point(s):
|Previously coded as:
|EFTSL value:
|Work experience in industry:
This is a Work Integrated Learning (WIL) unit*
|Unit chair:
A Craig
Completion of 12 credit points
|Incompatible with:
|Contact hours:
This unit requires no formal class attendance. However, this work placement will involve between 100-120 hours of supervised contact.
*Placements can be completed in Australia or overseas. Students must apply using the application form which can be found through http://www.deakin.edu.au/buslaw/wil
Students cannot enrol in the unit or commence a placement without written approval.
Students should have made substantial progress in their major(s) and would normally study this unit in their final year.
You will need to access substantial learning resources and experiences in CloudDeakin (Deakin's online learning environment). Compliance with the Standards in computing, connectivity and student capability are a condition on your enrolment.
This unit aims to provide students with the opportunity to undertake appropriate and relevant experiential learning.
Students complete a work placement of 100 - 120 hours with an approved host organisation. Internships can be completed in all discipline and general business areas. Students will critically reflect on their placement, their graduate attributes and employability competencies through a continuous assessment process.
Assessment 1 (Individual) - Written Assignment - Start pf placement, self evaluation (1500 words) - 20%
Assessment 2 (Individual) - Written Assignment - Reflective Learning Journal (3500 words) - 30%
Assessment 3 (Individual) - Written Assignment - Post placement report (3500 words) - 50%
Unit Fee Information
|Student Contribution Rate*
|Student Contribution Rate**
|Fee rate - Domestic Students
|Fee rate - International students
* Rate for all CSP students, except for those who commenced Education and Nursing units pre 2010
** Rate for CSP students who commenced Education and Nursing units pre 2010
Please note: Unit fees listed do not apply to Deakin Prime students.

subset: commoncrawl


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College is very different than high school; you'll need to be your own advocate once you arrive on campus.
While many schools offer support to students with learning disabilities, you will only receive a service if you specifically request it. Before you arrive on campus, work with your parents, high school teachers and counselors to assess your own learning style. It will be helpful to know how you learn best and strategies that help you succeed. You should also be aware of the circumstances in which you do not learn well.
One note: Different schools offer different levels of LD services, from basic accomodations all the way up to extensive programs run by several staff members. Ask before you apply!
Before classes start, find the Office of Disability Services (ODS) and let them know that you have a learning disability. They will request documents that support your claim. It's a good idea to inquire in advance to find out what documents are required; some colleges even offer their own assessments. (If you've self–identified during the application process, you should still visit the ODS to check in when you arrive on campus.)
Your college may ask you to notify professors and request accommodations from them yourself. This is a very different procedure than the one you encountered in high school, when teachers and administrators worked to address your needs without much input from you.
If you choose not to request help, and then struggle in your classes, you won't be able to go back and re–take a test or re–write a paper. You'll have to live with your grades, at least until the next semester.
Colleges are not required to provide you with special programs that meet your educational needs. They aren't obligated to provide classes or tests specifically tailored to your LD.
Under the Americans with Disabilities Act, however, colleges are required to ensure that you have equal access to existing programs and services. So if your LD prevents you from participating fully, you have the right to request help. The college must provide assistance with existing classes and tests-the same ones everyone else is taking.
Depending on the school, services offered to LD students can include tutors, writing programs, assistance with registration and enrollment, specially equipped computer laboratories, modifications to exam procedures or course loads, the use of note–takers and training on learning techniques and strategies.
Your college can choose the kind of assistance it will provide, as long as it works. For example, if you ask ODS to provide you with a laptop computer and special note–taking software, the office may instead offer to pay another student to take notes for you.
Many students believe that because they have to ask for services, their colleges don't actually want to provide them. This is not true. Your college admitted you, and they want you to succeed.
You will need to be more upfront and self–sufficent than you were in high school. But if you stand up for yourself and communicate clearly, you're likely to get all the support you need.


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This emotional journey will revisit the stories of my Uncle Joe once again. I hope you will enjoy them, and think of your family as you read.
Joseph Henry Thompson (pictured, left) was born in June 1925 in Birmingham, England. The eldest of 4 children, and brother of my father (dad being the youngest). I never knew him and my father hardly had the time before his tragic demise post-war at 22.
Joe 'joined up' to the RAF, along with thousands of other young men, in 1943 at the tender age of 18. He left his widowed Mother, Olive (my Nan) and 3 siblings and left for training in London after Christmas. This letter is from his first posting to the Intake Training Wing (ITW) in Bridlington, just 2 weeks or so later, where he has been sent for 6 weeks of intensive, tough training.
Letter 14 – Don't worry, Mum – 31st January 1944
Letter transcript:
5Flt. 96 Intake
East Yorkshire
Dear Mom and Kids,
"I received your (friday) letter today. I've already answered the one that came with the second parcel, I hope you got it OK. I did not see the M.O. about my eyes as they had cleaned up when I woke next day.
I had two letters the other day, one from Aunt Em and the other from Unc' Bill Beddard. The letter from Aunt Em & Co enclosed a 5/- Postal Order (very tasty!) and Uncle Bill's had one in for 2/-! They came just right! I'm going to answer Aunt Em's after this but I'm in a fix about Uncle Bill as I can't find his letter. When you write again will you send their address on as I must thank them for the 'dibs'. By the way, please don't go to any trouble or expense for a parcel for me, they are very welcome but I know how things are at home. About that allowance, if it comes as you want me to withdraw the 5/-, I can send it to you by the post.
Please don't worry about me when I say I'm going on or have been to the range as the slip that chap made last week* (*see previous letter) was probably 1 in a million. You see he put six bullets in the gun and only fired five and when he handed it to me to unload the sixth was up the 'spout'.
Now I'm thinking of it don't bother about me and washin', they let us send some things to the Laundry each week and any other oddments which need it we wash ourselves. About socks, up to now I've had no darning to do on my 'issue' but that will come!
We went on guard again last night. I was put on guard with the usual sub-machine gun and truncheon, at Wing H.Q. After the supper man had gone, the Corporal of the guard said I could 'oppit if I liked!! Oh boy, what a life!
By the way (once again) wish 'our kid' the best for me when he starts work. Was glad to see that Freda had heard from Norman it must be a great relief to her to write to him. Also thank her for her kind remembrance of the young ex-serf!
That picture you wrote of was round here last week but I never saw it worse luck. 'Financial straits'!
Let me know how Leo Terry gets on. I see Roma isn't wasting much time! I've first realised that I have never written to Aunt Phyll. The trouble is that I've so many to write to that I don't know whether so and so's had a letter from me or not half of the time. I do hope she will excuse the delay.
Those pyjamas by the way are very welcome at night, especially when we've no fire.
Now for the bit of good news! I've saved it to the end of my letter on purpose. I may get as much as 14 days leave from here when my six weeks is up! The officer said that it will be at least 5 days so keep your fingers crossed! When this course is finished we go to an 'Air Gunnery School' one of which there happens to be at Bridgenorth, about 30 miles from Brum*! I only hope that they send me there.
That's all for now, so Cheerio,
Love to you all
Joe. xxxx
PS. May also send a group photo later on, with 3 or 4 pals on too.
PPS. Haven't got the first yet!
.. a bit more:- Thanks for the stamps, Post Offices are closed when we finish each day and they only allow 2 each at NAAFI"
*Brum = Birmingham (home town)
Even handling these 68-year-old letters makes me a bit nervous. Today's letter was still held together at the top of the pages by the original glue from the flimsy RAF notepad on which Joe wrote. I had to gently prise the pages apart in order to scan them for posterity. I love to think of Joe handling the same piece of paper and tearing the pages out roughly….quite a contrast to the delicate hands and focused eyes which I am using today to read and protect his words….
Joe's full story is beautiful and tragic. He was our family hero. He IS our family hero. If I knew how to complete an effective RAF salute, I would salute you now, Joe. Long may your memory live in our family stories.
I hope to post a new letter from Joe's correspondence with his Mother here every Friday until they're done. It will be a turbulent and heart-wrenching journey. Subscribe to the Blog to make sure you don't miss any of it.
Other posts in this series:-
Letter 1 – 29 December 1943, arriving at Recruit Camp
Letter 2 – 31 December 1943, settling in
Letter 3 – 5th January 1944, confined to Barracks!
Letter 4 – 8th January 1944, meeting a boxing champ
Letter 5 – 10th January 1944, theft and wrongful punishment
Letter 6 – 13th January 1944, preparing to leave basic training camp
Letter 7 – 13th January 1944, high jinx and punishing schedules
Letter 8 – 14th January 1944, posted to Bridlington
Letter 9 – 18th January 1944, arrival in 'the dump' for 6 weeks training
Letter 10 – 21st January 1944, an introduction to firearms
Letter 11 – 25th January 1944, a fellow cadet in killed
Letter 12 – 27th January 1944, pork pies, live rounds and dimwits
Letter 13 – 29th January 1944, 10 fillings & the Browning machine gun


text:
Virtual Tour - Life On Campus
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Involvement in student activities is an important part of a well-rounded education at Carroll. However, Student Life is more than events and activities. The Office of Student Life promotes a sense of belonging for students, whether new or returning. The office encourages networking among students to develop a feeling of connection to the entire campus.
Faculty and staff at the college believe student involvement in activities that complement academics play an important role in the learning process.
Participation in campus activities helps to promote student growth. Student events such as weekend trips, concerts, theatrical productions, lecture programs, student publications, and multicultural programs are some of the special opportunities available to students.


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Deep garnet in color, with rich aromas of plum, black cherry, tobacco leaf and spice. Enormously complex, it has highly-extracted, concentrated flavors of smoky currant, blackberry, vanilla and mocha.
*Finger Lakes International Wine Competition
*Pacific Rim International
*Taster's Guild
*International Eastern Wine Competition
*Armenti Del Vino
*Indy International Wine Competition


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333 Busch's Frontage Rd.
Annapolis, MD 21409-5534
At Annapolis Volvo we carry a huge inventory of used Volvo and pre-owned cars in Annapolis from a variety of manufacturers. We put all our used vehicles through an extensive inspection before hitting the pre owned car lot in order to ensure that they are of the highest quality. Whether you are looking for a pre owned truck, car, van, or SUV in Annapolis, we're confident that we have what you are looking for. Give us a ring or visit our Annapolis used car dealership for a test drive today. We invite you to experience why we are one of the Annapolis, Silver Spring, Easton, and Owings Mills region's most trusted used car dealers.
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Details and Shopping
Customer Favorite
- FP Exclusive :
- Only sold thru Free People
Dramatic floral printed maxi dress with black lace and leather stitch trimming. Extravagantly decorated collar that ties at the back of neck with embroidered ties. Sides of waist have coiled rope detailing and fringe tassels. Low scoop back. Zips up the back. Lined.
The delicately romantic and texture heavy New Romantics collection was inspired by the dream-worthy beach views and magically hidden coves of Sardinia, Italy.
*100% Polyester
*Dry Clean Only
Measurements for Size 6:
Length: 43 1/4"
Bust (all around): 31"
Waist (all around): 28 1/2"
Strap Length: 7 3/4"
Collar Length: 12 1/2"
The delicately romantic and texture heavy New Romantics collection was inspired by the dream-worthy beach views and magically hidden coves of Sardinia, Italy.
*100% Polyester
*Dry Clean Only
Measurements for Size 6:
Length: 43 1/4"
Bust (all around): 31"
Waist (all around): 28 1/2"
Strap Length: 7 3/4"
Collar Length: 12 1/2"
Rated 4.6 out of 5Â by 9 reviewers.
Rated 4 out of 5Â by Zala Super pretty This dress is quiet heavy due to the amount of fabric used but no complain here! The flow is beautiful when in circular motion. Length is just right for my 173CM/5'8" height. 5.1.2013
Rated 5 out of 5Â by nado Romantics Black Magic Dress This dress is even more beautiful than represented in the photos. I got it last week and it is now my most favorite dress ever. The only problem was that the sizing is absolutely true, and I ordered a size larger. Should have gone by the sizing guide. But I love it and want to wear it all the time. 12.19.2012
Rated 5 out of 5Â by Roon Love this dress! This dress fits true to size. It's has a wonderful flowy style and is well constructed. 8.29.2013
Rated 4 out of 5Â by raniakhallaf Chic the dress looks exactly like pictured, though the S size was little large, go for one size smaller.I wish that dress was padded since i cannot wear a bra because of the low back. 6.18.2013
Rated 5 out of 5Â by CarpeVentum Dynamite This dress is the epitome of a black mass and the autumn equinox. The details and craftmanship of this dress are excellent. I sized down from my normal 8 to a 6. The back fits and lays just like the model pictures. The material does add a bit of bulk to the hips. The dress has beautiful movement and flow. Like other reviewers mentioned it is a tad heavy in material. I found that you must stand up straight and let the dress hang as it will for the lace neck piece to lay flat. 6.10.2013
Rated 4 out of 5Â by Jessica_C Very pretty dress but... First of all this is a very gorgeous dress with an insane amount of great detail. The collar is very comfortable although it could look overwhelming especially on someone of short stature. Length is perfect, I'm 5'6 and reaches about my ankles and I find the fit in general very true to size. However, the print is not for someone of my age, it would look beautiful on someone in their late 30s-40s but definitely not on someone in their 20s like me. I'm sad that I'll have to return it but hopefully free people will come up with a similar design but in a solid color. 6.4.2013
Rated 5 out of 5Â by slu all in all gorgeous well, i must say that at first look i wasn't impressed. the dress is very heavy, seems a bit "old lady style". i tired it on and the "vintagey" look was immediately eminent. one thing i did straight away was to cut out the horrible under lining -the dress became lighter and less heavy on my body and looks great ! the fabric is partially sheer but not a see through so you can leave it at that. this is a day dress for me and the quality of the fabric and stitching is superb! ITS A KEEPER. 6.4.2013
Rated 4 out of 5Â by KittyMalone Gorgeous When I saw that this dress had finally been marked down I jumped on buying it immediately. It is really gorgeous in person and the photo here is a true representation of the dress. The details are amazing. However, the dress is extremely heavy and the fabric is a bit scratchy. It also ran large on me, but I am a tiny girl at 5'0 tall, 90 lbs. 23 inch waist, 32B bust. I ordered a size 0. It swallows me, but it's so unique I want to keep it. I will have to take it to a seamstress to see if there is a way to make it fit through the torso and also the front lace part that reaches up to the collar - that part is about 2 inches too long on me. The length of the rest of the dress is fine for my height - I could wear it with flat sandals or heels and it does not touch the floor surprisingly. I wish it would have fit me right out of the package - or came in a size 00. 5.18.2013
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|Off Topic Lounge All Discussions Not Related To Drumming
|Thread Tools
Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
A way to think about this is in terms of energy. With analog, vibrations are converted to electrical waves then pressure waves (sound); there's a continuum of energy here. With digital, vibrations are converted to electrical waves and then digitized. Then the digitization is reproduced into electrical then pressure waves (sound). There seems to be this "interruption" of energy.
I'm somewhat convinced that analog seems to be the "purer" type of sound and digital is somehow "fake". I don't really have the confidence to use those words without quotations so I'm on the edge of the argument. I'm trying to convince myself that digital isn't "fake" but I can't seem to do that.
Which do you prefer and why assuming equal sound quality (ie. highest fidelity equipment known to man for each)?
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Assuming 'perfect' quality, there would be no difference. Both would be perfect.
Digital sound does sample. Hence 44.1KHz sampling rate - 44,100 samples per second, or 48KHz or 96KHz, etc. Analogue sound is theoretically at an infinite sample rate and therefore theoretically 'higher' in quality. The same is true of the bit depth (the number of steps available dynamically) - digital is stepped and analogue is theoretically not stepped.
In practice they are very different. Digital sampling rates (particularly those above CD quality (44.1KHz at 16-Bit)) are so high that the ear cannot distinguish any practical difference between the recorded sound and 'natural' sound.
Analogue on the other hand does have a particular sound. Tapes are often driven hard and produce a slight compression, which is usually pleasing and helps 'glue' the low-end together on a track - the drums and bass can often fit better together than with purely digital recording.
For an analogue system to truly 'outperform' a modern digital system is terms of natural sound, or rather accuracy would be to all intents and purposes impossible. Digital sound is, by it's nature, clean and clinical. What goes in the A/D is what comes out of the D/A converters if no manipulation is applied (and by manipulation, I include downsampling and equipment besides the computer). Analogue sound is inherently transformed by the recording medium.
Furthermore, there are some really great emulators out there that can reproduce the sound of tape within a DAW. In one issue of 'Sound on Sound' magazine they actually conducted a blind experiment to see whether anyone in the studio could tell the difference between a recording done on a 24-track tape recorder (the specific model escapes me but it was essentially the best-regarded machine in the industry) and a modern DAW with software written to emulate the sound of that precise machine. The difference between the two was practically nothing and neither 'won' the contest.
If you want to record on tape, be my guest. I've done it. It's a lot of fun. Practically though, it's much harder to get good-sounding results on tape than it would be on a modern DAW system. There are specific difficulties with tape machines that make them more specialised - setting the azimuth, setting the bias correctly, choosing the type of tape and cleaning the heads. Also, you have to bear in mind that tape degrades so you cannot afford to 'run over' the same section again and again because it will compromise the quality of the recording.
Editing is incomparably more difficult on tape. Honestly? Unless you're very handy with a razorblade and have a lot of practice and time, I wouldn't even bother trying. Editing on a DAW system is quite literally hundreds of times easier.
Analogue (due to the limited track count) does force you to streamline your workflow and make mix decisions early. This is a good thing. It means you end up with a better result most of the time because you're eliminating the unnecessary cruft. Adapting the same technique with a digital system is a good idea if you have the discipline.
A lot of modern studios run a 'hybrid' system whereby they record to tape, dump the tape tracks to digital, edit digitally and then master to tape. That's the best of both Worlds really but still highly specialised.
In an ideal World, I would run the hybrid system. It's not an ideal World though and I don't have the patience to use tape regularly. I also don't want to be moving a 400-pound tape machine from one room to another when I could simply take my laptop. Or deal with the acres of outboard gear, or the setting up of the machine itself. Tape is a pain in the arse, although it does sound very good if you can get it right.
Here's a great article about the different steps that analogue systems use in recording:
It's very complicated. It's highly specialised. It's difficult and if I were home recording, I wouldn't be touching tape with a ten-foot barge pole. I would only consider doing it in a 'real' studio with 'real' money and a lot of time - and I have a good idea of what I'm doing.
Last edited by BacteriumFendYoke; 01-28-2013 at 05:43 AM.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
This argument consistently cracks me up. In the 1960's I guarantee not one person said "Man, I really wish we still recorded to a copper plate like we did fifty years ago!"
Put your superstition aside and appreciate the technological advancements in recording you are living to experience. I promise they do nothing but make your life/workflow easier.
Not banned (yet)
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Excellent write-up, Duncan.
IMO, the practical benefits far outweigh any relatively small sonic advantages you *might* get - it's not as easy to find analog hold-outs as it used to be so the pool of expertise is an ever shrinking one.
BTW, I don't see digital as being fake in any way. It won't mask a poor performance or make a bad one sound good. There's not any smoke and mirrors going on; on man behind the curtain so to speak. At the end of the day, all those zeros and ones are voltage signals. The translation uses a different principal but it's no less valid. As long as the resolution is tighter than what you can hear, I don't see how it can be fundamentally inferior.
I can see how the words "digital" and "analog" evoke different emotional responses, but historically that's never been a good gauge of something's worth.
My kit: It's not just good, it's good enough. Recent band.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
I always incorporate analog into recordings that I do in my studio, whether it be tracking on tape or mastering, or even just a tube compression plug in. Editing always happens in the digital realm, though.
You can't assume the sound quality is the same. If it were, there would be NO contest--digital for the win. The fact remains that there is a world of difference in the sound. I like using the best of both worlds.
Be vewwy quiet, I'm hunting Lawwy
My kit: http://drummerworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44195
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Analog is cool if you didn't know any other way of working. Once you start working, if an easier way came up to be able to do it, you would.
Your statement was if "all things were equal", then they'd be equal. The question is how you work within each mediums' parameters.
I know an older gentleman who was an analog synthesist pioneer in the 60s and actually produced the music for Disney's Electrical Parade which debuted in 1972, and we were talking about digital, and he asked me, "would you go back to analog after knowing what you know now?" And the answer was "of course not". He's always looking for newer better ways to do things, and the man has done them. Les Paul said it too to a group of engineers at an audio convention: "You'd think with all those bald heads out there you'd come up with a better way to record and reproduce sound than by dragging a diamond needle in vinyl grooves or running rust over a metal head". And he was right.
Obviously, the op owns a computer. I'm wondering if you partake of the joys of downloading music and carrying all your library in an iPod (or something similar) - or better - you have all of it on your phone. If you are going to commit to analog, I think you should do it all the way ;)
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Both - of course!! (Like matched vs. traditional grip.)
But either way make sure you're using the best stuff you can afford!
You know what added to the 'analog is better/smoother' hype? The fact that in those days technology simply wasn't any better than it was - not saying it was bad - it was... limited from today's perspective but on the other hand folks at that time manufactured gear to sometimes _higher_ technical specifications (component selection, overall build quality) than nowadays! Those components were more 'forgiving' in terms of signal processing and the signal flow within the equipment was 'slower' than nowadays. This resulted in the overall sound being less harsh (having less or smoother high frequencies) and the transients (fast level bursts which by far exceed the average level) were more prone to being reduced simply by the components, not by design.
Nowadays gear tends to sound cleaner or, if you want, 'harsh'. But that's not because the gear is crappy but because there's more left of the original sound than there was in the past. That's a somewhat simplified version. We _do_ have crappy gear nowadays but you get the idea.
Personally I like using (hi-end) analog gear as front-end (signal -> mics -> analog pre-amps), then (if needed but usually yes) I'd add EQ and/or compression (analog also), then convert the signal. After A/D conversion I'd either use digital stuff or sometimes add another D/A stage for further analog processing. While there are stunning plugins if you once set your hands on really great analog gear and learn what analog stuff can do to the signal (literally within a few seconds you can have noticeable improvements when e.g. using an EQ and turning real knobs instead of fumbling with a mouse at the PC) analog does provide a sound quality to dream of and gives you a great feel of having control over a sound. Plus having real knobs at one's fingertips is just different from clicking in menues.
Provided you have decent gear there's not much of a sonic difference. The difference becomes really obvious when you compare so-so gear (from both worlds).
Converters are a critical component because regardless of the processing quality of the gear itself a crappy D/A converter will make you think that piece of equipment is crap. And modern converters are extremely high standard (money provided).
Just recently I've bought the very best guitar modeling/fx processor around (Fractal Audio Axe-Fx II) and for the first time I really feel I'm not playing a modeling device but a real instrument/amp. In fact I'm considering selling some of my guitar/analog processors/effects because that digital thingy makes so many things extremely easy (endless routing/editing/saving options, all within _one_ unit - plus MIDI footcontroller). I do have a decent Mesa/Boogie tube head sitting at my homestudio but the sound difference is shockingly tiny if inaudible (provided you have a minimum of talent getting settings right/reasonable). I'll keep the amp, at least for now - not really because of any sound difference but because I've paid good money for it, it's decent analog/tube gear and it looks cool! (But weighs a ton...) Haha.
Ultimately I'd rather go with great analog front-end plus mediocre A/D converters than crappy digital.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
On the other hand if you have a limited budget and anticipate the majority of your audience listening to your recordings through tiny ear-bud headphones connected to an mp3 player then time and money spent on analogue mics, pre-amps, desks, tape reorders, and the rest of it would seem a little superfluous wouldn't it?
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Analog Rush albums vs. digital age Rush albums. You decide.
I'm the Analog Man. 100%. No comparison.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
No problem or preference with either, the resulting sound is what's important and digital has come a long way since its relatively brittle roots a few decades ago. Mics, rooms, and mic preamps make more of a difference than ever now. Al's new tracks are all digital, but have the sound we had for our first several albums, which were all recorded and mixed to tape. Of course, the advantages of production and mixing in ProTools (or DP, Logic, Sonar, etc) cannot be denied. Even if somebody wants to track to tape, it's dumped to digital before much else will happen.
And that's another thing... it's all digital, isn't. Record all you want in the analog domain, transfer it at 24/192 for integrity, and in the end it becomes a CD at 16/44.1 anyway. Or worse and more common, a streamable/downloadable format.
But back to the sound... if done right, there doesn't have to be a difference. And if done wrong, neither format is very forgiving.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Not banned (yet)
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Bermuda, just to add.
I have held the view for a long time that CD 44.1/16 is hopelessly outdated and has been for at least a decade. CDs sound fine for most applications and they are honestly a good-quality format but in countries with high-bandwidth Internet access (like mine, we have a decent fibre connection in my house) that lossless audio or FLAC is definitely the way forward. The sound quality is better and 24-bit audio definitely and noticeably improves the dynamic range of digital recordings.
Above 192 Kb/S, Mp3 is good enough for 99% of listeners, even. Even at lower bitrates, Mp3 is a good codec and I doubt there are a huge number of laypeople that can differentiate between 128 Kb/S and 192 Kb/S. I can (definitely) but amongst the general public? Not so much.
Digital, high-quality downloads are the future and it's only the inherent conservatism of distributors and labels that has prevented this from becoming the 'standard' method of delivery. iTunes has come a long way in providing quality downloads and other places offer lossless or FLAC files for a little more money, I just wish it had become more mainstream in record shops.
I don't mind buying CDs and I continue to do so because they're just about good enough but it's high time that physical disks were upgraded to 96/24. It annoys me that DVDs often have higher-quality sound than CDs and in a lot of cases are much cheaper to buy. Using a DVD format for music would alleviate most of the issues with people needing to buy new equipment. SACD was a good idea but required specialised players to take advantage of the format and there weren't ever enough good new releases taking advantage of the format.
When it comes to my own listening, I like to listen to vinyl. I like the imperfections and I like the sound but for the sake of convenience, at least 80% of my listening is digital and usually lossy.
The industry need to sit down and discuss a new physical format and get behind it. The Red Book needs updating badly. CDs have been around 30 years (as of this year) commercially and are not the best that we could do any more.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Good input from everyone (who supported their stance). Unfortunately the "it all ends up digital" argument doesn't necessarily apply in this situation since we're more in the punk/noise music world where its very common to release something on vinyl. Then again there's always a streaming/downloading system used as well. Right now budget is a HUGE determining factor so digital/analog together it is.
Thinking about it more, later on (with money) I could produce an EP or LP with only analog devices. This analog concept would tie into the album and be meaningful but I think for general purposes, a hybrid system might be the way to go. There's seems to be some inherent quality of analog that makes it seem more.. alive. I'm not sure what it is really. Maybe the imperfections bring in an aspect of randomness that makes it have its own personality of sorts... Too much time spent thinking about analog or digital, not enough time spent making music.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Noise, or Punk?
I ask because Noise was my specialism at University.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Drummer for Gloryhammer
My facebook page
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
As long as I never turn out like this guy:
God help me if I ever end up running one of those.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
But in just the last 5 years, the advatages of "hi def" have become quite clear in the visual context with better screens and content for TVs and devices. Perhaps there's a better understanding and a new willingness to accept hi-def audio again. Agreed that a DVD player has already replaced CD players for many people, and BD movies are often cheaper than CDs as well.
Our most recent album was released as a CD, LP, and BD with uncompressed audio. Happily, there were videos for every song on the album, so there's something to see in addition to just listening. But it's that kind of value added benefit that will make such a format attractive for those who might otherwise just buy the CD or downloads. And it's an introduction to the use of a BD player as a hi-def audio player.
I'm ready, my hearing is still good enough to tell the difference!
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
I think it depends on what type of equipment we're talking about, generally I like Analog synths more than soft synths, but usually I find that Pro Tools gives a better sound than analog recording methods, even modern analog recordings, but I do see both sides there. And vinyl, which could be considered analog of sorts, is of course better than cd's or Mp3/flac ect.
But in the end it just depends on the sound you are looking for.
just my 2 cents.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Do any of you have any idea what it takes to keep a top of the line analogue tape recorder clean and up to spec? Digital makes it so you don't need to do any of that. Also, your music is safer in the digital format and will not degrade over time, which is what happens to reels of analogue tape, not to mention generation loss.
And digital sounds great. Listen to Roy Haynes' CD "Love Letters" and tell me that it should have been recorded analogue.
Call me J
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Thanks for the informative post, Duncan. I found this especially interesting:
I think of the digital / analogue process in stages. The instrument (acoustic or electo), the recording gear (tape or direct to digital) and the mixing gear where, as mentioned earlier, the improvements are so great that you might as well say there's only one way to go.
I can do so much more with free software like Audacity today than I could with an expensive Portastudio plus effects units back in the 80s. The only small thing I lose is the ability to adjust the faders while doing the final mix down - which was a bit of an art in itself in the old days.
(Having said that, the other improvements are so great and my ears are not so fine that missing out on doing final touch ups with the faders is a non issue for me, and I mention it only for the purpose of completeness :)
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Drummer for Gloryhammer
My facebook page
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Is there more to it than that? Is it a listening "skill" that anyone can develop, or is it simple physiology/age, etc?
I would love to do a truly blind A/B test and see if I could tell the difference between 128/256/320, etc.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
MP3 works by using a series of psychoacoustic 'tricks'. The encoder will run a series of analyses on the original file and - depending on the quality required - take out more or less of the original source signal. This is true of any lossy codec and they all work is similar ways, although the algorithm used to determine what is unnecessary is different between each different codec, so they will sound different.
One of the common methods used is to take out frequencies that are masked by others. Some frequencies 'cover up' other frequencies making them difficult to hear and - thus - irrelevant to the mix. Those will be taken straight out with only the prominent frequency remaining. Another technique that is used is take out the fundamental frequency of a note and to leave some of the harmonics. The human ear quite often 'fills in' the fundamental note if we hear the harmonics, so taking out the lowest fundamental is utilised. Out goes a whole set of other frequencies.
There are dozens of these little things that MP3 does.
Then you run into all the 'standard' quality changes. Bit depth, sampling rate, etc.
This article:
Explains quite a few of them. Even though the article is nearly thirteen years old, the codec (and hence encoding) is still the same. The processes have got marginally better and refined since then but the basic premise and the techniques are the same.
The fact is, that the more we remove from an original PCM recording, the more we notice the distortions and changes - to the point where it starts to sound 'unnatural'. Now, for most people, 128 Kb/S is just about 'good enough', although a lot of people will be able to tell the difference; especially if they're trained (like me) to spot the differences. 192 Kb/S is more than good enough for the vast majority of people (myself probably included) for an MP3 to sound like the original PCM recording. There is a certain skill to it and I can best describe it as a kind of 'graininess' that you get at lower-quality. When you get into very low-quality, it's immediately obvious because the dynamic range and sampling rate (hence frequency output - like up Nyquist theorem) is significantly altered. That does get harder to detect with age because of a natural loss of hearing at high-frequency but if somebody is - theoretically - over the age of fifty or sixty with 'normal' hearing loss, then it's still detectable and obvious.
When mixing tracks though, it always helps to have the highest-quality source file to work from in the first place. When processing tracks, some of the quality is likely to be lost with various manipulations or any distortions made more obvious by processes like normalisation, so working with the best-quality we can prevents that from happening.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
They sound lovely but now you can get hold of tape machine emulators that are indistinguishable from the original machines as a plug-in for a DAW there really is no need to use them any more.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
Duncan, thanks so much for taking the time to post all that. It's so nice to finally come across a person who really knows his sh**. There are a lot of pretenders out there, as I'm sure you know.
Very enlightening.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
It's important that musicians understand the formats that we're using to communicate and how they might effect our art.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
with close listening, there is clearly more depth to the FLAC. I wouldn't notice it with casual listening. If I didn't listen to each side by side I might not be able to consistently tell which is which. I suspect that with higher end systems, the difference may be more apparent. or maybe not.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
I'm just listening through my iTunes library right now with my 'good' headphones on (AKG K701) but running through a small interface that's limited to 44.1/16.
Every now and then I change album, listen for a few seconds and check the bit-rate. I have managed to identify the 128 Kb/S-encoded tracks every time before checking. Between 192, 256 and 320 I can't obviously discern a difference but that might be a limiting factor of the portable interface I'm using. I'll try it again tomorrow through my 'full' interface.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
"I'm somewhat convinced that analog seems to be the "purer" type of sound and digital is somehow "fake"."
I'd argue that both analog and digital recording systems are not pure. For example, in its strictest sense, distortion is a corruption of a pure signal. Distortion can either occur or be invoked in both analog and digital recording devices and systems. The only difference is that because analog is an earlier technology, many types of music have already established a large repertoire of creative uses for analog distortion, and these have gone on to become canons of recording practice. But there are other more recent contemporary styles which are have found equally creative applications for digital distortion, and which have opened up new avenues for artistic expression.
Much of 20th and 21st century popular music have invoked all sorts of signal processing which, on the one hand can be seen as a corruption of a pure signal, but on the other hand are deemed necessary to fulfill the creative desires of the artist. I've stopped worrying about the analog-digital argument, and focused more on how the inherent characteristics of each paradigm can be deployed to deliver my artistic intentions. I use whatever works. And I 'm thankfull for having both technologies at my disposal.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
I would have to choose digital, because of the easy accessibility. But, that's just me. I enjoy having the modern technology at my disposal, but I also love the sound of vinyl records (I have a turntable, forgot which model).
-Aaron, the aspiring drummer
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
The binary system of digital recording is, in a way, identical to analog tape. Instead of ones and zeros, tiny magnetic poles on the tape are turned from "off" negative to "on" positive (or is it the other way around, I can't remember...). So, the OP's superstition is unnecessary (as superstitions tend to be).
It has long been known that tape compression/saturation, and the harmonics imparted by preamps and mixing consoles are responsible for analog's desirability. But every year a new plug-in arrives to emulate these features, and they sound better and better. Initially, crappy AD and DA converters and jittery wordclocks were to blame (and you can still find crappy converters in consumer stereos), but that's been addressed in recording interfaces.
The one failure of digital as a medium is monitor mixing. Sending a signal through a computer, and then back into a pair of headphones takes a few milliseconds, whereas in analog the task is instantaneous. As computer processing power continues to increase, though, this becomes less and less of an issue as well.
Re: Assume sound quality is equal: Digital or Analog?
The primary reason for tape breakdown was the introduction of "back coating". This turned out, after many years, to be a thorn in the backsides of both Scotch and Ampex. Most of the early tape formulations without the back coating, such as Scoth 111, are still fine and even today are still being used to make digital copies of material that was recorded more than sixty years ago. No one really knows the life expectancy of our current digital media or processes.
I have to use both, it goes with the territory, but I enjoy using analog because it was instilled into me at a very early age.
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Stir jalapeno and lime juice together. Add kiwi, 1/4 teaspoon salt (or to taste), and cilantro. Stir to combine.
Season shrimp with 1/2 teaspoon salt. Heat oil in a large skillet over high until shimmering. Add shrimp in a single layer and cook without turning until underside is pink, about 3 minutes. Turn and cook until opaque throughout, 2 minutes more. Remove from pan and serve immediately with kiwi-lime relish.
To peel a kiwi easily, trim off top and bottom ends and slide a spoon under the skin to remove.


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Tim Cook shmoozes with politicians around Washington
Tim Cook recently visited a bunch of U.S. politicians to open up the lanes of communication between Apple and Washington. Two weeks ago he visited House Speaker John Boehner, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell. An anonymous aide says conversations stayed light and introductory, so nothing heavy like the e-books case or patent infringement issues came up.
This is just one of the many ways in which Tim Cook is handling Apple in a decidedly different way than Steve Jobs ever did; as you could imagine, Jobs was never particularly interested in working with the government, nevermind in such a relaxed, friendly manner. President Obama was known to be relatively chatty with with Steve Jobs, and even the rank-and-file bureaucrats are opting to pick up iPhones.
It certainly behooves Apple to get cozy with lawmakers, especially now it's more embroiled than ever in legal issues with other manufacturers. Still, their lobbying budget is way smaller than Google's, and these meetings are but a small first step towards Apple's involvement with Washington.
Source: Fortune
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Tim Cook shmoozes with politicians around Washington
frankly it just strikes me wrong that the ceo would go and talk to politicians when they shouldn't have anything to do with apple. (correct me if I'm wrong) all politicians are scheming little bastards so the fact that apple or at least the ceo would have something to do with them kinda turns me off to the whole iPhone thing. however I'm not gonna let that get in the way of me enjoying an excellent product.


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EST430 - Educational Software Tools 1
Unit details
|2015 unit information
|Enrolment modes:
|Trimester 1: Cloud (online)
|Credit point(s):
|EFTSL value:
|Unit chair:
|L Bragg
|Incompatible with:
|Contact hours:
Learning experiences are via CloudDeakin
The topics to be addressed in this unit include: the development of skills with the use of word processing and graphics applications for the presentation of educational documents. Capabilities with a desktop publishing application will be developed, sufficient to create short reports, newsletters and student newspapers. The use of database and spread sheet applications will be investigated for storing, organising, manipulating and maintaining information such as survey investigation data, student records, class lists and assessment records. The use of electronic mail, blogs and the internet for educational activities will be developed.
Task 1: Skill development portfolio, including the use of Inspiration and the Internet, websites, blogs, Word, Excel, and/or PowerPoint applications (50%).
Task 2: Digital portfolio of a student's work or a portfolio of set tasks (50%).
Assessment will total 4000 words or equivalent.
Teachers will be encouraged to include content in their assigned tasks that will have a personal professional use for them. For example: in the development of curriculum materials that they can use currently; and for on line electronic searches of library catalogues and internet sites to find resources that will have current professional applicability for them; and to be able to apply computers to create a classroom environment where children are confident in using information technology across the curriculum.
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* Rate for all CSP students, except for those who commenced Education and Nursing units pre 2010
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Please note: Unit fees listed do not apply to Deakin Prime students.


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I had to unsub for time reasons, but now I hear that the game is in serious trouble and that Doc says last week was the 'week from hell'?
Without being complete nobs about it (all the hardcore CRS haters) does anyone know if the game is still alive? :(
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Joined: 10/14/08
They had some scripting server issues last week and an ongoing scoring database bug. But the game is still up and running. It's all on their main page.
Novice Member
Joined: 10/02/12
The game is still alive but they had some problems getting the new campaign going last week.
1.34 is still buggy, 1.35 is ???; all the dev focus from what I can see is on Rapid Assault.
The game can get active on the weekends or at other specific periods, but most of the time is quite boring. There haven't been any significant rule or gameplay changes since I last unsubbed.
WWII Online Community Manager
Joined: 6/01/12
Originally posted by rendus
Yes this is accurate. Last week was challenging, but we're square now *sigh of relief.*
We've shared a lot on our main page recently, check out THIS ARTICLE for a more recent update on our path.
Their main focus is their 10-year old "technology demo" caled RA.
As far as WWIIOL, hasn't been an update in over 18 months. If you are into CTD's, laggy gameplay and single-digit population server WWIIOL is for you!
Clearly didn't read my second sentence then huh? Grow up.
Novice Member
Joined: 3/06/07
Originally posted by argel
I think he gave you a pretty clear picture as to the state of the game. Its not like he went on a endless rant about CRS but rather gave you a short direct answer. If your looking for biased glowing reviews about the game might I suggest you go to the CRS fourms because I am sure those reviews would be less upsetting to you.
Novice Member
Joined: 8/23/05
Originally posted by Zbus
You mean instead he went on a short rant, further selling his hate for the game?
Originally posted by argel
From the responses looks like you got your answer, didn't you?
Novice Member
Joined: 3/06/07
Originally posted by Stug
Lets see
Point 1- CRS main focus is RA (True)
Point 2 - No updates in 18 months (content not stability patches mind you) (True)
Point 3 - CTDs and laggy play.This has been true for ages not just recently for alot of players (True)
Point 4- Single diget player base (ok not all true but for certain time zonesit is true. Ethier way even during prime time battles are small in scale) So even this is a overall true statement. (TRUE)
So Stug I dont see the hate you are refering to just a honest review of the game play like the OP asked for, just because you dont like it does not mean it is any less valid. If you have info that refutes his claims then post it until then you seem to be the hater in this thread not Depot.
Well I've played the game in the last 6 months so I'm not stupid. I still think the good outweighs the bad in the main, hence why I'm interested. I don't have the time to play - or the spare money to contribute to the game without playing - but I think the game generally works pretty well and it's kind of disingenuous to suggest otherwise.
There's a bunch of stuff that can be improved and I hope they get 1.35 out because it probably is the last chance, but I don't understand the rationale of those people on here who slate the game out of spite. Surely you all want the game to succeed in the long haul?
Novice Member
Joined: 5/19/06
I feel wwiionline has made it's mark in my mind, sadly many if not all of my squad slowly disbanded from the sinking ship.
I have no HATE towards CRS, they gave me great entertainment through the years but honestly I'm not going to re-install the game just to re-live the past. The game had it's day in my eyes, it lost my appeal but for other players that Haven't experienced the game I say go for it and play it.
CRS does deserve that atleast, let them convince you as a new player to stay and pay.
Novice Member
Joined: 9/20/12
Point 5 - the game blows and doesnt belong online anymore.
With the numbers it has, I wouldnt call it online anymore anyway. More promises of content you will never most likely see much less anything remotely related to addressing the critical by design issues. They cant even keep the stats page up, so another run at the last fanbois wallets before it finally dies is quite humorous.
How sad is it when you ask people for another 12 bucks a month to keep the game floating from your subscribers and only 40 people show up LMFAO. When you can find 40 people that would rather see this game go under much easier its time to call it :)
Squads did win the battle in the end. They all left because of the suck dev behind this monstrosity :) Put that in your toe/hc/ao pipe and feel free to review any of my posts from 2004 where I explained how bad your ideas were in great detail.
Novice Member
Joined: 2/01/04
With ya OJ.
Read a quite funny thing last night on their forums.
For the LONGEST time I have told them just how much of a mistake that website of theirs is, that they do not have a store, nor a product to put in a box, in fact ALL they have is that website.
Now that website is just about the worst thing I have ever seen, it has no functionality, no design (not talking about looks here), looks like something someones nephew did etc. etc.. all in all an abomination.
All they have ever said was "we can not let players make this" - only to HAVE TENPIN POST THAT HE WAS THE ONE WHO MADE THE WEBSITE!!
I have raised issues that are OBVIOUS for anyone apart from CRS, but DOC can not admit when he is wrong - and keeps on trucking with the same stupid reply every time "there are things you do not know".
Never does he mention what that is - so I'm inclined to think it is just him being stubborn and refusing to admit when he is wrong.
I'm at the end of my wits here, we are a few people who actually works with web for a living (and no I do not make shitty crappy joomla microsites) who are all saying the same thing (apart from killemall who likes to think he has insight, but is just the biggest brown nose in the game) - yet they REFUSE to listen.
Heck they even have a website admin/developer who admitted he had to "learn as he went along".
They have become a joke, and I do not see the game living much longer - and this from a previously ardent defender of the game and 10 year veteran.
It is especially the gestapo modding on the forum that pisses me off - now a ToS violation is not what is needed to get your post removed - now it is enough that DOC or XOOM do not like what they are reading...
Funny side effect they get from their gestapo methods in forums are that then people go elsewhere to raise their voice about the problems - places like here, which is the LAST place they should want it to happen - so what they end up with is their game recieving only bad bad bad posts here - when they could have kept it "in-house"
Sad sad sad panda!
Novice Member
Joined: 11/03/08
sad sad sad
The graphic above was 4 days old, so thats 10 "hero" subscriptions a day. At that rate they will hit thier first goal of 1000 by March 2013 which is the end of the first quarter. 4500 subscribers? Please. They can't even get 4500 likes on Facebook
I have a feeling with the pleading by doc to not unsubscribe plus being at the end of December that they are probably out of money by the end of this month.
Sad sad sad. With DOC's toxic attitude and chumps like XOOM running things no wonder they are going under. To top it all off I can't believe DOC says "Unsubscribing doesn't send us a message". Yes it does.
I am paying money for a service that I perceive has value. A buggy, HC run game with no updates in 18 months is NOT a good place to spend my money or time. As usual DOC has to make it all about himself and that somehow we are doign it to spite him. No DOC, we're leaving because of the poor service, buggy product and company attitude that we are not customers but instead people who are here to just shovel CRS money so they can dumb down the game to a version to appeal to the twitch gamers against titles they have absolutely no chance to compete against. No DOC, people don't want RA, they don't want 3rd person tanking or 64 player maps. Why is it that hard to understand for them?
Novice Member
Joined: 11/03/08
Originally posted by depot12
Actually that graphic is for NEW and Hero accounts. We don't know how many zero's I mean heros are out there. The way crs controls its members and content I wouldn't be surprised if they fake numbers to help things along.......if your buddies jumped off a cliff would you do it to if they said it was fun and cool, even to their deaths? I hope they get the numbers they are looking for. I would like to see the game continue even though at this time I cannot play. But, again, this approach is horrible.
Novice Member
Joined: 7/26/12
Let the game die already CRS, give it some dignity it deserves, begging for money,kickstarter,money for ads (what ads?)and now "Heros".
Planetside 2 isn't perfect but,by god I'm having alot more fun, more action and more people than 18 (yes 18!) sometimes during EU TZ.
Originally posted by Abyssuss
Yea, they said it was for ads on MMORPG. Has anyone seen a BE ad on here in the last few months?
Novice Member
Joined: 9/20/12
Hey Szy!
The website, dead forums, and much of what they have done over the past years has been so far off. These begging drives with nothing to show have become so entertaning. Whats next ? The last 200 people on planet earth that somehow find this game fun need to pay 2.5k a year? LMAO
Investors? You have shed players since 2005 when you started this backwards ass vision of a direction for the game. Anyone who would invest with that wont have much money for long lol
Did you see the new fb idea they are throwing around? How clueless can one get !!! You might as well just have a play now button that throws you into some herd as the gameplay option. You certainly dont even need fb's anymore when the game delivers such an awful freedom less, leaderless, non tactical, fubar supply borked ass game mechanics.
The only damn entertainmnet left is listening to bar think hes god by raping the 30 people left playing the game. Hi bar :P
Half of me enjoys seeing these brainwashed fanbois getting scewed out of their money and playing general of the herd in a box but the other half really wants to see this game go away.. A 12 yr old could figure out more entertaining game mechanics than this group could with Einsteins help. We have the map of europe, kits of gear for a few countries, a somewhat potential for having a supply/logistics system that would be incredible and they came up with a box of forced can play, chased away player freedom and ;leadership development with the hc system and have supply set to smash tv mentalify. Thats a complete and total disconnect from what the players wanted, as proven today by your numbers and lack of squad controlled play..
They couldnt handle my critics anymore and banned me long ago for my "agenda" just like many other vocal players. Thank you mmopg for aIlowing a venue to share both sides opinion on this game. CRS keep policing your internal forums and eventually the dirty laundry ends up getting aired out elsewhere. I am not here to vent because I was banned, you dont see me hiding behind some fake name, I'm here to support the large amount of players that have played with me or are thinking about playing this game. That support is me telling them this game is a complete waste of money, time and has no future with CRS associated with it.
Thats really not a news flash to the vets who have played but this company should no longer be in business and wont be much longer. Personally, I dedicated large amounts of time leading one of the biggest squads the game ever had.. Wish I could take back every second as it supported such a bad products existence. To feel a little value, any future time spent will be to go out of my way to discourage people from the game. I knows lots ands lots of your subscribers :) Most are long gone but I'm a sadistic bastage and will never give up trashing you at every possible chance :)
Please look forward to my own personal upcoming topic on the demise of this game. My hope, as many of us, is one day someone else does realize the potential this game had long ago and develops is correctly. Most of what not to do can be learned by just watching these guys in action over the years.