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Wednesday, October 18, 2006
Why the Heidgen Verdict Won't Stick
I know this is difficult to understand. Depraved indifference to human life is a tough matter and the NY State Court of Appeals has made it as clear as they can. Here is the answer, yes the person who drives purposely the wrong way down a one way street at full speed not intending to kill anyone but not caring if he does and realizing he might is guilty of Depraved indifference. The person who either does not perceive the danger to others because he is intoxicated or metal ill, or lost, is not guilty of depraved indifference murder.See this decision
As written on a bulletin board service I am privileged to subscribe to, if a person goes up on top of a high rise and drops a bowling ball on a crowd below, that's depraved indifference. If he is so drunk that he goes to the top of the high rise and throws the ball down thinking he is in a bowling alley, he's not guilty. (A That Lawyer Dude thanks to Sufolk County criminal defense attorney John Powers for the example.)
Heidgen would have plead guilty to a offer of Manslaughter 2 which would have put him in for 5-15 years. It would have been the right solution to a really bad case, and saved the county taxpayers hundreds of thousands and maybe a million dollars.
Today Rice won, tomorrow taxpayers will lose. Politics as justice, Nassau's new standard.
UPDATE UPDATE UPDATE: The jury foreman claims she and another juror were coerced into finding the murder verdict. Another juror who voted for conviction says that the descriptions of violence in the jury room were correct but not coercive (yeah right) and he also admits those jurors who were for a Murder 2 conviction refused to debate (deliberate)the issue! You read it here, this verdict is getting overturned on appeal.
15 comments:
- Ray said...
So basically, you can do anything you want but if your drunk, that makes it a lesser offense.
What a country we live in. - Thu Oct 19, 11:44:00 AM EDT
thinking he is in a bowling alley
Wonder how one can discern what the guy was thinking? - Thu Oct 19, 12:39:00 PM EDT
- That Lawyer Dude said...
Ray: If intoxication is serious enough then yes it mitigates some crimes that require an intent. Murder always requires an intent. Manslaughter 2 does not require an intent.
There is never a need to put someone into a level of trouble more than is required to assure that the person will not commit another crime. The penal law in NY is not retributive it is corrective (Hence the term Correction law)part of that is punishing people for the correct intent. Which leads us to:
Anonymous: Intent is an element which must be proven by the prosecution beyond a reasonable doubt. They bring the charges, it is their burden to prove them beyond a reasonable doubt. IF they cannot prove intent beyond a reasonable doubt then they need to bring a different charge. Manslaughter 2 for example.
Now for those that have a problem with the fact that a victim can die and do so violently and that a person responsible for such a death will not be charged with murder, I can only say that while a conviction for the highest count may make people feel better, it is a waste. I abhor waste especially in the criminal justice system. Precious money needed for incarceration, probation, rehabilitaion and early intervention programs. Hence in the case above, we are faced with a jury run amok, an appeal that will take a lot of money and a probable retrial. This case would be worth all of that had it fit the elements of Murder 2*. Since it does not, trying to fit the facts into a category tahat it doesn't belong in is a waste of taxpayers money. Doing it so you can say you are tough on crime when you run for higher office is a crime - Thu Oct 19, 03:33:00 PM EDT
First of all the taxpayers of Nassau County wanted this man convicted of murder and 12 of them voted to convict.
Second everyone seems to forget that this man was indicted under Denis Dillon.
Third voluntary intoxication is not a defense to depraved indifference murder. It is only a defense to specific intent crimes.
Fourth when you watch the video and listen to the testimony of the other drivers, you see that this man drove straight towards these people. He was TRYING to kill someone. - Thu Oct 19, 06:58:00 PM EDT
Does it matter who indicted the case? Moreover did you poll "the people of Nassau?" Most people would do away with the Bill of Rights if they had the chance, until it's their rights being "infringed"upon. The author is suggesting that the present Nassau DA is dispensing Justice by popularity contest rather than evaluating cases according to case law.
Finally, depraved indifference still requires that the defendant perceive the risk. Voluntary intoxication may not be a defense to depraved indifference murder but may be proof that the defendant couldn't perceive the risk, which is in part what the defense argued here. - Fri Oct 20, 01:23:00 AM EDT
Yes It does matter who indicted him. Everyone seems to make it out to be that this entire case, including the murder charge, are part of Kathleen Rice's crusade against drunk drivers when the fact is that it was Denis Dillon who made that choice. Although Ms. Rice claims that he was too soft on drunk drivers, Mr. Dillon made the choice to indict the defendant for murder. It was not just part of her "scheme" to "ruin" ever person who drinks and drives.
And depraved indifference does not so much as require that the defendant percieves the risk but more requires that the defendant disregards the obvious risk in his behavior - which is exactly what happened in this case. This man drove for over 2 miles, in the wrong direction, twice trying to crash into an oncoming car, not caring who he hurt or killed with 14 drinks in his system. This man was trying to hurt himself and didn't care who he took down with him. I find it very difficult to make an argument that that is NOT depraved indifference to human life. He might have been extremely intoxicated but any person who practices criminal law knows, its nearly impossible to get to a .28 without being a regular heavy drinker. A normal person is unconscious at a .28. - Sat Oct 21, 10:51:00 AM EDT
- That Lawyer Dude said...
I am really suprised this post has gathered so much interest.
Anyway, I agree that Dillon's decision was "foisted" on Rice, but she did more than just proceed on it, she has embraced it and she has used it as I said in the post as a bully pulpit.
As for the .28, everyone reacts differently to alcohol. I have seen people who don't drink blow a .3 and still not appear really drunk and I have seen regular drinkers blow .08 and appear so drunk that they couldn't stand up. Anyone really familar with the concept of BAC knows that it is really bullshit. It is so fraught with bad science that it is scary, however it is one way for us to try to stem the drunk driving problem so we turn a blind eye to the issue much the way we used to accept blood matches of less than 5 percent error as ok in murder and rape cases. We are now learning thru DNA testing that while many of these convictions were correct,many others were not.
While DWI remains a misdemeanor, we continue to use this flawed science, however, it disgust me that we use it for felonies.
That of course is not the case in the Hiegden case. He admits to 14 drinks and the quiestion I believe is still did he percieve the risk his driving did when he was driving. I do not think that the prosecution will be able to prove that when he drove to the bar, he intended to drive his car into oncoming traffic. I am not sure that you could prove he decided that when he got into the car after drinking that night. This is then the problem. It is a horrible case, but it doesn't reduce or change the burden of proof. Each element must be met and I do not think that the case will stand.
On a different issue, I wonder what will happen to the sequestration issue and what effect that decision will have on the viability of the verdict. - Sun Oct 22, 01:53:00 AM EDT
I understand that it is popular among defense attorneys to believe the experts who criticize Breath Alcohol Content and the Blood to breath ratio but the fact is that in this case, there was no question. It was a blood test, with no issues as to "bad science". It is almost foolproof and is backed up by his admission to 14 drinks (which matches the commonly referred to .02 per drink formula).
I think at least 10 people were convinced that the people met their burden in this case and 12 voiced that opinion in their verdict. Unless the Court of Appeals really wants to overturn this verdict, i don't think they will interject themselves into this case.
I also have serious doubts as to whether the sequestration will even play any role, considering all reports indicated that LaMagna consented. - Sun Oct 22, 04:08:00 PM EDT
"Here is the answer, yes the person who drives purposely the wrong way down a one way street at full speed not intending to kill anyone but not caring if he does and realizing he might is guilty of Depraved indifference. The person who either does not perceive the danger to others because he is intoxicated or metal ill, or lost, is not guilty of depraved indifference murder."
Tell me something: is there actually a competent adult in this country who doesn't understand that drinking alcohol leads to drunkenness, and that driving in that state means you probably will commit any or all of those actions and kill someone? Depraved indifference proved. Here's another one: if the appropriate level of justice is not provided thru the courts, then the family is justified in making its' own. This potential juror surely won't vote to convict. - Sun Jan 14, 11:10:00 AM EST
- That Lawyer Dude said...
To Anonymous (Jan 14) thanks for joining the debate. Your argument that drinking alcohol leads to drunkeness falls flat. Many people, myself included drink and drive. The idea is to not drink and drive drunk. Drinking only leads to drunkeness when drinking is done to excess.
That drunkeness is arbitrarily set at .08 is a whole other problem. Most adults can safely operate a car at that level of breath test. The politicians however couldn't resist pandering to the advocacy groups who demanded federal legislation. The fix was a mandate by congress to withhold highway funds from states that didn't lower the BAC. (Which violates the 10th amendment if we had judges who actually would enforce the tenth amendment.) NY had a perfectly good answer to the .08 bac which was the violation of driving while ability is impaired.
Anyway I digress, the real problem with your post Anon. is the last line
" if the appropriate level of justice is not provided thru the courts, then the family is justified in making its' own. This potential juror surely won't vote to convict."
We are a nation of laws. The Criminal Justice system is not the answer for the victim of a crime. It is meant to bring justice between society and the accused. The civil justice system is the sword of the victim. That is where the victim is made "whole." If society is unhappy with the way Depraved Indifference is written, it can change the law or the state constitution. Not getting what you want at trial is never an excuse for taking the law into one's own hand. That you would not even consider that is somewhat scary, although the prosecution of a parent who is outraged by a courts unfairness (if we can call it that)is the kind of case many people would use to justify jury nullification. - Mon Jan 15, 01:53:00 AM EST
Can anyone update me on the status of this case? I can find no record of this person on the NY State prison inmate search. Is he out on an appeal bond?
Bruce - Mon Mar 10, 03:24:00 PM EDT
There is no way Martin Heidgen is a murderer. You people make me sick who think he is. Because I am sure he really had the intent of killing a 7yr old girl and a driver that night. Do you people know what murder is? Yes he should be punished for drink driving and manslaughter, but this man is no murderer.
- Thu Jun 05, 02:27:00 PM EDT
Your explanation to Ray has holes so big in it, Martin could drive his truck through them -- drunk or sober.
Ask even the most stupid, inchohate drunk if driving on the wrong side of the road at 70 miles an hour could result in striking an oncoming vehicle and possibly killing its occupants, and I'll bet you dollars to donuts they'd admit it could. Drunk doesn't mean you don't understand reality; it means to you don't care about it. There's a big difference. And that, my friend, spells intent. - Thu Jan 29, 03:28:00 PM EST
Once again, Anonymous gets it wrong: Heidgen didn't intentionally drive on the wrong side of the road because he was drunk. That's what alcohol does—it impairs judgment. Because his judgment was impaired, the law says he can't be held to have fully appreciated the risk. If he wasn't aware of the risk, he can't be held to have disregarded it with depravity. Hence, no depraved indifference murder.
Depraved indifference requires a conscious decision on the part of the defendant, which any first-year law student could see is wholly lacking in the Heidgen case.
It really is amazing how many lawyers — the nitwit Nassau DA included — can't grasp a simple concept like mens rea that is taught within the first month of law school. - Mon Aug 03, 12:33:00 AM EDT
If you only know the basic facts of the case (Martin drank A LOT all night long and got behind the wheel of his pickup and somehow wound up going the wrong way on the parkway... and hit a car head on killing two ppl.. these facts alone are not sufficient for "depraved heart" murder. However, I think there were some additional facts that came out during the trial which indicated that Heidgen was in a depraved state of mind at the time he was drinking and at the time he got in his car. No one can know except for Heidgen what exactly was going through his mind at the time. But let's say hypothetically he was drinking because he was very upset after having a big fight with a girl he was seeing... and let's say that at the time he was driving late at night on a July 4th weekend he simply DID NOT CARE about anyone else but himself.
Also... would it matter if the facts indicated that he was familiar with the parkway he was driving on? How many ppl in an ultra intoxicated state would drive the wrong way on a road they were familiar with??
However, everyone is entitled to due process of law and an unbiased jury. If there was jury misconduct, than the ruling should certainly be overturned. That is the way of the legal system, and god forbid anyone finds themselves as a defendant in a criminal case we all would want the same thing... fairness. - Mon Sep 20, 05:10:00 PM EDT


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Bourbon Barrel Aged Vanilla Bean Dark Lord - Three Floyds Brewing Co. & Brewpub
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Reviews by tjfilippo:More User Reviews:MCain04Illinois 4.19/5 rDev -11.4% look: 4.25 | smell: 4.5 | taste: 4 | feel: 4.25 | overall: 4.25 Thanks Kieran for opening this up for us! 2013 vintage. Poured out at slightly below cellar temp. The pour is surprisingly light, was expecting a darker motor oil pour. Little head, if any. The smell on this is heavy, heavy on the vanilla. Definitely a lot of sweetness, from vanilla, malts, and bourbon. You get some additional toffee, caramel, and roasty notes, but dominated by vanilla. The taste is so vanilla-heavy it's insane. It really does overpower most of the other flavor profiles. The bourbon and barrel notes play nicely off the base beer, which is cloyingly sweet at baseline. Unfortunately there is a pretty apparent metallic taste that doesn't fully resolve with warming. Mouthfeel is smooth, low carb, medium bodied. Sticky finish. Overall, this is a sweet, sweet beer, which is one of the most vanilla-forward beers I've ever tried. The metallic taste was a big set back for me though. This was beat out by Black Tuesday and Melange 1 in our tasting, in my opinion. Given the price of admission, between what it takes to trade for and even the price tag for purchasing, there are better beers out there. This is overhyped, in my humble opinion! Serving type: bottle 12-14-2013 21:38:20 | More by MCain04 StevedoreWisconsin 5/5 rDev +5.7% look: 5 | smell: 5 | taste: 5 | feel: 5 | overall: 5 Was able to try this thanks to Dustin at a whale tasting 7/13/2013. Poured into a BCBS snifter, probably 5 ounces. Basically this beer smelled like bourbon chocolate marshmallows but in liquid form. It has such a strong, pungent aroma that makes me smile. There is a bit of the barrel here but for the most part it is a delicious smelling bourbon marshmallow. It pours a pitch black, incredibly thick and viscous body that comes with a minimal head & retention. Not a ton of lacing. The flavour is straight up sweet chocolate marshmallows with some bourbon and hints of coffee in the background. This beer is not subtle at all. I wouldn't call it complex but everything it does, it goes beyond what anyone would expect even of Three Floyds. Insanely rich and savoury but not necessarily instant diabeetus like the regular Dark Lord is, if that makes sense. Its super sweet but it comes together in a good way. Mouthfeel is perfect. Smooth, rich, roasty and carbonated well enough. Aftertaste is a slick bourbony marshmallow feel that makes me smile. Overall, this beer gets super hyped for a reason which I now understand completely. It is so ridiculously unbalanced and complex, it's awesome. I don't have the trade ammo and it probably isn't worth all the craziness surrounding it but it is an incredible beer, probably the best imperial stout I've ever had the chance to drink. And that includes the BCS Rare we drank at the same tasting. Re-review: the 4 of us bought into a single 2012 vintage bottle of Bourbon Barrel-Aged Dark Lord aged in Vanilla Beans. Bottle # 58/934. So its about a year and half old now. Poured into an unlabeled snifter today, 12/8/2013. Still pours a perfect opaque black body, with a nice mocha collar that sticks around with good retention. And well, the nose is still intense 100% bourbon chocolate marshmallows, one of the best smelling beers I've ever had. Its not the most complex, but it is the most incredible nose out there. And of course the flavour is incredible- the vanilla does cover up some of the complexity of the base beer, but it replaces it with bourbon chocolate marshmallows that is just so sweet yet not the type of sweet that Grey Monday brings; its easily drinkable and so enjoyable. Mouthfeel is definitely full bodied, silky and smooth drinking without much discernible heat. Again, this is a beer that is phenomenal and one of the best I've ever had. I can't believe I've had this beer twice in the span of less than a year, but it is well worth it. The main difference between the 2012 and 2013 vintage is that the bourbon is a bit more muted in the 2012 vintage compared to the fresh version. This beer is probably still best drank fresh, but it will certainly hold up over time if cellared properly. As before, I understand the hype and trade value behind this beer 100%. Thank you Matt, for being generous enough to send this one to our group. Serving type: bottle 12-09-2013 05:08:25 | More by Stevedore starshockey9New Jersey 4.58/5 rDev -3.2% look: 4 | smell: 4.75 | taste: 4.5 | feel: 5 | overall: 4.5 This was my birthday brew, full bottle to the dome. 2012 version. Bottle #695 of 934. A. While pouring seems a tad light but once it's in the glass, perfectly black with barely any head. S. The aroma hits you as soon as the cap comes off and my god, one of the best smells ever. Nice bourbon, raisin, and vanilla. T. Holy cow! This is top notch. The bourbon flavor comes through real nicely. Then you get hit with the vanilla in the end. The two flavors mingle excellently. M. If the appearence, smell, and taste doesn't win you over, the mouthfeel will. Not too thick but in no means light. It is just perfect. It coats your mouth leaving you craving more. O. Im a sucker for barrel aged beers and vanilla beers but this one takes the cake. Alcohol is very well hidden, not to boozy, and not too sweet. I now truly understand why it trades so high. Wish i could get another bottle. Best beer I've had to date. Thank you three floyds! Serving type: bottle 11-26-2013 06:30:05 | More by starshockey9 vinny21balIllinois 4.95/5 rDev +4.7% look: 5 | smell: 4.75 | taste: 5 | feel: 5 | overall: 5 I can't say much more then this is the best Stout out there if you get the chance to try it. The nose, mouth, flavor, everything is almost flawless. We opened it with a year of age on it and it was amazing. I was very pleased with it. And $50.00 is a steal to try this beer. Serving type: bottle 11-17-2013 04:03:35 | More by vinny21bal nrs207Pennsylvania 4.95/5 rDev +4.7% look: 4.5 | smell: 5 | taste: 5 | feel: 4.75 | overall: 5 Had alongside the base beer. 2013 vintages for both. A - Quite dark, has a little tan head. It looks a little darker and a little better than the base beer. S - Smells like some sort of vanilla/brownie mixture. Incredible. There's just a hint of the barrel, but it's nice because it lets the vanilla and chocolatey aromas shine through. I have no idea how this is the same beer as the non-barrel aged version. T - Just like the smell. Loads of vanilla and fudge. It's truly a dessert beer, but at the same time I could've had the entire bottle. The bourbon barrel is just barely there, cutting the sweetness just a bit. It's as sweet as I'd like this type of beer to be. When it's around room temp, I get a little alcohol, but very light and only when it's very warm. Hides it extremely well. M - Smooth, rich, creamy, no burn from the alcohol. It's almost perfect. I think if it was just a tiny bit fuller it would've gotten a 5. O - I'm so happy this lived up to the hype. Took a lot to get, but I think it was worthwhile. One of the best beers I've had. Serving type: bottle 11-14-2013 16:05:56 | More by nrs207 |
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Bourbon Barrel Aged Vanilla Bean Dark Lord from Three Floyds Brewing Co. & Brewpub
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Dead to Sin, Alive to God (Part 2)
Dr. Sproul recovers verse 4 discussing being buried with Christ in baptism and then moves into a discussion of the "man" with the believer to recon himself as being dead to sin with our bodies being instruments of righteousness. A definition of regeneration is provided while explaining the believer being … Listen
Man Is Without Excuse
Paul now addresses the Jews. The Jews are judging others by God's standards and Paul explains that they should know that because they do these things that they will be judged by that same standard they are judging others. Dr. Sproul covers the relationship of the Jew to the Law … Listen
Righteousness Revealed
Dr. Sproul investigates the specific controversy that sparked the reformation — the doctrine of justification by faith alone. He looks into the areas of agreement and disagreement between Roman Catholics and Protestants of the reformation. Further he looks at the double transfer of Christ's righteousness in exchange for our sins … Listen
The Good Shepherd Discourse
When Jesus spoke about thieves and robbers breaking into the sheepfold, people start to associate this with false messiahs or the Devil. Dr. Sproul indicates who these people are in context of what the shepherd is to do. In this section we have another "I am" saying in which He … Listen
From Jerusalem to Illyricum
Paul writes boldly here as a reminder of the burden that Christ has placed on him as a minister to the Gentiles. As a minister Paul is to proclaim the Gospel of God. While Paul borrows language from the priesthood, he is emphasizing that his ministry is the sacrifice. Dr. … Listen
The Glory of Christ
Dr. Sproul relates an event when he was teaching at Conwell School of Theology where he met Henry Barraclough who wrote the hymn "Ivory Palaces" and the author's reason for writing the hymn. From there he moves into an investigation of Jesus requests. Dr. Sproul gives a detailed explanation of … Listen
The One Who Sent Me
John cites verses from Isaiah 53:1 and 6:9-10 to show that the LORD has blinded eyes, hardened hearts to prevent understanding and belief. Dr. Sproul explains the ramifications of this verse in relation to sin and salvation. Dr. Sproul continues with an explanation of Jesus' statements concerning light and darkness … Listen
The Blessed King
Because of Lazarus resurrection, Jesus fame had increased and when He entered Jerusalem the crowds welcomed Him as King of Israel. Dr. Sproul expounds on the significance of the greeting Jesus was given as well as the use of a donkey's colt and how that relates to both the prophecies … Listen
Submit to Government (Part 2)
Dr. Sproul takes us back to Genesis and the banishment of Adam and Eve and then moves to chapter 9 and discusses the institution of capital punishment. The sanctity of life is the basis for government to protect, maintain and defend human life from aggressor countries. Listen
Bread from Heaven
Dr. Sproul starts this section expounding on Jesus' walking on the water with an investigation into the phrase "I am" in Greek ego eimi. When Jesus is found on the other side of the sea a discussion starts concerning why they seek Him. Dr Sproul starts the discussion concerning food … Listen
God's Everlasting Love
Paul asks if God is for us who can stand against us? Who can bring a charge against God's elect? This is Satan's most futile work. This lesson shows why justification is not an abstract doctrine as Dr. Sproul covers 17 aspects that secure the believer's relationship with God. Listen
From Suffering to Glory (Part 2)
Paul starts the golden chain with God's foreknowledge and Dr. Sproul discusses this word from the various views that are currently held and applied by believers. In the discussion of the word foreknowledge, it is demonstrated why it must come first and what it is that God foreknows. Listen
Christ - The Scholar
Jesus starts teaching in the temple midway through the feast and the Jews are asking for His credentials much as we would ask for a Dr. to present his credentials. Jesus responds indicating His doctrine was not His invention, but that it came from another source. Dr. Sproul discusses what … Listen
Jesus' Self-Witness
Jesus starts this section with another "I am" statement by declaring "I am the light of the world", which the Pharisees responded that He bears witness of Himself and therefore His witness is not true. Dr. Sproul investigates Jesus response that has several reasons why His witness is true and … Listen
Another Helper
Dr Sproul starts this section out with his recollection of his girlfriend and his planned future wife while in college and his praying for her salvation even though they had been raised in the same church and heard the same messages. From there Dr. Sproul starts the discussion of the … Listen
Freely listen in to the Lord's Day pulpit ministry of R.C. Sproul at Saint Andrew's near Orlando Florida.Topics
- All
- Basic Reformed Theology
- Irresistible Grace
- Perseverance of the Saints
- Total Depravity
- Unconditional Election
- The Church
- God
- Sovereignty
- Jesus Christ
- Cross
- Resurrection
- Justification
- Man and Sin
- Salvation
- Faith
- Regeneration
- Theological Views
- Roman Catholicism
- Christianity and Culture
- Creation
- Ethics
- Books of the Bible
- Gospels
- New Testament
- Controversies in the Church
- Covenant Theology
- Law and Gospel
- Politics
- Spiritual Gifts
- Marriage and Family
- Practical Theology
- Fellowship
- Godliness
- Knowing God's Will
- Prayer
- Sanctification and Growth
- Suffering


text:
Rebecca Skloot takes us on an extraordinary journey, from the "colored" ward of Johns Hopkins Hospital in the 1950s to stark white laboratories with freezers full of HeLa cells; from Henrietta's small, dying hometown of Clover, Virginia — a land of wooden slave quarters, faith healings and... read more
Her name was Henrietta Lacks, but scientists know her as HeLa. She was a poor Southern tobacco farmer who worked the same land as her slave ancestors, yet her cells—taken without her knowledge—became one of the most important tools in medicine. The first "immortal" human cells grown in... read more
""This child will someday know that her great-grandmother Henrietta helped the world! So will that child...and that child...and that child. This is their story now. They need to take hold of it and let it teach them they can change the world too.""James Pullum (Henrietta's daughter Deborah's second husband
"Today, nearly 60 years after Henrietta's death, her body lies in an unmarked grave in Clover, Virginia. But her cells are still among the most widely used in labs worldwide—bought and sold by the billions. Though those cells have done wonders for science, Henrietta—whose legacy involves the birth of bioethics and the grim history of experimentation on African-Americans—is all but forgotten."
"Pounding in the back of their heads was a gnawing feeling that science and the press had taken advantage of them."
"When an editor who insisted I take the Lacks family out of the book was injured in a mysterious accident, Deborah said that's what happens when you piss Henrietta off."
"Like the Bible said . . . man brought nothing into this world and he'll carry nothing out. Sometime we care about stuff too much. We worry when there's nothing to worry about.""Gary Lacks
"We'd form a deep personal bond, and slowly, without realizing it, I'd become a character in her story, and she in mine.""Rebecca Skloot in speaking about Deborah Lacks
"After writing "HeLa," for Henrietta and Lacks, in big black letters on the side of each tube, Mary carried them to the incubator room that Gey had built just like he's built everything else in the lab: by hand and mostly from junkyard scraps, a skill he'd learned from a life-time of making do with nothing."
"Hennie made life come alive -bein with her was like bein with fun," Sadie told me, staring toward the ceiling as she talked. "Hennie just love peoples. She was a person that could realy make the good things come out of you.""
"Like I'm always telling my brothers, if you gonna go into history, you can't do it with a hate attitude. You got to remember, times was different.""Deborah, "Dale" Lacks
""We're a mess!" she said, pointing to the hives now covering her face. "Lord, I was so anxious last night. I couldn't do anything with myself so I painted my fingernails." She held out her hands for me to see. "I did a horrible job!" she said, laughing. "I think I did it after I took my pill.""
"We must not see any person as an abstract. Instead, we must see in every person a universe with its own secrets, with its own treasures, with its own sources of anquish, and with some measure of triumph."Elie Wiesel
"He wrongly believed that light could kill cell cultures, so his laboratory looked like the photo negative of a Ku Klux Klan rally, where technicians worked in long black robes, heads covered in black hoods with small slits cut for their eyes. (pg 72)"
"Henrietta's cells have now been living outside her body far longer than they ever lived inside it."
"One scientist estimates that if you could pile all HeLa cells ever grown onto a scale, they'd weigh more than 50 million metric tons..."
"No one knows who took that picture, but it's appeared hundreds of times in magazines and science textbooks, on blogs and laboratory walls. She's usually identified as Helen Lane, but often she has no name at all. She's simply called HeLa, the code name given to the world's first immortal human cells—her cells, cut from her cervix just months before she died. Her real name is Henrietta Lacks."
"When tissues are removed from your body, with or without your consent any claim you might have had to own them vanishes. When you leave tissues in a doctor's office or a lab, you abandon them as waste, and anyone can take your garbage and sell it."Supreme Court of California
"Though no law or code of ethics required doctors to ask permission before taking tissue from a living patient, the law made it very clear that performing an autopsy or removing tissue from the dead without permission was illegal."
"If our mother was so important to science, why can't we get health insurance?"Lawrence Lacks
A Few Words About This Book
Prologue: The Woman in the Photograph
Deborah's Voice
Part 1: Life
1. The Exam ... 1951
2. Clover ... 1920-1942
3. Diagnosis and Treatment ... 1951
4. The Birth of HeLa ... 1951
5. "Blackness Be Spreadin All Inside" ... 1951
6. "Lady's on the Phone" ... 1999
7. The Death and Life of Cell Culture ... 1951
8. "A Miserable Specimen" ... 1951
9. Turner Station ... 1999
10. The Other Side of the Tracks ... 1999
11. "The Devil of Pain Itself" ... 1951
Part 2: Death
12. The Storm ... 1951
13. The HeLa Factory ... 1951-1953
14. Helen Lane ... 1953-1954
15. "Too Young to Remember" ... 1951-1965
16. "Spending Eternity in the Same Place" ... 1999
17. Illegal, Immoral, and Deplorable ... 1954-1966
18. "Strangest Hybrid" ... 1960-1966
19. "The Most Critical Time on This Earth Is Now" ... 1966-1973
20. The HeLa Bomb ... 1966
21. Night Doctors ... 2000
22. "The Fame She So Richly Deserves" ... 1970-1973
Part 3: Immortality
23: "It's Alive" ... 1973-1974
24: "Least They Can Do" ... 1975
25: "Who Told You You Could Sell My Spleen?" ... 1976-1988
26: Breech of Privacy ... 1980-1985
27: The Secret of Immortality ... 1984-1995
28: After London ... 1996-1999
29: A Village of Henriettas ... 2000
30: Zakariyya ... 2000
31: Hela, Goddess of Death ... 2000-2001
32: "All That's My Mother" ... 2001
33: The Hospital for the Negro Insane ... 2001
34: The Medical Records ... 2001
35: Soul Cleansing ... 2001
36: Heavenly Bodies ... 2001
37: "Nothing to Be Scared About" ... 2001
38: The Long Road to Clover ... 2009
Where They Are Now
We're hiding the errata, movie connections, books that influenced this book, books influenced by this book and books that cite this book sections. If you would like to add content to them, you must first make them visible.


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August 24, 2011, 6:51 am
You can get Zee Avi's new album "Ghostbird" now! Zee Avi performed at the KINK holiday show in 2009. "The Book Of Morris Johnson" is the first single from the new album.It's available in stores (including Starbucks) and on-line now!
Portland Concert
You can also catch Zee live at The Doug Fir Lounge on Tuesday, October 11, 2011. Tickets!
Official Web site: www.zeeavi.com/ghostbird


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Question by Smiley 1 31 · Jan 12 '12 at 01:17 AM · weight-loss stalled
I need some advice? I am a 27 year old female that needs to lose about 40 lbs.( in the belly region mostly) :0P I have always been active, but have been a roller coaster when it comes to my weight. About 5 months ago I started paleo and joined CrossFit! I felt wonderful! I lost 12 lbs. within the first month or two. I know that I have gained muscle so I shouldn't be too concerned with the scale, but I have been a little discouraged lately. I haven't been feeling as well, more fatigued and not sleeping as well. Should I just be patient? I have seen a lot of posts on here about people stalling with weight loss, so is that my problem, should I just continue and not be too worried? Not to compare Paleo to WW, but I may be confused because when I was on weight watchers I lost 30lbs in 3 months and it continued to come off; however, I gained it back quickly. I have been told that it is best to lose weight slowly, is this true?
7:00 Breakfast: 2 eggs, 2 strips of bacon, salsa, ½ an avocado or ( 1 banana, 1 c. unsweetened coconut milk, 1 tbsp. almond butter, and ½ c. blue berries) I know that fruit should be limited when trying to lose weight, so could this be my problem?
11:30 Lunch: Chicken breast, butternut squash,(spinach, carrots, or other vegetables) tsp. olive oil
2:00 Snack: apple or handful of nuts (macadamia, almonds, pistachios etc.)
Between 5:00 and 7:00 Dinner: spaghetti squash with a red meat sauce
I work out at CFit 4 times a week.
I would love any advice! I want to accomplish my goal!
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Answer by gismcieri 634 · Jan 12 '12 at 02:19 AM
Hi Smiley,
I was listening to a Robb Wolf podcast the other day and what you are describing is basically due to cortisol probably due to over training. You may also be eating too little carbs for your activity level. You may want to try eating some more tubers or roots and look at the affect it has. Remember Paleo isn't low carb per say. Its the the correct amount of carbs. I would start by cutting back on the hard training and just do some walking or playing. Robb says if you don't sleep you don't lose weight or recover so get the probable cortisol issue under control.
Just my thoughts!
Answer by meret 67 · Sep 07 at 12:44 AM
given your activity level, and the fact that you're feeling fatigued, you may consider that you might be over-training. it's not a good place to be, so read up on it and decide whether that might be your case.
Answer by James 3 8406 · Jan 12 '12 at 08:37 PM
I concur with overtraining. Chronic training can lead to chronically high levels of cortisol. High levels of cortisol can interfere with sleep. (your sleep issues)
In addition, you're probably not eating enough carbs for the work level you are doing (your fatigue issues along with sleep).
So, multiple things. Reduce crossfit sessions (maybe take a week off) and see how that affects your sleep. Once you resume crossfit, make sure and get in carbs afterward to help recovery time.
Answer by Nance 197 · Jan 12 '12 at 01:28 AM
Hi, Smiley, sorry you're not feeling well right now.
I'd say being sleep deprived and tired may be more important than what you're eating. If at all possible, I'd work in catching plenty of zzzs. Are you stressed right now? Being sleep deprived and stressed will kill weight loss.
Have you changed your mix of foods lately? For example, have you thrived on coconut products in the past or could that be something that doesn't work for you? Have you considered 3 workouts per week vs. 4? Or are they all different?
The above are just examples of things I'd look at--if you want improved results, you'll need to change what you're doing. Doing more/less, eating more/less, changing what you eat, etc.
Best wishes!
Answer by jakeA 6004 · Jan 12 '12 at 12:27 PM
Hi Smiley
I second what others are saying in that you may want to up your carb level. I don't think anyone else has yet pointed out that it doesn't look like you are eating very much. You probably would be better off eating a lot more than you are during your workout days. Personally if I underway I get extremely lethargic. Eat more!
Hi JakeA:
It sounds like that's the consensus; I should up my carbs and eat more! I do have a question though, what if I am not hungry? I feel so strange eating when I am not hungry.Answer by AndyM 4883 · Jan 12 '12 at 03:09 PM
My first instinct was that you were not eating enough, and having read the rest of your question I think that's probably the case. If you enjoy the crossfit and want to stay active then you need to make sure you eat well, pay attention to recovery, and have time to get extra sleep. It's not easy to get everything right, which is why too much exercise can be counter-productive for weight loss.
Even those at the higher end of the fitness scale would tend to advise at least a week off every 3 months if they are training regularly. So you can either take it easier every week, or keep the effort up and take a complete break every so often. Right now though it's probably worth resting and making sure you are fed well enough and caught up on sleep. There's not really much point training until that's fixed, apart from the fun of course :)
Answer by Joshua 1 87 · Jan 12 '12 at 07:00 PM
Sleep and possible overtraining might be the issue.
[begin Mr. Wizard]
Here is an experiment you can try at home!
[end Mr. Wizard]
Take your temperature and resting pulse. Write it down.
Take 3-4 days off crossfit (yes, really) and just try to get in some low impact stuff, walking, swimming, lots of sun if you can.
Make sure your room is blacked out well, and focus on sleep. The Yogi Sleep tea has been awesome for my wife and I, especially in those times when my brain decides at the exact moment it hits the pillow, to ponder just what did a Neanderthal's home smell like, is a Circus Monkey's hat comfortable, or how I can solve World Peace. ZMA also works well for me, but female mileage may vary, as ZMA has had mixed results for women - my wife included.
As soon as you start to feel better, take your temperature and resting pulse. If you were overtrained, chances are your temperature will be lower as well as your resting pulse.
Answer by Bill1102inf 7781 · Jan 12 '12 at 07:28 PM
Smiley, Ive had clients with the exact same issue you are having. Here is what we did.
Judging by your diet and activity level, you are carb depleted. For one day you should 'carb up'. Not only will this make you feel better, it will give you greater strength and you will learn something else that is extremely important.
Weigh yourself in the morning when you get up after you use the bathroom. For the rest of the day, consume high carbohydrate foods, - and protein if you want, but very low fat. The important part is the carbs. Shoot to eat 500-800-1000 grams of carbohydrate. And drink a ton of water (at least 1.5 and preferably 2 gallons). You can even drink gatoraide or another sports drink if you want to. A large sweet tater, is about 400grams total, 80 grams of carbs, so put a lot of honey on it(no butter) if you choose to eat it.
You should feel better pretty quickly.
The next morning, weigh yourself when you get up after you use the bathroom. The scale should reflect an increase in weight. 100% of that increase is stored glycogen in your muscles and liver + the water that accompanies it. Make note of this weight, this is your glycogen LOADED weight and what I consider your true weight. Its going to show an increase of 1-10lbs. The more weight it shows, the more you were glycogen depleted.
Worried that the increase is fat? At the upper range - 1000 grams of carbs = 4000 calories. For one day, your body uses about 2000 calories. So, there are 2000 ' extra calories. But they are NOT going to get stored as fat. Human physiology does not allow for this to happen (in YOUR case). Your body will up the burning of carbs in the presence of these carbs, and it will store them, but it will store them as Glycogen, not fat.
Let me know how it goes if you don't mind or if you have any questions.
Some of the weight will be roughage (Thanks Nance), IF you decide to do this with some paleo foods like fruit. Here is my suggestion and it goes well with Paleo.
White Potato (no butter)
White Rice
Sweet Potato (no butter)
Sports Drinks
Out of those, the one I like the least is Sports Drink. Mix and match the rest, if you want to make 2 cups of white rice and then cover it with honey, be my guest.
Write down how many carbs you have eaten as you eat them during that day, its important.
12:00 1 big slice Hasta La Vista Pasta Lasagna (lasgna without chesse and zucchini replaces the noodles)
More Sweet potatoe!Answer by Bread-Eating Beelzebub 56034 · Jan 17 '12 at 10:03 PM
In my experience a lot of Crossfit gyms work newbies waaaay too hard and they end up overtraining and burning out. Don't be afraid to say you are going to take a week off. Also, when you are on a training day, like others have said you are going to need to up the fat or carb (or both) content of your diet.
Answer by Hillary 31 · Jan 17 '12 at 10:31 PM
I'm no expert and I'm very new to paleohacks but I'd like to make a suggestion.
Start a food log and note how you feel after you eat (immediately and hours later), I also like to note bowel movements, etc. After a while, you'll notice a pattern about certain 'trigger' foods. You also may notice that certain combos of food cause you to drag your feet and have a hard time falling asleep.
I also agree with not getting enough carbs on heavy workout days, possibly not enough food. I'm an endurance athlete and finding the right combo of foods is so important to performance during and recovering after your workout.
When I'm struggling falling asleep, I practice a little yoga method. I lay in savasana and practice Ujjayi breathing. after each 'complete breath', I relax my facial muscles. It always works for me!
Best of luck!
Losing 5 lbs. per week for the next 17 weeks? 8 Answers
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See breathtaking views of the stars and planets through the impressive Victorian refracting telescope. The reflecting telescope with state-of-the-art 'go to' technology, allows you to hop from one object to another more quickly than ever before.
During October to March, the Planetarium Shows provide the chance to learn about constellations, planets and other jewels of the night sky. If you're curious about comets, mystified by meteors and want to glean a wealth of information about the galaxy, the friendly staff at Mills have the answers. There are also displays on the solar system and space exploration.
For details on the events programme visit www.leisureandculturedundee.com
For Accommodation and information, please call:
0845 859 1006
Monday to Friday 9am - 5pm
Saturday and Sunday - closed
*Calls may be recorded


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Orange You Glad?
Orange You Glad?
Our latest addition to the certified farmers market at North Park is Lone Oak Ranch, bringing crispy Asian pears, giant Pommelos, Satsuma mandarins and other juicy citrus right now; they're also pretty well known to local chefs for bringing some of the state's best stone fruit in the summer months.Please stop by and welcome them and their fruit to the neighborhood.
Speaking of citrus…
Since citrus fruits and juices are so refreshing, many people think of them as summer fruits, but in California citrus thrives in winter. Right now some of the very best and ripest fruits are available from R&L, Smit and Lone Oak, including navel, Valencia and Cara Cara oranges, Oro Blanco grapefruit, tangelos and tangerines. Ruby Red grapefruit and blood oranges may be here as soon as this Thursday. Toss citrus sections with your favorite greens and sliced red onion from Suzie's or J.R. Organics for a simple salad, or add a piece of grilled fish from Poppa's or pork loin from Da Le Ranch to make a great dinner.
I've lived in San Diego for over ten years and have never heard of the San Diego Woman's Club. Where on earth is it? It appears I'm mnsiisg out on some quality live music.
If they're bringing 10-20 cars into a riisdenteal area, causing traffic and parking problems absolutely. See, here's how rights work: your rights are yours to choose until they infringe on somebody else's rights then you have to compromise. Those people were creating traffic and parking problems in a riisdenteal neighborhood on a weekly basis and had already had one of their visitors hit somebody else's car, they were blocking others' driveways and parking on lawns. Doesn't matter if you're meeting to study the bible, play poker, or have ****** you cause a nuisance, you're infringing on other peoples' right to the quiet enjoyment of their own property.The point of the permit, by the way, is that to get one requires filling out information about how many cars will be there, how often, is there adequate parking that doesn't infringe on others, etc. If your meeting (again, no matter what it is for) is causing a neighborhood problem, you're not going to get a permit.Oh, and liberal *** kicker: the constitution allows regulation of gathering, religious or political or otherwise. The county isn't telling them they can't do bible study, they're telling them they can't infringe on their neighbor's rights. It's especially ridiculous in this case, because the group was offered *free* space at the local country library, which has adequate parking and private meeting rooms, but they turned it down and instead infringed on their neighbors' rights.I live in that county the christian news sources have done a very poor and completely biased job of reporting facts, preferring instead to call it religious persecution. Ridiculous. The county has done the exact same thing for weekly poker games. It's not a first amendment issue.I'm also sure this pastor would be the first one to scream to the county if his neighbors started having nightly islamic prayer services at their home Peace.
SD Weekly Markets brings farmers' markets to the city in San Diego, and people to the table. Each of our San Diego farmers' markets is geared to the needs and interests of the communities it serves, and each is managed professionally to provide the highest quality farm-fresh produce, meats, fish, eggs, and artisan foods to San Diego farmers' market shoppers.


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http://kideas.com/This simple Lady Bug Costume is easy to make for kids and won't get in the way of Halloween Trick or Treating.
1-2 Yards red felt
1 Yard (or less) black felt
Hot glue gun
Fabric scissors
Black permanent marker
Black Plastic Headband
Two black pipe cleaners
Black leotard, tights, and shoes.
Safety pins
Cut two large ovals for the ladybug wings. The size will depend on the size of your child, and should roughly run from neck to rear.
Using your black marker, draw a line down the middle of one oval to define the "wings".
Lay a layer of batting between the two ovals, and hot-glue the seams. You may sew the seams instead, if desired.
Cut several circles of various sizes out of the black felt. Glue circles onto the ladybug wings as "dots". Look at pictures of real ladybugs for inspiration.
For the antennae, simply wind pipecleaners around headband and curl into spirals.
Dress child in leotard, tights, and shoes. Alternately we added the ladybug dress on our daughter. Safety pin the wings to the back of your child's shirt and enjoy!
This craft reprinted courtesy of Kideas.com.


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LEGO Batman - PS3
There's been a big break-out from Arkham Asylum. Batman must again face off against classic bad guys and girls like the Joker and Catwoman. Designed for standard two-player, drop-in/out cooperative play, Lego Batman is broken up into 18 levels, with three different story arcs (that's six levels per story arc). Lego Batman lets you play in both hero and villain story modes, as well as a free-play mode. The Batcave serves as the natural hub area for Batman while Arkham Asylum is the hub for villains.
Lego Batman lets you build and take control of Lego versions of your favorite vehicles like the Batmobile, Batboat and the Batwing. As you collect various Lego pieces throughout a level, you'll develop special superhero power suits to give you extra moves. The bad guys come with their own evil perks. For instance, the Joker electrifies enemies and powers machines with his electric buzzer and Harley Quinn soars above other characters with her super-jump.
Assembled Country
Component Country
Shipping Information
Warranty Information
Computer and video game software must be returned in the original and unopened packaging with a receipt to receive a refund. Defective software must be returned within 90 days of the original purchase with a receipt to receive an exchange of merchandise.There is no additional information available for this item.


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32 Reform Jews across America took out an ad that appeared this week in the Los Angeles Jewish Journal and national Jewish Newspaper, The Forward. The group calls themselves Jews Against Divisive Leadership (JADL). They were objecting to the patent Anti-Israel stands of the new Reform Movement President designee, Rabbi Richard Jacobs, the 'visionary' spiritual leader of the Westchester Reform Temple in Scarsdale, New York.
The JADL signatories to the ad declared:
The Union for Reform Judaism's nominee for President, Rabbi Richard Jacobs, does not represent the pro-Israel policies cherished by Reform Jews. He does not represent us.
As we said in a March 23rd Iconoclast post:
He is . . . Anti-Israel and No Zionist given his current and past memberships in the J Street Rabbinic Council, the board of the New Israel Fund (NIF), chair of its 'Pluralism Grants Committee' and co-chair of its Rabbinical Council. He may have been one of the rabbis who attended White House sessions with Jewish communal heads as an acolyte of President Obama's peace process to be imposed on Israel in a dangerous and chaotic Middle East.
The FresnoZionism.org (FZ) blog post, "New URJ Head has appalling Ideology", we cited in our March 23rd Iconoclast post, had several telling examples of Rabbi Jacob's views. The JADL ad noted, among these, Jacob's presence on the J Street Rabbinic Cabinet, the board of the NIF, and the anti-Zionist Sheikh Jarrah neighborhood demonstration in Jerusalem.
The FZ in its post on the JADL ad, "Three eminent Reform rabbis who slept through logic class" noted the 'equal time' given in a Jewish Journal op ed, "The Zionism of Rabbi Richard Jacobs – A Model for Our Times", co-authored by Rabbi David Ellenson, President of Hebrew Union College-Jewish Institute of Religion (HUC-JIR), Rabbi Naamah Kelman Dean of the Jerusalem campus of HUC-JIR andRabbi Michael Marmur, who resides in Jerusalem, Vice President for Academic Affairs at HUC-JIR.
The trio of reform rabbis gave several reasons why Jacob's form of Zionism was the real deal. They excoriated the ad sponsors for allying themselves with right-wing extremists and put a sheen on the infectious approach of the new URJ head, Jacobs, appealing to young unaffiliated 30 to 40 something Jews 'embarrassed' by Israel.
The fact that those who have assaulted Rabbi Jacobs' integrity have wrapped themselves in the flag of Zionist purity is particularly galling. Since its inception, the Zionist movement has provided a forum for a range of opinions. If these self- appointed purists try to bar a great congregational rabbi whose views represent the mainstream of the American Jewish community and the Reform Jewish Movement from the fold of the True Believers, who wins? The campaign to discredit the work of the NIF (which hundreds of Zionist rabbis support) shows all the symptoms of separation plague — self-righteous certainty, disregard for nuance, allergy to reason and a strong appetite for the whiff of a witch-hunt. Support for Israel is not the exclusive property of one party or another.
Lovers of Israel with a range of political commitments should welcome with enthusiasm that the mantle of leadership of the Reform Movement will go to a man who cares deeply about Jewish learning, Jewish creativity and Jewish unity. They should decry tawdry attempts to sully the integrity of a good man. Rabbi Jacobs is a model of constructive engagement. At a time of rampant confusion and galloping alienation, the tactics of witch-hunting and demagoguery are not what we need. The leadership epitomized by Rabbi Richard Jacobs is.
That is clearly not what either the FZ or the JADL believe. Witness these concluding comments from the FZ post:
I am not sure about what wrapping oneself in the flag of Zionist purity is, but this brings me to the next fallacy that is so prevalent in this piece: I call it the Humpty Dumpty fallacy (apologies to Lewis Carroll): the view that words can mean whatever one wants them to mean. 'Zionism'is a word that already means something, and the rabbis cannot simply redefine it to mean "knowing what's good for Israel better than Israelis themselves," as they seem to want to do.
The tone of this article is insulting. The writers say that critics of the NIF display "self-righteous certainty, disregard for nuance, allergy to reason and a strong appetite for the whiff of a witch-hunt."
May I suggest that this better characterizes the writers themselves?
Three of the JADL ad signatories came from Temple Beth Avodah in Newton Centre, Massachusetts. They are Richard Calmus, Judi and Norman Greenberg and Margot Einstein. They have reason to be concerned about Rabbi Jacobs given that their spiritual leader, Rabbi Keith Stern, was a roommate of Rabbi Jacobs at the Hebrew Union College-the Reform movement seminary. Stern is also on the board of the J Street Rabbinical Cabinet.
Stern and Jacobs were among the 400 rabbis who signed a letter sent by the progressive group, Jewish Funds for Justice that ran in the Wall Street Journal and The Jewish Forward requesting that Fox News owner Rupert Murdoch 'sanction' Glen Beck for alleged anti-Semitic remarks about the adolescent George Soros' involvement in confiscation of Jewish property during the Holocaust in Hungary revealed in a 1998 interview with Steve Kroft of CBS 60 Minutes. Stern was one of the 70 members of the Sanhedrin of foolish rabbis who signed a letter to the Boston Jewish Advocate, effectively issuing a 'rabbinic fatwa' against Dr. Charles Jacobs (no relation). This banned him from their pulpits for the unforgiveable sin of criticizing one of their own members, Rabbi Eric Gurvis, immediate past-President of the Massachusetts Board of Rabbis. Rabbi Gurvis was photographed in a bear hug with an anti-Semitic leader of the Islamic Society of Boston Cultural Center, Bilal Kaleem, head of Boston Chapter of the Muslim American Society, a Muslim Brotherhood front. See our NER interview with Jacobs, "Fighting Muslim Brotherhood Lawfare and Rabbinic Fatwas."
There was a free speech incident that involved Rabbi Stern and J Street leader, Jeremy Ben Ami, at Temple Beth Avodah. A number of congregants had submitted suggested speakers to appear at adult education lectures, one of whom was Dr. Charles Jacobs. Stern refused the congregants' suggestions. But then Stern was presented with an opportunity to have J Street Leader, Jeremy Ben Ami speak at Temple Beth Avodah, which caused an uproar among his congregants. As a result he was forced by members of his congregation to change the venue to a local elementary school.
Doughty JADL signatory, Margot Einstein, stood up at the public school J Street presentation and said:
What kind of free speech is it when our rabbi said that Dr. Charles Jacobs would never set foot in my Temple?
So, the reform rabbinate in America is bound and determined to lead the Reform Movement into abject dhimmitude to Jihadist allies both in America and the chaotic Middle East. All perpetrated under the Orwellian mantra of Jeremy Ben Ami of J Street demanding an immediate Palestinian state putting Israel at risk behind the infamous pre-June 1967 War armistice line that divided Jerusalem. A Palestinian unity deal was announced this week between the PLO-Fatah on the West Bank and the Hamas 'terrorstan' in Gaza, now formally allied in seeking the destruction of the Jewish State of Israel. This nefarious unity deal was immediately rejected by Israeli PM Netanyahu because it directly threatened the security of six million Jewish citizens of Israel. J Street Rabbis Jacobs, Stern, Ellenson, Kelman, Marmur and hundreds of others may find themselves besieged by a lot more reform members than just the 32 JADL ad signatories. By persisting in this deception, that J Street is 'pro-Israel, pro peace' they are, in actuality, traitors to the Zionist cause and the Jewish State of Israel.


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Believe In Tomorrow's 17th Annual Port to Fort 6k
Sunday, May 5, 2013 @ 8am
Baltimore Museum of Industry
1415 Key Highway
Baltimore, MD 21230
Thank you very much to all of our runners, walkers, volunteers, sponsors, and overall supporters who helped make Believe In Tomorrow's 17th Annual Port to Fort 6k race a great success! Although it was a tad chilly, about 2,000 participants came out to enjoy another great 6k race on behalf of Believe In Tomorrow Children's Foundation.
Click here to check out this year's race coverage from FOX45 News!
A very special thanks to:
- All our event sponsors
- Members of our 80+ teams
- All Believe In Tomorrow families
- The generosity of our many fundraisers and donors
- Candace Dold of FOX45 News, for her uplifting role as our emcee
- DJ Ray Der of Baltimore's Premier Event Solutions
- Ms. Julia Tucker for her wonderful rendition of the National Anthem
- The Baltimore City Police Department, Department of Transportation, Mayor Stephanie Rawlings-Blake, and all those who made this race possible!
- The United States Armed Forces
- Every single volunteer, without whom we would not have had such a successful race!
View the results from this year's race here. Overall results are followed by top finishers.
Check out photos from this year's race! A great big thank you to our photography, Matt Fiery, for his awesome shots. If you'd like to share your own, please email email@example.com or share on our Facebook page.
Didn't get a chance to pick up your medal or fundraising prize? Give us a call or stop by our office to claim your award: 410-744-1032 or 6601 Frederick Road, Baltimore, MD 21228.
Congratulations to the winners of this year's Team Challenges!
Largest Family Team: Team Little Fire, with over 75 team members!
Top Fundraising Family Team: Team Payton, for the third year in a row, raising over $10,000!
Largest Community Team: This year we had a tie between The Gnatcatchers and Parkville Adaptive Lacrosse, each with 15 team members!
Top Fundraising Community Team: Parkville Adaptive Lacrosse, for raising $1,465!
Largest Corporate Team: The Home Depot, for the third year in a row with over 100 team members!
Top Fundraising Corporate Team:Total Core Fitness, for raising $1,875!
Largest Military Team: 34IS Tough Ducks claimed the title with 10 team members!
Other honorable mentions include…
Top Family Teams (by size)
1. Challenge Winner – Little Fire, 75+ members
2. Team Payton, 60+ members
3. Team Nate, 36 members
4. Life is Fragile, 23 members
5. Footprints for Ava, 19 members
Top Family Teams (by fundraising)
1. Challenge Winner – Team Payton, over $10,000 raised
2. Team Tyler, $4,045 raised
3. Team Nate, $3,600 raised
4. Little Fire, $2782 raised
5. Footprints for Ava, $1070 raised
Top Community Teams (by size)
1. Challenge Winner – The Gnatcatchers and Parkville Adaptive Lacrosse, 15 each
2. Alpha Phi Johns Hopkins, 12 members
3. Run For Boston, 15 members
4. Phi Mu Phi Theta, 12 members
5. Reunion Runners, 11 members
Top Community Teams (by fundraising)
1. Challenge Winner – Parkville Adaptive Lacrosse, $1,465 raised
2. Loft Addicts, $1175 raised
3. SlowPokes, $840 raised
4. The Gnatcatchers, $525 raised
5. Kids for Kids, $510 raised
Top Corporate Teams (by size)
1. Challenge Winner – The Home Depot, over 100 members
2. Team DAP, 92 members
3. Vision Technologies, 33 members
4. Team PayPal, 22 members
5. Millennial Media, 20 members
Top Corporate Teams – Funds Raised
1. Challenge Winner – Total Core Fitness, $1875 raised
2. Team DAP – $1365 raised
3. Team PayPal, $1115 raised
4. Home Depot 2504, $470 raised
5. Fxstudios, $370 raised
Top Military Teams – Size
1. Challenge Winner – 34 IS Tough Ducks, 10 members
2. Coalition of the Willing, 6 members
Thanks again to our event sponsors, many of whom you may have met on race day! We could not have done it without all their support!
Title Sponsor
Gold Sponsor
Silver Sponsors
Bronze Sponsors
Media Sponsors
Parking Sponsors
Mile Marker Sponsors
In-Kind Sponsors
Water Stop Sponsors
For more information, please contact the Believe In Tomorrow office at 410-744-1032 or send an email to email@example.com.


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The Top 5 Grossing Shark Films of All Time (Video)
July 16 (Bloomberg) -- Adam Johnson reports on the top 5 grossing shark films of all time on Bloomberg Television's "Lunch Money." (Source: Bloomberg)
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Jack Stearman back with New Earswick All Blacks (From York Press)
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Jack Stearman back with New Earswick All Blacks
11:29am Thursday 6th September 2012 in Sport
JACK STEARMAN will be back for New Earswick All Blacks as they kick off their Pennine League championship campaign at home to Westgate Wolves (2.30pm), writes Peter Martini.
As reported by The Press, all of All Blacks' matches were postponed last Saturday following the tragic death of club chairman Phil Johnson.
They will now start their winter season against a Wakefield-based side who opened their term with a 56-0 thrashing of Ossett so it promises to be a baptism of fire for new All Blacks head coach Simon Malarkey as he looks to better last season's sixth-placed finish. However, he has a full squad available – including Stearman, above.
The 24-year-old prop has been on York City Knights ' books but featured only once in 2012 and returns, as he has often done in past winter seasons, to his amateur club.
All Blacks will hold a minute's silence before kick off at all of their home matches this weekend in memory of Johnson.
Kev Fellow is hoping his reign as Selby Warriors boss continues in fine fettle after last week's excellent opening day win in Pennine League division three.
They go to Odsal Sedbergh with confidence boosted by the 24-14 victory at Pontefact SSC, a team who remained unbeaten last season in the Yorkshire League . Pontefract were a physical outfit but the Warriors – despite missing captain Wayne Fennel and at times looking disjointed with several newcomers playing – never took a backward step and had four tries ruled out.
The hosts took the lead against the run of play but Connor Smith, having had an equaliser from dummy-half disallowed, levelled from 30 yards after a Mark Hanson break.
Veteran winger David Makin powered over after a flowing move and on half-time Stevie Bell dummied in.
The hosts hit back in a stop-start second half with two tries, but Bell bagged another try from an outrageous dummy.
Danny England (3) and Nick Weaver added conversions.
Comments are closed on this article.


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SUPERBUG?: Common bacterium Klebsiella pneumoniae can cause nasty infections, but when it carries a genes to make the NDM-1 enzyme, it becomes immune to most antibiotics.
Image: CDC
The Best Science Writing Online 2012
Showcasing more than fifty of the most provocative, original, and significant online essays from 2011, The Best Science Writing Online 2012 will change the way...
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In the fight to stay alive, many bacteria, such as MRSA, have developed resistance to commonly used antibiotics. But other bacteria are using a more insidious type of resistance: that imbued by transferable genes, which can spread among commonly circulating strains.
One of these genetic elements, NDM-1 (New Delhi metallo-beta-lactamase 1), is an enzyme-based defense that renders a bacterium immune to beta-lactam-based antibiotics, which include penicillin, as well as carbapenems (often used as a last resort antibiotic against Escherichia coli infections), cephems (such as cephalosporins and cephamycins) and monobactams, making treatment extremely difficult. The trait was first identified in 2008 (in a patient with Klebsiella pneumoniae), and instances of NDM-1–positive infections are now not uncommon in India, Pakistan and Bangladesh. Cases also have been documented in Brazil, Canada, Japan, the U.K. and the U.S.
A new essay published in the December 16 issue of The New England Journal of Medicine revisits the issue, highlighting the potential that NDM-1 and other antibiotic-busting genes have to disable much of our current pharmaceutical arsenal.
"The spread of these organisms has prompted widespread concern because some of them are resistant to all antimicrobial agents except the polymyzins," Robert Moellering, of Harvard Medical School and Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, wrote in the perspective piece.
Initial cases of NDM-1 seemed to be only found among patients who had received medical care in India, where antibiotic use is less regulated. But more recent findings have suggested some NDM-1–positive patients in the U.K. might have picked up a resistant strain without traveling abroad.
These genes do not need an exotic infection to wreak havoc in a patient. They can be picked up by "all sorts of bugs we're all walking around with in our guts," says Brandi Limbago, of the Division of Healthcare Quality Promotion at the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. But once the resistant genetic material enters the bacterium, "it produces an enzyme that attacks the antibiotic and makes it nonfunctional—they basically chew it up," she explains. These infections are not always deadly, but "in the right host," such as one with a weakened immune system or inserted medical equipment (including catheters), "those patients become infected with these organisms," Limbago says. "And if you don't have the right tools to treat them, that's when you run into trouble."
Newer antibiotics, such as cephalosporins and carbapenems as well as beta-lactamase inhibitors, seemed like an effective strategy against these bacterial tactics. But these have "simply been met with the evolution of new beta-lactamases, often through mutations, that inactivate these antibiotics," Moellering wrote. Currently, there are some 890 such known enzymes, "far more than the antibiotics developed to combat them."
Indeed, Limbago warns, "all carbapenem-resistant Enterobacteriaceae [CRE] are bad—it's not just NDM-1 that should have us worried." And although NDM-1 might be grabbing more headlines globally, Limbago explains that here in the U.S., another enzyme, Klebsiella pneumoniae carbapenemase (KPC), has been a much bigger concern. And, as Moellering noted in his essay, another class, known as CTX beta-lactamases, "at the very least will compromise our ability to use beta-lactam antibiotics to treat community-acquired urinary tract infections."


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Jesse Jackson Has A Point!
Obama's toughlove is off key.
Klein Lives: Have the rules changed? Last Tuesday, Time's Joe Klein wrote:
The fact that a great many Jewish neoconservatives--people like Joe Lieberman and the crowd over at Commentary--plumped for this war, and now for an even more foolish assault on Iran, raised the question of divided loyalties: using U.S. military power, U.S. lives and money, to make the world safe for Israel.
Max Boot, Pete Wehner, Jennifer Rubin, Paul Mirengoff and Abraham Foxman of the Anti-Defamation League all wrote confidently outraged responses to Klein's raising of the "divided loyalties" possibility--and, indeed, it's not the sort of assertion that has typically gone unpunished in the past. When Klein stubbornly failed to back down in a second post, Wehner somewhat smugly anticipated his near-certain demise:
It's like watching a movie that you now know is going to end very badly, and very sadly.
But here's the thing: It's now a week later, and as far as I can tell Klein still has his job. He's still blogging (wondering "why Lieberman is so fixated on Iran"). He hasn't been publically rebuked by his employer. He hasn't been forced to issue a groveling apology.
Can it be that the rules have changed? I suspect they have. And I think this is progress, for reasons outlined here and here. It should be possible to publicly debate whether some "Jewish neoconservatives," among others, too easily convinced themselves that America's and Israel's interests happily coincided in the prosecution of the war. Meanwhile, Foxman's view that
Neoconservatives have the right to make their case without having their religion brought up. ... [snip] Religious beliefs are personal, and matters of faith belong in the heart, in the church and in the home
seems preposterously artificial. Note to Foxman: I worked at The New Republic! The magazine supported the war. I consider its editor, Martin Peretz, to be a friend and mentor. But if you think Marty's views are uninfluenced by his affinity for Israel--and that the views of many of the eminent neocons who visited our offices were uninfluenced by "matters of faith" and/or religious identity--then you don't know Marty and you don't know The New Republic. In fact, you're more than a bit clueless. But you are not clueless.
This isn't to say that the decision to go to war in Iraq was necessarily wrong or right. It's not to say that "Jewish neoconservatives" were more than what Klein calls a "subsidiary" source of support for the war. It's not to say that anyone is more patriotic than anyone else. The influence of pro-Israel sympathies (or pro-wherever sympathies) invariably takes the form of encouraging the belief that what you think is right for the United States is also what is right for Israel (or wherever), and vice-versa. But that only begins the discussion of whether this belief is itself distorted by those sympathies. It doesn't end it. At least it doesn't seem to any more. ...
Update: M.J. Rosenberg at TPM on Klein's "chutzpah." ...1:52 A.M. link


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Dawson is one of 21 Georgia counties approved for public assistance through the Federal Emergency Management Agency.
Two members of the Dawson County Elections Board say the county's some 10,000 registered voters can be served by two precincts, one in town and another on the county's east side.
The Dawson County Board of Commissioners gave full support to a 1-mile walking trail proposed for Veterans Memorial Park during last week's meeting.
4 p.m. Thursday at city hall
A new walking trail at Veterans Memorial Park could be finished by March if the county commission approves the project Thursday.
The Dawson County commission plans to move about $220,000 from its reserves as the final step in trimming nearly $5 million from the 2009 operating budget.
A. Roll Call B. Opening Presentation - Doris Cook, Dawson County Meth Taskforce C. Pledge of Allegiance D. Announcements E. ...
Jason M. Blackwell recently graduated from the GPSTC Regional Police Academy in Athens.
Do you want to know how your government works? Residents are invited to go behind the scenes of government departments at Dawson County Citizens Academy.
Lt. Stephen Knowles comes from a long line of firefighters.
4 p.m. Thursday, Sept. 10 G.L. Pete Gilleland Council Chambers at city hall K. New Business 1. PROCLAMATION: Clean Water Month – Doris Cook, EWSA <font ...
Six candidates have qualified to run for two seats on the Dawsonville City Council.
Motorists traveling through Dawson County played a part in Dawson County Emergency Services last month collecting more than $6,600 for the Muscular Dystrophy Association.
A. Roll call B. Opening Presentation - Karen Armstrong, cancer support group C. Pledge of Allegiance D. Announcements E. ...
Georgia's Speaker of the House David Ralston, a republican from Blue Ridge, will be the featured guest at next week's joint meeting of the Dawson County Republican and Dawson County Tea parties.
The issue of sludge application is expected to go before lawmakers when the Georgia General Assembly convenes next year.
Dawson County commissioners have chosen to delay until next month a decision on a rezoning request for a large apartment complex near Ga. 400.
State transportation officials outlined plans to replace the Etowah River bridge on Hwy. 136 north of Dawsonville during a public information meeting last week.
A Dawson County commissioner who is looking into the amount of hotel-motel tax revenue spent on promoting local tourism said he won't propose a change to the budget for the coming year.
The city of Dawsonville has again been denied a state loan that would advance the planning phase of the proposed Calhoun Creek Reservoir.
Transportation officials are holding a public information open house meeting to discuss the proposed detour necessary for reconstruction of the Hwy. 136 bridge over the Etowah River in Dawsonville.
After more than six months of negotiations, the newest addition to the Gold Creek Foods Inc. property has been fully rezoned.
In their latest round of talks about a new service agreement, the Etowah Water and Sewer Authority has made Dawsonville an offer it's unlikely to accept - sell the authority the city's system.
With all the ballots counted, Dawsonville has elected its incumbents back into office for city council. Long-time councilman Mike Sosebee, who previously served more than 30 years on the council, and Angie Smith, who was elected last year after being appointed to fill an unexpired term, garnered the top two highest amounts of votes in the election.
The city of Dawsonville is testing a new technology system designed to give residents additional Internet options.
What could have been a much worse problem for Robinson Elementary is working its way to a resolution.
A project to improve safety at a busy crossing along Hwy. 53 is nearly finished.
Advance voting is under way for the Nov. 5 General Election.
Dawsonville has moved forward with two pieces of business that will allow it to expand water infrastructure.
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I am planning to buy a fly fishing rod and as I am a beginner, I have never used them before. I am looking for a strong and easy to use rod and I am willing to spend $150. So, what do you guys suggest?
Think of a beginner setup as something to learn on. You won't have it forever. The make and model doesn't matter so much as the ease of use. Here are some tips:
Good luck!


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EVENT DATE: Tuesday, March 27 This is a reminder that PATCA will be hosting a Sunnyvale networking group for members and guests who are based in or near the South Bay. TIME: 12:00 PM to 1:30 PM LOCATION: Coco's Bakery & Restaurant 1206 Oakmead Parkway Sunnyvale, CA 94086 (408) 736-2895 View Map FACILITATOR: Joel Williams RSVP (Encouraged): firstname.lastname@example.com
PATCA Lunches are designed to offer: · Member-to-member networking with other consultants. · Discussion of issues and challenges of running a successful consulting practice. · Exchange of ideas about a variety of industries and business topics. · Opportunities to share leads or collaborate on projects. · Have an enjoyable business lunch with interesting people on a regular basis. Here's how it works: · Each PATCA Lunch will meet at the same location on a regular monthly schedule. · Each group is led by a volunteer facilitator. · Table topics will be tailored to the interests of participants, who will suggest focus areas for future discussions. · Planned topics will be posted on the web site, and ongoing feedback will ensure the topics are of interest to the group. · As time allows, each session will include discussion of issues or questions that are raised by attendees. · Participants will order and pay for their own reasonably-priced meals or snacks. · Trust and respect are expected from all participants, especially when members request confidentiality for business or client information that may be shared. · There are no attendance requirements; however regular participation will provide the most benefit and will help make each PATCA Lunch a success. · Guests are welcome to attend to sample the benefits of PATCA membership. Volunteer facilitators are needed to host PATCA Lunch satellite groups in areas around the Bay Area. Please contact the PATCA Administrator if you would like to take an active role in making our new service a big success.
PATCA is a nonprofit professional association of independent consultants and principals who work in small consulting practices. Since its founding in 1975, PATCA members have been highly respected for their professionalism, integrity, objectivity and competence. They include experts in all aspects of business and technology, and serve clients in many industries, throughout the U.S. and the world. PATCA offers a free "Post a Project" referral service at www.patca.org for clients searching for an expert consultant, and provides leads, referrals, and consulting education to its consultant members, including monthly meetings in Santa Clara, California. PATCA administrative mailing address is P.O. Box 2261, Santa Clara, CA 95055.
Be sure to check our calendar for upcoming events!
© 2012 PATCA. All Rights Reserved.


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- Budget
Ed Marshall
Time Out rating:
Venue details
Rosa's 12 Hanbury Street
- Venue phone:
020 7247 1093
- Venue website:
- Opening hours:
Meals served noon-10.30pm Mon-Thur, Sun; noon-11pm Fri, Sat
- Transport:
Tube: Liverpool Street tube/rail or Shoreditch High Street rail
- Price:
Main courses £7.50-£15.50
- 12 Hanbury Street
- www.rosaslondon.com
- 51.520213,-0.073932
- 12 Hanbury Street
Reviews & ratings
This place is great. There is also a second floor (so don't just think it's a tiny cubicle-esque restaurant). The food is extremely flavour-FULL, but if you don't like spice stay away: everything contains spice to some degree. The only main issue I had, was picking some food, there isn't an enormous selection of foods to choose from, but everything sounds amazing. Asking for a comprehensive description of ingredients or what a particular food is, isn't the best idea as you won't get very far. However, it is a very pretty place. I benefited from ordering "what the guy next to me had". (http://thriftlogic.blogspot.co.uk/2013/10/consommateurs.html)
Abi Mon Oct 21Rated as: 4/5 -
Extremely rude staff esp. the manager, terrible service. Avoid.
SJ Fri Aug 23Rated as: 1/5 -
excellent food, excellent service. went for lunch and had a red curry which was just delicious. I also had a thai style ice tea which I can highly recommend, it tastes just great. I can't complain I did find it really good. For sure one of the very best restaurants in the area.
Mark Wed May 15Rated as: 5/5 -
excellent food, excellent service. went for lunch and had a red curry which was just delicious. I also had a thai style ice tea which I can highly recommend, it tastes just great.
I can't complain I did find it really good. For sure one of the very best restaurants in the area.Mark Wed May 15 -
I love this place - Rosas Thai. My brother and I visited the Soho branch last week, I had the Black Pepper Venison curry which melted in my mouth while he had Prawn Pad Thai - the ultimate of Thai dishes! Washed down with a bottle of of wine, it was the perfect antidote to the horrid cold weather. Service with a smile, and a big warm welcome. Thank you for looking after us so well, you will be seeing us again for sure!
Foodie Heaven Mon Feb 18Rated as: 5/5 -
I really like Rosa's and have visited both the Soho and Spitalfields restaurants. I've always found the staff to be friendly and the service very good. The food is great, there are some really interesting dishes on the menu and the portions are generous. It's great value and I'd definitely recommend it.
Amuse Bouche Mon Feb 18Rated as: 5/5 -
I am never disappointed by the food I actually think that the spicy soup and the pad thai are the best I ever had. But today we tried one more time (and the last time) the delivery service, which shows exactly what you also experience in the restaurant - a really poor service. The first time when we ordered online (using hungryhouse) the food came 2.5 hours late (!!!!) and they did not feel sorry about it at all and of course it was cold by then. The second time they declined the order after 1.5 hours, of course we were already waiting for the delivery and were highly disappointed that we waisted 1.5 hours waiting. Today they declined the order again after 1 hour. Seriously if Rosa is not able to deliver, they should stop doing it. It is really a shame that they cannot manage to offer at least a normal service as the food is, as I said, very good. I am quite sure that I never heard in the restaurant a "hi" , "good bye" or "how was your meal" and also no FRIENDLY "are you ready to order" - is it so difficult?
Clara Sun Dec 9 2012Rated as: 2/5 -
Terrible service. It's these type of people that make me believe that customer service is dead. Not to mention that the bill came to £44 each!?!?!?!?! The food was not AMAZING. It was OK. The Satay sauce was cold and the portion was only enough for one satay. I was forced to pay £2 extra to receive 2 more tiny portions of sauce. Will never go here again. Highly annoyed that I wasted a weeks shopping money on a mediocre meal and awful service.
Bonnie Fri Nov 9 2012Rated as: 1/5 -
Tried Rosa's twice and was bitterly disappointed with the meal. It was incredibly expensive and poorly cooked. As a huge Thai food fan I was really let down by their cuisine which promised much and delivered little.
Angharad Llewellyn Sat Nov 3 2012Rated as: 1/5 -
A lot of the negative reviews on here are highly dubious, the style of writing is very similar, for example there is one review that mentions "patchy" service and then another one following it uses the word "patchy", and loads of other example besides, the tenor of the complaints is identical in several cases, as well as the focus on this supposed bad service and not much mention of the food. I have visited Rosa's many times, always enjoyed the food which is delicious and comes in very generous portion sizes for the price, and also have always found the service to be friendly, quick and accomodating. Seems obvious to me some unscrupulous competitors are posting phony reviews to try and hurt the business which to me is a testament to how high quality and popular Rosa's is. Ignore the bad reviews and give it a try yourself
Dan Barnes Wed Oct 17 2012Rated as: 5/5


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Vt Mental Health Department has new deputy commissionerThe Associated Press | August 03,2013MONTPELIER The Vermont Department of Mental Health has a new deputy commissioner.
Officials announced Thursday that Frank Reed has been appointed deputy commissioner.
Reed has worked for the department since 1999, serving most recently as interim deputy and commissioner.
Reed is a licensed clinical social worker. He has served as president of the Vermont Chapter of the National Association of Social Workers and as a behavioral health surveyor for the Commission on Accreditation of Rehabilitation Facilities.
Officials say Reeds knowledge of Vermonts designated hospital and community services programs made him a clear choice for this position.MORE IN Vermont NewsMONTPELIER In an attempt to avoid some of the same operational challenges they continue to... Full StoryMONTPELIER With recovery from Tropical Storm Irene still underway in parts of the state, the... Full StoryMONTPELIER Fancy a pint of Pliny the Elder or Heady Topper double India pale ales, but cant... Full Story -
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