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Friday 24 February 2012, 15:58
Both individuals and societies tell themselves stories to simplify and make sense of the messy chaos of reality. It is naive to think that it is possible to live without the protective bubbles these stories create. But sometimes the stories can become terribly limiting and trap us, and prevent both individuals and whole societies from moving on into another kind of future.
One September night in 1945 three British mathematicians and astronomers went to see a new film at a cinema in Cambridge. It was called Dead of Night. It was a series of ghost stories told by a group of people gathered together in a farmhouse. The stories are linked by a device of a central character who is convinced that he has experienced the whole situation in the farmhouse before. In the end he murders another of the group - but then wakes up from this terrible dream.
That morning the telephone rings, he is invited down to the farmhouse, and the whole story, or dream, starts all over again.
The scientists loved the film, and they sat discussing its circular structure. One of them suggested that it could be the model for how the whole universe really worked. That, although the universe was expanding, it was also constantly renewing itself - to maintain itself in a steady state.
Out if this came what was called the "Steady State" theory of the universe. It was going to dominate scientific thinking for the next twenty years, and it would also make one of the three scientists very famous.
He was a very difficult and argumentative man called Fred Hoyle - and the story of what happened to him and his idea is odd and funny - and also shows how science can often add a spurious certainty to the stories that modern societies tell themselves.
I also want to tell the story of two of the men behind the film Dead of Night - because both of them were convinced that the certainties of the post-war years had trapped Britain in a narrow bubble that was preventing it from seeing the world as it really was.
And we may still be in that bubble.
Fred Hoyle was one of the first scientists to become famous on television and radio. It was because he told a dramatic story about the universe - about how amazing it is, and the extraordinary discoveries that astronomers like him were making.
Ever since the 1920s scientists had realised that the universe wasn't static - it was expanding. There was a furious dispute about what this meant. One group of cosmologists said it meant that the universe had begun with an enormous explosion. Hoyle thought this was ridiculous, and he derisively gave his opponent's theory a name. He called it "the big bang" on a radio programme in 1949.
Hoyle thought this idea was silly because it meant that everything that now exists in the universe would have had to have been created in that one explosive moment. Hoyle believed that the universe had no beginning and no end - and that fiery stars throughout the cosmos were continually creating new matter that filled up the universe as it expanded.
And in 1948 Hoyle published a paper that was more than just a piece of scientific theory. It amounted to a new philosophical description of the universe, and it captured the public imagination. Two years later the BBC invited Hoyle to give a series of lectures on the radio, and millions listened to his dramatic vision.
Underpinning it was Hoyle's belief that mathematics has an objective truth to it - but that truth is something that we as humans can only dimly perceive. What astronomers were starting to find, Hoyle believed, was just a tiny part of something truly awesome. A giant mathematical plan to the universe that we will only ever understand a tiny part of.
Here are bits from a couple of films the BBC made about Hoyle and his ideas. He is obviously a very difficult character, but he has a great way of expressing himself. I love his description of what human beings are like when faced with the mathematical plan of the universe. They are, he says, like "fish a mile or two off Yarmouth". They can glimpse Yarmouth, but they will never come near comprehending it properly.
The most dramatic part of Hoyle's theory was the way it challenged our concept of time - that all things must have a beginning and an end. Hoyle dismissed his opponents' belief in the big bang as being a simple reflection of the deep human desire to see everything in the world as stories.
In another BBC programme he put it bluntly:
"The reason why scientists like the "big bang" is because they are overshadowed by the Book of Genesis. It is deep within the psyche of most scientists to believe in the first page of Genesis"
And the reason that the film Dead of Night had such an effect on Hoyle was because it too has no beginning and no end.
Behind that structure were two fascinating men in the British film industry of the 1940s and 50s who consciously wanted to challenge the happy stories that post-war Britain was telling itself.
They were Robert Hamer and Alberto Cavalcanti. Not only in Dead of Night, but in other films they made, Hamer and Cavalcanti both set out to puncture what they saw as a naive, simplistic vision of human beings, and of society, that had emerged in post-war Britain.
Both Hamer and Cavalcanti were intellectuals of a generation that had been profoundly shocked by the second world war. Not the second world war that we remember today as a simple story of the triumph of good over evil. But something profoundly chaotic, a moment in history when all the comforting stories fell away and millions of people faced a dark and frightening chaos. What that generation learnt was that when that happens anything is possible. It is terrifying because it leads to unimaginable horrors, but it is also exciting because there are no boundaries and you can do whatever you want.
Much of that complex view of human beings was forgotten or hidden away at the end of the war. But I think it came back in some of the films - those made in America in film noir, and in Britain above all with the films of Robert Hamer.
Robert Hamer was a sardonic, disillusioned man who worked as a director at Ealing Studios. In contrast to the happy, naive output of Ealing - like Passport to Pimlico - Hamer was blunt about his ambition. He told the wife of Ealing's head of publicity:
"I want to make films about people in dark rooms doing beastly things to each other"
Hamer directed the section of Dead of Night where a man is given an antique mirror by his fiancee. When he looks into it he sees another, older, room that begins to possess him. It turns him into a violent, depraved man, and he tries to kill his fiancee. It is the story of the overwhelming power of madness and destructive passion. And order is only restored at the last moment.
But Hamer's masterpiece was a film he made two years later in 1947 - called It Always Rains on Sunday. It is a wonderful, powerful film. The central character is Rose, she had been a barmaid in a pub in Bethnal Green, but now she is married to an older man. Then suddenly her old lover Tommy turns up. He is on the run from prison and he pleads with Rose to shelter him.
Rose loves Tommy and she deceives her family - hiding Tommy in the upstairs bedroom.
The film's power comes from the intense mood it creates. Rose, played by Googie Withers, beautifully expresses the feeling of numbed desire that then breaks out in the dark, claustrophobic rooms of the east end house when she smuggles Tommy in. Passion that smashes through all the naive fantasies of post-war Britain.
But Tommy is not good - he loves Rose, but he is also brutally interested in his freedom, and Rose finds herself betrayed. All the stories have been torn away - both happy family life, and passionate love. She tries to commit suicide, is saved and returns to her family that has now become a prison.
It is impossible to give a proper sense of the film from a clip - you really have to watch the whole thing.
Michael Balcon, who ran Ealing studios, didn't like all this complex pessimism, and he stopped many of Hamer's future projects. I really like the one which was going to be the story of a young man who gets falsely accused of murder, is tried and is acquitted. But in the process he has become intoxicated with being in the news headlines, so he decides to commit a murder in order to experience it all over again.
Hamer made one other masterpiece - Kind Hearts and Coronets. On the surface it was a jolly comedy, but underneath Hamer wrote it as a vicious black satire about how a horrible lower middle class couple lie, cheat and murder their way to the top of British society. They have no goodness as characters - yet Hamer makes you like them, and root for them.
And then Robert Hamer became a self-destructive alcoholic.
I have stumbled upon a wonderful programme the BBC made in 1977 which tells the story of what happened to Hamer. It is a monologue done straight to camera by Pamela Wilcox. She was the daughter of another British film studio boss, Herbert Wilcox. In the late 1950s she met Hamer and fell in love with him, and they started living together.
By now Hamer drank all day. In 1960 he was given one last chance, to direct a film called School for Scoundrels, but he collapsed on the set. He and Pamela Wilcox then started living an extraordinary life, both of them were drinking heavily and bit by bit they fell into their own private hell.
Wilcox tried to escape - only to find that she fell further into what she describes in the programme as "limbo-land". Like the heroine of It Only Rains on Sunday, she found herself without any comforting stories, facing only the terrifying chaos that is existence.
It is a really moving story - and she tells it very vivid way. You can see how annoying and self-destructive she must have been. But you also really like her and get caught up in her story.
I have cut the beginning where she tells of her time living in Hollywood in the early 50s. It picks up when she discovers that her American husband has a lover - and she returns to England.
The vivid story that Fred Hoyle told about the universe not only caught the public imagination but it also promoted the idea that mathematics was somehow the key to understanding everything.
Hoyle had a mantra that he repeated in all of the programmes he appeared on:
"If there is a god, then Mathematics is God. The basic laws of physics, insofar as we have any concept of god, is God."
What Hoyle meant by this is that the science of mathematics was not just a construct projected onto the stuff of the universe - but that the pattern of order that physicists and astronomers like him were uncovering was mathematical.
It was a very powerful idea - and many other disciplines turned to mathematics in the post-war era to try and give themselves a power and dignity that they felt had been missing from their "science".
One of these was economics - and out of the economists' attempts to "mathematicize" their discipline would come another great story of our time. The conviction that the economy could be organised in such a way as to achieve its own "steady state".
In the 1930s most economists didn't bother with mathematics - except for a few numbers in tables. But after the war an economist called Paul Samuelson decided to take the mathematical methods developed to study the laws of thermodynamics and apply them to economics. It was an extraordinary move - because what Samuelson said was, that just as a thermodynamic system seeks to achieve equilibrium, so too does an economy.
Samuelson called it the "Ergodic Hypothesis", and the image he gave was of the economy as being like a giant pendulum - that wherever you started its swing from, the pendulum would always want to settle back on the same fixed point. To put it in his language, the ergodic hypothesis was:
"a belief in a unique, long-run equilibrium independent of the initial conditions"
The simple phrase "initial conditions" is the key - because it means that whatever you do to the system, or whatever turbulence hits the system, it will always want to return to the same stable position. In other word - history doesn't matter. Again there is no beginning and no end. There is just the equilibrium - just like the steady state of the universe. And the economists' job was to help the economy achieve that equilibrium.
It had an enormous effect on political ideas about how to manage economies in the 1950s. The theories were further simplified so it became a technocratic dream that promised the politicians an economy that would expand but would also remain stable.
A few dissenting voices in the 50s said this was a pseudo-science. That what people like Samuelson were really doing was telling stories about the world in mathematical form. But the substitution of numbers for words seemed to make the stories more valid.
Here is an extract from a film from the Pandora's Box series that I made about the history of those economic experiments in 1950s and 60s Britain. It begins with an economist called Bill Phillips who built a giant computing machine run by water to demonstrate how to make an economy expand, yet not run out of control.
In 1961 the Steady State theory began to fall part. The attack was led by Fred Hoyle's sworn enemy - a Radio Astronomer called Martin Ryle. Where Hoyle was stubborn, Ryle was angry, sometimes so angry that he was made to work in a different building in Cambridge from his colleagues to avoid violent arguments breaking out.
In 1961 Ryle gave a press conference proudly announcing that he had discovered pulsating things called quasars far out in the universe. This proved that the steady state theory was wrong, he said, because if it was correct then qasars should be everywhere - not far out in the distance receding from us.
And then, four years later, came the killer blow. A couple of scientists in New Jersey called Penzias and Wilson had started picking up a hissing noise on a giant radio antenna that they were using. At first they thought it was the pigeons inside the antenna, so they went out and shot all the pigeons.
But the hiss continued, and they finally decided that they were picking up something much bigger. It was called Cosmic Microwave Background Radiation, and it was a faint glow of radio light that seemed to fill the universe.
This kind of radiation had been predicted by the big bang scientists because it was the radiation left over after the early stages of the universe's formation. Now it had been found, and their theory conquered the scientific world.
This is their big radio antenna, after the pigeons had gone.
But Hoyle didn't believe it. He accepted that the radiation raised serious questions, but he wasn't convinced that the big bang was the answer. He thought that the scientific establishment were like fish two miles off Yarmouth believing that they now understood what Yarmouth was really like.
To express his anger Hoyle wrote a TV drama series for the BBC called A for Andromeda. His aim was to show how scientists, and the politicians they entrance, can become possessed and corrupted by what seems to be a pure mathematical theory.
A for Andromeda tells the story of how astronomers pick up radio signals coming from outer space. They decode the signals and from them learn how to build a giant computer. The computer then electrocutes one of the scientists - Christine, played by Julie Christie. But it then recreates a perfect clone of her.
The hero - John Fleming - becomes convinced that the computer is being used to take over the earth by the aliens who sent the signals. But none of the other scientists see this. Then the government becomes obsessed with the computer because it seems to answer all their needs. It starts to run their defence systems - and then it offers to run the country's economy, and make it a rational system.
So Hoyle's hero - who was a model of Hoyle himself - has to save the world.
All the episodes have been lost except for one, the fifth out of six. It is very much in the model of John Wyndham science fiction, but Hoyle's fury burns through, especially in the passionate speech of his hero as he sets out to destroy the computer. It's great - and it was very popular.
The most frightening section of Dead of Night is the story of the ventriloquist who becomes possessed by his dummy. Michael Redgrave plays the ventriloquist called Maxwell Frere who has a dummy called Hugo - and the film follows Frere as he descends into madness. Hugo becomes a vicious, horrible and cruel figure that seems to control his master. At one point Frere says quietly to a rival ventriloquist: "You don't know what Hugo is capable of".
The director of this section was Alberto Cavalcanti. He was originally from Brazil where his father was a mathematician. But in the 1920s Cavalcanti had gone to Paris where he became deeply involved with avant-garde filmmaking. Then in the 1930s he came to England and worked in the early documentary film movement.
Like Robert Hamer, Cavalcanti thought that the British had a dangerously false vision of themselves - a twee artifice of forced jollity. He expressed this most powerfully in 1942 in a film he made for Ealing Studios called Went the Day Well? It tells the story of how a group of Nazis, disguised as British soldiers take over a beautiful English village.
The films starts as a piece of war propaganda. The nazis are vicious and sadistic. Then the villagers start to fight back, but instead of being noble and kind they become even more violent - and what's more they start to really enjoy it.
Here is a brief clip, but it will give you a sense of what Cavalcanti was up to.
Cavalcanti later said of the people in the film: "People of the kindest character, such as the people in that small English village, as soon as war touches them, become absolute monsters"
His point wasn't the simple oh-dearist lament that "people are bad", it was that humans are very complex, and that they have all sorts of dimensions and capacities that the simple stories leave out. For Cavalcanti, and many of his generation who experienced the second world war, post war Britain was possessed by a false and shallow cheerfulness.
In the story in Dead of Night the ventriloquist is possessed by the opposite. His dummy is a dark, bitter, destructive character that for Cavalcanti represented the dimension of human beings that was being brushed under the carpet and suppressed.
What Cavalcanti was saying was that just because we fought a good war, it doesn't necessarily mean we are good people.
In the 1990s I made a series called the Living Dead. The first film was about how that complex and extraordinary experience that many people lived through in the second world war was wiped away and forgotten immediately after the war. And how it was replaced by a simple story of the Good War.
The film argued that we are still possessed by that simplistic myth of goodies and baddies - a myth that subsequently has been the main driving force behind humanitarian interventions from Kosovo to Iraq and Libya. That myth says that if we liberate the people from their evil oppressors, then they will automatically become like us - good people.
Here is a part of the film. It begins with the story of the film that the American prosecutors showed at the Nuremberg trials in 1946 . It was called the Nazi Plan, and helped create the idea of the Good War. Set against this is the personal experience of some of the Americans who had fought in the war. One of them is a very interesting man called Paul Fussell who went on to become a well-known writer and critic in post-war America
And economics was rapidly becoming another central part of that simplified post-war world.
In the early 1970s there was a terrible battle between the man who had bought mathematics into economics - Paul Samuelson - and the free-marketeer, Milton Friedman.
Friedman said that Samuelson's mathematical models - that showed governments what to do to make their economies stable - were completely useless. Samuelson had been promoting something called the Phillips Curve which had been created by the same Bill Phillips who had built the giant economic water machine.
The Phillips Curve showed, Samuelson said, that if governments let unemployment rise then inflation would inevitably fall. Unfortunately it didn't. In the 1970s both unemployment and inflation went rocketing up, and none of Samuelson's followers could explain why.
Milton Friedman said that the solution was simple. Governments should stop trying to manage their economies and other than controlling the money supply they should just let things rip. This became the cornerstone of Mrs Thatcher's policies in the 1980s, which culminated with the deregulation of the financial markets in the City of London in 1986 - which was called the Big Bang.
Unlike the cosmologists and their Big Bang, the free market economists still believed that this explosion would lead to a stable equilibrium.
They had a simplified, mathematical vision of human beings as creatures who logically analysed everything in the market, and then reacted as if they were computing machines. Few people at the time said that this might be an area that maths didn't really have anything to do with, and that the scope of equations like the Black-Scholes model - which made derivatives trading predictable - might be very limited.
Here is a montage of the TV news reports leading up to the Big Bang in the City in 1986. It's a great picture of the old world that was about to be swept away - and the new one that was coming. Plus a wonderful early example of fear journalism - promoted in a very funny interview by a detective from the Fraud Squad.
But in the 1970s the mathematics behind the cosmologists' theory of the Big Bang started to lead to some very weird places. The man who caused the problems was Stephen Hawking.
Hawking had begun his work as a cosmologist by studying the big bang. He looked at black holes - they are what happens when a star collapses in on itself. Thus they are a sort of reverse of what is supposed to have happened at the origin of the big bang.
In the 1970s Hawking showed mathematically that black holes were eating information. Put simply this meant that stuff in the universe was disappearing into the black holes. Under the theories of quantum physics this was impossible, and lots of other cosmologists got very angry. But Hawking's mathematics were so good that no one could disprove it.
It was called The Black Hole Information Paradox.
Hawking's argument had massive implications. As he himself pointed out - it meant that there was no certainty any longer in the universe, it undermined the whole idea of cause and effect, and you couldn't predict the future with any certainty, or even be sure about what had happened in the past.
It was pretty bad.
So lots of other cosmologists set out to destroy Hawking's proof. They were led by a man called Leonard Susskind who publicly declared war of Hawking. It led to a wonderful, vicious scientific battle - and a few years ago Horizon made a film about the thirty year War of the Information Paradox.
The proof that Susskind finally comes up with is extremely odd. It involves accepting that if you as an individual fell into a black hole - it would look to those watching you from outside as if you had been torn to pieces. But in reality you would still feel as though you were you - even though you had been stretched around the edge of the black hole to become a two-dimensional version of yourself. Just like a cinema film.
You begin to wonder whether the mathematics isn't leading the cosmologists to tell stories that are far odder than any science fiction. I particularly love the scientist who explains that there are trillions of black holes throughout the universe. He says there might even be black holes inside his own head.
Here is a part of the Horizon programme.
Meanwhile things hadn't been going very well for Fred Hoyle. He had been appointed the head of the Institute of Theoretical Astronomy in Cambridge, but he was so difficult and argumentative that he was forced to resign. He then turned his back on the scientific establishment and went to live in the Lake District - where he continued to write science fiction with his son who was a national pistol champion.
But Hoyle still managed to fascinate the BBC - and he persuaded them to make a ninety minute film about his ideas, and dramatise one of his stories. The drama is truly one of the worst things I have ever seen on television - so I thought I would show part of it.
A beam from outer space has made time slip on earth. But in some places it makes time go forward, while in others it goes backwards. Time has effectively disintegrated and two scientists move separately through this dislocated world until they both end up in Mexico - but a Mexico way in the future.
Hoyle also put forward even odder scientific ideas. He said that he had proved that intelligent life on earth had originally come from outer space - in the form of bacteria carried on meteorites. When other scientists attacked this - he became even more convinced.
Hoyle had succumbed to the thing he had attacked other scientists for back in the 1960s - he had become possessed by his own stories. He had become a fish that thinks it knows what Yarmouth is like - and Hoyle's vision of Yarmouth had turned out to be a very strange place indeed.
Coincidentally, at the very same time, the BBC made an episode of the Holiday Programme about Great Yarmouth. It was presented by Joan Bakewell. No fish, however good their mathematics, could have ever imagined this.
Meanwhile Hoyle's enemies - the proponents of the Big Bang theory - had been trying to deal the fundamental problem with their theory.
What came before the Big Bang?
And out of this has come a new idea in recent years which is called The Big Bounce. This says that before the initial explosion there was a contracting universe just like ours which collapsed in a Big Crunch, and then exploded out again. What this implies is a cycle - with the universe exploding out, contracting and then collapsing until it explodes - and starts all over again.
Which is just like the structure of the film Dead of Night.
You have the funny feeling that you have been here before.
And since the economic crash of 2008 Britain seems to be returning to an older form of society and politics.
I'm told on reliable authority that the servants at Chequers feel more at home today than they have for a very long time. The cycle has returned to its conservative origins.
Maybe it was all a dream.
All posts are reactively-moderated and must obey the house rules.
I was reading this the pub today and really liked it.
Galileo said back in 1661
'Philosophy is written in that great book which ever lies before our eyes — I mean the universe — but we cannot understand it if we do not first learn the language and grasp the symbols, in which it is written. This book is written in the mathematical language, and the symbols are triangles, circles and other geometrical figures, without whose help it is impossible to comprehend a single word of it; without which one wanders in vain through a dark labyrinth.'
I think the big crunch idea is contradicted by the discovery that the expansion of the universe is accelerating (members of research teams got the noble prize this year)
Sean Carroll did a great talk about modern ideas for what might have happened before the big bang
I don't believe that just because something can be described mathematically that means it is simple and cold, maths can be used to understand things much more complex and beautiful than what its used for in schools :-).
Another great piece and thanks again.
It seems that we create stories and systems to deal with the unknown. The unknown is always scary. That is the evocative power and existential appeal of horror films. We are scared of the dark because it accommodates the unknown. However, when we turn the light on there is rarely anything there to be frightened of. Although, by transposing that metaphor on to larger human and cosmological mysteries, maybe I am making the mistake of seeking a comforting 'truth' which may not be true at all. So, cyclically, I'm back to the beginning, the unknown. Oh well, we muddle through as long as we avoid apophenia, dogmatism and hubris.
Also, despite Ryle taking credit for the discovery of quasars, as you probably know but didn't have time to go into, it was actually the keen eye of Jocelyn Bell that spotted the phenomenon. When she pointed out her find to Ryle's team the fear of the unknown caused them to conclude that the regular pulsations indicated an alien intelligence. There was a bit of a panic.
Thanks for reminding me of Went the Day Well.
Ealing horror vs cosmology mash up...
Perhaps noticing the repetition or the cyclical nature of in vogue mindsets does represent some sort of new uniqueness of closing in on the "truth" or at least "a truth".
The way in which many of us try to explain reality through the analogy of film and mass media is something that is becoming apparent to me. It is a language we all understand. AC uses it well even if its a stretch.
The character in Dead of dead of night also has the sense of repetition as he approaches the house in his car. A for Andromeda of course was aped by the latter film species which perhaps highlights how this analogy language of using films may itself be a trap as ideas in films are often repetitions of earlier ideas. In a way we are limited in expressing ideas of reality through the limitations of a language that hangs on these cultural co-ordinates.
To break free and head off into a new plane of understanding that no longer shares cultural co-ordinates with previous ideas trapped on some overly mapped 2D plane of existence requires imagination and creativity. Does re-synthesising [repeatedly oh the irony] old media into new meanings via a sort of quasi-intellectual analysis meet this criteria? I think it does as it has inspired me to make this observation.
I always enjoy reading this blog, sort of like Zizek's film crit but without all the Lacanian/Hegelian cobblers. I would recomend John D Caputo' " Radical Hermeneutics " - an attempt to re-establish an original difficulty and address Eleatics.
"I want to make films about people in dark rooms doing beastly things to each other."
This quotation from Robert Hamer could describe the American TV series "American Horror Story" whose first series aired in most countries in November 2011 and whose second series will broadcast in Australia in March 2012. The show is about a troubled family that moves into a house haunted by ghosts. Anyone remember the Amityville Horror?
Funny, I was on another blog forum today discussing the importance of teaching geography in schools and I recalled the quotation about war being God's way of teaching Americans geography. I looked up information about that quotation, how old it was and who first quoted it, and sure enough discovered that the 19th century writers Mark Twain and Ambrose Bierce both came up with very similar observations.
The United States has repeatedly invaded or infiltrated countries around the world since the 1800s to install "democracy", only for that so-called democracy to wither into dictatorship and repression: Nicaragua (1909 - 1933), Haiti in 1914, Greece in the late 1940s, Iran in 1953, Guatemala in the 1950s, Australia in 1975 and possibly 2010, Panama in 1989, Iraq in 1991 and 2003, Kosovo in the 1990s, Libya in 2011. In nearly every country, there's a pattern: the US aids politically conservative or right-wing forces directly or indirectly and when these win, the Americans leave everyone to sort out the mess left behind.
After the Cold War, the Americans continued to build up their military in spite of the lack of an enemy their own size. No matter - they have found a new one: terrorism. According to Chalmers Johnson in his book "Dismantling the Empire", the US navy still uses strategies based on the assumption that it will fight ... the Japanese Imperial Navy.
Possibly the US insistence on fighting anyone and everyone not conforming to the American way goes back to the days of the American Civil War, the wars against the native Amerindians, perhaps even the revolutionary days of fighting the British. Perhaps this insistence goes back to the founders of the early colonies in New England in the 1600s when people fleeing religious persecution and violence saw no contradiction between wanting freedom to worship, to own land and practise their culture and denying the same freedom to the native peoples.
And if the bureaucrats at Chequers feel times are familiar again ... what times are those? What older form of society and politics is Britain returning to ... one before the 1940s, that denied social welfare to the great bulk of the population and in which a class-based hierarchy without upward social mobility reigned supreme?
Comments 5 of 45
Tuesday 31 January 2012, 15:43
Tuesday 6 March 2012, 15:45


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Looking for someone participating in an event?
Saturday, May 11th, 2013 at the Old School Forest Preserve in Libertyville, IL
This is our second year at Libertyville's Old School Forest Preserve and we couldn't be more excited! If you choose to run, runners will have the opportunity to be officially timed with a Chrono-Timed Chip. All runners will receive their bib number with chip at the registration table the morning of the 5K!
Schedule of Events
Where to Meet
We will meet in the Old School Forest Preserve, and our event will take place at Shelter C. To access this shelter, turn right into the parking lot after the "Trails" parking area.
Transportation & Parking
Old School Forest Preserve is in central Lake County near Libertyville. The entrance and parking area is located on Saint Mary's Road just south of Route 176, and north of Route 60 (Townline Road).

subset: commoncrawl


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Pirates' Match At Longwood Cancelled
March 24, 2008 GREENVILLE, N.C. - The East Carolina men's tennis squad's non-conference match against Longwood, scheduled for Monday, March 24 in Farmville, Va., has been cancelled because of the forecast of inclement weather and subsequent wet court conditions. No make-up date is expected to be announced for a match between the Pirates and Lancers this season. East Carolina (12-7) will return to action Sunday when it hosts Appalachian State (12 noon) and Chowan (4:30 p.m.) in a split non-conference doubleheader at the ECU Tennis Complex.


text: The Hillside School aims to be a resource for families, professionals, organizations and other schools. Part of our purpose is to develop community awareness of the needs of children and adults with learning disabilities. In addition to sharing the latest available education, our expert faculty and staff are eager to share their knowledge and experience. READ MORE


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The word woman use to describe their displeasure and contempt for anything a male could do, would do, will do, or should do in order to please their partner.A woman never explains what is "typical", it just covers every sin known to man.
Dave. "Hello dear. I fixed the blocked drain, paid those bill's you left on the table, took your dog for a walk and ironed you a new blouse for work. I didn't get time to build the Ikea entertainment unit you bought but can I do that after I come back from the pub?"
Stella. "typical"
Stella. "typical"


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Shore Fire Media
about shore fire
contact us
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Jukebox The Ghost
Click above for photos and more info.
April 11, 2012
Printable Version
Jukebox The Ghost Announce US Headlining Tour Including Bowery Ballroom And Record Store Day 7"
Listen To First Track "Somebody" At NPR.org:
Jukebox the Ghost announced their Summer headlining tour in support of new album 'Safe Travels,' out June 12 on Yep Roc, including a set at NYC's Bowery Ballroom June 22 to celebrate the album's release. See a full list of tour dates below.
NPR.org debuted the first track from 'Safe Travels' this week, the "wistfully optimistic," "Somebody." Embeddable version here:
For Record Store Day, the trio is releasing a limited edition 7" single cover of Donna Lewis' "I Love You Always Forever," featuring hand-drawn artwork by the band. Watch the guys creating the custom sleeves at Yep Roc HQ here:
Jukebox the Ghost tour dates:
April 20 - Newport News, VA - Gaines Theater at Christopher Newport University
June 2 - Elmer, NJ - Appel Farm Arts Music Festival
June 9 - Manchester, TN - Bonnaroo Music & Arts Festival
June 15 - Danbury, CT - Heirloom Arts Theater
June 16 - Portland, ME - Space Gallery
June 21 - Boston, MA - Brighton Music Hall
June 22 - New York, NY - Bowery Ballroom
June 29 - Washington, DC - The 930 Club
June 30 - Millvale, PA - Mr. Smalls Theater
July 6 - Cleveland, OH - The Grog Shop
July 8 - Chicago, IL - Lincoln Hall
July 7 - Indianapolis, IN - Earth House
July 9 - Minneapolis, MN - 7th Street Entry
July 11 - Kansas City, MO - The Riot Room
July 12 - St. Louis, MO - Firebird
July 13 - Nashville, TN - The High Watt
July 14 - Cincinnati, OH - Bunbury Music Festival
July 20 - Ann Arbor, MI - Ann Arbor Art Fair
Aug 3 - Red Bank, NJ - Songwriters in the Park at Riverside Gardens Park
Aug 4 - Philadelphia, PA - Morgans Pier
Jukebox the Ghost on the Web:
For more information on Jukebox the Ghost please contact Brendan Gilmartin (
) or Matt Hanks (
) at Shore Fire Media: (718) 522-7171


text:
March 28, 2012
Garden internship, Ellwanger Estate Bed and Breakfast, Rochester, N.Y.
Posted by cdc25 under ArchiveNo Comments
Hands-on experience at the historical Ellwanger Estate for persons aspiring to a career in horticulture, gardening and landscape architecture or design.
Interns work with myself and volunteers in all phases of garden maintenance & development. Includes planting, weeding, watering, mulching, pruning, interacting with a few visitors. May also become involved in special projects such as accession records, garden inventories, plant signage or flower arranging. The estate is located on 3 urban acres and consists of 3 display gardens, one greenhouse.
Previous gardening experience and course work in horticulture, gardening or landscape design required. Junior and senior undergraduate students preferred. Must be responsible, self-motivated, capable of the strenuous nature of gardening.
Summer internships are 12 weeks, 10-15 hours per week starting in mid to late May, 2012. Salary/Credit: Stipend of $7.50/hour
Please submit a cover letter and application to Rosemary Janofsky at email@example.com
Phone Number: 585-546-5103
625 Mt. Hope Avenue, Rochester, NY 14620


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I can hardly wait for this movie to debut in Dallas! I have had it on my calendar for over a month and will be in line early at the theater come the second week of September! Fashion movies seem to be quite the rage, remember Valentino earlier this year??
Wednesday, August 19, 2009
18 comments:
- Elle Woods said...
I'm super excited about this film! Looove Anna Wintour and Vogue. I've fallen out of love with a lot of fashion magazines lately, but I doubt my affair with Vogue will ever end.
- August 19, 2009 at 7:18 PM
- Caroline said...
I am beyond thrilled! Of course Anna is an exquisite creature, but I'm also looking forward to Grace & ALT...not to mention Hamish if he makes an appearance.
- August 19, 2009 at 7:53 PM
- Only The Good Stuff said...
CANNOT WAIT!!!!!!!!!!! I will, of course, have to make the 2 hour trip to Dallas to see it, but OH! will it be worth it!!! Thank you for sharing!
- August 19, 2009 at 8:06 PM
- Pink Maple said...
I'm so glad you posted about this! I just read an article somewhere discussing this film and it didn't mention when it was coming out. It sounds really good!
- August 19, 2009 at 8:56 PM
- Kyle said...
This looks so good! Just my type of film! Now I just hope it comes to a theater near me!
- August 19, 2009 at 9:39 PM
- thepreppyprincess said...
I cannot wait for this one, simply cannot wait. The reviews have been so disparate when it comes to how good or evil Le Wintour is, I need to be able to decide for myself at this point.
Have a splendid Thursday Miss Hopsy!
tp - August 19, 2009 at 9:45 PM
- Suburban Princess said...
I cant wait! It looks fabulous!
- August 19, 2009 at 10:12 PM
- tickledpink said...
I hope this film comes to our theater! I want to see it so bad! I might have an excuse to make a road trip to Dallas if it doesn't come to our theater!
- August 19, 2009 at 11:19 PM
- Stephanie said...
Wow! I had not heard of this movie! Looks fantastic - so many people I would love to see behind the scenes...vera, oscar, thakoon!! I hope it comes to a theater in my area. If it doesn't you'll have to tell me all about it!
- August 20, 2009 at 1:17 AM
- martha - ca knitter said...
I'm with you on this ...I can't wait for this movie to come to my theatre.
- August 20, 2009 at 2:22 AM
- Emily said...
Thanks for bringing this to my attention. Can not wait to see it when it comes out in Dallas!
- August 20, 2009 at 8:28 AM
- It Is Everlasting said...
I can't wait! Hopefully it will have a semi-wide release and I can see it here in St. Louis. I've always been to intrigued by Anna and Andre.
- August 20, 2009 at 8:55 AM
- Piper Jacquelyn said...
I am SO excited about it! I will be first in line in OMaha, ha!
- August 20, 2009 at 9:37 AM
- a H.I.T. said...
I am so excited to see this movie!
- August 20, 2009 at 9:55 AM
- Farrell and Lauren said...
Team Grace! Just kidding, I have no idea, but that seems to be the gist of the reviews I've read. But I can't wait to see the movie for myself!
- August 20, 2009 at 10:34 AM
- Melissa said...
I am so excited for this, it's like the real version of the Devil Wears Prada! Can't wait!
- August 20, 2009 at 1:44 PM
- Tickled Pink And Green said...
I want to go with you!
- August 20, 2009 at 3:44 PM
- BLC :o said...
Soooooooooooooo excited!!! Xoxo-BLC
- August 23, 2009 at 8:06 PM


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Risk Management in Outdoor and Adventure Programs offers a systematic approach to examine potentially dangerous situations and apply appropriate strategies to minimize the potential for injury. This text presents risk management strategies as well as legal knowledge with specific application to outdoor and adventure programs. More than 50 real-life scenarios will help you develop decision-making skills for better identification of risk, increased safety, and prevention of injuries or fatalities.
Primary text for undergraduate outdoor and adventure courses. Supplemental text for courses on the technical, programming, and leadership aspects of outdoor and adventure recreation. Reference for outdoor and adventure program leaders as well as K-12 teachers.
Aram Attarian, PhD, is an associate professor in the department of parks, recreation, and tourism management at North Carolina State University in Raleigh. He is the owner of the risk management consultation firm Adventureprogrammanagement.com and serves as the director of the National State Park Leadership School.
Attarian has over 30 years of experience in adventure education and outdoor leadership working with a range of individuals and settings, including adjudicated youth, college and university programs, businesses, camps, and Outward Bound. His most significant experiences have been with North Carolina Outward Bound (NCOB), where he worked as an instructor, climber, and course director for over 25 years.
Currently, Attarian serves on the NCOB board of directors and chairs its safety committee. He is also a member of the American Alpine Club Safety Advisory Council and is a regional contributor to Accidents in North American Mountaineering. In his free time, Attarian enjoys rock climbing, outdoor living, and working on his hobby farm in western North Carolina. He resides in Raleigh.
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Sunday, April 12, 2009
Happy Easter
Happy Easter all. Like my bunny picture??
Actually this is the Miss Kalik April 2009. I haven't had good internet in awhile but I do now. Enjoy the pic – missed sending it on the 1st of the month.
Today has been pretty nice. Although disconcerting this morning. Some sail boat anchored behind us with clanging halyards had moved during the night – by itself!! I awoke this morning to halyard clanking coming from a different direction and that boat had moved during the night to a spot in front and to the side of us.. Ohhh grief!! It was very close to another derelict boat and eventually was bumping into it. I think/hope his anchor is fouled with that one and will stop moving.
When I checked into the marina office this morning to register the dinghy I mentioned the boat to the dockmaster and he was quite interested. When I pointed it out he said "Glad I moved my boat to the North Anchorage". That was it!!
We wandered about town a bit this morning. The dinghy just barely made it into the marina. Ohhh I hate it when this stuff doesn't work well!! They have a ships store here and I tried to buy new plugs for it. All they have are Champion plugs and mine are NGK. They had no cross reference chart or engine application chart. Damn you would think this was the Bahamas except the plugs were less than $4 each vs. $16 each in the Bahamas.
I called Andy and he got on the internet and looked the cross reference up. I bought 2 plugs and tried them in the engine. One at a time. Lo and Behold the first one made a HUGE improvement. My 15hp engine is now the equivalent of a 8hp motor vs. the ½ hp it was doing on our way in. I believe this is another Al gotcha. He left a gallon of no name 2-cycle oil I have been using and I think this stuff fouls the plugs. The previous set was new and only in for about a month till this happened. The motor is at least serviceable now.
This afternoon there is a parade planned at 3pm and the cruisers want to do dinner at 5:15pm tonight. We will head back in and do both. Maybe take some pictures too…
Not sure about the next couple of days. Forecast is for lots of storms and rain (2 – 3 inches) beginning tomorrow afternoon and then all day Tuesday. Might just stay here till Wednesday -- Decisions Decisions.
Time to get ready for the Easter parade today.
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Whoah, you're at our level cap. Good job, you rock! Here, have some cake.
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superb well done mahindra
i want to test drive this car and im coming on the 15th December i live in patilia
Be Indian buy Indian Mahindra has given us very good SUV I have taken the Test Drive of this XUV And is very happy I had being Driving Mitsubishi Pajero for 15 years. Now time has Come to buy Mahindra Very well job done Vijay Mehta
Is there any automatic transmission in the XUV500?
Not now... But will be coming soon.
Is there any automatic transmission in the XUV500?
hey.good morning to all the staffs.At present am working in USA army.I am planning to back to chennai end of the year.I would like to have a test drive and finally decided to bye a SUV from mahindra.Hope its purely made out from our nation,Really am pround of that.Hope in future our automobile industry growth rapidly shows good process.Lets that thanks to our nation.bye!!!!!!.
what about warranty of xuv500?
no warranty for this vehicle
3yr or 100000km warranty
pl let me know which is better XUV 500 or Innova
can u tell me why u prefer innova ? have u gone for XUV 500 test drive or do u own it ?
innova looks like a pig cab when compared to xuv500
innova is better than xuv500
I want testdrive
i like Mahindra_XUV500 & I want testdrive
test drv
innova is better than xuv 500
ya any time cause on same price ur getting innova, u can see my other comment it s detail
p;zzz dont be childish with ur approach.be genuine with ur answers .ur dont have any reasons to tell y innova is better it shows ur knowledge on vehicles...
Please let me know the price ?
looks r good but back seeting is not good,suspension is not so good, truning rudius is bigger than other like innova, xuv onroad cost is 12.13 for basic modle & higher modle is 13.43, if ur spending 12.13 than innova is beeter option for same cost
i want to buy this car but first a test drive a must
lov mahindra bulero no 1
It looks more like a Prado to me.Probably inspired by Prado's exteriors.
hi,this is nice suv
When is the auto transmission 4x4 launch?? Is it Soon or not planned at all??
I want dis car...! itz lik fortuner..! i wanna test driv... :))
i am based at udaipur raj.when can i get delivery if book now.
iwant to buy this car but first a test drive a must
I am dam sure that it is a good one, but people are comparing it with innova, fortuner, ford endavour, captiva, hyndai new suv etc etc, guys why dont u understand that this is purely home made and you know what i definitely feel that down the line after 5 years you will need spare parts then it would be much cheaper. I WILL BUY an INDIAN MAKE ONLY....
All the best Sreeni...
Mahindra needs to improve those issues (suspension, Interior leg space) rest all are outstanding. Its a benchmark for other SUV's. Its been compared to Ford Endeavor, Captiva, & Fortuner also,, but guys those all are a LOT more expensive than this. It shows how good it is in (value for money). If it gives good fuel average, rest all can be sort-ought. All the best Mahindra, am also gonna join your club soon.
Xuv looks r stunning,& Innova is a proven comfort family muv. the waiting time is 4 months ,is there any gud suv being launched ,which is better than XUV 5OO.if Xuv is the best is there any way to get it earlist.
Before you make a decision to buy a new car, refer to the car reviews section on CarDekho.com to know what customers think about it.
Read on the new cars in 2013 in India. Get detailed information on upcoming cars 2013 including reviews and price.
Know more about upcoming cars in India, get their expected price and expected launch date on CarDekho.com.


text:
Checkoff Programs
See For Yourself 2014
See For Yourself to Japan and the Philippines
There's no better way to learn about what is happening in the global soybean market than to see it for yourself. The Minnesota Soybean Research & Promotion Council (MSRPC) is coordinating a See For Yourself trip to Japan and the Philippines to show Minnesota soybean farmers where their soybeans are going, to build relationships with foreign buyers and to help farmers better understand how their checkoff dollars are being invested. It also provides you with a chance to evaluate your investment.
Minnesota soybean farmers are encouraged to apply for this See For Yourself trip, scheduled for March 15-25, 2014. The mission will include overviews of the market in Southeast Asia, meetings with local soybean buyers, processors and suppliers, supermarkets and embassies. Participants will get an in-depth look at the soybean industry in Japan and the Philippines and participate in high level meetings with leaders from the region. This trip will offer a unique perspective and access to the industry.
Applications are open to any Minnesota soybean farmer. Cost of the trip for those selected is $2,000. Spouses can attend but must be paid on your own at an estimated $5,600. Application deadline is December 1. Selection will occur in early December. Click here to apply. Space is limited.
Take a look for yourself at the 2013 See for Yourself trip to China.
For more information, contact the Minnesota Soybean office at 888-896-9678.


text:
A cop pulled this suspect over to warn him about a crack in his windshield. It turns out he was hauling 25 pounds of pot, which probably explains his behavior during the stop.
The comments below are member-generated and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of PoliceOne or its staff.
Be the first to comment on this article. |
Because the stop was illegally prolonged, the evidence (6 pieces of crack cocaine) was suppressed
Police arrested 32-year-old Amy Seiber and charged her with possession
The couple claimed chicken wings started their kitchen fire, but an investigation proved otherwise
A bomb squad and HazMat were called in to inspect a package atop a rail car that turned out to be 2 kilos of marijuana
Troopers say they smelled marijuana and found more than 4 pounds of a white powdery substance in the car


text:
Legend of the Burrito Blade is a production of Awesomancy Studios. Who are they? Wouldn't you like to know!
The Writer |
Adam P. Knave is the author of STAYS CRUNCHY IN MILK, CRAZY LITTLE THINGS and STRANGE ANGEL as well as countless other bits of fiction, non-fiction and humor. He can be found at hellblazer.net, where he keeps his blog and news as well as the footnote which he writes for and co-runs. He has appeared as an editor in the Image anthology POPGUN. He lives in NY with his cat. |
The Artist |
Renato Pastor is an ex-corporate drone who's gone rogue in the world of Illustration. Drawing is his day job now. In 2 years of freelancing he's done art for the tv pilot "Mild Mannered" (the official selection of the NYTVF ´07) as well as cover illustrations and sequential art for the short film "Cancer Man". You can see his art on the cover of the german punk rock band The Junktones, as well as countless other stuff scattered around in print and online. He´s a nice, relaxed guy who likes coffee a lot, but he's not that relaxed after a dozen and a half cups of coffee by the end of the day. He likes comics, like, A LOT. |
The Editor |
When she escapes the drudgery of her day job as a medical journal editor, Lauren Vogelbaum likes to unwind by doing some editing. Her exploits as a grammarmonkey-for-hire can be observed in such varied works as Mormon romance novels, young adult vampire fiction, Southern speculative lit, and gay Victorian erotica. She laughs a lot, hasn't been asked to wear a foam rubber lobster suit at a rheumatology convention in nearly two years now, and probably wants to make cookies for you. You can find her in Atlanta if you look hard enough. She's not only the editor of the comic, she's also the co-plotter. |
The Advertiser |
Maria makes us look good. She has designed all of our banner ads and had a hand in the look we present to the public. Which means that if the ads look good they are to her credit. When they look bad it means APK had too much influence. An active blogger, designer, gamer and mom, Maria is kind enough to work with us. You can find her at Mommy Melee, a blog of awesomeness. |
The Spiritual Guide |
D.J. Kirkbride is the soul of things around here. Frequent co-writer with Adam P. Knave, as well as the author of SOULLESS: MAN WITHOUT A SOUL in Image's POPGUN anthologies, Kirkbride is a man of action, a part-time ninja and Chuck Norris' preferred stunt double. The Burrito Blade started as a joke for Kirkbride and every step of the way he has been informed and has been nothing but supportive. Hell, a major character is named after him! He can also be found at the footnote which he writes for and co-runs. He lives in L.A., as much as anyone can said to be "living" there. |
Please Note: Our roles for Legend of the Burrito Blade are the jobs we do for this webcomic. It is in no way intended to say that's all we do. Adam also edits. Lauren also writes. Renato writes and overflows with new ideas. D.J. writes and edits. We are all highly creative people and are available for birthday parties and anniversaries. Awesomancy Studio can not cater your party, but our mere presence could make it … well … awesome.
We are Awesomancy Studio. We, ourselves, are awesomancers. Fear it. Respect it. Give it money and stand back. Or, at least, toss us a cookie or something, willya? We could use a cookie. Or three.


text:
Financial Services Council:
Financial Services Segment Home
FSC Membership Roster
Council Events
Join This Council
Related Content:
Other Councils
Join The DMA
Search For DMA Events
The DMA Financial Services Company of the Year Award recognizes an outstanding company in the industry.
The award is presented at The DMA2010 Insurance and Financial Services Council Dinner in San Francisco in October.
An eligible Insurance or Financial Services Selling Company: Any insurance or financial services company, regardless of distribution channel employed, which uses the direct marketing concept as a strategic tool, focusing on business-to-business or consumer markets. Please note that nominated companies MUST BE members of the DMA.
The company must meet the following criteria:
Marsh U.S. Consumer Accepting: Ron McGinnis, CEO
The Marsh Marketing Data Warehouse (MDW) is an example of our award-winning methods developed by Marsh U.S. Consumer. This cutting-edge central repository stores tens of millions of membership and records of insureds, along with third-party demographic, behavioral, geographic, economic, and cluster data. Because of its size, the Warehouse has consistently resulted in ever-improving results for marketing campaigns across our client base. Marsh was recently recognized with a Gold Award by the National Center for Database Marketing (NCDM) for its predictive modeling techniques. Marsh has worked closely with industry-leading data vendors, such as ChoicePoint, Experian, InfoUSA, Merkle, CACI/ESRI, and Knowledgebase Marketing, to append and apply third-party data to enhance marketing campaigns. The Data Warehouse empowers Marsh to: * create and refine predictive-response models that accurately forecast response rate; * create client profiles and powerful segmentation techniques and statistical analyses to gain insight into a client's population; and * provide the best possible return on investment (ROI).
It is impossible to single out one instance of success because all of Marsh's programs employ strategized use of multimedia channels and integrated cross-media promotions, including direct mail, Web, inbound and outbound telemarketing, print and on-site events. This approach is evidenced by the fact that in the face of the economic downturn and historic market instability, Marsh U.S. Consumer generated a record level of new penetration revenue at the end of 2008 while also delivering expenses significantly under budget. Besides our documented financial success, Marsh U.S. Consumer was recognized by its peers for exemplary marketing accomplishments in 2008: * eight awards (including two Golds and three Silvers) from The Professional Insurance Marketing Association (PIMA); * six awards (including three First Places) from the American Marketing Association (AMA); and * six Outstanding Customer Service certifications from J.D. Power and Associates; Marsh remains the first and only U.S. insurance broker to receive this designation. These recognitions solidify Marsh's position as a world-class marketing organization.
Marsh in 2008 greatly ramped up its Web presence, which increased premium on an order of magnitude. This efficient and spot-on effort, which generated millions in premium, was achieved by creating tools allowing customers to get online quotes, bind coverage online, and manage their accounts online. Our updated e-marketing strategy now includes new partnerships with key e-tailers Walmart.com and Lending Tree; and increased participation in social and professional networking sites (Facebook, LinkedIn, MySpace, and YouTube). Marsh already maintained revenue-producing Web tools: the industry standards CHOICE Auto program and ProLiability.com. Additionally, Smart Business Interactive and Personal Plans Advisor serve as educational tools to enhance the advantage of Marsh products and services. Web roll-outs added in 2008 to support new business initiatives: * GatewayConnexions.com, serving expatriates of many nations traveling abroad; * Trusted Advisor, enriching the advantage of voluntary benefits plans and services; * CampusConnexions.com, supporting the college and university markets; * AlumniConnexions.com, for Alumni clients; * Increased scope of IDTheftSmart.com to support 40 custom client portals; and * Generated 84M impressions on Facebook.
2008 - N/A 2007- Wells Fargo's Consumer Credit Group 2006 - National Australian Bank 2005 - Gerber Life Insurance Company 2004 - AIG Direct Marketing 2003 - Hartford Financial Services Group 2002 - RBC Financial Group 2001 - Capital One 2000 - Progressive Insurance 1999 - Charles Schwab 1998 - American Bankers Insurance Group 1997 - National General Insurance Company 1996 - SafeCo, Inc. 1995 - AT&T Universal Card 1994 - JCPenney Life Insurance Company 1993 - Blue Cross & Blue Shield of Illinois and DiMark, Inc.
For more information, please contact Lisa Merizio Smith at (212) 790-1567.
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text:
Continued from GQ thread "Minorities."
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Which was, incidentally, at: http://www.straightdope.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/001567.html .
Minorities. Do they exist? Or don't they? What do we really think of them? How do you spell "Minorities"? Why are there 3 different threads entitled "Minorities" on the SDMB right now, and one that was deleted? The Great Debate wages on.
Your Quadell |
Continuing my point from the General Questions thread, I will ask here: Did the 1980 and 1990 censuses continue the lack of an ethnic "majority" (or even much of any ethnic plurality!) in the U. S. Population? Is it likely the 2000 Census will?
There's never been a lack of an ethnic majority in America. 83.4% of Americans are white. (12.4% are black.) 56% are Protestant. (28% are Roman Catholic, 10% are "none".)
This info comes direct to you from the CIA, http://www.odci.gov/cia/publications...us.html#people. Where did you get the idea whites weren't a majority? Your Quadell |
I exlained this in the General Questions thread. The 1970 U. S. Census showed that there were two ethnic minorities in the United States with the greatest numbers: Anglo-Saxon Whites (19 million) and black (19 million. Since the 1970 Census showed a total of 203,235,298--a number later corrected only slightly--this means 165 million Americans in minorities even smaller than 19 million. (The Information Please Almanac for 1971 subdivided "whites" into Anglo-Saxon, Hispanic, Slavic, Arab, Scandinavian, Celtic, etc.)
THAT's what I mean by 'no majority.' |
I'm fairly certain there is no longer an ethnic majority in California, even if you do lump all the "White" Europeans together. In fact, Hispanics (European-Native American mix, I guess) are predicted to out number Whites (mostly European, I guess...again!) within a very short number of years.
I suspect that as soon as Whites technically become a minority there will still be those that will insist that we label them something stupid like "dominant culture ethnicity" Many of those who proclaim that their ultimate goal is a color blind society are the same that insist that the means to this goal are to focus on color. I find this as silly as Marx's "Dictatorship of the Prolotariate" as a prerequesite for an egalitarian society. Chew on this: If you really think color shouldn't matter, stop saying that since it still does, it should. |
[[Did you query each of them about their political beliefs? This is just the sort of generalization based on skin color (i.e. they're not "white," nor are they "liberals" but rather "white liberals" using the skin color as an adjective modifying the noun, thus establishing a link between the two) that doesn't sit well with me.]]
Let me clarify, if I can. The two people who were offended that I finked on the thief happened to be White, and were upset that anyone could accuse a Black person of stealing, even if I witnessed it, which they heard that I had. I called them "liberals," but maybe that isn't accurate. Anyone got a better term there? There probably is one. I was assuming that they felt uncomfortable that any White person could accuse any Black person of wrong-doing. (I also consider myself to be a liberal on most issues.) [[Later on you refer to "white racists and black thieves" -- the parallel structure making it seem that you're referring to the "white liberals" and the "scumbag" from your story..]] No. I wasn't describing the people in the store when I said "white racists." I meant that my child will suffer, probably, because of white racism against blacks (some may argue that this doesn't occur anymore?) AND also because of black criminals like the shoplifter who, by their actions, reinforce the stereotypes that all Black folks steal. [[So how is it that they're white racists? Are you sure of this? Are you making the link that liberal=racist? Are you claiming that they are racist for making the generalization that you as a white were being racist by pointing out the kid's thievery? ]] Hope I clarified that that is not what I meant. I meant to describe a personal incident and my personal reaction to it. But I'm gonna get out now, while the gettin is good. I don't seem to articulate my positions very well on this topic. Jill |
I took a course in literature at El Camino College in California. The instructor, who is black, assigned us to read "The Invisible Man," by Ralph Ellison. It was an impressive novel, but one point taken up early in the story (and hammered on by the instructor), was that "responsibility" must be overridden by the objective of equality ('there will be no peace without justice'). The problem here is that this can be easily seized on by white supremacists and other bigots: "See, they won't act responsibly! We are justified in our treatment of them!" Which is no better a notion.
Dougie_Monty, if I'm understanding you correctly, I believe you have to be wrong about this. I can't find any on-line info on the 1970 census, but the 1960 census revealed roughly 19 million back people, and roughly 158 million white people. Not 19 million.
Your Quadell |
I have (what I consider) an interesting question that may or may not have relevance to this board:
Am I Japanese? Now, here's the thing: I live in Japan, I work in Japan. I have many Japanese freinds. Many of my interests are related to Japan in some way. I speak Japanese (fairly well, of course not perfectly). I feel personally (although I may be wrong) that I understand the Japanese way of doing things and the like as well, if not better, than the way of my native country. I may not live here forever, and I may not feel this way forever; I'm not currently a citizen of Japan, but rather a landed foreigner. My skin is white, and my features are caucasoid. I was not born here. The most surprising reaction I get when I tell some people this is anger; some people consider me a "traitor," although how prevalent that is, I don't know. I would assume that someone who chose their culture would have even more claim to being of that culture than someone who was randomly born into a culture. What do you think? |
Which so obviously is no longer anywhere.
I do not believe that racism exists. That is not to say that people do not have prejudices towards easily identifiable groups. Rather, I mean that people are prejudiced against those that they percieve to be significantly different than the group with which they identify.
For example, a tall, stout, educated, middle class white woman may be prejudiced against males, aaaavery thin women, poor people, those of another race, short people, uneducated people, etc. But it is about difference, not race. Race is often simply an easy identifier. ------------------ "Do that which consists in taking no action and order will prevail" --Lao Tzu |
And I have a question to follow up on Alex's. I have two friends who were born and raised in Africa and who are now citizens of the U.S. They are both white, yet under any definition, they are "African-American." Which is why I hate the term (not the PEOPLE, the term!). I have black friends who are neither African nor American, and they get understandably ticked off when they are referred to as such. Who the hell's stupid idea was the term African-American, anyway?
Jesse Jackson and a number of his acquaintances had a conference in Chicago several years ago to discuss the general issues of blacks surviving in a white society.
At the end of their conference, they held a press conference to describe their conclusions. Most of their thought has been lost in time (I certainly can't remember any of it), but the big news that got a lot of air-play was their declaration that they wanted to be referred to as African-Americans. They actually had good (if flawed) reasons for doing this. One reason was that they wanted to have the opportunity of "selecting" their own term. (Since I remember the black community "selecting" black over Negro, colored, Afro-American and others terms in a three-year debate in the late sixties, I find this argument flawed as it indicates that Jesse and his buddies can't remember their own history.) The reason that African-American was selected, specifically, was that it looked most like the ethnic terms that are a large part of the consciousness of urban/metropolitan Chicago. In that environment the terms Polish-American, German-American, and Italian-American, etc., are used by the descendents of immigrants as a point of pride in their heritage. Since the de-culturization that all imported slaves had to go through pretty well destoyed the ability of the grand-children of slaves to call themselves Gambian-American or anything similar, Mr. Jackson's group settled on African-American. One significant problem with their attempt, of course, is that outside the strip of cities running through Milwaukee, Chicago, Detroit, Cleveland, Pittsburg, and Buffalo, the whole hyphenated-American experience is greatly diminished. So what Mr. Jackson's group did made sense from a local perspective, but did not play well across the whole country. Of course, Since Mr. Jackson is a national figure, the news media picked up on his pronouncement and many news groups changed their style books to reflect his suggestion. On the other hand, the last poll I saw among blacks gave a 70%/28%/other split favoring the term black over African-American (actually down from the 58%/40%/other split of about four years ago). I would generally refer to Mr. Jackson as African-American, since that is his preferred term, but I follow the polls (and the people in that group whom I know personally) and use black in other discussions. ------------------ Tom~ |
{{{Chew on this:
If you really think color shouldn't matter, stop saying that since it still does, it should. }}}---PapaBear I'm interpreting this to mean: "Stop saying that color doesn't matter, because the statement indicates that it still does--to you." Hope I got it right PB, because it's a bit early and I'm only on my second cup of Joe. At any rate, in that context, this brings to mind some comments, made by a local merchant, to my "significant other" and myself, as we were walking with our two children. Her ethnicity is unimportant, but her attitude was obvious in both her body language, word choice and inflection: <looking at me> "Are you their father?" <looking at her> "And you're their mother?" <looking at our girls> "My, my, aren't they just precious? And so clean too!" <looking back at both of us> "No." (pregnant pause) "....Color just doesn't matter a bit you know. What matters is that you're clean. Yup, you're clean. That's all that matters--being clean. You're both very clean and your daughters are simply gorgeous....and....and....clean." She moved on *very* quickly. We looked at each other and laughed. (No! She didn't hear us laughing. That would have been rude.) ------------------ --Kalél (The Original EnigmaOne) |
One comment that Jill made that nobody (to my recollection) responded to was that she'd never heard a nonwhite person say "race doesn't matter." This has been my experience as well. I've never heard a nonwhite person say "My race is human" either. Why do y'all think that would be? Is it because nonwhites think race should matter? Or because their experience has been that it does?
Do any actual nonwhite people on this board want to get a word in? ------------------ Never regret what seemed like a good idea at the time. |
Just a few thoughts: Growing up near Detroit I have seen the effects of racism first-hand on a day-to-day basis. Plenty of my coworkers, neighbors and friends will not venture into the city to enjoy restuarants, concerts and other events because they perceive the city as a dangerous place. Some of this attitude can be attributed to racism but a large part of it is simple ignorance. Had I never met an Italian I would have thought them all to be heartless killers based upon jokes, mafia movies, opinions of others, etcetera. That, to me, is not racist, it's ignorance. Racism is much more noxious. Racism stems from hatred of a given people based solely upon perceived inferiority. The problem is, racism breeds racism. Too often parents who are racist rear children who hold similar attitudes. This can only be remedied by education, it seems. I question whether AA has done anything to ease animosity between blacks and whites because, as I see it, one who is already prejudiced is not going to take kindly to government intervention into their beliefs and ideals, however misguided they may be. You simply cannot legislate thoughts and opinions, no matter how evil. We've come a long way since Selma in 1965. Maybe in another 30 years we'll have licked this altogether and we can move onto something else. Like finding Jimmy Hoffa's killer or something. |
Alex Kennedy: after having spent five straight years on the outskirts of Tokyo, I find it indredibly difficult, nay impossible, to believe that you have not witnessed the discrimination in Japan against foreigners. Even Konishki, who is now a Japanese citizen, still catches some of that although he's at the top of the national sport there.
What? You've never been to a bar and been told "Gaijin kinjite." I have. It hurts. Now if I'd been Japanese-American and knew the language (I'm Scots-German American and know Japanese), I'd probably not have the crossed arms greet me when I enter the place. To those who didn't get the stats above: Anglo-Saxon White Americans aren't a majority BUT White Americans are. I'm not Ango and I'm not Saxon and I most strongly detest being lumped in with WASP since I'm not Protestant either. But I have the luxury of being White in a country mostly inhabited by Whites. The Japanese-Americans I postulated above in this post in Japan would thus have the luxury of being of Japanese race in a country mostly populated by those of Japanese race. That's the way I see Jill's point. And it's not only dishonest to pretend that's not a valid point. It's ingorant and mean. |
In my last posting above, the last sentence should read:
Sorry folks-I won't be back to this thread..but I must say this!
Jill--fancy seeing you here!! and responding to your own comments in the original thread. Let's see, last time, I heard from you on the subject, You were raling and stamping your feet about how unfairly you were being treated on this subject, your parting words were: "I'm hitting reply button on the top and not going near the rest of it" Again..important as this issue is to me, I can't discuss it here, at this time. |
To quadell: As I said before the "white" population was broken down, according to the 1971 "Information Please Almanac," into various ethnic subdivisions: Anglo-Saxon, Mediterranean, Slavic, Scandinavian, etc. I will agree that, for general purposes, there are five "races"--white, black, American Indian, "Oriental," and Polynesian--but I bet even these divisions are suspect. (See how Cecil treated this in "Return of the Straight Dope.")
OK... my $.02
Minorities are created by the majority. What does that mean? you may ask... I'll tell you, I say. If we define the majority as those people guaranteed full participation and emersion in the culture, the "minorities" are those people who are excluded from that culture. Minorities, excluded from the predominant culture, will go on to form their own culture. In our culture, the majority at some point along the line had chosen some arbitrary characteristic that, when present in an individual, excluded that individual from full participation and emersion in the predominant culture. This exclusion can be systemic and formal (in the case of slavery and Jim Crow laws) or casual and informal (such as a general attitude or misconception). It does not have to be written into law, but it can be. It just has to be that at some point in history, a group of individuals was denied full participation in the culture due to an arbitrary characteristic. All people seek participation in a culture. If denied participation in one culture, a people will form their own culture. The next point is one people often miss: Even if the causes for the exclusion are removed, the culture that was formed because of it does NOT disappear. Thus, even though there is no more slavery, and their are laws protecting blacks from discrimination, there is still an African-American culture that is seperate and distinct from the standard American culture. Cultures, once formed, are extremely stable things. Thus, we have minorities. Skin color is one arbitrary characteristic that seems obvious. Linguistic heritage is another. Why are people whose ancestors spoke Western Hemisphere dialects of Spanish denied full participation in the majority culture, but those whose ancestors spoke German or French not? By denying Hispanic-Americans full access to the American culture, the minority culture of Hispanic-Americans formed. Since no such exclusion occured for Franco-Americans, there is no minority class of Franco-Americans. To quote V.I. Lenin: "What is to be done?" How do we guarantee full rights and privilages to people in a way that does not seek to eradicate their culture? People are necissarily defensive when measures are proposed that can lead to the eradication of a way of life they have always known. But we also seek equality and liberty for all people in the U.S. How do we reconcile these issues? It may take a bigger person than I to answer these questions. ------------------ Jason R Remy "Open mindedness is not the same thing as empty mindedness." -- John Dewey Democracy and Education (1916) |
<<One comment that Jill made that nobody (to my recollection) responded to was that she'd never heard a nonwhite person say "race doesn't matter." This has been my experience as well. I've never heard a nonwhite person say "My race is human" either. Why do y'all think that would be? Is it because nonwhites think race should matter? Or because their experience has been that it does?
Do any actual nonwhite people on this board want to get a word in?>> The only non-white people I have heard say that are members of the Ba'hai faith. (sp?) An article of their faith is that it's immoral to recognize any distinction among the races. They'll tell you they belong to the Human Race. Non-whites KNOW race matters. The only place where non-whites have the luxury of pretending that it doesn't *might* be cyberspace. I'm curious: I know male friends who've pretended to be women on the net; does anyone have any experience of intentionally "passing" as another race? |
Yes, I know a situation where a white person that I know on a local message board passed himself off as black. It's pretty easy to do.
I've surfed quite a bit and I rarely encounter blacks on the internet. Why is that? ------------------ Contestant #3 |
Yes, I know a situation where a white person that I know on a local message board passed himself off as black. It's pretty easy to do.
I've surfed quite a bit and I rarely encounter blacks on the internet. Why is that? -Contestant #3 Ummm...how would you know if you had? Seriously, an upper income black or hispanic family is almost as likely to use the 'net regularly as is a white family of the same socio-economic level, although poor folks of pretty much any description are slow to get wired. It's statistically less likely that poor blacks and latinos will use the net than poor whites but that gap seems to have shrunk this year. I have a friend who volunteers teaching inner-city Chicago kids to become UNIX programmers. The first assignment he gives them is to look up starting salaries on the net. When these children see the starting salaries are 10X what their parents can make, BOY do they get excited! But back to your Black Like Me friend: how did he or she make out? Did they find anything different about the experience? |
Can I become African American?
Don't laugh - it is rumored that there will be a layoff where I work...it might be good for me to become a member of a minority group. If I was challenged in court, how could the government dis-prove my claim? Is it enough to have a dark complexion, eat soul food, listen to the blues? Suppose I found out that my grat-graet grandfather was black-would that make me an afro-american? For that matter, can I claim to be a hispanic ? (I like Mexican food). |
Gene, the joke at a company I worked for during layoffs was that we were all Gay. Let's see them disprove that one.
BTW, skin tone has little to do with race. Indians (the kind from asia, not america) are Caucasians despite the fact that their skin color may be much darker than say, the Xhosa of South Africa. And the skin color in India has a wide range itself. ------------------ Jason R Remy "One pill makes you taller, and one pill makes you small, but the ones that mother gives you don't do anything at all" -- Jefferson Airplane White Rabbit (Slick, G. 1966) |
{{{The only non-white people I have heard say that are members of the Ba'hai faith. (sp?) An article of their faith is that it's immoral to recognize any distinction among the races. They'll tell you they belong to the Human Race.}}}---DianneCar
Interesting. Although I would find myself at juxtaposition with other articles of the Ba'hai (sp? - me too) faith, I have lived my life in accordance with the quoted material, with the exception of the use of the word "race." Nit-picky? Maybe, but I actually see far more sense in the term "ethnicity." ------------------ --Kalél (The Original EnigmaOne) Common ¢ for all ages. |
Kalel says: "Interesting. Although I would find myself at juxtaposition with other articles of the Ba'hai (sp? - me too) faith, I have lived my life in accordance with the quoted material, with the exception of the use of the word "race." Nit-picky? Maybe, but I actually see far more sense in the term "ethnicity."
I see your point. I don't lose sleep over the distinction but, you're right, we're all humans. Now if we could just learn to treat each other that way... Oh, someone had asked about black folks on the 'net. This morning I learned that black American consumers spent a little over $750 Million on computers and computer products in 1997. This figure doesn't even include purchases by blacks in ecommerce, nor does it include black-owned businesses. Thought it interesting. |
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"There is no fate... no predestination... no luck. Don't use that as an excuse to not live the life you want. Work for it. You make your future - no one else.
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Where can I buy bright wood lathes?
I've been looking to purchase a new wood lathe, but within seems to be a very predetermined selection of them at places like the Home Depot or Canadian Tire. I'm not looking to settle $1000 for an industrial class lathe, but I am looking for something a little more than the limited inspection offered locally. Any suggestions? I am willing to order it online.
try http://www.harborfreight.com/
Here are several of them
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I am redo my son's room. His ceiling is lathe and plaster.?
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Connected load(KW X P) funds what for a lathe?
try http://www.harborfreight.com/
Here are several of them
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The F32 4 Series Coupe and F33 4 Series Convertible have finally shown one of its most important signature design elements (and on any BMW) – the kidney grilles!
As expected, the kidney grilles of the coupe are sportier (thinner, shapelier and wider) than that of the F30 3 Series sedan. A close look reveals a different number of slats and differing designs for the grilles on each side – 11 flatter slats on the driver side versus 9 'kinked' slats on the passenger side. We are likely looking at the separate grille designs for the different 'lines' that the F32 and F33 will be offered in (just like the F30 sedan). The closeup image of the hood and front end also reveals extra camouflage panels on … CONTINUED
A couple of 2014 X5 (F15) prototypes flashed their grilles for the first time during one recent test run and our quick acting spies managed to capture it before their camouflage were reattached.
As we've reported previously, the grilles are indeed larger, wider, and bolder than those on the current X5. It retains the 7 slat design, but the grilles now dominate more of the front fascia and has a much thicker grille surround than the current X5 – see the comparison image below.
The hoodline has been moved to above the kidney grilles and taking up recent design cues a la F30 3 series, the headlights will connect with the kidney grilles. Although the headlight shape is still obscured by the camouflage on this prototype, we've … CONTINUED
We've just spied the next generation BMW X5 M prototype beginning its testing! Although still clad in full camouflage, signature M features leave no doubt that we are looking at the next X5 M.
The most conspicuous items are the quad M exhausts, active differential and blue brake calipers, which have become the signature color for M model brakes (i.e. F10 M5 and F12/F13 M6). Seen behind the blue M brakes are drilled rotors, the first for any X5 model. Hiding behind the front end camouflage are huge air intakes and we get a very clear look at how the headlights will connect to the kidney grilles, in the same fashion as on the F30 3 Series.
This prototype comes just 6 months after the regular F15 X5 … CONTINUED
A mystery BMW model appeared at the BMW Museum a bit over a month ago, shrouded under a big blue tarp. It's yet to be positively identified, but could this possibly be the next generation F80 M3 sedan or F82 M4 coupe?
There's not much to go off of by way of the sparse photos, but the one part of the car that can be partially seen – the wheels, happen to match the wheels that have been spotted on the F80 M3 sedan prototypes from our spy photos.
It's premature for any F80 M3 concept to be shown, much less an F82 M4 coupe (the F32 4 series coupe upon which the M4 will be based has not even debuted yet), but is it just our hopeful … CONTINUED
We bring you the first video of the F34 3 Series Gran Turismo (GT) in action. 335i prototypes were spotted on and around the Nurburgring as it recently began its performance testing at the Ring.
The 3 Series GT is being tested concurrently with the other future F3x variants – the F32 coupe and F33 convertible.
The overall apperance of the 3 series GT will follow the 5 Series GT in having some independent styling from the other 3 series variants. Unlike the 5 Series GT however, it will feature a simple hatch design/function rather than the twin trunk arrangement. It should also have sportier styling and driving intentions than the 5 Series GT, which its retractable spoiler seems to be a sign of.
Expect the 3 Series Gran … CONTINUED
We spotted the upcoming 3 series GT (Gran Turismo) out on the highway recently. As you can see, it had its retractable spoiler extended while at speed.
Expect the 3 Series Gran Turismo F34 to debut sometime in 2013 and in both gasoline and diesel models.
Catch more spy photos @ http://www.bimmerpost.com/spyshots/
We recently posted the first photos of the F32 4 Series Coupe hitting the Nurburgring for high performance testing, and we've now also added a live video of the prototypes in action.
The recently revealed 2013 F31 3 Series touring is set to make its world public debut this week at the 2012 AMI (Auto Mobil International) auto show in Leipzig, Germany 2012.
And although we've already posted some great looks at the F31 M Sport test mules, we're hoping to see the M Sport model fully revealed at the AMI show. Whether it does or not however, here is a first look at a beautiful fully revealed production F31 3 Series touring with M Sport package, in Estoril Blue II.
For details on the F30/F31 M Sport package, see our M Sport Guide.
We first began spying the next generation BMW X5 (F15) in January during its cold climate testing. BMW has now ratcheted up testing of the F15 X5 and moved to the Nurburgring to begin some serious track testing.
The F15 X5 is expected to weigh less than the current E70 X5 and ride on a modified version of the F10 5 series chassis. Expect both diesel and gasoline 6-cylinder and 8-cylinder engine options. It should be introduced in late 2013 – early 2014 as a 2014 model year X5.
To here's a recap of what we know about the 2014 X5 so far (with a reposting of the associated spy photos from our earlier coverage).
Judging by what has been previously spied, the X5 retains its muscular … CONTINUED


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COLUMBUS COUNTY, NC (WECT) - Adventure, romance and ancient curses – Beauty and the Beast has it all. This award-winning musical will transport audiences to a time long, long ago on Monday, Feb. 18, at 7 p.m. at Bowers Auditorium.
Southeastern Community College is presenting this family classic as part of its Richard F. Burkhardt Fine and Performing Arts Series, which is sponsored by the SCC Foundation.
All-new songs tell Beauty's journey from her home to the Beast's castle, where she tries to save her father and discovers that the power of love can overcome even the beastliest of adversities.
Admission is $5 for children and $10 for adults. Tickets may be purchased at the door or in advance by calling (910) 642-7141, ext. 320.
The series continues with the Dr. Sharyn Edwards Piano Festival and Competition, March 14-16, and the 8th Annual Honors Jazz Band Festival, April 18 and 20.
Courtesy of: J. Ray Realty
Courtesy of: J. Ray Realty