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in Cleveland, OH
9 attending
in Canal Fulton, OH
6 attending
in Brecksville, OH
4 attending
in Brecksville, OH
14 attending
in Walton Hills, OH
6 attending
in Peninsula, Oh
12 attending
in Cuyahoga Falls, UN
9 attending
27 Meetup Groups match "Hiking" near Medina, OH
Hiking is a great way to get in shape or stay in shape. It is low impact exercise and is a family oriened activity. It also give you a chance to explore our local parks and wildlife. We will be scheduling group hikes for the Summit County Metro Parks Fall Hiking Spree. As well as other activities as they come up. During the winter if the snow gets to be at least 4 inches on the ground we will schedule snow shoeing hikes in the Cuyahoga Valley National Park. Snow shoe rental is cheap and there a …
Hikers Unite! Short hikes, long hikes, easy hikes, moderate hikes, strenuous hikes, kid friendly hikes and dog friendly hikes! The mission is to provide a variety of hikes for hikers of all abilities to get together, enjoy nature and perhaps burn off a few calories in the process. All hikers participate at their own risk. Hiking should always be within your comfort and skill level. Please read the Meetup description carefully and email the event organizer if you have any question about your abi …
Calling all people who want to focus on good health! Let's get together and walk, hike, do yoga, attend cooking and nutrition classes, zumba, do some circuit training and more! I think we all know that getting active/staying active is way more fun with others! Join us! Whether you are just starting some healthy new habits or are a persona trainer, join!
This is a outdoor adventure group based in Cleveland , OH that creates "respites" in the woods. The primary mission is to enjoy this natural world that surrounds us by leaving behind the technologies, stress and ease of "city life" by trekking (one boot in front of the other) into the wilderness, all that we have securely packed on our backs. Whether the trip is near (Ohio, PA, WV) or far (CO, Cali, WY)...our goal is remains the same: safe adventure travel to pristine natural areas. I started th …
There are no upcoming Meetups.
Get Lost! is a group of people who just like to hike around parks in Northeast Ohio and get lost in nature, thought, and conversation. Any member of this group can add an idea for a meetup, so let's share some of our favorite places with each other! All hiking abilities and ages are welcome. Bring your camera if you like, a good supply of water and a snack. If you like photography, consider checking out this facebook group, the Photo Fun Group! http://www.facebook.com/groups/285347077390/
Meet with people who like outdoor adventures and athletic activities, such as hiking, canoeing & kayaking, biking, indoor rock climbing, orienteering, bowling, snowshoeing, etc. All are welcome! Check out our group description: Click on Pages, above.
The group has sponsored hiking and other outdoor activities for several decades, from our website at whynotadventure.org. Mainly we hike on Sunday mornings from October to April, at a leisurely, social page. No one left behind. Dogs welcome. Always food afterwards.
There are no upcoming Meetups.
This group is oriented towards dog owners who want to get out there and explore new parks and trails! If you don't own a dog, no problem, you are still welcome to join us! :) All members can suggest a meetup. All walks and hikes are on leash unless otherwise stated in the description.
Mosaic Outdoor Club of Northeast Ohio, founded 1998, is the Ohio chapter of a network of non-profit, volunteer groups dedicated to organizing outdoor, active, recreational, social and environmental events for Jewish adults. Mosaic serves Jews of all ages, both married and single, who share a love for nature and the outdoors. Based in Cleveland, we have events throughout the Northeast Ohio area, including hiking, bicycling, canoeing, skiing, skating, camping, rock climbing, horseback riding, dinn …
Meetup details are available only to members.
Join us for socializing, networking and camaraderie as we experience all things Northeast Ohio. Seasonal activities will include wineries, towpath biking and hiking, as well as other social gatherings. Hope to see you there!
The greater Cleveland area has some great terrain set aside for our enjoyment. If you're interested in hiking in the Cuyohoga Valley National Park, playing disc golf at the Parma Disc Golf Course, or going camping further afield, then come and join us! Hiking We're not going to abandon you when you're on the trail. Our objective is not to use the trail as a pretty treadmill, but to enjoy immersing ourselves in nature. You can stop and take pictures, and we'll wait for you. We'll take regular …
N.E.O.K is a group founded Feb 11th 2011 Northeast Ohio Kayakers, known as N.E.O.K.,brings a way for paddling enthusiasts of all ages, abilities and interests to get together for fun on the water. Flat water kayaking and canoeing are some of the fastest-growing hobbies in Northeast Ohio and all over America. N.E.O.K is a way to introduce families, kids, adults and seniors to this fun, green, and affordable sport. N.E.O.K. provides a common ground for sharing information, ideas, good judgment, …
Help prevent nature deficit disorder in your preschooler! This is a group for preschool age children (up to age 5) and their parents to get outdoors and play and explore in nature. We are so fortunate to have such a wealth of parks in our region, and our kids NEED to be out in them. We will meet up in different area parks to let our children explore and play while we help them develop a healthy respect for natural resources, teach them ethical nature-play practices, and foster their sense of won …
There are no upcoming Meetups.
This is a group of like minded individuals in pursuit of the supplies and abilities to be prepared in any situation. Supported by A&P Gear Co. located in New Philadelphia, Ohio this group will aim to work together in developing the skills and procuring the supplies needed to be prepared, for anything. Survival Camping, Hunting, Homesteading, Tactical Training, Self Defense Training, Gardening, Trapping, Hiking, and much more will be explored and improved upon in this group. Join us and be prepar …
Meetup details are available only to members.
The idea came to me recently at the completion of an event in which I was bonding with women. It is difficult to describe how I felt "transformed" by the experience; I felt stronger, more compassionate, and courageous...a better version of myself. I would like to maintain and evolve the transformation, and the only way I know how, is to find a network of women who share my desire to continually challenge themselves in mind, body, and spirit. As the name implies…this group is for women only. It i …
Welcome all I am starting this group to meet other people and to do fun stuff together. I also started this group because there wasn't any east side groups like this one Each week we will do fun stuff together like going to coffee shops, seeing movies,taking a hike in the metro parks, or other things like that. Anyone is welcome to join if they want to meet new people and enjoy each others company
There are no upcoming Meetups.
If you're a second-shifter, or have the day off, or are waiting for the kids to get home from school, or enjoying the "blessing of unemployment", and need friends to fill your day, this is the group for you! Let's all meet for coffee, a ballgame, a movie, or just a walk in the park. Please note that this is not a thinly disguised dating / hook-up group! If you are considering joining with that intent, please don't.
There are no upcoming Meetups.
Hello ladies! Thanks for checking us out! Girls Rollin' On CLEast Side group gathers together single or married, professional women (active professionals or career on-hold SAHM) in their mid-20s to mid-40s for fun trying new things and experiencing everything our side of town has to offer. For the single gals needing a breather from career and the marrieds needing a breather from mommyhood/hubby, let's get together and exhale over a drink! Let's explore and do stuff all over the east side: Chagr …
Meetup details are available only to members.
Tired of sitting at home with nothing to do? Tired of the bar scene or trying to meet nice people on some online dating service ? Maybe you just want to get out and have some fun and make friends the old fashioned way by actually meeting them in person ? We are a group dedicated to having a good time and invite fun people (over the age of 21) to get together and enjoy life. Cook-outs, Bar/Nightclub Excursions, Themed parties,Picnics, weekend vacations , camping, canoe and rafting trips etc.. M …
Meetup details are available only to members.
Looking for a "reason based" community? Sick of the sad state of science education and the gullibility of the average person? Since 2008 our members have been making friends, learning, challenging and being challenged with people who like to examine commonly held ideas and beliefs with a scientific eye. Take a break from those who forward dubious alarmist emails or buy into the latest panacea, religious idea, scam or utopian vision based on "truthiness" alone. Hang out for a laugh, write an act …
Meetup details are available only to members.
Cuyahoga Valley Bike Club is a volunteer club that encourages socialization, creating friendships, becoming better cyclists, challenging each other, and giving back to the community. We are a cycling club that is geared toward novice riders and beyond. We are introducing road cycling and trail cycling in 2013 at the beginning of the season for cyclists that ride at 10mph and higher. All of our rides will be rated so you will know what to expect on each ride. Road cyclists, hybrid cyclist, tourin …
There are no upcoming Meetups.
Welcome!! Do you want to learn how to live a healthier lifestyle but just don't know where to start? Well, you've come to the right place. Not only will you learn a lot of important and interesting information on health, but you will meet a lot of great people who also want to learn from you! We are designing this group so that we can learn from each other and have fun while transitioning to a healthier lifestyle. Some of the ideas we have for meetups include but are not limited to: Guest speake …
There are no upcoming Meetups.
This group will organize various fun events to help incorporate fitness into enjoyable activities (bike rides, hikes, softball games, kickball, frisbee, sledding, snowman building, snowball fights). Additionally by sharing workout facilities with each other we can find workout partners. I hope to also have get togethers to share our stories, favorite recipes, and learn that in order to have fun together we do not need high calorie foods and high calorie alcohol. This is a group about introducing …
We are families who love life! Families who have a common interest in: - natural family planning, - fertility awareness, - natural help for infertility. Families who want support and friendship in living: - strong, healthy marriages, - and raising wholesome, happy children, - and understanding Theology of the Body and Catholic life. Our meetups are get-togethers and events planned just for our group, like a hike or bowling or a picnic. We will no longer have meetups which are 'attending' some o …
Goals of True Form Running Group: To improve our abilities as athletes To gain a sense of camaraderie through training together To accept athletes of all abilities and move toward growth as a runner Incorporate conditioning to exercise other muscle groups Have athletes come chat with our group about nutrition, running techniques, strengthening our skills as runners, etc.
There are to date, 635 area people listing travel as one of their first meetup interests. Although there are wine groups that take overnight trips, hiking groups that take backpacking trips, and skiing groups that take skiing trips, there is no group specifically dedicated to taking trips just for the sake of traveling. I am starting this group to see if the 635 of us can meet, figure out the various needs, and start planning anything from weekend and long weekend local or regional trips to int …
There are no upcoming Meetups.
Puppy socialization and dog meet and greet. Fun, sweet and gentle dogs invited to my office. Short, quick Meet Ups are to be for 30 minutes prior to my weekly Group classes until the weather warms up and we can socialize the puppies and dogs outside at a recommended location.
Get an alert email when new Meetup Groups like this start near you.
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SYRACUSE -- Heavy lake snow over Oswego County will shift south towards Syracuse on Monday morning. The morning commute for many may be affected for some.
View a complete listing of school closings and delays and the complete weather forecast.
Watch Meteorologist Peter Hall's full forecast above.
There are lake effect snow warnings for Syracuse and all of Central New York.
Meteorologist Peter Hall says that areas near or north of Syracuse and the Thruway will get 3 to 6 inches. There could be additional 1 to 3 inches later in the evening.
Areas to the south and east of Syracuse will get 1 to 3 inches by 5 p.m. From Oswego west to Rochester could get 6 to 12 inches of new snow by 5 p.m.
Today's high in the Syracuse area is 23 degrees with a low of 8.
Follow Peter Hall on Twitter or Facebook for weather updates throughout the day.
Follow CNY Central for the latest news and weather on Twitter, Facebook, and You Tube.
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Great Photos Annika!
Hi Annika.
thanks for your kind comments on my dolls.
Hi Annika
Welcome in our nest of doll lovers
Dolly cheers
Hi, Annika...so nice to meet you. Welcome to the dolly family!
from Deb
Hello Annika, welcome aboard. Your Barbie dolls are lovely!!
Hi Annika! Lovely to have come and join us.. Be sure to check out our brand new Welcome Centre for lots of info and help on getting started with the community and its features!
Warmest regards, Simon
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Veterinary medicine
Veterinary medicine is the branch of science that deals with the prevention, diagnosis and treatment of disease, disorder and injury in animals. The scope of veterinary medicine is wide, covering all animal species, both domesticated and wild, with a wide range of conditions which can affect different species.
Veterinary medicine is widely practiced, both with and without professional supervision. Professional care is most often led by a veterinary physician (also known as a vet, veterinary surgeon or veterinarian), but also by paraveterinary workers such as veterinary nurses or technicians. This can be augmented by other paraprofessionals with specific specialisms such as animal physiotherapy or dentistry, and species relevant roles such as farriers.
Veterinary science helps human health through the monitoring and control of zoonotic disease (infectious disease transmitted from non-human animals to humans) and veterinary scientists often collaborate with epidemiologists.
The Egyptian Papyrus of Kahun (1900 BCE) and Vedic literature in ancient India offer one of the first written records of veterinary medicine.[1] (See also Shalihotra) One of the edicts of Ashoka reads: "Everywhere King Piyadasi (Asoka) made two kinds of medicine (चिकित्सा) available, medicine for people and medicine for animals. Where there were no healing herbs for people and animals, he ordered that they be bought and planted."[2]
the first attempts to organize and regulate the practice of treating animals tended to focus on horses because of their economic significance. In the Middle Ages,around 475 CE farriers combined their work in shoeing and generally caring for horses' hooves with "horse doctoring". In 1356, the Lord Mayor of London, concerned at the poor standard of care given to horses in the city, requested that all farriers operating within a seven mile radius of the City of London form a "fellowship" to regulate and improve their practices. This ultimately led to the establishment of the Worshipful Company of Farriers in 1674.[3] Meanwhile, Carlo Ruini's book Anatomia del Cavallo, (Anatomy of the Horse) was published in 1598. It was the first comprehensive treatise on the anatomy of a non-human species.[4]
The first veterinary college in Europe had been founded in Lyon, France in 1762 by Claude Bourgelat. In the ensuing 20 years similar colleges were established in other European cities. The Veterinary College of London was founded in 1791 by a group led by Granville Penn, a grandson of William Penn.[5] In the United States, the first veterinarians had been trained in Europe. However, Boston, New York and Philadelphia all had their own private veterinary schools by the 1850s. These urban schools concentrated primarily on the care of horses. By the turn of the 20th century, several American agricultural colleges had started their own veterinary schools which were focused on livestock animals. In 1879, Iowa Agricultural College became the first land grant college to establish a school of veterinary medicine.[6]
Veterinary workers[edit]
Veterinary physicians[edit]
Veterinary care is usually led by a veterinary physician (usually called a vet, veterinary surgeon or veterinarian). This role is the equivalent of a doctor in human medicine, and usually involves post-graduate study and qualification.
In many countries, the local nomenclature for a vet is a protected term, meaning that people without the prerequisite qualifications and/or registration are not able to use the title, and in many cases, the activities that may be undertaken by a vet (such as animal treatment or surgery) are restricted only to those people who are registered as vet. For instance, in the United Kingdom, as in other jurisdictions, animal treatment may only be performed by registered vets (with a few designated exceptions, such as paraveterinary workers), and it is illegal for any person who is not registered to call themselves a vet or perform any treatment.
Most vets work in clinical settings, treating animals directly. These vets may be involved in a general practice, treating animals of all types; may be specialized in a specific group of animals such as companion animals, livestock, laboratory animals, zoo animals or horses; or may specialize in a narrow medical discipline such as surgery, dermatology, laboratory animal medicine, or internal medicine.
As with healthcare professionals, vets face ethical decisions about the care of their patients. Current debates within the profession include the ethics of purely cosmetic procedures on animals, such as declawing of cats, docking of tails, cropping of ears and debarking on dogs.
Paraveterinary workers[edit]
Paraveterinary workers, including veterinary nurses, technicians and assistants, either assist vets in their work, or may work within their own scope of practice, depending on skills and qualifications, including in some cases, performing minor surgery.
The role of paraveterinary workers is less homogeneous globally than that of a vet, and qualification levels, and the associated skill mix, vary widely.
Allied professions[edit]
A number of professions exist within the scope of veterinary medicine, but which may not necessarily be performed by vets or veterinary nurses. This includes those performing roles which are also found in human medicine, such as practitioners dealing with musculoskeletal disorders, including osteopaths, chiropractors and physiotherapists.
There are also roles which are specific to animals, but which have parallels in human society, such as animal grooming and animal massage.
Some roles are specific to a species or group of animals, such as farriers, who are involved in the shoeing of horses, and in many cases have a major role to play in ensuring the medical fitness of the horse.
See also[edit]
- By country
- ^ Thrusfield 2007, p. 2.
- ^ Finger 2001, p. 12.
- ^ Hunter, Pamela (2004). Veterinary Medicine: A Guide to Historical Sources, p. 1. Ashgate Publishing, Ltd.
- ^ Wernham, R. B. (1968). The New Cambridge Modern History: The Counter-Reformation and price revolution, 1559-1610, Volume 3, p.472. Cambridge University Press.
- ^ Hunter (2004) p. 4
- ^ Widder, Keith R. (2005). Michigan Agricultural College: The Evolution Of A Land-Grant Philosophy, 1855-1925, p. 107. MSU Press
Introductory textbooks and references[edit]
- Aspinall, Victoria; Cappello, Melanie; Bowden, Sally; Jeffery, Andrea (forward) (2009), Introduction to Veterinary Anatomy and Physiology Textbook, Elsevier Health Sciences, ISBN 978-0-7020-2938-7, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Boden, Edward; West, Geoffrey Philip (1998), Black's veterinary dictionary, Rowman & Littlefield, ISBN 978-0-389-21017-7, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Done, Stanley H. (1996), Color atlas of veterinary anatomy: The dog & cat, Elsevier Health Sciences, ISBN 978-0-7234-2441-3, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Dyce, Keith M.; Sack, Wolfgang O.; Wensing, Cornelis Johannes Gerardus (2010), Textbook of veterinary anatomy, Saunders, ISBN 978-1-4160-6607-1, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Fenner, William R. (2000), Quick reference to veterinary medicine, John Wiley & Sons, ISBN 978-0-397-51608-7, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Lawhead, James B.; Baker, MeeCee (2009), Introduction to veterinary science, Cengage Learning, ISBN 978-1-4283-1225-8, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Pfeiffer, Dirk (2009), Veterinary Epidemiology: An Introduction, John Wiley and Sons, ISBN 978-1-4051-7694-1, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Radostits, O. M.; Gay, C. C.; Blood, D. C.; Arundel, J. H.; Hinchcliff, Kenneth W (2000), Veterinary Medicine: A Textbook of the Diseases of Cattle, Sheep, Pigs, Goats and Horses, 9th edition, Elsevier Health Sciences. Pp. 1877, ISBN 0-7020-2604-2
Monographs and other speciality texts[edit]
- Dunlop, Robert H.; Malbert, Charles-Henri (2004), Veterinary pathophysiology, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-8138-2826-8, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Eurell, Jo Ann Coers; Eurell, Jo Ann; Frappier, Brian L.; Dellman, Horst-Dieter (25 May 2006), Dellmann's textbook of veterinary histology, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-7817-4148-4, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Foreyt, William J.; Foreyt, Bill (2001), Veterinary parasitology reference manual, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-8138-2419-2, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Gupta, Ramesh Chandra (2007), Veterinary toxicology: basic and clinical principles, Academic Press, ISBN 978-0-12-370467-2, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Hirsh, Dwight C.; Maclachlan, Nigel James; Walker, Richard L. (2004), Veterinary microbiology, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-8138-0379-1, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Hunter, Pamela (2004), Veterinary Medicine: A Guide to Historical Sources, Ashgate Publishing, Ltd. Pp. 611, ISBN 0-7546-4053-1
- Merck, Melinda D. (2007), Veterinary forensics: animal cruelty investigations, John Wiley & Sons, ISBN 978-0-8138-1501-5, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Murphy, Frederick A. (1999), Veterinary virology, Academic Press, ISBN 978-0-12-511340-3, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Nicholas, Frank W. (2009), Introduction to Veterinary Genetics, John Wiley and Sons, ISBN 978-1-4051-6832-8, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Robinson, Wayne F.; Huxtable, Clive R. R. (2004), Clinicopathologic Principles for Veterinary Medicine, Cambridge University Press. Pp. 452, ISBN 0-521-54813-6
- Slatter, Douglas H. (2002), Textbook of small animal surgery, Elsevier Health Sciences, ISBN 978-0-7216-8607-3, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Kahn, Cynthia M., ed. (2010), The Merck Veterinary Manual, Whitehouse Station, N.J., Merck, ISBN 978-0-911910-93-3
- Thrusfield, Michael (2007), Veterinary epidemiology, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-1-4051-5627-1, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Zajac, A.; Conboy, Gary A.; American Association of Veterinary Parasitologists (2006), Veterinary clinical parasitology, John Wiley & Sons, ISBN 978-0-8138-1734-7, retrieved 21 November 2011
Veterinary nursing, ophthalmology, and pharmacology[edit]
- Adams, H. Richard (2001), Veterinary pharmacology and therapeutics, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-8138-1743-9, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Bryant, Susan (2010), Anesthesia for Veterinary Technicians, John Wiley and Sons, ISBN 978-0-8138-0586-3, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Cannon, Marthaxcxlast2=Hijfte (2006), Feline medicine: a practical guide for veterinary nurses and technicians, Elsevier Health Sciences, ISBN 978-0-7506-8827-7, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Crispin, Sheila M. (2005), Notes on veterinary ophthalmology, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-632-06416-8, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Gelatt, Kirk N. (2000), Essentials of veterinary ophthalmology, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-683-30077-2, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Lane, D. R.; Cooper, B. (2003), Veterinary nursing, Elsevier Health Sciences, ISBN 978-0-7506-5525-5, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Pattengale, Paula (2004), Tasks for the veterinary assistant, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-7817-4243-6, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Riviere, Jim E.; Papich, Mark G. (2009), Veterinary pharmacology and therapeutics, John Wiley and Sons, ISBN 978-0-8138-2061-3, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Anthony, David; University of Pennsylvania. University Museum (1984), Man and animals: living, working, and changing together : in celebration of the 100th anniversary, the School of Veterinary Medicine, University of Pennsylvania, UPenn Museum of Archaeology, ISBN 978-0-934718-68-4, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Catanzaro, Thomas E. (1998), Building the Successful Veterinary Practice: Innovation and creativity, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-8138-2984-5, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Finger, Stanley (2001), Origins of neuroscience: a history of explorations into brain function, Oxford University Press, ISBN 978-0-19-514694-3, retrieved 21 November 2011</ref>
- Rollin, Bernard E. (2006), An introduction to veterinary medical ethics: theory and cases, Wiley-Blackwell, ISBN 978-0-8138-0399-9, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Sherman, David M. (2002), Tending animals in the global village: a guide to international veterinary medicine, John Wiley & Sons, ISBN 978-0-683-18051-0, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Shilcock, Maggie; Stutchfield, Georgina (2003), Veterinary practice management: a practical guide, Elsevier Health Sciences, ISBN 978-0-7020-2696-6, retrieved 21 November 2011
- Smith, Gary; Kelly, eds. (2008), Food Security in a Global Economy: Veterinary Medicine and Public Health, Phila.: University of Pennsylvania Press. Pp. 176, ISBN 0-8122-2044-7
- Swabe, Joanna (1999), Animals, Disease, and Human Society: Human-animal Relations and the Rise of Veterinary Medicine, Routledge. Pp. 243., ISBN 0-415-18193-3
- Swope, Robert E.; Rigby, Julie (2001), Opportunities in veterinary medicine careers, McGraw-Hill Professional. Pp. 151, ISBN 0-658-01055-7
External links[edit]
Wikimedia Commons has media related to Veterinary medicine. |
Look up veterinary medicine in Wiktionary, the free dictionary. |


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The Order of the Arrow has several publications available to help Arrowmen in carrying out the OA program. These publications are normally available through your local lodge or council. Contact your lodge adviser or staff adviser if you need a copy. Many publications are available online. Most are revised regularly, so be sure to get the current edition. Some helpful publications include:
This document is now a part of "Appendix 12 - JumpStart" in the Guide to Inductions. Link to Guide to Inductions
This report provides a summary of the OA's activities and programs at the National level for the year listed.
The online Publications are in "Portable Document Format" (PDF).
Get Information about how to read PDF format.
Revised 10/13/2013


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Phi Beta Kappa
The Phi Beta Kappa Society has been in operation for more than 200 years. The organization is one of the leading academic...
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Perhaps you could apply filters more judiciously next time. Or, we could just try harder to find your results. Come to think of it, we're working on that.


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BRAND NEW, 20 by 12, PLEASE CALL ME AT 786 355 8766 MARIANO, GRACIAS.. Location: PLANTATION it's ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests Posting ID: 3518530220 Posted: 2013-01-18, 7:10AM EST email to a friend back to original listing
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smile often
i love: my friends, my family, my wonderful boyfriend, my doggie, shopping, smiling, purses, bags, clutches, (and more bags!) hugs, chi tea lattes, saying "i love you", cupcakes, gratitude, ice cream, fashion, making good grades, red velvet cake, anything pink, snow, starbucks, clothes, fuzzy socks, movies on rainy days, texting, expensive things, singing too loud, diet dr. pepper, zeta, staying up too late, waking up too early, laughing and making others laugh, warm coats, traveling, birthday cards, facebook, getting flowers, music, talking, jewelry, bubble baths, and lots and lots of other things but most importantly, my wonderfully fabulous life. ♥♥♥
these pictures are of what i like and of what makes me happy.
if you like them please use them. i do not own any of them.
July 18


text: MaupinTour helps make dreams come true with inspiring journeys of discovery all over the world. From North America and all the way down to the tip of South America, from Europe's vibrant history to the mystery and intrigue of the Orient and then over to the wild of Africa, there is so much to do and experience. Begin exploring our journeys and a world of possibility by clicking the links below and find the trip of your dreams.


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Sunday, August 30, 2009
for butterflies
Tomorrow is *the day* and we've gotten our supplies, visited the classrooms, and tried on every pair of pants in the house to see if any of them are still long enough. (of course not!) I've got my reusable sandwich wraps ready (pattern in Sewing Green and here), a few snack bags (lots of tutorials all over the web) along with these new organic cotton canvas food sacks (below left) from Graze Organic that I won from Mindful Momma!
I thought this might be a good time to get back on my soap box about packing trash-free lunches again. Last spring I wrote a post about it after I spoke to our school's PTA. The statistics about the garbage one school can generate is staggering! Check it out.
Also in Sewing Green is my pattern for the Lunch Tote, seen here made in organic cotton from Harmony Art. My boys are still clinging to their Transformer and Superman lunch sacks, so I haven't been able to make ones for them yet. Maybe next year. I've seen a few Lunch Totes already pop up in the Sewing Green Flickr Group and they look great!
Ok, I'm off to label school supplies and bake cookies. Tummy butterflies are much calmer when you give them cookies, you know. :)
11 comments:
- Anonymous8/30/09, 5:48 PM
I don't have anyone in the house going back to school this year, but I remember the butterflies.
And the tears (mine) in
Grade one. Nice bags;)
Michele I just made both boys lunches tonight for the first time. I had to use a few ziploc bags. Boo! Because I haven't made the time to make some snack bags yet even though I have all of the supplies. I am determined to do that this week! I'm going to use the 2nd tutorial that you linked to. That looks exactly like what I had in mind. I'm using the ripstop nylon instead of PUL because I've read that PUL isn't proven to be food-safe but the ripstop nylon is.
The sandwich wrap project is meant to be helpful and create less waste on a daily basis. I hope, as with any project, you make it work for you and tailor it to your own familly's needs and desires. If you are wary of PUL or other plastics, please don't use them. I've used the plain organic cotton canvas snack sacks in the 1st photo and the food stayed fresh until lunch.
Thanks so much for taking the time to comment on my blog. Your thoughts and messages are greatly appreciated!


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Retirement fund still solvent; hit hard by stock market crash
This entire article is available to all Northside Sun print and web subscribers. If you are already a subscriber to the newspaper, please complete a short one-time registration and get a self-selected user ID and password. This will give you immediate access. In the future, simply log in using your user ID and password. To register or log in, click HERE.
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Jackson's police and firefighter retirement system is underfunded by nearly $62 million, but the system is still solvent, so say city officials.
The system was on track to be fully funded by 2020, but fell behind as a result of the near crash of the stock market in 2008 when investment returns dried up.


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Local Sports Event Date:
Union at St. James. 7:30 on KLPW-AM 1220.
Union at St. James. 7:30 on KLPW-AM 1220.
The KLPW Radio Athlete of the Week is Cullen VanLeer from Pacific High School. FIve games into the season, Cullen is averaging 22.4 points, 10.4 rebounds and 4.2 assists per game. He led the Indians to the third place trophy in the Borgia Thanksgiving Tournament and was named to the Blue Division All Tournament Team.
On the evening of December 2, nearly the entire nation of Venezuela went dark in the second massive power outage to take place in less than a year. Rather than take responsibility for the failures of the state-owned electric company, socialist president Nicolas Maduro instead told the Venezuelan people to "be strong against this electrical war that fascists have declared against our people."
Boys Basketball...
Hermann at Linn
Girls Basketball...
Washington at New Haven
Sullivan hosts Waynesville
St. James at Cuba
Owensville at Steeleville
Hermann at Linn
St. Clair will host a tri-meet


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While hormones, genetic makeup, diet, and the weather can all influence how shiny your face looks, the truth is that an oily face can be troublesome and lead to additional problems. One of the best strategies for dealing with an oily sheen is to begin using an oil-free cleanser designed specifically to help eliminate excess sebum. Follow your cleanser up by using an astringent that delivers oil-controlling capabilities and an oil control gel or cream that will mattify for hours. With a good routine in place, oily shine will be minimized.
For those moments throughout the day when excess oils seep through your foundation, consider using purse-size blotting sheets. They are convenient to carry with you due to their small size and just as simple to use, making it easy to freshen up throughout the day.
Today's oil-blotting sheets have been created to offer oil reduction without messing up your makeup. Quite commonly, oil-blotting linens are formulated with ingredients known to deliver extra benefits. For example, they might contain powerful antioxidants such as Green Tea in order to offer your skin protection against free radicals. Some styles include essential oils such as Peppermint to add a cooling sensation to your skin, Rose or Vanilla to soothe both your skin and emotions, or Orange to energize your spirit.


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The Scots have their scotch. Italians, their wine. Russians, their vodka. In America, we've got our bourbon. Known as "America's Native Spirit," it's the only alcohol that is a distinctive product of the United States.
In Kentucky, we take pride in that, especially considering 95 percent of this corn-based, caramel colored sipping icon is distilled, aged and bottled right here in the state's bourbon country. It's big business for the Bluegrass State. But more than industry, bourbon is a culture, a history and heritage built by generations of Kentuckians from as early as the late 18th century.
Today, you too can experience the culture of Kentucky bourbon country.
Kentucky Bourbon Trail
Take the legendary Kentucky Bourbon Trail through the heart of bourbon country and stop in on six of the state's distilleries including Maker's Mark, Jim Beam and Woodford Reserve. Tour bourbon country and experience the bourbon making process, view the facilities and amazingly beautiful surrounding landscapes, and stick around for an after-tour bourbon tasting.
Urban Bourbon Trail
Headed back to the city? Once you're done with your tour of bourbon country, the Urban Bourbon Trail in Louisville should be your next stop. The trail consists of "the world's best bourbon bars," all of which must serve at least 50 different kinds of bourbon and hold at least one bourbon-related event each month. Many even specialize in bourbon-related food dishes.
Other Bourbon Distilleries
Other Kentucky bourbon distilleries are also located along the bourbon trail. Distilleries such as Buffalo Trace and Barton 1792 Distillery are definitely worth visiting, and offer exciting tours and free tastings. Use the search below to explore more about bourbon in Kentucky, bourbon tour experiences and additional attractions and events.
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New Johnny Cash album to be released next spring
Chris Talbott, Associated Press |
posted 3 minutes ago
There's new never-before-heard music coming from Johnny Cash.
Review: 'Nashville' soundtrack slick and solid
Jeff Karoub, Associated Press |
posted 24 minutes ago
"The Music of Nashville: Original Soundtrack Season 2, Volume 1" (Big Machine Records)
A do-ahead breakfast to bake while you celebrate
Alison Ladman, Associated Press |
posted 30 minutes ago
With all those presents to open, nobody wants to spend Christmas morning in the kitchen. So to keep you where you belong on the big morning, we created this easy raspberry and cream cheese stuffed breakfast biscuit that is fast and easy to assemble. It also can be prepped a week or more in advance, then frozen. Just bake it Christmas morning right from the freezer.
Bosnian musician to help poor Roma study music
Aida Cerkez, Associated Press |
posted 32 minutes ago
Bosnia's most popular musician _ a man whose international career has been built on music inspired by Balkan and Gypsy tunes _ is searching for talented Roma children to help them get an education in music.
Song lyrics, photos combine for holiday decor
Holly Ramer, Associated Press |
posted Dec 10th - 8:19am
The holidays are a great time to pull out the old photos and reminisce, but there's no need to huddle around a dusty album. There are a variety of ways to get them out in the open by making them part of your holiday decorations.
La Scala names new musical director: Chailly
Colleen Barry, Associated Press |
posted Dec 10th - 7:39am
The famed Milanese opera house La Scala has confirmed that Riccardo Chailly will be its new musical director, replacing Daniel Barenboim.
For gifters: kid picture books with snowy themes
Leanne Italie, Associated Press |
posted Dec 10th - 7:04am
Brrrr. It's time for all good children, at least those in chilly territory, to curl up with a good book featuring snow.
AP Newsbreak: Winfrey announces new book club pick
Hillel Italie, Associated Press |
posted Dec 10th - 6:38am
Here's something to pre-order for the holidays: Oprah Winfrey's new book club pick.
France snubs Google culture launch amid row
Associated Press |
posted Dec 10th - 6:33am
France's culture minister has snubbed the launch of Google's latest project, the Paris-based Cultural Institute Lab over a row about privacy.
Justin Bieber visits Philippine typhoon victims
Associated Press |
posted Dec 10th - 6:26am
Teen heartthrob Justin Bieber visited young victims of Typhoon Haiyan on Tuesday, traveling to the Philippines after launching a worldwide campaign to help those affected by the deadly storm.
Bacharach calls musical of his songs a 'valentine'
Mark Kennedy, Associated Press |
posted Dec 10th - 6:16am
A few years ago, Kyle Riabko found himself in the most intimidating of places on Earth for a young singer-songwriter.
'Sound of Music' actress Eleanor Parker dies at 91
Jessica Herndon, Associated Press |
posted Dec 10th - 5:47am
Eleanor Parker, who was nominated for Academy Awards three times for her portrayals of strong-willed women and played a scheming baroness in "The Sound of Music," has died at 91.
Justin Bieber arrives in Philippines
Associated Press |
posted Dec 9th - 9:54pm
Teen heartthrob Justin Bieber arrived Tuesday in the Philippines, where he has launched a campaign to help victims of last month's killer typhoon.
Storm snarls travel; power outages persist
Joshua Freed, Associated Press |
posted Dec 9th - 8:56pm
Snow and bitter cold snarled traffic and prompted another 1,650 U.S. flight cancellations on Monday, and tens of thousands of people were still without power after January-like weather barged in a month early.
Sundance announces 2014 premiere lineup
Jessica Herndon, Associated Press |
posted Dec 9th - 8:17pm
The Sundance Film Festival will premiere 117 independent feature films and 11 documentaries at its 30th anniversary next month _ a lineup representing the 2014 fest's most prestigious films.
Entertainment News
February 13th, 2013 @ 7:10pm
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After a two day search for 18-year-old Jamisha Gilbert , police are now standing down after the discovery of body late Wednesday morning.Lt. Dave Gearheart with the Lynchburg police spoke with WSLS about the investigation."During their search team members located a deceased black female at this time the area is being treated as a crime scene and is being thoroughly processed by the Lynchburg police department and the virginia state police crime scene technicians."The body has been sent to Roa... More>>
The Lynchburg Police Department has roped off a building on Concord Turnpike and Pleasant Valley. More>>
Roanoke Police release more information about a deadly shooting in southeast Roanoke in the 1600 block of Queen Ann Drive, that happened around 4:45 p.m. Wednesday. The gunshot victim has now been identified as 18 year old Tratavious Davon Oliver McDuffie. More>>
A look at stories happening in our area today. More>>
The current facility will remain open until construction is complete. More>>
A celebration in the New River Valley tonight. The Montgomery Museum and Lewis Miller Regional Art Center is celebrating recent renovations and a new roof.
Roanoke County students were eligible for the first time last year but this is the first full year for the program and the application will be more extensive. More>>
The Carilion Clinic Foundation lit the first ever Lights of Love tree Wednesday night. The Lights of Love program is a new initiative to raise money to pay for hotel rooms for the families of patients. The hospital cares for many people who live far away from Roanoke. Donors can symbolical purchase a light on the tree in honor of a loved one. More>>
The Rockbridge Area Community Services Board met Wednesday afternoon for the first time since Gus Deeds stabbed his father, State Senator Creigh Deeds, then killed himself. The group has been under heavy scrutiny after reports surfaced that they released Gus Deeds from an emergency mental health hold less than 24 hours before the incident.
The only time the board publicly mentioned the incident was at the beginning of the meeting when Board Chairman Percy Nowlins asked for a moment o More>>
A sticky mixture has grown in popularity because of its stronger marijuana content. A Radford City Police detective says he didn't expect "hash" to make its way here."It's mostly a west coast thing but of course we have a high population of college students here that ranks rapid among our students," says an undercover detective with Radford City Police.The drug "hash" has a higher concentrate of marijuana meaning a quicker buzz for users. After police say a Radford University student died of ... More>>
A non-profit helping put a stop to child abuse in the Roanoke and New River Valleys needs your help finding nominations for their "Golden Halo Awards." Each year, Children's Trust recognizes those in our community who go above and beyond to protect our children. More>>
Delegate Lacey Putney who is the longest serving member in the Virginia General Assembly is recognized tonight for his service. It starts at 5:30 Wednesday night at the Trivium Estate and Conference Center in Forest. Governor Bob McDonnell is the keynote speaker. Putney is retiring after 52 years in office and the Bedford Board of Supervisors and Town Council approved a resolution to make this happen. More>>
Virginia State Police are now helping the Alleghany County Sheriff's Office in a homicide investigation. Sheriff Kevin Hall says 71-year-old Joe Rumfelt was found shot to death in his home in Selma last night. Deputies are now searching the area and asking neighbors if they saw anything suspicious that could lead them to a suspect. More>>
Former Alaska Governor Sarah Palin will be the featured speaker at Liberty University's final convocation today starting at 10 a.m. before stopping in Roanoke Saturday.
The "Be a Santa to a Senior" program will provide gifts to more than 2,000 seniors this year in the Roanoke, Lynchburg, and Smith Mountain Lake area.
Vera Lee Craft was just 13-months-old when she was severely shaken and beaten to death in July of 2012. More>>
A celebration in the New River Valley tonight. The Montgomery Museum and Lewis Miller Regional Art Center is celebrating recent renovations and a new roof.


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It's a 1950s spin on Romeo and Juliet
ESCANABA -- The ill-fated tragedy of Romeo and Juliet has been adapted into many plays and musicals, but none more famous than that of West Side Story. The musical drama features memorable songs, characters, and a familiar theme of love and heartbreak. The Escanaba Fine Arts Department is putting the finishing touches on the musical. It features a 42-member cast, 12 songs, and a 26-member orchestra.
The story is one that's sure to delight audiences of all ages. The plot is set in 1950s New York, when Jets member Tony, falls in love with Maria, the sister of the rival gang's leader.
"The very first scene is the prologue," says P.J. Uhazie, who plays Bernardo. "And it's where they play through an intro, and you get to see the two different gangs feuding. And it's a really big dance number and there's stage fighting. It's really exciting!"
The cast has been rehearsing for months, and it's the only musical of the year. There are two acts, and there's a lot of emotion packed into them.
"Everything in it is intense," says Samuel Bender, who plays Tony. "From the music in the pit to the music we're singing to the dance we're doing to the acting and emotion required for the role."
So how do the cast members feel about sharing their passion?
"I know out of all the years I've done this, this is the one I've enjoyed the most and the one I take the most pride in. I hope the audience will reciprocate that," Uhazie says.
Tickets are still available at the Escanaba High School main office. West Side Story runs November 16, 17, 19, and 20 at 8 p.m.


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JANI-KING has immediate franchise opportunities available for as little as $1500.00 down. Invest in your future today. The commercial cleaning industry is booming! Jani-King provides: Customers Growth Local Support On-Going Training Clean up in the Wichita... More info Email a friend |
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Tumi Leather Cover for iPhone 5 and 5S
best complemented with
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Tumi Leather Snap Case for new iPad
was: $145
Tumi Leather Snap Case for new iPad
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Tap into the Tumi heritage of design excellence with TICON, a modern collection of travel and lifestyle accessories. Defined by a graphic T-patterned exterior, TICON draws inspiration from the Tumi logo and distinctive weave of Tumi's iconic ballistic nylon. This embossed leather cover is designed to fit the iPhone 5 and 5S. It snaps on the phone easily and securely, and features a screen protector that also shields against scratches and dirt. Resistant to heat, glare and fingerprints. Interior plastic tray.
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- Gift box included
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We want you to be fully satisfied with every product that you purchase from www.tumi.com. If you are not satisfied with a product that you have purchased, you may return the product within 30 days of delivery for a full refund of the purchase price, minus the shipping, handling, gift box, and other charges. Please note, however, that monogrammed and personalized items, including Accent Your Alpha, cannot be returned. Return shipping is free. You will be provided with a pre-paid UPS domestic label to return your purchase. If you cannot find the prepaid shipping label, please call our Customer Service Department at 1-800-299-TUMI (8864) or contact us by email.
We ask that the product be unused, in original boxes (whenever possible), and with all paperwork, parts and accessories in order to ensure credit. Sale merchandise will be issued a credit at the current selling price. Unused items purchased on www.tumi.com can also be returned to a US Tumi full price location. Please make sure to have all paperwork, parts and accessories to ensure credit. Store credit will be issued for items without documentation.
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Dresses & Skirts
Shadow Stripe Party Dress
Fit-and-flare knit dress with a micro-faille texture is banded in sheer mesh. It's a pretty way to define the bodice, hourglass the waist and spin a swingy skirt. Shell: 97% Polyester, 3% Spandex. Lining: 100% Polyester. Dry clean. Imported.
- Fit and flare silhouette.
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- Black soft knit lining.
- Length: 39" from shoulder.
Available to ship by 12/16/13. Don't worry, you won't be charged until your item ships.


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Celebrity weddings are a source of constant fascination for most of us and every detail, from the dresses and the shoes, to the shape of the cake is eagerly digested. One of the reasons that we are so obsessed by the way famous people tie the knot is that they tend to do things on a much bigger scale than the rest of us. Big budgets, over the top dress designs and sparkling celebrity guest lists mean that we just can't get enough of star wedding style. Grab yourself a cup of tea and take a look at the top 10 most elaborate celebrity weddings of all time:
1. Holly Valance and Nick Candy
When the singer tied the knot with her property developer beau she did it with considerable largesse at the home of a multi million pound grocery store owner in Beverley Hills with Simon Cowell on the guest list. She didn't skimp on the dress either, which had an OTT train measuring no less than 15ft…
2. Justin Timberlake and Jessica Biel
It was the logistics of the wedding for these two aesthetically pleasing actors that was so incredibly elaborate – the 150 guests weren't simply ask to show up at the church on time but had to fly from the US to Germany before taking a private plane to Italy where the ceremony was held.
3. Kim Kardashian and Kris Humphreys
Their relationship may have lasted just 72 days but the wedding went down as one of the most ostentatious in history. Budget-wise they pulled out all the stops with Kim's headpiece alone costing $2.5 million.
4. Celine Dion and Rene Angelil
They married in 1994 at Notre Dame Basilica in Montreal in the kind of over the top ceremony that you would expect from the big lung-ed lady. From a 20-foot train to a seven-pound crystal tiara that had to be sewn to her head, nothing was done on a small scale.
5. Kate Middleton and Prince William
No top 10 celebrity wedding list would be complete without mentioning the most over the top wedding in recent history – Kate Middleton and Prince William. Celebrations went on for several days, the entire event was televised and we all got a day off work to watch it – there's little more elaborate than that!
6. David and Victoria Beckham
These two have been married so long now they're practically part of the furniture, but for those that remember, this was one of the stand out weddings of the time. From a price tag of nearly a million to their insistence on 'his' and 'hers' thrones, there was nothing low key about this wedding.
7. Amit Bhatia and Vanisha Mittal
This one may well have had the most expensive wedding in history with nuptials that cost nearly £60 million. Their endurance wedding went on for six days and included a performance by the legendary Kylie Minogue.
8. Liza Minnelli & David Gest
Married in a £2 million (ish) ceremony with Michael Jackson as the best man and Elizabeth Taylor as the maid of honour. Their wedding cake was a whopping 12 tiers and there was a performance by Tony Bennett to top off the day.
9. Wayne Rooney and Coleen McLoughlin
You would expect a footballer to have a pretty ostentatious wedding day and Wayne Rooney and Coleen McLoughlin certainly didn't disappoint. A 17th century Italian villa provided the setting for the £6 million wedding, which included a chartered flight for 65 guests from the UK and use of a multi million pound yacht for a week.
10. Prince Charles and Lady Diana
The cost of Prince Charles and Lady Diana's wedding has eclipsed virtually every other since, even Charles' own son. With the bride having a 25-foot train, the event itself drawing in a TV audience of 750 million and a price tag of £110 million at today's prices, these were nuptials on a breathtaking scale.
Whether these top 10 celebrity weddings have provided inspiration for your own special day or simply make you shudder, they're certainly pretty spectacular. Not all of us would want to have a 15ft train or a massive TV audience, but it's still great entertainment to watch those that do.
Written by Susana from Simply Wedding Photography in Brighton – a wedding photographer with a love of unique weddings, whether big or small.


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modern furniture & lighting
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Store your child's clothes and other necessary items in these functional and stylish dressers and armoires. Add a coordinating nightstand to their bedroom space and the room will be complete. Also check out modern dressers & nightstands.


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WebMD Physician Directory
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- Jesse E. Adams III, MD, Cardiovascular Disease, Internal Medicine
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The Ministry of Waiting …
Our love for one another should make us eager to help one another get to God.
Our love for one another should make us eager to help one another get to God.
Take worship seriously. None of us knows when it will be our last day in the house of the Lord.
Anything that helps you express your heart for God and does not hinder other people is good.
If worship were optional Paul and Silas would not have been singing with bloody backs in the Philippian dungeon at midnight.
We can be silent before majesty either because of its beauty or because of our blindness.
Will there ever be revival in a place where everything is aimed at cultivating a light and pleasant spirit?
To grow up into the fullness of the stature of Christ includes emotional transformation.
We are a singing people because we are the children of a singing God.
Ten reasons to set aside a Friday night each month for corporate worship.
You are always in a temple—your body. Therefore, always worship.
10 practical preparations for hearing the word of God on Sunday morning.
Learn from David what to do in a brokenhearted, terrifying moment: Worship.
God loves us by commanding us to praise him, because we won't be happy until we give it.
The Glory of God Sanctification & Growth Devotional Life Pride & Humility Hymns


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Carry over from another thread. I said the following. "On the one hand you have people who view the game as a puzzle to be solved. How can I make the best X to win all of the things. The rules, to them, are the game. On the other hand you have the people who view the game as an interactive story that they expect to not be a simple "win" or "lose" kind of proposition. The rules, to them, serve the setting. Obviously with people who fall in the grey area in between. When I hear about someone trying to argue for bound genies with no risk granting bonuses, I want to throw a book at them. You are, to me manipulating the rules to break the setting. When someone else hears me say "You can't do that" to something they think is RAW, to them, I am cheating and being cruel. I fall very strongly on the side of the rules serve the setting, rather than the setting serving the rules." 1. Do you agree that this is a fair dividing line (with lots of people who fall into grey areas between on various issues) 2. Which side of the debate are you generally on. In other words, do you believe the rules serve the setting or that the setting serves the rules.
ciretose wrote:
Whose setting?
ciretose wrote: But if you have a conflict where the rules and the setting depart (which happens frequently) which one holds higher value at your table. Oddly, I haven't had this happen frequently. I've been doing this sort of thing for more than a decade, and I can't recall the last time I felt the rules and the setting were at war with one another. Or even in a bad mood with each other, for that matter.
Ashiel wrote: You also find ways to manipulate the rules to acheive outcomes and have a setting where you can't get +3 items but you can buy attributes from Genie binders, neither of which seems consistent with any published setting I've read.
Setting is such a loaded word. The rules effect the settings and vice versa. Because if your setting is low magic like E6 or E8, there are rules that are basically never used. Or that you have to add rules to still allow characters to feel that they are growing. If by setting you mean like is the game social/skills focused or combat focused. The D&D/PF rules are definitely combat focus, their skill/social resolution is too simplistic to do a nuanced game based on politicking without heavy house rules. In D&D and PF the first thing in character creation is ability scores. There are other games that focuses on developing character concepts first and foremost, and than the crunch follows. So even by that simple change in layout of character creation I feel will have a subtle but strong impact on setting. Is it character personality driven or crunch driven? I can probably write a ton more on this subject. At the end of the day the rules should fit the story that you are trying to tell and that is more important than anything.
ciretose wrote: Well we have Golarion as the published setting for one. We could go Forgotten Realms or Greyhawk...but I suspect if you are on the rules side you probably have your own setting to conform to the rules, as you read them, which would mean the setting serves the rules. Well I run Golarion occasionally when I'm running APs. I've done a little time in the Forgotten Realms. I'd really like to track down a copy of Living Grayhawk though 'cause one of my favorite deities is from that book and it was the setting of 3.x but I never got the book. I'm a pretty big fan of Eberron, but I haven't run that in a while. Recently I've been putting more emphasis on my homebrew world which tries a few things that are a little different than the norm, I think. I think if I was going to run Golarion specifically for a while, I think I might like to set up something heavily involved in Cheliax. The place has a certain uniqueness to it, and we have art of people who apparently consort with pit fiends on a semi-regular basis which caught me off guard a bit the first time I saw it. I was like "Wow, you would need a gate spell to get a pit fiend to your side. These people aren't kidding around". It was a bit odd that they had a pit fiend and succubus in the same art though. Oh well, evil casters are evil casters I suppose. I still can't recall the last time a setting got in an argument with the rules though. Generally most settings tend to let you know up front what is different from them and the rules.
ciretose wrote: How does that even happen? That's like asking "When the conflict arises between what should happen on earth and what is permitted by the laws of physics, who wins?" The premise of the question doesn't make sense to me. Can you give me concrete examples? I mean, all I can think of is if the GM decided to, say, make a setting where divine magic doesn't exist but then failed to houserule a ban on divine casters or establish unavailability of divine magic items. But then that's just an example of a GM's utter ineptitude artificially creating a conflict that shouldn't have existed in the first place. So surely that's not what you're talking about. So what are you talking about?
ciretose wrote:
I get it this isn't a philosophical debate on rules interactions with setting but your beef with Ashiel. You can ignore my posts. I can see stories where Ashiel's abuse would be no problem but I can see stories where the abuse can be problematic. If Ashiel played at my table I will make it clear which type of story I intend to GM for and ask him to play nicely.
Interesting. It seems those who think the setting serves the rules don't even notice that they do so. Think about it this way: The rules are an abstraction. An approximation of how the game world works. They are necessarily incomplete and probably wrong in detail. They are also focused on things important to adventurers and much less on the rest of the world. The rules, at least in my settings, are not actually the laws of physics. They are close enough for most things I need them for.
Gignere wrote: No, it is a philosophical debate on rules. Ashiel I feel is a strong advocate of the "RAW is the setting" side of the debate. I'm a strong advocate of if the rules make no sense in the setting, sense overules until you can get the devs to fix it.
Yes, ciretose. I think this is actually an interesting question, and I'd rather not see it dragged down into a flame war quite yet. Can you find examples other than Ashiel's?
thejeff wrote:
I agree 100% and I think this is the divide. If a player can manipulate a rule to do something completely absurd, they aren't going to be allowed to do it just because the rules didn't plan for every contingency. The GM is the final arbitor specifically because the rules can't plan for every contingency. And where the rules either don't cover the issue at hand, or just don't make sense, it is the job of the GM to keep the game moving smoothly.
ciretose wrote:
However, RAW does have a heavy impact on setting, like the example above even something as subtle as how character creation is laid out can have an impact on the setting of the game. So how can RAW not impact setting? If certain rules breaks verisimilitude in your game than you ask the player to not do such. It is impossible to say setting trumps RAW in all case because some of RAW basically helps define the setting. Imagine if the RAW on the spell section were gone. You are basically playing a no magic game, whether you want to or not.
Jiggy wrote: I guess I don't know what this whole "bound genies issue" is. One of the many ways people have proposed you can capture/create Genies and force wishes at no risk. But thejeff is correct, it isn't about a specific ruling, it is about a mindset. Do you approach the game from the starting point that if the rules allow it, that overules the...for lack of a better word, physics of the setting, or as thejeff put it are the rules the best appoximation of the physics of the setting, and therefore if a technicality in the rules don't match the "physics" you go with the logic of the setting.
ciretose wrote: Where are the Genie Binding stores in Golarian? I haven't seen them mentioned? And if they were prevelent it seems odd the published attributes are so low... My guess is where casters capable of providing such services are? I'd imagine Cheliax would be a pretty likely bet. I mean, they got pit fiends, an efreeti would bit nothing and would fit the lawful evil nature of them well. I mean Cheliax is Lawful Evil and likes slaves, Efreeti are Lawful Evil and like slaves. One has the power to call 'em up, one has some power to give. Seems like they would fit in very well there. As for the statistics of NPCs published in adventures, well y'know everyone has their idea as to what is right and good to stat up. Some stuff in adventures are quite weak, some quite powerful, and everyone does things a little differently. On a side note, I couldn't imagine it being that appealing to NPCs from a perspective of spellcasting services. Junk is expensive. Generally you get way more love out of a few cheap magic items or a lil' buff. More bang for your buck if you will. But hey, if you've got someone who has ready access to such things on the cheap, sure, knock yourself out. Quote: If the rules seem to allow something that seems inconsistent with the setting, which one wins. It depends. Inconsistent with the setting is pretty rare usually. One could say anything above 11th level is pretty inconsistent with Eberron for example (the most inconsistent thing is actually in the campaign setting itself, where it clearly notes the barren condition of characters above 10th level at the start of the campaign, yet they got magic items requiring caster levels higher than 10th all over the place before Pathfinder fixed that problem). I find Pathfinder meshes pretty nicely with most settings. I myself prefer a fairly realistic (I know, realism in fantasy, yuck) scale in my fantasy worlds. I like for normal people to die from normal things, do normal stuff, and live normal lives. I'm not big on the idea that you average bartender is a 5th level character, or that your typical homeless beggar or prostitute is a 2nd level PC-classed character with heroic stats. Not my bag baby. I like that Pathfinder allows us to have most magic item creationists be reasonably leveled adepts and other mild classes. One of my fondest moments as a GM that I recall from recent years was when my players entered the local alchemist shop in a small village and were greeted by a rather tomboyish potion maker and alchemist with half-singed hair and a dirty apron and patches all over her clothing. Had a blast roleplaying the scene, players loved the NPC, and then they bought some potions at the rates and availability expected and then they went off. Came back for her help later when they found something they weren't sure what to do about (if memory serves I think some evil necromancer had plagued them with a clutch of plague zombie bats or somesuch and they were trying to see if he had any medicinal solutions). Good times.
And yet, because of the interaction of a setting picture and the rules, your Cheliax must be full of 17th level casters.
Gignere wrote:
I think this is what some believe, it is what I believe, but other don't and that is the divide. I am honestly not trying to assign "Wrongbadfun" to this, as I have no doubt that that side of divide do enjoy the way that they play. Theorycraft in and of itself is really enjoyable to people who are into that kind of stuff. The question is when you sit down at the table are you trying to create a setting to conform to the rules, or are you more interested in having the rules be an outline for how to accomplish things in the setting. For example, I think some spells are written in a vague way in order to allow options for stories. To allow that something "could" happen so a story "could" occur. However I don't think they were intended to be written so that it was the norm, as following the possible applications out via what I would can manipulation and someone else would call "intelligent play" completely changes how the setting would logically work. So which is paramount. Assuring the logic of the setting stays consistent, or having the rules define what the setting is. Which informs which.
thejeff wrote: And yet, because of the interaction of a setting picture and the rules, your Cheliax must be full of 17th level casters. And this is the divide. Is it the GMs role to maintain the integrity of the setting, or simply to act as a referee calling balls and strikes. Should technicalities be allowed.
Ashiel wrote: Save that you're ignoring the cultural bias to enslaving devils. That's what makes Cheliax different from Qadira, which is the far more logical place to shop for enslaved genies. (it's even highlighted that way in the Inner Sea World Guide) But these are just ingredients for a story. It's one thing to talk about genie binders. But it's when you use them in a story that things like consequences put into play. (Such as the occasional genie breaking loose of it's confines and causing absolute havoc, also described in the guides) Risk is an inherent part of storytelling. Without risks and things going wrong, you have no story. Eberron, Golarion, Greyhawk,the Forgotten Realms, Krynn, all of these are worlds chock full of things gone wrong... that's what makes them story vehicles.
I know I'm late to the party on this whole genie binding thing, but it sounds like one person (Ashiel? Someone else?) said "doing X is possible, therefore there's probably someone somewhere doing X" and then ciretose and possibly others are claiming that Ashiel or whoever instead said "doing X is possible, therefore I can find the product of X at any corner shop". Did I get that about right?
I'm also kind of curious why a spellcaster capable of summoning and binding efreets capable of granting wishes is bothering to sell regular spellcasting services rather than putting those wishes to use for himself. But then, the rules say, X level spell is available in cities of Y size for Z price. So, he doesn't have any choice. Or at least, someone will have to do it.
ciretose wrote:
Ok I think you need to split this discussion into rules that makes the engine of the game, and exception rules that are not crucial to the game's engine. Because character creation, leveling, skill checks, attack/damage rolls and magic casting rules definitely controls the settings more than the opposite. Because without these or changes to these engine rules will have great impact on how the group plays. Additional exception rules like from spells and/or feats are the opposite the setting should define which of these should be allowed and followed.
ciretose wrote: But if you have a conflict where the rules and the setting depart (which happens frequently) which one holds higher value at your table. If a house rule needs to be made, I have no qualms with doing so. But that house rule still should (ideally) have been made before the campaign even began, if I intended it to be part of the setting in the first place. I haven't the foggiest idea how you would classify that in terms of one serving the other.
Jiggy wrote:
I'll link to it, but I don't want this to become the discussion. It is illustrative of the divide, but it is in my opinion an extreme example that may or may not be rules legal but definately would not be allowed in any game I would go with 100 feet of. Now, that being said, if a player approaches you with a rule that when applied to the specific situation makes no logical or rational sense, which happens on occasion, do you go with the rule or common sense. I go with common sense then come to the board to check for an FAQ or errata.
Gignere wrote: Even in character creation, do you have an expectation that your players create characters that are logically consistent with the setting? The expectation that they are logically consistent with the rules allows grey area on things like traits that require certain history or background. On skill checks, how do you adjudicate what skills do or don't do? How much goes to the GM's view of how the NPC would act and how much goes to allowing wide leeway on skills to over-rule logical NPC actions.
For me rules generally rules are to serve setting, not the other way around - when rule does not make a sense in particular setting I just drop the rule. If it would be problematic to drop single rule (because it is too much intertwined with other rules) I just pick another game mechanics to support the setting. The fact that rules allow for something mechanically does not mean that it is actually done. Not every race, class, archetype, spell, magic item have to exist in each and every setting. Spoiler:
That was one of the offenses of D&D 4th edition - they attempted to introduce all their creations to all their settings which messsed up with certain parts of Forgotten Realms and Dark Sun, but it is matter for another discussion. Unlike some of the folks here on boards I am used to playing different systems, however, so it is natural to me to pick system to suit the world I want to play in or to tweak it to my needs.
Jiggy wrote:
That's how this sort of thing usually goes. TheJeff wrote: And yet, because of the interaction of a setting picture and the rules, your Cheliax must be full of 17th level casters. Well, not necessarily. I'll give it the benefit of the doubt. Pathfinder as a system did a lot to allow the possibility of certain high level magics to be used without high level casters. The most strait forward explanation is there is at least one 17th level caster who can bring such a creature across the divide. Alternatively, you might have had some lower level casters create a magic item and raised the DC to craft said item using the item creation rules, and then they used that magic item (perhaps some sort of profane book or text) that when used calls forth the Pit Fiend. There's a lot of nice little ways you could do it in Pathfinder. I suppose it depends on what sort of game you wish to run within the setting. Some people insist to me that Golarion really is just crawling with super high level people and that your average bartender is a 5th level character and your average prostitute is a 2nd level heroic classed NPC with heroic ability scores as is the case in the Gamemastering Guide NPC gallery. That's not really the sort of Golarion I'd like to run (or any world for that matter) so I suppose I would change it a little bit. LazarX wrote: Save that you're ignoring the cultural bias to enslaving devils. That's what makes Cheliax different from Qadira, which is the far more logical place to shop for enslaved genies. (it's even highlighted that way in the Inner Sea World Guide) Hey calm down a sec fanboy. I didn't say that they would enslave the genie I said they'd get along with the genie pretty well. I'm sure there are places that might be even more likely, sure. I just know that at least Cheliax would be big and powerful enough to have some folks capable of being able to arrange such a meeting for a fee with some regularity. Also, forgive me, but I'm no expert on Golarion lore and don't claim to be. Like I said before, I run some Golarion when I'm running adventure Paths, and I have the original Golarion campaign setting book, but I don't have the latest copy (the Inner Sea World Guide). It's something I'd like to get but money doesn't grow on trees and I haven't found an opportunity to buy it (and I've been busy with my own setting as well). Honestly I never said anything about an enslaved genie anyway. I just said somewhere you could could get access to some efreeti. I'm actually not really into enslaving people I want to work with, and I doubt efreeti would be interested in being someone's slave (they're more the slavers than the slavees as best as I can see). Quote:
Absolutely. This goes without saying, but you're preaching to the choir buddy.
Since this is posted as a "survey" rather than a "debate", I'll state my personal preference as: "The rules serve the setting." As for a concrete example as Jiggy asks for, consider the Bard spell "Gallant Inspiration". According to RAW, you can cast it anytime anyone fails a save. In tonight's game, the party will be stepping into accursed lands, and all of them will have to make Will saves to avoid certain effects. According to RAW, if anyone fails their save, the Bard can cast Gallant Inspiration and help them succeed. However, as GM, since this is an overall miasma with no visible effect, I am going to rule that the bard cannot possibly perceive who is affected and who isn't, and so cannot cast Gallant Inspiration on his affected fellow party members. (Yes, I'll allow him to cast Gallant Inspiration on himself, since he'll feel himself being affected.) So I'm trumping RAW in favor of storytelling and 'realism'. Is that a satisfactory example?
Here's an example of rules abstraction/game world divide that I don't think is actual flamebait: In the course of a combat round, do characters actually act in sequence, one taking his whole action before the next moves, or do they all act essentially at once, some slightly faster than others? Alternate version of the same question: How long does it take a character with 30' movement to charge 60' and swing at an enemy? IMO, the rules break the round up into discrete actions so that we can handle them. The characters would not see themselves as standing around waiting while other people moved. Yet a "laws of physics" view would have to say that's exactly what they do. Maybe reacting if they get an AoO or immediate action, but otherwise standing motionless waiting for their turn As for how long it takes: Common sense and my view is that it takes him just about 6 seconds. A laws of physics approach says it depends on how many people in the fight. A round always takes 6 seconds. Everyone acts in sequence. If it's a one-on-one fight, he can charge and swing in 3 seconds. If there are 12 people involved he can cover the same distance and attack in a half a second.
NobodysHome wrote:
Great example. The antagonize debate was another one.
ciretose wrote: Now, that being said, if a player approaches you with a rule that when applied to the specific situation makes no logical or rational sense, which happens on occasion, do you go with the rule or common sense. Here's a fun question. Well, first, I ask him or her what they're trying to achieve (maybe there's a less strange way to go about it). Honesty is always a good bet with me. Then assess it, see if it really warrants a house rule, and try to work together to come to a mutual happiness, and if a rule is just at its core bizarre we might be able to come up with something less bizarre that serves a similar purpose. Here's an example. Once I had a player who found that in 3.x you could revive someone by beginning to drown them. This is...kind of a bizarre rule, and likely not something that was intended ("Oh he's at -3 Hp, drowning makes his HP become 0 HP, we cured him!") but in this players' mind it sort of made sense to him in a "A sudden shock to the system to get them to spring back!" sort of way. I wasn't really as convinced. I asked him honestly, "Why do you want to do this? Is it because you think it's funny and you wanted to try it?" I asked, because it was indeed pretty funny. I mean, I got a grin out of it. Turns out he wanted a good way to rescue his friends, and he thought this was more reliable than him biffing a heal check (this was in 3.x, and Heal was a cross-class skill for him, so it would be many levels before he could reliably give first aid). I nodded, thought about it for a bit and said "What about, instead of drowning the poor sod to heal him, we cook you up a magical healer's kit that automatically stabilizes the patient as if it had used cure minor wounds on them?" and he liked that idea. I even joked and said that if he really just wanted to splash people with water we could flavor it as a bucket or something. He was happy with the magic healer's kit, and felt gratified for his investment each time he rescued a downed ally with his little kit. I looked at it. Evaluated it. Realized there was no harm here, and went along. I've changed rules before as needed. I adjusted wish in 3.5 as well because of some broken interactions with it in the rules (if wish worked in Pathfinder like it did in 3.5 then you'd never, ever, eeeeeeveeeeeer be able to defeat a Pit Fiend). It had some stuff that was too much. I talked it over with my group and we fixed it.
This supposed divide you speak of is a false dilemma. Rules and settings aren't servants of each other. They must, by inherent purpose, work symbiotically with each other or they don't work at all. Specifically in Pathfinder the core rulebook is a mechanical worktable to appropriate mutual arbitration of supposed "physics." Any setting, once it is connected to a set of "physics," must then conform to those "physics." The only place these two could ever possibly separate from one another is if something in the setting went blatantly against the rules. If the setting said a magic-user pulled the moon out of its orbit, and nowhere in the mechanical "physics" was there an approximation or set of rules to define how that would happen, you would have a breach. Filling up a vast land with 17th level casters doesn't discount the rules, it proves them true. Can Cheliax be created using the rules? Yes. Does that fit with your personal idea of what Cheliax should look like? Perhaps not, but it doesn't change the fact that the setting and the rules continue to work symbiotically.
ciretose wrote:
I see traits more in line with feats, as rules exception instead of the engine rules. Skill checks is interesting for PF because it is so simplistic as compared to combat. Because of this it leaves wide leeway for both GM interpretation and player abuse. I have played in games that actually spell out what happens to NPCs or even other PCs depending on the level of your success. It works in those games because the rules accomodate it. Since the players and GMs going in expecting skills to totally change the outcome of a social challenge there are no damn that is breaking my game. They have stuff like if you hit a certain difficult or number of successes or margin of success, or actually engage in a duel of wits, you can literally convince a loving mother to kill their child, it is highly unlikely but still possible. Does it break verisimilitude in those games that allow it, no it doesn't because there is an expectation of skills having major impact. Does it break verisimilitude in PF yes, because skills are added in like an afterthought.
MendedWall12 wrote: This supposed divide you speak of is a false dilemma. Rules and settings aren't servants of each other. They must, by inherent purpose, work symbiotically with each other or they don't work at all. Specifically in Pathfinder the core rulebook is a mechanical worktable to appropriate mutual arbitration of supposed "physics." Any setting, once it is connected to a set of "physics," must then conform to those "physics." The only place these two could ever possibly separate from one another is if something in the setting went blatantly against the rules. If the setting said a magic-user pulled the moon out of its orbit, and nowhere in the mechanical "physics" was there an approximation or set of rules to define how that would happen, you would have a breach. Filling up a vast land with 17th level casters doesn't discount the rules, it proves them true. Can Cheliax be created using the rules? Yes. Does that fit with your personal idea of what Cheliax should look like? Perhaps not, but it doesn't change the fact that the setting and the rules continue to work symbiotically. How about if the Setting books state that Cheliax isn't full of 17th level casters, but other details imply that it would have to be by the rules?
Do they? Conceptually, as I understand it Cheliax was the result of one house allying with devils to win a civil war. This actually doesn't require a vast land of 17th level casters to occur. It is a trope that could occur any number of way, based on the classic soul contract stuff I assume the setting was based on. In my opinion, the setting, or at least the tropes, came first. Then the rules were written to allow the tropes to occur, while at the same time creating some logical sense to the whole thing. In my opinion, the rules are an approximation of the world, written to facilitate the setting. Not the other way around.
NobodysHome wrote:
I find that usually if someone thinks they need to "trump RAW" as you put it (or alternatively, when they think "RAW" needs to "trump" something else), one or both parties has misread or misunderstood something in the rules and thereby accidentally fabricated a conflict that doesn't actually exist. Gallant Inspiration wrote: Cast this spell when a creature fails an attack roll or skill check. Oh look, I was right. ;)
TriOmegaZero wrote: Eh? TheJeff wrote: How about if the Setting books state that Cheliax isn't full of 17th level casters, but other details imply that it would have to be by the rules? I can't answer for him, but a very similar thing crops up in the Eberron Campaign Setting actually. The book pretty much says "There aren't any people above 10th level and there are airships". So later you look at the airships in the book and they require you to be like 12th level to create them. So we have a paradox. Now that irks the crap out of me (partially from a writing standpoint but also 'cause I like there to be consistency in things). Now in Pathfinder this wouldn't be a big deal. The creator would just have to hit DC X to craft it despite lacking the caster level and/or spells of the item, but in 3.x you just flat out could not craft this item if you were below 12th level! So, you have to make a choice. Either lower the requirements or assume that there are indeed greater than 10th level characters and that they apparently spend their time making magical airship engines by not-evilly enslaving elementals (yes, that too is probably a paradox) or make up a way that they can do it anyway. In theory any of these methods can work. However, not addressing it a little bit can impact the verisimilitude of the world. I like consistency, so my natural impulse would be to come up with an alternate way to meet the requirements (perhaps a feat or option to allow multiple craftsmen to work together in a sort of aid-another fashion).
ciretose wrote:
Of course, the problem with that argument is that the rules largely came first. What it seems like to me is that the setting and tropes were written separately, then combined with the rules, not always fitting perfectly.That's not quite true either, since the D&D rules were obviously in mind when Golarion was invented, but I do think the basic nation descriptions were written largely independent of the rules. "We'll have devil worshippers down here and an undead mage over here, not-Vikings here and not-Egyptians there." etc. Figuring out what the mechanics would be for a nation of devil worshippers would be came later if at all. Or an area ruled only by kings capable of soloing linnorms for that matter. It's a cool concept, run with it.


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The UN Under-Secretary -General for Humanitarian Affairs, Sir John Holmes, who is on an official visit to Sri Lanka from 17th to 19th November 2009 called on Foreign Minister Rohitha Bogollagama on 18th November 2009 at the Ministry.
During the discussions, Foreign Minister Bogollagama outlined the resettlement process and demining activities which had taken place so far and highlighted the fact that the number of IDPs was declining on a daily basis due to the rapid pace of the resettlement process. Foreign Minister Bogollagama requested Sir John Holmes to consider providing more assistance in the areas of demining, infrastructure development and livelihood enhancement for the IDPs who were recently resettled and added that there was room for further movement out of the welfare villages in the coming days.
Responding to Foreign Minister Bogollagama, Sir John Holmes, who is in Sri Lanka on the invitation of the Foreign Minister, stated that he was pleased to be in Sri Lanka again under "more positive circumstances". The UN Under –Secretary- General for Humanitarian Affairs also stated that he was "encouraged" by the fact that people were "adjusting to peace". Sir John Holmes, who had, on 17th November visited Jaffna, Vavuniya, Mannar and areas related to the IDPs including resettlement sites and locations where de-mining is taking place, appraised the Foreign Minister of the progress that he was able to observe since his previous visit.
During the discussions, Foreign Minister Bogollagama also explained the various measures taken by the Government to provide health care for those remaining in the welfare villages. He stated that over 1000 health care workers were still working in and around the welfare villages to attend to the needs of the remaining IDPs. The Foreign Minister also stated that the Government of Sri Lanka was paying special attention to the rehabilitation of ex-combatants and former child soldiers and that the efforts being taken to assist their gradual reintegration into society. Mr. Suhada Gamalath, Secretary, Ministry of Justice and Law Reforms elaborated on the legal process that was being followed in terms of the ex-combatants and former child soldiers. He said measures were underway to enhance their livelihood opportunities for the future.
Sir John Holmes also referred to the process of reconciliation and stated that it was an important opportunity for reconciliation in the post-conflict phase.
The Secretary, Ministry of Resettlement and Disaster Relief Services, Mr. U.L.M. Haldeen, Mr. Mohan Peiris, PC the Attorney General , Mr Romesh Jayasinghe, Secretary Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Senior Officials of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs as well as the UN Resident Representative Mr. Neil Buhne and Officials from the UN Country Team were also present during the discussions.
Sir John Holmes is also due to call on H.E. President Mahinda Rajapaksa, Hon. Mahinda Samarasinghe, Minister for Disaster Management and Human Rights, Hon. Basil Rajapaksa, Senior Advisor to the President and Mr. Gotabaya Rajapaksa, Secretary, Ministry of Defence, Public Security, Law and Order on 19th November 2009.
Ministry of Foreign Affairs
18th November 2009