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As predicted, the Supreme Court has agreed to hear Microsoft's case on transnational patent law:
« Accelerated Examination: PTO Training Session | Main | Evidence Based Prosecution: Non-Patent Prior Art Leads to Rejections »
You can follow this conversation by subscribing to the comment feed for this post.
Here is the issue: In copying US patent protected software overseas, the Federal Circuit held that foreign "reassembling" of software code made in the US in violation of 35 US 271(f). Others believe that foreign copying of US software is not a "reassembly" of US patent protected software.
Here is a summary of the prior comments from the above link:
1. US patent law should prevent foreign copies of US patented software code developed in the US, since real work and expense takes place in U.S. -- Tom
2. Patent law is a territorial concept and make[, use, and sell] needs to occur with in U.S. territory to violate U.S. law -- Milind
3. US patent law should not retard innovation by protecting any software since all software ideas are necessarily both derivative and novel like spoken human speech. Copyright law is sufficient to protect software. Makes interesting point that defendant Microsoft wants to lose case in US to accomplish what it couldn't in Europe (e.g., protect Microsoft software in Europe). -- Software V.
4. Internet selling in the US of US patent protected software manufactured overseas is a problem and preventing foreign manufacture of US patent protected software will address this problem. -- Alan
5. Foreign copying of US patent protected software code is similar to foreign copying of US patent protected seeds, plants, mice, and other self-reproducing articles. -- Andy
6. If US patent law prohibits foreign manufacture of US patent protected software, then we are headed down a slippery slope. One day, merely thinking about represented patented software technology in the US will result in a lawsuit. -- Software V.
7. I disagree that Microsoft wants to lose case -- Tom
8. If US patent law does not prohibit foreign manufacture of US patent protected software, US will go the way of France - a fourth rate player politically and economically in global playpen. Includes detailed advertisement for Professional Inventors Alliance USA -- Ron
9. Patents on the whole should be abolished since they only benefit con artists, extortionists, and lawyers. -- Chris
10. Queries on how to protect against elements of a software patent claim being manufactured in separate parts of the world. -- Alan G.
11. I disagree with some assertions made here. -- globaliable
12. There are no examples of a software patent that has promoted innovation and the development of the arts and sciences. -- President L
13. Independent inventors not working for large corporations produce more significant patents than inventors who work for corporations. Large corporate patent pirates always brutalize inventors who produce significant inventions virtually. -- Ron
14. As used in 35 USC 271(f), component only applies to product claims and not article claims. Thus, the Federal Circuit was wrong to apply 35 USC 271(f) to US patent protected software apparatus claims. See http://www.patentbaristas.com/archives/000423.php -- David
15. Big companies wield their patents against each other. -- Software V.
16. Independent software developers do not have the resources to read through 100,000's of software patents to ensure they not infringing which hinders innovation rather than fostering it thereby invalidating the reason for software patents in the first place. -- Jan H.
17. While big corporation battles it out, small innovative high-tech startups and independent inventors wait on the sidelines and will eventually be wronged by the outcome. -- small i
18. Just let the system work. -- Tony
19. I disagree with Jan H on some points. -- small i
20. Agrees with Alan (who Queries on how to protect against elements of a software patent claim being manufactured in separate parts of the world) and points out the even more serious problem where the foreign manufacture takes place in unowned territories (e.g., the South pole, on the high seas, the moon) -- small i
21. Corporations populated by voluntary members of different Borgs are scared of those who want to retain their individuality and pursue their own goals, building their own inventions and creating their own businesses. -- Tom
Applying US patent law to foreign sales of software will drive software development for world markets out of the US.
Judges like to pontificate about natural consequences but have a remarkably poor record of understanding the natural consequences of their own decisions.
The comments to this entry are closed.


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Photos: Romo's future replacement? A look at 10 of the top QBs in NFL Draft
Published: 10 February 2013 09:34 PM
Updated: 12 February 2013 01:52 AM
Photos: From HS yearbook photos to starting for the Cowboys — a look back at Tony Romo's career
Mock draft roundup: Cowboys' draft projections riddled with SEC linemen
Gosselin: 'If you extend Tony Romo, your whole focal point this offseason is the offensive line'
Breaking Down the 'Boys: Who are the Cowboys' most likely targets at 18?
Cowlishaw: Tony Romo being one of the most hated athletes is a joke
Donovan Lewis: Cowboys' Tony Romo is hated for a simple reason
Photos: How much is Tony Romo worth? A look at 10 of the richest quarterback contracts in the NFL
Todd McShay: Mizzou DT Sheldon Richardson 'perfect fit' for Cowboys
Sabin: Why drafting a quarterback is 'harder to rationalize' after Cowboys hired Monte Kiffin
Did you see something wrong in this story, or something missing? Let us know.
- Stephen Jones: This Dallas Cowboys season 'is the beginning of something special'
- Of gloves, Cowboys QB Tony Romo and former coach Bill Parcells
- Cowboys LB Sean Lee on team's December woes: "We need to win…We haven't gotten it done."
- If Tony Romo is technically sound, he can turn bad weather into an advantage for the Dallas Cowboys
- Dallas Cowboys CB Morris Claiborne, WR Dwayne Harris remain sidelined with hamstring injuries
Listen live to 1310 The Ticket radio station. Fast forward, pause and rewind up to 20 minutes and read up-to-the-minute news on your favorite teams.

subset: commoncrawl


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you are viewing a single comment's thread.
I usually do mine wed. but monday is working out good too. I haven't done a Sunday line up yet. I guess like Boss Hog and boys I like at least a night to let the last race go an emotions to pass. LoL.MoToR


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50 experts and 171 advocates oppose the HHS/IOM Contract to re-define ME/CFS.
Check out our IOM Contract Forum for the latest news and to join the campaign.
Demonstrations in San Francisco Dec 9th and Washington D.C. Dec 10th
The fifth and final article in a series attempting to explain the science behind fairly common topics and exploring how they relate to ME/CFS. This time the topic is the nervous system – by Andrew Gladman.
Discuss the article on the Forums.
Earning money through Ebay
Discussion in 'Finances, Work, and Disability' started by taniaaust1, Jun 23, 2012.


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Mount Baldy Temporarily Closed
Mount Baldy is temporarily closed untill further notice.
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Did You Know?
Cowles Bog is not a true bog but rather a fen because it has an underground water source. This water source has contact with limestone bedrock, making the fen's water slightly alkaline. Indiana Dunes National Lakeshore is restoring a portion of this fen.


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0407 314 002
Perfectly placed in Seaholme's most highly desired court location is this secluded 4 bedroom weatherboard home with an abundance of seaside character. Ideally suited to those who embrace urban bayside living, but seek the warmth and comfort on offer from this spacious family home. Set on a generous 800 sqm (approx.) allotment and featuring an oversized true entertainers rear deck area, this property presents a multitude of future options. One can simply move in and enjoy, further renovate into... More


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Government Works to Showcase Its Brain Fingerprinting Technology at Renowned Polygraph Conference
Government Works to showcase its Brain Fingerprinting Technology at renowned Polygraph Conference at 48th Annual APA Seminar & Workshop at Hilton Orlando Bonnet Creek, Orlando, Florida which will take place on - September 8-13, 2013.
MA (I-Newswire) August 19, 2013 - Government Works, Inc, provider of revolutionary Brain Fingerprinting Technology, an established science that quickly detects concealed information by measuring brain waves, will exhibit newer version of its patented product at the , 48th Annual APA Seminar & Workshop at Hilton Orlando Bonnet Creek, Orlando, Florida which will take place on - September 8-13, 2013.
In addition to introducing this newer version of the product, the company will conduct a live demonstration of the system for all interested attendees. Brain Fingerprinting Technology version 2.1 is the newest version of this game-changing and patented scientific tool that quickly unveils concealed information by measuring brain waves.. The onsite demonstration and presentation will be conducted by Richard Keifer - who has over twenty years of experience in the security industry and has been the FBI National Polygraph Program Coordinator as well as FBI HQ Polygraph Supervisor.
The newer version of the Product comes in a portable carry on pelican case and includes a laptop, wireless EEG headset and a portable monitor. It is an out of the box system that is ready to plug and test any suspect at any location.
"We look forward to introducing our new version of Brain Fingerprinting Technology application to attendees of the 48th Annual APA Seminar & Workshop," said Krishna Ika, Founder and President of Government Works, Inc. "We are thrilled to offer this advanced user friendly interface for Version 2.1. We have improvised the systems robustness and added features that help investigators test suspect using crime-related images, words, phrases, audio and videos (stimuli). Our goal in focusing on security and investigations market segment is to provide affordable and accurate scientific solution to address the needs of law enforcement officials and counter terrorism agencies throughout the world."
About Government Works, Inc.
Government Works is a Federal Contractor and provider of innovative, comprehensive, cutting edge, mission critical solutions to various defense and civilian agencies in the US. Headquartered in Southborough, Massachusetts, the company offers its patented Brain Fingerprinting Technology with applications in National Security and Counter-terrorism to law enforcement agencies worldwide.
About Government Works, Inc.
Government Works (GWI)-a thought leader at the forefront of emerging and sophisticated technology - More..is pleased to offer Brain Fingerprinting as part of its suite of products.
This proven and scientific solution measures and reads the brain's involuntary electrical activity in response to a subject being shown images relating to a crime. It has been tested at the FBI, the CIA and the US Navy. We encourage your interest and inquiries.Less..
Contact Information
Government Works, Inc.
Kajal Pendse
257 Turnpike Road
Phone : 7747601600
Published On:
August 19, 2013Print Release:
Print ReleaseIf you have questions regarding information in this press release contact the company listed above. I-Newswire.com is a press release service and not the author of this press release.The information that is on or available through this site is for informational purposes only and speaks only as of the particular date or dates of that information. As some companies and PR Agencies submit their press releases once per week,month or quarter, make sure to check the official company website for accurate release dates as our site displays the I-Newswire.com press release distribution date only.We do not guarantee the accuracy or completeness of information on or available through this site, and we are not responsible for or omissions in that information or for actions taken in reliance on that information.
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Thought Bubbles
New profile decor and siggy for July
July 2 at 9:48 AM
Cafe AmyB Love it. July 2 at 12:24 PM
earthangel1967 Awww thanks Amy! : ) I have so much fun redecorating cafemom profile page and siggy for each new month. : ) LOVEEE cafemom! : ) July 2 at 12:40 PM
Check out these interesting topics from all over CafeMom:
- Toddler Tips: Advice That'll Save Your Sanity
- Maximizing Playtime: Help Make Their Fun More Enriching
- Best Baby Advice: Get Tips & Support From Other Moms
- Holiday Traditions: Make the Season More Special


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Runtime: 2m5s
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Feature Trailer
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Plastic Planet
Feature Trailer
The feature trailer for Plastic Planet. We live in the Age of Plastic. Its cheap and practical, and its everywhere even in our blood. But is it a danger to us?
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Director: Werner Boote
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COMMERCIAL DESCRIPTION Bottle and can: Pasteurised. Ingredients: Pale, chocolate and crystal malts; English Fuggles and Styrian Goldings hops. Hobgoblin is a powerful full-bodied copper red, well-balanced brew. Strong in roasted malt with a moderate hoppy bitterness and slight fruity character that lasts through to the end. Michael Jackson 500 Classic Brews
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Audi: B&B Tunes Up 2012 Audi RS3 to 510 Horsepower - 2012 B&B Audi RS3 side view
What we have here is the image of 2012 B&B Audi RS3 side view, featured under B&B Tunes Up 2012 Audi RS3 to 510 Horsepower subject as well as related to our Audi topic. Uploaded by Tom in August 18, 2011, the image above is originally sized in 890*593 pixels as well as you can download it for free. Check out the "Image Full Size" button on the image above to see its original size.
On the other hand, if you missed the entire article regarding the image above, we recommend you to check the news we posted at front, do so by clicking this link : B&B Tunes Up 2012 Audi RS3 to 510 Horsepower.
Moreover, the 2012 B&B Audi RS3 side view featured at above was labeled in several automotive terms such as Just before you making the next step, please spread out your thoughts about the "2012 B&B Audi RS3 side view" pictured at above or the article "B&B Tunes Up 2012 Audi RS3 to 510 Horsepower" through comment box at below, we really love to hear that.


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- Friday 13 December 2013
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Six arrests after alcohol-fuelled fight on Uluru
27 December 2012 07:50 PM
On Boxing Day, like every other day of the year, the tourists descended on Uluru, the great sandstone monolith formerly known as Ayers Rock, photographing it and ascending its steep slopes, despite polite signs asking them not to climb it.
Queensland: Deadly snakes hatch in wardrobe
21 December 2012 07:09 PM
As three-year-old Kyle Cumming slept peacefully in his Queensland home, a clutch of wild eggs he had discovered in his backyard were incubating in his wardrobe.
'Scandal' exposed as plot to weaken Australian PM
12 December 2012 07:21 PM
A tumultuous year in Australian politics has ended with a court ruling that senior opposition figures conspired with a former political staffer to undermine Julia Gillard's minority Labor government by bringing sexual harassment charges against the then parliamentary Speaker, Peter Slipper.
2Day FM - the radio station where a former host claims she was paid $50 whenever she made a listener cry
10 December 2012 06:58 PM
A radio landscape where outrageous stunts are encouraged in the endless quest for ratings
Australian radio presenters express sorrow over nurse's apparent suicide following prank tragedy
10 December 2012 06:55 PM
Hospital spokesman queries if station sought to make contact before broadcast
Prank-call DJs are 'ready to speak out' over death of nurse
09 December 2012 09:00 PM
Intensive counselling for presenters who hoaxed nurse later found dead
'Shattered' DJs in hiding as bosses say hoax was not illegal
09 December 2012 12:00 AM
The two Sydney radio presenters who made a hoax call that apparently precipitated the suicide of a nurse at the London hospital treating the Duchess of Cambridge were holed up at an unknown location yesterday amid mounting public anger tempered by pleas from some quarters not to blame them.
Sketch: Leveson shows judge's discretion on jaunt Down Under
06 December 2012 11:00 PM
The arcane niceties of the tort of privacy would not normally pack the grand ballroom of Sydney's Shangri-La Hotel, but when the speaker is a man who has just spent 17 months dissecting the ethics of the British press, a large turn-out is assured.
Wombats hit by killer plants
02 December 2012 12:00 AM
Animals so sensitive they suck their thumbs if upset, suffer population crash
Bryce Courtenay: Advertising executive who went on to become a blockbuster author
01 December 2012 12:00 AM
He was known to exaggerate. 'I take a fact, put a top hat on it, a silk shirt and a bow tie,' he said
- 1 French café starts charging extra to rude customers
- 2 Sun will 'flip upside down' within weeks, says Nasa
- 3 Australia incest case: Severely deformed children found in remote farming community after generations of inbreeding
- 4 Physicists discover 'clearest evidence yet' that the Universe is a hologram
- 5 Fox News presenter tells viewers it is a 'fact' that both Jesus and Santa Claus are white
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- May 23, 2013
- 4:42 p.m.
- Suggest removal
- Reply to this post
avenger9 writes:
in response to Cooper:
I like your idea, but it won't fix all of the DUIs. This guy wasn't even using alcohol (hydros and xanax), and I'd be willing to foot a guess that he didn't get them through a pharmacist. Your idea is a good start, though!
And you take the same approach with drugs. DUI with opiates, you can never legally possess or take those either.
Of course the best solution is 1 year mandatory 1st DUI and death penalty for subsequent conviction, but many will whine that is too harsh, but you won't have 7th offenses.
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'New Girl' Enlists Margo Martindale to Play Nick's Mom
The "Justified" Emmy winner will make an her debut in a March episode.
The Miller family is growing.
On the heels of an appearance from guest star Dennis Farina as Nick's dad, New Girl has settled on an actress to play his mother. The Hollywood Reporter confirms that Margo Martindale has landed the role, as first reported by EW.
PHOTOS: Up Close and Adorkable With the Cast of 'New Girl'
The March episode will find the roommates staging a pilgrimage to Nick's (Jake Johnson) homeland of Chicago, where they meet a very skeptical Mrs. Miller. Like his pony-loving, grifter dad, she doesn't seem to have it all together.
An Emmy winner for her work on Justified, Martindale recently joined FX's The Americans in a recurring role. She'll have an eight-episode arc in the freshman season playing Claudia, a liaison between the KGB and central spies Phillip (Matthew Rhys) and Elizabeth (Keri Russell). She'll also soon be seen in Beautiful Creatures, the film adaptation of August: Osage County and Showtime's Masters of Sex.
Martindale is repped by Gersh.
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Why a Dramedy Category Is Overdue
6:00 AM PDT 6/19/2012 by Matthew Carnahan
Chocolate in my peanut butter? Yes please, says "House of Lies' "Matthew Carnahan, who argues for a new category for unconventional comedy.
There are wild parrots in my yard. Seriously. They escape, get released by pet owners and form their own colonies in the L.A. Basin and beaches, begin breeding in the wild, live a long time and whap! There you have it, a new subspecies, the wild/domesticated L.A. parrot. Doesn't have a particularly sexy or correct ring to it, but they … exist.
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San Jose Holiday Parade goes dark
- Eli Segall
- Reporter- Silicon Valley Business Journal
The San Jose Holiday Parade has long been a tradition in the South Bay. Until this year.
It was started in 1981 and grew to be a live televised event with big-name sponsors that drew tens of thousands of people to downtown San Jose.
Now, the event is cancelled for the first time in decades.
The reasons? Dwindling city funds, and a lack of interest from private operators.
A story in this week's Silicon Valley/San Jose Business Journal looks at the parade, the economic impact of such cultural events, and why the parade went "dark."
It would have been held this year on Dec. 4, the first Sunday after the Thanksgiving holiday weekend.
Faced with a gaping budget deficit for the year starting July 1, 2010, Mayor Chuck Reed told city staff to outsource the operations of the parade.
Earlier this year, the city proposed that the would-be contractor finance and produce the entire event, all without a guarantee that City Hall would help pay the costs. A number of prospective operators reviewed the proposal, but not one submitted a bid.
One person who read it was Ray Pulver, owner of San Jose-based Upbeat Parade Productions. He helped run the parade in the 1990s as a city official.
City officials wanted a contractor to run the show, but he says they also wanted to stay involved and have some influence over the production.
The city, in its "request for interest" seeking an operator, said the contractor would "work closely with city staff to develop and implement talking points and communication strategies."
The city also said that the operator "shall be expected to produce, manage and fund all aspects of the parade," as well as recruit all volunteers and secure TV coverage.
Eli Segall covers finance, law, sports business and economic development at the Business Journal. His phone number is 408.299.1829.
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text:
Hope it's not bad news.
I'll be holding this for quite awhile so if it goes down I'll buy more. Not worried.
Sentiment: Strong Buy
I'm thinking no matter what, this will be about the low for it unless Europe's financial woes bring us back into recession, and even then the downside is limited.
When you own the silver and gold, there won't be any bad news. I am glad we have 25% of gold now. Diversification is a good thing.


text:
HOUSTON (KTRK) -- Houston police were called to a shop in northeast Houston, where they believed a robbery suspect had barricaded himself inside a shop.
SWAT teams were called to a business in the area of Normandy and I-10. According to police, the manager of a smoke shop saw three people trying to rob his store. That's when he reportedly got his own weapon out to try to fend off the would-be burglars.
Police say that manager says he saw two suspects get away, but he fired at a third person who they believed was barricaded inside the smoke shop. But after a couple of hours, they entered the business and discovered it empty.
The suspects who ran from the scene remain at large.
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Outdoors enthusiasts know the value of having a handheld GPS system with them on hikes and backcountry expeditions. Until now, the GPS technology has not involved other outdoor communities.
Magellan GPS introduced the Switch and Switch Up Fitness Series. With the ability to create nine different customizable profiles, Multi Sport Mode allows you can create what content you want to display for all of your different outdoors activities. If you are a runner you can have a running profile, then when you want to snow shoe, switch to your snow shoe profile.
With a sensitive GPS receiver, the Switch and Switch Up tracks your position while relaying time, distance, speed/pace, elevation and calories and has the feature to link to a heart rate monitor to track the heart rate. A feature of the Switch Up, called the Vibrate Motor, will vibrate when you hit goals that you set an alert for.
The Switch and Switch Up data can be uploaded to the Magellan Fitness website and can be transferred to other fitness websites allowing your data to be used how you want.
The Magellan Switch and Switch Up are priced from $250 and $350 and will be available in Spring 2012.
Tyler Tate is the owner and writer of T Squared Action Sports. Follow @TSquaredSports
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In the Media
Gulf of Mexico coast closed to shrimping
Anne Sewell
May 2, 2012 in
By Anne Sewell.
Two years after the BP oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico, shrimp and fish are turning up deformed and with lesions. Shrimping has now been halted.
had originally reported that the stoppage of shrimping was due to the deformities found in the fish caused by the oil spill and chemicals used to clean up the oil. Now they have
withdrawn their original story
"The closure is in response to routine shrimp sampling that indicated the average size were smaller than 68 head-on shrimp per pound. Meaning biologists found smaller than average shrimp in the waters causing the temporary closure. They will continue to take samples in these areas and determine any modifications to the closures."
Their original post on April 23 was titled: "Looming Crisis: Officials Close Gulf Waters to Shrimping as Reports of Deformed Seafood Intensify."
All waters in the Mississippi Sound and Mobile Bay, plus some areas of Little Lagoon, Wolf Bay and Bon Secour have been closed to shrimpers.
While the original story was withdrawn, the problems persist.
Problems began after BP's Deepwater Horizon oilrig exploded on April 20, 2010, releasing at least 4.9 million barrels of oil. The oil company then used around 1.9 million gallons of toxic Corexit dispersants to disperse the oil.
Reports have since been received of
grossly deformed seafood
all along the Gulf from the Florida panhandle through to Louisiana. However, Alabama is the first state to close waters to the seafood fishing industry.
Dr James Cowan
, with the Louisiana State University's Department of Oceanography and Coastal Sciences said in an interview with
Al Jazeera
, "The fishermen have never seen anything like this. And in my 20 years working on red snapper, looking at somewhere between 20 and 30,000 fish, I've never seen anything like this either."
Dr Cowan was also involved in the clean up of the Exxon Valdez oil spill.
Dr Cowan states that he first started hearing about fish with lesions and sores from fishermen in November 2010.
Al Jazeera also interviewed Tracy Kuhns and her husband Mike Roberts. The couple are commercial fishers in Barataria, Louisiana, and they have been finding eyeless shrimp.
They told the news service, while showing a sample of the eyeless shrimp, "At the height of the last white shrimp season, in September, one of our friends caught 400 pounds of these."
Kuhns stated that at least 50% of shrimp caught between 2010 and now in Barataria Bay are affected. The popular shrimping area was badly affected by BP's oil and the dispersant chemicals used.
Kuhns added: "Disturbingly, not only do the shrimp lack eyes, they even lack eye sockets."
She then stated, "Some shrimpers are catching these out in the open Gulf [of Mexico]. They are also catching them in Alabama and Mississippi. We are also finding eyeless crabs, crabs with their shells soft instead of hard, full grown crabs that are one-fifth their normal size, clawless crabs, and crabs with shells that don't have their usual spikes … they look like they've been burned off by chemicals."
Keath Ladner, another seafood processor in Hancock County, Mississippi, is also very disturbed by recent findings: "I've seen the brown shrimp catch drop by two-thirds, and so far the white shrimp have been wiped out. The shrimp are immune compromised. We are finding shrimp with tumors on their heads, and are seeing this everyday," he stated to Al Jazeera.
He further stated that he had seen shrimp with gill defects and "their shells missing around their gills and head".
"We've fished here all our lives and have never seen anything like this," he added.
Ladner said that he had also seen crates of blue crabs, all of which lacked at least one of their claws.
Al Jazeera also interviewed Darla Rooks, who has been fishing all her life in Port Sulfur, Louisiana.
In the interview she stated that she is finding crabs "with holes in their shells, shells with all the points burned off so all the spikes on their shells and claws are gone, misshapen shells, and crabs that are dying from within … they are still alive, but you open them up and they smell like they've been dead for a week".
Rooks has also reported finding shrimp with abnormal growths, without eyes, and female shrimp with their babies still attached. She has also seen shrimp with oiled gills: "We also seeing eyeless fish, and fish lacking even eye-sockets, and fish with lesions, fish without covers over their gills, and others with large pink masses hanging off their eyes and gills."
Rooks has grown up in the area, fishing with her parents, and says that she has never seen such things in these waters. She also states that the seafood catch last year was "ten per cent what it normally is".
The possible cause?
Dr Riki Ott
, who is a marine biologist and toxicologist told Al Jazeera: "The dispersants used in BP's draconian experiment contain solvents, such as petroleum distillates and 2-butoxyethanol. Solvents dissolve oil, grease, and rubber. It should be no surprise that solvents are also notoriously toxic to people, something the medical community has long known".
The dispersants used are well known to be mutagenic. This alarming fact can be seen in the current seafood deformities.
With shrimp having a very short life-cycle, two or three generations have existed since the BP disaster started, giving the chemicals sufficient time to enter the genome and cause the disturbing deformities that are now being seen.
A chemist and Macarthur Fellow,
Dr Wilma Subra
, says she has conducted tests on sediment samples and seafood along the gulf, testing for the chemicals from toxic dispersants and BP's crude oil. She told Al Jazeera: "Tests have shown significant levels of oil pollution in oysters and crabs along the Louisiana coastline. We have also found high levels of hydrocarbons in the soil and vegetation."
Dr Cowan with the Louisiana State University's Department of Oceanography and Coastal Sciences, quoted above, believes that chemicals called polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PHAs), which were released from BP's submerged oil, are most likely to blame for the results he is finding. He states that the fish with lesions are from a "a wide spatial distribution that is spatially coordinated with oil from the Deepwater Horizon, both surface oil and subsurface oil. A lot of the oil that impacted Louisiana was also in subsurface plumes, and we think there is a lot of it remaining on the seafloor".
He further stated: "The fish are being exposed to PAHs, and I was able to find several references that list the same symptoms in fish after the Exxon Valdez spill, as well as other lab experiments. There was also a paper published by some LSU scientists that PAH exposure has effects on the genome."
A survey was conducted by the University of South Florida, which released findings which were very similar to Cowan's. The found a 2-5% infection rate in the same oil impact areas with red snapper and more than 20 other species of fish with lesions. In their findings, in many locations 20% of the fish had lesions and in later expeditions they found an alarming 50% of fish had the lesions.
Dr Cowan states, "I asked a NOAA [National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration] sampler what percentage of fish they find with sores prior to 2010, and it's one tenth of one percent. Which is what we found prior to 2010 as well. But nothing like we've seen with these secondary infections and at this high of rate since the spill."
He continued: "What we think is that it's attributable to chronic exposure to PAHs released in the process of weathering of oil on the seafloor. There's no other thing we can use to explain this phenomenon. We've never seen anything like this before."
Al Jazeera contacted BP for a response. However, they refused to comment on the issue in a television interview, but did provide a statement reading, "Seafood from the Gulf of Mexico is among the most tested in the world, and, according to the FDA and NOAA, it is as safe now as it was before the accident."
BP further claims that lesions on fish are common. They state that prior to the Deepwater Horizon spill there was "documented evidence of lesions in the Gulf of Mexico caused by parasites and other agents."
They added: "As part of the Natural Resource Damage Assessment, which is led by state and federal trustees, we are investigating the extent of injury to natural resources due to the accident."
"BP is funding multiple lines of scientific investigation to evaluate potential damage to fish, and these include: extensive seafood testing programs by the Gulf states; fish population monitoring conducted by the Louisiana Department of Wildlife and Fisheries, Auburn University and others; habitat and water quality monitoring by NOAA; and toxicity tests on regional species. The state and federal Trustees will complete an injury assessment and the need for environmental restoration will be determined."
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GM Confirms Chevrolet Sonic as New US Built Small Car
text size: A- A+
"The Sonic represents a new beginning for Chevrolet in the small car segment and so we felt it was time to give it a new name," said Chris Perry, vice president, Chevrolet U.S. Marketing. "The new car is roomy, stylish and fun to drive, and Sonic is a youthful, energetic name that helps convey what this vehicle is about."
GM hasn't provided technical specifications or other types of details regarding the new Sonic, but it will most likely be a rebadged Aveo that will undergo several modifications to comply with US legislation. The European Aveo, presented at the 2010 Paris Auto Show earlier this year, will be offered starting next year with our cylinder petrol and diesel engines. The lineup includes a 1.2l engine (86 hp) and a 1.4l unit (100 hp) and, for the first time, two versions of a 1.3l diesel engine (75 hp and 95 hp) with Start/Stop technology.
Of course, General Motors will most likely display the Sonic at the upcoming North American International Auto Show in January 2011, so more information will probably emerge as we get closer to the official debut moment.
autoevolution will be attending the 2011 NAIAS, so stay tuned for some real up close and personal shots of the vehicles, as well as for first-hand details of the motorized contraptions presented at the event.
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Lease this WebApp and get rid of the ads.
Tony Patton
TP Preston
Tue Jun 26, 2012 13:48
The name of the book is:
"The Battle of Resaca: Atlanta Campaign,1864
by Philip L. Secrist.
I'm sending you an attachment to your email address
You may already have this, if not, it mentions your great uncle in an article from the Confederate Veteran Magazine: January-1898.
Let me know if you recieve it.
Tony Patton
Lease this WebApp and get rid of the ads.
TP Preston
J.L. Preston,
Mon Jun 25 17:27
Dear, Sir, thank you very much for the information you provided. I am not familiar with the book by Phil Secrist. Would you mind trying to learn the title if this book, so, I can purchase it? I just...
TP Preston
Tony Patton ,
Tue Jun 26 13:48
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We're celebrating the new Prince who was born using Hypnobirthing, private courses are now only £200
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Miss Dana
has 24 followers and is following 11 people
- Chicagoland, IL, USA
- member since January 23, 2012
has 24 followers and is following 11 people
Hi, thanks for the wonderful books on your shelf, I now have even more books to read. (:
I hope you are having a wonderful day. :3
Hi Dana
I agree, a lot of my friends dont share the same passion for reading as I do.. Reading is an escape from life for me, but it is also a way for me to go to places I have never been and meet some people I have never met... I have learnt many things in the last 2 years. I have been setting a yearly goal for myself.. and ai am loving it...
Have fun
Hello Dana
I see you have a couple of Jodi Picoult books on your shelf.
My Favourites of hers are
Plain Truth
Nineteen Minutes
Handle With Care
I could also recommend
Secret Life Of Bees by Sue Monk Kidd
The Book Thief by Markus Zusak
Water For Elephants by Sara Gruen
The Conjurers Bird by Martin Davies
The Memory Keepers Daughter by Kim Edwards
Happy reading.. and I hope we can chat sometimes
Hi, Dana. If you love to read, then you should check out my new book, (Bruma and the enchanted forest). You will find it rewarding and it will bring you hours of reading pleasure, specially at night. I know you will recommend it. God bless you.


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Makers & DIY Electronics
> Making Things See: 3D vision with Kinect, Processing, Arduino, and MakerBot
by Greg Borenstein
Making Things See: 3D vision with Kinect, Processing, Arduino, and MakerBot
by Greg Borenstein
List price: $39.99
Softpro Price:
Welcome to the Vision Revolution. With Microsoft's Kinect leading the way, you can now use 3D computer vision technology to build digital 3D models of people and objects that you can manipulate with gestures and spoken commands. This hands-on guide provides all the technical and conceptual information you need to build cool applications for Kinect, using the Processing programming language and the Arduino microcontroller.
Whether you're a student, hobbyist, maker, gamer, or hardware hacker,
Making Things See
gets you running with several Kinect projects, and gives you the skills and experience you need to build your own fun and creative projects with this magical 3D computer vision technology. Unlock your ability to build interactive applications with Kinect.
Learn about face recognition, gait analysis, and depth imaging
Analyze and manipulate point clouds
Track people with skeletonization and pose detection, and use blob tracking to detect objects
Use gestural interfaces for assistive technology
Create models for design and fabrication, using 3D scanning technology and a 3D printer
Delve into motion tracking for animation and games
Build every project in this book with inexpensive off-the-shelf components
Unless otherwise noted above, most orders ship within 1 to 2 days. We will promptly notify you if there is a stock problem with any items on your order and provide you with an estimated delivery date. If you have a firm need by date, please provide such information in the comment section at checkout.
Publisher: O'Reilly Media
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Pub Date: 2/2/2012
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Massive sinkhole on I-40 continues to grow
UPDATED 6:26 PM MDT Sep 14, 2013
A massive sinkhole along Interstate 40 at To'hajiilee continues to grow.
The sinkhole is 20 miles west of Albuquerque. It was around 20 feet deep before Friday's downpours, but now it has grown significantly.
Crews from the New Mexico Department of Transportation are working to fix the hole. I-40 will be reduced to one lane during the fix.
Copyright 2013 by KOAT.com. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.


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text: I have traveled to Corpus Christi for many years. I am always looking for that little gem hidden away that makes me think it is just there for me. Grounded is that gem. I stopped by in the afternoon after visiting all the shell shops on the island. I liked the atmosphere right away: large open, clean space with seating... More


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Middle Eastern Festival
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Sashar Zarif Dance Theatre Presents SAMA-E RAST at Toronto Centre for the Arts Tonight
Sashar Zarif Dance Theatre presents the world premiere of Sama-e Rast, an unprecedented, multi-layered evening of integrated dance, music and poetry stemming from the ancient mystic traditions of Western and Central Asia. Choreographed and performed by Toronto's acclaimed Sashar Zarif, accompanied by the legendary Azerbaijani Mugham master singer Alim Qasimov and his Ensemble, this thrilling DanceWorks CoWorks Series event is presented tonight, December 21 at the Toronto Centre for the Arts' George Weston Recital Hall in celebration of the Winter Solstice. Tickets: $35, $45, $55, $75, $100 (VIP). Box Office: 416-250-3708 OR online at sashardance.com.
Sama-e Rast is the first of a planned trilogy to introduce the art of Mugham - connected to the Sufi and Shamanic cultures of Azerbaijan, Iran and Central Asia - to Canadian audiences through Sashar Zarif Dance Theatre's Dance of Mugham Series. These are the same cultures that have been introduced to the west through the poetry and philosophy of people like Rumi and Omar Khayyam.
Choreographed and performed by Sashar Zarif,
Music composed and performed by Alim Qasimov and Ensemble
Dramaturgy & Creative Facilitation by Elizabeth Langley,
Lighting by Arun Srinivasan,
Costumes by Sashar Zarif
7pm: Gallery Exhibit of audio and visual material from the Dance of Mugham research archive opens for viewing
8pm: Sama-e Rast performance begins, followed by the premiere of the short documentary Three Apples Fell from the Sky
George Weston Recital Hall, Toronto Centre for the Arts, 5040 Yonge St. (north of Sheppard subway). Tickets: $35, $45, $55, $75, $100 (VIP). Box Office: 416-250-3708 OR online at sashardance.com.
Pictured: Alim Qasimov. Photo credit: Arturan Najafi Gol.
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text:
This Is Exactly What I Feel Like Doing To The Chicago Bears
Whether it be depantsing them myself and exposing their weak manhood or depantsing myself in front of their team bus, I feel like showing off my butt cheeks the same way Devin Hester did last night on NBC Sunday Night Football.
The only difference between him showing his butt and me showing mine is that mine would be funny.
At least, I would think so.
I will admit that the Bears played somewhat well in the game last night, going up against a good team in the Philadelphia Eagles.
They still can't run the ball, and the defense definitely needs help learning to cover wide receivers and how to make a correct form tackle.
But, when it came down to it, they had a chance to win the game. And, in today's NFL that is all you can really ask for with your favorite team.
But, the Jay Cutler saga continues, and for all intents and purposes, the Chicago Bears are now 4-6 because of his misjudgment.
I am not aware of what the gambling line was on last night's game, but the way Cutler missed three "easy" touchdown passes, it would almost seem as if the man had money on the game remaining close. And, in the end, he needed his team to lose, which meant missing a streaking Johnny Knox for an easy touchdown at the end of the game.
And, horribly missing Devin Hester at the end of the game for an easy first down.
Even worse were the two missed TD passes to Greg Olsen and Devin Hester on back-to-back passes.
No NFL quarterback should miss wide open receivers twenty yards down the field, and in the end zone.
Thus, it remains a fact...Jay Cutler is a horrible red zone quarterback.
Thus, it also remains a fact...the Chicago Bears suck.
What is the duplicate article?
Why is this article offensive?
Where is this article plagiarized from?
Why is this article poorly edited?
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text:
1 Samuel 15:3-8
3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.. 7 And Saul smote the Amalekites from Havilah until thou comest to Shur, that is over against Egypt. 8 And he took Agag the king of the Amalekites alive, and utterly destroyed all the people with the edge of the sword.
TotalVictory wrote:PS -- Jason: I have no idea which part of this huge topic you want to tackle, but I'm all ears!!!
May I ask where your coming from with this?
Are you a pacifist...
Do you think there is any value to the four Gospels if redemption from the crucifixion is a myth...
Jason said
If Jesus was Himself God, then Christianity centers on the redemption of God's enemies through a violence required by God upon Himself.
Salvation is to begin to be free from those evil forces, and to be transformed by the reign of God and to take on a life shaped -- marked -- by the story of Jesus, whose mission was to make visible the reign of God in our history.
In carrying out that mission, Jesus was killed by the earthly structures in bondage to the power of evil. His death was not a payment owed to God's honor, nor was it divine punishment that he suffered as a substitute for sinners. Jesus death was the rejection of the rule of God by forces opposed to that rule. In fact, this review of Jesus' life as narrative Christus Victor exposes how incongruous it is to interpret this story as one whose ultimate purpose was to arrange a death in order to satisfy divine justice. Far from being an event organized for a divine requirement, his death reveals the nature of the forces of evil that opposed the rule of God. It poses a contrast between the attempt to coerce by violence under the rule of evil and the nonviolence of the rule of God as revealed and made visible by the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus.
TotalVictory wrote:As for the use of the term "myth" I hope that does not offend or distract. Myth is here used in the sense of collective cultural expressions of the way things are. Myth is the shared, personal, experiential representation of what is. Myth is the story which best encapsulates the perceived realities of a people.
TV wrote:That you listed the 5 items which you did suggests you wonder if these themselves are under some attack or revision.
TV wrote:Where I would part ways with you is this notion that the violence was "required" by God upon Himself
To me, this treads far too close to pagan ideas of a god who needs to be appeased; a god who can be "altered" or effected into being more favorably disposed toward us.
TV wrote:God neither orchestrated the violence against Christ, nor needed it.
TV wrote:If God's hand was involved in this act against Christ it would follow that if the events of the cross were willed by God then the perpetrators of this horror should be honored as heroes who fulfilled the will of God and praised for helping facilitate our redemption!
J Denny Weaver in The NonViolent Atonement wrote:His death was not a payment owed to God's honor, nor was it divine punishment that he suffered as a substitute for sinners. Jesus death was the rejection of the rule of God by forces opposed to that rule.
Was it your face that I saw in the crowd?
Was it your fist I saw raised?
Was it your voice I heard scream for his blood?
Your mouth that was twisted with rage?
Oh did you join in when they started to sing
'Crucify!, crucify him!' ?
I know it was you for I was there too
When the world said no.
I know that it's true - I was stood next to you
When the world said no.
Jason said
There is an ontological necessity in this being primarily a deed of God as well: otherwise some other entity (Satan? Caiaphas the mere human!!?) was primarily responsible for something happening to God. And now we're talking about a very different theology than that which we both agree is true.
that it was God's doing for them to throw him down into the pit, to be sold as a slave of no identity into pagan Egypt
TotalVictory wrote:Specifically, for example, must I know what a "Lewisian mythopoecist" is?
or what "narrative and thematic fault on the first clause" means? to properly continue?
TV wrote:God orchestrating violence against His own Son?? This chills me to the core; you find it wondrous and inspiring. Shall we just chalk this up to another difference in interpretations? If this is how you see it, how do you avoid the charges (of certain feminist theologians) of divine child abuse? (Just wondering )
TV wrote:Jeff A brings up a very central point in that we humans, all of us, can be seen as participating in the killing of God.
TV wrote:But I can no more think of honoring the ones who actually killed Christ than I could honor one who killed a member of my own family. That seems to me wildly discordant.
TV wrote:Jason: If you accept the God of the bible in all His glorious and salvific violence, just tell me so and we shall disagree straightaway. I'm afraid of such a God; you seem not.
TV wrote: let me ask you, (for clarification) in your theology, did GOD kill His own Son?
TV wrote:(On a very related note; it seems to me that in your scheme of things sin, rebellion, the fall, was necessary for God to complete and perfect His creation. You're not saying that -- are you??)
TV wrote:The way you speak of Gods activity in men's affairs it sounds as if men have little choice of their own; it is all God's will.
JRP in his previous comment wrote:They are notheroes who have fulfilled the will of God, but villains... No, they are sinners... They should not be honored as heroes (for they weren't), and not as villains (for they were)... That does not mean that we should sin so that grace will increase--may it never be! (as St. Paul emphatically says.) Our crime is the abuse of the grace of God... Judas is to blame, yes... Are [the brothers of Joseph] to blame? Yes.
TV wrote:You actually do find their acts somehow noble and admirable??
TV wrote:Another window into our differences here is your take on the Joseph story -- which I agree is a beautiful example of Gods activity in a sinful setting. But to saythat it was God's doing for them to throw him down into the pit, to be sold as a slave of no identity into pagan Egypt
seems to me monstrous and not grace at all. The Genesis 50:20 principle (for some reason, the Charismatics I've known love this text ) is that YOU meant it for evil but God meant it for good. God taking that evil and bringing good from it need not mean He ordained (orchestrated) the evil in the first place.
TV wrote:Please do not take my befuddlement at your conviction on violence as hostile in any way.
There is no place in Scripture where we are told that evil is a creation of either man or the devil. While it is true that men DO evil, and that evil certainly exists in the world, God always takes credit for it in the ultimate sense.
All evil is the result of Adam's sin. Evil is ultimately the divine judgment for sin. Evil is the result of sin. Therefore, evil is not a CAUSE but is derivative. For example, God told Adam and Eve that in the day they eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, they will surely DIE. Death is evil, and it is the consequence of sin, the effect of a prior cause.
All evil stems from this one act, the "original sin," and is merely an extension of that first great evil called "death." Who would question that death was the consequence of sin by the justice of God? Hence, in the great chapter setting forth the sovereignty of God, He tells us in Isaiah 45:7, "I form the light and create darkness; I make peace and CREATE EVIL; I the Lord do all these things."
Not only death, but also calamities and pestilence are evils which God may bring upon a nation for their sin. All judgment for sin is "evil" from the perspective of the ones affected by it—until they come to see that such judgments were sent by a just God to judge sin.
This is not to say that God SINS. Most people object to God creating evil on the grounds that it makes God a sinner. But such a view is taken only when one does not know the difference between evil and sin. God creates evil, but God does not sin.
The Hebrew word for "sin" is khawtaw , which means "to miss" or "to fail to hit the mark (goal)." The definition of sin is made clear in both the Old and New Testaments. First, in Judges 20:16 we read,
16 Out of all these people 700 choice men were left-handed; each one could sling a stone at a hair and not MISS [khawtaw]."
Here the meaning of the word is clear. It has to do with not missing a target. When the target, goal, or standard is the law of God, then to miss has moral implications. We call it "sin." In this sense, Paul tells us in Romans 3:23, "For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God." In other words, the glory of God is the goal—the mark—and all men, in shooting toward that goal, have found their "arrows" falling short of that goal. All have missed the mark.
God creates evil, but God never fails to achieve His goals. He never misses the mark. If God were ever to fail to reach His goal, He would become a "sinner." So if we understand the divine plan, which is His goal, and see it, not as wishful thinking but as the divine target of all history, then we will know the end from the beginning, because God will not fail to reach that goal.
There are many who think that God spends most of His time dreaming about what might have been, could have been, or would have been—if only Adam had not sinned. Such a mindset would produce many regrets, spawned from the despair of a great divine Failure. Was Adam's sin outside the overall divine plan? Was God taken by surprise? If so, then God is a failure and thus a sinner by biblical definition.
But no, God forbid! God was neither surprised nor handicapped by Adam's sin. The divine plan will succeed in the end. Neither mankind nor the devil can stop the least part of God's plan for His creation.
Evil is only sin if it misses the mark. Mankind has been given a mark to hit, a goal to achieve, a perfect standard. It is set forth in Scripture in general, and in the law in particular. The law is the expression of the moral and judicial side of God's character. When men do evil to each other, it is a sin, because they fail to achieve the perfection of the glory of God. However, when God does evil, it is according to His perfect wisdom; it has purpose, and His arrow always hits the bull's eye. Though we do not always understand what He is doing—because we do not see the end from the beginning—we ought to have faith that He is a good God who will work all things together for good (Rom. 8:28).
Job is set forth in Scripture as a primary example by which we may understand the concept of evil. First, we are told that "Satan" needed God's permission to afflict Job with "evil." See Job 1:12 and 2:6.
Why did God allow this? The book makes it clear that God had a higher purpose, not merely to test Job, but to bring Job to a greater level of understanding in the end. Job already knew more than the average Christian about the source of evil, for he said in 2:10,
10 Shall we indeed accept good from God and not accept adversity? In all this Job did not sin with his lips.
The word translated "adversity" (NASB) is the Hebrew word ra'a, which means "evil" and is so translated in the KJV. It carries the idea of calamity and anything which men call "evil."
Job's friends tried to tell him that surely he was harboring some secret sin in his life. This would explain why God was judging him (or allowing Satan to judge him). But in saying this, they sinned with their lips, and in the end Job was required to pray for them (42:10).
At the end of the story (42:11, 12), Job's family came and "comforted him for all the evil that the Lord had brought on him . . . . And the Lord blessed the latter days of Job more than his beginning."
In other words, when the Lord does or allows evil to befall us, it is ultimately for the purpose of blessing us. This is the basis of Paul's statement in Romans 8:28,
28 And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose.
It is perhaps no coincidence that God worked anonymously to make men label this verse "8:28." The number 828 is 2 x 414, which is the factor of "Cursed Time," and it illustrates the fact that even God's so-called "curses" are ultimate blessings.
There are many other Scriptures that have direct references to God doing "evil" without sinning. Amos 3:6 says, "If a calamity [ra-a] occurs in a city, has not the Lord done it? " God always takes credit for bringing judgment upon a city or a nation—including Israel —in order that they might know the Source and purpose of their judgment, which they call "evil."
Divine judgment is never coincidental, as historians may think. While God uses "natural causes," He always stands behind history as the First Cause of all things. This is the story presented in Scripture, whether God was hardening Pharaoh's heart (Ex. 10:1) or putting a hook in his jaw (Ez. 29:4) to ensure that they would do His bidding.
We are called to get to know the God of the Bible, so that we begin to comprehend Him and the way He thinks by the mind of the Spirit. This is often difficult, especially the more evil we see and the more that bad things happen to us personally. Our perspective is simply too limited, too personal, too myopic, and so it is fortunate that we ourselves are not God.
We must ultimately come to the same conclusion as Joseph did, after being sold as a slave by his own brothers, and after being imprisoned for years through false accusation. In Gen. 50:19, 20 he said,
19 Fear not; for am I in the place of God? 20 But as for you [brothers], you thought evil against me; but God meant it for good, to bring to pass, as it is this day, to save many people alive.
This attitude is the primary mark of spiritual maturity in Scripture. All the bitterness and anger of his youth had melted away, once he saw the greater purpose of God in all the "evil" done to him. He had ceased to think of good and evil dualistically. He now saw both good and evil with a singular mind as proceeding from God and having an ultimate good purpose .
-- All Christian authorities everywhere would agree, however (or so I suppose and have found from experience), that this death is not done primarily by us; but primarily by God Himself --
I accept the God of the Bible in having done this violence anyway.
I do not believe that God was murdering Himself; God was not sinning to sacrifice Himself in love for us, even for the people who sin in murdering God.
"For those contemplating for the first time how an assumption of Christian nonviolence impacts Christian doctrines of Christology and atonement, the idea of divinely sanctioned violence of punishment as the basis of justice may not seem like a problem. After all, Christian tradition has a long history of accommodating violence via the doctrine of supposedly justifiable war, and the idea that dong justice means punishment is the hallmark of the United States criminal justice procedures. I submit, however, that it is very much a problem of Christian faith. The classic orthodox formulation of the Trinity emphasizes that each person of the Trinity participates in all the attributes of God. According to this doctrine, it would be heretical to develop attributes in one person of the Trinity that were different from the other persons of the Trinity. That idea is already contained in the key formulation of Nicea,which said that Jesus was "one in being" [homoousis] with the Father. Thus in the orthodox formulations, and as was stated in several of the efforts to rehabilitate satisfaction, Jesus as the revelation of God reveals the very character and being of God. I suggest, however, that if Jesus rejected the sword and His actions portrayed nonviolent confrontation of evil in making the reign of God visible, then it ought not be thinkable that the God who is revealed in Jesus would orchestrate the death of Jesus in a scheme that assumed that doing justice meant the violence of punishment. If Jesus truly reveals God the Father, then it would be a contradiction for Jesus to be nonviolent and for God to bring about salvation though divinely orchestrated violence, through a scheme in which justice depended on violent retribution."
"The God of vengeance and justice is not revealed in the crucified Messiah. Such a division of roles among persons of the Trinity, with the role of violence reserved for God the Father but not exercised in God the crucified Son, runs counter to classic trinitarian doctrine, which holds that what is true for each person of the Trinity must also be true for God as one."
p 209
I could easily expect an Incarnation and a Passion and a Resurrection even for an unfallen Nature, simply as part of God's loving communion with us.
TotalVictory wrote:First, in the story of the Tares among the Wheat Jesus says:
"An enemy has done this"
He does not say the enemy participating with God, nor that God will bring good from this evil act. The deed is simply wrong. End of story. No sense of God's participation here. This recognizes a whole category of things that are "not God" at all. Regardless that He brings Good from it.
TV wrote:Second would be in James where he says (1:13)
"Let no one say when he is tempted, I am being tempted by God…"
Again, the clear dissociation of God from that evil. It's as if James says that we act apart from God -- all on our own.
TV wrote:Now after the fact, when everything had all worked out, and Joseph SAW the change the brothers evil act had wrought in their lives, and Joseph considered the endless creativity of God in redeeming sin, Joseph could speak AS IF God had intended the entire series of acts. Joseph was adopting a manner of speaking in order to assuage his brothers shame and guilt.
TV wrote:So, a major problem I have with what seems to me your conflation of God's redeeming and saving responses to evil with the evil itself is that it doesn't know which evils come from God so can only say ALL of them do.
TV wrote:Now I am sure you mean more than just that God, because he is creator and therefore responsible for all this in that sense, hasn't abandoned us. For me it is necessary for God to "weep" with each evil we choose -- even as He busies Himself redeeming our rebellion.)
TV wrote:My response here is, "AN ENEMY has done this ma'am!"
TV wrote:My response is NOT EVEN CLOSE to "God did this" (a la God did this to Joseph)
TV wrote:I hope you understand my stance here
TV wrote:What I do not want to do is lay evil at the feet of God that does not belong there… Nor do you I am sure.
TV wrote:Moving on, I am curious why you have not addressed my central observation about relationships; violence breeds fear -- yet God insists we are NOT to fear.
TV wrote:For, when we consider the violence in an abusive marriage, and that the temptation of the abused wife is to be "mature" and accept that her husband really does "love" her, any right thinking person recoils in horror and sees her 'acceptance' not as maturity, but as psychosis and pathology. For what she must do is get the hell out.
TV wrote:By your statements, it seems you are ready to excuse God of ALL charges of violence
TV wrote:That's about as different as two could possibly get!
TV wrote:more later on my troubles with your articulations of Trinitarian orthodoxy.
TV wrote:Also on your moving description of the Last Supper.
TV wrote:I find it curious that you would make a statement like this:
-- All Christian authorities everywhere would agree etc.--
when the very premise of this site (EU) is, by those same "Christian authorities", seen to be heresy. Just an observation…
TV wrote:I am seeing that the theology you are articulating (and with which I disagree) is itself based upon a premise with which I also disagree. Namely, that sin somehow requires a response of violence and punishment; that sin demands retributive punishment for its own sake.
TV wrote:As to avoiding the charge of "divine child abuse" I guess I have to reject your assertion that since it was God doing it to Himself (a truly bewildering expression to any non-Trinitarian listening in) He is therefore absolved.
TV wrote:For me that's a glaring contradiction. You sound like you are excusing the God's act (I guess if by definition God can't sin, and if God did kill His Son, the killing of Christ couldn't be a sin) while at the same time admitting to the act. So the act of killing Jesus is not a sin when God does it, but IS a sin when we do it? For me that's "pretzel think".
Total Victory wrote:So not only does UR not "trump the Myth of Redemptive Violence" for you, (nor does it need to,) UR is deeply subservient to the Myth of Redemptive Violence. How else TO interpret this statement?
Total Victory wrote:Obviously there are some details on which we disagree on now, but in time (maybe the hereafter) resolution will emerge.
Stephen Jones wrote:God's Liability Laws Based upon Ownership
To prove this liability, let us look at some of the laws of ownership:
Exodus 21:33-34
33 And if a man shall open a pit, or if a man shall dig a pit, and not cover it, and an ox or an ass fall therein; 34 the owner of the pit shall make it good, and give money unto the owner of them; and the dead beast shall be his.
The liability here is based upon ownership. If a man digs a pit and does not take the necessary steps to cover it and an ox comes along and falls in by his own free will or by his own stupidity, guess who is liable according to God's law? This is the law that sets the standard of liability. It is the owner of the pit who is liable, and he must then buy the dead ox for himself. The owner has to pay for it as though it were a live ox, and the dead ox is his.
Back in the Garden of Eden, God dug a "pit." He did not cover it up, and man fell. Why did man fall? Why did he die? He died because God planted a couple of "trees" in this garden and gave man the "free will" to make the decision, fully aware what decision Adam would make. Yet God did not cover the pit to prevent Adam's fall. He did not take the precaution in this case. He did not build a ten-foot fence around that tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Man fell because God did not take the proper precautions that would have been necessary to prevent man from sinning.
Could God have prevented man from sinning? Of course He could have. He did not have to plant the tree in the first place, or if He did, He did not have to omit the fence. Even then, He did not have to create a tempter and allow him entrance into the garden. Did the tempter come in without God's knowledge? Did God turn off the security alarms and somehow the devil entered the garden without God's knowledge? Did God say "oops!"? Is God really that ignorant?
The fact is that God knew the end from the beginning. He was not taken by surprise. He dug that pit and left it uncovered because He had a plan, and the plan called for man to fall. And so he did. By God's own liability laws, then, He is responsible. So what did God do about it? He sent His only begotten Son who was lifted up on the cross in order to drag all men to Himself. He paid for the sin of the whole world because all of creation became subject to death through Adam's fall. He bought the dead ox. The ox is now His.
Do you realize what this means? He bought all who fell, and they are now His. Has anyone escaped falling? At the present time it may not look like all mankind is His, but the fact is that God created them and therefore, by His own liability laws, He purchased the world. In doing so, He fulfilled the law perfectly. This is the Good News of the New Testament. His blood was sufficient and worth enough to pay for the sin of the whole world.
1 John 2:2
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.
Let us take a closer look at the law regarding the ox in the pit. It is obvious that under normal circumstances, the ox simply did not see the pit or got too close to it. At any rate, the ox fell into the pit by his own free will or by his own blindness or stupidity. In such cases, the law clearly says, the one who dug the pit (its "owner") would be liable to pay for the ox.
But suppose I had pushed the neighbor's ox into this pit. Would that make any legal difference? Well, it does not say anything about that, because that point is legally irrelevant. If he pushed the ox into the pit, he may perhaps owe the owner five oxen (Ex. 22:1). But even if it were totally accidental, the owner of the pit is liable because he owns the pit. Either way, the owner of the pit is liable. The issue is not whether the ox fell by his own free will or if someone (like the devil) nudged him into it. The question remains the same: who owns the pit? It is not a question of the ox's free will; it is a question of ownership.
Let us look at another liability law that came from the mind of God:
Deuteronomy 22:8
8 When thou buildest a new house, then thou shalt make a battlement for thy roof, that thou bring not blood upon thine house, if any man fall from thence.
According to this law, all you have to do to be liable is fail to build a railing on the roof of the house. In those days the people built houses with flat roofs, because they liked to fellowship in the cool of the evenings on the top of the house. Because of this, God required them to put a railing ("battlement") around the roof, so that people would not accidentally fall. If there were no railing, and if someone were to fall off the roof, who is liable?
If a man pushed his neighbor off the roof, of course, he would be held liable for murder. But our issue is not whether he fell by accident or if someone pushed him deliberately. There is liability either way, and the only difference would be the degree of liability. Our issue is whether or not the man could have prevented the death of his neighbor by building a railing around the roof of the house. The fact is that if you own the house, you are responsible for putting those safety precautions into place. If you do not do so, "it was an accident" does not remove all liability from your door.
God's house is the whole heavens and the earth. His abode is in the heavens now, but He is making His home in the earth, and that is why He is coming – to make His home here. The problem is that when He built this house, man fell off the "roof." Who is liable? We agree that God did not PUSH Adam off the "roof." One cannot blame God for murder. Yet we cannot simply blame the devil in order to remove all liability from God. We cannot merely claim that man was careless and fell off by his own free will. To say it was totally man's fault is not a lawful answer. Ownership of the house makes God liable by His own liability laws.
There is another liability law that should help us understand this issue.
Exodus 22:5
5 If a man shall cause a field or vineyard to be eaten, and shall put in his beast, and shall feed in another man's field; of the best of his own field, and of the best of his own vineyard, shall he make restitution.
What happens if an ox tears down a fence by his own free will, plods into another field, and eats his neighbor's grass? Who is liable to pay for the grass? The owner of the ox, of course. The law is clear.
Suppose the owner of the ox opens the fence, pushes the ox into the neighbor's field, and pushes the ox's nose to the ground, saying, "Now you eat this grass, or I will beat you to death." The ox is forced to eat the grass and has no free will in the matter. Who is liable? The owner of the ox. The only difference in penalty is that if the offense is deliberate, he would have to pay at least double restitution. If the ox committed the offense by his own "free will," the owner has reduced liability. But he is still liable either way. To insist upon putting the entire blame upon the ox does not solve the problem of ownership. Whether that ox got in there by his own free will or whether the ox was pushed to go in against his free will, does not free the owner of liability itself. Ownership itself brings liability.
The theologian's insistence upon man having a free will may reduce the problem of God's liability, but it can never eliminate it altogether.
JeffA wrote:It seems with the Christian God the end DOES justify the means.
Jason said
For what it's worth, I do not typically see violence in the Bible as being beautiful or admirable, even when the heroes are the ones doing it.
Jason said
this enemy was operating within the permission and even the grace of God
Jason writes:
Seducing people into doing evil? No.
JasonPratt on Sun Mar 29, 2009 4:56 pm wrote:
even sin happens within the will of God, in a very real way. Otherwise, we're talking about cosmological dualism or polytheism or any of several worldviews which are not an ultimate theism.
there are corollaries to saying that something happens entirely apart from the will of God. They're much the same corollaries we bring up when a traditional damnationist wants to claim that someone continues existing in hell entirely separated and apart from God.
Tom (on Wed Apr 22, 2009 2:29 pm) said this:
Now the question is whether God can—and this is where I want to be careful--make compatibilistic use, say, of the evil intentions/plans of wicked persons? Can it ever be compatible with divine omnibenevolence to 'direct' or 'channel' ('orchestrate', 'influence') the already resolved/determined evil intentions/plans of persons/nations in a way that best fits his overall plan? I'd like to answer YES to this, but a very careful yes, not at all similar to Calvinism's secondary causation of unconditionally decreed outcomes...
But does God 'want' to make compatibilistic use of the already determined evil characters and intentions of wicked persons in such cases? I think so, yeah.
Jason wrote:
I would rather just be agnostic on the topic of which evils occur because God is acting to bring those sufferings about in cooperation with the evil choices of people (though unlike them His intentions are actually good) and which ones God isn't directly and specifically cooperating with in bringing the incidents about.
and this:
there are corollaries to saying that something happens entirely apart from the will of God.
and this:
Actually, I thought I had written somewhere earlier that I am not committed to accepting every charge of violence attributed directly to God in scripture.
JeffA wrote:Bobx3,
Thank you for the acknowledgements. I am not a rigorous thinker like Jason - I am an impulsive Jack-of- all-Trades and master of none. i am a passionate person who rises and falls like the tide and my moods and emotions very definitely colour my thinking (and how I respond to the ideas of others). I think this is why I sit on the fulcrum of the debate God/no God because I find very plausable arguments on both sides.
However, I find your debate with Jason fascinating and illuminating
justin abraham wrote:Why did God set up (or at least continue--if we don't believe its origin is God) a system of sacrifice in the first place? I don't think God needed the shedding of blood (death) of animals for the remission of sins. He created the system for some strange reason that we don't understand. Would it not have been a lot easier just to require a remorseful heart?
RanRan wrote:maybe all that blood letting was just a way to convince those idiots back then.
RanRan wrote:"We said we were sorry! So you didn't need to sacrifice your only Son." Hey, maybe all that blood letting was just a way to convince those [xxxxxx] back then.
RanRan wrote:
The slaughter of animals continues because we're hungry.
firstborn888 wrote:And because we are still rather insensitive to suffering which doesn't hurt us directly.
Jeff wrote:If I don't get any kind of genuine conversion pre-mortem then as far as even Universalist theology is concerned it's death and a pile of punishment and then eventually some long eons into the future maybe something good will happen
TotalVictory, to Jeff wrote:We must not let this moment pass without acknowledging the very important contribution the idea articulated by SJ brings to the concept of UR; that God can properly be said to "own" His creation -- us along with it -- surely also means He must, as mature ruler/sovereign/lord/master etc take "responsibility" for the mess His own creation has spawned.
Personally, I am bewildered why you would consider the self-sacrifice of someone out of love's sake for the sake of someone else, to be the same as that person abusing himself (in the unethical sense implied by the term "divine child abuse").
John 10:17 "Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again. 18 No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again."
Heb 12:2 "looking unto Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith, who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross"
1 Cor 15:54-56 "Death is swallowed up in victory."
" O Death, where is your sting?
O Hades, where is your victory?"
The sting of death is sin,
"For whoever desires to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake will find it" link
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
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Latest news
According to Sophos researchers, the latest trend among hackers is to inject malicious code into legitimate JavaScript already present on the compromised websites.
"The JavaScript is automatically loaded by the HTML webpages and inherits the reputation of the main site and the legitimate JavaScript," they point out the benefit of this approach, noting that it has the added advantage of the detection occasionally being discarded as a false positive.
They discovered a wide variety of sites across the globe sporting examples of this malicious code, and the best part it is that the code is easily spotted if a knowledgeable human (as opposed to a malware analysis system) manually checks the site's source code. The problem is that not many do.
If you're not your site's web developer, it's important to choose a good hosting provider, the researchers point out. Not only will they keep all the software and the (JavaScript) libraries updated, but they will also fulfill the obligation of checking the site periodically for compromises.
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- Similar itemStretch cotton sateen. Banded high waist. Slim, relaxed legs taper to cropped ankles. Center crease elongates the leg. Zip closure. Cotton/spandex. Imported of Italian materials.
- Our sexiest, skinniest fit. Looks like a jean, feels like a legging. 54% Cotton 43% Rayon 3% Spandex Soft stretch cotton sateen. Fit like your favorite legging. Low 7.75" front rise. Higher 13" back rise. Most fitted 10.25" leg opening. Angled hip zipper pockets. Moto paneling and stich detail. Back patch pockets. Imported, Machine Wash.


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April 1, 2011
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