Airbnb Nightmare: No End In Sight - <AUTHOR> http://ejroundtheworld.blogspot.com/2011/07/airbnb-nightmare-no-end-in-sight.html <comment><USER5> Airbnb & YC, just fix this please:

1\. Get a new place for EJ. Furnish it fully. Pay for everything.

2\. Help her restore her virtual identity. Use any resources at your considerable disposal.

3\. Help her find her irreplaceable stuff. A few private detectives and a small team of scouters can make more progress in 2 weeks that the SFPD can make in a lifetime. Publish pictures of her grandmother's jewelry to enlist a giant army of spotters.

4\. Hire her and pay her well (perhaps even with equity). She is obviously an excellent writer and an empathetic persona. But more importantly, she is an expert in addressing what is clearly the weakest link in your business model's chain.

5\. Fuck the business models, projections, and funding rounds and just "do the right thing".

This appears to be a royal fuck-up. But nothing compared to the lost goodwill for Airbnb, YC, the startup community, and the "new order" in general. Many of us had thought that you all had deprecated the era of Ford Pinto thinking. Current data appears to be to the contrary.

Turn this lemon into lemonade before the window closes. Tick. Tick. Tick.

[EDIT: This has nothing to do with assigning blame; this incident was clearly an outlier and nobody's fault (except the obvious bad guys). And it has nothing to do with solving this class of problem. All I'm saying is that fixing this instance will lead to solving this class. It presents an excellent opportunity to fix things in a way that never could have been imagined before. Airbnb has a compelling business proposition with an obvious Achilles heel. This unfortunate situation presents an excellent opportunity to address that weakness head on. But only with a 179 degree change in thinking. I don't know what the ultimate solution to this problem is, but _now_ is clearly the time for Airbnb to get moving on it...]

<comment><USER6> I've just learned more about this situation, and it turns out Airbnb has been offering to fix it, from the very beginning. From the beginning they offered to pay to get her a new place and new stuff, and do whatever else she wanted.

The story Arrington wrote yesterday about Airbnb not offering to help was bullshit. He asked a company spokesman what Airbnb was doing to help her. The spokesman, who'd been told by their lawyers that he couldn't go into detail about that because of the precedent said "I can't comment on that." So Arrington, in typical Arrington fashion said "Well, unless you tell me I'm going to write that you're not willing to do anything for her." And he did. Really not cool.

I've talked to the Airbnb guys and they are already doing everything they could be doing to help this woman.

Even if you don't believe they are nice guys (which they are, among the nicest of all the people we've funded), do you really think they are so dumb that they don't realize it's not worth the bad PR to save money and effort in this situation?

<comment><USER7> _I've just learned more about this situation, and it turns out Airbnb has been offering to fix it, from the very beginning. From the beginning they offered to pay to get her a new place and new stuff, and do whatever else she wanted._

I think this goes a long way towards confirming suspicions some people have held since the beginning of the debacle, namely that the victim here is blowing things out of proportion in an attempt to mar Airbnb's reputation as much as possible.

Granted her situation is very distressing, but weigh that against the fact that even if she had not been participating with Airbnb her home still could have been broken into and ransacked. The upside here is that Airbnb was involved and it seems is trying to do whatever they can to help her, up to and including paying for a new place. Now that it's been revealed she is misrepresenting Airbnb's reaction and handling of her case in her latest post[1] it becomes hard to deny this "victim" is utilizing their situation, i.e. manipulating it. So it seems she has a particular ax to grind, apparently with Airbnb...

[1] [http://ejroundtheworld.blogspot.com/2011/07/airbnb- nightmare...](http://ejroundtheworld.blogspot.com/2011/07/airbnb-nightmare-no- end-in-sight.html) "Airbnb has not assisted me in securing my safety, if that is the implication being made in Chesky's article" and "But the staff at Airbnb has not made a positive contribution to me personally or my situation in any way, particularly since June 30." While maybe true in fact, clearly misleading her audience.

Edit: I can see the angry mob is already hard at work down voting me. At least provide some counterpoint if you feel you disagree; yes, my point of view is unpopular on this subject, but have I made incorrect observations here?

<comment><USER8> You're using pg's (apparently) second-hand information to discredit EJ's account of her experience. What proof do you have that EJ is misrepresenting anything? At best, this is a case of he-said-she-said. But given pg and EJ's positions relative to the situation here, it seems more likely to me that pg has been misinformed than that EJ is egregiously lying.

(I admit the latter is _possible_ , but you seem to be taking the less plausible explanation as a given and using that assumption to attack the victim here. Hence the downvotes.)

<comment><USER7> Paul Graham would have a lot to lose by making such a broad, unfounded statement...unless of course that's what he's been told and has good reason to believe it's correct. If so, why should we disbelieve the pg and Airbnb account? Simply because EJ's is loaded with emotional appeal? I don't see how a random blogger is more plausible than pg and Airbnb?

I believe that most of her story is true (in the first blog post she even states that Airbnb has been incredibly helpful[1]; in fact this seems to corroborate pg's statement, they offered her financial support), that it was very traumatic for her, but what I don't believe is that pg and Airbnb are lying, that Airbnb has effectively made no attempt to help her; because they could have tried and she might have refused and now she's realized that the whole Internet is up in arms and on her side...so she can frame it however she likes, right or wrong. But I'm still inclined to believe pg would not spread disinformation; why should he? I think the man is much smarter than you're giving him credit for...

[1] <http://ejroundtheworld.blogspot.com/2011_06_01_archive.html> "I would be remiss if I didn't pause here to emphasize that the customer service team at airbnb.com has been wonderful, giving this crime their full attention. They have called often, expressing empathy, support, and genuine concern for my welfare. They have offered to help me recover emotionally and financially, and are working with SFPD to track down these criminals."

<comment><USER9> > I don't see how a random blogger is more plausible than pg and Airbnb?

Yeah, that's status thinking and antithetical to rational discourse. You evaluate a story or its plausibility on _its_ merits, not on the status of who tells it (unless you have _real_ information about the author's credibility, which in this case neither of us, correct me if I'm wrong, have.)

> this seems to corroborate pg's statement, they offered her financial support

No, it doesn't. There's a difference between "offering" support and giving it. What EJ said in her follow-up post is that although she was initially offered full support, none of it has actually materialized in the weeks after.

> But I'm still inclined to believe pg would not spread disinformation; why > should he? I think the man is much smarter than you're giving him credit > for...

Maybe you should get your nose out of pg's behind and realize that pg too puts his shoes on one at a time and shits like you and me. Having psychological, reputational, and financial stakes in one party of a dispute can induce biases. What I mean is, even good and smart people can fuck up, even with the best intentions. AFAIC, his story gets weighed on the same scale as everyone else's.

<comment><USER10> > Yeah, that's status thinking and antithetical to rational discourse. You > evaluate a story or its plausibility on _its_ merits, not on the status of > who tells it (unless you have _real_ information about the author's > credibility, which in this case neither of us, correct me if I'm wrong, > have.)

What about in the other direction? I have no information about the author's credibility whatsoever, but from personal interaction I have ample information about PG's credibility.

<comment><USER11> That's still argument from authority, like saying "Colin Powell is known to be a highly educated man and honored soldier, how could he be possibly fooled by faked documents?"

there is the possibility that the anonymous blogger has just as much integrity and honesty as pg. We don't know whether or not she does. We _do_ know what both parties have said in public. therefore, we need to limit our evaluations to that until further information is known.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> _He then addressed his concerns about my blog post, and the potentially negative impact it could have on his company's growth and current round of funding. During this call and in messages thereafter, he requested that I shut down the blog altogether or limit its access, and a few weeks later, suggested that I update the blog with a "twist" of good news so as to "complete[s] the story"._

If this is true it is downright appalling. Does he really think this woman that just had her life turned upside down gives a shit about his next round of funding?

<comment><USER13> Edit: bring on the downvotes! That's right, downvote a difference of opinion, and forget about logical or reasoned counterargument. Next time the internet lynch mob will come for your startup; hope that someone takes your side when they do.

\----

Don't you think the CEO has to worry about the people he's paying? Who knows what their burn rate is; that funding could have been a life or death event, and in the event of death then a bunch _more_ unemployed people would be hitting the streets.

And that wouldn't help anyone, least of all this woman.

AirBnB reported this to the police. They said they had someone in custody. What more do you want them to do? Go after them like Dirty Harry?

Dollars to donuts this woman is planning a lawsuit and looking for a payday. Not against the drug addicts who trashed her apartment, but against AirBnB. She rents out a room to people she's never met in person and then acts surprised when sometimes it goes wrong.

It's depressing to see the mob mentality here on Hacker News, and the extent to which Arrington delights in playing the organ grinder.

A pedestrian is hit by a DUI driver, does he sue or blame Honda? No? So why all the hate on AirBnB when it was a bunch of drug addicts who committed the crime? Sell them into old school bondage and send the income to her, by all means, but let's be real: it was the criminals' fault first, her fault second, and AirBnB in a distant third.

<comment><USER14> Putting aside the questions of blame, and the eventual intent of the individual. Putting aside the question of culpability, and whether anyone acted inappropriately.

Thinking about this entirely from the perspective of AirBnB. Doing what a company is supposed to do, by law, and considering only the shareholders.

Given what they've done, do you think it's the best thing to have done to give the company the best chance of long-term survival?

I don't.

Leaving out the morals and the ethics, assuming we only care about the company's survival, this issue has to be dealt with in an open, transparent, and above all _seen by all to be fair_ manner.

Providing for the short term care of this customer is vital. Whether it's right or wrong, ethical or moral, if they don't do it, people will say _"That might have been me."_

Above all else, that will kill AirBnB, and they are seeming to do nothing about it.

Leaving aside the moral and ethical considerations, working only according to the game theoretic standard of doing right by the company, what they are doing is clearly not in the best interests of the company.

</comment></comment></comment><comment>==

ADDED IN EDIT: From <http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html> :

        Please don't bait other users by
        inviting them to downmod you.

FWIW - I didn't down-vote you. I think you're wrong, and I don't think you've thought it through enough, but I didn't down-vote you. I took the time to reply because I think your view is common enough, and you had the courage to say it out loud.

But as I say, the current actions (as we understand them to be) are not in the best interests of the company or its employees - really, they're not.

<comment><USER13> Well, ok. While being entirely rational, let's also think about a related angle. The woman is out quite some money. She wants it back. The most coldbloodedly rational act on her part would have been to wait till they closed the round and then sue. Which, if you read her post carefully, is almost certainly what will happen in terms of timeline.

A billion dollar co is a real juicy target, much more so than the actual bad guys.

<comment><USER14> Sure. And:

a. She's in a fit state to be cold-bloodedly rational

b. She knew AirBnB was about to close a round

c. That closing was within a few weeks, and hence worth waiting

d. In the meantime she has no home, and has to deal with

d.1. the police,

d.2. all the credit card issues,

d.3. all the banks,

d.4. AirBnB themselves

Seems unlikely to me that she planned that. <shrug> You call them as you see them. I'm saying that I think AirBnB did the wrong thing to start with, and continues to make it worse, even discounting the ethics and morals. Add those in and it's even worse still.

      | Rock | AirBnB | Hard place |

The real issue, again ignoring ethics and morals and just concentrating on optimal course of actions for the company - where is their risk assessment and contingency plan? If they don't have one, that's tantamount to negligence. And you can't claim 20:20 hindsight, because people have been expressing concerns over this issue ever since they started.

As a director of two companies, one of which is involved in safety and security issues, I watch the unfolding - and perhaps unravelling - drama with interest (in both senses of the term).

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> I have a simple question for AirBnB.

      Did one of the founders ask this woman to take down
      or limit access to her blog post?

When you cut through everything else I think the answer to that would be telling. If the answer is no, then it points to dishonesty on the part of EJ, if the answer is yes, then much has been learnt about how AirBnB dealt with this situation.

</comment><comment><USER16> They must have totally messed this up for her to write a rebuttal post like that. This post absolutely torn apart all positive points from Chesky's response. I just still can't believe airbnb didnt see this coming, and stomp on the problem as hard as they can to get EJ on their side. If everything she said is true here, airbnb truly screwed up and deserve the negative PR coming their way.

Isn't this why you give up equity to have advisers on your team? Shouldn't they have predicted this?

<comment><USER17> I guess there are three options:

1) dive in help her, pay up make it all good get good PR. BUT if they are thinking that this is going to be a common problem and going to happen a lot then they may be making rod for their own backs…

or

2) Ride the storm - which again you would only do if you thought this was going to be an ongoing issue

or

3) they are idiots and have no idea how to handle PR (just like I wouldn't hire a project manager who hadn't been on a serious failed project I wouldn't hire PR who hadn't weathered some sort of shit storm)

None of those choices speak well for Airbnb's value - either this is going to be a problem for their business model or they aren't experienced enough to run something like this…

to be fair if it's (3) I'm sure they are getting some pretty good learning in right now

<comment><USER18> I honestly think that there's three proper responses:

1\. Work on your system to help prevent something like this doesn't happen again.

2\. Add a couple dollars of "insurance" to the cost. If the PR statement is accurate and there's been "2 million nights stayed" before an incident like this, having a couple bucks per renter would have more than covered the cost of this theoretically isolated incident.

3, which is far more important, figure out a way to reimburse her. This is already far overdue, and I realize there's a couple lawyers that'll say "But it opens the door for a fault-based civil suit", but that's an issue for the lawyers. It seems like human decency here, and it would be a transparent PR tactic to have waited 5 weeks to do it, but it really does seem like it's something they'll have to do to recover from this, especially if she keeps blogging about it.

<comment> eric-hu I would add onto 3--however the reimbursement is done, make sure she doesn't publish the actual numbers. One of the AirBnB guys blogged about this and included the maximum on his insurance policy for his east coast cabin. The first comment was "if you publish this number, everyone and anyone who sues will sue for this amount". Likewise with any future settlements.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> So somewhere between, "we need to appear to have taken responsibility for this and done everything in our power to help the victim and prevent future incidents", and "we need to take responsibility for this and do everything in our power to help the victim and prevent future incidents", Chesky et al went seriously off the rails. If there's anything worse than doing nothing, it's saying you've done the right thing when, in fact, you clearly haven't.

I know pg isn't likely to talk about this while the situation is still ongoing, but it'd be nice to hear his thoughts on the matter. This is the kind of behaviour you expect from a major airline or telecom, not a YC startup. It certainly doesn't speak well of the character of the founders.

</comment><comment><USER20> It is becoming so typical of the modern society to try to put spin on everything for our own narrow benefit rather than trying to get to the root cause and fix it.

This is another glaring example of it. A month after such a gruesome incident, nothing at all has been done by AirBnB. But they have gone out of their way in trying to put a positive spin on this whole sordid episode in order to protect their precious funding. When will somebody from AirBnB step up and say that we take responsibility for what happened and will do whatever it takes to help the victim and fix the system so that something like this does not happen again rather than wasting their efforts in trying to put a positive twist to this story? Doing such a thing will help them much more in the longer term than trying to simply sweep this story under the carpet.

<comment><USER21> The only reason I can think of for the founders behaviour is that this kind situation may happen more often than you would think and the founders don't have the cycles to appropriately handle each one.

<comment><USER22> That's what I was thinking, they didn't understand the gravity of this case because I imagine at AirBnB volume, this must happen at least once a day somewhere.

That said, from a customer support point of view, you never know which negative customer experiences are going to blow up so it's important that every customer leave with some level of satisfaction (or at least a payoff and a signed contract if you want to be shady!)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER23> It's a sad state of affairs, to be sure. But the answers are simple, although it's going to be a real pain for AirBnB's "frictionless" transaction model.

1) You MUST put down a CREDIT CARD. Not a bank card, not a debit card, not a prepaid card. No plasticky no rentee. A major credit card to make a transaction. No bitcoin, no cash, no BS. Airbnb then puts a hold equal to transaction cost + 20% for the duration of the stay. That 20% can be put toward insurance on both ends, paid out when satisfactory closeout of the transaction on _both ends_ occurs. If renters balk at the 20% hold, they shouldn't be on vacation. If owners balk at the "hold" instead of cash in hand, they can take their business to craigslist or wherever.

2) AirBnB must then become an arbitrator, a mediator, a guarantor, and/or (unless they want to outsource this) an insurer.

<comment><USER24> What is the insurance premium on:

1) A dedicated holiday apartment with little valuables and suitable furnishings

2) My primary residence full of my own furniture, valuables and sentimental items

Who is going to do that appraisal? AirBnB?

<comment><USER25> That's actually fairly easy. Host should declare coverage limits. Does not make sense to artificially lower the limits, since insurance will not pay for what's not declared. Thinking somewhat similar to insurance that FedEx and UPS are happy to sell.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> What's telling about this whole story is how Airbnb tried to "manage" her.

I thought the whole point of being a startup is you don't need to fall in line with the dehumanizing bullshit that you find in big corporations.

That's why I'm in a startup at least and it works for me on that level.

But there's such a stench of insincerity about the Airbnb approach that I will never use their site now.

<comment><USER27> Upvote - the CEO really comes off as a used car salesman here and serious d-bag.

<comment><USER27> edit: I just read her blog & she said she had no contact w/ the CEO, Brian Chesky so far. It was another co-founder who asked her to take down the blog it seems.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER28> Oh. My. God.

I really believed they're doing their best to help EJ. I trusted in that.

Yes, I liked AirBNB to the point of talking about it with friends and pretty much advertising it all around as a great idea and a great company - <USER2> because I liked them. They looked trustworthy and like a really nice company.

If what EJ wrote is accurate[1], then I find the way they handle this situation outraging. It hurts my feelings and right now completely destroyed my trust in AirBNB. If they won't fix it soon and start behaving like a real human beings, theny I'm no longer caring about them, and will advice my friends against them.

[1] - I try to not jump into conclusions too fast.

</comment><comment><USER29> In our rush to disintermediate old industries we may discover that some of those intermediaries are there for a reason.

<comment><USER18> What I don't get is how AirBnB vets the people leasing in the first place. I have to get a background check when I get a job, when I rent an apartment...does AirBnB really just let people sign up under pseudonyms without doing any one-time identity or background checks? I realize a background check may not have helped at all in this situation, and I don't know how much personal info AirBnB has stored on the guy that did all of this-- but how often is something like this going to happen when you know you're going to be tied directly to the aftermath of it?

Is there anyone on HN who runs a hotel that can say how often you have trashed rooms when you have accurate information on the people renting the room?

<comment><USER24> It's not just the issue of accurate information. Hotels have a security infrastructure in place and the rooms are checked regularly.

Had the criminals who did this tried it in a hotel there is a very good chance they would have been arrested straight away. They also have an agreement with the guest that the guest is liable for damages.

<comment><USER18> To be fair. I'd think a guest-liability thing wouldn't be too hard to work into AirBnB's infrastructure, although keeping the hosts honest is another question entirely.

Thinking about it as a whole, I have to wonder if the proper response would be to have a host-to-guest feedback system. As a host, you can request that guests have a certain "level" of feedback, with the drawback of receiving a reduced amount of money. Then on the other side, guests can get that as discounts-- as they travel and get good feedback from the hosts, they then can bunk at with the people who are, in essence, charging less.

Or maybe the whole system is untenable and couldn't possibly work without webcams set up in every room of the host's house. I guess we'll find out where it goes in the next week or so.

<comment><USER30> They already have host and guest reviews and feedback. Granted, most people are new to the system, and don't have feedback. As an AirBNB host, I screen potential customers all the time, and definitely seeing positive reviews from others is helpful.

<comment><USER31> Curious-- how does this incident affect your thoughts on being a host, if at all?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER32> Isn't this easily the most popular news about Airbnb this year?

I am surprised that they kept their mouth shut in all their public channels. No mention in the blog, no direct message in twitter. And it looks they chose to talk about this issue in TC only because TC wrote about the original story. This is what they replied to people in twitter:

 _@joyandjoy EJ's blog post says, "They have offered to help me recover emotionally and financially, and are working with SFPD"_

Yeah right. Now EJ's blog post says that they did not keep their promise.

This is what happens when you hesitate to help the victim of an incident like this and instead start plotting and planning PR activities supposed to do the damage control for your next valuation.

What a shame.

<comment><USER33> No, the problem is they did NOT do any PR planning whatsoever.

</comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> EJ writes: "And I was - but no longer am - scared of Airbnb's reaction, the pressure and the veiled threat I have received from them since I initially blogged this story."

Wow. That sounds quite different from what Brian Chesky claims here: [http://techcrunch.com/2011/07/27/on-safety-a-word-from- airbn...](http://techcrunch.com/2011/07/27/on-safety-a-word-from-airbnb/)

<comment><USER14> Chesky's claims are addressed directly in the blog post, and don't look good.

<comment><AUTHOR> "...don't look good." is quite the understatement. If he tried to manage the fallout, it totally backfired, and now they have a full-blown PR _nightmare_ to deal with, which could've been avoided.

<comment><USER18> >>Once our host's safety was secured, our attention moved to further strengthening our system.

In the context of this article, this sentence from their PR statement takes on a new and depressing overtone-- that of "Okay, we think the guy is arrested, so you're fine, right? We don't need to pay attention to you anymore, right? By the way, can you take down that blog post now?"

<comment><USER34> I don't like to be vulgar, particularly on HN, but it really needs to be asked.

Is anyone here really all that surprised Chesky is a douche?

<comment><USER35> Or it might just be that the guy is under a lot of stress and making bad decision. Watching your company potentially go up in flames with one incident is probably not an easy situation in which to make decisions.

We don't know the whole story. I understand the host stance also, basically on both sides they see things they've invested a lot into (her personal life and belongings, the company) be destroyed.

I'm not saying they are on the same level here (Her personal life and stuff is not easy to fix and she can't fail with that, at least not as easy as doing another company to me).

<comment><USER36> I agree. I can't even start to imagine the pressure. It's easy for us to say "he should have done like that" because we can think clearly from a distance.

This guy was one of us reading HN and hoping to make it a couple of years ago. Now he's managing millions.

Nobody really prepared him for that. I can imagine phone calls from people above him counseling to kill the story.

He may even had wanted to take a different approach but bend to pressure for what we know. Money talks loudly.

I don't like the was he's dealing with it, I just want to say that it must be very hard to take good decisions in such a situation.

<comment><USER37> If managing millions robs you of the empathy that is necessary in this situation then there is something very wrong in the whole situation.

A user of your service had their life upended as a direct result of loopholes in your vetting model. The LEAST you can do is reimburse them in full for their loss, take the monetary hit, and plug the holes in your model. If you are managing this in any other way you deserve to have your job forfeited.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER38> > _And for those who have so generously suggested a donation fund be set up to > help me recover, I thank you from the bottom of my heart, and suggest that > instead, you keep the money and use it to book yourself into a nice, safe > hotel room the next time you travel._

Will do.

</comment><comment><USER39> Just be a good company and take care of the customer. This isn't rocket science. Hire someone who is her personal assistant through the process until the process is over, help as much as possible.

Concerns for setting a cost-inefficient precedent? BS. Not helping her has become the real cost-inefficient precedent set in this case. I had no idea this had been going on for a month now.

This is a shame. Take care of your customers, so much more when they're in your backyard.

<comment><USER40> I would change personal assistant to agency. People in these type of situations tend to not deal as well with being assigned a person. A single person in an agency is fine as the office and desk lends to creditability and doesn't give the "another person invading my space" problem.

</comment></comment><comment><USER41> Brian Chesky (Airbnb CEO) here. My heart goes out to our host. My co-founder has contacted her multiple times, as recently as last night, and we have again offered to help her in any way that she needs. We will continue to make ourselves available to her to do whatever she asks of us in this time of need. We have encouraged her to reach us so that we can help her through this, and we are standing by.

<comment><USER42> I think you need to act on this, rather than just keep making promises. I also believe you would have helped already if you really wanted to.

You're essentially asking her right now to be a beggar, and putting her into an even more degrading position. What do you expect her to do? Write you that she needs $1000 for a new laptop, $100 for a new door, $50 for new locks?

Put yourself in her shoes. Doubt you would do that.

EDIT: Also, you can't have it both ways. If you state you're going to help her, then help her. Otherwise just state it's out of AirBnbs' reach, and the hosts should have insurance and pay carefull consideration to who they rent.

You're coming of as disingenuous in your remarks.

<comment><USER43> You're exactly right on this. She also simply lacks the energy to do everything she needs to do to overcome this. AirBnB could really turn this from a crisis to an opportunity by taking the bull completely by the horns here, and making her whole again, at least emotionally. Waiting for an emotionally scarred PTSD-victim to figure out and enumerate exactly what they need is not going to cut it.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER44> The internet is moving _really_ fast, I've already seen non tech people I know commenting about this on Facebook. They might have lost already. When something like this happens I think you probably have hours to sort it out, rather than weeks. Remember that it was less than 24 hours from the story breaking that News Corp decided the best course of action was closing a business with ~7 million repeat customers. Of course there may be other reasons they did this but still...

<comment><USER45> Which incident are you referring to?

<comment><USER46> The tabloid they owned that was tapping the phone lines of celebrities.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER47> From a comment on an earlier post by Brian Chesky:

 _We've created a marketplace built on trust, transparency and authenticity within our community, and we hold the safety of our community members as our highest priority._

I'm really not sure how he can reconcile that comment with the actions described in this post.

<comment><USER48> Thats just generic PR text. Almost boilerplate.

Isnt your BS-detector off the charts when reading 'trust' 'transparency' 'community' and 'highest priority' all in one sentence?

</comment></comment><comment><USER49> It seems like easy money, but being a landlord is a crummy business to be in. I haven't had an experience quite this bad, but we screen our tenants, don't keep our own valuables where they can get them, and take a large deposit up front. We have still had places trashed and had to pay repairs of well over $10k to return them to rentable condition when someone moves out...

Luckily we have much of the tenants information to try to collect from them. Un-luckily we can almost never collect damages from these types of people. They will quit their job to not have an income we can garnish.

You don't want to be a landlord. I don't want to be a landlord.

<comment><USER30> I would propose that being a landlord, and hosting on AirBNB have the potential to be quite different things. My father is a landlord, he shares similar stories of disaster. He also rents out in a low-income, remote area.

My AirBNB offering is near Boston, where 85% of my visitors are traveling here as tourists from far away. I keep my nightly price reasonable, but on the higher end. I ask plenty of questions about the visiting party, where they're coming from, what they do for work, what they plan to do while here, and I require a photo.

If I receive any questionable answers, they delay in providing the information, or just anything seems off, I call it off with that prospect.

I've hosted well over 100 people in the last 18 months for over 100 nights. With the exception of one of my first guests, I don't believe any of the people who have stayed with us are the kind of people that would cause damage, much less any trouble.

<comment><USER49> What would you do if you had had the same sort of experience that EJ had? I think you might change your mind.

Let's look at your numbers... I'll guess that you charge $150/night (minus the $20 AirBNB fee = $130/night you had 100 nights in 18 months, for an average of ~$722/month.

That's a tidy sum. Is it worth the work, risk and headache? Would the value of the extra property you are keeping and renting provide a better return if you moved to a smaller place and put the value difference in another investment?

These are questions you have to ask yourself, and everyone will have different opinions. My opinion is that being a landlord means having illiquid assets that provide a low return with high risk and a lot of work.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER50> Hmm... At this point, AirBnB has gone beyond the point of reconciliation with this EJ. Either she is lying or AirBnB is lying.

The onus is on AirBnB to supply evidence to the contrary of what EJ has to say. They have more at stake. Their brand is now blowing in the wind along with the goodwill they have built up.

What we have so far is that you have indeed offer to help financially. What we don't have is evidence to support you did or you did and she turn down the offers. Appropriate receipts would easily discredit her. Any other response short of supplying document would only discredit AirBnB.

<comment><USER51> It's not just AirBnB, it is the whole YC brand that is at stake. PG on this thread is now on record coming out in defense of AirBnB -- and effectively saying that EJ is lying when contrasted to those "nice guys" over at AirBnB.

</comment></comment><comment><USER52> We've had the initial blogpost and Brian Chesky's response on Techcrunch. I would love to read what Airbnb CEOs have to say about the second blog post.

I think they should take credible steps as soon as possible to improve the author's situation. While they're at it, an explanation of how such incidents can be stopped from happening again would also be good.

If trust is so important for their business model, they have to demonstrate that Airbnb is trustworthy.

</comment><comment><USER53> "Airbnb was mentioning their funding to a victim of ransacking? OMG that's bad..." (quote from TC comment)

</comment><comment><USER54> I'm much more inclined to believe EJ than Airbnb's spin. The week after EJ's story appeared one of my writers (I'm an editor at a travel website) approached EJ for a story we were doing about safety and vacation rentals. She helped out on the story, but didn't want any more attention drawn to her case at that point. She's been thrust back into the spotlight b/c of Airbnb's spin, not because she's out to get them. If her story was fake, Airbnb wouldn't be doing the serious damage control they're engaged in now.

I think they're seriously worried that the attention to the case will highlight two big weaknesses of their product: 1. In many markets, it's illegal to do short-term rentals, 2. Homeowners/renters insurance doesn't cover damages in these situations. Many markets won't crack down on these rentals (see the NYT story about SF rentals last weekend), but if they in the name of safety or code violations, Airbnb's got a problem. And if people start getting spooked about insurance issues, they're screwed from the other end.

</comment><comment><USER55> This is such a tragic situation. I am shocked by the lack of response by Airbnb. The very least they can do is provide her assistance and connecting her with the right resources to move forward.

When I was in college, a classmate in a philosophy class found out I was a business major and turned to me and said "you guys are just so heartless." I resented the statement but brushed it off as a gross generalization. Situations like these just prove my classmates point to be more real than I was willing to admit at the time. Putting profit above the safety and well being of your customers/users is a terrible business practice that will certainly lead to the death of your business. This isn't even about PR, this is fundamental to the future of the Airbnb platform and they aren't even listening.

The hotel lobby has a huge opportunity here that I don't think they realize yet. With this being on the front page of the Financial Times today, the hotel lobby should be swooping in anytime to pick up the pieces of Airbnb's failure to act. If I were the manager of any hotel in the SF area, I'd be offering her a free stay until things got sorted out. Airbnb is going to be left in the wake wondering what the hell happened.

</comment><comment><USER56> This is reminding me of the Soutwest Air response to the mistreatment they put Kevin Smith thru. When he went public, it was obvious they didn't give a damn about him and they were totally in damage control mode. Rather than apologize and recognize the error, they tried to turn it into a debate about whether fat people should fly, and they misrepresented the situation further.

I saw that comment on tech crunch and felt that Chesky was begin dishonest (based solely on having ready he previous blog post from ej) and now we see that AirBnB tried to get her to shut up!

As a frequent AirBnB customer (staying in a place rented via AirBnB at the moment, in fact) I'm finding that I'm having less and less faith in the company as these incidents unfold. (I'm not just talking about this, but Kutchner, the Craigslist, the fact that they keep their customers in the dark, etc.)

Frankly, as someone who has been online for two decades now, talking to people I can get a good feeling for how trustworthy they are. AirBnB inhibits this because it inhibits communication-- it can only happen thru their service which is not conducive to having a dialog.

The sole purpose of restricting this communication and restricting customer's ability to assess the risk in any of these transactions is AirBnB's desire to prevent the possibility that a deal might happen off of their site.

Reality is, this is silly. We found an apartment on AirBnB once and then found it on the internet (wasn't hard given knowledge of the details of the apartment.) We could have booked it that way and saved the AirBnB commission... but we booked it thru AirBnB anyway because we wanted them to escrow the funds. (Little did we know how little protection AirBnB provides in that regard.) But we were able to find out more about that apartment by looking at its website compared to the info on AirBnB.

And more importantly, having the owner's email address allowed us to discuss a lot of possible issues about the situation, and assess their trustworthiness... something impossible or difficult to do thru AirBnB.

</comment><comment><USER57> We're lucky this was a property crime. I know the victim is feeling crushed right now, but property can be replaced (aside from some personal items). There is a huge potential for a sick property owner or vacationer to become violent with the other party. Imagine if they story was about a kidnapping, murder, assault, or rape. AirBnB better figure out the mechanism for their background check ASAP, becuase you can count people being good >99.9% of the time, but that <0.1% breaks your system.

</comment><comment><USER58> _"...keep the money and use it to book yourself into a nice, safe hotel room the next time you travel. You'll be glad you did."_

Statements like this certainly fuel the hotel industry conspiracy theories from yesterday for me. It doesn't even make sense, as she claims the hotels will be safer for the travellers. The travellers safety was never at question here was it?

<comment><USER48> I read it as just an elaborate way of saying "Thanks, but no thanks", and "dont use AirBnB"

</comment></comment><comment><USER59> Just like everyone else, I hope the AirBNB guys will do the right thing.

I don't know if many of you have seen her Jan 2nd post titled 'New Year. New Home.'

"As 2011 sets in, I find myself curled up on a new couch in a new apartment in a not-so-new city, reading today's (and yesterday's) New York Times, and listening to the rain fall against the skylight overhead. A Duraflame log burns in the fireplace, a bar of dark chocolate sits half-eaten on the counter, and a lull of soft music whispers from the stereo. I am cozy, comfortable and perfectly content. I am home."

".... unpacking dusty boxes, unloading suitcases and scouring the internet for furniture. Something along the lines of a home began to take shape, and with it came that invaluable feeling of being at peace."

"....For the time being anyway, it's my home. And - surprisingly or not - <USER3> pretty great home it's turning out to be."

It is a tragedy.

</comment><comment><USER24> Does AirBnB educate hosts on the risks involved?

Does it encourage them to remove valuables and non-replaceable items from the apartment being rented?

Does it tell them that any damages incurred will probably not be covered by their homeowners insurance? Does it provide information on how to attain extra insurance?

Does AirBnB hold the guest liable for any damages to a hosts property?

</comment><comment><USER60> I think this is a shakedown, even if it occurred as EJ said.

Renting one's own living space to someone sight unseen is absurdly naive. It is incumbent upon the owner of the property to protect his own. Hotels do it, B&Bs do it, but EJ did not. That is sheer stupidity. There should have been someone to meet the renter and to monitor their stay.

The relationships here are business relationships and there are certain minimal precautions one should take. EJ took none. I don't believe she is justified in insisting that Airbnb fix everything. She learned a lesson (and luckily, so did many others vicariously). A normal person would stand up, clean up and learn. A nutball would get a lawyer (and eventually lose).

Also, doesn't she have insurance? Although I would imagine that most policies would not cover renting one's dwelling to a complete stranger sight unseen without a special rider ("hotel insurance" maybe).

Finally EJ might look at her property's deed restrictions. Is she allowed to run a business at her residence? Is she allowed to rent her home? Is she required by the state or city to to pay a "hotel tax", a "business registration fee", etc.? EJ may be in violation of any number of municipal and state laws.

</comment><comment><USER61> Upon reading the article about TaskRabbit, I think Airbnb can apply the same type of checks:

"Since many common tasks are carried out in the senders' homes, runners are vetted through a three-step process..

which starts with an application form and progresses to an automated phone or video interview that poses a series of questions designed to weed out deadbeats.

Finally, TaskRabbit pays the database giant Acxiom to perform a federal criminal background check on each prospective worker."

<http://www.wired.com/magazine/2011/07/mf_taskrabbit/>

</comment><comment><USER62> I guess I'm weirdly cynical, but I never though airbnb had a viable model. Perhaps for rental properties, but I would never rent my own home. I see a certain analogy between this and hitchhiking. Hitchhiking used to be safe in America, but now you rarely see it because it's perceived to be dangerous. I always figured airbnb would follow the same trajectory.

<comment><USER63> I think I remember reading that pg had the same reaction, and was surprised at how many users they got, then decided to invest. I too thought it was a terrible idea, and was (and still am) surprised that people would want to do this.

I am not saying this single incident is proof either way, but that was my initial reaction to the idea.

</comment></comment><comment><USER64> It would be great if some journalist would do a bit of fact checking on both sides of the story instead of just blindly republishing what they both claim to be the truth. I'm sure someone must have a SFPD source that could verify some of this story, even off the record would be better than nothing.

</comment><comment><USER65> My advice would be to forget PR, forget trying to spin it. Just tell the truth, do the right thing for the victim, and figure out how to prevent it going forward.

 __ _That's all they have to do._ __

</comment><comment><USER66> Awful customer service and PR failure on Airbnb's part, they should be ashamed. Not only did they NOT do anything to help this poor woman but they lied about it for positive PR and asked her to remove/edit the blog? Wow, that's about as low as it gets.

</comment><comment><USER67> I doubt I'm the only one that was interested in using AirBNB with their growing traction and successes.

No way will that happen now. It's hard to imagine how they could have handled this worse.

<comment><USER18> >>It's hard to imagine how they could have handled this worse.

At least they had the foresight to take down the snarky "nobody'll steal a grand piano" comment off their FAQ.

</comment></comment><comment><USER68> Parallels with DropBox and their no password login disaster? Bad processes and a botched PR response.

Methinks these super-hot startups may be reaching critical mass before they develop business maturity.

<comment><USER69> Very true - though look at some large companies and you see them make the same mistakes. It all trickles down.

</comment></comment><comment><USER32> Update: SF police arrest suspect in trashing of Airbnb rental

[http://news.cnet.com/8301-27080_3-20085741-245/sf-police- arr...](http://news.cnet.com/8301-27080_3-20085741-245/sf-police-arrest- suspect-in-trashing-of-airbnb-rental/)

</comment><comment><USER70> What a huge missed opportunity for AirBnB! For a drop in the bucket of time & expense, they could have easily come out of this looking stellar & likely would have gained the business of many people who have been on the fence.

Instead the come out looking like they're trying to hide the flaws in their model.

</comment><comment><USER71> Now wait for the mainstream media to jump on this.

<comment><USER72> Here's one: [http://www.businessinsider.com/airbnb-not-safe-the-renter- st...](http://www.businessinsider.com/airbnb-not-safe-the-renter-stolen- identity-and-destroyed-her-life-2011-7) and it showed up on the first page when i searched for AirBnB on Google. And there's a Techcrunch post on the bottom of the first page as well.

<comment><USER19> That's from a couple days ago. I somehow doubt future stories will paint airbnb in such a positive light.

<comment><USER72> True it's from two days ago. But the title is 'AIRBNB HORROR' (yes in all caps). I wouldn't want that showing on a Google's first results page when googling my companies name.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER73> Just to kick off an alternate perspective on the situation: up until reading about this incident, airbnb and the whole business model of "borrow my home" has somehow escaped my attention, and even though what has happened in EJ's situation is really horrible and she has my sympathy, I definitely recognise that her case is an extreme minority case that potentially wouldn't affect me as a user of the service. After reading about airbnb following this incident and browsing their website a bit, I am actually quite keen on trying the service! So perhaps any publicity really is good publicity!

</comment><comment><USER74> The people who did this are horrible, and Airbnb definitely has areas they could improve their process.

That said, I'm more shocked at "EJ's" naivety and passing of all responsibility on Airbnb. You're renting your place out to complete strangers, not only that, you're leaving all of your valuables there with them. You don't know their real (or the fake one they stole) name until you're already aboard an outbound plane?! That is insanity to me.

If a person NEEDS Craigslist-style warnings about being careful, that person should probably not rent their place out on Airbnb. This is just very poor judgement on her part.

<comment><USER43> True. I've used AirBnB a few times and it was always while the host was still in the apartment. It never occured to me that people would rent their apartment via AirBnB without actually being there.

I do wonder now whether EJ's 'DJ Pattrson' knew she would be away and planned to ransack the place whether she were home or not. If she were home, what would they have done, tied her in the closet, or worse?

</comment></comment><comment><USER75> The real nightmare is Airbnb's handling of this situation. Slow and inadequate response, a founder trying to put a spin/silence the victim (this is called a coverup) and another founder sending a feeble email stating he/she"would enjoy meeting" the victim. Sure, if I was the victim I would love to grab a cup of coffee with the founder of the company that created a service that was the direct catalyst of the most traumatic event of my life in recent years to "touch bases" and get to know each other. How about, "I would like to personally meet you to apologize and talk about how we can make this situation right. Here's my phone number, please call me any time of the day." You're in the same neighborhood, surely you can get in touch personally in five weeks if you tried hard enough.

And pg doesn't seem to have a clue when it comes to the "personal touch" either. "Fix it", in this case doesn't mean compensating all damages financially and maybe adding a little extra money for trouble. The victim's home and sanctuary was violated by people. If this was a natural disaster, maybe money would go a long way, but this person's trust in people was violated and she also lost "priceless" memorabilia etc. to vandals who are either social misfits and/or drug addicts that methodically deceive unknowing victims.

This situation is reminiscent of Sony's reaction to cracker attacks. The criminals attacked a glaring hole in the security model, company shifts blame to criminals. "A community built on trust" without security? What about trust and verify? The victim clearly states that Craigslist has a better security model and for all we know that couch surfing site too.

The lack of security measures in this case illustrate a glaring hole in the founder's approach to the problem. Any casual observer would conclude that the safety of users is only secondary to the company's goals of generating more revenues and obtaining more funding.

Airbnb, please come out of the state of denial and just simply admit:

A. We messed up big time

B. Any compensation will never truly fix this situation but we will do everything within reason to remedy it

C. Lessons from this disaster will be applied immediately to ramp up security and formalizing the response of such crises in the future.

</comment><comment><USER76> Even though Fred Wilson said "We couldn't wrap our heads around air mattresses on the living room floors as the next hotel room and did not chase the deal."

...with regards to not funding airbnb I somehow feel that that might not have been the case.

I think Fred's age (49?) and experience in life basically made it hard to understand how an idea like this couldn't have potential problems such, as only one example, this situation.

Hold on a second before you say "it only happened this one time".

How do we know that? People seem to think that either your place gets trashed or it's absolutely fine.

It's not digital it's analog. There's an in between state.

Something could get stolen that you don't know even about until much later. It won't always be the obvious thing like jewelry (and why would you leave that actually) it could be one of many little things you don't realize you have until missing. Or something could be broken.

The fact is there is no way for airbnb to insure against any number of minor type things that could happen. Where minor becomes your problem and your aggravation.

Have you ever seen how big of an industry shoplifting prevention is? Do you really think that only a minor % of the population commits petty type crimes?

And there is the reverse situation.

If you stay at someones place what if they honestly think that you stole something of theirs because they can't find it? Honest mistakes like this happen all the time. And the most obvious culprit tends to be blamed.

</comment><comment><USER77> It seems to me that what AirBnB should do is just this:

1\. Announce they are instituting a (possibly optional) insurance policy. At most, there should be a checkbox when I rent my place out that says 'insure it' and if I check it they take the cost of insurance out of what I'd get paid otherwise. If insurance is cheap enough (I don't know what 'cheap enough' is) they can simply make it mandatory.

(The decision to self-insure or use an external insurance agency is not germane to this discussion... that's something they need to figure out internally.)

2\. Offer this person some sum (say, 5x what insurance would have paid) for her silence.

Now, I'm sure they are working on 2. but I think #1 is actually more important, because many of us are not going to be willing to do this negotiation in public to get compensation... so insurance is better all around. The people renting out the houses know they can get paid with minimal hassle, and AirBnB knows exactly how much it is going to cost ahead of time. If you can find an insurance company that insures hotels, they might also be able to help with risk mitigation efforts.

I really think that instituting some sort of insurance policy is a good way for AirBnB to accept responsibility for the problem, and a realistic "and this is what we are doing to mitigate the problem going forward"

</comment><comment><USER78> Last paragraph of the blogpost: EJ doesn't want other people to help her and strongly advises them to book a hotel room instead of using airbnb.. after all that happened to her, shouldn't that be of latter concern? I mean being in her shoes, I would welcome any donations from people willing to help.. unless of course it's not a true story.

I can't be sure of course, but all the anonymity around it makes it kind of suspicious.

</comment><comment><USER79> Airbnb should look at,this situation as an opporrunity to turn bad publicity into a good one. Some bucks taken out from huge funding rounds and spent towards ej would go a long long way. This should also be combined with better identity measures implemented to avoid airbnb from having to cover cost of any more cases like these.

</comment><comment><USER80> Question: Suppose that I use airbnb to rent out my apartment to someone, and that person leaves the door unlocked and a third person goes in and steals my imac. Who takes liability here? Is there something in the airbnb agreement which explicitly waives rights to pursue airbnb for the losses?

</comment><comment><USER81> Airbnb should probably read their 6th golden rules of thumb

<http://www.airbnb.com/home/goldenrules>

"If something goes wrong unexpectedly, be accessible to help remedy the situation. Be a hero to your guest!"

</comment><comment><USER82> "He requested that I shut down the blog altogether or limit its access"

If true, that's really sleazy.

</comment><comment><USER83> Airbnb's Terms & Privacy section states that "We are not involved in the actual face-to-face contact between users," have "no control over the conduct of our users or the truth or accuracy of the information that users post," and " do not investigate any user's reputation, conduct, morality, criminal background, or verify the information that any user submits to the Site."

It's a business, they're supposed to be money driven. Although it's sad to see someone abuse the system, she agreed to those terms when she put her apartment up there. The owners aren't obligated to recompense the lady.

<comment><USER84> Absolutely and let's assume they don't. If the facts of the case are as stated, then Airbnb acted unethically in my opinion. Since their lack of ethics cannot be punished in a court of law, the author claims her right to smear the company publicly. That's all this post is meant to do and I think that's just.

</comment></comment><comment><USER85> What's totally missing here is some kind of compassionate reaction from Airbnb.

Regarding that joke in the FAQ about guests stealing the grand piano: I think it's okay to make such a joke IF AND ONLY IF the reaction to a case like this is in the same vein: The minute they learned about this ordeal, they should have stopped working, cancel all meetings and help her. And if that means mopping her floors themselves then do it. They did the opposite, they acted greedily and stingily and thereby didn't just let down the girl, but everyone in the startup community who admired and rooted for them.

<comment><USER86> > _The minute they learned about this ordeal, they should have stopped > working, cancel all meetings and help her. And if that means mopping her > floors themselves then do it._

Doing so might well be appropriate, but they'd probably want to downplay that fact---otherwise, they'd risk raising the bar for their response the next time something happens. Gotta try to manage expectations, difficult as that is.

</comment></comment><comment><USER87> I'm slightly concerned that AirBNB are spinning this rather than just sorting stuff out. Veiled threats to the victim, whilst spreading incorrect stories are a concerning development in an already distressing case. If the guy in custody is the guy responsible, why are AirBNB and EJ not in sync? This smells massively of a total PR disaster for AirBNB, whatever is said about compensation or no, threatening victims, or telling them to 'limit access to their blog' is as naive as it is stupid - how does the internet usually react to 'limiting access'?

</comment><comment><USER88> _And for those who have so generously suggested a donation fund be set up to help me recover, I thank you from the bottom of my heart, and suggest that instead, you keep the money and use it to >> book yourself into a nice, safe hotel room the next time you travel <<. You'll be glad you did._

Devil's advocate (not being inconsiderate): doesn't the hotel industry have an enormous interest in the demise of Airbnb? Interesting how the blog posts makes this suggestion after the heart strings have been tug.

</comment><comment><USER89> Oh boy....this is going downhill fast!

</comment><comment><USER90> This is pretty awful. I'm hoping Airbnb takes care of her. They are in a pretty tough position, though.

If they go under because of this I personally hope it is not until August. So, first and foremost, fix EJ's situation, but also for all of the people who are still using the service, currently using the service, or have plans made in the next few weeks through this service, take care of this. Don't leave her hanging.

Also, it is unfortunate that Airbnb will be known by a lot of new people because of this incident.

</comment><comment><USER91> Did anyone see this as an utter failure of handling customer expectations by Airbnb? Don't make promises if you're unable to keep them. I feel very sorry for this poor lady.

</comment><comment><USER92> Noone has commented this yet. What are the chances this is all in some way a PR play (possibly gone bad) to get on the news during a round of funding? (The "there's no such things as bad publicity" kind)

Not saying it is .. but I do wonder. The only thing that would make it doubtful is that part where she says he told her about _the impact on Airbnb round of funding_. But then again, if your mind is twisted ...

</comment><comment><USER93> Between this and the spammy--potentially illegal--posts to Craig's List ([http://www.tnooz.com/2011/06/01/news/airbnb-admits-rogue- sal...](http://www.tnooz.com/2011/06/01/news/airbnb-admits-rogue-sales-team- used-craigslist-for-stealthy-property-drive/)) to generate rentals, it's very hard to think of AirBnB as a well run company.

</comment><comment><USER94> Prediction: She will sue Airbnb. And win.

<comment><USER95> How so? I don't think Airbnb is liable for any damages to her property.

<comment><USER96> I'm not sure why this being downvoted. What liability does Airbnb have? Financially, the burden for the damage should be covered by the host's renter's insurance. If she wasn't properly insured, how is that the fault of airbnb?

<comment><USER97> One cannot be insured for this occurrence. Neither homeowner's nor renter's insurances cover paid guests in the home.

<comment><USER96> Homeowner's and renter's insurance are not the only types of insurance there are. Who insures traditional BnB's?

<comment><USER97> From the earlier conversations on this particular issue, business insurance (i.e. landlord insurance, hotel insurance) is needed. You can't get business insurance to run an unlicensed business in a private residence, particularly if a) your home isn't zoned for it, and b) if it violates your lease (in the case of a rental)/HOA (in the case of homeownership)/local law (in the case of NYC/SF/Paris et al.). Is there an opportunity there for someone to step up and insure Airbnb-style rentals? Yes. Meanwhile, though, these rentals are not insurable.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER98> The solution for AirBnB is (or was...) simple.

1\. Make this person whole, at least in terms of material possessions and safety, to the extent possible. And do it __FAST __

2\. Ask them to take down the blog, and replace it with something along the lines of "my situation is resolved. Thank you AirBnB. But I can't discuss the terms".

3\. Work on strengthening your internal processes to make sure the chances of a similar incident are further reduced by a couple of orders of magnitude

4\. Improve your customer-service department.

But it's been almost a month, and they still haven't done any of this. They just seemed too concerned about what this will do to their valuation. This is pure bullshit on their part! It shows that they have absolutely no idea how to operate in a customer-facing industry.

</comment><comment><USER99> This story is beginning to smell fishy. I was burglarized in a similar, but not as extreme manner. My landlord was involved immediately. Why is there no mention of the property owner in any of these stories?

In my case, the "investigation" was over in about 1.25 days. There's not much the police can do. SFPD would not spend 2 months investigating a burglary in an illegal sublet.

Furthermore, there are no photos of the damage, the victim is anonymous, and there is no description of the neighborhood or apartment complex. If someone was bent on catching the burglars, more info would be disseminated, not less. The articles are written as though the author has an axe to grind with AirBNB, not that she wants to catch the thieves.

<comment><USER100> Why not mention the landlord? Maybe because it's not particularly relevant? I mean, what would she say about the landlord? "I told the landlord, and he commiserated with me, and helped me change the locks." And heck, she already mentioned changing the locks.

As far as the investigation, Airbnb has claimed that a suspect has been apprehended, but apparently neither the SFPD nor Airbnb have contacted her with any further details. She's not necessarily blaming the SFPD for not having caught the suspect; but she's arguing that the spin that Airbnb has put on this story is untrue, that everything has not been resolved, and they have not been as helpful as they claim.

And why would someone who had just been victimized by someone anonymous they connected with on the internet want to publish a whole bunch of personal details all over the internet? Internet vigilantism is not some silver bullet; publishing more information may lead her to be more vulnerable, not less. Her intent is not to get "the internet" to help catch the thieves; her intent is to warn people about the risks of using Airbnb's service, and that Airbnb will basically do nothing to mitigate those risks.

And it's not like this story is completely made up. Brian Chesky wouldn't have written a response confirming many of the details and contesting none of them if the story were untrue. All he did was try to put a positive spin on it, which this second post demonstrates is just spin, with no real content.

<comment><USER99> This is a 37 year old woman who lived in NYC for 6 years and then spent two year traveling to places like Brazil and Bogota, Columbia. At this point she knows that people suck and shit happens. She definitely does not have PTSD from this experience. I take back any thing that might have suggested I agreed with the conspiracy theorists. This woman is BROKE and she's trying to spin this hard to get some sort of payout from AirBNB.

<comment><USER101> There's a world of difference between seeing shit happen to other people and having it happen to you. You might think you're ready to handle it, but the moment you're violated it will likely affect you in ways that you could never really imagine. (and that's not to say that everyone will fall apart - <USER4> it's almost never what you expected)

<comment><USER99> In my previous post I mention a similar burglary DID happen to me. Honestly, one cleans up and gets over it.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER102> My first thought is that you'd might actually have a higher chance of having someone trash your house if you leave it unoccupied for week vs. letting someone rent it on Airbnb.

<comment><USER103> If you leave it unoccupied for a week and it gets trashed you can probably claim from your insurance company. If you rent it out to a randomer online, the insurance company probably won't cover any damages.

<comment><USER102> True, didn't think of that.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER104> Does anyone actually know the "real" story? I feel like Airbnb/YC is saying one thing, and EJ is saying something else.

Is this a case of miscommunications that got blown out of proportion?

</comment><comment><USER105> I never understood any hype around AirBnB, my hunch was and is "stay at a distance, this is somehow dirty".

As an afterthought, I think, they sell an illusion, sack in money and let their customers alone take at least one huge risk.

For me they have already passed the point of no return, they have shown who they are (instead of supporting the victim full heartedly they play an evil game), I will not use their service.

Could this help: "As a gesture of goodwill and without acknowledging any legal obligation."

</comment><comment><USER106> Scary how fast a startup can get a bad company.

</comment><comment><USER107> Wow.

AirBnb is /done/.

</comment><comment><USER108> Is it possible that she made the story up?

<comment><USER109> Of course it's possible. Is it likely? No. Especially since airbnb already responded and acknowledged the situation.

</comment></comment><comment><USER110> I think the most disturbing part is how they tried to get her to take her blog or limit access to her blog post. The reason? Because it would hurt their funding round. So instead of a $5 billion valuation they now get $4.5 billion.

Please. The fact is this incident happened on their watch. Trying to pretend they are the hero in this mess and spin it their way bothers me tremendously. I mean, she got robbed as a consequence of using their site. That stuff happens and honestly I don't think anyone really believes they can stop all bad things from happening. But this whole let's try to hide this under the rug deal makes them look 1000x worse I think than her getting robbed (which still sucks!)

</comment><comment><USER111> So Chesky dropped the "suspect is in custody" line to give the press the impression of closure?

Foxy move on his part.

Looks like he just got busted though or the victim would surely know of the existence of a suspect.

</comment><comment><USER112> Just a side note.. have you guys ever wondered what the impact of this story would've been if AirBnB was not an YC company? That's a big reason why AirBnb is always talked about here. If this was just a regular, non-YC, non-funded company, I doubt this would be a big story. I doubt Techcrunch would talk about it and I doubt we here would vehemently argue about this... In the end, it's about a woman who's room got trashed.. Yes, very unfortunate, but let's face it, this would not make big headlines if this was just a regular company.

</comment><comment><USER113> All of this discussion about what airbnb should or shouldn't do is ultimately moot now. Unless they can prove "EJ" is totally fictional and/or an insane liar the company is essentially dead in the water already (at least as a US operation). Not just because of the PR hit (though that is substantial), but because of the inevitability of media, lawyers & politicians circling the wagons around this story.

Airbnb's business will be explicitly illegal throughout much of the US by year's end, and honestly in its current incarnation I'm not convinced that it is a bad thing (for obvious reasons this is clearly a market which needs more regulation and process than they provide).

Nice experiment... too bad about all of that flushed away money though.

</comment><comment><USER114> tl;dr: Devil's Advocate.

This is not going to be very popular, but I'm just going to go on the record and say that this whole story may be a hoax.

And I highlight "maybe". What we have here are two blog posts from someone we know nothing about who epitomizes a concentration of fears (woman, home, identity, violation) and manages, in two blog posts over the past seven months to bring about a PR nightmare for AirBnB. Is Chesky and idiot and/or sociopath? Probably not, and this could be some crappy CYA on AirBnB's behalf, but the second blog post in response to Chesky's On Safety release does nothing but reinforce and add onto the imagined fetal-curling fears the author expressed in her first post, but also systematically tries to disprove any actions mentioned by Chesky while simultaneously smearing unnamed AirBnB reps.

Two blog posts over seven months. Talented writer with no writing history able to communicate and project emotions and elicit visceral responses from complete strangers.

Am I the only one whose bullshit alarm is going off?

Disclaimer: I have no connection to YC, pg, AirBnB, Chesky, Starwood Hotels nor have I participated in AirBnB's program or any similar crashpad/couchsurfing/hosteling schemes.

<comment><USER57> That doesn't really make any sense. If it was a hoax, AirBnB would have come out and said that in their TC post. Instead they came out and said effectively 'yes, this happened, we're fixing it'. The victim is now disagreeing with AirBnB's assertion that they are fixing it.

Obviously AirBnB has confirmed the damage to her house. As have the police. So you are basically arguing that she trashed her own house and committed the crime of filing a false police report in an all out effort to crush AirBnB. Occam's Razor tells me the odds of that being the true angle here are slim.

As for your comments 'someone we know nothing about' and 'talented writer with no writing history'. You know nothing about her. You have never seen her writing before. But why should you know a random stranger? And most writers are not bloggers. The internet is not the universe. I've won a bunch of awards for my fiction writing, yet you probably can not find more than my HN posts online from me. Believe it or not, some things exist out there that Google can't find.

<comment><USER114> > Obviously AirBnB has confirmed the damage to her house. As have the police.

Sorry, but I've seen no proof of either and I doubt that you have. Even if AirBnB has seen the damage as reported by the host and the SFPD have a person in custody, what we have is the alleged destruction of property and alleged identity theft. Alleged, not proven.

> You know nothing about her.

Exactly, but what I do know is that there's a person who has made use of her blog three times this year: 1/22, 6/29 and 7/28. Two of those posts relate to AirBnB, drawing attention to the intense emotional trauma she's currently suffering and inattention and callousness that AirBnB is displaying towards her situation. Prior to that, we have an entry from 8/3/10. Nothing much to go by in order to assess who this person was prior to the AirBnB incident. Except we do have a blogroll link for "My year of getting published" dated one month ago. How odd.

Another thing that we have, and I'm drawing my own conclusions here, is the perfect recipe to get noticed in a sea-full of nerds: single vulnerable white female, lives alone in SF, violated by the actions of an unknown person or persons and who is crying out for help, appealing to the crowd who'll most like empathize with her: nerdy single guys who'd jump at the chance to put on their cape and save the day. It's too perfect of a recipe to ignore.

So what I'm saying is that she should get herself a lawyer, today, and have them handle her case and public relations going forward, because we all know that she's going to sue AirBnB and due to the amount of buzz she's been generating on the Twitters, my guess is that many a TV producer has been tasked with tracking her down for an interview. We'll see how that plays out.

If it took Chesky a whole month to address these issues of hers and implement changes in the organization to address them and those issues were real and valid, then shame on him, but something tells me that they may have expected this problem to go away.

I'm not trying to draw and links between this woman's complaint and those of the Groupon cafe owner, but it sees to me that, as always, people are engaging in activities whose potential consequences they know nothing about and in response they take to the web to generate outrage in support of their situation, but in those cases that I'm aware of, the stories start to unravel once they undergo any scrutiny beyond reading a blog post or two.

And if I'm still able to gauge public opinion correctly amongst the normals, most are going assume that you get what you deserve for handing the keys to your apartment to a total stranger for a whole week. It's something that is simply not done in the real world.

<comment><USER57> What do you mean it's not something done in the real world? What is VRBO.com (vacation rental by owner). I've taken a half dozen vacations where I rented someone elses house - long before AirBnB. There have been vacation houses in ski towns for decades, on the shore for literally hundreds of years. The only twist AirBnB provides is that it competes with regular hotels - not just vacation homes. And I know more than one vacation home owner who has a similar story to the one told here. People trash vacation homes. People trash normal rental apartments. It happens all of the time.

The apartment I live in now had $15,000 in damage done by the previous tenant when he was evicted for not paying rent. He took a sledgehammer to the toilets and walls. He spray painted the ceiling and burned the curtains. My friend's vacation house at Disney World had all of the furniture stolen by someone renting it. This stuff happens all the time.

The only thing I'm shocked by is that this is the FIRST incident on AirBnB that we've heard of. They should have had a plan to deal with it. I'm not exactly deep in the rental scene and I have two stories to tell of this happening from people I personally know. This stuff must happen every week.

<comment><USER114> > vacation houses

Renting out your apartment to include all of your worldly belongings, not a vacation-purposed structure, or loaning your car to a complete stranger through a scaled web application is a relatively new phenomenon and the normals, who often view their vacation lodgings as part of the experience, simply do not participate in this type of activity as AirBnB wishes to scale. It's a very new and unique concept.

I'm shocked as well and I'm sure that incidents and misunderstanding have already occurred in the past and they've obviously been able to deal with them. And I'll bet that the AirBnB crew are shocked at what they're seeing right now, given the exposure that two blog posts have been able to generate.

Spats between businesses and customers rarely get this type of hype from a venerable institution like the FT this early in the story. This is the kind of exposure that you plan and pay for.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER115> A summary:

 _As of today, July 28, I have received no confirmation from either the San Francisco Police Department or the District Attorney that any culprit is in custody for my case._

 _I received a personal call from one of the co-founders of Airbnb. We had a lengthy conversation, in which he indicated having knowledge of the (previously mentioned) person who had been apprehended by the police, but that he could not discuss the details or these previous cases[sic] with me, as the investigation was ongoing._

 _Too much about this case remains unknown and unresolved, and according to both the District Attorneys and the police, it could be many more months before the criminal investigation moves forward._

Edit: This is clearly a problem with a thief, with society, with criminal behavior. This woman wants to throw her story and passive aggressive attitude around to destroy Airbnb, and it is blatantly obvious. Come on people.

I have been robbed. I have been a victim. I didn't flee to the internet to write a story about the gas station parking lot where it took place. Why? I would have gotten _no attention_ for it, _no sympathy_ , and the gas station would have not been to blame _at all_ and everyone knows that.

Not to be insensitive, but this is reminiscent of the type of people that sue McDonalds for spilling hot coffee all over themselves. Not entirely the same, but it feels oddly familiar.

Airbnb tries to offer a good service. That doesn't mean they can keep the murderers out of Disneyland. She made a good point that craigslist makes warnings of scams more obvious on their website than Airbnb. She should have honestly just left it at that. Because at this point she is just doing more damage on the perpetrator's behalf and _I think she knows it._

The knee-jerk reaction to this story is showing itself to be very far from this, so go ahead and downvote me, but nonetheless my opinion here is valid. Your next stay at Airbnb may very well be a scene out of the movie Hostel. It is just as likely however that it may happen at the next apartment you rent, the next hotel you stay at, or the next ski lodge. It doesn't matter that it was Airbnb.

I understand that she feels the reaction piece to her initial post was disingenuous, but with writing like this, it is clear she is just out to watch Airbnb burn. She should go hire a private detective and find the guy if she is so hell bent on revenge. She is after the wrong people. Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned. This woman has no target and her anger is entirely misdirected.

This is what insurance in our society is for. Get some. Be happy for what _didn't_ go wrong and could have. She should be happy she didn't get raped when she got back to her apartment, as she _obviously crossed tracks with a very bad person_. Seriously. Shit happens in life. Everyone in this world has to deal with deceit, robberies, theft, and lies. She is no different, nor are you. She is playing out the sympathy excuse far too well. Her reaction is more similar to that of the McDonald's hot coffee victim than that of a robbery victim at this point. And like I said previously, I'm pretty sure she knows it.

Good luck Airbnb.

<comment><USER116> > This is what insurance in our society is for. Get some.

No homeowner's insurance will cover an Airbnb rental. Hell, finding a _lease_ which _permits_ an Airbnb rental would be tough, let alone finding someone to insure an apartment where strangers show up and pay you for it. You must know this, because it's been discussed to death all over this issue.

> Your next stay at Airbnb may very well be a scene out of the movie Hostel. > It is just as likely however that it may happen at the next apartment you > rent, the next hotel you stay at, or the next ski lodge.

This logic is incredibly faulty. This is the same as saying "you might get ripped off meeting a stranger on craigslist. It is just as likely however that it may happen at a Best Buy." The structure of airbnb lends itself toward antisocial behavior far, far more than a _hotel_. That kind of comparison is just deceitful.

In fact, to turn your "point" around, I find it more likely you're an airbnb employee/pg fanboy shilling than EJ being out to destroy airbnb. You've demonstrated complete disregard for logic and facts to defend airbnb in this situation. She's just told a story.

</comment></comment><comment><USER117> Fuck this shit. This is like when a Facebook user gets contacted by a raper using it; this is like when a Gmail account gets completly deleted.

Shit happens, and it will continue to happen to someone from time to time, but one case between thousands should not damage so much a single company.

<comment><USER117> BTW She is making more damage to the AirBnB employees (and their families) than the raiders did to her.

</comment></comment><comment><USER118> Who really cares?

<comment><USER28> I do.

</comment></comment><comment><USER119> Isn't Airbnb's reaction a normal one? Wouldn't anyone do the same if it could have adverse effects on their current round of funding?

<comment><USER45> Step 1) have home utterly destroyed via Airbnb

Step 2) write a blog post sharing how terrible the situation is, and to indicate you're _slightly_ upset about this

Step 3) get cut off from Airbnb customer service, then receive call from Airbnb co-founder asking to remove the blog post because "it might impact our funding"

No. I wouldn't do the same.

</comment></comment><comment><USER120> I feel badly for the person whose placed got trashed, and it seems Airbnb is doing what they can to remedy the situation - but am I the only one who feels there's a certain risk to be assumed with online transactions such as this?

If a girl meets a man on match.com who claims to be single, but after getting into a relationship with him she finds out he's married - is match.com to blame for this? Could they have done more to verify his background - perhaps, but that's also the risk we take.

It's an unfortunate incident, but trust me other than hacker news, techmeme and techcrunch (that's where the FT got it from) this is not really headline news, and it's not going to affect airbnb's performance in the long run.

On a separate note, I hope pg realizes with 423 comments on here it's hard to make heads or tails of what to read - hopefully the comments rating system will be brought back.

</comment><comment><USER121> This time her blog title is direct and to the point, and mentions Airbnb by name. It seems she's learning some SEO tactics during the course of this ordeal. Personally I'm glad as it seems obvious this story didn't deserve to be mostly unnoticed for most of a month after the first blog post went up.

<comment><USER71> SEO? Come on man.</comment></comment>