The ethics of the Guardian's Whisper bombshell - <AUTHOR> http://m.cjr.org/303546/show/fa2aa41c24bd3f6153bb074404b15eb1/? <comment><USER2> Let me give a list of people who actually should be named and shamed here:

Everyone who had seen the stuff going on but didn't blow the whistle.

I understand the people who did the deed - according to the description "A team headed by Whisper's editor-in-chief, Neetzan Zimmerman" \- they had some rather obvious profit motivation. I understand the people at The Guardian - they simply did the right thing. But everybody else at Whisper and their guests and passersby who had seen this happen - you suck. If you see your employer do slimy stuff, and put your "loyalty" as a reason to let it be, then you're as slimy and deserve to be associated with the slime and blamed for it, and I hope they're paying an appropriate price for selling your conscience.

If you see your acquaintance (or a company you're visiting or investing in) doing bad stuff, and simply do nothing, then that's not calling being a passive bystander - it's called being an accomplice, and you deserve to be treated as co-guilty.

<comment><USER3> Things are never that simple. There are often complicated situations that may prevent people from blowing the whistle (for example, people with families that rely on their income). It's never as black-and-white as you make it seem, and automatically lumping everyone into the "guilty" or "evil" camp is unjustified (unless you know the specifics of the people you're condemning?).

<comment><USER2> Of course, doing the right thing very often has a cost and self protecting behavior is very natural.

I can very much understand why they likely chose to do a bad thing and I can't claim that given their specific circumstances I woudn't do the same in their shoes - but yes, it is still justified to claim that they _did do a bad thing_.

Knowing the specifics of the people I'm condemning clarifies the justification and reasons for behaving the way they did but it cannot make their conscience clean. Having good personal reasons for behavior that hurts others is an understandable mitigating circumstance, but the actions should still be condemned by the wider society.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER4> Maybe if you're lying about your app and policies, it's probably not a good idea to bring a newspaper into your offices! Especially when its blatently obvious you're looking to use your app to either blackmail or leak this information for your own gain.

The Guardian is a newspaper, it acted exactly how it should have.

If I knowingly invite a cop into my house and I've got a pound of cocaine on my coffee table. Is it unethical for the cop to arrest me? No. They're a fucking cop!

If you don't want people knowing shady parts of your business, don't invite people who make a living publishing stories about shady goings on!

<comment><USER5> No, it's an excellent idea to bring in outsiders when you're lying! I hope it catches on!

<comment><USER6> I genuinely can't understand the thought processes of the nabobs who think the Grauniad acted inappropriately here. My first response was, "Journalism is not the priesthood," and considered it similar to interviewing Frank Underwood on background and _not_ reporting on his history of blackmail and murder. But it's really even simpler than that -- it's as if Nixon went on _Meet the Press_ and started bragging on-air about black-bag jobs to Spivak. Under what journalistic conventions _wouldn 't_ you report it out? Certainly makes you wonder what Business Insider _isn 't_ reporting.

(By the way, I apologize -- I mis-clicked when upvoting your comment, and had to upvote a few past comments to rectify the error. I posit my poor hand-eye coordination is the result of either too many espressos or not enough; I'll pull a few more shots and report back on the results.)

<comment><USER5> > By the way, I apologize

We'll get through this. :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> It is appalling how brazenly Keith Rabois, Dan Primack and interestingly Henry Blodget (charged with a civil securities fraud by SEC [1, 2]) acted publicly and pinned moral blame on Guardian. Reeks like repeat of Gary Webb episode.

What is wrong with Guardian's reporting on Whisper's? As this article shows, nothing at all. Good for them to break open this cabal and report user's best interests, and not being worried about getting lampooned on by "new" media. Good on CJR for this write-up, I very well appreciate it. Guardian acted like journalists here.

[1] - [http://www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/comp18115b.htm](http://www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/comp18115b.htm) [2] - [http://www.sec.gov/news/press/2003-56.htm](http://www.sec.gov/news/press/2003-56.htm)

Well i found this interesting article:- [http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/10/20/whisper_doorstepping](http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/10/20/whisper_doorstepping)

</comment><comment><USER8> It seems that Whisper is acting in a manner that is contradictory to almost every claim they make about the service and software. Isn't this just spyware?

\- They track your location regardless of stated preferences

\- They store "anonymous" messages indefinitely

\- They share contents of said messages with the media when it's profitable for the corporation

\- They freely share data with the US, UK and Chinese governments

\- They track users with a high potential for juicy posts "for life"

\- They lie about all of the above (though their terms have been updated since the Guardian revelations)

<comment><USER9> I think it's more nuanced than that. If geolocation is turned off, I don't think they are pulling GPS data anyway. So they are not 'tracking your location regardless of stated preferences' any more than every other site on the internet. They don't track anything that isn't implicit in the functioning of the internet -- i.e. an IP address.

Obviously they store the messages that their users submit to them. Their data retention should be spelled out in their ToS, and it's not clear if they are violating their own policies here. But take, for example, when Google a while back made a very concerted effort to ensure that deleting an email in Gmail actually meant the email would be deleted from all backups system-wide in some reasonably short timeframe (some number of days/weeks). However, prior to this, and in almost all databases worldwide, you will find that clicking 'Delete' doesn't actually remove the item from backups, and backups are kept for quite a long time / indefinitely.

An anonymous post is not necessarily a secret post, they are two different concepts entirely. I've never used Whisper, but when you post something there, I believe it is _entirely public_. On the face of it, there should be no more an issue sharing a tweet than sharing a whisper. To the following point, I would need to understand what _private_ data they are sharing, not simply that they are featuring specific public posts. If they do feature a post, it makes sense for them to do some due diligence on the veracity of the claims. Honestly, I'm not sure how I feel about them using GeoIP databases as part of that diligence. If someone makes a post to Whisper without using Tor then they have certainly given their IP address away completely willingly, but I'm not sure what restrictions on use of that IP are expected by Whisper, or by any site in general which logs IPs (all of them).

Whisper, very similar to Snapchat, both promise the impossible. If you understand that technically their core feature is not actually possible, you try to understand why do people use it anyway. Either they truly thought they were getting the impossible, or there's value to the platform anyway. With Snapchat, you can see how they are trying to reframe the issue from truly secure ephemerality to simply a _user interface_ which focuses on the present and discards the past. Similarly, Whisper is trying to reframe the issue from truly secure anonymity, to simply a user interface which doesn't include usernames / identity.

Unless you are a trained professional practicing perfect opsec, you _are not anonymous on the internet_. It's wrong and potentially dangerous that Whisper is making people feel like they are perfectly anonymous, but I almost wonder why anyone on HN would be surprised by any of this? As a cryptographer, I expect every piece of information I submit/leak to be used against me, so given there's literally nothing about Whisper that provides any security whatsoever, my expectation going into it would be that I am getting none. I get that my perspective is completely different from the average user on this.

<comment><USER10> That's a bit like saying "I'm a nutritionist. How could not think most of the aisles at the grocery store are out to kill you?"

<comment><USER9> Food isn't supposed to kill you, but the internet definitely is supposed to identify you. It's only through extraordinary measures that you can get on the internet anonymously, but it would take extraordinary measures to kill yourself eating at the grocery store.

If someone told me the corner grocery store was selling deadly food, I would be just as likely to believe them as someone telling me that posting on Whisper.sh keeps me securely anonymous on the internet.

<comment><USER11> > the internet definitely is supposed to identify you

If you have a rudimentary technical understanding of the internet, it's clear that the default assumption should be that you're identified unless presented with strong evidence/reasoning to the contrary. But what percentage of internet users do you think have any technical understanding of the internet? 20-30 percent, maybe? To most people it's basically magic, and they have no compelling reason to give any thought to how it works.

Regulations should be designed with the common user in mind, not the technically proficient. If a company claims that they provide anonymity, they should live up to that promise or be prosecuted for false advertising.

<comment><USER9> I think the fact that this was as big of a story as it is shows us how poorly people understand how privacy and anonymity work online.

The closer the general response to this story is "Well, duh" I think the better.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> Scary to see so many journalists piling onto other journalists who are actually doing their jobs in the public interest (but against corporate interests). Reminds me of the "journalists" who were so fast to criticize Glenn Greenwald for his NSA reporting.

<comment><USER13> Maybe they are afraid of compromising or losing unethical connection that they may be nurturing with some of these companies.

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> The Guardian acted perfectly ethically as a news organization.

The Guardian acted completely unethically as a business partner.

Another reason why introducing profit motives into a news organization is a recipe for trouble. Conflicts of interest like this are just too common.

<comment><USER2> I'm going to have to disagree here.

If some other business partner was shown the same thing as Guardian but chose to disregard it due to their business relationship, then I will consider them as unethical themselves, much more so if they took any active measures to hide it, such as a manager implying to their subordinate that they should keep their mouth shut about their ethical feelings re: their partner's behavior.

</comment></comment><comment><USER15> People need to understand this. If an app or service is free and some combination of:

(a) _At all_ expensive to run.

(b) Funded by investors who demand a return.

(c) Has no visible means of direct revenue.

... then you _REALLY_ need to ask the following question immediately before deciding to use it or what to entrust it with:

"How is it monetizing _me_?"

If you see an app or service like this, you are the product. It's either tracking you, spying on you, selling your data, somehow targeting you for advertising, or doing something else of a similar nature.

<comment><USER10> This isn't as axiomatic as you might think. Eyeballs count more than revenue in many cases, and can carry some ventures all the way through to liquidity with no profit on the horizon. This is especially true in messaging apps where building a network effect is a far higher priority than profit.

</comment></comment><comment><USER16> Clearly what Whisper was doing was newsworthy, but at the same time I can understand why other journalists would want to debate the issue since it could impact one of their profession's building blocks ( on-the-record v.s. off-the- record distinctions). The ethics around exceptions for similar tools such as attorney-client privilege and doctor-patient privilege are subjects for professional debate but what sets journalism apart is the number of people impacted by the scope of their decisions. Would a majority of lawyers feel compelled to alert the authorities in Whisper's case? Only if they were committing fraud. Lawyers necessarily are privy to an incredible amount of malfeasance, and no matter how troubled this knowledge might make them, their function depends on their silence.

Would a majority of journalists would feel this story was damaging enough to the public that they had an obligation to publish it? Probably.

Should we feel bad for the public personas who are being taken to task for expressing an opinion that ended up on the wrong side of the issue? To some degree, yes. While these avatars did seek out the relative fame that now shames them, their mistaken logic forces the projection of humanity that twitter and blogs represent to consider both sides, and pause.

<comment><USER17> Protecting your source and keeping stuff off the record only counts when your source is passing on information about a story, not when your source is the story.

edit - for example, if a journalist is investigating a crime and you offer to give them information as long as it stays off the record and they agree, but then you tell them you committed the crime they are trying to investigate, they have no obligation whatsoever to keep what you said to them off the record.

<comment><USER9> No. Once you agree you are talking off the record, there's no going back on that. In this case, however, I don't think anyone has claimed that Guardian reporters were off the record.

What makes this an interesting case study in journalism ethics is that they weren't off the record, but whether you can ethically act in your capacity as a journalist in the middle of strategic business negotiations. The two are opposing interests, so to the extent I think I'm in a business meeting with The Guardian Company I'm probably also not thinking I'm the lead in their next story.

To turn it around a bit more, would it be OK for Guardian to go into Whisper under false pretenses, knowing they have no interest in a partnership, but in order to gather facts for a story? Surely they are entitled to do that form of investigative reporting, but likewise they shouldn't be surprised if that blows back on them the next time they want to form a strategic partnership with someone.

<comment><USER17> " _No. Once you agree you are talking off the record, there 's no going back on that._"

Of course there is, for instance if someone was threatening to harm you or others, it really wouldn't matter if you had agreed to keep things off the record. There is a difference between professional discretion and complicity.

edit - you described the tactics they possibly used and the potential strategic blowback, but ethically you answered your question for yourself already when you conceded that they are entitled to do that form of investigative reporting. They are a newspaper.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> So the Guardian was unethical because it exposed Whisper's unethical ways?

<comment><USER8> The linked CJR article concludes that the Guardian acted ethically and responsibly.

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> Sometimes I see something so bizarre and so different from my expectations that I momentarily wonder if I've shifted into a parallel universe that's subtly different from my own.

Apparently this is a universe where a lot of people think it's unacceptable for journalists to report on information they learned in a business meeting. I wonder what else has changed.

</comment><comment><USER20> All the journalist hand-wringing over the Guardian is exactly how we get the milquetoast reporting we do these days.

I understand why someone wouldn't want to burn bridges, but when their strategy for protecting access preempts any reporting ever, they cease to be performing any journalistic function. They're just hangers-on.

</comment><comment><USER21> Android needs App Ops back. We can't rely on shady for-profit companies to protect our anonymity and privacy. Same for other operating systems, of course.

</comment><comment><USER22> Got it. Guardian good, Whisper evil. What are the opportunities here, for our hacking community and social engineers, what kind of exploitation of Neetzan Zimmerman, using Whisper services, may be obtained for public humiliation, hopefully legal prosecution, and ideally profit?

</comment><comment><USER23> My general formula for journalism.

IF Public Interest >= Physical + Mental Damage / Reputational Damage to "source" THEN = Publish ELSE redact LOOP

<comment><USER24> This leads to an obvious problem with the definition of "public interest": A very large proportion of the public is interested in what goes on in the bedrooms of celebrities. I'm not sure I could support that definition of "public interest" in this equation.

<comment><USER23> Agreed. Public interest is a very difficult to define - Snowden vs Celebrate gossip etc. I was being looking for a distraction and was doing a bit of a thought experiment :)

<comment><USER25> if (anthonyWeiner.status == published) { publish(JenniferLawrenceStory); }

Many have expressed doubt that the media reaction would be the same if Kristen Stewart's photos were leaked instead.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


How Low Can Central Banks Go? JPMorgan Reckons Way Lower - <AUTHOR> http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-02-10/how-low-can-central-banks-go-jpmorgan-reckons-way-way-lower <comment><USER2> I remember Reid Hoffman talking about some of the mistakes he's made as an entrepreneur ([http://ecorner.stanford.edu/podcasts](http://ecorner.stanford.edu/podcasts))

He said one of the big ones he made was in times of frothy capital markets when all your competitors are well capitalized, its was a mistake to be frugal and not take as much investors money as they could.

We are currently in a time of very frothy capital markets. Money is just being given away. This is going to lead to, if it hasn't already, a big jump in the gap between the rich and the poor.

These lower interest rates are allowing hedge funds to make money via currency carry trades ([http://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/currencycarrytrade.asp](http://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/currencycarrytrade.asp)) while the average person is unlikely to be able to take advantage of this situation, if anything it make sit harder for the average person to save for retirement due to the paltry interest rates that are being paid on the products available to them.

I don't know what the solution to this is.

I guess if there is any good news in this, its that every single government who matters has already forced their bansk to go through some pretty strenuous stress tests wrt negative interest rates and there hasn't really been alot of bad news to come out of Europe, Canada or the US.....yet

<comment><USER3> Pardon my ignorance , but why is it that normal people can't borrow like hedge funds ?

ZIRP as it's done today is basically a massive wealth transfer.

<comment><USER4> Normal people aren't structurally important parts of the economy.

Not that I think it's clear that hedge funds and big banks are structurally necessary, but they've managed to create a system where they are considered important by all the people that matter.

<comment><USER5> > Normal people aren't structurally important parts of the economy.

I suggest we try to remove them to see what happens! :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Negative interest rates really aren't scary, they're just unusual in an era (since early 1980's) where inflation targeting (which is closely coupled with interest rates) of ~2% is the norm for the world's most important central banks. Here's a good overview from Bernanke (pre chairman of Fed years). [1]

In the short run, nothing will change from a day-to-day consumer perspective. Your 0.05% interest-rate saving account might drop to a 0.01% interest-rate account. If you have _a lot_ (tens of millions) of money that you'd like to put in a liquid savings account, you might be charged a slightly negative interest rate. Some banks are already doing this with institutional investors, but I doubt it will trickle down into commercial consumer banking. [2]

Kocherlakota, an ex-fed economist whose views I respect, called for negative rates yesterday: "The FOMC needs to go negative - and that's a gigantic _fiscal_ policy failure." I have to agree.

As he points out, low real interest rates present "an incredible opportunity" for US gov to make huge, necessary infrastructure investments. Read more here: [https://sites.google.com/site/kocherlakota009/home/policy/th...](https://sites.google.com/site/kocherlakota009/home/policy/thoughts- on-policy/2-9-16)

The only scary implication of negative rates comes from the fact that central banks do not want to go negative, but may be forced to. So they continue to lose control over once-powerful monetary policy tools. This is only scary if you put a lot of stock into a central bank's altruism, benevolence, and ability to effectively guide an extremely complex and intertwined economic/financial system.

[1] [http://www.federalreserve.gov/Boarddocs/speeches/2003/200303...](http://www.federalreserve.gov/Boarddocs/speeches/2003/20030325/default.htm)

[2] [http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-02-26/julius- bae...](http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-02-26/julius-baer-charges- institutional-clients-for-snb-negative-rate)

<comment><USER7> Negative rates are scary if they go low enough, where an inverse of the problems with high inflation come about. Rather than try to collect payments as fast as possible due to the eroding value of money, there will be an incentive to delay receipt of payment as long as possible. Taxes will be overpaid to be reclaimed in the following year. How would your local telco handle being treated as an implicit temporary checking account?

I don't claim to understand all the implications, but it's an odd experiment we would probably be better off not trying. What's worse, how do we ever get back to some range between [-2,2] once we've gone that far negative?

<comment><USER6> Right, hyper [inflation, deflation] is bad and usually ends in the governing body losing all power over the economy as people switch over to another country's currency (Zimbabwe) or a new government's currency (Germany). That's a discussion we should have when we get to -2.0% interest on _long-term_ assets.

<comment><USER7> Fair enough, luckily we're not there yet, but what's concerning is that the title of the article uses the words "way, way lower"!

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> Firstly, note that these are negative _deposit_ rates. As a bank you have to keep your spare money somewhere, and that is usually in an account at the local central bank which also serves as part of the interbank clearing system. Central banks are now proposing charging for keeping excessive reserves in this account.

The bigger picture is that wealth accumulation _cannot_ outstrip economic growth long-term or even medium-term without causing serious strain somewhere. Pushing the rate of return on capital negative is the gentlest possible way to do this. But the real problem is real estate and its endless appreciation in value.

</comment><comment><USER9> This is a disaster in the making: About 80% of small business loan applications in the US are denied. The cost of underwriting and servicing the loans and Federal regulations make these loans almost unprofitable for big banks. Negative interest rates won't help.

Negative interest rates will instead force big business to seek _safe_ returns wherever they can - and that will not be by investing in small business. That money may well be deployed in competition against small business.

Consider this... the US Small Business Administration's loan portfolio is barely a rounding error compared to the cost of quantitative easing and national security expenditures these past years. Double or triple SBA loans and USGOV balance sheet will not feel it, but the impact on job creation, salaries and investment could well exceed any benefit in the US from negative interest rates.

<comment><USER10> >"About 80% of small business loan applications in the US are denied."

Wow, I thought 80% was an overstatement. You are very much correct with regards to the "big" banks.

See: "big banks – that is, banks with $10 billion or more in assets – approved of 21.3 percent of small business loan applications in January 2015, up from 21.1 percent the month prior" [0]

Not the world's greatest source, but informative none the less: [0]: [http://www.pymnts.com/news/b2b-payments/2015/big-bank- backed...](http://www.pymnts.com/news/b2b-payments/2015/big-bank-backed-small- business-loan-approval-rate-up/)

<comment><USER11> Also, that's 80% of official applications. Countless others were given soft nos - "don't bother applying as a start-up/fico under 680/time in business under 3 years" etc.

<comment><USER12> Yup. Couldn't even get a LOC for $15k when we had cash reserves of $35k and 2 years in business making $250k/year because we wouldn't become personal guarantors on the loan and we were a risky startup.... that was cash finances, no debt....

Okay. I don't pretend to understand. (We wanted the line to service hard goods / inventory instead of cash servicing inventory, which is a standard retail tactic. Oh well.)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> Summary:

JPM estimates that if the ECB just focused on reserves equivalent to 2% of gross domestic product it could slice the rate it charges on bank deposits to -4.5%. Alternatively, if the ECB were to concentrate on 25% of reserves, it would be able to cut as low as -4.64%. That compares with minus 0.3% today and the minus 0.7% JPMorgan says it could reach by the middle of this year as reported yesterday.

In Japan, JPM calculates that the BOJ could go as low as -3.45% while Sweden's is likely -3.27%.

Finally, if and when the Fed joins the monetary twilight race, it could cut to -1.3% and the Bank of England to -2.69%.

What could prompt the Fed to go NIRP: a recession.

"With IOER at 0.5% and the Fed maintaining concerns about US money markets, the US is not close to considering NIRP. However, if recession risks were realized, the need for substantial additional policy support would likely push the Fed towards NIRP."

</comment><comment><USER13> Crony capitalism at its best. JP Morgan makes bets on central bankers moving lower, then publishes a study saying that they could. If they can shift opinion, then their bets just paid off.

Better yet if cronies of theirs in central banks buy the reasoning, the banks are likely to actually move lower, making for an even larger transfer of real wealth to the financial sector. Thereby paying off JP Morgan's bets even more AND giving it a shot at more free money from central bankers trying to "improve the economy".

The result is a very large wealth transfer to the financial sector. Who will then say that they, "deserve it for being so smart." And then try to figure out how to top what they did the last time.

<comment><USER14> How is that "crony capitalism?" Companies try to shift opinion in their favor all the time.

<comment><USER13> Crony capitalism describes any situation where success in business depends on close relationships between business people and government officials.

Over the last decade, top financial firms have succeeded due to central bank policies that the firms themselves have been part of shaping. For example estimates are that "too big to fail" banks make an extra $34 billion per year off of the implicit guarantee from the federal government.

Moving on, McKinsey studied the effects of the US government policy of quantitative easing. See [http://www.mckinsey.com/insights/economic_studies/qe_and_ult...](http://www.mckinsey.com/insights/economic_studies/qe_and_ultra_low_interest_rates_distributional_effects_and_risks) for the full study. The bottom line is that it is estimated to have directly enriched private companies to the tune of $460 billion dollars (about a third of which went to banks), and cost American households $360 billion. That's a pretty large and direct transfer of wealth!

This study examines how much room Europe has to pursue similar policies. JP Morgan is effectively telling the central banks, "Here is how much money we think you could afford to give us." But doing so in a sufficiently opaque way that it isn't obvious that that is what they said.

<comment><USER14> Even assuming any of that is credible, here were not talking about a personal relationship with government. We're talking about public projections and studies that at best influence government through persuasion not relationships.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> This negative rates thing is fascinating and scary. Apparently economists have been talking about it for years. I remember reading about the magnetic stripe on the dollar bills suggestion in the WSJ some time around 2000. The idea is that over time the dollar bill becomes worth less, and this is tracked by the magnetic stripe.

Just found this interesting paper from the IMF:

[https://goo.gl/65CuKF](https://goo.gl/65CuKF) (scribd)

What will happen if they try to do something like this?

<comment><USER16> They don't have to do mess around with face value. Individuals and companies with billions of dollars in cash can't really stick it in a mattress and ignore it. They have to find storage, pay rent, heating/cooling/humidity control, security, etc. That costs money. Negative interest rates reflect that cost.

Security guards alone would cost round_up(24*7/40) = 5 security guards assuming you only need a single guard (and they never get sick or take vacation), which at a loaded labor cost of at least $150k (low end) is $750k, which is 4% interest on $18.75m. So, under $20m and you're happy to pay the central bank the money to guard your cash.

<comment><USER17> _Individuals and companies with billions of dollars in cash can 't really stick it in a mattress and ignore it._

True. Far better to bury it somewhere remote. See this "news article" from the future about how it plays out:

       The desert dollar industry
       January 1, 2021

       These days, the desert is swimming in cash... literally.
       Over the last six months, a booming business in illegal
       cash storage has sprung up in Nevada, New Mexico, and
       Arizona where analysts estimate that $30 billion worth of
       $100 notes have been hidden. By day, smugglers drive deep
       into the desert, SUVs loaded down with suitcases full of
       Ben Franklins. Once they've found an ideal spot, they wait
       till the sun goes down and frantically dig a hole, only to
       drive away the next morning with nothing but the cache's
       GPS coordinates and a drone or two to guard it. When asked
       about the sorts of people staying at her motel these days,
       Smith shrugs. "I don't ask who they are and they pay cash."

       ...

[http://jpkoning.blogspot.com/2015/12/the-desert-dollar- indus...](http://jpkoning.blogspot.com/2015/12/the-desert-dollar- industry.html)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> I thought the only reason that banks had excess reserves was due to the fed paying 50 basis points of interest. This was the fed's way of preventing +/-$2.28 Trillion [1] from being loaned out thus adding $2.28 trillion x (fractional reserve rate...10 if mandatory reserves were 10%) to the money supply through lending. With negative interest rates excess reserves again become an expense, therefore removing banks disincentive to lend.

[1] [https://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/EXCSRESNS](https://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/EXCSRESNS) [2] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional- reserve_banking](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional-reserve_banking)

</comment><comment><USER19> The world economy has seen plenty of downturns but the whole developed world turning to negative interest rates is a new thing.

Is this a sign that the economic dogma underlying central bank decision making is not really based on anything solid but rather just follows keynesian trends of the day combined with the race to the bottom of "europe is doing it so we need to as well!"

Fortunately I hold a large bitcoin position which I believe hedges me pretty well in this situation.

<comment><USER20> They'll come for your bitcoin just like they once came for gold (if they so desire).

<comment><USER21> If it gets to that point, you might as well stock up on alcohol and chocolate for barter.

In a post-bank economy they're going to be a lot more valuable than bitcoins or PMs.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> With negative interest rates, you would make money by taking out a loan. Banks literally have profit margins just from borrowing money and doing nothing with it. What would happen if we gave the same advantage to the general public?

Something seems very wrong.

<comment><USER23> If you borrowed $100 but kept it in a bank account, then you'd be losing to the negative interest rate on that sum too (and friction of having to make regular payments).

The only way to benefit is to borrow and invest that money, which is exactly what the fed wants (with the expectation that productive investments will boost economic growth).

I think the real issue is that if you're paying -5% for a loan. It's rational to invest that into something that returns -1% (and profit by 4%). This means people are incentivized to invest in unproductive resources... Which might be a bad thing in the long run.

<comment><USER24> Or borrow and keep a stack of $100 bills under your mattress to be used to pay back a smaller sum at the end of the term?

<comment><USER25> That's why cash must be (gradually) banned, among other reasons. See Germany, Norway.

<comment> dav-ycombinator No need to ban cash for arbitrarily negative rates to work. Simply introduce an exchange rate between physical currency and deposits.

Simply introduce an exchange rate between the dollar and it's physical representation.

Barriers are largely people's lack of understanding of how this works and how huge the benefits would be for society.

<comment> dav-ycombinator > Maybe if you think government and society are the same thing.

No, I just think that neutral monetary policy which leads to full employment (defined as natural employment under given tax/regulatory regime) is good for society.

Also good for govt's ability to manage budget, but that's secondary.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER26> What percentage of world debt is on negative interest rates?

<comment><USER8> Very little at the moment. Remember this is only negative short term deposit rates at a few central banks. There's quite a bit at zero or near-zero rate though.

More governments should take the opportunity to borrow money at zero rates and invest in socially useful things.

<comment><USER27> Borrowing money is simply the government doing socially useful things now in exchange for giving up the ability to do so later. Sure, low interest rates give you better terms on this, but it's not obviously clear that this is the correct thing to do. Roads and bridges need maintenance, and in the future there will be more old people that we want to take care of.

<comment><USER28> Except if you don't invest in infrastructure and useful social things, there's no future of note anyway. I don't really think the economy will do too well if nobody can make it to work.

<comment><USER27> Right, there's obviously transportation and infrastructure projects that are positive-value. We should do those. What we shouldn't do is invest in transportation and infrastructure projects without evaluating whether or not they're positive-value. Even if we have unprecedented ability to cheaply invest in infrastructure, that doesn't mean that all projects are worth doing.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Somehow this gives me the image of a "high functioning" meth addict discovering the rush delivered by this wonderful drug called heroin. Surely he'll keep things under control.

<comment><USER29> A government aggressively trying to borrow less money gives you that image?

<comment><USER30> "borrow less" is the new "pay back what you owe"

<comment><USER29> Not paying back what you owe is default, and the countries in that position aren't the countries being talked about.

<comment><USER30> That is an incorrect definition of "owe." Owing begins at the inception of incurring a liability, not at the moment of being legally required to pay the obligation.

And even if you had used the correct definition, retorts like yours are pointlessly pedantic, petty and add no value to a discussion.

<comment><USER29> Countries are paying back what they owe. How does your original reply add anything or even make sense? If you are this worried about it you should probably at least understand what you are talking about.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Is Wikipedia Trolling? When is enough, enough? - <AUTHOR> https://twitter.com/LeoNatan/status/884904391588950018 <comment><USER2> > _Is Wikipedia Trolling?_

No. They're asking for money. You should look up the definition of trolling.

They have similarly aggressive ads for people in the US as well.

> _When is enough, enough?_

When people provide as much value to Wikipedia and Wikipedia provides to them. By that I mean giving Wikipedia enough money that it can run indefinitely.

<comment><USER3> And they ask for money by... reducing the value they provide by adding nag screens? I think you can call that trolling.

(I'm actually not that bothered by _Wikipedia 's_ nag screens because they are easily discarded and I can identify with the cause.

However, there seems to be a proliferation of agressive, undismissable "quasi- paywall" nag screens in other services that would do really well to die a quick death. But of course they won't...)

<comment><USER2> > _reducing the value they provide by adding nag screens_

Is this sincere? How does it reduce the value? You just scroll past it.

> _I think you can call that trolling._

You can call it trolling, but you won't be using the same definition as most people[1].

If Wikipedia is trolling, then so are art galleries who ask you to donate at the door, churches who pass around a collection plate, toll roads, and anyone else who provides a public service and asks for money.

If people are really irritated by Wikipedia asking for money, they should stop using it. But they won't because it's literally one of the most important and useful creations in human history. How can people begrudge them a request for a donation?

1\. From Webster's:

> _a : to antagonize (others) online by deliberately posting inflammatory, > irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content … trolls > engage in the most outrageous and offensive behaviors possible—all the > better to troll you with. — Whitney Phillips_

> _b : to act as a troll (see 3troll 2) on (a forum, site, etc.) … is also > notorious, for trolling message boards on the Internet, posting offensive > material he himself has written and then suing anyone who responds in > agreement. — Mark Hemingway_

[https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/troll](https://www.merriam- webster.com/dictionary/troll)</comment></comment></comment>


Back to the future of automobiles - <AUTHOR> http://www.marketwatch.com/story/back-to-the-future-of-automobiles-2015-04-25

<comment><AUTHOR> Timeless Lesson learned: The Dymaxion story cautions against falling in love with your own engineering, no matter how smart you are.</comment>


Re: MacOS High Sierra Root Vulnerability - <AUTHOR> I came across someone a post with a link to a forum where this was presented as a solution if you lose access to admin accounts on your Mac.<p>This was 2 weeks ago and dude who discovered it thought it was a feature   - https://forums.developer.apple.com/thread/79235 (scroll to bottom of page) <comment><AUTHOR> Link - [https://forums.developer.apple.com/thread/79235](https://forums.developer.apple.com/thread/79235) (scroll to bottom of page)

</comment><comment><USER2> I don't see this post. What is it telling?

<comment><AUTHOR> This response -

chethan177 Nov 13, 2017 12:48 PM (in response to Taylor E) Note: This solution might be specific to High Sierra

Try this: Solution 1: On startup, click on "Other" Enter username: root and leave the password empty. Press enter. (Try twice) If you're able to log in (hurray, you're the admin now), then head over to System Preferences>Users & Groups and create a new Admin account. Now restart and login to the new Admin Account (you may need a new Apple Id). Once you're logged into this new Admin Id, you can again proceed to your System Preferences>Users & Groups. Open the Lock Icon with your new Admin ID/Password. Assign "Allow user to administer this computer" to your original Apple ID. Restart.</comment></comment>


Show HN: Our Time to Think – A Team Pomodoro-Like Tool for Slack - <AUTHOR> https://ourtimetothink.com/ <comment><AUTHOR> Our Time To Think (OTTT) is a productivity tool for teams who want to have a few blocks of time a day where they are not interrupted by notifications.

When an OTTT session begins - either manually with a command like /ottt 30 (for 30 minutes) or by the OTTT schedule tool - OTTT scans the Slack channel for its members and sets their Do Not Disturb (DND) for that period of time.

Subscribers to OTTT can link multiple Slack workspaces so that starting an OTTT session in one will set their DND status in all of their workspaces.

In the future, OTTT will include managing teams DND settings on their computers and phones, too, and support a physical indicator such as a light that turns color so that other office workers know when a team is focused.</comment>


House cats know what they want and how to get it from you - <AUTHOR> http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2009-07/cp-hck070909.php <comment><USER2> either my cat is stupid or he likes getting ejected from the bedroom. Although he does act like a back-up alarm clock.</comment>


Zendesk 2016 Security Incident (2019 Update) - <AUTHOR> https://www.zendesk.com/blog/security-update-2019/ <comment><USER2> > 700 customer accounts, including expired trial accounts and accounts that > are no longer active. This includes: > Transport Layer Security (TLS) > encryption keys provided to Zendesk by customers

So it appears that some customers unknowingly had their TLS certificates out in the wild for over 3 years.

How was this not caught by Zendesk sooner?</comment>


Django replaced occurrences of master/slave terminology with leader/follower - <AUTHOR> https://github.com/django/django/pull/2692 <comment><USER2> What a colossal waste of human effort. It is a shame that the political correctness, diversity, and inclusion efforts have metastasized into results like this.

no one wins in this scenario. A hollow victory (at best) for the cry bullies whose "feelings" are triggered, or whatever the current trend is.

<comment><USER3> political correctness is perfectly fine when you are part of a multi-ethnic project.

<comment><USER2> I'm all for civility and decorum, but I believe that political correctness has slipped into a hole of trigger warnings, safe spaces, and all the fun stuff we see happening on many college campuses.

In my opinion multi-ethnic projects mean that we should grow thicker skin, and laugh off the misunderstandings and preconceptions rather than "re-educate" Orweillian style.

<comment><USER3> I would not consider renaming master/slave as an Orwellian "re-education". Orwellian-style re-education would be refraining from talking about the Holocaust because it causes people to get pissed off / "triggered". I also think there is a big difference between re-naming terms in computer science and not being able to talk about $ethnicity in a history class in an education setting (college campuses etc.). You should not confuse the two.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> Sorry all; this came across my Twitter feed and I thought it was current. I wouldn't have bothered if I noticed it was 2 years old.</comment>


Computer Science Loses to Math in New Hiring Formula - <AUTHOR> http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304871704575160553254798886.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_sections_tech <comment><USER2> Statistics is a very interesting subject, and it is a distinct subject from mathematics proper. Here (in what is becoming a FAQ post for HN) are two favorite recommendations for free Web-based resources on what statistics is as a discipline, both of which recommend good textbooks for follow-up study:

"Advice to Mathematics Teachers on Evaluating Introductory Statistics Textbooks" by Robert W. Hayden

<http://statland.org/MyPapers/MAAFIXED.PDF>

"The Introductory Statistics Course: A Ptolemaic Curriculum?" by George W. Cobb

[http://repositories.cdlib.org/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=10...](http://repositories.cdlib.org/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1002&context=uclastat/cts/tise)

Both are excellent introductions to what statistics is as a discipline and how it is related to, but distinct from, mathematics.

A very good list of statistics textbooks appears here:

[http://web.mac.com/mrmathman/MrMathMan/New_Teacher_Resources...](http://web.mac.com/mrmathman/MrMathMan/New_Teacher_Resources.html)

I have encountered some recent examples of people finding interesting work by being able to step into the intersection of computer science and statistics, with a strong pure math background besides. A lot of statistical researchers need programming help, and a lot of programmers need to be more aware of statistical issues. It's a win-win when a learner learns a lot about math, statistics, and computer science.

<comment><USER3> I like your comment. Let me add a second view-point to your first sentence.

> Statistics is a very interesting subject, and it is a distinct subject from > mathematics proper.

Mathematics proper is more than one subject, already. (Theoretical) computer science and statistics are just two more branches of math.

The notion of statistics as being outside math remains me a bit of how thermodynamics was viewed as not proper physics (or prober chemistry) in the 19th century.

The study of thermodynamics got a huge boost from the commercial need to understand and build better steam engines. If you look close enough, thermodynamics is actually statistics. (And of course statistics and probability theory is just applied measure and integration theory.)

<comment><USER4> I kind of agree that statistics should be viewed as slightly different subject from math proper. The math aspect of statistics is not, in itself, the important aspect. The interesting (and in my opinion harder) aspect is the more subjective part of getting a good feel for how to pick from the myriad of statistical tests available to use on your data and to analyse exactly what the results from those tests mean relative to your data.

Both of those aspects are core to applying statistics and neither are purely mathematical. Both are also often ignored or marginalized by those who simply see statistics as applied analysis-light.

<comment><USER5> Actually, picking tests is a purely mathematical topic. The only reason it feels like an art and not math is because people still use frequentist statistics.

<comment><USER3> Picking an optimality criterion for your tests is an art. Then picking optimal tests is pure math. But for anything beyond toy problems picking an optimal test (or optimal parameters for your test), so there comes the black art part in again.

What do you pronounce as the alternative to frequentist statistics? May I guess you'd pick Bayesian approaches?

Mathematical things like maximum likelihood estimators can be seen as solving a min-max problem atop of Bayesian calculations.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> >>>>Employees teach new recruits to use tools for comparing the performance of one version of a feature with another and how to determine what sort of difference in response is _meaningful_.>>>>>

I hate when people use statistical significance to determine what is _meaningful_. People wrongfully think you need 95% confidence in the data to make a decision and move forward with a feature change, etc. For me when I am changing things on my site based on data mining, I will make a decision with a 60% confidence (which can come within 5-10 samples in most cases). Hacking websites is engineering not science! Overall it makes sense to trade a low confidence value for speed of development.

<comment><USER7> Statistical significance is also not even a sufficient condition for a difference to be meaningful. In the real world, very few things are truly _identical_ , so you can eventually get a statistically significant difference for just about any comparison, given enough samples. But the differences may be negligibly small.

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> Meta: When I clicked the link from HN (or from the WSJ front page), I got 2 paragraphs and a paywall. But using Google on a line of the text sets it up so you get the article.

<comment><USER9> Firefox extension RefControl, to change the referrer for wsj.com to <http://www.google.com> , seems to work well.

RefControl:

<https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/953>

</comment></comment><comment><USER10> I would be fascinated to hear comparisons of the performance of graduates of different disciplines as developers. I know we everyone can think of a few examples of good and bad for all; but it would be interesting to collate large numbers of peer reviews and see if any disciplines stand out. In the eight companies I have worked for, I think it's quite likely the maths graduates stand out. If not maths then probably electrical engineering. The chemistry and physics graduates are widely distributed. I know a lot of computer science graduates but I would hesitate to categorise any as great developers. A hundred or so is a terribly small sample so I would love to see results from a decent sample. (It happens I am about to start recruiting again, and no, I'm not a maths graduate.)

<comment><USER11> Why? The difference in skill between programmers is huge, but only a tiny amount of that variance could be predicted by the programmer's major. This is as misguided as discarding everyone who doesn't have a 4.0 GPA or didn't go to a top-10 school.

<comment><USER12> I suspect the average math undergrad is not as good a programmer as the average CS undergrad (but my sample is restricted to my college).

However, if we count only the maths majors who end up working as programmers then I believe there will be some significant self-selection. So if such a study were done I wouldn't be surprised if math and physics majors were found to be better than CS majors.

In any case I'd agree with you that in that I would never blindly use that in a hiring process.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER3> Combine this with the ascend of compressed sensing--which leverages e.g. linear optimization--and I am set.

</comment><comment><USER13> I recommend reading programming collective intelligence if you want to learn some data mining techniques that you can use out of the box, today.</comment>


Ask HN: What app/system do you use for saving notes? - <AUTHOR> I'm making a note-keeping web application and am looking to do a bit of idea validation. I'd really appreciate if everyone that read this could answer any or all of these questions:
A) Do you have a system for saving information to reference later?
B) What is your currently preferred app/system/setup for doing so?
C) What is one thing that bothers you about your current system you wish was done differently?
I'd love if you could give an up-vote and maybe get this to the front-page for maximum exposure. Thanks! <comment><USER2> I use Apple Notes because it's free and always on my devices. Used EverNote in the past but then they started charging. I bought an iOS app but they went to a subscription fee.

Personally, I'd prefer a Markdown with Github integration. I moved some of my notes to Github in .org or .md format:

[https://github.com/melling/MathAndScienceNotes](https://github.com/melling/MathAndScienceNotes)

[https://github.com/melling/LanguageLearning](https://github.com/melling/LanguageLearning)

Save your notes to Github and use Markdown so people don't feel locked in.

</comment><comment><USER3> A) I typically use Apple notes.

B) Built-in

C) Actually I would love something that could format various languages of code too but also by cross device</comment>


Show HN: Q2 2020 Outage Report - <AUTHOR> https://statusgator.com/blog/2020/08/21/5-biggest-outages-of-q2-2020/ <comment><AUTHOR> Hi all! A few months ago someone on HN here recommended we use all the data we're gathering at StatusGator to produce a quarterly report, kind of like Backblaze does: [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23471993](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23471993)

I thought it was a great idea! So we got to work. This is the result of that effort, although this attempt is not as data-driven as I first imagined. It turns out that I'm really no data scientist and couldn't quite figure out how to get insights from our data.

So instead I took a more human approach and tried to keep it light. I'm not here to shame anyone after all.

I would love your feedback along with what you'd want to see in a Q3 report.</comment>


How Trump's Hudson Tunnel Snit Threatens the National Economy - <AUTHOR> https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2018-hudson-river-amtrak-tunnel-american-economy <comment><USER2> This is a project that seems like it needs to be funded, but we wouldn't even be having this conversation if it didn't cost over 10 billion dollars to dig a 1.3 mile tunnel. If it cost a billion, New York and New Jersey could just pay for it themselves. To put this in perspective, this is $12,000 per daily rider, just for the tunnel. If we can't get infrastructure costs under control in this country, we aren't going to even be able to maintain what we've got.

</comment><comment><USER3> Of course, Trump is just the latest in a long line of folks who have put sectarian politics ahead of the long-term needs of the economy. As one of the people who would be directly affected by any sort of outage in the tunnel, I'm pretty well disgusted. The problem should have been solved long before Trump ever took office. But as the article points out, we largely have Chris Christie to blame.

If the Northeast Corridor fails, the amount of real wealth that would be destroyed is staggering. It would almost certainly put me underwater on my mortgage. I'd have to imagine default rates would skyrocket, railroad town economies would go into recession. I'm at least lucky that I can do my job just fine from home and that the PATH offers me an alternative route to the office.

</comment><comment><USER4> While this is definitely a clusterfuck, I also think it's worthwhile to ask why commuting to Manhattan doubles one's salary. Does the same work really have 3X the value when performed across a river?

The super-concentration of wealth and opportunity in a tiny number of very small locales is the real problem. I have a sense that it's gotten a lot worse over the last 1-2 decades, though I'd be curious to see real numbers.

Even if we do build a new tunnel here it still remains a very small single point of failure. If Manhattan is US Economy HQ then a hurricane, engineering failure, or terrorist attack could destroy the economy of the entire country. Wouldn't it be better and more "antifragile" to geographically diversify?

Why can't we do this? Why is this so hard?

<comment><USER5> > _why commuting to Manhattan doubles one 's salary_

"Mr Glaeser, a Harvard economist who grew up in Manhattan...calls cities 'our species' greatest invention': proximity makes people more inventive, as bright minds feed off one another; more productive, as scale gives rise to finer degrees of specialisation; and kinder to the planet, as city-dwellers are more likely to go by foot, bus or train than the car-slaves of suburbia and the sticks."

TL; DR People become more productive in cities. That translates to higher wages.

[https://www.economist.com/node/18111592](https://www.economist.com/node/18111592)

<comment><USER4> There are dozens of large cities all across America and hundreds of smaller ones.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> Being a NJ resident close to NYC this whole tunnel debacle has been infuriating, but I can think of one positive that may come out of some catastrophic tunnel failure.

If one of the tunnels does eventually collapse or otherwise become unusable, companies may be forced to adopt a long term remote work policy for the huge number of NJ->NYC commuters that would be impacted, at least until a new tunnel is built or the existing ones are rehabilitated.

I want companies to be more flexibility in regards to working from home... I wouldn't want to work from home every day but honestly doing it 2 or 3 times per week would be glorious.

<comment><USER3> I'm guessing we'd see WeWork and other coworking options spring up all over the Newark Penn Station area.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> Doing infrastructure piecemeal is surely the most expensive way of doing it. It should require more than a whim for a politician to put a halt to an infrastructure development or to screw with the brief half way through. Same goes with stuff like NASA. Things that take longer than a political campaign to plan and execute, should require a defined formal process to be followed in order to screw about with them.</comment>


First Official Pics of Tesla Model S Leaked - <AUTHOR> http://www.autoblog.com/2009/03/26/leak-tesla-model-s-pics-surface-on-web-ahead-of-todays-debut/ <comment><USER2> I like that design (although I cant see the front) better than the coupe.</comment>


Show HN: Design that says yea I went to college, but Ill stab u if u fn cross me - <AUTHOR> https://horriblenoise.ca/?utm_campaign=hn <comment><AUTHOR> I worked for an ecommerce company that ran an internal competition that encouraged employees to run and create their own online stores using the platform.

I decided to go against the grain a little by pairing up with a close friend of mine who makes lowbrow art and uses social media whoring as his medium of choice.

I always found his stuff to be refreshing because of how dystopian it is, and how much it contrasted the optimistic, utopian sentiment of most technology companies. @horriblenoise's Instagram was basically the polar opposite of my company's own Instagram account. See [https://www.instagram.com/horriblenoise](https://www.instagram.com/horriblenoise) if that sounds exciting.

I was looking for new things to wear, so we decided to make clothes that celebrate, and make fun of, the feelings of alienation, anxiety, and sexual frustration anyone familiar with the programmer midnight garbage ordering dominoes at midnight lifestyle should know.

This one is my personal favourite: [https://horriblenoise.ca/collections/merch/products/oh- fuck-...](https://horriblenoise.ca/collections/merch/products/oh-fuck- tee?utm_campaign=hnc)

tl;dr - sick tshirts with really funny product descriptions

Any feedback on the site, or tips on how to sell physical things to a niche audience would be much appreciated.

</comment><comment><USER2> I found this disappointing. I put a high priority on impact in art. Something downright threatening intrigues me.

This, however, seems like a commercial for the millennial version of the CCS catalog, Pac-Sun, insert similar reference here.

I bothered to click through the site and I didn't find anything interesting or redeeming.

I don't think he would really stab anyone. And, that, is disappointing.

<comment><AUTHOR> > I don't think he would really stab anyone. And, that, is disappointing.

I thought the janky spelling would give away that it's going to be humorous. It's a fantasy about being badass and threatening.

Sorry for misleading you. I changed the title and replaced the word "Art" with "Design".

Maybe this one will be more up your alley: [https://www.instagram.com/p/BAx3ZRWvFj1/?taken- by=horribleno...](https://www.instagram.com/p/BAx3ZRWvFj1/?taken- by=horriblenoise)

<comment><USER2> That sounds right to me. I really wanted to avoid a definition of art debate. My original post is subjective, but honest.

In case you're interested this is where I was coming from: [http://artnews.org/artist.php?i=613](http://artnews.org/artist.php?i=613)

The site works, I didn't see any issues, and I think it does a good job staying out of the way of the product.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER3> this is pretty great. I don't find many of these type of t's out there in the wild.

</comment><comment><USER4> what do an online shop and technology have in common?

ps: rhetorical question</comment>


I am writing a book about my experience making a website pay for itself - <AUTHOR> http://tosbourn.com/decided-write-book-making-website-pay/

<comment><USER2> Landing pages, email signups, and so on aren't ready to be tried out yet, so they don't count as Show HNs. Please read the Show HN guidelines at [https://news.ycombinator.com/showhn.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/showhn.html).</comment>


Show HN: Lightbus – Proposal for a new Python message bus and task queue - <AUTHOR> http://lightbus.org/ <comment><AUTHOR> Proposal author here – I'm posting this here to try and solicit some feedback on the idea.

Is there demand for a project like this? Is the design sane? Any suggestions? Feedback is very welcome indeed.

Additionally, the concerns[1] and choices[2] pages currently contain a number of open questions.

[1] [http://lightbus.org/en/latest/concerns.html](http://lightbus.org/en/latest/concerns.html)

[2] [http://lightbus.org/en/latest/implementation/choices.html](http://lightbus.org/en/latest/implementation/choices.html)</comment>


The strawberry-picking robots doing a job humans won't - m-i-l http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-43816207 <comment><AUTHOR> Friend of mine that worked in the fields as a kid mentioned picking strawberries was terrible back breaking work. Because strawberries are close to the ground you have to bend over to do it.

<comment><USER2> ... which makes it a bit easier for kids. It was common in areas like East San Jose for kids to work strawberry farms below age 16, when more conventional W-4 jobs become an option.

There was a huge strawberry field behind Piedmont Middle School, for example.

But the important point is, such jobs in agriculture (and elsewhere) that frequently cause repetitive-strain injuries need to be automated.</comment></comment>


A web server in a shell script - <AUTHOR> http://www.debian-administration.org/article/371/A_web_server_in_a_shell_script

<comment><USER2> The author points this out but it probably bears repeating: this implementation is insecure as it exposes your entire filesystem to anyone who can connect to your port 80. Use with caution :)

<comment><USER3> The joy of VM's.

<comment><USER4> Yeah, you should totally deploy a separate virtual machine just to serve files from a toy Bash web server (irony).

<comment><USER5> He's right. The joy of VMs is that they let you play while throwing caution to the wind. Tone down the snarkiness.

<comment><USER4> Virtual machines are great for isolation and defense in depth, _not_ as the only security measure. It's like believing that a firewall will magically solve all your network security problems.

For experiments relying on that is fine, but not for anything more serious.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> See also: <http://github.com/tlrobinson/wwwoosh>

It includes a netcat-based webserver written in bash (that speaks CGI) as well as a Sinatra-like micro "framework" for shell (that also speaks CGI) that lets you do things like this:

        get "/DeanMartin.jpg" dean_handler
        function dean_handler () {
            header "Content-Type" "image/jpeg"
            cat "DeanMartin.jpg"
        }

Unfortunately I haven't figure out a way to get rid of that placeholder function name (e.x. "dean_handler" above). Ideas?

</comment><comment><USER7> Bash is awesome.

This is one of my favorite bash scripts, it's an IRC bot in about 12 lines:

<http://inamidst.com/code/shellbot>

It's also pretty easy to add other commands & extend.

<comment><USER8> Unix is awesome.

I recently had lunch with a friend and I asked him about if he was planning new features their key/value store and I loved his answer: (paraphrased)

 _I'm a unix-guy. I want small bits of software that does one thing and does it really well._

His point was that software these days is rarely "finished". However in Unix so much of the software are small pieces. Each piece does one job and does it well. Then you can fit those pieces together in all sorts of configurations to do new and interesting things.

<comment><USER9> The unixlike nature of certain tools is what makes the Unix architecture more or less unique. Look at binutils and you'll find heaps of tools with amazing abilities like dd, cat and echo. For me, vim wins over emacs precisely because ultimately it's an editor. Emacs for me is a whole operating environment like Gnome (although I use both and appreciate that vim can be heavily extended).

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> I prefer:

cd $WEB_DIR; python -m SimpleHTTPServer

<comment><USER11> twistd -n web --path .

for evented goodness.

</comment></comment><comment><USER12> > you don't want the hassle of installing the full Apache package

        sudo apt-get install apache2
        sudo vim /usr/lib/cgi-bin/hello_world
        sudo chmod a+x $_

Not _that_ much of a hassle.

<comment><USER13> Install Apache on a VPS with 64MB or 128MB of RAM is a hassle.

<comment><USER14> Okay, replace the first line with:

        sudo apt-get install lighttpd

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> This is a neat hack, but the title is a little misleading - most of the real work is handled by inetd, not the shell script.

<comment><USER16> _Should_ every server re-implement inetd, though? Why not let that handle connections, daemontools/runit handle process supervision & logging, and focus on what you're actually trying to do?

You don't need OOP for reusability.

In the few cases where scalability matters, you can re-implement the relevant behavior, but that's a performance trade-off.

</comment></comment><comment><USER17> cat "$filename"

...

Oh dear. Ohdearohdearohdear.

Now all we need to do is make sure that the first character in $filename is "&" followed by some privilege escalation exploit and ...

(Am I missing something?)

<comment><USER18> Well the variable expansion _is_ quoted, so afaik it could only be interpreted as a single argument to cat.

<comment><USER19> The double quote quoting, while allowing you to do e.g. rm "file with spaces" still expands $ and `. Compare:

echo none:`date`

echo double: "`date`"

echo single: '`date`'

<comment><USER20> But it doesn't expand recursively, so "$var" is safe to protect against special characters in var. That said, one should really read one's shell's documentation, because there be dragons.</comment></comment></comment></comment>


The Writings of Leslie Lamport - <AUTHOR> https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html <comment><USER2> I actually read through all of these (the summaries, not the papers) in the process of writing the TLA+ wikipedia article. Some favorites:

* On the oft-misunderstood significance of the bakery algorithm: [https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#bakery](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#bakery)

* On submitting an algorithm with a bug in it, thus arousing interest in verifying concurrent algorithms (culminating decades later in the development of TLA+): [https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#proving](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#proving)

* On how nobody has actually read his most famous paper ( _Time, Clocks..._ ): [https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#time-clocks](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#time-clocks)

* Hanging out, drinking beer at Dijkstra's house: [https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#new-approac...](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#new-approach)

* On creating the first (impractical) digital signature algorithm: [https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#dig-sig](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#dig-sig)

* A several-times-rejected paper which then became one of the most cited in the field of temporal logic: [https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#sometime](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#sometime)

* A lifelong source of fascination, the arbiter problem: [https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#buridan](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#buridan)

* The creation of LaTeX: [https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#latex](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#latex)

* On presenting the first paxos paper in an Indiana Jones outfit, to widespread incomprehension: [https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#lamport-pax...](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#lamport-paxos)

I'll stop here because basically every single summary is fun and worth reading.

</comment><comment><AUTHOR> The comments, anecdotes, and historical context he gives the papers are by themselves a great read, especially if you're even somewhat familiar with the results. The comments on #12, which introduces the Bakery Algorithm [1] are a great example of this.

[1] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamport%27s_bakery_algorithm](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamport%27s_bakery_algorithm)

<comment><USER3> There are great bits in the papers, too. For instance in the Buridan paper ...

> _An empirical absence of dead asses does not invalidate Buridan's Principle_

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> "What Good is Temporal Logic?" ([https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#what- good](https://lamport.azurewebsites.net/pubs/pubs.html#what-good)) is in the running for my favorite CS paper. Well worth reading, and understandable even if you have a passing familiarity with predicate logic.

</comment><comment><USER5> This page make me want to write some narratives about my own papers. Maybe I wouldn't release the narratives, but Lamport's page made me realize how much detail is lost to time. The context of the papers is interesting and maybe even relevant to the research.

<comment><USER6> Interesting how that makes me think of state in programming. Maybe theres a way to encapsulate state in these papers to capture as much as possible from the context.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> This reminds me very much of the Dijkstra archive[1]. I look forward to reading all of these as I did with those (the Dutch language ones excepted).

[1] [https://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/EWD/](https://www.cs.utexas.edu/users/EWD/)

</comment><comment><USER8> If you're more into web design than math, check out that spartan HTML ... it's pre-Geocities, if that's possible.

Didn't know that the title element would render fine even inside body!

</comment><comment> astn-austin Well now here go with the good coffee shop reading!

<comment><USER9> Mathematical papers seem to require coffee for their production [1] and their consumption.

[1] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfr%C3%A9d_R%C3%A9nyi#Quotati...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfr%C3%A9d_R%C3%A9nyi#Quotations)</comment></comment>


Racism is far more than old white men using the N-word - <AUTHOR> http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/may/18/racism-more-than-old-white-men-using-n-word

<comment><USER2> At the risk of being accused of completely missing the point of the article, I read the article linked within it:

[http://www.mirror.co.uk/tv/tv-news/jeremy- clarksons-9-most-o...](http://www.mirror.co.uk/tv/tv-news/jeremy- clarksons-9-most-outspoken-3480134)

I have to say I've long thought Clarkson was less an "edgy" comical car guru, and more a high paid bigot - I think that settles it :P</comment>


An introduction to last branch records - <AUTHOR> http://lwn.net/Articles/680985/ <comment><USER2> when did division become expensive again?

i'm also not sure how this adds anything to being able to stick timers in code. it affords me the same kind of analysis without relying on architectural details... maybe i am just missing some key insight here that the article failed to get across to me.

<comment><USER3> Last time I checked (which admittedly was ~3 years ago), division was about 10x as expensive as addition/subtraction (rule of thumb, doesn't take the complexity of modern processors into account but if you're not mixing too many things it should pan out).

This became noticeable in a codepath I was optimizing.

<comment><USER4> Once you factor the "complexity", it actually becomes much worse. A better rule of thumb for 64-bit math might be that division is 100x the cost of addition. 64-bit division on current Intel takes 40-80 cycles, and they don't overlap well. Addition takes only 1 cycle, and the processor has three execution ports that can execute this instruction in parallel.

Moreover, with SIMD, you can add 4 64-bit floats with each instruction. There are no vector instructions for division.

The last case where I found this to be the limiting factor was ranged random number generation. If you have a fast generator, reducing it to an unbiased range by traditional means can often be most expensive step. It can be much faster to substitute a lot of other arithmetic just to avoid the division/modulo.

<comment><USER3> I need to adjust my mental factor to 100x then :).

However, you mention that there's not SIMD instruction for division. Then what are divps/divpd? Those do SIMD division (on x86).

<comment><USER4> Wow, you're absolutely right. I should have said that is no SIMD instruction for integer division (which is what I needed for the ranged random numbers), and somehow I got the idea that they didn't exist for floating point either. The 64-bit division timing I quoted was after looking at IDIV on Haswell:

      IDIV | r64 | 59 | 59 | p0p1p5 p6 | 39-103 | 24-81

[http://www.agner.org/optimize/instruction_tables.pdf](http://www.agner.org/optimize/instruction_tables.pdf)

This is saying that it takes 59 µops spread across Ports 0, 1, 5, and 6 to a signed integer division. That latency for a single operation will be between 39 and 103, but if you are doing many signed integer divisions in a row you'll finish a division once every 24 to 81 cycles.

For DIVPD on Haswell we have:

      VDIVPD | y,y,y | 3 | 3 | 2p0 p15 | 19-35 | 16-28

Here it takes only 3 µops (2 on Port 0, one on Port 1 or 5), has a single instruction latency of 19 to 35 cycles, and if doing many in a row we can finish one vector's worth of divisions every 16 to 28 cycles. Since a 256-bit YMM register holds 4 doubles, this is about 6 cycles per double precision division.

Performance on Skylake is dramatically improved:

      VDIVPD | y,y,y | 1 | 1 | p0 | 13-14 | 8

Only one µop (on Port 0), a latency of 13-14 cycles, and an inverse throughput of just 8 cycles. Thus the best case double precision requires only 2 cycles per division!

By contrast, double precision addition on Skylake is 1 µop on Port 0 or Port 1, 4 cycles of latency, and optimally we can complete 2 of these operations per cycle (inverse throughput of .5). At 4 doubles per YMM vector, this means we can do 8 double precision additions per cycle, or 16 every two cycles.

So on the most recent Intel processors, in the best optimized case, double precision division should be 16 times slower than double precision addition --- much closer to your 10x estimate than my 100x. I think my numbers are still about right for 64-bit integer division, but I appreciate the pushback.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: New or lesser-known job titles in the tech industry - <AUTHOR> Tell us about any new or lesser known job titles in the tech industry.<p>For e.g.<p>* Entrepreneur in Residence (EIR) - https://www.forbes.com/sites/neilkane/2014/09/09/what-is-an-entrepreneur-in-residence<p>* Customer Reliability Engineer (CRE) - https://cloud.google.com/blog/products/gcp/introducing-a-new-era-of-customer-support-google-customer-reliability-engineering<p>* Solution Architect - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solution_architecture <comment><USER2> In my previous role, we had few Junior Devs - Teens who are just about to go to college get to experience working on a professional project and seeing if they like software development at a big (FAANG) co. We didn't treat them as interns because the expectation was they did not know anything about software development.

<comment><AUTHOR> What did they bring to the table for the corp?

<comment><USER2> We just took it as a mentorship exercise. Couple of gals in the group were really fast learners and didn't need as much help, so we know some eventual new-hires who sort of know our system and way of doing things. Also, their questions were often very simple but piercing.</comment></comment></comment>


Show HN: The Hosting Tribune – 2x Weekly email of hosting industry news - <AUTHOR> I've just launched The Hosting Tribune (www.thehostingtribune.com) and would love to get some early eyes on the content.  The goal is to provide industry insight by curating important hosting news and offering a short analysis to keep those interested in the industry "in the know." So far I have published 8 issues, a new issue arrives in the subscriber's inbox Monday and Thursday mornings.
The value proposition is that we are saving people time by delivering a full view of the hosting industry that can be consumed twice a week in just a few minutes.
Audience is B2B in or near the hosting profession, which is why it isn't free.  But my thought is $10 to stay on top of the industry - an industry where most SMB/Enterprise customers spend a lot more than $10 - is a bargain.
I super-soft launched to 10 friends in the hosting industry and 9 have signed up to pay on their own accord, each saying that the content is applicable to their daily work and saves them time.  I think some of them expense it to their employer, which is fine with me.
I would love to give a free subscription to anyone that emails me at firstname.lastname@example.com for the next few weeks as I try to dial in the content.  Any other comments or questions of course welcome. <comment><USER2> Thumbs up for the idea, but as I am not an industry insider that's probably not for me. Have you considered running a news website with the free content and paid newsletter? Such a bundle would increase a value of your offering, as diving alone into the paid newsletter without any test drive seem to be risky.

<comment><AUTHOR> Thank you for the suggestion. I've given that some thought but the problem is so much of the news is about AWS and the response of Google, Microsoft and Oracle to AWS. I worry that a news site would just be a feed of AWS announcements, which doesn't offer much value.

That said, I have blogged in the B2B space for years and might try to do some original content both to increase credibility and SEO.</comment></comment>


The invisible network that keeps the world running - <AUTHOR> http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20150209-the-network-that-runs-the-world

<comment><USER2> Here's a premise for you: autonomous cargo ships, incorporated as their own entities, bidding on freight contracts and offering transport through a system not unlike an AdWords bidding auction. They circle the world constantly, offloading and picking up cargo from sail-through offshore platforms, stopping only for maintenance, and occasionally doing really strange things for reasons only their algorithms can explain.

<comment><USER3> When things move so slowly, there is no advantage to being autonomous. And it makes little difference economically who the owners are. Right now, ships will change their speeds based on changes in interest rates, since it is more fuel efficient to move slowly, but when interest rates go up, it is worthwhile to get the cargo to its destination quicker.

<comment><USER4> That's really interesting. I know little / nothing about the economics of large scale maritime transport. Could you point me towards some reading material on this subject?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> For those who want a peek into the maritime industries (shipping, offshore extraction, navies, tourism, etc) and their concerns (commodity prices, shipwrecks, arctic warming, big engine tech): gcaptain.com

<comment><USER6> Thanks! I didn't know and I've been working in the industry for many moons already.

My go-to site for offshore is the local [http://www.offshore.no/international/](http://www.offshore.no/international/)

Anyone else has good resources?

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> A book suggestion for anyone who would like to read more: "Ninety percent of everything"

[http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ninety-Percent-Everything- Shipping-I...](http://www.amazon.co.uk/Ninety-Percent-Everything-Shipping- Invisible/dp/1250058295/)

<comment><USER8> And a book thoroughly covering this from the beginning, which also provides a physical world example of successful but painful standards creation: _The Box: How the Shipping Container Made the World Smaller and the World Economy Bigger_ [http://www.amazon.com/Box-Shipping-Container-Smaller- Economy...](http://www.amazon.com/Box-Shipping-Container-Smaller- Economy/dp/0691136408/)

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Wait until he visits Rotterdam. It's all robot cranes and robot vehicles.</comment>


Sweden ends contract with Elsevier, moving for open access for science articles - <AUTHOR> http://openaccess.blogg.kb.se/2018/05/16/sweden-stands-up-for-open-access-cancels-agreement-with-elsevier/ <comment><USER2> I am surprised that it took so long after the invention of the Internet. In the pre-Internet era, these journals used to play a significant role in distributing research papers in physical paper form. It made sense then. There was no way to copy a 10 page research paper from Germany to China with a few finger taps at low cost. But with the advent of the Internet and its pervasiveness, it no longer makes sense to rely on a costly media based on physical printing, distribution, and centralized organizations milking money out of it.

I remember Timothy Gowers calling for a boycott of Elsevier back in 2012. It's 6 years since then and Elsevier is still alive. Influential researchers still submit their work to Elsevier! It took less time (a few weeks?) for everyone to boycott Digg!

It's surprising how the Internet has been used to distribute cat videos, advertisements, time-draining, and attention-draining content to a sickening degree but it is still underutilized to distribute good content like research papers such that the Internet becomes the primary and de facto media for such content.

<comment><USER3> That's because, despite being called "publishers", publishing is not the main function academic publishers like Elsevier are being used for. Their main function is identifying and recognising the most valued academics in each field. So obviously academics are going to pay whatever amount of public money is needed and available to get that stamp of approval, because otherwise they'll be out of a job in a _very_ competitive job market.

 _Edit:_ The argument in more detail: [https://medium.com/flockademic/to-fix- scholarly-publishing-d...](https://medium.com/flockademic/to-fix-scholarly- publishing-decouple-credentialing-from-publishing-29b211f49acc)

<comment><USER4> Most of the time the publishers just forward the abstract or sample to peers and then make their decision based on that.

Imagine HN where you are only allowed to publish your own content and random users would be selected to evaluate your work.

<comment><USER5> > Imagine HN where you are only allowed to publish your own content and random > users would be selected to evaluate your work.

We should try this!

<comment><USER6> it's called "the internet"...

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> Good, now the Nobel Committee should say it will only consider science published in open source journals for future Nobel prizes...

<comment><USER8> Excellent idea. Wish I'd thought of that :)

It's arguable that stuff isn't actually in the public record if access requires payments.

<comment><USER7> Elsevier is a criminal enterprise, nothing more, nothing less...

<comment><AUTHOR> We gotta stop enabling them. If we demand that publicly funded universities adopt open access Elsevier will be gone in a few years. And of course I'm not recommending Sci-Hub because it's illegal but worth mentioning it...

<comment><USER9> How will Elsevier be gone if it controls so much of the content used in citations?

<comment><AUTHOR> Over time I believe more content will be published in open access journals. In Machine Learning this is already quite common and it's amazing.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> The more democratic you are as a nation, the more time elected officials spend thinking about ways to improve the lives of ordinary people (not just those in power).

Been considering moving to one of the countries high on the democracy index to work/code and pay taxes. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democracy_Index)

<comment><USER11> I've got to say, political debates in Scandinavia have nothing to do with what you see in the US. People are debating the real problems (education, housing, healthcare, etc.) instead of focusing on inter-party rivalries.

<comment><USER12> I watched the debate between the party leaders recently and the level of conversation really struck me. That's not to say that there aren't problems - the Sweden Democrats have basically succeeded in wedging immigration into every single conversation. But there seems to still be an appreciation for serious policy and statesmanship.

<comment><USER13> You see the same thing in Vermont, New Hampshire, Maine, Massachusetts, etc. In the US, on average if you want to see a better form of political discourse, you have to move toward more local politics (whether state, county, city, town).

Sweden = local politics. It's a small nation. 25% of their population lives in just four cities.

Directly comparing the whole of the US to Sweden is absurdity. One would expect a dramatic increase in messy national politics if you took 33 Swedens and put them under a Federal authority.

<comment><USER14> I could see that, maybe the U.S. should just separate into smaller city states. Let each fend for themselves... It'd be much easier for people to get what they want out of a national government - they could just move to the state that actually represents their interests better... Want universal Healthcare / Legalized Marijuana / try california. Want to make sure nobody gets handouts at all including SSI, Medicaid, and Medicare move to Louisiana or Texas.

<comment><USER15> I've often wondered if the U.S. would work better if there were some sort of multi-layered federalism wherein each cultural region (Northeast, Deep South, Cascadia, etc) got their own executive and legislative office above the state level, but not at the federal level. Doing this would probably eliminate a lot of the gridlock in DC since people could work on cultural and social issues at that level rather than across all 50 states (although it would also probably make things a lot worse for minorities in the South...).

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> Blog spam.

Go here: [http://openaccess.blogg.kb.se/2018/05/16/sweden-stands-up- fo...](http://openaccess.blogg.kb.se/2018/05/16/sweden-stands-up-for-open- access-cancels-agreement-with-elsevier/)

<comment><USER17> Yes. Just came here to say that the linked to site appears to be a content aggregator and that the original article is here: [https://www.timeshighereducation.com/news/sweden-cancels- els...](https://www.timeshighereducation.com/news/sweden-cancels-elsevier- contract-open-access-dispute-spreads)

Superb news though, couldn't happen to a nicer company.

</comment></comment><comment><USER18> > Starting June 30, Swedish researchers will no longer be publishing in > Elsevier and will not have access to Elsevier magazines.

Legality aside, given how high the usability of Sci-Hub is these days, I have no doubt in my mind about who got the short end of this stick...

</comment><comment><USER19> Here is a dumb thought I just had.

What if in stead of a giant stack of hard to nav papers...

...what if in stead each discipline would aim to publish a book????!

Each chapter would highlight the most important components of which the full version would be.... another book?

tier 2 of the books would simply refer to papers to provide even more additional reading.

The whole thing would keep it self up to date using version control and the closer to the front page of tier 1 the more extremely critical the review would be. An as-large-as-possible crowd sourced budget should be dedicated to reviewing and rewriting each of the book.

Each would be freely available online but every self respecting nerd would want a copy on his bookshelves.

A strict less is more policy would keep the books portable.

Technicality of the tier 1 books should be limited as much as possible in order to fit in a little encyclopedia of terms and methods.

By exposing the most important parts of a field to an audience as large as possible scientists would finally get the recognition they deserve which in turn would stimulate allocation of public funds.

A truly absurd idea, there, I said so myself.

</comment><comment><USER8> And with Sci-Hub still alive, Sweden etc have more leverage.

<comment><USER17> I had trouble getting to Sci-Hub and LibGen at my uni (this was about a month ago) and I don't know if it was my uni's firewall or the recent court ruling smack-downs in earlier this month[0] and last November[1]. I just checked from home and I found [https://sci-hub.tw/](https://sci-hub.tw/) and [http://gen.lib.rus.ec/](http://gen.lib.rus.ec/) work okay for me so ¯\\_(ツ)_/¯

[0] [https://torrentfreak.com/sci-hub-pirate-bay-for-science- secu...](https://torrentfreak.com/sci-hub-pirate-bay-for-science-security- certs-revoked-by-comodo-ca-180503/)

[1] [https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/11/23/sci_hubs_become_ina...](https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/11/23/sci_hubs_become_inactive_following_court_order/)

<comment><USER20> I try to keep this list up to date with the latest links: [https://citationsy.com/blog/download-research-papers- scienti...](https://citationsy.com/blog/download-research-papers-scientific- articles-free-sci-hub/)

Citationsy also has a similar feature built-in: [https://citationsy.com/blog/new-feature-citationsy- archives/](https://citationsy.com/blog/new-feature-citationsy-archives/)

<comment><USER3> Here's a crowdsourced list (based on Wikidata): [https://whereisscihub.now.sh](https://whereisscihub.now.sh)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> Cool, odd that I as a Swedish researcher haven't heard of this... Maybe they ment Switzerland - people have major difficulties discerning the two.

Tack, ha en bra dag!

<comment><USER3> Nope, it's Sweden :) Much is still unclear though, as these negotiations were done on the level of the universities, so even academic librarians don't fully know what this might mean to e.g. their budgets, and whether they can invest the money saved in open research infrastructure.

</comment></comment><comment><USER22> Knowledge will eventually be communicated by adding new information to a universal network which represents all known truths ... the act of ~publishing~ will be to add new nodes and/or edges ... this network will get launched by seeding it from culling all existing published papers however once it goes live the very idea of publishing research to any journal will become obsolete and counterproductive

</comment><comment><USER23> Some more details for those of us who would like to know who "Sweden" is in these circumstances. This kind of decisions are usually not taken on the level of the national government.

[http://openaccess.blogg.kb.se/2018/05/16/sweden-stands-up- fo...](http://openaccess.blogg.kb.se/2018/05/16/sweden-stands-up-for-open- access-cancels-agreement-with-elsevier/)

<comment><USER24> Not by the government directly but by a national library organisation reacting to a goverment mandate for open access.

<comment><USER23> Yes, I think that was what it said in the link I provided. :)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> long ago, while working at a science software company, I was casually told by a co-worker that in Japan, science publishing is run by their mafia.. The scientists I saw were so busy, so intent and so disciplined, that no management topics were ever discussed. So I went to a US business school library and looked up some management-side statistics about profit-per- employee.. and saw that the science companies of the time had less than half the number of employees, typically, with large revenue.

Some number of people are just predatory over profits, whatever the level of intelligence, legality and social status. Whatever the origins of this science conglomorate, you can bet that over the years, a crude extraction of profits via control of players, emerged.

</comment><comment><USER26> As with other online transfers, actually publishing/reading material has become the easy part and a whole pile of issues with security cropped up instead. (You don't even really need a publisher to help with notoriety, if your stuff already shows up easily on Google.)

I wish that Elsevier was being paid to solve a bunch of hard security problems but they seem to just be an expensive paywall. For example, do they provide a block chain or other trusted time stamp solution to make it easy to prove that a publication was "first" (no matter who decides to steal a file and copy/paste their own name as author instead)? I'd really like to see those kinds of things become mainstream defaults for publishing. Right now the main downside to just throwing files on random web sites is that they _don't_ typically have those security elements, making it easy to steal and hard to authenticate what you're seeing.

<comment><USER3> Journals do usually list the submission date, I believe. Otherwise, submitting your work to a preprint server can prove that you were first (assuming you trust the preprint server), although in some fields, journal publication is still the only thing recognised as planting the pole.

You'd only need blockchain if you don't trust the preprint servers, but I don't think there's reason not to.

</comment></comment><comment><USER27> I worked in the scientific publishing industry. Not directly for Elsevier, but we had dealings with them too.

Many people here view Elsevier as this evil nebulous entity. Leaving "evil" aside, like every large business, Elsevier is composed to people, some of them very smart.

Which is to say Elsevier has seen this "open access" movement coming for a better part of a decade now, just like everyone else. As far back as 2011 the industry has been inventing ways to make "open access" as profitable as the current system (ideally, even more). Green open access, gold open access, diamond and hybrid; moving walls, paywalls, article processing charges…

Having seen the sausage made, I guess I'm a little cynical about "open access". I see it devoid of the idealistic "stick it to the man" connotations, and more like another feel-good buzzword scam.

<comment><USER28> Many companies fell despite having many smart people working for them.

I would say every semi-big company probably has many smart people working for them. That does not prevent them from doing very stupid/bad/evil things, and sometimes disappearing.

The fact that they anticipated the move does not mean anything regarding their future, just like Kodak with digital photography for instance.

Taken differently, maybe you see a tsunami coming from very far away and are able to even calculate how strong it is and when it will come, but that does not mean you will be able to save your house in the seafront ;)

<comment><USER27> Sure. My point was not only did Elsevier see the "tsunami" coming, they also prepared for it profusely. Using a combination of legislation, regulation, lobbying and technology.

Obviously any company can fail. I'm just offering a little inside information that pushes back against the notion that Elsevier is a static, dumb, backward- facing entity, taken completely by surprise by this new-fangled thing called "open access". Not the case.</comment></comment></comment>