NBC's Snapchat news show gains 29+ million viewers in its first month - <AUTHOR> https://techcrunch.com/2017/08/18/nbcs-snapchat-news-show-gains-29-million-viewers-in-its-first-month <comment><USER2> It is borderline irresponsible for a blog post to tout NBC's Snapchat initiatives without fitting in a line about how NBC is Snapchat's biggest (perhaps only?) major media investor, to the tune of $500M: [https://www.recode.net/2017/3/3/14801168/snap-nbc- investment...](https://www.recode.net/2017/3/3/14801168/snap-nbc-investment- steve-burke-letter)

I don't mean to suggest that NBC is futzing the numbers to bolster its investment, just that they have a massive incentive to make things look as rosy as possible. And, on the flip side, they have an incentive to be as innovative in the media storytelling space as possible. Other outlets have Snapchat presences but nothing quite to this scale.

</comment><comment><USER3> This is great, and I'm not really surprised by its success. The stuff they have on there now is just total, absolute garbage. Right now it's:

"Courtney (one of the karsidhins) is an Egyptian Goddess"

"How Much Porn is Too Much Porn"

"Is this the Big L for Drake"

I just cannot imagine caring about any of this stuff, and it uses a lot of data to just load the previews. It's so annoying I did my first Instagram story this week.

Good to see snapchat is putting together some content that you wouldn't see in a tabloid magazine. I realize I probably sound like an old man, which I am not.

<comment><USER4> > "Courtney (one of the karsidhins) is an Egyptian Goddess"

Did they misspell "Kardashians", or did you? Even the kind of people who would be interested in why a Kardashian is an Egyptian Goddess would presumably notice the misspelling.

<comment><USER5> It doesn't matter.

<comment><USER4> I know you want to signal that you're too cool to care about the Kardashians, and I don't care about them either. But it's entirely relevant to the conversation and the attempt to understand what kind of userbase this post describes if NBC isn't even bothering to spell names right in their headline.

<comment><USER5> The novelty of NBC's move and the reason it's being talked about on HN is that an old media giant is embracing Snapchat's younger demographic. Once you know that any supporting details are largely irrelevant because they only further describe what is already known.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> I asked my 16 year old nephew 6 months ago how he accesses the news. His answer: Snapchat. I followed that with anywhere else? His response was nope.

There is a lot of potential for using snapchat for news related coverage. Say NBC creates a "become a NBC snap journalist package" available to anyone that requests it. Included is a pin, handheld mic with "NBCx" (or some other visual identifier), something like an AP style guidebook that is simplified, and a concise bit a rules on what is considered news. NBC can sift through these specific accounts, select and publish what's most relevant.

I might sign up for an account if Snap gave me a way to get hyper-local coverage from snap journalists.

<comment><USER7> > I asked my 16 year old nephew 6 months ago how he accesses the news. His > answer: Snapchat.

I mean, I'm 29 and I get all my news from Twitter, Imgur, and HackerNews. Panders to a different demographic, but is ultimately just as bad.

Most news is garbage anyway. Designed to make you anxious so you'll buy more stuff. At least HackerNews doesn't have that motive so it's more interesting on average.

<comment><USER8> In Germany (and the same applies to many other countries as well) the majority of people watch public broadcast news every day. It's financed by tax money so there is no profit motive and it's reasonably unbiased. I think a major reason for the current political divide in the US is that both camps have their own sources of information.

<comment><USER9> Just because it doesn't have private shareholders doesn't mean there's no income motive. Executives want to maximize the money they can pay themselves regardless of whether the company distributes dividends.

<comment><USER8> That's true. I actually don't know how the incentives are structured for executives in the German broadcast but they seem to reward creating quality, unbiased news.

If you look at the most popular newspaper in Germany which is essentially a tabloid it's clear it's not because there is less demand for that kind of trash in Germany.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER10> Big difference between what snapchat counts as a "view" \- just opening a single video - and actually viewing the program, as in watching it for more than second.

Would be interesting to see what 29MM viewers converts into number of minutes of actually viewed content.

But hey, as a vanity metric, 29MM is impressive! =]

<comment><USER11> Snapchat is using a disingenuous metric here to count views which plays to their advantage; an advantage they wish to exploit as long as they can before their advertisers and content partners wisen up and start demanding a metric that better captures whether the content was consumed to the producer's satisfaction enough to count as an impression.

Right now, this is not as big of a concern because Snapchat's coveted demographic composition and its curated way of working with content partners and advertisers; this results in advertiser self-selection and attracts brand- oriented advertisers with big budgets and less of an acute interest in tracking ROI.

However, once those advertisers look harder at their ROI (like Procter & Gamble [1]) or Snapchat wishes to attract the sorts of SMB advertisers its competitor Facebook can readily attract onto FB and Instagram -- and even struggling Twitter can court -- Snapchat will face increasing pressure to change the way they count views. Facebook, for example, has had a 3-second cutoff before counting a video view for a while, even as they bungled the way they reported metrics [2]. Different platforms have differing definitions on what counts as a view or impression [3].

[1] [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14879204](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14879204) [2] [http://www.businessinsider.com/facebook-exaggerating-view- co...](http://www.businessinsider.com/facebook-exaggerating-view-count-didnt- affect-advertiser-bills-2016-9) [3] [http://marketingland.com/whats-a-video- view-on-facebook-only...](http://marketingland.com/whats-a-video-view-on- facebook-only-3-seconds-vs-30-at-youtube-128311)

<comment><USER12> It is tough to compare them. Facebook videos automatically play so that 3 second level isn't completely real either.

<comment><USER13> Even when you explicitly disable auto play it gets turned back on for some odd reason.

<comment><USER14> The "sort by > most recent" resetter was foreshadowing.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> Is any of the news content on snapchat worth watching? Scrolling through their _entire offering_ seems to offer less information than a casual glance at the front page of a newspaper.

</comment><comment><USER16> Senior digital media guy here. If I were to ask some pointed questions around these claims they might be along the lines of...

\- What is the distribution of view durations? Given how Snap counts a view I'd be shocked if more than a small percentage were longer than a second or two.

\- How many of these views were paid to increase reach (either directly or via some deal given their investment in Snap)? Most "successful" online videos like this are kicked off with sizeable spend to claim large view counts, get a spike for popularity (which in some platforms can help get organic views)

\- What so subsequent views and view duration cohorts look like? I'd be shocked if there wasn't steep drop off.

\- What is the distribution of account age for these viewers? This could flag less sophisticated fake account creation if there was any padding going on.

</comment><comment><USER17> What amazed me from those numbers is that Lester Holt who does the evening news for NBC only gets around 9 million viewers.

[http://thehill.com/homenews/media/326152-nbcs-lester-holt- to...](http://thehill.com/homenews/media/326152-nbcs-lester-holt-tops-evening- news-ratings)

So how long before Mark Zuckerburg says to Kevin Systrom, call CBS or ABC and then make a copy of this service?

<comment><USER18> Holt's numbers are for 30 minute views of roughly five minutes of news, if there's enough going on not to require filler, ten minutes of complimentary copy, political preaching to the choir, and video news releases, and finally fifteen minutes of advertising. The snapchat thing is for starting 30 second videos. They're providing a similar amount of news content after all the corrections are applied.

Also all social media services have purchased content and purchased clicks available. Its impossible to estimate how many of the 29 million are bots or purchased traffic.

Combined, Holt has a larger reach, at least for now.

</comment></comment><comment><USER19> I'm confused -- i thought Snapchat was for sending pictures that get auto- deleted. I'm honestly not sure how to even keep up with this stuff anymore, other than installing everything and using it, which i don't have the time or inclination for.

</comment><comment><USER20> So it looks like those kinds of news is not tailored to the user, right?

What's interesting is how beneficial is the news curated by an ML algorithm. If we optimize the content presented to the user by the metric of his engagement, that a slippery slope, as we know that the majority of people would unconsciously click on click-bait articles which might not be the most interesting, relevant or beneficial for them. Moreover, there is a risk of opinion bias, as we clearly seen with Facebook during the recent US presidential campaign.

Which in turn raises the question: "Is consuming news (even if tailored to your preferences) is the best way to have a well-rounded view of the world"?

</comment><comment><USER21> So how long is each segment? 10 seconds? That's not news.

<comment><USER22> I'm not familiar with Snap but I recently downloaded Instagram for the first time and, despite 99% of the content being "look at how cool I am!", I did find a regional news station (from Spain) that only posts 30 second clips of local news. It's akin to Great Big Story on YT, in the way that it gives you just enough info to see if you're interested (at which point you can look up more about whatever it is online).

I'd love to find more IG accounts like this but I'm not sure news clips via IG is actually a thing.

</comment></comment><comment><USER23> "But that's not necessarily a fair comparison, given that Snapchat counts a view as soon as a video opens."

Take the 29 million view count with a grain of salt.

</comment><comment><USER24> I don't know if it's something in recent events (I presume not) but it's disappointing HN can't have a conversation around popular culture topic without descending into calling part of the population "vapid" or whatever. Can't we just accept people like different things. I like ruby. Maybe you don't.

</comment><comment><USER25> I pretty much exclusively followed the last presidential election through Snapchat channels.

</comment><comment><USER26> oh great, yet another avenue for younger generations to bleed more of their IQ (and by extension wealth) off.

at some point this shit-show is going to come home to roost.... (wait...that's happening now multi-generationally with trump)....

seriously, after the multi-decade debacle of the 24 hour conflict channels (CNN/MSNBC/FOX) one would think we'd learned our lesson...

apparently not.....

<comment><USER27> The film Idiocracy is a prediction not satire.

<comment><USER28> It's just eugenics propaganda, although you can make the case for that interpretation to be unintended.

Good comedians never let facts or good taste get in the way of good jokes, and Idiocracy has some interesting observations, but the framing device is repugnant.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER29> Seems like a lot of news stories already cite fb or Twitter posts anyway, so it's a natural progression.

</comment><comment><USER30> Is this like "MTV News" ?

</comment><comment><USER31> Too good to be true.

</comment><comment><USER32> Does anyone still use Snapchat? Isn't it all teenagers?

</comment><comment><USER33> Amazed at this hacker news at the top of the charts.</comment>


I went to the hospital to give birth and tested positive for meth - <AUTHOR> http://narrative.ly/i-went-to-the-hospital-to-give-birthand-tested-positive-for-meth/ <comment><USER3> If this happens on a regular basis and people find out about it, people will stop going to the hospital to give birth, raising the rate of mortality and complications for infants and mothers.

Anyone who has a basic understanding of Bayes' Theorem can tell you that testing all new mothers for X (where X is relatively rare among new mothers) will lead to a large number of false positives even if the test has high specificity and sensitivity, simply because the prior probability for X is so low.

<comment><USER4> _people will stop going to the hospital to give birth, raising the rate of mortality and complications for infants and mothers._

According to Healthcare Triage, home births have an overall lower risk of complications. It's only in the cases of things going spectacularly wrong that being in the hospital helps.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHWvSPhENtk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHWvSPhENtk)

It fits with my view of things: If there's something really broken, go to the hospital to get it fixed. However, if you're fine, you're better off avoiding the place. (Do get checkups from a doctor you have a good relationship with.)

<comment> ygjb-dupe > It's only in the cases of things going spectacularly wrong that being in the > hospital helps.

Yep. My wife had a perfectly normal pregnancy, and everything went perfectly until something went spectacularly wrong. When my daughter was born, and didn't breath on her own for the first 3 minutes. If she hadn't been in a hospital, it would have gone down as still born. She was in the hospital, immediately received resuscitation and numerous other treatments which maintained her blood oxygen level sufficient to prevent brain damage, and now at the age of 4 is ahead of every developmental measure.

"It's only in the case of things going spectacularly wrong" that _any_ risk mitigation activity actually provides value, and in every other case is essentially worthless. YMMV, but I tell everyone I can the story of my daughter whenever they talk about home birth.

<comment><USER5> I agree with the larger sentiment, but don't be so quick, it's a game of chance even when shit happens.

One of my daughters too didn't breathe when she was born. The midwives grew very very ernest very very quickly, and the little child was rushed off to hospital in an ambulance. All went fine. I was a little shaky that first night.

<comment> ygjb-dupe Life is a game of chance, but we make our own luck (beyond what we are born with) by making sensible decisions, taking measured chances, and knowing when to admit we are out of our depth.

Yes, midwives (in some jurisdictions) are trained, qualified practitioners. That said, they are not equipped to deal with many, many complications other than by calling an ambulance and hoping for the best.

Choosing to have my daughter born in a hospital instead of a home birth was most likely the difference between having a healthy baby girl and something in the range of severe mental handicap to stillbirth.

Having a child is a huge risk and investment (by every measure, emotionally, financially, socially, economically, etc). Why would you risk having a stillborn child, life with a mentally or physically handicapped child (this is not a shot against handicapped children - it's a shot against people who refuse to apply critical thinking skills to emotionally charged high risk decisions) so that you can satisfy some foolish ideal that being born at home is better than being born around people who have trained for much of their adult lives to keep your kid alive in its first few days?

It ranks right up there with the foolish parents who refuse to vaccinate children against common ailments or choose naturopathy or homeopathy because of "toxic western medicine".

<comment><USER6> Don't confuse midwifery with home-birth. They are overlapping but different. There are midwife delivery centers that are attached to hospitals.

<comment> ygjb-dupe I didn't; I acknowledged that in some jurisdictions midwives are well regulated. I also contrasted hospital birth with home birth.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> This is a big part of why homebirth is gaining popularity. It's just family and maybe a midwife. Nobody is going to do a meth test. The doors don't lock you inside, unable to escape without permission. (that security is NOT to protect the baby from strangers; it's so CPS can take your baby)

Also: There is no need to drive madly to the hospital. There will be no incentive to keep you for exactly how long your insurance will pay, nor to perform surgery. You get to sleep in your own bed, without constant beeping and light from the hallway. You can have as many visitors as you want. You will never be separated from your baby, not even for a moment. You won't be treated like a potential criminal. You get respect.

<comment><USER8> And if there's trouble and the kid[0] dies[1] you can just say that was "their journey" and wash your hands from it. Hell, you might even "get respect" and praises for having killed your kid, go you.

But hey, CPS didn't get to take your kid[2], so there's that.

[0] or the mother, or both

[1] which is anything but rare, even in the UK under obstetric care[3]

> The risk of dying on the day of birth (0.43 per 1000, or 430 micromorts) > exceeds that of any other average day of life until the 92nd year.

and matches the risks of major surgery. Homebirth, especially with completely unqualified midwives (which is the rule in the US) is almost an order of magnitude more risky[4].

[2] the coroner did, to check for foul play

[3] [http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/1471-0528.12544/f...](http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/1471-0528.12544/full)

[4] [https://olis.leg.state.or.us/liz/2013R1/Downloads/CommitteeM...](https://olis.leg.state.or.us/liz/2013R1/Downloads/CommitteeMeetingDocument/8585)

<comment><USER9> That's just an ignorant response. There are plenty of board-certified midwives, birthing centers, etc. Importantly, a great deal of risk can be ascertained before labor, and like any other medical procedure you're either a good candidate for non-hospital birth or you're not.

<comment><USER10> It depends heavily on the quality of the midwife and how well they can recognize complications. If they miss something (which very likely would turn from from a required test in a hospital), by the time the baby has stopped breathing, it might be too late to save them.

"Planned out-of-hospital birth was associated with a higher rate of perinatal death than was planned in-hospital birth (3.9 vs. 1.8 deaths per 1000 deliveries, P=0.003; odds ratio after adjustment for maternal characteristics and medical conditions, 2.43; 95% confidence interval [CI], 1.37 to 4.30; adjusted risk difference, 1.52 deaths per 1000 births; 95% CI, 0.51 to 2.54). The odds for neonatal seizure were higher and the odds for admission to a neonatal intensive care unit lower with planned out-of-hospital births than with planned in-hospital birth." [1]

"Midwife home births had a significantly higher total neonatal mortality risk than deliveries by hospital midwives (1.26 per 1000 births; relative risk [RR], 3.87 vs 0.32 per 1000; P < .001). Midwife home births of 41 weeks or longer (1.84 per 1000; RR, 6.76 vs 0.27 per 1000; P < .001) and midwife home births of women with a first birth (2.19 per 1000; RR, 6.74 vs 0.33 per 1000; P < .001) had significantly higher risks of total neonatal mortality than deliveries by hospital midwives. In midwife home births, neonatal mortality for first births was twice that of subsequent births (2.19 vs 0.96 per 1000; P < .001). Similar results were observed for early neonatal mortality. The excess total neonatal mortality for midwife home births compared with midwife hospital births was 9.32 per 10,000 births, and the excess early neonatal mortality was 7.89 per 10,000 births." [2]

[1] [http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsa1501738](http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsa1501738) [2] [http://www.ajog.org/article/S0002-9378(14)00275-0/abstract](http://www.ajog.org/article/S0002-9378\(14\)00275-0/abstract)

<comment><USER11> Rounding up your first statistic slightly, that's a difference of two severe incidents per thousand births. That's a reasonably big risk factor in absolute terms, but small enough that it's not unreasonable to take in order to get other things that you care about.

Like, these are "am I willing to make this tradeoff" numbers similar to choosing to drive to work daily, rather than "fuck no, go to the hospital" numbers.

<comment> ygjb-dupe Midwives don't sell themselves on the increases risks, they talk about the (largely) cosmetic benefits of home birth.

Look up earlier in the thread for my comment, but anecdotally, almost every parent that I have told my story to has changed their opinion on home birth vs. hospital birth.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> It was (likely) the inhaler!

It can cause a positive meth test (thank you Google):

[https://www.labcorp.com/wps/portal/!ut/p/c1/04_SB8K8xLLM9MSS...](https://www.labcorp.com/wps/portal/!ut/p/c1/04_SB8K8xLLM9MSSzPy8xBz9CP0os_hACzO_QCM_IwMLo1ALAyNj1yBnQxNfA4MQU6B8JG55d2MCuv088nNT9QtyI8oB5fb_Fw!!/dl2/d1/L0lDU0lKSWdrbUEhIS9JRFJBQUlpQ2dBek15cXchL1lCSkoxTkExTkk1MC01RncvN19VRTRTMUk5MzA4OVMxMDJKR00xTTJOMkRNMC9JX19fXzE!/?WCM_PORTLET=PC_7_UE4S1I93089S102JGM1M2N2DM0_WCM&WCM_GLOBAL_CONTEXT=/wps/wcm/connect/LabCorp%20Content/labcorp/services/drug+testing+services/faq/toxicology+faq)

<comment><USER12> Here is the relevant piece:

Q: What do the percentages mean in methamphetamine "d" and "l" isomer test results? A: In order to help determine whether a methamphetamine positive may be due to an illicit source, it is helpful to determine the percentage of "d" isomer. For example, following an individual's use of Vick's Vapor Inhaler, the expected result would be 100% "l" methamphetamine. However, there is a possibility that trace amounts of "d" isomer may be present in the quantitative analysis. Laboratory guidelines have been established to allow for trace presence of the "d" isomer. If the laboratory report indicates more than 80% "l" methamphetamine, the results are consistent with Vick's Vapor Inhaler use. If the laboratory reports more than 20% "d" methamphetamine present, the result indicates the use of "d" methamphetamine other than the inhaler. Illegally produced methamphetamine and amphetamine may contain mixtures of "d" and "l" isomers. LabCorp recommends use of a medical review officer (MRO) to review all non-negative test results.1

<comment><USER13> That's not informative. That's an OTC nasal decongestant.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levomethamphetamine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levomethamphetamine)

She was using an albuterol inhaler. It's prescription only and operates on the lung passages.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salbutamol](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salbutamol)

<comment><USER12> Whoops. I really thought I had this cracked. So close, yet so far.

But this leads to the obvious question: can Salbutamol confuse the drug test?

Google seems to say yes to several chemicals that look similar (both the chain and the name), but not getting a direct hit.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> Something similar happened to us. When she was 4 years old, our daughter had a string of unexplained severe seizures over the course of 8 hours or so, and she too tested positive for methamphetamine at the hospital.

What made it especially bad was the fact that my daughter was in the middle of a medical emergency, and the staff at the hospital were wasting time on a ludicrous "meth" hypothesis.

<comment><USER15> I understand why it was ludicrous from your perspective. It was not, however, ludicrous for them to spend time ruling it out.

New onset seizures (particularly a string of seizures) are unusual for a kid. Methamphetamine causes seizures. There are ways a child could have been exposed to meth that a parent wouldn't know about (another caretaker left it lying around, a preschool friend brought it in for "show and tell" and no one noticed, etc...). It was prudent on their part to consider it as a possible cause of your daughter's seizures. A positive meth test for a seizure patient (of any age) would certainly raise my index of suspicion enough to thoroughly explore the possibility of intentional or accidental ingestion.

I totally get why you would perceive them as "wasting time" (and obviously I wasn't there, it's entirely possible they were), but it's very likely they were running down all the other "normal" differential diagnoses in parallel.

<comment><USER16> You're vastly overestimating the average competence and concern that most human beings have when doing their jobs.

I've seen multiple instances with family members where the doctor's dumbass hypothesis absolutely did not match the symptoms, but they persisted in trying the worthless treatment anyway. Took 'em months to find and start treating the slightly rare form of cancer. Bring on the diagnostic computers, I say.

<comment><USER15> I know a lot of ER docs (I assume this story took place in an ER). Some are better than others, but I can't think of any that I wouldn't consider "above average" relative to "most human beings".

I'll absolutely agree with you in terms of primary care docs... As someone who routinely transports patients out of doctor's offices when the doc is in over their head, there is a _much_ broader variation in competency...

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER17> Let me state right out I don't think this person deserved such treatment, and basic critical thinking and cross-checking the prescription for the inhaler (which surely should've been a phone call away?) in theory absolves the issue. It's just, well, personal experience leads me to be wary of medical care, not simply hit autopilot and think things will turn out great. It can from time to time! But, hey, this kind of story is an excellent caution...this is why it's very, very important to pester the ever loving dogsh!t out of your health-care provider to have every single detail prepared in your file _before_ going into - essentially - the custody of a medical facility.

No matter how many times it might _seem_ stupid for me to reiterate that with my condition I can't have any blood thinners - no Aspirin specifically - <USER2> simply don't trust anybody new with being, well, competent enough to make the connection themselves. I police what goes into my body with pretty good results. I go out of my way, time and again, to discuss my specific treatment needs and precautions. Granted, not everything is in my control, but the things I can monitor, I do try to get a handle on.

</comment><comment><USER18> This is interesting because I'm a nurse and I deal with people who occasionally test positive for methamphetamine.

We've found that many of these people take Zantac (aka ranitidine, used for acid reflux). This hasn't been studied since 1991[0] but it probably should be again, given increasing rates of meth use.

I wish the author had given the name of her prescription inhaler- Vick's Vapor inhaler has been shown to test positive but albuterol and other steroid inhalers are more common.

[0] [http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2051743](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2051743)

<comment><USER13> It is clearly stated to be albuterol.

 _My husband scrolls through pages of information about albuterol inhalers and drug tests. He shows his phone to every nurse who steps foot in the room._

<comment><USER18> Oops, thanks.

Cross-reactivity studies don't seem to be published often but searching for albuterol + 'cross reactivity' shows some drug tests are cross reactive with albuterol and some aren't.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> When I was a kid:

I rode a bike without a helmet

I played outside, by my self, and would sometimes go MILES from my house.

We did stupid stuff, with fire, fireworks and the like.

My parents left me home alone after school, I was a latch key kid.

Today, the police would bring my kids home and I would get a visit from CPS for any of these things.

Welcome to having children in the new millennium.

<comment><USER20> Your anecdote doesn't correct for survivor bias.

<comment><USER21> All my friends did that too. It was the norm in the 80s when I was growing up. To my recollection, any deaths or serious injuries from it were somewhere between rare and non-existent. That's not survivor bias.

I have no doubt that a study would find there were more then than there are now, but things don't exist in isolation. We make trades for everything.

For example, we've traded relatively rare (and usually treatable) skin cancer for more widespread sunlight deprivation and Vitamin D deficiency that's implicated in a number of different conditions. I don't think this was a good trade, personally.

In this case we've traded our kids' childhoods and parents' exercise of discretion--this is part of their life cycle too, keep in mind--for what I'm quite convinced is a minimal increase in safety. Mandatory bicycle helmets? Sure, if it stopped there. But we've gotten way more paranoid than that. I don't think that's a good trade either.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER22> Drug testing around childbirth is a wreck and needs to be seriously looked into...

My second son was premature... when we were in the NICU... there was a lady there, whos child was born premature because the taxi she was riding in from the airport was involved in an accident. She came from california... where her gyno was pro-mj, and she used MJ to manage her Hyperemesis gravidarum... so its in her system, clearly... but this is Texas... so even though her doc recommended it, not only was her child in the NICU, but when he got out, he didnt get to go home with her... because of stupid laws that pay no mind to actual scientific evidence...

</comment><comment><USER12> Was it the inhaler? Was it just a screw up? I wish they would tell us what caused the mix up.

<comment><USER23> Right? What a weirdly unsatisfying ending. Did they sue the hospital for not knowing enough about medicine that her inhaler could cause this?

<comment><USER24> That's the point exactly. What a weirdly unsatisfying ending. All this emotional trauma over a false positive.

It also really underscores an extremely critical question with society: When the system is inflexible, and uncaring, what recourse do you have when it fails you? Imagine the hopelessness, the bleak future, of the world turning its back on you because of a mistake. I can only imagine this is what it's like to be falsely convicted of a crime... or failing a drug test that you shouldn't have failed.

I think there's even a lesson for us technical folks here: When the systems we design are too automated, and too rigid, we are removing all compassion. Now if the system is "perfect" there's no problem, but even Google hasn't been able to completely perfect their systems. People still become the victim of false DMCA takedowns, etc.

I guess at the end of the day, the moral is to "Remember the person."

<comment><USER13> Here's the thing, it isn't just automated systems. Large institutions do the same thing. People have less and less of the full picture and act more and more as a component of the system.

In this case it appears that the social worker had enough of the full picture to inject some measure of sanity, but I really wonder if the nurses understood the statistics related to the tests well enough to treat her like shit over them.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> I would mention lawyers and lawsuits a lot more during the visit in this hospital and definitely sue them with a 500 pages long claim.

It's fighting law with law. If they were draw a sword, I would draw mine too.

<comment><USER8> > I would mention lawyers and lawsuits a lot more during the visit in this > hospital and definitely sue them with a 500 pages long claim.

That would be idiotic, nonsensical and a very good way to make current and future interactions even worse. Hospitals are mandatory reporters, if they don't report suspicious situations (such as a pregnant mother failing a drug test) they're on the hook for it, and they _must prepare for a possible NAS case_ which is anything but fun, or a walk in the park.

And despite the completely one-sided report, it looks like much of the antipathy came from her insisting on her "experience" and on e.g. breastfeeding the child.

<comment><USER26> the issue isn't the mandatory reporting. The issue was the way they treated here AFTER the two known-to-be-spurious tests, neither of which were _blood draws_ which are vastly more accurate.

So, yes, a lawsuit would be in order (IMO). I wouldn't ask for a huge payday, but at the very least that they clean up their testing procedures and follow protocols.

<comment><USER8> > The issue was the way they treated here AFTER the two known-to-be-spurious > tests

The tests were not _known to be spurious_ by the hospital.

> neither of which were blood draws which are vastly more accurate.

Blood draws tests are also much longer (that's the 2~3 weeks test whose results they got afterwards).

> I wouldn't ask for a huge payday

Not that you'd get any even if you did.

> at the very least that they clean up their testing procedures and follow > protocols.

Is there any protocol you know them to not have followed?

Keeping in mind that the one account we have is the one-sided version of the parents, consider the hospital's point of view: what they have is an expectant mother who has twice failed a drug test and thus a NAS risk, a nearly DOA newborn from emergency C-section and the possibly drug-addicted mother thereafter insists on breastfeeding.

<comment><USER27> _The tests were not known to be spurious by the hospital._

Then the hospital is negligent. It is _their responsibility_ to know the failure modes of any technology they use.

<comment><USER28> They do. And the balance of probabilities is that the urinalysis is more likely than not to be accurate (I don't know percentages). So as a mandated reporter, they did what they could.

They gave multiple chances for retests. The results were consistent.

A blood test four weeks prior to delivery would be a good start, but still leaves a window.

There are two suboptimal possibilities at that point:

1) err on the side of the mother, who has failed (incorrectly as it may be) multiple drug tests and allow her to breastfeed her child, or

2) err on the side of the child, who is exhibiting symptoms that could point to NAS, bradycardia and the like, who is delivered by emergency C-section (so she would not have had the bonding experience immediately post partum, as it was, anyway)

They did know the failure mode.

They evaluated.

They held off on calling CPS. They allowed contact after the baby's urinalysis.

There is no negligence here. The father showing by their own words anecdotal forum posts and such is not reason for the hospital to say "Well, what do we know, here you go".

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> > A part of me recognizes the hospital is acting in the interests of my child. > But even if I were a drug user, does that justify turning delivery into > something criminal? At what point do the rights of my child outweigh my own?

rights to have a "birth experience" according to a wishlist, possibly at the expense of the child? At more or less every point I would assume.

<comment><USER29> You're having the abortion debate with yourself.

<comment><USER30> I think most arguments for abortion rely heavily on the right of the mother to bodily autonomy. That is, once the baby is delivered, those arguments fall apart. Breastfeeding your child because you want the "experience" is completely different.

<comment><USER31> breastfeeding is a hell of a lot more than 'an experience'

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER32> Lawsuit against the hospital thats what the lady needs to do. Would be a nice college fund for her kid.

<comment><USER33> And continue to drive up unaffordable medical costs?

<comment><USER34> Yes. The solution for high medical costs isn't less lawsuits, it's UHC.

<comment><USER35> United Health Care is pretty bad. They are always finding some excuse to not pay. I suggest Blue Cross Blue Shield, at least the PPO.

<comment><USER36> I'm not GP, but UHC = universal health care, presumably single payer health care

<comment><USER35> See for yourself: [http://www.uhc.com/](http://www.uhc.com/)

OK, it's UnitedHealthcare® if you want silly capitalization.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER37> > My doula rubs lavender essential oil on my temples, and my husband plays > "Push It," the Spotify playlist I created for labor and delivery. I have a > photo of Beyoncé propped up on the over-bed table, because if anything can > inspire me, it's Queen Bey. Also on the table is my birth plan, which is > kind of like a wish list for delivery. That includes modest requests, like > keeping the door to my room closed, as well as more imperative things, like, > "Please delay all routine procedures on the baby until after the bonding and > breastfeeding period."

> The bulk of my produce was organic, my drinking water purified through a > reverse-osmosis system. I used clove oil on a persistent toothache instead > of visiting the dentist, because I didn't want any anesthetic to pass > through my body and into the placenta. During all 42 weeks, the hardest > drugs that entered my body were prenatal vitamins and puffs from my > prescription asthma inhaler.

"But... I'm white! I'm middle-class! I have a doula! It's patently absurd that these nurses could think I did drugs! Just look at me! What do you mean that's exactly what a drug user would say?"

From her point of view she's a perfect mommy, but as far as the nurses and doctors know, she's just somebody who showed up pregnant with meth in her system and an unlicensed hippie who's smearing lavender oil around the place.

</comment><comment><USER38> Why is the state using birth as grounds for a search?

edit: If the answer is "will someone think of the children!" why isn't the state randomly drug testing all parents?

<comment><USER13> The drug test is relevant to providing care to the mother. In the case of a delivery, I think it is reasonable to consider the results of the test while providing care for the child.

It's obviously a thorny question, but what should a facility that treats children do when it notices a conflict between the interests of the child and the interests of the parent? It's clearly going to happen.

</comment></comment><comment><USER39> The title needs editing, the fancy ellipsis of the original has been eaten. Mods, please? My eeeeyeeees ...

<comment><USER40> That's not a "fancy ellipsis", that's an ordinary, standard U+2026 horizontal ellipsis. It is not three period characters in a row.

HN appears to support Unicode://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9105273

<comment><USER39> Yes, I know, that was what I meant and tried to express in a semi-funny way.

I fully realize that the ellipsis is a code point/glyph/character/whatever in its own right, and that the rendering of it using three periods is not correct.

The existance of that rendering is what makes the _proper_ one seem "fancy", from some points of view.

Also, one should never explain jokes I guess.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER41> Sometimes I think that the HN crowd is less prone to very non-scientific biases than the general public, or a place where I'm less likely to see people throwing around things that sound like facts that are mostly psuedo-science. Then threads like this happen.

</comment><comment><USER42> I visit my sister at work sometimes, a nurse who looks after drug addled premature babies at a big hospital... it is heart wrenching to see those little people hooked up to morphine lines because they were born addicts to useless parents.

I am sorry she went through that, it is very unfortunate that statistically some tests will come back with false positives. Arguing that they should have treated her different is much like arguing babies should not to be vaccinated because there is a very slight statistical chance they might have a bad reaction.

<comment><USER43> If a test has a non trivial false positive rate, then a positive must not be treated as a true one without further analysis. Innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around.

<comment><USER44> Yet arrests can be made, and bail denied, before a trial if there is reasonable suspicion that the defendant is a danger to other human beings. And in this case, the positive test result was certainly enough for reasonable suspicion. Everyone acted professionally, the baby was not taken away, the freedom to breastfeed was not taken away. Even if the (statistical) test should have taken whether a person is known to use an asthma inhaler into (greater?) account in its prior distribution, that doesn't change the procedure here, just the number of people it might apply to.

<comment><USER45> From the article:

> All three days, the nurses are reluctant to hand over the baby, saying my > actions are irresponsible.

> Every shift change, two nurses stand by my bed and inform another two nurses > of my status as a combative patient. "This woman tested positive for > methamphetamine,"

This does not strike me as very professional. The medical staff should have considered the possibility of a false positive, and given the mother the benefit of the doubt when she said she wasn't taking methamphetamine. Telling the mother that she shouldn't breastfeed and that CPS have been called, while not stopping her from breastfeeding (presumably they have no legal power) is the worst of both worlds: increase stress/worry (which is something the child would pick up on), draw everyone's focus away from the actual birth and the child, while simultaneously allowing her to potentially pass this, presumably harmful, drug to the child. Madness.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER46> Maybe she just left out from the story, but why didn't she say "But I didn't take any meth! I didn't even drink any alcohol! After a miscarriage I'd never do anything like that! Is it possible that the test is wrong?"

<comment><USER9> You, the filthy unwashed public: "Is it possible that the test is wrong?"

Them, apparently omnipotent gods: _silent shaking of head and look of pity_

<comment><USER8> Had they been certain the test was right, CPS would have been hovering over the birthing bed and the parents would have risked carting to a cell. That's not what happened.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER47> What's so scary about CPS? She should have called her doctor/gyna and prepared to lawyer up, especially if she knew she didn't do drugs. Being treated like crap after birth tho must have been tough.

<comment><USER26> CPS has basically unlimited power to take the kid for any contrived reason they can imagine BEFORE it goes through any kind of court... all based on their perceived notion of 'what's best' for the child.

And if you don't believe in raising your kid the same way THEY want you to, watch out...

[http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/04/13/parents...](http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/04/13/parents- investigated-letting-children-walk-alone/25700823/)

[http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/06/14/florida-parents- charge...](http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/06/14/florida-parents-charged- felony-neglect-after-11-year-old-son-plays-backyard-90-minutes)

<comment><USER48> > CPS has basically unlimited power to take the kid for any contrived reason > they can imagine BEFORE it goes through any kind of court... all based on > their perceived notion of 'what's best' for the child.

This is 100% absolutely false, but it's a misconception CPS agents love to abuse. CPS is NOT a law enforcement agency. If they want to remove a child from a house, they need to have the police and judge's order to do so. In fact, they can only enter your house with your permission or with a warrant with police present. However, some of their worse agents thrive on threatening parents with child removal.

If you ever, ever get wind of CPS coming to visit you, consult a lawyer, and record any conversations you have with them (on your property). You need to stand up to them. Source: I've been through this. Fortunately, the person I worked with understood she was entering a hostile environment.

<comment><USER26> I've been an EMT for 15 years, in 3 states. I've reported suspicions, as required. I've also seen CPS take kids. All it takes to get a judge's 'order' is a phone call. cops at least need to present _something_ before getting a warrant.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER49> I think this piece captures brilliantly the emotional and psychological toll that rote and thoughtless application of harsh procedures and mindless judgment can be wrought on people by an uncaring system.

When my daughter was conceived her mother was addicted to opiates. We were both in a bad place. I was just out of a relationship with someone with Borderline Personality Disorder and she was coming out of her own abusive relationship. Needless to say this wasn't how either of us had envisioned conception.

But her pregnancy was a strong motivator to turn things around. But addiction isn't something you can just switch of. Especially something like an opioid. It is _extremely dangerous_ to the fetus for the mother to detox during pregnancy. Miscarriage is common. But that doesn't mean that treatment isn't an option. That treatment is, however, most commonly something like opioid maintenance in the form of methadone.

Methadone is still an opioid (although longer acting and "harder to abuse"). It still comes with the same risk of NAS. But that risk is actually fairly low. In researching the risks around my daughter's birth I came to find that only about 1/3rd of all babies born to opiate addicted women suffered NAS, and the greatest correlation was tied to usage of multiple illicit substances (say opioids and amphetamines together)

So we dedicated ourselves to having a healthy pregnancy and a healthy baby and she started methadone maintenance at a local clinic.

In the end my daughter was born four weeks premature (premature birth is actual common in opioid addicts). The author of this story did an excellent job of capturing how the atmosphere changed as soon as it was discovered that my wife was under a maintenance dose of methadone. The derisive judgment. The loathing in the eyes of the nurses. That was a very new experience for me.

And the procedures and policies described in the article are actually in many ways detrimental to and harmful to the outcome for the infant.

Opportunities for bonding should be encouraged. And at least in the case of opiates it has been found that breastfeeding decreases the risk of NAS and should be encouraged (opiate concentration in breastmilk of a woman using opiates is measured in micrograms, far below the threshold to affect the infant, but the simple skin on skin contact and intimacy seems to make all the difference).

My daughter did not suffer from NAS and after three days of observation we were discharged when it was clear her lungs were fine and she was not going to suffer withdrawals. Thankfully the attitudes of the nurses changed within about the first day. I suppose we weren't typical of "addict" parents...but I can say that being on the receiving end of that sort of experience...the only effect is going to be to push addicts further down a hole with even less chance of being healthy, functional parents.

</comment><comment><USER50> Sorry to be negative, but I'm not sure I understand what I should be outraged about. She tested positive for meth. The hospital advised her on all the things they probably advise to everyone else in that situation, they tested the baby for meth (came back negative), and they did an additional, more thorough test later (came back negative), and finally mom and dad are off to be parents. CPS was never even involved. I guess the article is about how a few nurses were mean and made her feel sad, because not much else seemed to happen.

If you really want to feel injustice and helplessness, why not try getting arrested for something you didn't do. Spend a few nights in jail, and deal with police, lawyers, judges, lose your job and friends because of it, find yourself on a bunch of lists you've never been on before, etc. That's what "being crushed by a system" is like.

<comment><USER51> I don't think you realize how emotionally fragile new mothers are.

</comment></comment><comment><USER52> She wasn't "treated like a criminal" because she tested positive to a preliminary test. She was treated like a criminal because she insisted on breastfeeding her baby despite several positive test results.

I think the mature thing to do would be to wait for the 2 week test to come back and not breastfeed your child in the meantime. Even if you know you haven't done meth, I would think the risk that you somehow have been exposed to meth should outweigh the desire to breastfeed.

The hospital is more concerned about the health of the baby than the desire of a new mother to validate their motherhood by breastfeeding. Seems okay to me.

<comment><USER53> If she did not breastfeed for the first 2 weeks it's unlikely she'd be able to start suddenly, her milk might simply have dried up. My wife wasn't able to breastfeed 1 of our 5 children and this alone caused her a degree of post- natal depression through feeling guility (no depression with the other 4).

I suspect you're male and don't have children, talk to mothers about the importance of breast feeding to them, you'll find this isn't a subject to be logical over.

<comment><USER54> Pump and dump is an option, so that mom keeps lactating, but not foolproof. The baby needs to learn how to latch on and if they are given a bottle for 2 weeks will likely refuse to breastfeed (e.g. baby turns into a frustrated screaming terror while mom sobs). But the more important point is the emotional and hormonal impact of breastfeeding on the mom, and health benefits of breastfeeding for the baby.

Breastfeeding is monumentally important for some mothers. Mom has every right to insist on breastfeeding even in the face of a test she _knows_ to be a false positive.</comment></comment></comment>


Ask HN: Are meetings painful for you? If so, how would you improve them? - <AUTHOR> In my team we have recurrent meetings such as demos, retro and planning. During those meetings most people are absent minded, often including myself.<p>Do you experience a similar situation at your job? If so, how would you like to improve it? <comment><USER2> Recurring meetings are bad. Most people come unprepared and since it is recurring unless you have made any progress, you are wasting time just for the sake of it.

Publishing agenda before meeting is a must. There is no point in starting a meeting on a blank note.

Many meetings can just be conducted over threads on slack or Microsoft team. What I mean by this is, the type of meeting where you want to confirm or come to an agreement over something, that chat thread can help flush out details before you waste everyones time over it.

In short, move most of your meeting and emails to your collaboration tool.

<comment><USER3> > _In short, move most of your meeting and emails to your collaboration tool._

Even old-fashioned collaboration tools like e-mail can be used effectively to avoid meetings. A discussion of an issue that doesn't need to be decided immediately can just as easily be done asynchronously via e-mail.

I've gotten countless meeting requests that are just some product manager wanting to get a specific item of information from a group of developers. I've averted many of these meetings just by declining the meeting request with "Here's the information you need, no need to have a meeting about this. E-mail me if you need more information."

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> Bad meetings are often the result of having meetings to discuss things that could/should have been done in email before the meeting. Send out a meeting agenda so people can come to the meeting with _answers_ instead of being blindsided.

Bad meeting: Sue: "Could you get me the figures for bugs-over-time?" Bob: "I'll have to get back to you on that."

Good meeting: Sue: "Bob investigate our bugs-over-time metric. Can you share with us what you found out?"

If you are asking a question in a meeting that could have been asked before the meeting just as easily, you're wasting expensive "meeting time".</comment>


Generative Board Games - <AUTHOR> https://www.generativeboard.games/ <comment><USER2> Tldr; GPT-2 trained over the rules of 2000 boardgames.

Unfortunately the AI doesn't know what a boardgame is, what rules are, etc. and it shows. As the site says, the rules are often nonsensical and must be adapted. This and other domains require 100% precision and consistency and a purely statistical algorithm can't get there.

</comment><comment><USER3> was thisboardgamedoesntexist.com already taken?</comment>


The new Reia: now without rainbow-farting Domo-kuns - <AUTHOR> http://www.unlimitednovelty.com/2009/11/new-reia-now-without-rainbow-farting.html

<comment><AUTHOR> Tony Arcieri (creator of Reia) just created a branch called Neotoma:

<http://github.com/tarcieri/reia/tree/neotoma>

So it looks like he might have changed his mind since this blog post.

</comment><comment><USER2> Best diagram I've seen all week.</comment>


[askHN] Did Hacker News lose its #1 ranking on Google Search? - <AUTHOR>

Every morning, I check HN by typing 'Hacker News' into Chrome's address bar and usually find it sitting on #1 spot. Today, it completely vanished from the first page and the #1 spot is occupied by www.thehackernews.com.<p>Any idea why? <comment><USER2> It was discussed earlier, pg IP blocked google's crawlers due to the load they put on the servers.</comment>


Tech.li TV: First Look at the New Twitter Design - <AUTHOR> http://tech.li/2011/12/tech-li-tv-first-look-at-the-new-twitter-design/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=tech-li-tv-first-look-at-the-new-twitter-design

<comment><USER2> Great episode Tech.li TV -- thanks for the good info.

</comment><comment><USER3> I like it. Great design.

</comment><comment><USER4> Sweetness!

</comment><comment><USER5> Awesome!</comment>


The code I'm still ashamed of - <AUTHOR> https://medium.freecodecamp.org/the-code-im-still-ashamed-of-e4c021dff55e <comment><USER2> This is from 2106. Previously discussed: [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12965589](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12965589)</comment>


Functional Pearl: I am not a Number – I am a Free Variable (2004) [pdf] - <AUTHOR> http://www.cs.ru.nl/~james/RESEARCH/haskell2004.pdf <comment><USER2> Conor McBride has some very memorable paper names. His generalization of Huet's zippers [1] gave rise to the "Clown" and "Joker" bifunctors in Haskell, and his paper [2] introducing quantitative type theory (on which Idris 2 is provisionally based) is called "I Got Plenty o' Nuttin'" after Gershwin.

[1] [http://strictlypositive.org/CJ.pdf](http://strictlypositive.org/CJ.pdf) [2] [https://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/conor.mcbride/pub/Rig.pdf](https://personal.cis.strath.ac.uk/conor.mcbride/pub/Rig.pdf)</comment>


StackMob, Heroku for mobile applications, raises $7.5 million - <AUTHOR> http://www.readwriteweb.com/mobile/2011/05/stackmob-funding-backend-services-for-mobile-invites.php

<comment><USER2> Can anyone explain the technical idea behind StackMob? Both the article and the marketing page are not exactly the informative type and the sentence "Heroku for mobile applications" doesn't make much sense.

<comment><USER3> StackMob provides a hosted platform for creating server-side data stores, logic, API's for mobile apps.

They were nice enough to send me a beta invite, but I've only had time to take a cursory glance. At present, the functionality looks equivalent to what you can do yourself using Ruby on Rails scaffolding to generate data models with a XML/JSON REST API--with the addition of an easy-to-use UI to manage that, rather than the raw command line interface of Rails.</comment></comment>


Your product is great, but I don't understand it - <AUTHOR> http://blog.sproutbox.com/2010/07/12/your-product-is-great-but-i-don%E2%80%99t-understand-it/

<comment><USER2> > Know your audience, Use jargon only where necessary, Use simple sentences, > Be consistent.

Forgive me for being cynical, but hasn't every copywriting/business writing book recommended the same thing?

</comment><comment><USER3> Great rant and 100% agree.

I started my company 5 years ago, helping Morten Lund (early Skype investor) redesigning and productifying many of the companies from his portfolio.

Many of them where tech heavy to say the least and needed to be made into understandable very easy to understand pitches.

The problem wasn't really the tech people but often the marketing people. For some reason they all thought that all these little details where important and absolutely needed to be in the copy. In some ways they always reminded me of lawyers trying to write every possible disclaimer into a piece of text.

The way I ended up solving it was to make sure to write copy into the design.

That way it became harder for them to add all sorts of additional content without breaking the pages.

</comment><comment><USER4> Basic points that have been rehashed a million times. Skip.

</comment><comment><USER5> Great rant on marketing copy.</comment>


We need to be wary of narratives of economic catastrophe - <AUTHOR> https://aeon.co/ideas/why-we-need-to-be-wary-of-narratives-of-economic-catastrophe <comment><USER2> I feel like in our attempt to predict the next recession we'll inadvertently end up causing one / cause it to occur earlier, but maybe that's just inevitable

<comment><USER3> I'd say the opposite. As long as everyone remains vigilant and looking for catastrophe in every shadow we should be less likely to have another 2008 sneak up on us.

<comment><USER4> What makes you think you or I have any say in this?

Recessions happen naturally as part of the business cycle, but are exacerbated by risky practices at major financial institutions that take on insanely leveraged bets in order to churn out a tiny profit that when summed up, becomes a huge profit.

The problem is that when average people go to political representatives to push for regulation of the markets, they are drowned out by corporate lobbyists who fill reps' pockets and fill the airwaves talking about and "class envy" and "socialist takeover".

<comment><USER5> Naturally? Is it a law of physics?

Where did this idea of recessions being required come from? Business cycle is a reflection of human psychology. It's possible for that to change.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> I have noticed the words recession and housing crash in the news a lot lately. It is almost as if some people are hoping for it.

<comment><USER7> That is because some people are hoping for it, in particular, home buyers.

If the price os something goes too high, it is a good thing that it goes down to levels in which they are affordable again for those that need it for living on them and not for speculating.

</comment></comment><comment><USER8> We need to be wary of _narratives_.

<comment><USER9> Well, narratives are enormously powerful. We need to be wary of false narratives; it might well be that we must employ narratives to communicate with everyone that doesn't have the time, patience, or otherwise capacity to dig through statistics and do a proper analysis.

<comment><USER10> All narratives are false sooner or later. I think that's the parents' point.

No narrative last forever. The globalist narrative for instance is now finding it's limited.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> It's a long but worthwhile reading; a TL;DR for those who don't have the time: excessive optimism and excessive pessimism are both bad for us; we need to go back to building narratives that include complex solutions for complex global(ised) problems, which is something that we were able to do in the past - after all, we went through much worse periods (eg the 1930s, WWII) and the World didn't end.

Personal comment: I can relate very much to this, but I also find that building those complex narratives - or even finding them - is incredibly difficult. I don't know how much this difficulty is related to the new media landscape (especially social media), but the net effect is that, apparently, only simple solutions (which will never work) seem to be gaining steam.

<comment><USER12> +1

It's hard to build up to complex solutions when we (society, broadly defined) seem unable to agree on the basic facts.

I don't know for sure if the past was better or worse when it came to reporting the truth. Given the limited number of news outlets, radio stations and tv stations historically, there were at least a limited set of reporting to agree on (independent of the accuracy of that reporting). This was probably very helpful in enabling more complex solutions.

<comment><USER13> The problem is that both sides of any big issue think they have the "facts" and refuse to compromise or engage with the facts from the other side.

The list of objective facts regarding any major issue is short. The list of subjective facts is infinite. When anyone can blast the world with their subjective facts, the objective facts are lost in the noise.

<comment><USER14> If economics were a hard science, then we could focus on the objective facts.

It's not one, though.

<comment><USER15> If the science was hard then then we'd just abuse statistics and anecdotes (like we do to promote gun control and deny climate change).

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> As a Brit, I find it weird to see an article about economic catastrophe that doesn't even mention Brexit: the world's first self-inflicted economic omnicatastroshambles.

<comment><USER10> Probably because it would fall in the too extreme negative narrative.

<comment><USER17> What brings you to this assessment? Your gut feeling? Just came across this: [https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1087425506931294209](https://twitter.com/faisalislam/status/1087425506931294209) today, that would be pretty serious indeed for a country that relies on so much imported food.

Edit: Ah, sneak edit. Carry on.

<comment><USER10> The fact that other countries manage to be outside the EU and do just fine.

This kind of catastrophist thinking is exactly the wrong way to think about things.

Yes it has conequences some negative and some positive. The world will go on.

<comment><USER17> I agree, the world will carry on. It's just a very heavy systemic shock switching your economic system from one set of conditions to a completely different set of conditions, from one day to another. So the question is: is the benefit greater than the cost? I'm pretty sure that the voters have not received the necessary information to really assess this question.

<comment><USER15> So? There's plenty of money to be lost for the people who depended too much on the specific conditions of the old system and plenty of money to be gained by people who are in a position to exploit the conditions of the new system. It might not be a net wash but the net effect will probably not be as extreme (positive or negative) as either side is saying.</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment>


Evidence for solar wind modulation of lightning  - <AUTHOR> http://iopscience.iop.org/1748-9326/9/5/055004/article What if solar wind does more than "modulate"? What if it powers lightning? <comment><USER2> " _Arrival of the high speed stream at Earth also coincides with a small (~1%) but rapid decrease in galactic cosmic ray flux...._ "

Wow, I guess that means a sufficiently increased density of protons from the sun such that 1% of the "cosmic rays" (very energetic protons and atomic nuclei) collide with them.

<comment><USER3> It's the magnetic field in the solar wind deflecting the charged cosmic rays. It is not a scattering effect from increased density.

What is talked about here is the arrival of the high speed stream, but it is not the high speed stream itself. What is important is the momentum transfer from the high speed stream to the slow stream out in front of it. This builds up to a genuine shockwave by Mar's orbit but at earth it is just a smooth increase in dynamic pressure. There's a pile up of the "frozen-in" magnetic field at this co-rotating interaction region and that field's intensity deflects the cosmic rays (and other charged particles) from certain directions at certain distances.

This is the pretty much the same mechanism as the Forbush decrease associated with coronal mass ejections.</comment></comment>


Ruby on App Engine Flexible Runtime Goes Beta - <AUTHOR> https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2016/05/Ruby-on-Google-App-Engine-goes-betaruntime.html <comment><USER2> One thing I don't understand from the documentation: with old fashioned AppEngine web apps, I can enable billing, set a maximum spend of $1 per day, and be good for low traffic sites, with a very low (or zero) monthly cost.

I think that for flexible platform apps, you are always paying for a continuously on micro or small instance so the cost per month of a low traffic Ruby app might be $5 to $10 per month. Is this correct?

<comment><USER2> To answer my own question: the deployment process is nice and easy, but this starts up small Compute Instance VPSs, which are billed. So, running Ruby rather than Python AppEngine apps seems to be much more expensive.</comment></comment>


Ask HN: have you chose HTML5 over native app? - <AUTHOR>

Dear fellow HNs -
I am looking for real world examples of developers choosing HTML5 over native app (or vice-verse).  I would appreciate you sharing with me some of your experience with this choice.
It would be helpful to know:
1. What kind of an app?  (Ie. game, service, standalone or extension to Web site, or existent product - anything about what is it and why do you built it.)
2. What did you choose and who have made that decision?  (Any insight into decision making process would be great to know.)
3. Are you happy that you have made this decision or not?
4. What you wish you would knew before you've started?
5. Do you do anything of the following: a) monetization b) analytics c) collect leads d) performance-sensitive ops e) rich and interactive interfaces
This also might be a good place to showoff your app, if you have it built already. :)
Thanks! <comment><USER3> We're a 2 man shop providing 2ndary education to a very targeted demographic. I'm the only programmer / sysadmin / anything technical.

I originally developed the website with a separate mobile version using some code to detect the type of device and decide to redirect and when. This, is a pain in the butt as i'd always forget to make changes to the mobile version when i changed the main site (A LOT on my plate)

I'm in the middle of developing version 2 of the site and developing the main site side by side with mobile devices so 1 site can do both desktop and mobile.

When this new version is done, I'll finish developing the iOS native app (i've started it, but put it on hold for the new ver 2 site)

1: I want both a mobile version and a native version - I feel a native iOS app will provide a better experience - BUT - i also think i'll run into the same problem as before; updating the main site and not updating the ios app - <USER2> by that time i can hire another programmer... As i'm a Apple user, I have multiple iPhones / iPads / iPods to test on. I don't even want to think of how many devices I'll need to build a proper native Android app.

2: I'm never happy; I'm constantly re-writing my code, persuing new / better ways to do stuff; i'm never done. Technology choices are always my choice but I make sure my partner knows why i'm doing something and hes open to question anything he wants, especially if it requires money / time / blood.

3: Version 1 was full steam a head, lets get it done and out there. It has a lot of short-comings - most of only i as a developer know of but some visible. Version 2 is much more planned; I took the time to build prototypes, play with different ideas, think about why i was doing something and not just programming away. I'm happy i'm moving to a scalable main website and i'm pretty happy we'll have our first of 3 planned iOS apps (native app, game and magazine). I try not to do things I'll regret, but making a mistake in the process of learning is ok.

4: How long building such a site would take as the only developer with a day job. I'm committed and hopefully the payout comes someday, but being the only programmer on a fairly large project kinda sucks.

5: I collect as much analytic information as I can. My data to date shows me the vast majority of my users are iOS users (reason for native iOS app), are between 20-30 years old, etc.. Someday it'll be monetized and version 2 will have interactive interfaces.

I'm not done yet so you can't see it!

<comment><AUTHOR> \- So do I understand you correctly, you have both the mobile friendly Web site and native app?

\- Are you monetizing your native app or is it "buy 1, get 2nd free" type of a thing?

\- Why do you need mobile app at all?

\- Is your native app only to gain more market traction, or it actually can do something Web-version cannot?

<comment><USER3> Yes, both mobile friendly and native

Our monetization will come from sponsors - we currently do not intend to charge our students.

Knowing our target demographic, we know their in school the majority of the day. We know their busy and may or may not be in front of a computer. We feel having a strong mobile presence will allow them to interact with the website more consistantly and more frequently. I want both mobile and native because I want our students to have the best possible experience. As I'm the sole programmer, I can handle the mobile and iOS native apps myself. I can't handle an (multiple) Android version or even Windows mobile and gasp... Blackberry. As I know the majority of my users are iOS users, they'll get the best experience in a native app. Everyone else - I hope the mobile version is just as good...

The native app is to improve reach and connection. A feature of the native app will be a push notification to notify students when other students need help. Think of it like your question here. You needed help / had a question to ask of your peers; but the only people that saw it are the people that clicked on the link to view your question. If other people got a notification that a question was raised on a topic they care about, your question would have a better chance of getting answered and you'd have a better chance of getting the help you needed.</comment></comment></comment>


Why is Firefox still not supporting .webp? - <AUTHOR> https://www.reddit.com/r/firefox/comments/46wxye/why_is_firefox_still_not_supporting_webp/ <comment><USER2> My take: WebP is not a good format. It was a clever quick hack betting on the older generation of WebM taking over the world, and that hasn't happened.

\- It doesn't compress well. It's _twice the size_ of HEVC. We have similarly- performing VP10 now, but WebP is based on VP8, which is a 2006 codec that has lost to a 2003 codec in the market.

\- It's actually 2 formats under one name. WebP has VP8 and its own lossless thing separately. JPEG-XR, JPEG 2000 and FLIF can use the same algorithm for both lossy and lossless.

\- The lossy variant (which is the only interesting one) does not support full-resolution color. You have to live with chroma subsampling which messes up anything with sharp saturated colors.

\- It's 8 bit only. This is too little for wide gamut displays which are becoming more common.

\- It doesn't support progressive decoding at all (misses out on awesome HTTP/2 optimization that gives illusion of all images loading instantly).

\- The alpha channel can only use lossless encoding. It's a big problem for non-binary transparency (complex shadows, smoke). That's _the_ major usecase for it on the web, and that's the least efficient variant of WebP.

\- It suffers from generation loss _waaay_ more than any format.

[http://flif.info/lossy.html](http://flif.info/lossy.html)

<comment><USER3> > The lossy variant (which is the only interesting one) does not support full- > resolution color. You have to live with chroma subsampling which messes up > anything with sharp saturated colors.

I always wondered if 4:4:4 but with more aggressive compression of chroma could beat the good old 4:2:0.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> My two cents: Which version of webp should Firefox support? There are 3 major versions, and the subtleties in the 'extended' webp is only traceable through the releases of Chrome.

further, how can I tell which client supports which version of webp? `Accept: image/webp` is insufficient because it doesn't tell me which version or subset of features this client uses. Take for example, ios9b1 where webp was thought to have accidentally been available through CoreImage. It only supported WebP basic. But how would a server know this?

Lastly, webp is not setup to be successful for the next set of requirements: it is 8bit per channel color only (can't do 10bit needed for P3 or rec2020). It can't do full chroma subsampling (4:4:4). And the list goes on. It was a good first start, but it needs much more work before it can break out of the Google grip and get wide support.

<comment><USER5> "Which version of webp should Firefox support?": libwebp

Track the implementation here:

[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1294490](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1294490)

Build with '\--with-system-webp':

[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=8808680&actio...](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=8808680&action=edit)

<comment><USER3> Still, it's not clear what subset of libwebp features will become popular. For example, I don't see much enthusiasm for animated webp. Even their own blog is full of GIFs: [https://blog.google/products/allo/buzzfeed-stickers- google-a...](https://blog.google/products/allo/buzzfeed-stickers-google-allo- give-you-one-more-reason-be-thankful/)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> That's an old, closed reddit post.

They have been actually actively implementing .webp support since August:

[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1294490](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1294490)

<comment><USER6> Great to see they're finally getting this in, since it results in real-world download reduction and quality improvement for users. Depends on content of course, but it's especially great for certain game content, icons, etc. I was never convinced their arguments against it outweighed the benefit of adding it, and was greatly disappointed when they opposed it. Hopefully Safari are still adding it. (Edit, seems Safari may not add it due to lack of 10-bit color support)

<comment><USER7> _since it results in real-world download reduction and quality improvement for users_

This is AFAIK really only true for images that can be lossy but which have an alpha channel, so a very specific use case.

The whole point of mozjpeg was to show that an improved JPEG encoder could achieve parity with WebP for all other use cases.

<comment><USER6> webp can do lossless with alpha channel, and the results (quality, size) are great. It also improves on jpeg, so it's actually a very general use case.

<comment><USER7> _webp can do lossless with alpha channel_

So can PNG. WebP doesn't add anything new here.

 _It also improves on jpeg_

Debunked in the post you're replying to. The difference disappears when the JPEG encoder is updated (in a backwards compatible manner!) with modern encoding techniques the WebP encoder also uses, instead of ones dating back to 1998...

<comment><USER6> _So can PNG. WebP doesn 't add anything new here._

Webp compresses to much smaller file sizes than PNG in lossless mode.

 _Debunked in the post you 're replying to_

Sorry, which post?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> AFAIK, Mozilla is very conservative in implementing non-standardized technologies. CSS styled scroll-bars anyone?

<comment><USER9> Please Mozilla never implement that!

<comment><USER8> Why? Every other browser supports it and hacking style with js is imho wrong

<comment><USER10> Scroll bar styling is a wrong feature and shouldn't be done by any method. The scroll bar is a part of the browser's UI and should look the same as the rest of the browser all the time, on every web page.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER7> The top comment does a good job of explaining the reasoning. That said, since then more browsers (IIRC Safari) have announced that they are adding support, and the use case of lossy images with an alpha channel is important for games.

This has caused Mozilla to revisit the issue:[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1294490](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1294490)

<comment><USER11> WebP support was added briefly in the macOS Sierra (10.12) public betas, but was removed. It doesn't seem to work in Safari right now (macOS Sierra 10.12.2 beta), according to this test page:

[https://developers.google.com/speed/webp/gallery](https://developers.google.com/speed/webp/gallery)

<comment><USER4> And it likely won't come back because of the lack of support for 10bit channels needed for P3 displays. Jpeg2000 (Apple's alternative to webp) does.

<comment><USER12> Jpeg2000 has nothing to do with Apple per say. It's an open standard managed by the Joint Photographic Experts Group (part of ISO). Not even sure if Apple even participates in the group.

WebP on the other hand is a proprietary format developed by a single company, an implementation of which is made available under an Open Source License.

<comment><USER13> Jpeg2000 is sort of an open standard, but OSS doesn't and can't use it because it's patent-encumbered.

<comment><USER12> "It has always been a strong goal of the JPEG committee that its standards should be implementable in their baseline form without payment of royalty and license fees... The up and coming JPEG 2000 standard has been prepared along these lines, and agreement reached with over 20 large organizations holding many patents in this area to allow use of their intellectual property in connection with the standard without payment of license fees or royalties." (Wikipedia)

So yes it's patent-encumbered but no more patent-encumbered than WebP.

[https://chromium.googlesource.com/webm/libwebp/+/master/PATE...](https://chromium.googlesource.com/webm/libwebp/+/master/PATENTS)

<comment><USER7> That statement is AFAIK now absent from the JPEG site.

On the positive side, it's now old enough that some key patents (e.g. arithmetic coding) have actually expired.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER14> If you're willing to deal with the development overhead of creating/storing multiple formats, which if you super care about optimized content serving you're doing anyway for sizes, then just use a picture element with fallback sources.

Progressive enhancement applies to more than just JS, and we've already been provided with a standard way to not have to care about browser support.

</comment><comment><USER15> This is what the accept header is for. Browsers should implement whatever they feel is best for performance, security, maintainability, etc. Then the server should look at the accept header for a resource and serve a format the client can understand.

Imgix offers this as "Automatic Content Negotiation": [https://docs.imgix.com/tutorials/improved-compression- auto-c...](https://docs.imgix.com/tutorials/improved-compression-auto-content- negotiation)

</comment><comment><USER16> Politics. There is a compile-time flag in firefox that allows it to use system codecs (for images as well as video). I ran a self-built Firefox for some time that had this enabled. Mainly to view media files on the local network, and because there was a time where people were putting up some files that chrome could open, but not firefox (I forgot what that format was - maybe it was even webp).

If you enable the flag (or, disable the built-in whitelist), then Firefox uses GStreamer (and I believe DirectShow on Windows or Quartz on macOS, but I'm not sure) to display the videos.

There also used to be the option of using MPlayer as a plugin, but NPAPI support was unfortunately removed.

</comment><comment><USER17> Does Chrome support apng yet? Firefox does.

</comment><comment><USER18> Is there a reason why a web browser could not integrate imagemagick (or equivalent) in order to support a "kitchen sink" set of formats?

Why not have Amiga IFF images on the web? ;)

<comment><USER19> Have you seen the horrendous security issues with ImageMagick lately (last one to get a nice branding and logo was ImageTragick ([https://imagetragick.com](https://imagetragick.com)) )? Browsers have a hard enough time already dealing with the few formats they currently support.

Now either they manually add trusted support for all the additional formats (which would mean basically rewriting ImageMagick, but without the security issues, which is really hard considering the huge amount of file formats out there) or they rely on an external library and risk something like ImageTragick to cause global machine ownage of never before seen scale.

No. I like my browsers to be conservative there, though JPEG2000 would be cool to have :p

</comment></comment><comment><USER20> Same reason it still hogs memory and crashes when I leave it open with no more than a dozen tabs for a while (Chrome never does this).</comment>


Dell Latitude Z: Macbook for Windows - <AUTHOR> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upS4EnUhFjI&feature=related

<comment><USER2> Actually, I don't think it's fair to include the word "Macbook" in the title. It wasn't in the original title.

This just looks like a nice new notebook computer.

Dell sells them already: [http://www.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/lap...](http://www.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/laptop- latitude-z?c=us&cs=04&l=en&s=bsd&~ck=mn) (specs also here)

From my point of view, interesting points in the specs include:

      - SU9400 or SU9600 processors, 10W TDP - not bad
      - GS45 Express Chipset
      - WLED Display
      - SSD drive in default configuration

the above points show good potential for this laptop not sucking battery perfomance-wise

The chart of Intel's Core 2 CPU's, with TDP: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Core_2_microproce...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Core_2_microprocessors)

Also an interesting point in the spec is "Integrated Memory" - as I understand, it means that the memory is not upgradeable, soldered to the motherboard to achieve minimum weight and volume.

</comment><comment><USER3> Dell definitely looks to be trying to get away from their original image as the cheap computer maker. Additionally, they're definitely targeting business with this system, which has always been their strong market.

I'm not sure how good the edge-touch bar on the right would be. I'm a big fan of not having to extend my arm.

The best feature of this laptop is definitely the wireless docking station and charger. Apparently you just have to put the laptop down on a desk and the wireless docking station will automatically detect the laptop and start external display and USB devices. Pretty slick.

<comment><USER4> And now they've got an image as the "overpriced shite" computer maker.

As for MacBook-like conventional PCs, MSI is making a MacBook Air clone that's stylish and light, but otherwise a relatively conventional x86 computer, for around $800 or so. It's awesome. <Phantom-Phreak>I want it to have my children.</Phantom-Phreak>

<comment><USER5> I haven't heard the overpriced thing before, on the contrary most 'common (you know computers? Fix mine!)' people I know buy dells due to the great deals they get.

Also the XPS line is pretty solid for a reasonable amount of money, with windows 7 I'd say you're getting less aesthetical appeal, but more total bang per dollar than you would with a mac. I own both a MacBook and Dell XPS, which is what I base my opinion on.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER6> In the past 2 to 3 months I've heard from 4 different people who have had terrible experiences with ordering Dell hardware. Servers misconfigured, laptops taking almost 4 months to be delivered, etc.

Who is the new PC company to go to if you want a decent product?

</comment><comment><AUTHOR> And also:

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=id4WTJkg_Ag&feature=relat...](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=id4WTJkg_Ag&feature=related)</comment>


Ask HN: How do I get awareness into the Seattle startup scene? - <AUTHOR> I work in one of the big companies in Seattle, and while I am doing cool shit, I feel I am isolated from cool shit outside the big company. I just want to learn more, network, and potentially see if I find something interesting to join.. what would you recommend I do? <comment><USER2> A web search on "startup meetups seattle" turned up a bunch of groups and events:

[https://duckduckgo.com/?q=startup+meetups+seattle](https://duckduckgo.com/?q=startup+meetups+seattle)

</comment><comment><USER3> Start meeting random people at NewTech. [https://www.newtechnorthwest.com/events/](https://www.newtechnorthwest.com/events/)</comment>


Ask HN: How can I use memcached as in-memory index - <AUTHOR>

I have 5TB of data and 20 machines with 16GB ram each. I want to create an in-memory index of this data (a financial time series which looks like <timestamp: tick values>) so that I could query the data by time range very quickly (in hundreds of msec).<p>I thought of using some distributed key-value store for the in-memory index, and I'm guessing it is impossible to construct something like the traditional B-tree index using hash table, so the indexing must be done differently from typical databases. What are some simple ways you can think of using memcached or other distributed in-memory key-value store for in-memory indexing of sequentially ordered data of this size. <comment><USER2> Different approaches take different levels of time investment on your part; here are some options

your focus is on the data-structure for the index, whereas I'm thinking that unless the data itself that the index points to is also in RAM, its going to be hard to get msecs results anyway.

1) if you are repeatedly accessing the same subset of your data, rather than making continuous random reads across the whole data set, then caching that set can help:

1a) if you have some file or DB on each of your machines, then the kernel will automatically cache regularly read bits and it'll all end up quite fast. You could use any database of your choice for this, with 'sharding'.

1b) you could run memcached and the DBs on each of your machines; to be honest, letting the OS do the caching is likely a better idea.

2) if you want to continuously go all over the data set, then you are going to be IO bound.

2a) therefore, if you can _compress_ your data set - find a space-efficient storage for it so it fits into 250GB of RAM instead of 5TB of disk, then you can avoid the disk and it'll fly. You could consider storing deltas and then arithmetic or huffman coding behind some low order predictor; ask on this compression forum <http://encode.ru/> and you'll have to tell them much more about your data and perhaps describe a few lines of it. Compression can be on small blocks of data, so you only have to decompress a small amount to get the random value you want

2b) or you might find that you only need to generate some statistics from the data once, and then work with the derived data - presumably small enough to fit in your RAM - from then on

3) you could buy bigger machines, or bigger amounts of RAM

</comment><comment><USER3> I would use redis ordered sets and shard between servers in your application.

1\. Get the server ID based on what the timestamp is. You would store a starting time and a server ID. You then lookup what server your data is on based on the start of your range.

2\. Use sorted sets to store your data, using the timestamp as the score. These are really fast in redis: <http://code.google.com/p/redis/wiki/ZaddCommand>

Other option is to checkout Raik, which will do the distributed part for you (a distributed hash-table with no master eg.) but it doesn't have the data structures that redis has (it is just key=>valu)

<comment><USER2> does redis support more data than it has RAM?

<comment><USER3> Yes - disk swapping was added in a recent release, see:

<http://antirez.com/post/redis-virtual-memory-story.html></comment></comment></comment>


WebAssembly support lands in Go language: golang wasm/js - <AUTHOR> https://react-etc.net/entry/webassembly-support-lands-in-go-language-golang-wasm-js <comment><USER2> We just had this discussion.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16834181](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16834181)

<comment><AUTHOR> Sorry, I missed it. Deleting.

Edit: missed the window. Sorry about that.</comment></comment>