Mercedes kills their only electric car - <AUTHOR> https://electrek.co/2017/07/31/mercedes-kills-electric-b-class/ <comment><USER2> Here in Norway, where electric cars abound, I've only seen a few electric B's.. Considering the incentives, it's not the price putting people off, it's a combination of the overall value proposition compared to the alternatives and the dedication and support from the manufacturer. This news makes sense in light of that.

I've always seen the B as and attractive alternative to the Leaf, e-golf, Renault Zoë and Hyundai ionic, but it's never received the attention in the form of battery updates, range improvement and general buzz that the aforementioned have. It's basically a large city car (as in size of the car, not the city), and while that makes sense, without the secondary capability of making it to the cabin (norwegians are quite fond of their cabins), it's become a bit of a non-starter. People are then more likely to go for a Tesla (which is an insane value proposition here) or an i3.

<comment><USER3> A while ago, I tried to configure an electric B, just for fun. Not that I was trying to buy one, because I don't have a permanent parking lot where I would mount the charger right now...

There were only two things that would really put me off:

* The car was super-expensive. With a few extras, it was ~45000 Euros, IIRC * Range was too limited (160km IIRC).

Now, if I could mount a charger, I would probably consider a <35000€, >300km A-Class, if such a thing existed.

</comment></comment><comment><USER4> "The B-class EV was originally a collaboration between Mercedes and Tesla. Mercedes, who used to be a big investor in Tesla but has since sold their stake, used a Tesla drive system to power the car."

I would imagine they are going in a new direction and want to clear away the old.

<comment><USER5> Yes, they clean the house before the Bs damage their electric car reputation.

</comment></comment><comment><USER6> In Germany there are discussions about banning diesels from cities because of the emission scandal. All car manufacturers have their PR machine in overdrive to try and prevent any such bans. One of the central arguments is that they are pushing for electric vehicles and the market will self-regulate...

<comment><USER7> The argument fails to a certain degree. I own a 10 year old 3L Diesel Jeep (tow horses at the weekends). Given the lifecycle of the average car, we're not talking about eradicating diesels the moment the EVs go on sale, but 15+ years before most vanish from the streets of our cities.

Diesels are going to be a problem for decades even if we stopped all sales right now.

I still have not seen a capable towing e SUV on the market yet .

<comment><USER8> I've seen the Tesla Model X can tow horses, camping trailers, cars and boats without breaking a sweat. The power consumption naturally goes up and towing something heavy for hundreds of kilometers is problematic if you're going outside the Tesla supercharger network.

The X is quite expensive, though. Hopefully there will be more affordable models coming to market over the next few years. But the technology to build a SUV capable of towing several tons is already here.

Quite a few cities will likely ban diesel driven cars from entering the city core at some point in the near future and this will to a certain extent obviate diesel powered cars.

<comment><USER9> The problem with electric SUVs is that if you're in the back country for days or weeks at a time, the ability to carry extra fuel or have the reliability required is a major selling point. When you're up in the mountains or in very rural areas, the last thing you need is to wonder where a charging station might be. Additionally, in emergency situations when power might be down, you can't easily charge a vehicle from a generator, but you can easily (and quickly) fill up from storage tanks. I also wonder about a model X's ability to cross high water or remain capable in harsh conditions. For example, what's the Model X performance in Alaska or Yukon style subarctic conditions? I would be not particularly good.

However, the vast majority of SUV users are essentially commuter vehicles so electric might be a suitable replacement. Most people don't use SUVs for their intended purpose, but more as a stylish minivan – an area an X would seem to excel. It's essentially a rich soccer mom car.

$100k for a Tesla X is a bit ridiculous. I could buy a nicely equipped Land Rover for that and not have to worry where the closest supercharger might be. I also can be confident of cold and harsh condition performance.

Obviously this will change as tech improves, but for the near term, an electric SUV isn't a serious car, but a show-off toy, albeit a very expensive and nice one.

<comment><USER10> _" what's the Model X performance in Alaska or Yukon style subarctic conditions? I would be not particularly good."_

There are many Teslas in Norway, which is also known for its harsh conditions, so I'd guess it's not that bad at least.

<comment><USER11> For whatever reason, when I think of Norway, I don't imagine hard-working blue collar type people who work out in the cold or need to get to work in sub-zero temps the way we do here in the northern US states and Alaska. I'm sure some people in Norway can't screw around with unreliable crap, though, right?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER12> I can really only hope that this is done in preparation of a truly well designed Mercedes electric car. The cancelled car was a car usually sold with combustion engines, equipped with a Tesla supplied electrical drivetrain. So it was a pretty crummy electrical car.

<comment><USER13> > _I can really only hope that this is done in preparation of a truly well > designed Mercedes electric car._

I was thinking the same thing.

Surely being so soon after the Model 3 launch can't be pure coincidence.

</comment></comment><comment><USER14> Yes, they are now trying to lobby against electric. Here, in India the Merc India CEO says that full electric would be as harmful to the environment as BS4 standards etc

<comment><USER15> India is fast adapting solar and it is expected to wean off coal in the next few decades. Solar, not coal, is India's future by 2030: Report - [http://www.business-standard.com/article/economy- policy/sola...](http://www.business-standard.com/article/economy-policy/solar- not-coal-is-india-s-future-by-2030-report-117061500891_1.html) There is a bigger and more pressing problem with internal combustion engines. Due to the population and vehicle density, smog is a real issue in cities and the air is becoming toxic. Electric vehicles help address that issue.

<comment><USER14> I am waiting for the day I can buy reliable solar lanterns which work :-)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER16> Scared by Tesla? I believe that Tesla is far ahead of any electric car maker in the world right now. The three stage vision of making an affordable car by Elon Musk is now a reality.

Most of the elite car makers like Mercedes and BMW cannot price their units down to $35000.

Tesla didn't only think of making a car but also they have created a web of charging stations in US.

Tesla Model 3 will be everywhere by 2020.

<comment><USER17> Well, I only saw a model X on Cebit, although the materials are good quality, the build quality is poor for the price. Then I saw a hybrid Porsche, and the X felt like a higher mid class suv in comparison. Worry not about German carmakers, they have infinite money to throw at any project. Once they decide to go serious about electric, Tesla won't be able to keep up with the competition. Don't get me wrong, I root for everyone, mainly for our future, but stop daydreaming.

<comment><USER18> German car makers don't have infinite money. They run huge operations on tiny margins and cannot afford to cannibalize the sale of their upper-end cars with cheaper electric cars.

The Model 3 is comparable to the C-Class in both price and size but vastly outperforms the C-Class on driving performance if the reviews are to be believed. The bling-bling leather, chrome and wood of the German high-end cars is more luxurious, but is not for everyone.

Let's see. My guess is as good as yours but I think the Germans will bleed if they don't transition to EVs very fast. If Tesla has the market for itself in all of 2018-2020, it might be too late for VW, BMW and Mercedes-Benz.

Right now, they have plans and talk, but not a single competitive EV on the market, no fleet of hundreds of thousands of self driving cars recording and learning, no network of superchargers, no thousands of talented EV and AI engineers, no remote update, no battery factories.

I sure hope they wake up. Competition will only be good for us consumers.

<comment><USER19> There are many other cars that could be compared to Model 3. Mazdas, VWs, Hyundais, Hondas. If we take only size, price, performance and interior quality into consideration then Model 3 is certainly not the best choice. But it's an EV. And others are not.

<comment><USER20> There's a lot of EV's comparable to the Model 3 in both price and range. There's a lot of EV's comparable to the Model 3 in range and price. VW e-golf costs about the same (or less) with comparable range and size. Hyundai IONIQ is cheaper with about the same range and size. Then you have the ugly EV's like Nissan Leaf and Kia Soul. Cheaper and with comparable range and size (perhaps a bit smaller trunk).

<comment><USER13> > _There 's a lot of EV's comparable to the Model 3 in both price and range_

No, there isn't.

Here's a chart made by a Redditor comparing price with range of all the Evs on the market. Checkout how much of an outlier the Model 3 Long Range is.

Even the Standard Model 3 has much more range than all the other EVs except the Bolt, and other Teslas.

[http://i.imgur.com/M4o8czW.png](http://i.imgur.com/M4o8czW.png)

<comment><USER21> Why are people not hyped about the bolt as much as they are about 3? It looks like a comparable car which is available now, instead of in 2019.

<comment><USER22> It's a GM, so it looks like it was made to appear in a Transformers movie and people trust a largely unproven manufacturer like Tesla to make something more reliable.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER21> Mercedes and BMW and Volkswagen are going to be dead (or faint shadows of their current state) within this decade (2027). Exactly what has happened to Nokia, Siemens and Ericsson is going to repeat itself. I would wager smaller players like Hyundai will adapt and hang on, maybe even innovate at a later date. Tough to predict Toyota and Honda though. The Japanese are clever in their ways.

Say what you want but American entrepreneurs do have an unbelievable appetite for disruption.

<comment><USER23> BMW has i3 (pure electric) and i8 (plug in hybrid). I drive a i3 daily and I'd say they have done a good job. It looks ugly but range is acceptable, performance is better than other options (Tesla is not here in my country) and the quality seems to be good overall.

I believe they'll adapt just fine.

<comment><USER21> The difference is Tesla has a plan to scale up. How is BMW going to acquire all the batteries needed if they want to start selling 10x the number of i3s? They may adapt, but will surely lose their comfortable position in the market.

<comment><USER24> I very much doubt that Tesla is in any special position right now. Tesla just has better marketing. First, Tesla needs to scale up because it currently produces tiny numbers of cars (70k) compared to Toyota (10 million), VW (10 million) and the other existing car companies.

And Teslas Giga Factory is nothing special. Much of the know how is bought in from Panasonic. Gigafacory is behind the planned production time. And China alone is expected to produce more than 3 times the output of Gigafactory in 2021 ([https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-28/china- is-...](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-28/china-is-about-to- bury-elon-musk-in-batteries)).

<comment><USER21> > Tesla just has better marketing.

Agreed. But that doesn't mean they aren't better technically, too. Case in point: Apple

> First, Tesla needs to scale up because it currently produces tiny numbers of > cars (70k) compared to Toyota (10 million), VW (10 million) and the other > existing car companies.

Except that the 10 million number does not matter if their entire system is set up to make exploding-fuel cars. The only thing common is the external shell and the dash electronics. The real expertise and resource is needed to make the rest of the stuff. And Tesla is ahead in that.

> And Teslas Giga Factory is nothing special.

Please point me to a battery factory this big, set up exclusively to supply batteries for one EV model.

> And China alone is expected to produce more than 3 times the output of > Gigafactory in 2021

Oh you mean an entire country (also one of the biggest producers of manufactured goods) is going to produce only 3x the amount of batteries made by _one_ factory, about 3 years later? Man that makes me more hyped for Tesla!

<comment><USER24> _> Except that the 10 million number does not matter if their entire system is set up to make exploding-fuel cars. The only thing common is the external shell and the dash electronics. The real expertise and resource is needed to make the rest of the stuff. And Tesla is ahead in that._

It's all about logistics, infrastructure and capital. Have a look at this video: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VreG1iC65Lc&feature=youtu.be...](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VreG1iC65Lc&feature=youtu.be&t=23)

Switching to batteries essentially just means reprogramming those robots.

 _> Please point me to a battery factory this big, set up exclusively to supply batteries for one EV model._

Please point me to a factory that actually produces 35GWh/a ;)

<comment><USER21> That video is awesome, it almost looks like the car factory in minority report!

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER25> I would have thought the car would have been a valuable platform for them gain knowledge and insight into the electric side of the industry.

If some years later they decide to start again, they'll have lost significant advantage, and I'm not talking about the technology side of things but the rest of the business mix that's involved.

<comment><USER26> The electric B-class used Tesla drivetrains. Mercedes are switching to their own electric drivetrains.

</comment></comment><comment><USER27> > So there's a tip for everyone – if you don't want a dealership to call you > back, just tell them you're looking to buy an EV.

lol.

</comment><comment><USER28> Good. Now start working on hydrogen-cell, like the Japanese.

<comment><USER29> They've been working for it for 25 years and have been the first-mover in the area: [https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes- Benz_NECAR](https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_NECAR)

Current iteration of their fuel cell efforts: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_F- Cell](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_F-Cell)

However they don't believe in it any more and will likely stop development/research: [http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1109713_did- mercedes-tur...](http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1109713_did-mercedes- turn-its-back-on-hydrogen-fuel-cell-vehicles)

<comment><USER26> That last article is not true. They are actively working on it right now. In fact they are incredibly proud of a recent breakthrough: having reduced the required rare earths to 90% of what is currently available on the market. Source: the head of that R&D program said it.</comment></comment></comment>


MIT Invents Alterable Pin Surface That Lets Objects Assemble Themselves - <AUTHOR> http://www.fastcodesign.com/3052266/mit-invents-a-flowing-river-of-3-d-pixels-that-lets-objects-assemble-themselves?partner=rss <comment><USER2> It's a bit obvious, right? Or maybe I'm the only person that had a pin box toy as a kid ([https://www.fatbraintoys.com/toy_companies/toysmith/classic_...](https://www.fatbraintoys.com/toy_companies/toysmith/classic_pin_art.cfm)).

Nine Inch Nails also did this: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDsqpeiTqg8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDsqpeiTqg8). Which, to me, is a bit more impressive even if it is CGI. A 3d pin video screen would be massively cool. I want to say someone else did a similar music video in the '80s, but can't remember.

</comment><comment><USER3> Even academic videos aren't safe from folksy startup music.

<comment><USER4> Has there been a Kickstarter campaign to fund an album of folksy music for use in Kickstarter videos?

</comment></comment><comment><USER5> This is neat research. Probably not very practical or useful in it's current form, yet, you have to engage in highly speculative research and even consider the ridiculous to discover new ideas.

This version is unlikely to be able to compete in almost any metric with robot arms or even far simpler purpose-built machines (think simple 1 DOF automation used in manufacturing assembly lines, like bottling plants). With time interesting and unique applications of some future version of this might find a problem it can solve elegantly.

<comment><USER6> Yep, you never know, something like this could pay off for nano machinery, etc. You can't just benchmark against current top of the line robot arms. It is about exploring approaches, not selling to auto manufacturers within a year to replace what they are currently using.

</comment></comment><comment><USER7> The video has me thinking this is foreshadowing some new type of warehouse. Maybe Amazon is going to make a "life size" version of this.

Now if this is efficient in any way - no idea.

<comment><USER8> Here is a company that provides conveyor belt that is in the same vein as this MIT project [https://www.festo.com/group/en/cms/10225.htm](https://www.festo.com/group/en/cms/10225.htm)

</comment></comment><comment><USER9> Very impressive!

Not a word about of each "3d pixel" is implemented, which is a shame. I guess it doesn't have to be too complicated, but there sure are a lot of them even in this early prototype/lab version. They're also bi-directional, with each pixel having position-sensing.

<comment><USER10> I've been working on something similar for several years. (Alas, I don't have MIT's PR budget.) I call it "PinThing" and implement the pins as DC motor powered, 3D printable linear actuators. I use limit switches to detect end-of- travel, and a shaft encoder to measure distance traveled. Current goal is to make an array of four 3x5 pin blocks to make a digital clock display. One of these days I really need to finish and formally publish this project! One big challenge in the project is driving down the cost per pin to make a large array affordable -- that's why I focus on using 3D printable parts and cheap motors.

Here's a demo of one pin powered by Arduino and an H-bridge motor driver circuit: [https://youtu.be/pLzDHLm01wM](https://youtu.be/pLzDHLm01wM)

Three.js software demo: [http://pinthing.com](http://pinthing.com)

<comment> gene-h well you can buy a chinese knock-off of the actuators the MIT people used from spark fun: [https://www.sparkfun.com/products/10976](https://www.sparkfun.com/products/10976)

<comment><USER10> I'm trying to drive the cost down to $1-2 per pin. It's obvious the MIT team did not optimize for cost. At $20/pin (from the SparkFun link), a 28-pin display (the minimum you'd need for a 4 digit, 7-segment display clock would cost $560. To so anything interesting, you'd want dozens or hundreds of pins. Cost is a _huge_ reason keeping this idea from being more wide-spread.

<comment> gene-h Well if you really want to drive down the cost, the best thing to do would be to mass produce the actuators for the purpose. The actuators MIT used aren't really intended as actuators, they're some weird part for moving knobs around on high end audio equipment.

Now as it turns out, there really are linear actuators that cost about $1 per actuator, they're just tiny: [http://www.alibaba.com/product- detail/Goteck-1-5g-Super-Micr...](http://www.alibaba.com/product- detail/Goteck-1-5g-Super-Micro-Analog_60006747818.html)

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> An early clunky version of programmable matter.

</comment><comment><USER12> Could something like this be contained in a box, so that each of the sides has these on it?

That way instead of just working laterally, and from the bottom, things could be done from multiple angles. For example, solving a rubiks cube via machine typically involves at least three axes and servos, but with a machine like this that operated on three axes, I imagine a more power efficient method could be developed.

This is really cool technology, I love how simple it is in design, yet it evokes all kinds of ideas in the mind.

</comment><comment><USER13> That is one perverse set of constraints.

Give me a few 1980s-vintage robot arms and I will outperform this system in any category except entertainment value. Robot arms once held great entertainment value and this system will become old media some day, too. Semiologically speaking, this system represents a silo of sublime resources from dopaminergics to labor and cash, but when the zombies come, I'll bet people will still run to the shed full of AK-47s.</comment>


Google owns duck.com. Shouldn't it belong to DuckDuckGo? - <AUTHOR>

They got it in the On2 acquisition and haven't used it since, except to make it redirect to google.com.
I mean, sure, they can do with it whatever they want. It just strikes me as being a bit anti-"Don't be evil" and it'd be good policy if they at least made a secret deal to transfer it or whatnot or transfer it covertly and quietly through a third party.
And surely it's better than avoiding bad press if DuckDuckGo ever becomes mainstream-popular. <comment><USER2> Do we really need yet another discussion of this? [http://www.hnsearch.com/search#request/all&q=duck.com](http://www.hnsearch.com/search#request/all&q=duck.com)</comment>


Robert W. Galvin, Who Led Motorola Into the Modern Age, Dies at 89 - <AUTHOR> http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/13/technology/robert-w-galvin-who-led-motorola-dies-at-89.html?src=twr <comment><USER2> When I was in high school, I took a summer job setting up large canopy tents. One of our regular customers was Galvin (or his various philanthropic organizations, etc). I only met him once, but I was a young nerd, a bit starstruck, but he had some words of encouragement when he found out I was saving up for an engineering degree. He was pretty respectful of our set-up crew, asking our opinions about how to place stuff rather than just ordering us around, and offered us sodas and sandwiches. In contrast, most customers just ordered us around and were sort of rude to us. Maybe I was just at a particularly impressionable point in life, but I took a lesson from that -- I mean a guy like that probably had better things to be doing than chatting up some guys hammering stakes into the ground -- I decided that no matter how successful, I should probably be having real interaction with people doing the actual work, even if it doesn't have an impact on the end result. Applying this to my life I certainly have gotten unexpected and pleasant results in a variety of situations.

RIP Mr. Galvin - thanks.

</comment><comment><USER3> Bob Galvin deserves a lot of credit for pioneering the mobile phone industry, and for propelling Motorola to be one of the most successful tech companies of its day. He was also a major philanthropist, and along with Bob Pritzker was a major contributor to the scholarship fund that paid for my college education. Thank you sir, rest in peace.

</comment><comment><USER4> I can't say Galvin's name was a familiar one to me, but I'm surprised I didn't know it given his role in the history of the mobile phone. Perhaps it's that personal mobile phones were such a slower revolution to start than personal computers, that his name isn't as well-known as some of the big names in personal computing's formative years.

</comment><comment><USER5> Galvin is/was a household name in Chicagoland. RIP.

</comment><comment><USER6> Hopefully the sale of his baby to Google isn't what killed him. My 1st gen Motorola flip phone was oh-so-cool! RIP</comment>


Facebook, This Is Not What "Complete User Control" Looks Like - <AUTHOR> https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/04/facebook-not-what-complete-user-control-looks <comment><USER2> To add more to that, 89% of Android users don't actually believe they gave consent to Facebook to collect their call and text history:

[http://blog.teamblind.com/index.php/2018/04/09/did-you- give-...](http://blog.teamblind.com/index.php/2018/04/09/did-you-give- facebook-consent-to-collect-your-call-and-text-history-89-of-android-users- say-no/)

You can talk about how users "don't pay attention" all you want, but that seems to me like too big of a number to just put all the blame on users. At some point you have to blame the developer, too.

When you have such high percentages of users doing something, it's not about "user stupidity" anymore. It's about the system's design. Facebook _designed_ its apps to get those high percentages of user approval (even without most realizing they gave that approval).</comment>