Best Buy Is Thriving in the Age of Amazon - <AUTHOR> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-07-19/best-buy-should-be-dead-but-it-s-thriving-in-the-age-of-amazon <comment><USER4> I can't speak for the Geek Squad (as I have never needed to use them), but they price match to Amazon (and several other online stores), and will generally have what I am looking for (at least for consumer electronics). I know that I will get it that day (vs. Amazon's "two day shipping" that regularly turned into three or four days) at an Amazon price, it will certainly NOT be a counterfeit, and I don't have to give my information so I don't feel like I am being tracked.

<comment><USER5> Lately my items generally show up on time but badly packaged. I would say 9 of the last 10 books I bought on Amazon have had some kind of visible damage, from minor cover dings to folded covers and ripped pages. The worst is when they put a single book into a bubble envelope that is so oversized the book can slide around and rotate a full 360 degrees inside the packaging. This is essentially a trade paperback book in an evvelope large enough to hold a textbook. I have avoided returns because I don't want to get banned from Amazon over my satisfaction with a $12 book (they are known to fire customers with too many returns), but I have started purchasing the books I want that I see in indie shops at full list just to avoid this disappointing experience.

<comment><USER6> Fire customers? I've never heard of that. My household is a heavy Prime user, and we make returns pretty frequently (few times a month). We've never had any issue.

<comment><USER7> It's more a ratio thing I think. If you buy a lot you can return a lot and still have a low return ratio. Plus it makes a difference if you buy and return only vs buy, return and get a different or replacement product.

<comment><USER5> Given my rate of book damage, I also have low confidence that the replacement item would arrive in good condition so exchange seems like a waste if time. I want to buy things and have them show up undamaged. Is it so much to ask?

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER8> But that call-in "customer support" is a deal killer. I made an online purchase, a cheap antenna (thank goodness). It arrived in a box with my address taped on it but with customized shirts inside. Boxes were damaged during shipping and when put back together, someone got my stuff and I got theirs. UPS - "it's not on us, contact Best Buy". So I decided to use this to test Best Buy's customer support. I call. Foreign accent. I explain very carefully, slowly, in detail. She didn't listen to a thing I said. Started asking questions that did not pertain to the situation whatsoever. More explanation. 10 minutes in. 15 minutes. Finally she says, oh, I have a tracking number right here and your new shipment is on its way! I said, give me the tracking number, a little surprised she found the solution so suddenly. She read it off. It was the identical tracking number of the damaged box I had just received, and UPS showed it delivered to my house already of course (the one with the shirts inside). Anything to get me off the line. I called her bluff and said "That's the same tracking number as the box that was already delivered and had shirts inside". She said "Well, it's not our responsibility anyway." Me, "goodbye". Only $15 (and 20 minutes of time) to determine to what extent Best Buy cares about customer support, and to guide my purchasing decisions accordingly.

<comment><USER9> I've had similar issues with Verizon support reps. What I've started doing is if I get the feeling they're not helping, I just hang up and call again. At least with Verizon I'd say 50% of agents know what they're talking about, so usually that works.

I know this is a shitty solution (and to be honest, I've never had to do the same with Amazon) but it does help.

<comment><USER10> I recently switched to T-Mobile from Verizon, because they were willing to straight up pay off the phone I bought a few months ago, whereas being a Verizon customer for a decade has given me basically no benefits whatsoever.

Anyway, there was a screwup with the reimbursement, and the one thing I'll give T-Mobile's customer service is that any time you contact them, they text a survey to you afterward, and if you express displeasure through the survey, man, they are all over that. You get a call back shortly after from someone in a department dedicated to fixing customer service issues.

I'm pretty sure it's the very first time that responding to one of those surveys wasn't a total waste of time. I really wish more companies handled it that way.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER11> Like most Americans I order a shitload from Amazon. However the last item I bought from Best Buy was a TV (my old LG just ... died).

Ordered online, chose to pick up in store.

Drive 35 min to store

Pickup process takes 10-15 min

Drive 35 min home.

Left after dinner, was watching it that evening.

The only condition that would have prevented me from using this model would be traffic, as it could extend the trip by 60-90 minutes and would also increase my stress significantly.

Whereas Amazon would take 2-3 days (maybe more) and I'd be shitting bricks worrying about it getting damaged and being forced through the horrors of shipping a return.

<comment><USER12> I ordered a TV from Amazon. They use a third party service that schedules delivery with you. Two dudes came out with TV, unboxed and set it up (put on stand, plugged in power to verify its working).

A few days after delivery I noticed a red line running along the top of the screen. Contacted Amazon about replacement. There was some issue with doing a direct replacement so they had me purchase another TV and then refunded the cost.

Dude comes out and picks up busted TV, puts it in box. New dudes come out a few days later with new TV.

All of that is to say - it really wasn't a big deal to order it online. Shipping was still free. Also they took packaging material with them, so it was nice not having to deal with disposing of a gigantic box.

<comment><USER13> I can't tell whether you're happy with Amazon's service. It sounds to me like you waited for delivery, got a bad TV, waited for delivery _again_... but at least you don't have to deal with the box?

No thanks.

<comment><USER14> He could have gone to Best Buy, drove the TV home himself if he had a car a 65-inch TV would fit in, dealt with the packaging and setup himself, and then found out it was defective.

It sounds to me like he got pretty good service and avoided a lot of hassle by doing it through Amazon.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER15> This is rather off-topic, but the only thing that saddens me about Best Buy is that it just doesn't feel the same walking in as it used to.

I remember when I got my first job, at age 14, in 1998. I cut, baled, loaded, hauled, and stacked hay in a barn for a local farmer. It was extremely hot and tiring work for an overweight geek, but it paid better than anything else I could have gotten at that age - I was paid by the bale and I want to say it worked out to about $6 / hour. I saved all summer with nothing in mind other than "I want to buy a cool tech gadget!"

At the end of that summer I convinced my grandfather to drive me ~90 miles to the nearest Best Buy, and walking in that day was the best feeling in the world - a whole store full of cool toys that I didn't have! I walked out that day with one of the first MP3 players, a Diamond Rio PMP300, and a 32MB SmartMedia card. I spent about $350 on them, which my family thought was absurd.

I proceeded to go home and fill it with songs I downloaded from UseNet, and took it to school. I went to a rural school, and I don't think anyone had a clue what it was - several people asked me if it was a MiniDisc player. I explained to them what an "MP3" was.

I wish I could recapture the feeling of walking into Best Buy in the 90s. These days I have pretty much every tech item I want, and there are very few things there that can hold my interest. It makes me a little bit sad to walk through the doors and not be excited about what I'll find. It's pretty much the very definition of a First World Problem, but it is what it is.

Back then, I wasn't really wanting "toys" as much as I was thirsting for knowledge and fields to explore. That little MP3 player introduced me to UseNet, then Napster, and finally Gnutella. It ended up being a pretty big part of what got me interested in technology in general and development in particular - I went from "Hey, this is cool, free music!" to "Hmm... LimeWire is open source, I wonder if I can figure out how to fix this bug..." over the few years following.

Ultimately, it led me to my career. I wouldn't quite go so far as to credit Best Buy with that, but it's fair to say that the store contributed a great deal to building my interest in a technology.

<comment><USER16> Wow 32MB? Fills up after what, 10 songs? For 350$, which is like 500$ today? :( I understand your family reaction lol

<comment><USER17> I suspect the recording were either much smaller (Let's call it 30 songs which seems insane still if compared to an ipod but it wouldn't exist for several years.) or there was audiophile quality hardware in it in which case carrying 1 album HiFi wasn't too bad. You could change it out after school the day you get bored of it.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> You really can't beat going into a physical store for a large ticket item purchase. No waiting for shipping, easy to return, viewing the product in store.

Recently purchased a MBP from Bestbuy. The first one I received had noticeable back light bleeding near a screen corner. Walked back in the store the next day to return. The process from an online retailer would have taken weeks.

<comment><USER19> A while back we had a refrigerator die, and I was like "no problem, I'll run to home depot and get one".

they could NOT handle it. Everyone seemed annoyed that I wanted to do this. They have refrigerators on the floor but only a few are for sale, and they can do delivery in theory but they didn't seem to know if their delivery guys were available or not.

I went over to Lowes next door and it was the same deal. I was astonished. Couldn't give them my money.

So yeah I got it online, which was a very smooth experience but was without a refrigerator for a few days which is not good.

<comment><USER20> Yeah I was somewhat surprised when I bought a new washer and dryer. Took my truck to the store so I would have space, get there, and they are like yeah its going to be two weeks for delivery. They keep none of those items on hand, as they are too large. Its all out in a warehouse somewhere else, and they just aren't prepared for someone who wants something now. It makes sense, but is not something I thought about before experiencing it.

<comment><USER21> Interestingly, the one place you could do this (walk in and buy a new washer/dryer/fridge and drive away with it) was Sears which has closed their stores in many major metro areas and are basically going out of business...

<comment><USER22> This is only true of a small portion of the sears with warehouse attached (aka the ones not in malls). Even then, I purchased my last two dishwashers there, and in both cases it took a couple days to deliver.

If you want something right now, go to one of the scratch and dent appliance places. Same basic deal as hd/lowes/bestbuy when it comes to appliances, just about the only ones those stores have in stock are the ones that got returned.

<comment><USER23> I worked at a Sears when I was younger. The location didn't have a large warehouse attached (smaller one, but it was only for smaller home and garden/electronics items), but there was one in town so for some items we'd sell and they'd go there to pick up. I do recall at points where items were sold from the store, but that was a rarity.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER24> Yesterday, I went into a Best Buy for the first time in ages because I needed a USB A to USB micro b cable and I was on the road in a small city (fewer than 50K).

I was surprised by how clean, well-organized, and well-staffed it was. When I asked where such cables were (not having yet left the front of the store because, not having a lock with me, I needed to stow my bicycle up front), the associate on the floor came over and directed me precisely and accurately to where the cables were.

I hope Best Buy figures out how to stick around because the cable I bought is actually pretty nice (braided cable) and I like having the option to buy quality electronic accessories from a clean storefront when I'm on the road (i.e. urgent electronics need and I don't want a low-quality no-name throw-it- away-after-5-uses knock-off).

<comment><USER25> The thing I find Best Buy really useful for is things that actually need to fit you or do not have a standardized size or really varying quality like headphones or mice. I get attached to models of both of those items and eventually they get deprecated and I have to find new ones and the Amazon experience just doesn't work for those things unless you want to buy 3 and return 2 that don't work for you.

I also feel like it's the same with phones- you can can go and see if it feels right in your hand or if you want the XL model or something and since it's not a mobile phone store primarily it's less apparent pressure then the dedicated stores for those sorts of things.

I think they do have a place going forward if they keep the experience up, the other big box places you can buy electronics such as Wal-Mart, Target, and Staples end up just being depressing supermarket-esque experiences with half the products on the shelves being out of date by 3 or more years or just being the absolute bottom of the barrel in quality. It really feels like a struggle for other stores to carry decent quality middle of the road products, but Best Buy does well in that aspect.

</comment></comment><comment><USER26> Their prices are not too bad anymore. They usually are about the same as online prices and returns are easier in store, so I have got a few things from Best Buy. Most recently a Macbook for my wife was $50 cheaper in Best Buy vs in the Apple store.

<comment><USER27> If you don't want to live in a world dominated by one company, you have to shop at the other guy as often as you can. That means picking #2 whenever they are no worse than #1, not just when they are better.

When amazon has no competition left, the experience will worsen. If for no other reason than that the stockholders will insist.

</comment></comment><comment><USER28> Don't forget, Best Buy's Geek Squad has been acting as an extension of the FBI for awhile. The FBI regularly pays Geek Squad employees to report on suspected illegal activity worth investigating further. [https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/03/geek-squads- relationsh...](https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/03/geek-squads-relationship- fbi-cozier-we-thought)

</comment><comment><USER29> Once Amazon started charging sales tax in my state, it was a no brainer to go to Best Buy first.

\- Same price (or sometimes less)

\- No waiting on delivery

\- High confidence that I'm getting a genuine product

For me, it's the last point that's most important...especially with more expensive electronics purchases.

<comment><USER30> > High confidence that I'm getting a genuine product

Coming from a guy wearing a $50 pair of counterfeit Billabong shorts right now, that I bought off Amazon, I agree.

</comment></comment><comment> at-fates-hands I worked at the Richfield HQ in 2010 before Joly came in and it was a disaster working there. Environments would go down and stay down for hours or days. I would come in at 8am and not be able to work until 1 or 2pm. They had such a consistent turn over, they would have 3rd party vendors and have no idea who the contact was or what company actually operated large chunks of their network. They essentially had a 70-80% contract workforce so the code was unbearable to deal with. Nobody cared about how bad the code was, they just cared the site looked nice. The amount of hacks I saw were shocking. Writing a 25 line script to indent an H3 title two spaces? Yeah, that was pretty common.

I left after 8 months. Several of my friends stayed on and noticed how different it was when Joly came on. Several years on, things have gotten significantly better. They've modernized a lot of their apps (even through their website is still clunky and old) and are in the process of revamping their site to a far more modern stack. Joly cleaned house and brought in people who want to modernize their software, and from what I know now, the people who stayed on are a lot happier nowadays.

<comment><USER31> I noticed that in the article, Joly gave back the employee discount and said it was a big morale booster. I think morale is important, especially for retail. Employees run the business, and store floor employees are the face of the business.

I've gone to Best Buy mainly for store pickups - but generally a good experience. One time I was there for pickups, and in general looking for a new vacuum cleaner...so I wandered over there. An employee approached me with a positive demeanor and asked if I had any questions, and even asked if I wanted a demo. I gently declined, she said I can find her if I have any other questions and she didn't bother me.

I didn't buy my vacuum cleaner from there...I found a clearance at Walmart that had great reviews. But if I wanted to buy one at retail value (or at least, non-clearance price) I'd go to Best Buy...good customer service, and they'll match anyone.

Happy employees = good business. I work for a big company, and management always does surveys. One of the biggest complaints is we don't get free coffee. The executives addressed it and responded...no free coffee. Would you rather want free coffee, or hire more employees? (funny thing is we're not hiring)

<comment><USER32> > Would you rather want free coffee, or hire more employees? (funny thing is > we're not hiring)

Indeed, an amusing twist on the traditional false dichotomy: the truth isn't that you can actually have both, but, rather, that you can't have either one.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER33> Amazon won me over with "real two day shipping". It was truly glorious when I signed up. It lulled me into this constant consuming state - shipping was so fast (and 'free' with prime) I could just mindlessly order any thing without waiting for a big shipment. I would order from Amazon a few times a day for days on end - any random thing I remembered I needed. It would all quickly stream into my house - I stopped even thinking about shipping and delivery days. It was wonderful.

They lost me with "not really two day shipping." Today, two-day shipping means "two days from when we ship it, not counting weekends, and not counting however long it takes for us to actually process the order, and then not even actually two days." 'Free two-day shipping' often comes in about a week for me. My constant state of consumption was interrupted by going days thinking, 'where is that thingamajig I needed to finish that project?' \- often manifesting by ordering something on Mon/Tues assuming it would be here for a weekend, only to have it not show up in time, forcing me to run to the local hardware store (or whatever) and then return my Amazon item.

I still buy some stuff on Amazon - mostly things that I don't really care about when it comes as long as it comes. I've gotten into the habit of compiling lists at home of stuff that I absolutely need at a certain time and then making trips to local stores when needed, including Best Buy.

</comment><comment><USER34> Similar to a lot of people in this topic, I recently visited a Best Buy for the first time in years, and was impressed with the new interior and layout.

I ended up leaving and buying what I needed on Amazon though. I had limited time in the store and didn't feel knowledgeable enough to choose between a handful of products, so I went home to do some research before ordering.

I wonder if Best Buy would benefit from a lounge, where you can sit down in peace, read product reviews, and browse online to make an informed purchase. Or maybe they could have tablets on stands next to groups of products with reviews. For example, you go to the printer section, and there's a tablet that shows all the printers and their user reviews. Then you can quickly compare options, sort by price, and see what printers are best reviewed.

Sometimes I try to check reviews in a store with my phone, but I usually feel out of place standing in an aisle for 15 minutes looking at my phone. So, it would be cool if they had a place where you could actually sit down for a while to educate yourself and make a decision.

<comment><USER35> If I'm browsing around a Best Buy, I almost always pull put an item i am looking at on Amazon, so that I can check for price match and check reviews/research.

kind of a reverse of the old model of playing with something in store, then buying it online.

</comment></comment><comment><USER36> I remember years ago on HN, there'd be debates over whether it was ethical or decent to go into a Best Buy store, then do a price check and order on Amazon, effectively using BB and other brick-and-mortar stores as showrooms. I remember the debate seeming split on generational lines, with younger folks pointing out that BB should adapt or die, and older folks arguing that brick- and-mortar was at a huge disadvantage no matter how low they cut prices, and that shuttered stores were a blight on real-life communities.

I still buy most of my stuff of Amazon but the nearby Best Buy stores are good enough that I see them almost as a premium shopping experience. Not at the level of Apple of course, but good enough that I'm happy to spend money there. I think the turnaround moment was a few years ago when I noticed a premium wireless mouse going for an incredibly low $20. When I tried to checkout, the cashier said that according to the system, it appeared the mouse was labeled wrong on the shelf, to the tube of $40 off. But without hesitation he gave me the discount anyway.

I would've predicted back when Amazon released its Price Check app that Best Buy would be decimated. I don't use their tech support/consulting so I still am surprised they are surviving. Ironically, I now take advantage of Amazon in order to buy at BB. When I see something I like on the shelf, I check to see if the Amazon reviews are good. If so, I can buy it without the same level of nagging doubt about the product's authenticity.

<comment><USER37> The moral arguments extend beyond "brick and mortar" vs online. I think the bigger issue is how they treat their employees. One company uses "third party contractors " to skirt labor laws and has their employees pissing in bottles to stay in good standing.

</comment></comment><comment><USER38> Recently I've found myself at Best Buy a few times after not having been in years. There's a few reasons.

For big ticket items like TVs, Amazon usually isn't much cheaper if they are at all like it seemed to be a few years ago. Being able to see them in person and take them home same day is also nice.

Amazon's listings are mess. Sometimes the listing are just skeevy looking and have missing or wrong information. Even when the listing looks good, I'm not always sure I'll get quite what I ordered. I've already started to basically not use 3rd party sellers, but even when Amazon is listed as the seller, I've gotten items that were clearly used(when they were supposed to be new) or just not the right item, once being a counterfeit of what I was ordering.

I also noticed that for "gravy" items like cables and stuff, where Amazon was often 3 or 4 times cheaper, Best Buy is at least not as bad as they were in the past. They've still got some very overpriced options, but they also have some more reasonably priced options. So now its a decision to spend $3 or $4 more on that HDMI cable at Best Buy when I get the TV rather than $15 more. The decision to to spend the couple more dollars at Best Buy for the cable isn't just convenience, but is bolstered by cheaper items on Amazon being even more of a crapshoot than they were in the past.

</comment><comment><USER39> I actually think it's Amazon that has the poor business model, and I'm puzzled how it's working for them. They are usually not competitive on price compared to other sites, and sometimes it's the same price off the shelf at Best Buy. Big ticket items from Amazon usually have free shipping, but it's a 3-4 day wait unless you pay for "free" shipping by joining Prime. But I quit Prime a few years ago after 10 out of my last 10 orders arrived late. I can understand the convenience of using a single website, but when you can find the same items elsewhere for $30-$40 cheaper, I don't see why more people aren't shopping around.

<comment><USER40> > But I quit Prime a few years ago after 10 out of my last 10 orders arrived > late

I have a hard time believing this. I've never had late shipments with amazon nor have any of my friends. Are you exaggerating or is there any omitted context?

<comment><USER41> Prime member for the last 8 years but I'm seriously considering canceling next year (mostly due to the price hike in Prime).

I've had plenty of items arrive late or not even at all, with stretches where I've had back-to-back-to-back issues with Amazon, so frustrating that I considered canceling Prime right then and there (~3 years ago).

A couple times they were delivered to our neighbors house next door (who dropped them off to us, thankfully) and a few times we had to contact Amazon Customer Service who just sent us a new one. In general, I trust Amazon to get me my item, but they're definitely not perfect and I wouldn't be surprised if OP isn't exaggerating...

BTW, I live in the Bay Area (and not out in the boonies).

<comment><USER40> I live in Los Angeles and have had the complete opposite experience. Been a prime member for 4 years now, I order from them all the time, and shipments always come on time with no problems whatsoever.

<comment><USER42> I live in LA as well. While most of my Amazon purchases arrive on time (and even occasionally early!), more of them have begun arriving late. My Prime Day purchases, for example, were originally supposed to arrive same day...but are currently on track for Saturday and Sunday. I could have just stopped by Best Buy on the way to work.

</comment></comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER43> It's amazing how many things Best Buy is doing right that have largely gone unnoticed over the last few years. While still not perfect, they've done more than almost any other retailer I can think of to modernize the shopping experience, while leveraging their existing advantages:

* Local Inventory with Google Shopping - if I search for almost any product on Google, Best Buy is usually the only major retailer that shows me local inventory for that product. I can't believe how few major retailers do this. If I search for an external hard drive on Google, I can see right away if I'm able to go down the street and pick it up.

* In Store Pick Up - this is almost as seamless as picking up an order at the Apple Store. Just yesterday I placed an order for in-store pick up at my local Best Buy. 20 minutes later I received a confirmation email that my order was ready, and all I had to do was show my ID when I showed up to the store. No signing a receipt, or making sure I had the credit card I placed the order with. The whole process took less than 3 minutes, and I could even add additional name(s) of people who were authorized to pick it up for me.

* Open-box items - I know these can be hit or miss, but at least with Best Buy you can inspect open box items before deciding to take them home (as opposed to Amazon Warehouse, where you have to go through the process of shipping it back if it's not what you expected). They even have these "outlet items" highlighted on both their app and website, so I can see which Best Buys around me have a specific open box item I'm looking for.

* Geek Squad Protection - this isn't perfect, and it can be expensive, but it's nice to know that if something goes wrong with a large item (such as a TV or appliance), someone will actually come to my house to check it out. They are also very willing to give you a brand new replacement if the repair is going to be expensive or labor intensive. I know I probably sound like an old fogey, but dealing with factory warranties directly through the manufacturer is always such a pain, and they almost never offer a full replacement.

* Best Buy APP - their app is great! It keeps track of all of my orders, and even tells me when something I've bought has an open recall. I think Target is the only company that does a better job combing both the in-store and e-commerce aspects into a single app.

They've also IMO done a good job keeping the in-store experience consistent between locations. I'm sure there are still some locations that have less helpful employees, or less reliable inventory, but this is happening less often for me.

<comment><USER44> Yes I'd second the comment on local inventory control in general - <USER2> other box stores with "fuzzy" inventory listed online, Best Buy seems to have a very accurate representation of what is in each store. If I want an item now I have high confidence that when I go there it'll be there for me to pickup.

</comment></comment><comment><USER45> Best Buy was great the day my GPU died and I needed a new one by the evening. Prices were pretty good.

<comment><USER46> Speaking of GPUs. I bought a ATI card for $600 during a mining craze. I had issues with blue screens, and they took it back 6 months after purchase and refunded me full price, even though it was selling for $370 at the time.

Pretty good customer service if you ask me. I mainly want to support local store because Amazon used to have much better pricing than all the physical stores, but now it is not the case. However, it is much convenient to find the item online instead of going to store and finding out the item is not there.

<comment><USER47> Mining existed when ATI is still a thing?

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER48> Best Buy still exists mainly because you can go and demo the gadgets. For certain things, you want to see them in person and they always price match Amazon for anything Amazon has cheaper.

I bought an 85" 4K tv a few years ago and it was not a cheap item. Do you really think someone would just buy something for $10k on Amazon and hope it is ok? I also paid them to have a team of 3 people come and install it on my wall. This is a case where the local store beat the online store.

</comment><comment><USER49> Over the last few months, I decided to try and reduce my Amazon.com shopping as much as possible. As a result, I have been doing my item finding on Amazon and then going out and buying the item at a brick and mortar. I find it to be an interesting reversal. It has also been pretty shocking to see how much money I save when I don't have a Prime account. It turns out that most things I want are things that I don't actually need.

</comment><comment><USER50> I went to Best Buy recently on a whim to try and _not_ by something from Amazon.

I had found a product on the Best Buy website, a $79 55-65 inch LCD/Plasma corner wall mount. So I drove to the store and looked for it. This was roughly 2 months after Christmas.

The store had about 300 units of a $199.99 version and 0 units of any thing the below $150...

I spent about 15 minutes looking for somebody to tell me what I already expected, they only carry the expensive one in store.

I bought the same brand (slightly different model number off Amazon.com [likely to prevent price matching]) while in the Best Buy for $69, shipped to my house.

It was $10 cheaper, I didn't need to leave my house, I didn't need to talk to anyone...

Best Buy completely lost my sale because they didn't have inventory and pushed a more expensive and way higher margin unit ...

I was so disappointed because I really, really tried to _not_ buy from Amazon.

It's no wonder Amazon is eating the world while only being mediocre... Retailers are simply botching any advantage they have (being local) for the last 15 years...

(disclosure: I worked for Sears Electronics department part time for about 3 years while going to college [sears no longer sells electronics like Televisions or radios])

</comment><comment><USER51> Last time I went to BB was to buy a Pixel 2 charging cable. A BB employee helped locate it and reminded me that it's called "USB C" cable not a "Pixel 2 charging cable".

<comment><USER52> > "USB C" cable

Would that it were so simple.

</comment></comment><comment><USER53> [https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/03/geek-squads- relationsh...](https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/03/geek-squads-relationship- fbi-cozier-we-thought)

[https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/18/us/politics/charges- cia-b...](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/18/us/politics/charges-cia-breach- vault-7.html)

All you need into let one of these guys into your house and some child porn magically ends up on your hard drive.

I'd pay a local IT a bit more knowing that I am supporting a local business while at the same time not supporting corporate Orwellian culture(TM).

</comment><comment><USER54> What was the "reality check" part about Ms Kordash's day at the end? She sold a TV, provided what appeared to be prompt and complete customer service, and the customers seemed to like her. The main drawback -- a relatively older clientele which may not necessarily be big consumers of the latest shiny -- was more due to the area she was serving. Certainly the level of service is expensive to provide, but it seems like Best Buy is either able to handle or at least reasonably aware of that cost.

<comment><USER55> I was asking myself the same question - maybe that field customer service and human contact are what makes BB compete effectively with Amazon?

<comment><USER54> Maybe, but the choice of words implied that there was some limit on their aspirations. However, she seemed to do very well in the field and clearly represented a competitive differentiator. I'm sure Amazon is taking notes.

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER56> In the last year counterfeits have become such a big problem for me that my trust in Amazon has eroded dramatically. I wonder when that will show up in their stock price.

</comment><comment><USER57> After years of not stepping into one due to them pushing Monster cables with every purchase I went back to look at appliances. I was pleasantly surprised. Sales staff was knowledgeable and they had a good selection. A much better experience than the home improvement stores I went to. Even better - my fridge went on sale the following week for $500 off my price, they gave that all back to me as they price-match post-sale.

</comment><comment><USER58> If your item has a high price, something like a laptop or TV, it's in the best interest of the consumer to see it in person, compare it directly with other models, and potentially walk out with it then and there. The lower the price of the item, there will be proportionally higher % of total cost to the consumer in going out to a store, in terms of labor and time spent.

Do I need to spend 25 minutes going out to pick a new phone charger for $10? My time is valued more highly than that. But for a $800 TV, the % of costs in the time/effort slice become proportionally much less. It will take me slightly longer to pick a TV out, but still, an hour of my labor at $35 is not even 5% of an $800 dollar TV, whereas the time/labor for me to get the phone charger in person is going to be much closer to 50% of the total cost.

</comment><comment><USER59> I don't trust Amazon for technology purchases any more. Best Buy offers the same level of convenience (next day delivery in most places), with the added benefit of being able to pick up something same day in-store. No fear of ever being stuck with counterfeits or missing deadlines on pre-orders.

</comment><comment><USER60> I will pop into best buy from time to time to see if there are any good open box items or any cheap blurays. I am always amazed that they continue to give as much floor space as they do to appliances. I guess they have good profit margins and someone must be buying them to keep offering them?

</comment><comment><USER61> In Germany we have Saturn and Mediamarkt, and these shops seem to work the same way they worked 15-20 years ago. In some regards the products available even went down, at least in the areas I care about. So really, every time I go into one I regret it. Not even USB cables are something I want to buy there because of the small amount of choice, because they are hard to find, and because they price cheat (i.e. put up a good price in front of product which actually costs too much; then claiming the way too small string on the price label says it's for another product), like many physical stores do these days here.

So I really want to support local, European companies, but there is no competition to Amazon here. I'd even consider Taobao before I purposefully would go to a store here.

</comment><comment><USER62> The in-home service is the last thing I'd want. But I have been shopping at Best Buy way more than I used to.

Here's why. A few years ago I bought a big-ticket item (TV) and obviously wanted to see it before I bought it. They were able to provide generous no- interest financing via their co-branded Citi credit card. They have a policy of offering 12-month no-interest financing on many products and split up over that much time it's easy to talk yourself into buying things you probably don't need.

Also the Gamer's Club Unlocked is better than Amazon's game discount system because it works anytime, not just up until release. I've heard that they have ended the program though which would just send me back to Amazon.

</comment><comment><USER63> Fry's doesn't appear to be doing so well. The Austin store reduced it's product selection during a remodel a couple of years ago.

For a tech city Austin only has 1 Fry's and 1 Altex for serious electronic / computer stores.

I wish MicroCenter would open a location here.

<comment><USER64> Had a MicroCenter back in Kansas City...that is a FUN store to go to for geeks.

</comment></comment><comment><USER65> I recently ventured beyond the in-store pickup area of a Best Buy for the first time in a while, I was pleasantly surprised. It seems they're positioning themselves as the smart home destination, pretty extensive inventory in this area, with product samples and descriptions clearly visible. They've also lowered the shelf heights and the store feels less cluttered (without feeling like an apple store clone). They also seem to be distributing inventory across regional stores to offer greater in-store pickup options. There are several Best Buy stores within reasonable distance to where I live, and typically at least one has the desired product. Staff seems generally more friendly as well.

<comment><USER66> Reducing the amount of music and movies they sell in store has helped a lot in that regard. They've reclaimed a lot of that space for the "store within a store" concept for things like wearables and smart home stuff, which brings a more inviting, open feel to the stores instead of feeling claustrophobic.

</comment></comment><comment><USER67> What is Best Buy anymore? I recently bought a refrigerator there and it was a really bizarre experience. It seemed more like a small mall than a big box store. The appliances were in a section called "Appliances by Pacific Sales", where Pacific Sales is a chain of stores in LA. We actually bought our oven at Pacific Sales years earlier. Then they had the "Apple Store at Best Buy," next to the "Verizon Store at Best Buy." I couldn't really tell whether Best Buy was directly selling anything or not. It just seemed to be a collection of stores within the Best Buy store. It was like a small mall, but only with electronics and appliances. So odd.

<comment><USER68> Not sure what you're expecting. Did people forget what an electronics retailer is?

A retailer such as BestBuy never sold their own "BestBuy" branded electronics. Retailers have always been the middle-man between the electronics manufacturer and the consume, so that the electronics company doesn't need to rent or build their own stores. It's cheaper for BestBuy to not hire their own bestbuy salespeople. Instead Verizon and Apple hire their own knowledgeable staff and put them at Best Buy.

</comment></comment><comment><USER69> Best Buy often has competitively priced weekly sales that beat Amazon regularly and they'll price match the rest. Their free shipping offer is reasonable, and in store pickup and return offer a huge advantage Amazon can't match for near instant transactions at nationwide scale. (Arguably, same day shipping offers at Amazon are close, but those are only in a few localities.)

I'm not surprised they're doing okay, especially since a lot of their retail competitors in the electronics, appliance, and movie businesses have closed up shop. Physical retail will always have a certain draw, when the market for it is reducing, you just need to outlast your competitors.

</comment><comment><USER70> I have had good experience (on multiple occasions) when buying consumer electronic from the Best Buy. They do price matching, you get to experience the product, and the customer rep was really helpful.

I can't say the same about the snob at the Apple Store.

<comment><USER71> You have to keep in mind though their "price matching" is basically dependant on whatever manager is currently working. Ive had them outright refuse a match on Amazon because the margins for them were too thin, or even add in the cost of same day shipping to the "matched" price.

</comment></comment><comment><USER72> One of the main benefits being reported here is the instant purchase, however with Amazon Prime Now (1-2 hour delivery of some items in metropolitan areas), this somewhat goes away. I recently used Amazon to buy new computer parts to upgrade my PC, and when they arrived and I started assembling it, I realized I had gotten the wrong RAM. So even at 9pm I was able to order 2 sticks of decent 8GB ddr4 ram and get it delivered that same night by 10pm and finish the build.

What I prefer about Amazon are the reviews and selection. Even when I'm in Best buy, I'm on my phone reading Amazon reviews for the products I'm considering and exploring alternatives.

<comment><USER32> > One of the main benefits being reported here is the instant purchase, > however with Amazon Prime Now (1-2 hour delivery of some items in > metropolitan areas)

I remember Amazon came out with this, but I initially dismissed it, thinking that the selection of items was too limited and never looked again.

I do, still, believe that limited selection is an issue, but what's a far greater issue is that I'm generally not even aware of what that is, due to lack of integration with their main shopping experience. Having to go to primenow.amazon.com and not seeing a "Prime Now" option prominently displayed for an item on their main shopping site means the option probably doesn't even occur to most people (as it doesn't to me).

Nowadays, there's also the controversy surrounding how Amazon "Flex" workers are treated and paid, which can have a more direct effect on the Prime Now experience.

</comment></comment><comment><USER73> I'm not sure why electronics stores should be dead.

They provide a discovery layer Amazon can't, including a hands on exposure, as well as Same-day ownership.

It might get interesting if Amazon opens their own electronics stores carrying their wider selection, though.

</comment><comment><USER74> Up until a year ago I didn't do much shopping at Best Buy but now I do a bunch. What changed? I got a PS4 last year and joined their Gamers Club Unlocked program. $30 for 2 years and I get 20% off all games (new/used/pre- ordered) as well as double Best Buy points on games/gaming accessories. I also can get $10 gift card for pre-ordering certain games (which would still be 20% off). So for FIFA 19, I preordered and saved 20% off list price and then will be getting a $10 Best Buy credit on my account once the game is shipped to me. Oh yea, they will ship the game to my house for free too.

</comment><comment><USER75> Best Buy often has sales on Macs. Educational discount or just $150-$300 off. Plus you can save a little more on an open-box.

I'd also much rather go to Best Buy to upgrade my phone. I absolutely detest going to the Verizon store.

</comment><comment><USER76> I go occasionally, usually when I am going to make a larger electronics purchase like a laptop, camera, etc. I still like being able to check out a physical copy of something and make sure it is what I am wanting.

I still like the breadth of options on Amazon and being able to get a lot of items to my door in 2 days. It actually happened yesterday where I went to a local shop and they didn't have what I wanted in stock, either wait 2 weeks for them to place the order and have it delivered or just get it off Amazon and have it on my doorstep on Saturday.

</comment><comment><USER77> Recently I've started buying small tech items (wireless mouse, laptop bag, temp cell phone, etc) from Best Buy again. Being a WA State resident, I'm paying the same 10% sales tax on Amazon purchases (or near enough to not care), and not only can I try out items before I buy - I get free, immediate delivery too, no Prime needed.

Then, after getting the product, no worries about it being counterfeit - <USER3> the pants I bought from Amazon, sold as adult pants but must have been children's pants, as my foot wouldn't fit through the leg.

</comment><comment><USER78> Best Buy is nice because I like being able to actually handle and try the products I'm going to buy. Plus buying from a physical store supports the local economy with jobs and sales taxes.

</comment><comment><USER79> A lot of people are talking about the respective pros and cons of dense metropolitan use of amazon vs. everywhere else and shipping times, and how they're slipping.

But what really matters to me is the lock-in, or lack of it. When I order from Best Buy online (I don't go in person anymore) I don't need to pay $100 for just the privledge of shopping there. That kind of anti-consumer practice I simply won't abide.

</comment><comment><USER80> I recently bought a washer and dryer at Best Buy. I was thoroughly impressed with the selection and customer service. They even gave me a deal on the higher tier model after the ones I wanted were on backorder. I think they partner with Pacific Kitchen and Home to do the appliances.

Their remodels have gone a long way in getting me back there, personally. I had otherwise steered clear and was an Amazon/BH junkie.

</comment><comment><USER81> Funny enough, I just went into Best Buy prior to a long road trip. My phone is old and has no memory left and I wanted an mp3 player to listen to some podcasts as well as a splitter cable to listen to an audiobook with my wife. I found cheap, but high quality products pretty fast. I love Amazon, but sometimes you need something right now. I'll be sad when all brick and mortar stores are gone.

</comment><comment><USER82> Looking over the comments, it looks like no ones thinks Best Buy should be dead. I don't either. Although I usually avoid it because I can't get through the store without several employees badgering me, it still has a place. Especially for non-tech people who actually want someone to sell them a TV/tablet/laptop because there are an overwhelming number of options now.

</comment><comment><USER83> I was gifted a 25$ Best buy gift card, I thought I would never remember to use it. One day the lady is looking at makeup and I see a Best buy. I go in looking for a new mousepad. The place is full of washers and blenders etc. The only mouse pad they had was 60$ (extreme gaming blah blah). I ended up grabbing a Pink Floyd vinyl for 22$. I found it odd but if it works it works.

<comment><USER84> Buying someone a gift card is another way of telling them that you're a consumerist idiot who doesn't give a shit about them. "First and foremost, I don't care about you at all. That said, instead of giving you $20 in cash, I'm going to give that same $20 to BestBuy and force you to shop there or forgo my gift in its entirety, because I'm an imbecile." Intelligent people who don't give a shit about a person will always go cash.

<comment><USER85> I'm truly glad I don't see the world in such drastic black and white. Sounds miserable.

<comment><USER84> Do you know of someone who migrated from binary black and white to whatever schema it is that you use to judge others?

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER86> They have become the showroom for new or high-margin tech like Oculus, Dyson, 7K refrigerators etc and they collect a hefty margin and shelf fees for the effort. They make more money B2B than B2C probably. On smaller stuff their markup is ridiculous ($40-50 for an iphone screen protector that you can buy in a different brand in a pack of 3 for $10 on amazon).

</comment><comment><USER87> I like going in to touch things. I often buy things that I wouldn't online because I can physically hold them and try them out.

<comment><USER88> Agree, with one caveat. When viewing via the website, a large fraction of items are "Online Only" through their 3rd party resellers. I'd like to touch but can't. Note: Canadian experience, may be different down south.

</comment></comment><comment><USER89> I walked into a best buy for the first time in years, and I was surprised how much it had changed, how modern it looked, and how many staff were there. Unfortunately it was right after opening, so they all had energy to continually ask if I needed help, which was a bit obnoxious, though I'm sure super helpful if you actually needed help.

</comment><comment><USER90> As long as you remember the first rule of Best Buy (never buy cables at Best Buy), you can find prices as good or better there than Amazon, and I have to say, the people there are very helpful and friendly. I especially liked their Magnolia store-within-a-store concept for higher-end audio products.

</comment><comment><USER91> I bought my camera at best buy and then took a free photography class, hosted by a best buy employee, the following weekend. It was great!

I've always enjoyed going to best buy and now that I'm an adult I've spent thousands of dollars there.

</comment><comment><USER92> I would say they are staying afloat, but still pretty far from shore.

Their stores are actually rented out retail space for Apple, Samsung, and other brands.

Their online is still somewhat of a disaster, they were #2 for a while but Jet/Walmart will probably pass them as they attempt to challenge Amazon.

Best buy is making no real attempt to challenge Amazon in online retail, a lot like Target isn't either.

Their IT is divided between dotcom and bricks and hate each other, and their IT will be lead by dinosaurs in brick and mortar for the foreseeable future, so the IT innovation that does exist is constrained by executive politics.

Their CEO is just punching the clock and doing what is necessary to trigger stock options.

So, again, treading water and not floundering, but "thriving"? That's like saying you're in the guillotine and there's a really nice breeze, and the blade hasn't been dropped.

<comment><USER93> > Their stores are actually rented out retail space for Apple, Samsung, and > other brands.

So, it's now largely a convenient place known to consumers that serves to connect them to third-party sellers where originally it was entirely a direct retailer itself.

So, it's like a bricks-and-mortar version of Amazon?

</comment></comment><comment><USER94> There's something to be said for just walking in and buying something you can hold in your hands and look at, at least if there isn't a tremendous difference in price.

</comment><comment><USER95> Best Buy price matches Amazon (for the most part) and if I have to pay tax I might as well get what I want today, vs in two days. And if it sucks I can return it to the store.

</comment><comment><USER96> every-time I go nearby store it's mostly empty... (price/sq.ft. ratio)

I'm also not happy with their price match... I had a BB gift card so went there with Costco headphone deal to price match, which they did with shipping of 3 weeks from order day... If you'd have to guess it... yes... shipping after the Costco deal would expire... I wanted to give benefit of doubt but when they canceled my order after 3 weeks... it kind of felt like a trap...

</comment><comment><USER97> At least in Canada, they changed their website quite a bit, accepting PayPal, having a marketplace with 3rd party sellers, similar to Amazon. Good for them, honestly.

</comment><comment><USER98> Sometimes they have some good deals online. I buy and get in the store. In the store itself, it's kind of a mess. I went to buy an $80 item that I saw online but the price there was $100, had to talk to manager to get the price (price matching themselves?).

The thing that makes me usually go to Amazon or elsewhere compared to Best Buy is the return policy. Best Buy will give you only 15 days to do a return with refund. Many times 15 minutes is not enough to install the product, test it and go to the store to return it.

</comment><comment><USER99> I personally don't really like Best Buy, I feel like they are still kind of overpriced and don't have what I need a lot of the times.

However, I am not really who they want in their store. They want older people who only want basic stuff and don't know how to use it.

It's a smart play to cater to people who don't know how to do much. There is a massive market for older people who hate learning how to use their devices on their own.

</comment><comment><USER100> The regular $150 8tb WD Easystore drive deal helped a bit I imagine!

</comment><comment><USER101> Best Buy sells things through Amazon. I just bought a tv through them.

</comment><comment><USER102> I buy big ticket items at BestBuy it's much saner for returns

</comment><comment><USER103> Why should it be dead? Poor management and bad money practices of some other competitors does not mean the retail segment is dead. Just that over leveraged companies are risky. No?

<comment><USER104> Best Buy used to have extremely shady practices, and to some extent still does. They used to have lower prices online, and higher in store, and IIRC not match their own website, nor online competitors. As I understand it, this has changed, their policy looks sane now. Last time I walked in to purchase a laptop, the only ones available had a small packet taped to them of 'upgrades' or antivirus or whatever that cost a ton. I had to track down an employee who had to get a ladder to find the same model with no such attachment.

<comment><USER94> They gave me a free antivirus product I never installed with my laptop.

<comment><USER104> to be honest, I don't remember what it was now. If I remember right it was some slip of paper that indicated Geek Squad had optimized it and put antivirus on it. IIRC it was around $100 extra. And it wasn't clearly indicated, I didn't even notice or find out until checkout.

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER105> I wonder how much the mining GPU shortage helps.

</comment><comment><USER106> I wonder what to what extent this is driven by cryptocurrency mining and other computationally intensive blockchain use-cases.</comment>


Ask HN: How much time do you spend on "marketing" your open source projects? - <AUTHOR> I guess the reason to start an open source project is to scratch your own itch (or because you love doing it). But finding users who will try it or collaborate with you may require some type of marketing? So did you create time to do that or is working on the project reward enough for you?<p>If you have a popular open source project can you tell me a few things like 1) why did you start it? 2) how did people find it? 3) did you post it somewhere to get traction? 4) do you think it's unfair to just work on something you like but never take the time to get the word out? <comment><USER2> Cocreator of Django here.

The very first thing I did was a presentation of Django at the Chicago Python Users Group. There were enough people in attendance that it led to a few early users. A few of those people blogged about it, and so on.

Django was open-sourced in 2005, and the world was very different back then. No GitHub/Bitbucket and people had very low standards/expectations for the design of an open-source project's website. The best "marketing" thing we did was to work with our excellent designer (Wilson Miner) on making a beautiful site. Again, I think expectations have shifted here — it's much more common for OSS projects to have nice-looking sites — but nice design still helps.

That was also before the days of Twitter, and blogging was big. I recall spending _tons_ of time posting comments on blogs. Responding to "reviews" of the framework, answering questions, making it clear that we were listening to the nascent community.

Lastly, there's lots to be said for great documentation and (sounds silly as I type this) software that actually works / can easily be installed. Again, expectations have shifted since 2005, but you really need to nail this. The best marketing is a great product.

<comment><USER3> Hey, we're thinking of building an app in Python/Django for internal use (partly to learn Python and partly because there are many good Python tools for what we intend to do in the future). Can you recommend, in your opinion, the best resource for an experienced Rails & JS/Node dev to learn Django? Something that shows you best tools for dev env setup and includes a tutorial step by step for building a mid-complexity app would suit my learning style. I've written scripts in Python previously but nothing more....

<comment><USER4> The official diagno tutorial is a pretty good start, followed by Tango With Django. That, combined with your previous experience + Django's documentation should be enough to get you going!

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER5> 2 years ago, when ethereum was the new hot sh*t. I started to build an Dapp (decentralized application). A big problem I had was to find the right database and after re-implementing the dapp with 3 different ones (pouchdb, gundb, nedb) I finally started to develop my own one, based on the best previous solution (pouchdb). It turned out that developing that single database was giving more fun and value to myself than any other software- project I had done before.

Like you said, everyone has a reason to do what he does, and so my reason is self-promo to be honest. I actually think most OSS-Projects are done by their maintainers for this reason.

For promotion I had done/do the following:

\- Post on relevant subreddits

\- Google for new results (last 24h) that match some keywords ("js database") and answer there if possible

\- Posted it on Lobsters and other js-news-sites

\- Shown HN (I did this a bit too much which maybe can be called spam by some or "growth hacking" by others)

\- Currently I think about doing an egghead.io-tutorial for the project

I would say that overall I spend about 20% of the time for marketing, 20% for the code, 30% for the tests and 30% for the documentation. Most of the time I just code for some weeks and after a new release, I do some promotion.

Here is the project btw: [https://github.com/pubkey/rxdb](https://github.com/pubkey/rxdb)

<comment><USER6> Congratulations on almost 6k stars and 0 open issues! That takes a lot of work to keep up with the issues and very good documentation to avoid unnecessary usage issues.

<comment><USER7> Give me access and I'll get your open issues to 0. ;)

But seriously, that's a good idea for a metric.

<comment><USER8> Yep, isitmaintained.com uses issue resolution time and open percentage of issues/PRs as the metrics: [http://isitmaintained.com/project/pubkey/rxdb](http://isitmaintained.com/project/pubkey/rxdb) :)

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER9> I maintain Bulma: [https://bulma.io/](https://bulma.io/)

1) I started it because it was simply a personal CSS framework I was using myself to kick start my projects, and I wanted to share it around.

2) People found it through various websites, organically I guess.

3) I initially only posted it here on Hacker News I think. Then it was trending on Github, and other people posted it on Reddit, and other websites like Codrops.

4) I've never really tried to market Bulma. It's just a solution to a problem I had, and it also happens to solve a lot of other developers problems.

I think if your open source project solves a common issue, people will eventually find it. I discover lots of valuable tools when trying to code something.

If you need a strategy, just copy what a successful startup would do: solve a problem that lots of people have. An open source project just happens to solve a problem you _personally_ have, and you assume others will to, so you share that knowledge.

<comment><USER10> Just today I started my first project that uses Bulma. Thanks.

</comment></comment><comment><USER11> Open source isn't synonymous with hobby!

I develop open source systems in my work, partly for internal use but also to help grow the ecosystem our firm is in, and to make a name for ourselves.

We don't market heavily right now because our documentation is sparse so more users means more support.

I think working seriously on documentation is the primary way to market open source, actually.

That means not only API references but appealing and well designed READMEs and changelogs, tutorials, blog posts, etc.

Also having a chat where people can get involved and ask questions.

Beware that users are not only fun to have. They're also a liability in that you kind of have to help them and care about them!

<comment><USER12> While I somewhat agree with you, I'd argue that this not the original understanding of OSS. The idea behind OSS (at least its' amateurish kind) has always been very simple and straight-forward: if you have something to share, just do it. All this worrying about "users" and liabilities is symptomatic of a paradigm shift, which happened, when OSS has become a key part of big corps' business strategy and marketing. Also to a lesser extent it's a consequence of the OSS being seen as a way to market yourself as a developer and steer your career, which led to Github being flooded with unusable and unfinished stuff.

So while it's true that good documentation is probably crucial for the project to become popular among the wider audience nowadays (or even to have a chance of being discovered by anyone), the absence of documentation is in no way an argument against telling fellow engineers about your work. We can figure things out, it's a part of the job :)

<comment><USER11> I kind of agree, but also not! For example, the GNU project always had thoroughly documented software. Emacs is a great example. And GNU does have an aim of getting users! So I don't think "marketing" (evangelizing, teaching, spreading) is just a thing that big corps brought in. Mostly everyone benefits from a project being well documented and accessible. Building a community around a piece of software is intrinsically valuable!

But yeah, it's not like you have to write narrative tutorials for newbies on every thing you do. I really like when there's documentation aimed at "hackers."

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER13> I've spent a fair amount of time promoting xi-editor, most notably presenting it at RustConf last year. I've also written a bunch of "rope science" posts about fancy algorithms and data structures for text manipulation, which got attention on HN and elsewhere. I've been more quiet in recent months, but am gearing up for another major wave of community outreach soon.

</comment><comment><USER14> Responding with [http://www.kiba-etl.org](http://www.kiba-etl.org) (a ruby data processing framework):

1) Why did I start it: I started it because Kiba ancestor [https://github.com/activewarehouse/activewarehouse- etl](https://github.com/activewarehouse/activewarehouse-etl) was crawling under its own technical debt, and I still wanted a way to express data processing jobs with Ruby, without having too much maintenance work on the ETL framework itself.

2) How did people find it: I wrote a number of blog posts at [http://thibautbarrere.com](http://thibautbarrere.com) (including one video), and also spent quite a bit of time working on documentation at [https://github.com/thbar/kiba/blob/master/README.md](https://github.com/thbar/kiba/blob/master/README.md).

3) If I recall well, I posted on the ruby subreddit, twitter, but also gave talks at conferences.

4) It's a matter of personal preference IMO!

To summarise, as marketing for an OSS project, I'm writing blog posts, detailed documentation, videos, speaking at conferences, and tweeting, mostly.

The ratio of all this vs. ratio of actual code in the project is actually very high.

</comment><comment><USER15> Any large and successful open source project that I can think of hinges entirely on the originator's ability to communicate what the project is to the right people -- just like product is 10% code, I'd say open source project is also 10% code. Actually just thinking about a few of them now, I start by thinking "Michael Meeks" before I think Libreoffice, "Miguel de Icaza" before GNOME, "Solomon Hykes" before I think Docker, and of course "Linus Torvalds" before Linux.

Look at projects like Docker -- it's built on the work of many other people, but they were too busy hacking on kernel patches to ever give talks and write end-user documentation. The result? Nobody knows what linux-vserver is or ever was, while everyone who is anyone knows what Docker is.

There are so many examples like that, and just as many counterexamples. It is a rare thing for an author to lack the human skills to communicate and still somehow have his work succeed, and usually it only happens due to their technical skillset, and oftentimes not even then.

</comment><comment><USER16> My most popular open-source project [1] I talk about at conferences, mostly C++ ones (last example [2]). I was lucky to also land a paper about it at ICFP'17 [3]. On Friday I will talk at the MeetingCpp conference in Berlin about a new library I am building (kind of experimental Redux for C++ with time-travelling debugger!).

I work as a freelancer and at the moment I do client work 3 days a week and dedicate the rest of the time to the open-source work. The open-source work includes doing research and implementing these tools, but also preparing the talks, which is a very time consuming task for me. Doing conference talks is very emotionally exhausting, I dread the previous weeks to the talk---but the feeling afterwards is very good and it is a good way to get exposure, I hope.

My dream is to some day form a social company with a coop structure that works full-time on open-source, either directly or indirectly helping clients use these tools in their system. I hope I am set up in the right direction.

Recently I opened a Twitter account to talk mostly about my open-source stuff [1]. I admittedly hate Twitter as a social network, but I've been convinced that it is a good place for networking in our industry, so I just play the game.

I keep telling myself that I should open blog too, but then I realize that one can't simply do everything all the time, so I guess maybe I'll never do it.

To your last question: is it unfair to not do marketing to your work? Totally not. Just do whatever feels right to you. If one day you realize you have built something really useful, probably you'll get the urge to tell people about it.

[1] Immutable data-structures for C++: [https://github.com/arximboldi/immer](https://github.com/arximboldi/immer)

Example usage: [https://github.com/arximboldi/ewig](https://github.com/arximboldi/ewig)

[2] [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPhpelUfu8Q](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPhpelUfu8Q)

[3] [https://public.sinusoid.es/misc/immer/immer- icfp17.pdf](https://public.sinusoid.es/misc/immer/immer-icfp17.pdf)

[4] [https://twitter.com/sinusoidalen](https://twitter.com/sinusoidalen)

<comment><USER17> Well, I'm kinda intrigued by the Redux/C++ idea. Will there be notes or video from the conference? I looked through the talks page but couldn't find anything that seemed like that.

<comment><USER16> Thanks! The talk is called "The most valuable values". A lot of it will be about "thinking in value semantics" and then I'll show the architecture of interactive software as an example. There will be video, I think :-)

</comment></comment></comment><comment><USER18> My main open source project is [http://zynaddsubfx.sf.net](http://zynaddsubfx.sf.net) and during typical development I wouldn't say that I had promoted it too much. Within the past year or so I did end up doing some fundraising for the project which did turn into a marketing heavy endeavor (videos/marketing only email lists/update posts targeting users/long replies to email or forums/etc). Some of the marketing emails were fun to show off new features, but they did eat a fair amount of time when they were coming out at a reasonable pace. Outside of that one time period the application receives most of its marketing from independent interested users and release announcements.

per the questions:

> 1) why did you start it?

I took over as a maintainer when I wanted to use the application and bugs/missing features were an issue (IIRC it was without a maintainer for ~3 years).

> 2) how did people find it?

Originally the project was marketed via mailing lists/forums/blogs/software review sites/early youtube or pre-youtube videos/etc. After a few years it ended up being presented in an open source community conference. Currently a fair amount of web traffic comes from a few freeware review sites in addition to the general linux community which is spread over a larger variety of sites (and more difficult to pinpoint as most users are going to obtain copies from their package manager rather than the website).

> 3) did you post it somewhere to get traction?

The releases are posted to 2 forums, 2 mailing lists. It's original release was only posted to a single audio based mailing list (AFAIK). When working on fundraising bits were posted to 2 different other mailing lists and information was provided to 3 software review sites, one of which posted the information provided.

> 4) do you think it's unfair to just work on something you like but never > take the time to get the word out?

Nope. You're spending your time working on something. If your goals align with having other people utilize your work, then by all means talk about it, otherwise there's no problem whatsoever with keeping it to yourself. Also consider that marketing for contributors and marketing for users are two (sometimes different) activities.

<comment><USER16> That's a really cool one, thanks for maintaining it! The audio Linux space is kind of niche, but awesome people like you keep it alive :D

EDIT: I find it a bit misleading now that the website shows a screenshot of Zyn-Fusion (which is not open source) instead of ZynAddSubfx. It could be clearer what is what.

<comment><USER18> It's a fair point about which screenshots are shown where, however it should resolve itself fairly soon as the new zyn-fusion UI will be entirely (vs. currently partially) open sourced by year end.

With the whole fltk/ntk vs mruby-zest(zyn-fusion) powered UIs situation the user can either be presented with a complex piece of information on the landing page or an oversimplified version. So far based upon general feedback it seems the oversimplified version is less confusing as when more information was put on the front page people didn't reliably read it.

<comment><USER16> I am very happy to hear that Zyn-Fusion will be completely open sourced. Once again, thanks for this tremendous work. I understand that financing open- source work, specially for end-user programs, is very dificult. Best wishes!

</comment></comment></comment></comment><comment><USER19> I started an open source project a few years ago that was relatively popular within a small community of developers. I started it because I wanted to learn more about certain programming concepts and I wanted some practice at running an open source project. I promoted it by writing a few blog posts and by commenting on relevant posts by other developers. I also answered a fair number of StackOverflow questions with the recommendation to use my project as a solution (and learned early on that you should include the disclaimer that it's your project). It was actually really fun responding to those StackOverflow questions because I got to see how my work could be used, and sometimes that gave me inspiration to make it better. I've also created open source projects that I think are really useful but that I never promoted. I feel like those projects are of less value to the developer community overall, but you never know who might find it useful.

</comment><comment><USER20> I work on mainly one open source library on github. I made sure to submit it to npm and blogged on a big site (thinkmof like tutorial like site for devs) about it once. Other than that, because it's just a useful little module people have interest in, it gets downloaded and discussed naturally.

Another little project I have is a bot for slack, this one was picked up randomly by a person on the internet who decided to do a better Readme.md version as a medium tutorial and got me traction...its pretty good for something this small and useful (I guess) If I were to make this worth marketing efforts, I would:

\- self promote in quora, stackoverflow

\- listen to relevant keywords in twitter and reply to those

\- launch it on HN as a ShowHN

\- find all relevant subreddits, contribute a little then self promote

\- give a talk at local meetup community or lightning talk about it.

As you can see my suggestions, they match pretty much what you would do in non oss projects to get some traffic going Btw I loved this question

</comment><comment><USER21> Speaking from experience. Often the marketing bit is the part that gets left out. Partly because of time reasons and partly because the passion driving the tech means that gets the focus.

</comment><comment><USER22> It's a good question, one I've wondered quite a bit about. I know IndieHackers has some info on this.

Personally, when I'm building side projects I spend 100% on dev for the first month. then when it's released I spend 90% of the time on marketing.

Anyone can code up a project or learn how to do it. The hardest part is getting word out to others. Even, just getting people to try it takes huge amounts of time and effort and money. Often times it seems like it takes more marketing work than development work.

For instance, I've been helping people prevent bugs in their code with my Regression testing platform: [https://swif.club/?s=h2](https://swif.club/?s=h2)

But, doing so without seeming spammy takes a lot of time and patience.

</comment><comment><USER23> I created an open source project called WarpSpeed for provisioning servers and deploying node, ruby, php, python, and html projects.

[https://github.com/warpspeed/warpspeed](https://github.com/warpspeed/warpspeed)

The project started because I had a need to get my code deployed quickly and easily with an affordable VPS provider like Linode or Digital Ocean. As a developer, I wasn't a fan of devops so I figured I would script everything so I only had to do it once.

The project has been through many iterations. I once had the whole thing written in ansible, but I went to bash since it is neutral ground. I released it open source because it feels good to share and get feedback. I now have sample projects in a lot of popular frameworks based on contributions of some friends.

I have done almost no marketing, but the project has seen some adoption with code schools since it makes the deployment process so simple. It also models development best practices by using git (push to deploy) and having a development environment that matches production (using vagrant).

I think marketing is hard for a lot of developers and creators, myself included. Everybody has something they are good at and being both a good creator and marketer is a rare combination it seems. I don't think this should stop us from creating, but perhaps it would be a good idea to partner with a friend that has marketing talent.

Thanks for offering me the opportunity to share here. :) If any of you give WarpSpeed a try, please let me know what you think.

</comment><comment><USER24> The rule in the film business is that success comes from a 50:50 division of production and marketing expenses. For open source projects that equates to spending about the same time on promotion as on coding. Of course that can include running a public forum or so.

If that's just not your bag, maybe team up with someone who loves your creation but hates coding, and would derive satisfaction from writing documentation, running a forum, or promoting it. Then, listen to each other.

</comment><comment><USER25> 1) I not maintain icecream [https://github.com/icecc/icecream/](https://github.com/icecc/icecream/) I didn't start it, I took it over because the other maintainers moved on and I badgered them enough with about a couple patches that they made me maintainer. (theoretically they still are maintainers, but I don't think they even look at it any more)

2,3) People mostly have known about this project. There are a lot of old blog posts. One advantage of a project being 10 years old is people may not have used it, but they have heard of it so when they (or someone they know) need it we come to mind.

4) Unfair? that depends. There are a lot of open source projects that are useful to exactly one person. If this is your project it is unfair to waste every bodies time marketing something they will not need. If you cannot honestly say the project is useful to someone else the time spent on marketing is a waste. In particular a lot of projects are started despite an existing project doing similar things (often as a fork), it is a lot of work to give the new project something that is compellingly better for more than just you.

On that note, I'll note that icecream and distcc do similar things. I have spoken to the maintainers of distcc and we agree with the principal that the features of icecream should be ported into distcc and then icecream killed. However since we forked distcc has got their own versions of our features. There are specific cases where only one way works, while the next the other way is the only one that works. As such I don't think we will ever port back despite a desire to do so.

</comment><comment><USER26> Not nearly enough :)

My most popular open source project is Jadelet[1], the frontend templating language nobody asked for. It was primarily made to solve my own problems so promoting it was secondary to coding it.

Most of my other projects are apps that happen to be open source but people experience them through the app much more than through the code, things like pixel editors[2], music makers[3], web based zine based operating systems[4], things like that. In those cases I spend much more time marketing the experience rather than the code or "open source" nature of the project, but again I probably don't spend nearly enough time marketing.

Thanks for reminding me to do more marketing :) aaaand... linkspam! Hopefully my ironic self-aware promotion style will be perceived as endearing and disarming rather than heavy handed and unsubtle.

[1]: [https://jadelet.com](https://jadelet.com) [2]: [https://pixieengine.com](https://pixieengine.com) [3]: [https://danielx.net/composer/](https://danielx.net/composer/) [4]: [https://whimsy.space](https://whimsy.space)

</comment><comment><USER27> I don't know if it's popular, but last year we released PullToRefresh.js[1]

1) We started it because other options out there required to change the whole structure for our site, so the focus with ptr.js was to make it as easy as possible.

2) + 3) The initial traction was on HN of course, but from there we got a mention on a few major twitter accounts, tympanus and a lot of development blogs.

4) I believe yes, it's unfair. You've put quite some time on creating a thing just to be ignored by the world because it's not clear enough what it does (there are a lot of OSS out there that doesn't have a demo link, it's hard to find, or the description is not clear enough). You should spend a few hours on the presentation; it doesn't need to be visually awesome (altough it helps), just think what would it be like if you stumbled upon this project and you knew nothing. What would you like to know? Where to check it without downloading? If it's not possible to demo it online, a gif or video might help.

1: [https://www.boxfactura.com/pulltorefresh.js/](https://www.boxfactura.com/pulltorefresh.js/)

</comment><comment><USER28> Note that "marketing" includes a lot more than what you're asking, which I believe is closer to "promotion", or "publicising".

Marketing is traditionally understood as the complete relationship of product and market, including, for example, deciding on a set of features, naming, pricing (yeah, I know–but choice of license may be a close analogue), connecting with other products, and much more.

</comment><comment><USER29> 0- My open source project is: [https://github.com/service- bot/servicebot](https://github.com/service-bot/servicebot) Website: [https://servicebot.io](https://servicebot.io)

1- We started it because we were tired of sending manual invoices to our clients for custom web application development work. We couldn't connect our invoices, customers, and services we provided to our customers in a single place. So we built Servicebot to automate the process of invoicing through Stripe. Creating a self service portal for customers to order more work, approve existing and future work. And we open sourced.

2- We have been writing blog content to show people how Servicebot will help cut business cost but automating the billing and customer management processes.

3- We have been posting it on Medium, Reddit, HN, and a lot of word of the mouth.

4- I don't think unfair is the right word. I think it's lack of knowledge. We spent a lot more time developing a solution for our itch than to think about marketing and product roll out.

</comment><comment><USER30> I have a pretty small open-source-project -- [https://github.com/Bloomca/redux-tiles](https://github.com/Bloomca/redux- tiles).

It is a library for javascript, which allows you to write less verbose Redux code. I don't have any social media activity (like big number of followers, etc), and had 0 stars, until I've tried to put it on Show HN. It gave me around 100 stars and some momentum, which resulted in 100 stars more over couple of months.

However, it is still a pretty small project, and I can't say that it is used somewhere. I use for myself, as it solves exactly my problems, but don't really think somebody else uses it.

Is it unfair? It depends on your goal -- if you build something for yourself, it is okay (but some marketing definitely won't hurt), but if you really want to share, then I think you should dedicate time on marketing -- meetups, blogs, HN, reddit, etc.

</comment><comment><USER31> I can confirm that for me, most of my own OSS projects serve the singular purpose of scratch-itching. :) Sometimes I feel like a tool that I write is generic enough to be able to serve other people, and I market them a bit (most commonly when someone happens to ask "what do you use to do X?", both in real life and on the internet).

To answer your specific questions, I'll take my most-starred repository, [https://github.com/holocm/holo](https://github.com/holocm/holo) (47 stars).

1) I wanted to use configuration management on my private notebook, but all existing systems seemed to be optimized for much bigger use-cases and have a lot of moving parts that need to be understood. So I thought "It can't be that hard to just deploy a few config files." Classic scratch-itching. What a fool I was. :D

2) As said above, when the discussion happened to come to the configuration mgmt topic, I chimed in and noted that my tool exists. Also, I made a website ([http://holocm.org](http://holocm.org) ) for documentation and a Twitter account ([https://twitter.com/holocm](https://twitter.com/holocm) ) to announce releases, and retweeted the announcements into my private account to spread them.

3) I never did a "Show HN" for some reason. I did, however, give a lightning talk at the 31C3 (the recording is in the pinned tweet on the Twitter account, if you're interested).

4) How is that "unfair"?

Everything you do you do because of some sort of motivation. For me, my OSS projects are all about "I need something that works for me", so a working system on my machine is all the reward that I need. I do a small amount of publicity, such as replying here ;), but not because I _need_ the attention. It's just a nice bonus.

</comment><comment><USER32> I have a small open source react component library for showing speedometer like gauge - [https://github.com/palerdot/react-d3-speedometer](https://github.com/palerdot/react-d3-speedometer)

I created it because I had a need for such a component, and there was almost no such component available. The only one that was available had no documentation.

After I created, I primarily posted in reddit, HackerNews and few react specific websites. Now, I get some organic traffic from search engines and some steady stream of downloads. Among the websites I posted, reddit was the single source of major traffic with some react newsletters/websites coming second.

Personally, I created this component for myself. But after releasing I made couple of major and minor changes based on the use cases for some real time users. That is gratifying for me.

</comment><comment><USER33> Interesting thread.

Apropos, this book may be of interest. I had come across it a while ago; I have read part of it:

Producing Open Source Software

How to Run a Successful Free Software Project

by Karl Fogel

(Consulting: Open Tech Strategies, LLC)

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Fogel](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Fogel)

Excerpt from his Wikipedia page:

[ Karl Fogel is an author, software developer, Executive Director of copyright activist non-profit Question Copyright,[1] and former board member of the Open Source Initiative where he served as the Board Treasurer.[2] His work, Producing Open Source Software, is a well referenced source of information about the human side of open source software.[3][4] Fogel is currently updating the Creative Commons licensed (CC BY-SA 4.0[5]) book to a second edition following a successful crowdfunding campaign on Kickstarter.com.[6] ]

</comment><comment><USER34> I wrote laboratory[1] after reading a blog post by github[2] and deciding it'd be useful in Python. Other than riding on the coattails on the popularity of the blog post and the original ruby library, I posted it to hacker news where it did fairly well.

There've been a few external contributions and there are definitely some users, but I'm not too sure how many. I don't think it's the sort of project that has much ongoing development, so it's not something a community would form around.

[1] [https://github.com/joealcorn/laboratory](https://github.com/joealcorn/laboratory) [2] [https://githubengineering.com/scientist/](https://githubengineering.com/scientist/)

</comment><comment><USER35> I've contributed to lots of open source software, but the only one I can say I actually started and maintained was an open source video card driver back in the early 2000s. I pretty much didn't market or promote it at all. I think I posted once to USENET letting people know their video card now had a Linux driver. That was enough to attract a relatively small (<10) but talented group of people who pretty much took it from there. One of them even set up a web site for it and ended up maintaining it. It made it into the kernel eventually and is still there today.

I didn't really care in the slightest about vanity metrics like how many people were using it or how many people were contributing code. I wrote it because I bought a piece of hardware and it didn't work with Linux.

</comment><comment><USER36> I made a tool that can help traders (in cryptocurrency markets) automate their TA based strategies. I am not sure what you consider popular, since this project is definitely in a niche space (so reach is limited). I used to post it here and there, but since it's an open source hobby project I don't feel the need to go out of my way to let new people know about it.

1\. I started the project to learn more about automated trading and cryptocurrency markets, and working on it to this day still scratches that itch.

2\. Searching Github, Google and Reddit I guess.

3\. I used to be quite active on an online forum that was basically the full community (bitcointalk).

4\. I do think so yes, it depends on why you are doing open source.

The project is: [https://gekko.wizb.it/](https://gekko.wizb.it/)

</comment><comment><USER37> It definitely depends on the audience you are trying to reach. I just finished building a feature selection algorithm to plug into sklearn: [https://github.com/chasedehan/BoostARoota](https://github.com/chasedehan/BoostARoota)

I'm also trying to figure out the best ways to do that. What my plan is: 1) I presented it last week at the ODSC West Conference and have seen a couple people use it and give me some comments. 2) I am planning on incorporating the algorithm into some Kaggle kernels so people can see its value. It definitely works better than some other outlets. 3) Respond on Quora or other places for cases when it might be useful 4) Shamelessly plug on HN ;)

</comment><comment><USER38> Good projects speak for themselves. Use cases, code design, documentation, commit history, ... should be setup well right from the beginning. Then simply speaking with everybody who might be interested in your project should start spreading your project into the wild.

<comment><USER28> There seems to be ample evidence against this idea, namely that I cannot think of a single commercial product that is not in some way promoted. Surely, there would be a few products that are good enough to get the best return on investment from allocating all resources to improving the product? But even cocaine cartels run CRM operations.

Yeah, I'm sure there are a few companies that don't spend money on advertisement. But those are probably allocating quite a lot of resources to making sure you know they're not advertising.

</comment></comment><comment><AUTHOR> Thanks everyone for your super insightful comments. I cannot believe so many creators of popular projects have replied with such so many details.

After reading it thoroughly I think the most common advice breaks down to make it super easy to install (this includes writing great documentation). Write blog posts about it (on medium is best i guess?) and create videos to demo it and always be eager to reply to questions on SO, etc.

Also majority of people think that if you've put in the effort to create the software you gotta put some effort in marketing too.. I was really on the fence for this, but thanks for the motivation!

</comment><comment><USER39> Artha ([http://artha.sourceforge.net](http://artha.sourceforge.net)), an offline open source, cross-platform English thesaurus built atop WordNet.

I had to publizie it in the Ubuntu Forums where I got good traction: suggestions, appreciation, feature requests. It eventually made it into the Debian repo and now is in most distro repos including Fedora, Suse, etc.

I'd say it was equally fun for me to get the feedback and incorporate it back into the system. I enjoyed it as much as coding it.

</comment><comment><USER12> I'm the author and the only maintainer of Bt, Java 8 BitTorrent library: [https://github.com/atomashpolskiy/bt](https://github.com/atomashpolskiy/bt). As of today, it has received 1136 stars.

I've started it quite literally to scratch my own itch: after having upgraded to a newer OS X, I found out that my favorite torrent client does not launch anymore. I've already been thinking about starting my own OSS project for some time (I contribute to a number of OSS as part of my job), so the decision came naturally to me.

It was clear to me upfront, that at some point the project will become too large for one person to take care of everything, and I will have to look for co-maintainers. So from the very beginning I've been spending a lot of time writing documentation, examples and polishing README, and of course paying a lot of attention to overall design "quality".

All of these things paid off, and each posting, be it on Reddit, StackOverflow, Quora or HN, received some attention, stars and downloads. People have started to post bugs and questions, and this contributed considerably to my motivation to continue working on the project.

In August I've added a GIF animation of the CLI component to the README and submitted a yet another ShowHN: [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14911372](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14911372). It was a blast! The project received several hundred of stars over the course of two days, and the feedback was also very insightful and helpful.

> do you think it's unfair to just work on something you like but never take > the time to get the word out

I honestly believe, that this is in fact an obligation for the author to get the word out, IF the project might be of interest to someone besides the author himself. Otherwise, why make this software open source in the first place?

I'd also recommend the following read for a more step-by-step advice on marketing of amateur OSS projects: [https://blog.cwrichardkim.com/how-to-get- hundreds-of-stars-o...](https://blog.cwrichardkim.com/how-to-get-hundreds-of- stars-on-your-github-project-345b065e20a2?gi=5c39a73e1a8d).

</comment><comment><USER40> This Ask HN was very timely for me. I just launched my first OS project -- a python based replacement for subscription management services such as Chargebee or Chargify.

I am looking for contributors -- if you are interested in this space, please contact me.

[https://github.com/michael-stajer/stripe-subscription- scaffo...](https://github.com/michael-stajer/stripe-subscription-scaffold- python)

<comment><USER40> Got my first star from someone here -- thank you for following me!

</comment></comment><comment><USER41> Really depending on project.

For pretty Easy privacy we do a lot [https://pep.foundation](https://pep.foundation). For my small side projects like pyPEG or YML2 I'm doing nearly nothing [https://fdik.org/yml](https://fdik.org/yml) [https://fdik.org/pyPEG2](https://fdik.org/pyPEG2)

</comment><comment><USER42> We (Changelog) are happy to help spread the word (via our newsletter, podcasts, twitter, etc) about awesome open source projects. If you have something you'd like us to consider, hit us up here:

[https://github.com/thechangelog/ping/issues](https://github.com/thechangelog/ping/issues)

</comment><comment><USER43> I've just been wondering this, as I am starting the process of getting my own open-source project out there ([https://github.com/JedS6391/LGP/](https://github.com/JedS6391/LGP/)).

If anyone has any tips for sharing machine learning frameworks, I'd be very interested!

</comment><comment><USER44> project page: [https://mhogomchungu.github.io/zuluCrypt/](https://mhogomchungu.github.io/zuluCrypt/)

>> why did you start it

I bought an external hard drive and i wanted to encrypt it just because i could,i already knew about TrueCrypt but it felt like a window's solution and i wanted a native linux GUI application.

>> how did people find it.

"Organic" google searches played a part in people finding out about it but i post and talk about it in various forums i see the project discussed. I google the name of the project around once a week and i answer any questions/bug people report in various online forums.

>> did you post it somewhere to get traction

I occasionally post in various linux forums and reddit on new releases.

</comment><comment><USER45> We maintain MFCard an easy to integrate payment UI for iOS.

To gain the initial momentum we did following:

\- Sharing with local community meetups

\- Sharing with CocoaPods & other component websites

\- Sharing with Top Github repository who maintain 'Awesome Lists'

</comment><comment><USER46> A lot. I think most of what set us up as a company people liked was marketing/promotion/community management and support.

</comment><comment><USER47> 0

</comment><comment><USER48> Marketing is getting something of value on the shelf.

Advertising is making sure it doesn't stay there.</comment>


Occipital launches low-cost AR/VR tracking platform for all-in-one headsets - <AUTHOR> https://techcrunch.com/2017/05/31/occipital-launches-low-cost-arvr-tracking-platform-for-all-in-one-headsets/ <comment><AUTHOR> Really impressive video of their tech showing Monocular 6-DoF Positional Tracking. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVdWED6kfKc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVdWED6kfKc)</comment>


Visual Studio Code 1.3 – now with tabs - <AUTHOR> https://code.visualstudio.com/updates/June_2016 <comment><USER2> Personally, I always thought Visual Studio Code was interesting, but I didn't like the lack of Vim support. So I spent the last month working on the VSCodeVim extension, and now I think it's much better.

If lack of Vim key bindings has been putting you off, give it a shot now! (And if there's anything missing, log it as an issue in our repository - we'll try to get to it quickly. [https://github.com/VSCodeVim/Vim](https://github.com/VSCodeVim/Vim))

</comment><comment><USER3> Previous discussion: [https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12052525](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12052525)

</comment><comment><USER4> yasss, i was so slow in vs code without navigatable tabs, which have pretty much become standard thanks to sublime and atom.</comment>


Grading the Presidential Candidates on Science - <AUTHOR> http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/grading-the-presidential-candidates-on-science/ <comment><USER2> These were hardly scientific questions. It's just more political B.S. and it's obvious that their answers were graded on how much the reader agreed with/enjoyed the answers.</comment>