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Polymer framed striker fired handguns are all the rage at the moment, but there's always something that bugged me about them. The basis of the guns are a metal chassis, but in order to make the frame they mold the chassis into the frame itself. That always struck me as a lazy solution to the problem of integrating metal and plastic to form the firearm, and apparently the guys at SIG SAUER thought so too. Building on the earlier P250 platform, they've created a truly modular striker fired handgun . . .
While I touched briefly on the impetus for the modular design in my first impressions article, there's another facet to the need for a modular handgun: the military. Tired of needing to buy multiple handguns to suit different roles (carry guns for military police, combat firearms for soldiers, concealable compact guns for investigators) the military has been wanting to replace their existing hodgepodge collection with a single model that can be configured on the fly to meet any mission requirement.
The drive to find the one gun is called the MHS or Modular Handgun System competition, and should be kicking off within the next few months. While SIG was always keeping the civilian market in mind, the true reason behind the P320 is the military's MHS competition.
While some firearms can arguably be called modular (a caliber change kit or interchangeable backstraps perhaps?) nothing really comes close to the P320 in its ability to change almost every major feature of the gun. The pistol disassembles in just a few seconds into its constituent parts, and the entire metal chassis of the gun — the serialized part that is technically the "firearm" in the eyes of the ATF — slides completely free of the frame. That chassis is also designed to fit exactly into the existing grips for the P250, meaning that there are already aftermarket parts available that will fit the 320.
In case you haven't figured out exactly how big a deal this is, let me give you some examples.
Instead of needing to buy a completely different firearm for your big-handed self and your small-handed girlfriend, now you only need to buy a new smaller frame for her at a cost of about $50.
If you want to change from a 9mm to a 45ACP gun you don't need a new firearm, just pay $350 to your parts supplier of choice and a conversion kit will arrive at your doorstep with everything you need to get running with your new chosen caliber…no FFL required. Or if you want to go from a full size gun to a compact carry version, $400 for a new barrel and grip is all you need.
And if you decide become a shade tree gunsmith with a soldering iron and add some aggressive stippling to your firearm — and then immediately regret your decision — you can replace the grip cheaply and easily.
But for competitors, the biggest benefit might be the ability to take your trigger group of choice, the one you've polished and tweaked and perfected to get it just the way you like it, and swap it between guns without any issues. Another benefit of the 320's easily-removed metallic bits is that you can clean the gun remarkably easily. No muss, no fuss, no trying to shove Q-tips into hard-to-reach nooks and crannies.
So, the gun is a technological step forward. But the real question is how well it works on the range, and for me it's something of a mixed bag.
The gun really does feel slick. The finish on the slide is as satin-smooth as any of their other firearms, and the overall design is extremely appealing. They've departed from the traditional SIG-y look a little bit and took a chance, and it seems to have worked. It's a more modern, stylized SIG SAUER handgun, and personally I think it looks fabulous.
Firing the gun, it feels exactly as solid as any of the all-metal firearms already in SIG Sauer's line. Polymer handguns can tend to have a more toy-like feel to them, but the P320 is built like a brick house. Recoil is no worse than with any other 9mm handgun, and the sights are the same ones from my P226 — slim but useful.
Instead of their traditional grip angle, SIG has gone for a slightly steeper approach. So moving from the FNH USA FNS-9 to the P320 it takes a couple of seconds to get acquainted with how the gun points, but it starts feeling natural pretty quickly. The angle is closer to what I would call "neutral" for me at least, closer to the normal cant of my hand than other handguns.
Other small improvements include metallic magazines (which everyone except GLOCK uses these days), night sights and a very conveniently placed magazine release button. There's also a full-length Picatinny rail (as opposed to the proprietary SIG rails on other guns) at the front of the gun for all your attachment needs.
SIG's Kevin Brittingham wants me to start using this as my competition handgun. And while I agree that it has some great features, there are two specific issues that give me some pause about making the switch.
Issue #1 is that, as-is fresh out of the box, the 320's trigger isn't perfect. But let me give you a little back story to illustrate how small of a nit-pick this is.
In striker fired handgun designs, you have to partially reset the firing pin using the forward motion of the slide. The trigger pulls the firing pin back the rest of the way and releases it, but if you used the trigger 100% for the firing pin reset, that makes it a long and heavy trigger pull. Most striker fired guns have somewhere between 60% and 70% of the firing pin reset accomplished by the slide's cycling motion, which gives the shooter some take-up in the trigger before the break and makes the trigger pull a bit heavy. SIG sets their triggers at 90%. That means minimal take-up, but it also requires them to set the trigger pull at a heavier weight to keep the shooter from accidentally touching off rounds.
The effect of that 90% setting is twofold. First, there's no segmentation in the 320 trigger — it's a solid piece and feels like any of their other triggers, which I like. But second, the way the trigger breaks due to the artificially increased pull weight just has too much roll for my preference. I like crisp and clean triggers, and this gun doesn't have one.
That's not to say that the trigger is bad. It's way better than either the stock GLOCK or S&W M&P triggers. It's just not perfect. Yet. The good news: replacing the trigger is easy as pie when they come out with a new version.
Issue #2 is the height of the gun. As with all SIG SAUER's handguns, I find that there's more material above my hand than with other brands. A higher bore axis means that it has a longer arm and therefore more felt recoil. But it's no more than I feel when I fire my P226. That higher bore is a function of the way the metal trigger insert is designed, since it can't protrude down into the magazine well (where most polymer framed handguns hide their internal bits) and instead needs to stay above the level of the hand.
The picture above is a side by side comparison of the P320 with my FNS-9 handgun. As you can see, the P320 is a little bit bigger — emphasis on the little. We're talking a difference of maybe 10%. But like I said, these are small issues.
So there are my two relatively minor issues with the gun. Everything else is exactly as you'd expect with a SIG handgun, including my propensity to ride the slide release and keep the gun from locking back on the last round. But as for that, they are indeed working on an improved design to put a stop from the inadvertent malfunctions once and for all. Ultimately though, the question is how well it shoots.
I honestly don't think I could do better even with my Wilson Combat 1911. The gun is a tackdriver.
Overall, what we have here is a truly modular handgun that actually functions really well. With the exception of two relatively minor gripes, the gun is an ideal choice for someone looking for a striker fired handgun. And based on my experience, I'd recommend this over either the GLOCK or the S&W M&P without any hesitation.
Chamber: 9mm (or .357 SIG, or 45ACP, or…)
Barrel: 4.7″
Capacity: Ships with 2x 17 round magazines (as allowed by law)
Ratings (Out of Five Stars):
All ratings are relative compared to the other weapons in the gun's category. Overall rating is not mathematically derived from the previous component ratings and encompasses all aspects of the firearm including those not discussed.
Accuracy: * * * * *
The gun is more accurate than I am.
Ergonomics: * * * *
The grip angle takes a little getting used to for more experienced shooters, but it works. The height of the bore axis, however, is an issue.
Reliability: * * * * *
No malfunctions whatsoever.
Customization: * * * * *
Customization is what the 320 is all about. You can convert it from a 9mm long slide competition handgun into a compact 45ACP self defense gun in roughly 30 seconds. And while caliber conversion kits are yet to be released (they're on their way) the grips are already on sale. And all P250 grips will fit the P320.
Overall Rating: * * * *
It's not perfect. Well, not yet anyway. A crisper trigger would go a long way. But out of the box, the gun is about three and a half stars. Factor in the insane level to which you can customize this gun and it earns a full 4 stars. A truly modular handgun, executed with typical SIG SAUER precision.
201 Responses to Gun Review: SIG SAUER P320
Exactly why would I pick this over a Glock??? Why would I want to change calibers??? The base cost + changing cost is the same as buying two different complete Glocks.
Maintaining the exact same trigger for consistency between calibers.
In some jurisdictions buying that second and third handgun is difficult.
This lets you have them without the hassle of waiting 10 days, and you keep the same trigger.
I think the "multiple guns in one" factor for those is severely freedom-restricted states is the only serious advantage of this kind of modularity for the general retail market. Those of us in states with less restrictive firearms laws often forget what a pain in the ass handgun ownership can be for folks in NJ, MD, and other places like that. So if you can go through the hassles and extra fees just once, then later buy conversion pieces to make the gun fit multiple roles, it might be worth it.
For people in states where you can just walk in to Cabela's and walk back out fifteen minutes later with a brand-new handgun, it's not much of an advantage. The side benefits of the modular system (same trigger, same sights, etc across calibers and frames) don't really outweigh the value of having two fully-functioning guns instead of one.
I am so glad I live in one of those states (Kansas) that I can just walk into Cabela's and walk out with a handgun or shotgun or rifle. I can't even imagine what it would be like not to. I do remember the "Brady Bill" Times though.
I personally love the modularity. It doesn't prevent me from having multiple firearms, but it sure gives me the ability to quickly adapt one to suit another shooter, such as my wife or Son. It also allows me to go from full size to carry in about 2 minutes if I'm not trying to speed trial the swap. I've had Glocks for years because they are dependable utilitarian tools, totally dispensable generic firearms IMHO. I'm replacing them all with the Sig P320's, of which the new X series is particularly exciting. I'm really hoping the new trigger is approaching the sheer delight of the Walter PDQ, which, again, in my opinion, is the pinnacle of triggers in today's striker fired pistol offerings. Your mileage may vary. Anyway, consider me a Sig P320 convert. Shoot what you like but don't turn off your objectivity and become a fanboy for any brand.
There is a downside to the switchable top-half concept; if you damage or break anything in the frame sub-module, ALL your pistols are now non-functional. I've seen this happen to a guy with 4 AR upper assemblies, and one lower receiver group; he broke a single part in the lower, and suddenly realized he no longer had ANY functional .223 rifles/carbines. At that point, he stopped yapping about the advantages of multiple uppers, how much money he had saved, etc.
I don't follow. Replacing the AR stripped lower is $200 or less. If he had to replace a whole gun, that'd be $1000+.
That's a part kit is all.
I have many lowers, but quite often use one, and simply replace the upper. That way I have my favorite trigger, grip, BAD and such.
Many of the other lowers are really test and back up platforms.
Being able to buy an upper without the 4473 hassle and waiting period is golden. I tend to buy lowers when they are on sale and in semi-bulk. Such as 3-5 at a time.
Rokurota, the point is, because he bought-in to the one-lower-multiple-uppers idea, when he broke the part in the lower, he actually had no functional firearms at all until it was repaired. As Xanthro noted in the post below yours, if you have another functional lower assembly, or even an internal parts kit so you can replace anything in the lower that breaks, then you can be up and running again with little to no delay. However, if you only have the one critical assembly and no spares, you are all done until you can get it repaired. I'm sure SIGs stuff is top-notch, but all it would take is a broken spring (probably subcontractor supplied, and therefore difficult to screen 100% for quality purposes), or a lost assembly pin, and all you have left is a pile of mean-looking paperweights.
The cost isn't really the point; even if it was a 25-cent part, you are still unarmed until you can get it delivered and installed. If your guns are range toys only, it's no big deal. If you use them for more serious purposes, then it might be a VERY big deal.
A popular saying with preppers and military folks, that illustrates this concept, is "One is none, and two is one."
Yeah, but four rifles costs $4K+, where as this man's setup, assuming a single lower, could cost 2/3 of that. His mistake is thinking of it as four rifles, when really it's one rifle with four uppers.
Same with this SIG P320. It's one pistol that you can customize for different non-concurrent situations, but I would never think of it as multiple handguns.
Just to let you know if you break the lower of the gun it only cost you $45 dollars to replace the frame instead of buying a whole new gun to me that is differently worth it..
That was my understanding as to why the P250 was invented. Places like Germany and Switzerland allow civilians to own only one handgun. Since only the fire control group counts as a handgun, residents of these countries can legally possess one gun in multiple configurations. Doesn't make as much sense in America, but in Europe it's genius.
Sorry but your completely wrong. I'm swiss and i live in Switzerland. You can have as much guns as you like. Myself, i've got more than 20 guns. In Germany there are some limits but it's also possible to have a lot of guns.
Incorrect. In Germany, you may only own two handguns as a hunter. As a sport shooter, you may own up to four. Most hunters are also sport shooters. As a hunter you may own as many rifles and shotguns as you wish, combination guns are still very popular there (such as the Drilling). You may not carry pistols for self defense, though hunters can carry a handgun for finishing shots. If you own two barrels (i.e., a conversion kit), it is the same as owning two guns, so the conversion would not be an advantage. I know, I was a sport shooter and hunter when I lived in Germany.
Because it isn't a Glock? Has a grip that isn't a reverse engineered brick? Has a smaller tendency to blow up (I presume it has a supported chamber)? Maybe because the sights aren't made by Mattel?
I could go on all day, Glocks are…decent, good enough. Not what I would use if I have a choice/say in the matter but I am not undergunned with one, except if we are talking rifles then again any pistol is inadequate compared to a rifle.
The "ka-boom" fairy tale was just that! When I bought my first Model 22, the all the "metal only" folks I knew said- what the experts discovered is that this was caused mainly by pisspoor reloaded ammo, especially. With worn casings being re-used.
After 22 yrs of carry as a former LEO , my GLOCK OUTSHOT AND OUT LASTED my dept. Issued Smith and Wesson model 5906( a quick rusting , rear sight falling off three times TURD) and two Beretta 92FS models( BOTH had cracked barrel lock lug issues way BEFORE the min. 10,000 rd recommended replacement)
In all fairness I own a Sig 220 safe queen( just love to occasionally shoot it and place it back in box and safe after thoroughly cleaning gawking at it) but the retired carry is my GLOCK 23, with two worn and still ticking GLOCK 21 and 22s sitting in the safe as well .
The new 320 looks good, but at about $750-800, which I know will be the LGS mark up plus local sales tax and CA. DROS, you are reaching the cost of buying two different model GLOCKS!!!
For all the "gotta have it now" folks, who whine about not being able to buy a box load of guns in your respective home state as soon as you walk into the LGS, move to a "wild frontier state" then!( by the way those looser gun law states also have VERY HARSH punishments for gun related stupidity and crime compared to purchase restriction states, so the issue does balance out!)
I live in CA. Which has a 30 day per purchase limit on handguns- no limit on long guns, as well as 10 day back ground, and even then I was able to pick up 8 handguns( pistols) that I wanted and could afford within a year- add to that 6 different rifles, including 3 ARs, my PTR 91, my M-1a, a bolt action Remington, and two 12 gauge shotguns( mossberg 590 and Remington 11-87) all within 3 yrs, and I don't feel "unarmed " or restricted by the Gov't.
The new offering by Sig my get my attention , but from the review here, I don't think it will do more than my GLOCKS , my current Sig, my beretta 8045, or my HK.
The modular system for all those here who champion it as havingn one gun they can configure into many FORGET they will still have only ONE GUN if the fire control group goes out , and the repair and reconfiguring parts STILL cost as much ( nearly 60%) of buying a completely different gun!
This may work for the military, well actually smaller units in the military, like maybe the Coast Guard, but knowing our military, they will probably buy the cheapest functioning competitor- and as we know that would be GLOCK – with bulk military contract buys you could still get two GLOCKS for even one multi cal. 320!
* our military sadly doesn't think our youth joining are too bright, as one of the reasons they even picked beretta was because it had an external "safety", I.E the decocking lever as for some reason general personnel couldn't be thoroughly taught better safety procedures with the vaunted 1911s the M9 was to replace- guess the Marines didn't have such a problem!); our Socom and coast guard already use the Sigs( with safeties!)
You can get them at $550, or online $520-30. This includes night sights. With just contrast they go online mid to high 400's. Buds (an online shop) has some good prices. You probably already know this by now though…eh, I had 30 seconds needing wasting. Well, I hope you know it. Glocks aren't bad, I've got a 17 I love, but I had to put $300 extra into it (night sights zev trigger system). The 320 shoot's just as well, only difference is a longer reset. Oh, and it cost $300 less
Your GLOCK outlasted a 5906? Sure it did. Sure it did.
Changing calibers is if you have a revelation and all of a sudden you want to shoot caliber X over caliber Y, it's less than buying a new gun and all of your holsters will fit said gun. You don't need to lay down another $100+ on aftermarket sights. You'll still be on the hook for all the mags though.
I'm not saying it's the bees knees and don't think I personally would ever use that feature, but I can see some positives for being able to.
Or if one caliber becomes difficult to find, you buy the parts to construct a "new" gun in a different caliber.
when the shtf if one owns other cofigurations and one caliber becomes extinct or another caliber can be procured by any means. One is well prepared
I'll take a SIG over a Glock any day!!
This is a cool idea. Ideally I would prefer the SIg too. But, my bank account would prefer a Gen 4 Glock 17 for $425. They come with 3 mags, and for $125 per barrel can be changed to .357 or 40S&W. Not that I really ever got the caliber change thing. Ammo is expensive enough, I can't imagine the special masochism that leads a person to think, "Gee, I wish I had one gun and needed to buy 3 different types of ammo for it!"
Love to know where you are finding Glocks for $425.
I typically see them for about $550 and a quick search shows they're going for $500, which is a price drop from what I was typically finding earlier this year (average was around $525)
Unless you're talking USED, in which case it is not apples to apples. Also, the $500 is "street" price and not MSRP. MSRP is typically higher though I don't know what Glock is these days because I can't remember ANY time I've purchased a firearm for MSRP (Don't shop at Gander Mountain)
Which is also the GSSF discount price.
I have owned both. Sig's (metal ones) have really great fit and finish, hands down better than Glock. I HATED the DA/SA triggers. I had issues with mine, that Sig fixed for free, and the customer services was amazing. Mags and everything else of them cost more or is something hard to get/find.
That said I only use 9mm these days and I have 3 Glocks in that caliber. I feel there is realistically zero advantage in any other pistol caliber for my hand gun needs, self defense. My Glocks have never broken. Mags are cheap and easy to get, I have a lot of them. After market parts for Glocks are basically everywhere. You want a fancy new holster that just hit the market. 10 out of 10 times there will be a G17 version of that holster the day they are available…..Sigs maybe, probably going to wait a while, maybe never.
I see a Glock 9mm pistol as a tool. Its cheap, stupid simple as a shooter and to maintain, reliable as hell and supported by the entire gun industry.
Ah, now we actually have a sensible argument –
"I see a Glock 9mm pistol as a tool. Its cheap, stupid simple as a shooter and to maintain, reliable as hell and supported by the entire gun industry."
That's how I see Glocks and why I also recommend them to new shooters. It is also why I have no interest in them. They are boring and the ultimate "good enough" handgun. They are good, not great. They have their drawbacks, like every platform, but I can't say they do anything poorly (Please spare me the whole "grip angle" and "reverse-engineered brick" comments). They are the Toyota Corolla of handguns.
The SIG seems more interesting to me. Will I choose it instead of the M&P? I'm still not sure. For one thing I can go buy an M&P for $460 right now, so there's that.
I think you underestimate industry support for SIG, or you are just spoiled to how good the support for Glocks are. As I said elsewhere in the comments, having a less commonly support brand (Magnum Research) I'll show you some poor industry support.
I also want to point out, and in support of your point, Larry, that during the gun run post-Newtown I could find Glock magazines easier than most. Not that the demand wasn't insane for them as well, but with so many manufacturers and already a high volume of production they did tend to turn up. Though they still went fast and were always sold out quickly.
Number of recalls on my new agency issued Sig P226 = 1*
Number of recalls on my personally owned Glock G27 = 0
*The Sig recall was no small matter.
Prefer a CZ over either of those.
I will never pick a Sig over any Glock.
both great guns could not go wrong either way
Agreed. Sig VS Glock? I've got both, and I know Glock is a very popular make, but I'd gladly trade any one of my three Glocks for the same thing in a Sig. Don't need to, because I have more Sigs than Glocks. I'll take a Sig over a Glock any day. I just bought this gun, and I can tell you, it's a mile above a Glock.
I believe the concept came from Germany where you are only allowed two firearms.
Only 2 guns? What a horrible thought.
There's other European countries with similar laws. For instance in France, you can only have 12 registered firearms (including handguns, shotguns and riffles). So if you want a 9mm, a .40S&W, a .45ACP and a .357… you will already have 4 firearms on the total 12 you can legally own. Now add some AR, AK, Remington or even some .22LR (crazy, hu?) and you can quickly top your 12 legal firearms.
Having just one serial number means only one registration, even if you will have several barrels, even if it's SBR for rifle or so (that's the great part, and luckily suppressors don't count either). That's why all firearms with modular system for multi-caliber is very appreciate in those countries.
But for the US, I'm not quite sure it provides any real benefit (but keeping a constant trigger across all calibers). Even from a financial point of view, it might be more interesting to have 5 different firearms. Unfortunately, if the ban-control keep growing in the US and all firearms will required NFA registration (such in Europe), it might be interesting… I don't wish it, but it could happen.
Europe gun laws are clearly what the anti-guns would love for the US. Few decades ago, in France people could have .22 and .25 pocket gun (and even carry them, it was pretty common for ladies to carry some personal defense guns such Derringers in their purses). Then it was banned… Few years ago, they did required to all gun owner to register their guns, including hunter shotguns. French had a lot of guns after WWII (some rest of the French Resistance). Of course, they banned all Full-Auto, and most of "assault weapons"… even some calibers were automatically considered as NFA (such 5.45×39, 5.56×45, 7.62×39, 12.7×99). That's why instead of .223 caliber, we can find some .222 caliber, which is pretty much the same, but doesn't fall under the same law. Unfortunately now, all gun owners are registered with background check, fingerprints, they must be active in a shooting club, go to the range regularly (well, this isn't a bad thing I guess).
But at any time, the government can just ban all guns and remove them from the hands of everyone. Owning a gun is a privilege, unfortunately not a right. And from where I stand, I see the US government that is trying step by step, slowly trying to do the exact same thing… starting with just one little thing (full auto, "assault" cosmetics, etc…) and finally trying everything they can to just control people like they already do in Europe.
Forcing manufacturers to come with some "crazy" design to avoid laws (Sig SB15, Modular design, new calibers, etc…). Don't get me wrong, I love all those new stuff, but I'd prefer them to come because of the shooters demand, not because of a government stupid law.
Long story short: Yeah, modular system might not be a big deal in the US, and pray it will never become one. Otherwise it would just mean US citizens lost their rights.
Yes, while the MSRP says it is at $719, my local shop has it priced at $565. Like just about every other sig handgun (I can't speak for rifles), their MSRP and actual retail are usually a couple hundred below. My P229 was MSRP's at $1,299 and I got it for $980. I think my next handgun will be this sig and $350ish for a full caliber swap isn't a bad price at all…. Hell, I buy 1 more P320 and I can have 4 calibers for $1,830. That's an easy deal and I'm sure I can talk down my gunship dealer $50 if I bought 2 guns in 1 day.
Thanks for the great idea!!!
I own the P250. Paid $424 2 years ago for the 2sum kit. One full size and one sub compact. Purchased the compact exchange kit for $229. So how many Glocks can you purchase for $654?
I like my Glocks. But they became safe queens for me. My Beretta 92, my CZ, all get less action.
Currently found the P320 for $565. One LGS had 4,sold them for $529. I was too late. They will come down.
What sold me on them? One trigger, for all purposes. If the P320 works out, I will be selling off my Glocks.
Because out of the box has real sights, has a better trigger, metal mags, is more accurate, is modular and looks way better.
Not just that it's neat own the Sig Sauer P250 full size 40 S&W with night sights, not a single malfunction, pistol just suffers form poor marketing. It's true early production Sig P250 had issues but today's production isn't the same pistol. Guns made after June 1, 2014 now come with two magazines.
A Sig is a Sig, no Tupperware needed, anybody anywhere in the Devgru unit/ ****ops section of the U.S. Military gets it and understands. Five Stars way up for the Sig 320! Hooyaa !
You should polish your reading skills. The author states, speaking of the trigger…."It's way better than either the stock GLOCK or S&W M&P triggers"….
Huh. Imagine buying a gun for the silly reason that it has a better trigger…
Any indication of light primer strikes? The P250 is the only gun I've ever traded due to poor performance… even after a trip to SIG it still needed a second strike far too often.
Nothing against SIG, I have a 226, 229, and a C3 that are all flawless. I'm curious if the "artificially increased pull weight" you mentioned is a little extra mainspring. Also, how is the reset? I loved the smooth pull of the P250 but the Kahr-esque reset was far too long.
Guessing you had a Gen1. Switching to a Gen2 polymer grip would've likely fixed your issues.
Oliver is correct. This issue was dealt with early. The Sig P250/P320 forum is full of knowledgeable users who can pretty much answer any question you may have. The firearm is one of the easiest to maintain, clean, in my experience.
Until you break one down, and clean it, you have no idea how great a design this pistol is.
How would this fare against the walther ppq?
Nothing can compete against a PPQ. It's so far above the crowd it is barred from comparison.
Thanks. I can sleep better now.
Very good post Nick. I know I appreciate it. I look forward to you doing a part two with information on how it has handled, if the trigger improved with use like CZ's can do, and if it has any durability issues. Also curious about it's ability to get dirty and keep going. I think that is my biggest fear is it being a gun that doesn't tolerate dirt.
Run this as dirty as you want. My gen 2 went 6 months with no cleaning. Went to the range every week. No issues. Cheap wal-mart ball ammo.
Hmmm, looks an awful lot like my brand new C Zed P09, especially the form of the slide (tapered at the front)… But P09 has wonderfully low bore axis, is hammer fired (yay), has a crisp Omega trigger, holds 19 rounds of 9mm (vs 17) and has tritium night sights (and is FDE). Once again, Sig doesn't find it's way into the safe.
From personal experience it is hard to compete with CZ.
Sadly they aren't more known/widespread in the US.
A lot of guys I shoot IDPA with are switching to CZ's, especially the guys who run USPSA for the SP01. Some guys adopted the P09.
They feel nice, but don't leave me feeling like I need to run out and spend all the money to switch platforms.
Sometimes it is better to stay with what you have because of familiarity, I get that. I like the CZ because it is cheap (as in inexpensive) and good. Also easy to get here in Europe.
Those Sphinx pistols are sweet. Too bad they dont come in 40SW. Mags must be a nightmare to get but the pistols appear to be the same CZ clones that were coming out of Solothurn 10 yrs ago, very high quality.
Three friends of mine have between them a 97B, 75 and SP01; I've shot them all and they are all fantastic pistols. I have nothing against CZ and think their products are some of the best in the world. But… that P09… I didn't think it was possible to make a pistol uglier than a Glock.
because then you could have a sig type glock. bonus score!
let's put a cz b sa in the ttag store please.
$400 for a new barrel and grip is all you need. hahahahahah
But you can get it delivered to your front door. No FFL. And for MD, no waiting period, no $10 background check fee, and no 30 day wait between purchases.
Glock mags ARE metal, surrounded with a strong covering of polymer. This new SIG looks like a brick. The high bore axis means you might as well swing a Colt Python around. Never understood this modular craze, you have one serial numbered trigger group, and a couple different frames and slides, which means you still have only ONE usable pistol. For the same money you can buy a subcompact, midsize and full size Glock, which each can use the full size mags.
Don't forget that a Colt Python has a 500 point coolness bonus.
I cut my teeth with a Model 66. Once you get used to staying on target with 6 magnum loads transitioning to a Glock makes you feel like Jerry Miculek.
isn't the 66 a .44 magnum? I am impressed. Gotta agree with the "learn to shoot with a difficult handgun" thing. Shoot with a tuned Nagant then transition to another handgun and you are suddenly lightning fast.
S&W Model 19 or 66 K frames are 357 mag. Standard issue to most LE and several military branches from the 70s to the 90s.
sounds like someone is defending their decision to buy one too many glocks … #urbummed
"Glock mags ARE metal, surrounded with a strong covering of polymer. This new SIG looks like a brick. The high bore axis means you might as well swing a Colt Python around. Never understood this modular craze, you have one serial numbered trigger group, and a couple different frames and slides, which means you still have only ONE usable pistol. For the same money you can buy a subcompact, midsize and full size Glock, which each can use the full size mags."
Glock mags crack and SIG mags are made of metal, so what's your point? Carrying a lightweight 9mm doesn't come close to carrying a Python, which again makes no point because you mentioned the bore axis. The cost of three Glocks would be over $1,500, so how is that cheaper than buying a $500 SIG and a few extra slide assemblies?
I thought the frame of a pistol WAS the pistol according to the ATF. How do I get a new frame without changing serial numbers?
From what I understand the trigger pack has the serial number, thus according to your laws it is the firearm AKA the gat.
Basically, this gun (and the P250 before it) show what a silly sham the "serialized part is the firearm" ATF rule really is. Basically, wherever the manufacturer puts the serial number on a piece of metal (as long as the ATF says it's OK) is the "firearm". On handguns, it's usually the frame, but there's no hard and fast rule that says it has to be. So on this system, that little metal chassis is the gun.
The ATF decides what part of every gun is the "firearm" part. It varies from gun to gun, many are the barreled receiver portion, HK MP5/94/SP89, Sig 551/556, ACR…
Interesting concept but as several other people commented I will take a pass. I already havepistols in 22lr, 9mm and 45 ACP. My normal carry guns are all hammer fired, SA only pieces with smoother and shorter pull triggers than any striker fired pistol. I do have two Springfield plastics but they have been relegated to airplane travel guns.
Those "springfield plastics", you have them because they are undetectable, right? Just like the Glock 7.
Yep, just waltz through the security and they never know. And I use stealth bullets too.
I just print my ammo, much easier that way. Plus the color matches my Glock 7.
This might become very cool, once the prices and availability fall in. $400 is still a little much to change the caliber of already mid-high price pistol. But the further south of that It gets, the more it becomes something you can deal with.
An interesting design that may be a dream come true for armorers in police departments and military units. We will have to wait and see how well it goes over in the civilian sector.
Before I scream out loud (and I'm only into the second paragraph) do me a favor Nick and learn the difference between passive language and active language. Your writing can be so much more powerful if you write using active language.
Care to share a few examples of where he used passive voice and where using active voice would have made the writing "powerful"? Not sure any gun review is going to blow someone's socks off, from a literary point of view.
Care to share a few examples of where he used passive voice
If they're there, I'm not finding them…
It's amusing to see the usual "It's not a Glock! Why would I want it?".
The modularity is a convenience factor and possibly just a gimmick. Take that away and it still looks like a solid handgun. My experience with Glocks is that they are solidly OK handguns. Good, but not great, and definitely overhyped. Don't get me wrong, I always recommend the Glock 19 to new shooters looking for a home defense weapon that don't know what to get and don't want to try out a bunch of guns. I have yet to see another platform that so easily fits a generic class of shooter.
For someone who enjoys shooting though, Glock doesn't do it for me. This SIG looks interesting and maybe fixes the sins of the P250. I won't be lining up for an early model though. That said, I have been considering an M&P and now I am thinking of waiting until the 320 gets the kinks out first (if there are any). I'm also interested in seeing what the final street price is. It looks good, but is it $200 better than the competition?
Then make it about CZ vs Sig. Why would you buy this over a CZ P09? The value the P09 comes in at is sensational, they're tack drivers, and have a great trigger.
I don't see Sig doing anything here that is a "gotta have" that can't be had at a lower price point.
From a competition standpoint: Has a better trigger than a glock or M&P, so does the CZ. Has a higher bore axis than the Glock & M&P & CZ.
But it's modular!
I guess I'm too utilitarian to get the fascination with Sigs, apart from their beautiful "1911" line up.
SIGs have a stellar reputation and support for them in terms of holsters, magazines, and accessories is much easier in the US than a CZ.
Believe me, I have an "off-brand" handgun and while I love my Jericho the fact is that owning it is a regular chore in terms of finding magazines, holsters, etc. There are days I just want to chuck it and go find something a little more common to US shooters.
CZ makes awesome handguns, but after the trials of owning a Magnum Research I am very hesitant to go with a brand that doesn't have wider support. The internet does not always make up for that lack of support at the local level either.
I understand, but all of my LGS's are starting to stock more and more CZ's, and carry about as many as they do Sigs (not counting 1911 variants). Could be a local thing.
Great review, thanks.
I really wish SIG would move the slide release further down the frame toward the muzzle on all their handguns.
As a lefty, I agree absolutely. Working anything but a 1911 or a Glock as a left-hander is a pain in the ass.
Kevin, one reason I purchased the P250. I am a lefty. Ambi slide release, plus, with a paperclip, change the mag release to the other side in about 1 minute.
You can change the mag release to the other side on all of sig's classic line of pistols.
As a lefty, perhaps you should try a firearm that actually has left handed or ambidextrous controls, instead of complaining you are unable to actuate a right thumb lever with your left trigger finger.
Stated otherwise, why ask them to move it forward, instead of moving it or duping it to the right side of the frame, which would allow you to use a proper manual of arms?
I am not left-handed, but my brother is.
You can change the mag release to the other side on all of sig's classic line of pistols."""
Yes but the 250 and 320 are done much easier. sig recommends that a certified armorer does the change on their Classic P series. Do it wrong and you may find yourself with a cracked frame trying to get it out.
Shot the 320 for the second time today in a match. Getting to love the trigger over my more standard 226. Funny think that at the same event two Glocks went down. Another 320 that had 6000 rounds through it without cleaning worked flawlessly.
Two many try to compare it to the 250 which is not even close.
One, for over 50 years, my "competitive" shooting has been limited to recreational trap & skeet. The rest of my "competitive shooting" with rifle, shotgun, handgun, has been at the street level as a LEO and/or CHL/CCW carry. An important point many folks are missing is that little thing-a-ma-jig is a properly called a slide STOP or LOCK, NOT a slide release. If one pays attention, they would notice that at nearly all levels of competition, including LEO training, the emphasis is to rack the slide for a positive release and FULL forward impetus for positive feeding/chambering and NOT hit that little slide stop/lock. The primary reason is that the slide stop/lock is designed to be obscure so as to NOT be inadvertently activated. Plus, for those that own and shoot several makes of pistols, that device is often located in a different place depending on manufacturer.
Over the many years I have worked at our local range, I have found that more people shooting a 1911 style pistol "ride the slide stop" than they do with where SIG places it on their non-1911 style guns.
The SLIDE, on the other hand, is ALWAYS on top of the pistol! It doesn't matter what make, model or whether one is right or left handed, etc., the slide is ALWAYS in same place. And dropping the slide into battery is MORE important than trying to lock the slide back manually. Even the training for support (AKA weak) hand shooting involves using the rear sight (or a part/portion of the slide) being hooked to the belt or other object to rack the slide (releasing the slide stop). If one is at the highest level of competing AND NO ONE is shooting back, a fraction of a second for those high-speed, low drag operators may change which winners ribbon they take home. But, on the street, there are no alibis and the word "oops" is NOT appropriate!
Just my $.02 and 50+ years experience worth, almost all at street level.
To summarize, in my humble, but extensively experienced opinion, it doesn't matter where the slide stop/lock is except when clearing a gun. My old saying is "There are those that CAN shoot no matter how bad the gun and there are those that CAN'T shoot no matter how good the gun!!!" So, one can throw all those other "excuses" like "high bore axis, trigger pull, trigger reset, ambi, non-iambi, paddle vs button mag release, match grade barrel, etc. all in the same bucket!!!
BigFED says:
Awesome reply – on TAC unit for over 12 years, shot a Sig 226 – loved it. One day Chief decided to go to Glock, wanted the 45 calibre. Made sense, so Glock offered a great deal to department. I shot well with both, but loved my Sig. I have never been a Glock fan or a striker fire trigger fan. My last duty weapon was a HK USP 40, I chose over the Glock. I have nothing bad to say about Glock at all, just not my preference for off duty carry. Yesterday, I broke down purchased the P320. Time will tell if I like it. I did own a P250, first gen Sig. It was the biggest piece of junk ever made. I also have owned the Walther PPQ in a 40. Awesome trigger and gun. The biggest problem with Walther – Slide release, as BigFED said, with my grip it was in the way. Always running dry with slide not locking back or locking slide back by accident. I either had to change shooting style or get ride of gun. I chose get rid of gun. 25 years of LEO, I was not changing shooting style for a gun, not matter how good trigger was. Big FED I agree with you.
50+ years of street level shooting. And not all in LE. Must be a rough neighborhood. I do agree with the blah blah blah portion of your post wherein folks nit pick the heck out of some aspect of a gun that most folks (especially me) may not even know exists. Is it reliable? Can you handle it well and put metal on target? That's what matters. I tend to look for nuggets of info in any review and usually ignore 95% of what is written. I am especially skeptical when someone drones on about their training and experience, since that does not necessarily add any credibility to their position. After all, there is 25 years of experience, then there is one year of experience 25 times.
Great review! Thanks.
Seems a cool choice for a long(ish)-slide .45acp HD gun; add a upper/lower for carry, we're in business. You can even run a WML on the HD frame, and a laser on the carry frame.
Its like tactical legos.
Every once in a while, I'd love Nick to review a handgun from a competitors standpoint.
Would you run this over a 34, M&P Pro, XD Tactical, or FNS 5″?
If the P320 runs like my P250, my answer would be yes. I have owned the 34, the Smith,and the XD. No experience with the FN. Too much trouble / expense / other issues them for me to keep. Gave the Glock 34 to my son (he is selling it, wants a new 1911 ), sold the Smith (not dependable for me), XD went away simply because I did not like it ( although I REALLY wanted too when I bought it ).
"runs"… what's that mean to you? Sigs are rare in IDPA/USPSA at the high levels. Given the amount of money over and above the stock configuration that folks pour into their gaming guns, it ain't the initial price tag that is deterring them.
The gun club I belong to has some member only matches. Not the fancy "sanctioned" or official type. We use the basic setup as IDPA and USPSA.
However, we use any pistol, revolver we want, no different divisions and all that stuff. We simplify the scoring as well. We keep it safe. More about the enjoyment, than competition. You do however, get a good idea how your firearm functions in that environment.
Now I REALLY want one. As soon as my LGS gets one I'm upgrading from my P250.
The slide looks almost identical to my CZ P-09. In fact, except for the hammer and decocker/safety, the two guns are remarkably similar-looking.
Much like a sofa-bed is neither a good sofa nor a good bed, anything "modular" will never be better than something purpose built.
That said its an interesting concept and a nice review.
Totally agree. When you try to be everything to everybody with the modularity you are really nothing to nobody. Good idea in the lab but a bad idea in practice.
I think you mean try to be everything to everyone and you end up being nothing to everyone.
Nothing to Nobody means: Nobody thinks the thing is Nothing. Double negatives are positive.
Once Bill Clinton's wife take office and makes life miserable for us gun owners, non serialized part changes are going to be a necessary feature.
Are there metal inserts molded into the frame that the slide moves forward and backward on? Or are they only in the trigger group component?
No, the slide moves on ramps, or "lips" (whatever the official description ) of the FCU (Fire control unit). This is the serialized trigger and hammer or striker portion of the firearm.
Interesting design. I won't be running out to get one as I have every pistol caliber I really want two are CZ designs and my XD40 can be converted to 9mm with a $150 dollar barrel swap.
Do we have confirmation all the p250 exchange kits will still work?
Confirmed by Sig, magazines also.
I like the accuracy, and the concept. Nice review, sir.
So I can swap the fire control of a 320 into a 250 and have a striker fired 250? If so, will sig sell just the fire control group?
Also when you say the reset is 90% does that mean you have to release the trigger 90% of the pull length to get it to reset? That is one of the downsides of the 250 is that there is no quick reset. I was hoping the 320 had a short reset.
In order:
Not likely – as far as I can tell they don't sell the p250 fcg alone, either.
90% reset refers to the amount the stiker is reset by the recoil action. Trigger reset is mechanically separate.
When you handled it, did it seem like it would be possible to turn it into a single stack gun? Because if this thing can go from full-size to an M&P Shield, my money will be spilling out of my pockets for this thing.
How long before someone reverse engineers the FCG and sells 80% kits?
Since it looks like stamped and folded sheet metal, you might be able to scratchbuild it.
It would be perfectly legal to make, but illegal to sell without a serial #.
Can it restrike? I assume it can't, I just want to hear it for sure. If not for the rumored HK striker-fired gun being able to restrike, and Sig's long history with DA, I wouldn't bother asking. That would be my third nitpick to add to the ones above.
No, I don't believe so. After cleaning I tried it and didn't find it could. I should have actually paid closer attention to the feature as a friend asked me the very same question.
In the event a round fails to fire on the first strike, GET RID OF IT! Rack the slide, next round up, shoot.
I've always shared you trepidations regarding striker-fired pistols. Something about them just feels WRONG to me.
+1 – Mainly due to the trigger feel
I started out with Sig's DA/SA trigger (sweet feel, but it's hard to get used to two different trigger pulls).
Then I tried striker fired for a few days (a Springfield XD45 with 4″ barrel). I put about 400 rounds through it in 4 days, but I couldn't wait to get back to the Sig trigger feel.
My next handgun will be a 1911 (SA with a safety). I'm hoping that will be my final choice after I've given it a good try.
Great idea, Sig! Now you should continue and expand on the idea. How about a modular gun with a Sig-style DA/SA fire control module? And a modular 1911 (with an SA action like your 1911 line, but everything else is interchangeable)? How about an SAO fire control module (or a DAO module) that I could swap into my DA/SA gun? OK, that last one may be too difficult.
An entire handgun product line that is modular and user-configurable! Now THAT would be innovative, ground-shaking, and industry-changing.
I've held a p250 and liked the way it felt but didn't really notice the grip angle until you mentioned it. Studying the pictures and measuring from them is all I can do since I don't have either of those pistols handy. Of course back straps effect how the pistol feels in your hand but you can get a pretty good read on the angle by comparing the bottom of the slide to the front strap.
From what I can tell the FN has a grip angle pretty close to the 1911 and the P320 is straighter or has less angle. That would make it a pretty big transition for Luger and Glock shooters used to even more grip angle than the other two.
I think the ease of take down and being able to clean this pistol thoroughly so easy is as big, if not bigger, selling point than interchangeable feature.
Just like the P250 worked great in all the reviews until it hit the streets. Where is sucked. I reserve judgement until it's in the hands of the end users. I don't think the swappable grips or slides is a big deal, EAA has been doing it for awhile now, at least in changing the slides. You can swap slide on a Glock too, Glockmeister will ship slide to your door. You can change the grip on Gen 4 Glocks too, jsut swap the back strap. Takes less than a minute.
Sorry, this isn't that invovative.
You are correct – on the Glock you can change the backstrap – but nothing else. The P320's system allows for the entire grip to be swapped out – allowing an adjustment to the entire size of the grip including the width of the grip. The "Small" size for the P320 is smaller in width than any SIG P220 range with "thin" side-straps mounted.
Multiple uppers for rifles I get. . .the lower of a quality AR is essentially fool proof to begin with and being able to convert instantly from a CQB set up to a marksman rifle is highly appealing. With a pistol I don't really get it. For my use pistols come in a few flavors: Small and highly concealable for use in deep concealment and as a BUG (LCP, Body Guard .380 etc) compact concealment pistols for primary EDC (shield, XDS, etc) 'serious' pistols like the G17, XD, HK USP and others that are either full duty sized, or concealable but still higher capacity (think G19ish) then there are the style pieces like the 1911. I can think of no way to convert a single pistol from duty size to concealment size to BUG size and ever have it be 'good' at all those roles. Also, I need at least 2 pistols at a time (primary and BUG) so I'd have to have at least 2 of these to begin with.
The modularity might have applications with large organizations such as the military, but as an individual user I can't see any advantage to this but can see multiple disadvantages.
Could you do a gaming gun showdown? Grab the 5 or so top gaming guns then run a couple courses of fire identically. Could be over a couple weeks where you would show up each day and shoot the course cold with each weapon to see how your splits end up then general impressions?
It'd be cool to see an M&P Pro 5″, FNS 5″ (tip o the hat to Sevigny if nothing else), CZ SP01 or P09 (shadow target would be over kill), Maybe Sig 320, XDM 5.25, etc.
Maybe it's just classic drills, or maybe it's a whole IDPA/USPSA classifier. That'd make a cool article, but take a lot of ammo and time from your part.
That'd be a really cool article.
I'm just looking at this from a tinkerer's perspective. One of the reasons I went with an AR as my first major firearms purchase was so I could build it myself. I can see this pistol appealing to builders for the same reason, and I like the idea of a pistol that can easily support 3rd party frames.
No reference to the glaring design similarities with the P250? The P320 seems to be nothing more than a striker fire version of the P250. Sure, it has a better trigger than the P250, but what doesn't? Now, HK just released the VP9 striker fire pistol. From what I've heard the trigger rivals or betters the Walther PPQ, and has the same wonderful P30 modular grips and stippling. Choices… What a great country!
Humm, another Glock copy. I have not shot any pistol that I can draw,shoot,reload better than a Glock. Will pass on this new wounder pistol.
The 4473 part of the SIG P320 ( and p250 hammer fired) is the metal frame that holds the trigger assembly called the FCU "Fire control unit".
I think the P320 is over priced.
I would like to see a detailed comparison between the P250 and the p320.
I don't recall seeing. as being striker fired, is it listed as sao or dao?
If classed as DAO is it remotely restrike capable?
As for the P 250 …..Some people give it crap , I think it's a pretty cool gun.
the flexibility is almost endless. If someone wanted to,
30 seconds -no tool changeover- to go from 9mm SC to 45cal FS
Looking closer at some of the pictures, Did it have a Plastic guide rod in the spring?
I didn't read through all of the comments, but one thing that struck me that didn't appear to strike anyone else yet is a cool little positive of it's modularity. It is a polymer framed handgun after all. What happens if your polymer frame on your Glock or S&W breaks, melts, or whatever? You more than likely have to buy a new gun as the frame is the serialized part. What happens if the same thing happens on your P320? You can just buy a replacement frame for a fraction of the cost of the entire pistol…
As I recall the gunwriters thought the P250 was a great concept. Trigger reset and durability and (sales would prove otherwise) Flopped… The high bore axis is welll a Sig. Will come out over priced as all Sig's do..Lets wait and see. I've become biased to 1st Gen handguns for recalls..think XDs, Shield, Ruger SR series, LCP, Caracal, Diamondback DB. All had issues of some sort…We've become factory beta testers..
Yay a new SIG review followed by the usual "can't wait to say my Glock is better" comment….then the requisite rants about firearm laws both here and abroad followed immediately by a bunch of COMPLETELY off topic crap that has nothing to do with this handgun. None of that here because I ACTUALLY OWN ONE. I put 150 flawless rounds down range yesterday with various ammos and I have to say it's great so far. The trigger is a clean crisp short break and even "GLOCK GUY" should like it if he would actually shoot it instead of carping about anything not a glock….just watch Hickock 45's review (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IyBfrf7iitA) ….he loves it and he is the consummate glock guy….I think it is a winner and at $545 with night sights 2 mags and a holster it is a very good way to get a Sig in your arsenal at a reasonable price.
Follow up ….another 300 rounds through gun and I am liking it even better. Different bullets used include blazer brass , s&b, WWB, sig sauer HPs and hornady HPs. No hitches or glitches…..felt so good and easy it now sits in the nightstand for home defense….don't see how anyone could have a gripe about the way this thing shoots if they just take one to the range….I have the full size with medium grip and i have to say I am damn near as accurate with it as I am with the p226 on single action. If I have any issues I will report.
Glad to see the commenters finally realized MSRP and dealer price aren't the same. MSRP of a S&W Shield is 449, but even when fairly new I got one for $350 from the LGS.
I recently bought one of these in full size 9mm and love it. It has a better stock trigger than my Glock 23 and any M&P I've shot. The trigger feels a lot like my Springfield XDM, only a slightly heavier pull. The Sig is a tack driver. It eats up any weight bullet I've run through it and has a nice, solid quality look and feel to it. It also points very naturally for me. I have shot IDPA with it and was quite pleased with how it handled including shooting one-handed strong hand and weak hand. I like the idea I'll (eventually) be able to get parts to change it to a smaller carry size and keep the same trigger feel. I think Sig has a winner here.
Following the P250, with this striker fired version is intriguing. The DAO trigger on the P250 has taken me awhile to master. However, after many rounds I have become proficient with it. I wonder about changing over to the striker fire design, and how difficult it will be to adjust? Has anyone had experience going back and forth between DAO and striker-fired pistols?
Please don't take what I say wrong, but during a "serious social discussion", little attention is given to trigger pull weight, reset, high bore axis, trigger takeup, trigger over travel, etc. Lead on target becomes the focus! I have most often made the comment that, "there are those folks that can shoot no matter how bad the gun and there are those that can't shoot no matter how good the gun. When one becomes proficient enough, only THEN does it come down to the gun. I have yet to see a master class shooter have a problem with a stock pistol. But, I have seen hundreds on our range that couldn't hit the floor if they dropped their Wilson, Kimber, STI or whatever make "custom gun" they spent beaucoup $$$ ON. Having the best gun in the world doesn't make one the best shot in the world! Just like in golf, any one of those pros can beat almost anyone using that other persons clubs!
As one other commenter stated, about the closest I can equate the P320 trigger with is a Springfield XD, But, unlike the other person, mine was just about identical. No problems, but I now have HK VP9 for EDC.
Personally I am an unapologetic Glock "fan boy". That being said I am also a south paw. This gun gives me the ability to improve on my gun handling effieciancy. I never was an M&P fan. Nothing against them. I have one. I just wouldn't want to carry it. I've been looking for the 4.7 inch in 9mm for a little while now. I can't wait to submit a review to my favorite sites. Shoot safe and shoot straight
Author says glock mags arent metal? Last time i checked they were… Just covered in plastic…
The proper term for Glock mags is "metal lined"!
The new 320C I bought does not work with commonly available suppressors. I own a 250C-TB with a Gemtech Tundra SV suppressor and when I switch them into the 320C nearly every round stovepipes because the spring tension is off. Sig says they have not yet "developed a 320C-TB." What nonsense. Do Glock 17s and 19s have special versions to work with suppressors? Of course not. The 320C also has a double spring design, like Glock Gen 4. Apparently the fullsize 320 has a single spring. Furthermore, after a dew hundred rounds of break in I noticed the 320C spring guide rod is protruding slightly beyond the tip of the barrel. Sig says this is normal for the 320C. It makes me doubt the safety and reliability of the 320C. Sig should address these issues under their warranty instead of giving lame excuses, but to date, they won't.
I've owned 9mm Sig 250 full, compact and subcompact sizes and sold them all for a new 320 compact and accessories to replace them because the short trigger pull is so much better for my accuracy. I milled down a full size grip, or can use X-grip adapters, to fit in my 17 round full size mags flush for home defense, or use a small thin subcompact grip and 12 round mags for CCW since there is less than a half inch difference in barrel length that makes little difference in printing the gun. Sig 320/250 are the most customizable reliable pistols now available. The only things I don't like are that the 320 striker guide rod has a tendency to stick out slightly past the barrel tip, and that the spring tension in the compact model stovepipes rounds when I swap in my Sig 250 threaded barrel and Gemtech suppressor, but Sig says it is designed that way. I think Sig should make the new guide rod spring in its 320-TB model available to existing 320 compact owners, but that would cut into sales of the expensive $600 320-TB.
At least hold the gun properly if you are going to call yourself a reviewer!
@ a samurai – "But, my bank account would prefer a Gen 4 Glock 17 for $425. They come with 3 mags, and for $125 per barrel can be changed to .357 or 40S&W."
Sorry "a samurai", but you are WRONG! 1) A new Glock 17 G4 wholesale lists for $475! So if anyone is getting one at the price YOU list, it is either used or pirated off a law enforcement order which Glock takes a dim view of. 2) No OEM Glock model in 9mm can be changed UP to a .357SIG or .40SW by just swapping out the barrel and magazine, at least with FACTORY parts. There is a difference in the dimensions of the barrel hood that prevents a larger caliber barrel being installed in the smaller caliber slide, 3) For the record, a) doing so with after market parts voids the Glock warranty, b) increases the potential for malfunctions since the extractor and ejector are set at different angles and, c) while remote, unintentional discharges may occur while cycling since the 9mm ejector points closer to the primer on the larger caliber guns. Now, an OEM Glock in .357SIG or .40SW can be down calibered to 9mm using AFTER market parts, but there is a big caveat to that also. The reliability is compromised! While much depends on the brand of ammo, there is a huge increase in the potential for malfunctions, i.e. failures to eject and fire. These are SPECIFIC warnings and anyone doing that conversion is warned to NOT use that pistol for duty or defense. No alibis on the street!
I've been in the business for over 50 years and Glock specific since 1985!
I sold off my 320C because the protruding guide rod (1/8 inch past the barrel tip) and stovepiping with my 250-TB barrel and Gemtech suppressor attached were unacceptable to me. Sig has announced it will come out with a 320C-TB in 2015 with a shorter threaded barrel and probably reworked guide rod spring, but they should have addressed these issues in the original version, not a year later. I did like the shorter trigger pull on the 320C compared to my 250C-TB model, but not enough to keep it and buy a future 320C-TB model. Plus I seen recent prices on the 250C-TB drop to $400 online if you search carefully. I've used mine with the can for nearly 5 years without a problem.
Tony – The reason the recoil spring guide "sticks out" on the P320 and MANY other of the new generation semi-autos like the SPR-XD is by DESIGN! Like almost all semis, the slide has a safety if the slide is not fully "in battery". The newest semis deigned the recoil spring guide too extend a fraction of an inch PAST the muzzle so that IF a person is in a struggle where they have to press against an attacker, the slide will NOT push back out of battery like a conventional 1911 will.
I accept your technical explanation but I did not like the look of the guide rod creeping out past the barrel tip nor trust Sig's original explanation that it is normal. I've never seen a Glock guide rod creeping out like that. The main reason I sold my 320C was it could not use the 250C threaded barrel and suppressor I already owned without stovepiping and I do not intend to buy a new very expensive 320C-TB when Sig finally releases it. Sig originally said all 250 accessories except the slides and trigger units were compatible with the 320 models and I didn't appreciate spending $600 to find that was a lie. I'm satisfied with the hammer restrike 250C-TB for home defense and 290RS for carry. I don't need to shoot rounds faster, just accurately and reliably when needed.
Also, for the record, I have several Glocks, SIGs, Springfield Armory, Colts, Kimbers, S&Ws and several other mfgs and have just added a HK VP9. Until I took delivery the HK, my SIG P320 was my EDC. Before those two, it was a SIG 239 (9mm/.357SIG/.40SW) or a Glock 19/23 or… Whatever "gun d'jour" I felt like. But, as of two days ago, it's the HK. But, the P320 is right next to it on my dresser!!!
Great article. Very informative. It actually made me go to the LGS and check this pistol out. I am now deciding between it int eh Carry form), the H-K VP9 and S&W M&P 9.
I do have to respectfully disagree with you on the purpose of the modular system on this design. You say it was for the military. With the US Military being the granddaddy of all military contracts, there is no way Sig Sauer would have designed this pistol without a manual safety if that was their intent. No way at all.
Apparently several foreign militaries and their major police units, including the Austrians and at least 52+ other countries, decided that a manual safety was not a deal killer. If one cannot control their trigger finger, they have NO business with a handgun to start with.
And consider this, in the 50+ years I have been in the gun business, when I some body come in the shop and make an issue of a "manual safety" being absent. I show them a revolver and ask them to point out the manual safety! When the say "That's different!" I ask HOW? Then they can't explain how!
A double-action-only (DAO) handgun has a long, heavy trigger pull for each shot thus is far less prone to accidental discharges than a handgun with a short, light trigger pull. If you are holding someone at gunpoint and are startled by a sudden movement your grip will naturally tighten which could result in an accidental discharge if the handgun has a short, light trigger pull. Likewise, you are much more likely to have an accidental discharge if you trip if you have a handgun with a short, light trigger pull than a DAO handgun with a long, heavy trigger pull for each shot. Thus it is desirable to have a manual safety catch on a pistol with a short, light trigger pull. A manual safety catch also helps stop a gun snatcher using it to kill you, thus is a highly desirable feature for open carry.
Many distracted/tired/stressed people have accidentally shot themselves in the leg and/or foot while drawing or reholstering a Glock with the standard 5.5-lb trigger pull, which is why the heavier 8-lb New York No.1 trigger option is very popular with savvy Glock owners. If I were using a striker fired pistol for open carry it would be a S&W M&P40 with the manual safety catch and magazine safety options (the magazine release can then be used as a "kill switch"). If I were carrying a DAO revolver for open carry it would be a 3" barrel S&W M66 fitted with the Murabito or Magna-Trigger safety. The later safety involves cutting the front of the grip frame so you want a steel frame, not aluminum as the frame could readily be bent during a struggle with a gun snatcher which could result in the safety being deactivated so it will not fire when you want it to despite wearing the magnetic ring.
BTW, I meant to day "(in the Compact Carry form)" in my post above.
Is the SIG P320 available for purchase in New York State, or is the capacity of their Magazines a problem considering the 7 round limit placed by our nut-job politicians?
Yo Delbert. Where did you get the idea a S&W 19 was a K frame? That was the first N frame. Developed by Wesson of S&W specifically for the military to replace the 38s they were using in the Pacific during WWII. He worked with Federal to develop the 357 cartridge.
Ok..now that I have that off my chest…this is quite a discussion here. I have noticed that Glock fans are true to their weapons and will defend them against anything. It seems you either love 'em or hate 'em. Me, I really do not have an opinion either way. I followed this guy on his blog a while back as he put a Glock through the ringer over a period of months. He did everything to this gun including putting it in cement and then chipping it out. He would show what he did to the gun and then show the results of whether it would still shoot. In all that he did the only time he actually go it to fail was when he submerged it in a bucket of mud and a little cement and let it set for a couple of days. When he took it out it would not shoot because everything was completely clogged. The ammo could not feed, the slide could not cycle completely, etc…But after a cleaning with a water hose and a stick to flush everything out and clear the clumps of gunk lo and behold it fired. Says a lot for the gun. The only reason I have ever questioned it for myself has nothing to do with quality or reliability. They are obviously a well built gun and sell for a reasonable price. It has to do with the angle of the grip. Having never spent any amount of time handling and shooting the weapon I simply do not know if it will work for me.
Now, as to the Sig; I know Sigs to be great weapons. And after reading multiple reviews on the 320 I would not mind owning one myself. Given the price that people here say they have paid for the Sig it seems to be very close to what the Glocks are selling for. So if you put that aside it really comes down to a matter of personal preference. We are not comparing say something from Charter Arms here or one of the other low rent manufacturers. So this is one of those areas that maybe the 2 sides just need to agree to disagree. Oh, and as for the M&P crowd; To each their own. I really would not put one of those in the same category as a Glock and a Sig. Nothing wrong with them, just seems a step down to me. Just my 2 cents.
Dave – Bubble bursting time. The S&W Model 19 IS a "K" frame, PEROID, END OF IT!!! Along with the Models 10, 11, 13, 14, 15, 16, 64, 65, 66, and several other models in other calibers, including .22 RF, .32 S&W Long, (but it could shoot standard "shorts" also). In 1958 S&W went to lettered frames and numbered models, they had the small "J" frame, the medium "K" frame and the "N" frame. Most frames/models went through some revisions and S&W started adding the suffix number codes "-1", "-2" etc. In the "K" frame, these revisions were things like dropping the "pinned barrel", the recessed cylinder for cartridge rims, the cosmetic and some functional changes that made manufacturing easier (i.e. cheaper) and engineering changes that eliminated some of the screws on the side plate and yoke/crane screw. Over the years, the "K" frames in .357 Remington were found to be subject to some "issues" like forcing cone splits at the bottom of the barrel right where there is a little flat. It took a fairly steady diet of mag ammo to affect the guns and the worst offender was the very popular Federal ".357B, 125 JHP" load.
To "FIX" this, S&W designed the "L" frame which shares the same grip sizes and some other features with the "K" frame, but is beefier in the cylinder area including the top-strap, the barrel mounting hole, and other areas. The "N" frame was produced for those LARGER calibers like .44S&W SPL, .44RemMag, .45 (Colt and Auto) and those larger cased rounds. S&W did produce the "N" frame model 28 and 27 (then referred to as the "Highway Patrolman" and the ".357 Combat Magnum" which did have a slightly larger frame , but at that time neither WAS a lettered/number frame. The NAME "Combat Magnum" did carry over to the Model 19, but that model WAS and IS a "K" frame! Both the ".357 Magnum (registered and unregistered) and the Highway Patrolman were the original .357 Magnum revolvers mad by S&W.
I own four Glocks, a M&P and two XDs. My dept. issues the G22 and mine has fired about 2,000 rounds so far with only a couple misfires. They suppIy the ammo. l like all these guns but none are perfect. The XDs have the best triggers. The M&P is nearly as good; Glock the worse. Because of this, I shoot better with the XDs and the Smith. I too find the P320 an interesting design but I would never buy one as I see no real advantage over the guns I already own. I called Glock and was told I could not put a 9mm barrel and magazine into my G22 but I could put a .357Sig in for $120 but the cost of ammo and availability is out of practicality.
I also have much the same and even more of the guns you mentioned. I also have two of the SIG P-320's, a 9m/m and .40SW in the carry models. I prefer to not have to change out the trigger system, but I also have the .357SIG barrel for the .40SW.
The P-320 and the HK VP9 are my EDC guns, sneak in the SIG P-938 for those discrete days. The SIG 320 and HK (by a fraction over the SIG) are the best trigger systems. I know some are going to want to include a Walther or other MFG/model, but we are talking about makes and models that are more likely to be an approved duty/carry model than a Walther or XD or CZ based units.
Seems to me that two handguns are adequate for defensive use. I prefer a Ruger SP101 in .357 Magnum for everyday use loaded with 125-gr. hollowpoints, or loaded with 180-gr. hard cast flat points for use against large animals like bears when in rural areas where such animals pose a threat. If I feel a need for more firepower a Glock 19 is a sensible addition to the more concealable Ruger (fitted with Eagle Boot Grips) but not a replacement. It seems to me that it is best to stick to one or two types of gun for defensive use as failing to do so could have fatal consequences for ourselves or a loved one as the manual of operation and trigger pulls are different from gun to gun which could lead to a fatal error under stress.
Go somewhere you can shoot one. 🙂
Mine is a keeper.
I own a P320 in full size 9mm. I have been checking around the web including Sig Sauer's website on getting an xchange kit in 9mm compact but have not been able to find one and that particular kit is not listed on Sig's site in their gun parts and accessories section. Does anyone know anything of the existence/ accessibility of this particular kit?
Mark, Got this e-mail the other day:
Sig Sauer P320 Owner,
We currently have many of our P320 Caliber Exchange kits in stock in both Compact and Full sizes that I am also authorized to offer discounts on. These Exchange kits have been very heavily backordered since the P320's launch last year. These conversion kits offer you the chance to go up or down in caliber, or up or down in gun size. Each Caliber Exchange kit comes complete with a slide w/ night sights, a barrel, a guide rod and spring, a grip module, and a magazine for the size and caliber desired. If you are interested in the discounted pricing currently or want more information please feel free to email me back with questions, or call me at my direct toll free number at 866-619-1128. Please leave a message if I am unable to pick up as I may be on the phone.
Ryan Gagneux
Customer Service
Thanks for the info BigFED!
I have a Glock 20 (10mm), with an optional complete Glock 21 (.45) slide and mags, as well as an Advantage Arms .22 conversion kit and 3 lonewolf conversion barels (.357, .40, 9×25).
That's 6 calibers from one gun. They are all reliable, and a heck of a lot cheaper than Sig. Replacement parts are easier to find, and cheaper as well.
FDE finish on this gun sucks. Big time. If you touch the slide it leaves marks and scratches. Shows wear big time. Its almost like they put a light, sandy type finish on it that rubs off very easily with any use. And forget about holstering the FDE. It will show wear like you wont believe. Im honestly extremely disappointed in the FDE finish. Love the gun itself, but the finish is just terribly done
And SIGs high bore axis has never been an issue when it pertains to felt recoil or muzzle flip because the way that the slide is set more forward on the pistol and the rear of the slide is clearly in front of the hand as compared to some pistols where the rear of the slide extends out over the hand, which causes more of a flip action when the slide cycles because it is set further back. IN fact I would say SIGS, even with high bore axis, have softer shooting guns than their peers. Case in point. P320 has a higher bore axis than the PPQ, but the PPQ has a bit more muzzle flip.
Had to qualify yesterday, Switched from my P250C to a full size P320. Passed 94/100 (I was going for perfect, but I let the weapon down).
Nick's review is great, If you're used to a Glock or Springfield, your grip may be a bit off. I didn't notice until an instructor pointed it out to me. Then he grinned and said, "I have one, too, you own a Glock, right?" I confessed to owning a Croatian Glock clone (Springfield XD), switched my grip and it was great after that.
I have advantage tactical sights (also reviewed on TTAG) on my 320, and the combination is great. I have no issues with bore axis, blah blah – point of aim is point of impact.
Sadly the 9/357/40 are NOT compatible with the 45ACP so X-Change Kits to change the 9/357/40 are not happening. The 45AVP is a P320 all to itself.
Sadly the 9/357/40 is not X-Change Kit compatible with the 45ACP so the 45ACP is a P320 all to itself as you cannot swap between it and the trio.
i want to know more information for the sig p 320
The P-320 (and its close cousin P-250) have a "trigger group" that is "THE GUN". It is essentially a "mannequin body" on which other parts are attached to make a operable handgun. "THE GUN" has the serial number, but is, by itself, incapable of firing without being mounted in a "exoskeleton/frame", adding a slide, barrel, recoil spring, and other parts that are required to have a functioning handgun. Sort of like having an "erector set" for guns. Those parts still have to be mated according to compatibility by caliber, parts length, etc. It is NOT a case where a bunch of parts can be dumped on a table and one could assemble an operable pistol with little regard for "matching/compatibility".
The upside of this design is that in several jurisdictions (many foreign, but some even here in the USA) there are limits on how many "firearms" one can own using the serial number as the determining factor. Since that "trigger group" is "THE GUN", none of the other parts are of concern (in most places, with exceptions, as usual). If one wants "full size" pistol for the range or some competitive event, then just use the appropriate parts. Want a smaller pistol for CCW/CHL, then pick the parts and mount the trigger group in the selected frame. Cheaper option than buying the same model except the compact, sub-compact, etc.
Now the downside is that a compatible "conversion kit" (caliber, size, etc) cost nearly as much as a complete pistol. And having a "golf bag" of parts that are just "waiting their turn"… Well, you get the point. If it is something simple, like just swapping a barrel (like using a .357SIG barrel in a .40S&W or vice versa) go for it. Now, some of those changes (like for a SIG P-239) in .357SIG, it also requires .40S&W magazine due to a slightly different feed design. The .357SIG round works in a .40S&W mag, but not the other way. For most other SIGs OF THE SAME model, the mags for those two calibers are compatible.
I like my P-320 for the way it shoots, not for the flexibility in configuration. It and my P-938 are what I use for my EDC. YMMV!
Yes the gun can be changed into different sizes and calibers Thats irrelevant to me I have other striker fired handguns and I really like the trigger in this gun compared to Most others and as others have said there are many reasons the modular design may be better for some I like it and may just get more in different configurations
Yes the gun can be changed into different sizes and calibers Thats irrelevant to me I have other striker fired handguns and I really like the trigger in this gun compared to Most others and as others have said there are many reasons the modular design may be better for some I like it and may just get more in different configurations
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This article is incorrect. You can NOT swap a .45 barrel/trigger assembly into a 9/.40 grip frame. They are NOT compatible.
Caliber exchange kits are eh nifty at best.
The advantages of this sig over a Glock are superior sights, superior trigger, superior ergonomics, traditional rail, and lasty the ability to move the fire control unit from a sub compact to compact to carry to full size. It is also th most ambidextrous platform out there.
Talking to a buddy in Delta he made a good point. Why have multiple guns and be only so good with each of them or have one firearm and one firearm you mastered. The P320 allows you to do that as much as possible while adjusting it's size. Out jogging use the subcompact have a tactical rig use the full size, undercover use the carry or compact. Each size still has the same operational controls all while ONLY registering one fire control unit.
To do the same with glock you would need to buy G17, G19, well you get the idea.
To skirt all this yap, let me clarify. I like Glock products. Good shooters, and very reliable. However, I own a Sig 320, I also owned a 250 Sig. I got rid of it quick. That said, the 320 is a fine weapon. I actually love the trigger, the ergonomics, night sights, It is one heck of a good, accurate shooter. That said, I am quite pleased to have the 320 over the Glock 17 every day of the week.
DO NOT BUY THIS GUN!!! That is if you plan on using it to possibly save your life. I have been teaching firearms to law enforcement for twenty five years. During this time, I have never seen a weapon perform as poorly as the Sig P320 carry model. Our Department is in the process of going with this weapon and I'm afraid we are making a grave mistake. I just got through running thirty eight rookies through their firearms block of school. We were constantly in touch with the Sig rep about problems with their weapon. We had multiple ( and I mean MULTIPLE failure to eject and some fails to feed. At first we thought the problem was the ammo. We were using Winchester Win Clean. We tried some Winchester Ranger which did not cause as much of a problem (but still had too many for us to feel comfortable with). We also shot some Speer (our new duty ammo) and still had problems. After a thorough cleaning, we had more problems than we did with them straight out of the box. During a fifty round course of fire, we had eighteen fail to eject and four fail to feed out of multiple weapons. We could not get through one phase of fire without a problem We also had four weapons that completely locked up resulting in us having to force them open against a wooden table. One of those, we had to place it in a vice and beat it open with a hammer. During their eighty hour firearms block of instruction, (two groups of eighteen students each doing eighty hours each) it would be safe to say we had hundreds of malfunctions. In my twenty five years teaching, we have used Beretta 92Fs, Beretta 96FSs, Glock 23s and Sig P229Rs and we haven't had that many weapon malfunctions combined. After the Sig rep came to our range, he confirmed it was a weapon problem and not the ammo. He shipped us fifty new replacement kits (new slides, barrels, mainsprings and frames). After switching the parts, the fail to eject problem decreased but now the weapons had a fail to feed problem. The weapon is definitely not a confidence builder. Our hope is the Chief will contact Sig Sauer and tell them "thanks, but no thanks".
I carry a P226 Enhanced Elite 9mm. Pretty heavy gun with 15 rounds. (Looking at 320 for weight concerns)
I shot a P320 Compact (25 rounds), and my finger was very sore.
Then shot a drill (60 rounds) with the 226 and finger felt fine.
Spoke to shop owner/gunsmith/cop, and they showed me distance from backstrap to trigger was much different on the 2 guns.
I was considering the 320 Carry – is the trigger reach any different on the guns, and does the grip/frame size change this reach (I would opt for the large grip/frame).
Have a good weekend shooting to all
It's a good gun. It's no better than 90% of any other poly gun. It's got a high bore axis. Glock has a crappy grip angle. S&w has an Average trigger that can be.fixed for 40 bucks. Walther better triggers and a high bore axis. It's whatever you like best.
As a college student on a budget, I could care a little less about the modular aspects – I have only enough money saved up for one gun, not the other conversions. That said, if later on I decide that I went too big for daily carry, I like the idea that I could still keep my favorite pistol, just in smaller form.
But what's the real reason I would like this pistol? I got some rented range time in a couple weeks ago, and had the opportunity to shoot the P320 Carry side-by-side with a P226, S&W M&Pc (my brother's personal arm), and Glock 19 (all in 9mm). I have to say, the P320 was my favorite! To be honest, I initially wanted to go with the Glock, but the P320 just felt perfect in my hands. I loved the trigger, the balance… in two words, I was supremely comfortable with the gun. In my mind, that's the number one priority for any shooter (which is why I can nail a golf ball at 70 yards with my ol' open sights .22 but not my buddy's fancy scoped AR), and that's why this Christmas break, I plan to add this new Sig to my humble firearm collection.
I just saw that the new US Army handgun is the Sig MHS which is very similar to the P320. So I came to TTAG's review here. Looking at the photos I noticed the lack of any safety what-so-ever (ignoring drop safety). Nick doesn't mention it, nor do any commenters as far as I can tell, except for two.
Commenter BigFED says (paraphrasing) "Who cares about a manual safety? Have you ever seen one on a revolver? What's the difference?" The difference is that a DA revolver takes about 20 times the pull energy as an striker-fired SA trigger pull.
I have often thought that the Glock inspired trigger safety was somewhere between a fig-leaf and a joke. My Springfield has a trigger safety and a grip/backstrap safety, which I consider to be half a joke. This article confirms my suspicion, 'cause Sig got rid of the joke!
So I gotta check further on the new Army model and see if they made any effort at including safeties.
I know the rap; the holster IS the safety and all that crap. And if I was a member of special forces or SWAT or even a beat cop, I would not want a manual safety. But as a skillful Joe citizen who may or may not want to carry, this is just an unacceptable level of carelessness.
If you want a P320 with a safety, google MA compliant P320. I think they did a limited run so im not sure they are readily available Lipsey's has it listed although the picture is not correct: http://lipseys.com/itemdetail.aspx?itemno=SI320C9BSSMSMA
The P320 has a very similar safety feature to the glocks and others that have the 'safe action trigger' but I think the P320 is a better design, and also more aesthetically pleasing.
Guy named gc70 posted this somewhere else, I don't know the rules of this site so I won't link to another forum:
To fire a Glock, the trigger pivots to the rear, pushing the trigger bar to the rear before releasing the striker. If a Glock was dropped on its rear, inertia would pull the trigger and trigger bar to the rear if that movement was not blocked by the trigger safety. A Glock trigger safety tab is too small and light for inertia to overcome the safety tab's return spring.
Next, look at the P320 trigger operation (start at 1:55 in the video).
To fire a P320, the trigger pivots to the rear, pulling the trigger bar forward before releasing the striker. If a P320 was dropped on its rear, the inertia of the part of the trigger below the trigger pivot would have to overcome the inertia of the part of the trigger above the pivot, the inertia of the trigger bar, and the force of the trigger return and trigger bar return springs to move the trigger bar in the direction opposite of the drop to release the striker.
Its Feb, 2017, A month or so after the Army announced Sig's 320 as the new Pistol Solution. It's also about 4 weeks after we added the Sig 320 to our Range Rental offerings.
We clean our guns every 3 weeks or so, but with all new entries we'll run them until malfunctions and stoppages just to see how much abuse they can take. We sell guns too, and sell reliability.
What I can say about the Sig 320 is that it's a great easy shooting versatile firearm. And I am very certain many Sig 320 will be sold over the next 5 to 10 years because of the Army's selection. However, I must also say that if you ask me which gun between Glock 19 and Sig 320 has run the longest without Servicing of any kind in our shop? It is the Glock 19. Of course the Army's selection was not just any off the shelf Sig 320 and I hope the Army's SIg 320 version does perform better than the off the shelf Glock 19.
Army just picked the Sig Sauer P320 as their pistol because it is modular!
Glock's must really be great guns, everything that goes BANG is compared to one. Safe action triggers (Colt, Ruger, S&W Springfield armory) modeler frames & striker fired ( now everybody and their brother) I guess I will stay with the innovator. Beretta, Sig, HK and CZ are all great guns own them all. I love my GEN 4 Glock 35 with the large beaver tail,( the gen 4 frame is smaller then the 320 with no back strap) I must admit I did replace the gen 4 trigger with a factory gen3 and come up with and awesome trigger no over travel and very short reset. Are Glock's perfect? NO, no gun is. all guns fail, shooters have good days and bad days, it is just the nature of the beast. What gets me is, 90 % of the people commenting never shot either of these two very nice weapons and only know what they read off the internet and don't shoot over 50 to 100 rounds a year. I and millions like me shoot 1000's of round a month.
I had this gun, full size, and didn"t like it. First off, the trigger pinched my finger after 20 rounds. Had to send in to SIG for an "adverse trigger" which eliminated the pain but as far as triggers go this one is no way as good as the PPQ, Canik TP9SA, VP9 and many others.
Secondly, accuracy sucked. I was all over the place and couldn't print good groups no matter how much I fiddled with the sights and my POI.
Thirdly, finicky about ammo. Had stovepipes, FTF's and extraction problems. Of 300 rounds fired, I rarely could get through a full mag without a misfeed.
The only way to get a better grip is to buy a module! No backstraps like most plastic guns.
Don't understand why the ARMY picked this gun over the Glock and Beretta MHS offerings except that GAO reported that SIG underbid Glock by 100 million, which no doubt played a role in its decision. First time I ever saw the US government worry about the cost of something.
Sold the P320 and kept my Canik and CZ P-09.
Agree. Staying with Beretta (and perhaps using existing supplies) or even going with Glock, which by most accounts is the standard these days, would have made more sense. I don't have a CZ but a guy at the range let me fire his (in exchange for letting him fire my 500 Mag) and it handled very well, so it's on my list. It took me years to warm up to Glock, but now I usually don't carry anything else. Ignoring all the tacit-cool commando comments I know it will fire whatever I load into it with minute-of-bad-guy accuracy at any distance I would expect to hit a target with a handgun.


text:
"I'm not surprised that the Teacher Bonus Bill was referred because the teachers' union put a lot of work into collecting signatures. I look forward to furthering the discussion with the people of South Dakota on this very important topic. The bill is aimed at improving student achievement by channeling extra money directly to our best teachers and phasing out teacher tenure."
Source: http://news.sd.gov/newsitem.aspx?id=13087

subset: commoncrawl


text:
Passing truck on busy road rec by Zoom H2
thank you, excellent
great, thanks
genial...muy bueno
Thanks just what i needed
A great sound my friend, many thanks. :)
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The convenience of location. The friendliness of the staff. The reasonable off season rates. The music from the club in the basement level resonates up through the hotel. Wish there was better sound proofing/ insulation to buffer the noise.
Staff was very friendly. Beds very comfy. Piano bar in lobby piano player sings music more for adult crowd but a lot of fun. Breakfast was minimal. Bread, muffins and bagels seemed store bought not freshly made. Also available was small selection of fruit, cereals and boiled eggs. Coffee and tea obviously but no orange juice only cranberry juice. Location at top of hill could be difficult for less able bodied patrons(no elevator either)
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The location was absolutely perfect as it was only a minute walk to the main part of town. The place was very nice and well kept. Would definitely recommend.
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The third floor deck, and the jacuzzi were great, and the location was ideal for food, drinks, and nightlife. Hotel Employee and the entire staff were very welcoming and helpful. The TV reception was spotty. Breakfast could be more substantial - it was very pastry oriented. However, the coffee was great, and you also get a 10% discount at bayside Betsy's, which has awesome breakfast.
It's so charming! The room was beautiful, the location is perfect for walking to Commercial St., and the staff was so friendly! Even the other guests there with us were awesome! Breakfast in the morning was amazing! We overall just had a wonderful stay!
The owner, Tim, was attentive, kind, and informative. The room was very comfortable. We stayed in the Rutland Suite. At breakfast, we ate with an older couple from Norway and a young Italian couple who were on their honeymoon. Great place to stay! Would definitely recommend.
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Great location and friendly staff, beautiful artwork.
The B&B was clean, well located, well maintained, and had all the necessary items laid out for its guests (towels, soaps, etc.). They were also very helpful with our late check in, leaving keys in the mailbox for us when we arrived at 8:30 p.m. There was an overall lack of staff around. The few people that looked like they worked there (handymen doing general repairs) said 'I don't work here' when we asked basic questions.
The John Randall House was conveniently located a short walk away from Commercial Street. The staff was very accomodating and informative. The common areas were very clean. I was a little apprehensive to share a bathroom, but it was totally fine! Our room was a little small, but to be honest, we were never there, so it didn't really matter.
Courteous staff. Awesome, clean condo. Great location.
My girlfriend and I come to the cape every June. We love Charm's location. A bike ride away to beaches and a short walk to commercial St. We also love Charms deck for the great view and relaxing atmosphere. Rooms are clean and staff is friendly. We will continue to come back Beds are a bit squeaky.