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Choosing a Gaming CPU October 2013: i7-4960X, i5-4670K, Nehalem and Intel Updateby Ian Cutress on 10/3/2013 10:05 AM EST
137 Comments
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tim851 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkYou know, once you go Quad-GPU, you're spending so much money already that not going with Ivy Bridge-E seems stupid.
In the same vein I'd argue that a person buying 2 high end graphics cards should just pay 100 bucks more to get the 4770K and some peace of mind. Reply
Death666Angel - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI'd gladly take a IVB-E, even hex core, but that damned X79 makes me throw up when I just think about spending that much on a platform. :/ Reply
von Krupp - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkIt's not that bad. I picked up an X79 ASRock Extreme6 for $220, which is around what you'll pay for the good Z68/Z77 boards and I still got all of the X79 features. Reply
cpupro - Sunday, October 06, 2013 - link"I'd gladly take a IVB-E, even hex core, but that damned X79 makes me throw up when I just
think about spending that much on a platform. :/"
And be screwed.
"von Krupp - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - link
It's not that bad. I picked up an X79 ASRock Extreme6 for $220, which is around what you'll pay
for the good Z68/Z77 boards and I still got all of the X79 features."
Tell that to owners of original not so cheap Intel motherboards, DX79SI. They need to buy new motherboard for IVB-E cpu, no UEFI update like other manufacturers. Reply
HisDivineOrder - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkNot if they actually bought one when it was more expensive then waited until these long cycles allowed you to go and buy a second one on the cheap (ie., 670 when they were $400, then another when they were $250). Reply
althaz - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkExcept that you might need the two or four graphics cards to get good enough performance, whereas there's often no real performance benefit to more than four cores (for gaming).
Take Starcraft 2, a game which can bring any CPU to its knees, the game is run on one core, with AI and some other stuff offloaded to a second core. This is a fairly common way for games to work as it's easier to make them this way. Reply
Jon Tseng - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - link<sigh> it was so much easier back in the day when you could just overclock a Q6600 and job done. :-p Reply
JlHADJOE - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkYou can still do the same thing today with the 3/4930k.
Back in the day the Q6600 was basically the 2nd tier HEDT SKU, much like the 4930k is today, perhaps even higher considering the $851 launch price. Reply
rygaroo - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI still run an O.C. Q6600 :) but my GPU just died (8800GTS 512MB). Do you suspect that the lack of fps on Civ V for the Q9400 is due more to the motherboard limitations of PCIE 1.1 or more caused by the shortcomings of an old architecture? I don't want to spend a lot of money on a new high end GPU if my Q6600 would be crippling it... but my mobo has PCIE 2.0 x16 so it's not a real apples to apples comparison w/ the shown Q9400 results. Reply
JlHADJOE - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkI tested for that in the FFIV benchmark.
Had PrecisionX running and logging stuff in the background while I ran the benchmark. Turned out the biggest FPS drops coincided with the lowest GPU utilization, and that pretty much nailed the fact that my Q6600 @ 3.0 was severely bottlenecking the game.
Tried it again with CPU-Z, and indeed the FPS drops aligned with high CPU usage. Reply
rygaroo - Sunday, October 06, 2013 - linkthanks for the info! Reply
Flunk - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkI upgraded from a Q6600 last year and it really did make a difference. If you're not looking to upgrade you CPU I'd get something like a Radeon 7850 and save the rest for a full rebuild in a year or two, Reply
rygaroo - Sunday, October 06, 2013 - linkThat sounds a pretty decent plan. Thanks for the recommendation! Reply
Felix_Ram - Sunday, October 06, 2013 - linkYou mean overclock an i5-2500k and job done. Reply
Scarier - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI'm surprised many people do not use Starcraft 2 or Heart of the Swarm to benchmark CPUs more often.
I've noticed a much bigger increase in that particular game going from i7 920 to 3770k. Reply
Jaguar36 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI'd lvoe to see some more SC2 benchmarks. Single player may not be that demanding but 4v4 with big armies will crush any CPU. Reply
Dustin Sklavos - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkThe problem is that StarCraft II is threaded HORRIBLY. It's single-threaded performance or bust, and that's really easy to quantify. HotS may have been released this year, but its architecture is from 2003. Reply
althaz - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkThis is absolutely correct. It can murder any CPU, but the game engine runs entirely on one core, with part of another used for a few extra things (networking, AI, etc). Reply
Flunk - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkThis is why some people who are really in to Starcraft 2 are configuring their desktops with low turbo settings on 3 cores and one very-high setting on the fourth to get that extra tiny bit of performance. I'm not too sure how well it works but some people swear by it. Reply
cbrownx88 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkStarcraft2 and BF3/4 pleeease Reply
Democrab - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkIt's not really representative of most games, everyone knows it's highly CPU limited...Most games are GPU limited as proven by this, yet a lot of people seem unaware of that. Reply
Spoelie - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkAnother choice I was considering for gaming: the i5 3350p.
This is the cheapest i5 available on this side of the pond and still Ivy, so it allows the 4 bin overclocking. Since haswell, intel does not allow any overclocking anymore for non-K parts.
In addition, Z77 motherboards are quite a bit cheaper than Z87 for the moment.
So for a 30$+ cheaper than the 4430, you get 3.7/3.6/3.6/3.5ghz Ivy vs 3.2/3.0ghz Haswell.
The platform isn't that upgradeable but with Intel moving to 2-year cadences for desktop upgrades, the performance should stay relevant for at least 4 years... Reply
mrdude - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkAmazing article, Ian. Thanks a ton.
It's shocking to see how well the dual core Intel parts and the two-module AMD chips fare, even at 1440p with a single GPU. With respect to single-GPU gaming, opting to pull some $ out of the CPU/MB fund in order to buy a better GPU is certainly more advisable.
Those who invested in the X58/1366 platform certainly got their money's worth. Frankly, even buying a secondhand 1366 platform is a good idea if it's cheaper than a new quad-core 1155/1150 + mobo. Going from an SSD running on 3GB/s to 6GB/s really isn't noticeable. I've done this twice on two separate platforms and the only difference I've seen is with respect to bootup speed.
You also have to figure that this graph will change with the newer generation of console ports. I have an inclining that 2/4 threads might stumble a bit with some more demanding titles. We might even see AVX play a more significant role as well Reply
cbrownx88 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkBF4 is gonna bump me from X58 I believe... way more CPU bound than BF3 (email@example.com) Reply
snouter - Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - linkBF4 makes my 4930k work more than I thought it would. Reply
BOMBOVA - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linki am reviving my x58 MSI board, with Syba sata 3 controller, and i really notice a difference on my long video editing files. that was my whole point of modding up. Cheers. good discussion Reply
chizow - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI really appreciated what this article tried to accomplish, and I think it does shed some light on some aspects of what you were trying to test...but someone at AnandTech couldn't throw you a bone and get you a pair of higher-end GPUs to test? 580s are a bit long in the tooth to garner any meaningful results. Maybe Gigabyte could have kicked a pair of 680s to you?
Also, it would have been nice to see some Battlefield 3 results, since it is widely touted as a title that scales extremely well with both CPU (and shows big differences with HT) and GPU, especially in MultiPlayer, and will be especially relevant in the next few months as Battlefield 4 launches. Reply
dusk007 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI find testing for CPU performance is not a strong suit of reviewers. The test has lots of data but it is missing the situations that gamers end up in which do require CPU performance.
Starcraft 2. Just run a replay of an 8 player map at 4x-8x speed and most dual core notebooks practically break down.
Total War set unit size to epic and run some huge battle. That is where this games is great but it drains cpu resources like crazy.
Shooters or racing games are examples where the CPU has to do nothing but feed the GPU which is really the least CPU intensive stuff. Mulitplayer adds quite a bit of overhead but it is still not something if you play you need to worry much about your CPU.
When testing CPU performance kick all those shooters to the curve and focus on RTS games with huge unit sizes.
It is the minimum frames at these games that require CPU performance. The situations where it gets annoying that in the biggest battles the CPU cannot keep up. Starcraft 2 on medium runs on almost any GPU but it can bring slower CPU quickly to its limits. Reply
IanCutress - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkCOH2 is planned for our next benchmark update to cover the RTS side. I know Rome II is also a possibility, assuming we can get a good benchmark together. As I mentioned, if possible I'd like to batch file it up so I can work on other things rather than moderate a 5 minute benchmark (x4 for repetitions for a single number, x4-8 for GPU configs to complete a CPU analysis, x25+ CPUs for scope).
If you have any other suggestions for the 2014 update, please let me know - email address is in the article (or click on my name at the top).
Ian Reply
anubis44 - Saturday, October 05, 2013 - link"COH2 is planned for our next benchmark update to cover the RTS side."
Excellent. This is one of my most-played games. In addition, I wouldn't be surprised if subsequent patches for this game didn't noticeably improve it's multi-threaded performance, so having older results will be nice to have once these patches are released in order to track the improvements. Reply
CrystalBay - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - link"Watch Dogs" coming on PC requires a octo-core or better for Ultra settings. Reply
jimhsu - Saturday, February 22, 2014 - linkYes to strategy games. Supreme Commander (the original, not the horrible "2" version), 80km maps, 8 players, 2000 unit limit, replay. Stuff like that.
You could also throw in some sandbox games; TES is a good choice for its many CPU constrained situations, GTA5 possibly, ... (results may vary depending on threading tweaks). Reply
romrunning - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkWhy is the i3-3225 missing from most of the CPU benchmarks? From the beginning of that webpage, it doesn't appear until "Explicit Finite Difference Grid Solver (2D)". Reply
IanCutress - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkIt was one of the first CPUs I tested and I only focused on the GPU results at that time - I ran my SystemCompute benchmark just to see what it was like. I have not gone back to retest as of yet, though on the platform refresh I'll make sure to add the numbers.
Ian Reply
crimson117 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - link> It is possible to consider the non-IGP versions of the A8-5600K, such as the FX-4xxx variant or the Athlon X4 750K. But as we have not had these chips in to test, it would be unethical to suggest them without having data to back them up. Watch this space, we have processors in the list to test.
I think you should make this a priority - one could save ~$20 with the 750K, which can make a big difference on a low budget. Reply
Kai Robinson - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkWhy choose the P965 chipset for an LGA775 motherboard, instead of the P35 or P45 chipsets? And why no mention of the Q9650? Reply
DanNeely - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkFor something that old testing came down to what Ian and the hardware vendors were able to scavenge up. A 965 and 9400 on the shelf somewhere beat a p45 and 9650 that need bought. Reply
cosminmcm - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkNo, it doesn't. That processor (low frequency, half the cache) on that motherboard (no pcie 2.0) really doesn't do Core 2 Quad justice. A top model would probably beat (in my opinion it would certainly beat) similarly clocked Phenom 2 processors and be higher on the ladder. Reply
email@example.com - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkthats surprising... after all these years, i5-2500k still is a beast of a CPU... Reply
dishayu - Friday, October 04, 2013 - link"all these" = 2. Reply
BrightCandle - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkSo again we see tests with games that are known not to scale with more CPU cores. There are games however that show clear benefits, your site simply doesn't test them. Its not universally true that more cores or HT make a difference but maybe it would be a good idea to focus on those games we know do benefit like Metro last light, Hitman absolution, Medal of honour warfighter and some areas of Crysis 3.
The problem here is that its the games that support more multithreading, so to give true impression you need to test a much wider and modern set of games. To do otherwise is pretty misleading. Reply
althaz - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkTo test only those games would be more misleading, as the vast majority of games are barely multithreaded at all. Reply
erple2 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkHonestly, if the stats for single GPU's weren't all at about the same level, this would be an issue. It isn't until you get to multiple GPU's - an area that you start to see some differentiation. But that level begins to become very expensive very quickly. I'd posit that if you're already into multiple high-end video cards, the price difference between dual and quad core is relatively insignificant anyway, so the point is moot. Reply
Pheesh - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkappreciate the review, but it seems like the choice of games and settings makes the results primarily reflect a GPU constrained situation (1440p max settings for a CPU test?). It would be nice to see some of the newer engines which utilize more cores as most people will be buying CPU for titles in the future. I'm personally more interested in the delta between the CPU's when in CPU bound situations. Early benchmarks of next gen engines have shown larger differences between 8 threads vs 4 threads. Reply
cbrownx88 - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkamen Reply
TheJian - Sunday, October 06, 2013 - linkPrecisely. Also only 2% of us even own 1440p monitors and I'm guessing the super small % of us in a terrible economy that have say $550 to blow on a PC (the price of the FIRST 1440p monitor model you'd actually recognize the name of on newegg-asus model (122reviews) – and the only one with more than 12reviews) would buy anything BUT a monitor that would probably require 2 vid cards to fully utilize anyway. Raise your hand if you're planning on buying a $550 monitor instead of say, buying a near top end maxwell next year? I see no hands. Since 98% of us are on 1920x1200 or LESS (and more to the point a good 60% are less than 1920x1080), I'm guessing we are all planning on buying either a top vid card, or if you're in the 60% or so that have UNDER 1080p, you'll buy a $100-200 monitor (1080p upgrade to 22in-24in) and a $350-450 vid card to max out your game play.
Translation: These results affect less than 2% of us and are pointless for another few years at the very least. I'm planning on buying a 1440p monitor but LONG after I get my maxwell. The vid card improves almost everything I'll do in games. The monitor only works well if I have the VID CARD muscle ALREADY. Most people of the super small 2% running 1440p or up have two vid cards to push the monitors (whatever they have). I don't want to buy a monitor and say "oh crap, all my games got super slow" for the next few years (1440p for me is a purchase once a name brand is $400 at 27in – only $150 away…LOL). I refuse to run anything but native and won't turn stuff off. I don't see the point in buying a beautiful monitor if I have to turn in into crap to get higher fps anyway... :)
Who is this article for? Start writing articles for 98% of your readers, not 2%. Also you'll find the cpu's are far more important where that 98% is running as fewer games are gpu bound. I find it almost stupid to recommend AMD these days for cpus and that stupidity grows even more as vid cards get faster. So basically if you are running 1080p and plan to for a while look at the cpu separation on the triple cards and consider that what you'll see as cpu results. If you want a good indication of what I mean, see the first or second 1440p article here and CTRL-F my nick. I listed all the games previously that part like the red sea leaving AMD cpus in the dust (it's quite a bit longer than CIV 5...ROFL). I gave links to the benchmarks showing all those games.
There's the comments section on the 2nd 1440p article for the lazy people :)
Note that even here in this article TWO of the games aren't playable on single cards...LOL. 34fps avg in metro 2033 means you'll be hitting low 20's or worse MINIMUM. Sleeping dogs is already under 30fps AVG, so not even playable at avg fps let alone MIN fps you will hit (again TEENS probably). So if you buy that fancy new $550+ monitor (because only a retard or a gambler buys a $350 korean job from ebay etc...LOL) get used to slide shows and stutter gaming for even SINGLE 7970's in a lot of games never mind everything below sucking even more. Raise your hand if you have money for a $550 monitor AND a second vid card...ROFL. And these imaginary people this article is for, apparently should buy a $110 CPU from AMD to pair with this setup...ROFLMAO.
REALISTIC Recommendations:
Buy a GPU first.
Buy a great CPU second (and don't bother with AMD unless you're absolutely broke).
Buy that 1440p monitor if your single card is above 7970 already or you're planning shortly on maxwell or some such card. As we move to unreal 4 engine, cryengine 3.5 (or cryengine 4th gen…whatever) etc next year, get ready to feel the pain of that 1440p monitor even more if you're not above 7970. So again, this article should be considered largely irrelevant for most people unless you can fork over for the top end cards AND that monitor they test here. On top of this, as soon as you tell me you have the cash for both of those, what they heck are you doing talking $100 AMD cpus?...LOL.
And for AMD gpu lovers like the whole anandtech team it seems...Where's the NV portal site? (I love the gpus, just not their drivers):
Origin AND Valve have abandoned AMD even in the face of new gpus. Origin spells it right out exactly as we already know:
"Wasielewski offered a further clarifying statement from Alvaro Masis, one of Origin's technical support managers, who said, "Primarily the overall issues have been stability of the cards, overheating, performance, scaling, and the amount of time to receive new drivers on both desktop and mobile GPUs."
More data, nearly twice the failure rate at another vendor confirming why the first probably dropped AMD. I'd call a 5% rate bad, never mind AMD's 1yr rate of nearly 8% failure (and nearly 9% over 3yrs). Cutting RMAs nearly in half certainly saves a company some money, never mind all the driver issues AMD still has and has had for 2yrs. A person adds a monitor and calls tech support about AMD eyefinity right? If they add a gpu they call about crossfire next?...ROFL. I hope AMD starts putting more effort into drivers, or the hardware sucks no matter how good the silicon is. As a boutique vendor at the high end surely the crossfire and multi-monitor situation affects them more than most who don't even ship high end stuff really (read:overly expensive...heh)
Note one of the games here performs worse with 3 cards than 2. So I guess even anandtech accidentally shows AMD's drivers still suck for triple's. 12 cpus in civ5 post above 107fps with 2 7970's, but only 5 can do over 107fps with 3 cards...Talk about going backwards. These tests, while wasted on 98% of us, should have at the least been done with the GPU maker who has properly functioning drivers WITH 2 or 3 CARDS :) Reply
CrispySilicon - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkWhat gives Anand?
I may be a little biased here since I'm still rocking a Q6600 (albeit fairly OC'd). But with all the other high end platforms you used, why not use a DDR3 X48/P45 for S775?
I say this because NOBODY who reads this article would still be running a mobo that old with pcie 1.1, especially in multi-gpu configuration. Reply
dishayu - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkI share you opinion on the matter, although I'm myself still running a Q6600 on a MSI P965 Platinum with an AMD HD6670. :P Reply
ThomasS31 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkPlease also add Battlefield 4 to the game tests in the next update(s)/2014.
I think it will be very relevant, based on the beta experience. Reply
tackle70 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI know you dealt with this criticism in the intro, and I understand the reasoning (consistency, repeatability, etc) but I'm going to criticize anyways...
These CPU results are to me fairly insignificant and not worth the many hours of testing, given that the majority of cases where CPU muscle is important are multiplayer (BF3/Crysis 3/BF4/etc). As you can see even from your benchmark data, these single player scenarios just don't really care about CPU all that much - even in multi-GPU. That's COMPLETELY different in the multiplayer games above.
Pretty much the only single player game I'm aware of that will eat up CPU power is Crysis 3. That game should at least be added to this test suite, in my opinion. I know it has no built in benchmark, but it would at least serve as a point of contact between the world of single player CPU-agnostic GPU-bound tests like these and the world of CPU-hungry multiplayer gaming. Reply
Harry Lloyd - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI am sorry to say that, but I never expected to see a completely useless test at AnandTech. 99% of singleplayer games are fine with a Core i3, 99.9% of all games are fine with a stock Core i5, but there is that 0.1 % that is not, and it is mostly multiplayer.
Go look at the BF4 beta tests, where even a Haswell i7 is a bottleneck. Even BF3 muliplayer performs better with a modern i5 than with a 1156/1366 CPU.
And with next-gen games right around the corner, the situation might change drastically with more and more games needing a very fast quad core CPU. Reply
Dribble - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkAgree. What's the point of running time demos (need less cpu grunt) on single player games (need less cpu grunt) at very high res/settings (gpu bound max fps) with no min fps (so weak cpu bottlenecks hidden).
Makes those with weak cpu's feel better and leads to lots of "surprising my AMD processor is good enough" comments, but it actually for many people it's not. Reply
just4U - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkPersonally I'd say that's a load of BS. I work with a lot of different setups, and unless your an enthusiast the average gamer really can't tell the difference. Their coming off of older setups already so unless your cutting a ton of corners you can easily go the AMD route for a good majority of them. Reply
glugglug - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI don't understand the recommendation for "at least quad core" for Civilization V.
Having looked at task manager during the game, it quickly becomes apparent that the game is effectively entirely single threaded. It doesn't even have a separate thread for video rendering vs. AI, or if it does, they completely block each other. Setting the CPU affinity to keep the game on a single core makes absolutely no difference in that game. Reply
JPForums - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - link
We see some of our biggest variations in CPU performance in Civilization V, where it is clear that a modern Intel processor (Ivy/Haswell), at least quad core, is needed to get the job done for the higher frame rates. Arguably any high-end AMD processor will perform >60 FPS in our testing here as well, perhaps making the point moot.
I've got to say, I'm impressed with the common sense approach, both to the setup of a benchmark of this size, and some of the conclusions I'm reading.
I'm interested to see how many AMD processor's end up above the "good enough to not bottleneck the GPU setup" line. I wonder if they will be cost effective vs and Intel setup.
A future experiment of interest to me is whether or not more budget oriented chipsets significantly hinder performance. I guess the question that's on my mind is "Is there any situation in which a faster processor on a board with lesser capabilities would be outperformed by a (somewhat) slower processor on a board with greater capabilities?" Or put a different way, "How much processing power is it logical to sacrifice in pursuit of a better platform (I.E. more PCIe lanes for multiGPU setups)?" Reply
KaarlisK - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkCould you please test a Haswell Pentium? In comparison to the i3, it has only slight lower frequency, but no HT, and is way cheaper. Reply
ShieTar - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI second this request. From the limited amount of tests I could find so far it seems that saving money on the CPU and investing it into the GPU is the way to go for most games. That seems to include even seemingly unbalanced combinations like a Pentium and a GTX 780 beating a Quad-Core and a GTX 770. Reply
Flunk - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI was quite surprised to see the Sandy Bridge chips hanging in there. There doesn't seem to be much need to upgrade if you have a i5-2500K or i7-2600k, especially if you factor in how easy they are to overclock for 4.5Ghz and sometimes beyond. Reply
just4U - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkWasn't much of a bump for ivyB or Haswell really.. Put all three on a table ("STOCK") /w similar hardware and I'd lay money on 99.9% not being able to tell the difference. CPU's have been going sideways in performance rather than upwards. (My opinion..) for sometime now.
What's interesting is Socket1366 cpu's are finally beginning to show some age.. Reply
A5 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkPerformance hasn't been increasing (as much) because of the focus on power consumption in laptops. That and AMD's utterly noncompetitive products at the high end.
I could 100% tell you which system was which if I had a Kill-A-Watt, though. Reply
A5 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkTo finish that thought, I do wish Intel still had some mainstream (aka cheaper) 130W CPUs on their normal platform. Reply
just4U - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkYep.. you should also be able to tell the difference simply by measuring heat.. The SandyB's tend to run a little cooler than the IvyB although they must have done something in Haswell since it does run cooler in normal operation.. but heats up rather quickly under load just like the IvyB. But on the surface their all fairly comparable I think anyway. Reply
brucek2 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkMy main system is still rocking an i7-920. These charts help explain rationally what my brain must have somehow known subconsciously: that there's not yet much reason to upgrade. (I'm discounting the +50% gains on the CPU benchmarks, because my i7-920 is overclocked, making the gains much less. And I'm rarely CPU bound for long.)
I would like a 6GB/sec SATA controller some day. My poor SSDs must be very frustrated with their host. Reply
Senti - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI'm in a similar boat: using i7-930 @4GHz. Seriously, who runs those wonderful Nehalem CPUs on default clocks when they easily overclock 1.5x? And with this overclock advantage of the newer CPUs is really underwhelming: far less than i7-920 line here shows.
As for SSD, I use PCI-E based one and it's probably still faster or at least on par with newest SATA ones. Reply
A5 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkMy 920 refused to go over 3 GHz after I updated the BIOS one day. Before that I still only got 3.5 or so.
My 4770K is a crappy overclocker, too. Maybe it's just me :-p Reply
cbrownx88 - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkA5 - was your 920 a C0 stepping? Mine is a D0, which at the time of purchase I remember going way out of my way to check the stepping before pulling the trigger Reply
BOMBOVA - Saturday, October 26, 2013 - linki put in a value pcie 6 Gbs, Syba controller card, only capable of 32k or 64k blocks, but is value at less than fifty bucks. works well, Reply
ninjaquick - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkIsn't Win7 old? Benchmarks like these should be run on the latest Windows, at least IMHO. Reply
brucek2 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkHasn't Win8 been rejected by large numbers of desktop enthusiasts & gamers? Its adoption rate on older platforms like many included here is pitiful.
Fortunately my sense from other articles is that its not likely to have made a significant difference either way? Reply
DanNeely - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkThe Steam HW survey has W8 at 16.4% vs 66.8% for W7.
I suspect W7 is being used in order to keep results directly comparable to historic results. Reply
warezme - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI to invested in the venerable (speak only in awe hushed whispers), i7 920 which I promptly overclocked to 3.6Ghz. This little jewel has been going strong for Goodness almost half a decade? and stable as a rock and I notice holding it's own very well even up against the latest and greatest. This is a testament to competition and engineering when competition in the CPU arena existed. I have long switched from dual GPU's to single but dual core cards on a single fat 16x pci-e bus even though my Evga X58SLI board supports higher. I'll ride the wave one more year and see what new gear crashes in next year. Hopefully a new Nvidia architecture that will inspire me to upgrade everything. Reply
Hrel - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - link"our next update will focus solely on the AMD midrange."
Please don't do that. PLEASE include at least 3 Intel CPU's for comparison. It doesn't matter if the FX8320 does well in benchmarks if for another $40 bucks I can get a i54670 that runs 50% faster. These are hypothetical numbers, obviously, but then Intel will be faster. By how much matters, once you factor in price and energy draw especially. Reply
A5 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkThe old numbers will still be there for comparison. The next update is just *adding* more AMD data. Reply
just4U - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkIt's hard making sense of AMD data in comparison to Intel. As near as I can tell their sitting at just beyond i7920 performance these days but /w all the new features. It gets confusing when you look at the X4 X6 older stuff though since some of that is actually faster... yet somehow only compares favorably to Intel's 9X Core2 stuff. Reply
just4U - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkWhy 3? The i5 entry level 4430 beats out every AMD chip on the market in most instances. Adding in more simply confuses people and adds more fodder for fanboys to fight over.. and I think it taxes the patience of most of us that already know what's what in the cpu arena.
Simple rule of thumb. If your on a budget you may want to go AMD to get all the "other" bells and whistles your looking to buy or.. if you have a more to spend your starting point will be the i54430. Reply
just4U - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkExcellent article Ian, I really like the inclusion of older CPU's. It's a good basis in which to decide if it's "time" to upgrade on that front. Most of the people I know are not on the bleeding edge of technology. Many sit back in 2009 with minor updates to video and Hard Drives. Anyway.. Well done lots to sift thru. Reply
Jackie60 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkAt last Anandtech is doing some meaningful second decade of 21st century testing. Well done and keep it up ffs! Reply
SolMiester - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkCan someone please tell me why we are using 2+ yr old GPUs? Reply
A5 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkYou could read the article. Reply
OrphanageExplosion - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkAmazing data. I do wonder whether the testing at max settings is a good idea though. The variation in performance can be extreme. Just watch the Metro 2033 benchmark play out. Does that look like the kind of experience you'd want to play?
Perhaps more importantly though, the arrival of next-gen console changes everything.
Did you see the news that Watch Dogs is x64 only? That's just the tip of the iceberg. Developers need to go wide to make the most out of six available Jaguar cores. Jobs-based scheduling over up to eight cores will become the norm rather than the exception. The gap between i5 vs. i7 will widen. AMD FX will suddenly become a lot more interesting.
In short order, I'd expect to see dual core CPUs and less capable quads start to look much less capable very quickly. i5 vs. i7 will see a much larger gulf in performance.
Check out the CPU data here for the Battlefield 4 beta:
The dual cores are being maxed out, FX-8350 is up there with the 3930K (!) Reply
tackle70 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkThe 8350 is with the 2600k, not the 3930k...
So yeah, it's a very good showing for AMD, but not as good as what you indicate. Also, according to sweclockers, an overclocked i5 is still superior to an overclocked 83xx CPU, so make of that what you wish.
I'm just glad we're seeing games starting to use more than 2-4 threads effectively. Reply
Traciatim - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkMuch more likely is that games will just become less and less reliant on CPU power because of the terrible netbook processors in the consoles and will instead rely more and more on the GPU. The PC versions of games will just be the same game with a high res texture pack and some extra graphics bling to use up GPU cycles while your processor sits around shuffling a little data. Reply
Flunk - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkI'm not sure AMD will benefit that much. As soon as consumer CPUs have a reason to have more cores they're just release a new chip with more cores. There is absolutely no reason that they can't release a 8 or ever 12 core desktop processor, they're already selling them for servers. Reply
Flunk - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkForgot to mention, Watch Dogs is probably x64 only because they want to use more than 2GB of RAM (which is the limit for the user-mode memory partition in Win32). Reply
Nirvanaosc - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkLooking just at the gaming results, does this means that almost any CPU is capable to feed the GPU at 1440p and it is always GPU limited? Reply
Nirvanaosc - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI mean in single GPU config. Reply
Traciatim - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkThat's pretty much just the games they picked. If you could reliably benchmark large scale PC games like Planetside 2, or other popular large scale MMO's reliably you'd pretty much see the exact opposite. The trouble is, it seems like no MMO makers give you reliable benchmarking tools so you can't use them for tests like these. Reply
ryccoh - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkI would really like to see a CPU comparison for strategy games.
For example, one could have a save game of a far advanced game in Civilization 5 or Total War with many AI players on the largest map and then see how the waiting time varies between the different CPUs. This should be feasible, shouldn't it?
I'm running an i5 2500k @4.6ghz and it just isn't cutting it for Civilization 5 on a large map once you're far into the game, it would be nice to see whether getting hyperthreading and more cores would be worth it. Reply
glugglug - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkHaving waited the ridiculous amounts of time between turns on Civ V, and having dual monitors, I put task manager up on the second monitor while it was running, to see that Civ V *IS NOT MULTITHREADED. AT ALL*. Setting the CPU affinity to make it use only 1 logical core makes absolutely no performance difference at all! The only thing I can think of for why a better result would be seen on quad-core systems would be that it likes having a larger L3 cache. Reply
glugglug - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkP.S. If my "Civ V just likes cache" theory is right, an Iris Pro laptop should be the ultimate Civ V machine. Reply
konondrum - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkThank you for doing this, it's quite informative. I just have one suggestion, perhaps you could get a Lynnfield CPU into these benchmarks. I've been happily using my i5-750 for about 4 years now, but I'm unsure if the performance would be closer to a i7-920 or Q9400. I'm thinking it may be getting close to time to upgrade, but I've still never come across a game or app that seems to choke it. Reply
teiglin - Saturday, October 05, 2013 - link+1 to Lynnfield. My i5-750 is still running great at a gentle ~3.5GHz, and I haven't really felt the burn in games, but I also am not running multi-GPU. Still I'd love to see how well it stacks up to the competition. Reply
cbrownx88 - Thursday, October 03, 2013 - linkBF3/4 pleeeease.
BF4 beta seems very CPU-bound on an i7920 at 4.2ghz at 1920x1200... very different story than BF3 (where I currently didn't feel the need to update) Reply
pandemonium - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkI love articles like this! Excellent stuff, thanks!
I'm still confused why you guys don't have an i5-3570k in your line-up. Of all of the processors, that's probably the most crucial to have, being it's performance for the price and popularity for builds. These tests give me little to go on without that processor, as important as it is for the general builder! Reply
pandemonium - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkAlso, CPU benchmarks for gaming aren't as necessary with single player games. A necessary contrast for CPU comparison will be for MMOs or multiplayer FPS runs. Obviously it's more difficult to get accurate baseline results for such instances, but a large amount of runs should at least minimize any variables between each testing instance and give a broader definition for how well each processor will perform.
If you guys could get on the latest MMOs and test out these rigs, that'd be where I see charts for CPU comparison really come into play for gaming. Reply
Nirvanaosc - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkFinal Fantasy XIV has a benchmark, but I don't know if it fits on their needs. Maybe worth check it although I'm not sure if that represents real world gameplay. Reply
BOMBOVA - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkGuys and Gals:, i have started using Video editing software, Coral, and Photo software ACD17, and need the best out of my i7 960, so, i have spent considerable time fitting with a new SYBA x4 SATA 3 controller, "50" bucks, and a better CPU cooler, double fan, big aluminum / copper beast. out come it works, SSD's are working like they should in Raid 0, / with 2.5 hdd backup, using hot swap. and i went back to the literature " stories " of over clocking, and settled on a 4.2 overclock. Letting you all know it words really, really good. i am almost ashamed of myself, " being techie " that it took me so long to get practical. . i am now resigned to waiting for DDR 4, and PCIe 3.x for future considerations. good article/ thanks Reply
BOMBOVA - Saturday, October 26, 2013 - linkupdate, i really parked the beast cpu 960 at 3.8x Mhz, 4.2 is too HOT, the fan rate is NOISy, and it is unstable, as i am wondering if my hard drive crashes are Malware, or just unstable, NONE of that at 3.8x, i will adjust my PCIe rate up from 133 MHz, say towards 137 or even 140 if stable, on all add in cards. it only works to your least stable card, i have settled on a Marvel, hdd controller card, for cheap , cost effective, bottom line, i like this article, and after 3 days of work, i am on to doing work with my computer. thanks all. Cheers Thomas Gx yvr.ca Vancouver Canada Reply
Ranger101 - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkEvery time an article of this sort is written, the conclusion is the same: In the vast majority of cases, due to GPU bottlenecks the differences between Cpus are so minute that no-one would ever notice the performance difference in game. Yawn. Reply
Ranger101 - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkEvery time an article of this sort is written, the conclusion is the same. In the vast majority of cases, due to GPU bottlenecks, the performance differences between CPUs are so minimal that no-one would notice the difference in game. Yawn. Reply
Ranger101 - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkEvery time an article of this sort is written, the conclusion is the same. In the vast majority of cases, due to GPU bottlenecks, the performance differences between CPUs are so minimal that no-one would notice the difference in game. Yawn.
This is the 3rd time I am posting this comment as it seems to be continually removed. Yet it is a legitimate and non offensive comment. What happened to freedom of expression at Anandtech? Reply
Flunk - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkI'm seeing all three of your posts Reply
dingetje - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkwould be nice to see how the haswell pentiums (like the g3420) do as low budget low power gaming cpu.
too bad none of the review sites so far have deemed them worthy of a review so far. Reply
geok1ng - Friday, October 04, 2013 - link"Of course we would suggest Haswell over Ivy Bridge based on Haswell being that newer platform."
If only Haswell OCs were equal to IB OCs. With Haswell you are STUCK at 4.2-4.6Ghz, depending on your luck, and going water wont help. With IB 4.4-5.0Ghz in usual, and the more money you invest in cooling , the better will be your OC. This luck of the draw in Haswell, and the walls in OCing at Z87 should be considered, especially at triple and quad GPU builds aiming at 4k gaming, where a bad overclock is the doom of the entire system. Reply
coachingjoy - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkgood job, like your work. Reply
meliketrolls - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkOf course AMD CPUs will have better scores. It's just that... AMD is WAAAAY better than Intel. Reply
R-Type - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkI have a Dell XPS 420 with Q6600. With the 8800GT (512 MB) card I was getting about 40 fps with medium settings. When I upgraded to a GTX 670, I got about 60 FPS with high settings, a very noticeable improvement. In my experience, a quad core Q6600 is still a pretty competent gamer with a strong graphics card on all but the most extreme games. Reply
R3dox - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkI'm one of those with a D0 i7 920 and it's been running at 3.8GHz (19x200bclk with 'only' 1600C9 memory, 12GB) for over 4 years. I suppose I'll just have to wait for a nice native PCIe SSD to avoid the old SATA controller and I'm golden for a good while more. It's just my HD6970 that could use replacement at some point (1920x1200 reso, nothing crazy). Reply
BOMBOVA - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkfor my x58, i put in one of these "" SYBA SI-PEX40057 PCI-Express 2.0 "" fifty bucks, makes the newer ssd's rock, i am still happy with my platform and video work, and jpg work, is flash twice as good. " we love our i7-920"s " Cheers, good thread this, all power users, / good fun Reply
R3dox - Sunday, October 06, 2013 - linkWhen I upgraded to my current intel 520( due to being 3x bigger than previous ssd), I looked into such cards but they were pretty bad and except for sequencial 128kb read, slower than the intel sata controller. I see this is a new version of the marvell controller but is it actually comparable to an intel sata 3 controller this time? Reply
BOMBOVA - Sunday, October 06, 2013 - linka low cost raid controller yes, 64kb, 128kb, show the merit of raid 0, at 6 Gbs each, i was doubtful myself, but took the test of the device, for i need better video editing performance, at least it works :) now we have to watch out for the 12Gbs devices coming soon, imo for games, not much notice of improvement to be seen, but in big data transfers, sata 3 improvements, can be had for low costs. gl, trying it out, borrow a card to try, if you can, Cheers. Reply
BOMBOVA - Saturday, October 26, 2013 - linkfact is you can set to 32 K blocks, or 64K, 'only" , but is a true Marvel controller chip, in the Syba, and is on the PCI e buss. , Control M, sets the chipset, works rite off, is quick, but, there is a hint, that the lanes are only 5 Gbit second, still is a fine patch upgrade, on low cost 6Gbit second ssd's i am in for 2x120 ssd's and controller for 250, Reply
R-Type - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkResults are typical for a variety of games where the resolution is set to 1920 x 1200. Games include Dirt 3, Civilization V, Guild Wars 2, Mechwarrior Living Legends, Diablo 3, Starcraft 2, etc. Reply
augiem - Friday, October 04, 2013 - linkI'm really kind of shocked to see how well Nehalem stands up still in many benchmarks. If you adjust the i7 920 benchmarks to make up for the difference in frequency between it and the 4770K, it's not half bad. I used the difference between the i7-920 and i7-950 to determine how the benchmark scaled on Nehalem. If it was close enough to linearly (+/- 1%), I considered it. I saw a 6% - 40% performance advantage for Haswell across the CPU tests, which is actually smaller than I expected for an almost 6 year old chip. (Obviously this includes differences in the platforms too.) Striking that even in 6 years the speed hasn't even doubled.
I'm still on an email@example.com, so this was very relevant to me. If it were 40% across the board, it might be more compelling, but quite a few were more like 15%, 20%, etc. Now I understand Haswell is going to OC a lot further than this one, so in that way you could get the performance diff up there.
I'm just dumbfounded that this Nehalem has lasted me 4.5 years already and it still doesn't feel slow. On the one hand its great value for the money, but on the other hand its a little disappointing to see performance curve drop off like it has over the past 6 years.
That would be a fun project. Make a graph showing average CPU performance increases over the last 30 years. Reply
Genericuser1234 - Saturday, October 05, 2013 - linkAs interesting these chips are for getting maximum performance from the high w parts. Will you do an article about the low TDP parts that are the true masterpieces Intel makes. I live in Denmark and energy cost more and more. My PC is running almost nonstop and I am curious how well these chips perform in a gaming environment. How far behind are they on performance and what kind of power cost on a year based on an average workload / idle time are we talking about you could save. I find the low power chips to be Intel's true stars. Do more with less. Maybe even throw in a power house chip from 2 years ago for comparison. That would be an interesting article Reply
agent_x007 - Saturday, October 05, 2013 - linkCongrats to those who did testing part.
Can't wait to see AMD added.
Too bad Pentium XE 955/965 (ie. Presler B1/C1 @ 3,46/3,73GHz) didn't "cut it" for this comparson :(
Hyper Threading and "Last of Netburst" legacy could be interesting in comparison with low end, fully-intergated setups, like VIA Nano or AMD Fusion.
+ There is also a possibility that todays multithreaded programs would better utilize the 4 threads of this kind of CPU, maybe to the point of matching Core 2 Duo's...
Either way, to sum it up in two words : GREAT WORK. Reply
khanov - Saturday, October 05, 2013 - linkA good article, and nice to see an update now that new CPU's are out.
Wouldn't it be nice if you could have all the benefits of X79 for multi GPU configurations, but without the added cost over Z87? Well actually you can, if you take in to account the quad-core LGA2011 CPUs.
The i7-4820K is no more expensive than the i7-4770K, and motherboard costs are very similar too. So people seriously considering 3 or 4 GPUs might be very interested in this option, to gain the benefits of extra PCIe lane allocation without the extra cost of a hex core CPU.
Ian, would you please consider adding i7-3820 and/or i7-4820K to the next update? It would be nice to see how well, or how badly, they fare against the competition. Reply
MarcHFR - Sunday, October 06, 2013 - linkHi all,
Sorry but i don't understand this review. What's the point of recommanding different CPU on the only basis of single/dual/tri/quad GPU ?
First, the GPU power is not related to the number of GPU only, with 2x660 you get lower performance than 1x780, but if i read the conclusion for 2x660 you recommand FX-8350 but A8-5600K for 1x780 ?
Second, for example with only a 7970 with a small CPU or a big CPU you get exactly the same performance on Sleeping Dogs 2560*1440 max settings. But what kind of player will keep a setting that offer 28 fps on such a carde ? None ! They will lower the graphic settings related to the GPU only to a point that they will get a higher framerate, like the 80 fps you get with three card.
Whatever the number/power of the GPU, as soon as it's not a lower-end card, the CPU needed to get playable framerate is the same with a GTX 660 or 2xGTX 780 as soon as you don't use graphics settings related to the GPU that lower the framerate that can be sustained by the GPU under the framerate that can be sustained by the CPU.
You can recommand different CPU to get more than 40/60/80/120 fps in some games (but good luck since integrated benchmark are generally not using the most CPU bound scene), but recommand different CPU for single/dual/tri/quad GPU seems a non-sense for me. Reply
Majesticii - Sunday, October 06, 2013 - linkDamn. How can you call this a CPU comparisson with data like this. The games are run at such extreme values that in no way they represent the impact of a CPU. Sleeping dogs is just 4 graphs with 28fps, how can any respected researcher show this data without severe shame. To add insult to injury, the vast majority seems to think this is how CPU tests are done and call it a nice review. Literally my heart sank as i read through these comments. Noone (except a few ignored), not even the reviewers has a clue what they're on about. This way of CPU-reviewing in games needs to stop. This isn't just uninformative, it's worse; It's completely misleading. Test games at 800x600 low settings, and pay no mind to those people calling for "real-world benchmarks". Stay true to what's real, instead of appealing to the community. Reply
3Ball - Monday, October 07, 2013 - linkForgive me if this is pointed out in the article and I have missed it, but it is worth pointing out. Battlefield 4 will use up to 8 cores/threads. My i7-860 @ 4.0ghz with hyperthreading is outperforming a friends Ivy bridge (3570k) at 4.4ghz without hyperthreading, so much so that my frames are better using a GTX680 against his GTX780.
This could be the product of the "beta", but I do believe it is a sign of things to come. The new consoles are most likely going to influence multithreaded performance greatly considering the lower sinlge thread performance present in the systems.
I have been planning on rebuilding with haswell early next year and was planning on getting a 4670k, but have now changed that decision to going with a 4770k due to this experience. Just my two cents. Cheers! Reply
pandemonium - Tuesday, October 08, 2013 - linkIt doesn't, because it doesn't exactly capture the dynamics of displaying several player models at once. It does a decent job at displaying several preprogrammed models at once.
The FF benchmarks have been a fairly low estimation of actual game performance when it comes to more demanding instances of raids and large crowds. With that said, they do better than most other canned benchmarks for determining the performance of a machine. Given it's consistent testing environment, I guess it wouldn't hurt to use it as a go-to benchmark. Reply
Tormeh - Tuesday, October 08, 2013 - linkBut where is the Civilization V end-of-turn benchmark? I don't care about the frame rates, I care about the times I'm staring at the screen waiting for the game to finish its calculations! Reply
defiler99 - Thursday, October 10, 2013 - linkI don't normally comment (as the reviews are generally excellent), but I was actually shocked to see the choice of graphics card(s) for this roundup. Nobody buying a gaming CPU is going to have stuff that slow, right? So many of the tests result in framerates under 60fps, etc. Reply
DPOverLord - Thursday, October 10, 2013 - linkBe great to see this with the new 4930K, Titan @ 1600p Reply
dennphill - Thursday, October 10, 2013 - linkLearn to write in the English language - or at least use the grammar checker. I wince reading this article. (But thanks for the effort. Content is OK) Reply
Hrel - Monday, October 14, 2013 - linkI'm finally in the process of building a new desktop, mini-ITX. Gonna use a 4570S CPU. Primary duties will be media streaming but I'll game on it too. The computer it's replacing? 650i SLI chipset based computer running an E8400 Core 2 duo. I can still max out Mass Effect games with no issue. Minecraft maxes out the CPU but that's just because Java sucks. So that old 2007 era computer is still a viable gaming machine with the GTX460 in it. Talk of needing to replace a Nehalem CPU soon seems kind of absurd to me. But then again I have no interest in Far Cry or Crysis. Reply
markthema3 - Tuesday, October 15, 2013 - linkWhat about The Witcher 2 for a benchmark? I have yet to see anything be more intense than that game's Ubersampling option. Reply
SeriousTodd - Tuesday, October 15, 2013 - linkWhat are the disadvantages of buying a 4770K? Reply
Enterprise24 - Saturday, October 19, 2013 - linkWanna see Total War Rome II in real time tactical mode (Probably the most CPU intensive game). Reply
boozzer - Thursday, October 24, 2013 - linkwell damn. it seems like if I am single gpu gaming at 1080p, cpu doesn't matter much at all? a 5800k would do the job well enough.
question: will aa amd 5800k bottleneck a gtx780? or a 290x? in 1080p. or it doesn't matter at all? since the resolution is so low. I am sure I am staying in 1080p for at least 5 more years. and my current pc parts are really old(c2d e8500 + 460 1gb) and thinking of upgrading. I am sure a 780 or 290x would last 5 or more years, so kinda want a matching cpu. Reply
BOMBOVA - Saturday, October 26, 2013 - linkThis article, prompted me to pull my P6T Asus mb out and replace it with a MSI 7666 which holds the 1366 I7 chip, i put in a 960 over my 920 , and clocked it up to 3.8x so far, and with my Nvidia 470 gpu, n raid 0 2x120 Gbyte ssd's things are rocking along, really good, it seems compared to the high end stuff presented here. , i had to install a cheap Syba controller card, on the Marvell chip set, set to 32 kbits, over 64 kbs, better data storage efficiency over speed, n a 4 channel usb 3.0 card, and it is good to go. , since i bought good , near new , used, i am in it for say half, price. and it works for me, i had a tough go, with microsoft critical patch updates. flooded on oct. 8th, n 15th. so my system restore points, crashed, , i am now set on NO automatic downloads, and all is good, " this is like a 3 day experience " i don't want to go through again, , enjoyed the article, and comments. good comments, thanks guys and girls. and am looking for the DD$4 stuff n Haswell super processor of 14, or early 15, now on to doing work with my computer :) , Cheers, all , have fun with candies, next, and have a good Xmas, buy yourselves something nice. lets keep america working, rtg. Vancouver Canada Reply
WHISP - Tuesday, November 05, 2013 - linkYour review is talking about recommendations based on # of GPU's but seems to make the assumption GPU = graphics card. I have a GTX 690 and am looking to possibly upgrade my cpu/mobo, what would your recommendation be keeping in mind in the future I may buy another gtx690 to boost performance? What CPU PLX or non PLX combo do I need to satisfy two 690's in sli? Reply
Gastec - Tuesday, November 05, 2013 - linkYou don't need PLX with dual-SLI, you don't even need a second GTX 690 :P I myself would never ever consider spending so much money on a video card, but I guess you play on multiple 30'' monitors with the maximum available resolution. Each with it's own. If you insist, then get the Intel i7-4960X, a socket 2011 X79 Asus motherboard with a PLX chip on it and 3 Nvidia GTX Titan. That would surely give you at least 150 FPS in any game except those that are specifically designed not to give more than what the designers want, like Crysis. Reply
Gastec - Tuesday, November 05, 2013 - linkI'm on a i7-860 since 2010 and HT was also a decision factor for buying it. But over the years I don't think HT has helped me that much with what I did and do on the PC. So now, after reading this article -which is very helpful- I think a i5-4670(K) with it's $100 lower price difference will suffice. Unless...upcoming games like The Elder Scrolls Online(that I want to play) will make use of HT, but I don't think so. Does anyone know of any game that makes good use of Hyper-Threading, or at least 4 cores? Reply
BlackOmega - Friday, November 08, 2013 - linkGoddammit. 6 years I spent without upgrading my rig, now I come back to anandtech and I can't understand one a single one of those benchmarks.
Hell, WHERE ARE THE CPU CLOCK SPEEDS? How the hell Intel and AMD expect me to understand this gibberish the use to name their processors, I want to compare IPC on every bench I see, I want to see em every test how the ghz of one CPU compares to another. I'm not going to read those benchs with a cpu dictionary trying to interpret every name on this list, nor have I a good enough memory to remember what CPU have more cache ou clock speed than the other as described in the first page.
6 years I stood away from the hardware scene, now I came back and I can't understand anything.
/frustrated Reply
BlackOmega - Friday, November 08, 2013 - linkps: AMD and Intel naming scheme suck, give us back clock speed. Reply
oranos - Tuesday, November 26, 2013 - link2500k best value gaming processor of all time :) Reply


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JACKSONVILLE, Fla. - Jacksonville police have arrested a man in connection with the shooting death of another man on the Westside last month.
Police said 34-year-old William McFaline, of Orange Park, was shot at an apartment complex in the 5600 block of California Avenue on May 9, then drove away through several back yards in the area. McFaline was found dead in his car when it crashed a few blocks away, police said.
Rasean Vann, 20, turned himself in Thursday, police said.
Police said McFaline and Vann had arranged to meet for a drug deal when the shooting happened.
Investigators said Vann admitted that he planned to rob McFaline, but he denied shooting him.
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subset: commoncrawl


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UI's independent, free-format, non-commercial radio station, offering music, issues-based programming and news to students and the community at large.


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text:
Security Demands Hardware Improvements
Fast, reliable network connectivity is at the heart of business today -- powering critical infrastructure systems, internal business operations, customer-facing communications, and home-based entertainment services. But it's not only system performance that keeps network managers awake at night. As more people embrace multiple connected devices through a wide range of applications, security vulnerabilities are top-of-mind for both network managers and network hardware designers. As the type and scope of network traffic continues to evolve, so does the complexity of security threats. It is more important than ever to address greater levels of security at all points within these complex and varied network environments.
Critical infrastructure networks (such as financial transactions and power plants) clearly require increased protection. But even 'lower level' networks must take greater care to protect personal information that may become exposed during everyday transactions. Emerging network platforms in the cloud, home gateways, and mobile enterprise have opened additional avenues for threats against data security and system performance.
Even the simple process of uploading a photo to the cloud -- much less using it to transmit enterprise data -- requires the image to be secure at the device level, in the cloud, and at all points between as it traverses the network itself.
As security threats continue to evolve and network providers vie for customers interested in high-performance, seamless security at every point within the network, innovation at the silicon level is critical. High performance security features -- integrated into silicon hardware -- allow network managers to more thoroughly and more intelligently inspect, encrypt, authenticate and secure Internet traffic at wire speeds.
Enhancing security performance with security-optimized communications processors
Security-optimized communications processors, on the other hand, combine both high-performance processors and application-specific hardware accelerators to more efficiently handle the heavy duty lifting of arduous security functions while simultaneously ensuring wire- speed throughput even under heavy load. With security-optimized communications processors, system developers are not limited by application-specific constraints; the implementation is instead driven by security performance. For example, where a 10 Gigabit network may have once had performance degraded by unusual or malicious activity -- dropping to even a 1 Gigabit performance level -- integrated, hardware-based security accelerators can handle a security attack while continuing to handle data packets at the 10 Gigabit wire speed.
Security-optimized processors are becoming essential in network design; they leverage advances in architecture, process technology and integration to enable flexible functionality without compromising performance -- all while maintaining ideal power and cost profiles. Integrated accelerator engines, high-speed network interfaces, deep packet inspection (DPI) functionality with RegEx and grammar engines, combined with high-performance CPUs offer much greater security while ensuring network performance at wire speed.
The overarching concept is that implementations using highly integrated security-optimized processors do not restrict users to a protocol or two. Instead, depending on usage models, different points within the protocol can be offloaded to accelerator engines, providing a greater level of flexible security.
Security-optimized communications processors deliver dramatic advances in Layer 7 DPI at wire speed, inspecting the full content of every packet as it moves through the system, instead of viewing just the headers. This is significantly more secure, and is analogous to viewing the contents of an envelope rather than just the address on the outside of the envelope.
Integrated Regular Expression (RegEx) engines enable an intelligent and efficient way to represent rules within DPI databases. The most straightforward example of this is a virus. The system may be watching for a specific bitstream signature that could potentially represent a known virus, however because viruses evolve so quickly, the bitstream may be altered enough to slow down the process or even make its way through the system. The ability to represent the database in regular expression helps to ensure that the database of viruses is smarter and more efficient, further assuring the speed and efficiency of the DPI engine. Seamless performance results when rule databases are dynamically updated in memory.
In addition to the RegEx engines, integrated grammar processing engines are an important element to defining a security-optimized communications processor. The grammar engine adds a level of intelligence that can pre-process and streamline packets into the respective RegEx engines, thus enhancing processing efficiency and effective throughput.
The importance of best-in-class CPU cores
Greater network security is the bottom line
The ability to perform full cross-packet content inspection at wire speed is essential to enabling original equipment manufacturers (OEMs) to deliver new levels of performance and functionality.
This article was originally published on EBN's sister publication, EDN.
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Topic: Happy New Year to you all!!
Hi everyone,
I just wanted to wish you all and your families a very happy new year. I hope the new year will be good to us all and may it bring you everything that you want.
Whatever you are doing this Hogmany, I hope you have a good one.
Thanks to each and every one of you and my very best wishes for 2010 to you all.


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Gore scores Nobel Peace Prize as mass media reports the 2007 Nobel Peace Prize has been awarded to environmental campaigner Al Gore and the UN panel on climate change, the IPCC.
Editorial Comment: The question that should be asked is "what does a movie on the weather have to do with peace?"
Forgive our untrusting suggestion "that a global problem needs a global solution which needs a global government", but politicians have tried for years to pull this off and we suspect they see this as their next best opportunity. It also detracts from the integrity of the Nobel Prize too when you can get one for making so many mistakes. (See item entitled Nine Inconvenient Untruths)
Evidence News 31 October 2007


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Why is it that the more efficient a car is, the uglier it tends to be? Sure, the Toyota Prius is a dull-looking ride, but the current batch of post-Prius plug-ins seems to be actively avoiding sex appeal. The Chevrolet Volt looks like a Bayformer, the Mitsubishi i-MIEV looks like a toy, and the 2012 Nissan Leaf SL that graced the Car Tech garage this week is arguably the ugliest of them all, with an exterior aesthetic best described as "techno-organic frog." I thought the future was supposed to look cooler than this. I went back and took a look at every car that I've reviewed over the past 12 months and the Leaf is easily the ugliest ride I've been seen in this year.
Okay, perhaps I'm being a bit unfair. The Leaf's form is mostly dictated by function and for every styling con, there is an equal and opposite aerodynamic pro.
Those elongated headlamps that bulge out from the front fenders cut an aerodynamic slice into the air, clearing a path for the wing mirrors and reducing drag. Those tiny wheels that look so impossibly small when contrasted with the Leaf's slab sides sit on low-rolling-resistance tires that reduce friction and disturb less air as they roll down the road.
The lump of a Leaf seats four adults comfortably or five in a pinch. The rear hatch is spacious enough for your average grocery, Costco, or IKEA run. However, the loading floor isn't flat, which could problems transporting bulkier items, but overall the Leaf wears its functional hatchback form well. This EV may not be sexy, but with an estimated 92-106 mpg equivalent from its all-electric drivetrain, a zero-tailpipe-emissions reputation that is sure to win second glances from eco-conscious guys and gals, and a price that the average buyer could possibly afford, it doesn't have to be.
The electric slide
Zero-to-60 estimates of about 8 seconds may make the Leaf seem slow on paper, but the torquey grunt that you get during a zero-to-45 mph drag on public roads paints a completely different picture. Mat the pedal when the light turns green and this electric frog leaps forward with an effortless immediacy that you can only really get from an electric power train. At about 45 mph, the engine starts to lose a bit of steam and the miles per hour pile on at a more relaxed rate, but at no point does the Leaf ever really feel gutless.
Pop the Leaf's hood and what you see won't look too much different from the engine room of a Nissan Versa. The 80 kW electric motor sits in about the same place as a small four-cylinder gasoline engine would and, save for the lack of vibration, noise, an intake, or exhaust, looks pretty much the same too. The 80 kW of output converts to about 107 horsepower. However, the real story here is the 207 pound-feet of torque which is available from a dead stop and is responsible for the Leaf's low-end grunt.
The Leaf also features an Eco mode that can be toggled. While in this more efficient drive mode, the vehicle attempts to extend its range by more aggressively using regenerative braking while coasting and remapping the throttle pedal travel for less-aggressive tip-in. Driving along at 20 mph and switching between the normal and Eco modes is like day and night; you can really feel the vehicle resist speed when going into Eco and then almost lurch forward as it rolls more freely and accelerates more readily in normal mode. I did about half of my testing in either mode and found normal to be great for darting through traffic, passing, and maintaining a steady highway speed and Eco to be good for squeezing a few extra miles per kilowatt out of the battery at neighborhood, city, and parking-lot speeds.
I was a bit annoyed by the shifter, which is a puck-shaped lump on the center stack that, like the shifter on the Prius, returns to a neutral position after each change in mode and features a dedicated "P" button for parking the vehicle. My issue wasn't with the shifter itself, rather I disliked the fact that I had to push the shift nubbin forward to shift into reverse and pull backward to move forward. This inverted shifting seemed, to me, to be particularly counterintuitive when quickly going from reverse to drive, such as during parallel parking. I sort of get what Nissan was going for here, echoing the layout of a traditional automatic shifter, but I figure if you're going to dramatically reinvent the shift lever, why not take a moment and make the shifting more intuitive?
Shift the Leaf into reverse in a quiet parking garage and you'll be able to hear the "beep-beep-beep" of its pedestrian-warning sound in action. This sound is easily audible from outside of the vehicle, but you'll have to strain to hear it from the driver's seat. There's also a similar pedestrian-warning sound that happens when driving forward at low speeds, but from the driver's seat, it's difficult to distinguish the high-pitched tone from the whine of the electric motor without really listening for it with the windows down.
Range anxiety? Not so much...
The EPA estimates the Leaf's cruising range on a full charge to be in the neighborhood of 73 miles. Hop into a fully charged Leaf SL and push the start button and you'll be greeted with an estimated range of 95 miles. Turn off the climate control system and that range estimate will jump to 105 miles. Shift down into the Eco drive mode and it will again jump to 115 miles. However, during my testing the trip computer's range and my own estimates put the Leaf's range at about 80 miles.
I noticed that traveling at highway speeds caused the Leaf's range estimates to become a bit more conservative. Like most EVs, the Leaf is at its least efficient at speeds of over 50 mph. That combined with the 80-to-100-mile cap before needing a recharge pretty much limits the Leaf to a city-to-suburb driving style.
You'll want to rent a conventional gasoline vehicle for your annual road trip. If I wanted to drive from my home in San Francisco to visit my friends in Atlanta, doing so in the Leaf would take about 28 days in 80-mile increments with 20-hour recharge breaks on 110V power. But again, I'm being dramatic. No one in their right mind would attempt a cross-country road trip in a Leaf and anyone serious about owning a Leaf will also be serious about getting a 240V charging station installed at home or at least making heavy use of public quick-charging stations.


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Hey y'all...nobody has been to Athens Alabama or Huntsville Alabama?
We have some mighty fine barbecue here. Southern style. Gibson's and Big Bob Gibson's and Whitts and, my very own favorite...LawLers Barbecue. Anybody had any???
Its a shame that a bbq place in Alabama makes some of the best tastin' St. Louis style dry ribs I ever eat. The bone slides out clean and the meat is tender. LawLers Barbecue sauce is out of this world. They ain't never won no contest though. Their pork is the most juicy and tender I have ever done ate. Anybody else with a favorite North Alabama que?


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WORCESTERSHIRE'S Friends Life t20 trip to Glamorgan tomorrow has been postponed following the tragic death of Tom Maynard.
The Surrey batsman, who spent his early career with the Welsh county, was found dead on London Underground railtracks early on Monday morning.
The SWALEC Stadium outfit have made the decision to cancel tomorrow's contest as a mark of respect to Maynard and his family.
The match has been rescheduled for Tuesday, July 3, with a 6pm start and all tickets that have been bought for tomorrow will be valid for new date.


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MyIT 2.0: Administering (WBT)
The BMC MyIT 2.0: Administering online course provides an overview of the new features and functionality of BMC MyIT v2.0. This self-paced course introduces participants to the concepts and procedures of BMC MyIT 2.0 administration. Additionally, administrators will receive the vital information and experience necessary to configure BMC MyIT2.0, using the BMC MyIT Administration Console.
This course includes an optional examination for BMC Accredited Administrator: BMC MyIT 2.0.
Major release:
MyIT 2.x
Good for:
Administrators, Developers, IT Managers, Users
Course Delivery:
Self-Paced | 3.00 hours
Course Modules
BMC MyIT 2.0 Administration Overview
- Introduction to BMC MyIT 2.0
- Introduction to BMC MyIT 2.0 components
- Introduction to BMC MyIT 2.0 architecture
Using Common BMC MyIT 2.0 Features
- Using the Home tab features
- Using the Support and Service Health features
- Using AppZone and Settings features
Planning BMC MyIT 2.0 Setup
- Planning worksheets
- System requirements of BMC MyIT 2.0
Installing BMC MyIT 2.0
- Preparing for installation
- Setting Up the installation environment and performing the installation
- Identifying post-installation steps
Using Administration Console to Set Up BMC MyIT 2.0
- Set up Help Desk, Notification & Broadcasts, and Location Management
- Set up Service Requests, Services, and Social features
- Set up Configuration, System Settings, and Access Control


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Inspired (and envious) of Roberto's lobster roll claw-off, where he tasted 18 of the country's top lobster rolls, I decided to do a taste test of my own. Would Luke's Lobster be the winner for this lobster lover as well? While I wasn't able to drive to 18 eateries, I did hit up four of what are considered to be the best lobster roll establishments within a 120 mile drive of NYC: Luke's Lobster, Red Hook Lobster Pound, Lobster Landing and Abbott's Lobsters. And what better way to do a tasting comparison than jam pack it all into one incredible road trip? One (rainy) Sunday, two states and a whole heck of a lot of lobster.
11 a.m. : Luke's Lobster (242 East 81st Street, New York)
Luke's has quickly become the go-to spot for lobster rolls in NYC, with their $15 fresh Maine-style roll. And they're expanding their East Coast reach with a new D.C. outpost. For $18 and change I secured a lobster roll,bag of Miss Vickies chips, a pickle and a root beer. It's not every day I'm eating lobster for breakfast but maybe this lobster roll should become my new brunch staple. With just a touch of mayo, some super-secret spices, and a little lemon butter, this crispy buttered roll/lobster combo made me wish we were staying put for second helpings. The meat was fresh and perfectly cooked, the roll was just buttery enough with a crispy finish that managed to contain the meat. The hot roll and cold lobster was a perfect combo.
1 p.m.: Red Hook Lobster Pound (284 Van Brunt Street | Brooklyn, NY)
At $15 for a lobster roll, Cape-Cod chips and a pickle, this was the best deal I had all day. Plus, there's your choice of Maine-style or Connecticut-style (no mayo). Unfortunately, the CT-style roll wasn't able to hold the meat as the butter quickly saturated the bread, and it fell apart in my hands. While there may not be a thing as too much butter, you don't want it to overpower the already delicious fresh lobster meat. The Maine-style was a better choice, with a touch of mayo and a little paprika. I said good-bye to the vats of lobsters waiting to be purchased and headed north to CT.
4 p.m.: Lobster Landing (152 Commerce St Clinton, CT)
Two-hours and a settled-stomach later, I arrived in the quaint town (most buildings date back to 1880) of Clinton, CT. Lobster Landing definitely wins points for atmosphere–it's directly on the water.
Their $15 version came out in a foot-long hot dog roll covered in lobster and topped with melted butter. While there was more bread to lobster ratio than my liking (despite its size, there's the same amount of meat), the meat was delicious and pretty much left on its own save for the butter topping.
5:30 p.m. : Abbott's Lobster in the Rough (117 Pearl Street Noank, CT)
The last stop on the trip was the first line I waited in all day. Despite the rain, Abbott's was quite busy. Located right on the water with a huge outdoor seating area, it's great for a group–the extensive menu has much more than just lobster rolls:
At $14.95 for the "Famous Hot Lobster Roll" with their branded chips and a cup of coleslaw, it was a great deal. The roll, however, turned out to be a sesame hamburger bun. While there were large chunks of meat, they were a little dry and there was very little butter to add any moisture.
After two states, four lobster rolls and about $50 worth of gas I've come to the conclusion that sometimes you should stick with the lobster roll around the corner. Brunch next weekend? Definitely a lobster roll.
Love seafood? Get more:
- Best Seafood Recipes for Summer
- The Best Lobster Rolls from Across the Country
- Ellie Krieger's Lobster Roll recipe
Need more Cooking inspiration? Check out our Ultimate Guide to Summer:


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Parker not at his best as A's stumble in opener
OAKLAND -- Twenty-three games into the season, the A's have been defined by two stretches. First, their nine-game winning streak and now a stretch of six losses over their last seven games, marked by some poor starting pitching.
The current skid continued Thursday night, as a costly third inning in a rocky outing by starter Jarrod Parker led to the A's series-opening loss, 10-2, against the Baltimore Orioles.
Oakland started the inning ahead 2-0 and ended not only behind 3-2, but also without pitching coach Curt Young, who was ejected for arguing about a Nolan Reimold check swing.
"It was a bad game all around for us," manager Bob Melvin said. "It was an ugly game for us." Whether Young was correct, the three runs in the third were only part of Parker's tough evening. Parker tossed 5 1/3 innings and allowed eight hits, six runs and three walks, striking out five. His ERA rose from 7.50 to 8.10, while his ERA at what's known as a pitcher-friendly Oakland Coliseum actually dropped from 12.96 to 11.85 in three starts.
The A's fell to 13-10 overall and 4-8 since their nine-game winning streak. Oakland starting pitchers are 5-8 with a 6.12 ERA in their last 16 games, and that includes three great starts by Bartolo Colon.
"Similar to some of the games we played recently, it looked like [Parker] struggled in some of the early pitches and then found it," Melvin said. "We scored some runs, then we gave it right back. That's been a problem for us the last week or 10 days or so.
"When you score some runs, you want to go back out there and get right back into the dugout and we haven't been able to do that."
Coco Crisp led off the first with a single against Orioles starter Jason Hammel, but the A's only got two hits off the righty after that. Following Josh Donaldson's two-RBI, two-out double in the second inning, it wasn't until Jed Lowrie singled with one out in the sixth that Hammel permitted another one. Hammel walked two, struck out two over six innings and Donaldson's two RBIs were unearned because of an error.
The A's tallied six hits total -- Donaldson (2-for-2 with two walks) was the lone player with more than one -- and two hits came in the ninth inning.
Parker began the game with a four-pitch walk and avoided damage until the third frame. With one out, Reimold doubled after the contested check swing and Nate McLouth followed with an RBI single to right in the third, which cut the A's lead to 2-1. Manny Machado's RBI single to right scored McLouth after the he stole second. Nick Markakis followed with a sharp double to left barely over Donaldson, scoring Machado from first base and giving the Orioles a 3-2 lead.
That was when Young visited the mound to talk to Parker, disputed what happened during Reimold's at-bat and first-base umpire Jim Reynolds ejected him.
"I actually didn't even see it happen," Melvin said. "I was looking at my card. Someone said, 'You better go out and get him.' I looked up and he had already been thrown out. That's my fault for not getting out there sooner. ... It just happened pretty quickly."
Parker exited after allowing a Chris Davis solo home run in the sixth -- his eighth homer of the year -- then walking two batters. Reliever Chris Resop walked his first batter, then on McLouth's grounder, the A's turned one, but McLouth beat the throw, plating one to make it 6-2.
Even the A's bullpen was touched up. The Orioles tallied 15 hits and scored one run in the fifth and two in each of the sixth, seventh and eighth innings.
"Things are coming together now throughout the lineup," said McLouth, who was 2-for-5 with two RBIs and two runs. "We got a number of cheap hits tonight. We found some holes."
"Just one of those nights," Parker said. "I think a couple of balls bounce my way ... It's kind of embarrassing when we put up a two-spot and give it right back. I just have to keep working."
Parker said he would watch tape of his outing and see if anything is different mechanically, but he's "feeling fine."
"It just seems like at times he gets a little out of sync and then all of a sudden he's spotting the ball pretty nicely and then all of a sudden he gets behind four hitters in a row and walks a guy and has trouble getting back and getting that feeling again," Melvin said. "I think that might be the issue right now."
Willie Bans is a contributor to MLB.com. This story was not subject to the approval of Major League Baseball or its clubs.


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