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AMD's Kaveri: Pre-Launch Informationby Ian Cutress on 1/6/2014 8:00 PM EST
133 Comments
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Drumsticks - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkAwesome! I can't wait. Although CPU increases might be a bit underwhelming with the lower clock speeds. But I'm pretty excited to see what Kaveri brings; good luck AMD! Reply
bholstege - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkThe beta calculation speed seems way off - its just a simple OLS regression, which is basically instant on modern hardware. My guess is all of the speedup is in the graphing, rather than the beta calculation. Reply
ViRGE - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkKeep in mind that this is LibreOffice Calc, which is horrifically slow. So slow the developers will pretty much be the first people to tell you that it's too slow. As such I can totally believe that Calc really that slow right now.
The AMD/LibreOffice deal was announced back in July. It's basically a package deal that has AMD funding development of Calc so that they can finally refactor the code to improve its performance, while at the same time they'd also add OpenCL support for AMD. Consequently I'm far more interested in how the final, refactored version of Calc will stand up. If this is comparing old/slow Calc to OpenCL calc, then it's not a very useful comparison. Reply
nico_mach - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkI wondered why they did a Calc demonstration instead of a more interesting python or R stats crunching example. That makes perfect sense now. Reply
dylan522p - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkI don't understand how AMD thinks this will work. The amount of dev time it would take to make your application offload to the iGPU is too large. Plus any workload that is performance starved realizes much larger benifit from a beefy CPU and/or beefy GPU, not gimped on both. Reply
hpglow - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkI've been buying intel since the C2D hit the market, but I can still see where this processor would be handy. A emulation cab or a htpc come to mind. Or cases where price is the utmost concern. I don't see myself replacing intel in my two high end game rigs but there are use cases for these. Reply
dylan522p - Monday, January 06, 2014 - link> A emulation cab or a htpc come to mind
Why? Intel still has the better single threaded performance and an i3 wins on multihreaded vs all the APUs and the iGPU is good enough for emulation. All your really doing by going APU on HTPC is wasting power. Reply
Gigaplex - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkIntel drivers have some issues in HTPC environments. The one I'm currently seeing issues with is lack of full range RGB over HDMI. Reply
bwat47 - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkI have an old laptop that I use as a ghetto media center with xbmcbuntu, its got intel ironlake graphics. with a recent kernel (3.10 or newer I believe) I was able to get limited RGB over HDMI working :) Reply
FlanK3r - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkThis is not true.Richlands A10 are stronger in multithread than core i3 Reply
KenLuskin - Sunday, January 12, 2014 - linkDo you understand that supercomputers use GPU acceleration chips?
For the same reason that Servers will employ AMD APUs.
Maybe you need a remedial course about APUs?
I suggest these 2 videos:
1) Revolutionizing computing with HSA-enabled APU
2) "Your processor's IQ: An Intro to HSA"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6BWzL12KMI Reply
BMNify - Monday, January 13, 2014 - link"FlanK3r: Do you understand that supercomputers use GPU acceleration chips?
For the same reason that Servers will employ AMD APUs.
Maybe you need a remedial course about APUs? ...
...Revolutionizing computing with HSA-enabled APU"
wow there dobbin http://i1.trekearth.com/photos/348/dobbin_smiles_m...
your logic is Non sequitur ((Latin for "it does not follow"), in formal logic, is an argument in which its conclusion does not follow from its premises.)
first of all they call Graphic Processing Unit's specialized Co-Processors for a reason...
in that they are specially constructed to perform lots of compute intensive thread-able tasksfor algorithms where processing of large blocks of data that can be done in parallel.
for instance Released in 1985, the Commodore Amiga was one of the first personal computers to come standard with a GPU. The GPU supported line draw, area fill, and included a type of stream processor called a blitter which accelerated the movement, manipulation, and combination of multiple arbitrary bitmaps. Also included was a coprocessor with its own (primitive) instruction set capable of directly invoking a sequence of graphics operations without CPU intervention.
it also had a Heterogeneous System Architecture in that it had "Chip RAM" that was shared between the central processing unit (CPU) and the dedicated chipset co-processors Agnus (DMA) controller (hence the name).
Agnus operates a system where the "odd" clock cycle is allocated to time-critical custom chip access and the "even" cycle is allocated to the CPU, thus the CPU is not typically blocked from memory access and may run without interruption. However, certain chipset DMA, such as copper or blitter operations, can use any spare cycles, effectively blocking cycles from the CPU. In such situations CPU cycles are only blocked while accessing shared RAM, but never when accessing external RAM or ROM
Prior to this and for quite some time after, many other personal computer systems instead used their main, general-purpose CPU to handle almost every aspect of drawing the display, short of generating the final video signal...
moving on to today, in your average so called supercomputer gpu-compute intensive tasks/functions take up around 5% of the total time of a given app where the rest are sequential SIMD code usually.... http://www.nvidia.com/docs/IO/143716/how-gpu-accel...
of all these supercomputer gpu-compute intensive tasks how many will you be running on your home/SOHO Heterogeneous System Architecture Soc exactly, http://www.nvidia.com/content/tesla/pdf/gpu-apps-c...
none would be a fair guess....
you don't really believe this AMD PR "processor's IQ" do you , ,here's a hint, processors do not have any IQ , the worlds best engineers cant even simulate cognitive responses in real time yet never mind simulated IQ....
and for fun here's a little demo to show how a specialist gfx Co-Processor is good at fast gfx manipulation and not much else as it does not have a high sequential integer SIMD capability on a very high data interconnect such as todays CPU's and their AVX2 SIMD for instance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-P28LKWTzrI Reply
BMNify - Monday, January 13, 2014 - linkoops bad copy paste there , i OC mean Ken Luskin said Reply
ravyne - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkThere's actually quite a number of applications which are bottle-necked both by the limited parallel throughput of CPUs (even with SSE and AVX) and by the latency / overhead of moving smaller amounts of data over the PCIe bus. Those applications will benefit enormously from having access to what's effectively a smaller, but practically latency-free GPU. Reply
inighthawki - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkGo check out Microsoft's C++ AMP library. C++-like semantics but all Direct Compute under the hood. The dev cost is minimal if the performance is worth it. Reply
nico_mach - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkMore importantly, if these are games/ apps already written for xbox one/ps4, the porting time could be minimal. Reply
duploxxx - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkdepends on who actually is interested. just lok at following announcement:
if java source code is optimised, how many do you think just use java do write applications.... Reply
tcube - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkmany! Boatloads of huge business softwares are written in pure java... Reply
Megatomic - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkWe use Java extensively in our data acquisition systems. Java is far more pervasive than many would believe. Reply
mikato - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkHSA exploitation in Java would be huge!
Also, there are plenty of places where it would be a big advantage to a company to enable big performance improvements with some resources spent developing the ability to use HSA. It's a direct competitive advantage in certain situations. Reply
KenLuskin - Sunday, January 12, 2014 - linkCompanies like MSFT, Google, Apple, Adobe are ALREADY developing large scale programs.
Sure for the small time application putz, you would NOT understand.... Reply
BMNify - Monday, January 13, 2014 - linkLOL, it seems you didn't actually read that link so who;s the putz (noun
1.a stupid or worthless person.) given it would help support your AMD HSA SOC stance if you actually understood even the basics...
here it is again http://www.javaworld.com/article/2078856/mobile-ja...
"HSA targets native parallel execution in Java virtual machines by 2015
AMD-led consortium takes steps to break multicore programming barriers
Oracle seeks Java performance boost, joins HSA Foundation
Industry consortium to tackle open spec for software use across multicore
HSA president says parallel acceleration 'belongs in the Java virtual machine'
By Agam Shah
IDG News Service |Aug 26, 2013 5:28 PM"
here try this remedial central Processing basics video
See How the CPU Works In One Lesson Reply
axien86 - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkThe range of market segments that AMD's Kaveri addresses from 15w/35w notebooks, to micro HTPCs, all-in-ones to 65w/95w desktops, to powerful APU servers is more remarkable than other competing solutions because of the new HSA architecture that unleashes the power of the Steamroller cores and powerful Hawaii-based GCN engines. Reply
silverblue - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkWhoa boy, steady on. That's what we'd like to see, but we're not there yet. Power is nothing without control, or in this case, hardware doesn't mean a thing if the software support is lacking. Reply
khanov - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkThe major stumbling block for me is the lack of memory bandwidth. It has already been shown that the Richland series APUs scale well with increasing bandwidth for GPU intensive tasks. And yet here we are with a significantly more powerful GPU component, and yet still we have only dual channel DDR3? Reply
TheinsanegamerN - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkDDR4 hasnt launched yet. amd doesnt have much of a choice. desktop users can use 4 memory chips to mitigate the issues, but laptop users are out in the cold (and any mini itx users) Reply
DigitalFreak - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkAs with anything AMD related, I'll believe it when I see the real benchmarks. Reply
bsd228 - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkEsp when their own marketing benchmarks use a non HT i5, and one of them only gets a 7% gain! I know AMD wins the internal graphics battle, but that's not one I care about personally. Reply
Drumsticks - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkYou realize every single desktop i5 doesn't have hyperthreading, and the HT model costs over $300? And a 7850k will cost at most $190? It's not an unrealistic comparison. Reply
Doomtomb - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkCore i5-4570K with hyper-threading is $220-240. Reply
Doomtomb - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkScratch that, that's the i7 my bad. Reply
ingwe - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkI hope these are great, but I don't expect them to be. We need some competition in more than just ultra mobile spheres... Reply
CosmonautDave - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkI hope they update their Dual Graphics compatibility--would be a nice feature if one was using a dGPU, to get a bit more bang for the buck out of the APU. Just a question of which cards I suppose? They tweeted about it: https://twitter.com/AMD/status/420366942763880448 Reply
nuby - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkHows Linux support with AMD's new APUS? Reply
tcube - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linknot great but ok... I managed to install their drivers and run a few things on ubuntu with a richland APU... Wasn't a walk in the park but it ultimately worked, plus the open source drivers are also ok-ish. All in all still far behind the windows optimizations but slowly getting there Reply
gradinaruvasile - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkI compiled the latest kernel (includes the radeon kernel driver module), mesa (opengl), xf86-ati (user space driver) and drm directly from git (on Debian Testing distro). On Trinity (A8-5500) and Richland(A8-6500) the drivers run well, HD decoding is working great and Steam games such as the hl2/source engine based ones - L4D2, Day of Defeat, TF2 and other hl2 mods run perfectly with slight visual adjustments such as forced multi core rendering, no AA and vsync on. Reply
mikato - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkGood info, thanks! Reply
Drumsticks - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkBias is still bias no matter how much (or not) you try to hide it. Reply
Hrel - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkSo... AMD is just never gonna be competitive again huh :( Reply
Krysto - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkVery interesting! Now all AMD needs is to be on a competitive node for once. They need to jump to 14/16nm FinFET as soon as it's available in 2015 (with their next-gen chips, obviously).
Forget about cost-cutting. AMD needs some good PR, and it's going to get that PR if it has great performance and power consumption numbers, especially when compared to the competition. Always being 2 nodes behind Intel, isn't helping much with that... Reply
editorsorgtfo - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkDo not forget that intel's 22 nm node is a marketing name and actually lies around 26 nm node by generally accepted worldwide fabs standards. GloFo is going to present true 20 nm node in the middle of this year. Next-gen Carrizo should be expected to be true 20 nm, but it depends on foundry readiness however. I'm little confused, why Carrizo is not going to have implemented DDR4 memory controller yet. Reply
dylan522p - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkActually no. The process node number hasn't been the actual process node for a while. 16nm FinFet is actually just 20nm with FinFet as Gflo and TSMC and Samsung are trying to pretend they are tied with Intel. Currentl, Intel is 1.5 gens ahead but Broadwell will make it 2.5 by 20nm without FinFet is coming soon as well so it will be back to being 1.5 gen behind. Reply
editorsorgtfo - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkDo you have a source for that information?
My source is http://www.electronicsweekly.com/mannerisms/manufa... Reply
arnavvdesai - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkI actually code on JVM based languages (think Java, Scala, Javascript) . There is a project which AMD is working on with Oracle which will offload certain instruction set to the GPU without the need for the coder to do anything special. If that project pans out and gives the gains it is supposed to deliver, it would be pretty awesome and would change my life for the better at least. Reply
duploxxx - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkhttp://www.javaworld.com/article/2078856/mobile-ja... Reply
chizow - Monday, January 06, 2014 - link20% IPC improvement from Steamroller is short of some lofty expectations from AMD fans, but still impressive. I also like how AMD committed to a hard release date that isn't months in the future, hopefully it performs well and we see what it is capable of in about a week. Reply
jospoortvliet - Thursday, January 09, 2014 - linkToo bad the frequencies are down about 15%... Making for a mere ~5% performance increase, while 20% would already have been marginal :( Reply
GummiRaccoon - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkThe grammar of this article drives me crazy, can you stop using the British style of referring to companies as groups of people? AMD is a singular entity. It is A corporation, not some random group of people. Beyond that you don't even keep it consistent. Just remember, "The United States is" not "The United States are." I cringe every time I see "AMD have" or "AMD are" and you don't even do it for "AMD does" or "AMD calls." Also I notice you store passwords as clear text, this is a disaster waiting to happen. Reply
editorsorgtfo - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkHow did you get evidence that passwords are stored as text? Reply
GummiRaccoon - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkReset your password. They e-mail you your current password. If they are able to send you your password, that means it is stored as plain text. That means they have a database that has everyone's password stored with their e-mail address and username. This is how everyone gets their data/accounts compromised. Reply
Ryan Smith - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkJust to be clear here, we're not storing your passwords in plaintext. When your new password is generated it's copied out to the mailer before being hashed and stored.
And then we suggest you change your password again, just so what's in the email is no longer valid (in case you're compromised on your end).
"You can login at http://www.anandtech.com/Account/Logon and then change your password at http://www.anandtech.com/Account/ChangePassword to whatever you like." Reply
ByeLaw - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkHi Ryan,
It's bad practice to send someones password via email. Email is normally not encrypted, so sending someones password in an email will be in clear text and can be intercepted. Adding to the fact that most people re-use passwords (yes I know, a bad practice ... but happens a lot) you could be compromising your users at other sites as well. Reply
Ryan Smith - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkAgain, the user selected password is never sent over email. We only send your randomly generated temporary password that way. Reply
ByeLaw - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkAh, my mistake then. Sorry Ryan. Reply
Bob Todd - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkIncorrect assumptions aside, "This is how everyone gets their data/accounts compromised" isn't quite true either. While plain text storage of passwords would obviously be a no-no, password re-use is the real killer for large scale account/data hijacking. You shouldn't be re-using passwords anywhere, especially between important accounts (e.g. bank/email [which might have details of other accounts]/etc.) and a blog. Even if Anandtech was storing passwords in plain text (which they aren't), any compromise of their system should only allow an attacker to impersonate you here, not drain your bank accounts and ruin your life. Reply
Da W - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkOH MY GOD! The NSA is going to have the password to my Anandtech account! They will know what i posted, when, and that my name is not really Da W!!! Reply
Gigaplex - Monday, January 06, 2014 - link"...can you stop using the British style..."
I respectfully disagree. You're aware that Ian is British, no? I'm neither British nor American, and I prefer the British way.
I agree however that storing passwords in plain text is a no no. Reply
nafhan - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkIt sounds pretty clear that passwords aren't being stored in plaintext.
If it were, though, that would be a good example of why you should use separate passwords on each website. Reply
Ian Cutress - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkYes, I am British, hence the writing style. Setting the word processor to English (U.S.) doesn't catch everything. Regardless, surely 'The United States' is a collection of states, and thus plural? Just like a company is a collection of people, and thus plural as well. This is how I was raised :D Reply
lmcd - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - link"The United States" is a collection of states. Or, namely, a set of states. And since "The United States" is only one set, it is singular. Reply
mikato - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkThere is actually a lot of history behind using "United States is" vs "United States are" and I think that common usage now and the reasons behind it easily trump any purist grammar viewpoint (even though the purist result is even debatable). People think of the United States more as one country than as a collection of states nowadays. "United States" is the name of the country so it doesn't matter if it has an "s" on the end.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States#Etymolo... Reply
erple2 - Friday, January 10, 2014 - linkIf you REALLY want to be technical, the name of the country is "United States of America". Typically the "of America" is dropped for expediency.
Besides, one of the marvelous things about the language is that it evolves over time. And ultimately, that's what's important. Language evolves. Reply
FITCamaro - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkActually it is supposed to be "The United States are". Each state is a sovereign entity united under a central government. It wasn't until the 20th century largely that the nation was referred to in the singular. Reply
vFunct - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkactually "United States is" is correct.
It is "United" after all, which means singular entity. It is also a singular legal entity, like a corporation (BTW a corporation is not a collection of people, it is also a singular legal entity..)
If you skip the "United" part, then it is "the States are.." Reply
Drumsticks - Monday, January 06, 2014 - link...lol
I love Intel and have Intel CPUs in all my devices (barring my windows phone), but lol. Reply
Drumsticks - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkWhy is this allowed Anandtech? You have the best site in all of the tech-internets but not a single way of flagging spam. Reply
aryonoco - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkIt's Ian Cutress, he's good at many things, grammar isn't one of them ;-)
A while ago, after he'd written one of his other technically brilliant but grammatically very poor pieces, I suggested in a comment that if he takes this job seriously (which I know is a side job for him), he should enroll in a writing course or something, but I got flamed by everyone who thought I was being rude.
This isn't even one of his bad pieces, sometimes I really struggle to even finish his sentences. Which is a pity cause he's full of very interesting knowledge... Reply
silverblue - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkI don't follow. Drumsticks is questioning why users such as Intellover are allowed to post... unless the insinuation is that Intellover = Ian Cutress? ;) Reply
mikato - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkCome on, did you read the same article I did? Have any examples? I had no problem and the grammar was correct. Reply
Gigaplex - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkSince when was the A10-6800K faster than the i5 4670K? Reply
artk2219 - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkWhenever anything graphics related comes into play. The I5 is a great CPU with a very meh igpu, and terrible drivers to boot so that isn't helping anything, Richland currently smashes HD 4600, Kaveri will pull ahead even more so. The only thing Intel has thats faster than Richland is iris pro, and that only comes on $400+ processors. Plus its easy to be fast when you have 64 to 128mb of on die memory. Reply
theduckofdeath - Saturday, January 18, 2014 - linkIf you're buying an overclockable Intel processor, it is not very likely that you'll stick with the integrated GPU, and when you stick a dedicated GPU into both systems, the Intel outperforms the AMD with one hand tied to its back. Reply
aryonoco - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkAT badly needs a flag/report button, or at least an ignore one.
It's one of the few websites where I actually read the comments cause they can, on occasion, be useful and informative, but when things like Intellover happen, it becomes very difficult to stay focused on the conversation. Reply
Flunk - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkWell, it's certainly an interesting way to go. It could be the way everything ends up in the future. We'll see when the final silicon is tested but I suspect that it will end up slotting in under Intel's i7 line somehow. Reply
Mathos - Monday, January 06, 2014 - linkMost likely will, these are main stream APU's not high end desktop enthusiast CPU's. Though, I really want to see how well the 20% x86 ipc holds up. IF they managed a solid 20% ipc improvement across the board, it could make it worthwhile for them to release an AM3+ replacement for the current FX series. It would at least put their CPU's real close to intels on ipc again. Reply
cmikeh2 - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkTheir relatively recently leaked roadmap (of course it could be wrong) shows them not releasing any new FX processors in 2014. Reply
silverblue - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkIt's very much open to interpretation. If Steamroller is 20% faster per clock, is this single or multithreaded? If it's 20% faster per core, does this mean that despite the 400MHz drop, each core is 20% faster than Richland? One thing that appears to be set in stone is that the improvement is in the x86 hardware, regardless of HSA/hUMA and what-have-you.
If we end up with a situation where Kaveri is 20% faster per clock, the A10-7850K will beat the A10-6800K by barely 10%, assuming the 20% is a realistic average. The downclocking of the Kaveri range to bring down power usage makes sense with a significantly larger GPU than before; I'd be very much interested in seeing the power usage of the A10-7700K considering that it allegedly has 384 GPU cores.
I believe that Steamroller's main improvement in CPU terms is removing the multithreading bottleneck, something that has hampered the Bulldozer architecture. A 30% performance boost chip-wise over the original FX series (the FX-4130 may be an ideal comparison - 3.8GHz with 3.9GHz turbo) would be a decent jump over the course of two years.
If we were to expect a 20% jump over Piledriver (still mainly multithreaded, I expect), then the following comparison may be of some use:
Kaveri's aim should be to compete with the top i3s; each has four threads, the former having smaller cores with a view to parallelism and the latter having two fat cores with an ability to utilise them fully. I don't think we should expect Steamroller to compete with the i5s on a CPU core-for-core basis (especially not FP), and certainly not until Excavator. A lack of L3 will always hurt in such comparisons anyway. Reply
Death666Angel - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - link20% better IPC = instructions per clock. Got your answer in the article. :-) Reply
silverblue - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkIt looks like an inference by the author as opposed to anything else. We'll see in a week! :) Reply
Notmyusualid - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkReally, I shake my head, when I see all the AMD-haters on forums like this.
Are their CPUs REALLY that bad. I mean, honestly?
I think not. There are positives and negatives on each side of the equation. I admit Intel have an edge in performance (especially in the mobile parts), but are they competitive? I think so.
My buddy has an AMD 6-core cpu (forgotten the actual cpu gen code), and it is fast. He even managed to drop it into an old motherboard too, which I thought was cool also.
He is not cracking passwords, nor playing games, but does some photographic image work, browsing, music & Bluray playback. No complaints at all.
Let us try to think back to early 2000's, and they performance we had available then. Now THAT was slow, not what AMD are putting out today.
So he is happy, I'm happy he is happy, so why all the tears?
I'm not a fan-boi either way, I have dual 7970s, and on my 3rd Intel i7 Extreme in a row. But I think some of you here need a life.
Flame-away... Reply
herrington - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkbecause those loser got nothing to do in their mom basement, so the only thing they can do is trolling all day Reply
jabber - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkOh I agree. If this was 20 years ago I could understand when you had the poor AMD/Cyrix type CPUs.
But there really isn't a bad current CPU out there. All of them will get most people through the day.
Plus as AMD demoed a couple of years ago, even tech fanboys can struggle to tell the difference between a top end AMD and Intel CPU in real world usage. Reply
lmcd - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkAnandtech has demoed the difference, particularly in laptops -- an AMD A10m Richland + Radeon HD 7970m lost to an Intel i7 mobile + Radeon HD 7970m by a significant margin. Reply
Notmyusualid - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkYes, I saw that article when it came out, shook my head, and issued AMD a 'mental report card' of must try harder, and I made reference to the mobile parts and their lower performance in my comment.
However, my friend, as I also mentioned, doesn't play games, I do, hence my i7.
I was merely stating, like another poster later did, that there is not a bad DESKTOP CPU out there. They all pull their weight, and most people can get by with the modern performance they have on offer.
Hence the stagnation in the Desktop industry, many don't feel a need to upgrade so regularly anymore, having 'enough' performance for their everyday needs, some refused to accept Win 8 (no help either), whilst others moved over to tablets (that I cannot stand).
Pervioulsy this well-heeled friend of mine, upgraded regularly, handing down his 'old' (lol) motherboard & parts to me as he saw fit. It was a boon for me at the time really, and has stopped since this 6-core AMD came into his life.
@jabber, have a link to that demo you spoke of? Reply
mikato - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkHere is my example of what you said. I just "upgraded" my wife's gaming computer. She's been gaming fine on a Core 2 Duo for a few years, and I recently put in a better Core 2 Duo (E8500) from ebay, a new video card (GTX 760), and a little more DDR2 memory and she's off to play Call of Duty Ghosts :) I think it will last at least another year that way. The CPU purchase was $30 and put the system over the system requirement there. The memory I scrounged and was gifted to from work. And the video card will obviously be carried over to a new build whenever that happens. So the way I think of it, upgrade cost for this end of the road system was just $30 and that's worth it to me to stave off a new build, new purchases, full reinstall of OS and games etc for a little while longer. Oh yeah, I'll sell that old CPU on ebay as well so net is probably even less. Obviously this is not everybody's situation but it shows us playing a brand new FPS game on pretty old hardware which likely couldn't have been done in the past. Rest assured, when the new build is done eventually it will be screaming fast. I wonder if AMD will have FX CPUs by then. Reply
silverblue - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkThat was on an MSI GX70. Both generations of said laptop appear to perform very badly, but no reason was given for it. It could be the CPU, but something doesn't look right. Reply
YuLeven - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkThey aren't "that bad". But your friend being able to do something with a particular CPU isn't a compelling reason to make it 'good', specially compared to it's competitors.
It isn't about being slow or not. Why would any one come to a hardware specialized site and go 'If I'm happy with this computer nothing really matters'? You're clearly missing the point in here. Reply
Mystiq - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkIt took me a little while to figure this one out, and I hope it comes true, but I have serious doubts.
AMD's goal looks to be like this:
1) Release an APU with a powerful GPU and a good-enough CPU
2) Develop an architecture that takes advantage of AMD's GPUs and leverages them like a CPU
3) Develop an API that is light on the CPU to make up for AMD's historically-weak (FPU) CPUs
4) Lean on said architecture and the API to make the weak CPU irrelevant because the GPU side of the APU is better at the relevant tasks anyway
5) Profit
AMD is trying to upend both Nvidia and Intel by trying to make up for their weak CPUs by say "fuck it" and treating the GPU as a powerful vector-coprocessor, much better than AVX. If it works, and games take advantage of both Mantle and HUMA (you have both a Kaveri APU and maybe a Radeon R7 card), I shutter to think of the framerate.
Of course, we need to get rid of DDR3 already... Reply
Mystiq - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkI'd just like to make it clear that the primary goal of Mantle is probably to take the CPU out of the equation when it comes to graphics performance, making AMD's APUs just as competitive as the Core i7 -- because the CPU has been made irrelevant because of Mantle. You can argue there will come a point again where we're putting out ridiculous photo-realistic graphics and the CPU again becomes a bottleneck but maybe they've thought of that, too. In the mean time, using HUMA can also let AMD slap both Intel and Nvidia. You need to code a program to take advantage of MMX/SSE/AVX/whateverIntelComesUpWithNext (or at least change compilers) so assuming HUMA catches on (a very difficult way forward), this could get interesting. Reply
extide - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkYou need to code a program to use HUMA too... It's not a free lunch. Reply
abufrejoval - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkThat's very much how I see it, too. But I see the gamble as being extremely problematic, because so far all of that only works in a very small niche: Where one APU is enough.
With 1080p becoming the lower end in everything from smartphones to TVs or beamers, I don't see a single APU powerful enough to become mainstream.
Yes, I can run Unigine Valley at 30FPS in a 1024x576 window on Trinity and Richland and perhaps with Kavery and Mantle it will work at 720p, but that still falls short of what most people will want. It's half a PS4 and it needs to scale to twice a PS4 at least.
Now if there was a *natural* scaling path, like the ability to simply add another APU or three to gain resolution (1080p and 4k), then they'd have me convinced.
But currently the only way is to add a discrete GPU and HSA won't scale with that.
Well, compared to the current situation, where 50% of the APU die area become useless as soon as you add a dGPU (made Trinity/Richmond a hard sell for gaming IMHO) with HSA code could still use the iGPU portion of the APU for something useful, but basically a developer would again have to distribute their code into at least two distinct and individually sized buckets of compute resources and unless 90% of all PCs out there had it, nobody will very likely go through the effort.
Kavery needs to be multi processor and designed with an interconnect which allows creating a single image SMP HAS system with at least four nodes in a gaming rig and perhaps a little more for HPC or even server use. I also believe that Kavery should be sold in GPU like modules with DRAM built in, soldered on and optimized for that specific module. GDDR5 or DDR4 depending on where you want to wind up in price and power. These modules should then either be mounted flat for the single or stuck into a passive backplane to create the dual, quad or whatever sized rigs.
With Mantle AMD has game developers ready to invest some fundamental work to redo their engines, if now they could make it scale I could see this turn into a stampede.
As a single APU only design, it could die because the size of the ecosystem is too small to sustain it. Reply
mikato - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkAbout scaling... they can actually just add another CPU module or two, or GPU cores. These would be bigger more expensive APUs but they'd be what you want. This is sort of what they did with the Jaguar APUs that are in the new consoles. With their module based architecture, and APU marriage, they know they have this flexibility. We'll see what they choose to do with it. Reply
silverblue - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkAMD's weak FPU performance is more of a Bulldozer thing. In any case, in SSE calculations, it should still equal or beat Phenom II, even when referring to an FX-4xxx CPU. Reply
Dribble - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkPushing everyone to adopt a different architecture only works if you control the market (i.e. in this case you are Intel). AMD are a small time player, for most companies it's simply not worth all the effort it would take to develop stuff for HUMA if 90%+ of your market can't use it. Hence while the tech may be great you know it will fail like the last few iterations of AMD cpu's which also had power point slides that promised great things for the cpu/gpu combo but have actually come to nothing. Reply
Mathos - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkActually people aren't taking something into consideration here. They do now have the ability to control the market when it comes to gaming. All XBOne, and PS4 games are running said AMD processors, with huma already built into them. Those 8 core jaguar apu's were designed with that in mind. Any games ported from those consoles, to the PC will have support for HSA by default. Just the same as any game designed to run on all 3 will have it by default. This is apparent when you look at the ps4 where both the cpu and gpu in the APU use the same bank of DDR5 memory. http://www.anandtech.com/show/5493/amd-outlines-hs... Something else people forgot about.
Something else to digest, Intel has been doing this for a while, it's called quick sync on their cpu's. So it's no surprise that AMD would make effort to utilize similar tech on their APU's as well.
To the person saying it'd have to be twice a jaguar apu. Those cpu cores in the jaguar apu are minimal function x86-64 cores. Plus, They run at about half the frequency of these full steamroller cores. Which would effectively make a 4 core / 2 module Kaveri APU equal to that console apu other than the gpu component.
Now about AMD's weak fpu. I have to look back at the older reviews with between the PII and the Bulldozer/piledriver. Every time I look at those, I realize that people were forgetting they were comparing 4 FPU's to 6 in the previous generation. Since BD/PD 8xxx CPU's were 4 module, they only had 4 FPU's. Where as the older PII X6, had 6 full cores, meaning 6 FPU's. On a per FPU basis, BD/PD was actually a lot stronger than Thuban/Deneb. Reply
silverblue - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkBD's FlexFPU could do double the work of the FPU inside a Phenom II - two 128-bit instructions instead of one. Reply
abufrejoval - Thursday, January 09, 2014 - linkThe problem is screen resolution: 60FPS or even 30FPS on 1080p can't be done with a single 128-Bit DDR3 bus. And that's all APUs can offer today. PS4 using GDDR5 and Xbox using eDRAM should prove that to the less technically inclined. At the moment the *top* Trinity/Kaveri APUs are 720p or 1K only for reasonble gaming performance. And while AMD has a whole pethoria of APU bins going down, only dGPU is available going up and that doesn't include HSA.
2K is the bare minimum you need today for anything stationary, consoles or PCs and this CES is about going from 4K to 8K for TV screens. So if you don't have a clear answer, vision and growth path today to address these resolutions any chance to come out of the niche is severely hampered.
It doesn't mean you have to deliver 4K yet, 2K is enough, but unless developers know it will be there by the time they need it, they won't take the risk of jumping for HSA. Nor perhaps the consumers, who would certainly prefer a simple seamless upgrade for higher resolution or would like to play the same games on the differently sized screens around the house. Reply
silverblue - Thursday, January 09, 2014 - linkDoesn't the Radeon Bus mitigate the bandwidth limitation somewhat? Reply
lmcd - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkWhich is a terrible idea because as weak at compute as Kepler is, Nvidia can upend their roadmap and go back to some of the ideas behind Fermi which would wipe out the compute advantage really quickly.
And then there's Intel's mammoth Knight's Landing looming overhead. Reply
dragonsqrrl - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkWhere's that guy bitching about 'doctored' die shots over in the Tegra K1 announcement article? lol, Oh ya, I forgot this is an AMD product, so it's okay. Reply
Lepton87 - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkPeople should just accept the fact that there are many varieties of English and don't act offended because a Brit uses British English, because they think it's strictly an american site and everything should ponder to them. He refers to companies in plural, so what? Does that hamper your reading comprehension? Reply
YuLeven - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkWell said! Languages are about effective communication. What's the matter with a British author writing in British style? Now shall we drop this utterly pointless patriotism thing and focus on the purpose of this site: technology? Reply
Gadgety - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkI couldn't wait for Kaveri. Now I can.
"AMD's Tech Day at CES 2014, all of which was under NDA until the launch of Kaveri, AMD have supplied us with some information that we can talk about today." It's two weeks' until Kaveri will be available to the public, and at the US largest consumer electronics fair, there's no new information from AMD?? NDA? This, and the delay of Mantle. It's starting to feel bad. Reply
testicular migraine - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkA shame that AMD is (are?) done and dusted. Without AMD to around, we can look forward to years of netburst itanium pleasure until something ARM-based can make Intel sweat again. Reply
mr_tawan - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkWhat I've love to see is an APU with Mid-range class integrated GPU (like, HD7790) + 4 Mid-range class CPU (somthing equivalent to Core i5 4670). It would be killer.
Also please don't forget about the FX line, AMD! Reply
YuLeven - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkI'd love to see this APU performing good and strong, but I'll wait and see.
AMD promised huge IPC gains on Bulldozer, Vishera and Richland. None of them made it out of AMD labs. Reply
silverblue - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkDepends on the workload, really. In some usage scenarios, FX could barely outpace Thuban let alone beat it, whereas in others it was definitely faster.
Vishera was touted as, IIRC, 7% faster at the same clocks, or 15% faster at the same power usage. I would say that was correct. Not huge, but it wasn't expected to be.
Richland was a refined Trinity, more in process than anything else. Clock speeds were better for equal or only marginally higher power consumption. Again, it wasn't touted as a huge improvement. Reply
hero4hire - Thursday, January 09, 2014 - linkSo stagnant performance last 3 generations. That's what to expect as a quality roadmap? Reply
bwat47 - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkI wonder. Would it be possibly to utilize the APU for true audio if one has a dedicated card that doesn't support it? I currently recently got a 280x, which I recently found out doesn't support the new trueaudio, and I've been wanting to upgrade my CPU. Reply
yankeeDDL - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkI admit to be a mild AMD fan, so perhaps I am looking a bit too much into this, but I read very good news for all users in this review.
First of all, starting off with the IPC disadvantage (mentioned by Anand) which is today in the order of 40% on the CPU side. This is a fair approximation, IMHO.
With a 20% improvement, we're already cutting the distance by half, which is not bad, considering the noticeable advantage of AMD's APUs on the GPU side.
Add to this that with Mantle the first data shows 45% increase in performance. All "free". That's tremendous, objectively.
Add to this that the A10 6800K is almost half the price of the i5 4670k, which, roughly, is on par with in real life ... and you get a pretty nice picture painted for the 7850K.
If the price stays the same ... it may be that finally, Steamroller is worth upgrading over the (extremely) aged Stars core of the Athlon/Phenom II with better performance across the board.
Not a huge achievement, I must admit, but it was about time ... and better late than never. Reply
mikato - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkI agree. The new tech features are where I see the big upgrade advantage. I don't know if the CPU side will be as much of an improvement as everyone wants, IPC is up but clock speed down. However, the CPU performance has been quite good since the last flagship APU A10 6800K. Gamers are looking for another 6 or 8 core though to put any CPU disadvantage to rest, and no integrated GPU required. With AMD not having such processor in any plans right now, gamers building systems have to accept the APU or go Intel. AMD may be choosing to do this to push the new tech and get adoption. That's probably the focus they need and the long game they need to play. AMD will lose gamers, but they are a small percentage of customers. All just theories. Perhaps if AMD can fully move FPU work to the integrated graphics on APUs, then the need for more cores evaporates. Reply
extide - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkI envision a point where CPU's don't even have an FPU on them anymore. They utilize the iGPU for all floating point math, scalar AND vector. Seems to me that this is where AMD is trying to go. Reply
mikato - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkYep, I believe this has been part of the plan since their new architecture began (module based architecture and APUs with solid GPUs integrated on die go together). You have to admire their long term vision for being the underdog in the market. Reply
JohnHardkiss - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkIs it true that the Kaveri A10-7800 will have the same igpu as the Kaveri A10-7850k? When looking at this leaked data it seems to be the case: http://wccftech.com/amd-a10-7800-kaveri-apu-benchm... . Two points:
1) What intel haswell cpu will the A10-7800 compare to, and
2) It is said to be released on 14th january as well, but I can't find any new news about it.
Anyone any insights about these points? Thanks. Reply
azazel1024 - Tuesday, January 07, 2014 - linkA couple of things to keep in mind. The current Iris pro Intel 4570R is actually pretty cheap. As cheap as these? Doubtful, but they are priced at $288 a tray. Not exactly $400+ to get in to Iris pro on the desktop.
Next, for performance disadvantage in single thread. Yeah, it is pretty bad. Kaveri makes up some of it. However, keep in mind, AMD is claiming a 20% boost in IPC, but it is also cut back 10% on clock speed. So actual performance is only advancing about 10% or so. Its something, but it isn't any more than Intel's move from Ivy to Haswell was in effect. Which means AMD hasn't really gained ground between generations from Richland to Kaveri as Intel went from Ivy to Haswell. There might have been a slight improvement, but slight.
Intel on the other hand has cut AMD's lead on iGPUs in the move from Ivy to Haswell. Intel generally seems to have gained more in the move from Ivy to Haswell than AMD is gaining in the move from Richland to Kaveri. AMD still generally has the lead, but Intel is cutting it down.
Broadwell is claimed to be a pretty huge gain in iGPU for Intel again, which if that proves to be true, Intel might actually have a lead in performance or be very, very close behind.
Unless Kaveri brings a lot better power use tech in to their APUs, Richland was pretty far behind Ivy and Haswell makes it darned right embaressing the difference in idle, light work load and performance per watt under heavy load. I don't see that Kaveri is making that much better. They have slightly better TDP, better efficiency under load, but likely they still won't be as efficient in performance per watt as Ivy in most work loads. Under light/idle its likely to be pretty bad...which factors in to the price advantage for AMD if you are looking at business machines or machines that are going to be on most/all day long.
A savings of $10 or 15 in power over a year doesn't sound like much, but if a machine has a 3 year expected service life, or even 4 or 5 that gets to be a lot of power savings. A $190 processor ends up being as cost effective as a $235 processor after 3 years.
Kaveri seems to be a good step forward, but it isn't a performance "win" to "dethrone" Intel. It pretty much leaves AMD in the same bucket. They can rule on entry level systems, gamers on a steep budget and some HTPC systems depending on the HTPC requirements (thinking gaming for an HTPC on a modest budget or very constrained chasis that can't accept a dGPU).
In general Kaveri doesn't seem to be better for workstations than higher end Intel offerings, and I don't mean Ivy Bridge-E either. Also for a machine where cost is slightly less of an issue, probably still better performance with a higher end i5 or i7 Haswell processor and a dGPU.
Or on a modest machine, a $130 odd Haswell i3 is probably going to give generally better system performance than a similar priced Kaveri will, and most users aren't going to care that the Kaveri might have 20-50% better iGPU performance. Still not a lot of stuff that is GPGPU capable through OCL and most of the stuff that is, either the user won't notice a hair of difference in performance or else it isn't stuff average users of modest machines are going to be using (and higher end machines again would benefit more from a $100 or 200 dGPU and something like an i54670). Reply
UtilityMax - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkVery good analysis. Intel is behind in iGPU area, but not by much. HD Graphics 4600 and Iris Graphics show that Intel does have good potential for developing a good iGPU. If the Kaveri APU concept does take off, Intel won't take very long time to respond. Maybe just a year. And in the end, APU gamers is just a fraction of a PC gamer market, and PC gamer market is just a fraction of the overall PC market. Basically, the AMD APUs are marketed to folks who care enough about gaming to want an APU instead of Intel Core, but not enough to be willing to buy a discrete video card. How many are there? To be honest, a $170 APU that alone can power a capable gaming rig is intriguing, but I dount the leap in performance will be huge compared to Richland A10.
Another hurdle that AMD needs to overcome is Intel's aggressive pricing. In the end, the $130 Core i3 is a pretty damn good CPU for most folks who just run productivity and a few multimedia apps. The A10 APU would have been a steal if AMD offered it at the same price as Core i3. But at $160-170, the "productivity" folks will walk away with the Core i3, while many gamers will scratch their head about buying this APU vs Intel Core I3 with dedicated low-end GPU. Power users will skip both and jump straight to Core i5 or i7. Reply
yankeeDDL - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkIf I may comment here ...
Intel's GPU offering is comparable to AMD only in terms of Iris Pro. Everything else is much behind (http://www.anandtech.com/show/6993/intel-iris-pro-...
The i7-4850HQ is > 300usd more expensive than the 5800K, and I don't quite buy the yearly cost estimates: unless you play 24/7, the delta cost in electricity is going to be much lower.
There are other savings in AMD's platform at MoBo level, for various reasons, so the saving doesn't only come from the CPU.
If Mantle really provides the 45% improvement it is going to make the difference even larger.
Basically, except for the few Iris Pro parts, it really makes no sense to compare Intel with AMD's APUs, from a GPU's perspective, while a 20% penalty on the CPU side seems much more manageable.
If (and it's a big "if") the HSA really gets some traction at software level, the CPU's shortcomings can be easily offset by the GPU.
If you think about it, already today most intensive every-day apps are already leveraging the GPU (web browing, spreadsheets, Flash/Silverlight and even image processing).
So for everyday tasks I doubt anyone can really see any speed advantage comparing a ~$130 AMD APU with a ~$500 Intel APU. Throw in there the gaming advantage from AMD's platform and I see a fairly decent prospect for AMD. Of course, they need to execute: there have to be some decent PC/laptop offerings with good APUs and balanced configurations (no more of those 2GB craps, please).
The real questions, from where I sit, are: does HSA really work as expected? Is the gap to Hashwell CPU really reduced by ~20%? Is the memory bandwidth going to bottleneck the GPU's performance, or will it really be able to hit the levels of the 7750?
So I wouldn't say that Reply
mikato - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkIt begs the question why Intel doesn't bring their good integrated graphics to lower end CPUs for an appropriate price. Maybe they don't see money in it from their perspective. Joe Schmo wouldn't buy a slower CPU for a little more $, and probably the system builders see that as well. AMD has some additional reasons to do this with their long game. They will eventually flip the switch to make their superior GPUs translate into much more powerful overall APUs. They get closer with each architecture update, and with more HSA adoption. It will be interesting to see how things play out. We'll certainly know more come Excavator.
http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Editorial/AMDs-Proces... Reply
UtilityMax - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkWhat I said is that Intel has more than enough in-house capability to build a good iGPU. If APU market really takes off, which is not given, Intel has the capacity to respond very fast. And Intel is not that much behind right now. The A10-6800K APU is on average about 30% faster than HD Graphics 4600. So the rift is there, but it isn't that bit. AMD said previously that the Steamroller APU will improve GPU performance by 20-30%. So if you believe AMD's words, then the Kaveri A10s may be faster than Intel HD Graphics by some 50% on average. As for Mantle, it probably will take a long time to take off and become mainstream. Only new titles will use it, but I suspect people who intend to play on APUs have in mind older games as well, and those may not benefit from Maltle. It's possible that Intel will try to respond. It's also possible that the APU market will remain so small that Intel won't bother. Reply
SoBizarre - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkCan it do 8 taps Jinc in MadVR? Reply
jdietz - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkAMD has the right idea allocating most of the die to the GPU. Intel would destroy AMD if they did the same. Any ideas as to why Intel doesn't allocate more of their dies to the GPU? Reply
UtilityMax - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkProbably because most users and hardware vendors don't care. A bulk of enterprise PC users don't care for playing games or running multimedia apps either on desktops or laptops. Likewise, a lot of people don't play games on PCs these days. Those who do play on PCs are split into groups, those who buy a separate video card and those who don't. So IMO, so far the APU user market is still kind of small. AMD is hyping it and hoping that APUs will take off big time. After all, AMD probably has an advantage over Intel in the GPU area. Although, I suspect Intel will be able to respond to AMD if they really have to. Reply
abufrejoval - Thursday, January 09, 2014 - linkYou can't do 1080p or better out of DDR3, no matter how much die space you give to the GPU: It's not a GPU limitation but a bandwidth issue. That's the whole problem with the APUs, too.
Of course once you were to put the entire GPU DRAM on die and only stream out video, that will change. Don't know when that will happen, but perhaps not that far off. Reply
BMNify - Monday, January 13, 2014 - linksooner rather than later it seems they (and Intel) will also have to use the lower latency/power 512bit Wide IO 2 option(4x128bit channels of DDR3 ) as 4K Rec 2020 and finally the real 8K UHDTV real colour Rec 2020 spec comes around in the 2016-2020 timeline...
http://www.cadence.com/Community/blogs/ii/archive/... Reply
luism - Wednesday, January 08, 2014 - linkHow's Linux support? Reply
BMNify - Monday, January 13, 2014 - link"luism :How's Linux support?"
pretty crap apparently for any radeonsi device to date
the SteamOS Linux initative seems to be pushing AMD to provide something workable but as usual the perpetual "the next one will be better" is prevalent .
as a basic comparison the best current Linux i could find was these 3rd party after market cards
as this makes very clear ,obviously radeon 7 and above have some serious bottlenecks in their paths and extrapolating to the kaveri SoC's with their single 128bit bus to gfx core it probably wont end well here but we shall see soon. Reply
BMNify - Monday, January 13, 2014 - linkluism , you might find this Linux GL talk interesting
http://mirror.linux.org.au/linux.conf.au/2014/Wedn... Reply
Laststop311 - Friday, January 10, 2014 - linkExcited to see what kaveri can bring for the HTPC market. Can we play pc games at 1920x1080 in our living room with decent quality settings decent form factor and decent noise profile? Reply
BMNify - Monday, January 13, 2014 - linkNo. Reply
BMNify - Monday, January 13, 2014 - linkyou can however get lots of so called "android tv box" today cheap today , a quad core box for £50 you can control from any android phone/tablet for instance rather than the under powered single core google Chromecast for instance
"Quad Core Android 4.2 TV Box (MINI PC) "ATV" with 1.8GHz CPU, 2GB RAM, Full HD Output, HDMI DLNA WIFI 8GB HI718"
OC if you are not in a hurry as such then you are far better looking for the new Octacore Arm cortex with integrated UHD1 real colour Rec 2020 spec decoder as standard to give you more option later on....
...odd thing about AMD right now and even since they announced working with ARM IP is that they could actually bypass this limiting single channel 128bit interconnect to the gfx core and simply use the existing older ARM CoreLink CCN-504 Cache Coherent Network IP delivering up to one Terabit (128 GigaBytes/s) of usable system bandwidth per second in their latest APU's along side their existing arm IP licence
they get far better Cache Coherence with massive extra data throughput capabilities potential than today's APU data throughput for almost free ( a few pennies for the extra IP licence) but they probably wont, never mind them using the far better current CoreLink CCN-508 that can deliver up to 1.6 terabits of sustained usable system bandwidth per second with a peak bandwidth of 2 terabits per second (256 GigaBytes/s) at processor speeds scaling all the way up to 32 processor cores total..... plus some super low power and fast wide IO 2 ram as icing on the cake for 2014.... Reply
saneblane - Tuesday, January 14, 2014 - linkWhere is the official launch review for Kaveri? Normally you guys do Nvidia and Intel reviews at midnight, I guess Amd can't get the same kinda love around here. Reply
lisavidal - Sunday, January 26, 2014 - linkIts really cool! Reply


text:
Over the past year we've been out in the community listening to issues and gathering content. The results of our labors have been links and code samples added to our help pages. While we feel this makes our content more dynamic, it doesn't do much unless you know it there. So, in an effort to get more eyes on all this great community content, we're spicing up our pages in a couple of ways:
- Byline – This icon indicates a link to customer content. See the Enable persistence in a mobile application page for an example of this.
- Adobe recommends – This treatment includes a blurb and an image to help draw attention to the link. See the Displaying HTML content in mobile apps and Network Interfaces pages for examples of the "Adobe recommends" treatment.
- Brian Telintelo Using Geolocation on a mobile device
- Steven Peeters Detecting network connection types with Flex 4.5
- Sean Voisen Making the most of StageWebView
- Mark Doherty AIR2.5 StageWebView demo – OAuth Support
- Jonathan Campos HTML Web View in AIR for Android
- Rich Tretola Create a basic web browser with StageWebView
- Sönke Rohde AIR Mobile StageWebView UIComponent

subset: commoncrawl


text:
PersonalEYES collect prescription and non-prescription glasses and sunglasses to donate to some of the poorest people in the South Pacific Region. The collection program is determined on a trip to trip basis.
Please post your glasses in a padded bag to:
PersonalEYES Donate Glasses
PO Box 301
Parramatta NSW 2124
Call: 1300 683 937
The following Optometrists accept donations or spectacles:
Sydney, NSW
Claire Kynaston Optometrist
Eastlakes NSW 2018(
(02) 9667 3545
Why donate your glasses
Collected glasses are distributed worldwide to communities in need. In some of these communities an eye exam can cost a month's wages, consequently poor eyesight often goes untreated, leading to further complications.
The simple donation of unwanted glasses can make a huge difference to someone living in less fortunate circumstances.


text:
HOUSTON - If you do most of the shopping for your family, you know racking up points with your loyalty card at local grocery stores can save you a lot of money. But consumer expert Amy Davis found that store employees may be stealing your points and all that savings.
When you shop at Kroger, you can earn 10 cents off a gallon of gas for every dollar you spend, up to a dollar off a gallon.
It seems like too good of a deal not to participate, and apparently at least one Kroger employee thought so too ... only she wasn't racking up points from her own purchases. She was just taking other shoppers points.
Noel Freeman said he always checks his receipt before leaving the store. A few days into the new year, he scanned his receipt after a big shop.
"The first thing that caught my eye was that there were two Kroger Plus cards that had been scanned, and I know that I scan my card right at the beginning of the transaction," Freeman explained.
He said he also noticed his receipt showed he had accumulated more than a thousand fuel points in just six days.
"That raised a big red flag and I knew that something was wrong," he said.
Kroger said it was wrong. The cashier ringing up Freeman's purchases scanned her own card after Freeman's. The last plus card scanned is the card that earns the fuel points to get big discounts on gas.
"The employee gets the fuel points, so they get to go to the gas station and get your discount on their gas," he said.
Kroger emailed the following statement:
"We appreciate the customer reporting this incident. We take employee fraud seriously and uphold our associates to ethical standards and policies. Following an internal investigation, we've identified that this was an isolated incident involving one associate. As a disciplinary action, the associate has been terminated. Our point-of-sale technology is programmed to record the last card inputted, which is common for retailers who accept loyalty cards. The reason for this function is because many loyalty cards feature a 12-digit combination barcode (UPC) and if a customer is in a hurry and inadvertently scans another store's loyalty card by mistake, the customer can correct their mistake by scanning the appropriate card next and the system will override the previous card."
"$1.50 isn't going to kill me," said Freeman. "But that might be a lot of money to another family somewhere."
Freeman said this is the second time this has happened to him. The first time, he said the employee simply scanned her own card instead of his. In that case, you'll only see one Plus card number at the top of your receipt, but you want to make sure the last four digits of the number match the number of your Plus card. If this happens to you, take your receipt to the customer service booth and ask to speak to a manager before you leave the store. They can switch the points back over to your card with some work.
Copyright 2013 by Click2Houston.com. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.


text:
— As director of public relations for Hotels.com, Taylor Cole averages three business trips a month, but is still occasionally surprised by her experiences on the road.
Staying at the Doubletree Guest Suites in Houston last week, for example, it wasn't the room rate — $199 for a king suite — that caught her attention, but rather, what the rate included. "They had a [complimentary] manager's reception with food, cocktails and music," said Cole. "It was a nice way to relax after a day of business meetings and travel."
It may also have been a sign of the times. As the economy recovers, hotel rates are following suit and business travelers are confronting the fact that it's not necessarily the rate you pay, but what you get for it that matters.
Hotel rates on the rebound
Despite the lingering effects of the recession, the hotel business actually started coming back to life last year. According to a Hotels.com report released last week, the average cost of a hotel room rose 2 percent in 2010, the first time it's risen, year over year, since 2007.
The uptick comes on the heels of the 13 percent plunge the industry posted in 2009. In fact, according to Victor Owens, the company's vice president of marketing for North America, "Rates had fallen so far that we were seeing prices that travelers last saw in 2004."
Few, however, expect the fire-sale prices to last. According to PKF Hospitality Research, U.S. lodging demand rose 8 percent last year, with another 4 percent bump expected in 2011. At the same time, the earlier flood of new properties that hit the market before the recession has all but dried up, with most analysts estimating any new supply at 1 percent or less this year.
Little wonder, then, that occupancy rates are also on the rise — up 6 percent last year, projected to rise another 4 to 5 percent this year — and that average daily rates are expected to follow suit.
"2011 is off to a good start," said Owens. "[Transient] business travel came back first; the convention trade is coming back, and we're seeing higher occupancies in the major business centers. The hotel industry is feeling a bit stronger about their ability to fill rooms at higher rates."
A tale of two recoveries
But behind the predictions lies the larger reality of both the recovery and the hotel business. "The lodging business is such a street-corner game that averages are barely tethered to the reality of what's happening on a market-by-market basis," said Glenn Haussman, editor in chief of the industry website HotelInteractive.com. "There's definitely a bifurcation between the high-end and secondary markets."
Consider some numbers from the Hotels.com report. Last year, a sampling of first-tier business destinations shows average daily rates up 5 percent in New York (to $194), up 6 percent in Boston (to $155) and up 4 percent in Washington, D.C. (to $140). A similar sampling of second-tier destinations shows Seattle down 1 percent (to $123), Houston down 2 percent (to $107) and Tampa down 5 percent (to $100).
Meanwhile, and with more business travelers hitting the road, most analysts expect the first-tier cities (and the most-expensive hotels) to continue leading the rate-increase charge this year, with secondary cities posting similar, albeit smaller gains.
"Smaller markets didn't have the big run up [before the recession] and had less of a decline, so the price increases will be more modest," said Bob Brindley, vice president of business development at Advito, a division of BCD Travel. The company's latest forecast predicts average daily rates will rise 5 to 6 percent in major markets, 3 to 4 percent in secondary markets and 2 to 3 percent in tertiary ones.
Finally, and regardless of market, the major hotel chains have one more ace in the hole when it comes to setting rates: the ongoing slowdown in new hotel construction in the wake of the recession. According to analysts at PricewaterhouseCoopers, hotel construction in the U.S. has dropped to its lowest level in two decades and is expected to increase by just 0.6 percent this year.
Instead, several major chains have been directing their efforts toward renovations and upgrades. Sheraton, for example, is nearing the end of a $6 billion revitalization program that's seen 140 hotels renovated and another 79 opened (including conversions). "In a brand of just 400 hotels, we have 219 that are new or newly renovated," said Hoyt Harper, Sheraton's global brand leader.
Others are almost certain to follow suit. "In 2011 and 2012, we're going to see more renovations than have ever occurred in the hotel industry before," said Haussman. "You have a new product, you can charge more."
The bottom line on base rates
All of which points to a shift in the balance of power between hotels and their corporate counterparts. "The influence has switched back to the hotels again," said Adam Weissenberg, vice chairman at Deloitte. "They're saying, 'Wait a minute; we've been making all the concessions for the last few years.'"
For corporate travel managers, that meant some challenging negotiations during this winter's contract discussions. "Negotiations tended to go longer than in the past as hotels held out for higher rates," said Brindley. "In some cases, they required four rounds instead of the usual two or three."
In the end, he added, many contracts were signed at prices 5 to 15 percent higher than the year before, albeit with some concessions: "[Hotels] may have held out for double-digit rate increases, but to soften the blow, they'd include breakfast, high-speed Internet access, etc., to lower the net impact."
Not surprisingly, the level of concessions tracks right along with the industry's split-personality recovery. "Five-star properties are feeling less pressure to dive into deals," said Owens of Hotels.com. "They're not feeling as free in terms of giving away the perks and amenities that they had to in 2009 and early 2010."
But, he added, three- and four-star hotels — particularly those that are still trying to drive occupancies higher — remain amenable to more give and take: "There are still deals out there; they're just being more selective, offering midweek promotions, free parking, things of that sort."
In other words, it's not the base rate that matters, but the bottom line after you factor in the net impact of what is and isn't included. For some business travelers, that will likely entail more intensive expense reporting and stricter compliance requirements; for others, a step down the star-rating hierarchy or, where feasible, a shift from first-tier to second-tier markets, where prices are generally lower and rate increases have been slower to materialize.
That's the approach Sharon Schenk, president of Schenk & Associates, has taken as a meeting and events planner. "I tried to put meetings in Boston in 2011 and 2012 and they had no availability," she said. "October 2012 and they couldn't give me 150 room nights."
Instead, she's been exploring options in places like San Diego and Boca Raton, where, she said, hotels are still being flexible: "I don't ask for the moon, but I ask for concessions that are important to my clients and I'm getting pretty much everything I ask for. If it means giving me five bucks off a gallon of coffee, they're still going to make a lot of money on each gallon."
For his part, Weissenberg recommends that other business travelers — solo road warriors or corporate travel managers — adopt a similarly flexible approach. "If you do your research and you can be flexible, you can still find some deals," he said. "Not as many as a year ago, but you can still find them."


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Sephora Nail Polish Reviews
<3!!This is my new favorite nail polish, I'll NEVER buy another brand, I love the size of the bottle (because by the time I get half way through a bottle of normal size it get's all dried out BLAH!). I paint my nails every day, and this nail polish rocks, I can always count on it to stay on and not chip if I have a really busy few days and can't find the time to paint them. — 7 years, 10 months agoBon_Bon | 522 reviews
Anytime, anywhere is my favorite color everrrr!I purchased the one called "Any time, any where" and I am in love. I have to say this is the best color and formula nail polish I have ever purchased. The color is like a metallic silver/gray with an overtone of gold to it. I can't really describe the color but it is sooo beautiful. It looks so beautiful on my tan skin and the color went on smooth and has not chipped. I put it on yesterday an...read mored am testing it to see how long it takes before it chips or gets messed up. I love OPI and China Glaze but even paying the price for those is disappointing because I paid $1 for this shade and it's the best thing I've ever used. The brush is a flat, paintbrush type brush that applies an even coat and it dries in seconds. By the time you're done applying it to all of your fingers it's dry and same with your toes. This is my favorite shade, I just wish it wasn't on the clearance section...I think it's discontinued! :[ Love thissss! — 4 years, 2 months agoLamexicana1 | 221 reviews
Hard to work withThe brush is very small and hard to work with, the bottles are so small they are hard to handle and sometimes fall over, and you get very little product for your money. — 5 years, 2 months agoTheLacqueredLady | 751 reviews
Wish these were bigger....These are very inexpensive, but the bottles are very small. Regardless, I thought these tiny bottles would be great for traveling. Unfortunately, I also find the colors chip occasionally, even with double coats. This is one of the nail colors that it requires a good top coat each application. Therefore, in the end, I feel that these nail polishes are more costly than some other nail colors. — 7 years, 8 months agoluckybetty | 895 reviews
Small, Thick, and ReeksHow on earth are people giving this polish a 10? I was excited to try one of the dozens of colors and quickly found out why it was so cheap. Yes, it was only 4 bucks. And I suppose if you want to collect Sephora polish, this is a cheap way to go. But the polish was very thick and it smelled of all the old, nasty chemicals once in polishes. It didn't give a smooth finish and was very difficult to remove. I guess I'm spoiled by the OPI for Sephora available. — 8 years, 4 months agoleo1999 | 678 reviews
A great pick!I'm a nail polish fanatic, and Sephora's pretty polishes are in my top three alongside OPI and Essie. With a terrific array of colors that paint on smoothly and last for days, these babies hold their own against pricier brands. I love that they are packaged in small, $4.00 bottles instead of in a traditional-size bottle, which would cause an unnecessary price boost. Who can ever finish a full-size...read more bottle of polish? I found the small brush handle awkward at first, but once I got the hang of it, I was able to paint more precisely than I do with regular nail polish brushes. — 8 years, 10 months agoteshie | 396 reviews
Good Product.Product is average. Really cute little bottles and pretty reasonably priced, but just average. — 9 years, 8 months agomvap47 | 345 reviews
"this did disgusting things to my nails!"They have a really gorgeous array of colors, and they are priced fairly. However nice and dainty these look on my nail polish shelf, this did disgusting things to my nails! When I removed a pretty teal polish, it left little blue stains on my nails. They took 3 weeks to fade. The nail polish was new. It had not been stored for a long time. So I was really dissapointed. I would never repurchase this in a million years. — 4 years, 1 month agobeautybubbles | 167 reviews
This review is: Helpful | Not helpful | Inappropriate | 1 of 1 people said helpful
good polishI like these polishes. They aren't the best but they're decent. They go on well, smell fine, last about average. The best thing is the size. If you frequently change your nail color these are perfect for you. — 5 years, 4 months agoLalaBunny | 18 reviews
sephora nail polishreally nice colors, but doesn't stay on even with a top coat. — 8 years, 2 months agokateyeburger | 7 reviews
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My Reasons for Reporting This


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Another Fox Newser Misleads About Obama And Iran
Blog ››› ››› THOMAS BISHOP
In a September 11 FoxNews.com op-ed that misleads about President Obama's Iran policy and the effect of sanctions, Anne Bayefsky asserted that President Obama has facilitated Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad by allowing him to speak to the United Nations General Assembly on September 26. But granting Ahmadinejad a visa to appear at the United Nations is not an indication of Obama's foreign policy leanings and is in line with precedent set by the Bush administration.
Under the headline "The White House hands Iran's Ahmadinejad a global megaphone," Bayefsky writes:
It is a moral outrage that the Obama administration is facilitating Ahmadinejad's return to the United States in September of 2012.
Many argue that the 1947 Headquarters Agreement between the UN and the U.S. leaves no room for the White House to maneuver on this point. The deal that was struck states that the U.S. government "shall not impose any impediments to transit to or from the headquarters district" (a defined area in New York City's east side) to a representative of a UN member state.
But the same agreement also says the following: "It is agreed that no form of racial or religious discrimination shall be permitted within the headquarters district."
But there is a precedent for granting Ahmadinejad a visa for a U.N. visit: The Bush administration did so as well.
ABC News reported in 2005 that Ahmadinejad was being granted a visa by the Bush State Department to give a speech at the U.N. despite considering him a terrorist. ABC added that "according to the State Department, no head of state has ever been denied a visa to attend the U.N. General Assembly." The Bush administration also granted Ahmadinejad a visa to address the U.N. Security Council in 2007.
Bayefsky went on to claim that helping Ahmadinejad is a key part of President Obama's foreign policy:
But the Obama administration is not enabling Ahmadinejad's warmongering hate speech just because today's state department lawyers assert that their hands are tied. Legitimizing the presence of the Iranian president in the United States on the world stage is a key tenet of President Obama's foreign policy. It goes by various lofty names like "diplomacy" or "engagement."
In fact, President Obama has made it clear that his policy is to prevent Iran from obtaining nuclear weapons, and he has signed strong sanctions against Iran. In joint remarks with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, Obama called a nuclear-armed Iran a danger to both Israeli and United States' security interests, saying:
And as I emphasized, even as we will continue on the diplomatic front, we will continue to tighten pressure when it comes to sanctions, I reserve all options, and my policy here is not going to be one of containment. My policy is prevention of Iran obtaining nuclear weapons. And as I indicated yesterday in my speech, when I say all options are at the table, I mean it.
Bayefsky is merely the latest Fox News commentator to mislead about Obama's Iran policy and falsely link Obama to Ahmadinejad.
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- National Security & Foreign Policy
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- FoxNews.com
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JACKSONVILLE, Fla. - Police say New Year's Eve is one of the worst nights for DUI deaths, so AAA and others are offering alternative ways for impaired drivers to get home.
Police say more than half the crashes after midnight will be alcohol related -- a sobering reality that college student Derek Gabel will never forget: an innocent bystander killed in a drunk driving accident.
"One guy from my high school got hit by a drunk driver and died," Gabel said.
Law enforcement and public safety groups always recommend designating a driver who will celebrate without alcohol. But if it's too late for that, there are other choices.
- AAA's TOW to GO program will tow a car for free within a 10-mile radius, and it's free, whether or not you are a AAA member.
- The DUI Patrol in Jacksonville advertises a 40-mile flat rate the first 12 miles. They will then tow you and your car for a charge of $1.99 each additional mile.
- Designated Drivers of Jacksonville will also transport you and your car to their destination for a fee.
Applications like Steer Clear on your smart phone also offer assistance.
Channel 4 asked people why they think drivers take the risk of operating a car while being drunk, knowing they are putting countless lives on the line.
"Definitely pride is on the line," Zack Oiler said. "They don't want to admit their drunk so confidence, and if your impaired your impaired, you don't think 100 percent straight."
Kaitlyn Jerrett, a Clemson Student, believes "they're just not thinking clearly and loose their better judgement."
Copyright 2012 by News4Jax.com. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.


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Kutty Chutties 26-04-2015 Sun TV Kutty Chutties 26.04.2015 Show Online | Kutty Chutties 26/04/2015 Sun TV Program 26th April 2015
Watch Sun tv Kutty Chutties 26.04.15 kids Show Kutty's Chutties 26/04/15 Latest Today Episode Online.
Kutty Chutties 26-04-2015 – Sun tv Show | sun tv 26-04-15 kids show Kutty Chutties Program 26th April 2015
Synopsis: Sun TV Network proudly presents the ultimate kids show! Here is an opportunity to bring out the best in your child. The show encourages them with the most wacky platform filled with energy, naughtiness and lots & lots of fun. This is a stage where your kids can be themselves, at the cost of our laughter!
So, If you are a proud parent of a cute, outspoken & naughty child between the age of 3 and 8, bring them over to our kids show & make them a star!
Hosted by Imman Annachi, this program features children who give funny and innocent answers for the questions asked by him.
Kutty Chutties, sun tv Shows
More Video's from this Category: Kutty Chutties | Sun tv Shows


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Northwest 22nd Street resurfacing project begins
Published: Friday, November 30, 2012 at 1:23 p.m.
Last Modified: Friday, November 30, 2012 at 1:23 p.m.
A road project on Northwest 22nd Street and Northwest Fifth Avenue began this week.
The $674,674 project includes resurfacing the approximately ½-mile patched and cracked stretch of Northwest 22nd between University Avenue and Northwest Eighth Avenue and the ¼-mile stretch of Northwest Fifth between 22nd and Northwest 20th Street, said Stefan Broadus with the city's Public Works Department.
Sidewalks will be widened from 5 to 6 feet where there is sufficient right of way, and the intersection of 22nd and Fifth will be raised as a traffic slowing measure, he said. Broadus said the intersection will be "similar to a speed table...with a plateau at the top."
On Friday, crews and heavy trucks were working along 22nd, where traffic was limited to one lane. They have also removed the old sidewalk along the north side of Fifth.
In addition to the wider sidewalks and the raised intersection, the "road will stay the same in essence," Broadus said, with no changes to lane widths.
The project is expected to be completed by the end of January. R.E. Arnold is the contractor. The City Commission awarded the bid for the Gainesville firm at the Nov. 15 meeting.
Reader comments posted to this article may be published in our print edition. All rights reserved. This copyrighted material may not be re-published without permission. Links are encouraged.


text: Springhill Group Home is a housing finance company with the principal goal of achieving a social requirement of motivating home ownership by offering long-term finance to households. Springhill Group Home has turned the idea of housing finance in Springhill into a world-class business venture with outstanding reputation for dependability, honesty and outstanding services. Springhill Group Home has a wide network of contacts from different loan companies within United States and Asia catering to towns & cities spread across the country providing housing loans and property advisory services. For inquiries, email us at firstname.lastname@example.com


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Topic: Resection Gave my Husband five great years of life!
Hello, my name is Sandra and I am so very happy that this forum has been founded. Five years ago my husband was diagnosed with cholangiocarcinoma and the internet resources were not nearly as robust. This forum is wonderful.
On resection and physicians, my husband was diagnosed at Mass General Hospital and the entire surgical team said that resection was not possible. At the time my husband was 52 years old and up until his diagnosis was an extremely healthy, fun-loving husband, father and grandfather. We simply would not accept the doctor's pronouncement of eminent death in less than 8 weeks! My husband had a large malignant tumor in his right lobe....the left lobe was functioning well and compensating. My son got on the internet and found Dr. Rick Selby at the Univ. of Southern California who felt that the tumor was resectable and performed the 10 hour surgery...without a blood transfusion...because of our religious beliefs. The surgery was successful...my husband regained weight....with a very healthy appetite for both food and life. The 5 years gained were great. Two years after the surgery small tumors were identified in his lungs; however we opted not to use chemotherapy. My husband continued on until last year when he began to experience discomfort in his abdominal area....this progressed until October, 2005 when he nearly died of an infection in his abdominal area due to a perforated intestine and blocked duodenum. He never recovered from a 12 day hospital stay and finally passed away in February 2005. The cause of death was septis; cholangiocarcinoma. I have many questions about what happened and how it happened. For example, the doctors never confirmed that the cancer was back in the abdominal area. The focus was on infection.


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Aside from being partly a product placement for Steve Harvey's relationship book, "Think Like A Man" (directed by Tim Story) was a worthwhile romantic ensemble comedy in which a group of men and women competed against each other to be the top dogs in their relationships. Yes, it was clichéd, but it had a great cast with great chemistry.
Now comes "Think Like a Man, Too" (also directed by Story), which wisely distances itself from the book (and Harvey, mostly) and tones down the battle-of-the-sexes plot so dominant in the first one.
This time, it takes place in Las Vegas, the night before one of the couples is to marry, and the men and women have a little fun.
The entire cast is back, which is the movie's main asset. There's the betrothed couple Candace (Regina Hall) and Michael (Terrence Jenkins), Jeremy (Jerry Ferrara) and Kristen (Gabrielle Union), and Zeke (Romany Malco) and Mya (Meagan Good).
Then there's Dominic (Michael Elay) and Lauren (Taraji P. Henson) and the token, white, dork couple, Bennett (Gary Owen) and Tish (Wendi McLendon Covey). And who can forget the high-energy Cedric (Kevin Hart), who acts like a sex-starved puppy dog for the duration of the movie.
Luckily, he's in the company of some immensely talented comedians who prevent the movie from just being "The Kevin Hart Show." Elay — who was in another Kevin Hart comedy, "About Last Night," earlier this year — especially excels as the sensitive chef, along with Hall, who manages to be both sweet and raunchy. Also to be commended is Owen, who chimes in at just the right moments.
As in the first movie, there is still competition between the men and the women (in the form of dueling bachelor/bachelorette parties), but it's toned down considerably, and instead, the movie is mainly about two sets of friends escaping to Vegas for the weekend. And it's this simplicity, along with the near-flawless comedic chemistry of the cast, that makes "Think Like A Man, Too" entertaining enough.
Are there clichés? Sure. There's a gambling montage (two, in fact) and a shopping-for-nice-clothes montage.
Does every joke work? Of course, not. The worst offender is easily the lengthy (and fatiguing) sing-along to a '90s song by the women in a nightclub.
And, as to be expected, there's the usual third-act drama that almost slows the action to a halt.
Luckily, Story and Co. don't spend too much time on it, keeping the comedy momentum going until the credits roll. And even better, they're able to avoid the break-up/make-up plot point altogether, something that caused the first movie to drag.
For what it's worth, "Think Like A Man, Too" is better than its predecessor. The jokes are better overall; it's not structured around Harvey's book; the men and women are already together, which saves us the hassle of having to sit through multiple wooing scenes; and it doesn't feel redundant.
It might help to see the first movie, to get acquainted with characters and see how they got together, but this one can be enjoyed by itself.
"Think Like A Man, Too" won't stand the test of time, but for the time being, you can do much worse.
To comment on this review, write to firstname.lastname@example.com.


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First Grade Math Worksheets and Printables
First grade is a big year for math, moving past counting and into simple addition. Cover all corners of first grade math, from coins to measurement to two-digit numbers, with our first grade math worksheets. A good place to start if kids want a warm-up is our first grade counting worksheets . Next thing you know, your first grader will be a math master!
Key First Grade Math Skills:Greater Than or Less Than
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Have Fun with 1st Grade Math
First grade math worksheets are great for practicing concepts like addition, subtraction, estimation, and pattern-making. Some first graders need some extra activities to get excited about math. Try these tips to bring the fun of math to your first grader everyday:
- Have fun with addition and subtraction in your regular conversation. If you're looking at your family calendar with your child, you might notice that a four day weekend is coming up. Say to your child, "I see that we have one day off of school this week, two days off this weekend, and one day off next week. How many days off do we have all together?" You might talk about subtraction while making breakfast: "I have one dozen, or twelve, eggs. If I use three eggs to make breakfast, how many will be left?" Get in the habit of talking through the mental math that you do everyday to get your child thinking.
- Point out patterns in objects, architecture, and nature. You might show your child a checked floor in a restroom, or the black-and-orange stripes on a tiger at the zoo. Kids like the challenge of finding patterns themselves. You can start a lot of conversations by saying, "I see a pattern in this room. Can you find the pattern?" You can also give your child a one day challenge by asking him to keep a notebook of patterns that he sees throughout the day. Share his findings at bedtime. After that, he'll see patterns wherever he goes!
- Students in first grade learn how to read time. You can make your child a time-keeper for your house. For example, if your family has a morning or evening routine that is tied with certain times, you might have your child alert the family when it's seven o'clock, seven thirty, and eight o'clock. If your child enjoys his new role, you might consider getting him a child's watch for a very special birthday or holiday gift.


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A packet of salted sepat/perch fish, about 5 pieces.
1/2 pineapple, cut into pieces.
200 ml coconut milk, I used low fat coconut milk.
100 - 200 ml water
Salt, sugar and pepper to taste
20 gm dried chillies
120 gm shallots
6 cloves garlic
15 gm lengkuas / galangal
6 gm kunyit / turmeric
20 gm ginger
10 gm belacan/ dried shrimp paste
3 pieces buah keras/ candlenuts
3 stalks of lemongrass, I used white part only
Soak salted sepat fish for about 5 to 10 minutes. Wash and drain.
Heat up 3 tbsp oil in a wok.
Stir fry the pounded ingredients until fragrant.
Ok, after this step, I removed half of the fried ingredients into a bowl. Because I cook this for 3 of us, and 1 meal only. I keep the other half in freezer for later use.
Add in water, after the water boils, add in pineapple and simmer for about 5 minutes.
Add in salted sepat/perch fish and simmer for another 3-5 minutes. Do not cook the fish too long, else you can find lots of fish bones in the gravy.....that's not good , you'll choke the bones.... becareful.
Lastly add in coconut milk, salt , sugar and pepper to taste.
Dish up and serve.


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create-domain-class command creates a domain and associated integration test for the given base name.
grails create-domain-class org.bookstore.Book
DescriptionCreates a domain class for the given base name. For example, for a base name "org.bookstore.Book" a domain class called
Book will be created in the
grails-app/domain/org/bookstore directory.A domain class represents the core model behind in your application and is typically mapped onto database tables. For more information on domain models in Grails refer to the chapter on GORM in the user guide.The exact behaviour of the command depends on the argument you pass. If you don't specify a package (like "org.bookstore" in the example), then the name of the application will be used as the package. So if the application name is "bookstore" and you run
create-domain-class Book, then the command will create the file
grails-app/domain/bookstore/Book.groovy. Also, if you don't give your domain class an initial capital letter, it will be capitalized for you. So an argument of "org.bookstore.book" will result in a domain class called
Book.Note that this command is just for convenience and you can also create domain classes in your favourite text editor or IDE if you choose.Usage:
Fired Events:
grails create-domain-class [name]
CreatedFile- When the domain class is created


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Only voters receive the private messages a model sends to her fans.
Voting is how you show love and appreciation to your favorite models & photographers.
Zivity pays them a cash royalty for each vote they receive.
Super sexy, I love it!!BobbyFrost
Subtle, sexy and oh so tempting. Every next set just makes me hungry for moreGoliath7
Nutella and books in the morning. Love the light you found in this shoot, especially around the kitchen.urdith
Buy votes to support this artist on Zivity. Votes are $1 each, and when you vote on a set you like, 55% goes to the model and 30% to the photographer. You can vote in the next step after registering and purchasing votes.


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No, not buffalo as in bison but Buffalo as in the city and the wings. The recipe comes from Ribs, Ribs, Ribs. and I grilled up a rack a couple of weeks ago.
The recipe calls for ribs (duh) and spices and seasonings to create the Buffalo flavor. Unfortunately my biggest cutting board is white poly and it always has a funky effect on the camera.
I can't remember for sure but I'm pretty sure I prepped the ribs that afternoon and this is what they looked like after a few hours in the fridge, just before heading to the grill.
The ribs were grilled indirect and bone side down until the ends showed about 1/4" and they were acceptably droopy.
Of course, sauce is a necessity! The ribs had a good mix of flavor and heat and were a nice change of pace from wings, although it was tough to separate the flavor of the pork from the rub, sauce, and blue cheese dressing (recipe also in the book). And while they take longer to cook than wings with enough advance planning I think they'd be just fine anytime wings are called for.


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Kai The Hitchhiker Remains In Philly Jail Following Arrest [VIDEO]
Kai the Hatchet Wielding Hitchhiker remains in a Philadelphia jail awaiting a trip back to Union County to face murder charges.
The internet sensation, whose real name is Caleb Lawrence McGillvary, was arrested at Philadelphia's Greyhound bus terminal early Thursday night trying to make his way to Georgia.
Union County Prosecutor Theodore Romankow told the Star Ledger that if McGillvary doesn't fight extrication he could be back in New Jersey in "a few days."
McGillvary is wanted in the murder of 73-year-old lawyer Joseph Galfy of Clark, who was found in his home dead wearing nothing but his underwear and socks when police came to check on him. He had not reported for work for several days and co-workers at the law firm of Kochanski, Baron and Galfy, PC in Rahway became concerned.
Funeral services for Galfy will be held today at Our Lady Of The Mount R.C. Church in Warren.
KYW TV reports that McGillvary was spotted at a Starbucks in Philadelphia's Center City by an employee who called 911. and struck up a conversation with a woman. He explained he was wanted for murder and trying to leave town. The woman thought he was "crazy" but her boyfriend recognized him and called police.
McGilvary is being held on $3 million bail and will be brought to the Union County Jail in Elizabeth today.
"I believe that everyone is a little safer with this person off the streets," said Romankow in a statement upon his arrest.
His internet fans are having a hard time understanding seeing McGillvary as a killer. "I hope they really listen to him and do a proper investigation," posted one fan on Facebook. Another was trying to pay for his legal defense and was accepting donations. So far he had collected $56 according to CNN.
Meet Leads To Murder
McGillvary spent at least two nights in Galfy's home in Clark, Romankow said, after the two met in Times Square. It's believed McGillvary took two trips to meet a fan in Asbury Park; Galfy picked him up after the first trip and brought him back to Clark, Romankow said.
It is unclear how McGillvary got to the train station a second time. After heading back to Asbury Park, McGillvary and the fan went to Philadelphia, then to Glassboro in southern New Jersey, where McGillvary spent Monday night, the day after he is accused of murdering Galfy.
Statements posted on McGillvary's Facebook page following the homicide were "sexual in nature," Romankow said.
McGillvary's last Facebook post, dated Tuesday, asks "what would you do?" if you awoke in a stranger's house and found you'd been drugged and sexually assaulted. One commenter suggests hitting him with a hatchet — and McGillvary's final comment on the post says, "I like your idea."
Next Stop: Glassboro
McGillvary spent the night in a Glassboro home the day after he is accused of bludgeoning Galfy to death.
Police say he came to Philadelphia and later called a fan who lives in the Glassboro house to pick him up.
"We didn't know when he was staying here. He didn't give any signs of it. He was a nice enough guy and everything, but afterwards it kind of made sense after everything we are hearing. You go back on all of the stuff he was saying and it all made sense," Eric told WPVI TV.