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Qualcomm Snapdragon S4 (Krait) Performance Preview - 1.5 GHz MSM8960 MDP and Adreno 225 Benchmarksby Brian Klug & Anand Lal Shimpi on 2/21/2012 3:01 AM EST
- Posted in
- Snapdragon
- Qualcomm
- Adreno
- Smartphones
- Krait
- Mobile
86 Comments
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sciwizam - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkAny thoughts on how Krait will compare against the A15 chips and when's the earliest will those be on market? Reply
wapz - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkLook in the architecture article on page 1 here: http://www.anandtech.com/show/4940/qualcomm-new-sn...
"ARM hasn't published DMIPS/MHz numbers for the Cortex A15, although rumors place its performance around 3.5 DMIPS/MHz."
Krait has 3.3 DMIPS/MHz, so if a dual Cortex A15 would run at the same frequency they would be fairly comparable I would imagine (obviously ignoring all other elements that could help performance on either of them). Reply
wapz - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkAnd if that's the case, HTC will have an interesting problem with their new lineup. It would mean, if the rumours are correct, their new flagship One X model using Tegra3 AP33 chipset at 1,5GHz and a 4,7 inch 720p screen might be slower compared to the One S, sporting the Snapdragon S4 chipset and a 4,3 inch screen with qHD. Reply
Lucian Armasu - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkIn that case even if the GPU's were equal in performance, the One S would be faster due to the fact that it uses a lower resolution. Reply
zorxd - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkIf by "faster", you mean more FPS in a 3D game, then yes.
The resulting image quality would be lower however. Reply
metafor - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkYes. FPS is only one factor in the overall equation of user experience. Higher resolution rendering is definitely preferable assuming one could maintain ~60fps. Reply
zorxd - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI'd rather have a 34 fps 1280x720 than a 60 fps 960x540. Reply
sosrandom - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkor better graphics at 30fps @ 960x540 than 30fps @ 1280x720 Reply
trob6969 - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkI agree, i would take quality over speed any day as long as the difference in speed is measured in mere seconds. Reply
vol7ron - Thursday, March 01, 2012 - linkI can't wait to see the power savings, especially since the modem is a huge power draw, and one of the benefits is that QC is the manufacturer, which means integrated chip and less power consumption (as well as thinner device). Reply
nbenedetto1998 - Tuesday, January 01, 2013 - linkKrait is a15 just built on the a9 nm process which is 32 nm I believe. The real A15 will be built on a 28nm process. Reply
sjael - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkWould be great to put some Transformer Prime numbers next to it. You know, just for kicks... Reply
infra_red_dude - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkSome numbers where it beats Tegra3 everywhere (almost):
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2400409,00.as... Reply
Loki726 - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI'd like to see a clock-for-clock comparison. Tegra 3's A9 is at 1.3ghz and Krait is at 1.5ghz here. I'd be interested to see what happens when A9 gets scaled down to 28nm, and whether or not Krait will still have an advantage. Reply
Wishmaster89 - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkAnd what would you need 1.5Hhz A9 for at 28nm? A15 is much better than any A9, and will come at lower process nodes.
Besides, you can see that 1.2Ghz Exynos is much slower than 1.5Ghz Krait so I don't think higher clock will change it. Reply
LordConrad - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI want one of these in my next phone. My HTC Thunderbolt works great, but it's getting a bit dated. Reply
TedKord - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkBeing an Anandtech reader, you've gotta be rooted and have a custom rom slapped on. What do you have flashed on yours? Reply
LordConrad - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkRight now I'm using the BAMF Forever ROM, nice features and very stable. I'll stick with it until I find something better (or get a new phone). Reply
ShieTar - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - link"At a lower resolution Apple's A5 is unable to outperform the Adreno 225 here."
Actually, 960x640 and 1024x600 both have exactly the same number of total pixels.
Not that it changes the conclussion. Reply
lowlymarine - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - link"At a lower resolution Apple's A5 is unable to outperform the Adreno 225 here."
Perhaps I'm misreading this line, but aren't 1024x600 and 960x640 actually exactly the same resolution in different aspect ratios? Reply
ssj4Gogeta - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI think he meant lower compared to the 720p GLBenchmark where the A5 wins. Reply
zanon - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI agree the wording is a bit awkward there since they are both driving identical numbers of pixels. If he meant to compare it to the earlier 720p results it'd probably be better to make that explicit. Reply
jjj - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkLooks like it's faster than Tegra 3 and with single threaded perf certainly much better the only remaining big question is power consumption. Reply
Malih - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI've been my old android device that comes with Android 1.6, and Cyanogenmod-ded to Gingerbread (it's not so responsive when running more than one app), because I need the new version of the Gmail app. Reply
Malih - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkcorrection: I've been *using* my old...
In short: it looks like I'll be waiting in line for a smartphone with this SoC Reply
Zingam - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI haven't been impressed by a CPU/GPU for years but this thing looks amazing! If they manage to go on like that we'll soon have a true ARM desktop experience.
Great job! I wish now they support the latest DirectX/OpenGL/OpenCL/OpenVG etc. stuff and we'll have it!!! It is unimaginable what ARM based SoCs would deliver when the time for 14nm comes. Reply
Torrijos - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkSince both devices actually render the same amount of pixel but with different aspect ratio, would it be possible, that the performance hit seen for the iPhone 4S, is the result of graphics rendered in a standard aspect ratio (16:9 or something else) then having to be transformed to fit the particular screen? Reply
cosminmcm - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkMaybe it's because at the lower resolution the faster CPU on the Krait (newer architecture with higher clocks) matters more than the faster GPU on the A5. When the resolution grows, the difference between the GPU becomes more apparent. Reply
LetsGo - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkWhat difference?
http://blogs.unity3d.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/0... Reply
metafor - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkConsidering Apple controls the entire software stack and the A5 silicon, it'd be pretty stupid of them to do that. And if you look at how performance scales between the iPad (4:3) and iPhone (16:9), there's no slowdown due to aspect ratio. Reply
k1ng617 - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkHonestly, I don't trust Linpack and believe it is probably one of the most outdated android benchmarks, that doesn't represent what a person will see with realworld user experience.
Can you try out Antutu & CFBench and post the scores please? Reply
juicytuna - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkIndeed. Linpack is a test of software as much as hardware, who knows what kind of optimizations they could have done to the VM to get these headline grabbing scores.
GPU is distincly meh for a 2012 soc, and single threaded performance doesn't seem that impressive to me. Sunspider and Browsermark seem to be on a par with what you'd expect to see from an email@example.com.
And how much of that 'faster feel' can be attributed to NAND performance? Reply
metafor - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkThere are some hickups in Android that have to do with the UI thread looking up storage but for the most part, it's a CPU thing. The thing to keep in mind is that UI fluidity is an entirely different type of code than Javascript parsing. And looking at the Basemark results, Krait is quite capable in that department. Reply
arm.svenska - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkWhy is the phone so long? I get that it is a reference design. But, could someone tell why it is like that? Reply
douglaswilliams - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI don't know for sure, not a definitive answer here, just adding to the discussion.
Like you said, it's a reference design (Mobile Development Platform). They put as little time as possible into making this pretty.
When I was in college we had some old development platforms for some Motorola chips that were essentially a large circuit card with ports on all the sides for all the I/O and buttons to push for different operating modes like programming mode. It in no way looked like what an actual product would look like - because that wasn't its purpose. Reply
peevee - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkOut-of-order Krait core at 1.5GHz consumes only 750mW. An Atom core at the same frequency consumes as much as 10x of that! While being in-order, no faster, if not slower! What a fail for Intel! Reply
Khato - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkYou might consider reading Anandtech's article covering the Intel Atom Z2460 launch in January - http://www.anandtech.com/show/5365/intels-medfield...
Granted, we're only given SunSpider and BrowserMark benchmarks for the Atom Z2460 reference platform, but they're both actually ahead of the numbers for the Krait MDP - 1331.5 versus 1532 on SunSpider and 116425 vs 110345 on BrowserMark. While I expected Atom to be competitive, I'd thought it likely for Krait to be slightly ahead on the single threaded benchmarks, so I'm somewhat surprised that it's not. (Note that I'm somewhat surprised that there was no mention of how Krait compares to Atom Z2460 in the article.)
As for power, that same article states that the Atom Z2460 SoC consumes ~750 mW at 1.6GHz - that's for the entire SoC, not just the CPU core. It'll be quite interesting to see how actual battery life compares between products once released. Reply
metafor - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkThe difference is, one is Intel's numbers and the other is a 3rd party reviewer's on an actual device.
So yes, I agree. We'll have to see what actual phones using Atom will be like. Note that Sunspider isn't the end-all of "single-threaded performance" either. The JIT for Javascript on x86 is far more mature -- having been developed for a decade now -- than it is for ARM. Reply
Khato - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkWell, I tend to trust Intel's numbers when they're actual hard numbers rather than percentages or normalized figures - they can't exactly get away with making up figures.
And no question about the fact that SunSpider/Browsermark aren't indicative of all too much... but I wouldn't claim that Intel's advantages on those benchmarks are due to a superior JIT/software advantage. Remember the performance figures from that Oak Trail Tablet prototype running an early Android port from June of 2011? That was a prime example of the sort of software disadvantage that Intel had to overcome in order to get Android running well on x86. While a bit dated, here's an excellent example of the performance differences on x86 java implementations between OS (note that linux had a slightly newer version, but they were both using the latest available) - http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&... Reply
metafor - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkNo, but you'd be surprised how much a bit of pick-and-choose can help. Most comprehensive reviews are pretty rigorous with how many times they repeat a test, how much warm-up they give a device and whether or not they pick the median, average, etc.
One could easily pick the best number, which can vary quite a bit especially for a JIT benchmark.
I've also seen that comparison before. There was a rather thorough discussion of it and its relative lack of merits at RWT. I'd link, but it's being marked as spam :/ Reply
Exophase - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkThat 750mW is not for the entire core, it's for the CPU with hyperthreading disabled plus L2 cache. Intel said enabling hyperthreading adds some further draw to it, something between 10-20% as far as I can remember. Reply
hova2012 - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI'm pretty sure I'm not the only one who is disappointed that the Krait dual core wasn't compared to intel's upcoming atom socs. Isn't this the generation that was supposed to bring arm up to parity with intel's chip? All in all this was a great article, sets the standard for tech reviews. Reply
Exophase - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkHard to give a good comparison when you don't have direct access to Intel's reference hardware, or if you do you aren't under liberty to publish benchmarking results. Reply
Lucian Armasu - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkWhy are the MDP versions of Qualcomm's chips significantly higher performance than the ones in the market, like the one in the HTC Rezound? Doesn't that seem strange to you?
Could it be that Qualcomm's MDP chips are meant to run significantly faster to show good benchmarks, but then they weaken them in shipping products? Or is there something I'm missing? Reply
Death666Angel - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkHow would they weaken them in shipping products?
Do you have more comparisons between the MDP and shipping phones apart from the Rezound?
I would look to different governor settings, different software builts and different settings as an explanation before jumping into conspiracy territory. :D Reply
Lucian Armasu - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI was just looking at the score charts Anandtech provided. Look at these 2 for example:
Why does the MDP MSM8660 have significantly higher (double) performance than the presumably "same" MSM8660 chip in HTC Rezound? Isn't the MDP MSM8660 supposed to showcase the same MSM8660 that will go into the market?
I'd love for Brian or Anand to prove me wrong here with some kind of technical explanation, but until then I'll just assume it's Qualcomm being sneaky and trying to manipulate the public's opinion about their chips. Reply
ndk - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkThe article clearly mentions that MDP 8660 was running with governor settings at "performance". I can't imagine HTC or any other company shipping their products with this setting on. Reply
Brian Klug - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkNDK is correct about governor being the reason, and I found that result interesting as well.
It's clear to me at least that the governor settings on the Rezound are fairly conservative, and that even with a workload that's supposed to completely load both cores (mashing the multi-threaded test button in linpack pro), you never really get better that single threaded performance.
-Brian Reply
infra_red_dude - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkAll the overlay customization by OEM and the power management code in the device kernel does have a detrimental effect on the device's performance. Reply
phoenix_rizzen - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkNot to mention versions of Android. The MDP is running 4.0.3. What's the Rezound running? Reply
metafor - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkIt's Sense. If you look at some of the phones with a less bloated version of Android (like the Xiaomi phone used in the Vellamo benchmark article that runs the same processor as the Rezound but with MIUI), they score pretty close to the MDP scores. Reply
Wishmaster89 - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkThat is why I will never buy device that bares the mark 'with HTC Sense'.
They went one step too far with their customisations when they impacted performance of the device. Reply
monoik - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkDid you make your tests on Gingerbread SGS2? I'm getting very different results on Ice Cream Sandwich Cyanogen Alpha:
For worse:
Linpack single 47.257 MFLOPS
Linpack multi 71.987 MFLOPS
For better:
BrowserMark 105937
Vellamo 1596
SunSpider-0.9.1 1762.2ms
non-cached anandtech.com about 4,5 seconds from touching "go" to the progressbar disappearing.
cached anandtech.com less than 2 seconds.
Stock browser. No overclocking. GT-I9100 Exynos version. Reply
Kaboose - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI am going to assume the latest OFFICIAL OS released by samsung Anandtech is not in the business of benchmarking every different ROM or OS on every phone. You would most probably be getting different results running ICS Cyanogen. As far as I know ICS is only official on the Nexus. Reply
monoik - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI assume you're right, so we're comparing apples and oranges here. No real value there, don't you think? Reply
rahvin - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkCyanogen is typically crippled by the fact that they are restricted to the open source versions. Especially in early release they don't have access to many of the customizations and binary code in release versions let alone per-release.
It's my experience that Cyanogen doesn't even come close to release performance or power use until about a year later. This is because it takes the manufacturers about 6 months to post their kernel source then another 6 months to port and modify for the cyanogen system.
So comparing a cyanogen alpha mod to a developer preview isn't even relevant, as was said. Reply
tomhoward - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkThere original SGS2 results were incorrect in the S2 vs 4S post a while back. There was a pretty big flame war in the comments from people with stock phones getting around 2000ms in Sunspider but Anandtech just ignored them. Reply
B3an - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - link@Brain or Anand...
Do you think that Win 8 tablets using ARM SoC's will likely have a SoC based on many of the components inside Krait? I know there will have be certain changes for WOA but the CPU and possibly the GPU (now that it supports Direct3D 9_3) will be used for these tablets?
And the same goes for ARM's A15, will WOA likely be running on SoC's based on that too? Reply
kyuu - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkIf I can get this SoC in a Lumia-ish Windows 8 phone with a decent screen and removable micro-SD storage, whoever makes that phone will have my money. Reply
kyuu - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI mean Windows *Phone* 8 phone, of course. Reply
BaronMatrix - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkWe can look at the perf of CedarTrail or Ivy Blossom or whatever. Since Intel has said they are more so competing with Qualcomm. And this is only at 1.5GHz. When the 2.5Ghz chips come out with the new Adreno (Former ATi GPU), everyone will have to pack up and go home. Reply
iwod - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkThe rumors of Apple A5X leads some to suggest next iPad would not be 28nm SoC. So this prove we may still have chance of 28nm SoC coming in next iPad.
Krait is bringing A15 level performance while being on a A9 class core?? Sorry i must be missing something. Or Since Krait is designed by Qualcomm A9 and A15 naming doesn't matter? (o.O)
No Mention of comparison to Intel newest Atom? Reply
infra_red_dude - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkCorrect, Krait cannot be directly compared to A9 or A15 architecture. I think calling Krait contemporary to A15 is more correct than "A15/9-class" CPU. Reply
snoozemode - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkIt's really about time you can plug in your mobile to computer screen and run the Tablet UI, preferably at native resolution. Don't know what I would need this processing power to otherwise. Reply
tipoo - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkThis is very obviously faster than something like the Tegra 3 in single or dual threaded performance, I wonder how many apps take advantage of more than two threads on Android or iOS? I'm guessing for the foreseeable future faster duals will win out. Reply
remixfa - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkCan Brian Klug & Anand Lal Shimpi please clarify for me which version of the SGS2 is being used? Its a very pertinent question. Is it the i9000 with the 1.2ghz Exynos chip or the American Hercules T989/Skyrocket variants that have the lesser Snapdragon 1.5ghz chips in them.
Judging from the benchmarks, it really makes me think its the hercules/skyrocket. That really needs to be clarified, since unfortunately not all SGS2s are created equal. Reply
Brian Klug - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkThe SGS2 used in the article is the UK SGS2 with Exynos 4210 inside.
-Brian Reply
larry6hi5 - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkOn page 1 of the article, the first table gives the MSM8660 as running at 1.5 GHz. Shouldn't this be 1.0 GHz? Reply
Brian Klug - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkThat's because the MSM8660 is indeed at 1.5 GHz :)
If you go back to our original MDP article we note it there: http://www.anandtech.com/show/4243/
And also the official MDP MSM8660 page: https://developer.qualcomm.com/develop/development...
-Brian Reply
ncb1010 - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - link"Even at its lower native resolution, Apple's iPhone 4S is unable to outperform the MSM8960 based MDP here"
1024 x 600 = 614,400 pixels
960 x 640 = 614,400 pixels
There is no basis for saying the iPhone 4S has a lower resolution than this MDP being evaluated. Reply
bhspencer - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkDoes anyone know if Linpak is using the hardware or software floating point calculations for the MFLOPS number. Reply
metafor - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkHardware. But it's run on the JIT instead of native code. According to CF-Bench, Java FP performance is around 1/3 of native. Neither actually use NEON but instead uses the older VFP instructions. Reply
vision33r - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkThe Tegra 3 is actually a big disappointment from a performance standpoint. It actually has 5 CPU cores and the GPU performance isn't much better than the Tegra 2. The Adreno 225 is a much bigger upgrade but I'm afraid that it's another marginal upgrade.
The A5 in the iPad2/iPhone 4S are over 1 year old by March. In that time, Nvidia's Tegra 2/3 has not dominated and the MSM8960 is finally a true contender for the fastest SOC on the market. By the time this thing is out in volume, Apple has the A6 ready and most likely another 4-8x performance increase over the A5.
This SOC will probably be forgotten when the A6 is out. Reply
LetsGo - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkYeah your right looking at my Asus Transformer Prime running GTA 3. /S
A lot of graphical optimisations can be done on the CPU cores before data is offloaded to the GPU.
The moral of the story is that Benchmarks are only a rough guide at best. Reply
tipoo - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkUnless the rumors are true and its A5X, not A6, with just faster dual cores rather than quads on a newer architecture. I would not be surprised, its like the 3G-3GS was an architecture change, then the 4 was just a faster chip on a similar architecture. The iPad 2 was an architecture change, the 3 might just be a faster version of the same thing, hopefully with improvements in the GPU. I'd be fine with that, as long as the GPU kept up with the new resolution. Reply
Stormkroe - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkI was just plotting out what little resolution scaling info there is here and noticed something very odd. Both the iphone 4s and galaxy s2 actually score MUCH higher when the resolution is raised to 720p offscreen. I can see that in the 4s' case it could be explained with fps caps, but the S2 is definitely not hitting a cap at 34.6 fps @ 800x480, yet it hits 42.5 fps @ 1280x720. All other phones predictably step down in speed. Anyone else notice this? Reply
Alexstarfire - Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - linkYes I did. It was actually the reason I was going to post. I was curious to know if the iPhone had VSync or not because it made no sense that it would get better performance at a higher resolution. Neither of the results make any sense to me since they are counter-intuitive.
If the "offscreen" tests force VSync off then that could explain it for the iPhone but not really for the SGSII unless some parts of the test go way past the 60FPS cap with VSync turned on. Reply
alter.eg00 - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkShut up & take my money Reply
Denithor - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkSeconded!!
I'm still carrying a first generation HTC Incredible (yep, one of the original ones!), been out of contract for a few months, was waiting to hear more about the 28nm SoC update. These look really, really good, seriously looking forward to them hitting the market now! Reply
tipoo - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkI wonder how many apps scale beyond two cores. For the time being, I doubt its many, and since you're still not doing any true multitasking I think a faster dual core like this will trump a slower quad like the Tegra 3 most of the time. Reply
Denithor - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkProbably very much like desktop performance here: going from 1 to 2 cores is a huge upgrade, even for single-threaded apps, because it off-loads background chores to the second core and you get a full core dedicated to your running app. Going from there to 3/4/6/8 cores is really only helpful if your apps are truly multi-threaded or you're heavily multitasking.
Now, the increase in IPC is definitely going to help everything go faster. Reply
vision33r - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkThen, what's the point of Nvidia doing the quad core and even planning for greater than 4 cores. Reply
Wishmaster89 - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkIMHO its only pure marketing. Eventually we'll get to a point where we'll have more cores in our phones than in most desktop workstations, only because it'll sell better. Sad but true. Reply
Smart hero - Friday, February 24, 2012 - link
I think an optimizes performance for Smart phone win over high-end end one ( I believe pod's need high-end performance )
1.Less game can be played in a small screen .
2.smart phone is not a cloud computer .
3.Traditionally , still we use win-32 bit more than 64 bit …are we changing with CPU??????????? Reply
R1V4L - Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - linkHow can You compare these video cards when the hardware is running different versions of software ?
Let me tell you that I've tested my Samsung Galaxy S2 running official Android 4.0.3 with Vsync on and on Egypt test I got 60fps !!! - evidently this result is influenced by the framelimit imposed by Samsung drivers.
So these benchmarks You did are not showing us the truth. Sorry to raise this problem - but I dare You to do these tests again :))) Reply
R1V4L - Tuesday, April 03, 2012 - linkGalaxy S2 - official android 4.0.3 : 45.67 FPS
Funny, huh ?!
Redo the tests, please - otherwise we will think this is a commercial crappy presentation for new products - not a professional benchmark. Reply


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HarleyThe Service and Therapy Dog forum is for all service and therapy dogs regardless of whether or not their status is legally defined by federal or state law, how they are trained, or whether or not they are "certified." Posts questioning or disputing a person's need for a service or therapy dog, the validity of a person's service or therapy dog, or the dog's ability to do the work of a service or therapy dog are not permitted in this forum. Please keep discussions fun, friendly, and helpful at all times.

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Retired UF prof, owner of Stubbies dead at 65
Published: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 at 4:32 p.m.
Last Modified: Wednesday, January 16, 2013 at 4:32 p.m.
Gar Hoflund and his daughter, Berkeley, brought craft beer to downtown Gainesville before craft beer was cool.
The Hoflunds opened Stubbie Shirt Pub, later Stubbies & Steins, in 2003, inspired by their travels around the world together, often in his role as a chemical engineering professor working with scientists in other countries.
Hoflund died at 65 on Tuesday after a sudden health problem, his daughter Berkeley Hoflund said.
He had been a chemical engineering professor at the University of Florida, specializing in surface science, from 1977 until his retirement in September 2012.
Berkeley said she was interested in business and they decided to start a business together. Gar had a collection of about 2,000 beer T-shirts and was also interested in fine food, beer and wine.
"It just sort of grew from T-shirts to 'let's serve lots of beer,' " Berkeley Hoflund said. "We really aimed to make it the kind of place we would want to hang out and hoped others would want to hang out there, too."
Stubbies opened with 60 craft and imported beers and now serves more than 400. It started offering food in 2008.
Berkeley said her father was at the pub every day greeting guests.
"It really grew out of a passion for our travel and having good times with lots of good people," she said.
Gar Hoflund was interested in golf — having played for the University of Iowa — scuba diving, Colonial Williamsburg furniture and Corvettes.
He is survived by longtime companion Lynn Sullivan, daughters Amy Bryce Hoflund and Berkeley Hoflund, and stepdaughters Ali and Jenny Burns.
Reader comments posted to this article may be published in our print edition. All rights reserved. This copyrighted material may not be re-published without permission. Links are encouraged.


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When it comes to the western lifestyle, nothing will keep the cowboy tradition alive like the kids of today. They are the cowboys and cowgirls of the future. Everyone who lives the way of the west was introduced to it early and often as kids. It's the same thing we do today to ensure the future doesn't lose the roots of the western lifestyle. From ranching to roping to western wear. The children are definitely the future of the West.
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Evans Family Records - Page 21
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That's right…a hole in my brand new, mint green sweater. As I arrived to work on this Denim Day [1], I reached for the appropriate awareness button on my cubicle wall (please tell me I am not the only one with a plethora of pins and buttons for every social justice activist occasion). But what a dilemma…do I put the button on my new sweater, thus risking a hole? I thought about attaching it to my scarf, but again…the hole. Then I got mad. WHY do I even have to make this choice? I now have a hole in my sweater, thanks to an Italian Supreme Court that made a horrendous decision years ago to overturn a rape conviction because the victim wore tight jeans. "Hashtag patriarchy" (direct quote from my cubicle mate).
The fact is, we are still battling victim-blaming attitudes and misconceptions about rape 15 years later. So on goes the button, hole in the sweater and all.
I'm heading to the grocery store soon, where I hope someone asks about my button. Because I didn't put a hole in my sweater for nothing.
What prevention activities are you involved with this Denim Day? Let us know my commenting below!
Links:[1] http://denimdayusa.org/
[2] http://www.nsvrc.org/blogs/preventionista
[3] http://www.nsvrc.org/blogs/preventionista/primary-prevention
[4] http://www.nsvrc.org/blogs/preventionista/promising-programs


text:
Twitter Party Monday 1/16/12 9pm EST
January 13, 2012 at 10:31 am melissaanddoug 2 comments
Join Us Monday Night 1/16/12 at 9pm EST
You must RSVP and attend the Twitter Party to be eligible for giveaways and to claim prizes!
This special Twitter party will emphasize both organization and staying healthy as a family.
Twitter Party Tips:
___ Follow @MelissaAndDoug on Twitter
___ Follow @TeachMama on Twitter
___ Follow @FamFunBlog on Twitter
___ LIKE Melissa & Doug on Facebook
___ LIKE Frugal Family Fun Blog on Facebook
___ Know your hashtag: #MDparty
___ Think of a kids' joke to share – Winter/Valentine's Day-themed is the best!
___ Tell a friend to join us!
___ Prepare for Fun!
Q. What's a Twitter Party?
A. A Twitter Party is a virtual party where partygoers connect over Twitter. A host leads the discussion and partygoers tweet to join the conversation, using a special hashtag to categorize comments as belonging to the party. A party can be searched by its hashtag. (See also http://www.twitterpartyguide.com/what-is-a-twitter-party)
Q. What's the hashtag for the Melissa & Doug Twitter Party?
A. #weteach
Q. What is a hashtag?
A. A word becomes a hashtag, or keyword, when it's preceded by a # symbol. This signals Twitter to categorize a tweet according to that keyword so it will come up in search results. So, for instance, when you do a Twitter search for #MDparty, you'll see what an amazing time we're having Monday night! (Also see https://support.twitter.com/articles/49309-what-are-hashtags-symbols)
Q. Why do I have to RSVP?
A. We pick names from the RSVP list for our prize giveaways. So technically you don't HAVE to RSVP–but you won't win prizes if you don't! (To be eligible for giveaways, you'll need to RSVP attend the party and participate by answering our party questions.)
Q. How far in advance should I RSVP?
A. You can RSVP as late as right before the first question is asked. We refresh the RSVP list right before our first giveaway.
Q. How long does the party last?
A. Our Twitter parties usually last one to two hours. You can come for just a few minutes, stay the whole time or anything in between.
Q. Do I have to participate?
A. You may participate as little or as much as you'd like. You need only be present and participating to be eligible to win prizes and giveaways.
Q. What will we do at the Twitter party?
A. During the Twitter party the host (@MelissaAndDoug and/or @weteach) will ask questions about parenting, toys, winter activities, Valentine's Day, telling kids jokes and more, and you can answer each question or comment on another person's answer. Remember to use hashtag #MDparty so everyone can see your comments.
For example, @MelissaAndDoug might ask, "Q1: Do you do anything special for your child on Valentine's Day? #MDparty" You could answer "@MelissaAndDoug Yes, I always put confetti hearts in with his lunch that day! #MDparty"
Each question is tied to a giveaway. Partiers are given a few minutes to answer each question. Once the question is closed we choose a winner for that question.
Throughout the party we also share information about our website, new products, upcoming events & promotions, tell jokes, get advice from other parents and more. Each party is different, but they are always fun!
Entry filed under: Contests & Special Offers, Coupons & Promo Codes, Giveaways, In the Media, Special Offers, Twitter. Tags: mdparty, twitter party.
2 Comments Add your own
It says that @FamFunBlog on Twitter does not exsist on twitter when I click on the link???
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FatBoy Beanbag Chair
I love these Fatboy Beanbag chairs almost more than my kids do! They're great for all ages! My husband and kids and I love using them to sit on to read books, watch tv or a movie, and hang out. My kids also love to jump on them! They're fun to snuggle with and super comfortable!


text:
Motorola Droid X2 Review - A Droid X with Tegra 2by Brian Klug on 7/7/2011 8:31 AM EST
72 Comments
Back to Article
HangFire - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkWill it be dead the second time you drop it, or will the speaker die in volume more every month that it does stay working?
Just going by the experience on my last 4 Motorola's... Reply
ImSpartacus - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI dropped my DX1 this morning. It was under a cheap pseudo-leather case that isn't even sold anymore. It's still chugging.
http://youtu.be/pJTjDsWnn34 Reply
HangFire - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkFirst or second drop? Reply
ImSpartacus - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkThird or fourth, I lost track. Reply
strikeback03 - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI dropped my X hard enough to knock the battery cover off once, no effect. This isn't a POS V710, it can actually take day-to-day life. Reply
quadrivial - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI wonder why there isn't criticism of the overheating problem? Reply
Stuka87 - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI can't speak for a droid, but I had my v3xx for four years, and it took multiple drops and was fine. The battery cover did get pretty loose. And my wife used it for two of those years. We now both have smart phones, but that phone held up extremely well.
If the Droids hold up like it did, then they are very durable devices. Reply
freefx - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI don't know about the X, but my original droid can take a beating. I've dropped it on concrete more times than i can keep track of. I've also dropped it while work on my roof. Tumbled all the way down the roof line and then dropped 9 feet to my concrete walkway. Battery cover came off and a barely noticeable scuff on one of the corners. My screen still has no scratches. My only complaint now is the slow processor and lack of ram.
Considering my clumsiness, I'm hoping one of these new phones can take the some punishment. Reply
jmcb - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkWere they those thin RAZR's?
My Droid 1 and Droid X1 has survived numerous drops with only scratches to show for it. The X face first many times. I dropped my Droid X so much you would think my Droid 1 was the newer phone.
Going back to the E815, minus the charging port on that phone breaking almost every 6 months...Motorola has made some durable phones.
Ask me about my Samsung Omnia 1 and drops. It didn't even make it 6 months. My Droid 1 and DX1 lasted a total of 16 months, still going strong. Reply
TechJunkie69 - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI don't know about the Droid X case, but my Atrix is near indestructible. I have dropped it, punched it (so I have anger issues, what), even my 2 year old niece has gotten ahold of it a few times (she responsible for 3 destroyed phones already), and it still works as good as it did on launch day.
And as far as performance, I'm running the SPB Shell 3D launcher with live 3D wallpaper and none of my apps have performance issues, except for angry birds seasons and its full page ads. The only difference between the X2 and the Atrix is the amount of RAM, which could potentially cause a few hiccups. As for battery life, I never have any issues with it. Then again I have it connected to a charger a lot (car dock, notebook, wall charger at night) so I wouldn't notice it as much as others might. Tegra 2 may not be the best on the market anymore, but it is still a solid platform. Reply
HangFire - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkWhen are you going to review the Charge? Now, there's a screen! Reply
HangFire - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkOops I see it has been reviewed, but it is missing in the third comparison graph- Contrast- on page 2. Reply
HangFire - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkPage 5? I'm sorry I'm used to MODERN comments section with at least a 60 second edit feature. Reply
Brian Klug - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkIt isn't missing, it simply isn't included. The effective contrast of the SAMOLED+ panels is undefined (divide by zero).
-Brian Reply
Vepsa - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkWhat app do you show in the GPS testing screenshots? Reply
Brian Klug - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI like to use GPS Test Plus, it does a decent job.
-Brian Reply
cditty - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkNo reason to upgrade... I bought my Droid X for .01 from Amazon when I rid myself of the craptastic AT&T in my market.
It is the best phone I ever had (I was an iPhone 4 user on AT&T). Verizon's network is what makes me say that, because ALL of the phone works ALL of the time (calls & data).
The original X is plenty fast. My next upgrade will be when my market goes LTE (a long way off). By then, there will be some great phones to be excited about. Funny how phones are the new *upgrade* hobby for old school computer enthusiast. Reply
silow675 - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkBrian I think you have the best mobile handset reviews. Great work on including thorough reviews on mobile displays - something lacking in most mobile reviews. Reply
Spoelie - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkThat thing looks hideous compared to recent HTC ventures, like some 80's throwback.
Mind you, I'm not talking about performance or usability or screen quality or ... It's purely my own opinion on physical styling of the device. Reply
jonup - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkWell, we spent the 90s and the better part of the last decade making phones smaller and more portable... and then all the effort went down the drain.
You can thank Apple for that. After the iphone everyone try better them with bigger and heavier phone. Remember, in America bigger is better! Reply
HangFire - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkFar be it from me to defend Apple, but this has little to do with them. The popularity of streaming media- made possible by WiFi, 3G, 4G, and pocketable 720P level resolution screens, has made phones mini media devices, and as for viewing media on screens, the bigger the better.
I like a small phone, and a large TV screen. The market is in the process of discovering just what compromise people want, and don't want, in terms of size.
Anyway, the current 3.5" screen iPhone is smaller (and more phone-like) than these 4.3" mini-tablets. Reply
jonup - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkI was not bad talking Apple so no point to defend them. I was inferring to the fact that the iPhone revolutionalized/popularized the "mini media devices". I was just a little facetious but thats my style. ;p
That said I am left with virtually no upgrade options unless I want to spend $1000+. Reply
strikeback03 - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkDid you retest the talk time for the original X? Or is your friend's X an early one? I got mine at the beginning of March, and the web browsing tests look similar to what I would expect from my phone (what do you set the screen brightness to?) but I don't think it could get anywhere near 8.9 hrs of calling. I'm used to seeing it drop 10% for 15-20 minutes of calling. Reply
jmcb - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkBeing in a good or bad reception area will have an effect on battery life. Are you in a bad reception area? Reply
Brian Klug - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI'm definitely aware of how much of a difference that can make, and we always test in moderate to good coverage areas. In this particular test area, VZW signal (both 1x and EVDO) are above -70 dBm, which is pretty good. I believe there's a screenshot or two that show -70 dBm and -65 dBm.
-Brian Reply
strikeback03 - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkMy Elixir icon shows less helpful stuff like "65%", so not sure what kind of reception in dBm I'm seeing. Though on further reading I doubt it would hit the WiFi browsing time either, with the screen on at my standard 12% brightness and all radios off I don't think it would last almost 9 hrs. Reply
strafejumper - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI see the Motorola Droid 3 is up for order now on Verizon!
Is the Droid 3 the next version of the phone in this review? Or a different animal?
If its the next in the same line its pretty funny that by the time a good review comes out for the phone the next one is already available to order!
Maybe with android phones if you wait for a thorough review you will be outdated before you have the phone in hand!
http://www.engadget.com/2011/07/07/motorola-droid-... Reply
strikeback03 - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkIt is more or less they same phone in a different form factor. Same as the Droid 2 and Droid X were closely related. Reply
strikeback03 - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkMY apologies, Droid 3 isn't Tegra 2, it is OMAP 4430. Brain fart. Anyway, it is still more a supplement than a replacement to the Droid X2 Reply
LoneWolf15 - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkActually, the Droid 3 replaces the Droid 2, just as the Droid X2 replaces the Droid X.
For those of us who still like tactile keyboards (like myself), the Droid 3 is the preferable phone. Reply
anandatar - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkSo yeah, I know, Anandtech is a US blog.
Still I'm surprised there is no comparison to the Galaxy S 2 - I was already surprised before by this but nothing has changed.
The main reason is because ALL the phones in the comparison look pale when compared with the S2.
It's (much) faster than any of the Tegra2 based devices.
It has more ram.
It's (much) lighter (there's no xperia either)
It's (much) thinner (there's no xperia either)
it's camera still picture is second to the N8 only
it's camera video recordings are above average (not blowing others out of the water tho - in 1080p it's zoomed and focusing is slower - in 720p its awesome)
it's battery life is (much) improved too
in fact, on the paper, only the resolution (800x480) is lower than the other phones (that sometimes have qHD)
Not only that, but it's also the first phone I'd use instead of an iPhone - it's that much better that it makes sense to switch. But I wouldnt settle for less. Reply
jmcb - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkGlad you like the GS2 so much....
If you know all this, why do you need to see a comparison? Check other sites, they do compare the GS2 with other phones...Imma help you out.... phonearena is one site that does. phonedog is another... Reply
NeoteriX - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkYou mentioned in your HTC Sensation review that with a little digging, you were able to come up with the camera sensor used there -- "Samsung's 8 MP S5K3H1GX 1/3.2" 3264x2488 CMOS sensor with 1.4 µm square pixels "
Though the sensor isn't the only thing as you mentioned (lens, etc.), it's useful to compare stated sensitivities, pixel sizes, etc. across the different current phones as well as generationally. I still feel like the gold standard is the iPhone 4 with its 1.75 µm pixel sites and BSI Omnivision sensor.
Do you have this information for the Droid X and X2? How does one generally determine this? I'd love to be able to figure it out for my Evo 3D. Reply
munky - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkIphone4 is by no means the gold standard. Also, there's plenty of variables affecting sensor performance which wouldn't be obvious just by looking at pixel pitch, not to mention how the image processing algorithms affect the final outcome. Unless you suggest AT start evaluating sensors with RAW data a la dxomark, I'd much rather they focus on comparing actual photos as opposed to numerical specs. Reply
NeoteriX - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI agree that specs aren't the whole picture, but I do think it provides useful insight to augment the results one sees in practical testing -- things like being able to tell how much of the improvement is image processing, what generation the sensor is and recently of development, and seeing if improving the image quality/sensors used is actually a priority for certain manufacturers. More information never hurts and it helps understand the story -- for example, when digital cameras were undergoing the megapixel race one or two years ago, it was clear that low light quality was degrading and pixel sites helped explain that story.
At any rate, I'm no expert on the state of cellphone cameras, but I will respectfully disagree with you on the iPhone 4 -- no other non-camera-phone smartphone (i.e., the Sony/Nokia/etc. type phones with real digital camera level optics and sensors built in, xenon-flashes the whole 9 yards) *I've seen* has the kind of low-light sensitivity and all-around flexibility of the iPhone 4.
It's likely a combination of the relatively large sensor sites, the large fixed aperture of the lens, the BSI CMOS design, and good image processing, but Android mfrs still have their work cut out for them over a year after the iPhone 4 release -- I'd be interested in hearing what other phone is better in low-light and all-around capability, because I certainly haven't seen it. Reply
Exodite - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkThe new Xperia series (arc/neo/pro/play) seems a good fit, especially considering that the iPhone 5 is slated to use the same sensor as those handsets.
Anyway the criteria you use for comparison are rather humorous, as it reads like the iPhone 4 having the best camera - as long as you disregard those that are better?
HTC is generally known to ship shitty cameras but I'd say both foo, bar, beep and bloop - to name those at the top of my mind - offer some excellent solutions for those who want decent images from their smartphones.
(As a side note to Anandtech - your spam filter sucks! Horribly.) Reply
Exodite - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkFeel free to replace foo, bar, beep and bloop with the names of big smartphone manufacturers that aren't HTC.
I would do it myself, if that wouldn't mean getting caught in the spam filter. Reply
NeoteriX - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkThat's fair although I wouldn't call my criteria bogus ;)
The vast majority of cell/smartphones are those built around sensor/lens/IC SOCs primarily built for mobile applications, they feature LED-based flashes--in essence, they are known to be significant compromises in the world of digital imaging because they are, in other words, phones first, cameras second.
Then, there is a small minority of cell phones that are essentially cameras with phones attached to them -- SonyEricsson C-902, Nokia N82, etc. that feature sensors and lenses pulled from traditional cameras, but with phone functionality -- we're talking about large sensors, camera glass, and xenon flashes intended for P&S digital camera applications and not mobile.
I've heard good things about the new Xperia Arc with the Exmor R BSI sensor, but it hasn't been released in the US yet and neither has the iPhone 5... thus my position that the iPhone 4 leads the pack. Reply
Exodite - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI would say my arc does decent pictures, though perhaps I'm spoiled by the fact that my better half uses a Nokia N8. Color accuracy is good but the focus area is unfortunately very narrow which makes the pictures less good than they could be.
The Samsung Galaxy S2 is arguably better, end results considered.
Anyway, I hope the iPhone 5 does end up using the same sensor as the Xperia line as it'd be interesting to see what a different hard/software solution would do with the same sensor.
Then there's stuff like the Motorola Milestone which also have a great camera, considering.
Would an N8 qualify, or is that too a camera first?
Because from my standpoint I can see something like the Altek Leo being a camera first and phone second but I'd still consider anything in a normal housing to be a phone first. Reply
munky - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkHave you seen the photos taken with the Nokia N8? They are cleaner that those from iphone4, not to mention more natural looking due to lack of over-sharpening and over-saturation. The iphone4 may be good compared to a crappy phonecam, but it is definitely not the best. Reply
NeoteriX - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkAgain, the N8 is an unfair comparison, it's not even the same class of camera phone. Just like the other examples I cited, the Sony C-902, Nokia N82... these are cameras that happen to also be phones. The problem is that these are not apples to apples comparisons.
The sensor on the N8 is 1/1.83″ -- by way of comparison, the Canon S95, a real point and shoot camera with very well-respected low light performance relative to its peers has only a slightly larger sensor of 1/1.7" Not to mention it has carl zeiss branded optics and a xenon flash (like the other examples I cited)
The iPhone 4 uses a mobile camera sensor of 1/3.2" and so does the HTC sensation.
Now I'm all for big sensors in cameraphones--the better the image quality the better, as the best camera is ultimately the one you take with you. And the N8 shows that you can shove real point and shoot sensors into a phone, but let's face the reality -- the market of phones with REAL camera sensors and optics is a very, very, very small niche market (they cost $$$ to put in those sensors) and doesn't reflect the mass market of advanced smartphones.
Again, the iPhone 4 represents the best candidate of this balance, and I'm really hoping others HTC, Motorola, etc. step up their game here, but I don't plan on owning an Apple device in the near future. Reply
munky - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkIt's a valid comparison, the N8 is a smartphone like all the others you mentioned, in the same form factor. I'm not comparing something the size of a DSLR to something that fits in your pocket.
Yes, it has a bigger sensor, just like the S95 has a bigger sensor than average pocket cameras - does that mean the S95 is not qualified to be the gold standard of pocket cameras? Doing so is just a refusal to acknowledge a superior product in favor of the lowest common denominator. Reply
NeoteriX - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI agree, but I think the distinguishing factor is that the S95 performs better than anything in its class by any dimension.
The large sensor camera phones are still a "niche" in the sense that you have to singularly want exceptional photographic performance to buy one of these phones -- and in return, you have to make several compromises as to the user interface, CPU performance/technology, software ecosystem, etc. The phones are geared towards an audience willing to deal with that.
However, if you look at the other major powers in the phone OS ecosystems (iOS, Win7, Android, WebOS?), none incorporate the large sensor into any phone, much less the kind of flagship phone that you would expect them to pull all the stops out for.
Believe me when I say I would go out and immediately buy the first Android phone with all the furnishings -- dualcore CPU, etc. that *also* included a large sensor and quality glass. Reply
Exodite - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkThat's a bit of a red herring considering that the vast majority of these so-called 'camera phones' aren't lacking in other desirable features.
Indeed, a good camera is becoming something of a hallmark of high-end smartphones in general, HTC being the exception to the rule.
As for the cost you mentioned before, the N8 - undeniably the best-equipped smartphone today when the camera is concerned - is a mid-range phone. Reply
Brian Klug - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI'm a huge optics nerd (it's what I studied in college at least) so I always try and find out everything I can about the cameras in here. Usually that ends up being very little because it either isn't documented, or there's no information in the place I look.
For the sensor type, it's easy enough to just run dmesg and scan through there. HTC lately has been initializing the camera and leaving the part number right there. I searched through on the X2 and couldn't find any camera sensor part numbers even in the sections where they're clearly starting to init the camera. It's unfortunate, because otherwise we could get a better feel for what sensors are usually very good and which ones usually aren't.
It's interesting that Apple did such a good job marketing backside illumination with the iPhone 4, when essentially every sensor at or over 8 MP needs to be backside illuminated (and thinned) due to skew effects. That said their camera is indeed very good.
-Brian Reply
jamyryals - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkLove the video review format. My favorite smart phone reviewer on the net, keep it up Brian. Reply
munky - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkWhy do the graphs always compare the usual Samsung and Motorolla phones, the old practically irrelevant iphone 3gs, Nexus One and Dell Streak, but not more variety of modern phones, like the Nokia N8, for example? Instead of grouping tablets and phones in the same graphs, separate the two categories so that each one has a better selection of relevant entries. Reply
Exodite - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkRegarding Motorala and their use of FWVGA over WVGA, they're not the only Android handset manufacturer who went that route as Sony-Ericsson also uses FWVGA on the X10/arc/neo/play. Reply
BryanC - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI might consider buying this phone if not for the terrible pentile screen door effect, which is simply unacceptable in today's day and age.
The iPhone4 has 960x640x3 subpixels in 5.65in2 area. The Droid X2 has 960x540x2 subpixels in 7.90in2 area. The iPhone has 2.5X the subpixel density of the Droid X2! And it's immediately obvious when you look at the displays - the iPhone4 display is so detailed the image looks printed on, it's in a completely different class.
Too bad. Reply
JayQ330 - Thursday, September 01, 2011 - linkwhat does that have to do with any of this? oh i see, wipe your chin there's still some iphone honey left. Reply
Hrel - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkI'd like to see them add an attachable/detachable slide out keyboard. Then they could also add a gamepad for actual hand held gaming. And they'd get to make money selling more accesories. It's a win for everyone! The thing is so thin as it is it can stand to gain some thickness without being an issue AT ALL. Reply
snoozemode - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkwhat do you mean, u cant see the grainy pattern in blue color? i see it just as good as in green, download the engadget app and put the icon on the homescreen, tons of black spots in it where the white subpixels have closed. RGBW sucks, period. Reply
bjacobson - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkall these high powered phones but scrolling up and down with your finger on a webpage is still laggy as hell. ??? Reply
bplewis24 - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkThey're displaying flash images...what do you expect? Reply
JayQ330 - Thursday, September 01, 2011 - linkyou have to download a gpu rendering browser, its the reason the iphone & samsung galaxy s2 & even the s are able to scroll & zoom in & out so smooth, when you see checker board effect you know its gpu rendered where as the regular android browsers are constantly resizing & adjusting words & images in realtime. they should take a hint from samsungs browser. Reply
NeoteriX - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkIf I was looking on my HTC Evo 3D, what text would I be searching for in the dmesg output to identify the camera initialization line? Reply
Brian Klug - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkThings like this:
<4>[ 14.364959] __s5k3h1gx_probe
<6>[ 14.365051] s5k3h1gx_vreg_enable camera vreg on
<6>[ 14.365173] sensor_vreg_on camera vreg on
<6>[ 14.365722] sensor_power_enable("gp4", 2850) == 0
<6>[ 14.366180] sensor_power_enable("gp6", 2850) == 0
<6>[ 14.463897] s5k3h1gx_probe successed! rc = 0
<6>[ 14.464141] ov8810 s->node 1
<6>[ 14.464324] s5k3h1gx: s5k3h1gx_sensor_probe: switch clk
<6>[ 14.464416] Doing clk switch (s5k3h1gx)
<6>[ 14.484527] [Camera] gpio_request(30, "s5k3h1gx")
Note the part with OV8810 which is an omnivision 8 MP 1/3.2" sensor. Possibly the Sensation uses some parts Samsung, some parts OV. Reply
YoPete525 - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkGreat review as always, but I still find it ironic how far software optimization has to come on Android in general. I realize the X2 is rendering 26%(?) more pixels, but for every time it appears to process actions more quickly than the X, there is an example of it falling behind, like when pulling up the menu with the hardware button, and loading Basemark from the app drawer. Also, if you were to load up one of the more scrolling-conscientious launchers from the market, like LauncherPro or Go Launcher, the homescreens would scroll essentially at the device's refresh rate without stutter. Same story with Opera Mobile vs. the stock browser. Reply
NeoteriX - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkAs I thought when I first looked at the dsmeg output; looks like it's no dice -- where the sensor ID should be is only "sp3d":
<6>[73834.064016] [CAM]sp3d_vreg_enable camera vreg on
<6>[73834.064139] [Camera]Shooter_sp3d_vreg_on
<6>[73837.130660] [CAM]sp3d_spi_open_init: 1697
<6>[73837.130691] [CAM]sp3d_vreg_enable camera vreg on
<6>[73837.130691] [Camera]Shooter_sp3d_vreg_on
<6>[73837.132155] [CAM]sp3d: sp3d_sensor_probe: switch clk
<6>[73837.163436] [CAM]sp3d_sensor_setting type:0 config:0
BTW, for what it's worth, the HTC Evo 4G uses the OV8810 omnivision for its camera:
<6>[690609.827789] [CAM]ov8810_resume Reply
wpwoodjr - Thursday, July 07, 2011 - linkThe effective available RAM memory on the DX2 is about 70-80mb less than the DX, you can see this by looking at Settings...Applications...Running Services and adding up the used and free memory. I was all set to buy a DX2 until I saw this. Even in the store I could easily make the Moto launcher close and be forced to redraw with only a few programs open. My DX already runs out of memory, I didn't want more problems. Perhaps this memory is taken up by the graphics card?
It would be great if you added some multi-tasking tests to your reviews that would stress memory. Reply
bplewis24 - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkI wonder if the updated version of Blur is the reason for the additional memory usage? Reply
wpwoodjr - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkNo, if that were the case the memory would still be counted in the Running Services report. The "missing" memory is probably used by the graphics card. I like the Moto "Home" app (especially the "Groups" feature and the "Recent" group) and some of the widgets. Reply
bplewis24 - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkWhere can we download the Basemark apk? Reply
Impulses - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkI like the closing thoughts, every new device doesn't have to one up the last one in every last category, even amongst the high end... As phones get more and more advanced they also get more personal, and so does the choice between them. A lot of people won't see LTE for a year or longer, they're far better off with this than any of the current LTE VZW options.
I'm not even with VZW btw, so personally I could care less, more choices are always a good thing for the consumer tho. Speaking of choices, the one thing Android desperately needs more of right now are high end phones sized at 4"or less. I'm a guy, I enjoy my 4.3" device, but the vast majority of women I speak to would never buy something larger than an Atrix and even that's pushing it. Yet many of them still want a device with the latest CPU, video recording capabilities, etc etc.
Anyway, as far as the review... I loved the part about the video recording issues and the SD card, that kind of in depth stuff (not to mention the usual barrage of tests) is why AT phone reviews are second to none. Keep up the good work!
Oh and any word on the EVO 3D review? Reply
Vinny DePaul - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkDroid X2 been around for awhile. Many web sites already have Droid x2 review. At first I thought it is a Droid 3 review. Reply
NeoteriX - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkAnd all the other sites have about 2/3rds less content, testing, and original information. Those are the breaks for quality reviewing. Reply
wpwoodjr - Friday, July 08, 2011 - linkThis is by far the best, most educated review. Reply
fabuchua - Wednesday, July 20, 2011 - linkwww ifancyshop com
Women's fashion, men's personality + shoes
Travel bagthat eye-catching jacket + super pack free shipping Reply
toilkenn - Thursday, July 21, 2011 - linkI've had the DX2 for about two months and I've already had 3 replacements. I originally got this phone as replacement for my original Droid X which locked up when I downloaded the 2.3 (gingerbread) update to it. Needless to say, I would rather have my old droid x back! The dual core processor is fast and you can tell this phone has a lot of potential, but it has a lot of bugs in the software and Motorola has yet to announce when they push the 2.3 update out for the DX2. Its kind of sad the the DX has the 2.3, but the DX2 doesn't.
Also the camera and camcorder are really bad on this one. They are a lot clearer and all but the camera is bugging and hesitates a lot when trying to capture footage and all. This is critical if your trying to catch a shot on the fly and you can't because all of a sudden your phone wants to act up. They should have left the dedicated camera button on, but I guess they have their reasons for doing so. All the phones that I have had reset ted on me randomly during calls or watching video and the phone itself gets really hot at times. I believe when they send out a firmware update, all these issues will be fixed, but until then, i would recommend the Droid 3 instead.
By the way, motoblur really sucks on this phone too. The Droid 3 has a revamped moto OS and it seems more fluid and stable than the Droid X2 OS! Reply
woyoulaile - Friday, July 22, 2011 - linkwww (point) ifancyshop (point) com
I tide fashion Good-looking, not expensive Free transport
Fashion Female show sexy,
personality Men's clothing + Shoes,
Low-cost wholesale shine cool sunglasses
Travel bagthat grabs an eye coat + Chao packet Free transport Reply
nitink - Monday, August 01, 2011 - linkthis phone have a great potential unleach its power get full hd games with sd card data..at:
http://nitin-xyz.blogspot.com/2011/07/free-and-ful... Reply
Spazztastik - Sunday, September 23, 2012 - linkI have the Droid x2. I have gashes in this phone and it works like a dream. I have dropped it more times than I can count and it still works amazing. I was at a bar and got shot at and my phone FLEW across a parking lot, lost the battery cover and it still works and the screen holds up its end of the deal too :) I love it :) Reply


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A community art contest for Coon Rapids students will be part of the 50th anniversary of Coon Rapids Snowflake Days.
Sponsored by the Coon Rapids Arts Commission, the Snowflake Days Arts Expo will take place Sunday, Feb. 16 with the art work displayed in the PGA Hall of Fame room at Bunker Hills Golf Course from 9 a.m. to 2 p.m.
Students can enter original art work, but no photographs and there is a limit of one entry per student.
Each entry should be no larger than eight by 10 inches.
There will be four divisions – grades K-two, three-five, six-eight and nine-12.
Prizes will be awarded to the first-place winner in each category.
Judges will be members of the Coon Rapids Snowflake Days Committee and all decisions will be final.
Entries should be submitted no later than 4:30 p.m. Wednesday, Feb. 12.
They can be dropped off at the Coon Rapids City Center or mailed to Coon Rapids City Center, Attention: Snowflake Days Arts Expo, 11155 Robinson Dr. NW., Coon Rapids, MN 55433.
Name, home address, school and grade of student artist should be included.