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Apple A5X Die Size Measured: 162.94mm^2, Samsung 45nm LP Confirmedby Anand Lal Shimpi on 3/16/2012 1:59 PM EST
45 Comments
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alent1234 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkhuge battery and same usage time meant something is up
why is apple still using 45nm? steve jobs should never have sued samsung Reply
A5 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkI'm not sure who they contract their manufacturing out to now, but it is a very real possibility that they couldn't get 28nm going in time to hit Apple's production timeline. You have to remember that these chips have probably been in production for several months.
I'm guessing that the "A6" that showed up in the beta code is a die shrink of this chip for the next iPhone. I don't think they'll have an A15 design ready for a July launch. Reply
alent1234 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linksamsung is still making them along with the screens. the least apple could have done was 32nm.
not sure if it's apple staying with the same process or samsung not offering to make CPU's for them on anything better and the move to TSMC is taking time Reply
scook9 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkProbably because the 45nm node is extremely well optimized at this point. Apple cannot afford low yields with the demand they see. Reply
dagamer34 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkIt's not as if Samsung has released any phones with 32nm chips in them. Reply
quiksilvr - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - link*Facepalm* Samsung WAS making a 28nm chip for Apple as far back as October. It was going to be the new A6 and an even thinner iPad 3 was supposed to happen. BUT since Apple got their panties in a bunch Samsung told Apple to piss off. Reply
KoolAidMan1 - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - link28nm yields are relatively low across the board. For the number of iPads Apple is going to be selling this year, it makes sense that they went with the more dependable 45nm process. It is either that or deal with not being able to make enough iPads to satisfy demand.
Samsung denying components out of spite is a ridiculous idea. They may be competing in the consumer products division, but in terms of components Apple is by far Samsung's largest client. Reply
pedrostee - Sunday, March 18, 2012 - linkyou appear certain in your reply.. any evidence or just blowin smoke? Reply
Shadowmaster625 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkWhy not? I'm sure at least 50 million dump yuppies will rush out to throw away their ipoop 2 in favor of dropping yet another $500-$1000 on an ipoop 3.
And what do you get for that extra $500 to $1000? A slightly prettier homescreen to stare at after safari crashes! Reply
name99 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkRead most of the other comments in this thread. Then ask yourself if you are not, perhaps, a little ashamed of your particular contribution to this debate.
We all have bad days, we all make mistakes. But you can make up for it by, in future, perhaps considering the tone of the people around you and trying to match that tone. Reply
ImSpartacus - Sunday, March 18, 2012 - linkOften times, it's best to just avoid replying to such comments. More often than not, the individual is simply "trolling" for comments. Reply
gorash - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkI'd say the new screen is pretty overrated. It doesn't look super different. Reply
KoolAidMan1 - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkI'd say you're pretty blind. It is almost as bad as saying that anti-aliasing doesn't make a difference in games.
After a day with the iPad I want this sort of PPI in ALL of my monitors. My desktop monitors are high end NEC IPS displays, and now all I see are pixels and blockiness in text. Crossing fingers that yields get good enough to allow this sort of pixel density in desktop and laptop displays.
It is insane that a display of this quality exists in a consumer product that only costs $500. Reply
steven75 - Sunday, March 18, 2012 - linkUh, mods? How about some help here. Reply
UpSpin - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkYou can't just switch to a different manufacturing process. Their A5, with both CPU and GPu, is designed and optimized for 45nm. They have to invest a lot of money to make it work on 32nm or 25nm. They have to redesign both CPU and GPU. It would be stupid to do this with no further change. Intel requires a whole new Generation for such a move.
For Apple it would have been idiotic, because ARM A15 technology is available now, so they better use their knowledge and time to build a new A6 based on Cortex A15 with the PowerVR6 GPU and build on 25nm. They probabley have to invest the same money and time, but get much much more.
You should rather ask why Apple still uses the Cortext A9 and hasn't switched to A15 yet (look at Qualcomm, it's possible to have A15 technology ready already). Reply
name99 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkI've said it before, I'll say it again.
To me everything looks like A5X is a plan B because A6 (for whatever reason) was delayed.
Look at, for example, the separate RAM that is being used, rather than PoP as in A5. I'm sure that Apple did not want this there, they were forced into it by switching to the larger A5X, and probably not being in a position, in time, to integrate double the RAM into the package.
I also am guessing that this *externally driven* RAM is a substantial part of the requirement for a large battery. I find it hard to believe this much larger battery (which supposedly gives us much the same lifetimes for various tasks as the previous iPads) is required for the screen.
People keep seeming to forget that we went through this transition before:
The iPhone 3GS had a 1219 mAh battery, the iPhone4 had a 1420mAh battery. The iPhone 4 was generally considered to have rather better battery life than iPhone 3GS, especially in tasks like movie-watching. That seems to indicate that, contrary to the "wisdom" of web commenters, there is no intrinsic reason that a highDPI screen has to burn power.
Sure, it is possible that this particular screen design burns power, in a way that the iPhone 4's does not --- but I think the onus on people who claim this is to provide proof, not to simply assert "well of course it does". Reply
Steelbom - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkBut 2048x1536 is so much higher than 960x640. The GPUs will be needed more often to power that display, and the display may have needed a more powerful backlight. Reply
name99 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkThis is what I am saying. THINK.
What determines the power usage of an LCD display. The backlight.
So why should more pixels over the same area require more energy? The total emitted light is the same.
Now in principle there COULD be effects related to more "borders" between pixels resulting in more dead area that doesn't channel light --- aperture effects. In practice,
(a) this seems to have been taken care of in the manufacturing process --- there was an article on it flooding the web about five days ago
(b) like I said, we have the example of the iPhone retina display. If that doesn't require a substantial boost in power over its predecessor, why should the iPad display be different?
There ARE more backlight LEDs in the iPad3 screen. But that does not imply that more backlight power is being generated --- they may just be there to create a more even backlight. Certainly my iPad1, while having a quite acceptable screen, had patches where light would bleed through a pure black image more so than in other regions of the screen. Reply
Steelbom - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkYou're assuming the backlight is the same, and not more powerful. With the iPhone, they only had to pack 614,000 pixels in a small area, but with the iPad they're dealing with five times more pixels on a larger area. They even mentioned that they had to (rough remembering of it:) separate the "pixels" from the "signals" in the display and lift the former up so that signals don't get crossed. That may make it thicker, and make it need a more powerful backlight.
Plus it requires more power from the GPUs to run the display. I doubt the RAM would increase power consumption by anything but a small amount. Reply
ssj3gohan - Thursday, March 22, 2012 - linkLet's put some science into this thread to end the speculation.
The transmissivity (amount of light it lets through) of a screen is a function of the transmissivity of the pixels and the fill factor (fraction of the total area that is actually pixels and not black). In general: higher pixel density = lower fill factor and lower transmissivity of the individual pixels. That is exactly what is going on here; the new iPad screen has significantly lower fill factor and thus, for the same luminance, needs a stronger backlight.
This is the sole reason for the larger battery. The vast majority of power is sucked up by the screen even in the original iPad and iPad 2. Reply
tipoo - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkThere are already reviews out and they\re all saying pretty much the same battery life as the 2. Reply
UpSpin - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkYou might be right that it was plan B, and that they had to make some unwanted decisions.
But let's talk about power consumption:
The new SoC is similar to the old one, except of a second GPU. Power consumption of the chip might be 30% more. RAM does consume some power, too, but not that much, or does RAM get noticeable hot?
But the display is the deal breaker. Just take a look at the Engadget post about the iPad screen under the microscope:
It's pretty obvious that horizontally no added black gap was introduced by the switch to the higher density. But vertically about twice as much black area was added! Additionally does each LC cell consume power if turned off, now they have to control 4 times the amount of cells, so the panel without backlight will consume at least 4 times more power (whereas a panel doesn't consume that much at all compared to the LED backlight, still an increase). So if you increase the pixel density you will get worse transmittance, thus you have to increase the backlight brightness. With a single row of LEDs they couldn't operate the LEDs in their most efficient region, so they had to add a second row to increase brightness.
Other way to think about it: The new battery is 20Whr larger but it has the same battery life. So if you think it's because of the RAM and SoC, both together have to consume an additional 2 Watt. That alone is ridiculous.
It's wrong to say it's the SoC only, it's totally wrong to say it's because of the added RAM, it's also wrong to say it's because of the display only, but it's mainly because of the display.
Higher backlight brightness maybe twice as bright, faster GPU necessary, more RAM necessary, all because of the higher resolution.
And placing the RAM at the side or over the chip doesn't really change the power consumption, it's just a space saving, thus cost saving. Reply
tipoo - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkWith Rogue, these mobile SoC GPUs are getting into and maybe beyond the 200Gflop range (they said 20x the per-core performance of the 543) as the PS360 GPUs. The current MP4 is about 30 I think. Do you think the limitation will be elsewhere for actual real world graphics performance though? Last I checked these chips still didn't have the memory bandwidth of graphics cards even from 2005, and then there's processor performance and how large apps/games can be, not to mention controls. With so much potential in Rogue and future SoC chips I hope the other problems are looked at too. Reply
thefrick - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkA 45nm A5X is a deal-killer for me. The "iPad 3" is essentially an underpowered version of the iPad 2 considering the display's high resolution and lack of CPU/GPU clock increases. The next iPad will benefit from a full node shrink to (presumably) 28nm on BOTH the CPU and the 4G baseband; likely in addition to new CPU (Cortex A15) and GPU architectures. The iPad 3 is shaping up to be a repeat of the iPhone 3G (read: only survives one iOS update before becoming slow enough to impair its usefulness).
This is in addition to the battery problems the iPad 3 is likely to experience: that 45nm A5X is BIG for a mobile SoC, and will be generating a lot of heat. Hot iPad innards = significantly diminished Li-Ion battery lifetime... Reply
labrats5 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkI'm not sure about your iPhone 3G comparison. Apple's iOS updates seems to be more RAM dependent than anything else. A good example would be that iPhoto runs on the iPhone 4 (512mb) but not the original iPad (256mb) even though the latter's SOC is faster. The new iPad version RAM doubled while the iPhone 3G wasn't. Reply
dagamer34 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkExcept Apple's already given their quoted battery life times and there's no change... this is an example of taking "speeds and feeds" so far, you are about to fall off a cliff. Reply
gorash - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkIt's basically iPad 2 with a better screen. iPad 2S. Reply
KoolAidMan1 - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkI am very curious to see practical benchmarks. It is possible that the GPU upgrade increased performance for things other than rendering video. Remember that Core Image, Core Video, and other components of iOS/OS X are GPU accelerated. Applications actually feel a little bit snappier than they do in the iPad 2.
It is a minor difference but it is there. Again, looking forward to Anandtech's review. Reply
jjj - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkSo it's as big as Ivy Bridge,that's a more interesting comparison.
Mobile GPU war -Apple can't be part of such a war,so for such a war to exist we would need Android phone makers that have their own SoC to go for huge die sizes,forcing Nvidia,Qualcomm and everybody else to do the same but that would push phone prices up so maybe it would be better to have no such wars before 20/22nm.There is also the matter of heat and a huge GPU could force lower CPU clocks (like it might just be doing right now in Apple's case).
For traditional PCs,consoles and TV's,obviously, a large GPU could work even before 20/22nm since $ and heat budget are less of a problem but there isn't much of a point to go that way unless you got the sales volume and the software.
If anything, i would much rather see 2-3x faster storeage in phones and tablets. Reply
A5 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkI'd much rather have a faster GPU than faster storage. The internal storage on phones is more than fast enough for now. Faster MicroSD cards would be nice, though. Reply
jjj - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkthat shows how little you know.storage impacts perf in a big way atm. Reply
darkcrayon - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkEven on a device that does not use a swap file? Once an app is launched, which takes on average a couple of seconds, where is all this slow disk i/o that's "bottlenecking" the experience? On the other hand, I can't think of many applications on something like the iPad that aren't using the GPU for *something*. Reply
A5 - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkPretty much this. The only apps that don't fit into RAM are the large, graphically intense games. Most day-to-day apps load within a second.
Mobile SoCs have more of a problem with memory bandwidth than storage speed. Reply
tipoo - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkYou can't really compare it to Ivy Bridge though, IB will be using 22nm transistors so it will have a much higher density, and even Sandy Bridge is on 32nm now while Apple is on 45nm. Heck, even Tegra is on 40nm, so Apples chips are less dense overall. Reply
Roland00Address - Monday, March 19, 2012 - linkAMD Zacate/Brazos (aka Bobcat high power/Bobcat low power) die size is 75mm^2 on TSMC low powered 40mm. 40nm has about a 25% greater transistor density than 45nm (I don't have numbers of TSMC vs Samsung transistor density for 45 vs 40nm so I am assuming 1:1). So 75mm^2 *1.25= 93 is mm^2
A6x is 162.94mm^2 or 212% the size of than AMD Zacate/Brazo 75mm^2 on TMSC 40nm, once you take in account 40 vs 45 that is about 173% the size of Zacate. Reply
zanon - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkThat still remains one of the oddest parts of Tegra 3. As pointed out in Anand's own Medfield review, current ARM cores by themselves can be very easily choked by lack of memory bandwidth (handling that much better seems to be a major part of why Medfield did so well). With the Tegra 2 it was somewhat understandable, because it was quite an early part, but at the end of 2011, with a quad-core part and updated (though still weak) GPU, it was very odd that Nvidia of all places would stay on a single-channel when everyone else had left that behind.
Tegra 3 was pretty disappointing. I very much hope as you say here that Wayne will be a major leap forward and really blow everyone's socks off. It's definitely going to be wicked exciting in 2013, with both Series 6 on the GPU-side and big.LITTLE A15/A7 heterozygous SoCs on the CPU-side. We're still on such a strong upward curve in the mobile space, every year is bringing incredible leaps forward and massive competition. Like being back in the early/mid-90s all over again but even better :). Reply
tipoo - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkI've always felt like Tegra was designed for marketability over all else. Every Tegra revision was supposed to be the leader of mobile SoCs, but every time they turned out to be more hot air than performance. Quad + 1 cores is marketable; dual channel memory to actually feed the cores isn't. An 8 "core" GPU is marketable, but its handily slaughtered by a year old Imagination Tech (SGX) chip. Reply
Roland00Address - Monday, March 19, 2012 - link1) They are cheap to make since the die size is so small. When carriers don't subsidize the device, margins can be small. Apple can make their chips be bigger since A) they sell so much volume and thus they can push downward pressure on their marginal costs by buying in bulk B) They are the market leader so they can charge more for their device
2) Tegra 2 was the Android development platform for Android 3.X thus everybody knows the software and you don't have to pay money to tweak it.
So good marketing combine with cheap to make means you can make your money and sell the device. Reply
iwod - Friday, March 16, 2012 - linkSo the next SoC in iPhone coming up in 6 months time.This definitely wont be the A5X as it simply wont fit in the iPhone size.
A5X with 28nm die shrink? But as someone has stated above this doesn't make any sense because switching nodes requires tuning and redesign. It would be better if they simply design A6 around the new node.
So what will A6 be? Cortex A15+A7 with Rogue? Sounds Great! But Both A7 and A15 aren't anywhere near ready in a few months time. And it would take Apple a month to stock up parts.
Any ideas?
Steelbom - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkI think we'll see a quad-core Cortex A15 in an iPhone, likely with 600 series graphics, and then the same in the iPad 4 but with roughly five times more powerful graphics. Reply
dagamer34 - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkGoing quad core when they know they are going to have a dual-core Cortex A15 next year is silly and dumb. Reply
Steelbom - Sunday, March 18, 2012 - linkWhat? They should have a quad-core Cortex A15 next year. The A6 found in iOS Beta is a quad-core, so it's pretty easy to guess that it'll likely be an A15 quad. Reply
Mike1111 - Saturday, March 17, 2012 - linkIMHO 162.94mm2 makes it very unlikely that the A5X will end up in the next iPhone. An A6 makes more sense, maybe even with big.LITTLE A7+A15. It was said that there will be devices available with big.LITTLE by the end of the year, so if the next iPhone launches in October like it did last year it could happen (yes, Apple needs a lot of chips, but they also have the advantage of owning and designing both the chip and the phone, so the timing advantage and disadvantage might cancel each other out).
I mean what are the alternatives? A5X die shrink? A6 with just 2xA15? Reply
Steelbom - Sunday, March 18, 2012 - linkWe won't see an A5X in the iPhone 5. The whole point of the extra graphics power is for powering the retina display in the iPad 3. It'll either stay with an SGX543MP2 or, and more likely, we'll see some 600 series chips.
I'm actually hoping Apple opts for a faster dual-core Cortex A15 rather than a quad-core Cortex A15. Reply
Mike1111 - Tuesday, March 20, 2012 - linkMaybe it's a "quad-core" in the sense of 2xA7 + 2xA15. ARM said it's also possible to expose all 4 cores to the OS (standard would be the OS sees either 2xA7 or 2xA15). Apple with full control over software and hardware could easily expose all 4 cores to iOS. Reply


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AMD SB750 arrives on the Foxconn A79A-S...by Gary Key on 7/21/2008 3:00 AM EST
- Posted in
- Gary's First Looks
38 Comments
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quanta - Friday, July 25, 2008 - linkIf you are going to buy the SB750 boards, you should stay away from Foxconn, because it was recently busted for deliberate sabotaging alternative systems and making shoddy motherboards that are not ACPI-compliant.[1] As strange as it sound, it was Microsoft Certified Motherboard! If that's not enough, currently the company is rated F by Better Business Bureau![2] If you want a reliable computer, stay away from the con that is Foxconn!
[1] http://ubuntu-virginia.ubuntuforums.org/showthread...
[2] http://www.labbb.org/BBBWeb/Forms/Business/Company...">http://www.labbb.org/BBBWeb/Forms/Busin...age_Expo... Reply
BLaber - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkI agree to an extent that improved super pi results don't guarantee performance improvements across the board , but 15% improvement is not totally because of cache size getting bigger , there has to be some thing else with the combination of improved cache size like decreased cache latency , improvement in core e.t.c to resulting in improved pi results....
Any way time will tell ... hope fully thing will get better for AMD , Bcz without AMD we are pretty much screwed by Intel. Reply
geok1ng - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkAMD is in dire straits on the CPU market for sure, but they are in better position on the Graphics and HTPC market with the 4000 series and the 780G.
i dont think that 45nm Phenoms can save the company, by the time 45nm parts arrive Intel will be all over the Nehalem, with DDR3 prices plummeting due to scaling gains. It is a very long shot to infere that 45nm Phenoms can compete with 45nm C2Ds, since these CPUs will reach sub $200 price tags by the time 45nm arrive.
But if AMD can put SB750 on the shelfes right now they may take advantage of the good moment they are living on the graphics market:
a- bundle 4850/4870/4870X2 with mobos/CPUs, since SB750 allows Phenoms to reach 3Ghz+ clocks, taking triple and quad cores to " budget gaming". These systems will dominate the price/performance budget gaming market, since the "budget" quad offer from intel (q6600/Q9450) rarely reachs 3,6ghz on air
b-created HTPCs mobos that can handle triple and quad cores Phenoms and take advantage of the lower power consumption that the SB750 allows, since the only reason to go Intel in a HTPC is the raw performance of C2Ds, something that 3 or 4 cores at 3Ghz+ may confront in equal terms.
Lets use my situation as an example: i WILL have a 4870X2, the very first VGA to allow gaming at 2560x1600, my 30" resolution. I can:
a-Put the 4870X2 on my 18 months old E4300+P5WDH system and wait for Nehalem to build a new system.
b-Dump $300 on a X48/P45 DDR2 mobo and $215 on a E8400
c-Build a quad phenom+SB750 system. But this latter option implies that SB750 will be available at 4870X2 launch and that triple/quad Phenoms prices go lower, right now they cant even compete with the higher performing/2 years old Q6600!
Maybe it is past time for AMD to take the gloves off on the IGP front:
Build an IGP that can allow gaming at 1680x1050/0xAA (the 780G can be overcloked enough to allow gaming at 1280x1024/0xAA) and make all the competitors on the HTPC AND the budget gaming markets run away!
Such a system would convince people that a Phenom may be less powerful than a Core 2, but it runs in a more complete plataform. Thas was the reasoning that carved AMDs market share on the HTPC market with the 780G, why cant it be the reasoning that will dominate the budget/casual gaming market once and for all?! Reply
BPB - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkYou can put an E8400 in the P5W DH board, I have the P5W DH Deluxe and am considering doing just that. Reply
wingless - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkYou make several excellent points. I would like to point out to you that 45nm Denebs are at least 12.5% faster than current Phenoms according to the SuperPi results published a couple of weeks ago. Also remember that K10 architecture historically does very poorly in SuperPi so some analysts suggested that the 12.5% increase is like a worst case scenario for Deneb. PCPer analysts said they have heard from people that have tested K10.5 that it performs between 20 and 30% better than current 65nm Phenoms. Deneb will apparently have much higher IPC according to those results and will comfortably match or exceed Penryn. The only problem on AMD's side is timing. They need to get this "fixed" K10.5 out the door ASAP but it won't arrive until early Q4/2008. Hopefully their Chipset and GPU business will keep them afloat until Deneb hits the market but it will be tight. Reply
BitByBit - Saturday, July 26, 2008 - linkA boost of 20-30% would require a complete architectural overhaul, so I would take such claims with a generous pinch of salt. I expect around a 5% boost from the additional cache (application dependent) and another 5% from core tweaks, giving an average gain of a little over 10%, maybe more in certain apps. Reply
Martimus - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkOne problem with that is that SuperPI is heavily reliant on cache, and Deneb has 3 times the L3 cache that current Phenom has. So using those results to say that Deneb is 15% faster isn't exactly an apples to apples comparison. It may very well have less of a performance increase with other applications. Reply
spidey81 - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkFrom what I'm reading here, does it seem reasonable to assume that future higher clocked Phenoms will not be compatible with older 790FX/SB600 boards? I recently went with the 790FX board because from all the road maps that I had seen, AMD was going to make it's near future processors compatible with the socket. And therefore make an easier upgrade path. Does anyone have any insight into this? Reply
Darkskypoet - Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - linkBeen waiting for the remainder of the review all day... Issues, troubles, or just teasing? Reply
ZootyGray - Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - linkAt the top of the page:
"(7/22/08 update - We are still clarifying ACC details with AMD before we publish the full article this week)"
This is like waiting for my favourite cappucino frozen yogurt in a cone. :)
Take your time, Gary - I appreciate the facts more than the hype. Do what you gotta do.
I love this - talking to AMD - I feel really 'connected'. Reply
jhb116 - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkI have to agree get the fact right and complete. If the 750 is good enough - I might just wait for it.
Although given the many comments about when will this be published begs the advice that Mr. Scott gave Geordi LaForge in Star Trek - something to the effect "You tell the Captain it'll take 12 hours and when you finish it in 6, you look like a hero." :) Reply
mariusmotea - Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - linkWhen will see the full review? Reply
BLaber - Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - linkGary I can't wait any longer , where is the promised review Reply
coolsam2 - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linki was looking for the next page.. awww.. my dreams of amd domination've to be put on hold.. Reply
ZootyGray - Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - linkNot on hold.
Just patiently waiting for the train. The lil engine that could :)
The domination part - well sure, why not :) I won't support those other guys anyway.
Sylvanas - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkThanks Gary! This is better than I had thought, I thought the Sb750 would only be bringing a slightly better core speed but +200mhz on the NB and a lower Vcore with +100mhz core is great. Reply
Calin - Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - linkAllow Gary to play with the new chipset, and more interesting results might come to light :)
Even so, this is great news - I wonder if some quick tests of "clock on clock" performance against Intel quad core could be in order. Reply
pattycake0147 - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkWill this be the SB chip that comes on the 790GX when it ships? By the way when can we expect the 790GX to start shipping? Reply
wildguy2k - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkYep, that's the way it's looking. GX & the "new" FX will both get this SB750, at least until next year when the SB8xx series launches ;)
I'd assume that if we're to see a full review of the chipset tomorrow, we're going to see retail availability pretty quickly thereafter. I'm hoping, at least :)
Good thread here: http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1323548">http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1323548
RandyB - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkGood job! We need to save our language. It is quickly deteriorating! I get a headache, just trying to read some of these posts and articles. Reply
RandyB - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkDJMiggy; you're scaring me a bit there, Hannibal!;) Reply
Guuts - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkI think lotion would have ruined the flavor of any delicacy Hannibal the Cannibal might have cooked up using his victims... :-p It was "Buffalo Bill" who encouraged us to moisturize. Reply
BLaber - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkWOW wonder what the combination of SB750 + 45nm Phenom X4 will achieve.
All in all looking good for AMD.
Anglamin - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkHi Gary and all AMD experts :
I am not very technical and would like to understand what this feature means to AMD's market share gain. Is this for a consumer segment or is this for AMD enthusiasts who build systems by themselves ? Are the primary improvements from the power consumption and speed ? Thanks for your help.
Calin - Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - linkThis isn't for the consumer, is only for the enthusiast (this is overclocking, and the consumer does not overclock).
Better stability at higher speeds, with lower voltages might mean an faster Phenom (even if validated only for the SB750 platform) might be near - this is good news for AMD, as it will push its performance higher. This is also good news for consumers, as Intel will push its performance higher again, or reply with an price cut/slash. Reply
Goty - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkQuick question, why has the PCI-E bus speed been raised in the last screen? I've always kind of been under the impression that messing with the PCI-E bus speed is more often than not detrimental to stability. Reply
Locutus465 - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkThey need something like this to further push the value of the Phenom CPU's pretty desperatly! I can't wait to read a more complete review of the platform with this new SB integrated..
I'm running the 2.5GHz phenom 4x on a 790FX board... Paird with 4GB of DDR2 (800MHz) and a Radeon 3870 I have to say the performance is friggen amazing, absolutly no issues at all gaming on my 19" screen (yeah, you'd probably want to upgrade to a 4870(or x2) to go with a bigger screen) but as far as a solid gaming rig goes, the current platform is great.
This SB with the new BIOS applied would just push the value still farther. It really seems like AMD is rather succesfully carving out a rather nice little value market on the Desktop front, while managing (for now) to hold on to their performance advantages on the server front. Reply
Dobs - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkI'm trying to get excited about AMD processors/chipsets as I am about the ATI 4800 series, but nothing in this article does it for me.... so far.
Hopefully the full article will reveal some real-world competition.
As a complete novice PC builder, I got my Q9450 running @ 3.2GHz on 1.3v which is effectively the same as the QX9770 @ stock.
I'm betting the performance of the 9850 @ 3.2 GHz and 1.3875v is still not on par with my Q9450 @ stock.... but I'm hoping I lose this bet... for competitions sake.
I like the choice of memory GSkill DDR2-1066 as it is low voltage, but if you are running Vista 64 please use the full capacity of the motherboard - 8GB. Why bother with x64 and only 4Gb??? you might as well have tested with Vista 32 bit. Reply
Locutus465 - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkBecause 4GB is plenty of memory for the system to do everything I've needed it to do (including work with 3GB text files) so far... Your comments about 4GB of memory being wasted on 64bit vista are incorrect, 32bit vista by default only allows 2GB memory per processe while 64b vista removes this limitation... When you do stuff like... Work with 3GB text files this becomes important. Reply
Dobs - Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - linkHey Locutus465,
I don't want to get into an argument with you about my post... if you are happy with 4Gb that is good for you. I'm somewhat surprised though considering you are working on '3Gb text files'...
What on earth is in these text files.... and what software are you using???
I occasionally work on text files max of 1.5Gb but usually smaller files up to 300Mb - often working on multiple files at once. These contain millions of peoples personal details - name, dob, addresses etc. and I usually use TextPad. Just curious to know what you use for the 3Gb files?
Cheers Reply
ZootyGray - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkWell said. And very exciting for me too. This is a wonderful surprise for a Monday Monday. I am just sitting here feeling WOW because I know Anandtech is not about hype - this is the facts, Jakk.
I simply knew something good was going to happen. I think this has huge implications in other areas as well. This might be the place where it all began - again. And it's kinda neat that it's almost an insider thing. I'm in.
I have already saved 4 pennies.
(love yer writing style Gary!) Reply
flipmode - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkVery intriguing results and there are still more to come.
Too bad I'm in the middle of remodeling my house - my time to upgrade is a ways off. Reply
just4U - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkI am curious how it stacks up against Quad offerings via Intel at those speeds. 3.3GHZ is impressive for a Phenom. Reply
acejj26 - Monday, July 21, 2008 - link"While are 100 MHz increase..." should be "While our 100 MHz increase..." Reply
CyberHawk - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkit is really interested, that not CPU alone is responsible for final overclock.
I'm getting one of these motherboards! Reply
Solberg - Friday, July 25, 2008 - linkOnly if you are certain that you only want to run Windows on it. It seems that Foxconn is less than friendly with anybody who wants to decide OS for themselves:
Hence I recommend acquiring the chipset (which indeed looks very promising) from another vendor. Reply
DJMiggy - Monday, July 21, 2008 - linkIt puts the lotion on its skin. Reply
hansmuff - Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - linkIt puts the lotion on its skin or it will not overclock. Reply


text:
NVIDIA's Ion Platform: Bringing High Def to Netbooksby Anand Lal Shimpi on 12/17/2008 9:00 AM EST
- Posted in
- GPUs
61 Comments
Back to Article
MAsterCATZ - Thursday, June 11, 2009 - linkIf only it had an Fibre Optic for sound
I would be all over it :S
Even COAX ... I never was to keen on running a cable per speaker to the Decoder
Add Raid Function and would be nice Torrent / Media Centre
I wounder if the GPU can Turn off whilst no in use ?
Any one know whats its power save features are like
( Drools over possible new WIN 7 Media Pc .. ) Reply
MAsterCATZ - Thursday, June 11, 2009 - linkOoops
How did I miss those Connectors :P
ok Now that Box is looking Mighty fine
and will order regardlss of price
( if it has blue tooth and wireless intergrated :P )
but I guess i can USB Dongle them in
( any Idea if those sata ports support Raid ? ) Reply
chamcham - Sunday, December 28, 2008 - linkResolution is one area where netbooks can stand to improve. The abysmal 1024x600 is often too small to fully read menu dialogs,
with the buttons below the screen and unreachable.
In fact, I'd argue that higher resolution is more important to netbooks than gaming performance. Finally, maybe we can have 1280x1024 on an 8.9" screen Reply
OBLAMA2009 - Sunday, December 21, 2008 - linksounds cool but wait til the product actually comes out. it will be so buggy that it will be too annoying to use Reply
Fanfoot - Friday, December 19, 2008 - linkVery interesting. I'll take Nvidia's claims about battery performance (which is CRITICAL in a netbook) with a grain of salt until somebody actually rolls one of these suckers out in a netbook, but seems very encouraging.
Like other I think this would be a very nice HTPC solution. I don't need a DVR, thanks, I've already got one of those, I just need a media tank that can double as a Hulu/ABC.com/CBS.com media player. So a little quiet low power box with HD playback capabilities, support for a SATA 2.5" drive, and an HDMI port would do the job. Pair it up with a USB driven wireless keyboard/mouse and you've got a great solution! Reply
ianken - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - link...with a 9400 and an atom CPU.
Also, I have gotten an Eee PC to do 1080i decode and rendering in Media Center on Windows 7 with the 945G. You just need the right drivers, because 945G does support rudimentary MPEG2 decode acceleration. It berly does it, but it does work. Reply
ty1er - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - linkomg, I have been holding out on building a HTPC. The good alway seems to out weight the bad. The cost is one thing, and having a big htpc under my tv is another. I just can't let go of my xbox running xbmc, i love it. But a version of this small powerful device will probably make its way into my living room to replace my xbox. Woot, very exciting! Reply
realneil - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - linkIntel needs a poke every now and then to keep them focused. The business that they're in thrives on innovation and if others are using their parts to come up with something better than they have, they'll take notice and get leaner and meaner. Considering their resources, they should be doing all of this innovating and not trying to (maybe) control the pace of new ideas.
NVIDEA's little gadget looks like a winner,...I wish I had one to play around with, no matter how it looks. Reply
DukeNukemCZ - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - linkOBR from PCtuning.cz
its review before NDA, it was hide again but i have save it.
Review for download (several html files in RAR):
ITS in Czech launguage so use translator or something Reply
Visual - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - link"NVIDIA claims that a netbook running with the Ion platform should have the same battery life as one running on the conventional Atom + 945G setup."
This is actually disappointing. The intel chipset is power-hungry and my netbook gets too warm very fast. I applaud the nVidia engineers for managing to fit all the extra performance into the same power envelope, but it would've been much better if it could work with less power when not using features like video encoder/decored and 3d graphics beyond aero level. Reply
swizeus - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - linkIt's fine with me, i'll buy that so called ugly ones if they were to sell it.
Anyway, the nVidia slide stating that 9400M have more processing power while drawing up same power it's a lie. ASUS netbook review which equipped with 2 video cards (GMA X4500 n 9300M) states that with GMA, battery can last up to 5 hours, while with 9300M only last for 1 hour Reply
Pok3R - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - linkGreat news Anand!
I have 3 questions (2 and a suggestion ;)
1) We would like to see some comparison benchmarks vs 945!
2) I'm not totally convinced how ddr3 fits here...power saving?
3) What about Atoms 230 and 330?
Does Ion include a "high end" version with them?
thanks and great job! Reply
philosofool - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkPeople pretend like predicting what's going to happen at the various mac extravaganzas is hard. It hasn't been at all since the Intel switch. If you watch what intel has rolling out, you can pretty much predict it.
This year we will see two major hardware announcements (possibly more): "the fastest Mac ever" which will be a Core i7 based machine. And we'll see a new Mac Mini based on the piece of hardware seen here (though with an internal HD.) Reply
iwodo - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI have always been saying Dual Core Atom ( N330 or even faster version ) with be used in the next Mac Mini, Since Hyperthreading gives it 4 thread which should give it some performance boost with Grand Central in Snow Leopard.
If Geforce 9400M could have some improvement with 55nm die shrink i suppose would be even better.
These pair with 30GB SSD, the new Mac should be very fast in 90% of day to day desktop application. Reply
BlueBlazer - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI would like to see a faster Atom, maybe in the 2.5GHz range? Would make that quite fast for gaming as well.. Should be around 6W or so at that frequency. Reply
sprockkets - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkJust 5 minutes ago I bought the mini-ITX Zotac nForce 7100 board + 2ghz Pentium processor for like $100, then this comes out.
I'm very surprised at this. The only thing VIA here is the pico-ITX form factor. I would have liked a Nano processor instead, but I can settle for a dual core Atom. Reply
gochichi - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI like the "ugly" design. It's so basic, and so crammed with high quality inputs/outputs. USB, HDMI, 2 x eSATA, it's flippin awesome.
The article says that it includes a 2.5" hard drive inside. So you're good to go there.
No optical drive is no problem at all. It's ironic that they kept comparing it to the Mac Mini with all the pictures, because it makes the most sense IN a Mac Mini.
I think that SSDs will be under $50.00 soon, just like we had a taste of that from OSZ the last few weeks. 30GBs and even 60GB middle-high performane SSDs should be inexpensive enough for these machines. 30GB should be enough to set up something using with these things. An external, self-powered 2.5" 500GB hard drive would go well as a tag along.
I'm pretty sure that USB 2.0 is enough for HD video, particularly processed stuff (as opposed to Blu-ray) but even Blu-ray drives come in external enclosures with USB connections.
I personally own a Blu-ray player and it sincerely seems like overkill at 25GB-50GB per movie. Mkv HD movie files between 4GB and 12GB are plenty for 720P HDTVs. Frankly, I see nothing wrong with 720P movies at 4GB a pop so long as the encoding goes well. But for arguments sake let's give 12 GB per movie and 1080P. That's roughly 40 movies in a 500GB 2.5" hard drive. And since they cost about $110.00, that's $2.75 per movie of media space (not great but doable).
I don't even primarily care about the media stuff though, it's just a really cool toy/tool. I wish it were somewhat less remedial of a CPU though, like a dual-core something. Reply
pslow - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkHowever, its needs firewire or esata since all storage will be external if it stays that small. Yes I'm a mac guy, but try to play 720HD video over usb, it drops frames. I wouldn't get one if it only has a usb 2.0 connection. Reply
MadMan007 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkYou'd want storage for an OS anyway. Plus there's networking... Reply
rmlarsen - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI just bought an Atom based netbook (Lenovo S10) for a family member for Christmas, and was pretty happy with the performance for simple tasks (watching SD video is certainly also doable). But with a chipset like this, the netbook world becomes A LOT more interesting, as you add decent gaming (hold back the Crysis jokes, people) and HD playback to the mix. Sign me up.
Does anybody know how fast (if at all) the CUDA-based Badaboom video transcoder would run on the 9400M, compared to transcoding on the Atom itself? Anandtech, any chance you could try this?
Rasmus Reply
tonjohn - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI would buy one right now if it were out.
I was looking at buying an Eee Box (http://usa.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=24&l2=165...">http://usa.asus.com/products.aspx?l1=24&l2=165... but this looks like a much better solution. Reply
autoboy - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkWe all knew this was possible. Why is everyone so surprised? The Asus EEE box has an ATI 3450 but nobody wet their pants over it. Asus has a netbook with the 9300M chipset but it is not selling that well. The 9400M is a great chipset, but it is simply filling a void that Intel left open by not allowing their G45 chipset to be used with the Atom.
Nobody is going to be playing many games on this thing. Maybe WoW but that is about it. The Atom is pretty slow guys. I have one. It works, but it isn't very fast. You definitely can tell that you are using a slow machine.
And why is everyone so excited about using this as a front end for a media center? VMC does not have softsled so you can't use it as an extender. MythTV can't play Blu-ray videos. I suppose you could rip them. Myth just now got some video acceleration. Boxee and XBMC don't use video acceleration at all so you lose the advantage of the 9400M. That leaves a few niche DVR applications and SageTV (which you can argue is also niche) where this thing would be useful as a HTPC client. A sageTV extender or popcorn hour are much more useful IMO than this.
As a low power desktop replacement it just doesn't do it for me. I would never consider using an Atom as a main machine, and it has been proven that a cheap Pentium Dual core and a G31 chipset are actually just as low power and 4-5 times faster than an Atom. Adding a 9400M won't change that. If all you want is a torrent box you can get routers that do that for you.
Ok, so the picture of it playing Dark Knight is cool. But I'm not going to dirty my pants over it.
MadMan007 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI think it's because people like the direction things are going even if the details aren't worked out yet. I'd to see this in the future with a dual core Atom and could see using that as a low power tiny basic desktop. The software/hardware chicken and egg is always going to be there, someone just has to blink first and in this case NV has blinked and created reference hardware. Reply
mm2587 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI think that little black box looks just perfect. Not fancy at all, but incredibly functional. These would make the perfect carputer. Reply
sidewinderx2 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkThe Asus N10J netbook already pairs an Atom with a 9300M GS. Reply
Roland00Address - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkThe ASUS uses the Discrete version of the 9300m. (Nvidia has both a 9300 integrated chipset as well as a discrete chip in the GS variant and the G variant.) The discrete mobile is different from the integrated mobile which is different from the desktop version
The 9300M GS is a 16-shader chip
256MB of DDR2 memory at effective 800MHz
GPU core running at 580MHz
shaders clocked at 1.4GHz
The 9300 integrated variant is using 16 shader chip
GPU core running at 450MHZ
Shaders clocked at 1.2GHZ
The 9400 integrated variant is using 16 shader chip
GPU core running at 580Mhz
Shaders clocked at 1.4 GHZ
But it is using the faster DDR3 ram, how much memory it is paired up (steals from the rest of ram) with is dependent on the OEM.
That said the netbook you refer to is using the single core n270
n270 2.5w TDP 1.6 GHZ, 1/2 MB Cache, 533 FSB (C States aka its different idling modes C0, C1, C2, C3, C4)
n230 4w TDP 1.6 GHZ, 1/2 MB Cache, 533 FSB (C States C0, C1) Pretty much the same chip but does idle as well as has a higher TDP
n330 8w TDP 1.6 GHZ, 1 MB Cache, 533 FSB (C States C0, C1) Same thing as the N230 but there is two chips on the same die.
Now to put this in comparison the new Core 2 Duo P series has a TDP of 25w. The n330 won't get as good as battery life as the n270 or the n230 but cost wise the n330 is very similar to the n270, this is a few months out of date but according to the article the n330 is $43 dollars per chip for a 1000 chip tray vs $44 dollars for the n270 for a 1000 chip tray
Eventually intel will also release a dual core netbook version and they are currently working on moving the atom to the new 32nm process Reply
uibo - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkDDR3 SO-DIMM ??? is the performance advantage for IGP-s really that big? Reply
praeses - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkYou can either think of it as a performance benefit or power savings.
In either case its a benefit. For single channel configurations, I think its pretty much a given that they would have to go with DDR3 at a decent clockrate to avoid bottlenecking the IGP significantly. Reply
MadMan007 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkThat's an impressive little basis for an integrated box. If it were cheap enough I'd pick one up just to have a tiny low power web browsing box and wouldn't even turn on my main PC half the time.
Things it needs though: 1) more than one internal SATA connection, HD+optical at a minimum needs two. No USB for optical please. That kind of dashes the hopes of some that have posted here except it does have eSATA ports...are they functional? 2) Although Atom is 'sufficient' I'd like to see a true (not HT) dual core variant. VIA Nano would be nice atm, or just wait until it's available with a dual core Atom. Reply
UNHchabo - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkThis was a reference design, made to get the creative juices flowing at Asus, Dell, HP, etc. They could put more SATA ports, component instead of or in addition to HDMI, etc. Reply
MadMan007 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkReply to both above: yes, I'm sure the OEMs would come up with a HDD+optical solution. This just would have been a no-go if it only had one SATA overall. Hopefully DIY solutions would have two internal SATA ports, however they're implemented (main motherboard or picoITX board.) Reply
strikeback03 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI'd imagine that all the eSATA, additional USB, sound, etc is provided by additional chips on that larger board. Reply
Thorburn - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI don't believe Netbooks tend to use Poulsbo. This is the chipset used for MID devices (and the Dell Mini 12 I believe), and I think it supports some H.264 decoding (baseline 720p?). It is paired up with Silverthorne Atom CPUs (Z-series) which I don't think support GTL+ front-side bus due to its higher power requirements.
Most Netbooks use the Diamondville Atom CPUs (N-series), which have a slightly higher TDP, support GTL+ and are paired with the older, higher power, 945GC chipset. Reply
R3MF - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkfinally the netbook becomes a useful computing device with the addition of CUDA/OpenCL.
i say this as the owner of a Lenovo S10e. Reply
djc208 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkThis could be the device that finally makes me consider building a carPC.
And while the Sage HD extender and Popcorn hour are great for video playback, the added functionality of a full PC in this form factor could make it a winner for HD capable HTPC client machines. Reply
strikeback03 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkWill this be cheaper than using the Poulsbo chipset? As none of the netbooks seem to be willing to offer Poulsbo for an increased cost, will the 9400M be cheap enough to get some business?
Looks great for a carputer though. Reply
superunknown98 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkHow I would have like a NANO in this. Seeing as how even with a Nvidia mobile 9600 the Atom can't play half-life 2. Just look at the Asus N10Jc-A1 netbook. So again what happened to the platform Nvidia said they were designing for the Nano? Did Via just get played? Reply
UNHchabo - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkKeep in mind that HL2 (and Source engine games in general) are pretty CPU-intensive, with much less emphasis on the GPU than other engines, like those made by Ubisoft, id, and others.
I'm pretty sure one of these two articles investigates that, but I can't check at the moment...
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2281">http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2281 Reply
SkullOne - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkWow...very very nice. I say increase the size just a little bit, add a slim BluRay player and kick the MacMini between the eyes!!! Reply
crimson117 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI bet this will drive the next Mac Mini revision. Reply
mmntech - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkIt's too bad it won't have Blu-ray though should the Mac Mini ever get revised. Most likely it will end up as the CPU/GPU combo for Apple's much rumoured netbook. Reply
Hrel - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkAnadtech, can you please do an in depth article on how Nvidia was able to put a GPU and a Northbridge controller and a Southbridge controller all in one chip PLEASE! I would just really love for someone to dive in and dissect the way this chip works the same way you have for G80, G92 and G94; and Larrabee even though it's not out yet. Those are probably the most interesting articles on this site. PLEASE do one on the 9400M! Reply
degeester - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkPlease see this article. Reply
degeester - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkWhoops, links aren't working but see under @ Anandtech motherboards, The IGP Chronicles Part 3: Nvidia GeForce 9300 Reply
ViRGE - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - link"If you tossed a 500GB 2.5" HDD in one of these things, you could carry your HTPC with you."
Is a 2.5" HDD fast enough for DVR functionality though? There are really two HTPC models as I see it: the DVR model ala Windows Media Center/MythTV where you have a DVR for television that also does a good job playing back recorded media; or the network media tank model ala the Popcorn Hour where it can only play back recorded media. The DVR model means you need space for a TV tuner, and even then the cable industry seems to be doing its best to kill anything that isn't one of their set-top boxes.
That leaves the network media tank model. If it can only play back things and you're going to run it from a network source, then Ion seems entirely too overbuilt for this purpose. A Popcorn Hour is cheaper and smaller yet, not to mention you don't have to dink with an OS. It has a bit less flexibility than a true computer like the Ion, but it's not as if there are any new codecs on the horizon that the Ion can decode anyhow.
This strikes me as something similar to a MID; it's too big to be a network media tank, and it's too small to be a full HTPC. Reply
FITCamaro - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkThey make 7200 rpm 2.5" HDDs. And I'm not really sure how fast the hard drives in DVRs are. They might be 5400 rpm. Reply
crimson117 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkThis would be fast enough:
Seagate Momentus 7200.3 320GB 16MB SATA 7200 RPM ST9320421AS
But your other points are valid.
Still, this could make one heck of a portable media center if you put it into a laptop. Reply
strafejumper - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkwhen i saw the pic of the little box it reminded me of popcorn hour and the Network Media Tanks, here is a pic of one that looks similar to the nvidia box (no internal hdd on this one i don't think):
New players using the sigma chipset found in blu-ray disc players (sigma 8635) come out every week, here is one from Western Digital that sometimes hits the $99.99 US price point (the WD box has no network capabilities):
these player play all kinds of formats, and can do up to 1080P HD video. Reply
HollyDOL - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkAs long as these devices don't sound like a swarm of spatting bees it could be interesting HTPC.
The other thing I would be curious about is the quality of sound (MP3, CDDA etc.). If it is supposed to plug in your home theatre system ( != $10 pc speakers) I would expect at least Audigy2 sound quality. Though so far integrated mobo soundcards all sound to me pretty badly (especially if you can compare the same sample just next to it with some sound card). Reply
glennpratt - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkThe DACs will probably be up to the individual solution, but I'm sure that with decent DAC's and any line inputs muted, it will be more then adequate for analog music play back. For me, it supports 7.1 LPCM over HDMI, that's all I need to hear, can't get better then that. Reply
plonk420 - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkif you need your DAC outside of an A/V amp solution, you can choose one of these: http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/all-dacs-money-c...">http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/all-dacs-money-c... Reply
fishbits - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - link"NVIDIA claims that a netbook running with the Ion platform should have the same battery life as one running on the conventional Atom + 945G setup."
Gimme! Seriously hope they can have some units with this for sale in the next three months, but doubt I'll get that lucky. Make the RAM 2GB while you're at it. Yum! Reply
therealnickdanger - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkBut I just got the biggest e-rection ever. Nerdgasm alert! OK, so when can I buy one? Reply
teohhanhui - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - linkIt definitely is cool. Wonder if they will actually make such machines... Reply
gwolfman - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkWith CUDA support as well to top that off. I'm liking this idea already! Reply
murphyslabrat - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkLol, I saw the picture of the mobo, and read "NVidia Ion", and I liked it then....Though, I was expecting something with Via.
I am hating the Atom, though. There's currently a netbook out, from Asus, with a GeForce 9300, and it performs miserably in games. Reply
Murloc - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkI can play gta san andreas on a pentium m 1,1ghz processor with integrated 3 years old intel graphics.
This thing is cool, you can play games on your TV.
For extreme gaming use the desktop.
CurseTheSky - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkNetbooks aren't meant to game on. They're meant to be small, light, and have great battery life. Similarly, you wouldn't bring a Prius to the drag strip and expect a 12 second run.
Even the 14.1" ASUS with a P8600 and 9650M GT that I'm typing on is barely satisfactory for newer games. If you want to game, shell out the $1300+ for a "gaming" laptop, or build a desktop. Reply
SirKronan - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - linkSpeaking of the Prius ... I have one that has a nice integrated LCD screen just begging for a car PC to be installed. I can't wait until these come out. I will integrate wi-fi, bluetooth, a PC based GPS unit, and a USB port right by my other dashboard buttons. Screw the bug, I'm going to make a REAL geekmobile.
This is AMAZING. Imagine your HTPC build into your TV. Reply
Jedi2155 - Thursday, December 18, 2008 - linkWell...its a Mac integration...but a comptuer nonetheless. So it is possible but you just gotta do a lot of your own work :).
http://www.kusnetz.net/prius/">http://www.kusnetz.net/prius/ Reply
afkrotch - Wednesday, December 17, 2008 - linkHell ya, I did too. I so want the one that's pictured here. I'd find a spot of dead space in my TV and mount it inside. Reply


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2 unaltered dogs found running loose with tight fitted muzzles onThis is a place to gain some understanding of dog behavior and to assist people in training their dogs and dealing with common behavior problems, regardless of the method(s) used. This can cover the spectrum from non-aversive to traditional methods of dog training. There are many ways to train a dog. Please avoid aggressive responses, and counter ideas and opinions with which you don't agree with friendly and helpful advice. Please refrain from submitting posts that promote off-topic discussions. Keep in mind that you may be receiving advice from other dog owners and lovers... not professionals. If you have a major problem, always seek the advice of a trainer or behaviorist!
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Kaspersky Security for Virtualization is an agentless anti-malware solution that provides a more efficient way to protect your virtualised infrastructure – with greater performance and less impact on virtualisation density. The application is easy to deploy and includes advanced management features that simplify a wide range of security tasks – across both physical and virtual computing assets.
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Thanks for this ! I've just started again after a 20 year break and my hands are a mess ! And yes - it does seem to be worse with the porcelain.
Next question - where on earth do I get Bag Balm in Australia ?!
*Off to search the internet*
Are there any Walgreen's there? I get Bag Balm at Walgreens in the lotion department.


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List of best Rheumatologist Doctors from trusted hospitals in South City 2, Gurgaon. Get detailed info on educational qualification, experience and other credentials of Rheumatologist Doctors in South City 2, Gurgaon. Check OPD schedule and book appointment online with best Rheumatologist from top hospitals in South City 2, Gurgaon. Call 8010- 994- 994 to talk to in-house Credihealth experts for FREE medical assistance to choose the right Rheumatologist, get options for Second Opinion or other other medical assistance.
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Capsule Review: Corsair's Vengeance M60 and M90 Miceby Dustin Sklavos on 2/22/2012 2:45 PM EST
- Posted in
- Peripherals
- Corsair
- Mouse
- Input Devices
40 Comments
Back to Article
stimpack99 - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - link... are currently poorly designed by most manufacturers, even logitechs new ambidextrous mouse sucks. The button placement is all wrong.
I swear the people designing these things aren't gamers. I'd really like a good dpad on the side of the mouse below the "web browser" forward/backward buttons. Either that or scrap the browser buttons entirely and put good quality gamepad like buttons on it oriented like you would have on a gamepad. It drives me insane that so-called gaming mice are just marketing labels for crappy mice. Reply
cigar3tte - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkI can't understand why all the mice have the thumb buttons laid out horizontally. Vertical buttons seems so much easier to hit both. Reply
moriz - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkthe idea with the horizontal placement is that you place your thumb over both, and rock back and forth on the second joint to press the buttons. this is way faster than repositioning your entire thumb up and down. Reply
Omega215D - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkThe MS Sidewinder line of mice had the vertical thumb button placement (save the X3 which has one on each side as it's ambi). They were pretty unique and the buttons functioned well. Their designs were ok but I would rather have the Logitech MX518/ G400 or CM Storm Spawn/ Xornet style bodies.
MS should make a new Sidewinder mouse that's like the IME with 2 vertical thumb buttons or 3 horizontal thumb buttons (like Logitech's G500 as I'm always in need of a 3rd thumb button). Reply
realjetavenger - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI agree that verticle placement of the thumb buttons makes more sense. But on the sidewinder mice I found the bottom thumb button placed too low. I always had a problem hitting that button since my thumb would be hitting the desktop moreso than the button itself and it just wasn't comfortable, for me. But this is another great example of how personal the feel of any mouse is. Again, love the idea of verticle placement, but in this case it just didn't fit my hand very well. Reply
mclazer - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkYou are a perfect example to highlight the truth of the first paragraph of the article.
Sounds like you are not satisfied with the feel/button placement of any gaming mice and are attributing it to cheapness/marketing labels.
I can empathize however. Since you never know if you will like a mouse until you have it in your hands it almost forces you to buy a whole crap ton of mice to get the one you want. I'm pretty picky also and went through almost 20 mice until I found the Roccat Kova+.. thats the one for me :D Reply
sking.tech - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkExactly! My God, have I gone through a crap-ton of mice!!! I still haven't found one that feels like the perfect fit. I wanted to love the cyborg mice as they look fantastic but, so far they leave a lot to be desired, same for razer, same for most logitech's - I'm using the m705 marathon currently - not a great gaming mouse but, not too bad - but, it's pretty comfortable as far as grip and long use time.
The M60 here looks pretty good, hoping to get my hands on one soon! Reply
Sabresiberian - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkOne of the "problems" with mice with a lot of buttons is that you have to be willing to figure out how to use them for your app(s) and then spend time adapting to the mouse. No matter how well the buttons are placed (and some of them aren't placed well at all on every one I've seen) you are just going to have to learn how to use it right - especially for gaming when you have to do things fast without thinking about it.
It's pretty much like learning how to type again - well, simpler than that, but that kind of thing. Before you buy one you should consider whether or not you have the aptitude to go through all that. I think it's worth it in the end, but it isn't an instant-gratification thing.
;) Reply
ckryan - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkThe Logitech MX1100 is more my speed, which is unfortunate, since they've not made that mouse for some time. Reply
Impulses - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkSame here, I'm hoping mine holds up for a few more years since I haven't found a siecle wireless replacement. I was intrigued by the R.A.T. for a while but kept hearing about too many QC issues. Reply
Impulses - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkSuitable replacement... Damn swype. ;) Reply
Th-z - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkSimilar with discontinued MX Revolution. To me its mouse wheel is the best for quickly scrolling long document/web page. They have made mice with hyper scrolling since, but they all require a switch, not the auto-shifting MX Revolution uses. What a shame. Reply
ckryan - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkI find that I leave hyperscrolling on all the time. The situations where I don't want to use it are quite rare. Reply
bji - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkKeyboards are just as much a matter of preference as are mice. There is no inherent superiority to mechanical switches when compared to other types of keyboards, it is entirely a matter of preference. Reply
mclazer - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkI've never heard of anyone who prefers the membrane over mechanical keys... I'm sure they exist but I think the majority of gamers/heavy keyboard users prefer mechanical.
Either way, you can look at a keyboard's feature list and get a pretty accurate gauge on whether you would like that keyboard or not. Whether it has mechanical keys, ergonomical, wrist rests, lighted keys, macro buttons for gamers, whatever. If it has the stats you want, your probably going to like it.
With a mouse it's a lot more subjective. On paper two mice could be exactly the same down to the sensor, but you don't know which one feels "right" until you use it. Reply
kyuu - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkTotally agree. Many people (myself included) don't like the long-travel, noise, and overly "clicky" feel of mechanical switches. I much prefer my Logitech keyboard with rubber-dome switches.
Just because you prefer them does not make them objectively better, Mr. Sklavos. Reply
exploderator - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkScroll wheel : does it free wheel or does it ratchet?
I have looked high and low, and yet have never found an answer to this critical question. Corsair hints about it being heavy, but still fails to say whether it can/does free-wheel.
This particular issue is a show stopper for me, and is the one reason why I can only use Logitech mice so far (eyeballing the G700 as a step up from my MX Revolution, more buttons is good). I cannot grind a ratchet all day with my middle finger when zooming in and out in CAD software. My seriously worn out MX (several years later) has saved me from suffering a repetitive stress injury that was just starting to happen when I bought it (one of the best $100 I have ever spent on computer hardware BTW).
I suppose I could probably butcher the ratchet mechanism out of one of these mice, depending on how it's implemented (ie not buried inside a tiny sealed rotary encoder), but it's a $70 gamble I would rather not take. And I admit that it's nice to be able to put my MX in clickety mode when playing FPS where it does your weapon selection, free wheel is a tad wild and unpredictable for that. To lose both the wireless and freewheel... that would be a $70 paper weight in my books. With bad drivers. Reply
Revdarian - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkFrom experience, most new scroll wheels feel extremely hard and do cause discomfort. But after 1-2 months of regular use they become pretty normal. It also annoys me that it is that way but at least now i try to artificially wear it down until it becomes soft enough to be comfortable. Reply
exploderator - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkUnfortunately, no amount of wear-down can compensate for my requirement of a fully free-wheeling scroll wheel.
The gesture is this: you give the wheel ONE very light flick in the intended direction, leaving your middle finger OFF the wheel, and touching back down to stop the free spin when the desired travel has been achieved. ONE FLICK vs. grind grind grind... it's a make or break difference. It's also the kind of gesture that is almost immediately fully automatic and intuitive, there is almost no learning curve, and it works immaculately well. It's one of those perfect natural solutions that our brains already understand. Expensive analog radio tuner dials used the same principle (albeit in a much less critical application). Good track balls do the same. There is no substitute. Reply
Death666Angel - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkThis doesn't make a lot of sense for gaming mice, considering that we gamers need distinct mouse wheel levels for weapon selection and the like.
What you describe sounds like what the click middle mouse button/mouse wheel is for. Click it once to get a stead scrolling going, click it again to halt that scrolling. Reply
Stuka87 - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkMany productivity mice (I have an MK710 on my work machine, the keyboard sucks, but the mouse is decent) has a button that allows you to select clicky feel, or free spin. The free spin is very handy for scrolling down large pages. But I prefer the ratchet many times as well.
For gaming though (which these are designed for) it has to be able to have distinct movement for selecting weapons/items.. Reply
madgabz - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkGet a Apple Mighty Mouse!!!! The new one with 'touchpad' instead of scroll wheel! U can do amazing scrolls both horizontally and vertically! - with a flick! Personally, its too sensitive as in too fast, but it sounds a lot more like what you want. Now, back to this threads origin: Gaming mice! Reply
LeftSide - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkI used to have a MX Revolution and loved it. After it finally died (it lasted forever) I had to replace it. I went with the G500. It has a button that alowes you to switch between ratchet and freewheel. It also has 2 buttons to let you switch DPI on the fly. I use photoshop and have found that swiching DPI for the more refined movements increase productivity.
I didn't realize how much lag the MX Revolution actually had until I bought the g500. It makes such a huge difference to have a wired mouse. I have started playing FPS games again (and doing well I might add).
I do miss the extra rocker thumb button, but everything else makes up for it. Reply
exploderator - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkG700, looks like the answer. Reply
Coup27 - Friday, February 24, 2012 - linkI'm the same. I had and loved a Logitech G9 which showed signs of dying so I replaced it with a G9X. I have an MX Revolution at work and I'm thinking about getting another G9X because the lag is just doing me in. Reply
realjetavenger - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkOn the M60 it is only ratchet. Don't know about the M90 but would suspect it's the same. Reply
exploderator - Friday, February 24, 2012 - link
Thank you, I can move on now. Logitech G700 it is then. Too bad, all those buttons on the M90 were very sexy looking for CAD work. But no freewheel and no wireless adds up to no deal for me. Reply
Stuka87 - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkFinding a mouse that is just right can be so difficult. Especially if you don't live near a large computer store that has many on display.
I have large hands, with especially long fingers. Its very hard to find a mouse that will make contact with the palm of my hand, or even the upper palm/knuckle area. The fact that these are a bit larger, may mean they are worthwhile for me to try and test. Reply
Brakner - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI have the same issue as you so I settled on the SteelSeries Cataclysm MMO mouse. I really like the thumb button placement.
http://steelseries.com/products/games/world-of-war... Reply
Azethoth - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkAfter 4 years of searching across all the multi-button mice out there this is the first one that worked for my hand size. It is also adjustable and so covers a larger spread of hand sizes.
The extra buttons are actually accurately pressable without getting carpal thumb. Reply
Azethoth - Wednesday, February 22, 2012 - linkOh yeah, and full disclaimer: I use RAT 7 MMO mouse + Vengeance K90 keyboard. They are no longer for actual MMO use though, I use the extra buttons for programming. Reply
Watwatwat - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI find the best solution is logitechs g9/g9x with the auto profile switching sofware
The mouse only has a few buttons, but the software makes the most of it, you do have to associate each profile with the executable, but most nerds probably can handle that. The main thing for thumb buttons is reachability in games, it has to be right there, not a reach or it becomes useless for quick access. There are also more buttons than you expect once you find out you can bind the wheel tilt to whatever you like as well, some wheels don't have feedback on tilt or are loose, the g9 series have a subtle click so its still useful in games.
The r.a.t. looked interesting, but the main thing other mice lack is the speed scrolling wheel of the logitech...hard to go back to other mice once spoiled. I have several wireless but yes like the revolution they aren't as smooth, the performance mx is the best of the lot but its clearly not for gaming, the thumb buttons are a big reach away as they jut out over your thumb... Reply
Shinobi_III - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkOh look! It's an Logitech G9! Reply
realjetavenger - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - link"There's also the placement of the "Sniper" button. On the M60, for my hands and the way I grip the mouse, it's just too far up the left side. The button needed to be lower to be under where my thumb usually rests."
Totally agree. Have been using the M60 or a few weeks now. Generally really like the performance of the mouse and the size fits my hand well. But find that the placement of the sniper button is just a litle too far forward. And as stated in the article it should be placed to fall under the thumb instead of having to move your thumb forward to use it. For me to hit it correctly, I have to cock my hand sideways a little to get my thumb forward enough to hold the button. This is self defeating as it now makes it more difficult to be precise with the mouse movement which is the whole point of the sniper button in the first place. Reply
Whiskey Mike - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI use, and am happy with, a Razer Naga (Molten). Lots of buttons (16 at quick count) some well placed, some not so much. I only use the ones that feel natural / are well-positioned. If macroing, you could use more. Decent software for mapping the mouse keys. I use it with a couple of different MMO's/games. I also use the Razer eXactMat, which is metal, two sided (control/speed), helps a lot. Downside is I have to clean the sensor window once a day, a blow off. I would buy it again were this one to fail.
Keyboard used is the Zboard Merc Stealth now sold by Steelseries. KB feel is okay, used it daily for maybe 4 (?) years now. The main attractions are the backlit keys (variable intensity and 3 colors) and the dedicated gaming-oriented integrated pad located to the left of the main keyboard which adds roughly 30 keys, very nicely arranged so that the left hand can easily span all of the keys; natural, quick, well placed for me. All are programmable, and are amenable to function shifts. I like this keyboard. I use two, and have bought a spare. KB downside is it is big, really big. Another downside is the right keypad area is poorly laid out. Reply
Sulik2 - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI rest my thumb at the bottom of the mouse on the left and I have never found a mouse puts the buttons at the bottom. I always have to raise my thumb which never feels natural. Are there any gaming mice that put the thumb buttons at the bottom of the left side of the mouse? Reply
kevith - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI think grip-wise you can divide mice in two categories. Palm-grip mice, designed for resting your whole hand on the mouse, and claw-grip mice, where you rotate the mouse inside your palm with only the fingertips resting on the surface of the mouse.
Mobile mice almost always fall in the latter category, given the need for small size. That´s my preference in mice, since my hands are wide with short fingers.
Would it be possible to divide reviewed mice into one of these categories from the start?
As a lot of the comments here, quite truly, state, that it´s almost impossible to know if a mouse is the right one for you, without actually holding it in your hand. But a division of particular mice like that might give a slightly better hint. Reply
jadawgis732 - Thursday, February 23, 2012 - linkI'm surprised to see this statement on Anandtech: "For basic browsing and productivity tasks, there's still really no substitute for a wired mouse." I thought it was proven not to make a discernible difference. I always defer to AT's general knowledge of all things tech, but in this case I think you may be disseminating false information. Reply
Sufo - Sunday, February 26, 2012 - linkI was a longtime g5 user - imo it was the pinnacle of understated yet powerful gaming mice. Sadly it started to die on me and it's basically impossible to replace them these days. The g500 was not an option as I don't want a free wheel, or a wheel capable of free wheeling (the click, when enabled, is not nice).
I thought nothing would be able to replace my g5 but in the end i settled on the m60 and I must say it's great. Build quality is excellent. The pads are even smoother than my g5, and the weight of the mouse (at its maximum) is adequate. m1/2 press is lighter than the g5, but crisp and distinct (maybe not appropriate for those that rest heavily on the mouse). The wheel click is muted but solid. I was unsure of it at first but i've come to enjoy it. I do not use the sniper button - as mentioned in this article it's poorly placed, and its benefits aren't all that useful to me at this stage anyway (if i could reassign it i might use it, but sadly this is impossible). the thumb buttons are ok - a bit springy tho, and they could have taken a leaf out of logitech's book in terms of positioning. I find it to be the right size, and the fact that the back falls away a bit results in plenty of room for me to pivot from the table.
Overall I'm happy with my purchase. Reply
Vril - Sunday, March 11, 2012 - linkthe problem with these is that they use a 2009 laser: Avago ADNS 9500
it`s like using an older engine on a new car... Reply


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The library of Kunsthaus Zürich has no large stock of old or bibliophile books and other prints. Normally the library does not purchase rare editions, collectibles or other valuable works.
Nevertheless, the library owns some libri rari. They are all individual pieces, which did not come into the library as part of an existing collection or by systematic collecting. In most cases, the titles, which now have become rare and valuable items and are counted among the libri rari, have once been acquired as normal inexpensive new books. Besides this there are gifts and as a rare exception also the purchase of a valuable title in connection with an exhibition at the museum.
Libri Rari can be used during the morning in the reading room of the library. Please register in advance and make an appointment:
Tel.: 0041-44-2538-531 oder 532


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UF hires new defensive assistant
Published: Sunday, January 20, 2013 at 4:59 p.m.
Last Modified: Sunday, January 20, 2013 at 4:59 p.m.
Numerous news outlets are reporting that South Carolina defensive line coach Brad Lawing has been hired by Florida coach Will Muschamp to fill the opening on the Gators' coaching staff.
Neither school would confirm the hiring late Sunday afternoon. An official announcement is expected to be made today.
Lawing is in his second stint at South Carolina, having joined Steve Spurrier's staff in 2006 and coached defensive line standouts Jadeveon Clowney and Melvin Ingram, among others. He also coached at USC from 1989-98 under Sparky Woods and Brad Scott.
In between, Lawing spent a combined seven seasons at Michigan State and North Carolina. He worked under Nick Saban at MSU.
Lawing likely will coach the defensive ends at UF, while Bryant Young will continue to coach the defensive tackles, as he has the past two seasons.
The opening on the staff was created last week when defensive coordinator Dan Quinn left to become the defensive coordinator for the Seattle Seahawks. On the same day, Muschamp promoted linebackers coach/special teams coordinator D.J. Durkin to defensive coordinator.
Lawing is considered a solid recruiter and has a reputation for developing young talent, including Clowney, one of the nation's most dominant players.
He'll have at least three promising young defensive ends to work with at UF — Ronald Powell and true sophomores Dante Fowler Jr. and Jonathan Bullard.
Reader comments posted to this article may be published in our print edition. All rights reserved. This copyrighted material may not be re-published without permission. Links are encouraged.


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|DIY diaper and baby project supplies by Babyville Boutique
|Newborn Pocket Diaper with Hook & Loop Closure
Babyville Boutique Monster PUL fabric
Once I read through the books, I got started on a few projects. My first project was making a newborn pocket diaper with hook & loop closure. I used the Babyville newborn cloth diaper pattern with this along with the Babyville newborn soaker pattern. For the inside of the diaper and soaker I cut up a flannel receiving blanket. Great way to use up those extra baby blankets you don't need!
I have only ever made cloth diapers with snaps so was interested to see how I liked working with the hook & loop. I was actually pleasantly surprised at how easy it was! I did have to trim the tabs down quite a bit to fit the tiny newborn diaper, but the end result was very nice. I do prefer snaps on my diapers as they hold up longer, but on newborn diapers hook & loop makes for a quicker diaper change which is great during those tiring nights with new baby! I can't wait to see my little man wearing this and have my fingers crossed it functions as good as it looks.
|Dual PUL OS Pocket Diaper using Babyville's Dino and yellow fabric,
yellow and green snaps, and dino diaper label.
Next I made 3 OS pocket diapers using my own pattern and an a variety of Babyville PUL fabrics, snaps, and diaper labels. My friend Jodi (my contributor) was having her baby shower last week, so I went to JoAnn's and bought one of the 3 packs of PUL diaper cuts for the occasion. I made a dual layer dinosaur diaper utilizing the dinosaur PUL scraps I had leftover from a previous project. This was pretty easy to do and really jazzed up the plain yellow PUL. I also added one of the cute dino diaper labels on the backside. It says, "Mr. Handsome". I lined the diaper with soft white minky and the end result was super cute! Now I have to make one for my little boy, because I want one too!
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with light turquoise snaps and lined in flannel.
The Turtles and Frogs PUL fabric is one of my favorites in the Babyville line. So adorable! I lined this diaper with white and green polk a dot flannel that I purchased at JoAnn's. It matches perfectly with the fabric too!
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|My little monkey wearing his monkey diaper!
Made with Babyville's Monkey PUL fabric and diaper label.
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Can be used for changing pad too!
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DxOMark review for APS-C camera 2010 : who takes the lead ?Monday January 24 2011 Sensor Recommendations
Sony alpha 580 vs Sony alpha 55 vs Canon EOS 60D vs Pentax K5 vs Nikon D7000: K5, D7000 and A580 come first
The five bodies selected for this review represent the latest developments in APS-C sensors. They all possess high-definition figures, with 16 megapixels packed on the sensor and even 18 for the EOS 60D. These cameras also have another point in common: they all display very wide ISO latitudes, ranging from ISO 100 to 12800, 25600, and even 51200 for the Pentax K5. On the spec sheets at least, these figures are impressive, and suggest avery good behavior in low-light environments, perhaps better than for some "ancient" full-frame bodies.
First we will analyze these cameras' DxO Use Case scores to see which tendencies they reveal. We will then dig deeper in our examination of the SNR and dynamic range metrics that are crucial to this study. And since these APS-C sensors are new, it is legitimate to ask how they compare with their predecessors… and with full-frame sensors.
a55: the audacious choice of a semi-transparent mirror
If the sensors all look roughly similar in their specifications, the Alpha 55 uses a radically different technology than the others bodies with its implementation of a semi-transparent mirror. The technology itself is not new: film cameras such as the Canon Pellix used this kind of mirror back in 1965.
The principle is simple: when light strikes the semi-transparent mirror, 70% manages to go through it, while the remaining 30% is deflected on the AF detection array. There are several advantages for the Alpha 55: the mirror does not move anymore, allowing much faster burst speeds (the Alpha 55 is actually the fastest one by far among the five cameras, reaching an impressive 10 fps); this technology also allows direct and constant live-view operation. While helpful for video operation, the bottom line for photography is that the amount of light hitting the sensor is reduced compared to a camera using a conventional mirror. This can pose problems, especially under low-light conditions, and it is probably the cause of a higher noise level. —This is, by the way, the main reason why the semi-transparent mirror bodies did not manage to seduce photographers in the past. Is it worth improving one function (the video) if it endangers another crucial one (the photography) ?
Further readings for the DxOMark review for APS-C camera 2010 : who takes the lead ?
To provide photographers with a broader perspective about mobiles, lenses and cameras, here are links to articles, reviews, and analyses of photographic equipment produced by DxOMark, renown websites, magazines or blogs.
We are already acquainted with the D3200: apart from a few ergonomic details, it's the same camera as the compact and lightweight D3100 SLR, though missing the secondary display on its bridge for even greater compactness. The D3200 weighs only 454 grams (without battery or card). Unlike the D3100, the D3200's lens is off-center for better balance and the highly practical LiveView/video mode activation tab of the D3100 and the D5100 has disappeared in favor of a more ergonomically mundane video recording button. The D3200 comes with a second (dorsal) infrared sensor to complement its front sensor for more practical infrared remote control. The motor selection tab (single-frame, burst, timer, remote control) is gone as well, again replaced by a direct-access button.
The Nikon D5100 replaces the D5000 in Nikon's lineup; it finds its place right below the Nikon D7000, according to Nikon's marketing the D90 is still positioned between the D5100 and the D7000, however the spec sheet and the performances of the D5100 make this hard to believe.
This is because the D5100 shares the same Sony 16 megapixels sensor as the D7000. The major difference between the two bodies being the AF: 11 points with 3D tracking for the D5100 (presumably the "old" MultiCam 1000 already used on the D90) versus the 39 points with 3D tracking now used on the D7000.
With the new data for the sony A580, DxOMark team provides an in depth benchmark of the latest APS-C sensors.


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Includes digital copy + 1 print. Each additional print is $3.99
October Twilight
Composed by Henry Hadley - Digital Sheet Music
Product InformationOctober Twilight composed by Henry Hadley - Digital Sheet Music
October Twilight digital sheet music. Contains printable sheet music plus an interactive, downloadable digital sheet music file.
- Contains complete lyrics
- This product is available worldwide
The Arrangement Details Tab gives you detailed information about this particular arrangement of October Twilight - not necessarily the song.
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Publishing administered by: Memory Lane Music


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Neurologic problem or what?
Discussion in 'Emergencies / Diseases / Injuries and Cures' started by beeball2, Apr 16, 2009.