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Apr 5, 2012 at 8:09 am #1288335
Im trying to decide what we should do for tents and could use some input from folks. I am working on getting us some light weight tents to use only for high adventure but I dont know if that is going to happen for this trek. So…
We had been planning to use the Philmnt tents because most places Ive read say that they weigh 5 to 5.5 pounds. Is this pretty accurate? The Philmont Surplus Gear Sale page lists them at 6.75 pounds but maybe that is the weight to ship them.
At 5.5 pounds, they are lighter than our Timberline 4 Troop tents (about 9 pounds) assuming 2 people in the Philmont tent versus 3 people in the TL4.
The other wrinkle is that we have an odd split of people. For the purpose of tenting we have 7 youth and 5 adults (one of the adults is an 18yo going as a youth).
So…it looks like I have two decent options:
* 3 youth in a TL4
* 4 youth (the four smallest) in a TL4
* 3 adults in a TL4
* 2 adults in a Philmont tent
This gives us 4 tents at about 32.5 pounds total for 2.5 or 3 pounds per person
* 3 Philmont tents with 2 youth each
* 2 Philmont tents with 2 adults each
* 1 Philmont tent with a youth and his dad
This gives us 6 tents at about 33 pounds total or 2.5 pounds per person
Is it worth the extra weight to have 2 fewer tents? Fewer tents means less space at the campsite but also a different distribution of gear.
The crew is all from the same home Troop so I dont think there will be any crew dynamics issues having one Scout share a tent with his dad instead of a buddy. We were thinking about it being the crew leader.
Thanks – the discussions and articles here at BPL have really helped in our preparation.Apr 5, 2012 at 11:53 am #1864021
Joshua GrayBPL Member
Just a quick post, but the PhilTents are about 7# (carried one for 1/2 summer as a ranger) and are poor tents. I really would suggest something like a BD Betamid/Megamid or similar (cheap, offer a good amount of space, light,…). These are great tents that would be good investments by the troop in general.
And I would really suggest not having someone tent with parent…I saw this many times and it was almost universally better to have all boys together an adults together. This allows better group cohesion, IMHO, but I understand that from a logistical standpoint may not be feasible.Apr 5, 2012 at 6:25 pm #1864181
Buy some floorless mid shelters. Buy them new if you have too and sell them when you are done.
$300 large 11×11 mid can hold 5 boys and weigh under 60 oz with a floor, pole adapter, and stakes. Works out to be 10-12 oz or less per kid, and $60 ea. Probably get $40+ of that back selling it.
Paying $20 ea to take 2+ lbs off the back is a deal. But more importantly, you take the volume out of the packs so everyone can use smaller lighter UL packs too. Put together that can save you 4-5 lbs with just two items.
If you dont get rid of the volume, you will have large conventional heavy packs. Conventional tents is not the way to go unless everything else, is already UL and you can tolerate the weight AND the volume
Unless of course you are planning on making the kids haul 40 lb packs. To each their own, but this is backpackingLIGHT.com.
Honestly, there is no reason for a pack to be over 30 lbs with minimal forethought and minimal expenditure. With a little effort and $$,it can be low 20's.
Sleeping bag – 2.5 lbs (plenty choices)
Pack 3.0 lbs (lenty choices)
sleeping pad .5 lb CCF
Tent .75 lb share
Big 4 = 6.75 lb
insulation 2 lbs
personal 1 lb max
sleep clothing .75 lb max
raingear .75 lb (driducks)
spare clothing 1 lb max
Subtotal – 12 lbs
crew gear – 3 lbs share
= 15 lbs before food/water
8 lbs food, 5 lbs water = 28 lbs.Apr 5, 2012 at 8:13 pm #1864230
@joshua – Seven pounds…ouch.
@m B – I cannot argue with your logic but there are a couple of things it doesnt take into account:
* The guys already have conventional gear including packs, bags and pads. We dont do enough backpacking for (most of) them to justify replacing gear simply to lighten up. The trip is already a $1400 bill so new gear is really a stretch for most of them. A couple of them did buy new packs for the trip but even after several crew meetings where we discussed lightening up, they still went for the 5+ pound Kelty packs. I switched from one of those to a Golite Pinnacle…man I like that pack.
* The bigger obstacle is that they are teenage boys who dont do much backpacking. Thus, they think they can carry the world. One Scout actually brought a 2 pound knife/hammer/shovel multi-tool to a shakedown hike. We asked what he thought he was going to use the hammer or shovel for. He didnt know…"just in case" because "it doesnt weigh much".
Now, it isn't a complete lost cause. Other than that one young man who thinks he knows it all, everyone is doing a good job eliminating unnecessary stuff and getting the lightest version of things that they can afford. Almost everyone is under 20 pounds for all their personal gear (except tent). A couple are just over 15 pounds.
Anyway…I like the idea of buying light tents and reselling them if the long-term finances require. Im open to other suggestions.Apr 6, 2012 at 6:22 am #1864299
Well, then it would seem, the only place left to save is on the shelters.
Oware has good prices on mids, and they resell here quickly, to others in the same position. Even MYOG sell here periodically. There was a 9×9 MYOG mid here a few wks ago I briefly considered buying for the same reason. Also an Oware. Search back on the forums and you can convince yourself you will have no problem reselling at 50-70% of purchase.
Good luck.
Maybe they need some strenuous training hikes to show them the light?Apr 6, 2012 at 9:03 am #1864357
Gordon ForrestMember
Floorless tarps and whatnot may work fine for Philmont but they are not practical for year round Scout use in New England where I live.
Our Troop does not backpack very much either, our shakedown trips and trek to Philmont this summer will be the first exposure for most of the 8 boys. However, we do anticipate doing more backpacking in the future. Our troop supplies tents and cooking gear and our "standard" troop tents are 7' X 7' Coleman and 8' X 10' Wenzel tents. I wouldn't take either on a backpacking or cold weather trip, however, they are too heavy and the fiberglass poles too brittle.
To that end, our troop committee just approved the purchase of new tents for high adventure use. We just placed an order for 4 ALPS Mountaineering Chaos 2 tents under ALPS' ScoutDirect program, $578 shipped to MA. These tents will be used by the boys in our Philmont crew and we will probably add more tents to the troop inventory if these seem to work out well this summer.
The Chaos 2 is a little heavier than the ALPS Mystique 2 or Zephyr 2 that seem popular with Scouts at Philmont but it is built sturdier and offers 4-season features that are appealing. I would look at purchasing gear that the Scouts can get 4-season use out of, not just for their 12 day trip to Philmont.Apr 6, 2012 at 10:46 am #1864385
This is backpackinglight.com.
It is the premier site for discussing ultralight backpacking gear and techniques. There is a veritable wealth of knowledge to be gained here from the experiences and opinions of others.
However, this particular forum is a bit of an anomaly. Ive noticed a significant percentage of people here destined for Philmont make excuses for not going UL. Defending the need for heavy boots, heavy tents, gigantic heavy packs.
There is only 2 reasons to stick with conventional heavy gear today IMO:
1) Cannot afford to spend any money to lighten up, already have gear
2) lack of knowledge of the lighter alternatives.
If you are spending $1400 it is worth a little more to have an enjoyable experience, vs. a miserable one. That should be made clear to everyone upfront IMO.
There are 2 types of people that leave Philmont. Those that cant wait to go back, and those that say they are never doing that again. There is no reason for anyone to not have a totally enjoyable experience.
My 13yo son and I just completed a "short" trip, crossing over 7 mountains, several in one day, 4days food, 2L water, up to 13 miles per day. Wearing trail runners. Steep, very rocky, strenuous terrain, lots of water crossings too. We hit the trail with packs weighing 16 and 18 lbs, and that was carrying a heavy 4lb tent. We were able to hike at 2-3mph, even on climbs, feet were wet all day every day. No foot problems, no twisted ankles. Feet always felt comfy. We passed other hikers with conventional gear like they were in slow motion, because they were.
We came upon a couple of hikers looking at a waterfall down the slope at one spot. They stayed on the trail, I climbed down and took a picture, and climbed right back up with my pack on my back. They were unable to do that, and didnt want to shed their pack and have to put it back on either. So they didnt get a good picture.
Believe in the UL approach, really. Embrace it. It makes a world of difference. Strive for it. It can be the difference between the kids loving the outdoors and backpacking, or hating it and never doing it again. You are shaping the kids vision of what outdoor experiences can be like.
For the last 5000 yrs a tent was a floorless single wall shelter with a door, still is at summer camp. Only in the last 40 has it become a heavy double wall monstrosity with multiple poles and bug proof innner sanctum with attached floor.
Peoples idea of a tent and what they NEED is often based somewhat on marketing, not reality.
The mid is the epitome of a storm resistant 4 season shelter. Philmont doesnt have bug issues, and climate is dry enough so that condensation shouldnt be issue. You can get net inners for mids too, however, for use in wetter/buggy areas. Making it quite versatile too.Apr 6, 2012 at 1:35 pm #1864461
We have 4 season tents already, well…not technically 4 season but we use the TL4 year-round.
Im taking the same approach and talking to our committee about tents to be used only for high adventures. Im coming to like the idea of a 4-5 person mid for the weight, bulk and cost. But I think we lose much of that benefit when we have to add the floor and bug nest – because Philmont wants an attached floor and because about 2/3 of our high adventures are in the BWCAW where solid bug protection is a necessity.
Guess Ill take the information to the crew and let them decide if they would rather have two in a tent but carry more weight, carry less weight but have 3-4 in a tent or kick in the extra money to get lighter tents.Apr 6, 2012 at 1:50 pm #1864467
I dont think Philmont requires an attached floor, they just want a floor.
Plenty of troops simply use stick on velcro to attach the plastic sheet,tyvek, or polycro floor to the tent so it serves as a bathtub too.Apr 6, 2012 at 2:04 pm #1864473
Again, I can't argue with your logic M B.
As I said at the start, we dont backpack much. Mostly because there are not many options for anything more than day hikes here in Iowa. I think this leads to heavy gear for both of the reasons you mentioned. Parents and Scouts buy heavy gear because that is what the big-box stores around here carry, because there is not a market for lighter stuff. They dont see the need to pay more for something lighter because they dont do much backpacking. When they do get to go backpacking they cannot justify the cost to replace "perfectly good" gear.
"If you are spending $1400 it is worth a little more to have an enjoyable experience, vs. a miserable one. That should be made clear to everyone upfront IMO."
I completely agree, but only because I carried a 40 pound pack on our trip to the Rockies a couple of years ago. That didnt kill me but it did make me much more willing to spend the $$$ for some lighter gear this time. I started by getting a scale and weighing everything. Then I traded a 3 pound Thermarest Basecamp for a 14oz Neoair and a 5.5 pound Kelty pack for a 2 pound Golite Pinnacle. Now Im deciding if it is worth picking up some Dri Ducks to save a pound on my rain gear. At some point you still have to draw a line.Apr 6, 2012 at 2:53 pm #1864501
Mark RashSpectator
@markrvpLocale: North Texas
It is correct that this forum is somewhat of an anomaly from the rest of Backpacking Light. Here's why:
Parents who don't go backpacking are making the financial decisions on what equipment gets bought for their sons going to Philmont. Most parents can't justify spending the money we all gladly spend on lightening our load. I personally gave a 2 hour presentation to all our crew members and parents with specific examples of equipment to buy… I even found the best deals online and gave them a printout of URLs showing where to order it online. A lot of that presentation fell on deaf ears… all the parents saw was the $$$ and not the benefit.
For example, I have a boy in my crew who is in a single parent family who's income is about $1600/month. He is paying for his trip through his sales of Popcorn in the annual Boy Scout Popcorn drive. That's a hell of a thing to raise $1000 by selling popcorn. The gear he is taking is put together from what all the rest of us had left over for him to use. For the guys on our crew, just convincing their parents to buy a couple of Platypus bottles has been a hard sell. We were lucky to get many of them Eureka Silver City sleeping bags as Christmas presents.
For me personally, I have been buying gear for over a year here on Gear Swap for both my son and me. If it weren't for the fact that my son's gear will eventually be passed down to my younger son for his Philmont trek in 2015 I probably would have gotten cheaper gear for him.Apr 6, 2012 at 3:58 pm #1864526
Yeah, I understand the difficulties. We are going in 2013 and might struggle with that, but so far our group is pretty small so maybe not.
I feel like if you can catch them far enough ahead of time maybe you can head off some of the difficulties, maybe Im wrong, find out soon enough.
Large light shelters are relatively cheap per person, and can be resold for minimal loss. If you can buy used here it will likely not cost more than $10 per person, most of that shipping loss. Golite packs go on sale every year around Jan. for less than conventional packs, this yr they were $70, how can you beat that anywhere??? Driducks are cheap and lightweight. Lightwt fleece is dirt cheap at walmart or old navy. Just bought my son an 11oz walmart fleece jacket for a trip for $7 because his favorite melanzana hoody "dissapeared". Old navy also had a very lightwt (~16 oz) puffy jacket too last yr for ~$30. Sleeping bags like MH Ultralamina 32 were available recently on Sierra trading post for $112, with rebate or coupon code only $93, for a 2lb bag.
I can see basically outfitting a kid with reasonably lightweight stuff for $300 if they shop smart, listen to advice, buy when it comes up, and dont go to the nearest big box store and buy crap. Of course if they depend on Christmas for this stuff, they likely will just buy whatever they can find local, and probably pay more for it too.
Get the 2.5 lb pack, the 2.5 lb bag, and share a large light tent, and 3/4 ridgerest and the rest is really convincing them to leave stuff behind they dont need.
The best situation might be a troop that doesnt backpack, because the kids dont have any gear to start with except usually a cheap $40 sleeping bag for car camping.
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text:
A Conservative Jewish day school will not renew its Boy Scouts charter because of the organization's policy excluding gay and lesbian adults as leaders.
The Golda Och Academy in West Orange, N.J., said in a letter to parents last week that the Scouts' policy presents a "problematic image for many families.
"To exclude same-sex families from membership and adult volunteerism is in direct contradiction of school policies, which place high value on inclusion," reads the Oct. 17 letter signed by head of school Joyce Raynor, the New Jersey Jewish News reported.
The Boy Scouts of America reaffirmed its ban on gays and lesbians over the summer.
There has several same-sex families at Golda Och, according to Raynor.
The day school's scout and pack are now in search of another location in which to meet. Thirty of the school's families have children in Boy Scout Troop 118, which started in 1995, and Cub Scout Pack 118 for younger boys.
Since 2001, the Reform movement has recommended that member congregations withdraw sponsorship of packs or troops over the issue, according to the Jewish News.
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subset: commoncrawl


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Travel slowly, staying in vacation rentals (villas, farms, cottages, apartments)
Trip Reports Home | My Trip Reports | Create Trip Report | Recent Reports | Search Trip Reports
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Report 2027: September in Sardinia
By Marian McCain from England, Fall 2012
Trip Description: We spent the month of September exploring multiple areas of Sardinia via mass transit and walking.
Destinations: Countries - Italy, Switzerland; Regions/Cities - Other Italy Region
Categories: Hotels/B&Bs; Vacation Rentals; Beach; Sightseeing; Walking/Hiking; Independent Travel; 2 People
Page 1 of 9: Getting There
Where we went
"Are we there yet?" No. But in a way, yes we are. For when you travel overland, as we do, the getting there and the getting back are all part of the experience. Slow travel is about opening the eyes and the mind to each new scene as it unfolds, to each new encounter and to each new moment. It's not a mode of traveling from place to place but also a mindset. So to move from the habitual, goal-oriented way of being in which so many of us live our daily lives into the more meditative, slow travel mindset requires a deliberate shift. And since my partner and I live a long way from anywhere, the first action of any trip we take is to remind ourselves and each other that the shift needs to happen as soon as we close the door of our cottage, walk up the hill to the village and climb on to the bus. So as usual it was bus to the station, train to Exeter, another train to London, Tube to St Pancras, Eurostar to Paris. But this time, we took a train from Paris to Zurich, where we stayed the night, so that instead of hurtling through the Alps in the dark on a sleeper train like we have done in years past, we could savor the beauty of that picture postcard Swiss scenery as we headed south towards Milan.
From Milan, another train took us to Genoa, where we found our way through busy streets to the ferry terminal and boarded our Tirrenia ferry for the overnight crossing to this year's destination the island of Sardinia.
The ferry docked in Olbia at seven in the morning and a little bus whisked us a few hundred yards to the terminal, which was mostly deserted. We managed to locate the big blue ARST bus to Dorgali, which was waiting some distance away in the car park, with the driver taking a nap in the back seat. It was thundery weather, with sudden, short downpours, so we sheltered in the doorway of the ferry terminal until it was time to leave. Then it was into the centre of Olbia and another mad dash through the rain to a bar to buy our bus tickets, since they don't sell them on the bus. The bus then took us south for two and a half hours to Nuoro, from where another bus brought us, three days after leaving home, to the first of our Sardinian destinations Cala Gonone.
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text:
Christie touts budget, criticizes Democrats for inaction on tax cuts during Montville stop
Governor Christie spoke briefly Wednesday morning about his $32.9 billion budget proposal, using most of his time at a Morris County event to criticize Democrats for not doing enough to cut taxes.
There was no hint of the confrontational and sometimes angry tone Christie used Tuesday as he laid out his budget for the fiscal year that starts July 1. Instead he drew laughs from a friendly crowd of more than 800 in Montville, a heavily Republican town, during the town-hall talk.
Christie chastised Democrats for failing to enact his tax cut or pass bills that would end payouts to employees for unused sick time; prevent towns from using user-fee hikes as a way to circumvent the 2 percent cap on property tax increases; and require municipalities to share services or risk losing state aid equal to the amount of money it would save them.
Christie said those bills would further lower taxes, which rose an average of 1.4 percent statewide last year.
"If we pass those three bills and I sign them into law, I am telling you that, that 1.4 percent is going to go down to zero or lower," he said. "Imagine if you got your property tax bill in August and it were less than the one before."
Christie joked that lower tax bills could cause some "major health problems."
"Folks would just pass out and hit their head," he said drawing, laughs. "But let's take the risk, right? Let's run the gamble. Let's pass these bills that are there in the Legislature."
Christie said the Senate has already passed the bill that would make any increases in fees for municipal services subject to the state-mandated cap on local tax hikes. He called on attendees to put pressure on the Assembly to pass the bill.
In his budget address Tuesday, Christie said Democrats "reneged" on their deal to cut taxes even after he reached a compromise with them. He said the move reinforced a lesson his mother instilled in him, that "a leopard never changes its spots."
The Democrats shot back, saying he has increased taxes while in office by scaling back a property tax rebate program. Christie didn't mention this Wednesday or in his budget address Tuesday, but he's closing a gap in the current budget by pushing the payment of rebates from May to August, which moves the program to the next budget cycle.
"Governor Christie has overseen a net 20 percent property tax hike and is causing hardship for senior citizens and the middle class by delaying property tax rebates, so he's lacking in credibility on property taxes and should look at his own poor performance before blaming others," said Tom Hester, a spokesman for Assembly Democrats.
Hester said the Assembly also passed a bill that would cap sick leave payouts but that Christie has refused to sign it. Christie said the first bill to get to his desk proposed a $15,000 maximum payment and the second $7,500. He said he will not support any payouts for unused sick time.
Although his budget sets aside no money for a tax cut, Christie said he would find the money if the Democrats support his proposal.
The Democrats have said they support a tax cut but wanted to wait and see if there was enough money to support it, after state revenue collections lagged behind Christie's projections.
Christie dismissed the idea that the state can't afford to cut taxes. "I don't understand all this pay-for-tax-cut stuff," he said getting huge applause. "It's your money in the first place."
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Muschamp Receives Extended Contract
Published November 27th, 2012
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GAINESVILLE- Florida football head coach Will Muschamp has the opportunity to end the football season as one of only three Gator coaches to win 12 games in a season.
But Muschamps good season actually started way back in August.
That is when he was given a contract extention that hopes to keep him in Gainesville until at least 2017.
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- Gators Extend Opening Win Streak to 24 with Win Over Toledo
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- Meyer Takes "Extended Leave of Absence" Rather Than Resign
- Gator Women's Basketball Extends Win Streak to 9 vs Robert Morris
- No. 9 Florida Lacrosse Extends Win Streak to Nine with 15-7 Rout of Fairfield


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What do you have? (I'm in California, USA for shipping).
Thank you!
What do you have? (I'm in California, USA for shipping).
Thank you!
One last time...
OK, recovered from the Xmas spending. Anyone?
Up please.
Look for Odin on this forum. he may have what you are looking for.
Odin's Best Moon sold...
yeah I bought it. Have you looked at the Sky risers lately?
The longest Sky ILF is 17". Are you referring to another one?
Jim has the conquest. I shot this riser and it balances nicely with no additional weight needed.
The bottom part of the riser looks like a design afterthought. For that money I can get a Nilo shipped. Thanks for the info, though.
Did you ever post pictures??
Of what ArtV? I'm looking to buy one. WTB=Want to buy
WTB: Lefty (LH) barebow riser, Spigarelli , Best by Italy or Bernardini
842 views and no one has one?
One more TTT, please.
TTT, please.
TTT please.


text: I am sending in a photo of the block I made for Deforsee. It is a friendship block and the colors in the photo are not showing up really good. They make it look kind of washed out. The palm trees are bright green and in this photo they look kind of blah. I thought the block looked much nicer than the photo. Diane emailed me and she recieved it and is pleased so that makes me happy.


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Answers Home
» Kittens
» Other Kittens
Do cats make noise when they give birth?
My cat<Gypsie>recently gave birth (she had 2 kittens, an ashy-gray one and a tabby that looks like her) and I was just wondering if cats yowl or wail or anything while they're giving birth because my dad woke up at around 4 on Saturday morning to a loud wailing, like a cat fight. Gypsie's kittens are only a few days old (their eyes aren't even open yet) so we were thinking that what he woke up to wasn't a cat fight at all, but my beautiful girl giving birth. So if anyone could respond to this, that'd be great. Thanks! :)
Asked by
on Apr 6th 2009
in Other Kittens
- Cast your vote for which answer you think is best!
I doubt seriously if a mother cat will "yowl" when she's giving birth. When cats give birth in the "wild" (outdoors) the LAST thing they want to do is make noise and advertise to all the predators out there that there are a bunch of newborn little creatures waiting to be killed and eaten. Cats are very stoic when it comes to pain. It's possible it was another cat outside who may have smelled the blood if a window was open. In any case, would you consider having your "beautiful girl" spayed after the kittens are weaned? You'll have her longer as she'll be heathier and live longer if she's not having kittens all the time and she won't be contributing to the overpopulation of kittens in our country. Just a thought.
Izadore (Izzie) answered on 4/8/09. Helpful? / 1
I am not sure if cats do or not, but I am about to find out, as one of my cats are gonna pop any second now, and I cant wait...So i will post after I know the answer...BUT I just wanted to say that I love how the other posting gave no real credible information, only an opinion, and only served to bore us with her agenda about having the cat spayed...Bet you took the same amount of nothing from that, that I did...
Apollo answered on 1/9/11. Helpful? / 0


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The Big Island of Hawaii 4) Kohala & Saddle Road
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The Kohala coast is a popular destination for tourists, with a string of resorts built beside beaches a half hour and more north of Kona. Many of the island's best resorts and golf courses are located on this dry sunny lava plain. Most of my trips to the Big Island are centered around medical meetings which tend to be situated in Waikoloa so I'm most familiar with this part of the island. Because the Big Island is a fairly new piece of land, beaches are limited and the best beaches -- Hapuna and Mauna Kea -- are located on the Kohala coast immediately adjoining several top notch resorts. As always, beware of rough water and riptides when swimming or snorkeling here. There's a great easy to reach group of petroglyphs close to the King's Shops, on the King's Trail.
There are a number of small charming towns on the Big Island, my favorite being WaimeaParker Ranch, the largest ranch in the United States (at 225,000 acres, it at one time comprised 9% of the Big Island). The town is situated on the saddle of Mauna Kea and Kohala volcanoes, at the transition between the wet and dry parts of the island, has a great climate with cool breezes and I think it would be a great place to live (it's also well above the tsunami danger zone). To me it seems more like a town from Montana or Idaho than Hawaii. Probably the finest restaurant on the Big Island, Merriman's, finds its home here.
From Waimea head north along Kohala Mountain Road which takes you up the spine of the old, dormant Kohala volcano. You'll pass herds of horses and cattle and see some beautiful ranch land. On a clear day you might catch stunning views of Maui; the Kohala Mountain Road is a great place to watch the sunset. This road ends in the the charming old sugar growing town of Hawi, which is worth exploring. It has several huge old Banyon trees, gift and wood craft shops, and wonderful ice cream is available at Tropical Dreams with such great flavors as coconut, chocolate macadamia nut, and many more.
Head east to the small town of Kapaau which has features an old statue of King Kamehameha the Great (just like the one in front of the Judiciary Building in Honolulu)Pololu Valley lookout, which offers good views of a classic Hawaiian valley. If you're up to it, hike the trail 400 feet down to the black sand beach and explore some of this valley -- something I've done twice and really enjoyed. The beach (beware of the strong undertow) and valley are quite isolated and give you a sense of the "real Hawaii" that so many people strive to find. There are seven remote valleys from Pololu to Waipio (which is approached from the Hilo side) most of which can only be accessed on foot so this is a potential backpacking trip if you're game.
As you head south from the northwest coast, drive the coastal road and stop at Lapakahi State Historic Park which features a reconstructed traditional coastal Hawaiian village. There's an easy trail that takes you through this village and along the coast which is worth the effort. Another very worthwhile stop is the Pu'ukohola Heiau, a massive stone temple built by King Kamehameha in 1790, located at the junction of Hwys 19 and 270. The Heiau has nice visitor center with traditional weapons display.
One of the great drives in America is Saddle Road, which crosses between the dry and wet sides of the island across the broad lava flow and saddle between Mauna Loa and Mauna Kea, the world's largest and tallest mountains respectively (base of Mauna Kea is 19000' below sea level; the part above ocean is 13796' high)
Saddle Road provides access to Mauna Kea, it's visitor center and world famous Observatory. The peak of Mauna Kea is one of the finest places on the planet from which to observe the stars. It's dry and clear with great air quality and fantastic views and can be only be accessed by four wheel drive vehicles (or on foot). As it's at high altitude you'll need a warm jacket when visiting here (during our last trip the road to the peak was closed due to heavy snow). The Onizuka Center for International Astronomy is located at 9200' and is a good stopping point to help acclimatize visitors to the mountain. It has videos and displays about the observatories, astronomy and the ecology of the mountain, and a small gift shop. There's a large military base nearby and some dramatic lava flows from Mauna Loa (on which the Apollo astronauts trained for their moon landings). At the turnoff to Mauna Kea from Saddle road sits Pu'u Huluhulu, a good place for a hike off road that offers lasting memories of views of the world's two greatest volcanoes.
If you would like to see high resolution views of the following images, pleae go to this link: http://drfumblefinger.com/wrdprs/?p=307 . For full screen views, click on the right sided icon of the slide show's toolbar (towards the bottom of the page).


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Town Square
KB Homes: Wrecking our hillsides one acre at a time
Original post made by Derek, Danville, on Mar 1, 2012
How the heck do these projects keep flying through the process with so little public input - or did I miss something? Is it rime to take local voting more seriously when it comes to our city council? I believe that it is.
Maybe this was covered well once before and I failed to realize the actual location, but somehow I doubt it.
a resident of another community
on Mar 2, 2012 at 6:44 am
Farmer Dave is a registered user.
If you don't want construction on that property, do what I did in Pleasant Hill in the early 1970's: Buy the land!
When development was slated for the hills across the street from my home, I formed a citizens' committee which put a measure on the ballot to raise funds and purchase what is now Paso Nogal Park.
The park is owned and operated by the Pleasant Hill Recreation and Park District.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 2, 2012 at 8:00 am
Way too late for that I'm afraid; this is apparently a done deal and the land was purchased by KB a long time ago. My understanding is that grading will start very soon.
Well, there's that and the fact that we don't have 1.3 mil an acre to shell out. Don't know how may acres are involved, but there are over 80 units planned. With streets and all, it might be 30 acres or so?
a resident of Vista Grande Elementary School
on Mar 2, 2012 at 9:02 am
I saw the "builder's sign" out there the other day too - SO SAD!!!
My kids love looking up at nature, the wild turkeys and horses on the hillside - Bye, Bye!
a resident of Danville
on Mar 2, 2012 at 10:03 am
Quite a few Tri Valley residents live in homes that sit on land that was once pristine. As much as I like natural settings, it strikes me as disingenuous, or perhaps even hypocritical, to lament land development so others might enjoy what I have had for the past 25 years.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 2, 2012 at 11:11 am
Can't be any cheaper than the junk that was built in Greenbrook in the 60's. Talk about cheap ticky tack! But you know what, that's what people can afford to buy and people need a place to live. The "I got mine" late comers to Danville are just going to have to stop their complaining and put up with it, or get more up to speed on what's going on.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 2, 2012 at 11:18 am
Do get involved in land conservation in the area. The decisions for these developments are contested and negotiated all the time. If you don't have the time to get involved, perhaps leverage your time by donating funds to an organization like Save Mount Diablo or the Tri Valley Conservancy. If you don't volunteer or donate consider yourself a mostly useless airbag.
here is a link Web Link for a relevant story.
The trail access to the Las Trampas Regional Park is a huge win for those that support our parks and open spaces.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 2, 2012 at 3:00 pm
Unless we are more selective in the future, our hills will look like the heavily crowded hills of San Francisco. What an ugly sight.
It seems to me the reason for our City Council's acceptance of this type of expansion is the income that will be obtained from future property taxes. Never mind the added cost of police, fire, etc that will be required.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 2, 2012 at 3:44 pm
Geoff Gillette is a registered user.
Good afternoon!
Just wanted to take a second and touch on a few things. After following this thread today, I spoke with Principal Planner David Crompton about this property and got the following information.
Approvals to allow for construction of homes on this site, known as the "Elworthy Property" were granted by the Town in July, 2008, following a three year review process. This approval followed extensive neighborhood outreach, completion of an environmental impact report and widely noticed public hearings. KB Homes has purchased the entitlement and will be starting construction later in spring 2012."
The site includes over 459+/- acres, stretching from San Ramon Valley Boulevard to the west, up and over the top of Las Trampas Ridge. A total of 84 single family homes and 12 apartments will be built on the lowermost 12 +/- acres located adjacent to San Ramon Valley Boulevard.
The entitlement retains almost 440 acres of the site as scenic open space, including the highly visible east-facing slope of Las Trampas Ridge. Approximately 232 acres of the upper hillside and ridgeline area will be dedicated to the East Bay Regional Parks District and will be added to the Los Trampas open space. A staging area will be built as part of the project to provide public access to the open space.
The highly visible and scenic nature of the site was a major consideration in the environmental review. Widening of San Ramon Valley Boulevard to match the segments located north and south of the property frontage will occur as part of the project.
Hope this helps.
Thanks for the comments and have a great weekend!
Geoff Gillette
Public Information Coordinator
Town of Danville
(925) 314-3336
e-mail: email@example.com
a resident of Greenbrook Elementary School
on Mar 2, 2012 at 7:23 pm
Mr.Gillette,can you be more specific, just what were the conclusions drawn from the "extensive outreach"efforts ,was there public support,did the EIR take into account the USGS REPORTS completed 30+yrs. ago(of which I have a copy) that indicated that this property is extremely unstable,unsuitable for structures,did sufficient numbers of interested parties attend,and comment, at the public hearings? You give no hint as to the outcome of these events,reporting that they occurred is of no value,the value is in what they produced and what value was given to the input!!
a resident of Danville
on Mar 2, 2012 at 11:35 pm
Thank you for your response Mr. Gillette, but I, like Greenbrook ELDER would like to know what the conclusions from the extensive outreach efforts were? And, how does public opinion affect the final decision of the Planning Commission?
a resident of Vista Grande Elementary School
on Mar 4, 2012 at 7:01 am
I remember this process well, and numerous articles in the paper alerted citizenry that this parcel was up for review. In my view, the mitigation efforts were the result of public input. The prominent scenic hillside will be preserved and the East Bay Parks gets a nice chunk of what was previously private property. As much as I lament the loss of green space it does seem the process worked in this case. Lastly thank you again Geoff for the information.
a resident of Alamo
on Mar 5, 2012 at 7:25 am
I was raised in San Ramon and attended San Ramon Valley High in the 1970's. I had my horse boarded on the Geldermann Ranch, which was near Montevideo. I spent many Saturdays at the barn and riding the beautiful hills of the San Ramon Valley. It was a beautiful valley filled with orchards, cattle and horses. Slowly over the last couple decades, everything changed with the development of homes, office parks and shopping centers. I still love our area but miss seeing kids riding horses, or working/volunteering at the barn, like I had the chance to do.
The best I could do to preserve my memories and lifestyle, was to move to Alamo years ago. I am sorry to see the Elworthy project being developed as this is the last hillside in Danville.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 5, 2012 at 10:08 am
Actually 12-acres being developed out of a total of 459 is a huge win for the preservation of the east slope of Las Trampas Ridge. The land that will be dedicated to EBRPD provides a very useful ridge top connection between lands currently owned by EBRPD.
If you drive in the California Chateau development, and go up to Peters Ranch, there is a water tank at the top. The land nearby on the ridge at this location is owned by EBRPD. The Elworthy Ranch dedication to EBRPD will bridge the gap to the currently open EBRPD land at the top of the ridge accessed from Prospect / Remington.
The reason that EBRPD is not accepting the entire open space lands is more than likely their not wanting to own the lands immediately upslope from the development, due to management issues and risk associated with landslides and fires.
The California Chateau development is built on the same earthquake fault system. It appears the original developer left a green belt through the entire development where the fault line is purported to be. I am assuming in this day and age, with all the increased knowledge that we have regarding earthquakes and landslides and how to geo-technical engineer for these risks, that that was taken into account. The iPhone isn't the only advancement made in the past 30 years. And yes there were a ton of meetings and publicity about this already.
a resident of Diablo
on Mar 5, 2012 at 10:12 am
If you want to stay abreast of development issues, support your local land conservancy's with your time or money. If you donate/join, you will get on the communication lists and provide the organizations with funds by which to support the cause.
Local Conservancy's
Save Mount Diablo
Tri-Valley Conservancy
a resident of Danville
on Mar 5, 2012 at 4:29 pm
Geoff Gillette is a registered user.
Good afternoon,
After reading some of your responses, I spoke further with Principal Planner David Crompton and got some additional information regarding the process to share with you.
As part of the Town's outreach efforts, all residents within 1000 ft. of the proposed development were notified by mail of the public hearing process. It should be noted that the state only mandates that residents within 300 ft. be notified. This resulted in approximately one thousand residents being notified directly of the development application and approval process.
In addition, a large sign was posted along the frontage of the property on San Ramon Valley Boulevard giving information on the project as well as providing David Crompton's phone number.
Articles were written about the development application in the Town's Quarterly newsletter and the press was notified of the process, which resulted in a number of stories being written in the Danville Weekly and in the San Ramon Valley Times.
Public hearings on the project were held before the Town Planning Commission and Town Council. At the hearing before the Town Council there were only two speakers. One in support of the project and one voicing concerns about increased traffic generated by the development.
An Environmental Impact Report was completed, which included a study of the geological stability of the site. The Town hired a third party geotechnical firm to peer-review the adequacy of the report prior to incorporating it into the EIR. The findings of the report were, in part, responsible for the location and design of the subdivision.
The question was asked regarding what effect public input has on the decision-making process. The Town Council gets information from staff regarding whether or not a development application is consistent with the Town's General Plan and other Town criteria for development.
During a public hearing, the Council gives residents an opportunity to voice their concerns about a specific application which they then take into account in their deliberations.
The value the Town places on public input can be illustrated through the development of the Elworthy property. In 1998, an application was submitted by another developer which proposed over 200 homes spread out over the entire hillside.
Using the same public notification methods described above, the Town received considerable input and the developer ultimately abandoned the project. Several years later when the current application was submitted, it incorporated many of the concerns voiced earlier by residents.
Hope this helps.
Thanks for the comments and have a good day.
Geoff Gillette
Public Information Coordinator
Town of Danville
(925) 314-3336
e-mail - firstname.lastname@example.com
a resident of Danville
on Mar 6, 2012 at 9:25 am
the first post states it all Wrecking OUR hillside..because you look at it does not give you ownership..perhaps you would like to give the real owner of this property a check for at least half of the tax paid over the years since it is YOUR HILLSIDE
a resident of another community
on Mar 6, 2012 at 4:31 pm
I was raised in San Ramon. Knew the Elworthys well. So much of what was San Ramon has changed. The freeway took us out in 1964. We moved to Danville and I'm now in Pleasanton. I remember my father saying in the 50's someday it will be solid homes all the way to Pleasanton.
How right he was!
It's just sad, especially to those of us who grew up there.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 7, 2012 at 6:30 am
Every time we drive by the hillside my 6 year old daughter say's "I feel sorry for the cow's, where will they go mommy?" Very sad :-(
a resident of Danville
on Mar 7, 2012 at 8:29 am
Come on Sue, have you read the emails, are you literate. 12/450 is less than 3% of the land that is going to be used for houses. I think the cows can live off the remaining acreage. In fact it is likely that EBRPD will continue grazing as that is their policy, and there is a good chance the homeowner association will also lease out their land for cattle ranching. So the cows go the same spot. Maybe you can give up on a few hamburgers per year so that the one cow that doesn't get to graze anymore doesn't starve. And perhaps you should mention to your daughter that our society serves those same cows on dinner plates every night of the year. Sorry to burst your daughters bubble, but those cows are in the Safeway manufacturing line.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 7, 2012 at 10:01 am
12/450 is great! What are we giving up for the Magee Ranch/Summerhill project? There are beautiful hills, wildlife and too much traffic now. Whats the ratio of land and open space?
a resident of Danville
on Mar 7, 2012 at 10:05 am
Sorry I meant to say What's the ratio between land for Houses and open space? Will we see these houses from Diablo Rd? That still won't fix the traffic problem but just curious?
a resident of Danville
on Mar 8, 2012 at 6:26 am
Wow Josh!! You're sure full of a lot of anger. Shame on you for being so rude. Hope you're proud of your self.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 8, 2012 at 7:16 am
Also I must admit that I didn't read the above e-mails. So I'm not illiterate just lazy.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 8, 2012 at 8:52 am
Where would the no-growthers be living today had we listened to them when their developments were being planned? Not here, obviously. The truth is Danville has been well planned and beautifully executed. It's a joy to live here because of the sane planning by our developers, careful consideration by our city and county staff, and we wisely ignored the bleating of the self-interested, uninvolved complainers.
a resident of Los Cerros Middle School
on Mar 8, 2012 at 9:12 am
Thanks, Patty, for bringing up the SummerHill Homes' application for 78 homes, plus possibly another 45 or more second residential units, to be built on Jed Magee's remaining 410-acre ranch in the scenic eastern Diablo Road corridor.
Under the current A-4 (Agricultural Preserve District) zoning for about 200 of those 410 acres, SummerHill would only be able to build one home per twenty acres. The rest of the acres are currently zoned A-2, one home per 5 acres. But SummerHill is trying to get Danville to rezone the 200 A-4 acres to A-2, one home per 5 acres, to accommodate SummerHill's plan.
WE MUST ALL GET INVOLVED TO STOP THAT REZONING FROM HAPPENING!! The Draft Environmental Impact Report for the project is expected TO BE MADE PUBLIC IN APRIL OR MAY. PLEASE LOOK FOR AN ANNOUNCEMENT ABOUT THE PUBLIC HEARING and SHOW UP FOR IT, OR SEND YOUR COMMENTS TO DANVILLE!
Also, get on the www.save-our-creek.com website and SIGN THE PETITION against the ill-conceived SummerHill proposed project and donate money via paypal to our grassroots organization dedicated to stopping it. Also, indicate if you would like to offer your assistance. Save-Our-Creek has hired an attorney and a traffic expert to oppose the traffic nightmare, flooding/erosion, loss of general-plan protected scenic beauty, and habitat destruction that SummerHill's plan will cause.
a resident of Diablo
on Mar 8, 2012 at 11:55 am
I am sorry Sue. I just think it is important to connect the dots.
As for Old Danvillian mentioning the "sane planning by our developers" I don't believe you would agree to the original Elworthy proposal being sane. It was to cover the entire hillside including on the ridge over 200 homes. If it were not for local activists, there would be nothing sane about how the hills would be covered with homes. There is not one ridgeline in the area that has not had homes 'planned' for development. And if not for these same local activists, the Town Councils and county staff and board of supervisors, would have rubber stamped insane amounts of leapfrog developments.
The lasting legacy of Ken Behring and the leap frog Blackhawk Development will be the motivation it provided for local activists to come together and stop development this kind of insane development. Thank the people for passing county urban limit lines so we can preserve our ridgelines and open spaces. In every urban limit line election, developers have spent millions to defeat them. They are not sane, they are self-interested in makeing money.
a resident of Diablo
on Mar 9, 2012 at 9:43 am
Although I would be broken hearted by the loss of lovely trees and open land along Diablo Road if Danville changes their zoning to allow Summerhill to build 123 homes along the Diablo Road corridor, a more horrific problem would be the traffic congestion. If you have ever traveled Diablo Road before school opens at Los Cerros or Monte Vista HS on any weekday morning, you will know that traffic is already a nightmare, and there are no alternative routes! Try it some morning, and you will understand why we are all so worried!
a resident of Green Valley Elementary School
on Mar 9, 2012 at 10:32 am
Summerhill will build and bolt and the residents in this area will be left sitting in the parking lot that is Diablo Road at various times of the day. Careful consideration needs to be made to the assumptions Summerhill will use in its analysis of traffic projections. Under estimating persons/household and vehicles/household is a technique used by builders to paint a more palatable, albeit false, picture of the impact of their development.
Let's also be on the alert lest the concept of Eminent Domain isn't advocated as a tool to steal property. "In the good of the community" is used all too often to mask "in the good of these individuals." When the private property of private citizens can be taken at will, we all risk losing our freedoms. Traffic would then be the least of our problems.
We ALL need to speak up. It may not be your neighborhood today, but what of tomorrow?
a resident of Los Cerros Middle School
on Mar 9, 2012 at 10:50 am
When I first became aware of this project, it was through SummerHill homes by mail. I almost didn't open it because it looked EXACTLY like junk-mail. I was truly horrified. You see when I bought my home in 2002, I was told by multiple sources that the hills and open space surrounding our neighborhood couldn't be built upon. I actually went to TOWN OF DANVILLE and checked-They said that was true. I am fine with Mr. Magee having the "right" to sell his land. Where I and many others have a problem is that he doesn't have a "right" to rezone it in order to fashion a lucrative and sweetheart deal with the builder facilitated and to my highly involved eye coddled by the town. This is NOT for so many Save our Creek and other involved community members a case of the NIMBY'S. Why can't we just want to preserve natural beauty, sensitive habitats and ecosystems, prevent a MORE abysmal ride to school and work, prevent flooding and erosion and dang, just simply not ravage and ruin every last green space? I have a kid. I want every last piece of green for her future world. Call me a tree-hugger-I don't care. Why do we need MORE houses for godsakes when there literally are hundreds for sale or foreclosure in Danville?
a resident of Diablo
on Mar 9, 2012 at 10:54 am
We, too, are VERY concerned about the Summerhill Development along the Diablo Road Corridor for many of the reasons listed above. Traffic will be HORRENDOUS!!! There will be real danger from creek erosion. Zoning laws would be severely compromised and the rural beauty of the area diminished. All of this affects our property values. IT IS SO IMPORTANT THAT WE CLOSELY MONITOR THE SITUATION, VOICE OUR CONCERNS TO THE PLANNING DEPARTMENTS, SIGN THE PETITION MENTIONED ABOVE BY "FED UP WITH TRAFFIC - LOS CERROS COMMUNITY PARENT", AND ATTEND ALL PUBLIC HEARINGS!! As Geoff Gillette, Public Information Coordinator, said in his message of March 5th above - PUBLIC INPUT IS VERY IMPORTANT AND HAS MADE A DIFFERENCE IN THE APPROVAL PROCESS.
a resident of Greenbrook Elementary School
on Mar 9, 2012 at 12:02 pm
Old Danvillain, I live in the Greenbrook neighborhood you are calling junk at take offense. I like where we live and my home is not junk. My home was built in the late 70's. Not sure if you are calling the current Greenbrook homes junk or not. If so, I find your comment as cheap and ticky tack.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 9, 2012 at 12:25 pm
Believe it or not. the L.A. suburbs used to be beautiful also. What is happening here will become L.A. North. There is a new proposed project along Diablo Road by Summer Hill, which will add crowded housing to the scenic hillsides, and make the roads in the area unpassable with gridlock. This is the time for Danvillians to say enough is enough, now.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 9, 2012 at 1:47 pm
If you are interested in discussing the impact of additional development in Danville you'll want to check out these blogs on the Danville Patch:
Web Link
a resident of Danville
on Mar 10, 2012 at 9:48 am
All those that agree that Diablo Road traffic is OVER its capacity, and that flooding and erosion in the area are already unacceptable should email the 5 Danville Council members and 8 Planning Commissioners (emails are available on the Town of Danville website) and tell them that! Many of the decisionmakers for the REZONING necessary for this proposal to be approved are involved in real estate and real estate-related businesses. Maybe if they think it will hurt their businesses they will vote against the insanity that is being proposed by SUmmerHill Homes!
In any case, let's not let Jed Magee and SummerHill Homes make a SPECULATIVE bundle by getting a REZONING and TAKING PROPERTY VALUE from all of us! NO ONE HAS A RIGHT TO REZONE!!
a resident of Danville
on Mar 11, 2012 at 9:29 am
Last one in, shut the door, no more new homes allowed. You've got your dream house, how dare anyone else move in and ruin if for you.
How selfish and hypocritical!!!
a resident of Danville
on Mar 11, 2012 at 10:51 am
To "Realist" -
You're not being remotely real; you're being disingenuous. A major issue re the SummerHill development is the capacity of the land and infrastructure to absorb the impact of the development. This includes traffic, flooding, erosion, schools. Serious safety concerns are neither "selfish" nor "hypocritical." There is little to be done to increase the capacity of the creek or Diablo Road, and both are beyond capacity at present, despite extraordinary mitigation measures. And yet Jed Magee and SummerHill want to profit from overburdening these systems even further. It's like having a pipeline that can safely accommodate 40 gallons per minute. First someone puts in 10 gpm. A second puts in another 10 gpm. Two additional each put in 10 gpm. The pipe is at capacity. Would you have everyone who wants to keep adding more flow, just because some others got to before? The only thing you'll end up with is a burst pipe and loss of life or property. Those of us living in Danville want the Town council and staff to protect us and our children, not developer's profits. Rezoning the property should not be allowed. What are zoning laws for, after all, if not to protect us from unchecked and unsafe development? Danville residents, speak up and make your voices heard, because your community may be next. Ask not for whom the bell tolls - it tolls for thee.
a resident of Los Cerros Middle School
on Mar 11, 2012 at 4:46 pm
To "realist"-Your arguments are simplistic and just plain wrong. This cause is not about the effected homeowners being selfish and having what you state in an immature "I've got mine, no one else can have theirs" mentality. Really? Why don't you do a little research. Google how many homes are for sale or forclosure already. Do you have a clue how many hours of work/research a lot of us have dedicated to this project? HAVE YOU gone to ANY of the city council or Mornings with the Mayor meetings? Spoken to to the council members at any of the Farmer's Market's? I didn't think so. Like I said, you have no idea what you are talking about, you are probably a finance guy working with SummerHELL. It's a democracy, you have the right to voice your opinion, I have the right to tell you that the "FACTS" you present do not bear out your "argument". Perhaps you just don't care about natural beauty and trivial things like flooding, erosion, traffic, pollution. The reason the DEIR is probably taken so long and I believe 3 traffic studies is that they can't get a "good" number for the traffic as it is now with staggered school start times and buses (which aren't guaranteed). Save the sanctimony and your little hissy.
a resident of Montair Elementary School
on Mar 12, 2012 at 8:18 am
Just got the notice over the weekend. There is another preliminary Development Plan submitted by Ponderosa Homes for the area just north of the Elworthy property. It's for 112 acre property owned by the Podva Family Trust. They plan to create 20 single family homes on the lowest 9.2 acres near Midland Way. The remainder if the site would be designated permanent open space. Rezoning from A-2 to P-1. Don't know any more than that yet.
a resident of Danville
on Mar 12, 2012 at 9:03 am
Our Town Council and General Plan advocate rezoning that fosters clustering of homes in the case of new development. Clustering allows for higher density housing that, in theory, preserves more of the land to be open space. So, if you take a look at what is being proposed by Bummerhill, you'll see that they want to take 200 acres zoned for one house per 20 acres and cluster homes on a small portion of it and then zone the remainder permanent open space. Open space is good, right? NOt so fast... First, take a look at where the clustered and other homes proposed by Bummerhill will be placed - on Diablo Road or up against existing homes. I run an drive along Diablo Road today at street level and I see open space. Place the homes where Bummerhill proposes and none of will see the beauty we currently see. We'll see only houses. All the beautiful open space that Bummerhill says it will retain will be behind these homes and out of sight from street level. And what about access to this wonderful open space?? How do we the public (who will be asked to pay for it) get access to it? There is no plan for that. Bummerhill just boasts of the open space like it's Mom or apple pie but it's all just window dressing - their way of making this project sound like it's good for our community when it's not.
Don't be fooled - this proposed project is bad for our community on so many levels - traffic, flooding, erosion, impact on schools, enviromental, aesthetics. Please get involved and speak up. Tell our Town Council that we don't want this project or ones like it in our community. Let's try to save what is left of the Danville we love. Check out www.save-our-creek.com to see what is being done to stop Bummerhill and what you can do to help the cause. Thanks.
a resident of another community
on May 7, 2015 at 10:12 am
Hello, I am a Pleasant Hill resident who lives near Paso Nogal Park. This park is a natural jewel that is well loved and used by hikers, joggers and dog walkers. It is also home to abundant wildlife including birds, deer, coyote and numerous small creatures like lizards and butterflies. Residents in the surrounding neighborhood are currently trying to save the park from the installation of an 18 hole disc golf course that would cover at least one third of the park and spread throughout the beautiful trails we all love. This would involve 5 by 12 foot concrete slab tees, metal posts with large chain baskets and numerous signs throughout. There is much data about the environmental damage these courses cause and this is a completely natural unspoiled environment. There is a public meeting TUES, MAY 12 at 7PM at the PH Community Center. We have all heard the story of how the park was saved from development by residents but can not find anything online regarding the guidelines set up for its use by the original creators. It would be great if we could hear from Farmer Dave above or others responsible for its creation. If nothing else, I would like to thank them for this beautiful piece of unspoiled land that I am so thankful to look at and use on a daily basis.


text:
Scholastic Parents: Raise a Reader
10 Must-Have Counting Books
Mix math and reading with these great titles!
on October 10, 2013
Combine math and reading with these 10 must-have counting books. Counting books can help your child learn about numbers while boosting literacy skills; however, a good counting book isn't just a combination of illustrations and numbers. Good ones have stories, draw readers in, and make them want to read the book over and over again. These 10 books are all great examples of how numbers and words can combine to make a great book.
- Anno's Counting Book, by Mitsumasa Anno, is a text-free book that naturally inspires readers to count and create stories about the numbers they find. Numbers are displayed on each page and readers can play detective trying to figure them out.
- My Granny Went to Market, by Stella Blackstone, is a great book that adds a multicultural spin on a counting book.
- Doggies, by Sandra Boynton, is such a fun book you will forget you are counting as you bark along with all the dogs. Toddlers adore it.
- The Very Hungry Caterpillar, by Eric Carle, gives readers a chance to count all the things that caterpillar ate. In addition to that, it teaches about nutrition and, of course, the lifecycle of a butterfly.
- Ten Black Dots, by Donald Crews, promotes counting as well as creativity in this deceptively simple book.
- On the Launch Pad: A Counting Book About Rockets, by Michael Dahl, has a fun space theme along with multiple ways to represent each number on every page.
- Fish Eyes: A Book You Can Count On, by Lois Ehlert, combines bright colors, cool cut-outs, and the power of anticipation to keep kids reading and counting from cover to cover.
- Ten Little Ladybugs, by Melanie Gerth, is an interactive counting book that lets children explore textures and touch the ladybugs as they count them.
- Zin! Zin! Zin! A Violin, by Lloyd Moss, has great illustrations and an incredible rhyming text that teaches readers about musical instruments as well as counting.
- One, by Kathryn Otoshi, proves that a counting book can be filled with a great lesson about bullying as well as a lesson about numbers.
Does your child have a favorite counting book? Share the title with us on the Scholastic Parents Facebook page.


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customer service phone i like talking to people not email
on 2017-05-04 at 10:53:59 AM 5/5
Best price I have found.
on 2017-04-23 at 09:16:22 PM 5/5
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Financial Planning News
Fri, 2 Aug 2013
Read the rest of this article on Financial Planning News
Related Topics:
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Not crushing on IPOs, Facebook's virtual strategy, a setback for Citi , and more.
With lower expected equity returns for the remainder of the year but the thirst for yield still prevalent, investors should consider dollar-cost averaging in and out of positions, says Sage Advisory's Anthony Parish.
©2017 Morningstar Advisor. All right reserved.


text: Hi, I have just bought a 2007 Sierra 2500HD Classic Diesel. According to the manual there are 2 positions for the turn signals, first will cause the signals to flash 3 times (6 times in tow mode) for lane changes and the second position latches on for continuous flashing for making a turn. I haven't been able to get the lane change to signal 3 / 6 times automatically, it will only flash while I hold it against the spring. Does anyone with the classic know whether the auto lane change really is fitted? wooly


text:
Republican candidates for the presidency have spent the past several months blasting President Obama for coddling the Iranian government and promised if they became president they would…… ? Secretary of State Hillary Clinton has led the campaign of isolating Iran from the world economic community by imposing sanctions. Latest sanctions punish banks which provide any form of financial aid not only to Iran but to any company which trades with Iran. The impact of this has been devastating to the Iranian government's ability to purchase goods or sell its oil.
Saees Jlili, a spokesperson for the Iranian government announced that his government is ready to talk-and negotiate. "We formally declare an intent to return to the full path of dialogue for cooperation." Their economy is hurt and Iran must cooperate or face even worse consequences to its ability for function in the modern world. I await Newt Gingrich, the great authority on foreign affairs, to explain how the Obama administration efforts have proved successful.


text:
Lowered M3 with Tein S springs, will it align without camber kit?
Do i need a camber kit with the drop that these springs provided? Or will the factory adjustments be enough to line me up?
I would install a camber kit. The factory adjustment is very limited, and another factor is how big of a wheel/tire combo you're running. You can get it close to specs, but the closer the better.
Good Luck!
I'm on H&R race (for e46 with sport package) and my car aligned fine.
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The SCILL Center has announced one of its proudest accomplishments to date: Director Jerry Gurrado said that 10 of the 10 students that enrolled in the adult welding class have received their American Welding Society certificates. While the national average is somewhere between 47 and 52 percent, Gurrado said the center is currently boasting a 100 percent average of those who completed the course and went on to receive their certification.
Gurrado said the SCILL Center will soon be starting its second batch of welding students in the adult welding class, with 13 current students enrolled. At the beginning of the last course, Gurrado said 12 people signed up; however, one of them dropped out of the class after the first week and one passed away before being able to complete the course. The ones who did complete the course, however, went on to receive their certifications.
"The good part is that we feel so blessed that this happened, and that was the purpose behind it, was to give some folks the opportunities to get good-paying jobs with some benefits and be able to take care of their families. A number of these folks didn't have jobs at all, so when I hear remarks like, 'Well, nobody really wants to work,' there are a lot of folks out there that want to work very very badly. And there are jobs out there you just have to be trained for them, so we're trying to be the matchmaker, for lack of a better term, and our board is committed to it, the foundation is committed to it," Gurrado said.
There are a variety of welding certifications available, and Gurrado said two of the students received three certifications, five of them earned two certifications, and the rest earned one. Gurrado said the credit goes to Andrew Odle, the head of the welding program, and he said they're blessed to have such a qualified welder and wonderful instructor to lead the students.


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Proven techniques and best practices for troubleshooting SQL Server 2012
This book is packed with expert advice and real-world examples, showing you how to troubleshoot SQL Server 2012 based on a thorough understanding of SQL Server and Windows internals. It shows how to master the use of specific troubleshooting tools, and how to interpret their output to quickly identify and resolve any performance issue?on any server running SQL Server.
Professional SQL Server 2012 Internals and Troubleshooting:
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View Rob Farley's full profile page.
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Broke the Longest Kill Streak record![ Edited ]
I've broken Tactician109's previous longest kill streak without a death record. I actually had a previous attempt to it as well but that ended at 35-0. This one went up to 37-0, thereby breaking the 36-0 by just 1 kill.
Previous attempt :-
I don't know if anyone else has broken the records or done much better than this earlier but I was very happy with this match and result. It was a totally legit match created in public match making, no PSN buddy in my team nor the opposing team.
If people are interested I can upload the match as my next commentary video. The proof for this one is here :-
Edit 1 : Btw I must add that this was actually a tournament ticket activated match. I ended up getting 4800 points from just 1 ticket.
Edit 2 : VIDEO IS UP!!!
Last of Us gameplay, Hunting Rifles Headshots , Custom created Game mode videos and MOAR!
Re: Broke the Longest Kill Streak record![ Edited ]
who were you shooting at?? nothing's there, lol.. congrats!! but were they noobs or something
EDIT: just saw the scoreboard, split screeners and a noob
I dont always play, but when I do. I play for hours.


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Here's Kevin Edson, The Guy Behind the Bomb Hoax
Hours after Tuesday's commemoration of the one-year anniversary of the twin bombings that killed three people and wounded dozens of others, police say an officer stopped a man acting suspiciously near the race finish line.
Kevin Edson allegedly told the officer that a rice cooker was in his backpack.
As a precaution, authorities blew up the backpack and another one found nearby.
DEADSPIN did some research on this guy who claims this was "performance art".
Check out their coverage HERE.
Image via Facebook/Deadspin. Info via Associated Press and NewsRadio 920 WHJJ.


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Q&A: Markus Winkelhock on the Rolex 24 Hours & Running out of Fuel on Last Lap
by George Achorn on 30 January 2013 in Motorsport
- 2013 Rolex 24 Hours of Daytona
- Daytona
- Markus Winkelhock
- Tudor United SportsCar Championship
When thinking about the 2013 Daytona 24 Hours in the future, what will stick in your memory?
Looking at the finish straight, because that's what was right in front of my eyes when I coasted with an empty fuel tank on the last lap. That was definitely bitter after such a hard battle for success for 24 hours.
On the whole, it was an emotional roller-coaster for you…
That's right. After the time penalty at night, which cost us two laps, we battled to make up ground again and took the lead. Then, in the last hour, I had to make sparing use of my fuel. We knew that it would be incredibly tight. The others came up from behind, so I had to step on the gas pedal again and still save fuel. That really wasn't easy but we almost made it – running out of fuel only 200 meters before the finish line was obviously painful. But it was still a great race and a cool experience for me. It was fun for me and the guys from the team anyway. I hope that next year we'll be able to strike back and complete the 200 meters that were lacking today.
What was going on in your mind at that moment?
Well, I knew that it would be a tight situation. My display was already showing "fuel alarm" on the last two laps, so I was expecting it in a way. But when the first misses actually started on the last lap I couldn't help but think: "This can't be true now!"
After qualifying, would you have expected such a big success for Audi?
Honestly speaking: no. But it was like it had often been the case in the past: We thought that it would be hard. But across the distance the Audi R8 was very, very good again. The R8 has meanwhile become an almost unbeatable endurance car that has won all the major endurance races that exist. But it was also a superb performance by all the teams, mechanics, drivers and everyone who was involved in this project. The entire team performance was right on the mark.
In which areas did the R8 GRAND-AM have its strengths at Daytona?
Things went really well across the distance and there was relatively little tire degradation. The car was consistently fast everywhere. The speed deficit we had in qualifying wasn't quite as large in the race. Still, we lost a tiny bit on the straight. That made overtaking difficult for us. With a little bit more power I wouldn't have had to stay behind a Ferrari here and there quite as long in traffic. But the car felt fantastic nonetheless: at night in cooler conditions just like in the heat – it was really good fun.
Will it be possible now to battle for victories with the R8 in the GRAND-AM at other races too?
I think that at Daytona we proved that the R8 GRAND-AM is capable of winning. I'm sure this will not have been the last GRAND-AM victory this year.


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A Sizzling Stay Under the High Desert Sun
Ayres Hotel & Spa Moreno Valley • Moreno Valley, CA
Escape Kit
- A One-Night Stay for Two in an Upgraded King or Two-Queen Studio Suite
- One-Hour Couples' Massage at Aura at Ayres Day Spa
- $10 Credit at Anza Lounge
- Bottle of Sparkling Wine
A couples' massage and bottle of wine make this boutique hotel stay perfect for an ultra-romantic retreat.
The Destination
Nestled between two Southern California locales—the beach and the mountains—the city of Moreno Valley is a place poised for adventurous decisions. The world-renowned coasts of Laguna, Huntington, and Newport are an hour west, should you choose to spend the day on the shore. Or, head an hour to the east, where the beauty of Big Bear Lake and the charm of Palm Springs await visitors seeking something off the beaten path. Stick within city limits and Moreno Valley's suburban setting will welcome you with a burgeoning arts scene, golf courses, and shopping.
The Digs
With décor awash in rich red and gold shades that match the sunset's tones behind the Box Springs Mountains in the distance, Ayres Hotel & Spa Moreno Valley truly complements its surroundings. Here, your copper-hued guest room includes a 32-inch flat-screen television and complimentary Wi-Fi to be enjoyed from the comfort of the suite's pillow-top mattress. The deluxe amenities also include a refrigerator, coffeemaker, and microwave for post-spa treats and late-night snacks.
The Diversions
Indulge in an intimate couples' massage at the Aura at Ayres Day Spa before enjoying a quiet moment in the solar-heated pool. Watch the sunset from the courtyard's stone fireplace, sip a cocktail in the Anza Lounge, or stay secluded in your suite with this Escape's included bottle of sparkling wine. Whatever you decide to do, this Inland Empire boutique hotel is the go-to place for a romantic weekend away from it all.
"SoCal is where those cinematic fantasies really can come true... Escape to the cooler alpine climes of Big Bear Lake or turn up the heat in SoCal's deserts with a getaway to retro-modern Palm Springs."-- Lonely Planet
escapes 30-day promise
LivingSocial gives you up to 30 days to return your unused voucher for a full refund. Once you've made a reservation, you are subject to the merchant's cancellation and refund policy. If you want to secure your preferred dates of travel, we strongly recommend that you complete reservation with the merchant within 30 days of your purchase—after that, LivingSocial will not issue any refunds.
the fine print
- Limit 2 per customer, additional as gifts; vouchers may not be combined to extend stay
- Only valid for stays now - September 30, 2014
- Reservations required and subject to availability
- Not valid toward existing or room block reservations
- Voucher includes one-hour couples' massage at Aura at Ayres Day Spa, one bottle of sparkling wine, and $10 credit at Anza Lounge
- Nights must be spent consecutively; all inclusions must be redeemed during one stay
- Voucher valid for 2 guests
- Merchant cancellation/re-scheduling policy of 72 hours in advance of scheduled arrival; voucher subject to forfeiture
- Taxes/resort fee not included; payable directly to the property
- Incidental charges, charges for additional services and gratuity at the property are not included
- Blackout date(s): February 14-16, 2014; April 22, 2014; May 9-11, 2014; June 13-15, 2014; July 4-5, 2014
- Other conditions apply • PAID AND PROMOTIONAL VALUES EXPIRES ON September 30, 2014 • PAID VALUE DOES NOT EXPIRE • PAID VALUE EXPIRES ON September 30, 2019 • PROMOTIONAL VALUE EXPIRES ON September 30, 2014 • Enjoy By September 30, 2014
Other conditions apply
Except where noted in the fine print:
• Cannot be combined with any other offer or promotion
• Tax and gratuity are not included
• Merchant is responsible for the quality of the products or services provided to you at redemption
• LivingSocial Terms and Conditions - https://www.livingsocial.com/terms
Original Price:
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text:
Made with:
- My Own Project
- Sublime Stitching Book Patterns
Get patterns and textiles here
Made by: Cydni Perkins, Seattle
About My Project:
This is an embroidered apron I made for my mom. I used the fan dancer picture from Embroidered Effects, along with bits and pieces from other sublime stitching designs for the "frame." I know my mom is going to love it.


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Dharun Ravi and Me
Ideally, those who have suffered unfairly develop a strong sense of compassion and justice. I like to think that happened in my case — but not right away. I arrived at my college determined never to be an underdog again, no matter what it took, and with the underlying conviction that most people would hurt you if they could. I planned to be as tough as necessary. I quickly developed a reputation as a sharp wit.
As noted here two or a hundred times, my childhood was not one of unadulterated bliss. My father was an alcoholic who could turn brutal when drunk, and my mother complained to anyone who would listen about the unfairness of being stuck with a boring bookworm for a daughter. She openly preferred several of her friends' daughters who were around my age, inviting them to shop and gossip with her and pointing out to me their superiority in looks, personality, and a general sense of fun. She told me that my friends didn't (couldn't) actually like me but must be using me to copy my homework/swim in our pool/meet my brother or, in the case of camp friends, visit New York.
We were a middle income family in a very affluent and prestige-conscious suburban community. My parents refused to buy new clothes for me starting in the seventh grade and canceled my allowance in high school; I had to buy what I needed with babysitting earnings until I reached 16 and was able to wait on my classmates in an ice cream parlor and then a convenience store. So in addition to being demoralized, I looked low-rent. Sharks can always smell blood in the water, and I was shunned and bullied by many of my classmates. I lived for the day I could escape to college.
Ideally, those who have suffered unfairly develop a strong sense of compassion and justice. I like to think that happened in my case — but not right away. I arrived at my college determined never to be an underdog again, no matter what it took, and with the underlying conviction that most people would hurt you if they could. I planned to be as tough as necessary. I quickly developed a reputation as a sharp wit.
I took an instant dislike to my roommate, based solely on her large wardrobe of nice clothes and the fact that my mother tried to bond with her as we unpacked. Over the next few weeks I perfected a cruel imitation of her way of walking and talking (i.e., a parody of a pretty young Southern woman, which is what she was) with which I entertained hall mates, sometimes in her hearing. I also short-sheeted her bed and hid her notebooks.
I like to think I would never have turned a webcam on her in the midst of a private act, even if the technology had been available, but the fact is, I'll never know. The movie MASH came out the year I graduated from high school, and we all thought the scene where Donald Sutherland and Elliott Gould wire the camp PA system to broadcast Sally Kellerman and Robert Duvall having illicit sex was hilarious.
For my first-year roommate and me, everything changed within a few months. She confronted me in a reasonable and humane way, and I realized I was acting like an idiot. She has a forgiving nature, and so we became, and have remained, friends. I was lucky. I had a wonderful college experience and emerged, I think, a much deeper, kinder and wiser individual.
Dharun Ravi is currently on trial for invasion of privacy, bias intimidation and other charges in connection with having watched, via webcam, and tweeted about a sexually charged embrace between his roommate, Tyler Clementi, and another man in the dorm room he and Clementi shared. He also may have tried to arrange a failed "viewing party" for a second sexual encounter. He is not being tried for Clementi's subsequent suicide, but that is of course in the background. He could serve ten years in prison, and the shame and notoriety may follow him for the rest of his life.
When I have expressed concern and compassion for Ravi and for Molly Wei, his friend and conspirator who took a plea deal, I've been misunderstood to mean that I don't think what they did was a big deal, or that there should not be consequences for their actions. What they did was contemptible and they are accountable.
But these were three eighteen-year-olds, works in progress, and struggling through their first few weeks in a strange environment. I wish they had all had more time to grow into the deeper, wiser and, in some cases, kinder adults they may have been capable of becoming.
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A very special place to get married!
We have over 30-years experience in planning and managing weddings at this Hertfordshire wedding venue. We use this expertise to provide you with a bespoke service and ensure an unforgettable day.
As well as your reception and party, you can also hold your civil ceremony at Redcoats.
So, whether you wish for an intimate dinner or a full day marquee event with exclusive use of the house and gardens, Redcoats could be the place for you.
The house and gardens are a stunning backdrop for your photographs, during which our staff can serve your guests with drinks and delicious home-made canapés.
We can seat up to 60 guests in our Conservatory and we have recently re-designed the lawn area adjacent to the conservatory and increased the size of the patio. This now allows us to have a 100+ guest marquee with direct covered access to and from the conservatory and combines the benefits of a larger party with yet better access to the garden and to the house.
Registered for civil wedding ceremonies
We can accommodate up to 80 guests for your ceremony in the largest of our three designated rooms:
The Conservatory – can hold up to 80 guests for the ceremony (60 seated + 20 standing)
The Victorian Room – can seat up to 25 people
The Oak Room – can seat up to 15 people
The ceremony is conducted by the local registrar. The Stevenage register office has to be contacted prior to finalising your date, details below.
The Register Office, Danesgate, Stevenage, Herts, SG1 1WW
Tel No: 01438 316579
Picturesque Setting for a Marquee
If you are planning to invite more than 100 guests and do not wish to spread your party across more than one room, the solution is a marquee on the lawn.
Whilst we understand this is an additional cost, holding your wedding in our beautiful garden is truly wonderful. Your table decorations, flower arrangements and other personal touches will be perfectly complimented by the white drapes, bunting and 'starlit' ceiling above the dance floor.
The additional space afforded by a marquee also gives you the opportunity to invite a few more guests along to the evening reception. Adding in a live band and even a fireworks display will ensure that your reception is the event of the year.
Old Barn
Very exciting news!
A plan has been submitted to buy and convert the barn next to Redcoats Farmhouse, in order to turn it into a beautiful purpose-built wedding and events venue. We also intend to increase the total number of bedrooms as well as refurbish some of the existing bedrooms.
The completion date has not been set yet, however we are hoping to welcome our first guests in the Spring / Summer of 2018.
Prices and availability will be released as soon as possible.
The Wedding Breakfast
Our team of chefs is well known for producing fantastic food all year round – weddings are no exception.
Come and talk to us as we will design a menu to suit you and your guests (and really get their taste-buds tingling!). If a set menu is not for you, we can offer a full gourmet buffet for your guests to choose from.
In this scenario your guests will all be seated and have their starter and a choice of puddings served to them at the table. They would be a selection of hot and cold dishes from which your guests would choose their main course.
We are here to help
We appreciate how much there is to do when organising a wedding but we are here to help!
In addition to the ceremony, reception and food & drinks, we can also help you with many other aspects of your day including:
Hotel accommodation including our stunning honeymoon suite
Wedding cake
Flower arrangements and balloons
Live music / DJ
Photographer and/or videographer
So, come in for an informal chat over a cup of tea or coffee, take a look around the house and gardens and tell us all about your BIG DAY. We will then put a package together for you, with an initial cost estimate and even hold the date for you while you decide.
Please note that we will be changing our brochure and updating our prices soon
in order to incorporate the new barn!


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In our bracket to determine your Public Enemy No. 1, it's down to two men who are forever linked in Dallas/Fort Worth sports history.
Fan voting has matched up Alex Rodriguez against the man who signed off on what was then the biggest contract in baseball history, Tom Hicks.
Rodriguez put up big numbers in Texas, but the Rangers finished in last place every year he was here. After being dealt to the Yankees, he took a shot at the "24 kids" he was forced to play with in Texas.
Hicks' ownership of the Rangers and Stars wound up in bankruptcy for both teams.
There are many reasons for fans to dislike both men. But only one will garner the title of Public Enemy No. 1. And it's up to you to make that choice.
Vote here and join the discussion here.