text:
Town Square
Older Homeowners and Local Property Taxes
Original post made by stephen levy, University South, on Apr 9, 2011
But now we have reverse mortgages. I think the older argument no longer has merit for homeowners with substantial equity in homes bought 20 to 40 years ago.
These homeowners CAN access the cash value in their equity through a reverse mortgage.
I see no reason to give a break to homeowners who are both relatively affluent and sitting in a home worth 5 to 10 times what their original purchase price. We owned such a home in Palo Alto before we moved downtown.
Similarly, I see no reason to give tax breaks to affluent seniors like the ability to opt out of parcel taxes though, fortunately, many Palo Altans voluntarily pay these taxes.
This generational inequity will only get worse as more baby boomers retire and we have to fund services for children--who will determine our future--services that are currently under great stress.
If older residents are in difficult financial circumstances, I can, perhaps, see some merit in age-based tax breaks but not for more affluent older residents. We should be paying our fair share.
And soliciting the votes of older residents for taxes while telling them they don't have to pay or they won't pay much because they have Prop 13 protected assessed values doesn't seem quite fair either.
Comments (65)
a resident of Atherton
on Apr 9, 2011 at 1:58 pm
As usual Levy is absolutely correct. Why should I pay less than 10% of the property taxes that my neighbors pay when we are all receiving the same public services.
Unfortunately the biggest, and unintended, beneficiaries of Prop 13 are businesses - whose property seldom changes hands, and therefore is almost always appraised well below market value, have so much to lose that they will do whatever is necessary to preserve Prop 13.
Why someone doesn't file an unequal protection lawsuit on Prop 13 I don't know.
a resident of Adobe-Meadow
on Apr 9, 2011 at 2:47 pm
How about letting business property taxes float with the market, but keep the caps on homeowner taxes?
Reverse mortgages may work for the elderly, but they are not the only ones caught in this trap. Very common for people in their 40s or 50s to have their homes appreciate 5X since they bought them. Not all of them can afford 5X of the property tax, especially if they are raising families. Are reverse mortgages available and practical for this age group?
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Apr 9, 2011 at 2:48 pm
There goes Steve Levy, again! Tax the rich! Why is it that we never hear him saying, "Stop spending!"?
Palo Alto has a huge backlog of infrastructure requirements. Do we ever hear Steve Levy say, "Stop the $Millions of subsidy to PACT? Stop the BMR subsidy? Stop the "New Urbanism"? Stop the local "green" agenda? Stop the craziness of the 20 kids/class, K-3? Stop the the absurd cadillac retirement plans of the public unions and non-unionized public employees, which control this city?
[Portion removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]
Keynesianism and Marxism are as dead as the Dodo bird, yet Steve persists....
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Apr 9, 2011 at 4:39 pm
Here again I'm the bad guy because I bought a home twenty years ago. As it is we are wondering how we are going to afford our property taxes when we retire. We don't get pensions, it's 401K and savings and some Social Security. We do everything ourselves, fix as much on our house as we can, garden (no help), you name it, we do what we can to save money. So the seniors who spent their money (however) will get a break because they qualify under Levy's generous proposal!
a resident of Santa Rita (Los Altos)
on Apr 9, 2011 at 4:42 pm
"Why someone doesn't file an unequal protection lawsuit on Prop 13 I don't know."
Someone did in LA quite a while ago. It went all the way to the Supreme Court, and Prop 13 was upheld. That was a residential case, but I doubt one related to commercial property would have a different outcome.
The only way to change Prop 13 is via another proposition.
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 9, 2011 at 5:44 pm
Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.
There is, of course, an alternative - hold permissible spending increases to the same standard as permissible tax increases. This way, everyone's tax would be the same.
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Apr 9, 2011 at 6:10 pm
The worst problem is with the benefits that a public employee has. Either a City employee, a state Employee, or a Federal Employee have so much benefits, while the rest of us have the only the 401K and nothing else. When we retire we better have the 401k to last another 30 years otherwise street homeless.
a resident of another community
on Apr 9, 2011 at 6:14 pm
Steven's idea is without merit. His is an opinion based on pluralism. There are so many reasons not to add taxes to senior citizens. I would place fixed income at the top.
a resident of Los Altos
on Apr 9, 2011 at 7:30 pm
Steven Levy wrote "... CAN access the cash value in their equity through a reverse mortgage".
OK, I'll bite. Who underwrites reverse mortgages today? None of the top 5 banks do. My contact at Merrill Lynch informed me reverse mortgage products are a thing of the past.
As a retired senior I would welcome a reverse mortgage so I could make needed repairs (new plumbing, new heating ducts, new driveway, etc.) to a home built in 1955 that I purchased in 1966.
And don't reply with "home equity" loans. Those require a reasonable and steady income for debt service.
I would really appreciate an answer based on fact.
a resident of Green Acres
on Apr 9, 2011 at 8:01 pm
@ concernPop13,
You are wrong about Federal Employees. I know because my spouse is one. Guess what? Federal employees hired about some time in the late 80s have to do with their 401k just like you. My spouse was hired by the Federal Government in 1989 and has to save up money in a 401K in order to retire. There are 2 kinds of federal employees. Those on the old system who have a full pension, and people like my spouse who have to make do with social security, a tiny sliver of pension, and mostly with a 401K.
So please don't throw us into the same pot as local and state employees who do have their gold plated retirement plans. Younger federal employees don't.
a resident of Los Altos
on Apr 9, 2011 at 8:08 pm
Re: reverse mortgages, some web searching revealed a 3-part series in the San Francisco Chronicle last year which seemed encouraging. However, no bank or other institution I've contacted is writing reverse mortgages at present.
The URLs to each part of the 3-part Chronicle series follows:
Sept. 23, 2010: Web Link
October 3, 2010: Web Link
Nov. 21, 2010: Web Link
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Apr 9, 2011 at 8:21 pm
ok, I did not know that all Federal Employees are now like the rest of us private Employees. It is a good time to modify the State level and City level to cut those fat pensions, No co-pay and complete Health Benefits, and give them all 401K just like the rest of us. No need to increase tax, and as a mater of fact there will be a major surplus that we never see before in the History of this Country.
a resident of Crescent Park
on Apr 9, 2011 at 10:29 pm
The problem isn't prop 13 per se. The problem is there is no cap on the tax regardless of how much the property price rises.
Rather then basing property tax on the actual value of the property, there should be bands and some discussion about how much the city needs and the citizens are willing to pay.
Always taxing the max "because they can" is what led to the state requiring prop 13 in the first place.
a resident of Duveneck School
on Apr 10, 2011 at 12:00 am
Since you want us all to pay our fair share, how about eliminating the mortgage interest deduction? It mostly benefits recent home buyers with no equity in their homes, not those seniors with paid off housing.
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 10, 2011 at 2:14 am
Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.
Still no consideration of living within one's means, huh?
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Apr 10, 2011 at 11:39 am
Steve Levy has never met a tax he didn't endorse. Steve Levy has at the same time never called for cost-controls on government spending, or rigorous audits of government operations--to ensure that the money assigned to government (actually taken these days) is well spent, and that there is no fraud in the programs funded by government.
Only about 50% of Americans actually pay income taxes, and only about 50% of Californians actually pay property taxes (directly). Maybe it's time to pass an "occupancy tax" for the 50% who don't pay property taxes directly--so that they can "pay their fair share" too.
We are way past time to downsize government, at every level. We don't need more taxes, we need more rethinking of the role of government, and the reduction of government to providing essential services only.
a resident of University South
on Apr 10, 2011 at 4:05 pm
stephen levy is a registered user.
It is interesting that some posters responded to the blog as a tax increase.
My intent was to raise two equity issues.
There has been a longstanding concern among many about the negative equity and economic implications of the current property tax system.
Some way to have more long time homeowners have assessments closer to market value would allow tax rates to fall for all property owners--a revenue neutral swap.
But the economic impacts are positive by lowering taxes on new home buyers and new business ventures. Probably many posters who thought this was about raising taxes would favor making it less expensive for new investments.
The same point holds true for offering seniors the option to opt out of parcel taxes. If everyone paid, the tax rate could be lower for all residents. Moreover, this is a funny twist on the revolution cry of "no taxation without representation". This is representation without taxation encouraging people to vote for others to pay a parcel tax, but not themselves if they choose to opt out.
Peter Carpenter understood the post in his first response. I am interested in people responding to whether this is a fairer and better economic approach to raising the same amount of property tax revenue.
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Apr 10, 2011 at 4:22 pm
Steve Levy personifies the old socialist axion, "Give according to ability, take according to need". Steve's new twist is that even if the old folks don't have it, in cash, they should borrow it, then give it to the state, so that Steve and his ilk can spend it on their favorite causes.
a resident of Atherton
on Apr 10, 2011 at 6:12 pm
My question reamins unanswered: Why should I pay less than 10% of the property taxes that my neighbors pay when we are all receiving the same public services?
This is not stealing from the rich and giving to the poor nor is it give according to ability, take according to need.
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Apr 10, 2011 at 6:39 pm
If I bought a gold wedding band in 1978, and there was a state sales tax on that purchase, say 6% at a given gold price, should I be compelled to retroactively pay 10%, if that is the current tax rate, or if that gold is worth more now? Prop 13 held the property tax at current rates and values, when it was enacted, with an inflation factor of 1-2%. What is wrong with that?
If my neighbor wants to sell his/her property, and there is a willing buyer, and that buyer understands the property tax protections of Prop 13, namely that they cannot be extorted into unbridled tax exortion, going forward, what is your problem, Peter?
Every sale of a property in this area generates higher tax revenues, but it is not a piggy bank for the public-sector pigs.
a resident of Atherton
on Apr 10, 2011 at 7:05 pm
Sean asks:"If my neighbor wants to sell his/her property, and there is a willing buyer, and that buyer understands the property tax protections of Prop 13, namely that they cannot be extorted into unbridled tax exortion, going forward, what is your problem, Peter?"
My problem remains that you and your neighbor are receiving the same public services but you are only paying a fraction for those services than is your neighbor.
You don't get any public services or pay any annual taxes for the possession of your gold ring.
a resident of Los Altos
on Apr 10, 2011 at 7:29 pm
Peter Carpenter wrote "My problem remains that you and your neighbor are receiving the same public services but you are only paying a fraction for those services than is your neighbor".
Then, perhaps, property tax is the "wrong" venue for funding such services. Those without property are paying nothing (directly) for such services.
Maybe only businesses should be taxed and that would also bring in monies from the people who are "off the radar".
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Apr 10, 2011 at 7:39 pm
"My problem remains that you and your neighbor are receiving the same public services but you are only paying a fraction for those services than is your neighbor."
But Peter, I do pay. My property taxes never were reduced. They were contained, yet they were always raised at 1-2% per year. Public expenses expanded beyond the property tax take. The problem is the public spending beyond the tax take. It is not my fault that public spending was not controlled. Also, I fail to understand how I benefitted from the overreach of this public largesse. My sidewalks are worse than ever, my streets have many potholes and I rarely ever see a police car in my neighborhood.
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 10, 2011 at 7:50 pm
I agree with Levy - there is a fairness issue that some pay much more than others. In Massachusetts, they did it begter, limiting the amount the town budgets could increase (2.5% - hence Prop 2 1/2), while distributing taxes as always based on assessed value. Towns could vote over-rides if they wish. That prevents the crazy notion that my neighbor pays 10% of the tax I pay for the same services.
There are a number of things severely broken in California, many set by referendum, others by the legislature. We have to dig out of the mess we've made and get back on a sensible track.
a resident of Atherton
on Apr 10, 2011 at 8:00 pm
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
Sean states:"It is not my fault that public spending was not controlled."
WRONG. It is every citizen's fault because every single increase in local public expenditures took place in public sessions which few citizens attended and to which few citizens objected.
a resident of Los Altos
on Apr 10, 2011 at 11:58 pm
Peter Carpenter wrote "every single increase in local public expenditures took place in public sessions which few citizens attended and to which few citizens objected".
Just curious: are public service employee salary and pensions subject to citizen review and approval? Per this Palo Alto Online article dated January 3, 2011, pension costs top Palo Alto's budget woes:
Web Link
This Palo Alto Online article dated March 15, 2011, basically paints a doom and gloom picture for Palo Alto's finances:
Web Link
And as Peter Carpenter wrote in Comments to the above article, "Finally, they need to move the review and approval of new labor agreements out from behind the current wall of secrecy from which the public is excluded", which belies Peter's comment there are public sessions open to the citizenry at which comments can be voiced.
How many other Palo Alto financial dealings are held behind closed doors?
a resident of Greenmeadow
on Apr 11, 2011 at 4:39 am
Yawn....well, Mr. Levy, tell you what. We will raise your taxes commensurate with your home value when you are 65, and expect you to pay them.
Gotta sell your home 'cuz you can't afford the taxes? Oh well, think of the "children".
BTW, all...what would happen to the value of your home if part of the buyer's configuration was to project their tax bill in 40-50 years? Connect some dots here, ...the housing prices would plummet for everyone here, a destroying the value of our homes, and killing off that great "tax increase in the sky" that Prop 13 deniers think will rain on us if we kill Prop 13.
Raise taxes, less tax revenue. Been tried around the world, in our nation, and in our State, many, many times. And every single time there is a rise in any tax, there is a decrease in tax revenue. When will we learn?
a resident of Green Acres
on Apr 11, 2011 at 4:42 am
Peter: If you own a home here in PA, in 40 years you will get the same services you get now, and your new, young, neighbor will be complaining that you "get the same services" he does but pay a lot less.
It is a cycle. And unfortunately the fighting and envy never, ever ends for those who have no historical or futuristic thinking.
a resident of Greater Miranda
on Apr 11, 2011 at 4:46 am
BTW Stephen: The generational stress is going to come from us baby boomers collapsing the next generation in taxes from our greedy ponzi schemes in Medicare and Social Security, and from our greedy massive expansion of borrowing/spending for new silly government programs.
If we really care about the "next generation", we would stop stealing their future from them by fixing right now the entitlement programs we older folks are going to suck up, and we would massively cut back on our spending/stop borrowing against our children's future.
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Apr 11, 2011 at 7:59 am
> Unfortunately the biggest, and unintended, beneficiaries of Prop 13
> are businesses - whose property seldom changes hands, and therefore
> is almost always appraised well below market value, have so much to
> lose that they will do whatever is necessary to preserve Prop 13.
As time passes, this claim becomes less and less true. Since there are no businesses allowed in Atherton, it's even less true there. Here in Palo Alto, if one looks around, one sees very few businesses that were on-going in 1978 when Prop.13 was approved by the voters.
There are a small number of businesses that haven't changed hands, but these don't make up much of the total business tax base. Even large businesses are subject to takeovers, so it's hard to identify many firms operating locally that are over thirty-five years old. Institutional operations, like Ricky's Hyatt have been sold and replaced with housing. The Palo Alto Hyatt has been re-opened under new management, Stanford Shopping Center has changed hands. It's hard to find any stores in downtown Palo Alto that were around in the mid-70s. And even the large apartment buildings are subject to turn-over every so often. It would take a little research, but this same turnover has not doubt been going on in Santa Clara county, and California, as a whole, too.
What's really unfair is that places like Channing House, and Webster Woods, which occupy prime downtown real estate, and in the case of Channing House cater to wealthy, upscale seniors, are tax-exempt. Talk about your "equity" issues, and let's see how many people would be ready to do away with all of those tax-exemptions.
The Santa Clara County Auditor has put on-line all (well almost all) of the property assessment data. This data can be viewed either by parcel number, or by address. If anyone is interested in what a business pays in taxes, that's a good place to start. The Santa Clara Tax Collector has also put on-line all of the tax collection data. This data can be access by parcel number. The identities of property owners is not revealed on the publicly-accessible web-sites, but obviously if the business address is known, then the tax data can be accessed on-line.
We also have to remember that businesses don't really pay taxes--they simply collect taxes from their customers in terms of higher prices for goods and services. While a little hard to prove, some claim that about 25% of the cost of retail goods can be attributed to "corporate taxes".
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Apr 11, 2011 at 9:32 am
> Peter Carpenter wrote "every single increase in local public
> expenditures took place in public sessions which few citizens
> attended and to which few citizens objected".
While this may be true, it's meaningless to the discussion, because until Prop.13 and it's 2/3rds requirement for tax increases became law, governing bodies were under no obligation to listen to any citizens' objections-about taxes, or any other thing--and few ever did listen.
The political process in the US (and California) does not require that candidates tell the truth to their constituencies. (Recently the Stolen Valor Act, which was passed after a candidate for political office claimed to have received the Congressional Medal of Honor was proven to have lied about receiving the Nation's highest Military honor, was overturned by a court action. The Court claimed that political candidates' Constitutionally-protected free speech rights allowed them to lie to voters about "little things", like whether they served in the Military, or having received the Congressional Medal of Honor--when in fact the did not.)
Prop.13 did many things--such as introducing some "equity" into the process of setting taxes. Prop.13 shifted the power to tax from elected officials that rarely showed evidence that they represented "all the people", rather than the special interests that have traditionally dominated "democracy" to the voters (in most cases).
People objecting to Prop.13 need to at lease acknowledge the history of elected Government in California, when tax policy, and practice, are concerned.
or even answer questions put to them. They are not required to post their resumes,
a resident of University South
on Apr 11, 2011 at 11:42 am
stephen levy is a registered user.
Same ol'
You raise some good points but you are also misreading parts of my post ans argument.
One, I am proposing a revenue neutral switch in how property taxes are assessed in order to 1) improve equity and 2) provide more incentive for new business investment. This is a tax increase for some property owners in exchange for lower rates for many others.
Two, you are right that the big dollars re the budget and in generational conflict are in the currently promised benefits to seniors through Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid (where 70%+ of the money goes to nursing home care for poor seniors).
I have another blog on the federal deficit where I do call for reductions in the growth of these spending streams, cut that if put into place today would directly affect me.
a resident of Duveneck/St. Francis
on Apr 11, 2011 at 12:24 pm
You have failed to delve into the pernicious effects of Prop 13 on the schools in basic aid districts, like PAUSD.
Prop 13 permits properties that are assessed far below market value to throw a continuous stream of students into school system through rental properties and multi-generational tax breaks. Why should my neighbor who lives in a second home in Hawaii be able to rent his house to a family with 4 children, yet only pay $2000 in property taxes? Do statistics that quantify the magnitude of this problem exist? What percentage of PAUSD students live in homes that are assessed at less than 10% or 20% of market value?
a resident of Duveneck/St. Francis
on Apr 11, 2011 at 12:40 pm
It is difficult for me to understand why two people should pay differentially for the same service. We bought our house 30 years ago, and are now paying 1/6 of the taxes that our neighbors in similar houses pay. Whether we are more or less able to pay is irrelevant to this point. If I am supposed to be "guaranteed" that my taxes will not increase, how about my utility bills? Shouldn't they also be the same as when I bought the house? Or my insurance rates? Or how about my food? This is not an ideological point: I cannot imagine any contortion of either "left" or "right" wing economics that justifies this. I suspect, however, that the constituency for the current rules is so strong that it can never be changed.
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Apr 11, 2011 at 1:09 pm
"It is difficult for me to understand why two people should pay differentially for the same service. We bought our house 30 years ago, and are now paying 1/6 of the taxes that our neighbors in similar houses pay."
Robert, if you sent your kids to school in Palo Alto 30 years ago, you were paying your fair share, based on your property assesment at the time. After Prop 13, you continued to pay a fair share for later generation kids...your property taxes INCREASED at the rate of about 2% per year. Public spending on schools and city services ahould have been contained to a 2% inflation rate. Instead, our city leaders and school board officials decided to go wild, increasing public spending into the stratosphere, espcially with cadillac pensions. Don't blame Prop 13, blame those city leaders who caved into absurd demands of the public sector employees. After all, those leaders based THEIR decisions on unequal tax sacrifices. The problem is spending, not taxation. What's your beef? I just don't get it!
a resident of Woodside
on Apr 11, 2011 at 1:37 pm
"Here in Palo Alto, if one looks around, one sees very few businesses that were on-going in 1978 when Prop.13 was approved by the voters."
OMG. Are you kidding?!? This isn't about a bagel shop on university. it's about the corporations that own blocks of property.
Who are the biggest landowners in Palo Alto? Take a look. HP? Stanford? What they do not pay dwarfs any residential payments.
Think much of those huge corporate tracts has been reaccessed?
Prop 13's corporate welfare status doesn't really apply to small businesses or residential property.
It's ALL about the big landowners being given massive tax breaks.
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 11, 2011 at 1:52 pm
Around 48% of property taxes goes to the school district, and 8% to the city; the rest goes to the county, community college, and other miscellaneous government entities.
Business owners do not send their kids to Palo Alto schools so it doesn't seem fair to me to raise their property taxes for a service they don't derive any benefit from.
And as some posters have mentioned, our local government entities have not spent our money wisely; for example, in 2006, the Palo Alto City Council enhanced the retirement benefits, which in 2009, added another $7 million in budget costs; and this figure keeps going up as the CalPERS retirement fund has not been able to meet it's return on investment targets.
And have you noticed that as the administrative/management staff has retired from the local government entities, the replacements that are hired are getting higher salaries? Quite a bit different than in the private sector, where many people who do find a job, are finding jobs pay less than pre-recession?
a resident of Woodside
on Apr 11, 2011 at 2:10 pm
common sense: this isn't about business owners, where their kids go to school and corporate taxes, as you deftly pivoted to, but about property taxes and the massive corporate welfare that you and I are subsidizing for the biggest landowners.
"This trend is especially dramatic in counties that both support large industries and have had thriving residential real estate markets recently like Los Angeles and Santa Clara counties. In Los Angels County the share of residential property taxes has shifted from 39 percent of the total in 1975 to 56 percent today. In Santa Clara County, the home to Silicon Valley, the share has gone from 50 percent to almost 70 percent." Web Link
You, I and the rest of the residential owners are now paying a far larger burden than the larger commercial landowners.
From half to almost 3/4. Is that what granny voted for in 1978?
That was never the intention of prop 13.
Close the commercial loopholes in prop 13.
Leave granny alone. Changing the residential part of prop 13, right of wrong, is a non-starter.
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Apr 11, 2011 at 2:17 pm
> Who are the biggest landowners in Palo Alto? Take a look. HP?
> Stanford? What they do not pay dwarfs any residential payments.
Stanford is, in fact, a large land holder. It receives a $4.7B exemption, based on its "educational mission". This exemption was originally written into the State Constitution, but the exemption was moved into state law in the early 1970s. It's a shame that Stanford isn't required to pay taxes, but "that's the law".
Companies that lease land in the Stanford Business Park pay the taxes, based on the time that they leased the property. They also pay "unsecured" property taxes, which are not limited by Prop.13.
Stanford is very aggressive in petitioning the County Assessor in reverting the tax assessment back to zero each time a tenet moves out, since the taxes fall on the owner when not leased to a business.
> Think much of those huge corporate tracts has been reaccessed?
Any company operating in Palo Alto can be researched, in terms of property tax assessments by looking on the SCC Assessor's web site.
> Prop 13's corporate welfare status doesn't really apply to
> small businesses or residential property.
Prop.13 deals with every entity equally. The bulk of the property in SCC is owned by individuals, not corporations. Statewide, there is still significant land in the hands of non-profits, the state government, universities and the federal government--all of which pay no taxes.
> It's ALL about the big landowners being given massive tax breaks.
Wonder if this gibberish is taught in public schools, like the PAUSD and Berkeley?
The SCC Assessor puts out a fairly nice annual report that is full of facts and figures about property taxes here in SCC:
Web Link
It's a shame that this isn't required reading in the public schools.
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Apr 11, 2011 at 2:28 pm
> In Los Angels County the share of residential property taxes has
> shifted from 39 percent of the total in 1975 to 56 percent today.
> In Santa Clara County, the home to Silicon Valley, the share has
> gone from 50 percent to almost 70 percent."
Ah .. this is meaningless unless you look at the actual parcel count, and track the ownership by type. The recent census puts SCC at about 1.7M people (if memory serves). These people have to live somewhere. In the last 30 years, we've seen a lot of new housing, most of it being privately owned. This means that each owner gets a parcel number, and a tax bill. New parcel numbers, new taxes from residential sources, of course pushes up the percentage of taxes paid by residential sources. This, by the way, is a "good thing"--because home ownership is at the essence of the American dream.
Math skills, and basic logic, are sadly lacking in so many people these days.
a resident of Woodside
on Apr 11, 2011 at 3:05 pm
"Math skills, and basic logic, are sadly lacking in so many people these days"
Such as the basics that homeowners taking over 70% of the prop tax burden is the issue, as you stated, UP from 50%.
Commercial, industrial, etc, the big landowners have dropped from 50% to 30%.
From your link: "Historical trend of assessed values in Santa Clara County
The chart compares the contribution by single family and condominium
properties versus other property, such as commercial and industrial properties, to the County's total net assessed value. Since proposition 13 passed in 1978, the contribution of secured assessed value of commercial and industrial properties relative to the total has declined 15 percent, a trend consistent with data from other counties."
In other words, corporate welfare subsidized by residential property owners at their expen$e, to the benefit of corporate property owners.
"It's a shame that this isn't required reading in the public schools."
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 11, 2011 at 8:18 pm
same ol' corporate WELFARE - Residential property owners are not subsidizing businesses; it's the other way around! Business property owners are subsidizng our school systems through the property taxes they pay; they don't have kids in the school system, yet through their property taxes, they are helping to fund your kids education.
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Apr 11, 2011 at 9:14 pm
> In other words, corporate welfare subsidized by residential property
> owners at their expen$e, to the benefit of corporate property
> owners.
This poster has no idea what he is talking about. If he really hates the US approach to life, the door is open. Try life in Zimbabwe, or Somalia, or Cambodia, or Tibet, or any number of countries were there is no "corporate welfare". And then report back in five years or so, and let us know how that's working out for you.
> they [corporations] don't have kids in the school system
While technically true, in fact the employees of corporations do have kids in school. Since the taxpayers (including the customers of corporations who pay prices raises to pay the taxes imposed by every level of government), ultimately the cost of education falls on the taxpayers--many of whom are the employees of corporations (or businesses). BTW.. here in California there is something called the "Allen Act", which allows parents to petition the school district where the parent works to accept his/her children as inter-district transfers. For ADA school districts, this isn't such a big deal, but for Basic Aid school districts (like the PAUSD), these transfers are rarely allowed.
a resident of Woodside
on Apr 11, 2011 at 10:33 pm
And neither of you will address how Prop 13 has shifted the tax burden from commercial to residential as I've posted several times above.
Good deflections though, suggesting I should move to Cambodia. And parents petitioning to change districts. Cambodia, that's great! Hyuk! Wonderful logic in the face of facts.
Let's try again: "In Santa Clara County, the home to Silicon Valley, the (residential) share has gone from 50 percent to almost 70 percent."
Maybe this time, instead of Cambodia, just come out and call me a socialist commie fascist. That works with the tea baggers.
"shifted the tax burden from commercial to residential" = corporate welfare
Eliminate the loopholes. Corporations should pay their fair share, like homeowners do.
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 12, 2011 at 1:10 am
same ol' corporate WELFARE - the share of commerical vs residential property taxes is pretty irrelevant. Going back to 1978, property taxes of agriculture zoned properties were much higher than they were now.
However, as properties were rezoned from agriculture to residential, the property taxes from agriculture zoned properties dropped, and the property taxes from residential properties increased.
We can see the same effect in some of the more recent projects done in Palo Alto, which converted commerical zoned properties to residential. For example, the commerical building at East Meadow Circle was rezoned to residential, and 75 condominiums built. As a commerical property, it was worth a several million dollars, but torn down and rebuilt into 75 condominiums, it's now $70 million. So residential property values went up by $70 million, and commerical went down. Repeat that for the past 30 years, and it's a big factor in why the ratio has changed.
a resident of Woodside
on Apr 12, 2011 at 10:03 am
CS: You think it's irrelevant, which explains a lot, and you give anecdotal stories without any real data.
Agriculture to housing? In Santa Clara Vally, all those orchards went to housing? None of them now have an Intel facility on it? A much higher value manufacturing site or office park?
Sorry, doesn't fly.
Apple's old corporate HQ address was on Mariani, yup, the family name for the orchards. Now a very wealthy landowning corporation. Web Link
The reason that "In Santa Clara County... the (residential) share has gone from 50 percent to almost 70 percent" happened is because of the loopholes written in for big land owning interests to keep from paying their fair share.
Fight it, call it irrelevant, tell me to take it to Cambodia, facts are facts. Prop 13 was put into place to protect Granny.
Granny's getting screwed, corporations are getting an easy ride to the bank.
And our budgets and schools, the very schools that once stood on top of the nation in funding AND performance, the schools that helped build Silicon Vally, are paying for it.
So Granny AND the kids are getting shafted by these loopholes.
As are you, I and any other property taxpayers.
You argue it like you don't own and don't pay taxes.
Or, perhaps, you own quite a bit, and want to keep it this way.
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 12, 2011 at 11:06 am
same ol' corporate WELFARE - in 1978, Santa Clara's population was around 1.2 million; today it's around 1.8 million. So there's been a conversion of non-residential property to residential property of 250,000 housing units over the last 30+ years.
That's been a big contributing factor to the chaning ration between residential & non-residential property values.
You should study the price of property values for commerical vs residential.
a resident of Woodside
on Apr 12, 2011 at 11:47 am
CS: "in 1978, Santa Clara's population was around 1.2 million; today it's around 1.8 million."
Thanks, I'll file that under "duh". Along with the fact that in 1978 there were a few (honest, maybe even more than a few!) tracts of orchards that are now business parks, plants, retail, and lots of rentals owned by large commercial landowners, etc..
It's called Silicon Valley. You may have heard of it. Been in all the papers. Might be a small part of the reason for the population growth. Just maybe.
You keep ignoring the point, so I'll ask directly to see if we can have an honest discussion, or you'll continue to deflect:
Are you denying that corporations, under prop 13, have huge loopholes not available to residential property owners?
That these loopholes have effectively transferred huge parts of the tax burden from business to individual property owners?
a resident of University South
on Apr 12, 2011 at 1:42 pm
stephen levy is a registered user.
My intent was to start a discussion of what I see as an inequity when long-time property owners pay far less in property taxes than new owners.
I know that this has bad impacts in terms of incentives for, say, starting a business.
I should have included long-time non-residentail property owners as well as homeowners.
This can be a revenue neutral swap with new owners paying less and longer-time owners paying more than they do now.
Or it could be crafted to raise revenue but that is a revenue raising debate not a fairness and economic incentive debate, which is what I was interested in hearing about from readers.
I don't think turning this into a fight over whether businesses in general are paying too much or too little is helpful although that subject is a legitimate national and local debate.
Much of the reason why residential owners pay a higher share of property taxes now than they did 30 years ago is about the higher turnovver rates for homes versus other properties.
The argument that the share shift is becasue orchards turned into homes has takes a true point (some orchards did turn into homes) but as other posters have pointed out many "orchards" turned into the large wave of high tech developments that have housed the dramatic economic growth in Silicon Valley since 1978.
Finally, I offer a question and a tease to posters who argue that the rates in 1978 are off limits as part of a grand agreement we made 33 years ago.
Should we then go back to the federal income tax rates of 1978--a maximum of 50% on earned income, 70% on unearned income and 39% on capital gains. If those rates can change in response to changing circumstances, why not the much smaller change in property taxation I suggest to make the system fairer?
a resident of Fairmeadow
on Apr 12, 2011 at 2:01 pm
You fail to address the issue of public sector greed. Public employees, and public causes, have sucked our blood dry. All you seem to want to do is to, somehow, suck the blood from seniors and property owners, in order to feed the public greed.
Please tell us where you want to cut public spending in Palo Alto and in California, Steve. Until you do this, you will have no credibility.
a resident of Woodside
on Apr 12, 2011 at 2:11 pm
SL: "...an inequity when long-time property owners pay far less in property taxes than new owners. ...this has bad impacts in terms of incentives for, say, starting a business."
So called "champions of small businesses" need to look at the disincentive that prop 13 provides for new businesses starting up vs larger or established businesses.
Oh, that's right, I forgot, conservatives only like using "small businesses" as a talking point.
Prop 13 loopholes are corporate welfare that makes it harder for new businesses to compete. Vibrant new businesses that can be at the heart of job creation and a recovering economy.
Provide them a level playing field: end tax loopholes for businesses in prop 13.
a resident of Atherton
on Apr 12, 2011 at 2:27 pm
Try it this way: Tax people who increase the population. The consumers' needs drive the services. Services drive cost. If you are having more children (consumers) charge accordingly.
a resident of Los Altos
on Apr 12, 2011 at 8:08 pm
My apologies for this partially off-topic but I couldn't find any way to initiate a new thread, so I'll keep it short -- it does pertain to money (lots of it, perhaps 100s of billions eventually).
In this San Jose Mercury News article at 7:18PM Tuesday April 12, 2011:
Web Link
is written this great news: "In another swift blow to California's $43 billion high-speed rail plan, federal officials Tuesday stripped all funds for the mega-project this year -- casting more doubt on the bullet train line's extension into the Bay Area and Southern California"
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 12, 2011 at 11:47 pm
You're dead right--it is unfair that long-time property owners are subsidized by newer owners. This amounts to a transfer of wealth from the young to the old and is just one more way in which the boomers are being carried by younger generations. (See for example the new Republican budget, which has "grandfathered" the boomers so that they will enjoy massively subsidized healthcare while their children and grandchildren go without.) Prop 13 is a tax on younger homeowners.
Prop 13 is just stupid--the people who thought it up were angry and not thinking clearly. It is possible to limit property taxes without imposing a special tax on younger homeowners--one could put a lid on overall growth of tax revenues without giving a windfall to those who have owned for a longer period.
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 13, 2011 at 5:44 am
Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.
So why is a 2% annual growth rate not sufficient?
a resident of Atherton
on Apr 13, 2011 at 6:06 am
The aggregate 2% should certainly be sufficient but the way it is apportioned among different tax payers remains manifestly unfair.
Why should I pay less than 10% of the property taxes that my neighbors pay when we are all receiving the same public services.
a resident of Woodside
on Apr 13, 2011 at 10:50 am
"Prop 13 is just stupid--the people who thought it up were angry and not thinking clearly."
No. The way prop 13 was sold to granny in a very effective campaign, and the way we bought it hook line and sinker, was "less than smart".
Stupid? No, it was insanely BRILLIANT for large landowners, with all the loopholes that have the effect of shifting the tax burden from business to residential tax payers.
As each decade goes by, the shift continues.
End the corporate welfare. Close the loopholes.
a resident of another community
on Apr 13, 2011 at 1:24 pm
I'm in my early 30s and Proposition 13 makes it very difficult to participate in home ownership, and I can't help but wonder what life would be like if property taxes were shared equally across the board.
While I do feel the biggest problem with the prop 13 situation is due to the fact that business properties can stay in trusts in perpetuity, it also does NOT SEEM FAIR AT ALL, that private citizens who really benefit from Prop 13 can vote on various measures and bond initiatives that add extra hardship on those who are paying a bundle property tax. Especially wealthy seniors who have no problem paying their property taxes, and pay only drops in the bucket for measures that are passed.
Something has got to give!
a resident of Menlo Park
on Apr 14, 2011 at 2:49 pm
Would you all quit assuming that just because "someone" (me) bought "property" (a condo) 25 years ago, and now as a single and retired (laid off) disabled person, I am considered "wealthy"? What in the world makes you think that just because a person owns "property," they are therefore "wealthy"? I'm so sick of that line. Right now my only income is Social Security and I manage to live on that plus what I was able to save while working until I'm old enough to withdraw from an IRA. I live very carefully, so please stop assuming every property owner is wealthy and should therefore pay higher property taxes. Remember that older people may live alone and can be disabled. Just because they own what they live in does not make them wealthy! That's a bunch of nonsense!
a resident of University South
on Apr 14, 2011 at 3:42 pm
stephen levy is a registered user.
I don't think all long time homeowners are wealthy. That is not the point I was trying to make.
But as Darwin poitned out not all new homewowers are wealthy either and I am arguing for more equity among people living in similarly valued homes and owning similarly valued commerical properties.
It is probably true that if you have owned your home or commerical property for a long time that you have experienced a large increase in value.
If there were some way to incorporate income into the property tax assessment formula I oculd see that being a possbility.
But Peter Carpenter's argument that people living in similar homes shouldn't find one payong five or ten times the property rtax of another simply becasuse they bought more recently (something we want to encourage) is not fair in my opinion.
I would pay more tax under the system I favor.
a resident of Midtown
on Apr 14, 2011 at 4:08 pm
Walter_E_Wallis is a registered user.
Peter, with a 2% increase, we would all be equally taxed. You are buying in to a hell of a lot more than I bought in to. You had your choice. I had mine. Live with it.
a resident of Atherton
on Apr 14, 2011 at 4:19 pm
Peter Carpenter is a registered user.
Walter - I don't understand your logic. Under Prop 13 everyone starts from a different cost base depending on when they bought. I paid less for my house 39 years ago than my new neighbors are paying in property taxes. And I pay a hell of a lot less in property taxes than my neighbors even after the 2% increase per year since Prop 13.
a resident of Charleston Gardens
on May 14, 2011 at 1:36 am
No my dear little babies... we need to take care of these people.. they are so broke they need their Medicare and their hundred $50,000 hit replacements and their scooters and everything else because they just have earned it!! No what we need to do is get rid of all these TEABAGGER pigs and make them pay their own true responsibilities instead of being welfare queens
a resident of Meadow Park
on May 14, 2011 at 4:37 am
Bottom line, think of the results.
You buy a house at 30 years old, and 30 years later you are 60...and the house is worth, if we take averages over the last 40 years, 10 times what it was when you bought it.
So, you folks want to tax 70 year olds on their properties at the same rate at 30 year olds just coming in, who are making 10 times as much?
We bought at 30 years old a property that, now 20 years later, even in this economy, would sell for at least 3 times what we paid. You want to raise our yearly tax from $5,000 to $15,000?
Results: Older folks would have to sell and move, probably out of State or to a much smaller and less expensive area...so, think about it, not only are you forcing out those 50 and older because we hit our peak earning power and are on the downhill side, you will lower the value of all homes because they wouldn't sell for as much from 1) more supply 2) people figuring out what they would be paying in 20-30 years and factoring in the housing costs in 20-30 years...and being willing to pay much less up front for a house.
Net result, lower housing prices all around, less property taxes coming in overall. Along the lines of increasing taxes on employers driving employers out of State, driving out employees, and lowering the amount of actual tax money coming into the State coffers.
Think long term.
Housing prices really took off once folks could count on a fixed tax rate that was predictable, and could put that figure into their long-term payment ability.
Prop13 welfare pigs? Your post is full of hate and envy. I recommend you work on that if you want to be happier.
Everyone's home values would plummet..even more than they are right now.
Of course we older folks pay less than our young neighbors, AND we older folks have already put our kids through schools etc at the current rate at the time.
Like Walter said, it is all about choices. We made ours, leave us alone and make yours.
Think about it.
Think of what would happen.
a resident of Meadow Park
on May 14, 2011 at 4:47 am
Batak, your swipe at the current Repub plan is silly: do you want to simply say no to people who have worked their whole lives for SS and Medicare, and break their social contract?
By the way,the baby boomer generation is the FIRST generation to actually put into the system their whole lives.
SS and Medicare were Ponzi schemes, poorly thought out, poorly executed. We have known for 30 years that they would be in the red by the time boomers hit the rolls, but nobody had the cojones to touch the '3rd rail"..it is time to fix it, but not on the backs of the only generation to pay into it their whole lives. We paid for our parents, we paid for the schools, we paid for the immigrants who brought parents in who had paid nothing, we paid for people who paid nothing, and a lot of people were duped into thinking we were paying for our OWN senior years.
It was all a big lie. I remember many times when the impending doom of our Seniors was boo'd off the table by Democrats who wanted to politicize the issue and not deal with it, turn it into a "big bad Republicans want Seniors to eat dog food and die in the streets" rhetoric.. the last time being Bush's 2 runs for office. No, THEN there was no problem, NOW, suddenly there is?
Think long term folks. The ponzi has to stop, AND we have to honor the commitment to people who were duped into believing the Ponzi, while setting up the younger ones with a system that actually works, while not hemorrhaging them for our own needs.
The same is true for Prop 13. If you want to change it, it needs to be done in a way that does not screw the people who bought homes under one contract, and now the contract changes. No matter how you change it, current homeowners will lose yet more property value, and put yet more of us under water...but, go ahead, be my guest, hurt more folks.
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One more week to vote!
Don't forget to cast your ballot online. Voting ends May 29th. Stay tuned for the results in the July 21st issue of the Palo Alto Weekly.


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Awkward: Jay Carney disparaging Obama's "bitter clingers" remark in 2008
posted at 2:01 pm on September 18, 2012 by Erika Johnsen
There has been much ado about (nothing, cough cough, what?) the mysteriously just-unearthed secret footage of Mitt Romney awhile back telling fundraiser attendees about his views on the 47 percent of Americans already certain to vote for President Obama. But of course, both the Obama campaign and the White House were all-too-quick to seize upon his remarks, trumpeting them as evidence for their 'Mitt Romney is an unfeeling, out-of-touch, secretive, black-hearted, profiteering corporatist'-narrative and arguing that they ostensibly show disdain for average Americans. Wait a tick… déjà vu, anyone?
MSNBC's Chuck Todd wondered as much to the reliably vociferous Obama campaign deputy press secretary Stephanie Cutter this morning, asking if Obama's erstwhile "bitter clingers" comments don't bear any resemblance to Romney's (via RCP):
"Well, Chuck, he was saying the exact opposite of what Mitt Romney was saying. He was talking about how, you know, some people get frustrated by their circumstances and react to that and that we need to bring everybody together and talk to everybody about how we are going to strengthen middle class security. … Mitt Romney was saying the exact opposite. That 47% of the country are never going to vote for him because they don't take personal responsibility for themselves, they consider themselves victims. And that they are never going to vote for him and they are not his concern. So it's the exact opposite."
Uh huh. But, that's not quite what Jay Carney — the current White House press secretary, whose job it is to explain and defend President Obama — argued at the time back in 2008.
It seems that Carney felt so strongly about the issue, he even penned a piece about it — a fact that Bloomberg reporter Hans Nichols wasn't going to let slide in today's press briefing after Carney pontificated about President Obama being "president of all the people."
Oops: I originally had Yahoo! News reporter Olivier Knox as Carney's discomfort-inducing questioner; corrected now!
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subset: commoncrawl


text:
Two Bend women aim for fun -- and protection
Pair learning to shoot guns, part of a growing trend
BEND, Ore. - Bend resident Cindy Van Patten likes teaching women how to safely shoot and handle guns. She's been doing it for years.
And this year, she's noticed something new.
"Just in the last 30 days, I've talked to maybe 50 different people," Van Patten said recently. "It's an off season, I mean, for women to be calling, or people to be calling about hand gun instruction in the winter months and spring, because usually, it's summer."
In Central Oregon and nationwide more women are taking aim.
Gun and ammunition sales spiked after the Sandy Hook school shooting. FBI background checks for weapons hit a record 2.8 million in December.
But national polls show women's interest in guns has been increasing for the last few years.
"I think more gun awareness is just out there these days, and I think especially in Oregon, because you can own a gun fairly easily," Van Patten said.
Speaking of her recent interest in taking gun safety and shooting lessons, Bend resident Debbie Walsh said, "For me, it was actually after I started to notice women friends of mine, realizing how many women actually know how to shoot a gun properly and keep them for self-defense."
A 2011 Gallup poll showed just 13 percent of women reported owning a gun in 2005. That number shot up to 23 percent in 2011.
The growing interest is all across the board. The National Sporting Goods Association reports women's target shooting is up 52 percent in the last decade and hunting is up 42 percent.
Still, protection tops the reason women are arming themselves. Nearly two-thirds of women polled this year by Pew reported buying a gun for protection, compared to 43 percent in 1999.
"I just thought it would be a really smart idea to be able to defend myself," Walsh said.
Van Patten added, "I'm helping to keep them safe, and I also think it's very empowering, I really enjoy helping people to find that within themselves."
Helping women like Walsh have peace of mind on the job. Walsh is a real estate agent.
"When I first got into real estate, I was cornered," Walsh said. "I was in the hallway, and he backed me up against a wall, and out of -- I don't know what happened, probably just an adrenaline, I shoved him to the side and ran out the door and got in my car and left."
When NewsChannel 21 met with Walsh, she was taking her first lesson.
"It feels dangerous, it was like 'Just follow all the rules,' listen to what was being told to you, keep it down, because it's a weapon,"' Walsh said about the first time she held a gun.
"When I finally shot it, it surprised me," she said. "I was kind of a little shaken up when I took that first shot. It's just something I'll have to get used to."
After Walsh fired her first shot, she jumped, backing away and giving the gun to Van Patten.
Another Bend woman, Melissa Andrade, hit the bull's-eye on her very first shot. She is taking lessons as a new hobby.
"I never really did a lot of sports, or anything of that nature, so it's just something that's going to turn out to be fun," Andrade said.
Andrade and Walsh offered different reasons for pulling the trigger, but they're both part of a new trend -- one Van Patten says isn't just a fad.
"Women are saying, 'Hey I can do that -- I can go buy a gun,"' Van Patten said.


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Rovio • Page 3
Angry Birds mobile animation series confirmed by Rovio
Rovio has detailed the long-promised Angry Birds animated series.
Rovio to launch new Swedish studio this year
Rovio's announced it'll open a brand new studio in Sweden later this year. The Angry Birds outfit is looking to hold 20-30 employees at the venue near Stockholm, with a search already underway for a general manager. Rovio also has locations in Tampere, Finland and in Shanghai. Thanks, Gamasutra.
Rovio buys Futuremark Games Studio
Angry Birds creator Rovio has announced its bought fellow Finnish company Futuremark Games Studio.
Angry Birds Space hits 10 million downloads in first three days, confirms Rovio
Angry Birds Space was downloaded 10 million times in its first three days, Rovio has said. It said in a tweet: "10 million Angry Birds Space downloads in less than 3 days! Thanks to our fans, stay tuned for more!" The title launched on iOS, Android, Mac and PC last week, with a Windows Phone […]
Angry Birds Space debuts at no. 1, Rovio "working on" Windows Phone release
Angry Birds Space debuted yesterday, and automatically hit the number one position on the App Store, knocking the super, fun Draw Something off its cushy perch. The latest pig beat 'em up landed on iOS, PC, and Android.
PC demo for Angry Birds Space available for download
A PC demo of Angry Birds Space is now available through GamersHell if you would like to get the game a try before you buy it. It's out today for iOS, Android and PC.
Anti-grav: Angry Birds Space launches all over the shop
Rovio has launched Angry Birds Space. You can get it on iPhone, iPad, Android, PC and Mac from as low as 69p to £5. Get it at its respective links above.
Rovio aims to be "much bigger" than Disney
Rovio has transitioned from casual games developer to a full blown cultural force, and doesn't intend to stop.
Angry Birds Space set for launch with new trailer
Rovio has released the launch trailer for Angry Birds Space which will be available for Android, iOS, PC, and Mac tomorrow, March 22. The title comes with 60 levels, six new characters and superpowers, and gameplay features based on a zero-gravity setting. The game will also be released at retail on April 20 courtesy of […]
Angry Bird Space level unlocked through anti-bullying campaign
Rovio has thrown its weight behind MTV's A Thin Line campaign, which aims to raise awareness of and crack down on cyber bullying.
Rovio: It's up to Sony whether Angry Birds will eventually release on Vita
Rovio's plans for porting Angry Birds Space are just as ambitious as they were with the original, Rovio's chief marketing Peter Vesterbacka has said the firm would like to see Angry Birds Space "on all the screens," but due to limited resources, it focused on Android, iOS, Mac and PC for launch with other platforms […]
Quick Shots: Angry Birds get launched into Space
You've seen the video, you've seen the teasers, and you've heard about the gameplay. All that's really left are some screenshots. We're happy to oblige you. Game's out March 22.
Angry Birds Space: 60 levels, 6 new characters, zero-gravity setting, retail release
Rovio has announced Angry Birds Space will launch with 60 levels, six new characters and superpowers, and gameplay features based on a zero-gravity setting.
Angry Birds Seasons gets Blossom update
Rovio's launching a Cherry Blossoms update for Angry Birds Seasons this week for iOS, Android and Symbian devices. Feature a blossom-filled background from Mt Fuji, It'll have 15 new levels and two additional bonus levels to boot. Thanks, D'Toid.
Rovio aiming to "create a long-lasting, global brand" with Angry Birds
Rovio's intention with Angry Birds is to make it a "long-lasting brand," CEO Peter Vesterbacka has said.
Rovio CEO: Gamers aren't 'walking wallets'
Angry Birds creator Rovio wants to treat its end users as human beings, not infinite cash cows.
Angry Birds Space gets a second teaser, official word coming March 8
Rovio has released a second teaser for Angry Birds in Space, which releases on March 22. An official announcement on the game is expected on March 8.
Rovio announces Angry Birds Space for March 22 release
Rovio has announced Angry Birds Space and has said it will be "the biggest game launch since the original Angry Birds."
Angry Birds now playable on Facebook
Catapult distressed avians at greedy porcine thieves on your social network. Assuming you can't hide your smartphone and Facebook isn't banned in your workplace, this may have made your day and ruined a vital report about plumbing supplies. You can post high scores to your news feeds to irritate your less-skilled friends, and soother their […]
Scandimania: Adventures in Finnish games, part one
VG247 tours Finland's games companies to find discs dead, investment capital flowing like champagne and mobile development everywhere. Patrick Garratt reports.
Rovio latest
Quick Quotes: KISS in talks with Sony, KISS Angry Birds incoming
Rovio: 6.5 million people downloaded Angry Birds on Christmas Day
Angry Birds turns two on December 11, Rovio celebrates by unlocking all levels
Angry Birds hits 500 million downloads in less than two years
Angry Birds hits 30 million DAU, 300 million minutes played every day
Rovio IPO "a year from now," $1.2 billion valuation "a bit north," says CEO
Wednesday Shorts II: Gotham City Impostors, Rovio, SCII, Steam sale
Angry Birds downloaded over 350 million times, 300 million minutes played a day
Report – New round of funding could see Rovio worth $1.2 billion
Rovio has been approached with buyouts, none found suitable as of yet
Wednesday Shorts: Dog fighting, DDO, Madden, God Hand, Angry Birds, Romero, sales
"If I was trying to sell $49 pieces of plastic to people then yes, I'd be worried too," says Rovio


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Please take note that the above (IMO) is the proper way to add dry sugar. Simply laying down newspaper and pouring sugar on top poses the risk of the dry sugar raining down on the cluster and landing on the bottom board or ground if you have open SBB. I like to dampen the sugar in layers of about a 1/2 inch deep. A cheap $1 store spray bottle works nicely.
When was the last time you checked the weight of this hive? This is one of the basic things that new beekeepers needs to make part of their Fall routine. Every opportunity (within reason) you should be checking the weight of the hive. Further, I'd skip the patties at this time of year, particularly if they are very light. You're seeking survival of the cluster not expansion - winter has just started - hold the patties till later (unless we're taking about some Irish whiskey, then toast to the health of your bees).


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I've been shooting for 30+ years, much of it competitively. Over that time, I've owned more than 100 firearms. Presently, I own five Glocks, seven SIGs, Beretta, Kimber, Kahr, S&W, and a few others. The P229 Elite in .40 S&W is the finest firearm I've ever owned. Period.
The trigger is glorious, the SRT is nice (personally, I think the regular SIG reset is good; the SRT is just icing on the cake), and the beavertail in combination with the SRT makes for a fantastic rapid-fire experience. None of my SIG triggers are "stiff", including my 1986-vintage P226. Like all SIGs, they like to be kept lubricated. They're not quite as smooth as butter, but they're close. By comparison, a Glock trigger feels like it has sand in the vasoline, if you know what I mean.


text:
Nielsen: Symphonies 2 & 3 (London Symphony Orchestra, Ode Records)
Sir Colin Davis conducts the London Symphony Orchestra. Our concert halls are not exactly flooded with the music of Carl Nielsen (1865-1931). In fact, the New Zealand Symphony Orchestra's 2007 performance of his Fourth Symphony was the first time the work had featured in its programmes.
Nielsen was born in the same year as Sibelius and the two share a similarly rugged individualism.
Later, Leonard Bernstein suggested that the famous Finn had unjustly dwarfed his Danish counterpart, despite Nielsen's irresistible virtues, ranging from his rough charm and swing, to his constant unpredictability.
Bernstein would have liked this new recording of the London Symphony Orchestra playing Nielsen's Second and Third Symphonies under veteran maestro Sir Colin Davis.
This is the composer at his most approachable - the harrowing inhumanities of the Great War had yet to darken his musical voice.
The 1902 Second Symphony was inspired by a series of folksy paintings in a country inn, which give the work its title, The Four Temperaments. The composer may have guffawed at these images at the time, but later he would crystallise them into four emotionally compelling portraits.
Davis brings off the first movement's vision of the choleric with the same vigour that he championed Berlioz with, in the 1960s. The brooding melancholy of the third movement has a Mahlerian intensity that the conductor has not always achieved with the Austrian composer.
It is impossible, too, in the high-spirited, jaunty march of the Finale, not to remember that the conductor is a countryman of Elgar.
You can hear that almost a decade has passed in the 1911 Third Symphony; the tension of the wild, pounding introduction persists in a surging theme that strains to break free from the shackles of D minor.
The work's title, Sinfonia Espansiva, is a mystery - but one senses a certain geniality here, flowing through to a stirring Finale, in which Davis adroitly tints a sturdy D major with all those unexpected touches that so delighted Bernstein.
Soprano Lucy Hall and baritone Marcus Farnsworth blend wordlessly into an Andante pastorale that searches for more than mere countryside contentment.
Stars: 5/5 stars
Verdict: "Veteran conductor makes a powerful case for more Nielsen in our concerts."


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Freakin awesome!!! your ding something I always wanted to do to the Koto figure.
Freakin awesome!!! your ding something I always wanted to do to the Koto figure.
Wow!!! When I first read the title I was wondering what a better Fett could be, since I've seen some pretty fantastic ones here. This is truly an awesome piece of work!
You have some fantastic talent my friend.
Great job.
I am blown away!
Sometimes the fine detail phase is fun. And sometimes it is NOT.
Tonight, it was definitely NOT fun!
I worked to finalize the final details of Boba Fetts helmet and it was truly a tedious experience.
Using strip styrene, I re-created the raised ridge details at the back of the helmet (which were lost during the cranial enlargement operation I performed three weeks ago).
I carefully measured the required size of the raised ridge and began assembling it off of the helmet. I made 45 degree angled miter cuts at the corners to form the right angles on this raised detail.
Lets just say that when the strips are this small, performing this operation accurately requires more that a few attempts.
When the square ridge detail had fully set, I painted it in the correct dull red.
While I waited for the paint to dry, I painted the rear bottom half of the helmet in dark green.
Using superglue, I carefully attached the assembled, painted ridge to the rear of the helmet.
I next turned my attention to the helmets rangefinder.
I really felt like I needed to correct the rubbery, overly thick rod of the rangefinder into something that was thinner and cleaner.
I actually used a single staple from a grapple gun, straightened it, and attached the rangefinder tip. I was very pleased with its overall slender metallic look once it was attached to the helmet.
Alright, some PM'ed requests have come in for some up to date photos of the custom Boba Fett figure in it's current state. It's also been requested to make the photos a bit less "shadowy" so that all details of the figure are visible.
Well here are some new photos more frontally lit.
Since the last time a full body shot of the figure was taken, I added:
1) The Working Shin Pockets with separate Shin tools (veneers) to get away from the standard production figure's molded look. The pockets have since been made even MORE flush again the figure's shins (they were a bit too bulky before / Now they are correct). NOTE: Looking at these new photos, I am SOOOOO glad that I went to the trouble of creating these pockets and tools veneers. To my eyes they make such a huge difference in the final look of the figure when compared to the molded pocket/shins look.
2) The stalk for the helmet's rangefinder has been made much stronger, straighter, slimmer, and sturdier (with the use of a grapple gun staple)
3) The rear of the helmet has had the ridge details finalized (not visible from these photos).
1) All pieces of armor (crotch, torso plates, backpack mount, collar armor) painted (if needed) and final glue.
2) Fastening straps added to the the backs of armored knee pads, and to the underside of crotch armor.
3) Final gloved hands painted and the raised white details added to the backs of both hands
4) Bicep sleeve cuffs sculpted to both upper arms
5) Power feed tube added to right arm wrist weapon gauntlet.
6) Final decal graphics added to back rocketpack
7) Tiny fastening studs added to collar armor shoulder seams. Aperature drilled into collar armor for side cape fastening.
8) Correct color wookie braids (3 strands) added and bundled with correct red and black bands.
9) Flack vest turtle neck created in fabric to match the rest of the garment.
10) Touch ups on paint rubs on the utility belt and left hand wrist gauntlet weapon.
11) Darkening right shoulder bell into (correct) deep orange (while left shoulder bell stays the current (correct) yellow.
12) Performing silver paint touch ups on steel toe spikes and steel fastening studs on sides on armored knee pads.
13) Lastly, Laser rifle updated into correct configuration to match prop as seen in film.
The only thing that stands out (at least to me) is that the RF stalk seems just a tad too high. If you are happy though it's cool.
Nope. You are ABSOLUTELY CORRECT, Muad'Dib. The RF stalk is a bit too tall (as someone else on another site pointed out) it will be corrected in the next update.
Wow, that is impressive! Fabulous job.
Oh. My. God. This is awesome! :cheers
very nice upgrade for boba
i've been following this thread since it started but i haven't posted until now because words cannot describe how completely in love i am with this figure mod/bash. i'm completely blown away and how awesome you've managed to make this.
Truly outstanding. Amazing work buddy, you have some serious skills.
Wow! Insane work!
Hey DarkLord...
I gotta talk to you about doing an accurate Jodo Kast figure. Your work is amazing!!
That is intense! I've never seen such devotion in an action figure customizer before. I anxiously await the final results.
Any progress? Can't wait to see the finishing touches. :thumbsup
It's only a few more hours until the next update!
Ol' custom Boba is nearly off my work bench now!;);)
I'm really lookin forward to seeing the finished product!
Alright, when last we saw custom Boba Fett, there were a few items that were awaiting attention on my "Still Pending" list. The first item on that list was to make all of Fett's armor its final color.
That task is what I concentrated on this evening. However, as usual, what I estimated to be a quick operation took me all night:
The collar armor, back armor plate (backpack mount), and crotch armor all needed their final paint job to match the torso armor plates (factory-painted at Hasbro).
The collar and back armor pieces needed prep by having the original factory paint carefully sanded off by hand.
Next, I used the Hasbro painted torso armor pieces as color reference to mix the paint for the collar, back, and crotch armor.
Using my Valejo hobby paint set, I was able to mix up a VERY, VERY close duplication of the flat green for Boba's armor.
I loaded up my airbrush and went to work.
Once the newly painted armor pieces were dry, I placed them back onto the figure and checked their final color accuracy under a white light against the Hasbro factory painted torso armor pieces.
I drilled a tiny hole into the back of the collar armor to accommodate Boba's side cape, and cut the fastening lead of the cape into a very fine point. I applied some glue, and then inserted the cape into the hole in the armor.
Another series of photos to check the color accuracy and quality of Boba's new armor paint-job:
I love how this photo demonstrates the preservation of this figure's slender build despite the addition of the soft-goods flak vest and the torso armor pieces.
I can never get over the time, patience and skill that people on forums like this have. That figure is incredible like so many other bashes i have seen, pity they are not made this well to start with, then a shmooh like me could have something that nice.
*** that is freking amazing the work you are doing is on a new level when i read the tital i thort oh wel here we go and each pic my jaw saged lower and lower until it hit the floor then i past out from shear disbaleif then wok up and thort it all a dream , only to look at the screen and there in all its glory was my dream come tru,
Congrats on an amazing wip
Any updates?
This is unbelievable! Fantastic work!!!


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Swedespeed forum member al_bcn has managed to capture a pair of what looks to be Volvo's refreshed-for-2010 C70 convertibles totally undisguised. The topless twosome were caught galavanting around in Barcelona as they were apparently being shot for some sort of commercial.Link
looks good. and i'm happy it doesn't have an offensivly large grill like everyone else is doing...
--------------------I'm working on a scifi-adventure webcomic!
I think it looks sharp, I hope they redesigned the interior...
It looks like a mix of everything with some Swedish fish tossed into it.I see a lot of Malibu for some reason.It's pretty nice though. Volvo is one of the few who can mix masculine and feminine features together together so well (The crown goes to Maserati GT in that regard IMO)
________________________All that I'm after is a life full of laughterAs long as I'm laughin' with youI'm thinkin' bout all that still matters is a love ever afterAfter the life we've been through, yeahKnow there's no life after you
I would think the S60 should look somewhat similar to this, hopefully.
Hopefully they facelift the S40, c30 and V50 the same way.
I like it.
Is this on the same platform as the Focus CC in Europe? I can't remember.
Yes^, But the Focus CC was designed by Pinifinaria.
Looks good. Volvo does need to spread that front end around to the rest of their lineup.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you think government is the problem, wait until you see their solutions.
I love it!!
I already liked the rear, but I thought the front could have been done better, perhaps the best looking in its class? I guess we'll have to wait for some official images...
Looks great, but the C70 was always a looker.
And I'd assume that the S40 and C30 will also get this new front end.


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"Practical views to stop harsh thoughts"
Amazing instruction on how to change detrimental self images. Beautiful live stories of people starting "the work" better then any self help book on self image! Live that she loves Jesus!!
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May is short story month!
Admit it, sometimes you want a good story, but don't have a lot of time, and the thought of starting up that thousand-page tome is daunting. If you're in the mood for a quick fix-try some short fiction!
Science fiction and fantasy readers could easily subsist entirely on short fiction if they so desired. With so many sources of good short fiction available, it's hard Not to read it.
Short fiction collections of stories written by one author, are one option.
A new title I recommend is "Fountain of Age," by Nancy Kress. She has won both Hugo and Nebula awards for two of her stories within this book. I expected greatness, and that's just what I got.
Nancy Kress uses physics-based ideas as a starting point, but more importantly, she tells stories about people. The author brings you into the story and builds on the story arc to a satisfying conclusion. Character development is quick and meaningful, and the characters are relatable. If you like intriguing, well developed themes that will keep you thinking long after you've finished, this book's for you.
Other notable sci-fi/fantasy collections include:
Diving mimes, weeping czars and other unusual suspects by Ken Scholes, The best of Larry Niven, Burning chrome by William Gibson, The collected stories of Philip K. Dick, The Saturn game by Poul Anderson, The golden apples of the sun, I sing the body electric, The illustrated man by Ray Bradbury, Hunt the space-witch! by Robert Silverberg, Sorry please thank you by Charles Yu, The unreal and the real by Ursula K. Le Guin, & Remember why you fear me by Robert Shearman.
If you like variety, sci-fi/fantasy anthologies (collections of stories by a variety of authors) come in an assortment of flavors.
Some great sci-fi/fantasy anthologies include:
Digital domains, Ghosts by gaslight, The mad scientist's guide to world domination, More stories from the Twilight zone, Oz re imagined, Rewired, the post-cyberpunk anthology, Rock on, the greatest hits of science fiction & fantasy, The book of Cthulhu, Circus, fantasy under the big top, Digital domains, The dragon book, Ghosts by gaslight, The Sandman book of dreams, & The new weird.
Find these titles and more in the SF section at WPPL!