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|Topic Review (Newest First)
Temperature changes when you top off or do water changes will depend on the volumes involved (tank and amount of water added) and the temperature difference between them.
I would never add outdoor-cold rain water to any tank, too cold even if i only needed to add a little bit.
I would add room temperature water to a tank, up to about 10% if it was a tropical tank, full water change is OK if the tank was already room temperature.
Best way to deal with this is to have the new water as close as possible to the existing water, within 5 degrees for a 50% water change. That way there is only about 2 degrees or so of temperature change either way. (The substrate holds the temperature too, so the math is right: 5 degrees difference in the new water creates no more than 2 degrees net difference with a 50% water change as long as it is not a bare bottom tank).
I have also used an aquarium heater to maintain the temperature in the garbage can, but I prefer to pay for gas to heat the water than electricity. Cheaper.
If you're going to dump the water in a garbage can, as m00se said, just put a heater in it. That's what I do.
I have the RO unit feeding into a plastic trash can, and a heater to get everything up to temp.
Right now I have 5-5 gallons water containers..
Diana - I like ur idea .. I usually do 50 % water changes every Sunday .. I think if i add my water to a trash container mix it with boiling water would work great.. Ill have that large amount of water with the right temp..
Also u said when u top it off .. maybe I could do water changes twice a week but less quantities of water.. Maybe it'll help prevent the water temp dropping during water changes
What do u think..
Thanks Diana .. Very helpful advice
I use a stainless steel pot on the stove to heat larger quantities of water. I also have a 2 part roasting pan, enameled, and both the lid and the bottom can be used on top of the stove.
I have taken in rain water, (almost RO) and brought it to a boil. Then add the boiling hot water to a garbage can of room temperature rain water. Depends on how warm the tanks, and which garbage can I am filling, it might take 3-4 heatings.
More detail:
Collect rain water via a pump from the tub in the yard to one of my water change prep cans. I have 3: 20 gal, 32 gal and 44 gal.
Use a smaller pump to fill (about 2/3 full) the roast pans on the stove (gas stove). The roast pans are large enough to span 2 burners. Bring the water to a boil, stirring occasionally.
Carry (VERY CAREFUL) the roast pan to the garbage can and dump it in, pan and all. The garbage cans are on wheels, so I can do this in the kitchen then roll it to the tank.
If the water in the can is not hot enough yet, pump more water out of the can and into the roast pans. Repeat until I have enough water, the right temperature, for water changes.
If I am just topping off the tanks I will not bother to heat the water. I bring in the rain water and allow it to come to room temperature, but no need to match the tank temperature when it is that small a volume.
|What kind of container are you holding the RO water in? Is there a reason why you can't drop an aquarium heater into it? *confused*
I'm looking for a better method to warm the water.. I have 72 gallon tank so I change large amounts of water weekly. So I'm trying to find out a better way for doing this.. I will consinder all feedback.. Any new ideas helps..
Thanks for the comments
Originally Posted by nalu86 View Post
Be careful with boiling water in the microwave oven.
I once did a science project for school when I was 15 or so: boiling water in microwave and cooling it down, giving it to a house plant, it killed the plant. I did the same to another plant (same species plant) same water, only not boiled in microwave, this plant did fine. I can't tell for sure the pant died because of the microwaved water, but I'm pretty sure.
Actually, you bring up another potential danger with RO water and microwaves. Seems when water is pure and you super heat it in a microwave (get it above 212F) it can actually boil explosively with the least amount of agitation. I forgot all about that phenomenon.
Watch this!
Be careful with boiling water in the microwave oven.
I once did a science project for school when I was 15 or so: boiling water in microwave and cooling it down, giving it to a house plant, it killed the plant. I did the same to another plant (same species plant) same water, only not boiled in microwave, this plant did fine. I can't tell for sure the pant died because of the microwaved water, but I'm pretty sure.
I use cold water for WC, never had a problem
|RO water is chemically pure. Water is a fantastic solvent and will dissolve anything eventually, which is why it's called the universal solvent. Better that you drop a heater into your RO reservoir to warm it to tank temp than to introduce it to 200F+ temps and risk contaminating it. That's what I used to do anyway.
Boiling R/O water to right temp..
I was wondering how people prepare their water temperature before pooring it in their tanks. When I do my water changes I try avoid water temp dropping.. I ussually put partial water in the microwave to warm it then blend it with room temp water but it takes too long.. I keep water temp @ 82-84 f......
I was wondering if I can BOIL R/O water to expedite this process... Well it affect the R/O water in anyway..
Wat methods do u guys use during ur water changes..
Thanks for u time ..
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The Dying Adam Dispatching Seth to Paradise
Hours of Catherine of Cleves, in Latin
Illuminated by the Master of Catherine of Cleves
Purchased on the Belle da Costa Greene Fund and with the assistance of the Fellows, 1963
Created in Utrecht, The Netherlands, around 1440, the manuscript was taken apart sometime before 1856. Its leaves were shuffled and then rebound into two volumes to make each look more or less complete. The first part was acquired by the duke of Arenberg, whose descendants owned it until 1957, when it was bought by New York dealer H. P. Kraus, who sold it to Alistair Bradley Martin. This volume had been known by scholars as the "Hours of Catherine of Cleves."
Meanwhile, the second part had been acquired by the Rothschild family, who kept their manuscripts secret. In 1963 their volume was sold to the Morgan as yet another "Hours of Catherine of Cleves." Studying the newly acquired book (it became MS M.917) along with the Martin volume, Morgan curator John Plummer determined that they were actually two halves of one and the same codex. In 1964 the Morgan mounted an exhibition of both volumes, displaying all the miniatures via color transparencies. When a facsimile of the manuscript was published by George Braziller in 1966, the exhibition was repeated. Finally, in 1970, the Morgan was able to buy the Martin volume (it became MS M.945), and thus came to own both parts of this greatest of all Dutch manuscripts.
Both volumes have been disbound in preparation for rebinding the leaves in proper order.
The rare Friday Hours of the Compassion of God plus the Mass of the Holy Cross are illustrated with a series of nine images, all of which are exhibited here. (Two introductory large miniatures for the Hours and the Mass are missing.) The iconography of the medieval legend of the True Cross offers an imaginative link—physical and metaphysical—between Adam and Christ and between terrestrial and celestial Paradise. The cycle begins with a remorseful Adam, on his deathbed, sending his third son, Seth, to the Garden of Eden to fetch a branch of the Tree of Mercy.
Hours and Masses for the Seven Days of the Week
The most unusual texts in Catherine's manuscript are the series of Hours and Masses for every day of the week. Medieval Christian tradition associated certain figures or themes with different days. Thus Sunday, the day of the Resurrection, was the Lord's Day; Thursday was connected with the Eucharist since that sacrament was instituted on Holy Thursday; and Monday was the day of the dead, since their torments were suspended on Sunday but recommenced the following day. In Catherine's prayer book, the themes for the Hours and Masses of the seven days of the week are:
|the Trinity
|the Dead
|the Holy Spirit
|All Saints
|the Blessed Sacrament
|the Compassion of God
|the Virgin.
Photography courtesy of Faksimile Verlag Luzern

subset: commoncrawl


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Manitou Springs couple linked to Fremont County robbery
FREMONT COUNTY, Colo. - A couple from Manitou Springs were arrested early Thursday after Fremont County deputies spent all night searching for them.
This all began around 1:15 p.m. Wednesday afternoon when a woman called to report that her home on Van Loo Road had been broken in to.
The Fremont County Sheriff's Office says the victim came home to find a strange man inside her house. The man took off running to a nearby parked car being driven by a woman.
Deputies have identified the man as Raymond Lannigan, 47, and the woman as Kimberly Lannigan, 47, from Manitou Springs.
The victim told investigators that Raymond Lannigan stole guns from her home.
Deputies spotted the Lannigan's getaway vehicle north of Cañon City later in the day Wednesday. They chased them on Garden Park Road for a short time. Deputies say the Lannigans pulled behind a barn, ditched their car, and ran into a heavily wooded creek bed area.
Approximately 50 law enforcements officers with the Fremont County Sheriff's Office, the Cañon City Police Department, the Florence Police Department dog team, and the Colorado State Patrol set up a perimeter and roadblocks to try to keep the couple from getting away again.
"We felt like it was the prudent thing to do not to leave armed suspects," said Sheriff Jim Beicker. "When someone gets on the run and gets desperate that's just a recipe for tragedy and we didn't want that."
A private helicopter was called in to help with the search, and emergency notification calls went out to homes in the area warning people to lock their doors.
The sheriff's office says the Lannigans surrendered to Department of Corrections officers at 5:45 Thursday morning.
Jan Schorg-Forsyth had a bird's-eye view on the hunt for the two suspects in her neighborhood.
"It was very scary," said homeowner Jan Schorg-Forsyth. "There are billions of places to hid, billions. It was scary and we had to keep our windows and doors locked."
The Lannigan's were taken to the Fremont County jail where they are facing charges of first degree burglary, felony theft, possession of a weapon by a previous offender (Raymond), vehicular eluding, criminal mischief, possession of burglary tools and criminal trespass.
Raymond has a criminal history counties around the state. He pleaded guilty to theft in Pueblo County in April 2013. He was charged with theft in Douglas County court. He was charged with substance possession in Arapahoe County for meth. He was charged with theft in El Paso County but he pleaded not guilty on July 8, 2013.
Kimberly Lannigan does not have a court record in Colorado.


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F.E.A.R.™ to strike XBOX 360™ – fall 2006
Critically acclaimed FPS comes to console with new single and multiplayer content.
LOS ANGELES, CA – (May 4th, 2006) – Vivendi Games' today announced that Sierra Entertainment's award-winning F.E.A.R. (First Encounter Assault Recon)™, is currently being developed for the Xbox 360™ gaming and entertainment system and will be unveiled at the forthcoming Electronic Entertainment Expo (E3) in Los Angeles.
F.E.A.R is a paranormal action thriller presented entirely in first person. An unprecedented adrenaline rush of close quarters combat seamlessly melded with the spine-tingling, shocking intensity of the paranormal unknown.
Already a critical and commercial smash on the PC, F.E.A.R. will bring a new level of FPS game play to Xbox 360 with brand new single player content designed to immerse the player deeper in the world of the F.E.A.R. team, as well as brand new multiplayer content created to fully utilize Xbox Live®.
Developed by Day 1 Studios in conjunction with Monolith Productions, F.E.A.R. is an intense first person close-quarters combat experience with rich atmosphere and an engaging, paranormal horror storyline.
F.E.A.R. is planned to ship for Xbox 360 during Fall of 2006.


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forum: Everything else
Pages: 1 | Home » Everything else » Jamies shoes!?
#1 Sun 01 Apr 07 12:57pm
- Member
- Member since Sun 01 Apr 07
Jamies shoes!?
HI Guys,
I'm from germany and i love Jamie Oliver! I also Love his shoes! I wanna know the name of the shoes in the book "Jamies Kitchen". (the white shoes with the three blue stripes)
(http://188.8.131.52/site/img/all/cont … 008035.jpg)
At page number 9 you can see them and on page number 323 you can see them too.
I hope you can help me...
Nice wishes Nadine
#2 Sun 01 Apr 07 6:17pm
- Member Occupation student
- From Germany
- Member since Fri 25 Jun 04
Re: Jamies shoes!?
Hi Nadine,
his shoes are by Adidas but I'm not sure if the model is still available as it is one of the older ones. Maybe try out ebay to get hold of them...Good luck!
#3 Sun 01 Apr 07 6:34pm
- Member
- Member since Sun 01 Apr 07
Re: Jamies shoes!?
Hi Cristiane,
Thank you very much, I hope i will find the rigth model but if anyone know them i would be happy if he/her would post a message!
#4 Mon 02 Apr 07 1:04pm
- Member
- From Jamie's office
- Member since Thu 06 Jul 06
Re: Jamies shoes!?
you never know.. theyre quite classic? i hope you manage to find them!
#5 Mon 02 Apr 07 1:54pm
- Forum champ
- From Switzerland
- Member since Fri 15 Apr 05
Re: Jamies shoes!?
#6 Mon 02 Apr 07 7:12pm
- Forum champ Occupation Study to become a social and healthcare assistent
- From Denmark
- Member since Mon 21 Jun 04
Re: Jamies shoes!?
id go to a shoe shop and ask as it is an old model ...
Pages: 1 | Home » Everything else » Jamies shoes!?


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Good news for U. S. Representative Gabrielle Giffords, she will be moving into a Texas rehabilitation clinic on Friday. This is great new for her husband and parents who are excited about her recovery. CNN reports her parents had long been worried about her safety.
Mark Kelly, Giffords husband and astronaut claims he had many discussions with her about what could occur, before the day of the shooting. There had been many threats against she and other members in Congress. Kelly also says he does not have time to think about the shooter, but just remain positive about his wife's condition. He says she is showing clear signs of recovery, doing things she used to do to reveal her love for him, by touching and playing with his wedding ring.
This is really a clear sign of miracles still occur in the 21st century. U. S. Representative Gabrielle Giffords is showing positive signs, eight days after being shot in the brain says CNN.
In a public release statement, released on Sunday, a spokesperson of University Medical Center in Tuscon said Rep. Giffords is continuing to do well.
Miraculously, Giffords has been off of the ventilator and breathing on her own through a through a tracheotomy tube.
Sen. Kristen Gillibrand who is a friend of Rep. Giffords says she is moving on both sides of her body today.
We just received news that First Lady Michelle Obama just penned a letter to parents across the nation about the tragedy in Tucson that took the lives of 6 victims including a 9 year old girl on Saturday.
It was appropriate that the First Lady take time to address the families of America about what this tragedy as caused in the eyes of young people, children and all Americans. She tries to shed some hope to parents and everyone across America of we can encourage one another.
Ex-Girlfriend Says Jared Loughner Went 'Mad' After Break Up
Jared Loughner had a typical life as a teenager when he met his high school girlfriend in 2004. She, Kelsey Hawkes stated that when they were together in high school, Jared had goals and aspirations until she broke up with him and it seemed as if life was over for him. Plus, below we found another girlfriend, Ashley Figueroa who describes Loughner in a similar bout different fashion.
These are her words about their relationship and how she felt about him:
President Obama Remarks at Tucson Victims Memorial
President Obama actually gave some encouraging and appropriate words at the memorial of all six victims of the Tucson shooting attack. We have provided you with excerpts of the remarks he made at the memorial on Tuesday thanks to AOL News.
Tribute to the Victims
"It's important for us to pause for a moment and make sure that we're talking with each other in a way that heals, not in a way that wounds."
His visit to see Gabrielle Giffords at Hospital
WBC Protest Called Off For Publicity But Exploited Arizona Victims
News has stated that the Westboro Baptist Church that planned to protest the 6 victims of the Arizona shooting on Saturday has called off the protest. Well, its not all because they came to their senses of course but only for an exchange for publicity. What?!
On Tuesday, daughter of founder of WBC Shirley Phelps-Roper has been promised an interview with 102.1 The Edge in Toronto, Canada if they agreed to call off the protest. We found that this is not the first time they have "called a bluff" on a protest. We did some research and found in 2006, Shirley Phelps-Roper called off a similar protest planned for the funerals of Amish schoolgirls who were shot to death in Lancaster, Pennsylvania in exchange for publicity.
Representative Gabrielle Giffords' husband who is an astronaut, Mark Kelly told President Barack Obama the miraculous news, the congresswoman opened her eyes for the very first time since the shooting. As President Obama gave the news at the memorial in Tuscon, the crowd cheered to her recovery. Although, Gifford is still listed in critical condition at the University of Arizona's University Medical Center, this is a clear sign, she is a survivor.
According to CNN news, the president spoke his thoughts at the memorial "She knows we're here, and she knows we love her,and she knows that we will be rooting for her throughout what will be a difficult journey."


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Gibraltar Dam rainfall at record low
Lake Cachuma 25 feet below spill level
SANTA BARBARA COUNTY, Calif. - After an unusually dry winter, current data shows Gibraltar Dam rainfall levels are at a record low.
So far this water year, only 7.9 inches of rain have been recorded. The previous low was in 2006-07 with 9.24 inches of rain. Prior to that, the lowest level on record was in 1923.
Rainfall totals at Gibraltar have been kept for 93 years.
The normal amount of rain at this reservoir is 26.94 inches.
Santa Barbara County Water Agency Manager Matt Naftaly looks at the big picture and says there's no reason to panic. "This is a normal fluctuation," he said.
Lake Cachuma in the Santa Ynez Valley is downstream from Gibraltar, and is the first stop for any runoff when the dam fills and spills. The lake level is also low. It's 25 feet below the gates at Bradbury Dam which releases toward Solvang, Lompoc and eventually the Pacific Ocean.
Sunday's storm that just passed through was weak. Less than a half an inch of rain fell. There's no significant rain in the forecast for the next seven days.
"If we don't get decent runoff next year we would certainly start to implement things we do for drier conditions," said Naftaly.
Underground, the water agency says supplies are solid, with no concerns there. That's a relief for farmers who use that water for irrigation, although they would rather have a few more rain clouds this year.
Overall, Santa Barbara County water levels are 49 percent of normal.


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Lazy pattern match
From HaskellWiki
What does "lazy pattern match" mean and what is the meaning of the tilde in pattern matches?
1 Syntax
These are all lazy pattern matches:
let (a,b) = p
f ~(a,b) = ...
case p of ~(a,b) -> ...
(\ ~(a,b) -> ... )
This seems to be quite arbitrary but this is how it is defined. That is, if you want to match constructors lazily in two levels then you have to write:
let (a, ~(b,c)) = p
f ~(a, ~(b,c)) = ...
case p of ~(a, ~(b,c)) -> ...
(\ ~(a, ~(b,c)) -> ... )
2 Meaning
What is the meaning of a lazy pattern match and why is it required sometimes?
The lazy pattern match on a pair as in
f ~(a,b) = g a b
can be translated to
f p = g (fst p) (snd p)
Generally, a lazy pattern match is translated to calling corresponding record field accessors.
The key difference between strict pattern match
f (a,b) = g a b
and lazy pattern match
f ~(a,b) = g a b
is that the strict pattern match requires to check for the pair constructorbefore
In contrast to that, the lazy pattern match allowsto defer the pair constructor match to the evaluation of
without looking at its argumentsthen
before matching the pair constructor.
This difference can be essential.For example compare the implementation of
with lazy and strict pattern match. Here is the (correct) lazy implementation:
import Prelude hiding (splitAt) splitAt :: Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) splitAt n xs = if n<=0 then ([], xs) else case xs of [] -> ([], []) y:ys -> case splitAt (n-1) ys of ~(prefix, suffix) -> (y : prefix, suffix)
Now try
Test> splitAt 1000000 $ repeat 'a'
With lazy pattern matchin the last line of the
you see an answer immediately whereas with a strict pattern match the Haskell interpreter requires some time and memory before showing something. The reason is that the strict pattern match forcesthe interpreter to perform all recursive calls to
in order to check whether they actually generate a pair constructor. This might look silly since the pair type has only one constructorbut mind you that a pair value can also be
Furthermore this behavior is consistent with data types with more than one constructor.If you are uncertain how that
then it might help to translate the tilde into pair element accessors
3 Implications
The lazy pattern match has some consequences. First of all a lazy pattern matches immediately always. Remember,
f ~(x:xs) = x:xs
is translated to
f ys = head ys : tail ys
That is with the lazy pattern match the order of matches counts. E.g.
f :: [a] -> [a] f [] = [] f ~(x:xs) = x:xs
is fine but stupid, because the first match already requires the decision whether the list is empty or not. But the reversed order
f :: [a] -> [a] f ~(x:xs) = x:xs f [] = []
because the first case already matches always.
You may have also noted the danger caused by a lazy pattern match. Since the lazy pattern match on a non-empty listis translated to
because these functions are not total. That is, generally it is good style to avoid lazy pattern matches on types with more than one constructor.


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Cool your jets, Directioners. Harry Styles is not about to bail on One Direction and go solo.
Per a report in the Sunday Mirror, 19-year-old Styles "is recording his own songs and hopes to release a solo album".
The tab reports that the singer "has worked on early versions of the songs" during sessions at Paramount's recording studio in Los Angeles last week, while on a break from his band's sell-out world tour.
"He loves messing around with some of the new songs he's been working on," imparted a so-called "close pal".
"He's bounced some ideas off his friend Ed Sheeran and has already laid down some vocals."
While Styles may supposedly be looking to pull a Justin Timberlake and go solo, the source adds, "Harry's priority is obviously still with 1D. But when he decides the time to go solo has arrived, he's likely to have a project raring to go."
The tab also notes that Styles and bandmates Niall Horan, Zayn Malik, Liam Payne and Louis Tomlinson signed a "watertight three-album deal" with Sony, which reportedly states that "all five members will face financial consequences if one decides to quit".
On a side note, The Sun reported something similar back in January.
A source told the tab: "It's a really clever contract that the boys have signed up to. It means they have a real incentive to tough it out and stick together.
"The formal length is for 36 months and an album a year - but the clever part is they get the big pay day after the three years.
"If one of them walks away before then, then all five miss out on the money. They don't miss out on a few quid either, we are talking millions.
"They all get on really well, but it would be the kind of deal that would see them through the worst aggro possible."
But here's the rub on the Mirror's report: A spokesperson for the band says that while Styles may have been hitting the studio as a party of one, there's no solo album in the works.
"Harry is not recording solo material. All of the band are working on tracks for their third album. Harry is putting together some ideas for the record," the rep told Mail Online.
"The boys sometimes work up ideas separately as well as working together, as they did last year. Niall for example recently collaborated with Tom and Dougie from McFly on new tracks."
Styles also addressed the "going solo" rumours on Twitter.
Asked by a follower if there was any truth to the rumbles, he replied, "No not at all, I missed a recording session that's why I was in the studio in LA catching up .x".
Rumour busted.
And finally...
* Madonna's estranged brother speaks out, claims the pop matriarch "doesn't give a s**t if I'm dead or alive. She lives in her own world".
* Glee star Cory Monteith checks into rehab for substance addiction, rep confirms; Lea Michele sends "love and support" to boyfriend and co-star.
* Amanda Bynes goes off on another bizarre Twitter rant.
* Justin Bieber's pet monkey seized in Germany.
* Angelina Jolie makes it clear she's not married to Brad Pitt...yet.
* Lady Gaga gets herself a custom-made Louis Vuitton wheelchair.
* Let the hookup rumours begin: Taylor Swift "desperate" to meet Prince Harry when he tours the US.
* Arnold Schwarzenegger and estranged wife Maria Shriver reunite over Easter.
* Queen legend Freddie Mercury snuck Princess Diana into a gay bar dressed in drag, comedienne Cleo Rocos writes in memoir.
* "I can't make everybody like me" - Chris Brown talks handling detractors, confirms he's still dating Rihanna.
* Rivers of snark: Scalpel-tongued comedienne Joan Rivers won't back down from those cruel comments she made about British songbird Adele's weight on The Late Show With David Letterman back in February.
Rivers was asked during a HuffPost Live interview last week to defend her comments.
"It's not mean. She's a chubby lady who's very, very rich, and she should just calm down - or lose weight! She wanted an apology, so I took an ad out on her a**. I said, 'You are not fat.' And then I had room for a lot of other ads," Rivers sniped.
"Adele is beautiful and successful and has what, $100 million? Let's face reality: she's fat!"
Check out video of Joan's interview here.
Follow Myrddin Gwynedd on Twitter.
- Rumour Has It


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Boston Marathon bombing could affect local events
Race scheduled for Sunday in Colorado Springs
COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. - Security at races and other events across the country could change because of the bombing Monday at the Boston Marathon.
Organizers of a race in Colorado Springs are discussing that possibility. The second-annual Big Mountain Trail Run is scheduled for Sunday in North Cheyenne Canon. The event offers a half-marathon, 5K and 10K races.
"We're going to be meeting between now and the race," said co-organizer James Luttrall. "We'll discuss the happenings of (Monday) and (decide) if any necessary changes will be required."
Luttrall said police will be providing traffic control during the event.
"But they'd certainly be available as first responders also," he said.
Luttrall said all of the 300 registered runners will be identified by wearing numbers, and staff will wear race jerseys. He said several ham radio operators will work the event to provide another level of security.
"But we know that nobody is in control of whether or not stuff happens, said Luttrall. "We can be completely prepared. The Boston Marathon had immense security and still this kind of a tragedy (happened)."
Luttrall said none of the runners who plan to attend the race has expressed concern about safety. He suggested that more resources be spent on teaching people to avoid violence, rather than continue to spend more money on security that isn't guaranteed to be perfect.
Luttrall said organizers gained experience in dealing with an unexpected incident last June, when the Waldo Canyon fire ignited during one of their run and bike races.
"A lot of the flames were less than a mile from our course," he said. "We had to suspend the race as we assessed the situation. There were 120 racers spread around. We had to get them out quickly and safely."
The fire department has two teams that can respond to local events: a special events team of up to eight people; and a tactical emergency medical support team in case of a bombing or other emergency.
"We'll respond in heavy gear with armored vests and helmets," said David Broch of the fire department. "We'll respond in support of any SWAT team call-outs."
Another popular local event that could be affected by the bombing is the Pikes Peak Ascent and Marathon on Aug. 17-18. Vice President Matt Lawrence, a 12-time winner of the Marathon, declined an interview Monday. However, he said on phone that he refuses to allow a terrorist or criminal to change the way he lives.


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Disney On Ice: Mickey & Minnie's Magical Journey
By kimsnelbaker
Get ready folks! Mickey, Minnie and some of their friends are going to be stopping by the Giant Center in Hershey starting April 11-15th. Tickets are on sale now! You can enjoy four Disney adventures in one show when Disney On Ice presents Mickey& Minnie's Magical Journey. Mickey ... Read More


text:
Nina Bobbie Sandal
Price $89.00
- 3-in. heel
- Buckle closure
- Satin
- Imported
Shipping your purchase is easy on belk.com. Depending on the destination of your package, you can expect it to arrive within 4-7 business days. Shipping Information
Returns are easy on belk.com. Easy returns
Nina is the go-to brand for women who seek fashionable style at an affordable price. Frequently featured in today's top fashion magazines and on the red carpet, Nina now offers handbags and bridal accessories in addition to footwear. Designed in New York City, Nina has enjoyed a leadership position for innovation and design over the past 60 years. Feel glamorous. Wear Nina.


text:
Patriots edge Aitkin 4-3 on Monday
The Pequot Lakes Patriots edged Aitkin 4-3 in a non-conference girls' tennis match on Monday, Sept. 30.
Pequot Lakes' Sydney Holt and Lauren Bengtson, who improved to 23-1 overall, both won singles matches while the Patriots' doubles winners were Ellie Erholtz-Carly Fyle (No. 1) and Madison Galligan-Alex Nelson (No. 2).
"It was fun to win a close match with Aitkin," said Pequot Lakes coach Monica Sergent. "Ellie (Erholtz) and Carly (Fyle) played outstanding, and Madison (Galligan and Alex (Nelson) also had a strong showing. The match was a good way to get ready for the playoffs."
Aitkin's Claire Browning edged Haley Weibolt 7-5, 6-3 in a close match at No. 1 singles. The Gobblers drop to 8-9 overall.
The Patriots, 14-4 overall, were rained out of the Wadena-Deer Creek tournament on Saturday, Sept. 28. They are tentatively scheduled to add a home match against Crosby-Ironton on Thursday, Oct. 3. Pequot Lakes will begin Section 6A team competition on Tuesday, Oct. 8. The section final is Friday, Oct. 11, in East Grand Forks. The section individual tournament will be Friday, Oct. 11, and Saturday, Oct. 12, in East Grand Forks.
Pequot Lakes 4, Aitkin 3
No. 1: Claire Browning (A) def. Haley Weibolt 7-5, 6-3: No. 2: Elise Courtemanche (A) def Jaden Lindner 4-6, 6-2, 6-2; No. 3: Sydney Holt (PL) def Lyndsey Benson 6-0, 6-1; No. 4: Lauren Bengston (PL) def Lexi Liljenquist 6-0, 6-0
No. 1: Ellie Erholtz-Carly Fyle (PL) def Lindy Lahmann-Sharbonda-Lisa Anderson 6-3, 6-4; No. 2: Madison Galligan-Alex Nelson (PL) def Marissa Kinzer-Megan Lawson 6-4, 6-2; No. 3: Taylor Smith-Lydia Browning (A) def Erika Monson-Maggie Heggerston 6-3, 6-3
Bengston wins title
Bengston was first at No. 4 singles for Pequot Lakes, which finished tied for second with Park Rapids with 33 points at the Mid-State Conference meet on Wednesday, Sept. 25. The tournament began on Saturday, Sept. 14, but was postponed twice because of heavy rain.
Bengtson defeated Crosby-Ironton sophomore Emilie Froidcoeur 6-1, 6-1 in the final.
"Lauren played very well," Coach Sergent said of Bengtson, who was a doubles player last year. "She has always been consistent, but her game has become more aggressive this year. Lauren developed more shots and is coming to the net more."
Staples-Motley's Mikayla Wing defeated the Patriots' Hailey Wiebolt in the No. 1 singles final to help the Cardinals win the conference title with 35 points. Pequot Lakes' singles players Jaden Lindner (No. 2) and Sydney Holt (No. 3) also finished second.
"All of our singles players did well," Sergent said. "Hailey (Wiebolt) had nice three-set wins in her first two matches, and then she lost to Wing, who is ranked in the top 10 in the state. Jaden (Lindner) had a three-set win in the second match before losing to Julia Renner of Park Rapids in the final 6-1, 6-1. Sydney (Holt) had a 6-3, 6-4 revenge win over Alex Fischer, but then lost to Julie Smith of Park Rapids 6-4, 6-2 in final."
The Patriots' Ellie Erholtz-Carli Fyle (No. 1), Madison Galligan-Alex Nelson (No. 2) and Erika Monson-Maggie Heggerston (No. 3) all finished third in doubles play.
"Ellie and Carlie won a third-place match against a team they had lost to earlier in the year," Sergent said. "Madison and Alex beat a good Detroit Lakes' doubles team 6-3, 7-5 for third. Erika-Maggie lost a three-set heartbreaker to Staples-Motley, but bounced back to beat a Crosby-Ironton team 6-3, 6-0 for third."
Sergent said finishing two points behind the Cardinals and tying with the Panthers shows how close the competitive level of the Mid-State.
"I'm so proud of them because we placed at every position," Sergent said. "We had a strong showing because we were only two points behind Staples-Motley. That proved our girls are right there with Staples-Motley and Park Rapids."
Mid-State tournament:
Team scores: 1-Staples-Motley 35, 2-Pequot Lakes 33, 2-Park Rapids 33, 4-Crosby-Ironton 22, 5-Detroit Lakes 13, 6-Wadena-Deer Creek 11, 7-Perham 0.
Individual results
No. 1: 2nd-Hailey Wiebolt (PL) 2-0
No. 2: 2nd-Jaden Lindner (PL) 2-1
No. 3: 2nd-Sydney Holt (PL) 2-1
No. 4: 1st-Lauren Bengston (PL) 3-0
No. 1: 3rd-Elli Erholtz-Carli Fyle (PL) 2-1
No. 2: 3rd-Madison Galligan-Alex Nelson (PL) 2-1
No. 3: 3rd-Erika Monson-Maggie Heggerston (PL) 2-1
Patriots 7, W-DC 0
Pequot Lakes celebrated senior night as all four Patriot seniors earned wins against the Wolverines in a Mid-State Conference match on Tuesday, Sept. 24.
Those four seniors were Ellie Erholtz (No. 4 singles), Jaden Lindner (No. 1 doubles) and Erica Monson and Sarah Najjar (No. 3 doubles).
"It was nice to recognize all four seniors before the match, and then they all won," said Sergent, whose squad improved to 3-3 overall in Mid-State Conference play. "We lost a total of four matches to three teams (Staples-Motley, Park Rapids and Foley) this season, and all three are ranked in the top 10 in Class A."
Patriots 7, Wadena-DC 0
No. 1 – Sydney Holt (PL) def. Paige Hartman 6-1, 6-1; No. 2 – Lauren Bengtson (PL) def. Abby Westrum 6-0, 6-0; No. 3 – Carly Fyle (PL) def. Whitney Eickhoff 7-6 (8-6), 6-2; No. 4 – Ellie Erholtz (PL) def. Tabby Baker 6-0, 6-0
No. 1 – Jaden Lindner-Haley Wiebolt (PL) def. Erin Johnson-Maddie Hinojos 6-0, 6-0; No. 2 – Madison Galligan-Alex Nelson (PL) def. Abby Wegscheid-Elise Kallevig 6-0, 6-1; No. 3 – Erica Monson-Sarah Najjar (PL) def. Sarah Moen-Gabi Weiher 6-1, 6-0
Pete Mohs can be reached at firstname.lastname@example.com. Follow him on Facebook.


text:
Mirror Pond committee seeks more input
Questionnaire online; more public meetings planned
BEND, Ore. - A steering committee trying to figure out what's best for Mirror Pond in Bend want more help from the community.
They say in the second phase of the project, those attending meetings and giving feedback has fallen back dramatically. They say on average, they're seeing 20 to 30 people show up to learn and give their opinion on what's best for that section of the river.
Tuesday night the committee held another open house. Among the options are to get rid of a nearly 100-year-old dam in Bend. Others include dredging the river to remove a buildup of silt, the issue that led to the current review.
The dam, which is owned by Pacific Power, produces enough electricity to power about 200 to 300 homes.
The company told NewsChannel 21 Tuesday morning they don't anticipate any capitol improvements being made on the structure, only those to keep it safe and operational.
The company added that it's looking to see what the community wants to see done with it when it's no longer needed for a hydropower project.
"They are at the table, they are part of the discussion, we're having ongoing discussions with them," project Manager Jim Figurski said.
"For us, there is no decision other than removing the dam," meeting attendee Devin Hess said. "It's the clear choice."
Hess argues Bend needs to look past the "iconography" of Mirror Pond and think about the future.
"If we want to be able live sustainably in place for thousands of years, then our focus needs to be on the ecology," Hess said.
But Doug Wermer, who has taught stream processes at Northern Arizona University, says the dam needs to stay, because it would have a dramatic effect upstream.
"It would incise a channel through that section of the river and drastically change it," Wermer said. "We're going to loose recreational opportunities and wildlife on that stretch of the river."
For more information on the Mirror Pond Project, including a questionnaire and schedule of remaining meetings, CLICK HERE


text:
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In terms of losses, yes, if you do as well as the norm for the area. But losses are just one side of the coin, production / profit is the other.
In terms of losses, yes, if you do as well as the norm for the area. But losses are just one side of the coin, production / profit is the other.
"Thinking Inside The Box"
Just saw a Post on Facebook which read "Other cultures are not failed attempt of being you." Pretty much sums up my pov about treatment free beekeeping.
Mark Berninghausen
My honey production was higher than our local average by about 20 lbs and my Sept. sugar roll mite counts were all below 3 %.
Going into winter with 41 tf hives, all but 3 or 4 look strong. But Aprils a long way away.
Success will be define differently for every beekeeper. For me, success is having more hives live year to year than die. I don't measure honey production in the equation because I'm not really interested in all the work involved in processing the honey. I don't rely on beekeeping for any of my income, so my goals are quite different than the next guy.
Regards, Barry
If one imports stock to test, to what extent is the test validated (or invalidated) if nucs are made out of them and queens are raised from them and open mated? Is the dilution of the imported stock important? Or is having bees that are alive the real trump card?
In an ideal world (one where I don't live but would like to visit) if I acquire XYZ super wonderful survivor stock should I need to get in to nuc mode or should the acquired hives survive just fine allowing me to maintain my hive count? I am primarily concerned about surviving mites and Nosema. AFB is not a problem near me (knock on wood.)
I believe we also need to look at the manner in which failure occurred. Was it a continuous down hill slide, or was there an initial dip followed by a steady rise, and then a crash, caused by reasons possibly not treatment related? We have recently seen weather issues that are more serious than mite issues. CCD kills treatment free as well as treated, so there is another non-treatment related issue.
Crazy Roland
What a fantastic question.
Whatever the answers, I think it recognizes a significant point: The issue of delayed feedback.
Given the amount of variables at play, it would be difficult to give a definite answer.
For myself, I'd want to know that someone had good winter survival for at least two winters after going TF - Only then would I be curious to find out more details, such as their survival rate, and where in the TF spectrum their practice lies.
Adam, it's just too much of a subjective question. It seems to me you could define failure better. I define it as having lost all your hives.
I'll tell you what:
If my bees are still seeming strong two years from now, I'm going to feel successful.
It seems to me that mites run an annual cycle, just like the bees. Once you get through a complete couple of seasons, I'd call that successful. Why would you need to go longer than that?
Well, you wouldn't stop, would you?
Mark Berninghausen
Honey Householder on this board is treatment free because he sells off his bees in fall and starts over in spring. He is constantly markets product on this board. Is his TF method successful?
I lose a lot of my bees every winter and start over from bait catches, also mite treatment free since 2007. I also run at a suitable profit to keep going year after year. I did treat for some EFB, and fed a bit to new swarms.
We both are profitable being treatment free. Are our TF methods a success?
We both restock with bees that probably have been treated. So if everybody went treatment free, probably our methods would not be sustainable.
It's not over till its over. Saying you "had a successful life" means that your life is over. You can still fail in the last day.
"Ain't over til it's over"? That might make sense from a biographer's standpoint, but agriculture is a seasonal pursuit. One season can boom, and the next bust. And everything is on a cycle. If we're talking about the success of keeping bees without treatments, then I feel like that should be measured on a seasonal cycle. After that, the question is how many seasons does it take to sufficiently test a method?
In the case of mites, we have to think about their life cycles and measures of success (health and well-being), the bees life cycles and measures of success, and then our own goals and objectives as well. If I winter my bees treatment free, then build up next season, have a solid harvest of honey and successfully winter again (meaning my colonies are still strong and able to build up strong), then I'm pretty unlikely to treat that Fall.
Even if the mites get strong again the following season, I'm hard-pressed not to go back to treating, because for all intents and purposes, those are by then different bees.
My survival rates went up when i quit treating. I also did a complete stock change, which im sure affected the numbers. I was using your average commercial queens, and was displeased with the results. I started researching more, collecting more feral, and raising my own queens from II'd breeders. I consider my venture thus far a success. But as any beekeeping operation, I could take a complete beating next year. Apiculture is Agriculture. We take on a lot of variables and associated risk.
Last edited by Whitetail; 12-04-2012 at 07:33 PM. Reason: Spelling
Well, you might take a beating, but a lot of the II queens are part of properly run breeding programs selecting for varroa resistance traits, so your chances are better than average.
"Thinking Inside The Box"
I agree Oldtimer. I've utilized USDA VSH breeders for years. Those open mated with an array of "survivor" lines make a pretty solid bee. I only offer them nutrition. I do micromanage them at times. If a hive or queen is failing or not up to spec (shows signs of brood disease or PMS) they get requeened with select stock. Seems to be working.......
John Kefuss has been doing this for a while and 2012 he has lost 50% of his hives.
Treatment free has a price tag.
Don't think for a minute that treating doesn't also carry a "pricetag." I'm sure a majority of beeswax products are contaminated with coumaphos and or fluvalinate. Both chemicals are proven to have an array of sublethal effects, most I'm sure we haven't figured out yet. Even soft treatments have sublethal effects on bees. Treating also has some, and or exclusive responsibility in the breeding of chemical resistant mite strains. There is a reason Universities and high level breeders are breeding stock that can survive without running on the pharmaceutical treadmill. Sustainability and logical long term solutions are the ultimate goal.
The gentleman mentioned previously could have had bees with meager stores going into winter. There are a vast array of variables leading to their demise. It's not always because they were not treated.
I'd say how long it takes is as variable as the climate, management practices and strains of bees involved.
The fact that it can be done is well established b/c many (among them Kirk Webster, deknow, and myself) are doing it.
I don't think the "if" is the subject of this thread though.
As soon as a guy is accomplishing what he wants to with his bees with a mortality rate from all causes that is acceptable to him, he'll know how long it takes.
Since what he wants to accomplish and what is an acceptable mortality rate varies from beekeeper to beekeeper, and the conditions in which he keeps his bees vary from location to location, the only real answer is:
Just until he succeeds.


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Home › Forums › General Forums › General Lightweight Backpacking Discussion › Android Map App. with 1:24,000 Resolution TOPO?
Mar 19, 2013 at 10:56 pm #1300674
Does this exist? I'm looking for topographic maps with 1:24k resolution if possible.
Should I just buy a different GPS?
Bob Gross, help!Mar 19, 2013 at 11:09 pm #1967709
I don't use Android apps.
If you are looking for a topo mapping app, that is one thing. TOPO! is different and has nothing to do with Android.
I use dedicated GPS receivers.
–B.G.–Mar 20, 2013 at 3:23 am #1967722
Dave GreyBPL Member
I have used Gaia GPS, seems to work well, you can cache the CalTopo maps, check Caltopo.com to assess the quality for yourself.
It's $10 but if you don't like it you can get a refund by contacting the developer, who is very active in working with you if you have any problems with your particular device.
Also, I use GPS Status which enables a manual download of up to date A-GPS data, which give the GPS information on the recent position of the satellites, which helps get a faster fix.
DaveMar 20, 2013 at 8:25 am #1967798
>>>TOPO! is different and has nothing to do with Android.
I'm not entirely sure what this means! What is TOPO!? :P
>>>I use dedicated GPS receivers.
Can you recommend a couple effective, and cost efficient receivers?
>>>Gaia GPS
Thanks Dave, I'll check that out.Mar 20, 2013 at 9:45 am #1967817
Charles PSpectator
@mediaurasLocale: Terra
Also check out an app called BackCountry Navigation. Unlike Gaia you get a free 2 week trial. You can download caltopo maps for offline use as well as import others .gpx files. I've tried the app and it works pretty well. I haven't tried Gaia but I would think both have similar functionality and features.Mar 20, 2013 at 9:49 am #1967820
Nevermind on the first question Bob. I see TOPO! is software from Nat. Geo. after a google search.
CheersMar 20, 2013 at 12:11 pm #1967885
"Can you recommend a couple effective, and cost efficient receivers?"
Garmin is the first brand name that comes to mind, since it is the market leader. Garmin has a broad product line, and there are Etrex models that sell for something around $100. I currently own three Garmins of different vintages.
There are many other brands, but few have the user interface worked out as finely as Garmin.
If you wander off into a completely different market other than for hiking, you will find other brand names, but they aren't relevant here.
–B.G.–Mar 20, 2013 at 12:44 pm #1967896
>>>I currently own three Garmins of different vintages.
I have an older garmin for car navigation, model nuvi 205w. I uploaded some topo maps I found on gpsfiledepot.com. The topo maps are nice but the garmin isnt very smooth. Are there certain garmins that are built around ease of use? Do newer garmins have better mapping capbilities? Sub $100 is my ideal range.Mar 20, 2013 at 1:29 pm #1967910
Garmin has been in that business for a long time, so it has had the time to polish the user interface. Not all Garmins have an identical interface, but once you understand the interface on one, you will easily pick up the interface on another. If you have a relatively recent model, like within five years old, if the user has an interface problem, it is generally because they didn't bother to read the user guide first.
Also, if you buy a GPS receiver that is intended purely for one application, like car navigation, and then if you try to use that for a completely different purpose, you are likely to find lots of interface problems mostly from your own head.
I have one Garmin model that can be set up to do car navigation, or else you can set it up differently to do hiking or geocaching or something else. It takes only a few seconds to switch it over from one to another. However, if the user forgets which way it is set up, then that makes problems as well.
"Do newer garmins have better mapping capbilities?"
Better than what? What kind of mapping capabilities do you seek?
The single biggest weakness of a typical GPS receiver is the small size and resolution of the display. You can see only maybe 1% of what you can see on a large paper topo map. As a result, I don't even try to make my GPS receiver compete with the large paper topo map.
The next biggest weakness is that of the map database. Typically there will be all sorts of minor errors in the database. If the company is giving away that database as a feature of the receiver, then that means one thing. If they are selling it, that means something different. Very few will do major updates of the map database simply because there is no profit in it. If you are a backpacker trying to follow a trail, you should not need very much of a mapping database. If you are trying to go off-trail, then topography gets much more important, but the topography is unlikely to be changing or needing updates.
Once every year, I try to do a head-down exercise where I watch only the GPS screen and try to go where I am going without looking at the surrounding terrain. Most of the time, I backpack purely head-up with the GPS receiver turned off.
To paraphrase Yogi Berra, "You can see a lot just by looking."
There is a lot to be gained by learning to read a topo map and do most of your navigation that way. The GPS receiver makes a good backup system since it will operate with no visibility or in bad weather. During bad weather or bad visibility is when humans need the most help, and that is where the implications of getting lost become the most severe.
My concern is that too many people can do land nav only with their face at a screen, and they can't effectively navigate by traditional methods. Once batteries crap out, they are in trouble.
I once hiked with a guy who had some Garmin model with a barometric altimeter feature. The question is: does the barometer adjust the GPS altitude, or does the GPS altitude adjust the barometer? The answer is that it could go either way, but if the user doesn't know how it is set up to function, then you don't know what you will get. This particular guy got into that situation, and he was cursing the receiver until he finally got frustrated and turned it off. Well, that was because he didn't read the book and try to understand.
I taught specialized GPS classes for almost 15 years, so I learned (1) how to get the best results out of my own receiver, (2) how to troubleshoot the other guy's receiver, and (3) how to teach the other guy so that he understood [and so he didn't bother us anymore].
Some of the worst cases of GPS understanding happened in some people with the highest educational level, so don't feel pregnant.
–B.G.–Mar 20, 2013 at 4:25 pm #1967954
Wow thanks Bob, that was a lot to take in! I think I have had an epiphany as a result, and that is to not rely on a technological device when my life may be on the line. In my case, my life should not be on the line because I will be following trails. Nonetheless, I see it's importance as a back-up tool (as long as I know how to use it properly).
I learned how to read a topo map in a College Geography course a few years back, which has been very helpful since then. I think I'll just stick with physical topo maps and maybe find my user guide for the Garmin that I already own (and read it).Mar 20, 2013 at 4:44 pm #1967960
Andrew JohnsonBPL Member
@trailbehindLocale: San Pablo Park
"Garmin has been in that business for a long time, so it has had the time to polish the user interface."
I think that one of the most striking differences between most good iPhone/Android GPS apps and a Garmin is the UI. Regardless of how long Garmin has been in business, "User Interface" is not their strong suit, which is a legacy of having to iterate hardware. It's not just the nice screen that makes iPhones easier to use than Garmins – the UIs are much better because of the medium used to create them.
Garmins are rugged, have good batteries, proprietary maps, and high GPS precision. On the other hand, Garmin UI was still in the dark ages last time I used one (5 years ago). Which was a fundamental reason why I made an iPhone app.
When the user has issues with a device because they didn't read the user manual, I regard that as primarily a flaw in the design of the device. I've never read a user manual in my life, not for a toaster, video game, Garmin, or anything else. If it's not IKEA furniture or a software API, I'm not reading the directions.Mar 20, 2013 at 6:33 pm #1968003
Andrew, spoken like a true software nerd.
–B.G.–Mar 21, 2013 at 9:14 pm #1968427
joseph petersonMember
@sparkyLocale: Southern California
What I do is download USGS topos onto my phone. It works great and has actually helped me out of a jam a couple times.Mar 22, 2013 at 8:34 am #1968508
Jim HBPL Member
@jraiderguyLocale: Bay Area
The app from Google called "My Tracks" just updated today, and finally allows import of KML files (google earth files). I haven't tested it for backcountry use, but if KML import works well, it would be possible in theory to have your route on the map and then just follow it. Here's the site for the app (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.google.android.maps.mytracks&hl=en)
Also, Overland Navigator is regarded as one of the better "cottage" GPS softwares, but it is developed by an enthusiast of overlanding (off-road backcountry vehicle travel/expedition). It sounds like he is developing version 3.0 for iOS only. http://spatialminds.com/blog/overland-navigator-30-os-selection.html
There's also Backcountry Navigator (http://www.backcountrynavigator.com/), which does have an android version. I haven't tried it yet, but it is generally well reviewed on forums. People often say it is full features, but maybe not the cleanest possible UI. It looks like its been updated since I last looked into it though.
There's probably a learning curve with whatever system you choose. Personally, I'm going to see if I can use Google My Tracks to follow a path imported via KML. If that works, it might be enough for me. If not, I'll try Backcountry Navigator. I'm not sure what maps are built into each, but it shouldn't take long to mess with each and see.Mar 28, 2013 at 12:56 pm #1970528
Benjamin BrillatMember
@brillbLocale: Northeast USA
I use Backcountry Navigator Pro on my Android phone and tablet. It's awesome. You can pull many different map database sources, so strictly speaking for the OP question, the map resolution isn't a function of the app but what maps you want to use.
The thing that makes Backcountry Navigator superior for me is that I travel somewhere every week for work. I can reach in my pocket and have a topo map to anywhere in the world after a quick download, and get in some fun hikes wherever I am. I've been able to use it not just in the USA but in India and Europe as well. Works great both on my phone and on my Nexus 7 tablet, which is nice to have a larger map format.
However, when I'm actually going out someplace serious… I buy a local map. It might be super convenient to have my Android phone, but a paper map and my Suunto MC-2G Compass are always going to get me back out of the woods.Mar 28, 2013 at 1:09 pm #1970534
Jim HBPL Member
@jraiderguyLocale: Bay Area
Thanks for the thoughts on Backcountry Navigator. I think I'll check it out. I tend to spend lots of time exploring various maps before hikes, just for the fun of it, so it would be nice to have a GPS app to plot POIs and stuff. I don't currently carry a stand-alone GPS, but I do always carry my cell phone because I'm afraid to leave much in my car after a couple break-ins over the years.Mar 28, 2013 at 9:38 pm #1970682
Nelson SherryMember
@nsherry61Locale: Mid-Willamette Valley
+1 for BackCountry Navigator
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text:
Town Square
Blogs, hm, seem a lot like conferences …
Original post made by Jay Thorwaldson, editor emeritus, on May 30, 2006
"In 15 or 20 years I believe 80 percent of us will be getting about 80 percent of our information through computers," I suggested in class about the future of journalism, as a community-based "lecturer" in the Communications Department (a notch or two above a teaching assistant, actually). My day job then was covering Palo Alto community news for the old Palo Alto Times.
My prediction was met with distinct incredulity. The class was still using non-electric typewriters in our writing lab, and struggling with how to insert carbon paper the right way -- not an easy task for Stanford seniors, it seemed at the time. (Did I hear someone ask, "What's carbon paper?")
But the aura of disbelief increased significantly when one bright student asked, "What if we want to keep a printed copy?"
Now I was in untried ground. Hadn't thought about it. So I winged it:
"Oh, I suppose we'll all have little printers in our homes that we can print stuff out on," I replied. The class looked at me as if I'd just stepped out of a flying saucer from another planet.
In today's keyboard era, of course, one needs to be a certain age to have ever used a typewriter, or even to know what a typewriter is. My bit of academic prescience, by the way, didn't extend to the dot-com mania that hit 15 years later, where virtual real estate became as valuable as the real stuff in Palo Alto, for a time, so I never got rich off my insights.
I left the PA Times in 1979, shortly after it became the Peninsula Times Tribune and began its painful, 14-year spiral into oblivion (in its centennial year, 1993). After nearly two years of consulting work and becoming involved in local non-profit organizations and some political issues (from which I had refrained as a journalist), I ultimately headed up the community relations/public affairs office of the then-new Palo Alto Medical Foundation, and became even more deeply involved in the world of local non-profit organizations, as a collaborative inter-agency team-builder.
By 1982, still fascinated with how computers might affect our lives, I chaired a multi-agency committee that created an experiment called the "Inter-Agency Communications Network," or ICNet. With the loan from Apple Computer of 20 rebuilt Apple IIs and 300-bits-per-second (translate to v-e-r-y s-l-o-w) modems, we linked 20 agencies that provided some type of services to seniors in northern Santa Clara County.
We soon found that the modem-to-modem dial-up was far less reliable and efficient than a simple phone call, and that the level of conversation more closely resembled the CB-band chatter between truckers than efficient business communications: "Hi, good buddy. What's new?" We concluded that we were a decade or two ahead of technology, and put the learning experience to a well-deserved rest.
Then came The WELL, the Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link, an outgrowth of Stewart Brand's Whole Earth Catalog, which emerged in the late 1980s as a Bay Area "bulletin board service," or BBS -- the way most people accessed the Internet in days before graphics became possible circa 1993-94. America Online (AOL) and other giant BBSs, later evolving into Internet service providers, ultimately overshadowed The WELL, except for diehards who still visit its conferences or keep @WELL.com e-mail addresses as a kind of virtual collector's item.
What set The WELL apart was its conferences -- in case you wondered where this was headed.
It had conferences on just about everything from current news events to what home printer was the best buy to varieties of adult fare worthy of triple-X rating, conducted discreetly behind closed, invitation-only screens. That, and monthly parties of WELL members in Sausalito, made it a special, almost personal experience. You actually knew the people who were running your Internet.
In 1991 I took time off from my day job at the Medical Foundation to serve as media coordinator for the First Conference on Computers, Freedom & Privacy, of CFP1, and later co-edited a book of transcripts that for a time served as textbooks in some colleges for this emerging field that today seems more relevant and immediate than ever. The dynamic dialogue between privacy zealots, academics, Libertarians, average people concerned about data security and computer hacking on one hand and representatives of the CIA, FBI, the Secret Service, police agencies and district attorneys' offices on the other was a phenomenal experience. This dialogue could not happen today, in our more entrenched times.
In 1994, the Internet "arrived" big time in Palo Alto. The city became the first to launch a municipal Web site, during its Centennial celebration. The Palo Alto Weekly became the first newspaper anywhere, to our knowledge, to post its entire editorial content directly onto the World Wide Web (without going through a limited-access BBS). At the Medical Foundation, I spearheaded the creation of the first (to my knowledge) community health care Web site.
And, beginning in late 1993, I and a couple of dozen others (including former Palo Alto head librarian Mary Jo Levy) co-founded the Palo Alto Community Network (PA-ComNet) listserv that began discussing ways to get something better and faster going than pokey dial-up modems, long before the community became entangled in an endless debate on whether to go to "fiber to the home."
In June 2000, when I was named editor of the Weekly, the staff had just begun talking about posting news stories online each day, which I wrote about in one of my first "On Deadline" columns in the Weekly. Former Editor Brian Aronstam completed a report on online postings, and we began with two or three postings a day. We now post between 35 and 50 news stories per week, everything from updates on community crime statistics to a streaker at a Stanford basketball game (which drew nearly 11,000 readers). Earlier big stories included the Fitzhugh murder case and when the mountain lion was wandering around Palo Alto neighborhoods looking for a free meal.
Now, a dozen years after the public discovered the Web, we arrive at blogs, Web logs -- a long step or two beyond the old text-only BBS conferences and the personal Web sites individuals and families have created since.
I still remain to be convinced that blogs are all that different from the hosted conferences of the early WELL days, except that in my blog at least one won't get "flamed" for posting too-long comments or ridiculed for not knowing proper Web protocol or procedures. I lurked around the WELL conferences for several months before venturing a comment, absorbing the give-and-take and learning the customs, like a timid anthropologist observing a new culture.
In this blog I will make some personal observations, provide historical anecdotes and tidbits from local history and make myself available to answer questions about the community -- which I began studying as something of a kid reporter in 1966. Every week, it seems, I discover something new about the community and its residents, mostly good, sometimes disappointing.
At age 16, working as a caretaker at a former summer camp in Los Altos, I discovered the Palo Alto Times and decided I wanted to work for that newspaper, finally landing a slot in 1964 covering Mountain View, Los Altos, Sunnyvale, Moffett Field and NASA-Ames. Two years later, I was promoted to the Palo Alto beat, as busy then as it is now, and the community grew upon me as I survived political battles over growth, antiwar and other demonstrations, the emerging environmental movement and even police and fire news.
As a longtime journalist, I'm more comfortable asking questions than answering them, but I have picked up historical detritus along the way. And, as with many journalists, I know whom to ask if I don't know the answer.
Ask me a question. Challenge my answers. Correct or enlarge upon my recollections. Tell me your stories.
Welcome to my blog.
Comments (18)
a resident of Embarcadero Oaks/Leland
on May 31, 2006 at 8:42 am
Cudos for the new Palo Alto Online format and the Town Square concept. I was hoping to find some editorial oversight on content to protect Town Square from being hijacked by a few strident voices as occurred on PA-ComNet and in the Daily News under its former editor, thereby rendering those forums places to avoid for the rest of us. There are so many bright, knowledgable members in our community that ultimately must feel comfortable sharing their ideas and insights to make Town Square the powerful community builder it could be.
a resident of Crescent Park
on May 31, 2006 at 9:05 am
What is your RSS feed? I'd like to promote it. We're trying to continue your pioneering internet work at Palo Alto Medical Foundation...
Web Link
director of IT, Embarcadero Media and webmaster of Palo Alto Online
on May 31, 2006 at 10:03 am
Frank Bravo is a registered user.
We are doing some final testing on the RSS feed. It should be available by the weekend.
publisher of the Palo Alto Weekly
on May 31, 2006 at 10:15 am
Bill Johnson is a registered user.
Response to Bob Harrington: We are acutely aware of the challenge we face in creating in Town Square a "safe" atmosphere where residents can engage in thoughtful discussion.
We will be carefully monitoring the postings and will not hesitate to delete posts, lock discussion threads or even block IP addresses if necessary to maintain a civil and respectful environment. We pledge our best efforts and encourage users to help us in spotting problem posts.
a resident of Crescent Park
on May 31, 2006 at 10:04 pm
I'm excited about Town Square, and I look forward to Jay's and other writers' blogs. There is no shortage of things to blog about in this city, and I think Town Square is going to remind us all what a small town PA really is.
I also applaud the Weekly team for their bravery in taking on this project, because I see their commitment to careful monitoring, and we know that's no small undertaking.
Good work, PAW team!
a resident of Green Acres
on Jun 1, 2006 at 1:05 am
How many of us have our own blogs? I do but don't go up there very often. My son in law's blog (chuckcurrie) is a touchstone for liberal Christians. Whilst he was in divinity school, he received course credit for his daily dialogue and commentary. He has become well known and consequently, cynically, Fox News recently asked him to debate on radio some rightwing conservative to rally the far right against him. My blog tends to rant about national issues, though it is called Granny's Nook. It started as a place to let family and friends look at photos without having to send huge files to show off my winsome grandkids.
With so much to read already I wonder that people will have the time to look, let alone comment.
Regards Alice
a resident of Midtown
on Jun 1, 2006 at 12:51 pm
Thanks, Joanna. We'll do our best to keep it dynamic, timely, interesting -- and safe for a broad range of people to share ideas, views, news and their own slices of history. Palo Alto definitely has a small town feel, in a good sense. But as with many small towns, new arrivals or those who haven't paid attention to local issues, people and politics can feel shut out. By having someplace to find out about local history and how it affects our lives today, perhaps TownSquare can make it easier for more people to feel part of that small town at the core. -jay
a resident of Midtown
on Jun 1, 2006 at 2:20 pm
Jay Thorwaldson is a registered user.
Alice Smith asks the same question I've been pondering for a long time: If we all become publishers who will be readers? We might have a virtual Tower of Babylon with everyone yammering (intelligently and with great sophistication and style) and no one listening, or being quite sure whom to believe about what -- or know who had hidden interests or motives.
But in a community where many people know each other the Internet, blogs and other aspects can help sustain contact between people with busy lives. And, if properly approached, can help us understand issues, define concerns and perhaps resolve issues we all face in a community or region.
-jay (editor, Palo Alto Weekly)
a resident of Midtown
on Jun 1, 2006 at 9:46 pm
All of (or most of us) heard / read the stories regarding a stranger approaching the children of Addison Elementary. Its a scary thought. When our kids are in school, we expect them to be *safe*. Ofcourse, this holds true as long as they stay inside the campus and not venture out on the streets.
But we have to remember, kids need to use the restrooms, kids are entrusted with the job of carrying the attendance sheet to the office - for one reason or other - child(ren) get out of their classrooms and are gone from the classrooms for some time.
Think about it - during the school hours, how many people have an access to the campus? Plenty! In the elementary schools that I have seen - there are quite a few people hanging around after the school is in session. These are parent volunteers, these are parents who are socializing, these are neighbors who have brought their young child just to see the happy and jolly kids, there are grandparents who have come to see off their grandchildren ..
Don't you think the school should have two gates that get locked down right after the school is in session? All the human traffic, once the gates are closed - should be directed through the office, where the person would have to state a reason (and maybe id himself/herself) before being let into the campus. Now .. I can see some people raising the question of - if there are locked gates, what happens in case of an emergency? I am not talking about padlocks, these should be electronic locks that we see everywhere - which will sound an alarm when opened. In case of an emergency - well, let the alarm sound. During other times, this alarm will alert someone in the office.
The school district will definitely argue about needing more $ to hire staff to monitor the traffic during the school hours. Well ... this is a small price to pay for the safety !
What do the other parents think ?
Thanks !
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Jun 3, 2006 at 11:51 pm
Congratulations on starting this blog. It's got a good start - respectful, with good comments. It will help to nicely leverage your print presence, and provide a real time outlet for community information and opinion.
a resident of another community
on Jun 13, 2006 at 5:40 am
As a follow-up to your projectionsnearly 30 years ago about how many of us will be receiving our news and other material via the Internet, you were right on when it comes to more global information. Still, even today, except for blogs such as yours and, of course, the oline editions of local newspapers, I think that local readers, particularly, still depend on the print media. Printing out news or advertising pages is becoming ever more costly, so we read the global, national and regional media online, but now, even more, like the convenience and feel of the local paper for movies, garage sales, police reports and, of course, local city and school government news.
a resident of Crescent Park
on Jun 17, 2006 at 12:20 am
Love the addition of Diana Diamond, but still no RSS feeds? Backfence launched, and although activity on their site pales in comparison (5 articles in last 2 days), they have better technology in place (photo sharing, etc.) And active RSS feeds.
Web Link
director of IT, Embarcadero Media and webmaster of Palo Alto Online
on Jun 17, 2006 at 4:16 am
frank bravo is a registered user.
We ran into a delay with the RSS feed before I left for a convention. It is working, but we need to refine it further before I released it to the public. If you want to send your e-mail address to me at webmaster (at) PaloAltoOnline (dot) com, I'd be happy to send you the link to what we have so far.
We also had photo sharing in place prior to launch, but we decided to hold off releasing it to the public for the time being. If you notice, there is a 'hole' in the list of categories at the top of the page. That's where 'Photos' will be when we activate it.
a resident of Old Palo Alto
on Jun 22, 2006 at 8:54 pm
You were and are a prophet, Jay! Wasn't for you, I don't think I would have this groovy job at PAMF.... We are with you on blogs, visit ours at Web Link
ed b, webmaster at the Palo Alto Medical Foundation
a resident of Green Acres
on Dec 1, 2006 at 6:30 am
Thanks, Jay, for sharing this bit of Palo Alto history with all of us. I started laughing when you mentioned "the carbon paper in the typewriter". We have come a long way from those days. I remember working as a secretary while my husband was in law school, and oh, how I struggled, with a head-set for dictation, white-out, and mimeograph machines!! (and I am not even THAT OLD).
I shall enjoy reading your site and maybe even commenting. Debbie Kurland
a resident of Los Altos Hills
on Jun 20, 2007 at 9:48 pm
Jay --
Whatever happened to PA-ComNet? I used to attend its meetings which were quite lively and informed. Did the group just fade away?
a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Jan 28, 2008 at 3:46 pm
Hum nothing since 2006?
a resident of Menlo Park
on Sep 2, 2009 at 12:45 pm
Hi, Jay!
Never been on a blog before...Hope this is a proper way to communicate with you.
Within the last couple of weeks, I rented a sewer snake at AAA Rentals on 5th Avenue in Redwood City. The guy behind the counter asked for my driver's license and before I realized what was happening, he scanned it into his computer and my license appeared on his screen. (I have not had that experience before, and it didn't feel right, so I went back later and they agreed to delete my license.)
This new business practice seems to be "crossing a line" of some kind and I thought you might not have heard of it.
Hope to see you at the Moonlight Run!
John Hargis
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text:
Movie Review: The Amazing Spider-Man
Just how amazing is the new The Amazing Spider-Man? It's not what you think.
Director: Marc Webb
MPAA Rating: PG-13
Studio: Marvel Entertainment
We could debate from now until the zombie apocalypse whether the moviegoing universe really needed a reboot of Spider-Man only a decade after the first Spider-Man web-spinner starring Tobey Maguire and Kirsten Dunst and only five years after the studio called an abrupt halt to the Sam Raimi–directed franchise with Spider-Man 3. A perfectly enjoyable do-over, The Amazing Spider-Man — budgeted at somewhere near $220 million — is pretty much an as-expected spin on the mythic Steve Ditko/Stan Lee Marvel Comics series that inspired the original flick, except it's often better acted and its special effects are all grown up. Hurling us back to day one, the origin story–heavy movie, directed by Marc Webb ((500) Days of Summer), gives us Andrew Garfield as the orphaned, kicked-around high school dweeb-turned-vigilante Peter Parker and the equally special Emma Stone as Peter's first romance, the pretty brainiac Gwen Stacy.
While action fans may get antsy, the flick is especially good in the character-driven opening that takes its own sweet time detailing awkward Peter's tragic childhood loss of his shadowy, secretive parents (Campbell Scott, Embeth Davidtz) and his tricky relationship with their surrogates, a loving aunt and uncle, played by Sally Field and Martin Sheen. Even more potent is the oddball sizzle and warmth of the relationship between twitchy, vulnerable, James Dean-esque Garfield and the nimble, funny, utterly irresistible Stone. Both bring refreshing, quicksilver intelligence, charm and openness to their roles. When angsty, snarky Parker gets his first taste of his death-defying superpowers leaping off skyscrapers, clinging to the sides of buildings and careening around Manhattan's steel canyons, Garfield makes his character's joy, triumph and ego tripping believable and relatable. Not only does he make the role completely his own but he also gives a performance with star quality spray-painted all over it. There's also strong stuff from the resourceful, fully committed Rhys Ifans as armless scientist Curt Connors, whose initially well intended experiments turn him into a gigantic, angry lizard and who then hatches plans to make Manhattan's entire populace his scaly companions.
As good as Ifans is, though, he's undercut by some hokey CGI effects, and his beastly self's silly taunts sound straight out of a B-Grade '40s flick. Denis Leary is on firmer ground playing Stone's cranky, conservative police chief father; he's big fun. Where the movie stumbles most is in its vertigo-inducing 3D action sequences that roar and thunder without deepening the goings-on or being in tune with its sweet-spirited, hip sense of poetry. The less said about a cringe-worthy sequence in which the high-flying Parker shouts out a tired, clichéd callback to Midnight Cowboy, the better. Although less than amazing, The Amazing Spider-Man is still plenty good enough to deliver big grins, thrills and a welcome tug on the heartstrings.


text:
Dear, Friends,
The bees seem to love this holly bush in our yard. I planted them 10 years ago and have no idea what they are. Can someone give me an opinion on what they think it is? Grows fast, always green, has only one sticker on the tip of the leaf..have tiny flowers that bees love and bright red berries..
here is a link to the photo:http://queenbjan.files.wordpress.com...e-on-holly.jpg


text:
Its definitely on us as players, an unnamed Packer told Lori Nickel of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel. But I think the refs are out to get us this year.
Are you serious????? Shut up and play the game right. You do that then maybe you wont lose games you are up by 18 points.