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Skip to comments.You Can't Call a Pretty Girl Pretty; What Kind of Country Are We Becoming?
Posted on 01/11/2013 1:19:12 AM PST by Kaslin
Before examining the ridiculous controversy stemming from Monday nights college football championship broadcast, let us stipulate that there are more urgent and scary ways to describe the current changes in America.
We are becoming a culture of dependency. We are becoming a neo-socialist experiment. We are becoming a dumbed-down nation unappreciative of its founders. We are losing touch with the Constitution and the very concept of liberty.
I do not argue that todays essay is our most pressing problem. But as scores of fine writers address the various angles of our republics dangle from a precarious thread, I thought Id venture to the periphery to lament another type of change which accrues to our societal detriment.
We are becoming a nation that caves to humorless, scolding bullies on matters of little or no consequence.
Not exactly a fiscal cliff or an Islamist-friendly CIA director, but a problem nonetheless.
If you didnt see it live, you surely have by now. The iconic Brent Musburger took a moment between plays to comment on the images from ESPN cameras dwelling on Alabama quarterback A.J. McCarrons girlfriend in the stands.
Turning to colleague Kirk Herbstreit, he playfully nudged: You quarterbacks, you get all the good looking women. What a beautiful woman. Wow!
Herbstreit, quarterback at Ohio State just over 20 years ago, added: A.J.s doing some things right down in Tuscaloosa.
Musburger then filled the remaining seconds before the next play: So if youre a youngster at Alabama, start getting the football out and throw it around with Pop.
Somewhere, a shriek rang out.
This is the only theory that can possibly lead to the sheer idiocy of ESPN apologizing for a completely innocent 30 seconds of broadcaster banter.
Somewhere, a phone rang. Or a hundred phones. An email, or a hundred emails, were sent. The sliver of America that found those moments offensive was going to get its pound of flesh.
Surely ESPN did not buckle on its own. Surely a network that will show you cheerleaders twenty times a game did not suddenly recoil in the production truck. No one wearing headphones said at the time, Oh, dang, that was terrible, we should apologize for that.
But the pathetic thing is, someone at ESPN may well have tensed up at the time-- not because the event was truly bad, but because every TV and radio operation knows that countless humorless scolders with empty lives stand poised to pounce on any turn of a word or phrase that jostles their fragile sensibilities.
Genuine offenses deserve genuine apologies. If Musburger had growled lasciviously about a wish to be 50 years younger while Herbstreit egged him on with his own prurient patter, Id be leading the call for displays of contrition.
But it is vital to understand that neither Ms. Webb nor her parents nor her national champion boyfriend were offended in the least.
But if a needed apology undelivered is an etiquette violation, it is an outright attack on our social order to make-- and tolerate-- demands for apology that are wholly without basis.
A culture filled with contrived offense erodes our measurements of which affronts are deserving of actual repentance. And the heartfelt regret of actual transgressors is devalued when surrounded by the din of phony apologies offered merely to stem a wave of phone calls and emails from troublemakers with time on their hands.
But if there is anything worse than an unnecessary apology crafted to reduce heat, it is an apology of that type that seeks to hose the public in the process.
We always try to capture interesting storylines and the relationship between an Auburn grad who is Miss Alabama and the current Alabama quarterback certainly met that test, said the ESPN statement.
Sure, guys, its all about her being from Auburn. Please.
If Katherine Webb were somewhat plain, she would not have been on camera as much. Conversely, blessed as she is, she would have been on camera as much if her degree were from Delaware State.
The statement went on to express regret that the commentary went too far and Brent understands that.
I hope not. I hope Brent thinks this whole thing is as stupid as it actually is.
If ESPNs phone lines did indeed blow up with outraged viewers the moment Musburger and Herbstreit finished calling a pretty girl pretty, I would have wanted a very different statement from the network:
ESPN welcomes input from all viewers on the commentary of our announcers. However, after reviewing the words spoken in this instance, we find that the only occurrence was a compliment to Ms. Webb and accompanying upbeat banter that also related to her in a completely positive way.
We note, and recommend that others do as well, that no one involved was offended, and as such, we see no reason whatsoever for an apology from Brent or anyone else.
We should always be vigilant about broadcast comments that truly hurt or offend people. But the flip side of that responsibility coin is to stand guard against contrived offense meant to stoke political fires, in this case, perhaps a feminist agenda that it is somehow inappropriate to observe that a beautiful young lady is a beautiful young lady.
Is this a case of stereotype, perpetuating some notion that the quarterback will always get the pretty girl, or that having a plainer girlfriend is somehow a lesser blessing?
Just asking that question takes the whole matter into the muddled world of overanalysis. Some people need to learn to let a compliment be a compliment, and in a sports broadcast booth, if there is no harm done, to let guys be guys.
Put that women in a burqa.... For the love of Allah .....
I wonder if the frowning left that found Musburger comment offensive understands they are the flip side of the Taliban coin....
Mutbeger is an idiot.
His comments were not necessary.
Its a football game. I would say stick to what you know but in his case lets make that stick to what you are paid for.
Pretty, yes. Not quite as gorgeous as my wife of 34 years, but she's right up there. I will never cease to compliment someone that looks good and puts the proper effort into it.
I'll give you all a choice... Ms Webb or the Obamaphone "lady".
She's ok. Looks like her hair is dyed a fake black though. The younger girl on the left aint bad though.
You don't like his comment, why don't you sue him? /sarcasm>
There. Just sign me up for sensitivity training now.
I detest Musberger with a passion, but...if I was waiting for him to step on his own crank, this isn't it.
I see the circus is in town...
Yet the Vice President of the United States can swear in a lady Senator and quip "Spread your legs; you are about to be frisked" and get by with it. THe left sure is choosy about where to express their outrage.
Joe Biden is simply vile and an embarrassment.
Fixed it.
Who said it was necessary? They have to fill time with something, especially during a blowout, and he was only reacting to what the director put in front of him. It's not as if he went on about gun control.
This is coming from someone who mutes the tv so he doesn't have to listen to the ex-jock blockheads who know about their narrow field but can't talk, or the broadcaster types who can talk but sound endlessly condescending and don't know anything.
It was the way he said it. He could have just said she was beautiful and moved on.
He's thinking, "I've never seen that much makeup on anybody in my entire life."
Or something like that.
I was thinking they might be related, does she have a younger brother or nephew who was with her at the game? Some vague resemblance there, imho.
Is that really a woman? I have my doubts.
It's a tranny.
I'll bet the one on the left has a staff, too.
It's someone caught in the deception of sin.
Genesis 18:20-21
20. Then the LORD said, "The outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous
21. that I will go down and see if what they have done is as bad as the outcry that has reached me. If not, I will know."
Genesis 19:4-7
4. Before they had gone to bed, all the men from every part of the city of Sodom--both young and old--surrounded the house.
5. They called to Lot, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them."
6. Lot went outside to meet them and shut the door behind him
7. and said, "No, my friends. Don't do this wicked thing.
Isaiah 3:9 The look on their faces testifies against them; they parade their sin like Sodom; they do not hide it. Woe to them! They have brought disaster upon themselves.
2 Peter 2:13b Their idea of pleasure is to carouse in broad daylight. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their pleasures while they feast with you.
Ezekiel 16:49-50
49. "`Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy.
50. They were haughty and did detestable things before me. Therefore I did away with them as you have seen.
1. But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them--bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2. Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.
3. In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.
4. For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment;
5. if he did not spare the ancient world when he brought the flood on its ungodly people, but protected Noah, a preacher of righteousness, and seven others;
6. if he condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah by burning them to ashes, and made them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly;
7. and if he rescued Lot, a righteous man, who was distressed by the filthy lives of lawless men
8. (for that righteous man, living among them day after day, was tormented in his righteous soul by the lawless deeds he saw and heard)--
9. if this is so, then the Lord knows how to rescue godly men from trials and to hold the unrighteous for the day of judgment, while continuing their punishment.
10. This is especially true of those who follow the corrupt desire of the sinful nature and despise authority. Bold and arrogant, these men are not afraid to slander celestial beings;
11. yet even angels, although they are stronger and more powerful, do not bring slanderous accusations against such beings in the presence of the Lord.
12. But these men blaspheme in matters they do not understand. They are like brute beasts, creatures of instinct, born only to be caught and destroyed, and like beasts they too will perish.
13. They will be paid back with harm for the harm they have done. Their idea of pleasure is to carouse in broad daylight. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their pleasures while they feast with you.
But there IS hope!!!
1 Corinthians 6:9-11
9. Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived:
Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders
10. nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
11. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
If you could NOT change, you would be in most pitiful shape...
Mudburger was just admiring the hottie Miss Webb. People need to relax....his comments were not offensive. And, Miss Webb seems to be fine with the nice comments. Lets move on
I strongly suspect that the creature with the big puffy hair is not female. The other creature's "staff" credential looks like a rainbow 'fag-flag'.
Yesterday there were a series of announcements made by various Massachusetts politicos....... all women. All obviously liberal, ugly women.
The ugly liberals hate being discriminated against.
Beauty might be only skin deep but ugly goes down to the bone
Yeah, that makes sense, though I have known genuine women that were that ugly and trashy looking.
FO pansies!
Yeah, I guess the liberals feel that Brent Musburger has a hell of a nerve encouraging young boys to take an interest in women instead of other boys.
Pretty soon it will be against the law to let a woman pass and then look back to check out her caboose.
When that happens I will just turn myself in at the nearest police station, and check out the backside of the Dyke cop as she locks me up.
I agree, as long as Brent wasn't coveting.
"Pretty soon it will be against the law to let a woman pass and then look back to check out her caboose."
"I love the women's movement, especially when viewed from behind." Rush H. Limbaugh III
Rush has said the left is after football. I believe him. Musburger advised kids to take up football to get girls! Thats the real outrage. How can they convince the little darlings to not play with that visual going unchallenged?
Its ALWAYS the violation of the narrative that gets them going....
Looks like Miss Planet of the ——!
The Left can't stand the thought that somewhere, someone is enjoying life.
Usually I am immune to this
But those comments were way out of place
in the BCS Bowl Broadcast, on National TV
I cringed when I heard them.
The left hates it when men act like men. They would rather have men act like castrated wimps.
I did not watch this particular game but I have a cure. For the last several years when I have watched a football game I have muted the sound and just watched the game. It made the experience a whole lot better. I got tired of the constant fawning or outright arm chairing done by the likes of Collingsworth and the other color guys. He forgets he never played on a championship team but to hear him you'd think he was Roger Staubach or Lynn Swann. Aikman has gotten better over the years and is tolerable but I just watch in silence and talk to the family while it is on.
The Mute Button is my friend
The game was basically over and the camera found some eye candy and Brett basically said it was the QB's eye candy. He then teased his buddy Herbstret about being a QB. Get over it!
Pray for America
Kirsten Powers, who is pretty liberal, was on O'Reilly the other night, and to her credit she was laughing and saying it was totally ridiculous to make a big deal out of this and that nothing Musberger said was offensive.
I think it's mostly the lesbian avenger types who lose it over this stuff.
You would post that image when I can't find my wire brush and I ran out of bleach two days ago. So - how do you expect me to get that image out of my brain?
HOWRVER, no one seems to care that the cameramen repeatedly scan the crowds for pretty women to zoom in on, nor that they zoom in on cheerleaders, nor the fact that we have CHEERLEADERS wearing the tightest and shortest UNIFORMS imaginable.
One must ask, who do we have cheerleaders at ADULT FOOTBALL (pro) games ?
I get it for JR. High, Sr. High, and College, as this gives the females a way to participate.
So WHY do pro football teams have cheerleaders ?
Political correctness is the worst thing to happen in my lifetime. I was born in the 50s.
Oh wait, make that PC is now the 2nd worst thing to happen in my lifetime.
The worst thing is the rapid onslaught of socialism that began in 2009 and the subsequent death of the republic.
It is all in God's hands now. My beautiful free nation was pulled out from under me, replaced with socialist evil and a coming totalitarian tyranny.
Pray to God and apologize to your children and grandchildren for losing your nation.
All Brent said is what every straight guy in America watching the game was thinking.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.


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It is really important to get the speed of the bowl rotation right, especially as gluten contents rise. When I start getting the dough to rise up the hook (which happens very quickly even when slowly adding high gluten flour) I tend to have to spin the bowl faster than it wants to go even without any of the brake engaged. I personally do not think this is a very good mixer for high gluten flour, but it can do amazing things with all purpose or Italian 00 flours. You might want to switch to something like this then work your way back if if you find the need to do so. This mixer is so fast and powerful at developing gluten that you may find you prefer a lower protein flour. Good luck.
I think that most mixers perform best at or almost at capacity.Mixing small amounts is tedious.
Matthew, I found it quicker and very easy to invite more friends, once the word gets out, you shouldn't have any problems using up your dough. Besides, flour is relatively cheap, and making larger batches is still cheaper than buying it in the stores, even if you don't use it all. You can always use it up making some rolls or something. -marc
Hi,I am seriously considering spendig A LOT of money on a santos mixer. I just wondered if anyone knows if there is a difference between the Santos 10qt and the Metcalfe DK12? The metcalfe mixer is also a santos, and from the specs it is identical to the santos 10qt mixer, but it says 12qt, not 10qt.. http://www.metcalfecatering.com/items.aspx?pt=cat2-josteh-

subset: commoncrawl


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NRC to decide wolf hunt
MARQUETTE – The Michigan Natural Resources Commission is expected to decide Thursday whether to approve provisions of a wolf hunt recommendation that was presented last month by division chiefs of the Michigan Department of Natural Resources.
The NRC's seven appointees will meet in downstate Roscommon. Before the panel votes, the commission's Policy Committee on Wildlife and Fisheries will hear presentations Wednesday from wolf experts.
Scheduled to speak are William VanderZouwen of the Wisconsin Department of Natural Resources and Dan Stark of the Minnesota Department of Natural Resources. Wisconsin and Minnesota both held wolf hunts this past winter.
Written testimony from outside experts will also be read into the record. Those contributing include Rolf Peterson who has extensively studied wolves on Isle Royale and David Mech of the U.S. Geological Survey, another prominent wolf expert.
DNR Wildlife Division Chief Russ Mason said he will read the testimony aloud if either Mech or Peterson does not attend the meeting.
The DNR chiefs' recommendation was recently revised to include the latest wolf population winter survey results, which showed the minimum number of wolves in the Upper Peninsula had dipped from 687 in 2012 to 658 this year.
DNR bear and furbearer specialist Adam Bump said biologists think there could be several reasons for the decrease, including some stabilization of the population.
"It's within our confidence level," Bump said. "It's within the error rate that we expect. It's not a significant decline."
In addition to the population level, the local densities of wolves have shifted a little bit, prompting adjustments to the wolf management zone proposals, Bump said.
The total number wolves recommended for a hunt is 43, down from 47 previously proposed. The objectives of the hunt are to reduce the numbers of nuisance wolf complaints and chronic livestock and dog depredations.
DNR officials defined three wolf management units where public hunting could begin Nov. 1 and end Dec. 31, unless harvest quotas were reached sooner. In each unit, a different wolf management objective was set. The season limit recommendation is one wolf per licensed hunter.
Over time, the DNR has said hunting could change the behavior of wolves, making them more wary of people, residential areas and farms. A reduction in wolves displaying fearless behavior would reduce the number of nuisance wolf complaints. Hunting could also reduce the abundance of wolves in the management units, which may result in fewer conflicts.
For each wolf management unit, different primary objectives were identified, along with recommended harvest quotas:
– Wolf Management Unit A: A portion of Gogebic County, including the city of Ironwood and the encompassing township. Unit quota: Originally 21 wolves, now 16. Objective: reduce nuisance wolf complaints, which have totaled 91 since 2010.
– Wolf Management Unit B: Portions of Baraga, Houghton, Ontonagon and Gogebic counties. Unit quota: Originally 18 wolves, now 19. Objective: Reduce the number of chronic livestock depredations. Since 2010, 80 livestock depredation events have been documented from 11 farms.
– Wolf Management Unit C: Portions of Luce and Mackinac counties. Unit quota: 8 wolves. Objective: Reduce the number of chronic livestock and dog depredations. Since 2010, the DNR recorded 25 livestock depredation events from seven farms and four depredation events involving 12 dogs.
Bump said if the NRC approves the recommendation it will then be "an approved system for harvest" of wolves.
DNR officials would then wait to see how political developments unfold, including the results of signature verification for a statewide ballot initiative aimed at reversing a law signed in December reclassifying wolves as game species in Michigan.
If the initiative is approved to go before voters, no wolf hunt could occur until after the referendum is decided.
Meanwhile, a bill is headed to Gov. Rick Snyder's office that was approved in the state Legislature last week, which would give the NRC and the Legislature the only authority to list animals as game species, and with only the Legislature able to remove them from the list.
If the ballot initiative is approved by voters, the new legislation Snyder will consider could see wolves added to the games species list and a hunt authorized by the NRC and then only the Legislature could remove them.


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Health and wellness is a primary focus at The Spa at The Breakers (561-653-6656) in Palm Beach. This summer, the luxury resort further extended that commitment by hiring Ashley Pearson (right) as its first-ever health and wellness coach. Pearson comes with more than 16 years of yoga experience and certification in Pranayama, meditation, yogic nutrition, guided imagery and Pilates. With Pearson on board, The Spa now provides services such as whole-life assessments, stress management assistance, nutritional guidance, smart shopping advice, pantry makeovers and wellness lectures. Through September 30, The Spa is offering two packages, Spring In To Balance and Spa Detox, so guests can experience a balanced life, one meditation class at a time.
Health and wellness coach Ashley Pearson guides yoga students at The Breakers. With a vast background, Pearson delivers a wellness experience for both body and mind.
Photography by LILA Photo


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Can't wait for this one tonight.
Agree with The Fight Dr. Calzaghe in a unanimous decision.
Respect Hopkins, think hes an asshole, also think hes overrated at this late stage of his career. Last two wins to re-elevate his status were over lesser (and unimpressive) versions of Tarver and Winky.
Ring Mag still has the cat #3 lb for lb. Calzaghe below him. Calazghe -240 tonight.
I'll be betting on and pulling for Calzaghe.
Unanimous decision, he'll knock him down once late.


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iHerb Customer Reviews
Savings of: $6.99 (50% off)
This works, and it's much easier than shots!
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Excellent product
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Not the good B12
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This is cyanocobalamin not methylcobalamin. I bought it by mistake. The cyanocobalamin COSTS the body methyl groups which controle homocysteine and reduce inflamation. We want methyl groups, so only ever take the good natural form of B12 : methylcobalamin.
Good product
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What differentiates this product, is that it has 2000 mcg as opposed to the standard 1,000 mcg B-12. Even if the body dispels the extra, it's there if the body requires it. Good value overall.
Source Naturals B12 sl
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I do find that my energy level has increased. This is a very good product.
Source Naturals, B-12 Sublingual
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I have taken B-12 for quite awhile and the is the only brand that has turned my hands and feet orange.I know it's the B-12 because I quit taking it after only one day. It only took about a week to fade back to normal.I've bought other Source Naturals products & never had any problems.Please let me know if anyone else has had a problem with this B-12.


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Yesterday Sherman Dickman, Myk Melez and I met with Tantek Çelik and Ryan King at the Technorati office in San Francisco to discuss potential support for microformats in future versions of Firefox.
Topics Discussed:
- They have created a Web service to convert hCard and hCalendar microformats to their binary equivalents, called X2V.
- Demo of Operator
- The reason Yahoo! has added microformats to their various properties is the same reason they were early supporters of RSS, because it is the right thing to do.
- When sending microformated content to an application, we have to remember to include the URL back to where the content came from. This is important because 1) it enables the user to go full circle, and 2) it gives the content producer an additional reason to embed microformats in their Web site.
- The user interface of microformat detection (I'll be blogging about this soon) [update: here is the post]
- The user interface of microformat creation (I'll be blogging about this soon)
- The various threats to microformats. Embrace and Extend is a strategy that emerges out of corporations that have a culture of secrecy. A corporation's level of secrecy translates to the probability that they may attempt to Embrace and Extend microformats.
- Adding microformats to HTML forms to enable perfect autofill.
- Impact of microformated content on accessibility.
- Capturing the microformats that users encounter on the Web, and then enabling users to tag this information. This would allow the user to tag people, events, locations and Web pages with the same tagging scheme. This could potentially fit into our Places strategy.
- We should expose rel-license somewhere in the chrome. This is something that Creative Commons has been asking us to do in Firefox.
- It turns out that the real winner in the battle between Internet Explorer and Firefox is OGIO:
Technorati Tags: microformats


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I'm down here in Australia, where the government is a bit stalled for the past two weeks at the moment, known formally as being managed by the [Caretaker government]. Apparently, there is a gap between the outgoing administration and the incoming administration, and the caretaker government is doing as little as possible until the new regime takes over. They are still counting votes, including in some cases dummy ballots known as "donkey votes", the Australian version of the hanging chad. Three independent parties are also trying to decide which major party they will support to finalize the process.
While we are on the topic of a government stalled, I feel bad for the state of Virginia in the United States. Apparently, one of their supposedly high-end enterprise class EMC Symmetrix DMX storage systems, supporting 26 different state agencies in Virginia, crashed on August 25th and now more than a week later, many of those agencies are still down, including the Department of Motor Vehicles and the Department of Taxation and Revenue.
Many of the articles in the press on this event have focused on what this means for the reputation of EMC. Not surprisingly, EMC says that this failure is unprecedented, but really this is just one in a long series of failures from EMC. It reminds me of the last time EMC had a public failure with a dual-controller CLARiiON a few months ago that stopped another company from their operations. There is nothing unique in the physical equipment itself, all IT gear can break or be taken down by some outside force, such as a natural disaster. The real question, though, is why haven't EMC and the State Government been able to restore operations many days after the hardware was fixed?
In the Boston Globe, Zeus Kerravala, a data storage analyst at Yankee Group in Boston, is quoted as saying that such a high-profile breakdown could undermine EMC's credibility with large businesses and government agencies. "I think it's extremely important for them,'' said Kerravala. "When you see a failure of this magnitude, and their inability to get a customer like the state of Virginia up and running almost immediately, all companies ought to look at that and raise their eyebrows.''
Was the backup and disaster recovery solution capable of the scale and service level requirements needed by vital state agencies? Had they tested their backups to ensure they were running correctly, and had they tested their recovery plans? Were they monitoring the success of recent backup operations?
Eventually, the systems will be back up and running, fines and penalties will be paid, and perhaps the guy who chose to go with EMC might feel bad enough to give back that new set of golf clubs, or whatever ridiculously expensive gift EMC reps might offer to government officials these days to influence the purchase decision making process.
(Note: I am not accusing any government employee in particular working at the state of Virginia of any wrongdoing, and mention this only as a possibility of what might have happened. I am sure the media will dig into that possibility soon enough during their investigations, so no sense in me discussing that process any further.)
So what lessons can we learn from this?
- Lesson 1: You don't just buy technology, you also are choosing to work with a particular vendor
IBM stands behind its products. Choosing a product strictly on its speeds and feeds misses the point. A study IBM and Mercer Consulting Group conducted back in 2007 found that only 20 percent of the purchase decision for storage was from the technical capabilities. The other 80 percent were called "wrapper attributes", such as who the vendor was, their reputation, the service, support and warranty options.
- Lesson 2: Losing a single disk system is a disaster, so disaster recovery plans should apply
IBM has a strong Business Continuity and Recovery Services (BCRS) services group to help companies and government agencies develop their BC/DR plans. In the planning process, various possible incidents are identified, recovery point objectives (RPO) and recovery time objectives (RTO) and then appropriate action plans are documentede on how to deal with them. For example, if the state of Virginia had an RPO of 48 hours, and an RTO of 5 days, then when the failure occurred on August 25, they could have recovered up to August 23 level data(48 hours prior to the incident) and be up and running by August 30 (five days after the incident). I don't personally know what RPO and RTO they planned for, but certainly it seems like they missed it by now already.
- Lesson 3: BC/DR Plans only work if you practice them often enough
Sadly, many companies and government agencies make plans, but never practice them, so they have no idea if the plans will work as expected, or if they are fundamentally flawed. Just as we often have fire drills that force everyone to stop what they are doing and vacate the office building, anyone with an IT department needs to practice BC/DR plans often enough so that you can ensure the plan itself is solid, but also so that the people involved know what to do and their respective roles in the recovery process.
- Lesson 4: This can serve as a wake-up call to consider Cloud Computing as an alternative option
Are you still doing IT in your own organization? Do you feel all of the IT staff have been adequately trained for the job? If your biggest disk system completely failed, not just a minor single or double drive failure, but a huge EMC-like failure, would your IT department know how to recover in less than five days? Perhaps this will serve as a wake-up call to consider alternative IT delivery options. The advantage of big Cloud Service Providers (Microsoft, Google, Yahoo, Amazon, SalesForce.com and of course, IBM) is that they are big enough to have worked out all the BC/DR procedures, and have enough resources to switch over to in case any individual disk system fails.
To learn more on this event, see the following articles: Washington Post, ZDnet.com, and Government Computer News.
technorati tags: EMC, Symmetrix, DMX, Failure, Virginia, State Government, DMV, IBM, Business Continuity, Disaster Recovery


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Toby Carvery Frimley
114 Portsmouth Road, Frimley, Camberley, Surrey, GU15 1HS
114 Portsmouth Road, Frimley, Camberley, Surrey, GU15 1HS
Lighter nights are here again... and the home of the roast just got even better, with a brand new menu for the warmer seasons.
Our baps and baguettes are perfect for sunny days - but if you fancy one of our famous carvery dinners, we heartily recommend our new rosemary and thyme roasties and wholegrain mustard mash.
You can still enjoy our traditional potatoes, but we've expanded your choice to FOUR varieties - and our seasoning will change throughout the year, so you can look forward to trying new flavours with your roast.
Then there's our yummy new range of puds, including our limited-edition Hobnob Sundae,White Aero Sundae and Lemon shortbread cheesecake - deliciously summery.
Plus, if you visit Toby Carvery Frimley between Monday and Saturday, you can tuck into our £6.99 two-course offer. It's available all day long - just drop by and choose a selected main course and pud (see our menu for details).
And finally - have you signed up for our news and offers via email? It's an easy way to make sure you don't miss any Toby Treats or exclusive deals... so sign up now and keep an eye on your inbox.


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Excellent looking Pizza Norma. What was the bake time and temp? You said you didn't get the crust down yet. What is it lacking? Also what brand cheese and sauce did u use?Nate
Norma,Those pizzas look great. I'm getting hungry. Did you notice any difference in the olive oil vs. the vegetable oil?--Tim
Norma,Did you forget the water? Peter
Norma,This is what Trenton Bill's dough formulation looks like, for three dough balls and for a single dough ball, including the extra tablespoon of All Trumps flour:Dough for Three PizzasAll Trumps High-Gluten Flour (100%):Water (66.8246%):IDY (0.77142%):Salt (1.02857%):Olive Oil (0.94285%):Sugar (1.05%):Total (170.61744%):466.67 g | 16.46 oz | 1.03 lbs311.85 g | 11 oz | 0.69 lbs3.6 g | 0.13 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.2 tsp | 0.4 tbsp4.8 g | 0.17 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.86 tsp | 0.29 tbsp4.4 g | 0.16 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.98 tsp | 0.33 tbsp4.9 g | 0.17 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.23 tsp | 0.41 tbsp796.22 g | 28.09 oz | 1.76 lbs | TF = N/ANote: Dough is for 3 dough balls for 12" pizzas; thickness factor = (28.09/3)/(3.14159 x 6 x 6) = 0.08279; no bowl residue compensationDough for One PizzaAll Trumps High-Gluten Flour (100%):Water (66.8246%):IDY (0.77142%):Salt (1.02857%):Olive Oil (0.94285%):Sugar (1.05%):Total (170.61744%):155.56 g | 5.49 oz | 0.34 lbs103.95 g | 3.67 oz | 0.23 lbs1.2 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.4 tsp | 0.13 tbsp1.6 g | 0.06 oz | 0 lbs | 0.29 tsp | 0.1 tbsp1.47 g | 0.05 oz | 0 lbs | 0.33 tsp | 0.11 tbsp1.63 g | 0.06 oz | 0 lbs | 0.41 tsp | 0.14 tbsp265.41 g | 9.36 oz | 0.59 lbs | TF = N/ANote: Dough is for one dough ball for a 12" pizza; thickness factor = 0.08279; no bowl residue compensationPeter
Norma,I was waiting to see how Trenton Bill would respond before commenting further. Based on what Trenton Bill said, I can see how a dough with a hydration of almost 67% (plus almost 1% oil) and about 0.77% IDY would ferment quite nicely over a roughly 3 hour period at room temperature and be amenable to forming into a skin with ease. The low salt level will also allow the dough to remain fairly soft and ferment faster. I suspect that using 1% salt might yield a finished crust that is on the bland side, especially since most people have become acclimated to high levels of salt in the food that they eat. The easiest and quickest and best way to prove out the dough formulation is to make a single dough ball and see what you get. Since you know the thickness factor, you might use that in the expanded dough calculating tool to make a large size pizza. A 12" skin will almost always be easier to work with than say, a 16" pizza or higher. Peter
I'd like to whip one of these up for tonight's pizza. Would you all like me to time it for Trenton Bill's 3 hr. window?Bob
Norma, what do you prefer to dust your peel with? I actually like wondra--there's something about it that allows the pizza to release nicely and it doesn't stick to the bottom like regular flour does. Sometimes I use a fine semolina if I'm out of the wondra. I used to use a bit of sea salt with the flour, but the OH is watching his sodium intake, so...
I just finished devouring most of the 12in. Trenton Bill's 3hr. dough. I was very pleasantly surprised with this pizza...thank you for posting about this Norma! Of course; it doesn't bowl you over with flavor, but it was not bad at all...the crust went really well with the cheese and tomatoes. Easily better than my local slice joint...this had a nice thin crisp crunch and tender chew that lasted; unlike the slice place's that loses it's snap and turns leather like within just maybe 10-15 min. out of the oven.I had no problems stretching this out flat and spread the sauce almost to the edge. I believe the dough final weight would need to be increased a little if one wants to stretch and have a larger more pronounced cornicione. Maybe not; I'm still learning the technique.It made a great easy peazzy pizza though and makes for a nice emergency dough in my opinion. Here's the pics....oh, baked straight on a 550 stone.
Bob,Thanks for posting about your pizza using Trenton Bill's 3 hr. dough. I am glad you liked the pizza. Do you think more salt should have been added to give more flavor to the crust? I like to hear the part about the thin crisp crunch and the tender chew that lasted. I am also glad you had no problems stretching the dough out flat. What kind of flour did you use? Your pizza looks very tasty to me and I like how your rim crust browned. I really don't think Trenton Bill and I are going for a pronounced rim, but you could up the TF if you want a more pronounced rim. Your mozzarella looks good too.Norma
Norma,To be honest; the salt is the one thing I changed from the formula Peter gave at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,25401.msg260164.html#msg260164.Instead of .29 t salt I used .50...half a teaspoon. I think it could probably still take a bit more if one wanted before becoming tough as this was a pretty tender dough.I used All Trumps flour. Yes, I went pretty heavy with the cheese. It was equal parts Trader Joe's whole milk, Stella LM/PS, and Stella smoked provo.Bob
Bob,Thanks for telling me you did use more salt in Trenton Bill's recipe Peter figured out. I find it interesting that you think that when using Trenton Bill's recipe with All Trumps that you got a pretty tender crust. I appreciate you also posted about the cheese blend you used. Did you use Trenton Bills mixing method, or one of your own?Norma
Diana,I never tried Wondra flour as a peel flour, but am glad you like it. I always use rice flour at market, unless a certain kind of pizza call for another flour. I really like rice flour as a release agent for a wooden peel. Sometimes at home I use regular flours, unless the formulation is a really high hydration dough.The Mellow Mushroom flour release agent is cornmeal as I posted at Reply 1251 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3940.msg169788.html#msg169788 and Peter also posted on that thread is you use the search feature on that thread. A few times I tried other flours. Sometimes at Steve's home for his WFO we just use regular flours as a release agent. Soon I will be trying the Dustinator like Papa John's uses that Peter posted about at Reply 493 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6758.msg260046.html#msg260046 You might want to look what Tom Lehmann recommends at Reply 17 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,23324.msg236800.html#msg236800 and from Tom's other posts on peel flour. If you search what other members use as peel flour you might see that different members have different preferences for what peel flours work for them. Norma
Norma,I forgot about Trenton Bill giving his mixing method. I mixed this the same way I always do my Chi-thin doughs...dump everything in a bowl, mix with a spoon, dump on counter and hand need. Although this dough was much more wet/sticky than Chi-thins and I don't have my technique down very good for wet doughs so this dough really only got mixed till it came together and just a couple 3 or 4 kneads on the counter. It was very cottage cheese like and this dough did not hardly rise at all after 4hrs. in a 100 degree oven.As you can see in the pics I got great bottom browning, even some slight char. By tender I am referring to the inside of the crust...outside had thin crispness....rim was still crisp even hours later.This was a good tasting pizza and I will soon be making again...would like to try it just a bit thicker.Bob
Norma, I use rice flour from time to time, and I prefer it to semolina or regular flour for dusting the peel. I also like rice flour for dusting bread. Have you ever made bread with some of the flour being rice flour? It has a very nice moist crumb. Here are some pics of some bread that I made using 25% rice flour and 75%Occident.


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Rapper's Delight: Fabolous, J.Cole, Jim Jones And A Gang Of Industry Insiders Attend Wale's 'Ambition' Listening Party In NYC [PICS]
- By Bossip Staff
3 of 12
Even though he might be mad at us, it appears that Wale has pleased the people with his new album Ambition.
Last night some music industry heavy-hitters all gathered at the Ganesvoort Park Avenue in NYC to take a listen to Maybach Music Group (and interviewer interrupter, LOL!) Wale's forthcoming album Ambition. It's pretty obvious from the pictures that the DMV rapper is more than excited to have his career trending upward in a big way.
Are you excited about Wale's new album??
Flip the script to see the pics from the star studded event.


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All quotes tagged Talked
(10798 quotes found)
"It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt."
"If the person you are talking to doesn't appear to be listening, be patient. It may simply be that he has a small piece of fluff in his ear."
"I enjoy talking to you more than anybody else because I never feel I am giving myself away and so can admit to shady, dishonest, crawling, cowardly, unjust, arrogant, snobbish, lecherous, perverted and generally shameful feelings that I don't want anybody else to know about; but most of all because I am always on the verge of violent laughter when talking to you.
If you were here, I keep thinking, we would spend the time in talk and drink and smoke and I should be laughing a lot of the time, and I should be enjoying myself a lot of the time."


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iHerb Customer Reviews
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while walking to a downtown concert last week i was approached by a homeless man. in chicago, a group of homeless try selling a newspaper, more of a brochure, really...for whatever charitable donation they can get for it. the paper is written by, printed by and completely constructed by the local homeless people (donations...such as printing presses and the paper it is printed on are not only welcome, but encouraged.) it wasn't the first time this has happened. and truth be told, i'm a lot more likely to keep walking past the guy without any remorse because either i have someplace to be, i have no disposable income to pass out, or maybe even just indifferent to their current situation at that particular time.
i flipped the guy a five...wished him luck and told him he could keep the newspaper for his next "sale". and know what? i felt sort of good about myself. but that got me to thinking...why do we give to charity? i know there can be charitable donations for tax reasons. and there is the feeling that you may have done something, however inconsequencial, to make a part of some elses life just a bit better. but i thought for the first time, i did that for me. i feel better having done that.
is that selfish? that is, can an act of kindness be as much (or more) about yourself than about whom you are trying to help? and if so...is it still a charitable act?


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Calling Cards- 5/21/12
Mary Meza uses phone cards to call her family in the Dominican Republic. But she complains she doesn't always get as much calling time as she expects. Mary Meza "I get really angry because I think it's not fair." Consumer Reports analyzed more than 130 prepaid phone cards. Most cost just two to five dollars. They look like bargains. But Consumer Reports found lots of problems. Robert Tiernan Consumer Reports "Three quarters of the cards we looked at didn't tell you how much it cost to make a call. You usually never found out until you were on the phone."15283466
And Consumer Reports found the amount of calling time varies tremendously. For example, these cards both cost two dollars, but this one gave us 200 minutes to call Mexico City. This one, only five minutes. And there can be lots of fees, which may be listed on the back in tiny type. Those prepaid phone card fees can include a fee for connecting or disconnecting or calling on a cell phone or calling from a pay phone. There can even be a daily maintenance fee. "The fees can really eat into the value of the cards. These were completely drained before we ever made our international call." In some cases, Consumer Reports was able to get the fees reversed, but only after calling customer service. Bob Tiernan "If you frequently make calls overseas, there are better alternatives." You can use Skype on your computer or smart phone to call overseas for modest rates, which are clearly spelled out on Skype's website. George Delgado "Skype is phenomenal." And if, like George Delgado, you and the person you are calling both have Internet, the call can be free. ."
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Oops. I meant "its designation" (no apostrophe). Sorry.
I noticed earlier: In paragraph #8 of the magazine's response to the open letter, you identify Tom Kealey as a "Stanford University professor." According to his own online information and other sources, he was a Stegner Fellow (and that, to me, is about as impressive as it gets following--or sometimes in place of--an MFA, so I'm not diminishing that achievement in the least). My understanding is that in the wake of his Stegner, he became a Jones Lecturer at Stanford. (He has a lectureship there now, but I don't know it's designation.) Anyway, as someone who used to write for a couple of newspapers, I thought I'd clarify that detail.
It surprises me that P&W is circling the wagons on this issue. Providing trustworthy information on MFA's should be a very high priority for P&W. It's too important a mission to do it by using indefensible methodology and in turn alienating about 200 and more of the most experienced and talented professionals working in the field. P&W's brand has been diminished. I just don't see any benefit in continuing to provide this vital service in a careless and cheap way. This is a real opportunity for P&W. Now that you have everybody's attention, I would assume that a few of them at least would be willing to contribute to a methodologically sound assessment of MFA programs for next year. Don't lose this opportunity by circling the wagons and wrapping yourself in the flag of 'serving writers.' Please, change your mission to "serving writers well." Clearly, these rankings do not. It only takes a little common sense, a wasted 15 minutes reading the overabundance of methodology disclosures and your overabundance of cautions, and a glance at the names on the letter to recognize that.
Dear Mary,
What saddened me about your response letter is that its tone struck me as defensive, even aggressive at times. I can understand that nobody likes to be criticized, and that this whole ordeal has been a bit embarrassing for the magazine, but I really feel like you missed a golden opportunity to extend an olive branch to the signatories and move toward some type of friendly resolution.
Instead, you seemed to spend most of the letter defending the rankings and presenting what seemed to me a point-by-point counterargument, and the overall tone was a sort of "us vs. them" one, not a "let's work together" one. To put it another way, the content of the letter sounded eerily similar to they types of defenses I've heard Seth Abramson make countless times online. Unlike Seth, however, your primary audience is not just students applying to MFA programs, but ALL writers, including the signatories of that letter, many of whom have contributed to your magazine in the past and even appeared on its cover.
My concern is that this issue simply isn't going to go away. If the people opposing these rankings had 200 distinguished signatories this year, they'll have 400 next year, and even more the next. What's going to happen is that the writing world is going to become completely polarized over this—with MFA professors and graduates on one side and prospective MFA students on the other—and the source of this division will, of course, be the rankings. I know that Seth has made his own allegiances clear, but that doesn't mean that Poets & Writers has to take Seth's side, simply because he's the author of the rankings. In fact, my hope is that you'll find a way to distance yourself from Seth and work with some of the signatories toward a friendly resolution, one that leaves everyone happy and the MFA world unified once again. I suspect that Seth will likely stubbornly resist any changes to his rankings, but that doesn't mean that you have to tc concede to him. After all, Seth works for you, not the other way around,
I obviously can't speak for Dinty W. Moore of Ohio University. Perhaps he hadn't read the methodology earlier (it does take some time to read).
Here's a link to a site that covers some of the most basic challenges in using statistics. The author is a professor emeritus of mathematics at UT-Austin who was also affiliated with the university's Division of Statistics and Computational Science. (You can find out more about her on the "About" page included on the site.)
I suppose it's nice to be able to both condemn a ranking and then celebrate it when it benefits you:
Ohio University's Creative Writing Ph.D. program was ranked third in the nation for 2012 by of Poets and Writers, a nationally distributed literary and educational magazine.
This is the first time that the creative writing program has received an official ranking by a national organization. There have been unofficial rankings in the past where OHIO's program has always been highly regarded.
Dinty Moore, professor of English and director of the Creative Writing Program responded to the news, "We were thrilled to be ranked the number three program nationally; both because the ranking is certainly impressive, but also because the faculty and students have been working very hard these past years to enhance the profile of the program."
-When magazines (like US News & World Report) rank programs, they don't allow the faculty or administrators to rate their own institutions. They use a peer-evaluation form, where they have them rank programs based on their personal knowledge. They are told to rank them: 1(marginal) - 5(distinguished), and "don't know" if they are not familiar with the programs. In other words, the chefs don't rate their own meals. This is one major problem with the P&W rankings; they don't use peer evaluation, they us data from a group who have no experience with MFA programs. It would be like asking me to rank Law Schools--I have no knowledge of law schools.
-Also, I direct this to Seth (if he's here), in your methodology, you seem to be exaggerating the weight that lawyers, judges and law firm hiring coordinators (found under "Assessment Scores by Lawyers/Judges") have in the ranking of Law Schools. It should be noted, for those reading, that "Quality Assessments" is broken into 2 groups: .15 for "Assessments by Lawyers/Judges", and .25 by "Peer Assessment"--this equals .40 for the law school rankings. As you can see, the lawyers/judges assessment doesn't even count for half of the .40. On top of that, assessments aren't even half of the ranking scores. I will also say that at least the lawyers and judges have gone through programs, and can reasonably evaluate programs through past experience and personal knowledge--and if they can't, they put "don't know". MFA Applicants have no point of reference, they are new to the process. I feel it is misleading to equate a MFA Applicant to a Lawyer or Judge. Lastly, why do you think that CW Programs were receptive to giving you information for the rankings? I am merely wondering...
-To those interested, US News has a very good explanation of their methodology. Below is the Law School methodology.
I am a serious applicant to the MFA programs and have spent an enormous amount of time researching the particulars of programs, which is truly an ordeal. It is peculiar to me that schools, who are at once voted in the top 10 of Atlantic's best programs, are happy to flaunt their appointment, however when their rank isn't uphelt by another, arguably more in-depth ranking system, these same schools become hostile. As an unbiased applicant who would have liked to apply to Boston U or Columbia, for example, I have found, in my own research, that these schools have run on unmerited prestige without being able to back their programs noteriety with those things most important to us prospective students. Most notable, funding, job placement, fellowship placement, and departmental requirements. Both BU and Columbia should not find it so heinous an insult as to be ranked where they did with thier vastly inferior if not non-existent funding, poor job and fellowship placements and arbitrary language requirements. It is as pretentious as it is presumptuous to assume and expect one's ranking without having to prove it. I am thankful for the important work done by Seth Abramson and P&W and will continue to use it, to hope it continues, and like any reasonable person, use it as a jumping off point from which I will further my research. Schools should not lash back with contempt but rather inquire as to the nature of these things, to consider the voices of those seeking their schools, and to honestly, sincerely work toward providing programs that better serve their purpose. As for Mr. Epstein's analogy I would like to say that it makes equally as little sense to ask the chefs of the restaurants in question to rate themselves...a clear conflict of interest.
You show your immaturity by pointing out a simple mistake. Do you have ties to BU? Were you rejected by their program? I feel there needs to be transparency in your comments toward him?
That, or just grow up.
HW: Who is this "Ms. Epstein" you're referring to? I'm not familiar with the woman you're defending, so I'm not sure I understand your rude comments.
Dear Unclenuncle,
-1st off, I assure you, applying to any school is a daunting experience, especially a top ranked one. But the only thing you can lose is the application fee.
-Secondly, if you read my post you would have noticed that I believe listing them alphabetically would work best. I'm sure that P&W would rather have them ranked because it seduces many students applying (like yourself) to buy a copy--much like the US News & World Report college ranking issues.
-Also, I'm not understanding how you equate The Huffington Post only printing the Top 25 Underrated programs to my comments. The Huffington Post is not an authority on CW programs, and the article had a specific focus in mind (25 underrated programs), whereas P&W is a magazine focused on writers, and the article consists of a complete list of every program. And back to my earlier point, wouldn't you get the same information, the same introduction to these non-ranked programs if they were merely listed?
-Next, Leslie's analogy is actually a very good one. It is merely pointing out that students not currently attending a program shouldn't be able to evaluate programs they haven't, or won't apply to. Your analogy is off because the customers (the students in this case) haven't eaten at any restaurant, so they have no background for judging any restaurant. Like Leslie said, they are merely looking at the menu. I'd like to add, it seems like you are more offended by Leslie wanting to cut you out of the process, than by her statements.
-Lastly, Seth does mention that students are his best avenue for these rankings, but that doesn't mean it's true--it merely means that was what was most available. As you can tell, by the 200 faculty members who have signed the letter, many professionals in the field disagree.
I'm the one who wrote the initial posting on the page devoted to the top 50 programs. I can appreciate the editorial response above for its calm tone. And I, too, don't see how an alum of a particular program could possibly compare that program with others.
On the other hand, I don't know how the editorial staff of P&W can possibly know for sure how thoroughly people read their magazine.
But what I really take issue with is the claim that the magazine "adheres to the highest journalistic standards" (and apart from the rankings, I respect the magazine very much, by the way). Where I don't see that happening is in the handling of reader comments on this issue. I avoided commenting on the rankings (which I regard as poll results) on various blogs where they were discussed because I'd seen extremely rancorous arguments between S. Abramson and others about that topic and others, and I suspected that I lacked the stomach for that kind of exchange. I assumed, though, that the comments section on the Web site of a major publication would involve a more civil exchange of views.
Pretentiousness is not generally considered online abuse. Nonetheless, if I came across as pretentious in my responses to Seth, I'm sorry; I can't say what "anyone who knows me" thinks of me because I can't pretend to know the opinions of everyone who knows me. But I can say with some confidence that those who know me WELL don't regard me as pretentious, which is conduct those people don't tolerate from anyone. In responding to Mr. Abramson's reaction to my posting, I fell into a fight-fire-with-fire mentality, and I realize that was a mistake.
At the same time, I stand by my original posting on that page. There was nothing inflammatory or unreasonable about it. In the comments sections of major newspapers or other major magazines, I've never seen the author of an article repeatedly argue with her or his critics. I can't imagine, say, Eugene Robinson arguing with his readers or jumping onto others' blogs to argue with readers there who disagree with his views; I can't imagine his doing that even if the Washington Post didn't have its current policy regarding their journalists' contact with readers, a policy I consider too restrictive. I think an author's responses can play an important role in setting the tone for readers' comments. (Someone on the other page told me "shut the f*ck up," something I cannot imagine saying--with or without the asterisks--to anyone else online. Someone else ordered me to "leave Seth alone." S. Abramson's tendency to argue with others on numerous other sites should make clear that he hardly needs protection from me. In fact, my response to the rankings is the first time I've ever commented online about him or his work.)
He identifies himself as a freelance journalist. I worked for two and-a-half years as a journalist for a company owned by a large Midwestern newspaper. I never would have dreamed of engaging in angry debates with my readers. Perhaps it would be more appropriate--and more professional--for P&W authors to write one response at the end of the period during which comments can be made by readers. That's the way it's traditionally been done by many other magazines.
Various news organizations--Reuters, the Guardian, etc.--have specific policies regarding how journalists should interact online with readers. The one recommended on this site is more or less typical of what I've seen in specific policies:
In one of Mr. Abramson's postings, part of my name was revealed. The option that allows those commenting to identify themselves by a username led me to believe that my privacy would be respected. I think that P&W should post in a prominent location the magazine's online privacy policy. If authors are allowed to reveal the identities of their critics, shouldn't potential critics be informed of this before they post a comment?
I definitely appreciate why you and other current applicants find these rankings helpful, but you also have to keep in mind that at some point in the future—perhaps after you've gone through an MFA Program and feel an allegiance to that program—your feelings on this issue might change.
In other words, it's not a coincidence that the people defending these rankings are primarily "current" applicants, and the people questioning them are individuals who have already gone through the experience and completed their degree. At some point, you'll probably be a member of the latter group, and, accordingly, your feelings might change.
Let me give you just one example of what I'm talking about. Let's say you get into a program you're excited to attend; you have an amazing experience there and gain an appreciation for some of the aspects of the program that aren't reflected in these rankings (the high quality of teaching, the incredible reading series, the friendly and supportive nature of the community, etc.) Then let's say that three years down the road the university that houses your program decides to cut your program's budget for reasons beyond the program's control. Suddenly word gets out about the change in funding and suddenly the application numbers drop, the program's ranking plummets 15 spots in the P&W rankings, and Seth (or someone else) begins to make disparaging comments online about how your program doesn't support its students. You try to protest that your program does support its students, that there's much more to your program than just funding, that your program's poor ranking isn't really an accurate reflection of how good it really is, etc., but no one wants to hear you. What they see is a number placed next to your program and that number determines, to a large part, how they feel about it.
This is just one example of something that happens fairly often, but I hope you can see how easily you might find yourself questioning these rankings once you're on the other side and feel that your own program isn't being treated fairly and that the applicants determining your program's ranking aren't getting the whole picture.
Please don't resort to an unranked list for next year! The ranking, like all of Seth Abramson's work, has been incredibly helpful. Thank you for publishing it and for standing behind its credibility.
- To Leslie Epstein: It's hard not to be a little offended by your analogy about "asking people who are standing outside a restaurant studying the menu how they liked the food." A more apt analogy would be asking people who had eaten at the restaurant how they'd compare it to restaurants they've never tried. Abramson makes it clear why MFA applicants are the best study pool in the ranking FAQ.
- To hello world's comment about low-ranking schools being unfairly represented, I'm baffled. So if we didn't have the ranking, schools like U of Alaska Fairbanks and UCF would somehow get more attention? And the fact is, the only reason I know of these schools is because of Seth's article in the Huffington Post: The Top 25 Underrated Creative Writing MFA Programs. By your statement, the school that came in 26th should have the same argument.
- Most of all, as an MFA applicant, I feel talked down to by this letter. Deciding to be a writer is such a fragile act of faith. And the application road is terrifying and confusing and lonely. The first site I looked at was UT, James Michener staring me down, saying "Don't waste your time or my money." Good Lord, who do I think I am to apply to a place like this? That's what we all think, even the most exceptionally talented among us.
The P&W ranking isn't much of a hand-holding, but it's enough to get us started. And it mirrors the conversations you hear at workshops, the advice you get from writing teachers and forums. It's important that we know which schools are rising to the top in the minds of the people most invested in the subject, and why. It helps us form our own filters for which programs might fit us best, which is what we applicants all ultimately do: We put the rankings aside and make our own map.
Thank you for your response letter. Since your final paragraph seems to invite constructive suggestions, I thought I'd offer a few friendly ones that might help to resolve this issue once and for all.
First of all, Poets & Writers has always been, in my opinion, a wonderful resource for writers, a place where we can go to learn about fellowships, awards, writing contests, and other opportunities in the field. It has also been a place where we can read interviews, articles and profiles that offer insights into both the artistic and business side of writing. In short, Poets & Writers has always been a "friend" to writers, a place that provides information that helps us on our individual journeys.
That said, what people seem to object to most about these rankings is that they go beyond simply providing information to young writers and instead assign numerical values to specific programs, leaving many people unhappy, frustrated, and confused. With this in mind, I think a subtle tweaking in the actual language you use to present this information would go a long way toward pleasing everyone. Here are my suggestions:
1. Remove the word "rankings." I know this word is much more attractive than a phrase like "Popularity among 2012 applicants," but it's also not an accurate description of what the data actually is--applicants are not asked to "rank" programs; they're asked to list the schools they're applying to. If you simply included a hierarchical list based on "popularity," and called it that, you'd be providing the exact same information without inviting any of the unnecessary criticism.
2. Remove the word "votes" as well as the "votes" column. I don't think the specific number of votes is really that relevant to most applicants, and, again, as someone mentioned earlier, applicants are not actually being asked to "vote." If you took away that word and that column, I think a lot of the criticism would simply go away.
3. When possible, I'd also remove numerical values in other parts of the rankings and simply use general categories, just as you do with other aspects like "program size." For example, with funding, you could have "Excellent," Good," "Fair" and "Poor." Or with selectivity, you could have "Extremely," "Very," "Moderately," and so on. Basically, by removing the numerical values, you'd be removing the impression that there are enormous gaps between particular programs, while at the same time still providing applicants with the exact same information.
Personally, I think that if you made some of these very small changes, nobody in their right mind would have a problem with the service you were providing to potential applicants. The applicants would still benefit greatly from the information, and nobody on the other end would feel left out or misrepresented. And perhaps most importantly, you'd remain in keeping with what has traditionally been the role of Poets & Writers in the literary world: a friend to writers and a source of information.
I'm not sure you are understanding the idea behind the letter, and the 200 faculty members who have signed it. You mostly focus on Leslie Epstein and B.U., alleging poor spending habits (on faculty) and lack of students applying because of the newness of the program and perhaps misspending. Do you have proof of this, or do you just like to speculate? Because B.U. is a private institution, I would assume their financial records weren't made available to you--unlike a public institutions where financials are disclosed. Actually, I recommend you research the top public schools listed on the rankings and see how much they pay their "star" faculty, and then consider their enrollment. I'm sure you'll find that there are many "star" faculty members who rarely teach, yet the program is still strong. Lastly, when did Ms. Epstein say that people weren't aware of the B.U. program? She seems to have only said that polling students who have not attended a program seems wrong and misleading. Your focus on B.U. seems obsessive and fraught with subjective emotions.
But all of this doesn't answer why schools like Iowa, University of Houston and Columbia have also signed the letter. Are they bitter, too?
And lastly, your comment "perhaps there are very good reasons" why some schools are at the bottom of the list is silly and unfounded. Who are you to judge programs you have no idea about? Unless you personally researched each program... You seem to only be able to make blanket statements, and in doing so, sound immature and misinformed.
Thanks for taking the time to comment. While I see your point, it's a challenge for us logistically to include all 200 programs alphabetically in our pages, which is why we tried to narrow it down. Many of our reader have either received their MFAs or don't care to pursue the degree at all. So we try to provide coverage for that portion of our readers who are interested in pursuing an MFA without having it dominate the pages of any one issue because we have a larger group of writers to serve. But, again, I appreciate your input. We are considering all constructive criticism carefully.
Richard M,
Thanks for your insights. I see your point about the rankings affecting the rankings. Our challenge was to try to find a way to provide to our readers an overview of what are considered the best programs, while also informing them that the best program for each of them is really the one that meets the needs and expectations they have for their experience. The rankings are not presented as the entire picture, but as a way to begin thinking about all that's involved in making such an important decision.
Leslie Epstein's complaint, in the open letter, evidently is that applicants aren't sufficiently aware of the stars on the Boston U. faculty.
Problems with this: My sense is that applicants have learned that MFA programs often hire star faculty as a marketing strategy. The stars tend to have light, difficult-to-predict teaching loads; in the worst case, their main contribution to the program may very well be name recognition. Also, those stars command large salaries; if the program has less competitive funding, as Boston U. does, an applicant may speculate that that's where the money goes.
So maybe it's not that applicants are unaware of the eminence of the Boston U. faculty, but rather that they're skeptical of the hire-stars approach to running an MFA program.
Boston U. also is a virtually brand-new as an MFA program. It was just a 1-year MA program until recently. Perhaps applicants aren't willing to take a chance on a program that has just reinvented itself?
I guess my point is that, in my view, applicants aren't as easily led astray as the open letter would suggest. If a program doesn't rank highly, perhaps there are very good reasons for that. And perhaps the 199 professors who signed the letter can entrust applicants with the rankings -- having faith that applicants will put the data to good use without being misled through a lack of street smarts and common sense.
Dear Mary,
Fist off, I have no doubt that there were good intentions behind making this list; I have always read P&W and will continue to read your magazine.
But my main concern is for schools like #117 Univ. of Alaska - Fairbanks or #121 UCF - Orlando, programs like these are put at a disadvantage for being at the end of the list. Not many students (and I know this, having gone through the selection process several years ago and having witnessed undergrads go through the process recently) want to even consider going to those schools. This treatment of barely acknowledging them (except as the "remaining 81 programs") hinders the possibility for these programs to stay competitive.
And what about the non-ranked schools? Because they were not ranked, one would get the feeling they are not legitimate. But shouldn't that call into question the knowledge of the potential students you interviewed? How knowledgeable are these students if none even knew of programs like UT - El Paso, BYU, UC - Chico (etc)?
To summarize, I feel too much emphasis is given to ranking MFA Programs, which misleads many prospective students. Much of the information provided is great, but could easily been provided with the programs being organized alphabetically.
I understand that methods will vary and that they will always be flawed, but what really worries me about this methodology is that it fails to account for the power of the previous rankings to perpetuate ordering into the current and future rankings. In the first set of rankings, Seth points out that the US News and World report rankings are both dated and flawed, hence the need for the PW rankings.
If that's the case, then your rankings should be pretty different from the USNWR rankings... However, in the 2009 version, 20 of the top 25 of PW's rankings were represented in the USNWR top 25 and every one of the top 10 still grace your lists... Sure, strong programs stay strong. But when students are looking to apply, they look to your list, then they log onto the MFA blog and say they applied to what schools they applied to (influenced by your list) and perpetuate said list.
This method was fine for year 1 and maybe year 2, but the longer it goes on, the more incestuous it will become (right now it's still correcting for the criteria you highlight... So Columbia plummets because you have decided to have 3 categories about funding, which it lacks in, and therefore the new applicants see this and continue Columbia's descent...)Basically, by setting the criteria (and what's important) for the rankings and then ranking based on those who use the rankings, all you do is make your rankings reflect the criteria you highlight...
Well, we'll consider that for next year. The reason why we haven't done it that way so far is we that thought it was important to present the reasoning behind why we were only including 50 (plus the honorable mentions) programs of the total number of programs. Our goal was to try to capture what was considered the leading programs. Also, we use the word "rankings" because there are several rankings included in the charts. Further, we didn't assume that the online community surveyed was better informed than any other applicants necessarily, only that they had, in fact, done research. And we knew this because they were a group we could identify. We couldn't survey all applicants because how would we find them? But, again, thanks for your productive suggestions. We'll take them into consideration. I appreciate your taking the time to comment.
I don't think the 190 people who signed the letter object to the information being made available, and I can tell you that I found it mighty handy when I was applying to MFA programs. The problem, which your response doesn't address, is the presentation of this information as a ranking. The programs are ordered by "votes"--i.e. the number of visitors to a few websites who have stated their intention to apply. Supposedly, this is because the people who voted in this way are better informed than the general population of applicants. I don't see any reason to make that assumption; in fact, it's a major selection bias. Why not just publish an alphabetized table with all the same information on it?


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At a recent international conference in Norway on the humanitarian impact of nuclear detonations, consensus emerged that the immediate humanitarian emergency created by a nuclear explosion—whether military, terrorist, or accidental—cannot be adequately prepared for. The conference also reached consensus on a related issue: Though it would be most severe in the country where it occurred, a detonation's impact would spread across borders and persist over the long term.
In the developed world, concerns about nuclear detonations tend to focus on terrorist attacks against wealthy countries. But even if that were the form that a detonation took, developing nations far from the bomb site would suffer. As documented in a recent study by the disarmament program Reaching Critical Will, disasters of various types exacerbate development challenges that range from poverty reduction to establishing gender equality. With Mexico planning to host a follow-up to the Norway conference early next year, Siddharth Mallavarapu of India, Jaime Aguirre Gómez of Mexico, and Robert Mtonga of Zambia address the following questions: How might a nuclear detonation affect poor and middle-income nations' efforts to achieve development goals—and how can development issues best be incorporated into arguments that nuclear weapons must be abolished?
The Development and Disarmament Roundtable can also be read in Arabic, Chinese, and Spanish.


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Savory Snack Tower - Salty Mix
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About this itemA gourmet selection of our favorite savory snacks in an elegant four tiered tower. Anyone who likes to munch on gourmet treats will be delighted to receive this abundant assortment.
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Dash Greek Yogurt Maker Set - Various Colors
by Dash | Item #: 189751 |
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About this item
It's easy to make healthy, delicious Greek Yogurt right at home with the Dash Greek Yogurt Maker. Make wholesome, and fun frozen treats for the whole family with Dash Fro Yo Push Pops, or take your Greek Yogurt and toppings to-go with the Dash Travel Mate Yogurt Jar.
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Wine show at Federation Square, Melbourne
If you were given the task of describing the taste of Victoria, you'd be best to start your research at one of the state's many and varied food and wine events. Toast the vintages at parties in Victoria's distinct wine regions and get tips on matching wines to the state's fresh produce from superstar chefs cooking at award-winning regional restaurants. Victoria's fresh produce arguably tastes better when eaten outside and accompanied by live music and good friends – picking your own food or learning how to cook it are definitely bonuses.
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Good Beer Week celebrates the fact that never before has there been so much good beer on offer. Homegrown microbreweries are popping up every month...
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At the end of each month, Bar Liberty holds a themed wine dinner in a private function room. Bar Liberty will talk through the theme and indulge in a...
Melbourne's oldest but newest riverside neighbourhood, South Wharf, is delighted to welcome a dining experience with a difference through the...
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Regarding your photography. .. talk to me. You obviously didn't just fall off the turnip truck. . Let's here a bit about your equipment, lighting, etc.
Thank you brethren of the pizza! First time making it, but not the last. Viva la Reuben pie!
I can't wait to make this. Reuben is one of my favorite things. Reuben on a pizza is a two-fer!!!
Johnny,We have quite a few JerryMac fans. Can you attach some numbers to the percents if you have them, along with the sizes of the pizzas you made (and correponding dough ball weights)?
Reuben pie- corned beef, sauerkraut, swiss cheese and red onion over a 1000 Island style sauce I made with Tabasco mayo. Bold flavors, surprisingly good!
Johnny,Thank you. I added your modified version to the collection at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11860.msg110289.html#msg110289.
Johnny,How long did this one bake? I'm making this one next week. Thanks for a great idea! You are the best Mary Ann
Those are truly beautiful pizzas, Johnny.
Johnny, those are classic examples of what I think of when I think of "NY Pie"... just like I remember growing up. Great job, man.
Thank you for the compliment Ronzo! Do you recall the names of the pizzarias you frequented in your youth? Lately, for my NY pies, I've adopted the "keep it simple" approach- good tomato sauce, good whole milk mozz, maybe some pepperoni/sausage, or fresh basil on a plain cheese pie.
Hi. Love that pizza, can you share the recipe please


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Aptostichus angelinajolieae is restricted in distribution to the Santa Lucia Range of Monterey County (Map 6), bounded to the east by the Salinas River Valley (SRV). The ecoregion is characterized as California Coastal Chaparral Forest and Shrub. As discussed in Bond and Stockman (2008) the DM (Map 7) predicts the areas with the highest probability of occurrence in the regions east of the SRV, with the valley likely serving as a barrier to dispersal. The few male specimens known were collected during the late fall through winter months (October–December, February), with one specimen collected in July that molted to the final adult stage a month later in August. Female specimens are frequently found on shaded, damp steep banks and road cuts throughout the region. Burrows are generally shallow comprising a white silken lined retreat, covered by a thin silk-soil trapdoor.
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Jennifer Hammock selected "Distribution" to show in Overview on "Aptostichus angelinajolieae Bond, 2008".