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|April 12, 2008, 06:23 PM
Moderator In Memoriam
Join Date: December 20, 2002
Location: MD.
Posts: 13,938
On Fighting Shotguns....
Like all other areas of human endeavor,there's a mess of misinformation about shotguns and their use under dire peril.
Here's some opinions, forged over decades and from real word experience. I've been involved with shotguns for a long time.
Fighting shotguns do not need to be all black, camo or have doodads bolted on, though they can be. They DO have to be reliable and Well known to the User.
As far as reliability goes, I like the test first espoused by Massad Ayoob. 200 rounds of duty ammo fired glitchless. A failure rate of .5% is acceptable.
Fighting shotguns do not have to be new designs. One of the oldest repeaters, the Winchester 97, is still one of the better choices.
Nor do they need to be expensive. A used name brand pump like an 870,500, 37, 1300 can often be purchased for a few day's pay. These can give yeoman service for decades with a bit of PM and TLC.
And, while off brands made in Third World countries proliferate and sell at low prices, I recommend sticking to known brands made in the US, Japan and Europe. Mechanical Immortality for a pittance.
Fighting Shotguns do need to FIT the user. A stock fits if when mounted, he or she can use the sights without moving the head and neck and it mounts easily. And of course, the shotgun can be fired in comfort.
Both wood and synthetic stocks are available in fixed styles. While folders and adjustable AR stocks are popular, best results usually are with fixed stocks as well as they tend to be way more comfortable.Unless you have extreme storage issues, a fixed stock's a better choice. Wood is easier to make fit.
And, if more than one person may use the shotgun, it should be made to fit the smallest shooter. It's far easier for use a shotgun that's a little short than one that's a little too long.
And, might as well get this up where people can see it. Despite Hollywood and Net myth, a stockless shotgun with only a pistol grip is much less effective than one with a stock that can be fired from the shoulder. BTDT and got paid to do so. While some of these are used by Police and Military units for breaching, they are merely large, hard kicking and hard to control handguns with bad sights and extremely limited utility.
Shun them as tools.
Fighting Shotguns do not have to have double digit magazine capacity. While extended magazines have some utility for some of us, they add weight to the muzzle end, often more than can be handled well. Learn to load and run the gun, then decide if an extension is a good idea for you.
In fact, fighting shotguns do not have to be repeaters. Even a single shot can be deadly in trained, cool hands.
Optical and hologram sights really do not add much to effectiveness here. Shotguns are close range weapons.
Beads, open sights and peep or Ghost Ring sights are the common choices. I find beads the fastest, then peeps, then open sights but YMMV. All shotgunners should try all three and find which works best for them.
More to come.....
Last edited by Dave McCracken; April 18, 2008 at 09:24 PM.
|April 12, 2008, 06:34 PM
Join Date: December 24, 2002
Location: CA
Posts: 529
I noticed on my Rem 870 that after I got everything installed, it was too heavy. This made it slower for the that critical first shot. I would lose the extended mags and get a lightweight light with rifle sights. I would agree with Mr. McCracken and Ayoob. Reliability means everything and tactical appearance means nothing.
|April 12, 2008, 06:43 PM
Join Date: January 26, 2003
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,153
One thing that I think works against some shooters is their lack of target and tactical training areas. I only have a rifle range to practice on at a private club. But if there is nobody else there... the shotgun is geting a work out with buck and #4s usually involving moving.
Sometimes when I pull the hd gun out, other shotgunners give you "the look". I just answer with a practice comment. Use it.. shooting trap with an 18" cyclinder barrel can be frustrating if your after scores... but it is very good practice.
wood and steel, standard magazine length to hold 5 shells of slug, buck. slug then bucks to finish, 18" bead barrel. Use it till the action is slicker then slick. Make sure it fits.
"A wayfarer should not walk unarmed, But have his weapons to hand: He knows not when he may need a spear, Or what menace meet on the road."
The Havamal
|April 12, 2008, 06:59 PM
Join Date: March 27, 2008
Location: Maine
Posts: 295
What about variable choke? Is there any serious disadvantage to it? I know most of the 18" barrels don't have them, but gunsmithing to install doesn't seem to expensive.
Rifle sights ... this means barrel-mounted open sights, correct? Usually express-type rather than a narrow notch? It's hard to tell much from the gunmaker websites ... they just say "rifle sights" and leave it at that.
Put glow paint on the sights, or get tritium?
Sometimes I hear people say a fighting shotgun needs a sling. I assume this is a simple carry strap ... or is it a true rifleman's sling (presumably useful for mid-range slug fighting)? Or one of those one-point slings I know nothing about?
Finally (yes, I will stop asking questions soon!) what is the best way to mount a tactical light? I heard (again, not sure if the source was reputable) that the integral forend mounts are needlessly heavy, though they certainly do look durable. Not sure if eschewing the magazine extension increases or decreases mounting options down there. TacStar had an interesting mount shaped like a shotgun shell, to fit in a side-saddle ammo holder, but I surmise that the latter is exactly the sort of thing the more experienced gents on this thread would consider unnecessary clutter.
|April 12, 2008, 07:26 PM
Join Date: December 25, 2002
Location: The Free State of Arizona
Posts: 1,264
I have two shotguns I have ready to rock these days.
I have moved my 590 Mossy to second place. I have moved a new Double barrel with dog ears up to first place. I like the fact that the weapon is like a revolver with no stressed springs, while in the standby position.
To fire pull back the hammers, release the safety, and, in my case, let lose both barrels of #1 buck. In my BUG out Bag is two boxes of #00 buck if there is still a fight to be fought. Also in that same bag is 3 Mags for the XCR and 3 mags for anyone of my 1911's.
As to flashlight, I use any of my Surefire's, that are on the bed stand, usually two, most often but not limited to a E2D or now a 6PL. I can comfortably hold both the light and forend of the double with my weak side hand while presenting the shotgun.
If it is a break in, I will be dug in in my bedroom. There is enough firepower there to outfit a platoon. Lots of rifles, pistols, shotguns, and ammo.
Just the way I do it these days.
Good Luck.
MINDSET - SKILLSET - TOOLSET - IN THAT ORDER! OODA -- COL John Boyd, USAF
To lead untrained men in to war, is to waste them. - Confucious
"Training errors are recorded on paper, tactical errors are etched in stone." - Field Marshal Erwin Rommel
We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality - Ayn Rand
Semper Fi
|April 12, 2008, 08:00 PM
Join Date: June 2, 2005
Location: SC
Posts: 2,728
|April 12, 2008, 10:25 PM
Join Date: January 26, 2003
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,153
Slings are fr outside... SHTF.. two point carry sling for moving or three point for assualt work. In a SHTF.. you make one of two choices....DEFEND or MOVE!!!
A x2 is about the best HD weapon or defensive weapon ever put on god's green earth. Simple, reliable and effective. Coach guns are +1 IMHO.
This thread is great... keep it going.
"A wayfarer should not walk unarmed, But have his weapons to hand: He knows not when he may need a spear, Or what menace meet on the road."
The Havamal
|April 12, 2008, 10:49 PM
Join Date: February 21, 2007
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,777
On screw in chokes and short barrels
One of my favorite setups now is a Mossberg 500 I have with an 18.5" heavy wall barrel with Accuchokes. It throws nasty tight patterns with most brands of buckshot I've tried in it. It also makes for a handy woods gun for deer drives and I killed one deer with it this past season (I've only had the gun for six months or so). With a Turkey choke it patterns good with 6's and 5's and should be a good gobbler getter. Haven't hunted turkeys with it yet.
This leads to my other point in that guns that serve mulitple purposes will be guns you spend more time with, which will in turn be guns that become more of a part of you.
For years my only shotguns were a Rem 31 28" bird gun a Rem 1100 28" bird gun, and my Mossberg 835 Deer/Turkey gun. The mossberg with a 24" barrel did double duty as a defensive weapon. I had, and still have, much faith in that weapon. Either of the 28 inchers could have (and still can) be pressed into service if need be.
Then I started acquiring 870's (3 at one point, but back down to 2 now). Lately picked up the 500 and most recently an 11-87. I have hunted with all of them save one of the 870's and the recently acquired 11-87 (That will change as soon as I get after the gobblers this spring).
Good grief scatterguns are addictive .
|April 12, 2008, 10:49 PM
Join Date: March 27, 2008
Location: Maine
Posts: 295
Wasn't expecting to see so much praise for doubles. For a while it seemed like inexpensive side-by-sides were all but gone, but I gather they've sort of been revived recently.
What are some brands to look for? I only know of Rossi and maybe Uberti?
Sights for SxSs? I know nothing about this gun configuration. Does the rear go on the receiver? Do SxSs have an ordinary rib that can take all the accessories that commonly go on ribs?
|April 13, 2008, 09:25 PM
Join Date: November 8, 2006
Location: Kentucky Backwoods
Posts: 1,449
Two words...Vang Comp.
The New Politically Insensitive Smokey Bear
|April 13, 2008, 10:11 PM
Moderator In Memoriam
Join Date: December 20, 2002
Location: MD.
Posts: 13,938
Thanks for the responses and sorry to take so long getting back, 'puter probs now resolved.
Moving on....
Sling capability is a given. Whether a single point or a plain carry strap, we may need our hands for something besides holding a shotgun. However, mine do not wear a sling inside the house, more chance of snagging at a horrible moment. Also, the slings that have ammo storage capability in the form of shell loops are counter productive. The extra weight causes a pendulum effect.
Re chokes, they're superflous at typical HD ranges, but things may heat up outside. A choke tubed barrel or one equipped with a variable device like a Polychoke adds a lot of versatility and enables one to fine tune patterns.
Lights are usually a good addon. Target ID is crucial. Good ones aren't cheap, though.
We can go broke sending checks to Wilson and Hans Vang. While their products and services are good, oft it amounts to tweaks when what we really need to spend money on are ammo and range fees.
There's way more good fighting shotguns out there than good Shotgunners. A good hand with a shotgun does well with about any shotgun, not just a highly modded, high ticket race gun.
Written on a tablet of stone in The Temple Of The Shotgun Gods is.....
Technology cannot substitute for expertise.....
The best way to get proficient is to shoot lots, under supervision of a good instructor. Shoot anything from clay frisbees to landfill rats, you'll get better as the round count rises......
Last edited by Dave McCracken; April 26, 2008 at 02:21 PM.
|April 14, 2008, 08:35 AM
Join Date: June 2, 2005
Location: SC
Posts: 2,728
Wilson does not do very much for your shotgun, especially for the outragous amount of money that they charge. You could do the work yourself easily for very little (installing extended tube, big head safety, side saddle, sling).
|April 14, 2008, 09:16 AM
Moderator In Memoriam
Join Date: December 20, 2002
Location: MD.
Posts: 13,938
A couple things....
Bead sights and front sights can be either switched to fiber optic "Glow Worm" style sights for low light use or dressed up with paint. One front sight here coupled with a Lyman peep on my oldest 870 has a dab of yellow paint brightening it up. The other slug shooter has a dab of white, which better shows up against a deer's shoulder.
Again, a little T&E done by each of us can tweak up performance a bit. Try and see, while expending rounds.
I can't overemphasize the need for training. The best shotgun in the world will do little to protect us if we lack technique and tactics.
Good instruction is not that hard to come by. Even a basic recreational shotgun course at the trap and skeet range can help get a new shooter started, and clay shooting is both fun and good training.
If a shooter can hit trap or skeet doubles moving at 50 MPH on different vectors while cycling a pumpgun, they will have little trouble hitting larger, slower targets even in short time frames and under extreme stress.
We fight like we train.....
|April 14, 2008, 09:40 AM
Join Date: January 26, 2003
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,153
Cheap doubles....
Look for Sears or Ted Williams SXS... they were usually made by Stevens, Savage or H & R if my memory holds true.
I have a Sears 311... Which is a Stevens 311 Field in 12g. It is a bruiser and definitely not a trap or skeet gun. But, if I ever get the nerve or need to do it and cut the 26" barrels down to 18.5"... it will be one hell of a SD gun.
"A wayfarer should not walk unarmed, But have his weapons to hand: He knows not when he may need a spear, Or what menace meet on the road."
The Havamal
|April 14, 2008, 01:12 PM
Join Date: December 29, 2006
Location: Murfreesboro, TN
Posts: 2,006
I find that the trap and skeet rounds do a lot for familiarizing a person to their shotgun, whatever model or configuration. Once you become proficient and have trap scores up into the 20's, then try some european style with the gun at rest by your side or even standing beside you. That will make a believer out of you about needing practice. The idea is that you would be rarely standing and waiting to "call the bird" in a home defense situation. It sure made me a lot better in getting the feel of bringing up the gun quickly and aquiring a target. Others may have different methods and opinions. This is what I do.
Is any firearm icon more American in history than a decent lever action rifle? Do you really think any gun collection should be without at least one?
|April 14, 2008, 04:22 PM
Join Date: December 25, 2002
Location: The Free State of Arizona
Posts: 1,264
When I used to Dove hunt a lot, I would use the skeet range before every season.
Skeet and trap are excellent shot gun training. Just be sure you are shooting the gun you will fight with.
Go figure.
MINDSET - SKILLSET - TOOLSET - IN THAT ORDER! OODA -- COL John Boyd, USAF
To lead untrained men in to war, is to waste them. - Confucious
"Training errors are recorded on paper, tactical errors are etched in stone." - Field Marshal Erwin Rommel
We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality - Ayn Rand
Semper Fi
|April 15, 2008, 04:35 PM
Join Date: June 12, 2005
Posts: 174
Late getting in on this,but after 40 plus years of using fighting shotguns I have to agree with everything Dave said.
Re: double digit capacity,it may be noted that the Saiga shotgun is becoming very popular. I havn't tried one but I'm sure it's a good weapon.That said,I still prefer the fighting pump gun with 6 to 8 round capacity. IMO one of the good things about a fighting scattergun is the fact that it's not dependant on detachable magazines to keep it running. It can be reloaded while being fired in many cases and with practice and experience a good man with a pump 12 can do some pretty amazing work.
While true of many weapons,I think keeping things simple with the shotgun is the only way to go. There's nothing new or even high tech about these guns yet they remain one of the most devastating weapons available to the general public,police,and military.
Skill does need to be dveloped in the shotgun's use,just as with any other weapons system,but it remains the best choice for many scenarios at close to intermediate ranges. One of the most untilitarian firearms available.
Old men of days gone by have used the shotgun to great effect without any gadgets or bolt on custom junk. It still works just fine that way if the user knows the gun and knows what he is doing.
Long live the street howitzer.
To be born free is an accident.To live free is a priviledge.To die free is a responsibility.
|April 15, 2008, 08:40 PM
Join Date: December 26, 2002
Posts: 6,108
The "perfect" defense shotgun is probably any pump shotgun with an 18 to 20 inch barrel and a bead sight, AND NOTHING MORE.
Problem is, people just love to accessories their guns to make them "better", but really to make them "yours".
What makes the shotgun the world's most deadly effective weapon at close range is not really the large amount of heavy shot or the spreading pattern.
What makes the shotgun so deadly is SPEED.
It's the SPEED at which a good shotgun man can get that load of shot on target.
While the typical rifle or pistol man is still aligning his sights on target, the shotgunner had dealt with the problem and moved on to the next one.
What so astounds people who've never seen a good combat shotgunner in action is just how FAST things happen.
What you have to do when fitting out a combat shotgun is to do a "Real World" cost/benefit analysis on EACH and every accessory you want to add to the basic gun.
Since virtually everything you can add actually slows the speed at which the gun can be gotten on target, you have to analyze each accessory or modification to determine if the loss in speed is out weighted by whatever you hope to gain.
Accessories like Ghost ring sights, extended magazines, side saddles, and folding or AR-15 type collapsing stocks are very "Cool", but each detracts from speed and efficiency and you must decide if it's worth it.
The problem is, very few people will do an honest analysis, and instead go with what looks "Cool".
What happens in the Real World is quite different than the Hollywood World, where the hero simply points the shotgun in the general direction of the bad guy and a load of shot that seems to contain 100 pellets of 00 buckshot not only blows the bad guy 10 feet backward, but also blows out every window within 200 yards.
The shotgun MUST be "aimed" or "pointed". Shooting from the hip looks great on the range when shooting at stationary targets a known distance away, but take the same shooter onto a real combat range, and he soon learns that in the Real World, if the butt stock isn't in the shoulder, you miss a LOT.
Another huge advantage of the shotgun is it's adaptability.
By switching ammo, and possibly the barrel you can hunt any game from quail, to ducks, to high-flying geese, to turkeys, to deer.
The same gun also defends your home or business, or goes into battle as a police or military weapon.
Even the pure defense gun can adapt to a changing situation.
As an example, a few years ago we made a couple of moves, and my 870 Police gun changed in each home move.
Originally, we were living in a small town.
The police department was literally in sight, and patrols passed often.
The street was well lighted, and neighbors were close on either side.
A "Real World Threat Assessment" of what the threat most likely would be, was that trouble would arrive on foot, and would be no more than two people, probably just one, who would flee at the first sign of resistance.
Police would be there in less than 2 minutes at most.
The gun was a Remington 870P Police with 18 inch barrel and synthetic stock.
At that time, it was set up as follows:
No magazine extension, standard 4 shot mag.
Ammo was standard load of #1 buckshot to prevent over-penetration that would threaten the homes on either side.
No other ammo was on-board.
No light was needed.
While a new apartment was being finished for us, we temporarily moved into a trailer on a relatives farm.
This was miles from town and very isolated.
Home and farm burglaries are common and home invasions do occur.
Law enforcement was the Sheriff's department, minimum response was at least 30 to 45 minutes, unless a patrol happened to be in the area.
There was NO light.
Nearest neighbor was 2 miles away.
The threat assessment said that trouble would arrive in a car and would be 2 to 3 persons.
Trouble would start with the people out of the car approaching the trailer at night.
The gun was changed to meet the new type of threat.
It now had a 7 shot extension.
A butt cuff with extra ammo, AND a canvas shoulder bag full of more ammo.
The gun was "dutch loaded" with the first shells being #1 buckshot, followed with shells loaded with 00 buck, and finally slugs.
This figured on the fight starting against exposed bad guys, who would move away to possible cover, then re-enter the car to hide/reload, or flee.
The gun was equipped with a fore end light, and another powerful light was in a pocket of the spare ammo bag, along with a cell phone.
The threat analysis said that I'd be alone in the dark with no help for some time, so I'd need to be able to engage in an possibly extended gun fight with multiply assailants in the dark.
After the new apartment was ready we moved in and the gun again changed.
The new place is in a larger small town.
Just yards behind is a school for handicapped children, there's city and county health offices nearby, and a bad neighborhood a block away.
There's a drug and alcohol rehab center just next door with various shady people often visiting.
It's not unusual for people from the bad neighborhood to tramp through the yards at 3:00am on the way to the rehab center to plant drugs for their friends in the grass.
The area is WELL lit, and due to the bad area, the police are more or less constantly around.
The treat assessment indicates that trouble will arrive on foot and will be no more then one person, possible two.
Due to their nature, the trouble will often fire a shot or two on general principles, then run for the 'hood.
Help would arrive in no more then 4 minutes.
The gun was now changed to:
The extended magazine was retained due to the possibility of more than one assailant, and who would likely open fire before running.
The extra on-board ammo was removed to increase speed with the gun, and the bag of ammo was stored in a handy closet close to the gun.
Ammo load was now #4 buckshot in a "reduced recoil" load in consideration to the close school and offices, AND to increase the speed of follow up shots..
Since the area is lighted to near daylight conditions, no light was needed, so the standard fore end was installed.
So, as you can see, the shotgun can be adapted to meet changing conditions, and as always, "Less is More". The less you hang on the gun, the faster and more effective it is.
In shotguns "Speed Kills".
When you do attach an accessory, it should be because there is a specific, definable advantage other than that it looks "Cool".
|April 15, 2008, 10:46 PM
Moderator In Memoriam
Join Date: December 20, 2002
Location: MD.
Posts: 13,938
Thanks for the input, especially you, D. Good points about speed and versatility.
Frankenstein is now added to the house gun roster. 21" barrel with Skeet choke in, 4 buck in magazine, no addons.
Faster'n a rattlesnake.5K rounds at least behind it in my hands.
As for speed, one of the games I have the kids play when I'm instructing starts right behind the wobble trap house. Low gun, one shot, and the idea is not only hit it, but do so closer to the house than anyone else.
The kids are adolescents from 13 to 17. None have run 25 yet at skeet or trap, but some have done 23 or so. When the old competitive spirit kicks in, those smoke balls get mighty close to the trap.
The hidden kicker is they're using Full and Mod choked guns so those patterns are quite tight,less than 18". If a tyro can center a speeding clay 20 yards from, the muzzle and smoke it in less than ONE second from low gun, the speed of a more accomplished shotgunner borders on a blur.
Last edited by Dave McCracken; June 28, 2008 at 12:47 PM.
|April 16, 2008, 12:27 AM
Join Date: March 16, 2007
Location: Helena MT
Posts: 3,878
My defensive shotgun mantra is "short, light and fast". Reliability goes without saying. I find it amusing that folks who view the defensive rifle as necessarily a semi-auto avoid same when it comes to scatterguns.
Sights are useful of you plan on using slugs. Modern slug ammo, particularly when paired with a rifles choke, can be very accurate. Past 30 or 40 yards, even 00 buck can be iffy depending on what the target is wearing. Slugs are dangerous at longer range, or when dealing with cover. Under-penetration is not always a good thing.
Personally, I think you should be able to fire and maneuver any defensive gun with one hand - whether that be rifle, pistol or shotgun. You need to be able to dial the phone, open a door, etc and still be able to employ your defensive weapon A big shotgun with a long magazine is a two handed weapon. So is any pump - particularly if you don't happen to be a big male.
Whatever you pick, practice with it. You can miss with a shotgun, particularly at close range.
Tod Glenn
"Everything I need to know, I learned by killing smart people and eating their brains."
|April 16, 2008, 09:50 AM
Moderator In Memoriam
Join Date: December 20, 2002
Location: MD.
Posts: 13,938
Good mantra, Tod.
I don't avoid autos, it's that all my training and experience has been with 870s.
Autos do have that one handed advantage. Make that SOME autos.
Pumps have nigh perfect reliability, and a wider usable ammo spectrum. Mine can eat 3/4 oz training loads and 2 oz turkey whackers and all between.
Sights are useful, but not universally so. And beads are faster than anything else by a small margin.
"Whatever you pick, practice with it"....
|April 18, 2008, 08:14 AM
Join Date: May 28, 2005
Location: Florida
Posts: 878
Intended use is a must
Intended use is a must in the gun/the loads.
The fastest, and slickest pump I ever owned or used, an 870, pistol grip full Chote? stock, 14" Brl: (Legal where I lived) jumbo safety, one shot extension (5 instead of 4) big bead, white enamel painted. Good for 100m hits.
Elastic side saddle, with 6 extra shells. Used a lot! action like glass, you could open a door (Hi under arm tuck, move muzzle from your door opening left hand!) and still be effective with the first shot.
Work Security shotgun, Mossberg 500 18.5 brl: fiber optic front sight, sling (need to open door to leave building) mode of carry, 5 in tube, all low velocity slugs, empty chamber, hammer down, safety off. All practice same setup (Dave your opinion on loaded with safety on please)
Two spare shells on belt, first a slug, second a 9 pellet double 0 buckshot, reduced velocity also,
Ex Police gun, plastic furniture, well used, not abused.
Escort across well lit parking lot, time of exposure, approx 3 minutes, bag and leave, Glock 19, spare G17 magazine on belt, plus surefire G2.
Oh, and level 11 vest, always!
|April 18, 2008, 09:09 AM
Moderator In Memoriam
Join Date: December 20, 2002
Location: MD.
Posts: 13,938
OG. mine are kept safety on, empty chamber, action locked (Hammer cocked). Matches the SOP at my old agency. And, while I can get it working in a blur, ignorami and kids cannot even in LONG time frames.
More later....
|April 18, 2008, 01:16 PM
Join Date: January 9, 2005
Location: Southern California
Posts: 1,277
I have paraphrased the below from this post I made about a year ago:
I recently took a basic Shotgun class that was taught by a local Police Officer.
Most of the guys in my class (all guys - 26 of them) had these super-uber black tactical shotguns with so much crap on them that they could barely hold them up for more than 2 minutes.
The instructor would have us hold our shotguns up in either the "on-target-ready-to-shoot" position, or the "high-ready" position, for an extended length of time and almost everyone on the shooting line had the shakes because they had their tactical lights, 8-shot extended magazines, and side-saddles loaded with ammo weighing down their gun.
The instructor was joking that everybody needed "muzzle-Viagra" to keep it up.
I do realize that in the real world you probably would not need to hold your shotgun up in the ready postion for that long, but, I got to admit, it was pretty funny seeing it happen.
My point is - if you've got a lot of stuff on your shotgun, make sure you are comfortable having it there, because it does affect how it handles - in other words: PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE!
|April 18, 2008, 01:29 PM
Member in memoriam
Join Date: September 17, 2007
Location: Eastern KS
Posts: 59,082
Fighting shotguns with all the TackyCool stuff bolted on them are kind of neat looking.
But then you got to figure some old man with a 6-7 pound bird or skeet gun is twice as fast.
And several times more likely to get the first shots on target.
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text:
I just wanted to start a topic for us to say Thanks to the Red Wings for providing us with a great regular season despite all the adversities and drama and odds against us! (Thank God, we didn't hear the "Too Old" card this year.)
So, despite all of this:
- Nick Lidstrom retiring
- Tomas Holmstrom retiring
- Brad Stuart trade
- New Asst. Coach
- Losing out on Parise, Suter, Schultz, Doan and every other "Top" UFA
- Countless injuries to our Defense creating our youngest average D since Nick and Vladdy were Rookies
- Gustavsson hurting himself and never really turning into a reliable backup
- Losing Helm for the season (again)
- Losing Bertuzzi's experience and Sammy to injury
(I am sure that I am leaving something out)
But anyway, despite all of this and despite the experts having us out of the playoffs for the first time since I turned 20, THE Detroit Red Wings proved once again, that when it comes to being a perennial winning team in the NHL, nobody does it better! Eat that Olsen Twins!
SO, Despite all the above mentioned scenarios that were supposed to have us dwelling at the bottom of the NHL, you guys did it. No matter where you go in the playoffs, this is a winning season and every other team in the league is just shaking their heads right now!
Watch out NHL, don't look now, because the Red Wings just rebuilt on the fly and will be back on top sooner than you can say 22 straight years!
THANK YOU DETROIT RED WINGS for a regular season to remember! (now lets spoil some parties!)
Edited by LeftWinger, 27 April 2013 - 10:28 PM.

subset: commoncrawl


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New Online Learning Library (OLL) content
By Irina Donaldson - Moderator -Oracle on Jun 26, 2013
Looking to brush up on OAM or OVD skills? Want some help with OIM?
Well, have you checked our Online Learning Library (OLL) recently?
OLL is a great way to pickup new skills in short blocks of time, and there is an enormous selection, on a diverse set of products. Every month these trainings get hundreds or thousands of hits. It would be worth your while to spend some time just poking around the nooks and crannies for items that interest you.
A smattering of new OBEs and other content have recently become available, and if you haven't already, you might want to check them out:
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- Oracle Identity Manager: Configuring SOA Composite
- Oracle Identity Manager: Web Services Connector - Overview
- How to do a basic Oracle Virtual Directory (OVD) Setup?
- How to setup a simple Oracle Virtual Directory (OVD) Join?
- Installing Oracle Access Manager: Identity Server and WebPass
Also new is an Oracle University 5-day class you might want to investigate:
An OAM Advanced Administration class is in the works and should be available late summer or fall, so keep your calendar clear!
Be sure to let us know in the Comments if there is a training you would find useful.
Happy Trails :)


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Series Premiere of Star Plates at 11pm
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Tonight, make sure to catch me in the Season Premiere of Star Plates! On this episode, Mindy Kaling will join me at Red Rooster and be put to the test as my line cook for Read More
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Summer 2016 Introduction
The Summer 2016 issue of Perspectives in Health Information Management features the latest research on topics such as a new HIM learning portal and a review of approaches for mapping from SNOMED CT to ICD-10-CM.
Summer 2016 Issue
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The Systematized Nomenclature of Medicine–Clinical Terms (SNOMED CT) and the International Classification of Diseases, Tenth Revision, Clinical Modification (ICD-10-CM) are two commonly used standardized health terminologies in the United States. In fall 2015, healthcare facilities across the United States were required to transition to a newer and more detailed version of one of these terminologies, from ICD-9-CM to ICD-10-CM. To facilitate the terminology transition, the National Library of Medicine (NLM) released semi-automated mapping rules and guidelines that should enable translation between SNOMED CT and ICD-10-CM codes.
Perceptions of the Benefits of Telemedicine in Rural Communities
Telemedicine is a means of improving care quality and access in rural areas, but limited evidence is available on how telemedicine affects the hospital-community relationship. We examined hospital staff perceptions about the ways in which rural communities benefited from the implementation of telemedicine offered by a hub facility. We fielded 405 surveys from 84 hospitals and conducted interviews with 81 clinicians and administrators at 26 hospitals. Survey respondents had positive perceptions about the benefit of tele-emergency services to rural communities, but this finding was less true of tele-pharmacy. Interviewees described how telemedicine enhanced rural hospitals' reputation for high-quality care, how community members benefited from being close to their support networks, and how word of positive patient experiences increased community awareness of hospital services.
Leveraging Health Information Management Competency-based Education with a New Type of Learning Portal
The move to fully realize competency-based education and the use of open educational resources and their effect on learners brings about opportunities to revisit long-held assumptions about the entire higher education enterprise. In response, a new type of online portal and educational search engine is being developed as part of a US Department of Labor Trade Adjustment Assistance Community College and Career Training (TAACCCT) grant and partnership between the American Health Information Management Association (AHIMA) and Lord Fairfax Community College.
Lessons Learned from an Electronic Health Record Downtime
Unexpected downtime of an electronic health record (EHR) system poses a risk to patient safety and can result in loss or compromise of data. This article reviews a downtime of the National Institutes of Health Clinical Center EHR system and presents the methodology of the review process, a description of the event, lessons learned, and potential process and policy improvements that can improve a facility's response to unexpected downtime and facilitate smooth transitions to downtime procedures during planned outages.
Disease Groupings: What are They, How are They Used, and How Do They Compare Internationally?
The purpose of this article is to review diagnosis-related group (DRG) systems by introducing the concept of disease groupings, describing the country-specific DRGs based on the International Classification of Diseases (ICD), and comparing country-specific disease classification systems and coding processes related to disease grouping. We discuss our findings with regard to the implications for disease groupings that may result from the upcoming adoption of ICD-11. This article is especially relevant for those working in health services who are involved in multicountry collaborations and require an understanding of the different DRGs used internationally, or who are preparing for the transition to ICD-11.
Clinical Terminology and Clinical Classification Systems: A Critique Using AHIMA's Data Quality Management Model
Clinical coding constitutes one of the fundamental functions in the field of health information management. Clinical classification systems and clinical terminologies represent two distinct sets of coding schemes that are used in healthcare. In this context, it is critical to distinguish between clinical terminologies and clinical classification systems, identify how both sets of systems are utilized in healthcare settings, and acknowledge individual contributions of each system to providing data infrastructure for clinical as well as administrative data uses in the healthcare delivery system.
Hiring for Competency: Hiring to Not Fail vs. Hiring to Succeed
Evolving economic and technological advances have affected the work environment and the workforce, resulting in new competency requirements for employees. Finding the right person for each job can be difficult, and new hires often fail to meet employers' expectations. This study examined employers' definitions of competency, instances of successful and unsuccessful hiring, and importance placed on industry credentials/certifications versus educational degrees.


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From the Departments of Bioengineering (Dr Bertocci and Mssrs Deemer and Aguel), Rehabilitation Science and Technology (Dr Bertocci and Mssrs Deemer and Aguel), and Pediatrics (Drs Bertocci and Pierce), Childrens' Hospital of Pittsburgh, University of Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh, Pa.
To demonstrate the usefulness of computer simulation techniques in the investigation of pediatric stair falls. Since stair falls are a common falsely reported injury scenario in child abuse, our specific aim was to investigate the influence of stair characteristics on injury biomechanics of pediatric stair falls by using a computer simulation model. Our long-term goal is to use knowledge of biomechanics to aid in distinguishing between accidents and abuse.
A computer simulation model of a 3-year-old child falling down stairs was developed using commercially available simulation software. This model was used to investigate the influence that stair characteristics have on biomechanical measures associated with injury risk. Since femur fractures occur in unintentional and abuse scenarios, biomechanical measures were focused on the lower extremities.
The number and slope of steps and stair surface friction and elasticity were found to affect biomechanical measures associated with injury risk.
Computer simulation techniques are useful for investigating the biomechanics of stair falls. Using our simulation model, we determined that stair characteristics have an effect on potential for lower extremity injuries. Although absolute values of biomechanical measures should not be relied on in an unvalidated model such as this, relationships between accident-environment factors and biomechanical measures can be studied through simulation. Future efforts will focus on model validation.
IN CHILD abuse cases, caregivers often falsely report common fall scenarios such as stair falls as the underlying cause of injury. Unfortunately, it is often difficult to determine the validity of caregiver-stated scenarios, since so little is known regarding pediatric biomechanics and injury risk associated with these relatively common falls. A better understanding of the influence that specific fall-environment factors have on injury biomechanics in children is needed. We propose that computer simulation can be used in evaluating the effect that the fall environment has on biomechanical measures associated with injury. With the use of computer simulation, a single characteristic of the fall environment, eg, the type or construction of steps, can be altered to investigate its influence on injury biomechanics and therefore injury potential. In our study, we used computer simulation modeling to investigate the effect of various stair characteristics on injury risk measures.
Studies such as those conducted by Lyons and Oates1 using case-specific biomechanical measures to evaluate injuries in children who have fallen from a bed are needed to begin scientifically distinguishing between unintentional and abusive injuries. In their study, injuries of 207 children who had fallen from beds or horizontal surfaces were classified by body region and correlated to momentum (child mass × fall velocity) of the child during the fall. Similar studies investigating the relationships between types of injuries and the biophysics of pediatric free falls are also available in the literature.2- 4 Joffe and Ludwig5 evaluated 363 stair falls in children aged 1 month to 19 years in an effort to better describe injuries resulting from stair falls. Although a limited number of studies describing relationships between the biophysics of a particular fall and associated injuries in children exist, additional studies are greatly needed to advance the forensic science to detect child abuse.
Femoral fractures are one of the most common fracture types associated with child abuse in children 5 years and younger.6- 13 However, femoral fractures can also result from falls in young children, making differentiation between abuse and unintentional injury mechanisms difficult for clinicians. To begin developing a foundation to aid in delineating between unintentional and abusive femur fractures, we propose using computer simulation to investigate pediatric biomechanics associated with common falls. Since femur fractures are common fractures associated with child abuse, and stair falls are a common scenario falsely reported in child abuse, our study is focused on the biomechanics of the upper leg during stair falls.
Fall characteristics and environment factors such as height of fall and impact surface properties have been shown to influence injury risk in pediatric and adult falls.2,14- 17 Mott et al16 reported that children sustained significant increases in injuries on playgrounds with concrete surfaces as opposed to those with bark or rubber surfaces. Studies have also documented height of falls from playground equipment as having significant influence on injury risk and fracture incidence.14 The study by Joffe and Ludwig5 of pediatric injuries in stair falls found that falls involving fewer than 4 steps had a similar incidence and severity of injury to those involving more than 4 steps. Case-based studies such as these are needed to define relationships between characteristics of the fall environment and corresponding injuries. Unfortunately, reconstruction of the victim, the initial condition, and the fall environment are often difficult to capture retrospectively. Computer simulation and modeling techniques offer tools that can aid in the investigation of falls when data from real-world scenarios are limited.
Computer simulation techniques have been used extensively in the prediction of injury risk, particularly in motor vehicle crash analysis.18,19 Recently, the Institute of Medicine has recommended an increase in the use of computer simulation techniques to study injury mechanisms and to predict injury risk.20 Computer simulation has allowed engineers to economically study the influence of various factors on the risk of injury in a given scenario. Once an experimentally validated simulation model has been developed, savings can be realized through reduction in the number of costly experimental tests needed to investigate slight permutations. In our study, we used computer simulation to investigate the effects of number of steps, stair-surface friction, stair-surface elasticity, and slope of steps on key biomechanical measures of the upper leg that are associated with injury risk.
General-purpose mechanical computer simulation software (Working Model 3D; MSC.Working Knowledge, San Mateo, Calif) was used to develop a model of a 3-year-old child stair fall. This rigid-body software is commonly used to study the motion and interaction of mechanical linkages. Various 3-D geometric shapes, joints, and mechanical constraints, eg, springs and dampers, are available in the software to construct body segments or the fall environment. Inertial properties of each model segment, eg, mass, center of gravity, and mass distribution, can also be prescribed. Surface characteristics, including friction and elasticity, which influence the contact between segments and the fall environment, also can be specified in the model. Forces and torques of specified magnitude and direction can be applied to the model segments and are used to establish initial conditions of various body segments. These parameters, with the specified inertial properties of the model segments and their surface characteristics that influence interaction with the fall environment, dictate the motion and response of the model. Simulations are controlled through equations of motion defined by principles of physics and are not constrained by animation. Measurements of force, rotational acceleration, linear acceleration, velocity, and self-defined parameters can be measured and recorded for each segment throughout the simulation event.
Using various geometric shapes, stairs with a pitch (slope) of 8:8 (rise-run or stair-height–depth) were constructed in the model (Figure 1). Stair-surface friction and elasticity variables were also prescribed. The 3-year-old child model was constructed using ellipsoid segments with mass and inertial properties matching that of the Hybrid III 3-year-old anthropometric test dummy (ATD). This ATD has been developed for use in motor vehicle crash analysis and provides an approximation of a 50th-percentile 3-year-old child. In addition, the matching of model specifications to the existing physical ATD will allow for future experimental validation of the model. Anatomically equivalent joints with prescribed ranges of motion were used for the hips, neck, shoulders, elbows, and knees. The ATD was placed at the edge of the stairs in a crawling position, and gravity initiated the forward movement.
Simulation model of a stair fall by a 3-year-old child. A, initial position; B, midfall; and C, final resting position.
Computer simulations are useful in evaluating the effects of the fall environment on biomechanics or other injury outcomes through a process known as parametric sensitivity analysis.18,19,21 Such an analysis varies by only 1 factor at a time while maintaining all others constant, allowing us to study the effects of each separate parameter on fall biomechanics. For example, the influence that the type of flooring may have on fall biomechanics or injury outcome in a given fall can be investigated by stepwise variation of floor surface stiffness while maintaining all other model parameters constant.
The contact interface between the sole of a shoe and flooring or stair surface can be characterized by resilience and friction properties of both materials in contact. Friction, or slip resistance, between 2 contact surfaces can be represented by the coefficient of friction (COF). Frictional properties are also highly dependent on surface conditions (wet vs dry). For example, hard rubber-soled shoes on a dry vinyl tile floor have a COF of near 1, whereas the same shoe on a more slippery oil-coated surface has a COF of approximately 0.1.22 The resiliency or elasticity (stiffness) of the shoe-surface interface can be defined by the coefficient of restitution (COR). The COR can be further defined as the amount of energy that is absorbed when 2 objects collide or come into contact. Shoe-surface contacts that are resilient will have CORs that approach 1. Materials that absorb energy on impact typically have low COR values. Examples of material COR values include the following: wood, 0.50; rubber, 0.95; rock, 0.20; and clay, 0.02.23
The baseline stair-fall model was defined as 7 steps with a slope of 8:8 and midrange surface friction (COF = 0.5) and stair elasticity (COR = 0.50). To determine the sensitivity of ATD fall biomechanics to various environment parameters, simulations were run in which 1 of the following parameters was varied while all others were held constant: number of steps, slope of stairs, stair-surface friction, and stair-surface elasticity. Starting with the baseline model, simulations were conducted for 3, 7, 11, and 15 steps while maintaining midrange stair friction and elasticity and an 8:8 stair slope. Simulations were also run for a series of stair-surface frictions (defined by the COF) ranging from a very slippery surface (COF = 0) to a nonslip surface (COF = 0.9) using the 7-step model and maintaining midrange surface elasticity. Next, using the 7-step, 8:8 slope model with constant stair-surface friction, simulations were conducted for varying stair elasticity (defined by the COR), ranging from a soft, "bouncy" surface (COR = 1.00) to a hard, more rigid surface (COR = 0). Finally, using the 7-step model with midrange surface friction and elasticity, the slope of stairs was decreased from the baseline 8:8 to 8:10 and 8:12. (Most building codes permit a stair slope of ≤8:12.) For all simulations, biomechanical measures associated with upper leg injury risk were evaluated. These measures included upper leg impact velocity with the steps, energy, and momentum. All measures were made at the center of gravity of the upper leg. Peak values of each variable were extracted for analysis.
Without experimental validation, results of simulations can only be used to study relationships and trends among variables. Since our model has not been experimentally validated, absolute values of biomechanical measures will not be presented; instead only relationships between biomechanical measures and fall-environment factors will be described. Figure 1 characterizes the initial and final conditions of the child and the total body kinematics during the stair fall. Observation of the fall dynamics showed that the upper leg may hit the steps several times during a stair fall, with increasing contacts associated with falls involving more steps. Our model also demonstrated a slightly asymmetrical fall pattern, which can lead to differences in biomechanical measures associated with the right and left legs.
All biomechanical measures were influenced by changes in the number of steps. The impact velocity of the upper leg (speed with which the leg impacts the steps) increased as the number of steps was increased in the model (Figure 2). When a 3-step fall was compared with a 15-step fall, impact velocity of the upper leg increased 3-fold. As much as a 7-fold increase was observed in the peak kinetic energy of the upper leg when a 3-step fall was compared with a 15-step fall (Figure 3). Since momentum is a function of velocity, similar increases in momentum are seen with increasing numbers of steps (Figure 4). Momentum of the upper leg is nearly 3 times greater in the 15-step fall compared with the 3-step fall. These findings suggest that potential for upper leg injury increases with increased number of steps.
Impact velocity of upper leg vs number of steps.
Kinetic energy of upper leg vs number of steps.
Momentum of upper leg vs number of steps.
All biomechanical measures decreased with increases in stair friction. Stair falls with a step COF of 0, representing a slippery surface, had higher upper leg impact velocity, kinetic energy, and momentum compared with nonslip stair surfaces (represented by a COF approaching 1). A step COF of 0 (slippery surface) in a 7-step fall generated a peak impact velocity of the upper leg that doubled the velocity found in the same fall with a nonslip surface (COF = 0.9) (Figure 5). Kinetic energy associated with the fall on a slippery surface (COF = 0) was 2 to 3.5 times higher than that associated with a less slippery or nonslip surface (COF = 0.9) (Figure 6). Similarly, momentum was nearly doubled for slippery stair surfaces (COF = 0) compared with surfaces with only slightly greater friction (COF≥0.2) in the 7-step fall (Figure 7). These findings suggest that slippery stair surfaces tend to increase potential for upper leg injury in a stair fall.
Impact velocity of upper leg vs coefficient of friction (COF).
Kinetic energy of upper leg vs coefficient of friction (COF).
Momentum of upper leg vs coefficient of friction (COF).
The elasticity (COR) or stiffness of the stairs was found to influence biomechanical measures. Kinetic energy decreased nearly 4-fold as COR was increased from 0 to 1.00 (Figure 8). Impact velocity and momentum also decreased slightly with increasing values of COR (Figure 9 and Figure 10). These findings suggest that stairs constructed of highly elastic materials tend to decrease risk for upper leg injuries in a stair fall.
Kinetic energy of upper leg vs coefficient of restitution (COR) (elasticity).
Impact velocity of upper leg vs coefficient of restitution (COR) (elasticity).
Momentum of upper leg vs coefficient of restitution (COR) (elasticity).
The slope of the stairs was also found to influence all biomechanical measures. In general, increases in the slope of stairs led to increases in biomechanical measures. Kinetic energy increased nearly 4-fold as the stair slope was increased from 8:12 to 8:8 (Figure 11). Momentum and velocity increased 2-fold with the same increase in slope (Figure 12 and Figure 13). These findings suggest that steeper stairs tend to increase injury risk of the upper leg in a stair fall.
Kinetic energy of upper leg vs slope of stairs (rise-run).
Momentum of upper leg vs slope of stairs (rise-run).
Impact velocity of upper leg vs slope of stairs (rise-run).
Using computer simulation models of a 3-year-old pediatric stair fall, we investigated the relationships between potential for upper leg injury and various fall-environment factors. Findings indicate that stair characteristics and the number of steps influence biomechanical outcome measures, and thus injury potential. Simulations revealed that increasing the number of steps, reducing stair friction (eg, slippery surface), decreasing stair stiffness (eg, concrete stairs), or increasing stair slope tended to elevate biomechanical measures increasing the potential for upper leg injury.
Our findings further suggest that characteristics of the fall environment can play a key role in predicting likelihood of injury. In other words, one stair fall is not the same as another, although they may have involved the same number of steps. This concept illustrates the need for more detailed investigation of fall scenes, especially when attempting to distinguish between unintentional and abusive cases. Also, similar detail is needed when conducting and reporting case-based epidemiological studies to correlate injuries to particular fall types. For example, although the study by Joffe and Ludwig5 relates the number of steps to the incidence and severity of pediatric injury, additional details of the fall environment and stair characteristics are needed to build an accurate database of stair fall injuries. (Joffe and Ludwig indicate that injury risk and severity were similar in stair falls involving more than 4 steps and stair falls involving fewer than 4 steps, without specification of stair characteristics.) Details of the victim's initial position and stair characteristics, such as those investigated in this study (surface friction, surface elasticity, and stair slope), must also be documented to make definitive statements related to injuries resulting from particular types of falls. As shown through simulations, characteristics of the fall environment affect biomechanics and the potential for injury. That is, a 7-step stair fall with a slippery or icy stair surface may have a higher potential for producing injury than a 7-step stair fall with steps that have a nonslip surface. Substantiating our findings, a report by Ellis24 proposes that stair-surface characteristics are 1 of 3 primary factors contributing to stair falls.
Unfortunately, few studies correlate fall-environment characteristics to injury type and severity that can be used as the basis for a pediatric stair fall injury risk model. However, the study by Joffe and Ludwig5 proposes an injury mechanism model that suggests "that stairway falls consist of an initial mild to moderately severe impact followed by a series of low-energy non-injurious falls." They further state that "there is no correlation between severity and number of steps fallen down" and that "the absence of severe or numerous injuries in falling down a greater number of steps is predicted by this model." Our simulation results do not agree with such findings and are in conflict with a stair fall injury risk model that is independent of the number of steps. Using our simulation model, we have further shown that overall body injury potential would likely increase with more steps, since total body velocity increases with the number of steps (Figure 14). Our simulation results support a model that reflects dependency of injury risk on the number of steps and other stair characteristics (surface materials and slope). We speculate that differences between our simulation-based model and the case-based model of Joffe and Ludwig may be due in part to undocumented variations in stair characteristics, eg, surface friction, surface elasticity, and stair slope. However, our model predicts injury risk or the likelihood of injury, whereas the model by Joffe and Ludwig was based on actual injury incidence. Our predictions of increased injury risk, implied through changes in biomechanical measures, may still be below injury tolerance levels and would not have been associated with injury incidence. In other words, predicted increases in injury risk may not reflect the difference between the absence or presence of injury or differences in injury severity. Discrepancies in these limited studies further justify the need for additional investigation in the area of stair fall biomechanics and injury incidence in the development of a pediatric stair fall injury model.
Total body velocity vs number of steps for varying slopes (rise-run).
Since community and government policies often dictate the design of playgrounds, injury epidemiology studies of playground falls have been motivated to document key environment details such as impact surface characteristics and heights of playground equipment.14,16 This type of detailed fall information and the associated injuries, occurring in a controlled playground environment, have provided a foundation for correlating playground injuries to the fall environment. These studies of playground injuries, like our computer simulation stair fall study, document the importance that subtle changes in the fall environment can have on injury potential.
The stair fall simulation model used in this study has not been experimentally validated. Future plans for our study include conducting experimental trials of stair falls for use in validating our model. Without experimental validation, absolute values of biomechanical measures should not be relied on and simulation results should only be used to study relationships between model parameters and outcome measures.
This study illustrated the usefulness of computer simulation techniques to investigate the influence of stair characteristics on pediatric injury potential associated with a stair fall. Although a number of factors must be considered when attempting to distinguish between injuries that have resulted from unintentional actions or abuse, knowledge of the relationships between the fall environment and injury potential is key to providing clinicians a scientific basis for judgment. Findings of our study documented that stair characteristics, eg, surface materials and slope, can play an important role in the likelihood of upper leg injury risk. Such findings further highlight the need to carefully document the details of the fall environment when conducting pediatric injury epidemiology studies. Validated fall simulations, leveraged with case-based injury studies, ultimately will aid in developing an empirical injury model for use by clinicians in detecting child abuse.
With this article by Bertocci and colleagues, we take advantage of the current capabilities of information technology. Computer modeling was used to simulate children falling down stairs—the consequences of which are commonly seen in our emergency departments. The effect of the number of stairs and the steepness of them was examined in a series of computer simulations. It is a dramatic example of how technology can be used to shed new light on an age-old problem. We welcome other such creative uses of information technology for articles published in ARCHIVES.—Frederick P. Rivara, MD, MPH
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In child abuse cases, caregivers often falsely report common fall scenarios such as stair falls as the underlying cause of injury. Unfortunately, it is often difficult to determine the validity of caregiver-stated scenarios, since so little is known regarding pediatric biomechanics and injury risk associated with these relatively common falls. A better understanding of the influence that specific fall environment factors have on injury biomechanics in children is needed. Our long-term goal is to use knowledge of biomechanics to aid in distinguishing between accidents and abuse. Our study demonstrated the usefulness of computer simulation techniques for investigating the biomechanics of stair falls. Using our simulation model, we determined that stair characteristics have an effect on lower extremity injury potential.
Accepted for publication March 27, 2001.
This research was funded through grants from the Childrens' Hospital of Pittsburgh (Pittsburgh, Pa), the Whitaker Foundation (Arlington, Va), and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention–Center for Injury Research and Control (Atlanta, Ga).
A poster format abstract of this work was presented at the 2000 Pediatric Academic Society Conference, Boston, Mass, May 12-16, 2000.
This work is dedicated to Frances Pierce, August 3, 1919, to December 21, 2000, Dr Pierce's mom and life inspiration.
Opinions expressed are those of the authors and do not necessarily reflect those of the funding agencies.
Corresponding author and reprints: Gina E. Bertocci, PhD, University of Pittsburgh, Rehabilitation Science and Technology, 5044 Forbes Tower, Pittsburgh, PA 15260 (e-mail: email@example.com).
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Chinese weights tend to be ground down flat but unpolished leaving an opaque base.
... had a look at their bums ...
As I am on the cusp between eastern and western Europe (Vienna, Austria) my novice readings (mostly on the web) tells me a hundred things and at the same time tells me nothing.
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text:
Only WPBF 25 News obtained the surveillance video of a crash that left a man hospitalized on the Treasure Coast on Valentine's Day.
Rollover crash caught on surveillance video at boat dealership
Published On: Feb 24 2014 11:38:17 AM CST Updated On: Apr 30 2014 02:01:23 PM CDT
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text:
Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
I Returned to TCR to recap THIS?!?!
Box Score, Play Log, Game Graphs, Photos
W- Lowe (1-0), calls for instant replay, people making their team or career debuts
L- Zambrano (0-1), dignity. 3 hours of my life
Things to Take from This Game
1. Not So Good: Zambrano, Samardzija
Zambrano got knicked by a series of softly hit singles before giving up a 3-run home run to Neo Heyward. Some throwing mistakes and a McCann homer in the second chased Zambrano from the game, having given up 8. The fourth reliever in, Samardzija, walked three in a one third of an inning.
2. Good: Byrd, Marshall, Russell.
Byrd gave the Cubs a very early and short-lived lead with a 3-run homer in the first. Marshall and Russell gave the Cubs a chance to get back in the game with a Ramirez 2-run Homer, as they pitched 4 and 2/3 of scoreless relief, before turning things over to Samardzija, Berg, and Grabow
3. McLouth Lies like a Dog. And Fakes It. And Just Isn't Very Nice.
Down 8-5 with Ramirez on 1st, Byrd smoked a liner to left center. McLouth made a diving catch with the ball popping out on contact with the ground. But McLouth faked the catch, threw it in, and the umpires, missing the call, declared Ramirez doubled off of first. We went from having the tying run at the plate with no outs, to no on and two outs. After Soriano predictbly ended the inning; it was all downhill from there.
The gory details, below
Game Recap
Inning 1 - Top
Trying to get settled in and find the game somewhere, anywhere, I turn in to espn3.com just in time to see Byrd hit a lined shot of a home run just to the right of dead-center. Impressive. 3-0 Cubs
Inning 1 - Bottom
- 3-2 count to Leadoff Hitter Melky Cabrera (heh), fasball just inside and it's a leadoff walk from Z. Byrd's HR on opening day is the first time a Cub newbie has done that since Henry Rodriguez. Any recap with a Henry Rodriguez shout-out is a good one.
- Prado reaches for one, dumps it down the line in right, runners to 1 and 3.
- Chipper pops to shallow center. You could hear and smell the cubbery coming from a mile away, as it drops just behind Theriot and just in front of Byrd and Soriano. Run scores, runners at 1 and 2. 3-1 Cubs
- McCann pops another one to just-in-front-of-Byrd. Bases loaded, no outs.
- Z blows a 94 mph fastball high and inside past Glaus. 3-pitch strikeout.
- Yunel Escobar with a chopper up the middle, two runs score tying the game. None of these have been well-hit balls, yet it's 3-3.
- Matt Weiters Chuck Norris Robert Redford Paul Bunyan Jesus Jason Heyward clobbers a low and inside fastball maybe 420 feet into the back of the bullpen in right-center. 6-3 Braves.
- 3-0 to McLouth, now 3-1. Walk.
- Lowe bunts to Z, Fontenot covering. Out, runner to 2nd.
- Sean Marshall up in the pen.
- Melky Cabrera (heh) fists one to Theriot, inning mercifully over.
Inning 2 - Top
- Fontenot bounces one to Escobar's left, 6-3 putout.
- Soto hits one to Chipper's right, makes a nice pick, 5-3.
- and Z rolls one to Escobar, 6-3, easy inning for Lowe
Inning 2 - Bottom
- Z whacks Martin Prado with a fastball off the elbow protector.
- Cubbery Part Deux. Jones rolls one past Lee, Fontenot and Z hook up for a nice 4-3. Z then turns and fires to third trying to get Prado advancing to third, but the throw is high and wide, Prado scores. Ramirez wasn't in any position to cover third, anyway. 7-3 Braves
- McCann smites a ball deep into right field. 8-3 Braves. Out comes LouPa
- In comes Marshall. If this is new, emotions-under-control Z, give me Cray-Z Z, anyday.
- Glause K's on a curve near his feet.
- Another nice curve, this time for called strike 2 on Escobar. Fouls off another tough curve. Finally grounds 5-3.
Inning 3 - Top
- Theriot with an easy 6-3 chopper. I am detecting a pattern, here.
- Fukudome with a nice opposite-field liner just out of Cabrera's reach, down the line for a double.
- Lee 6-3.
- Ramirez takes a low fastball out to left of straight-away left. Nice lined shot, classic Aramis. 8-5 Braves
- Byrd with a pretty dumb swing at something low, for Lowe's first K.
Inning 3 - Bottom
- Hercules Heyward lines out to Lee.
- McLouth swings through a high fastball, K.
- Swinging strike on another nice curve, Lowe's AB is done. Nice work by Marshall.
Inning 4 - Top
- Soriano squibs the first pitch, 4-3
- Fontenot with an easy chop to Chipper. Lowe is doing his thing.
- Soto 5-3. Little opposition put up against Lowe this inning.
Inning 4 - Bottom
- Cabrera 5-3. Marshall mowing them down. Z's era is 54.
- "With Zambrano, you just didn't expect this." - Santo.
- Marshall with a real sharp, big curve that hits the bottom of the strike zone, gets Prado looking.
- Another curve for a called strike 3, this one on Larry Wayne Jones.
Inning 5 - Top
- Marshall taken down for Chad Tracy. 2 and 2/3 IP, 5 K. I'd have kept him in, but what do I know. 37 pitches for Marshall.
- Tracy walks.
- Theriot lines one to Escobar, doubles-up Tracy.
- Curve just off the corner, full count on Fukudome. Walks on the next pitch.
- Lee smokes one to right-center, McLouth makes an excellent, fully extended running catch to rob a double.
Inning 5 - Bottom
- James Russell makes his big league debut. Haven't had a chance to watch much spring training, Russell is big, ugly, works quickly, sort of a severe 3/4 delivery.
- and he gets McCann to roll out to Fontenot.
- Glaus lines a single to the left-center gap.
- Escobar flies to right
- Jesus Caesar Rasputin Ric Flair Heyward looks at a high curve for a called strike three from Russell.
Inning 6 - Top
- Ramirez reaches for one, slaps it to Chipper's left for a single.
- Byrd macks one to the left-center gap. McLouth makes a fantastic diving catch, but then the ground shakes the ball out of his glove, rolling on the ground before he picks it up. Ramirez sees it come out and goes to second. The ump rules it as a catch, however, causing Ramirez to be doubled off at first base. Review clearly shows that it came out, but after conferencing, they uphold the double play. Len and Bob correctly point out that none of the umps would have been able to see the ball coming out behind McLouth's glove and body, and McLouth sold it quite well. Then on the other hand, if Ramirez can clearly see it, how can four umps miss it? Bob asks.
- Soriano up, he should be the tying run with nobody out. Instead he's up with two outs and nobody on. Ramirez is prety frustrated.
- Soriano swings at a pitch in the dirt to end the inning. Ouch.
Inning 6 - Bottom
- McLouth with a slow roller off the mound, Fontenot fumbles the awkward hop, but it's correctly ruled a hit. No, now it's ruled an error. Meh.
- Lowe chops a bunt off the plate, Russell goes to first for the out.
- Ramirez shown shaking his head in disbelief at 3B. Me too, Rammy. Me too.
- Len: If Melky does well in Atlanta, and they name a street after him, it can be The Melky Way.
- Oh, dear god.
- Melky flies to right, McLouth to third.
- Prado rolls to Fontenot. Good work by Russell
Inning 7 - Top
- Fontenot's error gets re-scored as a hit. Good.
- Peter Moylan in.
- Over my wgn on mlb.tv telecast, I barely hear someone on ESPN on the TV mention that "Moylan comes from down under, twice." - He's a siderarm/submariner from Australia.
- Fontenot back to Moylan.
- Soto K's swinging
- Colvin makes his first appearing, pinch-hitting for Russell. Flies to Heyward, just getting under it.
- I am so sick of God Bless America being part of the Mid-Seventh Festivities. No one felt the need to sing it until mid-September 2001. It made sense to sing it, then. Maybe we can retire it, ten years later?
Inning 7 - Bottom
- Samardzija in. I'm in mid-season form, correctling spelling Samardzija on the first try.
- Jones walks.
- Theriot is trying to ask for time as Jones gets about a four-step jump on Samardzija as he stands in the stretch. Soto then tries to get up and call for time, as Samardzija starts to throw, realizes what Soto's doing, and lets up, lobbing in a ball. Jones steals second. Ugly.
- Now McCann walks.
- Full count to Glaus. This isn't going so well for Samardzija.
- fastball just off the outside corner, bases walked loaded.
- Rothschild out.
- Escobar lines a shot of a double through the left-center gap, fastball belt-high and middle-in. Bases clear. 11-5 Braves.
- Gilgamesh Heyward bounces to Lee, who throws way above Samardzija's head, scoring Escobar while Heyward goes to second. 12-5 Braves
- McLouth K's looking
- Hinske hits for Moylan. Crushes one deep to right-center, stretches it into a triple with a bad relay throw. 13-5 Braves
- Justin Berg in.
- We're playing the infield in. Bwaaaaaaahahahahahaaaaaa.
- That said, it works. Melky hits one right to Fontenot, 4-3 with the runner holding. Brilliant!
- Prado lines a single to the left of second base for a single, 14-5 Braves.
- Fontenot makes an excellent diving grab on a Chipper liner to his right. Inning mercifully over.
Inning 8 - Top
- Saito in to pitch.
- Theriot K's swinging at a slider low and off the plate.
- Fukudome with a lazy fly to Melky
- Lee K's swinging, Saito looks pretty good.
Inning 8 - Bottom
- Berg walks McCann to lead off the eighth.
- 2-0 on Glaus. Rothschild out. High and tight for ball four.
- Brooks Conrad (who!?!?) runs for McCann.
- This game's just a stinker. (For you, kjk)
- Escobar flies to straight away right, advanced Conrad.
- Sparticus Luke Skywaker Hammurabi Indra Heyward lines a single back up the middle, scoring Conrad. 15-5 Braves
- 2-1 to McLouth, Berg continues to miss high.
- Most runs the Cubs have allowed on opening day since 1884.
- McLouth walks.
- Grabow in for Berg
- Omar Infante pinch hits for Chipper, grounds to.... aw, I dunno, fuck it, someone, who cares anymore. Run scores. 16-5 Braves
- Conrad (I think) pops to foul territory, Theriot makes a nice running catch, worth 11 runs.
Inning 9 - Top
- Wagner in. K's Ramirez swinging at a slider low and inside.
- Byrd pops to Prado at second.
- Soriano K's swinging at a 96 mph fastball. Wagner looks like he's back.
Parachat Recap
Inning 1
- What have you done in your offseason, in six words?
- Technical difficulties
- You always know that things are going badly when Cholera appears.
- Fantasy teams
Inning 2
- Other games.
- Chipper Jones, Conversation killer.
- basting the lamb shanks
- expressions of disappointment.
Inning 3
- Will 8 runs win this game?
- Why does Z keep getting the Opening Day assignment?
- The new parachat sign-in, tougher and more inscrutable security than the airport.
- Missing HRes while dicking around with your password
- Recommended drugs/medications for Z
- Marshall's time to Free Agency
Inning 4
- First-day performances.
- Soriano still is not good.
- Which is higher, Z's era or his Emotional IQ. (Now that's just mean, CT Steve).
- "Marshall will open next season just like this one. Starting in the second." - Mr. Whipple
Inning 5
- 1st Johann's Mom reference of the year.
- and Jacos links it to a Tiger Woods joke. Very nice.
- Jacos on fire: Not only is Nady wearing Prior's number, he's also wearing Prior's arm.
- What we'd ask Z after the game.
- Where's Prior?
- That Buehrle play.
Inning 6
- The racial subtext of being "Raised right"
- The bane of my existence, adds for The Blind Side
- That botched call on the Byrd hit.
- How to convince Fukudome that every day is opening day.
- And Fontenot that he's two feet taller, Lee that it's 2005, etc. etc.
- If only we could be hyponotized into liking some other team....
- Lee's 2009 vs. 2005.
- Is it your vasectomy that is making you snippy?
- Oh, dear god.
Inning 7
- Bad Answers to Essay Questions
- Things we'd rather doo to our genitalia than watch this game.
- the horrific Bogut injury
- Chainsaws.
- The GBA singer.
- I'm Rupaul. But don't tell anyone.
- How to characterize the worst exams I'm grading.
- How to characterize Samardzija's performance.
- Misery.
- Put in Lady Gaga!
- Chainsaw vasectomies.
- If you wagered that Samardzija would be better than Z, you lose.
- How do we feel?
Inning 8
- Forms of violation that remind parachatters of this game.
- Creative analogies that I'm avoiding like the plague.
- What might have saved this game.
- Fan racism and booing players.
- Stinker.
- Insurance/Warranty scams.
- global warming
Inning 9
- Broadband access
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
My mood is best reflected by my comment to your comment in the previous thread. :-)
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
LOL. New ad tagline for the Cubs. The Cubs: A bunch of dirty little fuckers.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Well, "i know its only one game" but after seeing the Wide Out today, this unfortunately reinforces my belief that he is a bust - and predicted it here. Prove me wrong, Wide Out!
I hate Notre Dame anyway.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Correct me if I'm wrong...but I'm getting the distinct impression that E-Man thinks Someninja will be a bust. Am I using my jump to conclusions mat?
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
That is probably right, and you have something there.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Forms of violation that remind parachatters of this game.
Don't parachat? Bet you're jealous now...
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
yay for chainsaws and stinker in the parachat recap!!! I feel just like james russell making it to the bigs! awwwwwww.... (as read by dr. zoidberg.)
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Yay. I missed the little feller.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Welcome back!
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Future Date: Feb. 25, 2011
- Cubs pitchers and catchers reported today, and Jim Hendry said Carlos Zambrano "looks great", and finally "gets it". Hendry said Big Z seems to have finally matured, and expects a season of consistent good performance from the team's "ace".
In a related note, today Tom Ricketts put the team up for sale on eBay.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Future Date: Feb. 25, 2012
- Cubs pitchers and catchers reported today, and Jim Hendry said Carlos Zambrano "looks great", and finally "gets it". Hendry said Big Z seems to have finally matured, and expects a season of consistent good performance from the team's "ace".
In a related note, Tom Ricketts has still not received any bids for the Cubs on eBay.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
If Jim Hendry is still the GM in 2012, the Cubs would have had to make a World Series. So I could deal with his comments then. I can't imagine the Ricketts Family being that dumb to keep him around for another couple years without a truly successful season.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
"Darryl Strawberry concerned over Dwight Gooden's troubles"
Pot, meet kettle.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Not funny, Carlos. Of course they're both black! But you should see that they are individuals, too.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
It's a good thing Fontenot, Soto, and Soriano picked up right where they left off last year.
Yeah, I guess we shouldn't be surprised.
The ugly loss doesn't bother me too much as it is only one game and all. But what bothers me is the same crappy things happening again already (Z being Z, Alf K'ing, etc.). It is like things are what they are and won't be changing.
This teams window is closing fast before the need to rebuild. STL is for real and I think it will take 93 wins for the WC. so hopefully this team can get out fast.
Go Cubs!
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Don't worry its only Spr...
Whoops, my bad!
Guess it counts now.
But, really don't worry about Fonty and Soto, its just the Catcher and 2B dude, at the bottom of the order.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
True... hitting is one part of the game, and when it comes to hitting they are down in the order. On the other hand, there's the whole other aspect of the game we like to conveniently forget about.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
It's a good thing the Cubs lost this game in such horrible fashion; spring training, the month+ of optimism and sunshine, doesn't give us much opportunity to work on our gloom and doom without looking unreasonable.
Could we at least give the players a full week of sucking during the regular season before we point to that sample as proof that the team is not, never was, and will never be any good? Or do I have to avoid TCR in order to enjoy the simple fact that baseball is real again until I am in the mood to complain and say nay?
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
It's the same reaction every year. So yeah, you'll have to avoid TCR to avoid it.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
It's hard to find another group of people as dedicated to baseball. Maybe I'll just try to talk myself out of the need to argue.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
I want to see how long it takes Lou to put Soriano on bench for a
couple of days when he continues to suck.
Pitchers will keep on pitching outside to him until he adjusts
or starts takin pitches.
Fontenot will be ok,for what is expected.
Soto i have no trust in he has to produce somewhere between 2008 and
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Soriano has already had a long and successful career. People act like he has never hit breaking pitches in his life. Trust me to have the career he has had, he has hitting breaking balls over his career.
Sitting on the bench doesn't help him or this franchise. He isn't going to be treated like some scrub rookie if he doesn't hit after a few days.
Besides who the fuck is going to replace Soriano's power in this lineup? Tyler Colvin? Is he our great savior? Gimme me a break that kid will be hitting .150 within a month.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
"Besides who the fuck is going to replace Soriano's power in this lineup? Tyler Colvin? Is he our great savior? Gimme me a break that kid will be hitting .150 within a month."
The last time we saw this "power" you speak of was almost an entire year ago. He is clearly not the player he was when he signed with the Cubs. The player he was appears to be gone. Almost anyone could replace him now...
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
3 for 20. Sounds about right for how much he'll be used. Or should that be not used.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Lol...way to work in your daily "Colvin Sucks" attitude...
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
I don't if he sucks or not. I just doubt Lou is going to follow through on getting him enough AB's to keep him in any kind of grove.
And I love it, in the same post we get this little gem: "Fontenot will be okay."
He's dog shit. I hate how Cubbie world plays favorites with their weak-ass favorite sons. Get over Fontenot. Contenders don't start guys like him.
How about a nice game of Player A/Player B:
In 2009:
Player A, .242/.312/.411
Player B, .236/.301/.377
And sorry rokfish, no offense or anything. This is just a culmination of many things. I'm annoyed that the Cubs didn't improve this off season and a 16-5 loss really drives that home. I'm annoyed that Cubbie world thinks this is a great team and can't see how truly mediocre it is. I'm going to go to a tea bagger protest and throw some freedom bricks now to vent.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
"I'm annoyed that Cubbie world thinks this is a great team and can't see how truly mediocre it is."
Who in Cubbie world thinks this is a great team?
Clearly not managment or they would have spent money in the off season, would have traded for a relief pitcher when Guzman went down and would not have promissed three starts a week to Colvin. Not the press, or did I miss all of the articles that picked the Cubs to win the divison? Not the fans as many games are not sold out?
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
I agree. Who has said, written, or blogged that this is a "great team"?
Most everyone has picked the team to finish either 2nd or third in the Central.
So many things have to go right for them to make the playoffs, that it puts it in the realm of "Cubbie Odds".
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Then I did not understand "Fontenot will be fine" correctly. Apparently he meant "Fontenot will be fine since the team is going to mediocre anyways."
Personally, and this is just me (maybe I'm in the minority on this one), I'd like to see a good Cubs team.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
We all want a good Cubs team, but that is unlikely if Soriano and Zambrano don't give good value for their contracts.
Re: many games are not sold out
Hell, Opening Day isn't even sold out yet.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
You can still get a Dugout seat or an obstructed view seat directly from the Cubs for the Home Opener as I write this.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Well, yes, but in this economy Dugout seats are a tough sell regardless - and - have you ever sat behind a pole at Wrigley?
Figuratively speaking, it is sold out.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
On one hand, the game really sucked. On the other hand, we got a game recap from Trans! I'd almost forgotten how much I love them!
Thanks, Trans. It almost makes up for the stupid game.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Off topic on this off day, but the Baseball Project, a great band featuring Scott McCaughey, Steve Wynn and Peter Buck, is doing a new song a month -- the Broadside Ballads series, in conjunction with ESPN. Second edition is about the Cubs. They played this song at the Len and Bob Bash.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Do you remember when Peter Buck was relevant?
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Peter Buck? Is that the name of a porn star?
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
ditto what rick telander has to say in this morning's sun-times...
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
It could be worse Baker could still be manager. Somehow he thought on Opening Day it would be cool to play his teams 4th and 5th Ofers in the starting lineup.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Jesus. I totally thought you were being sarcastic. I can't believe he actually played his 4th and 5th OF on opening day. I guess ST really tired some of his starters out.
I don't remember whose theory it was, but this reminds of the TCR theory that Dusty knows some "manager moves" that he doesn't understand. He uses them in order to appear managerial.
So yes. It could be MUCH worse.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
well, it's pretty simple stuff...he played the L/R matchup.
nix played over stubbs...
i dunno what the "other" OF issue is supposed to be about.
i guess im supposed to assume johnny gomes should play? meh, whatever...double meh, whatever vs. a hard right hander.
i dunno of a manager out there more over-analyzed since jimmy williams in BOS/HOU.
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
Re: Game 1 Recap: Cubs 5, Braves 16
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Recent comments
Friday's games will be in Washington, Chicago, Arlington, and Cleveland or Boston. Someone's game is starting laaaaaaaate - 50-50 chance it's the CDT Cubs.
Meh, I messed that up. Mets are in.
Cards and Giants can still tie though.
Kershaw gets hurt by his defense and gave up 2 more runs. Blach has 8 shutout innings.
Mets already won as did Cards.
tomorrow is gonna be helluva fun if Giants hold on. We're all rooting for a 3-way tie I presume.
good news is now 5 K's for Lester through 4 (in a quest for 200 for season). Bad news is he's already at 86 pitches.
be curious how long Maddon sticks with Lester to try and let offense get back into it and get him the win (4-2 as I type, was 4-0)
Fwiw, he needed 2.1 IP to cross 200 for season so he got that at least. He also needs 9 K's for 200K's on season and he has 4 through 3.
cubs score 2 runs thanks to predictable reds pitching and horrible CIN defense...cubs only down by 1 now. heyward even got a gift 2rbi double out of an easy popout. neat.
something named Ty Blach has outpitched Clayton Kershaw through 6 innings (1-0 Giants).
not that finishing 2nd place will matter much nor did this game, but have to think if Hendricks pitches well tomorrow, he could leapfrog Lester in Cy Young voting. Don't see anyway Scherzer doesn't win it regardless and it doesnt' look like Lester has any incentive clauses that matter. Also might give Cueto some votes.
Rather remarkable how many teams have really good 1-2 options this year.
Nats: Scherzer and Roark (and Strasburg was great before injuries)
Cubs: Lester and Hendricks (and Arrietta is still damn good just not as consistently lately)
pretty much what I'm gathering from this thread is that it doesn't matter who you play in 5-game series, but no one wants to have to deal with Cardinal fans if we end up losing.
I can respect that.
first game for lester giving up more than 2 runs since july 24th. hell of a run.
doh, yes...dunno what happened there. jake arrieta is all "bro wut?"
lester going for #20...cubs haven't had a LH (thanks jpep for the correction) 20 game winner since d.ellsworth in 1963.
fwiw, all the games are free on mlb.tv
Short rest for MadBum would be 2 days. WC game is Wed., Games 1 & 2 are Friday/Saturday.
A left-handed one...
J-Hey not finishing with an offensive onslaught.
If Geoff Blum could be a Playoff hero, there is hope still...


text:
Even though Google (NASDAQ: GOOGL ) Maps is back on the iPhone, Apple (NASDAQ: AAPL ) still needs to get its own Maps service up to snuff. Apple's already spent several hundred million dollars on at least three map-related acquisitions: Placebase, Poly9, and C3 Technologies. It might as well add another.
TechCrunch is reporting that the Mac maker turned map maker is potentially looking to acquire Waze, the crowd-sourced traffic and navigation service that already has 30 million users pitching in to data aggregation. This buyout rumor actually makes perfect sense. Here's why.
First off, Waze happens to fit the bill of an Apple acquisition. It is small and likely has negligible revenue currently (relative to Apple's massive top line). It also has unique technology that could be integrated into Apple products to make them better. Waze has raised $67 million in venture funding so far, so Apple could probably pick it up for well under $500 million, which is typically the upper limit of how much it likes to spend on acquisitions.
When CEO Tim Cook publicly apologized to users over Maps criticism, he specifically pointed to alternatives to use as Apple works on improving its own. That included services from key rivals like Microsoft (NASDAQ: MSFT ) Bing, AOL's (UNKNOWN: AOL.DL ) Mapquest, Google, and Nokia (NYSE: NOK ) . At the time, Google and Nokia only had web apps available, but both have since launched native iOS apps.
Notably, Cook also recommended users give Waze a try. That meant that the small start-up was bumping mapping elbows with tech titans, and recognition from Apple isn't to be squandered. Waze is also one of Apple's current mapping partners for data, as it's found in Apple's acknowledgements of map data sources.
Acquiring Waze and stitching it into Apple Maps wouldn't be a magical panacea, but its real-time traffic and location data would definitely be a step in the right direction.
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