text:
'Road & Track' magazine
Posted 18 January 2005 - 16:17
OK I know I'm losing it ("I grow old... I grow old... I shall wear the bottoms of my trousers rolled" kinda thing) but anyone else think R&T is doing a fairly decent job these days?
Posted 18 January 2005 - 16:33
I have always enjoyed the Salon articles, I just wish someone would publish a compilation book on Salon articles like Phil Hill has done with his Ferrari articles.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 16:50
That being said, I still find it superior to the competition and Peter Egan's column is always a pleasure to read.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 16:50
Posted 18 January 2005 - 17:04
Originally posted by snash
I still miss the good old days when Rob Walker and Innes Ireland gave in depth Grand Prix reports, as well as Rob's annual driver ratings.
That being said, I still find it superior to the competition and Peter Egan's column is always a pleasure to read.
Agreed on both counts - I have a full run of R&T for the 70s and bunches of copies for the 60s and 80s and loved Rob Walkers work..
I do like Peter Egan - have no idea why but look forward to my monthly dose of his burblings.....
Posted 18 January 2005 - 17:15
Posted 18 January 2005 - 17:29
Originally posted by snash
I still miss the good old days when Rob Walker and Innes Ireland gave in depth Grand Prix reports, as well as Rob's annual driver ratings.
I am old enough to miss the always entertaining Formula One reports of Henry N. Manney III.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 17:39
So am I AMEN to Henry
Posted 18 January 2005 - 17:45
Originally posted by jlp356
I am old enough to miss the always entertaining Formula One reports of Henry N. Manney III.
He was a little before my time, but i have read several reprints of his articles...hilarious!!!!!
Posted 18 January 2005 - 18:06
Is it the type of magazine you can refer to for 'historical fact' - i.e. what actually happened? I have rarely seen anybody cite it as a source.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 18:18
Posted 18 January 2005 - 19:11
It shone among the other motor magazines...so I bought it.
And since...I bought i until the beginning of the 80;s.
I beleieve R&T sold a lot on it`s catchy covers...and then the reader found out what a good magazine it was.
Well...I must say...in the beginning of the 80;s...it was not interesting for me anymore...except for some issues I guess.
I still have most of them...except for some that was in fact stolen from me.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 19:26
Posted 18 January 2005 - 19:42
I used to enjoy Rob Walker's "Rob's Cars" articles, too.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 19:56
1) The current automotive situation in the world just isn't particularly interesting to me any longer.
2) The magazine is DRASTICALLY overstuffed with ads. Just as an example, taking the current issue of February 2005, you have a 162 page magazine with about 85 pages fully taken up with ads. Ads, ads, ads, ads......... I don't care to pay for a magazine that is more than 50% ads. They should pay ME to take it home.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 20:02
Originally posted by JB Miltonian
2) The magazine is DRASTICALLY overstuffed with ads. Just as an example, taking the current issue of February 2005, you have a 162 page magazine with about 85 pages fully taken up with ads. Ads, ads, ads, ads.........
...and this makes R & T different from other mags in what way????
Posted 18 January 2005 - 20:09
However, I have to agree with what JB Miltonian said-there's not a whole lot going on that I really have to read about, and there are waaaaay too many adverts. Granted, I can level the same criticism to most car magazines.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 20:19
Originally posted by JB Miltonian
They should pay ME to take it home.
..I think I pay just over $1 per issue delivered, so its getting close..............
Don't get me wrong - R&T ain't perfect and arguably isn't as good as it was - but it does have a couple of regular writers I like (Egan and Judd) and has a 2 or so long text based articles a month that we here seem to crave. So I thought it was worth a little postive recognition......
Now the one thing it doesn't seem to do is to use photo archives to any extent - wonder whether it has an extensive one?
Posted 18 January 2005 - 20:20
Posted 18 January 2005 - 20:21
Posted 18 January 2005 - 20:25
Originally posted by JB Miltonian
Well, Snash (post 16) - just as a comparison, the new issue of Sports Car International that I brought home last night has 96 pages, of which 12 are taken up with full page ads. That means there is more content in 96 pages of SCI than there is in 162 pages of R&T. So it's possible to crank out a nice, glossy, enthusiast-themed magazine that doesn't make you want to throw it in the fire. I still buy R&T every month, and I enjoy the occasional article in it, but I don't rate it highly.
SCI, a bi-monthly, has a subscription price that is two and a half times an issue as expensive as the monthlies. So I guess all those ads are good for something.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 20:34
Originally posted by Todd
SCI, a bi-monthly, has a subscription price that is two and a half times an issue as expensive as the monthlies. So I guess all those ads are good for something.
Exactly what I was thinking...somebody has to pay the bills. I find the adverts as highly annoying as anyone else, but I will tolerate them if it keeps the subscription price down.
Posted 18 January 2005 - 20:59
Posted 18 January 2005 - 21:56
Thoughts of Tom T Meshingear... is that right?
But mostly, an oddball story, how Innes Ireland learned to steal military equipment.
I certainly hope my son is keeping up my subscription... when he went to America to live he said he'd get it for me and send it over in batches. I've had the first batch arrive, about 15 issues... let's see... that was in 1995?
Posted 19 January 2005 - 02:51
Of course, Racer, Forumla, and others of that ilk may have had something to do with it, and the much improved TV coverage, via cable had a lot to do with my lack of desire to wait for a monthly to see race results.
Posted 19 January 2005 - 03:03
Speaking of Cyclops - one was spied last year at the Phoenix, HSR-West race...
Posted 19 January 2005 - 07:52
Posted 19 January 2005 - 14:48
R&T was a great mag when it centered on motor racing.
Peter Egan still writes some pretty good pieces, but there never seems to be enough there to keep me interested!
Ditto for Innes and Rob. Two very missed gentemen!!
Posted 19 January 2005 - 15:06
I discovered the magazine after a visit to the 1976 NY Auto Show. My first issue was Feb 1976, the cover photo was of a Lamborghini Countach. Since that time, I have managed to collect 98% of the issuesd dating from the early 1950's to the mid 1990's.
While reading an issue dated mid 90's I realized that the magazine was not what it once was. I recall analysing a road test and coming to the conclusion that while the article took up 4 pages, there were maybe 2 paragraphs that that were based upon the experiance of actually driving the car ! The rest of the text was glorified ad copy that was creatively adapted from brochures and press releases. No value. Combine that with the declining race coverage and I decided to no longer purchase the mag. If I have any reqrets about leaving it behind, it would be for their Salon and retrospective articles as well as Peter Eagan.
Posted 19 January 2005 - 16:05
The coverage of F1 was what did it for me. I soon had a subscription, and Rob Walker's reports were always the first thing I went to when new issues arrived. Sadly, as the 70's wound down and my time and resources went toward school anda career, I quit subscribing and when I came back to motorsport, the magazine no longer held for me what it once did. Now it's my son who asks me to buy it.
Other than F1, I also remember how my dad, a university librarian with NO interest in cars or motorsport, was fascinated by the Electrophant and the straight-12 Jag reports. Funny stuff!
Posted 19 January 2005 - 18:19
Posted 19 January 2005 - 18:19
Posted 20 January 2005 - 14:12
no matter how much the wife bitches about old mags
but droped them after dad died and later switched to autoweek for way faster race reports
most of what I know about F-1 in those days is thanks to HNM and R Walker's race reports and Eion's gossip
as in the USA we had not much else at the time
I have looked at their site and resent issues and they are getting better resently
Posted 20 January 2005 - 16:25
R&T web site has 1993 to 2004:
Posted 20 January 2005 - 16:39
Originally posted by D-Type
Is it the type of magazine you can refer to for 'historical fact' - i.e. what actually happened? I have rarely seen anybody cite it as a source.
For me the best part of R&T through the years re:motor racing was the writing as opposed to the detailed race records. However Rob Walker used to do an annual summary of the F1 year that had just ended which was wonderful and did slice data in a way that others didn't (e.g. looking at how many laps particular drivers had led races etc). He also used to grade the drivers.
Posted 20 January 2005 - 19:42
I almost daily use my copies of Wallace's "Automotive Literature Index", in three volumes, covering 1947 through 1986, in order to find material in the major automotive journals of these years.
Posted 20 January 2005 - 19:59
Unfortunately it doesn't seem to cover the off-beat Innes stories mentioned above and which I would love to get hold of.
Posted 20 January 2005 - 20:07
Posted 20 January 2005 - 20:42
Bob Brzezinski mentions a story about Ferraris, Ray Bell's recollection of Innes learning to steal miltary equipment sounds fantastic, I'm sure he's mentioned it before. I seem to recall hearing about a road story involving Stirling and Innes, and driving the machine that moves the Saturn rockets, was that one?
If anyone has any must read suggestions let me know.
Posted 20 January 2005 - 21:31
Posted 25 August 2006 - 15:25
SHMBO & I are empty nesters and some time ago she made "down sizing" noises & "are you aware that your collection of racing magazines is going to cause storage problems in a smaller property".
I started buying Rodent Rack in the sixties, and kept up with it for many years as & when I could find it on the shelf. Henry Manney, Innes Ireland & Rob Walker, what a line up! House moves & lendings out means that I no longer have these early issues, but subsequent gift subsciptions had accrued a substantial holding of copies going back to the eighties.
Co-incidently my last subs. had expired a month earlier & I realised I did not miss it. Apart from Peter Egan - who is superb - the magazine has declined to such an extent that it has disappeared of my personal radar screen.
As the smaller property situation pressure increased, I binned the lot!
Guess what. Still in the same house.
Posted 25 August 2006 - 17:06
Posted 25 August 2006 - 17:47
My very fond memories of R&T are Rob Walker's GP reports and his driver ratings articles.
And then there were Jon Thompson's annual GP reviews and points tables. I was so impressed that finally, in 2004, I wrote this program using Visual Basic and MS Access to "mimic" what I saw in R&T all those years ago...
Posted 25 August 2006 - 19:18
Originally posted by Rosemayer
I am old enough to miss the always entertaining Formula One reports of Henry N. Manney III.
and the photos of Geoffrey Goddard, the annual april fool issue "Rod & Truck", the always entertaining PS at the end of the magazine, the Brockbank cartoons....
Posted 26 August 2006 - 14:36
I stopped actually reading it very closely at some point in the 1980s, but continued to subscribe out of habit until maybe three or four years ago when I finally dropped it -- after many, many years of reading it (from about 1953/1954). I have not looked at a copy lately, but this might be a good prompt to do so. I was never really "bad," just not what I was really interested in, the salon features being about all I actually did read, generally ignoring the rest of it. I will take the time to take a look.
Well, I took a look. On my way back to this desert paradise several months ago, I picked up a copy of Rodent Crap at one the airports where I was whiling away time between connections. I looking for something to read since I was going through my reading material a bit faster than I anticipated. So, I saw a copy of Rodent Crap and bought it.
I left it on the plane when I got back here.
I was truly underwhelmed.
Something that stirs up in my mind the question of just why are automotive magazines today so universally tepid and lacking? The Rodent Crap was generally bird cage liner. The overall standard of writing was poor to at best, mediocre. Having just left home and while there taking the time to look at a few of the issues from the Fifties, Sixties & Seventies, gave me a fair comparison against which to judge the current product.
What was nice about the old R&T's was that you could often read an article about an event or some trend or happening and it was written in a coherent, sensible fashion and actually something more than mush or drivel we now have to deal with whenever we open the pages of such a magazine today. There is something that actually appears to be "writing" and not, well, whatever it is.
I now pity the young people are being denied the privilege to read articles that allow you to "see" an event in your mind's eye. Of course, people -- especially the young the old as well -- don't read very much any more. I recently re-read "The Great Gatsby" and scarcely a single officer in my section (our Mega Cubicle of Excellence) could claim to have actually read it. Plus, they were absolutely stunned that I would choose such a book for pleasure reading. So imagine what it has been like with "Middlemarch," "A Tale of Two Cities," "Moby Dick," and some of the others I am reading once more (usually for at least the fourth or fifth time).
It is truly sad to realize that for a time we could read articles by HNMIII, DSJ, Pete Lyons, and RRC Walker on a routine basis whereas today....
Posted 26 August 2006 - 14:49
I now expect several TNFers with much sharper memories than mine, or fewer brain cells dissolved by Aussie lager, to tell me they were both in C&D, or MT, or SCW, but not R&T.
The other US magazine that sticks a little in my mind was Hot Rod Magazine, 1960s. I still occasionally hanker after a really neat T-bucket. Failing that a deuce highboy.
Posted 26 August 2006 - 19:29
Posted 26 August 2006 - 23:50
All good things come to end they say and there was a significant downturn in the late 70's/early 80's. Haven't looked at one in a decade after the content dwindled away to ads, ads and more ads.
Sniff, sniff...
Posted 27 August 2006 - 01:31
The other item was some sort of spoof, with the Crunchcog team laying a slot racing groove around the entire circuit, and Crunchcog driving using a slot car thumb control. Some wonderfully exaggerated cartoons of the car in action. Possibly not R&T, then, or possibly an April edition. And now that I think back, it might have been the Targa Florio, not the Mille Miglia.
Posted 27 August 2006 - 03:46
My last find was an R&T from March 1987 appropriately starting off with a Winter Racing piece by Peter Egan in Side Glances column followed by Gone…But Not Forgotten by Alan Girdler in the 10/10ths column. For brevity I'll list below the other stimulating articles:
Miscellaneous Ramblings by John Dinkel
Benetton-BMW B186 Formula 1 by Innes Ireland ("In my day, the drivers were fat and the tires were skinny.")
Mercury Tracer road test
AUTOKRAFT Beyond Cobra by John Lamm
Rising to Greatness (Rene Dreyfus) by Ted West
Porsche 928S 4 Road Test
Fleur de Lys Newark UK by Doug Nye (our admired TNF'er)
Range Rover Over Here UK by John Lamm
Triumph TR6 impressions by Peter Bohr
Servings of Sensible Flights of Fancy Jaguar and Mirage evaluation
Opel Wins Again Letter from Europe by Paul Frere
Exotic Yankeeland Letter from Japan by Jack Yamaguchi
DETROIT Letter from Detroit by Paul Lienert
Holler-Day on Ice About the Sport by Joe Rusz
Stop Thief! By Ivan Berger
1955 OSCA MT4 By Robert T. Devlin & Michael T. Lynch (7 pp)
1986 Formula 1 - FOUR ABOVE THE REST by Rob Walker (art work pieces in the article of Mansell, Piquet, Prost and Berger gives it away.
The 1986 Grand Prix Season by Jonathan Thompson
If I Had My Life To Live Over, I'd live over a Formula 1 Garage Technical Tidbits by Dennis Simanaitis
Technical Correspondence (letters to the Tech column) picks up the rear of this issue.
Incidentally, more track than road it seems in this issue.
There are 69 full-page ads in the total magazine page count of 176 pp. (39%)
How does the content of this issue compare with current issues?


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