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Are you considering a switch from iPad to Microsoft Surface?
While both the well established Apple iPad and the newly announced Microsoft Surface are thin, powerful tablets of generous size, that seems to be about all they share in common.
The iPad is a singular, giant screen, with software dedicated for mobile, and a story that's all about the apps. Because it's been on the market since 2010, and built on the success of the iPhone, those apps now number in the hundreds of thousands, and the accessories are also plentiful.
The Surface is really two devices, a mobile running Windows RT and a cross-over running full Windows 8 Pro. The second one will have access to the massive Windows PC software library but the first will have to make its case for Metro apps. They both have USB ports and kickstands and other amenities that I really like but likely give Apple's Jony Ive the chills.
Because the Surface is like an iPad but is not an iPad, it might just appeal to people looking for exactly that, or for something in between an iPad and a MacBook Air (running Windows.)
On the downside, Microsoft didn't announce pricing, availability, or battery life, which, I'm not going to lie, are real concerns. And if the Windows 8 Pro version is expensive enough, a laptop, including a MacBook Air, might be a better alternative.
Apple is also getting ready to release iOS 6 this fall and likely an iPad 4 next spring. Depending when the Surface is actually released, who knows what that will bring to the table? Would you wait and see before deciding?
As always, vote in the poll up top and then tell me why in the comments below!
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Reader comments
Are you considering a switch from iPad to Microsoft Surface?
I recently bought a Samsung Series 7 Slate, and loaded Windows 8 Consume Preview, back around January. I have been using Windows 8 ever since, and have actually not touched my iPad 2! I upgrades to Windows 8 Release Preview the day it came out, and let me be the first to say, that this is the most beautiful experience I have ever had on a tablet! I can run photoshop, office, play Bejeweled Blitz on Facebook, play Star craft, I mean this is a Windows tablet! This ia significant because it allows me to take my office and games anywhere I go! I have a dock I slide it into in my office and pull out when I leave! It is the best idea of mobile computing since the iPad itself, and most definitely the greatest innovation, I feel, I'm computing history!
Thanks for sharing your experience. I am on the same boat. When I saw the Samsung Slate 7 at the MS Store, it sold me as a working professional's tablet (work heavy on PS and Illustrator) without being a netbook/laptop/ultrabook form factor. It was great to see that Surface comes in 2 flavors (RT and Pro). The biggest concern is really the price.
Just buy the original apple wireless keyboard and connect it to Bluetooth.
It's awesome
Yup! I already switched as of last night when the Ad came out. iOS was getting tired. ;)
What they did not say says more than what they did say. For example they did not say that a Keyboard is required for operation because the tablet lacks a [Ctrl][Alt][Del] key combo which is always required for all Windows PC's. They made sure to call this a PC so we know it will need those important keys multiple times per day in some cases.
Repeated lame joke much?
I can honestly say I've never had to ctrl+alt+del in at least the last 2 to 3 years. I use Visual Studio most of the time (it might be that there a problems with different apps perhaps?).
I woud consider getting a Surface aswellas an iPad. I don't think there is a single _haveonlythisdevice_, rather you have the devices that help you do what you need to do. Having applications transition between the devices when needed is what is important to me.
Thumbs up for you.
It's a shame that imore doesn't use Disqus. Otherwise you've got multiple +1's
I've used Consumer and Release Preview versions of Win8 on both a Fujitsu i5 with 8 GBs of ram, and on a Compaq with a Celeron and 4 GBs of ram. Little or no reboots required with the Fujitsu since it is at least a moderately powered laptop. The Compaq did seem to run out of the ability to complete multiple tasks and require bringing up the Task Manager to kill a program, usually iTunes, but sometimes Windows Explorer. The more powerful, but still mid level Fujitsu almost never requires a Task Manager, and never requires a reboot.
I had the exact same experience on the same computers using Win7. Perhaps your computer, which requires multiple forced reboots multiple times per day merely needs a more powerful processor or more ram?
I doubt, subject to correction, that an average Win 7 or 8 user locks up or needs to reboot their computer multiple times per day. That sounds extreme even with Win 95, 98, ME, or early XP, all of which I used successfully for years.
Very interested in the pro version. Ability to run a full desktop in something ultra-portable is a very attractive feautre.
Of course, a final decision will depend on the final specs (including battery life on the Ivy Bridge processor, and particularly price)
iOS6 is, unfortunately, disappointing to this stage, and that's probably what is pushing me most right now.
With proper support from app developers, the ARM version could change the market in a way reminiscent of the original iPad, and if anyone can do it, I have no doubt that Microsoft can, but they'll need the support.
And I think it's a very intelligent move to target both ends of the market with a single product line. People who don't want an iPad due to lack of productivity will be drawn to the Pro, and, at the right price, the ARM version will (finally, hopefully) make a reasonable competitor to the iPad.
A tablet is not that productive with full OS type software, if you want to know what the experience is like just download the iPad app Splashtop and you can run your Windows PC on your iPad. I do use it sometimes to run my Windows 7 PC from my iPad. It works fine but Windows software is not suited for a tablet so Apps designed for the iPad are much easier to use. It is a pain to have to use a mouse on a tablet computer even though Splashtop has an very good track pad feature. I use it for software that is not available on the iPad. Microsoft includes a Keyboard with their Surface computers and if you are going to have a keyboard you just as well get a laptop with a decent keyboard or a better tablet keyboard like the Logitech keyboard for the iPad. I think the on screen keyboard would be just as easy to type on as that flat thing Microsoft showed. We will have to see.
I think the Surface tablet will do well and it is good for Apple to get some competition, it forces them to keep improving. It will take some time for developers to produce some good Metro Apps. I don't think the Surface Pro version will do that well. Many people say that is what they want but I don't think they will be nearly as popular as the RT version.
Microsoft does have a big problem with people thinking the RT tablet will run native Windows software, no matter how many time they say that it doesn't many people still think it will. They should not have called Window RT Windows 8.
No the surface didn't interest me at all. HP slate all over again.
Did you notice they never show the Surface operating in Portrait mode. I think it must only work in Landscape mode. I watched the entire video and never once did it show the Surface working in Portrait mode. Pretty Lame, I use my iPad in portrait mode more than in landscape.
It also has a 16:9 aspect ratio so even with a 10" screen it has much less screen surface than the iPad.
What is and iPad Fan - - Someone who likes his iPad
What is a Surface Pro Fan - - A device that blows hot air on your fingers
Don't know why they didn't show it on the Surface, but Windows 8 indeed has portrait mode:http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2011/10/20/optimizing-for-both-landsc...
So...is there a touch screen keyboard, or am I going to have to find a flat surface large enough for me to fold out my keyboard EVERY time I want to type something. I would think the ability to simply hold a tablet in one hand and type with the other is a must. Otherwise, it might as well be a laptop.
As mentioned in the keynote. The on-screen keyboard exists whenever you need it. The cover is an option and not a necessary accessory. The idea is why just a flat cover that doesn't do anything, slap a nice keyboard there and make something useful of that extra width the cover adds.
Thank you for putting that out there. Complaining that the kickstand and keyboard will drive people away is not smart. Really? If there isn't a need for them, then why do they exist? I think some people are forgetting all the iPad keyboard accessories and kickstands available out there.
Albeit, they may not be for everyone but you have to admit, making both the stand and keyboard integrate into the tablet and keep the small form factor is what portability is all about. Portability, OS integration and form factor are why the iPad exist! The Surface is a viable addition to the market (notice I didn't say "iPad killer" as everyone looks for). To each his own.
Thanks for the clarification. I did not get to see the keynote, and none of the reporting I saw afterwards mentioned a touchscreen keyboard. For me, the jury is still out. I actually find the touchscreen keyboard works best for me. I have a friend who has a bluetooth keyboard for his iPad that he seems to love. However, when I watch him use it, I can see some awkwardness, as he forgets what functions he still has to tap the screen for.
Depending on price, I see this as potentially causing more harm to Android tablets than iPads. The problem with Android is that it does give the user more control over the OS, but there are so many flavors and subflavors out there it is hard to support it. The Surface could potentially give techies the control they go to Android for, but with a more controlled OS experience like iPad users love.
I left the PC for Apple in 2010. The iPad was part of that transformation that has evolved from iPad2 to New iPad. I do not have the need to do all that I do on my iMac on a portable device. The iPad serves its purpose well and is a fine piece of art. The word in the end to me is integration, an iMac, iPad, Macbook (just donated to my daughter along with an iPad2)all working together in a system that works. I cannot count on the Surface to do the same.
Pricing, battery life, and apps. If the battery life isn't there, then it's a no go. I already have and iPad 2 and don't require a second tablet of any kind, so this isn't something I need, but if the apps are there, the battery life is there, and the price is under what I paid for my iPad 2 ($399), it's something to consider. If it's over $399, forget it. Not with Google producing a 7" Nexus Tablet for under $300.
I am not a fan of anything Microsoft, but admit that this is very interesting......I have oned iPad 1,2 and now 3. Am I bored with ios? How can something that is easy, intuitive and works be boring?
I do not see it as an iPad killer, however it will hurt iPad market share. I do believe the Surface device will be more of an Android killer - sorry Samsung et. all.
I agree. It might not be an iPad killer, but definitely will hurt the Android tablet market.
I have an iPad, iPhone. And iOS really is getting boring to be honest. It 'just works' that's right. But there's so much more that it could be. Apple doesn't seem to be adding much from iOS 5 to 6. New map services source? why would I care about that, Google maps served me well enough, and they now have 3D maps as well. Where are the real innovations that end consumers will fall in love with?
I own an iPhone, but I don't own an iPad. Likely never will. They are cool and all, but for my purposes they are nothing more than a toy. I am a psychologist who takes notes all day long and works on reports almost every day. I have used Tablet PC's for years because they give me the convenience of taking notes electronically, but also have the power of a computer with access to all the patient management software I need. iPad does not have that, nor will it ever have that, IMHO. I love the tablet form factor, but I need more computing power - AND PEN INPUT. Not mushy pens like they have for iPad, but real input for taking patient notes during sessions. Surface gives me exactly what I want and what I need, in one form factor. iPad does not. So, in the end, it depends on the user's need. iPad has tons of apps that can do a lot. But it is not geared toward my needs or profession. Tablet PC is, and getting a Surface will allow me to get away from my HP Touchsmart Tablet/laptop. I am still angry with HP over webOS. ;-)
Not this, but the Razer Project Fiona? It's tempting..
Surface is a very Microsoft take on tablet and tablet-like computing. People know Microsoft, and these look interesting. If they actually come up with a shipping date and competitive pricing, I think the Surface line will do well. Their version of the smart cover is brilliant in and of itself. This is the first time that Microsoft has my attention in many year. I will give these a close look when they are actually available.
The iPad is a great device, but it doesn't fit every use. The MB Air is a great device, and it doesn't fit every use. Apple jumped out to a huge head start in tablet and post-PC land, and they have methodically refined their offerings. But the game is changing. I think Apple is going to have to stay aggressive, or they will slowly lose market share down to some niche but stable market share. Google may suck at tablets, but Microsoft has enough horse power to get a few things right. And in the smart phone area, Google and Microsoft both know how to play hard ball. The times, they are a changin'
I agree, I think with Microsoft finally replying to the iPad that Android for Tablets will become like Linux or Unix are for the PC market but for the Tablet market, there will be a market for it but mostly for the hobby types. I think the major players will drop Android for Windows RT.
I would not be surprised if Android for Phones also starts to level out and drop off as Manufactures come up with their own phone OS or begin to adopt Windows phone. Android like all the versions of Unix for PC's is all messed up with to many versions out there to support.
Unless it is as far from windows as possible not a chance..just look at the name
Yeah. The name. There's a good reason not to like a product. ;-)
In the end for me: Tablet form factor + keyboard cover + PEN INPUT = perfect for me. I get the fun of a tablet but the ability to do the work I need in one device. I am all about convergence. If the iPad could have done that for me for my patient management, I would have switched to it already.
Not interested. Despite my displeasure with using Microsoft OS systems, their "innovative" iPad-with-a-kickstand does not add productive, entertainment, or consumption value to my well-connected Apple-centric lifestyle.
Just the fact that this question can seriously be asked is a win for MS. If the price and battery life turn out to be reasonable this will be a huge winner and the first real ipad competitor. Far more innovative than anything running iOS has done in the last 2 or 3 years. Competition is good, it's Apple's serve now.
Microsoft were the first ones to do Tablet but they did not do it right way, I mean, they failed at adding a stylus based operation, And the iPad changed it all. And now Microsoft again is doing the tablet in a wrong way. What they are really doing is mirroring the PC onto the tablet and what they need to understand is that Tablet is a new device which should mirror the PC. And obviously people using iPads would never want to be PC guys again.
COMPLETELY disagree. More of a niche audience, but there are those of us that need a tablet form factor, but need more power and office-based apps than iPad has. For me, in the mental health/medical field, I need to be able to take notes on my tablet, and also be able to use my patient management software, my MS Office apps for reports, and so forth. They are not targeting the iPad/Apple fanatic audience. They are targeting those that want both. Like me. It is right in my wheelhouse, so to speak.
Actually they didn't lose me at any of the features like kick stand they lost me when they were blatant that they were going to fragment it with two totally incompatible hardware architectures and two incompatible versions of the operating system.
So you go with the Intel based system the 'Pro' then pay another fortune for the Office package or you go with the cheaper Arm processor model and have the windows designed for mobile devices and tailored for the tablet with a cut down version of Microsoft Office included and would have to deal without having Outlook which is the feature most people want.
For the buyer in a smaller company that does not have the luxury of having a mistake of purchasing the wrong tablet for some employees and then replacing them with the one more suited for your needs it could be a disaster.
Honestly, this fragmentation is worse than that of Android devices, at least those Android devices are reasonably compatible but Microsoft's two devices are not compatible when it comes to software they just operate the same way when you using them but with Pro you have to purchase the device and they pay for Office which is Microsoft's plan.
They are a software company, their revenue is from selling the software, These tablets, as they cannot be called 'tablet' since they are two totally different platforms and the hardware is two different hardware designs and unfortunately while Ballmer implied the cohesion of the software and hardware and said that the two devices were aimed at two different types of user, making a fragmentation of this type and removing the compatibility of app's will harm this device. It means that app's need to be written twice or the 'pro' model will have to have an emulator to allow the ARM based app's to run.
I'm still using an original iPad, and buying a new tablet of any kind is just not in the budget right now. That said, if the surface turns out to be price competitive, I will be sorely tempted. Better MS Office document editing is something I feel is lacking in the iPad, and that keyboard cover is brilliant!
Would i switch from an ipad to a Surface? Nope. I'm barely finding enough reasons to use an ipad but that retina display helps. I can't imagine wanting a low res Metro only 16:9 tablet with no direct support. I've not seen a Metro app that is worthwhile. I don't care about Office on a tablet.
The Surface Pro is more of the same we've seen. It's too heavy for a tablet. It'll be priced like an ultrabook or MBA. Honestly, it's not an ipad competitor. I'd rather have a laptop for that money.
Finally, MS is terrible at marketing. They want to repeat the xbox's success but seem ignorant of how it became successful. This RT ARM tablet needed some games to demo. It needed a cool name. It needs to appeal to consumers. Show how it works with xbox and any other parts of your ecosystem. MS is chasing Apple but looks clueless and that much was obvious during their rushed event.
That's still a silly HD resolution.
I don't know why people don't ask for 4K or 8K screens.
HD screens really suck a lot compared to that.
Why isn't there an option for "Hell No!"?!
I sure wouldn't "switch" but if the price is right (and it works well overall) I might get one to use in addition to my iPad.
I like tech! I also have been trying the W8 beta and it is intriguing. I'd like to see MS make some headway on this, if only to get beyond legacy Windows (which I have never been able to warm up to.)
Way, way, WAY too early to tell. Vaporware is always enticing, but until you can hold it, you can't be sold on it.
That said, Surface tablets have a glimmer of potential. For me, personally, I almost never find myself reaching for my iPad, except for Netflix while exercising. It usually loses out to my MBP (when I want to do something substantial) or my iPhone (because it is always with me). Perhaps a Surface tablet would plug that gap for me more neatly than an iPad. It might also find a home in vertical applications (think POS terminals, medical practices), if MS courts developers with the same aggressiveness they did in the Win vs Mac days.
Check back in a year, when Microsoft is closer to shipping.
I've owned every iPad and still can't do any serious work on it. Yea, I know there are ways to get things done with an iPad, but you can also dig a big hole with a spoon, but it's not the best way to do it. Surface might just be the answer.
When webOS went belly up and Sprint got the iPhone, I made the big switch to the Apple ecosystem and added the iMac and iPad 3. I'm VERY happy did and would never buy a Windows "tablet" etc. The selection of apps on the iPad is amazing and I'm really looking forward to more integration and syncing of all the devices with Mountain Lion and iOS6!
A reader above commented that the iPad doesn't work for his professional life as a psychologist. Well, I'm a psychologist who makes house calls and my iPad works great. Suffice to say, the variety of apps really helps me integrate the device into a wide variety of situations. I use several styluses for writing and drawing, and Apple keyboard occasionally.
I don't know how anyone can go back to a PC once they've gotten used to an iMac and a magic trackpad. Apple will only make all their products even better down the line.
Apple have dominate the tablet market and have pretty much won it just like they did with the MP3 market. People don't ask for tablets they ask for iPads and settle for a tablets often because of price not because of quality.
I am extremely happy with my iPad and am getting a Mac to enhance my computing experience, I believe this will become the normal attitude from consumers and business in the near future and Microsoft will begin its decline. I also see Linux picking up the leftovers after Apple takes its share.
This will mean historians well tell people about the first worldwide consumer operating system and how it failed to keep up in a changing world namely mobile operating systems.
Complaining that the kickstand and keyboard will drive people away is not smart. Really? If there isn't a need for them, then why do they exist? I think some people are forgetting all the iPad keyboard accessories and kickstands available out there.
Albeit, they may not be for everyone but you have to admit, making both the stand and keyboard integrate into the tablet and keep the small form factor is what portability is all about. Portability, OS integration and form factor are why the iPad exist!
The Surface is a viable addition to the market (notice I didn't say "iPad killer". I hate that everything new has to compare to it).
Judging from the comments, it seems name brand (and OS) are the reason why people are saying Surface is no good. People say the same about Apple, what makes you any different in this case? As mentioned all too well, pricing and battery life will help future decisions. To each his own.
you know as a microsoft fan i came in here thinking you would all be bashing on the surface and to my pleasent surprise while most of you say you arent switching your very classy in the way you say it and that makes me excited. to know that the surface isnt your flavor but you arent completely knocking it off is a pretty good sign aside from some apple cockgobblers most of you have kept your reasons for not getting one fairly legitimate thanks guys ! :D
No, they lost me at the kick stand. Really, how juvenile!. I have an iPad case which has got a kick stand and I use it all the time....cooking...watching TV...reading at my breakfast bar! I think whoever voted for this option needs to have a long hard look at themselves. It's this fanboy snobbery that real does my head in when it comes to Apple products! Bring on a successful windows tablet! The better the competition the better products for us customers,
Seems to me that there are a ton of unanswered questions - on purpose. Those questions have to do with the software which Mr. Softie is only willing to show in a limited basis given the GA for Win 8 is later this year. I wonder what the driver is to get so far out in front of this launch so that they could not tell a complete story? Anyway, they seem to have done a nice job on the hardware but for them to sell me is on how the ecosystem works. Until they do, Apple is still ahead by quite a bit.
The windows surface is intriguing, but I doubt it will be anything more for me. At this point I'm not considering buying either iPad or a surface. What will be interesting to see is how Microsoft will handle updates. I know Microsofts software update history all to well. Each update comes out at $80+. In the beginning iOS updates would cost $10-30 but now they are free, and bring killer new functionality with them. Will Microsoft be willing to allow mobile users update their devices with new functionality and not just security patches for free? And how will this translate to desktop users? Microsoft has to be competitive in software updates if they want this to be anything more then a hobby.
Re: "Because the Surface is like an iPad but is not an iPad, it might just appeal to people looking for exactly that, or for something in between an iPad and a MacBook Air (running Windows.)"
Surface is such a half-assed product. The keyboard-case screams "We had no idea what to do so we just threw all these features in." Either go all-multi-touch or go all-keyboard. Do one or the other well. Don't do both badly.
But even with such a half-baked keyboard, Surface is a death blow to the Ultrabook Initiative. Maybe the final nail in that particular coffin. Because it will drastically undercut any and all Ultrabooks in price. There's nowhere for the Ultrabook makers to go now. They can't compete against the MacBook Air or iPad. And now there's an actual Microsoft-branded Ultrabook-killer. Oh well, life in the big city and all.
Ever heard of ifile. It's a perfect file manager. Thru the camera connection kit just put a SD-Card, USB HDD or stick in it. And you can do everything with the files. Also mobileterminal allows you to do all terminal(Unix) tasks.
So please stop talking jibberish.
It will all come down to user needs, and the system(s) you already have. As laptops are getting closer to the power of the desktop, the tablets, are an extension of the laptop. If you have the latest laptop running windows, the new MS tablet makes sense. If you have a Mac, the iPad makes sense. May be in the future will the tablet replace everything, but until then, what works for you the best, and matches the prooducts you already have, makes the better choice.
One other thing that can be the decision changer, the app store. "There is an app for that" is so true. You can make the iPad, or Android device anything you need it to be. Enterprise to games. That is what makes these systems so enjoyable. Can Microsoft compete with the app stores of the other platforms? Just some thoughts.
This won't be a consumer hit. This will be an enterprise jolt to the iPad, however. The iPad will continue to roll on as the consumer darling, no doubt made better by some real competition... but honestly I see the surface being used in the legacy enterprises that are too stiff to have embraced consumerization or BYOD programs... you know the types, they love disabling the business and locking down "their" equipment. The Surface will make these IT dinosaurs all giddy.
Granted I think this is a good step forward for Microsoft, who has been a real dud as of late. Time will tell.
That they are going the way of Apple like everyone else is a real compliment to Job's and his legacy.
Bring on the competition. What I want out of the Surface is a better iPad!
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But the Surface crashed during live presentation. Why would anyone want that? Even if the hardware is good, come on...it's a Windows based OS. Blue Screens will happen. I talked with a Microsoft's gentleman during a presentation in Portugal, and I told him that Microsoft needs to re-write their kernel, or OS structure. He agreed with me. Yes he works for Microsoft. And he told me that. yes.


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|The most helpful favorable review
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1 of 1 people found the following review helpful:
By petercarden from USA on 2008-03-14 07:40:50Things I liked:sturdy, and use of cheek pad. well built
Things I would have changed:nothing
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Friday, November 15, 2013
The Stratford cross country teams competed in the Class AAAA state championships on Saturday at the Sandhills Research Center in Columbia.
The Knights finished 13th, while the Lady Knights came in 15th place.
Only the top 20 teams out of 52 Class AAAA schools qualified for the state meet so the Stratford programs still had a solid season.
The best overall finish by a Stratford runner was turned in by junior Alex Zimmer in the girls race. She placed 14th with a time of 19:07.46.
Junior Bethany Reeves was 30th with a time of 19:47.03.
The Lady Knights also counted times from senior Tiffany Hutson (21:27.38), eighth-grader Lauren Adams (21:43.29) and junior Zaria Dennis (22:56.31).
For the Stratford boys, senior Ryan Abdullah was the top finisher in 33rd place with a time of 16:52.69. Freshman Kyle Thomas was 69th at 17:11.71.
The Knights also counted times from seniors Austin Weaver (17:13.80), Morgan Woods (17:44.61) and Brett Alford (17:54.20).
Riverside won the girls title while Mauldin was the champion in the boys race.
The lone state championship team from the area was Academic Magnet in Class AA boys.
Wando's boys were second in Class AAAA, while Bishop England's girls were runner-up in Class AA.
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Kyle Lovern
Sports Editor
GOODY, Ky. – The Belfry Pirates played one of their better games of the season defeating perennial West Virginia baseball power 6-0 in the Jim Vaughn Smith Classic Thursday.
Sophomore pitcher Keaton Taylor hurled a complete game, two-hit shutout for Belfry.
The Pirates jumped out to an early 2-0 lead after the first inning.
Logan sophomore pitcher Cameron Sammons hit the first two batters he faced, Taylor and Eli Huddle.
Then base hits by Zack Francisco and Joey Duty scored Taylor and Huddle
Francisco led the Pirates at the plate with a double and to singles, Zac Fields had a pair of hits, Duty had two hits, Reed Williamson a single and Taylor a base hit.
Trent Dalton and Brent Vance had the two hits for the visiting Wildcats.
On Friday night, the Pirates took on the Hazard Bulldogs.
Belfry scored the first run of the game, but ended up losing 3-1. This is the third game the Pirates have lost to the Bulldogs this season.
In the nightcap of the JVSC, Pikeville outslugged MaGoffin County 11-9.
Belfry is scheduled to host Sheldon Clark Monday and travel to Logan, W.Va. on Wednesday, May 1.


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A home health care company which has filed an application to provide service here is facing some uncertainty about its future in Aiken County after an announcement from the S.C. Department of Health and Environmental Control that it would suspend its review of such applications.
Department of Health and Environmental Control Director Catherine Templeton is telling South Carolina health care providers that her agency will no longer run the Certificate of Need program and won't look at any projects awaiting a review, according to a letter from the agency obtained on Friday by The Associated Press.
CareSouth HHA Holdings of South Carolina LLC filed a Certificate of Need application with the department for the establishment of a home health agency. The project cost is approximately $77,000.
Now, the application is apparently in limbo.
"We are really uncertain as to what effect this will have on us. We are sort of in limbo right now having filed an application and it being deemed complete," said Rick Griffin, president and chief executive officer, CareSouth Health System Inc.
This week, Gov. Nikki Haley vetoed $1.7 million to run the program from the state's spending plan. The House refused to override the veto, so Templeton said there is no way to run the program without money, according to the Associated Press. About three dozen projects worth about $90 million are awaiting Department of Health and Environmental Control approval.
"Many of us questioned the need for Certificates of Need," said Rep. Bill Taylor. "Why is the government again in this business, to pick winners and losers? If there is a demand for more health care facilities, why not let them come? They would still be subject to regulation. I say, 'Y'all come in.' I am in favor of the elimination of Certificates of Need."
The Associated Press reports the decision won't affect the department's licensing program.
Essentially, the S.C. Department of Health and Environmental Control's application review covered the request's alignment with the needs of residents – analyzing demographic information, population growth and current use of medical services – a determination of whether the request would duplicate services and the project cost and client charges.
This approach has resulted in the location of a nursing home in every county in South Carolina, the availability of home health services in every county in the state, and the provision or expansion of renal dialysis services to most rural counties, according to the department's website.
Haley Hughes is the news editor for the Aiken Standard. She joined the newspaper in 2007 and covered Aiken County government until her promotion in 2013. Hughes, a graduate of Middle Tennessee State University, hails from Knoxville, Tenn.
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WORLD at WAR, Official 2012 Thread (TO BE CONTINUED) Israel, Iran, Syria, Hezbollah, PA, Egypt, Libya, Pakistan, North Korea, Russia, China, U.S.
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[quote:Anonymous Coward 29134036:MV8xOTc0NTc2XzM0ODkxNjczXzhBNEE3N0E2] [quote:DarkKnightNomeD:MV8xOTc0NTc2XzM0ODg2OTEzXzc3RkI4NjE0] Breaking News: Obama Sends Thousands of U.S Troops to Syria Uploaded by the youtube user djgabrielpresents [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAT9hb6GReo[/youtube] [/quote] She's so full of shit... yeah we're placing all that on the Syrian border but don't worry, we won't do anything... LOL yeah riiiiiiiiight! [/quote]
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In continuation of a series of years of World at War,THIS IS A SPECIAL EDITION BASED UPON URGENT PENDING MATTERS, the following was the 2011 thread.
Thread: The World at War, Official 2011 war thread for North Korea, Iran, Israel, China, U.S.
The following is the 2012 Thread up to the end of August.
Thread: World at War, Official 2012 Thread for Israel, Iran, Syria, Hezbollah, PA, Turkey, Egypt, Pakistan, India, North Korea, Russia, China, U.S.
Now we enter into the last four months of 2012. Follow the past year to see where we are at. I try not to give much BS and only ask that if you do not care for the topic or format, do not visit this thread.
Trolls, you will be deleted or blocked, you can start your own thread if you wish, just leave us alone!
As stated at the start of 2012, 2012 will be the start of much chaos economically as well as militarily. We have gone through much doom and gloom already. But now, it is of urgency that we wait to see whether Iran goes nuclear, whether Israel takes it upon herself to attack Iran, whether the US leaves Israel to fend for herself, what the results of the US election have in store for Israel, the Mideast and the US, and what will happen in Syria.
Israel must face the challenge of a nuclear Iran with or without the U.S. to protect her. Further, Syria feels threatened as did Libya where Assad may lash out at Israel. The Hezbollah may too jump on in. Lebanon and Jordan may face their own arab spring. Egypt may tear up the Israeli peace treaty any day. Turkey looks as Israel with jealousy for Israel's gas and oil reserves in the Med.
China and Russia wish to impose retrictions on America's once global dominance where there will be more challenges to U.S. interests leading to possible military blows.
North Korea's tender young leader has no fear in challenging U.S. might and may cause further military adventurism.
Pakistan has nukes that could be stolen and/or Pakistan and the U.S. may enter into more vis a vis hotile interactions.
Iran is threatening to challenge the west and is due for a nuclear detonation soon. What the U.S./and or Israel do to stop Iran is worthy of watching every day.
Iraq is now under Iran's thumb and likely will further become a feifdom of Iran.
Afghanistan is soon to force the withdrawal of U.S. forces.
India and Pakistan may soon come to blows.
Will the global economic crisis resolve itself, will the crisis collapse the world economy, or whom may come forward with some new currency?
Further, spiritually, 2012 looks to be a year of turmoil.
There are seers warning of some type of sign from God this coming year. The Mayan's seemed to predict something. The Pope may flee Rome? A comet in the sky? Great earthquakes? Signs in the sky?
Look further at bug-outs or going grey, everyone should be prepping by now in case things really do go bad. I am just saying.
So, if you wish to discuss the above mentioned or wish to hear it from others, feel free to drop in and leave some good 5 stars if you find this inforomation either entertaining or productive.
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As the chair of the Washington West Supervisory Union executive committee, I'd like to offer some thoughts on the supervisory union (SU) budget that we passed last week. As was reported in The Valley Reporter, there was a vigorous and respectful debate about the proposed increase of 9.9 percent in the central office budget. Questions were raised about a disproportionate rise in central office spending compared to local schools; about a pay raise for our superintendent, 8 percent this year; and about the general message this budget might send to our community in a time of economic hardship.
Despite these legitimate questions, the executive committee—made up of community members from every town in the supervisory union and from the Harwood board—overwhelmingly supported this budget, and I'd like to explain why.
First of all, our central office has historically been quite lean. In 2010, the most recent year that comparable data is available, central office costs represented only 2.8 percent of the overall expenditures in our supervisory union. This is lower than every adjacent SU, including: Washington Central (4.8 percent); Washington Northeast (4.4 percent); Washington South (4.8 percent); Lamoille South (3.7 percent); and Lamoille North (6.4 percent). Barre was the only nearby SU that spent a lower percentage than us, at 2.1 percent. We are not leaping ahead disproportionately; we're catching up.
Of course there is no need to catch up if things are going along just fine, but they haven't been. Our schools generally are experiencing declining enrollment, with increasing costs; we've had instability in school leadership, with several principal transitions; a constantly shifting state and federal regulatory landscape; and increasing special education costs and needs, just to name a few. The simple truth is that in this very complex environment we need vigorous, consistent leadership at the central office to help us. They provide the data and perspective we need to make careful, considered decisions about how to maintain our outstanding educational quality and even improve it under diminished circumstances. But they cannot do it on the cheap. The contention that they can do more with less simply does not ring true for those of us in the community who have been intimately involved with their work.
Regarding the superintendent's salary, we faced a similar situation. The pay our SU offered was significantly lower than adjacent districts. Two years into a tenure marked by overwhelmingly positive performance reviews, we began to worry that we might not be able to retain our superintendent, yet again. After having five superintendents in the past 12 years and noting the significant opportunity and financial costs in the endless transitions and searches, we felt that it was absolutely imperative to craft a contract that brought us into line with other districts in the hopes of maintaining steady, consistent leadership. We feel our children need and deserve no less, and that Brigid Scheffert is providing us with extraordinary value—as is the rest of the central office staff.
Much more could be said: that Harwood's business functions are now managed through the SU, contributing to an increase several years ago in central office costs that decreased costs at Harwood for all district taxpayers; the way our central office staff has assisted local districts in crafting level or near-level funded budgets over the past several years, one proof among many of their value; a decade of increasing state and federal mandates that require the ever-increasing attention and time of our staff; exponentially increasing technology needs over the past decade; multiple principal searches; ongoing personnel issues; the list goes on.
Lastly, it is important to note that the central office budget is a tiny percentage of our overall SU spending: roughly $1 million out of $40 million. Although the percentage increase this year is high, the absolute increase is a small fraction of our overall educational spending. As one of our board members stated at the meeting last week, the central office budget is not what is driving up educational costs and property taxes: it is per-pupil spending. And our feeling at the executive committee is that the central office—as constructed in this current budget—has the potential to provide us with the data and the tools to make informed decisions about this far larger issue of per-pupil spending. Without their help we will be making decisions largely in the dark and to the detriment of our students and taxpayers. This is an investment we need to make in the long-term health, accountability and viability of our school system, and I urge the Washington West community to support it.
Smith lives in Duxbury.


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Tuscarawas News Detail
Why is Change So Hard?Posted Feb. 4, 2013
That will be the topic for a special presentation on Friday, Feb. 15, at Kent State University. Cynthia Ackrill, M.D., noted speaker and president of Wellspark, will speak at 10 a.m. in the Kent Student Center Kiva on "Habit Shifting - Why It Is So Hard to Make a Change, and How to Make it Easier; The Neuroscience of Behavior Change." The session is open to faculty, staff and students.
Change is always difficult, whether it is your New Year's resolution, losing weight or getting that job promotion. Ackrill explores the role of the brain (neurological) and body (physiological) in changing habits, and what you can do to help produce the results you want.
Today's problems demand extraordinary leadership. And such leadership requires developing the best of human potential — physically, mentally, emotionally and spiritually. Ackrill's mission is to drive innovative change by applying science and wisdom to help extraordinary leaders enhance their skills.
Ackrill is a graduate of Duke University and the University of Maryland School of Medicine, a Fellow and Board Member of the American Institute of Stress, a charter member of HeartMath, and a former board member of the International Society of Neurofeedback and Research. She is also a certified Wellcoach® and Wellness Inventory coach, and has completed training in advanced executive coaching, positive psychology and intrinsic motivation.
Registration to attend the program is requested and can be done online. For those unable to attend, the session will be streamed live. You can access the live stream link here on Feb. 15, about 15 minutes prior to the start of the program.
The program is sponsored by Kent State OneWellU wellness program and the College of Nursing.


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Review of The Week
We will keep you in bull markets as long as possible and out of bear markets as long as necessary.
The market environment constantly changes, providing very different opportunities in each of its cycles. Some say that trying to time the market does not work, but they cannot be further from the truth. There are numerous studies that prove that using simple moving averages and market breadth readings, could substantially improve long-term performance and reduce drawdowns. Our vast experience confirms the same notion.
The purpose of this segment is to highlight the notable market developments of the week and to provide a guidance toward the level of risk appetite that is suitable for the current environment. With our weekly review our members will get everything they need to know about the ST50 list and the Model portfolio. The goal is to help members be aggressive in upward trending markets and protect capital in bad markets.


text: Our first clutch of eggs contains 47 (That's right FORTY - SEVEN) eggs. I was hoping to get the webcam up in time but I missed out on the first twenty hatch. Twenty - seven more to go (We hope). And about 30 days later the second clutch of 28 should be ready to pop !


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When asked what he remembers the most about his time with the Wolves, Kevin Dahl's answer was simple and to the point.
"I remember winning a lot," he said.
And with an organization like the Wolves, whose goal every year is to win a championship, that makes perfect sense. Dahl played in 144 regular-season games for Chicago from 1997 to 2001 and was a member of the 1998 and 2000 Turner Cup championship teams.
"They were both special in their own ways," he said of the two title runs. "But the first one definitely meant more since it was both my first championship and the organization's."
Following the team's second Turner Cup championship in three years, Wolves Head Coach John Anderson named Dahl team captain for the 2000-01 season.
"The management and coaches felt my leadership abilities were strong enough to lead the team towards a championship," Dahl said. "It was nice being recognized as a leader for such a great organization."
Other than "all the winning," Dahl remembers the team camaraderie he experienced as a member of the Wolves, both with the players and the staff involved with the team, as one of the best environments he has played in. The friendships he built with his teammates during his four seasons – and three Turner Cup Finals appearances – have stayed with him to this day.
"My wife and I still go on trips with people from those championship teams," said Dahl. "It is getting harder the further removed from the game we all get, but about five us went on a trip with our wives last fall, [including former teammates Jamie Baker, Tom Tilley and Paul Koch]. We try to do something every year and get together with the Mylymok's and Marinucci's for trips, too. We have gone on a cruise and gone to Napa Valley in the past."
Even though Dahl is six years removed from his playing days, he hasn't strayed too far from the game. Currently living in Cleveland, he runs a company that recruits former athletes to place them into jobs in the corporate world. He also coached his two daughters' (ages 10 and 12) hockey teams until they stopped playing.
Although he has played all over the world, from Calgary to Chicago, to Germany and around the world for the Canadian national team (which includes winning the silver medal at the 1992 Winter Olympic Games), the Windy City and the Wolves remain near the top of his list.
"I think Chicago was my favorite place to play outside of the majors," he said. "Plus, I had both of my kids during my time there, so that made it special. I think the Chicago Wolves fans are very loyal. They were always fun and we did a lot of things with them. They supported us real well.
"The organization was top notch, too. My favorite part about being there was they way that we were treated and the way my whole family was treated," Dahl concluded.
When asked what he remembers the most about his time with the Wolves, Kevin Dahl's answer was simple and to the point.


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with Shokuchi Deirdre Carrigan and Shundo David Haye
July 20, 2013
1 - 4 pm
Located at ZaZEN, 2219 Filbert Street, San Francisco view map
In this workshop we will practice presence with the wondrous workings of mind and body.
We will begin the afternoon with Yoga Asana, cultivating awareness of the subtle energies of the body as we practice yoga postures. From this peaceful process, a sense of stillness of mind and body will begin to arise, and this stillness will deepen and expand during a period of Zazen (seated meditation), as we watch the subtle activity of the mind with equanimity and compassion. By the end of the afternoon, we will feel grounded, refreshed and renewed.
Workshop sliding scale
Price includes one free week of yoga at Zazen.
Supporter contribution $40
Member contribution $35
Sustaining contribution $30
To Register visit zazensf or call 415.806.6899
A San Francisco Zen Center program offered at ZaZEN Filbert Street
Shokuchi Deirdre Carrigan has been teaching Yoga in the San Francisco Bay Area since 1988 and was a professional dancer for 27 years. Shokuchi received priest ordination from Tenshin Reb Anderson in March 2010 and currently serves as the Conference Coordinator at Green Gulch Farm.
Shundo David Haye came from England to Zen Center to begin his practice in 2000. Since then he has lived at City Center and Tassajara, following the traditional monastic training path. He has served as work leader at Tassajara, tenzo (head of the kitchen) and ino (head of the meditation hall) at City Center, and currently holds the position of director at City Center. He was ordained as a priest in 2009 by Ryushin Paul Haller, and was head monk at Tassajara last fall. He helps to run the Young Urban Zen group in the city, maintained the Ino's Blog for more than two years, and is deeply interested in spreading the dharma widely for the benefit of all beings.


text:
"How do I prevent the asset pipeline from concatenating all my javascript when running Jasmine tests?"
Max has an almost-there solution that he sent out to the mailing list:
module Jasmine
class Config
def src_files
Rails.application.assets["application"].dependencies.map do |asset|
"assets/" + asset.logical_path
"I'm looking for a client-side JS syntax highlighter!"
- Don't use: pygments — it's what GitHub uses and is server-side only.
- Consider using: code mirror
That slowness when you start Terminal? It's parsing through all your system logs to figure out when the last log-in occured. Speed up your terminal with
touch ~/.hushlogin
http != https — who knew? Turns out sending an AJAX post from a non-secured origin (http) to a secured end point (https) smacks agains the same-origin policy. Solutions?
- Bring up and iframe pointed to https and AJAX post from there.
- Or (better): Enforce SSL on the originating page.


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Newtown shooting prompts safety evaluations, local counseling help
With the nation still reeling from the massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School last week in Newtown, Conn., local schools are taking varied approaches in dealing with their own students this week.
Representatives for Moore County Schools couldn't be reached, but public schools in Lee, Chatham and Harnett counties worked over the weekend to prepare counselors and other support staff in case individual students, or even entire schools, asked for help. However, unless someone asks, it will be business as usual.
"Each school will kind of do what they think is best for their individual site," said Johnnye Waller, the Lee County Schools' director of student resources, giving a sentiment that was common to public and private school administrators around the area. "We just wanted to make sure we had the resources in place in case anyone requested it."
The districts also sent out messages to stakeholders in various ways. Lee, Moore and Chatham schools all posted messages on their websites expressing grief for the Newtown victims, promising local support for anyone who needs it and providing information or links to websites with advice for parents and teachers in the wake of such a tragedy.
Harnett County distributed a letter to staff Friday, containing information about dealing with questions about the tragedy, and also sent parents a separate letter Monday afternoon.
Stephen Coble, school administrator for Lee Christian School, said his school has worked closely with the Lee County Sheriff's Office to develop a crisis management plan in case of an emergency. The school won't address students directly about the shootings, he said, but the matter has been raised frequently in prayers, and counselors are prepared to work with individuals.
Lee Christian doesn't have any guards or resource officers on campus, but Coble said many parents are in the military or law enforcement and frequently stop by the school, whether it's to pick up and drop off their kids, eat lunch or visit for some other reason — which he said does give some added, albeit unreliable, security throughout the day.
Grace Christian School was the exception to the rule Monday, gathering its students for chapel and speaking to the whole group about the shootings.
"These kind of things happen because (perpetrators) have a lack of hope, and obviously we offer hope in the form of Jesus Christ," Headmaster Bill Carver said he told the assembly. "And the most important thing is reaching out to the community and instilling that belief and that hope."
Like Lee Christian, Grace doesn't have a security officer and would rely on the Sheriff's Office in emergencies. He said this shooting has made administrators take a serious look at how accessible the whole complex — containing the church, school and other buildings — is throughout the day.
Each public school district has student resource officers stationed at middle school and high school campuses. Administrators said that while those officers can get to an elementary school quickly in the event of a crisis and also check in sporadically, there are no officers stationed specifically at those schools. Each district did announce plans to reexamine its security over the coming days.


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Unjust Discrimination? (UPDATED)
Eduardo Moisés Peñalver April 24, 2013 - 11:17am
The obituary for the mother of a (Methodist) female gym teacher at a Catholic high school in Ohio mentions said gym teacher's female partner. Gym teacher is promptly fired. Maybe Cardinal Dolan should get Bishop Campbell on the horn and explain to him that Catholics are supposed to "try our darndest to make sure we're not anti-anybody." (HT Balloon Juice)UPDATE: Here's a link to the obit. It's just sad. And, to be honest, I'm sick of this stuff happening in my name as a Catholic. At some point, doesn't toothless dissent become complicity?UPDATE II: Here's a very moving interview with the teacher. I wonder what impact this firing will have on the young students' relationship with their church. I don't even know this woman and it's testing mine.
And here's Bryan Fischer, defending the termination. My mom has always said you can tell a lot about someone by who their friends are.
Commenting Guidelines
"Write to the bishop, folks and maybe your own bishop as well denouncing this."OK. I'm sure that Salvatore Cordileone will be VERY open to my thoughts on this.Ed and Lisa ... please join me in this little exercise of self abuse, OK?
Discipleship indeed! Disciples will try to practice and teach what the Master taught. But Christ said nary a blessed word about most of the matters that are both roiling and defining the Church today. Incarnation, Resurrection, the Great Commandments, well yes, we'll give them a few days every year, but the things we need to talk about every day are condoms, pills, and who's doing what with whom. Christ unaccountably failed to stress or even to mention them, so it's good that various Patres and Doctores and other Homines Otiosi saw fit to extend his remarks and fill up his deficiencies.After all, loving one's neighbor isn't much of an agenda for a serious religion. It's just too easy.
"at the outset of their employment agree that they will abide by the rules, regulations, and policies of the Catholic Diocese,"I know these issues have already been raised rhetorically, but now that we have this bit of personnel policy I'd actually like to know if they interpret it to mean they would not hire a divorced Methodist, and would have to fire a person discovered to be using birth control.
Once were all dead and they are the church, why would they not change the way it treats gays?Because its not how we think gays should behave, but rather how Christ has said they should behave. Its not a popularity contest folks. Rather, its best summarized by Chesterton: The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting. It has been found difficult; and left untried.
Circa 1990 an Irish friend of mine had a coworker who had married at 19 and whose wife had left him for another man 2 years later. Since there was no divorce in Ireland at the time, the abandoned husband eventaully cohabited (sans marriage) with another woman. One day the priest of the parish where the job site was located showed up at the job site and demanded that the owner fire the "sinful" guy who was cohabiting outside marriage- on pain of the business owner being excommunicated. (The guy was fired.) That kind of thing wouldn't have happened in this country in 1990, but it might have in 1950.My point is, I really want the American bishops to define up front the limits of this kind of economic punishment for what they regard as sexual sins. I do get it that a teacher in a Catholic school is quasi-ministerial (although I disagree with the bishops about committed gay relationships) I want an assurance that this approach will not be extended to cafeteria workers in Catholic universities, nurses in Catholic hospitals, employees of a businesses owned by Catholics, etc. It's sad that I don't truest my bishops more than that, but unfortunately I don't.
Jim McCrea, I live with it because I don't consider myself to be Catholic anymore. So yeah. For those willing to wait, good luck to all. Sincerely, I mean that, but I'm too tired to keep at it.
Im too tired to keep at it.My impression is that we have little choice but to keep discussing issues until we are in better communion. We have little choice, because I believe that if we don't do it now, we'll still have to do it after we die. One way or another, it has to happen, so that we "may all be one" It's not so much about being Roman Catholic as about unity. Maybe we're not going at it the right way, and that might be why progress is so imperceptibly slow, and maybe we ought to change the way in which we do it; but I don't see how we can give up on ironing out our differences. It's like leveling mountains, lifting valleys, and making straight the crooked paths - not easy, but necessary for seeing the Lord.At least that's my motivation.
"One day the priest of the parish where the job site was located showed up at the job site and demanded that the owner fire the sinful guy who was cohabiting outside marriage- on pain of the business owner being excommunicated. (The guy was fired.) That kind of thing wouldnt have happened in this country in 1990, but it might have in 1950."Anne --I can't imagine that happening here at any time. I don't remember even hearing of threats of excommunication except in the case of Leander Perez and his racist friends. Of course, New Orleans is known as "Sin City", and it's true it tolerates sins of the flesh quite easily. But maybe that's the wise way.
Claire: I'm 72. How much longer do you think people like me, Barbara, Joe Jaglowicz, and countless others should hang in there on the object side of the conversation while the rest of you discuss and discuss and discuss ... I think you get my point.I have been at the point for quite some time now that I freely admit to being a protestant catholic. I no longer wish to be a Roman Catholic nor an American Catholic. My only connection to denominational Catholicism is via my parish which is socially progressive, liturgically moderate, loving, accepting, friendly and peopled primarily (but far from exclusively) by LGBT folks .... www.mhr org. If it goes away (we are in the Archdiocese of San Francisco and have been "blessed" by the appointment of Salvatore J. Cordileone as archbishop, so who knows what will happen to us) then I'll just shake the last few specks of catholic dust from my sandals and look somewhere else.I learned many years ago that when one formally leaves Roman Catholicism one does not die and go to hell ... surprising as that might seem to a few posters on this website. Au contraire, in many cases you discover Christianity for the first time, unbridled by authoritarian, clericalist, legalistic people and rules.
Jim, I do wish people stayed within the Roman Catholic church, but that was not my focus in this thread. Forget the pre-death denominations during our lives on earth. We're all baptized, post-death we'll all hopefully end up together in Christ. I don't think that can happen until we're united, so we've got to keep working on unity. We've got to keep talking. Giving up is not an option, it seems to me. I'm not thinking about denominations but about Christian unity at the level of individuals, I guess with a more eschatological perspective. I note that 72 is four years younger than pope Francis. Maybe you still have the most important part of your life ahead of you!
Anne --I didn't mean that nobody was fired for sexual misbehavior here, I just meant that the bishops didn't threaten excommunication over it, at least I've never heard of such thing. I knew an adulterous pair at one big corporation who got into trouble but weren't fired. And in the old days here girls who got pregnant were either forced to marry or were whisked away to some other city (so said) where they'd have the child then give it up for adoption. (Isn't it odd how Americans, who are generally so free-wheeling about extramarital sex, are still very, very much against adultery, or so I've read.)Glad you don't have your same archbishop. I pray your new one is more humane, or should I say human. IHopefully Pope Francis will do a better job of picking bishops. He seems to be a good judge of people, though I don't know how much reliable information he gets about proposed bishops. I posted on another thread the report that Francis has decided to stop appointing bishops in Scotland until the whole O'Brien scandal has been thoroughly investigated. Looks like he means to really clean house. The question is, can he be fooled by those around him -- and will he truly listen to others.
"Were all baptized, post-death well all hopefully end up together in Christ. I dont think that can happen until were united." Are you saying that "heavenly unity" is dependent on "earthly unity"? Why? Your reasoning doesn't seem logical to me.
This situation has stayed with me over the weekend. These words from yesterday's Gospel really struck me: "This is how all will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another. In my view, it is more than appropriate to think of a Catholic school as a community of disciples. By all accounts, this teacher was a member of that community - it seems that she believed that she was, and so did the other members. I expect this is why she has said that she'd like to have her old job back, so that she can continue to belong to that community of disciples.I think it is in love that students and others who are members of that community are rising up to defend her - are circulating the petition. They are loving one another.I also think it is possible for a member of a community of disciples to do something that is so contrary to what the community believes that she must be removed from the community, unless she mends her ways; and that it is for the leaders of the community to make that determination.But the leaders must lead in love. And love seems absent in how she has been treated by the community leaders. She was not treated as a beloved member of the community. According to the accounts presented here, she has been treated very harshly - as one who is despised. And that is contrary to this past Sunday's Gospel imperative.Is it possible for the community's leaders to balance both requirements: to discipline erring members, while continuing to treat them with love? I believe it is. Here is one way that could transpire in this case:* For the investigation and judgment, there should be due process that respects her rights and dignity as a member of the community of disciples. * If it is found that she has transgressed, then she should be given some time to mend her ways, and offered some spiritual guidance. Asking someone to change the nature of a relationship with a presumably-intimate partner, to change her place or mode of living - that is asking much. And that doesn't even take into account the grief that she just be experiencing from the loss of her mother. I think most of us would need some time to come to grips with these things. The school could be generous in giving her time - say, until the beginning of the next academic year. The school could place her on paid administrative leave until then, to give her time and space to process its demands.* If she decides not to work at the school according to the requirements of the community of disciples, then the school could thank her graciously for her service, and let her know that the door is always open, should she rethink her situation.The school doesn't have the luxury of infinite squishiness in how it treats her. Whatever it does in this case will be a precedent for all sorts of other employment-related disputes that may arise in the future with other employees. In prudence, it can't be notably more lenient in this case than in other cases. But within these limits, it must act in love. And as I say, I don't think it did.Way up at the top of the thread, someone said something along the lines of, "Is this the new evangelization?!" That person has it exactly right. The church tells the world about its discipleship in how it publicly treats the least of these. The church authorities seem to have badly missed the mark in this instance.
Barbara, I imagine that heavenly unity in Christ will be about as intimate as anything I have ever known. But if you are that close to Christ, and I am that close to Christ, then (by the triangular inequality in a metric space, for a Math analogy!...) you and I also have to be intimately close to one another. He gathers us all to him: therefore we also become closer and closer to one another. So, when there are other Christians who say or do certain things that cause me to want to keep them at arms' length, by rejecting them I am also blocking the possibility of fusion with Christ. He wants to be with all of us, and he wants to draw us all to him. There is no choice: loving him requires me to love all. To be with him I have to share his attitude. For a physics analogy, think of particles being attracted to a powerful magnet: if the particles repulse one another, their mutual repulsion prevents them from being together on the magnet, and they end up some distance away from the center.As to whether it happens on earth or in heaven, I'm not sure I make much of a difference between the two. Whatever work is not done on earth to be united by love will remain to be done after we die, somehow. (I'm guessing that that's what purgatory would be for.)I have heard many prayers at Mass, read many Pauline texts, and sung many 1970s hymns based on those texts, that seem to me to echo similar sentiments. But I have not heard that precise thought before, so as you wonder it could be kooky.
Claire - those are some beautiful reflections, and I think you are right on about how Jesus brings us closer together by bringing us closer to him.As for heaven and earth: God's kingdom is at hand in the person of Jesus. Jesus was feared, hated and reviled by the rulers of earthly kingdoms because he has announced a rival kingdom, the kingdom of heaven, in their midst.
It seems to me that the basic moral question here is: should sinners be ostracized?(I sure hope not. Not in every case, anyway.)
Should sinners be ostracized?Whatever happened to the idea that the church is a hospital for the sick, not a club for saints?Caveat: I do not consider Carla Hale to be either sick nor a sinner.Is anyone saying that if someone who is allegedly sick does not get well in the manner that you think appropriate, than that person should be kicked out of the club?If some try this one .... 2 Thess 3:14-15 ... I will respond with Mt 18:21-23.(Having spent many years in a nondenominatioal church has its scriptural quote gotchas!)
I was always taught that we are *all* part of the body of Christ, that is how I remain in the church even though many well-meaning people would probably say I should not stay. Be known and seek to know others. Keep my heart and mind open to different viewpoints that challenge me and prayerfully search my conscience and ask guidance from God.I see a real difference between a requirement to *respect* the teaching authority of the magisterium and a requirement to *agree* with all teaching of the magisterium. For me, the requirement to respect the teaching authority of the magisterium means I should not attempt to represent as Catholic teaching anything that is in fact not Catholic teaching, and if I am going to express disagreement, do so only after serious reflection.
Ann - I don't think sinners should be ostracized. Jesus made rather a point of dining with them.
"Should sinners be ostracized?"Whatever happened to the idea that the church is a hospital for the sick, not a club for saints?"Caveat: I do not consider Carla Hale to be either sick nor a sinner."This is the point I was trying to make above, and it is much larger than Carla Hale, which makes the treatment of her doubly infuriating. A very large number, I might even say the vast majority, really don't think of sexual activity as sinful at all outside of a few specific classes of conduct: non-consensual, involving minors, duplicitous relationships (e.g., not telling one partner about another, or witholding health information). And even if they pay lip service to traditional norms, they aren't by and large living them. I might even be so bold as to call this the "new normative culture" as it comes to sexual activity. And that's not even getting into the issue of use of contraception. And yet, when it comes to punishing people committing "traditional" sexual sins, who is called out? What if Carla Hale's partner's name in that parenthetical had been "Julian"? Is there anyone here who thinks there would there have been an inquiry into whether they were married, or divorced and then remarried? Ignoring an ocean of heterosexual deviance (according to church teaching), is simply the neon backlighting to going after that one drop of homosexual inclination. It's not just that the action was unkind, ill-considered and lacking in charity, but it lacks moral credibility.
This weekend parishioners in the Dioceses of Columbus will be asked to complete pledge cards for the Bishop's Annual Appeal. Excellent timing and an opportunity for the faithful to make a statement!
Claire:The members of my parish have for years refused to contributed to the Archdiocese of SF's AAA to the point that we were in arrears by almost $400,000. This was done in protest of the lead that the California Council of Bishops had taken over the years on initiatives that we viewed to be anti-LGBT.We finally reached a compromise: (1) wipe out all back debt, and (2) allow us to choose to whom our annual amount would be given. We chose local Catholic schools and Catholic Charities.The message was received by the Archdiocese loud and clear: don't assume that people will roll over and play dead. We didn't and still don't.
I think the best catholics are protestant catholics and the best christians are buddhist christians. I also think we should never forget that all the categories of the New Testament are Jewish categories. Archbishops obsessing about sexual acts are not what christianity is about.
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About the Author
Eduardo Moisés Peñalver is the Allan R. Tessler Dean of the Cornell Law School. He is the author of numerous books and articles on the subjects of property and land use law.


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Since the 1960's, the California Geological Survey (CGS) has produced numerous maps that show landslide features and delineate potential slope-stability problem areas. Preparation of these maps has been episodic, often driven by landslide disasters and subsequent legislative mandates. Many CGS landslide maps and related products have been produced for local or state agencies in response to their specific needs.
Please see our Landslide Map Index to find the landslide map that covers your area of interest. Refer to the explanation on that map and descriptions of the types of landslides and types of landslide maps for details on how landslides are mapped and described.
CGS has prepared a statewide map of landslide susceptibility based on mapped landslides, variations in rock strength and slope. That map has been published as CGS Map Sheet 58.
In the 1970's, CGS prepared a series of "Geology for Planning" and "Environmental Geologic Analysis" reports and maps for local agencies in urbanizing areas. These products were designed to assist local agencies in evaluating hazards and developing policies that consider landslide hazards as residential development spread into landslide-prone terrain.
Following the 1982 El Nino storms in the San Francisco Bay area, the Landslide Hazard Mapping Act mandated new maps to show landslides and landslide hazards. Landslide Hazard Identification Maps were prepared by CGS for use by local government planners from 1986 to 1995. A set of three to four maps was prepared for each map study area, usually encompassing a USGS 7.5-minute topographic quadrangle map. The set of maps typically consisted of a geologic map, a landslide inventory map - showing the location and distribution of existing landslides – and one or two landslide relative susceptibility maps.
Also beginning in the early 1980's, concerns about the long-term ecologic impacts of timber harvesting lead to the mapping of landslide features in forested lands. Maps developed under this program include landslide inventory maps, and depict other geomorphic features (e.g. debris-slide slopes and inner gorges) where shallow landsliding is a dominant mode of mass wasting.
Although the Geology for Planning, Environmental Geologic Analysis, and Landslide Hazard Identification programs are no longer in existence, their products are generally still available as paper prints. Work is in progress to convert these reports and maps into high-quality digital versions. Currently active landslide mapping programs at CGS, and their respective products are described in more detail below.
The Forest and Watershed Geology Program provides maps and information on landslides, erosion, and sedimentation to help guide land-use decisions in California's forested lands, and help preserve water quality and fish habitat.
The Seismic Hazards Zonation Program maps existing landslides and delineates landslide zones of required investigation. The zone maps, which also identify liquefaction hazards, identify areas where a site-specific study must be completed before a building permit is approved. Landslide Inventory Maps prepared for Seismic Hazard Zonation are now available as part of a new CGS map publication series, the Landslide Inventory Map Series
CGS has prepared a series of maps and reports for the California Department of Transportation (Caltrans) in the Caltrans Highway Corridor Mapping project that evaluate the severity of landslide hazards along highway corridors through mountainous and potentially unstable terrain.
CGS regularly provides technical input and advice to the California Emergency Management Agency (CalEMA) during and immediately following major landsliding events, and immediately following major wildfires in anticipation of post-fire debris flows. CGS provides brief reports on individual emergency response tasks to CalEMA and local emergency response agencies to assist them in evaluating ongoing hazards and planning for recovery. Post-event reports and maps documenting landslide occurrences have been summarized as Open-File Reports, articles in California Geology magazine, and on CGS's web pages.
The California Geological Survey classifies landslides with a two-part designation based on Varnes (1978) and Cruden and Varnes (1996). The designation captures both the type of material that failed and the type of movement that the failed material exhibited.
Material types are broadly categorized as either rock or soil, or a combination of the two for complex movements. Rock refers to hard or firm bedrock that was intact and in place prior to slope movement. Soil, either residual or transported material, is used in the engineering sense to mean unconsolidated particles or poorly cemented rock or aggregates. Soil is distinguished further on the basis of texture as debris (coarse fragments) or earth (fine fragments). The distinction between rock and soil, and the further distinction between debris and earth is most often based on interpretation of geomorphic characteristics within landslide deposits, but can also be inferred from geologic characteristics of the parent material described on maps or observed in the field.
Landslide movements are interpreted from the geomorphic expression of the landslide deposit and source area, and are categorized as falls, topples, spreads, slides, or flows. Falls are masses of soil or rock that dislodge from steep slopes and free-fall, bounce, or roll downslope. Topples move by the forward pivoting of a mass around an axis below the displaced mass. Lateral spreads, commonly induced by liquefaction of material in an earthquake, move by horizontal extension and shear or tensile fractures. Slides displace masses of material along one or more discrete planes. In rotational sliding the slide plane is curved and the mass rotates backwards around an axis parallel to the slope; in translational sliding the failure surface is more or less planar and the mass moves parallel to the ground surface. Flows mobilize as a deforming, viscous mass without a discrete failure plane. More than one form of movement may occur during a failure, in which case the movement is classified as complex if movements occur sequentially and composite if they do not.
Five of the 20 possible material/movement combinations are commonly found when preparing a landslide inventory map. These are Rock Slides, Earth Flows, Debris Slides, Debris Flows and Rock Falls, and these are described in more detail below.
ROCK SLIDE: A landslide involving bedrock in which the rock that moves remains largely intact for at least a portion of the movement. Rock slides can range in size from small and thin to very large and thick, and are subject to a wide range of triggering mechanisms. The sliding occurs at the base of the rock mass along one to several relatively thin zones of weakness, which are variably referred to as "slide planes," "shear surfaces," "slip surfaces," "rupture surfaces," or "failure surfaces." The sliding surface may be curved or planar in shape. Rock slides with curved sliding surfaces are commonly called "slumps" or "rotational slides," while those with planar failure surfaces are commonly called "translational slides," "block slides," or "block glides." Rock slides that occur on intersecting planar surfaces are commonly called "wedge failures."
Rock slides commonly occur on relatively steep slopes in competent rocks. Slope gradients are commonly from 35% to as steep as 70%. Movement of an intact rock mass along a curved slide plane leads to a steep, arcuate headscarp at the upper boundary of the slide. Immediately below the headscarp is a block that is commonly rotated so that it is less steep than the surrounding hill slopes. Below the bench, the slide mass may be intact with a similar gradient to the surrounding slopes or may have additional scarps and benches. The lower parts of the slopes may bulge outward and be steeper that the surrounding slopes.
EARTH FLOW: A specific type of Soil Flow landslide where the majority of the soil materials are fine-grained (silt and clay) and cohesive. The material strength is low through much of the slide mass, and movement occurs on many discontinuous shear surfaces throughout the landslide mass. This movement along numerous internal slide planes disrupts the landslide mass leading to cumulative movement that resembles the flow of a viscous liquid characterized by a lumpy, or "hummocky" slope morphology. The lower parts of an earth flow usually bulge outward and are steeper than adjacent slopes.
Earth flows commonly occur on moderately steep slopes. Slope gradients are commonly from 10% to as steep as 30%, although steeper slopes may be found in headscarp and toe areas.
Earth flows typically are initiated by periods of prolonged rainfall and sometimes don't initiate until well after a storm or the rainy season has passed. They are characteristically slow moving, in the millimeters or centimeters per day range, and may continue to move for a period of days to weeks after initiating.
DEBRIS SLIDE: A slide of coarse-grained soil, most common in unconsolidated sandy or gravelly units, but also are common in residual soils that form from in-place weathering of relatively hard rock. Owing to the granular constituents, overall strength of the debris slide mass generally is higher than that of earth flows, but there may be a very low strength zone at the base of the soil or within weathered bedrock. Debris slides typically move initially as shallow intact slabs of soil and vegetation, but break up after a short distance into falls and flows. Movement of the slide mass as a shallow slab leads to a smooth, steep, commonly curved scar. The debris is deposited at the base as a loose hummocky mass, although the deposit may be rapidly removed by erosion.
Debris slides commonly occur on very steep slopes, as steep as 60% to 70%, usually in an area where the base of a slope is undercut by erosion. Debris slides form steep, un-vegetated scars which are likely to remain un-vegetated for years. Re-vegetated scars can be recognized by their steep slopes, and a shallow amphitheater morphology.
A single heavy rainstorm or series of storms may deliver enough rain to trigger debris slides. Individual debris slides may move at rates ranging from meters per day to meters per minute. Debris slide scars are extremely steep and therefore are very sensitive to renewed disturbance. Natural erosion at the base of debris slide scars may trigger additional slides. Cutting into the base of a debris slide scar may also trigger renewed slides. Even without additional disturbance, debris slide scars tend to ravel and erode, leading to small rock falls and debris slides from the same slope.
DEBRIS FLOW: A Soil Flow where the majority of the materials are coarse-grained (fine sand to boulder size particles) and non-cohesive. Debris flows are most often triggered by intense rainfall following a period of less intense precipitation, or by rapid snow melt. High pore water pressures cause the soil and weathered rock to rapidly lose strength and flow downslope. Debris flows can move very rapidly, at rates ranging from meters per hour to meters per second and travel relatively long distances, making them a significant threat to life and property.
Debris flows commonly begin as a slide of a shallow mass of soil and weathered rock. Their most distinctive landform is the scar left by the original shallow slide. The path of the debris flow may be marked by a small drainage that has been stripped of vegetation. The debris flow may not leave any deposit if it flows directly into a larger creek and is immediately eroded away. Many debris flow deposits are ephemeral, but in some cases successive debris flows may deposit material in the same area thereby forming a debris fan, which resembles a small, steep alluvial fan.
Individual debris flows typically are small in areal extent and their deposits are relatively thin. Evidence of past debris flow movements often is masked by vegetation growth which can cover the surface rapidly, sometimes within a few years, making them difficult to identify using aerial photographic and field reconnaissance methods. Therefore, only the larger and more recent debris flows typically are identified and included on landslide inventory maps
ROCK FALL: A landslide where a mass of rock detaches from a steep slope by sliding, spreading or toppling and descends mainly through the air by falling, bouncing or rolling. Intense rain, earthquakes or freeze-thaw wedging may trigger this type of movement.
Rockfalls occur on steep slopes of hard, fractured rock. The scar left by a rockfall on the slope may be no more apparent than an area of rock that is less weathered than the surrounding rocks. Rockfall deposits are loose piles of rubble that may be easily removed by erosion. Because neither the scar nor the deposit are distinctive, and because the most frequently occurring rockfalls are typically small, individual rock falls are usually not shown on regional-scale (1:24,000 and smaller) landslide maps.
Though infrequent, moderate- to large-volume rockfalls can be extremely dangerous and sometimes fatal. Large slabs of rock impacting a hard ledge after a long drop can rapidly break apart, leading to air entrainment and long runouts, induced airblasts, airborne projectiles (flyrock) and severe dust clouds.
CRUDEN, D.M., and VARNES, D.L. 1996, Chapter 3: Landslide types and processes, pp. 36-75 in A.K. Turner and R.I. Schuster (eds.), Landslides: Investigation and Mitigation, Special Report 247, Transportation Research Board, National Research Council, Washington D.C.: National Academy Press.
VARNES, D.J., 1978, Slope movement types and processes. In, Special Report 176: R.L. Schuster and R.J. Krizek (eds.), Landslides: Analysis and Control, TRB, National Research Council, Washington, D.C. pp. 11-33.
Four principal types of information describing the various classes of landslides are portrayed by different landslide maps prepared by the California Geological Survey: (1) inventories of existing landslides, (2) landslide hazard—expressed as landslide susceptibility or landslide potential maps, (3) landslide risk maps, and (4) landslide zone maps. The maps can be either qualitative or quantitative in their preparation.
Landslide hazard, risk and zone maps are prepared in many ways, increasingly involving complex manipulations of multiple criteria by computer. Because the value of landslide maps can be judged only by whether they correctly predict the locations of future failures, effectiveness of the different approaches to constructing them is difficult to evaluate.
National Landslide Hazards Program
Recommended Procedures for Landslide Investigations
FEMA Landslide and Debris Flow
Quick Hits